1 00:00:01,880 --> 00:00:07,200 Speaker 1: What is feminism in today's world? What is feminism in 2 00:00:07,240 --> 00:00:12,400 Speaker 1: an era where some people refuse to define the word woman, 3 00:00:12,760 --> 00:00:17,280 Speaker 1: or when men like Dylan mulvaney are encouraged to be women. 4 00:00:17,680 --> 00:00:18,959 Speaker 2: It's all a little confusing. 5 00:00:19,560 --> 00:00:22,919 Speaker 1: And we've been encouraged for a long time, or at 6 00:00:23,000 --> 00:00:24,920 Speaker 1: least as long as I can remember. I'm thirty eight 7 00:00:25,000 --> 00:00:28,920 Speaker 1: years old, to be girl bosses, to go out, to 8 00:00:28,960 --> 00:00:30,920 Speaker 1: be CEOs, to put work ahead. 9 00:00:31,680 --> 00:00:34,479 Speaker 2: Are we happier as a result of all of that? 10 00:00:35,600 --> 00:00:40,520 Speaker 1: And why are nearly seventy percent of divorces initiated by women? 11 00:00:41,040 --> 00:00:43,680 Speaker 1: What's behind all of this? We're going to talk to 12 00:00:43,760 --> 00:00:46,920 Speaker 1: doctor Carrie Gress. She has a doctorate of psychology. She 13 00:00:47,040 --> 00:00:50,120 Speaker 1: is also the author of the new book The End 14 00:00:50,120 --> 00:00:54,920 Speaker 1: of Woman, How smashing the patriarchy has destroyed us. We're 15 00:00:54,960 --> 00:00:57,840 Speaker 1: going to get into all of these questions with her, 16 00:00:58,400 --> 00:01:02,560 Speaker 1: get to the heart of what the left thinks feminism is, 17 00:01:03,640 --> 00:01:06,560 Speaker 1: where it's driven us to and why no one seems 18 00:01:06,560 --> 00:01:08,440 Speaker 1: to be happier as a result of any of it. 19 00:01:08,959 --> 00:01:16,640 Speaker 1: So stay tuned for doctor Carrie Gress. 20 00:01:16,680 --> 00:01:18,679 Speaker 2: Doctor carry Gress, I appreciate. 21 00:01:18,319 --> 00:01:21,560 Speaker 1: You taking the time to join the show. We are 22 00:01:21,600 --> 00:01:27,679 Speaker 1: in a weird time in history, as a society when 23 00:01:27,720 --> 00:01:33,200 Speaker 1: we talk about feminism and an era where some refuse 24 00:01:33,319 --> 00:01:34,880 Speaker 1: to define the word woman. 25 00:01:35,640 --> 00:01:40,440 Speaker 3: Yeah, I think it's it's amazing time because it's it 26 00:01:40,440 --> 00:01:42,679 Speaker 3: feels like there's there's no reason anymore. You know, we 27 00:01:42,720 --> 00:01:45,520 Speaker 3: were in sort of this post rational age where it's 28 00:01:45,520 --> 00:01:49,120 Speaker 3: sort of all depends on what you're feeling and your 29 00:01:49,120 --> 00:01:51,880 Speaker 3: emotions on things. But you know, this is what's really 30 00:01:52,040 --> 00:01:54,160 Speaker 3: drew me out to draw this book called The End 31 00:01:54,160 --> 00:01:57,240 Speaker 3: of Woman Is, because you know, how is it We've 32 00:01:57,240 --> 00:01:59,160 Speaker 3: gone to this point where women are being raised in 33 00:01:59,200 --> 00:02:02,000 Speaker 3: sports and we can't define what a woman is. And 34 00:02:02,280 --> 00:02:04,160 Speaker 3: at the same time, I don't think there's anyone out 35 00:02:04,200 --> 00:02:06,520 Speaker 3: there who doesn't want to help women, you know. I 36 00:02:06,520 --> 00:02:08,200 Speaker 3: mean I think that that's sort of our impression of 37 00:02:08,240 --> 00:02:11,280 Speaker 3: feminism broadly speaking, is isn't that how we help women? 38 00:02:12,200 --> 00:02:14,880 Speaker 3: And so I've just really dug into it and just said, 39 00:02:14,880 --> 00:02:18,600 Speaker 3: you know, we have two hundred years of feminist history, like, 40 00:02:18,840 --> 00:02:20,560 Speaker 3: let's pull out some of the threads and see what's 41 00:02:20,600 --> 00:02:23,040 Speaker 3: going on. And I think for me, what I really 42 00:02:23,120 --> 00:02:25,560 Speaker 3: found that made the most sense out of the situation 43 00:02:25,600 --> 00:02:28,800 Speaker 3: that we're in is the feminist question that's been asked 44 00:02:28,840 --> 00:02:31,400 Speaker 3: from the very beginning, but that's been reiterated over the 45 00:02:32,000 --> 00:02:35,400 Speaker 3: generations is not how do we help women as women, 46 00:02:35,600 --> 00:02:38,640 Speaker 3: but how do we help women become more like men? 47 00:02:39,280 --> 00:02:42,280 Speaker 3: Because they saw the thought that men had better and 48 00:02:42,320 --> 00:02:46,520 Speaker 3: easier lives, especially because they didn't have the weight of 49 00:02:46,560 --> 00:02:49,960 Speaker 3: their fertility or the vulnerability associated with it, and so 50 00:02:50,040 --> 00:02:52,360 Speaker 3: that became the big question. And so you know, even 51 00:02:52,400 --> 00:02:55,079 Speaker 3: for fifty years, all of our lives, really there's been 52 00:02:55,080 --> 00:02:58,680 Speaker 3: this kind of idealization of the masculine, and you know, 53 00:02:58,720 --> 00:02:59,840 Speaker 3: women have been pushed into that. 54 00:03:00,000 --> 00:03:01,520 Speaker 4: I'm sure you heard growing up. 55 00:03:01,560 --> 00:03:03,360 Speaker 3: You know, you can compete with the boys, and you 56 00:03:03,360 --> 00:03:06,040 Speaker 3: know that all that kind of attitude, and so what 57 00:03:06,080 --> 00:03:08,600 Speaker 3: we're really seeing now is sort of the culmination of it, 58 00:03:08,639 --> 00:03:11,360 Speaker 3: because part of what happened in the seventies two is 59 00:03:11,360 --> 00:03:14,800 Speaker 3: this big question about gender and this desire to really 60 00:03:14,840 --> 00:03:19,240 Speaker 3: erase gender entirely. And so that's where we're at is people, 61 00:03:19,320 --> 00:03:21,080 Speaker 3: you know, it's a culmination of it, is just this 62 00:03:21,160 --> 00:03:23,040 Speaker 3: idea of we can we can get rid of it. 63 00:03:23,040 --> 00:03:25,520 Speaker 3: It's a social construct and we don't have to pay 64 00:03:25,560 --> 00:03:28,080 Speaker 3: attention to biology. We can just go with what people 65 00:03:28,120 --> 00:03:30,560 Speaker 3: are feeling and that that's going to inform our choices. 66 00:03:30,639 --> 00:03:33,600 Speaker 3: So I think for those of us who are I 67 00:03:33,680 --> 00:03:36,800 Speaker 3: still think that biology is important, and you know that 68 00:03:36,920 --> 00:03:40,880 Speaker 3: there are two sexes. You know, it feels really insane, 69 00:03:41,040 --> 00:03:44,040 Speaker 3: but when you start really digging into all of the scholarship, 70 00:03:44,080 --> 00:03:46,160 Speaker 3: you can just see that the crumbs are all there 71 00:03:46,640 --> 00:03:49,400 Speaker 3: and this is just the you know what we ended 72 00:03:49,480 --> 00:03:49,640 Speaker 3: up with. 73 00:03:49,920 --> 00:03:53,000 Speaker 1: Yeah, I guess they went from trying to turn women 74 00:03:53,360 --> 00:03:59,880 Speaker 1: into men to now turning men into women. Yes, exactly, Yeah, 75 00:04:00,200 --> 00:04:02,440 Speaker 1: excuse me if I'm confused. 76 00:04:04,040 --> 00:04:05,000 Speaker 4: That's exactly right. 77 00:04:05,080 --> 00:04:07,960 Speaker 3: So and kind of all this the weird stuff too, 78 00:04:08,080 --> 00:04:10,839 Speaker 3: like you know, we don't we you know, we hate 79 00:04:10,920 --> 00:04:13,040 Speaker 3: men and the patriarchy. There are oppressors, but we want 80 00:04:13,080 --> 00:04:15,920 Speaker 3: to be just like men, and we want men to 81 00:04:15,960 --> 00:04:19,480 Speaker 3: be just like us too. So it's it gets really confusing, 82 00:04:19,600 --> 00:04:22,239 Speaker 3: very very quickly. And a lot of it is because 83 00:04:22,279 --> 00:04:26,120 Speaker 3: of all of the psychobabble and a ton of Marxism 84 00:04:26,200 --> 00:04:30,000 Speaker 3: and and you know, communist tropes are thrown into it. 85 00:04:30,120 --> 00:04:33,280 Speaker 3: So yeah, I really look at at feminism as sort 86 00:04:33,320 --> 00:04:36,560 Speaker 3: of this this gateway drug too, what has led to 87 00:04:36,600 --> 00:04:39,680 Speaker 3: the woke culture because of all of these you know, 88 00:04:40,120 --> 00:04:43,040 Speaker 3: places where we're supposed to see opression and places where 89 00:04:43,040 --> 00:04:45,640 Speaker 3: we're also supposed to see victimization. And I think that's 90 00:04:46,120 --> 00:04:48,680 Speaker 3: what we're you know, is really allowed things to run rampant, 91 00:04:48,760 --> 00:04:51,680 Speaker 3: is that we've made We've given people the title of 92 00:04:51,720 --> 00:04:54,760 Speaker 3: being a victim, and then that victimhood has given them 93 00:04:54,760 --> 00:04:57,600 Speaker 3: a kind of status, you know, almost like bulletproof status 94 00:04:58,160 --> 00:05:00,520 Speaker 3: where they can't be held accountable for their action anymore. 95 00:05:00,600 --> 00:05:02,760 Speaker 4: So, yeah, it's kind of a mess, but it has 96 00:05:02,800 --> 00:05:03,200 Speaker 4: a source. 97 00:05:03,279 --> 00:05:05,480 Speaker 2: Really, that's a good way to put it. You know. 98 00:05:05,920 --> 00:05:08,800 Speaker 1: What's interesting is, you know, at least you know, I'm 99 00:05:08,839 --> 00:05:12,160 Speaker 1: thirty eight, right, so throughout my generation, there's been this 100 00:05:12,320 --> 00:05:18,160 Speaker 1: encouragement to be a girl boss, to you know, career, career, career, 101 00:05:18,440 --> 00:05:21,240 Speaker 1: to really prioritize career over a family. 102 00:05:21,520 --> 00:05:24,839 Speaker 2: Why are we seeing that? You know? What's the intent 103 00:05:24,960 --> 00:05:25,560 Speaker 2: behind that. 104 00:05:26,040 --> 00:05:26,960 Speaker 4: Huge, huge question? 105 00:05:27,480 --> 00:05:29,760 Speaker 3: You know, And I'm older than you are, and it 106 00:05:30,320 --> 00:05:33,479 Speaker 3: was really the same focus. I think part of it 107 00:05:33,520 --> 00:05:36,000 Speaker 3: comes back to Betty. For Danna actually is really interestingly 108 00:05:36,120 --> 00:05:38,440 Speaker 3: she you know, published her book The Feminine Mystique in 109 00:05:38,560 --> 00:05:43,119 Speaker 3: nineteen sixty three, sold three million copies within the first 110 00:05:43,240 --> 00:05:46,880 Speaker 3: few years, and it just is really remarkable when you 111 00:05:46,920 --> 00:05:49,720 Speaker 3: start digging into her life there's actually a whole book 112 00:05:49,720 --> 00:05:53,320 Speaker 3: about it, commenting about her connections to the Communist Party, 113 00:05:53,320 --> 00:05:56,200 Speaker 3: because she actually always said she was just a housewife, 114 00:05:56,279 --> 00:05:59,440 Speaker 3: she wasn't really interested in anything political or women's issues 115 00:05:59,480 --> 00:06:03,160 Speaker 3: until a fifth but there's significant evidence that she actually 116 00:06:03,200 --> 00:06:07,520 Speaker 3: was much more involved in leftist projects. 117 00:06:07,600 --> 00:06:09,440 Speaker 4: You know, her resumes just riddled with it. 118 00:06:10,160 --> 00:06:13,200 Speaker 3: So she hid it very very well, but she was 119 00:06:13,320 --> 00:06:17,720 Speaker 3: very motivated by Marx and Engles and trying to what 120 00:06:17,760 --> 00:06:20,520 Speaker 3: she really believed. And actually there's a journal entry of 121 00:06:20,560 --> 00:06:24,200 Speaker 3: her she's quoting an Angles quote about women, and she 122 00:06:24,200 --> 00:06:28,159 Speaker 3: says women can never fully be free until they're actively 123 00:06:28,200 --> 00:06:32,279 Speaker 3: in the marketplace because at that point, motherhood wasn't considered 124 00:06:32,480 --> 00:06:34,920 Speaker 3: any kind of real production. That was the big thing. 125 00:06:34,960 --> 00:06:37,760 Speaker 3: You had to be producing something and children didn't count. 126 00:06:38,560 --> 00:06:40,880 Speaker 3: So she, along with so many others, thought that that 127 00:06:41,200 --> 00:06:42,880 Speaker 3: was the real goal, is how do we get women 128 00:06:42,920 --> 00:06:46,640 Speaker 3: out of what she called the comfortable concentration camp, which 129 00:06:46,720 --> 00:06:47,200 Speaker 3: was the home. 130 00:06:48,240 --> 00:06:49,960 Speaker 4: So that really forced women out. 131 00:06:50,000 --> 00:06:52,360 Speaker 3: And you know, I obviously work, and I have an 132 00:06:52,360 --> 00:06:54,640 Speaker 3: advanced degree, and you know, I don't have a problem 133 00:06:54,720 --> 00:06:57,040 Speaker 3: with that, but I think the big problem has come 134 00:06:57,080 --> 00:07:01,919 Speaker 3: in when in order to facilitate that ideology. You know, 135 00:07:02,040 --> 00:07:05,400 Speaker 3: men and children have had to become the enemies, and 136 00:07:05,440 --> 00:07:09,560 Speaker 3: the home itself really of women. And I think that's 137 00:07:09,600 --> 00:07:12,960 Speaker 3: where things really started getting off course, was when that 138 00:07:13,040 --> 00:07:16,120 Speaker 3: ideology really took hold and women were inspired by it 139 00:07:16,160 --> 00:07:20,000 Speaker 3: because she wrote so well, she was a psychology major, 140 00:07:20,040 --> 00:07:22,520 Speaker 3: and you know, going back to that idea of victimhood, 141 00:07:22,600 --> 00:07:25,560 Speaker 3: she just really you know, rather than coming at it 142 00:07:25,600 --> 00:07:28,640 Speaker 3: from a Marxist way, she came at it from an 143 00:07:28,640 --> 00:07:31,520 Speaker 3: emotional way. She she you know, hit on those buttons 144 00:07:31,520 --> 00:07:33,960 Speaker 3: that really get us to move, like a fear of 145 00:07:33,960 --> 00:07:36,240 Speaker 3: missing out. That was one of them. You know, you're 146 00:07:36,000 --> 00:07:38,040 Speaker 3: what are you missing out on when you're at home? 147 00:07:39,000 --> 00:07:41,320 Speaker 3: And then of course the other one is is that victimization. 148 00:07:41,440 --> 00:07:44,440 Speaker 3: You know, how awful you your life is because you're 149 00:07:44,720 --> 00:07:49,200 Speaker 3: at home. So that I think that those are really 150 00:07:49,480 --> 00:07:53,200 Speaker 3: those ideas have been the drivers, and you know that 151 00:07:53,280 --> 00:07:57,120 Speaker 3: the predominant culture and narrative has just really run with 152 00:07:57,160 --> 00:07:58,880 Speaker 3: it and not really allowed. 153 00:07:58,440 --> 00:08:00,360 Speaker 4: Any kind of straying from that. 154 00:08:00,920 --> 00:08:03,440 Speaker 3: And so you know, it's funny now to look around 155 00:08:03,520 --> 00:08:07,080 Speaker 3: and see, especially with COVID, you know how much things 156 00:08:07,120 --> 00:08:10,000 Speaker 3: like sourdough bread and gardening and knitting and all these 157 00:08:10,000 --> 00:08:13,360 Speaker 3: things are back in style, all these homemaking skills, even 158 00:08:13,440 --> 00:08:17,240 Speaker 3: interior design, and yet that idea of homemaking is still 159 00:08:17,440 --> 00:08:20,440 Speaker 3: very taboo and you know, not something that any woman 160 00:08:20,760 --> 00:08:22,560 Speaker 3: would say when she's in college. Oh, I just want 161 00:08:22,600 --> 00:08:23,960 Speaker 3: to be a homemaker. You know, you just don't hear 162 00:08:24,000 --> 00:08:26,920 Speaker 3: that very with any kind of prevalence. It's still that 163 00:08:26,960 --> 00:08:32,680 Speaker 3: push to career and you know, focus on that avenue 164 00:08:32,760 --> 00:08:35,640 Speaker 3: for making women happy. And of course we're also seeing 165 00:08:35,679 --> 00:08:38,000 Speaker 3: it's not really making women happy. That's not you know, 166 00:08:39,040 --> 00:08:42,480 Speaker 3: showing statistically that women are increasing in happiness the more 167 00:08:42,480 --> 00:08:44,160 Speaker 3: that they drive into their careers. 168 00:08:45,200 --> 00:08:47,400 Speaker 2: Is the point to the nuclear family? 169 00:08:48,040 --> 00:08:50,960 Speaker 4: Yes, yeah, that is it. 170 00:08:51,200 --> 00:08:53,320 Speaker 3: That is the point, because the nuclear family is what 171 00:08:53,440 --> 00:08:58,080 Speaker 3: makes civilization strong. It's what creates the defense against the ideologies. 172 00:08:58,240 --> 00:09:02,360 Speaker 3: And these are really really about power and control. You 173 00:09:02,400 --> 00:09:05,520 Speaker 3: can see it most especially, I think with the way 174 00:09:05,559 --> 00:09:08,880 Speaker 3: that men are treated, and sadly, you know, it's been 175 00:09:08,880 --> 00:09:12,160 Speaker 3: like kryptonite. You know, no man wants to talk about feminism, 176 00:09:12,559 --> 00:09:14,439 Speaker 3: and I do not blame them. I would not want 177 00:09:14,480 --> 00:09:15,800 Speaker 3: to talk about I don't even want to talk about 178 00:09:15,800 --> 00:09:18,720 Speaker 3: feminism much less, you know, as a man. And but 179 00:09:18,800 --> 00:09:21,080 Speaker 3: that's they've they've been able to paint with a broad 180 00:09:21,160 --> 00:09:24,880 Speaker 3: brush men as these oppressors, and so they don't there's 181 00:09:24,880 --> 00:09:26,679 Speaker 3: no way for them to really get out of that 182 00:09:26,760 --> 00:09:30,920 Speaker 3: in a healthy and engaging way with other women. But yes, 183 00:09:31,000 --> 00:09:34,800 Speaker 3: it's absolutely to destroy the nuclear family is really at 184 00:09:34,800 --> 00:09:35,280 Speaker 3: the heart of it. 185 00:09:35,480 --> 00:09:37,320 Speaker 1: I also think people don't want to talk about it 186 00:09:37,360 --> 00:09:40,199 Speaker 1: because no one knows what the hell it means these days. 187 00:09:40,400 --> 00:09:47,880 Speaker 1: It's right like I think most you know, most guys 188 00:09:47,920 --> 00:09:50,079 Speaker 1: are like, I don't even know what's going. 189 00:09:49,840 --> 00:09:54,600 Speaker 3: On, so true, and keep your head down and just 190 00:09:54,679 --> 00:09:58,080 Speaker 3: keep moving, like don't talk to the feminists because you 191 00:09:58,080 --> 00:09:59,680 Speaker 3: don't want to look at you, you know, sort of 192 00:09:59,679 --> 00:10:03,600 Speaker 3: like the me teacher in school, like just don't notice me. Yeah, 193 00:10:03,679 --> 00:10:05,760 Speaker 3: I think that that is very true. And that's the 194 00:10:05,800 --> 00:10:09,920 Speaker 3: other problem is that it's become it means so many 195 00:10:09,920 --> 00:10:13,280 Speaker 3: different things, again with this idea of benevolence, But there 196 00:10:13,280 --> 00:10:16,560 Speaker 3: were really three things about it that we can see 197 00:10:16,600 --> 00:10:20,559 Speaker 3: throughout the last two hundred years that stick out. Obviously 198 00:10:20,559 --> 00:10:22,719 Speaker 3: there are going to be other definitely, and I'll go 199 00:10:22,760 --> 00:10:23,920 Speaker 3: into those three things in a second. 200 00:10:23,920 --> 00:10:26,439 Speaker 4: But I think there are other ways to define feminism. 201 00:10:26,440 --> 00:10:28,600 Speaker 3: It's just that nobody's really forced to do it, so 202 00:10:29,000 --> 00:10:31,760 Speaker 3: people don't do it, and that's what creates so much confusion. 203 00:10:32,559 --> 00:10:34,440 Speaker 3: But the three things that I found that we're there 204 00:10:34,480 --> 00:10:38,040 Speaker 3: from almost the very beginning, where this commitment to free love, 205 00:10:38,080 --> 00:10:41,239 Speaker 3: which of course is you know, goes right against monogamy 206 00:10:41,280 --> 00:10:45,360 Speaker 3: and the family. This idea of smashing the patriarchy, which 207 00:10:45,440 --> 00:10:48,000 Speaker 3: was this idea of kind of collapsing culture, getting rid 208 00:10:48,000 --> 00:10:50,720 Speaker 3: of things like any kind of hierarchy in the church 209 00:10:50,800 --> 00:10:52,720 Speaker 3: or in the military, you know, all those gifts that 210 00:10:52,800 --> 00:10:56,480 Speaker 3: men have had in spades and have built civilizations on. 211 00:10:57,000 --> 00:10:58,720 Speaker 3: Not to say that women can't do those things, but 212 00:10:58,760 --> 00:11:01,880 Speaker 3: that was the target that came right out of the 213 00:11:01,880 --> 00:11:05,000 Speaker 3: Front Revolution. And then the third piece was really the occult, 214 00:11:05,080 --> 00:11:07,400 Speaker 3: which is just amazing. But if you look around at 215 00:11:07,440 --> 00:11:09,880 Speaker 3: the culture today you can see it kind of cropping 216 00:11:09,960 --> 00:11:12,480 Speaker 3: up in all kinds of ways with different TV shows 217 00:11:12,480 --> 00:11:16,040 Speaker 3: and movies that are out and music videos and you know, 218 00:11:16,120 --> 00:11:19,240 Speaker 3: books whatnot. So those are the three things that I 219 00:11:19,360 --> 00:11:21,440 Speaker 3: found to be sort of at the core of the 220 00:11:21,480 --> 00:11:27,040 Speaker 3: movement from early eighteen hundreds to certainly up to today. 221 00:11:27,320 --> 00:11:29,240 Speaker 3: And you know, I think those are the things that 222 00:11:30,200 --> 00:11:32,200 Speaker 3: most of us just really don't want to be endorsing. 223 00:11:32,400 --> 00:11:34,800 Speaker 3: So I think that's why we need to be more careful. 224 00:11:34,840 --> 00:11:36,959 Speaker 3: If we're going to still call ourselves feminists, we need 225 00:11:37,000 --> 00:11:40,480 Speaker 3: to be more specific about exactly what we mean, because 226 00:11:40,559 --> 00:11:42,440 Speaker 3: it's all the terms are so loaded. 227 00:11:43,200 --> 00:11:46,800 Speaker 1: You had mentioned that women are less happy today. 228 00:11:47,240 --> 00:11:48,120 Speaker 2: Why do you think that is? 229 00:11:48,520 --> 00:11:49,960 Speaker 4: Well, I mean, if. 230 00:11:49,800 --> 00:11:53,559 Speaker 3: You're going to take men and take your children and 231 00:11:53,720 --> 00:11:57,079 Speaker 3: make them the enemy and then tell women that they 232 00:11:57,080 --> 00:11:59,400 Speaker 3: need to be bitter and resentful, you know, I don't 233 00:11:59,400 --> 00:12:03,679 Speaker 3: think anyone's going to be happy. That's sort of the 234 00:12:03,440 --> 00:12:06,800 Speaker 3: the push that we've we've gotten. And I think also 235 00:12:06,840 --> 00:12:10,440 Speaker 3: it's just that this this realization of just a job 236 00:12:10,480 --> 00:12:11,440 Speaker 3: can only go so far. 237 00:12:11,600 --> 00:12:11,760 Speaker 5: You know. 238 00:12:11,840 --> 00:12:13,760 Speaker 3: You hear all these stories about these women that given 239 00:12:13,760 --> 00:12:17,839 Speaker 3: themselves over to their careers and then they get to fifty, sixty, 240 00:12:17,920 --> 00:12:20,760 Speaker 3: seventy and they, you know, wonder what happened to their lives, 241 00:12:20,800 --> 00:12:22,800 Speaker 3: Like this was not the life that they were promised 242 00:12:22,920 --> 00:12:27,480 Speaker 3: or that they expected. Tragically, And yeah, I think that 243 00:12:27,559 --> 00:12:31,600 Speaker 3: there's there's all kinds of reasons that are going into it, 244 00:12:31,640 --> 00:12:34,120 Speaker 3: but it's again this kind of pitting the sexes against 245 00:12:34,160 --> 00:12:38,440 Speaker 3: one another, pitting these these very tender natural relationships like 246 00:12:38,480 --> 00:12:42,320 Speaker 3: a mother to child, and making them out to be 247 00:12:42,440 --> 00:12:48,240 Speaker 3: something you know, awful and as obstacles to our fulfillment 248 00:12:48,280 --> 00:12:51,120 Speaker 3: instead of really avenues to it. I don't think it 249 00:12:51,160 --> 00:12:53,480 Speaker 3: can do anything but make us unhappy because I think 250 00:12:54,040 --> 00:12:56,640 Speaker 3: what we're trying to do is with feminism as tinker 251 00:12:56,720 --> 00:13:01,079 Speaker 3: with human nature and human nature revolts, which just says, look, 252 00:13:02,720 --> 00:13:05,720 Speaker 3: you are not going to be happy in this tract 253 00:13:05,840 --> 00:13:08,480 Speaker 3: that you are currently you know, have put yourself in 254 00:13:08,559 --> 00:13:11,920 Speaker 3: because people told you to. So I think that has 255 00:13:11,920 --> 00:13:14,160 Speaker 3: a lot to do with it. Is this this pushing 256 00:13:14,160 --> 00:13:16,440 Speaker 3: against human nature and trying to come up with different 257 00:13:16,440 --> 00:13:20,079 Speaker 3: results when that's we're not saying that that is happening. 258 00:13:20,400 --> 00:13:26,960 Speaker 1: Let's take a quick commercial break more with doctor carry Grass. Well, 259 00:13:26,960 --> 00:13:30,520 Speaker 1: because to some degree, you know, men and women are 260 00:13:30,640 --> 00:13:35,000 Speaker 1: inherently and biologically built differently, and we're being taught to 261 00:13:35,120 --> 00:13:40,079 Speaker 1: sort of deny these biological impulses and sort of our 262 00:13:40,120 --> 00:13:42,880 Speaker 1: own human nature, and so you know, it would make 263 00:13:42,960 --> 00:13:46,440 Speaker 1: sense as to why that would make people unhappy. 264 00:13:46,800 --> 00:13:48,360 Speaker 4: Yeah, well, and I think too. 265 00:13:48,559 --> 00:13:50,160 Speaker 3: You know, I've spent a lot of time just to 266 00:13:50,200 --> 00:13:53,760 Speaker 3: even thinking about what the vulnerability that is involved with fertility. 267 00:13:53,760 --> 00:13:56,520 Speaker 3: I have five children, and you know, I have an 268 00:13:56,559 --> 00:14:00,520 Speaker 3: amazing husband that allows us to have the life that 269 00:14:00,559 --> 00:14:04,480 Speaker 3: we have with healthy you know children. We've been incredibly blessed. 270 00:14:05,440 --> 00:14:08,400 Speaker 3: But there's something about, you know, being able to have 271 00:14:08,440 --> 00:14:10,760 Speaker 3: that dynamic where you are in a situation where you 272 00:14:10,800 --> 00:14:13,320 Speaker 3: can be vulnerable with someone. And obviously there are situations 273 00:14:13,320 --> 00:14:16,680 Speaker 3: where they're just bad men. You know, there's just bad 274 00:14:16,720 --> 00:14:19,920 Speaker 3: women too, And I think this is what motivates it. 275 00:14:19,960 --> 00:14:20,040 Speaker 4: Is. 276 00:14:20,040 --> 00:14:23,840 Speaker 3: The hard part is that people behave badly. But the 277 00:14:24,280 --> 00:14:27,400 Speaker 3: way that we've tried to solve it isn't you know, 278 00:14:27,440 --> 00:14:30,800 Speaker 3: by helping people act more virtuously. It's been like, why 279 00:14:30,840 --> 00:14:32,840 Speaker 3: don't we just dissolve all of it and then women 280 00:14:32,880 --> 00:14:35,600 Speaker 3: don't have to deal with any of it. And I 281 00:14:35,640 --> 00:14:39,480 Speaker 3: think that's really what that missing piece is is we're 282 00:14:39,520 --> 00:14:43,600 Speaker 3: made to be in relationship. We're made, you know, we're 283 00:14:43,640 --> 00:14:45,880 Speaker 3: made to bring new life into the world, and to 284 00:14:45,960 --> 00:14:48,040 Speaker 3: sort of just cut those things off because there might 285 00:14:48,040 --> 00:14:52,360 Speaker 3: be suffering, you know, that's not really a human answer. 286 00:14:52,400 --> 00:14:55,600 Speaker 3: That's sort of a very superficial answer and very short 287 00:14:55,600 --> 00:14:58,560 Speaker 3: sighted answer, because of course you're talking about the perpetuation. 288 00:14:58,080 --> 00:15:01,280 Speaker 4: Of the species as well. So yeah, I think that 289 00:15:01,720 --> 00:15:03,880 Speaker 4: is part of the problem too. 290 00:15:04,160 --> 00:15:06,400 Speaker 1: I had read in one of the columns that you've 291 00:15:06,400 --> 00:15:10,960 Speaker 1: written recently that nearly seventy percent of divorces are initiated 292 00:15:11,000 --> 00:15:11,560 Speaker 1: by women. 293 00:15:12,440 --> 00:15:14,680 Speaker 2: Why is that, you know, I think. 294 00:15:14,760 --> 00:15:17,680 Speaker 4: A lot of it is again sort of this attitude 295 00:15:17,880 --> 00:15:19,760 Speaker 4: of you know. Again, it goes back. 296 00:15:19,680 --> 00:15:22,600 Speaker 3: To the difference between men and women, and a lot 297 00:15:22,600 --> 00:15:24,640 Speaker 3: of times men are sort of blindsided by because they 298 00:15:24,640 --> 00:15:27,280 Speaker 3: think things are going just fine, and then women are 299 00:15:28,120 --> 00:15:30,840 Speaker 3: asking for a divorce because they are bored, or they 300 00:15:30,920 --> 00:15:33,640 Speaker 3: feel like they've moved on, or they want more from 301 00:15:33,680 --> 00:15:35,720 Speaker 3: their relationship. You know, there's all kinds of reasons, but 302 00:15:35,760 --> 00:15:41,080 Speaker 3: it seems like women are encouraged to break out of 303 00:15:41,080 --> 00:15:45,160 Speaker 3: something if they're unhappy and look at the unhappy oneness 304 00:15:45,320 --> 00:15:48,280 Speaker 3: must be in that situation, instead of encouraged to say, 305 00:15:48,720 --> 00:15:52,440 Speaker 3: maybe we need to work on this or whatnot. So yeah, 306 00:15:52,480 --> 00:15:55,000 Speaker 3: I mean, if you look, I think pop culture too, 307 00:15:55,040 --> 00:15:58,560 Speaker 3: you can sort of see the femeralness of relationships. But 308 00:15:58,600 --> 00:16:02,800 Speaker 3: it also is that that almost kind of shopping mentality 309 00:16:02,800 --> 00:16:06,360 Speaker 3: that we've sort of adopted about our relationships and something good, 310 00:16:06,720 --> 00:16:10,600 Speaker 3: better could be coming along and viewing you know, men 311 00:16:10,680 --> 00:16:13,760 Speaker 3: through that kind of relationship in terms of what have 312 00:16:13,800 --> 00:16:14,720 Speaker 3: you done for me lately? 313 00:16:14,800 --> 00:16:16,040 Speaker 4: And you know all of that. 314 00:16:16,240 --> 00:16:18,720 Speaker 3: So I think it's a remarkable statistic, and I think 315 00:16:18,720 --> 00:16:20,680 Speaker 3: it's really sad because it tells you a lot too 316 00:16:20,720 --> 00:16:25,520 Speaker 3: about you know, just men feeling probably in a lot 317 00:16:25,560 --> 00:16:27,720 Speaker 3: of respects, just very out of control, especially when they 318 00:16:27,720 --> 00:16:30,119 Speaker 3: are blindsided by this. You know, they thought their relationships 319 00:16:30,160 --> 00:16:33,960 Speaker 3: were fine, and they obviously weren't what they thought too. 320 00:16:34,160 --> 00:16:36,560 Speaker 3: So and of course the children that are involved too, 321 00:16:36,680 --> 00:16:39,280 Speaker 3: is you know, another tragic element. 322 00:16:39,160 --> 00:16:39,360 Speaker 5: You know. 323 00:16:39,640 --> 00:16:42,240 Speaker 1: And it's also you know, this is all being pushed 324 00:16:42,480 --> 00:16:45,320 Speaker 1: through culture as well. I don't know if you saw 325 00:16:45,400 --> 00:16:50,040 Speaker 1: the interview that the new Snow White Rachel Zegler, Yeah, 326 00:16:50,080 --> 00:16:52,160 Speaker 1: I want to play that clip real quick and then 327 00:16:52,840 --> 00:16:54,400 Speaker 1: get your thoughts on the other side of it. 328 00:16:55,840 --> 00:16:58,280 Speaker 5: The original cartoon came out in nineteen thirty seven and 329 00:16:58,360 --> 00:17:02,640 Speaker 5: very evidently so there is a big focus on her 330 00:17:02,840 --> 00:17:06,160 Speaker 5: love story with a guy who literally stalks her. 331 00:17:07,240 --> 00:17:07,600 Speaker 4: Weird. 332 00:17:07,960 --> 00:17:09,000 Speaker 2: Weird. 333 00:17:09,000 --> 00:17:10,399 Speaker 5: So we didn't do that this time. 334 00:17:11,080 --> 00:17:13,200 Speaker 4: So no prince or a different kind of prince. 335 00:17:13,320 --> 00:17:15,680 Speaker 5: We have a different approach to what I'm sure a 336 00:17:15,720 --> 00:17:18,159 Speaker 5: lot of people will assume is a love story just 337 00:17:18,200 --> 00:17:20,639 Speaker 5: because like we cast a guy in the movie Andrew 338 00:17:20,680 --> 00:17:25,000 Speaker 5: burn Up, great dude, Yeah, It's one of those things 339 00:17:25,000 --> 00:17:26,800 Speaker 5: that I think everyone's going to have their assumptions about 340 00:17:26,840 --> 00:17:29,040 Speaker 5: what it's actually going to be, but it's really not 341 00:17:29,200 --> 00:17:31,800 Speaker 5: about the love story at all, which is really really wonderful, 342 00:17:31,800 --> 00:17:33,360 Speaker 5: and whether or not she finds love along the way 343 00:17:33,440 --> 00:17:37,080 Speaker 5: is anybody's guess. Until twenty twenty four, all of Andrews 344 00:17:37,080 --> 00:17:39,760 Speaker 5: Stine's could get cut. Who knows it's Hollywood baby. 345 00:17:40,280 --> 00:17:44,840 Speaker 1: So she's like, princes are terrible, men are awful. All 346 00:17:44,880 --> 00:17:47,560 Speaker 1: young girls hate men and you know, be afraid of them, 347 00:17:48,119 --> 00:17:49,080 Speaker 1: and in the. 348 00:17:49,080 --> 00:17:50,600 Speaker 2: Process of it, we're not. 349 00:17:50,640 --> 00:17:53,880 Speaker 1: Going to get good men in this environment. I think 350 00:17:53,880 --> 00:17:55,760 Speaker 1: that's what worries me the most. 351 00:17:56,160 --> 00:17:59,280 Speaker 3: Yeah, No, I think that's an incredibly scary reality. The 352 00:18:00,240 --> 00:18:03,040 Speaker 3: other interesting detail that come out has come out recently 353 00:18:03,119 --> 00:18:05,600 Speaker 3: is the I think it's twelveth grade boys that were 354 00:18:05,600 --> 00:18:09,400 Speaker 3: interviewed that are actually becoming more conservative instead of more 355 00:18:09,520 --> 00:18:13,040 Speaker 3: feminist minded, which is interesting. I'm not saying it's necessarily 356 00:18:13,080 --> 00:18:16,119 Speaker 3: making them by default better men, but I think it 357 00:18:16,200 --> 00:18:20,240 Speaker 3: shows that there's kind of this inherent detachment from what 358 00:18:20,320 --> 00:18:22,640 Speaker 3: the women are thinking in a way that you didn't 359 00:18:22,640 --> 00:18:24,639 Speaker 3: see that in the boomer movement, you know, or even 360 00:18:25,920 --> 00:18:28,400 Speaker 3: you know and beyond. It seemed like there was always 361 00:18:28,440 --> 00:18:30,200 Speaker 3: this sense of like, we want to support the women. 362 00:18:30,280 --> 00:18:32,879 Speaker 3: You know, look at Prince Harry and Megan Markle. I 363 00:18:32,880 --> 00:18:35,000 Speaker 3: mean it's not like he calls himself a feminist and 364 00:18:35,000 --> 00:18:37,440 Speaker 3: all that kind of stuff, Like he's supporting Megan and 365 00:18:37,560 --> 00:18:39,920 Speaker 3: all of that by using the language that she expects 366 00:18:39,960 --> 00:18:41,960 Speaker 3: and things like that. But it seems like the younger 367 00:18:42,000 --> 00:18:45,760 Speaker 3: generation is finally like, no, we're not doing that, which 368 00:18:45,800 --> 00:18:48,760 Speaker 3: may or may may not be healthy. But to have 369 00:18:48,840 --> 00:18:52,639 Speaker 3: this sense though that this isolation is sort of mentality 370 00:18:52,760 --> 00:18:56,119 Speaker 3: is I think what's also really scary too, that you 371 00:18:56,160 --> 00:18:59,240 Speaker 3: know that there's something creepy about a romance in nineteen 372 00:18:59,280 --> 00:19:03,520 Speaker 3: thirty six, sort of heartbreaking, like what has happened to dating? 373 00:19:03,600 --> 00:19:05,439 Speaker 3: And you know, all of those kinds of questions that 374 00:19:05,480 --> 00:19:10,159 Speaker 3: you just feel really sorry for this generation and just 375 00:19:10,280 --> 00:19:12,440 Speaker 3: all the things that are missed and all of those 376 00:19:12,880 --> 00:19:15,480 Speaker 3: ways that you learn about other people, you learn about yourself, 377 00:19:15,560 --> 00:19:19,200 Speaker 3: you learn a way to communicate, and that the beautiful 378 00:19:19,200 --> 00:19:22,000 Speaker 3: things that come from those relationships, you know, instead of 379 00:19:22,040 --> 00:19:24,280 Speaker 3: just what it seems like now has become just such 380 00:19:24,280 --> 00:19:29,040 Speaker 3: a h hook up, quick awkward. You know, that's I 381 00:19:29,080 --> 00:19:30,800 Speaker 3: think the word I keep hearing the most there's all 382 00:19:30,800 --> 00:19:33,560 Speaker 3: these awkward relationships, Like people just don't have a sense 383 00:19:33,600 --> 00:19:36,479 Speaker 3: of how to relate to other people and so end 384 00:19:36,520 --> 00:19:38,879 Speaker 3: something awkward and everybody's just sort of like, well, let 385 00:19:38,920 --> 00:19:39,200 Speaker 3: me just. 386 00:19:39,119 --> 00:19:39,920 Speaker 4: Go back to texting. 387 00:19:39,960 --> 00:19:43,760 Speaker 3: You kind of return to that instead of really dating 388 00:19:43,800 --> 00:19:45,879 Speaker 3: someone and getting to know them and taking them out 389 00:19:45,920 --> 00:19:47,520 Speaker 3: to dinner, you know, all those kinds of things. 390 00:19:47,560 --> 00:19:51,520 Speaker 4: So yeah, it's it's there's a lot to be worried about. 391 00:19:51,560 --> 00:19:52,359 Speaker 4: I think for the future. 392 00:19:52,440 --> 00:19:54,640 Speaker 1: Well, you know what, I'm a millennial, and I think 393 00:19:54,680 --> 00:19:58,080 Speaker 1: in dating, even in my generation, you know, there's a 394 00:19:58,119 --> 00:20:02,200 Speaker 1: real fear of marriage in a way that's very different 395 00:20:02,280 --> 00:20:05,359 Speaker 1: than you know, my parents got married, and you know what, 396 00:20:05,480 --> 00:20:07,520 Speaker 1: it was just that's what you do, that's what you did. 397 00:20:07,560 --> 00:20:10,800 Speaker 1: You know, you wanted to get married, and uh, you know, 398 00:20:10,880 --> 00:20:13,520 Speaker 1: so I don't know how you you know, reshape that. 399 00:20:13,600 --> 00:20:15,600 Speaker 1: And so I can't imagine if that's what's going on 400 00:20:15,680 --> 00:20:18,080 Speaker 1: in my generation, what you know, gen z looks like 401 00:20:18,320 --> 00:20:19,000 Speaker 1: or you know. 402 00:20:19,640 --> 00:20:22,320 Speaker 3: No, I think that's and that and that's the hardest 403 00:20:22,359 --> 00:20:25,800 Speaker 3: part is just again this huge rift that's been placed 404 00:20:25,920 --> 00:20:28,879 Speaker 3: between men and women and then sort of this wild 405 00:20:28,920 --> 00:20:31,280 Speaker 3: card of you know, you can be whatever, you know, 406 00:20:31,440 --> 00:20:34,360 Speaker 3: me pan you can you know, all of this, all 407 00:20:34,400 --> 00:20:36,960 Speaker 3: of these different options, and it seems like people are going, 408 00:20:37,160 --> 00:20:40,520 Speaker 3: you know, trying them on and and that obviously can't 409 00:20:40,560 --> 00:20:42,760 Speaker 3: be helping either when you can't even you know, you're 410 00:20:42,800 --> 00:20:46,800 Speaker 3: not even sure what what you are. So yeah, it's 411 00:20:46,160 --> 00:20:48,159 Speaker 3: it's it's really daunting. 412 00:20:48,080 --> 00:20:50,160 Speaker 1: You know. And then now, you know, to to add 413 00:20:50,320 --> 00:20:55,199 Speaker 1: confusion to all of it, you've got kids being told that, 414 00:20:55,520 --> 00:20:57,520 Speaker 1: you know, they're not the gender they're supposed to be, 415 00:20:58,000 --> 00:21:00,200 Speaker 1: that if you're a little boy, you can be a girl. 416 00:21:00,240 --> 00:21:02,000 Speaker 1: If you're a little girl, you can be a little boy, 417 00:21:02,119 --> 00:21:07,120 Speaker 1: and just you know, sewing additional chaos. You know, why, 418 00:21:07,160 --> 00:21:12,199 Speaker 1: why do you think there is this seemingly intentional push 419 00:21:12,880 --> 00:21:16,560 Speaker 1: to sew additional chaos among children? 420 00:21:16,800 --> 00:21:19,399 Speaker 4: I think that's a great question. It's I think it's 421 00:21:19,440 --> 00:21:20,479 Speaker 4: a very big question. 422 00:21:20,560 --> 00:21:22,840 Speaker 3: And I think that so much of it has to 423 00:21:22,840 --> 00:21:27,080 Speaker 3: do again with this idea of revolution and utopia and 424 00:21:27,119 --> 00:21:29,880 Speaker 3: trying to sort of steering the United. 425 00:21:29,680 --> 00:21:30,280 Speaker 4: States to. 426 00:21:31,880 --> 00:21:35,879 Speaker 3: You know, something that's supposedly better, this this vision, and 427 00:21:35,960 --> 00:21:39,520 Speaker 3: yet all it is is just is creating more discord. 428 00:21:39,680 --> 00:21:42,560 Speaker 3: But what happens when you create discord is you need 429 00:21:42,640 --> 00:21:44,960 Speaker 3: more government assistants, You need more government. 430 00:21:45,240 --> 00:21:48,040 Speaker 4: You know, people, government has to be involved in your life. 431 00:21:48,080 --> 00:21:50,879 Speaker 3: You know that there's that great word bureagamy that was 432 00:21:50,920 --> 00:21:54,119 Speaker 3: invented by lioneld Tiger who also he's a psychologist. I 433 00:21:54,119 --> 00:21:56,399 Speaker 3: think he came up with that term male bonding that 434 00:21:56,960 --> 00:21:59,879 Speaker 3: was popular, you know, a decade or so ago, but 435 00:22:00,080 --> 00:22:02,560 Speaker 3: burerogamy where you know, a woman is basically married to 436 00:22:03,119 --> 00:22:07,040 Speaker 3: this the state. And even in the Obama administration there 437 00:22:07,119 --> 00:22:09,719 Speaker 3: was that that woman Julia that they created that you know, 438 00:22:09,800 --> 00:22:12,320 Speaker 3: she her whole life, she was just taken care of 439 00:22:12,359 --> 00:22:15,639 Speaker 3: by the government. That was her life. And we're seeing 440 00:22:15,640 --> 00:22:18,800 Speaker 3: that more and more, especially among the poor. Uh, you know, 441 00:22:18,880 --> 00:22:21,240 Speaker 3: marriage has become sort of a status symbol or something 442 00:22:21,280 --> 00:22:23,399 Speaker 3: that you know, people have to have a certain amount 443 00:22:23,400 --> 00:22:25,520 Speaker 3: of money to be able to do, instead of what 444 00:22:25,600 --> 00:22:28,119 Speaker 3: it's typically been, which is, you know, something that was 445 00:22:28,160 --> 00:22:31,480 Speaker 3: for all the classes. So yeah, you can see this 446 00:22:31,560 --> 00:22:34,840 Speaker 3: real centralization into the government because suddenly you have all 447 00:22:34,840 --> 00:22:37,600 Speaker 3: these vulnerable women with children and they don't have the 448 00:22:37,640 --> 00:22:43,679 Speaker 3: means to support them properly, and so rather than you know, 449 00:22:43,760 --> 00:22:46,119 Speaker 3: being married to the father of these children, they're just 450 00:22:46,240 --> 00:22:49,240 Speaker 3: married to the state and they don't really understand how 451 00:22:49,280 --> 00:22:51,879 Speaker 3: to sort of get out of that. But yeah, I 452 00:22:51,880 --> 00:22:57,960 Speaker 3: think that it's it's about power being you know, coming 453 00:22:58,000 --> 00:23:01,080 Speaker 3: together in one place. It's all so about you know, 454 00:23:01,119 --> 00:23:05,040 Speaker 3: that kind of destruction is kind of a road to nowhere, 455 00:23:05,720 --> 00:23:07,960 Speaker 3: And that's the part that they don't talk about, is 456 00:23:08,640 --> 00:23:10,760 Speaker 3: what the direction of which we're going and what it 457 00:23:10,840 --> 00:23:13,240 Speaker 3: leads to. And I think, you know, look at San Francisco. 458 00:23:13,440 --> 00:23:15,439 Speaker 3: This is kind of the perfect example. It's sort of 459 00:23:15,480 --> 00:23:19,960 Speaker 3: the the prototype of what we can expect because of 460 00:23:20,000 --> 00:23:23,440 Speaker 3: all of these policies that are clearly not working with 461 00:23:23,560 --> 00:23:27,879 Speaker 3: human nature, clearly not helping anybody, and yet they just 462 00:23:27,960 --> 00:23:30,840 Speaker 3: keep pushing from over and over again, and it just it. 463 00:23:30,720 --> 00:23:31,680 Speaker 4: Does create destruction. 464 00:23:31,760 --> 00:23:32,879 Speaker 3: So it's one of those things where you're like, this 465 00:23:32,920 --> 00:23:36,639 Speaker 3: doesn't even make sense on paper, but because it's been 466 00:23:36,680 --> 00:23:38,520 Speaker 3: going on for so long, you sort of have to think, well, 467 00:23:38,520 --> 00:23:41,320 Speaker 3: maybe there's really a lot more at work, you know, 468 00:23:41,359 --> 00:23:43,800 Speaker 3: whether you want to go look at the spiritual battle 469 00:23:43,840 --> 00:23:46,480 Speaker 3: part of it, or more specifically even the governmental part 470 00:23:46,480 --> 00:23:51,440 Speaker 3: of it and the consolidation of power. So yeah, all 471 00:23:51,440 --> 00:23:53,840 Speaker 3: those things I think come into play because it does 472 00:23:53,960 --> 00:23:57,280 Speaker 3: literally does not make any sense in terms of what. 473 00:23:57,240 --> 00:23:58,760 Speaker 4: They're trying to build. They're not building. 474 00:23:58,520 --> 00:24:01,800 Speaker 3: Anything, They're just can chin continually just tearing and tearing 475 00:24:01,840 --> 00:24:06,240 Speaker 3: and tearing things down. So children are the latest effort 476 00:24:06,359 --> 00:24:09,480 Speaker 3: because they've been sort of left alone up until now. 477 00:24:10,280 --> 00:24:12,200 Speaker 1: Yeah, it's like, the more I think about it throughout 478 00:24:12,200 --> 00:24:18,000 Speaker 1: this conversation, it's almost like the entire intention is to 479 00:24:18,119 --> 00:24:23,960 Speaker 1: push people to believing that they are unfulfilled, that they're unhappy. 480 00:24:24,520 --> 00:24:29,040 Speaker 1: You know, it's it's too really to make people constantly 481 00:24:29,160 --> 00:24:33,400 Speaker 1: yearn for, you know, this unfulfillment in life and try 482 00:24:33,440 --> 00:24:36,119 Speaker 1: to seek things that aren't actually going to bring fulfillment. 483 00:24:36,200 --> 00:24:38,680 Speaker 1: You know, it's it's really just like all a facade 484 00:24:38,680 --> 00:24:39,800 Speaker 1: to make people unhappy. 485 00:24:39,960 --> 00:24:41,840 Speaker 3: I have this one part in the book where I 486 00:24:41,880 --> 00:24:44,080 Speaker 3: talk about these queen bees that you can sort of 487 00:24:44,119 --> 00:24:46,760 Speaker 3: imagine who they might be in the culture that sort 488 00:24:46,800 --> 00:24:51,040 Speaker 3: of rule over everything, And you know, it has become 489 00:24:51,119 --> 00:24:54,440 Speaker 3: sort of a quasi religion where the preaching is really 490 00:24:54,480 --> 00:24:58,520 Speaker 3: about discontent. You know how really if you don't, if 491 00:24:58,560 --> 00:25:01,320 Speaker 3: you don't start out discontent, well they will sure make 492 00:25:01,400 --> 00:25:03,399 Speaker 3: your discontent. They will show you all the areas in 493 00:25:03,440 --> 00:25:06,919 Speaker 3: which your life you want to be discontented by, and 494 00:25:06,960 --> 00:25:10,840 Speaker 3: that that's you know, just comes with the preaching and 495 00:25:10,880 --> 00:25:12,920 Speaker 3: the narrative and what we hear over and over again, 496 00:25:12,960 --> 00:25:15,960 Speaker 3: and so then as a result you actually do actualize 497 00:25:16,480 --> 00:25:20,320 Speaker 3: realities that are are that do create discontent. 498 00:25:20,400 --> 00:25:21,480 Speaker 4: So it just gets worse. 499 00:25:21,520 --> 00:25:23,359 Speaker 3: You know, you can just see it sort of like 500 00:25:24,119 --> 00:25:28,480 Speaker 3: snowballing and becoming almost this, you know, bigger and bigger 501 00:25:28,560 --> 00:25:30,679 Speaker 3: because you started with this discontent that was small and 502 00:25:30,720 --> 00:25:34,960 Speaker 3: then you are actually creating a reality that is more discontented. 503 00:25:35,000 --> 00:25:36,040 Speaker 4: And you know, on and on. 504 00:25:36,359 --> 00:25:42,680 Speaker 1: Quick breaks, stay with us. And the book is out now. 505 00:25:42,680 --> 00:25:45,720 Speaker 1: It's called The End of Woman How smashing the patriarchy 506 00:25:45,840 --> 00:25:49,639 Speaker 1: has destroyed us. Why did you decide to write this book? 507 00:25:49,760 --> 00:25:52,719 Speaker 1: You know what, what kind of what encouraged it? I mean, 508 00:25:52,760 --> 00:25:54,800 Speaker 1: obviously a lot of the discussion we're having, but what 509 00:25:54,960 --> 00:25:55,679 Speaker 1: kind of spurred it? 510 00:25:55,840 --> 00:25:58,960 Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean it's definitely that question of womanhood. I 511 00:25:59,200 --> 00:26:01,640 Speaker 3: feel like we can't we don't. We don't have any 512 00:26:01,720 --> 00:26:04,560 Speaker 3: way to actually speak of womanhood anymore. We don't have 513 00:26:04,680 --> 00:26:07,040 Speaker 3: like the moral categories to think of women in a 514 00:26:07,040 --> 00:26:09,960 Speaker 3: healthy way outside of what you know, telling us to 515 00:26:10,000 --> 00:26:12,439 Speaker 3: be like men or the girl boss or whatever. So 516 00:26:12,480 --> 00:26:15,679 Speaker 3: that was one of the things certainly. You know, I 517 00:26:15,720 --> 00:26:17,480 Speaker 3: have a lot of sympathy for men. I think men 518 00:26:17,520 --> 00:26:21,120 Speaker 3: have really been mistreated by feminism, and I would love 519 00:26:21,240 --> 00:26:22,920 Speaker 3: to say I don't I don't expect men to start 520 00:26:22,960 --> 00:26:24,880 Speaker 3: fighting back because I don't think that's that's the way 521 00:26:24,880 --> 00:26:26,439 Speaker 3: in which they do things. But I would love to 522 00:26:26,440 --> 00:26:29,680 Speaker 3: see them like rise the occasion and become better men 523 00:26:29,720 --> 00:26:32,320 Speaker 3: because of it. And and I think just helping men 524 00:26:32,400 --> 00:26:35,480 Speaker 3: and women understand, like why do we have so many 525 00:26:35,640 --> 00:26:38,919 Speaker 3: of these struggles, you know, and to help us realize like, 526 00:26:39,000 --> 00:26:41,000 Speaker 3: these are not new things. None of this is new. 527 00:26:41,080 --> 00:26:44,919 Speaker 3: It's all been sort of sewn into the to the 528 00:26:45,000 --> 00:26:47,680 Speaker 3: culture because of the ideology for for a very long time. 529 00:26:47,800 --> 00:26:50,680 Speaker 3: So I think being able to see it helps people 530 00:26:50,760 --> 00:26:53,119 Speaker 3: significantly and be able to step out of it, certainly 531 00:26:53,119 --> 00:26:55,800 Speaker 3: in their own lives and in their kids' lives, and 532 00:26:55,880 --> 00:26:57,200 Speaker 3: you know, even in the workplace too. 533 00:26:57,280 --> 00:27:00,000 Speaker 4: So all of that. I also, I don't think there's 534 00:27:00,040 --> 00:27:00,639 Speaker 4: a book like this. 535 00:27:00,800 --> 00:27:04,120 Speaker 3: I think that you know, so many even women whom 536 00:27:04,119 --> 00:27:06,320 Speaker 3: I respect a lot, who do call themselves feminists that 537 00:27:06,359 --> 00:27:09,560 Speaker 3: you know, they usually say, well, the feminist problem started 538 00:27:09,600 --> 00:27:12,239 Speaker 3: with the second wave, and so that was the amazing thing, 539 00:27:12,359 --> 00:27:14,320 Speaker 3: was to go back and say, no, it's it's it's 540 00:27:14,359 --> 00:27:17,080 Speaker 3: a lot older than that, and it's just been this. 541 00:27:17,440 --> 00:27:19,000 Speaker 3: You know, it's been like a brand. It just keeps 542 00:27:19,040 --> 00:27:22,040 Speaker 3: rebranding itself and cycling through and doing the exact same thing, 543 00:27:22,200 --> 00:27:25,480 Speaker 3: only you know, a little bit worse each each go around. 544 00:27:26,200 --> 00:27:27,479 Speaker 3: And I think we're on the edge of it at 545 00:27:27,520 --> 00:27:29,960 Speaker 3: the next iteration of the brand. I think Barbie has 546 00:27:30,000 --> 00:27:32,600 Speaker 3: really ushered that in. I think that was part of 547 00:27:32,640 --> 00:27:34,920 Speaker 3: the intention of the movie was to draw in new 548 00:27:34,960 --> 00:27:39,280 Speaker 3: followers with the very clear signaling the patriarchy's bad and 549 00:27:39,480 --> 00:27:42,359 Speaker 3: women bring order to everything and men are unnecessary. 550 00:27:42,480 --> 00:27:43,840 Speaker 4: You know, there's there's so much. 551 00:27:43,680 --> 00:27:48,400 Speaker 3: In that that movie that you know, my research laid bare, 552 00:27:49,040 --> 00:27:52,320 Speaker 3: and I think that you know, they dressed it up beautifully. 553 00:27:52,359 --> 00:27:56,120 Speaker 3: They it's it's pink, it's nostalgic, it's you know, it's 554 00:27:56,160 --> 00:27:58,000 Speaker 3: it has some tender moments in it, and I think 555 00:27:58,040 --> 00:28:02,040 Speaker 3: that's what we are used to buying into without really realizing, 556 00:28:02,119 --> 00:28:04,639 Speaker 3: like there's a lot of real rot in that that 557 00:28:05,080 --> 00:28:07,120 Speaker 3: we need to just start rejecting out right. 558 00:28:07,160 --> 00:28:08,440 Speaker 4: But anyway, so. 559 00:28:08,400 --> 00:28:10,280 Speaker 3: Hopefully people will be a little bit more aware of 560 00:28:10,800 --> 00:28:13,119 Speaker 3: what it is that they're ingesting and I'd love to 561 00:28:13,160 --> 00:28:13,600 Speaker 3: see people. 562 00:28:13,640 --> 00:28:15,359 Speaker 4: I'd love to see conservatives start. 563 00:28:15,160 --> 00:28:19,320 Speaker 3: Making more films, being more involved in media, being you know, 564 00:28:19,359 --> 00:28:22,639 Speaker 3: a fashion magazine something like this, with things that content 565 00:28:22,680 --> 00:28:24,840 Speaker 3: that women absorb. Because this is the way that we've 566 00:28:24,880 --> 00:28:28,719 Speaker 3: really been destroyed to is by allowing all of the 567 00:28:28,720 --> 00:28:31,080 Speaker 3: media from the left to and pop culture to be 568 00:28:31,240 --> 00:28:34,120 Speaker 3: really taken over by the left. So I think that 569 00:28:34,119 --> 00:28:36,480 Speaker 3: that is one huge step and one huge area rather 570 00:28:36,520 --> 00:28:39,720 Speaker 3: than thinking fit of them is fluff, we could really 571 00:28:39,760 --> 00:28:42,560 Speaker 3: make some great strides with without huge budgets. 572 00:28:42,600 --> 00:28:44,080 Speaker 4: You know, even the movie Sound of Freedom. 573 00:28:44,760 --> 00:28:47,120 Speaker 3: Obviously it's not a feminist film, but it's the kind 574 00:28:47,160 --> 00:28:50,080 Speaker 3: of films that I think could be made that, you know, 575 00:28:50,080 --> 00:28:51,440 Speaker 3: people would really respond to. 576 00:28:51,880 --> 00:28:53,920 Speaker 1: I agree with all that, and I'm fortunate because i 577 00:28:53,960 --> 00:28:57,120 Speaker 1: have three brothers and a great dad, so I've never 578 00:28:57,160 --> 00:29:00,000 Speaker 1: I never, you know, even during all the meat too stuff, 579 00:29:00,040 --> 00:29:02,840 Speaker 1: if I had ever bought into the whole Men are 580 00:29:02,840 --> 00:29:07,680 Speaker 1: inherently evil somehow, when you know women can be too. 581 00:29:07,840 --> 00:29:16,120 Speaker 1: So exactly, Doctor Carrie Gress, this is very interesting. The 582 00:29:16,160 --> 00:29:18,880 Speaker 1: book sounds fascinating. I appreciate you taking the time in 583 00:29:19,000 --> 00:29:19,680 Speaker 1: joining the show. 584 00:29:20,320 --> 00:29:22,320 Speaker 4: My pleasure. Thank you so much for having me. 585 00:29:27,960 --> 00:29:32,000 Speaker 1: That was doctor Terry grest, author of the book The 586 00:29:32,160 --> 00:29:36,000 Speaker 1: End of Woman house smashing. The patriarchy has destroyed Us. 587 00:29:36,120 --> 00:29:40,160 Speaker 1: A really interesting conversation. I hope you enjoyed it as well. 588 00:29:40,200 --> 00:29:42,600 Speaker 1: I know I did. I want to thank John Cassio, 589 00:29:42,720 --> 00:29:44,880 Speaker 1: my producer, for putting the show together. I want to 590 00:29:44,920 --> 00:29:48,080 Speaker 1: thank you guys for listening to the podcast every Monday Thursday, 591 00:29:48,160 --> 00:29:50,720 Speaker 1: but you can listen throughout the week until next time.