WEBVTT - What Is a Coup D'Etat, and Could It Happen In America? 0:00:01.920 --> 0:00:07.000 Welcome to Brainstuff, a production of I Heart Radio, Hey Brainstuff. 0:00:07.080 --> 0:00:13.680 Lauren Boglebaum here. On February one, the Myanmar military seized 0:00:13.720 --> 0:00:18.200 control of the country's government, ousting it's democratically elected civilian leader. 0:00:18.920 --> 0:00:22.480 The event sparked widespread resistance from the pro democracy electorate, 0:00:23.079 --> 0:00:25.320 many of whom took to the streets to march in 0:00:25.400 --> 0:00:29.240 peaceful protest. They were met with violence from the military regime. 0:00:29.920 --> 0:00:33.280 To date, more than six hundred people, including women and children, 0:00:33.400 --> 0:00:38.479 have been killed. Political turmoil like what's happening in Myanmar 0:00:38.800 --> 0:00:42.559 is not new, but what occurred in the United States 0:00:42.680 --> 0:00:46.479 at a Q and On affiliated event on mate a 0:00:46.560 --> 0:00:51.959 Memorial Day was new. At the Four Godden Country Patriot 0:00:52.040 --> 0:00:56.240 round Up conference in Dallas, former National Security Advisor Michael 0:00:56.240 --> 0:01:00.520 Flynn suggested a coup should happen in the US When 0:01:00.560 --> 0:01:03.200 responding to a question from an audience member who asked, 0:01:03.520 --> 0:01:08.840 why what happened in Myanmar can't happen here. A former 0:01:09.040 --> 0:01:12.399 U S National security advisor implying that the U S 0:01:12.440 --> 0:01:17.240 military should overthrow the government, shocked and concerned many, including 0:01:17.280 --> 0:01:22.720 Republican Representative Liz Cheney, who condemned Flynn's comments. The French 0:01:22.760 --> 0:01:27.280 phrase coudta literally translates to blow of state in English, 0:01:27.560 --> 0:01:31.160 a likening forced political seizure to a physical strike against 0:01:31.200 --> 0:01:34.760 the government. It didn't enter the English lexicon until the 0:01:34.840 --> 0:01:39.600 late seventeen hundreds, coinciding with several major political upheavals in France. 0:01:41.080 --> 0:01:45.360 Who's differ from other forms of civil unrest like war, rioting, 0:01:45.360 --> 0:01:50.280 and revolution in several ways. For example, unlike civil wars, 0:01:50.400 --> 0:01:54.080 which can draw out for years, who's usually take place 0:01:54.120 --> 0:01:58.160 in a single day, And unlike revolutions, which tend to 0:01:58.200 --> 0:02:02.480 have broad majority support, coups are usually spearheaded by a 0:02:02.520 --> 0:02:07.160 small group seeking political power. Finally, they also tended to 0:02:07.160 --> 0:02:10.320 focus on an executive power, such as a president or 0:02:10.360 --> 0:02:16.200 a prime minister, rather than the entire governmental apparatus. When 0:02:16.280 --> 0:02:19.280 most people think of a coupa, they picture a violent 0:02:19.440 --> 0:02:24.320 military uprising, something like Chile's bloody overthrow of President Salvador 0:02:24.360 --> 0:02:29.239 Alliende in ninety three for revolt that cost an untold 0:02:29.320 --> 0:02:33.000 number of lives in Mali. And although the majority of 0:02:33.040 --> 0:02:37.720 these events do skew towards violence, not all coups involved bloodshed. 0:02:38.320 --> 0:02:42.640 Napoleon's seventeen ninety nine capture of Paris for instance, reportedly 0:02:42.720 --> 0:02:47.600 went off without a single death. So what leads to 0:02:47.639 --> 0:02:52.160 a coup it depends from country to country. For the article, 0:02:52.240 --> 0:02:54.440 this episode is based on How Stuff Works. Spoke by 0:02:54.520 --> 0:02:57.960 email with Brian class, An associate professor of Global politics 0:02:58.000 --> 0:03:01.880 at University College London and host of the podcast Power Corrupts. 0:03:02.760 --> 0:03:05.320 He said the drivers of a coup in a place 0:03:05.360 --> 0:03:09.160 like Madagascar are very different from those in Thailand, for example, 0:03:09.840 --> 0:03:14.839 but political chaos and dysfunction make coups more likely, and 0:03:15.080 --> 0:03:17.919 the best coup predictor for any given country is whether 0:03:17.960 --> 0:03:22.040 that country has a history of them. For example, after 0:03:22.080 --> 0:03:26.359 gaining independence from Britain, Myanmar enjoyed fourteen years of democracy 0:03:26.520 --> 0:03:30.280 before its first military coup in nineteen sixty two. A 0:03:30.400 --> 0:03:34.239 procession of military leaders followed until eleven, when the country 0:03:34.320 --> 0:03:39.760 transitioned back to a representative quasi democracy. However, the military, 0:03:40.000 --> 0:03:43.960 evidently dissatisfied with the most recent election results, snatched power 0:03:44.000 --> 0:03:50.600 back earlier this year. Another predictor is a country's economic status. Generally, 0:03:50.720 --> 0:03:53.960 poorer countries tend to have more political unrest, which can 0:03:54.040 --> 0:03:58.160 lead a small radicalized group to seek power. Four of 0:03:58.200 --> 0:04:01.600 the current top five most poverished countries in the world 0:04:01.680 --> 0:04:06.040 by gross domestic product being Burndi, South Sudan, the Central 0:04:06.040 --> 0:04:10.320 African Republic, and Malawi have all experienced coup attempts in 0:04:10.320 --> 0:04:14.760 the last decade, but it would be arnist to assume 0:04:14.920 --> 0:04:18.320 that only poor nations are susceptible. After all, one of 0:04:18.400 --> 0:04:22.159 history's most famous attempted coups, the assassination of Julius Caesar, 0:04:22.480 --> 0:04:26.720 occurred near the height of the Roman Empire's power. Deep 0:04:26.800 --> 0:04:31.320 political polarization can also precipitate a coup, especially if one 0:04:31.360 --> 0:04:34.159 group feels that their interests are being excluded in the 0:04:34.200 --> 0:04:39.359 election process. So with that in mind, could a coup 0:04:39.400 --> 0:04:44.680 happen in the US? Experts say it's improbable, though not impossible. 0:04:45.880 --> 0:04:50.400 Coups rarely happened in what political scientists have termed consolidated democracies, 0:04:50.600 --> 0:04:55.360 where democratic institutions are deeply and firmly entrenched. Klaus said 0:04:55.720 --> 0:05:00.640 the United States is a consolidated, albeit severely flawed democracy. 0:05:01.720 --> 0:05:05.159 Three major factors contribute to the United States coup proofing. 0:05:06.000 --> 0:05:09.400 The first is an independent court system. By and large, 0:05:09.480 --> 0:05:13.040 U S courts are nonpartisan and beholden to judge, jury, 0:05:13.120 --> 0:05:17.560 and legal president rather than a particular political party. This 0:05:17.640 --> 0:05:21.080 holds true even for Supreme Court justices, who may be 0:05:21.160 --> 0:05:26.440 appointed directly by a sitting president. Second is a military 0:05:26.520 --> 0:05:29.880 chain of command. The president holds the highest rank in 0:05:29.920 --> 0:05:34.480 the military as commander in chief. Every general answers to them, 0:05:34.520 --> 0:05:37.640 and as an institution, respect for authority in the military 0:05:37.839 --> 0:05:42.480 runs deep. But if corruption enters the hierarchy, there are 0:05:42.480 --> 0:05:45.400 still checks in place. The soldiers have the right to 0:05:45.440 --> 0:05:49.960 refuse orders that strike them as palpably illegal. Furthermore, U 0:05:50.040 --> 0:05:54.479 S military personnel are not a completely homogenized group, as 0:05:55.680 --> 0:05:59.599 people of any gender, racial background, sexual orientation, or political 0:05:59.640 --> 0:06:04.640 persua Asian can and are encouraged to serve together. These 0:06:04.800 --> 0:06:08.760 theoretically ensure that one political actor or party does not 0:06:08.880 --> 0:06:15.520 achieve an unbreakable stranglehold over military power. Finally, there's the 0:06:15.640 --> 0:06:20.359 sheer byzantine sprawl of the United States government. How stuff works. 0:06:20.400 --> 0:06:23.360 Also spoke with Scott Anderson, a senior fellow with the 0:06:23.440 --> 0:06:27.200 National Security Law Program at Columbia Law School. He said, 0:06:27.600 --> 0:06:31.760 we have a highly decentralized system. It's actually fairly difficult 0:06:31.800 --> 0:06:34.440 to hijack the system because you would need to hijack 0:06:34.640 --> 0:06:39.279 lots and lots of parts. Some political scholars have argued 0:06:39.320 --> 0:06:41.760 that the twenty fifth Amendment, which allows a sitting vice 0:06:41.800 --> 0:06:44.360 president to take over for a president who has deemed 0:06:44.400 --> 0:06:47.880 unfit for office, could amount to a non military coup 0:06:48.160 --> 0:06:52.040 under the right circumstances. Other individuals have argued that the 0:06:52.080 --> 0:06:55.440 Insurrection Act of eighteen o seven somehow provides a legal 0:06:55.520 --> 0:07:00.159 loophole that would authorize the former president to command the military, 0:07:00.160 --> 0:07:05.640 claim that Anderson calls complete nonsense. But democracy always needs 0:07:05.720 --> 0:07:08.920 to stay vigilant. Once the ideas in the air, a 0:07:09.040 --> 0:07:13.320 coup becomes marginally more possible, feeding the fears and false 0:07:13.360 --> 0:07:16.920 beliefs of a small group of extremists. That's why, as 0:07:17.000 --> 0:07:27.640 Claus says, quote Flynn's statement was extraordinarily dangerous. Today's episode 0:07:27.680 --> 0:07:30.560 is based on the article what is accupata and is 0:07:30.600 --> 0:07:33.040 the U S Coup Proof? On house to works dot 0:07:33.120 --> 0:07:36.240 com written by Joanna Thompson. Brain Stuff is production of 0:07:36.280 --> 0:07:38.600 iHeart Radio in partnership with hous toff works dot Com 0:07:38.680 --> 0:07:41.600 and is produced by Tyler Clay. Four more podcasts my 0:07:41.640 --> 0:07:44.800 heart Radio, visit the iHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or 0:07:44.800 --> 0:07:46.560 wherever you listen to your favorite shows.