Speaker 1: A warning.
Speaker 2: This episode contains depictions of violence and conversations about suicide
Speaker 2: that may be disturbing and triggering for some listeners. If
Speaker 2: you are struggling with suicidal thoughts, please fast forward to
Speaker 2: the end of this episode to find out where help
Speaker 2: is available. It's been almost three years since eighteen year
Speaker 2: old Anastasia Whitbolsfugen was brutally murdered in Lincoln Cemetery. There
Speaker 2: have been no arrests in the case. No one has
Speaker 2: been ruled out.
Speaker 3: Followings interviewer conducted on.
Speaker 4: September twenty first, two thousand, starting in approximately thirteen oh
Speaker 4: five hours.
Speaker 2: Then out of nowhere, a huge break in the case.
Speaker 2: Someone comes forward who says they know who killed Anastasia
Speaker 2: and they're ready to come clean. I'm Leah Rothman. This
Speaker 2: is the real killer. Episode five. We shouldn't talk about this.
Speaker 5: Station name Kelly Moffatt, date of birth.
Speaker 2: With the promise of immunity from prosecution, Kelly Moffatt, who
Speaker 2: went out the night of October twenty second, nineteen ninety
Speaker 2: seven with her boyfriend Byron Case, Anastasia, and Anastasia's boyfriend
Speaker 2: Justin Bruton, has now come forward to say she witnessed
Speaker 2: Anastasia's murder and she knows who pulled the trigger. Sergeant
Speaker 2: Gary Kilgore speaks with her at Mainstream Women's Center, a
Speaker 2: drug rehab facility where Kelly is doing inpatient treatment.
Speaker 3: I understand that.
Speaker 4: The times that you and I have previously talk that
Speaker 4: you were not entirely truthful with me.
Speaker 3: Yeah that is correct.
Speaker 5: Yeah, that's great, okay, and.
Speaker 4: You are now willing to be truthful with them.
Speaker 5: Yes.
Speaker 2: At the time of this interview, Kelly is seventeen, about
Speaker 2: one month shy of her eighteenth birthday. She was fifteen
Speaker 2: the night of Anastasia's death.
Speaker 3: Do you know how Anastasia died?
Speaker 5: Yes?
Speaker 3: Could you go ahead and tell me what it is?
Speaker 3: Did you know about them?
Speaker 5: Where? Should I start? Just anywhere? Anything? Well, I'll start
Speaker 5: with what I know, okay, because I'm not.
Speaker 2: Kelly begins with Justin and Anastasia's tumultuous relationship in early
Speaker 2: fall of nineteen ninety seven. She says, Anastasia had been
Speaker 2: living with Justin at his condo and they were fighting
Speaker 2: a lot. Kelly says about one week before Anastasia was murdered,
Speaker 2: Justin asked her to move out, so she moved back
Speaker 2: home with her dad.
Speaker 5: After that, she was kind of Justin was getting upset
Speaker 5: because she was calling him constantly and showing up at
Speaker 5: his apartment and everything. Him and Anastasia. Justin and Anastesia
Speaker 5: had had plans at one point because Justin's parents were
Speaker 5: so wealthy and he didn't get along with them, they
Speaker 5: were gonna go rob them, and that didn't work out.
Speaker 5: They had I guess they had it planned out or whatever.
Speaker 5: I never saw a weapon or anything.
Speaker 3: They tim robbed Justin's parents.
Speaker 5: Got no as far as I know, they decided to.
Speaker 5: They started to drive down there to told to Oklahoma
Speaker 5: to his parents' house, and they ended up kind of
Speaker 5: chickening out and turning around and coming back home.
Speaker 3: And when was this taking place, probably.
Speaker 5: I don't know, a couple of weeks before she died,
Speaker 5: before she moved out anyway, so that was kind of
Speaker 5: when Justin's weird plans for things like started.
Speaker 3: Did they discussing any of these?
Speaker 2: The conversation then turns to October twenty second, nineteen ninety seven,
Speaker 2: the last day Anastasia was seen alive. Kelly says, after school,
Speaker 2: Byron and Justin picked her up, and I just figured.
Speaker 5: It was like a normal day, like we were gonna
Speaker 5: go hang out. When I got in the car with them,
Speaker 5: they asked me if I would help them with something
Speaker 5: and I was like, well what, And Justin's like, well,
Speaker 5: you know, I've been having like a really hard time.
Speaker 5: And he goes, who's the person who's like the biggest
Speaker 5: pain in my ass right now? So I said your
Speaker 5: parents and he was like, no, they're in Tulsa. You know,
Speaker 5: they're not that big of a problem. So I was
Speaker 5: like in Anastasia and he goes, yes, and he said,
Speaker 5: wouldn't my life be a lot easier? She wasn't like around.
Speaker 5: So that's how like all that talk started.
Speaker 3: And where were you when this convers SAFETI was taking
Speaker 3: close in the.
Speaker 5: Car with them, driving around j They come and picked
Speaker 5: me up, Yeah, in Justin's car.
Speaker 3: Then did night just driving around talking about this.
Speaker 6: HM.
Speaker 5: Well they He was saying all this as we were
Speaker 5: on the way to a gas station where they wanted
Speaker 5: me to call her and ask her to meet her
Speaker 5: d meet them at Dairy Queen. But she knew that
Speaker 5: all it was all three of us, And when I
Speaker 5: called her, you know, they said that they he was
Speaker 5: going to get her out there and break up with
Speaker 5: her and all this, and.
Speaker 3: You called Anna sty Yes I did from where.
Speaker 5: From the kick sixty sixth uh gas station in Lennoxa, Kansas.
Speaker 5: And about what time is between four and five?
Speaker 4: I'd say, okay, So in your conversation with Anna stage.
Speaker 3: Or was what it was?
Speaker 5: Just it wasn't long. I just called her and said,
Speaker 5: did uh Firen and Justine they were going to meetup
Speaker 5: with day And She's like, yeah, where am I supposed
Speaker 5: to meet you guys? And I just said the dairy queen?
Speaker 3: Mkay? So she had already You've made arrangement?
Speaker 5: Yeah, I guess sh she'd talk to 'em on the
Speaker 5: phone or earlier that day, but I'm pretty sure they
Speaker 5: were like wanted me to make the phone call probably,
Speaker 5: you know. So she told somebody, yeah, Kelly called, were
Speaker 5: going to go meet up a dairy queen something like that,
Speaker 5: because what were heppened? Okay? And so after that they
Speaker 5: were talking about how he did They did say that
Speaker 5: they were going to shoot her?
Speaker 3: Just sh how did they come out? Uh? I mean,
Speaker 3: are you sitting.
Speaker 4: There listening to t two people playing a a a murder?
Speaker 3: Do you have questions though.
Speaker 5: Yeah, basically I was like, what did you say or
Speaker 5: you know, I said, well, I didn't really think that
Speaker 5: they were gonna do it, because, like I said, the
Speaker 5: whole robbery thing and stuff before. But it was just
Speaker 5: kind of him saying, you know that he was just well,
Speaker 5: Justin was really depressed anyway, him just saying that everything
Speaker 5: would be a lot easier if she was like out
Speaker 5: of the way and all this. And it was also
Speaker 5: they kind of had like Justin had always said that
Speaker 5: he just kind of wanted to kill somebody just to
Speaker 5: I guess to have done it in his lifetime or
Speaker 5: something like that, and Buyer and agreed to it, you know, to.
Speaker 4: Killing somebody or specifically killing Anastasia.
Speaker 5: I heard him talk about like kind of having like
Speaker 5: the morbid curiosity of one because when he before, but
Speaker 5: this time it was specifically her. Mkay.
Speaker 4: And you said when they were talking about this, you
Speaker 4: said what, I.
Speaker 5: Was like, you guys are you guys are not? So
Speaker 5: I was like, you were really not gonna do this?
Speaker 5: And it was just so stupid because it was broad daylight,
Speaker 5: I'd just gotten off school. It was like a week
Speaker 5: day and everything. I was like, you guys, don't even
Speaker 5: I mean, it just seemed ridiculous, you know. And also
Speaker 5: they had when I got in the car, they had
Speaker 5: a bottle of Jack Daniels. So they've been drinking and
Speaker 5: they've been just kind of brooding with each other all day.
Speaker 5: I guess about this or just about something anything.
Speaker 3: Did you see a weapon?
Speaker 5: Uh?
Speaker 3: Uh No, did you ever see a weapon?
Speaker 5: The only weapon I ever saw was I knew at
Speaker 5: Byron's dad's house that I didn't think Justin never had
Speaker 5: one or anything, but I knew at Byron's dad's house
Speaker 5: there was like a hunting rifle or like a shotgun
Speaker 5: of some sort that was up on the wall at
Speaker 5: his dad's house.
Speaker 4: Okay, Uh, if your memory serves me right, when you
Speaker 4: and I talked in the past, you told me about
Speaker 4: a shotgun that Justin out.
Speaker 5: They just knowaned now that must have just been part
Speaker 5: of the story cause of Holly, I never saw having one.
Speaker 4: So uh, it's telling me about the shotgun in the
Speaker 4: past and what you saw.
Speaker 3: Kah, Yeah, Why did you tell me that?
Speaker 5: Because at that point in time, me and Byron thought
Speaker 5: it would just be easier if somebody thought, you know,
Speaker 5: Justin had done it. And since they they had told
Speaker 5: me that they had him on camera buying the shotgun,
Speaker 5: and I kind of went along with it.
Speaker 2: Okay, Okay, Now this is interesting because remember investigators have
Speaker 2: the firearms transaction record for the shotgun Justin purchased in
Speaker 2: September of nineteen ninety seven, just weeks before the murder,
Speaker 2: so that gun did at one point exist.
Speaker 4: Okay, okay, So you're still in the car and they're
Speaker 4: talking about the Yeah, Anastasia and I need more conversation
Speaker 4: about that.
Speaker 5: But Justin was saying that they were talking about, you know,
Speaker 5: who was actually going to do it, and Justin said
Speaker 5: he didn't think that he could actually do it, so
Speaker 5: he asked. Justin was all, it was just weird, you know,
Speaker 5: he was going to do over there he wasn't and
Speaker 5: he asked Byron if he would do it. And also
Speaker 5: cause I don't think Jodin had ever saw a shot
Speaker 5: gun or anything before. So they decided that, uh, Byron
Speaker 5: was gonna do it. And then I just thought, you know,
Speaker 5: that was ridiculous, cause what Byron even had to do
Speaker 5: with it. You know, he knew in the stage that
Speaker 5: he went to high school with her and everything, but it.
Speaker 3: Just seemed, you know, okay, did they talk about how
Speaker 3: they were gonna do?
Speaker 5: They just they said that they had the gun in
Speaker 5: the trunk. I mean he was gonna pop the true shooter,
Speaker 5: but they didn't.
Speaker 3: Who did you hear say that?
Speaker 5: Byron said it? I said, well, how the hell are
Speaker 5: you even gonna do this? I was like, it's froad daylight.
Speaker 5: He's like, well, I don't think it would take very
Speaker 5: long and it's in the trunk. And I was like,
Speaker 5: you know, you don't even how do you even know
Speaker 5: how to shoot a gun or anything? And he's like, well,
Speaker 5: I used to go like hunting with my dad or
Speaker 5: something like that. So I'm not sure like how that happened.
Speaker 5: We ended, We drove out to go get her, picked
Speaker 5: her up. You know, she got in the car.
Speaker 3: You drove out to where to the dairy Queen.
Speaker 5: I don't know which road it was on, but the
Speaker 5: one across the street from Mount Washington.
Speaker 3: Do you uh remember about what time?
Speaker 5: Yes?
Speaker 3: Nay, hum, not really, I don't know. Okay, when you
Speaker 3: arrived at the dry queen? What did you guys do
Speaker 3: She just got in the car. Do you remember what
Speaker 3: she was wearing?
Speaker 5: No? Anymore, I know I'm sure probably just seems in
Speaker 5: like a T shirt or sweat shit, that's usually what
Speaker 5: she wore. I don't say.
Speaker 4: So, you guys are parked out the Dry Queen parking
Speaker 4: lot and uh, Anastasia gets in the car.
Speaker 3: Where was everybody's dating?
Speaker 2: Kelly says. Justin was in the driver's seat. Anna Stesia
Speaker 2: was in the front passenger seat. Kelly was sitting behind Anastasia,
Speaker 2: and Byron was sitting behind Justin conversation.
Speaker 3: Uh what was said?
Speaker 5: Just you know, she gets in the car, small talk
Speaker 5: all this stuff, and she was abating. She was like, Justin,
Speaker 5: you're late, You're always late on the We were just
Speaker 5: kind of uh. Then Justin said that he need to
Speaker 5: talk and everything would drive across the street to Mount
Speaker 5: Washington Cemetery cause I think they they used to go
Speaker 5: out there. I'd only been out there with him like
Speaker 5: once or twice. Then Anna Stezia was kind of up
Speaker 5: because he's like, I need to talk to you, and
Speaker 5: she's like, well, then why'd you bring them? You know,
Speaker 5: She's like sh She was kind of like embarrassed that
Speaker 5: he wanted to talk about their relationship in front. I
Speaker 5: guess of uh, me and Byron. So we're driving around.
Speaker 5: She's kind of driving aimlessly. It was like they had
Speaker 5: they had no spot, they knew where they were gonna
Speaker 5: do this or anything. Now this is not watching. Yes,
Speaker 5: we're start watching the cemetery. So we're driving around. They're
Speaker 5: kind of bickering and stuff the whole way. Me and
Speaker 5: Byron are standing in the back of the car drinking,
Speaker 5: and I don't know how long we drove around in there,
Speaker 5: and so finally I got we exited the cemetery. But
Speaker 5: uh huh.
Speaker 4: Before you exited the cemetery, did you come into contact
Speaker 4: with anybody?
Speaker 5: I think we saw the grounds keep a guy like
Speaker 5: in his car or something. I don't remember really.
Speaker 3: Any anybody get out of the car.
Speaker 5: I don't think so.
Speaker 3: Even briefly.
Speaker 5: I th actually I think maybe Jocelyn and a stage
Speaker 5: I got up for a little bit. You remember where
Speaker 5: it was that It was at a mausoleum of some
Speaker 5: sort something. I think they got I think I can't remember. Well,
Speaker 5: I mean it was just briefly got out of the car,
Speaker 5: just kind of walked around a little bit, but didn't
Speaker 5: It was like out of the car, kind of got out,
Speaker 5: looked around while I kind of.
Speaker 3: A little bit got back, so they were out of
Speaker 3: the car for a few minutes.
Speaker 5: Yeah.
Speaker 4: Human, And did you and uh Byron have any conversation
Speaker 4: while they were out.
Speaker 5: Of the car. No, not really. Well, I was just like,
Speaker 5: you know, this is ridiculous, blah blah blah. You know,
Speaker 5: you guys aren't really gonna do this. I ask if
Speaker 5: they had like planned it for a while. He said
Speaker 5: that they'd been like talking about it, and I was
Speaker 5: just like, well, I was like, hopefully, you know, they'll
Speaker 5: just break up and it'll be over. So but I
Speaker 5: can't really remember like exact conversation about it.
Speaker 4: Well, prior to that particular day, did you know anything
Speaker 4: about them talking.
Speaker 3: About doing thathing?
Speaker 5: No? They always kind of had rich schemes and stuff
Speaker 5: like that. That's why it seemed so ridiculous, cause it was
Speaker 5: just like it came out of nowhere, mkay for this, cause,
Speaker 5: like I said, probably just a week or two prior
Speaker 5: to that, Justin's little thing, and then that they.
Speaker 4: Were in Rock's parent Okay, So, uh, they did get
Speaker 4: back in the car and you exited, they.
Speaker 3: Yeah, Mount Washington Cemetery. Where'd you go from there?
Speaker 5: They were just driving around kind of looking for a
Speaker 5: park or some of a place where they could talk
Speaker 5: or whatever. But I mean it was still light out,
Speaker 5: I basically and everything, and somehow they ended up in
Speaker 5: the little cemetery where she was shot. I don't really
Speaker 5: quite remember where it was and everything. I guess it
Speaker 5: was kind of like Justin and Baron kind of looked
Speaker 5: at each other when they pulled them there. I guess
Speaker 5: it was like but it was still ripe pace.
Speaker 4: Did they go anywhere else before you got to bat location?
Speaker 5: I don't think so.
Speaker 3: Mkay, you don't think so.
Speaker 5: I don't. Uh, I don't really recall. I mean, I
Speaker 5: think they were just kind of driving to a park.
Speaker 3: Didn't go to anybody's house.
Speaker 4: No, So they were just a constant just driving or yeah,
Speaker 4: looking until you get to this point.
Speaker 3: Yeah, what's Lincoln? The cemetery was where.
Speaker 5: She was sho Okay, yeah, then we got there.
Speaker 4: Okay, do you remember which uh you'd you pulled into
Speaker 4: her from to get into the mm cemetery and you
Speaker 4: know the streets that bordered Lincoln Cemetery?
Speaker 5: Mm mm no, I don't. I think it was a
Speaker 5: it was a back entrance to it.
Speaker 3: Sumhow could you describe that too?
Speaker 5: No, not really.
Speaker 3: I mean it was it uh on a hill? Was
Speaker 3: it straight away?
Speaker 5: I just curved with uh you know, No, I think
Speaker 5: it was cause I we didn't.
Speaker 3: I don't think.
Speaker 5: I don't think we got to it from main Street.
Speaker 5: I think it was like through some gravel thing or something.
Speaker 5: By last year, i'd probably have to see place first
Speaker 5: to see which lake, cause I haven't. I mean I
Speaker 5: went back there once because I knew there was a
Speaker 5: little bit more. I don't think for her there, but that's.
Speaker 4: It, okay, send Uh So you eventually stopped then at
Speaker 4: a n location in Lincoln, seb.
Speaker 3: Yeah, what happened.
Speaker 5: Justin and I stays I got out of the cart
Speaker 5: of talk, you know, like once again they got out
Speaker 5: and they were kind of over on like the driver's side,
Speaker 5: seeing they're talking, just like yelling at each other. Yeah,
Speaker 5: so me and bron are kind of still sitting in
Speaker 5: the back like during well at least I was. I
Speaker 5: was just sick the drinking, kind of just like listening
Speaker 5: to him and yell at each other and everything like that.
Speaker 3: Was it still light or dark?
Speaker 5: I think it was starting to get dark. I don't think.
Speaker 5: I mean, it wasn't like pitch flack. But I know
Speaker 5: it wasn't cr It wasn't like complete daylight, cause I
Speaker 5: remember I think I remember seeing headline and stuff with
Speaker 5: cars like passing on the street or by there. So
Speaker 5: they're out of the car talking fighting or whatever, and.
Speaker 3: Uh, could you hear anything being said.
Speaker 5: Yeah, it was just basically her telling him to bug off,
Speaker 5: just like an argument earlier in the car. She'd taken
Speaker 5: off this ring he gave her and threw it at
Speaker 5: him and all this stuff, and he was just telling
Speaker 5: her to like calm down, and she was just you know,
Speaker 5: telling him. She's like, I can't believe you're not emotional
Speaker 5: about those just that kind of stuff.
Speaker 3: Do you know what happened to that ring? Mmm?
Speaker 5: Great. So we're just sitting back there and Byron tells
Speaker 5: me to stay in the car, and he got out
Speaker 5: of the car. He pushed justin c for it or
Speaker 5: got out, and so he gets out of the car.
Speaker 5: That's all happened in a matter probably I don't know,
Speaker 5: like thirty seconds. It was really quickly. He got out
Speaker 5: of the car and I saw him go around to
Speaker 5: the back of the trunk and I could hear Justin
Speaker 5: yelling at him in German saying what saying like never mind,
Speaker 5: never mind?
Speaker 3: Okay, uh stop say that in German.
Speaker 5: No. But I mean at the time I was in
Speaker 5: that's what cause. Okay, but you'll figure out how I
Speaker 5: knew that what he was saying.
Speaker 3: I that's what I'm to figure out.
Speaker 5: Yeah, when he got back in the car after well,
Speaker 5: okay here, so he's saying like stop, he's saying that
Speaker 5: in English and he's saying never mind like in German.
Speaker 5: But Byron, I guess was fokes on what he was
Speaker 5: doing or whatever. When he had gotten out of the car,
Speaker 5: the keys were in the ignission, so he'd like grab
Speaker 5: the keys. I could hear'em, you know, like open the
Speaker 5: trunk and got out the gun and shot her.
Speaker 2: Kelly Moffatt just told Sergeant Kilgore. On the night of
Speaker 2: October twenty second, nineteen ninety seven, she witnessed her then
Speaker 2: boyfriend Byron Case shoot her friend Anastasia Whitfelsfugen close to
Speaker 2: the car.
Speaker 5: I like saw hoping that happened, and the whole time
Speaker 5: Justin was yelling at her exactly. I saw him get
Speaker 5: the gun out, just go do a little I don't
Speaker 5: know what he did, just the whole.
Speaker 3: Tell me what you think he did. What did you hear?
Speaker 5: Well, I don't think I don't think I heard that
Speaker 5: little because they were still talking so much. I don't
Speaker 5: think he did the little the little teaching thing. But
Speaker 5: I don't I don't think he did that. I just
Speaker 5: thowting with it.
Speaker 3: Were you describing to me as like a pump shotgun?
Speaker 5: No, I'm not sure if he did that. I saw
Speaker 5: him kind of filling with it for a couple seconds,
Speaker 5: but it he just like grabbed it out and walked
Speaker 5: down the side of the car. I think it was
Speaker 5: double barreled though, cause it looked like an old gun.
Speaker 3: Which side of the car we him or me?
Speaker 5: Where?
Speaker 3: Uh?
Speaker 4: Just then then Anastas or they were on the h
Speaker 4: driver's side of the driver's side, say like.
Speaker 5: Here's the back of the car. All he had to
Speaker 5: do he got out, got it and then went cause
Speaker 5: they were still pretty close to the car. Okay, And
Speaker 5: it just all happened in a matter of seconds. He
Speaker 5: just lifted it up and shot.
Speaker 3: Her, just lifted it up and shot. Where'd you shoot
Speaker 3: her at?
Speaker 5: Just in the head?
Speaker 3: Kay?
Speaker 5: Did you see pretty close to the car.
Speaker 3: Did you see her fall down?
Speaker 5: Yeah, how did she fall? It fell back? Well, it
Speaker 5: was like kind of like an explosion, you know, it
Speaker 5: just I mean, it just knocked her backwards, the whole thing, Okay,
Speaker 5: and really quickly by and just like threw that thing
Speaker 5: in the the gun in the trunk again, you know,
Speaker 5: like opened it up through it in there was like.
Speaker 3: Did you see her fall to the ground?
Speaker 5: Yes?
Speaker 3: And what position did she fall in?
Speaker 5: I don't know, cause I remember I looked at that
Speaker 5: and then just kind of, you know, obviously sawed. I
Speaker 5: like screamed and kind of looked away, and then I
Speaker 5: looked back and I couldn't really she was just I
Speaker 5: think she was on her back just like that. I'm
Speaker 5: pretty sure it locked her backwards cause I just remember
Speaker 5: kind of seeing her body on the ground like that.
Speaker 3: Kay, And uh then what happened then?
Speaker 5: Justin like freaked out. He was like, oh my god,
Speaker 5: Oh my god. And they got in the car, you know,
Speaker 5: Barne's like getting in the car, getting the cars ruled.
Speaker 5: Like I said, we're right by a street and everything.
Speaker 5: We jump in.
Speaker 3: Can you say we jump No?
Speaker 5: I was in the car. No I didn't. I'm' just
Speaker 5: say they did it up time, Okay, So they get
Speaker 5: into the car and and then I said it all
Speaker 5: happened in like a matter of seconds.
Speaker 3: What uh who was driving? Justin was trying okay, and
Speaker 3: where did Byron? Where did he sit.
Speaker 5: In the front passenger's seat? Okay, So they get in
Speaker 5: the car and Justin drives off, and Justin's like, that's
Speaker 5: how I knew what he said in German. He was
Speaker 5: kind of freaking out. He was like, oh my god,
Speaker 5: oh my god, he goes. Didn't you hear me telling
Speaker 5: you to never mind? To stop and everything like that?
Speaker 5: As Byron said, He's like no, He's like, I was
Speaker 5: concentrated on that. He goes, and once you know, I
Speaker 5: got out of the car, He's like, what else was
Speaker 5: I supposed to do? Cause you'd already you know, got
Speaker 5: a gun out or whatever. He's like, what was I
Speaker 5: supposed to do? And Justin was just like flipped out
Speaker 5: the whole time, like he was driving. Eventually he went
Speaker 5: to some I don't know if it was pre planned
Speaker 5: or not. It didn't really seem like it. He just
Speaker 5: drove up to some railroad tracks and uh, Byrone got
Speaker 5: out and.
Speaker 7: Threw the gun.
Speaker 3: How far away from the cemetery?
Speaker 5: I don't know. I don't think it was very far.
Speaker 3: Do you remember what street?
Speaker 2: Hm?
Speaker 5: If I I would probably remember that on remember what street?
Speaker 5: So when they did that, when he threw the gun
Speaker 5: out and everything, Justin was like so shaken up and
Speaker 5: everything that Byron drove and he drove back to Justin's condo,
Speaker 5: and I remember just because Byron seemed to really calm
Speaker 5: about I remember Justin saying, he goes, I don't understand
Speaker 5: how you seem so calm about this. It's like you
Speaker 5: had like two brains to like put it in, because
Speaker 5: he was just we were just in like this, and
Speaker 5: Byron kind of seems normal, you know, he could drive
Speaker 5: and everything. So got back to Justin's condo.
Speaker 2: Kelly says, at Justin's condo they came up with the story.
Speaker 2: They will eventually tell everybody that Anastasia got out of
Speaker 2: the car at Truman Road and the I four thirty five.
Speaker 2: Kelly says that Byron was the one leading the narrative
Speaker 2: because Justin was almost incoherent.
Speaker 1: He was so shaken up.
Speaker 5: For a little bit and everything, and you know, like
Speaker 5: you are you He kept repeating the thing over and
Speaker 5: over again because they knew that people were obviously going
Speaker 5: to be questioned, and so finally it was getting pretty late,
Speaker 5: and you know, they didn't want it to seem like
Speaker 5: anything weird it happen. I had to be home between
Speaker 5: like ninety nine thirty, so drove back to my house
Speaker 5: and went inside, and Justin asked to use the phone
Speaker 5: because Barne was like, well, what are we going to say?
Speaker 5: You know happened to her and all that, you know,
Speaker 5: how we're gonna he had to contact somebody. So they
Speaker 5: came in and Justin used my phone and called her house.
Speaker 5: I don't know who he talked to though, and told
Speaker 5: her sister the story that they've made up that she
Speaker 5: got out of the car and everything, and Byron made
Speaker 5: it a point to in front of my mom say yeah,
Speaker 5: you know, Anna Stasia jumped out of the car and everything.
Speaker 5: I guess made it more like believable.
Speaker 2: And they left and I didn't Kelly says Byron, and
Speaker 2: Justin left soon after, and late that night she spoke
Speaker 2: with Byron again.
Speaker 5: And I don't know, Byron just didn't seem very pricked
Speaker 5: out about the whole thing. It was like he didn't
Speaker 5: really I don't think he really understood how great doubt.
Speaker 4: You know, Justin was when you were talking to the
Speaker 4: Byron later that night, did you.
Speaker 3: Ask him anything like how could you?
Speaker 5: Yeah, exact yeah. I was like, well how did you
Speaker 5: you know, how could you do that? Or whatever? And
Speaker 5: I was like, there's really there was like no reason
Speaker 5: for it. And he was like, well, you know, once
Speaker 5: I got the gun out, there was like turning back
Speaker 5: and everything. And I was like, well, why you know
Speaker 5: did it happen in the first place? And he goes, well,
Speaker 5: Justin asked me to do it, and you know, because
Speaker 5: he couldn't do it. He goes, and he shouldn't have
Speaker 5: asked me to do it if like he didn't want
Speaker 5: it to be done basically, and so and that's why
Speaker 5: I said. I go, well, you do realize that this
Speaker 5: makes you like a murderer. And I remember exactly what
Speaker 5: he said. He goes, no, he goes, I think a
Speaker 5: murder of someone who doesn't feel bad about like what
Speaker 5: they did. He's like, well, I feel bad, but it
Speaker 5: already happened.
Speaker 2: So kil Gore turns over the tape. Kelly says the
Speaker 2: next time she spoke with Byron was the following day, Thursday,
Speaker 2: after she got back from her grandmother's house.
Speaker 4: And you came out and talk to me first time.
Speaker 4: I believe that was on the following Friday. Okay, so
Speaker 4: you talked to Byron on Thursday, and did you talk about.
Speaker 5: Just Well, obviously, you know, that was the focus of
Speaker 5: the conversation. I remember him talking about that they couldn't
Speaker 5: find Justin, like he'd called there and he wasn't there,
Speaker 5: everything like that. Just you know, I was like, you know,
Speaker 5: freaked out, what are we gonna do? You know, where
Speaker 5: to Justin and all this? And then I obviously asked him,
Speaker 5: I was like, had you guys been planning this and everything? Friend?
Speaker 5: He said yeah, And I said, well, why did you,
Speaker 5: you know, bring me into this and all this?
Speaker 3: And he's like, well, I.
Speaker 5: Guess we needed somebody to call her, and cause you
Speaker 5: know I didn't, I was like, well, why'd you bring
Speaker 5: I was kind of, you know, like bad, like, why'd
Speaker 5: you bring me into this and everything?
Speaker 4: Did you guys go over, uh the story that you
Speaker 4: were gonna tell the police?
Speaker 5: Yeah? He had. Yeah, he was like talking about that
Speaker 5: like quite a bit. Now.
Speaker 3: You and I went out the few days later and.
Speaker 4: And uh, you know, we discussed the circumstances there and
Speaker 4: the events that it happened.
Speaker 3: Did you and your mother went with me and I.
Speaker 4: Asked you to show me the path and the route
Speaker 4: that you guys would taken. Did you uh seemed pretty
Speaker 4: uh sure of yourself when you were telling me where.
Speaker 3: To go and what you guys did. Did you uh
Speaker 3: go over that with Byron? Also?
Speaker 5: Yeah, Byron when he had said, cause I don't know
Speaker 5: independence at all, when he said that she was, you know,
Speaker 5: where she got out of the car and every thing
Speaker 5: like that, I believe I think it was the next
Speaker 5: day or the day after, you know, when he obviously
Speaker 5: knew that we're gonna have to talk to you guys.
Speaker 5: He took me out there to the spot He's like,
Speaker 5: a miss, is where you know you're gonna say that
Speaker 5: she got out of the car, which was at that
Speaker 5: stop light?
Speaker 3: Okay, it would have been at Truman in four thirty five.
Speaker 4: I believe when you and I talked the first time
Speaker 4: on Friday, you drove me, drew me out of a little
Speaker 4: mass You recall doing that, yeah, and so then move
Speaker 4: Byron drove you around.
Speaker 5: She drove me out there saying, you know, this is
Speaker 5: where we're gonna say she got out because I was
Speaker 5: that was He was like worried about that because I
Speaker 5: didn't know, you know, where we were, where we'd gone.
Speaker 5: Whose car were you when he drove out there?
Speaker 3: I believe you know what kind of car it was.
Speaker 2: Tilgore circles back to the shooting and asks Kelly to
Speaker 2: show him, specifically the position of Justin's car at Lincoln Cemetery.
Speaker 2: Although it's not set out loud, it sounds like Kelly
Speaker 2: is drawing a map for him.
Speaker 5: See, they wasn't that far from the road. Probably the
Speaker 5: road was like here, do want me to show where?
Speaker 5: Like the people are?
Speaker 3: Sure?
Speaker 5: Okay, okay, so that's I'm like the back passenger seat
Speaker 5: at first, bron was obviously sitting there. Justin and Anastagia
Speaker 5: got out. They weren't very far from the car. Let's
Speaker 5: just stay here. Justin was probably like there and Anna
Speaker 5: Sasa was there. They were talking. So byrone, you know,
Speaker 5: got out of the car, went right around there, and
Speaker 5: he was pretty close to where just got it out
Speaker 5: to like a thick a step forward or so. He
Speaker 5: wasn't like walking around a lot. He just got right out,
Speaker 5: went back to the trunk and hop gun.
Speaker 3: How close was he when he shot her.
Speaker 5: To her or to the car to her? Pretty close?
Speaker 5: And probably say, I don't hear to that wall. He
Speaker 5: wasn't very far at all. He's close to her.
Speaker 4: There was what you showed maybe was practically five foot Yeah.
Speaker 5: Maybe that are a little bit over. He was closed
Speaker 5: to her, though, really close to her.
Speaker 4: Did you hold the shotgun of with the end of
Speaker 4: it to his shoulder like you would hold it right?
Speaker 5: Role, I I think I know, I don't.
Speaker 3: I just all I saw him.
Speaker 5: Yeah, I was probably up cause I all I saw
Speaker 5: was that it like happened so quickly.
Speaker 3: Okay, it's been almost three years. Why now, Why am
Speaker 3: I saying something?
Speaker 5: Yeah, because well it just first off, I know how
Speaker 5: Knot's like her family is probably going. And also I
Speaker 5: mean it's just it's just like wrong. It's like Justin
Speaker 5: said in station said there was no reason for it.
Speaker 5: You know, Byron's still out there and it seems like
Speaker 5: he's not having any problems because of this, whereas you know,
Speaker 5: obviously my life's been really messed up, I mean, rehab,
Speaker 5: my life's been like completely just you know, messed up,
Speaker 5: like because of this, and it's just you know, it's
Speaker 5: just not right. It doesn't And like I said, it
Speaker 5: seems like it's two people are dead for no reason,
Speaker 5: and he's just like out there.
Speaker 6: You know.
Speaker 2: Kilgore asks if Kelly's shared the story with anyone else.
Speaker 2: She says about a year ago, she told her then
Speaker 2: boyfriend that Byron had shot Anastasia. She asked him not
Speaker 2: to say anything besides her ex boyfriend. Kelly says she
Speaker 2: told her drug rehab counselor Maggie, which led to her
Speaker 2: coming forward.
Speaker 4: Okay, so you told Maggie and who.
Speaker 3: Else have you told?
Speaker 5: Well? Then after, you know, I talked to Maggie my
Speaker 5: parents and everything.
Speaker 3: How long ago did you first tell your parents?
Speaker 5: How long ago? Well? I told him that, you know,
Speaker 5: I knew more than I said and everything, but I
Speaker 5: hadn't ever told him the complete story up until recently
Speaker 5: when I told.
Speaker 4: Maggie, what did you How much did you tell them
Speaker 4: back in the past?
Speaker 2: Not.
Speaker 5: I just told him that, you know, I knew what
Speaker 5: happened and everything like that.
Speaker 3: So you told him that you knew for back? How
Speaker 3: in a state died?
Speaker 2: Okay?
Speaker 3: And did they discuss it with you?
Speaker 5: Well, I mean they were always trying to get me
Speaker 5: to tell like the complete story and stuff. But I
Speaker 5: wouldn't why because well I was just scared to And
Speaker 5: also I didn't I was just scared to say anything.
Speaker 5: And anytime I'd say anything to viron about saying, it'd
Speaker 5: be like, you know, it's over in the past. He's like,
Speaker 5: we don't need to wreck our lives, or as it's
Speaker 5: already you know, He's like, they think, justin did it.
Speaker 5: It's like in the past or whatever. Well when also
Speaker 5: I just didn't wanna, you know, admit to my parents
Speaker 5: that I had like anything to do with anything of it,
Speaker 5: you know, cause it just seems so you know.
Speaker 4: Or were you scared what would happen to you go
Speaker 4: to jail or something?
Speaker 5: Yeah, well, not not so much to that, just that,
Speaker 5: I mean, that's a it's a weird thing to tell
Speaker 5: your own parents that you were like involved in something
Speaker 5: like that, because regardless of if I really didn't think
Speaker 5: it was gonna happen, and I still should have said,
Speaker 5: you know, what are you know tonight? I've gotten a carlin.
Speaker 2: On September twenty one, two thousand and almost three years
Speaker 2: after Anastasia Whipples Fuchen was killed, Kelly Moffatt has come
Speaker 2: forward to say Byron Case murdered her again. Strangely, Kelly
Speaker 2: shows no real emotion while telling this story, the real story,
Speaker 2: the one she's been holding onto for so long. The
Speaker 2: next day, Kelly goes out with Sergeant Kilgore to show
Speaker 2: him where Anastasia was killed and where the gun was dumped.
Speaker 2: They start at the Dairy Queen, then head across the
Speaker 2: street to Mount Washington Cemetery. Steely Dan's Dirty Work is
Speaker 2: playing on the radio for the first few moments of
Speaker 2: their drive.
Speaker 3: If anything works familiar, it's been such a lot of time.
Speaker 2: Eventually they make their way towards Lincoln Cemetery.
Speaker 3: In your medium right here, does any of this look familiar?
Speaker 5: I don't know. Well, I know that where it happened,
Speaker 5: you could see a street. I think you could see
Speaker 5: a street house. I don't know. I didn't get out
Speaker 5: of the car, so I don't know. I just remember
Speaker 5: seeing like I thought you could actually see like where
Speaker 5: people were buried something, cause it's just kind of like
Speaker 5: a park. Yeah. I think they pulled that onto this,
Speaker 5: they think, But I thought there was like houses or something, No,
Speaker 5: cause I remember trying. Okay, Yeah, this is how it
Speaker 5: came out.
Speaker 3: Okay, this is the way you left after uh.
Speaker 5: She was killed? Yeah, I believed so.
Speaker 3: Weren't you in here and found the memorial side afterwards?
Speaker 5: Yeah?
Speaker 6: Do you remember where that.
Speaker 5: Was at all? Assume to me maybe this is where
Speaker 5: they stopped. But I could have sworn they could see
Speaker 5: the street from there, like see.
Speaker 3: Cars nothing, Weland, Stay, his body was found over here
Speaker 3: in this.
Speaker 5: Area, probably cause I think I just worn it was
Speaker 5: close to the street though.
Speaker 4: The way you described it to me yesterday, would have
Speaker 4: had to have stopped the car somewhere in here, mkay,
Speaker 4: based on where her body was found.
Speaker 3: Is there any way you could reconstruct that position my
Speaker 3: vehicle like right here? Well, where do you think it was?
Speaker 3: That's why I'm trying to get you to do it?
Speaker 5: Yeah for me? Yeah, keep going forward.
Speaker 3: You're just not sure that where you actually stopped.
Speaker 5: No, I'm not sure.
Speaker 8: Okay, I think it was at least maybe like here,
Speaker 8: because yeah, I mean I.
Speaker 5: Could at least see cars going past on that road
Speaker 5: because I.
Speaker 8: Remember, yeah, cause I could see headline and stuff over there,
Speaker 8: and I was like, well, god, you know, I mean
Speaker 8: it was right by like a busy street and everything okay.
Speaker 2: Next, Sergeant Kilgore asks Kelly to show him where they
Speaker 2: got rid of the gun.
Speaker 3: Here I was just right after it happened.
Speaker 8: I remember that there was like maybe factories are like
Speaker 8: a rock if there were some type of old something
Speaker 8: with the roroad tracks going by.
Speaker 2: Kelly says Justin and Byron acted like they'd been there before,
Speaker 2: because Kelly told kil Gore in their interview the gun
Speaker 2: had been ditched not far from Lincoln Cemetery. Kill Gore
Speaker 2: drives in and around the area, but nothing seems to
Speaker 2: jog Kelly's memory. She then remembers they got on the
Speaker 2: highway pretty quickly after the shooting. She says they wanted
Speaker 2: to get out of the area as fast as possible.
Speaker 3: Justin or Byron did either one of them give any floating.
Speaker 2: Kelly then says they might have driven to a place
Speaker 2: in Kansas, not too terribly far from her house in
Speaker 2: Lenexa to ditch the gun, so.
Speaker 1: Kill Gore heads that way.
Speaker 2: Roughly forty minutes of driving, they seem to zero in
Speaker 2: on an area that might look familiar to Kelly.
Speaker 4: Practically rode off Douglas Is in the area of the
Speaker 4: Inland Quarries and Kelly believes that it could possibly be
Speaker 4: the road an area that.
Speaker 3: Withdrawn.
Speaker 2: Four days later, Kilgore and two other sergeants search the
Speaker 2: area for the weapon, but are unable to find it,
Speaker 2: probably not surprising since it had been almost three years
Speaker 2: since the killing. About two and a half months later,
Speaker 2: on December fifth, two thousand, a tape recorder is installed
Speaker 2: at Kelly's parents' house in the hopes Kelly can get
Speaker 2: Byron on tape confessing to the crime. Nothing seems to
Speaker 2: happen for about six months. Then on June fifth, two
Speaker 2: thousand and one, around eleven thirty.
Speaker 6: What's Mom's house?
Speaker 5: Hello?
Speaker 6: He is Byner.
Speaker 3: You have to hear Byron. Yeah?
Speaker 5: Is this Kelly?
Speaker 6: Hello? I realize you probably don't wanna talk to me.
Speaker 6: I have to talk to you. I absolutely have to
Speaker 6: fucking talk to you. Okay, hello here listening? Okay, some
Speaker 6: extremely bad shit has gone down.
Speaker 5: Are you listening to me?
Speaker 4: Yeah?
Speaker 6: Okay. I don't know what to do and that's why
Speaker 6: I called you, because you do realize that I have
Speaker 6: been a drug addict for some time. My memory is
Speaker 6: not a dead and they are harassing me about information
Speaker 6: now and I don't know what to do. About it.
Speaker 6: Do you know what I'm talking about? Yeah, okay, you know,
Speaker 6: Caesar's dad has called me. Two or three investigators have
Speaker 6: called me, and I don't know what to do. I
Speaker 6: don't remember the whole story, and I need your information please,
Speaker 6: because they're gonna call me in. They're gonna fucking ask
Speaker 6: me for a light to take your test again. And
Speaker 6: I have no idea. Okay, I know I'm probably the
Speaker 6: last person on the oath that you wanna talk to you,
Speaker 6: but we have to talk about this otherwise. Remember the
Speaker 6: fucked what?
Speaker 5: I don't remember?
Speaker 6: You don't remember what? What?
Speaker 5: Yeah? Things that don't remember?
Speaker 6: Don't you remember? You don't remember what we said at all?
Speaker 5: Like you?
Speaker 2: But but what whatever Byron says next is unintelligible.
Speaker 5: Mm.
Speaker 6: This is like not a game anymore. And I was
Speaker 6: like realized that to It's like a fullest extent and
Speaker 6: it sucks.
Speaker 3: Really Suppose they called again?
Speaker 6: Well, they called again, They've called a bunch again, They've
Speaker 6: called while I was and where all they showed that
Speaker 6: all there? Yeah, I don't understand. I like, seriously, what
Speaker 6: all went on or whatever? And I seriously I hate
Speaker 6: to say this, but I why, seriously, why did you
Speaker 6: have to come? What was the whole fucking big deal?
Speaker 6: Could you explain that to me? Because I don't get it? Seriously,
Speaker 6: Justin said, for no reason, she said, for no reason.
Speaker 6: It's just all fucked up, And for some reason they're
Speaker 6: talking to me because you won't talk Ie fucked And
Speaker 6: it makes me look horrible because everybody already knows that
Speaker 6: I'm a fucking crackhab and I'm a coke habb I'm
Speaker 6: an alcoholic, and I don't remember shit. If I try
Speaker 6: to talk to 'em, nothing's gonna add up. So I mean,
Speaker 6: if you could seriously explain to me as to why
Speaker 6: you actually fought the need to kill her, then that
Speaker 6: would really help me feel better about the whole fucking thing.
Speaker 6: I mean, is there seriously any reason to all this?
Speaker 2: Talk about this?
Speaker 5: Why like something should talk about that? Of course we
Speaker 5: should as up.
Speaker 6: I think I need to talk to you. What do
Speaker 6: you mean?
Speaker 5: Yeah?
Speaker 6: I would love we talk we it because nothing nothing
Speaker 6: has been the same thing said okay, and you may
Speaker 6: have been okay or whatever, but all I did was
Speaker 6: get more drunk or get more fucked up. That's it.
Speaker 5: That's it.
Speaker 6: Okay, I'm not the same person, and you know that
Speaker 6: I have not been the same person for years and
Speaker 6: I hate it. Then something seriously has to give where
Speaker 6: we need to talk or something because for some reason,
Speaker 6: you know, it just seems like you were inaccessible or
Speaker 6: you were too cold or something, and everybody's coming to
Speaker 6: me and I got talked to any serious that I
Speaker 6: can't do.
Speaker 5: Any of those.
Speaker 2: It's really hard to hear Byron in this next section,
Speaker 2: but he tells Kelly that he was granted immunity and says, quote,
Speaker 2: I told my lawyer flat out that I didn't I
Speaker 2: wasn't going to remember things. I told the cops that too.
Speaker 2: I was like, I can't remember things. And so basically
Speaker 2: I would, you know, tell them up front before you
Speaker 2: go in or agree to meet them, just say I'm
Speaker 2: not going to remember things. Kelly then says she really
Speaker 2: needs to talk with Byron. They agree to meet in
Speaker 2: person something.
Speaker 6: Because I don't. Yeah, I don't like this over the
Speaker 6: phone bullshit, but I can't. So I was the one
Speaker 6: that went to brow to picked your house. I was
Speaker 6: wh when all this shit happened to and so I'm
Speaker 6: the one that they're like robbing and for some reason
Speaker 6: that bif shit, fucking like police force out there to
Speaker 6: talk to us somehow, and is just father has my
Speaker 6: number and you know how disturbing he is, and he's
Speaker 6: emailing me. He's calling me. I have no idea what
Speaker 6: to do. I can't remember anything. I know, but I
Speaker 6: don't remember anything. The whole banger his leg. I thought
Speaker 6: it would go in, it's not.
Speaker 2: Byron says he's sick, he has the flu, but he
Speaker 2: will meet Kelly at a local park the next day
Speaker 2: at eleven am.
Speaker 6: The black by phone.
Speaker 2: Really impressed, okay, According to Kilgore's report, He retrieves the
Speaker 2: tape from this June fifth recorded phone call. The next day,
Speaker 2: although Byron and Kelly made a plan to meet for
Speaker 2: her own safety, Assistant Prosecutor Amy McGowan instructs Kelly not
Speaker 2: to go. On June seventh, Kelly calls Byron again. I
Speaker 2: only have the transcript of that call, but basically Byron
Speaker 2: wants to know why Kelly didn't show up at the park.
Speaker 2: They decided me the next day, time and place to
Speaker 2: be figured out the next morning, but it seems that
Speaker 2: never happens. Four days later, on June eleventh, two thousand
Speaker 2: and one, Kansas City Sheriff's deputies and the Kansas City
Speaker 2: Fugitive Apprehension Unit descend on Byron's mom's house. According to
Speaker 2: an arresting officer's report, it says quote entry was made
Speaker 2: to the residence, and I continued to yell police as
Speaker 2: I moved toward the hallway that led to the bathroom
Speaker 2: and bedroom area of the residence. A white male who
Speaker 2: resembled Case started to come out of the north bedroom.
Speaker 2: Upon seeing me, Case retreated into the bedroom, closed the door,
Speaker 2: and was attempting to lock the door when I pushed
Speaker 2: it open. As I entered the room, Case was in
Speaker 2: Case stumbled backwards onto a bed. Case was taken into
Speaker 2: custody without further incident.
Speaker 1: Almost four years.
Speaker 2: After Anastasia Whitpelsfuchen was murdered, twenty two year old Byron
Speaker 2: Case is charged with first degree murder and armed criminal action.
Speaker 2: Bond is set at two hundred thousand dollars, but Assistant
Speaker 2: prosecutor Amy McGowan argues that because the idea of the informant,
Speaker 2: Kelly Moffatt, had been revealed to Byron for her safety,
Speaker 2: bond should be revoked, and it is the bond issue
Speaker 2: actually comes up again. A judge ends up modifying the bond,
Speaker 2: raising it to three hundred thousand dollars, but since Byron
Speaker 2: can't afford to post it, he remains in jail awaiting trial.
Speaker 2: At trial, Byron will be represented by Horton Lance, a
Speaker 2: Jackson County public defender. Trying the case for the state
Speaker 2: will be Jackson County prosecutors to A. Crayon and David Fry,
Speaker 2: and presiding over the trial will be Judge Charles Atwell.
Speaker 2: April nineteenth, two thousand and two, start the pre trial motions.
Speaker 2: Prosecutors want evidence of Byron's goth lifestyle to be allowed in.
Speaker 2: They believe it shows a fascination with morbid death and
Speaker 2: it gives context to what Kelly is going to say
Speaker 2: on the stand. They argue the jury should be able
Speaker 2: to hear about things like Byron's appearance, how he wore
Speaker 2: his face pale with black makeup, his hair dyed black,
Speaker 2: and how he dressed in black clothes, which they say
Speaker 2: was different than Justin's appearance he was somebody out of
Speaker 2: quote the gap ad. They want the jury to hear
Speaker 2: about how Byron and a friend would walk around town
Speaker 2: wearing priest collars and how he had been seen wearing
Speaker 2: a button that said I as raped your Savior. Prosecutors
Speaker 2: want Byron's license plates morbid and atheist to be allowed
Speaker 2: into evidence, as well as his bumper stickers that read
Speaker 2: evil and I Am God, also that he had an
Speaker 2: autopsy photo as his computer screensaver. They want the jury
Speaker 2: to hear that Byron's sign and name to his own
Speaker 2: website was Savior, and that the website included discussions of
Speaker 2: Justin's death, Anastasia's death, the crime itself, and the Jackson
Speaker 2: County Sheriff's investigation. The defense wants Kelly's mental health records
Speaker 2: to be allowed in and they want the June fifth
Speaker 2: and June's seventh recorded phone calls between Byron and Kelly
Speaker 2: to be kept out. When Judge Atwell rules on these motions,
Speaker 2: he says Kelly's medical records will remain sealed. They're out
Speaker 2: the June fifth and June seventh recorded conversations will be
Speaker 2: allowed in.
Speaker 1: Judge Atwell says Kelly's voice is much.
Speaker 2: Clearer than Byron's, but with the aid of the transcript
Speaker 2: he can understand what was said. The transcripts are quote
Speaker 2: exceptionally accurate in regard to the goth lifestyle stuff, Judge
Speaker 2: Atwell is not going to allow in the bumper stickers,
Speaker 2: license plates, autopsy screensaver, the button, the website stuff, or
Speaker 2: descriptions of Byron's appearance. On April twenty ninth, two thousand
Speaker 2: and two, about four and a half years after the murder,
Speaker 2: the trial begins. The prosecution star witness is Kelly Moffatt
Speaker 2: about the night of October twenty second. Kelly tells the
Speaker 2: same story she told Kilgore when she came forward in
Speaker 2: September of two thousand, that after school, Byron and Justin
Speaker 2: picked her up. Justin asked who's the biggest problem in
Speaker 2: his life. He said Anastasia, and wouldn't it be better
Speaker 2: or easier if she were gone? Justin said he couldn't
Speaker 2: kill Anastasia, so he said Byron would. Kelly says they
Speaker 2: stopped at a gas station near her house because Byron
Speaker 2: and Justin wanted her to call Anastasia to tell her
Speaker 2: to meet them at the Dairy Queen. She says she
Speaker 2: didn't have Anastasia's number, so they gave her a number.
Speaker 2: Kelly says, quote, I think maybe Justin dialed it for me.
Speaker 2: I'm not sure, Kelly says. Anastasia answered the phone, and
Speaker 2: the conversation went like this quote, Hi, I'm with Justin
Speaker 2: and Byron. You know we're supposed to meet. She said, well, yeah,
Speaker 2: you're running a bit late. But dairy Queen. Kelly goes
Speaker 2: on to say, quote, I guess the original I don't
Speaker 2: know what the deal was. I guess the original plan
Speaker 2: was to meet at Mount Washington, but it got changed
Speaker 2: to Dairy Queen. Kelly says they picked up Anastasia at
Speaker 2: the Dairy Queen, then went across the street to Mount
Speaker 2: Washington Cemetery. They got ushered out of there, then drove around,
Speaker 2: eventually finding a road off Truman that led to what
Speaker 2: looked like a park with a circle drive. They parked,
Speaker 2: and Justin and Anastasia got out of the car. Kelly
Speaker 2: says it was dark enough to where she could see
Speaker 2: cars with their headlights going by. She says Byron then
Speaker 2: got out of the car popped the trunk. She saw
Speaker 2: Justin was waving his arms saying something in German. Kelly
Speaker 2: says Justin was standing pretty close to the driver's door.
Speaker 2: Anastasia was standing by the second window on the driver's side.
Speaker 2: She wasn't reacting, she was just looking at Justin. Kelly
Speaker 2: says she then saw Byron raise the gun. Then she
Speaker 2: heard a big loud noise. She screamed, turned away, then
Speaker 2: looked back and saw Anastasia's body had been quote blown
Speaker 2: backwards and I could see her feet.
Speaker 1: Kelly says. She was crying.
Speaker 2: Justin and Byron got in the car and Justin said,
Speaker 2: didn't you hear me say stop? And Byron said, quote,
Speaker 2: I already had the gun out, I already had it
Speaker 2: in her face.
Speaker 1: What was I supposed to do? You asked me to
Speaker 1: do this? Kelly says. They drove for.
Speaker 2: A while, then dumped the gun in an industrial area.
Speaker 2: They went back to Justin and came up with the
Speaker 2: story that Anastasia got mad and got out of the
Speaker 2: car at Truman Roade and the I four thirty five.
Speaker 2: Kelly says she continued to date Byron for a little
Speaker 2: over a year after the murder, finally breaking up with
Speaker 2: him around December of nineteen ninety eight. Kelly says eventually
Speaker 2: her life's biraled. She got deep into drugs and it
Speaker 2: got so bad her parents kicked her out and wouldn't
Speaker 2: let her back in the house. She was living in
Speaker 2: crack houses, was homeless in and out of rehab, she says.
Speaker 2: Eventually Byron moved to Saint Louis, leaving her to deal
Speaker 2: with everything on her own. Kelly testifies that in September
Speaker 2: of two thousand, the night before she went into rehab,
Speaker 2: she told her father that Byron did it. Then in rehab,
Speaker 2: her counselor, whom she'd known for some time, convinced her
Speaker 2: to tell what she knew about that night or she
Speaker 2: was going to kill herself with drugs and alcohol. So
Speaker 2: Kelly told the counselor Justin killed Anastasia. When Kelly's mom
Speaker 2: has told this, she said, but wait, Kelly told her
Speaker 2: dad Byron did it. Kelly says she broke down and
Speaker 2: explained that she pointed the finger at Justin because he
Speaker 2: was already gone. The police believed he did it, and
Speaker 2: she was afraid because Byron had always told her she
Speaker 2: is as guilty as he is. She finally says it
Speaker 2: was Byron. The counselor then called a lawyer, and from
Speaker 2: there the Moffitts went to.
Speaker 1: Talk with prosecutors.
Speaker 2: Then prosecutors get to the June fifth and June's seventh
Speaker 2: recorded phone calls between Kelly and Byron. Prosecutors say the
Speaker 2: June fifth call is significant because when Byron told Kelly,
Speaker 2: we shouldn't talk about this, that is a tacit admission.
Speaker 2: A tacit admission is when someone doesn't say something directly,
Speaker 2: but their words are acts suggest that they agree with something,
Speaker 2: like because Byron didn't deny anything during that call, like
Speaker 2: when Kelly said, why did you have to kill her?
Speaker 2: That can be seen as a tacit admission that it's true.
Speaker 2: Byron's attorney, Horton Lance, then cross examines Kelly. He points
Speaker 2: out she's lied to police multiple times. He then challenges
Speaker 2: her about her drug problems. She admits she used drugs
Speaker 2: before Anastasia's murder, but says witnessing the murder caused her depression,
Speaker 2: which made her drug use much worse. He then asks
Speaker 2: what was going on with Justin leading up to the murder.
Speaker 2: Kelly says he had been very depressed. He'd been using
Speaker 2: drugs and was even hearing voices, and he talked about
Speaker 2: having odd plans about hurting people. Kelly says, but Byron
Speaker 2: did too. Then Lance drills down on the phone call
Speaker 2: Kelly says she made to Anastasia from the gas station
Speaker 2: in lenn Nexa, Kansas.
Speaker 1: He challenges Kelly on whether she or.
Speaker 2: Justin called Anastasia's house because Anastasia's sister Francesca told police
Speaker 2: Justin called the house from Lenexa not long after Anastasia
Speaker 2: had already left for Mount Washington Cemetery. Kelly says she
Speaker 2: believes Justin spoke with Francesca earlier that day, she doesn't
Speaker 2: recall him using the payphone at the gas station. Byron's
Speaker 2: attorney then asks about the gun Kelly had said she
Speaker 2: saw hanging at Byron's dad's house. Kelly says she doesn't
Speaker 2: remember which room it was in, and she doesn't know
Speaker 2: if that was the gun used. All she knows is
Speaker 2: Byron told her the gun they had with them that
Speaker 2: night was Byron's dad's gun. Horton Lance asks Kelly if
Speaker 2: she still stands by what she told Kilgore that Byron
Speaker 2: was five feet away or a little more from Anastasia
Speaker 2: when he shot her.
Speaker 1: She says yes.
Speaker 2: Horton Lance asks why that night, after Byron and j
Speaker 2: were gone, didn't she tell her mom that she had
Speaker 2: just witnessed her boyfriend kill her friend, Kelly says she
Speaker 2: was scared. Then he confronts Kelly about an email she
Speaker 2: sent to Anastasia's dad, Bob Whitplesfuchen in May of nineteen
Speaker 2: ninety eight. In it, Kelly wrote quote, let's get together
Speaker 2: and swap stories. Kelly says she didn't want to necessarily
Speaker 2: talk about the murder. She just wanted to let him
Speaker 2: know how sorry she was that Anastasia was dead. Lance
Speaker 2: asks if she got the ten thousand dollars reward money.
Speaker 2: Kelly says no. Then Horton Lance wants to know did
Speaker 2: Kelly warn Anastasia that Byron and Justin were planning to
Speaker 2: murder her that night? Kelly says she did not. On redirect,
Speaker 2: Prosecutor Teresa Crayon wants to make clear Kelly said Byron
Speaker 2: was five feet away when he shot Anastasia, but Kelly
Speaker 2: also said Iron was holding a long gun. Also testifying
Speaker 2: for the state, our Deputy David Epperson, who found Anastasia's body,
Speaker 2: and Deborah Moffatt, Kelly's mom. Debora, testifies that when Kelly
Speaker 2: got home the night of the twenty second, Byron and
Speaker 2: Justin came inside with her.
Speaker 1: Debora said she was upstairs.
Speaker 2: But she could hear the three of them whispering downstairs,
Speaker 2: which made her suspicious. Debora says by January of nineteen
Speaker 2: ninety nine, about fifteen months after Anastasia's murder, Kelly's drug
Speaker 2: use had gotten really bad. She would disappear, be gone
Speaker 2: for days at a time. Then one night, late around
Speaker 2: March of two thousand, Debora says, Kelly called her and
Speaker 2: said she saw Anastasia murdered. Debora says she asked if
Speaker 2: it was Justin, and she said yes. That was the
Speaker 2: end of the conversation. Debra says she eventually came home
Speaker 2: but never wanted to talk about it. According to Deborah,
Speaker 2: over the coming months, Kelly ran away from rehab two
Speaker 2: or three times, and they always took her back. Then
Speaker 2: one night Kelly told her dad Byron killed Anastasia. Deborah
Speaker 2: and her husband took Kelly back to rehab, and not
Speaker 2: long after, Kelly confessed to her drug counselor that Justin
Speaker 2: killed Anastasia. Eventually, when confronted with her changing story, Kelly
Speaker 2: said it was Byron. After Deborah Moffatt, Diane Marshall, Anastasia's stepmom, testifies,
Speaker 2: then Anastasia's sister, Francesco Whipplesfugen takes the stand. Franzays, in
Speaker 2: October twenty second, Anastasia was wearing her black shoes, some
Speaker 2: black jeans, and a tan corduroy jacket when she went
Speaker 2: to meet Justin at Mount Washington Cemetery. She says, around
Speaker 2: four thirty pm, Justin called the house looking for Anastasia,
Speaker 2: and he sounded surprised to learn she had already gotten
Speaker 2: a ride to Mount Washington about fifteen or twenty minutes before.
Speaker 2: She says, during that call, Justin acted like he didn't
Speaker 2: want to drive all the way from Lenexa, Kansas, to Independence,
Speaker 2: Missouri to meet Anastasia. Francisca testifies that when Justin called
Speaker 2: her later that night, she told him, quote, if anything
Speaker 2: happened to her, it was his fault, and I kind
Speaker 2: of hung up on him at that point. Francisca also
Speaker 2: says she never spoke to Kelly that day. The state's
Speaker 2: other witnesses include Glenn Colliver, the caretaker at Mount Washington Cemetery.
Speaker 2: He testifies he saw Anastasia at Mount Washington around five pm,
Speaker 2: then later with two males and a female. Originally, he
Speaker 2: told investigators he saw her the second time around seven pm.
Speaker 2: Now on the stand, he says he saw her around
Speaker 2: nine pm. Next to take the stand is John Bruton,
Speaker 2: Justin's dad. Then Jim Dodd, the bullet Hole store employee
Speaker 2: who sold Justin the gun the morning of October twenty third.
Speaker 2: Then two from law enforcement testify. The detective who worked
Speaker 2: Justin's death case. He says it was obviously self inflicted,
Speaker 2: the officer who arrested Byron. Then doctor Chase Blanchard, who
Speaker 2: works at the Jackson County Medical Examiner's office, takes the stand.
Speaker 2: The chief medical Examiner, doctor Thomas Young, who actually performed
Speaker 2: the autopsy, is out of town. Doctor Blanchard testifies from
Speaker 2: doctor Young's report, saying that Anastasia died from a contact
Speaker 2: wound to the nose, meaning the muzzle was up against
Speaker 2: her skin. Doctor Blanchard says doctor Young saw a dark
Speaker 2: city deposit around the face and the presence of gunpowder particles,
Speaker 2: which also means a close range shot. Doctor Blanchard says,
Speaker 2: quote to me, that means less than six inches. The
Speaker 2: muzzle must have been less than six inches from the
Speaker 2: person to the person's skin. She goes on to say quote,
Speaker 2: but it was probably right up against the skin. And
Speaker 2: that's what I believe doctor Young's opinion is, because he
Speaker 2: calls it a contact. Doctor Blanchard also says there were
Speaker 2: no defensive wounds detected, and she can't say specifically what
Speaker 2: kind of gun fired the fatal shot. For all of
Speaker 2: the people who do testify for the prosecution, there's one
Speaker 2: person I am stunned wasn't even called. Lead investigator, Sergeant
Speaker 2: Gary Kilgore. Next up is the defense's case. Don Wright,
Speaker 2: the dairy queen worker, testifies first. She says although she
Speaker 2: told Sergeant Kilgore she gave Anastasia a pad that night,
Speaker 2: she actually gave her a tampon. Don Wright says she
Speaker 2: hasn't used anything other than a tampon since she was.
Speaker 1: About thirteen or fourteen years old.
Speaker 2: She said she only said it was a pad because
Speaker 2: she couldn't think of a polite name for it. An
Speaker 2: important distinction for the defense, because if don Wright gave
Speaker 2: Anastasia a tampon, then why was she found in Lincoln's
Speaker 2: cemetery wearing a clean pad. Don Wright says that night,
Speaker 2: Anastasia had a long brown purse with her and she
Speaker 2: was wearing light blue jeans and sandals with socks. She
Speaker 2: also testifies to a story different than Kelly's. Don Wright
Speaker 2: says that Anastasia told her she and her boyfriend Quote
Speaker 2: had been in an argument because they had plans that
Speaker 2: night and she couldn't get a ride over there to him,
Speaker 2: so she had gotten out to the dairy Queen called
Speaker 2: him and asked if he could come pick her up,
Speaker 2: and he said that he had already made plans with
Speaker 2: his best friend, and she was upset. Then Byron's mom,
Speaker 2: Evelyn Case, takes the stand. She says Byron came home
Speaker 2: the night of October twenty second, around ten or eleven pm.
Speaker 2: He told her about Anastasia and justin arguing and Anastasia
Speaker 2: getting out of the car. She says Byron didn't smell
Speaker 2: like alcohol or seemed to be acting out of the ordinary.
Speaker 2: They had idle chit chat. Then Byron went to his
Speaker 2: room and got on his computer. Ellen says after that night,
Speaker 2: Kelly and Byron seemed the same. Kelly never seemed afraid
Speaker 2: of Byron. They would cook together and listen to music.
Speaker 2: She says about that June fifth recorded phone call with Kelly,
Speaker 2: Byron was sick. The next day, he went to a
Speaker 2: doctor and had something like strep throat. He was prescribed antibiotics.
Speaker 2: Evelyn says Byron's dad, her ex husband, never owned a gun.
Speaker 2: He wasn't a hunter. They were an anti gun family,
Speaker 2: and she says Byron's car was in the shop the
Speaker 2: night of the murder. Evelyn says about a month after
Speaker 2: Byron was arrested, Kelly called her. She said the first
Speaker 2: thing Kelly said to her was, quote, this is insane,
Speaker 2: Evelyn says. Kelly went on to say, quote, I'm an accomplice.
Speaker 2: I'm an accomplice. But since I told I got they
Speaker 2: gave me part immunity. Evelyn says. Kelly went on to say, quote,
Speaker 2: my family really liked Byron a lot. I should be
Speaker 2: in jail with him, and I'm ready to go, Evelyn says.
Speaker 2: Kelly asked if she could write to Byron in jail.
Speaker 2: On cross examination, prosecuteter David Frye asks Evelyn where she
Speaker 2: was born. She says Germany. She reads and writes and
Speaker 2: speaks in German as much as she can, and Byron
Speaker 2: is still learning, but he knows the basics enough for
Speaker 2: them to communicate. Evelyn says she would speak to Justin
Speaker 2: in German too. This is an important point for the
Speaker 2: prosecution to make, because Kelly testified that Justin was yelling
Speaker 2: something in German to Byron right before he shot Anastasia.
Speaker 2: As the defense's case continues, Horton Lance calls to the
Speaker 2: stand Nancy Knolger, Byron's aunt, his dad's sister, who testifies
Speaker 2: her brother never had any guns and he never hunted.
Speaker 2: Then Byron's friends, Abraham Nisley and Tara McDowell testify, who
Speaker 2: both say they saw Byron that night and nothing seemed
Speaker 2: out of the ordinary with him. Tara says when Byron
Speaker 2: came by that night, he and Justin did not smell
Speaker 2: of alcohol. They seemed to be in fairly good moods,
Speaker 2: and Justin specifically and look upset, shaken, or that he'd
Speaker 2: been crying earlier. On cross examination, Tara's asked why in
Speaker 2: her February nineteen ninety eight interview with Sergeant Kilgore, she
Speaker 2: said Byron and Justin were going to Abraham's house after hers.
Speaker 2: She said that's how she remembered it, then now she
Speaker 2: doesn't remember.
Speaker 1: It at all.
Speaker 2: She's also asked if before trial Abraham gave her the
Speaker 2: case file to read so she could prepare before testifying.
Speaker 2: Tara says she only had a stack of papers and
Speaker 2: she only read her interview with Kilgore and the autopsy reports.
Speaker 2: Then Don Rand, the night mechanic at the Amico station,
Speaker 2: takes the stand. He says, when he first spoke with investigators,
Speaker 2: he was shown two photos, one of a boy and
Speaker 2: one of a girl. He said the girl in the
Speaker 2: photo looked like the one he saw walking quickly away
Speaker 2: from the car at the light at Truman Road and
Speaker 2: the I four thirty five. Don Rand says her faster
Speaker 2: pace made him think she was upset. He says he
Speaker 2: thinks this happened around dusk or a little bit after dark,
Speaker 2: and he saw the young woman walk east on Truman
Speaker 2: Road towards Independence, both in the direction of Lincoln's Cemetery
Speaker 2: and Anastasia's house. On cross examination, Don Rand is asked
Speaker 2: to confirm the height and wait of the girl he
Speaker 2: saw that night. Don Rand says she was about five
Speaker 2: six or five seven and about one hundred and thirty pounds.
Speaker 2: Anastasia was five to two and one hundred and twenty pounds.
Speaker 2: Then Byron takes the stand in his own defense, he
Speaker 2: tells the same basic story he's told since he first
Speaker 2: spoke with Sergeant Kilgore back in October of nineteen ninety seven.
Speaker 2: But Byron denies they were drinking that night and says
Speaker 2: he and Justin never asked Kelly to call Anastasia to
Speaker 2: meet them.
Speaker 1: At the Dairy Queen.
Speaker 2: He says they didn't even know where the Dairy Queen was,
Speaker 2: Anastasia gave them directions. On cross examination, Prosecutor David Frye
Speaker 2: questions Byron about everything from his relationship with Kelly, who
Speaker 2: was fourteen when they first started dating Byron was eighteen,
Speaker 2: to the night of October twenty second. Byron for the
Speaker 2: first time says he Justin and Kelly stopped at the
Speaker 2: gas station in Lenexa, where Justin called Anastasia's house. Byron
Speaker 2: says Justin spoke with her sister Fran and learned that
Speaker 2: Anastasia had already left for Mount Washington Cemetery. Prosecutor David
Speaker 2: Frye challenges Byron on this, asking if it would have
Speaker 2: been normal for Anastasia to page him if she couldn't
Speaker 2: get a hold of him, and Justin Byron says yes.
Speaker 2: Then David Frye asks, quote, and if she had reached
Speaker 2: you on your pager and given the number, you could
Speaker 2: have dialed the phone number that Kelly says she dialed,
Speaker 2: and Kelly could have talked to her at the dairy queen.
Speaker 1: Isn't that right?
Speaker 2: Byron says yeah, if the pay phone allowed incoming calls,
Speaker 2: but he says he doesn't remember getting paged by Anastasia.
Speaker 2: David fry says Byron's story about that night is hogwash.
Speaker 2: He says there's no way this stubborn, strong fighter who
Speaker 2: was Anastasia would end up dead with no defensive wounds,
Speaker 2: implying she knew her killer and her killer was him.
Speaker 2: In closing arguments, Prosecutor Teresa Crayon says Kelly Moffatt had
Speaker 2: no reason to come forward and lie, admit she was
Speaker 2: a drug addict, accusan ex boyfriend she broke up with
Speaker 2: two and a half years before, and implicate herself in
Speaker 2: a murder. Defense Attorney Horton Lance says in his closing
Speaker 2: there are two Kelly Moffetts, one who's a crack addict,
Speaker 2: alcoholic who's ruined her life and has no excuse. The
Speaker 2: other Kelly, he asserts, is all of those things, but
Speaker 2: has an excuse. She witnessed a murder and that's how
Speaker 2: her family could take her back because it's not her fault.
Speaker 2: Horton Lance reminds the jury that Anastasia was the one
Speaker 2: who wanted to get together that day. He says she
Speaker 2: got a ride in Mount Washington and only went across
Speaker 2: the street to the Dairy Queen when Justin didn't show up.
Speaker 2: He says Anastasia was the one who called and said,
Speaker 2: I'm at the Dairy Queen, come get me. When Justin
Speaker 2: spoke with Francesca, she said Justin acted like he didn't
Speaker 2: want to drive all the way from Lenexa to Independence
Speaker 2: to meet Anastasia. Horton Lance says Anastasia called Justin four
Speaker 2: or five times from the Dairy Queen and was mad
Speaker 2: when they picked her up so late. Horton Lance argues,
Speaker 2: if the plan was to kill Anastasia, why are they
Speaker 2: so late. He says they were late because the plan
Speaker 2: was for Justin and Anastasia to talk about their relationship,
Speaker 2: not to kill her. He says Justin didn't even want
Speaker 2: to be there, which Horton Lance says is the opposite
Speaker 2: of Kelly's testimony. After three days, the case goes to
Speaker 2: the jury. A little over three hours later, they come
Speaker 2: back with their verdict for count one murder in the
Speaker 2: first degree guilty for count two armed criminal action guilty.
Speaker 2: Almost two months later, Judge Atwell sentences Byron case to
Speaker 2: two life terms to run. Concurrently, I spoke with Byron's
Speaker 2: defense attorney, Horton Lance, about possibly sitting down for an interview.
Speaker 2: He told me he'd consider it, he was busy about
Speaker 2: to start a trial and I should call him back
Speaker 2: in a few weeks, which I did. I left several
Speaker 2: messages for him, but he never returned any of them.
Speaker 2: I also reached out to Prosecutor Teresa Crayon. Her communications
Speaker 2: director said quote, the office has decided that until all
Speaker 2: litigation is complete on this matter, it isn't appropriate for
Speaker 2: a potential witness. I e Teresa to participate. In twenty fourteen,
Speaker 2: Teresa Crayon was interviewed for on the case with Paula's On.
Speaker 2: Here is what she said about why Kelly you should
Speaker 2: be believed.
Speaker 7: When you listen to Kelly's whole story, it made sense.
Speaker 7: Kelly never saw a picture of the crime scene. She
Speaker 7: was never shown one Yep, she was able to describe
Speaker 7: exactly the position of Anastasia's body. And you know what
Speaker 7: was Kelly's motive to lie about this when she came forward.
Speaker 2: I also reached out to former prosecutor David Frye. He
Speaker 2: never responded, and I emailed Kelly Moffatt finally right first,
Speaker 2: she responded with quote, you don't have an agenda and
Speaker 2: your podcast is called The Real Killer. I find that
Speaker 2: incredibly hard to believe. How did you get my email?
Speaker 2: Two emails later, she wrote this quote, I will briefly
Speaker 2: talk to you. I'll let you know what happens. So
Speaker 2: the trial is over, the judge and Jerry have spoken.
Speaker 2: Now I want to talk to Byron Case. Did you
Speaker 2: kill Anastasia Whitfelsfugen Next time on The Real Killer? What
Speaker 2: do you say to the people out there who think
Speaker 2: you are murderer? My face to face interview with the
Speaker 2: man convicted of killing Anastasia.
Speaker 9: I a long time ago accepted that people aren't going
Speaker 9: to like me, and people are going to think some
Speaker 9: terrible things about me, and it isn't my job to
Speaker 9: make them think otherwise.
Speaker 2: The views and opinions expressed in this podcast are solely
Speaker 2: those of the individuals participating in the podcast. If you
Speaker 2: or someone you know is experiencing suicidal thoughts or a crisis,
Speaker 2: please no help is available. Call or text nine to
Speaker 2: eight eight, or chat online at the Suicide and Crisis
Speaker 2: Lifelines website at nine eight eight lifeline dot org. To
Speaker 2: see photos, maps and documents related to this season's story,
Speaker 2: follow The Real Killer Podcast on Instagram and at TRK
Speaker 2: podcast on TikTok. The Real Killer is a production of
Speaker 2: AYR Media and iHeartMedia, hosted by me Leah Rothman. Executive
Speaker 2: producers Leah Rothman and Elisa Rosen for AYR Media, Written
Speaker 2: by Leah Rothman, editing and sound design by Cameron Taggi,
Speaker 2: mixed and mastered by Cameron Taggi. Production coordinator Andy Levine,
Speaker 2: Audio engineer Justin Longerbeam studio engineer Graham Gibson, Legal console
Speaker 2: for AYR Media, Douglas Executive producer for iHeartMedia, Maya Howard