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Speaker 1: Welcome to How the Money. I'm Joel, I am Matt,

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Speaker 1: and today we're answering your listener questions.

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Speaker 2: You know, abuddy, it is Monday, and I am excited

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Speaker 2: to hear from multiple how to Money listeners. Today. We've

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Speaker 2: got a listener who is interested in shifting his investments

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Speaker 2: towards gold. He's looking to diversify. But is he doing

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Speaker 2: it for the right reasons? And is this something we'd recommend.

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Speaker 2: We'll get to that one. Another listener is looking to

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Speaker 2: avoid a potential student loan repayment scam, so we'll cover

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Speaker 2: the details there. And someone else is unimpressed with some

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Speaker 2: of the returns that he's gotten from his robo advisor.

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Speaker 2: Is it the fault of the algorithm? Is he to blame?

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Speaker 2: Or maybe there's something else going on, Joel that we

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Speaker 2: can get to as we answer his question.

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Speaker 1: Do you feel like a private eye when it comes

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Speaker 1: to that question? Like the Sherlock Holmes trying to uncover

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Speaker 1: this mystery?

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Speaker 2: Do you think you'd make a good private investigator? Now?

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Speaker 2: I don't.

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Speaker 1: My attention to detail is lacking. Like you would be

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Speaker 1: great at that. You would be a good gum shoe.

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Speaker 1: You'd be like seeing the details.

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Speaker 2: I would like to think I would be I don't

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Speaker 2: know if I actually.

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Speaker 1: Of a footprint, and you'd be like, he wandered off

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Speaker 1: that way.

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Speaker 2: There's a It's funny because there's a dive bar near

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Speaker 2: where we live and I didn't even notice this, but

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Speaker 2: there's a private eye that's evidently above that that bar

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Speaker 2: that the lady our wives brought to my attention. I'm like, wait,

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Speaker 2: what are you talking about. They're like, have you never

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Speaker 2: seen the sign? And they specialize in relational investigation. They're

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Speaker 2: totally like having us followed. I hope you know. It

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Speaker 2: seems like that. It's the kind of private eye that

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Speaker 2: keeps an eye on the other partner, that kind of thing.

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Speaker 2: And I was like, wait a minute, it's like that show.

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Speaker 2: Why is this? Is this something you're considering? What's going

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Speaker 2: on here? I felt like I was missing a big

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Speaker 2: part of the story. Yeah, I got nothing to hide. Yeah,

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Speaker 2: bring it on.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, all right, real quick, before we get into the

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Speaker 1: list of our questions, I just wanted to mention Jonathan Clements,

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Speaker 1: who you start for the Wall Street Journal, has a

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Speaker 1: website called The Humble Dollar. He's such a fantastic dude.

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Speaker 1: He's been detailing recently on the Humble Dollar, his bout

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Speaker 1: with cancers, diagnosis with cancer, and the fact that he

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Speaker 1: doesn't have much longer to live, and I just like

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Speaker 1: really appreciate, by the way, like how honest and forthcoming

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Speaker 1: he's been with the struggle that is, and and just

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Speaker 1: kind of the all the money stuff that goes along

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Speaker 1: with it too. Not on that note, though, he had

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Speaker 1: an article on his website about how people should track

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Speaker 1: allow their insurance companies to track their driving because they

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Speaker 1: can save big dollars.

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Speaker 2: He's still focusing on the thing that he loves, which

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Speaker 2: is personal finance and investing, so sometimes he covers that

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Speaker 2: overlap even in the midst of it all.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, and then sometimes it's like just random money saving

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Speaker 1: articles still and yeah, I know, I think last time

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Speaker 1: we talked about this, we got a lot of pushback

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Speaker 1: and people were saying, like, I don't want that in

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Speaker 1: invasion of privacy in my life, dude. But like the

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Speaker 1: truth is, you can potentially save quite a bit of money.

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Speaker 1: Typically when you have your driving tracked by your insurance company,

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Speaker 1: you don't stand to lose anything. You can only save money,

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Speaker 1: supposedly based on what they tell you. And I think

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Speaker 1: if you drive cautiously not.

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Speaker 2: You might end up being part of the class actual

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Speaker 2: loss where you'll get paid seventy seven dollars and ten years.

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Speaker 2: That's a good point.

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Speaker 1: That's a good point. But I do think like, if

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Speaker 1: you drive relatively reasonably well, you should consider it, just

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Speaker 1: especially with what's happening with insurance traits these days.

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Speaker 3: Yeah.

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Speaker 2: On a related note, having kids also makes you drive

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Speaker 2: more carefully, Joe. I don't know if you've noticed this,

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Speaker 2: but do your kids yell at other drivers or like

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Speaker 2: if we're if you're waiting in line and the light

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Speaker 2: turns green, are they're like, go buddy, the like's greed.

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Speaker 2: They start saying that.

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Speaker 1: No, they like to mess with pedestrians sometimes, like just

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Speaker 1: yell at them randomly out the window, which is terrible.

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Speaker 2: I tell them this, stop. They're a nuisance. They are

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Speaker 2: those kids. They're those kids. They like throwing like empty

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Speaker 2: as you drive by. No, they don't do that, but

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Speaker 2: it came on beer kids. It's half enjoyed. Capri Son's right.

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Speaker 1: No, they think they're funny. They think they're funny, and

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Speaker 1: they make try to make funny comments as we're driving

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Speaker 1: by and I'm like they don't think that's funny.

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Speaker 2: They you just scared. You need you need to stop that. Yeah, well,

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Speaker 2: well maybe I am confessing what it is that I say,

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Speaker 2: because our kids learn from us, you know, like there

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Speaker 2: are little sponges. And I've known this forever, but I'm

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Speaker 2: realizing that more and more they're learning how to drive

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Speaker 2: based on how I drive, and it's causing me, like truly,

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Speaker 2: to drive more carefully when they're in the vehicle, which

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Speaker 2: should probably be the case anyway, but typically you're just

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Speaker 2: trying to get from point A to point B, but

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Speaker 2: paying more attention to the speed limit, not trying to

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Speaker 2: eke in under that light that's turning yellow from yellow

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Speaker 2: to red. I guess I'm pointing out additional accountability that's

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Speaker 2: taking place by having kids in the car, maybe not

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Speaker 2: unlike having your driving monitored. Buy an insurance company. So

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Speaker 2: if you don't have.

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Speaker 1: A kid, steal a nephew or a niece or something

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Speaker 1: like that, let them ride along with you. Either that

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Speaker 1: or put in one of these I don't know, monitoring systems.

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Speaker 2: Right, Joel loves it when the Amberillers go out to

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Speaker 2: everybody after he's stolen his nephew he's fine, he's with me.

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Speaker 2: Do you remember what it was like coming home from

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Speaker 2: the hospital for the first time with your first baby? Yeah,

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Speaker 2: how carefully you're driving. It's so funny how things just

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Speaker 2: change and you have a couple of kids and you

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Speaker 2: don't think about it as much. But like, I've never

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Speaker 2: driven so carefully and sell on eggshells and so like,

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Speaker 2: right at the speed limit in the far right lane

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Speaker 2: on the interstate, making sure that I was doing everything

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Speaker 2: I can to not get hit. But I think having

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Speaker 2: more of that mentality because not only will it help

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Speaker 2: when it comes to insurance, I guess, but also just

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Speaker 2: the wear and tear on your vehicle, man, Like, Like

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Speaker 2: when you are accelerating less aggressively, when you're breaking less aggressively,

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Speaker 2: your tires are going to be in better shape, your

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Speaker 2: brakes are going to be in better shape. You're gonna

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Speaker 2: get better gas mileage. Yeah, just better overall maintenance on

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Speaker 2: the vehicle.

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Speaker 3: Man.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, just a little PSA. All right, that's basically the

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Speaker 1: beer we're having on today's episode, Matt. It's oatmeal raisin

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Speaker 1: cookie quad, which sounds decadent. So I'm excited to have

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Speaker 1: this one. Is this is so good today on the show.

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Speaker 2: You've already enjoyed a couple of SIPs.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, we'll give our thoughts so good in our review

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Speaker 1: at the end of the episode. But if you have

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Speaker 1: a money question we'd love to hear from you. Just

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Speaker 1: record your question on the voicemail map of your phone.

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Speaker 1: Send it our way if you want the details, just

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Speaker 1: got to have to money dot com slash ask and

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Speaker 1: if we get your question in before the end of

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Speaker 1: the year, we'll send you some how to money socks.

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Speaker 1: The more interesting your question, the more likely we are

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Speaker 1: to take it. So submit your interesting money questions. That

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Speaker 1: is true, Yeah, and hopefully we'll get you on the

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Speaker 1: next episode. Matt, let's get to a question from a

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Speaker 1: young adult actually has a chunk of change at her

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Speaker 1: disposal that didn't come from her.

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Speaker 4: Hi, Matt Ajoel, my name is Laura. I'm from Saint Louis, Missouri.

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Speaker 4: I've been listening to the podcast for just about a

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Speaker 4: year now. I really like the show and you guys

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Speaker 4: have been a huge help on my financial journey so far.

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Speaker 4: So I have a question about UTMA accounts. I am

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Speaker 4: an adult. I am twenty eight, but I have an

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Speaker 4: UTMA that was set up for me by my grandparents,

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Speaker 4: and I know several other people who are in a

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Speaker 4: similar situation. And my general question is, once you're an adult,

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Speaker 4: what should you be doing with this account? I've been

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Speaker 4: leaving the money there and making withdrawals occasionally for purchases

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Speaker 4: regarding college.

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Speaker 2: I know other.

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Speaker 4: People who used it in part to pay for or wedding.

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Speaker 4: But I would love some advice on what I should

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Speaker 4: actually be doing with the money and if it needs

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Speaker 4: to come out of that account and go into something else.

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Speaker 4: Thanks so much.

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Speaker 2: All right, Laura, I will say you've got some cool

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Speaker 2: grand Did she say her grandparents left you that money?

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Speaker 2: Not only does she have cool grandparents, but her friends

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Speaker 2: have cool grandparents as well, Because she said, she sounds

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Speaker 2: like she knows a few folks.

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Speaker 1: She's running in circles with fellow UTMA inheritors.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I need a I don't know. It must be

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Speaker 2: in the water there and where was it in Missouri?

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Speaker 1: Missouri?

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Speaker 2: Yeah?

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Speaker 1: I don't think I know. At least nobody that I

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Speaker 1: know has told me that they inherited a Nutma. I

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Speaker 1: certainly didn't.

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Speaker 2: There's lots of things I don't tell you. Yeah, I

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Speaker 2: know you know your secret. No, ugma on over here

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Speaker 2: in my account's lineup?

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Speaker 1: Should we just mention I think sometimes people gloss over

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Speaker 1: that term utma ugma. They're these specific accounts that where

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Speaker 1: people can save ahead for a minor save and invest ahead,

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Speaker 1: save and invest ahead, and then when the miner reaches

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Speaker 1: the age of maturity, they basically inherit that money they

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Speaker 1: can do whatever they want with it.

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Speaker 2: Sure, but Laura, I love that you've been disciplined with

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Speaker 2: the funds that you have on hand there, Like you

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Speaker 2: didn't go buy a fancy new car or something like that.

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Speaker 2: I am sure that there are other folks out there

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Speaker 2: in the world in your situation who would have been

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Speaker 2: tempted into that direction. But you know, I would say,

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Speaker 2: depending on how much money we're talking about here, and

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Speaker 2: what your goals are, what your financial I was gonna

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Speaker 2: say financial goals, but like it's not financial. We're talking

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Speaker 2: about goals that you are going to potentially fund with

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Speaker 2: this money that's could have a significant impact on your future.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, And I kind of just kind of out briefly

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Speaker 1: outlined what utmos are and ugmas and Uniform Transfer to

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Speaker 1: Miners Act, Uniform Gift to Miners Act is like what.

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Speaker 2: It stands for.

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Speaker 1: And we're usually talking about this from the other side

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Speaker 1: of the equation, right, we're talking to parents or grandparents

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Speaker 1: who are looking to help the next generation, and they're saying, Hey,

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Speaker 1: Matt and Joel, should we put money into one of

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Speaker 1: these accounts for a baby or a little kiddo who

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Speaker 1: we love and we want them to set them up

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Speaker 1: for future financial success. And that is and that is

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Speaker 1: a question that is worth discussing. But Laura is the

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Speaker 1: next generation, right, she is the inheritor, the person who

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Speaker 1: has received the good fortune of somebody else's smart and

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Speaker 1: intelligence and kind moves. And just to reiterate, by the way,

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Speaker 1: depending on the state that folks live in, the UPMA

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Speaker 1: account goes fully into the hands of the beneficiary at

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Speaker 1: age eighteen or twenty one, and in some states age

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Speaker 1: twenty five. So depending on your state specific laws, it

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Speaker 1: depends when you're going to get the money. Laura's twenty eight,

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Speaker 1: so she's had access to the money for a little

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Speaker 1: bit of time. So to have only spent the money

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Speaker 1: for education and to have most of those funds intact

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Speaker 1: at age twenty eight is quite a feat and it

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Speaker 1: means that her grandparents' trust was well placed. You've likely

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Speaker 1: seen that account balance grow depending on how it's invested

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Speaker 1: as well, Laura, which is awesome. So you've just seen

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Speaker 1: that kind of continue to amass and it's like a

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Speaker 1: snowball rolling downhill and you're like, wait a second, way

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Speaker 1: more money than when I first inherited this thing, which

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Speaker 1: is a good problem to have. But now let's talk

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Speaker 1: about what do you do with the money. We don't

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Speaker 1: necessarily want you to spend it, but you also might

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Speaker 1: not want to leave it.

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Speaker 2: Bet you could spend it, would just spend it in

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Speaker 2: the right way. Yeah, I will say you'll have a

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Speaker 2: capital gains tax bill on hand when you start to

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Speaker 2: pull those dollars out. It's not the end of the world,

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Speaker 2: just something to be aware of. But just start outlining

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Speaker 2: some of these different upcoming goals that you have that

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Speaker 2: might be expensive. Do you have a home, Well, if not,

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Speaker 2: do you want one? Because using this money as a

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Speaker 2: down payment could be a fantastic use for it. Maybe. So,

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Speaker 2: I think she said she's twenty eight, Maybe she's been

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Speaker 2: out of school for a little bit, but maybe she

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Speaker 2: wants to go back to school, grad school. Perhaps I

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Speaker 2: think this money could be very helpful in that way

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Speaker 2: as well. Even she mentioned like some friends using enough

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Speaker 2: to pay for a wedding. I think that's in another

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Speaker 2: reasonable use case. But the first use of these funds

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Speaker 2: would be to use them to pay for some of

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Speaker 2: these bigger goals in life that you would otherwise hopefully

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Speaker 2: not but a lot of folks are resorted to debt

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Speaker 2: in order to accomplish these goals. So I would find

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Speaker 2: a way to avoid some of these. I don't want

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Speaker 2: to say the worst forms of debt, but if you're

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Speaker 2: a able to not have to pay any financing on

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Speaker 2: some of these goals that you do want to achieve,

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Speaker 2: that that's where my head goes first.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, if you can eliminate the need for debt for

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Speaker 1: just a bigger personal goal like that, or reduce your

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Speaker 1: need for debt, like let's say, in the event of

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Speaker 1: a home purchase like you alluded to, Matt, maybe Hey,

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Speaker 1: this allows you to put twenty or twenty five percent

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Speaker 1: down instead of putting five percent down. That's pretty cool, right,

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Speaker 1: because that'll reduce your monthly mortgage payment, that'll eliminate PMI like,

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Speaker 1: it's a really smart financial move to use. I think

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Speaker 1: up of funds for a bigger thing like that. If

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Speaker 1: you're so inclined and you know you're in the phase

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Speaker 1: of life where this money I think could help you

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Speaker 1: do something really smart for your financial future. Have you

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Speaker 1: thought about house hacking or becoming a real estate investor?

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Speaker 1: And I think you know, house hacking is one of

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Speaker 1: those things that Laura could do. Use this as down

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Speaker 1: payment money and then also at the same time potentially

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Speaker 1: minimize her housing costs. I think the nudge here is

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Speaker 1: to encourage you not to just think about expensive purchases,

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Speaker 1: but to think about making moves that are going to

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Speaker 1: benefit you over the long haul, like in the years

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Speaker 1: and decade to come. Matt, you mentioned grad school, like

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Speaker 1: that could be a thing too, right, increasing her future

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Speaker 1: earnings if that's of interest to her. Also, I mean,

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Speaker 1: if she's inclined towards owning and managing real estate, this

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Speaker 1: could really be the seed money to pull that off.

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Speaker 1: Like you'd be taking money from an investment account, money

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Speaker 1: that's already kind of essentially working for to build up

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Speaker 1: wealth through your future, and you'd be using them to

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Speaker 1: buy income producing assets that go up in value over time.

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Speaker 1: It's not for everyone investing in real estate, but I

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Speaker 1: think it is, especially if you're going in the house

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Speaker 1: hacking direction, it can be one of the one of

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Speaker 1: the best financial levers that you can pull. So I

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Speaker 1: think it's just worth putting that on your radar as

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Speaker 1: something that might make sense.

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Speaker 2: For the use of some of this money.

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Speaker 1: Sure, yeah, depending on how much there is, Like, we

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Speaker 1: don't know how much there is.

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Speaker 2: Either that is true. I think she's also wondering whether

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Speaker 2: or not she should take this money out of this

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Speaker 2: account and put it into a different account. And so

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Speaker 2: I'm not sure if you are currently able to fully

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Speaker 2: fund a roth ira or not. My guess is that

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Speaker 2: you are working since you are twenty eight years old,

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Speaker 2: and if you have enough earned income, which is highly likely,

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Speaker 2: but maybe you just don't have enough extra free cash

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Speaker 2: on hand in order to max out that roth ira. Right,

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Speaker 2: we're talking about seven thousand dollars every single year. Well,

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Speaker 2: pulling a bit from your UTMA each year to ensure

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Speaker 2: that you get as much money in that roth ira

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Speaker 2: as possible. I think that is a smart move. Yes, indeed,

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Speaker 2: you are paying a little bit of tax now, but

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Speaker 2: maxing out your roth IRA every year is going to

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Speaker 2: shelter you from future tax bombs down the road, and

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Speaker 2: I would be interested in doing that, especially too, you

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Speaker 2: didn't say who you have the UTMO with, and so

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Speaker 2: I would be paying close attention to any potential fees

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Speaker 2: that are associated with that account or the investments. Maybe

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Speaker 2: it's not the brokerage that you're with. Let's say they

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Speaker 2: charge zero zero dollars for an annual fee, Well, what

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Speaker 2: kind of funds are you invested? Like, what are the

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Speaker 2: expense ratios there on those funds? Because it could vary

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Speaker 2: wildly depending on the brokerage, and especially if this was

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Speaker 2: something that was set up like years and even decades ago.

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Speaker 2: There's a chance. Man, it makes me think of I

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Speaker 2: had a buddy and he started investing in American fund

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Speaker 2: which I'm sure there are some great American funds out there,

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Speaker 2: but I remember at the time they had some massive

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Speaker 2: fees associated with them, like no joke, in the two

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Speaker 2: to three percent range, not like zero point two percent,

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Speaker 2: point three percent, literally two to three percent. And so

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Speaker 2: if I robbery right there, if that was the case,

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Speaker 2: then I would be in more of a hurry to

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Speaker 2: get my funds out of this UTMA. But otherwise, I mean,

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Speaker 2: if it's a low cost provider, and it's widely diversified.

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Speaker 2: There's not necessarily any rush to get those funds out

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Speaker 2: of that UTMA.

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Speaker 1: So and I think you're pointing something out here too, Matt. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: look at the investment fees, but also look at the investments, right,

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Speaker 1: because what did your grandparents, What sort of funds did

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Speaker 1: they put your investments in. Maybe they're not high expense ratios,

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Speaker 1: but maybe they're too conservative, right, So you might want

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Speaker 1: to have more a higher stock allocation in your investments

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Speaker 1: inside of the UTMA.

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Speaker 2: Uh.

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Speaker 1: And that's something worth looking at as well. So, Laura,

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Speaker 1: when it comes down to it, I'd be thinking about

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Speaker 1: this money as allowing you to make bigger financial moves

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Speaker 1: that you'd otherwise have to delay or push further down

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Speaker 1: the road.

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Speaker 2: And she's got that seed money, which I'm sure honestly

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Speaker 2: is exactly what her great parents intended for it to be.

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Speaker 2: The other thing we didn't even really talk about was well,

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Speaker 2: maybe you want to launch a business or something like that,

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Speaker 2: and this could be seed money for that. I mean,

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Speaker 2: there's all sorts of things where it can feel like

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Speaker 2: you don't have the runway, but this is like added

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Speaker 2: support to allow you to really go in a whole

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Speaker 2: bunch of different directions. I was just thinking about it

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Speaker 2: as extra jet fuel though, propelling you towards the future

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Speaker 2: that you want, not as money for consumption in the

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Speaker 2: near term, and also helping to fuel bigger financial goals

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Speaker 2: like home ownership, not as kind of money for pittoy

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Speaker 2: spending here and there, right, that you could pull off.

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Speaker 1: In the near term. And maybe just a portion of

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Speaker 1: this money, because I just said, don't spend it on

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Speaker 1: pilly stuff, maybe a portion of it does make sense

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Speaker 1: for fun stuff, right, maybe five to ten percent of it.

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Speaker 1: This is the time of her life where probably her

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Speaker 1: friends are going to be getting married. Maybe there's destination weddings,

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Speaker 1: maybe she's got to be a bridesmaid in a wedding

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Speaker 1: or something like that. And it's easy to say I

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Speaker 1: can't afford that, I'm not going to do that, and

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Speaker 1: you miss out on some kind of good times because

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Speaker 1: of that, maybe being overly frugal. And so I would say, well,

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Speaker 1: let's take a portion of this, and whether it's a

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Speaker 1: trip with friends, whether it's whatever else, something else is

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Speaker 1: going to bring you joy. Consider taking some of those

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Speaker 1: up funds and getting at least a little bit of

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Speaker 1: pleasure out of the ability to use them right now,

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Speaker 1: in the here and now, or in the next.

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Speaker 2: Year or two.

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Speaker 1: I think having a plan is wise been optimizing every

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Speaker 1: single dollar would likely be a bummer.

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Speaker 4: Two.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, absolutely. I really like the idea of using

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Speaker 2: it for like these one off things that you would say,

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Speaker 2: well that I can't fit that into my budget. Like

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Speaker 2: I like the idea of having something that feels more

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Speaker 2: aggressive and a conservative budget. But then if you have

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Speaker 2: like these sort of one off things that kind of

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Speaker 2: fall into your life that normally you would say no

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Speaker 2: to because it's that sort of outside of the bounds

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Speaker 2: of how it is that you want to live. But

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Speaker 2: then you're able to say, well, I got the Utler money.

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Speaker 2: This is maybe more of a once a year, special

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Speaker 2: occasion sort of thing that I'm tapping it for. And

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Speaker 2: I think that would would allow you to, in fact

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Speaker 2: have I don't know, like an increased aptitude or like

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Speaker 2: a widened aperture of what life could look like for

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Speaker 2: you without totally subscribing to doing something like this every

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Speaker 2: single year. He's like best of both worlds. Yeah, right,

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Speaker 2: you're locking yourself in being disciplined with your money, but like, oh,

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Speaker 2: there's the occasional splurs here in there.

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Speaker 1: I mean kind of like we talk about with investing,

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Speaker 1: where yeah, five percent of it can be used on

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Speaker 1: single stocks and crypto and stuff like that. We'll do

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Speaker 1: the same with this five percent when it comes to

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Speaker 1: your spending, and then do the smart long term stuff

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Speaker 1: with the rest of it.

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Speaker 2: But Joe, we got more to get to, including whether

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Speaker 2: or not robots are better investors than we are. We'll

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Speaker 2: get to that more right after this.

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Speaker 1: All right, Matt, we're back.

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Speaker 2: Now.

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Speaker 1: We've got a question about one of my least favorite things,

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Speaker 1: student loans.

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Speaker 3: Gentlemen, my name is Zach. I am in Bend, Oregon.

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Speaker 3: My student loans were through a company called Naviant, and

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Speaker 3: recently I've been getting emails, phone calls, and texts from

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Speaker 3: a company called Mohela telling me that I'm six months

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Speaker 3: delinquent and that I needed to pay right away or

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Speaker 3: certain things were going to happen financially against me. So

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Speaker 3: I called this mohalah Ela to discuss the Navviant loans

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Speaker 3: that apparently went delinquent somehow even though I had auto

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Speaker 3: pay turned on. And Mohala said, well, give us fifty

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Speaker 3: dollars right now over the phone, and we can push

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Speaker 3: your forbearants back until January when we would start to

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Speaker 3: continue the monthly payment of about one hundred and thirty bucks. Anyway, emails,

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Speaker 3: phone calls, tech started doubling, threatens, harassment, all that started doubling.

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Speaker 3: Now I'm questioning, is this Mohala company legit and in general,

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Speaker 3: what is the best way to pay off student loans

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Speaker 3: without dealing with these reselling of loans or harassment with

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Speaker 3: collection companies or auto pays or anything in that nature.

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Speaker 3: If you have any advice, I had a preciate it. Hey,

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Speaker 3: thanks guys, best friends out.

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Speaker 1: Oh Matt, what's better? What's better than text messages for

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Speaker 1: people who are trying to like rip money out of

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Speaker 1: your life?

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Speaker 2: Text for people who are saying, hey, I've got money

437
00:19:10,840 --> 00:19:13,320
Speaker 2: for you, just send us your all your personal information.

438
00:19:13,359 --> 00:19:17,440
Speaker 2: That I would say maybe equally as dangerous. But Zach,

439
00:19:17,480 --> 00:19:20,000
Speaker 2: first off, here, man, these tactics that are being used

440
00:19:20,280 --> 00:19:24,800
Speaker 2: sound ridiculous. They sound quite untowed. It appears that your

441
00:19:24,840 --> 00:19:28,240
Speaker 2: loan has been transferred to Mohila, which is another student

442
00:19:28,320 --> 00:19:29,080
Speaker 2: loan servicer.

443
00:19:29,160 --> 00:19:31,680
Speaker 1: Yeah, he was basically asking about their legitimacy. The they're

444
00:19:31,680 --> 00:19:32,399
Speaker 1: a legit company.

445
00:19:32,520 --> 00:19:35,520
Speaker 2: Yeah, and I think it stands so it's the MO

446
00:19:35,680 --> 00:19:38,000
Speaker 2: part stands for Missouri, but it's the HILA is the

447
00:19:38,080 --> 00:19:41,159
Speaker 2: I think Higher Education Loan Authority or something something like that.

448
00:19:41,600 --> 00:19:44,440
Speaker 2: But they are they are a legit company. They are

449
00:19:44,480 --> 00:19:47,320
Speaker 2: not necessarily a good company. All of the Internet. They

450
00:19:47,320 --> 00:19:50,240
Speaker 2: seem to agree that their customer service is one of

451
00:19:50,280 --> 00:19:52,560
Speaker 2: the worst. And the reason that you're your loan is

452
00:19:52,600 --> 00:19:56,200
Speaker 2: no longer with Naviant, the company who you originally went with,

453
00:19:56,359 --> 00:19:59,760
Speaker 2: is because they are barred from servicing federal student loans.

454
00:20:00,119 --> 00:20:04,119
Speaker 2: Moving forward, everyone's doing stuff. Everyone's doing a great.

455
00:20:04,000 --> 00:20:05,960
Speaker 1: Job here student loan space full of great people doing

456
00:20:06,000 --> 00:20:06,400
Speaker 1: great stuff.

457
00:20:06,520 --> 00:20:10,760
Speaker 2: Were they're treating borrowers so horribly, steering them into inappropriate

458
00:20:10,760 --> 00:20:15,479
Speaker 2: products that cost more and actually harmed recent grads credit scores.

459
00:20:15,760 --> 00:20:18,280
Speaker 2: The student loan space is a complete mess, and unfortunately

460
00:20:18,320 --> 00:20:22,160
Speaker 2: I don't necessarily seeing it getting cleaned up anytime soon.

461
00:20:22,160 --> 00:20:24,920
Speaker 1: So was Naviant like the en Run of student loans

462
00:20:24,960 --> 00:20:28,000
Speaker 1: and mohilas like the Comcast of student loans. I don't know,

463
00:20:28,160 --> 00:20:30,640
Speaker 1: it's really hard to kind of peg them to other

464
00:20:30,680 --> 00:20:33,119
Speaker 1: companies that really really suck that people tend to hate.

465
00:20:33,160 --> 00:20:36,400
Speaker 2: But then Comcast pivoted and it's Exfinity. Yeah right, it's

466
00:20:36,400 --> 00:20:38,680
Speaker 2: not Infinity sucks. It was Comcast.

467
00:20:38,720 --> 00:20:40,560
Speaker 1: It was a different company to give themselves a new

468
00:20:40,640 --> 00:20:42,720
Speaker 1: name because everyone hated them so much, and then people

469
00:20:42,720 --> 00:20:45,360
Speaker 1: are like rebranded. Well, the Accunity person showed up my door.

470
00:20:45,400 --> 00:20:48,080
Speaker 1: They seem nice, and it's like, well, yeah, it's lipstick

471
00:20:48,080 --> 00:20:50,680
Speaker 1: on a pig here. Well, and that's I think sometimes

472
00:20:50,680 --> 00:20:53,960
Speaker 1: what is happening with these student loan providers, right, Student

473
00:20:54,000 --> 00:20:56,080
Speaker 1: Loan Planner, which is we've had people on from their

474
00:20:56,119 --> 00:20:59,200
Speaker 1: company before Matt. They're awesome folks. They had an article

475
00:20:59,240 --> 00:21:02,760
Speaker 1: about just how the major student loan service providers are

476
00:21:03,240 --> 00:21:06,399
Speaker 1: and they rank them in order of which ones are

477
00:21:06,400 --> 00:21:08,879
Speaker 1: the worst, and they're all kind of mostly not great,

478
00:21:09,080 --> 00:21:12,480
Speaker 1: but Mohila tops the list as being the worst. And

479
00:21:12,520 --> 00:21:14,720
Speaker 1: if they're harassing you, which it sounds like they are,

480
00:21:15,000 --> 00:21:17,720
Speaker 1: I would report them to the Consumer Financial Protection Bureau

481
00:21:17,760 --> 00:21:20,560
Speaker 1: the CFPB, which you can go to their website consumer

482
00:21:20,600 --> 00:21:23,840
Speaker 1: finance dot gov or maybe both. I would file a

483
00:21:23,840 --> 00:21:27,040
Speaker 1: complaint with your state's attorney general as well, just letting

484
00:21:27,080 --> 00:21:29,960
Speaker 1: them know, hey, this company is harassing me. They're doing

485
00:21:30,000 --> 00:21:34,080
Speaker 1: some ridiculous things. They're making some absurd asks that's not okay,

486
00:21:34,200 --> 00:21:35,760
Speaker 1: right what they're doing and how they're talking to you

487
00:21:35,840 --> 00:21:39,200
Speaker 1: and the ways they're communicating with you. So now let's

488
00:21:39,200 --> 00:21:42,640
Speaker 1: talk about maybe how you move forward with these jerks

489
00:21:42,680 --> 00:21:47,119
Speaker 1: at Mohila And basically, well, you're not as delayed in

490
00:21:47,560 --> 00:21:50,760
Speaker 1: your payment as they're making it sound from everything we

491
00:21:50,840 --> 00:21:52,959
Speaker 1: know about student loans and what's happening with student loan

492
00:21:53,000 --> 00:21:55,959
Speaker 1: payments right now, because even after student loan payments started

493
00:21:56,000 --> 00:21:59,080
Speaker 1: again last year, there was a mandatory on ramp period,

494
00:21:59,440 --> 00:22:03,120
Speaker 1: which means you couldn't be penalized for not paying through

495
00:22:03,160 --> 00:22:06,159
Speaker 1: the end of September. And also what planned you're on

496
00:22:06,440 --> 00:22:08,640
Speaker 1: determines whether or not you even need to start paying

497
00:22:08,720 --> 00:22:10,680
Speaker 1: right now exactly. So if you're on the Safe plan,

498
00:22:10,720 --> 00:22:13,520
Speaker 1: which we don't know you didn't mention it in your question,

499
00:22:13,840 --> 00:22:16,520
Speaker 1: you're still technically in forbearance for the time being and

500
00:22:16,560 --> 00:22:18,800
Speaker 1: you will likely continue to be for some months to come.

501
00:22:19,080 --> 00:22:21,120
Speaker 1: If you didn't sign up for Safe, you might need

502
00:22:21,119 --> 00:22:23,239
Speaker 1: to start paying, but still it's not like you're like

503
00:22:23,480 --> 00:22:25,960
Speaker 1: six months behind or something like that. Mohela might want

504
00:22:26,080 --> 00:22:28,280
Speaker 1: to make it sound like that, but that's not actually

505
00:22:28,359 --> 00:22:29,120
Speaker 1: the facts on the ground.

506
00:22:29,160 --> 00:22:33,960
Speaker 2: They've just implemented some aggressive collections practices here, but not

507
00:22:34,040 --> 00:22:37,639
Speaker 2: paying that would still cause interest to accrue. But you

508
00:22:37,760 --> 00:22:41,200
Speaker 2: were able to avoid late fees, collections efforts, and negative

509
00:22:41,240 --> 00:22:43,400
Speaker 2: hits to your credit score for that one year period.

510
00:22:44,000 --> 00:22:46,359
Speaker 2: But after the end of that arm phase that Joe's

511
00:22:46,359 --> 00:22:48,440
Speaker 2: talking about there, all those other realities are back in

512
00:22:48,520 --> 00:22:51,760
Speaker 2: play unless you are in save. If not, it is

513
00:22:51,800 --> 00:22:53,639
Speaker 2: important to get current on your payment and to do

514
00:22:53,720 --> 00:22:57,680
Speaker 2: so quickly in order to avoid those repercussions. You asked

515
00:22:57,720 --> 00:23:02,960
Speaker 2: as well about avoiding getting migrated to a different servicer

516
00:23:03,280 --> 00:23:05,200
Speaker 2: on your student loans, right, and just how much of

517
00:23:05,240 --> 00:23:06,840
Speaker 2: a big of a pain in the butt this is.

518
00:23:07,160 --> 00:23:08,800
Speaker 2: I wish I had better news here, but sadly, there's

519
00:23:08,840 --> 00:23:10,520
Speaker 2: no way to avoid that. It's just one of the many.

520
00:23:10,880 --> 00:23:13,119
Speaker 2: It's the modern financial system that we currently are living in,

521
00:23:13,160 --> 00:23:14,960
Speaker 2: like the same with like your mortgage payment exactly like

522
00:23:15,000 --> 00:23:17,239
Speaker 2: you don't have. You might refinance or might take out

523
00:23:17,280 --> 00:23:19,200
Speaker 2: a mortgage with a certain bank, and they might sell

524
00:23:19,200 --> 00:23:21,400
Speaker 2: it two months down the road, six months down the road,

525
00:23:21,520 --> 00:23:23,200
Speaker 2: and you get the paperwork and you have to figure

526
00:23:23,200 --> 00:23:24,760
Speaker 2: out a whole new back end system and get that

527
00:23:24,760 --> 00:23:27,480
Speaker 2: stuff set up. It's annoying, but it's also just kind

528
00:23:27,520 --> 00:23:29,200
Speaker 2: of part of the reality, like you said, Matt, of

529
00:23:29,280 --> 00:23:32,520
Speaker 2: the modern financial system. So it's an indignity you have

530
00:23:32,520 --> 00:23:34,560
Speaker 2: to put up with. And I'm not sure, Zach, what

531
00:23:34,680 --> 00:23:37,680
Speaker 2: your overall financial situation looks like and how big of

532
00:23:37,760 --> 00:23:40,879
Speaker 2: a financial burden your student loans are for you. And

533
00:23:41,119 --> 00:23:44,560
Speaker 2: student loans, by the way, are incredibly difficult to get

534
00:23:44,600 --> 00:23:46,439
Speaker 2: out of. They stick to you like glue. They're one

535
00:23:46,480 --> 00:23:48,520
Speaker 2: of these things where you take them out. And basically

536
00:23:48,600 --> 00:23:52,119
Speaker 2: on almost every other financial product, there are ways to

537
00:23:52,440 --> 00:23:55,639
Speaker 2: cut the strings. With student loans, there almost aren't. But

538
00:23:55,720 --> 00:23:59,240
Speaker 2: if your payment is something you truly can't afford, it

539
00:23:59,280 --> 00:24:03,800
Speaker 2: is possible to have them just discharge partially or fully

540
00:24:03,800 --> 00:24:08,320
Speaker 2: in bankruptcy if you can prove something known as undue hardship.

541
00:24:08,800 --> 00:24:11,200
Speaker 2: And this isn't a step to take lightly, and there's

542
00:24:11,400 --> 00:24:14,880
Speaker 2: no guarantee that when you claim undue hardship that you're

543
00:24:14,920 --> 00:24:16,879
Speaker 2: going to be able to prove it. The standard is

544
00:24:16,920 --> 00:24:19,320
Speaker 2: quite high. But I'm just wanting to mention it because

545
00:24:19,359 --> 00:24:21,920
Speaker 2: it is something that more people have been able to do,

546
00:24:22,359 --> 00:24:26,480
Speaker 2: even though it's still a really difficult hurdle to jump over. Sure, Yeah,

547
00:24:26,480 --> 00:24:28,320
Speaker 2: and as we're looking ahead. The truth is everyone with

548
00:24:28,400 --> 00:24:31,040
Speaker 2: student loans might have a tougher time. Like we don't

549
00:24:31,080 --> 00:24:34,960
Speaker 2: know exactly how the next administration are going to approach

550
00:24:35,119 --> 00:24:38,359
Speaker 2: student loans, but it's certainly not going to be as

551
00:24:38,920 --> 00:24:42,879
Speaker 2: dubvish and kind as the Biden administration has been. I'm

552
00:24:42,920 --> 00:24:44,840
Speaker 2: sure we'll be talking about it pretty regularly here on

553
00:24:44,880 --> 00:24:47,200
Speaker 2: the show throughout all of next year twenty twenty five.

554
00:24:47,520 --> 00:24:49,760
Speaker 2: And so it's just best to start planning for the

555
00:24:49,800 --> 00:24:54,359
Speaker 2: potential elimination of favorable income based repayment programs like Save

556
00:24:54,920 --> 00:24:58,240
Speaker 2: and the likelihood of higher payments going forward, and just

557
00:24:58,359 --> 00:25:00,720
Speaker 2: as future students are starting to play I think these

558
00:25:00,760 --> 00:25:03,760
Speaker 2: less general student loan payment options and plans it makes

559
00:25:03,800 --> 00:25:06,720
Speaker 2: it even more important for folks as they're considering they're

560
00:25:06,760 --> 00:25:09,359
Speaker 2: borrowing load, right like the debt that they're looking to

561
00:25:09,359 --> 00:25:11,840
Speaker 2: take on. One other things you wanted to mention, Zach

562
00:25:11,880 --> 00:25:14,080
Speaker 2: talked about making these payments over the phone, which makes

563
00:25:14,119 --> 00:25:17,200
Speaker 2: me nervous as well, like I don't like getting phone

564
00:25:17,200 --> 00:25:19,199
Speaker 2: calls from people that I don't necessarily know and then

565
00:25:19,240 --> 00:25:20,960
Speaker 2: giving them money, sort of like you're talking about all

566
00:25:20,960 --> 00:25:23,359
Speaker 2: as far as receiving text from folks if it was me,

567
00:25:23,560 --> 00:25:26,439
Speaker 2: I would not be paying a single dollar over the phone. A.

568
00:25:27,000 --> 00:25:29,040
Speaker 2: I don't like answering the phone. B. I would rather

569
00:25:29,080 --> 00:25:33,200
Speaker 2: do it by like via the Mohilo or Mohila whatever,

570
00:25:33,359 --> 00:25:36,359
Speaker 2: the online portal where you've got a paper trail. The

571
00:25:36,400 --> 00:25:38,600
Speaker 2: ability to see payments in that way when they come

572
00:25:38,640 --> 00:25:41,879
Speaker 2: and say, hey, you receive this payment, you have a screenshot,

573
00:25:41,920 --> 00:25:44,119
Speaker 2: you have a confirmation number. Instead.

574
00:25:44,119 --> 00:25:45,879
Speaker 1: If I talked to Susie over the phone and she

575
00:25:45,960 --> 00:25:46,840
Speaker 1: said I was just said.

576
00:25:46,760 --> 00:25:48,720
Speaker 2: Yeah, it was gonna get applied to my account. Just

577
00:25:48,720 --> 00:25:50,840
Speaker 2: the ability to get in there and do that to

578
00:25:50,840 --> 00:25:54,080
Speaker 2: make sure you're doing everything on the up and up,

579
00:25:54,240 --> 00:25:56,120
Speaker 2: and while you're in there too. I don't know if

580
00:25:56,600 --> 00:25:58,520
Speaker 2: click over and check out your profile and see if

581
00:25:58,800 --> 00:26:01,119
Speaker 2: they have your phone number there, because I think maybe

582
00:26:01,160 --> 00:26:04,400
Speaker 2: even just attempting to remove that from your profile might

583
00:26:04,480 --> 00:26:06,680
Speaker 2: allow them to not be able to reach out to

584
00:26:06,720 --> 00:26:08,400
Speaker 2: you so directly. Because what they're doing here is they're

585
00:26:08,440 --> 00:26:10,760
Speaker 2: trying to get people to pay more than they need to,

586
00:26:10,840 --> 00:26:12,879
Speaker 2: right Like what if there's somebody who is on the

587
00:26:12,880 --> 00:26:14,480
Speaker 2: safe plan and they've only got it like a couple

588
00:26:14,480 --> 00:26:18,800
Speaker 2: more years, but they're getting so inundated with messages emails, calls,

589
00:26:19,640 --> 00:26:22,280
Speaker 2: text messages that they're like, you know what, it's only

590
00:26:22,280 --> 00:26:24,520
Speaker 2: three thousand dollars. I've got four thousand dollars sitting right

591
00:26:24,560 --> 00:26:26,199
Speaker 2: now in my same mus account. Let me just let

592
00:26:26,240 --> 00:26:27,640
Speaker 2: me just pay it off and then whatever it takes,

593
00:26:27,680 --> 00:26:29,120
Speaker 2: then I don't have to worry about it at all

594
00:26:29,320 --> 00:26:30,840
Speaker 2: because you're just so fed up with it. But that's

595
00:26:30,880 --> 00:26:33,520
Speaker 2: not the emotional state or point that we want to

596
00:26:33,560 --> 00:26:35,280
Speaker 2: get you. That's where they want to get you to

597
00:26:35,320 --> 00:26:37,840
Speaker 2: where they're getting paid as opposed to just having that,

598
00:26:38,080 --> 00:26:40,040
Speaker 2: you know, having that forgiven if you're within the Safe

599
00:26:40,040 --> 00:26:41,080
Speaker 2: Program or something like that.

600
00:26:41,119 --> 00:26:43,720
Speaker 1: And again, safe program might be on on the rails

601
00:26:43,720 --> 00:26:46,240
Speaker 1: and it might not last. Not even you mentioned the

602
00:26:46,240 --> 00:26:48,000
Speaker 1: next administration map that might be part of it, but

603
00:26:48,000 --> 00:26:50,160
Speaker 1: it could just also be court rulings right that undo

604
00:26:50,240 --> 00:26:53,640
Speaker 1: the Safe Plan because it wasn't properly implemented. The reality

605
00:26:53,680 --> 00:26:55,760
Speaker 1: for student loan borrowers is going to shift in the

606
00:26:55,760 --> 00:26:58,520
Speaker 1: coming months. We'll continue to talk about this, but Zach,

607
00:26:58,600 --> 00:27:01,440
Speaker 1: hopefully for you this hew and you need to stick

608
00:27:01,520 --> 00:27:03,920
Speaker 1: up for yourself with Mohila. It's really tough because they're

609
00:27:03,960 --> 00:27:05,760
Speaker 1: like a ten thousand pound gorilla that wants to push

610
00:27:05,800 --> 00:27:07,879
Speaker 1: you around, and you got to push back. All right, man,

611
00:27:07,960 --> 00:27:10,720
Speaker 1: Let's get to a question about robo advising for medium

612
00:27:10,800 --> 00:27:12,160
Speaker 1: term savings goals.

613
00:27:12,440 --> 00:27:15,399
Speaker 5: Hey, Matt Joel, this is Dan from New York City.

614
00:27:15,800 --> 00:27:18,679
Speaker 5: I've been listening to the podcast for several years and

615
00:27:18,960 --> 00:27:21,560
Speaker 5: appreciate all you guys. Do I have a question for you.

616
00:27:21,600 --> 00:27:24,200
Speaker 5: I have some money in a betterment account that's set

617
00:27:24,240 --> 00:27:26,600
Speaker 5: aside to be used just a couple of years from now,

618
00:27:26,960 --> 00:27:30,439
Speaker 5: would be part of a home purchase. It's on auto

619
00:27:30,480 --> 00:27:34,359
Speaker 5: adjust and they keep reallocating more into bonds, currently thirty

620
00:27:34,359 --> 00:27:38,080
Speaker 5: four sixty six stocks to bonds. It hasn't got a

621
00:27:38,080 --> 00:27:42,520
Speaker 5: great return. It's gotten about eight percent total return since

622
00:27:42,600 --> 00:27:45,399
Speaker 5: March twenty twenty, and so I'm wondering if I'd be

623
00:27:45,400 --> 00:27:48,720
Speaker 5: better off just moving into a savings account instead. Part

624
00:27:48,720 --> 00:27:50,480
Speaker 5: of me has felt that I should just trust the

625
00:27:50,520 --> 00:27:53,400
Speaker 5: process and that maybe most of the games would come

626
00:27:53,440 --> 00:27:55,920
Speaker 5: as time goes on it gets closer to the target date,

627
00:27:56,720 --> 00:27:58,760
Speaker 5: but it just seems like a very low return and

628
00:27:58,800 --> 00:28:01,800
Speaker 5: I'm not really sure if that's actually going to happen.

629
00:28:01,960 --> 00:28:04,640
Speaker 5: So just wondering what the best thing for the money

630
00:28:04,640 --> 00:28:06,439
Speaker 5: in this account would be from this point forward.

631
00:28:06,920 --> 00:28:11,480
Speaker 2: Thanks ooh Joe. Eight percent since twenty twenty. I'm pretty

632
00:28:11,480 --> 00:28:13,280
Speaker 2: sure what he's saying there is eight percent total, so

633
00:28:13,320 --> 00:28:15,640
Speaker 2: he's we're looking at an average of two percent a year.

634
00:28:16,320 --> 00:28:18,280
Speaker 2: Not the kind of position that I would want to

635
00:28:18,320 --> 00:28:19,359
Speaker 2: find myself in.

636
00:28:19,720 --> 00:28:21,760
Speaker 1: And not the position, to be honest and not to

637
00:28:21,960 --> 00:28:24,199
Speaker 1: rub salt in the woundstand that many people find themselves

638
00:28:24,240 --> 00:28:26,320
Speaker 1: and given kind of what's happened even with just basic

639
00:28:26,359 --> 00:28:27,960
Speaker 1: saving straight so this that's really tough to.

640
00:28:27,960 --> 00:28:30,399
Speaker 2: Endure, that is true. Let's address Betterment first. As far

641
00:28:30,400 --> 00:28:31,920
Speaker 2: as we can tell, it's the best one out there

642
00:28:31,920 --> 00:28:35,080
Speaker 2: on the market in our opinion, and they've sort of

643
00:28:35,160 --> 00:28:38,560
Speaker 2: changed the game right like they have given DIY investors

644
00:28:38,560 --> 00:28:41,760
Speaker 2: a middle of the road choice that isn't either just

645
00:28:41,800 --> 00:28:43,520
Speaker 2: like a low cost brokerage firm like one of our

646
00:28:43,560 --> 00:28:47,560
Speaker 2: favorites like Fidelity or Vanguard, where you are completely on

647
00:28:47,600 --> 00:28:51,160
Speaker 2: your own, You're you're flying solo. That's one option, but

648
00:28:51,200 --> 00:28:52,880
Speaker 2: then the other option is, okay, I got to hire

649
00:28:52,880 --> 00:28:55,920
Speaker 2: a fully fledged financial advisor. Well, Betterment is offering that

650
00:28:55,960 --> 00:28:59,200
Speaker 2: sort of middle of the road path, offer fairly reasonable

651
00:28:59,200 --> 00:29:01,160
Speaker 2: price and with other and whistles that can help you

652
00:29:01,200 --> 00:29:03,400
Speaker 2: to stay the course. When it comes to your investing.

653
00:29:03,720 --> 00:29:05,120
Speaker 2: And actually it was a couple of weeks ago we

654
00:29:05,200 --> 00:29:08,480
Speaker 2: talked with Dan Egan, who is over there at Betterment.

655
00:29:08,600 --> 00:29:12,080
Speaker 2: He's a behavioral psychologist on the team. We'd recommend for

656
00:29:12,080 --> 00:29:14,560
Speaker 2: folks to listen to that episode if you missed it.

657
00:29:14,640 --> 00:29:17,280
Speaker 1: Yeah, it gives you kind of some inside baseball onto

658
00:29:17,640 --> 00:29:19,480
Speaker 1: how Betterment system is run and how it's kind of

659
00:29:19,520 --> 00:29:22,760
Speaker 1: set up to help people make better decisions with their investments.

660
00:29:23,040 --> 00:29:26,280
Speaker 1: And Dan, these medium term money goal questions are often

661
00:29:26,320 --> 00:29:28,920
Speaker 1: the hardest to tackle, right. We've talked about those regularly

662
00:29:28,920 --> 00:29:30,920
Speaker 1: on the show. Depending on what your timeline is and

663
00:29:30,920 --> 00:29:33,680
Speaker 1: what your risk tolerance is, it can be really hard

664
00:29:33,720 --> 00:29:36,200
Speaker 1: to figure out exactly what you should be doing if

665
00:29:36,200 --> 00:29:38,680
Speaker 1: you have a money goal that's two, three, four or

666
00:29:38,720 --> 00:29:41,280
Speaker 1: five years down the road, and you are, of course

667
00:29:41,360 --> 00:29:44,480
Speaker 1: disappointed with your returns because the stock market has been

668
00:29:44,480 --> 00:29:47,840
Speaker 1: crushing it and you've had your money in more conservative

669
00:29:47,840 --> 00:29:50,720
Speaker 1: investment choices and the returns have been even below that

670
00:29:50,960 --> 00:29:53,920
Speaker 1: of a savings account these days, although Matt I think

671
00:29:53,960 --> 00:29:57,600
Speaker 1: what savings rates ticked up in twenty twenty two significantly,

672
00:29:57,880 --> 00:29:59,640
Speaker 1: back in twenty twenty twenty twenty one, they were still

673
00:29:59,680 --> 00:30:02,440
Speaker 1: pretty paltry, And I totally get that you'll be bummed

674
00:30:02,440 --> 00:30:04,680
Speaker 1: out by that, but I also have to have to

675
00:30:04,720 --> 00:30:08,000
Speaker 1: say that that's the nature of target date funds that

676
00:30:08,080 --> 00:30:10,240
Speaker 1: start out with a decent chunk of bond exposure and

677
00:30:10,280 --> 00:30:13,600
Speaker 1: bonds have not done so well over the past five years,

678
00:30:14,160 --> 00:30:16,120
Speaker 1: and then those accounts get adjusted to have more and

679
00:30:16,160 --> 00:30:18,480
Speaker 1: more bonds that closer you get to target the target date.

680
00:30:19,000 --> 00:30:21,160
Speaker 1: And when you look at the performance of total bond

681
00:30:21,240 --> 00:30:24,680
Speaker 1: dtfs like Vanguard's B and D, it's actually had a

682
00:30:24,760 --> 00:30:28,200
Speaker 1: negative return since March of twenty twenty, minus ten percent,

683
00:30:28,240 --> 00:30:30,960
Speaker 1: to be exact. So the more heavily it's not something

684
00:30:31,000 --> 00:30:33,200
Speaker 1: you could have predicted. This is one of those things

685
00:30:33,200 --> 00:30:36,120
Speaker 1: that happens, though, when you're investing in the stock market

686
00:30:36,160 --> 00:30:38,920
Speaker 1: and in the bond market, and the more heavily towards

687
00:30:38,960 --> 00:30:42,200
Speaker 1: bonds your portfolio has been allocated, Unfortunately, the worse it's

688
00:30:42,240 --> 00:30:42,920
Speaker 1: performed for you.

689
00:30:43,080 --> 00:30:45,800
Speaker 2: Yeah, and Dan said, should I just trust the process?

690
00:30:45,960 --> 00:30:48,960
Speaker 2: And this is an instance where we would say, well, no,

691
00:30:49,160 --> 00:30:50,960
Speaker 2: you don't actually want to trust the process. You trust

692
00:30:50,960 --> 00:30:53,360
Speaker 2: the process if you're invested in the stock market when

693
00:30:53,720 --> 00:30:56,320
Speaker 2: you've got rolling time rolling returns well and it's not

694
00:30:56,360 --> 00:30:58,520
Speaker 2: just about time. It's the fact that literally his portfolio

695
00:30:58,640 --> 00:31:02,160
Speaker 2: is literally changing to be more conservative, which means likely

696
00:31:02,600 --> 00:31:05,520
Speaker 2: that it's going to continue to underperform. Right, So as

697
00:31:05,560 --> 00:31:09,320
Speaker 2: you gain more bond exposure, you're looking for preservation of capital.

698
00:31:09,320 --> 00:31:11,400
Speaker 2: You're looking for most folks are looking for a more

699
00:31:11,440 --> 00:31:15,840
Speaker 2: stable portfolio, which means that you're not going to see

700
00:31:15,840 --> 00:31:19,040
Speaker 2: like a rebound. I guess Dan, on the returns that

701
00:31:19,080 --> 00:31:22,200
Speaker 2: you've seen so far, unfortunately, like you basically have seen

702
00:31:22,280 --> 00:31:26,400
Speaker 2: like the you've experienced the worst four year period when

703
00:31:26,400 --> 00:31:28,960
Speaker 2: it comes to bonds since like the Great Recession, and

704
00:31:29,040 --> 00:31:30,960
Speaker 2: that is just again that's the nature of investing in

705
00:31:31,000 --> 00:31:33,960
Speaker 2: the market. It's not necessarily guaranteed, but it is what

706
00:31:34,160 --> 00:31:37,480
Speaker 2: bonds seek to do, which is to provide stability to portfolios.

707
00:31:37,920 --> 00:31:39,880
Speaker 2: And I you know, it's tough to miss out on

708
00:31:39,960 --> 00:31:42,080
Speaker 2: a bowl market like this when you are looking at

709
00:31:42,080 --> 00:31:45,200
Speaker 2: the stock market, but hopefully you have experienced some of

710
00:31:45,240 --> 00:31:47,720
Speaker 2: those gains in other accounts like a four roh andin

711
00:31:47,800 --> 00:31:50,040
Speaker 2: k or within an IRA that you have.

712
00:31:50,200 --> 00:31:50,840
Speaker 1: That's a good point.

713
00:31:51,000 --> 00:31:53,360
Speaker 2: I mean, maybe it's cold comfort, but those dollars are

714
00:31:53,360 --> 00:31:56,120
Speaker 2: designated for decades down the road, and they should be

715
00:31:56,120 --> 00:31:59,200
Speaker 2: invested mostly in the stock market, so you haven't completely

716
00:31:59,240 --> 00:32:02,560
Speaker 2: missed the glory. Is just this important portion of your

717
00:32:02,560 --> 00:32:05,800
Speaker 2: money for a down payment, but it's for a good reason, right,

718
00:32:05,840 --> 00:32:07,600
Speaker 2: Like what if the market. Let's say you're invested fully

719
00:32:07,600 --> 00:32:09,160
Speaker 2: in the stock market and the market were down thirty

720
00:32:09,200 --> 00:32:12,160
Speaker 2: percent this year instead of it being up well, your

721
00:32:12,200 --> 00:32:14,720
Speaker 2: goal of buying a home would likely need to be

722
00:32:15,160 --> 00:32:18,800
Speaker 2: punted much further down the road. Rather than not having

723
00:32:18,840 --> 00:32:22,360
Speaker 2: the most optimal returns, you possibly would have even lost money.

724
00:32:22,880 --> 00:32:25,080
Speaker 2: So that's important to keep in mind, because once you

725
00:32:25,240 --> 00:32:27,920
Speaker 2: know why you're making the decision, and you have a

726
00:32:27,920 --> 00:32:30,800
Speaker 2: good why for not investing those dollars fully in the market,

727
00:32:31,480 --> 00:32:33,000
Speaker 2: I think we would recommend for you to kind of

728
00:32:33,000 --> 00:32:35,800
Speaker 2: get zen with whatever results come your way, knowing that

729
00:32:35,840 --> 00:32:38,160
Speaker 2: you did the right thing. In this way, you have

730
00:32:38,240 --> 00:32:40,640
Speaker 2: sort of trusted the process. But I guess he's asking

731
00:32:40,680 --> 00:32:43,080
Speaker 2: what to do now, and there is an action that

732
00:32:43,320 --> 00:32:45,200
Speaker 2: he can take from this point moving forward.

733
00:32:45,360 --> 00:32:47,880
Speaker 1: And I get why you would say the results didn't

734
00:32:47,880 --> 00:32:50,560
Speaker 1: pan out as well as I'd hoped, or as well

735
00:32:50,600 --> 00:32:52,040
Speaker 1: as I could have had I just been in like

736
00:32:52,080 --> 00:32:54,800
Speaker 1: a straight up savings account. But that doesn't mean that

737
00:32:54,840 --> 00:32:56,640
Speaker 1: you did the wrong thing, right. I think that's what

738
00:32:56,640 --> 00:32:59,040
Speaker 1: you're saying, Matt, is like you might have still you

739
00:32:59,120 --> 00:33:01,640
Speaker 1: still made the decision for the right reason, and it's

740
00:33:01,680 --> 00:33:03,960
Speaker 1: important to highlight that because you don't want to brace

741
00:33:04,000 --> 00:33:06,960
Speaker 1: yourself for this move when you really shouldn't. And so

742
00:33:07,280 --> 00:33:09,040
Speaker 1: he did the right thing at the time, knowing what

743
00:33:09,080 --> 00:33:11,400
Speaker 1: he knew exactly In hindsight, it's like, well, yeah, of

744
00:33:11,440 --> 00:33:13,760
Speaker 1: course I should have just stuck my money in savings accounts,

745
00:33:13,800 --> 00:33:15,760
Speaker 1: so then at least gotten that. But well, you know,

746
00:33:16,000 --> 00:33:18,080
Speaker 1: but savings account rate sucked when he was doing this

747
00:33:18,120 --> 00:33:20,160
Speaker 1: in twenty twenty two. So it's like, you can't beat

748
00:33:20,160 --> 00:33:22,280
Speaker 1: yourself up over this, and you can't cry over spilled milk.

749
00:33:22,520 --> 00:33:24,640
Speaker 1: So what do you do with that account?

750
00:33:24,680 --> 00:33:24,760
Speaker 2: Now?

751
00:33:24,800 --> 00:33:26,200
Speaker 1: What do you do with the money in that account?

752
00:33:26,400 --> 00:33:29,400
Speaker 1: I would personally want those dollars in savings unless you're

753
00:33:29,400 --> 00:33:31,680
Speaker 1: willing to expand your timeline, like two years down the

754
00:33:31,720 --> 00:33:34,360
Speaker 1: road just really isn't that far at this point, and

755
00:33:34,400 --> 00:33:37,239
Speaker 1: it would be an absolute shame to expose yourself to

756
00:33:37,240 --> 00:33:40,120
Speaker 1: too much risk when you're getting closer and closer.

757
00:33:39,760 --> 00:33:40,440
Speaker 2: To your goal.

758
00:33:40,840 --> 00:33:43,600
Speaker 1: And we've discussed this on the show before, but CDs

759
00:33:43,640 --> 00:33:45,959
Speaker 1: are the perfect vehicle for a home down payment. These days,

760
00:33:46,200 --> 00:33:48,880
Speaker 1: rates on high save these accounts. They are starting to fall,

761
00:33:48,960 --> 00:33:51,360
Speaker 1: although they're not terrible, and you can lock in a

762
00:33:51,360 --> 00:33:54,400
Speaker 1: CD rate that can protect you against further rate drops.

763
00:33:54,480 --> 00:33:58,600
Speaker 1: So I see that as like a solid happy medium. Yeh,

764
00:33:58,680 --> 00:34:01,320
Speaker 1: to kind of preserve this capital and grow it without

765
00:34:01,320 --> 00:34:04,600
Speaker 1: taking on undue risk and potentially underperforming that savings like

766
00:34:05,080 --> 00:34:07,040
Speaker 1: you're saving, to mind, underperformed the bond market in the

767
00:34:07,080 --> 00:34:10,520
Speaker 1: coming two years. But I think it's given the timeframe

768
00:34:10,560 --> 00:34:13,920
Speaker 1: that you have left until this really important purchase, that's

769
00:34:14,040 --> 00:34:14,600
Speaker 1: the route.

770
00:34:14,400 --> 00:34:16,279
Speaker 2: I would want to take. Yeah, and there are two

771
00:34:16,320 --> 00:34:18,120
Speaker 2: year CDs out there that are over four percent that

772
00:34:18,160 --> 00:34:21,120
Speaker 2: you can find. And I would say the more flexible

773
00:34:21,120 --> 00:34:23,560
Speaker 2: you are, the more risk on that you can choose

774
00:34:23,560 --> 00:34:26,640
Speaker 2: to be, Because if you decide that renting is not

775
00:34:26,680 --> 00:34:29,120
Speaker 2: all that bad, maybe you wouldn't mind staying put for

776
00:34:29,120 --> 00:34:31,440
Speaker 2: another four years or so if need be well. If so,

777
00:34:31,520 --> 00:34:33,440
Speaker 2: then you can choose to be more stock heavy. You

778
00:34:33,480 --> 00:34:36,120
Speaker 2: can invest more aggressively, even if you want to buy

779
00:34:36,120 --> 00:34:38,160
Speaker 2: in two years. But you've got no problem kicking the

780
00:34:38,160 --> 00:34:41,279
Speaker 2: can down the road based on market conditions, right, Like

781
00:34:41,360 --> 00:34:43,000
Speaker 2: you don't have to decide now what it is that

782
00:34:43,040 --> 00:34:44,279
Speaker 2: you're going to do, you can decide in a couple

783
00:34:44,320 --> 00:34:47,200
Speaker 2: of years. If so, then investing a little more aggressively

784
00:34:47,239 --> 00:34:48,760
Speaker 2: in the market I think could be a good option.

785
00:34:49,040 --> 00:34:51,240
Speaker 2: It's not a great route for everyone to take, because

786
00:34:51,600 --> 00:34:54,360
Speaker 2: I think most folks aren't willing to have a more

787
00:34:54,440 --> 00:34:58,239
Speaker 2: sort of amorphous timeline. But if you are an optimizer

788
00:34:58,280 --> 00:35:00,200
Speaker 2: who doesn't mind being flexible, I think that could be

789
00:35:00,200 --> 00:35:01,000
Speaker 2: the best choice for you.

790
00:35:01,160 --> 00:35:03,719
Speaker 1: So, Dan, we hope that helps. We know that the

791
00:35:03,760 --> 00:35:06,400
Speaker 1: outcome over the past few years in this account hasn't

792
00:35:06,400 --> 00:35:08,200
Speaker 1: been what you hoped it would be, but we hope

793
00:35:08,200 --> 00:35:10,239
Speaker 1: you're able to continue growing those dollars over the next

794
00:35:10,239 --> 00:35:12,560
Speaker 1: couple of years and buy that house you want when

795
00:35:12,560 --> 00:35:14,600
Speaker 1: you're ready. We got more questions to get to on

796
00:35:14,920 --> 00:35:19,440
Speaker 1: this ask htm episode, including we'll talk about savings challenges

797
00:35:19,800 --> 00:35:22,600
Speaker 1: and unrest in the US and what that means for

798
00:35:22,640 --> 00:35:24,880
Speaker 1: your portfolio. We'll get to those questions right after this.

799
00:35:32,800 --> 00:35:34,279
Speaker 1: All right, Joe, we are back from the break.

800
00:35:34,360 --> 00:35:37,719
Speaker 2: Let's get to some more personal finance topics. It is

801
00:35:37,800 --> 00:35:39,879
Speaker 2: now time for the Facebook Question of the Week, which

802
00:35:39,920 --> 00:35:43,120
Speaker 2: is from Justin and he wrote, can anyone recommend a

803
00:35:43,200 --> 00:35:45,839
Speaker 2: savings challenge. I'm looking to participate in one or two,

804
00:35:45,920 --> 00:35:48,360
Speaker 2: but I am interested in those that offer savings advice

805
00:35:48,719 --> 00:35:52,200
Speaker 2: and ways to minimize spending. A Google search showed an

806
00:35:52,239 --> 00:35:54,560
Speaker 2: overwhelming number of them, so I wasn't sure where to start.

807
00:35:54,960 --> 00:35:58,080
Speaker 2: Any that you would recommend, Joel, you personally, what would

808
00:35:58,120 --> 00:35:58,680
Speaker 2: you recommend?

809
00:35:58,840 --> 00:36:01,319
Speaker 1: That's a good question, Matt, and I think people feel.

810
00:36:01,280 --> 00:36:03,759
Speaker 2: Do you like savings challenges at all? Like, what's the

811
00:36:03,480 --> 00:36:04,560
Speaker 2: what are your thoughts on that?

812
00:36:04,840 --> 00:36:06,480
Speaker 1: Do like savings challenge? I feel like last time we

813
00:36:06,520 --> 00:36:09,200
Speaker 1: talked about this, we got some flak from some listeners

814
00:36:09,239 --> 00:36:11,719
Speaker 1: and they're like, it's just moving deck chairs around on

815
00:36:11,719 --> 00:36:13,920
Speaker 1: the Titanic or something. That was kind of the general

816
00:36:13,920 --> 00:36:15,000
Speaker 1: response for people your.

817
00:36:14,920 --> 00:36:17,920
Speaker 2: Personal finances are going down, don't even try.

818
00:36:17,640 --> 00:36:20,239
Speaker 1: Well, or it's just you're just shuffling dollars around, and

819
00:36:20,239 --> 00:36:23,759
Speaker 1: so a savings challenge isn't actually doing anything meaningful for you.

820
00:36:23,800 --> 00:36:26,640
Speaker 1: But I disagree. I totally disagree. Some people find them gimmicky,

821
00:36:27,000 --> 00:36:28,600
Speaker 1: and I do think past a certain point in your

822
00:36:28,600 --> 00:36:31,960
Speaker 1: financial journey they become unnecessary. But for a whole lot

823
00:36:31,960 --> 00:36:34,880
Speaker 1: of folks who aren't inherently frugal or on the front

824
00:36:35,280 --> 00:36:38,440
Speaker 1: end of the money gears. Money challenges can make a

825
00:36:38,480 --> 00:36:40,840
Speaker 1: real difference I think in your mindset kind of in

826
00:36:40,920 --> 00:36:43,160
Speaker 1: how you just approach your personal finances in general. They

827
00:36:43,200 --> 00:36:46,880
Speaker 1: can start to shift you towards greater levels of frugality

828
00:36:46,920 --> 00:36:49,560
Speaker 1: and just intentionality with your money. And it could also

829
00:36:49,840 --> 00:36:53,279
Speaker 1: actually make a difference in your trajectory towards building wealth too.

830
00:36:53,360 --> 00:36:53,560
Speaker 3: Yeah.

831
00:36:53,640 --> 00:36:56,560
Speaker 2: Yeah, you will literally hopefully see more in your savings,

832
00:36:56,560 --> 00:36:58,360
Speaker 2: but it can just provide a framework, I think for

833
00:36:58,400 --> 00:37:01,400
Speaker 2: folks when you are well just looking at your general

834
00:37:01,480 --> 00:37:03,640
Speaker 2: personal finances, like you've got a savings account or whatever,

835
00:37:03,880 --> 00:37:06,600
Speaker 2: and there's no there's no like guardrails, there's no parameters,

836
00:37:06,640 --> 00:37:08,560
Speaker 2: there's and you don't even know what goals to set

837
00:37:08,560 --> 00:37:10,480
Speaker 2: out for yourself. But having a savings challenge can give

838
00:37:10,480 --> 00:37:13,799
Speaker 2: you something very achievable that can I think provide some

839
00:37:13,840 --> 00:37:14,840
Speaker 2: movement for folks.

840
00:37:14,719 --> 00:37:17,600
Speaker 1: Especially especially if you're like I'm in the e fund phase,

841
00:37:17,640 --> 00:37:21,400
Speaker 1: whether it's in the very first money gear of establishing

842
00:37:21,400 --> 00:37:24,680
Speaker 1: that twenty four hundred and sixty seven dollars emergency fund,

843
00:37:24,760 --> 00:37:26,719
Speaker 1: or if you're in the money gear where you're trying

844
00:37:26,719 --> 00:37:28,879
Speaker 1: to mass that three to six months, Like if you're

845
00:37:28,960 --> 00:37:31,800
Speaker 1: just trying to stop file that cash. These savings challenges

846
00:37:31,840 --> 00:37:34,480
Speaker 1: can help like get you there quicker, absolutely, and.

847
00:37:34,480 --> 00:37:36,480
Speaker 2: So we would recommend for you to head over to

848
00:37:36,560 --> 00:37:38,440
Speaker 2: our website. We actually have the few over there for

849
00:37:38,480 --> 00:37:41,120
Speaker 2: you to check out. But one that comes to mind

850
00:37:41,200 --> 00:37:44,319
Speaker 2: is the Paintry challenge. This is a food related challenge, right,

851
00:37:44,360 --> 00:37:45,800
Speaker 2: This is a way to try and cut your grocery

852
00:37:45,800 --> 00:37:47,759
Speaker 2: bill significantly over the course of a month.

853
00:37:47,840 --> 00:37:48,960
Speaker 1: Well, I thought you were going to say, this is

854
00:37:48,960 --> 00:37:51,200
Speaker 1: where you rent out your pantry on Airbnb for someone

855
00:37:51,200 --> 00:37:51,600
Speaker 1: to stan in.

856
00:37:51,760 --> 00:37:54,759
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's a form of extreme house house yeah right, No,

857
00:37:55,000 --> 00:37:57,680
Speaker 2: you literally just like empty your freezer, empty your pantry,

858
00:37:57,760 --> 00:37:59,919
Speaker 2: make do with what you've got on hand. Maybe only

859
00:38:00,600 --> 00:38:03,240
Speaker 2: head to the grocery store for like fresh veggies and milk,

860
00:38:03,320 --> 00:38:06,279
Speaker 2: but otherwise we are going to make meals based on

861
00:38:06,320 --> 00:38:08,080
Speaker 2: what we have on hand. But you can also challenge

862
00:38:08,080 --> 00:38:10,160
Speaker 2: yourself not to eat out for a full month, right,

863
00:38:10,200 --> 00:38:12,640
Speaker 2: Like you are packing your lunch, you're meal planning, you

864
00:38:12,719 --> 00:38:15,279
Speaker 2: are making bulk meals on Sundays. We've got friends who

865
00:38:15,400 --> 00:38:18,080
Speaker 2: do like the breakfast burritos and they freeze them. They

866
00:38:18,120 --> 00:38:19,920
Speaker 2: stick them in the freezer and then they take them

867
00:38:19,920 --> 00:38:21,279
Speaker 2: to work and they throw them in the microwave, that

868
00:38:21,320 --> 00:38:23,480
Speaker 2: kind of thing. But I think that's another challenge than

869
00:38:23,520 --> 00:38:26,040
Speaker 2: not eating out for a month challenge. That's another one

870
00:38:26,040 --> 00:38:27,920
Speaker 2: that can help you to cut down on that food

871
00:38:27,960 --> 00:38:28,840
Speaker 2: spending specifically.

872
00:38:28,960 --> 00:38:30,760
Speaker 1: Yeah, and those are the kind of things where normally

873
00:38:30,840 --> 00:38:33,719
Speaker 1: we just go with the flow and our food bill

874
00:38:33,840 --> 00:38:37,719
Speaker 1: remains elevated because we're not making significant changes, or maybe

875
00:38:37,800 --> 00:38:40,239
Speaker 1: we're just kind of like nibbling around the edges. And

876
00:38:40,520 --> 00:38:42,640
Speaker 1: the more extreme you can make it, the truth is

877
00:38:42,680 --> 00:38:45,000
Speaker 1: you'll realize, oh, wait, I've actually got a lot of

878
00:38:45,040 --> 00:38:47,720
Speaker 1: food randomly hanging out in my pantry or in my freezer.

879
00:38:48,040 --> 00:38:50,319
Speaker 1: That and I you know, it might not be the

880
00:38:50,320 --> 00:38:53,280
Speaker 1: most appetizing meal by like day twenty eight of the month,

881
00:38:53,680 --> 00:38:55,839
Speaker 1: but you're able to do it. You're able to pull

882
00:38:55,840 --> 00:38:57,680
Speaker 1: it off, and just to prove yourself that it can

883
00:38:57,880 --> 00:39:00,440
Speaker 1: be done, and to see how much money you might

884
00:39:00,480 --> 00:39:03,000
Speaker 1: be able to not funnel towards grocery stores there for

885
00:39:03,000 --> 00:39:05,480
Speaker 1: a hot minute, it can be pretty impressive. And yeah,

886
00:39:05,560 --> 00:39:07,640
Speaker 1: I think it could be confidence building when it comes

887
00:39:07,680 --> 00:39:09,160
Speaker 1: to your personal financial progress.

888
00:39:09,200 --> 00:39:10,880
Speaker 2: I think more than anything, that's what these challenges do.

889
00:39:10,920 --> 00:39:13,640
Speaker 2: They prove to yourself that in fact, can be done. Yeah,

890
00:39:13,640 --> 00:39:15,319
Speaker 2: but you have more control and agency of your life

891
00:39:15,320 --> 00:39:16,240
Speaker 2: than you thought otherwise.

892
00:39:16,440 --> 00:39:18,560
Speaker 1: I mean, we talk about the barebones budget sometimes, Matt,

893
00:39:18,560 --> 00:39:20,480
Speaker 1: and that's not like a money challenge per se. But

894
00:39:20,480 --> 00:39:23,239
Speaker 1: I think everyone should create a barebones budget, and that

895
00:39:23,360 --> 00:39:25,719
Speaker 1: is just to say, well, what if I did get unemployed,

896
00:39:25,719 --> 00:39:28,440
Speaker 1: what are the bear essentials I need to be spending

897
00:39:28,480 --> 00:39:29,960
Speaker 1: money on every single month? And it's like the roof

898
00:39:30,000 --> 00:39:32,080
Speaker 1: over the head, and it is the groceries on the table, right,

899
00:39:32,160 --> 00:39:34,000
Speaker 1: But then there it proves to you that there are

900
00:39:34,000 --> 00:39:36,879
Speaker 1: so many other things you actually could live without, and

901
00:39:37,000 --> 00:39:39,880
Speaker 1: maybe all of the fluff that actually is in outgoing

902
00:39:39,880 --> 00:39:41,440
Speaker 1: every month. And it's not that you want to eliminate

903
00:39:41,480 --> 00:39:44,000
Speaker 1: all those things from your life and just live a

904
00:39:44,000 --> 00:39:48,000
Speaker 1: monastic existence or something like that, but just by actually

905
00:39:48,200 --> 00:39:50,960
Speaker 1: doing the step of creating the bare bones budget, it

906
00:39:51,000 --> 00:39:53,879
Speaker 1: can be enlivening, I think, to realize that there are

907
00:39:54,120 --> 00:39:56,239
Speaker 1: a lot of changes you could make if you needed to,

908
00:39:56,520 --> 00:39:57,960
Speaker 1: and that you can make just because you want to.

909
00:39:58,000 --> 00:39:59,960
Speaker 1: If you want to make quicker progress, you could also

910
00:40:00,000 --> 00:40:02,440
Speaker 1: so I think challenge yourself to cut out all of

911
00:40:02,480 --> 00:40:05,480
Speaker 1: your recurring subscriptions for an entire month, and you might

912
00:40:05,560 --> 00:40:08,240
Speaker 1: end up leaving some of those subscriptions behind for good.

913
00:40:08,719 --> 00:40:10,680
Speaker 1: You can always, of course, go back to the ones

914
00:40:10,680 --> 00:40:12,560
Speaker 1: that you love and sign up again. You can say

915
00:40:12,600 --> 00:40:14,920
Speaker 1: I really miss Netflix or whatever it is and then

916
00:40:15,040 --> 00:40:17,120
Speaker 1: jump back, but I don't know for a whole month

917
00:40:17,280 --> 00:40:18,920
Speaker 1: to be like no streaming. What's this look like for

918
00:40:18,960 --> 00:40:21,080
Speaker 1: our family? And what's this look like for our budget?

919
00:40:21,680 --> 00:40:23,520
Speaker 1: There are other good ones on the list on our

920
00:40:23,560 --> 00:40:25,600
Speaker 1: website as well at how toomoney dot com. There's the

921
00:40:25,680 --> 00:40:29,360
Speaker 1: Seller Stuff Challenge or the wroth Ira challenge. And you know,

922
00:40:29,400 --> 00:40:31,640
Speaker 1: we like the selling stuff one because you're decluttering and

923
00:40:31,680 --> 00:40:34,759
Speaker 1: you're bringing money into your life, and then you can

924
00:40:34,880 --> 00:40:36,719
Speaker 1: use that money to fund the roth Ira that do

925
00:40:36,800 --> 00:40:38,920
Speaker 1: both at the same time. Maybe make the selling your

926
00:40:38,920 --> 00:40:41,600
Speaker 1: stuff thing be the funding the roth Ira challenge and

927
00:40:41,640 --> 00:40:44,319
Speaker 1: then yeah, I think while these challenges can act like

928
00:40:44,360 --> 00:40:47,719
Speaker 1: a financial stimulus of sorts, the goal is to keep

929
00:40:47,760 --> 00:40:50,560
Speaker 1: some of these habits up. But maybe with a little

930
00:40:50,600 --> 00:40:54,360
Speaker 1: more moderation than an extreme month long savings challenge would

931
00:40:54,480 --> 00:40:55,360
Speaker 1: encourage people to do.

932
00:40:55,520 --> 00:40:57,080
Speaker 2: That's right, and again you can find this up on

933
00:40:57,080 --> 00:40:59,239
Speaker 2: the website at howdomoney dot com a list of those

934
00:40:59,239 --> 00:41:02,680
Speaker 2: different challenges. Joe, let's take another one from John. He wrote,

935
00:41:02,680 --> 00:41:05,960
Speaker 2: We're concerned about where the US is headed and might

936
00:41:06,000 --> 00:41:08,120
Speaker 2: see a lot of unrest or even a civil war,

937
00:41:08,160 --> 00:41:11,560
Speaker 2: which would possibly collapse the dollar. I'm considering investing ten

938
00:41:11,600 --> 00:41:14,719
Speaker 2: percent of our assets in gold as a hedge. What

939
00:41:14,760 --> 00:41:18,880
Speaker 2: are your thoughts? First off, what's your personal opinion on gold?

940
00:41:18,680 --> 00:41:21,319
Speaker 2: Did you see the movie Civil War by A twenty four?

941
00:41:21,480 --> 00:41:24,160
Speaker 2: I did not? Did you? Yeah? Not great? Didn't like

942
00:41:24,239 --> 00:41:25,440
Speaker 2: it and mad in love? I thought you normally like

943
00:41:25,480 --> 00:41:27,040
Speaker 2: A twenty four? So I do? I do?

944
00:41:27,040 --> 00:41:28,960
Speaker 1: They make great movies? That one was not one of

945
00:41:29,000 --> 00:41:31,000
Speaker 1: their best? Was this one too prepper? Too prepper heavy

946
00:41:31,000 --> 00:41:31,279
Speaker 1: for you?

947
00:41:31,320 --> 00:41:33,880
Speaker 2: No? I like prepper stuff even I can like dystopian.

948
00:41:33,920 --> 00:41:37,920
Speaker 2: Why no prepper genre? I know some real sci fi dystopian. Yeah,

949
00:41:38,120 --> 00:41:39,760
Speaker 2: I like that stuff too. It doesn't mean just because

950
00:41:39,760 --> 00:41:42,160
Speaker 2: you know what prepper doesn't mean you like watching prepper movies.

951
00:41:42,719 --> 00:41:45,439
Speaker 2: I don't like watching prepper TV shows. But yeah, okay,

952
00:41:45,440 --> 00:41:48,080
Speaker 2: But let's let's get to John's actual question here. And

953
00:41:48,560 --> 00:41:51,799
Speaker 2: I think politics has got a whole lot of people

954
00:41:51,840 --> 00:41:53,719
Speaker 2: on edge right now, Matt. I think that's to me,

955
00:41:53,880 --> 00:41:56,319
Speaker 2: what this question highlights is that there's this kind of

956
00:41:56,400 --> 00:41:59,960
Speaker 2: general reticence that people have about what's happening in our

957
00:42:00,000 --> 00:42:02,799
Speaker 2: our culture and what's happening in our political sphere. And

958
00:42:02,840 --> 00:42:05,239
Speaker 2: I know that John is not alone in feeling this way,

959
00:42:05,800 --> 00:42:08,080
Speaker 2: But he's also not alone in the context of human history,

960
00:42:08,080 --> 00:42:10,480
Speaker 2: which I think it's important to point out. It's not

961
00:42:10,520 --> 00:42:14,239
Speaker 2: that truly consequential things that alter our existence and our

962
00:42:14,280 --> 00:42:18,600
Speaker 2: future don't happen. Like we've all lived through COVID, a

963
00:42:18,960 --> 00:42:22,040
Speaker 2: that was a true life changing experience for a whole

964
00:42:22,040 --> 00:42:23,960
Speaker 2: lot of people, for almost everyone listening to the show.

965
00:42:24,280 --> 00:42:26,720
Speaker 2: But it's also hard to know in advance which events

966
00:42:26,760 --> 00:42:29,319
Speaker 2: are going to make a significant impact and what the

967
00:42:29,360 --> 00:42:32,920
Speaker 2: fallout is going to be, right, Like, I think in

968
00:42:32,960 --> 00:42:34,880
Speaker 2: twenty nineteen, a lot of us thought we knew what

969
00:42:34,880 --> 00:42:38,000
Speaker 2: the future was going to hold, and then as COVID

970
00:42:38,040 --> 00:42:39,840
Speaker 2: came about, there were a lot of predictions about what

971
00:42:39,840 --> 00:42:41,400
Speaker 2: the future was going to entail, like, Hey, this is

972
00:42:41,440 --> 00:42:43,960
Speaker 2: what COVID is going to change in our lives. Business

973
00:42:43,960 --> 00:42:47,279
Speaker 2: travel is dead. New York City never coming back. No

974
00:42:47,280 --> 00:42:48,640
Speaker 2: one's going to want to live there anymore.

975
00:42:48,640 --> 00:42:51,360
Speaker 1: On top of each other, because the pandemic has proved

976
00:42:51,400 --> 00:42:52,640
Speaker 1: that large cities and.

977
00:42:53,200 --> 00:42:55,200
Speaker 2: Most the point of living in a city when there's

978
00:42:55,200 --> 00:42:57,560
Speaker 2: no entertainment to be had, right, no Broadway.

979
00:42:57,320 --> 00:42:59,600
Speaker 1: Right, the millennials are moving to rural America, and this

980
00:42:59,680 --> 00:43:01,319
Speaker 1: is going to change the face of the country for

981
00:43:01,360 --> 00:43:04,640
Speaker 1: the Yeah, it didn't happen, right, even work from Home,

982
00:43:04,920 --> 00:43:07,920
Speaker 1: which was like lauded as this is going to change everything,

983
00:43:07,920 --> 00:43:10,720
Speaker 1: and it has in some respects, but in other ways we're.

984
00:43:10,520 --> 00:43:13,600
Speaker 2: Talking about where every single week there's another company yes,

985
00:43:13,760 --> 00:43:16,560
Speaker 2: or another government agency that yes, like oh, now we're

986
00:43:16,560 --> 00:43:18,560
Speaker 2: going we're gonna go back to four, if not five

987
00:43:18,640 --> 00:43:19,160
Speaker 2: days a week.

988
00:43:19,280 --> 00:43:21,399
Speaker 1: So none of those things that we all thought were

989
00:43:21,400 --> 00:43:24,360
Speaker 1: going to be true indefinitely moving forward turned out to

990
00:43:24,400 --> 00:43:26,640
Speaker 1: be true. So I guess my first piece of advice

991
00:43:26,760 --> 00:43:29,319
Speaker 1: to John here is just to not overreact.

992
00:43:29,560 --> 00:43:32,000
Speaker 2: Yeah, you're going one hundred percent in on zoom Stock

993
00:43:32,040 --> 00:43:34,840
Speaker 2: didn't pan out either, did it, Joel thinking that, uh

994
00:43:35,360 --> 00:43:37,879
Speaker 2: what no one means you and Kathy would No. It's

995
00:43:38,120 --> 00:43:39,920
Speaker 2: not that I think that the US dollar is going

996
00:43:39,960 --> 00:43:42,799
Speaker 2: to be the world's reserve currency for forever. But there's

997
00:43:42,840 --> 00:43:46,120
Speaker 2: also not a clear there's not a better alternative rising

998
00:43:46,200 --> 00:43:48,040
Speaker 2: up to take its place. And so John, I mean,

999
00:43:48,080 --> 00:43:50,400
Speaker 2: you could certainly invest a portion of your portfolio in

1000
00:43:50,480 --> 00:43:53,200
Speaker 2: gold but then that raises other questions like, uh, what

1001
00:43:53,239 --> 00:43:55,000
Speaker 2: does that look like? Do you buy a gold fund,

1002
00:43:55,320 --> 00:43:58,160
Speaker 2: do you buy gold bullion, do you buy a physical

1003
00:43:58,160 --> 00:44:01,000
Speaker 2: gold And if things really do hit the fan, like

1004
00:44:01,040 --> 00:44:03,040
Speaker 2: a civil war, do you think that a gold fund

1005
00:44:03,160 --> 00:44:05,680
Speaker 2: or even gold bars would make you and your family

1006
00:44:05,840 --> 00:44:11,280
Speaker 2: more secure personally? Even though I find myself getting pulled

1007
00:44:11,320 --> 00:44:13,480
Speaker 2: more and more in the direction of being able to

1008
00:44:13,520 --> 00:44:15,640
Speaker 2: like live off of the grid, I am not some

1009
00:44:15,840 --> 00:44:18,360
Speaker 2: like doomsday prepper. I do not have what do you

1010
00:44:18,360 --> 00:44:22,240
Speaker 2: call it, like a reseller, a bunker lined with leads

1011
00:44:22,440 --> 00:44:24,719
Speaker 2: for like nuclear filoup or anything like that. But like

1012
00:44:24,760 --> 00:44:28,200
Speaker 2: honestly stocking up on food and living a more sustainable lifestyle,

1013
00:44:28,520 --> 00:44:31,560
Speaker 2: they probably are better ways to prepare for whatever might

1014
00:44:31,640 --> 00:44:34,160
Speaker 2: end up happening off in the future, even if you

1015
00:44:34,200 --> 00:44:35,920
Speaker 2: are assuming the worst, even if you are taking a

1016
00:44:35,960 --> 00:44:38,000
Speaker 2: more pessimistic sort of point of view.

1017
00:44:38,040 --> 00:44:40,680
Speaker 1: It's interesting that people always turn towards like gold is

1018
00:44:40,719 --> 00:44:42,359
Speaker 1: going to protect me. But then when you talk about

1019
00:44:42,400 --> 00:44:45,839
Speaker 1: their fears, like the actual solution to their fears is

1020
00:44:46,200 --> 00:44:49,359
Speaker 1: probably better planning and changing their lifestyle a little bit

1021
00:44:49,680 --> 00:44:52,920
Speaker 1: so that they can be more self sustaining instead of

1022
00:44:52,960 --> 00:44:56,800
Speaker 1: like just having a slightly slightly more of their investments

1023
00:44:56,840 --> 00:44:59,560
Speaker 1: targeted towards a gold rock. And I think ultimately, when

1024
00:44:59,560 --> 00:45:01,000
Speaker 1: it comes down to you and I'm Matt, we would

1025
00:45:01,040 --> 00:45:03,960
Speaker 1: be we'd be fine with people having gold precious metals

1026
00:45:04,000 --> 00:45:07,440
Speaker 1: allocation of roughly five percent of their portfolio, sure, preferably

1027
00:45:07,680 --> 00:45:11,239
Speaker 1: through a low cost fund like gld's. That's a good

1028
00:45:11,239 --> 00:45:13,919
Speaker 1: one if you're so inclined. And gold actually has done

1029
00:45:13,960 --> 00:45:17,040
Speaker 1: really well over the past two decades, but we just

1030
00:45:17,040 --> 00:45:19,680
Speaker 1: don't feel the need to have it ourselves, although we

1031
00:45:19,800 --> 00:45:22,359
Speaker 1: understand why you do and why some people do, and

1032
00:45:22,400 --> 00:45:24,040
Speaker 1: we don't want to minimize those feelings either.

1033
00:45:24,080 --> 00:45:26,160
Speaker 2: So it's done well over the past twenty years, but

1034
00:45:26,160 --> 00:45:27,960
Speaker 2: it hasn't done well over the past forty years. Like

1035
00:45:28,160 --> 00:45:30,360
Speaker 2: you look at the past, ye keeps dooming out and

1036
00:45:30,400 --> 00:45:31,719
Speaker 2: you're like, oh, I guess we're back to where we

1037
00:45:31,719 --> 00:45:33,799
Speaker 2: were when Joel Mett were born.

1038
00:45:35,080 --> 00:45:37,520
Speaker 1: That's right, And this was true leading up to the election.

1039
00:45:37,640 --> 00:45:40,640
Speaker 1: This is true post election. Do not let your political

1040
00:45:40,680 --> 00:45:44,360
Speaker 1: feelings run the investing ship that you're steering. And maybe

1041
00:45:44,400 --> 00:45:46,759
Speaker 1: read some US history too, like there have been so

1042
00:45:47,040 --> 00:45:50,520
Speaker 1: many other times of extreme turbulence in our nation, and

1043
00:45:50,560 --> 00:45:53,360
Speaker 1: there have been so many unforeseen black swan events, and

1044
00:45:53,400 --> 00:45:55,439
Speaker 1: it's often the things that we are pointing to as

1045
00:45:55,520 --> 00:45:58,279
Speaker 1: that's the thing that we're really nervous about. Something else

1046
00:45:58,320 --> 00:46:00,680
Speaker 1: comes out of the woodwork, and it's far scared uh

1047
00:46:00,760 --> 00:46:03,840
Speaker 1: and is far more determined of our future than the

1048
00:46:03,880 --> 00:46:05,359
Speaker 1: thing that seems most clear in the moment.

1049
00:46:05,520 --> 00:46:09,600
Speaker 2: So it's true, and maybe maybe consider bitcoin instead and.

1050
00:46:09,640 --> 00:46:11,920
Speaker 1: Humans, Matt, Humans, we just live in a perpetual state

1051
00:46:11,960 --> 00:46:13,760
Speaker 1: of chaos to a certain degree. And it's really easy.

1052
00:46:13,800 --> 00:46:17,480
Speaker 1: It's it's always easy to identify that the massive threats

1053
00:46:17,560 --> 00:46:20,919
Speaker 1: to our financial security and to our lives. But what's

1054
00:46:20,960 --> 00:46:24,160
Speaker 1: far more difficult, I think to see is the eternal

1055
00:46:24,200 --> 00:46:26,160
Speaker 1: march of human progress and the ways that we have

1056
00:46:26,200 --> 00:46:28,560
Speaker 1: all been able to benefit from that just as human beings,

1057
00:46:28,600 --> 00:46:30,880
Speaker 1: but also from a financial perspective. And so I would

1058
00:46:31,000 --> 00:46:33,960
Speaker 1: maybe refocus on that. And that's the reason why we invest,

1059
00:46:34,239 --> 00:46:36,439
Speaker 1: is because we're investing in companies who are doing good

1060
00:46:36,760 --> 00:46:39,640
Speaker 1: for us and for humanity, and we all stand a

1061
00:46:39,640 --> 00:46:41,440
Speaker 1: profit from investing in those companies.

1062
00:46:41,640 --> 00:46:44,439
Speaker 2: That certainly takes more of an abundance mindset, Joel, which

1063
00:46:44,480 --> 00:46:47,239
Speaker 2: is evidently the new theme for next year. The Ezra

1064
00:46:47,280 --> 00:46:49,759
Speaker 2: Klan book and everything else. That's I'm down with that.

1065
00:46:50,320 --> 00:46:51,920
Speaker 2: But let's get back to the beer that you and

1066
00:46:52,000 --> 00:46:54,960
Speaker 2: I enjoyed during this episode. Oat Mill Raisin Cookie Quad.

1067
00:46:55,239 --> 00:46:57,960
Speaker 2: This is a quad, a Belgian quad aged in rye

1068
00:46:57,960 --> 00:47:01,840
Speaker 2: whiskey barrels with cinnamon and rare by Monday Night Brewing.

1069
00:47:02,040 --> 00:47:03,040
Speaker 2: What were your thoughts?

1070
00:47:03,440 --> 00:47:05,640
Speaker 1: Monday Night never lets me down this.

1071
00:47:05,840 --> 00:47:07,319
Speaker 2: I just went to smell it and I put the

1072
00:47:07,360 --> 00:47:08,000
Speaker 2: cat back on.

1073
00:47:07,920 --> 00:47:10,200
Speaker 1: The des like a nerd.

1074
00:47:10,840 --> 00:47:11,480
Speaker 2: I'm an idiot.

1075
00:47:11,640 --> 00:47:13,759
Speaker 1: This so to me, this one tasted actually sweeter than

1076
00:47:13,800 --> 00:47:15,400
Speaker 1: I thought it was. It almost tasted like it was

1077
00:47:15,400 --> 00:47:18,480
Speaker 1: aged in rum barrels, because rum barrels add a lot

1078
00:47:18,480 --> 00:47:21,879
Speaker 1: of sweetness to barrel aged beers. This had I thought.

1079
00:47:21,920 --> 00:47:24,480
Speaker 1: The cinnamon came through nicely, absolutely delish.

1080
00:47:24,760 --> 00:47:27,560
Speaker 2: I love this beer. Interesting that you mentioned rum barrels

1081
00:47:27,560 --> 00:47:29,600
Speaker 2: because I felt like, like right off the bat, like

1082
00:47:29,680 --> 00:47:32,880
Speaker 2: right out of the gate, that rye flavor is the

1083
00:47:32,880 --> 00:47:34,640
Speaker 2: first thing I noticed. And then once it warms up

1084
00:47:34,640 --> 00:47:35,880
Speaker 2: in your mouth a little bit, you taste some of

1085
00:47:35,880 --> 00:47:38,560
Speaker 2: that some of those raisins, some of that cinnamon spice

1086
00:47:38,680 --> 00:47:40,960
Speaker 2: makes you think of like a snicker doodle mixed with

1087
00:47:40,960 --> 00:47:43,960
Speaker 2: a oatmeal raisin cookie, which oatmeal Raisin. I know you

1088
00:47:44,000 --> 00:47:45,399
Speaker 2: don't like, but I'm a huge fan.

1089
00:47:45,800 --> 00:47:48,240
Speaker 1: I love snickerdoodles though the indiotis the season.

1090
00:47:48,680 --> 00:47:52,120
Speaker 2: You gotta check out the girls and made a batch

1091
00:47:52,160 --> 00:47:56,280
Speaker 2: of snickerdoodles yesterday. Oh that included They were someone inviting

1092
00:47:56,320 --> 00:47:58,720
Speaker 2: myself over tonight. They were short on something and instead

1093
00:47:58,760 --> 00:48:03,839
Speaker 2: included coconut as a substitute. They turned out amazing nice.

1094
00:48:03,880 --> 00:48:05,600
Speaker 2: I forget what it was that they substituted, but it

1095
00:48:05,640 --> 00:48:08,600
Speaker 2: was quite delicious and hopefully we'll be able to save

1096
00:48:08,600 --> 00:48:10,799
Speaker 2: one or two for you. Please do. We're entering that

1097
00:48:10,840 --> 00:48:14,560
Speaker 2: like Christmas cookie baking season, aren't we most But that's

1098
00:48:14,560 --> 00:48:16,319
Speaker 2: gonna be it for this episode. You can find show

1099
00:48:16,320 --> 00:48:18,880
Speaker 2: notes up on the websites. There you will see some

1100
00:48:18,920 --> 00:48:20,640
Speaker 2: of the different resources that we mentioned.

1101
00:48:20,960 --> 00:48:22,640
Speaker 1: Head over, including those savings challenges.

1102
00:48:22,760 --> 00:48:25,319
Speaker 2: That's right. Head over to wherever it is that you're

1103
00:48:25,320 --> 00:48:27,760
Speaker 2: listening to this podcast. Actually leave us a solid review.

1104
00:48:28,320 --> 00:48:30,920
Speaker 2: It always helps others to find the show to enable

1105
00:48:30,960 --> 00:48:34,200
Speaker 2: them to start making better financial decisions with their own

1106
00:48:34,239 --> 00:48:36,160
Speaker 2: money and think about like an early Christmas present for

1107
00:48:36,200 --> 00:48:38,600
Speaker 2: the two of us. Oh, I'll take it, but that's

1108
00:48:38,600 --> 00:48:40,879
Speaker 2: gonna be it for this episode, Buddy. Until next time,

1109
00:48:41,040 --> 00:48:43,600
Speaker 2: best friends out, best friends out