Speaker 1: Hey, folks, it is Friday, August fifteenth, and Brian Koberger,
Speaker 1: who is serving four life sentences for killing those four
Speaker 1: University of Idaho students, says the other prisoners aren't being
Speaker 1: nice to him. He's been told to stop whining. Welcome
Speaker 1: to Amy and TJ. Robes. That's a headline making its
Speaker 1: way around how he is complaining about other prisoners taunting him.
Speaker 1: But some real headlines and real information robes that we
Speaker 1: have never heard before that we are getting. Now that's
Speaker 1: kind of giving us. He hasn't told us why he
Speaker 1: did it, but we're getting a little more insight into
Speaker 1: maybe why he did this.
Speaker 2: Yes, this is fascinating stuff because even at the sentencing hearing,
Speaker 2: we were all hoping that Brian Coberger was going to
Speaker 2: say something to the families of those just brutally murdered
Speaker 2: Idaho students. He said nothing. Everyone wanted to know why.
Speaker 2: Everyone wanted to know if there was a connection between
Speaker 2: these students, any of these students in him. And now
Speaker 2: we are starting to actually get real information because a
Speaker 2: gag order has been lifted and one of the digital
Speaker 2: forensics experts has been talking about what she uncovered while
Speaker 2: investigating this trial or preparing for this trial and investigating
Speaker 2: this crime, and what we're learning is creepy. It's like
Speaker 2: stuff movies are made of. Horror movies are made of
Speaker 2: what this man, Brian Coberger, was doing in the weeks
Speaker 2: leading up to the murders and then in the weeks
Speaker 2: following the murders before he was actually captured.
Speaker 1: So to remind you all, to catch you up here, yes,
Speaker 1: he the murders happened back in twenty twenty two. Two
Speaker 1: were preparing for trial this year. He pleads guilty, just
Speaker 1: sentenced last month. Yes, so this is where we are.
Speaker 1: Even on the day of his sentencing, when all this
Speaker 1: was finally over, a lot of the gag orders were
Speaker 1: lifted and a lot of things were unsealed, and I
Speaker 1: think immediately after, I think it was press conferences, some
Speaker 1: officials were starting to give out a little more information publicly.
Speaker 1: And this brings us today. This Heather Barnhardt is her name.
Speaker 1: She's a digital forensics expert, so she is not under
Speaker 1: any kind of gag order, but she's starting to give
Speaker 1: some interviews. So this is why we're getting a lot
Speaker 1: of these details. And she Robes was one of the
Speaker 1: ones and she was prepared to testify, and she's telling
Speaker 1: us what she was going to say. But she is
Speaker 1: one of the ones who went through his phone, and
Speaker 1: this stuff is.
Speaker 2: Fascinating, it truly is. So she was able to find
Speaker 2: out that he was planning this murder for quite some time.
Speaker 2: She can see and she could tell it. Actually he
Speaker 2: tried to cover up his searches and his research and
Speaker 2: these PDF files and these documents he was downloading on
Speaker 2: serial killers, multiple multiple serial killers that he was obsessed with,
Speaker 2: She basically said, not just casually Google searching him them,
Speaker 2: but actually obsessed with them. And there was a.
Speaker 1: Study is a good way to put it. He was
Speaker 1: studying them woo.
Speaker 2: And that is some scary stuff when you start to
Speaker 2: see who he was studying and who he was obsessed with.
Speaker 2: There was actually one particular serial killer who he seemed
Speaker 2: to be fixated on.
Speaker 1: Danny Rawling. Now I don't know if that name. I
Speaker 1: didn't recognize the name when I first saw at Robes,
Speaker 1: but Danny Rawling. Some people might remember the murders in
Speaker 1: nineteen ninety down in Florida near the University of Florida campus.
Speaker 1: Danny Rawling was known as the Gainesville Ripper, and he
Speaker 1: killed five students down there over a stretch of a
Speaker 1: few days. Now, if that doesn't sound familiar to you,
Speaker 1: this will. This guy served as the inspiration for one
Speaker 1: of the greatest probably horror movie franchises of all time, Scream.
Speaker 2: Yeah and so yes. He was called the Gainesville Ripper,
Speaker 2: and he would go into these college students' rooms through
Speaker 2: a sliding glass door, an open door, and then he
Speaker 2: killed them and posed their bodies. And so it appears
Speaker 2: when you look and see what Coburger did in terms
Speaker 2: of getting through in a sliding glass door. He stalked.
Speaker 2: They believe he stalked this home to look and see
Speaker 2: where he could go in, where he could enter, and
Speaker 2: it just it was scarily similar to what if you
Speaker 2: go back and look and see what Rolling did. It's
Speaker 2: kind of eerily similar to what Coburger did.
Speaker 1: And yeah, you said he I think they had a
Speaker 1: did they say twenty? I think they said twenty serial
Speaker 1: killers that he had research on, but this was one
Speaker 1: in particular.
Speaker 2: Go ahead, yeah, Well, some of the ones he was
Speaker 2: researching are household names. He was looking into Ted Bundy,
Speaker 2: he was looking into John Wayne Gacy. But there are
Speaker 2: twenty names and all of these people. He It was
Speaker 2: really interesting how this forensic experts put it. She said,
Speaker 2: he didn't just google these cases. He downloaded full PDFs
Speaker 2: of case files, not once, but repeatedly. He was downloading
Speaker 2: detailed reports about serial killers. This wasn't casual browsing. This
Speaker 2: was meticulous research.
Speaker 1: I mean, so that I mean that answer is a
Speaker 1: pretty significant question, does it not. This dude was planning
Speaker 1: to kill somebody while he was doing this research. He
Speaker 1: might not have even known who, but this was a plan.
Speaker 1: This wasn't just random. He didn't just happen upon a house,
Speaker 1: happen upon some people he wanted to kill. That is terrifying,
Speaker 1: and think about it.
Speaker 2: He also was a PhD student. He was getting his
Speaker 2: master's degree in criminology, so he was a student of
Speaker 2: crime and then became someone who took it to the
Speaker 2: next level and wanted to become a serial killer. It
Speaker 2: looked as though that was what he was researching, even academically,
Speaker 2: and then in his free time was taking it even
Speaker 2: a step further, which is just chilling.
Speaker 1: You said he wanted to be a serial killer. He
Speaker 1: also didn't want to get caught. That is part of
Speaker 1: the information that's come out again from this forensic scientist
Speaker 1: who went through his phone, who was prepared, who was
Speaker 1: supposed to be a witness at his trial, says here quote,
Speaker 1: he was diligent in prep and cleanup, and he made
Speaker 1: our job really hard. This is someone who tried really
Speaker 1: hard to not be detected. What I mean, I don't
Speaker 1: know how much they've gotten in the psych evaluation of
Speaker 1: this guy, but he wanted to be a serial killer.
Speaker 1: He was trying to get away with this. I mean,
Speaker 1: I guess sometimes people are wired strangely. This is an illness.
Speaker 1: This is sick.
Speaker 2: It is sick. And even at the time where they
Speaker 2: were trying to again build the case against him, should
Speaker 2: it have gone to trial, but his phone, he even
Speaker 2: knew he didn't lose signal or run out of battery
Speaker 2: when he was at the home of those four college students.
Speaker 2: Right before he went and committed these heinous acts, he
Speaker 2: turned his phone off, but he also took his Wi
Speaker 2: Fi off, took his like he meticulously made sure that
Speaker 2: his phone would not link him to this crime. So
Speaker 2: for a full two hours, his phone was completely turned off,
Speaker 2: out of service, and unavailable for any sort of way
Speaker 2: that they could trace where somebody was at the time
Speaker 2: of the crime.
Speaker 1: So this is how particular and this is what digital
Speaker 1: forensics can do. They know exactly when his phone went
Speaker 1: dark November thirteenth, twenty twenty two, the day of the murders.
Speaker 1: Phone went dark two fifty four am, came back at
Speaker 1: four forty eight am. In that stretch of time, four
Speaker 1: kids were murdered in Idaho.
Speaker 2: That wasn't a coincidence. And the other interesting thing they
Speaker 2: found on his phone was that they could go back
Speaker 2: and see where it had logged into Wi Fi and
Speaker 2: everyone was looking for this connection. Did Coburger know his victims,
Speaker 2: did he stalk them? Did he watch them? Well, it
Speaker 2: turns out two of the victims worked at a Greek restaurant,
Speaker 2: the Mad Greek I believe was the name of it,
Speaker 2: and they were able to go back and see twice
Speaker 2: I believe his phone connected to that Wi Fi, So
Speaker 2: it appears at least on two occasions he was in
Speaker 2: the same restaurant where two of the victims worked. So
Speaker 2: there is now for the first time, a real potential
Speaker 2: connection that maybe he did watch these girls, he was
Speaker 2: specifically targeting them and planning it.
Speaker 1: The saint that could have been totally random as well.
Speaker 1: In a smaller town, he happens to go in there.
Speaker 1: But at the same time they came out and said again,
Speaker 1: did they not robes? After sentencing, they came out and
Speaker 1: said it again. There is We have been going through
Speaker 1: this case since twenty twenty two. We have still not
Speaker 1: found a single connection between this guy and these kids.
Speaker 2: It sounds like he was studying serial killers. He was
Speaker 2: studying criminology at school in a master's program or a
Speaker 2: doctorate program, excuse me, he was getting his PhD. And
Speaker 2: he was waiting for the right time, perhaps the right victims,
Speaker 2: in the right location. And it's really chilling to think
Speaker 2: that this was all happening. And ah, and he had
Speaker 2: this one goal in mind, which is just frightening. Something
Speaker 2: else that's extra creepy. It brings back and it hearkens
Speaker 2: another horror movie, Psycho. Because this was also so interesting,
Speaker 2: this digital forensic expert said the amount of times he
Speaker 2: would text and call his parents was actually extraordinary, and
Speaker 2: he had them. He only had the contacts in his
Speaker 2: phone were mother, father, sister, and he almost had I think.
Speaker 2: They said they found one other text chain where he
Speaker 2: might have said one thing to a classmate, and that
Speaker 2: was it. He did not have friends, he did not
Speaker 2: have other contacts, but to even have his family labeled
Speaker 2: as mother, father, sister, no names, And immediately after the
Speaker 2: murders he was texting his mom before and after at
Speaker 2: six thirteen am. And then if his mom wouldn't answer,
Speaker 2: he'd call his father. It was as if he had
Speaker 2: to constantly be connected to them and calling them and
Speaker 2: texting them in a very strange ways.
Speaker 1: Saved in your phone?
Speaker 2: Mom, Dad?
Speaker 1: What about your brother Eric? How about you? Yeah? I
Speaker 1: think I have mom, I have pop, but I'm trying to.
Speaker 2: Think about but mother, father, sister, Sister's even the weirdest.
Speaker 2: Can you imagine just having sister in your phone?
Speaker 1: Pastor, I mean cousin his daughter. I have never actually
Speaker 1: heard of this.
Speaker 2: It's almost never. If you're you're desensitized in a way
Speaker 2: that you are actually not even humanizing the people in
Speaker 2: your life closest to you. You're actually just having some
Speaker 2: formal name associated with it. Can you imagine daughter one,
Speaker 2: daughter two instead of Ava and analyse? But that's kind
Speaker 2: of what it's akin to. And she pointed it out
Speaker 2: that it and if you look to see his texting
Speaker 2: and calling habits, they were abnormal.
Speaker 1: They said. The details again, one last thing about how
Speaker 1: he kept things hidden. They said, some things and rogues
Speaker 1: that he was planning to get away with this, And
Speaker 1: I guess he studied the serial killers of the things
Speaker 1: they got right and if you will, and the things
Speaker 1: they got wrong and got them called. But he was
Speaker 1: trying to cover his tracks. They say. He was trying
Speaker 1: so hard to cover his tracks that you could not
Speaker 1: find some of the information on that phone unless you
Speaker 1: had special forensic tools to use, so so a normal
Speaker 1: person couldn't do it. So he was taking robes some
Speaker 1: pretty significant steps to do this and get away with this.
Speaker 2: And then after the murders, he was downloading reports incessantly
Speaker 2: on the Idaho murders and was doing extensive searches on
Speaker 2: each of the victims, and again buried these files in
Speaker 2: directories like a way that you and I wouldn't even
Speaker 2: know how to do it. But they were able to
Speaker 2: find that he was obsessed with the crime, obsessed with
Speaker 2: the coverage of it, and was monitoring it multiple times.
Speaker 2: They said he was even on the Moscow Police Department
Speaker 2: constantly going back and checking for updates and looking to
Speaker 2: see what they had what they knew and it was
Speaker 2: all uncovered through their work.
Speaker 1: Also, the also in that batch of things he was
Speaker 1: looking at and looking at press reports that came out
Speaker 1: from this forensic analysis said that the day before his
Speaker 1: arrest and the day yeah, the day before his arrest,
Speaker 1: he was searching things like wiretapping, psychopath and paranoid was
Speaker 1: in his searches the day before he was arrested.
Speaker 2: That's so bizarre, and it was bizarre, It really is.
Speaker 2: I think it's it's I love the way the forensic
Speaker 2: expert put this. She said, with what they were able
Speaker 2: to find, there wasn't a single smoking gun, but what
Speaker 2: they found was digital evidence that told a story of preparation.
Speaker 2: So that was a big part of that. This was
Speaker 2: so premeditated. This was prepared, it was analyzed, it was researched,
Speaker 2: and then he was and became obsessed with what was
Speaker 2: going if he was going to get caught.
Speaker 1: Oh my godness. All right, well, folks, the latest thing
Speaker 1: with him, and it's this is bizarre in a bizarre case.
Speaker 1: Robes is that he's in prison and apparently the other
Speaker 1: prisoners aren't being nice to him, and those reports have
Speaker 1: been out there to the point that now the Idaho
Speaker 1: Department of Corrections has actually had to put out a
Speaker 1: statement and respond to what's happening to him. I'll summarize. Now,
Speaker 1: shut up, Brian.
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Speaker 1: Continuing now with what's pretty much some mom certainly never
Speaker 1: before heard, but pretty stunning details robes about Brian Coberger,
Speaker 1: who was convicted, of course and serving for life sentences
Speaker 1: for the deaths for those brutal murders of those four
Speaker 1: University of Idaho students. And we've been talking about this
Speaker 1: forensic digital forensic expert who went through his phone and
Speaker 1: was prepared to testify at his trial, but of course
Speaker 1: he ended up pleading guilty. But we've we've shared some
Speaker 1: of the quotes that are out there, but this one
Speaker 1: we kind of saved because this quote, I think maybe
Speaker 1: is the strongest one we've heard so far from this
Speaker 1: forensic expert and maybe even from anybody to try to
Speaker 1: explain the why. This is as closed as we get.
Speaker 2: Everybody wants to know the why. But this is what
Speaker 2: she said. This wasn't someone who just snapped. This was
Speaker 2: someone who planned. He didn't accidentally stumbled into this house
Speaker 2: and commit the heinous crime. It was intentional.
Speaker 1: That's tough.
Speaker 2: It really is tough. And you know, she said, we're
Speaker 2: never going to be able to give the families a
Speaker 2: true why he did this, but they wanted to, and
Speaker 2: their whole purpose was to at least show how he
Speaker 2: did it, and really not make it like it wasn't
Speaker 2: something he just decided to do on impulse. This was
Speaker 2: something that was planned. It was not spontaneous, and that
Speaker 2: was a part of understanding the why. You know, you
Speaker 2: don't you won't be able to ever know why he
Speaker 2: chose who he chose, but in understanding the why, he
Speaker 2: was intentional. He was planning this. This was what he
Speaker 2: wanted to be and become, and he wanted to do it.
Speaker 2: It seems as though he wanted to do it more
Speaker 2: than once. He wanted to build up this serial killer reputation.
Speaker 2: It's really disturbing, you.
Speaker 1: Know, if every story right. We learned this very early
Speaker 1: on the who, what, when, where, why, and how? We've
Speaker 1: answered everything, I think except the why now because really,
Speaker 1: through some of this information that this analysis put out,
Speaker 1: we are at least in the public understanding more of
Speaker 1: the how. The how he did this was not just randomly.
Speaker 1: How he was able to be on the run and
Speaker 1: undetected for so long kind of makes more sense now
Speaker 1: because he had no connection. Maybe he made sure he
Speaker 1: had no connection to these kids. I don't perhaps, but
Speaker 1: he covered his tracks as well as something. But this
Speaker 1: is the why is left the How this helps.
Speaker 2: Yeah, it does. I think that it is incredibly helpful.
Speaker 2: I wonder what his parents knew or suspected, if anything
Speaker 2: at all. But it did seem as though he was
Speaker 2: so closely tied to them, at least electronically, and it
Speaker 2: seemed as if he had a very close relationship with them.
Speaker 2: It's hard to imagine they didn't wonder about his disposition
Speaker 2: or wonder about his mindset. If he's researching all of this,
Speaker 2: living in this a criminality criminology PhD student, would there
Speaker 2: be signs? Were there signs? I wonder what that relationship
Speaker 2: must be like with his family who sat in court
Speaker 2: with him every day and the prisoner yeah, the mom cry.
Speaker 2: But prisoners when he was being held during right before
Speaker 2: the trial after he was arrested, described him as talking
Speaker 2: on the phone with his mom for hours. So this, Yeah,
Speaker 2: that's just fascinating to think that they wouldn't have known
Speaker 2: something was off.
Speaker 1: And I have it right there, and you remind me,
Speaker 1: I'm sorry, you don't know either. There was an uptick
Speaker 1: they said right in uh messages to his mom, Yes,
Speaker 1: what the morning after the killings. Then somewhere around his.
Speaker 2: Arrest with yes, so two different times, right before he
Speaker 2: was arrested, yes, and then right before right after the
Speaker 2: murders were committed. So he committed the murders between somewhere
Speaker 2: between two and four am. At six thirteen am, they
Speaker 2: said he was just non stop texting his mom and
Speaker 2: calling his mom and his dad, both of them, just
Speaker 2: very like in a way that drew attention. It was abnormal,
Speaker 2: is how she described it.
Speaker 1: All right, Well, we mentioned off the top here. Yes,
Speaker 1: the headlines were being made that he in fact was
Speaker 1: being taunted, is the right way to put it. Maybe
Speaker 1: by fellow prisoners at the prison maximum security prison where
Speaker 1: he's being held in Idaho. So those reports were getting
Speaker 1: around rose about some pretty I think it was News
Speaker 1: Nation that was first reporting. I believe they were. When
Speaker 1: was it that they were screaming at him through the
Speaker 1: vents or something?
Speaker 2: H Yeah, so he's yeah, physically he's in no danger,
Speaker 2: but mentally they're they're torturing him deliberately. So they're banging
Speaker 2: on the walls, yelling at him, shouting at him through
Speaker 2: the vents, I believe is what the description was, And
Speaker 2: that he's been complaining incessantly to the guards that he's
Speaker 2: being tormented, and they're saying, hey, you are physically safe.
Speaker 2: Ain't nothing else we can do. And in fact, the prison.
Speaker 1: Statement, how often do we when do we ever get
Speaker 1: a chance to say, hey, Department of Corrections, you nailed
Speaker 1: it on that press release.
Speaker 2: Department of Corrections nailed it on this statement that they said.
Speaker 2: And they this is what they gave out to the
Speaker 2: news outlets who were asking, hey, you know he's complaining.
Speaker 2: He's saying he's being tortured. So here's what the what
Speaker 2: the prison said. We are aware of Coburger's complaints about
Speaker 2: what he considers taunting. Incarcerated individuals commonly communicate with each
Speaker 2: other in prison. Brian Coberger is housed alone in a cell,
Speaker 2: and IDoc security staff maintain a safe and orderly environment
Speaker 2: for all individuals in our custody.
Speaker 1: I love that you. I think you read it the
Speaker 1: way they meant it to be read. That whoever is
Speaker 1: on that staff, I don't know who came up with that,
Speaker 1: but what a way to put it. They commonly communicate
Speaker 1: with each other in prison. That was just well done. Great.
Speaker 1: I don't think anybody cares about him not being able
Speaker 1: to sleep, and I understand we're not suggesting any inhumane
Speaker 1: treatment of anyone, but complaining about being taunted by fellow prisoners.
Speaker 1: Well done, Idaho Department of Correction.
Speaker 2: And I don't think anyone's shedding one tier for poor
Speaker 2: mister Coburger who doesn't like being mentally tortured or having
Speaker 2: to have, you know, people kicking the doors and utilizing
Speaker 2: the event system to shout whatever they'd like at him.
Speaker 2: I kind of want to know what they're saying, but
Speaker 2: just I just kind of want to know.
Speaker 1: It's just common prison to talk common.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I wonder what that is. I wouldn't know, but.
Speaker 1: Well, this was one and we should remember Ethan Chappin
Speaker 1: twenty years old, Zanna Kernodle twenty years old, Madison Mogan
Speaker 1: twenty one years old, and Kaylee Guncalvis twenty one years old,
Speaker 1: the four victims in all this. And I think Grove
Speaker 1: I would really wonder what the families think about the
Speaker 1: information they've gotten, because we're learning it for the first time.
Speaker 1: They were complaining about the lack of information, so they're
Speaker 1: learning a lot of things now as well. Wonder how
Speaker 1: they feel about this bit of information.
Speaker 2: It's probably so hard to hear to know that he
Speaker 2: had been quietly planning all of this all along, and
Speaker 2: perhaps was even stalking and watching their loved ones before
Speaker 2: he ended up doing just what no parent wants to
Speaker 2: wake up and hear.
Speaker 1: Look.
Speaker 2: I just Annalie's literally as we're recording. This is on
Speaker 2: her way to her college campus, where she is going
Speaker 2: to be living in a house with six other folks,
Speaker 2: and I have been repeatedly telling her the story. Please
Speaker 2: lock your doors, Please like your doors. She actually yelled
Speaker 2: at me yesterday Mom stopped talking about the idahom. But
Speaker 2: this is something. This is every parent's worst nightmare, anyone
Speaker 2: who's sending their kids off to college right now, this
Speaker 2: is the time of year we're all doing that, and
Speaker 2: this is just a cautionary tale, a scary one at that.
Speaker 2: But to know that there are evil people out there.
Speaker 1: And yes, lock your doors. You feel safe in numbers. Right,
Speaker 1: there's six of us living in this house.
Speaker 2: There are guys in our house. And I said there
Speaker 2: was a guy in the Idaho house as well. It
Speaker 2: doesn't make you immune to certain people who want to
Speaker 2: do evil, who want to do something terrible, and so
Speaker 2: locking your doors and just being aware that people like
Speaker 2: this exist in the world It's not just in the movies.
Speaker 2: These are, unfortunately people who are living around us and
Speaker 2: among us, and it's just it is a cautionary.
Speaker 1: Tale, all right. Folks will continue to keep an eye
Speaker 1: on this case as more information does continue to trickle out.
Speaker 1: We always appreciate you listening with us. Signed TJ. Holmes
Speaker 1: alongside my partner Amy Robot. Talk to you all soon.