WEBVTT - Starting a Golf Tour and Playing on the APGA 0:00:00.080 --> 0:00:02.800 I miss a green, for example, I'm already upset. When 0:00:02.840 --> 0:00:04.920 I find my ball in the bunker, I'm really upset. 0:00:05.040 --> 0:00:05.960 And when I find my. 0:00:05.880 --> 0:00:08.719 Ball in a bride egg Frida egg, the dreaded Frida 0:00:08.760 --> 0:00:12.720 eg Frida Egg bride egg Lie, I'm about ready to 0:00:12.800 --> 0:00:14.120 run off the golf course. 0:00:34.760 --> 0:00:39.240 Welcome back to another edition of the Friday Egg Golf Podcast. 0:00:39.360 --> 0:00:42.800 I am your host, Andy Johnson. Today We've got an 0:00:42.840 --> 0:00:43.880 awesome episode. 0:00:44.320 --> 0:00:44.479 Uh. 0:00:44.600 --> 0:00:48.600 This is really centers around the APGA Tour, which, for 0:00:48.720 --> 0:00:52.680 those that do not know, is a tour that's really 0:00:52.760 --> 0:00:56.120 focused on inclusivity and diversity in the game of golf 0:00:56.160 --> 0:00:59.880 at the highest level at professional golf. So the ap 0:01:00.120 --> 0:01:02.880 GA Tour has been around for over a decade. It 0:01:02.960 --> 0:01:06.800 was all started by Ken Bentley. He's the first of 0:01:06.840 --> 0:01:10.560 our two guests. We also have Aaron Beverly. Ken goes 0:01:10.600 --> 0:01:14.360 into just kind of starting a golf tour, what his 0:01:14.640 --> 0:01:18.200 original goals were and what has become. It's become something 0:01:18.240 --> 0:01:22.800 really pretty incredible and you know, become a great place 0:01:22.880 --> 0:01:27.160 to play and a great place to develop diverse talent 0:01:27.280 --> 0:01:30.120 in the game of golf, which I think is super important. 0:01:30.280 --> 0:01:33.920 Our second guest is Aaron Beverly. Aaron Beverly played on 0:01:34.000 --> 0:01:39.360 PGA Tour Canada as well as the APGA Tour this year. 0:01:39.880 --> 0:01:43.280 Great guy lives in Sacramento, met him earlier in the 0:01:43.360 --> 0:01:45.880 year and wanted to get him on the pod to 0:01:46.280 --> 0:01:50.720 just talk golf in his career. So I spent this 0:01:50.840 --> 0:01:56.440 week Sunday through Tuesday out at the APGA event down 0:01:56.480 --> 0:02:00.240 in Pebble Beach. It was the Cisco Invitational. It was 0:02:01.600 --> 0:02:04.360 It was a historic event in terms of the APGA. 0:02:04.560 --> 0:02:08.000 It was played at Spanish Bay and Spyglass and it 0:02:08.040 --> 0:02:11.519 was the first ever fifty four whole event for the APGA, 0:02:11.639 --> 0:02:14.640 and it had the biggest perse ever in APGA history, 0:02:14.639 --> 0:02:17.799 one hundred and fifty thousand dollars. Fifty thousand dollars went 0:02:17.800 --> 0:02:20.680 to the winner, which was why at Worthington. You you've 0:02:20.720 --> 0:02:26.399 probably recognized that name from the PGA Championship. He's qualified 0:02:26.400 --> 0:02:29.840 for a number of PGA Championships. He shot sixty four 0:02:30.480 --> 0:02:34.160 in the final round at Spanish Bay, which for anybody 0:02:34.160 --> 0:02:37.600 that's been out there, there are disasters waiting at every 0:02:37.680 --> 0:02:41.480 turn there. It is a really tricky golf course, a 0:02:41.520 --> 0:02:44.880 really uncomfortable golf course, and sixty four is a really 0:02:44.880 --> 0:02:49.959 great score there to win. He beat a slew of players. 0:02:49.720 --> 0:02:52.960 There's a lot of talent. I played. I played in 0:02:53.000 --> 0:02:55.239 the pro am, which was it was kind of cool. 0:02:55.320 --> 0:02:59.239 It was during the round of golf. It was during 0:02:59.280 --> 0:03:02.360 the second round of the tournament, so I was playing 0:03:02.400 --> 0:03:06.520 with with a couple guys, Marcus Bird as well as 0:03:06.800 --> 0:03:10.040 Jared Garcia. I played with those guys and we it 0:03:10.120 --> 0:03:13.880 was during their second round of competition, and it was 0:03:13.960 --> 0:03:17.040 it was really neat. I mean, both guys were super impressive. 0:03:17.120 --> 0:03:20.200 Jared was three under through three ended up shooting I 0:03:20.200 --> 0:03:22.959 think one under on the round. And then Marcus Bird, 0:03:23.480 --> 0:03:26.000 who you might recognize that name. He was the Charlie 0:03:26.000 --> 0:03:30.200 Sifford exemption to Riviera this year. He actually won the 0:03:30.480 --> 0:03:34.040 Lexus Cup, which is like the APGA Player of the 0:03:34.120 --> 0:03:38.960 Year race. That he won that and he'll get full 0:03:39.000 --> 0:03:42.840 status on the PGA Tour Americas, which is Canada Latin 0:03:42.880 --> 0:03:45.760 America next year. Definitely a name to watch. He hits 0:03:45.800 --> 0:03:49.760 the crap out of the ball and really really magnetic personality. 0:03:50.040 --> 0:03:52.520 But along with that, you know, they I spent a 0:03:52.560 --> 0:03:55.080 lot of time with the players. You know, it was 0:03:55.200 --> 0:03:57.600 just fun. You know, you go to these PGA Tour 0:03:57.640 --> 0:04:00.400 events and and nobody wants to talk to you as 0:04:00.400 --> 0:04:05.440 a media member. And at the APGA event, it was 0:04:05.560 --> 0:04:08.560 just it was so nice to just talk with with players, 0:04:08.560 --> 0:04:11.440 hear their stories where they where they played college golf, 0:04:11.480 --> 0:04:14.800 at how they've been playing on the tour, and uh, 0:04:15.040 --> 0:04:17.480 it was super fun. So you know, that was a 0:04:17.640 --> 0:04:20.680 it was a really great experience. Uh. And I think, 0:04:20.800 --> 0:04:24.760 you know, the companies like Cisco, Farmers other companies that 0:04:24.800 --> 0:04:28.720 have really put some financial backing behind this tour deserve 0:04:28.760 --> 0:04:32.240 to be applauded for what they're doing really advancing the 0:04:32.279 --> 0:04:36.240 game of golf. I plan to pay a lot closer 0:04:36.279 --> 0:04:39.960 attention to the APGA Tour moving forward, and I hope 0:04:39.960 --> 0:04:42.839 to see some of these guys make it to the 0:04:42.920 --> 0:04:45.320 highest level of the game. I think that, you know, 0:04:45.560 --> 0:04:48.840 I obviously go to the majors. I go to a 0:04:48.839 --> 0:04:52.679 couple PGA Tour events a year. These guys hit the ball, 0:04:53.960 --> 0:04:56.520 you know, at a level that they can they can play. 0:04:56.560 --> 0:04:59.520 It's about putting it together and I think Ken talks 0:04:59.560 --> 0:05:05.560 about it, and I agree, it's about providing an opportunity 0:05:05.960 --> 0:05:10.280 for them to develop and play. And you know, I 0:05:10.600 --> 0:05:15.000 talked to Marcus Bird after his round and he was 0:05:15.040 --> 0:05:19.800 telling me about how after college he was working at UPS. 0:05:20.160 --> 0:05:22.200 I mean, this guy was in the top one hundred 0:05:22.400 --> 0:05:26.240 of the world amateur golf rankings and he was he 0:05:26.279 --> 0:05:29.040 didn't because he couldn't put the money together to play 0:05:29.080 --> 0:05:33.919 professional golf. And it wasn't until COVID happened. He still 0:05:33.960 --> 0:05:37.200 had exemptions and he played some amateur events with the 0:05:37.200 --> 0:05:41.680 money he was making caddying and working at UPS, and 0:05:41.680 --> 0:05:44.920 he played a few amateur events the next summer and 0:05:44.960 --> 0:05:48.839 then he got some people to put some money behind him. 0:05:49.080 --> 0:05:51.640 But like, you know, the thought of like a top 0:05:51.680 --> 0:05:55.520 one hundred amateur player not being able to even pursue 0:05:56.120 --> 0:05:58.920 a professional career. Think about that in like the context 0:05:58.960 --> 0:06:02.200 of any other sport. Think about it into the context of, like, hey, 0:06:02.200 --> 0:06:04.680 this is one of the one hundred best NFL prospects 0:06:04.880 --> 0:06:07.720 and he's not going to get a chance to play 0:06:08.240 --> 0:06:11.560 in the league because he can't, you know, afford to 0:06:11.640 --> 0:06:15.840 play you know, developmental and you know football, it doesn't work. 0:06:15.920 --> 0:06:18.920 It's not Apple's Apples comparison, but it makes sense, like 0:06:19.800 --> 0:06:22.640 there needs to be places of play that support the players. 0:06:22.720 --> 0:06:24.960 And I know, like you don't want to make these tours, 0:06:25.000 --> 0:06:28.000 destination tours. You don't want, you know, it to be 0:06:28.040 --> 0:06:30.760 a place that you know, you can make a living here, 0:06:30.920 --> 0:06:33.600 like a great living here, Like you want the highest 0:06:33.680 --> 0:06:37.400 level of golf rewarded. But like just the nature of 0:06:37.480 --> 0:06:41.520 golf is it is very difficult unless you have financial 0:06:41.560 --> 0:06:45.160 means or access to financial means. And I think that's 0:06:45.160 --> 0:06:47.880 one of the things that is great about what's happening 0:06:47.960 --> 0:06:52.479 with the APGA is that it is providing a bridge and 0:06:52.560 --> 0:06:57.960 an opportunity for people to get better without you know, 0:06:58.640 --> 0:07:02.039 fifty to one hundred thousand dollars expenses a year and 0:07:02.200 --> 0:07:04.360 allowing them to play for some cash. Like you know, 0:07:04.839 --> 0:07:07.880 I mean, why at Worthington making fifty thousand, that's going 0:07:07.920 --> 0:07:12.320 to really change his life. So, without further ado, let's 0:07:12.360 --> 0:07:15.560 get to Ken Bentley and Aaron Beverly and thank you 0:07:15.600 --> 0:07:23.400 guys for listening. All right, Ken, I'd love to hear 0:07:23.520 --> 0:07:25.160 how you got into golf personally. 0:07:25.880 --> 0:07:29.040 Well, I was working at Nestley, and I was an 0:07:29.040 --> 0:07:31.600 executive at Nestley, and I've been a tennis player all 0:07:31.640 --> 0:07:34.880 my life. I went to college on a tennis scholarship 0:07:35.960 --> 0:07:39.280 and I found that I was missing out on all 0:07:39.320 --> 0:07:41.360 the meetings, the guys were playing golf, and I swore, 0:07:41.440 --> 0:07:44.320 I was never gonna play golf. It's too slow, was it, 0:07:45.080 --> 0:07:47.600 you know, my kind of game. But then I found 0:07:47.720 --> 0:07:50.800 I was missing all all those meetings, those four hours 0:07:50.840 --> 0:07:54.400 on a golf course, and so I decided I would 0:07:54.480 --> 0:07:59.000 just play and learn well enough so I could play 0:07:59.160 --> 0:08:03.360 in those just corporate out And the first time I played, 0:08:04.640 --> 0:08:08.400 I was so bad. You know. Again, I swore and 0:08:08.440 --> 0:08:10.800 never do it again. And then I went out again 0:08:10.920 --> 0:08:14.000 and took a lesson and I hit a couple of shots, 0:08:14.040 --> 0:08:17.360 and then I was hooked. I just I just fell 0:08:17.360 --> 0:08:21.960 in love with the game, gave up tennis, just went 0:08:22.000 --> 0:08:24.000 to I mean, when I first started playing, I was 0:08:24.040 --> 0:08:27.000 single at the time, and so I would go to 0:08:27.040 --> 0:08:30.520 the driving range after work every night and I'd hit 0:08:30.520 --> 0:08:33.800 two hundred balls, and the guy who worked at the range, 0:08:35.679 --> 0:08:38.079 he would say, okay, you know, if you want to 0:08:38.120 --> 0:08:41.640 stay afterwards, you can hit balls till midnight if you 0:08:41.679 --> 0:08:46.320 wanted to. And I would actually hit balls until midnight. 0:08:46.520 --> 0:08:50.160 I chise, I just love the game, and I still do. 0:08:50.440 --> 0:08:52.960 I mean, I still, you know, I think about it 0:08:53.000 --> 0:08:55.160 all the time. I'm one of those golf junkies. I 0:08:55.840 --> 0:09:00.400 buy all the latest clubs, and you know, I love 0:09:00.559 --> 0:09:02.880 talking about golf. And the funny thing is all the 0:09:02.880 --> 0:09:05.960 guys I grew up playing tennis with are now playing golf, 0:09:07.000 --> 0:09:10.880 and so uh, it's just been. It's just been. It's 0:09:10.880 --> 0:09:13.280 a sport of a lifetime. I hope to play for 0:09:13.400 --> 0:09:14.640 us as long as I live. 0:09:15.320 --> 0:09:17.640 Were you living in LA when you were when you 0:09:17.679 --> 0:09:23.400 started playing? Yeah, it was it by chance. The Westchester Range. Yeah, 0:09:23.559 --> 0:09:27.520 I spent many a nights of that range. Yeah. 0:09:27.559 --> 0:09:27.880 Wow. 0:09:28.640 --> 0:09:30.600 Yeah, I used to go to Westchester and I used 0:09:30.640 --> 0:09:33.920 to play that which was crazy. It was like almost 0:09:34.000 --> 0:09:36.440 like a video game playing that course at night. Did 0:09:36.520 --> 0:09:37.520 you ever played at night? 0:09:37.840 --> 0:09:39.840 I didn't ever play it at night. I was just 0:09:40.280 --> 0:09:41.960 I was just going there for the range. 0:09:42.280 --> 0:09:45.440 Oh yeah, yeah, so I love that range. Actually, but 0:09:45.520 --> 0:09:48.160 when you play Westchester at night, they actually have the 0:09:48.160 --> 0:09:53.720 worst lights in the world and place balls are flying 0:09:53.800 --> 0:09:56.680 all over. So you take your life in your old hands. 0:09:56.320 --> 0:09:59.000 And then you got the planes. The planes are going over. 0:09:59.480 --> 0:10:03.440 It's a yeah, that is a it's listen. That range 0:10:03.520 --> 0:10:05.840 is just if if you want to if you want 0:10:05.880 --> 0:10:10.080 quintessential l a golf, that range is is just you 0:10:10.200 --> 0:10:13.800 got every every type of every profile of Los Angeles 0:10:13.880 --> 0:10:17.640 golfer in in one place at that range is Uh, 0:10:17.800 --> 0:10:21.320 it's an incredible experience. I I I remember I've lived 0:10:21.320 --> 0:10:23.920 there in my twenties for a little bit and I was, 0:10:24.000 --> 0:10:26.440 you know, a golf junkie and that was the that 0:10:26.520 --> 0:10:28.320 was the range that I went to all the time 0:10:28.400 --> 0:10:28.960 during the week. 0:10:29.000 --> 0:10:31.720 Oh yeah, I love that place. A great putting area, 0:10:31.960 --> 0:10:33.360 that big, big pudding green. 0:10:33.600 --> 0:10:36.120 Yeah. Yeah. When you were described when you said the lights, 0:10:36.160 --> 0:10:38.960 and I was just like it had to be that range. 0:10:39.280 --> 0:10:39.920 Yeah, of course. 0:10:40.480 --> 0:10:43.960 Yeah, the music going, it's a it's an awesome, awesome spot. 0:10:44.120 --> 0:10:47.480 It's a Hey. Speaking of tennis, you being a big 0:10:47.520 --> 0:10:50.920 tennis player already, did you watch bunch of the US 0:10:51.000 --> 0:10:54.680 Open and uh, you know a resurgence of American tennis 0:10:54.720 --> 0:10:55.160 this year? 0:10:55.720 --> 0:10:59.400 Oh, big time. Yeah, I was glued to the TV. Uh. 0:11:00.400 --> 0:11:03.920 The Americans have really made a statement and as we 0:11:04.160 --> 0:11:07.040 as we talked earlier, I mean it's intentional. They have 0:11:07.160 --> 0:11:10.240 a great player development program. I mean they looked a 0:11:11.080 --> 0:11:15.160 few years ago and American tennis was down so far, 0:11:15.640 --> 0:11:19.360 especially on the men's side, that the USTA invested in 0:11:19.400 --> 0:11:21.560 a lot of money in player development and you've seen 0:11:21.640 --> 0:11:22.760 the results of it today. 0:11:24.000 --> 0:11:28.160 Yeah, it's it's incredible to see just the young talent. 0:11:28.480 --> 0:11:32.040 I as somebody who recently moved to the West coast, 0:11:32.720 --> 0:11:37.120 the US Open unbelievable for anybody that lives on the 0:11:37.120 --> 0:11:40.200 West coast. Maybe not the best on the East coast, 0:11:40.240 --> 0:11:44.000 but those matches that especially you get in those quarterfinal matches, 0:11:44.520 --> 0:11:47.280 and there's nothing better than that light match that you're 0:11:47.400 --> 0:11:50.160 you're enjoyed, you know, it's under the lights and everything. 0:11:51.160 --> 0:11:53.600 So I want to talk about your your work at 0:11:53.600 --> 0:12:01.200 golf and with you founding the APGA. Obviously, I think 0:12:01.240 --> 0:12:03.719 it's a tour that has gained a lot of momentum, 0:12:04.320 --> 0:12:07.400 a lot of exposure over the last few years. But 0:12:07.480 --> 0:12:10.000 I want to go back to the start. What made 0:12:10.040 --> 0:12:13.320 you want to start the APGA and can you tell 0:12:13.400 --> 0:12:16.120 us about, you know, kind of the early days of 0:12:16.160 --> 0:12:16.880 the APGA. 0:12:17.640 --> 0:12:20.320 Well, I used to, as I said, I was a 0:12:20.320 --> 0:12:23.760 tennis player, but so once I got into golf. Twice 0:12:23.760 --> 0:12:26.400 a year I would get my friends together and maybe 0:12:26.440 --> 0:12:29.720 he would be thirty forty guys and we would go 0:12:30.080 --> 0:12:33.840 to different parts of the country and play golf. We 0:12:33.880 --> 0:12:37.800 would raise money for charity and those places where we 0:12:37.840 --> 0:12:40.360 would go and so at one of these we call 0:12:40.440 --> 0:12:44.520 them gatherings. And one of these gatherings, I had a 0:12:44.520 --> 0:12:47.280 conversation with a friend of mine, Adrian Stills, who had 0:12:47.320 --> 0:12:50.600 played on the PGA Tour, and so we were just 0:12:50.640 --> 0:12:53.640 talking about why there weren't more African Americans on the 0:12:53.640 --> 0:12:56.760 PGA Tour, and he said, when he came along, there 0:12:56.800 --> 0:13:00.000 was a United Golf Association Tour, which was kind of 0:13:00.160 --> 0:13:03.560 the Negro leagues of golf, and he had a chance 0:13:03.679 --> 0:13:08.200 to hone his game. He built camaraderie with players, and 0:13:08.240 --> 0:13:10.960 he felt like if we could start something where guys 0:13:11.000 --> 0:13:14.439 had a chance to play and develop their games, we 0:13:14.480 --> 0:13:17.520 could get some guys on tour. So I went to 0:13:18.000 --> 0:13:20.720 two companies I was associated with. I was at NESLEI 0:13:20.800 --> 0:13:22.600 at the time, so I got a grant from Nestle 0:13:22.800 --> 0:13:25.199 and I'm on the board of Farmers Insurance. I got 0:13:25.200 --> 0:13:26.840 a grant from them, and I put some of my 0:13:26.920 --> 0:13:30.280 own money in it. And we started in twenty ten 0:13:30.440 --> 0:13:34.200 with three tournaments. And I'll never forget that first tournament 0:13:34.480 --> 0:13:38.079 at Rogers Park in Tampa, and we didn't know what 0:13:38.160 --> 0:13:40.960 to expect, right, it was just a whole new concept. 0:13:41.080 --> 0:13:46.080 We send notices out the guys, and here were sixty guys, 0:13:46.679 --> 0:13:52.320 mostly African Americans on the driving range, beautiful swings, you know, 0:13:52.520 --> 0:14:00.439 all fired up, excited about this opportunity, and we had 0:14:00.480 --> 0:14:02.760 no idea where this was going to lead. So we 0:14:02.800 --> 0:14:06.360 started with just three tournaments, four thousand dollars first prize. 0:14:06.800 --> 0:14:08.800 I think we had. Our whole budget was like forty 0:14:08.840 --> 0:14:13.000 thousand dollars that first few years. And if you fast 0:14:13.000 --> 0:14:16.959 forward to today, we got eighteen tournaments, over a million 0:14:17.000 --> 0:14:21.320 dollars in prize money and bonus money. We're playing on 0:14:22.360 --> 0:14:27.360 iconic golf courses, places that host US Opens and PGA 0:14:27.520 --> 0:14:30.920 Tour events. So, yeah, we've come a long way. And 0:14:31.160 --> 0:14:35.600 I had a person one of our sponsors, asked me 0:14:35.960 --> 0:14:40.200 yesterday if this has been more than I envisioned back 0:14:40.680 --> 0:14:44.800 when we had that conversation, And yeah, it's been. I 0:14:44.920 --> 0:14:47.640 never dreamed. I thought we'd just have some tournaments, right, 0:14:47.720 --> 0:14:51.920 we'd have a few tournaments on inner city golf courses. 0:14:51.920 --> 0:14:54.960 But I had no idea in fourteen years we'd be 0:14:55.000 --> 0:14:55.880 where we are today. 0:14:56.400 --> 0:14:59.800 Yeah, I think that's the beautiful thing. I would say 0:14:59.800 --> 0:15:04.720 that this is entrepreneurship. About entrepreneurship is you start something 0:15:05.720 --> 0:15:08.000 and you kind of have an idea of where it 0:15:08.000 --> 0:15:09.960 could go. And I'm sure in your in the back 0:15:10.000 --> 0:15:12.080 of your head you might have believed it could be this. 0:15:12.320 --> 0:15:15.160 But you you kind of go on this road and 0:15:15.160 --> 0:15:19.600 and a lot of things happened that you know that 0:15:19.720 --> 0:15:23.800 are you know, just big moments, and then you get 0:15:23.840 --> 0:15:26.560 to these places and you you say, I never imagined 0:15:26.600 --> 0:15:30.600 that this was going to get here with the early days. 0:15:31.680 --> 0:15:35.040 Are there any humorous stories from like the courses, or 0:15:35.120 --> 0:15:39.200 purses or or or players early early in the APGA 0:15:39.720 --> 0:15:42.800 that gives of kind of give kind of color of 0:15:42.800 --> 0:15:45.760 of what the tour was when you started up. 0:15:46.440 --> 0:15:50.000 Well, I think, you know, it's a couple stories. One, 0:15:51.720 --> 0:15:55.440 we were out at Chester Washington, right is it's kind 0:15:55.440 --> 0:15:57.800 of a legendary golf course where they used to it's 0:15:57.840 --> 0:16:01.680 the road going into Chester now named after Charlie Sifferd 0:16:01.680 --> 0:16:05.880 because he played there. But we would we go out there, 0:16:06.640 --> 0:16:10.600 and again you just have no idea. But but those 0:16:10.640 --> 0:16:14.920 guys won't go to Riviera. The people that play at 0:16:15.080 --> 0:16:18.640 regularly at Chester, they don't go to Riviera to see 0:16:18.680 --> 0:16:23.000 professional golf. So when you're sitting around there, they're talking 0:16:23.040 --> 0:16:27.080 about Tim O'Neill, you know, they're talking about Willie Mack. 0:16:28.040 --> 0:16:30.840 Those are the guys that they talk about that are, 0:16:31.240 --> 0:16:34.480 you know, professional golf. That's professional golf to them. Because 0:16:34.520 --> 0:16:37.720 they actually got a chance to see those guys, they 0:16:37.760 --> 0:16:41.760 follow them and I think, I think it's amazing how 0:16:43.440 --> 0:16:47.400 those guys, our players resonate with those guys. And another 0:16:47.480 --> 0:16:51.560 another story, I'll give you two one to show you 0:16:51.680 --> 0:16:56.160 how important I think diversity is in golf. So we're 0:16:56.200 --> 0:17:01.400 at Tory Pines and Farmers had a clinic and so 0:17:01.440 --> 0:17:08.200 they had Willie Mack, they had Billy horschew Ricky Fowler, 0:17:08.760 --> 0:17:11.240 and one other player I can't bubble watch it. I 0:17:11.280 --> 0:17:14.680 think doing the clinic, and so they had fifty kids 0:17:15.040 --> 0:17:17.800 and there were three African American kids out of the fifty, 0:17:17.920 --> 0:17:20.720 and so they allowed the kids to self select what 0:17:20.960 --> 0:17:24.639 line they went into and what player they would actually 0:17:24.640 --> 0:17:29.280 get instructions from. And the black kids immediately went to 0:17:29.320 --> 0:17:32.399 Willie Mack. Now they hadn't seen him on TV, but 0:17:32.640 --> 0:17:35.520 when they heard he was a professional golfer who looked 0:17:35.560 --> 0:17:39.000 like then they stayed in his line the whole time. 0:17:40.119 --> 0:17:43.359 They were so fired up, and I think it was 0:17:43.840 --> 0:17:46.800 just so great to see how excited these kids were 0:17:46.840 --> 0:17:50.400 to see a professional golfer. The other one is kind 0:17:50.400 --> 0:17:53.480 of a sad story. We're at We're in Texas, in 0:17:53.600 --> 0:17:57.600 Dallas at a tournament at Craig Ranch. We played the 0:17:57.680 --> 0:18:01.320 first We played the first round and then we noticed 0:18:01.480 --> 0:18:06.080 that they're punching the greens in the fairways. So we 0:18:06.240 --> 0:18:09.600 go in the pro shop and we said, you know, 0:18:09.760 --> 0:18:13.160 we're having a pro tournament out there, and they said, oh, well, 0:18:13.200 --> 0:18:17.400 your guys won't notice the punch greens and the punch fairways. 0:18:17.680 --> 0:18:21.119 So it's crazy we had to play the second round 0:18:21.600 --> 0:18:26.199 with punch fairways and punch greens. But I think, you know, 0:18:27.040 --> 0:18:29.200 that would never happen today. I think there's a lot 0:18:29.240 --> 0:18:33.920 more respect for our guys. There's a you know, there's 0:18:33.960 --> 0:18:36.680 a general feeling that you know, our guys can play, 0:18:36.680 --> 0:18:40.360 and they've proven it over time. So I think those 0:18:40.400 --> 0:18:45.280 early days too, I couldn't get phone calls returned. You know, 0:18:45.359 --> 0:18:48.600 I think it was just that that idea that people 0:18:48.720 --> 0:18:53.639 just didn't think we could be successful. Now just like 0:18:53.680 --> 0:18:54.639 a whole different world. 0:18:55.280 --> 0:18:58.679 Did you ever have your own doubts about whether you 0:18:58.720 --> 0:19:00.240 could be successful at that point? 0:19:01.200 --> 0:19:01.399 You know? 0:19:02.640 --> 0:19:08.240 The thing I I well, I think we made a 0:19:08.280 --> 0:19:10.919 turning point for us. There's been a couple turning points, 0:19:11.359 --> 0:19:12.920 And you asked me if I had doubts. 0:19:14.160 --> 0:19:18.840 I had doubts about whether I'd be able to get 0:19:18.920 --> 0:19:22.520 a whole bunch at corporate support. So we made a decision. 0:19:23.320 --> 0:19:27.080 Probably three or four years in, we were having trouble 0:19:27.119 --> 0:19:32.000 getting corporate sponsors, and so we I went to some 0:19:32.080 --> 0:19:35.920 of my friends and I just said, you know, if 0:19:35.960 --> 0:19:40.280 we if you guys believe in what we're doing, then 0:19:40.480 --> 0:19:43.040 we got to put our own money in and we 0:19:43.160 --> 0:19:45.800 got to get it to a point where people will 0:19:45.840 --> 0:19:47.560 believe in this. And I think that was a big 0:19:47.600 --> 0:19:48.080 turning point. 0:19:48.119 --> 0:19:48.280 Souse. 0:19:48.280 --> 0:19:50.400 I got a bunch of my friends together to put 0:19:50.440 --> 0:19:53.359 in money, and so we were able to add a 0:19:53.359 --> 0:19:56.959 little prize money. Also, the PGA tour came on in 0:19:57.000 --> 0:20:01.000 twenty twelve, and it was a it's a weird situation 0:20:02.000 --> 0:20:05.720 that we got a check in the mail from them 0:20:05.720 --> 0:20:09.560 for like six years in a row. Just know, we 0:20:09.680 --> 0:20:14.200 never met with them. They just sent us a check 0:20:14.280 --> 0:20:17.800 every year in January, but the check, but the fact 0:20:17.840 --> 0:20:23.480 that they believed in us enough to invest money was great. 0:20:25.280 --> 0:20:27.840 A big turning point in that relationship was in I 0:20:27.840 --> 0:20:30.760 think twenty eighteen, I get a call from Alison Keller, 0:20:31.800 --> 0:20:34.880 who's the chief operating officer over at the PGA Tour, 0:20:35.800 --> 0:20:38.479 and she said, you know, I noticed that we've just 0:20:38.520 --> 0:20:43.000 been sending you this check every year and we don't 0:20:43.040 --> 0:20:45.160 know what we get for. We don't know a lot 0:20:45.160 --> 0:20:48.959 about the APGA. So either we're gonna stop get sent 0:20:49.040 --> 0:20:53.280 in a check, or we're gonna invest heavily in the APGA. 0:20:53.359 --> 0:20:54.880 So you got to come in. You got to talk 0:20:54.920 --> 0:20:56.719 to all of our executives. You got to tell us 0:20:56.720 --> 0:20:59.240 what you're doing and what your vision is for the future. 0:21:00.119 --> 0:21:03.320 You just been getting a check. Yeah, check it round 0:21:03.480 --> 0:21:07.760 and six years later we asked you to come in. 0:21:08.720 --> 0:21:14.439 Right. It was crazy, but you know it was the 0:21:14.520 --> 0:21:17.800 reception once we went in and presented our vision was amazing. 0:21:18.640 --> 0:21:18.800 Uh. 0:21:18.840 --> 0:21:21.840 And they've been an unbelievable partner for us. 0:21:22.119 --> 0:21:26.320 That's what I mean. What do you think initially drew them? 0:21:26.320 --> 0:21:29.320 Did you ever find out what initially got the check 0:21:29.359 --> 0:21:32.200 coming in and then what were what was the big 0:21:32.240 --> 0:21:35.320 thing that they they do? You think resonated about the 0:21:35.359 --> 0:21:36.880 APGA with the PGA Tour. 0:21:37.400 --> 0:21:40.120 Well, Steve Mona, who was head of the World Golf Foundation, 0:21:40.640 --> 0:21:41.800 he had contacted. 0:21:42.160 --> 0:21:42.360 Uh. 0:21:42.440 --> 0:21:45.760 He came to one of our tournaments and uh, he 0:21:45.880 --> 0:21:48.120 was really impressed with what we do. So he called 0:21:48.400 --> 0:21:51.760 a friend of his at and I'm not sure who 0:21:51.800 --> 0:21:54.639 it was he contacted, but he contacted our friend somebody 0:21:54.680 --> 0:21:57.880 at the a P at the PGA tour and that's 0:21:57.920 --> 0:22:01.040 how we got to check and they just you know, 0:22:01.720 --> 0:22:04.879 we tried to make contact with somebody over there, but 0:22:04.920 --> 0:22:06.960 we just never did it and got to check in 0:22:07.000 --> 0:22:11.160 the mail. But I think what there are a few 0:22:11.240 --> 0:22:14.200 things I think that resonated with them. One, we had 0:22:14.840 --> 0:22:19.240 sustained success over we had been in existence then for 0:22:19.280 --> 0:22:24.119 about six or seven years, and we had started the 0:22:24.440 --> 0:22:29.200 players had started to play better, you know. I think 0:22:29.280 --> 0:22:32.000 they saw the passion that we had. And by then, 0:22:33.200 --> 0:22:35.240 you know, we had a big vision for the APGA. 0:22:35.400 --> 0:22:38.159 After we had been in around for six or seven years. 0:22:38.280 --> 0:22:43.040 I saw this idea of where we could be, you know, 0:22:43.200 --> 0:22:46.520 I saw the I had the vision of where we 0:22:46.560 --> 0:22:50.040 could take this organization. And I think they were they 0:22:50.080 --> 0:22:53.840 were impressed by by the passion that we had and 0:22:53.920 --> 0:22:55.959 also that the vision we had for the future. 0:22:56.560 --> 0:23:00.000 What what was the I guess do you do you 0:23:00.200 --> 0:23:04.639 recall was there a moment where your vision became this 0:23:04.760 --> 0:23:09.880 grand vision for the APGA and from you know, just hey, 0:23:09.920 --> 0:23:12.400 we're trying to do a couple of tournaments as you mentioned, 0:23:12.720 --> 0:23:16.600 at some city courses. You know, when did that change? 0:23:17.359 --> 0:23:22.480 You know, I think it started to develop when we 0:23:22.720 --> 0:23:26.560 got the opportunity to have a tournament at Tory Pines 0:23:27.600 --> 0:23:31.280 alongside of the PGA Tour event. When the Farmers Jeff Day, 0:23:31.320 --> 0:23:34.119 who was the CEO of Farmers at the time, and 0:23:34.160 --> 0:23:37.199 I had a conversation and I told him about the 0:23:37.240 --> 0:23:41.119 APGA and he thought it was a great idea. It 0:23:41.160 --> 0:23:44.600 took us a while to sell it to you know, 0:23:44.720 --> 0:23:49.200 the PGA Tour and to Century Club. But once we did, 0:23:50.000 --> 0:23:53.760 you know, once our guys got on site and there 0:23:54.200 --> 0:23:56.920 the amazing thing was there. You know, Tory Pines has 0:23:56.920 --> 0:23:59.000 a north courtse in the south court, so our guys 0:23:59.040 --> 0:24:01.800 were on the north course while the PGA guys were 0:24:01.840 --> 0:24:04.760 on the south course at the same time. So you're 0:24:04.880 --> 0:24:11.320 walking the same fairways with Tiger Rory and you got 0:24:11.359 --> 0:24:15.359 the signs up. There's thousands of people there and to 0:24:15.440 --> 0:24:19.440 see and have all those people asking about the APGA 0:24:20.240 --> 0:24:23.960 and to see our guys in that environment, I think 0:24:24.000 --> 0:24:26.760 that's when I really started to say, hey, this thing 0:24:26.760 --> 0:24:30.359 could be really unbelievable. And then when we got the 0:24:30.400 --> 0:24:34.120 final round televised live a few years later, I mean, 0:24:34.160 --> 0:24:36.960 that was another breakthrough moment to see our guys on 0:24:37.080 --> 0:24:42.359 national TV in a live tournament. So I think the 0:24:43.240 --> 0:24:47.080 I think getting to Tory Pines was a watershed moment 0:24:47.119 --> 0:24:47.480 for us. 0:24:48.080 --> 0:24:51.040 Going back to the early days. I think anybody that 0:24:51.200 --> 0:24:57.359 started something generally longs for the some parts of the 0:24:57.400 --> 0:25:01.919 early days. Is there a specific aspect of the first 0:25:02.000 --> 0:25:05.320 couple of years of the APGA that you really miss 0:25:05.480 --> 0:25:10.520 now that you've become this you really developed tour, you know, 0:25:11.600 --> 0:25:15.280 nationally recognized tour, a tour with, as you said, over 0:25:15.320 --> 0:25:18.159 a million dollars in prize money. Is there something you 0:25:18.200 --> 0:25:20.479 missed from those early days where you're just kind of 0:25:20.520 --> 0:25:21.960 thrown together tournaments? 0:25:22.320 --> 0:25:25.000 You know, I miss going to those inner city golf 0:25:25.040 --> 0:25:28.040 courses because, as I mentioned, you know, our guys were 0:25:28.160 --> 0:25:33.159 heroes out there. You know, we connected with the community. 0:25:35.359 --> 0:25:39.400 There was a different feel and I miss that. You know, 0:25:39.440 --> 0:25:43.960 you don't get the the same feeling at Chester Washington 0:25:44.080 --> 0:25:46.600 that you get at Valhalla, right, I mean, it's a 0:25:46.680 --> 0:25:49.600 different it's a whole different vibe. You don't get the 0:25:49.640 --> 0:25:53.879 community as involved. But you know, you can't prepare guys 0:25:53.920 --> 0:25:57.359 for the PGA Tour if you're playing Chester Washington every week, 0:25:57.520 --> 0:26:00.320 so you have to have it. But I I really 0:26:00.359 --> 0:26:02.160 think we got to go back to some of that. 0:26:02.800 --> 0:26:05.480 I think we if we're going to help grow golf, 0:26:06.240 --> 0:26:09.959 we can't play all of our tournaments on you know, 0:26:10.040 --> 0:26:14.360 those so far away from the community. So I think 0:26:14.400 --> 0:26:16.960 you'll see us in the future bring some. 0:26:17.040 --> 0:26:17.600 Of that back. 0:26:17.680 --> 0:26:19.920 We still got to prepare the guys for the PGA Tour, 0:26:20.000 --> 0:26:23.399 so we'll still have those iconic golf courses, but I 0:26:23.400 --> 0:26:27.399 think we'll sprinkle back in the Chester, Washington's and the 0:26:27.560 --> 0:26:28.240 Rogers Park. 0:26:28.880 --> 0:26:33.000 Yeah, I mean, and hopefully in the next few years, 0:26:33.080 --> 0:26:37.159 the you know golf movement of some of these city 0:26:37.240 --> 0:26:41.040 golf courses getting worked on and elevated continues. I know 0:26:41.280 --> 0:26:44.879 one course that's that's about to start a big renovation project. 0:26:44.960 --> 0:26:49.119 It's Cops Creek and Philadelphia, and that golf course, you know, 0:26:49.160 --> 0:26:51.480 if you read back to when it was built, was 0:26:51.520 --> 0:26:53.680 one of known as one of the best golf courses 0:26:53.720 --> 0:26:58.240 in the world. Another project would be in Washington, d C. 0:26:58.400 --> 0:27:02.040 With their three courses with East Potomac lengths, and you know, 0:27:02.200 --> 0:27:05.439 those golf courses getting work done could elevate them to 0:27:05.520 --> 0:27:09.679 a spot where a hosting a tournament wouldn't be you know, 0:27:09.720 --> 0:27:12.320 we aren't taking a step down, you know. And I 0:27:12.320 --> 0:27:14.640 think that's something just in general with golf, is that 0:27:15.200 --> 0:27:19.440 you know, inner city golf. It shouldn't be different as 0:27:19.480 --> 0:27:21.639 somebody who lived in a city and played at city 0:27:21.640 --> 0:27:25.800 golf courses in Chicago and in Los Angeles like you shouldn't. 0:27:25.840 --> 0:27:28.320 It shouldn't have to be as uh, you know, I'm 0:27:28.320 --> 0:27:30.879 playing city golf versus going out to the suburbs and 0:27:30.880 --> 0:27:34.240 playing suburb golf. Right, there shouldn't be a difference, just 0:27:34.280 --> 0:27:36.760 in general with the golf. I think that you know, 0:27:36.800 --> 0:27:41.560 these golf courses have enough play, enough support that they 0:27:41.680 --> 0:27:46.119 should have, you know, better facilities in general. So what 0:27:46.240 --> 0:27:50.080 do you think about the the APGA and you think 0:27:50.119 --> 0:27:53.760 about just individual success stories, is there is there one 0:27:53.840 --> 0:27:55.400 or two that stand out to you? 0:27:55.920 --> 0:27:56.080 Well? 0:27:56.080 --> 0:27:59.520 I think the two big success stories for me. One 0:27:59.600 --> 0:28:03.000 is Willie Mac. I mean, Willie Mack is amazing, amazing story. 0:28:03.040 --> 0:28:06.520 Here's the guy who was homeless six or seven years ago, 0:28:07.560 --> 0:28:10.000 living in his car and you know, you talk to 0:28:10.040 --> 0:28:13.480 Willie Mack and he had to play tournaments every week 0:28:13.880 --> 0:28:17.320 because you know, for us when we stand over a 0:28:17.400 --> 0:28:19.880 four foot putt and we talk about the pressure of it, 0:28:20.920 --> 0:28:23.719 you know, for Willie Mack, it meant the difference of 0:28:23.760 --> 0:28:26.560 whether he had dinner that night if he made that 0:28:26.600 --> 0:28:28.959 for a foot. But so that's real pressure. And to 0:28:29.000 --> 0:28:32.520 see Willie Mack now a full member of the corn 0:28:32.560 --> 0:28:38.440 Ferry Tour, you know, it just it really really does 0:28:38.560 --> 0:28:40.920 make me feel good and makes all this hard work 0:28:41.000 --> 0:28:44.480 worth it. And Io and Tim O'Neil is the other one. 0:28:44.520 --> 0:28:48.520 I mean, Tim O'Neil was with us when we first started, 0:28:48.600 --> 0:28:54.520 played in our first tournament. His disappointments and tour school 0:28:54.800 --> 0:28:59.360 to school has been well documented. He you know, he 0:28:59.600 --> 0:29:04.920 just was on this grind for twenty five years, a 0:29:04.960 --> 0:29:09.480 good player but couldn't get to the next level. Played 0:29:09.520 --> 0:29:13.400 with us for thirteen years, and now he's a full 0:29:13.440 --> 0:29:16.040 member of the Champions Tour. He's one of almost four 0:29:16.160 --> 0:29:19.960 hundred thousand dollars on the Champions Tour. And it's great 0:29:20.000 --> 0:29:25.120 to see Tim just in those kind of lights, considering 0:29:25.360 --> 0:29:28.480 all what he's been through. And Tim was the great 0:29:28.480 --> 0:29:30.680 thing about Tim is that he was such a big 0:29:30.760 --> 0:29:34.000 mentor to our guys. They looked up to him because 0:29:34.040 --> 0:29:37.720 Tim was a real professional. You know, he took every 0:29:38.040 --> 0:29:40.640 time he stepped on the golf course, he treated it 0:29:40.680 --> 0:29:44.120 like it was a US Open. You know, he was professional. 0:29:44.760 --> 0:29:48.560 He went about his craft with a professional attitude. And 0:29:48.600 --> 0:29:52.720 it's so great to see him now on the Champions Tour. 0:29:53.520 --> 0:29:57.440 I think another one, the last one for me, is 0:29:57.480 --> 0:29:59.640 one of the most inspirational guys I ever met is 0:29:59.720 --> 0:30:03.680 Kevin Hall. I mean, here's a guy who his parents 0:30:03.720 --> 0:30:06.840 found out he was deaf. I think he had meningitis 0:30:06.920 --> 0:30:09.640 or some illness when as a kid at two years old, 0:30:10.160 --> 0:30:14.960 lost his hearing, and the parents made a decision right 0:30:15.000 --> 0:30:18.840 then that Kevin Hall would not be a kid that 0:30:18.920 --> 0:30:21.440 people would feel sorry for. It would be someone that 0:30:21.480 --> 0:30:24.640 would pursue his dreams and would be able to do 0:30:24.680 --> 0:30:28.479 something that everyone else did. And to watch him, you know, 0:30:28.520 --> 0:30:32.680 win twice this year, be our Player of the Year 0:30:32.760 --> 0:30:36.680 a few years ago, always has a smile on his face. 0:30:37.360 --> 0:30:41.600 I mean, he's just a true inspiration. I remember playing 0:30:41.680 --> 0:30:47.480 he played in the Genesis the Charlie Sifferd Exemption, and 0:30:47.600 --> 0:30:50.480 Kevin was walking off the green I think it was 0:30:50.520 --> 0:30:53.600 the fourteenth green and this little kid came up to 0:30:53.680 --> 0:30:58.479 him and he handed him a ball and Kevin, you know, 0:30:58.680 --> 0:31:01.240 was making emotion like do you want me to sign it? 0:31:01.840 --> 0:31:04.400 And the kid said, no, read it and the ball 0:31:04.440 --> 0:31:07.680 said you are my hero and he handed it to Kevin. 0:31:08.320 --> 0:31:10.960 I mean, you know, it's just moments like that that 0:31:12.320 --> 0:31:15.040 just give you chills when you see, you know, what 0:31:15.320 --> 0:31:18.200 the impact our players have had on golf. 0:31:18.800 --> 0:31:21.120 Yeah, And I think I think the thing with with 0:31:22.000 --> 0:31:24.120 kind of the stories that you've you've brought up, the 0:31:24.120 --> 0:31:27.680 players you brought up, and it, I mean, professional golf. 0:31:27.880 --> 0:31:30.800 So much of the coverage goes to the phenoms, the 0:31:30.800 --> 0:31:37.000 players that are immediately tour players, right, But one of 0:31:37.040 --> 0:31:42.320 the you know, wonderful aspects of professional golf is the grinders, 0:31:42.480 --> 0:31:45.360 the guys that you know that make it out to 0:31:45.440 --> 0:31:47.600 the tour for the first time at age thirty eight, 0:31:47.680 --> 0:31:51.520 age thirty nine in the in the you know, Tim 0:31:51.520 --> 0:31:55.000 O'Neill working his ass off until the Champions Tour is 0:31:55.040 --> 0:31:59.120 a great example of somebody perseverance. And I think one 0:31:59.160 --> 0:32:03.720 of the hardest things about professional golf is finding places 0:32:03.760 --> 0:32:07.080 to play golf that you can you can turn a 0:32:07.160 --> 0:32:10.680 profit to keep the dream alive to you know, and 0:32:10.960 --> 0:32:13.840 Willie max case to to have a meal to eat, 0:32:14.120 --> 0:32:17.000 but also a place to play golf, to get ready 0:32:17.080 --> 0:32:20.600 for the corn Ferry Tour. And I think, like obviously, 0:32:21.120 --> 0:32:23.440 I think one of the challenges with professional golf for 0:32:23.560 --> 0:32:29.400 anybody that's even considered pursuing it is the monetary burden 0:32:29.680 --> 0:32:33.840 that it presents. What have you guys done to try 0:32:33.880 --> 0:32:38.600 to you know, bridge that monetary gap that you know, 0:32:39.200 --> 0:32:43.920 the monetary kind of mountain that faces any aspiring professional golfer. 0:32:44.520 --> 0:32:47.920 Well, four or five years ago, we surveyed our players 0:32:48.160 --> 0:32:51.760 and we found out that most hadn't been fitted for clubs, 0:32:52.320 --> 0:32:54.880 that they were practicing on first tea courses, that they 0:32:54.920 --> 0:32:59.960 weren't taking lessons from top name professionals. So we start 0:33:00.080 --> 0:33:04.000 did a player development program and we take the guys 0:33:04.080 --> 0:33:06.720 that we feel have the most potential to make it 0:33:06.760 --> 0:33:09.640 to the PGA Tour, and we pay for all that. 0:33:09.840 --> 0:33:12.880 We pay for lessons, We pay for them to join 0:33:12.920 --> 0:33:16.840 a club, we paid for make sure they have the 0:33:16.920 --> 0:33:21.680 right equipment. We also pay for them to go to 0:33:21.760 --> 0:33:25.280 Q School. We pay for them to do five Monday 0:33:25.400 --> 0:33:30.320 qualifying and a PGA Tour corn Fair event. We've got 0:33:30.320 --> 0:33:33.120 a psychologist that works with them, and so we've been 0:33:33.280 --> 0:33:37.200 and we did a deal with full Swing. So each 0:33:37.280 --> 0:33:39.360 one of the guys in our program has a full 0:33:39.400 --> 0:33:45.960 Swing Launch monitor. So we're trying to fill those gaps that, 0:33:46.440 --> 0:33:49.600 you know, the the financial gaps that these guys have 0:33:49.800 --> 0:33:52.200 and through our player development program. 0:33:52.560 --> 0:33:55.760 Yeah, I mean, I think that's obviously you think about 0:33:55.760 --> 0:33:59.680 other sports and this isn't necessarily a challenge that other 0:33:59.720 --> 0:34:03.480 sports or its face in terms of, you know, the 0:34:03.520 --> 0:34:07.000 financial burden. Is there any sport that you guys look 0:34:07.080 --> 0:34:10.400 at and try and draw from from what they're doing 0:34:11.600 --> 0:34:16.440 to support players and and use some of their tactics. 0:34:17.200 --> 0:34:20.840 Well, I think tennis is a classic example because I 0:34:20.880 --> 0:34:26.280 think the the player demographics for tennis are similar to golf, 0:34:27.360 --> 0:34:30.840 and you know, the the equipment is not nearly as expensive, 0:34:30.840 --> 0:34:33.279 but the travel and the tournaments that you have to 0:34:33.320 --> 0:34:38.600 play and the lessons and everything are right are similar 0:34:38.640 --> 0:34:42.520 to golf. And so what tennis has done is they 0:34:42.560 --> 0:34:47.120 created a diversity program a number of years ago and 0:34:47.200 --> 0:34:52.080 they decided, look, we're gonna make tennis available to everyone. 0:34:52.239 --> 0:34:54.920 We're going to take cost out of the equation. And 0:34:55.000 --> 0:34:59.600 so if the tennis player shows promise. The USDA paced 0:34:59.640 --> 0:35:02.880 for every thing for them, They pay for all the travel, 0:35:02.920 --> 0:35:06.920 their lessons. They have these performance centers around the country 0:35:06.960 --> 0:35:10.759 that kids can go and take free lessons, And I 0:35:10.800 --> 0:35:14.919 think that's why you see so many kids that grew 0:35:15.040 --> 0:35:18.480 up playing on public tennis courts now at the highest 0:35:18.520 --> 0:35:22.799 ranking in tennis, and both men's and women's tennis. You 0:35:22.840 --> 0:35:26.319 don't see you don't necessarily in tennis have to come 0:35:26.360 --> 0:35:29.040 from a country club in order to make it to 0:35:29.080 --> 0:35:32.160 the top levels because the USTA has put so much 0:35:32.280 --> 0:35:35.719 of their resources into it. So that's what we use, 0:35:36.160 --> 0:35:40.520 and I look at that model and try and replicate 0:35:40.600 --> 0:35:41.280 what they're doing. 0:35:41.760 --> 0:35:45.600 And just in general, when you get beyond the APGA 0:35:45.840 --> 0:35:50.520 and beyond your tour, what does you know, what are 0:35:50.560 --> 0:35:54.480 the big benefits of having greater diversity in the professional game. 0:35:55.040 --> 0:35:57.200 What will that do for golf in the long run? 0:35:57.800 --> 0:35:59.759 Well, I think you know a couple of things that'll 0:35:59.760 --> 0:36:02.560 do for golf. I think, and again you see it 0:36:02.560 --> 0:36:06.800 in tennis. You just it brings more people into the game. 0:36:08.120 --> 0:36:11.720 You know, when you talk to our guys, they all 0:36:11.880 --> 0:36:13.560 and you say, well, why did you get into golf? 0:36:13.600 --> 0:36:16.200 And they say, I saw Tiger. I saw Tiger win 0:36:16.280 --> 0:36:18.840 the US Open, I saw Tiger win the Masters. I 0:36:18.880 --> 0:36:23.799 saw you know, I saw Tiger. And that's the kind 0:36:23.840 --> 0:36:27.279 of you bring more people into the game. You have 0:36:27.719 --> 0:36:30.600 on a business side, you have more consumers that will 0:36:30.640 --> 0:36:35.880 buy the goods. I think America is changing. The demographics 0:36:35.920 --> 0:36:40.359 of America's changed, so you can't continue to survive if 0:36:40.400 --> 0:36:44.680 you have one demographic playing golf. And so I think 0:36:44.880 --> 0:36:47.120 we've got to reach out to everyone. I mean women, 0:36:47.920 --> 0:36:52.000 it's great to see more women playing. You know, you 0:36:52.120 --> 0:36:55.920 go out to a place like Westchester. We talked about Westchester. 0:36:56.800 --> 0:37:00.760 Westchester looks like America every day on the driving range, 0:37:01.360 --> 0:37:04.080 and that's the beautiful thing about it. And that's what 0:37:05.600 --> 0:37:08.120 we're trying to get golf too, to look like Westchester 0:37:08.719 --> 0:37:09.680 all over the country. 0:37:10.239 --> 0:37:14.600 Yeah, I uh, it's it's definitely as a different you 0:37:14.640 --> 0:37:18.080 know when you there's all these different spheres of golf 0:37:18.080 --> 0:37:21.120 in different ways that people experience golf, different places that 0:37:21.160 --> 0:37:26.000 people experienced golf. With the APGA, I think obviously you 0:37:26.000 --> 0:37:31.040 you've grown to an incredible place in recent years as 0:37:31.080 --> 0:37:34.960 you as you alluded to earlier in the podcast, what 0:37:36.040 --> 0:37:38.520 are your goals for the next five years, do you 0:37:38.560 --> 0:37:42.080 have any grand ambitions and where do you continue to 0:37:42.120 --> 0:37:44.839 see this tour grow, growing and getting to. 0:37:45.800 --> 0:37:48.239 You know, it's a it's interesting to ask that we 0:37:48.320 --> 0:37:52.280 have a committee now that we call APGA twenty thirty. 0:37:53.200 --> 0:37:57.840 So we we uh, we got one of our board members, 0:37:58.239 --> 0:38:01.680 Keith Hulamard, who was the president of the Jordan Brand. 0:38:02.600 --> 0:38:05.399 He's heading that project up and we're looking at all 0:38:05.600 --> 0:38:09.239 aspects of our organization and to see where we want 0:38:09.280 --> 0:38:12.279 to be. You know, what if I had a crystal ball, 0:38:12.960 --> 0:38:15.719 you know, I look, one thing I think we have 0:38:15.840 --> 0:38:19.520 to do is we have to have a women's component 0:38:19.600 --> 0:38:23.440 to our organization. You know, we can't bring greater diversity 0:38:23.480 --> 0:38:27.560 to the game if we're only focused on men. I 0:38:28.160 --> 0:38:33.680 went to the mac Champ Championship that Cameron Champ does 0:38:34.320 --> 0:38:37.239 for the top minority kids in the country, and so 0:38:37.280 --> 0:38:40.640 I went there and one of a father came up 0:38:40.640 --> 0:38:41.960 to me and he said, you know, I have a 0:38:42.000 --> 0:38:45.479 fifteen year old son, and my son all he talks 0:38:45.480 --> 0:38:48.160 about is one day playing the APGA Tour and he 0:38:48.200 --> 0:38:51.839 gets so excited. He follows the results and you know, 0:38:51.880 --> 0:38:54.719 he can't wait till he graduates from college and can 0:38:54.719 --> 0:38:59.120 play the APGA Tour. He said, but my daughter is 0:38:59.200 --> 0:39:04.160 sixteen and she's an even better player, and she says, 0:39:04.200 --> 0:39:07.279 why isn't there an APGA Tour for me? What am 0:39:07.280 --> 0:39:11.080 I gonna do? You know? And how fair is that? 0:39:11.840 --> 0:39:13.880 And so the dad said, you know, you've got to 0:39:13.920 --> 0:39:17.440 think about that. And so since I had that conversation 0:39:17.520 --> 0:39:21.319 with him, I think about it all the time. I 0:39:21.360 --> 0:39:25.640 think the future's got to hold a women's tour for us. 0:39:27.120 --> 0:39:30.520 You know, I don't think we need more tournaments. We 0:39:30.560 --> 0:39:35.640 certainly have eighteen. We don't need more tournaments. I think 0:39:35.680 --> 0:39:40.160 we need more development money. We need to have these 0:39:40.160 --> 0:39:44.120 guys play more tournaments outside the APGA Tour. We need 0:39:44.160 --> 0:39:48.640 to get to the younger kids. We started the Cisco 0:39:48.719 --> 0:39:53.800 Junior Series. We've got to put more resources into developing kids. 0:39:55.920 --> 0:40:01.480 So I see, the other thing that's a tough conversation 0:40:02.840 --> 0:40:06.600 is I don't want the APGA Tour to be a destination. Now, 0:40:06.640 --> 0:40:09.160 that's the danger in the prize money that we have, 0:40:11.800 --> 0:40:14.920 that guys can make one hundred and fifty two hundred 0:40:14.960 --> 0:40:18.320 thousand on the APGA Tour. It's a blessing and a 0:40:18.400 --> 0:40:21.640 curse because you know, there's not many tours around the 0:40:21.680 --> 0:40:23.600 world that you could make one hundred and fifty two 0:40:23.640 --> 0:40:24.400 hundred thousand on. 0:40:25.400 --> 0:40:28.879 So yeah, if you're doing that on the corn Ferry Tour, 0:40:29.000 --> 0:40:32.239 you're you're going to the PGA Tour. Yeah, you're going 0:40:32.280 --> 0:40:34.640 to the challenging. I have a friend that's been on 0:40:34.680 --> 0:40:37.120 the corn Ferry Tour for six years running and he 0:40:37.360 --> 0:40:39.680 barely makes a living. Is like, what do you do. 0:40:39.760 --> 0:40:43.560 You're you're one or two good weeks away from being 0:40:43.600 --> 0:40:46.120 on the best tour in the world, but you're not 0:40:46.239 --> 0:40:48.879 in a you know, as you put it, a destination tour. 0:40:48.920 --> 0:40:51.479 And that's something that the PGA Tour has been very 0:40:51.920 --> 0:40:55.480 you know, reticent about, is keeping it the you know, 0:40:55.560 --> 0:40:59.880 prize money low in order to not make it that And. 0:41:00.239 --> 0:41:02.719 I think that's what we've got to look at. We've 0:41:02.760 --> 0:41:07.000 got to make We've got to make the APGA Tour 0:41:07.160 --> 0:41:11.720 a past group. The guys play five to seven years, 0:41:12.560 --> 0:41:16.520 get their cards, go to the corn Ferry, do something else. 0:41:16.800 --> 0:41:18.839 But we've got to make the mindset. And I tell 0:41:19.040 --> 0:41:21.560 the young people that get on the APGA Tour, I 0:41:21.560 --> 0:41:25.839 don't want to see you here past five years. Take 0:41:25.880 --> 0:41:29.000 the APGA Tour, take advantage of all the resources we 0:41:29.080 --> 0:41:32.520 have and then move on. And I think we've got 0:41:32.520 --> 0:41:36.440 to we've got to really hone that message and we've 0:41:36.440 --> 0:41:39.279 got to give the guys the resources to make sure 0:41:39.320 --> 0:41:41.640 that they're ready to make it to the next level. 0:41:42.600 --> 0:41:44.799 And that's the big challenge for me, is to give 0:41:44.840 --> 0:41:48.000 them all the resources they need and then get them 0:41:48.000 --> 0:41:49.920 to move on to the next level. 0:41:50.440 --> 0:41:54.120 How do you guys go about identifying players that are 0:41:54.239 --> 0:41:55.839 fit for the APGA Tour. 0:41:56.360 --> 0:42:02.000 Well, we have an application process that this year we 0:42:02.120 --> 0:42:06.880 turned away probably one hundred players that applied for membership 0:42:06.920 --> 0:42:10.520 on the APGA Tour. We feel like with our infrastructure 0:42:11.120 --> 0:42:17.160 that we could handle seventy members and then once you also, 0:42:17.239 --> 0:42:21.319 you know, we wea this year. A couple of years ago, 0:42:21.400 --> 0:42:24.839 we set a standard that you have to shoot a 0:42:24.840 --> 0:42:29.000 certain score in order to retain a membership. And you know, 0:42:29.040 --> 0:42:31.799 in the old days, we were fighting for people to 0:42:31.800 --> 0:42:36.160 play our tournaments. So you know, we had guys shooting 0:42:36.200 --> 0:42:41.279 eighty five ninety and we cut all that out, so 0:42:41.640 --> 0:42:44.160 you have to shoot a minimum score in order to 0:42:44.239 --> 0:42:49.480 play the APGA Tour and that's up the quality of 0:42:49.520 --> 0:42:52.439 the play and it's also reduced the number of people 0:42:52.560 --> 0:42:55.120 we have playing and we're okay with that because we 0:42:55.160 --> 0:42:56.319 want the quality to be. 0:42:56.280 --> 0:43:00.160 Where it is, I imagine. I mean you always see this, 0:43:00.280 --> 0:43:06.040 and with any sport where there's more money in the sport, 0:43:06.120 --> 0:43:09.520 you know, you get better athletes going there. I think 0:43:09.560 --> 0:43:13.080 that's something that's very true about golf in general with 0:43:13.239 --> 0:43:16.200 Tiger Woods. Have you seen a similar thing with the 0:43:16.239 --> 0:43:21.320 APGA and the quality of players interested in playing since 0:43:21.480 --> 0:43:23.799 you have had kind of a lot of success on 0:43:23.840 --> 0:43:26.399 the corporate and the perse side of things. 0:43:26.440 --> 0:43:29.040 Oh, definitely. I mean we have a number of guys 0:43:29.760 --> 0:43:33.799 now that would probably be playing basketball or baseball or 0:43:33.800 --> 0:43:36.960 something like that that would there are really really special athletes, 0:43:37.680 --> 0:43:40.360 and I think you see it in the swings and 0:43:41.640 --> 0:43:45.960 how they approach the play. I mean, these guys are athletes. 0:43:47.080 --> 0:43:49.960 But I think the next thing for us is the 0:43:50.000 --> 0:43:53.520 mental aspect of it. Kirk Triple, who plays on the 0:43:53.600 --> 0:43:55.759 Champions Tour, came out and watched our guys play and 0:43:55.760 --> 0:43:58.279 he said, they hit the ball. If you if you 0:43:59.760 --> 0:44:02.640 if person went out to a PGA Tour event and 0:44:02.680 --> 0:44:05.400 went to one of our events, they wouldn't be able 0:44:05.840 --> 0:44:08.360 to tell the difference in how guys hit balls. Because 0:44:08.400 --> 0:44:12.440 our guys can hit the ball. I think it's the 0:44:12.440 --> 0:44:14.799 The next evolution for us is did you know how 0:44:14.840 --> 0:44:19.080 you approach it? And we have a psychologist that works 0:44:19.120 --> 0:44:20.960 with our guys, and I think that's where we'll put 0:44:21.000 --> 0:44:24.560 a lot of resources, you know, getting top level coaching, 0:44:25.239 --> 0:44:28.120 talking to our guys about the mental aspect of it. 0:44:28.719 --> 0:44:28.919 Yeah. 0:44:28.960 --> 0:44:31.439 I mean, so much of golf as self belief, and 0:44:31.520 --> 0:44:34.319 so much of self belief just comes from being in 0:44:34.560 --> 0:44:38.560 big moments and achieving things, or not even achieving things, 0:44:38.600 --> 0:44:40.799 but being in the moment. And the only way you 0:44:40.840 --> 0:44:44.959 get there is with opportunities. Going back to we talked 0:44:45.000 --> 0:44:48.399 a little bit about junior golf and development. How how 0:44:48.480 --> 0:44:55.040 can the junior game and how we as a golf 0:44:55.080 --> 0:45:00.520 ecosystem develop and identify players improve and really I think 0:45:00.600 --> 0:45:02.960 like fun players. We talked a little bit about tennis, 0:45:03.040 --> 0:45:07.759 the idea of when somebody shows promise and putting economic 0:45:07.800 --> 0:45:09.239 support behind them. 0:45:09.600 --> 0:45:11.360 Yeah, I think we got to get to that point. 0:45:12.360 --> 0:45:15.719 I think we have to. We have to. We have 0:45:15.800 --> 0:45:19.200 to start the kids early when they start to show promise. 0:45:20.360 --> 0:45:22.960 The Cameron Chanp Foundation does a really good job at that. 0:45:23.400 --> 0:45:26.839 They they really do a great job of identifying the 0:45:26.880 --> 0:45:31.040 top minority talent in the country. Jeff Champ has a 0:45:31.120 --> 0:45:35.320 database and he tracks all those kids. So I think, 0:45:35.880 --> 0:45:39.319 you know, the next step for us is, now that 0:45:39.400 --> 0:45:42.920 we've identified those kids, is to provide the resources for 0:45:43.040 --> 0:45:48.000 them again like tennis does, so a kid won't have 0:45:48.160 --> 0:45:50.960 to drop out of golf because they can't afford to play. 0:45:51.840 --> 0:45:55.160 You know that, that to me is one of the 0:45:55.320 --> 0:45:59.799 if you talk about one of the things that disappoints 0:45:59.880 --> 0:46:04.600 me most about golf, and in our time at the APGA, 0:46:04.760 --> 0:46:08.040 I think of a guy like Josh Wooding. Josh Wooding 0:46:08.160 --> 0:46:13.319 was an All American at SC, did really well out 0:46:13.360 --> 0:46:17.160 on the Mini Tours initially and just ran out of money. 0:46:17.840 --> 0:46:20.520 You know, at twenty nine years old, just ran out 0:46:20.560 --> 0:46:23.560 of money. Couldn't He had to give the game up. 0:46:23.680 --> 0:46:27.640 And he's doing really well as a stockbroker. But if 0:46:27.680 --> 0:46:30.120 you ask him, I think he would still love to 0:46:30.160 --> 0:46:33.480 go back and play, and I would want to. I 0:46:33.520 --> 0:46:36.600 don't want in the future guys to say I had 0:46:36.640 --> 0:46:39.479 to give up because I didn't have the money. I'd 0:46:39.520 --> 0:46:42.240 like for them to say I'm gonna leave the game 0:46:42.440 --> 0:46:47.520 knowing I had the resources, I had the opportunity, I 0:46:47.680 --> 0:46:50.439 just didn't make it and I'm gonna go to something else. 0:46:50.520 --> 0:46:53.400 I don't want him to say that money and resources 0:46:53.880 --> 0:46:55.640 were the reason why they left the game. 0:46:56.520 --> 0:47:00.439 I think that applies to every level of golf, too, right. 0:47:00.760 --> 0:47:04.600 I think you think about anybody that watched the Netflix 0:47:04.640 --> 0:47:09.040 show The Full Swing. They talked in detail about Tony 0:47:09.080 --> 0:47:12.799 Finow and the sacrifices his family made just for him 0:47:12.800 --> 0:47:15.080 to be able to afford to play tournament golf. I mean, 0:47:15.120 --> 0:47:18.520 you think about, you know, what goes into tournament golf 0:47:19.080 --> 0:47:22.960 as a junior, and you know that that's where you 0:47:23.000 --> 0:47:26.319 get recognized and where you get the opportunity to move 0:47:26.320 --> 0:47:29.959 in play at college a college program. And the better 0:47:30.080 --> 0:47:32.680 you play in these tournaments that are you know, terms 0:47:32.719 --> 0:47:35.160 you have to travel to that cost money to get into, 0:47:35.560 --> 0:47:38.040 costs money to travel to. The better you play at 0:47:38.080 --> 0:47:41.360 those tournaments, the better chance you have of playing at 0:47:41.400 --> 0:47:44.600 a better program that will continue to prepare you. I 0:47:44.600 --> 0:47:48.760 mean it's a stepping stone type of uh, you know, pursuit, 0:47:48.960 --> 0:47:53.319 you know, and the toughest thing about anything. And I 0:47:53.360 --> 0:47:57.480 think it's becoming greater. The burden is the financial burden 0:47:57.600 --> 0:48:02.160 of junior and amateur and professional golf is just becoming 0:48:02.200 --> 0:48:06.600 more and more difficult as the tournaments get further away 0:48:06.960 --> 0:48:10.120 and bigger and have a bigger entry fee. 0:48:10.680 --> 0:48:13.840 Right, No, I agree with you. I do think that 0:48:13.920 --> 0:48:20.440 there's there's a recognition that there is this barrier, and 0:48:20.480 --> 0:48:23.160 I think people are trying to knock the barrier down. 0:48:23.920 --> 0:48:29.120 It's just not coming down fast enough for us. You know, 0:48:29.200 --> 0:48:33.600 we're we're trying our best. But you know, you again, 0:48:33.719 --> 0:48:38.719 you got to go back to it's not only resources, 0:48:38.760 --> 0:48:43.320 financial resources, it's opportunity to I think you've got to 0:48:43.360 --> 0:48:47.239 get these guys have to have the top level coaching. 0:48:47.960 --> 0:48:50.480 They have to have the opportunity to play on the 0:48:50.560 --> 0:48:53.560 great golf course, to practice on great golf course, because 0:48:53.560 --> 0:48:56.440 you can't. You can't expect somebody to make it to 0:48:56.480 --> 0:49:00.359 the PGA who are practicing a first t courses. You know, 0:49:00.440 --> 0:49:03.760 you can't if they don't have the proper equipment. Sean 0:49:03.800 --> 0:49:08.080 Foley was telling us that, you know, PGA tour guys, 0:49:08.160 --> 0:49:11.840 they changed their wedges almost every month, you know, because 0:49:11.880 --> 0:49:15.600 there's they've factored in that if you got new wedges, 0:49:16.280 --> 0:49:20.560 you know, you could be so much more precise. And 0:49:20.640 --> 0:49:23.719 so our guys had had wedges five six years old, 0:49:24.400 --> 0:49:26.799 so you can't ask them to compete with guys that 0:49:26.840 --> 0:49:29.440 are that have brand new wedges. So I think all 0:49:29.480 --> 0:49:31.800 those things come into play. 0:49:32.640 --> 0:49:35.920 Yeah, you know, you made a great point too about courses. 0:49:36.080 --> 0:49:39.839 I I remember as a kid, you know, qualifying for 0:49:40.120 --> 0:49:44.120 the state tournaments, Like qualifying for a State Am. One 0:49:44.160 --> 0:49:46.440 of the most exciting things was you knew it was 0:49:46.480 --> 0:49:48.920 going to be held at a big time course. And 0:49:49.440 --> 0:49:52.480 as somebody who grew up at Lake Bluff Golf Club, 0:49:52.640 --> 0:49:55.120 a UNI that didn't have like the best, it didn't 0:49:55.120 --> 0:49:58.200 have good dreams. You know, they were spongy, they were slow. 0:49:58.920 --> 0:50:01.360 There was always like a shock when you went to 0:50:01.400 --> 0:50:04.760 these courses at the pace, at the speed of the game. 0:50:05.160 --> 0:50:07.520 I mean, I think, like we've talked a lot about tennis, 0:50:07.560 --> 0:50:10.320 I imagine when you move up a level in tennis, 0:50:10.400 --> 0:50:12.800 the biggest thing that's to struggle is the speed of 0:50:12.840 --> 0:50:16.239 the game, the athletes, the pace, the balls. Coming back 0:50:16.520 --> 0:50:20.160 with golf, it is it is a big step up 0:50:20.239 --> 0:50:23.279 when you go and play a State Am. It's a 0:50:23.280 --> 0:50:25.879 bigger step up when you go and play a US 0:50:25.960 --> 0:50:28.840 AM or US Midam. Just the pace, the setup of 0:50:28.880 --> 0:50:31.719 the golf course. And it goes back to you know, 0:50:32.000 --> 0:50:35.280 these club like even at the State Golf Association level, 0:50:35.600 --> 0:50:40.120 these clubs opening their doors and providing opportunities to play 0:50:40.200 --> 0:50:44.440 at the venues that could host you know, big tournaments 0:50:44.480 --> 0:50:49.439 for kids like ajor, Oh, a junior am at a 0:50:49.480 --> 0:50:52.400 state level being held at a very good golf course 0:50:52.680 --> 0:50:55.839 is important because it gives you know, a kid an 0:50:55.840 --> 0:50:59.360 opportunity to go play high level golf and understand the 0:50:59.440 --> 0:51:02.120 difference that they're going to see it and if they 0:51:02.160 --> 0:51:04.920 want to play a college at a college level, the 0:51:05.000 --> 0:51:07.560 difference in golf course they're going to see. Right. It 0:51:07.560 --> 0:51:09.960 allows them to go play, get their you know, they 0:51:10.000 --> 0:51:12.200 might get their ass kicked, but they come back and 0:51:12.239 --> 0:51:14.840 they go, oh, because this is the way golf works. 0:51:14.960 --> 0:51:16.640 You play a tournament, you get your ass kicked, and 0:51:16.719 --> 0:51:18.640 you're like, oh, I need to get better at X, 0:51:18.760 --> 0:51:21.160 Y and Z. But if you're never given an opportunity, 0:51:21.760 --> 0:51:24.520 then you don't get those learning experiences. 0:51:25.000 --> 0:51:27.120 Oh no, I agree with you. I I you know, 0:51:27.320 --> 0:51:33.279 if you if you play Chester and practice every day 0:51:33.320 --> 0:51:35.680 at a place like Chester and then you go and 0:51:35.760 --> 0:51:40.640 play Baltish roll, yeah, you know, it's like a whole 0:51:40.680 --> 0:51:44.080 different world. And the thing that was interesting about our 0:51:44.120 --> 0:51:47.480 guys at Tory Pines, they didn't get a chance to 0:51:47.480 --> 0:51:49.200 play a practice round all the South course. 0:51:50.040 --> 0:51:54.000 You're playing PGA Tour conditions too, which like people, I mean, 0:51:54.080 --> 0:51:57.239 it is it's insane what regular rough is for them. 0:51:58.480 --> 0:52:03.560 And then it was rainy and cold and wendy, and 0:52:03.680 --> 0:52:05.800 you play in a golf course you've never seen before. 0:52:06.480 --> 0:52:09.280 It's so it was a it was an eye opener. 0:52:09.440 --> 0:52:12.239 And so you know, some people say, you know, what 0:52:13.400 --> 0:52:16.600 was it beneficial given that the guys couldn't play a 0:52:16.640 --> 0:52:19.080 practice around. I said, yeah, it's totally. So you know, 0:52:19.160 --> 0:52:22.040 you get that that experience, you'll play better. You just 0:52:22.160 --> 0:52:26.840 want more experiences just playing in those kind of conditions. 0:52:27.200 --> 0:52:30.439 So let's uh kind of on the way out here. 0:52:30.719 --> 0:52:33.000 What who are a few players that you're you know, 0:52:33.080 --> 0:52:37.200 really excited about maybe from their just their personal story. 0:52:37.280 --> 0:52:40.919 You've talked about Tim and Kevin and uh Willie Mack. 0:52:41.000 --> 0:52:42.799 But you know a few players that are you know, 0:52:42.880 --> 0:52:46.600 on the tour now that you're either really excited about 0:52:46.640 --> 0:52:49.600 from their personal standpoint or from just the play the 0:52:49.680 --> 0:52:50.680 level of play you've seen. 0:52:51.520 --> 0:52:55.360 Well, I think that the main guy this year who's 0:52:55.440 --> 0:53:00.480 kind of dominated play is Marcus Bird. I mean Marcus 0:53:00.040 --> 0:53:04.520 he is one of the most talented guys. You'll see 0:53:04.719 --> 0:53:08.799 he hits the ball long. He's got great hands. He 0:53:08.920 --> 0:53:13.040 became a YouTube sensation at Tory Pines on a par 0:53:13.200 --> 0:53:15.680 five he was too eighty out, had to go over 0:53:15.800 --> 0:53:18.440 water and hit a driver off the deck to ten feet. 0:53:20.200 --> 0:53:22.560 That's the kind of guy he is. He's I think 0:53:22.560 --> 0:53:24.920 he's got to tone some of that down because you 0:53:24.920 --> 0:53:27.000 don't want to hit a driver off the deck over 0:53:27.120 --> 0:53:31.839 water too often. But he's just a really talented guy. 0:53:31.880 --> 0:53:36.239 He's won four times this year. Chase Johnson is another one. 0:53:36.360 --> 0:53:38.560 Chase was on the corn Ferry Tour for a couple 0:53:38.560 --> 0:53:44.160 of years, had some injuries and just lost his confidence. 0:53:45.520 --> 0:53:47.840 He's won a couple of times on our tour. Really 0:53:47.920 --> 0:53:50.960 talented guy, really really talented. He won the John Shipping 0:53:51.040 --> 0:53:54.879 as well. He's a guy that I think we will 0:53:54.960 --> 0:53:58.480 be back on the corn Ferry Tour next year. Just 0:53:58.520 --> 0:54:03.240 a really talented guy. And then you you look at 0:54:03.440 --> 0:54:06.839 you know our a pg A collegiate guys. Uh Tory 0:54:07.000 --> 0:54:10.040 Taylor out of Michigan State. He was the number one 0:54:10.080 --> 0:54:14.840 guy in our a pg A Collegiate rankings. Really talented 0:54:14.880 --> 0:54:18.120 guy is His dad was a point four year starter 0:54:18.719 --> 0:54:23.399 at Point guard for Ohio State when Clark Kellogg was there. 0:54:23.480 --> 0:54:26.920 So he's from an athletic family. He's going to be 0:54:26.960 --> 0:54:29.200 a really good player, somebody you really need to keep 0:54:29.200 --> 0:54:32.520 an eye on. So they're there are a number of 0:54:32.600 --> 0:54:35.520 young guys out there, and I'm so impressed with the 0:54:35.600 --> 0:54:40.840 young guys. Roman Solomon's a young kid who's actually Bobby 0:54:40.840 --> 0:54:45.320 Bernia's son. Yeah, so he's playing at Peple. 0:54:45.680 --> 0:54:49.080 Bobby is still getting that uh that contract. I always. 0:54:50.320 --> 0:54:53.080 Bobby will be there, Bobby, and you know, Bobby has 0:54:53.840 --> 0:54:58.600 is so invested in his son's golf career that Bobby 0:54:58.680 --> 0:55:01.799 goes to every single tournament that his kid plays in. 0:55:01.920 --> 0:55:05.200 And Bobby's right there. Doug walk as well as he 0:55:05.320 --> 0:55:08.239 used to from all those home run trots he had. 0:55:09.880 --> 0:55:12.800 But but your Roman Solomon is a good young player. 0:55:13.120 --> 0:55:16.560 You'll we'll see how he competes with the pros. But 0:55:16.680 --> 0:55:19.920 he's sixteen years old. He's going to be a really 0:55:19.960 --> 0:55:22.120 really good player. So you'll get a chance to see 0:55:22.200 --> 0:55:23.400 him mentor at Pebble. 0:55:23.880 --> 0:55:28.520 Awesome. Awesome, that's great. And then last question, how can 0:55:28.560 --> 0:55:32.800 people help? What? What? What's the way just a regular 0:55:33.120 --> 0:55:36.279 guy can help? And how can somebody else help? The 0:55:36.360 --> 0:55:37.480 APGA in any way. 0:55:37.880 --> 0:55:39.759 Well, I think there's a few ways. Of course, we 0:55:39.800 --> 0:55:43.680 always need money. You can go to APGA tour dot 0:55:43.760 --> 0:55:48.640 org and make a donation. We need we need financial resources, 0:55:49.239 --> 0:55:52.359 but we also need volunteers at all our tournaments. We 0:55:52.440 --> 0:55:56.439 need volunteer scores, We need people to come and help 0:55:56.480 --> 0:55:58.799 out in a variety of ways. And you can go 0:55:58.840 --> 0:56:01.239 to our website and find out the different ways you 0:56:01.239 --> 0:56:06.000 can volunteer. And the other way that I think is 0:56:06.120 --> 0:56:09.640 equally as important as the financial resources and to volunteer 0:56:09.920 --> 0:56:12.920 is when you see one of our guys, just tell 0:56:12.960 --> 0:56:15.320 them that you believe in them. Just tell them that 0:56:15.920 --> 0:56:19.160 you know you're there supporting them, that you you want 0:56:19.239 --> 0:56:22.040 them to do well. All too often our guys don't 0:56:22.040 --> 0:56:25.360 hear that, you know. So what I do as often 0:56:25.400 --> 0:56:28.439 as I can, as I tell the guys I want 0:56:28.480 --> 0:56:32.080 to see you successful. I'm going to put all whatever 0:56:32.200 --> 0:56:35.840 resources I have to make you successful because I believe 0:56:35.880 --> 0:56:40.440 in you. And if you can do that, if a 0:56:40.520 --> 0:56:44.000 person sees an APGA Tour player and they can just 0:56:44.160 --> 0:56:49.480 say something inspirational to them, that something's just as simple 0:56:49.520 --> 0:56:52.360 as I believe in you, I think that's as important 0:56:52.360 --> 0:56:55.560 to us as the money and the time spent volunteering. 0:56:56.520 --> 0:56:58.680 Yeah, and I think a lot of people listen to 0:56:58.760 --> 0:57:02.239 this or just golf nuts. I imagine that just just 0:57:02.360 --> 0:57:06.000 following along and and and being a fan is a 0:57:06.000 --> 0:57:09.680 lot too. Just you know, every tour needs more fans. 0:57:10.080 --> 0:57:12.280 Right, we could use more fans, that's for sure. 0:57:12.840 --> 0:57:15.439 All Right, Thanks so much, Ken for coming on and 0:57:15.520 --> 0:57:18.840 uh and and I look forward to uh following along 0:57:18.920 --> 0:57:21.840 as as your as the APGA continues to grow and 0:57:21.960 --> 0:57:25.960 UH and become more and more household name in golf. 0:57:26.520 --> 0:57:28.680 Well, thanks for having me on and thanks for what 0:57:28.720 --> 0:57:31.800 you're doing for golf. I think you know your podcast 0:57:31.960 --> 0:57:35.520 and and just the work you're doing helps to grow 0:57:35.600 --> 0:57:38.760 the game and helps all of us that are involved 0:57:38.760 --> 0:57:39.320 in this game. 0:57:40.720 --> 0:57:43.520 All Right, that's it for Ken. Let's jump in with 0:57:43.800 --> 0:57:56.000 Aaron Beverly. All right, Aaron, I got to ask, you know, 0:57:56.360 --> 0:57:59.440 we when we met last year, we were talking about 0:57:59.440 --> 0:58:02.560 the hope of the Kings. It was it was kind of, uh, 0:58:03.120 --> 0:58:05.720 we weren't sure they were scratch of the surface. They 0:58:05.760 --> 0:58:09.520 obviously had an incredible season. I became kind of a 0:58:10.280 --> 0:58:13.040 fake Kings fan when I moved out to California, but 0:58:13.520 --> 0:58:17.960 a fan nonetheless, tell me what are your expectations. Do 0:58:18.000 --> 0:58:21.000 you just feel an exuberant about the Kings that you 0:58:21.040 --> 0:58:22.960 haven't felt in a long time. 0:58:23.400 --> 0:58:26.400 Yeah, I think the best part of last year I 0:58:26.440 --> 0:58:29.400 went to Game one against the Warriors in the playoffs, 0:58:29.480 --> 0:58:33.400 and I've never seen so many people just downtown around 0:58:33.760 --> 0:58:36.920 the arena and just the energy, like I don't think 0:58:36.960 --> 0:58:39.280 any of us sat down the whole first quarter. I mean, 0:58:39.320 --> 0:58:43.320 the introduction was great. So it's it's awesome to see. 0:58:43.480 --> 0:58:47.120 My expectations for him this season is to take another step, 0:58:47.240 --> 0:58:50.400 you know, leap forward. I want to seize the bonus, 0:58:50.400 --> 0:58:52.640 play a little bit better in the playoffs, try to 0:58:52.720 --> 0:58:54.160 sert his dominance a little bit more. 0:58:54.240 --> 0:58:54.400 So. 0:58:55.560 --> 0:58:57.640 I don't want to go as far as Western Conference 0:58:57.720 --> 0:58:59.919 finals because that's that might be a stretch, but death 0:59:00.040 --> 0:59:02.440 playing into the second round of the playoffs at least. 0:59:02.640 --> 0:59:05.919 Yeah. Yeah, I feel like they were the feel good 0:59:05.960 --> 0:59:09.840 story the NBA last year and they were just like 0:59:10.000 --> 0:59:12.440 I couldn't believe how fun they were to watch. And 0:59:12.840 --> 0:59:16.240 I think there's like an added level of as corny 0:59:16.280 --> 0:59:18.960 as the light the beam is, it adds this like 0:59:19.120 --> 0:59:21.960 level of fun and energy in the stadium. I mean 0:59:22.000 --> 0:59:24.640 that's the thing about that that I got to get 0:59:24.680 --> 0:59:28.640 out to a game this year. I was really kind 0:59:28.680 --> 0:59:31.600 of upset with myself that I didn't make it out 0:59:31.600 --> 0:59:34.320 to a game this year or last year. But this 0:59:34.440 --> 0:59:36.439 year I'm going to remedy that and play a little 0:59:36.440 --> 0:59:38.760 golf in Sacramento while I'm out there there. 0:59:38.800 --> 0:59:40.440 You go, just give me a call. We'll go golf 0:59:40.480 --> 0:59:42.440 and then go to a game afterwards. Because it is 0:59:43.000 --> 0:59:45.160 the light the Bean champs when they start in the 0:59:45.200 --> 0:59:47.840 fourth quarter. And whether it was at home or whether 0:59:47.880 --> 0:59:49.600 it was on the road, I mean, it just it 0:59:49.680 --> 0:59:52.880 was awesome to see just the whole city finally come 0:59:52.920 --> 0:59:54.840 around and just have something to cheer for, you know, 0:59:54.880 --> 0:59:57.520 and a winning team cheerfo because Sacramento fans have always 0:59:57.520 --> 1:00:00.520 been loyal, we just haven't always had the teams to 1:00:00.760 --> 1:00:03.200 you know, be proud of. So it's great to see. 1:00:03.480 --> 1:00:05.680 One question, how far could you see the beam? 1:00:06.160 --> 1:00:06.280 Like? 1:00:06.440 --> 1:00:07.080 Could you see it? 1:00:07.160 --> 1:00:07.320 Oh? 1:00:07.400 --> 1:00:10.400 You like across the city on a clear night. 1:00:10.560 --> 1:00:14.080 You can probably see if you're driving from Davis, which 1:00:14.120 --> 1:00:17.280 is about fifteen to twenty miles, Yeah, you can see 1:00:17.320 --> 1:00:19.880 it from a long way. Yeah, So it's you can 1:00:19.920 --> 1:00:21.880 see any part if you're in Sacramento. You can see 1:00:21.880 --> 1:00:23.280 it anywhere you're at, that's for sure. 1:00:23.920 --> 1:00:26.840 Hey, I was reading some articles about you, and uh, 1:00:27.120 --> 1:00:30.560 I came. I stumbled across You're you're really into ballet 1:00:30.640 --> 1:00:31.280 as a kid. 1:00:32.000 --> 1:00:33.320 Yeah, yeah, really into l. 1:00:33.320 --> 1:00:36.280 A how'd you get into it? And and what you know? 1:00:36.400 --> 1:00:39.439 Like what's being into ballet mean? 1:00:40.440 --> 1:00:40.520 Like? 1:00:40.640 --> 1:00:41.720 What what does that mean? 1:00:42.320 --> 1:00:42.520 Yeah? 1:00:42.560 --> 1:00:46.480 So it started my mom was dancing, uh, And she 1:00:46.600 --> 1:00:48.440 ended up taking me to class when I was three. 1:00:48.760 --> 1:00:51.000 And the way she tells the story is, for like 1:00:51.040 --> 1:00:53.280 the first thirty minutes, I was doing really well, and 1:00:53.280 --> 1:00:55.240 then for the last thirty minutes I just sat there 1:00:55.240 --> 1:00:58.959 and cried. So bless her heart, she ended up taking 1:00:58.960 --> 1:01:01.520 me back to the next line, and I just end 1:01:01.640 --> 1:01:04.280 up falling in love with just dancing in general. So 1:01:04.760 --> 1:01:07.040 I was dancing around the stores, dancing around the house, 1:01:07.240 --> 1:01:09.880 just kind of You couldn't like really stop me from dancing. 1:01:09.920 --> 1:01:13.840 So ballet was something I did from three to about seventeen. 1:01:15.120 --> 1:01:17.720 It was a lot of fun. I got made for 1:01:18.240 --> 1:01:20.360 made fun of for it in high school, which is, 1:01:20.680 --> 1:01:24.520 you know, it just makes you tougher. But I enjoyed it. 1:01:24.560 --> 1:01:26.720 It taught me a lot about discipline, you know, gave 1:01:26.760 --> 1:01:31.400 me flexibility and just I think it translated perfectly into 1:01:31.400 --> 1:01:33.680 golf and kind of just athletics in general, because you 1:01:33.760 --> 1:01:38.040 have so much body awareness and body control, which is great. 1:01:38.280 --> 1:01:41.040 And yeah, I'm very thankful for my time doing it 1:01:41.080 --> 1:01:43.120 and still love to do it when I have time. 1:01:43.520 --> 1:01:46.680 Yeah, you kind of answered my next question is I 1:01:47.520 --> 1:01:50.400 think like we've gotten into this space with athletics just 1:01:50.440 --> 1:01:53.720 in general, where everybody wants to specialize in things at 1:01:53.760 --> 1:01:56.400 a really young age. And when I read that, I 1:01:56.440 --> 1:01:59.640 was thinking, I was like, God, what a great activity, 1:02:00.160 --> 1:02:02.600 Like you never think about it, but like that's a 1:02:02.640 --> 1:02:06.480 great activity for golf because of the balance and as 1:02:06.520 --> 1:02:10.920 you said, balance, flexibility, body control. I imagine that there 1:02:10.960 --> 1:02:15.479 are just so many your body has, just muscles and 1:02:16.120 --> 1:02:18.360 the ability to do things that other people can't. 1:02:18.720 --> 1:02:18.919 Yeah. 1:02:19.000 --> 1:02:21.680 I always say core strength is a big one, and 1:02:21.720 --> 1:02:25.240 obviously leg strength is huge. Obviously when you're jumping in 1:02:25.280 --> 1:02:27.320 ballet and you're trying to get as high as possible 1:02:27.360 --> 1:02:29.760 and you're doing pure wets and you're trying to turn 1:02:29.800 --> 1:02:32.640 as much as possible, you know, you're using muscles that 1:02:33.240 --> 1:02:36.760 like most athletes wouldn't think about, or most people wouldn't 1:02:36.760 --> 1:02:40.360 think about. So it's one of those things that at 1:02:40.360 --> 1:02:41.920 the time when I was doing as a kid and 1:02:41.960 --> 1:02:44.920 as a teenager, really wasn't conscious about, oh, this is 1:02:44.960 --> 1:02:46.680 going to help me further down the line of my 1:02:46.760 --> 1:02:49.200 golf swing. I just did because I loved it. But 1:02:49.320 --> 1:02:51.280 looking back on it, it's definitely one of those things 1:02:51.280 --> 1:02:53.160 that's for sure has had its benefits. 1:02:53.600 --> 1:02:56.280 Did you do Did you play any other sports growing 1:02:56.360 --> 1:02:59.840 up other than golf? In ballet or. 1:03:00.160 --> 1:03:02.080 Yeah, played basketball, played baseball. 1:03:02.200 --> 1:03:04.000 Do they consider a sport ballet? 1:03:04.400 --> 1:03:06.959 It should be consider an art form art form because 1:03:06.960 --> 1:03:10.360 there's no so sports is always a competition. The ballet 1:03:10.400 --> 1:03:12.800 is no real competition. You're just performing. So I just 1:03:12.920 --> 1:03:14.040 got to just go to art form. 1:03:14.200 --> 1:03:17.520 Okay, physical physically is. 1:03:17.560 --> 1:03:20.360 By far the hardest thing I ever did. Like the 1:03:20.400 --> 1:03:23.080 summer intensives where you were dancing for six hours a day. 1:03:23.120 --> 1:03:25.960 That like that beats thirty six holes in one day 1:03:25.960 --> 1:03:27.440 in golf without question? 1:03:28.440 --> 1:03:30.280 What what your you to golf from? 1:03:30.480 --> 1:03:30.720 Uh? 1:03:30.840 --> 1:03:33.320 Compared to other sports? What? What was the thing that 1:03:33.400 --> 1:03:36.160 made you want to play golf in college and pursue 1:03:36.160 --> 1:03:37.000 it as a profession. 1:03:37.440 --> 1:03:40.720 I didn't have to rely on teammates for my success, 1:03:41.480 --> 1:03:44.720 and because When I played baseball, I was a pitcher 1:03:44.760 --> 1:03:48.200 and a shortstop, and you know, I'm not to brag 1:03:48.280 --> 1:03:50.600 of one of the better players on the team, and 1:03:50.840 --> 1:03:53.320 I could do all I could and we could still lose, 1:03:53.720 --> 1:03:57.160 and so that was always just frustrating, and so I 1:03:57.160 --> 1:04:00.320 didn't want to have to rely on my success being 1:04:00.360 --> 1:04:02.880 determined by other people. So that's what I love about 1:04:02.880 --> 1:04:06.439 golf is it's all on me and obviously caddy and coach, 1:04:06.520 --> 1:04:07.600 but at the end of the day, I'm the one 1:04:07.680 --> 1:04:10.280 hitting the shots and you know, hitting putts. So I 1:04:10.920 --> 1:04:12.720 just love the individualism of it. 1:04:13.440 --> 1:04:16.360 I feel like when you get more the more players 1:04:16.640 --> 1:04:20.920 are involved in a sport, the less an individual impact 1:04:21.120 --> 1:04:24.760 can have. Like, right, yeah, you know football, for example, 1:04:24.800 --> 1:04:27.480 you could have a really good football team and no 1:04:28.080 --> 1:04:32.560 real superstar you could have, But then you get into 1:04:32.680 --> 1:04:36.320 like the NBA, and and if you don't have one 1:04:36.360 --> 1:04:39.880 of the guys you got no. Yes, it's like the 1:04:39.920 --> 1:04:43.919 difference between five guys and a fifty three man roster, right, 1:04:44.040 --> 1:04:47.560 Like it's just amazing. And then obviously golf is in 1:04:47.680 --> 1:04:51.640 tennis or the two real you know, big individual sports, 1:04:51.680 --> 1:04:55.360 and it's I always fight it humorous. When I was 1:04:55.400 --> 1:04:58.080 watching a lot of US Open tennis recently. How like, 1:04:58.560 --> 1:05:00.840 you know, they got their coach is in the box, 1:05:01.120 --> 1:05:03.520 you know, and this guy's like yelling at their coaches. 1:05:03.600 --> 1:05:06.000 Is like, what are they yelling about? They're the ones 1:05:06.080 --> 1:05:07.400 getting the shots, you know. 1:05:07.720 --> 1:05:10.960 Yeah, And I like my example, I used this the 1:05:11.000 --> 1:05:13.320 other day, was I would hate to be show hey 1:05:13.360 --> 1:05:16.160 Otani and be by far the greatest player of a 1:05:16.280 --> 1:05:19.760 generation and we can't ever win. Like that would just 1:05:19.880 --> 1:05:26.040 really frustrate me. So I, yeah, golf is Mike Trout too, yep, 1:05:26.080 --> 1:05:28.160 and still can't We got two of the best players 1:05:28.160 --> 1:05:29.200 in the league, can't win. 1:05:29.640 --> 1:05:31.960 I mean, like that's what everybody was saying about Mike 1:05:32.000 --> 1:05:35.640 Trout before Otani, was like this is this might be 1:05:35.680 --> 1:05:39.000 the best baseball player we see for decades, and then 1:05:39.040 --> 1:05:41.880 Otani comes along on the safe team and they still stick. 1:05:42.400 --> 1:05:44.680 Yeah, still can't win. That reminds me I was a 1:05:44.760 --> 1:05:46.520 kid and we had Barry Bonds and Jeff Canton. We 1:05:46.560 --> 1:05:48.360 still I mean, we got to World Series, but we 1:05:48.360 --> 1:05:50.560 couldn't win. So it just, yeah, frustrating. 1:05:51.720 --> 1:05:54.480 So you played golf at and Sacramento State. You had 1:05:54.480 --> 1:05:57.800 a really good career there. Your two time Conference Player 1:05:57.840 --> 1:06:01.440 of the year. What's your favorite colle golf story or 1:06:01.480 --> 1:06:03.600 one that you think when do you think about a lot? 1:06:04.000 --> 1:06:06.360 Oh, I got two. I got too because this first 1:06:06.400 --> 1:06:10.480 one I brought up the other day. We replaced my 1:06:10.680 --> 1:06:15.200 sophomore year playing at Washington State's home tournament at Polose Ridge. 1:06:15.800 --> 1:06:18.960 And it's my seventy first hole and I think I'm 1:06:19.000 --> 1:06:21.400 like five or six underd a tournament like seeking in 1:06:21.480 --> 1:06:24.160 the top ten somewhere, and I had this downhill putt. 1:06:24.160 --> 1:06:26.760 It's like twenty feet and my parents are off watching, 1:06:26.920 --> 1:06:29.840 kind of like twenty thirty yards away. Hit the putt, 1:06:30.200 --> 1:06:33.440 race it by nine feet and my dad says it. 1:06:33.520 --> 1:06:36.200 He says, doesn't he know it's downhill? And he didn't 1:06:36.200 --> 1:06:37.880 realize that. He said it loud enough to where I 1:06:37.880 --> 1:06:40.080 could hear it, and so I looked at him. I 1:06:40.080 --> 1:06:42.280 was like, yes, I know it's downhill. I just hit 1:06:42.320 --> 1:06:45.080 it too hard. And then I made the comebacker and 1:06:45.120 --> 1:06:47.240 I was like, hey, see that one is just as good, 1:06:47.400 --> 1:06:49.240 and so we walked to the next hole of him 1:06:49.240 --> 1:06:52.320 and I were just laughing. So that's always just a 1:06:52.400 --> 1:06:55.400 fun memory. And then my other one was winning conference 1:06:55.480 --> 1:06:59.960 with my team's senior year. I ended up winning individual, 1:07:00.280 --> 1:07:02.640 and it was one of those rounds where I was 1:07:03.320 --> 1:07:06.840 leading going into it, and then a freshman from Northern Colorado, 1:07:07.280 --> 1:07:10.440 kolbe Welch, he couldn't miss a putt on the front nine, 1:07:10.760 --> 1:07:12.320 and I think he ended up taking like a three 1:07:12.360 --> 1:07:14.920 shot lead in every hole. I was just he'd make 1:07:14.960 --> 1:07:17.160 a twenty footer and he make a thirty footer and 1:07:17.200 --> 1:07:18.480 I looked at my dad. I'm like, is this going 1:07:18.520 --> 1:07:20.080 to continue all day? He's like, I don't know, but 1:07:20.120 --> 1:07:22.320 you're gonna need to start making birdies at some point. 1:07:23.040 --> 1:07:24.960 And so we get to the last hole and I 1:07:24.960 --> 1:07:28.600 had one shot lead. He hits it to thirty feet 1:07:28.640 --> 1:07:31.479 and I hit it to like seven, and he hits 1:07:31.480 --> 1:07:34.240 his putt on watching it, I'm like, that's thinner cut again, 1:07:34.440 --> 1:07:36.160 and he'd hit the back of the cup and it 1:07:36.200 --> 1:07:38.800 popped out, and I was just like, oh my god, 1:07:38.880 --> 1:07:41.760 this kid is unbelievable pudding. But thankfully, I think with 1:07:41.840 --> 1:07:43.600 just a two button win, we won as a team, 1:07:43.640 --> 1:07:45.800 and it was great because we had lost by two 1:07:45.800 --> 1:07:48.520 strokes the year before, so that that meant a lot. 1:07:49.000 --> 1:07:51.720 There's uh, there's nothing worse than when you're playing with 1:07:51.760 --> 1:07:55.800 somebody and like and you just you just like expect 1:07:55.840 --> 1:07:58.120 every putt to go in and then hitting putts like 1:07:58.160 --> 1:08:02.040 it's rolling, especially what you get in match plight situations, 1:08:02.120 --> 1:08:04.160 like oh yeah, well you're just terrified. 1:08:06.720 --> 1:08:08.880 I'm just sitting there because I kept hitting good shots 1:08:08.920 --> 1:08:11.280 and he ended up making birdies and I'm like, wow, 1:08:11.360 --> 1:08:14.200 this is incredible. But yeah, that was That was a 1:08:14.240 --> 1:08:14.720 lot of fun. 1:08:15.200 --> 1:08:18.120 When did you decide that you wanted to pursue professional 1:08:18.160 --> 1:08:20.639 golf as a as a career. 1:08:21.200 --> 1:08:24.320 Oh, it was probably about six or seven, somewhere in there. 1:08:24.760 --> 1:08:28.360 We watched Tiger. I mean every weekend, every Sunday, we'd 1:08:28.720 --> 1:08:31.040 played golf in the morning, played with nine holes and 1:08:31.120 --> 1:08:34.280 a little short course that was like twenty minutes away. Thankfully, 1:08:34.360 --> 1:08:37.280 Tiger always had usually an afternoon tea time on Sundays, 1:08:37.320 --> 1:08:40.600 so so we come back, we have breakfast, we do 1:08:40.680 --> 1:08:43.200 some chores, and then sit down and couch and watch 1:08:43.240 --> 1:08:46.000 them for four or five hours. And just I remember 1:08:46.040 --> 1:08:49.120 being so captivated as a kid, just watching obviously the 1:08:49.160 --> 1:08:52.920 fist pumps and and everything about it, and I was like, Okay, 1:08:52.960 --> 1:08:54.639 I want to do that when I get older. 1:08:55.280 --> 1:08:58.360 Yeah. It's uh. I think that most people in our 1:08:58.760 --> 1:09:03.320 our age range and probably fall into the same bucket 1:09:03.479 --> 1:09:09.160 with with Tiger Woods being a driving inspiration and any 1:09:09.280 --> 1:09:12.559 level of golf that you played, and or you're just 1:09:12.640 --> 1:09:17.360 general interest in the game of golf. Do you have 1:09:17.960 --> 1:09:21.360 a favorite Tiger moment from your childhood? Is there something 1:09:21.400 --> 1:09:23.439 that sticks with you. I get a couple, and I'm 1:09:23.479 --> 1:09:24.840 just curious what yours are. 1:09:25.320 --> 1:09:28.759 Yeah, see, I got two again. So the first one. 1:09:29.160 --> 1:09:32.240 The first one is a lot like the corny story. 1:09:32.320 --> 1:09:35.400 But when he won the Masters in five and had 1:09:35.439 --> 1:09:39.320 the chip in on sixteen, we were watching it, and 1:09:39.360 --> 1:09:42.240 we watched the chip in and I was so excited 1:09:42.320 --> 1:09:46.360 watching that. And the way my home course, like Practice Green, 1:09:46.439 --> 1:09:49.599 was set up, had this huge slope, and so I 1:09:49.640 --> 1:09:52.240 went to the course, grabbed like five balls, and I 1:09:52.280 --> 1:09:55.400 sat trying to hit the same chip for probably three hours, 1:09:55.439 --> 1:09:57.559 and it wasn't good enough like rolled up the hill 1:09:57.560 --> 1:09:59.639 and wins the whole. It had to try to stop. 1:10:00.360 --> 1:10:02.439 And there's for three hours of sitting there trying to 1:10:02.439 --> 1:10:03.840 get the ball to stop on the lip, and I 1:10:03.840 --> 1:10:07.479 think I maybe did it kind of once. So I 1:10:07.600 --> 1:10:11.000 just remember that. And then the one that's like really 1:10:11.040 --> 1:10:14.280 minuscule that no one would really think about he was playing. 1:10:14.800 --> 1:10:17.840 I want to say this is seven or oh nine. 1:10:18.600 --> 1:10:21.240 He's playing at Firestone in the final round. He has 1:10:21.280 --> 1:10:25.160 a match or he's battling with Padrick Harrington, and I 1:10:25.160 --> 1:10:29.200 think it's either fifteen or sixteen Tiger. I think it's 1:10:29.240 --> 1:10:31.439 part five. Tiger's a good driving it's an eight irons 1:10:31.439 --> 1:10:33.799 to like two feet or a foot and a half, 1:10:33.880 --> 1:10:38.360 and Padrick's kind of some trouble. He hits a bad shot, 1:10:38.760 --> 1:10:40.679 then he hits it over the green, then he hits 1:10:40.680 --> 1:10:42.280 it into the water, then he's got to go take 1:10:42.280 --> 1:10:44.840 a drop and waved back in the fairway, and the 1:10:44.880 --> 1:10:46.960 whole time I'm thinking, oh, Tiger's just gonna tap him, 1:10:46.960 --> 1:10:48.479 but he's just standing on the edge of the green 1:10:48.600 --> 1:10:52.280 waiting for project to finish. And I think Padrick ends 1:10:52.360 --> 1:10:54.000 up making a seven or eight on the whole, and 1:10:54.040 --> 1:10:57.040 I just remember thinking, I'm like, wow, he just the 1:10:57.040 --> 1:11:00.600 intimidation that he put on him by hitting shot to 1:11:00.720 --> 1:11:02.760 two feet was incredible. And then I think I had 1:11:02.760 --> 1:11:06.160 a high school match, probably like a week later, two 1:11:06.200 --> 1:11:08.800 weeks later, and the same like type of situation happened 1:11:08.800 --> 1:11:11.240 where I hit a shot close and other kids off 1:11:11.320 --> 1:11:13.280 hitting it into the water and taking them drop and 1:11:13.360 --> 1:11:15.320 hitting it back and forth and he's like, man, you 1:11:15.320 --> 1:11:16.880 can go ahead and finish, and I said, no, I'll 1:11:16.960 --> 1:11:20.400 just wait, and so I just that's one of those things. 1:11:20.439 --> 1:11:22.120 And I don't know why that one sticks out in 1:11:22.160 --> 1:11:23.720 my head so much, but it was just one of 1:11:23.760 --> 1:11:26.000 those moments where I was like, Okay, this guy is 1:11:26.360 --> 1:11:29.840 really intimating to everybody he plays with and that's pretty 1:11:29.840 --> 1:11:30.360 cool to watch. 1:11:30.920 --> 1:11:34.560 Yeah, yeah, it's it's amazing. I'll never forget. I was 1:11:34.600 --> 1:11:37.280 watching live from that. I think it was Saturday night 1:11:37.439 --> 1:11:41.200 of the of the Masters that he won in twenty nineteen, 1:11:41.439 --> 1:11:45.439 and David duval everybody was making their picks on who 1:11:45.520 --> 1:11:47.519 was going to win, and David Duvall was just like 1:11:47.600 --> 1:11:50.720 tigers winning and they're like why, and he was like 1:11:50.880 --> 1:11:53.400 I saw the look in his eye and I haven't 1:11:53.439 --> 1:11:55.519 seen that look in his eye in a long time, 1:11:55.760 --> 1:11:58.080 and he's winning the tournament and it was just like 1:11:58.680 --> 1:12:02.320 it's like wild, Like it's just a wild thing when 1:12:02.439 --> 1:12:05.320 like a guy that was in the in the arena 1:12:05.400 --> 1:12:09.200 with them, Like I'll never forget that call because of 1:12:09.360 --> 1:12:13.200 like just the conviction and the way like everybody's got 1:12:13.280 --> 1:12:15.679 he is, like, you know, you're picking somebody to win 1:12:15.760 --> 1:12:17.880 you got these reasons just like I just saw it 1:12:17.880 --> 1:12:21.320 in his eye like I is you know, and I 1:12:21.400 --> 1:12:25.240 mean just intimidating, I dominant like there. It's just a 1:12:25.320 --> 1:12:28.799 crazy thing. It had to be a crazy experience, obviously, 1:12:28.800 --> 1:12:32.040 a crazy experience. Gave the Charlie Siffer exemption a few 1:12:32.080 --> 1:12:35.000 years ago into Genesis and then get to spend some 1:12:35.080 --> 1:12:37.760 time with Tiger. What was that? What was that? 1:12:37.920 --> 1:12:38.040 Like? 1:12:38.200 --> 1:12:38.960 Was it was? 1:12:38.720 --> 1:12:39.000 It? Was? 1:12:39.040 --> 1:12:44.160 It like just I explained to me, like the lead 1:12:44.240 --> 1:12:47.519 up of that and and then in the moment how 1:12:47.600 --> 1:12:48.040 that was. 1:12:48.920 --> 1:12:52.479 Yeah, So it was. It was interesting. So the week 1:12:52.560 --> 1:12:54.960 guys showed up. I got there on Sunday and then 1:12:55.040 --> 1:12:58.559 Monday I had to play in the Call of Jam 1:12:59.479 --> 1:13:01.439 in a group, and so I showed up to the 1:13:01.439 --> 1:13:04.240 course at like six o'clock and the guy kind of 1:13:04.320 --> 1:13:06.719 runs everything. Mike Antellini stopped me as I was walking 1:13:06.760 --> 1:13:09.000 to the range and he goes, hey, you know how 1:13:09.080 --> 1:13:11.880 we said you were going to do a little media 1:13:11.960 --> 1:13:16.080 session or interview. I said, yeah on Wednesday, right. He goes, yeah, 1:13:16.080 --> 1:13:17.559 I said, well you're gonna do that with Tiger now, 1:13:17.600 --> 1:13:20.840 I said what He's like, Yeah, it'll be the two 1:13:20.840 --> 1:13:23.040 of you at a panel and it'll probably take about 1:13:23.040 --> 1:13:24.720 an hour. I said, I you have to tell you 1:13:24.800 --> 1:13:27.799 this right now, said now the rest of Monday and Tuesday, 1:13:27.840 --> 1:13:30.760 I'm screwed because I can't think of anything else other 1:13:30.800 --> 1:13:34.360 than having to sit in front of cameras and on 1:13:34.400 --> 1:13:38.920 the stage next to Tiger. And then Wednesday comes along 1:13:39.040 --> 1:13:40.720 and they said, all right, we want you to have 1:13:40.760 --> 1:13:42.760 a chance, you know, to meet him beforehand and get 1:13:42.760 --> 1:13:44.920 a chance to talk and everything. So they end up 1:13:44.960 --> 1:13:48.120 walking me up to the third story at Riviera, which 1:13:48.120 --> 1:13:50.400 I didn't even know it had three stories in the building, 1:13:50.640 --> 1:13:53.439 and he was doing an interview in the room and said, 1:13:53.439 --> 1:13:55.439 all right, please just wait, you know, right here, he'll 1:13:55.479 --> 1:13:57.639 be done the second I said, okay, so I'm making 1:13:57.640 --> 1:14:00.360 short conversation with everybody that was there. 1:14:00.400 --> 1:14:02.120 Are you really nervous right now? 1:14:02.520 --> 1:14:02.720 Oh? 1:14:03.120 --> 1:14:05.760 My hands started sweating. I was like I can hear 1:14:05.800 --> 1:14:07.920 my heart beating and my neck, which was really weird. 1:14:09.680 --> 1:14:11.280 And all of a sudden, like I'm in like mid 1:14:11.320 --> 1:14:13.680 conversation with these people, and then you just feel I 1:14:13.680 --> 1:14:15.679 don't even know how to describe it. You just feel 1:14:15.680 --> 1:14:17.280 like a presence. And all of a sudden, he walks 1:14:17.320 --> 1:14:20.839 around the corner and I just remember looking I was like, wow, 1:14:21.080 --> 1:14:24.840 he has really broad shoulders. That was like my first thought. 1:14:25.000 --> 1:14:26.799 And then he walked up he said, Hey, I'm Tiger. 1:14:26.800 --> 1:14:30.360 I'm like, yeah, I know, Mare. He didn't know, and 1:14:30.439 --> 1:14:32.360 so he kind of laughed, and then he asked a 1:14:32.360 --> 1:14:35.160 couple of questions about the course and how I was 1:14:35.240 --> 1:14:38.360 planned on playing it and stuff, and it was really 1:14:38.400 --> 1:14:41.360 just a normal conversation from which I thought was pretty neat. 1:14:42.880 --> 1:14:45.040 And then obviously we did the press conference, and I 1:14:45.080 --> 1:14:47.760 remember sitting first. I remember walking into the room. They 1:14:47.760 --> 1:14:50.479 opened up the doors and I said, oh Jesus Christ, 1:14:50.479 --> 1:14:53.839 there's way more people than I expected, and like eighty cameras. 1:14:54.600 --> 1:14:56.040 And so we walked onto the stage and I was 1:14:56.120 --> 1:14:58.439 so happy that there was water on the stage because 1:14:58.479 --> 1:15:01.000 my mouth was dry and had no idea what was 1:15:01.040 --> 1:15:03.640 going on. And I just remember sitting there when they 1:15:03.640 --> 1:15:05.320 were asking a bunch of questions and I would look 1:15:05.360 --> 1:15:08.800 over and I just felt like, in a dream, Wow, 1:15:08.840 --> 1:15:11.640 that's really Tiger, just sitting right there. 1:15:12.600 --> 1:15:15.040 So do you have any regrets? Is there something that 1:15:15.120 --> 1:15:17.519 you wish you had asked him, or or something you 1:15:17.560 --> 1:15:19.519 wish you had said in that moment? 1:15:20.880 --> 1:15:23.479 Not really, I'd ask him a question on how to 1:15:23.560 --> 1:15:26.960 play the fifth holest part three because green sets up 1:15:27.320 --> 1:15:31.000 strange to me, right fourth Yeah, yeah, yeah, fourth A. 1:15:31.160 --> 1:15:32.920 I don't think anybody that. 1:15:33.080 --> 1:15:35.880 Well, yeah, green just sets up the wrong way for 1:15:36.200 --> 1:15:38.439 such a long iron shot. And because he had asked 1:15:38.439 --> 1:15:41.360 me what I like my ballflight normally is, I said 1:15:41.400 --> 1:15:42.960 it's usually kind of a draw, and he goes, oh, 1:15:43.000 --> 1:15:45.040 that's perfect. I was like, yeah, but on that whole 1:15:45.200 --> 1:15:47.280 it runs away with the draw, so like every time 1:15:47.320 --> 1:15:48.800 I hit it, it just keeps going to the back 1:15:48.920 --> 1:15:51.519 or over the green. And so we talked about hitting 1:15:51.520 --> 1:15:52.479 a high cut and everything. 1:15:52.560 --> 1:15:56.920 So yeah, it was neat yeah yeah. With uh, with 1:15:57.000 --> 1:16:00.599 playing professional golf, what what's been the top this thing 1:16:00.640 --> 1:16:03.799 from going from a very good college player to playing 1:16:03.920 --> 1:16:07.200 professional golf. What's spend the biggest challenge in terms of 1:16:07.320 --> 1:16:09.600 just being a professional golfer. 1:16:09.920 --> 1:16:12.400 I think it's just the self discipline you have to 1:16:12.439 --> 1:16:15.240 have because when you're in college, you know you're you know, 1:16:15.320 --> 1:16:18.639 the team's working out Monday, Wednesday, Friday at six am. 1:16:18.760 --> 1:16:22.519 That was always our schedule. Your tournament's already booked for you. 1:16:22.520 --> 1:16:24.559 You know, you have five in the fall of six 1:16:24.640 --> 1:16:28.000 or seven in the spring. Yeah, you're you know where 1:16:28.040 --> 1:16:30.519 you're practicing at every day, you know, like our coach 1:16:30.520 --> 1:16:33.840 and gives drills you qualifying. You know, you just have 1:16:33.880 --> 1:16:36.519 a set schedule and you know what you're doing. And 1:16:36.640 --> 1:16:39.200 so in terms offessionally, it's now it's just all on me. 1:16:39.479 --> 1:16:41.599 I gotta be I got to schedule, you know when 1:16:41.640 --> 1:16:44.800 I'm playing and where I'm traveling to, and just have 1:16:44.880 --> 1:16:46.519 to be disciplined enough to say, Okay, I'm going to 1:16:46.560 --> 1:16:48.280 get up on a workout and these are the things 1:16:48.280 --> 1:16:50.400 I'm going to do. I'm gonna eat right. No one's 1:16:50.479 --> 1:16:52.599 you know, cooking my meals for me. Now, don't get 1:16:52.600 --> 1:16:57.120 to just go to the the cafeteria. So I would 1:16:57.160 --> 1:16:59.719 just say that that self discipline is probably the hardest part, 1:17:00.160 --> 1:17:02.200 but it's one of those that's rewarding too. When you 1:17:02.240 --> 1:17:04.160 see everything work out the way you want it to, 1:17:04.400 --> 1:17:06.120 you're like, Okay, I know I'm doing the right things. 1:17:06.160 --> 1:17:09.040 I'm taking care of myself, and it's I'm good to go. 1:17:09.600 --> 1:17:13.360 You've played on the APGA Tour since the early twenty 1:17:13.560 --> 1:17:19.880 ten pretty long time. What's been you know, I mean 1:17:19.920 --> 1:17:22.920 I imagine the growth how it's changed has been remarkable. 1:17:22.960 --> 1:17:24.960 What do you think is the big The biggest thing 1:17:25.000 --> 1:17:26.960 that you look back on is like, wow, I can't 1:17:26.960 --> 1:17:29.040 believe that's the same tour as it is today. 1:17:29.600 --> 1:17:32.040 I just the courses, I think is the biggest thing. 1:17:32.160 --> 1:17:35.559 And the level of competition now is incredible. I mean 1:17:35.600 --> 1:17:38.600 every week someone's always going just group of guys is 1:17:38.600 --> 1:17:40.240 always going low. It's not like we just have one 1:17:40.280 --> 1:17:43.920 person that you know, predominantly shoots ten to twelve under. 1:17:43.960 --> 1:17:46.679 We got a whole gang of guys that can shoot, 1:17:46.800 --> 1:17:51.840 you know, anywhere from sixty eight to sixty three. So 1:17:51.880 --> 1:17:54.599 the competition level and then obviously, I said, the courses 1:17:54.640 --> 1:17:57.400 and have the ability to play the TVCs, whether it's 1:17:57.479 --> 1:18:02.639 DC Sugar Loaf Louisiana Vegas, having the Farmers Invitational out 1:18:02.640 --> 1:18:06.760 at Tory Pines, and then obviously now the Cisco Invitational 1:18:06.840 --> 1:18:10.960 being at Spyglass in Spanish Base. Like you take where 1:18:11.000 --> 1:18:13.760 we were playing, you know, Chester, Washington in LA and 1:18:13.800 --> 1:18:16.519 a couple of other courses, and you look at where 1:18:16.560 --> 1:18:20.240 it is now is truly remarkable. And I know that's 1:18:20.479 --> 1:18:22.559 something that we're all very thankful of that we get 1:18:22.560 --> 1:18:26.680 to play these championship courses and have the opportunity to 1:18:26.720 --> 1:18:29.280 say okay, this is where they play on tour, and 1:18:29.320 --> 1:18:31.880 this is how I stack up, and so it's neat. 1:18:32.160 --> 1:18:34.240 What's been your favorite course that you guys have played. 1:18:35.360 --> 1:18:38.160 Honestly, my favorite one was probably Balti Straw. It kicked 1:18:38.160 --> 1:18:42.080 my ass, but it was really a great test of 1:18:42.160 --> 1:18:45.760 golf and just mental fortitude because I never I never 1:18:45.840 --> 1:18:48.479 played a course where if you just hit am like 1:18:48.600 --> 1:18:52.400 just slightly bad shot, you screwed and it turned into 1:18:52.400 --> 1:18:54.360 double so fast. So it was neat to be put 1:18:54.439 --> 1:18:58.200 into that challenge in that atmosphere. And then TVC sawgrass 1:18:58.200 --> 1:19:00.360 because I've seen so much on TV, so that was 1:19:00.360 --> 1:19:02.080 cool just to play seventeen in the tournament. 1:19:02.560 --> 1:19:05.639 It's so I think that's one of the great things 1:19:05.640 --> 1:19:09.360 about golf when you're developing or trying to get to 1:19:09.400 --> 1:19:13.080 the next level is those moments where you clearly take 1:19:13.120 --> 1:19:15.120 a step up. And a lot of times it happens 1:19:15.120 --> 1:19:17.920 that in the tournament sense, whether you're junior and you 1:19:17.960 --> 1:19:20.519 play in a stadium, or whether you're an amateur you 1:19:20.560 --> 1:19:23.559 play a USGA event. I imagine at the pro level 1:19:23.600 --> 1:19:26.040 it's like I'm playing in a PGA Tour event right 1:19:26.040 --> 1:19:29.080 at Riviera, Like that's a huge step up. But when 1:19:29.120 --> 1:19:32.920 you do that, you walk away from those tournaments, whether 1:19:32.960 --> 1:19:35.559 you play well or play bad, you get such a 1:19:35.800 --> 1:19:39.840 nice barometer on where you're at. When you played that, 1:19:39.920 --> 1:19:42.960 you talked about Baltistrawl, you know, being just this level 1:19:42.960 --> 1:19:45.120 of golf course. What did you walk away from that? 1:19:45.200 --> 1:19:47.080 You know, you said it kicked your ass, but what 1:19:47.120 --> 1:19:49.639 did you walk away from that thinking about your game 1:19:49.720 --> 1:19:50.920 and what you needed to work. 1:19:50.760 --> 1:19:56.400 On the first thing I thought of was mentally how 1:19:56.640 --> 1:19:58.439 I was able to just stay in it because I 1:19:58.479 --> 1:20:01.599 think the first round I shut forty one or forty 1:20:01.640 --> 1:20:05.200 two on the front, but had five verties in a 1:20:05.280 --> 1:20:07.360 row going on the back. So it was one of 1:20:07.360 --> 1:20:10.040 those things where I know my younger self after a 1:20:10.200 --> 1:20:12.320 bad front Nove would have just probably checked out and 1:20:12.400 --> 1:20:14.519 been frustrated and just wanted to get off the course. 1:20:15.560 --> 1:20:18.200 But I was able to stay in it and stay focused. 1:20:18.240 --> 1:20:20.240 So that was one of those moments I was like, 1:20:20.240 --> 1:20:22.040 all right, good for me. I can you know I 1:20:22.040 --> 1:20:24.559 can still whether it's a bad start or I get 1:20:24.560 --> 1:20:26.360 off to a good start, I'm always in it. I 1:20:26.439 --> 1:20:28.559 don't mean I can't take myself out of it. So 1:20:28.640 --> 1:20:31.040 that was that was good, And then I was like 1:20:31.120 --> 1:20:32.599 I need to work on my wedges to make sure 1:20:32.600 --> 1:20:34.439 I can hit them a lot tighter, because if you 1:20:34.479 --> 1:20:36.559 do hit it in a bad spot and you have 1:20:36.640 --> 1:20:38.559 to bail out, you want to be able to, you know, 1:20:38.680 --> 1:20:40.439 hit a wedge in there, the inside ten feet and 1:20:40.479 --> 1:20:41.400 give yourself a flick a car. 1:20:42.320 --> 1:20:44.400 I think that. Yeah. To me, that's one of the 1:20:44.400 --> 1:20:48.160 crazy things about really high leveled golf is just how 1:20:49.800 --> 1:20:53.120 when you get out of position, then you have to 1:20:53.160 --> 1:20:57.240 hit great shots to get into position to save a 1:20:57.280 --> 1:21:02.320 par Yeah, and it's extraordinar how easy the top tier 1:21:02.400 --> 1:21:04.920 players in the game of golf make this look, but 1:21:05.120 --> 1:21:08.800 how challenging it is in real life. Right, It's just 1:21:09.240 --> 1:21:13.439 and the discipline, the discipline of understanding when you have 1:21:13.520 --> 1:21:17.719 to take your medicine or versus risk taking a risk 1:21:17.840 --> 1:21:20.840 is is just such a difficult thing to weigh. 1:21:21.040 --> 1:21:23.800 Yeah, yeah, without a doubt. And it's one of those things. 1:21:23.880 --> 1:21:26.200 I remember seeing it as a coach when I helped 1:21:26.200 --> 1:21:28.880 out a sax State and you see these kids getting 1:21:29.000 --> 1:21:31.439 get into trouble, and you know, you play it in 1:21:31.439 --> 1:21:33.200 your mind as if you were a player, because you're 1:21:33.240 --> 1:21:35.800 kind of playing caddy at the same time, and you 1:21:35.800 --> 1:21:38.080 you know, you give them the safe option, just because 1:21:38.080 --> 1:21:41.280 that's like, this is the smart play. There's no no 1:21:41.439 --> 1:21:43.720 bad thing that will have worse case we make bogie. 1:21:44.880 --> 1:21:47.040 But you know, as a player, you look like I 1:21:47.120 --> 1:21:49.280 see that gap in the tree. It's a little nine. 1:21:49.360 --> 1:21:52.040 I can get through there. And and you just have 1:21:52.120 --> 1:21:54.840 to have confidence in your player all the time. And 1:21:55.000 --> 1:21:57.800 so it's you weigh it and hopefully if you can 1:21:57.840 --> 1:21:59.760 execute it well, then then everything's great. 1:22:00.600 --> 1:22:03.080 You were you just hit on this. You were assistant 1:22:03.120 --> 1:22:06.880 coach at Sacramento State. How many years did you do that? 1:22:07.680 --> 1:22:10.439 Two and a half? COVID kind of cut it most short. 1:22:11.200 --> 1:22:15.639 What were the biggest advantages for your personal game from 1:22:15.760 --> 1:22:16.600 that experience? 1:22:17.240 --> 1:22:19.559 You just see different ways of playing golf. Like we 1:22:19.720 --> 1:22:23.840 had five kids, and all of them played five very 1:22:23.920 --> 1:22:27.080 distinct ways of playing golf. One kid could hit it 1:22:27.120 --> 1:22:30.160 really far like myself, and another kid was short but 1:22:30.160 --> 1:22:31.840 always hit a bunch of fairways and a bunch of 1:22:31.840 --> 1:22:34.520 greens and it was good with his wedges. And then 1:22:35.160 --> 1:22:38.240 one kid was super creative, could hit these low shots 1:22:38.280 --> 1:22:41.400 and these big swoopers, and so it was just interesting 1:22:41.439 --> 1:22:44.160 to see five different ways of how to try to 1:22:44.160 --> 1:22:46.719 get it done. And so you try to take pieces 1:22:46.720 --> 1:22:48.439 of that and like, okay, well, I know, if I 1:22:48.439 --> 1:22:50.200 get nervous on a T shot, I can hit that 1:22:50.240 --> 1:22:52.120 low one like he hit, and it's you know, the 1:22:52.200 --> 1:22:55.080 driver might only fly to seventy, but it's two seventy 1:22:55.080 --> 1:22:56.240 and it's going to go down the middle of the 1:22:56.280 --> 1:22:59.760 fairway every time. And then there's advantages obviously to just 1:23:00.680 --> 1:23:03.240 hitting it far and maybe a slightly crooked, but if 1:23:03.240 --> 1:23:04.560 you can, you know, hit it far and have a 1:23:04.600 --> 1:23:06.760 wedge end, that's an advantage. So it was it was 1:23:06.800 --> 1:23:08.920 neat to see where you could pick a piece and 1:23:09.479 --> 1:23:10.559 take something from everybody. 1:23:10.840 --> 1:23:14.320 Yeah, what's uh, what's your favorite moment from the early 1:23:14.439 --> 1:23:15.479 days of the APG. 1:23:15.640 --> 1:23:19.600 A favorite moment from the early this is this is 1:23:19.880 --> 1:23:23.840 a good ish bad story. So we're a tournament in 1:23:24.000 --> 1:23:29.360 Arizona and I show up and see all the guys 1:23:29.400 --> 1:23:32.240 and see one guy that I had seen in college 1:23:32.280 --> 1:23:35.400 and went to north Ridge and obviously I went to 1:23:35.479 --> 1:23:38.040 sax State. And I'm looking at him and I can't 1:23:38.080 --> 1:23:41.599 remember his name, and it's killing me. I'm just staring, 1:23:41.800 --> 1:23:43.479 like God, I don't know what his name is. I'm like, 1:23:43.520 --> 1:23:48.479 hopefully he doesn't come say anything to me. Yeah, as 1:23:48.520 --> 1:23:50.000 soon as I grab my putter and I go to 1:23:50.080 --> 1:23:52.840 the hole, he walked over, Hey, Aaron, how you doing. 1:23:52.880 --> 1:23:54.360 I was like, oh, what's up, man, how you been? 1:23:54.400 --> 1:23:56.800 And goes, no, no, no, no, you gotta say my name. 1:23:56.880 --> 1:24:00.759 And I was like, oh no, and I'm like, I'm staring, 1:24:00.800 --> 1:24:03.800 I'm looking thinking, so I'm gonna be honest me. I 1:24:03.800 --> 1:24:06.880 don't remember. He goes, it's Aaron. I was like, oh god, 1:24:07.000 --> 1:24:11.280 I overthought the hell And now those Aaron Grimes And 1:24:11.320 --> 1:24:13.519 now him and I are pretty much best friends and 1:24:13.560 --> 1:24:15.960 we travel all the time together. So it's just funny 1:24:15.960 --> 1:24:18.559 that we had seen each other in college. We'd always 1:24:18.600 --> 1:24:21.639 said Helow and for whatever reason, my mind went blank 1:24:21.680 --> 1:24:23.920 and I was overthinking it because he had the same 1:24:24.000 --> 1:24:24.439 name as me. 1:24:24.720 --> 1:24:27.040 So there's nothing worse than that moment. 1:24:27.840 --> 1:24:28.839 Oh, it was horrible. 1:24:29.280 --> 1:24:33.479 It's like, you know, the name. I'm not good. I'm 1:24:33.560 --> 1:24:35.439 not good at names. I'm not good. 1:24:35.880 --> 1:24:38.519 I'm pretty tried to get I've tried to get a 1:24:38.560 --> 1:24:39.759 lot better after that moment. 1:24:39.840 --> 1:24:43.960 Specifically, it's uh, so you you had status on PGA 1:24:44.040 --> 1:24:47.479 tour Canada this year as well? What how was it 1:24:47.640 --> 1:24:50.840 balancing to tours? So you have the APGA schedule Yeah, 1:24:50.920 --> 1:24:55.520 the Canada schedule, I imagine it probably was difficult. 1:24:56.360 --> 1:24:58.320 Yeah, It's one of those things you just try to 1:24:58.320 --> 1:25:02.479 weigh what is what's most important, like if I've play 1:25:02.960 --> 1:25:04.800 and how I figured it in my mind is that 1:25:04.920 --> 1:25:08.759 if I play really good golf on both tours, which 1:25:08.800 --> 1:25:13.120 one benefits me the most? And I looked at it 1:25:13.160 --> 1:25:16.519 as playing well on Canada, if you finished in the 1:25:16.520 --> 1:25:20.799 top five, you're automatically moved on to the Cornbier and ABG. 1:25:20.960 --> 1:25:23.880 If you finished and be the top player, then you 1:25:23.960 --> 1:25:26.040 get full status on what's now going to be PJ 1:25:26.200 --> 1:25:31.200 Tour Americas. So I waited and I decided Canada was 1:25:31.240 --> 1:25:33.120 probably the better stretch, and that's what I did. This 1:25:33.240 --> 1:25:36.800 was last summer, and so I ended up playing seven 1:25:36.800 --> 1:25:40.560 tournaments up there, and I thoroughly enjoyed it. And it's 1:25:41.160 --> 1:25:44.240 four day tournaments are more of a challenge than two 1:25:44.280 --> 1:25:46.960 day tournaments obviously, because two day tournaments from like a sprint, 1:25:47.160 --> 1:25:49.679 and the four day tournaments are I mean, in Canada, 1:25:49.680 --> 1:25:53.400 they're pretty much like a sprint marathon because everybody scores 1:25:53.520 --> 1:25:57.040 so low. But yeah, it's an interesting balance. But it 1:25:57.160 --> 1:26:00.439 was nice to play up there and travel up there 1:26:00.479 --> 1:26:02.640 and then with the times I could come back and 1:26:02.680 --> 1:26:04.639 play on the tour. It was really nice to come 1:26:04.640 --> 1:26:06.360 back and play on the APG because it felt like 1:26:06.360 --> 1:26:08.479 I was coming back on my family and it was 1:26:08.520 --> 1:26:10.920 really happy to see all the guys and everybody. So 1:26:11.000 --> 1:26:12.040 that was that was neat. 1:26:12.400 --> 1:26:16.320 What were your big takeaways form the PGA Tour Canada. 1:26:16.840 --> 1:26:19.640 You gotta make a lot of berries. I mean, we 1:26:19.720 --> 1:26:23.160 had one cut where it was six under par. Was 1:26:23.200 --> 1:26:26.720 the cutter seven under par? And so, I, you know, 1:26:26.800 --> 1:26:29.560 I play, I like to just play boring golf and 1:26:30.080 --> 1:26:33.240 not you know, if it's drivable, I'll weigh my options. 1:26:33.280 --> 1:26:35.839 But usually i'd take play up and hit a wedge 1:26:36.400 --> 1:26:38.080 and so I you know, I'd shoot a bunch of 1:26:38.080 --> 1:26:41.519 one under two under rounds and that just wasn't low enough. 1:26:41.760 --> 1:26:44.439 And so it taught me that you just have to 1:26:44.479 --> 1:26:46.560 be aggressive. You got to keep the pedal to the 1:26:46.600 --> 1:26:49.680 metal at all times, and and really important to leave 1:26:49.720 --> 1:26:51.280 the ball below the hole. And so you can have 1:26:51.360 --> 1:26:54.120 uphill buds so you can be aggressive birdy budgs. 1:26:54.200 --> 1:27:00.000 So it's a fascinating thing with all developmental tours, even 1:27:00.160 --> 1:27:03.000 down to the corn Fairy Tour, is we see you 1:27:03.080 --> 1:27:05.439 see this and you see players talk about this when 1:27:05.439 --> 1:27:08.040 they get up to the PGA Tour, just how drastically 1:27:08.120 --> 1:27:11.240 different the golf is on the PGA Tour because the 1:27:11.240 --> 1:27:15.840 golf courses demand more patients, demand more, you know, like 1:27:17.560 --> 1:27:21.160 understanding when to you know, versus you know, at the 1:27:21.200 --> 1:27:24.000 corn Faery Tour level Canada. You know, some of the 1:27:24.040 --> 1:27:29.280 Latin American courses are really tough, actually, but they those 1:27:29.320 --> 1:27:33.439 courses are there's just not repercussions for aggressive play, and 1:27:33.479 --> 1:27:36.760 they're shorter and in different like it's just such a 1:27:36.800 --> 1:27:39.800 different style of golf and I don't know really what 1:27:39.840 --> 1:27:42.600 the fixes to get. You know, there's just only a 1:27:42.640 --> 1:27:45.479 finite number of golf courses in the country that are 1:27:45.520 --> 1:27:48.160 a willing to host and be, you know, willing to 1:27:48.240 --> 1:27:50.599 test the top tier players in the game of golf 1:27:50.640 --> 1:27:53.719 at this point. But it is that is a challenging 1:27:53.800 --> 1:27:56.840 I think that resonates with like anybody that's been on 1:27:56.920 --> 1:27:59.600 those tours is just you know, and you see it 1:27:59.680 --> 1:28:01.640 like some some times the best better players on the 1:28:01.680 --> 1:28:03.680 corner ferry get to the PGA Tour and it just 1:28:03.760 --> 1:28:06.240 doesn't work and they're back down there and it's in 1:28:06.439 --> 1:28:10.040 some of the guys that aren't necessarily, you know, thought 1:28:10.080 --> 1:28:11.640 of as the best players on the corner ferry of 1:28:11.640 --> 1:28:13.280 the year before I get up to the PGA Tour 1:28:13.320 --> 1:28:16.280 and it's like, wow, these guys are studs, right, Yeah. 1:28:16.640 --> 1:28:18.960 Yeah, I mean I looked at it as like a 1:28:18.960 --> 1:28:22.200 couple of courses up in Canada, I just I would 1:28:22.240 --> 1:28:23.720 hit a bunch of two irons because they're a little 1:28:23.720 --> 1:28:26.400 bit more narrow, And I was like, they're shorter courses. 1:28:26.439 --> 1:28:30.320 But when I look at who would win, oh, he's 1:28:30.360 --> 1:28:32.479 hitting driver there. And you know, if you hit a 1:28:32.479 --> 1:28:35.360 good drive, then you're pitching versus my two iron, I 1:28:35.439 --> 1:28:38.000 might have ninety yards out eighty yards down. Obviously, the 1:28:38.040 --> 1:28:41.160 closer yards of the whole there's more chances you'll probably 1:28:41.160 --> 1:28:45.960 have to make birdie. So it rewards the aggressive straight player. 1:28:47.520 --> 1:28:50.000 And where I think on tour, a lot of the courses, 1:28:50.040 --> 1:28:52.840 like this week they're gonna be playing uh Silverado. You 1:28:53.040 --> 1:28:56.200 just you can't afford to be out of position if 1:28:56.240 --> 1:28:59.040 you're aggressive, so you're almost better off just laying back 1:28:59.040 --> 1:29:01.360 a few times iron and you know, taking middle of 1:29:01.360 --> 1:29:02.439 the green and two buddy. 1:29:03.080 --> 1:29:05.639 Yeah. And then there's a lot of variety in courses, right, 1:29:05.880 --> 1:29:08.880 you know, it's like I'm friends with Zach Blair, and 1:29:08.920 --> 1:29:12.799 it's like, you know, there's you know, twelve twelve courses 1:29:12.840 --> 1:29:14.840 a year that he's got to he's got to play 1:29:14.840 --> 1:29:17.600 well on because he's a shorter hitter, right, and Silverado 1:29:17.680 --> 1:29:20.519 is one that he's historically played really well at because 1:29:20.560 --> 1:29:24.639 it it really rewards some some accuracy off the tee, right, 1:29:24.960 --> 1:29:27.479 And it's uh, it's it's a really Uh it's an 1:29:27.520 --> 1:29:32.479 interesting aspect. You know, like what outside of the outside 1:29:32.520 --> 1:29:36.280 of the four rounds versus two rounds, were there any 1:29:36.360 --> 1:29:39.799 other big differences between the APGA and the PGA Canada. 1:29:39.920 --> 1:29:42.080 I mean, you're playing better courses on the APG A. 1:29:43.560 --> 1:29:48.080 Yeah. Uh. The travel is a lot harder in Canada, 1:29:48.120 --> 1:29:52.120 I would say, I imagine, yeah, just because you know 1:29:52.439 --> 1:29:55.000 and out when you play APGA Tour here, you know, 1:29:55.000 --> 1:30:03.160 we're in Atlanta, or in Chicago, Vegas, San Diego, Orlando, 1:30:03.840 --> 1:30:06.120 and so it's it's kind of easier and obviously you 1:30:06.160 --> 1:30:08.719 just know those places better. But when you're in Canada, 1:30:08.840 --> 1:30:13.600 you're in Victoria, and you're in Calgary, you're in Saskatchewan 1:30:14.160 --> 1:30:17.360 and places I never heard of, and so it's just 1:30:17.439 --> 1:30:20.040 it's harder to get to and I'm there with some 1:30:20.080 --> 1:30:23.040 issues with clubs and rental cars and just kind of 1:30:23.720 --> 1:30:26.559 just you don't know really what to expect, I would 1:30:26.560 --> 1:30:28.160 say all the time when you're traveling up there. So 1:30:28.840 --> 1:30:31.160 that part of it is can be challenging, but at 1:30:31.160 --> 1:30:32.559 the same time it can be a lot of fun. 1:30:32.600 --> 1:30:35.400 Like we drove through Bamf. I'd never seen Bamf before, 1:30:35.439 --> 1:30:36.960 and it was a nine hour drive and it might 1:30:36.960 --> 1:30:39.599 have been the most gorgeous nine hours I think I've 1:30:39.600 --> 1:30:44.280 ever seen in my life. So it's I try to 1:30:44.320 --> 1:30:47.080 make the most out of everything, and so it just 1:30:47.160 --> 1:30:50.800 you kind of you take those those moments of frustration. 1:30:51.000 --> 1:30:53.920 It's just good times to be able to tell a cool. 1:30:53.760 --> 1:30:59.519 Story, any crazy travel tales from from any any point 1:30:59.520 --> 1:31:03.080 of your your PGA, your your professional golf. 1:31:04.040 --> 1:31:06.720 Yeah, buddy of mine. We were playing in Windsor, was 1:31:06.800 --> 1:31:10.799 right across the Ambassador Bridge from Detroit, and we rented 1:31:10.840 --> 1:31:13.800 an air or staying in Airbnb. We had the car. 1:31:14.920 --> 1:31:17.840 We played the first round and go to dinner, come 1:31:17.880 --> 1:31:20.439 to it's actually July fourth. We go to dinner, we 1:31:20.479 --> 1:31:23.280 see a couple of fireworks across the river, and then 1:31:23.800 --> 1:31:27.680 go back home, take some take our bags up to 1:31:27.680 --> 1:31:29.240 the car. But I had left my travel bag in 1:31:29.240 --> 1:31:31.120 the car, and you had left a couple of budges. Whatever, 1:31:31.920 --> 1:31:34.080 So we walked down the next morning. Car had been 1:31:34.120 --> 1:31:38.080 broken into. One of his shoes was stolen, just one 1:31:38.120 --> 1:31:44.519 of them and just one one shoe show yeah, but 1:31:44.760 --> 1:31:46.920 joy he had. The left one was stolen, the right 1:31:46.960 --> 1:31:48.240 one stayed in the car. 1:31:48.520 --> 1:31:49.800 They were right next to each other. 1:31:50.520 --> 1:31:53.840 They were right next to each other, and so one 1:31:53.840 --> 1:31:57.000 shoe was stolen, two budges were stolen. My travel hard 1:31:57.080 --> 1:32:00.400 case was stolen, which so we were trying to figure 1:32:00.400 --> 1:32:02.880 out how like it just was a funny image of 1:32:03.080 --> 1:32:08.960 somebody walking down the street with this hard case. Oh yeah, 1:32:09.120 --> 1:32:12.719 And it was a hassle trying to get it everything, 1:32:12.840 --> 1:32:15.040 the insurance part of it and all taken care of. 1:32:15.120 --> 1:32:18.519 And I had to go play right after I played 1:32:18.520 --> 1:32:20.000 in the morning. He played in the afternoon, so he 1:32:20.080 --> 1:32:23.360 dropped me off. We're driving cars. Got a window that's gone, 1:32:23.400 --> 1:32:26.760 and funny enough, I think I shot twenty nine on 1:32:26.800 --> 1:32:29.000 the front line or something, because I was like, I 1:32:29.200 --> 1:32:31.439 just I was really not worried about the golf. I 1:32:31.479 --> 1:32:34.600 was more concerned about the cars. So I wasn't like 1:32:34.680 --> 1:32:38.240 really too focused on just playing, but it was that 1:32:38.400 --> 1:32:41.400 was an interesting, frustrating time. 1:32:41.760 --> 1:32:45.880 I feel like when your mind is extremely preoccupied, it 1:32:45.920 --> 1:32:52.000 can with other things. Golf goes into very different directions. 1:32:52.000 --> 1:32:55.000 It can either go extremely well or very poor, and 1:32:55.040 --> 1:32:56.480 there's no middle grounds. 1:32:56.880 --> 1:32:59.880 There's definitely no middle ground. I completely agree with that, 1:33:00.200 --> 1:33:01.120 completely agree with that. 1:33:02.320 --> 1:33:05.160 What do you look at your career thus far, what 1:33:05.320 --> 1:33:08.439 is what's the best stretch of golf that you've played, 1:33:08.600 --> 1:33:11.479 and what do you think was really really going well? 1:33:11.520 --> 1:33:15.960 Then? Scoring wise, the best stretch of golf I've played 1:33:16.200 --> 1:33:18.720 this past like three months, I think when I was 1:33:18.720 --> 1:33:21.720 looking at my scores, I've had one round over par 1:33:21.800 --> 1:33:27.080 in the last twenty rounds in tournament play. So that's 1:33:27.120 --> 1:33:29.960 been in terms of just like scoring average, it's been 1:33:30.000 --> 1:33:32.400 the best, and it's been been the best. I've driven 1:33:32.439 --> 1:33:36.080 the ball, best of iron distance wise has been good, 1:33:37.080 --> 1:33:40.080 Wedge distances have been good, short games vastly improved from 1:33:40.160 --> 1:33:44.160 last year. Now it's just a matter of putts falling. 1:33:44.240 --> 1:33:47.799 And my rounds of seventeen sixty nine turned into sixty 1:33:47.800 --> 1:33:51.799 six sixty five six before, So that's been a good stretch. 1:33:52.600 --> 1:33:54.760 I will say the best golf I've ever played for 1:33:54.840 --> 1:33:58.559 a week was my sophomore year at college. We had 1:33:58.560 --> 1:34:04.280 a match play tournament a Spyglass actually, the NCGA match 1:34:04.320 --> 1:34:08.000 Play tournament that's there every year, and I shot even 1:34:08.040 --> 1:34:10.560 on the first round and then four under on the 1:34:10.600 --> 1:34:14.479 second round qualify for the match play portion number one seed. 1:34:14.840 --> 1:34:17.479 Won my first match seven to six, won the next 1:34:17.520 --> 1:34:21.880 match six and five, won the next match four and two, 1:34:22.080 --> 1:34:25.320 in the next match two and one, and then got 1:34:25.400 --> 1:34:30.080 to the final match on Friday and was four up 1:34:30.120 --> 1:34:32.560 after the first eighteen and then ended up losing on 1:34:32.640 --> 1:34:35.640 the last hole of the second match. But it was 1:34:36.240 --> 1:34:39.160 just like this incredible stretch of golf where nothing really 1:34:39.240 --> 1:34:43.000 seemed to go wrong, Like I mean, I probably shot 1:34:44.520 --> 1:34:47.439 sixteen to nineteen under, I think in that stretch of 1:34:47.479 --> 1:34:50.000 all that golf. And my dad was caddying for me 1:34:50.040 --> 1:34:52.280 at the time, and we get done with the matches 1:34:52.320 --> 1:34:54.760 and we just smile and laugh. Becau's like everything we 1:34:54.880 --> 1:34:59.040 talked about in practice or whatever was just working for 1:34:59.200 --> 1:35:00.519 whatever reason, which was cool. 1:35:01.400 --> 1:35:05.720 What what what's your plans for the upcoming year? What 1:35:05.760 --> 1:35:08.680 are you what are you trying to do? Are you 1:35:08.720 --> 1:35:11.000 trying to do any of the Q schools? What's the 1:35:11.160 --> 1:35:13.240 what's the plan for twenty twenty four? 1:35:14.120 --> 1:35:17.519 Twenty twenty four bunch of Mondays is my strategy, play 1:35:17.600 --> 1:35:22.040 all of APGA tournaments, but do at least twelve to 1:35:22.040 --> 1:35:27.160 fifteen mondays because I look at my style and my 1:35:27.520 --> 1:35:30.000 way I'm hitting the ball now is I just need 1:35:30.280 --> 1:35:32.559 one or two good weeks of getting hot with the 1:35:32.600 --> 1:35:35.800 putter and the rest can be you know, history. So 1:35:36.520 --> 1:35:39.799 I look forward to doing that and traveling that route 1:35:39.840 --> 1:35:43.439 and seeing you know, and making it, making it on 1:35:43.520 --> 1:35:47.400 to the tour that route, and my plan is to 1:35:47.439 --> 1:35:50.600 go Corey Connors with it and and money, qualify and 1:35:50.640 --> 1:35:53.320 win and just move on that way. 1:35:53.560 --> 1:35:55.080 That'd be a good way to go, you know. 1:35:56.080 --> 1:35:56.200 Uh. 1:35:56.760 --> 1:35:59.479 I always thought there'd be a good business in like 1:35:59.560 --> 1:36:03.600 hosting tournaments in city like the city the tours in 1:36:04.160 --> 1:36:08.040 for like Tuesday Wednesday tournaments after a Monday qualifier. So 1:36:08.080 --> 1:36:11.599 then somebody's like, you're not going there if you don't 1:36:11.600 --> 1:36:14.040 make it, since there's you know, it's a whatever five 1:36:14.160 --> 1:36:18.000 or four percent or two percent success rate, right then 1:36:18.040 --> 1:36:21.640 you have a place where people can recoup cash, right y, 1:36:21.800 --> 1:36:25.200 you know, and and keep playing and it's like okay, 1:36:25.320 --> 1:36:27.680 like this isn't that hard, Like if you're going to 1:36:27.720 --> 1:36:30.639 set up a mini tour, especially the way that things 1:36:30.680 --> 1:36:33.160 are set up now, everybody wants to play these mondays 1:36:33.360 --> 1:36:36.680 and give themselves, you know, a chance. They've you know, 1:36:36.680 --> 1:36:39.200 there's so there's never been so much talent in the 1:36:39.240 --> 1:36:42.080 game of golf, and there's so little places to play. 1:36:42.320 --> 1:36:46.479 So it's like that would be a brilliant mini tour idea. 1:36:46.600 --> 1:36:49.719 I feel like, yeah, definitely, definitely. And it's interesting because 1:36:49.720 --> 1:36:52.040 I remember when I was in high school the mini tour. See, 1:36:52.160 --> 1:36:54.519 we always had two or three tournaments I think it's 1:36:54.520 --> 1:36:57.240 a Pepsi Tour back then that would come through and 1:36:57.320 --> 1:36:59.679 always play. And I know they had the Gateway Tour 1:36:59.840 --> 1:37:02.599 and the Hooters Tour and kind of just a whole 1:37:02.640 --> 1:37:04.720 bunch of a whole bunch of them, and now all 1:37:04.720 --> 1:37:09.200 of a sudden, there's like four, and it's it's weird 1:37:09.280 --> 1:37:11.360 that it's kind of is the most amount of golf 1:37:11.400 --> 1:37:14.400 ever being played, but the least amount of like opportunity 1:37:15.000 --> 1:37:17.360 to play, you know, a mini tour events and grind 1:37:17.400 --> 1:37:17.720 that way. 1:37:18.040 --> 1:37:22.080 It's uh yeah, and then almost all of like a 1:37:22.120 --> 1:37:25.759 lot of them end up being shifty and shady, shadily 1:37:25.880 --> 1:37:29.920 run tours, right, like the horrors of horrors of many tours, 1:37:30.080 --> 1:37:33.120 or the stories are just you know sometimes like the 1:37:33.520 --> 1:37:36.120 latest is the big money classic, you know, but. 1:37:36.520 --> 1:37:39.120 Oh yeah, yeah when no one gets paid. Yeah, that 1:37:39.320 --> 1:37:41.960 just is Yeah. 1:37:42.000 --> 1:37:45.759 Hey, Aaron, I appreciate the time and look forward to 1:37:45.800 --> 1:37:48.960 continue to follow your career. And uh and and we'll 1:37:48.960 --> 1:37:51.479 see you next week and uh in miner Ray. 1:37:51.800 --> 1:37:54.080 Yes, sir, I look forward to Andrews should be good 1:37:54.080 --> 1:37:56.880 and make sure you bring all good weather and not 1:37:57.120 --> 1:37:59.679 just you know, good vibes and we have a good time. 1:38:00.040 --> 1:38:00.360 All right. 1:38:09.960 --> 1:38:12.519 All right, that's it for another episode of the Friday 1:38:12.600 --> 1:38:16.599 Golf Podcast. I will be back next week early next 1:38:16.640 --> 1:38:18.960 week with the Ryder Cup. The Ryder Cup is here, 1:38:19.439 --> 1:38:22.120 so we will be doing a five Things about the 1:38:22.200 --> 1:38:25.559 Ryder Cup with a familiar, a friend of the program, 1:38:25.640 --> 1:38:29.160 Trevor Immulman will be on. He'll be you know, a captain, 1:38:29.320 --> 1:38:32.160 a captain of Ant, the most recent international team in 1:38:32.200 --> 1:38:34.400 the President's Cup. I just thought he would bring a 1:38:34.400 --> 1:38:37.920 neat dimension. Obviously he's never participated in a Ryder Cup, 1:38:38.080 --> 1:38:42.920 but he has led a team into battle against the Americans, 1:38:43.160 --> 1:38:44.920 so I just thought he would be a great guest. 1:38:45.760 --> 1:38:48.760 And I thank you for him for coming on, and 1:38:49.320 --> 1:38:52.799 so he will be on Monday, well or maybe even Sunday. 1:38:52.840 --> 1:38:55.880 We might really said Sunday, so keep your ears out 1:38:55.920 --> 1:39:00.200 for that. Thank you to Matt Ruschis for editing and 1:39:00.439 --> 1:39:04.040 producing this podcast, putting this all together, and thank you 1:39:04.040 --> 1:39:08.040 guys guys for listening. I appreciate it. And we are 1:39:08.320 --> 1:39:12.160 on the precipice of the last massive event on the 1:39:12.200 --> 1:39:16.479 golf calendar and I can't wait to get into the 1:39:16.520 --> 1:39:43.320 Ryder Cup week