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Speaker 1: From Meat Eaters World News headquarters in Bozeman, Montana. This

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Speaker 1: is Cal's wee Can Review with Ryan cal Callahan. Now

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Speaker 1: here's Cal.

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Speaker 2: Hey, what's happening, friends and neighbors. This week's special drop

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Speaker 2: Cal's week in Review, our weekly insertion of extra conservation knowledge.

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Speaker 2: We have a very special guest, someone you may know,

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Speaker 2: Steven Ranella. Steve is not here in his official capacity

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Speaker 2: as like the man at the helm of Meat Eater,

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Speaker 2: but in his capacity as a Teddy Roosevelt Conservation Partnership

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Speaker 2: board member and at risk of talking about a topic

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Speaker 2: that may not seem like a real, oh intriguing area

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Speaker 2: of perview, I guess I don't know.

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Speaker 1: Inquiry inquiry There you go. Some people there might not

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Speaker 1: be dudes at home dying to know about what boards,

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Speaker 1: what what nonprofit boards are all about.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, but you know, folks always want to know about

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Speaker 2: how they can be involved in conservation groups, and we

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Speaker 2: get a ton of that at the ASCAL email. So

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Speaker 2: I thought it'd be good just get do a quick

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Speaker 2: hitter here with old Steve about why the heck a

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Speaker 2: guy who's as busy as he is is on the

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Speaker 2: board of a conservation group which is an unpaid position.

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Speaker 2: You're volunteer. Why you doing it?

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Speaker 1: I'm doing it because, man, it's a it's a big conversation.

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Speaker 1: I'm doing it largely because I was asked. I was

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Speaker 1: invited to do it. I have a ton to say

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Speaker 1: about being on it, but I didn't. I didn't uh

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Speaker 1: pursue it. Now recently I did, Like I was recently

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Speaker 1: at a fundraiser event for a different conservation organization, and

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Speaker 1: I sort of dropped a hint that in the future

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Speaker 1: that would be of interest to me, you know, but

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Speaker 1: with with the TRCP or Theodore Roosevelt Conservation Partnership. They

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Speaker 1: I didn't realize, but I I, you know, maybe I

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Speaker 1: was cultivated as a board member, Like I was invited

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Speaker 1: into certain discussions and did some fundraiser stuff and eventually

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Speaker 1: got the invitation to do it, And without really knowing

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Speaker 1: what it meant to be a board member, I became

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Speaker 1: a board member and I am. There are a lot

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Speaker 1: of different kinds of board members. I see that there's

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Speaker 1: like different roles at board. There's ways to be a

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Speaker 1: valuable board member, and I have I feel like I

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Speaker 1: have a fairly I make a fairly narrow contribution to

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Speaker 1: the board at TRCP, and uh, you.

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Speaker 2: Know, in my experience you're you're referencing. There's board members

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Speaker 2: who are very well connected with people who are in

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Speaker 2: a position to make financial contributions to a nonprofit. There's

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Speaker 2: board members who are well connected, well studied, and can

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Speaker 2: help inform and guide the CEO in policy or marketing

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Speaker 2: decisions for the organization. There's board members who have all

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Speaker 2: of those skills or their their previous jobs gave them

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Speaker 2: an added layer of insight into areas that that your

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Speaker 2: nonprofit that you're exploring works on.

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Speaker 1: Right, So, I'm not sure at the latest count at

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Speaker 1: t RCP there might be about I'm not sure to

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Speaker 1: lays count around twenty four board members. So with TRCP,

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Speaker 1: let's think about that partnership thing for a minute. So,

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Speaker 1: just to help people get up to speed on what

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Speaker 1: TRCP does, I'll start by what they don't do. Okay,

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Speaker 1: you have a bunch of there's a lot of conservation

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Speaker 1: organizations that do a lot of habit like habitat work.

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Speaker 1: They do land transfers, they're very involved on the ground

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Speaker 1: doing on the ground conservation work. Okay, rim Ducks Unlimited

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Speaker 1: National Turkey Federation, like they're doing on the ground habitat work,

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Speaker 1: among many other things, Okay, helping out helping out federal agencies,

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Speaker 1: helping out state agencies like doing you know, down to

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Speaker 1: the business of like removing old fencing or prying.

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Speaker 2: A chainsaw, setting things on fire.

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Speaker 1: Yep, like real on the ground stuff. TRCP is. Trcp's

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Speaker 1: focus is federal policy. So as much as everybody loves

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Speaker 1: this say like that, howeverybody loves to hate lobbyists, you

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Speaker 1: don't really there are lobbyists that work against you, and

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Speaker 1: there's lobbyists that work for you. And TRCP is on

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Speaker 1: the ground in DC, influencing, guiding federal policy for the

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Speaker 1: benefit of hunters and anglers. So we know that that

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Speaker 1: under the Biden administration, there's a lot of spending on infrastructure. Okay,

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Speaker 1: so they're going to have this big pot of money

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Speaker 1: they're going to spend on infrastructure that's already happening. No

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Speaker 1: one's going to stop that. What can be done out

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Speaker 1: of that infrastructure spending when they go to spend that

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Speaker 1: infrastructure money, how can that be guided to be beneficial

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Speaker 1: to wildlife? Okay? How can habitat and wildlife benefit from

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Speaker 1: infrastructure spending? And maybe you know overpasses on migration wildlife

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Speaker 1: migration corridors. Right, another area of federal policy, we have

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Speaker 1: a big thing called the Farm Built, huge piece of

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Speaker 1: legislation that impacts private land conservation all over the place.

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Speaker 2: Many people call it the single largest piece of legislation

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Speaker 2: that impacts conservation. It's the biggest conservation thing that we

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Speaker 2: have in our pocket.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, it's it's like that. At TRCP, conversations about the

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Speaker 1: farm built never go away. How can we influence the

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Speaker 1: crafting of the farm bill to benefit wildlife, to benefit

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Speaker 1: hunters and angers. So that's kind of stuff they work on.

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Speaker 1: Let me give you one more example, the deep Water

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Speaker 1: Horizon oil spill. Okay, when all that money came in

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Speaker 1: for cleanup, how can we how can that money be

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Speaker 1: best spent to rehabilitate fisheries? In that case, money could

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Speaker 1: go in crazy directions, right, like people can find all

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Speaker 1: this like tangential stuff for that money, Like how do

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Speaker 1: we keep that money on task for fisheries? So those

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Speaker 1: would be areas that that the TRCP plays in the

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Speaker 1: partnership is that on certain issues they represent a wide

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Speaker 1: array of conservation organizations. So of those twenty four board members,

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Speaker 1: Becky Humphries, who is running National Wild Turkey Federation, was

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Speaker 1: a board member. She currently is the Becky Humphries is

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Speaker 1: currently they interim interim CEO and president of TRCP, but

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Speaker 1: she at a time ran NWTF and held a board

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Speaker 1: seat at TRCP. So there's a type of board member

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Speaker 1: there right. The CEO, I don't know what the title

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Speaker 1: of the US at Pheasants Forever was a CEO, president's

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Speaker 1: CEO whatever. Howard Vincent very successfully ran Pheasants Forever at

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Speaker 1: the same time he held a board seat at TRCP

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Speaker 1: because they would collaborate together. So that's like a type

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Speaker 1: of board member. At a time. They might have board

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Speaker 1: members who are people from the sporting goods world. Okay,

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Speaker 1: So there's a time when there's a brief period when

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Speaker 1: the CEO of r I was a board member at TIERCP. Okay,

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Speaker 1: So that's another type. So you know, the sporting goods

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Speaker 1: world plays into the conservation space you have that you'll

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Speaker 1: have other donors that there are other board members who

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Speaker 1: are just great financial assets and I don't want to

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Speaker 1: diminish their work. But TRCP has a board member, for instance,

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Speaker 1: of she represents a family endowment. That's a family endowment

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Speaker 1: that invests very heavily in wildlife conservation. She was a

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Speaker 1: board member at TIERCP. There are also board members that

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Speaker 1: are that have great fiscal chops, right, great financial chops.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, that's a great point, right, because boards are typically

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Speaker 2: comprised and there can be extra positions, but you have

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Speaker 2: like an officers group of a board chair, a vice chair, secretary,

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Speaker 2: and a treasurer yep.

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Speaker 1: I think they call the Executive Leadership Committee or something,

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Speaker 1: and those board members are really good at like you're

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Speaker 1: running a business. Right, There's there's banking involved in all

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Speaker 1: kinds of fiscal stuff, and so they bring all this

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Speaker 1: expertise and those are the ones on board calls. You're

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Speaker 1: hearing a lot from them about just like the management

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Speaker 1: of it. Right. What I feel that my role as

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Speaker 1: a board member is fundraising and awareness raising and uh,

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Speaker 1: this is not going to come as news anyone at TERCP,

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Speaker 1: but I'm never going to be more than that. Like

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Speaker 1: that's what that's that's what I am, and that's what

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Speaker 1: I do and that's what I have room for. And

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Speaker 1: so that's where I try to contribute and with Ian.

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Speaker 2: Your uh, your your however you guys do your call,

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Speaker 2: your monthly calls or a couple of months, you know, however,

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Speaker 2: your whatever your schedule is. Though, I imagine, uh, there's

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Speaker 2: room for discussion on how TRCP is going to weigh

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Speaker 2: in on certain issues that I can't imagine you abstain from.

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Speaker 1: Okay, I'll say, yeah, I'll clarify that I get interested

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Speaker 1: in messaging, you know, But all in all, I'm probably

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Speaker 1: not well. I'm not. I have a lot of conflicts

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Speaker 1: to keep me from being involved in a lot of

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Speaker 1: the day to day stuff. I voice opinions about things

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Speaker 1: I try to help with with with messaging and priorities,

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Speaker 1: but for the most part, for the most part, I

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Speaker 1: keep up to speed and what the organization does. I'm

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Speaker 1: supportive of what the organization does. And I have never

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Speaker 1: gone in and had any kind of a hissy fit

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Speaker 1: about anything on why we're talking about this or I

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Speaker 1: don't feel that to be my role. I could picture

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Speaker 1: later in life I might have more room for that,

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Speaker 1: but I just don't want. I don't want to oversell.

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Speaker 1: I don't want to, like, in any way, over sell

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Speaker 1: how I'm involved with it, you know what I mean? Yep.

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Speaker 2: But then one thing that I think people may find

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Speaker 2: interesting right, is like, right now TRCP has has is

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Speaker 2: in a transition period. Had a long time CEO at

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Speaker 2: the helm of TRCP for fifteen years. Yeah, he's stepped down.

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Speaker 2: You're in this interim CEO period, meaning that you have

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Speaker 2: a temporary CEO. There's a search going on trying to

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Speaker 2: find that new leader for the org.

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Speaker 1: I've tried to be involved in that, and that's part of.

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Speaker 2: The duties of a board. So the board can casually

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Speaker 2: be referred to as the boss of the CEO.

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Speaker 1: I don't think. Yeah, maybe people that might not be

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Speaker 1: a thing that's well understood. Is that's an interesting dynamic.

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Speaker 1: It is because that they're governed by a president CEO

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Speaker 1: who is mostly presenting to the board of directors. They're

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Speaker 1: mostly like at the helm, presenting about what they're doing,

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Speaker 1: presenting about priorities, right, and looking for some guidance. But

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Speaker 1: they're like the boss of the room. But they're not right.

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Speaker 1: They serve at the pleasure. They serve at the pleasure

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Speaker 1: of a board, right, And so it does create like

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Speaker 1: you can't become when someone runs a nonprofit, someone runs

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Speaker 1: a nonprofit conservation or gets set up with this structure.

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Speaker 1: They're not a dictator right.

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Speaker 2: Right right, and oftentimes like I'm on the We've covered

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Speaker 2: this a bunch, but I'm on the board. Just just

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Speaker 2: became the chair of the board for back Country Hunters

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Speaker 2: and Anglers. We just went through a very the exact

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Speaker 2: same thing we had. Our longtime CEO stepped down. We

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Speaker 2: went through a search, we interviewed a bunch of candidates,

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Speaker 2: and we have a brand new CEO, Patrick Berry. And

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Speaker 2: it's really interesting this this brand new person of the

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Speaker 2: organization is running the organization, but weekly and for the

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Speaker 2: executive committee and monthly soon to be every other month,

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Speaker 2: kind of presents the organization and in certain aspects kind

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Speaker 2: of asked for permission to say like, Okay, this is

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Speaker 2: where we want to go, what we want to do.

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Speaker 2: How's that sound everybody right? And it's like, okay, have

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Speaker 2: you considered this might be? That's typically the way the

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Speaker 2: board informs. That's that's interesting. I like where you're headed,

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Speaker 2: but have you considered going this path or have you

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Speaker 2: considered asking this partner organization for help. Hopefully that's not

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Speaker 2: too vague for everybody, but that's kind of how we're

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Speaker 2: not there to manage, but it's an oversight.

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Speaker 1: Committee. Yeah, I think that in business too, Like if

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Speaker 1: you're going to put someone forward to do a job,

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Speaker 1: you can't hamstring them with second guessing, you know what

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Speaker 1: I mean, Like like you're there to do a thing.

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Speaker 1: Like if you were going to bring in a really

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Speaker 1: a very effective person to lead an organization and they

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Speaker 1: feel like they're constantly in permission asking mode, you.

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Speaker 2: Could see how they wouldn't be in ass kicking mode.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, it's hard to get it's hard to get effective.

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Speaker 1: So I think that that's I guess that's one of

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Speaker 1: the areas that I don't That's one of the things

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Speaker 1: I don't do a lot of is uh, why aren't

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Speaker 1: you doing this? And why aren't you doing that? I

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Speaker 1: feel like you should be over here. It's just it's

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Speaker 1: just not Later in life, maybe I would have maybe

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Speaker 1: I would be more of a pesky you know, more

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Speaker 1: of a pesky board member. And there's a role for

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Speaker 1: pesky board members and around and around us bringing on

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Speaker 1: a new one and initiating a search for a new

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Speaker 1: CEO at TRSP that brought a lot of board members

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Speaker 1: forward in a way where like a lot of Sunday

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Speaker 1: afternoon phone calls and you know, it was like it

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Speaker 1: demanded a lot of people, right, and so in those moments,

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Speaker 1: I think you do need to be willing to step

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Speaker 1: up because there's nothing worse. You know, this is a

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Speaker 1: little bit contradict my hands off policy. There's nothing worse

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Speaker 1: than being invested in an organization and then later having

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Speaker 1: this like, well, I wish it had been this. I

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Speaker 1: wish you had done that. I wish you hadn't done that.

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Speaker 1: But you were never part of any of those convers stations.

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Speaker 1: But you're a board member and now you've.

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Speaker 2: Had the ability to be a part of right.

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Speaker 1: And you chose not to. And then you do like

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Speaker 1: there's a term I like where someone is called parachuting

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Speaker 1: in someone parachutes into the middle of a conversation that's

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Speaker 1: been going on for a long time, and you have

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Speaker 1: a what in the world, why did anybody? It's like, buddy,

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Speaker 1: there was a lot of conversations about this. You chose

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Speaker 1: not to get involved in it. Now you're gonna have

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Speaker 1: a you're gonna have a fit about this now, and.

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Speaker 2: You're hurting the whole process because now we gotta slow down.

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Speaker 1: And dude's that's not a super helpful board member, which

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Speaker 1: is kind of why I don't. Yeah, I don't. I

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Speaker 1: just I feel like I I as a board member,

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Speaker 1: I feel like I know my role and I'm and

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Speaker 1: I'm aware there's probably some there's probably board members that

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Speaker 1: look and and and they probably feel that I don't

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Speaker 1: maybe pull my weight, but uh later I will. Well.

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Speaker 2: But that's the other thing is like it's a volunteer board,

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Speaker 2: and in these times of transition, when you're asking people

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Speaker 2: to step up, it is it's a lot. And at

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Speaker 2: the end of the day, boards are comprised of a

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Speaker 2: select group of people who are diverse enough in their

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Speaker 2: areas of expertise to where if everybody can contribute something

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Speaker 2: from their area of expertise, it creates this whole package

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Speaker 2: that's going to help guide the ship. That's that's what

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Speaker 2: your group contribution is. And at the base level, that's

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Speaker 2: your responsibility as a as a board member to be like,

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Speaker 2: you know what this is where I can I can

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Speaker 2: chime in if it's appropriate. I've seen this before. Through this,

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Speaker 2: my cards are kind of on the table, and that's

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Speaker 2: going to help guide the conversation on policy or the

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Speaker 2: next fiscal move, or the the logo change or all

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Speaker 2: the all the things that may come across the table.

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Speaker 1: There's someone I'm close to who sits on the board

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Speaker 1: of a nonprofit that's not in the conservation space, totally

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Speaker 1: different area, and it it almost strikes me it's almost crass,

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Speaker 1: this this organization. When you're a bored, they come to

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Speaker 1: you and say, there's a there's an expectation. There's an

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Speaker 1: annual expectation of X dollars. You can give it or

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Speaker 1: you can find it. Yep. But that's the expectation. Yep.

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Speaker 1: And it just lays it lays it right out, dude.

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Speaker 1: It's like, that's what this is ye. And that that

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Speaker 1: is a board that is not a managerial that is

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Speaker 1: not a managerial board. It's not an expert tease board.

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Speaker 1: It's like you get a you get a thing on

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Speaker 1: your resume for X dollars. Yep. It's it feels so transactional.

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Speaker 2: But it's very it's very common.

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Speaker 1: It's probably I'm guessing it probably is common. Yeah, and

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Speaker 1: that thankfully isn't That's not how this organization is run,

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Speaker 1: Like TRSP does not run. That's not my experience. That

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Speaker 1: trs right.

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Speaker 2: So I'd like to just talk because this is such

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Speaker 2: a huge topic. But tr CP on the partnership side

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Speaker 2: of things. When they go in to an elected officials

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Speaker 2: office or even going to the Fish and Wildlife Service

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Speaker 2: or Department of the Interior. Oftentimes they have gone to

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Speaker 2: a ton of the conservation organizations the Trout Unlimited, bha

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Speaker 2: Is Tier or Pheasants, Forever's Mule, their foundation and said, hey,

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Speaker 2: all of these conservation groups and all of these business interests,

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Speaker 2: you know first Light meat eater or of us, all

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Speaker 2: of these business interests and then can even be like

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Speaker 2: endowments foundations are in agreement. Here's our letter that says

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Speaker 2: we're very concerned about the way your department's handling this

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Speaker 2: or what just recently happened in regards to the BLM

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Speaker 2: rules that came out and consequently a big stir up

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Speaker 2: in Congress to knock back some of these rules. A

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Speaker 2: letter was just presented that says, hey, we're in favor

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Speaker 2: of these chains just as we understand them to mean

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Speaker 2: X y Z, which are very beneficial to the conservation

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Speaker 2: of the habitat species, wild lands, waters and access to

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Speaker 2: them type of things. So trying to uh condense the

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Speaker 2: message and condense the power.

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Speaker 1: Yep.

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Speaker 2: And here's a nice little package for you to know

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Speaker 2: that this is how we want you to to follow through. Right.

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Speaker 1: We had a we had a conversation we see with

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Speaker 1: Becky Humphries, who's the inter interim CEO of t RCP,

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Speaker 1: and we were talking about like a an aspect of

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Speaker 1: what you're getting at, which is, so we're gonna have,

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Speaker 1: you know, big election in November, and there's an issue

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Speaker 1: of how are you gonna whatever administration comes in, how

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Speaker 1: do you lay the groundwork and approach and then administration

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Speaker 1: or the continuation of the Biden administration or incoming Trump administration,

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Speaker 1: how does the conservation community come and lay out to

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Speaker 1: the administration. Here's some areas we'd like to cooperate on.

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Speaker 1: Here's some concerns we have. You're going to have certain appointments.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, and by the way, what would you like to

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Speaker 2: accomplish How can we help with that?

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Speaker 1: Yeah? Exactly. And then you're going to make certain appointments.

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Speaker 1: These are some great names we'd love for you to

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Speaker 1: look at for the appointments. That would be people that

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Speaker 1: we're going to interface with on conservation issues. And where's

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Speaker 1: their room to cooperate? Where are we not going to

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Speaker 1: be able to cooperate let's not blindside We don't want

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Speaker 1: to blindside you, right, Like, so heads up, this is

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Speaker 1: gonna be a big issue going forward, even if you

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Speaker 1: know you're not going to get cooperation from an administration,

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Speaker 1: it's considered, you know, a good way to partner and

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Speaker 1: a good way to plan together to say we're going

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Speaker 1: to have friction around this. Don't want to be a surprise,

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Speaker 1: but this is gonna be an area of friction for us.

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Speaker 1: If you're going to continue down the path that you

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Speaker 1: seem you're gonna continue down, we want you to know

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Speaker 1: that that we're gonna probably stand in opposition to you

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Speaker 1: on this. Heads up or is there way you know?

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Speaker 1: So you're you're doing a lot of this at the

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Speaker 1: federal level, You're doing a lot of that relationship building

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Speaker 1: you know, not me, but that the organization is right.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, And it's kind of like the outdoor industry, right Like,

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Speaker 2: the same names kind of pop up in different places

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Speaker 2: throughout a career, and it's good to have that communication.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, right, But yeah, it's funny that way in which

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Speaker 1: that way in which industry gets involved is let's say,

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Speaker 1: let's say you go look at over the years, uh

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Speaker 1: bass pro shops has been up. You know, they've been

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Speaker 1: a TRCP supporter. Uh. Imagine coming from that perspective, you're

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Speaker 1: serving this enormous audience of outdoorsmen who are buying products

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Speaker 1: to hunt and fish to enjoy the outdoors. If you're

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Speaker 1: if you're looking out long range, like any like executive

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Speaker 1: leader should be, You're like, man, I need to pursue that.

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Speaker 1: I need to look out for the interests of my clients,

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Speaker 1: my customers, who they're participating with. My business depends on

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Speaker 1: them having access to these resources going forward. So a

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Speaker 1: long range planning for the business would be, how can

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Speaker 1: I align with the conservation world to make hunting and

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Speaker 1: fishing remain strong in America and to make sure people

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Speaker 1: have places to go boating and go hunting and go fishing,

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Speaker 1: because I need to protect my business long term. And

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Speaker 1: so they get you know, the really forward thinking ones

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Speaker 1: get involved in the conservation thing as not just because

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Speaker 1: it's doing the right thing by the environment, it's doing

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Speaker 1: the right thing by their bottom line. Yeah, the future

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Speaker 1: of your business. Meaning if you sell fishing boats and

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Speaker 1: you know that fishery stocks are declining, Uh, that don't

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Speaker 1: look good for selling fishing boats, you know, and so

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Speaker 1: that's a part of that's like a part of the

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Speaker 1: nonprofit space is like you're partnering with for profit enterprises

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Speaker 1: who are willing to spend money to promote a conservation message.

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Speaker 1: So you see a ton of cooperation between like a

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Speaker 1: nonprofit organization like TRCP and many others and for profit

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Speaker 1: enterprises and they maintain a balance. You know, there's a

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Speaker 1: balance there where it's like they support the mission and

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Speaker 1: do funding, but the conservation organization needs to have the

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Speaker 1: autonomy to not become like an errand boy for the

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Speaker 1: corporate interest. But it's got to be the corporate interest

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Speaker 1: has to say I'm trusting you on these issues to

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Speaker 1: pursue your things, and good leadership maintains that they take

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Speaker 1: the money and stay on task and don't become, like

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Speaker 1: I said, you don't become a corporate errand boy. But

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Speaker 1: there's certain things you're working.

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Speaker 2: On which can involve those exact same conversations that you

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Speaker 2: just outlined, right, like, well, what do you want to accomplish,

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Speaker 2: mister bass Pro or Cabello's or meat eater or whatever. Okay,

390
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Speaker 2: here's where we might have some friction on that, but

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Speaker 2: this is where we agree and that's how you you

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Speaker 2: build out that that trust or that cooperative agreement in

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Speaker 2: the beginning, right sure, and when we.

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Speaker 1: Talk about.

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Speaker 2: You know, we all like like that set it and

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Speaker 2: forget it. Thing like we see the the TRCP sign

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Speaker 2: on letter right where like great, click through it auto

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Speaker 2: fills in your stuff and it goes out. B h

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Speaker 2: A has one, pheasants forever has one. You might do

400
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Speaker 2: a couple because you're getting bombarded for the issue, do

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00:27:05,520 --> 00:27:10,800
Speaker 2: jour and you should do those things. And it helps

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00:27:11,920 --> 00:27:15,159
Speaker 2: all of these organizations say well, yeah, we sent out

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Speaker 2: this is how many people signed on through our sign

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Speaker 2: on letter. When they go and they talk to that

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00:27:20,920 --> 00:27:28,960
Speaker 2: representative or senator, and that person can be like okay, great,

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00:27:29,880 --> 00:27:34,719
Speaker 2: that means something, and then they're going to pivot and

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00:27:34,760 --> 00:27:38,280
Speaker 2: be like, okay, listen, aids, we've heard from the conservation groups.

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00:27:39,320 --> 00:27:43,560
Speaker 2: And then it's like okay, well, actually here's somebody from

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Speaker 2: and I used to do this on the first light

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Speaker 2: side of things. Here's somebody from a business in Idaho.

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Speaker 2: And I'd come in and I'd say, hey, this is

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Speaker 2: what we do. This is how many employees we have,

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Speaker 2: this is where we're located, this is the customer that

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Speaker 2: we sell to. This is their average income kind of

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Speaker 2: you know, give some demographic information and say, by the way,

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Speaker 2: like we don't have a business if you guys push

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Speaker 2: this thing through and it, you know, shuts down access

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Speaker 2: to public lands or divest public lands for for a

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Speaker 2: for instance, and then hopefully you have a bunch of

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Speaker 2: businesses that are empowered to do the same thing. And

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Speaker 2: then they go okay, hey, it's we've heard enough from

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Speaker 2: the business people, and then hopefully there's okay, well the gosh,

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Speaker 2: there's like a soccer mom of four kids here from

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Speaker 2: and she just wants to talk to you, and and

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00:28:46,440 --> 00:28:49,520
Speaker 2: that lady has the same messaging right yep, she's like,

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Speaker 2: this is where we live, this is how much we make,

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Speaker 2: this is what we do on the weekends.

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Speaker 1: It means a lot to us that that business thing

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Speaker 1: you see is a thing you see played a lot

430
00:28:59,400 --> 00:29:01,720
Speaker 1: and like our business, our company is signed on to

431
00:29:01,840 --> 00:29:04,160
Speaker 1: some of these I know TRCP has put somebody together

432
00:29:04,240 --> 00:29:08,560
Speaker 1: where that speaks to certain people in the political spectrum.

433
00:29:08,600 --> 00:29:12,960
Speaker 1: Meaning when you do those robo letters, let's be honest,

434
00:29:13,280 --> 00:29:18,240
Speaker 1: no one's reading those letters. They're put them in two piles. Yay, nay, right,

435
00:29:18,280 --> 00:29:20,920
Speaker 1: they're putting in two piles. Now. The business thing is,

436
00:29:21,040 --> 00:29:23,440
Speaker 1: I feel is a little bit different, where if there's

437
00:29:23,480 --> 00:29:27,360
Speaker 1: an issue and you can come and be like, you know,

438
00:29:27,520 --> 00:29:33,320
Speaker 1: here's two hundred and fifty businesses that are saying this

439
00:29:33,480 --> 00:29:37,560
Speaker 1: conservation issue is gonna impact our bottom line and impact

440
00:29:37,560 --> 00:29:41,520
Speaker 1: our ability to create jobs and keep jobs, which is

441
00:29:41,960 --> 00:29:45,240
Speaker 1: X amount of jobs, yeah, and it's X amount of revenue.

442
00:29:47,920 --> 00:29:50,840
Speaker 1: That that speaks a lot like if there's an invasive

443
00:29:50,880 --> 00:29:56,160
Speaker 1: species that's gonna destroy, you know, a fishery, and then

444
00:29:56,240 --> 00:29:59,000
Speaker 1: all those businesses that contribute to that fishery say like,

445
00:29:59,040 --> 00:30:00,800
Speaker 1: hey man, I don't care what you gotta do, take

446
00:30:00,800 --> 00:30:03,040
Speaker 1: care of this problem because you're hurting our bottom line

447
00:30:03,040 --> 00:30:05,480
Speaker 1: here or potentially can destroy my business, and that's gonna

448
00:30:05,480 --> 00:30:08,120
Speaker 1: be a hard conversation for us to have. It just

449
00:30:08,160 --> 00:30:12,480
Speaker 1: speaks to a different political mentality.

450
00:30:12,000 --> 00:30:14,000
Speaker 2: Yeah, because we all like to put things in buckets,

451
00:30:14,160 --> 00:30:17,040
Speaker 2: right and be like, Okay, well I got the boat people,

452
00:30:17,360 --> 00:30:20,480
Speaker 2: and it's like, oh, it turns out there's also the

453
00:30:20,960 --> 00:30:24,480
Speaker 2: bird watching people and it's all tied into the same thing.

454
00:30:24,920 --> 00:30:28,600
Speaker 2: And then pretty soon the ideal scenario is like every

455
00:30:28,720 --> 00:30:33,719
Speaker 2: pivot that person makes, they get the same story. From

456
00:30:34,440 --> 00:30:37,760
Speaker 2: what at least appears to be a very different slice

457
00:30:37,800 --> 00:30:38,880
Speaker 2: that political pie.

458
00:30:39,080 --> 00:30:41,800
Speaker 1: Yep. And picture those situations where you're like, I got

459
00:30:41,840 --> 00:30:44,760
Speaker 1: the bird watchers on my case about this, I got

460
00:30:44,840 --> 00:30:47,520
Speaker 1: the hunters on my case about this. I got the

461
00:30:47,600 --> 00:30:49,560
Speaker 1: damn Marinas on my case.

462
00:30:49,720 --> 00:30:52,520
Speaker 2: Yes, exactly, the people who love wolves, the people who

463
00:30:52,600 --> 00:30:55,080
Speaker 2: hate wolves, that you know, and then all of a

464
00:30:55,120 --> 00:30:58,240
Speaker 2: sudden they're like, turns out we're crazy, like it was.

465
00:30:58,440 --> 00:31:02,120
Speaker 2: It turns out we wasn't amed idea or however it gets.

466
00:31:01,920 --> 00:31:04,520
Speaker 1: Spil out exactly like I got everybody pissed off of me.

467
00:31:04,600 --> 00:31:06,720
Speaker 1: Now we're gonna walk away from this idea. And that

468
00:31:06,760 --> 00:31:09,520
Speaker 1: what we really saw, Like I think the great example

469
00:31:09,560 --> 00:31:12,280
Speaker 1: we saw that and it was a real is around

470
00:31:12,280 --> 00:31:20,720
Speaker 1: twenty fifteen twenty sixteen the movement around divestiture of public lands,

471
00:31:21,080 --> 00:31:24,360
Speaker 1: which which comes up now, and then you know, there

472
00:31:24,400 --> 00:31:26,360
Speaker 1: was there was a version of it in the eighties,

473
00:31:26,400 --> 00:31:28,360
Speaker 1: there was a version of it in the twenty teens,

474
00:31:28,680 --> 00:31:31,160
Speaker 1: a big push and it was one of those areas

475
00:31:31,200 --> 00:31:42,800
Speaker 1: where you saw almost universal disapproval from conservation organizations at

476
00:31:42,840 --> 00:31:45,600
Speaker 1: a grassroots level, disapproval of that plan, and then a

477
00:31:45,720 --> 00:31:52,000
Speaker 1: real pushback from the outdoor industry around that plan and

478
00:31:52,000 --> 00:31:54,480
Speaker 1: and that push. I mean it lived down in some ways,

479
00:31:54,480 --> 00:31:57,400
Speaker 1: but that push kind of like rose and died yep, right,

480
00:31:57,480 --> 00:32:01,400
Speaker 1: because there was a great coalescing of forces and a

481
00:32:01,400 --> 00:32:05,520
Speaker 1: great coalescing of conservation boards that really just came out

482
00:32:05,560 --> 00:32:09,200
Speaker 1: and showed how unpopular that idea was. And we don't

483
00:32:09,200 --> 00:32:12,080
Speaker 1: see that a ton you know that we saw it

484
00:32:12,120 --> 00:32:13,360
Speaker 1: with Pebble Mind.

485
00:32:14,080 --> 00:32:19,560
Speaker 2: Meaning like not that many the broad diverse coalition that

486
00:32:19,640 --> 00:32:24,479
Speaker 2: came together on that issued doesn't happen for every issue.

487
00:32:24,600 --> 00:32:26,800
Speaker 1: No, you don't see it come up in my recollection.

488
00:32:26,920 --> 00:32:30,400
Speaker 1: I can think of in my recollection, I can I

489
00:32:30,440 --> 00:32:36,160
Speaker 1: can think of Pebble Mind being like industry environmental groups

490
00:32:36,400 --> 00:32:42,200
Speaker 1: hunter Angler groups right, and an around divestry of public land.

491
00:32:42,280 --> 00:32:47,600
Speaker 1: I feel like there was like industry environmental groups, hunter

492
00:32:47,680 --> 00:32:52,000
Speaker 1: angler groups right really made it just made it very

493
00:32:52,040 --> 00:32:55,240
Speaker 1: clear their displeasure with that plan became very clear.

494
00:32:55,520 --> 00:33:00,000
Speaker 2: Yeah, which is awesome to have those moments of being like, Okay,

495
00:33:00,120 --> 00:33:02,280
Speaker 2: we're all in this, in this thing together.

496
00:33:02,440 --> 00:33:06,400
Speaker 1: Yeah, right. And at other times you see and other

497
00:33:06,440 --> 00:33:08,320
Speaker 1: times you see something different play out. And I have

498
00:33:08,400 --> 00:33:13,520
Speaker 1: been witness to I don't want to get into detail

499
00:33:13,520 --> 00:33:15,680
Speaker 1: about this, but talking about being on a board of

500
00:33:15,720 --> 00:33:20,440
Speaker 1: a nonprofit. I'm not saying anything I shouldn't say, because

501
00:33:20,480 --> 00:33:23,920
Speaker 1: this is of course, this is true. There are areas

502
00:33:24,200 --> 00:33:29,040
Speaker 1: where there's you hit, areas of internal conflict. There are areas,

503
00:33:29,080 --> 00:33:32,520
Speaker 1: like I've been privy to conversations. I don't want to

504
00:33:32,520 --> 00:33:34,880
Speaker 1: get into specifics on it, just out of respect for

505
00:33:34,920 --> 00:33:37,960
Speaker 1: the organization, but there are there are these kind of

506
00:33:38,000 --> 00:33:43,280
Speaker 1: like general areas of friction yep, among board members, which

507
00:33:43,280 --> 00:33:48,080
Speaker 1: should be expected, it should be healthy. But like policy

508
00:33:48,600 --> 00:33:53,720
Speaker 1: driven things where this group of twenty four board members

509
00:33:54,960 --> 00:34:03,280
Speaker 1: have varying opinions about certain issues yep. And that I

510
00:34:03,360 --> 00:34:07,280
Speaker 1: see can cause you know, a slowness of movement.

511
00:34:08,360 --> 00:34:10,560
Speaker 2: But you could argue too, like that's the way a

512
00:34:10,640 --> 00:34:12,120
Speaker 2: board should be constructed.

513
00:34:12,360 --> 00:34:13,600
Speaker 1: How would you not want it that way?

514
00:34:13,920 --> 00:34:14,200
Speaker 2: Right?

515
00:34:14,400 --> 00:34:16,120
Speaker 1: Because it's not a rubber I guess I pointed out,

516
00:34:16,200 --> 00:34:19,560
Speaker 1: it's not a rubber stamp committee. Yeah, And there's a

517
00:34:19,560 --> 00:34:22,440
Speaker 1: lot of things, like you know, like a president of

518
00:34:22,440 --> 00:34:25,200
Speaker 1: an organization, like they have to make a higher. Of

519
00:34:25,239 --> 00:34:27,040
Speaker 1: course they want some input. By that point, the person

520
00:34:27,040 --> 00:34:29,040
Speaker 1: needs to be able to make the damn higher, yep.

521
00:34:29,680 --> 00:34:31,640
Speaker 1: They that could spend six months arguing about it. Like

522
00:34:31,680 --> 00:34:33,600
Speaker 1: at some point you're like, okay, you got what you need,

523
00:34:33,800 --> 00:34:35,640
Speaker 1: you know, make your decision. We're gonna agree with your

524
00:34:35,680 --> 00:34:38,080
Speaker 1: decision and move on or spending or like they're gonna

525
00:34:38,120 --> 00:34:41,319
Speaker 1: switch from that. You know, they're gonna switch from this

526
00:34:41,400 --> 00:34:43,680
Speaker 1: lease to that least. It's like let your opinion, you known,

527
00:34:43,800 --> 00:34:45,880
Speaker 1: let the person do their job. But there's some issues

528
00:34:45,920 --> 00:34:50,480
Speaker 1: I and you know, there are some issues that become

529
00:34:50,760 --> 00:34:53,600
Speaker 1: like you know, there's things that are wound up being

530
00:34:53,680 --> 00:34:57,040
Speaker 1: very long term discussions about how to approach issue and

531
00:34:57,080 --> 00:34:58,319
Speaker 1: that is carried on.

532
00:34:58,680 --> 00:35:02,719
Speaker 2: Right, We're gonna make a a national level policy on

533
00:35:03,360 --> 00:35:07,720
Speaker 2: we just talked about like emerging technologies, right, and it's like, well, okay,

534
00:35:08,239 --> 00:35:12,120
Speaker 2: if we want to make that policy on a BHA

535
00:35:12,400 --> 00:35:19,440
Speaker 2: national level, that may not sit very well with our

536
00:35:19,520 --> 00:35:23,400
Speaker 2: corporate partners who make that particular technology.

537
00:35:23,600 --> 00:35:24,839
Speaker 1: Yeah, are we.

538
00:35:25,000 --> 00:35:28,120
Speaker 2: Taking that into consideration and how do we feel about that? Right?

539
00:35:28,760 --> 00:35:33,000
Speaker 1: Yeah? That would be just speaking generally of conservation organizations,

540
00:35:33,560 --> 00:35:35,520
Speaker 1: that might be one up being like a pretty interesting

541
00:35:35,560 --> 00:35:38,880
Speaker 1: litmus test if you're in a if you're in the

542
00:35:40,440 --> 00:35:43,719
Speaker 1: at a board level, the conservation group is when you

543
00:35:43,760 --> 00:35:45,960
Speaker 1: do wind up in a situation where you need to

544
00:35:46,000 --> 00:35:51,320
Speaker 1: take a policy position that's going to sit at odds

545
00:35:51,400 --> 00:35:55,400
Speaker 1: with a major contributor. Yep, and listen, man, I'm not

546
00:35:55,440 --> 00:35:58,880
Speaker 1: discrediting either of these perspectives because they're real. The real

547
00:36:00,160 --> 00:36:02,600
Speaker 1: is do you say, you know, there's plenty of other

548
00:36:02,640 --> 00:36:07,560
Speaker 1: stuff we can do. Why have the friction? Why upset

549
00:36:07,600 --> 00:36:12,759
Speaker 1: a corporate sponsor? We have our our second and third

550
00:36:12,800 --> 00:36:16,240
Speaker 1: most important issue. Let's just pursue those and not upset

551
00:36:16,280 --> 00:36:21,400
Speaker 1: this balance. We have a funding or. You can say,

552
00:36:21,600 --> 00:36:25,439
Speaker 1: we need to do what's right by our mission, what's

553
00:36:25,560 --> 00:36:30,319
Speaker 1: right by you know, the people, all the thousands of

554
00:36:30,400 --> 00:36:33,560
Speaker 1: individual donors we have, and we're gonna do this thing

555
00:36:33,600 --> 00:36:37,600
Speaker 1: that's going to make a corporate sponsor uncomfortable. That's tough, man.

556
00:36:37,920 --> 00:36:39,719
Speaker 1: And like I said, I'm not saying that. You know,

557
00:36:39,800 --> 00:36:43,479
Speaker 1: it's simplistic to say you should always go it should

558
00:36:43,480 --> 00:36:44,600
Speaker 1: always go one direction or the.

559
00:36:44,600 --> 00:36:50,120
Speaker 2: Other, that that one direction of what's right could also

560
00:36:50,160 --> 00:36:56,080
Speaker 2: be unattainable, and the others and the B and c's

561
00:36:56,960 --> 00:37:00,400
Speaker 2: are like going to create a greater good for the

562
00:37:00,440 --> 00:37:03,840
Speaker 2: long run in and of themselves. So yeah, it's not

563
00:37:04,520 --> 00:37:11,600
Speaker 2: the classic black and white right. So what's your elevator's

564
00:37:11,640 --> 00:37:14,879
Speaker 2: speech for TRCP, Like if you bump into somebody at

565
00:37:14,880 --> 00:37:16,640
Speaker 2: the airport and you're on your way to the board

566
00:37:16,680 --> 00:37:20,000
Speaker 2: meeting and they're like, oh, why would buy throw a

567
00:37:20,000 --> 00:37:21,120
Speaker 2: couple of bucks towards.

568
00:37:20,840 --> 00:37:25,399
Speaker 1: TRCP advocating on behalf of hunters and anglers in DC

569
00:37:25,680 --> 00:37:28,120
Speaker 1: with federal politicians and federal policy.

570
00:37:27,760 --> 00:37:30,319
Speaker 2: Makers boots on the ground in DC.

571
00:37:30,520 --> 00:37:36,360
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, that we're here here, the policy makers, lawmakers,

572
00:37:36,480 --> 00:37:41,640
Speaker 1: legislators are hearing the perspective of hunters and anglers from

573
00:37:41,680 --> 00:37:47,800
Speaker 1: a measured, balanced, intelligent organization that is not looking to

574
00:37:47,840 --> 00:37:53,640
Speaker 1: play gotcha, not looking to embarrass you, right, not looking

575
00:37:53,640 --> 00:37:56,640
Speaker 1: to make a big, a big press release trying to

576
00:37:56,680 --> 00:37:59,759
Speaker 1: shame you, but like, how can we work together? Here's

577
00:37:59,760 --> 00:38:03,239
Speaker 1: the thing that are important to us. Which of these

578
00:38:03,280 --> 00:38:05,920
Speaker 1: things in front of you can we both win on

579
00:38:07,800 --> 00:38:12,360
Speaker 1: and be helpful partners. That's there's a lot of things

580
00:38:12,600 --> 00:38:16,560
Speaker 1: like that. Is not to discredit people out rolling up

581
00:38:17,560 --> 00:38:22,879
Speaker 1: old fence and doing grasslands work and doing wetlands work

582
00:38:23,160 --> 00:38:27,400
Speaker 1: and putting in boat launches, right, all of that's important.

583
00:38:27,680 --> 00:38:28,640
Speaker 1: All that's important.

584
00:38:28,680 --> 00:38:30,840
Speaker 2: And you're not saying you can't contribute there too.

585
00:38:30,800 --> 00:38:34,919
Speaker 1: Right now. It's just that like this organization is doing

586
00:38:34,960 --> 00:38:40,560
Speaker 1: an essential thing which is guiding federal policy, influencing federal

587
00:38:40,600 --> 00:38:45,520
Speaker 1: policy and being you know, boots on the ground in DC.

588
00:38:46,400 --> 00:38:49,080
Speaker 2: And is there a thing at the at the DC

589
00:38:49,320 --> 00:38:54,080
Speaker 2: level right now that you feel strongly about or people

590
00:38:54,080 --> 00:38:54,920
Speaker 2: should be aware of.

591
00:38:55,480 --> 00:38:59,440
Speaker 1: Yeah, a lot of involvement, just some just recently. Some

592
00:38:59,480 --> 00:39:01,759
Speaker 1: things that there's been a ton of involvement on is

593
00:39:01,800 --> 00:39:06,120
Speaker 1: like the perennial Farm Bill, so getting conservation money and

594
00:39:06,160 --> 00:39:11,120
Speaker 1: also federal access dollars, So federal dollars to increase access

595
00:39:11,120 --> 00:39:16,640
Speaker 1: for hunters and anglers, getting appropriate thing for getting CRP

596
00:39:16,960 --> 00:39:21,640
Speaker 1: or Conservation reserve program stuff in place. Helping private landowners

597
00:39:21,640 --> 00:39:24,279
Speaker 1: who want to do the right thing by conservation on

598
00:39:24,320 --> 00:39:28,239
Speaker 1: their private lands, helping them have funding and expertise to

599
00:39:28,360 --> 00:39:31,560
Speaker 1: do private lands wildlife conservation. And again most of the

600
00:39:31,560 --> 00:39:35,200
Speaker 1: country it's private property. We spent a lot of time

601
00:39:35,239 --> 00:39:37,399
Speaker 1: in the West time about public lands, public lands, public lands.

602
00:39:37,400 --> 00:39:41,960
Speaker 1: But meanwhile, east of the Mississippi, let's be honest, conservation

603
00:39:42,120 --> 00:39:47,680
Speaker 1: happens on private ground. Okay, So having dollars, yeah, you know,

604
00:39:48,080 --> 00:39:51,959
Speaker 1: having that expertise there anir thing with Again, another big

605
00:39:52,000 --> 00:39:56,279
Speaker 1: thing was infrastructure. Another big thing is climate spending. So

606
00:39:57,920 --> 00:40:00,000
Speaker 1: and I don't give you how you feel about climate spending.

607
00:40:00,120 --> 00:40:06,280
Speaker 1: Money is getting spent on alternatives, Okay, we're they're doing solar,

608
00:40:07,239 --> 00:40:10,360
Speaker 1: they're doing wind, and there's a lot of federal money

609
00:40:10,400 --> 00:40:14,480
Speaker 1: going to subsidize those industries. Are those industries and this

610
00:40:14,680 --> 00:40:19,319
Speaker 1: explosion of spending around renewables, Are those renewable dollars going

611
00:40:19,400 --> 00:40:24,480
Speaker 1: to be used in a way that is less harmful

612
00:40:26,360 --> 00:40:30,759
Speaker 1: to wildlife? As we develop resources, develop landscapes for alternatives,

613
00:40:30,760 --> 00:40:32,839
Speaker 1: how can we guide this in a way that's beneficial

614
00:40:33,360 --> 00:40:38,160
Speaker 1: or less destructive on wildlife habitat. That's a big thing

615
00:40:38,200 --> 00:40:39,719
Speaker 1: happened at the federal level right now.

616
00:40:40,520 --> 00:40:47,960
Speaker 2: And last thing, all of which I should say everything

617
00:40:47,960 --> 00:40:54,439
Speaker 2: that Steve just said hundred percent, like you have got

618
00:40:54,440 --> 00:40:57,680
Speaker 2: to be the classic saying of like if you're not

619
00:40:58,760 --> 00:41:02,520
Speaker 2: at the table, you're on the menu. Every single one

620
00:41:02,560 --> 00:41:05,960
Speaker 2: of those points that Steve are issues that Steve just

621
00:41:05,960 --> 00:41:08,080
Speaker 2: brought up is something we all need to be paying

622
00:41:08,120 --> 00:41:10,759
Speaker 2: attention to and weigh in on. But the last thing,

623
00:41:11,960 --> 00:41:14,520
Speaker 2: if somebody were to approach you and say, hey, do

624
00:41:14,520 --> 00:41:16,640
Speaker 2: you want to be on the board for this nonprofit?

625
00:41:19,160 --> 00:41:20,360
Speaker 2: What would be your two cents?

626
00:41:20,400 --> 00:41:24,239
Speaker 1: Like, would you say, I would be you're talking from

627
00:41:24,239 --> 00:41:28,799
Speaker 1: an advice standpoint. Yeah, man, I would do this. I

628
00:41:28,840 --> 00:41:39,439
Speaker 1: would get really granular about expectations and a realistic look

629
00:41:39,480 --> 00:41:46,000
Speaker 1: at what you can do and is what exactly is

630
00:41:46,040 --> 00:41:51,600
Speaker 1: being asked to me? How will I succeed? And then

631
00:41:51,640 --> 00:41:53,879
Speaker 1: a self examination of am I going to be able

632
00:41:53,880 --> 00:41:56,520
Speaker 1: to deliver that? And go into it where you understand

633
00:41:56,600 --> 00:41:58,200
Speaker 1: what's being asked of you and you know that you

634
00:41:58,200 --> 00:42:00,799
Speaker 1: have the capacity to deliver on it because you don't

635
00:42:00,800 --> 00:42:04,359
Speaker 1: want to become a you don't want to become dead

636
00:42:04,360 --> 00:42:07,640
Speaker 1: weight on an organization. You're filling up a seat and

637
00:42:07,880 --> 00:42:10,880
Speaker 1: you're not bringing it. So like, man would love to help.

638
00:42:11,239 --> 00:42:15,239
Speaker 1: What are you thinking here? My like, how can I

639
00:42:15,280 --> 00:42:18,160
Speaker 1: be most beneficial? And then ask yourself can I deliver

640
00:42:18,280 --> 00:42:22,960
Speaker 1: on that promise? And also you should probably familiarize yourself

641
00:42:25,080 --> 00:42:29,160
Speaker 1: with the policy stances right and know what you're getting into.

642
00:42:30,120 --> 00:42:33,120
Speaker 2: Now, where's the organization at what's the health of the organization?

643
00:42:33,320 --> 00:42:36,960
Speaker 1: Yeah? And then and then you know, can you do

644
00:42:37,000 --> 00:42:40,360
Speaker 1: you feel that you can be generally supportive of the

645
00:42:40,480 --> 00:42:43,200
Speaker 1: organization or do you feel that the organization would need

646
00:42:43,239 --> 00:42:48,200
Speaker 1: to change fundamentally in order to make you comfortable? And

647
00:42:48,200 --> 00:42:51,920
Speaker 1: then are you really in the position to change an

648
00:42:52,000 --> 00:42:55,800
Speaker 1: organization fundamentally, or are you able to come on board

649
00:42:55,840 --> 00:42:59,080
Speaker 1: and be comfortable support in the organization and not become

650
00:42:59,120 --> 00:43:00,840
Speaker 1: on board and be like yeah yeah, but yeah but

651
00:43:01,640 --> 00:43:04,880
Speaker 1: all the time. Yeah, and sometimes that's helpful, but like

652
00:43:04,960 --> 00:43:07,960
Speaker 1: coming in the door, you know, it's probably a good

653
00:43:08,000 --> 00:43:09,480
Speaker 1: idea to be comfortable with the organization.

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00:43:10,000 --> 00:43:13,719
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean, because you're you're expected, if you're going

655
00:43:13,760 --> 00:43:17,960
Speaker 2: to be at that level, to be an overall supporter

656
00:43:18,160 --> 00:43:20,520
Speaker 2: of the organization and be able to like wear that

657
00:43:20,640 --> 00:43:23,920
Speaker 2: on your sleeve, right Yeah, yeah, yep, because kind of

658
00:43:24,000 --> 00:43:29,840
Speaker 2: recruitment for what the organization does and kind of like that.

659
00:43:29,920 --> 00:43:35,879
Speaker 2: Grassroots marketing is a very base level ask so much

660
00:43:35,920 --> 00:43:40,400
Speaker 2: so that it's it's very much inferred, right, So Steve,

661
00:43:40,440 --> 00:43:42,920
Speaker 2: you got to go, man, I gotta go. Thank you

662
00:43:42,960 --> 00:43:49,680
Speaker 2: so much, uh Gang Teddy Roosevelt Conservation Partnership, and keep

663
00:43:50,120 --> 00:43:52,839
Speaker 2: writing in and asking what you want to know and

664
00:43:52,880 --> 00:43:54,960
Speaker 2: who we need to talk to a s k c

665
00:43:55,120 --> 00:43:57,839
Speaker 2: a L. That's Askcal at the meat Eater dot com.

666
00:43:57,880 --> 00:43:59,600
Speaker 2: Thanks again, We'll talk to you next week.

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00:43:59,640 --> 00:44:03,480
Speaker 1: Guys.

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Speaker 2: Expect at a t in action after the DATASA