Speaker 1: Hello. My name is Jason and Sepsio and I'm Rosey
Speaker 1: Night and welcome back to x re Envision, the podcast
Speaker 1: where we dive deep been to your favorite shows, movies,
Speaker 1: comics and pop culture. Coming to you from iHeart Podcast,
Speaker 1: where we are bringing you to action packed episodes a week,
Speaker 1: every Tuesday and Thursday.
Speaker 2: In today's episode, there's just one topic, baby, that's you
Speaker 2: know what it is.
Speaker 3: It's The Acolyte. We've been waiting for it and it
Speaker 3: is here.
Speaker 2: So in the airlock, guess what we're gonna be discussing
Speaker 2: the first two episodes of That Acolyte on Disney Plus
Speaker 2: with full spoilers, So listenableware, let's get into it.
Speaker 1: The Acolyte season. On episode one, we open with a
Speaker 1: crawl with a not quite a bit crawl, but more like.
Speaker 2: A it's a little it's a couple of steps, A
Speaker 2: couple of steps, yeah, not a full crawl.
Speaker 1: That basically tells us that where we are in time,
Speaker 1: we're one hundred years before the Rise of the Empire,
Speaker 1: the peak of the Jedi Order. Rosie, where would you
Speaker 1: date the rise of the Empire too? Do you date
Speaker 1: it to like the end of the Clone Wars or
Speaker 1: do you date it to like Order sixty six, I would.
Speaker 2: Probably say if they're talking about the Rise, I would say, like.
Speaker 3: The end of the Clone was.
Speaker 2: But I also thinking of Luke Becus film and the
Speaker 2: way this stuff is, I wouldn't be surprised if the
Speaker 2: hundred years they're talking about is just to Order sixty six.
Speaker 3: It's I think that being I think they may be
Speaker 3: being purposefully vague, which I think that.
Speaker 1: That's wise on their part, because you don't want to
Speaker 1: get painted into a quarter back to the recap. But
Speaker 1: independent Force users across space and time are forging their
Speaker 1: own relationships with the power that binds the galaxy, side
Speaker 1: stepping the directives, some would say, the overly authoritarian.
Speaker 3: Directives, definitely in this era.
Speaker 1: Of the Jedi Order. That's one thing we should say
Speaker 1: right away is this is one of the most critical
Speaker 1: mm hmm pieces of Star Wars storytelling with regards to
Speaker 1: the Jedi Order. Like it's openly like are they are
Speaker 1: they doing it the right way?
Speaker 2: I was kind of blown away by how openly critical
Speaker 2: this is of the Jedi, and not just in something
Speaker 2: I really like about this is not just in a
Speaker 2: way of those kind of like gotcha like they're doing
Speaker 2: something bad. It's actually in these different characters and representations
Speaker 2: of how the Jedi behave and what they believe, and
Speaker 2: you kind of build up to this feeling of.
Speaker 3: Oh, maybe we were right.
Speaker 2: Maybe the Jedi being completely in control wasn't a good thing.
Speaker 1: We meet an assassin who has tracked a Jedi master
Speaker 1: master in Dara to a cantena, and the assassin has
Speaker 1: a hand to hand fighting style which she augments with
Speaker 1: the force, a kind of raw force talent, and she
Speaker 1: has knives that she throws clearly guided by the force.
Speaker 1: Also in Dara, you get the sense that in Dara
Speaker 1: is just kind of getting the measure of this assassin
Speaker 1: and that without too much difficulty, could beat her, but
Speaker 1: wants to see what she can do. She recognizes her
Speaker 1: attacker you can see from her reaction, but when in
Speaker 1: Dara is distracted by having to save the life of
Speaker 1: a bystander, the assassin gets the opening she needs and
Speaker 1: sinks a blade right into her chest. I love this
Speaker 1: opening action sequence of nods to the matrix.
Speaker 2: I kind of love that they cast carry Am Moss.
Speaker 2: Everyone was like, oh my god, Carry.
Speaker 1: You were right, this is what we were right by
Speaker 1: the way.
Speaker 2: We were right, I thought she was gonna die, But
Speaker 2: I love that it feels almost like because of the
Speaker 2: Wujia influences the wirework that we get here, I feel
Speaker 2: like they said, hey, this is really influenced by the matrix.
Speaker 2: Let's have carry Ann play a part in this story, like,
Speaker 2: let's bring her in as one of these Jedi that
Speaker 2: this assassin is hunting down.
Speaker 3: I love this opening fight scene.
Speaker 2: I think it's really really cool, and as we get
Speaker 2: more into it, it also is like a key part
Speaker 2: of the story that this assassin fights that way.
Speaker 1: Elsewhere, Osha, a mechnic who looks identical to our assassin
Speaker 1: but is clearly not her, wakes up to start her workday.
Speaker 1: She's working on a Trade Federation ship. The officials on
Speaker 1: board are quite desperate to get where they're going to
Speaker 1: unload some very sensitive cargo, and it was I have
Speaker 1: to say, it was interesting to see the Trade Federation again. Yes,
Speaker 1: they clearly took something of the initial very bad in
Speaker 1: my in my estimation characterization of the Trade Federation from
Speaker 1: the prequel movies and kind of iterated on it.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 2: Yeah, playing it in a less terrible way. I agree,
Speaker 2: But they're still up to Shenanigans. They're still I mean,
Speaker 2: it's the Trade Federation. Also, can I just say, Osha
Speaker 2: is so Calcastis coded. She sets up, she's got her
Speaker 2: little ball, and she's like and she's wearing a little
Speaker 2: jacket and she's she's doing some mechanics, and I.
Speaker 3: Was like, I feel like Leslie Hedlund, who is.
Speaker 2: The showrunner of the show also the showruner of The
Speaker 2: Incredible Russian Doll on Netflix. She's talked about being a
Speaker 2: nice of the Old Republic fan, of being a Expanded
Speaker 2: Universe fan, but I want to know if she's also
Speaker 2: like a Jedi Survivor fan, because I feel like, oh
Speaker 2: is so much like Calcastis that I was getting it
Speaker 2: even feels like you're walking.
Speaker 3: Around his room, you know, in the ship. I loved
Speaker 3: that intro.
Speaker 2: And I just thought Amandla did such a good job
Speaker 2: defining those those two roles in that moment.
Speaker 1: Next thing, you know, that was what you want? What
Speaker 1: did the cops show up? The fuck isn't the fucking
Speaker 1: cop show? Gold Jackets a Night of the Jedi Order.
Speaker 1: Jord Fandar and his padawan Tassi are looking for Osha because,
Speaker 1: as we all saw, she matches to a t Uh
Speaker 1: the description of the assassin of Master Indar, and apparently
Speaker 1: Osha was once a Jedi in training. Ohan knows yord
Speaker 1: they were at the Jedi Temple.
Speaker 3: Together a bit of history there.
Speaker 1: Yep, they interrogate Osha, who again they suspected Nadar's murder.
Speaker 1: We learned that Osha was brought to the Jedi eight
Speaker 1: after her entire family was wiped out by something.
Speaker 2: Which, by the way, they point out, is very late
Speaker 2: for padawan.
Speaker 3: And so, by the way, yes, they're not just making
Speaker 3: child soldiers.
Speaker 2: They're making baby soldiers like eight is old to become
Speaker 2: a Jedi.
Speaker 1: And we should also note that throughout history the Jedi
Speaker 1: Order has like bent the rules or let in students
Speaker 1: later than they usually would, and those always end up
Speaker 1: being the notable ones. Don't they baby like that?
Speaker 2: Maybe you should learn something about that bringing them in
Speaker 2: at like ten maybe. So.
Speaker 1: Apparently Indara played some kind of role in OSHA's leaving
Speaker 1: of the Jedi Order, though Osha insists that it was
Speaker 1: all her decision, and she's like, I didn't do this,
Speaker 1: I would never kill her. Why would I do that?
Speaker 1: And then all of a sudden Jord brings in the
Speaker 1: barkeeper from the cantina, who immediately says, that's her, she
Speaker 1: did it.
Speaker 3: Yeah, who buy today?
Speaker 2: The assassin left thee because she saw that he had
Speaker 2: a child with him, So the assassin clearly has some
Speaker 2: kind of emotional kind of moral compass even though they
Speaker 2: are assassinating these Jedi.
Speaker 1: Right, not full Anakin, but like not a full Anakid killer.
Speaker 1: We go to Corusan, the Jedi temple. We meet Jedi
Speaker 1: Master Soul, who is training a group of patawans. His
Speaker 1: colleague Master Venestra brings Saul the news that the suspect
Speaker 1: in his friend master in Dara's murder has been caught
Speaker 1: and also it's his former padawan.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 1: Saul is like, what, no way, Osha, I can't believe this,
Speaker 1: you know, me and and Dara. We saved OSHA's life
Speaker 1: apparently and involved there was some kind of devastating fire
Speaker 1: that wiped out her entire family and they saved her
Speaker 1: from that. Venestra is like, well, listen, this murder is
Speaker 1: just bad pr like the aactics are terrible.
Speaker 2: Yeah, people think they can just go around murdering Jedi, Like,
Speaker 2: what's gonna happen it's gonna go badly.
Speaker 3: Oh, I just want to say as well.
Speaker 2: So there's two things about this that I think is
Speaker 2: really important. One, we're getting Vanestra around from the High Republic.
Speaker 2: Everybody loves her, everyone's really excited to see her. But
Speaker 2: I did love the in our discord, people are like,
Speaker 2: what happened in the last like one hundred and twenty
Speaker 2: three years to make us such like a sad sack?
Speaker 2: Like she used to be fun and now she is
Speaker 2: like a job's worth who loves the Jedi.
Speaker 3: And she's very sad. So like, I want to know
Speaker 3: people want to know that story, and I think that's
Speaker 3: a great point.
Speaker 1: So Vnestra tells Saul, like, you need to go investigate this,
Speaker 1: but quietly. And here's where I just want to say,
Speaker 1: I don't see red flags, but I this is the
Speaker 1: first of the interactions between Venestra and Saul where I'm like, hmmm,
Speaker 1: I agree with our discord that there's something different about
Speaker 1: this Venestra. Yeah, And I almost wonder as the mystery,
Speaker 1: as the murder mystery that is central to this story unfolds,
Speaker 1: if she does not have something to do with it.
Speaker 3: It does feel like.
Speaker 1: She doesn't it feel that way a lot, especially the way.
Speaker 3: She's like, we got to keep it underrat.
Speaker 1: We gotta keep it quiet.
Speaker 2: Everyone knows if you're trying to tell somebody to keep
Speaker 2: something a secret's usually something bad, right, Like you learn
Speaker 2: that from when you're a kid. I will say something
Speaker 2: I really love here. I love that while we have
Speaker 2: this incredibly cop like Jedi like with yourr is very
Speaker 2: much in that space your nab, I'm coming in, I'm
Speaker 2: coming in and I'm gonna mind probe you.
Speaker 3: And it's like, bro, that that doesn't look good.
Speaker 2: That's not that's not seen as a good thing nowadays
Speaker 2: thanks to you know, Kylo Ren. You do yeah right, yes,
Speaker 2: like it's all it's only bad. Don't don't do that.
Speaker 2: You need consent. But what I love is I actually
Speaker 2: find that Master Soul who's played by Squid Games at
Speaker 2: Lee Jung Jay, who's so fantastic here. I love that
Speaker 2: he is this more compassionate version of the Jedi who's
Speaker 2: almost going so much farther to the other, like further
Speaker 2: than an Obi Wan Kenobi Wood, where he has these
Speaker 2: students and they're thinking about what the force means to them,
Speaker 2: and you see people saying balance, water life, and he
Speaker 2: has young girl who says fire, it consumes everything, and
Speaker 2: Soul says, yeah.
Speaker 3: The Force is very powerful.
Speaker 2: He doesn't see that as her leaning to the dark side.
Speaker 2: He finds a way to look at it through a
Speaker 2: compassionate lens and understanding lens. And I really love that
Speaker 2: they decided to bring in this more nostalgic kind of loving.
Speaker 3: I mean, he clearly cares.
Speaker 2: About Osha, which you're not supposed to do in the Jedi.
Speaker 2: You know, a Jedi shall not feel love, hate, fear, anger,
Speaker 2: but Soul clearly has that. And I think it's a
Speaker 2: really interesting contrast to this era of the Jedi that
Speaker 2: we're seeing.
Speaker 1: I completely I completely agree on the transport to Corasanosha's
Speaker 1: fellow prisoner's launch an escape that paralyzes the ship. They
Speaker 1: get away in all of the escape pods, leaving Osha
Speaker 1: on a crashed ship. The ship ends up crash landing
Speaker 1: on the ice planet Carlac, and Osha survives.
Speaker 2: Oh yes, sorry, can we just I just need to
Speaker 2: bring up the Jedi again here please. Sarah is a
Speaker 2: prisoner on this ship who is being subdued by a
Speaker 2: mind altering parasite that the Jedi have attached to his face.
Speaker 2: So can we talk about this? Do you remember saw Guerrera,
Speaker 2: who we always support, who they say he went gully.
Speaker 3: Poor Gulley.
Speaker 2: But the Jedi in the Higher Republic era they are
Speaker 2: using like alien parasites Corris and it's not good, guys?
Speaker 3: Is it bad? The Jedi listen doing a bad thing.
Speaker 1: As we progress into the story, I think you're gonna
Speaker 1: find a significant amount of guilt questioning of the Jedi's
Speaker 1: motives and decision making processed from within the Jedi order itself,
Speaker 1: but that has for further on in the recap, Saul
Speaker 1: Force interrogates one of the prisoners that escaped from the transport,
Speaker 1: learns that Osha had nothing to do with the mutiny,
Speaker 1: and Osha is presumed dead at this moment, but Saul
Speaker 1: convinces Venestra to let him go looking for her on Karlac.
Speaker 1: Osha has a vision of herself for the assassin who
Speaker 1: looks like her, and we learn it's her sister Brendock
Speaker 1: May May. It's her sister May from the planet from
Speaker 1: Brendock right. It's her twin sister May. The vision becomes
Speaker 1: a flashback to the fire and the night that her
Speaker 1: family burned, and we learned that with it. Who's May OSHA's.
Speaker 3: No, no, no, Osha is Osha is Osha. May is May.
Speaker 3: But I understand they seem like, you don't.
Speaker 2: Know if it's actually her, if it's like a diad
Speaker 2: or like a jewel thing. But yeah, no, no, no,
Speaker 2: she's She is Osha and the other one is May.
Speaker 1: The vision of her sister admits to killing Indhara and
Speaker 1: then ads that she wants to kill all of them,
Speaker 1: who we and we presume all means the Jedi, kill
Speaker 1: all the Jedi. Soul catches his padawan, Jeckie up on Osha.
Speaker 1: Apparently it was the sister May who started the fire
Speaker 1: that killed the entire family, and Soul is convinced that
Speaker 1: she's dead because he saw her die.
Speaker 2: And also Jackie is played by daf Nicken, who is
Speaker 2: X twenty three and we love her and she's so
Speaker 2: cute and I love Jackie.
Speaker 3: I would die for Jeckie.
Speaker 1: She is a Thlin human hybrid yes, which is very
Speaker 1: very interesting. The theling. We're already a very rare species,
Speaker 1: and this seems like even more rare.
Speaker 2: And it's also like something that's really great is Jackie
Speaker 2: is really represented as like a logical kind of force
Speaker 2: user who's like, yes, why are you feeling nostalgic about
Speaker 2: your former padawan or whatever? But Soul is this great
Speaker 2: leader for her and this great mentor because he actually
Speaker 2: has more of that compassion. So they're a great kind
Speaker 2: of straight man and like soft team.
Speaker 1: I'm a fast It's wonderful on Carlac, Saul, Yord, and
Speaker 1: Jeckie track down Osha. They track her to like this
Speaker 1: underground tunnel that leads to an opening over a cliff
Speaker 1: where in what I think is the greatest easter egg
Speaker 1: in recent Star Wars history, a clear nod to the fugitive.
Speaker 2: It's so good because it's direct like to me, and
Speaker 2: you literally could put them over each other.
Speaker 3: It's so good.
Speaker 1: Down to the dialogue of Osha saying I didn't do it,
Speaker 1: she says she didn't do it. She falls off the
Speaker 1: edge just like doctor except Doctor Kimball jumped, and Saul
Speaker 1: catches her and pulls her back. I just love this
Speaker 1: easter egg one because it's not Star Wars, but it's
Speaker 1: Harrison Ford exactly. So you still got the vibes, so
Speaker 1: you still got the vibes and it's just it's just awesome.
Speaker 1: Osha tells Saul that actually May is alive, and elsewhere
Speaker 1: we see walk down a beach where she needs a
Speaker 1: mysterious figure with a some kind of affected voice.
Speaker 3: And a scary mask.
Speaker 1: With scary mask it looks like kind of chainsaw man esque,
Speaker 1: and the figure says to me that he wants he
Speaker 1: or she they want to destroy the Jedi and destroy
Speaker 1: their dream.
Speaker 2: Yeah, and and something something that I think is really
Speaker 2: cool about this episode that Susanna Polo wrote about Polygon
Speaker 2: is like he wants her to murder a Jedi without
Speaker 2: a weapon, and that is like a recurring theme throughout
Speaker 2: these two episodes. And it's really interesting because it's obviously
Speaker 2: something that he needs her to achieve, but we kind
Speaker 2: of don't know why. And I think that's really interesting
Speaker 2: because that's we've getting this Force fighting. But what could
Speaker 2: this potential because we don't know technically all the Siths
Speaker 2: should be gone at this period in time from what
Speaker 2: we know, but I'm assuming this is probably going to
Speaker 2: wreck on it, or maybe it will be some kind
Speaker 2: of different Dark Force users. But yeah, I'm very interested
Speaker 2: to see where they go with that before we continue.
Speaker 1: I forgot to note it here. I think I noted
Speaker 1: in the in the next part of the recap, but
Speaker 1: let's talk about it now. One notable feature of every
Speaker 1: fight scene involving May is that she makes a grab
Speaker 1: for the lightsaber every single time. I know, it's very
Speaker 1: notable in every fight scene.
Speaker 3: Why it is yourself?
Speaker 2: Or is she trying to get rid of it so
Speaker 2: that then she can kill them without a weapon, because
Speaker 2: the lightsaber is their ultimate weapon, you know, I'm very
Speaker 2: interested in that.
Speaker 3: And we know, like we see the.
Speaker 2: Mysterious you know, May's mysterious Master ignite his red lightsaber
Speaker 2: at the end, so we know he has a corrupted
Speaker 2: Kaiber crystal hypothetically and he already has that technology.
Speaker 3: May need a.
Speaker 2: Lightsaber or is she trying to get rid of it
Speaker 2: so she can kill them with this kind of force
Speaker 2: fighting technique because she does always pull out the knives
Speaker 2: at the last minute when everything else has gone wrong,
Speaker 2: you know. But yeah, it's I just thought like, this
Speaker 2: was such a good, scary ending, and I'm really excited
Speaker 2: to see where they go with this villain, because is
Speaker 2: this gonna be another scenario like ah Soca where we're like,
Speaker 2: is this villainous character gonna be someone that we know?
Speaker 3: And then it ends up not some Yeah, right, like
Speaker 3: is it Vnestra?
Speaker 2: I think we've seen I think in the discord we've
Speaker 2: had people who think it might be your especially with
Speaker 2: some of the timing between and yeah, I am very
Speaker 2: interested to see where it goes.
Speaker 3: And yeah, let's talk about the second episode because there's
Speaker 3: so much stuff in there.
Speaker 4: We'll be right back after a quick grip.
Speaker 1: And we're back. We open on the planet a Lega
Speaker 1: May quite easily, we should say, breaks into the local
Speaker 1: Jedi devil, no problem. She gets right in.
Speaker 2: And not just that, can I say she literally breaks
Speaker 2: in yet by getting like a child to annoy the
Speaker 2: entry droid and then she pops like a little bomb
Speaker 2: on his head.
Speaker 3: So let's this is actually a great thing that you've
Speaker 3: picked up on here, because this is how.
Speaker 2: Complacent the Jedi, extremely cool. They are so in power,
Speaker 2: happy without threat. They are at the top of the
Speaker 2: food chain that a literal child annoying an entry droid
Speaker 2: allows an assassin to get into the Jedi temple.
Speaker 1: She is there to confront Master Torbin, who we later
Speaker 1: learned has been meditating for ten years and has not
Speaker 1: spoken to anybody in there time. She finds him levitating
Speaker 1: in a chamber. She calls him out and says, I
Speaker 1: demand that you fight me with all of your strength.
Speaker 2: Yeah, which she also said ton Dara, which is very interesting.
Speaker 1: I think it's very interesting. And when there's no response,
Speaker 1: she attacks, but she cannot get through his impregnable force shields,
Speaker 1: so she flees on Karlac Yord wonders why Saul doesn't
Speaker 1: keep Osha restraint.
Speaker 3: He's like, oh, well, put her into force handcups.
Speaker 1: I'm like that your friend, that was you got to
Speaker 1: handcut the suspect.
Speaker 3: I'm like, didn't you grow up with her in the
Speaker 3: Jedi temple? Like this is your friend? Like what is
Speaker 3: wrong with you?
Speaker 1: I'm just saying, is she not a suspect and a murder?
Speaker 1: Don't we have to handcover anyway?
Speaker 4: On him?
Speaker 3: Be quiet?
Speaker 1: And I wanted you just shut up. Saul is on
Speaker 1: video link with Venestra and he tells her about the
Speaker 1: twins and about his twin theory and that it might
Speaker 1: be the sister that did it, even though he saw
Speaker 1: her die. Vinestra then tells Saul that there's been another
Speaker 1: attack on Olega by the same assassin who killed in Dhara.
Speaker 1: Uh So Osha is now cleared, so your chill the
Speaker 1: fuck out.
Speaker 3: Yeah, she didn't do it. She didn't do it, Brav.
Speaker 1: I know, but maybe she can aid in the investigation.
Speaker 1: You're also against that, right against it. I don't know.
Speaker 3: It's starting to act suspicious at this point. Him of Venestra,
Speaker 3: what's going on? I'm suspicious.
Speaker 1: Well, I think it's clear that whatever their history is,
Speaker 1: it plays into Orde's current feelings about Osha. Something, something
Speaker 1: about their time at the Jedi temple together is causing
Speaker 1: your tonack. Like this on Olega, May meets with her
Speaker 1: contact kmire a drunk played by the super handsome Manny.
Speaker 2: I love him so much and I think is like
Speaker 2: such an interesting character. Like when I when I interviewed,
Speaker 2: I interviewed the cast for IGN, and I was the
Speaker 2: thing about Kima that's so interesting is that he is basically.
Speaker 3: Just like a normal guy.
Speaker 2: He's not in the Jedi, he's not in the Sith,
Speaker 2: he's not being trained, he's not and Or who has
Speaker 2: a mission. He's just a guy who's just like trying
Speaker 2: to survive. Yeah, and that's something that Manny was like
Speaker 2: really drawn to is like, how do you just live
Speaker 2: in this world where there are these like unbelievable forces,
Speaker 2: And part of Kaim's answer is being drunk, being.
Speaker 1: Drunk all the time.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 1: May is very clearly under a lot of pressure to
Speaker 1: kill Jedi and by her mysterious mask, by her mysterious master,
Speaker 1: and she's currently bottlenecked on Torbin, who she can't even touch.
Speaker 1: So she suggests poison. Then Chymer makes for some and
Speaker 1: then we're gonna later find out it's a very unique
Speaker 1: and specific poison. Soloo should talk about May. Saul is
Speaker 1: sad that he couldn't save both sisters, although they're clearly alive,
Speaker 1: so you'd like, they're both alive. Yeah, success, you.
Speaker 3: Didn't do it. You didn't save her.
Speaker 2: But like, but also again, this is another this is
Speaker 2: another soul moment where it's like, yeah, he has these
Speaker 2: deep emotions that Jedi aren't really supposed to have.
Speaker 3: That's right now.
Speaker 2: But he's like, I've made peace with events, Osha, why
Speaker 2: can't just make peace with the fact justice to die?
Speaker 2: And now maybe she's not that and she's an assassin.
Speaker 2: Get over it, you gotta get over it. That's why
Speaker 2: you left the Jedi.
Speaker 1: I have to say, it's very interesting. You put your
Speaker 1: finger on it. It's like the Jedi dogma is disconnection.
Speaker 2: M hm.
Speaker 1: You don't care about this anymore, Like this is pain
Speaker 1: is part of life, and you let it wash over.
Speaker 1: You don't care about it. Saul seems to have a
Speaker 1: slightly different philosophy. But the difference I think is important.
Speaker 1: It's that he accepts that these terrible things have happened,
Speaker 1: he feels the grief, and then he learns to live
Speaker 1: with the grief exactly and not a disc It's not
Speaker 1: a disconnection of emotion. And I think that's a really
Speaker 1: important decision.
Speaker 2: And that's what he wants Osha to do, and that's
Speaker 2: what she could never do, and why it seems like
Speaker 2: she left the Jedi.
Speaker 1: Back on a lega May makes an attempt to Torbent again.
Speaker 1: She addresses him, this time pulls out the vial of
Speaker 1: poison which she she has on around her neck, and
Speaker 1: she feels that his four shields are weakening. So whatever
Speaker 1: she has said to him has seemed to like bringing
Speaker 1: him out of his meditation.
Speaker 2: Okay, so basically what it is is she pulls down
Speaker 2: her mask. He opens his eyes, he sees who she is,
Speaker 2: and then she basically says like, I can give you
Speaker 2: the I can give you the forgiveness that you need,
Speaker 2: like if you if you drink this poison, I'll forgive you.
Speaker 2: So it's like because because because he and he says,
Speaker 2: I've been waiting for ten years like she, He's been
Speaker 2: waiting for her to go there.
Speaker 3: Whatever.
Speaker 1: That is the question. What is the thing that it's
Speaker 1: like Jedi's What does this Jedi feel bad for? What
Speaker 1: did they do? And how intertwined is it with what
Speaker 1: happened to Ocean May.
Speaker 2: I've actually got to go to the discord because there
Speaker 2: was such a good theory about this that I need
Speaker 2: to name check the person who did it, because it
Speaker 2: is like so good, so Alo said our user. Alo said,
Speaker 2: I think Ocean and May are some kind of diad
Speaker 2: like what we saw in the sequel trilogy, and that
Speaker 2: the three Masters recognized May was the dark side of
Speaker 2: the pair, so they tried to kill her. I think
Speaker 2: that is so good, and so I love it and
Speaker 2: I think that that is how they were able to
Speaker 2: I love that so much, and I do think that
Speaker 2: there is a potential for some kind of diad here
Speaker 2: or I don't know if they would use that term
Speaker 2: after it coming up really in the Rise of the Skywalker,
Speaker 2: but I do think there's some idea of this force connection.
Speaker 3: Actually, until they confirmed that.
Speaker 2: They were twins in the first episode, I was pretty
Speaker 2: sure that they were going to do something where it
Speaker 2: was one person who the Jedi had split into.
Speaker 3: I thought maybe they'd tried kind.
Speaker 2: Of like Adam Warlock, where they made the Majors with
Speaker 2: all of his kind of evil side, and I wondered
Speaker 2: if they tried to do that where they'd found this
Speaker 2: very forced sensitive kid and tried to split the dark
Speaker 2: side away and that had become may But they're twins,
Speaker 2: and I think this idea of a diad who had
Speaker 2: tried to kill them, or you know, the other option
Speaker 2: is something like they're from a family of force users
Speaker 2: who weren't in the Jedi and the Jedi didn't like it.
Speaker 3: But I love this idea of a diet. I think
Speaker 3: it's so cool. I think Alo just absolutely smashed that theory, and.
Speaker 2: I love I love in that moment that Torbyn is
Speaker 2: like He's like I've been waiting for you, and she's like,
Speaker 2: I can give you the thing that you want.
Speaker 3: I can give you forgiveness. I can give you the
Speaker 3: peace you've been looking for.
Speaker 1: He's clearly so oppressed by guilt that the only way
Speaker 1: he can live within the Jedi strictures of disconnection of
Speaker 1: a feeling of emotion is to just be in meditation for.
Speaker 3: Such a good read. And so yeah, he does it.
Speaker 3: He drinks the poison. He drinks.
Speaker 2: Then he's like, He's like, I was just waiting for
Speaker 2: this child assassin to come and give me some poison.
Speaker 2: I'm I'm piecing out. I'm one with the force, and
Speaker 2: the forces, one.
Speaker 1: With what we should say before that. May offers him
Speaker 1: a choice before he drinks the poison, which is either, oh,
Speaker 1: you confess your crimes to the Jedi Council, which is
Speaker 1: interesting because it suggests that whatever was done was done
Speaker 1: without the explicit okay from the Jedi Council, which, by
Speaker 1: the way, I think would implicate a high up leader,
Speaker 1: but not all the way at the top. Someone yeah me.
Speaker 1: While Osha and Saul are in the Jedi temple as
Speaker 1: this is happening, Osha feels May's presence. Torb drinks the poison.
Speaker 1: As we said, he drops dead. The Jedi guards confront Osha,
Speaker 1: but Yord number one police officer.
Speaker 5: Yored in the building, who was following her but apparently
Speaker 5: not following close enough to like actually stop the killing,
Speaker 5: is like, you know what I was, I was watching
Speaker 5: her the whole time.
Speaker 3: She didn't, I will say, very suspicious.
Speaker 2: And this is one of the reasons why our discord
Speaker 2: is proposing that Yord may be the master, because it
Speaker 2: seems like he comes back too quickly, and he's like,
Speaker 2: shouldn't do it?
Speaker 3: I don't worry, wasn't that? And May's gone, sorry, oh
Speaker 3: she's gone.
Speaker 1: Osha recognizes the poison. It's called Bunta, it's native to
Speaker 1: her home planet of Brendoc, and it's got a very
Speaker 1: short life span, so it must have been brewed on
Speaker 1: planet and close by because it quickly loses effectiveness over time.
Speaker 1: Solo the Jedi quickly I d Kimier. Jeckie suggests, Hey,
Speaker 1: why don't we send Osha as May to go meet
Speaker 1: with Kimier.
Speaker 2: By the way, very smart, because your suggestion is to
Speaker 2: just go in there and cop it up.
Speaker 3: He's like, He's like, I'm fucking going in there. I'm
Speaker 3: gonna cop it up.
Speaker 2: I'm gonna be a cop I'm gonna get him to
Speaker 2: tell me what's what, and if he doesn't, I'm gonna
Speaker 2: mind prob himself with the lightsaber. And Jackie's like, oh,
Speaker 2: you could not do that, and you could just use
Speaker 2: this twin to our advantage.
Speaker 1: Can we promote Jackie? I think Jackie's jen enough.
Speaker 3: She's a Jedi knight.
Speaker 1: Yeah, you're concerned.
Speaker 2: Uh.
Speaker 1: Kymri quickly implicates himself as the poison maker. Uh to Osha.
Speaker 1: He says, you know, our boss is gonna be super
Speaker 1: pleased with what you've done. The Jedi snatch him up.
Speaker 1: Soul wants to know who the person behind all of
Speaker 1: this is, but all Kimier really knows is May wants
Speaker 1: revenge from the Jedi and has good reason to.
Speaker 2: See And interestingly, just before the Jedi come in and
Speaker 2: snatch him up bad Boys style, he realizes that it's
Speaker 2: not May, and he says, you look exactly like her,
Speaker 2: implying I think that kaim In knows about Osha, whether
Speaker 2: he knew her from when they were kids, or whether
Speaker 2: he knows her because May's told him about it.
Speaker 3: I thought that was really interesting.
Speaker 2: And Manny, he's still looking so handsome and beautiful even
Speaker 2: when he's playing like a cosmic drunk and.
Speaker 1: They're trying they mess up his hair and it's like
Speaker 1: making a greasy and messy him wear.
Speaker 2: Like a raggedy like cloak. But he's still he's killing it.
Speaker 1: Yeah, the jar line could could cut glass. Yes, the
Speaker 1: Jedi steak aut Kimer's shop. May starts walking up, Saul
Speaker 1: confronts her in the street and they have this fight.
Speaker 1: Oh so again, Saul is taking the measure of her.
Speaker 1: He's confused about why May fights weaponless.
Speaker 2: This is very matrix, lots of lots of He will
Speaker 2: never strike her, he's stack, he's he's dodging, and it's
Speaker 2: just so much fun, so much wirework. And again that
Speaker 2: weaponless question comes up, why does she fight weaponless?
Speaker 1: And just as in the fight within Dara, May throws
Speaker 1: knives as a distraction and then and then sweeps in
Speaker 1: to try and grab Saul's lightsaber. Doesn't get it, just
Speaker 1: like within Dara, And as they fight, Saul is interrogating
Speaker 1: May about who she works for. Saul realizes, actually, May
Speaker 1: doesn't know a lot about who her master is.
Speaker 2: Oh yeah, Jedi mind tricks.
Speaker 3: Harm realizes she really doesn't know.
Speaker 1: Saul tells May, actually your sister is live. Osha is alive.
Speaker 1: She doesn't believe it. The Jedi try to take her
Speaker 1: into custody, but May who grabs all the sand around
Speaker 1: her force and makes an explosion of sand kind of
Speaker 1: like amawing smoke bump, and she's on a run. Osha
Speaker 1: then draws down on her. She as as May is
Speaker 1: commandeering a vehicle. Ohsha's like in an alley, the entrance
Speaker 1: to an alley. She's like, I would say, three to
Speaker 1: five meters away, pretty close. Oh yeah, she has a
Speaker 1: blaster and set on stunt and she misses. It's like
Speaker 1: a storm trooper level myth And I think she was
Speaker 1: trying because she shoots again.
Speaker 2: I'm like, I'm very I think they did a good
Speaker 2: job here of like I still don't know, like if
Speaker 2: my life don't on it, I don't know. But the
Speaker 2: fact that she shoots again does kind of seem like it.
Speaker 2: But maybe it was a she did she couldn't.
Speaker 3: She couldn't do.
Speaker 2: It the first time, and then she's frustrated, so she
Speaker 2: does it the second time. But then you know, the twins,
Speaker 2: their eyes meet, we see that there's two of them,
Speaker 2: and in that moment they kind of realized that their
Speaker 2: sister is still alive.
Speaker 1: Saul, of course, wants to continue the pursuit. They're hot
Speaker 1: on maze heels, she's they're right here on planet with her.
Speaker 2: She's and it's his chance to save this kid that
Speaker 2: he never got to say. He didn't get to bring
Speaker 2: into the Jedi fold.
Speaker 1: But Venestra is like, no, you got to come back
Speaker 1: to Coroussant we had There's something I don't know. The
Speaker 1: coffee maker is down. There's something here that you need
Speaker 1: to deal with. You need to come back to the
Speaker 1: Corothon right now.
Speaker 3: Why she's she doesn't want him to get to the truth.
Speaker 1: I think that there's something. I think that there's something.
Speaker 1: Kimer and may find each other on the outskirts of
Speaker 1: the city. He says, I got a great place for
Speaker 1: us to hide out and we can multitask. We should
Speaker 1: go to Cofar where the Wookie Jedi master kill Knack.
Speaker 3: A Wookie Jedi adamiye Lizen. We have to see this
Speaker 3: little house. I love him kill that. I love you.
Speaker 2: I believe that you are an important Jedi. I believe
Speaker 2: you will survive. I don't want you to die.
Speaker 3: I want to see.
Speaker 2: Count that guy, I need to see you, my friend.
Speaker 2: The Star Wars shows have done such a good job.
Speaker 3: Giving us cool wookies. Yeah, you know, like the cool
Speaker 3: metal Wookie who I think was.
Speaker 2: In Book of Boba Fair Yeah, or Mandalorian, I can't remember,
Speaker 2: but he was great.
Speaker 3: Who was from the Kieran Gillen comics. Yes, the Acolyte.
Speaker 2: I was a lover of this series. I those first
Speaker 2: two episodes I loved. I really loved the action. I
Speaker 2: felt like they did this great job of expanding on
Speaker 2: what we were excited about when we saw Emmana Spardi's.
Speaker 3: Performance as Oh my God, why is my mind?
Speaker 2: Ezra as Ezra and that kind of he was using
Speaker 2: this more peaceful version of that was fighting.
Speaker 3: That was more about, you.
Speaker 2: Know, controlling the wind. And but I love that here
Speaker 2: we get this force martial arts.
Speaker 3: You know. When I spoke to.
Speaker 2: Leslie Headlin, she was just so in awe of the
Speaker 2: stunt team and kind of talking about how they had
Speaker 2: really Chris Cowan, who'd worked on the Dark Vata scene
Speaker 2: in and he came up under Brad Allen, who's like
Speaker 2: a very famous stunt guy, and they just like did
Speaker 2: so much wirework, so much practical stunt work. Amandler had
Speaker 2: two stunt doubles, Colleen and Cassie, and they just really
Speaker 2: I think the action in this is a standout.
Speaker 1: Even though it's a slow burn mystery, and I know
Speaker 1: that for some people that is not necessarily going to
Speaker 1: be what they want from a Star Wars show.
Speaker 2: It's very intimate, it has very few characters compared to
Speaker 2: what we usually see. But for me, this feels like
Speaker 2: the best of the books of the expanded universe of
Speaker 2: the High Republic, where you're following a small team on
Speaker 2: a mission and you're getting to see new parts of
Speaker 2: the world that still feel familiar. You're getting to build
Speaker 2: in that law, whether it's with getting to see this
Speaker 2: new version of Finestra, getting to see the early kind
Speaker 2: of ships that might end up being able to travel
Speaker 2: through light speed. Like I just it was really everything
Speaker 2: I wanted and I love that came in and was like,
Speaker 2: you think that I did a twist in Russian Doll, Well,
Speaker 2: guess what, I've been showing you the wrong character the
Speaker 2: whole time in all the trailers, and they're twins. And
Speaker 2: a really funny thing she told me was they're actually
Speaker 2: originally were meant to be just sisters, right, and it's
Speaker 2: this idea of if you want to explore the dark
Speaker 2: side and the light. And then she was like, well,
Speaker 2: Luke and Lea, maybe they should be twins. And then
Speaker 2: she found out something I don't know that I knew
Speaker 2: or had heard of.
Speaker 3: Kathleen Kennedy is a twin.
Speaker 4: WHOA.
Speaker 3: Yeah, it was kind of what cemented it.
Speaker 2: And Kathleen was like, yeah, baby twins, let's do it
Speaker 2: like And that's kind of how it became more of
Speaker 2: this idea of them being twins rather than just just sisters.
Speaker 3: So I thought that was really cool.
Speaker 2: I love the idea of I'm hoping that we they
Speaker 2: do keep They do kind of say this thing when
Speaker 2: they're in that mind palace or whatever where they kind
Speaker 2: of see each other as kids, where it's like, you know.
Speaker 3: Or born as two, always as one or.
Speaker 2: Something, and I think that really sounds very diet ish.
Speaker 1: I agree.
Speaker 2: We're going to take a quick break and we'll be
Speaker 2: right back.
Speaker 3: We're so I'm very interested to see what did you
Speaker 3: think about it?
Speaker 1: I loved it. I didn't love it as much when
Speaker 1: I watched only the first episode, but then on rewatch, Yes,
Speaker 1: when I watched one and two I was like, actually,
Speaker 1: this is great, and then.
Speaker 2: Definitely you got to watch two because somebody in our
Speaker 2: discord said the same thing. Yeah, you know, if one
Speaker 2: doesn't necessarily leave you with that big moment, but two
Speaker 2: you by that point you're invested in the world.
Speaker 1: Yes, by two, I'm like, Okay, this is actually extremely interesting.
Speaker 1: And then on second rewatch you start noticing all the
Speaker 1: little whether it's clues or clues to the kind of
Speaker 1: the philosophical I think conflict at the heart of this story,
Speaker 1: which is how complicit are the Jedi in bad things
Speaker 1: that happen to the galaxy specific to their guardianship. I
Speaker 1: think i'd call it gatekeeping of the force. How does
Speaker 1: their gatekeeping of the force potentially create the enemies that
Speaker 1: they then fight? And I think that's a really fascinating question.
Speaker 1: And I think that I think that you know, you've
Speaker 1: you've laid out. I think a lot of really interesting
Speaker 1: past this could take. And I think it's going to
Speaker 1: be at the heart of this. It's going to be
Speaker 1: something about the way the Jedi reach out to and
Speaker 1: manage Force users. Yeah, I think the Jedi listen. They're
Speaker 1: clearly a military organization. Although they try to present themselves
Speaker 1: as a like peace key pace keeper, right, they train
Speaker 1: children in the arts of warfare from a very young age.
Speaker 1: And I think we're going to find that there are
Speaker 1: other paths to the Force.
Speaker 3: That have existed that the Jedi do not like.
Speaker 1: That the Jedi do not like for whatever reason.
Speaker 3: I think you're absolutely right, and that while there are.
Speaker 1: Evil people who would use the Force for evil and
Speaker 1: would easily be you know, inculcated into the ways of
Speaker 1: the Sith if they exist now, I think we're also
Speaker 1: going to find that there are people on the margins
Speaker 1: who don't want to be soldiers or don't want to
Speaker 1: wield at lightsaber or using the Force for other.
Speaker 2: Things exactly like if you're connected to the Force, could
Speaker 2: you have like a you know, the beginning of Furio,
Speaker 2: So we get to see this kind of lush space
Speaker 2: within the desert where they grow food and they and
Speaker 2: they have fresh water and there's grass and there's fruit.
Speaker 2: I would love to know and there are people who
Speaker 2: can farm like that. They're people who mess up the
Speaker 2: Trade Federation because they're able.
Speaker 3: To grow their own food via the Force.
Speaker 2: I'm interested in that. Also, you mentioned the Sith. I
Speaker 2: think something's really interesting is when Kimer and May are
Speaker 2: making the poison, they say pieces a lie, and that
Speaker 2: is the first line of like the Sith code, pieces
Speaker 2: a lie. There is only passion. Through passion, igrain strength
Speaker 2: through strength, I gain power. So I'm interested like to
Speaker 2: see if the way that the Jedi have tried to
Speaker 2: control the force, if it's gonna be able to draw
Speaker 2: a direct line between that and then the resurgence of
Speaker 2: the Sith, which I think is is really natural because
Speaker 2: if you try and stop people from using it, then
Speaker 2: people are gonna look for different ways to use it,
Speaker 2: and that is obviously gonna lead you to the old books.
Speaker 2: You're gonna find out about the Sith. Oh dear power
Speaker 2: of too. It's gonna be It's gonna be a lot.
Speaker 1: I can't wait to keep watching this really fun show. Yeah,
Speaker 1: it looks amazing. It looks so good, like just visual quality,
Speaker 1: the action, the sets, the backgrounds. It looks great. It
Speaker 1: looks great.
Speaker 3: I love the costumes.
Speaker 2: I think, Yeah, it really feels like if you love
Speaker 2: the High Republic books, it really feels like you're reading
Speaker 2: one of them. The visuals of it feel like it's
Speaker 2: come to life and uh oh, it could be fun
Speaker 2: to do a high Republic episode. Actually, we have a
Speaker 2: lot of High Republic book readers. That could be really fun.
Speaker 3: But yeah, I love it. It's gonna be coming out.
Speaker 3: It's got that Ahsoka style drop.
Speaker 2: It's going to be Tuesday at six pm PT, nine
Speaker 2: pm ET.
Speaker 3: And yeah, I can't wait to see what happens next.
Speaker 1: And that's it for today's episode.
Speaker 3: Thanks so much for listening, Thanks so much for listening.
Speaker 3: Don't Be a Cop Like Your.
Speaker 1: X Ray Vision is hosted by Jason Kitsupsion and Rosie
Speaker 1: Knight and is a production of iHeart Podcasts. Our executive
Speaker 1: producers are Jewel Smith and Aaron Kaufman. Our supervising producer
Speaker 1: is a Boo Zafar. Our producers are Carmen Laurent and
Speaker 1: Mia Taylor. Our theme song is by Brian Basquez.
Speaker 2: Special thanks to Soul Rubin and Chris Laude, Kenny Goodman
Speaker 2: and Heidi our discord moderator.