1 00:00:07,080 --> 00:00:09,400 Speaker 1: Hey, what up? Welcome in. I'm Doug godlie Man. This 2 00:00:09,680 --> 00:00:11,719 Speaker 1: is the All New All Ball. We took a slight 3 00:00:11,760 --> 00:00:15,800 Speaker 1: diversion with our last episode Lil Wayne joined us. It 4 00:00:15,880 --> 00:00:19,280 Speaker 1: was awesome. You can steal download and listen to that one. UM, 5 00:00:19,320 --> 00:00:22,159 Speaker 1: we have a great special guest this week or in 6 00:00:22,160 --> 00:00:27,520 Speaker 1: this episode. Start pumping out multiple UM episodes per week hopefully. UM. 7 00:00:27,560 --> 00:00:31,600 Speaker 1: Our guest this week is Paul west Head. Okay, Paul 8 00:00:31,600 --> 00:00:34,199 Speaker 1: west Head, of course, legendary coach lad the Lakers to 9 00:00:34,240 --> 00:00:38,080 Speaker 1: an NBA title. UM. He led Loyal La merriamount to 10 00:00:39,400 --> 00:00:41,640 Speaker 1: was three n c A tournaments, including in the Lead eight, 11 00:00:41,680 --> 00:00:46,520 Speaker 1: and famously coached Bou Bou, Kimball and Hank Gathers. UM 12 00:00:46,560 --> 00:00:49,240 Speaker 1: also Jeff Fryer and Tom Peabody a bunch of other dudes. 13 00:00:49,280 --> 00:00:53,360 Speaker 1: But UM, so we'll talk to him about the Speed Game. 14 00:00:53,440 --> 00:00:56,760 Speaker 1: That's his new book and it talks about uh teaching 15 00:00:56,800 --> 00:00:59,960 Speaker 1: tea guys teams to play fast. I think you'll really 16 00:01:00,120 --> 00:01:05,000 Speaker 1: really enjoy that interview. Let's let me start though, as 17 00:01:05,120 --> 00:01:07,520 Speaker 1: we're a couple of days removed from the NBA Finals 18 00:01:07,560 --> 00:01:10,600 Speaker 1: in the NBA Championship, and I did hear Lebron James 19 00:01:10,600 --> 00:01:13,880 Speaker 1: say I want some respect, and I just I don't 20 00:01:13,880 --> 00:01:18,720 Speaker 1: know you. I think he's great. What happens when in 21 00:01:19,080 --> 00:01:22,360 Speaker 1: our world now of sports is either somebody's the best 22 00:01:23,480 --> 00:01:27,120 Speaker 1: or you're a hater. You're like, all right, Like I 23 00:01:28,640 --> 00:01:33,160 Speaker 1: many parts of his game. I haven't necessarily loved some. 24 00:01:33,319 --> 00:01:36,600 Speaker 1: He's improved some he hasn't, right, like that post game 25 00:01:36,640 --> 00:01:39,280 Speaker 1: that gave the fadeaway jump shot that's kind of disappeared. 26 00:01:40,000 --> 00:01:43,319 Speaker 1: He doesn't really have a middle game. He's developed a 27 00:01:43,360 --> 00:01:45,959 Speaker 1: step back jump shot, and he's obviously developed into being 28 00:01:46,000 --> 00:01:49,240 Speaker 1: a more than capable open three point shooter. He's improved 29 00:01:49,280 --> 00:01:52,640 Speaker 1: his shooting. But like, look, this is like, oh, well, 30 00:01:53,120 --> 00:01:55,120 Speaker 1: you know, Cindy Crawford has a mole, right, you're talking 31 00:01:55,120 --> 00:01:59,160 Speaker 1: about award on a on a supermodel Lebron James is 32 00:01:59,200 --> 00:02:03,800 Speaker 1: incredible old player. Doesn't move as well defensively, um throughout 33 00:02:03,800 --> 00:02:06,600 Speaker 1: the entire game or in back to back games, but 34 00:02:06,720 --> 00:02:09,519 Speaker 1: can clearly really really defend and can dominate a game. 35 00:02:10,200 --> 00:02:14,680 Speaker 1: I have no I'm not gonna pick apart his game 36 00:02:14,720 --> 00:02:18,079 Speaker 1: in any way. My whole thing with Jordan's is that 37 00:02:18,160 --> 00:02:22,960 Speaker 1: Jordan's was a force of sheer, force of will, like 38 00:02:23,400 --> 00:02:25,000 Speaker 1: he had to find a way to win, and once 39 00:02:25,000 --> 00:02:27,320 Speaker 1: he found it, we figured out how to win. There 40 00:02:27,400 --> 00:02:30,639 Speaker 1: was literally no stopping him. You know, I know he 41 00:02:30,919 --> 00:02:33,400 Speaker 1: I saw when he lost to the Orlando Magically he 42 00:02:33,480 --> 00:02:35,359 Speaker 1: lost the basketball and he wasn't sharp. He didn't look 43 00:02:35,400 --> 00:02:37,919 Speaker 1: like a good ball handler. And I understand that players 44 00:02:38,200 --> 00:02:41,960 Speaker 1: I do think have more well rounded skill set bass now, 45 00:02:42,040 --> 00:02:44,359 Speaker 1: but the game is very different. It's much less physical. 46 00:02:44,520 --> 00:02:47,399 Speaker 1: There's no power forwards. Sometimes there's no centers in the game. 47 00:02:47,800 --> 00:02:50,000 Speaker 1: So instead of comparing eras, I will just tell you 48 00:02:50,040 --> 00:02:52,440 Speaker 1: that for his era, I felt like Jordan was more 49 00:02:52,560 --> 00:02:55,640 Speaker 1: thoroughly completely dominant. There was no discussion over who the 50 00:02:55,639 --> 00:02:57,640 Speaker 1: best player in the game is. And I think if 51 00:02:57,639 --> 00:03:00,359 Speaker 1: we were honest, we would say that Lebron didn't go 52 00:03:00,400 --> 00:03:03,560 Speaker 1: against the full field as Durant was hurt, Stephan Clay 53 00:03:03,560 --> 00:03:05,960 Speaker 1: weren't in it, and they had both been hurt this year. 54 00:03:06,600 --> 00:03:09,480 Speaker 1: Um and you know, he never had to face off 55 00:03:09,520 --> 00:03:12,120 Speaker 1: with the honest although Nice is not nearly close in 56 00:03:12,200 --> 00:03:15,919 Speaker 1: terms of, you know, being completely refined, and they got 57 00:03:15,919 --> 00:03:19,880 Speaker 1: an incredibly favorable matchup along the way to even face Kauai, 58 00:03:20,080 --> 00:03:22,760 Speaker 1: who has done a great job on Lebron in the past. 59 00:03:23,000 --> 00:03:27,680 Speaker 1: So with all that mind, I'm not taking shots to Lebron. 60 00:03:28,160 --> 00:03:31,760 Speaker 1: What I don't love is the why would you ever 61 00:03:31,880 --> 00:03:37,119 Speaker 1: have a need for respect? You know, who are we trolling? 62 00:03:38,560 --> 00:03:42,680 Speaker 1: Why does it matter that these are the This is 63 00:03:42,720 --> 00:03:47,000 Speaker 1: the real mistake that Lebron makes is dignifying anybody he 64 00:03:47,040 --> 00:03:52,000 Speaker 1: feels like he's disrespectful to his level of success. That 65 00:03:52,160 --> 00:03:54,680 Speaker 1: that's that's punching down. I want some respect, Like, the 66 00:03:54,720 --> 00:03:58,119 Speaker 1: only people you think are disrespecting you are people whose 67 00:03:58,160 --> 00:04:02,680 Speaker 1: opinions shouldn't matter. And look, there's plenty of former players 68 00:04:03,640 --> 00:04:07,200 Speaker 1: that opinions I think do matter that would prefer Jordan's 69 00:04:07,320 --> 00:04:10,040 Speaker 1: or their era to Lebron. And maybe that's what he's 70 00:04:10,080 --> 00:04:12,360 Speaker 1: talking about. But when you say respect, it feels like 71 00:04:12,400 --> 00:04:17,040 Speaker 1: you're giving credibility to TV shows and radio shows, even mine. 72 00:04:17,320 --> 00:04:21,360 Speaker 1: And I'm very reasonable, Like people forget that. In the 73 00:04:21,400 --> 00:04:24,880 Speaker 1: early eighties, it was Larry Bird Matt Johnson say the 74 00:04:24,920 --> 00:04:27,400 Speaker 1: league they deserve to be in any discussion of the 75 00:04:27,440 --> 00:04:29,760 Speaker 1: top five players in the modern history of the game, 76 00:04:29,920 --> 00:04:33,840 Speaker 1: So too does Michael Jordan's um, so too does Lebron James. 77 00:04:34,080 --> 00:04:36,440 Speaker 1: And then you gotta go, okay, do we go Tim Duncan, 78 00:04:36,480 --> 00:04:38,360 Speaker 1: who want all those titles. Do we do Kobe Bryant, 79 00:04:38,400 --> 00:04:40,279 Speaker 1: who had his when all his titles? Like, what do 80 00:04:40,360 --> 00:04:42,720 Speaker 1: we do? I don't know. All I can tell you 81 00:04:42,800 --> 00:04:44,279 Speaker 1: is that if somebody wants to put me in a 82 00:04:44,320 --> 00:04:46,919 Speaker 1: list of the two best players in the history of 83 00:04:46,960 --> 00:04:49,200 Speaker 1: the sport or the ten best players in the history 84 00:04:49,200 --> 00:04:51,880 Speaker 1: of the sport, I think that's pretty respectful. And I 85 00:04:51,920 --> 00:04:55,880 Speaker 1: think any I think asking for respect feels like some 86 00:04:57,040 --> 00:05:01,960 Speaker 1: unneeded insecurity being being outed that he clearly shouldn't have. Nonetheless, 87 00:05:02,000 --> 00:05:05,120 Speaker 1: we should respect Lebron James. Like the four NBA titles 88 00:05:05,120 --> 00:05:08,919 Speaker 1: are special. I know we can't compare because no superstar 89 00:05:08,960 --> 00:05:11,640 Speaker 1: players ever bounced to three or actually four different teams, 90 00:05:11,640 --> 00:05:13,680 Speaker 1: really if you kind of get down to it. So 91 00:05:13,760 --> 00:05:16,280 Speaker 1: this whole well, no one's won three with three different 92 00:05:16,360 --> 00:05:22,479 Speaker 1: like I got you, I got you, But no, you know, 93 00:05:22,600 --> 00:05:25,640 Speaker 1: Kareem bounced the two teams. Shack bounced to a couple 94 00:05:25,640 --> 00:05:28,760 Speaker 1: of different teams. Obviously took two to the NBA finals. 95 00:05:28,760 --> 00:05:30,880 Speaker 1: Couldn't get the Calves to the finals when he was 96 00:05:31,320 --> 00:05:33,560 Speaker 1: a bit player with Lebron or the Sons to the 97 00:05:33,640 --> 00:05:37,920 Speaker 1: NBA finals, So that would be the only only parallel 98 00:05:37,960 --> 00:05:40,000 Speaker 1: there and Chack didn't take care of himself the way 99 00:05:40,040 --> 00:05:44,960 Speaker 1: that Lebron took care of himself. Um, But to me, 100 00:05:45,160 --> 00:05:48,640 Speaker 1: the the the NBA playoffs and the bubble was about 101 00:05:48,760 --> 00:05:51,320 Speaker 1: his leadership, his ability to get guys to totally buy 102 00:05:51,320 --> 00:05:53,520 Speaker 1: into why they were there, and coaching, I mean thinking 103 00:05:53,520 --> 00:05:56,839 Speaker 1: how much play the use of zones, Like Miami couldn't 104 00:05:56,920 --> 00:05:58,839 Speaker 1: run a zone against the Lakers. They just sliced and 105 00:05:58,880 --> 00:06:01,280 Speaker 1: diced it right, But they would not have gotten to 106 00:06:01,320 --> 00:06:05,000 Speaker 1: the finals without the use of his own. Oh yeah, 107 00:06:05,040 --> 00:06:07,400 Speaker 1: by the way, the Lakers and their adjustment for you know, 108 00:06:07,480 --> 00:06:10,279 Speaker 1: quick doubling, James Harden getting it out of his hand 109 00:06:10,279 --> 00:06:12,919 Speaker 1: before you get into his game. Like again, all of 110 00:06:12,920 --> 00:06:15,360 Speaker 1: these things are coaching and and even getting the Lebron 111 00:06:15,480 --> 00:06:18,360 Speaker 1: to buy into whatever the defensive schemes were from the Lakers. 112 00:06:18,360 --> 00:06:20,600 Speaker 1: That that's coaching. Now, some of that is Lebron being 113 00:06:20,600 --> 00:06:24,359 Speaker 1: coachable and then you know, leading and getting ways to 114 00:06:24,360 --> 00:06:26,520 Speaker 1: get motivated Anthony Davis and all their whole team to 115 00:06:26,560 --> 00:06:30,120 Speaker 1: play at a super high level defensively. But I I 116 00:06:30,480 --> 00:06:34,159 Speaker 1: kind of feel like coaching gets undersold in the reason 117 00:06:34,320 --> 00:06:36,880 Speaker 1: the Lakers became the best team in the NBA won 118 00:06:37,080 --> 00:06:42,800 Speaker 1: NBA Championship let's let's speak of the Lakers winning a championship. 119 00:06:43,360 --> 00:06:46,680 Speaker 1: Let's welcome him in. He the longtime college and NBA 120 00:06:46,720 --> 00:06:50,480 Speaker 1: and w NBA champion head coach Paul west Head joins us. 121 00:06:51,240 --> 00:06:53,479 Speaker 1: Be sure to catch the live edition of The Doug 122 00:06:53,560 --> 00:06:56,440 Speaker 1: gott Leap Show weekdays at three p m. Easter noon 123 00:06:56,520 --> 00:06:59,960 Speaker 1: Pacific on Fox Sports Radio and the I Heart Radio 124 00:07:00,080 --> 00:07:04,799 Speaker 1: lap Let's welcome in. The book is called The Speed Game, 125 00:07:05,200 --> 00:07:09,520 Speaker 1: My Fast Times in Basketball. Paul west Head, uh is 126 00:07:09,520 --> 00:07:12,720 Speaker 1: is my guest. Um, There's a lot of places people 127 00:07:12,760 --> 00:07:15,000 Speaker 1: could start, but I I want to start at a 128 00:07:15,040 --> 00:07:18,040 Speaker 1: place that that is uh really most interesting to me. 129 00:07:18,240 --> 00:07:20,680 Speaker 1: So I apologize, coach if it's not where you want 130 00:07:20,720 --> 00:07:26,640 Speaker 1: to begin. Um. I had I had seen Hank Gathers 131 00:07:26,640 --> 00:07:29,720 Speaker 1: in both kimball playing a pickup game at cal State 132 00:07:29,840 --> 00:07:34,520 Speaker 1: Northridge the summer before Hank's finals. Hank and Bost final 133 00:07:34,560 --> 00:07:36,800 Speaker 1: season together for you at local Merymount, and I was 134 00:07:37,640 --> 00:07:39,440 Speaker 1: a kid from Orange County. I was kind of blown 135 00:07:39,480 --> 00:07:41,960 Speaker 1: away by this kind of bigger than life mythical player. 136 00:07:42,360 --> 00:07:44,800 Speaker 1: And I had known how you guys had played, watch 137 00:07:44,840 --> 00:07:46,160 Speaker 1: you guys in the n s A tournament the two 138 00:07:46,240 --> 00:07:51,560 Speaker 1: previous years. So then fast forward to the WCC tournament 139 00:07:52,320 --> 00:07:58,640 Speaker 1: and Hank passes out, what what now, we're like thirty 140 00:07:58,720 --> 00:08:05,520 Speaker 1: years later, what memories do you have of that night? Well? Uh, 141 00:08:05,720 --> 00:08:09,080 Speaker 1: you know, I I saw what everyone else saw that 142 00:08:10,120 --> 00:08:14,560 Speaker 1: made us gigantic, slam dunk, turned to get back on defense, 143 00:08:15,640 --> 00:08:21,640 Speaker 1: got almost the half court and collapsed and and you 144 00:08:21,680 --> 00:08:27,720 Speaker 1: know we lost them. I mean, there's nothing that even 145 00:08:27,760 --> 00:08:30,280 Speaker 1: thirty years later makes up for that. It's it was 146 00:08:30,320 --> 00:08:35,160 Speaker 1: a devastating time for me, for the team, for his family, 147 00:08:35,920 --> 00:08:39,440 Speaker 1: and there's something stuff you just sunk it over and 148 00:08:39,520 --> 00:08:42,319 Speaker 1: that that happens to be one of them. Yeah, I'm 149 00:08:42,640 --> 00:08:45,160 Speaker 1: that's actually what's what most intrigues me. Because I went 150 00:08:45,200 --> 00:08:47,760 Speaker 1: to the next game. It was a bit long beach arena. 151 00:08:48,000 --> 00:08:52,120 Speaker 1: You played the Mexican State. And to this, to this day, 152 00:08:52,120 --> 00:08:54,720 Speaker 1: I tell people my love for college basketball. I had 153 00:08:54,760 --> 00:08:56,880 Speaker 1: loved it before that, my dad taken to games n 154 00:08:56,920 --> 00:08:58,640 Speaker 1: c A tournaments. I loved it after that and I 155 00:08:58,679 --> 00:09:01,760 Speaker 1: played in it. But the moment to me was, you 156 00:09:01,800 --> 00:09:04,840 Speaker 1: guys came running out and there's Marouin everywhere in forty 157 00:09:04,880 --> 00:09:10,000 Speaker 1: four is everywhere, and and then Bo gets fouled and 158 00:09:10,320 --> 00:09:12,320 Speaker 1: all of a sudden he takes three triples with his 159 00:09:12,440 --> 00:09:15,040 Speaker 1: right hand, switches to and then he makes it. He 160 00:09:15,120 --> 00:09:19,840 Speaker 1: makes it, I mean like out of a movie. Um, okay, 161 00:09:19,880 --> 00:09:24,200 Speaker 1: so how like, Look, this is a kid whose parents 162 00:09:24,240 --> 00:09:27,000 Speaker 1: trusted you. Write he transfers over from USC and he 163 00:09:27,080 --> 00:09:29,400 Speaker 1: trust you, and the kids trust you with the style 164 00:09:29,520 --> 00:09:33,200 Speaker 1: that obviously they he benefited greatly from. But it is frenetic. 165 00:09:33,320 --> 00:09:35,760 Speaker 1: It is different. The level of conditioning. It was obscene 166 00:09:35,800 --> 00:09:37,280 Speaker 1: what you guys do. And I want to get into that, 167 00:09:38,679 --> 00:09:41,040 Speaker 1: but but you lose him there on the floor. How 168 00:09:41,080 --> 00:09:44,080 Speaker 1: did you get that group together? What did you say? 169 00:09:44,240 --> 00:09:46,400 Speaker 1: What did you do? How do you not because you're 170 00:09:46,400 --> 00:09:50,560 Speaker 1: dealing with your own emotions, I'm wondering how you did that? Yeah, well, 171 00:09:50,960 --> 00:09:54,840 Speaker 1: you know, we we had some hard times together. Immediately 172 00:09:54,880 --> 00:10:01,280 Speaker 1: after Hanks passing, they had a ceremony at Loyal Marymutt 173 00:10:01,280 --> 00:10:05,679 Speaker 1: and garstin Marina where the whole campus was there and UH, 174 00:10:06,120 --> 00:10:08,880 Speaker 1: players and I were in attendance, and then we all 175 00:10:08,920 --> 00:10:16,320 Speaker 1: flew back to Philadelphia for for the official funeral. UH 176 00:10:16,640 --> 00:10:23,360 Speaker 1: his his mom's church. And then we returned and the 177 00:10:23,520 --> 00:10:27,079 Speaker 1: players came to me. I to be honest, I said, like, 178 00:10:27,679 --> 00:10:30,160 Speaker 1: if we just want to end it here, that's fine, 179 00:10:30,960 --> 00:10:34,320 Speaker 1: and they said, no, we want to play, and we 180 00:10:34,360 --> 00:10:39,480 Speaker 1: want to play for Hank. So we started, We've had 181 00:10:39,480 --> 00:10:43,920 Speaker 1: a couple of practices, went to Long Beach and and launched, 182 00:10:44,440 --> 00:10:49,080 Speaker 1: and it's just a little perspective. They played better than 183 00:10:49,160 --> 00:10:53,720 Speaker 1: they ever did or could have, And it's kind of interesting. 184 00:10:54,280 --> 00:10:58,600 Speaker 1: You can say they played for Hank, but they were 185 00:10:58,640 --> 00:11:03,440 Speaker 1: playing kind for themselves. They they wanted to kind of 186 00:11:03,679 --> 00:11:08,360 Speaker 1: get away from all of the sorrow. So plane was, 187 00:11:08,960 --> 00:11:13,199 Speaker 1: you know, two hours of relief from the other parts 188 00:11:13,240 --> 00:11:18,360 Speaker 1: of the day that you were in Greek lisn't how 189 00:11:18,400 --> 00:11:20,440 Speaker 1: you always played when you want an NBA championship with 190 00:11:20,440 --> 00:11:23,960 Speaker 1: the Lakers, but what you did took the world of 191 00:11:24,000 --> 00:11:28,559 Speaker 1: basketball by absolute storm. And what I remember, like one 192 00:11:28,559 --> 00:11:33,280 Speaker 1: of the names I remember had seventy two at the half, 193 00:11:34,720 --> 00:11:37,160 Speaker 1: and I remember my dad, who had coach Oregon State. 194 00:11:37,679 --> 00:11:39,760 Speaker 1: He told me at the time after the game, he's like, 195 00:11:39,800 --> 00:11:42,760 Speaker 1: you know what happens is everybody scored in the first half, 196 00:11:42,800 --> 00:11:45,200 Speaker 1: they feel great and they're like this is easy, and 197 00:11:45,240 --> 00:11:47,080 Speaker 1: then they hit a wall in the second half and 198 00:11:47,080 --> 00:11:49,560 Speaker 1: they can't make a shot, they can't trouble the camp pass, 199 00:11:49,600 --> 00:11:51,760 Speaker 1: they can't make a layup, and you guys end up 200 00:11:51,840 --> 00:11:55,960 Speaker 1: conditioning kind of wins the day. So just the style 201 00:11:56,040 --> 00:11:58,880 Speaker 1: of how you played later in your career, Loila Merymount 202 00:11:59,440 --> 00:12:01,920 Speaker 1: Uh to the Anver Nuggets, when you pressed and you ran. 203 00:12:03,400 --> 00:12:06,000 Speaker 1: How do you formulate that style in your mind or 204 00:12:06,040 --> 00:12:09,560 Speaker 1: in a discussion with other coaches? Well, I, you know, 205 00:12:10,360 --> 00:12:13,559 Speaker 1: through the seventies, when I was at Los Angle University, 206 00:12:13,600 --> 00:12:19,760 Speaker 1: and and through my professional careers with the Lakers and 207 00:12:19,760 --> 00:12:25,400 Speaker 1: and Chicago Bulls and then ultimately Loyal and Merrymount, I 208 00:12:25,480 --> 00:12:28,120 Speaker 1: was always a running coach, and I and I believed 209 00:12:28,160 --> 00:12:32,199 Speaker 1: in in the quick shot. I believe it makes more 210 00:12:32,240 --> 00:12:36,080 Speaker 1: sense to run the ball down and beat the defense. 211 00:12:36,120 --> 00:12:39,839 Speaker 1: I mean, why why play five on five when if 212 00:12:39,840 --> 00:12:42,040 Speaker 1: you go fast enough you can play five on three. 213 00:12:42,440 --> 00:12:46,680 Speaker 1: I mean it's a lot easier. So I did it 214 00:12:46,679 --> 00:12:49,840 Speaker 1: for those reasons. But it wasn't until all the Marrian 215 00:12:49,880 --> 00:12:54,600 Speaker 1: Mount until hankin Bow and Corey Gaines, Uh and Tom 216 00:12:54,600 --> 00:12:59,520 Speaker 1: Peabody all showed up together, all transferring from different parts 217 00:12:59,559 --> 00:13:03,439 Speaker 1: of the of the country. Hall l a kids dad. 218 00:13:03,520 --> 00:13:05,640 Speaker 1: I said, well, I'm gonna run, but I have to 219 00:13:05,679 --> 00:13:09,000 Speaker 1: do something to make the other team run. So that's 220 00:13:09,040 --> 00:13:13,520 Speaker 1: when we employed a full court man and man press, 221 00:13:14,559 --> 00:13:18,880 Speaker 1: and the press was good enough or if you want 222 00:13:18,920 --> 00:13:22,000 Speaker 1: to look at it another way, weak enough that you 223 00:13:22,120 --> 00:13:24,679 Speaker 1: shot the ball in five seconds like we were shooting 224 00:13:24,679 --> 00:13:29,160 Speaker 1: the ball in five seconds. So kind of accidentally I 225 00:13:29,240 --> 00:13:35,319 Speaker 1: created the perfect scenario. We're shooting five, you shooting five. 226 00:13:35,760 --> 00:13:38,960 Speaker 1: Do that for forty minutes and see how you feel. 227 00:13:39,480 --> 00:13:45,160 Speaker 1: Our players could sustain that the opposition. Many times we're 228 00:13:45,200 --> 00:13:49,000 Speaker 1: doing well by halftime and then would ultimately crack. And 229 00:13:49,040 --> 00:13:53,439 Speaker 1: our guys knew that was going to happen. Um, how 230 00:13:53,440 --> 00:13:55,480 Speaker 1: do you condition for something like that, for that style 231 00:13:55,520 --> 00:13:59,440 Speaker 1: of play? Yeah, I mean we did some preseason things. 232 00:13:59,520 --> 00:14:03,880 Speaker 1: We know, we did some running. Uh we we actually 233 00:14:04,040 --> 00:14:10,880 Speaker 1: ran the sand dunes uh in Manhattan Beach that it's 234 00:14:10,920 --> 00:14:14,000 Speaker 1: really quite a challenge. I my memory is, and I 235 00:14:14,040 --> 00:14:18,640 Speaker 1: did it once myself. It's about, oh, it seems like 236 00:14:18,679 --> 00:14:21,440 Speaker 1: a mile straight up, but it's probably a few hundred yards. 237 00:14:21,760 --> 00:14:24,640 Speaker 1: But you have to run straight uphill and sand dunes 238 00:14:24,680 --> 00:14:29,480 Speaker 1: and and very difficult. So our guys kind of saw 239 00:14:29,520 --> 00:14:32,480 Speaker 1: that as a challenge. We didn't do it every day. 240 00:14:32,480 --> 00:14:40,080 Speaker 1: We did it a couple of times before October. But honestly, Doug, 241 00:14:40,360 --> 00:14:43,640 Speaker 1: the way you get conditioned to run the fast break 242 00:14:43,760 --> 00:14:46,280 Speaker 1: like we did, and press. You have to do it 243 00:14:46,320 --> 00:14:49,600 Speaker 1: every day in practice. I mean I was not a 244 00:14:49,680 --> 00:14:53,240 Speaker 1: stand around coach who would stop play and give a 245 00:14:53,280 --> 00:14:58,440 Speaker 1: two minute explanation on how to defend the pick and roll. Uh. 246 00:14:59,600 --> 00:15:04,240 Speaker 1: Those two minutes were possessions wasted for me. So I 247 00:15:04,440 --> 00:15:09,360 Speaker 1: played the speed game in every drill, and therefore the players, 248 00:15:09,880 --> 00:15:14,000 Speaker 1: they were very acclimated to playing NonStop. Yeah, and then 249 00:15:14,440 --> 00:15:16,840 Speaker 1: you get, as you described, you get a team playing 250 00:15:16,880 --> 00:15:19,400 Speaker 1: a style that your kids practice and play every day, 251 00:15:20,000 --> 00:15:22,440 Speaker 1: and they play once or twice a year, and so 252 00:15:22,520 --> 00:15:25,880 Speaker 1: they're kind of discombibulated. While it feels good to be 253 00:15:26,040 --> 00:15:28,760 Speaker 1: that free and playing that fast, when you're not used 254 00:15:28,800 --> 00:15:30,680 Speaker 1: to it, you start to make errors. You do, you 255 00:15:30,720 --> 00:15:32,880 Speaker 1: get out of you, You lose your wind, and then 256 00:15:32,920 --> 00:15:35,600 Speaker 1: you start teams to also start playing their benches and 257 00:15:35,720 --> 00:15:38,440 Speaker 1: guys that didn't normally play are thrust in there. And 258 00:15:38,480 --> 00:15:40,840 Speaker 1: now that the strength of your death ends up becoming 259 00:15:40,840 --> 00:15:44,880 Speaker 1: a factor. I mean, the teams get so tired. I 260 00:15:44,920 --> 00:15:48,880 Speaker 1: don't know if we had a game where we played 261 00:15:49,080 --> 00:15:53,960 Speaker 1: L s U with Shaquiel Neal uh since at a 262 00:15:55,120 --> 00:15:58,080 Speaker 1: Nike clinic and he said, you know, coach, we had 263 00:15:58,120 --> 00:16:01,000 Speaker 1: one of our point guards about eight minutes ago in 264 00:16:01,040 --> 00:16:04,680 Speaker 1: a game, he was so tired that he was coming 265 00:16:04,760 --> 00:16:10,640 Speaker 1: down with the ball and on purpose threw it out 266 00:16:10,680 --> 00:16:15,480 Speaker 1: of bounds to cause a turnover so he could get 267 00:16:15,480 --> 00:16:19,760 Speaker 1: his perpetition and relax. He would do anything. They would 268 00:16:19,800 --> 00:16:23,840 Speaker 1: do anything to stop to play. Uh. And we've had 269 00:16:23,840 --> 00:16:28,200 Speaker 1: occasions with teams that did the old football trick where 270 00:16:29,560 --> 00:16:32,480 Speaker 1: if a team's playing so fast and football, you fake 271 00:16:32,520 --> 00:16:35,280 Speaker 1: an injury and you're on the ground and then three 272 00:16:35,280 --> 00:16:38,440 Speaker 1: minutes later they start playing again. We had teams that 273 00:16:38,480 --> 00:16:40,120 Speaker 1: would do that to us too. They would kind of 274 00:16:40,120 --> 00:16:43,360 Speaker 1: fall down and and act like they're hurt, and you 275 00:16:43,360 --> 00:16:46,040 Speaker 1: know they weren't hurt because a minute later after they 276 00:16:46,040 --> 00:16:48,200 Speaker 1: came out, they were back in the game. So but 277 00:16:49,200 --> 00:16:53,920 Speaker 1: for our guys, it was enjoyable. I mean, they love 278 00:16:54,080 --> 00:16:58,360 Speaker 1: playing fast, They love that speed game. They thrived on it. 279 00:16:58,680 --> 00:17:00,440 Speaker 1: But I will say to you, Doug, and this is 280 00:17:00,520 --> 00:17:03,080 Speaker 1: part of my my book, there were a lot of 281 00:17:03,120 --> 00:17:06,800 Speaker 1: coaching jobs that I had that it didn't work, that 282 00:17:07,000 --> 00:17:13,159 Speaker 1: players didn't accept it, that said this is crazy, that said, 283 00:17:13,280 --> 00:17:18,639 Speaker 1: after ten days of practice, players only meeting, like we 284 00:17:18,720 --> 00:17:22,080 Speaker 1: got to get rid of this. So was that that 285 00:17:22,200 --> 00:17:23,880 Speaker 1: was that the Nuggets? I mean, what what why didn't 286 00:17:23,880 --> 00:17:26,400 Speaker 1: it work with? No? Not not the Nuggets so much. 287 00:17:27,080 --> 00:17:30,359 Speaker 1: The Nuggets were interesting group of guys. They they were 288 00:17:30,400 --> 00:17:34,480 Speaker 1: a depleted team. They Alex English and everybody all left 289 00:17:34,680 --> 00:17:37,840 Speaker 1: almost at the same time. So we had some some 290 00:17:38,000 --> 00:17:41,919 Speaker 1: young players and some leftovers. And uh uh and I 291 00:17:41,960 --> 00:17:45,320 Speaker 1: say left overs, their delightful leftovers. But I had Orlando 292 00:17:45,359 --> 00:17:48,919 Speaker 1: Woolridge and Walter Davis, but they were well at the 293 00:17:49,000 --> 00:17:53,720 Speaker 1: end of their career, like thirty five going up. So 294 00:17:53,840 --> 00:17:57,719 Speaker 1: we had a nice group of guys. Uh. So they 295 00:17:58,240 --> 00:18:02,280 Speaker 1: really tried their their darn this to keep this space. 296 00:18:02,600 --> 00:18:06,040 Speaker 1: They had trouble with the defense. See, I I was 297 00:18:06,160 --> 00:18:08,840 Speaker 1: foolish enough. That's why I got fired fourteen out of 298 00:18:08,920 --> 00:18:12,640 Speaker 1: twenty jobs. I was foolish enough to try and pull 299 00:18:12,680 --> 00:18:17,639 Speaker 1: it off. Uh. The NBA guys, they might think about 300 00:18:17,920 --> 00:18:22,640 Speaker 1: running the break deep down players don't really want to run. 301 00:18:23,920 --> 00:18:26,840 Speaker 1: I'm sure you're a little bit aware of that. I mean, 302 00:18:26,880 --> 00:18:28,919 Speaker 1: they'll steal the ball and make a fast break, but 303 00:18:29,000 --> 00:18:30,679 Speaker 1: they do not want to go up and down, up 304 00:18:30,680 --> 00:18:33,520 Speaker 1: and down, up and down in five seconds. It's it's 305 00:18:33,640 --> 00:18:38,840 Speaker 1: against you know, almost the union rule. Uh. And for 306 00:18:38,920 --> 00:18:43,280 Speaker 1: sure they don't want a full court press. And I 307 00:18:43,320 --> 00:18:48,679 Speaker 1: can remember practicing and in games having Walter Davis and 308 00:18:48,800 --> 00:18:52,280 Speaker 1: Orlando Woolwich being the back two of my press. But 309 00:18:52,359 --> 00:18:54,879 Speaker 1: I wanted them to come forward when the ball was 310 00:18:54,960 --> 00:18:58,800 Speaker 1: inbounded into the action, you know, getting in the mix 311 00:18:58,880 --> 00:19:02,480 Speaker 1: of things. And they continually when the ball got passed 312 00:19:02,520 --> 00:19:06,680 Speaker 1: and backed up, and I said, come on, Walter and 313 00:19:07,440 --> 00:19:10,280 Speaker 1: oh you and he said, Coach, we're covering for you. 314 00:19:10,320 --> 00:19:13,520 Speaker 1: We're covering for you. Man. We don't want you to 315 00:19:13,560 --> 00:19:16,399 Speaker 1: look bad. Well, they might have been doing it, but 316 00:19:16,440 --> 00:19:18,920 Speaker 1: they really didn't want to run. That was the real 317 00:19:18,960 --> 00:19:22,879 Speaker 1: bottom line. It's easier to back up on defense, and 318 00:19:22,920 --> 00:19:27,959 Speaker 1: it's easier to take your time on offense then sprint 319 00:19:28,000 --> 00:19:31,680 Speaker 1: on offense and play full court defense. It's very difficult 320 00:19:31,720 --> 00:19:35,880 Speaker 1: to do. That's fascinating. Um, okay, what what was it 321 00:19:35,920 --> 00:19:39,679 Speaker 1: like to go from coaching, uh, the world of the 322 00:19:39,800 --> 00:19:43,280 Speaker 1: NBA two then coaching women both in college and professionally. 323 00:19:43,520 --> 00:19:45,800 Speaker 1: What what is that like in terms of not just 324 00:19:45,840 --> 00:19:49,160 Speaker 1: your style, but the way in which you approach approach 325 00:19:49,240 --> 00:19:56,800 Speaker 1: coaching your players. Yeah, I take the Phoenix Mercury job. Uh. 326 00:19:56,960 --> 00:19:58,720 Speaker 1: A couple of things happened well when I go to 327 00:19:58,960 --> 00:20:03,960 Speaker 1: the start and sign the contract. I fly in from 328 00:20:04,119 --> 00:20:09,480 Speaker 1: l A to Phoenix, and who's at the airport at 329 00:20:09,520 --> 00:20:14,439 Speaker 1: the gate waiting for me is Diana Trassi. So I 330 00:20:14,440 --> 00:20:16,520 Speaker 1: can only say to you, Doug. There there's a difference 331 00:20:17,080 --> 00:20:19,879 Speaker 1: of all the teams I coach, especially the proteins, and 332 00:20:20,000 --> 00:20:22,840 Speaker 1: one of the players ever waiting for me at the airport. 333 00:20:24,800 --> 00:20:27,880 Speaker 1: Some of them took me to the airport to say goodbye. 334 00:20:28,000 --> 00:20:31,800 Speaker 1: But so anyway, we we go to the arena. It's 335 00:20:31,800 --> 00:20:34,359 Speaker 1: going to be a little press conference, and she says 336 00:20:34,400 --> 00:20:39,040 Speaker 1: to me, Uh, coach, I know what you do, and 337 00:20:39,520 --> 00:20:45,800 Speaker 1: don't water anything down. Give us exactly what you have 338 00:20:45,840 --> 00:20:49,080 Speaker 1: done to the men. We want you to treat us 339 00:20:49,119 --> 00:20:54,520 Speaker 1: the same. So I did I mean I. I deployed 340 00:20:54,560 --> 00:20:59,640 Speaker 1: the press and run and they gravitated to the fast 341 00:20:59,640 --> 00:21:04,240 Speaker 1: spray in a great manner. They were good, and they 342 00:21:04,280 --> 00:21:08,399 Speaker 1: got better and better and better. The full court defense 343 00:21:09,200 --> 00:21:14,320 Speaker 1: they tried, but it they crumbled. They and I was 344 00:21:14,359 --> 00:21:17,359 Speaker 1: getting smart enough to say, well, let's play a little 345 00:21:17,400 --> 00:21:21,200 Speaker 1: half court zund once in a while. Uh. But they 346 00:21:21,240 --> 00:21:24,920 Speaker 1: were terrific with the running game. Doug. I had a 347 00:21:24,920 --> 00:21:29,840 Speaker 1: point guard, a young lady named Kelly Miller, her first practice, 348 00:21:29,880 --> 00:21:32,639 Speaker 1: we got her in a trade. Her first practice said Kelly, 349 00:21:32,720 --> 00:21:34,520 Speaker 1: I want you to push the ball as fast as 350 00:21:34,560 --> 00:21:38,360 Speaker 1: you can on the dribble down the other end on offense. 351 00:21:38,960 --> 00:21:42,399 Speaker 1: And every time she said I can do that. Well, 352 00:21:42,560 --> 00:21:46,639 Speaker 1: every practice, every drill, every game, no matter what the score, 353 00:21:47,160 --> 00:21:52,160 Speaker 1: Kelly Miller pushed that ball all the way down. So uh, 354 00:21:52,640 --> 00:21:57,400 Speaker 1: she was. She was the the engine that got everybody going. 355 00:21:57,480 --> 00:22:00,439 Speaker 1: And to ROSSI just fell in line. And and I 356 00:22:00,480 --> 00:22:04,040 Speaker 1: had Cappy condex Er, who was a tough minded girl 357 00:22:04,080 --> 00:22:08,480 Speaker 1: from Chicago. Uh, Penny Taylor. I just had a good team. 358 00:22:08,480 --> 00:22:11,120 Speaker 1: And we're jumping around. But I'll tell you one thing. 359 00:22:11,160 --> 00:22:13,440 Speaker 1: I realized. It took me twenty eight years after I 360 00:22:13,560 --> 00:22:16,639 Speaker 1: won with the Lakers in the NBA. Took me twenty 361 00:22:16,680 --> 00:22:21,400 Speaker 1: eight years to get another championship. And I realized you 362 00:22:21,440 --> 00:22:25,480 Speaker 1: have to have very very good players in order to win. 363 00:22:26,560 --> 00:22:29,400 Speaker 1: Sometimes you can have good players and you still don't win. 364 00:22:29,480 --> 00:22:32,480 Speaker 1: But if you have the very good ones like to 365 00:22:32,680 --> 00:22:38,040 Speaker 1: Rossi and Magic Johnson and Kareem Abdulgebar, you got a 366 00:22:38,119 --> 00:22:40,959 Speaker 1: good shot. You mentioned Magic and Kaream, obviously you went 367 00:22:41,000 --> 00:22:43,720 Speaker 1: an NBA title. And that was when famously Magic had 368 00:22:43,720 --> 00:22:48,000 Speaker 1: just started at center for you, right, yes, Um, take 369 00:22:48,080 --> 00:22:50,679 Speaker 1: take me back before before that game, what was the 370 00:22:50,720 --> 00:22:53,320 Speaker 1: discussion like in the locker room between your coaches and 371 00:22:53,480 --> 00:22:56,960 Speaker 1: with you and Magic. Well, it's funny you say that. 372 00:22:57,400 --> 00:22:59,919 Speaker 1: I'll start with when you said discussion with your coaches. 373 00:23:00,040 --> 00:23:02,840 Speaker 1: I know today there's a little about eleven guys that 374 00:23:02,880 --> 00:23:07,080 Speaker 1: get into his coaches discussion and have input and analytics 375 00:23:07,080 --> 00:23:10,760 Speaker 1: and all kinds of stuff. At that moment, there was 376 00:23:10,880 --> 00:23:14,440 Speaker 1: me and one other coach. It happened to be pat Riley. 377 00:23:14,480 --> 00:23:20,040 Speaker 1: That's it. So there wasn't, you know, a big coaches meeting. Uh. 378 00:23:20,440 --> 00:23:25,880 Speaker 1: The game five, which put us up three two. Uh, 379 00:23:26,000 --> 00:23:31,399 Speaker 1: Kareem abdul Jabbar was injured. Uh. He came back and 380 00:23:31,480 --> 00:23:36,080 Speaker 1: played the last quarter with a severely injured ankle. We 381 00:23:36,160 --> 00:23:39,879 Speaker 1: finished the game one and Kareem doesn't come on the 382 00:23:39,920 --> 00:23:42,119 Speaker 1: trip with us. That's why we know we have to 383 00:23:42,160 --> 00:23:45,600 Speaker 1: do something about it. So we're on the flight back 384 00:23:45,640 --> 00:23:49,240 Speaker 1: to Philadelphia. We're flying commercial now, no no private planes 385 00:23:49,320 --> 00:23:54,080 Speaker 1: or anything. And I say the Magic, I said, can 386 00:23:54,240 --> 00:24:00,000 Speaker 1: you could you play center? And he says, sure, no problem. 387 00:24:00,040 --> 00:24:02,840 Speaker 1: He said, you know, I was a center in high school. 388 00:24:02,960 --> 00:24:05,200 Speaker 1: And if you look at his background. It was only 389 00:24:05,280 --> 00:24:08,080 Speaker 1: two years ago. He played in high school. Then he 390 00:24:08,119 --> 00:24:10,879 Speaker 1: played one year at Michigan State, and now here he is, 391 00:24:10,960 --> 00:24:15,200 Speaker 1: you know, a rookie. So you know, we have one 392 00:24:15,240 --> 00:24:17,920 Speaker 1: little shoot around practice and now we're going to play 393 00:24:17,960 --> 00:24:21,480 Speaker 1: the game. I can still remember a game time. We're 394 00:24:21,520 --> 00:24:25,800 Speaker 1: about to go out and my other the biggest player 395 00:24:25,800 --> 00:24:28,560 Speaker 1: in the starting lineup, Jim Jones, is like seven foot, 396 00:24:28,960 --> 00:24:34,920 Speaker 1: big strong man. Says to me, Coach, so I'm jumping center, right, 397 00:24:35,320 --> 00:24:39,280 Speaker 1: I said, no, we talked about this. Magic is going 398 00:24:39,320 --> 00:24:43,200 Speaker 1: to jump center, So I mean I did it kind 399 00:24:43,200 --> 00:24:49,400 Speaker 1: of symbolically, like here is Kareem's replacement for this game. 400 00:24:50,359 --> 00:24:54,520 Speaker 1: So we get our first possession, we throw the ball 401 00:24:54,560 --> 00:24:57,720 Speaker 1: to Magic. He just on his own, goes down into 402 00:24:57,760 --> 00:25:01,480 Speaker 1: the low post, takes a little sky I hooked, kind 403 00:25:01,480 --> 00:25:04,560 Speaker 1: of jump hook. It goes in and then he does 404 00:25:05,480 --> 00:25:09,439 Speaker 1: anything and everything guard forward center, and he gets forty 405 00:25:09,440 --> 00:25:13,280 Speaker 1: two points. But we didn't really have many choices, Doug 406 00:25:13,520 --> 00:25:17,640 Speaker 1: and Magic smiled and said, yeah, I can, I can 407 00:25:17,680 --> 00:25:22,240 Speaker 1: do it. What was Cream like to coach? Yeah, Kareem 408 00:25:22,240 --> 00:25:28,000 Speaker 1: was a special guy. It's interesting. I when I arrived 409 00:25:29,320 --> 00:25:31,600 Speaker 1: from Los Angeles, I went right to a kind of 410 00:25:31,600 --> 00:25:36,160 Speaker 1: a workout practice and I was the assistant coach. Jack McKinney, 411 00:25:36,200 --> 00:25:38,200 Speaker 1: my good friend was was the head coach. And I 412 00:25:38,800 --> 00:25:41,280 Speaker 1: walked in and he said, yeah, we're working some guys out. 413 00:25:41,720 --> 00:25:44,400 Speaker 1: He said, Kareem's down the other end. Uh, why don't 414 00:25:44,400 --> 00:25:47,199 Speaker 1: you go down and work out with him? So I 415 00:25:47,280 --> 00:25:50,000 Speaker 1: walked down and I said hello, and he kind of nodded. 416 00:25:50,320 --> 00:25:53,160 Speaker 1: I think he said he lope. It wasn't a big conversation, 417 00:25:53,920 --> 00:25:56,600 Speaker 1: and he said, why don't you feed me the ball? 418 00:25:56,960 --> 00:26:00,000 Speaker 1: So I was like in the baseline area feeding him 419 00:26:00,119 --> 00:26:04,320 Speaker 1: in the low post. I fed him about twenty passes. 420 00:26:05,040 --> 00:26:10,480 Speaker 1: He made all twenty shots, threw the ball back to 421 00:26:10,520 --> 00:26:12,920 Speaker 1: me after the twenty and said thank you very much. 422 00:26:13,480 --> 00:26:17,000 Speaker 1: And I said okay, and I went back to McKinney. 423 00:26:17,040 --> 00:26:19,719 Speaker 1: I said, hey, this is easy, you know, you know, 424 00:26:19,760 --> 00:26:22,440 Speaker 1: you just just passed the guy the ball and he 425 00:26:22,560 --> 00:26:25,960 Speaker 1: makes shots and it's over. Well that was kind of 426 00:26:26,000 --> 00:26:29,840 Speaker 1: the start of my relationship with Kareem. Since then we 427 00:26:29,920 --> 00:26:33,199 Speaker 1: really got along. I learned one thing by instinct. You 428 00:26:33,240 --> 00:26:37,520 Speaker 1: don't want to try and tell Kareem something about basketball. 429 00:26:38,359 --> 00:26:42,760 Speaker 1: You know, you kinda maybe might suggest some things, but 430 00:26:42,840 --> 00:26:44,760 Speaker 1: you're not gonna say Hey, you know, I think if 431 00:26:44,760 --> 00:26:48,240 Speaker 1: you drop your right foot you'll be better. He would 432 00:26:48,240 --> 00:26:51,119 Speaker 1: look at you like and no, no, no, no no. 433 00:26:51,640 --> 00:26:55,159 Speaker 1: So I learned that quick enough and we got a 434 00:26:55,200 --> 00:27:01,440 Speaker 1: long very well. I think more because of limited things 435 00:27:01,480 --> 00:27:05,520 Speaker 1: I said to him, rather than trying to over coach him. Uh. 436 00:27:06,520 --> 00:27:11,000 Speaker 1: And I I do recall one time in training camp. Uh. 437 00:27:11,040 --> 00:27:13,240 Speaker 1: And this is a tribute to him. It was our 438 00:27:13,280 --> 00:27:15,600 Speaker 1: first practice, and I tried to impress the guys that 439 00:27:15,680 --> 00:27:18,479 Speaker 1: we're gonna really work hard this year. So we had 440 00:27:18,480 --> 00:27:22,560 Speaker 1: a two hour practice and then like a good old 441 00:27:22,560 --> 00:27:24,919 Speaker 1: college coach, I said, Okay, get on the lines, and 442 00:27:24,960 --> 00:27:26,800 Speaker 1: we're going to run the lines. I mean, I don't 443 00:27:26,800 --> 00:27:29,520 Speaker 1: know what you and your dad called it, but he 444 00:27:29,680 --> 00:27:33,119 Speaker 1: called suicide. You call it murder, yes, yes you. So 445 00:27:33,160 --> 00:27:35,240 Speaker 1: we're going down and back down and back down and back. 446 00:27:35,320 --> 00:27:38,800 Speaker 1: So we do a whole set and it's over and 447 00:27:38,840 --> 00:27:41,920 Speaker 1: the players walk one way to the locker and I'm 448 00:27:42,000 --> 00:27:45,439 Speaker 1: walking the other way and Kareem comes over, puts his 449 00:27:45,560 --> 00:27:51,480 Speaker 1: arm around me, and he says, Paul, I don't do murder. 450 00:27:53,920 --> 00:27:57,400 Speaker 1: And that was it. So I went back to my room. 451 00:27:57,440 --> 00:27:59,399 Speaker 1: We're gonna have another practice. That's when you could have 452 00:27:59,440 --> 00:28:04,000 Speaker 1: two a day, and he was saying to me, I 453 00:28:04,040 --> 00:28:07,639 Speaker 1: hope you're smart enough to know don't do them again. Yes, 454 00:28:07,800 --> 00:28:11,720 Speaker 1: And I never did so to his credit though he 455 00:28:11,760 --> 00:28:13,800 Speaker 1: did it the first time. And I don't know if 456 00:28:13,800 --> 00:28:16,480 Speaker 1: you picked up one of it. I did, he said 457 00:28:16,520 --> 00:28:20,439 Speaker 1: to me, Paul, Yes, you know, he never called the coach, 458 00:28:21,440 --> 00:28:24,280 Speaker 1: can see him. There's probably only only one coach right now. 459 00:28:24,320 --> 00:28:26,200 Speaker 1: There was only one coach. It was John Wooden and 460 00:28:27,040 --> 00:28:29,480 Speaker 1: the rest of it. I played for him, and I 461 00:28:29,480 --> 00:28:31,520 Speaker 1: wish I would have had this conversation with you before 462 00:28:31,520 --> 00:28:34,200 Speaker 1: I played for him, because we we butted heads a ton, 463 00:28:35,119 --> 00:28:37,800 Speaker 1: and it was it was it was an interesting experience. 464 00:28:37,840 --> 00:28:41,040 Speaker 1: I find him to be a brilliant guy. But but 465 00:28:41,040 --> 00:28:44,240 Speaker 1: but he's he is not And even though he's a 466 00:28:44,240 --> 00:28:46,920 Speaker 1: great orator, he's not necessarily great communicator as a coach, 467 00:28:46,920 --> 00:28:49,920 Speaker 1: which are two very very different things. Is as you know, 468 00:28:50,600 --> 00:28:53,920 Speaker 1: I will say after I got fired from the Lakers, 469 00:28:54,520 --> 00:28:57,960 Speaker 1: and I went home, you know, devastated, and and that's 470 00:28:58,000 --> 00:29:02,040 Speaker 1: another whole series. I probably the best, I'm the best 471 00:29:02,080 --> 00:29:05,080 Speaker 1: coach in America to talk to two coaches who get fired, 472 00:29:05,320 --> 00:29:09,240 Speaker 1: because I've been fired fourteen times. But the Lakers job 473 00:29:09,360 --> 00:29:11,960 Speaker 1: was the first one right, and the first one you 474 00:29:12,040 --> 00:29:16,400 Speaker 1: take it personal. And I drive home to my wife 475 00:29:16,440 --> 00:29:19,880 Speaker 1: and my kids and and they're the kids are crying, 476 00:29:20,000 --> 00:29:24,560 Speaker 1: my wife is upset. And I'm home maybe half an 477 00:29:24,560 --> 00:29:29,880 Speaker 1: hour and the phone rings before cell phones, the phone rings. 478 00:29:29,920 --> 00:29:34,800 Speaker 1: I pick it up and it's Kareem Abdul Jabbar, who says, coach, 479 00:29:34,840 --> 00:29:39,320 Speaker 1: I'm really sorry. You know I wasn't involved with any 480 00:29:39,360 --> 00:29:43,440 Speaker 1: of this, and I feel bad for you. So what's 481 00:29:43,480 --> 00:29:48,360 Speaker 1: what happened? Was it was you got cross Magic? Oh 482 00:29:48,400 --> 00:29:50,680 Speaker 1: I have I have no idea. I mean, there there 483 00:29:50,800 --> 00:29:53,960 Speaker 1: wasn't an issue in the game before I got fired 484 00:29:54,280 --> 00:30:02,160 Speaker 1: with Magic Johnson and I. But I think ultimately Magic 485 00:30:03,200 --> 00:30:08,120 Speaker 1: and that incident created some of the issues. But I 486 00:30:08,160 --> 00:30:14,160 Speaker 1: would not blame him. I think the management and Jerry Buss, uh, 487 00:30:14,280 --> 00:30:16,680 Speaker 1: you know, did what they felt they needed to do 488 00:30:16,960 --> 00:30:19,680 Speaker 1: so and if I and again I was I'm so 489 00:30:20,000 --> 00:30:22,800 Speaker 1: I'm at that point, I'm so young that all I 490 00:30:22,840 --> 00:30:24,880 Speaker 1: know is based upon what I was told and read 491 00:30:24,920 --> 00:30:28,000 Speaker 1: and said. Magic was really close to Jerry Buss, maybe 492 00:30:28,240 --> 00:30:30,480 Speaker 1: too much more so than any player and owner have 493 00:30:30,600 --> 00:30:33,800 Speaker 1: ever been. At that point in time, Magic very young, 494 00:30:34,200 --> 00:30:37,360 Speaker 1: and you know Jerry Buss tried to act what he 495 00:30:37,400 --> 00:30:39,720 Speaker 1: thought was in his best interest. But is it just 496 00:30:39,800 --> 00:30:44,080 Speaker 1: it's kind of an interesting, um what is I think 497 00:30:44,120 --> 00:30:46,680 Speaker 1: getting fired is one thing? Obviously, if you coach long enough, 498 00:30:46,680 --> 00:30:49,400 Speaker 1: it's gonna happen to anybody. How hard is it, though, 499 00:30:49,480 --> 00:30:53,400 Speaker 1: to watch their success and they're like, wait, that was 500 00:30:53,640 --> 00:30:56,360 Speaker 1: that? It It should have been me, that that should have 501 00:30:56,360 --> 00:30:58,680 Speaker 1: been me? And oh yeah, by the way, the way 502 00:30:58,720 --> 00:31:01,720 Speaker 1: which they played showtime I'm your former assistant pat Riley 503 00:31:01,800 --> 00:31:04,920 Speaker 1: like that's how he laid They played fast? So what what? 504 00:31:04,920 --> 00:31:07,600 Speaker 1: What is that like emotionally to process all these years later? 505 00:31:09,360 --> 00:31:12,320 Speaker 1: As you move on as I moved to other jobs, 506 00:31:12,400 --> 00:31:15,400 Speaker 1: when I as I moved to Chicago Bulls and the 507 00:31:15,680 --> 00:31:22,600 Speaker 1: Denver Nuggets and and different teams, I realized that when 508 00:31:22,600 --> 00:31:27,160 Speaker 1: you get fired, it's not personal. It's not like you're 509 00:31:27,240 --> 00:31:33,080 Speaker 1: the bad guy. It's that it's business. The team has 510 00:31:33,760 --> 00:31:39,400 Speaker 1: made the decision that they need to try something different, 511 00:31:40,160 --> 00:31:44,680 Speaker 1: and you're the easy out. I did find in in 512 00:31:44,760 --> 00:31:50,680 Speaker 1: the NBA very difficult to get rid of players and 513 00:31:50,720 --> 00:31:55,800 Speaker 1: their contracts. So if the ship isn't sailing the way 514 00:31:55,800 --> 00:31:59,120 Speaker 1: you like it, it's much easier to say goodbye to 515 00:31:59,160 --> 00:32:02,360 Speaker 1: the captain of the ship and and get someone new. 516 00:32:02,480 --> 00:32:05,480 Speaker 1: So I have a much better perspective. And and I 517 00:32:05,560 --> 00:32:08,600 Speaker 1: will say this, Jerry Buss fired me. But Jerry Buss 518 00:32:08,600 --> 00:32:12,800 Speaker 1: was the best owner I've ever had. And I say 519 00:32:12,840 --> 00:32:18,880 Speaker 1: that because he did anything he could to get players. 520 00:32:20,200 --> 00:32:23,560 Speaker 1: You know. He in fact, this was before the salary 521 00:32:23,640 --> 00:32:27,400 Speaker 1: cap we needed a rebound, or after we won a championship, 522 00:32:27,400 --> 00:32:29,240 Speaker 1: and then the next year we faltered a little bit. 523 00:32:29,760 --> 00:32:33,120 Speaker 1: And he said, who's the best free agent out there 524 00:32:33,160 --> 00:32:36,479 Speaker 1: to help you? And I said, Miss cup Check is 525 00:32:36,520 --> 00:32:40,880 Speaker 1: the best free agent that we need. He said, I'll 526 00:32:40,880 --> 00:32:45,440 Speaker 1: get him. I said, well, you know, really, he said, 527 00:32:45,600 --> 00:32:48,240 Speaker 1: I'll go to the vault. I will get Miss cup Check. 528 00:32:48,320 --> 00:32:51,400 Speaker 1: For that's what you want, I'll get him. So you 529 00:32:51,480 --> 00:32:54,280 Speaker 1: can't do any better, especially if you're a professional coach, 530 00:32:54,480 --> 00:32:57,840 Speaker 1: to have an owner that will do anything it takes 531 00:32:58,480 --> 00:33:04,080 Speaker 1: to get the best player. I marvel at you know. Now, 532 00:33:04,320 --> 00:33:09,680 Speaker 1: his his daughter Genie, who my recollection is, she was 533 00:33:10,720 --> 00:33:15,640 Speaker 1: maybe a ten eleven year old, maybe a pre teen girl. 534 00:33:16,080 --> 00:33:20,520 Speaker 1: I'd see it occasionally. She did the same thing. She 535 00:33:20,680 --> 00:33:25,160 Speaker 1: went out and got Anthony Davis. And therein lies the 536 00:33:25,200 --> 00:33:28,840 Speaker 1: whole difference, you know, get the right player and put 537 00:33:28,920 --> 00:33:32,560 Speaker 1: him in with what you have and Davis and Lebron 538 00:33:32,760 --> 00:33:37,280 Speaker 1: the nobody's gonna beat them in seven games. No, no, nobody. 539 00:33:37,320 --> 00:33:39,080 Speaker 1: Nobody did well, Coach. I can't wait to read the 540 00:33:39,160 --> 00:33:40,800 Speaker 1: entirety of the book. It's called The Speed Game, My 541 00:33:40,880 --> 00:33:43,000 Speaker 1: Fast Times in Basketball. Know, there's a ton of stories 542 00:33:43,080 --> 00:33:45,800 Speaker 1: ton a basketball lor. I can only tell you as 543 00:33:45,800 --> 00:33:47,560 Speaker 1: a guy who loves the sport I got a chance 544 00:33:47,600 --> 00:33:50,600 Speaker 1: to play. I love watching your teams play your unique style, 545 00:33:50,920 --> 00:33:53,400 Speaker 1: and I'm gonna I would I would argue with you 546 00:33:53,480 --> 00:33:55,320 Speaker 1: to the death though. I would love to play that 547 00:33:55,520 --> 00:33:57,320 Speaker 1: because I can't imagine how many assists I could have 548 00:33:57,360 --> 00:34:00,160 Speaker 1: gotten playing players like to play fast. No, no no, no, 549 00:34:00,160 --> 00:34:05,080 Speaker 1: no, no no, I love no, I love it. Yeah, I know, 550 00:34:05,160 --> 00:34:07,480 Speaker 1: but trust me, I've had teams that I have. My 551 00:34:07,520 --> 00:34:09,359 Speaker 1: first meeting, I say, okay, now we're going to fast 552 00:34:09,360 --> 00:34:12,920 Speaker 1: break this year, and who's in favor? And you know, 553 00:34:12,960 --> 00:34:15,879 Speaker 1: all twelve guys raise their hands, you know, and then 554 00:34:15,920 --> 00:34:19,200 Speaker 1: after about six practices, if you ask the same question, 555 00:34:19,960 --> 00:34:24,520 Speaker 1: you might have two I would be I would be 556 00:34:24,600 --> 00:34:26,200 Speaker 1: one of those two. I would be one of those 557 00:34:26,320 --> 00:34:30,000 Speaker 1: one of those two. Yeah. Yeah, Well, well, if I 558 00:34:30,040 --> 00:34:32,279 Speaker 1: had you, Doug, you'd be in the speed Game. Then 559 00:34:32,320 --> 00:34:35,279 Speaker 1: you'd be in this this book, and then you can 560 00:34:35,320 --> 00:34:38,320 Speaker 1: get it on Amazon dot com right now it's available. 561 00:34:38,600 --> 00:34:43,359 Speaker 1: But I just hope that people realize how hard it 562 00:34:43,480 --> 00:34:48,279 Speaker 1: is to run this one. It's because players want to 563 00:34:48,440 --> 00:34:53,279 Speaker 1: play steady as it goes. They they say they want 564 00:34:53,280 --> 00:34:56,520 Speaker 1: to play fast. They don't want to play fast. It's 565 00:34:56,560 --> 00:34:59,520 Speaker 1: too hard. Hey, coach, thanks so much for joining us. 566 00:34:59,520 --> 00:35:03,200 Speaker 1: Congrats the book and can't wait to read it ins entirety. 567 00:35:03,880 --> 00:35:06,160 Speaker 1: Be sure to catch the live edition of The Doug 568 00:35:06,200 --> 00:35:09,680 Speaker 1: Gottlieb Show weekdays at three p m. Easter noon Pacific. 569 00:35:10,080 --> 00:35:11,920 Speaker 1: Um My, thanks to Paul west Ed. What a what 570 00:35:12,000 --> 00:35:15,680 Speaker 1: a really insightful guy. Interesting book, Speed Game. You can 571 00:35:15,680 --> 00:35:18,280 Speaker 1: pick it up on Amazon whoever you pick up books. 572 00:35:18,280 --> 00:35:20,480 Speaker 1: A quick reminder of the Doug Gotlip Shows daily three 573 00:35:20,560 --> 00:35:23,160 Speaker 1: to six Eastern Time, twelve to three Pacific. If you 574 00:35:23,239 --> 00:35:27,960 Speaker 1: miss it, you can download the podcast wherever you download podcast. Obviously, 575 00:35:28,160 --> 00:35:30,520 Speaker 1: this all ball we were pretty big fans of, but 576 00:35:30,840 --> 00:35:32,839 Speaker 1: little Wayne joined us in the last one. You can 577 00:35:32,840 --> 00:35:36,439 Speaker 1: still download that one. Uh download, subscribe, subscribe, and don't 578 00:35:36,440 --> 00:35:40,320 Speaker 1: forget to rate us. Um I think we got a 579 00:35:40,400 --> 00:35:42,680 Speaker 1: chance of something pretty special over the next couple of 580 00:35:42,719 --> 00:35:45,560 Speaker 1: years in college basketball, as guys are gonna get a 581 00:35:45,640 --> 00:35:47,440 Speaker 1: chance to get an extra year of eligibility and not 582 00:35:47,520 --> 00:35:51,640 Speaker 1: count against the thirteen scholarship of living. College basketball to 583 00:35:51,719 --> 00:35:54,840 Speaker 1: me has been not just watered down because there's so 584 00:35:54,880 --> 00:35:57,439 Speaker 1: many teams and so many conferences and everything's on TV, 585 00:35:58,040 --> 00:36:01,400 Speaker 1: but because guys just leave too early. They just do 586 00:36:02,400 --> 00:36:04,520 Speaker 1: and we don't and they transfer so much we don't 587 00:36:04,560 --> 00:36:07,280 Speaker 1: know whose where. Like, I've done this for twenty years, 588 00:36:07,640 --> 00:36:10,440 Speaker 1: and I gotta do a much better review nowadays than 589 00:36:10,480 --> 00:36:13,360 Speaker 1: I used to because everybody transfers or goes to the pros. 590 00:36:14,000 --> 00:36:16,279 Speaker 1: But with the extra year of eligibility, has a chance 591 00:36:16,320 --> 00:36:19,919 Speaker 1: to reset reset the market. Mo. Yeah, by the way, 592 00:36:20,120 --> 00:36:23,480 Speaker 1: the g leagues in major trouble. This is a great 593 00:36:23,640 --> 00:36:26,000 Speaker 1: move by the n c A and one that could 594 00:36:26,040 --> 00:36:29,879 Speaker 1: help kind of regenerate some interest into college basketball as 595 00:36:29,880 --> 00:36:34,359 Speaker 1: we regenerate the the depth of talent because teams had 596 00:36:34,400 --> 00:36:37,680 Speaker 1: really become watered down losing entire teams on a year 597 00:36:37,719 --> 00:36:40,600 Speaker 1: to year basis. All Right, we got great interviews up 598 00:36:40,600 --> 00:36:42,920 Speaker 1: coming on future All Balls. Thanks so much for listening. 599 00:36:43,239 --> 00:36:45,719 Speaker 1: Don't forget to download, subscribe rate listen to the Doug 600 00:36:45,760 --> 00:36:48,560 Speaker 1: Gotlip Show Daily. I'm Doug Gottlieben. This is all ball, 601 00:37:00,160 --> 00:37:03,759 Speaker 1: simper