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Speaker 1: Welcome to Naked Sports, the podcast where we live at

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Speaker 1: the intersection of sports, politics, and culture. Our purpose reveal

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Speaker 1: the common threads that bind them all.

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Speaker 2: So what's happening in women's basketball right now is what

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Speaker 2: we've been trying to get to for almost thirty years.

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Speaker 1: From the stadiums where athlete to break barriers and set records.

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Speaker 3: Caitlin Quark broke the all time single game assists record.

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Speaker 2: This is crazy for rookies to be doing.

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Speaker 1: Our discussions will uncover the vital connections between these realms

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Speaker 1: and the community we create. Welcome to Naked Sports. I'm

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Speaker 1: your host, Carrie Champion. Hey everyone, So on today's podcast

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Speaker 1: we have the lovely, the extraordinary, multi talented Jane Kennedy.

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Speaker 1: This one, for me was highly emotional. Jane Kennedy was

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Speaker 1: the very first black woman I saw on television doing sports.

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Speaker 1: She was a first in many ways, an actress, she

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Speaker 1: was an entrepreneur in ways in which we had never

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Speaker 1: seen black women be put in spaces in that way.

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Speaker 1: I had the wonderful experience of being on a panel

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Speaker 1: with her during the All Star weekend.

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Speaker 3: And when I.

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Speaker 1: Tell you, I could turn to someone I've admired over

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Speaker 1: the years only from afar and say thank you for

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Speaker 1: what you've done. In fact, if it wasn't for you,

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Speaker 1: I don't know how far that I could have gone

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Speaker 1: in my career.

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Speaker 2: So thank you.

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Speaker 1: She recently wrote a book. It's called Plain Jane. Please

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Speaker 1: go out and get it. This book is fascinating. It

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Speaker 1: tells her story. She is in control of her narrative

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Speaker 1: and it's very, very emotionally touching, but it's also very inspiring.

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Speaker 3: I hope you enjoy this interview.

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Speaker 1: And for my ladies who want to be more than

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Speaker 1: what they are right now, or who feel like they

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Speaker 1: can't do more, she is a perfect reminder that it's

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Speaker 1: not over. There's still more time, there are there still

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Speaker 1: more things for you to do. So I hope you

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Speaker 1: enjoy my conversation with Jane Kennedy. Welcome to Naked Sports, y'all.

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Speaker 1: It goes without saying, and I told you this when

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Speaker 1: I met you. I was just very effusive with praise

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Speaker 1: reading your book even more so, and I almost feel

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Speaker 1: like it's never too late, just obviously to honor our heroes,

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Speaker 1: and in your case, this is just an honor for me.

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Speaker 2: Thank you very much. I really appreciated. Thank you, especially

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Speaker 2: coming from you. You know, you and Jamil are my

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Speaker 2: heroes so many people, you know, and I'm watching with

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Speaker 2: such pride watching you know you girls. I feel like

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Speaker 2: a mother birthday there children and watching them grow up.

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Speaker 2: And so now I guess I'm into grandmother phase right now.

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Speaker 3: No.

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Speaker 1: No, you definitely you definitely paved the way. I think

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Speaker 1: that every image that we have of you. I'll just

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Speaker 1: share this story. The first time that I really had

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Speaker 1: a moment to interact with you was at the Essence

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Speaker 1: Women in Hollywood of It some three years ago. A

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Speaker 1: couple yeah and you and you walked up to me

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Speaker 1: and you say, oh, I know you, and it just

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Speaker 1: made my day.

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Speaker 3: And I want you to know. Just those words and

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Speaker 3: it doesn't have to be much more.

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Speaker 1: Just those words solidify the work that you've done and

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Speaker 1: the work that we've done, and it does it does matter.

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Speaker 1: It does matter to hear it from people that you see,

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Speaker 1: that you see and say, oh, it's possible.

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Speaker 3: And for me, that's what that was. When I would

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Speaker 3: see you.

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Speaker 1: On television, I would think, it's so possible, and could

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Speaker 1: I ever be that pretty? And could I ever be

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Speaker 1: that eloquent? And could I you know, all of these

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Speaker 1: things that you think about yourself when there's so few

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Speaker 1: images of little brown and black girls. Your book starts

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Speaker 1: off saying plain Jane, and I remember thinking, as the

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Speaker 1: title of it, I thought, well, She's anything but plain.

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Speaker 1: But can you tell me why that was your title?

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Speaker 1: I know there was significance behind that.

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Speaker 2: There was because I've always seen myself as just the

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Speaker 2: girl next door, you know, even though at my pinnacle

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Speaker 2: in Holly would and I'm not going to say pinnacle

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Speaker 2: because I'm still looking for that pinnacle. That's right, that's right,

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Speaker 2: at the last level of achievement. I'll leave it at that,

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Speaker 2: but you know I'm still looking at you know, what

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Speaker 2: can I do next? But I've always been the girl

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Speaker 2: next door. I was a tomboy. I remember when my

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Speaker 2: mom entered me in the Miss Cleveland pageant that led

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Speaker 2: into the Miss Ohio pageant. So it wasn't something that

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Speaker 2: I had chosen, but she entered me in and the

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Speaker 2: guy said to me, the owner of the dealership, after

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Speaker 2: I had won, he said, you know, you could go

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Speaker 2: all the way if you get rid of those tomboy knees.

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Speaker 3: What are tomboy knees? Exactly?

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Speaker 2: Oh, my gosh, I would wit did stunts. Our street

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Speaker 2: was a dead end street and it was had a

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Speaker 2: little slut to it. So we would sell tickets. Everybody

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Speaker 2: have to pay a quarter to come and watch our show.

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Speaker 2: And we would practice, of course, preparing for the show.

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Speaker 2: So my stunt was that I would get to the

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Speaker 2: end of the street, paddle as fast as I can,

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Speaker 2: and then stand up on the back of the you

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Speaker 2: know they had the little carrier with this right right so,

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Speaker 2: and stand up on the back, put my head down

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Speaker 2: on the seat and stand on my head going there,

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Speaker 2: going down the road. Wow, achieved at once.

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Speaker 3: The things we're so fearless when we're kids.

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Speaker 1: Now you're like, never, I would never do many things happening,

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Speaker 1: Well I will.

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Speaker 2: That's just me plain, Jane. You know, I knew in

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Speaker 2: Hollywood that I was going to have to reshape an image,

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Speaker 2: but I never wanted to leave the essence of who

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Speaker 2: I was that my parents raised me to be.

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Speaker 1: When you were told you can go all the way

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Speaker 1: and then you ultimately win, miss Ohio, what are you

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Speaker 1: thinking at that moment? Are you still feeling out of place,

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Speaker 1: are you still feeling very are you still feeling like yourself?

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Speaker 2: Like playing j the night of the Miss Ohio pageant.

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Speaker 2: It was at the local mall that I used to

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Speaker 2: work in. I was a model for May Company Fashion

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Speaker 2: Department and they had I think maybe five counties and

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Speaker 2: all the local high schools would have a representative to

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Speaker 2: the May Company eighteen fashion board. So I remember being

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Speaker 2: there so and I'm going up you know, every Saturday,

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Speaker 2: and back then stores weren't open on Sundays. It was

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Speaker 2: a blue law. So I mean, you know, I'm really

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Speaker 2: aging myself when I say that, but you know, this

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Speaker 2: is this is who I was. So you know, I

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Speaker 2: saw that I had the opportunity to do the the

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Speaker 2: the Miss Ohio tryout. I'm sorry, Yeah, seventy seventy four

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Speaker 2: is not fun when you forget stiff.

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Speaker 3: Wait, do trust me, I have zero memory, so it's fine, yes.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, yeah, But you know, I just I just

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Speaker 2: always thought that I could do something in that area.

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Speaker 2: I thought I could do something in basketball. I ended

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Speaker 2: up forming my own basketball team pre title ninth and

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Speaker 2: we would play each other and I always had the

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Speaker 2: championship teams. I was always an eager person to do

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Speaker 2: the best that I could.

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Speaker 1: It's interesting when you think about all the things, and

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Speaker 1: you need a book for that very reason, to document

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Speaker 1: your story so that you control the narrative. You were

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Speaker 1: a first in so many ways, and quite frankly, I

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Speaker 1: don't know of and even if we left in a

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Speaker 1: sports category, I can't think of a sports reporter to date, black, brown,

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Speaker 1: or white that has done.

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Speaker 3: What you were able to do when you were.

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Speaker 1: An actress, a model, a sports broadcaster, the first to

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Speaker 1: do NFL today, like I can't think of anybody who

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Speaker 1: has done what you have already accomplished. So to hear

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Speaker 1: you consider yourself playing Jane, that's that's refreshing but also

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Speaker 1: very remarkable to me. So on once you win Miss Ohio,

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Speaker 1: was Hollywood waiting for you? How did you make that

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Speaker 1: transition from the Midwest to out west in Hollywood?

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Speaker 2: Hope that because I wanted to also thank you for

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Speaker 2: acknowledging that it was something that you know, it's.

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Speaker 3: Never been done before, that never been done before.

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Speaker 1: It's never been done before, and it's and so when

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Speaker 1: you say you're at your pinnacle, you were at your pinnacle,

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Speaker 1: and you said there's still more. There is so much more.

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Speaker 1: I see so much more. Everyone now is very interested

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Speaker 1: in obviously learning your history so that you know what

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Speaker 1: could be accomplished, as opposed to just being so caught

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Speaker 1: up in the quick of it all that you are

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Speaker 1: showing us what There's still so much more to do.

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Speaker 3: There's still so much more to do.

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Speaker 2: But for me, it was necessity. It was all out

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Speaker 2: of necessity because if you're a black actress and you're

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Speaker 2: in Hollywood in the nineteen seventies, you don't get very

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Speaker 2: many opportunities to work. So, yes, I was a singer,

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Speaker 2: Yes I was a dancer. Yes I traveled around the

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Speaker 2: world with Bob Hope. Yes, I would do all kinds

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Speaker 2: of different things, you know. I. And then when the

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Speaker 2: idea to do sports braskets broadcasting came along, that was

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Speaker 2: totally new. But I knew that I could do it,

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Speaker 2: and there wasn't anybody telling me, but you're an actress,

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Speaker 2: you can't do that, Because in my heart, I said,

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Speaker 2: I know I can do this, because whatever I put

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Speaker 2: my mind to, I can find a way to achieve that.

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Speaker 1: But okay, so you did these things out of necessity

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Speaker 1: because there wasn't going to be much work for you

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Speaker 1: when it came to acting and or singing and or

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Speaker 1: modeling as a black woman in Hollywood.

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Speaker 2: Correct, Because maybe I was blessed that I did get

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Speaker 2: a lot of jobs, but none were guarantees, you know,

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Speaker 2: like I was the one. It wasn't because I went

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Speaker 2: to an audition that my agent sent me to. It

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Speaker 2: was because I knew somebody who knew somebody who knew somebody,

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Speaker 2: and you make those connections and then you end up

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Speaker 2: working in an area that you're totally unfamiliar with and

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Speaker 2: you go home and you learn it, you know. And

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Speaker 2: that was my career because we didn't have opportunity. There

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Speaker 2: weren't very many black actresses working at that time. I

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Speaker 2: was blessed to be able to work along with Marla

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Speaker 2: Gibbs who was working at that time, Diane Carroll who

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Speaker 2: was working at that time. I was in the movie

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Speaker 2: with Diana Ross, with Billy d Williams, and I'm so

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Speaker 2: excited and I go, you know, I'm playing Billy's first

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Speaker 2: girlfriend when he finally meets her, and the scene where

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Speaker 2: she slides down the wall as she sees this gorgeous

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Speaker 2: man walking into the club. You know, I had all

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Speaker 2: of these scenes and I'm sitting at the watching the

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Speaker 2: you know, the release of it, and I'm saying, where

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Speaker 2: am I. I'm just totally out of the movie. Except

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Speaker 2: the scene where we walk into the nightclub. You see

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Speaker 2: me for a hot second, and then it focuses on

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Speaker 2: Billy D. And that's what Motown wanted. They wanted everybody

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Speaker 2: in America to see Billy D the same way Diana did,

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Speaker 2: and when she melted and fell down the wall, all

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Speaker 2: of America melted it down their walls as well, including me. So,

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Speaker 2: you know, I went up to Bury because he was

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Speaker 2: my friend. I went up to Barry and I said,

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Speaker 2: you were one hundred percent right, So you know, there's

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Speaker 2: you know, I just I've done everything, you know, and

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Speaker 2: I was very proud of my ability to adapt. And

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Speaker 2: it didn't hurt that you knew contexts. Sammy Davis Junior

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Speaker 2: was a huge supporter. So how do you meet Sammy

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Speaker 2: Davis Junior? You say, you know, I was on I

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Speaker 2: was on Rowan and Martin's Laughin and Sammy was one

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Speaker 2: of the performers, one of the talent, main talent, and

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Speaker 2: Leanna and I became good friends with him and we

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Speaker 2: would go to Sunday dinners and Friday night movies all

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Speaker 2: the time where he would introduce us to industry executives,

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Speaker 2: and that's how we made the connections. It wasn't about

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Speaker 2: going to an audition.

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Speaker 1: I think it's interesting how Hollywood, they say doesn't change.

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Speaker 1: But it feels very like a very intimate, small black community.

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Speaker 1: And for you, it's not unusual for people in front

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Speaker 1: of the camera to meet other people who are in

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Speaker 1: front of the camera, but for them to become friends.

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Speaker 1: Was it because there were so few of you in

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Speaker 1: that space, because it doesn't feel that as friendly. Now

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Speaker 1: it's friendly, and you do meet these people, but there's

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Speaker 1: definitely a separation between church and state. If you are

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Speaker 1: a broadcaster, you're not an actress, you're not a model.

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Speaker 1: You may be able to be an influencer in a capacity,

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Speaker 1: but how did you how did how were these bonds formed?

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Speaker 1: You talk of being friends with some legends, and it

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Speaker 1: feels very casual, and I wonder.

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Speaker 3: How that happened.

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Speaker 2: You're absolutely correct that there were not many opportunities for

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Speaker 2: anyone and we were very close friends. And I speak

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Speaker 2: of it like a small community because it was, you know,

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Speaker 2: I could probably in my book, I've gone through the

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Speaker 2: near the very end, I've named all the amazing black

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Speaker 2: actresses that I worked with in the seventies that maybe

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Speaker 2: didn't have the chance to make the big the big

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Speaker 2: change that created their career and made it, you know,

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Speaker 2: made them a legend. And I just say say their

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Speaker 2: names because they should be acknowledged as well. These are

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Speaker 2: all people that were my friends. Yes, we would party together,

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Speaker 2: but there was also the day or the day you

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Speaker 2: would walk into casting and you told your friend, well,

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Speaker 2: I'm just going to walk around the block, and you

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Speaker 2: show up at the casting meeting and you get there

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Speaker 2: and your partner and your friend is at the same

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Speaker 2: casting meeting because they didn't tell you either, because you know,

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Speaker 2: it's only one chance. So first guess the job the

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Speaker 2: other person doesn't have that.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, that's oh, that still happens, Jane.

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Speaker 1: Then you'll talk about, oh, I'm up for a job

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Speaker 1: and the person you're on the phone with is up

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Speaker 1: for the same job and they don't tell you, and

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Speaker 1: that still happens. You just it just does, because it

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Speaker 1: just it's so few spaces for us.

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Speaker 3: Still.

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Speaker 2: If you're looking at few spaces today, you can imagine

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Speaker 2: how few those opportunities were in the seventies and eighties.

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Speaker 1: You mentioned you talked about Lady Sings the Blues and

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Speaker 1: everyone's reaction to Billy d Williams my mom's boyfriend. Everybody's well,

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Speaker 1: he was my boyfriend, and I'm the kid. I was like,

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Speaker 1: I'm twelve. I like you man, you know, but you

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Speaker 1: literally he was just such a beautiful man. But he

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Speaker 1: had that reaction he gave. Everyone had that reaction to him,

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Speaker 1: as we did to you. I was looking at some

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Speaker 1: of the archives and I remember just sleeping through some

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Speaker 1: of the films that you were in wonder Woman. I mean,

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Speaker 1: I'm what, like, you were in wonder Woman and that's

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Speaker 1: not even a film as a TV show?

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Speaker 3: Was a TV show? Wonder Woman, right?

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Speaker 2: TV show?

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Speaker 3: Yes, And I was making sure.

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Speaker 1: I was like, oh my god, I that had to

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Speaker 1: be I just you just don't understand that to me

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Speaker 1: is that was phenomenal. You were a superhero, like you

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Speaker 1: were a superhero before they were allowing us to be

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Speaker 1: superheroes before exactly was Catwoman, Like you were a superhero

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Speaker 1: and there were so few jobs and I'm thinking, Gosha,

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Speaker 1: you had them all.

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Speaker 3: I wonder if, and I wonder if the way you

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Speaker 3: see yourself is so different from the way we see you.

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Speaker 2: I can say absolutely, yes, yeah, yeah, And that's that's

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Speaker 2: a whole dialogue because people say to me all the time,

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Speaker 2: you don't see yourself that way, and I don't, you know,

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Speaker 2: like I feel like I'm just playing Jane, you know,

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Speaker 2: and I treat people like that. I don't see myself

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Speaker 2: as a I'm holding myself above anyone else. I don't

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Speaker 2: think that, you know, I made this huge leap and

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Speaker 2: became that the NFL today you find me and it

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Speaker 2: still does today. So a leap of faith, you know,

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Speaker 2: And then you get to the point where they still

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Speaker 2: aren't giving you the job, even after you know, Brent

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Speaker 2: Musburger walked off the set in the audition and say

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Speaker 2: it's Jane or nobody, and he walked off the set

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Speaker 2: and didn't complete the other auditions. And they're still not

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Speaker 2: going to hire me because they're concerned that the Southern

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Speaker 2: Affiliates are going to bulk because there's one black on

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Speaker 2: the show, one white and one black, so two blacks

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Speaker 2: and one white wasn't going to work for the Southern Affiliates.

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Speaker 2: They sent my audition tapes down to the Southern Affiliates

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Speaker 2: and they said, Wow, she can really do this job,

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Speaker 2: but how can we fix this? Well, Jimmy the Greek

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Speaker 2: had already been on the show, but he was not

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Speaker 2: on the desk, so they put him on the desk.

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Speaker 2: So you've got two blacks on the desk, two whites

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Speaker 2: on the desk. Problem solved, but they still only gave

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Speaker 2: me a six week contract. I had to prove myself

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Speaker 2: all over again.

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Speaker 1: You write about that in the book, and I get

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Speaker 1: so infuriated because what's old is new and it's still

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Speaker 1: the same. We consistently in this business, after years of excellence,

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Speaker 1: black excellence more specifically, have to prove ourselves over and

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Speaker 1: over again every time we come into work, every time

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Speaker 1: we get in front of the camera. There's another level

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Speaker 1: of proving and expectations that we have to meet, and

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Speaker 1: they keep moving the goal line. And you tell a

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Speaker 1: story that I love and I wish you could just

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Speaker 1: share it with our viewers as well as our listeners

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Speaker 1: well about Muhammad Ali, And at that moment you would

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Speaker 1: think like, looking.

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Speaker 3: Back, well, this solidifies me.

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Speaker 1: They give you a six week contract to see if

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Speaker 1: you can do the job.

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Speaker 3: You more than do the job. But you hear them

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Speaker 3: asking if or how can they get an interview with

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Speaker 3: Muhammad Ali. Can you tell everyone about that?

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Speaker 2: Right? It was only my second week on the job,

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Speaker 2: second of the two weeks, and I had gone in

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Speaker 2: earlier to ask them for training. They refuse to offer

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Speaker 2: that to me. By training, opportunity to get on the

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Speaker 2: set and just feel what it was like and you know,

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Speaker 2: just be there and run through, you know what it looks,

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Speaker 2: what it's like to be on the show, I've never seen.

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Speaker 3: Now.

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Speaker 2: I've done live television before, but I had never been

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Speaker 2: in this position where you have fifteen sixteen games on

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Speaker 2: the monitor that you have to watch. And you have

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Speaker 2: to also understand that this was way back when, so

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Speaker 2: you didn't have all the digital that you have today.

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Speaker 2: You don't have people giving you information that you can

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Speaker 2: really use. My very first throw to tape was the

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Speaker 2: director telling me in my ear Jane, You're you're going

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Speaker 2: to have to fill for three minutes because the machine

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Speaker 2: just ate the tape.

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Speaker 3: Oh boy, no problem.

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Speaker 2: I hadn't even been on the set, you know. I

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Speaker 2: just met IRV like twenty minutes ago. I just met

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Speaker 2: everybody else on the set, and here now I'm winging

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Speaker 2: it for three minutes. Luckily it was Cleveland, Sam Retigliano,

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Speaker 2: and I was from Cleveland, so I knew a lot

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Speaker 2: that I could just come off the tip of my

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Speaker 2: hands with. But you know, it's it was a struggle.

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Speaker 2: But here we are and they're saying that, you know,

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Speaker 2: they can't allow. The argument that they were having with

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Speaker 2: Sports Spectacular was that they could not have a broadcast

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Speaker 2: and not have a post fight interview with Mahmad Ali,

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Speaker 2: who was fighting Leon Spinks that night in New Orleans.

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Speaker 2: They had no access to him at all. ABC had

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Speaker 2: all the rights and they wanted a post fight interview,

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Speaker 2: especially if he won. And so they're arguing, how we're

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Speaker 2: going to do this, and I turned around and I'm

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Speaker 2: just I don't work for them. I work for the NFL. Today.

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Speaker 2: This was Sportsbeck. So I just turned around. I say,

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Speaker 2: I can get you the interview. And they said, who

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Speaker 2: are you? So I'm the lady that can get you

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Speaker 2: the interview, and I don't know why they believe me.

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Speaker 2: They put me on a private jet sent me to

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Speaker 2: New Orleans. I met the crew there. I called Ali.

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Speaker 2: He was a friend of mine and so I said, Ali,

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Speaker 2: I really need to make this happen. He said, I'll

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Speaker 2: leave the key at the front desk. Meet me in

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Speaker 2: my suite and I'll come by before I go to

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Speaker 2: the interviews, which he did. He walked in the door.

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Speaker 2: I took a deep breath, and he walked into the

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Speaker 2: camera and he punched the lens and he said, I'd

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Speaker 2: only do this for my friend, Jane Kennedy.

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Speaker 3: I leant so much, I went so much.

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Speaker 2: I went back to New York. Sports Bet got their

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Speaker 2: peace on Saturday. They cut a clip for me on

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Speaker 2: my show On Sunday. I went home exhausted because I

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Speaker 2: was living in LA working in New York. I got

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Speaker 2: to La totally exhausted. In the morning, woke up, the

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Speaker 2: phones were ringing and they say, Jane Kennedy. I said, yes,

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Speaker 2: your contract has been picked up for the remainder of

390
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Speaker 2: the year. So those are the things that I believe in.

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Speaker 1: Janet say something you had to You had to get

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Speaker 1: an interview with the greatest boxer of all time for

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Speaker 1: them to understand that you've been excellent and you did

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Speaker 1: it on your own without help, And they're like, well,

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Speaker 1: I guess we can reward although you probably had been

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Speaker 1: so excellent throughout. It is that type of to me,

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Speaker 1: not plain at all. That's like excellence beyond because no

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Speaker 1: one had that access and they knew how valuable you

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Speaker 1: were at that moment.

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Speaker 3: But that's the type of proving that you had.

401
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Speaker 2: To do exactly every single day, well day. And then

402
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Speaker 2: you know, I was by living in New York, I

403
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Speaker 2: didn't have the opportunity to mingle with all the people

404
00:21:42,800 --> 00:21:46,440
Speaker 2: that were in New York. And so when they decided

405
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Speaker 2: two years later that they were going to fire me

406
00:21:49,320 --> 00:21:54,360
Speaker 2: without telling me, they signed a contract with Phillis George

407
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Speaker 2: in December. Super Bowl wasn't until February. I worked the

408
00:21:59,680 --> 00:22:04,280
Speaker 2: super and I'm thinking I still got a job, and

409
00:22:04,480 --> 00:22:07,359
Speaker 2: they put me the helicopter and I'm circling over a

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Speaker 2: beautiful Los Angeles and I'm getting ready to throw to

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Speaker 2: my pre tape package and they cut away to Phyllis

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Speaker 2: George in the Gingerbread House in Beverly Hills. So a

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Speaker 2: couple of times they did it. I jump out of

414
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Speaker 2: the helicopter when we land and earth Cross is standing

415
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Speaker 2: there and he just grabs me and he says, Jane,

416
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Speaker 2: there's nothing you can do. And I'm furious because I

417
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Speaker 2: don't know what happened, and they still did not tell

418
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Speaker 2: me that I was fired. I go to the desk

419
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Speaker 2: for the halftime and I said to Brent, don't tease me,

420
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Speaker 2: don't fool me, don't try to pull any more tricks

421
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Speaker 2: on me, because this is not going to work. And

422
00:22:47,480 --> 00:22:52,040
Speaker 2: so show us over. Several more months go by, they

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Speaker 2: have me booked to go to Korea for the Miss

424
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Speaker 2: Universe show and I'm going to be co hosting the

425
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Speaker 2: So I get ready to leave my house in Pasadena,

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Speaker 2: and as soon as I walk out of the door,

427
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Speaker 2: I get a notice, You're fired. And this is on

428
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Speaker 2: my way to the airport. Now I've got to rush

429
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Speaker 2: to the airport. We didn't need access to you know,

430
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Speaker 2: we don't have cell phones, we don't have access to

431
00:23:21,680 --> 00:23:24,200
Speaker 2: methods of getting to and there early in the morning,

432
00:23:24,240 --> 00:23:27,119
Speaker 2: I was nobody won't work, and so I have to

433
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Speaker 2: get on the plane. And the entire time on the plane,

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Speaker 2: I'm trying to figure out what happened. And this is

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00:23:32,560 --> 00:23:35,879
Speaker 2: months and months later after the Super Bowl, almost heading

436
00:23:35,920 --> 00:23:43,800
Speaker 2: into the next season. So here we are on the airplane.

437
00:23:44,080 --> 00:23:47,040
Speaker 2: I get off and I run into Richard Browntree, who

438
00:23:47,040 --> 00:23:50,280
Speaker 2: had just finished taping a movie, and he said, Hi,

439
00:23:50,359 --> 00:23:53,400
Speaker 2: let's go to lunch. And I sort of dismiss him,

440
00:23:53,720 --> 00:23:55,920
Speaker 2: and years later he said, Gane, I thought I'd done

441
00:23:55,960 --> 00:23:56,919
Speaker 2: something wrong.

442
00:23:59,080 --> 00:24:01,000
Speaker 3: Doing nothing like me anymore.

443
00:24:01,080 --> 00:24:02,560
Speaker 2: I said, oh my god, I said no, and I

444
00:24:02,640 --> 00:24:04,760
Speaker 2: told them what happened. I said, but you know that,

445
00:24:05,200 --> 00:24:07,600
Speaker 2: and I told I call my husband and I told

446
00:24:07,680 --> 00:24:10,320
Speaker 2: him what happened. And he said, why are you calling me?

447
00:24:10,359 --> 00:24:14,720
Speaker 2: You're wasting so much money and he hung up my distance.

448
00:24:15,160 --> 00:24:18,720
Speaker 2: I was crazy expensive at that time, and I had

449
00:24:18,840 --> 00:24:22,879
Speaker 2: nobody to turn to. And I'm there in Korea. But

450
00:24:24,359 --> 00:24:26,960
Speaker 2: my Q card guy that I'd known for years because

451
00:24:27,000 --> 00:24:29,840
Speaker 2: I've worked with them since the Dean Martin Show, and

452
00:24:30,200 --> 00:24:32,520
Speaker 2: he said, Jane, they've told me to write you out

453
00:24:32,560 --> 00:24:36,159
Speaker 2: of all the QUE cards. He said, I don't know

454
00:24:36,200 --> 00:24:39,160
Speaker 2: what's happening. And so when I get back to LA

455
00:24:39,600 --> 00:24:42,560
Speaker 2: I find out that they fired me. And they said

456
00:24:42,560 --> 00:24:44,840
Speaker 2: they fired me because I was working for another show,

457
00:24:45,440 --> 00:24:48,680
Speaker 2: but I had gotten permission from the President of Sports

458
00:24:48,720 --> 00:24:51,520
Speaker 2: to work that show, so they hired me back. Once

459
00:24:51,560 --> 00:24:54,760
Speaker 2: I presented the doctor letter, they hired me back. Two

460
00:24:54,760 --> 00:24:57,000
Speaker 2: weeks later, they fired me again, saying I can't do

461
00:24:57,080 --> 00:24:59,960
Speaker 2: the show because it's too taxing on me living in

462
00:25:00,119 --> 00:25:02,880
Speaker 2: Los Angeles working in New York and I said, well,

463
00:25:03,359 --> 00:25:06,520
Speaker 2: I work in LA two days, I'm in New York

464
00:25:06,720 --> 00:25:09,080
Speaker 2: two days. In the middle of the week, I'm going

465
00:25:09,119 --> 00:25:11,520
Speaker 2: on the road two days to do my interviews. Brent

466
00:25:11,640 --> 00:25:16,240
Speaker 2: Musburger is working two days in New York, five days

467
00:25:16,280 --> 00:25:21,120
Speaker 2: a week in La. As anchorings the evening news. You're

468
00:25:21,160 --> 00:25:24,920
Speaker 2: saying that a man can do it, but a woman can't. Yes,

469
00:25:25,560 --> 00:25:29,439
Speaker 2: And so they hire me back, and I've got Gloria Aldridge.

470
00:25:29,480 --> 00:25:33,160
Speaker 2: Now I'm working on my beat. So then about three

471
00:25:33,200 --> 00:25:36,800
Speaker 2: weeks later, they fire me again for just an innocuous reason,

472
00:25:36,840 --> 00:25:42,000
Speaker 2: and they paid me off my poultry salad salary, and

473
00:25:43,000 --> 00:25:45,600
Speaker 2: I was gone. And I still didn't know what had

474
00:25:45,640 --> 00:26:02,680
Speaker 2: happened until years later. What was it they wanted Phillis

475
00:26:02,680 --> 00:26:05,280
Speaker 2: back on the show. There's a book by a gentleman.

476
00:26:05,480 --> 00:26:08,600
Speaker 2: His name is rich Bondoalski, and he said the way

477
00:26:08,600 --> 00:26:11,680
Speaker 2: he describes it, he said, everybody knew that Jane was

478
00:26:11,720 --> 00:26:16,400
Speaker 2: gone in December except Jane. I didn't know until.

479
00:26:16,240 --> 00:26:19,800
Speaker 1: July why though, they just wanted her back on the show.

480
00:26:19,840 --> 00:26:23,000
Speaker 1: They didn't want you because why because you're black?

481
00:26:23,080 --> 00:26:24,160
Speaker 3: Because what I don't know.

482
00:26:24,640 --> 00:26:26,520
Speaker 2: I never did get a reason for that. I never

483
00:26:26,600 --> 00:26:31,440
Speaker 2: met Phyllis, But I just feel that they, in my opinion,

484
00:26:31,960 --> 00:26:37,919
Speaker 2: they wanted the Black Girl was getting too much attention.

485
00:26:38,280 --> 00:26:41,919
Speaker 3: Oh gosh, oh god, Jane, you're hurting my heart. Listen ratings.

486
00:26:42,080 --> 00:26:46,399
Speaker 2: My ratings were going up and the show was like

487
00:26:46,560 --> 00:26:50,080
Speaker 2: growing like crazy, and Phyllis wanted to come back because

488
00:26:50,080 --> 00:26:52,920
Speaker 2: the show was doing so well. This is my take.

489
00:26:54,040 --> 00:26:58,600
Speaker 2: I have no proof, but you know, the Black Girl

490
00:26:58,680 --> 00:27:03,960
Speaker 2: was gone, a little Miss America's back and the black

491
00:27:04,000 --> 00:27:06,359
Speaker 2: media is saying, you should have kept that job, Jane,

492
00:27:06,720 --> 00:27:09,520
Speaker 2: even if you had to kiss ass because it meant

493
00:27:09,560 --> 00:27:11,520
Speaker 2: so much to Black Americans.

494
00:27:12,520 --> 00:27:14,320
Speaker 1: You didn't have a choice. You were trying to keep

495
00:27:14,320 --> 00:27:17,639
Speaker 1: the job. Everybody back, that was enough to you.

496
00:27:18,119 --> 00:27:21,440
Speaker 2: The press said that I had left the show. They

497
00:27:21,440 --> 00:27:23,600
Speaker 2: did not. They refused to admit that they fired me.

498
00:27:24,600 --> 00:27:27,280
Speaker 2: They said that I fired because I left the show

499
00:27:27,320 --> 00:27:29,960
Speaker 2: because I wanted to do the other show. No matter

500
00:27:29,960 --> 00:27:32,760
Speaker 2: how many times I showed them the letter from the

501
00:27:32,800 --> 00:27:37,040
Speaker 2: president of CBS Sports, nobody cared. They just wanted to

502
00:27:37,040 --> 00:27:38,280
Speaker 2: get Phyllis back on the air.

503
00:27:39,000 --> 00:27:40,880
Speaker 3: What's your takeaway from that? Years later?

504
00:27:41,200 --> 00:27:43,560
Speaker 1: What have you what did you learn from that in

505
00:27:43,680 --> 00:27:44,959
Speaker 1: terms of what the business is.

506
00:27:46,200 --> 00:27:50,080
Speaker 2: The business is very cruel there. You know, you have

507
00:27:50,200 --> 00:27:52,879
Speaker 2: to be very sure of yourself and you have to

508
00:27:52,920 --> 00:28:00,280
Speaker 2: be willing to take huge leaps of confidence and never

509
00:28:00,320 --> 00:28:04,080
Speaker 2: take it personal because I don't think it is. And

510
00:28:04,720 --> 00:28:07,439
Speaker 2: I say that in duality because as a black woman,

511
00:28:07,520 --> 00:28:10,600
Speaker 2: I do when I see what they are doing, and

512
00:28:10,640 --> 00:28:13,000
Speaker 2: you know, you can't get a job just because you're black,

513
00:28:13,359 --> 00:28:16,520
Speaker 2: and that all women across the board, not just in sports,

514
00:28:16,800 --> 00:28:18,959
Speaker 2: and you can't get the job because you're black. So

515
00:28:19,000 --> 00:28:23,120
Speaker 2: I do. I do value that. But the other opportunity

516
00:28:23,720 --> 00:28:26,399
Speaker 2: that comes along is, you know, they don't want you

517
00:28:26,560 --> 00:28:30,359
Speaker 2: to succeed, and we don't have enough black women in

518
00:28:30,359 --> 00:28:36,320
Speaker 2: the C suites to assist you in your access to success.

519
00:28:36,880 --> 00:28:40,880
Speaker 2: There's a show, there's a show called The History of

520
00:28:40,920 --> 00:28:44,560
Speaker 2: the Black Quarterback. Oh yeah, okay. It aired on Super

521
00:28:44,560 --> 00:28:48,200
Speaker 2: Bowl Sunday, and it talked about you know, and it

522
00:28:48,240 --> 00:28:50,960
Speaker 2: was done by it was produced by a black woman,

523
00:28:51,760 --> 00:28:52,440
Speaker 2: wasn't it, Maria?

524
00:28:52,840 --> 00:28:53,200
Speaker 3: Yeah?

525
00:28:53,280 --> 00:28:59,520
Speaker 2: Yeah yeah. And here's this amazing show. And you start

526
00:28:59,560 --> 00:29:03,400
Speaker 2: with Doug Williams, who's the first black quarterback to ever

527
00:29:03,760 --> 00:29:08,440
Speaker 2: win a Super Bowl with five touchdowns, and you know

528
00:29:08,520 --> 00:29:13,920
Speaker 2: there's can you how can you not have that promoted?

529
00:29:14,440 --> 00:29:17,920
Speaker 2: I didn't see any promotion whatsoever on that. And you've

530
00:29:17,920 --> 00:29:20,720
Speaker 2: got this entire super Bowl package, all of this is

531
00:29:20,760 --> 00:29:23,440
Speaker 2: going on the week leading up to Super Bowl, all

532
00:29:23,480 --> 00:29:27,280
Speaker 2: of this, and you have this amazing piece of footage,

533
00:29:27,400 --> 00:29:31,120
Speaker 2: this documentary that talks about black quarterbacks in the NFL.

534
00:29:32,040 --> 00:29:34,520
Speaker 2: And I don't know how many people saw it. I

535
00:29:34,600 --> 00:29:35,240
Speaker 2: never saw it.

536
00:29:35,840 --> 00:29:38,240
Speaker 3: Yeah, and it was I'm looking out.

537
00:29:38,320 --> 00:29:42,560
Speaker 1: It was a Maria and Lorne Michaels and NFL Films

538
00:29:42,600 --> 00:29:46,240
Speaker 1: and Ricky Hughes, she directed it.

539
00:29:46,320 --> 00:29:49,680
Speaker 2: So four part series. How many people knew about it?

540
00:29:50,080 --> 00:29:54,080
Speaker 3: Nobody? Nobody. And that's another thing too that we could

541
00:29:54,120 --> 00:29:54,680
Speaker 3: talk about.

542
00:29:54,840 --> 00:29:57,720
Speaker 1: I think that when you do get these opportunities, they

543
00:29:57,800 --> 00:29:59,840
Speaker 1: want you to be quiet about them because too much

544
00:30:00,120 --> 00:30:03,240
Speaker 1: tension is too much attention. So I to your point

545
00:30:03,280 --> 00:30:06,400
Speaker 1: of what you were dealing with earlier, I just I

546
00:30:06,440 --> 00:30:09,320
Speaker 1: don't know. It breaks my heart, It really does that

547
00:30:09,400 --> 00:30:12,320
Speaker 1: you had to deal with that, that we still have

548
00:30:12,360 --> 00:30:13,880
Speaker 1: to deal with that you have to deal with we

549
00:30:14,040 --> 00:30:16,880
Speaker 1: still have to deal with it. But I do know

550
00:30:17,600 --> 00:30:23,200
Speaker 1: that even for that time, it still was significant. It

551
00:30:23,240 --> 00:30:24,920
Speaker 1: could have been two years, it could have been two months,

552
00:30:24,920 --> 00:30:29,480
Speaker 1: but it was so significant and so important just for

553
00:30:29,520 --> 00:30:31,600
Speaker 1: that short period of time, whether it's almost like our

554
00:30:31,640 --> 00:30:35,680
Speaker 1: first black president. So those eight years may seem so

555
00:30:36,000 --> 00:30:38,360
Speaker 1: long ago and just that short period of time, but

556
00:30:38,640 --> 00:30:41,160
Speaker 1: it was important to be able to visualize it and

557
00:30:41,200 --> 00:30:46,120
Speaker 1: see it, and it changed history. It changed you changed history. Yes,

558
00:30:47,000 --> 00:30:51,960
Speaker 1: do you feel now that you have a different level

559
00:30:52,080 --> 00:30:54,720
Speaker 1: or a different measure of respect?

560
00:30:56,440 --> 00:31:00,760
Speaker 2: That's a yes and no for me. Okay, And I'll

561
00:31:00,800 --> 00:31:04,880
Speaker 2: start with no because it's easier. I've been out of

562
00:31:04,920 --> 00:31:07,200
Speaker 2: the spotlight for a long time. It would be different

563
00:31:07,200 --> 00:31:12,080
Speaker 2: if I were still consistently working. So I acknowledge that

564
00:31:12,120 --> 00:31:15,800
Speaker 2: there are people in their thirties twenties that don't know

565
00:31:15,840 --> 00:31:20,040
Speaker 2: who I am. They were probably babies, you know. So yeah,

566
00:31:20,080 --> 00:31:24,280
Speaker 2: there's that I acknowledge. But I do think that there

567
00:31:24,320 --> 00:31:29,240
Speaker 2: are things that I have been I wouldn't be trying

568
00:31:29,280 --> 00:31:33,640
Speaker 2: to relaunch my career if I didn't believe that there

569
00:31:33,720 --> 00:31:36,720
Speaker 2: was that it was still possible. And I think that

570
00:31:36,880 --> 00:31:42,480
Speaker 2: it's very, very, very crucial for us to all know

571
00:31:42,560 --> 00:31:44,720
Speaker 2: that we have to work together to make this happen,

572
00:31:46,320 --> 00:31:48,240
Speaker 2: and because I don't think that it's going to be

573
00:31:48,280 --> 00:31:52,080
Speaker 2: handed to us again, because unfortunately the politics in this

574
00:31:52,200 --> 00:31:57,640
Speaker 2: country to a place where some people come out of

575
00:31:57,680 --> 00:32:02,080
Speaker 2: the walls, and they don't want you to succeed. They've

576
00:32:02,080 --> 00:32:04,880
Speaker 2: always been there, you know, but they didn't come out

577
00:32:04,920 --> 00:32:09,080
Speaker 2: of the walls until they've been allowed to in the

578
00:32:09,120 --> 00:32:13,920
Speaker 2: past few years. And then there's people like you know,

579
00:32:14,000 --> 00:32:16,360
Speaker 2: like you know, I'm still my mind blowing. I don't

580
00:32:16,360 --> 00:32:19,520
Speaker 2: know if this is timeless in terms of how you're

581
00:32:19,520 --> 00:32:22,560
Speaker 2: going to air the show, but I'm still stunned at

582
00:32:22,600 --> 00:32:25,800
Speaker 2: the fact. You know, I followed the monks and their journey.

583
00:32:26,040 --> 00:32:28,440
Speaker 2: I don't know if you did. I followed their journey

584
00:32:28,840 --> 00:32:33,600
Speaker 2: from Fort Worth, Texas, oh the walking, the Walk for Peace,

585
00:32:34,600 --> 00:32:38,240
Speaker 2: to Washington, d C. I don't know if I just

586
00:32:38,320 --> 00:32:41,479
Speaker 2: missed it, but I following it. I should have seen it.

587
00:32:41,720 --> 00:32:44,880
Speaker 2: I didn't see anything acknowledging them when they landed in

588
00:32:44,960 --> 00:32:50,080
Speaker 2: d C President's office and they had to extend their

589
00:32:50,640 --> 00:32:55,520
Speaker 2: walk and go into Baltimore, where the black governor received

590
00:32:55,560 --> 00:32:57,040
Speaker 2: them all at his home.

591
00:32:58,720 --> 00:33:05,960
Speaker 1: Yeah Wes Moore, great guy, Yeah, yeah, I this is Keys,

592
00:33:06,480 --> 00:33:08,800
Speaker 1: this is where we are right now, the state of

593
00:33:08,840 --> 00:33:09,520
Speaker 1: this country.

594
00:33:10,360 --> 00:33:13,360
Speaker 3: But I still feel like what you're when you say

595
00:33:13,400 --> 00:33:16,880
Speaker 3: relaunching your career, I still feel like there is and

596
00:33:16,920 --> 00:33:18,680
Speaker 3: I don't I don't have the words for it, and

597
00:33:19,240 --> 00:33:21,200
Speaker 3: maybe we can look back on this, you know, a

598
00:33:21,280 --> 00:33:21,880
Speaker 3: year from now.

599
00:33:21,920 --> 00:33:24,520
Speaker 1: But there is something in the zeigeist in the universe

600
00:33:24,560 --> 00:33:27,440
Speaker 1: that tells me that this is going to be a

601
00:33:27,560 --> 00:33:31,360
Speaker 1: very successful relaunch. Uh, this country currently will have to

602
00:33:31,360 --> 00:33:33,880
Speaker 1: look at its history so it could it can establish

603
00:33:33,920 --> 00:33:37,000
Speaker 1: its future. And that has to do with what you've

604
00:33:37,000 --> 00:33:40,040
Speaker 1: been able to contribute and who you are and acknowledging

605
00:33:40,080 --> 00:33:43,760
Speaker 1: your space and place in history. And I think that that,

606
00:33:44,000 --> 00:33:47,320
Speaker 1: to me is what I'm feeling that when we share

607
00:33:47,320 --> 00:33:50,320
Speaker 1: at the stage at the twenty fifth University of Love

608
00:33:50,320 --> 00:33:53,440
Speaker 1: and Basketball, the HBCU first Look, there were so many

609
00:33:53,520 --> 00:33:55,720
Speaker 1: of my friends who were there who went and bought

610
00:33:55,800 --> 00:33:57,720
Speaker 1: your book and said, oh my god, I didn't know

611
00:33:57,760 --> 00:33:58,360
Speaker 1: her story.

612
00:33:58,440 --> 00:34:00,320
Speaker 3: I have to have it. I I just to me

613
00:34:00,640 --> 00:34:01,400
Speaker 3: by what.

614
00:34:01,320 --> 00:34:03,920
Speaker 1: You were able to, what you were able to accomplish,

615
00:34:04,000 --> 00:34:07,160
Speaker 1: because it just doesn't happen anymore. In the book, you

616
00:34:07,200 --> 00:34:11,439
Speaker 1: talk about or maybe you set things straight, you set

617
00:34:11,600 --> 00:34:15,320
Speaker 1: narratives straight, You talk about your relationships your ex husband

618
00:34:15,760 --> 00:34:17,000
Speaker 1: and you're currently married.

619
00:34:17,320 --> 00:34:20,640
Speaker 3: Was that hard for you to do to tell because

620
00:34:20,680 --> 00:34:21,719
Speaker 3: I understand that. I know.

621
00:34:21,760 --> 00:34:23,680
Speaker 1: For me, I try to I keep everything so close

622
00:34:23,719 --> 00:34:25,879
Speaker 1: to the chest it's this thing that we are. We're

623
00:34:25,960 --> 00:34:30,080
Speaker 1: very very private people in this space, while we ask

624
00:34:30,120 --> 00:34:33,840
Speaker 1: everyone all of their business and questions.

625
00:34:32,719 --> 00:34:34,280
Speaker 3: While we dig into their lives.

626
00:34:34,640 --> 00:34:37,320
Speaker 1: But was that hard for you to tell that story?

627
00:34:37,400 --> 00:34:41,320
Speaker 1: And what made you decide it's time to reshare that story.

628
00:34:42,040 --> 00:34:45,279
Speaker 2: It was extremely difficult for me to include that. My

629
00:34:45,440 --> 00:34:48,520
Speaker 2: first several drafts of the book did not include it

630
00:34:48,600 --> 00:34:51,600
Speaker 2: at all. My first draft did not even talk about

631
00:34:51,640 --> 00:34:54,520
Speaker 2: that I was married. Before I thought, you know, I

632
00:34:54,560 --> 00:34:57,439
Speaker 2: want to talk about just me, who I am, how

633
00:34:57,440 --> 00:35:01,000
Speaker 2: I got here. And then I started realizing, you know,

634
00:35:01,080 --> 00:35:02,920
Speaker 2: I have to tell the full story. You know, everybody's

635
00:35:02,920 --> 00:35:04,960
Speaker 2: going to buy the book, you know, so you have

636
00:35:05,040 --> 00:35:08,160
Speaker 2: to have to make it appealing because they I was

637
00:35:08,200 --> 00:35:14,120
Speaker 2: so successful during my tenure in Hollywood.

638
00:35:14,960 --> 00:35:15,319
Speaker 3: I was.

639
00:35:16,000 --> 00:35:17,760
Speaker 2: I had gotten to a point where I had started

640
00:35:17,800 --> 00:35:21,200
Speaker 2: making the same amount of money as my white co cort.

641
00:35:21,920 --> 00:35:25,560
Speaker 2: I was at a place where I was earning deals

642
00:35:25,560 --> 00:35:28,920
Speaker 2: with Coca Cola six year contract going all around the

643
00:35:28,920 --> 00:35:35,280
Speaker 2: world representing Coca Cola USA. I had my exercise platform

644
00:35:35,880 --> 00:35:38,520
Speaker 2: in number three in the country, along with Jane Fond

645
00:35:38,560 --> 00:35:42,239
Speaker 2: and Richard Simmons. I was achieving so many levels of

646
00:35:42,320 --> 00:35:45,040
Speaker 2: success that had nothing to do with sports. And I

647
00:35:45,080 --> 00:35:50,560
Speaker 2: also was a moderator on a host on Greatest Sports

648
00:35:50,640 --> 00:35:54,440
Speaker 2: Legends and they would usually have a different host every year. Well,

649
00:35:54,480 --> 00:35:58,160
Speaker 2: the show ran for thirty years. I was back three

650
00:35:58,320 --> 00:36:02,399
Speaker 2: I'm sorry, six straight years I did that show, and

651
00:36:02,640 --> 00:36:09,439
Speaker 2: we had people like, who was it? They had asked

652
00:36:09,520 --> 00:36:12,000
Speaker 2: him so many times, Bill Russell, They had asked him

653
00:36:12,040 --> 00:36:14,360
Speaker 2: so many times to do the show, and he always refused.

654
00:36:15,000 --> 00:36:17,400
Speaker 2: And when I got on the show, he called, he

655
00:36:17,400 --> 00:36:19,160
Speaker 2: said I want to do the show and they said why,

656
00:36:19,680 --> 00:36:21,920
Speaker 2: and so he didn't say anything. He said, I'm just

657
00:36:21,960 --> 00:36:24,440
Speaker 2: you know, so they said come on. When he got

658
00:36:24,520 --> 00:36:27,879
Speaker 2: on swer before we started, I said, I don't know.

659
00:36:28,200 --> 00:36:30,000
Speaker 2: Why did you come and do the show for me?

660
00:36:30,600 --> 00:36:32,919
Speaker 2: He said, because you're creating a legacy and I want

661
00:36:32,920 --> 00:36:36,360
Speaker 2: to help you build it. You might and so and

662
00:36:36,480 --> 00:36:38,880
Speaker 2: Walter Payton would talk about, you know, how proud he

663
00:36:39,000 --> 00:36:41,400
Speaker 2: was that I was, that I was in the position

664
00:36:41,520 --> 00:36:45,520
Speaker 2: that I was, and he would send out an edict

665
00:36:45,560 --> 00:36:50,160
Speaker 2: throughout the NFL teams, We're going to take care of

666
00:36:50,200 --> 00:36:52,960
Speaker 2: our Jane. We're going to take care of our Jane.

667
00:36:52,960 --> 00:36:56,439
Speaker 2: We're going to see that she succeeds. I had how

668
00:36:56,440 --> 00:37:00,000
Speaker 2: could I walk away from that. I had so much

669
00:37:00,280 --> 00:37:04,480
Speaker 2: love in my heart for what I was doing. I

670
00:37:04,520 --> 00:37:13,800
Speaker 2: respected my peers. I was living a life that was glam,

671
00:37:14,440 --> 00:37:18,240
Speaker 2: but it never felt glam to me. It always felt

672
00:37:18,480 --> 00:37:21,600
Speaker 2: just plain Jane for me. You know, Like I'll talk

673
00:37:21,640 --> 00:37:25,120
Speaker 2: about the night I went to a speaking engagement with

674
00:37:27,719 --> 00:37:32,799
Speaker 2: Walter Payton and Hi Gary Leonard. Yes, so anyway, you know,

675
00:37:33,120 --> 00:37:35,680
Speaker 2: we're doing the banquet together and then they say, well,

676
00:37:35,680 --> 00:37:37,680
Speaker 2: you know, you know you never eat banquet food, you know,

677
00:37:37,760 --> 00:37:40,000
Speaker 2: so we're gathering. He said, well, let's meet in the

678
00:37:40,040 --> 00:37:42,040
Speaker 2: suite and I go change my clothes, go up to

679
00:37:42,080 --> 00:37:45,319
Speaker 2: the sweep and they've got tons of shrimp, cocktail and

680
00:37:45,360 --> 00:37:48,120
Speaker 2: all this, all the food, just know, just fill to

681
00:37:48,200 --> 00:37:51,960
Speaker 2: the brim and sitting. I mean, how many people would

682
00:37:51,960 --> 00:37:54,719
Speaker 2: have that chance, you know, how many people would have

683
00:37:54,760 --> 00:38:00,640
Speaker 2: the chance to sit alongside Mama Muhammad Ali and just

684
00:38:00,760 --> 00:38:02,120
Speaker 2: swap stories with him.

685
00:38:02,360 --> 00:38:04,960
Speaker 3: It's it's it's unheard of.

686
00:38:05,360 --> 00:38:09,399
Speaker 1: I can't tell you a person within proximity that could

687
00:38:09,400 --> 00:38:11,880
Speaker 1: tell that story outside of Laila, Like, I don't know

688
00:38:11,960 --> 00:38:14,319
Speaker 1: anybody who could ever say these are the moments that

689
00:38:14,400 --> 00:38:17,720
Speaker 1: can still remember that, uh in the way that was history.

690
00:38:17,800 --> 00:38:21,920
Speaker 1: Muhammad Ali to me, there is no equivalent. Everyone aspires to,

691
00:38:23,040 --> 00:38:26,040
Speaker 1: there is no equivalent. Athletes wish that they were built

692
00:38:26,239 --> 00:38:29,680
Speaker 1: that way to be him, and many emulate what he

693
00:38:29,719 --> 00:38:32,440
Speaker 1: was able to do on and off the in terms

694
00:38:32,440 --> 00:38:35,040
Speaker 1: of basketball court or in and out of the boxing ring.

695
00:38:35,600 --> 00:38:39,040
Speaker 1: I think that that is how just as you talk

696
00:38:39,080 --> 00:38:41,040
Speaker 1: about that, that's how many of us see you as

697
00:38:41,080 --> 00:38:44,280
Speaker 1: you tell these stories, and how you are still here

698
00:38:44,760 --> 00:38:48,960
Speaker 1: able to speak so in a first first hand accounts

699
00:38:50,120 --> 00:38:52,359
Speaker 1: of our legends, like that's a that's a TV show

700
00:38:52,360 --> 00:38:56,040
Speaker 1: in itself, and you know the people that you know right,

701
00:38:56,239 --> 00:38:58,520
Speaker 1: Like you're literally telling us who these people are taking

702
00:38:58,600 --> 00:39:01,759
Speaker 1: us behind the scenes, you know, off their ailments are off,

703
00:39:01,800 --> 00:39:04,399
Speaker 1: and you're telling us who they are and what they accomplished.

704
00:39:04,600 --> 00:39:06,440
Speaker 1: They're out of the ring, and we're seeing them in

705
00:39:06,440 --> 00:39:08,319
Speaker 1: this way. You mentioned Brett. I'm like, no one knows

706
00:39:08,320 --> 00:39:11,160
Speaker 1: Brett Musburger that way. We have our own ways of

707
00:39:11,239 --> 00:39:13,160
Speaker 1: knowing him, but not the way in which you knew

708
00:39:13,200 --> 00:39:15,239
Speaker 1: him in an intimate way where he is, you know,

709
00:39:15,960 --> 00:39:18,360
Speaker 1: you know, saying that you have to be his co hosts.

710
00:39:18,360 --> 00:39:21,960
Speaker 1: Like I think these stories as you explain them are

711
00:39:22,000 --> 00:39:26,240
Speaker 1: simply extraordinary and far from playing. But I love the idea.

712
00:39:26,760 --> 00:39:28,960
Speaker 1: Perhaps that's why you were so good at what you do,

713
00:39:29,040 --> 00:39:30,520
Speaker 1: and you are so good at what you do because

714
00:39:30,680 --> 00:39:33,160
Speaker 1: you see yourself as just someone there to do your

715
00:39:33,200 --> 00:39:37,319
Speaker 1: job in treating everyone that way in the book, I

716
00:39:37,680 --> 00:39:41,400
Speaker 1: wonder if you thought being pretty held you back.

717
00:39:41,800 --> 00:39:43,480
Speaker 3: There's a pretty tax that we call.

718
00:39:43,360 --> 00:39:48,720
Speaker 2: In our business pretty tex. Yes, it does exist. I'd

719
00:39:48,719 --> 00:39:52,799
Speaker 2: have to say that it worked for me and against me.

720
00:39:55,800 --> 00:40:00,399
Speaker 2: For me in ways that it allowed access. The first

721
00:40:00,480 --> 00:40:03,040
Speaker 2: time I met Mohammed, Okay, let's just go with that.

722
00:40:04,719 --> 00:40:10,000
Speaker 2: There was a conference, an industry conference here in Los Angeles,

723
00:40:10,640 --> 00:40:13,320
Speaker 2: and Leon and I are on the floor of the

724
00:40:14,120 --> 00:40:17,640
Speaker 2: pavilion and we hear that Muhammad Ali is upstairs. Now

725
00:40:17,680 --> 00:40:21,879
Speaker 2: we had already crushed the streets and broken down the gate,

726
00:40:22,120 --> 00:40:25,120
Speaker 2: climbed over the gate to go watch him by Troe

727
00:40:25,200 --> 00:40:27,680
Speaker 2: Fraser when we were kids in Cleveland, So you know,

728
00:40:27,760 --> 00:40:29,759
Speaker 2: the idea that he's here, we're of course we're going

729
00:40:29,800 --> 00:40:32,440
Speaker 2: to go upstairs try to lead him, right. So we

730
00:40:32,560 --> 00:40:35,160
Speaker 2: get up there and there's so many people in the

731
00:40:35,200 --> 00:40:37,960
Speaker 2: press just around him and people from the hotel, and

732
00:40:38,000 --> 00:40:41,440
Speaker 2: they're crowding the hallways, and so you know, we're pushing

733
00:40:41,440 --> 00:40:43,640
Speaker 2: our way forward, and I had been on the Dean

734
00:40:43,680 --> 00:40:48,080
Speaker 2: Martin Show two years before and the name of the

735
00:40:48,120 --> 00:40:54,000
Speaker 2: girls was called the Dingling Sisters. Oh Okay dancers, and

736
00:40:54,040 --> 00:40:57,040
Speaker 2: we were called the Dean Martin's Dingling Sisters. So we

737
00:40:57,200 --> 00:40:59,879
Speaker 2: walked into the room and the first thing Ali does

738
00:41:00,360 --> 00:41:03,840
Speaker 2: points at me and he says, that's there, goes that girl,

739
00:41:03,960 --> 00:41:06,680
Speaker 2: the Dingling system. Look at that girl, the Dingling Sister.

740
00:41:07,239 --> 00:41:08,600
Speaker 3: Any really yeah?

741
00:41:08,640 --> 00:41:10,279
Speaker 2: And he says, come on up here and sit down

742
00:41:10,320 --> 00:41:13,759
Speaker 2: with me. And then you know, I'm sitting I'm two

743
00:41:13,880 --> 00:41:16,560
Speaker 2: years in Hollywood and I'm sitting on the desk with

744
00:41:16,680 --> 00:41:20,040
Speaker 2: Muhammad Ali. How am I? How is that possible in

745
00:41:20,080 --> 00:41:20,719
Speaker 2: a lifetime?

746
00:41:21,239 --> 00:41:25,200
Speaker 1: Well worked in your favor, I said, I said, Jane,

747
00:41:25,239 --> 00:41:27,279
Speaker 1: I can only imagine because it's still to this day,

748
00:41:27,360 --> 00:41:31,279
Speaker 1: like you know, it's very you know when I say,

749
00:41:31,320 --> 00:41:33,120
Speaker 1: I said it as a joke, and the kids say, like,

750
00:41:33,160 --> 00:41:34,759
Speaker 1: you haven't been a choke hold. Like when you walk

751
00:41:34,800 --> 00:41:36,919
Speaker 1: in a room, everyone's you know, you take the broth

752
00:41:36,920 --> 00:41:40,439
Speaker 1: away and I want to be in proximity or near. So, yes,

753
00:41:40,480 --> 00:41:42,239
Speaker 1: it does work in your favor, but it can also

754
00:41:42,400 --> 00:41:46,560
Speaker 1: work against you because jealous people. I mean, I'm sure

755
00:41:46,600 --> 00:41:49,920
Speaker 1: you've had you you share stories which you felt that

756
00:41:50,040 --> 00:41:52,160
Speaker 1: could be backlash because of what you look like.

757
00:41:53,520 --> 00:41:58,640
Speaker 2: I agree, you know, and I think that every girl

758
00:41:58,680 --> 00:42:03,319
Speaker 2: that's quote unquote pretty sure or perceived to be or

759
00:42:03,440 --> 00:42:10,440
Speaker 2: actually is, you know, it's it's hard to navigate that road.

760
00:42:13,160 --> 00:42:17,799
Speaker 2: What I look at is when I see my looks like,

761
00:42:17,840 --> 00:42:20,400
Speaker 2: because I have doubts, you know, I look at myself

762
00:42:20,400 --> 00:42:22,480
Speaker 2: in the mirror and I see, no, that's not working.

763
00:42:22,760 --> 00:42:24,719
Speaker 2: Oh my gosh, I'm too heavy. I got to lose weight.

764
00:42:24,760 --> 00:42:27,239
Speaker 2: Oh my gosh. All of the things you know, I

765
00:42:29,040 --> 00:42:31,560
Speaker 2: do I let my hair go gray? Do I you know,

766
00:42:31,640 --> 00:42:34,640
Speaker 2: all of the things make you doubt who you are?

767
00:42:34,760 --> 00:42:36,960
Speaker 2: You know? So one thing is do I let my

768
00:42:37,040 --> 00:42:39,000
Speaker 2: heart go gray? And then will my fans still know

769
00:42:39,080 --> 00:42:41,200
Speaker 2: me when I've got a book coming out? So that

770
00:42:41,360 --> 00:42:44,440
Speaker 2: was a big question. But you know, COVID hit. So

771
00:42:44,520 --> 00:42:46,440
Speaker 2: I let you know my ma hair grow as a

772
00:42:46,480 --> 00:42:50,960
Speaker 2: test and I liked it, and to me, it made

773
00:42:51,120 --> 00:42:54,920
Speaker 2: it resonated way more than I expected because I'm looking

774
00:42:54,920 --> 00:42:58,880
Speaker 2: at myself and I say, playing Jane, how can I

775
00:42:58,960 --> 00:43:04,040
Speaker 2: be playing Jane? And I'm dying my hair? So when

776
00:43:04,040 --> 00:43:07,080
Speaker 2: the book comes out, I'm gonna be up there talking

777
00:43:07,080 --> 00:43:09,879
Speaker 2: about on playing Jane with dyed black hair.

778
00:43:12,080 --> 00:43:14,279
Speaker 3: That wouldn't have even occurred to me.

779
00:43:14,400 --> 00:43:17,040
Speaker 1: Jane, that would even occurred to me, I would have

780
00:43:17,040 --> 00:43:19,680
Speaker 1: been like, that's why. But it looks beautiful as is.

781
00:43:19,719 --> 00:43:21,600
Speaker 1: But I wouldn't even have thought twice about it.

782
00:43:22,000 --> 00:43:24,840
Speaker 2: Thank you. But yeah, there's you know sometimes that and

783
00:43:24,880 --> 00:43:27,239
Speaker 2: people will say, oh, she's thinks she's too pretty, and

784
00:43:27,280 --> 00:43:29,399
Speaker 2: they don't you know, they count you out no matter

785
00:43:29,440 --> 00:43:33,440
Speaker 2: how intelligent you are, never matter, doesn't matter. Yeah, but

786
00:43:33,520 --> 00:43:36,480
Speaker 2: that's on the person. That's not that's on the person

787
00:43:36,560 --> 00:43:40,040
Speaker 2: that's making those decisions. It's not the individual. And my

788
00:43:40,120 --> 00:43:43,280
Speaker 2: mom always taught me, don't worry about that person, worry

789
00:43:43,280 --> 00:43:44,040
Speaker 2: about yourself.

790
00:43:56,719 --> 00:44:00,399
Speaker 1: In the book, there's this beautiful there's so many. First

791
00:44:00,440 --> 00:44:03,480
Speaker 1: of all, I love a book everyone listening and watching.

792
00:44:03,600 --> 00:44:04,840
Speaker 3: I love a book with images.

793
00:44:04,920 --> 00:44:09,279
Speaker 1: And there are so many great images of you modeling,

794
00:44:10,000 --> 00:44:12,920
Speaker 1: living your life, doing what you do. Oh my god,

795
00:44:12,960 --> 00:44:15,520
Speaker 1: I mean they're just they're stunning, speaking of gorgeous. And

796
00:44:15,560 --> 00:44:19,040
Speaker 1: then there's a picture of you. I believe this is

797
00:44:19,040 --> 00:44:20,520
Speaker 1: with your your husband, and.

798
00:44:20,480 --> 00:44:23,399
Speaker 3: You are he You're wearing a white dress and you're

799
00:44:23,719 --> 00:44:26,799
Speaker 3: leaning back like so my favorite.

800
00:44:26,800 --> 00:44:29,480
Speaker 1: My favorite, it's right I'm going to re emulate that

801
00:44:29,520 --> 00:44:30,680
Speaker 1: I just got to find a husband.

802
00:44:30,680 --> 00:44:32,640
Speaker 3: I'm going to redo this about five.

803
00:44:32,960 --> 00:44:35,520
Speaker 2: Hey, do that? Do that? Because that's how I find

804
00:44:35,520 --> 00:44:36,040
Speaker 2: my husband.

805
00:44:36,320 --> 00:44:36,839
Speaker 3: What do you mean?

806
00:44:37,200 --> 00:44:39,280
Speaker 2: That was the first staid me and my husband met,

807
00:44:39,560 --> 00:44:39,879
Speaker 2: and I.

808
00:44:39,920 --> 00:44:41,920
Speaker 3: Was just going to read Okay, Yes, I was just

809
00:44:41,960 --> 00:44:45,040
Speaker 3: going to read that. Okay, So for the first time.

810
00:44:44,880 --> 00:44:47,760
Speaker 1: I met Bill Overton was a photo shoot for Lamont

811
00:44:48,360 --> 00:44:50,279
Speaker 1: Who is it mac Lamore Maclamore?

812
00:44:50,680 --> 00:44:54,000
Speaker 3: Yes, okay, you tell the story. Tell the story. I

813
00:44:54,560 --> 00:44:57,120
Speaker 3: absolutely love this photo.

814
00:44:57,719 --> 00:44:59,799
Speaker 2: I do too. It's one of my favorites for sure.

815
00:45:00,360 --> 00:45:05,640
Speaker 2: But let me also say that my dear friend Lamont

816
00:45:05,760 --> 00:45:11,800
Speaker 2: maclamore asked away and the funeral was yesterday, So wasn't.

817
00:45:11,560 --> 00:45:15,520
Speaker 3: It really Oh my god, I didn't know that. Yeah,

818
00:45:15,520 --> 00:45:16,200
Speaker 3: Oh my god.

819
00:45:16,239 --> 00:45:18,000
Speaker 2: I apologize for a little bit long.

820
00:45:19,719 --> 00:45:21,880
Speaker 1: Oh my gosh, I'm sorry. I had no idea. I

821
00:45:21,920 --> 00:45:23,160
Speaker 1: wouldn't have asked.

822
00:45:23,440 --> 00:45:25,480
Speaker 2: Oh that's okay. He's my dearest friend in life, and

823
00:45:25,520 --> 00:45:29,200
Speaker 2: I'm proud of to talk about him. I wouldn't have

824
00:45:29,320 --> 00:45:33,600
Speaker 2: it any other way. Lam Maclamore was the founding member

825
00:45:33,640 --> 00:45:36,879
Speaker 2: of the Fifth Dimensions, and most people remember them by

826
00:45:37,040 --> 00:45:42,399
Speaker 2: you know, Up, Up and Away, the song global hit

827
00:45:42,600 --> 00:45:49,080
Speaker 2: sensation and ten years talk about a quick quick reaction. Man,

828
00:45:49,239 --> 00:45:53,480
Speaker 2: the world just loved them, and ten years into it,

829
00:45:54,480 --> 00:45:57,920
Speaker 2: one less felt to answer all of their up, up

830
00:45:57,960 --> 00:46:02,839
Speaker 2: and wayh my beautiful balloon. You know the Age of Aquarius,

831
00:46:02,880 --> 00:46:07,279
Speaker 2: you know all of those wonderful songs, and the other

832
00:46:07,360 --> 00:46:13,040
Speaker 2: members won his past. But Florence and Billy and Maryland

833
00:46:14,400 --> 00:46:17,520
Speaker 2: McCoo davis, they were there at the funeral yesterday.

834
00:46:18,440 --> 00:46:21,719
Speaker 1: So you went to the funeral yesterday. I am so sorry.

835
00:46:21,840 --> 00:46:23,640
Speaker 1: I am really sorry for your loss.

836
00:46:24,120 --> 00:46:27,799
Speaker 2: Yeah, and his wife. As soon as I walked in

837
00:46:27,880 --> 00:46:30,279
Speaker 2: the room, his wife came over and she grabbed my

838
00:46:30,320 --> 00:46:32,959
Speaker 2: hand and she took me to the urn and she says,

839
00:46:33,000 --> 00:46:34,960
Speaker 2: we have to touch the urn together because we were

840
00:46:35,000 --> 00:46:36,040
Speaker 2: as two favorite people.

841
00:46:37,840 --> 00:46:37,880
Speaker 1: Know.

842
00:46:38,000 --> 00:46:44,680
Speaker 2: That was Oh God, I'm sorry, that's okay, that's okay.

843
00:46:44,840 --> 00:46:49,160
Speaker 2: He's a great person. He made you laugh every time.

844
00:46:50,080 --> 00:46:54,120
Speaker 2: His house was where all of the Hollywood stars back

845
00:46:54,160 --> 00:46:58,839
Speaker 2: in the nineteen seventies would go to, and he photographed

846
00:46:58,840 --> 00:47:02,200
Speaker 2: so many people. He was a prime photographer for Jet

847
00:47:02,239 --> 00:47:08,560
Speaker 2: Beauties of the Week I'll call Jet Beauties of the Week,

848
00:47:08,719 --> 00:47:12,840
Speaker 2: and it's been doing very well, and I did the

849
00:47:12,880 --> 00:47:18,000
Speaker 2: forward for it. But you know, it's just he was ninety.

850
00:47:18,040 --> 00:47:19,040
Speaker 2: He lived a full life.

851
00:47:19,239 --> 00:47:23,200
Speaker 3: He lived a full life. Well, he also introduced you

852
00:47:23,280 --> 00:47:24,560
Speaker 3: that's where you met your husband?

853
00:47:25,200 --> 00:47:26,880
Speaker 2: Yes, yes, I got sidetracked.

854
00:47:26,920 --> 00:47:32,520
Speaker 3: And yes, the photo my favorite photo was it love

855
00:47:32,560 --> 00:47:33,120
Speaker 3: at first sight?

856
00:47:34,080 --> 00:47:37,960
Speaker 2: No, not at all. Ten years later I think something

857
00:47:38,040 --> 00:47:42,600
Speaker 2: like that. But he had just come from New York.

858
00:47:42,640 --> 00:47:45,480
Speaker 2: He was a model in New York and he also

859
00:47:45,760 --> 00:47:49,319
Speaker 2: was a football player early on in his career. Graduated

860
00:47:49,360 --> 00:47:52,080
Speaker 2: from Wake Forest, played football for Wake Force and Demon

861
00:47:52,480 --> 00:47:56,160
Speaker 2: Demon Deacons, and went to New York and then he

862
00:47:56,239 --> 00:48:01,000
Speaker 2: became a scout there and he started working at the Wilhelmina,

863
00:48:01,760 --> 00:48:05,360
Speaker 2: the FORID Agency, I'm sorry, as a model, and he

864
00:48:05,440 --> 00:48:09,080
Speaker 2: got hired to do several films on the West Coast.

865
00:48:09,160 --> 00:48:11,040
Speaker 2: So he decided, you know, that he would just move

866
00:48:11,080 --> 00:48:15,000
Speaker 2: to the West Coast. And he was just here and

867
00:48:15,080 --> 00:48:18,560
Speaker 2: Lamont was doing a magazine called Too And for the

868
00:48:18,600 --> 00:48:24,000
Speaker 2: cover for his first edition, he wanted to have people

869
00:48:24,040 --> 00:48:27,080
Speaker 2: that was appeared to be husband and wife for the

870
00:48:27,280 --> 00:48:30,279
Speaker 2: for the cover, and he chose Lamant and I and

871
00:48:30,400 --> 00:48:32,400
Speaker 2: that's and so when I showed up, you know, and

872
00:48:32,440 --> 00:48:35,719
Speaker 2: I'm you know, Mont's Monts standing there and he's got

873
00:48:35,800 --> 00:48:39,480
Speaker 2: his brief son and no shirt, and you know, and

874
00:48:39,640 --> 00:48:45,600
Speaker 2: I'm wearing a shirt that comes down to halfway through

875
00:48:45,719 --> 00:48:47,719
Speaker 2: to my knees, and that supposed to be the cover

876
00:48:47,840 --> 00:48:51,560
Speaker 2: of the magazine, and then these ancillary photos were to

877
00:48:51,600 --> 00:48:55,120
Speaker 2: be on the interior. And that's the first day we met,

878
00:48:55,360 --> 00:48:59,759
Speaker 2: and so we just became friends. We uh for the

879
00:48:59,800 --> 00:49:04,759
Speaker 2: next ten years, although through my marriage when I divorced

880
00:49:04,760 --> 00:49:11,839
Speaker 2: and we actually separated in eight twenty eight, nineteen eighty one.

881
00:49:12,080 --> 00:49:18,279
Speaker 2: We got divorced in eighty two. He was married, had

882
00:49:18,280 --> 00:49:24,680
Speaker 2: a daughter, Cheyenne, who's my wonderful stepdaughter, and then five

883
00:49:24,760 --> 00:49:29,080
Speaker 2: years later we ended up getting married and we have

884
00:49:29,160 --> 00:49:33,719
Speaker 2: three children, Savannah, Copper, and Zaire, and they're the light

885
00:49:33,760 --> 00:49:35,800
Speaker 2: of my life.

886
00:49:36,040 --> 00:49:39,439
Speaker 1: You took so if we were to trunk a which

887
00:49:39,440 --> 00:49:41,800
Speaker 1: we can't really, but if we say seventies and eighties,

888
00:49:42,520 --> 00:49:45,560
Speaker 1: part of the nineties you were working, maybe mid nineties.

889
00:49:46,000 --> 00:49:48,160
Speaker 1: You told me how much work you did in the nineties,

890
00:49:48,160 --> 00:49:50,120
Speaker 1: but then there was a time in which you took

891
00:49:50,160 --> 00:49:53,399
Speaker 1: time to take care of your family, mother, wife, all

892
00:49:53,480 --> 00:49:54,320
Speaker 1: of those things.

893
00:49:54,920 --> 00:49:55,840
Speaker 3: During that time.

894
00:49:56,080 --> 00:49:58,719
Speaker 1: Were you thinking, oh, I want to come back and

895
00:49:58,800 --> 00:50:01,040
Speaker 1: work again, or were you you trying to and you

896
00:50:01,080 --> 00:50:05,719
Speaker 1: felt shut out by Hollywood or were you in the

897
00:50:05,760 --> 00:50:08,080
Speaker 1: gray phase of I don't necessarily know.

898
00:50:09,680 --> 00:50:13,640
Speaker 2: When I was diagnosed with endometriosis in the early eighties,

899
00:50:14,320 --> 00:50:19,560
Speaker 2: it and I had the HIT exercise program, traveling all

900
00:50:19,600 --> 00:50:23,920
Speaker 2: across the country, and now I can't even do one

901
00:50:23,960 --> 00:50:27,560
Speaker 2: set up and I couldn't figure out what the diagnosis was.

902
00:50:28,000 --> 00:50:30,840
Speaker 2: And it was sort of a new disease at that time,

903
00:50:31,400 --> 00:50:33,879
Speaker 2: and so all of these doctors I went to many,

904
00:50:33,880 --> 00:50:36,800
Speaker 2: many hospitals, nobody could find an answer. And finally my

905
00:50:37,800 --> 00:50:41,960
Speaker 2: obgyn said, well, why don't we just test you for indometriosis?

906
00:50:41,960 --> 00:50:45,120
Speaker 2: And it came back positive and I couldn't do my

907
00:50:45,200 --> 00:50:49,120
Speaker 2: exersports program anymore. Everything had to shut down. It was

908
00:50:49,200 --> 00:50:57,239
Speaker 2: so painful that I couldn't function at all. Everything. He said,

909
00:50:57,280 --> 00:51:01,480
Speaker 2: the only thing that can help is pregnancy, and I said, okay, God,

910
00:51:01,520 --> 00:51:02,040
Speaker 2: I'm ready.

911
00:51:02,400 --> 00:51:03,000
Speaker 3: Oh wow.

912
00:51:03,400 --> 00:51:05,680
Speaker 2: I just I went to Bill and I said, you know,

913
00:51:05,880 --> 00:51:07,200
Speaker 2: I want to have a baby. I want to have

914
00:51:07,280 --> 00:51:11,160
Speaker 2: your baby. He said, we just we were just together

915
00:51:11,280 --> 00:51:14,520
Speaker 2: like one year, and you know, we hadn't even said

916
00:51:14,560 --> 00:51:17,400
Speaker 2: anything about getting married or anything. But I said, I

917
00:51:17,480 --> 00:51:19,279
Speaker 2: knew this was going to be the path for me.

918
00:51:19,719 --> 00:51:21,600
Speaker 2: And now we've been together forty years.

919
00:51:21,719 --> 00:51:24,960
Speaker 3: Well that's good, that was great. That was good work.

920
00:51:25,080 --> 00:51:28,520
Speaker 2: Now, But the end of metriosis was there as long

921
00:51:28,560 --> 00:51:33,080
Speaker 2: as I was If I was pregnant, it was gone.

922
00:51:33,560 --> 00:51:37,400
Speaker 2: During nursing, it was gone. As soon as I stopped nursing,

923
00:51:37,440 --> 00:51:40,520
Speaker 2: it would come back. So I lived within demetriosis for

924
00:51:40,560 --> 00:51:45,520
Speaker 2: eleven years, which took me out of the industry. And

925
00:51:45,600 --> 00:51:48,160
Speaker 2: I'm raising my children and I'm thinking, you know, now,

926
00:51:48,160 --> 00:51:50,520
Speaker 2: I'm being a proud mom, and we're saying, you know,

927
00:51:50,600 --> 00:51:52,680
Speaker 2: what are we going to do, you know, other than

928
00:51:52,880 --> 00:51:55,279
Speaker 2: going on the road all the time. And that's when

929
00:51:55,280 --> 00:51:58,719
Speaker 2: we came up with doing a theatrical play called The

930
00:51:58,800 --> 00:52:02,000
Speaker 2: Journey of the African America. Was supposed to run for

931
00:52:02,080 --> 00:52:05,400
Speaker 2: six weeks. Bill was producer, actually Bill and I, but

932
00:52:06,360 --> 00:52:09,200
Speaker 2: I was being mommy too much to actually be the producer.

933
00:52:09,840 --> 00:52:12,919
Speaker 2: And we had a cast of thirty five. A lot

934
00:52:12,960 --> 00:52:16,799
Speaker 2: of children were in it. But it was an incredible

935
00:52:16,920 --> 00:52:19,799
Speaker 2: It was supposed to run for six weeks. It ran

936
00:52:19,880 --> 00:52:22,880
Speaker 2: for ten months, and then we got booked on the

937
00:52:22,960 --> 00:52:26,040
Speaker 2: road and so we're now going out, you know, with

938
00:52:26,280 --> 00:52:29,840
Speaker 2: this huge cast. We're in Atlanta, we have you know,

939
00:52:30,000 --> 00:52:35,280
Speaker 2: standing ovations, while we were in La Mendela was freed

940
00:52:36,080 --> 00:52:41,080
Speaker 2: and Mayor Tom Bradley invited him to Los Angeles and

941
00:52:41,160 --> 00:52:45,440
Speaker 2: he asked for command performance from our troop to perform

942
00:52:45,480 --> 00:52:48,359
Speaker 2: on the steps of city Hall when Mendela was there,

943
00:52:48,760 --> 00:52:50,840
Speaker 2: and we changed the lyrics of the song to go

944
00:52:50,960 --> 00:52:55,759
Speaker 2: with Mendela's free with the African American family. You know,

945
00:52:55,960 --> 00:53:01,680
Speaker 2: we were just doing so well, and Matriosis was, you know,

946
00:53:01,719 --> 00:53:03,560
Speaker 2: I was as long as I was pregnant, I was.

947
00:53:03,600 --> 00:53:09,040
Speaker 2: It was doing well. And then we're out on the

948
00:53:09,120 --> 00:53:16,520
Speaker 2: road and I get a message from Leon and he says,

949
00:53:18,440 --> 00:53:21,160
Speaker 2: I need to come over and talk to you. And

950
00:53:24,560 --> 00:53:27,040
Speaker 2: I could tell right then we were heading I were

951
00:53:27,080 --> 00:53:29,320
Speaker 2: heading out on the road. So we were at home

952
00:53:29,719 --> 00:53:31,840
Speaker 2: and my children were getting ready to go to the beach.

953
00:53:32,280 --> 00:53:34,000
Speaker 2: So I told the girls, I said, you know, we're

954
00:53:34,040 --> 00:53:35,200
Speaker 2: not going to have to go to the beach day.

955
00:53:35,239 --> 00:53:37,440
Speaker 2: I could tell it by the tone in his voice.

956
00:53:38,239 --> 00:53:40,640
Speaker 2: And he came over, and this has been ten years

957
00:53:40,680 --> 00:53:44,560
Speaker 2: since we've been divorced, and he said the tape is out.

958
00:53:45,560 --> 00:53:48,320
Speaker 2: And I hadn't even thought of the tape. I did totally.

959
00:53:49,120 --> 00:53:51,720
Speaker 2: It was so far we that was done in nineteen

960
00:53:51,800 --> 00:53:55,279
Speaker 2: seventy five, and here we are in nineteen ninety two,

961
00:54:00,560 --> 00:54:02,840
Speaker 2: and there was a gentleman, I don't even want to

962
00:54:02,840 --> 00:54:06,120
Speaker 2: call him a gentleman, an individual that stole the tape,

963
00:54:07,160 --> 00:54:12,319
Speaker 2: sold it so that he could get drugs, and it

964
00:54:12,440 --> 00:54:19,799
Speaker 2: destroyed my career. It destroyed my belief in myself. I

965
00:54:19,840 --> 00:54:22,719
Speaker 2: didn't want anybody to see me anymore. I couldn't. I

966
00:54:22,719 --> 00:54:28,600
Speaker 2: couldn't look at anybody anymore. I couldn't even look at myself.

967
00:54:30,920 --> 00:54:36,520
Speaker 2: My children became my lifeline. My husband tried to help

968
00:54:36,560 --> 00:54:38,520
Speaker 2: as much as he could, but I was just broken.

969
00:54:47,280 --> 00:54:49,400
Speaker 2: And people would call and say, you know, well, can

970
00:54:49,480 --> 00:54:52,920
Speaker 2: Jane come and do this? And Bill knew the answer.

971
00:54:53,400 --> 00:54:55,759
Speaker 2: You know, usually he'd say no, but sometimes he'd ask.

972
00:54:56,280 --> 00:55:00,040
Speaker 2: And in a CP image Awards called and we I

973
00:55:00,040 --> 00:55:02,560
Speaker 2: had gotten the Theater Award for Best Production with the

974
00:55:02,560 --> 00:55:07,279
Speaker 2: African American. So some years later they asked me if

975
00:55:07,320 --> 00:55:11,160
Speaker 2: I would come and present the Theater Award to a

976
00:55:11,200 --> 00:55:14,640
Speaker 2: troop of actors that had just they thought was going

977
00:55:14,680 --> 00:55:19,640
Speaker 2: to be winning. And Bill asked me, and he knew

978
00:55:19,640 --> 00:55:21,120
Speaker 2: I was going to say no, and I said yes,

979
00:55:22,719 --> 00:55:27,600
Speaker 2: and he did a double take. He said, what are

980
00:55:27,640 --> 00:55:31,480
Speaker 2: you sure? And I said yeah, So I got to

981
00:55:31,600 --> 00:55:38,360
Speaker 2: the arena and I was so scared. I didn't know

982
00:55:38,360 --> 00:55:44,040
Speaker 2: what to do. I did not want to go I

983
00:55:44,080 --> 00:55:46,600
Speaker 2: did not want to go out and let my peers,

984
00:55:46,920 --> 00:55:52,719
Speaker 2: my friends see me again. And I kept trying to

985
00:55:52,719 --> 00:55:55,200
Speaker 2: find an exit. I kept trying to find a door.

986
00:55:56,000 --> 00:55:57,799
Speaker 2: There were none. I said, well, that's got to find

987
00:55:57,840 --> 00:55:59,560
Speaker 2: out there's a window that I can break and I

988
00:55:59,560 --> 00:56:04,360
Speaker 2: can jump. I didn't do this. I didn't Bill grab

989
00:56:04,400 --> 00:56:08,480
Speaker 2: me and he had given him a script and he

990
00:56:08,560 --> 00:56:11,000
Speaker 2: grabbed my hand and he had led me on stage,

991
00:56:11,480 --> 00:56:16,040
Speaker 2: and I just trusted him, and I walked up the

992
00:56:16,040 --> 00:56:20,000
Speaker 2: steps behind him, and he walked to the podium and

993
00:56:20,120 --> 00:56:23,160
Speaker 2: he threw away the script and he said, I just

994
00:56:23,200 --> 00:56:26,239
Speaker 2: want to thank the NACAP for getting my wife out

995
00:56:26,239 --> 00:56:34,759
Speaker 2: of the house. And all of my friends that I've

996
00:56:34,800 --> 00:56:45,000
Speaker 2: been afraid of, they all stood up with a standing ovation. Yeah,

997
00:56:45,400 --> 00:56:48,920
Speaker 2: And that was that was a turnaround for me to

998
00:56:49,080 --> 00:56:52,120
Speaker 2: that I needed to turn my life around. It took

999
00:56:52,160 --> 00:56:55,200
Speaker 2: many more years to do that, but that was it.

1000
00:56:55,360 --> 00:56:58,920
Speaker 2: That was the moment. It was a defining moment. And

1001
00:56:58,960 --> 00:57:03,520
Speaker 2: then you're dealing with, Okay, you've been away from the industry,

1002
00:57:03,719 --> 00:57:08,360
Speaker 2: can you come back. So many other people they're continuing

1003
00:57:08,360 --> 00:57:16,560
Speaker 2: their jobs, they're performing. We've got Debbie Allen doing directing

1004
00:57:16,640 --> 00:57:18,760
Speaker 2: on TV, you know, and all these other people, these

1005
00:57:18,800 --> 00:57:21,640
Speaker 2: amazing women doing things that I wanted to do. I

1006
00:57:21,680 --> 00:57:27,000
Speaker 2: wanted to be a director, and I walked away from it.

1007
00:57:28,560 --> 00:57:32,200
Speaker 2: So I had to talk myself into how are you

1008
00:57:32,280 --> 00:57:32,880
Speaker 2: going back?

1009
00:57:33,800 --> 00:57:34,040
Speaker 1: Yeah?

1010
00:57:34,400 --> 00:57:36,720
Speaker 2: First was I had to start losing weight because I

1011
00:57:36,760 --> 00:57:44,280
Speaker 2: had gained so much weight. So I I did. I

1012
00:57:44,280 --> 00:57:51,280
Speaker 2: lost seventy bounds and I'm still enjoying trying to lose more.

1013
00:57:52,120 --> 00:57:59,320
Speaker 2: But the bookman a lot to me. Ad meant the

1014
00:57:59,400 --> 00:58:02,480
Speaker 2: book was the most important thing other than my family,

1015
00:58:04,200 --> 00:58:09,240
Speaker 2: to prove to myself and let people know that I

1016
00:58:09,320 --> 00:58:13,960
Speaker 2: am not done yet. Amen, And that's the name of

1017
00:58:13,960 --> 00:58:14,600
Speaker 2: my company.

1018
00:58:18,160 --> 00:58:21,760
Speaker 3: It's so wonderful to hear this. I need this, we

1019
00:58:21,800 --> 00:58:22,280
Speaker 3: need this.

1020
00:58:23,520 --> 00:58:25,960
Speaker 2: But you know, then I go on stage and I

1021
00:58:26,040 --> 00:58:30,160
Speaker 2: see you guys on stage, and I'm so proud of you.

1022
00:58:31,080 --> 00:58:35,840
Speaker 2: That day that we went on stage together, I looked

1023
00:58:35,840 --> 00:58:37,440
Speaker 2: at each and every one of you. I didn't want

1024
00:58:37,480 --> 00:58:40,320
Speaker 2: to say anything until I could take you all in

1025
00:58:40,600 --> 00:58:45,000
Speaker 2: and enjoy sitting there and watching you shine, you know,

1026
00:58:45,160 --> 00:58:51,440
Speaker 2: and knowing that I had a pardon. I'm so proud

1027
00:58:51,440 --> 00:58:56,600
Speaker 2: of all of you, all of the women in sports broadcasting,

1028
00:58:59,160 --> 00:59:01,280
Speaker 2: there's one that I'm.

1029
00:59:01,920 --> 00:59:06,440
Speaker 3: Well, there's always one. Thank you.

1030
00:59:06,480 --> 00:59:08,560
Speaker 1: We can say this. Jamale and I talked about this

1031
00:59:10,680 --> 00:59:13,520
Speaker 1: and she said, I don't think Jane feels like she

1032
00:59:14,040 --> 00:59:16,760
Speaker 1: gets the respect and or love that she deserves. I

1033
00:59:16,800 --> 00:59:20,920
Speaker 1: was like, I could imagine her not feeling that way.

1034
00:59:21,960 --> 00:59:23,840
Speaker 1: But if you had any time with any of us,

1035
00:59:23,840 --> 00:59:27,840
Speaker 1: you know that we are so in awe of what

1036
00:59:27,880 --> 00:59:29,280
Speaker 1: you've been able to do.

1037
00:59:30,760 --> 00:59:38,280
Speaker 3: And the level of grace that you handle yourself with.

1038
00:59:39,280 --> 00:59:42,120
Speaker 1: I think when you tell your story, a lot of

1039
00:59:42,160 --> 00:59:45,040
Speaker 1: me gets upset because I think, gosh, I hate that

1040
00:59:45,200 --> 00:59:49,960
Speaker 1: a tape with your husband can ruin your career or

1041
00:59:50,320 --> 00:59:53,360
Speaker 1: sideline your career when there are so many other more

1042
00:59:53,440 --> 00:59:55,480
Speaker 1: egregious things happening in the world.

1043
00:59:55,520 --> 01:00:01,640
Speaker 3: This feels overly punitive, But I do feel like it's

1044
01:00:01,680 --> 01:00:02,160
Speaker 3: your time.

1045
01:00:02,640 --> 01:00:06,680
Speaker 1: I think that being welcomed back into this world where

1046
01:00:06,720 --> 01:00:09,480
Speaker 1: you know that everyone knows you, at least anyone with

1047
01:00:09,560 --> 01:00:12,080
Speaker 1: any significance in their career knows who you are and

1048
01:00:12,120 --> 01:00:14,240
Speaker 1: what you've done. We stand on your shoulders and I

1049
01:00:14,320 --> 01:00:19,480
Speaker 1: mean that, And there's all we all have felt ignored

1050
01:00:20,000 --> 01:00:23,360
Speaker 1: and or sidelined and or exiled in this business for

1051
01:00:23,560 --> 01:00:25,840
Speaker 1: being a black or brown girl trying to do her

1052
01:00:25,960 --> 01:00:30,959
Speaker 1: job and then also trying to have a personal life. Unfortunately,

1053
01:00:31,040 --> 01:00:34,160
Speaker 1: we're not allowed to have one sometimes and many of

1054
01:00:34,240 --> 01:00:36,560
Speaker 1: us feel like we have to pretend to be something

1055
01:00:36,600 --> 01:00:41,800
Speaker 1: we're not. And you've you lived in so many different worlds,

1056
01:00:42,120 --> 01:00:44,720
Speaker 1: and you made it okay to say I'm multi talented

1057
01:00:44,800 --> 01:00:47,800
Speaker 1: and I and I want to be many things, and

1058
01:00:47,840 --> 01:00:53,120
Speaker 1: I deserve to be many things. And nowadays you think

1059
01:00:53,120 --> 01:00:56,800
Speaker 1: about a tape sex sake that isn't seedy or gotdy,

1060
01:00:56,840 --> 01:00:59,160
Speaker 1: I'm with my husband, it's nothing in comparison to what

1061
01:00:59,240 --> 01:01:01,680
Speaker 1: I see people do all the time in this business.

1062
01:01:02,160 --> 01:01:03,200
Speaker 3: So that's why it's.

1063
01:01:03,000 --> 01:01:05,840
Speaker 1: Beautiful to know that there's still more left and you

1064
01:01:05,920 --> 01:01:08,880
Speaker 1: haven't given up. We all need to hear that story

1065
01:01:09,080 --> 01:01:12,200
Speaker 1: because no one wants to walk away silently into the night.

1066
01:01:12,280 --> 01:01:14,200
Speaker 1: We still want to work in different ways, and you

1067
01:01:14,280 --> 01:01:17,280
Speaker 1: still are doing that with this book. You're giving us

1068
01:01:17,400 --> 01:01:20,040
Speaker 1: renewed hope for those of us who still know there

1069
01:01:20,120 --> 01:01:23,240
Speaker 1: is still more left. It's not your final act. So

1070
01:01:23,320 --> 01:01:26,080
Speaker 1: I'm so grateful for you sharing that story. I'm so

1071
01:01:26,280 --> 01:01:28,080
Speaker 1: hurt that you had to go through that.

1072
01:01:29,160 --> 01:01:32,120
Speaker 3: I wonder if you ever get over that, Jane, has

1073
01:01:32,160 --> 01:01:33,960
Speaker 3: that hurt left you?

1074
01:01:33,960 --> 01:01:36,919
Speaker 2: You know, I think about that a lot, because I'm

1075
01:01:36,960 --> 01:01:39,040
Speaker 2: saying to myself, you know, why am I telling this

1076
01:01:39,160 --> 01:01:42,840
Speaker 2: story again? And I'm still crying, you know, I and

1077
01:01:43,000 --> 01:01:45,600
Speaker 2: I and I said when I wrote the book, if

1078
01:01:45,640 --> 01:01:48,120
Speaker 2: I get it out, then I can be strong, and

1079
01:01:48,160 --> 01:01:50,880
Speaker 2: then I can go forward and do all the things

1080
01:01:50,920 --> 01:01:52,919
Speaker 2: that I love to do. I can be a matter

1081
01:01:53,200 --> 01:01:56,480
Speaker 2: to my children, you know, I can be I mean,

1082
01:01:56,560 --> 01:01:58,360
Speaker 2: I think I'm a great mom to my child. And

1083
01:01:58,400 --> 01:02:01,200
Speaker 2: they'll tell you, well, you have a right. Well, this

1084
01:02:01,400 --> 01:02:08,800
Speaker 2: amazing extended, blended family, that's just crazy, crazy, amazing. I'm

1085
01:02:08,880 --> 01:02:13,720
Speaker 2: so blessed in that regard. And you know, so that

1086
01:02:13,800 --> 01:02:19,080
Speaker 2: part I'm not worried about. But yes, it's really hard.

1087
01:02:19,320 --> 01:02:22,760
Speaker 2: And I had found I didn't know how to forgive

1088
01:02:22,800 --> 01:02:26,840
Speaker 2: myself for a long time, and I knew that I

1089
01:02:26,920 --> 01:02:31,040
Speaker 2: had to forgive. I'm thinking of all these people have

1090
01:02:31,120 --> 01:02:33,439
Speaker 2: to forgive, people that have wronged me. People have done

1091
01:02:33,440 --> 01:02:36,479
Speaker 2: this and this and this, and I said, I can't

1092
01:02:36,480 --> 01:02:39,320
Speaker 2: forgive them. You know, my life has been destroyed. My

1093
01:02:39,400 --> 01:02:42,000
Speaker 2: life is ruined, and you know I can't forgive them.

1094
01:02:42,240 --> 01:02:45,800
Speaker 2: And then I met this gentleman. There was a small

1095
01:02:45,880 --> 01:02:50,680
Speaker 2: church and that I was going to the market, and

1096
01:02:50,720 --> 01:02:54,120
Speaker 2: this glowing yellow light was coming through the door and

1097
01:02:54,160 --> 01:02:57,600
Speaker 2: you could hear the choir rehears and it was an

1098
01:02:57,640 --> 01:03:01,560
Speaker 2: African American church, sound like southern southern singing with which

1099
01:03:01,560 --> 01:03:04,560
Speaker 2: I love, you know. So I just made a U turn.

1100
01:03:04,840 --> 01:03:07,080
Speaker 2: I don't know why other than the fact that God

1101
01:03:07,120 --> 01:03:09,479
Speaker 2: told me and I just made a quick U turn

1102
01:03:09,560 --> 01:03:12,680
Speaker 2: pulled it to and I sat there waiting till their

1103
01:03:12,840 --> 01:03:16,400
Speaker 2: rehearsal was over, and I went to the pastor. I

1104
01:03:16,480 --> 01:03:19,920
Speaker 2: had no idea who he was, and I just started crying.

1105
01:03:19,960 --> 01:03:22,280
Speaker 2: I said, I need to know how to forgive. And

1106
01:03:22,360 --> 01:03:26,560
Speaker 2: I started talking and he didn't say anything. He just

1107
01:03:26,640 --> 01:03:32,040
Speaker 2: let me vomit, you know, and spit everything out that

1108
01:03:32,120 --> 01:03:39,280
Speaker 2: I was feeling to a total stranger, to a total stranger.

1109
01:03:39,720 --> 01:03:41,240
Speaker 2: Then he gave me a tissue, and he says, you know,

1110
01:03:41,320 --> 01:03:47,560
Speaker 2: these things come in handy sometimes. He says me to

1111
01:03:47,640 --> 01:03:50,400
Speaker 2: set some sessions, and he said, you can come and

1112
01:03:50,440 --> 01:03:56,120
Speaker 2: we can meet. We did for six weeks and the

1113
01:03:56,200 --> 01:03:59,200
Speaker 2: last week he said, so what have you learned as

1114
01:03:59,240 --> 01:04:03,200
Speaker 2: of today? And I said, I have to learn how

1115
01:04:03,240 --> 01:04:08,040
Speaker 2: to forgive myself. I said, that's the only thing. I said.

1116
01:04:08,320 --> 01:04:12,840
Speaker 2: I know I've I'm a nice person. I'm a decent person.

1117
01:04:12,920 --> 01:04:17,440
Speaker 2: I'm not hard on anybody, even though I'm a scorpio.

1118
01:04:18,040 --> 01:04:21,200
Speaker 2: You know, I don't really hold a grudge except the

1119
01:04:21,240 --> 01:04:25,880
Speaker 2: guy that stole the tape. I don't know how to

1120
01:04:25,920 --> 01:04:29,200
Speaker 2: forgive him, and I don't know how to forgive myself.

1121
01:04:29,200 --> 01:04:32,360
Speaker 2: He said, that's it. You don't know how to forgive yourself.

1122
01:04:33,400 --> 01:04:36,360
Speaker 2: And we talked about that for a long time. I

1123
01:04:36,400 --> 01:04:39,040
Speaker 2: went back for our next session and the church was

1124
01:04:39,040 --> 01:04:42,760
Speaker 2: boarded up, so I said, well, maybe I don't know,

1125
01:04:42,800 --> 01:04:45,280
Speaker 2: maybe they moved. I called his wife. She said, no,

1126
01:04:45,320 --> 01:04:47,880
Speaker 2: I haven't seen him in three or four years. She says,

1127
01:04:47,920 --> 01:04:53,800
Speaker 2: we're not together. And went back again. Church have been bulldozed,

1128
01:04:56,080 --> 01:05:04,760
Speaker 2: and I never saw him again. Wow. Message is that

1129
01:05:05,480 --> 01:05:09,800
Speaker 2: you've learned. You've learned that you have to forgive yourself.

1130
01:05:11,000 --> 01:05:13,280
Speaker 2: And that's the reason I came there in the first place.

1131
01:05:14,280 --> 01:05:20,280
Speaker 2: I needed to learn that, and now I have. And

1132
01:05:20,360 --> 01:05:23,840
Speaker 2: I know, say, you know, how can you say you

1133
01:05:23,840 --> 01:05:25,880
Speaker 2: forgive yourself and you're sitting there in tears? But I

1134
01:05:25,920 --> 01:05:28,560
Speaker 2: have because I was strong enough to write the book,

1135
01:05:30,120 --> 01:05:33,640
Speaker 2: and I wanted to put people say, well, why in

1136
01:05:33,680 --> 01:05:36,360
Speaker 2: the first part, you know, I said, because if I

1137
01:05:36,360 --> 01:05:38,680
Speaker 2: don't put it there, and if I don't talk about

1138
01:05:38,680 --> 01:05:41,280
Speaker 2: it in the book, people won't believe the book at all.

1139
01:05:42,800 --> 01:05:46,920
Speaker 2: And my story was too important to have this again

1140
01:05:47,520 --> 01:05:51,800
Speaker 2: destroy me. So I put it in the book.

1141
01:05:53,800 --> 01:05:56,040
Speaker 1: I will I will tell you most people like me

1142
01:05:56,320 --> 01:05:59,720
Speaker 1: who know the story or bits and pieces of it.

1143
01:06:02,120 --> 01:06:07,400
Speaker 1: I know I felt seeing seeing that it's okay to

1144
01:06:08,360 --> 01:06:12,240
Speaker 1: not always love every detail about your life. But when

1145
01:06:12,360 --> 01:06:16,760
Speaker 1: I read it, I felt like that secret shouldn't have

1146
01:06:16,760 --> 01:06:20,000
Speaker 1: any more power, because secrets have power, like they hold

1147
01:06:20,080 --> 01:06:23,880
Speaker 1: so much power. And I've felt like for me if

1148
01:06:23,920 --> 01:06:26,320
Speaker 1: you read, when you read something, you often relate to

1149
01:06:26,360 --> 01:06:30,760
Speaker 1: how where where it resonates with you. And it felt

1150
01:06:30,880 --> 01:06:39,160
Speaker 1: very fearless. It felt very I've learned, and now there's more.

1151
01:06:39,720 --> 01:06:42,560
Speaker 1: And also in the grand scheme of things. I know

1152
01:06:42,640 --> 01:06:44,960
Speaker 1: you probably don't feel this way because it is your experience,

1153
01:06:45,560 --> 01:06:50,040
Speaker 1: but when I think about it, it feels so insignificant

1154
01:06:50,200 --> 01:06:55,040
Speaker 1: considering where we are in today's times. It doesn't even

1155
01:06:55,080 --> 01:06:58,479
Speaker 1: feel like it should it should even be it should

1156
01:06:58,600 --> 01:07:02,400
Speaker 1: be a just okay, that happened, that happened. It shouldn't

1157
01:07:02,440 --> 01:07:04,960
Speaker 1: be like, let's stop the press. This is There is

1158
01:07:05,040 --> 01:07:08,560
Speaker 1: no penalty I think attached to it anymore. There's nothing

1159
01:07:08,600 --> 01:07:12,280
Speaker 1: more punitive that can happen to you. If anything, people

1160
01:07:12,320 --> 01:07:15,000
Speaker 1: are looking at it and learning that things do happen,

1161
01:07:15,280 --> 01:07:18,240
Speaker 1: bad things happen to good people, but they survive. That's

1162
01:07:18,600 --> 01:07:23,200
Speaker 1: how I read it, And I think that message for

1163
01:07:23,360 --> 01:07:26,600
Speaker 1: little brown girls who do what we do is so

1164
01:07:26,720 --> 01:07:29,640
Speaker 1: important because we won't always get it right, we won't

1165
01:07:29,640 --> 01:07:32,960
Speaker 1: always make the decisions. They judge us so much more

1166
01:07:33,280 --> 01:07:37,400
Speaker 1: harshly than they do others. So if we learn to

1167
01:07:37,440 --> 01:07:41,320
Speaker 1: forgive ourselves, you know, then we can move on. That's

1168
01:07:41,560 --> 01:07:42,840
Speaker 1: what I'm hearing you say.

1169
01:07:43,840 --> 01:07:49,160
Speaker 2: Absolutely, absolutely, And that message was not just for me.

1170
01:07:49,320 --> 01:07:51,760
Speaker 2: It was for my daughters. When you say, we look

1171
01:07:51,800 --> 01:07:55,560
Speaker 2: at these brown girls and you know, and they do

1172
01:07:55,680 --> 01:08:00,720
Speaker 2: need to be told that they matter. They do need

1173
01:08:00,760 --> 01:08:03,080
Speaker 2: to be told that no matter what you can achieve,

1174
01:08:03,720 --> 01:08:07,200
Speaker 2: you know. I was given the maybe five years ago,

1175
01:08:10,040 --> 01:08:13,520
Speaker 2: Black Enterprise Magazine and the Women of Power Legacy Awards

1176
01:08:14,440 --> 01:08:17,280
Speaker 2: they gave me. They Butch Graves called me in the

1177
01:08:17,320 --> 01:08:21,360
Speaker 2: morning and I hadn't talking to him since he been

1178
01:08:21,360 --> 01:08:24,680
Speaker 2: a kid. I knew his father, and he called me

1179
01:08:24,720 --> 01:08:26,880
Speaker 2: and he said, Jane we want to honor you with

1180
01:08:26,880 --> 01:08:30,080
Speaker 2: the Legacy Award this year. And he said, but you

1181
01:08:30,120 --> 01:08:33,120
Speaker 2: can't come unless you bring your daughters to because I'm

1182
01:08:33,160 --> 01:08:35,680
Speaker 2: to see this. I want them to see who their

1183
01:08:35,720 --> 01:08:41,840
Speaker 2: mother is. And that was probably just one of the

1184
01:08:41,880 --> 01:08:50,400
Speaker 2: most amazing things anybody could say to me. So we

1185
01:08:50,479 --> 01:08:56,000
Speaker 2: went down there, gave my speech. Girls were having a blast.

1186
01:08:56,360 --> 01:09:02,200
Speaker 2: Two thousand black women strong, all the executives of this

1187
01:09:02,400 --> 01:09:06,439
Speaker 2: that and the other strong women in this country, and

1188
01:09:06,520 --> 01:09:09,920
Speaker 2: the possibilities are endless. And they saw that, you know,

1189
01:09:09,960 --> 01:09:13,880
Speaker 2: and so one person as copper, they said, you know, so,

1190
01:09:14,240 --> 01:09:16,040
Speaker 2: what was it like when you were growing up? You know?

1191
01:09:16,439 --> 01:09:19,080
Speaker 2: And you look at your mom and she says, well,

1192
01:09:19,120 --> 01:09:21,479
Speaker 2: you know, well, we knew that she was in an

1193
01:09:21,640 --> 01:09:24,599
Speaker 2: entertainment book, she said, but when I'm standing here today,

1194
01:09:24,720 --> 01:09:28,080
Speaker 2: now I know what y'all been talking about. Yeah, And

1195
01:09:28,840 --> 01:09:32,880
Speaker 2: so the book is for them, for them to know

1196
01:09:33,439 --> 01:09:40,240
Speaker 2: who they came from.

1197
01:09:40,560 --> 01:09:42,879
Speaker 3: But have you read a grap anyday.

1198
01:09:45,920 --> 01:09:48,759
Speaker 2: This wasn't supposed to happen. We're supposed to be talking sports.

1199
01:09:48,800 --> 01:09:52,400
Speaker 3: Girl, we are, we did we have.

1200
01:09:54,040 --> 01:09:56,559
Speaker 1: I think we're talking about this is a This is

1201
01:09:56,800 --> 01:09:59,760
Speaker 1: Jane the story of women in sports, and this is

1202
01:10:00,080 --> 01:10:01,639
Speaker 1: passes black and Brown.

1203
01:10:01,680 --> 01:10:02,880
Speaker 3: It's a tough ask.

1204
01:10:03,479 --> 01:10:06,519
Speaker 1: It's still very male dominated business, even though we, like

1205
01:10:06,560 --> 01:10:09,680
Speaker 1: I said, stand on your shoulders. It's hard to be

1206
01:10:09,720 --> 01:10:15,000
Speaker 1: in this industry and find space that feels safe and

1207
01:10:16,120 --> 01:10:21,040
Speaker 1: know that you can have a life after and then

1208
01:10:21,120 --> 01:10:23,439
Speaker 1: come back and have a life after, and then come

1209
01:10:23,479 --> 01:10:27,160
Speaker 1: back and have a life after. And you've shown us that,

1210
01:10:27,280 --> 01:10:29,160
Speaker 1: and you can show all of your talents like this

1211
01:10:29,320 --> 01:10:33,759
Speaker 1: is so important to know that we're able to live loudly.

1212
01:10:34,600 --> 01:10:38,120
Speaker 1: I think your tears are so refreshing for me like

1213
01:10:38,200 --> 01:10:40,639
Speaker 1: I because you are speaking to my spirit in every

1214
01:10:40,680 --> 01:10:44,559
Speaker 1: possible way. I think we all feel no matter how

1215
01:10:44,560 --> 01:10:47,080
Speaker 1: successful we are, no matter what we've accomplished, we always

1216
01:10:47,080 --> 01:10:49,559
Speaker 1: feel like we're being hidden. I've had this conversation with

1217
01:10:49,680 --> 01:10:51,920
Speaker 1: Maria and Jamel and Taylor.

1218
01:10:51,960 --> 01:10:55,040
Speaker 3: I can name a list of women who appear to

1219
01:10:55,080 --> 01:11:00,240
Speaker 3: be thriving, but always wonder where safe? Is Is it

1220
01:11:00,320 --> 01:11:01,679
Speaker 3: safe here? Is it safe there?

1221
01:11:02,200 --> 01:11:02,519
Speaker 2: Yes?

1222
01:11:04,000 --> 01:11:06,800
Speaker 3: And thank you? Does all I have to say is this,

1223
01:11:06,880 --> 01:11:10,280
Speaker 3: thank you? This book is its bomb. It's nurturing.

1224
01:11:11,600 --> 01:11:15,160
Speaker 2: There was a little girl that when I was getting

1225
01:11:15,160 --> 01:11:18,960
Speaker 2: my ward at Black Enterprise, I woke up that morning,

1226
01:11:19,240 --> 01:11:21,599
Speaker 2: opened my phone and the very first thing I saw

1227
01:11:22,520 --> 01:11:25,920
Speaker 2: was a dad had posted that his little girl was

1228
01:11:25,960 --> 01:11:30,600
Speaker 2: supposed to make a poster for who she admired. And

1229
01:11:31,880 --> 01:11:35,479
Speaker 2: she had this poster board around her and she's standing

1230
01:11:35,520 --> 01:11:37,519
Speaker 2: in the muddle, you know, one of those things you're

1231
01:11:37,560 --> 01:11:40,479
Speaker 2: holding at the board around you. And so she had

1232
01:11:40,520 --> 01:11:43,320
Speaker 2: a miss Ohio banner on and she was holding the

1233
01:11:43,720 --> 01:11:46,400
Speaker 2: red football, a football like in my poster. I have

1234
01:11:46,439 --> 01:11:50,080
Speaker 2: a photo like a yeah, a land photo for me

1235
01:11:51,240 --> 01:11:53,799
Speaker 2: that was shot by Lamont, and I'm holding a football

1236
01:11:54,920 --> 01:11:57,360
Speaker 2: with a red blouse, red satin blouse. So she's in

1237
01:11:57,400 --> 01:11:59,880
Speaker 2: a red dress. She's holding the football. So he's got

1238
01:11:59,880 --> 01:12:02,800
Speaker 2: the she's got the crowd on her head, and she's

1239
01:12:02,800 --> 01:12:05,280
Speaker 2: got my name all around and all around the boarder

1240
01:12:05,439 --> 01:12:08,519
Speaker 2: the border, and her dad is telling her, if you

1241
01:12:08,600 --> 01:12:10,439
Speaker 2: see it, you can achieve it, you man.

1242
01:12:11,880 --> 01:12:15,960
Speaker 1: Jane Kennedy, I know that we have gone way over time,

1243
01:12:16,040 --> 01:12:18,200
Speaker 1: so I appreciate you taking your time and sharing this

1244
01:12:18,280 --> 01:12:23,280
Speaker 1: story with me. I feel I feel a biopic coming on,

1245
01:12:23,520 --> 01:12:26,799
Speaker 1: like I feel these I feel I feel.

1246
01:12:26,560 --> 01:12:28,439
Speaker 3: A bio pick coming on, Like I.

1247
01:12:28,400 --> 01:12:31,880
Speaker 1: Feel like I feel like, well, can I play the

1248
01:12:31,920 --> 01:12:34,000
Speaker 1: middle aged version of you? Because I was like, I

1249
01:12:34,040 --> 01:12:35,440
Speaker 1: too want to be an actress.

1250
01:12:35,080 --> 01:12:39,400
Speaker 3: And talk to you like let me in. I wonder

1251
01:12:39,680 --> 01:12:41,160
Speaker 3: it would be my honor.

1252
01:12:42,040 --> 01:12:45,599
Speaker 1: For sharing your story and being so naked and honest,

1253
01:12:45,920 --> 01:12:49,360
Speaker 1: really truly, just it's so important and we don't get

1254
01:12:49,360 --> 01:12:53,280
Speaker 1: to have these honest conversations, and if anybody is listening,

1255
01:12:53,439 --> 01:12:55,520
Speaker 1: the biggest takeaway is to forgive ourselves.

1256
01:12:56,360 --> 01:12:59,480
Speaker 3: Like that's the hardest thing to do ourselves.

1257
01:12:59,560 --> 01:13:03,679
Speaker 2: It's it's good. See who you are and then forgive yourself.

1258
01:13:04,439 --> 01:13:06,760
Speaker 3: Be who you are, and then forgive yourself.

1259
01:13:07,479 --> 01:13:09,840
Speaker 2: A lot of times we don't see who we are. Well,

1260
01:13:10,000 --> 01:13:11,120
Speaker 2: is it for someone else?

1261
01:13:11,960 --> 01:13:13,920
Speaker 3: Thank you very much, thank you for your time.

1262
01:13:14,040 --> 01:13:17,400
Speaker 2: I really appreciate it. Thank you, I appreciate it. I

1263
01:13:17,439 --> 01:13:18,760
Speaker 2: totally enjoyed this. Thank you.

1264
01:13:21,040 --> 01:13:25,160
Speaker 1: Naked Sports written and executive produced by me Carrie Champion,

1265
01:13:25,320 --> 01:13:29,400
Speaker 1: produced by jacquesse Thomas, sound design and mastered by Dwayne Crawford.

1266
01:13:29,680 --> 01:13:31,919
Speaker 1: Naked Sports is a part of the Black Effect podcast

1267
01:13:31,960 --> 01:13:33,200
Speaker 1: network in iHeartMedia.