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Speaker 3: All right, gosh, yeah, welcome back. We are here special guests.

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Speaker 3: We have Kurt Franklin and Norman and business partners in Curt,

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Speaker 3: somebody that obviously everybody knows Norman. This might be an

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Speaker 3: introduction for people, So this is going to be a

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Speaker 3: good two sided conversation and we talk about a variety

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Speaker 3: of different things. But on a business aspect, I think

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Speaker 3: this is good because you know, everybody knows you from

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Speaker 3: your spectacular career as a musician and the inspiration for people,

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Speaker 3: so we definitely got to talk about that. But you know,

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Speaker 3: you're doing a lot in the business world as well,

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Speaker 3: and new ventures that you have and different things, so

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Speaker 3: I think that that might be interesting for people to

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Speaker 3: have that level of the conversation. So first and foremost,

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Speaker 3: thank you guys for joining us.

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Speaker 4: Appreciate it. To be here, man, to be here.

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Speaker 5: I told you when you walked in.

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Speaker 1: For about ten seconds, I was like, that's really his

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Speaker 1: voice and in my mind melodies of Heaven is going

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Speaker 1: on right now. So I mean, icon it is an understatement.

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Speaker 6: Man.

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Speaker 5: We are happy to have you both, very very grateful.

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Speaker 3: So how does this work and relationship come about? How

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Speaker 3: do you guys meet and how do you guys formulate

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Speaker 3: some level of partnership.

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Speaker 4: Well, you know, man, I am.

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Speaker 7: I have been doing music, especially in the space of

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Speaker 7: gospel music now for about thirty two years, and it

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Speaker 7: has always been deficient with a level of access to

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Speaker 7: professional information just because of the limited amount of professional

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Speaker 7: and financial growth in the space of gospel music. Historically,

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Speaker 7: it never was attractive to people that had higher levels

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Speaker 7: of understanding of business where the acumen was able to

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Speaker 7: really be depositing in people that were really very very

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Speaker 7: absence of knowing how to be able to maneuver, whether

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Speaker 7: it was music publishing or touring, or understanding contracts, understanding

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Speaker 7: the value of what they were contributing to a space.

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Speaker 7: So a lot of times in black gospel music, you

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Speaker 7: were just really left to just survive on your own.

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Speaker 7: And so just over the last several years, you've seen

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Speaker 7: more younger entrepreneurs, especially men of color, that have seen

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Speaker 7: areas that could be beneficial in these joint spaces for

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Speaker 7: themselves and also for the artists. There was just a

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Speaker 7: space of just lack of information, lack of accessibility. And

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Speaker 7: so over the last decade, I've had a chance to

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Speaker 7: run into this fine young gentleman named Norman Gianphy. And

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Speaker 7: Norman started out managing artists, bringing opportunities to artists, came

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Speaker 7: from this great space of marketing. And the more I

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Speaker 7: was around him, I understood that it was a secret

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Speaker 7: that was written from like like there was a gem,

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Speaker 7: there was a genius gem that we were not really

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Speaker 7: tap into, that we were not tapping into to the

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Speaker 7: best of our ability as a genre. And so as

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Speaker 7: he made himself more available, we just became friends and

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Speaker 7: we just started to try to talk and communicate. And

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Speaker 7: I would have never known that that that so many

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Speaker 7: things that I was aspiring to do, he had the

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Speaker 7: tools to be able to give me the resources and

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Speaker 7: the knowledge and information on how to be able to

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Speaker 7: diversify and really become better at that. So over the

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Speaker 7: last five years it has been a wonderful partnership and

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Speaker 7: I've been so impressed with his acumen and his business compass.

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Speaker 7: And so he started to reach out and to build

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Speaker 7: a bigger conglomerate with other men of color that came

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Speaker 7: from the space of of of of faith, curated content.

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Speaker 7: And so he he over the last two years, built

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Speaker 7: this this this this this type of new ideal that

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Speaker 7: was attractive to me. I was about to sign again

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Speaker 7: with Sony Records and and uh RCA Records and well

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Speaker 7: and and and and it was a really nice offering

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Speaker 7: that they were going to give me again because I've

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Speaker 7: been in the house for years. Uh But at the

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Speaker 7: same time, I'm looking at Cross the River and I'm

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Speaker 7: seeing these black men that are coming together and they

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Speaker 7: want to be able to really own the space and

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Speaker 7: really be able to give equity and to be able

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Speaker 7: to give voice to individuals like myself. And so I

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Speaker 7: had this incredible choice of going back with a house

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Speaker 7: that was already part of the institution that I knew well,

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Speaker 7: or to take a chance on something that seemed so

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Speaker 7: attractive and something that really looked like other and it

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Speaker 7: was an outlier from what I experienced, and it was

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Speaker 7: the best decision I've ever made.

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Speaker 1: So this is Insignia Assets. Yes, So no, I'm obviously

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Speaker 1: we know your iconic career. Was your career always surrounded

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Speaker 1: about around faith based content and music or how did

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Speaker 1: you get to this point?

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Speaker 6: Yeah, that's a good question. So no, I had nothing

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Speaker 6: to do with music, definitely not Christian music. I'm an

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Speaker 6: economist and industrial engineer Georgia Tech.

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Speaker 2: Went to Howard.

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Speaker 6: My sister married a gospel artist, Travis Green, and so

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Speaker 6: I started working with him. And from there I noticed,

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Speaker 6: as Kirk mentioned, a lot of arbitrage, a lot of

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Speaker 6: deficiencies in the marketplace, and the main thing I noticed

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Speaker 6: was that they didn't market music the way the mainstream

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Speaker 6: music did. So I started a marketing company. And then

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Speaker 6: as I started the marketing company, I noticed that a

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Speaker 6: lot of brands, a lot of television TV film corporations,

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Speaker 6: a lot of labels needed marketing. They just weren't capturing

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Speaker 6: what they were doing. So that's what we started. We

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Speaker 6: started just capturing everything that we did. You see Chris

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Speaker 6: here right now. As soon as we started working with Kirk,

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Speaker 6: so I told him you got to have a camera

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Speaker 6: on you all the time because people don't believe a

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Speaker 6: lot of what you say. Kirk was in Brazil. You

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Speaker 6: have fifty thousand people there. When you hear that, everybody

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Speaker 6: see something different. My brother in law Travis, when it did,

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Speaker 6: it shows one point one million people. When I say

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Speaker 6: that everybody has an idea of what one point one

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Speaker 6: million people, it's a difference when I show you what

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Speaker 6: it looks like. And so when you actually show people

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Speaker 6: and you give this POV of what it's like to

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Speaker 6: be Kirk Franklin, Travis Green, Tosh Cobbs, Leonard Lacraye, whoever,

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Speaker 6: you are showing people that in the Christian music space,

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Speaker 6: we're not all just walking around with choir robes on

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Speaker 6: jumping around. These are massive brands, iconic brands. I do

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Speaker 6: jump around them that are filling arenas stumps too, you

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Speaker 6: know what I mean. And so my main thing when

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Speaker 6: I came into space was to number one, aggregate and

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Speaker 6: galvanize the most loyal consumer there is, which is the

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Speaker 6: African American consumer one. But secondarily, the most loyal consumers

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Speaker 6: actually believers, people that believe in God are the most

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Speaker 6: loyal consumer in America. That just elected the president. Whether

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Speaker 6: you like it or not, that's what happened, you know

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Speaker 6: what I mean. And so when you can aggregate that

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Speaker 6: communicating community mobilized, and I hate to use the word,

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Speaker 6: but monetize that community, you have a unique opportunity to

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Speaker 6: do something special.

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Speaker 4: So what exactly isn't asset and signey.

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Speaker 2: As a holding company.

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Speaker 6: And so one of the main things I noticed was

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Speaker 6: there was no vertical integration. So I didn't want to

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Speaker 6: have any outside partners. We have no outside partners with

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Speaker 6: not taking on any debt. We have a distribution strategic partner,

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Speaker 6: which is Torture. That's about it. I work directly with

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Speaker 6: Love of Nation and touring, AG and touring. I work directly.

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Speaker 6: We own our own publishing, we're on our own masters.

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Speaker 6: We own everything in house. So it's a record label.

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Speaker 6: It's not a record label. It does everything we do television.

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Speaker 3: Film, so it's it's a record label's part of it

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Speaker 3: a record label is one part that's tribal Records.

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Speaker 6: It's one sole part, and we have a publishing division.

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Speaker 6: We have a publishing company. We have a TV film

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Speaker 6: company called Three Diamonds. That's if you're saying Dennis Kings,

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Speaker 6: it's doing really well right now with Kirk sat down

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Speaker 6: with DC Young, Fly Lou Young and.

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Speaker 2: Ellis and Conjay. That's still our company.

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Speaker 3: So it's a three sixty offering of everything media and

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Speaker 3: it's solely based around Christian.

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Speaker 4: Faith.

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Speaker 6: That's the genesis. That's the genesis. That's our modus operandi.

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Speaker 6: But we work with everybody. We work with Tamar Braxton,

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Speaker 6: you know what I mean, we work with It doesn't

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Speaker 6: matter if you're faith based or not. It matters whether

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Speaker 6: you are a brand that can be multifaceted. Tour podcast,

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Speaker 6: create music, create a book, create an asset that we

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Speaker 6: can then monetize multiple verticles.

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Speaker 7: And then what is also interesting about what Norman is

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Speaker 7: saying is that even with your question is that the

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Speaker 7: unique space and the unique opportunity with this type of

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Speaker 7: platform is that people of color are very diverse and

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Speaker 7: nuanced in that space is that they go to the

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Speaker 7: club and they go to church too, So so you're

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Speaker 7: able to curate content that if it knocks, they'll listen,

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Speaker 7: and if it feels good, they'll come. And so it

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Speaker 7: inspires and aspires at the same time. And that's what

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Speaker 7: made it very unique for me.

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Speaker 1: As you're watching him build it and at the time

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Speaker 1: you hadn't signed with them, you hadn't partnered with them,

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Speaker 1: but you're on the other side with the traditional major label.

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Speaker 1: He's watching and saying, they're not marketing it's right. What's

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Speaker 1: that complexity feel like?

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Speaker 2: Right?

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Speaker 1: Like you're watching a friend do something that's really unique

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Speaker 1: and you're kind of on the fence about doing it,

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Speaker 1: but you're stuck in a traditional kind of mindset of

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Speaker 1: marketing and distributing.

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Speaker 5: What is that time period? What was it like for

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Speaker 5: you trying to battle that well?

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Speaker 7: For me, the only tension was my concern of the

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Speaker 7: possibility of there being any unknown challenges with the beautiful

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Speaker 7: personal relationships that were being built. Is because I didn't

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Speaker 7: have good experiences with doing business with people that I

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Speaker 7: fell in love with as brothers, and so that was

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Speaker 7: my trepidation.

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Speaker 4: So you didn't have relationship, you didn't have good experiences.

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Speaker 7: I've never had good experiences working with individuals that were

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Speaker 7: also friends and family, like individuals, and so that's what

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Speaker 7: my trepidation was now when it came to when it

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Speaker 7: came to me being clear of the deliverables. My first

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Speaker 7: project that I worked with Norman on was a tour

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Speaker 7: and it was back in twenty twenty two and it

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Speaker 7: ended up being the biggest attended, biggest grossing Christian or

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Speaker 7: a gospel tour even history, and it was myself in

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Speaker 7: Maverick City. And so when I saw the level of

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Speaker 7: execution on that tour, that's what really sparked my attention.

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Speaker 7: Is because I've toured my entire life, you know, in

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Speaker 7: my space, by God's grace only speaking, I've done all

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Speaker 7: of the big tours in my space historically over the

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Speaker 7: last twenty five years. But I've never been I've never

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Speaker 7: been able to really crack the code on the diversification

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Speaker 7: that normally comes to other artists when they tour. And

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Speaker 7: so working with Norman and his partners, it was just

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Speaker 7: an eye opening experience and then we became closer through it,

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Speaker 7: and so that began to be the beginning of me

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Speaker 7: starting to question if it could be something that could

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Speaker 7: really survive in that level of duality.

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Speaker 3: So let me ask both of you guys this because

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Speaker 3: you both mentioned that gospel artists don't get marketed the

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Speaker 3: right way. So, Kirk, from your standpoint, what did you

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Speaker 3: see that was the problem when you was in like

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Speaker 3: the institution, and from your standpoint on the outside looking

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Speaker 3: at what did you see that say, Okay, they're not

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Speaker 3: doing this correctly. I think that I can add this

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Speaker 3: level of exposure through marketing.

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Speaker 7: It is very much not being part of the culture.

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Speaker 7: Is that most individuals that work in major systems, they

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Speaker 7: don't go to a local hood church. They're not at

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Speaker 7: the barbershop listening to Sunday sermons. They're not sitting in

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Speaker 7: the missionary Baptist church. They're not from that space. So

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Speaker 7: you've got to remember that the origin of gospel music

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Speaker 7: was very much about the community and the engaging of

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Speaker 7: the picnic, the barbecues, the three o'clock services. And that's

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Speaker 7: why gospel music flourished so much than the seventies and

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Speaker 7: eighties and nineties because a lot of the labels that

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Speaker 7: were running it back then were still people that were

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Speaker 7: part of the community. They were going to church themselves,

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Speaker 7: they were very much engrafted in the space of the

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Speaker 7: ecosystem of church ideals.

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Speaker 4: In the community.

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Speaker 7: But because when you are people of color and America,

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Speaker 7: especially during that period of time, either you or somebody

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Speaker 7: you knew, you were not far removed from the church experience.

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Speaker 7: Even if you didn't go, you lived in a house

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Speaker 7: with somebody that did. You knew somebody that did. So

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Speaker 7: you understood the language, you understood the respect, you understood

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Speaker 7: all of the tenets of that cultural experience, even if

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Speaker 7: you were not always privy to it every week. So

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Speaker 7: what happened is is there is more corporation began to

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Speaker 7: come and buy the smaller companies in the nineties, in

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Speaker 7: the two thousands.

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Speaker 2: That.

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Speaker 7: Access of the real experience of the community of church,

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Speaker 7: the language of church, and the heartbeat of the foundational

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Speaker 7: elements of gospel us began to get washed and they

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Speaker 7: began to get quickly separated from what was happening. And

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Speaker 7: so the more you moved up the higher echelon, you

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Speaker 7: missed the heartbeat of what Christian and gospel music was.

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Speaker 7: And so I started to see it. Everyone started to

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Speaker 7: see it. And so what this what it created were

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Speaker 7: executives that were trying to work in gospel music, but

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Speaker 7: they could easily work in hip hop because they.

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Speaker 5: Were going to the clubs.

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Speaker 7: They knew what was happening industries, they understood all of

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Speaker 7: the all of the tenants of hip hop culture. But

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Speaker 7: then when they had gospel artists, they didn't know what

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Speaker 7: to do. And so it was a very divine moment

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Speaker 7: for Norman and his partners to really see that happening

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Speaker 7: and to see it as a great business opportunity to

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Speaker 7: be able to tap into those that really needed this

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Speaker 7: bridge of what was and now what was missing.

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Speaker 6: Yeah, I mean, you hit on a couple of points

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Speaker 6: really well. I think the main thing is something that

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Speaker 6: he said is when you talk about the nineties, everybody

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Speaker 6: grew up. I think at that time ninety three to

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Speaker 6: ninety seven percent of people went to church. Today thirty

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Speaker 6: eight to forty one percent of people go to church.

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Speaker 4: Oh you said ninety eight percent of people.

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Speaker 6: During the ninety many women of color, people know in

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Speaker 6: the United States consider themselves Christian once somewhere at some

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Speaker 6: point in the nineties. That number was in the ninety

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Speaker 6: to ninety seven percent time in the nineties. Back then,

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Speaker 6: everybody consider themselves. It's just a thing. You go up

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Speaker 6: to somebody, you're Christian. It's just a yes. That was,

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Speaker 6: I wouldn't call it an enlightenment in America, but as

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Speaker 6: we come into today, that number is dwindled to the

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Speaker 6: low forties to the mid thirties.

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Speaker 3: Oh, people that attend church that consider themselves Christian, themselves

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Speaker 3: Christians church, Yes, when can look it up fact checking.

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Speaker 3: That has a lot to do with the marketing piece

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Speaker 3: because the way we market so there were things you

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Speaker 3: could just say in the nineties and we just accepted them,

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Speaker 3: like you.

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Speaker 6: Could just say God bless you. Nowadays, if you just

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Speaker 6: walk up to somebody say God bless you, they say,

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Speaker 6: what God, What do you mean by God bless you.

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Speaker 6: It's just certain things that impacts marketing because if I'm

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Speaker 6: a brand and I know I want to your consumer,

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Speaker 6: I may not use a Christian artist because it may

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Speaker 6: offend some audience that wouldn't necessarily be offended. Are there

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Speaker 6: are many communities currently of color, not of color, of

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Speaker 6: sexual orientation, or whatever the case may we talk about

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Speaker 6: Roe v. Wade that are offended by certain belief systems.

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Speaker 6: Whether or not those beliefs actually have oppressive intent is irrelevant.

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Speaker 6: As a brand, I don't have the opportunity to communicate. Oh,

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Speaker 6: I don't agree with everything Kirk Franklin believes, or I

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Speaker 6: don't agree with everything Xyz believes. You don't have that opportunity.

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Speaker 6: So I'm just going to shy away from the very

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Speaker 6: mere fact that he says he's a Christian because it

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Speaker 6: may offend someone. So what I noticed coming into the

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Speaker 6: space was that that was a There was a large

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Speaker 6: group of people that still didn't didn't mind to have

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Speaker 6: someone like Kirk be the spokesman for what they wanted.

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Speaker 6: That wasn't There wasn't anyone willing to come in and say, hey,

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Speaker 6: I'm going to put my money behind this space and

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Speaker 6: look at ways to correlate them with certain brands, certain companies,

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Speaker 6: certain products, and push that to just our base. Our

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Speaker 6: base is still, like I said's the most loyal base

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Speaker 6: you have period.

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Speaker 3: When you say your base, what is your because there's

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Speaker 3: a lot of Christians in America. Yeah, but there's Evangelical

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Speaker 3: White Christians, there's Roman Catholics, Yeah, there's Southern Baptists.

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Speaker 4: What is your base that you're referring?

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Speaker 6: So the unique part of where we sit in the

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Speaker 6: marketplace is Kirk mentioned Maverick City. So I am one

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Speaker 6: of the owners of Maverick City, with one of my

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Speaker 6: business partner, Jonathan Jay. And the unique thing about Maverick

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Speaker 6: City was that we prioritize diversity and so we were

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Speaker 6: able to build one of the first groups that had

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Speaker 6: African Americans in it that was able to be played

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Speaker 6: on what we consider CCM radio. So much like pop

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Speaker 6: and R and B, in the Christians space, you have

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Speaker 6: Christian and you have Gospel.

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Speaker 2: That means white and black. I mean, let so no

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Speaker 2: one Christians.

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Speaker 4: Christian music is white. Gospel music is black.

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Speaker 6: Yes, so if you hear Christian music, you hear Christian music,

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Speaker 6: you're going to have a white.

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Speaker 4: Person and there's no ambiguity.

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Speaker 7: What he says, none, no, no, but but but but

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Speaker 7: but can I also do you mind if if I

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Speaker 7: can also celebrate What he was saying is that this

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Speaker 7: piece of marketing that Norman and his partners brought to

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Speaker 7: the table is what it did for those spaces that

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Speaker 7: were already biased, is that it humanized the voices in

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Speaker 7: the space.

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Speaker 2: Exactly.

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Speaker 7: That's what it did. Is that is that it allowed

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Speaker 7: people to see themselves in us. Is because being able

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Speaker 7: to have the idea, you know, we're going to bring

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Speaker 7: cameras into every space, We're going to do intentional marketing

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Speaker 7: to humanize the voices in this space so that they

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Speaker 7: do not sound so iconoclastic, right, that they sound more

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Speaker 7: human humanized. And so that has been a great benefit

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Speaker 7: for not for not on other artists, but also for myself.

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Speaker 7: And I was always a very public person, but in

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Speaker 7: the partnership I have seen the benefits of being intrusive

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Speaker 7: in a very intentional way so that people can understand

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Speaker 7: the viability and the relevance of not only just these brands,

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Speaker 7: but also the subject matter.

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Speaker 1: This is interesting because even this is revolutionary. This partnership

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Speaker 1: feels revolutionary, but it feels like pretty new, right, you're

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Speaker 1: talking about tour in twenty twenty two. Yeah, but most

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Speaker 1: people look at you as the icon in terms of

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Speaker 1: gospel music. I mean it changed even from like the

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Speaker 1: eighties to the nineties, and like when you came and

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Speaker 1: then it was like it's praise and worship. It's a

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Speaker 1: totally different sound. But gospel music is still part of

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Speaker 1: the music business. Yeah, And so at what point did

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Speaker 1: did you feel like you've grasped the business.

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Speaker 5: Or you're still learning up to this point.

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Speaker 1: Obviously you learn some new things and find new ways

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Speaker 1: to market, and as you as a leader in that space,

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Speaker 1: I would say, how are you seeing other artists as

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Speaker 1: you're growing and you're brand is building? Are we treating

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Speaker 1: it like a business or we always talk about R

401
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Speaker 1: and B artists who signed these contracts that were so

402
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Speaker 1: negligent and yeah, you know they didn't know what to

403
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Speaker 1: ask and pride and the kind of naive in the space,

404
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Speaker 1: but we never really hear it in other genres. Was

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Speaker 1: that an experience and that time as well leading up

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Speaker 1: to current day where we have more information, more resources,

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Speaker 1: obviously great partners.

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Speaker 7: You know, the answer for me is very nuanced because

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Speaker 7: it has been the last decade and a half of

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Speaker 7: me where I've been able to understand the necessity of

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Speaker 7: leaning into longevity that that's going to require more of

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Speaker 7: me being more infused and informed and also having the

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Speaker 7: tools to realize that these are the errors that I

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Speaker 7: can be strong in.

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Speaker 4: See. See.

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Speaker 7: The difficult thing is that it's not once sis fits

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Speaker 7: off every artists, because there are some artis.

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Speaker 5: That or or that or maybe more They are not extroverts.

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Speaker 4: They they they.

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Speaker 7: May not have the woodness about themselves where they can

421
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Speaker 7: deliver in front of a camera. What is necessary for

422
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Speaker 7: for his part of the business. But whatever it is

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Speaker 7: is that what I think is very important is that

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Speaker 7: we need more individuals to surround talent in the space

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Speaker 7: to be able to point out those strengths, maximize and

426
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Speaker 7: manage those weaknesses so that they can be able to

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Speaker 7: have the opportunity to tap into these these these new

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Speaker 7: tools or the tools that are now available to them

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Speaker 7: so that we can talk about diversification and even longevity.

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Speaker 7: And that has not always existed. But it's because once again,

431
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Speaker 7: we were not prived to the best entertainment lawyers. We

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Speaker 7: were not prived to the booking agents and to the

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Speaker 7: the the the the talent ages. William Morris, who's not

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Speaker 7: running down our space. And when they were running down

435
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Speaker 7: our space back in the day, it was only just

436
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Speaker 7: to collect the dollars just for booking. It was not

437
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Speaker 7: to really to diversify and get them a television and

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Speaker 7: film like a lot of always promise. And it's not

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Speaker 7: a slate with wm is because they're a great company.

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Speaker 7: They're just too big. These companies are too big to

441
00:23:07,920 --> 00:23:11,239
Speaker 7: be able to be in the minutia of how do

442
00:23:11,280 --> 00:23:16,879
Speaker 7: we speak, it's almost adjacent to the Tyler peri model

443
00:23:17,600 --> 00:23:21,080
Speaker 7: is that his voice is so wrapped into the experience

444
00:23:21,160 --> 00:23:23,800
Speaker 7: of the community. Is that Hollywood did not know that

445
00:23:23,800 --> 00:23:27,320
Speaker 7: that was a community that even existed, and so it's

446
00:23:27,400 --> 00:23:32,760
Speaker 7: kind of privy to that space that there is this community,

447
00:23:32,920 --> 00:23:37,280
Speaker 7: there's this island that has always existed. That now we

448
00:23:37,400 --> 00:23:41,520
Speaker 7: cannot rely just on Sunday morning to get the message

449
00:23:41,560 --> 00:23:43,040
Speaker 7: that we exist there. We've got to be able to

450
00:23:43,119 --> 00:23:45,760
Speaker 7: do it Sunday night, Monday morning, Tuesday, Wednesday at the

451
00:23:45,760 --> 00:23:48,240
Speaker 7: club and the streets, at the barbershop where we go.

452
00:23:48,320 --> 00:23:51,160
Speaker 7: We've got to be able to have talented conversations, especially

453
00:23:51,160 --> 00:23:53,439
Speaker 7: with the advent of social media, to let people know

454
00:23:53,480 --> 00:23:56,600
Speaker 7: that we're aware, reformed, and we're still relatable to whatever

455
00:23:56,680 --> 00:23:58,960
Speaker 7: space people need when they need to be inspired and

456
00:23:58,960 --> 00:24:01,639
Speaker 7: be reminded of life bigger than themselves.

457
00:24:02,000 --> 00:24:05,560
Speaker 6: I think you ask a good question, and Kirk, you

458
00:24:05,640 --> 00:24:09,000
Speaker 6: expounded on a number of things, but the straightforward answers. Yeah,

459
00:24:09,000 --> 00:24:14,280
Speaker 6: the deal sucked the deals in gospel like they did everywhere.

460
00:24:14,920 --> 00:24:17,760
Speaker 6: One of the most disruptive factors of what we did

461
00:24:17,960 --> 00:24:21,640
Speaker 6: was we were giving royalties to artists without deals, and so.

462
00:24:21,560 --> 00:24:23,160
Speaker 2: We were able to really.

463
00:24:24,560 --> 00:24:27,080
Speaker 6: Aggregate some of the best talent in Christian and gospel

464
00:24:27,119 --> 00:24:29,320
Speaker 6: music at the time, because they didn't have to commit

465
00:24:29,400 --> 00:24:32,280
Speaker 6: anything to work with us, a tribal in Maverick City,

466
00:24:32,400 --> 00:24:35,760
Speaker 6: Maverick City Publishing, and so a lot of the buildings

467
00:24:35,800 --> 00:24:37,880
Speaker 6: didn't like what we were doing. We weren't Nashville base,

468
00:24:37,960 --> 00:24:42,280
Speaker 6: we weren't old white guys from the Midwest. We were

469
00:24:42,280 --> 00:24:45,080
Speaker 6: some young black dudes from Georgia. And so that was

470
00:24:45,160 --> 00:24:48,840
Speaker 6: kind of disruptive in and of itself from a racial standpoint.

471
00:24:49,040 --> 00:24:51,400
Speaker 6: But also we were trying to push for an all

472
00:24:51,440 --> 00:24:54,240
Speaker 6: white format at radio to also play black music. And

473
00:24:54,320 --> 00:24:56,560
Speaker 6: so when you talk about the deals, and when you

474
00:24:56,560 --> 00:24:59,520
Speaker 6: hear about the nineties, the R and B and those

475
00:24:59,640 --> 00:25:01,640
Speaker 6: horse mc kirk has a hard story.

476
00:25:01,680 --> 00:25:02,560
Speaker 2: He might not talk about it.

477
00:25:02,600 --> 00:25:04,479
Speaker 6: I said it, but he had a bad deal at

478
00:25:04,520 --> 00:25:06,720
Speaker 6: a point, you know, someone took all of his publishing,

479
00:25:06,800 --> 00:25:09,520
Speaker 6: Someone took everything from him. And so in this lot

480
00:25:09,600 --> 00:25:11,640
Speaker 6: of part of his career, well I won't even say

481
00:25:11,640 --> 00:25:12,120
Speaker 6: the lot of part.

482
00:25:12,160 --> 00:25:14,040
Speaker 2: Let God decide that. But at this point in.

483
00:25:14,000 --> 00:25:18,840
Speaker 6: His career he is now leveraging and monetizing out of

484
00:25:18,880 --> 00:25:21,480
Speaker 6: way as an entrepreneur. You know, he's the chief creative

485
00:25:21,520 --> 00:25:25,399
Speaker 6: officer in my company. He makes decisions on what the

486
00:25:25,480 --> 00:25:27,480
Speaker 6: type of music we're going to put out. We need

487
00:25:27,520 --> 00:25:29,560
Speaker 6: great I'm gonna call him gate keepers, but we need

488
00:25:29,680 --> 00:25:32,159
Speaker 6: quality control in every genre of music.

489
00:25:32,440 --> 00:25:33,679
Speaker 2: Not that we need these.

490
00:25:33,560 --> 00:25:35,640
Speaker 6: A and rs to say dis should come out they shouldn't,

491
00:25:35,800 --> 00:25:39,679
Speaker 6: but we also need for us by us still at

492
00:25:39,720 --> 00:25:41,960
Speaker 6: a point, you need people that are in the space

493
00:25:42,000 --> 00:25:46,400
Speaker 6: to understand his value, understand the artist's value. Everybody's making money,

494
00:25:46,440 --> 00:25:48,520
Speaker 6: but what happens when you're in one of these majors.

495
00:25:49,080 --> 00:25:51,720
Speaker 6: The money's going into this vacuum and out to these

496
00:25:51,760 --> 00:25:53,560
Speaker 6: people that we've never met.

497
00:25:53,960 --> 00:25:54,520
Speaker 2: You know what I mean.

498
00:25:54,720 --> 00:25:58,200
Speaker 6: So as an indie label, I know what I need

499
00:25:58,240 --> 00:25:59,959
Speaker 6: to survive it and I can say yeah for real.

500
00:26:00,000 --> 00:26:04,359
Speaker 2: So the artists need to be able to really eat.

501
00:26:04,840 --> 00:26:07,240
Speaker 6: They need to be able to really see the benefits

502
00:26:07,280 --> 00:26:09,600
Speaker 6: of the hard work they're doing. He's running around all

503
00:26:09,680 --> 00:26:13,159
Speaker 6: day promoting his single, his podcast, these things.

504
00:26:13,440 --> 00:26:15,800
Speaker 2: He should have ownership in that. You know where the

505
00:26:15,840 --> 00:26:16,720
Speaker 2: traditional deal is.

506
00:26:16,720 --> 00:26:21,240
Speaker 6: An artist has they on fifteen percent of this master

507
00:26:21,320 --> 00:26:25,359
Speaker 6: work they created, and they took this loan essentially eighty

508
00:26:25,359 --> 00:26:29,000
Speaker 6: five thousand dollars to do this, their life's work, put

509
00:26:29,000 --> 00:26:31,840
Speaker 6: out their first album. It does amazing the labels making

510
00:26:31,840 --> 00:26:33,600
Speaker 6: millions of dollars. They're not going to redo the deal

511
00:26:33,640 --> 00:26:35,400
Speaker 6: for you. They're not going to come back and give

512
00:26:35,400 --> 00:26:36,679
Speaker 6: you a bonus.

513
00:26:36,359 --> 00:26:37,560
Speaker 2: You agreed to it.

514
00:26:37,720 --> 00:26:40,320
Speaker 6: So you're paying you pay back everything you gave us

515
00:26:40,400 --> 00:26:43,800
Speaker 6: off the fifteen percent royalty that I've given you, and

516
00:26:43,840 --> 00:26:45,840
Speaker 6: I'm going to keep eighty five percent of every dollar

517
00:26:45,880 --> 00:26:50,760
Speaker 6: that we made, and then once your fifteen percent has recouped.

518
00:26:50,560 --> 00:26:52,520
Speaker 2: I'll give you your royalties.

519
00:26:52,800 --> 00:26:55,560
Speaker 6: And that's on something you created all yourself, and they

520
00:26:55,640 --> 00:26:57,600
Speaker 6: just gave you the money to do it. I just

521
00:26:57,640 --> 00:26:58,639
Speaker 6: didn't think that was fair.

522
00:26:58,960 --> 00:27:01,080
Speaker 4: So, Kurt, when did you know it's similar?

523
00:27:01,119 --> 00:27:06,480
Speaker 3: Because obviously, so okay, you and YG on the opposite

524
00:27:06,520 --> 00:27:09,600
Speaker 3: sides of the spectrum in life.

525
00:27:09,320 --> 00:27:14,159
Speaker 6: Right and music theoretically right. I don't know why G personally.

526
00:27:14,160 --> 00:27:16,040
Speaker 6: I won't speak to his spirituality.

527
00:27:16,920 --> 00:27:19,600
Speaker 4: Good God, but when somebody looks at what I know him,

528
00:27:19,600 --> 00:27:20,119
Speaker 4: I know him well.

529
00:27:21,840 --> 00:27:23,800
Speaker 3: But the reason why I say that is because you know,

530
00:27:23,840 --> 00:27:25,840
Speaker 3: we had a conversation with YG and he was saying

531
00:27:25,880 --> 00:27:28,080
Speaker 3: that when he signed his first record deal was it

532
00:27:28,160 --> 00:27:31,520
Speaker 3: was five albums for twenty five thousand offs. That makes sense,

533
00:27:31,560 --> 00:27:33,440
Speaker 3: and pretty much he didn't know what he was getting

534
00:27:33,480 --> 00:27:36,160
Speaker 3: himself into an he made mistakes, and he learned the business,

535
00:27:36,160 --> 00:27:37,800
Speaker 3: and he realized that he was in a bad deal.

536
00:27:40,560 --> 00:27:42,560
Speaker 3: You said that you was in a bad deal, right, Yes,

537
00:27:42,640 --> 00:27:46,240
Speaker 3: When did you realize that you were you were in

538
00:27:46,280 --> 00:27:46,800
Speaker 3: a bad deal?

539
00:27:47,359 --> 00:27:49,920
Speaker 7: Well, and and and I also want to be able

540
00:27:49,920 --> 00:27:57,199
Speaker 7: to to acknowledge it in a space that is that

541
00:27:57,359 --> 00:28:02,399
Speaker 7: I signed. I signed the deal, so it wasn't forced

542
00:28:02,480 --> 00:28:05,600
Speaker 7: upon me. I signed a deal that was not the

543
00:28:05,600 --> 00:28:08,760
Speaker 7: most beneficial for me, you know. And and and I've

544
00:28:08,800 --> 00:28:11,640
Speaker 7: had to learn how to phrase it that way because

545
00:28:12,720 --> 00:28:17,199
Speaker 7: sometimes it has been weaponized against me, even though it's

546
00:28:17,280 --> 00:28:20,560
Speaker 7: truth that I that one hundred percent of my publishing

547
00:28:20,640 --> 00:28:24,920
Speaker 7: was not given to me until almost twenty years into

548
00:28:25,000 --> 00:28:27,680
Speaker 7: my career, so you know, and that's and that is

549
00:28:27,800 --> 00:28:28,600
Speaker 7: very unfortunate.

550
00:28:28,880 --> 00:28:29,879
Speaker 4: That's very unfortunate.

551
00:28:29,960 --> 00:28:34,800
Speaker 7: So it was me understanding and realizing as I continue

552
00:28:34,840 --> 00:28:39,280
Speaker 7: to matriculate in the space that the information that I

553
00:28:39,320 --> 00:28:41,880
Speaker 7: was not privy to at the very beginning other artists

554
00:28:41,920 --> 00:28:45,120
Speaker 7: and other situations is because what started to happening again

555
00:28:45,440 --> 00:28:48,720
Speaker 7: was also just the advent of independent individuals, people that

556
00:28:48,760 --> 00:28:51,000
Speaker 7: were doing it on their own, and people that were

557
00:28:51,000 --> 00:28:54,560
Speaker 7: doing on their own social media and social platforms gave

558
00:28:54,560 --> 00:28:57,600
Speaker 7: them a louder voice. And so what started to happen

559
00:28:57,680 --> 00:29:00,440
Speaker 7: is that the information that was that was fight years

560
00:29:00,440 --> 00:29:03,120
Speaker 7: away from us getting. Now there are artists that are

561
00:29:03,200 --> 00:29:06,160
Speaker 7: now giving you the information themselves. And as you see

562
00:29:06,240 --> 00:29:09,240
Speaker 7: younger artists that are now more empowered and now have

563
00:29:09,360 --> 00:29:12,520
Speaker 7: more of the tools to be able to to to

564
00:29:12,960 --> 00:29:16,120
Speaker 7: be strategic in the navigation of their own future, you

565
00:29:16,200 --> 00:29:19,360
Speaker 7: realize that that that you need to make some major

566
00:29:19,400 --> 00:29:23,480
Speaker 7: paradragmatic changes, right and and so in that you start

567
00:29:23,520 --> 00:29:28,920
Speaker 7: to have these divine, uh cosmic collisions that that that

568
00:29:29,000 --> 00:29:30,959
Speaker 7: I give you the information and the resources. One one

569
00:29:30,960 --> 00:29:33,920
Speaker 7: of one of the first individuals that that I became

570
00:29:33,960 --> 00:29:37,200
Speaker 7: blessed with that that that that really became a great

571
00:29:37,280 --> 00:29:38,880
Speaker 7: enlightenment for me. It was an individual by the name

572
00:29:38,880 --> 00:29:42,000
Speaker 7: of Ron Hill. Ron Hill was an individual that interned

573
00:29:42,000 --> 00:29:45,800
Speaker 7: with me when he was his senior in college and uh,

574
00:29:45,840 --> 00:29:48,200
Speaker 7: this was his space, this was his major, and so

575
00:29:48,680 --> 00:29:51,320
Speaker 7: he equipped me with the information that I did not have,

576
00:29:51,400 --> 00:29:54,320
Speaker 7: and he had the skill set like he's a he

577
00:29:54,320 --> 00:29:57,440
Speaker 7: he is a walking master class, like this individual like EJ. Gaines,

578
00:29:57,560 --> 00:30:00,440
Speaker 7: like Phil Thornton, and of these are the men of

579
00:30:00,480 --> 00:30:03,239
Speaker 7: color that that are that are kind of like the

580
00:30:03,280 --> 00:30:06,800
Speaker 7: wonder kinds that he's that he's pulled together, right, And

581
00:30:06,880 --> 00:30:10,880
Speaker 7: so with that, you are now able to have all

582
00:30:10,920 --> 00:30:13,520
Speaker 7: of this, all of this wisdom and information that you're

583
00:30:13,520 --> 00:30:15,840
Speaker 7: able to tap into. And so these were men that

584
00:30:15,920 --> 00:30:19,880
Speaker 7: I also found and in different parts of my journey

585
00:30:19,960 --> 00:30:24,440
Speaker 7: getting here as well. So the more I understood what

586
00:30:24,560 --> 00:30:27,959
Speaker 7: I did not have, and the more I was being

587
00:30:28,240 --> 00:30:31,240
Speaker 7: given the opportunity to understand what I could have just

588
00:30:31,280 --> 00:30:32,640
Speaker 7: with a couple of little.

589
00:30:32,840 --> 00:30:35,760
Speaker 5: Small changes, just some small changes.

590
00:30:36,040 --> 00:30:40,240
Speaker 7: But those small changes, the value in them has been

591
00:30:41,440 --> 00:30:43,840
Speaker 7: has been humbling and overwhelming and I can't even begin

592
00:30:43,920 --> 00:30:46,080
Speaker 7: to quantify what it's been for me.

593
00:30:46,960 --> 00:30:49,840
Speaker 5: It's been a miraculous journey.

594
00:30:50,880 --> 00:30:54,720
Speaker 1: As I was thinking about, I remember when you came

595
00:30:54,720 --> 00:30:57,280
Speaker 1: on the scene in the nineties and this is like

596
00:30:57,320 --> 00:31:01,040
Speaker 1: when TRL and Yellow Thing and Cities the thing and

597
00:31:01,160 --> 00:31:04,320
Speaker 1: they were showing your videos. Yeah, I'm thinking to myself, like,

598
00:31:04,440 --> 00:31:06,520
Speaker 1: this guy's made it to raps, Like how is this possible?

599
00:31:06,720 --> 00:31:09,440
Speaker 1: Beating people on the countdowns? And I'm like, yeah, that

600
00:31:09,520 --> 00:31:11,959
Speaker 1: was a CE era, right, So you're making money and CDs.

601
00:31:12,000 --> 00:31:14,160
Speaker 1: I'm sure you have a bunch of platinum records. I mean, yeah,

602
00:31:14,360 --> 00:31:18,200
Speaker 1: ount lists and then music changes. Yes, and it's now

603
00:31:18,200 --> 00:31:21,840
Speaker 1: a streaming era. Not really your expertise. I would assume

604
00:31:22,600 --> 00:31:25,320
Speaker 1: you are probably familiar with this space. How do you

605
00:31:25,440 --> 00:31:28,760
Speaker 1: navigate the streaming era? Coming from an artist who was

606
00:31:28,920 --> 00:31:32,720
Speaker 1: prominent and thrived in a different era of music.

607
00:31:32,640 --> 00:31:35,920
Speaker 6: Yeah, I mean gospel act like many genres. I mean,

608
00:31:37,400 --> 00:31:42,120
Speaker 6: like like many different drivers and music. At that time,

609
00:31:43,040 --> 00:31:46,800
Speaker 6: gospel remained primarily physical for quite some time. I think

610
00:31:46,840 --> 00:31:50,240
Speaker 6: that really that changed in the past three to five years.

611
00:31:50,960 --> 00:31:53,080
Speaker 6: When I came into the space of something, I noticed

612
00:31:53,320 --> 00:31:56,520
Speaker 6: they were, you know, you would have artists posts, don't

613
00:31:56,800 --> 00:31:58,760
Speaker 6: don't go on out for music, don't go on Spotify,

614
00:31:58,880 --> 00:32:02,160
Speaker 6: buy my you know, download actually by and what they

615
00:32:02,160 --> 00:32:04,560
Speaker 6: were fighting was a tide that was going to overwhelm them.

616
00:32:05,320 --> 00:32:07,240
Speaker 6: I think, you know, one of the main things I

617
00:32:07,320 --> 00:32:10,040
Speaker 6: focused on was embracing change because the change was coming.

618
00:32:10,080 --> 00:32:13,760
Speaker 6: It was inevitable. It's like attempting to stop people from

619
00:32:13,880 --> 00:32:17,560
Speaker 6: using AI now like music, people are really anti AI now.

620
00:32:17,880 --> 00:32:19,160
Speaker 2: The change is inevitable.

621
00:32:19,560 --> 00:32:22,040
Speaker 6: So either you're going to figure out a way to

622
00:32:22,120 --> 00:32:25,000
Speaker 6: adapt to change, or the change's going to move you

623
00:32:25,040 --> 00:32:27,160
Speaker 6: out the way. I remember when everybody used to have

624
00:32:27,200 --> 00:32:28,000
Speaker 6: a Kodak camera.

625
00:32:28,320 --> 00:32:28,440
Speaker 2: Now.

626
00:32:28,440 --> 00:32:31,480
Speaker 6: I know everybody used their iPhone, you know, and you

627
00:32:31,520 --> 00:32:35,240
Speaker 6: know the same company also disrupted music iTunes. It's the

628
00:32:35,280 --> 00:32:37,680
Speaker 6: way the only way to purchase music now. One of

629
00:32:37,720 --> 00:32:40,560
Speaker 6: the sole ways to purchase music now was not created

630
00:32:40,560 --> 00:32:43,760
Speaker 6: by the billion dollar record labels. It was created by

631
00:32:43,840 --> 00:32:48,200
Speaker 6: tech company in Silicon Valley. Because disruption's gonna happen now,

632
00:32:48,240 --> 00:32:50,280
Speaker 6: you can adapt to it, or you can think that

633
00:32:50,320 --> 00:32:53,360
Speaker 6: you're going to stop it. You're not gonna stop convenience.

634
00:32:53,760 --> 00:32:56,960
Speaker 6: We're in America. People love convenience. It's no different than

635
00:32:56,960 --> 00:32:59,360
Speaker 6: when they were trying to stop Uber for happening from happening,

636
00:32:59,440 --> 00:33:03,120
Speaker 6: or door down, that's Airbnb. Imagine tellings some people twenty

637
00:33:03,200 --> 00:33:05,680
Speaker 6: years ago, you're gonna have random strangers living in your

638
00:33:05,720 --> 00:33:07,400
Speaker 6: house when you're not there. You're gonna get in the

639
00:33:07,440 --> 00:33:10,200
Speaker 6: car with some guy you never met before. He's gonna

640
00:33:10,200 --> 00:33:13,200
Speaker 6: take you to your next location, all right. Or imagine this,

641
00:33:13,320 --> 00:33:15,120
Speaker 6: he's gonna pick up your McDonald's and drop it off

642
00:33:15,160 --> 00:33:15,640
Speaker 6: to you at two.

643
00:33:15,560 --> 00:33:16,320
Speaker 2: O'clock in the morning.

644
00:33:16,440 --> 00:33:19,560
Speaker 6: You're as gonna let strangers give them your address, come

645
00:33:19,560 --> 00:33:21,840
Speaker 6: to your house and give you your food that you don't know.

646
00:33:21,880 --> 00:33:23,440
Speaker 6: If you know we talk about back in the day,

647
00:33:23,600 --> 00:33:25,800
Speaker 6: you don't know if they spit in that, that's what that's.

648
00:33:27,760 --> 00:33:27,840
Speaker 2: Like.

649
00:33:28,360 --> 00:33:33,040
Speaker 6: Disruption and convenience are things that we're always going to

650
00:33:33,360 --> 00:33:37,080
Speaker 6: prioritize as Americans because that's the type of environment we

651
00:33:37,200 --> 00:33:44,120
Speaker 6: foster now, unless there's some socio socio physiological change amongst us,

652
00:33:44,480 --> 00:33:47,680
Speaker 6: which I don't see happening, convenience is the thing we prioritize.

653
00:33:47,680 --> 00:33:50,880
Speaker 6: And so when it came to music, it's easier for

654
00:33:50,960 --> 00:33:53,440
Speaker 6: me to just stream than this would be to go

655
00:33:53,480 --> 00:33:57,480
Speaker 6: to Walmart, buy your CD, put have a CD player, put.

656
00:33:57,240 --> 00:33:59,160
Speaker 2: It in my car, then listen to it.

657
00:33:59,440 --> 00:34:01,480
Speaker 6: When I have to do that for every single artist

658
00:34:01,520 --> 00:34:04,120
Speaker 6: instead of just putting you all on one playlist, picking

659
00:34:04,160 --> 00:34:05,720
Speaker 6: my favorite song and listening to it.

660
00:34:05,840 --> 00:34:07,320
Speaker 2: So I prioritize streaming.

661
00:34:07,360 --> 00:34:09,399
Speaker 6: When I came into the space, I was the guy

662
00:34:09,440 --> 00:34:12,200
Speaker 6: that actually figured out what the streaming record was in gospel.

663
00:34:12,920 --> 00:34:13,840
Speaker 2: I went through all.

664
00:34:13,719 --> 00:34:15,600
Speaker 6: The charts for like the past thirty years to put

665
00:34:15,600 --> 00:34:18,120
Speaker 6: that together with my guy Phil Thornton, and to shout

666
00:34:18,120 --> 00:34:20,239
Speaker 6: out to guys that Kirk mentioned, we all have come

667
00:34:20,280 --> 00:34:21,400
Speaker 6: together with one company.

668
00:34:21,400 --> 00:34:22,640
Speaker 2: They all work at Insignia.

669
00:34:22,840 --> 00:34:26,879
Speaker 6: They're the sea level executive team that does what Kirk

670
00:34:26,960 --> 00:34:29,840
Speaker 6: is talking about. We each sit down and eat every

671
00:34:29,840 --> 00:34:32,080
Speaker 6: division and we figure out how the best way to

672
00:34:32,080 --> 00:34:35,440
Speaker 6: monetize what Kirk is doing, what MAVI is doing with

673
00:34:35,440 --> 00:34:38,440
Speaker 6: our artists like Todd Gaber, Channel more Naomi Rain are doing.

674
00:34:38,840 --> 00:34:41,360
Speaker 6: And what that gives us a leg up on is

675
00:34:41,400 --> 00:34:42,560
Speaker 6: if you look at the charts.

676
00:34:42,360 --> 00:34:43,080
Speaker 2: It's indicative.

677
00:34:43,360 --> 00:34:45,680
Speaker 6: If you look at the gospel trants, you'll see that

678
00:34:45,960 --> 00:34:48,680
Speaker 6: primarily seven of the top ten records are released by

679
00:34:48,719 --> 00:34:52,560
Speaker 6: Trivel or something we worked on. You keep going down

680
00:34:52,600 --> 00:34:54,759
Speaker 6: further than that eight. I think it's sixteen out of

681
00:34:54,800 --> 00:34:57,960
Speaker 6: the top twenty. It's because if you don't embrace change,

682
00:34:58,000 --> 00:34:59,160
Speaker 6: change is going to run you over.

683
00:34:59,520 --> 00:35:01,120
Speaker 4: How do you think all about the current state of

684
00:35:01,160 --> 00:35:02,279
Speaker 4: gospel music.

685
00:35:02,560 --> 00:35:09,520
Speaker 6: Personally, I'm very I'm worried. The main thing, man, it's

686
00:35:09,520 --> 00:35:13,440
Speaker 6: got to discuss all day is how do we I

687
00:35:13,480 --> 00:35:17,560
Speaker 6: would say this for him after the BT, it was

688
00:35:17,560 --> 00:35:20,239
Speaker 6: it was a lot of conversation. The first question this

689
00:35:20,320 --> 00:35:23,319
Speaker 6: man asked us say at dinner was how do we

690
00:35:23,360 --> 00:35:26,279
Speaker 6: take this opportunity and make it something that's for the

691
00:35:26,480 --> 00:35:32,240
Speaker 6: entire genre. And the problem with that is the KPIs

692
00:35:32,880 --> 00:35:37,040
Speaker 6: that major mainstream institutions look at many gospel artists don't

693
00:35:37,040 --> 00:35:37,880
Speaker 6: feel are important.

694
00:35:38,640 --> 00:35:39,799
Speaker 2: And as long as you.

695
00:35:41,360 --> 00:35:45,160
Speaker 6: Don't position yourself in a manner to where you're attractive

696
00:35:45,520 --> 00:35:48,359
Speaker 6: to the very thing that can broaden the message that

697
00:35:48,400 --> 00:35:52,000
Speaker 6: we all want to reach everyone, you have to you

698
00:35:52,080 --> 00:35:53,239
Speaker 6: have to do certain things.

699
00:35:53,280 --> 00:35:56,080
Speaker 2: It's the Bible. You gotta become all things to all men.

700
00:35:56,000 --> 00:35:58,640
Speaker 6: To win some If you need to be fly, if

701
00:35:58,680 --> 00:36:01,840
Speaker 6: you need to be able to articulate in a certain conversation,

702
00:36:01,920 --> 00:36:03,040
Speaker 6: you need to be able to sit down and have

703
00:36:03,080 --> 00:36:05,320
Speaker 6: a conversation with you guys and be able to articulate

704
00:36:05,360 --> 00:36:09,000
Speaker 6: and understand business to push forward the gospel, then be

705
00:36:09,080 --> 00:36:12,560
Speaker 6: ready to do that. Not being prepared for that conversation,

706
00:36:12,680 --> 00:36:14,279
Speaker 6: to me is no different than when they buried their

707
00:36:14,280 --> 00:36:15,200
Speaker 6: talents in the Bible.

708
00:36:15,600 --> 00:36:17,359
Speaker 2: It's good, you know what I mean. That's how I

709
00:36:17,360 --> 00:36:17,759
Speaker 2: see it.

710
00:36:17,840 --> 00:36:19,520
Speaker 6: So when I look at the state of gospel vieus,

711
00:36:19,560 --> 00:36:21,440
Speaker 6: I look at a lot of people whining and complaining

712
00:36:21,480 --> 00:36:22,960
Speaker 6: about something they haven't prepared for.

713
00:36:23,880 --> 00:36:26,000
Speaker 7: And can I just jump in and say say that

714
00:36:26,000 --> 00:36:30,719
Speaker 7: that that that that that the the whining and complaining

715
00:36:30,800 --> 00:36:35,680
Speaker 7: also is the fatigue of not being able to have

716
00:36:35,760 --> 00:36:38,840
Speaker 7: the oxygen reach everyone. Yeah, that's what a lot of

717
00:36:38,880 --> 00:36:43,239
Speaker 7: it is also see the blessing and benefiting. The challenge

718
00:36:43,280 --> 00:36:46,040
Speaker 7: of my career is that it has allowed me to

719
00:36:46,080 --> 00:36:50,440
Speaker 7: have access I've been blessed to have access with with

720
00:36:50,440 --> 00:36:54,120
Speaker 7: with great minds and and and with spaces that challenge

721
00:36:54,200 --> 00:36:56,520
Speaker 7: my thinking, challenge me to want to be able to

722
00:36:56,680 --> 00:37:00,759
Speaker 7: push forward and have engaging opportunities and conversation too, to

723
00:37:00,880 --> 00:37:05,000
Speaker 7: not only enlighten but also be enlightened. Where most individuals

724
00:37:05,000 --> 00:37:08,839
Speaker 7: in my space, their ecosystem is the black church, it's

725
00:37:08,840 --> 00:37:11,200
Speaker 7: the black conference, it's the black events, it's the black

726
00:37:11,239 --> 00:37:16,240
Speaker 7: spaces where a lot of information never gets never gets.

727
00:37:16,120 --> 00:37:16,800
Speaker 4: To that level.

728
00:37:17,080 --> 00:37:19,520
Speaker 7: And so when you find out that there are other

729
00:37:19,600 --> 00:37:22,200
Speaker 7: conversations that are happening that you're not privy to, that

730
00:37:22,320 --> 00:37:25,399
Speaker 7: and it self can breed frustration. And so I think

731
00:37:25,440 --> 00:37:28,360
Speaker 7: that it is my passion to want to be a conduit,

732
00:37:28,600 --> 00:37:31,280
Speaker 7: to try to be a catalyst to get that information,

733
00:37:31,920 --> 00:37:34,240
Speaker 7: just to get this but even if it only impacts

734
00:37:34,280 --> 00:37:36,720
Speaker 7: one or two, at least we've been able to try

735
00:37:36,760 --> 00:37:38,759
Speaker 7: to do as much as we can to deposit and

736
00:37:38,800 --> 00:37:43,120
Speaker 7: invest in individuals that are able to keep the narrative going.

737
00:37:44,040 --> 00:37:45,400
Speaker 5: Yeah, it's important.

738
00:37:45,400 --> 00:37:47,480
Speaker 1: I asked the CD question because I was going to

739
00:37:47,560 --> 00:37:50,319
Speaker 1: church every Sunday and I was sitting the sound Upart

740
00:37:50,360 --> 00:37:53,560
Speaker 1: of Sound Industry and I'm making CDs. It's like twenty fifteen.

741
00:37:53,640 --> 00:37:56,120
Speaker 1: I'm like, they don't know that. People don't listen to CD,

742
00:37:56,200 --> 00:37:57,640
Speaker 1: but every Sunday I'm making the CD.

743
00:37:57,760 --> 00:37:58,400
Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah.

744
00:37:58,440 --> 00:38:00,080
Speaker 1: And so it brings me to the point where I'm like,

745
00:38:00,320 --> 00:38:02,319
Speaker 1: if the church doesn't get younger, where does it go?

746
00:38:02,680 --> 00:38:02,919
Speaker 2: Yeah?

747
00:38:03,680 --> 00:38:07,000
Speaker 1: And so when I'm thinking about the numbers that you

748
00:38:07,080 --> 00:38:09,120
Speaker 1: said right from the nineties, I don't disagree with you,

749
00:38:09,200 --> 00:38:11,400
Speaker 1: like there was a large percentage of people that identified

750
00:38:11,440 --> 00:38:14,920
Speaker 1: as Christian and went to church to where we're at today,

751
00:38:16,200 --> 00:38:19,480
Speaker 1: those numbers, I mean, if you're not declining, I mean,

752
00:38:19,480 --> 00:38:21,520
Speaker 1: if you're not inclining, you're declining.

753
00:38:21,560 --> 00:38:22,520
Speaker 5: You're declining to me.

754
00:38:22,640 --> 00:38:26,240
Speaker 1: So my question is like, how do we the state

755
00:38:26,280 --> 00:38:27,960
Speaker 1: of the I guess the Black Church, how do we

756
00:38:28,040 --> 00:38:30,239
Speaker 1: increase the youth participation in it?

757
00:38:30,560 --> 00:38:33,279
Speaker 3: Can I say something about that, cause I don't know

758
00:38:33,360 --> 00:38:36,880
Speaker 3: if that's entirely true For me, from the outside looking in,

759
00:38:37,840 --> 00:38:39,840
Speaker 3: it looks like there's more young people.

760
00:38:39,880 --> 00:38:43,040
Speaker 4: That's that. It feels like a renaissance. As far as

761
00:38:43,080 --> 00:38:44,120
Speaker 4: from what Icy.

762
00:38:44,160 --> 00:38:46,440
Speaker 3: Now, it is from Icy like I said, I'm on

763
00:38:46,480 --> 00:38:50,439
Speaker 3: the outside looking at but like even like Spiritual Word,

764
00:38:50,680 --> 00:38:53,600
Speaker 3: it's not really a Christian based thing, but it started.

765
00:38:53,640 --> 00:38:55,280
Speaker 4: That's a long story. But long story short.

766
00:38:55,920 --> 00:38:59,640
Speaker 1: Wait, hold on, were talking about that's how it started started?

767
00:38:59,680 --> 00:39:02,560
Speaker 5: Like now, like that's how what started spiritual work.

768
00:39:02,600 --> 00:39:04,799
Speaker 3: You know, Spiritual Word page. But Spiritual Word is a

769
00:39:04,800 --> 00:39:08,520
Speaker 3: big social media platform. Yeah, they have millions of followers.

770
00:39:08,960 --> 00:39:12,719
Speaker 3: If you watch their content, it's not Christian based at all,

771
00:39:12,760 --> 00:39:15,120
Speaker 3: but every now and then they'll throw a sermon, then

772
00:39:15,160 --> 00:39:17,000
Speaker 3: they'll throw some stuff. So I spoke to the owner

773
00:39:17,040 --> 00:39:20,200
Speaker 3: before and I'm like, your name is Spiritual Word, but

774
00:39:20,239 --> 00:39:22,719
Speaker 3: you're not really posting anything spiritually. And he was just saying,

775
00:39:22,760 --> 00:39:27,080
Speaker 3: like he started it as a Christian based platform, it

776
00:39:27,120 --> 00:39:29,719
Speaker 3: wasn't really gaining traction. They changed in the shade room,

777
00:39:29,920 --> 00:39:31,879
Speaker 3: but every now and then he tries to. But long

778
00:39:31,880 --> 00:39:36,680
Speaker 3: story short, I think that there's a lot of young

779
00:39:36,719 --> 00:39:42,120
Speaker 3: people that I see that are now becoming religious, embracing

780
00:39:42,120 --> 00:39:43,560
Speaker 3: that on social media at least that's what it.

781
00:39:43,480 --> 00:39:44,719
Speaker 2: Looks like they're spiritual.

782
00:39:45,280 --> 00:39:46,880
Speaker 5: That's the Yeah, there you go.

783
00:39:46,960 --> 00:39:50,360
Speaker 1: I think that's the difference people like people will identify

784
00:39:50,440 --> 00:39:53,080
Speaker 1: as spiritually. I'm talking spiritual right, the people that are

785
00:39:53,080 --> 00:39:56,200
Speaker 1: going like the youth right. I was a teacher for

786
00:39:56,480 --> 00:39:59,759
Speaker 1: fifteen years. Churchill wasn't even something that students. It's not

787
00:39:59,800 --> 00:40:01,840
Speaker 1: even a place that they were going. And I was

788
00:40:01,880 --> 00:40:03,839
Speaker 1: in the community that I was teaching. I was going

789
00:40:03,880 --> 00:40:05,600
Speaker 1: to church there, and I never saw any of my students.

790
00:40:05,760 --> 00:40:08,880
Speaker 1: I'm like, the church two blocks away, nobody's going. And

791
00:40:08,920 --> 00:40:11,719
Speaker 1: then it hit me, I'm like, wait, I'm looking at

792
00:40:11,719 --> 00:40:14,680
Speaker 1: it in New York City. I'm like, are people bringing

793
00:40:15,000 --> 00:40:15,879
Speaker 1: the children to church?

794
00:40:15,960 --> 00:40:16,080
Speaker 2: Right?

795
00:40:16,120 --> 00:40:18,279
Speaker 1: You used to have to go with your grandma? Right

796
00:40:18,320 --> 00:40:21,040
Speaker 1: then your mom's not going, so you stopped going. How

797
00:40:21,080 --> 00:40:22,240
Speaker 1: do we reverse that cycle?

798
00:40:22,239 --> 00:40:25,360
Speaker 2: Though? One of the key things, and this is to

799
00:40:25,440 --> 00:40:26,600
Speaker 2: kind of come to what you're saying.

800
00:40:26,800 --> 00:40:29,080
Speaker 6: What you see and what you feel and what you

801
00:40:29,320 --> 00:40:33,720
Speaker 6: notice is what you see across the gospel Christian music

802
00:40:33,760 --> 00:40:37,719
Speaker 6: space is. And I talked to Kirk about this a lot.

803
00:40:37,760 --> 00:40:43,040
Speaker 6: The struggle that existed in the eighties and the nineties

804
00:40:43,080 --> 00:40:46,000
Speaker 6: that made our grandma make us go to church. I'm

805
00:40:46,000 --> 00:40:48,560
Speaker 6: not saying it doesn't exist anymore, but the way it

806
00:40:48,640 --> 00:40:52,200
Speaker 6: exists is different. When you think about Kirk Franklin's daughter

807
00:40:52,440 --> 00:40:55,399
Speaker 6: or my ive eighteen year old and you guys, now

808
00:40:55,600 --> 00:40:58,240
Speaker 6: you're talking about you, you're talking about young African American

809
00:40:58,280 --> 00:41:02,400
Speaker 6: men who likely a millionaires. The way we raise our

810
00:41:02,480 --> 00:41:05,120
Speaker 6: children is totally different than how we came up, and

811
00:41:05,160 --> 00:41:08,880
Speaker 6: so what we sought from the Black church in the

812
00:41:09,040 --> 00:41:12,520
Speaker 6: eighties and the nineties isn't the same thing my daughter's

813
00:41:12,560 --> 00:41:16,840
Speaker 6: gonna seek from church. They're seeking a different experience. And

814
00:41:16,880 --> 00:41:19,680
Speaker 6: when you seek that different experience, it's a different environment.

815
00:41:20,120 --> 00:41:23,799
Speaker 6: And so a lot of times now you have young

816
00:41:23,840 --> 00:41:26,880
Speaker 6: African American kids that go to what we would consider

817
00:41:26,960 --> 00:41:30,480
Speaker 6: evangelical white church because they want to hear a different

818
00:41:30,520 --> 00:41:33,359
Speaker 6: style of music. That's where their friends go. That's who

819
00:41:33,400 --> 00:41:36,160
Speaker 6: they went to college with, that's who uh, that's what

820
00:41:36,280 --> 00:41:39,080
Speaker 6: they're working with. So no, they're not going to go

821
00:41:39,160 --> 00:41:43,600
Speaker 6: to the Baptist church around the corner. They're going to

822
00:41:43,640 --> 00:41:46,960
Speaker 6: the megachurch over here. Because everybody likes the place. They

823
00:41:47,000 --> 00:41:49,360
Speaker 6: can't get in that, I mean even churches or watching

824
00:41:49,480 --> 00:41:51,960
Speaker 6: watch it online or watch it online. The thing that

825
00:41:52,000 --> 00:41:56,200
Speaker 6: happened with COVID is that Black churches with disproportionately unprepared

826
00:41:56,719 --> 00:42:00,840
Speaker 6: for streaming. When it came time to stream. We are

827
00:42:01,360 --> 00:42:04,960
Speaker 6: experiential people, so we ain't have cameras when they ain't

828
00:42:04,960 --> 00:42:07,360
Speaker 6: believe it is they weren't good. They was making CDs

829
00:42:07,440 --> 00:42:10,760
Speaker 6: still in twenty twenty, yeah, buddy, So they was making

830
00:42:10,920 --> 00:42:14,600
Speaker 6: these and selling the pastor sermon every mega or the

831
00:42:14,960 --> 00:42:16,120
Speaker 6: evangelical white churches.

832
00:42:16,120 --> 00:42:16,600
Speaker 2: They were prepared.

833
00:42:16,600 --> 00:42:19,319
Speaker 6: They were streaming already that huge. They were having huge

834
00:42:19,360 --> 00:42:20,040
Speaker 6: numbers already.

835
00:42:20,120 --> 00:42:20,279
Speaker 2: Yeah.

836
00:42:20,320 --> 00:42:22,040
Speaker 6: And that's why you start to addving to Mike Todd,

837
00:42:22,200 --> 00:42:24,799
Speaker 6: pastor Mike Todd, and that's why his church blew up

838
00:42:25,040 --> 00:42:27,840
Speaker 6: because he was one of the few black pastors at

839
00:42:27,880 --> 00:42:30,160
Speaker 6: the time that went tapped in, was taped in then

840
00:42:30,160 --> 00:42:32,279
Speaker 6: and ready to go in Manwick City at the time,

841
00:42:32,280 --> 00:42:34,160
Speaker 6: they were one of the only groups still making music.

842
00:42:34,200 --> 00:42:36,360
Speaker 6: They blew up at the time they became the worship

843
00:42:36,400 --> 00:42:40,040
Speaker 6: team for all of America. And so much like anything else,

844
00:42:41,640 --> 00:42:45,319
Speaker 6: what streaming was necessary. Then everybody's trying to catch up,

845
00:42:45,719 --> 00:42:46,920
Speaker 6: everybody's trying to get there.

846
00:42:47,160 --> 00:42:48,160
Speaker 2: One of the foundations of.

847
00:42:48,160 --> 00:42:52,480
Speaker 6: My company was we were doing almost seven hundred services

848
00:42:52,520 --> 00:42:56,480
Speaker 6: for churches from my house every Sunday during COVID because

849
00:42:57,280 --> 00:43:00,239
Speaker 6: churches they didn't know how to stream it. They and

850
00:43:00,280 --> 00:43:02,960
Speaker 6: then at that point people starting to record early because

851
00:43:03,000 --> 00:43:06,000
Speaker 6: you had to be live and in Facebook was crashing

852
00:43:06,640 --> 00:43:08,160
Speaker 6: to was crashing that to.

853
00:43:08,080 --> 00:43:11,160
Speaker 2: Have a way to have a.

854
00:43:10,400 --> 00:43:13,080
Speaker 6: Redundancy, and a lot of churches just didn't have or

855
00:43:13,120 --> 00:43:15,800
Speaker 6: could afford to setting it up last minute. So what

856
00:43:15,920 --> 00:43:18,480
Speaker 6: we're talking about and how when you're talking about things

857
00:43:18,520 --> 00:43:20,760
Speaker 6: are growing, it's growing. It's not going in the black church.

858
00:43:21,040 --> 00:43:22,680
Speaker 7: Well, and then I also want to jump in and say,

859
00:43:22,680 --> 00:43:25,160
Speaker 7: if you don't mind, it's growing, but it is not

860
00:43:25,760 --> 00:43:34,839
Speaker 7: growing in the traditional monotheistic, monothistic ideal that that that

861
00:43:34,840 --> 00:43:37,759
Speaker 7: that we were raised at. It is very much Jesus adjacent.

862
00:43:38,400 --> 00:43:42,560
Speaker 7: It's very much youth meaning that you have now younger

863
00:43:42,640 --> 00:43:46,479
Speaker 7: Christians that don't believe in Jesus and crystals that that

864
00:43:46,480 --> 00:43:49,480
Speaker 7: that that that that that that it's both and now

865
00:43:49,840 --> 00:43:53,720
Speaker 7: where where where there is this there is this pluralistic

866
00:43:53,880 --> 00:43:58,960
Speaker 7: ideal that is permeated Western Christianity in the younger generation.

867
00:43:59,320 --> 00:44:01,279
Speaker 7: And a lot of these churches that they go to

868
00:44:01,640 --> 00:44:05,239
Speaker 7: are almost like Christian's bars, the christ Christmas bos. Are

869
00:44:05,239 --> 00:44:07,400
Speaker 7: you gonna get your neck rubb, you're gonna figure if

870
00:44:07,400 --> 00:44:09,600
Speaker 7: you're gonna get your feet done, you're gonna get your

871
00:44:09,640 --> 00:44:12,000
Speaker 7: head done. You know, everything is about the better man.

872
00:44:12,719 --> 00:44:17,359
Speaker 7: It's almost like spiritual Ted talks so so so it's

873
00:44:17,440 --> 00:44:20,400
Speaker 7: not challenging people. And so you got to remember, you know, man,

874
00:44:20,400 --> 00:44:23,239
Speaker 7: think about gospel music, God's music, talked about the Cross,

875
00:44:23,560 --> 00:44:25,920
Speaker 7: talk about the blood of Jesus, and talk about you know,

876
00:44:26,120 --> 00:44:29,720
Speaker 7: you know God forgive me for my sins. Yeah, he's able.

877
00:44:30,280 --> 00:44:32,200
Speaker 7: I mean you talk to younger generation, what's sin?

878
00:44:33,360 --> 00:44:33,879
Speaker 4: What sin?

879
00:44:35,160 --> 00:44:37,279
Speaker 7: Sin is a man made construct to a lot of

880
00:44:37,280 --> 00:44:40,200
Speaker 7: these individuals. And so this is not to demonize the

881
00:44:40,239 --> 00:44:43,520
Speaker 7: next generation. I'm saying that these things begin to also

882
00:44:43,920 --> 00:44:48,200
Speaker 7: filter down to the music. It's going to impact the music.

883
00:44:48,480 --> 00:44:50,560
Speaker 7: When you are against the rapper. It's hardest to rap

884
00:44:50,640 --> 00:44:53,880
Speaker 7: like that when you move to Brentwood. It's easy to

885
00:44:53,920 --> 00:44:55,759
Speaker 7: rap like that when you still live in Compton. But

886
00:44:55,800 --> 00:44:58,680
Speaker 7: when you move, when you move to Beverly Hills, it's

887
00:44:58,719 --> 00:45:00,640
Speaker 7: gonna affect your music. It's going to facture, it's going

888
00:45:00,680 --> 00:45:03,080
Speaker 7: to affect the fire of your lyrical content. And what

889
00:45:03,120 --> 00:45:06,600
Speaker 7: has happened is that American culture has moved from the

890
00:45:07,160 --> 00:45:10,839
Speaker 7: and and I can't say, I humbly can't say all

891
00:45:10,880 --> 00:45:13,760
Speaker 7: of it is bad. It's because I think a lot

892
00:45:13,800 --> 00:45:19,879
Speaker 7: of what we were grouped into a lot of or

893
00:45:19,960 --> 00:45:24,400
Speaker 7: or or indoctrinated into was also dogma. It was also

894
00:45:25,080 --> 00:45:29,880
Speaker 7: the the the the residue of colonialism, you know, and

895
00:45:30,520 --> 00:45:34,359
Speaker 7: the residue of Puritanism. And because that's what that that

896
00:45:34,480 --> 00:45:37,840
Speaker 7: those are the tenets of Western Christianity, Western Christianity, the

897
00:45:37,840 --> 00:45:41,880
Speaker 7: tennis are colonialism and puritanism. And so those did not

898
00:45:42,040 --> 00:45:46,040
Speaker 7: really speak to the need flavery. Well, that that is

899
00:45:46,080 --> 00:45:48,600
Speaker 7: the birth of colonialism and puritanism, you know what I'm saying.

900
00:45:48,640 --> 00:45:51,719
Speaker 7: It's like the Mama of colonialism and the dad e

901
00:45:51,760 --> 00:45:55,840
Speaker 7: Puritanism birth slavery, right, and so we understand that that

902
00:45:55,840 --> 00:45:59,080
Speaker 7: that that that Western Chris, Western Christianity is rolled in

903
00:45:59,160 --> 00:46:01,880
Speaker 7: that space. And even what gospel music was at the

904
00:46:01,880 --> 00:46:03,439
Speaker 7: time was what how I got over.

905
00:46:03,719 --> 00:46:06,080
Speaker 4: Lord helped me get through, Lord keep me strong.

906
00:46:06,360 --> 00:46:09,480
Speaker 7: And so now that we're seeing people being able to

907
00:46:09,560 --> 00:46:13,640
Speaker 7: be elevated from these spaces, it's going to impact the

908
00:46:13,719 --> 00:46:16,759
Speaker 7: music and it's also going to impact their idea of

909
00:46:16,840 --> 00:46:17,560
Speaker 7: who God is.

910
00:46:18,239 --> 00:46:18,479
Speaker 2: Good.

911
00:46:18,960 --> 00:46:21,080
Speaker 4: Well, let me ask you this. You guys spoke about

912
00:46:21,080 --> 00:46:22,000
Speaker 4: tech a lot.

913
00:46:22,960 --> 00:46:25,120
Speaker 3: Another one of our friends, Timbaland he got a lot

914
00:46:25,120 --> 00:46:27,960
Speaker 3: of heat recently saw that we're working with him on

915
00:46:28,040 --> 00:46:32,280
Speaker 3: So okay, he signed that, but he signed the AI artist,

916
00:46:33,080 --> 00:46:34,680
Speaker 3: and people were very disappointed.

917
00:46:35,200 --> 00:46:36,640
Speaker 4: They were let down.

918
00:46:36,719 --> 00:46:40,000
Speaker 3: The artists said that he was betraying the art of

919
00:46:40,120 --> 00:46:43,480
Speaker 3: music and that some people even want as far as

920
00:46:43,520 --> 00:46:47,080
Speaker 3: say that this is demonic. I saw what is your

921
00:46:47,120 --> 00:46:49,880
Speaker 3: thoughts on AI's role in music?

922
00:46:50,440 --> 00:46:52,800
Speaker 2: Anything can be used for the good of God. Anything

923
00:46:53,840 --> 00:46:54,560
Speaker 2: I believe that.

924
00:46:55,600 --> 00:46:59,040
Speaker 6: I don't believe anything under the sun it cannot be

925
00:46:59,160 --> 00:47:00,680
Speaker 6: used for the benefit of God.

926
00:47:00,760 --> 00:47:02,960
Speaker 2: So, whether that's AI, whether.

927
00:47:02,760 --> 00:47:07,200
Speaker 6: That's whatever, I mean, there's certain things that are you

928
00:47:07,239 --> 00:47:09,959
Speaker 6: know people, Someone says, well, what about porn? Well, sex

929
00:47:10,080 --> 00:47:12,400
Speaker 6: was created by God to be in the confines of marriage.

930
00:47:12,400 --> 00:47:14,239
Speaker 6: So I'm just gonna come to that point and to

931
00:47:14,280 --> 00:47:18,680
Speaker 6: say everything has a purpose that God intended for as

932
00:47:18,719 --> 00:47:21,920
Speaker 6: it pertains the Timbland. Overall, I'm gonna stick to what

933
00:47:21,960 --> 00:47:24,799
Speaker 6: I said earlier. You can fight the tide all you want.

934
00:47:24,800 --> 00:47:30,000
Speaker 6: The tide is gonna overwhelm. Will people decide that they

935
00:47:30,120 --> 00:47:33,319
Speaker 6: don't like to listen to an AI generator artist?

936
00:47:33,440 --> 00:47:36,799
Speaker 2: We don't know yet. It's like being early to anything, right.

937
00:47:37,000 --> 00:47:39,359
Speaker 6: If you talk about being early and the streaming people say,

938
00:47:39,400 --> 00:47:42,960
Speaker 6: I'll never download Spotify, I'll never download Apple Music. The

939
00:47:43,040 --> 00:47:45,239
Speaker 6: artists don't get the money they're paying pennies on the dollar. Now,

940
00:47:45,280 --> 00:47:47,160
Speaker 6: you couldn't find a CD if you want it one,

941
00:47:47,440 --> 00:47:49,600
Speaker 6: you know what I mean. So to me, I believe

942
00:47:49,640 --> 00:47:52,759
Speaker 6: Timberlan is early. I was maybe too early. I think

943
00:47:52,760 --> 00:47:54,840
Speaker 6: he's going to be the one that bears the brunt

944
00:47:55,239 --> 00:47:59,719
Speaker 6: of the frustration of that artists existing because you're saying, basically,

945
00:48:00,040 --> 00:48:03,520
Speaker 6: you're taking publishing, you're taking royalties, and you're giving them

946
00:48:03,600 --> 00:48:06,440
Speaker 6: all to the person that creates this AI entity. But

947
00:48:06,520 --> 00:48:08,640
Speaker 6: I believe that's where music will go when you talk

948
00:48:08,719 --> 00:48:12,480
Speaker 6: about ten twenty years from now, I do believe many

949
00:48:12,719 --> 00:48:17,040
Speaker 6: artists will simply be AI creations from the minds of

950
00:48:17,040 --> 00:48:19,759
Speaker 6: the Kirk Franklins of the world, from the minds of

951
00:48:19,800 --> 00:48:22,520
Speaker 6: the Drakes of the world, from the DJ Callis of

952
00:48:22,520 --> 00:48:24,120
Speaker 6: the world, from the whatever.

953
00:48:24,200 --> 00:48:25,560
Speaker 2: Because it's just going to be more convenient.

954
00:48:25,680 --> 00:48:27,680
Speaker 6: I don't got to get a session together, I don't

955
00:48:27,680 --> 00:48:30,719
Speaker 6: gotta pay for studio time, I don't got to pay producers.

956
00:48:30,960 --> 00:48:34,600
Speaker 6: Whenever you can find a throughput to cheaper and hire

957
00:48:34,680 --> 00:48:40,280
Speaker 6: ore ROI. You cannot fight the tide of efficiency. People

958
00:48:40,320 --> 00:48:43,360
Speaker 6: are not gonna do something that is inefficient for the

959
00:48:43,480 --> 00:48:46,080
Speaker 6: feeling of it, even if they say that they will

960
00:48:46,120 --> 00:48:48,640
Speaker 6: on camera. Behind the scenes, They're going to figure out

961
00:48:48,640 --> 00:48:50,600
Speaker 6: a way to do it and mask it under some

962
00:48:50,719 --> 00:48:54,719
Speaker 6: different umbrella. And I've already heard and had those conversations currently,

963
00:48:55,160 --> 00:48:57,520
Speaker 6: So ten twenty years from now, I believe a lot

964
00:48:57,560 --> 00:49:00,520
Speaker 6: of music will be AI mood driven. Imagine being able

965
00:49:00,560 --> 00:49:02,920
Speaker 6: to pick up your phone and based on how you're feeling,

966
00:49:03,160 --> 00:49:06,879
Speaker 6: it creates music to make you feel and that I'm

967
00:49:06,880 --> 00:49:09,160
Speaker 6: getting ready to go to the club. Boom, you got

968
00:49:09,239 --> 00:49:11,280
Speaker 6: exactly what you want. I'm getting ready to go to church. Boom,

969
00:49:11,360 --> 00:49:13,640
Speaker 6: you got exactly what you want. My life's about to

970
00:49:13,680 --> 00:49:15,399
Speaker 6: have a baby. Boom, you got exactly what you want.

971
00:49:15,400 --> 00:49:17,680
Speaker 6: I need to get my baby to bed. Imagine having

972
00:49:17,680 --> 00:49:19,959
Speaker 6: the most soothing playlist ever to get your baby to bed.

973
00:49:20,080 --> 00:49:21,040
Speaker 6: No one's gonna fight.

974
00:49:20,960 --> 00:49:24,400
Speaker 5: That one thing that I can can can can can.

975
00:49:24,360 --> 00:49:24,960
Speaker 4: Can say to it.

976
00:49:25,000 --> 00:49:26,879
Speaker 7: Let me let me just give just a little let

977
00:49:26,880 --> 00:49:28,960
Speaker 7: me just give just a little small twist to if

978
00:49:28,960 --> 00:49:31,840
Speaker 7: you don't mind in my time. And you know it

979
00:49:31,880 --> 00:49:34,239
Speaker 7: is because on the in the conversation, I'm the og

980
00:49:34,360 --> 00:49:36,160
Speaker 7: at the table, right, you know, you know, you know

981
00:49:36,320 --> 00:49:40,240
Speaker 7: I'm eighty seven years old, right, I remember the advent

982
00:49:40,239 --> 00:49:44,319
Speaker 7: of the conversation, of cloning, and I remember how big you.

983
00:49:44,360 --> 00:49:46,120
Speaker 7: I can't get thinking, I think you know where I'm going.

984
00:49:46,280 --> 00:49:48,840
Speaker 7: And it was a big conversation and people had a

985
00:49:48,840 --> 00:49:50,440
Speaker 7: lot of anxiety about cloning.

986
00:49:50,600 --> 00:49:51,920
Speaker 4: You didn't know where was going.

987
00:49:52,160 --> 00:49:54,840
Speaker 7: One thing that I think that you can never ever duplicate,

988
00:49:54,920 --> 00:49:57,240
Speaker 7: and I think that the younger generation continue to speak

989
00:49:57,280 --> 00:50:00,560
Speaker 7: loud about this as well, is authenticity. One thing that

990
00:50:00,600 --> 00:50:04,680
Speaker 7: you will not be able to just manipulate is authentic voices.

991
00:50:04,880 --> 00:50:08,680
Speaker 7: Is because no matter how much information and technology continues

992
00:50:08,719 --> 00:50:12,160
Speaker 7: to grow, we are still with our species given these

993
00:50:12,560 --> 00:50:16,719
Speaker 7: these these these interesting dynamics of emotions and affections that

994
00:50:16,840 --> 00:50:20,440
Speaker 7: we still look for authentic voices to speak into. And

995
00:50:20,600 --> 00:50:23,800
Speaker 7: I believe that that that storytellers, even though the stories

996
00:50:23,840 --> 00:50:25,880
Speaker 7: may be told different, there still has to be a

997
00:50:25,920 --> 00:50:29,320
Speaker 7: certain level of authenticity to the story that I believe

998
00:50:29,360 --> 00:50:32,239
Speaker 7: that only our species can deliver. And that's why I

999
00:50:32,280 --> 00:50:35,160
Speaker 7: believe that you didn't see much of cloning continue to advances,

1000
00:50:35,200 --> 00:50:38,200
Speaker 7: because people still want to be able to hold in

1001
00:50:38,440 --> 00:50:43,160
Speaker 7: a time where the survival of our species is already

1002
00:50:43,160 --> 00:50:46,640
Speaker 7: so questionable with the political tension that we see globally.

1003
00:50:46,920 --> 00:50:49,279
Speaker 7: You know, when we see this geopolitical tension that we're

1004
00:50:49,320 --> 00:50:52,680
Speaker 7: living in right now. People are begging and pulling for

1005
00:50:52,840 --> 00:50:58,040
Speaker 7: something that is foundational, something that is rooted in, something

1006
00:50:58,040 --> 00:51:01,120
Speaker 7: that they can It's almost like what's well. One of

1007
00:51:01,440 --> 00:51:04,279
Speaker 7: one of my favorite movies is Inception, and I love

1008
00:51:04,320 --> 00:51:07,000
Speaker 7: the fact that an exception he was able to go

1009
00:51:07,040 --> 00:51:11,240
Speaker 7: into these different levels of these unrealities, but he needed

1010
00:51:11,280 --> 00:51:13,960
Speaker 7: something to remind him of the truth, right, and so

1011
00:51:14,040 --> 00:51:17,080
Speaker 7: he needed that spinner. Yeah, yeah, just to remind him

1012
00:51:17,080 --> 00:51:21,719
Speaker 7: of true soul. So as much as technology and informations

1013
00:51:21,760 --> 00:51:24,440
Speaker 7: and as humans that we advance, I believe that one

1014
00:51:24,480 --> 00:51:26,759
Speaker 7: thing about art, and the reason why real art is

1015
00:51:26,760 --> 00:51:30,279
Speaker 7: because you were even talking about, think about as much

1016
00:51:30,280 --> 00:51:33,759
Speaker 7: as tech, technology information has continued to grow, a Picasso

1017
00:51:34,360 --> 00:51:38,680
Speaker 7: still has its value. Is that because there's something authentic

1018
00:51:38,719 --> 00:51:41,800
Speaker 7: about the narrative of where this individual was when he

1019
00:51:41,880 --> 00:51:44,839
Speaker 7: painted it. And so I think the music and storytellers

1020
00:51:44,880 --> 00:51:47,120
Speaker 7: are still going to have a place. We're going to

1021
00:51:47,200 --> 00:51:50,120
Speaker 7: find these abbs and flows of AI in different levels

1022
00:51:50,160 --> 00:51:53,880
Speaker 7: of technology. But I'm still comfortable that when people have pain,

1023
00:51:54,239 --> 00:51:56,040
Speaker 7: they're going to need a real voice to speak to

1024
00:51:56,080 --> 00:51:56,479
Speaker 7: that pain.

1025
00:51:57,000 --> 00:51:59,759
Speaker 1: You bring up a good point in terms of AI

1026
00:52:00,040 --> 00:52:02,400
Speaker 1: and music, So I want to know your thoughts about

1027
00:52:02,400 --> 00:52:08,960
Speaker 1: AI in the church, because we've seen augentic agents that

1028
00:52:09,040 --> 00:52:14,480
Speaker 1: are now pastors. We've seen pastors who use AI to

1029
00:52:14,560 --> 00:52:19,200
Speaker 1: help create sermon. That's a complete shift right when we're

1030
00:52:19,200 --> 00:52:22,440
Speaker 1: talking about this obviously the story of the Bible interpretation

1031
00:52:22,560 --> 00:52:24,800
Speaker 1: of it, but the autensity of the actual person who's

1032
00:52:24,800 --> 00:52:28,560
Speaker 1: delivering the message. Do you see that becoming disruptive AI

1033
00:52:28,640 --> 00:52:30,160
Speaker 1: inside of the actual church.

1034
00:52:32,680 --> 00:52:36,640
Speaker 7: I still believe that as we continue to try to

1035
00:52:36,680 --> 00:52:39,759
Speaker 7: push and see how far these barriers can go, or

1036
00:52:39,760 --> 00:52:42,319
Speaker 7: these boundaries can go, I do believe that there still

1037
00:52:42,320 --> 00:52:45,440
Speaker 7: will be a ceiling that will happen in the hearts

1038
00:52:45,480 --> 00:52:48,319
Speaker 7: and minds of individuals, that they will still find the

1039
00:52:48,360 --> 00:52:50,160
Speaker 7: space that they still want to be able to do.

1040
00:52:50,480 --> 00:52:54,400
Speaker 7: It's like, for example, you know, and I say this

1041
00:52:54,520 --> 00:53:00,919
Speaker 7: with great humility, great, great, great gratefulness, ten ten years ago,

1042
00:53:00,960 --> 00:53:04,160
Speaker 7: fifteen years ago, would you ever thought that people would

1043
00:53:04,160 --> 00:53:05,799
Speaker 7: have stayed up to twelve and one o'clock in the

1044
00:53:05,800 --> 00:53:09,120
Speaker 7: morning to hear fifty five year old gospel artists and

1045
00:53:10,000 --> 00:53:10,959
Speaker 7: a black.

1046
00:53:10,600 --> 00:53:14,520
Speaker 5: Award show only if his name was Kurt Franks.

1047
00:53:15,120 --> 00:53:16,600
Speaker 4: Well forget him anybody else.

1048
00:53:16,800 --> 00:53:20,959
Speaker 7: I'm just saying that it still says that it still

1049
00:53:21,000 --> 00:53:25,000
Speaker 7: says that for individuals, there's still something about voices.

1050
00:53:24,600 --> 00:53:26,560
Speaker 4: That they still want to be able to hear and

1051
00:53:26,600 --> 00:53:27,239
Speaker 4: hold on to.

1052
00:53:27,880 --> 00:53:31,319
Speaker 7: And so, even though there's a myriad of voices that

1053
00:53:31,360 --> 00:53:34,920
Speaker 7: have advanced far beyond Kurt Franklin, there's still something, by

1054
00:53:35,000 --> 00:53:37,440
Speaker 7: the grace of God, I'm very grateful. I don't know why,

1055
00:53:37,840 --> 00:53:41,200
Speaker 7: but it's still something that whatever. The music that God

1056
00:53:41,320 --> 00:53:45,680
Speaker 7: trusted to alone me still anchors people some people, And

1057
00:53:45,719 --> 00:53:47,600
Speaker 7: so I believe that no matter how much we try

1058
00:53:47,640 --> 00:53:50,680
Speaker 7: to curate these ideas outside of humans, people are still

1059
00:53:50,680 --> 00:53:56,080
Speaker 7: going to want that pastor, that social leader, that artist,

1060
00:53:56,200 --> 00:53:59,160
Speaker 7: that storyteller to be the one to say, I'm telling

1061
00:53:59,239 --> 00:54:02,640
Speaker 7: this because I live. This came from me being in prison.

1062
00:54:02,680 --> 00:54:04,399
Speaker 7: This came from me being in jail. This came from

1063
00:54:04,400 --> 00:54:09,160
Speaker 7: me having a cancer scare. And so I am. I

1064
00:54:09,200 --> 00:54:12,359
Speaker 7: am aware, but I'm not afraid now.

1065
00:54:12,440 --> 00:54:14,960
Speaker 1: I only asked that because it goes back to the

1066
00:54:14,960 --> 00:54:18,440
Speaker 1: first question of if there's less people actually going to

1067
00:54:18,520 --> 00:54:21,839
Speaker 1: the institution of the church, right and they're getting more

1068
00:54:21,840 --> 00:54:22,520
Speaker 1: influenced from.

1069
00:54:22,480 --> 00:54:25,839
Speaker 7: They We're building new churches. We're building new churches. This

1070
00:54:25,920 --> 00:54:28,600
Speaker 7: is church now, absolutely, this is church. Church is a

1071
00:54:28,680 --> 00:54:31,879
Speaker 7: gathering of believers and there you go. I think we'll

1072
00:54:31,880 --> 00:54:33,880
Speaker 7: have a you will have a unique concept on it.

1073
00:54:33,960 --> 00:54:36,960
Speaker 7: I think with Jennef King's King Church.

1074
00:54:37,120 --> 00:54:41,279
Speaker 6: Yeah, what we're talking about is it's two things, and

1075
00:54:41,320 --> 00:54:43,680
Speaker 6: I don't want to conflate them. Is I don't think

1076
00:54:43,680 --> 00:54:48,879
Speaker 6: you'll ever eliminate actual people making music. I don't think

1077
00:54:48,920 --> 00:54:51,200
Speaker 6: we'll eliminate it. I do believe they will be AI

1078
00:54:51,200 --> 00:54:53,400
Speaker 6: al rightist, it's no different. I used to work in banking,

1079
00:54:53,680 --> 00:54:55,880
Speaker 6: and I remember when I first started working in bankings.

1080
00:54:55,920 --> 00:54:58,239
Speaker 6: Probably i'm aging something forty years old. I was twenty

1081
00:54:58,320 --> 00:55:00,680
Speaker 6: years ago. Basically I was young. I was in college.

1082
00:55:00,719 --> 00:55:02,600
Speaker 6: I was one of the personal bankers, and they talked

1083
00:55:02,640 --> 00:55:06,120
Speaker 6: about how people, no matter what's happening online banking, people

1084
00:55:06,160 --> 00:55:08,439
Speaker 6: will always want to come into the bank to meet

1085
00:55:08,480 --> 00:55:11,799
Speaker 6: with somebody, have a conversation. Okay, when's the last top

1086
00:55:11,840 --> 00:55:14,360
Speaker 6: any of us are here been inside the bank. The

1087
00:55:14,400 --> 00:55:16,560
Speaker 6: point I'm making is people still go inside the bank.

1088
00:55:17,320 --> 00:55:20,239
Speaker 6: I'm not saying anything will be eliminated, but the way

1089
00:55:20,239 --> 00:55:23,440
Speaker 6: we do it will drastically change. All of us have

1090
00:55:23,520 --> 00:55:25,759
Speaker 6: a bank app on our phone right now, and back

1091
00:55:26,000 --> 00:55:28,480
Speaker 6: when I started to bank, that was foreign people came

1092
00:55:28,520 --> 00:55:29,320
Speaker 6: into the bank.

1093
00:55:29,120 --> 00:55:31,120
Speaker 2: To learn how to download the app log it.

1094
00:55:31,280 --> 00:55:32,920
Speaker 6: I don't want to put my password into all. But

1095
00:55:33,880 --> 00:55:37,640
Speaker 6: we relax all of that for convenience. And that's why

1096
00:55:37,760 --> 00:55:41,240
Speaker 6: the only way I see technology slowing down and changing

1097
00:55:41,280 --> 00:55:44,799
Speaker 6: our way of life is if we decide philosophically that

1098
00:55:45,040 --> 00:55:48,440
Speaker 6: convenience isn't the thing that drives how we spend our money.

1099
00:55:48,800 --> 00:55:53,440
Speaker 7: And that's where eye leaning exactly that that that that

1100
00:55:53,680 --> 00:55:56,520
Speaker 7: little crack of light that he just said is I

1101
00:55:56,640 --> 00:56:02,480
Speaker 7: believe that problems, challenges, sickness, true issues are things that

1102
00:56:02,680 --> 00:56:07,399
Speaker 7: will force individuals to respond differently at different moments in time.

1103
00:56:07,520 --> 00:56:10,160
Speaker 7: Is because we are wired to Is that one thing

1104
00:56:10,200 --> 00:56:13,360
Speaker 7: that we cannot do is we cannot unwire the human

1105
00:56:13,400 --> 00:56:16,040
Speaker 7: species and our experiences.

1106
00:56:16,520 --> 00:56:18,080
Speaker 3: Well, Kurl, let me ask you this. As far as

1107
00:56:18,080 --> 00:56:21,800
Speaker 3: you talked about off camera. You know, sometimes it's difficult.

1108
00:56:22,080 --> 00:56:25,200
Speaker 3: I mean, you're looked at a certain way, right Like, Yeah,

1109
00:56:25,280 --> 00:56:27,560
Speaker 3: if you're a regular R and b RS or a

1110
00:56:27,640 --> 00:56:30,520
Speaker 3: rapper or you know, you don't have the same pressures

1111
00:56:30,960 --> 00:56:32,800
Speaker 3: as somebody who's looked at as a man of God.

1112
00:56:33,080 --> 00:56:35,120
Speaker 4: Yeah, you're held to a higher standard. Yeah.

1113
00:56:35,480 --> 00:56:42,920
Speaker 7: Unfortunately, fortunate, fortunately fortune and unfortunately both I think so.

1114
00:56:43,040 --> 00:56:44,760
Speaker 4: I would love to hear the fortunately.

1115
00:56:44,760 --> 00:56:47,760
Speaker 6: I mean, the fortunate part of it is that people

1116
00:56:47,920 --> 00:56:50,200
Speaker 6: honor you in a way that they don't honor certain

1117
00:56:50,239 --> 00:56:51,160
Speaker 6: artists when they come in here.

1118
00:56:51,200 --> 00:56:53,759
Speaker 2: There's certain nights that come in here. These they have

1119
00:56:55,000 --> 00:56:55,759
Speaker 2: not to speak for y'all.

1120
00:56:55,800 --> 00:56:59,920
Speaker 6: There's a certain reverence for you because you maintain a

1121
00:57:00,200 --> 00:57:03,840
Speaker 6: standard of living. Now, it's not to say you're perfect,

1122
00:57:04,280 --> 00:57:07,719
Speaker 6: but it's fortunate also because God sees it.

1123
00:57:08,120 --> 00:57:08,680
Speaker 2: That's one.

1124
00:57:08,719 --> 00:57:12,279
Speaker 6: But two, there's a respect that you know they're not

1125
00:57:12,320 --> 00:57:13,880
Speaker 6: in here, not to say you got to smoke. They

1126
00:57:13,920 --> 00:57:16,800
Speaker 6: wouldn't be in here just smoking blunts when you come in,

1127
00:57:16,920 --> 00:57:19,040
Speaker 6: They're not gonna be in here just with liquor. There's

1128
00:57:19,080 --> 00:57:22,280
Speaker 6: a reverence and respect, not to say those things are wrong,

1129
00:57:22,800 --> 00:57:24,680
Speaker 6: that's just a reverence in respect. That's why I been

1130
00:57:24,760 --> 00:57:26,120
Speaker 6: fortunate and unfortunate.

1131
00:57:26,480 --> 00:57:27,560
Speaker 5: There's a tie between.

1132
00:57:27,840 --> 00:57:30,080
Speaker 1: Like I said, when I heard your voice, I'm like,

1133
00:57:30,120 --> 00:57:32,440
Speaker 1: oh my god, I've heard that voice so many times.

1134
00:57:32,640 --> 00:57:35,000
Speaker 1: There's a connection in the home, this connection to the church,

1135
00:57:35,040 --> 00:57:37,480
Speaker 1: and this connection in real life. So when people see you,

1136
00:57:37,600 --> 00:57:40,720
Speaker 1: there's just a level of automatic respect outside of it. Yes,

1137
00:57:40,760 --> 00:57:42,800
Speaker 1: that's the og, but it's like, no that's a man

1138
00:57:42,840 --> 00:57:45,040
Speaker 1: of God. Like, no, he's not Jesus Christ, but he's

1139
00:57:45,040 --> 00:57:46,040
Speaker 1: a follow of Jesus.

1140
00:57:45,840 --> 00:57:47,320
Speaker 4: Christ and found it.

1141
00:57:47,360 --> 00:57:49,960
Speaker 7: I have found I have not found it in my

1142
00:57:50,080 --> 00:57:52,080
Speaker 7: career and in my lifetime to be fortunate.

1143
00:57:52,400 --> 00:57:55,040
Speaker 4: When I say I want to get that, I said,

1144
00:57:55,160 --> 00:57:56,080
Speaker 4: even I do that.

1145
00:57:56,400 --> 00:57:58,880
Speaker 5: I know he's gonna say why not, but that's why.

1146
00:57:59,200 --> 00:58:03,200
Speaker 7: Yeah, yeah, And I have not found it beneficial for

1147
00:58:03,280 --> 00:58:06,720
Speaker 7: even those that also serve in that role as well.

1148
00:58:07,720 --> 00:58:10,920
Speaker 7: It's I think that it is the greatest misnomer of

1149
00:58:10,960 --> 00:58:14,800
Speaker 7: our human experience. It's once again going back to the

1150
00:58:14,880 --> 00:58:19,080
Speaker 7: very much of the iconoclastic ideals. You know, it's I'm

1151
00:58:19,120 --> 00:58:22,560
Speaker 7: not Catholic, and I know that they're beautiful people. They're

1152
00:58:22,560 --> 00:58:26,280
Speaker 7: beautiful humans on this planet that subscribe to Catholic ideals.

1153
00:58:26,560 --> 00:58:29,040
Speaker 7: But when you look at the corruption that has happened

1154
00:58:29,120 --> 00:58:33,800
Speaker 7: historically in Catholicism for centrist full millennia and the Roman

1155
00:58:33,840 --> 00:58:36,440
Speaker 7: Catholic Church to still maintain its power and influence on

1156
00:58:36,520 --> 00:58:40,800
Speaker 7: the globe, it is because humans still want to hold

1157
00:58:40,840 --> 00:58:45,000
Speaker 7: on to They still need an idea of a tangible

1158
00:58:45,000 --> 00:58:49,280
Speaker 7: individual to usher them into the presence of God because

1159
00:58:49,280 --> 00:58:52,120
Speaker 7: they do not feel worthy enough that in itself is

1160
00:58:52,240 --> 00:58:55,680
Speaker 7: problematic on so many levels. That's what I'm trying to say.

1161
00:58:55,840 --> 00:58:58,520
Speaker 7: I'm trying to say that if you respond to me

1162
00:58:58,600 --> 00:59:02,480
Speaker 7: different than you do Lil Wayne, I'm saying I find

1163
00:59:02,520 --> 00:59:07,120
Speaker 7: that extremely problematic. It's because God doesn't. God does not

1164
00:59:07,240 --> 00:59:10,400
Speaker 7: view me different than Litla Wayne. And so those are

1165
00:59:10,400 --> 00:59:12,919
Speaker 7: the things that I continue to be committed to deconstruct.

1166
00:59:13,000 --> 00:59:15,080
Speaker 7: It's because it's problematic for the person that you do

1167
00:59:15,160 --> 00:59:17,160
Speaker 7: it too, and it's problematic for the person that you

1168
00:59:17,200 --> 00:59:17,800
Speaker 7: do it against.

1169
00:59:19,080 --> 00:59:22,440
Speaker 4: Well, on that that's my soapbox.

1170
00:59:22,920 --> 00:59:26,920
Speaker 3: Now that was that was that was insightful? Did Jamaica situation?

1171
00:59:27,680 --> 00:59:27,880
Speaker 2: Right?

1172
00:59:29,760 --> 00:59:31,280
Speaker 4: These are people that are Christians?

1173
00:59:32,080 --> 00:59:34,840
Speaker 3: So how does that play because that's a whole different

1174
00:59:34,880 --> 00:59:37,280
Speaker 3: conversation of like, Okay, it's one thing for people to

1175
00:59:37,400 --> 00:59:40,440
Speaker 3: judge you a certain way because but it's like now.

1176
00:59:40,240 --> 00:59:42,000
Speaker 4: You got religious people.

1177
00:59:42,080 --> 00:59:45,560
Speaker 3: Yes, Yes, that's even more because you don't you don't

1178
00:59:45,560 --> 00:59:48,240
Speaker 3: want to offend somebody, yes, and that's the same religion

1179
00:59:48,240 --> 00:59:48,520
Speaker 3: as you.

1180
00:59:48,760 --> 00:59:52,040
Speaker 4: Yes, how did that impact you? Well?

1181
00:59:52,080 --> 00:59:54,480
Speaker 7: And I also think that it reveals even this conversation

1182
00:59:54,640 --> 00:59:57,760
Speaker 7: because it wasn't all Jamaicans. It was some Jamaicans, but

1183
00:59:57,960 --> 01:00:01,400
Speaker 7: there were other Jamaicans that would if you were into the.

1184
01:00:02,880 --> 01:00:04,600
Speaker 4: Comment section they were.

1185
01:00:05,040 --> 01:00:07,000
Speaker 7: They were having their own arguments about if there was

1186
01:00:07,040 --> 01:00:08,920
Speaker 7: one you're making to say, y'all wanted him to have

1187
01:00:08,960 --> 01:00:10,840
Speaker 7: a suit on it pass out and y'all know, and

1188
01:00:10,880 --> 01:00:11,600
Speaker 7: they say, and you know.

1189
01:00:11,560 --> 01:00:12,960
Speaker 4: Our healthcare system not her son.

1190
01:00:13,320 --> 01:00:15,320
Speaker 5: You know what I'm saying. And I thought that was hilarious.

1191
01:00:15,360 --> 01:00:18,919
Speaker 7: So but it's but once again, I think that it's

1192
01:00:18,960 --> 01:00:24,080
Speaker 7: the tension because dogma has led the narrative for our

1193
01:00:24,160 --> 01:00:27,880
Speaker 7: species on the planet of how we process God and

1194
01:00:27,920 --> 01:00:30,560
Speaker 7: what we think is God lee And so what I

1195
01:00:30,600 --> 01:00:33,520
Speaker 7: have to do is I have to understand those nuances.

1196
01:00:33,600 --> 01:00:36,200
Speaker 7: I can't fight them. I have to pick and choose

1197
01:00:36,280 --> 01:00:37,680
Speaker 7: when I fight them. I have to pick and choose

1198
01:00:37,680 --> 01:00:39,280
Speaker 7: when I speak against them, and I have to pick

1199
01:00:39,320 --> 01:00:41,960
Speaker 7: and choose when it's time to acquiesce to that reality.

1200
01:00:42,320 --> 01:00:44,600
Speaker 7: Because there is a reality that I exist in that

1201
01:00:44,760 --> 01:00:47,560
Speaker 7: I understand that's the construct of a lot of individuals

1202
01:00:47,560 --> 01:00:50,680
Speaker 7: that subscribe to monothistic ideals. And so because of that,

1203
01:00:50,960 --> 01:00:53,800
Speaker 7: I must digress in moments, acquiesce to the reality of

1204
01:00:53,840 --> 01:00:56,360
Speaker 7: that and try to maneuver the best that I can

1205
01:00:56,400 --> 01:00:57,720
Speaker 7: with truth and authenticity.

1206
01:00:58,280 --> 01:01:00,360
Speaker 6: I think, to your point, just to add is it

1207
01:01:01,080 --> 01:01:05,400
Speaker 6: most often we read the Bible, but we don't comprehend it.

1208
01:01:06,000 --> 01:01:10,040
Speaker 6: You know, the same people they're ignoring that David danced

1209
01:01:10,080 --> 01:01:12,800
Speaker 6: out of his clothes, they just ignore that whole entire scripture.

1210
01:01:12,800 --> 01:01:15,400
Speaker 6: He literally danced out of his clothes. But a was

1211
01:01:15,440 --> 01:01:17,440
Speaker 6: an adulter at the same time, you know, and a murderer.

1212
01:01:17,440 --> 01:01:20,040
Speaker 6: He killed his best friend, took his wife, had a

1213
01:01:20,120 --> 01:01:23,240
Speaker 6: kid with her. Yes, it's better than any real housewives.

1214
01:01:23,400 --> 01:01:26,560
Speaker 6: Yes yeah, man, Well but let's this is the man

1215
01:01:27,280 --> 01:01:28,600
Speaker 6: after the gods.

1216
01:01:29,200 --> 01:01:32,520
Speaker 7: Yes, right, yes, that's what he That's what we was. Moses,

1217
01:01:32,560 --> 01:01:34,680
Speaker 7: the murderer, was the one that God used. But we

1218
01:01:34,720 --> 01:01:37,400
Speaker 7: don't says the murderer. But Moses was a murderer.

1219
01:01:37,640 --> 01:01:39,960
Speaker 6: And this is the key to all of this when

1220
01:01:39,960 --> 01:01:44,160
Speaker 6: you talk about believers disagreeing, and we all want to

1221
01:01:44,160 --> 01:01:47,600
Speaker 6: see ourselves in the Bible as the heroes. Right when

1222
01:01:47,640 --> 01:01:49,720
Speaker 6: people look at the Bible, everybody wants to be David

1223
01:01:49,880 --> 01:01:55,240
Speaker 6: or Joseph or Jonah or Paul or we would more

1224
01:01:55,440 --> 01:01:58,440
Speaker 6: likely be the people when the woman got called the

1225
01:01:58,480 --> 01:02:00,560
Speaker 6: active adultery holding the stones of the stone.

1226
01:02:00,680 --> 01:02:01,040
Speaker 5: That's good.

1227
01:02:01,080 --> 01:02:03,280
Speaker 2: That's who we are. That's who we are as believers.

1228
01:02:03,320 --> 01:02:06,040
Speaker 6: Now we have canceled at our core, at our core,

1229
01:02:06,440 --> 01:02:07,600
Speaker 6: we are canceled culture.

1230
01:02:07,960 --> 01:02:10,840
Speaker 2: I'm more saved than you. I'm not as bad as you.

1231
01:02:11,000 --> 01:02:15,360
Speaker 6: Yes, I'm not having pride and being a prideful person

1232
01:02:15,760 --> 01:02:18,840
Speaker 6: that has to whatever is as bad as being is

1233
01:02:18,880 --> 01:02:20,080
Speaker 6: as bad as any other sin.

1234
01:02:20,240 --> 01:02:23,600
Speaker 7: And if we look at the biblocentricy it's also if

1235
01:02:23,600 --> 01:02:26,960
Speaker 7: we look at biblocentrically, it is really the greater. I mean,

1236
01:02:26,960 --> 01:02:30,080
Speaker 7: there's not a greater, but but but but if you

1237
01:02:30,120 --> 01:02:34,400
Speaker 7: look at how much it returns in scripture, pride is

1238
01:02:34,440 --> 01:02:34,800
Speaker 7: the one.

1239
01:02:35,000 --> 01:02:35,640
Speaker 4: Pride is one.

1240
01:02:35,760 --> 01:02:37,680
Speaker 7: But you know, growing up in church, if you were

1241
01:02:37,720 --> 01:02:39,880
Speaker 7: sleeping having sense ful maverage, you was going you know,

1242
01:02:39,960 --> 01:02:42,120
Speaker 7: that's it's something like you felt like that that's all

1243
01:02:42,160 --> 01:02:44,000
Speaker 7: God cared about. You know what I'm saying, that's who

1244
01:02:44,000 --> 01:02:46,720
Speaker 7: you was smashing in the youth choir behind me. It's

1245
01:02:46,760 --> 01:02:50,120
Speaker 7: a thin line, but okay, there is a thin line

1246
01:02:50,120 --> 01:02:54,200
Speaker 7: trend because one group of people say like, yeah, you

1247
01:02:54,240 --> 01:02:57,000
Speaker 7: can't be judgment to everybody. Nobody's perfect.

1248
01:02:57,040 --> 01:03:00,960
Speaker 3: Everybody sends he without sending cast the first stone all

1249
01:03:01,000 --> 01:03:04,800
Speaker 3: of that. But that kind of does lead to just

1250
01:03:04,920 --> 01:03:07,760
Speaker 3: doing anything and just saying, well you know. God knows

1251
01:03:07,760 --> 01:03:10,680
Speaker 3: my heart. God knows my heart. People just do anything

1252
01:03:11,240 --> 01:03:13,200
Speaker 3: that's not my heart problem.

1253
01:03:14,800 --> 01:03:17,680
Speaker 6: I'm so ready to respond ahead, I'm I'm quick and

1254
01:03:17,680 --> 01:03:19,480
Speaker 6: I'm gonna get it's quick.

1255
01:03:19,480 --> 01:03:22,320
Speaker 2: I'm passing straight to you. It's quick. I'm gonna pass

1256
01:03:22,360 --> 01:03:25,720
Speaker 2: straight to you. It's not it's not that's not it.

1257
01:03:26,160 --> 01:03:31,920
Speaker 6: So people often believe if you if you don't slap

1258
01:03:32,000 --> 01:03:36,320
Speaker 6: people with sining, that they are going to then trample

1259
01:03:36,360 --> 01:03:39,840
Speaker 6: on grace. Yes, they're gonna trample on grace. We talked yes,

1260
01:03:40,360 --> 01:03:45,280
Speaker 6: but it's clear you give people grace and truth. Yes, okay,

1261
01:03:47,120 --> 01:03:51,439
Speaker 6: that's it's having sex outside of marriage or fortication saying yes,

1262
01:03:52,360 --> 01:03:53,400
Speaker 6: is it difficult to.

1263
01:03:53,320 --> 01:03:54,240
Speaker 2: Stay away from?

1264
01:03:54,600 --> 01:03:56,360
Speaker 4: Yes, it's both.

1265
01:03:56,440 --> 01:04:00,440
Speaker 6: And and to to say that God.

1266
01:04:00,280 --> 01:04:00,880
Speaker 2: Knows my heart.

1267
01:04:00,920 --> 01:04:02,560
Speaker 6: He does, and that's a good at a bad thing.

1268
01:04:03,040 --> 01:04:05,840
Speaker 6: God knows whether you believe in him truly or you don't.

1269
01:04:06,000 --> 01:04:08,240
Speaker 6: So when you say God knows your heart, yeah he does.

1270
01:04:08,480 --> 01:04:10,840
Speaker 6: That's what I always tell someone. And at the same time,

1271
01:04:10,920 --> 01:04:13,360
Speaker 6: you should judge people. You should tell them the truth.

1272
01:04:13,480 --> 01:04:15,800
Speaker 6: You should say that your homeboy, hey bro, you gotta

1273
01:04:15,800 --> 01:04:18,040
Speaker 6: stop smashing all them girls. But can I tell my

1274
01:04:18,080 --> 01:04:20,280
Speaker 6: home I understand why he's smashing all those girls.

1275
01:04:20,360 --> 01:04:20,600
Speaker 2: Yes.

1276
01:04:21,280 --> 01:04:23,439
Speaker 6: And that's the part that gets missed, is that when

1277
01:04:23,440 --> 01:04:26,360
Speaker 6: you go to church often, yeah, you hear you shouldn't

1278
01:04:26,400 --> 01:04:29,840
Speaker 6: do that, but you don't hear the empathy behind. I

1279
01:04:30,080 --> 01:04:33,320
Speaker 6: understand why, and here is how, here are how in

1280
01:04:33,440 --> 01:04:35,120
Speaker 6: ways you cannot do that.

1281
01:04:35,120 --> 01:04:36,160
Speaker 2: That's the part that's missed.

1282
01:04:36,200 --> 01:04:37,680
Speaker 5: And please let me jump in and say this.

1283
01:04:38,000 --> 01:04:42,400
Speaker 7: The reason why on this planet the Protestant Faith has

1284
01:04:42,440 --> 01:04:46,000
Speaker 7: so many different denominations is because of that issue right there.

1285
01:04:46,360 --> 01:04:50,840
Speaker 7: It's because people need to control the narrative of the

1286
01:04:50,880 --> 01:04:54,440
Speaker 7: process of other humans. So the Methodist will say, okay,

1287
01:04:54,440 --> 01:04:57,120
Speaker 7: you guys are trying to take advantage, and so from

1288
01:04:57,120 --> 01:05:00,280
Speaker 7: that then you get the Pentecostals. And then the Pentecostal say,

1289
01:05:00,280 --> 01:05:02,000
Speaker 7: well you got to live holy. Okay, well yeah, but

1290
01:05:02,000 --> 01:05:03,560
Speaker 7: you're gonn only live holy on the Sabbath, so you

1291
01:05:03,560 --> 01:05:05,560
Speaker 7: get the Sabbath of Pinecostal. It's like when you look

1292
01:05:05,600 --> 01:05:08,600
Speaker 7: at Protestant. When you look at the Protestant faith in America,

1293
01:05:09,040 --> 01:05:14,920
Speaker 7: no other branch of faith has so many denominations, denominations

1294
01:05:15,320 --> 01:05:20,439
Speaker 7: like the mono theistic ideal of Christianity, that's problematic. You've

1295
01:05:20,480 --> 01:05:23,720
Speaker 7: got Pentecostal you've got Church of God in Christ. You've

1296
01:05:23,720 --> 01:05:27,400
Speaker 7: got Apostolic, You've got PAW whis probably the same thing.

1297
01:05:27,520 --> 01:05:29,760
Speaker 7: You've got Methodists, you got Lutheran, you got BAPED, you

1298
01:05:29,840 --> 01:05:32,920
Speaker 7: got missionary BAP. I mean so many branches and it

1299
01:05:33,080 --> 01:05:35,200
Speaker 7: was all birthed out of this idea. Okay, well, y'all

1300
01:05:35,200 --> 01:05:37,000
Speaker 7: are taking advantage of this where y'all don't do this

1301
01:05:37,120 --> 01:05:40,080
Speaker 7: enough dos and it becomes so overwhelming they guess what

1302
01:05:40,120 --> 01:05:42,360
Speaker 7: people do now Here we are twenty five years later,

1303
01:05:42,440 --> 01:05:44,040
Speaker 7: thirty four percent people of going to church.

1304
01:05:44,320 --> 01:05:45,360
Speaker 4: That's what's happened.

1305
01:05:45,240 --> 01:05:50,000
Speaker 7: Because non domination, no, no, well even non denominational once again,

1306
01:05:50,240 --> 01:05:51,920
Speaker 7: some of that is not becoming country clubs.

1307
01:05:51,960 --> 01:05:54,440
Speaker 5: Ted talkson becoming all these other frameworks.

1308
01:05:54,520 --> 01:05:55,280
Speaker 4: It really is.

1309
01:05:55,400 --> 01:05:58,080
Speaker 6: Non denomination is a reaction to all of the denomination.

1310
01:05:58,280 --> 01:06:01,000
Speaker 6: That's it's a denomination. And of this, beautifully said, the

1311
01:06:01,040 --> 01:06:05,360
Speaker 6: beautiful reaction, say from God, nobody.

1312
01:06:05,040 --> 01:06:05,760
Speaker 5: Argues with you.

1313
01:06:05,880 --> 01:06:07,880
Speaker 7: If you want to go drink fourteen ninety two at

1314
01:06:07,880 --> 01:06:11,240
Speaker 7: your club nine, I say that I.

1315
01:06:14,800 --> 01:06:15,600
Speaker 2: Don't know what.

1316
01:06:16,560 --> 01:06:19,560
Speaker 7: I just call it what exactly And guess what if

1317
01:06:19,600 --> 01:06:21,640
Speaker 7: you wanted to drink fourteen ninety two, I would not

1318
01:06:21,880 --> 01:06:23,919
Speaker 7: argue with you. I would allow you to drink whatever

1319
01:06:23,960 --> 01:06:26,120
Speaker 7: nask they drink you want to drink. Is because there

1320
01:06:26,240 --> 01:06:30,320
Speaker 7: is no there is no debate outside of the space

1321
01:06:30,480 --> 01:06:33,000
Speaker 7: because people allow you to be you. But when you

1322
01:06:33,040 --> 01:06:36,000
Speaker 7: come here, we think that we've got to hold people

1323
01:06:36,040 --> 01:06:38,280
Speaker 7: to a standard that God does not even hold us to.

1324
01:06:39,080 --> 01:06:42,160
Speaker 7: And it's becoming overwhelming and we're missing people with the

1325
01:06:42,280 --> 01:06:45,360
Speaker 7: great news and the simple because here's the simple message, kings.

1326
01:06:45,960 --> 01:06:47,080
Speaker 4: God made man.

1327
01:06:48,000 --> 01:06:51,520
Speaker 7: Man rejected God, and God won't stop until he wins

1328
01:06:51,600 --> 01:06:52,040
Speaker 7: man back.

1329
01:06:52,520 --> 01:06:52,960
Speaker 2: Amen.

1330
01:06:53,120 --> 01:06:59,360
Speaker 5: Amen, it's that simple, Amen. Anything else is problematic. Norman Kirk,

1331
01:06:59,400 --> 01:07:02,080
Speaker 5: We must do this again as we wrap.

1332
01:07:02,680 --> 01:07:04,080
Speaker 7: I don't want to wrap. I want to come on.

1333
01:07:04,160 --> 01:07:06,560
Speaker 7: Give me some more, give me too old, Let me

1334
01:07:06,600 --> 01:07:09,760
Speaker 7: too more? Man, I love I love the platform. I'm

1335
01:07:09,800 --> 01:07:13,080
Speaker 7: super fans. Give me too more? Can me do two more?

1336
01:07:14,080 --> 01:07:15,920
Speaker 7: You got my man off sharp? Coming up here a couple, man,

1337
01:07:16,000 --> 01:07:18,760
Speaker 7: Let us give us some more. He was on point.

1338
01:07:19,120 --> 01:07:20,120
Speaker 7: I was going to actually go.

1339
01:07:20,240 --> 01:07:21,720
Speaker 1: I mean, we could talk about doing it again before

1340
01:07:21,720 --> 01:07:23,919
Speaker 1: we go, but I was going to talk about that

1341
01:07:25,840 --> 01:07:31,320
Speaker 1: prosperity right and doing God's work and that that's fine balance, right.

1342
01:07:31,560 --> 01:07:35,640
Speaker 1: They see you achieving successes. Does he have that is

1343
01:07:35,640 --> 01:07:36,919
Speaker 1: he really following God?

1344
01:07:37,040 --> 01:07:37,200
Speaker 2: Is he?

1345
01:07:38,240 --> 01:07:40,600
Speaker 5: I mean, he's look at what he's doing with his money.

1346
01:07:40,640 --> 01:07:41,480
Speaker 2: People watching that.

1347
01:07:41,600 --> 01:07:43,080
Speaker 5: How do you, I mean, how do you deal with that?

1348
01:07:43,120 --> 01:07:46,720
Speaker 1: Outside of that from a mental standpoint, because the mental

1349
01:07:46,720 --> 01:07:49,640
Speaker 1: health piece is important too inside the church, how do

1350
01:07:49,680 --> 01:07:50,280
Speaker 1: you manage that?

1351
01:07:50,480 --> 01:07:52,920
Speaker 6: I'll do the mental health part. You do, then the

1352
01:07:52,960 --> 01:07:55,520
Speaker 6: prosperity thing. I think the easy way to look at

1353
01:07:55,560 --> 01:07:59,000
Speaker 6: it is this. I've always held this belief. It's easier

1354
01:07:59,040 --> 01:08:03,040
Speaker 6: to look at it from this vantage point. I think

1355
01:08:03,040 --> 01:08:06,160
Speaker 6: we all can relate to the thing of a homeless

1356
01:08:06,160 --> 01:08:07,720
Speaker 6: man comes to knox On. You do he wants one

1357
01:08:07,760 --> 01:08:11,320
Speaker 6: hundred dollars right, or he wants money? And people always

1358
01:08:11,320 --> 01:08:13,000
Speaker 6: saying I don't give homelessreeple money because don't know what

1359
01:08:13,000 --> 01:08:13,720
Speaker 6: they're gonna do with it.

1360
01:08:14,160 --> 01:08:16,880
Speaker 2: Right. There's this idea as Americans that we have.

1361
01:08:16,960 --> 01:08:21,240
Speaker 6: It's Western, it's very Western that unless the person does

1362
01:08:21,400 --> 01:08:23,479
Speaker 6: with the money, what I intend for them to do

1363
01:08:23,560 --> 01:08:26,160
Speaker 6: is I don't want to give it. The truth of

1364
01:08:26,200 --> 01:08:29,479
Speaker 6: the matter is the principle is about a heart. It's

1365
01:08:29,479 --> 01:08:32,759
Speaker 6: about a heart issue. It's a heart issue. The truth

1366
01:08:32,920 --> 01:08:36,160
Speaker 6: is we're selfish and.

1367
01:08:35,400 --> 01:08:38,639
Speaker 2: Instead of just saying we're selfish. We said he's.

1368
01:08:38,479 --> 01:08:42,479
Speaker 6: Gonna go by drugs. The where do you get that from?

1369
01:08:42,920 --> 01:08:44,760
Speaker 6: Where do you get the notion from that? When you

1370
01:08:44,800 --> 01:08:47,760
Speaker 6: give money to your church, they have to spend it

1371
01:08:47,800 --> 01:08:49,559
Speaker 6: the way you would want them to spend it. The

1372
01:08:49,600 --> 01:08:52,840
Speaker 6: biblical principle is about you giving to God first.

1373
01:08:53,600 --> 01:08:55,920
Speaker 4: That's it. Whether it's that's it.

1374
01:08:56,080 --> 01:08:58,479
Speaker 6: The biblical principle about giving to the homeless is about

1375
01:08:58,600 --> 01:09:01,360
Speaker 6: giving to charity. Who cares what the homeless man does

1376
01:09:01,400 --> 01:09:04,200
Speaker 6: with the money. The reward for you is that your

1377
01:09:04,280 --> 01:09:06,840
Speaker 6: heart prostrust is in the right place. So this is

1378
01:09:06,840 --> 01:09:11,519
Speaker 6: how I see prosperity and ministry. They're doing a job,

1379
01:09:12,040 --> 01:09:18,160
Speaker 6: they're making money. God walks on gold. The result of

1380
01:09:18,200 --> 01:09:23,400
Speaker 6: being excellent at anything is generally success, and in America,

1381
01:09:23,800 --> 01:09:28,240
Speaker 6: in most cultures, success generally leads to wealth. If a

1382
01:09:28,280 --> 01:09:32,000
Speaker 6: pastor is wealthy, it doesn't hurt me, It doesn't hurt

1383
01:09:32,080 --> 01:09:35,679
Speaker 6: anyone that when someone looks at him they see okay, boom.

1384
01:09:35,880 --> 01:09:38,920
Speaker 4: Some people ask me, taking advantage of your color? There

1385
01:09:38,960 --> 01:09:41,759
Speaker 4: are some people that do that happens, that's something.

1386
01:09:41,840 --> 01:09:45,080
Speaker 6: And their CEOs that take advantage of their customers see

1387
01:09:45,280 --> 01:09:49,360
Speaker 6: and in no way of business or walk of life

1388
01:09:49,479 --> 01:09:54,160
Speaker 6: is uh uh, I don't want to use turn perversion,

1389
01:09:54,200 --> 01:09:57,080
Speaker 6: but where it is, a perversion exists.

1390
01:09:57,560 --> 01:09:59,559
Speaker 2: So they're CEOs that take advantage of people.

1391
01:09:59,680 --> 01:10:02,600
Speaker 6: You have this Sam Blackman find that had FTX he

1392
01:10:02,720 --> 01:10:04,920
Speaker 6: stole billions of dollars from people. Burn the mad off

1393
01:10:05,000 --> 01:10:06,519
Speaker 6: was the head of the NATS that he stole billions

1394
01:10:06,520 --> 01:10:08,320
Speaker 6: of dollars with people. Are there pastors that's still from

1395
01:10:08,320 --> 01:10:08,919
Speaker 6: the Congression?

1396
01:10:08,960 --> 01:10:09,200
Speaker 2: Yes?

1397
01:10:09,520 --> 01:10:12,600
Speaker 6: Are there passors that don't yes? Are the CEOs that

1398
01:10:12,680 --> 01:10:13,800
Speaker 6: don't treat their workers right?

1399
01:10:13,920 --> 01:10:16,320
Speaker 2: Yes? Or do people still work there? Yes?

1400
01:10:17,000 --> 01:10:21,439
Speaker 6: So are you gonna throw away your iPhone because you.

1401
01:10:21,400 --> 01:10:22,000
Speaker 2: Don't like them?

1402
01:10:22,280 --> 01:10:24,080
Speaker 6: Or did you stop getting at ubers because there was

1403
01:10:24,160 --> 01:10:25,800
Speaker 6: uber culture and they were being mean to women?

1404
01:10:25,840 --> 01:10:27,759
Speaker 2: Know, everybody still ordered ubers today?

1405
01:10:27,960 --> 01:10:34,479
Speaker 6: So what I don't like people's disingenuous approach to how

1406
01:10:34,520 --> 01:10:37,800
Speaker 6: they problem solve anything else. There's bad churches, the good

1407
01:10:37,800 --> 01:10:40,679
Speaker 6: they're good churches. There's bad pastors, that's good pastors. There's

1408
01:10:40,760 --> 01:10:44,200
Speaker 6: terrible CEOs, there's good CEOs. And we still we're on

1409
01:10:44,280 --> 01:10:48,639
Speaker 6: the target boycot targets. Earnings have increased quarter over quarter,

1410
01:10:48,960 --> 01:10:52,760
Speaker 6: we're boycotting. I'm just saying that we disagree with something.

1411
01:10:52,800 --> 01:10:56,080
Speaker 6: We're saying we're against something it doesn't stand, but we

1412
01:10:56,240 --> 01:11:02,360
Speaker 6: do hold it really tightly against the church. Yes, I'm

1413
01:11:02,400 --> 01:11:04,920
Speaker 6: okay with a pastor being rich, just as just as

1414
01:11:04,960 --> 01:11:06,479
Speaker 6: I'm okay with the CEO being rich.

1415
01:11:07,000 --> 01:11:10,439
Speaker 7: Well, what I can say, though, is that it also

1416
01:11:10,560 --> 01:11:14,120
Speaker 7: is necessary to continue to teach people that that the

1417
01:11:14,120 --> 01:11:18,640
Speaker 7: institution of church and the ones that run these institutions,

1418
01:11:19,080 --> 01:11:22,960
Speaker 7: we cannot model our pursuit of God through them. And

1419
01:11:23,000 --> 01:11:26,400
Speaker 7: I think that those are the constructs that I'm always

1420
01:11:26,439 --> 01:11:30,599
Speaker 7: committed to deconstruct with American culture and with global ideals,

1421
01:11:30,680 --> 01:11:32,639
Speaker 7: that a monotheistic is that we've.

1422
01:11:32,439 --> 01:11:33,679
Speaker 5: Got to get to people.

1423
01:11:33,840 --> 01:11:36,320
Speaker 7: And and that was the part of the of of

1424
01:11:36,360 --> 01:11:39,000
Speaker 7: even the Reformation, right, is that Martin Luther at the

1425
01:11:39,040 --> 01:11:41,920
Speaker 7: time was continuing to try to tell people we can

1426
01:11:42,040 --> 01:11:45,800
Speaker 7: go to God now ourselves. And so that is the

1427
01:11:45,920 --> 01:11:49,679
Speaker 7: narrative that Kirk is so passionate about. I'm passionate about

1428
01:11:49,960 --> 01:11:52,719
Speaker 7: like like I can be on a plane and and

1429
01:11:52,720 --> 01:11:55,000
Speaker 7: and and it's a little bit adjacent to this conversation.

1430
01:11:55,080 --> 01:11:56,320
Speaker 4: I can be on a plane, bros.

1431
01:11:56,479 --> 01:11:58,400
Speaker 7: And you know, I'm I'm blessed to sit in first

1432
01:11:58,439 --> 01:12:01,000
Speaker 7: class and people are getting on the plane, and some

1433
01:12:01,040 --> 01:12:02,799
Speaker 7: people will notice me on the plane.

1434
01:12:02,880 --> 01:12:04,479
Speaker 5: And I've heard people say.

1435
01:12:04,520 --> 01:12:08,439
Speaker 7: Oh, I know this plane ain't gonna crash now, God

1436
01:12:08,560 --> 01:12:13,360
Speaker 7: on the plane. And I'm thinking, Nigro Christians die, Christians die,

1437
01:12:13,400 --> 01:12:16,920
Speaker 7: and plane crashes every day. People think that because I'm

1438
01:12:16,960 --> 01:12:20,400
Speaker 7: on the plane, the plane can't crash.

1439
01:12:20,520 --> 01:12:21,559
Speaker 5: I've got to fix that.

1440
01:12:21,680 --> 01:12:27,560
Speaker 7: We We've got to We've got to fix that complex. Yeah,

1441
01:12:27,840 --> 01:12:30,519
Speaker 7: hey man, bro it happens on time. So many times.

1442
01:12:30,520 --> 01:12:32,280
Speaker 7: I'm in the store in the mall, Kirk where you

1443
01:12:32,320 --> 01:12:35,000
Speaker 7: pray for men. You know it's I know, Kirk is

1444
01:12:35,000 --> 01:12:37,360
Speaker 7: I know God hear your prayers. And I have to stop.

1445
01:12:37,360 --> 01:12:40,240
Speaker 7: I have to top constantly, have to stop constantly. Bro On,

1446
01:12:40,360 --> 01:12:42,680
Speaker 7: my sister, I need for you to know, first of all,

1447
01:12:42,680 --> 01:12:44,320
Speaker 7: I've been real happy to pray for you, but when

1448
01:12:44,360 --> 01:12:47,840
Speaker 7: I do, please know God here's your prayers, just as

1449
01:12:47,840 --> 01:12:50,760
Speaker 7: clear as he does mine. But it is such a

1450
01:12:51,000 --> 01:12:55,120
Speaker 7: constant wiring of a That's why it's problematic for me

1451
01:12:55,400 --> 01:12:58,040
Speaker 7: when people hold me to a higher standard. It's because

1452
01:12:58,080 --> 01:13:00,679
Speaker 7: I know what it means. Intrinsically. I know it means

1453
01:13:00,680 --> 01:13:02,679
Speaker 7: that you don't think you're worth enough to get to God.

1454
01:13:02,680 --> 01:13:05,599
Speaker 7: But I am, and that pisces me off that we

1455
01:13:05,720 --> 01:13:07,440
Speaker 7: have already created that in individuals.

1456
01:13:07,439 --> 01:13:08,960
Speaker 5: And what also pisses me off.

1457
01:13:09,040 --> 01:13:11,639
Speaker 7: Is that we have religious leaders that are not joining

1458
01:13:11,680 --> 01:13:13,719
Speaker 7: me in trying to debunk that ideal as well.

1459
01:13:14,360 --> 01:13:16,599
Speaker 1: I think has it always been that way, Like there's

1460
01:13:16,600 --> 01:13:19,160
Speaker 1: no bit of ego on the ascension to where you're

1461
01:13:19,200 --> 01:13:21,240
Speaker 1: at now that it wasn't that way?

1462
01:13:21,400 --> 01:13:22,160
Speaker 2: Has it always been that?

1463
01:13:22,400 --> 01:13:23,840
Speaker 4: It has always been a problem for me?

1464
01:13:24,280 --> 01:13:29,280
Speaker 7: It has always been I intrinsically has intrinsically have always

1465
01:13:29,320 --> 01:13:32,479
Speaker 7: been uncomfortable, and it has been difficult for me to

1466
01:13:32,479 --> 01:13:38,080
Speaker 7: see the weaponization of leadership in my community and through

1467
01:13:38,280 --> 01:13:41,920
Speaker 7: the space of the black church in the black community. Yes,

1468
01:13:42,240 --> 01:13:45,680
Speaker 7: I played for a church that was in a neighborhood

1469
01:13:45,920 --> 01:13:48,760
Speaker 7: and for Worth where some of the biggest drug king

1470
01:13:48,800 --> 01:13:53,160
Speaker 7: pings existed in America. In that small black neighborhood existed

1471
01:13:53,400 --> 01:13:57,320
Speaker 7: thirty two churches in this one neighborhood, thirty two churches.

1472
01:13:59,240 --> 01:14:02,080
Speaker 5: But the biggest drug kingpins I'm.

1473
01:14:01,680 --> 01:14:05,160
Speaker 7: Crack cocaine in the eighties in America existed in I mean,

1474
01:14:05,200 --> 01:14:07,160
Speaker 7: you can look it up in Fort Worth, Texas. Some

1475
01:14:07,200 --> 01:14:10,679
Speaker 7: of the biggest king pins in America lived in Fort Worth, Texas,

1476
01:14:10,720 --> 01:14:14,840
Speaker 7: in this community called Lake Como thirty two churches, but

1477
01:14:15,040 --> 01:14:18,240
Speaker 7: drugs and king pins were able to exist with no problem.

1478
01:14:19,520 --> 01:14:22,040
Speaker 7: That's a challenge for me and it was a time

1479
01:14:22,040 --> 01:14:23,600
Speaker 7: to me even when I had a Jeri curl. So

1480
01:14:25,120 --> 01:14:28,240
Speaker 7: now going back to the issue of mental health, I

1481
01:14:28,320 --> 01:14:33,679
Speaker 7: believe that religion does contribute to mental health. Religion can

1482
01:14:33,720 --> 01:14:38,280
Speaker 7: contribute to the issues of trauma and our people. Is

1483
01:14:38,320 --> 01:14:41,280
Speaker 7: because if people do not see themselves good enough, how

1484
01:14:41,280 --> 01:14:44,479
Speaker 7: can they become healthy in their finances, in their homes

1485
01:14:44,479 --> 01:14:46,840
Speaker 7: and their families, in their own mental space. If they

1486
01:14:46,840 --> 01:14:51,080
Speaker 7: feel that they need something to exist outside of them,

1487
01:14:51,080 --> 01:14:53,880
Speaker 7: outside of their creator, to be able to be good individuals,

1488
01:14:53,880 --> 01:14:57,120
Speaker 7: to be able to see themselves as valuable. Is that

1489
01:14:57,479 --> 01:15:00,000
Speaker 7: we need to continue to see church as a hospital.

1490
01:15:00,920 --> 01:15:03,799
Speaker 7: At everybody in there, including the man behind the pullpit,

1491
01:15:03,880 --> 01:15:04,400
Speaker 7: is a patient.

1492
01:15:04,840 --> 01:15:05,759
Speaker 4: No one is a doctor.

1493
01:15:06,400 --> 01:15:09,680
Speaker 3: Before we leave the last question, given the times that

1494
01:15:09,680 --> 01:15:11,479
Speaker 3: we're in right now, this is something that I even

1495
01:15:12,479 --> 01:15:15,080
Speaker 3: do you ever lose hope for humanity? We see what

1496
01:15:15,120 --> 01:15:18,840
Speaker 3: happens and Israel and Iran and then Kansastan and the

1497
01:15:19,000 --> 01:15:22,120
Speaker 3: Congo and Sudan, and it's just like we've been on

1498
01:15:22,120 --> 01:15:25,200
Speaker 3: this earth for thousands of years and still can't figure

1499
01:15:25,200 --> 01:15:28,640
Speaker 3: out how to live together peacefully, right, And it's like,

1500
01:15:28,800 --> 01:15:32,879
Speaker 3: after a while, do you just say, like it's almost

1501
01:15:32,920 --> 01:15:35,320
Speaker 3: like doomed on a certain level, right, Like it's very

1502
01:15:35,320 --> 01:15:39,439
Speaker 3: depressing where we just keep going through these things year

1503
01:15:39,520 --> 01:15:42,120
Speaker 3: after year after year, and people are dying and babies

1504
01:15:42,120 --> 01:15:45,200
Speaker 3: are dying, and it's just like Ukraine Russia. Like, yes,

1505
01:15:45,640 --> 01:15:48,000
Speaker 3: given the state of the times that we're in, Like,

1506
01:15:48,640 --> 01:15:51,920
Speaker 3: what's your thought process and what's the word for the people?

1507
01:15:51,960 --> 01:15:52,200
Speaker 2: Yeah?

1508
01:15:52,200 --> 01:15:54,240
Speaker 7: Man, let me say this, first of all, even as

1509
01:15:54,240 --> 01:15:56,879
Speaker 7: you begin to talk, I begin to wail inside. Because

1510
01:15:57,479 --> 01:16:01,040
Speaker 7: I can be very Kennist transparent. I feel you. I

1511
01:16:01,080 --> 01:16:01,799
Speaker 7: feel you deeply.

1512
01:16:01,840 --> 01:16:02,040
Speaker 4: Brother.

1513
01:16:02,080 --> 01:16:05,680
Speaker 7: It's because again being I'm fifty five years old, I

1514
01:16:05,680 --> 01:16:08,960
Speaker 7: mean I was raised in the space of faith, That's

1515
01:16:09,040 --> 01:16:11,840
Speaker 7: all I know, and so it has always been problematic

1516
01:16:11,880 --> 01:16:15,120
Speaker 7: for me too. I remember September eleventh and how that

1517
01:16:15,200 --> 01:16:17,800
Speaker 7: following Sunday you couldn't I mean, you would think that

1518
01:16:17,920 --> 01:16:20,400
Speaker 7: Drake was performing at the church because we standing line

1519
01:16:20,400 --> 01:16:22,599
Speaker 7: only because people were trying to get in, because people

1520
01:16:22,600 --> 01:16:25,160
Speaker 7: were so afraid. And then as that began to wear

1521
01:16:25,200 --> 01:16:27,200
Speaker 7: often people begin to go. You know, I remember when

1522
01:16:27,240 --> 01:16:29,519
Speaker 7: George Floyd happened like we all know, and people were

1523
01:16:29,560 --> 01:16:31,720
Speaker 7: so adamant about trying to make change, and then it

1524
01:16:31,800 --> 01:16:35,120
Speaker 7: just begins to go away. I believe that what's going

1525
01:16:35,160 --> 01:16:41,560
Speaker 7: to make a greater change that can be more substantial

1526
01:16:42,040 --> 01:16:44,760
Speaker 7: and more substantive that we can be able to see consistently,

1527
01:16:45,240 --> 01:16:49,080
Speaker 7: is that I need the help of other leaders that

1528
01:16:49,240 --> 01:16:54,000
Speaker 7: will push the narrative of our broken humanity and the

1529
01:16:54,040 --> 01:16:57,880
Speaker 7: fact that we are not perfect individuals. And I think

1530
01:16:57,920 --> 01:17:01,320
Speaker 7: that as long as we have that, that as long

1531
01:17:01,360 --> 01:17:06,960
Speaker 7: as we continue to celebrate and push our political leaders

1532
01:17:07,000 --> 01:17:10,320
Speaker 7: like Donald Trump and other individuals that do not reflect

1533
01:17:10,560 --> 01:17:13,720
Speaker 7: any attributes of a Christian character, is that we will

1534
01:17:13,720 --> 01:17:18,800
Speaker 7: continue to become victims and slaves to these ongoing problems,

1535
01:17:19,040 --> 01:17:21,400
Speaker 7: because these problems have to do with the wickedness of

1536
01:17:21,439 --> 01:17:25,000
Speaker 7: the hearts of the leaders. And until we acknowledge that

1537
01:17:25,040 --> 01:17:28,559
Speaker 7: there is a that there is a seed given in

1538
01:17:28,600 --> 01:17:32,559
Speaker 7: every human of choice, and when people have the ability

1539
01:17:32,640 --> 01:17:37,479
Speaker 7: to choose evil, we must hold that decision accountable not

1540
01:17:37,680 --> 01:17:41,599
Speaker 7: with creating other levels of evil, but with the level

1541
01:17:41,720 --> 01:17:47,040
Speaker 7: of unified compassion, unified grace, unified love that has a

1542
01:17:47,160 --> 01:17:51,320
Speaker 7: uniformity that collectively we say that this is the answer,

1543
01:17:51,920 --> 01:17:54,519
Speaker 7: is that this love and grace that they need is

1544
01:17:54,520 --> 01:17:56,400
Speaker 7: the same love and grace that I because see, here's

1545
01:17:56,439 --> 01:17:58,800
Speaker 7: the problem with the arguments of judgment. The arguments of

1546
01:17:58,840 --> 01:18:01,839
Speaker 7: judgment is that people never include themselves in their argument.

1547
01:18:03,600 --> 01:18:05,519
Speaker 7: You are just as guilty as I'm because you are

1548
01:18:05,600 --> 01:18:08,080
Speaker 7: just as dirty, even though you may then shoot somebody

1549
01:18:08,160 --> 01:18:10,920
Speaker 7: you thought a bad thought, and in the eyes of God,

1550
01:18:11,240 --> 01:18:14,479
Speaker 7: it is just as equal as anybody else. And until

1551
01:18:14,720 --> 01:18:18,200
Speaker 7: we begin to see ourselves as the needy and not

1552
01:18:18,280 --> 01:18:21,040
Speaker 7: the ones that are always having is that until that,

1553
01:18:21,160 --> 01:18:25,280
Speaker 7: probably until that paradigm shifts, we will for millennia after

1554
01:18:25,360 --> 01:18:28,080
Speaker 7: millennia after millennia, have this question in this conversation.

1555
01:18:28,439 --> 01:18:30,000
Speaker 5: I don't know the answer right now.

1556
01:18:30,040 --> 01:18:31,800
Speaker 7: I don't know the wind, I don't know the how,

1557
01:18:32,080 --> 01:18:34,639
Speaker 7: but I do know that the tools are there and

1558
01:18:34,680 --> 01:18:35,719
Speaker 7: the answers are there.

1559
01:18:35,800 --> 01:18:38,400
Speaker 4: We just don't respond to it. We don't pick it up.

1560
01:18:38,439 --> 01:18:43,560
Speaker 7: We we you know you can, you can create the medicine,

1561
01:18:43,880 --> 01:18:48,320
Speaker 7: but how to get people to take it is the lifelong.

1562
01:18:48,160 --> 01:18:50,320
Speaker 4: Response of our species of how do we do that?

1563
01:18:51,160 --> 01:18:53,880
Speaker 6: And my simple answer to it is that I don't

1564
01:18:53,880 --> 01:18:56,120
Speaker 6: lose open humanity. It reminds me that God is real

1565
01:18:56,960 --> 01:18:59,800
Speaker 6: as long as sin exists, will have death. As long

1566
01:18:59,840 --> 01:19:04,320
Speaker 6: as there's disparity, we're gonna have war. And the answer

1567
01:19:04,400 --> 01:19:08,519
Speaker 6: to it all is God alone. And so it gives

1568
01:19:08,560 --> 01:19:11,559
Speaker 6: me hope. You use the perfect examples. I think oft

1569
01:19:11,560 --> 01:19:15,519
Speaker 6: the time moments, all things work together for the good

1570
01:19:15,520 --> 01:19:17,320
Speaker 6: of those that love the Lord and are called according

1571
01:19:17,320 --> 01:19:20,320
Speaker 6: to his purpose. So a note eleven. There are people

1572
01:19:20,360 --> 01:19:22,160
Speaker 6: that were saved from nine eleven. Yeah, when you look

1573
01:19:22,200 --> 01:19:25,479
Speaker 6: at package what's happened in Palestine and Israel, they aren't

1574
01:19:25,520 --> 01:19:27,600
Speaker 6: ways that we would have decided to do things to

1575
01:19:27,680 --> 01:19:31,320
Speaker 6: draw people to God. But He knows and he does all.

1576
01:19:31,439 --> 01:19:34,240
Speaker 6: And then the perfect example for me is this. If

1577
01:19:34,280 --> 01:19:36,840
Speaker 6: I had to save the world, I only have one son.

1578
01:19:37,439 --> 01:19:39,200
Speaker 6: I only have one son. If I had to save

1579
01:19:39,240 --> 01:19:42,840
Speaker 6: the world, there's no way that if I could do

1580
01:19:42,880 --> 01:19:46,000
Speaker 6: it any way possible, you got one. If I could

1581
01:19:46,000 --> 01:19:49,639
Speaker 6: do it anyway possible, that I would choose to kill

1582
01:19:49,680 --> 01:19:53,040
Speaker 6: my only son, put him on a cross, send him

1583
01:19:53,040 --> 01:19:56,280
Speaker 6: through the most brutal, embarrassing death you could think of,

1584
01:19:56,520 --> 01:19:59,920
Speaker 6: for all mankind, for all mankind. So if that is

1585
01:20:00,000 --> 01:20:02,320
Speaker 6: that's how God decided to save the world, I can

1586
01:20:02,439 --> 01:20:07,400
Speaker 6: only imagine the things that we look at as evil

1587
01:20:07,680 --> 01:20:11,080
Speaker 6: are bad and the actual and ten of those things can.

1588
01:20:11,040 --> 01:20:13,519
Speaker 2: Be something good because when we look at the struggle that.

1589
01:20:13,520 --> 01:20:16,120
Speaker 6: Jesus went through, none of us could imagine to say

1590
01:20:16,120 --> 01:20:18,920
Speaker 6: that if my only son went through that, that that

1591
01:20:19,120 --> 01:20:20,200
Speaker 6: something good would come up.

1592
01:20:20,280 --> 01:20:22,240
Speaker 2: The only way we know good come up came up it.

1593
01:20:22,280 --> 01:20:24,559
Speaker 6: Now it's supposed to have been centuries and the story

1594
01:20:24,600 --> 01:20:26,600
Speaker 6: has been told, the story will be told of some

1595
01:20:26,640 --> 01:20:27,680
Speaker 6: of these things we look at.

1596
01:20:27,720 --> 01:20:30,120
Speaker 2: It's calamity and there could have been some good in it.

1597
01:20:30,680 --> 01:20:34,920
Speaker 4: I honestly like his ass so much better than thank you, brothers.

1598
01:20:34,920 --> 01:20:36,080
Speaker 4: Appreciate the coppreciation.

1599
01:20:36,479 --> 01:20:36,679
Speaker 2: Man.

1600
01:20:36,760 --> 01:20:39,679
Speaker 4: I do it again. Honored so much.

1601
01:20:39,600 --> 01:20:41,200
Speaker 5: And go pick up do it again.

1602
01:20:42,520 --> 01:20:44,839
Speaker 4: Right jan the Kings check it out.

1603
01:20:44,840 --> 01:20:48,599
Speaker 7: Get that it's on the YouTube, Kurk Franklin and it's

1604
01:20:48,800 --> 01:20:51,599
Speaker 7: it's it's we are so grateful how people to responded

1605
01:20:51,640 --> 01:20:51,800
Speaker 7: to it.

1606
01:20:51,800 --> 01:20:52,479
Speaker 4: It's really dope.

1607
01:20:52,600 --> 01:20:55,400
Speaker 1: I appreciate you, man.

1608
01:20:55,439 --> 01:20:56,240
Speaker 2: This is dope. Man.

1609
01:20:58,280 --> 01:21:01,960
Speaker 8: An illegal alien from Guatemala charged with raping a child

1610
01:21:02,000 --> 01:21:05,800
Speaker 8: in Massachusetts. An MS thirteen gang member from Al Salvador

1611
01:21:06,040 --> 01:21:10,160
Speaker 8: accused of murdering a Texas. Man of Venezuelan charged with

1612
01:21:10,240 --> 01:21:14,120
Speaker 8: filming and selling child pornography in Michigan. These are just

1613
01:21:14,240 --> 01:21:18,000
Speaker 8: some of the heinous migrant criminals caught because of President

1614
01:21:18,040 --> 01:21:21,559
Speaker 8: Donald J. Trump's leadership. I'm Christy Noman, the United States

1615
01:21:21,640 --> 01:21:26,439
Speaker 8: Secretary of Homeland Security. Under President Trump, attempted illegal border

1616
01:21:26,439 --> 01:21:30,000
Speaker 8: crossings are at the lowest levels ever recorded, and over

1617
01:21:30,080 --> 01:21:33,280
Speaker 8: one hundred thousand illegal aliens have been arrested. If you

1618
01:21:33,360 --> 01:21:37,200
Speaker 8: are here illegally, your next you will be fined nearly

1619
01:21:37,280 --> 01:21:41,320
Speaker 8: one thousand dollars a day, imprisoned, and deported. You will

1620
01:21:41,360 --> 01:21:45,000
Speaker 8: never return. But if you register using our CBP home

1621
01:21:45,040 --> 01:21:48,400
Speaker 8: app and leave now, you could be allowed to return legally.

1622
01:21:48,760 --> 01:21:53,519
Speaker 8: Do what's right. Leave now. Under President Trump, America's laws,

1623
01:21:53,680 --> 01:21:56,120
Speaker 8: border and families will be protected.

1624
01:21:56,240 --> 01:21:58,360
Speaker 4: Sponsored by the United States Department of Homeland Security.