Speaker 1: I owe you the biggest apology. I was so unbelievably
Speaker 1: condescending to you that day. I'm sure of it. I'm
Speaker 1: sure that I don't remember exactly you told me. You
Speaker 1: sold me. I just shot a pilot. I'm like, oh,
Speaker 1: good for you, we just met. Oh good for congratulations. Man.
Speaker 1: What's the pilot? It's the American version of the Office
Speaker 1: And I literally went, oh, you poor thing. The look
Speaker 1: at my face is like, you dumb sat I am
Speaker 1: Kevin Rom, and I am proud to say that I
Speaker 1: am the second lead of the acclaimed short film moose Cock.
Speaker 1: Hello everybody, and welcome back to Yes Off the Beat.
Speaker 1: I am, as always your host Brian baum Gartner, and
Speaker 1: today's episode, well, I am very excited to welcome the
Speaker 1: amazing Kevin Rom into the studio. Kevin has been and
Speaker 1: on some of the biggest shows of all time, from
Speaker 1: Desperate Housewives to Mad Men to most recently, Madam's Secretary
Speaker 1: and man does Kevin have range? On Desperate Housewives, he
Speaker 1: played Lee McDermott for over sixty episodes and he got
Speaker 1: in touch with his sillier side his words. On mad Men,
Speaker 1: of course, he played Ted chaw a k A rival
Speaker 1: to the one and only Don Draper. Truly, guys, Kevin
Speaker 1: is he is one of the best in the business,
Speaker 1: and so today I'm excited to deep dive into his career,
Speaker 1: from his lgbt Q representation on Desperate Housewives to what
Speaker 1: it means to be part of mad Men's lasting legacy,
Speaker 1: and of course, as you heard in his open, we
Speaker 1: will also talk about his biggest accomplishment to date, working
Speaker 1: with me, Brian and Bam Gartner for our acclaimed short
Speaker 1: film Moosecock. Yes you did hear that right, Moosecock? I know,
Speaker 1: I know, with all the moose Cock swirling in your brains,
Speaker 1: the suspense must be killing you. So here he is now,
Speaker 1: Kevin rom Bubble and Squeak. I love it. Bubble and
Speaker 1: Squeak on Bubble and Squeaker cookie every month left over
Speaker 1: from the Nabby people. What's up, Brian? How you doing, buddy, Kevin?
Speaker 1: I'm so happy to see you. What is going on,
Speaker 1: my friend? It's a lot and nothing and a lot,
Speaker 1: and it's been forever. It has been forever. It's great
Speaker 1: to see you. I am delighted every time I see
Speaker 1: you on TV. That's all. There's something about seeing somebody
Speaker 1: who you worked with so early on, and you're like,
Speaker 1: yes every time, every time, just excited, excited, uh, looking
Speaker 1: forward to yeah, all the good things. It's funny that
Speaker 1: there came around the time that we met, it stopped
Speaker 1: being a competition between other actors for me personally, Like
Speaker 1: I I got to the point of my career where
Speaker 1: if they were gonna cast me, it's like putting nutmeg
Speaker 1: in and if they're gonna cast you, it's like putting
Speaker 1: a little more spicy something. And so it didn't feel
Speaker 1: like a competition. If like they're going to choose the
Speaker 1: best spice for the soup, and these are my comrades
Speaker 1: in arms, you know what I mean. Yeah, that's really
Speaker 1: an interesting point, right, Like they the proverbial, they are
Speaker 1: not choosing someone better, They're just choosing someone different ideally.
Speaker 1: I mean, look, look, I've I've shot the bed in
Speaker 1: many auditions, so like there are times when they chose
Speaker 1: someone better because I was of all. But when it
Speaker 1: comes down to it, if you're if you're right for
Speaker 1: the role, and you're you're what you're around, what they're
Speaker 1: looking for, and you know there's another guy who's different
Speaker 1: than you, and you know like I I read I
Speaker 1: tested for, according to Jim, to be the brother in law. Okay,
Speaker 1: have you seen according to Jim, I've seen according to Jim. Yes,
Speaker 1: we we are. We are different. We are completely different
Speaker 1: human beings. And and like I walked into the screen
Speaker 1: test and I was like, Okay, so it's either him
Speaker 1: or me. There's no there's no in between. Like They're
Speaker 1: gonna go one way or the other, and I'm gonna
Speaker 1: give my best version of it in this testing situation.
Speaker 1: That's so awkward anyway, and then they're gonna they're gonna choose.
Speaker 1: But I didn't take it. You know, it still sucks,
Speaker 1: But um, you can acknowledge that it was a different
Speaker 1: they were. They were making a different soup than what
Speaker 1: I was bringing to the two. Yes, but you but yes.
Speaker 1: But so at around the time we met, you started
Speaker 1: being able to be happy for other people or other
Speaker 1: people you have, Matt. Yeah, before before that, it was
Speaker 1: a competition. You know, there was a pie. There was
Speaker 1: only so many slices, you know that metaphor. And around
Speaker 1: the time that we met, I started to get in
Speaker 1: a place where I was like, you know, there's room
Speaker 1: for there's place for everybody. To do well. Right, all right,
Speaker 1: we're gonna talk about our meeting here very shortly, but
Speaker 1: I want to I want to go back to your
Speaker 1: childhood for just a little bit. You grew up in
Speaker 1: Texas As, Louisiana, Louisiana and Texas. Born in Texas, raised
Speaker 1: in Louisiana, finished high school in Texas. Okay, but you
Speaker 1: also were in Atlanta, because you know, I was in Atlanta, Atlanta, Texas, Atlanta, Texas. Yes,
Speaker 1: Atlanta high School in a clean city in Texas to
Speaker 1: very soon. I think they were the running rabbits, and
Speaker 1: I think there were I want to say, eight thousand
Speaker 1: people in the towne tiny little town. That makes sense
Speaker 1: that I haven't heard of it. And also I was
Speaker 1: going to ask you Atlanta high School I wasn't familiar with.
Speaker 1: Was born and bred there. Um the running rabbits that
Speaker 1: suits you. Actually you are, You're kind of like a rabbit.
Speaker 1: I feel like quick, just used to be quick, yeah, shifty?
Speaker 1: Maybe did you do sports in high school or early
Speaker 1: on or early on? And then like eighth grade, I
Speaker 1: just like I was playing football. I just located and
Speaker 1: I was never gonna be a football player. Let's let's
Speaker 1: be real clear I was. I was five ft on
Speaker 1: my freshman year, um five to my sophomore year, and
Speaker 1: I didn't grow until much later in high school. So
Speaker 1: I I quickly went into to debate and spiting debate,
Speaker 1: which led me to theater in a weird way. And
Speaker 1: then um I did. I did cheerleading for one year
Speaker 1: at at an all boys Catholic school, all all boys.
Speaker 1: I was about to ask if you you were small,
Speaker 1: if you were if you were strong enough to to
Speaker 1: lift people up, but apparently you were lifted. Well, that's
Speaker 1: very funny you to think that. And I can see that,
Speaker 1: and and uh, and I think in retrospect, I probably
Speaker 1: should have been the one being lifted. We had an
Speaker 1: all girls sister school, well and they are girl cheerleaders
Speaker 1: came from them, and so but Leah Leah Leah Hudson,
Speaker 1: who's who's still friends of mine, was my cheerleading partner.
Speaker 1: And we were definitely the weakest links like we were.
Speaker 1: We were the bottom. But they needed eight couples and
Speaker 1: they're like we they had seven, and they're like, okay,
Speaker 1: well let Leah Kevin, come on, I guess we need eight.
Speaker 1: Let's go. We were we were not very good and
Speaker 1: we had a lot of fun. Though. Wow, I'm sure,
Speaker 1: But now, wait a second. Isn't the point of an
Speaker 1: all boys school to keep the boys and girls separate
Speaker 1: yet lifting and cohording physically, I don't understand. Look, I
Speaker 1: made a very smart decision. I could either have gone
Speaker 1: to two days in the summer and be around a
Speaker 1: bunch of sweaty, sweaty men smelling, with no chance of
Speaker 1: ever playing the game because I was the third string.
Speaker 1: Or I could go to cheerleading camp where there were
Speaker 1: ten guys and four hundred girls. Right. I mean to
Speaker 1: be clear though, to be the weakest length on the
Speaker 1: cheerleading squad, but at least you're playing. At least you're
Speaker 1: at least I'm on the team. Man, I'm I. I
Speaker 1: got a letter. I am suited up. Do you have
Speaker 1: a letter? I got a letter? Yeah? Oh yeah, well no,
Speaker 1: well it's not a jacket's a sweater. It's a sweater.
Speaker 1: It's a letter sweater. They didn't give us. They would
Speaker 1: they literally the football team was like, no, they can't
Speaker 1: have jackets, they can have sweaters. All the jocks are like, no,
Speaker 1: that's not cool. Okay, so you're cheerleading, but you really
Speaker 1: start focusing on debate and that brings you to theater.
Speaker 1: So you you started doing plays? Yeah, so I you know,
Speaker 1: debate was my thing. Man, I I love debate. I
Speaker 1: thought I wanted to go to law school. My grandmother
Speaker 1: said I could argue with a signpost, and so I
Speaker 1: when I moved high schools. When I quit the school
Speaker 1: in Streeport, Louisiana, always Catholic school, I went to a
Speaker 1: public school in East Texas and they didn't have a theater,
Speaker 1: they didn't have a debate program for they had a
Speaker 1: huge drama program. So I got I got kind of
Speaker 1: thrown into a drama class, and like I had done,
Speaker 1: I did two Shakespeare plays my freshman and sophomore year,
Speaker 1: not by choice because my big brother quote unquote for
Speaker 1: the senior you have a senior as a freshman. He
Speaker 1: was like, you're auditioning for the play. And I was like, no,
Speaker 1: I'm not. He goes, yeah, yeah you are, and I
Speaker 1: was like okay. He was much bigger than I was,
Speaker 1: and he bought my beer on the weekend, So I said, okay,
Speaker 1: So I I did. I did. We did Julius Caesar
Speaker 1: my freshman year and it was fun. You know, I
Speaker 1: got the attention from the girls from the all girls
Speaker 1: school that way as well. And and then when I
Speaker 1: got to Atlanta, Texas, Yeah, they had a huge drama
Speaker 1: program and I kind of just jumped in that. That's
Speaker 1: where you you got the bug or you decided this
Speaker 1: is what you wanted to do. Well, I definitely got
Speaker 1: the bug. This is pre internet, this is pre you know.
Speaker 1: No one had from any of those towns had gone
Speaker 1: on to make something of themselves in our industry, and
Speaker 1: so there was never a thought to do it professionally.
Speaker 1: It wasn't until I got to college and I thought,
Speaker 1: I really enjoyed that in high school, maybe I should
Speaker 1: try it in college. And I saw play. I saw
Speaker 1: a two hander, Um, I can't think of anyw right now,
Speaker 1: A guy girls show and it was really good and
Speaker 1: the girl I fell in love with and she was amazing,
Speaker 1: and um, Tally's Folly. That's the play I saw and
Speaker 1: I was like, Wow, I should try that in college.
Speaker 1: And that's when that's when I jumped into the theater program.
Speaker 1: And that's when I was like, Okay, I'm gonna do this.
Speaker 1: I didn't know what I was gonna do, but I
Speaker 1: was going to do this, and uh, and I died.
Speaker 1: He was going to play every semester and never looked
Speaker 1: back from there doing a ton of THEA. So yeah,
Speaker 1: similar to me, I found it like as an activity
Speaker 1: to do. Yeah, that was what I was gonna do
Speaker 1: in high school and right before college actually I decided,
Speaker 1: oh I think I could actually do do this, and
Speaker 1: so I went to school for it. It seems seems
Speaker 1: like you were a little bit later. But this is
Speaker 1: at b y U. Is that right? Where did you go?
Speaker 1: Where did you go to college? Just study study theater SMU? Oh? Wow,
Speaker 1: they had a good program, didn't they. Yeah, they did,
Speaker 1: thank you for I mean obviously, I see. He was
Speaker 1: one of the programs that I thought about going to
Speaker 1: grad school. Okay, I thought about because my intent when
Speaker 1: I was in college, my intent was to go to
Speaker 1: grad school, get the m f A, and then go
Speaker 1: to New York. And that was that was my intent.
Speaker 1: And of course and like all, you know, all other
Speaker 1: plans that changed. But um, that was the thought. You're
Speaker 1: at b y U and you think you're going to
Speaker 1: go to grad school. Uh, well, at the first two
Speaker 1: years of b y U, the thought is I'm gonna
Speaker 1: go to law school. Um, this is just for doing
Speaker 1: the theater for fun. Um, gonna go to law school
Speaker 1: because that's how, you know, that's how I move up
Speaker 1: in the world. And then like I just got the bug,
Speaker 1: and I staid. Then I started working and I started
Speaker 1: loving it, and I was like, unbeknownst to me, I
Speaker 1: created a grad program for myself just by being lazy
Speaker 1: and not going to the other classes. And so four
Speaker 1: years in, I'm like, Okay, I need another year of
Speaker 1: education before I can graduate. And it's all general education,
Speaker 1: Like I needed sophomore English, and I needed to religion
Speaker 1: classes and I needed math. And my two best friends
Speaker 1: were leaving college and I was like, I can't be
Speaker 1: here anymore. I'm taking someone spot. I wasn't. I was
Speaker 1: pretending to be Mormon at the time, you know. I
Speaker 1: was like, I can't. I gotta get out of here.
Speaker 1: This is not for me. Um. And by one of
Speaker 1: my best friends went to a c T and grad
Speaker 1: to grad school. My of the best friend went to
Speaker 1: New York to be an actress. And I was like,
Speaker 1: I'm already getting paid. I've already done. I'm sag eligible.
Speaker 1: I've done two movies of the week I've done Promised
Speaker 1: Land and touched by an Angels guest stars. I'm moving
Speaker 1: to l A. Let's go, Let's pack my eight Honda
Speaker 1: Accord with one working headlight. Let's go to Los Angeles.
Speaker 1: And so you decide to go to Los Angeles. But wait,
Speaker 1: I can't just you were pretending to be Mormon. What
Speaker 1: I don't explain that Mormon. I grip Mormon. Okay, you
Speaker 1: grew up, well, I grew up Mormon. I was baptized Mormon,
Speaker 1: and then I did a mission for two years to
Speaker 1: nineteen to twenty one. I went knocked on doors in
Speaker 1: Switzerland and France, on islands East South Africa and tried
Speaker 1: to condunce where I heard yes, yeah, and then uh.
Speaker 1: And then I would go to buy U, mainly because
Speaker 1: I knew if I went anywhere else to my friends
Speaker 1: from high school at I would leave. Woman is very quicker,
Speaker 1: probably like all my friends were at l s U
Speaker 1: and UT and and uh and m um. And I
Speaker 1: was like, I can't go Eric, so I'll get in
Speaker 1: trouble fast. And so I went to be by you,
Speaker 1: trying to be the good boy. And then within two
Speaker 1: years I was like this is not for me. I
Speaker 1: gotta get out of this, and I then you did.
Speaker 1: But you have to be doing the things to stay there,
Speaker 1: Like you have to go to church, you have to
Speaker 1: have a bishop sign a thing saying you're doing all
Speaker 1: the things, and so you have to lie ultimately. Um
Speaker 1: so I I just I was. I had to. You know,
Speaker 1: I'd go to Salt Lake with my friends on Saturday
Speaker 1: night and then I'd teach Sunday school on Sunday morning.
Speaker 1: So that was That's what pretending to be Mormon means. Right. Okay,
Speaker 1: So because you did the missionary trip, you're older. Yeah, right,
Speaker 1: so you you started started at one, right, so that
Speaker 1: makes sense like that, you know, you're you're thinking about
Speaker 1: grad school. But at that point, you know, you start
Speaker 1: to get experience, you start to get maturity. As you said,
Speaker 1: you start to get jobs. Now, when you worked on
Speaker 1: Touch by an Angel? Was that filmed in Utah? Is
Speaker 1: that how you promised? Land? And Touched by an Angel
Speaker 1: were both shot in Salt Lake City, in and around
Speaker 1: Salt Lake. Uh. And they always had like one movie
Speaker 1: the week came through every year, a big movie would
Speaker 1: come through every year. They had a they had a
Speaker 1: decent you know, had a decent market in Salt Lake.
Speaker 1: And then you know, there was a modeling agency in
Speaker 1: salt Lake. CYS. This funny story. Actually Aaron eck Cart
Speaker 1: was a year ahead of me at the way, and
Speaker 1: he was a film student, not really in the acting tract,
Speaker 1: you know, and and he was getting work as a mom.
Speaker 1: He was with this modeling agency. And I was like,
Speaker 1: if that guy can get work, I can get work.
Speaker 1: And I went and got his agent because he would
Speaker 1: be he was like the helicopter pilot and like you know,
Speaker 1: he was like he would get these day jobs. They're
Speaker 1: paying like five hundred bucks a day, and I'm like,
Speaker 1: I can do that. That's better than delivering flowers on
Speaker 1: the weekend, you know what I mean, Like, I'll go
Speaker 1: do that. And uh so I literally went to Salt
Speaker 1: Lake and got his agent and that's how I started.
Speaker 1: I was like, I started booking you know, blue local
Speaker 1: commercials and radio spots and all that kind of stuff.
Speaker 1: It was a hand model for one day once. Just
Speaker 1: the left hand though, it's better than the right hand.
Speaker 1: Your left hand is more attractive than you're right. That's
Speaker 1: that's that's what I was told. That's what I was
Speaker 1: told by professionals. I'm just gonna leave that. I don't
Speaker 1: I don't need to go deep into this, but I
Speaker 1: will tell you a story about Salt Lake because you
Speaker 1: say you went out in Salt Lake. Now now things
Speaker 1: are different. Things are different now I understand. And I
Speaker 1: have been back. And by the way, salt Lake City,
Speaker 1: beautiful city, very nice, beautiful state. Utah. I love it now.
Speaker 1: I there was another show that filmed there that I
Speaker 1: happened to do a couple of episodes on. I think
Speaker 1: ever would film there in Utah. And I remember arriving.
Speaker 1: This is such a tangent. I remember arriving on the
Speaker 1: day of the National Championship Basketball tournament, right, so the
Speaker 1: final four, but the championship day it's always a Monday.
Speaker 1: I check into the hotel and I'm like, where is
Speaker 1: a bar? I want to watch the game. I'm a
Speaker 1: sports fan. And they were like, okay, well it's down
Speaker 1: And I remember walking down this highway. Walking down this highway,
Speaker 1: it starts snowing and I get to a sports bar
Speaker 1: just think Chili's, I don't know, and they asked me
Speaker 1: for my membership number and I'm like, this is a
Speaker 1: sports what do you and you had to have you
Speaker 1: had to be registered in order to enter and established
Speaker 1: join the private club. Yes, to join the private club
Speaker 1: of Applebee's or whatever, like you literally had to join.
Speaker 1: It's where the it's it's behind the ropes of Applebee's,
Speaker 1: right like it's like the v I P of Applebee's.
Speaker 1: And I was like, well can I yeah? No, No,
Speaker 1: it was like two dollars. I was like, how much
Speaker 1: is it to join? Two dollars? But I guess I'm
Speaker 1: registered in the state of Utah for having him at
Speaker 1: that one Applebee's just that one app it was. It
Speaker 1: just not. It's like if you go if you go
Speaker 1: down to a weaverer, it does not it's not transferred
Speaker 1: to the not it's not transferable, no non transfer. So
Speaker 1: my version of that is I met by U just
Speaker 1: side I want a beer. I'm like, I'm done with Mormonism.
Speaker 1: I just all I want is a beer. I haven't
Speaker 1: had a beer in probably five or six seven years.
Speaker 1: And probably the hot beverage or a hot Toddy you
Speaker 1: a hot beverage, yest um, those are just as bad. Obviously,
Speaker 1: you know your Mormonism, you know your Word of wisdom.
Speaker 1: So uh, there's there was two bars in Provo. One
Speaker 1: of them was called the ABC Bar dive a little
Speaker 1: dive bar in downtown Provo, and the other one was
Speaker 1: at the Marriott, which you could possibly run into someone.
Speaker 1: And so I figured, anyone who I run into with
Speaker 1: the ABC Bar is not gonna knock on me, because
Speaker 1: I'm not gonna ork on them. The joke is, if
Speaker 1: you want to drink a beer, invite invite one Mormon over,
Speaker 1: because if you invite you know, two Mormons over, they
Speaker 1: won't drink, but one who don't drink your beer. Um,
Speaker 1: So you go in. I go up to the door
Speaker 1: and I have I'm poor college student, I have like
Speaker 1: twenty dollars in my pocket. And I get to the
Speaker 1: door and the door guy goes, are you a member?
Speaker 1: And I think of the church, and I'm like um,
Speaker 1: because I'm I I have the Mormon boy haircut, I'm
Speaker 1: in Khaki's like I look like a Mormon missionary still,
Speaker 1: and he goes, are you a member? And I went, um, no,
Speaker 1: and he goes of the bar, you have to be
Speaker 1: a member of the bar. And I'm from Louisiana where
Speaker 1: at fourteen you could walk up to anywhere and did
Speaker 1: give up here for free. And I was like, whatever,
Speaker 1: kid here have a have a hurricane twelve year old
Speaker 1: and so I'm like, I have to be a member.
Speaker 1: I was so confused. I was like, get to be
Speaker 1: a member of what? He was the bar? You have
Speaker 1: to join the bar? And I said how much? And
Speaker 1: he told me twenty bucks. And I had twenty bucks
Speaker 1: in my pocket and that's if I pay them to join.
Speaker 1: I can't afford to buy a drink, and so I
Speaker 1: I go, I just kind of go, dude, I only
Speaker 1: have twenty dollars. And he goes, well, someone can sponsor you.
Speaker 1: And then he turns and he goes, anyone here, I
Speaker 1: want to sponsor this kid. And there's like maybe ten people,
Speaker 1: like a dartboard in the back and the jukebox and
Speaker 1: it's like the record skips. Everyone turns and looks at
Speaker 1: me and they all look me up and down, pause,
Speaker 1: and then look away. Not one person, not one person
Speaker 1: sponsored me. And I was like, oh my god, this
Speaker 1: is awful. I just want okay, and I just I
Speaker 1: I sunk my head and I went home. I did
Speaker 1: not get a beer. That I did not get a beer. Well,
Speaker 1: you had you had people, You had people even though
Speaker 1: you thought there was nobody watching you, there were people
Speaker 1: watching you. Oh yeah, yeah someone someone was watching the Lord.
Speaker 1: The Lord was watching. Yes, the Lord was watching you.
Speaker 1: Moved to Los Angeles and then what you you work
Speaker 1: to get an agent and you start auditioning. Is this
Speaker 1: this is how it goes. So I was I was
Speaker 1: ahead of the game because you know, um, well, an
Speaker 1: agent wouldn't see you at the time unless you were
Speaker 1: eligible or already SAG. And you know, it's kind of
Speaker 1: like you have to get a job to become SAG,
Speaker 1: but no one would give you a job unless you
Speaker 1: were SACK. It's one of those. And so the way
Speaker 1: to get your SAG card is either to be come
Speaker 1: an extra for multiple days where you had to become
Speaker 1: friends with the A D s and they give you
Speaker 1: a voucher and that takes a while. And the other
Speaker 1: way is to get cast in something where they called
Speaker 1: us staff heartley you know this, but the audiences don't
Speaker 1: know what's called taff heart lead and they have to
Speaker 1: pay a fine to hire you and say, there's no
Speaker 1: one else you can do this job in town that's union.
Speaker 1: So we're gonna make this kid eligible. And so I
Speaker 1: did that in Utah. So I was ahead of the game.
Speaker 1: But by being sag eligible, I had I had a
Speaker 1: tape at the time, literally on tape, so I had,
Speaker 1: I had, I had five minutes of me on camera
Speaker 1: that I could show people. And I had won this
Speaker 1: acting award in college, and so I thought that was
Speaker 1: gonna be a big entryway. And so and then David Giella,
Speaker 1: who was the casting director for touched fin Angel and
Speaker 1: promised land at the time I reached out to him.
Speaker 1: He actually reached out to me and said when are
Speaker 1: you moving down? And I said, actually, I'm coming in
Speaker 1: a couple of months. And he goes, okay, well, let
Speaker 1: me know when you get in town. And I put
Speaker 1: together I spent, like you, two hundred dollars at Kinko's
Speaker 1: money I didn't have making color copies of the newspaper
Speaker 1: stuff from when I winned this playwriting of this National
Speaker 1: Acting Award, um and the and the play I was
Speaker 1: in when the National Playwriting Award and we get to
Speaker 1: perform it in Kennedy Center and d C. And it's
Speaker 1: like the heisman of acting, right and but but that's
Speaker 1: no one knows about it, so the know the Irene. Yeah,
Speaker 1: this is a big Granny clamp It award is my friends.
Speaker 1: My friends call it the Granny clamp It Award. Um. So,
Speaker 1: I I put together this packet and like my resume
Speaker 1: and but like it's mainly it's like it's like ten
Speaker 1: color pages of this stuff about the Irene Ryan and
Speaker 1: the National Player running awards stuff and uh I submitted
Speaker 1: David gave me, Uh, David Giella gave me like twenty
Speaker 1: agencies to submit to, and I so, I twenty copies
Speaker 1: of this that I submitted, you know, Tension so and
Speaker 1: so at this agency referred by David Kiela. Just say
Speaker 1: that as I can't. I say, there's twenty of them
Speaker 1: that I submitted to, like three of them. Some assistant
Speaker 1: called new is, Hey, dude, come pick this up. It's
Speaker 1: they're gonna throw it away. And it's just this you
Speaker 1: put to get a lot of work into this. It's
Speaker 1: really nice. I don't want to throw it away. You'd
Speaker 1: probably come pick it up. I'm like, okay, thanks. No
Speaker 1: word from anyone else. And then two of them call me. Um,
Speaker 1: I get two meetings out of it, and like one
Speaker 1: of them is the artist agency where I ended up
Speaker 1: UH signing with at the time, and uh, I said,
Speaker 1: so what about the Like I just for my reference, Like,
Speaker 1: what did you like about the packet? They're like, what packet?
Speaker 1: I'm like, the twenty pages of color copies of information
Speaker 1: about my my accolades from college theater um that clearly
Speaker 1: or the reason I'm in this room. They're like, oh no, no,
Speaker 1: we just saw David's name on the cover and that
Speaker 1: someone called you. It's nothing to do. You could have
Speaker 1: written said hey, David said call you, and we would
Speaker 1: have called you. I was like, oh, cool, thanks, It's
Speaker 1: like all that energy and like, uh, that's so good.
Speaker 1: By the way, I did the same thing. I'm sure
Speaker 1: no one called me. No one called me to pick
Speaker 1: up my packet. I ran into one of fairly recently.
Speaker 1: You had the packet still, I had it somewhere, Yes,
Speaker 1: I ran into it, like in my archives. I don't know,
Speaker 1: do I have an archive in my hope somewhere, I
Speaker 1: hope somewhere there's a copy of that. I know, I
Speaker 1: know I have some old head shots and stuff like that,
Speaker 1: but I hope somewhere is I mean, somewhere is the
Speaker 1: newspaper clippings. But I don't know if the colored copied.
Speaker 1: I couldn't. I couldn't. I couldn't spend the extra money
Speaker 1: to get the spiraling put on it. Like that was
Speaker 1: too much, right, I think I stapled it. What were
Speaker 1: some of the challenges for you starting out once you
Speaker 1: moved to Los Angeles? Did it? Was it easier, harder
Speaker 1: than you expected it to be, or it was hard?
Speaker 1: It was? It was hard. I mean, like I uh,
Speaker 1: it seemed like this impenetrable fortress. Like it's felt like
Speaker 1: you were walking up to like one of those old
Speaker 1: Babylonian cities and there's a there's one gate and you
Speaker 1: can you can hear what's happening inside, and but you
Speaker 1: can't figure out your way over this wall or through
Speaker 1: this gate, and it just felt like there was it
Speaker 1: felt like it was really slow, like everything was just
Speaker 1: crazy slow. It's like, you know, I put all this
Speaker 1: together and email mailed him and I you mailed him
Speaker 1: at the time, like instead of drapping, they're not gonna
Speaker 1: let you drop them off, so you have to wait
Speaker 1: a week before you could possibly hear something. You know,
Speaker 1: so it's like a week of doing what what do
Speaker 1: I do for a week? Uh? You know, you get
Speaker 1: a job to make money. I played basketball and pickup
Speaker 1: games and outdoor parks, and you know, it's like what
Speaker 1: do you do with your time? I hadn't found an
Speaker 1: acting class yet, um, so I started waiting tables, and
Speaker 1: I just feel like a long time until I got situated.
Speaker 1: I had some horrible apartment experiences, and I mean I
Speaker 1: rented a room from this cat lady that I found,
Speaker 1: you know, and I can't remember where I found the ad,
Speaker 1: but like I read it was like, you know, less
Speaker 1: than two d a month. I was renting this one
Speaker 1: room in this house of this woman who managed the
Speaker 1: house and the apartments behind it, and I literally there
Speaker 1: was just dog and cat hair everywhere, and like I
Speaker 1: would just go in there and sleep at night that
Speaker 1: I'd leave all day because I didn't know what to do,
Speaker 1: Like what do you do? So eventually you get a
Speaker 1: role in Jesse, Yes, and then what your first well
Speaker 1: before the first one was Everything's Relative. So that was
Speaker 1: four episodes. It was me and Jeffrey Tambor, Jill Clayburgh
Speaker 1: and Eric Schaefer. It was they, it was Want to
Speaker 1: Be Arrested Development, it was Mitch Hurwitz, it was Jim Valley, Geniuses,
Speaker 1: and I was de Bateman character and to put out
Speaker 1: the center of the family, keeping everyone together. And they
Speaker 1: hadn't figured it out yet, right, they hadn't worked it
Speaker 1: out yet, But I read for that once a month
Speaker 1: for six months, Alison Jones would bring me in and
Speaker 1: I would read, and they'd be like, that's exactly what
Speaker 1: we're looking for. Who's next? Because they were looking for
Speaker 1: ja They wanted Jason Bateman. They wanted someone with the
Speaker 1: name to come in and be the lead of their show.
Speaker 1: And finally they cast Jeffrey Tambor and then they could
Speaker 1: cast and nobody as the as the guy as the kid,
Speaker 1: and uh. We did four episodes. We were after just
Speaker 1: shoot me, I think on NBC in the in the spring,
Speaker 1: and they candid immediately, and then I jumped on Jesse.
Speaker 1: That's what then people in the business know who I
Speaker 1: knew who I was. I did another pilot right after
Speaker 1: that with Patrick Warburton. Patrick and I did a pilot
Speaker 1: together called Jeff of the Universe, where I was Jeff
Speaker 1: and uh and my claim to fame at the times
Speaker 1: I read again like one of the people reading for
Speaker 1: that role was John Cryer, and I was like, I
Speaker 1: walked into the audition room, and I'm like, are you
Speaker 1: fucking kidding me? I'm reading against John Carr. There's no
Speaker 1: way I get this job. Of course, Ducky gets this job.
Speaker 1: How do I? How do I get a job? It's
Speaker 1: John Craiger. John Kraiger is gonna get this job. And
Speaker 1: I think because he was one of the people testing,
Speaker 1: I completely relaxed, And I think that's why I got
Speaker 1: the job, because I was like, oh, I'm not going
Speaker 1: to get this job, so I'm just gonna try to
Speaker 1: be the best I can in this room. So for
Speaker 1: the next job, right, maybe they'll maybe these people like
Speaker 1: me and I'll get up. I'll get another part of
Speaker 1: the show later on. So I think that's part of
Speaker 1: the reason I booked that pilot. And then then I
Speaker 1: jumped then I jumped on Jesse that summer. It was
Speaker 1: like that was back to back to back those three jobs.
Speaker 1: So your career is is taking off at this point? Yes, Yeah,
Speaker 1: you're starting to feel good and confident. Oh maybe a
Speaker 1: little too confident confident maybe maybe a little maybe a
Speaker 1: little too confident, I'm not. Yeah, and then judging Amy, yeah,
Speaker 1: that's your first long time show, right, more than more
Speaker 1: that Yeah, Jesse, I did one year. Everything's relative was
Speaker 1: four episodes. This was three seasons, like I did three
Speaker 1: full years of twenty two episodes a year. I bought
Speaker 1: my house like this is That was the one that like, okay,
Speaker 1: I can't Yeah, I'm now a working actor full time.
Speaker 1: And then we met right after I left judging Amy. Yeah, no,
Speaker 1: so that's where I'm gonna go. I mean, for first
Speaker 1: off three years and that stability that that brings. What
Speaker 1: did that? What did that give you as an actor? Uh? Well,
Speaker 1: beside your house a little besides a home and literally
Speaker 1: my first home, like my first not just a house,
Speaker 1: but my first home where I I created a safe
Speaker 1: place for myself. That was the positive side of it.
Speaker 1: It gave me boodles of confidence as I when working
Speaker 1: with Tyne Daily and Amy Brennaman on the regular and
Speaker 1: feeling like I was holding my own with them made
Speaker 1: me feel like I deserve to be in the room.
Speaker 1: I deserve to be in the in the talk like
Speaker 1: I felt like I and and and really naively of myself.
Speaker 1: I felt like, Okay, I've been number three on a
Speaker 1: TV hit, hit, acclaimed TV show, not not as not
Speaker 1: as part of the Zeitgeister a juggernaut ratings wise, but
Speaker 1: like well respected. It's respected for its acting at least,
Speaker 1: you know, yep. Um. So the next step is I'll
Speaker 1: get my own show. That's the next step. And so
Speaker 1: maybe a little too confident looking into that when I
Speaker 1: walked out of Judging Gavey. So I leave Judging Amy
Speaker 1: and it's like, uh, they're gonna do one more year.
Speaker 1: They're letting um uh oh gosh, what I'm gonna say.
Speaker 1: I can't lave forgo this name. He left the show.
Speaker 1: He was gonna come back for the last year, and
Speaker 1: I had replaced him mostensib plice. So anyway, so that
Speaker 1: I anyway, so I leave, I leave the show, and
Speaker 1: I'm like, right and high man, this is like this
Speaker 1: coming this back when they had pilot season. You know,
Speaker 1: I leave in the spring, I have this summer off
Speaker 1: I do it, you know, motorcycle trip to Europe, blah
Speaker 1: blah blah. And then that that like November, I get
Speaker 1: an audition for this cable show for a network I've
Speaker 1: never heard of. And it's a really good script, like
Speaker 1: really like I was like, holy cow, this is amazing.
Speaker 1: And I go in and I meet the creator and
Speaker 1: I read for it and they're like, yeah, we want
Speaker 1: you to test for this, and I get the test
Speaker 1: deal and it is half of my quote for half
Speaker 1: of the amount of episodes. Right. So, and this is November,
Speaker 1: so pilot seasons January February where I'm gonna get my
Speaker 1: own show because that's what happens next. And this is
Speaker 1: like an ensemble show. And I'm definitely not the lead,
Speaker 1: not even like maybe like the fifth lead. But it's
Speaker 1: a really really good script and I really like this guy.
Speaker 1: I wrote it and and I said, good look, guys,
Speaker 1: I can't I can't test for this. This is not
Speaker 1: you know, I'm gonna take a fourth of my pay
Speaker 1: and I'm gonna I'm about to get my own show, guys,
Speaker 1: So thank you, but good luck with your little show
Speaker 1: on a network called f X whatever that is. Uh.
Speaker 1: That show was The Shield, um and and so uh
Speaker 1: and that person was Sean Ryan who who who? And
Speaker 1: I look, I don't know that I would have gotten
Speaker 1: the part, but I was in the I was in
Speaker 1: the mix for the part, right and then I what
Speaker 1: I what happened that pilot seasons if if you can
Speaker 1: guess already is I did not get my own show.
Speaker 1: Not only did I not get my own show, I
Speaker 1: did not get any shows I tested. I don't know
Speaker 1: how many times I tested, but it was in the
Speaker 1: high teams. I tested for things and didn't book anything.
Speaker 1: And I learned. My lesson I learned was that zero
Speaker 1: times five years is still zero. And I was. I
Speaker 1: was a little humbled after that year. And this brings
Speaker 1: us to moose Cock o Man. I mean, listen, Kevin
Speaker 1: and I met on a little project and it's called
Speaker 1: moose Coock. It exists out there, it's out there, and
Speaker 1: so coming off of of this show, I'm more surprised
Speaker 1: that you said yes than I did. I had, at
Speaker 1: the time, shot a pilot for a show called The
Speaker 1: Office that everyone, including you, oh Will, every everybody that
Speaker 1: I worked with, was sure was doomed for absolute failure.
Speaker 1: I owe you the biggest apology. I was so unbelievably
Speaker 1: condescending to you that day. I'm sure of it. I'm
Speaker 1: sure I don't remember exactly you told me. You told
Speaker 1: me I just shot a pilot. I'm like, oh, good
Speaker 1: for you, we just met. Oh good for congratulations. Man.
Speaker 1: What's the pilot? It's the American version of the office
Speaker 1: and I literally went, oh the got my face is like, you,
Speaker 1: dumb sap. I hope you. I hope you saved every
Speaker 1: fucking penny they gave you. This ship is going nowhere.
Speaker 1: Have you seen the original office. There's no way, There's
Speaker 1: no one you can cast to compete. There is no
Speaker 1: Steve Carrell PI out there to create this. Oh my god,
Speaker 1: I was so everyone Will Will, our director writer was condescending.
Speaker 1: We were all like you, pour, dumb sap. Hopefully this
Speaker 1: makes it to festivals for you. Um we we we
Speaker 1: both we both said yes. Now I have to tell you.
Speaker 1: I don't know. I need to know from you if
Speaker 1: this is true for you. I mean I do a
Speaker 1: lot of appearances of colleges. Now I'm invited. I'm not
Speaker 1: just hanging out our campus. Important notes important note. That's
Speaker 1: the important note. Good information. But undoubtedly some smartass in
Speaker 1: the audience will raise their hands end and start talking
Speaker 1: effusively about admiring my work. Uh in Moosecock and it
Speaker 1: is a title that brings confusion unsettled ness? Is that
Speaker 1: a word? I don't think so? Are you asked about Moosecock?
Speaker 1: Not as often? Not as often as you are I'm
Speaker 1: not doing that my college experience. I my college tours
Speaker 1: aren't sanctioned, and so I'm just hanging out looking for
Speaker 1: a cheap salad. So uh, I feel like college kids
Speaker 1: are the ones who are going to do a deep
Speaker 1: dive on IMDb to say the funny thing in front
Speaker 1: of their buddies. So they're gonna find it. Um yeah,
Speaker 1: So no, I don't. I don't get it as much.
Speaker 1: I get it like every every once in a while, right,
Speaker 1: but you know, not as all. Well, it's there, it's
Speaker 1: a part of the record. It's really funny. It is.
Speaker 1: It's funny. It's funny the stuff, the stuff we got
Speaker 1: to do together, and I loved I mean, you got
Speaker 1: to go that, you went on and did all of
Speaker 1: this other stuff that I wasn't up part of. But
Speaker 1: like I that was a fun day for me. Like
Speaker 1: I really enjoyed shooting that with you. Yes, and I
Speaker 1: like he let us play, it was like it was
Speaker 1: the whole thing. Like I really enjoyed that experience. That
Speaker 1: was one of the that was one of the first
Speaker 1: times I walked onto a set and felt confident to play,
Speaker 1: you know what I mean, Like because it was will
Speaker 1: we knew it was our buddy and he and he
Speaker 1: cast us because he knew we could do it, and
Speaker 1: so I didn't feel any weird pressure about being something
Speaker 1: or doing something an extra Yeah. No, I remember it
Speaker 1: being incredibly fun and never could I have dreamed it
Speaker 1: could have won the Oscar and I it would not
Speaker 1: have gotten as much attention but for the name for
Speaker 1: me all these years later, I love you still get it?
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, um, no comment. So things don't go quite
Speaker 1: as you expect them to go. However, shortly thereafter you
Speaker 1: start a run of shows, historic shows, one might say,
Speaker 1: I'm very, very jealous of this, and I mean this sincerely.
Speaker 1: With Desperate Housewives, starting on a show that's already established
Speaker 1: that you don't have to sort of fight to invent.
Speaker 1: The world is there and created by the time you
Speaker 1: get on, talk to me a little bit. Were you
Speaker 1: a fan? Had you watched Desperate Housewives before auditioning, or
Speaker 1: how did that come about? I I was like everyone
Speaker 1: else in the country for the first two seasons, I was.
Speaker 1: I was a fan. I watched religiously, loved the ladies,
Speaker 1: loved what they were doing. I loved Marks, the tone
Speaker 1: that Mark took with the show. I thought it was
Speaker 1: so unique and interesting and um, there's a reason it's
Speaker 1: it was part of the zeitgeist. Um. And then I
Speaker 1: got the audition for it. And it's funny because like
Speaker 1: I was dating my now wife long distance and she, uh,
Speaker 1: she we she had come to visit me in l A.
Speaker 1: And of course, the minute she booked a flight to
Speaker 1: come visit me, I booked a job. And I was
Speaker 1: doing an episode of Scrubs as a guest and my
Speaker 1: character had had been bitten by a tick and had
Speaker 1: lines disease, and so they finally had to shave my
Speaker 1: head to find the tick. And so I'm in a
Speaker 1: ball cap and my audition, let's say, let's say it's
Speaker 1: at four o'clock. My auditions at four o'clock for Housewives,
Speaker 1: and I'm supposed to read for leak for Bob, and
Speaker 1: they don't let me out there and let me I
Speaker 1: take my ball cap off until like three thirty, and
Speaker 1: they're like, if you're not here by four, you can't
Speaker 1: get in. And I raced down this down the street
Speaker 1: from each other, and she's in the car with me,
Speaker 1: and I pull up to the lot and uh that
Speaker 1: that that entrance entrance through on the left at Universal,
Speaker 1: I had like ten minutes to get in and I'm like,
Speaker 1: I'm racing and I give my a D and he's like, okay,
Speaker 1: what about her? And I'm like what about her? He's like,
Speaker 1: she can't, she's not on the list. I'm like, well,
Speaker 1: she's with me. She's just gonna sit in the car
Speaker 1: this okay, And they're like, no, no, she can't come
Speaker 1: on along. I'm like, no, well, I don't understand what
Speaker 1: you what do you want her to sit on the curb?
Speaker 1: Like what do you want for me right now? And
Speaker 1: I'm I just I'm getting so mad at this poor
Speaker 1: person doing their job and becoming I I'm like, what
Speaker 1: do you They're like, yeah, she's got I'm like, no,
Speaker 1: she's I'm not. And my now wife Amy, she goes, Kevin,
Speaker 1: go to your audition. I'm gonna stay, I'm gonna get
Speaker 1: out of the car and I'm gonna stand here on
Speaker 1: the curb while and I'm like, no, you are, and
Speaker 1: I'm not letting you stand on the curb while I
Speaker 1: go read this. And I'm not even sure I want
Speaker 1: to do this. I'm not even sure I want to
Speaker 1: be on the show. And so I go, so I
Speaker 1: find going to the I get there like three fifty nine,
Speaker 1: and I go in and I read Bob and Bark.
Speaker 1: Sheera goes, did you look at Lee? And I go, yeah,
Speaker 1: he's funnier, and he goes, will you look at it?
Speaker 1: Go yeah, give me two minutes. It's fine, give me
Speaker 1: two minutes. And I go outside and I look at
Speaker 1: it for two minutes and I come back in and
Speaker 1: I just become a bitchy queen. I just I'm like
Speaker 1: mm ummmmmmm. And and that's so I think the gate
Speaker 1: guard because I think because I was so heated when
Speaker 1: I walked in, that's time I got the job. And
Speaker 1: now my wife takes full credit for me getting that job.
Speaker 1: But yeah, it was walking into an established world. Uh,
Speaker 1: it was just fun like it was just play. And
Speaker 1: they would write. They would just write the biggest, funnest
Speaker 1: stuff for me, and I would just see if I
Speaker 1: could do it, and uh, and I would say, let's go,
Speaker 1: let's how big? And there was one one of my
Speaker 1: favorite moments of the whole show is there and I
Speaker 1: when I read it, I laughed out loud. And then
Speaker 1: it's a it's a sight gag where they're like and
Speaker 1: behind her, you see Lee skating down the street like
Speaker 1: roller skating, and they never explain it, they never see it. Again.
Speaker 1: I never talked about skating, but I'm wearing like shorts
Speaker 1: and kneepads and like a bright yellow sweater vest and
Speaker 1: and I skateboard. I mean I I roller skate behind
Speaker 1: you know, like I just it was just silly and fun,
Speaker 1: and uh yeah it started. It started a run of like,
Speaker 1: if you want your show to end in three years,
Speaker 1: I'm your guy. Bring me in about three more good
Speaker 1: years and then we're done. People. Yeah, but that's that's
Speaker 1: not a bad number of years. No, No, that's a
Speaker 1: good number. Mark Cherry, the creator who you mentioned, has
Speaker 1: said that he wanted to treat Lee and Bob like
Speaker 1: the heterosexual couples on the show. Um. Yeah, this is
Speaker 1: an approach that is ahead of its time at this point,
Speaker 1: right for network television to treat them just like any
Speaker 1: other couples. Obviously, gay marriage is not legalized at this point.
Speaker 1: Did he talk to you about this or did this
Speaker 1: This is a part of the conversation. He introduced me
Speaker 1: as the fifth housewife in the in the room and
Speaker 1: the right, and like any time we depressed anytime. He's like,
Speaker 1: Lee is the fifth housewife. That's the that's and that's
Speaker 1: how he That's how everybody thought of them, you know.
Speaker 1: And some people were okay with it, and some weren't,
Speaker 1: and some people were different versions of okay with it. Um.
Speaker 1: I mean, one of the one of my audition scenes
Speaker 1: was the scene with Terry Hatcher where she shows up
Speaker 1: to give us, to introduced herself and give us cookies,
Speaker 1: and she realizes in the scene that we're not couples.
Speaker 1: We're not we're not at partners as in business partners,
Speaker 1: were life partners. And like the moment that that realization
Speaker 1: happens was one of my audition scenes. And I added
Speaker 1: this bit in the audition where she suppose we say something,
Speaker 1: she says something, we say something, and then she realizes
Speaker 1: and uh, it's between her lines that she realizes. And
Speaker 1: so in between the pause, I just turned the bob
Speaker 1: and I go, wait for it. She and then she
Speaker 1: realizes which killed in the audition, right, It killed in
Speaker 1: the audition. It wasn't on the page and it killed
Speaker 1: in the audition. And then I I made the mistake
Speaker 1: of doing it in rehearsal without telling her on my
Speaker 1: first day and and she goes, what are you What
Speaker 1: are you doing? What are you doing that's not on
Speaker 1: the page? And I was like, oh, I just did
Speaker 1: something I did in the audition and they thought it
Speaker 1: was funny. She goes, yeah, I don't. I don't. We're
Speaker 1: not going to do it like that, are we can?
Speaker 1: Like turn to the director and he goes, no, no,
Speaker 1: we're not gonna do because what you realize is they
Speaker 1: cut away. They would cut away from her instead, so
Speaker 1: it wouldn't the camera wouldn't stay on her. It would
Speaker 1: cut away to me and go back to her. And
Speaker 1: she's like, no, we're gonna stay on me, the new boy.
Speaker 1: We don't know you yet. We'll see you might. You
Speaker 1: might earn that tape later, but we'll see. For now,
Speaker 1: the camera is going to stay on the lead of
Speaker 1: the show. I was like, okay, cool, good enough, good
Speaker 1: to know that. Yeah, it's so good. I love Terry. Uh. Um,
Speaker 1: what do you think that show's legacy is today? It's
Speaker 1: it's hard. It was so big at the time, it
Speaker 1: was so big. It was so big. Um. I have
Speaker 1: really good friends from that Still, I don't know. I
Speaker 1: don't know where it will stack up. Look, it's not
Speaker 1: it's not mash for me, you know, it's not Sopranos
Speaker 1: for me. But as far as comedies, man, it's up there.
Speaker 1: It'll be interesting in fifteen years from now to see
Speaker 1: if it holds up, you know what I mean, and
Speaker 1: whether or not it feels kind of universal though I
Speaker 1: I you know, I feel like it's I haven't. I
Speaker 1: haven't seen it. I don't, you know, I don't even
Speaker 1: know if it's airing anywhere right now. I'd be interested,
Speaker 1: you know it now it seems like the time of reunions,
Speaker 1: and I'd be interested to see if there would ever
Speaker 1: if that is even possible, you know, what the story
Speaker 1: would be if if it's possible to do that, or
Speaker 1: if it's if it's just dead no water. I don't know,
Speaker 1: but you know, i'd be I'd be interested to see
Speaker 1: what those people were doing. Yeah, you mentioned the Sopranos,
Speaker 1: widely considered by myself included the greatest drama television show
Speaker 1: of all time. You put you put that, you put
Speaker 1: it above the wire. I do. For me, it's for me,
Speaker 1: it's number one, but there's there's a top five that
Speaker 1: is really close. And you were in one of those
Speaker 1: mad men. Um, Ted Chaw you joined that show late
Speaker 1: as well. UM, just an un unbelievable for formants. I
Speaker 1: have to I have to tell you there was just
Speaker 1: this disarming confidence and presentness. There was just something that
Speaker 1: was so pleasurable, even when we weren't rooting for you,
Speaker 1: especially early on, that I just I found so remarkable.
Speaker 1: So you should feel just so good about that performance.
Speaker 1: That is very this is very very kind of you.
Speaker 1: They Um, that was a special, special special place you've
Speaker 1: you note John Ham and you talked to him recently. Um,
Speaker 1: what he's and he's the guy you want as your
Speaker 1: number one. He's the guy you want leading the ship.
Speaker 1: As from the actor's point of view, Matt Weiner crazy
Speaker 1: smart and and and so focused and has such a strong,
Speaker 1: strong point of view, and he's the guy you want
Speaker 1: leading the ship that way, you know, demanding of everyone
Speaker 1: to bring their a game. I mean everyone from top
Speaker 1: to bottom. I mean I there's I have so many
Speaker 1: stories about that show that there's there's a scene where
Speaker 1: my secretary hands me a plane ticket I'm going to California,
Speaker 1: and it's in front of my office and then I think,
Speaker 1: I think Lizzie comes up, Peggy comes up to complain
Speaker 1: about something, and more was handing me the ticket. I
Speaker 1: literally take the ticket I put in my pocket. Let
Speaker 1: you see it the outside of the ticket for a second,
Speaker 1: and that was it. You never you never see me
Speaker 1: open it later. You never you know that ticket I
Speaker 1: when you open it up, is a carbon copy plane
Speaker 1: ticket like they had during the time. And I guarantee
Speaker 1: you if you look up the dates of the flights
Speaker 1: of that day, then flight numbers correct, the time is correct.
Speaker 1: It's a carbon copy. And that's one of the things
Speaker 1: I kept like. It ended up in my pocket. I
Speaker 1: took it back to my trailer and I was like,
Speaker 1: I'll give it to him tomorrow, and I forgot about it,
Speaker 1: and I at the end, I just put it in
Speaker 1: a book and took it home. So it's in a
Speaker 1: book somewhere in my bookcase. Um. But like if they
Speaker 1: handed you a file on hersheet, it was a file
Speaker 1: on Hershe. It was twenty pages of information about Hershey,
Speaker 1: and not same page over and over again. It was
Speaker 1: someone someone somewhere had spent the weekend creating a file
Speaker 1: on Hershey candy bar. And so in the scene when
Speaker 1: you look down at any page. You could become lost
Speaker 1: in that the world was so like there was a
Speaker 1: moment where Elizabeth had a poster of a jazz festival
Speaker 1: um and the behind her and like Matt came into
Speaker 1: a rehearsal was like, Nope, that doesn't happen for three months.
Speaker 1: Take it down, get the other one, or that's not
Speaker 1: until next year, or you know something like you know,
Speaker 1: just the detail that painting hasn't painted yet, that hasn't
Speaker 1: happened yet. Like that. Housewives was similar in the sense
Speaker 1: that Mark Cherry and and and Matt Winer gave you
Speaker 1: the box man, here's the box, this is this is
Speaker 1: the box we're playing in, and then you could go
Speaker 1: crazy in that box. And I remember getting to lethal
Speaker 1: weapons and I was like, okay, tell me what the
Speaker 1: boxes where? You give me the box and and and
Speaker 1: they're like, that's cool, let's do whatever you're doing. Great.
Speaker 1: I'm like, no, but I need what's the what's the
Speaker 1: give me? Give me the box man, what's give me this?
Speaker 1: But I didn't I need this box? So I can.
Speaker 1: They're like, no, you're doing what you're doing great, it's fun.
Speaker 1: I'm like, but can we And I love Matt Miller's great,
Speaker 1: but Matt Miller doesn't have the box like those He's
Speaker 1: not as he's not as uptight about his world as
Speaker 1: they are in that way. But I liked I like
Speaker 1: the box man, I like having the box. And then
Speaker 1: the confidence thing I got lucky it was that was
Speaker 1: one of those auditions were in the room. I mean
Speaker 1: that it was at the height. Man, Everyone in l
Speaker 1: A love that. Everyone in l A knew the show.
Speaker 1: I don't know how about it. I don't know if
Speaker 1: it had won words already. It was it was part
Speaker 1: of the Psycheist already when I read for it, and
Speaker 1: in the and I don't remember who they were, but
Speaker 1: I remember in the room knowing everyone in the room,
Speaker 1: like you recognized every actor in that room. They had
Speaker 1: all done stuff, they all worked, they were all good,
Speaker 1: and it was one of those moments it's like, Okay,
Speaker 1: here's my take, here's my take on it. This is
Speaker 1: what I think the guy doesn't is and and this
Speaker 1: is the other thing they don't. I don't know if
Speaker 1: you know this, but they they never told you who
Speaker 1: you were actually reading for and with like all the
Speaker 1: names have been changed. So when you get the audition scene,
Speaker 1: it's a scene from the show, but they don't want
Speaker 1: anyone to know what's happening in the show, so they've
Speaker 1: changed the names. And so I just figure. I just
Speaker 1: I was like, Oh, this guy's talking to John Draper.
Speaker 1: This has to be with Don you know, if he's
Speaker 1: gonna come out, he's gonna it was this The Benny
Speaker 1: Hannes scene was my audition scene, and I was like, Oh,
Speaker 1: he's talking to Don Draper and he's sucking with him.
Speaker 1: He thinks he's as good as Don Draper. That's the guy.
Speaker 1: He's gotta he's gotta be as confident, but he's got
Speaker 1: to do it differently. It's gotta be with a smile, right,
Speaker 1: And that's I guessed correctly in the sense of like
Speaker 1: of like what they were looking for for the role,
Speaker 1: and then brought my my my spice to it. Um.
Speaker 1: It was fun, man, it was Oh my god that
Speaker 1: it was. What a dream? What a dream? Everyone man.
Speaker 1: Jay Ferguson, Uh, we had worked together on Judging Amy
Speaker 1: and and then Slattery. We had worked together for a
Speaker 1: minute on Housewives. So when I walked into my first
Speaker 1: table read, there's two guys I know and love and
Speaker 1: Slat's like, hey, Grom, come over here, man. You know
Speaker 1: j already cool, you know John, Hey, this is Lizzie,
Speaker 1: this is yesh Sa now and welcome to the you know,
Speaker 1: welcome to our you know. And then Matt Winer would
Speaker 1: come and be like, okay, welcome everyone. You're now part
Speaker 1: of the Madman family. Um, do not tell anybody what
Speaker 1: your character's name is. Do not telling me what year
Speaker 1: it is. If you do, we will recast you, or
Speaker 1: we'll re shoot without you. Welcome to the show. It's like,
Speaker 1: if you want to read, if you want to read lines,
Speaker 1: do not read it with anyone else. We have someone
Speaker 1: to do that for you. If you tell anybody, if
Speaker 1: you tweet about it, if you you know, I think
Speaker 1: Twitter was just happening, Like if you if you talk
Speaker 1: about it, if you tweet about if you put it
Speaker 1: on social media, we will recast you, and we will
Speaker 1: we will do it that you welcome, Welcome. I often
Speaker 1: wondered about this because of the merger and everything else
Speaker 1: that that happened through the show. Were you secure that
Speaker 1: you were staying around? Did you know the story enough,
Speaker 1: did you know that they were going to bring you on,
Speaker 1: continue with you or was there a point where you
Speaker 1: were sort of living in that limbo of of maybe
Speaker 1: getting downsized the Chevy, the Chevy thing. Yeah, by that point,
Speaker 1: I felt pretty confident. I felt like I felt like
Speaker 1: I had a I had a place, I had a
Speaker 1: place in the world. But it was I never got
Speaker 1: overconfident in the sense that I and I never didn't
Speaker 1: show up prepared like that was. I didn't get to
Speaker 1: like they need me now, you know what I mean?
Speaker 1: Like I always I always felt like I was replaceable,
Speaker 1: but I didn't really get a I wasn't really afraid,
Speaker 1: like you know, like when I got cast, I was
Speaker 1: cast as a guest, a day player. Yeah, I think
Speaker 1: that's where I'm going, because it felt like you just
Speaker 1: kind of kept surviving. It felt like a four to
Speaker 1: six episode arc rival for Don, and then you'd go away.
Speaker 1: That's what That's sort of what I thought when I
Speaker 1: when I was watching you and watching you on the show,
Speaker 1: I was like, God, that's so great. I think that's
Speaker 1: more my feeling is like that was that was so great,
Speaker 1: That was so awesome, what a great character. And then
Speaker 1: just kind of kept feeling like you were not going
Speaker 1: to be there for that log like you know what.
Speaker 1: I'm not in like a bad way, but just like, oh,
Speaker 1: that's kind of what I what I expected the story
Speaker 1: to be. And then and then I was just so
Speaker 1: happy for you and obviously love the character and was
Speaker 1: glad you were around. Well, Brian, this is this is
Speaker 1: what I do. I show I show up on a
Speaker 1: show as a guest star, and then I just sink
Speaker 1: my hooks into him and I just charmed the pants
Speaker 1: off of him and I and I won't let him
Speaker 1: let me leave. I won't let them, you know. Paula
Speaker 1: Malcolmson on on Deadwood. Uh, she she said to me that,
Speaker 1: you know, at this end of season one, Milts was
Speaker 1: going to kill her character. He was she was supposed
Speaker 1: to die at the end of season one. She went
Speaker 1: up to Milts and she's like, you're not killing me
Speaker 1: in her in her beautiful irishex and she ain't killing me.
Speaker 1: You can't kill me. You have to keep me. And
Speaker 1: he did. He was like he got scared of me,
Speaker 1: and he kept her. She lasted the whole whole whole series.
Speaker 1: I I there was a sense of that at first.
Speaker 1: You know, his cast is like two maybe three episodes
Speaker 1: and it was day stuff. Man I got. My first
Speaker 1: episode was one day. The next episode I did maybe
Speaker 1: a day and a half, two days, and then um,
Speaker 1: I think the first three or four episodes were day rates.
Speaker 1: It was like you come in for the day, here's
Speaker 1: here's what we're gonna pay you. There was no negotiation.
Speaker 1: There's mad men. It's like, yeah, I'll do whatever you want, man.
Speaker 1: And then there was there was a scene where I
Speaker 1: was still day I was still day playing or at
Speaker 1: least guest starring. And there's the scene where I've now
Speaker 1: I've I have Peggy. Peggy has come to work for me,
Speaker 1: and we have that scene where it's it's New Year's
Speaker 1: Eve and we're looking at the commercial and I walked
Speaker 1: into her office and they were like, look at each
Speaker 1: other a little longer, like like we look, we're looking
Speaker 1: at the cameras over here, and like, you know, we're
Speaker 1: looking down together. We look up and look at each
Speaker 1: other and look back down and they go just just
Speaker 1: linger on the look a little longer. And Lizzie and
Speaker 1: I are both like why, what's what's wrong with you?
Speaker 1: And they're like, just look at each other longer, Like
Speaker 1: you've done that since you have a relationship. Later we're
Speaker 1: setting up the relationship and I'm like, oh oh, And
Speaker 1: that was like to the end of the season, and
Speaker 1: I didn't have any commitment to be on. I was like, yes,
Speaker 1: look at her as long as long. And then they're
Speaker 1: like then they're like they're like too much, wrong, too
Speaker 1: much backing up? Wait, too much? Wait too much? No, no, no,
Speaker 1: that's now. Now you've ruined it. Now you've ruined it.
Speaker 1: Oh God, so good. So many shows you've been on
Speaker 1: that I watch actually too. Bates Motel was a fun
Speaker 1: one for me. Vera Farmiga so amazing, she's so briant,
Speaker 1: she's so there's there's a handful of actors I've worked with,
Speaker 1: and she's one of them. Lizabe Elizabeth Moss is another one,
Speaker 1: um Hams and also another one, uh tyme Daily another one.
Speaker 1: We're in a scene Mike coverage the cameras on me
Speaker 1: and I'm watching them act and they're so good it
Speaker 1: takes me out of the scene where I'm like, holy
Speaker 1: sh it, that's good. I should how wow, that's really good,
Speaker 1: Like this is what there's playing in my head. And
Speaker 1: then I'm like, oh, shoot, I'm supposed to talk now.
Speaker 1: Um So Dawn uh, but seriously, vera. For me, it happened.
Speaker 1: There was a scene with her and Nestor and I
Speaker 1: in my office of Bates Hotel, two of them. She
Speaker 1: was sick like like this, like like had the fluish
Speaker 1: Wait before COVID, you could be sick on set. She
Speaker 1: was sick, like almost falling asleep in between takes, you know,
Speaker 1: like they give her some tea and she'd cuttle up
Speaker 1: and like take a little nap and um. But being
Speaker 1: the trooper that she is, she stayed. And now it's
Speaker 1: my coverage. Men, we've already shot her. She's done, so
Speaker 1: she could have gone home. They we could easily have
Speaker 1: a stand in read the lines for me and a
Speaker 1: lot of people would just go home at that point.
Speaker 1: She stayed and it's my coverage. And then she starts acting,
Speaker 1: and I'm like, holy shit, that it's not only different
Speaker 1: than what you did, but unique and specific to for me,
Speaker 1: that you're doing this and I'm the only person that
Speaker 1: gets to watch this right now. And I was like
Speaker 1: Elizabeth Moss, same thing. There's a scene when I tell
Speaker 1: her I've decided that I'm I'm I'm going to California,
Speaker 1: and she's, you know, she says, you're she glad you
Speaker 1: get to make those decisions and uh and my coverage. Man,
Speaker 1: she she comes, she leaned into me and I was
Speaker 1: like literally, I was like, holy balls, that is amazing.
Speaker 1: That's so good. And I'm the only person that ever
Speaker 1: gets to see that that was for me. And then
Speaker 1: it's just a gift. It's what you know, it's what
Speaker 1: a scene partner is supposed to be. And but you
Speaker 1: don't always get that, you know, so when when you do,
Speaker 1: it's it's special and exciting. Yeah. I, Um, that's awesome
Speaker 1: to hear. That's so you can't I can't tell you
Speaker 1: how happy I am to hear that about her. I
Speaker 1: have not worked with her. Um you get mistaken for Spader? Yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: not not as much anymore. Um, there used to be.
Speaker 1: There's Antonio's Pizza and the like I'm vent sure Boulevard
Speaker 1: and Sherman Oaks. I don't know if it's still there
Speaker 1: for the long For a long time, it was my
Speaker 1: head shot that I signed James Spader. We put it
Speaker 1: up when I first got to l A as this
Speaker 1: woman on a red carpet. I don't know how I
Speaker 1: was on this red carpet. I didn't had no business
Speaker 1: being there. It was for Volcano with Pierce Brazen and
Speaker 1: it was terrible. You know you'll never see it. Um.
Speaker 1: So we're I'm walking, I don't know how I'm on
Speaker 1: the red carpet. This woman James, James, James. I'm telling, like, James,
Speaker 1: fucking answer her already. And I turned around, like what
Speaker 1: She's like James pointing at me. I'm like, come here,
Speaker 1: come here. I walk over and I go, who do
Speaker 1: you think I am? She goes, You're James Spader and
Speaker 1: I go, I'm really not choose, just sign it, and
Speaker 1: I went all right, I signed James Spader and walked up.
Speaker 1: I was like sure. I was okay, I'm not gonna
Speaker 1: argue with you anymore. I know who I am. Um.
Speaker 1: But it was what was that? What was the what
Speaker 1: was his show with William Shatner? Of course, Boston Legal? No,
Speaker 1: Boston Legal, Yeah, Boston Legal. I had an audition. This
Speaker 1: is before I was a golfer. I had an audition
Speaker 1: to go play Julie Bowen's ex husband, like a two
Speaker 1: episode thing, to be her ex husband who was a
Speaker 1: professional golfer. And it was a nothing, It was a
Speaker 1: nothing part. It was like, I knew it wasn't gonna
Speaker 1: go anywhere. There was a guest spot that I was like,
Speaker 1: and I I James. We still looked enough alike that
Speaker 1: I was like, this is my moment. This is my
Speaker 1: Danny de Vito walking in. Who the funk wrote this moment?
Speaker 1: You know? You know that story? Um, this is my moment,
Speaker 1: So I'm gonna walk. I walked. I drove. This is
Speaker 1: David Kelly Studios down in Manhattan Beach right, drive all
Speaker 1: the way down there, parked my car. I go in
Speaker 1: for the audition. Haven't even looked at the size. I
Speaker 1: haven't even looked. I'm not I'm not there to audition.
Speaker 1: And I walked. I wait my turn, And I walked
Speaker 1: into the casting and producer's room and they're casting, the
Speaker 1: producers theyre I'm like, hey, They're like, are you ready?
Speaker 1: I like, nope, that this is parts not for me,
Speaker 1: But I'm here to tell you that I should be
Speaker 1: Spader's brother. I've signed his autograph. We look alike. I
Speaker 1: could be I could be some kind of drug addict
Speaker 1: or whatever I come to steal from him, But like,
Speaker 1: you should write a part for me where I am
Speaker 1: Spader's brother, and I'm expecting them to go, oh my god, yes,
Speaker 1: look at you. You just like him. Of course you're
Speaker 1: a young Spader. Silence, just dead silence, and they and
Speaker 1: then then then there's like I feel I feel the anger.
Speaker 1: They're like, are you fucking kidding me? And they look
Speaker 1: at me and they're like, so are you going to read?
Speaker 1: And I'm like no, I'm good. They thank you, and
Speaker 1: I was like, Okay, thanks a lot, guys, see it.
Speaker 1: I walk out and I was like, I never I
Speaker 1: never got an audition for those again, I never. I
Speaker 1: never got I never had an audition down there for
Speaker 1: like the next five years. They're like, I got a
Speaker 1: little little asterix next to my name and I was
Speaker 1: not called back. You should have called me. I would have.
Speaker 1: I would have put you in the office as Robert
Speaker 1: California's brother. Oh my god, how did I not? I
Speaker 1: should have been Robert California's brother. I think you would
Speaker 1: have at least gotten a laugh out of our crew.
Speaker 1: I don't know if if it would have happened. Was
Speaker 1: Alison Jones still casting? Yes, al with Alison Jones, Yes,
Speaker 1: she would have got I would have got a laugh
Speaker 1: out with Alison because he at least she knows me. Yes, Um,
Speaker 1: so much, great work, love Victor, Madam Secretary. You worked
Speaker 1: with on Madam Secretary. I have to bring this up
Speaker 1: because we started with this. Guys that I worked with,
Speaker 1: I've totally lost touch. This is one of those things
Speaker 1: where he definitively will not remember me, but every time
Speaker 1: I see him, I get that same warm and fuzzy
Speaker 1: feeling in circa nineteen. There we're starting with a nineteen.
Speaker 1: It's early seven or some of you haven't been born yet.
Speaker 1: I had had a friend and who got a play
Speaker 1: at the New York Stage and Film Festival, and they
Speaker 1: have sort of a company of actors and I think
Speaker 1: that they're like a pick to come and do this play.
Speaker 1: Reading was Jelko Vane and I remember watching him for
Speaker 1: those I don't know, two weeks of working on this,
Speaker 1: and I was like, oh, this guy is incredible. So
Speaker 1: he's another one that whenever I see him on anything,
Speaker 1: including Damages, which I watched which he won an Emmy for,
Speaker 1: he was great. He was great on Damages, so good
Speaker 1: on Damages. You enjoyed working with him? Oh, Jelko, Oh
Speaker 1: my god, he's another one. He's another one. Of those people.
Speaker 1: They're like, are you kidding me? He's small, he's not
Speaker 1: a big man. Then he's short, but he has a
Speaker 1: presence that is haunting when he wants when he needs
Speaker 1: to be, and terrifying when he needs to be. Has
Speaker 1: hit his moment with this girl and the one scene
Speaker 1: in the oval office and he puts his hand up
Speaker 1: to her face in the scene like he's gonna rip
Speaker 1: her face off, and he got he I was watching
Speaker 1: was it was a masterclass and how to be big
Speaker 1: when you're not big, Like he had his arms up
Speaker 1: and he does this thing with this girl and she
Speaker 1: was towering over him. And this girl, the actual the
Speaker 1: person the actors melted. She was like terrified of this man.
Speaker 1: He's and he's and he and on top of that,
Speaker 1: the best part is he is the kindest, most unassuming, humble,
Speaker 1: sweet how's your family? How are you doing? You know,
Speaker 1: just like he and Tea I could. I would have
Speaker 1: done that show for for as long as they would
Speaker 1: have had me. I would have I would have gladly
Speaker 1: done four or five more years about just they so lovely.
Speaker 1: Eric Stoltz was when the directing producers is a great
Speaker 1: as well. Um, just like another family atmosphere where everybody
Speaker 1: comes to work, to work hard, and it's gonna have fun.
Speaker 1: And here we're gonna do our best version of this
Speaker 1: and we're gonna go home Gore families, you know. Um,
Speaker 1: but she'll come. Man, he's a he's a stud. What
Speaker 1: a great dude. Another one, another one. I could just
Speaker 1: watch him in scenes likely ship. That's so cool. Um.
Speaker 1: I mean, your career is just it's amazing. I mean
Speaker 1: it truly is a dream. The variety of roles that
Speaker 1: you've been able to play. Literally, I do not have time.
Speaker 1: I'm way too busy a person to talk about every
Speaker 1: show that you've ever been in. You have to go
Speaker 1: work on your chipping. I've got to go. Yeah, I've
Speaker 1: gotta go work on my golf. Um. And not only
Speaker 1: an amazing career, but also speaking of chipping a great humanitarian.
Speaker 1: One of these years, I'm going to do it. You
Speaker 1: have my pledge here. It's recorded for posterity. The rom
Speaker 1: Celebrity Golf Tournament. You give so much to St. Jude's.
Speaker 1: Talk to me about that, your passion for St. Jude's,
Speaker 1: how that came about, and your commitment through your golf
Speaker 1: tournament to them. My first ever job I told you
Speaker 1: earlier was that Everything's Relative show. That was a with
Speaker 1: Thomas production with Thomas as in Danny Thomas's son, Tony
Speaker 1: Thomas is the Thomas and with Thomas, and we pretty
Speaker 1: much shut with Thomas down. They did Soap, they did
Speaker 1: Golden Girls, and I shut the doors on them as well.
Speaker 1: I've shut the doors on a Minia show. I shut
Speaker 1: the doors on that hole person. That whole building went down. Man,
Speaker 1: we shut it down. Um, so I have that claim
Speaker 1: to fame. So I felt like I owe the Thomas
Speaker 1: family something by shutting those doors. So that was my
Speaker 1: first connection with St. Jude. And then you know, I
Speaker 1: I met Patrick and Patrick started his tournament now twelve
Speaker 1: years ago. Patrick Warburton started his tournament twelve years ago,
Speaker 1: I believe now. And Clark Rainy, who runs Patrick's tournament.
Speaker 1: Clark called me about five years ago and said, hey,
Speaker 1: we want to do an East Coast version of this
Speaker 1: and we want you to be the namesake. And I said, well, okay,
Speaker 1: and my wife was on the phone. We were going
Speaker 1: somewhere where I put my works on speaker with me,
Speaker 1: and I said, so clearly you've gotten to the rs
Speaker 1: in your Rollodex, and no one else was stupid enough
Speaker 1: to say, yes, are you kidding me? Like you want
Speaker 1: me to go to Florida where I don't have any
Speaker 1: family or no anyone where I'm at to have people
Speaker 1: fly across country. I knew that we could do it,
Speaker 1: and I was excited to try. And I once you
Speaker 1: go to that hospital, um, you will, you will do
Speaker 1: anything you can to support to support it. It's a
Speaker 1: It's a special place for many many reasons. Uh, the
Speaker 1: least of which is that they're trying to keep kids
Speaker 1: from dying of cancer. That is the least of which
Speaker 1: it is amazing. They share all their research, everything's free.
Speaker 1: It's also interesting that in the nineteen fifties Danny Thomas
Speaker 1: decided to do it in Memphis, Tennessee and took everyone
Speaker 1: regardless of color, creed, or religion, which is a big
Speaker 1: deal at the time. Uh So, there's there's a lot
Speaker 1: of reasons that played that places. It's and it's it's hopeful.
Speaker 1: I don't like hospitals. My mom was a nurse. There
Speaker 1: was a lot of death in my family, so I
Speaker 1: don't like being around hospitals in general. And um, this
Speaker 1: place feels different. It just it feels people were walking
Speaker 1: around there with smiles in their faces, and there's there's hope.
Speaker 1: There's hope there. And so I would do anything I
Speaker 1: could to help and so and I'm proud my name's
Speaker 1: on it. It's awesome. Thank you for your generosity and
Speaker 1: your work. I want you to know, you know, we
Speaker 1: don't see each other very often, but it is always
Speaker 1: so so my pleasure. Thank you so much for joining
Speaker 1: me and before I feel the same way, Brian. I
Speaker 1: feel the same way, man, And like I think the
Speaker 1: last time we r indo each other was at the
Speaker 1: at the BMW like four or five years ago. And
Speaker 1: every time I see you on those tournaments on TV
Speaker 1: play and I get so excited. Other people I'm like,
Speaker 1: how the fund did that guy get an invite at
Speaker 1: the tournament? Every time I see you, I'm excited you
Speaker 1: you deserve it. You're a good guy. I'm proud of you. Uh.
Speaker 1: And I was again one more apology. I was so
Speaker 1: wrong about the office. It was really good. It was
Speaker 1: really really good. You were amazing. Uh, Steve turns out,
Speaker 1: Correl turns out, Correll, you can it could be an
Speaker 1: American office. It turns out, no, I didn't know it
Speaker 1: was wrong. I was wrong. I admitted, I admitted freely.
Speaker 1: I apologize for the condescension. Um, you and your two
Speaker 1: houses and your private golf club membership and deserve it. Um.
Speaker 1: Let me let me just say this. Let me just
Speaker 1: say this. I am very very glad you were wrong
Speaker 1: as well. Thank you, Thank you so much, Kevin. My pleasure,
Speaker 1: My pleasure, Kevin, Thank you so much. This was such
Speaker 1: a treat. Congratulations again for all you are doing for St. Jude's.
Speaker 1: And yes, I will join you on the course next year.
Speaker 1: I truly mean that. Thanks so much for your time
Speaker 1: and well your deep diviness and listeners. Make sure to
Speaker 1: catch us on Thursday this week for a sports edition
Speaker 1: of Off the Beat. I will also be back at
Speaker 1: it next Tuesday. One might call it double the Fun,
Speaker 1: double the magic, double the me. Basically, I just coined
Speaker 1: a catchphrase, maybe I'm going to talk to you soon.
Speaker 1: Off the Beat is hosted an executive produced by me
Speaker 1: Brian Baumgartner, alongside our executive producer Langley. Our producers are
Speaker 1: Diego Tapia, Liz Hayes, Hannah Harris, and Emily Carr. Our
Speaker 1: talent producer is Ryan Papa Zachary and our intern is
Speaker 1: Sammy Katz. Our theme song Bubble and Squeak performed by
Speaker 1: my great friend Creed Bratton, and the episode was mixed
Speaker 1: by seth O Landscape m