1 00:00:00,080 --> 00:00:12,240 Speaker 1: Ye, welcome to another episode of Varieties Strictly Business podcast, 2 00:00:12,280 --> 00:00:14,360 Speaker 1: where we talked with some of the brightest minds working 3 00:00:14,360 --> 00:00:18,959 Speaker 1: in media today. I mean Andrew Wallenstein with Variety Intelligence Platform. 4 00:00:19,000 --> 00:00:21,439 Speaker 1: Like everything else these days, the TV industry is in 5 00:00:21,560 --> 00:00:23,919 Speaker 1: a state of flux, to say the least. That's meant 6 00:00:23,920 --> 00:00:27,600 Speaker 1: a recalibration of all kinds of practices and processes for 7 00:00:27,760 --> 00:00:30,400 Speaker 1: people like my next guest, Ken Basin, is not just 8 00:00:30,480 --> 00:00:34,159 Speaker 1: the author of the book The Business of Television, he's 9 00:00:34,200 --> 00:00:37,479 Speaker 1: the head of business Affairs at Paramount Television. Welcome back 10 00:00:37,479 --> 00:00:40,440 Speaker 1: to Strictly Business. Ken. Thanks Andy, it's really fun to 11 00:00:40,440 --> 00:00:42,559 Speaker 1: be back. Yeah. I went back and checked and you 12 00:00:42,560 --> 00:00:48,000 Speaker 1: were on the podcast almost exactly two years ago, July one, 13 00:00:48,800 --> 00:00:51,880 Speaker 1: And it's only been two years, but honestly it feels 14 00:00:52,000 --> 00:00:56,240 Speaker 1: like two hundred. Yeah, you know, I think it's it's 15 00:00:56,360 --> 00:00:59,000 Speaker 1: been an exciting decade since I last spoke to you. 16 00:00:59,280 --> 00:01:04,440 Speaker 1: I think we've all lived many lifetimes in journeys since then. 17 00:01:04,640 --> 00:01:07,480 Speaker 1: So yeah, you know, no interesting updates, right, we can 18 00:01:07,520 --> 00:01:09,360 Speaker 1: make a quick short one of this. I'm sure it 19 00:01:09,360 --> 00:01:13,119 Speaker 1: should be pretty simple. Yeah. When we last talked, peak 20 00:01:13,200 --> 00:01:16,039 Speaker 1: TV was topic a and it seemed like the industry's 21 00:01:16,080 --> 00:01:20,319 Speaker 1: worst problem was there's too many TV shows. Fast forward 22 00:01:20,360 --> 00:01:23,840 Speaker 1: to now and there's barely any shows in production due 23 00:01:23,880 --> 00:01:27,520 Speaker 1: to the pandemic. And I'd imagine that means deal making 24 00:01:27,640 --> 00:01:31,800 Speaker 1: is going quite differently for you these days. Definitely, I mean, 25 00:01:31,959 --> 00:01:36,160 Speaker 1: certainly in the simplest terms. The focus is on development 26 00:01:36,240 --> 00:01:38,280 Speaker 1: right now because that's what we're in a position to do. 27 00:01:38,920 --> 00:01:42,240 Speaker 1: And uh, you know, Paramount, like every company, has been 28 00:01:42,240 --> 00:01:45,160 Speaker 1: thinking hard about how we can continue to do the 29 00:01:45,200 --> 00:01:47,800 Speaker 1: most business in the best way with the circumstances that 30 00:01:47,840 --> 00:01:49,680 Speaker 1: are in front of us. And so we know that, 31 00:01:50,440 --> 00:01:51,760 Speaker 1: you know, there's a lot of work to do to 32 00:01:51,880 --> 00:01:53,880 Speaker 1: manage the pandemic right now, but that there will be 33 00:01:53,920 --> 00:01:56,800 Speaker 1: another side of it, and so we're preparing ourselves with 34 00:01:56,880 --> 00:02:02,560 Speaker 1: a lot of new project generation, still working extensively with 35 00:02:02,640 --> 00:02:07,640 Speaker 1: writers and producers, trying to be very thoughtful about how 36 00:02:07,760 --> 00:02:10,280 Speaker 1: we put projects together and when we take them to 37 00:02:10,360 --> 00:02:12,400 Speaker 1: market to make sure that they get the best opportunity 38 00:02:12,440 --> 00:02:16,360 Speaker 1: to succeed and don't get swallowed up. Uh, within the 39 00:02:16,400 --> 00:02:20,400 Speaker 1: moment that we're in. But business is absolutely moving forward. 40 00:02:20,880 --> 00:02:23,320 Speaker 1: If you had asked me in March, what would I 41 00:02:23,360 --> 00:02:25,400 Speaker 1: be doing if lockdown was still going in late July, 42 00:02:25,520 --> 00:02:27,920 Speaker 1: I would have answered, probably a lot of yoga and 43 00:02:27,960 --> 00:02:30,320 Speaker 1: building legos. But as it is, I'm as busy as 44 00:02:30,360 --> 00:02:33,240 Speaker 1: I was on the first day of the lockdown, which 45 00:02:33,240 --> 00:02:35,600 Speaker 1: is as busy as I was a week before it began. Well, 46 00:02:35,639 --> 00:02:38,880 Speaker 1: let's put development aside for a second. Is there any 47 00:02:38,919 --> 00:02:43,920 Speaker 1: activity with regard to production resuming at some point for 48 00:02:44,000 --> 00:02:46,520 Speaker 1: shows that have obviously already made it through development and 49 00:02:46,560 --> 00:02:49,240 Speaker 1: are ready to go and all the things that go 50 00:02:49,360 --> 00:02:54,400 Speaker 1: into creating a safe environment for production. Should it happen 51 00:02:54,440 --> 00:02:58,239 Speaker 1: again anytime soon. Absolutely, And there's a couple of wings 52 00:02:58,240 --> 00:03:04,239 Speaker 1: in which that's taking place. One is just extensive dealmaking 53 00:03:04,360 --> 00:03:06,440 Speaker 1: is is one of the right words, but really just 54 00:03:06,560 --> 00:03:11,280 Speaker 1: coordination and collaboration between you know, studios and networks in 55 00:03:11,320 --> 00:03:14,680 Speaker 1: the environment, working together to come up with plans for 56 00:03:14,919 --> 00:03:18,000 Speaker 1: how we return and working to figure out what are 57 00:03:18,080 --> 00:03:21,160 Speaker 1: the sort of economic consequences of the moment and how 58 00:03:21,200 --> 00:03:23,720 Speaker 1: those are going to be borne by the various parties 59 00:03:23,760 --> 00:03:27,480 Speaker 1: involved with the show. Um, you know, I think every 60 00:03:27,560 --> 00:03:30,840 Speaker 1: large company is undertaking its own process to come up 61 00:03:30,919 --> 00:03:34,160 Speaker 1: with return to work rules, the new procedures that we 62 00:03:34,240 --> 00:03:37,520 Speaker 1: want in place to assure the safety and security of 63 00:03:37,600 --> 00:03:41,080 Speaker 1: cast and crew, but our network partners have opinions about 64 00:03:41,080 --> 00:03:42,720 Speaker 1: that sort of thing as well, and so part of 65 00:03:42,760 --> 00:03:45,480 Speaker 1: the process is, uh, you know, coming up with joint 66 00:03:45,520 --> 00:03:51,160 Speaker 1: plans that incorporate the priorities and needs and concerns of 67 00:03:51,720 --> 00:03:54,840 Speaker 1: both the networks and the studios. And in a sense, uh, 68 00:03:55,040 --> 00:03:56,440 Speaker 1: you know, those are only two of the voices of 69 00:03:56,440 --> 00:03:59,920 Speaker 1: the room. We're also incorporating the opinions and requirements of government, 70 00:04:00,240 --> 00:04:03,520 Speaker 1: where in extensive negotiations with the unions, all of them 71 00:04:03,520 --> 00:04:07,760 Speaker 1: over return to work rules, um, which involves you know, 72 00:04:07,840 --> 00:04:09,600 Speaker 1: a lot of commitments to them about how to keep 73 00:04:09,600 --> 00:04:13,000 Speaker 1: their members safe and all the while, you know, all 74 00:04:13,040 --> 00:04:16,200 Speaker 1: of these things come with costs. So we are you know, 75 00:04:16,520 --> 00:04:20,719 Speaker 1: in constant dialogue with the networks about what's the appropriate 76 00:04:20,760 --> 00:04:23,440 Speaker 1: allocation of those burdens in a way that is both 77 00:04:23,640 --> 00:04:27,720 Speaker 1: fair and also frankly allows these things to continue. I 78 00:04:27,760 --> 00:04:31,200 Speaker 1: don't think it's anybody's desire or really that anybody would 79 00:04:31,200 --> 00:04:37,039 Speaker 1: be well served by completely disclaiming responsibility for for any 80 00:04:37,080 --> 00:04:40,000 Speaker 1: aspect of what's going on. One of the lessons certainly 81 00:04:41,040 --> 00:04:43,000 Speaker 1: I'm taking, and I hope others are taking of this 82 00:04:43,080 --> 00:04:47,599 Speaker 1: pandemic moment is we live in a complex, interconnected ecosystem 83 00:04:47,640 --> 00:04:50,039 Speaker 1: where we all rely on each other. I mean, really, 84 00:04:50,040 --> 00:04:52,360 Speaker 1: we should have all known this all along, and so 85 00:04:52,480 --> 00:04:56,200 Speaker 1: we're trying to bring that attitude and perspective into coming 86 00:04:56,279 --> 00:04:59,599 Speaker 1: up with solutions for what we're dealing with right now, 87 00:04:59,720 --> 00:05:02,880 Speaker 1: because as there is economic pain to go around, and um, 88 00:05:02,920 --> 00:05:06,000 Speaker 1: you know, we ultimately want this to be sustainable and 89 00:05:06,000 --> 00:05:09,280 Speaker 1: survivable for ourselves and the parties that we work with 90 00:05:09,320 --> 00:05:12,359 Speaker 1: every day. In addition, as we're now a few months in, 91 00:05:12,480 --> 00:05:16,600 Speaker 1: we are starting to look ahead to deal making four 92 00:05:16,720 --> 00:05:20,520 Speaker 1: returns to production and that's a you know, tentative process 93 00:05:20,560 --> 00:05:23,920 Speaker 1: and it's a very i think custom process on our 94 00:05:23,920 --> 00:05:27,920 Speaker 1: project by project basis, because the situation isn't different everywhere, 95 00:05:28,040 --> 00:05:30,840 Speaker 1: excuse me, isn't identical everywhere in the world, and so 96 00:05:31,080 --> 00:05:35,120 Speaker 1: are sort of preparedness and anticipated timetables for going back 97 00:05:35,160 --> 00:05:38,760 Speaker 1: to production in Vancouver may be very different from those 98 00:05:38,800 --> 00:05:42,160 Speaker 1: in Los Angeles, may be very different from those in Australia, 99 00:05:42,480 --> 00:05:44,559 Speaker 1: depending on conditions on the ground. But we are also 100 00:05:44,600 --> 00:05:48,760 Speaker 1: starting the process of making deals with you know, line producers, 101 00:05:48,839 --> 00:05:51,599 Speaker 1: with casting directors and with other sort of key contributors 102 00:05:51,640 --> 00:05:55,200 Speaker 1: to the production of a series in anticipation of coming back, 103 00:05:55,680 --> 00:05:58,560 Speaker 1: but doing our best to prepare ourselves if those uh, 104 00:05:58,800 --> 00:06:01,080 Speaker 1: you know, optimistic hopes are an't always born out and 105 00:06:01,120 --> 00:06:04,240 Speaker 1: we have to push back even further. This all sounds 106 00:06:04,279 --> 00:06:08,920 Speaker 1: horrifically complex, and I know, even in the best of circumstances, 107 00:06:09,600 --> 00:06:13,080 Speaker 1: UH can be quite contentious. So what is the culture 108 00:06:13,080 --> 00:06:16,960 Speaker 1: of deal making right now? Because everyone's got to you know, 109 00:06:17,160 --> 00:06:20,520 Speaker 1: row the yours in the same direction to make it work. Yeah, 110 00:06:20,600 --> 00:06:23,279 Speaker 1: and I think there's a recognition of that. And I uh, 111 00:06:23,440 --> 00:06:26,960 Speaker 1: certainly one thing that I've observed and marveled at with 112 00:06:27,080 --> 00:06:30,000 Speaker 1: others who do what I do is, for the most part, 113 00:06:30,160 --> 00:06:33,600 Speaker 1: the culture of deal making right now has been very 114 00:06:33,600 --> 00:06:37,159 Speaker 1: positive and collaborative. I think there's a sense both that 115 00:06:38,080 --> 00:06:41,719 Speaker 1: on a professional and industrial level it is incumbent upon 116 00:06:41,760 --> 00:06:43,760 Speaker 1: all of us to figure this out so all of 117 00:06:43,839 --> 00:06:48,240 Speaker 1: us can continue to you know, earn revenue, run our companies, 118 00:06:48,600 --> 00:06:51,400 Speaker 1: make projects. And at the same time, I think there's 119 00:06:51,440 --> 00:06:55,560 Speaker 1: a recognition among everybody who's you know, bouncing a kid 120 00:06:55,640 --> 00:06:58,680 Speaker 1: on their knee during their work zoom meetings or otherwise 121 00:06:58,720 --> 00:07:03,080 Speaker 1: trying to reconcile uh, their their parental responsibilities of professional 122 00:07:03,120 --> 00:07:06,520 Speaker 1: responsibilities and maybe just a tiny corner of personal sanity 123 00:07:06,560 --> 00:07:08,320 Speaker 1: that everybody on the other side of the phone or 124 00:07:08,320 --> 00:07:09,840 Speaker 1: the other side of the zoom is going through much 125 00:07:09,840 --> 00:07:12,600 Speaker 1: the same thing. And so I think, um, it's really 126 00:07:12,640 --> 00:07:15,440 Speaker 1: been a healthy environment where people have kind of brought 127 00:07:15,440 --> 00:07:19,480 Speaker 1: their best selves to the negotiations, um, and and try 128 00:07:19,560 --> 00:07:22,280 Speaker 1: to approach things in a way that's solution oriented rather 129 00:07:22,320 --> 00:07:26,160 Speaker 1: than adversarial in a negotiating climate that is sometimes you know, 130 00:07:26,280 --> 00:07:30,080 Speaker 1: particularly adversarial among many industries, I think as Hollywood has 131 00:07:30,080 --> 00:07:34,640 Speaker 1: a reputation for I'd say if in deal making, one 132 00:07:35,040 --> 00:07:37,760 Speaker 1: clause I've heard more about in the last four months 133 00:07:37,760 --> 00:07:42,720 Speaker 1: than possibly the last ten years is forced masure, which 134 00:07:43,360 --> 00:07:48,200 Speaker 1: I can only imagine how different those clauses are in 135 00:07:48,320 --> 00:07:53,679 Speaker 1: terms of how they're structured going forward. Yeah, So, first 136 00:07:53,680 --> 00:07:56,200 Speaker 1: of all, I mean the biggest difference is that as 137 00:07:56,240 --> 00:07:58,040 Speaker 1: you say that, it's it's a pair of words on 138 00:07:58,080 --> 00:08:03,200 Speaker 1: everybody's lips, because traditionally deal making, uh, you know, force masure, uh. 139 00:08:03,240 --> 00:08:07,880 Speaker 1: And just to kind of define terms for for those 140 00:08:08,240 --> 00:08:11,000 Speaker 1: that it is you know, second nature to your force 141 00:08:11,080 --> 00:08:15,960 Speaker 1: masure is a concept under basic contract law about excusing 142 00:08:16,000 --> 00:08:19,880 Speaker 1: performance if there is a sort of major, unexpected third 143 00:08:19,920 --> 00:08:24,040 Speaker 1: party event that interferes with parties doing business under contract. 144 00:08:24,080 --> 00:08:26,800 Speaker 1: And so the classic examples of force masu are war 145 00:08:27,600 --> 00:08:33,199 Speaker 1: um uh. Labor strikes can be considered force masures uh. Floods, fires, 146 00:08:33,400 --> 00:08:36,960 Speaker 1: big sort of natural disasters, earthquakes, acts of God is 147 00:08:37,000 --> 00:08:41,120 Speaker 1: a sort of synonym that sometimes used. And in traditional 148 00:08:41,160 --> 00:08:43,520 Speaker 1: Hollywood deal making, you always knew that the force masure 149 00:08:43,600 --> 00:08:46,000 Speaker 1: was kind of a background aspect of virtually any agreement 150 00:08:46,000 --> 00:08:47,880 Speaker 1: that you entered into, but it was something you virtually 151 00:08:47,960 --> 00:08:51,480 Speaker 1: never talked about. It was routine. Um. It was something 152 00:08:51,520 --> 00:08:54,240 Speaker 1: that never came up the deal making phase where people 153 00:08:54,280 --> 00:08:56,360 Speaker 1: are focused on substantive terms. It was something that you 154 00:08:56,480 --> 00:08:58,880 Speaker 1: worked out in the paperwork once you got past that 155 00:08:58,920 --> 00:09:05,000 Speaker 1: first step. Now, especially with an eye towards productions coming back, uh, 156 00:09:05,080 --> 00:09:09,640 Speaker 1: you know, people are aware that the that force masure 157 00:09:09,679 --> 00:09:12,199 Speaker 1: plays an important role in what we're doing right now. 158 00:09:12,240 --> 00:09:14,600 Speaker 1: And really, for the first time in my career, force 159 00:09:14,679 --> 00:09:17,320 Speaker 1: masur is being introduced as a deal point in the 160 00:09:17,360 --> 00:09:20,480 Speaker 1: initial deal making phases. Uh. And one of the things 161 00:09:20,520 --> 00:09:22,760 Speaker 1: that's interesting about it is there is no sort of 162 00:09:22,760 --> 00:09:27,880 Speaker 1: disparity of information out there. Everybody's negotiating these points kind 163 00:09:27,920 --> 00:09:29,840 Speaker 1: of you know, looking at the world and having the 164 00:09:29,920 --> 00:09:34,960 Speaker 1: same observations and experiences, and so Talent are looking for 165 00:09:35,000 --> 00:09:39,080 Speaker 1: protections that if there's a resurgence of COVID that you know, 166 00:09:39,160 --> 00:09:42,720 Speaker 1: shuts production back down again after it resumes that they 167 00:09:42,760 --> 00:09:46,800 Speaker 1: will be protected in their compensation or at least, um 168 00:09:46,840 --> 00:09:49,480 Speaker 1: you protected in their flexibility if they don't want to 169 00:09:49,480 --> 00:09:54,240 Speaker 1: wait around indefinitely. And studios are as finally attuned as 170 00:09:54,280 --> 00:09:57,920 Speaker 1: ever to the importance of these clauses in protecting ourselves 171 00:09:58,440 --> 00:10:01,240 Speaker 1: because while we're not looking to s to manipulate any 172 00:10:01,280 --> 00:10:04,920 Speaker 1: situation with Talent, if we are forced to shut down production, 173 00:10:05,240 --> 00:10:07,040 Speaker 1: we need to be able to mitigate the expense of 174 00:10:07,120 --> 00:10:09,880 Speaker 1: that and um, you know, protect our ability to keep 175 00:10:10,160 --> 00:10:13,760 Speaker 1: key cast and crew together. So uh, you know, something 176 00:10:13,800 --> 00:10:16,960 Speaker 1: that became that spent many years as an afterthought has 177 00:10:17,000 --> 00:10:21,120 Speaker 1: become a central deal point, which you know, again brand 178 00:10:21,120 --> 00:10:24,880 Speaker 1: new to all of us in this game. Another aspect 179 00:10:24,920 --> 00:10:27,920 Speaker 1: that I would imagine is changing much for you is 180 00:10:28,440 --> 00:10:33,920 Speaker 1: how you're dealing with the AMPTP these days, given that 181 00:10:34,160 --> 00:10:38,840 Speaker 1: there's also the backdrop of all this pandemic issues playing out. 182 00:10:39,080 --> 00:10:45,760 Speaker 1: While tensions with the guilds are obviously front and center. Uh, 183 00:10:46,120 --> 00:10:50,840 Speaker 1: what has that been like? Sure? So Uh, look, was 184 00:10:50,840 --> 00:10:53,080 Speaker 1: going to be a big year for the AMPTP no 185 00:10:53,120 --> 00:10:56,840 Speaker 1: matter what, because is on the every three year cycle 186 00:10:56,960 --> 00:11:00,320 Speaker 1: where we're negotiating the d g A, w g A 187 00:11:00,440 --> 00:11:04,880 Speaker 1: and SAG after agreements anyhow, uh and so uh, you know, 188 00:11:04,920 --> 00:11:07,240 Speaker 1: no surprise that there was a role for them this year. 189 00:11:07,800 --> 00:11:10,760 Speaker 1: But you know, the pandemic, maybe more than anything that 190 00:11:10,800 --> 00:11:17,280 Speaker 1: I've encountered in my career, is a true hand industry issue, um, 191 00:11:18,600 --> 00:11:23,040 Speaker 1: something that is affecting every producer more or less equally. 192 00:11:23,360 --> 00:11:26,320 Speaker 1: I've never seen a situation where all production everywhere in 193 00:11:26,360 --> 00:11:28,880 Speaker 1: the world ground to halt all at once. And so 194 00:11:28,960 --> 00:11:34,040 Speaker 1: when you're facing a challenge that truly touches on every 195 00:11:34,040 --> 00:11:36,480 Speaker 1: part of the industry and affects everybody, there's an important 196 00:11:36,559 --> 00:11:39,520 Speaker 1: role for a trade group like the AMPTP so that 197 00:11:39,640 --> 00:11:43,800 Speaker 1: we can make smart decisions because you know, ultimately, UM, 198 00:11:44,480 --> 00:11:48,120 Speaker 1: I think Hollywood gets through this by recognizing our our 199 00:11:48,480 --> 00:11:53,359 Speaker 1: shared uh interests and are shared fate, and the AMPTP 200 00:11:53,480 --> 00:11:56,319 Speaker 1: becomes a vehicle for that. So uh, just as the 201 00:11:56,400 --> 00:12:00,880 Speaker 1: AMPTP is the central body through we we organized art 202 00:12:00,960 --> 00:12:05,720 Speaker 1: collective margeting, as we're now dealing more extensively with the unions, 203 00:12:05,760 --> 00:12:07,920 Speaker 1: on return to work rules. The A m B t 204 00:12:08,080 --> 00:12:11,839 Speaker 1: P is the vehicle through which we're having those conversations, 205 00:12:12,120 --> 00:12:16,199 Speaker 1: so every company doesn't have to negotiate independently with the unions. 206 00:12:16,480 --> 00:12:20,040 Speaker 1: The AMPTP has also had an important role in kind 207 00:12:20,080 --> 00:12:23,360 Speaker 1: of being the touch point for the industry with the 208 00:12:23,720 --> 00:12:27,800 Speaker 1: state and federal government officials. Again, we are submitting plans 209 00:12:27,840 --> 00:12:31,280 Speaker 1: and white papers to the governor in California and in 210 00:12:31,400 --> 00:12:35,160 Speaker 1: New York articulating the industry's vision for when and how 211 00:12:35,679 --> 00:12:40,720 Speaker 1: production should resume. The AMPTP has allowed us to speak 212 00:12:40,840 --> 00:12:44,000 Speaker 1: more or less with one voice so that we can 213 00:12:44,160 --> 00:12:50,200 Speaker 1: have that conversation most effectively, um ultimately, As I said, 214 00:12:50,360 --> 00:12:54,240 Speaker 1: you know, this is an area where I'm sort of 215 00:12:55,040 --> 00:12:56,520 Speaker 1: when I look at the challenge in front of us, 216 00:12:56,559 --> 00:13:02,240 Speaker 1: I'm reminded of kind of other similarly structural challenges to 217 00:13:03,559 --> 00:13:08,000 Speaker 1: television or film or entertainment where maybe the industry wasn't 218 00:13:08,000 --> 00:13:10,840 Speaker 1: always as smart about looking at itself as a unitary whole. 219 00:13:10,920 --> 00:13:14,080 Speaker 1: And sometimes I think about the rise of home taping 220 00:13:14,200 --> 00:13:16,439 Speaker 1: in the early eighties, where the music industry and the 221 00:13:16,800 --> 00:13:20,520 Speaker 1: film and television industry viewed themselves as separate and competitive 222 00:13:21,000 --> 00:13:26,160 Speaker 1: and did not work together. To come up with legislative 223 00:13:26,200 --> 00:13:30,559 Speaker 1: solutions or regulatory solutions to protect themselves from piracy, and 224 00:13:31,160 --> 00:13:33,600 Speaker 1: as a result, I think suffered a lot more from 225 00:13:33,640 --> 00:13:37,280 Speaker 1: initially home taping piracy in the eighties leading to internet 226 00:13:37,320 --> 00:13:40,480 Speaker 1: piracy in the two thousands because they did not approach 227 00:13:40,600 --> 00:13:43,599 Speaker 1: things as a group, um and as an industry with 228 00:13:43,679 --> 00:13:46,680 Speaker 1: common goals. Uh. Here, I think that the industry has 229 00:13:46,720 --> 00:13:48,400 Speaker 1: been much more intelligent about saying that, you know what, 230 00:13:48,880 --> 00:13:52,559 Speaker 1: there isn't a division between producers and platforms, or studios 231 00:13:52,559 --> 00:13:56,199 Speaker 1: and networks here, or talent and studios, um. Ultimately we 232 00:13:56,280 --> 00:13:58,520 Speaker 1: all get back to work together. And so I think 233 00:13:58,520 --> 00:14:00,959 Speaker 1: the AMPTP again has been a very useful vehicle for 234 00:14:01,360 --> 00:14:06,920 Speaker 1: taking that collective approach, got it? Uh? And if as 235 00:14:07,000 --> 00:14:09,160 Speaker 1: we talk here, I feel like we're adding layer upon 236 00:14:09,320 --> 00:14:12,240 Speaker 1: layer of complexity. So let me just throw yet another 237 00:14:12,800 --> 00:14:16,480 Speaker 1: thing on the stack here, which is the diversity issue, 238 00:14:17,000 --> 00:14:20,600 Speaker 1: which is obviously a huge subject in the wake of 239 00:14:20,960 --> 00:14:24,680 Speaker 1: the Black Lives Matter movement. And you know, I'm curious, 240 00:14:25,200 --> 00:14:30,600 Speaker 1: does that is that something that is already sort of 241 00:14:30,760 --> 00:14:35,960 Speaker 1: permeating deal making, permeating even the culture of companies like 242 00:14:36,120 --> 00:14:39,000 Speaker 1: Paramount right now, given there's so much to reckon with 243 00:14:39,160 --> 00:14:44,800 Speaker 1: their Yeah, I mean, I think it's it's it operates 244 00:14:44,920 --> 00:14:47,680 Speaker 1: independently of the pandemic. I think it's it's an issue 245 00:14:47,680 --> 00:14:50,920 Speaker 1: in a conversation that predates the pandemic. But as you know, 246 00:14:52,080 --> 00:14:55,160 Speaker 1: twenty isn't hurting for big news stories and big challenges 247 00:14:55,200 --> 00:14:58,520 Speaker 1: to society, and we are all being forced to sort 248 00:14:58,520 --> 00:15:01,640 Speaker 1: of reckon with racial engage us as an inequity on 249 00:15:01,720 --> 00:15:04,920 Speaker 1: a social level in a really meaningful way and and 250 00:15:05,200 --> 00:15:07,640 Speaker 1: and more forcefully than has been the case of the past. 251 00:15:07,760 --> 00:15:11,240 Speaker 1: So I think the industry has talked the talk about 252 00:15:11,360 --> 00:15:14,480 Speaker 1: taking diversity and inclusion seriously for some time, but uh, 253 00:15:14,680 --> 00:15:18,120 Speaker 1: you know, the events of the Black Lives Matter protests, 254 00:15:18,480 --> 00:15:20,920 Speaker 1: you know, the murders of of George Floyd and mad 255 00:15:20,960 --> 00:15:24,640 Speaker 1: Aarberry and others have, um, you know, encouraged everybody to 256 00:15:24,640 --> 00:15:26,960 Speaker 1: start walking the walk in a bigger way and to 257 00:15:27,360 --> 00:15:31,040 Speaker 1: really commit themselves to these these issues in in more 258 00:15:31,200 --> 00:15:34,360 Speaker 1: tangible ways. I think a lot of companies are looking 259 00:15:34,400 --> 00:15:36,560 Speaker 1: at their own numbers. I think Paramount has a good 260 00:15:36,600 --> 00:15:40,480 Speaker 1: track record organically over the last few years of seeking 261 00:15:40,520 --> 00:15:45,680 Speaker 1: out diverse storytellers and diverse stories. But yeah, I mean, 262 00:15:45,840 --> 00:15:51,480 Speaker 1: I think the moment demands real action and not just platitudes. 263 00:15:51,920 --> 00:15:54,960 Speaker 1: And so every company is going through a period of 264 00:15:55,040 --> 00:15:59,120 Speaker 1: introspection about where it's truly at and how it gets 265 00:15:59,160 --> 00:16:03,520 Speaker 1: to a better place. And I'm sure that's also working 266 00:16:03,600 --> 00:16:06,680 Speaker 1: itself into where we started the conversation in terms of 267 00:16:06,760 --> 00:16:10,440 Speaker 1: your your focus now on the development front. I understand 268 00:16:10,520 --> 00:16:14,200 Speaker 1: that that sort of proceeds apace. But given you don't 269 00:16:14,240 --> 00:16:17,200 Speaker 1: really know when a lot of what you're talking about 270 00:16:17,200 --> 00:16:19,840 Speaker 1: in development will actually be put in production, how does 271 00:16:19,960 --> 00:16:27,320 Speaker 1: that impact the usual development deal making? Well, Um, for one, 272 00:16:27,440 --> 00:16:31,120 Speaker 1: it requires a lot of communication between the studio and 273 00:16:31,240 --> 00:16:33,360 Speaker 1: the talent and the representatives about what's the plan and 274 00:16:33,480 --> 00:16:36,920 Speaker 1: what's the process. You know, deal making is all well 275 00:16:37,000 --> 00:16:40,560 Speaker 1: and good, but deal making is really designed to the 276 00:16:40,640 --> 00:16:42,680 Speaker 1: way that I think about it as kind of getting 277 00:16:42,720 --> 00:16:46,680 Speaker 1: getting every uh documenting everybody being on the same page 278 00:16:46,720 --> 00:16:48,520 Speaker 1: and what our understandings and what the rules will be 279 00:16:48,760 --> 00:16:51,680 Speaker 1: will be. But the sort of you know, root of that, 280 00:16:51,920 --> 00:16:54,760 Speaker 1: like another step up, is just actually understanding each other 281 00:16:54,800 --> 00:16:58,280 Speaker 1: and having a plan. So we're having transparent conversations with 282 00:16:58,640 --> 00:17:01,280 Speaker 1: our with the writers and producers that we work with 283 00:17:01,320 --> 00:17:04,119 Speaker 1: about what we think the timetable should be. UM Paramount 284 00:17:04,160 --> 00:17:07,399 Speaker 1: has always invested heavily in internal development. You know, there 285 00:17:07,440 --> 00:17:10,680 Speaker 1: are studios that focus more on ifcom arrangements, put together 286 00:17:10,760 --> 00:17:13,080 Speaker 1: a quick package, take a pitch out, take it to market, 287 00:17:13,320 --> 00:17:18,280 Speaker 1: versus blinds, firm script deals, long internal development and packaging processes. 288 00:17:18,880 --> 00:17:21,640 Speaker 1: Paramount has always done a bit of both, and certainly 289 00:17:22,160 --> 00:17:25,280 Speaker 1: we're extra focused on internal development right now because we 290 00:17:25,400 --> 00:17:28,520 Speaker 1: do not want to again take projects out into a 291 00:17:28,600 --> 00:17:32,920 Speaker 1: marketplace where our buyers are maybe feeling really financially stressed 292 00:17:33,520 --> 00:17:36,040 Speaker 1: or kind of you know, struggling with their budgets for 293 00:17:36,080 --> 00:17:40,040 Speaker 1: the year, and so we're taking our time UM working 294 00:17:40,080 --> 00:17:46,399 Speaker 1: on second scripts, bibles and formats. UM. We are being 295 00:17:47,200 --> 00:17:49,440 Speaker 1: you know, we we want to give our projects the 296 00:17:49,480 --> 00:17:52,680 Speaker 1: best opportunity to succeed, and sometimes that means waiting a 297 00:17:52,760 --> 00:17:55,360 Speaker 1: minute so that they kind of reach the most receptive audience. 298 00:17:55,760 --> 00:17:59,240 Speaker 1: And then part of you know, the next planning aspect 299 00:17:59,280 --> 00:18:01,440 Speaker 1: of that is how you cannibalize yourself and you don't 300 00:18:01,480 --> 00:18:03,960 Speaker 1: rush to take everything to market all at once and 301 00:18:04,200 --> 00:18:07,680 Speaker 1: to spread things out in a certain way. It's also 302 00:18:08,600 --> 00:18:11,240 Speaker 1: a task of how you manage kind of pre existing 303 00:18:11,280 --> 00:18:14,160 Speaker 1: development and projects that were already well along the way 304 00:18:14,880 --> 00:18:19,000 Speaker 1: uh to production UM, where maybe the network and the 305 00:18:19,359 --> 00:18:21,840 Speaker 1: studio agree that creatively, this is where we want it. 306 00:18:22,040 --> 00:18:24,320 Speaker 1: And you know, in a normal world this would be 307 00:18:24,359 --> 00:18:26,359 Speaker 1: ready to go, but we can't perceive right now. So 308 00:18:26,440 --> 00:18:28,639 Speaker 1: what do we do? And you know, we're talking to 309 00:18:28,720 --> 00:18:33,080 Speaker 1: network partners about conditional orders where you know, they're making 310 00:18:33,160 --> 00:18:38,560 Speaker 1: a commitment to the series moving forward, subject to you know, 311 00:18:38,720 --> 00:18:41,400 Speaker 1: answering those last questions about what's the cost and what's 312 00:18:41,440 --> 00:18:45,719 Speaker 1: the production plan in a COVID production environment, because we're 313 00:18:45,760 --> 00:18:50,000 Speaker 1: still in the process of quantifying that experience. UM. We're 314 00:18:50,040 --> 00:18:54,000 Speaker 1: also you know, uh, within our network development generating more 315 00:18:54,119 --> 00:18:57,560 Speaker 1: material and more scripts, uh, something that has I think 316 00:18:57,600 --> 00:19:01,880 Speaker 1: already been a trend of development where you're putting together 317 00:19:01,960 --> 00:19:04,480 Speaker 1: more written material before you get into production, so that 318 00:19:04,560 --> 00:19:07,719 Speaker 1: when production does resume, there's the hope of actually smoother 319 00:19:07,920 --> 00:19:10,800 Speaker 1: and easier production because there's more written material and the 320 00:19:10,840 --> 00:19:13,720 Speaker 1: traditional system of kind of rolling the writing and the 321 00:19:13,800 --> 00:19:16,120 Speaker 1: production process doesn't have to take place the same way. 322 00:19:16,359 --> 00:19:18,440 Speaker 1: You can walk into the first day of production with 323 00:19:18,560 --> 00:19:21,639 Speaker 1: more scripts ready. You can have you know, your scripts 324 00:19:21,680 --> 00:19:25,120 Speaker 1: done at an earlier phase in the production process. UM, 325 00:19:26,040 --> 00:19:28,600 Speaker 1: And it's a way to both kind of productively use 326 00:19:28,680 --> 00:19:30,720 Speaker 1: the time we can doing the work we can and 327 00:19:30,840 --> 00:19:33,400 Speaker 1: putting ourselves in a position to have the best production 328 00:19:33,440 --> 00:19:37,160 Speaker 1: experience when that's back on the table. So you've got 329 00:19:37,359 --> 00:19:42,200 Speaker 1: the development pipeline humming. Uh, I'm curious what this means 330 00:19:42,280 --> 00:19:46,480 Speaker 1: in terms of, you know, have you revised your expectations 331 00:19:46,560 --> 00:19:49,359 Speaker 1: in terms of the peak TV trend? Is this? Is 332 00:19:49,400 --> 00:19:52,200 Speaker 1: this still something that's gonna be a hockey stick curve 333 00:19:52,320 --> 00:19:55,119 Speaker 1: flying off to the top right of the chart, or 334 00:19:55,600 --> 00:19:58,520 Speaker 1: are we seeing some disruption of that now? I think 335 00:19:58,560 --> 00:20:01,600 Speaker 1: we are seeing some disruption and of that. Um. I 336 00:20:02,119 --> 00:20:05,679 Speaker 1: think that you know, the peak TV curve, even if 337 00:20:05,720 --> 00:20:07,720 Speaker 1: it was a hockey stick, it was never going to 338 00:20:07,840 --> 00:20:10,280 Speaker 1: be a perpetual hockey stick. There was always going to 339 00:20:10,320 --> 00:20:13,879 Speaker 1: be a plateau on the other end of it. And uh, 340 00:20:14,200 --> 00:20:18,200 Speaker 1: you know, I do think that this moment may accelerate 341 00:20:18,320 --> 00:20:22,480 Speaker 1: the arrival of that plateau. I mean the streaming wars 342 00:20:22,760 --> 00:20:26,160 Speaker 1: as as you know, people like that term. They're very competitive, 343 00:20:26,240 --> 00:20:28,800 Speaker 1: difficult wars. And I think there's broadly been a perception 344 00:20:28,920 --> 00:20:32,479 Speaker 1: that with the proliferation of all these new streaming services, uh, 345 00:20:32,680 --> 00:20:36,400 Speaker 1: not all will be able to survive forever. Uh. There's 346 00:20:36,680 --> 00:20:40,480 Speaker 1: a assumption that you know, households will tolerate a certain 347 00:20:40,560 --> 00:20:44,000 Speaker 1: number of subscriptions. I believe the average household in the 348 00:20:44,080 --> 00:20:46,760 Speaker 1: research I most recently saw in the US has if 349 00:20:46,800 --> 00:20:49,920 Speaker 1: it is a streaming household, has two point seven streaming subscriptions. 350 00:20:50,240 --> 00:20:53,560 Speaker 1: How much higher can that go? Especially in a time 351 00:20:53,720 --> 00:20:56,359 Speaker 1: when you know, put aside the economic stress on the 352 00:20:56,440 --> 00:20:59,040 Speaker 1: industry and the companies in the industry, there's economic stress 353 00:20:59,119 --> 00:21:02,879 Speaker 1: on the public, on everybody. People are looking at their budgets. Um, 354 00:21:03,080 --> 00:21:07,720 Speaker 1: you know, they're they're feeling economically insecure, even if their 355 00:21:07,840 --> 00:21:10,240 Speaker 1: jobs are still in place for now, and I'm probably 356 00:21:10,240 --> 00:21:12,719 Speaker 1: asking them tell their hard conunptions of do I need 357 00:21:12,800 --> 00:21:16,000 Speaker 1: four or five subscription services. One of the trope phrases 358 00:21:16,000 --> 00:21:17,359 Speaker 1: that I've been using for a while is, you know, 359 00:21:17,440 --> 00:21:19,359 Speaker 1: this time a year and a half ago there were 360 00:21:19,400 --> 00:21:22,160 Speaker 1: three premious subscription services. This time next year there will 361 00:21:22,200 --> 00:21:23,760 Speaker 1: be eight, and this time four years from now there 362 00:21:23,760 --> 00:21:26,480 Speaker 1: will be four. Maybe I need to revise that to 363 00:21:26,560 --> 00:21:29,040 Speaker 1: this time three years from now there will be four, um, 364 00:21:29,359 --> 00:21:32,720 Speaker 1: because ultimately, you know, I think the business plan for 365 00:21:33,119 --> 00:21:37,600 Speaker 1: all of these companies contemplated being able to tolerate a 366 00:21:37,720 --> 00:21:40,159 Speaker 1: certain period of time of pain, a certain period of 367 00:21:40,200 --> 00:21:44,520 Speaker 1: time of operating at a loss to acquire the subscriber 368 00:21:44,600 --> 00:21:46,800 Speaker 1: base that it needs to kind of advance to the 369 00:21:46,880 --> 00:21:52,080 Speaker 1: next stage of the industry. And right now, all of 370 00:21:52,240 --> 00:21:56,280 Speaker 1: these new entrants into the market are going to have 371 00:21:56,400 --> 00:21:58,240 Speaker 1: a Harvard time to what have otherwise been the case 372 00:21:58,560 --> 00:22:03,080 Speaker 1: building up their original content offerings. So putting together that 373 00:22:03,240 --> 00:22:06,440 Speaker 1: really appealing package to the consumer to justify the initial 374 00:22:06,440 --> 00:22:08,760 Speaker 1: subscription is a little bit more challenging if you can't 375 00:22:08,880 --> 00:22:13,399 Speaker 1: load up your number of new shows, and uh, the 376 00:22:13,840 --> 00:22:17,400 Speaker 1: sort of macro economic pressure that everybody is under may 377 00:22:17,520 --> 00:22:20,240 Speaker 1: make it harder for these companies to be willing to 378 00:22:20,440 --> 00:22:23,760 Speaker 1: operate these services at significant losses for two, three or 379 00:22:23,760 --> 00:22:26,080 Speaker 1: four years at a time to make it to that 380 00:22:26,160 --> 00:22:29,720 Speaker 1: phase of profitability. So I do think there's a risk that, um, 381 00:22:30,040 --> 00:22:34,119 Speaker 1: you know that the pandemic is going to accelerate the 382 00:22:34,160 --> 00:22:39,080 Speaker 1: contraction in the number of platforms that are active in 383 00:22:39,119 --> 00:22:42,760 Speaker 1: the marketplace, which probably comes with a contraction in the 384 00:22:42,840 --> 00:22:46,240 Speaker 1: overall volume of production that's in the marketplace. Uh. So 385 00:22:46,520 --> 00:22:48,880 Speaker 1: you know, it's not the end of peak TV right now, 386 00:22:49,080 --> 00:22:52,119 Speaker 1: but I do wonder if you know peak TV as 387 00:22:52,160 --> 00:22:53,920 Speaker 1: we understand it. I think when we last spoke, I 388 00:22:54,040 --> 00:22:57,400 Speaker 1: predicted a you know further five year runway to peak 389 00:22:57,480 --> 00:23:01,159 Speaker 1: TV before things we're going to start really tightening up. 390 00:23:01,359 --> 00:23:03,399 Speaker 1: I think there's a good chance that that five year 391 00:23:03,440 --> 00:23:06,480 Speaker 1: runway may look more like a three year runway. I 392 00:23:06,640 --> 00:23:08,960 Speaker 1: hear you. I follow the logic, but I would also 393 00:23:09,040 --> 00:23:14,120 Speaker 1: be remiss in not noting that your parent company, Viacom 394 00:23:14,200 --> 00:23:19,240 Speaker 1: CBS seems intent on entering this marketplace and a lot 395 00:23:19,400 --> 00:23:23,199 Speaker 1: later than many of the other players. So how does 396 00:23:23,280 --> 00:23:27,400 Speaker 1: that bode for your company's effort on this front. Well, look, 397 00:23:27,440 --> 00:23:29,880 Speaker 1: I think I think we have to be clear eyed 398 00:23:29,920 --> 00:23:32,399 Speaker 1: about the challenge in front of us. I think for 399 00:23:33,720 --> 00:23:38,159 Speaker 1: Viacom CBS, the focus is on marshaling the combined resources 400 00:23:38,200 --> 00:23:42,159 Speaker 1: of the recently merged company and sort of um uh 401 00:23:43,040 --> 00:23:46,680 Speaker 1: bringing to bear for the company, UH quality assets that 402 00:23:46,720 --> 00:23:49,080 Speaker 1: we've kind of kept in our back pockets. Where we 403 00:23:49,240 --> 00:23:55,000 Speaker 1: at Paramount are extensive conversations with CBS all access about 404 00:23:55,400 --> 00:23:59,679 Speaker 1: Paramount titles that are a good fit for for the service. UH. 405 00:24:00,160 --> 00:24:04,520 Speaker 1: Paramounts Library has always been sort of are big kind 406 00:24:04,560 --> 00:24:08,720 Speaker 1: of entered market advantage as an independent studio of A 407 00:24:08,760 --> 00:24:10,960 Speaker 1: big reason why we've been able to establish ourselves as 408 00:24:11,080 --> 00:24:15,720 Speaker 1: quickly as we have is by accessing the resources of 409 00:24:15,800 --> 00:24:17,720 Speaker 1: the great i P that we've got, and and sort 410 00:24:17,760 --> 00:24:20,080 Speaker 1: of more that has been brought back into the fold 411 00:24:20,160 --> 00:24:22,560 Speaker 1: because of the combination CBS, and some of that i 412 00:24:22,680 --> 00:24:25,199 Speaker 1: P was sort of split up between the companies when 413 00:24:25,280 --> 00:24:29,160 Speaker 1: they divided back in two thousand six. There's a lot 414 00:24:29,320 --> 00:24:32,320 Speaker 1: that has been sort of held in reserve, UM that 415 00:24:32,800 --> 00:24:36,920 Speaker 1: we can now deploy for CBS all access some kind 416 00:24:36,920 --> 00:24:40,639 Speaker 1: of crown jewel ideas. UM. I can't say a lot 417 00:24:40,720 --> 00:24:42,480 Speaker 1: more than that at this phase, other than to say 418 00:24:42,520 --> 00:24:45,560 Speaker 1: that there's still fuel in the tank, UM, and and 419 00:24:47,000 --> 00:24:51,120 Speaker 1: we're going to have to strike that balance between remaining 420 00:24:51,160 --> 00:24:55,440 Speaker 1: active in the ecosystem and maintaining our relationships with outside 421 00:24:55,440 --> 00:24:59,560 Speaker 1: companies while supporting the big strategic endeavor of ICOM CBS 422 00:24:59,600 --> 00:25:02,280 Speaker 1: as a whole. Yeah. I mean that to me would 423 00:25:02,320 --> 00:25:04,440 Speaker 1: be the big question. You know, you're gonna need a 424 00:25:04,520 --> 00:25:07,760 Speaker 1: lot of fuel in that tank to you know, fuel 425 00:25:07,960 --> 00:25:11,600 Speaker 1: up other rival companies with your content, but at the 426 00:25:11,720 --> 00:25:15,399 Speaker 1: same time, uh, fueling your own effort. And I know 427 00:25:15,520 --> 00:25:18,920 Speaker 1: it's early days and it's not clear what what Viacom 428 00:25:19,080 --> 00:25:23,720 Speaker 1: CBS is exactly doing, UM, but you know that also 429 00:25:23,800 --> 00:25:27,639 Speaker 1: begs another question, which is last time we talked Vicom 430 00:25:27,760 --> 00:25:31,480 Speaker 1: CBS did not exist. Uh, you guys were off separately 431 00:25:31,560 --> 00:25:35,320 Speaker 1: with Viacom. So you know, sort of layer five in 432 00:25:35,400 --> 00:25:39,239 Speaker 1: our you know, complicated stack of of what's making your 433 00:25:39,320 --> 00:25:42,560 Speaker 1: life tough these days. Does that change the nature of 434 00:25:42,640 --> 00:25:47,120 Speaker 1: deal making having a new parent company, Yeah, I mean 435 00:25:47,400 --> 00:25:53,800 Speaker 1: certainly there are lines of of business that there's a 436 00:25:53,880 --> 00:25:57,600 Speaker 1: natural expectation that everybody's going to take advantage of. We 437 00:25:58,000 --> 00:26:02,800 Speaker 1: as as Paramount, already had had relationships with UM, you know, 438 00:26:02,880 --> 00:26:06,040 Speaker 1: showtime and CPS all access prior to the merger, but 439 00:26:06,320 --> 00:26:11,560 Speaker 1: those have deepened tremendously. We still operate on an arms 440 00:26:11,640 --> 00:26:15,000 Speaker 1: length basis. We have obligations to participants. Uh, you know, 441 00:26:15,080 --> 00:26:17,320 Speaker 1: we're trying to maintain our own business, but it's also 442 00:26:17,359 --> 00:26:20,280 Speaker 1: a deal making context in which you know, everybody understands 443 00:26:20,320 --> 00:26:23,520 Speaker 1: it's got to get done. UM. Not figuring it out 444 00:26:23,720 --> 00:26:26,920 Speaker 1: is not an acceptable result. But the good news is 445 00:26:27,040 --> 00:26:31,359 Speaker 1: I think everybody is a real professional, and the experiences 446 00:26:31,440 --> 00:26:35,000 Speaker 1: that we've had since the merger UM have actually been really, 447 00:26:35,080 --> 00:26:40,560 Speaker 1: really uniformly positive in terms of I think that one 448 00:26:40,640 --> 00:26:43,480 Speaker 1: thing that I've encountered in large companies UM, and I've 449 00:26:43,520 --> 00:26:46,480 Speaker 1: worked in large companies over my career is when different 450 00:26:46,520 --> 00:26:50,080 Speaker 1: parts of companies are working, you know, into company, there's 451 00:26:50,119 --> 00:26:52,800 Speaker 1: often an expectation on both sides that each is owed 452 00:26:52,840 --> 00:26:55,960 Speaker 1: a sweetheart deal. And it actually increases the friction rather 453 00:26:56,000 --> 00:26:58,680 Speaker 1: than decreases it, because everybody thinks they should be on 454 00:26:58,800 --> 00:27:02,879 Speaker 1: the good end of the favor. Essentially, Um, it's counterproductive 455 00:27:03,640 --> 00:27:06,840 Speaker 1: and UM and it you know, I think it leads 456 00:27:06,840 --> 00:27:10,399 Speaker 1: to bad results. The attitude that I've found within the 457 00:27:10,520 --> 00:27:14,440 Speaker 1: vi Com CBS merger is nobody's expecting anybody to do 458 00:27:14,520 --> 00:27:17,280 Speaker 1: them tremendous favors. We're expecting each other to work with 459 00:27:17,320 --> 00:27:22,000 Speaker 1: each other reasonably, uh, to kind of cut the nonsense 460 00:27:22,080 --> 00:27:26,000 Speaker 1: and find the real business solutions and to um, you know, 461 00:27:26,160 --> 00:27:29,000 Speaker 1: operate fairly. And there are real professionals on all sides 462 00:27:29,080 --> 00:27:32,359 Speaker 1: to understand the marketplace. And so those have been I 463 00:27:32,480 --> 00:27:36,440 Speaker 1: think really productive and for the most part, smooth conversations. Um, 464 00:27:36,840 --> 00:27:39,600 Speaker 1: it's been I don't want to say a pleasant surprise 465 00:27:39,680 --> 00:27:42,760 Speaker 1: because I don't want to. I wasn't necessarily so dower 466 00:27:42,880 --> 00:27:45,760 Speaker 1: on in advance. But I think it's gone really well. 467 00:27:46,920 --> 00:27:49,240 Speaker 1: That's good. And we've talked a lot about streaming. But 468 00:27:49,520 --> 00:27:52,159 Speaker 1: you know, I remember last time we spoke about you 469 00:27:52,280 --> 00:27:56,320 Speaker 1: had particular takes on the future of broadcast and cable 470 00:27:56,400 --> 00:28:00,760 Speaker 1: television in this landscape. Have those changed at all? Do 471 00:28:00,920 --> 00:28:05,000 Speaker 1: they still have seats at the table for who knows 472 00:28:05,080 --> 00:28:08,760 Speaker 1: how long? Yeah? I mean so, I think I think 473 00:28:08,800 --> 00:28:11,600 Speaker 1: a lot of my production predictions from our last session 474 00:28:11,920 --> 00:28:15,240 Speaker 1: umor have have been borne out to an extent and 475 00:28:15,560 --> 00:28:19,080 Speaker 1: maybe supported by recent events, and some uh, you know, 476 00:28:19,200 --> 00:28:22,960 Speaker 1: require some further thought. When we talked about broadcasters, my 477 00:28:23,080 --> 00:28:25,800 Speaker 1: going theory was that the best approach for broadcasters would 478 00:28:25,840 --> 00:28:30,200 Speaker 1: be to refocus on the content that was traditionally successful 479 00:28:30,200 --> 00:28:33,359 Speaker 1: in their platforms that hadn't been as popular in streaming, 480 00:28:33,440 --> 00:28:38,440 Speaker 1: so things like reality, multi camera comedies, excuse me, procedural dramas, 481 00:28:38,880 --> 00:28:42,440 Speaker 1: classic broadcast television. Um. I think that's still true, and 482 00:28:42,480 --> 00:28:44,800 Speaker 1: I think that's more true than ever. Uh. And I 483 00:28:44,920 --> 00:28:48,560 Speaker 1: also I think it's worth noting that as as companies 484 00:28:48,600 --> 00:28:51,000 Speaker 1: are thinking about what kinds of productions can come back 485 00:28:51,160 --> 00:28:54,560 Speaker 1: into uh, what kinds of shows can go back into production, 486 00:28:54,560 --> 00:28:56,480 Speaker 1: as soon as those are the shows that are going 487 00:28:56,520 --> 00:28:59,200 Speaker 1: to find the easiest time to come back. Reality shows 488 00:28:59,280 --> 00:29:02,760 Speaker 1: with controlled stage environment, especially if you reduce the presence 489 00:29:02,800 --> 00:29:07,880 Speaker 1: of the audience, multi camera comedy, same logic versus some 490 00:29:08,000 --> 00:29:13,480 Speaker 1: of the bigger, complex, location oriented, large numbers of extras, 491 00:29:13,520 --> 00:29:17,520 Speaker 1: massive crew shows that are characteristic of quote unquote premium 492 00:29:17,520 --> 00:29:20,520 Speaker 1: television or streaming style television that I think are going 493 00:29:20,640 --> 00:29:24,280 Speaker 1: to take longer to really get back up to speed. UM. 494 00:29:24,960 --> 00:29:28,720 Speaker 1: So I think that sort of prescription for broadcast hold. 495 00:29:28,840 --> 00:29:30,680 Speaker 1: And I think that as we look ahead to how 496 00:29:30,680 --> 00:29:35,240 Speaker 1: they're going to actually program their two seasons, we're going 497 00:29:35,320 --> 00:29:37,800 Speaker 1: to see a lot of programming of that type. Uh. 498 00:29:38,240 --> 00:29:46,720 Speaker 1: Cable certainly is um it remains stressed. UM. I think 499 00:29:46,840 --> 00:29:49,920 Speaker 1: that uh, you know, when we spoke last there was 500 00:29:50,080 --> 00:29:54,000 Speaker 1: a contraction underway in the number of networks that we're 501 00:29:54,040 --> 00:29:59,480 Speaker 1: going to that we're investing in scripted programming UM, and 502 00:30:00,000 --> 00:30:03,760 Speaker 1: again particularly quoe unquote premium scripted programming. I think that 503 00:30:04,360 --> 00:30:06,760 Speaker 1: trend is continuing, and we are going to find that 504 00:30:07,200 --> 00:30:10,360 Speaker 1: some of the networks that you know, we have gotten 505 00:30:10,440 --> 00:30:12,320 Speaker 1: used to seeing scripted programming on are going to be 506 00:30:12,400 --> 00:30:16,960 Speaker 1: turning away from that, uh that content. In part that's 507 00:30:17,080 --> 00:30:21,440 Speaker 1: related to the rise of streaming. The all of these 508 00:30:21,520 --> 00:30:27,280 Speaker 1: major news streaming players are associated with traditional legacy media companies, 509 00:30:27,400 --> 00:30:29,320 Speaker 1: and so I think there's there's a little question that 510 00:30:29,440 --> 00:30:32,480 Speaker 1: HBO Max is really the focal point of the new 511 00:30:32,800 --> 00:30:35,920 Speaker 1: A T and T Warner brother environment. Peacock is really 512 00:30:36,000 --> 00:30:41,360 Speaker 1: the focal point of the new the Comcast NBC universal environment, 513 00:30:41,560 --> 00:30:44,160 Speaker 1: in the same way that by Coom CBS is streaming 514 00:30:44,240 --> 00:30:46,640 Speaker 1: is likely to be a significant focal point of the 515 00:30:46,800 --> 00:30:51,600 Speaker 1: Vicom CBS strategy going forward. And uh, as as you know, 516 00:30:51,680 --> 00:30:56,080 Speaker 1: companies are looking how to serve their digital offerings and 517 00:30:56,120 --> 00:30:58,920 Speaker 1: their cable offerings. You know, streaming is sucking up a 518 00:30:58,960 --> 00:31:00,920 Speaker 1: lot of the con tent and it's going to affect 519 00:31:00,920 --> 00:31:05,360 Speaker 1: the programming strategies for cable. Um. I think there will 520 00:31:05,400 --> 00:31:08,360 Speaker 1: always be a place for scripted on cable, but I 521 00:31:08,440 --> 00:31:12,280 Speaker 1: think scripted is going to become progressively less common on 522 00:31:12,480 --> 00:31:16,680 Speaker 1: cable and there will be a focus on specials on 523 00:31:16,920 --> 00:31:21,960 Speaker 1: unscripted um with a lot of the kind of traditional 524 00:31:22,080 --> 00:31:26,600 Speaker 1: dramas that we've gotten used to seeing being pushed more 525 00:31:26,680 --> 00:31:29,840 Speaker 1: towards the streaming side of the business. For streaming, it's 526 00:31:29,880 --> 00:31:33,520 Speaker 1: really about how do you take maximum advantage of this moment? Uh. 527 00:31:33,640 --> 00:31:36,440 Speaker 1: You know, Netflix's stock has been having quite the time 528 00:31:36,520 --> 00:31:40,320 Speaker 1: over the last few months. Um. Uh, you know, as 529 00:31:40,400 --> 00:31:44,880 Speaker 1: people are home, it's very obvious that they are looking 530 00:31:44,960 --> 00:31:46,600 Speaker 1: for ways to pass the time, and streaming is an 531 00:31:46,600 --> 00:31:49,920 Speaker 1: important part of that equation. So I think for every 532 00:31:50,000 --> 00:31:52,640 Speaker 1: streaming player it's about how do you sort of use 533 00:31:52,760 --> 00:31:54,720 Speaker 1: this opportunity to build the relationship with your customer and 534 00:31:54,840 --> 00:31:57,560 Speaker 1: make sure that it persists so that they remain interested 535 00:31:57,600 --> 00:31:59,480 Speaker 1: in your brand and your service once they're allowed to 536 00:31:59,480 --> 00:32:03,480 Speaker 1: go back out side again. Well, in keeping with our 537 00:32:03,560 --> 00:32:06,440 Speaker 1: every two year podcast schedule, I'm gonna ask you to 538 00:32:06,520 --> 00:32:10,720 Speaker 1: set your calendar for July. It'll be interesting to see 539 00:32:10,800 --> 00:32:13,720 Speaker 1: how much has changed when we do this again. Thanks 540 00:32:13,760 --> 00:32:16,400 Speaker 1: for coming on the podcast, Ken, Thank you Andy. Always 541 00:32:16,400 --> 00:32:25,800 Speaker 1: a pleasure. This has been another episode of Strictly Business. 542 00:32:26,200 --> 00:32:29,400 Speaker 1: Tune in next week for another helping of scintillating conversation 543 00:32:29,560 --> 00:32:32,440 Speaker 1: with media movers and shakers, and please make sure you 544 00:32:32,520 --> 00:32:36,320 Speaker 1: subscribe to the podcast to hear future episodes. Also, leave 545 00:32:36,360 --> 00:32:39,640 Speaker 1: a review in Apple Podcast let us know how we're doing.