1 00:00:13,119 --> 00:00:16,120 Speaker 1: I'm Caroline Hyde at Bloomberg's world headquarters in New York 2 00:00:16,239 --> 00:00:19,120 Speaker 1: and then made Lovelow in San Francisco. This is Bloomberg 3 00:00:19,200 --> 00:00:21,520 Speaker 1: Technology and it was a tough first day of trading 4 00:00:21,560 --> 00:00:24,799 Speaker 1: for the year, especially for Tesla shareholders to stop falling 5 00:00:24,800 --> 00:00:29,720 Speaker 1: by the most after deliveries they miss and Sam bankman 6 00:00:29,800 --> 00:00:33,040 Speaker 1: Fried pleads not guilty as the ft X founder faces 7 00:00:33,120 --> 00:00:36,240 Speaker 1: trial in October. The same day, the top US banking 8 00:00:36,240 --> 00:00:40,480 Speaker 1: watchdogs send a warning about crypto activity and the slowdown 9 00:00:40,479 --> 00:00:43,320 Speaker 1: in ad spending will continue to shake up Silicon Valley 10 00:00:43,360 --> 00:00:46,400 Speaker 1: giants like Google and Meta. That's as Netflix and TikTok 11 00:00:46,600 --> 00:00:50,519 Speaker 1: come into play. We bring you expert analysis. But first 12 00:00:50,880 --> 00:00:54,560 Speaker 1: on this first day of three trading, editor is good 13 00:00:54,600 --> 00:00:55,920 Speaker 1: to be back with you, and we talked about it 14 00:00:55,960 --> 00:00:57,920 Speaker 1: all with Dana Hall, where Piece of Station joins us 15 00:00:57,920 --> 00:00:59,880 Speaker 1: to kick off this new year's show. These new glasses 16 00:00:59,880 --> 00:01:02,160 Speaker 1: as well, whether we love them, but down people don't 17 00:01:02,240 --> 00:01:04,080 Speaker 1: love the numbers that came out of Tesla. What is 18 00:01:04,080 --> 00:01:06,560 Speaker 1: it four hundred, five thousand, two hundred seventy eight vehicles 19 00:01:06,800 --> 00:01:09,000 Speaker 1: in the last three months. Why was that such a 20 00:01:09,040 --> 00:01:12,080 Speaker 1: shock to the four hund and twenty that they promised, Well, 21 00:01:12,080 --> 00:01:14,520 Speaker 1: you know, it's always about expectations. A beat is a beat, 22 00:01:14,560 --> 00:01:16,039 Speaker 1: and a miss and a miss is a miss, and 23 00:01:16,040 --> 00:01:18,400 Speaker 1: this is a clear miss. I mean Elon Musk spent 24 00:01:18,480 --> 00:01:21,120 Speaker 1: the last earnings call talking about Tesla is going to 25 00:01:21,160 --> 00:01:23,679 Speaker 1: have this epic year end, and we saw on social 26 00:01:23,680 --> 00:01:27,040 Speaker 1: media that Franz, the chief designer, was at the delivery 27 00:01:27,040 --> 00:01:29,080 Speaker 1: center helping to hand over the car. So everyone was 28 00:01:29,120 --> 00:01:31,080 Speaker 1: kind of expecting that the numbers would be pretty close 29 00:01:31,120 --> 00:01:34,360 Speaker 1: to consensus, but they missed consensus by a mile, even 30 00:01:34,360 --> 00:01:37,440 Speaker 1: the company's own the consensus. And you can't, you know, 31 00:01:37,520 --> 00:01:39,360 Speaker 1: you just can't be that way when you're this kind 32 00:01:39,360 --> 00:01:41,800 Speaker 1: of a company. In the SNP five, I mean, people 33 00:01:41,800 --> 00:01:44,319 Speaker 1: are expecting things to be better. The other thing is 34 00:01:44,360 --> 00:01:47,000 Speaker 1: that over thirty or four thousand cars were quote unquote 35 00:01:47,000 --> 00:01:50,000 Speaker 1: in transit, and so it's like Tesla is this big 36 00:01:50,000 --> 00:01:52,760 Speaker 1: company now, and yet they still have this logistical problem 37 00:01:52,760 --> 00:01:55,200 Speaker 1: in terms of getting cars into the hands of customers 38 00:01:55,240 --> 00:01:58,920 Speaker 1: at the end of every quarter, third consecutive quarter of 39 00:01:59,000 --> 00:02:01,520 Speaker 1: missing delivery estimate this thing I'm right and saying. And 40 00:02:01,560 --> 00:02:03,280 Speaker 1: then the other kind of thing that jumped out with 41 00:02:03,320 --> 00:02:05,480 Speaker 1: me your story is that they didn't quite make that 42 00:02:05,560 --> 00:02:09,480 Speaker 1: fifty percent average annual growth rate. A lot a lot 43 00:02:09,480 --> 00:02:11,400 Speaker 1: of analysts of cut price tuggets. I mean, what is 44 00:02:11,760 --> 00:02:15,639 Speaker 1: the picture now for Tesla going forward? In well, they 45 00:02:15,639 --> 00:02:18,079 Speaker 1: report earnings later this month, and the big question is 46 00:02:18,120 --> 00:02:20,960 Speaker 1: the hit too margins? So you know, they cut all 47 00:02:20,960 --> 00:02:23,240 Speaker 1: these prices to try to make to try to make 48 00:02:23,360 --> 00:02:25,799 Speaker 1: the delivery target. That didn't work, So now there's gonna 49 00:02:25,840 --> 00:02:27,520 Speaker 1: be a great hit to gross margins. And I think 50 00:02:27,520 --> 00:02:30,440 Speaker 1: the big thing too is guidance, Like why didn't Tesla 51 00:02:30,520 --> 00:02:33,280 Speaker 1: lower their guidance? You have Elon Musk selling shares of 52 00:02:33,360 --> 00:02:35,560 Speaker 1: his stock in the company mid December when he clearly 53 00:02:35,600 --> 00:02:37,799 Speaker 1: had a clear look at what demand was like for 54 00:02:37,880 --> 00:02:41,040 Speaker 1: the quarter. So he unloads his stock. Everyone else is 55 00:02:41,040 --> 00:02:44,160 Speaker 1: holding the bag. And then they missed by several units. 56 00:02:44,280 --> 00:02:47,160 Speaker 1: And so going into earnings, everyone's cutting their targets and 57 00:02:47,160 --> 00:02:50,760 Speaker 1: everyone wants more conservative guidance for the going You're going forward, 58 00:02:50,800 --> 00:02:53,000 Speaker 1: all right, Bloomberg's Dona Hole, Thank you very much. Want 59 00:02:53,040 --> 00:02:56,760 Speaker 1: to continue the conversation is stick with Tesla with all convests. 60 00:02:57,160 --> 00:03:01,440 Speaker 1: Chief futurist Brett Winton. Brett, we'll get into two arcs 61 00:03:01,639 --> 00:03:06,320 Speaker 1: long term call around Tesla shortly, but just first your 62 00:03:06,360 --> 00:03:08,880 Speaker 1: reaction to the fourth quarter of deliveries miss and as 63 00:03:08,880 --> 00:03:11,679 Speaker 1: we were discussing with Dane of the third consecutive miss 64 00:03:11,680 --> 00:03:15,200 Speaker 1: for deliveries for Tesla, I think it's ironic that you 65 00:03:15,400 --> 00:03:19,160 Speaker 1: qualified as a miss when a company delivers year in 66 00:03:19,240 --> 00:03:23,360 Speaker 1: your growth against an auto market that's declining. Eight. I 67 00:03:23,400 --> 00:03:26,680 Speaker 1: think it's very clear from our perspective that electric vehicles 68 00:03:26,680 --> 00:03:29,840 Speaker 1: are going to become the dominant drive trains um for 69 00:03:30,160 --> 00:03:33,760 Speaker 1: um for automotive over the next five years. And we 70 00:03:33,800 --> 00:03:38,200 Speaker 1: think there'll be sixty million evs sold in and Tesla 71 00:03:38,240 --> 00:03:41,200 Speaker 1: will take a plurality of that. Uh, and so they 72 00:03:41,200 --> 00:03:43,360 Speaker 1: have a huge tail wind behind them. Uh. You know, 73 00:03:43,400 --> 00:03:46,440 Speaker 1: equities are priced on the basis of future expectations of 74 00:03:46,520 --> 00:03:51,280 Speaker 1: cash flow, not the quarterly delivery results. And so I 75 00:03:51,360 --> 00:03:54,520 Speaker 1: expected over the you know, long term, this will resolve 76 00:03:54,560 --> 00:03:56,720 Speaker 1: and will be seen as just a blip in the 77 00:03:56,800 --> 00:04:00,080 Speaker 1: company's trajectory. Right, you called it ironic. What I'm saying 78 00:04:00,160 --> 00:04:02,320 Speaker 1: is that, you know, we need a yard stick, a 79 00:04:02,400 --> 00:04:05,760 Speaker 1: benchmark by on which to go by. Right, it's three 80 00:04:06,080 --> 00:04:10,240 Speaker 1: consecutive quarters of miss against consensus. But you also mentioned 81 00:04:10,240 --> 00:04:13,680 Speaker 1: that and your growth Tesla set out once again in 82 00:04:13,720 --> 00:04:18,680 Speaker 1: two hopes of reaching a fift annual average growth target. 83 00:04:18,720 --> 00:04:21,320 Speaker 1: They didn't hit that either. Do you expect them to 84 00:04:21,400 --> 00:04:25,320 Speaker 1: hit it going forward? Yeah, Then whether or not they 85 00:04:25,400 --> 00:04:28,320 Speaker 1: hit their growth target is a function of production, not demand. 86 00:04:28,360 --> 00:04:30,880 Speaker 1: And so right now the market is talking a lot 87 00:04:30,880 --> 00:04:35,520 Speaker 1: about demand. I think it's probably um true that consumers 88 00:04:35,520 --> 00:04:39,560 Speaker 1: are confused by the u S regulation and which evs 89 00:04:39,560 --> 00:04:42,159 Speaker 1: will qualify and what mix and models will and so 90 00:04:42,520 --> 00:04:45,760 Speaker 1: there is probably a demand kind of hiccup as people 91 00:04:45,800 --> 00:04:49,240 Speaker 1: tried to assess and wait out kind of tax guidance 92 00:04:49,440 --> 00:04:52,200 Speaker 1: for for getting money off the vehicle starting in the 93 00:04:52,240 --> 00:04:55,040 Speaker 1: new year. But ultimately it's a question of whether or 94 00:04:55,080 --> 00:04:58,279 Speaker 1: not Tesla can scale production, and they've demonstrated over time 95 00:04:58,320 --> 00:05:01,480 Speaker 1: that they can, and and I think that's the you know, 96 00:05:01,760 --> 00:05:04,960 Speaker 1: we're making a huge transition from one drive train to another. 97 00:05:05,080 --> 00:05:07,920 Speaker 1: Tesla is is at least three or four years ahead 98 00:05:07,960 --> 00:05:10,520 Speaker 1: of the industry and driving that transition. And we believe 99 00:05:10,520 --> 00:05:13,640 Speaker 1: they're going to continue to scale drive down costs of manufacture. 100 00:05:13,960 --> 00:05:16,000 Speaker 1: And and that's not a scenario where you end up 101 00:05:16,040 --> 00:05:20,960 Speaker 1: with a problem on on even margins as as as 102 00:05:21,040 --> 00:05:23,440 Speaker 1: Dana mentioned, who knows what the margins will look like 103 00:05:23,480 --> 00:05:25,839 Speaker 1: this quarter. I think over time, the company has delivered 104 00:05:25,839 --> 00:05:30,600 Speaker 1: an ability to expand gross margins and and operating margins 105 00:05:31,040 --> 00:05:35,080 Speaker 1: as they have this incredible tailwind of demand for electric vehicles, 106 00:05:35,080 --> 00:05:36,960 Speaker 1: which is the way in which we're going to ride 107 00:05:36,960 --> 00:05:40,400 Speaker 1: around to us. Though about the competition, of course, you 108 00:05:40,480 --> 00:05:42,560 Speaker 1: say that what ahead of it? But competition is coming, 109 00:05:42,560 --> 00:05:46,719 Speaker 1: and it's coming firstly bred sure. So Tesla released the 110 00:05:46,800 --> 00:05:50,039 Speaker 1: Model three in sen and it basically took the industry 111 00:05:50,120 --> 00:05:54,000 Speaker 1: four years before there was a range and cost competitive 112 00:05:54,600 --> 00:05:58,120 Speaker 1: vehicle with the Model three. With that Model three, and 113 00:05:58,320 --> 00:06:00,920 Speaker 1: their cars haven't stayed the same. In March, we think 114 00:06:00,920 --> 00:06:04,080 Speaker 1: that Tesla's gonna announce a new vehicle platform and that 115 00:06:04,240 --> 00:06:06,800 Speaker 1: the cost of manufacturer for that vehicle platform will be 116 00:06:06,880 --> 00:06:09,599 Speaker 1: roughly half the cost of the Model three. If you 117 00:06:09,640 --> 00:06:11,640 Speaker 1: look at what happened when they released the Model three, 118 00:06:11,680 --> 00:06:15,320 Speaker 1: they had a massive gross margin expansion and massive unit 119 00:06:15,400 --> 00:06:18,320 Speaker 1: volume expansion over multiple years. I think the same thing 120 00:06:18,400 --> 00:06:21,159 Speaker 1: is going to happen with the new vehicle platform they 121 00:06:21,200 --> 00:06:23,920 Speaker 1: announced in March, and so they're gonna set the standard 122 00:06:23,960 --> 00:06:26,240 Speaker 1: for the industry again. The industry will again be four 123 00:06:26,320 --> 00:06:29,480 Speaker 1: or five years behind UH and for shareholder it's it's 124 00:06:29,480 --> 00:06:32,880 Speaker 1: a great outcome. Uh. You you end up with a 125 00:06:33,040 --> 00:06:37,560 Speaker 1: company establishing a strategic footprint in in a massive, literally 126 00:06:38,080 --> 00:06:42,560 Speaker 1: trillion dollar plus market UH and UH and and likely 127 00:06:42,600 --> 00:06:45,320 Speaker 1: to dominate and soak up all of the profits out 128 00:06:45,320 --> 00:06:49,200 Speaker 1: of that industry, as as the rest of the competitors 129 00:06:49,200 --> 00:06:53,040 Speaker 1: struggle to catch up. Well, I mean, China's a slightly 130 00:06:53,080 --> 00:06:56,880 Speaker 1: different UH market than than the US and Western markets. 131 00:06:56,920 --> 00:06:59,840 Speaker 1: I think that Tesla will remain at the higher end 132 00:07:00,040 --> 00:07:03,280 Speaker 1: the Chinese market and UM and clearly they have a 133 00:07:04,160 --> 00:07:08,039 Speaker 1: beneficial and synergistic relationship with the government in China, and 134 00:07:08,080 --> 00:07:13,520 Speaker 1: that they're providing demand for the Chinese battery ecosystem and 135 00:07:13,520 --> 00:07:16,280 Speaker 1: and releasing a product into the market that the Chinese 136 00:07:16,280 --> 00:07:19,480 Speaker 1: domestics really enjoy and love. UH and that market is 137 00:07:19,520 --> 00:07:23,320 Speaker 1: likely to be more competitive just because costom manufacturers so 138 00:07:23,400 --> 00:07:26,560 Speaker 1: much lower. There right, brett Arc has a sort of 139 00:07:26,640 --> 00:07:30,720 Speaker 1: long term call on the stock hundred dollars per share, 140 00:07:30,760 --> 00:07:37,120 Speaker 1: which you expect to materialize in six I asked Twitter 141 00:07:37,240 --> 00:07:39,400 Speaker 1: users and our followers, our audience on the show kind 142 00:07:39,400 --> 00:07:41,280 Speaker 1: of what they wanted to ask you. Many wanted to 143 00:07:41,320 --> 00:07:44,200 Speaker 1: ask about that call if it's still is intact. But 144 00:07:44,240 --> 00:07:46,560 Speaker 1: they also wanted to ask how much of it is 145 00:07:46,600 --> 00:07:50,160 Speaker 1: reflective of the promise of full self driving away from 146 00:07:50,200 --> 00:07:55,360 Speaker 1: just the simple business of selling vehicles. Sure, so, just 147 00:07:55,360 --> 00:07:57,920 Speaker 1: just a note that forty dollars to show that was 148 00:07:58,000 --> 00:07:59,760 Speaker 1: pre stock split, so you have to make in a 149 00:08:00,080 --> 00:08:02,760 Speaker 1: split for the stock split, for the for the for 150 00:08:02,840 --> 00:08:06,440 Speaker 1: the UH. You know, current adjusted UH share price expectation, 151 00:08:06,600 --> 00:08:10,640 Speaker 1: though our expectation hasn't um changed UH and in fact, 152 00:08:10,720 --> 00:08:15,440 Speaker 1: we're going through the process of of updating our numbers 153 00:08:15,880 --> 00:08:17,960 Speaker 1: right now, so keep an eye out for that as 154 00:08:17,960 --> 00:08:20,960 Speaker 1: well as our overall EV forecast and and in our 155 00:08:21,000 --> 00:08:24,160 Speaker 1: Big Ideas report that will release later this month. UM 156 00:08:24,440 --> 00:08:28,560 Speaker 1: the roughly a third of the value of the business 157 00:08:28,720 --> 00:08:31,200 Speaker 1: is the EV manufacturing the business in our view, and 158 00:08:31,280 --> 00:08:34,120 Speaker 1: two thirds of the value of the business is expectations 159 00:08:34,120 --> 00:08:38,440 Speaker 1: for GROBOTAXI. And that's a really important consideration here. People 160 00:08:38,480 --> 00:08:44,400 Speaker 1: act like, oh, this unit number in matters tremendously in 161 00:08:44,400 --> 00:08:48,280 Speaker 1: in the the scheme and scope of of the business model. 162 00:08:48,480 --> 00:08:51,360 Speaker 1: If they can deliver full self driving, that will transform 163 00:08:51,440 --> 00:08:54,480 Speaker 1: the company. You go from getting one time profitability from 164 00:08:54,480 --> 00:08:59,240 Speaker 1: each asset sold to ongoing cash flow generation from every 165 00:08:59,360 --> 00:09:03,520 Speaker 1: asset in field per annum. On a go forward basis, 166 00:09:03,600 --> 00:09:07,240 Speaker 1: as these um individually owned vehicles that are used you know, 167 00:09:07,360 --> 00:09:10,480 Speaker 1: five percent of the time and spend their time part 168 00:09:10,840 --> 00:09:14,360 Speaker 1: turn into robotaxis that can take you know, five or 169 00:09:14,400 --> 00:09:17,160 Speaker 1: ten people around in a day uh and and deliver 170 00:09:17,400 --> 00:09:21,400 Speaker 1: ongoing returns to shareholders. So it will be a business 171 00:09:21,480 --> 00:09:24,360 Speaker 1: value transformation if and as they deliver it, and the 172 00:09:24,440 --> 00:09:26,959 Speaker 1: evidence on the ground is they'll be able to. I mean, 173 00:09:27,040 --> 00:09:30,800 Speaker 1: I use it every day. It makes driving safer less stressful. 174 00:09:31,080 --> 00:09:33,920 Speaker 1: Uh and and I'm less tired after driving. It's a 175 00:09:33,960 --> 00:09:37,280 Speaker 1: great product. And by the way, it improved yesterday while 176 00:09:37,280 --> 00:09:39,440 Speaker 1: it was sitting in my driveway. The car I owned 177 00:09:39,440 --> 00:09:42,120 Speaker 1: today is better than the car I owned yesterday. There's 178 00:09:42,120 --> 00:09:44,960 Speaker 1: almost no other vehicle in the world you can say 179 00:09:44,960 --> 00:09:48,520 Speaker 1: that about. And so I think that the promise of 180 00:09:48,559 --> 00:09:52,480 Speaker 1: that transformation to the business models is really extreme and 181 00:09:52,640 --> 00:09:54,840 Speaker 1: you don't need to assume it's going to happen in 182 00:09:54,920 --> 00:10:00,160 Speaker 1: order to underwrite a really material return for the company. Right. Well, 183 00:10:00,280 --> 00:10:02,520 Speaker 1: certainly the bill case, we thanks for you for having 184 00:10:02,800 --> 00:10:05,600 Speaker 1: new on and do come back with the updated numbers. 185 00:10:06,320 --> 00:10:09,560 Speaker 1: It's the pragmatic case. I mean, like, let's be honest, 186 00:10:09,640 --> 00:10:13,960 Speaker 1: this is a world class um product that people love 187 00:10:14,240 --> 00:10:17,280 Speaker 1: and that makes them safer and gets them to and 188 00:10:17,400 --> 00:10:20,920 Speaker 1: from places faster and easier. Uh, and I don't expect 189 00:10:21,000 --> 00:10:24,200 Speaker 1: it that that hasn't changed, and so we expected to 190 00:10:24,200 --> 00:10:27,880 Speaker 1: continue of arc. We thank you, hands up, have a 191 00:10:27,920 --> 00:10:30,480 Speaker 1: great start to twenty three. Thanks for coming on. All 192 00:10:30,559 --> 00:10:33,559 Speaker 1: things tess are all things pragmatic, or some would say, 193 00:10:33,559 --> 00:10:35,839 Speaker 1: in all case, what to expect from tech stocks? Of course, 194 00:10:35,880 --> 00:10:38,360 Speaker 1: more broadly, next to you bull more generally, we're gonna 195 00:10:38,400 --> 00:10:40,480 Speaker 1: be asking, ever core I s I Senior Imagine Director 196 00:10:40,480 --> 00:10:44,040 Speaker 1: and head of Internet Research, Mark Mahaney, that's next is 197 00:10:44,080 --> 00:10:56,040 Speaker 1: a bloomberg. These take investors really haven't had to focus 198 00:10:56,040 --> 00:10:59,000 Speaker 1: on business fundamentals for a long period of time. They've 199 00:10:59,040 --> 00:11:02,200 Speaker 1: been writing this lower inflation rate cycle and riding the 200 00:11:02,320 --> 00:11:05,080 Speaker 1: right you know, the rising in stock prices that come 201 00:11:05,120 --> 00:11:07,280 Speaker 1: as a result of that. So tech investors are now 202 00:11:07,320 --> 00:11:10,160 Speaker 1: actually having to do the work that we have been doing, 203 00:11:10,360 --> 00:11:13,000 Speaker 1: you know, as active stock pickers our entire career. So 204 00:11:13,240 --> 00:11:15,840 Speaker 1: that's why we think there's a lot of opportunity there, 205 00:11:15,880 --> 00:11:20,600 Speaker 1: But you really need to be stockpickers. Franklin Mutual Advisors 206 00:11:20,640 --> 00:11:25,079 Speaker 1: portfolio manager Katrina Dudley. There was some tough love tech investors. 207 00:11:25,080 --> 00:11:27,600 Speaker 1: As we entered this new year, let's continue the conversation 208 00:11:27,640 --> 00:11:30,080 Speaker 1: with a man who does a lot of fundamental analysis, 209 00:11:30,240 --> 00:11:32,920 Speaker 1: Mark Mahaney of ever Core. And it's great to start 210 00:11:33,000 --> 00:11:35,160 Speaker 1: the year with you, Mark and talk to us about 211 00:11:35,200 --> 00:11:38,800 Speaker 1: what was cautious and muted two now turns to constructive 212 00:11:38,840 --> 00:11:42,360 Speaker 1: after a brutal last year. Mark, some of your best 213 00:11:42,400 --> 00:11:44,880 Speaker 1: ideas and one of them is Uber. It's interesting we 214 00:11:44,920 --> 00:11:48,160 Speaker 1: just finished a conversation had on the heels of Tessa robotaxis. 215 00:11:48,200 --> 00:11:53,840 Speaker 1: What fundamentally looks nice to you with Uber? Mark? Well, Caroline, 216 00:11:53,880 --> 00:11:56,079 Speaker 1: thanks and happy new year to you. It's nice to 217 00:11:56,080 --> 00:11:58,920 Speaker 1: see you again. The this last year wasn't terrible year. 218 00:11:59,400 --> 00:12:02,440 Speaker 1: There was the worst performing year for stocks, especially for 219 00:12:02,480 --> 00:12:06,120 Speaker 1: growth equities since two thousand and eight. So yeah, that 220 00:12:06,200 --> 00:12:09,040 Speaker 1: was that was very challenging. I'm going into this year 221 00:12:09,080 --> 00:12:11,880 Speaker 1: we try to be tactically constructive, which means we're looking 222 00:12:11,920 --> 00:12:15,200 Speaker 1: for companies that are somewhat recession resistant and I don't 223 00:12:15,200 --> 00:12:18,560 Speaker 1: cover a defensive space, so somewhat recession resistant, maybe have 224 00:12:18,600 --> 00:12:21,559 Speaker 1: new revenue streams and then have taken cost actions because 225 00:12:21,600 --> 00:12:23,199 Speaker 1: you need to do that at demand is going to 226 00:12:23,280 --> 00:12:26,440 Speaker 1: soften and that leads us to like to two stocks 227 00:12:26,440 --> 00:12:28,960 Speaker 1: in particular. You mentioned one Uber, the others Netflix Uber. 228 00:12:29,240 --> 00:12:30,760 Speaker 1: I just think that the ride sharing part of the 229 00:12:30,840 --> 00:12:34,320 Speaker 1: business is more for utility than a discretionary spend environment. 230 00:12:34,360 --> 00:12:37,640 Speaker 1: We still need to commute, We still have our weekend outings, 231 00:12:38,000 --> 00:12:40,559 Speaker 1: and we still have some airport trips, and leisure demand 232 00:12:40,559 --> 00:12:42,880 Speaker 1: trends seem to be holding up very well. So I 233 00:12:42,960 --> 00:12:45,080 Speaker 1: just think that that part of the business holds up well. 234 00:12:45,320 --> 00:12:47,320 Speaker 1: Company has taken a lot of costs out it was 235 00:12:47,440 --> 00:12:50,600 Speaker 1: forced to, and it was probably to its own benefit. UH. 236 00:12:50,600 --> 00:12:52,440 Speaker 1: And they've now turned a corner on free cash flow, 237 00:12:52,440 --> 00:12:54,040 Speaker 1: and I think they'll be able to continue to grow 238 00:12:54,160 --> 00:12:56,199 Speaker 1: free cash flow. So I think it's that as the 239 00:12:56,240 --> 00:12:58,800 Speaker 1: story changes from a growth at all cost company to 240 00:12:58,920 --> 00:13:01,559 Speaker 1: a im positive free cash flow company. I just think 241 00:13:01,559 --> 00:13:02,800 Speaker 1: that you know, you're going to find a lot of 242 00:13:02,880 --> 00:13:05,920 Speaker 1: valuation support for the name UH and that's why I 243 00:13:05,920 --> 00:13:09,079 Speaker 1: think the stock and outperformed this year. It's interesting just 244 00:13:09,240 --> 00:13:11,600 Speaker 1: there already you're getting to the nuts and the bolts 245 00:13:11,600 --> 00:13:14,360 Speaker 1: of fundamentals and decisions while you're picking certain companies to 246 00:13:14,480 --> 00:13:17,160 Speaker 1: perform over and above others. Do you think it's true 247 00:13:17,240 --> 00:13:19,720 Speaker 1: that a lot of technology investors out there haven't done 248 00:13:19,760 --> 00:13:22,800 Speaker 1: the fundamental analysis or indeed aren't able and set up 249 00:13:22,840 --> 00:13:25,280 Speaker 1: for an environment that is completely out odds with what 250 00:13:25,320 --> 00:13:27,360 Speaker 1: they've been used to, which is basically lower rates for 251 00:13:27,400 --> 00:13:32,800 Speaker 1: longer there's no question and easy money time, you know, 252 00:13:32,880 --> 00:13:38,240 Speaker 1: with with practically zero interest rates allowed multiples for one 253 00:13:38,559 --> 00:13:43,480 Speaker 1: to get in times very aggressive, and it kind of 254 00:13:43,520 --> 00:13:46,720 Speaker 1: there was a fools follow fools, and I was certainly 255 00:13:46,720 --> 00:13:49,280 Speaker 1: one of those fools. From time to time on certain stocks. 256 00:13:49,320 --> 00:13:51,120 Speaker 1: We all make mistakes. I've made fit more than my 257 00:13:51,200 --> 00:13:54,280 Speaker 1: share of them. But in terms of the fundamentals, you know, 258 00:13:54,320 --> 00:13:55,840 Speaker 1: I still stick with those, and I think a lot 259 00:13:55,920 --> 00:13:59,280 Speaker 1: of tech investors do. I don't think. I don't think 260 00:13:59,320 --> 00:14:02,840 Speaker 1: that's hot rising interest rates. So this caused names like 261 00:14:02,960 --> 00:14:07,640 Speaker 1: Amazon or Google or Meta to underperforming stocks. I think 262 00:14:07,679 --> 00:14:11,000 Speaker 1: there are other issues, including now increasingly cyclical risk. In 263 00:14:11,200 --> 00:14:13,480 Speaker 1: case of Meta, there are these Apple privacy changes. In 264 00:14:13,480 --> 00:14:16,400 Speaker 1: the case of Amazon, there's also some MISSE execution on 265 00:14:16,440 --> 00:14:19,880 Speaker 1: the airport, and then also just full exposure to inflationary concerns. 266 00:14:19,880 --> 00:14:22,280 Speaker 1: So there really were a lot of issues besides just 267 00:14:22,480 --> 00:14:26,440 Speaker 1: rising rates. Rising rates really affected those long term profitable, 268 00:14:26,480 --> 00:14:29,720 Speaker 1: near term profit less companies, and that would be more 269 00:14:29,960 --> 00:14:32,720 Speaker 1: names like a Shopify for example, and that's why you 270 00:14:32,760 --> 00:14:35,720 Speaker 1: saw names like that with the highest multiples correct the 271 00:14:35,800 --> 00:14:39,480 Speaker 1: most last year, Mark, Caroline and I spent a lot 272 00:14:39,520 --> 00:14:41,600 Speaker 1: of the last few weeks of the year talking about 273 00:14:41,680 --> 00:14:45,400 Speaker 1: layoffs or hiring freezes, cost cutting. I'm trying to summarize 274 00:14:45,400 --> 00:14:47,280 Speaker 1: all of your your points that you seem to be 275 00:14:47,360 --> 00:14:51,080 Speaker 1: suggesting that all the pain is gone, like it's been done. 276 00:14:51,120 --> 00:14:53,640 Speaker 1: We we we we We've gone through it, We've d risk. 277 00:14:53,840 --> 00:14:57,800 Speaker 1: Is that your conclusion going into this year? No, I 278 00:14:57,800 --> 00:15:00,360 Speaker 1: I wouldn't go that far, wouldn't be that bold. US 279 00:15:00,520 --> 00:15:03,520 Speaker 1: multiples have been de risked. Could multiple still fall, of 280 00:15:03,520 --> 00:15:06,440 Speaker 1: course they could, but they have fallen pretty dramatically. And 281 00:15:06,480 --> 00:15:08,600 Speaker 1: you've got a good number of these large cap internet 282 00:15:08,680 --> 00:15:10,360 Speaker 1: names that I look at that are trading at five 283 00:15:10,440 --> 00:15:13,080 Speaker 1: year trop multiples. Doesn't mean they can't go down further, 284 00:15:13,320 --> 00:15:15,440 Speaker 1: but a lot of the risk has been taken out. 285 00:15:16,200 --> 00:15:17,880 Speaker 1: The same thing with estimates, and one of the things 286 00:15:17,920 --> 00:15:20,320 Speaker 1: that it's caused estimates to come down are these companies 287 00:15:20,400 --> 00:15:24,600 Speaker 1: taking costs out of their business. The six percent riff 288 00:15:24,640 --> 00:15:29,800 Speaker 1: reduction enforce at door Dash, the riff production enforce at 289 00:15:30,040 --> 00:15:33,040 Speaker 1: Meta these companies and Amazon did this to There are 290 00:15:33,040 --> 00:15:35,440 Speaker 1: companies that have yet to do this, though Google is 291 00:15:35,480 --> 00:15:37,880 Speaker 1: one where I just think they had five quarters in 292 00:15:37,920 --> 00:15:41,360 Speaker 1: a row of accelerating in record high employee ads up 293 00:15:41,400 --> 00:15:44,080 Speaker 1: through the September quarter of last year. It's really kind 294 00:15:44,080 --> 00:15:47,320 Speaker 1: of a little bit shocking in hindsight. I'm surprised that 295 00:15:47,360 --> 00:15:50,720 Speaker 1: the company didn't start tempering down it's number of new employees. 296 00:15:51,000 --> 00:15:53,400 Speaker 1: I think they're gonna have to start, you know, reducing 297 00:15:53,480 --> 00:15:56,360 Speaker 1: that employee footprint or else margin is gonna be under 298 00:15:56,400 --> 00:15:59,040 Speaker 1: a lot of pressure. Mark we took to twin at 299 00:15:59,040 --> 00:16:02,320 Speaker 1: to Oscar already it's how they see three. We asked 300 00:16:02,600 --> 00:16:05,040 Speaker 1: are you bullish on tech or you barish on tech? Vs? 301 00:16:05,040 --> 00:16:09,040 Speaker 1: Are the results will bring them up for you mostly 302 00:16:09,240 --> 00:16:13,480 Speaker 1: bullish respondents bullish? What would it take to make you 303 00:16:13,640 --> 00:16:18,200 Speaker 1: bullish on technology broadly going into the rest of the year. Well, 304 00:16:18,400 --> 00:16:23,000 Speaker 1: I'm actually surprised that the survey was that bullish. Frankly, 305 00:16:23,000 --> 00:16:27,280 Speaker 1: I'm I'm surprised by that. So, uh, you know, I 306 00:16:27,320 --> 00:16:29,080 Speaker 1: want to be tactically constructive, and I tell you one 307 00:16:29,120 --> 00:16:30,760 Speaker 1: thing I still want to get across the point here. 308 00:16:30,880 --> 00:16:33,200 Speaker 1: I think demand trends are going to continue to soften 309 00:16:33,240 --> 00:16:34,840 Speaker 1: they did in Q three. I think when the Q 310 00:16:35,040 --> 00:16:37,400 Speaker 1: four results come out over the next month, we're going 311 00:16:37,440 --> 00:16:40,920 Speaker 1: to see the revenue trendsfer online retail, online advertising, cloud 312 00:16:40,960 --> 00:16:44,160 Speaker 1: computing companies. Those are all continued to soften, and I 313 00:16:44,200 --> 00:16:46,840 Speaker 1: think they will continue to in the middle through the 314 00:16:46,840 --> 00:16:50,000 Speaker 1: middle of twenty three. Then I hope and the market hopes, 315 00:16:50,240 --> 00:16:53,600 Speaker 1: that fundamental trends stabilized, revenue growth starts to re accelerate. 316 00:16:53,800 --> 00:16:56,960 Speaker 1: If that happens, you'll start seeing multiples go up. And 317 00:16:57,080 --> 00:17:00,240 Speaker 1: especially with cost taking out, you have revenue growth reacceleration 318 00:17:00,280 --> 00:17:03,640 Speaker 1: on a lower cost base, you get this EPs slingshot opportunity. 319 00:17:04,040 --> 00:17:06,200 Speaker 1: That's what's going to cause these stocks to work well. 320 00:17:06,480 --> 00:17:08,600 Speaker 1: So the market is sort of hoping thinking that that 321 00:17:08,640 --> 00:17:10,720 Speaker 1: will happen in the back cap of twenty three. And 322 00:17:10,760 --> 00:17:13,000 Speaker 1: the question we all need to ask ourselves is is 323 00:17:13,040 --> 00:17:15,000 Speaker 1: the market going to be too early or too late 324 00:17:15,040 --> 00:17:17,800 Speaker 1: on that call? All right? Mark mehadia ever call a 325 00:17:17,920 --> 00:17:29,439 Speaker 1: day one three in the bag, Thank you. It was 326 00:17:29,640 --> 00:17:32,639 Speaker 1: Sam bang Winfried's day in court. The ft X founder 327 00:17:32,720 --> 00:17:36,000 Speaker 1: appeared before a federal judge in Manhattan and pleaded not 328 00:17:36,119 --> 00:17:38,639 Speaker 1: guilty to criminal charges he's now set to face a 329 00:17:38,720 --> 00:17:41,840 Speaker 1: trial in October. Stood outside, this is the one the 330 00:17:41,880 --> 00:17:45,480 Speaker 1: only Asian hallibus joining us from the courthouse, and we'll 331 00:17:45,520 --> 00:17:51,000 Speaker 1: where next Shannani. What a day it's been, Caroline, Because 332 00:17:51,040 --> 00:17:53,760 Speaker 1: in addition to him playing not guilty as we had 333 00:17:53,760 --> 00:17:57,640 Speaker 1: expected to eight criminal counts here, there's a lot else 334 00:17:57,680 --> 00:18:01,600 Speaker 1: that happened. A trial date has been set for October. Second, now, 335 00:18:01,640 --> 00:18:04,159 Speaker 1: if everything goes correctly, and that does indeed happen on 336 00:18:04,200 --> 00:18:07,600 Speaker 1: October seven A second, Sorry, this is expected here to 337 00:18:07,680 --> 00:18:10,040 Speaker 1: take a number of weeks to play out in terms 338 00:18:10,080 --> 00:18:11,920 Speaker 1: of the trial that we made too later this year. 339 00:18:12,200 --> 00:18:14,800 Speaker 1: In the coming weeks, we expect the US to start 340 00:18:14,840 --> 00:18:18,159 Speaker 1: presenting their evidence, to present evidence at greater scale on 341 00:18:18,359 --> 00:18:21,000 Speaker 1: the charges that they have made. And remember, then there 342 00:18:21,040 --> 00:18:23,639 Speaker 1: is a process by which Sam Bangmun freed and his 343 00:18:23,800 --> 00:18:27,040 Speaker 1: lawyers set forward their motions. So there is a process here, 344 00:18:27,080 --> 00:18:31,159 Speaker 1: and again things could change before October, certainly, but we 345 00:18:31,200 --> 00:18:33,760 Speaker 1: did get a lot of information today about the nature 346 00:18:33,760 --> 00:18:36,240 Speaker 1: of what we'll play out ahead and the timelines in 347 00:18:36,280 --> 00:18:39,359 Speaker 1: which we are preliminarily operating on. Now. I will also 348 00:18:39,440 --> 00:18:42,560 Speaker 1: say there was contention in the court. Sam Bangmun freed 349 00:18:42,640 --> 00:18:46,119 Speaker 1: came in wearing a suit north face backpack that was 350 00:18:46,160 --> 00:18:50,960 Speaker 1: his arms crossed as the prosecutors asked to amend the 351 00:18:51,160 --> 00:18:54,439 Speaker 1: terms of his bail package. Now this is very interesting 352 00:18:54,440 --> 00:18:57,840 Speaker 1: because Bloomberg is separately reported Aba Beny Morrison for US 353 00:18:57,840 --> 00:19:02,199 Speaker 1: has broken that US prosecutors are separately investigating this idea 354 00:19:02,280 --> 00:19:06,480 Speaker 1: here of money being transferred out of FT and Alameda wallets. Remember, 355 00:19:06,600 --> 00:19:09,040 Speaker 1: the part of a THEIL amendment now is for them 356 00:19:09,080 --> 00:19:12,679 Speaker 1: to seek the spf SA. Magma Freed himself cannot be 357 00:19:12,840 --> 00:19:16,399 Speaker 1: taking money. It cannot be taking any cryptocurrency assets or 358 00:19:16,400 --> 00:19:20,280 Speaker 1: any other assets from Alameda and f TS wallets. Now 359 00:19:20,320 --> 00:19:23,160 Speaker 1: he himself has tweeted as we know that he has 360 00:19:23,200 --> 00:19:26,520 Speaker 1: not done so, but the prosecutor had said the assistant 361 00:19:26,560 --> 00:19:29,560 Speaker 1: attorney has said that this is something that they've seen 362 00:19:29,640 --> 00:19:33,399 Speaker 1: him lie about before in general, and so again a 363 00:19:33,480 --> 00:19:36,359 Speaker 1: point of contention here. But we will see this play 364 00:19:36,400 --> 00:19:40,520 Speaker 1: out in real time, all right, thanks to bloombergs Snali Bassett. 365 00:19:40,600 --> 00:19:43,000 Speaker 1: October seems a long way away, given that that story 366 00:19:43,080 --> 00:19:54,360 Speaker 1: is dominated headlines for the last two months. Welcome back 367 00:19:54,400 --> 00:19:57,000 Speaker 1: to Bloeveog Technology of Caroline Hide in New York alongside 368 00:19:57,000 --> 00:20:00,440 Speaker 1: at Ludlow in San Francisco and big text we out 369 00:20:00,440 --> 00:20:02,800 Speaker 1: of the world of hedge funds in fact today, Yeah, 370 00:20:02,840 --> 00:20:04,840 Speaker 1: it was really interesting because throughout the day this was 371 00:20:04,880 --> 00:20:07,080 Speaker 1: one of the most read stories on the Bloomberg terminal 372 00:20:07,160 --> 00:20:11,320 Speaker 1: and online. It's about Serga cap okay debut Tuesday. It's 373 00:20:11,359 --> 00:20:14,600 Speaker 1: the first or biggest launched by a woman led hedge 374 00:20:14,600 --> 00:20:17,640 Speaker 1: fund one point eight billion dollars in assets under management. 375 00:20:17,640 --> 00:20:19,960 Speaker 1: And I found this so fascinating because we've been writing 376 00:20:19,960 --> 00:20:22,920 Speaker 1: a lot of Bloomberg about how hedge funds suffered in 377 00:20:23,000 --> 00:20:27,000 Speaker 1: two Those that kind of looks more to private markets 378 00:20:27,040 --> 00:20:29,200 Speaker 1: fed a little bit better. But this is really interesting 379 00:20:29,240 --> 00:20:31,880 Speaker 1: based on what Serga Cap is going to be focused on. 380 00:20:32,080 --> 00:20:35,159 Speaker 1: Malagan caused the founder. She's kind of this alumni of 381 00:20:35,480 --> 00:20:39,720 Speaker 1: Lone Pine Capital and according to sources, this is interesting Caroline. 382 00:20:39,920 --> 00:20:43,639 Speaker 1: She's going to be using data science to invest in 383 00:20:43,840 --> 00:20:47,640 Speaker 1: themes that look at how technology can improve pretty bog 384 00:20:47,680 --> 00:20:52,119 Speaker 1: standard areas. So how technology enhances financials, industrials, healthcare is 385 00:20:52,320 --> 00:20:55,439 Speaker 1: enterprise data. But really the why we care here is 386 00:20:55,480 --> 00:20:58,200 Speaker 1: that this is the largest debut of a woman led 387 00:20:58,240 --> 00:21:00,720 Speaker 1: hedge fund in the industries here streak given all of 388 00:21:00,760 --> 00:21:04,520 Speaker 1: the volatility literally around this industry and the under performance 389 00:21:04,560 --> 00:21:06,920 Speaker 1: of two. It was a headline that caught my eye, 390 00:21:06,920 --> 00:21:08,399 Speaker 1: and certainly this is a name that we want to 391 00:21:08,440 --> 00:21:11,640 Speaker 1: keep an eye on going forward. Historic day, it would 392 00:21:11,640 --> 00:21:13,919 Speaker 1: seem there's some history being made in politics as well. 393 00:21:13,920 --> 00:21:16,200 Speaker 1: If I briefly want to bring you the headline after 394 00:21:16,240 --> 00:21:18,960 Speaker 1: Macarthury suffered a historic rebar remember and a pretty drawn 395 00:21:18,960 --> 00:21:21,440 Speaker 1: out speaker vote, they are going to be a journeying 396 00:21:21,560 --> 00:21:26,240 Speaker 1: now until tomorrow Wednesday noon, after failing to elect a 397 00:21:26,359 --> 00:21:28,720 Speaker 1: Speaker of the House. Of course, that's in the United 398 00:21:28,760 --> 00:21:32,720 Speaker 1: States politics. So for now we see an adjournment after 399 00:21:32,880 --> 00:21:35,440 Speaker 1: three rounds of votes to elect a Speaker of the House. 400 00:21:35,760 --> 00:21:37,760 Speaker 1: But let's get back to our bread and butter. Let's 401 00:21:37,760 --> 00:21:40,240 Speaker 1: get back to technology. Let's get back to in fact 402 00:21:40,440 --> 00:21:43,680 Speaker 1: precede investing as well, and in this environment, many saying 403 00:21:43,680 --> 00:21:45,440 Speaker 1: that's still the area that's going to be humming along 404 00:21:45,520 --> 00:21:48,280 Speaker 1: quite nicely. My al gave as with our CEO of 405 00:21:48,320 --> 00:21:50,280 Speaker 1: tech Stars. It is invested in Get This more than 406 00:21:50,280 --> 00:21:52,600 Speaker 1: three thousand three early stage startups, making it one of 407 00:21:52,640 --> 00:21:56,000 Speaker 1: the world's largest precede investors, having written early checks to 408 00:21:56,040 --> 00:21:59,119 Speaker 1: companies such as Uber and Twilio. It is wonderful to 409 00:21:59,119 --> 00:22:02,280 Speaker 1: have you here in York. And how are you feeling 410 00:22:02,280 --> 00:22:04,840 Speaker 1: as we enter twenty three? How are the companies which 411 00:22:04,880 --> 00:22:09,040 Speaker 1: you help fund feeling. I think three is going to 412 00:22:09,119 --> 00:22:12,840 Speaker 1: be one of the trickiest year on record since the 413 00:22:12,960 --> 00:22:16,879 Speaker 1: dot com the dot com bubble, for both investors and startups, 414 00:22:17,280 --> 00:22:19,760 Speaker 1: and mostly because there are so many things happening at 415 00:22:19,800 --> 00:22:22,560 Speaker 1: the same times. On one hand, you have valuations going down, 416 00:22:22,720 --> 00:22:26,240 Speaker 1: found raising lasting much longer I p O not happening, 417 00:22:26,560 --> 00:22:28,480 Speaker 1: and as a result of that, we expect a lot 418 00:22:28,520 --> 00:22:31,719 Speaker 1: of companies are going to fail. At the same time, 419 00:22:31,880 --> 00:22:35,080 Speaker 1: we're seeing an influx of early stage ideas and a 420 00:22:35,080 --> 00:22:37,040 Speaker 1: lot of entrepreneurs on the back of some of the 421 00:22:37,080 --> 00:22:39,960 Speaker 1: tech layoffs that have met the headlines. And then on 422 00:22:40,119 --> 00:22:42,520 Speaker 1: top of that you have the VC industry which is 423 00:22:42,520 --> 00:22:45,879 Speaker 1: going through a fundamental restructuring and what looks more and 424 00:22:45,920 --> 00:22:51,320 Speaker 1: more like a pretty deep consolidation. So trickier for everyone. Tricky, 425 00:22:51,880 --> 00:22:54,720 Speaker 1: many say, from the ashes rise the roses and and 426 00:22:54,880 --> 00:22:57,160 Speaker 1: d We saw that perhaps in the thousand and seven 427 00:22:57,160 --> 00:22:59,760 Speaker 1: eight after the financial crisis, we saw the birth of Uber. 428 00:22:59,840 --> 00:23:02,320 Speaker 1: We all the birth of Airbnb, and there likes. What 429 00:23:02,680 --> 00:23:04,639 Speaker 1: do you look for at the moment in the people 430 00:23:04,640 --> 00:23:06,800 Speaker 1: that you're wanting to be helping, wanting to be mentoring, 431 00:23:06,840 --> 00:23:09,200 Speaker 1: want to be giving money. How we started to see 432 00:23:09,200 --> 00:23:11,600 Speaker 1: a focus on perhaps the profit side of the equation. 433 00:23:12,280 --> 00:23:15,040 Speaker 1: So we we've been investing in early stage for fifteen 434 00:23:15,119 --> 00:23:18,320 Speaker 1: years and we have continuously looked for the same thing. 435 00:23:18,760 --> 00:23:23,480 Speaker 1: We want resilient, unstoppable founders who are working on really 436 00:23:23,640 --> 00:23:28,160 Speaker 1: innovative ideas and big markets. And the reason why three 437 00:23:28,359 --> 00:23:32,040 Speaker 1: four early stage investors like us is really exciting is 438 00:23:32,080 --> 00:23:35,040 Speaker 1: because we see a lot again talking about the tech 439 00:23:35,160 --> 00:23:38,440 Speaker 1: li off, a lot of tech workers coming and being like, 440 00:23:38,480 --> 00:23:40,800 Speaker 1: I want to be an entrepreneur, and they come with 441 00:23:40,960 --> 00:23:43,560 Speaker 1: very big idea and then when you look whether it's 442 00:23:43,560 --> 00:23:47,080 Speaker 1: by geography or by industry, there's like massive pool of 443 00:23:47,119 --> 00:23:49,760 Speaker 1: innovation happening. And so I don't think there's ever been 444 00:23:49,760 --> 00:23:52,320 Speaker 1: a better time to be an early stage investor. Actually, 445 00:23:53,640 --> 00:23:56,120 Speaker 1: mail one of the conversations Caroline and I were having 446 00:23:56,160 --> 00:23:59,560 Speaker 1: towards the end of two was about the positives that 447 00:23:59,600 --> 00:24:03,639 Speaker 1: come out layoffs. Obviously incredibly tough losing your job, but actually, 448 00:24:03,640 --> 00:24:06,080 Speaker 1: if you look back at prior recessions, the dot com 449 00:24:06,080 --> 00:24:09,639 Speaker 1: bubble t eight, a lot of those laid layoffs. Laid 450 00:24:09,720 --> 00:24:12,840 Speaker 1: off go on to be entrepreneurs in their rights start 451 00:24:12,840 --> 00:24:15,639 Speaker 1: their own companies. Do you agree with that the school 452 00:24:15,680 --> 00:24:18,960 Speaker 1: of thoughts absolutely, and we're seeing it right now. The 453 00:24:19,040 --> 00:24:23,720 Speaker 1: number of entrepreneurs who are peaching us to become their investors, 454 00:24:23,800 --> 00:24:27,360 Speaker 1: who come from the midle of this world, the Google 455 00:24:27,400 --> 00:24:32,080 Speaker 1: of this world, has increased dramatically, and so that's extremely positive. 456 00:24:32,119 --> 00:24:35,760 Speaker 1: And again across multiple industry and multiple geographies, we're seeing that. 457 00:24:36,359 --> 00:24:39,280 Speaker 1: The other positive that is not always talked about is 458 00:24:39,320 --> 00:24:42,439 Speaker 1: for early stage companies UM there was a lot of 459 00:24:42,440 --> 00:24:46,720 Speaker 1: pressure on compensation to hire tech workers, and with the 460 00:24:46,800 --> 00:24:52,840 Speaker 1: layoff that have happened in the pressure on compensation has decreased, 461 00:24:52,840 --> 00:24:54,879 Speaker 1: and it has been a lot easier for a lot 462 00:24:54,920 --> 00:24:58,120 Speaker 1: of our portfolio companies to hire the head of product 463 00:24:58,160 --> 00:25:00,119 Speaker 1: that they had always dreamed about, or the c for 464 00:25:00,320 --> 00:25:03,359 Speaker 1: that they had always dreamed about. I find text I 465 00:25:03,480 --> 00:25:06,000 Speaker 1: was really interesting. You've got about a billion dollars in 466 00:25:06,040 --> 00:25:10,480 Speaker 1: assets under management, right, but you look at precede, that's 467 00:25:10,600 --> 00:25:14,360 Speaker 1: very different size and scale to the industry. As I understanding. 468 00:25:14,400 --> 00:25:16,200 Speaker 1: You know, lots of players in the seed stage or 469 00:25:16,240 --> 00:25:20,760 Speaker 1: precde have tens or maybe a hundred million dollars. It 470 00:25:20,840 --> 00:25:24,560 Speaker 1: makes me think about consolidation and this idea that actually 471 00:25:25,040 --> 00:25:28,960 Speaker 1: small venture capital firms are all trying to buy for 472 00:25:29,119 --> 00:25:32,399 Speaker 1: similar promising names. What do you expect the industry to 473 00:25:32,480 --> 00:25:35,919 Speaker 1: experience this year. So, because we are one of the 474 00:25:36,000 --> 00:25:38,879 Speaker 1: major deal flow to the venture world, we talked to 475 00:25:39,000 --> 00:25:42,440 Speaker 1: thousands of investors every year, and we are seeing now 476 00:25:42,520 --> 00:25:46,240 Speaker 1: something that is not yet reflected in the data. We're 477 00:25:46,280 --> 00:25:50,399 Speaker 1: seeing an increasing number of emerging managers. Managers will have 478 00:25:50,520 --> 00:25:53,200 Speaker 1: less than a hundred million dollars of assets under management, 479 00:25:53,240 --> 00:25:56,639 Speaker 1: will have raised one, maybe two fonts, telling us behind 480 00:25:56,680 --> 00:25:59,240 Speaker 1: closed door, we're not going to raise our next FONT. 481 00:25:59,640 --> 00:26:02,639 Speaker 1: And so we expect that the number of small venture 482 00:26:02,680 --> 00:26:05,480 Speaker 1: capital firm is going to decrease dramatically, potentially up to 483 00:26:05,560 --> 00:26:11,160 Speaker 1: fifty of the venture capital firm that exists today seizing 484 00:26:11,240 --> 00:26:15,880 Speaker 1: practically to function in the next few years. May your 485 00:26:15,920 --> 00:26:20,280 Speaker 1: background also really fascinating And we speak here as a 486 00:26:20,320 --> 00:26:24,000 Speaker 1: lot of Europeans basically around a table talking about US opportunities, 487 00:26:24,000 --> 00:26:26,040 Speaker 1: but go global for us. You're someone who's led businesses 488 00:26:26,040 --> 00:26:28,960 Speaker 1: and in Russia, in Europe, your farm of course France. 489 00:26:29,680 --> 00:26:32,440 Speaker 1: What what a the global opportunities here? Is everything going 490 00:26:32,480 --> 00:26:34,800 Speaker 1: to revert to the mean, the normal of Oh, we're 491 00:26:34,800 --> 00:26:37,760 Speaker 1: going to back tech entrepreneurs out of Selicon Valley and 492 00:26:37,800 --> 00:26:40,560 Speaker 1: they're kinda gonna look like US. I don't think so. 493 00:26:40,640 --> 00:26:44,640 Speaker 1: I think what's what's happening right now is a lot 494 00:26:44,680 --> 00:26:49,760 Speaker 1: of other places creating very vibrant ecosystem. Uh. Look at 495 00:26:49,920 --> 00:26:52,800 Speaker 1: the Middle East and Africa right now, it is booming 496 00:26:52,960 --> 00:26:56,639 Speaker 1: a lot of entrepreneurs, lots of capital flowing their big 497 00:26:56,680 --> 00:27:00,879 Speaker 1: market that are completely untapped. Even Europe, where we're both from, 498 00:27:00,920 --> 00:27:04,240 Speaker 1: like Paris, has done a phenomenal job at at creating 499 00:27:04,680 --> 00:27:08,320 Speaker 1: an extraordinary ecosystem, and so we are textures are very 500 00:27:08,359 --> 00:27:11,600 Speaker 1: bullish on opportunities. Not just in the US obviously the 501 00:27:11,680 --> 00:27:15,439 Speaker 1: US remained the leading market for tech entrepreneurs, but also 502 00:27:15,760 --> 00:27:19,439 Speaker 1: Middle East, Africa and Europe for sure. Male the I 503 00:27:19,520 --> 00:27:22,200 Speaker 1: p A market ground to a halt last year. Will 504 00:27:22,200 --> 00:27:26,680 Speaker 1: it revive this year? I don't think so. It looks 505 00:27:26,720 --> 00:27:31,280 Speaker 1: like it's going to flatlock, continue to flatline. Um. The unknown, obviously, 506 00:27:31,480 --> 00:27:33,600 Speaker 1: is around a few of the big I p O 507 00:27:33,680 --> 00:27:36,920 Speaker 1: which are supposed to be in the pipe, things like 508 00:27:37,560 --> 00:27:42,040 Speaker 1: Insta carts or or Stripe and not made changed. The 509 00:27:42,480 --> 00:27:45,400 Speaker 1: sentiments on the market, but as of today, we advise 510 00:27:45,520 --> 00:27:48,960 Speaker 1: or portfolio companies to look at alternative We tell them 511 00:27:48,960 --> 00:27:51,600 Speaker 1: that if they're desperate for an exit, they probably already 512 00:27:51,640 --> 00:27:54,240 Speaker 1: lost the battle and that they should be focusing on 513 00:27:54,280 --> 00:27:59,760 Speaker 1: alternative option down round of venture debts or M and 514 00:27:59,800 --> 00:28:02,919 Speaker 1: A as an alternative to I P. We we do 515 00:28:03,000 --> 00:28:04,480 Speaker 1: get a little bit hung up on I P O 516 00:28:04,600 --> 00:28:06,800 Speaker 1: s right, this kind of north star that you look 517 00:28:06,840 --> 00:28:10,040 Speaker 1: to to go public but actually precede seed stage. You 518 00:28:10,080 --> 00:28:13,919 Speaker 1: have options, right, strategics can acquire you. You can you know, 519 00:28:14,000 --> 00:28:17,199 Speaker 1: basically shop yourself to a bigger party. What are some 520 00:28:17,280 --> 00:28:19,000 Speaker 1: of those options? I mean, do you see M and 521 00:28:19,040 --> 00:28:25,160 Speaker 1: A broadly taking place in absolutely and again behind closed 522 00:28:25,160 --> 00:28:27,480 Speaker 1: door Because of our large portfolio, we have a lot 523 00:28:27,520 --> 00:28:30,760 Speaker 1: of conversations with a lot of people in the market, 524 00:28:31,400 --> 00:28:35,480 Speaker 1: and what we're seeing is an increasing number of large 525 00:28:35,520 --> 00:28:39,320 Speaker 1: companies looking at M and A. Because the valuations are 526 00:28:39,360 --> 00:28:42,320 Speaker 1: going down, it makes it more attractive for them, and 527 00:28:42,400 --> 00:28:45,880 Speaker 1: because the founders are struggling to found raise from the 528 00:28:45,960 --> 00:28:49,880 Speaker 1: VC world, there are more amenable to have this conversation. 529 00:28:49,960 --> 00:28:52,560 Speaker 1: So I would expect a lot more M and A 530 00:28:53,120 --> 00:28:57,600 Speaker 1: this year and next year. Let's talk industries or problems 531 00:28:57,640 --> 00:29:00,520 Speaker 1: looking to be fixed right now, because you talk about 532 00:29:00,600 --> 00:29:01,920 Speaker 1: M and A, and a lot of the issues about 533 00:29:02,040 --> 00:29:05,280 Speaker 1: M and A is sometimes regulatory in their minded people 534 00:29:05,320 --> 00:29:07,760 Speaker 1: can't make the acquisitions they perhaps would like to. What 535 00:29:07,840 --> 00:29:10,240 Speaker 1: are the problems that people want to fix that they 536 00:29:10,240 --> 00:29:12,080 Speaker 1: would like to fix right now? What are you seeing 537 00:29:12,120 --> 00:29:14,160 Speaker 1: from these entrepreneurs who perhaps getting laid off at some 538 00:29:14,160 --> 00:29:16,200 Speaker 1: of the big companies that can't do the purchasing right now. 539 00:29:16,880 --> 00:29:21,320 Speaker 1: So Number one climate climate tech, and it's a It's 540 00:29:21,320 --> 00:29:24,240 Speaker 1: at a point right now where I'm starting to wonder 541 00:29:24,280 --> 00:29:26,800 Speaker 1: whether there's not going to be a big bubble specifically 542 00:29:26,800 --> 00:29:29,560 Speaker 1: in climate tech. But the market is hard, lots of innovation, 543 00:29:29,720 --> 00:29:33,320 Speaker 1: lots of capital, and look objectively big problems to solve, 544 00:29:33,360 --> 00:29:36,520 Speaker 1: So that's an interesting market. We're also seeing a lot 545 00:29:36,560 --> 00:29:40,080 Speaker 1: of things happening in foot tech and arctech UM in 546 00:29:40,120 --> 00:29:44,160 Speaker 1: particular following the war in Ukraine and the problem was 547 00:29:44,240 --> 00:29:46,120 Speaker 1: supply chain, so I think a lot of people have 548 00:29:46,200 --> 00:29:51,200 Speaker 1: started realizing that actually, um, we needed to be more 549 00:29:51,240 --> 00:29:55,680 Speaker 1: focused on creating food for the world. And then health 550 00:29:55,760 --> 00:29:59,920 Speaker 1: tech is also booming. Lots of things happening in that environment, uh, 551 00:30:00,120 --> 00:30:02,720 Speaker 1: especially in developing countries where people are starting to get 552 00:30:02,720 --> 00:30:06,080 Speaker 1: access to better healthcare. Really good to have some time 553 00:30:06,080 --> 00:30:09,960 Speaker 1: with the head. Yeah, well, you know we're very focused 554 00:30:10,000 --> 00:30:11,520 Speaker 1: on that. You know that what I would call the 555 00:30:11,520 --> 00:30:13,880 Speaker 1: sexy end of the startup curve. Right, we talked all 556 00:30:13,920 --> 00:30:17,160 Speaker 1: about these growth stage companies. Actually, everything you and I 557 00:30:17,200 --> 00:30:19,800 Speaker 1: have heard in recent weeks says look at seed and 558 00:30:19,880 --> 00:30:23,840 Speaker 1: presead stage because that's where we'll see some activity. Ine 559 00:30:23,880 --> 00:30:26,680 Speaker 1: mile Garv, CEO of Textiles, will find out over the 560 00:30:26,680 --> 00:30:29,320 Speaker 1: course of the next twelve months if you're right. Thank you. Now, 561 00:30:29,320 --> 00:30:31,600 Speaker 1: coming up from the I p O drought to the 562 00:30:31,680 --> 00:30:34,480 Speaker 1: ads drought, how will Matter and Google fair as the 563 00:30:34,520 --> 00:30:37,479 Speaker 1: advertising market moves out of their favor? What does that 564 00:30:37,520 --> 00:30:49,480 Speaker 1: mean for media? This is Bloomberg. I want to bring 565 00:30:49,480 --> 00:30:52,280 Speaker 1: you some headlines that cross the terminal. This our Twitter 566 00:30:52,880 --> 00:30:56,240 Speaker 1: is easing its political ad policies in an effort to 567 00:30:56,280 --> 00:30:59,080 Speaker 1: boost revenue. Will dig into that as we get more information. 568 00:30:59,120 --> 00:31:02,480 Speaker 1: But a slowdown and advertising markets could present a big 569 00:31:02,480 --> 00:31:06,000 Speaker 1: problem for tech. This year, US advertising growth is expected 570 00:31:06,040 --> 00:31:10,120 Speaker 1: to have from ten percent to five three according to 571 00:31:10,120 --> 00:31:14,640 Speaker 1: an analysis published Tuesday by Bloomberg Intelligence. Here to discuss this, 572 00:31:14,760 --> 00:31:18,160 Speaker 1: Mark Douglas, CEO of Mountain a software to help companies 573 00:31:18,240 --> 00:31:22,760 Speaker 1: launch direct response campaigns on television in particular Mark, Let's 574 00:31:22,800 --> 00:31:25,720 Speaker 1: start with that forecast, the idea that broadly the ad 575 00:31:25,760 --> 00:31:29,959 Speaker 1: markets growth will slow from ten per cent to five three. 576 00:31:30,000 --> 00:31:33,560 Speaker 1: Does that reflect what you're seeing? Um? Yeah, And it's 577 00:31:33,560 --> 00:31:36,320 Speaker 1: occurring for a couple of reasons. I think in when 578 00:31:36,360 --> 00:31:39,880 Speaker 1: you look at like paid search and paid social, especially 579 00:31:39,880 --> 00:31:44,480 Speaker 1: paid social like we're talking Instagram, TikTok, those kind of 580 00:31:44,520 --> 00:31:46,840 Speaker 1: platforms which you're seeing there, I think it's a lot 581 00:31:46,920 --> 00:31:50,600 Speaker 1: of concerns about brand safety around the political discourse on 582 00:31:50,640 --> 00:31:55,240 Speaker 1: these platforms, and also just a sheer performance. Apples changes 583 00:31:55,320 --> 00:31:58,440 Speaker 1: did wind up having an impact. Their changes in terms 584 00:31:58,520 --> 00:32:01,960 Speaker 1: of identification and device did wind up having an impact 585 00:32:02,000 --> 00:32:05,160 Speaker 1: in particular one Meta and Snap and others. The other 586 00:32:05,240 --> 00:32:07,920 Speaker 1: thing that's affecting it when you look at the television market, 587 00:32:08,320 --> 00:32:10,920 Speaker 1: there's just a supply demanding balance. You have a lot 588 00:32:10,960 --> 00:32:16,960 Speaker 1: of inventory coming online from Netflix, Disney Plus and other suppliers. 589 00:32:17,000 --> 00:32:20,800 Speaker 1: And while brand advertisers are literally not spending more, they're 590 00:32:20,840 --> 00:32:23,200 Speaker 1: spending less. So that's going to create a price war 591 00:32:23,200 --> 00:32:26,240 Speaker 1: and you're gonna see declining prices. The two of those combined, 592 00:32:26,280 --> 00:32:29,520 Speaker 1: they're having a pretty negative impact UM in the near term. 593 00:32:29,600 --> 00:32:31,480 Speaker 1: Oneis markets, but I think you'll see more growth in 594 00:32:31,520 --> 00:32:36,880 Speaker 1: the second half. Two was just packed with news and 595 00:32:37,000 --> 00:32:39,160 Speaker 1: a significant events. And you think about two February in 596 00:32:39,200 --> 00:32:41,800 Speaker 1: the start of the war in Ukraine, the impact that 597 00:32:41,880 --> 00:32:44,280 Speaker 1: had on advertising, in the shock that Meta gave us 598 00:32:44,280 --> 00:32:46,320 Speaker 1: in February, and then by the end of the year 599 00:32:46,360 --> 00:32:50,800 Speaker 1: we're talking about add supported tiers for Disney, for Netflix, 600 00:32:50,840 --> 00:32:54,440 Speaker 1: and the markets changed its conversation. How important were those 601 00:32:54,560 --> 00:32:57,960 Speaker 1: sort of big ticket items in two in shaking up 602 00:32:58,000 --> 00:33:01,520 Speaker 1: the landscape and advertising. Yeah, I don't think that kind 603 00:33:01,560 --> 00:33:04,080 Speaker 1: of news. I mean, obviously the war in Ukraine then 604 00:33:04,080 --> 00:33:07,320 Speaker 1: affected the stock market. So I think what we saw 605 00:33:07,640 --> 00:33:12,440 Speaker 1: is over the summer, advertisers just somewhat panicked and didn't 606 00:33:12,440 --> 00:33:15,720 Speaker 1: know what to do, you know, so, but they that 607 00:33:15,920 --> 00:33:17,760 Speaker 1: started to recover in the second half of the year, 608 00:33:17,760 --> 00:33:19,880 Speaker 1: at least in our business, we ended the year with 609 00:33:19,960 --> 00:33:22,840 Speaker 1: record breaking months, So you know, if that's any indication 610 00:33:22,920 --> 00:33:26,520 Speaker 1: of larger market UM, advertisers, like I said, panicked over 611 00:33:26,560 --> 00:33:28,480 Speaker 1: the summer, and I think once they got in the 612 00:33:28,520 --> 00:33:31,080 Speaker 1: holiday season, they realized, look, if we're gonna grow up business, 613 00:33:31,080 --> 00:33:34,080 Speaker 1: we're gonna have them spend money to reach consumers. So 614 00:33:34,200 --> 00:33:37,720 Speaker 1: I think ultimately the market, the market in the second 615 00:33:37,720 --> 00:33:41,640 Speaker 1: half kind of stabilized. But again these macro forces, you know, 616 00:33:41,880 --> 00:33:45,040 Speaker 1: especially like price war is coming from so much supply, 617 00:33:45,600 --> 00:33:48,760 Speaker 1: those kind of things are just having a big overall effect. 618 00:33:49,000 --> 00:33:51,680 Speaker 1: I think it will create a better future though, and 619 00:33:51,880 --> 00:33:55,760 Speaker 1: meaning that there's no longer this duopoly of Jet, Google 620 00:33:56,240 --> 00:34:00,160 Speaker 1: and Meta, you know, dominating advertising. I think television is 621 00:34:00,160 --> 00:34:02,840 Speaker 1: now digital is going to really have a big impact 622 00:34:02,880 --> 00:34:05,680 Speaker 1: on the overall market. Okay, so who wins that mark 623 00:34:05,760 --> 00:34:09,799 Speaker 1: from your perspective in terms in terms of TV, it's 624 00:34:09,840 --> 00:34:11,759 Speaker 1: the big players. I think you're likely to see a 625 00:34:11,760 --> 00:34:14,440 Speaker 1: lot of M and A. So what's gonna happen is 626 00:34:14,560 --> 00:34:16,960 Speaker 1: there are new advertisers coming in the market. I mean 627 00:34:17,000 --> 00:34:19,320 Speaker 1: TV is now The way to think of this is 628 00:34:19,360 --> 00:34:23,520 Speaker 1: there what's this duopoli between Google and Meta. They now 629 00:34:23,640 --> 00:34:26,080 Speaker 1: control less than half of the advertising body, so that 630 00:34:26,360 --> 00:34:30,000 Speaker 1: their overall controllers applient as other areas have grown. And 631 00:34:30,040 --> 00:34:33,640 Speaker 1: so what has happened is television with connected TV streaming 632 00:34:34,280 --> 00:34:37,919 Speaker 1: is digital also and it's now benefiting in the same 633 00:34:37,960 --> 00:34:42,040 Speaker 1: way that digital advertising benefited Google and Meta. And so 634 00:34:42,120 --> 00:34:45,040 Speaker 1: you see this growth occurring there more customers coming into 635 00:34:45,080 --> 00:34:48,960 Speaker 1: the market, They're spending more. It's diversifying the customer base 636 00:34:49,360 --> 00:34:52,640 Speaker 1: away from just a thousand or two thousand advertisers to 637 00:34:52,760 --> 00:34:56,520 Speaker 1: many more. And so television is coming on strong as 638 00:34:56,520 --> 00:35:00,520 Speaker 1: this third big scale channel that's now a true digital channel. 639 00:35:01,000 --> 00:35:03,560 Speaker 1: And I don't think that means Men and Google lose, 640 00:35:04,040 --> 00:35:06,600 Speaker 1: but it just kind of means that they no longer 641 00:35:06,719 --> 00:35:08,759 Speaker 1: dominate in the way they have in the pass and 642 00:35:08,800 --> 00:35:12,200 Speaker 1: that's really good overall for avertis for the advertising industry, 643 00:35:12,239 --> 00:35:14,480 Speaker 1: and there's new sort of rules of the game. The 644 00:35:14,640 --> 00:35:16,520 Speaker 1: load of the companies need speech. You have to learn, 645 00:35:16,560 --> 00:35:18,919 Speaker 1: particularly when it comes to maybe Disney Plus not wanting 646 00:35:18,960 --> 00:35:21,400 Speaker 1: to advertise you're thinking of alcohol if they give a 647 00:35:21,440 --> 00:35:23,879 Speaker 1: politics and just have the headline about Twitter perhaps going 648 00:35:23,920 --> 00:35:26,480 Speaker 1: a little bit more into political advertising. But how are 649 00:35:26,520 --> 00:35:28,440 Speaker 1: some of the clients you speak to how companies and 650 00:35:28,480 --> 00:35:32,879 Speaker 1: advertises marketers thinking about where they place the ads, how 651 00:35:32,960 --> 00:35:36,040 Speaker 1: they place the ads. Yeah, I mean, so the advertising 652 00:35:36,040 --> 00:35:40,000 Speaker 1: market is splitting the brand advertisers and that you don't 653 00:35:40,040 --> 00:35:44,560 Speaker 1: sell alcohol like over the internet, right, so so so 654 00:35:45,000 --> 00:35:49,600 Speaker 1: you certainly and so you know the brand advertisers that 655 00:35:49,680 --> 00:35:52,560 Speaker 1: everyone thinks of when they watch sports and what and 656 00:35:52,600 --> 00:35:56,480 Speaker 1: watch other TV there there's not actually that many of them. 657 00:35:56,600 --> 00:35:59,480 Speaker 1: It's about you know, thousand and two thousand and but 658 00:35:59,560 --> 00:36:03,600 Speaker 1: it's what everyone thinks of. It's the direct response advertisers. 659 00:36:03,640 --> 00:36:07,680 Speaker 1: I mean, Meta has ten million customers advertising on their platform. 660 00:36:08,000 --> 00:36:10,000 Speaker 1: Those are numbers they in nown school Goal has an 661 00:36:10,040 --> 00:36:12,799 Speaker 1: equal or higher number and so and now you're seeing 662 00:36:12,840 --> 00:36:16,000 Speaker 1: a lot of those advertisers come to television and so 663 00:36:16,280 --> 00:36:19,759 Speaker 1: those advertisers really don't care about those rules. It's the 664 00:36:19,800 --> 00:36:23,040 Speaker 1: brand advertisers that worry about how their brand is being perceived. 665 00:36:23,400 --> 00:36:28,560 Speaker 1: The direct response advertisers that really truly dominate advertising. Um 666 00:36:28,719 --> 00:36:31,640 Speaker 1: that they're like, if you think of the direct response 667 00:36:31,680 --> 00:36:33,799 Speaker 1: market the US is three times the size of the 668 00:36:33,840 --> 00:36:37,919 Speaker 1: brand average sizing market and television. Those direct renaissance advertisers, 669 00:36:38,040 --> 00:36:41,000 Speaker 1: they just want to reach consumers wherever they are. They're 670 00:36:41,040 --> 00:36:43,680 Speaker 1: not worried about rule, you know, they're not thinking of 671 00:36:43,719 --> 00:36:46,759 Speaker 1: those rules. So so you know, all of these things 672 00:36:46,800 --> 00:36:49,400 Speaker 1: you're seeing in terms of the you know, rules like 673 00:36:49,440 --> 00:36:53,000 Speaker 1: that that really just pertains to to the advertisers that 674 00:36:53,080 --> 00:36:56,600 Speaker 1: are not directly measuring the response the ads, which is 675 00:36:56,640 --> 00:37:00,640 Speaker 1: what we mean when we say direct response advertising are 676 00:37:00,680 --> 00:37:03,520 Speaker 1: great to get your direct analysis with us on direct 677 00:37:03,560 --> 00:37:07,520 Speaker 1: response advertising and all of the gamute maybe sensitability there, 678 00:37:07,520 --> 00:37:11,080 Speaker 1: Mark Douglas, we thank you so much, CEO Mountain. Meanwhile, 679 00:37:11,400 --> 00:37:15,200 Speaker 1: well from advertising year ahead to perhaps your own resolutions 680 00:37:15,360 --> 00:37:19,400 Speaker 1: around work, what about perhaps we have fewer meetings? He 681 00:37:19,680 --> 00:37:22,279 Speaker 1: d e commerce giant shopper fight. Did you hear it's 682 00:37:22,280 --> 00:37:26,160 Speaker 1: clear today putting an end to unproductive meetings saying look, 683 00:37:26,239 --> 00:37:30,440 Speaker 1: employees just say no. They're currently saying, look, we are 684 00:37:30,520 --> 00:37:34,040 Speaker 1: calendar purging right now. We were removing all recurring meetings 685 00:37:34,080 --> 00:37:36,319 Speaker 1: if we can't remember why or if they started. And 686 00:37:36,680 --> 00:37:40,600 Speaker 1: also they're reupping the ruler that on a Wednesday tomorrow, 687 00:37:40,840 --> 00:37:43,680 Speaker 1: not a single meeting to we had. That's quite a 688 00:37:43,680 --> 00:37:46,759 Speaker 1: commonplace thing here in on the West Coast, you know, 689 00:37:46,800 --> 00:37:51,040 Speaker 1: Twilio Meta have no meeting Wednesdays. When I read this story, 690 00:37:51,200 --> 00:37:53,080 Speaker 1: I thought, how are they going to make this happen? 691 00:37:53,120 --> 00:37:55,759 Speaker 1: You and I are calendars are full of meetings right 692 00:37:55,800 --> 00:37:57,840 Speaker 1: And in the story they say that there will be 693 00:37:57,840 --> 00:38:01,480 Speaker 1: a boss to enforce this. So every time somebody organized 694 00:38:01,480 --> 00:38:03,239 Speaker 1: as a meeting, you get this bot pop up and 695 00:38:03,239 --> 00:38:06,000 Speaker 1: say a reminder. You know you don't need to have 696 00:38:06,040 --> 00:38:09,160 Speaker 1: this meeting. Right, it's bizarre, It's completely bizarre. But it's 697 00:38:09,160 --> 00:38:11,560 Speaker 1: also like the opposite effect of the pandemic. Right, we 698 00:38:11,640 --> 00:38:14,480 Speaker 1: all worked at home but then became so accustomed to 699 00:38:14,640 --> 00:38:18,239 Speaker 1: doing constant zooms or meets or whatever it is, and 700 00:38:18,280 --> 00:38:20,960 Speaker 1: it's a money suck. Basically, the University of North Carolina 701 00:38:20,960 --> 00:38:23,080 Speaker 1: are saying a hundred million dollars on average is lost 702 00:38:23,080 --> 00:38:25,120 Speaker 1: by a big company because everyone spending their time of meetings. 703 00:38:25,160 --> 00:38:27,680 Speaker 1: And it's the opportunity cost. It's what you're not doing 704 00:38:27,960 --> 00:38:29,759 Speaker 1: when you're in that meeting that perhaps didn't need to 705 00:38:29,800 --> 00:38:32,920 Speaker 1: be arranged. You're not being productive and perhaps being a 706 00:38:32,960 --> 00:38:36,160 Speaker 1: bit more stressed. I can hear the producers in my saying, 707 00:38:36,200 --> 00:38:38,400 Speaker 1: don't think about it. You're already late enough as it 708 00:38:38,480 --> 00:38:41,399 Speaker 1: is to our meetings, all the meetings, all the time 709 00:38:49,680 --> 00:38:53,319 Speaker 1: going viral and outcoring of support for Damar Hamlin, the 710 00:38:53,320 --> 00:38:55,960 Speaker 1: twenty four year old Buffalo Bill safety who suffered from 711 00:38:56,000 --> 00:39:00,239 Speaker 1: cardiac arrest on Monday night. Football Hamelin is unsurprisingly gaining 712 00:39:00,280 --> 00:39:04,200 Speaker 1: support with well wishes, but he's also gaining support in fundraising. 713 00:39:04,560 --> 00:39:07,719 Speaker 1: His go fund me page, astonishing it was from to 714 00:39:07,800 --> 00:39:11,120 Speaker 1: purchase toys for underprivileged children. Barely at that point a 715 00:39:11,120 --> 00:39:14,879 Speaker 1: cross two thousand, five hundred dollars. The goal was without two. 716 00:39:14,960 --> 00:39:18,080 Speaker 1: Now the fund has more than four and a half 717 00:39:18,320 --> 00:39:21,480 Speaker 1: million dollars, more than three million donated to the fund 718 00:39:21,520 --> 00:39:24,640 Speaker 1: in a seven hour period from more than seventy five 719 00:39:24,680 --> 00:39:29,360 Speaker 1: thousand donors. Really, the outpouring here is substantial, and indeed 720 00:39:29,400 --> 00:39:32,719 Speaker 1: from some key executives. I know you've kept any on. Yeah, 721 00:39:32,760 --> 00:39:35,239 Speaker 1: I mean, this is our going viral segment, right, and 722 00:39:35,640 --> 00:39:38,160 Speaker 1: it's fair to say that in those moments after it 723 00:39:38,239 --> 00:39:41,600 Speaker 1: happened on the field, it did go viral, particularly on Twitter. 724 00:39:41,840 --> 00:39:45,719 Speaker 1: An example, Bob Iger, the returned CEO of Disney, took 725 00:39:45,760 --> 00:39:48,680 Speaker 1: to Twitter and said, you know, tonight we should all 726 00:39:48,680 --> 00:39:51,799 Speaker 1: be praying for Deamar Hamlin. But that for me. You 727 00:39:51,880 --> 00:39:54,120 Speaker 1: and I have been covering Twitter in particular, but social 728 00:39:54,120 --> 00:39:57,360 Speaker 1: media broadly for weeks months, and this is the first 729 00:39:57,400 --> 00:40:02,080 Speaker 1: moment where I saw a very widespread um support, sympathy, 730 00:40:02,160 --> 00:40:05,839 Speaker 1: empathy which has been missing from that platform for some time. 731 00:40:05,880 --> 00:40:08,120 Speaker 1: And what was so fascinating to me, Carrow, is how 732 00:40:08,120 --> 00:40:11,000 Speaker 1: many people tweeted please do not share the footage of 733 00:40:11,040 --> 00:40:14,879 Speaker 1: the incident itself, which is very interesting. Yeah, there are 734 00:40:14,920 --> 00:40:18,840 Speaker 1: times where humanity comes together, and in many ways, social 735 00:40:18,840 --> 00:40:24,000 Speaker 1: media can be a divisive, sometimes sport like environment where 736 00:40:24,040 --> 00:40:26,200 Speaker 1: people have their teams and they go against one another. 737 00:40:26,239 --> 00:40:29,160 Speaker 1: In this moment, there were no teams, there was no division, 738 00:40:29,440 --> 00:40:31,280 Speaker 1: and it's just everyone coming together to try and tosform 739 00:40:31,320 --> 00:40:34,759 Speaker 1: one individual. Yeah. I meanwhile, that does it. From this 740 00:40:34,920 --> 00:40:37,960 Speaker 1: edition of Bloomberg Technology tomorrow, we have the so far 741 00:40:38,000 --> 00:40:42,360 Speaker 1: ahead of Investment Strategy Liz Young. Yeah. Then don't forget 742 00:40:42,360 --> 00:40:44,520 Speaker 1: of course, to check out our podcast. You can find 743 00:40:44,520 --> 00:40:47,560 Speaker 1: it on the terminal, on Apple, Spotify, and on iHeart. 744 00:40:47,680 --> 00:40:48,520 Speaker 1: This is Bloomberg