1 00:00:00,240 --> 00:00:27,320 Speaker 1: Ridiculous History is a production of I Heart Radio. Welcome 2 00:00:27,360 --> 00:00:30,560 Speaker 1: back to the show Ridiculous Historians on Earth and a 3 00:00:30,760 --> 00:00:35,920 Speaker 1: broad big shout out to our super producer, Mr Max Williams. 4 00:00:37,800 --> 00:00:41,479 Speaker 1: They called me Ben. We've got Mr Noel Brown on 5 00:00:41,520 --> 00:00:47,040 Speaker 1: the horn today as well. Uh uh okay, guys, let's 6 00:00:47,040 --> 00:00:49,879 Speaker 1: just I was thinking how to kick this off. This 7 00:00:49,920 --> 00:00:51,920 Speaker 1: is one we're very excited about. This is gonna be 8 00:00:51,920 --> 00:00:57,680 Speaker 1: a two parter on the cultural phenomenon Star Trek, which 9 00:00:57,680 --> 00:01:02,560 Speaker 1: has changed the world. Now. There are entire podcasts about 10 00:01:02,600 --> 00:01:05,760 Speaker 1: all sorts of specific things about Star Trek, but being 11 00:01:05,800 --> 00:01:09,760 Speaker 1: a history show, we love to talk origin stories and 12 00:01:09,920 --> 00:01:13,840 Speaker 1: I gotta ask you, guys, did you have a favorite 13 00:01:13,880 --> 00:01:16,920 Speaker 1: Star Trek character growing up or French? First of all, 14 00:01:16,920 --> 00:01:18,559 Speaker 1: have to say, I'm kind of bummed because I thought 15 00:01:18,560 --> 00:01:21,919 Speaker 1: we were doing the epic two part Mork and Mindy episode. Um, 16 00:01:21,920 --> 00:01:24,960 Speaker 1: but Stark Star Treks cool and honestly, there would be 17 00:01:25,000 --> 00:01:27,959 Speaker 1: no morkan Mindy if there were no Star Trek. I 18 00:01:28,000 --> 00:01:33,399 Speaker 1: would deposit I've never been a Trekky guy. I like it, um, 19 00:01:33,440 --> 00:01:35,880 Speaker 1: but I don't know that I'm familiar enough as a 20 00:01:35,880 --> 00:01:38,120 Speaker 1: fan to have a favorite character, you know, what now. 21 00:01:38,360 --> 00:01:40,920 Speaker 1: I always just like LaVar Burton as a as a 22 00:01:41,000 --> 00:01:44,840 Speaker 1: dude or Visa VI reading Rainbow. So and I liked 23 00:01:44,880 --> 00:01:46,840 Speaker 1: his little headgear. I thought it was a cool look. 24 00:01:47,080 --> 00:01:50,160 Speaker 1: So yeah, Jordie LaForge ft W. I do this all 25 00:01:50,200 --> 00:01:53,080 Speaker 1: the time when I'm recording by myself. I like to 26 00:01:53,120 --> 00:01:56,600 Speaker 1: pretend I'm either Cyclops or Jordie LaForge. Ben is placing 27 00:01:56,680 --> 00:02:00,280 Speaker 1: his his headphones uh down around his eyes like some 28 00:02:00,360 --> 00:02:03,240 Speaker 1: sort of Star Trek aviisor it looks great and thank you, 29 00:02:03,320 --> 00:02:06,800 Speaker 1: thank you for the visual note the So I would say, 30 00:02:06,880 --> 00:02:09,400 Speaker 1: of the three of us back, you were probably the 31 00:02:09,400 --> 00:02:15,560 Speaker 1: biggest Treky. You're also a research associate for this series personally. Uh. 32 00:02:15,840 --> 00:02:19,480 Speaker 1: Growing up, uh, Captain Kirk always reminded me of my 33 00:02:19,600 --> 00:02:23,040 Speaker 1: dad for several reasons. Uh. I always thought data was 34 00:02:23,080 --> 00:02:26,880 Speaker 1: super cool. And then when Next Generation came out, you know, 35 00:02:26,919 --> 00:02:29,280 Speaker 1: I remember freaking out because there was a Klangon on 36 00:02:29,320 --> 00:02:32,600 Speaker 1: the crew. You know. But as we'll see, that's almost 37 00:02:32,639 --> 00:02:36,400 Speaker 1: meta progressiveness in the world of Star Trek, which actually 38 00:02:36,480 --> 00:02:40,040 Speaker 1: had a lot of real life progressiveness. Here this shows 39 00:02:40,040 --> 00:02:45,119 Speaker 1: Star Trek not ridiculous history. Debuted on September eight, nineteen 40 00:02:45,760 --> 00:02:49,760 Speaker 1: sixty six, and uh, to your point, Noel, which which 41 00:02:49,800 --> 00:02:53,120 Speaker 1: I really enjoy, you can't look at the legacy it 42 00:02:53,240 --> 00:02:57,840 Speaker 1: left without acknowledging how many other things came into the 43 00:02:57,840 --> 00:03:01,440 Speaker 1: world because Star Trek paved the way. Stuff like Futurama, 44 00:03:01,480 --> 00:03:04,320 Speaker 1: of course, and then you know countless spinoffs of the 45 00:03:04,320 --> 00:03:08,200 Speaker 1: original series, but also stuff like U Mork and Mindy 46 00:03:08,320 --> 00:03:12,320 Speaker 1: and Star Trek Podcast and uh, some big wins for 47 00:03:12,560 --> 00:03:16,240 Speaker 1: civil rights which some people might not might not have 48 00:03:16,280 --> 00:03:19,760 Speaker 1: seen coming. But how would we loosely describe Star Trek 49 00:03:19,800 --> 00:03:21,680 Speaker 1: to someone who had never heard of it before? They 50 00:03:21,760 --> 00:03:25,399 Speaker 1: knew the word trek journey, they knew the words star right, 51 00:03:25,720 --> 00:03:27,480 Speaker 1: but they had no idea it was the TV show? 52 00:03:27,520 --> 00:03:29,720 Speaker 1: What what will we tell them? What would be our 53 00:03:29,760 --> 00:03:35,280 Speaker 1: log line for this show? Gentle soap opera in space Utopia? 54 00:03:35,800 --> 00:03:40,680 Speaker 1: I like it. I like it. It is about It 55 00:03:40,880 --> 00:03:45,119 Speaker 1: is about a semi utopian society, right, and the Federation, 56 00:03:45,640 --> 00:03:49,960 Speaker 1: which spans galaxies is not out to make a quick buck. 57 00:03:50,040 --> 00:03:53,160 Speaker 1: They're not out to do resource extraction. They're out to 58 00:03:53,360 --> 00:03:57,960 Speaker 1: learn more about the universe around them. Pretty cool stuff. 59 00:03:58,000 --> 00:03:59,920 Speaker 1: But as you know, they get they managed to get 60 00:04:00,080 --> 00:04:04,880 Speaker 1: too trouble every episode. Uh, and now as we're recording three. 61 00:04:05,440 --> 00:04:09,440 Speaker 1: There are twelve different series. They spanned over forty seasons. 62 00:04:09,480 --> 00:04:12,320 Speaker 1: We're talking eight hundred episodes. That's not even counting the 63 00:04:12,400 --> 00:04:17,200 Speaker 1: thirteen movies and a pop culture phenomenon. Right. There are 64 00:04:17,200 --> 00:04:21,000 Speaker 1: conferences for trek Ease. There are big and small get 65 00:04:21,040 --> 00:04:25,359 Speaker 1: togethers alike. We have several people listening in the crowd today, 66 00:04:25,520 --> 00:04:29,360 Speaker 1: ridiculous historians who might be in their Trek e costume. Actually, 67 00:04:29,640 --> 00:04:31,520 Speaker 1: since he said that, Um, I'm gonna get a little 68 00:04:31,560 --> 00:04:39,240 Speaker 1: more comfortable over here. Oh, here we go shows, there 69 00:04:39,320 --> 00:04:44,760 Speaker 1: we go. Okay, so yeah, Max has Donnes his spok 70 00:04:44,839 --> 00:04:48,680 Speaker 1: ears and a bit of a spock wig. Is that 71 00:04:48,720 --> 00:04:53,760 Speaker 1: sort of spock cut? Yeah, it's It's horribly uncomfortable, but 72 00:04:53,839 --> 00:04:56,279 Speaker 1: I'm going to stick through it the entire episode. It's 73 00:04:56,279 --> 00:04:59,760 Speaker 1: all one piece is it plastic? It looks a little 74 00:04:59,839 --> 00:05:06,159 Speaker 1: like this highly conditioned much like Star trek Uh like outfits, 75 00:05:06,240 --> 00:05:09,360 Speaker 1: makeup and everything. It is horribly uncomfortable, but I will 76 00:05:09,440 --> 00:05:11,960 Speaker 1: wear it. Well, can you give us a vulcan face? 77 00:05:12,000 --> 00:05:14,279 Speaker 1: I'm gonna take a screenshot. This is this is just 78 00:05:14,360 --> 00:05:18,719 Speaker 1: for me. Yeah, because they don't smile. Great, you know, 79 00:05:18,839 --> 00:05:21,120 Speaker 1: I can only do the Star Trek fingers with one 80 00:05:21,200 --> 00:05:24,000 Speaker 1: hand the other one. I can kind of do it, 81 00:05:24,040 --> 00:05:27,640 Speaker 1: but it's just a little more. It's hard. Yeah, you 82 00:05:27,640 --> 00:05:30,640 Speaker 1: guys are killing it. Well. This is actually from judaism. 83 00:05:31,160 --> 00:05:35,039 Speaker 1: Leonard Nimoi made this up. This is a blessing when 84 00:05:35,040 --> 00:05:38,080 Speaker 1: you do it with both hands for a specific type 85 00:05:38,080 --> 00:05:42,799 Speaker 1: of priest. But this is weird. We're running the weird 86 00:05:42,800 --> 00:05:46,520 Speaker 1: trivia out first. So okay, this is the thing you 87 00:05:46,600 --> 00:05:49,880 Speaker 1: might not recognize seeing this entertainment juggernaut. You might not 88 00:05:49,960 --> 00:05:55,440 Speaker 1: be aware of folks that Star Trek almost never existed. 89 00:05:55,480 --> 00:05:58,240 Speaker 1: And there's a great there's a great article that you 90 00:05:58,320 --> 00:06:03,359 Speaker 1: found Max from entertain Weekly ine titled how Star Trek 91 00:06:03,560 --> 00:06:08,640 Speaker 1: Almost Died, and it talks about how close the show 92 00:06:08,760 --> 00:06:13,440 Speaker 1: came to being canceled in the early years, like multiple times. Right, yeah, 93 00:06:13,480 --> 00:06:18,640 Speaker 1: I mean, you know, usually revolutionary ideas they don't come easy. 94 00:06:18,760 --> 00:06:21,440 Speaker 1: You know, people tend to fight them against the status 95 00:06:21,520 --> 00:06:24,400 Speaker 1: quo and things like the Grand Old Opry, which, don't 96 00:06:24,440 --> 00:06:27,080 Speaker 1: get me wrong, is a a cultural phenomenon in and 97 00:06:27,080 --> 00:06:30,599 Speaker 1: of itself, if not like the whitest kind of most 98 00:06:30,720 --> 00:06:34,680 Speaker 1: vanilla of cultural phenomenons that still exists to this day. 99 00:06:34,720 --> 00:06:36,320 Speaker 1: But it was a television show. You know, it's sort 100 00:06:36,320 --> 00:06:38,680 Speaker 1: of a variety show, and it was very, very very popular. 101 00:06:39,120 --> 00:06:43,400 Speaker 1: And in the South and Southwestern states, folks kind of 102 00:06:43,440 --> 00:06:45,800 Speaker 1: favored the Grand Old Opry. We're like, what's the Star 103 00:06:45,880 --> 00:06:49,839 Speaker 1: Trek business. So programmers, station managers, whoever was making these 104 00:06:49,839 --> 00:06:54,560 Speaker 1: decisions in local markets were very close to ditching Trek 105 00:06:55,000 --> 00:06:58,360 Speaker 1: entirely in favor of of this kind of you know, 106 00:06:58,520 --> 00:07:02,960 Speaker 1: scuting and Newton Country Western program Yeah. NBC tried to 107 00:07:03,000 --> 00:07:07,320 Speaker 1: cancel Star Trek three times over its original seventy eight 108 00:07:07,320 --> 00:07:11,800 Speaker 1: episode rutten from September of sixty six to June of 109 00:07:11,880 --> 00:07:15,680 Speaker 1: nineteen sixty nine, and each time it would have been 110 00:07:15,720 --> 00:07:20,400 Speaker 1: canceled had the fans not rose up and livid outrage. Uh. 111 00:07:20,480 --> 00:07:24,000 Speaker 1: And it was a critics darling for a while. It 112 00:07:24,040 --> 00:07:26,520 Speaker 1: was never Uh. I think the highest to gotten the 113 00:07:26,600 --> 00:07:30,800 Speaker 1: Nielsen ratings was the number fifty spot. It was way 114 00:07:30,880 --> 00:07:34,920 Speaker 1: behind other popular shows of the day like Mr. Terrific 115 00:07:35,080 --> 00:07:39,520 Speaker 1: and the Tammy Grimes Show, and uh where you've probably 116 00:07:39,560 --> 00:07:43,120 Speaker 1: never heard of either. I was gonna say the funny 117 00:07:43,120 --> 00:07:46,320 Speaker 1: thing about history, you know, when's the next Tammy Grimes 118 00:07:46,480 --> 00:07:50,840 Speaker 1: con or Mr. Terrific spin off? Uh? And like you said, 119 00:07:50,960 --> 00:07:55,640 Speaker 1: people didn't uh cotton to it with the same enthusiasm 120 00:07:55,800 --> 00:07:59,720 Speaker 1: in different regions of the US. And look, if you 121 00:08:00,000 --> 00:08:03,520 Speaker 1: are a big studio producer in the sixties, Star Trek 122 00:08:03,800 --> 00:08:09,560 Speaker 1: is a really wacky idea. Creator Gene Roddenberry pitched it 123 00:08:09,640 --> 00:08:13,720 Speaker 1: originally as a wagon train to the stars, and he 124 00:08:13,800 --> 00:08:16,560 Speaker 1: was doing that because when you talk to producers and 125 00:08:16,760 --> 00:08:20,400 Speaker 1: studio execs this is a true thing and podcast as well, 126 00:08:20,640 --> 00:08:23,800 Speaker 1: you want to try to tie the concept to something 127 00:08:23,840 --> 00:08:28,440 Speaker 1: that has already been proven to be successful. So he's like, uh, westerns, 128 00:08:28,480 --> 00:08:30,560 Speaker 1: you like westerns. They are like, yeah, Western's make a 129 00:08:30,640 --> 00:08:32,199 Speaker 1: lot of money for us, and he goes, well, this 130 00:08:32,280 --> 00:08:34,640 Speaker 1: is a Western, but it's in space, which is kind 131 00:08:34,640 --> 00:08:39,400 Speaker 1: of funny because we know what Star Trek became, wasn't that. 132 00:08:39,480 --> 00:08:41,720 Speaker 1: I mean, there were certainly some fights on like desert 133 00:08:41,760 --> 00:08:44,520 Speaker 1: planets and things like that, but this concept really is 134 00:08:44,559 --> 00:08:47,600 Speaker 1: not what took off ultimately, but it is kind of 135 00:08:47,640 --> 00:08:52,319 Speaker 1: what Star Wars is and became. The Star Wars really 136 00:08:52,440 --> 00:08:56,640 Speaker 1: and most of its incarnations is a space western, especially 137 00:08:56,640 --> 00:08:59,800 Speaker 1: with the Mandalorian, you know, and Star Wars starts in 138 00:08:59,840 --> 00:09:02,960 Speaker 1: the world of feature film. Star Trek starts as this 139 00:09:03,480 --> 00:09:06,880 Speaker 1: TV show from this guy who used to be a 140 00:09:06,920 --> 00:09:09,920 Speaker 1: pilot from pan Am. He used to work for the 141 00:09:10,080 --> 00:09:13,760 Speaker 1: l a p D as a press officer. Uh he was. 142 00:09:14,000 --> 00:09:17,920 Speaker 1: He was a huge nerd who wrote for shows like Dragnet, 143 00:09:18,280 --> 00:09:21,000 Speaker 1: Have Gun, Will Travel, which is I still think is 144 00:09:21,040 --> 00:09:23,719 Speaker 1: a great show. That's nostalgia there. I gotta say too. 145 00:09:24,120 --> 00:09:26,600 Speaker 1: When I found out that Gene Roddenbara used to be 146 00:09:26,720 --> 00:09:29,040 Speaker 1: worked for the l A p D. I just that's 147 00:09:29,080 --> 00:09:31,720 Speaker 1: just the most l A thing ever. Like he's working 148 00:09:31,760 --> 00:09:34,040 Speaker 1: at his like l a p D press desk post 149 00:09:34,360 --> 00:09:36,560 Speaker 1: and being like, you know, so one day I'm gonna 150 00:09:36,559 --> 00:09:40,160 Speaker 1: beco'mem gonna be a screenwriter too, you know, in between 151 00:09:40,160 --> 00:09:44,079 Speaker 1: writing press releases about you know whatever police press officers 152 00:09:44,200 --> 00:09:47,280 Speaker 1: right about he's working on is his pilot? Sorry, Jill Ce, 153 00:09:47,440 --> 00:09:50,480 Speaker 1: one day I'm gonna be a star. Yeah. And that's 154 00:09:50,720 --> 00:09:54,120 Speaker 1: you know kind of comment in Los Angeles. Uh he 155 00:09:54,120 --> 00:09:56,839 Speaker 1: he says, my series that I'm working on, he's writing 156 00:09:56,840 --> 00:09:59,240 Speaker 1: scripts from this back in the fifties. He says it's 157 00:09:59,240 --> 00:10:03,520 Speaker 1: gonna be mix of anthology sci fi stuff like Outer 158 00:10:03,640 --> 00:10:06,840 Speaker 1: Limits or Twilight Zone, but the characters are going to 159 00:10:06,960 --> 00:10:09,880 Speaker 1: stay the same throughout. So he describes it as a 160 00:10:09,920 --> 00:10:13,719 Speaker 1: Gulliver's travel of the future. These are all pulled from 161 00:10:13,760 --> 00:10:17,480 Speaker 1: things he was saying to Studio exacts. So this this 162 00:10:18,320 --> 00:10:21,520 Speaker 1: to take a quick aside the idea of anthology series 163 00:10:21,600 --> 00:10:24,800 Speaker 1: with the same characters. That's more like a Monster of 164 00:10:24,840 --> 00:10:27,480 Speaker 1: the Week kind of format, right like the X Files, 165 00:10:27,760 --> 00:10:30,560 Speaker 1: where you have your core cast, but they're you know, 166 00:10:30,640 --> 00:10:33,960 Speaker 1: traveling around and doing different adventures every episode, like Scooby 167 00:10:33,960 --> 00:10:37,120 Speaker 1: Doo or whatever. Right, Yeah, And one thing that really 168 00:10:37,160 --> 00:10:41,800 Speaker 1: sticks out about the anthology hybrid approach here is that 169 00:10:41,840 --> 00:10:46,640 Speaker 1: there's kind of a reset between episodes, so terrible, crazy, 170 00:10:46,760 --> 00:10:50,760 Speaker 1: sometimes hilarious Triple esque stuff will happen, but then when 171 00:10:50,800 --> 00:10:54,720 Speaker 1: you get to next week's show, things are back relatively 172 00:10:54,800 --> 00:10:57,720 Speaker 1: to normal. Right, No one's died unless they were wearing 173 00:10:57,720 --> 00:11:00,920 Speaker 1: a red shirt to establish the stakes of a and uh, 174 00:11:01,080 --> 00:11:05,400 Speaker 1: no one has serious scars that remain with them in 175 00:11:05,400 --> 00:11:08,040 Speaker 1: the early days, and they're kind of self contained. You 176 00:11:08,080 --> 00:11:10,640 Speaker 1: don't have to know what happened in episode eight to 177 00:11:10,800 --> 00:11:13,480 Speaker 1: dig what happened in episode nine, which is a huge 178 00:11:13,559 --> 00:11:16,920 Speaker 1: plus for for studio executives because it allows you to 179 00:11:17,000 --> 00:11:20,040 Speaker 1: kind of come in midway and not feel left behind 180 00:11:20,200 --> 00:11:21,920 Speaker 1: or feel like if you didn't start from the ground 181 00:11:22,000 --> 00:11:25,360 Speaker 1: floor that you're you know, going to be completely lost. Uh. 182 00:11:25,400 --> 00:11:27,960 Speaker 1: And we know that that model, you know, at least 183 00:11:27,960 --> 00:11:31,199 Speaker 1: outside of the like era of kind of prestige television 184 00:11:31,760 --> 00:11:34,360 Speaker 1: has has remained, you know, at least in in the 185 00:11:34,400 --> 00:11:38,320 Speaker 1: idea of sitcoms and more of these X files type shows. 186 00:11:38,600 --> 00:11:40,360 Speaker 1: You know, it's a little harder when you have like 187 00:11:40,400 --> 00:11:43,840 Speaker 1: a Lost where if you miss an episode you will 188 00:11:43,880 --> 00:11:52,040 Speaker 1: be titularly lost. Yeah. And also the Lost writers, we're 189 00:11:52,160 --> 00:11:56,240 Speaker 1: very building the plane yeah while they were flying, so okay, 190 00:11:57,440 --> 00:12:00,360 Speaker 1: truck yes, And then went on to mess of Star 191 00:12:00,400 --> 00:12:02,680 Speaker 1: Trek whether you want to say right for a mess 192 00:12:02,760 --> 00:12:13,520 Speaker 1: with that's a division amid the fandom. So our buddy Gene, 193 00:12:14,000 --> 00:12:17,520 Speaker 1: who is dreaming big but maybe doesn't know just how 194 00:12:17,520 --> 00:12:20,760 Speaker 1: big a stream will become. First he goes to the 195 00:12:20,880 --> 00:12:24,839 Speaker 1: suits at CBS, and the suits at CBS sit them 196 00:12:24,880 --> 00:12:30,200 Speaker 1: down for essentially a two hour long conversation about the 197 00:12:30,320 --> 00:12:33,480 Speaker 1: nuts and bolts of this Star Trek idea, and then 198 00:12:33,520 --> 00:12:37,360 Speaker 1: they say, okay, great meeting. Uh, someone will be in touch. 199 00:12:38,480 --> 00:12:40,880 Speaker 1: And someone was in touch, but not with him. They 200 00:12:41,080 --> 00:12:45,160 Speaker 1: bought Lost in Space instead. So he goes to NBC, 201 00:12:45,880 --> 00:12:50,800 Speaker 1: and NBC gives him a chance for a pilot episode. 202 00:12:50,800 --> 00:12:53,960 Speaker 1: We're getting a lot of this from Richard Zoglin over 203 00:12:54,080 --> 00:12:57,120 Speaker 1: at Time, who talks about Star Trek first made into 204 00:12:57,160 --> 00:13:01,800 Speaker 1: the into the screen. So this episode is called the Cage, 205 00:13:02,480 --> 00:13:06,840 Speaker 1: and this is the one that doesn't have Captain James T. 206 00:13:07,040 --> 00:13:10,480 Speaker 1: Kirk as a guy named Captain Pike played by a 207 00:13:10,520 --> 00:13:14,280 Speaker 1: star at the time, Jeffrey Hunter. And Pike is in 208 00:13:14,360 --> 00:13:19,600 Speaker 1: this pilot taking captive on a planet where the indigenous 209 00:13:19,679 --> 00:13:24,240 Speaker 1: inhabitants want to use him to quote breed a new race. 210 00:13:24,640 --> 00:13:28,199 Speaker 1: The network said, this show is too smart for our audience, 211 00:13:28,559 --> 00:13:32,160 Speaker 1: it's too cerebral. But we like where your head's at, Gene, 212 00:13:32,520 --> 00:13:35,360 Speaker 1: So why don't you take a swing at a second pilot? 213 00:13:35,600 --> 00:13:39,559 Speaker 1: And that's kind of rare, right isn't Is it rare 214 00:13:38,320 --> 00:13:42,280 Speaker 1: to pilots? Oh yeah, I mean even you know in 215 00:13:42,440 --> 00:13:46,520 Speaker 1: the in the much less expensive podcast world, you know, 216 00:13:46,800 --> 00:13:49,800 Speaker 1: we get a lot of pitches for shows, and if 217 00:13:49,800 --> 00:13:53,640 Speaker 1: a pilot is rejected, it almost never, you know, is 218 00:13:53,640 --> 00:13:55,079 Speaker 1: the case. It will be like, well, why don't you 219 00:13:55,120 --> 00:13:57,680 Speaker 1: give it another shot? And it costs like nothing to 220 00:13:57,720 --> 00:14:00,240 Speaker 1: make a podcast pilot, So this is there definitely only 221 00:14:00,440 --> 00:14:03,760 Speaker 1: was some faith in this fellow and and his ideas. 222 00:14:03,800 --> 00:14:06,679 Speaker 1: They just wanted to hone it in and probably broaden 223 00:14:06,760 --> 00:14:10,760 Speaker 1: it out a little bit, you know what I mean. Yeah, yeah, 224 00:14:10,840 --> 00:14:13,199 Speaker 1: the same as it ever was, right, And this is 225 00:14:13,240 --> 00:14:17,440 Speaker 1: where we have to introduce the legendary Lucille Ball, who 226 00:14:17,480 --> 00:14:20,280 Speaker 1: has some stuff to say about Star Trek. Lucille Ball 227 00:14:20,440 --> 00:14:24,360 Speaker 1: was tough, we know, you know, again, like um in 228 00:14:24,480 --> 00:14:29,160 Speaker 1: Hollywood even to this day, like new ideas are hard 229 00:14:29,600 --> 00:14:33,280 Speaker 1: sell until they just blow up and then they become 230 00:14:33,680 --> 00:14:36,680 Speaker 1: the thing that everyone else wants to mimic, you know. 231 00:14:37,040 --> 00:14:41,160 Speaker 1: So Lucille Ball was a funny woman leading a show, 232 00:14:41,200 --> 00:14:43,480 Speaker 1: and that was not a thing. Women were usually kind 233 00:14:43,520 --> 00:14:47,240 Speaker 1: of supporting characters to funny men, and they were usually 234 00:14:47,240 --> 00:14:49,680 Speaker 1: just wives and we're kind of like the butt of 235 00:14:49,760 --> 00:14:52,440 Speaker 1: jokes often, but they weren't the ones making the jokes 236 00:14:52,480 --> 00:14:55,240 Speaker 1: and getting all the laugh lines. So Lucy was huge, 237 00:14:55,240 --> 00:14:57,560 Speaker 1: and she was so huge and became such a cultural 238 00:14:57,560 --> 00:15:00,680 Speaker 1: phenomenon with I love Lucy. I mean again, her husband, 239 00:15:00,920 --> 00:15:04,240 Speaker 1: who you know, their relationship is famously a little bit 240 00:15:04,320 --> 00:15:07,120 Speaker 1: rocky at times, but he was definitely kind of second 241 00:15:07,160 --> 00:15:09,120 Speaker 1: fiddle to her, at least in terms of the show. 242 00:15:09,440 --> 00:15:11,160 Speaker 1: He was kind of a straight man, even if he 243 00:15:11,200 --> 00:15:14,200 Speaker 1: had some funny bits here and there. Um often that 244 00:15:14,320 --> 00:15:16,840 Speaker 1: kind of capitalized on his nationality and to this day 245 00:15:16,880 --> 00:15:18,440 Speaker 1: kind of on age super well and come off as 246 00:15:18,440 --> 00:15:21,160 Speaker 1: a little bit racist and weird. But it was Lucy 247 00:15:21,240 --> 00:15:23,920 Speaker 1: who was the power behind the throne, and she and 248 00:15:24,120 --> 00:15:27,600 Speaker 1: Desi Arnaz her husband um were so successful that they 249 00:15:27,600 --> 00:15:31,760 Speaker 1: were able to buy a studio. They bought the former 250 00:15:31,880 --> 00:15:35,360 Speaker 1: Archao Studios was just like a legacy old school studio 251 00:15:35,440 --> 00:15:37,480 Speaker 1: that made I think like a lot of like like 252 00:15:37,640 --> 00:15:40,120 Speaker 1: Golden Air, a kind of monster movies and stuff. For like, 253 00:15:40,160 --> 00:15:44,080 Speaker 1: what did what did Arkao do? This is Alex Williams question. 254 00:15:44,120 --> 00:15:48,560 Speaker 1: I'm sure he's done episodes in ephemeral about r Kocho 255 00:15:49,160 --> 00:15:51,880 Speaker 1: did a lot of um. I mean, you're right, they 256 00:15:51,960 --> 00:15:54,200 Speaker 1: date back to the radio days. But they did stuff 257 00:15:54,240 --> 00:15:58,200 Speaker 1: like jazz singer. I want to say, a lot of 258 00:15:58,240 --> 00:16:02,760 Speaker 1: those buzz Berkeley type, you know, big musical kind of things. 259 00:16:02,800 --> 00:16:05,400 Speaker 1: I want to say, I think they were responsible for 260 00:16:05,520 --> 00:16:09,600 Speaker 1: Citizen Kane uh And they also birthed a lot of 261 00:16:10,360 --> 00:16:14,480 Speaker 1: huge um uh stars you know, King Kong is what 262 00:16:14,520 --> 00:16:16,560 Speaker 1: they did. Of course, so r KO was definitely more 263 00:16:16,600 --> 00:16:18,240 Speaker 1: than just a run of the mill kind of like 264 00:16:18,360 --> 00:16:21,840 Speaker 1: b Studio. They made massive, massive hit films and birth 265 00:16:22,160 --> 00:16:27,640 Speaker 1: stars like Katherine Hepburn, uh Fred Astaire Ginger, Rogers, Carry 266 00:16:27,680 --> 00:16:31,800 Speaker 1: Grant had you know, had um contracts with r KAO Pictures, 267 00:16:31,840 --> 00:16:34,600 Speaker 1: but then they went bust and we're you know, sitting 268 00:16:34,640 --> 00:16:37,520 Speaker 1: dormant for a while. Lucy and Desi bought the studio, 269 00:16:37,600 --> 00:16:42,160 Speaker 1: which was actually adjacent to the Paramount lot. And if 270 00:16:42,160 --> 00:16:45,800 Speaker 1: I'm not mistaken, Star Trek has been a Paramount property 271 00:16:46,160 --> 00:16:49,720 Speaker 1: since the since the word go ish right, No Max 272 00:16:49,760 --> 00:16:55,320 Speaker 1: has given us the hand kind of well, it's probably 273 00:16:55,320 --> 00:16:59,240 Speaker 1: one of those Spider Man versus the Marvel Universe kind 274 00:16:59,280 --> 00:17:03,760 Speaker 1: of I things. Star Trek has been in a situation ship, 275 00:17:04,240 --> 00:17:09,159 Speaker 1: an entanglement perhaps with Para. So so we're setting up 276 00:17:09,200 --> 00:17:14,680 Speaker 1: the story of Lucille Ball and taking over uh r 277 00:17:14,760 --> 00:17:19,040 Speaker 1: Kao's property to make their company, Desilu Productions. Get it, 278 00:17:19,200 --> 00:17:22,480 Speaker 1: Desi Lucille whether they think Lucy des didn't have the 279 00:17:22,520 --> 00:17:24,560 Speaker 1: same ring. And I think it's funny that the man 280 00:17:24,640 --> 00:17:28,320 Speaker 1: still gets to lead the little acorny in the little portmanteau. 281 00:17:28,520 --> 00:17:33,040 Speaker 1: Every relationship is a country all its own. So Lucille 282 00:17:33,160 --> 00:17:38,440 Speaker 1: Ball has an eye for talent. She can tell when 283 00:17:38,600 --> 00:17:42,560 Speaker 1: something might be a hit, so they produce in film 284 00:17:42,640 --> 00:17:45,840 Speaker 1: series like The Andy Griffith Show, which you will probably 285 00:17:45,880 --> 00:17:48,840 Speaker 1: remember more so than Mr Terrific, The Life and Legend 286 00:17:48,840 --> 00:17:52,280 Speaker 1: of wider and of course, the Dick Van Dyke Show. 287 00:17:52,800 --> 00:17:56,440 Speaker 1: After she and Desi break up, she eventually buys her 288 00:17:56,520 --> 00:18:00,280 Speaker 1: ex's share of the firm, making her not just a 289 00:18:00,280 --> 00:18:04,960 Speaker 1: powerful star, but the most powerful woman in television. And 290 00:18:05,119 --> 00:18:09,040 Speaker 1: she is in the catbird seat when NBC projects jeans 291 00:18:09,200 --> 00:18:14,280 Speaker 1: first pilot, the Cage. Uh Lucy Lucille Ball agrees to 292 00:18:14,880 --> 00:18:19,639 Speaker 1: finance the second project, even though everybody on her board 293 00:18:19,640 --> 00:18:22,200 Speaker 1: is say no, that's crazy. Can do you have any 294 00:18:22,240 --> 00:18:27,480 Speaker 1: idea how expensive it will be? And she says, uh yeah, 295 00:18:27,600 --> 00:18:30,080 Speaker 1: And I'm the most powerful woman in the television in 296 00:18:30,160 --> 00:18:34,600 Speaker 1: the game of television, so make it so. Make it so. Indeed, 297 00:18:34,800 --> 00:18:38,080 Speaker 1: Max was would um Lost in Space already have been 298 00:18:38,640 --> 00:18:41,280 Speaker 1: a minor hit at this point since it got picked 299 00:18:41,359 --> 00:18:45,639 Speaker 1: up in you know, in over Roddenberry's original pitch Um. 300 00:18:45,680 --> 00:18:48,199 Speaker 1: I'm guessing it's probably come an honor at the same time, 301 00:18:48,320 --> 00:18:50,719 Speaker 1: But but I don't think it was like sci fi 302 00:18:50,720 --> 00:18:54,480 Speaker 1: of this degree, wasn't like entrenched yet as some sort 303 00:18:54,520 --> 00:18:58,040 Speaker 1: of massive like cultural phenomenon. And in any way, it 304 00:18:58,119 --> 00:19:00,520 Speaker 1: was still kind of fringe e compared to the stuff 305 00:19:00,560 --> 00:19:03,240 Speaker 1: that the studios knew worked, like those westerns. Well, Outer 306 00:19:03,359 --> 00:19:07,720 Speaker 1: Limits was also very much sci fi, still lost in 307 00:19:07,840 --> 00:19:12,320 Speaker 1: spaces n So they did come out the year previous. 308 00:19:12,480 --> 00:19:15,440 Speaker 1: But there's a funny Lucia Ball story we should tell. 309 00:19:15,920 --> 00:19:21,359 Speaker 1: So while she's supporting making this thing, she originally thought 310 00:19:22,000 --> 00:19:26,239 Speaker 1: Star Trek was about traveling performers working for the U 311 00:19:26,400 --> 00:19:28,680 Speaker 1: s O. You know, the ones who like go out 312 00:19:28,840 --> 00:19:32,760 Speaker 1: during global conflicts and do a little vaudeville show. So 313 00:19:32,880 --> 00:19:35,119 Speaker 1: she was thinking of what would later be you know, 314 00:19:35,240 --> 00:19:38,880 Speaker 1: like Star Search or America's Got Talent. I do want 315 00:19:38,880 --> 00:19:41,600 Speaker 1: to say this on air because I know somebody, well, 316 00:19:41,640 --> 00:19:44,360 Speaker 1: we're not really sure about that. There are a couple accounts. 317 00:19:44,400 --> 00:19:48,080 Speaker 1: There's some people who say Lucile Ball was very involved 318 00:19:48,080 --> 00:19:49,840 Speaker 1: and like the day to day of Star Trek, and 319 00:19:49,840 --> 00:19:51,200 Speaker 1: there's some people who go all the way to the 320 00:19:51,240 --> 00:19:53,359 Speaker 1: other way and say, oh, she didn't know anything about 321 00:19:53,359 --> 00:19:56,120 Speaker 1: the show at all. I am going with this report 322 00:19:56,160 --> 00:19:59,160 Speaker 1: because this is from the guy who brought her Star 323 00:19:59,240 --> 00:20:02,120 Speaker 1: Trek M and was in there like on the day 324 00:20:02,119 --> 00:20:04,520 Speaker 1: to day, and this is what he said. She said, 325 00:20:04,720 --> 00:20:08,160 Speaker 1: So we're gonna go with that, all right, Guys, can 326 00:20:08,200 --> 00:20:10,159 Speaker 1: you imagine? I mean, you know, we know Lucy from 327 00:20:10,240 --> 00:20:13,919 Speaker 1: her persona as Lucay, you know, as Lucy on On 328 00:20:14,040 --> 00:20:16,840 Speaker 1: mc gilla cutty, you know on I love Lucy, but 329 00:20:16,960 --> 00:20:19,720 Speaker 1: I bet mean to be a woman of that stature 330 00:20:19,920 --> 00:20:23,000 Speaker 1: in such a boys club of Hollywood and this era, 331 00:20:23,359 --> 00:20:26,320 Speaker 1: she had to have been tough as nails and dan 332 00:20:26,480 --> 00:20:28,879 Speaker 1: suffer no fools. And when you look at pictures of 333 00:20:28,920 --> 00:20:31,719 Speaker 1: her like I R L you know, and also certain 334 00:20:31,880 --> 00:20:35,280 Speaker 1: dramatic kind of recreations of her this time, I would 335 00:20:35,280 --> 00:20:37,679 Speaker 1: be she she she comes off as a little bit scary. 336 00:20:38,200 --> 00:20:39,880 Speaker 1: Well you would, you would have to be. I mean, 337 00:20:39,920 --> 00:20:43,919 Speaker 1: there's probably so much there's so many traumatic experiences she 338 00:20:44,000 --> 00:20:47,560 Speaker 1: had to have that just haven't made it into history books. 339 00:20:47,800 --> 00:20:52,600 Speaker 1: But uh, but yeah, she persevered and weathered the storm, 340 00:20:52,760 --> 00:20:55,639 Speaker 1: and with a force like Lucille ball on your side, 341 00:20:56,040 --> 00:21:00,359 Speaker 1: making a second pilot seems a lot less crazy. They 342 00:21:00,400 --> 00:21:04,480 Speaker 1: recast almost everybody. Actually, the guy who would have played 343 00:21:05,200 --> 00:21:08,640 Speaker 1: the captain, the guy who played Captain Pike bows out 344 00:21:08,720 --> 00:21:10,919 Speaker 1: because he's worried the sci fi thing will be a 345 00:21:10,960 --> 00:21:16,399 Speaker 1: Fad Roddenberry cast this, uh, this guy from Canada who's 346 00:21:16,560 --> 00:21:18,199 Speaker 1: kind of an up and comer with a lot of 347 00:21:18,240 --> 00:21:21,920 Speaker 1: experience on on stage and screen. His name is William Shatner. 348 00:21:22,440 --> 00:21:28,600 Speaker 1: He becomes James T. Kirk and Roddenberry also makes it 349 00:21:28,720 --> 00:21:34,600 Speaker 1: very makes a priority to have this crew be international 350 00:21:34,880 --> 00:21:38,760 Speaker 1: in terms of their representation. You've got a chief engineer 351 00:21:38,920 --> 00:21:43,160 Speaker 1: who is cartoonishly from Scotland. You've got a helmsman who 352 00:21:43,240 --> 00:21:46,880 Speaker 1: is definitely from Japan, well famous George T. Cap. You've 353 00:21:46,920 --> 00:21:51,520 Speaker 1: got a you've got a communications chief who is African American. 354 00:21:51,960 --> 00:21:56,720 Speaker 1: This part, especially in the South, probably ruffled some feathers 355 00:21:56,760 --> 00:22:00,280 Speaker 1: because these people were working as equals. The old thing 356 00:22:00,320 --> 00:22:03,560 Speaker 1: that made them unequal was the hierarchy of a ship's crew. 357 00:22:03,960 --> 00:22:05,719 Speaker 1: I wouldn't be surprised to you. I mean if this 358 00:22:05,800 --> 00:22:10,560 Speaker 1: was a appealing part of the equation to Lucy as well, 359 00:22:10,920 --> 00:22:13,440 Speaker 1: who had been such a game changer in terms of 360 00:22:13,480 --> 00:22:17,720 Speaker 1: women's role in Hollywood, both behind and in front of 361 00:22:17,760 --> 00:22:19,879 Speaker 1: the camera, you know, I mean, I think this is 362 00:22:19,920 --> 00:22:22,760 Speaker 1: probably something that she maybe again, I mean, I'm just 363 00:22:22,800 --> 00:22:25,119 Speaker 1: conjecturing here. I'd love to read her her perspective on this. 364 00:22:25,160 --> 00:22:28,040 Speaker 1: I'm sure it exists, but it would appear that outside 365 00:22:28,080 --> 00:22:30,040 Speaker 1: as being a savvy business person who thought that they 366 00:22:30,040 --> 00:22:31,879 Speaker 1: could have a hit on their hands, that there's some 367 00:22:31,920 --> 00:22:34,399 Speaker 1: appeal here and like, let's let's let's push this further, 368 00:22:34,800 --> 00:22:37,040 Speaker 1: you know, let's um, let's have something that looks a 369 00:22:37,040 --> 00:22:39,320 Speaker 1: little different, people that look a little different, in a 370 00:22:39,359 --> 00:22:42,159 Speaker 1: show that also is a little different. But she kind 371 00:22:42,200 --> 00:22:46,120 Speaker 1: of saw the big picture and this was again crucial 372 00:22:46,160 --> 00:22:50,600 Speaker 1: to genius. He's casting up Deforce. Kelly plays the doctor. 373 00:22:51,040 --> 00:22:55,880 Speaker 1: He won't you constantly? Yeah, they do. He constantly. He's 374 00:22:55,880 --> 00:22:59,480 Speaker 1: the one who constantly establishes that he's a doctor and 375 00:22:59,560 --> 00:23:03,320 Speaker 1: not an expert in whatever thing is brought to him 376 00:23:03,359 --> 00:23:07,199 Speaker 1: at any given point. It's a trope, you know, Damnit, Jim, 377 00:23:07,240 --> 00:23:11,040 Speaker 1: I'm a doctor, not a horticulturist. Dammit, Jim, I'm a 378 00:23:11,440 --> 00:23:13,639 Speaker 1: you know even what he doesn't need to. It's just 379 00:23:13,680 --> 00:23:17,560 Speaker 1: a casual question. They're like, hey, are you going to uh? 380 00:23:17,600 --> 00:23:21,880 Speaker 1: Are you gonna make it to the cocktail party this 381 00:23:22,080 --> 00:23:25,119 Speaker 1: space afternoon. He's like, damnit, Jim, I'm a doctor, not 382 00:23:25,240 --> 00:23:30,200 Speaker 1: a calendar professor. You know. It's particularly myself here. Oh, 383 00:23:30,240 --> 00:23:32,320 Speaker 1: it's a great joke. It's I mean it's so much 384 00:23:32,359 --> 00:23:35,560 Speaker 1: that even when U D S nine did the Fans 385 00:23:35,600 --> 00:23:39,040 Speaker 1: Service Letter Trials and Tribulations episode, they have Dr. But 386 00:23:39,160 --> 00:23:43,560 Speaker 1: Schier say, I'm a doctor, not a historian. So okay, 387 00:23:43,560 --> 00:23:46,399 Speaker 1: now we get to one of my favorite characters, I 388 00:23:46,480 --> 00:23:51,679 Speaker 1: believe one of yours as well, Max, the half alien 389 00:23:51,920 --> 00:23:57,560 Speaker 1: member of the crew, Mr. Spock played by Leonard Nimoy Uh. 390 00:23:57,720 --> 00:24:03,040 Speaker 1: Spock is incredibly contra virtual to the studio. NBC really 391 00:24:03,160 --> 00:24:08,440 Speaker 1: wants to drop him because they say, look, this guy 392 00:24:08,520 --> 00:24:11,639 Speaker 1: looks kind of satanic. You know, he doesn't have a goatee, 393 00:24:11,680 --> 00:24:14,200 Speaker 1: but his eyebrows are doing a lot of work. He's 394 00:24:14,200 --> 00:24:19,280 Speaker 1: got pointy ears. And Roddenberry made this amazing rebuttal he 395 00:24:19,359 --> 00:24:21,960 Speaker 1: said quote, I felt like we couldn't do a space 396 00:24:22,000 --> 00:24:25,480 Speaker 1: show without at least one person on board who constantly 397 00:24:25,480 --> 00:24:28,560 Speaker 1: reminded you that you are out in space and in 398 00:24:28,680 --> 00:24:31,879 Speaker 1: a world of the future. It just occurred to me 399 00:24:31,960 --> 00:24:37,919 Speaker 1: that I think maybe his uh resemblance to founder of 400 00:24:37,960 --> 00:24:41,600 Speaker 1: the Church of Satan Anton LaVey might have had something 401 00:24:41,640 --> 00:24:44,280 Speaker 1: to do with this idea of him looking Satanic, because 402 00:24:44,320 --> 00:24:50,440 Speaker 1: LaVey was bald and also had mega pointy ears and um, 403 00:24:50,480 --> 00:24:54,360 Speaker 1: you know, kind of sharp pointy features and arched eyebrows, 404 00:24:54,440 --> 00:24:57,800 Speaker 1: you know. Uh, and I believe yeah it was it 405 00:24:57,880 --> 00:25:00,600 Speaker 1: was around the sixties or the late fifty is that 406 00:25:00,640 --> 00:25:03,200 Speaker 1: he would have been in the press as a figure 407 00:25:03,280 --> 00:25:07,919 Speaker 1: of some uh countercultural kind of controversy, along with folks 408 00:25:07,960 --> 00:25:11,960 Speaker 1: like Kenneth Anger ninety and not to mention Fritz Lieber 409 00:25:11,960 --> 00:25:17,159 Speaker 1: and so on. Nineteen sixty six, I think is around 410 00:25:17,200 --> 00:25:20,080 Speaker 1: the time that Levy starts doing lectures on the occult. 411 00:25:20,560 --> 00:25:23,639 Speaker 1: So this, yeah, there, there's definitely some stuff in the 412 00:25:23,720 --> 00:25:28,320 Speaker 1: zeitgeist here, uh NBC. Besides that, this is not the 413 00:25:28,400 --> 00:25:31,440 Speaker 1: hill they're gonna die on, so they let spak across 414 00:25:31,520 --> 00:25:35,199 Speaker 1: the past. But they said, but they literally say, you know, 415 00:25:35,800 --> 00:25:38,840 Speaker 1: kind of keep him in the background, like we will 416 00:25:39,000 --> 00:25:41,400 Speaker 1: let people be reminded there in space, but we don't 417 00:25:41,640 --> 00:25:43,720 Speaker 1: want to be in their face about it. Essentially. Yeah. 418 00:25:43,760 --> 00:25:47,560 Speaker 1: But but then once the spot character like just takes off, 419 00:25:47,640 --> 00:25:51,280 Speaker 1: they're like, spok it up, spark up front, give us 420 00:25:51,359 --> 00:25:54,280 Speaker 1: more spok let's lead into that Vulcan neck pinch or 421 00:25:54,400 --> 00:25:58,080 Speaker 1: whatever the hell it's called. Yeah, exactly. Also, just a 422 00:25:58,119 --> 00:26:00,560 Speaker 1: little bit of a silly trivia that we've talked about before. 423 00:26:00,560 --> 00:26:04,480 Speaker 1: There was a phenomenon cultural phenomenon. Uh that that is 424 00:26:04,600 --> 00:26:09,480 Speaker 1: relatively contemporary where people in Canada were drawing, um, exactly 425 00:26:09,480 --> 00:26:11,840 Speaker 1: what Max has on his head, this kind of like 426 00:26:11,960 --> 00:26:15,800 Speaker 1: you know, bang kind of straight cut bang thing and uh, 427 00:26:15,920 --> 00:26:19,440 Speaker 1: pointy ears and a little bit of a goatee thing 428 00:26:19,920 --> 00:26:24,040 Speaker 1: um and hand doing the fingers uh that live long 429 00:26:24,080 --> 00:26:27,640 Speaker 1: and prosper figures on their Canadian bank notes because the 430 00:26:27,680 --> 00:26:31,959 Speaker 1: former prime minister Wilfred Laurier looked a lot like spok 431 00:26:32,119 --> 00:26:35,200 Speaker 1: and they call it spaking um. And also the bank 432 00:26:35,240 --> 00:26:38,200 Speaker 1: apparently was against it. But because it's you know, technically 433 00:26:38,240 --> 00:26:42,720 Speaker 1: defacing money is like illegal, yes, yeah, and you can 434 00:26:42,800 --> 00:26:46,760 Speaker 1: see people doing that with doing similar things with Washington 435 00:26:46,960 --> 00:26:50,840 Speaker 1: on US currency. But this, yeah, this uh, this spot 436 00:26:50,920 --> 00:26:53,760 Speaker 1: guy is going to be a big deal. NBC is 437 00:26:54,160 --> 00:26:58,520 Speaker 1: wrong about it. And Max also you pointed out that 438 00:26:58,600 --> 00:27:01,560 Speaker 1: if you look at the first pile it which still 439 00:27:01,560 --> 00:27:04,240 Speaker 1: had Leonard Nimoy, and you look at the second pilot, 440 00:27:04,520 --> 00:27:10,080 Speaker 1: they definitely dialed back that quote unquote satanic look um. 441 00:27:10,119 --> 00:27:12,840 Speaker 1: And maybe they would have treated Nimoy better if they 442 00:27:12,840 --> 00:27:14,520 Speaker 1: had known that he was going to go on to 443 00:27:14,640 --> 00:27:18,919 Speaker 1: have an illustrious musical career. Thinking of the Ballad of 444 00:27:19,000 --> 00:27:22,120 Speaker 1: Bilbo Baggins, which have linked to the chat. It's uh, 445 00:27:22,200 --> 00:27:24,360 Speaker 1: I gave you the full album version, so maybe wait 446 00:27:24,440 --> 00:27:27,639 Speaker 1: till we're off the air. Also, you know, related to 447 00:27:27,720 --> 00:27:29,640 Speaker 1: the other show that Ben and I do together stuff 448 00:27:29,640 --> 00:27:31,720 Speaker 1: they don't want you to know. Leonard Nimoy became a 449 00:27:31,840 --> 00:27:37,680 Speaker 1: very famous kind of conspiracy unsolved mysteries type presenter with 450 00:27:38,000 --> 00:27:41,520 Speaker 1: in search of you know, starring Leonard Nimoy uh, famously 451 00:27:41,560 --> 00:27:46,119 Speaker 1: referenced in the Tenaceous Diesa referring to Leonard Nimoy kicking 452 00:27:46,119 --> 00:27:50,320 Speaker 1: out the jams and uh. That makes me think we 453 00:27:50,359 --> 00:27:52,880 Speaker 1: do a Nimoy episode in the future, or just Star 454 00:27:52,920 --> 00:27:56,719 Speaker 1: Trek music. I Actually it's weird because here's how much 455 00:27:56,760 --> 00:28:00,480 Speaker 1: of an effect this thing. As a slight sidebar doing 456 00:28:00,600 --> 00:28:05,159 Speaker 1: research for something else, I actually pinned Max looking for 457 00:28:05,440 --> 00:28:11,240 Speaker 1: scholarly papers uh from economists about the post scarcity economy 458 00:28:11,400 --> 00:28:14,520 Speaker 1: of Star Trek, and Maxwell follow up with you. I 459 00:28:14,800 --> 00:28:17,920 Speaker 1: gotta tell you this. It's a weird thing. But anyhow, 460 00:28:18,040 --> 00:28:20,879 Speaker 1: Star Trek we wouldn't be having any of these conversations 461 00:28:21,280 --> 00:28:32,280 Speaker 1: if everything hadn't worked out. Just so, the first episode 462 00:28:32,440 --> 00:28:37,159 Speaker 1: that ever hits the network is uh not the pilot 463 00:28:37,240 --> 00:28:41,280 Speaker 1: it's called the Man Trap. The crew encounters a vampire 464 00:28:41,600 --> 00:28:45,200 Speaker 1: esque alien, but instead of drinking blood, it drains bodies 465 00:28:45,200 --> 00:28:49,120 Speaker 1: of salt. Uh. This is a Thursday night, September eight, 466 00:28:49,520 --> 00:28:52,920 Speaker 1: and the other shows that are on at the time 467 00:28:53,400 --> 00:28:56,840 Speaker 1: are Bewitched, which is still, you know, kind of iconic 468 00:28:56,920 --> 00:29:04,320 Speaker 1: and My Three Sons. People didn't immediately like Star Trek, 469 00:29:04,400 --> 00:29:08,840 Speaker 1: at least the critics didn't. They said it was confusing, 470 00:29:08,960 --> 00:29:13,280 Speaker 1: it was too complex, it just didn't work, and uh, 471 00:29:13,520 --> 00:29:15,280 Speaker 1: ratings were good enough for the show to make it 472 00:29:15,280 --> 00:29:19,760 Speaker 1: to a second season, but just barely, you know what 473 00:29:19,800 --> 00:29:22,600 Speaker 1: I mean. It's almost like the first season was a 474 00:29:22,680 --> 00:29:25,560 Speaker 1: not good enough pilot in itself, so they said, we're 475 00:29:25,560 --> 00:29:29,080 Speaker 1: gonna keep trying. Yeah, there's a cool quote from Variety. 476 00:29:29,160 --> 00:29:31,400 Speaker 1: We're not being cool. It's just it's a very uh 477 00:29:31,440 --> 00:29:34,560 Speaker 1: summing up the perspective of the time quote from Variety saying, 478 00:29:34,600 --> 00:29:38,920 Speaker 1: Star Trek obviously solicits all out suspension of disbelief, but 479 00:29:39,040 --> 00:29:42,240 Speaker 1: it won't work, Um, because of the things that you 480 00:29:42,280 --> 00:29:44,520 Speaker 1: were saying. Even within the sci fi frame of reference, 481 00:29:44,680 --> 00:29:49,200 Speaker 1: it was an incredible and dreary mess of confusion and complexities. 482 00:29:49,400 --> 00:29:52,440 Speaker 1: And that is a criticism that maybe some people who 483 00:29:52,480 --> 00:29:55,880 Speaker 1: today don't get Star Trek might still throw at it. 484 00:29:56,080 --> 00:29:58,600 Speaker 1: You know, it does have a certain vibe to it 485 00:29:58,840 --> 00:30:01,680 Speaker 1: that you're either on board with or you're not, because 486 00:30:01,680 --> 00:30:03,680 Speaker 1: it isn't like really any other show. It kind of 487 00:30:03,720 --> 00:30:06,280 Speaker 1: sets its own tone. And if it's not for you, 488 00:30:06,360 --> 00:30:08,320 Speaker 1: if the pacing isn't for you, and if kind of 489 00:30:08,480 --> 00:30:11,480 Speaker 1: you know, some of the political undertones aren't for you, 490 00:30:11,880 --> 00:30:14,360 Speaker 1: then it just might not be your bag. But it 491 00:30:14,520 --> 00:30:17,520 Speaker 1: is the bag of plenty oh folks, as we know 492 00:30:18,080 --> 00:30:21,840 Speaker 1: it would eventually become. So apparently this was This was 493 00:30:21,920 --> 00:30:26,240 Speaker 1: right around NBC's decision the first time to cancel the show, 494 00:30:26,280 --> 00:30:29,480 Speaker 1: and this was announced in the middle of its second season, 495 00:30:30,480 --> 00:30:34,120 Speaker 1: and a lot of people were upset due to some 496 00:30:34,200 --> 00:30:38,320 Speaker 1: pragmatic concerns. If a show only runs for two seasons, 497 00:30:38,440 --> 00:30:42,360 Speaker 1: then it's highly unlikely that the network will bother to 498 00:30:42,440 --> 00:30:46,160 Speaker 1: air reruns, and so Star Trek would have become an 499 00:30:46,200 --> 00:30:51,840 Speaker 1: historical footnote. However, fans like sci fi writer Betty Joe 500 00:30:51,880 --> 00:30:56,880 Speaker 1: Tremble also called b Joe Uh, they gather to the cause. 501 00:30:57,960 --> 00:31:02,320 Speaker 1: Tremble later says it really annoyed me talking about the cancelation. 502 00:31:02,600 --> 00:31:05,000 Speaker 1: I think we had a moral prerogative not just to 503 00:31:05,040 --> 00:31:07,440 Speaker 1: save the show, but to let these networks know the 504 00:31:07,520 --> 00:31:12,400 Speaker 1: public have an opinion. So she and her husband John 505 00:31:13,040 --> 00:31:17,360 Speaker 1: create a campaign called Save Star Trek. It's this huge 506 00:31:18,160 --> 00:31:23,080 Speaker 1: letter writing effort the fan base that already considers this 507 00:31:23,160 --> 00:31:27,000 Speaker 1: occult classic. They're getting all the addresses from fan mail. 508 00:31:27,120 --> 00:31:32,440 Speaker 1: Even Gene Roddenberry, through like a shell of plausible deniability, 509 00:31:32,480 --> 00:31:36,680 Speaker 1: is chipping in so fans can get free postage stamps. 510 00:31:37,120 --> 00:31:41,360 Speaker 1: And there's this chain letter that goes around for anybody 511 00:31:41,520 --> 00:31:45,840 Speaker 1: who is not old enough to have experienced these. In 512 00:31:45,880 --> 00:31:49,080 Speaker 1: the days before, your crazy uncle would send you emails 513 00:31:49,120 --> 00:31:53,400 Speaker 1: that said forward forward, forward forward. Obama says Earth is 514 00:31:53,440 --> 00:31:57,720 Speaker 1: flat or whatever. People would send these letters that would say, 515 00:31:57,760 --> 00:32:00,560 Speaker 1: send a copy of this letter to x amount of 516 00:32:00,640 --> 00:32:04,200 Speaker 1: people right or you know, it'll give you instructions. It's 517 00:32:04,240 --> 00:32:08,280 Speaker 1: meant to go viral, and it gave These letters gave 518 00:32:08,320 --> 00:32:11,160 Speaker 1: people a step by step guide for how to write 519 00:32:11,200 --> 00:32:14,280 Speaker 1: to the network and what to say. As a result 520 00:32:14,320 --> 00:32:17,720 Speaker 1: of this, NBC gets more than one dred and ten 521 00:32:17,960 --> 00:32:23,120 Speaker 1: thousand letters individual letters from fans across the United States, 522 00:32:23,680 --> 00:32:27,240 Speaker 1: and we still don't know how many letters they got. 523 00:32:27,280 --> 00:32:30,840 Speaker 1: They may have received many more at least that's what 524 00:32:30,960 --> 00:32:34,840 Speaker 1: some former NBC folks say, but officially it's unclear, is 525 00:32:34,880 --> 00:32:38,160 Speaker 1: that right, Max? Yeah, I mean there is some reporting 526 00:32:38,280 --> 00:32:41,560 Speaker 1: that say it's in the millions of letters they got, 527 00:32:42,160 --> 00:32:46,680 Speaker 1: but it's like also um from off the record former 528 00:32:46,960 --> 00:32:53,120 Speaker 1: NBC employees, So it's like who actually knows. And there's 529 00:32:53,120 --> 00:32:57,400 Speaker 1: a lot uh involving this about Gene Rodber maybe doctoring 530 00:32:57,560 --> 00:33:01,320 Speaker 1: some of this stuff too. So because Gean was a writer, 531 00:33:01,880 --> 00:33:04,320 Speaker 1: maybe he wrote the protest letter that he had other 532 00:33:04,360 --> 00:33:07,920 Speaker 1: people copy. Uh, that's a conspiracy, but but we know 533 00:33:08,840 --> 00:33:11,959 Speaker 1: the real thing, the letter writing conspiracy or movement if 534 00:33:11,960 --> 00:33:14,960 Speaker 1: you want to call it that. Regardless how many actual 535 00:33:15,040 --> 00:33:19,760 Speaker 1: letters arrived, it did shake NBC because no one had 536 00:33:19,760 --> 00:33:22,640 Speaker 1: ever tried this at such a large scale as a 537 00:33:22,680 --> 00:33:28,680 Speaker 1: fan community, and because of this, Tremble is often referred 538 00:33:28,760 --> 00:33:31,840 Speaker 1: to in the Trekky community. Treky's are the fans of 539 00:33:31,840 --> 00:33:34,920 Speaker 1: Star Trek. She's often referred to as the woman who 540 00:33:35,120 --> 00:33:41,200 Speaker 1: saved Star Trek, but she says at the time people 541 00:33:42,400 --> 00:33:45,760 Speaker 1: thought she was an idiot. There were other things happening 542 00:33:45,800 --> 00:33:48,480 Speaker 1: in the world. Of course. The women's liberation movement was 543 00:33:48,520 --> 00:33:51,680 Speaker 1: in the forefront of the news. There were women speaking up. 544 00:33:51,840 --> 00:33:55,240 Speaker 1: There were people saying this must change. And then concurrently, 545 00:33:55,440 --> 00:33:59,000 Speaker 1: you know, or simultaneously there's another group of people led 546 00:33:59,000 --> 00:34:02,040 Speaker 1: by a woman who are save this weird TV show. 547 00:34:03,040 --> 00:34:07,280 Speaker 1: So they were questioning priorities. But again to the conversation 548 00:34:07,320 --> 00:34:12,000 Speaker 1: about how how hard lucile Ball had to be to 549 00:34:12,200 --> 00:34:16,880 Speaker 1: succeed in a predatory environment and a misogynistic one. B 550 00:34:17,120 --> 00:34:21,600 Speaker 1: Joe is managing to do some unprecedented stuff as a 551 00:34:21,640 --> 00:34:25,400 Speaker 1: female sci fi fan. You know, she's rallying the little people, 552 00:34:25,400 --> 00:34:29,320 Speaker 1: and despite that initial media skepticism, it worked. In March, 553 00:34:30,000 --> 00:34:35,160 Speaker 1: NBC said, okay, we're no longer going to cancel Star Trek. 554 00:34:35,280 --> 00:34:38,759 Speaker 1: There will be a season three. Yeah you can't be 555 00:34:38,840 --> 00:34:41,040 Speaker 1: the change. Yeah you wish to see in the world. 556 00:34:41,400 --> 00:34:44,080 Speaker 1: It can be done, especially you know, in this time 557 00:34:44,120 --> 00:34:46,960 Speaker 1: where you know, we look at like you know, change 558 00:34:47,040 --> 00:34:50,400 Speaker 1: dot Org petitions. It's kind of uh um, spitting in 559 00:34:50,440 --> 00:34:52,799 Speaker 1: the wind or whatever. You know, if if you can 560 00:34:52,800 --> 00:34:55,239 Speaker 1: feel a little bit daunting to go up against the 561 00:34:55,280 --> 00:34:58,040 Speaker 1: powers that be, this is a as maybe lower stakes 562 00:34:58,120 --> 00:35:00,120 Speaker 1: or something like this might seem it is a an 563 00:35:00,160 --> 00:35:04,719 Speaker 1: example of somebody being able to singlehandedly rally, you know, 564 00:35:04,920 --> 00:35:08,160 Speaker 1: enough people to get the attention of a much larger 565 00:35:08,239 --> 00:35:12,360 Speaker 1: entity and and make a positive change. Because Star Trek 566 00:35:12,760 --> 00:35:16,919 Speaker 1: was an important cultural institution, It created a lot of 567 00:35:17,480 --> 00:35:21,840 Speaker 1: changes in the way people perceive characters on television. It 568 00:35:21,960 --> 00:35:25,160 Speaker 1: gave a lot of opportunities to because of that multinational 569 00:35:25,239 --> 00:35:27,080 Speaker 1: kind of angle that we talked about. We're gonna get 570 00:35:27,120 --> 00:35:31,600 Speaker 1: to some specifics, uh in part two about how this 571 00:35:31,680 --> 00:35:34,400 Speaker 1: was such an important cultural moment and some of the 572 00:35:34,440 --> 00:35:37,799 Speaker 1: things that were being tackled on Star Trek, whether thematically 573 00:35:37,880 --> 00:35:41,640 Speaker 1: in episodes or just between the cast, were important. It 574 00:35:41,680 --> 00:35:45,360 Speaker 1: was important for representation, you know, on television during a 575 00:35:45,400 --> 00:35:49,160 Speaker 1: time when like women's liberation, um, and kind of you know, uh, 576 00:35:49,520 --> 00:35:52,279 Speaker 1: let's say, civil rights were really starting to be very 577 00:35:52,360 --> 00:35:55,200 Speaker 1: very front and center and very important. You know, pop 578 00:35:55,239 --> 00:35:58,920 Speaker 1: culture can help those kinds of causes. And we have 579 00:35:59,200 --> 00:36:03,160 Speaker 1: b Joe too for that, we really do. But they're 580 00:36:03,200 --> 00:36:06,880 Speaker 1: not out of the space woods yet, fellow ridiculous historians. 581 00:36:06,960 --> 00:36:11,640 Speaker 1: Because the show's budget is dramatically cut in the third season, 582 00:36:12,040 --> 00:36:16,640 Speaker 1: NBC is practicing what I would call malicious compliance. Roddenberry 583 00:36:17,520 --> 00:36:20,759 Speaker 1: is no longer, at least at this period. He's not 584 00:36:21,920 --> 00:36:25,000 Speaker 1: hands on show runner. He's stepping away from the day 585 00:36:25,040 --> 00:36:28,040 Speaker 1: to day stuff, and as a result, a lot of 586 00:36:28,040 --> 00:36:31,000 Speaker 1: people will tell you the quality of the show declines 587 00:36:31,120 --> 00:36:34,319 Speaker 1: in the third season, and by the end of season three, 588 00:36:34,360 --> 00:36:37,799 Speaker 1: everybody thinks the show is going to be canceled. The 589 00:36:37,840 --> 00:36:40,800 Speaker 1: fans come back out. Let's get the band back together, 590 00:36:40,920 --> 00:36:44,000 Speaker 1: Let's reunite the army of the little folk fighting the 591 00:36:44,040 --> 00:36:49,120 Speaker 1: studio exects. They even march outside of NBC's Burbank studios. 592 00:36:49,560 --> 00:36:53,400 Speaker 1: It doesn't work. February nineteen sixty nine, the network says 593 00:36:53,840 --> 00:36:58,560 Speaker 1: we're going to cancel the series after that final episode 594 00:36:58,760 --> 00:37:02,520 Speaker 1: runs in June. The final episode, turn About Intruder is 595 00:37:02,920 --> 00:37:07,279 Speaker 1: uh according to Our Residents star Trek critic both very 596 00:37:07,320 --> 00:37:11,480 Speaker 1: horrible and disgusting. Max has given thumbs downs. It is 597 00:37:11,520 --> 00:37:15,080 Speaker 1: the episode that establishes that in the distant future, women 598 00:37:15,120 --> 00:37:19,719 Speaker 1: cannot become captains, which they spend many, many, many many 599 00:37:19,760 --> 00:37:24,600 Speaker 1: subsequent seasons and shows undoing, including Voyage. You're making sure 600 00:37:24,680 --> 00:37:27,200 Speaker 1: like the main character in the Captain was a woman. 601 00:37:27,680 --> 00:37:30,160 Speaker 1: It's like, oh, this woman just goes insane because she 602 00:37:30,160 --> 00:37:34,360 Speaker 1: could not become a captain. It's like what, but okay, 603 00:37:34,440 --> 00:37:37,280 Speaker 1: so this seems like an ignominious end, right, You remember 604 00:37:37,320 --> 00:37:43,120 Speaker 1: the iconic opening opening monologue from Captain Kirk. They talked 605 00:37:43,160 --> 00:37:45,439 Speaker 1: about a five year mission. Now it looks like they're 606 00:37:45,440 --> 00:37:48,839 Speaker 1: not going to make it to five years. But there 607 00:37:48,960 --> 00:37:52,080 Speaker 1: is a very important victory that b Joe and the 608 00:37:52,120 --> 00:37:55,880 Speaker 1: fans earned. Since Star Trek got a third season, it 609 00:37:56,000 --> 00:37:59,480 Speaker 1: had enough episodes to go into syndication, and as we'll 610 00:37:59,520 --> 00:38:03,000 Speaker 1: see you part two of this series. That is a 611 00:38:03,040 --> 00:38:06,400 Speaker 1: game changer. For now. I mean, the time is just 612 00:38:06,480 --> 00:38:08,719 Speaker 1: flown by here and old. For now, I think we're 613 00:38:08,719 --> 00:38:12,719 Speaker 1: going to pause. Uh, we're gonna go away too. Was 614 00:38:12,760 --> 00:38:16,360 Speaker 1: it ten forward and forward? We're gonna We're gonna adjourn 615 00:38:16,480 --> 00:38:20,080 Speaker 1: to ten forward. Chatted up with Guy Nan, who, according 616 00:38:20,120 --> 00:38:22,840 Speaker 1: to the lore of Star Trek, must have been alive 617 00:38:23,120 --> 00:38:26,839 Speaker 1: at the time of the original series. Uh, we'll get 618 00:38:26,880 --> 00:38:29,560 Speaker 1: into that. We'll not get into it at all. I mean, 619 00:38:29,600 --> 00:38:32,319 Speaker 1: I mean that might be shown in a Star Trek 620 00:38:32,360 --> 00:38:37,080 Speaker 1: movie or something I'm not quite possibly maybe, Uh, but 621 00:38:37,239 --> 00:38:39,359 Speaker 1: for now, I want to say thank you, of course 622 00:38:39,400 --> 00:38:43,799 Speaker 1: to our super producer, research associate and Residents Spot cosplayer 623 00:38:44,400 --> 00:38:48,520 Speaker 1: Mr Max Williams. Thanks of course to Lucille Ball. I 624 00:38:48,520 --> 00:38:50,600 Speaker 1: bet a lot of folks didn't see that coming, but 625 00:38:50,760 --> 00:38:55,799 Speaker 1: thank you for I Love Lucy and also star Trek Indeed, 626 00:38:56,280 --> 00:38:58,839 Speaker 1: and of course thanks again to you Max for doing 627 00:38:58,880 --> 00:39:02,080 Speaker 1: this incredible research for excited to get right into part 628 00:39:02,280 --> 00:39:06,239 Speaker 1: two post haste. Also thanks to Chris Frosciota is here 629 00:39:06,239 --> 00:39:09,680 Speaker 1: in spirit heaves, Jeff Coates, Jonathan's stricklin time is nige 630 00:39:10,280 --> 00:39:15,080 Speaker 1: if not past nine agreed, uh he is our resident Kardassian, 631 00:39:15,560 --> 00:39:20,080 Speaker 1: not Kardashian. Sorry, sorry, strict. I'd also like to thank 632 00:39:20,120 --> 00:39:23,720 Speaker 1: Alex Williams for making this slap in pop and uh nool. 633 00:39:24,880 --> 00:39:28,360 Speaker 1: Thank you. It looks like we're on our continuing mission 634 00:39:29,000 --> 00:39:32,560 Speaker 1: to uh to explore history in the most ridiculous way possible, 635 00:39:32,600 --> 00:39:35,160 Speaker 1: and they couldn't be more excited. Samy here, my friend. 636 00:39:35,200 --> 00:39:44,279 Speaker 1: We'll see you next time. Books. For more podcasts from 637 00:39:44,280 --> 00:39:47,000 Speaker 1: my Heart Radio, visit the I Heart Radio app, Apple podcast, 638 00:39:47,160 --> 00:39:49,240 Speaker 1: or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.