1 00:00:00,200 --> 00:00:03,080 Speaker 1: Welcome in his verdict with Ted Cruz week in Review, 2 00:00:03,160 --> 00:00:05,080 Speaker 1: and it's so nice to have you with us. As 3 00:00:05,120 --> 00:00:07,560 Speaker 1: you know, normally we do the top stories of the 4 00:00:07,600 --> 00:00:09,399 Speaker 1: week and let you get up to date on what 5 00:00:09,440 --> 00:00:12,239 Speaker 1: you may have missed this past week. However, we're going 6 00:00:12,280 --> 00:00:15,239 Speaker 1: to do a special show today and is remembering our 7 00:00:15,320 --> 00:00:18,720 Speaker 1: good friend Lindsey Graham. If you missed Senator Cruz talking 8 00:00:18,760 --> 00:00:22,400 Speaker 1: about Lindsay after his sudden death, We took a moment 9 00:00:22,480 --> 00:00:25,440 Speaker 1: to talk about everything he'd accomplished in some really cool 10 00:00:25,480 --> 00:00:28,640 Speaker 1: behind the scenes stories. So with that being said, it 11 00:00:28,720 --> 00:00:31,280 Speaker 1: is the weeknd Review and it starts right now. 12 00:00:32,080 --> 00:00:35,160 Speaker 2: Look, this was a hard day. This was a shocking day. 13 00:00:35,520 --> 00:00:38,360 Speaker 2: I woke up, as so many people did across America, 14 00:00:38,960 --> 00:00:44,280 Speaker 2: with the news that Lindsay had passed away of what 15 00:00:44,400 --> 00:00:47,200 Speaker 2: has been reported to be a massive heart attack at 16 00:00:47,200 --> 00:00:51,080 Speaker 2: his home Saturday night. I was stunned. I had five 17 00:00:51,159 --> 00:00:54,440 Speaker 2: or six texts in my phone as I woke up, 18 00:00:54,680 --> 00:00:57,279 Speaker 2: and I just stared at them in disbelief. It did 19 00:00:57,320 --> 00:01:02,560 Speaker 2: not seem real. Lindsay was a good friend of mine. 20 00:01:03,280 --> 00:01:06,080 Speaker 2: Lindsay was he was one of a kind. He was 21 00:01:06,120 --> 00:01:09,119 Speaker 2: someone he and I did not always see eye to eye. 22 00:01:09,120 --> 00:01:11,240 Speaker 2: In fact, we battled on a lot of issues, but 23 00:01:11,640 --> 00:01:14,040 Speaker 2: we also agreed on a whole bunch of issues. And 24 00:01:14,440 --> 00:01:19,640 Speaker 2: we were close allies fighting for years uh to confirm 25 00:01:19,880 --> 00:01:24,960 Speaker 2: conservative judges and conservative conservative justices. We were close allies 26 00:01:24,959 --> 00:01:28,559 Speaker 2: fighting to defend the Second Amendment. We were close allies 27 00:01:28,600 --> 00:01:31,920 Speaker 2: fighting to support the men and women of the military. 28 00:01:32,000 --> 00:01:36,040 Speaker 2: We were close allies fighting to defend our national security, 29 00:01:36,080 --> 00:01:40,800 Speaker 2: to stand with our allies, to stand with Israel. And 30 00:01:40,800 --> 00:01:44,240 Speaker 2: we were close allies standing up to America's enemies, that 31 00:01:44,360 --> 00:01:48,600 Speaker 2: especially Iran, and and and Lindsay was someone he was 32 00:01:48,640 --> 00:01:54,840 Speaker 2: a force of nature. But his personality, I gotta say, 33 00:01:54,840 --> 00:01:56,920 Speaker 2: if you spent time with Lindsay, I think it was 34 00:01:56,960 --> 00:02:02,200 Speaker 2: impossible to dislike Lindsay. He was charming, He was funny 35 00:02:02,240 --> 00:02:06,640 Speaker 2: as hell, like just witty. For years, I used to 36 00:02:06,640 --> 00:02:10,359 Speaker 2: say to Lindsay and John Kennedy, I'd ask each of them, 37 00:02:10,800 --> 00:02:12,880 Speaker 2: I don't know which one of you is funnier, and 38 00:02:12,880 --> 00:02:15,160 Speaker 2: they'd kind of both sort of bow up their chests 39 00:02:15,200 --> 00:02:18,239 Speaker 2: and get mad at E and I Actually I do 40 00:02:18,320 --> 00:02:21,880 Speaker 2: have a theory. I think John Kennedy is the better 41 00:02:22,080 --> 00:02:25,080 Speaker 2: stand up comedian. Like, like, if John Kennedy and John 42 00:02:25,120 --> 00:02:27,360 Speaker 2: prepares a fair amount of his material, but when he's 43 00:02:27,400 --> 00:02:31,280 Speaker 2: delivering it, he could be a professional comedian, yes, But 44 00:02:31,280 --> 00:02:35,360 Speaker 2: but Lindsey was wittier just sitting there. He would fire 45 00:02:35,639 --> 00:02:40,079 Speaker 2: zingers that you're like it was, and many of them 46 00:02:40,120 --> 00:02:43,519 Speaker 2: were self deprecating. He did not take himself too seriously. 47 00:02:43,600 --> 00:02:47,040 Speaker 2: He would make fun of himself like crazy he did, 48 00:02:48,600 --> 00:02:52,640 Speaker 2: and it was you know, I've traveled abroad with Lindsay 49 00:02:52,880 --> 00:03:01,640 Speaker 2: multiple times. He loved our country absolutely with a passion. Look, 50 00:03:02,080 --> 00:03:05,800 Speaker 2: Lindsey wasn't married, he didn't have kids. Every ounce of 51 00:03:05,840 --> 00:03:09,359 Speaker 2: his life was the Senate. He would travel all over 52 00:03:09,400 --> 00:03:11,600 Speaker 2: the world. I mean, it's just what he did. He 53 00:03:11,720 --> 00:03:15,200 Speaker 2: was out, you know, I think it was beautiful in 54 00:03:15,240 --> 00:03:18,080 Speaker 2: some ways fitting. So he had just come back from Ukraine. 55 00:03:18,120 --> 00:03:20,880 Speaker 2: He'd been meeting with President Zelensky, came back to the 56 00:03:20,960 --> 00:03:23,880 Speaker 2: United States Saturday night. He was on the phone with 57 00:03:23,960 --> 00:03:27,520 Speaker 2: President Trump. And by the way, he was one of 58 00:03:27,600 --> 00:03:31,400 Speaker 2: President Trump's closest friends. And I say that without exaggeration 59 00:03:31,480 --> 00:03:33,800 Speaker 2: because Lindsay and Trump disagreed on a lot of issues. 60 00:03:34,400 --> 00:03:39,600 Speaker 2: But Trump loved the guy, and it was was hard. 61 00:03:39,360 --> 00:03:40,200 Speaker 3: If you saw him. 62 00:03:40,480 --> 00:03:42,280 Speaker 1: They're talking about him on Meet the Press He's like, 63 00:03:42,320 --> 00:03:44,840 Speaker 1: he kind of had like unfeathered access to the White House. 64 00:03:44,840 --> 00:03:46,440 Speaker 1: He goes out, he really did a lot of people, 65 00:03:46,720 --> 00:03:48,880 Speaker 1: but he was like, Lindsay just came over all the time. 66 00:03:49,720 --> 00:03:54,080 Speaker 2: Look, Look, Lindsay was like the Trump whisper. He would 67 00:03:54,120 --> 00:03:56,040 Speaker 2: call Trump. He talked to him early in the morning, 68 00:03:56,080 --> 00:03:57,640 Speaker 2: he talked to him late at night. He talked to 69 00:03:57,720 --> 00:04:00,760 Speaker 2: them day after day after day. And Trump Trump didn't 70 00:04:00,760 --> 00:04:02,640 Speaker 2: always agree with him, but he would listen to him 71 00:04:02,680 --> 00:04:05,480 Speaker 2: and Lindsey. When Trump was really mad about at something, 72 00:04:05,560 --> 00:04:07,680 Speaker 2: Lindsey could kind of walk him back off that cliff 73 00:04:07,680 --> 00:04:11,520 Speaker 2: a little bit. Lindsey was like, and I've spent a 74 00:04:11,600 --> 00:04:15,040 Speaker 2: lot of time with Lindsay and Trump together, and the 75 00:04:15,080 --> 00:04:19,840 Speaker 2: bond they had was really special, and it was in 76 00:04:19,920 --> 00:04:23,680 Speaker 2: some ways almost a perfect distillation of his life. That 77 00:04:23,720 --> 00:04:27,320 Speaker 2: he is in Ukraine, he flies back to the United States. 78 00:04:27,320 --> 00:04:30,919 Speaker 2: He's on the phone with President Trump and Sunday morning 79 00:04:30,960 --> 00:04:32,839 Speaker 2: he was scheduled to be on Meet the Press. It 80 00:04:32,839 --> 00:04:36,200 Speaker 2: would have been his sixty fourth appearance on Meet the Press. 81 00:04:36,960 --> 00:04:37,800 Speaker 3: And it's a. 82 00:04:37,760 --> 00:04:41,120 Speaker 1: Lot in colleges. By the way, Meet the Press is 83 00:04:41,839 --> 00:04:44,800 Speaker 1: kind of like Saturday Night Live. If you're like a 84 00:04:44,839 --> 00:04:48,279 Speaker 1: celebrity being on Meet the Press. That's a number that 85 00:04:48,520 --> 00:04:50,400 Speaker 1: I would love to know what that is ranking compared 86 00:04:50,400 --> 00:04:52,600 Speaker 1: to other Republicans. You've done it a lot, but it's 87 00:04:52,600 --> 00:04:54,080 Speaker 1: not sixty something times. 88 00:04:54,400 --> 00:04:54,520 Speaker 4: Now. 89 00:04:54,920 --> 00:04:57,120 Speaker 2: I've done it a lot, but it's nowhere close to that. 90 00:04:57,279 --> 00:05:00,400 Speaker 2: And I try to be pretty deliberate. I do Sunday 91 00:05:00,480 --> 00:05:04,039 Speaker 2: shows when I've got a particular message that I'm trying 92 00:05:04,040 --> 00:05:06,400 Speaker 2: to drive, like, when there's a reason, I try to 93 00:05:06,400 --> 00:05:09,680 Speaker 2: be quite deliberate about doing it. Lindsey, Look, look, I 94 00:05:09,760 --> 00:05:12,320 Speaker 2: have two teenage daughters, I've got a wife, I've got 95 00:05:12,320 --> 00:05:14,479 Speaker 2: a family. I want to be back in Texas, you know, 96 00:05:14,560 --> 00:05:17,359 Speaker 2: with my family, and so a Sunday show there had 97 00:05:17,400 --> 00:05:20,080 Speaker 2: to be a reason to do it. Yeah, Lindsay, part 98 00:05:20,120 --> 00:05:22,240 Speaker 2: of what he was was just a warrior. Every day. 99 00:05:22,279 --> 00:05:24,599 Speaker 2: He'd go to the Sunday shows when the news were great. 100 00:05:25,040 --> 00:05:26,960 Speaker 2: He'd go to the Sunday shows when the news was 101 00:05:27,040 --> 00:05:29,480 Speaker 2: terrible and like, nobody wanted to be out there defending 102 00:05:29,520 --> 00:05:32,359 Speaker 2: whatever was on fire at that moment, and Lindsay was like, 103 00:05:32,400 --> 00:05:34,680 Speaker 2: I'll do it, and he would. Part of it is 104 00:05:34,720 --> 00:05:39,040 Speaker 2: he would do it in a cheerful, funny, affable way. 105 00:05:39,160 --> 00:05:41,440 Speaker 2: If things were a mess he'd kind of acknowledge, Yeah, 106 00:05:41,440 --> 00:05:44,560 Speaker 2: they're a mess, but you know, all right, it was 107 00:05:45,720 --> 00:05:48,960 Speaker 2: I literally have been been walking around in a daze 108 00:05:49,040 --> 00:05:52,600 Speaker 2: much of today because I mean I spent a lot 109 00:05:52,640 --> 00:05:54,560 Speaker 2: of time with Lindsay and we would go out and 110 00:05:54,600 --> 00:05:55,680 Speaker 2: I've been texting you guys. 111 00:05:55,680 --> 00:05:57,680 Speaker 1: By the way, you shared a picture that proud up 112 00:05:57,680 --> 00:06:01,000 Speaker 1: on your phone. You guys were recently in Paris. 113 00:06:01,520 --> 00:06:03,520 Speaker 2: So so, and this was just you know how iPhone 114 00:06:03,560 --> 00:06:05,000 Speaker 2: kind of randomly picks pictures. 115 00:06:05,480 --> 00:06:05,680 Speaker 3: Yeah. 116 00:06:06,120 --> 00:06:09,000 Speaker 2: Now I'm sort of convinced our phones like spy on 117 00:06:09,120 --> 00:06:10,000 Speaker 2: us and know everything. 118 00:06:12,200 --> 00:06:14,719 Speaker 3: Yeah, but yeah, that's that is accurate. I agree with 119 00:06:14,760 --> 00:06:15,400 Speaker 3: you on that one. 120 00:06:15,920 --> 00:06:20,240 Speaker 2: But bizarrely enough, today my iPhone kind of midday popped 121 00:06:20,320 --> 00:06:24,599 Speaker 2: up a picture of me and Lindsey and Katie Britt 122 00:06:24,600 --> 00:06:27,920 Speaker 2: and Eric Schmidt, all four of us in Paris and 123 00:06:28,360 --> 00:06:30,360 Speaker 2: we're on a river boat and we're right in front 124 00:06:30,400 --> 00:06:32,320 Speaker 2: of the Eiffel Tower and we went for the eightieth 125 00:06:32,320 --> 00:06:34,360 Speaker 2: anniversary of D Day. It was an amazing trip. It 126 00:06:34,440 --> 00:06:38,200 Speaker 2: was a powerful, beautiful trip with you know, we got 127 00:06:38,200 --> 00:06:40,400 Speaker 2: to see these World War Two veterans who it's it's 128 00:06:40,440 --> 00:06:43,560 Speaker 2: the very tail end of their journey on Earth, and 129 00:06:43,720 --> 00:06:48,599 Speaker 2: the four of us are just arm in arm and 130 00:06:48,680 --> 00:06:51,040 Speaker 2: it was just beautiful. And I've been I've been texting 131 00:06:51,080 --> 00:06:53,880 Speaker 2: and talking to friends and colleagues, and all of us 132 00:06:53,880 --> 00:06:59,680 Speaker 2: are just going, this doesn't seem real real, Yeah, I 133 00:06:59,680 --> 00:07:03,200 Speaker 2: mean it's you know, I did an interview with a 134 00:07:03,240 --> 00:07:07,320 Speaker 2: reporter today who said, who will fill the void? Who 135 00:07:07,320 --> 00:07:12,160 Speaker 2: will fill Lindsey Graham's shoes? And my answer is nobody. Nobody. 136 00:07:12,600 --> 00:07:17,800 Speaker 2: The role he played in the Senate, he was universally respected, 137 00:07:17,840 --> 00:07:21,240 Speaker 2: but also universally liked and even adored by people who 138 00:07:21,760 --> 00:07:27,560 Speaker 2: disagreed with him. Passionately he could be by the way, 139 00:07:27,600 --> 00:07:31,480 Speaker 2: the guy was as effective a cross examiner as I've 140 00:07:31,520 --> 00:07:35,760 Speaker 2: ever seen. Lindsay was a South Carolina trial lawyer, and 141 00:07:36,120 --> 00:07:39,720 Speaker 2: he could. On the Judiciary committee, the two. 142 00:07:39,600 --> 00:07:40,800 Speaker 3: Were committees together. 143 00:07:40,840 --> 00:07:44,400 Speaker 1: So people understand, you guys, it wasn't just being like 144 00:07:44,680 --> 00:07:47,280 Speaker 1: centaers together. You guys worked on committees as well. 145 00:07:47,720 --> 00:07:52,000 Speaker 2: We worked judiciary. We spent thousands of hours together. We 146 00:07:52,000 --> 00:07:54,200 Speaker 2: were on Senate Armed Services together, we were on Foreign 147 00:07:54,240 --> 00:07:58,200 Speaker 2: Relations together, and we just worked hand in hand on 148 00:07:58,280 --> 00:08:00,720 Speaker 2: a lot of issues. There are issues where we just immigration. 149 00:08:00,800 --> 00:08:04,000 Speaker 2: Lindsay and I were in very different places, but there 150 00:08:04,000 --> 00:08:07,800 Speaker 2: were a lot of issues when Lindsey was with you. 151 00:08:08,800 --> 00:08:11,280 Speaker 2: I don't know that there was a more potent ally 152 00:08:11,360 --> 00:08:12,240 Speaker 2: in the Senate when he. 153 00:08:12,240 --> 00:08:12,600 Speaker 4: Was with you. 154 00:08:13,200 --> 00:08:19,680 Speaker 2: Yeah, and it would he could be look it was 155 00:08:21,080 --> 00:08:24,400 Speaker 2: I can't count. There are a hundred different Senate Republican 156 00:08:24,480 --> 00:08:29,160 Speaker 2: lunches when people were having really passionate, sharp disagreements about 157 00:08:29,200 --> 00:08:32,240 Speaker 2: something and Lindsey would stand up and say something, and 158 00:08:32,280 --> 00:08:34,800 Speaker 2: he'd always have a joke and people be double over laughing. 159 00:08:34,800 --> 00:08:36,720 Speaker 2: There be times when people are like screaming at each other, 160 00:08:36,800 --> 00:08:39,480 Speaker 2: almost ready to like, you know, take a swing at 161 00:08:39,520 --> 00:08:43,000 Speaker 2: each other. Yeah, and Lindsey would sort of cut the 162 00:08:43,160 --> 00:08:47,280 Speaker 2: tension and bring people back to the task at hand. 163 00:08:48,440 --> 00:08:52,360 Speaker 2: You know, when I'm in d C fairly regularly, I'll 164 00:08:52,400 --> 00:08:54,240 Speaker 2: have dinner with other senators and there's kind of a 165 00:08:54,240 --> 00:08:56,080 Speaker 2: group of folks that I invite that are sort of 166 00:08:56,120 --> 00:08:59,360 Speaker 2: the like guys I like hanging out with. And Lindsey 167 00:08:59,600 --> 00:09:03,200 Speaker 2: was almost the auto invite, because if Lindsay showed up 168 00:09:03,200 --> 00:09:07,959 Speaker 2: at the table, your ribs would hurt from laughing. And 169 00:09:08,559 --> 00:09:10,360 Speaker 2: by the way, it wasn't just that he was like 170 00:09:10,440 --> 00:09:15,360 Speaker 2: telling jokes. He was just insightful and smart and he cared. Look, 171 00:09:15,400 --> 00:09:16,720 Speaker 2: look whether you are his customer. 172 00:09:17,200 --> 00:09:19,720 Speaker 1: That's one of the things I don't think people understand 173 00:09:19,720 --> 00:09:22,400 Speaker 1: how much he loved this country you mentioned. Didn't have 174 00:09:22,559 --> 00:09:25,719 Speaker 1: he wasn't married, he didn't have kids. His family was America. 175 00:09:25,760 --> 00:09:29,160 Speaker 1: His family was defending America. I said this this morning 176 00:09:29,200 --> 00:09:32,520 Speaker 1: on Fox and Friends. He had a grand It was 177 00:09:32,520 --> 00:09:35,080 Speaker 1: a love story with the United States of America. 178 00:09:35,679 --> 00:09:37,800 Speaker 2: Yes, I'll tell you, it was also with our military. 179 00:09:38,080 --> 00:09:42,200 Speaker 2: So Lindsay sosolutely. Lindsey spent thirty three years in the 180 00:09:42,240 --> 00:09:43,880 Speaker 2: Air Force, active duty. 181 00:09:43,640 --> 00:09:45,880 Speaker 3: As a colonel. People don't know that he. 182 00:09:45,920 --> 00:09:48,760 Speaker 2: Rose up to being a colonel. I did tell him. 183 00:09:48,800 --> 00:09:51,199 Speaker 2: I said, Lindsay, if the clowns at the Pentagon ever 184 00:09:51,280 --> 00:09:53,600 Speaker 2: try to give you a star, damn it. I'm going 185 00:09:53,640 --> 00:09:57,520 Speaker 2: to the Florida filibuster it. I ain't calling you General Graham. 186 00:09:57,559 --> 00:10:00,840 Speaker 2: You could be Colonel Graham, but just under there's a 187 00:10:00,880 --> 00:10:04,839 Speaker 2: hard ceiling. And and he basically agreed with me and said, yeah, 188 00:10:04,840 --> 00:10:06,640 Speaker 2: I sure hope they'll make me a general. They shouldn't. 189 00:10:06,640 --> 00:10:10,520 Speaker 2: I mean, I mean, that's like a classic he was. 190 00:10:11,400 --> 00:10:14,240 Speaker 2: And I've been with him both in the US and 191 00:10:14,280 --> 00:10:18,000 Speaker 2: abroad where we would meet with service men and women, 192 00:10:18,040 --> 00:10:20,559 Speaker 2: and he had a connection to the men and women 193 00:10:20,600 --> 00:10:26,600 Speaker 2: of the armed services, a love affair where they loved 194 00:10:26,679 --> 00:10:29,000 Speaker 2: him and I would see them come up and like 195 00:10:29,160 --> 00:10:33,680 Speaker 2: hug him, and he would. He viewed it as his mission. 196 00:10:33,880 --> 00:10:36,520 Speaker 2: I'm going to fight for you. If you're defending this country, 197 00:10:36,559 --> 00:10:38,840 Speaker 2: if you signed up to be in the military, I'm 198 00:10:38,880 --> 00:10:43,440 Speaker 2: going to fight ferociously for you. And that was it 199 00:10:43,520 --> 00:10:48,160 Speaker 2: was real, It was sincere, it was passionate. That was 200 00:10:48,200 --> 00:10:49,280 Speaker 2: a beautiful thing. 201 00:10:49,880 --> 00:10:50,080 Speaker 3: You know. 202 00:10:50,440 --> 00:10:53,080 Speaker 1: I think one of the cool things about his services country. 203 00:10:53,120 --> 00:10:54,920 Speaker 1: I've got a lot of friends that sign up after 204 00:10:55,000 --> 00:10:59,400 Speaker 1: nine to eleven, and in politics sometimes they get frustrated 205 00:10:59,559 --> 00:11:01,960 Speaker 1: with people that serve their country and they go to 206 00:11:02,080 --> 00:11:04,200 Speaker 1: Washington and everything is based on why I was in 207 00:11:04,200 --> 00:11:05,200 Speaker 1: the military. 208 00:11:04,760 --> 00:11:05,840 Speaker 3: And you weren't. Kind of thing. 209 00:11:06,600 --> 00:11:10,240 Speaker 1: He didn't use his military service that night, and a 210 00:11:10,280 --> 00:11:12,120 Speaker 1: lot of people didn't realize that. Number One, he was 211 00:11:12,120 --> 00:11:14,760 Speaker 1: a colonel until he passed away. A lot of people 212 00:11:14,760 --> 00:11:16,360 Speaker 1: didn't realize he was in for thirty years. A lot 213 00:11:16,360 --> 00:11:18,040 Speaker 1: of PEO didn't realize he was in the reserves while 214 00:11:18,120 --> 00:11:21,840 Speaker 1: serving his country. In Congress, he continued to be in 215 00:11:21,880 --> 00:11:24,400 Speaker 1: the reserves and to continue to do that, but he 216 00:11:24,440 --> 00:11:26,240 Speaker 1: didn't come in and go, well, I would I serve 217 00:11:26,360 --> 00:11:29,880 Speaker 1: it wasn't a trump card for him, and it was 218 00:11:30,200 --> 00:11:34,360 Speaker 1: it was. It was he obviously fought hard for military 219 00:11:34,400 --> 00:11:36,040 Speaker 1: and he fought hard for things in a state that 220 00:11:36,080 --> 00:11:39,280 Speaker 1: were related to military and military complex and bases. But 221 00:11:39,400 --> 00:11:42,040 Speaker 1: it wasn't his number one thing on TV, like, well, 222 00:11:42,120 --> 00:11:44,839 Speaker 1: let me tell you why because I served and you didn't. 223 00:11:44,840 --> 00:11:46,559 Speaker 1: He didn't use it that way publicly. 224 00:11:46,760 --> 00:11:46,960 Speaker 2: Never. 225 00:11:47,200 --> 00:11:49,160 Speaker 1: A lot and a lot of people that I know 226 00:11:49,280 --> 00:11:51,240 Speaker 1: that are in the military and have recently retired that 227 00:11:51,280 --> 00:11:54,120 Speaker 1: gave twenty twenty five years, that's what they liked about 228 00:11:54,160 --> 00:11:55,120 Speaker 1: him the most. 229 00:11:55,520 --> 00:11:58,880 Speaker 2: Well, and look to understand Lindsay, he grew up in 230 00:11:59,360 --> 00:12:03,160 Speaker 2: modest circuit stances in South Carolina. He grew up his 231 00:12:03,320 --> 00:12:07,080 Speaker 2: parents ran a bar in a pool hall. And part 232 00:12:07,120 --> 00:12:10,640 Speaker 2: of to understand Lindsay's magic is he was like the 233 00:12:10,679 --> 00:12:14,720 Speaker 2: best bartender you've ever seen, who would smile and crack 234 00:12:14,800 --> 00:12:18,720 Speaker 2: a joke and and whether you were celebrating a great 235 00:12:18,760 --> 00:12:21,000 Speaker 2: thing that happened in your life, or you were there 236 00:12:21,880 --> 00:12:25,199 Speaker 2: weeping because your wife just divorced you, or you just 237 00:12:25,360 --> 00:12:28,400 Speaker 2: had a death in the family, and and he could 238 00:12:28,960 --> 00:12:32,640 Speaker 2: the charm that he brought, the sort of effortless. I 239 00:12:32,679 --> 00:12:35,960 Speaker 2: remember years ago I was at a Silver Elephant dinner, 240 00:12:35,960 --> 00:12:38,199 Speaker 2: which is the big Republican dinner in South Carolina, and 241 00:12:38,240 --> 00:12:39,160 Speaker 2: he was speaking there. 242 00:12:39,720 --> 00:12:40,600 Speaker 3: And at the. 243 00:12:40,600 --> 00:12:44,880 Speaker 2: Time, Ryan's prebus was the chairman of the r NC, 244 00:12:45,120 --> 00:12:46,880 Speaker 2: and I think Ryance was speaking at that dinner. This 245 00:12:46,920 --> 00:12:48,920 Speaker 2: was a while ago, but I think Ryance was speaking 246 00:12:48,960 --> 00:12:50,680 Speaker 2: at that dinner. I remember Lindsay got up and went 247 00:12:51,960 --> 00:12:57,400 Speaker 2: Ryan's previous, Ryan's previous, What the hell is that is 248 00:12:57,400 --> 00:13:03,960 Speaker 2: not like a French electric car, and like it brought 249 00:13:04,000 --> 00:13:06,880 Speaker 2: the house down. I mean, he would throw lines out 250 00:13:06,920 --> 00:13:13,240 Speaker 2: there all the time, and it was He also had 251 00:13:13,280 --> 00:13:18,640 Speaker 2: a special gift for I would say, earning the trust 252 00:13:18,720 --> 00:13:28,800 Speaker 2: of and providing really valuable counsel to extraordinarily volatile, larger 253 00:13:28,840 --> 00:13:32,120 Speaker 2: than life figures and two in particular, John McCain and 254 00:13:32,160 --> 00:13:35,840 Speaker 2: Donald Trump. Yes, now, look John McCain, I served a 255 00:13:35,840 --> 00:13:38,880 Speaker 2: lot of years with John. When I arrived in the Senate, 256 00:13:39,000 --> 00:13:41,800 Speaker 2: John McCain hated my guts. In fact, he was quoted 257 00:13:41,800 --> 00:13:44,439 Speaker 2: as saying I hate his eff and guts. Like John 258 00:13:44,480 --> 00:13:50,000 Speaker 2: and I battled in a bloody way. Yes, over the years, 259 00:13:50,880 --> 00:13:55,000 Speaker 2: John and I became friends. But John was you know, 260 00:13:55,280 --> 00:13:57,600 Speaker 2: in terms of the history of the Senate. John McCain 261 00:13:57,720 --> 00:13:59,720 Speaker 2: was one of those legends who have walked the halls 262 00:13:59,720 --> 00:14:01,640 Speaker 2: of the s And I disagreed with so many positions 263 00:14:01,679 --> 00:14:05,040 Speaker 2: John had. But but the man was a war hero. 264 00:14:05,160 --> 00:14:07,040 Speaker 2: The man fought for a country. He was He was 265 00:14:07,080 --> 00:14:11,200 Speaker 2: imprisoned in Vietnam, he was tortured, he denied early release. 266 00:14:11,280 --> 00:14:13,640 Speaker 2: I mean, he was larger than life, yes, and he 267 00:14:13,679 --> 00:14:16,679 Speaker 2: could be volcanic like John's temper. 268 00:14:18,640 --> 00:14:20,040 Speaker 3: It was real. It was real. 269 00:14:20,400 --> 00:14:21,640 Speaker 2: Oh, I had been on this. 270 00:14:21,760 --> 00:14:22,960 Speaker 3: I've been on the other end of that. 271 00:14:23,040 --> 00:14:24,480 Speaker 1: You've been on the other end of that, and it 272 00:14:24,600 --> 00:14:26,960 Speaker 1: is let me tell you, I the talking to is 273 00:14:27,000 --> 00:14:30,760 Speaker 1: that I received you earlier in my career were brutal 274 00:14:30,840 --> 00:14:31,560 Speaker 1: when I got them. 275 00:14:32,560 --> 00:14:35,280 Speaker 2: Lindsey was John McCain's best friend in the Senate, and 276 00:14:35,320 --> 00:14:38,120 Speaker 2: he was the McCain whisperer. I mean, it was an 277 00:14:38,160 --> 00:14:42,160 Speaker 2: amazing thing. And Lindsey would kind of soften John's you know, 278 00:14:42,200 --> 00:14:43,840 Speaker 2: he come in and pound the hell out of someone, 279 00:14:43,840 --> 00:14:50,360 Speaker 2: and Lindsay sort of cut a joke and like, you know, men, Yeah, it. 280 00:14:50,240 --> 00:14:53,440 Speaker 1: Was Joe Aberman said, he spoke Democrat and Republican. Well 281 00:14:53,600 --> 00:14:55,200 Speaker 1: is I think the way he described it he could. 282 00:14:55,280 --> 00:14:57,920 Speaker 1: He could, he could, and he could speak McCain, which 283 00:14:57,960 --> 00:14:59,200 Speaker 1: was really important. 284 00:15:00,080 --> 00:15:04,080 Speaker 2: And he also speaks Trump. Like, look their times, just 285 00:15:04,520 --> 00:15:07,120 Speaker 2: like John McCain. We get really pissed off their times. 286 00:15:07,120 --> 00:15:09,160 Speaker 2: This is no secret. When Donald Trump gets pissed off 287 00:15:09,160 --> 00:15:12,360 Speaker 2: and when he's angry and he's like on a tear, Lindsey, 288 00:15:12,880 --> 00:15:15,160 Speaker 2: we kind of all say, Lindsey, go on in there 289 00:15:15,160 --> 00:15:19,000 Speaker 2: and sort of talk him down, and Lindsey could. It 290 00:15:19,160 --> 00:15:22,320 Speaker 2: was an amazing thing. He'd just sort of laugh a 291 00:15:22,360 --> 00:15:24,760 Speaker 2: little bit, and you know, Trump would yell at him, 292 00:15:24,800 --> 00:15:27,240 Speaker 2: and he'd make Trump laugh and it would just soften 293 00:15:27,360 --> 00:15:30,880 Speaker 2: the whole thing. He had a gift for that, and 294 00:15:30,960 --> 00:15:33,680 Speaker 2: it was not just because he wanted people to like him. 295 00:15:34,200 --> 00:15:36,200 Speaker 2: He had a gift because he was trying to get 296 00:15:36,240 --> 00:15:39,480 Speaker 2: these these great men. He was trying to move them 297 00:15:39,480 --> 00:15:42,240 Speaker 2: in what he believed was a positive direction for America. 298 00:15:42,240 --> 00:15:46,760 Speaker 2: And it was a beautiful thing to watch him do that. 299 00:15:48,160 --> 00:15:51,160 Speaker 2: I will say, Lindsey, some of y'all who listened to 300 00:15:51,200 --> 00:15:53,680 Speaker 2: Verdict may not know this. Lindsey Graham was the very 301 00:15:53,760 --> 00:15:57,720 Speaker 2: first guest in the history of Verdict, Like when we 302 00:15:57,800 --> 00:16:01,040 Speaker 2: had just launched this show. This show launched on the 303 00:16:01,080 --> 00:16:04,680 Speaker 2: first night of the very first Trump impeachment and the 304 00:16:04,720 --> 00:16:08,320 Speaker 2: show went from zero. Look, before we launched, we had 305 00:16:08,440 --> 00:16:12,520 Speaker 2: zero viewers, zero listeners. Yeah, it's skyrocketed up the charts 306 00:16:12,560 --> 00:16:15,720 Speaker 2: and it became the number one ranked podcast in the world. 307 00:16:16,480 --> 00:16:18,160 Speaker 2: And as we're doing it, and we would do it 308 00:16:18,200 --> 00:16:24,600 Speaker 2: every night. This was PB pre Ben. This is what 309 00:16:24,680 --> 00:16:26,640 Speaker 2: I was doing with Michael Knowles, who's a great friend 310 00:16:26,840 --> 00:16:31,480 Speaker 2: of both of ours. Yeah, and it would be every 311 00:16:31,600 --> 00:16:33,880 Speaker 2: night after the impeachment trial, we'd go and do a 312 00:16:33,960 --> 00:16:37,400 Speaker 2: Verdict that night and put it out real time. And 313 00:16:37,520 --> 00:16:40,480 Speaker 2: Lindsey came, all right, I want you to watch the 314 00:16:41,040 --> 00:16:44,320 Speaker 2: cold open for our show that Lindsey recorded as our 315 00:16:44,400 --> 00:16:45,360 Speaker 2: very first guest ever. 316 00:16:45,760 --> 00:16:48,480 Speaker 1: All right, take a listen. This is again the cold 317 00:16:48,520 --> 00:16:51,560 Speaker 1: open Lindsey Graham, the first guest on Verdict back in 318 00:16:51,600 --> 00:16:51,960 Speaker 1: the day. 319 00:16:52,400 --> 00:16:56,320 Speaker 4: Hello, I'm senner Lindsey Graham. Welcome to Verdict with Ted Cruz, 320 00:16:56,360 --> 00:16:59,160 Speaker 4: the number one podcast in the entire country. 321 00:16:59,400 --> 00:17:10,159 Speaker 5: What is the fun guest, Welcome back to Verdict with 322 00:17:10,320 --> 00:17:11,919 Speaker 5: Ted Cruz. I'm Michael Knowles. 323 00:17:11,920 --> 00:17:15,560 Speaker 6: I'm joined by not one, but two US Senators to 324 00:17:15,640 --> 00:17:18,760 Speaker 6: help us break down the most shocking day of the 325 00:17:18,920 --> 00:17:21,679 Speaker 6: entire impeachment trial. Senator Graham, thank you so much for 326 00:17:21,720 --> 00:17:24,480 Speaker 6: being here at VI. Here gentlemen. The last time that 327 00:17:24,520 --> 00:17:27,600 Speaker 6: we sat down, I was told this impeachment was going 328 00:17:27,640 --> 00:17:29,800 Speaker 6: to drag on for weeks. We were going to get witnesses. 329 00:17:29,800 --> 00:17:31,040 Speaker 6: We were going to get Bolton, we were going to 330 00:17:31,080 --> 00:17:33,359 Speaker 6: get Hunter Biden. This was going to get long and ugly. 331 00:17:33,760 --> 00:17:37,159 Speaker 6: I go to sleep. I wake up today and the 332 00:17:37,240 --> 00:17:40,199 Speaker 6: senators are voting no more witnesses. This thing could be 333 00:17:40,200 --> 00:17:42,040 Speaker 6: over next week. Senator Cruz, what happened? 334 00:17:42,400 --> 00:17:45,000 Speaker 2: Well, today was a big day. And let me say, Lindsey, 335 00:17:45,040 --> 00:17:48,080 Speaker 2: thank you well you. I appreciate your coming. This is 336 00:17:48,160 --> 00:17:49,960 Speaker 2: late at night. We spent all day in. 337 00:17:49,960 --> 00:17:51,720 Speaker 4: The setting and a lot of money on production. 338 00:17:54,600 --> 00:17:58,359 Speaker 2: Well, this was you're right yesterday. If the vote had 339 00:17:58,359 --> 00:18:01,600 Speaker 2: gone differently today, this trial could have gone on for months. 340 00:18:02,000 --> 00:18:04,360 Speaker 2: We could have seen it drag on and on and on, 341 00:18:04,440 --> 00:18:06,159 Speaker 2: and it was a big deal. It was up in 342 00:18:06,200 --> 00:18:08,400 Speaker 2: the air, and today was the most important vote we've 343 00:18:08,400 --> 00:18:08,880 Speaker 2: had in the. 344 00:18:08,960 --> 00:18:11,520 Speaker 3: Entire By the way, I love it. Even there he 345 00:18:11,600 --> 00:18:12,320 Speaker 3: cracked a joke. 346 00:18:12,400 --> 00:18:14,520 Speaker 1: He's like, you're not spend a lot on production, like 347 00:18:14,600 --> 00:18:15,960 Speaker 1: he had to get his zinger in there. 348 00:18:16,040 --> 00:18:18,040 Speaker 3: That's just what made Lindsay Lindsay. 349 00:18:18,000 --> 00:18:21,840 Speaker 2: Well, and look, at the time, we were filming Verdict 350 00:18:22,280 --> 00:18:25,720 Speaker 2: in a basement studio about a mile from Capitol Hill, 351 00:18:26,320 --> 00:18:28,480 Speaker 2: and so we drove there after the day of the trial. 352 00:18:28,480 --> 00:18:31,360 Speaker 2: It was like midnight, and you went to this basement studio. 353 00:18:31,440 --> 00:18:33,760 Speaker 2: You walked at a dark alley and you walked down 354 00:18:33,840 --> 00:18:38,000 Speaker 2: these like concrete stairs, and listen, Lindsay and I at 355 00:18:38,040 --> 00:18:40,760 Speaker 2: the time were not actually that close of friends. We 356 00:18:40,880 --> 00:18:44,280 Speaker 2: had been more adversaries than friends. Our friendship developed over 357 00:18:44,280 --> 00:18:47,760 Speaker 2: the years. And as we're walking down the stairs, he's like, 358 00:18:48,000 --> 00:18:51,320 Speaker 2: I feel like Joe Peshi and good Fellows. Are you 359 00:18:51,320 --> 00:18:54,400 Speaker 2: getting ready to whack me? Because like we're like walking 360 00:18:54,440 --> 00:18:57,600 Speaker 2: into a dark basement in the middle of nowhere. And 361 00:18:58,880 --> 00:19:01,439 Speaker 2: he looks around. In our studio, we had this this 362 00:19:01,640 --> 00:19:05,240 Speaker 2: shag carpet out of the nineteen seventies. We had these 363 00:19:05,320 --> 00:19:08,480 Speaker 2: big old brown leather chairs. We had these giant microphones, 364 00:19:08,560 --> 00:19:10,320 Speaker 2: kind of like we still have the giant microphones. Yeah, 365 00:19:11,280 --> 00:19:15,240 Speaker 2: and he says on the show, the cactus don't yeah, Okay, 366 00:19:15,240 --> 00:19:18,639 Speaker 2: I miss miss our cactus. Our cactus is still our 367 00:19:18,680 --> 00:19:23,119 Speaker 2: cactus is still part of the Verdict family. But he 368 00:19:23,240 --> 00:19:25,760 Speaker 2: looked around and he said this on the podcast. He's like, 369 00:19:27,200 --> 00:19:30,520 Speaker 2: you guys are the number one podcast in the world. 370 00:19:31,640 --> 00:19:34,080 Speaker 2: Who the hell is number two? Some guy in a 371 00:19:34,160 --> 00:19:39,600 Speaker 2: van by the river Like it was. It was size splitting, 372 00:19:40,520 --> 00:19:46,760 Speaker 2: But but that charm, it had real power, Yes, because 373 00:19:46,800 --> 00:19:49,960 Speaker 2: it would cause people to listen. It would break through 374 00:19:51,080 --> 00:19:54,840 Speaker 2: and listen. He was not always joking. If you were 375 00:19:54,880 --> 00:19:59,800 Speaker 2: to think of the singular moment, what is the number 376 00:20:00,080 --> 00:20:02,760 Speaker 2: one thing people remember that Lindsey Graham did, And I'm 377 00:20:02,800 --> 00:20:06,720 Speaker 2: gonna suggest it was when during the Brett Kavanaugh confirmation. 378 00:20:06,920 --> 00:20:09,200 Speaker 1: Here I was gonna say no doubt Brett Kavanaugh and 379 00:20:09,720 --> 00:20:12,760 Speaker 1: saving Brett Kavanaugh from the insanity of the left that 380 00:20:12,840 --> 00:20:16,960 Speaker 1: were accusing him of the most horrific crimes without any evidence, 381 00:20:17,080 --> 00:20:19,639 Speaker 1: making it up as they went trying to destroy him, 382 00:20:19,680 --> 00:20:22,120 Speaker 1: the same way they went after Clarence Thomas very much, 383 00:20:22,160 --> 00:20:26,040 Speaker 1: but in a TMZ twenty twenty plus year type of 384 00:20:26,160 --> 00:20:29,560 Speaker 1: going after him, just more vile social media. You didn't 385 00:20:29,560 --> 00:20:32,240 Speaker 1: have that with a Clarence Thomas, right, Like Clarence Thomas 386 00:20:32,320 --> 00:20:36,680 Speaker 1: was ABCNBC, CNN, it was mainstream. Now they were trying 387 00:20:36,680 --> 00:20:39,640 Speaker 1: to assassinate Brett Kavanaugh's integrity and they were using all 388 00:20:39,720 --> 00:20:41,840 Speaker 1: social media to try to accomplish it. 389 00:20:42,000 --> 00:20:46,280 Speaker 2: Well, and Lindsey unloaded on the Democrats and it changed 390 00:20:46,320 --> 00:20:49,880 Speaker 2: the entire dynamics of the hearing. I want you, most 391 00:20:49,920 --> 00:20:51,360 Speaker 2: of y'all have seen and heard this, but I want 392 00:20:51,400 --> 00:20:54,000 Speaker 2: you to give a listen again, because I think there's 393 00:20:54,000 --> 00:20:57,320 Speaker 2: a real argument. Without Lindsay doing this, Brett Kavanaugh may 394 00:20:57,359 --> 00:20:59,960 Speaker 2: not get confirmed. Give a listen to Lindsay at the hearing. 395 00:21:00,920 --> 00:21:05,359 Speaker 4: Are you aware that at nine to twenty three on 396 00:21:05,440 --> 00:21:07,560 Speaker 4: the night of July the ninth, the day you were 397 00:21:07,600 --> 00:21:12,080 Speaker 4: nominated to the Supreme Court by President Trump, Senator Schumer 398 00:21:12,200 --> 00:21:15,959 Speaker 4: said twenty three minutes after your nomination, I will oppose 399 00:21:16,040 --> 00:21:19,760 Speaker 4: Judge Kavanaugh's nomination with everything I have. I have a 400 00:21:19,800 --> 00:21:23,320 Speaker 4: bypartisan I hope a by person majority will do the same. 401 00:21:23,840 --> 00:21:27,600 Speaker 4: The stakes are simply too high for anything less. Well, 402 00:21:27,600 --> 00:21:29,840 Speaker 4: if you weren't aware of it, you are now. Did 403 00:21:29,880 --> 00:21:33,679 Speaker 4: you meet with Senator Diane Feinstein on August twentieth? I 404 00:21:33,720 --> 00:21:35,920 Speaker 4: did meet with Centa Finestine. Did you know that her 405 00:21:36,000 --> 00:21:40,199 Speaker 4: staff had already recommended a lawyer to dodnor Ford. I 406 00:21:40,240 --> 00:21:42,679 Speaker 4: did not know that. Did you know that her and 407 00:21:42,720 --> 00:21:46,879 Speaker 4: her staff had this allegations for over twenty days. 408 00:21:47,560 --> 00:21:49,160 Speaker 5: I did not know that at the time. 409 00:21:49,600 --> 00:21:52,760 Speaker 4: If you wanted an FBI investigation, you could have come 410 00:21:52,800 --> 00:21:55,560 Speaker 4: to us. What you want to do is destroy this 411 00:21:55,640 --> 00:21:59,280 Speaker 4: guy's life. Hold this seat open and hope you went 412 00:21:59,320 --> 00:22:04,200 Speaker 4: in twenty twenty. You've said that, not me. You've got 413 00:22:04,359 --> 00:22:08,760 Speaker 4: nothing to apologize for. When you see Soda Maron Kagan, 414 00:22:08,840 --> 00:22:12,560 Speaker 4: tell him that Lindsay said, oh, because I voted for them, 415 00:22:12,880 --> 00:22:15,120 Speaker 4: I would never do to them what you've done. 416 00:22:14,960 --> 00:22:16,040 Speaker 2: To this guy. 417 00:22:16,160 --> 00:22:22,000 Speaker 3: This is the most unethical sham. 418 00:22:20,680 --> 00:22:24,240 Speaker 4: Since I've been in politics. And if you really wanted 419 00:22:24,240 --> 00:22:26,720 Speaker 4: to know the truth, you sure as hell wouldn't have 420 00:22:26,760 --> 00:22:29,560 Speaker 4: done what you've done to this guy. Are you a 421 00:22:29,680 --> 00:22:30,560 Speaker 4: gang rapist? 422 00:22:31,320 --> 00:22:31,399 Speaker 6: No? 423 00:22:32,880 --> 00:22:37,120 Speaker 4: I cannot imagine what you and your family have gone through. Boy, 424 00:22:37,200 --> 00:22:39,320 Speaker 4: y'all want power. God, I hope you never get it. 425 00:22:39,840 --> 00:22:42,920 Speaker 4: I hope the American people can see through this sham 426 00:22:43,160 --> 00:22:45,760 Speaker 4: that you knew about it and you held it. You 427 00:22:45,840 --> 00:22:50,280 Speaker 4: had no intention of protecting doctor Ford none. She's as 428 00:22:50,359 --> 00:22:51,760 Speaker 4: much of a victim as you are. 429 00:22:53,119 --> 00:22:53,359 Speaker 3: God. 430 00:22:53,400 --> 00:22:56,160 Speaker 4: I hate to say it because these have been my friends, 431 00:22:56,840 --> 00:22:58,480 Speaker 4: but let me tell you, when it comes to this, 432 00:23:00,280 --> 00:23:03,159 Speaker 4: you're looking for a fair process. You came to the 433 00:23:03,240 --> 00:23:07,320 Speaker 4: wrong town at the wrong time, my friend. 434 00:23:07,080 --> 00:23:11,240 Speaker 3: Senator, you look at that frustration. That was genuine. 435 00:23:11,480 --> 00:23:15,320 Speaker 1: It wasn't inauthentic, It wasn't something that was a pre 436 00:23:15,440 --> 00:23:16,399 Speaker 1: planned moment. 437 00:23:16,600 --> 00:23:17,680 Speaker 3: It wasn't scripted. 438 00:23:17,720 --> 00:23:20,920 Speaker 1: We see a lot of scripted moments from politicians these days, 439 00:23:20,960 --> 00:23:23,560 Speaker 1: and some of these hearings there it's all pre organized, 440 00:23:23,640 --> 00:23:28,520 Speaker 1: pre planned protesters involved. That was real and raw and 441 00:23:29,520 --> 00:23:31,560 Speaker 1: as you mentioned, and I think you should explain a 442 00:23:31,560 --> 00:23:35,159 Speaker 1: little bit more, this forced and change the direction that 443 00:23:35,200 --> 00:23:36,000 Speaker 1: hearing was going. 444 00:23:36,520 --> 00:23:40,199 Speaker 2: Well, and listen Lindsey's career. For a lot of his career, 445 00:23:40,240 --> 00:23:43,119 Speaker 2: he's been a very bipartisan senator. Senator, He's worked with 446 00:23:43,160 --> 00:23:45,600 Speaker 2: a lot of Democrats. As he noted, he voted to 447 00:23:45,720 --> 00:23:49,879 Speaker 2: confirm both Justice Sotoma Ora and Justice Kagan, and the 448 00:23:49,920 --> 00:23:51,960 Speaker 2: Democrats were all happy with him. They were all lovey 449 00:23:52,000 --> 00:23:54,080 Speaker 2: dove And so when he says, look, I would never 450 00:23:54,160 --> 00:23:57,280 Speaker 2: do to them what you're doing to Brett Kavanaugh, that 451 00:23:57,400 --> 00:24:00,720 Speaker 2: had power to it. I was sitting there at the 452 00:24:00,840 --> 00:24:04,879 Speaker 2: DAAs when when Lindsay was unloading, and you could have 453 00:24:05,400 --> 00:24:08,480 Speaker 2: heard a pin drop in the room, you know, the 454 00:24:08,640 --> 00:24:12,000 Speaker 2: silence when he asked Brett Kavanaugh, Are you a gang rapist? 455 00:24:12,000 --> 00:24:17,240 Speaker 2: And Brett says no, and Lindsey's just silent for about 456 00:24:17,320 --> 00:24:20,639 Speaker 2: four seconds, and the entire silence, there's not a peep 457 00:24:21,240 --> 00:24:25,080 Speaker 2: in the hearing room. That was a riveting moment. And 458 00:24:25,600 --> 00:24:28,639 Speaker 2: by the way, you mentioned Clarence Thomas. Clarence Thomas is 459 00:24:28,680 --> 00:24:31,240 Speaker 2: on the Supreme Court because during his confirmation hearing, the 460 00:24:31,280 --> 00:24:34,000 Speaker 2: Democrats did the same thing, which is they sand bagged 461 00:24:34,040 --> 00:24:39,200 Speaker 2: him with allegations from Anita Hill. And the American people 462 00:24:39,240 --> 00:24:42,080 Speaker 2: heard Anita Hill's testimony in Clarence Thomas's and by a 463 00:24:42,480 --> 00:24:45,719 Speaker 2: margin of about two to one, they believe Justice Thomas. 464 00:24:46,560 --> 00:24:49,240 Speaker 2: The same thing happened with Brett Kavanaugh. That's why Clarence 465 00:24:49,280 --> 00:24:52,240 Speaker 2: Thomas got confirmed. That's why Brett Kavanaugh got confirmed. And 466 00:24:52,359 --> 00:24:55,480 Speaker 2: Lindsey's that moment there played I think a real part 467 00:24:55,520 --> 00:24:58,919 Speaker 2: in people assessing and saying, wait a second, this is 468 00:24:58,960 --> 00:25:01,399 Speaker 2: not a real inquiry, this is not a fair assessment. 469 00:25:01,880 --> 00:25:05,120 Speaker 2: This is a political slime job. These guys had these 470 00:25:05,160 --> 00:25:08,240 Speaker 2: allegations for weeks, they sat on them, they held them back. 471 00:25:08,640 --> 00:25:12,840 Speaker 2: This is it is a drive by shooting by partisans 472 00:25:12,880 --> 00:25:16,040 Speaker 2: who just want power. That was what was effective. And 473 00:25:16,040 --> 00:25:19,359 Speaker 2: I'll tell you. So my mom, Ben, you know my mom. 474 00:25:19,440 --> 00:25:21,919 Speaker 2: She's love my mom. She's ninety one, about to be 475 00:25:21,960 --> 00:25:25,280 Speaker 2: ninety two in November. She is as conservative it can be. 476 00:25:25,359 --> 00:25:27,960 Speaker 2: My mom thinks you and I are little wobbly. She 477 00:25:28,119 --> 00:25:29,959 Speaker 2: is a rock rib conservative. 478 00:25:31,640 --> 00:25:33,240 Speaker 1: By the way, I don't know if I ever said 479 00:25:33,240 --> 00:25:35,760 Speaker 1: this on the show, I've never had more fun hanging 480 00:25:35,760 --> 00:25:39,200 Speaker 1: out with your mom than than your reelection night, watching 481 00:25:39,240 --> 00:25:42,640 Speaker 1: her be excited, watching her son not a senator, her 482 00:25:42,680 --> 00:25:47,560 Speaker 1: son when reelection, and just the beaming joy. 483 00:25:47,680 --> 00:25:50,640 Speaker 3: On her face. You weren't there when in that part. 484 00:25:50,640 --> 00:25:53,760 Speaker 1: You were busy, and she came in and she was 485 00:25:54,119 --> 00:25:56,520 Speaker 1: just so happy, and I was like, this might be 486 00:25:56,560 --> 00:25:57,920 Speaker 1: my favorite moment of the whole night. 487 00:25:59,080 --> 00:26:02,720 Speaker 2: So my mom, prior to the Kavanaugh hearing, was not 488 00:26:02,960 --> 00:26:06,600 Speaker 2: a Lindsay Graham fan. She mostly knew Lindsay because he 489 00:26:06,640 --> 00:26:09,239 Speaker 2: and I had battled a lot on immigration. We had 490 00:26:09,359 --> 00:26:12,119 Speaker 2: very different views on immigration, and so that's, you know, 491 00:26:12,160 --> 00:26:15,600 Speaker 2: anyone who fights her son my mom doesn't like. And 492 00:26:15,720 --> 00:26:21,959 Speaker 2: so when that cross examined examination ends, my mother sends 493 00:26:22,000 --> 00:26:28,800 Speaker 2: me a text and says, Okay, I now love Lindsey Graham, 494 00:26:31,080 --> 00:26:33,159 Speaker 2: And I actually got up a few minutes later and 495 00:26:33,160 --> 00:26:36,280 Speaker 2: I walked over to Lindsay and I pulled out my phone. 496 00:26:36,280 --> 00:26:38,800 Speaker 2: I said, Lindsay, here's a text I just got from 497 00:26:38,840 --> 00:26:41,880 Speaker 2: my mom, and I clicked on it and he cracked 498 00:26:42,000 --> 00:26:45,800 Speaker 2: up laughing, and then my mother proceeded to go to 499 00:26:45,840 --> 00:26:49,800 Speaker 2: his website and to give him thirty five dollars? 500 00:26:50,160 --> 00:26:51,639 Speaker 3: Are you serious that I am? 501 00:26:52,359 --> 00:26:54,560 Speaker 2: I am serious? And I told him, I said, Lindsay, 502 00:26:54,560 --> 00:26:57,639 Speaker 2: in my entire time in politics, my mother's never contributed 503 00:26:57,680 --> 00:27:02,520 Speaker 2: to my campaign. She's given you money like it was. 504 00:27:02,600 --> 00:27:07,160 Speaker 2: And he loved that. But it was look he could 505 00:27:07,200 --> 00:27:12,159 Speaker 2: be when he was engaged in a fight. He was 506 00:27:12,280 --> 00:27:18,040 Speaker 2: as effective a warrior as you could see. And that 507 00:27:18,240 --> 00:27:23,400 Speaker 2: was powerful. And it was he and I worked together. Look, 508 00:27:23,720 --> 00:27:26,960 Speaker 2: you look last summer the Working Family's tax cut, the 509 00:27:26,960 --> 00:27:29,840 Speaker 2: big Reconciliation bill, which we've talked a lot about on 510 00:27:29,880 --> 00:27:32,280 Speaker 2: this podcast. I still think it's the legislation that has 511 00:27:32,320 --> 00:27:35,640 Speaker 2: the most conservative victories in it of any bill that's 512 00:27:35,680 --> 00:27:40,320 Speaker 2: ever passed into law. Yeah, Lindsay was the chairman of 513 00:27:40,359 --> 00:27:43,040 Speaker 2: the Budget Committee, and the Budget committee plays a critical 514 00:27:43,080 --> 00:27:46,919 Speaker 2: part in reconciliation has to pass the budget resolution. To 515 00:27:46,960 --> 00:27:50,159 Speaker 2: begin with, Lindsay and I worked hand in hand I 516 00:27:50,200 --> 00:27:53,920 Speaker 2: don't know that we win that reconciliation battle without Lindsay's 517 00:27:53,960 --> 00:27:57,320 Speaker 2: leadership as chairman of the Budget Committee, and he would 518 00:27:57,400 --> 00:28:02,040 Speaker 2: there were times when people are you know, look, our 519 00:28:02,119 --> 00:28:04,720 Speaker 2: majority is not always rock solid. You have people that 520 00:28:04,800 --> 00:28:06,919 Speaker 2: run off this way, run off that way, and to 521 00:28:07,040 --> 00:28:11,720 Speaker 2: get fifty votes to yes is really really hard. And 522 00:28:12,359 --> 00:28:16,320 Speaker 2: Lindsey was awfully good at it. 523 00:28:18,400 --> 00:28:19,840 Speaker 3: He was all making friends. 524 00:28:20,840 --> 00:28:23,320 Speaker 1: I mean, that's one of the lost arts in politics, 525 00:28:23,359 --> 00:28:25,919 Speaker 1: I think, is just how good he was at making 526 00:28:26,160 --> 00:28:30,479 Speaker 1: friends and making friends that he disagreed with in his 527 00:28:30,520 --> 00:28:32,720 Speaker 1: own party and making friends on other side. But he 528 00:28:32,840 --> 00:28:36,159 Speaker 1: also had just a way of understanding when there's moments 529 00:28:36,200 --> 00:28:36,959 Speaker 1: to laugh and not. 530 00:28:37,680 --> 00:28:40,320 Speaker 3: I told this earlier. I was young. I don't think 531 00:28:40,320 --> 00:28:41,480 Speaker 3: I've ever told you this story. 532 00:28:42,880 --> 00:28:45,920 Speaker 1: It was probably two thousand and five or six seven, 533 00:28:46,000 --> 00:28:48,680 Speaker 1: somewhere in there, and it was something to deal with 534 00:28:48,680 --> 00:28:51,720 Speaker 1: Iraq or Afghanistan. And I was on I think it 535 00:28:51,760 --> 00:28:54,160 Speaker 1: was Shepherd Smith's show on Fox back in the day, 536 00:28:54,720 --> 00:28:58,120 Speaker 1: and they asked me directly about Lindsay Graham and something 537 00:28:58,120 --> 00:28:59,920 Speaker 1: he'd said. They played the soot come out of it, 538 00:29:00,160 --> 00:29:03,160 Speaker 1: asked me, and I was pretty blunt, and I was like, 539 00:29:03,200 --> 00:29:04,560 Speaker 1: I strongly disagree with him. 540 00:29:04,640 --> 00:29:07,080 Speaker 3: YadA YadA, YadA. I get done. 541 00:29:07,120 --> 00:29:08,600 Speaker 1: And it was one of those you don't know it's 542 00:29:08,640 --> 00:29:11,360 Speaker 1: coming moments, welcome to Live TV, and so I gave 543 00:29:11,400 --> 00:29:12,080 Speaker 1: my assessment. 544 00:29:12,120 --> 00:29:13,000 Speaker 3: I get done. 545 00:29:13,640 --> 00:29:17,880 Speaker 1: Center within probably a minute. I was not out of 546 00:29:17,920 --> 00:29:21,280 Speaker 1: the seat yet. My phone rings. Now, if you're twenty something, 547 00:29:21,320 --> 00:29:23,840 Speaker 1: in your phone rings, and it's a senator like that's like, 548 00:29:23,960 --> 00:29:26,480 Speaker 1: it's you know, you answer right? So I answer it. 549 00:29:26,520 --> 00:29:29,400 Speaker 1: It's two two number and it's Lindsey Graham. I don't 550 00:29:29,440 --> 00:29:32,040 Speaker 1: know who he got my number from. And I answer 551 00:29:32,080 --> 00:29:35,840 Speaker 1: and he starts just unloading on me, telling me why 552 00:29:35,920 --> 00:29:36,400 Speaker 1: I'm wrong. 553 00:29:36,800 --> 00:29:37,960 Speaker 3: But it was all a ruse. 554 00:29:38,120 --> 00:29:41,040 Speaker 1: He was messing with me because he was down the 555 00:29:41,080 --> 00:29:43,760 Speaker 1: hall in the green room at Fox, knowing he was 556 00:29:43,800 --> 00:29:46,640 Speaker 1: gonna see me in twenty seconds. So I'm on the 557 00:29:46,640 --> 00:29:48,520 Speaker 1: phone walking out of the studio and it's you know, 558 00:29:48,560 --> 00:29:50,520 Speaker 1: the hallway there, it's a short hallway you go down 559 00:29:50,560 --> 00:29:52,160 Speaker 1: make it's on the left, green rooms on the right, 560 00:29:52,600 --> 00:29:55,840 Speaker 1: and I'm hearing the conversation in my ear delayed, and 561 00:29:55,880 --> 00:29:58,960 Speaker 1: I'm hearing his voice and I walk in and we'd 562 00:29:59,040 --> 00:29:59,880 Speaker 1: never met before. 563 00:30:00,120 --> 00:30:02,240 Speaker 3: I never had met before that moment. 564 00:30:02,280 --> 00:30:04,040 Speaker 1: And I'm on the phone with him and he looks 565 00:30:04,040 --> 00:30:05,600 Speaker 1: at me and goes, gotcha, And that. 566 00:30:05,680 --> 00:30:08,320 Speaker 3: Was it, Like he didn't mind that was ripping on him. 567 00:30:08,600 --> 00:30:09,520 Speaker 3: And I walked in there. 568 00:30:09,600 --> 00:30:11,600 Speaker 1: We laughed and he talked to me for a minute, 569 00:30:11,640 --> 00:30:13,440 Speaker 1: but he literally just wanted to mess with me. Like 570 00:30:13,520 --> 00:30:16,080 Speaker 1: it was like the perfect you know joke there, and 571 00:30:16,120 --> 00:30:18,920 Speaker 1: that's how he was. But like after that, it was hard. 572 00:30:19,040 --> 00:30:21,480 Speaker 1: He was smart. It was harder for me to go 573 00:30:21,520 --> 00:30:25,320 Speaker 1: after him on TV because I liked him personally from 574 00:30:25,360 --> 00:30:26,480 Speaker 1: that moment of him. 575 00:30:26,760 --> 00:30:28,520 Speaker 3: He could have been a jerk, he wasn't. 576 00:30:28,880 --> 00:30:30,880 Speaker 1: He saw the humor in the moment and was like, 577 00:30:30,920 --> 00:30:32,360 Speaker 1: I'm gonna mess with this guy, and it was. 578 00:30:32,400 --> 00:30:33,800 Speaker 3: It was a brilliant political move. 579 00:30:35,160 --> 00:30:40,000 Speaker 2: And that's who Lindsay was. I don't know a single 580 00:30:40,080 --> 00:30:44,640 Speaker 2: senator out of ninety nine other senators who didn't didn't 581 00:30:45,080 --> 00:30:48,400 Speaker 2: like genuinely like Lindsay and consider him a friend like 582 00:30:48,520 --> 00:30:50,720 Speaker 2: all of them. And it was a gift. And by 583 00:30:50,720 --> 00:30:52,520 Speaker 2: the way, I've been in Senate lunches, and we've talked 584 00:30:52,560 --> 00:30:54,920 Speaker 2: about a lot of those Senate lunches on this podcast 585 00:30:55,120 --> 00:31:01,960 Speaker 2: where things got raw and bare knuckles and on foreign policy, look, 586 00:31:02,160 --> 00:31:05,800 Speaker 2: Lindsey was an interventionist. He was an aggressive interventionist in 587 00:31:05,840 --> 00:31:08,400 Speaker 2: the style of John McCain. He believed it, it was honest, 588 00:31:08,440 --> 00:31:11,880 Speaker 2: but he was very much an interventionist. We've had lunches 589 00:31:11,960 --> 00:31:14,840 Speaker 2: where Lindsey and Ran Paul would scream at each other 590 00:31:15,000 --> 00:31:20,880 Speaker 2: and Lindsay Rand is very much an isolationist Lindsay and 591 00:31:20,920 --> 00:31:22,800 Speaker 2: by the way, I'm in the middle of both of them, 592 00:31:22,840 --> 00:31:25,680 Speaker 2: I agree with with with with Lindsay about half the 593 00:31:25,720 --> 00:31:28,160 Speaker 2: time and Rand about half the time. I've also been 594 00:31:28,160 --> 00:31:31,800 Speaker 2: in lunches where Lindsay and JD Vance would be screaming 595 00:31:31,840 --> 00:31:34,560 Speaker 2: at each other. JD is is much more of an 596 00:31:34,600 --> 00:31:39,080 Speaker 2: isolationist and disagreed with Lindsay. Like on Ukraine. I mean 597 00:31:39,160 --> 00:31:42,440 Speaker 2: they would go at it where where JD Vance wanted 598 00:31:42,520 --> 00:31:45,680 Speaker 2: us to get the hell out of Ukraine yesterday, Lindsey 599 00:31:45,760 --> 00:31:47,840 Speaker 2: was passionate on the other side, and they would slug 600 00:31:47,840 --> 00:31:48,120 Speaker 2: it out. 601 00:31:48,120 --> 00:31:48,280 Speaker 5: You know. 602 00:31:48,360 --> 00:31:51,320 Speaker 2: JD put out a very kind and gracious tweet today 603 00:31:51,680 --> 00:31:54,000 Speaker 2: actually telling that story, saying, look, you know, Lindsay has 604 00:31:54,080 --> 00:31:56,000 Speaker 2: yelled at me, but I respected him and he was 605 00:31:56,080 --> 00:31:59,760 Speaker 2: my friend. And actually I saw a clip today that 606 00:31:59,840 --> 00:32:04,960 Speaker 2: I never seen before. So Blake Masters, Blake Masters ran 607 00:32:05,080 --> 00:32:07,480 Speaker 2: for Senate in Arizona. I like Blake. I went and 608 00:32:07,520 --> 00:32:10,560 Speaker 2: campaigned for him. He didn't win. I wish Blake had won, 609 00:32:10,600 --> 00:32:13,719 Speaker 2: but he did not. Uh and uh, you know, Blake 610 00:32:13,920 --> 00:32:16,680 Speaker 2: is is more on the isolation side of things. He's 611 00:32:16,720 --> 00:32:19,600 Speaker 2: more with with Rand and JD. And on Ukraine, he 612 00:32:19,680 --> 00:32:22,840 Speaker 2: was a vocal opponent of the Ukraine conflict. And it's 613 00:32:22,920 --> 00:32:28,520 Speaker 2: interesting Lindsey went to campaign for Blake and and they 614 00:32:28,560 --> 00:32:31,160 Speaker 2: asked him, all, wait a second, you guys disagree on Ukraine. 615 00:32:31,160 --> 00:32:33,719 Speaker 2: I want you to listen to to Lindsay's response as 616 00:32:33,760 --> 00:32:37,400 Speaker 2: the he's there campaigning for a guy with whom he 617 00:32:37,480 --> 00:32:39,719 Speaker 2: has sharp disagreements on foreign policy. 618 00:32:39,720 --> 00:32:44,200 Speaker 4: Give a listen, remember my race, Remember Lindsey Graham dot com. 619 00:32:44,520 --> 00:32:48,280 Speaker 4: Anybody watched Sean Hannity. So I was on Sean Hannity 620 00:32:48,440 --> 00:32:52,640 Speaker 4: three nights a week. Blake saying they're gonna shoot my 621 00:32:52,720 --> 00:32:57,920 Speaker 4: dog tomorrow at midnight. If you don't give me I 622 00:32:57,960 --> 00:33:00,680 Speaker 4: know you're living on cat food, but you can. You 623 00:33:00,720 --> 00:33:05,280 Speaker 4: can spare a few bucks here, people responded. My opponent 624 00:33:05,400 --> 00:33:07,840 Speaker 4: raised one hundred and thirty two million dollars against me, 625 00:33:08,560 --> 00:33:11,360 Speaker 4: the most in the history of the Senate. Man, why 626 00:33:11,400 --> 00:33:15,000 Speaker 4: have across the cabin. They hated my guts. They wanted 627 00:33:15,000 --> 00:33:17,800 Speaker 4: to destroy the guy's life. I sort of got in 628 00:33:17,800 --> 00:33:21,440 Speaker 4: the way. That's the way these people are, right, There's 629 00:33:21,440 --> 00:33:25,160 Speaker 4: nothing they won't do for power. So the reason people 630 00:33:25,200 --> 00:33:27,680 Speaker 4: responded to me is you don't have to agree with 631 00:33:27,680 --> 00:33:29,480 Speaker 4: me all the time, but when there's a fight, I 632 00:33:29,520 --> 00:33:30,200 Speaker 4: will show up. 633 00:33:31,280 --> 00:33:33,560 Speaker 3: He shows up. He's not lying when he says that. 634 00:33:34,280 --> 00:33:36,800 Speaker 2: Yeah, And look, he would joke all the time, like 635 00:33:36,840 --> 00:33:39,400 Speaker 2: when he was running for reelection the last time. He 636 00:33:39,440 --> 00:33:42,280 Speaker 2: would go on on Hannity, to go on Fox News 637 00:33:42,320 --> 00:33:44,840 Speaker 2: and he'd say Lindsey Graham dot Comlinsy Graham dot Comlinsy 638 00:33:44,880 --> 00:33:46,920 Speaker 2: Graham dot com. And he was shameless. I mean, he 639 00:33:47,000 --> 00:33:48,880 Speaker 2: was like, Hi, my name is Lindsay Graham dot com. 640 00:33:48,920 --> 00:33:51,160 Speaker 2: He would raise money and he'd say he'd say, if 641 00:33:51,160 --> 00:33:52,920 Speaker 2: you're a little old lady and you're trying to feed 642 00:33:52,960 --> 00:33:55,080 Speaker 2: your cat, don't feed your cat tonight, go and give 643 00:33:55,120 --> 00:33:57,760 Speaker 2: me money instead. And it would people would crack up, 644 00:33:57,760 --> 00:34:01,320 Speaker 2: but they would do it. But so Blake Masters who 645 00:34:01,360 --> 00:34:03,880 Speaker 2: lost that race. He tweeted out that video. But here's 646 00:34:03,920 --> 00:34:06,800 Speaker 2: what he said in his tweet, which is interesting. Blake said, 647 00:34:06,920 --> 00:34:12,759 Speaker 2: quote once when a donor asked Senator Graham, why are 648 00:34:12,800 --> 00:34:16,000 Speaker 2: you helping Blake given how much you two disagree on 649 00:34:16,040 --> 00:34:21,440 Speaker 2: foreign policy. He replied with a grin. So Blake's wrong 650 00:34:21,560 --> 00:34:25,759 Speaker 2: about Ukraine. Who gives a shit. We aren't here to 651 00:34:25,800 --> 00:34:29,200 Speaker 2: talk about how correct I am all the time. We're 652 00:34:29,200 --> 00:34:32,560 Speaker 2: here to talk about getting the Senate majority because I 653 00:34:32,719 --> 00:34:37,040 Speaker 2: want to be chairman of my committees. And Blake continues, 654 00:34:37,120 --> 00:34:40,360 Speaker 2: Lindsey was cheerful and determined, and he understood that he 655 00:34:40,440 --> 00:34:44,759 Speaker 2: played a team sport. May his memory be eternal. That's 656 00:34:44,880 --> 00:34:48,320 Speaker 2: pure Lindsey Graham. He could disagree with you, and Lord 657 00:34:48,360 --> 00:34:51,919 Speaker 2: knows he and I did, but it wasn't personally, wasn't 658 00:34:52,040 --> 00:34:57,000 Speaker 2: angry with you, and and that sort of joy. Look, 659 00:34:57,040 --> 00:34:59,279 Speaker 2: it is amazing the number of times you look at 660 00:34:59,280 --> 00:35:04,040 Speaker 2: his relationship with Trump. Lindsay was a huge Trump critic. Yeah, 661 00:35:04,080 --> 00:35:07,520 Speaker 2: and he ran against him, said he was going to 662 00:35:07,600 --> 00:35:10,400 Speaker 2: destroy the world. But by the way, you look at me, 663 00:35:10,719 --> 00:35:13,319 Speaker 2: all right, So in the presidential look, Lindsay ran against Trump, 664 00:35:13,400 --> 00:35:15,680 Speaker 2: ran against me. And in the course of that campaign, 665 00:35:15,760 --> 00:35:20,719 Speaker 2: Lindsay said, you know, if you killed Ted on the 666 00:35:20,760 --> 00:35:25,520 Speaker 2: Senate floor, and the Senate was the jury, nobody could 667 00:35:25,600 --> 00:35:28,719 Speaker 2: convict you. I gonn admit that. That was funny as hell. 668 00:35:28,800 --> 00:35:30,480 Speaker 2: I like laughed, I'm like, all right, that's a hell 669 00:35:30,520 --> 00:35:35,080 Speaker 2: of a line. Now, Lindsay ended up not prevailing in 670 00:35:35,120 --> 00:35:38,640 Speaker 2: that race, obviously, he dropped out, and after Lindsay dropped out, 671 00:35:38,640 --> 00:35:41,440 Speaker 2: he endorsed my campaign. So he came and endorsed my campaign, 672 00:35:41,480 --> 00:35:44,920 Speaker 2: and he campaigned with me for president twenty sixteen. And 673 00:35:45,040 --> 00:35:47,000 Speaker 2: and Lindsey said at the time, he and I were 674 00:35:47,000 --> 00:35:50,120 Speaker 2: doing a fundraiser together, and I stood up and I said, 675 00:35:50,520 --> 00:35:52,280 Speaker 2: you know, I got to say, this is the first 676 00:35:52,280 --> 00:35:55,960 Speaker 2: time in my life I've ever been endorsed by someone 677 00:35:56,000 --> 00:36:02,040 Speaker 2: who's publicly called for my murder. And that was kind 678 00:36:02,040 --> 00:36:05,160 Speaker 2: of how Lindsay was. He He had, you know, in 679 00:36:05,239 --> 00:36:07,280 Speaker 2: the same time. You know, he and Trump would battle 680 00:36:07,360 --> 00:36:11,680 Speaker 2: like crazy, but Trump just liked him and it was real, 681 00:36:11,760 --> 00:36:17,400 Speaker 2: and Lindsey liked Trump. Lindsey saw the power. Look, Trump 682 00:36:17,520 --> 00:36:21,520 Speaker 2: has a cast iron backbone, he has courage, and and 683 00:36:22,040 --> 00:36:29,040 Speaker 2: Lindsey saw that the historic value of President Trump's strength, 684 00:36:29,080 --> 00:36:31,520 Speaker 2: and it was really important. Now, all right, I'll give 685 00:36:31,520 --> 00:36:35,279 Speaker 2: you another story from from first term Trump. We were 686 00:36:35,360 --> 00:36:38,520 Speaker 2: having a disputed about funding the border wall, and the 687 00:36:38,560 --> 00:36:41,319 Speaker 2: President wanted to sign and was going to sign an 688 00:36:41,360 --> 00:36:45,040 Speaker 2: emergency declaration and use the emergency powers of the president 689 00:36:45,360 --> 00:36:48,520 Speaker 2: to shift funding to the border wall. I came up 690 00:36:48,560 --> 00:36:50,800 Speaker 2: with a different legal theory that would let him build 691 00:36:50,840 --> 00:36:52,880 Speaker 2: the border wall, let him build every penny of the 692 00:36:52,920 --> 00:36:56,080 Speaker 2: border wall one hundred percent, but not do it through 693 00:36:56,080 --> 00:36:58,840 Speaker 2: an emergency declaration. And my concern was, look, if you 694 00:36:58,880 --> 00:37:03,080 Speaker 2: create the precedent for doing this the next Democrat president, 695 00:37:03,640 --> 00:37:06,120 Speaker 2: the next if we have a President Bernie Sanders or 696 00:37:06,120 --> 00:37:08,920 Speaker 2: President Elizabeth Warren, they're going to declare an emergency on 697 00:37:09,000 --> 00:37:12,080 Speaker 2: climate change. They're gonclare an emergency on gun violence and 698 00:37:12,280 --> 00:37:14,600 Speaker 2: use it to justify all sorts of bad policies. So 699 00:37:14,680 --> 00:37:17,279 Speaker 2: I had a second theory that would have done one 700 00:37:17,320 --> 00:37:20,040 Speaker 2: hundred percent of the upside without the downside of the 701 00:37:20,040 --> 00:37:23,520 Speaker 2: bad president. And I pitched it to Lindsay, and Lindsay 702 00:37:23,560 --> 00:37:26,120 Speaker 2: was like, Yeah, that makes sense. And so Lindsey and 703 00:37:26,120 --> 00:37:29,719 Speaker 2: I spent a day trying to call the President and 704 00:37:30,120 --> 00:37:33,440 Speaker 2: pitch this theory. And at the time, the White House 705 00:37:33,480 --> 00:37:36,040 Speaker 2: staff did not want Lindsay and me to talk to 706 00:37:36,080 --> 00:37:38,160 Speaker 2: the president, so they were blocking us. They were preventing 707 00:37:38,239 --> 00:37:39,680 Speaker 2: us from getting through to the president. 708 00:37:40,120 --> 00:37:43,360 Speaker 3: The oldest trick in Washington is that one right there. 709 00:37:44,120 --> 00:37:46,840 Speaker 2: And so we were sitting there, it was getting to 710 00:37:46,880 --> 00:37:49,880 Speaker 2: be maybe seven seven thirty at night. We were on 711 00:37:49,920 --> 00:37:52,120 Speaker 2: the Senate floor, and we were both frustrated because for 712 00:37:52,120 --> 00:37:54,719 Speaker 2: twenty four hours we'd been calling the president, we hadn't 713 00:37:54,719 --> 00:37:58,279 Speaker 2: gotten through. And I finally said to lindsay, screw it, 714 00:37:58,400 --> 00:37:59,960 Speaker 2: let's get in the car and drive over there. Like 715 00:38:00,080 --> 00:38:01,960 Speaker 2: what And I'm like, yeah, let's just go over there 716 00:38:02,000 --> 00:38:03,879 Speaker 2: right now. He's like all right, let's go. And then 717 00:38:03,920 --> 00:38:07,760 Speaker 2: oddly enough, a third senator jumped in the car, Ben Sass, 718 00:38:07,800 --> 00:38:09,279 Speaker 2: who was another friend, but he was just kind of 719 00:38:09,280 --> 00:38:12,080 Speaker 2: standing there, and Ben's like, oh, I'll go. And so 720 00:38:12,120 --> 00:38:15,359 Speaker 2: the three of us drove over and we're literally we're 721 00:38:15,360 --> 00:38:16,719 Speaker 2: not invited. We're uninvited. 722 00:38:16,719 --> 00:38:17,719 Speaker 3: We're just you're not list. 723 00:38:17,760 --> 00:38:19,440 Speaker 1: And by the way, people need to understand, there's two 724 00:38:19,520 --> 00:38:22,359 Speaker 1: gates you go through and if you're not on the list, 725 00:38:22,400 --> 00:38:23,960 Speaker 1: they look at you like you're an alien. 726 00:38:24,160 --> 00:38:28,480 Speaker 2: Okay, So we're driving over and and Lindsey calls and 727 00:38:28,480 --> 00:38:30,560 Speaker 2: actually gets Trump on the phone as we're driving over, 728 00:38:30,560 --> 00:38:33,640 Speaker 2: and he's like, yeah, we're come over right now. And 729 00:38:33,760 --> 00:38:37,719 Speaker 2: Trump was getting ready to have dinner with Milania, and 730 00:38:37,800 --> 00:38:41,320 Speaker 2: it was like their first like couple's dinner, a romantic 731 00:38:41,440 --> 00:38:44,360 Speaker 2: dinner in like a month. And Lindsey's like, no, we 732 00:38:44,360 --> 00:38:46,840 Speaker 2: need to see you right now. And so we go 733 00:38:47,040 --> 00:38:50,680 Speaker 2: up to the residence and Trump is pissed. He is 734 00:38:50,880 --> 00:38:53,680 Speaker 2: madder than a hornet because like his whole date night 735 00:38:54,400 --> 00:38:57,360 Speaker 2: has been blown up by us going over to the 736 00:38:57,360 --> 00:38:59,200 Speaker 2: White House. And so we come over there and we're 737 00:38:59,239 --> 00:39:02,480 Speaker 2: up in the residence and and Trump brings up a 738 00:39:02,520 --> 00:39:04,839 Speaker 2: couple of lawyers from the White House Counsel's office, and 739 00:39:04,840 --> 00:39:07,080 Speaker 2: and they're smart guys, but they were on the other 740 00:39:07,160 --> 00:39:10,120 Speaker 2: side of this. And we begin arguing, and I got 741 00:39:10,239 --> 00:39:13,160 Speaker 2: to say, look, Lindsey could judge the prevailing wins really quickly, 742 00:39:13,880 --> 00:39:16,280 Speaker 2: and and he could see that Trump was not buying 743 00:39:16,320 --> 00:39:19,839 Speaker 2: what I was selling that particular night. So Lindsey very 744 00:39:19,880 --> 00:39:22,279 Speaker 2: quickly abandons me. He just jumps out, and he goes 745 00:39:22,320 --> 00:39:25,640 Speaker 2: and sits with with with with Trump, and I'm arguing 746 00:39:25,680 --> 00:39:27,400 Speaker 2: with this lawyer from the White House Council. I mean, 747 00:39:27,440 --> 00:39:30,719 Speaker 2: we are slugging it out. I mean it's uh, it 748 00:39:30,920 --> 00:39:35,120 Speaker 2: was a bare knuckle fight. And Lindsey turns to Trump 749 00:39:35,160 --> 00:39:38,000 Speaker 2: and said, who do you think is winning. How they 750 00:39:38,040 --> 00:39:41,080 Speaker 2: do it, and like Trump's kind of laughing, and they're 751 00:39:41,160 --> 00:39:45,480 Speaker 2: almost like color commentators watching us have this legal argument. 752 00:39:45,760 --> 00:39:47,879 Speaker 2: And then in the middle of it, Trump calls one 753 00:39:47,920 --> 00:39:49,879 Speaker 2: of one of the staff of the White House and says, 754 00:39:50,080 --> 00:39:51,879 Speaker 2: bring us some of those pigs in a blanket, those 755 00:39:52,400 --> 00:39:54,920 Speaker 2: those those little ordures. So they bring a plate of 756 00:39:55,000 --> 00:39:58,239 Speaker 2: pigs in the blanket and this goes on for like 757 00:39:58,480 --> 00:39:59,280 Speaker 2: three hours. 758 00:39:59,640 --> 00:40:02,640 Speaker 3: No, so you guys straight up Trump the date night. 759 00:40:02,880 --> 00:40:06,120 Speaker 2: Yeah, it blew up the date night. We ended up 760 00:40:06,160 --> 00:40:08,760 Speaker 2: not being persuasive that night. Although I will say lindsay, 761 00:40:08,800 --> 00:40:13,640 Speaker 2: cut me loose so fast and any job. But he didn't, 762 00:40:13,840 --> 00:40:16,439 Speaker 2: like he admitted after he is like, yeah, you weren't winning, 763 00:40:16,440 --> 00:40:18,040 Speaker 2: So I wasn't gonna be with that. He's like, I'll 764 00:40:18,080 --> 00:40:20,319 Speaker 2: be behind you, way way way behind you. 765 00:40:20,320 --> 00:40:22,080 Speaker 3: Right behind you. Yeah, around the corner. 766 00:40:22,600 --> 00:40:26,680 Speaker 2: But it was the sort of thing that's that was 767 00:40:26,920 --> 00:40:30,680 Speaker 2: very much Lindsey Graham, and it's part of why Trump 768 00:40:30,800 --> 00:40:33,759 Speaker 2: listened to him, because he didn't win every argument, but 769 00:40:33,800 --> 00:40:35,720 Speaker 2: he was there to go again and to go again, 770 00:40:35,960 --> 00:40:39,799 Speaker 2: and it was really effective. And I'll tell you where 771 00:40:39,800 --> 00:40:44,240 Speaker 2: it mattered enormously. There's no area Lindsay and I worked 772 00:40:44,320 --> 00:40:49,440 Speaker 2: more closely on than Iran and standing up to the 773 00:40:49,880 --> 00:40:53,799 Speaker 2: incredible danger to America. If the Iyotola ever gets a 774 00:40:53,840 --> 00:40:56,760 Speaker 2: nuclear weapon, I think it's an existential threat to America. 775 00:40:56,800 --> 00:40:59,920 Speaker 2: I think if the Iatola who chanced death to America 776 00:41:00,040 --> 00:41:03,720 Speaker 2: it's a nuclear weapon, I think the odds are unacceptably 777 00:41:03,840 --> 00:41:06,719 Speaker 2: high that that hundreds of thousands or even millions of 778 00:41:06,760 --> 00:41:10,120 Speaker 2: Americans would be murdered. And Lindsay agreed with that, and 779 00:41:10,280 --> 00:41:14,280 Speaker 2: he and I wereked hanned in hand over and over 780 00:41:14,360 --> 00:41:17,640 Speaker 2: and over again, talking with President Trump every week, sometimes 781 00:41:17,680 --> 00:41:22,280 Speaker 2: every day, saying you're exactly right to stand up to Iran. 782 00:41:22,560 --> 00:41:24,960 Speaker 2: The President has said repeatedly Iran will never get a 783 00:41:25,040 --> 00:41:28,640 Speaker 2: nuclear weapon. There will be zero enrichment. And Lindsey was 784 00:41:28,760 --> 00:41:33,680 Speaker 2: an incredible ally UH that that that I've was fighting 785 00:41:33,680 --> 00:41:37,080 Speaker 2: alongside and the President listened to us, which is part 786 00:41:37,080 --> 00:41:41,760 Speaker 2: of why we've seen, UH seen the President's incredible strong 787 00:41:41,840 --> 00:41:46,319 Speaker 2: leadership UH taking out Iran's military capacity and stopping them 788 00:41:46,360 --> 00:41:49,080 Speaker 2: from getting nuclear weapons. That that that was one of 789 00:41:49,120 --> 00:41:51,239 Speaker 2: the most important legacies Lindsay ever had. 790 00:41:51,800 --> 00:41:53,080 Speaker 3: It's it's really incredible. 791 00:41:53,080 --> 00:41:54,959 Speaker 1: We're gonna do something really fun this week as well, 792 00:41:55,080 --> 00:41:58,600 Speaker 1: that first podcast that you did with your first guests 793 00:41:58,840 --> 00:42:01,600 Speaker 1: was Lindsay Graham. We're gonna put that out this week, 794 00:42:01,680 --> 00:42:04,280 Speaker 1: so look for that on the feed as well. Senator, 795 00:42:04,360 --> 00:42:06,560 Speaker 1: I'm so glad you got to talk about your friend. 796 00:42:06,600 --> 00:42:09,480 Speaker 1: I mean this so sincerely. I'm so sorry for your loss. 797 00:42:09,800 --> 00:42:12,560 Speaker 1: When you lose a friend, I've lost too many you lose, 798 00:42:12,719 --> 00:42:13,919 Speaker 1: especially a sudden like this. 799 00:42:14,000 --> 00:42:15,040 Speaker 3: It is gut wrenching. 800 00:42:15,600 --> 00:42:19,520 Speaker 1: Hug your family, Hug your friends, call your friends, check 801 00:42:19,560 --> 00:42:21,799 Speaker 1: on your friends. I say that often to people you 802 00:42:21,880 --> 00:42:25,759 Speaker 1: just never know. And and I'm glad You've got to 803 00:42:25,800 --> 00:42:27,279 Speaker 1: spend so much quality time with him. 804 00:42:28,320 --> 00:42:31,800 Speaker 2: Well, he will be missed. He left a legacy that 805 00:42:32,600 --> 00:42:37,319 Speaker 2: was extraordinary. And I will say, whether you agreed with 806 00:42:37,440 --> 00:42:43,800 Speaker 2: him or disagreed with him, Lindsey loved this country and 807 00:42:44,000 --> 00:42:46,920 Speaker 2: he devoted every waking moment of his life to fighting 808 00:42:46,960 --> 00:42:50,120 Speaker 2: for this country. That that was his mission. And I 809 00:42:50,160 --> 00:42:53,880 Speaker 2: admired that. I admired that it was real, it was genuine, 810 00:42:54,000 --> 00:42:58,239 Speaker 2: and he made a profound difference. It is a good 811 00:42:58,239 --> 00:43:01,640 Speaker 2: reminder Lindsay was just seventy one years old. He was 812 00:43:01,840 --> 00:43:04,040 Speaker 2: full of energy and vigor. To be honest, if I 813 00:43:04,080 --> 00:43:07,120 Speaker 2: were to pick one of my colleagues who was not 814 00:43:07,160 --> 00:43:09,600 Speaker 2: going to be making not gonna make it. Lindsey would 815 00:43:09,640 --> 00:43:12,000 Speaker 2: not have been on the list. He had the energy 816 00:43:12,080 --> 00:43:16,600 Speaker 2: that that he was unstoppable at energy. And it's a 817 00:43:16,600 --> 00:43:18,719 Speaker 2: good remindered all of us that that that none of 818 00:43:18,760 --> 00:43:22,200 Speaker 2: us are guaranteed to be here tomorrow. So so hug 819 00:43:22,280 --> 00:43:26,080 Speaker 2: your family, hug your kids, and and say thanks to 820 00:43:26,120 --> 00:43:28,600 Speaker 2: God for the for the privilege of living in a 821 00:43:28,640 --> 00:43:31,239 Speaker 2: time of consequence and and and making a difference in 822 00:43:31,280 --> 00:43:34,319 Speaker 2: our country. And I will say this, Lindsey Graham made 823 00:43:34,320 --> 00:43:36,000 Speaker 2: an enormous difference for our country. 824 00:43:36,160 --> 00:43:38,080 Speaker 3: Amen to that as always. 825 00:43:38,360 --> 00:43:41,320 Speaker 1: Thank you for listening to Verdict with Center Ted Cruz 826 00:43:41,400 --> 00:43:44,160 Speaker 1: Ben Ferguson with you don't forget to deal with my podcast, 827 00:43:44,200 --> 00:43:46,000 Speaker 1: and you can listen to my podcast every other day 828 00:43:46,000 --> 00:43:47,920 Speaker 1: you're not listening to Verdict or each day when you 829 00:43:47,920 --> 00:43:50,480 Speaker 1: listen to Verdict. Afterwards, I'd love to have you as 830 00:43:50,480 --> 00:43:53,480 Speaker 1: a listener to again, Ben Ferguson Podcasts, and we will 831 00:43:53,520 --> 00:43:55,600 Speaker 1: see you back here on Monday morning.