WEBVTT - Across the Spider-Verse Mailbag + Spider-Man: India w/ Nikesh Shukla 0:00:00.240 --> 0:00:02.960 Warning, this podcast contained spoilers for Spider Man Across the 0:00:02.960 --> 0:00:05.840 Spider Verse in theaters now go see it, plus some 0:00:05.960 --> 0:00:21.599 MCU Spider spoilers. Hello, my name is Jason can Stepsi 0:00:21.960 --> 0:00:24.840 and I'm Rosy Night and welcome next Revision, the Crooked 0:00:24.880 --> 0:00:27.200 Media podcast where we dive deep into your favorite shows, movies, 0:00:27.200 --> 0:00:28.160 comics of pop culture. 0:00:28.360 --> 0:00:31.520 In this episode, on the Airlock, it's a spider bag, 0:00:31.880 --> 0:00:35.080 a spider male bag bag them and tag I'm the 0:00:35.080 --> 0:00:36.239 Bombastic bag Man. 0:00:36.280 --> 0:00:36.720 We're here. 0:00:36.840 --> 0:00:40.640 We here to answer your spider questions. Omnibus, Jason's doing 0:00:40.680 --> 0:00:44.840 a delightful deep dive discussing Spider Man twenty ninety nine, 0:00:45.200 --> 0:00:47.000 and in the Hive Mind it's an interview with Nick 0:00:47.000 --> 0:00:49.920 ash Shukla, the writer on the New Spider Man India comic. 0:00:49.960 --> 0:00:51.800 So if you're a fan of pav In Across the 0:00:51.840 --> 0:00:54.080 Spider Verse, make sure to listen to that one. 0:00:54.280 --> 0:00:54.840 Coming up. 0:00:55.080 --> 0:01:06.960 Your questions, Rosie, do you feel that it's our spider 0:01:07.040 --> 0:01:09.520 sense is tingling and we're stepping out of the airlock 0:01:10.120 --> 0:01:14.679 to some very very dangerous Spider Man themed mailbag questions 0:01:14.760 --> 0:01:17.959 straight from the nefarious laboratories of Alchemax. 0:01:18.920 --> 0:01:20.400 Question one from Dewan. 0:01:21.000 --> 0:01:23.880 What's your favorite oh shit or well damned Peter Parker 0:01:23.920 --> 0:01:26.640 Spider Man comic moment? One of mine is when May 0:01:26.680 --> 0:01:29.000 was shot in Peter rolled in jail and humiliated the Kingpin. 0:01:29.080 --> 0:01:30.280 Oh wow, that's good. What's yours? 0:01:31.720 --> 0:01:35.720 Mine is probably this is like less of Peter being 0:01:35.760 --> 0:01:37.720 a bad ass, because that's not really how I see him. 0:01:37.720 --> 0:01:39.319 But it did make me say, oh shit. 0:01:39.720 --> 0:01:42.600 Is when Peter is really broke so he tries to 0:01:42.680 --> 0:01:45.319 join the Fantastic Four because he wants to get a paycheck. 0:01:46.120 --> 0:01:48.400 That's like one of the funniest. 0:01:47.880 --> 0:01:52.120 Peter Parker moments in comics in my opinion, and I 0:01:52.160 --> 0:01:52.960 think about. 0:01:52.720 --> 0:01:53.720 It a lot. 0:01:53.880 --> 0:01:56.200 Okay, so my original answer, this is the real answer, 0:01:56.240 --> 0:01:59.320 and it's not that cool, but it's the answer that 0:01:59.520 --> 0:02:03.240 like twelve year old me would give, and that is 0:02:03.720 --> 0:02:06.880 black suit Peter Parker Spider Man crawling out of the 0:02:06.880 --> 0:02:10.200 grave in Craven's Last Hunt. Oh now, Craven's Last Hunt. 0:02:10.520 --> 0:02:13.639 Incredible art by Mike Zeck. Does the story hold up? 0:02:13.880 --> 0:02:15.160 I would say kind of. 0:02:15.200 --> 0:02:15.720 Not really. 0:02:16.480 --> 0:02:18.800 It's not my favorite Spider Man story, but at the 0:02:19.000 --> 0:02:24.840 time everything about it just floored me, including that like 0:02:25.080 --> 0:02:29.880 iconic cover where you know, Craven is like searching throughout 0:02:29.880 --> 0:02:32.440 his hunting lodge, you know for Spider Man, and Spider 0:02:32.480 --> 0:02:35.200 Man's like in the ceiling rafters like looking down at him, 0:02:35.240 --> 0:02:37.400 Like I remember looking at that on the Spinneract and being, 0:02:37.480 --> 0:02:38.440 holy shit, I gotta get that. 0:02:38.720 --> 0:02:42.600 Yeah, that's definitely one of those most influential story ocs. 0:02:42.639 --> 0:02:44.320 I think, even like you said, no matter how it 0:02:44.360 --> 0:02:46.360 holds up, I think a lot of us like that 0:02:46.520 --> 0:02:48.440 was a Spider Man story that we always remember. 0:02:48.800 --> 0:02:53.040 Yeah, and then this is going to be a unoriginal answer, 0:02:53.600 --> 0:02:57.920 but it's you know, this early Steve Ditgo. They've retcon 0:02:58.040 --> 0:03:01.520 this moment so many times, both in shows and in 0:03:01.800 --> 0:03:05.400 other iterations of Spider Man comics, but it's that moment 0:03:05.440 --> 0:03:07.320 where he doesn't really know how strong he is yet 0:03:07.360 --> 0:03:09.480 early in the days of Spider Man. Right, this weight 0:03:09.520 --> 0:03:12.200 of like all this like rubble and stuff has collapsed 0:03:12.200 --> 0:03:13.720 and it's fallen down on him. 0:03:13.800 --> 0:03:14.000 Right. 0:03:14.080 --> 0:03:16.360 Oh, yeah, that's such a great panel. 0:03:16.639 --> 0:03:18.520 You see this moment in the Spider Man movie, you 0:03:18.520 --> 0:03:21.560 see it in other things, and water is filling up 0:03:21.600 --> 0:03:24.320 the space and like the concrete is crushing him and 0:03:24.360 --> 0:03:26.200 it's like pushing him down and he doesn't know if 0:03:26.200 --> 0:03:28.320 he's gonna make it, and he's thinking, oh god, I 0:03:28.440 --> 0:03:30.160 just might give up. I can't do it, and then 0:03:30.200 --> 0:03:33.880 he finds the strength somewhere inside of himself to be like, no, no, 0:03:34.200 --> 0:03:35.280 I'm going to escape. 0:03:35.280 --> 0:03:36.760 I'm going to push all this stuff off me. 0:03:37.160 --> 0:03:41.360 And that is just such an iconic Spider Man moment 0:03:41.480 --> 0:03:44.520 because Peter Parker figured it out on his own. 0:03:45.360 --> 0:03:47.280 Like you know, the X Men all have a school, 0:03:47.440 --> 0:03:49.280 Tony has billions of dollars. 0:03:49.600 --> 0:03:53.160 Tony has billions of dollars. They all do regular training 0:03:53.240 --> 0:03:56.920 at the mansion. Like Daredevil got ninja training and boxing 0:03:56.960 --> 0:03:59.880 training from his dad. Peter Berger had none of that. 0:04:00.440 --> 0:04:03.120 He did like one amateur wrestling match and then was 0:04:03.160 --> 0:04:08.200 a superhero. So this is him really understanding how strong 0:04:08.240 --> 0:04:10.280 he is for the first time and letting loose. 0:04:10.440 --> 0:04:10.680 Yeah. 0:04:10.680 --> 0:04:13.400 And it's just an iconic Spider Man moment that has 0:04:13.400 --> 0:04:15.080 been recreated again and again and again. 0:04:15.160 --> 0:04:17.920 Yeah. And that panel is like still just as powerful 0:04:17.960 --> 0:04:18.880 every time you see it. 0:04:19.080 --> 0:04:19.560 Yeah. 0:04:19.640 --> 0:04:21.920 Just to add to this in case you didn't know 0:04:21.960 --> 0:04:25.599 about this ridiculous after Jason gave that incredibly good, sincere 0:04:25.640 --> 0:04:28.719 coherent answer, here is more of my chaotic facts about 0:04:28.800 --> 0:04:31.559 why this works, sure, so it happened. In the first 0:04:31.560 --> 0:04:33.680 issue of Amazing Spider Man, Peter goes to try and 0:04:33.760 --> 0:04:36.440 join this Fantastic Four because he needs a paycheck, right 0:04:36.600 --> 0:04:38.840 and they say no. But the issue I was actually 0:04:38.839 --> 0:04:41.920 thinking of is number one, what if Spider Man joined 0:04:41.960 --> 0:04:45.320 the Fantastic Four where they say yes? And because of this, 0:04:45.839 --> 0:04:48.479 because they let him into the group because he is broke, 0:04:48.920 --> 0:04:52.159 Sue ends up leaving Reed to go and be with 0:04:52.520 --> 0:04:55.520 the submarner nay More and ends up like dating him 0:04:55.640 --> 0:04:59.480 and finding solace in his arms because she gets left 0:04:59.480 --> 0:05:01.880 behind him favor of Peter. So that is another oh 0:05:01.960 --> 0:05:04.480 shit moment. Peter joining the Fantastic Four because he's broke 0:05:04.600 --> 0:05:07.279 leads to Sue cheating on read just iconic stuff. I 0:05:07.320 --> 0:05:09.880 love that weird shit, And for me Spider Man, I'm 0:05:09.920 --> 0:05:12.840 always just here to laugh about how he's broke. But yeah, 0:05:12.880 --> 0:05:17.200 those two moments are really great. Jason Joshua asks lots 0:05:17.200 --> 0:05:19.880 of discourse on how people are divided, on how they 0:05:19.920 --> 0:05:23.240 feel about how most of the Spider Force in across 0:05:23.240 --> 0:05:26.240 the Spider Verse react to the canon events and accepting 0:05:26.320 --> 0:05:28.520 that they need to happen. We'd love to hear Jason 0:05:28.560 --> 0:05:31.360 and Rosy's thoughts on this. Is it acceptable or out 0:05:31.400 --> 0:05:33.880 of characters for the Spiders or do we just chalk 0:05:33.920 --> 0:05:35.600 it up to the right as poking fun at how 0:05:35.640 --> 0:05:38.520 the comics editor's office won't seem to let Peter grow. 0:05:39.080 --> 0:05:42.840 I think what makes that movie so good is that 0:05:43.000 --> 0:05:44.279 everybody has a point. 0:05:44.360 --> 0:05:44.720 Mm hmm. 0:05:45.080 --> 0:05:48.120 That's why it's a great, great conflict. Like I think 0:05:48.120 --> 0:05:51.880 we all would disagree with Miguel Spiderman twenty. 0:05:51.800 --> 0:05:53.400 Ninety nine's tactics. 0:05:53.640 --> 0:05:56.840 Yeah, but I think it's also fair to say that 0:05:57.560 --> 0:06:02.159 keeping to the cannon in a multiverse sense has kept 0:06:02.480 --> 0:06:07.120 a lot of bad slash chaotic time stream events from 0:06:07.160 --> 0:06:10.880 happening like he's I think also clearly held the universe together. 0:06:11.040 --> 0:06:14.320 And to speak more to that, the Spider Force, the 0:06:14.320 --> 0:06:18.359 Spider Society, all of these Spider people that are helping 0:06:18.400 --> 0:06:22.159 the girl, they are all the heroes of their dimension 0:06:22.800 --> 0:06:24.560 and they look at McGall and go, this guy's right. 0:06:25.160 --> 0:06:29.279 So clearly there is something there that is worth doing. 0:06:29.800 --> 0:06:33.559 And what's so perfect about the conflict is that from 0:06:34.400 --> 0:06:39.000 Miles's perspective, now knowing what the outcome is going to be, 0:06:39.760 --> 0:06:43.880 that's the thing that flips it. If you knew Uncle 0:06:43.960 --> 0:06:47.479 Ben or police captain close to Spider Man was going 0:06:47.520 --> 0:06:50.520 to die, you know, much like Uncle Ben's words. You know, 0:06:50.760 --> 0:06:53.520 then you have the responsibility to do something about it. 0:06:54.120 --> 0:06:57.680 But looking from the you know, multiversal fifty thousand foot 0:06:57.800 --> 0:07:01.279 view where the hero doesn't know and the Spider society 0:07:01.360 --> 0:07:04.440 do know, and you're just letting events take their course. 0:07:04.839 --> 0:07:06.560 Yeah, I think they have a point as well. 0:07:06.800 --> 0:07:09.200 So I think that's why it's a great story is 0:07:09.200 --> 0:07:12.080 because you can see that both sides have an authentic perspective. 0:07:12.160 --> 0:07:12.400 Yeah. 0:07:12.400 --> 0:07:13.800 No, I absolutely agree with you. 0:07:13.840 --> 0:07:15.800 And I think the other thing about it is it 0:07:15.840 --> 0:07:18.720 plays into that ultimate moral ethical question, which is like 0:07:18.720 --> 0:07:21.400 the good of the many versus the good of the few. Yeah, 0:07:21.520 --> 0:07:24.000 Like if you could save the life of your loved one, 0:07:24.320 --> 0:07:27.080 but it would kill an entire universe, what would you do? 0:07:27.440 --> 0:07:30.360 And that is the position that Miguel puts people in, 0:07:30.400 --> 0:07:32.800 with the binary choice he's asking them to make. I 0:07:32.840 --> 0:07:34.800 also think Joshua makes a great point here where he 0:07:34.840 --> 0:07:36.960 says the thing about the writers kind of poking fun 0:07:37.000 --> 0:07:39.120 at how comics editors won't let Peter grow, you know, 0:07:39.160 --> 0:07:42.600 things like Peter can't stay married, but he can't get divorced, 0:07:42.640 --> 0:07:45.320 so he has to make a deal with Mephisto. I 0:07:45.360 --> 0:07:47.600 think that Josh makes a great point. I don't necessarily 0:07:47.640 --> 0:07:49.280 know if it's poking fun at I think it is 0:07:49.320 --> 0:07:51.440 done in a tongue in cheap way, but I do 0:07:51.520 --> 0:07:54.160 think has Kemp Powers said on our show, I do 0:07:54.280 --> 0:08:01.200 think that it is a acknowledgement of how Canon can 0:08:02.200 --> 0:08:05.560 force writers and creatives and characters to be put through 0:08:05.600 --> 0:08:08.440 the same kind of stories again and again and again. 0:08:08.760 --> 0:08:11.320 You know, we did a chat with Nick Kesh, yeah, 0:08:11.440 --> 0:08:14.440 talking about how the original Spider Man India was basically 0:08:14.480 --> 0:08:18.280 them redoing the Uncle Ben origin story, but in India 0:08:18.360 --> 0:08:21.920 with this new character Pav And that's really interesting because 0:08:21.960 --> 0:08:24.880 again somebody else has to die. Somebody else has to die. 0:08:24.920 --> 0:08:28.120 So I think it's a really smart, cool way of 0:08:28.160 --> 0:08:32.760 building in a conversation with your audience as well as 0:08:32.840 --> 0:08:36.200 an interesting conflict that we're going to have conversations about 0:08:36.240 --> 0:08:39.520 this for years, because it does play into these big 0:08:39.520 --> 0:08:42.600 moral and ethical questions about being a hero and what 0:08:42.640 --> 0:08:45.480 that really means. Nobody can say Miles is wrong, but 0:08:45.559 --> 0:08:48.320 you also can't say that the Spider Society doesn't have 0:08:48.360 --> 0:08:51.600 a point when you see what happens in Pav's universe 0:08:51.600 --> 0:08:54.160 where this you know, black hole into the multiverse opens up. 0:08:54.679 --> 0:08:57.600 Nobody can say that. Jack w asks which Disney MCU 0:08:57.679 --> 0:08:59.880 care do you think will next appear in Tom Holan 0:09:00.120 --> 0:09:02.439 live action Spider Man movies and ek Spider Man four 0:09:02.520 --> 0:09:05.080 could be more street based, and since they tease Daredevil's 0:09:05.120 --> 0:09:06.920 run in No Way Home, it seems like the obvious 0:09:07.000 --> 0:09:10.720 choice any dark horses on your mind's rosy any thoughts. 0:09:10.920 --> 0:09:12.920 I think Jack is absolutely right, and I think the 0:09:12.960 --> 0:09:14.800 cash in our conversation is absolute right. 0:09:14.840 --> 0:09:17.280 It's going to be more of a street level og 0:09:18.000 --> 0:09:19.400 experience Spider Man. 0:09:19.600 --> 0:09:22.839 Yeah, I totally agree. My gut says, Look, this isn't 0:09:22.960 --> 0:09:26.560 fully MCU. But I also think we could see Miles. 0:09:26.600 --> 0:09:29.200 That's always been my thought about Spider Man four. You 0:09:29.360 --> 0:09:31.440 set it up so you have Peter as a street 0:09:31.480 --> 0:09:35.280 level hero, Spider Man gains more of that reputation, and 0:09:35.360 --> 0:09:37.199 near the end you meet Miles, and you set it 0:09:37.320 --> 0:09:40.240 up so that rather than Peter being dead, people just 0:09:40.280 --> 0:09:42.440 don't know Peter ever existed, and then you can have 0:09:42.520 --> 0:09:44.920 that mentorship. So I wouldn't be surprised to see a 0:09:44.960 --> 0:09:47.960 little Miles cameo a live action Miles cameo. But I 0:09:47.960 --> 0:09:50.240 think you're right. I think any dead evil characters are 0:09:50.320 --> 0:09:53.000 up for play. I think that we could see someone 0:09:53.080 --> 0:09:55.679 like Kate Bishop Hawkay. I feel like that is a 0:09:55.880 --> 0:09:57.760 very natural space. 0:09:57.880 --> 0:09:58.760 Oh, that would be cool. 0:09:58.840 --> 0:10:01.439 And she didn't know Peter Parker before, so you can 0:10:01.480 --> 0:10:04.560 also establish a world where she does know him. Does 0:10:04.600 --> 0:10:08.200 the spell keep going though? Does any time anyone learns 0:10:08.200 --> 0:10:10.720 that he's Peter Parker they forget? I don't know if 0:10:10.760 --> 0:10:13.840 it's like an ongoing, like Invisible Life of Addie LaRue 0:10:13.880 --> 0:10:16.480 type spell, But I think a Kate Bishop Porkeye, someone 0:10:16.600 --> 0:10:19.000 young and fun could be like that Kamala and Peter. 0:10:19.280 --> 0:10:20.280 That could be really great. 0:10:20.360 --> 0:10:21.280 Oh that's a good one. 0:10:21.360 --> 0:10:22.240 I would like to see it. 0:10:22.280 --> 0:10:24.800 Also, we know that they like to take things from 0:10:24.800 --> 0:10:27.760 Miles's comic and kind of transplant them onto Tom Holland, 0:10:27.800 --> 0:10:30.800 and Miles and Kamala have an ongoing friendship, so those 0:10:30.800 --> 0:10:32.880 would be the ones. I think that street level vibe 0:10:33.240 --> 0:10:35.920 with maybe a few young kids. And let's be real, 0:10:35.960 --> 0:10:38.560 I mean, Kamala is only a like, she's not very 0:10:38.600 --> 0:10:40.920 far from New York City, so that to me really 0:10:40.960 --> 0:10:43.400 seems like the most obvious choice. 0:10:43.400 --> 0:10:46.679 What about you, Gosh, taking a king from you. I 0:10:46.720 --> 0:10:48.120 think it can make a lot of sense to see 0:10:48.120 --> 0:10:48.720 that kingpin. 0:10:49.040 --> 0:10:50.679 Oh god, I'd love to see it. 0:10:50.840 --> 0:10:55.720 Kind of an examination of the underlying organized crime forces 0:10:55.760 --> 0:10:58.120 in New York City. I know that, you know, Born 0:10:58.160 --> 0:11:00.160 Again is probably going to delve into that greatly. We 0:11:00.160 --> 0:11:02.600 haven't really seen anything like that on the big screen. 0:11:02.640 --> 0:11:05.920 It's been kind of, you know, much much larger scale 0:11:06.040 --> 0:11:10.360 threats than that Venom has been teased. So what about 0:11:10.400 --> 0:11:11.880 some sort of symbiote battle. 0:11:12.160 --> 0:11:13.360 Oh, I think you're right. 0:11:13.400 --> 0:11:15.800 I think the Symbia suit could be a big call 0:11:15.880 --> 0:11:16.320 for four. 0:11:16.600 --> 0:11:16.800 Yeah. 0:11:16.840 --> 0:11:20.000 What if the Symbia crawls over some big, muscle bound 0:11:20.080 --> 0:11:23.240 guy who already has a problem with Peter Parker And 0:11:23.280 --> 0:11:25.439 now all of a sudden you've got a built in antagonist. 0:11:25.840 --> 0:11:27.880 And then we've done the Green Goblin. What about the 0:11:27.920 --> 0:11:30.640 hob Goblin? M what about the hob I. 0:11:30.679 --> 0:11:32.520 Just want to say, I've talked about this a lot. 0:11:32.600 --> 0:11:35.760 Yeah, but you know, there is a version of the 0:11:35.800 --> 0:11:39.480 world where a certain Ned. 0:11:39.280 --> 0:11:41.480 Leads, and so I'm saying. 0:11:41.520 --> 0:11:44.160 Is the Hobgoblin. I would love to see it. 0:11:44.320 --> 0:11:47.080 I've talked to Jacob Alin about that before he plays Ned. 0:11:47.080 --> 0:11:48.720 I've said, like, is that something you would want to do? 0:11:48.880 --> 0:11:52.280 Imagine that friendship at torn apart, you know, Spider Man 0:11:52.360 --> 0:11:55.760 three style, the emotion, that would be extremely cool. Okay, 0:11:55.760 --> 0:11:58.880 what about this? What do you think the reality? 0:11:58.960 --> 0:11:59.760 You know, something I. 0:11:59.800 --> 0:12:03.360 Love about she Yock and that I loved about Hawkeye 0:12:03.679 --> 0:12:06.559 was that they reintroduced the dead evil characters in like 0:12:06.559 --> 0:12:07.680 a slightly new tone. 0:12:07.960 --> 0:12:08.320 Yeah. 0:12:08.360 --> 0:12:11.200 Do you imagine a world where we could see the 0:12:11.360 --> 0:12:18.840 MCU Netflix Punisher join the MCU again but in Spider Man. 0:12:19.440 --> 0:12:23.880 I think we could see it mm hmm. But of course, 0:12:24.000 --> 0:12:27.400 you know, for one, the character has been, through no 0:12:27.520 --> 0:12:31.319 fault of anyone's politicized by the fact that the Thin 0:12:31.400 --> 0:12:35.040 Blue Line movement has co opted the Punisher skull as 0:12:35.080 --> 0:12:39.160 like one of their pieces of iconography. I feel like 0:12:39.320 --> 0:12:42.080 this iteration of Disney, or really any iteration of Disney 0:12:42.080 --> 0:12:43.720 would be like, we don't need it. It's not like 0:12:43.760 --> 0:12:45.600 he's a major well, I mean, the people that like 0:12:45.640 --> 0:12:48.479 the Punisher, it's like a religion. Yeah, it's like licorice, 0:12:48.520 --> 0:12:50.720 you know, like, not a lot of people like the Punisher, 0:12:50.800 --> 0:12:52.880 but those who like it, like really really like it. 0:12:53.160 --> 0:12:55.240 And so I think that there's a way to do 0:12:55.320 --> 0:12:57.240 it you make the more of like a special forces 0:12:57.280 --> 0:12:59.200 guy and it maybe not so much like a vigilante. 0:12:59.200 --> 0:13:01.240 He was just like guns people down. And they've done 0:13:01.240 --> 0:13:03.520 that in the comics A little bit X did that, 0:13:03.760 --> 0:13:06.120 and Civil War did that where it's like the Punisher 0:13:06.240 --> 0:13:08.920 was involved and all the heroes were like, this guy's 0:13:08.960 --> 0:13:11.480 working with this. This guy's like a fucking mass murderer. But 0:13:11.880 --> 0:13:14.400 the stuff that he did was kind of like splinter 0:13:14.520 --> 0:13:18.079 Cell type activities where he's like sneaking into the Baxter 0:13:18.160 --> 0:13:18.520 building and. 0:13:18.520 --> 0:13:19.079 Stuff like that. 0:13:19.200 --> 0:13:19.640 Mm hmmm. 0:13:19.800 --> 0:13:21.240 So I think that there's a world in which they 0:13:21.240 --> 0:13:22.760 could do it, but I think they would have to 0:13:22.840 --> 0:13:25.559 necessarily tone it down. There's a guy in a country 0:13:25.640 --> 0:13:26.800 racked by gun violence. 0:13:26.960 --> 0:13:27.319 Mm hmm. 0:13:27.559 --> 0:13:31.640 Here is a guy who unapologetically just like guns mafia 0:13:31.760 --> 0:13:34.800 dudes down in their hundreds like all the time. 0:13:35.160 --> 0:13:35.520 Yeah. 0:13:35.800 --> 0:13:39.480 I actually just saw so John Burnhallpe is coming back 0:13:39.600 --> 0:13:42.600 in Dead Devil Born Again, So that could be our 0:13:42.760 --> 0:13:46.520 place where they reimagine him, because I feel like, if 0:13:46.559 --> 0:13:49.400 you're gonna put him back into the MCU, the version 0:13:49.480 --> 0:13:51.840 they did in the Marvel Netflix show. 0:13:51.760 --> 0:13:53.000 Was so dark. 0:13:53.520 --> 0:13:54.720 It was incredibly dark. 0:13:54.800 --> 0:13:57.520 You're gonna have to put him in a Spandex costume 0:13:57.920 --> 0:13:59.839 and have him with like a paintball gun, Like you're 0:13:59.840 --> 0:14:02.120 really gonna have to go the other way with it. 0:14:02.040 --> 0:14:04.280 And I will say I kind of liked it. 0:14:04.360 --> 0:14:06.640 I get why they did it, but it doesn't fit 0:14:06.679 --> 0:14:08.400 into the Spider Man of it. 0:14:08.480 --> 0:14:10.760 All that said, I think that there is a way 0:14:11.080 --> 0:14:14.720 because you know, again, like Maral, comics is made up 0:14:14.720 --> 0:14:18.240 of characters with different tones, like oftentimes when Frank Castle 0:14:18.360 --> 0:14:21.360 gets in a room with Spider Man or whoever, they're. 0:14:21.160 --> 0:14:22.040 Just roasting the guy. 0:14:22.120 --> 0:14:24.120 Yeah, yeah, yeah, And so I think that there is 0:14:24.160 --> 0:14:27.880 a world where he becomes, while still a very very 0:14:27.960 --> 0:14:30.480 dangerous individual, the butt of a lot of jokes. 0:14:30.760 --> 0:14:33.000 Oh, that could be fun. I think that that is 0:14:33.040 --> 0:14:36.440 a really fun, interesting way to do it. You make 0:14:36.520 --> 0:14:38.080 him the butt of the jokes and you take away 0:14:38.480 --> 0:14:41.680 the seriousness that he's been afforded by certain groups. I 0:14:41.680 --> 0:14:45.000 think that could be very good. Chauncey asks, it's controversial, 0:14:45.000 --> 0:14:48.200 but I like it. Which was the better series, nineties 0:14:48.320 --> 0:14:52.240 X Men animated series or nineties Spider Man animated series. 0:14:52.640 --> 0:14:55.760 I mean, listen, they're both really really good. But the 0:14:55.880 --> 0:14:58.840 nineties X Men was iconic, and part of it is 0:14:58.880 --> 0:15:02.960 that it had a great theme. It was taking incredible, 0:15:03.520 --> 0:15:08.080 already legendary arcs from the X Men comics and like 0:15:08.440 --> 0:15:13.359 boiling them down into really really punchy, half hour animated episodes. 0:15:13.640 --> 0:15:18.200 And it had so much more interpersonal drama because you 0:15:18.240 --> 0:15:21.240 have this big team of heroes. It was just better. 0:15:22.000 --> 0:15:24.480 And this is no shots to anybody who likes the 0:15:24.560 --> 0:15:26.080 animated Spider Man, because we're. 0:15:25.920 --> 0:15:27.880 Fair and balanced here. I'm going to make the argument 0:15:27.920 --> 0:15:30.000 for the nineties Spider Man. I agree with everything you 0:15:30.080 --> 0:15:33.160 just said. I do believe that the X Men cartoon 0:15:33.240 --> 0:15:35.920 is iconic. I love the way that it takes those 0:15:36.480 --> 0:15:40.200 iconic classic arcs and truncates them and makes them accessible. 0:15:40.440 --> 0:15:44.280 I will say I do rewatch the Spider Man show more, 0:15:44.600 --> 0:15:47.200 and it is because of that same device that they use. 0:15:47.560 --> 0:15:50.600 You can watch that Spider Man show and you can 0:15:50.600 --> 0:15:52.760 find out the origin of any supervillain. You want to 0:15:52.760 --> 0:15:54.280 find out what happened to Venom, you can watch that 0:15:54.320 --> 0:15:56.480 story on there. You want to see this character, you 0:15:56.480 --> 0:16:00.200 can do it in the tradition of Spider Man as well. Wow, 0:16:00.680 --> 0:16:03.800 there are so many good villains in that show, Like 0:16:04.000 --> 0:16:07.120 every out there weird villain is around. So I will 0:16:07.120 --> 0:16:11.640 say that's the underrated gem. But obviously X Men ninety 0:16:11.640 --> 0:16:13.800 two everybody knows it. There's a reason that's getting a sequel. 0:16:13.800 --> 0:16:16.360 That shit's iconic. But Spider Man, I'm glad you brought 0:16:16.400 --> 0:16:18.120 up Chauncey because I don't think it gets the love 0:16:18.120 --> 0:16:18.680 it deserves. 0:16:19.000 --> 0:16:22.440 Should we do a rewatch of the original nineties X 0:16:22.480 --> 0:16:25.640 Men animated series in preparation for the upcoming X Men 0:16:25.720 --> 0:16:27.120 animated series on Disney Plus? 0:16:27.160 --> 0:16:30.640 Oh my god, Yes, And let's do Pride of the 0:16:30.760 --> 0:16:32.480 X Men two, you know, the one they made before. 0:16:32.880 --> 0:16:35.360 Yeah, yeah, because that's like that shit. 0:16:35.480 --> 0:16:37.640 I will tell you the real truth when you watch that. 0:16:37.920 --> 0:16:40.440 You gotta watch it after you watch ninety two, because 0:16:40.680 --> 0:16:43.560 ninety two doesn't hold up to Pride. Oh wow, Pride 0:16:43.600 --> 0:16:46.080 is actually like you want to see that story. You 0:16:46.120 --> 0:16:48.960 want to see that story? Okay, yeah, it's so good. 0:16:49.360 --> 0:16:51.560 Ian asks, is the real hidden theme of our film 0:16:51.560 --> 0:16:54.160 that actual reality sucks ass because there's no Spider person 0:16:54.200 --> 0:16:56.760 in it. I think that might be to make it 0:16:56.800 --> 0:16:58.640 serious for a second, I think that part of the 0:16:58.640 --> 0:17:02.000 theme is that our reality actually success because they're you know, 0:17:02.080 --> 0:17:06.000 what are these stories? Generally speaking? They are like incredible 0:17:06.040 --> 0:17:08.800 wish fulfillment where we want to live in a world 0:17:09.000 --> 0:17:13.600 in which people with tremendous power and tremendous resources, who 0:17:13.640 --> 0:17:19.280 are geniuses and are rich and are incredibly talented and powerful, 0:17:19.680 --> 0:17:24.480 don't just like sit up in their skyscraper penthouses and 0:17:24.600 --> 0:17:29.160 like a crew capital and like build bunkers on islands 0:17:29.160 --> 0:17:31.520 off the coast of New Zealand waiting for the apocalypse. 0:17:31.560 --> 0:17:34.800 They go out and they try and save the world. 0:17:35.200 --> 0:17:37.639 We want that to be the case. It's clearly not 0:17:37.720 --> 0:17:39.560 the case in our world, but we want it to be. 0:17:39.680 --> 0:17:42.440 That's why these stories have so much staying power. That's 0:17:42.440 --> 0:17:44.960 why people still engage with them. That's why kids and 0:17:45.040 --> 0:17:47.639 adults and everybody are in a comic store anytime you 0:17:47.680 --> 0:17:50.080 walk in there. So, yeah, I think that you're right 0:17:50.280 --> 0:17:53.160 Ian in a certain kind of sense. You're correct. 0:17:53.800 --> 0:17:56.520 Nothing well to add that was perfect. I totally agree up. 0:17:56.560 --> 0:17:59.240 Next, return to the Omnibus to discuss Spider Man twenty 0:17:59.320 --> 0:18:00.200 ninety nine. 0:18:03.359 --> 0:18:04.520 We've got exciting news. 0:18:04.680 --> 0:18:07.480 Extra Vision will be recording our fifteenth Anniversary of The 0:18:07.560 --> 0:18:11.440 Dark Knight Retrospective episode live in Los Angeles on June 0:18:11.440 --> 0:18:14.840 twenty six, that's seven PMPT. Join us in person or 0:18:14.960 --> 0:18:17.560 via live stream from the comfort of your home. Tickets 0:18:17.600 --> 0:18:28.560 are More info available at Crooked dot com Slash Events. 0:18:39.160 --> 0:18:42.159 Welcome to another chapter in the Omnibus where lore, analysis 0:18:42.160 --> 0:18:45.480 and understanding come together. This week Miguel O'Hara Spider Man 0:18:45.520 --> 0:18:48.720 twenty ninety nine. Reboots and retcons are, of course a 0:18:48.800 --> 0:18:52.359 necessary part of serialized storytelling. That's particularly true in comics, 0:18:52.760 --> 0:18:56.840 right where you're trying to continuously engage a new audience. 0:18:57.080 --> 0:18:59.560 A new person whose next comics is their first comic. 0:19:00.119 --> 0:19:03.360 Talked a lot about the Marvel's Ultimate Universe, the two 0:19:03.400 --> 0:19:07.480 thousand's era line of books featuring Marvel's most popular heroes 0:19:07.560 --> 0:19:10.480 in a modern setting. Miles Morales, of course, makes his 0:19:10.520 --> 0:19:14.119 first appearance in twenty eleven's Ultimate Universe, number four and 0:19:14.280 --> 0:19:18.040 offshoot of Marvel's Ultimate Spider Man. The Ultimate Universe has 0:19:18.040 --> 0:19:22.119 been incredibly influential to all of the MCU properties. Fallout 0:19:22.240 --> 0:19:28.200 explored the repercussions of the shocking, tragic, and incredibly sorrow 0:19:28.320 --> 0:19:31.040 filled death of Peter Parker in the pages of Ultimate 0:19:31.040 --> 0:19:33.760