1 00:00:12,280 --> 00:00:16,000 Speaker 1: I'm Andrea Gunning and this is Betrayal Bonus Episode four 2 00:00:16,920 --> 00:00:21,639 Speaker 1: update on Erin. Before the bonus starts, I want to 3 00:00:21,680 --> 00:00:24,080 Speaker 1: tell you that more stories of betrayal will be coming 4 00:00:24,120 --> 00:00:27,120 Speaker 1: in twenty twenty four. So we want to hear your stories. 5 00:00:27,600 --> 00:00:31,280 Speaker 1: And although we've talked about marriages and parent relationships, we 6 00:00:31,320 --> 00:00:34,080 Speaker 1: are open to any betrayal that has changed your life 7 00:00:34,120 --> 00:00:37,519 Speaker 1: in a meaningful way. If you're open and want to 8 00:00:37,520 --> 00:00:40,520 Speaker 1: share your story of betrayal, email me at Betrayal Pod 9 00:00:40,560 --> 00:00:45,159 Speaker 1: at gmail dot com. That's Betrayal Pod at gmail dot com. 10 00:00:45,320 --> 00:00:47,080 Speaker 1: And of course, if you want to write in and 11 00:00:47,240 --> 00:00:50,159 Speaker 1: just share privately, this email account can continue to be 12 00:00:50,240 --> 00:00:52,960 Speaker 1: a safe space for you to okay. So on to 13 00:00:53,000 --> 00:00:55,240 Speaker 1: an important update on Erin, one of the women you 14 00:00:55,280 --> 00:00:58,880 Speaker 1: got to know last season. We receive so many wonderful 15 00:00:58,960 --> 00:01:02,400 Speaker 1: emails expressing so poor and concern about her. Let me 16 00:01:02,400 --> 00:01:05,600 Speaker 1: give you a quick recap of her story. Erin is 17 00:01:05,640 --> 00:01:08,240 Speaker 1: a family therapist. She was married to Joel and they 18 00:01:08,280 --> 00:01:11,000 Speaker 1: lived with their two kids in Texas. Joel was an 19 00:01:11,040 --> 00:01:15,199 Speaker 1: explosive specialist for the military. Erin knew her husband was struggling, 20 00:01:15,600 --> 00:01:19,160 Speaker 1: her marriage was in trouble, and after a fight Erin's 21 00:01:19,160 --> 00:01:20,160 Speaker 1: intuition kicked in. 22 00:01:20,520 --> 00:01:23,520 Speaker 2: I decided to look at his computer and I went 23 00:01:23,560 --> 00:01:28,600 Speaker 2: into his recently deleted files, and that's where there was 24 00:01:28,720 --> 00:01:34,840 Speaker 2: just a plethora of pictures like little Miss Country, USA, 25 00:01:35,280 --> 00:01:40,760 Speaker 2: all different ages, all different looks. It was so many 26 00:01:40,800 --> 00:01:45,440 Speaker 2: people he had collected. I clicked on one and it 27 00:01:45,600 --> 00:01:49,200 Speaker 2: was this little girl who I'd never seen before, don't 28 00:01:49,240 --> 00:01:54,120 Speaker 2: recognize at all, standing naked on a beach. She had 29 00:01:54,120 --> 00:01:57,120 Speaker 2: a look on her face like, this is not me 30 00:01:57,200 --> 00:02:00,720 Speaker 2: being cute and playing on the beach. No, it was inappropriate. 31 00:02:01,640 --> 00:02:05,720 Speaker 2: So I actually took a picture of her from the 32 00:02:05,800 --> 00:02:09,280 Speaker 2: face up because I just needed to prove to myself 33 00:02:09,320 --> 00:02:12,560 Speaker 2: that I wasn't crazy. And then I took a picture 34 00:02:12,639 --> 00:02:15,000 Speaker 2: of the names of the files, and then I shut 35 00:02:15,040 --> 00:02:16,360 Speaker 2: it all down and I put it all back. 36 00:02:16,720 --> 00:02:20,600 Speaker 1: What Aaron found was the tip of the iceberg. She 37 00:02:20,639 --> 00:02:24,080 Speaker 1: took her two small young children and fled. She drove 38 00:02:24,160 --> 00:02:27,160 Speaker 1: to the airport and flew back to her hometown in California, 39 00:02:27,240 --> 00:02:30,800 Speaker 1: seeking solace and family support. Her mother was deceased, and 40 00:02:30,840 --> 00:02:33,680 Speaker 1: her two brothers and father did not offer the safe 41 00:02:33,680 --> 00:02:38,119 Speaker 1: haven she was seeking. After almost three years, her husband 42 00:02:38,560 --> 00:02:39,360 Speaker 1: was prosecuted. 43 00:02:39,680 --> 00:02:45,880 Speaker 2: He pled guilty to twenty five felony charges of child pornography. 44 00:02:46,600 --> 00:02:49,280 Speaker 2: He was sentenced to eight years, and he only did three. 45 00:02:49,600 --> 00:02:52,600 Speaker 1: One piece of Aaron's story that really affected our listeners 46 00:02:52,720 --> 00:02:55,880 Speaker 1: was how difficult it was to start over. She lost 47 00:02:55,880 --> 00:02:59,320 Speaker 1: her livelihood and her husband's income. At one point, Aarin 48 00:02:59,360 --> 00:03:04,160 Speaker 1: applied for welfare. Then there was her family. Although there 49 00:03:04,160 --> 00:03:07,120 Speaker 1: were many family members who helped and supported her, her 50 00:03:07,200 --> 00:03:10,440 Speaker 1: nuclear family did not seem to find Joel's crimes as 51 00:03:10,480 --> 00:03:13,560 Speaker 1: troubling and serious as she did. We heard from so 52 00:03:13,680 --> 00:03:17,720 Speaker 1: many of you mothers, a former prosecutor, other victims, all 53 00:03:17,800 --> 00:03:20,840 Speaker 1: rooting for Erin, and even listeners who wanted to send 54 00:03:20,880 --> 00:03:24,560 Speaker 1: her financial support. Erin read all of it. 55 00:03:25,160 --> 00:03:29,799 Speaker 2: I was blown away. I've not felt that kind of 56 00:03:29,840 --> 00:03:34,440 Speaker 2: support since my mom was alive, and that was like 57 00:03:35,920 --> 00:03:41,800 Speaker 2: the whole nation counteracting what I had grown up believing 58 00:03:42,120 --> 00:03:45,920 Speaker 2: with kind of a low self esteem and second guessing 59 00:03:45,960 --> 00:03:50,760 Speaker 2: my every move. And so I really think that motivated 60 00:03:50,880 --> 00:03:54,200 Speaker 2: me to go, you know what, I'm really doing my 61 00:03:54,320 --> 00:03:58,400 Speaker 2: best here, and so it was really miraculous and I 62 00:03:58,440 --> 00:04:02,000 Speaker 2: can't tell you how heal this podcast was for me. 63 00:04:03,440 --> 00:04:06,800 Speaker 2: One thing that really gets me is when people wrote 64 00:04:06,800 --> 00:04:09,600 Speaker 2: to me. And they said, I wish I had a 65 00:04:09,640 --> 00:04:16,839 Speaker 2: mom like you. My mom was great. My mom was amazing. 66 00:04:17,560 --> 00:04:20,200 Speaker 2: She had cancer for twenty six years and she never 67 00:04:20,279 --> 00:04:24,680 Speaker 2: dropped a ball. I mean, she was really, really fantastic, 68 00:04:24,720 --> 00:04:28,159 Speaker 2: and I always wished that everyone had a mother like her. 69 00:04:29,080 --> 00:04:33,320 Speaker 2: It's an honor to her also that I'm making good 70 00:04:33,400 --> 00:04:35,800 Speaker 2: choices and that I'm looking out for my kids and 71 00:04:35,800 --> 00:04:37,920 Speaker 2: that I keep them number one. 72 00:04:38,640 --> 00:04:41,919 Speaker 1: Once Aaron's ex husband, Joel was released from present in Texas, 73 00:04:42,200 --> 00:04:44,800 Speaker 1: he moved in with his parents. It was only about 74 00:04:44,800 --> 00:04:46,960 Speaker 1: a mile from where Erin and her children were living. 75 00:04:47,680 --> 00:04:50,240 Speaker 2: When he got out, I got the restraining order and 76 00:04:50,279 --> 00:04:55,000 Speaker 2: he got awarded visitation with the kids in a supervised facility. 77 00:04:55,680 --> 00:04:59,480 Speaker 1: Aaron managed to avoid those visits while other parental litigation 78 00:04:59,800 --> 00:05:00,520 Speaker 1: was pending. 79 00:05:01,360 --> 00:05:04,560 Speaker 2: Then the lawyer called me and said, he just got 80 00:05:04,640 --> 00:05:08,839 Speaker 2: arrested again, and when we looked it up online, it 81 00:05:08,960 --> 00:05:14,559 Speaker 2: did mention possession of child pornography. And I still don't 82 00:05:14,560 --> 00:05:18,960 Speaker 2: know the details of all of that, but it sounds 83 00:05:19,080 --> 00:05:24,120 Speaker 2: as though he may have had his first parole check 84 00:05:24,560 --> 00:05:28,040 Speaker 2: the first time in a year, and they found some 85 00:05:28,160 --> 00:05:32,760 Speaker 2: things on his phone like social media, which we've learned 86 00:05:33,040 --> 00:05:36,640 Speaker 2: is a common way that people share Sea sam material. 87 00:05:47,120 --> 00:05:50,760 Speaker 1: Joel Lavelle Callahan was arraigned on September twenty sixth, twenty 88 00:05:50,800 --> 00:05:54,120 Speaker 1: twenty three, in the Superior Court of Fresno and assigned 89 00:05:54,160 --> 00:05:55,080 Speaker 1: a public defender. 90 00:05:55,600 --> 00:05:58,960 Speaker 2: He denied the public defender so that he could hire 91 00:05:58,960 --> 00:06:01,919 Speaker 2: a private driven a law attorney, and he has a 92 00:06:01,960 --> 00:06:05,359 Speaker 2: private family law attorney, which has bought him quite a 93 00:06:05,360 --> 00:06:07,920 Speaker 2: bit of time out in the free world. 94 00:06:08,760 --> 00:06:11,720 Speaker 1: Erin has kept moving forward and stayed focused on building 95 00:06:11,760 --> 00:06:14,800 Speaker 1: a healthy life with her two kids. She's a licensed 96 00:06:14,839 --> 00:06:16,400 Speaker 1: therapist in California. 97 00:06:16,520 --> 00:06:20,479 Speaker 2: My private practice is what I would consider very successful. 98 00:06:20,520 --> 00:06:24,560 Speaker 2: I'm very comfortable and able to give my children the 99 00:06:24,640 --> 00:06:29,000 Speaker 2: life that I want without needing child support for relying 100 00:06:29,040 --> 00:06:29,400 Speaker 2: on that. 101 00:06:29,839 --> 00:06:32,320 Speaker 1: Aaron moved her family a few hours away to a 102 00:06:32,360 --> 00:06:34,320 Speaker 1: beach community for a fresh start. 103 00:06:34,800 --> 00:06:37,680 Speaker 2: That is just like going from the depths of hell 104 00:06:38,160 --> 00:06:42,400 Speaker 2: all the way to heaven. I've already seen so much 105 00:06:42,440 --> 00:06:46,359 Speaker 2: healing happening in myself, which I think trickles down to 106 00:06:46,440 --> 00:06:50,200 Speaker 2: them as well. They love where we live, they said, 107 00:06:50,240 --> 00:06:54,240 Speaker 2: it's like being on vacation every day. We have a 108 00:06:54,240 --> 00:06:59,240 Speaker 2: lot more fresh grown, local produce here. So another part 109 00:06:59,279 --> 00:07:03,279 Speaker 2: of our healing was having better nutrition. So we're working 110 00:07:03,320 --> 00:07:07,080 Speaker 2: on diets, We're working on mental health. We like to 111 00:07:07,080 --> 00:07:09,640 Speaker 2: go to the park a lot. We feel safer. 112 00:07:10,200 --> 00:07:13,040 Speaker 1: Aaron lived in fear for a long time. At one 113 00:07:13,080 --> 00:07:15,080 Speaker 1: point she felt she needed to be armed. 114 00:07:15,560 --> 00:07:18,320 Speaker 2: A year ago, I was walking around with a gun 115 00:07:18,400 --> 00:07:21,960 Speaker 2: strap to my person. You know, I had my concealed 116 00:07:22,000 --> 00:07:24,440 Speaker 2: carried weapons permit, and I didn't even want to leave 117 00:07:24,560 --> 00:07:27,120 Speaker 2: to go to the office without that. And out here 118 00:07:27,360 --> 00:07:31,840 Speaker 2: also like we live in a very safe area that 119 00:07:31,920 --> 00:07:34,440 Speaker 2: I feel like we can sleep with the windows open 120 00:07:34,480 --> 00:07:36,400 Speaker 2: and hear the ocean outside. 121 00:07:36,480 --> 00:07:39,040 Speaker 1: Her son has become a top runner in his school. 122 00:07:39,360 --> 00:07:43,440 Speaker 1: Her daughter does won an award for writing. They're thriving. Still, 123 00:07:43,520 --> 00:07:47,000 Speaker 1: heartbreak sneaks up every once in a while, especially around 124 00:07:47,000 --> 00:07:47,640 Speaker 1: the holidays. 125 00:07:48,200 --> 00:07:51,680 Speaker 2: Thanksgiving just passed by. My brother hosted Joel and his 126 00:07:51,720 --> 00:07:54,840 Speaker 2: family for Thanksgiving, Whereas we were in a town with 127 00:07:54,920 --> 00:07:58,680 Speaker 2: no familiar faces, and you know, no one familiar to 128 00:07:58,680 --> 00:08:02,640 Speaker 2: celebrate that with. And that's just like you just continue 129 00:08:02,640 --> 00:08:04,320 Speaker 2: to keep stabbing me in the heart. 130 00:08:05,200 --> 00:08:07,320 Speaker 1: Arin does not want Joel to have right to the 131 00:08:07,400 --> 00:08:10,160 Speaker 1: kids at all. Her fight in court is for him 132 00:08:10,200 --> 00:08:11,400 Speaker 1: to be removed as a parent. 133 00:08:11,880 --> 00:08:16,320 Speaker 2: I'm prepared to fire on all cylinders. But I hope 134 00:08:16,440 --> 00:08:19,320 Speaker 2: for my sanity that I don't have to keep proving 135 00:08:20,040 --> 00:08:23,640 Speaker 2: why he shouldn't have visitations more than he's trying to 136 00:08:23,720 --> 00:08:27,880 Speaker 2: prove why he should. I genuinely think I'm probably still 137 00:08:27,920 --> 00:08:31,200 Speaker 2: doing more to help Joel than anybody else is. You 138 00:08:31,200 --> 00:08:34,040 Speaker 2: know how much of a privilege is it to say 139 00:08:34,440 --> 00:08:37,480 Speaker 2: I've got our kids, I will take great care of 140 00:08:37,520 --> 00:08:40,560 Speaker 2: them while you take the time to figure your life 141 00:08:40,600 --> 00:08:43,840 Speaker 2: out or clean your life up, or whatever you've got 142 00:08:43,840 --> 00:08:48,920 Speaker 2: to do. I can't make our kids not love him. 143 00:08:49,360 --> 00:08:53,000 Speaker 2: I can't make them disown him or anything like that. 144 00:08:53,200 --> 00:08:55,280 Speaker 2: And so if they want to have a relationship with 145 00:08:55,400 --> 00:08:58,319 Speaker 2: him when they get older, or they have questions about 146 00:08:58,320 --> 00:09:02,000 Speaker 2: their health or whatever, that is still on the table. 147 00:09:02,400 --> 00:09:05,959 Speaker 2: And so all I'm trying to do is keep them 148 00:09:06,040 --> 00:09:09,040 Speaker 2: out of that equation so that they're not affected and 149 00:09:09,160 --> 00:09:13,000 Speaker 2: give them a nice, comfortable life so that they don't 150 00:09:13,080 --> 00:09:17,760 Speaker 2: have to endure everything that he's putting them through. I'm 151 00:09:18,200 --> 00:09:21,320 Speaker 2: trying to give him and my children both the space 152 00:09:21,360 --> 00:09:24,720 Speaker 2: that they need to get healthy and myself as well. 153 00:09:24,760 --> 00:09:28,480 Speaker 2: I mean, I've been severely damaged with trust and trauma 154 00:09:28,600 --> 00:09:31,800 Speaker 2: through a lot of this, and so we need to 155 00:09:31,880 --> 00:09:35,680 Speaker 2: be able to untether in order to show up for 156 00:09:35,800 --> 00:09:36,360 Speaker 2: one another. 157 00:09:36,960 --> 00:09:39,920 Speaker 1: How do you measure recovery for someone who consumes c 158 00:09:40,120 --> 00:09:44,559 Speaker 1: SAM Do services provided in prison cure the addiction. It's 159 00:09:44,559 --> 00:09:47,360 Speaker 1: something we talked about during the series, and there isn't 160 00:09:47,400 --> 00:09:48,319 Speaker 1: a clear answer. 161 00:09:49,120 --> 00:09:53,120 Speaker 2: His whole case was precipitating on the fact that they 162 00:09:53,520 --> 00:09:58,520 Speaker 2: thought he was reformed, and clearly he's not reformed. And 163 00:09:58,600 --> 00:10:00,680 Speaker 2: I think it's a lot of people who don't work 164 00:10:00,679 --> 00:10:05,040 Speaker 2: in mental health that don't know what is required to 165 00:10:05,080 --> 00:10:12,800 Speaker 2: treat addiction or treat this type of abusive behavior. Maybe 166 00:10:12,840 --> 00:10:15,400 Speaker 2: they do think church is enough, Maybe they do think 167 00:10:15,480 --> 00:10:21,000 Speaker 2: that court consequences are enough. But I know through direct experience, 168 00:10:21,080 --> 00:10:24,600 Speaker 2: having worked with people with similar attributes, that that is 169 00:10:24,679 --> 00:10:29,520 Speaker 2: not enough. You need a lot more accountability, a lot 170 00:10:29,559 --> 00:10:33,200 Speaker 2: more hand holding out of that, because you know, he 171 00:10:33,280 --> 00:10:36,840 Speaker 2: didn't become addicted to things in a day. He's not 172 00:10:36,880 --> 00:10:41,120 Speaker 2: going to recover in a day. So I just wish 173 00:10:41,240 --> 00:10:45,240 Speaker 2: that there was more mental health woven into that equation 174 00:10:45,480 --> 00:10:47,840 Speaker 2: so that they could look at it from that perspective, 175 00:10:47,880 --> 00:10:53,640 Speaker 2: because I am not convinced, and his reoffense just supported 176 00:10:54,040 --> 00:10:55,880 Speaker 2: what my feeling was this whole time. 177 00:10:57,960 --> 00:11:00,160 Speaker 1: It was really good to find out how our and 178 00:11:00,200 --> 00:11:03,440 Speaker 1: has been doing since Betrayal Season two first dropped. We'll 179 00:11:03,480 --> 00:11:06,880 Speaker 1: be back soon with an update on Ashley Linton. You 180 00:11:06,880 --> 00:11:09,400 Speaker 1: can always reach out to our team at Betrayalpod at 181 00:11:09,400 --> 00:11:13,559 Speaker 1: gmail dot com. That's Betrayal Pod at gmail dot com. 182 00:11:13,800 --> 00:11:17,439 Speaker 1: Thank you for listening. Betrayal is a production of Glass Podcasts, 183 00:11:17,600 --> 00:11:20,960 Speaker 1: a division and Glass Entertainment Group and partnership with iHeart Podcasts. 184 00:11:21,520 --> 00:11:24,360 Speaker 1: The show was executive produced by Nancy Glass and Jennifer Fason, 185 00:11:24,960 --> 00:11:28,280 Speaker 1: hosted and produced by me Andrea Gunning, written and produced 186 00:11:28,280 --> 00:11:32,720 Speaker 1: by Kerry Hartman, also produced by Ben Fetterman, Associate producer 187 00:11:33,000 --> 00:11:37,440 Speaker 1: Kristin Melcurie. Our iHeart team is Ali Perry and Jessica Crincheck. 188 00:11:38,320 --> 00:11:41,760 Speaker 1: Audio editing and mixing by Matt Alvecchio. A trail's theme 189 00:11:41,840 --> 00:11:45,640 Speaker 1: composed by Oliver Bains. Music library provided by my Music 190 00:11:46,080 --> 00:11:49,040 Speaker 1: and For more podcasts from iHeart, visit the iHeartRadio app, 191 00:11:49,080 --> 00:11:51,640 Speaker 1: Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.