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Speaker 1: Oh, welcome back to Behind the Bastards, a podcast about

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Speaker 1: Coco Chanel this week. How are you feeling? How are

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Speaker 1: you feeling? How are we feeling about Coco so far? Yeah?

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Speaker 1: Are we still down for that nickname? Court? I loved

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Speaker 1: her for part one minus a few anti Semitic rants, yeah,

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Speaker 1: the anti semitism, the fast fashion, but otherwise pretty good. Yeah.

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Speaker 1: So now you're about to ruin my Coco Chanel fantasy

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Speaker 1: and I'm not excited. But yeah, look, we can just

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Speaker 1: make a whitewashed version of her life story for like again,

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Speaker 1: Netflix or Hulu or somebody, and we can just cut

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Speaker 1: out the whole, you know, ixnay on the atsien a

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Speaker 1: part of it, and then we'll be good. Yeah. I

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Speaker 1: know that's a good People do that all the time. Yeah, yeah, yeah,

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Speaker 1: make a lot of money. Let's just make a lot

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Speaker 1: of money. Look when you when you've got Netflix money,

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Speaker 1: which at this point is what like forty dollars, you

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Speaker 1: don't have to apologize for anything. Um. So, Coco Chanel

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Speaker 1: is riding high in the in the early nineteen twenties.

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Speaker 1: She is rich as shit, She is the talk of

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Speaker 1: the town. She is pretty racist, and the guy she

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Speaker 1: loves is dead, but hey, she's friends with Picasso, and

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Speaker 1: can you put a price on being friends with Picasso? Probably?

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Speaker 1: She's also friends with the Grand Duke Dmitri, who is

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Speaker 1: a former Russian noble exiled after the Bolshevik Revolution U

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Speaker 1: Grand Duke Dmitri like the TLDR of his background as

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Speaker 1: he was one of the guys who killed Rasputant. So

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Speaker 1: this is like a dude that she parties with. Um,

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Speaker 1: maybe has a thing with. Is the Grand Duke Dmitri

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Speaker 1: pretty cool? Um? Is he a good guy or a

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Speaker 1: bad guy? I mean he's a he's a czarist noble,

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Speaker 1: so he's a bad guy, but he's not the particularly bad. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: she will hang out with worse people. And he does

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Speaker 1: not have a baleful influence on her. Mainly the thing

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Speaker 1: that like, they spend a lot of time drinking and

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Speaker 1: talking and whatever, and from his like stories of the homeland,

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Speaker 1: she decides to launch a line of Chanelle clothing patterned

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Speaker 1: off of Russian peasant clothes, which is again very successful.

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Speaker 1: And it's also from her conversations with the Grand Duke

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Speaker 1: that Coco gets the inspiration to create her own scent.

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Speaker 1: And yeah, this is what becomes Chanelle number five, Right,

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Speaker 1: everybody knows that CNN Fashion describes the process of concocting

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Speaker 1: the soon to be infamous scent. Chanelle launched her eponymous

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Speaker 1: number five perfume in nineteen twenty one. A year before,

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Speaker 1: so the legend goes, she had challenged French Russian perfumer

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Speaker 1: Ernest Bow to create a scent that would make its

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Speaker 1: wear smell like a woman and not like a rose.

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Speaker 1: The result was a mixture of eighty natural and synthetic ingredients,

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Speaker 1: which Bow presented her with a numbered series of fume

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Speaker 1: samples to choose from. She picked the fifth. The blend

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Speaker 1: subverted the notion of fragrances as a symbol of high

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Speaker 1: social class, instead pushing the idea that women could be

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Speaker 1: multiple things, natural and artificial, provocative and pure. It was

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Speaker 1: what I was waiting for, Chanel later said, a perfume

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Speaker 1: like nothing else, a woman's perfume with the scent of

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Speaker 1: a woman. I did hear one time that she picked

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Speaker 1: something else first? I think did yeah, yeah, yeah, I

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Speaker 1: think she picks like another one twenty two, like yeah,

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Speaker 1: she eventually lands on five. But that's why it's Chanelle

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Speaker 1: number five, because she's given a bunch of options, and

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Speaker 1: five is the one she picks, and she's not only like, obviously,

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Speaker 1: I guess it smells good. I can't think of off

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Speaker 1: the top of my head what Chanelle number five smells like, Like,

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Speaker 1: I couldn't tell you, but you know, everyone knows that

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Speaker 1: it's a thing, right, you say Chanelle number five, and

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Speaker 1: everyone has heard of it, which is it's like Coca Cola, Right,

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Speaker 1: it's the Coca Cola of perfumes. At this point, I

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Speaker 1: think it smells like department store kind of fright. Yeah, yeah,

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Speaker 1: probably that's probably fair to say at this point. And

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Speaker 1: so the most interesting thing about it is how it

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Speaker 1: became that ubiquitous, And this passage from how Vaughan's book

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Speaker 1: describes the innovative way in which Coco is going to

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Speaker 1: market her new perfume. To promote her new invention, Chanelle,

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Speaker 1: like the shrewd peasant she was believed in word of mouth.

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Speaker 1: She tested Chanelle number five by inviting friends to dine

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Speaker 1: with her at a posh restaurant near Grass. Then she

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Speaker 1: furtively sprayed guests passing by her table, and they reacted

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Speaker 1: with surprise and pleasure. Pleased with the results, Chanelle returned

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Speaker 1: to Paris and quietly launched her new venture. She didn't

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Speaker 1: announce its arrival in the press. She wore it herself

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Speaker 1: and sprayed the shop's dressing rooms with it, giving bottles

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Speaker 1: to a few of her high society friends. Her perfume

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Speaker 1: soon became the talk of Paris. She does kind of

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Speaker 1: the department store. Yeah, no, no, non consensual perfume spraying.

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Speaker 1: I do feel like the fact that they're marketing it

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Speaker 1: a woman's perfume. They that's how it's marketed. Now, it's

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Speaker 1: the same exact marketing. I mess with success, Sophie, you know.

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Speaker 1: And then and then I think that the non consensual

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Speaker 1: spraying is basically department that it is funny, Courtly, you

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Speaker 1: brought up department store. She does kind of invent that too. Yes, yeah,

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Speaker 1: some braun's just got to spray you. We would never

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Speaker 1: have that episode of Friends with Joey. Sorry. If you

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Speaker 1: got it, you got it. If you didn't get it,

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Speaker 1: watch it. I feel like guns stores should do the

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Speaker 1: same thing with mace, like you want, honey, where are

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Speaker 1: you going with it? Yeah? No, it was a mace joke.

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Speaker 1: It's fine. So the demand for Chanelle number five almost

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Speaker 1: immediately exceeded. This blows up like basically nothing ever had before.

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Speaker 1: It immediately exceeds Coco's ability to produce or distribute it.

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Speaker 1: You know, she is a boutique fashion maker. She's very successful,

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Speaker 1: but she does not have the kind of production capacity

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Speaker 1: to mass manufacturer perfume. And so she starts looking for

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Speaker 1: somebody to help her expand and an entrepreneur named Pierre

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Speaker 1: Wertheimer makes her an offer. Pierre is the patriarch of

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Speaker 1: a wealthy Jewish family, and he probably also is kind

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Speaker 1: of in love with Coco Chanelle. Coco has kind of

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Speaker 1: a love hate relationship with him because there's I think

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Speaker 1: a degree to which she finds him a little charming,

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Speaker 1: but also she's very racist. And more to the point,

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Speaker 1: this deal that he's going to make with her to

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Speaker 1: produce Coco's perfume, to produce Shanelle number five, it's going

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Speaker 1: to make her incredibly wealthy, right, and it's going to

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Speaker 1: make Shanelle number five an iconic product, but he gets

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Speaker 1: most of the money from it. Now, wait, is this

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Speaker 1: you said she'sist. Is this a Jewish man? Oh? Yeah,

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Speaker 1: so that's going to be a problem because the deal

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Speaker 1: and you know whatever, these are all wealthy capitalists, So

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Speaker 1: I'm not going to try to come down on like

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Speaker 1: this person and is the right or the wrong. But

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Speaker 1: he is taking on the primary financial risk by putting

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Speaker 1: in a shitload of money upfront to create a production

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Speaker 1: line to mass produce Chanel number five, right, And so

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Speaker 1: he gets most of the money. Right. Coco makes a

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Speaker 1: shitload of money. She makes more money than anyone could

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Speaker 1: ever spend in a lifetime, and more money, in fact,

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Speaker 1: than she is able to ever spend in her lifetime.

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Speaker 1: But she will spend the rest of her life kind

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Speaker 1: of obsessed with the fact that he's cheating her out

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Speaker 1: of her fair share of the profits. And this is

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Speaker 1: very related to the fact that he is Jewish and

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Speaker 1: she is racist. Right, Yeah, it like that validates all

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Speaker 1: of her I mean not really, but in her mind

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Speaker 1: validates all of her. Like yes, And from where I'm

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Speaker 1: sitting again, I'm not gonna like whitewashed Wortheimer because there's

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Speaker 1: some critiques to make of him because he's a wealthy businessman.

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Speaker 1: But she makes more money than she could ever have

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Speaker 1: spent on this ship. So the fact that she's obsessing

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Speaker 1: over the fact that this is not as fair a

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Speaker 1: contract as she thinks it should be is. I don't know.

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Speaker 1: It says a lot about her, obviously. I think that

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Speaker 1: is more understandable because she grows up super poor. So

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Speaker 1: maybe she has this kind of fixation because money was

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Speaker 1: always so tight for her as a younger person. I

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Speaker 1: don't know, but like her anger at the fact that

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Speaker 1: she's not getting more money as academic because she is

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Speaker 1: never able to spend close to as much money as

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Speaker 1: she has. By the mid nineteen twenties, Coco had reached

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Speaker 1: the absolute height of success in her business life, and

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Speaker 1: she was about to reach a similar height in her

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Speaker 1: personal life. In nearly twenty she made the acquaintance of

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Speaker 1: a British socialite and aristocrat named Vera Bate Lombardi. Vera

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Speaker 1: was famed for her beauty and had many influential suitors

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Speaker 1: in the British nobility. She was one of these like, look,

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Speaker 1: you're not going to marry me, but we're gonna have

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Speaker 1: a good time, right And Vera is a big advocate

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Speaker 1: of what was called at the time the sporting life,

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Speaker 1: and this is kind of how British aristocrats spent their

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Speaker 1: free time. They're going on a hunts, they're shooting pheasants,

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Speaker 1: there shooting foxes, they're playing tennis, They're going on sailing

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Speaker 1: advent is around the Cape of Good Hope or whatever.

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Speaker 1: You know, this is what the elite spends their time doing, right,

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Speaker 1: and that Vera is a big advocate of the sporting life.

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Speaker 1: And because she is so beautiful and fucking a lot

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Speaker 1: of these influential British aristocrats, she knows all of the

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Speaker 1: people that are worth knowing in British high society. Now

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Speaker 1: she falls in love with Chanelle because the sporting life

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Speaker 1: is kind of difficult when you're wearing like a sixty

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Speaker 1: five pound whalebone dress that's got like a ten foot

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Speaker 1: wide like hoop skirt or whatever. So Coco's clothing, like

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Speaker 1: the sporting life is kind of increasingly becoming a fashionable

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Speaker 1: thing in late eighteen hundreds, early nineteen hundreds, and the

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Speaker 1: fact that Coco starts coming out with these really comfortable, thin,

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Speaker 1: like easy to wear clothing is huge for abroad. Like Vera,

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Speaker 1: She's like, oh man, this fucking this lady makes the

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Speaker 1: best clothing ever. And so Vera befriends Coco Chanelle and

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Speaker 1: introduces her to English high society, which is the most

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Speaker 1: closed and hardest to enter aristocratic set in European society

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Speaker 1: at this point. And it's through Vera that in nineteen

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Speaker 1: twenty three, Coco gets invited to a dinner at Monte Carlo,

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Speaker 1: where she meets the Duke of Westminster, Hugh Richard Aartha Grosvena,

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Speaker 1: known as Ben Door to his friends, and Coco quickly

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Speaker 1: becomes a friend of Bendor. He is entranced by her.

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Speaker 1: And you know, Ben Door is one of the only men,

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Speaker 1: maybe the only man really she was likely to meet

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Speaker 1: who has more money than her, because he is probably

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Speaker 1: the richest man in Europe. He is the largest landowner

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Speaker 1: in Europe at like near the height of the colonial period.

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Speaker 1: This guy he has so this guy's got a lot

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Speaker 1: of slaves. There's a couple of levels, basically essentially, but like, so,

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Speaker 1: there's a couple of levels to having money. Right, There's

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Speaker 1: like being middle class, which is when you can afford

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Speaker 1: the stuff that you need, but you're not free of procarity. Right.

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Speaker 1: There's upper middle class, where you can afford this off

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Speaker 1: you need and most of the things you want, but

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Speaker 1: you're not entirely free of precarity. And then there's rich, right,

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Speaker 1: which is where you have all you have a lot

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Speaker 1: of money, right, But there's a level and most people

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Speaker 1: just think that, like, yeah, rich is kind of like

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Speaker 1: the top of having money. There's a level above rich

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Speaker 1: because rich people have money, the mega rich like Bendor,

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Speaker 1: they don't have money. They just don't have They can

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Speaker 1: never run out of money. That's a different thing, right,

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Speaker 1: Having money is different than you Like Bendor does not

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Speaker 1: spend money. Ben Door demands things and they are made

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Speaker 1: for him or they come to him, right, Like his

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Speaker 1: wealth is so vast that he effectively does not have money.

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Speaker 1: He has a superpower, he has magic. That is the

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Speaker 1: kind of rich this guy is, right, like this is

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Speaker 1: this is like this is um, this is Jeff Bezos

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Speaker 1: level right of wealth, except for more of it is

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Speaker 1: actually in physical things for a guy like Bendorum it is.

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Speaker 1: You cannot exaggerate how much fucking money this guy has.

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Speaker 1: So like British, I mean usually it's old money, right,

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Speaker 1: but you're year old. No, he is old money. He

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Speaker 1: is inherited a lot of it. Um, this is old

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Speaker 1: colonial money. He owns land all over the fucking place

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Speaker 1: like that, he owns palaces, um, he owns a massive

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Speaker 1: yacht that is like a gigantic floating English mansion, Like

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Speaker 1: it's a country mansion that he had turned into a

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Speaker 1: yacht so he could sail around but still live in

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Speaker 1: an English country mansion like this, Like yeah, beyond rich,

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Speaker 1: you know, like that's that is the kind of money

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Speaker 1: this guy possesses. Like this boat sounds like a great

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Speaker 1: way to die. Yeah, and again, nobody told him how

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Speaker 1: much the boat cost. He just said, I would like

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Speaker 1: a boat that feels like my country mansion and it

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Speaker 1: was made, you know, like that's the that's the degree

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Speaker 1: the kind of guy. This is. One of the women

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Speaker 1: who spent time around Bendor later described him this way,

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Speaker 1: a pure Victorian who had eyes for his shotgun, his hunters,

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Speaker 1: jumpers and race horses, his dogs, while English women of

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Speaker 1: his day had only to give birth to children and

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Speaker 1: please their masters. A man who played it dropping a

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Speaker 1: bit of sugar in its paper wrapper into hot coffee

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Speaker 1: and with a chronometer in hand, timing how long it

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Speaker 1: took to melt. A man who enjoyed hiding diamonds under

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Speaker 1: the pillow of his mistresses. A man who could brutalize women. Okay,

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Speaker 1: that has been door sexy. Yeah, that's what Coco thinks,

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Speaker 1: and he is drawn to her in part because, like,

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Speaker 1: as rich as he is, she is probably the only

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Speaker 1: woman on planet Earth who he would number one be

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Speaker 1: interested in, but who has no interest in his money.

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Speaker 1: Yeah right, she doesn't need his money because she hasn't

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Speaker 1: She like, again, he's rich as fuck, but like she

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Speaker 1: has more money than she can ever spend. At one point,

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Speaker 1: they have a spat over the fact that he's like

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Speaker 1: constantly cheating on her, right, and she tells him all

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Speaker 1: I want from you? He's like, basically, what can I

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Speaker 1: do to make this right? And she says, all I

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Speaker 1: want from you are the wild flowers picked by your

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Speaker 1: own hands, right, Basically, I want you to actually go

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Speaker 1: do a thing for me. And instead he has his

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Speaker 1: servants get a bunch of wildflowers and lace them with

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Speaker 1: jewels and give them to her because he just can't

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Speaker 1: comprehend doing a thing. You know, he's not that kind

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Speaker 1: of man. No, So what she is interested in? Addition,

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Speaker 1: I think she does legitimately like this guy. She stays

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Speaker 1: with him for ten years, right, she does. I think

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Speaker 1: there is like an emotional connection that they have, and

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Speaker 1: he seems to legitimately care about her to the extent

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Speaker 1: that a man like this is capable of caring about

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Speaker 1: other people. Um. She is also interested in his connections.

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Speaker 1: And it's through ben door that Coco meets with the

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Speaker 1: Duke of Windsor later Edward King Edward the Eighth, who

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Speaker 1: then abdicates because he marries a common woman. Even don't

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Speaker 1: yeh he is he is he is he is a

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Speaker 1: hung out with Hitler. Not he is a he is

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Speaker 1: a first name basis with Hitler Nazi. Um. She also

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Speaker 1: meets with Winston Churchill, who, despite being pretty anti Nazi,

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Speaker 1: is friends with all of these guys and hanging out

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Speaker 1: with them. Churchill writes a lot at Churchill actually writes

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Speaker 1: a good amount about Coco Chanelle. She is a good hunter.

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Speaker 1: She's really good at like riding horses and hunting from horseback.

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Speaker 1: And he's like impressed with how good she is at

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Speaker 1: this stuff. He writes, I think he might have had

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Speaker 1: a crush on her. He writes a decent amount about

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Speaker 1: like her shooting animals and riding her horse and stuff. Um,

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Speaker 1: he's very he finds her very impressive though. Um, And

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Speaker 1: you know, all of these men, including Churchill, are incredibly

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Speaker 1: right wing and all of these men, aside from Churchill,

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Speaker 1: are huge fans of Hitler. So even Churchill, though, wasn't

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Speaker 1: he a little anti Semitic? Oh yeah, I mean for sure, yes, yes, yeah, yeah,

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Speaker 1: yeah yeah, but he is he does like he is.

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Speaker 1: One of the things you have to give Churchill is

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Speaker 1: like he's not a not a Hitler stand right? Yeah? Um,

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Speaker 1: but no, I mean they're all they're all biggots, they're

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Speaker 1: all right leg homies with Hitler. Hitler. Yeah, I mean

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Speaker 1: I like it. But all these guys are shitty. Don't

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Speaker 1: get me wrong, It's just that Churchill is not that

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Speaker 1: specifically fuck all of these motherfuckers. But there are tears, absolutely,

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Speaker 1: there are tears of fucker rate. And the guy that

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Speaker 1: she's like bumping with is that one is almost the shittiest.

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Speaker 1: I would say, King Edward the Eighth is a little

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Speaker 1: shittier than Ben Door. But yeah, it's it's good stuff.

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Speaker 1: So in the late nineteen twenties and early thirties, which

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Speaker 1: is when it's like kind of the mid twenties to

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Speaker 1: the early thirties, like twenty three to thirty three, I

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Speaker 1: think more or less, that's when Coco is kind of

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Speaker 1: a really intimate part of this circle. So that's quite

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Speaker 1: a lot of time, you know. They spend a lot

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Speaker 1: of time together. The Duke of Westminster and his friends

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Speaker 1: admired the Nazi movement, most particularly for its strong stance

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Speaker 1: against the Jews. Lawrence James, author of a book called Aristocrats,

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Speaker 1: claims what lay behind their support of appeasement was a

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Speaker 1: fear of communism. What emerges is a picture of a

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Speaker 1: knot of peers adrifted, an unconcus genial world united by paranoia, pessimism,

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Speaker 1: and panic. So basically, the Bolshevik revolutions just happened. All

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Speaker 1: of the nobility in Russia has been either murdered or

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Speaker 1: forced to flee, and a lot of their wealth has

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Speaker 1: been taken. Ben door. This is one of the few

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Speaker 1: things he's got a fear is like with the socialism

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Speaker 1: thing spreads over to England. Yeah, like I gotta shipload

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Speaker 1: to louse um. So they support Nazison because of that,

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Speaker 1: and because they're all anti Semitic, they see Bolshevism as

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Speaker 1: a Jewish movement, right yeah, And these are the people

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Speaker 1: that Coco's hanging out with. So this kind of this

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Speaker 1: is when she I think probably moves from the normal

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Speaker 1: level of anti Semitic in French society more or less

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Speaker 1: too super racist because she spends ten years with the

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Speaker 1: most racist in these guys. All they have is money

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Speaker 1: and time to spin conspiracy theories, often about the Jews,

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Speaker 1: and so like she's just kind of hanging out with

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Speaker 1: them when they're like drinking and talking about this Judeo

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Speaker 1: Bolshevism shit and how fascism is the only thing that

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Speaker 1: can stop it. She's like, you got to meet these

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Speaker 1: guys have really great YouTube channels. Oh man, these guys

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Speaker 1: would have all been Tate stands absolutely. Lawrence James goes

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Speaker 1: on to explain visceral anti Semitism permeated the upper classes

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Speaker 1: between the wars. Jews were vilified as flashy and pushy

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Speaker 1: arivests with a knack for enriching themselves when the aristocracy

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Speaker 1: was grumbling about an often exaggerated downturn in their fortunes.

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Speaker 1: And Coco, obviously, she's well prepared to embrace this bigotry.

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Speaker 1: But Ben Door is going to not only kind of

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Speaker 1: encourage this bigotry, but he's going to lend a sheen

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Speaker 1: of class and education to the way in which she's racist.

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Speaker 1: As how Vaughan describes here whatever channel's views on Bolshevism.

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Speaker 1: Before nineteen twenty five, Ben Door tutored her on the

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Speaker 1: evils of communism and confirmed her antipathy toward Jews. He

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Speaker 1: shuddered at the word Marxism. He was notoriously homophobic. When

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Speaker 1: his homosexual brother in law advocate free trade unions. As

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Speaker 1: leader of the Liberal Party, Bendor revealed him to be

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Speaker 1: gay to the King George the Fifth, ruining his sister's marriage.

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Speaker 1: In the man's political career, Chanelle could match Bendor's homophobia.

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Speaker 1: She is quoted as telling Paul Morand while in exile

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Speaker 1: in Switzerland in the winter of nineteen forty six, at

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Speaker 1: Saint Maurice's homosexuals, Are they not always hanging around women

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Speaker 1: my beauty, my little one, my angel, continually strangling them

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Speaker 1: with flattery. I have seen young women ruined by these

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Speaker 1: awful queers, drugs, divorce and scandal that will use any

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Speaker 1: means to destroy a competitor in Reek vengeance on a woman.

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Speaker 1: The queers want to be women, but they are lousy women.

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Speaker 1: Oh my gosh, she's a real piece of shit. This

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Speaker 1: is the end of the sympathetic Coco. Oh yeah, yeah,

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Speaker 1: I p is she going back and forth from Britain,

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Speaker 1: Great Britain to Paris, Like London and Paris at this time,

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Speaker 1: she travels constantly, okay, and she's often like hopping a

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Speaker 1: ride across the Channel or whatever on like a yacht

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Speaker 1: or you know, she's got she has all of the

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Speaker 1: money in the world. She has all these connections. And

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Speaker 1: you know who else has all the money in the world.

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Speaker 1: Our sponsors, not yet, not until you pay them some

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Speaker 1: of your Ah, we are b a q that's how

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Speaker 1: you spell back. So Chanel spends the worst years of

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Speaker 1: the Great Depression with Bendor, and you know this is

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Speaker 1: she is kind of completely divorced from regular life at

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Speaker 1: this point. She's a very grounded upbringing, you might say,

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Speaker 1: not anymore. As his mistress, she finds herself regularly at

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Speaker 1: exclusive gatherings, these royal cotillions, where she'll be like drinking

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Speaker 1: and partying with like literally the fifty or sixty most

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Speaker 1: powerful people in the world. Pretty much. Bindor's palace, Eaton Hall,

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Speaker 1: had fifty four suites and a staff who were changed

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Speaker 1: trained to keep completely silent and just ensure that the

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Speaker 1: guests never had to lift a finger. So while millions

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Speaker 1: of people are starving all around the world while like

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Speaker 1: the depression is at its worst. This is what Coco's

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Speaker 1: up to, Yeah, would have been, could have used Amalata

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Speaker 1: of her too. So she and the Duke of Westminster

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Speaker 1: finally break up in the early thirties I believe it's

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Speaker 1: thirty three, primarily due to the fact that Westminster wants

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Speaker 1: an air and Chanelle is unable to get pregnant. She

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Speaker 1: was also frustrated constantly by the fact that he cheated

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Speaker 1: on her with clock like regularity. The two fought more

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Speaker 1: and more as time went on, having a particularly rivaled

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Speaker 1: argument after Bin Door brought a beautiful socialite onto his yacht,

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Speaker 1: the Flying Cloud. His usual tactic was to calm Cocoa

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Speaker 1: with a gift, and on this occasion he gave her

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Speaker 1: a priceless emerald that had been carved out of one

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Speaker 1: of the Empire's overseas colonies, something that's probably worth an

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Speaker 1: incalculable fortune to day. And because they're fighting, she takes

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Speaker 1: this massive emerald and she drops it into the ocean

390
00:22:01,560 --> 00:22:05,119
Speaker 1: like a real life Titanic thing. Yeah, but instead of

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Speaker 1: it being for whatever reason that lady did it, she

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Speaker 1: just does it because like, fuck you were fighting. I

393
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Speaker 1: don't even need this Emerald. I think she is like

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Speaker 1: you can't buy me. That's like one of her vibes.

395
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Speaker 1: It's just like, fuck off, rich guy, and I think

396
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Speaker 1: that is That's one of the things that is really

397
00:22:22,440 --> 00:22:24,919
Speaker 1: interesting and kind of as bad as she is endearing

398
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Speaker 1: about her is that from the beginning she's got this

399
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Speaker 1: like number one, I ain't going to actually stay with

400
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Speaker 1: a dude unless I really am in love with him.

401
00:22:32,400 --> 00:22:35,479
Speaker 1: And part of how I will make that, like, the

402
00:22:35,520 --> 00:22:37,800
Speaker 1: only way to really prove that is to make sure

403
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Speaker 1: that I am rich as shit, like so that this

404
00:22:40,760 --> 00:22:44,200
Speaker 1: whatever I'm doing is totally my call, you know, which

405
00:22:44,280 --> 00:22:46,199
Speaker 1: is interesting about her. It's one of the things that

406
00:22:46,240 --> 00:22:50,840
Speaker 1: makes her a compelling person to read about. Now they

407
00:22:50,880 --> 00:22:53,840
Speaker 1: break up, but there again, she's pretty good with her exes.

408
00:22:53,880 --> 00:22:56,879
Speaker 1: They're friends for the rest of Bendor's life, which fortunately

409
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Speaker 1: ends in fifty three, but Chanelle drifts away from him

410
00:23:00,640 --> 00:23:03,399
Speaker 1: after kind of the early thirties. She spends a chunk

411
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Speaker 1: of those years in Hollywood, where she designs clothing for

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00:23:06,119 --> 00:23:08,840
Speaker 1: actor just like a like less than a year in Hollywood,

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Speaker 1: she makes clothing for actors and actresses in a bunch

414
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Speaker 1: of films, but most of those movies flop, which is

415
00:23:13,800 --> 00:23:16,280
Speaker 1: kind of one of her few brushes with failure. But

416
00:23:16,400 --> 00:23:18,640
Speaker 1: her time there puts her into the acquaintance of the

417
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Speaker 1: next great love of her life, a guy named Paul

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Speaker 1: Era barn Garay, known to most as Paul Iribe, thank God,

419
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Speaker 1: because I can't really say that last time. So Paul

420
00:23:30,880 --> 00:23:34,159
Speaker 1: Iribe is a Basque man. He was, he's in the

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Speaker 1: film industry. He had succeeded in the movie business as

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Speaker 1: an art director for Cecil b de Mille. He was

423
00:23:40,240 --> 00:23:42,879
Speaker 1: also a director in his own right in France. He

424
00:23:42,960 --> 00:23:45,400
Speaker 1: was famous for being the illustrator of an erotic art

425
00:23:45,400 --> 00:23:47,840
Speaker 1: book and also for being one of the first writers

426
00:23:47,840 --> 00:23:52,760
Speaker 1: and illustrators for Vogue. So he's an artist. You know, Yeah,

427
00:23:52,760 --> 00:23:57,720
Speaker 1: she's very drunk, well flaws. I'm sure you're gonna lay on.

428
00:23:58,680 --> 00:24:01,399
Speaker 1: So in addition to being a very talented artist with

429
00:24:01,440 --> 00:24:06,720
Speaker 1: a provocative wit, he is so racist. This guy, this

430
00:24:06,760 --> 00:24:10,879
Speaker 1: guy is like Hitler level of racist, right um, and

431
00:24:10,960 --> 00:24:13,840
Speaker 1: that has an impact on Paul aid because like Hitler's

432
00:24:13,880 --> 00:24:15,800
Speaker 1: coming into power in this period, the far rights in

433
00:24:15,840 --> 00:24:19,520
Speaker 1: a sent globally. You know, YadA, YadA, YadA, anti Semitism

434
00:24:19,600 --> 00:24:22,600
Speaker 1: is in, you might say, Vogue and a Reb convinces

435
00:24:22,720 --> 00:24:25,200
Speaker 1: Chanel that she could be a part of this big

436
00:24:25,240 --> 00:24:29,120
Speaker 1: ground swell in racism. With a small investment and using

437
00:24:29,160 --> 00:24:32,679
Speaker 1: her money, he relaunched a failed newspaper, Le Timoyne as

438
00:24:32,720 --> 00:24:37,080
Speaker 1: a nationalist anti Semitic propaganda paper. And I'm gonna quote again, Yeah,

439
00:24:37,440 --> 00:24:42,120
Speaker 1: Koko Chanelle founds a racism newspaper. Oh my gosh, cool,

440
00:24:42,240 --> 00:24:46,400
Speaker 1: it's awesome. I can't believe you, like, learn what racism

441
00:24:46,840 --> 00:24:50,760
Speaker 1: is and you're like, you know what, I'm gonna gotta

442
00:24:50,760 --> 00:24:53,480
Speaker 1: be a newspaper about this shit. I want to pay

443
00:24:53,520 --> 00:24:56,639
Speaker 1: for the town with how racist I am. Yeah, I

444
00:24:56,640 --> 00:24:59,000
Speaker 1: gotta make a newspaper about how much I hate people.

445
00:24:59,600 --> 00:25:04,679
Speaker 1: I can just only imagine her in modern times, Like

446
00:25:05,240 --> 00:25:07,680
Speaker 1: I think she would have been just as successful. I'll

447
00:25:07,680 --> 00:25:10,320
Speaker 1: tell you that much. Yeah. No, I don't disagree. I

448
00:25:10,440 --> 00:25:16,399
Speaker 1: don't disagree. I just it's fascinating the parallels. Yeah, yeah,

449
00:25:16,440 --> 00:25:20,080
Speaker 1: and she really like she is this kind of timeless

450
00:25:21,640 --> 00:25:25,679
Speaker 1: capitalist ghoul because you can just imagine, Yeah, you just

451
00:25:25,680 --> 00:25:29,000
Speaker 1: transfer today the internet. She wouldn't have been any less successful.

452
00:25:29,000 --> 00:25:31,240
Speaker 1: She would have made most of the same calls and

453
00:25:31,280 --> 00:25:33,560
Speaker 1: they would have worked about as well. She's like in

454
00:25:33,560 --> 00:25:38,040
Speaker 1: this oddly fraught relationship with Bill Maher or something. Yeah,

455
00:25:38,040 --> 00:25:40,440
Speaker 1: I would have been Bill mare today. So I'm gonna

456
00:25:40,440 --> 00:25:43,920
Speaker 1: I'm gonna quote from how Vaughan. According to one biographer,

457
00:25:43,920 --> 00:25:47,800
Speaker 1: Aribe was an elitist bourgeoisie supercharged with a with an

458
00:25:47,840 --> 00:25:51,320
Speaker 1: irrational fear of foreigners. Reading his issues of Letemoine, one

459
00:25:51,320 --> 00:25:53,760
Speaker 1: would think France was the eternal victim of some vast

460
00:25:53,800 --> 00:25:57,560
Speaker 1: international conspiracy. The magazine was a timid echo of France's

461
00:25:57,600 --> 00:26:01,600
Speaker 1: fascist and anti Semitic press, publications that supported French stormtroopers

462
00:26:01,640 --> 00:26:04,680
Speaker 1: named the Hooded Ones, and groups promoting law and order

463
00:26:04,680 --> 00:26:08,480
Speaker 1: in Italy and Germany. Biographer Charles Rue believed Chanelle's launching

464
00:26:08,480 --> 00:26:11,320
Speaker 1: of Le Timoine with Ariba as editor and art director

465
00:26:11,359 --> 00:26:13,960
Speaker 1: marked her transition from political indifference to a view of

466
00:26:13,960 --> 00:26:16,800
Speaker 1: the future modeled on the opinions of Aribe, mixed with

467
00:26:16,880 --> 00:26:20,480
Speaker 1: ideas and prejudices absorbed during her peasant and Catholic upbringing.

468
00:26:20,840 --> 00:26:23,440
Speaker 1: In the February twenty fourth, nineteen thirty three edition of

469
00:26:23,480 --> 00:26:26,000
Speaker 1: the magazine, Aribe had the brass to draw Chanelle as

470
00:26:26,040 --> 00:26:29,280
Speaker 1: a martyred Mary Anne in her Ferrgian Bonnet, her naked

471
00:26:29,320 --> 00:26:31,960
Speaker 1: body held by a collection of evil looking men with

472
00:26:32,040 --> 00:26:35,280
Speaker 1: obvious Jewish features. France, according to a Ribe and Let,

473
00:26:35,320 --> 00:26:38,640
Speaker 1: Timoyne was suffering from a conspiracy managed by enemies within

474
00:26:39,040 --> 00:26:43,119
Speaker 1: called Samuel or Levy, the alien like Leon Bloom and

475
00:26:43,200 --> 00:26:47,400
Speaker 1: the Judeo Masonic mafia, the USSR and read rabbles. Leon

476
00:26:47,480 --> 00:26:50,840
Speaker 1: Bloom is like the leader of the Popular Front, which

477
00:26:50,920 --> 00:26:53,800
Speaker 1: is kind of this like left wing progressive political movement

478
00:26:53,840 --> 00:26:58,240
Speaker 1: that defeats the fascists and France during this period. So yeah,

479
00:26:59,000 --> 00:27:02,680
Speaker 1: that's the bigot. This is all the shit that's in

480
00:27:02,800 --> 00:27:09,320
Speaker 1: her paper. Yeah, oh my god, it's pretty bad. Yeah,

481
00:27:10,280 --> 00:27:12,720
Speaker 1: now there's a good there's some good news coming Courtney,

482
00:27:12,960 --> 00:27:15,480
Speaker 1: because Paula Reebe, like after a couple of years of

483
00:27:15,560 --> 00:27:18,600
Speaker 1: this in late nineteen thirty five, he's he's paying, he's

484
00:27:18,600 --> 00:27:22,120
Speaker 1: playing tennis, Coco's out sunning herself. They're having a great day.

485
00:27:22,320 --> 00:27:24,919
Speaker 1: And this motherfucker drops the fuck dead of a heart attack,

486
00:27:25,200 --> 00:27:29,920
Speaker 1: which is awesome, that's great, dead Nazi fuck him. But

487
00:27:30,240 --> 00:27:34,119
Speaker 1: second time her boyfriends died, right, Yeah, she loses a

488
00:27:34,160 --> 00:27:36,440
Speaker 1: lot of boyfriends. Yep. I'm just saying, you could really

489
00:27:36,560 --> 00:27:42,560
Speaker 1: sell this fucking Netflix show. I know. I look, you're

490
00:27:42,600 --> 00:27:44,840
Speaker 1: gonna have to cut a lot of the anti semitism.

491
00:27:45,119 --> 00:27:47,359
Speaker 1: You're gonna have to You're gonna have to cast for

492
00:27:47,480 --> 00:27:50,080
Speaker 1: Paula Rebe Who do we cast? Oh? Who's that guy?

493
00:27:50,240 --> 00:27:52,479
Speaker 1: He's in? Um, he's in the new Star Wars movies.

494
00:27:52,880 --> 00:27:59,960
Speaker 1: Everybody thinks he's handsome. Oh uh, you could probably do Padre,

495
00:28:00,240 --> 00:28:04,080
Speaker 1: you could do Pedro. You could whitewash Paula Rebus, Pedro, Pascal. Sure,

496
00:28:04,400 --> 00:28:10,879
Speaker 1: let's do that. You know what Courtney green Litt the

497
00:28:11,040 --> 00:28:17,159
Speaker 1: Coco story asterisk? My question? Yeah, what's that fucker's name? Um? Okay,

498
00:28:17,240 --> 00:28:20,320
Speaker 1: one sec? I want to know who you think is handsome?

499
00:28:22,200 --> 00:28:25,160
Speaker 1: I don't. I'm so bad at like movie star names. Wow,

500
00:28:25,800 --> 00:28:31,440
Speaker 1: I'm going I gotta say one thing. I appreciate. I

501
00:28:31,600 --> 00:28:35,760
Speaker 1: just typed into being Star Wars handsome guy. There's a

502
00:28:35,840 --> 00:28:39,840
Speaker 1: lot of potential options for that. You get Warwick Davis Um,

503
00:28:40,120 --> 00:28:42,800
Speaker 1: which I think is awesome. I don't even know who

504
00:28:42,880 --> 00:28:47,000
Speaker 1: that is. Warwick is the guy who plays the LEPrecon

505
00:28:47,080 --> 00:28:53,360
Speaker 1: and the LEPrecon films. He plays a number of Adam Driver. No,

506
00:28:53,600 --> 00:28:55,840
Speaker 1: not Adam Driver. I don't think Adam Driver's very good looking.

507
00:28:56,000 --> 00:28:59,720
Speaker 1: He's the guy who's kind of like Latin. Oh I'm sure,

508
00:28:59,840 --> 00:29:02,920
Speaker 1: I'm sure. Literally the entire audience is screaming at us.

509
00:29:03,320 --> 00:29:06,920
Speaker 1: Yeah he was in Willow too, Yes, yeah, God, who's

510
00:29:06,920 --> 00:29:12,680
Speaker 1: the fucking the guy who plays Anakin because everybody likes no, no, no, no,

511
00:29:14,400 --> 00:29:17,120
Speaker 1: I don't know. I'm so bad at names. He's he's

512
00:29:17,320 --> 00:29:21,360
Speaker 1: a little person that was in Willow and actually it

513
00:29:21,480 --> 00:29:24,240
Speaker 1: worked with a relative of mine and Willow. We're getting

514
00:29:24,280 --> 00:29:28,080
Speaker 1: totally derailed. Sorry, you know, he's grab I just appreciate

515
00:29:28,240 --> 00:29:30,680
Speaker 1: for his sake that he is the first pick and

516
00:29:30,840 --> 00:29:33,920
Speaker 1: bing for Star Wars. Handsome guy. Good for you, Warwick, Yes,

517
00:29:35,040 --> 00:29:38,960
Speaker 1: love you appreciate you. Oscar Isaac, God that was driving

518
00:29:39,000 --> 00:29:43,040
Speaker 1: me crazy. Oh yes, okay, yeah yeah. Oscar Isaac is

519
00:29:43,040 --> 00:29:46,240
Speaker 1: who I would cast as Paula Reeb in the whitewashed

520
00:29:46,400 --> 00:29:49,000
Speaker 1: version of Coco's life where we pretend she didn't run

521
00:29:49,040 --> 00:29:54,440
Speaker 1: a Nazi newspaper. But dope, yeah, isn't he? Ye? Look,

522
00:29:54,480 --> 00:29:58,640
Speaker 1: he's a handsome man, Oscar Isaac. Yeah, you're once. He's

523
00:29:58,760 --> 00:30:03,480
Speaker 1: he's he's Guadama, he's his Guatemalan and and I think

524
00:30:03,560 --> 00:30:08,320
Speaker 1: he's going to be honest. That ship I mean, yeah,

525
00:30:08,360 --> 00:30:10,000
Speaker 1: but who are I mean, we're who are we casting

526
00:30:10,080 --> 00:30:12,520
Speaker 1: for Coco? Right? We're going with somebody like in this period?

527
00:30:12,520 --> 00:30:14,880
Speaker 1: Actually kind of maybe Aubrey Plaza is who I cast

528
00:30:14,960 --> 00:30:18,480
Speaker 1: for Coco. She's kind of like her her late thirties,

529
00:30:18,560 --> 00:30:20,640
Speaker 1: early forties around this time. I think, so, yeah, I

530
00:30:20,680 --> 00:30:22,200
Speaker 1: think she could I think she could do and she

531
00:30:24,200 --> 00:30:27,400
Speaker 1: really well yeah, honestly, I don't know who else you

532
00:30:27,520 --> 00:30:32,600
Speaker 1: cast cast now, now that we've mentioned it, now, um, yeah, Aubrey,

533
00:30:32,680 --> 00:30:35,160
Speaker 1: do it, do it, and do it racist. Let's just

534
00:30:35,400 --> 00:30:37,640
Speaker 1: let's just go for it. You're going if you're if

535
00:30:37,680 --> 00:30:40,360
Speaker 1: you're sticking with a French actress, you could do. Um

536
00:30:40,760 --> 00:30:44,800
Speaker 1: Marian Courtier. I don't know who that is now, you don't.

537
00:30:45,680 --> 00:30:47,840
Speaker 1: I barely I couldn't. It took me like ten minutes

538
00:30:47,880 --> 00:30:52,680
Speaker 1: to figure out who Oscar Isaac was. Cool. Um, so

539
00:30:53,240 --> 00:30:56,000
Speaker 1: you know, this piece of shit dies and good riddence.

540
00:30:56,240 --> 00:30:59,000
Speaker 1: Very funny that he dies playing tennis. Fuck this asshole.

541
00:30:59,440 --> 00:31:01,800
Speaker 1: This makes Oko very sad, though, because she loves the

542
00:31:01,840 --> 00:31:05,400
Speaker 1: piece of shit, and she is made only the sadder

543
00:31:05,560 --> 00:31:07,920
Speaker 1: because of the political currents that are going around in

544
00:31:08,040 --> 00:31:11,440
Speaker 1: France at the time, as had happened in Italy, Spain,

545
00:31:11,560 --> 00:31:13,880
Speaker 1: in Germany. The far right is on the rise in

546
00:31:14,000 --> 00:31:16,840
Speaker 1: France and the mid to late thirties, but unlike in

547
00:31:16,920 --> 00:31:20,360
Speaker 1: those countries, a united left wing popular front was able

548
00:31:20,440 --> 00:31:23,160
Speaker 1: to rise up and block the fascists from power. We

549
00:31:23,280 --> 00:31:26,800
Speaker 1: cover this somewhat in our Behind the Insurrection series. Nineteen

550
00:31:26,960 --> 00:31:30,000
Speaker 1: thirty six is the year of the popular fronts electoral success,

551
00:31:30,280 --> 00:31:32,640
Speaker 1: and it brings with it, as part of this big,

552
00:31:33,200 --> 00:31:35,840
Speaker 1: you know, kind of left wing counterwave to the fascists,

553
00:31:36,200 --> 00:31:39,920
Speaker 1: a wave of strikes by organized labor. There's a general

554
00:31:40,040 --> 00:31:42,960
Speaker 1: strike on May twenty sixth, and by June the boutiques

555
00:31:42,960 --> 00:31:46,520
Speaker 1: in the Ritz Hotel where Coco lived full time had closed.

556
00:31:47,800 --> 00:31:51,200
Speaker 1: You know. Within a few weeks, Chanelle's salesgirls and seamstresses

557
00:31:51,240 --> 00:31:54,000
Speaker 1: had joined the strike. Some four thousand of her workers

558
00:31:54,040 --> 00:31:57,440
Speaker 1: in total start striking, and when Chanelle is informed of this,

559
00:31:57,920 --> 00:32:00,520
Speaker 1: she so she learns her workers are on strike because

560
00:32:00,560 --> 00:32:03,760
Speaker 1: her personal assistant has to sneak into the hotel from

561
00:32:03,800 --> 00:32:06,600
Speaker 1: the back because the employees have a picket line out front.

562
00:32:07,120 --> 00:32:10,840
Speaker 1: And Coco is horrified and shocked that her workers have

563
00:32:10,960 --> 00:32:14,160
Speaker 1: decided to join this strike. She expresses the thought that

564
00:32:14,200 --> 00:32:16,680
Speaker 1: they must have lost their minds. She calls them her

565
00:32:16,720 --> 00:32:20,040
Speaker 1: little hands. That's what she calls her workers. I know

566
00:32:20,640 --> 00:32:24,800
Speaker 1: she is a goal at this point, and she accuses

567
00:32:24,840 --> 00:32:28,080
Speaker 1: them of having been infected by an American mind virus.

568
00:32:28,320 --> 00:32:31,720
Speaker 1: List sit down, which is interesting to me that like today,

569
00:32:31,800 --> 00:32:33,640
Speaker 1: when you talk about strikes, the French are like the

570
00:32:33,680 --> 00:32:35,560
Speaker 1: first people you think about. But back in this day,

571
00:32:35,760 --> 00:32:37,960
Speaker 1: when her workers go on strikes, she's like, this damn

572
00:32:37,960 --> 00:32:42,520
Speaker 1: American striking virus. That could be us again, folks. So

573
00:32:42,720 --> 00:32:47,000
Speaker 1: her workers meanwhile SAPs like all held signs. That's so

574
00:32:47,280 --> 00:32:49,600
Speaker 1: like they would basically, you know, the workers at these

575
00:32:49,600 --> 00:32:52,480
Speaker 1: shops would cover the windows with signs that said occupied

576
00:32:52,920 --> 00:32:55,080
Speaker 1: because they were not. They weren't just like not working.

577
00:32:55,400 --> 00:32:58,080
Speaker 1: They were sitting in her factories and her stores and

578
00:32:58,240 --> 00:33:01,120
Speaker 1: refusing to either work or leaves so that nothing could

579
00:33:01,160 --> 00:33:05,120
Speaker 1: be done, which is fucking rad. It's very cool. Chanel

580
00:33:05,240 --> 00:33:08,520
Speaker 1: calls this a betrayal. She felt that she paid them fairly.

581
00:33:08,640 --> 00:33:13,000
Speaker 1: She's particularly angry because she offered them unpaid vacation days

582
00:33:13,440 --> 00:33:17,960
Speaker 1: and they weren't grateful. Can you believe that court now?

583
00:33:18,440 --> 00:33:21,880
Speaker 1: They weren't happy with their unpaid vacation day day? Was

584
00:33:21,960 --> 00:33:25,360
Speaker 1: she paying them fairly for the time. I don't think

585
00:33:25,400 --> 00:33:27,560
Speaker 1: it's bad pay for the time. Obviously they're not happy

586
00:33:27,600 --> 00:33:30,000
Speaker 1: with it, so I'm gonna trust them that it could

587
00:33:30,040 --> 00:33:35,480
Speaker 1: be better. Yeah, that's clearly a their attitude. So she

588
00:33:35,680 --> 00:33:38,120
Speaker 1: became convinced, I don't think like from what I've read,

589
00:33:38,160 --> 00:33:40,880
Speaker 1: I don't think it was particularly bad, but clearly it

590
00:33:40,920 --> 00:33:43,000
Speaker 1: could have been better, and it's about to get better

591
00:33:43,040 --> 00:33:47,000
Speaker 1: because they go on strike. She becomes convinced that a

592
00:33:47,080 --> 00:33:50,760
Speaker 1: civil war is imminent. Such insolence from the working class,

593
00:33:50,800 --> 00:33:53,160
Speaker 1: that's the only thing it could mean, right bolshevisms around

594
00:33:53,200 --> 00:33:54,880
Speaker 1: the corner. They're going to be hunting us down in

595
00:33:54,920 --> 00:33:58,240
Speaker 1: the streets. This is the only logical conclusion to what

596
00:33:58,360 --> 00:34:02,560
Speaker 1: if we had paid vacation days. You you live in

597
00:34:02,680 --> 00:34:05,239
Speaker 1: a hotel and will never be able to spend all

598
00:34:05,280 --> 00:34:08,879
Speaker 1: the money you have. Maybe we could have paid vacation days.

599
00:34:10,080 --> 00:34:15,360
Speaker 1: She's like, no revolution or nothing, this is war again.

600
00:34:15,480 --> 00:34:18,760
Speaker 1: Very little ever changes. So gold prices during this period

601
00:34:18,840 --> 00:34:21,520
Speaker 1: skyrocket in France because Coco and all of our friends

602
00:34:21,840 --> 00:34:23,560
Speaker 1: buy all of the gold that they can get their

603
00:34:23,600 --> 00:34:26,240
Speaker 1: hands on because they're worried the cash is going to collapse,

604
00:34:26,520 --> 00:34:29,520
Speaker 1: which is actually that's not unfair considering this is around

605
00:34:29,640 --> 00:34:32,400
Speaker 1: like right after the Great Depression, right, like not unreasonable

606
00:34:32,440 --> 00:34:36,400
Speaker 1: to be worried about that. Coco raged and roared as

607
00:34:36,440 --> 00:34:38,840
Speaker 1: she sought to bring her laborers to heal, without success.

608
00:34:39,360 --> 00:34:42,719
Speaker 1: They would not move on their demands, though ironically, her

609
00:34:42,800 --> 00:34:46,200
Speaker 1: designs became even more iconic during this period because one

610
00:34:46,239 --> 00:34:48,719
Speaker 1: of the big symbols of the strike is all of

611
00:34:48,800 --> 00:34:52,080
Speaker 1: these Chanelle workers and their Chanelle suits strutting around in

612
00:34:52,160 --> 00:34:55,359
Speaker 1: front of Chanelle's shops, refusing to work without a fucking raise.

613
00:34:57,239 --> 00:35:00,759
Speaker 1: Pretty cool, So like they're advertising for her kind of well,

614
00:35:00,760 --> 00:35:04,439
Speaker 1: I mean, it's the nicest clothing they have, right, yeah, yeah,

615
00:35:04,600 --> 00:35:07,280
Speaker 1: you know, I don't know, it's what they do. Eventually,

616
00:35:07,400 --> 00:35:09,840
Speaker 1: Coco is forced to concede after the leader of the

617
00:35:09,920 --> 00:35:12,480
Speaker 1: Popular Front and the French labor movement sign a pact

618
00:35:12,560 --> 00:35:16,239
Speaker 1: granting French workers a forty hour work week, paid vacations,

619
00:35:16,520 --> 00:35:19,799
Speaker 1: collective bargaining rights, and compulsory schooling up to the age

620
00:35:19,840 --> 00:35:23,400
Speaker 1: of fourteen. Coco fought to the last moment possible, but

621
00:35:23,760 --> 00:35:30,520
Speaker 1: enraged eventually conceded. So fuck yeah, way to go workers again.

622
00:35:30,800 --> 00:35:33,080
Speaker 1: Like every story that has a good thing in it,

623
00:35:33,239 --> 00:35:35,759
Speaker 1: in this part of the twentieth century. It's like, yeah,

624
00:35:36,040 --> 00:35:39,560
Speaker 1: that all ends well. And then on June fourteenth, nineteen forty,

625
00:35:39,600 --> 00:35:44,799
Speaker 1: Germany invades Friends and things take a turn, shall we say.

626
00:35:45,360 --> 00:35:48,399
Speaker 1: Within weeks, the Germans break the back of the French army.

627
00:35:48,800 --> 00:35:51,200
Speaker 1: Paris has declared an open city to spare it from

628
00:35:51,239 --> 00:35:53,239
Speaker 1: getting the fuck blown out of it, and as soon

629
00:35:53,320 --> 00:35:55,880
Speaker 1: as the fighting starts, Coco is like, well, I'm not

630
00:35:55,920 --> 00:35:58,719
Speaker 1: going to stay in fucking Paris. So she bounces to

631
00:35:58,840 --> 00:36:01,880
Speaker 1: her nephew Andre. He's like an adult now, he's in

632
00:36:01,960 --> 00:36:04,279
Speaker 1: the French army, he's got a family, he has a

633
00:36:04,440 --> 00:36:07,080
Speaker 1: nice home in the countryside. He's done reasonably well for himself.

634
00:36:07,080 --> 00:36:09,440
Speaker 1: I'm sure she helped. And she winds up just kind

635
00:36:09,480 --> 00:36:11,839
Speaker 1: of crashing with his family in the countryside in their

636
00:36:11,960 --> 00:36:16,080
Speaker 1: nice manner. For a while. Andre is on the imagine

637
00:36:16,120 --> 00:36:18,239
Speaker 1: O line. I probably don't need to explain to you

638
00:36:18,360 --> 00:36:21,920
Speaker 1: that he gets captured. That's not a I mean, it

639
00:36:22,000 --> 00:36:24,000
Speaker 1: doesn't work all that badly for him. Sorry, I'm so,

640
00:36:24,360 --> 00:36:27,840
Speaker 1: what's that line you just said? Oh, the imagine O line.

641
00:36:27,880 --> 00:36:30,040
Speaker 1: So I shouldn't make assumptions like that. The imagine O

642
00:36:30,160 --> 00:36:32,480
Speaker 1: line is so, you know, World War One goes pretty

643
00:36:32,480 --> 00:36:34,920
Speaker 1: badly for everybody involved, a lot of a lot of murdering.

644
00:36:35,239 --> 00:36:37,919
Speaker 1: So in order to like not have that happen again,

645
00:36:38,040 --> 00:36:41,799
Speaker 1: the French build this big wall of fortifications across most

646
00:36:41,880 --> 00:36:44,560
Speaker 1: of their border with Germany and the hope that, like, well,

647
00:36:44,600 --> 00:36:46,319
Speaker 1: the next time they attack, will just kill them all

648
00:36:46,440 --> 00:36:50,479
Speaker 1: with these gigantic like bunkers and forts. But they don't,

649
00:36:50,880 --> 00:36:52,839
Speaker 1: you know, the imagine O line actually does its job

650
00:36:52,920 --> 00:36:55,600
Speaker 1: reasonably well. The French. The Germans just move around it

651
00:36:55,920 --> 00:36:58,600
Speaker 1: and then enter from that area anyway, it's a whole thing.

652
00:36:59,200 --> 00:37:01,280
Speaker 1: But he's stationed in the imagine a line, the Germans

653
00:37:01,320 --> 00:37:03,520
Speaker 1: get around them, he gets captured, he becomes a prisoner

654
00:37:03,560 --> 00:37:07,360
Speaker 1: of war. Right, So, Coco and her family living in

655
00:37:07,440 --> 00:37:11,200
Speaker 1: the countryside are mostly insulated from the opening stages of

656
00:37:11,239 --> 00:37:14,040
Speaker 1: World War Two, but they are worried for Andre. You know,

657
00:37:14,400 --> 00:37:17,080
Speaker 1: it becomes clear something has gonna ry when he stops

658
00:37:17,080 --> 00:37:21,959
Speaker 1: sending letters. The mystery only lingered after the fighting ended

659
00:37:22,040 --> 00:37:25,680
Speaker 1: and Germans occupied the French heartland. Coco found this as

660
00:37:25,760 --> 00:37:28,759
Speaker 1: intolerable as she was separated from her businesses. That's the

661
00:37:28,800 --> 00:37:33,240
Speaker 1: main reason she is frustrated about the German conquest of Paris.

662
00:37:33,960 --> 00:37:37,240
Speaker 1: And so shortly after Adolf Hitler's triumphant visit to Paris,

663
00:37:37,560 --> 00:37:41,480
Speaker 1: she returns home telling her family the Germans aren't all gangsters.

664
00:37:43,239 --> 00:37:47,600
Speaker 1: Oh Coco, Oh Cocoa. One fun anecdote is that on

665
00:37:47,719 --> 00:37:51,279
Speaker 1: the drive back gases and shuts such short supply and

666
00:37:51,360 --> 00:37:54,680
Speaker 1: it's about to be rationed into extinction for regular people.

667
00:37:54,920 --> 00:37:57,040
Speaker 1: Her chau fur has to fill the trunk with tin

668
00:37:57,160 --> 00:37:59,360
Speaker 1: cans of gasoline in order to get her to Paris.

669
00:38:00,120 --> 00:38:03,320
Speaker 1: Un't know, interesting context. Another thing I learned during this

670
00:38:03,440 --> 00:38:06,160
Speaker 1: that I hadn't known is because the Germans when they

671
00:38:06,239 --> 00:38:09,959
Speaker 1: take over, you know, most of France, because they rash

672
00:38:10,000 --> 00:38:12,480
Speaker 1: and gas and people can't get it. A lot of

673
00:38:12,560 --> 00:38:15,279
Speaker 1: French people convert their cars to beat to run off

674
00:38:15,360 --> 00:38:18,120
Speaker 1: of like like like literally to run off of like

675
00:38:18,480 --> 00:38:21,520
Speaker 1: charcoal and wood. So you just like stoke a burner

676
00:38:21,600 --> 00:38:24,120
Speaker 1: and it makes your cargo. I didn't realize you could

677
00:38:24,160 --> 00:38:28,040
Speaker 1: do that. That's kind of a cool idea. That is interesting. Hey,

678
00:38:28,200 --> 00:38:31,239
Speaker 1: did she feel safe because the Nazis are in charge

679
00:38:31,280 --> 00:38:35,439
Speaker 1: of Paris? Right, so it's like she had friends? Yeah,

680
00:38:35,520 --> 00:38:37,960
Speaker 1: she's Coco, you know, I think she she has this

681
00:38:38,120 --> 00:38:42,040
Speaker 1: kind of confidence that it'll be fine and there's a

682
00:38:42,120 --> 00:38:45,080
Speaker 1: reason for this confidence, because this is the point at

683
00:38:45,080 --> 00:38:48,360
Speaker 1: which Channell's life comes to intersect with a Prussian military

684
00:38:48,480 --> 00:38:53,759
Speaker 1: officer named Hans Gunther von Dinklage. Now Dinklage had been

685
00:38:53,840 --> 00:38:56,319
Speaker 1: born the son of a Prussian major and the daughter

686
00:38:56,400 --> 00:38:59,600
Speaker 1: of a German merchant family. He'd been educated in England, though,

687
00:38:59,640 --> 00:39:03,760
Speaker 1: which from this kind of worldly charm that German spies

688
00:39:03,960 --> 00:39:07,080
Speaker 1: generally aren't good. In World War Two, the British basically

689
00:39:07,200 --> 00:39:10,160
Speaker 1: catch all of them. Dinklage is about to become a spy.

690
00:39:10,440 --> 00:39:12,520
Speaker 1: He's a very good spy because he has this kind

691
00:39:12,520 --> 00:39:15,840
Speaker 1: of worldly background. So after World War One, where he

692
00:39:15,920 --> 00:39:18,759
Speaker 1: serves in the cavalry, he joins the ab VI or

693
00:39:19,160 --> 00:39:22,920
Speaker 1: ab there, which is like German military intelligence, and he

694
00:39:23,040 --> 00:39:25,759
Speaker 1: gets sent to France in nineteen twenty eight, so he's

695
00:39:25,800 --> 00:39:29,400
Speaker 1: there before the Nazis rise to power, and he's working

696
00:39:29,480 --> 00:39:32,480
Speaker 1: as a secret agent for the German government disguised as

697
00:39:32,520 --> 00:39:35,279
Speaker 1: a diplomat for the entire period from twenty eight up

698
00:39:35,320 --> 00:39:38,200
Speaker 1: to the start of World War Two. And his job

699
00:39:38,320 --> 00:39:41,439
Speaker 1: is basically to earn trust and sympathy with French high

700
00:39:41,520 --> 00:39:45,880
Speaker 1: society people, with politicians, with the wealthy and He develops

701
00:39:45,920 --> 00:39:49,120
Speaker 1: a perfect cover to do this because his wife is Jewish.

702
00:39:49,680 --> 00:39:52,400
Speaker 1: So he's like, yeah, you know, we're here in France

703
00:39:52,440 --> 00:39:54,719
Speaker 1: because of all the anti Semitism in Germany. We had

704
00:39:54,760 --> 00:39:57,440
Speaker 1: to flee those Nazis, you know, we had to. Like,

705
00:39:57,719 --> 00:40:03,320
Speaker 1: he's perfect double agent while he's fucking spying for the Nazis.

706
00:40:03,560 --> 00:40:05,840
Speaker 1: And to make it more fucked up, he actually divorced

707
00:40:05,920 --> 00:40:09,040
Speaker 1: his wife in nineteen thirty five before the Nuremberg Laws,

708
00:40:09,120 --> 00:40:11,640
Speaker 1: which made it illegal for them to be married, but

709
00:40:11,719 --> 00:40:14,200
Speaker 1: they continue to live together in France in order to

710
00:40:14,280 --> 00:40:19,840
Speaker 1: provide for his cover. Oh, it's fucked up. It's totally

711
00:40:19,920 --> 00:40:23,000
Speaker 1: fucked up. I guess she would stay because she needed

712
00:40:23,040 --> 00:40:25,080
Speaker 1: to be safe. I don't think she had a lot

713
00:40:25,120 --> 00:40:28,800
Speaker 1: of options. Yeah, I don't know. I'm not an expert

714
00:40:28,840 --> 00:40:30,759
Speaker 1: on the her specific story or why she did it.

715
00:40:30,880 --> 00:40:34,879
Speaker 1: It's messy, that's for sure. Yeah, when the Germans won,

716
00:40:35,080 --> 00:40:38,360
Speaker 1: Dinklage returned to like because he leaves right before the invasion,

717
00:40:38,440 --> 00:40:41,280
Speaker 1: he comes back after it succeeds because he knows France

718
00:40:41,320 --> 00:40:43,400
Speaker 1: and the Germans need people in country who can help

719
00:40:43,480 --> 00:40:46,560
Speaker 1: them run it. He and Chanel had known each other

720
00:40:46,719 --> 00:40:49,520
Speaker 1: again before the war. He's kind of playing as this

721
00:40:49,680 --> 00:40:54,200
Speaker 1: like exile in high society. He's a noble, so they're friendly,

722
00:40:54,440 --> 00:40:57,080
Speaker 1: you know, they know each other, and then when the

723
00:40:57,239 --> 00:41:00,920
Speaker 1: Nazis take over Paris, she runs into him and is like,

724
00:41:01,360 --> 00:41:04,000
Speaker 1: oh shit, I know this guy, and he's kind of

725
00:41:04,040 --> 00:41:05,799
Speaker 1: a good guy to know right now, so they start

726
00:41:05,880 --> 00:41:09,040
Speaker 1: hooking up right the fuck away. It doesn't hurt that

727
00:41:09,120 --> 00:41:11,800
Speaker 1: Dinklage is a dashing man in his own right, but

728
00:41:11,920 --> 00:41:15,040
Speaker 1: he also provides her a pathway to respect and luxury

729
00:41:15,160 --> 00:41:18,640
Speaker 1: in the tenuous reality of the war years. Gotta get

730
00:41:18,680 --> 00:41:23,440
Speaker 1: that good Nazi dick. Yeah yeah. Von Dinklage, whose nickname

731
00:41:23,520 --> 00:41:26,400
Speaker 1: is Spitz, is able to get Coco permission from the

732
00:41:26,520 --> 00:41:29,160
Speaker 1: Reich to live in the Ritz Hotel in Paris, which

733
00:41:29,280 --> 00:41:32,760
Speaker 1: during the occupation is only for Nazis and their approved guests,

734
00:41:33,040 --> 00:41:34,960
Speaker 1: so she gets to keep living in her fancy hotel

735
00:41:35,000 --> 00:41:38,080
Speaker 1: because she's kind of boinking this guy. She also gets

736
00:41:38,160 --> 00:41:42,880
Speaker 1: high quality French cuisine, which is mostly restricted. Like actual

737
00:41:42,960 --> 00:41:46,240
Speaker 1: French people are living on a starvation diet. The average

738
00:41:46,280 --> 00:41:49,359
Speaker 1: French working person diet is like twelve hundred calories a day.

739
00:41:49,600 --> 00:41:51,960
Speaker 1: During the war in the areas that the Germans are

740
00:41:52,000 --> 00:41:54,759
Speaker 1: running at least, but you can get all of the

741
00:41:54,840 --> 00:41:57,120
Speaker 1: good food in the Ritz, right because it's being served

742
00:41:57,160 --> 00:42:00,320
Speaker 1: to Nazis and to Coco, who at this point is

743
00:42:00,360 --> 00:42:03,200
Speaker 1: basically a Nazi. For an idea of like how bad

744
00:42:03,280 --> 00:42:07,480
Speaker 1: shit is for regular French people, hospitals are bartering their

745
00:42:07,719 --> 00:42:10,280
Speaker 1: wine rations for their patients because some of their patients

746
00:42:10,360 --> 00:42:13,279
Speaker 1: are too sick to drink wine in order to get potatoes,

747
00:42:13,320 --> 00:42:15,440
Speaker 1: which is the only food dense enough in calories to

748
00:42:15,560 --> 00:42:18,279
Speaker 1: keep their patients from starving to death. Like, that's again

749
00:42:18,360 --> 00:42:20,560
Speaker 1: how bad it is for regular people? While Coco is

750
00:42:20,600 --> 00:42:27,440
Speaker 1: living in the Ritz, So yeah, that's good, awesome. You

751
00:42:27,520 --> 00:42:30,200
Speaker 1: know who else lives in the Ritz, Courtney, Probably some

752
00:42:30,480 --> 00:42:34,880
Speaker 1: more Nazis. I'm guessing more Nazis. Yeah, probably still Nazis,

753
00:42:35,239 --> 00:42:43,719
Speaker 1: but also our sponsors. No, oh god, we'll fix this

754
00:42:43,840 --> 00:42:53,120
Speaker 1: in post. Ah, we're back. I don't think we fixed

755
00:42:53,160 --> 00:42:56,160
Speaker 1: it in post. Oh well, what are you gonna do?

756
00:42:56,600 --> 00:42:59,279
Speaker 1: You know that it was really good? How can you

757
00:42:59,360 --> 00:43:05,480
Speaker 1: blame them? I'm sure it fucking was. So we're back

758
00:43:06,000 --> 00:43:09,320
Speaker 1: a good times. Um. So, while this is going on,

759
00:43:09,560 --> 00:43:12,560
Speaker 1: Coco and her new Nazi friends they're holding feasts. They're

760
00:43:12,600 --> 00:43:15,359
Speaker 1: having these like fancy parties in some of which you're

761
00:43:15,360 --> 00:43:17,759
Speaker 1: pretty cheeky. One of the parties she has at the

762
00:43:17,880 --> 00:43:21,480
Speaker 1: Ritz is one where like all it's like these these

763
00:43:21,560 --> 00:43:25,480
Speaker 1: French collaborators and all these Nazi officials, and the Nazi

764
00:43:25,520 --> 00:43:28,160
Speaker 1: officials aren't allowed to speak German, so they have to

765
00:43:28,239 --> 00:43:31,360
Speaker 1: attempt to speak French. That's like the fun theme of

766
00:43:31,440 --> 00:43:35,680
Speaker 1: this party, while everyone else in Paris is starving. German

767
00:43:35,760 --> 00:43:39,000
Speaker 1: officers consciously wielded starvation as a weapon, which made it

768
00:43:39,120 --> 00:43:43,319
Speaker 1: easier to compel behavior by awarding collaborators with rations. As

769
00:43:43,400 --> 00:43:46,439
Speaker 1: one German officer in the Ritz stated, in times like these,

770
00:43:46,640 --> 00:43:48,960
Speaker 1: to eat well and eat a lot gives a feeling

771
00:43:49,000 --> 00:43:56,480
Speaker 1: of power. Yeah, yep, good guys. The Nazis sympathizers will

772
00:43:56,520 --> 00:43:59,400
Speaker 1: often justify Chanelle's choice to collaborate by saying that she

773
00:43:59,520 --> 00:44:02,799
Speaker 1: was simply looking out for her nephew. This is true,

774
00:44:02,880 --> 00:44:04,920
Speaker 1: but it's also true that she saw to her own

775
00:44:05,040 --> 00:44:08,440
Speaker 1: comfort first, although it was to protect Andre that she

776
00:44:08,600 --> 00:44:12,200
Speaker 1: finally became an agent for the Nazis intelligence service. So

777
00:44:12,760 --> 00:44:15,799
Speaker 1: she wants to get this guy, her nephew maybe son,

778
00:44:16,000 --> 00:44:18,480
Speaker 1: out of jail, and that's why she agrees to start

779
00:44:18,560 --> 00:44:20,359
Speaker 1: working with the Nazis and I'm gonna I'm gonna read

780
00:44:20,400 --> 00:44:24,239
Speaker 1: a quote by Tim Ott Here Dinklage introduced his lover

781
00:44:24,360 --> 00:44:28,279
Speaker 1: to another prominent obver agent, Baron Louis de Vaufreland, who

782
00:44:28,360 --> 00:44:31,400
Speaker 1: allegedly promised to help Chanelle free her nephew in exchange

783
00:44:31,440 --> 00:44:34,239
Speaker 1: for her service to Berlin. Sometime in nineteen forty one,

784
00:44:34,360 --> 00:44:37,319
Speaker 1: Chanelle was registered as agent F seven one two four

785
00:44:37,640 --> 00:44:41,040
Speaker 1: with a code name of Westminster, after her former flame

786
00:44:41,280 --> 00:44:44,680
Speaker 1: You know She's Her Nazi nickname is her fascist boyfriend

787
00:44:45,640 --> 00:44:50,160
Speaker 1: That's cool. Tasked with obtaining political information from colleagues in Madrid,

788
00:44:50,320 --> 00:44:52,640
Speaker 1: Chanelle traveled to the Spanish city for a few months

789
00:44:52,760 --> 00:44:56,680
Speaker 1: midnine forty one with Vafferland under the guise of business dealings.

790
00:44:56,920 --> 00:44:59,120
Speaker 1: There is a record of her dinner with British diplomat

791
00:44:59,160 --> 00:45:02,560
Speaker 1: Brian Wallace, which she casually discussed life and occupied Paris

792
00:45:02,840 --> 00:45:05,400
Speaker 1: and the animosity the French and Germans held toward each other.

793
00:45:05,880 --> 00:45:08,680
Speaker 1: It is unclear whether Channelle's interactions in Madrid moved the

794
00:45:08,760 --> 00:45:10,840
Speaker 1: needle in any way, but there were apparently enough to

795
00:45:10,920 --> 00:45:14,520
Speaker 1: impress ab their supervisors and earn the release of her nephew.

796
00:45:15,160 --> 00:45:18,399
Speaker 1: So she goes on the spying mission in Madrid. Maybe

797
00:45:18,400 --> 00:45:20,680
Speaker 1: it's to prep for a potential the Nazis are kind

798
00:45:20,719 --> 00:45:23,800
Speaker 1: of considering occupying the city. There's there's a number of

799
00:45:23,880 --> 00:45:26,200
Speaker 1: theories about what she's doing. This is the first little

800
00:45:26,280 --> 00:45:29,120
Speaker 1: thing she does, and as spying for the Nazis go,

801
00:45:29,880 --> 00:45:33,719
Speaker 1: it's not that sketchy, but it's about to get sketchier

802
00:45:33,719 --> 00:45:35,759
Speaker 1: because once she's done the solid for them, they have

803
00:45:35,840 --> 00:45:39,920
Speaker 1: a relationship. She's like, Hey, you know, there's this I

804
00:45:40,080 --> 00:45:45,920
Speaker 1: kind of like spying. She's also like, so there's this

805
00:45:46,080 --> 00:45:49,799
Speaker 1: Jewish family I got beef with. Oh the people who

806
00:45:49,840 --> 00:45:53,799
Speaker 1: are making her perfume, the Wertheimer's. And she uses her

807
00:45:53,840 --> 00:45:56,640
Speaker 1: position as an arian, which is a legal position in

808
00:45:57,040 --> 00:46:00,520
Speaker 1: Nazi law, to petition German officials to lead goalies her

809
00:46:00,600 --> 00:46:05,239
Speaker 1: claim as sole owner of the perfume. On May fifth,

810
00:46:05,400 --> 00:46:07,920
Speaker 1: nineteen forty one, she writes to the Nazi official in

811
00:46:08,000 --> 00:46:12,280
Speaker 1: her area who's responsible for confiscating Jewish assets. She lists

812
00:46:12,320 --> 00:46:15,200
Speaker 1: her grounds for ownership of the perfume as based on

813
00:46:15,280 --> 00:46:19,320
Speaker 1: the claim that perfumes Chanel is quote still the property

814
00:46:19,400 --> 00:46:22,359
Speaker 1: of the Jews and has thus been legally abandoned by

815
00:46:22,400 --> 00:46:24,920
Speaker 1: its owners when they fled the country. She wrote, I

816
00:46:25,000 --> 00:46:27,400
Speaker 1: have an indisputable right of priority. The profits that I

817
00:46:27,440 --> 00:46:29,640
Speaker 1: have received from my creation since the foundation of this

818
00:46:29,760 --> 00:46:32,320
Speaker 1: business are disproportionate, and you could help to repair in

819
00:46:32,400 --> 00:46:34,400
Speaker 1: part the prejudices I have suffered in the course of

820
00:46:34,480 --> 00:46:39,959
Speaker 1: these seventeen years. But Coco has been out foxed because

821
00:46:40,000 --> 00:46:43,240
Speaker 1: the Vertheimer's set shit up before they fled the country.

822
00:46:43,520 --> 00:46:46,960
Speaker 1: They transferred ownership of the perfume firm to an Arian

823
00:46:47,080 --> 00:46:49,799
Speaker 1: friend before they fled the continent, and during the war

824
00:46:49,960 --> 00:46:52,040
Speaker 1: years they sent one of their allies. This is kind

825
00:46:52,040 --> 00:46:53,920
Speaker 1: of a cool story. They send this guy who becomes

826
00:46:54,000 --> 00:46:57,360
Speaker 1: the president of their company into Paris where he like

827
00:46:57,520 --> 00:47:00,160
Speaker 1: sneaks in and pretends to be somebody else, and he

828
00:47:00,320 --> 00:47:03,040
Speaker 1: steals the formula for Chanel number five so it can

829
00:47:03,080 --> 00:47:07,120
Speaker 1: be produced in the United States. It's like this skullduggery action,

830
00:47:07,239 --> 00:47:11,560
Speaker 1: but it's all about making perfew amazing. I love that

831
00:47:11,640 --> 00:47:14,799
Speaker 1: they looked out for themselves. Oh yeah, they're smart. They

832
00:47:14,880 --> 00:47:17,600
Speaker 1: knew what they were doing. They took care of their shit.

833
00:47:18,160 --> 00:47:21,120
Speaker 1: So there are rumors that during the war years, while

834
00:47:21,200 --> 00:47:24,160
Speaker 1: she is working for the Nazis, she is also working

835
00:47:24,239 --> 00:47:28,360
Speaker 1: for the British royal family, possibly via Winston Churchill because

836
00:47:28,960 --> 00:47:32,160
Speaker 1: her ex flame Ben Door and the former King all

837
00:47:32,320 --> 00:47:36,200
Speaker 1: own property in Nazi occupied Europe, and the Nazis are

838
00:47:36,239 --> 00:47:39,279
Speaker 1: fighting the British right. So the Nazis could take all

839
00:47:39,360 --> 00:47:41,520
Speaker 1: that shit, they could destroy it, they could do give

840
00:47:41,560 --> 00:47:46,640
Speaker 1: it to other people, and Chanel allegedly helps them protect

841
00:47:46,680 --> 00:47:50,320
Speaker 1: their properties on the continent during the war. Right, we

842
00:47:50,400 --> 00:47:52,239
Speaker 1: don't know if this happened. We do know though, that

843
00:47:52,320 --> 00:47:54,680
Speaker 1: she stays in one of these properties after a visit

844
00:47:54,760 --> 00:47:58,520
Speaker 1: to Berlin to meet with SS General authors Schellenberg about

845
00:47:58,560 --> 00:48:04,120
Speaker 1: another operation. So by nineteen forty three, most of the

846
00:48:04,239 --> 00:48:08,000
Speaker 1: smart Nazis around Hitler, including Himmler and Schellenberg, knew that

847
00:48:08,120 --> 00:48:10,879
Speaker 1: the war was lost. The sheer scale of the tide

848
00:48:10,920 --> 00:48:13,200
Speaker 1: that had turned against them in Russia made any hope

849
00:48:13,200 --> 00:48:16,720
Speaker 1: of German victory nothing but a fantasy, and these Nazis

850
00:48:16,800 --> 00:48:19,520
Speaker 1: went behind Hitler's back to try and make a separate

851
00:48:19,600 --> 00:48:22,680
Speaker 1: peace through some of their sympathetic friends in the British government,

852
00:48:22,760 --> 00:48:25,840
Speaker 1: including the former King and the Duke of Westminster. And

853
00:48:26,000 --> 00:48:29,160
Speaker 1: this brings us back to our friend Vera Bate Lombardi.

854
00:48:29,520 --> 00:48:35,480
Speaker 1: Remember Vera, She's that Italian British socialite who introduces Coco

855
00:48:35,600 --> 00:48:39,560
Speaker 1: to the Duke of Westminster. You know, she had remarried

856
00:48:39,600 --> 00:48:43,480
Speaker 1: an Italian fascist military officer near the end of the twenties,

857
00:48:43,840 --> 00:48:48,040
Speaker 1: so she's not anti fascist, right, But Mussolini's government also

858
00:48:48,160 --> 00:48:51,000
Speaker 1: didn't trust her because she was English. So even though

859
00:48:51,080 --> 00:48:54,520
Speaker 1: she's married to this fascist, she's watched carefully by Italian

860
00:48:54,600 --> 00:48:57,680
Speaker 1: intelligence services. During the outbreak of World War Two in

861
00:48:57,880 --> 00:49:02,640
Speaker 1: nineteen forty three, horrendous reversals forced Mussolini briefly from power,

862
00:49:02,960 --> 00:49:06,600
Speaker 1: and there's kind of this fascist crackdown to retake power

863
00:49:06,680 --> 00:49:09,719
Speaker 1: in parts of the country, and the authorities arrest Vera

864
00:49:09,880 --> 00:49:12,520
Speaker 1: during this crackdown. She spends about a week in an

865
00:49:12,600 --> 00:49:15,680
Speaker 1: Italian fascist prison camp before the Germans intervene and get

866
00:49:15,719 --> 00:49:18,080
Speaker 1: her out. And they get her out, so that Coco,

867
00:49:18,719 --> 00:49:21,400
Speaker 1: because Coco's like, hey, if you get me and Vera together,

868
00:49:22,360 --> 00:49:24,719
Speaker 1: we can go, you know, meet with our contacts in

869
00:49:24,800 --> 00:49:28,040
Speaker 1: the British government and negotiate a separate piece, right, That's

870
00:49:28,080 --> 00:49:30,760
Speaker 1: what Coco tries to set up. That's why the Germans

871
00:49:30,840 --> 00:49:34,080
Speaker 1: get Vera out of prison. But Vera is kind of

872
00:49:34,200 --> 00:49:36,920
Speaker 1: pissed off that she's been arrested by the fascists and

873
00:49:37,000 --> 00:49:39,680
Speaker 1: put in a prison camp. She does not like this,

874
00:49:40,200 --> 00:49:43,280
Speaker 1: so she's actually not gonna be a very good partner

875
00:49:43,360 --> 00:49:47,080
Speaker 1: to Coco in this Nazi scheme of cocos. Yeah, and

876
00:49:47,160 --> 00:49:51,560
Speaker 1: I'm gonna yeah, it's pretty funny. I'm gonna rote quote

877
00:49:51,600 --> 00:49:55,120
Speaker 1: next from a write up by PBS. Nazi leaders contacted

878
00:49:55,200 --> 00:49:57,120
Speaker 1: Dinklage and told him it was time to leave Paris

879
00:49:57,200 --> 00:49:59,920
Speaker 1: and Chanel behind. Unwilling to be left alone in Parish

880
00:50:00,040 --> 00:50:02,600
Speaker 1: Channelle decided to devise a new plan with Dnklage, attempting

881
00:50:02,640 --> 00:50:05,959
Speaker 1: to leverage Vera Bate's connection with Winston Churchill. Citing French

882
00:50:06,080 --> 00:50:10,160
Speaker 1: historian Hendry Goodell, Vaughn writes, Mademoiselle Chanelle thought she could

883
00:50:10,160 --> 00:50:13,160
Speaker 1: barter her friendship with Winston Churchill to persuade the Nazis

884
00:50:13,200 --> 00:50:15,319
Speaker 1: that she and Dnklage had the contacts to broke her

885
00:50:15,320 --> 00:50:18,520
Speaker 1: a separate piece with Britain. Goodell believed the Duke of Westminster,

886
00:50:18,640 --> 00:50:20,799
Speaker 1: well known for being pro German, along with many other

887
00:50:20,920 --> 00:50:24,160
Speaker 1: senior British politicians and royals, feared that the Soviet Union

888
00:50:24,200 --> 00:50:26,719
Speaker 1: would grab all of Europe. The Duke encouraged Channell to

889
00:50:26,800 --> 00:50:30,080
Speaker 1: act as an emissary between Berlin and London. However, the

890
00:50:30,200 --> 00:50:33,439
Speaker 1: plan went horribly awry when Chanelle's friend Vera Bate, upon

891
00:50:33,560 --> 00:50:36,520
Speaker 1: arriving in Madrid, confessed to the authorities her part as

892
00:50:36,560 --> 00:50:39,440
Speaker 1: a German agent in the final hour, naming Chanelle as

893
00:50:39,440 --> 00:50:42,480
Speaker 1: an informer. And so they get to Madrid and Vera's like,

894
00:50:42,560 --> 00:50:44,719
Speaker 1: this bitious a Nazi. We're working for the Nazis. I

895
00:50:44,760 --> 00:50:47,799
Speaker 1: don't want any part of the ship. Fuck these fascists, right,

896
00:50:48,600 --> 00:50:51,560
Speaker 1: I respect. That blows it all up. I mean she

897
00:50:51,719 --> 00:50:54,480
Speaker 1: did kind of come late to not liking the Fascists,

898
00:50:54,600 --> 00:50:57,719
Speaker 1: to be fair, but where you know, however you get there, right.

899
00:50:59,640 --> 00:51:01,920
Speaker 1: I was just watching this thing and it's crazy how

900
00:51:02,000 --> 00:51:06,279
Speaker 1: many people are traders and double agents are ours. It

901
00:51:06,400 --> 00:51:11,120
Speaker 1: happens all the time, constantly. So the fact that she

902
00:51:11,320 --> 00:51:14,680
Speaker 1: has been exposed as a Nazi agent causes difficulty for

903
00:51:14,800 --> 00:51:18,279
Speaker 1: Coco Chanelle. After Paris is liberated in nineteen forty four,

904
00:51:18,760 --> 00:51:21,880
Speaker 1: she is quickly arrested by the Free French Purge Committee

905
00:51:21,880 --> 00:51:25,359
Speaker 1: and accused of being what's called a horizontal collaborator. Now

906
00:51:25,440 --> 00:51:27,640
Speaker 1: this is a serious allegation, and we know it's a

907
00:51:27,680 --> 00:51:30,560
Speaker 1: true one. People were imprisoned and in some cases beaten

908
00:51:30,719 --> 00:51:33,960
Speaker 1: or killed for less than what Coco did. Yet, after

909
00:51:34,120 --> 00:51:37,560
Speaker 1: several hours of questioning, Coco is released, and nobody really

910
00:51:37,719 --> 00:51:42,480
Speaker 1: knows why. There is suspicion that Winston Churchill negotiated her release,

911
00:51:42,600 --> 00:51:45,719
Speaker 1: possibly is payment or to hush up the underground work

912
00:51:45,800 --> 00:51:49,200
Speaker 1: she'd done with the Nazis protecting the assets of wealthy

913
00:51:49,280 --> 00:51:54,000
Speaker 1: British people on the European continent may have happened. If

914
00:51:54,080 --> 00:51:56,640
Speaker 1: it did, it means that Churchill himself was guilty of

915
00:51:56,760 --> 00:51:59,200
Speaker 1: violations of his own Trading with the Enemy Act. But

916
00:51:59,680 --> 00:52:02,160
Speaker 1: you know, we'll never verify this one way or the other.

917
00:52:02,360 --> 00:52:09,399
Speaker 1: But pretty cool. Interesting, Yeah, yeah, some Churchill tea there,

918
00:52:10,400 --> 00:52:12,480
Speaker 1: which I guess is just normal tea because he's English,

919
00:52:12,560 --> 00:52:17,120
Speaker 1: but probably tea with gin, probably just gin with a

920
00:52:17,200 --> 00:52:20,840
Speaker 1: tea bag in it actually. So at any rate, Chanelle

921
00:52:20,880 --> 00:52:23,640
Speaker 1: gets out of this first thing with this French committee

922
00:52:23,760 --> 00:52:26,400
Speaker 1: and she bounces. She goes to fucking Switzerland. She's like,

923
00:52:27,400 --> 00:52:30,440
Speaker 1: and I staying around to see if this winds up

924
00:52:30,480 --> 00:52:34,160
Speaker 1: being cool in the long term. Tim OTTs summarizes what

925
00:52:34,320 --> 00:52:37,360
Speaker 1: comes next. After the war's conclusion, Chanelle appeared in a

926
00:52:37,400 --> 00:52:41,040
Speaker 1: French court to account for sworn testimony from arrested German officers.

927
00:52:41,080 --> 00:52:43,200
Speaker 1: That tied her to the ab There she managed to

928
00:52:43,239 --> 00:52:46,080
Speaker 1: wriggle her way out of trouble, confirming that Raferland had

929
00:52:46,360 --> 00:52:48,680
Speaker 1: promised to get her nephew out of prison, but otherwise

930
00:52:48,760 --> 00:52:51,880
Speaker 1: denying the extent of their interactions. According to Sleeping with

931
00:52:51,960 --> 00:52:54,520
Speaker 1: the Enemy, Chanelle also took care to erase evidence of

932
00:52:54,600 --> 00:52:58,080
Speaker 1: her actions where possible. Upon learning that an ailing Schellenberg

933
00:52:58,200 --> 00:53:01,040
Speaker 1: was planning to publish his memoir, ll paid his medical

934
00:53:01,080 --> 00:53:04,240
Speaker 1: bills and and ensured his family was on sound financial footing.

935
00:53:04,480 --> 00:53:07,040
Speaker 1: The subsequent memoir had no mention of her involvement as

936
00:53:07,040 --> 00:53:10,040
Speaker 1: an agent. So when this old Nazi general is dying,

937
00:53:10,200 --> 00:53:13,160
Speaker 1: she makes sets his family up. She gives them a

938
00:53:13,239 --> 00:53:15,719
Speaker 1: fortune so that he doesn't write about her in his

939
00:53:15,800 --> 00:53:21,600
Speaker 1: autobiography as a fucking Nazi spy shrimp shripe, very rude.

940
00:53:22,360 --> 00:53:26,400
Speaker 1: So the fight over control of the Channel Perfume brand continues.

941
00:53:26,640 --> 00:53:29,000
Speaker 1: You might think that Coco's involvement with the Nazis would

942
00:53:29,000 --> 00:53:32,640
Speaker 1: have benefited the Wertheimer's case. This is not really the case.

943
00:53:32,840 --> 00:53:36,560
Speaker 1: So so the Perfume is in their control legally, and

944
00:53:36,680 --> 00:53:40,000
Speaker 1: they also have the recipe. But this is kind of

945
00:53:40,040 --> 00:53:42,320
Speaker 1: their weakness in this court case. With her because probably

946
00:53:42,360 --> 00:53:45,200
Speaker 1: if they were to fight this, they could like point out,

947
00:53:45,320 --> 00:53:47,440
Speaker 1: you were working for the Nazis, we should get all

948
00:53:47,480 --> 00:53:50,240
Speaker 1: of the money from their perfume. But this is Chanel

949
00:53:50,400 --> 00:53:53,640
Speaker 1: number five. If Coco gets sort of dragged through the

950
00:53:53,719 --> 00:53:56,399
Speaker 1: mud as a Nazi, people aren't gonna want to wear

951
00:53:56,640 --> 00:54:00,120
Speaker 1: Nazi number five perfume, right, So the word him is

952
00:54:00,120 --> 00:54:03,239
Speaker 1: there kind of an a vulnerable position here too, So

953
00:54:03,400 --> 00:54:05,719
Speaker 1: they reach in Rather than like taking her to the

954
00:54:05,800 --> 00:54:08,719
Speaker 1: fucking matt, they reach an arrangement with her, and a

955
00:54:08,840 --> 00:54:12,000
Speaker 1: pretty weird one. Not only do they give her millions

956
00:54:12,040 --> 00:54:14,360
Speaker 1: in back pay from the war years when she hadn't

957
00:54:14,360 --> 00:54:18,040
Speaker 1: been making channel money, but Pierre Wertheimer agrees to pay

958
00:54:18,200 --> 00:54:20,600
Speaker 1: all of her personal living expenses for the rest of

959
00:54:20,680 --> 00:54:28,280
Speaker 1: her life. Weird us, Yeah, I mean weird. It's weird,

960
00:54:29,040 --> 00:54:33,040
Speaker 1: but it's a complicated situation. She always winds up on top.

961
00:54:33,120 --> 00:54:35,759
Speaker 1: You got to say that for fucking Coco, even after

962
00:54:35,880 --> 00:54:38,040
Speaker 1: she's been caught. Is that, even even when she is

963
00:54:38,120 --> 00:54:41,440
Speaker 1: fighting in court with the Jewish family she tried to

964
00:54:41,640 --> 00:54:45,520
Speaker 1: like rob during the Holocaust, she wipes up on top.

965
00:54:45,840 --> 00:54:48,920
Speaker 1: They're doing the same deal with her though kind of

966
00:54:49,000 --> 00:54:50,920
Speaker 1: They're like we'll pay for all your shit if you

967
00:54:51,040 --> 00:54:53,560
Speaker 1: just give us what we want. We'll pay for your

968
00:54:53,600 --> 00:54:56,600
Speaker 1: shit if you'd stop fighting us in court, and if

969
00:54:56,680 --> 00:54:59,360
Speaker 1: we don't have to actually fight you in court and

970
00:54:59,440 --> 00:55:02,040
Speaker 1: thus distre roy your good name, right right, because no

971
00:55:02,160 --> 00:55:05,759
Speaker 1: one else knows. The French society does not know. It

972
00:55:05,920 --> 00:55:09,600
Speaker 1: is not public knowledge that she was working for the Nazis, right.

973
00:55:09,880 --> 00:55:12,120
Speaker 1: The Vertheimer's know because they've got the people to do

974
00:55:12,239 --> 00:55:14,920
Speaker 1: the digging. There's some folks in government and in the

975
00:55:14,960 --> 00:55:19,200
Speaker 1: spy agencies that are aware, but publicly it is not known.

976
00:55:19,680 --> 00:55:23,319
Speaker 1: And so the Vertheimer's just kind of decide, let's keep

977
00:55:23,440 --> 00:55:26,400
Speaker 1: working with Coco because there's a lot of money in Coco.

978
00:55:26,840 --> 00:55:29,480
Speaker 1: And in fact, the Verteimer family plays a major role

979
00:55:29,560 --> 00:55:32,200
Speaker 1: in helping her return to the fashion industry in nineteen

980
00:55:32,320 --> 00:55:34,759
Speaker 1: fifty four. They basically like put a bunch of money

981
00:55:34,840 --> 00:55:37,920
Speaker 1: into her rebranding and like putting out new lines of stuff.

982
00:55:38,360 --> 00:55:41,040
Speaker 1: She continues to be a massive success in an influential

983
00:55:41,080 --> 00:55:44,239
Speaker 1: part of the industry until her death in nineteen seventy one.

984
00:55:44,920 --> 00:55:47,480
Speaker 1: No public acknowledgement of her work for the Abvare was

985
00:55:47,560 --> 00:55:51,200
Speaker 1: made until two eleven, when Sleeping with the Enemy was published.

986
00:55:51,520 --> 00:55:53,920
Speaker 1: The pr campaign around that book and the well deserved

987
00:55:53,960 --> 00:55:57,239
Speaker 1: buzz that generated created problems for the Chanelle brand. As

988
00:55:57,320 --> 00:56:01,239
Speaker 1: Forbes summarizes, the brand described in the book a speculation

989
00:56:01,320 --> 00:56:04,640
Speaker 1: and said it will, no doubt always remain a mystery. Today,

990
00:56:04,719 --> 00:56:07,520
Speaker 1: the brand seems more open to acknowledging the standpoint while

991
00:56:07,560 --> 00:56:10,640
Speaker 1: distancing the current brand from it. A spokesperson told me,

992
00:56:11,000 --> 00:56:13,880
Speaker 1: Gabrielle Chanelle was a daring pioneer, and the House of

993
00:56:14,000 --> 00:56:17,640
Speaker 1: Chanelle upholds and extends her extraordinary legacy. Her influence on

994
00:56:17,719 --> 00:56:20,480
Speaker 1: many designers has been significant, and she continues to inspire

995
00:56:20,560 --> 00:56:23,560
Speaker 1: new generations. However, her actions during World War Two are

996
00:56:23,600 --> 00:56:27,640
Speaker 1: the subject of discussion in many publications and biographies. The

997
00:56:27,719 --> 00:56:30,120
Speaker 1: actions that some have reported in no way represent the

998
00:56:30,239 --> 00:56:33,440
Speaker 1: values of Chanelle today. Since that time in history, the

999
00:56:33,520 --> 00:56:36,360
Speaker 1: House of Chanelle has moved forward, well passed well beyond

1000
00:56:36,400 --> 00:56:39,799
Speaker 1: the past of its founder, not quite saying yeah, man,

1001
00:56:39,920 --> 00:56:42,920
Speaker 1: she was a Nazi. That's fucked up, Like, can we

1002
00:56:43,040 --> 00:56:47,080
Speaker 1: still keep the stock high? Though? Please? We grew from

1003
00:56:47,120 --> 00:56:50,360
Speaker 1: her being a Nazi. We moved on from the founder

1004
00:56:50,440 --> 00:56:55,480
Speaker 1: being a Nazi. Now, the Chanel Corporation's attitude is not

1005
00:56:55,600 --> 00:56:59,520
Speaker 1: a universal belief, particularly among people inclined to analyze the

1006
00:56:59,560 --> 00:57:03,480
Speaker 1: fashion industry through a more skeptical eye. Tansy Hoskins, author

1007
00:57:03,520 --> 00:57:07,160
Speaker 1: of Stitched Up, the Anti Capitalist Book of Fashion, disagrees

1008
00:57:07,239 --> 00:57:11,160
Speaker 1: that we can separate Coco from her clothing. Quote. It's

1009
00:57:11,200 --> 00:57:14,640
Speaker 1: clear that Chanelle's far right ideologies influenced her designs. She

1010
00:57:14,840 --> 00:57:19,280
Speaker 1: championed minimalism and the austere. It's very white European and

1011
00:57:19,440 --> 00:57:23,160
Speaker 1: that's the note we're gonna end on. Okay, well, listen,

1012
00:57:23,280 --> 00:57:25,800
Speaker 1: I don't know if her style. That last thing on

1013
00:57:25,880 --> 00:57:28,480
Speaker 1: her style. I don't know much about style at all.

1014
00:57:28,560 --> 00:57:34,439
Speaker 1: This is just what someone said. Yeah, yeah, yikes, Well

1015
00:57:34,600 --> 00:57:38,800
Speaker 1: that's a life. That's a life. Yeah, you're gonna go

1016
00:57:38,880 --> 00:57:41,240
Speaker 1: pick up some channelle number five Courtney. Yeah, I can't

1017
00:57:41,280 --> 00:57:45,840
Speaker 1: wait to smell like that bitch. Yeah right, that's actually

1018
00:57:45,920 --> 00:57:48,880
Speaker 1: not a bad ad, just like a lady walking and

1019
00:57:48,960 --> 00:57:52,360
Speaker 1: like a perfume bottle. Can't wait to smell like that bitch.

1020
00:57:55,640 --> 00:57:58,320
Speaker 1: She's got a fucking red arm band with a swastika

1021
00:57:58,400 --> 00:58:00,800
Speaker 1: on it. Hell yeah, that's how you do still smell

1022
00:58:00,920 --> 00:58:06,959
Speaker 1: good after all that hell of her perfume. M hm, Well,

1023
00:58:07,200 --> 00:58:12,200
Speaker 1: coordinate how you feeling you know, I feel just so

1024
00:58:12,400 --> 00:58:17,480
Speaker 1: much internal conflicted feelings about this feminist icon who was

1025
00:58:17,600 --> 00:58:20,800
Speaker 1: a horrible person. But yeah, you know, that's what this

1026
00:58:20,920 --> 00:58:26,280
Speaker 1: show does. Was there was there anything uh to do

1027
00:58:26,400 --> 00:58:32,880
Speaker 1: with her, like the logo of Chanel? Yeah, Nazism. No, no,

1028
00:58:33,000 --> 00:58:35,560
Speaker 1: it's not a Nazi thing, it's her, it's Coco Chanel

1029
00:58:35,680 --> 00:58:38,480
Speaker 1: CC Well, I got a lot, yes, but I was

1030
00:58:38,520 --> 00:58:40,840
Speaker 1: just wondering if there was anything anything more to it

1031
00:58:40,960 --> 00:58:43,680
Speaker 1: than just that I don't know this shit in it.

1032
00:58:43,720 --> 00:58:45,760
Speaker 1: In both of the books about her her logo, I

1033
00:58:45,840 --> 00:58:48,720
Speaker 1: didn't find it interesting, so I didn't. I didn't include it, Sophie,

1034
00:58:48,720 --> 00:58:50,600
Speaker 1: because I'm a hack in a fraud. Now I don't.

1035
00:58:50,640 --> 00:58:52,280
Speaker 1: You're If you didn't find it interesting, then I no

1036
00:58:52,360 --> 00:58:57,640
Speaker 1: longer care. I was all about the Nazism stuff, all

1037
00:58:57,720 --> 00:59:01,400
Speaker 1: about all about that. Well, probably shouldn't say that. Don't

1038
00:59:01,440 --> 00:59:06,560
Speaker 1: be all about Nazism, she don't. Don't. Don't be about

1039
00:59:06,720 --> 00:59:09,960
Speaker 1: Courtney co Sacks plugables right now? Yeah, Courtney, what do

1040
00:59:09,960 --> 00:59:13,680
Speaker 1: you got a plug? Oh? You guys, if you like podcasts,

1041
00:59:13,880 --> 00:59:17,640
Speaker 1: I make a ton of podcasts. I make a new

1042
00:59:17,720 --> 00:59:23,000
Speaker 1: podcast for podcasters called podcast Bestie, and for writers, I

1043
00:59:23,320 --> 00:59:27,960
Speaker 1: make a podcast called The bleeders and for horn dogs.

1044
00:59:28,360 --> 00:59:32,560
Speaker 1: I make a podcast called Private Parts Unknown, and I

1045
00:59:32,840 --> 00:59:37,240
Speaker 1: am winding down my only fans, so you can go

1046
00:59:37,360 --> 00:59:40,480
Speaker 1: get some last pick sneak a peek at me naked

1047
00:59:40,760 --> 00:59:45,919
Speaker 1: at Coco peep Show. M hm, check it out. Check

1048
00:59:46,000 --> 00:59:50,800
Speaker 1: out Coco peep Show. Not to be confused with Yeah.

1049
00:59:51,000 --> 00:59:54,840
Speaker 1: I mean Courtney very famously during World War Two, you

1050
00:59:54,960 --> 01:00:01,040
Speaker 1: fought for the French underground. Um. I like that, Yes, yeah, yeah, yeah, um, yep,

1051
01:00:01,320 --> 01:00:05,120
Speaker 1: that's that's so support this Coco. Don't support the other

1052
01:00:05,240 --> 01:00:08,880
Speaker 1: Coco who was dead. Um, so I guess it doesn't matter.

1053
01:00:09,080 --> 01:00:11,120
Speaker 1: I guess at this point there's nothing you can do

1054
01:00:11,240 --> 01:00:13,960
Speaker 1: to harm her either way. So I mean that is

1055
01:00:14,080 --> 01:00:16,720
Speaker 1: kind of the thing, right, She won, like she she won.

1056
01:00:16,960 --> 01:00:19,200
Speaker 1: She played a hell of a hand, Yeah she did.

1057
01:00:19,440 --> 01:00:22,160
Speaker 1: She got she got a dog shit hand and like

1058
01:00:22,880 --> 01:00:26,960
Speaker 1: a terrible person, but god, you have to like admire

1059
01:00:27,080 --> 01:00:30,400
Speaker 1: the skill with which she played a zero hand, not

1060
01:00:30,560 --> 01:00:33,880
Speaker 1: a single fucking asset, but whatever was inside her head

1061
01:00:34,040 --> 01:00:38,360
Speaker 1: and made it work. Yep, yeah, yep. All right, Well,

1062
01:00:39,520 --> 01:00:42,760
Speaker 1: this has been a series of episodes about a fascist

1063
01:00:42,960 --> 01:00:46,560
Speaker 1: who was kind of impressive while being a fascist. Yay,

1064
01:00:48,760 --> 01:00:51,480
Speaker 1: behind the bastards is a production of cool Zone Media.

1065
01:00:51,880 --> 01:00:54,479
Speaker 1: For more from cool Zone Media, visit her website cool

1066
01:00:54,520 --> 01:00:58,480
Speaker 1: zonemedia dot com, or check us out on the iHeartRadio app,

1067
01:00:58,560 --> 01:01:00,920
Speaker 1: Apple podcast, or wherever you get your podcasts.