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Speaker 1: Welcome to Before Breakfast, a production of iHeartRadio. Good Morning,

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Speaker 1: This is Laura. Welcome to the Before Breakfast podcast. Today's

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Speaker 1: episode is going to be a longer one part of

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Speaker 1: the series where I interview fascinating people about how they

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Speaker 1: take their days from great to awesome in any advice

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Speaker 1: they have for the rest of us. So today I'm

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Speaker 1: delighted to welcome Jane Juncture to the show. She is

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Speaker 1: an ordained Buddhist nun who is also a graduate student.

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Speaker 1: So Jan Junkshure, welcome to the show.

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Speaker 2: Thank you, Laura, I'm excited to be excited to have

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Speaker 2: you here.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, well, why don't you tell our listeners a little

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Speaker 1: bit about yourself?

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Speaker 2: Okay, I am a big shoony, I'm ordained in the

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Speaker 2: Mahayana Buddhist tradition, and currently I'm going into my second

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Speaker 2: year of graduate school.

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Speaker 1: Very exciting. Yeah, and you had a different life before

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Speaker 1: in ring a monastery. Correct.

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Speaker 2: Yes, for over a decade I sold tea whole sale

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Speaker 2: tees and yeah, I did sales and marketing and PR.

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Speaker 1: Sales and marketing, yes, yeah, And so what led to

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Speaker 1: this pretty big career change.

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Speaker 2: I think that you know, from the time I was

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Speaker 2: a teenager. I was always deeply interested in Buddhism, and

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Speaker 2: for a long time I attended the monastery and winter

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Speaker 2: retreats and was you know, very kind of like active

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Speaker 2: in the monastery. But then there was a point where

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Speaker 2: I realized that I wanted to be more serious and

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Speaker 2: I realized that I actually had the potential to pursue

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Speaker 2: them inn astic life, and I saw the way kind

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Speaker 2: of open up in front of me, and I decided

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Speaker 2: to go for it.

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Speaker 1: That's wonderful, Yeah, I mean it's it was a big

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Speaker 1: process though, right. It took multiple years.

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Speaker 2: Yes, and you've been with me for many of them.

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Speaker 1: I've enjoyed hearing about your process for sure, because I

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Speaker 1: think people don't understand like what you had to learn

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Speaker 1: a lot. You had to learn a lot of new knowledge,

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Speaker 1: and so it was a fairly intense training. So can

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Speaker 1: you can you talk a little bit about what was

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Speaker 1: involved in the ordination process?

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Speaker 2: Certainly? So. I actually began my training in twenty seventeen

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Speaker 2: and I started living in the monastery then. And when

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Speaker 2: I lived in the monastery, I also kind of worked

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Speaker 2: a full monastery schedule and attended about six hours of

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Speaker 2: ceremonies and other events in the Buddha Hall and was

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Speaker 2: just more involved in the community. And then I became

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Speaker 2: a novice in twenty nineteen, and then my schedule got

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Speaker 2: even more hectic, and I was like, Oh, my goodness,

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Speaker 2: how do I do this? And that's when I came

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Speaker 2: across your book one hundred and surs. And I was like, oh,

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Speaker 2: this is actually really helpful because I had no idea

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Speaker 2: how I was going to get it all done, and

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Speaker 2: nothing would fit into twenty four hours. And then when

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Speaker 2: I started looking at things through the space of a week,

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Speaker 2: I was able to start fitting everything in well.

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Speaker 1: Because I mean the daily schedule you mentioned, like six

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Speaker 1: hours of ceremonies. Can you maybe talk about what a

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Speaker 1: daily schedule looks like at the monastery so people understand

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Speaker 1: sort of how much you were talking about is trying

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Speaker 1: to be in twenty four hours?

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Speaker 2: Okay, So in our monastery, we're maybe more strict than

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Speaker 2: other Buddhist monasteries, and we have a very traditional, very

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Speaker 2: rigorous schedule. Monastics and permanent residents who live in the

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Speaker 2: monastery usually wake up around three thirty am, and then

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Speaker 2: we go to ceremony from four to five am, and

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Speaker 2: then there's another ceremony after that universal bowing, which lasts

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Speaker 2: from five to six, and then many people participate in

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Speaker 2: suture recitation from seven to eight and then we have

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Speaker 2: our work period from about eight to ten thirty am,

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Speaker 2: which people have many different jobs around the monasteries, and

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Speaker 2: then we have another small ceremony before lunch ten thirty

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Speaker 2: to eleven am, and then in our tradition, monks and

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Speaker 2: nuns only eat one meal a day, so we have

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Speaker 2: our main meal of the day between about eleven am

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Speaker 2: and twelve pm, and then there's another ceremony, a great

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Speaker 2: Compassion Repentance from one pm to about two fifteen pm,

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Speaker 2: and then there's another work period from two to fifteen

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Speaker 2: pm till about five pm, and then we have free

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Speaker 2: time from five pm till about six fifteen pm, and

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Speaker 2: then we get ready to go to evening ceremony. The

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Speaker 2: monastics will usually line up in what we call a

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Speaker 2: taiban and then we will walk to the Buddha Hall

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Speaker 2: and be there by six thirty pm, and then we

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Speaker 2: have evening ceremony from six thirty pm to seven thirty pm,

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Speaker 2: and then Evening Lecture from seven thirty pm to nine pm.

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Speaker 2: Another small ceremony from nine pm to nine thirty pm

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Speaker 2: and then we have, you know, our own time until

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Speaker 2: we wake up at three thirty am.

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Speaker 1: As I say, do you ever get used to waking

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Speaker 1: up at three thirty am? I mean, even if one

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Speaker 1: is a morning person, that's pretty early.

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Speaker 2: It is pretty early. And how how used to you know?

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Speaker 2: Some days it feels fine and I'm very happy to

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Speaker 2: wake up. And if you have a lot on your plate,

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Speaker 2: I find particularly is like a graduate student, it's much

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Speaker 2: more talented because your brain is more full of things.

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Speaker 2: So there are monks and nuns in our tradition whose

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Speaker 2: sole focus is on attending the ceremonies and being present

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Speaker 2: in the Voodha hall, and for them, I think it's

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Speaker 2: rather enjoyable, like they really enjoy that. But when you

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Speaker 2: add on like responsibilities as being a student or teaching

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Speaker 2: or other administrative plifics, you could feel more talenting.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, because I mean if the last ceremony is

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Speaker 1: at nine, there's not a whole lot of sleeping time

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Speaker 1: in there.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, there's less than six hours. I think there's exactly

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Speaker 2: six hours between nine thirty pm and three thirty am,

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Speaker 2: and I need a little like downtime to like unpack

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Speaker 2: and get ready for the next day. So usually I

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Speaker 2: run on like five four and a half five hours

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Speaker 2: of sleep.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, But then do you sometimes nap at other points

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Speaker 1: to try to catch up a little bit?

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Speaker 2: I'm going to have to confess, but occasionally I do. Yeah, Yeah,

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Speaker 2: usually for like thirty minutes. Probably not every day, but

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Speaker 2: on more rigorous days, especially in about five to six

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Speaker 2: pm period, that's a good time to catch a quick

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Speaker 2: nap before going into the next cycle.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, but it certainly sounds I mean, given that so

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Speaker 1: much of the day is spoken for, and then you

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Speaker 1: also have classes for instance, I think you kind of

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Speaker 1: have to make your piece of looking at the whole

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Speaker 1: week and saying, well, I can't be at absolutely every

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Speaker 1: single ceremony, I can aim to be at a certain

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Speaker 1: number of them. Is that how you manage this?

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Speaker 2: That's where I am as a graduate student, because I'm

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Speaker 2: going into my second year of graduate school and I'm

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Speaker 2: taking a couple of extra classes because I'm learning Chinese,

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Speaker 2: I'm taking extra languages this year, and I'm also very

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Speaker 2: interested in writing a book for young adults and children,

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Speaker 2: and I also need time for that. So basically I

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Speaker 2: told my Dharma sisters you know, I can make this

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Speaker 2: many ceremonies during the week while I'm doing this semester,

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Speaker 2: and you know, these are my classes, so people know

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Speaker 2: where I am and what I'm up to. But it's

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Speaker 2: still very false.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, it sounds like it sounds like a very skull schedule.

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Speaker 1: All right, Well, we're going to take a quick ad

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Speaker 1: break and then I'll be back with more from gene Juncture. Well,

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Speaker 1: I am back talking with gene Juncture, who is an

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Speaker 1: ordained Buddhist nun. She's also a graduate student. We've been

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Speaker 1: hearing about the intense schedule of life in the monastery,

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Speaker 1: which we then need to layer your classes on top of,

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Speaker 1: layer your studying on top of I mean, when do

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Speaker 1: you actually wind up doing your studying.

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Speaker 2: So, because I'm a graduate student right now, my work

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Speaker 2: schedule has been adjusted and I have basically committed to

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Speaker 2: trying to do most of the morning ceremony of the

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Speaker 2: evening ceremonies, but the afterdoon ceremony, the Great Compassion Repentance

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Speaker 2: I do far less frequently. I'm more like once a week,

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Speaker 2: once every other week, because that those periods the day

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Speaker 2: are my class study time. So basically I try to

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Speaker 2: sell all of my classes and study time in the

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Speaker 2: morning and the afternoon period.

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Speaker 1: Okay, now I have you backing up a little bit.

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Speaker 1: So when you were going through the ordination process, one

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Speaker 1: of the things we began going back and forth by

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Speaker 1: email about a couple of years ago is that you

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Speaker 1: had to do a lot of memorization as part of

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Speaker 1: your training. Can you talk a little bit about what

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Speaker 1: that was?

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Speaker 2: Oh, my goodness, yes. So that was a big part

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Speaker 2: of the full or debate process. Is that in our tradition,

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Speaker 2: we memorize three sets of precepts and we're supposed to

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Speaker 2: recite them from memory before we fully ordain. And so

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Speaker 2: these are basically three books, and they take a long

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Speaker 2: time to memorize. And before I had started this process,

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Speaker 2: I don't think I had ever memorized anything longer than

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Speaker 2: a poem, you know, something very short for like high

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Speaker 2: school or something like that. So it was difficult, and

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Speaker 2: I had no idea how to go about doing this,

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Speaker 2: and I had to schedule it. I had to very

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Speaker 2: kind of like meticulously go line by lying, and then

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Speaker 2: to to do it, I had to break up the

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Speaker 2: text and the pieces and then basically I would you know,

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Speaker 2: if you sit still you can memorize maybe a sentence

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Speaker 2: of text, right, and then if you repeat it to

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Speaker 2: yourself throughout the day, you might be able to remember

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Speaker 2: it later during the day. But because the books were

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Speaker 2: so long, I had to figure out a way to

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Speaker 2: do this without kind of losing it in the process.

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Speaker 2: And so I started reading all of these books on

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Speaker 2: like different memorization techniques, and you know, some people know

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Speaker 2: about memory palaces. So I started trying to figure out

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Speaker 2: like different methods to kind of like hold these things

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Speaker 2: in my mind. And what it required was a lot

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Speaker 2: of time, and time was something that I felt very

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Speaker 2: short on, and so I had to really map out

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Speaker 2: in the schedule. And then my mind during that time

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Speaker 2: period was basically only focused on memorization. I was doing

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Speaker 2: my activities, but the only thing that was happening in

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Speaker 2: my mind was the memorization.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, and I and you just realized it was just

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Speaker 1: going to take time, right, I mean, that's the thing.

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Speaker 1: You have to get your head around, the idea that

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Speaker 1: you can only memorize a certain amount of time, a

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Speaker 1: certain amount of the precepts in any given day or

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Speaker 1: any given weeks, and so it's just going to be

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Speaker 1: years until you can get them all into your head. Correct.

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Speaker 2: It took me a long time to wrap my mind

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Speaker 2: around that, because how often do we sit down and think, oh,

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Speaker 2: I'm going to spend a year memorizing this book or

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Speaker 2: two or three years, you know, as the case may be.

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Speaker 2: And this is something that we don't really have, like

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Speaker 2: in our Western culture. You know, the only people who

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Speaker 2: I think memorized lines are like actors, you know, It's

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Speaker 2: not very common for ordinary people. And what it took

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Speaker 2: me a long time to realize is that it was

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Speaker 2: really a factor of dedication and not intelligence. And I thought, oh,

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Speaker 2: I'm a very smart person. I'll be able to do

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Speaker 2: this very fast. And then I realized, no, this is

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Speaker 2: more like exercise than it is, you know about intelligence.

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Speaker 2: It's about having enough stamina to get through it.

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Speaker 1: And you just kept going for several years then, right,

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Speaker 1: but clearly did it as you are now officially ordained.

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Speaker 2: Yes, yes, thank you.

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Speaker 1: So how did that feel when you finally did your

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Speaker 1: formal recitation as part of it?

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Speaker 2: It felt great and for me, you know, it was

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Speaker 2: like a dream realized after you know, from the start

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Speaker 2: of the training was twenty seventeen to the platform was

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Speaker 2: twenty twenty three, so that was like six years of

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Speaker 2: actual training. But I started this past in probably twenty thirteen,

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Speaker 2: kind of moving in this direction, so it was like

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Speaker 2: the work of a decade.

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Speaker 1: But you did it, which is very exciting. And then

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Speaker 1: you mentioned that all of your mental energy had been

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Speaker 1: devoted to memorization, and then you did it. And I

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Speaker 1: know that the nuns recite these precepts frequently as part

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Speaker 1: of your ceremonies, but still you weren't actively memorizing anymore. Yes,

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Speaker 1: so what did you do with that brain space?

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Speaker 2: Then? Okay, So once I wasn't actively memorizing anymore, I

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Speaker 2: got my first assignment in the monastery as a fully

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Speaker 2: ordained men, and they asked me to teach classes, and

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Speaker 2: so I began teaching. And I had volunteered taught before,

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Speaker 2: but I had not been volunteered teaching in several years.

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Speaker 2: And they gave me six classes to teach. So that

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Speaker 2: was my first year as a fully ordained men, was

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Speaker 2: teaching elementary and high school students for over six hours

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Speaker 2: a day. And then after that I applied to go

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Speaker 2: to graduate school and was accepted and began this journey.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, so now you're filling your brain with learning Chinese

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Speaker 1: and hermeneutics. Right, that was on your class schedule.

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Speaker 2: I believe exactly. I'm getting a master's in Buddhist classics

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Speaker 2: from Dharma around Buddhist University. And as you said earlier,

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Speaker 2: this here, my whole year has basically been Heidigger, Chinese

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Speaker 2: and dragons.

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Speaker 1: What a combination. I love it because The Dragons is

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Speaker 1: your novel, right, you're writing about for young adults, a

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Speaker 1: Buddhist theme novels.

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Speaker 2: There may be dragons in it, because you know, I

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Speaker 2: really enjoy dragons, but I think that there are a

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Speaker 2: lot of exciting themes in Buddhist texts. And what I've

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Speaker 2: found is that we have booked for very young children,

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Speaker 2: and then we have booked for adults, but we have

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Speaker 2: nothing for kind of the middle of years. And as

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Speaker 2: I taught students in twenty twenty three twenty twenty four,

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Speaker 2: I really saw this gap and I saw certain students

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Speaker 2: that I really wanted to reach out to and get

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Speaker 2: them enthusiastic about some of these texts. But I felt

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Speaker 2: like if there was no bridge, there would be no

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Speaker 2: way for them to enter them as adults.

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Speaker 1: So you're going to write the book that's going to

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Speaker 1: bring them in.

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Speaker 2: I hope that I'm going to write the book. It's

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Speaker 2: going to be the bridge. And I'm actually signed out

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Speaker 2: for a six week writing course with a woman who

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Speaker 2: has been publishing young adult books, who is also a

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Speaker 2: professor at a local college in our area. So I'm

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Speaker 2: very excited about that.

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Speaker 1: We've got a plan to make it happen. All right, Well,

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Speaker 1: we're going to take one more quick ad break and

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Speaker 1: then I'll be back with more from Gene Juncture. Well,

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Speaker 1: I am back talking with Gene Juncture, who is an

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Speaker 1: ordained Buddhist nun a graduate student. We've been talking about

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Speaker 1: her various ways of managing the schedule and all that

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Speaker 1: she has had to do as part of the ordination

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Speaker 1: process and then later teaching and being a student. So

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Speaker 1: you've just been working on your schedule for the fall semester.

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Speaker 1: I understand when we are we're having this conversation, maybe

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Speaker 1: you can talk about your process of how you create

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Speaker 1: a schedule for yourself, knowing what you know about you

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Speaker 1: know how you work and your responsibilities and all that

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Speaker 1: you're trying to accomplish.

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Speaker 2: Hey, well, I actually use the spreadsheet that you send

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Speaker 2: out in the time tracking challenge every year, and I

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Speaker 2: do it in fifteen minute increments. And so I start

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Speaker 2: by putting the morning and the evening ceremonies in because

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Speaker 2: those kind of book in the day for me, and

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Speaker 2: it's also a good way to connect with the other

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Speaker 2: monastics in the monastery. And then I put in all

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Speaker 2: the classes because the ceremonies and the classes are fixed

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Speaker 2: and you know, very important, and I'm taking extra classes

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Speaker 2: this semester so I can continue to improve my Chinese.

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Speaker 2: And I added in one fun class, which was quilting.

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Speaker 2: There's a NOD for credit quilting class, and my grandmothers

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Speaker 2: were wonderful quilters, but I never learned, so I'm taking

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Speaker 2: that as a side thing. So I put the classes

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Speaker 2: in and then I figure that I need roughly two

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Speaker 2: to three hours of study time writing time for every

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Speaker 2: hour that I'm in class, and so I try to

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Speaker 2: map out my study time so that I had at

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Speaker 2: least two or three study time to each class, one

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Speaker 2: directly before the class, one after the class, and one

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Speaker 2: in the middle. And so it took me like two

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Speaker 2: days to like, you know, kind of map this all out.

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Speaker 2: But then I feel really good because I have a

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Speaker 2: plan for the semester and then if special things come up.

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Speaker 2: It's just about moving things around a little bit. But

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Speaker 2: it's not a blank space. Now I know where I'm

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Speaker 2: going for the next few months.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, and building in time to study, like knowing that

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Speaker 1: that has to happen. And you're not just trusting that

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Speaker 1: it will happen. You're like, I, if it's important to me,

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Speaker 1: it needs a space on the calendar. Correct.

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Speaker 2: Yes, And I think as an undergraduate, when I had

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Speaker 2: endless optimism, you know, from eighteen to twenty two years old,

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Speaker 2: there were a lot of things that I tried to

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Speaker 2: like fit in at the last minute. I thought, oh,

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Speaker 2: this will only take two hours, but it ended up

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Speaker 2: taking six hours, and that's throwing the next day off.

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Speaker 2: And I think, you know, as an adult, I'm forty

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Speaker 2: five now, you know, I'm very aware that things take

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Speaker 2: more time than you think they will. And if you

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Speaker 2: leave more space, then you won't be panicked, You'll you know,

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Speaker 2: you'll feel much more confident.

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Speaker 1: Yeah. And it sounds like you've been doing quite well

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Speaker 1: in school. I hear you have the very high GPA.

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Speaker 2: Not too bad. My first year was three point eight. Yeah,

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Speaker 2: I'm very exot.

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Speaker 1: Well, it's so hard to go back to school as

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Speaker 1: an adult, Like you said, I mean, this is you know,

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Speaker 1: I guess the upside is you have the benefit of

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Speaker 1: wisdom and experience. But you know, it's been a long

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Speaker 1: time since you did this the first time around, right.

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Speaker 2: Yes, you know, I'm forty five now and I went

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Speaker 2: to you know, I did my underred when I was

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Speaker 2: eighteen to twenty two. So coming back to school and

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Speaker 2: writing papers, you know, formal academic papers after twenty three years,

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Speaker 2: was a real challenge because I had and little bits

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Speaker 2: of writing, you know, like press releases or marketing copy

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Speaker 2: or little things like that, but it had been a

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Speaker 2: really long time since I had written a fifteen twenty

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Speaker 2: plus page paper, and you know, finding good sources for

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Speaker 2: that and being able to you know, write it skillfully

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Speaker 2: is a talent that I'm still working on. But I

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Speaker 2: love writing and you know, will hopefully continue to improve.

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Speaker 1: I love it well, like with anything, I mean, it's

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Speaker 1: more dedication than it is talent. I think that's one

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Speaker 1: of the things we realize as grown ups.

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Speaker 2: I think that I completely agree with that, and that's

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Speaker 2: something I have really realized as an adult that I

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Speaker 2: did not know. When I was younger, I thought it

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Speaker 2: was all about you know, how smart you were, But

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Speaker 2: so much of what happens in life is about dedication

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Speaker 2: and you know, wisely spending your time.

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Speaker 1: Absolutely well, I agree with that for sure. So TJJ

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Speaker 1: I always ask people, what is something you have done

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Speaker 1: recently to take a day from great to awesome? So

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Speaker 1: something that has made a normal day better?

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Speaker 2: Okay. I made a resolution at the beginning of this

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Speaker 2: year that I told you about that I'm very pleased with.

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Speaker 2: And because I have so much kind of work and

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Speaker 2: classes and also ceremonies, I felt like I wasn't having

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Speaker 2: that much human connection with people. So one of my

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Speaker 2: goals with the schedule fifty walks a week, fifty walks

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Speaker 2: a year, and so I've been taking walks with people

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Speaker 2: and instead of having a meeting with them or you know,

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Speaker 2: doing zoom, I just if they're in the local area,

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Speaker 2: I just schedule, you know, a fifteen to thirty minute

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Speaker 2: walk and sometimes those walks go you know, for an hour.

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Speaker 2: But I've had some great conversations on my walks, and

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Speaker 2: then I also get outside and we live in a

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Speaker 2: very beautiful valley surrounded by mountains, so I feel like

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Speaker 2: I'm getting nature, exercise and human connection. So I love

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Speaker 2: scheduling walks with people.

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Speaker 1: I love it. That's a lot of awesomeness for one activity.

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Speaker 1: And what are you looking forward to right now?

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Speaker 2: I'm so excited to work on the book, the book

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Speaker 2: for children young adults, and I'm very excited for the

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Speaker 2: writing workshop which I'll be doing August in October. And

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Speaker 2: I'm also, you know, looking forward to what comes next

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Speaker 2: and after graduate school, it feels like possibilities will open

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Speaker 2: up again, you know. Will I focus on writing, Will

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Speaker 2: I focus on I'm working on some compilations of Dharma talks,

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Speaker 2: I do a lot of editing for our magazine and

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Speaker 2: other publications. And will I teach agen. So I'm sitting

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Speaker 2: with all of these possibilities.

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Speaker 1: And seeing what comes of it. I love it. Yeah, absolutely, well,

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Speaker 1: g Juck here, Thank you so much for joining us.

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Speaker 1: Thank you to everyone for listening. If you have feedback

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Speaker 1: about this or any other episode, you can always reach

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Speaker 1: me at Laura at Laura vandercam dot com. In the meantime,

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Speaker 1: this is Laura. Thanks for listening, and here's to making

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Speaker 1: the most of our time. Thanks for listening to Before Breakfast.

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Speaker 1: If you've got questions, ideas, or feedback, you can reach

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Speaker 1: me at Laura at Laura vandercam dot com. Before Breakfast

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Speaker 1: is a production of iHeartMedia. For more podcasts from iHeartMedia,

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Speaker 1: please visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you

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Speaker 1: listen to your favorite shows.

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Speaker 2: The