1 00:00:01,280 --> 00:00:04,279 Speaker 1: Welcome to Stuff You Missed in History Class, a production 2 00:00:04,360 --> 00:00:13,520 Speaker 1: of I Heart Radio. Hello, and welcome to the podcast. 3 00:00:13,600 --> 00:00:17,840 Speaker 1: I'm Tracy V. Wilson. Now I'm Holly Fry. Foxes are 4 00:00:17,880 --> 00:00:21,279 Speaker 1: one of many wild animals that share cities and other 5 00:00:21,320 --> 00:00:25,080 Speaker 1: places with human beings, and in April, one of them 6 00:00:25,120 --> 00:00:29,280 Speaker 1: made headlines after biting at least nine people around the 7 00:00:29,360 --> 00:00:33,959 Speaker 1: US capital. When this story crossed my Twitter feed, I'm 8 00:00:33,960 --> 00:00:37,559 Speaker 1: became incredibly invested in whether everybody who got bitten by 9 00:00:37,560 --> 00:00:41,960 Speaker 1: this fox had gotten their rabies shots. Afterward, news articles 10 00:00:41,960 --> 00:00:45,800 Speaker 1: were not telling me the answer to this information. Some 11 00:00:45,920 --> 00:00:49,000 Speaker 1: of them were talking about a specific reporter or a 12 00:00:49,080 --> 00:00:53,400 Speaker 1: specific congress person, but I was like, no, everybody, everybody 13 00:00:53,440 --> 00:00:57,040 Speaker 1: needs to get the raby shots because foxes can carry rabies. 14 00:00:58,040 --> 00:01:02,160 Speaker 1: Rabies is virtually always is fatal once people develop symptoms, 15 00:01:02,240 --> 00:01:06,520 Speaker 1: once anyone developed symptoms, but today's rabies profile access is 16 00:01:06,560 --> 00:01:10,679 Speaker 1: almost a dent effective at preventing that from happening. It 17 00:01:10,800 --> 00:01:13,080 Speaker 1: is I think the most effective vaccine that we have 18 00:01:13,200 --> 00:01:16,200 Speaker 1: in existence. So then when news broke that yes, this 19 00:01:16,360 --> 00:01:19,920 Speaker 1: fox did have rabies, it was like just a big flashing, 20 00:01:20,000 --> 00:01:23,160 Speaker 1: screaming side in my brain, like raby shots raby shots. 21 00:01:23,200 --> 00:01:27,360 Speaker 1: Raby shots, Please tell me everyone got their rabies shots. 22 00:01:27,959 --> 00:01:29,640 Speaker 1: Of course, then that made me want to do a 23 00:01:29,680 --> 00:01:33,639 Speaker 1: podcast on rabies and the vaccine that prevents it, something 24 00:01:33,840 --> 00:01:36,840 Speaker 1: that somehow I thought we already had stuff on. We don't, 25 00:01:37,280 --> 00:01:39,959 Speaker 1: or if we do, I failed to find it. The 26 00:01:40,120 --> 00:01:44,560 Speaker 1: vast majority of our listeners live in places where Raby's 27 00:01:44,600 --> 00:01:48,600 Speaker 1: deaths in humans are extremely rare. Some parts of the 28 00:01:48,640 --> 00:01:51,840 Speaker 1: world are rabies free, and here in the United States 29 00:01:51,840 --> 00:01:57,000 Speaker 1: there were only five human deaths from rabies, and that 30 00:01:57,200 --> 00:02:00,080 Speaker 1: was the highest number of annual rabies deaths in the 31 00:02:00,160 --> 00:02:03,280 Speaker 1: United States in a decade. There are also places, though, 32 00:02:03,280 --> 00:02:07,640 Speaker 1: where rabies is still endemic, and globally about fifty six 33 00:02:07,680 --> 00:02:10,480 Speaker 1: thousand people die from it every year. That is not 34 00:02:12,200 --> 00:02:14,760 Speaker 1: like that's a small number compared to something like the 35 00:02:14,800 --> 00:02:20,040 Speaker 1: current pandemic, but they're fifty six thousand totally preventable deaths, 36 00:02:20,080 --> 00:02:23,200 Speaker 1: Like we have what we need to prevent this, So 37 00:02:23,200 --> 00:02:26,200 Speaker 1: I wanted to talk about that heads up though there's 38 00:02:26,200 --> 00:02:31,640 Speaker 1: a lot of animal experimentation in this episode and deaths. Obviously, 39 00:02:32,440 --> 00:02:36,000 Speaker 1: rabies is caused by rabies list of virus, which probably 40 00:02:36,080 --> 00:02:40,200 Speaker 1: originated in Old World bats. This virus has existed on 41 00:02:40,320 --> 00:02:45,079 Speaker 1: every continent except Antarctica and Australia for millennia, and although 42 00:02:45,120 --> 00:02:48,840 Speaker 1: Australia is Rabi's free, it's home to a closely related 43 00:02:48,919 --> 00:02:52,800 Speaker 1: virus called bat lists of virus. But in spite of 44 00:02:52,840 --> 00:02:56,960 Speaker 1: the viruses connection to Bat's humanity's connection to rabies has 45 00:02:57,000 --> 00:03:00,440 Speaker 1: mainly been through dogs. That connection show is up in 46 00:03:00,480 --> 00:03:04,640 Speaker 1: the first written reference we have of rabies, that's in 47 00:03:04,720 --> 00:03:08,040 Speaker 1: the Eshnuna code from roughly two thousand b c e. 48 00:03:09,200 --> 00:03:11,760 Speaker 1: Shnano was a city and what's now Iraq, and some 49 00:03:11,880 --> 00:03:14,720 Speaker 1: of its laws have survived on a pair of broken 50 00:03:14,800 --> 00:03:18,280 Speaker 1: tablets that were found at an archaeological site near Baghdad. 51 00:03:18,800 --> 00:03:22,440 Speaker 1: Here's one of the laws quote. If a dog is mad, 52 00:03:22,560 --> 00:03:25,200 Speaker 1: and the authorities have brought the fact to the knowledge 53 00:03:25,200 --> 00:03:27,640 Speaker 1: of its owner, if he does not keep it in, 54 00:03:27,880 --> 00:03:30,480 Speaker 1: and it bites a man and causes his death, then 55 00:03:30,520 --> 00:03:34,000 Speaker 1: the owner shall pay two thirds of amina of silver. 56 00:03:34,639 --> 00:03:37,360 Speaker 1: If it bites a slave and causes his death, he 57 00:03:37,440 --> 00:03:41,800 Speaker 1: shall pay fifteen shekels of silver. The first written reference 58 00:03:41,840 --> 00:03:45,560 Speaker 1: to rabies in China is from the Zoo tradition, sometimes 59 00:03:45,560 --> 00:03:49,240 Speaker 1: called the Zoo Commentary. This is a commentary on the 60 00:03:49,280 --> 00:03:52,640 Speaker 1: spring and Autumn Annals, which chronicles a period of Chinese 61 00:03:52,680 --> 00:03:55,600 Speaker 1: history stretching from seven twenty two to four eighty one 62 00:03:55,640 --> 00:04:00,320 Speaker 1: b C. One passage in the Two Tradition describes people 63 00:04:00,320 --> 00:04:03,800 Speaker 1: of the capital city of Sung chasing a rabid dog. 64 00:04:04,480 --> 00:04:07,160 Speaker 1: The dog ran into the home of a minister named 65 00:04:07,200 --> 00:04:10,600 Speaker 1: wat Chin, and the people chased after it. Wat Chin 66 00:04:10,760 --> 00:04:14,280 Speaker 1: was afraid and fled the city, and about the fourth 67 00:04:14,320 --> 00:04:18,720 Speaker 1: century BC, Aristotle wrote this and his History of Animals 68 00:04:18,800 --> 00:04:24,760 Speaker 1: quote dogs suffer from three diseases, rabies, quincy, and sore feet. 69 00:04:25,520 --> 00:04:29,839 Speaker 1: Rabies drives the animal mad, and any animal whatever, accepting man, 70 00:04:29,960 --> 00:04:33,280 Speaker 1: will take the disease if bitten by a dog so afflicted, 71 00:04:33,920 --> 00:04:37,279 Speaker 1: the disease is fatal to the dog itself and to 72 00:04:37,480 --> 00:04:42,080 Speaker 1: any animal it may bite man accepted. So this translation 73 00:04:42,160 --> 00:04:45,440 Speaker 1: makes it sound like Aristotle was saying that humans don't 74 00:04:45,440 --> 00:04:48,640 Speaker 1: get rabies, but it's also been interpreted as meaning that 75 00:04:48,680 --> 00:04:52,280 Speaker 1: people don't always develop rabies when bitten by a rabid dog, 76 00:04:52,320 --> 00:04:55,560 Speaker 1: and that is true, or that people don't always die 77 00:04:55,640 --> 00:04:58,440 Speaker 1: from the disease if they contract it, which is almost 78 00:04:58,480 --> 00:05:01,800 Speaker 1: never true. People will have known that rabies was essentially 79 00:05:01,839 --> 00:05:05,960 Speaker 1: always fatal for thousands of years, though Roman court physicians 80 00:05:06,000 --> 00:05:11,640 Speaker 1: Scribonious Largest described rabies as incurable in the first century CE. 81 00:05:11,800 --> 00:05:15,840 Speaker 1: In addition to being lethal, rabies progresses in a way 82 00:05:15,880 --> 00:05:19,320 Speaker 1: that can be really terrifying. The exact symptoms can vary, 83 00:05:19,400 --> 00:05:22,960 Speaker 1: but there are two broad categories, both of which end 84 00:05:23,080 --> 00:05:29,600 Speaker 1: in coma and death. Paralytic rabies involves lethargy, weakness, and paralysis, 85 00:05:29,960 --> 00:05:36,200 Speaker 1: and furious rabies involves agitation, aggression, and hyperactivity. The word 86 00:05:36,400 --> 00:05:40,240 Speaker 1: rabies reflects this latter type that comes from the Latin 87 00:05:40,400 --> 00:05:43,520 Speaker 1: for to rage, which may have roots in a Sanskrit 88 00:05:43,520 --> 00:05:48,159 Speaker 1: word meaning to do violence. Lissa virus has a similar root. 89 00:05:48,240 --> 00:05:52,200 Speaker 1: It comes from a Greek word meaning frenzy or madness, 90 00:05:52,560 --> 00:05:55,359 Speaker 1: which was used to describe rabies as well as to 91 00:05:55,400 --> 00:05:59,719 Speaker 1: describe irrational rage. Raby shows up a lot in popular 92 00:05:59,760 --> 00:06:02,840 Speaker 1: cult sure, and that goes back thousands of years as well, 93 00:06:03,000 --> 00:06:05,800 Speaker 1: including the use of rabies or rabid dogs as a 94 00:06:05,839 --> 00:06:10,760 Speaker 1: metaphor for being mad or uncontrollable. For example, in the Iliad, 95 00:06:10,880 --> 00:06:13,320 Speaker 1: which was written in about the eighth century b c. E. 96 00:06:13,920 --> 00:06:18,560 Speaker 1: Homer describes Hector as a rabid dog. Rabies can also 97 00:06:18,680 --> 00:06:22,400 Speaker 1: cause paralysis and spasms in the throat that make it 98 00:06:22,440 --> 00:06:27,839 Speaker 1: impossible to swallow water. That's why it's also known as hydrophobia, 99 00:06:27,960 --> 00:06:31,839 Speaker 1: and the second century CE Roman philosopher Celsus used the 100 00:06:31,839 --> 00:06:36,599 Speaker 1: word hydrophobia in his description of the disease. Celsus also 101 00:06:36,720 --> 00:06:42,279 Speaker 1: recognized that something was present in saliva that transmitted this illness, 102 00:06:42,440 --> 00:06:45,560 Speaker 1: and he recommended a range of techniques to draw this 103 00:06:45,680 --> 00:06:49,840 Speaker 1: substance out of wounds. Like the connection between rabies and 104 00:06:49,880 --> 00:06:53,960 Speaker 1: aggressive rage, the connection between rabies and hydrophobia made its 105 00:06:53,960 --> 00:06:57,880 Speaker 1: way into literature centuries ago. For example, in about the 106 00:06:57,960 --> 00:07:01,720 Speaker 1: year five hundred, Klias A lean Is suggested that Homer's 107 00:07:01,760 --> 00:07:06,000 Speaker 1: description of Tantalus in the Odyssey might have been inspired 108 00:07:06,040 --> 00:07:09,680 Speaker 1: by rabies, since Tantalus is tormented by water that he 109 00:07:09,760 --> 00:07:14,360 Speaker 1: cannot drink. It's also possible that rabies influenced ancient Greek 110 00:07:14,400 --> 00:07:18,280 Speaker 1: depictions of Cerberus, the multi headed dog that guarded the underworld, 111 00:07:18,680 --> 00:07:21,720 Speaker 1: and that those depictions of a mad beast with poison 112 00:07:21,840 --> 00:07:26,360 Speaker 1: frothing from its jaws circled back to influence people's perceptions 113 00:07:26,360 --> 00:07:30,600 Speaker 1: of rabies. So through these and other written references, we 114 00:07:30,720 --> 00:07:35,400 Speaker 1: know that rabies had spread from wherever it originated, all 115 00:07:35,440 --> 00:07:39,400 Speaker 1: through India, China, the Middle East, Greece, rome in Egypt 116 00:07:39,520 --> 00:07:43,240 Speaker 1: by about fifteen hundred years ago, but we don't really 117 00:07:43,280 --> 00:07:46,600 Speaker 1: know how widespread the disease was in any of these places, 118 00:07:46,720 --> 00:07:50,520 Speaker 1: or how many deaths it caused among humans and other animals. 119 00:07:50,840 --> 00:07:53,960 Speaker 1: That starts to change in the medieval period, when people 120 00:07:54,000 --> 00:07:58,760 Speaker 1: started documenting large outbreaks of the disease within specific animals. 121 00:07:59,360 --> 00:08:02,840 Speaker 1: These account it's primarily focused on outbreaks among dogs and 122 00:08:02,920 --> 00:08:07,480 Speaker 1: other canids, including wolves and foxes. For example, an outbreak 123 00:08:07,560 --> 00:08:11,760 Speaker 1: of wolf rabies struck Franconia in twelve seventy one. A 124 00:08:11,920 --> 00:08:15,320 Speaker 1: massive outbreak among red foxes spread over parts of Europe 125 00:08:15,320 --> 00:08:19,160 Speaker 1: between fifteen seventy one and fifteen eighty one, leading people 126 00:08:19,200 --> 00:08:23,000 Speaker 1: to try to stop the disease by culling them. Sometimes 127 00:08:23,000 --> 00:08:26,840 Speaker 1: these outbreaks could spread to other animals, including infecting people 128 00:08:26,880 --> 00:08:30,200 Speaker 1: when they were bitten. At this point, we haven't mentioned 129 00:08:30,280 --> 00:08:34,880 Speaker 1: rabies in the America's and that's because while rabies existed 130 00:08:35,000 --> 00:08:39,040 Speaker 1: in the Americas through all this, rabid dogs probably did not. 131 00:08:40,080 --> 00:08:44,959 Speaker 1: Based on genetic studies of the virus itself. Before European colonization, 132 00:08:45,320 --> 00:08:50,520 Speaker 1: rabies and the America's primarily infected bats and skunks. There's 133 00:08:50,520 --> 00:08:54,080 Speaker 1: some evidence that Indigenous peoples in ancient Central and South 134 00:08:54,120 --> 00:08:59,439 Speaker 1: America regarded both bat bites and snake bites as potentially dangerous, 135 00:09:00,120 --> 00:09:04,120 Speaker 1: treated bat bites with washing and cauterization with hot culls 136 00:09:04,240 --> 00:09:08,959 Speaker 1: to try to prevent disease. Spanish colonists were reported being 137 00:09:09,120 --> 00:09:12,320 Speaker 1: bitten by bats in the early fifteen hundreds, and in 138 00:09:12,440 --> 00:09:17,800 Speaker 1: fifteen fourteen, Fernandez de Oviedo wrote about several soldiers dying 139 00:09:17,920 --> 00:09:22,120 Speaker 1: after being bitten by vampire bats. Dog rabies is one 140 00:09:22,160 --> 00:09:26,040 Speaker 1: of many diseases that Europeans introduced to the America's, and 141 00:09:26,200 --> 00:09:29,360 Speaker 1: after that introduction, it spread to other animals and became 142 00:09:29,480 --> 00:09:33,320 Speaker 1: far more likely to infect people, but that process did 143 00:09:33,360 --> 00:09:36,400 Speaker 1: not happen nearly as quickly with rabies as it did 144 00:09:36,400 --> 00:09:41,200 Speaker 1: with diseases like smallpox. Rabies typically has an incubation period 145 00:09:41,200 --> 00:09:44,240 Speaker 1: of roughly three to eight weeks, although it can occasionally 146 00:09:44,280 --> 00:09:49,160 Speaker 1: be much longer. Once symptoms appear, rabies is virtually always 147 00:09:49,200 --> 00:09:53,520 Speaker 1: fatal within about ten days. When Europeans first started sailing 148 00:09:53,520 --> 00:09:56,800 Speaker 1: to the America's, the voyage often took more than two months, 149 00:09:56,880 --> 00:09:59,960 Speaker 1: so any dogs or other animals that had been infect 150 00:10:00,040 --> 00:10:04,160 Speaker 1: did before setting sale usually developed symptoms and died or 151 00:10:04,200 --> 00:10:07,760 Speaker 1: were killed while still at sea, so that meant introducing 152 00:10:07,920 --> 00:10:11,600 Speaker 1: dog rabies to the America's required a voyage that was 153 00:10:11,720 --> 00:10:16,280 Speaker 1: short enough for infected dogs to survive. It also required 154 00:10:16,320 --> 00:10:20,079 Speaker 1: a large enough population of dogs and other mammals within 155 00:10:20,120 --> 00:10:23,439 Speaker 1: a colony for the disease to keep circulating once it 156 00:10:23,520 --> 00:10:28,360 Speaker 1: had been introduced. The first recorded outbreak of dog rabies 157 00:10:28,480 --> 00:10:31,880 Speaker 1: in the Americas was reported in Mexico City in seventeen 158 00:10:31,880 --> 00:10:34,400 Speaker 1: o nine, and by the end of the eighteenth century, 159 00:10:34,480 --> 00:10:37,880 Speaker 1: dog rabies was widespread in most of the places in 160 00:10:37,920 --> 00:10:42,640 Speaker 1: the Americas that Europeans had colonized. This in turn spread 161 00:10:42,679 --> 00:10:46,360 Speaker 1: the disease to the continent's native animals, with some of 162 00:10:46,400 --> 00:10:49,440 Speaker 1: those exposures leading to new strains of the virus that 163 00:10:49,480 --> 00:10:53,400 Speaker 1: were adapted to specific species. We'll talk about how a 164 00:10:53,480 --> 00:11:05,600 Speaker 1: vaccine was developed to prevent rabies after a sponsor break. 165 00:11:06,400 --> 00:11:10,120 Speaker 1: By the eighteenth and nineteenth centuries, outbreaks of rabies were 166 00:11:10,160 --> 00:11:13,319 Speaker 1: spread across a lot of the world and domesticated dogs 167 00:11:13,360 --> 00:11:17,280 Speaker 1: and in wild animals. In North America, rabies became so 168 00:11:17,360 --> 00:11:21,080 Speaker 1: widespread in skunks that they were nicknamed Phoebe cats like 169 00:11:21,200 --> 00:11:25,080 Speaker 1: hydrophoby and phoebe tents were advertised as a way for 170 00:11:25,200 --> 00:11:28,320 Speaker 1: cowboys to avoid being bitten by them in their sleep. 171 00:11:29,160 --> 00:11:32,480 Speaker 1: In eighteen o three, and outbreak among wild foxes in 172 00:11:32,520 --> 00:11:37,680 Speaker 1: France spread to dogs, pigs, and people. Bites from rabid 173 00:11:37,800 --> 00:11:41,760 Speaker 1: wolves tended to be particularly lethal, in part because attacking 174 00:11:41,800 --> 00:11:46,680 Speaker 1: wolves often bit people's faces or necks, meaning the virus 175 00:11:46,760 --> 00:11:50,280 Speaker 1: was way closer to their brain, while rabid dogs usually 176 00:11:50,320 --> 00:11:53,720 Speaker 1: bit people's hands or arms. There was no cure for 177 00:11:53,840 --> 00:11:56,400 Speaker 1: rabies and no way to tell whether a person would 178 00:11:56,400 --> 00:11:59,720 Speaker 1: develop it after being bitten, and estimates of how many 179 00:11:59,720 --> 00:12:03,040 Speaker 1: people developed rabies after a bite stretch all the way 180 00:12:03,080 --> 00:12:07,720 Speaker 1: from five percent to Some of this is just because 181 00:12:07,760 --> 00:12:11,040 Speaker 1: of imprecise record keeping, but it's also connected to how 182 00:12:11,080 --> 00:12:14,920 Speaker 1: people responded to the disease. In many places, there was 183 00:12:14,960 --> 00:12:18,880 Speaker 1: a widespread assumption that any animal that bit had rabies, 184 00:12:19,160 --> 00:12:22,160 Speaker 1: and during outbreaks, people tended to hunt down and kill 185 00:12:22,240 --> 00:12:25,560 Speaker 1: animals that they thought might be spreading disease. So a 186 00:12:25,679 --> 00:12:28,000 Speaker 1: dog that bits someone in the midst of all of 187 00:12:28,040 --> 00:12:31,360 Speaker 1: this might be rabid, or it might just be scared 188 00:12:31,400 --> 00:12:35,000 Speaker 1: and cornered and trying to defend itself. Around the world, 189 00:12:35,080 --> 00:12:39,160 Speaker 1: people tried various herbs and medical preparations to prevent or 190 00:12:39,280 --> 00:12:43,080 Speaker 1: cure rabies, and because it was so lethal, many of 191 00:12:43,120 --> 00:12:47,240 Speaker 1: these were also relied on the idea of divine intervention. 192 00:12:48,000 --> 00:12:51,760 Speaker 1: For example, Hubertus, also called St. Hubert Is the patron 193 00:12:51,840 --> 00:12:55,960 Speaker 1: saint of hunting, and one of his reported miracles involved 194 00:12:56,000 --> 00:12:58,880 Speaker 1: curing somebody who had been bitten by a rabid dog. 195 00:12:59,480 --> 00:13:02,920 Speaker 1: So inch of Europe people used a piece of iron 196 00:13:03,040 --> 00:13:07,800 Speaker 1: called St. Hubert's key to cauterize bite wounds. As part 197 00:13:07,840 --> 00:13:10,600 Speaker 1: of this treatment, a priest would also make a shallow 198 00:13:10,640 --> 00:13:14,960 Speaker 1: cut over a person's forehead, place a black bandage over that, 199 00:13:15,080 --> 00:13:18,160 Speaker 1: and the person wore that bandage for nine days. Some 200 00:13:18,200 --> 00:13:21,120 Speaker 1: people even carried one of these keys around with them 201 00:13:21,160 --> 00:13:24,760 Speaker 1: for protection. Long before the development of the germ theory 202 00:13:24,760 --> 00:13:27,880 Speaker 1: of disease, people recognize that when someone was bitten by 203 00:13:27,880 --> 00:13:31,960 Speaker 1: a rabid animal, something in the animals saliva was going 204 00:13:32,040 --> 00:13:35,720 Speaker 1: into the wound and potentially causing rabies. So some of 205 00:13:35,720 --> 00:13:39,400 Speaker 1: the other treatments for bites involved washing the wound, applying 206 00:13:39,440 --> 00:13:42,760 Speaker 1: caustic chemicals to it, or cauterizing in whether it was 207 00:13:42,840 --> 00:13:45,880 Speaker 1: with a Saint Hubertists key or with some other implement. 208 00:13:46,640 --> 00:13:50,439 Speaker 1: If these treatments were done immediately, after a person was bitten. 209 00:13:50,800 --> 00:13:53,920 Speaker 1: They may have helped reduce the chance of developing rabies 210 00:13:53,960 --> 00:13:58,760 Speaker 1: by washing away the animals infected saliva. Thoroughly washing the 211 00:13:58,800 --> 00:14:02,760 Speaker 1: wound is still step one in rabies prevention today, but 212 00:14:02,920 --> 00:14:05,679 Speaker 1: none of this was enough to totally prevent the chance 213 00:14:05,720 --> 00:14:09,600 Speaker 1: of developing the fatal disease. People also tried to prevent 214 00:14:09,679 --> 00:14:13,319 Speaker 1: rabies by reducing the numbers of animals that could carry 215 00:14:13,360 --> 00:14:16,319 Speaker 1: it and transmit it to humans and to other animals. 216 00:14:16,800 --> 00:14:20,120 Speaker 1: For example, in eighteen sixty seven, the UK passed the 217 00:14:20,160 --> 00:14:25,000 Speaker 1: Metropolitan Streets Act. Among other things, this act empowered police 218 00:14:25,080 --> 00:14:28,600 Speaker 1: to collect and muzzle stray dogs, are dogs that were 219 00:14:28,600 --> 00:14:32,320 Speaker 1: determined to be dangerous. This reportedly led to a drop 220 00:14:32,360 --> 00:14:36,200 Speaker 1: in human cases of rabies in British cities. Also in 221 00:14:36,240 --> 00:14:40,440 Speaker 1: the eighteenth and nineteen centuries, researchers were learning about rabies 222 00:14:40,480 --> 00:14:43,720 Speaker 1: and working on ways to prevent it spread. During the 223 00:14:43,800 --> 00:14:46,800 Speaker 1: earlier part of this time, researchers didn't yet know what 224 00:14:46,840 --> 00:14:50,400 Speaker 1: a virus was. But trying to talk around that got 225 00:14:50,440 --> 00:14:52,720 Speaker 1: really clunky. So we are still going to call it 226 00:14:52,800 --> 00:14:56,640 Speaker 1: a virus in our discussion today. Yeah, it was a 227 00:14:56,720 --> 00:14:59,400 Speaker 1: lot of incredibly stilted sentences before I was like, we're 228 00:14:59,440 --> 00:15:03,720 Speaker 1: just it a virus, regardless of whether that individual research 229 00:15:03,760 --> 00:15:07,680 Speaker 1: or knew what a virus was. So in seventeen sixty nine, 230 00:15:07,960 --> 00:15:13,720 Speaker 1: Italian anatomist and pathologist John Morganni observed that rabies traveled 231 00:15:13,840 --> 00:15:18,160 Speaker 1: via the nerves rather than traveling through the bloodstream. He 232 00:15:18,280 --> 00:15:21,560 Speaker 1: made this connection because some patients reported a feeling of 233 00:15:21,640 --> 00:15:25,840 Speaker 1: pins and needles or other neurological disturbances around the site 234 00:15:25,840 --> 00:15:30,240 Speaker 1: of their original bite wounds. Morgan was correct. Once it 235 00:15:30,480 --> 00:15:34,360 Speaker 1: enters the body, the rabies virus moves along the nerves 236 00:15:34,440 --> 00:15:36,240 Speaker 1: until it gets to the brain and the rest of 237 00:15:36,280 --> 00:15:39,320 Speaker 1: the central nervous system. After it gets to the brain, 238 00:15:39,520 --> 00:15:42,560 Speaker 1: the rabies virus makes its way to the salivary glands, 239 00:15:42,600 --> 00:15:47,120 Speaker 1: where it can cause excessive salivation, and although eighteen century 240 00:15:47,120 --> 00:15:50,680 Speaker 1: researchers didn't quite have that part figured out, they did 241 00:15:50,760 --> 00:15:54,400 Speaker 1: know that the disease was spread through saliva. In seventeen 242 00:15:54,480 --> 00:15:58,280 Speaker 1: ninety three, Scottish surgeon John Hunter speculated that it would 243 00:15:58,280 --> 00:16:01,640 Speaker 1: be possible to use a lancet to intentionally introduce an 244 00:16:01,640 --> 00:16:06,240 Speaker 1: infected animals saliva into another animal, but it's not clear 245 00:16:06,240 --> 00:16:09,640 Speaker 1: whether he tried this in practice. We also don't know 246 00:16:09,720 --> 00:16:15,200 Speaker 1: whether German naturalist George Gottfried Zinca was familiar with Hunter's work, 247 00:16:15,280 --> 00:16:19,320 Speaker 1: but in eighteen o four he brushed saliva from a 248 00:16:19,480 --> 00:16:22,360 Speaker 1: rabid dog onto a cut he had made in the 249 00:16:22,440 --> 00:16:27,800 Speaker 1: leg of a healthy dog. This previously healthy dog contracted rabies. 250 00:16:28,320 --> 00:16:31,800 Speaker 1: He did the same thing with other healthy mammals, demonstrating 251 00:16:31,800 --> 00:16:34,280 Speaker 1: that it was possible for the bite of an infected 252 00:16:34,360 --> 00:16:38,600 Speaker 1: dog to infect animals of other species. In eighteen twenty one, 253 00:16:38,800 --> 00:16:44,120 Speaker 1: French neurophysiologist Francois Magendie reported that he had infected a 254 00:16:44,200 --> 00:16:48,520 Speaker 1: previously healthy dog with saliva from a person who had 255 00:16:48,560 --> 00:16:52,920 Speaker 1: contracted rabies. Victor Gautier was a professor at the National 256 00:16:53,000 --> 00:16:57,000 Speaker 1: Veterinary School in Lyon, France, and he started experimenting with 257 00:16:57,080 --> 00:17:00,920 Speaker 1: rabies in eighteen seventy nine. He found that it was 258 00:17:00,960 --> 00:17:03,880 Speaker 1: possible to transmit rabies from a dog to a rabbit, 259 00:17:04,280 --> 00:17:08,080 Speaker 1: and then from that rabbit to another rabbit. Rabbits were 260 00:17:08,119 --> 00:17:10,720 Speaker 1: smaller and easier to keep than dogs, and they were 261 00:17:10,800 --> 00:17:15,920 Speaker 1: less dangerous research subjects than rabbid dogs were. Gaultier also 262 00:17:15,960 --> 00:17:18,800 Speaker 1: found that the rabbits had a shorter incubation period of 263 00:17:18,840 --> 00:17:21,760 Speaker 1: about eighteen days rather than a month or more that 264 00:17:21,800 --> 00:17:25,560 Speaker 1: you might see in a dog. Gaultier did various experiments 265 00:17:25,600 --> 00:17:29,760 Speaker 1: with infected animals saliva, attempting to see whether he could 266 00:17:29,760 --> 00:17:34,080 Speaker 1: find some way of using this infectious material to prevent rabies. 267 00:17:34,600 --> 00:17:37,679 Speaker 1: In eighteen eighty one, he injected rabies virus into the 268 00:17:37,800 --> 00:17:41,919 Speaker 1: jugular veins of sheep and they didn't develop rabies, and 269 00:17:41,920 --> 00:17:44,480 Speaker 1: then when he exposed one of them to saliva from 270 00:17:44,520 --> 00:17:47,639 Speaker 1: a rabbit dog later on, it seemed like it was 271 00:17:47,680 --> 00:17:52,280 Speaker 1: immune to the disease. French chemist and microbiologist Louis Pasteur 272 00:17:52,480 --> 00:17:55,800 Speaker 1: started working on rabies at about this same time, and 273 00:17:55,840 --> 00:18:00,680 Speaker 1: he was inspired by Gaultier success. Pastor already an extensive 274 00:18:00,720 --> 00:18:03,800 Speaker 1: background in this kind of work. In the eighteen fifties, 275 00:18:03,840 --> 00:18:07,280 Speaker 1: he had studied yeast and alcohol fermentation, as well as 276 00:18:07,320 --> 00:18:12,240 Speaker 1: the ability for micro organisms to contaminate fermenting beverages. This 277 00:18:12,359 --> 00:18:15,399 Speaker 1: had contributed to both the germ theory of disease and 278 00:18:15,480 --> 00:18:19,520 Speaker 1: the development of pasteurization. In the eighteen sixties, he had 279 00:18:19,520 --> 00:18:23,639 Speaker 1: identified a micro organism that was devastating the French silk industry, 280 00:18:24,080 --> 00:18:27,199 Speaker 1: and in the eighteen seventies he studied animal diseases like 281 00:18:27,280 --> 00:18:32,600 Speaker 1: anthrax and chicken colera, including developing an anthrax vaccine. While 282 00:18:32,680 --> 00:18:35,880 Speaker 1: Pasteur had lots of experience in this kind of research, 283 00:18:36,000 --> 00:18:39,720 Speaker 1: he had pretty much no experience in medicine or the 284 00:18:39,760 --> 00:18:43,879 Speaker 1: clinical treatment of patients, so he relied on other people 285 00:18:43,960 --> 00:18:48,080 Speaker 1: for this knowledge, including French physician and bacteriologist Emile Roux. 286 00:18:49,080 --> 00:18:52,840 Speaker 1: A whole team of other scientists and doctors were involved 287 00:18:52,840 --> 00:18:57,160 Speaker 1: in this work as well, including Charles Chamberlin, Emile Duclox, 288 00:18:57,680 --> 00:19:02,080 Speaker 1: Louis Dulier, and Joseph grane A. This is definitely not 289 00:19:02,240 --> 00:19:05,960 Speaker 1: a solo effort, and Pasteur was not always excited about 290 00:19:06,000 --> 00:19:09,719 Speaker 1: crediting other people for their involvement in it. There are 291 00:19:09,760 --> 00:19:12,920 Speaker 1: even some historians who have accused him of stealing other 292 00:19:12,960 --> 00:19:17,600 Speaker 1: people's ideas. Much of Pastor's previous work had involved culturing 293 00:19:17,640 --> 00:19:21,440 Speaker 1: bacteria and working from those cultures, and he started out 294 00:19:21,440 --> 00:19:24,480 Speaker 1: trying to do the same thing with rabies. Since rabies 295 00:19:24,560 --> 00:19:27,960 Speaker 1: is caused by a virus rather than a bacterium, Pastor's 296 00:19:27,960 --> 00:19:32,480 Speaker 1: efforts to replicate his earlier process failed. He started working 297 00:19:32,560 --> 00:19:36,080 Speaker 1: directly with the saliva of infected animals and then moved 298 00:19:36,119 --> 00:19:39,520 Speaker 1: on to working with central nervous system matter. He found 299 00:19:39,560 --> 00:19:42,480 Speaker 1: that if he exposed a healthy rabbit to rabies, it 300 00:19:42,640 --> 00:19:46,840 Speaker 1: developed rabies. Then if he used that rabbit's central nervous 301 00:19:46,840 --> 00:19:51,439 Speaker 1: system matter to expose another rabbit, that second rabbit also 302 00:19:51,560 --> 00:19:55,359 Speaker 1: developed rabies, and the second rabbits infection seemed to be 303 00:19:55,400 --> 00:19:58,359 Speaker 1: more virulent than the first. If he did this a 304 00:19:58,480 --> 00:20:03,080 Speaker 1: third time, the third rabbit's infection was also more virulent 305 00:20:03,119 --> 00:20:07,800 Speaker 1: than the seconds had been. He continued this serial passage 306 00:20:07,920 --> 00:20:10,840 Speaker 1: of the virus from rabbits to rabbit until he had 307 00:20:10,880 --> 00:20:14,840 Speaker 1: a strain of it that he described as fixed. It 308 00:20:14,960 --> 00:20:18,240 Speaker 1: was consistent and how virulent it was, and it had 309 00:20:18,280 --> 00:20:21,840 Speaker 1: an incubation period that was set at six or seven days. 310 00:20:22,400 --> 00:20:26,000 Speaker 1: From there, Pastor air dried the spinal cords of rabbits 311 00:20:26,040 --> 00:20:29,840 Speaker 1: that had died of that highly virulent fixed strain. The 312 00:20:29,960 --> 00:20:32,960 Speaker 1: longer they dried, the weaker the virus became. That's a 313 00:20:33,000 --> 00:20:37,399 Speaker 1: process called attenuation. When he exposed other animals to a 314 00:20:37,480 --> 00:20:41,440 Speaker 1: small amount of this attenuated virus, they seemed to develop 315 00:20:41,480 --> 00:20:45,840 Speaker 1: a resistance to rabies rather than becoming ill. From there, 316 00:20:45,960 --> 00:20:48,960 Speaker 1: Pastor started to wonder whether it was possible to make 317 00:20:49,000 --> 00:20:52,399 Speaker 1: an animal more resistant to rabies after it had already 318 00:20:52,440 --> 00:20:57,360 Speaker 1: been bitten. Preventing it from developing the disease. Having successfully 319 00:20:57,400 --> 00:21:00,200 Speaker 1: tested out this idea in dogs, he tried at it 320 00:21:00,280 --> 00:21:03,280 Speaker 1: on two people, but he didn't publish on either of 321 00:21:03,320 --> 00:21:07,000 Speaker 1: these attempts, so they were not known about until much later. 322 00:21:07,760 --> 00:21:09,639 Speaker 1: One of these was a man who had been bitten 323 00:21:09,680 --> 00:21:12,800 Speaker 1: by a dog, and while this man survived, it's also 324 00:21:12,960 --> 00:21:15,720 Speaker 1: likely that he had not actually been exposed to rabies. 325 00:21:16,400 --> 00:21:18,840 Speaker 1: The other was an eleven year old girl who had 326 00:21:18,840 --> 00:21:21,760 Speaker 1: been bitten in the face by a puppy, and she 327 00:21:21,880 --> 00:21:25,840 Speaker 1: had already started developing rabies symptoms. She died the day 328 00:21:25,880 --> 00:21:30,440 Speaker 1: after she was given the treatment. On July four, nine 329 00:21:30,520 --> 00:21:33,800 Speaker 1: year old Joseph Meister was repeatedly bitten by a dog 330 00:21:33,840 --> 00:21:37,399 Speaker 1: in Alsace. The dog was believed to be rabid, and 331 00:21:37,480 --> 00:21:40,439 Speaker 1: two days later the child was brought to Pestor for help. 332 00:21:41,080 --> 00:21:44,399 Speaker 1: Emil Ru had been heavily involved in Pestor's research up 333 00:21:44,400 --> 00:21:46,840 Speaker 1: to this point, and he refused to be involved in 334 00:21:46,880 --> 00:21:51,359 Speaker 1: the boy's treatment because of ethical concerns. Pastor expressed some 335 00:21:51,400 --> 00:21:55,399 Speaker 1: reluctance as well, but Joseph Granche and Alfred Vopien of 336 00:21:55,440 --> 00:21:59,399 Speaker 1: the Academy to Medicine encouraged him to try with granch 337 00:21:59,640 --> 00:22:02,959 Speaker 1: admit us during the treatment. Since Pastor was not a doctor, 338 00:22:03,640 --> 00:22:06,920 Speaker 1: Joseph was given a series of inoculations over the span 339 00:22:07,000 --> 00:22:11,000 Speaker 1: of ten days, starting with a very weak preparation and 340 00:22:11,160 --> 00:22:15,160 Speaker 1: working up through ones that were less and less attenuated. 341 00:22:15,600 --> 00:22:19,000 Speaker 1: Three months later, he had no sign of rabies. Another 342 00:22:19,080 --> 00:22:22,480 Speaker 1: attempt was started with another patient shortly after Joseph Meister 343 00:22:22,640 --> 00:22:25,359 Speaker 1: was declared to be in the clear. That was Jean 344 00:22:25,440 --> 00:22:28,920 Speaker 1: Baptiste Jupel, a fourteen year old shepherd who had been 345 00:22:29,000 --> 00:22:32,680 Speaker 1: mauled while saving a group of younger boys from a dog. 346 00:22:33,400 --> 00:22:36,760 Speaker 1: Pastor reported his results to the French Academy of Science 347 00:22:36,760 --> 00:22:41,720 Speaker 1: on October eighteen eighty five, while Dupeel's treatment was still ongoing. 348 00:22:42,400 --> 00:22:45,280 Speaker 1: Told about his success with Joseph Meister and the fact 349 00:22:45,320 --> 00:22:49,879 Speaker 1: that he had successfully inoculated fifty dogs against rabies before 350 00:22:49,920 --> 00:22:53,160 Speaker 1: trying this process on a human. We're gonna talk more 351 00:22:53,320 --> 00:22:55,880 Speaker 1: about what happened with all of this after we paused 352 00:22:55,880 --> 00:23:07,639 Speaker 1: for a quick sponsor break. As a word of Pastor's 353 00:23:07,640 --> 00:23:12,159 Speaker 1: success that preventing rabies started to spread, people started flocking 354 00:23:12,160 --> 00:23:15,440 Speaker 1: to him for treatment. By the start of eighteen eighties six, 355 00:23:15,480 --> 00:23:18,800 Speaker 1: he had treated at least three hundred and fifty people. 356 00:23:19,280 --> 00:23:23,080 Speaker 1: They came from all over Europe and from the United States. 357 00:23:23,560 --> 00:23:26,840 Speaker 1: In early December of eighteen eighty five, a dog bit 358 00:23:27,000 --> 00:23:31,400 Speaker 1: at least seven other dogs and six children in Newark, 359 00:23:31,520 --> 00:23:34,919 Speaker 1: New Jersey. Word of Pastor's work had made it to 360 00:23:34,920 --> 00:23:38,320 Speaker 1: the US, and a local doctor published an appeal for 361 00:23:38,400 --> 00:23:42,720 Speaker 1: funds to send the boys to Paris for treatment. Four 362 00:23:42,840 --> 00:23:46,159 Speaker 1: of the boys were sent to Paris by steamer. The 363 00:23:46,200 --> 00:23:49,720 Speaker 1: other two were determined to not have sufficient injuries to 364 00:23:49,840 --> 00:23:53,960 Speaker 1: need treatment. American news coverage of these boys tripped to 365 00:23:54,040 --> 00:23:56,760 Speaker 1: Paris and then they returned to the United States turned 366 00:23:56,960 --> 00:24:02,120 Speaker 1: rabies vaccine into just a media station, and three of 367 00:24:02,160 --> 00:24:05,600 Speaker 1: the boys were displayed at the Globe Museum in the 368 00:24:05,640 --> 00:24:08,960 Speaker 1: Bowery in New York after they all got home. Not 369 00:24:09,240 --> 00:24:12,119 Speaker 1: everyone agreed with what Pastor and his team were doing. 370 00:24:13,040 --> 00:24:16,800 Speaker 1: Anti vivisectionists objected to the use of animals in this research. 371 00:24:17,040 --> 00:24:19,560 Speaker 1: And as we've said, not everyone who is bitten by 372 00:24:19,560 --> 00:24:23,560 Speaker 1: a rabid animal contracts rabies, and not every animal who 373 00:24:23,600 --> 00:24:27,239 Speaker 1: bites someone is rabid. Since there was still not a 374 00:24:27,280 --> 00:24:30,960 Speaker 1: test for rabies, determining whether an animal had it usually 375 00:24:31,000 --> 00:24:34,000 Speaker 1: involved just waiting to see if it died. But that 376 00:24:34,160 --> 00:24:36,760 Speaker 1: wasn't really possible if it had already been killed, or 377 00:24:36,800 --> 00:24:39,960 Speaker 1: if it just couldn't be found. You could also expose 378 00:24:40,040 --> 00:24:42,679 Speaker 1: a healthy animal to the brain or saliva of an 379 00:24:42,680 --> 00:24:45,320 Speaker 1: animal who had bitten someone, but by the time the 380 00:24:45,359 --> 00:24:48,280 Speaker 1: healthy animal showed any symptoms, it was just likely to 381 00:24:48,280 --> 00:24:51,840 Speaker 1: be too late for the human patient. So critics made 382 00:24:51,840 --> 00:24:56,080 Speaker 1: the point that Pasteur was potentially exposing people to rabies 383 00:24:56,200 --> 00:25:01,720 Speaker 1: for no reason, and his inoculation caused somebody who had 384 00:25:01,760 --> 00:25:05,600 Speaker 1: been bitten by a non rabid dog to then develop 385 00:25:05,760 --> 00:25:09,679 Speaker 1: rabies because of their treatment. Critics also noted that some 386 00:25:09,760 --> 00:25:14,560 Speaker 1: of pasteurs patients did die. By November of eighteen eighty six, 387 00:25:14,800 --> 00:25:18,800 Speaker 1: seventeen hundred patients had received rabies injections, and ten of 388 00:25:18,840 --> 00:25:23,720 Speaker 1: them had died. The uncertainty combined with the deaths to 389 00:25:23,840 --> 00:25:26,920 Speaker 1: spark a huge amount of debate within the medical community 390 00:25:26,960 --> 00:25:30,879 Speaker 1: about whether what Pasteur was doing was ethical or even 391 00:25:31,040 --> 00:25:34,919 Speaker 1: medically necessary. The Academy Demnsen held a meeting on the 392 00:25:34,960 --> 00:25:39,960 Speaker 1: subject on January eleventh, eighteen eighty seven. Although Pastor's critics 393 00:25:39,960 --> 00:25:44,800 Speaker 1: were vocal, his supporters, led by Dr Joseph Granche, successfully 394 00:25:44,840 --> 00:25:49,800 Speaker 1: defended his work. The Institute Pasteur was established on June fourth, 395 00:25:49,800 --> 00:25:53,040 Speaker 1: eighteen eighty seven, and it opened on November fourteenth of 396 00:25:53,119 --> 00:25:57,080 Speaker 1: that year. It focused on disease research and on providing 397 00:25:57,200 --> 00:26:02,360 Speaker 1: rabies vaccine. By eight more than twenty thousand people had 398 00:26:02,359 --> 00:26:06,359 Speaker 1: been treated at the Pastier Institute after a possible rabies exposure, 399 00:26:06,400 --> 00:26:09,680 Speaker 1: and only nine six of them had died, or less 400 00:26:09,680 --> 00:26:13,280 Speaker 1: than half of a percent of patients. To be clear, 401 00:26:13,359 --> 00:26:17,040 Speaker 1: there was a lot about this early version of the 402 00:26:17,160 --> 00:26:21,080 Speaker 1: vaccine that was inherently unsafe. It was basically made from 403 00:26:21,119 --> 00:26:24,720 Speaker 1: animal brain or spinal corn tissue. There could for sure 404 00:26:24,840 --> 00:26:29,160 Speaker 1: be complications, but this was still a dramatic improvement over 405 00:26:29,800 --> 00:26:35,679 Speaker 1: an untreatable fatal disease. Discoveries about the rabies virus continued 406 00:26:35,760 --> 00:26:40,439 Speaker 1: after this point. In three, Italian pathologist al Deci Negri 407 00:26:40,640 --> 00:26:44,160 Speaker 1: discovered round and oval regions in the brains of animals 408 00:26:44,160 --> 00:26:48,240 Speaker 1: that had died of rabies, which he called negribodies. At 409 00:26:48,240 --> 00:26:50,680 Speaker 1: the time he thought they were some kind of parasite, 410 00:26:50,760 --> 00:26:53,959 Speaker 1: but they actually arise as part of the reproductive cycle 411 00:26:54,000 --> 00:26:57,280 Speaker 1: of the virus. This paved the way for the first 412 00:26:57,440 --> 00:27:01,720 Speaker 1: rabies tests. While there are new methods for detecting rabies 413 00:27:01,720 --> 00:27:05,960 Speaker 1: in brain matter, Today, negribodies are still sometimes used when 414 00:27:06,000 --> 00:27:10,320 Speaker 1: those methods are not available. The most reliable tests do 415 00:27:10,520 --> 00:27:13,960 Speaker 1: still involve examining an animal's brain, which is why living 416 00:27:14,000 --> 00:27:17,520 Speaker 1: animals have to be euthanized to be tested for rabies. 417 00:27:18,160 --> 00:27:22,200 Speaker 1: Refinements in the vaccine were also in the works. Pastor's 418 00:27:22,320 --> 00:27:26,960 Speaker 1: methods didn't always produce a consistently potent vaccine, and if 419 00:27:27,000 --> 00:27:30,960 Speaker 1: it was too potent, it could cause somebody to contract rabies. 420 00:27:31,520 --> 00:27:35,399 Speaker 1: In the early twentieth century, researchers started using phenol to 421 00:27:35,560 --> 00:27:39,280 Speaker 1: kill the virus rather than attenuating it through air drying. 422 00:27:40,160 --> 00:27:43,960 Speaker 1: Viruses were cultured in tissues in NY six, which led 423 00:27:44,040 --> 00:27:49,439 Speaker 1: to tissue cultured vaccines rather than using brain matter to 424 00:27:49,520 --> 00:27:53,240 Speaker 1: make them. Today's rabies vaccines are mostly cultured in human 425 00:27:53,280 --> 00:27:58,040 Speaker 1: cells or in chick embryos or some other cellular matter. 426 00:27:58,600 --> 00:28:01,960 Speaker 1: Although some of Pastor's colleagues speculated about whether it would 427 00:28:02,000 --> 00:28:05,520 Speaker 1: be possible to mass vaccinate dogs or other animals and 428 00:28:05,680 --> 00:28:09,399 Speaker 1: lower the spread of rabies to people, serious efforts to 429 00:28:09,480 --> 00:28:13,240 Speaker 1: do that didn't start until decades later, but efforts like 430 00:28:13,359 --> 00:28:16,600 Speaker 1: that have led to the successful eradication of rabies in 431 00:28:16,680 --> 00:28:20,400 Speaker 1: some parts of the world. There are too many rabies 432 00:28:20,440 --> 00:28:23,120 Speaker 1: free countries today for us to try to name them all, 433 00:28:23,119 --> 00:28:26,960 Speaker 1: but they include many islands, including many Caribbean islands, the 434 00:28:27,040 --> 00:28:33,280 Speaker 1: Canary Islands, the Falkland Islands, the Galapagos Islands, the UK, Iceland, Japan, 435 00:28:33,520 --> 00:28:37,639 Speaker 1: and New Zealand. Several nations in continental Europe are also 436 00:28:37,720 --> 00:28:42,200 Speaker 1: considered rabies free, including much of Western Europe. We should note, though, 437 00:28:42,240 --> 00:28:48,000 Speaker 1: that rabies free often means rabies free and terrestrial animals. 438 00:28:48,560 --> 00:28:51,560 Speaker 1: There can still be rabies or other lists of viruses 439 00:28:51,800 --> 00:28:55,360 Speaker 1: in bats, specifically, so even if you are somewhere that 440 00:28:55,520 --> 00:29:00,800 Speaker 1: is considered rabies free, being bitten by a bat still 441 00:29:00,880 --> 00:29:05,160 Speaker 1: warrants medical attention. Just in general, don't touch baths with 442 00:29:05,200 --> 00:29:07,840 Speaker 1: your bare hands. You don't need to be afraid of bats. 443 00:29:08,160 --> 00:29:10,400 Speaker 1: They're generally pretty shy and they're not gonna mess with 444 00:29:10,440 --> 00:29:12,040 Speaker 1: you if you don't mess with that. But like, don't 445 00:29:12,080 --> 00:29:14,520 Speaker 1: go grab one with your hands, which is so hard 446 00:29:14,520 --> 00:29:18,240 Speaker 1: because they're so cute, not for me because I see one. 447 00:29:18,320 --> 00:29:20,120 Speaker 1: Like if I see a bat somewhere that I don't 448 00:29:20,120 --> 00:29:21,920 Speaker 1: expect to see a bat, I'm like that bat is 449 00:29:21,960 --> 00:29:26,640 Speaker 1: definitely a problem. I'm not going anywhere near it. I 450 00:29:26,680 --> 00:29:28,880 Speaker 1: will tell a bat story and are behind the scenes. 451 00:29:30,080 --> 00:29:32,400 Speaker 1: As we said at the top of the show, rabies 452 00:29:32,480 --> 00:29:34,960 Speaker 1: is still endemic in some parts of the world, including 453 00:29:35,000 --> 00:29:39,760 Speaker 1: parts of Asia and Africa. About of human rabies deaths 454 00:29:39,800 --> 00:29:42,719 Speaker 1: occur each year in India, with the vast majority of 455 00:29:42,720 --> 00:29:47,400 Speaker 1: those exposures coming from dogs, and some serious outbreaks among 456 00:29:47,440 --> 00:29:51,240 Speaker 1: wild animals started long after the raby's vaccine was developed. 457 00:29:51,760 --> 00:29:55,520 Speaker 1: For example, rabies was identified in North American raccoons in 458 00:29:55,640 --> 00:29:58,880 Speaker 1: nineteen thirty six, and there is an ongoing epidemic of 459 00:29:58,960 --> 00:30:03,360 Speaker 1: rabies among rec coons all along the East Coast. There 460 00:30:03,400 --> 00:30:06,240 Speaker 1: are efforts to get these and other outbreaks in wild 461 00:30:06,280 --> 00:30:10,880 Speaker 1: animals under control, using things like oral rabies vaccine baits. Yeah, 462 00:30:10,880 --> 00:30:14,560 Speaker 1: they're also mass vaccination campaigns. A lot of work on this. 463 00:30:14,840 --> 00:30:17,200 Speaker 1: A lot of the deaths that occur around the world 464 00:30:17,200 --> 00:30:19,960 Speaker 1: happen in children who just wanted to pet a dog 465 00:30:20,080 --> 00:30:24,280 Speaker 1: and got bitten, so it is very sad. It's also 466 00:30:24,400 --> 00:30:29,080 Speaker 1: possible for one animal to spark a huge exposure scenario 467 00:30:29,280 --> 00:30:34,080 Speaker 1: even in places where rabies is relatively well controlled. For example, 468 00:30:34,160 --> 00:30:38,240 Speaker 1: on October a family bought a kitten from a pet 469 00:30:38,280 --> 00:30:40,880 Speaker 1: store in New Hampshire and then about three weeks later, 470 00:30:40,920 --> 00:30:45,040 Speaker 1: this kitten developed seizures and died. After its death, it 471 00:30:45,120 --> 00:30:48,760 Speaker 1: was determined to have had rabies. This kitten had been 472 00:30:48,760 --> 00:30:52,080 Speaker 1: examined by a veterinarian and had a certificate of health 473 00:30:52,160 --> 00:30:55,640 Speaker 1: before it was sold, but the pet store didn't have 474 00:30:55,880 --> 00:31:00,760 Speaker 1: clear records of when animals had arrived there or been sold, 475 00:31:01,520 --> 00:31:05,560 Speaker 1: so in the end, six hundred sixty five people received 476 00:31:05,600 --> 00:31:10,160 Speaker 1: post exposure prophylaxis or PEP for rabies. These were people 477 00:31:10,400 --> 00:31:13,920 Speaker 1: who had come into contact with that kitten, or who 478 00:31:13,960 --> 00:31:17,080 Speaker 1: had bought other animals that had probably had contact with 479 00:31:17,120 --> 00:31:20,520 Speaker 1: the kitten at the store, or people who had contact 480 00:31:20,560 --> 00:31:24,480 Speaker 1: with those animals, people who worked at the store, people 481 00:31:24,480 --> 00:31:28,239 Speaker 1: who visited the store and handled the animals. Really just 482 00:31:28,360 --> 00:31:31,440 Speaker 1: on and on. The probable initial source for this whole 483 00:31:31,920 --> 00:31:35,040 Speaker 1: thing was a raccoon that may have come into contact 484 00:31:35,080 --> 00:31:38,360 Speaker 1: with three feral kittens that were then captured and sold 485 00:31:38,400 --> 00:31:41,120 Speaker 1: at the store. As a side note, you may have 486 00:31:41,160 --> 00:31:44,920 Speaker 1: heard that Raby's prophylaxis is a horrifying series of incredibly 487 00:31:44,920 --> 00:31:48,680 Speaker 1: painful shots directly into the stomach with a gigantic and 488 00:31:48,840 --> 00:31:54,000 Speaker 1: terrifying needle. It is not Older versions of Raby's PEP 489 00:31:54,120 --> 00:31:57,000 Speaker 1: did involve a long series of fourteen to twenty one 490 00:31:57,120 --> 00:32:00,960 Speaker 1: shots usually given in the abdomen. But that's just because 491 00:32:01,000 --> 00:32:03,920 Speaker 1: the abdomen offered a lot more surface area to work with, 492 00:32:04,120 --> 00:32:07,000 Speaker 1: not because the injections went into the stomach through a 493 00:32:07,080 --> 00:32:10,160 Speaker 1: huge needle. Still, I mean to be clear, that is 494 00:32:10,160 --> 00:32:12,440 Speaker 1: a lot of shots into a tender area, and the 495 00:32:12,520 --> 00:32:15,080 Speaker 1: vaccine that was in use at the time could have 496 00:32:15,160 --> 00:32:18,840 Speaker 1: a range of unpleasant side effects. Yeah, I would not 497 00:32:18,920 --> 00:32:22,200 Speaker 1: want to get fourteen to twenty one shots all around 498 00:32:22,240 --> 00:32:27,560 Speaker 1: my abdominat it. It was not a gigantically long needle 499 00:32:27,640 --> 00:32:31,800 Speaker 1: going into people's actual stomachs. It's also not what is 500 00:32:31,840 --> 00:32:36,080 Speaker 1: in use today. The current recommendation is that a person 501 00:32:36,160 --> 00:32:40,360 Speaker 1: gets one dose of human rabies immune globulin and one 502 00:32:40,440 --> 00:32:44,200 Speaker 1: dose of rabies vaccine shortly after the bite. The immune 503 00:32:44,200 --> 00:32:48,320 Speaker 1: globulin is typically injected near the bite location, and then 504 00:32:48,360 --> 00:32:51,440 Speaker 1: the vaccine typically goes into the deltoid region of the arm, 505 00:32:51,600 --> 00:32:55,320 Speaker 1: where lots of other vaccines go. Then the person gets 506 00:32:55,400 --> 00:32:58,720 Speaker 1: three more doses of vaccine that are spread out in 507 00:32:58,760 --> 00:33:02,520 Speaker 1: the days that follow, again as injections into the shoulder area. 508 00:33:03,080 --> 00:33:06,160 Speaker 1: Also using a vaccine that is like cultured and tissues 509 00:33:06,200 --> 00:33:09,440 Speaker 1: and a lot safer than what was being used in 510 00:33:09,480 --> 00:33:12,320 Speaker 1: the past. This process can be a little bit different 511 00:33:12,360 --> 00:33:15,440 Speaker 1: for children or if a person is um you know, compromised, 512 00:33:15,560 --> 00:33:19,320 Speaker 1: or if a person has been previously vaccinated for rabies. 513 00:33:19,920 --> 00:33:22,880 Speaker 1: That's something that's typically only done based on a person's 514 00:33:23,000 --> 00:33:26,920 Speaker 1: risk for being exposed to rabies. As another side note, 515 00:33:27,040 --> 00:33:29,920 Speaker 1: we have been really really focused on bites here because 516 00:33:29,960 --> 00:33:33,920 Speaker 1: the overwhelming majority of rabies exposures come from bites or 517 00:33:33,960 --> 00:33:38,280 Speaker 1: possibly scratches. There are some other ways to contract the disease, 518 00:33:38,320 --> 00:33:42,240 Speaker 1: but they're extraordinarily rare, like through the eyes or mucous membranes. 519 00:33:42,280 --> 00:33:46,240 Speaker 1: If someone is exposed to aerosolized rabies virus in some way, 520 00:33:46,960 --> 00:33:51,320 Speaker 1: or because rabies can closely resemble various types of encephalitis, 521 00:33:51,400 --> 00:33:54,640 Speaker 1: it is sometimes missed as a diagnosis when doctors don't 522 00:33:54,640 --> 00:33:58,000 Speaker 1: know that the person was bitten by an animal. This 523 00:33:58,080 --> 00:34:01,040 Speaker 1: has led to an extremely small a number of rabies 524 00:34:01,080 --> 00:34:05,400 Speaker 1: transmissions through organ transplants, although the risk of this is 525 00:34:05,520 --> 00:34:09,400 Speaker 1: extremely remote. After their first report of it happening, many 526 00:34:09,560 --> 00:34:13,560 Speaker 1: organ procurement organizations started including screening questions to try to 527 00:34:13,640 --> 00:34:17,719 Speaker 1: rule out this possibility. Circling back around to rabies and 528 00:34:17,760 --> 00:34:19,960 Speaker 1: pop culture, This was actually a plot line on the 529 00:34:19,960 --> 00:34:25,120 Speaker 1: TV show Scrubs. Its sounds truly horrifying, but also like 530 00:34:25,719 --> 00:34:29,040 Speaker 1: the disease process that rabies causes, like in the umbrella 531 00:34:29,080 --> 00:34:31,440 Speaker 1: of encephalitis, And if a doctor doesn't know that a 532 00:34:31,480 --> 00:34:33,920 Speaker 1: person was bitten by an animal or picked up a 533 00:34:33,920 --> 00:34:37,839 Speaker 1: bat or whatever, like it's most doctors have never seen 534 00:34:37,920 --> 00:34:40,200 Speaker 1: a case of rabies in their career, and it's not 535 00:34:40,239 --> 00:34:43,799 Speaker 1: the thing that first comes to mind. In two thousand four, 536 00:34:44,160 --> 00:34:47,560 Speaker 1: fifteen year old Gina Geezy and her medical team made 537 00:34:47,640 --> 00:34:51,120 Speaker 1: headlines after she became the first person known to survive 538 00:34:51,200 --> 00:34:55,040 Speaker 1: rabies after starting to develop symptoms. She had picked up 539 00:34:55,080 --> 00:34:58,200 Speaker 1: and been bitten by a bat, and although her wound 540 00:34:58,360 --> 00:35:01,200 Speaker 1: was cleaned with hydrogen per beside, she wasn't taken in 541 00:35:01,239 --> 00:35:05,239 Speaker 1: for further treatment. She started developing symptoms about a month later, 542 00:35:05,360 --> 00:35:08,480 Speaker 1: and then about six days into her illness reported having 543 00:35:08,520 --> 00:35:11,920 Speaker 1: been bitten by the bat. Doctors placed ge Zy in 544 00:35:11,960 --> 00:35:15,200 Speaker 1: a medically induced coma and gave her anti viral drugs 545 00:35:15,280 --> 00:35:19,759 Speaker 1: and other treatments. These treatments continued until tess suggested that 546 00:35:19,800 --> 00:35:22,319 Speaker 1: her body was fighting off the virus, and at that 547 00:35:22,360 --> 00:35:25,480 Speaker 1: point she was brought out of the coma. She survived 548 00:35:25,480 --> 00:35:28,560 Speaker 1: this experience, and news outlets have continued to report on 549 00:35:28,600 --> 00:35:32,279 Speaker 1: her life into the year one. At the time, this 550 00:35:32,360 --> 00:35:35,120 Speaker 1: seemed like a hopeful sign that what came to be 551 00:35:35,200 --> 00:35:38,600 Speaker 1: known as the Milwaukee Protocol would make it possible to 552 00:35:38,680 --> 00:35:42,440 Speaker 1: cure people after they started showing symptoms of rabies, but 553 00:35:42,600 --> 00:35:47,839 Speaker 1: efforts to replicate that success have been largely unsuccessful. One 554 00:35:47,880 --> 00:35:51,080 Speaker 1: paper in the Journal of the Brazilian Society of Tropical 555 00:35:51,120 --> 00:35:55,440 Speaker 1: Medicine traced thirty eight published uses of the Milwaukee Protocol, 556 00:35:55,560 --> 00:35:59,680 Speaker 1: including one use of a similar protocol called the Recipe 557 00:35:59,719 --> 00:36:03,839 Speaker 1: proto Call. Only eleven of those patients survived, with all 558 00:36:03,880 --> 00:36:08,400 Speaker 1: but five of them having moderate to severe complications afterward. 559 00:36:09,040 --> 00:36:12,000 Speaker 1: This is certainly an improvement over a disease with an 560 00:36:12,080 --> 00:36:17,439 Speaker 1: essentially fatality rate, but these numbers may be deceptively optimistic. 561 00:36:17,920 --> 00:36:20,799 Speaker 1: Three of the people who were described as having survived 562 00:36:21,080 --> 00:36:23,640 Speaker 1: did make it through the most critical part of the illness, 563 00:36:23,719 --> 00:36:26,800 Speaker 1: but they still died. At least one of the patients 564 00:36:26,960 --> 00:36:30,120 Speaker 1: may not have actually had rabies, and there's been no 565 00:36:30,239 --> 00:36:33,880 Speaker 1: coordinated method for tracking when this protocol has or hasn't 566 00:36:33,880 --> 00:36:37,400 Speaker 1: been attempted. It's likely that anyone who tried it and 567 00:36:37,480 --> 00:36:41,279 Speaker 1: succeeded would publish their results. But it's also possible that 568 00:36:41,320 --> 00:36:44,600 Speaker 1: people who tried it and failed have not yet. There 569 00:36:44,600 --> 00:36:49,160 Speaker 1: are some papers like Opinion Commentary written by teams of 570 00:36:49,200 --> 00:36:51,440 Speaker 1: doctors that are like this does not work and we 571 00:36:51,520 --> 00:36:54,680 Speaker 1: need to stop focusing our effort on it, and others 572 00:36:54,719 --> 00:36:57,239 Speaker 1: that are a little bit more like this may need 573 00:36:57,440 --> 00:37:02,560 Speaker 1: some other refining before it could work. Aside from all that, though, 574 00:37:03,200 --> 00:37:06,359 Speaker 1: all the patients described in these publications spent at least 575 00:37:06,360 --> 00:37:10,040 Speaker 1: a month in the hospital with extensive care throughout their stay, 576 00:37:10,239 --> 00:37:14,560 Speaker 1: so it's extremely unlikely that this protocol could really be 577 00:37:14,640 --> 00:37:17,480 Speaker 1: put into use in the places where human deaths from 578 00:37:17,560 --> 00:37:20,839 Speaker 1: rabies are the most prevalent. These places tend to be 579 00:37:20,960 --> 00:37:24,320 Speaker 1: rural and poor without a lot of health care infrastructure. 580 00:37:24,960 --> 00:37:29,080 Speaker 1: Places where people don't have access to Raby's profile axis 581 00:37:29,120 --> 00:37:32,120 Speaker 1: are likely to also be places where people don't have 582 00:37:32,280 --> 00:37:37,120 Speaker 1: access to a hospital that could support this kind of treatment. Also, 583 00:37:37,160 --> 00:37:40,880 Speaker 1: it's extremely clear at this point that coordinated programs of 584 00:37:41,000 --> 00:37:46,520 Speaker 1: public education and dog vaccinations and sometimes vaccinations in particular 585 00:37:46,600 --> 00:37:51,960 Speaker 1: wild animals, can lower the number of human Raby's deaths enormously, 586 00:37:52,880 --> 00:37:55,960 Speaker 1: and places that don't have the resources to support those 587 00:37:56,040 --> 00:37:59,719 Speaker 1: kinds of programs and initiatives are really likely not to 588 00:37:59,800 --> 00:38:03,560 Speaker 1: have the resources to support hundreds or thousands of people 589 00:38:04,080 --> 00:38:08,839 Speaker 1: with long term hospital stays and medically induced comas. It's like, 590 00:38:09,040 --> 00:38:12,200 Speaker 1: even if this worked, it would really be working for 591 00:38:12,239 --> 00:38:15,680 Speaker 1: the wealthiest countries in the world and not the places 592 00:38:15,760 --> 00:38:20,000 Speaker 1: where treatment is most needed. So all of that said, 593 00:38:20,360 --> 00:38:23,840 Speaker 1: the global cost of rabies is roughly eight point six 594 00:38:23,880 --> 00:38:27,640 Speaker 1: billion dollars per year, and more than fifteen million people 595 00:38:27,680 --> 00:38:31,839 Speaker 1: per year received rabies PEP. This protocol can be really expensive. 596 00:38:31,920 --> 00:38:34,600 Speaker 1: In the United States, it can cost between twelve hundred 597 00:38:34,680 --> 00:38:38,640 Speaker 1: and sixty hundred dollars. Yeah, that's like one estimate that 598 00:38:38,680 --> 00:38:40,640 Speaker 1: I can saw that I saw. I saw something that 599 00:38:40,680 --> 00:38:44,200 Speaker 1: were even higher than that. September twenty eight every year 600 00:38:44,280 --> 00:38:47,319 Speaker 1: is World Raby's Day. That's also the anniversary of the 601 00:38:47,360 --> 00:38:53,800 Speaker 1: death of Louis Pasteur. Well, that's a basic history of rabies. Rabies. 602 00:38:54,440 --> 00:38:58,200 Speaker 1: My my hope is that in the future will at 603 00:38:58,320 --> 00:39:01,480 Speaker 1: least get to the point where the places in the 604 00:39:01,520 --> 00:39:07,799 Speaker 1: world that have lots of free roaming dogs also have 605 00:39:08,239 --> 00:39:13,520 Speaker 1: those dogs vaccinated, because that's really where like so much 606 00:39:13,600 --> 00:39:17,040 Speaker 1: feeding back into the greater environment and so much feeding 607 00:39:17,080 --> 00:39:21,000 Speaker 1: into humans cases of rabies, Like it's all interconnected with 608 00:39:21,080 --> 00:39:24,080 Speaker 1: the dogs. Yeah. I think we mentioned it at the 609 00:39:24,120 --> 00:39:27,640 Speaker 1: top of our episode on the history of veterinary medicine 610 00:39:27,640 --> 00:39:31,279 Speaker 1: that one of the vets at my practice participates in 611 00:39:31,280 --> 00:39:34,040 Speaker 1: a program where she goes to countries where the dog 612 00:39:34,080 --> 00:39:37,560 Speaker 1: population is not well vaccinated and tries to just do 613 00:39:37,760 --> 00:39:41,240 Speaker 1: as many vaccinations as they can in a short period 614 00:39:41,239 --> 00:39:44,279 Speaker 1: of time. Yeah, they had gone some mallowe I think. 615 00:39:44,400 --> 00:39:48,879 Speaker 1: And Malawi's target is like se of the dog population vaccinated, 616 00:39:49,520 --> 00:39:51,560 Speaker 1: which would do a lot to reduce the number of 617 00:39:51,640 --> 00:39:54,000 Speaker 1: human deaths, but still would like there would still be 618 00:39:54,040 --> 00:39:58,920 Speaker 1: a reservoir of circulating rabies among dog populations. There are 619 00:39:58,960 --> 00:40:00,600 Speaker 1: a lot of sad parts to that, but one of 620 00:40:00,600 --> 00:40:02,719 Speaker 1: the saddest parts is like a lot of the a 621 00:40:02,719 --> 00:40:04,400 Speaker 1: lot of the people who die of rabies are like 622 00:40:04,480 --> 00:40:10,720 Speaker 1: just a kid that wanted to pet a dog. So anyway, uh, 623 00:40:10,960 --> 00:40:16,640 Speaker 1: I haven't a listener mail it's about animals, um, it's 624 00:40:16,680 --> 00:40:20,279 Speaker 1: not about rabies. It's from Kaylee, And it followed our 625 00:40:20,640 --> 00:40:25,000 Speaker 1: episodes on Shackleton. Kaylee rode in and said, Hi, Holly 626 00:40:25,120 --> 00:40:28,279 Speaker 1: and Tracy, I'm a huge fan of yours. I've been 627 00:40:28,280 --> 00:40:30,760 Speaker 1: listening to your podcast for years. I finally have something 628 00:40:30,800 --> 00:40:32,759 Speaker 1: to write to you about. I just listened to the 629 00:40:32,880 --> 00:40:35,719 Speaker 1: Endurance episodes. I can't wait for your behind the scenes 630 00:40:35,760 --> 00:40:39,600 Speaker 1: episodes about it. I'm a children's librarian in Maine, and 631 00:40:39,680 --> 00:40:41,880 Speaker 1: it's my job to try to read as many books 632 00:40:41,880 --> 00:40:45,719 Speaker 1: in our children's collection in order to give recommendations. Well, 633 00:40:45,719 --> 00:40:49,720 Speaker 1: a twenty nineteen book called Fearless Felines thirty True Tales 634 00:40:49,760 --> 00:40:53,080 Speaker 1: of Courageous Cats came across my desk a few months back, 635 00:40:53,120 --> 00:40:55,440 Speaker 1: and as an avid cat lover, I opened up the 636 00:40:55,480 --> 00:40:59,720 Speaker 1: book and immediately started reading. The first story I happened 637 00:40:59,760 --> 00:41:03,480 Speaker 1: to see was about Mrs Chippy, the explorer cat aboard 638 00:41:03,480 --> 00:41:07,000 Speaker 1: the Endurance. According to this children's book and other research, 639 00:41:07,040 --> 00:41:09,680 Speaker 1: I found, Mrs Chippy would climb in the rigging and 640 00:41:09,760 --> 00:41:13,480 Speaker 1: walker along the narrow ship rails, even in bad weather. 641 00:41:13,960 --> 00:41:16,560 Speaker 1: There was one episode where Mrs Chippy jumped through the 642 00:41:16,600 --> 00:41:19,880 Speaker 1: porthole and the crew had to rescue him after he 643 00:41:19,960 --> 00:41:22,680 Speaker 1: spent ten minutes in the water. When I read the 644 00:41:22,680 --> 00:41:25,239 Speaker 1: part about the ship getting stuck in shackleton, making tough 645 00:41:25,280 --> 00:41:28,480 Speaker 1: decisions and this meant no more Mrs Chippy, I absolutely 646 00:41:28,520 --> 00:41:30,799 Speaker 1: lost it and hit in the library basement, bawling my 647 00:41:30,840 --> 00:41:33,840 Speaker 1: eyes out. As a highly sensitive person, sometimes I wonder 648 00:41:34,160 --> 00:41:36,480 Speaker 1: if I can make it as a children's librarian from 649 00:41:36,520 --> 00:41:39,760 Speaker 1: all the books I've read that have caused tears. Fast 650 00:41:39,840 --> 00:41:42,239 Speaker 1: forward to more recent weeks than I was driving to 651 00:41:42,280 --> 00:41:44,600 Speaker 1: work and listening to NPR and the story of the 652 00:41:44,719 --> 00:41:48,560 Speaker 1: Endurance wreckage being discovered came on. A descendant of Shackleton 653 00:41:48,719 --> 00:41:51,520 Speaker 1: was talking about how their great grandfather was a hero 654 00:41:51,680 --> 00:41:54,080 Speaker 1: and brave and all I could do was hell but 655 00:41:54,200 --> 00:41:57,880 Speaker 1: he killed Mrs Chippy at the radio, listening to your 656 00:41:57,920 --> 00:42:01,200 Speaker 1: episodes about Shackleton and the Endurance gave me another perspective. 657 00:42:01,239 --> 00:42:04,080 Speaker 1: Though Shackleton clearly cared about his crew, from their health 658 00:42:04,120 --> 00:42:07,000 Speaker 1: to the morale. Their situation was dire, and I'm glad 659 00:42:07,120 --> 00:42:10,520 Speaker 1: Mrs Chippy, along with the puppies and dogs, didn't starve 660 00:42:10,600 --> 00:42:13,600 Speaker 1: to death. You probably found this in your research. But 661 00:42:13,840 --> 00:42:16,480 Speaker 1: mc nish, the carpenter on the Endurance, held a grudge 662 00:42:16,520 --> 00:42:20,479 Speaker 1: against Shackleton after the whole Mrs Shippy Ordeal McNish died 663 00:42:20,520 --> 00:42:24,080 Speaker 1: penniless and was buried in an unmarked grave. In nineteen thirty. 664 00:42:24,120 --> 00:42:27,360 Speaker 1: The New Zealand Antarctic Society gave him a headstone in 665 00:42:27,440 --> 00:42:29,880 Speaker 1: nineteen fifty nine, and then in two thousand four, a 666 00:42:30,000 --> 00:42:33,920 Speaker 1: life size bronze statue of Mrs Chippy was built on 667 00:42:33,960 --> 00:42:37,200 Speaker 1: his grave. Visiting his grave and the Mrs Chippy memorial 668 00:42:37,320 --> 00:42:39,120 Speaker 1: is now on my bucket list and if I make it, 669 00:42:39,160 --> 00:42:41,280 Speaker 1: I'll be sure to send a picture. But in the meantime, 670 00:42:41,320 --> 00:42:44,400 Speaker 1: here's a picture of my cat family I rescued last summer. 671 00:42:44,880 --> 00:42:49,239 Speaker 1: Past regards from a librarian considering joining Peter Cayley, thank 672 00:42:49,280 --> 00:42:52,040 Speaker 1: you so much for this email. You are not the 673 00:42:52,080 --> 00:42:57,840 Speaker 1: only person who commented in some way about being angry 674 00:42:57,840 --> 00:43:00,880 Speaker 1: at Shackleton about Mrs Chippy. Like when we put the 675 00:43:00,920 --> 00:43:04,640 Speaker 1: episode on our on our social media, there were various 676 00:43:04,680 --> 00:43:07,839 Speaker 1: comments that said things like he killed Mrs Chippy, he's 677 00:43:07,880 --> 00:43:13,279 Speaker 1: a monster of and it uh, it reminded me a 678 00:43:13,320 --> 00:43:16,239 Speaker 1: little bit um. Some years ago, we were having a 679 00:43:16,280 --> 00:43:20,560 Speaker 1: conversation about potential future episode topics and suggestions on our 680 00:43:20,560 --> 00:43:23,120 Speaker 1: Facebook page or somewhere, and there were a lot of 681 00:43:23,160 --> 00:43:26,839 Speaker 1: people who were asking for LM. Montgomery, who wrote Ann 682 00:43:26,880 --> 00:43:28,840 Speaker 1: of Green Gables, who was definitely on my to do 683 00:43:28,960 --> 00:43:32,920 Speaker 1: list for an episode. And there was one particular person 684 00:43:32,960 --> 00:43:36,759 Speaker 1: who had been apparently traumatized by a scene in one 685 00:43:36,760 --> 00:43:40,680 Speaker 1: of the later books that involves a cat being killed, 686 00:43:41,960 --> 00:43:45,560 Speaker 1: and then was like commenting in reply to every single 687 00:43:45,640 --> 00:43:49,279 Speaker 1: person who suggested that topic with like how horrible the 688 00:43:49,400 --> 00:43:52,839 Speaker 1: cat death was, And I was like you, clearly, this 689 00:43:52,880 --> 00:43:56,120 Speaker 1: is something that really upset you as a child. But 690 00:43:56,280 --> 00:44:00,239 Speaker 1: attitudes about animals were very different at the time, and 691 00:44:00,560 --> 00:44:03,400 Speaker 1: like what people thought of as the humane way to 692 00:44:03,480 --> 00:44:07,560 Speaker 1: treat animals not the same as we think of now 693 00:44:07,920 --> 00:44:11,400 Speaker 1: when we think of pets as family members. A very 694 00:44:11,480 --> 00:44:15,040 Speaker 1: different situation, and I understand how upsetting it can be. 695 00:44:16,239 --> 00:44:20,759 Speaker 1: But like Kaylee, I'm glad that the animals who were 696 00:44:20,840 --> 00:44:24,319 Speaker 1: with Shackleton, although we could have a whole argument about 697 00:44:24,360 --> 00:44:26,240 Speaker 1: whether they should have been there in the first place, 698 00:44:27,120 --> 00:44:30,360 Speaker 1: glad that they did not face some of the dire 699 00:44:30,520 --> 00:44:36,320 Speaker 1: situations of of hunger and cold and all of that 700 00:44:36,320 --> 00:44:41,399 Speaker 1: that the that the men faced. Um, so thank you 701 00:44:41,600 --> 00:44:45,600 Speaker 1: for this email and the picture. And the story is 702 00:44:45,600 --> 00:44:48,879 Speaker 1: about Mrs Chippy. I didn't put a lot about Mrs 703 00:44:48,960 --> 00:44:51,560 Speaker 1: Chippy in the episode itself because I didn't want to 704 00:44:51,600 --> 00:44:54,400 Speaker 1: make the end of Mrs Chippy even sadder than it 705 00:44:54,520 --> 00:44:57,640 Speaker 1: already was. Like part of me didn't even want to 706 00:44:57,640 --> 00:45:00,200 Speaker 1: put the name Mrs Chippy in there, but some how 707 00:45:00,280 --> 00:45:03,400 Speaker 1: that made it harder. Um, so thank you for giving 708 00:45:03,440 --> 00:45:07,640 Speaker 1: me the chance to share some Mrs Chippy stories. You 709 00:45:07,640 --> 00:45:09,680 Speaker 1: would like to write to us about this or any 710 00:45:09,680 --> 00:45:13,640 Speaker 1: other podcasts for a history podcast at iHeart radio dot com. 711 00:45:13,760 --> 00:45:15,800 Speaker 1: And we're all over social media at MS in history 712 00:45:15,800 --> 00:45:18,600 Speaker 1: That's Real Fight or Facebook, Twitter, Pinterest, and Instagram. And 713 00:45:18,680 --> 00:45:21,520 Speaker 1: you can subscribe to our show on the iHeart Radio 714 00:45:21,520 --> 00:45:29,960 Speaker 1: app or wherever you like to get your podcasts. Stuff 715 00:45:29,960 --> 00:45:31,920 Speaker 1: you Missed in History Class is a production of I 716 00:45:32,080 --> 00:45:35,479 Speaker 1: heart Radio. For more podcasts from I heart Radio, visit 717 00:45:35,520 --> 00:45:38,800 Speaker 1: the iHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen 718 00:45:38,840 --> 00:45:39,800 Speaker 1: to your favorite shows.