Speaker 1: He's time to say your legs the girls by we
Speaker 1: will sit you.
Speaker 2: In tow's the gunners.
Speaker 3: Welcome to Wednesday, April nineteenth on the Just Baseball Show.
Speaker 3: It is the mail bag where we answer all of
Speaker 3: your questions, whether that be from our Twitter at just Bbie,
Speaker 3: Underscore Media, or our Instagram at Just Baseball Show. We
Speaker 3: do this every other Wednesday. Arm and I hop on
Speaker 3: the mic answer all of your amazing questions that you
Speaker 3: left for us on those social media pages. Make sure
Speaker 3: if you want to be featured on the Just Baseball
Speaker 3: Show to leave your questions When we dropped a little
Speaker 3: mail bag post. It's kind of rudimentary, but it works
Speaker 3: and we get hundreds of questions. They're all awesome. We
Speaker 3: wish we could get to all of them, but we
Speaker 3: have seven. We are going to do a little kind
Speaker 3: of look at the odds of bet MGM right because
Speaker 3: we're weirdly enough. Dude, we're ten percent through the season
Speaker 3: so far, which is insane. I feel like it just
Speaker 3: started eight minutes ago. So we're gonna look at some
Speaker 3: division odds see if there's any value answer some questions.
Speaker 3: But first Hunter Green gets hit on the leg and
Speaker 3: to start against the Reds or excuse me for the
Speaker 3: Reds on a start against the Rays and you know
Speaker 3: what the Reds do. You're fine, We're gonna give you
Speaker 3: six years, fifty three million. What was your reaction arm
Speaker 3: to the extension.
Speaker 2: I think I think they just felt bad. They had
Speaker 2: like a booboo. They wanted to make them feel a
Speaker 2: little better. But now it's awesome. It is. It's good
Speaker 2: when the notoriously cheap and frustrating teams extend their young stars.
Speaker 2: And while it's only two years on top of the
Speaker 2: years of control, so it'll be one more year of
Speaker 2: control and then a club option after that, so it
Speaker 2: buys the Reds two more years. It also gives Hunter
Speaker 2: Green some much needed, you know, financial stability. Just I
Speaker 2: think that all of these players need to have in
Speaker 2: the early going of their career, especially someone like Hunter
Speaker 2: Green that's dealt with some arm issues in the past.
Speaker 2: I think some people might look at the deal and say,
Speaker 2: oh wow, that baseline is really cheap, but it has
Speaker 2: escalators that bring it up to ninety plus million, and
Speaker 2: I think it's a fair contract given his injury history.
Speaker 2: When he's healthy, he's fantastic. He's been pretty healthy over
Speaker 2: the last couple of years. Overall, he's had just some
Speaker 2: small flare ups. But it's just good to see the
Speaker 2: Reds start to lock up the core because we've talked
Speaker 2: about their talent, they're getting there, start to identify the
Speaker 2: pieces that are part of your future and lock those
Speaker 2: guys up. So that's exciting for Cincinnati and hopefully Reds
Speaker 2: fans have something to be happy about.
Speaker 3: And I hope they'll Nickelodolo even though as we're speaking
Speaker 3: right now, six earned runs against the Rays. It's all right,
Speaker 3: the razor crazy. Yes, he just gave up six earned
Speaker 3: against the Rays and we're like in the third inning,
Speaker 3: so that could be a tough start. But he's a
Speaker 3: guy you have to lock down. Gray Ashcraft is a
Speaker 3: guy you have to lock down. One more good news
Speaker 3: and then we're going to get to two things that
Speaker 3: are rather shitty to be honest with. So the first one,
Speaker 3: while we already talked about hundred green, the second one
Speaker 3: Mason Miller of the Oakland A's the sun is shining
Speaker 3: in the Bay Area for once, because Mauson Miller is
Speaker 3: a freak and the A's just vaulted him up because
Speaker 3: he already looks like a big leaguer.
Speaker 2: Yes, and he was a guest on the call up.
Speaker 2: I highly encourage and he wants to go listen to
Speaker 2: that podcast that was before the season. Miller as one
Speaker 2: of the coolest stories, which is going to be featured
Speaker 2: on Just Baseball dot com. Actually right now, by the
Speaker 2: time you're listening to this, the feature story I wrote
Speaker 2: in my conversation with Mason Miller is up. And he
Speaker 2: didn't find out I want boyo with all of it,
Speaker 2: use We've got a lot to talk about here. But
Speaker 2: he didn't find out that he was a ty one
Speaker 2: diabetic until his sophomore summer at Division III Waynesburg get
Speaker 2: Is sevent era. Through his first two years of Division
Speaker 2: one baseball was down thirty pounds and was like, what
Speaker 2: the heck is going on? I don't feel good. I
Speaker 2: don't feel right. And it wasn't until he had an
Speaker 2: internship with a health office somewhere where he had to
Speaker 2: provide a urine sample where they were like, hey, do
Speaker 2: you know that you're diabetic? And he's like what, So
Speaker 2: that's how he found out treated that and then all
Speaker 2: of a sudden starts throwing up her nineties so it's
Speaker 2: an awesome story. But now you're seeing him at the
Speaker 2: big or at the minor league level, professionally, he looks insane.
Speaker 2: I talked to a couple guys that faced him recently
Speaker 2: in Triple A who said, best fastball I've ever seen.
Speaker 2: And they told me that a couple big leaguers on
Speaker 2: that team that are now down in Triple A said
Speaker 2: it was the best fastball they've seen and they were
Speaker 2: playing in the big leagues not long ago. So that
Speaker 2: says a lot about Mason Miller. More on him in
Speaker 2: that story. But if you have some free time tonight
Speaker 2: as you're listening to this episode, mark your calendar, your schedule,
Speaker 2: watch that Ace. I don't know, he might he might
Speaker 2: have some growing pains in his first start, but he's
Speaker 2: one O two with life, uh and that's fun to
Speaker 2: watch no matter no matter how well he pitches.
Speaker 3: And we do this a lot, right And we got
Speaker 3: a comment on Twitter when we started the mail bag,
Speaker 3: were you guys? And when I see you guys, I
Speaker 3: mean us three you, Jack and I. We talk about prospects,
Speaker 3: you know, we glow about them right like their next
Speaker 3: step that we'd take them over the vet And in
Speaker 3: some cases, and you laid it out in the comment
Speaker 3: like some cases, we truly do think that the prospect
Speaker 3: is better right now than the veteran right Matt Mervis
Speaker 3: with the Chicago Cubs, even though Osmer is having a
Speaker 3: pretty good start. You gave other examples too, but I
Speaker 3: think this is the best example of when a prospect
Speaker 3: is legit going to be better than the rest of
Speaker 3: the rotation. When we're looking at James Caprillian, Chitaro Fujinami
Speaker 3: who did kind of pitch well against the Mets out
Speaker 3: of nowhere, jpc yours who also pitched pretty well against
Speaker 3: the Mets, and then you got other arms like ken
Speaker 3: Walda Chuck and we can go through the line. But
Speaker 3: this guy, Mason Miller, might be the best pitcher on
Speaker 3: the Oakland A staff right now, right which.
Speaker 2: Is awesome, and that's why I'm glad they're calling him up.
Speaker 2: Twenty eight ge or twenty eight innings in the minor
Speaker 2: leagues plus the areson a fall league. Not a lot
Speaker 2: of action, but I don't think you need to see
Speaker 2: much more. It's one hundred to one hundred and two.
Speaker 2: It's a plus breaking ball. He added a cutter at
Speaker 2: ninety five, which he actually said on the call up.
Speaker 2: That was like his kind of announcement of the pitch.
Speaker 2: It's like, yeah, been playing around with this cutter. I
Speaker 2: was like, whoa, whoah, tell me about this cutter. So
Speaker 2: he starts talking about the cutter and he's like, yeah,
Speaker 2: it's ninety five, Like I think it can make me special.
Speaker 2: It's like, well, it's making him special. He looks really
Speaker 2: good and then he's got the feel for the change up.
Speaker 2: It's about the health for him, his shoulder. He had
Speaker 2: a little bit of a shoulder strain last year that
Speaker 2: cut a season shorts. But if he's healthy, my goodness,
Speaker 2: he could be special. And I'm glad that the a's
Speaker 2: are being aggressive with him.
Speaker 3: Speaking about health too. Bad things in the American League
Speaker 3: East number one, Jeffrey Springs Tommy John will be out
Speaker 3: for the season. We actually not like we broke the news,
Speaker 3: but I heard the news when I was streaming on
Speaker 3: Twitch on our Not Gambling Advice show four thirty to
Speaker 3: six thirty pm Eastern Monday through Friday. And we hear
Speaker 3: in the chat Jeffrey Springs TJ. Jeffrey Springs TJ, what
Speaker 3: happened to Jeffrey Springs and I look MLB trade rumors
Speaker 3: Jeffrey Springs out for the year, will get Tommy John surgery,
Speaker 3: which I had an immediate reaction of That stinks, like
Speaker 3: that is a killer because this guy, by a lot
Speaker 3: of metrics, was one of the best pitchers in baseball.
Speaker 3: Rays don't just extend anyone, right, and they extended Jeffrey
Speaker 3: Springs before this season began, and he showed why the
Speaker 3: Rays loved him so much. Electric left hander. There was
Speaker 3: times where I was watching them Jeffrey Springs starts and
Speaker 3: I was like, wow, Sean McLennan is the second best
Speaker 3: lefty on his own, even though he's one of the
Speaker 3: best lefties of baseball. That's how well Jeffrey Springs was pitching.
Speaker 3: So when fortunately Tommy John for him and then gin
Speaker 3: Carlos Stanton, it's a tail as old as time. Unfortunately,
Speaker 3: six weeks Grade two hamstring strain and six weeks yeah right,
Speaker 3: it's gonna be eight. Like he'll be back in the
Speaker 3: middle of June. You know. I'm on the phone my dad,
Speaker 3: a huge Yankee fan, and he's like, when do you
Speaker 3: think Stanton's gonna come back? And I'm like, who cares? October.
Speaker 3: That's all we need him for. Like, yeah, and he
Speaker 3: was surprised, right, My dad was surprised, And I'm like,
Speaker 3: how can you be surprised at this point with a
Speaker 3: guy like Stanton? Every year it's continuous, it's just when
Speaker 3: is it going to happen? It's unfortunate. He's a great talent,
Speaker 3: but like this is kind of the story of his
Speaker 3: career at this point is just he plays really well, Bang,
Speaker 3: he's out, and then it's rehabbing and then we're back.
Speaker 4: Right.
Speaker 2: There was some years with the Marlins through his prime
Speaker 2: where he was in the middle of some awesome campaigns
Speaker 2: and Marlins team that like desperately needed him. He was
Speaker 2: MVP with the Marlins, and when they were hanging around
Speaker 2: the wild Card, he'd go down and then the team
Speaker 2: would kind of just fall apart. And it sucks because
Speaker 2: if he's been on the field as much as some
Speaker 2: of the other guys you know, over the last ten years,
Speaker 2: he'd be pushing towards a lot of really exciting milestones
Speaker 2: and he still has a shot to crack those milestones.
Speaker 2: But I agree with you, like the hamstring that that lingers,
Speaker 2: especially for a guy like Stanton and I think he's
Speaker 2: almost just too much of a beast, like he's too
Speaker 2: muscular and just too strong, where his muscles just go
Speaker 2: from time to time, which sucks. On the spring point,
Speaker 2: I'm very happy that he got his bag before this year.
Speaker 2: That part is at least a nice silver lining and
Speaker 2: it is at least just Tommy John, which is just
Speaker 2: to me, it seems like more just like this, it's
Speaker 2: like this paid vacation now where.
Speaker 3: It's just Tommy John. That's what we've done to Is
Speaker 3: it really at that point I've got anymore? I mean,
Speaker 3: you're off for the season.
Speaker 2: It's just a duration. It's how long it takes that sucks.
Speaker 2: But in terms of like if you told me, you know,
Speaker 2: shoulder strain, like two shoulder strains that come up in
Speaker 2: the same year, or Tommy John, I think I'd rather
Speaker 2: have the Tommy John because the shoulder strains don't seem
Speaker 2: to go away and it usually points towards something else.
Speaker 2: Tommy John a lot of times he's got to take
Speaker 2: care of it and then they're good to go. It
Speaker 2: almost seems like a foregone conclusion for most pitchers. A
Speaker 2: lot of them get it out of the way earlier
Speaker 2: and again, I hope humans evolve to not need UCLs anymore,
Speaker 2: but wishing Jeffrey Springs to speedy recovery and the raise.
Speaker 2: The good news for them is next man up, they'll
Speaker 2: bring somebody else back from the il like a glass now. Uh,
Speaker 2: And then I think we'll see a lot more TODs Bradley,
Speaker 2: who pitches tonight as we're recording this.
Speaker 3: And we're speaking about the Rays. So that leads us
Speaker 3: into our first question of the mail bag. The current
Speaker 3: raise infield is solid with Yanni Diaz, Brandon Lao Wannafranco,
Speaker 3: and Isak Pretties, with Taylor Wallas as the third middle
Speaker 3: infielder who is already doing well off like Nick Lidolo,
Speaker 3: kind of a lefty killer with Curtis Mead Manzardo. I
Speaker 3: don't even know who this is? You correct me? Bisabi?
Speaker 2: Yes, Ocelevis Bisab, who I actually love. That was the
Speaker 2: guy that we hyped up a lot on the on
Speaker 2: the Rays prospect rankings. But yeah, Basabe is an infielder
Speaker 2: as well.
Speaker 3: Perfect. And so the question is what is the infield
Speaker 3: light looking like in August if everyone is healthy? That
Speaker 3: comes from us from at Todd Bernias B e r
Speaker 3: ni Us on our Instagram. So, Arm, this is a
Speaker 3: perfect question for you. I mean, with the way the
Speaker 3: Rays are playing, as good as these young guys are,
Speaker 3: it would be nice to see Curtis, Mead, Manzarto and Basabe.
Speaker 3: But at the end of the day, like were you
Speaker 3: taken out of that injury?
Speaker 2: That's the thing. Man Manzarto is off to a phenomenal start,
Speaker 2: but I think he's somebody that has a little bit
Speaker 2: more time. Mead is actually off to a slow start,
Speaker 2: so that helps a little bit in terms of the
Speaker 2: log jam. And then Basab is awesome, really really good
Speaker 2: back to ball guy. He's a plus hitter, a potentially
Speaker 2: plus plus hitter, and he's actually hitting them all harder
Speaker 2: than people expect it. But I still think of is
Speaker 2: like this second base or infield utility type. If it
Speaker 2: ain't broke, don't fix it. And I don't think we're
Speaker 2: going to see any of those guys until somebody gets hurt.
Speaker 2: Hopefully that doesn't happen. I think if somebody gets hurt,
Speaker 2: then we'd see probably one of those guys. I guess
Speaker 2: it depends on who gets hurts. I think they're all
Speaker 2: pretty equally ready. I'd say Basab might be the most
Speaker 2: ready given his bats to ball skills and versatility. But
Speaker 2: like you said, Peter, who you booting? Even Eastok Perettis
Speaker 2: has been swinging it well, I don't. I don't really
Speaker 2: know who you would remove from this lineup. And Taylor
Speaker 2: Walls just took Nickeldolo deep and I think you just
Speaker 2: picked up like a double the next at bat, like
Speaker 2: if Walls is swinging a two with his defensive ability,
Speaker 2: like who are you bumping? I'm very interested to see
Speaker 2: what they do. I'm actually floored by what Taylor Walls's
Speaker 2: numbers are actually enting to entering today. I don't think
Speaker 2: you do anything. I think it's similar to the Oriole
Speaker 2: situation that we're going to talk about, like you kind
Speaker 2: of just sit on them.
Speaker 3: Potentially a trade, right, you can potually look at one,
Speaker 3: maybe he gets some outfield help like Randy has got
Speaker 3: it locked up, but then you have Josh Lowe and
Speaker 3: Manny Margo and it's not like they need help there.
Speaker 3: But potentially, could a Brian Reynolds trade be in the cards.
Speaker 3: It never happens with the Rays. It's so out of
Speaker 3: the ordinary for them. I'm just thinking of ways to
Speaker 3: be creative here, because they have such a glut of
Speaker 3: incredible Again, everyone on their major league roster is incredible.
Speaker 3: They're just an incredible team. So I guess let's just
Speaker 3: move on to our second question, and it's a good one.
Speaker 3: Out of the surprise teams that have started hot, and
Speaker 3: the three listed were the Pittsburgh Pirates, the Arizona Diamondbacks,
Speaker 3: and the Chicago Cubs, which team do you think can
Speaker 3: have the most sustained long term success? That was asked
Speaker 3: by at Riley Underscore mcl wai N two on Instagram.
Speaker 2: That's a really good question.
Speaker 3: The crazy thing is, I don't know if there's a
Speaker 3: wrong answer here, but all are off the great starts.
Speaker 3: The Cubs are near the top of the division. If
Speaker 3: it weren't for the Brewers being twelve and five, one
Speaker 3: of baseball's best records. The d Backs look like they
Speaker 3: have an outside shot at making the playoffs. That's a
Speaker 3: good day then. And then you have the Cubs, who
Speaker 3: just continue to win games, go into Los Angeles great
Speaker 3: series against them. These are three teams that are massively
Speaker 3: over performing expectations. I would say the Pirates have overperformed
Speaker 3: the most, even though I think the Cubs and the
Speaker 3: d Backs are playing better baseball, but we thought the
Speaker 3: Pirates might be bottom dwellers, and there are anything from it.
Speaker 3: So who's your choice? I guess because there really is
Speaker 3: no wrong answer. It's more of a thought exercise.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I say, let's walk through this together because I
Speaker 2: want to see where you're at. T Backs is a
Speaker 2: team I have a little bias towards just leading into
Speaker 2: this because that was a team I liked better going
Speaker 2: into the season. So there's gonna be some confirmation by
Speaker 2: us on that performance. The Cubs, the thing with them
Speaker 2: is we didn't really account for Cody Bellinger looking like this. Yes,
Speaker 2: it's only a dozen games, but if Cody Bellinger's swinging
Speaker 2: it like this and then the Cubs look a lot different,
Speaker 2: then you're gonna swap out Eric Cosmer, who's probably been
Speaker 2: now after the good five games to start to slow down,
Speaker 2: Like you swap that out for one of the best
Speaker 2: offensive prospects right now in baseball and Matt Murvis. That
Speaker 2: helps bolster your offense. They're gonna get say a Suzuki,
Speaker 2: you know, really rolling again for them and just got
Speaker 2: them back in the lineup like this. Team is gonna
Speaker 2: get better. The pitching is a little bit of a concern.
Speaker 2: We'll see how that holds up. But they've got Danzby Swanson, they'
Speaker 2: spent money, They've got a little bit more star power
Speaker 2: on that team. The d Backs are younger and more volatile,
Speaker 2: but also I think are more balanced across the board,
Speaker 2: if that makes sense, Like you're leaning on performances from
Speaker 2: guys that are less established, but guys I believe in.
Speaker 2: So I'm gonna say d Backs. Wouldn't surprise me if
Speaker 2: it's the Cubs, but I'm gonna say d Backs because
Speaker 2: they're doing this right now with like mad bum mad
Speaker 2: bum pitching. You swap him out for Brandon Thought. I
Speaker 2: think Corbyn Carroll is gonna be one of those guys
Speaker 2: who just gets stronger as the year gets goes on
Speaker 2: and gets better and better. Longo looks good. I like
Speaker 2: the whole team, and that's without Moreno really getting going.
Speaker 2: I think a lot of the pitching staff is still
Speaker 2: going to get better and better. Bullpen's a concerned, but
Speaker 2: I think a bullpen's concern for almost any of these
Speaker 2: middling teams.
Speaker 3: And Andrew Chafin has been that dude in the back
Speaker 3: end of the Arizona Diamback's bullpen. And a guy who
Speaker 3: I think is becoming maybe one of the most underrated
Speaker 3: players in all of baseball. That's Josh Rojas. I got
Speaker 3: I can play all over the field and is a
Speaker 3: really good hitter. He is just like he's one of
Speaker 3: those guys who you know, kind of doesn't get talked
Speaker 3: about because we talked about all these young, exciting guys
Speaker 3: on the Diamondbacks, and it's like him leading the way consistently.
Speaker 3: Guy like Lordi Scuriell, Junior, Christian Walker, Ketel Marte. They
Speaker 3: have a lot of good players, and then the emergence
Speaker 3: of Dre Jamison is another arm. You know, Ryan Nelson
Speaker 3: is a good arm. Then you have Zach Allen, who
Speaker 3: can lead any staff in Major League Baseball with his stuff.
Speaker 3: We saw him dominate the Miami Marlins. We're going to
Speaker 3: talk about that trade in a little while. They are
Speaker 3: the most exciting team, and I think one aspect of
Speaker 3: the Diamondbacks that again goes a little bit underreported, is
Speaker 3: that I think they are one of the teams that
Speaker 3: benefits the most from these new rules. Right They're a
Speaker 3: scrappy team that likes to put the ball on the
Speaker 3: ground and that helps with no shift, bigger bases, you
Speaker 3: know the pickoff rules. They're stealing back bases like nobody's business.
Speaker 3: This is a fast, exciting team and they play really
Speaker 3: good defense too, Like we talk about Alec Thomas in centerfield,
Speaker 3: Corbyn Carroll in a corner when he could be an
Speaker 3: elite center fielder, you know, Heraldo Perdomo is not the best,
Speaker 3: you know, hitter, but he can pick it at short
Speaker 3: and that's the reason why he's in the bigs. Christian Walker,
Speaker 3: gold Glover, Josh Rowss can play all over the infield
Speaker 3: to tell Marte and then Gaby Maraino, Like, this team
Speaker 3: is set up perfectly for this new age of baseball,
Speaker 3: and we're gushing over the Diamondbacks. Shouldn't take away from
Speaker 3: the Pirates of the Cubs either, like all three of
Speaker 3: these teams. That's why it's such a good question and
Speaker 3: there is no wrong answer, is because they're all set
Speaker 3: up really nicely. So the US are out overperforming. And
Speaker 3: this isn't even the Cubs window yet they have all
Speaker 3: these great prospects that you and Jack talk about at nauseum.
Speaker 3: How about the Pirates they're going to get Dylan Cruz
Speaker 3: O'Neil Cruz isn't even playing in their winning games. Yeah,
Speaker 3: like all three of these teams. If you are a fan,
Speaker 3: I would be very excited right now, Like this is
Speaker 3: a great question.
Speaker 2: Yeah, one hundred percent, and real quick, just to highlight
Speaker 2: that the Pirates, I mean to get what they're getting
Speaker 2: from mccutch and I hope he does it as long
Speaker 2: as possible because it's so awesome to see him performing
Speaker 2: in a Pirates uniform. But you know, just to see
Speaker 2: what Brian Reynolds is doing. I know he's come down
Speaker 2: to earth a little bit, but that's been really solid.
Speaker 3: I mean he came down from hitting a home run
Speaker 3: every single Yeah, from every single like that.
Speaker 2: I love g Wan Bay. I think he's going to
Speaker 2: continue to get going offensively. But they've got a lot
Speaker 2: of pieces that I think are contributing and can serve
Speaker 2: their role pretty well. And I think the pitching selled
Speaker 2: up better than people thought. I do think they're going
Speaker 2: to slow down a little bit, but yeah, I think
Speaker 2: the final answer is d backs. But all these teams
Speaker 2: I think are going to be much more watchable than
Speaker 2: a lot of people might have expected, especially many of
Speaker 2: their cynical fans, specifically on the Pirates side.
Speaker 3: This is a perfect question for you, and we are
Speaker 3: going back to the Rays, but this question isn't about
Speaker 3: the Rays. So question number three. If the Rays are
Speaker 3: the model for developing pitching, which teams do you consider
Speaker 3: the leaders in hitting development? What a fascinating question because
Speaker 3: while the Rays are the leaders, you'd say, but like
Speaker 3: the Dodgers are pretty damn good at it in terms
Speaker 3: of developing pitching, the Guardians are pretty damn good at it.
Speaker 3: The Mariners, right, bringing up George Kirby, Right, they got
Speaker 3: Bryce Miller coming in the minor leagues, like Emerson Hancock
Speaker 3: looks good. There are a lot of teams at the
Speaker 3: forefront of this, and I'm sure there are a lot
Speaker 3: of teams at the forefront of offense for you.
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's a great question, and there's a lot that
Speaker 2: goes into it because I think it's it's measurable by
Speaker 2: how many guys did you draft or trade for in
Speaker 2: the minor leagues and then of course develop into big
Speaker 2: league pieces. But also it's just kind of looking at
Speaker 2: it anecdotally from player to player and saying like, okay,
Speaker 2: they took this guy that was struggling and really helped
Speaker 2: him kick it into another gear. Or this guy was
Speaker 2: pretty good and now he's just hit another stride. And
Speaker 2: then there's also like the question of is it scouting
Speaker 2: or development, because some teams are really good at both.
Speaker 2: Some teams might be better than at one than the other,
Speaker 2: and you don't know because the other kind of mask
Speaker 2: masks the other. But I think the Astros have to
Speaker 2: be up there, and I might put the Astros at
Speaker 2: number one just because of the fact that you look
Speaker 2: at their roster top to bottom right now, and you
Speaker 2: look at their team, A lot of those guys are homegrown.
Speaker 2: And then even guys that they didn't specifically sign, they developed.
Speaker 2: Nobody thought jord On Alvarez was gonna was gonna be
Speaker 2: what he is, and look at what he developed into.
Speaker 2: They traded for him at the lower levels. Yeah, Bregman
Speaker 2: was a top pick, but he's hit his ceiling. Jeremy
Speaker 2: Panel was a development master class from what they've had there.
Speaker 2: You look at Kyle Tucker, who hit some snags at
Speaker 2: point people were wondering whether he was gonna hit his ceiling.
Speaker 2: He does. And then you've got the tween or types
Speaker 2: like a Chas McCormick who gets better and better and
Speaker 2: better and turns into a really solid option for them.
Speaker 2: So for me, it's got to be guys like that,
Speaker 2: because the don't even get the role players like David Hensley,
Speaker 2: who turned into valuable or at least somewhat productive. That's
Speaker 2: for them. I'd say that the Astros are right there.
Speaker 2: The Cardinals are in the same boat. When you get
Speaker 2: the large noop bars of the world, the Tyler O'Neals
Speaker 2: who you trade for and then unlock more out of him,
Speaker 2: and then a lot of the other guys we could
Speaker 2: talk about, obviously Jordan Walker's development. You see other guys
Speaker 2: that are really doing well, but I think the Astros
Speaker 2: have to be the gold standard. I also think the
Speaker 2: Yankees don't get enough praise. They do a really good
Speaker 2: job of getting the most out of there of their bats,
Speaker 2: especially guys that have come through the minor League's Anthony
Speaker 2: Volpi one of the best examples, but even Jason Dimingez,
Speaker 2: the changes he's made, the improvements he's made, Oswald Perrazza,
Speaker 2: and then guys at the big league level, Aaron Judge, Hello,
Speaker 2: that's not a guy that like just rolled out hit
Speaker 2: that tooks more.
Speaker 3: Like the end of the first round out of Fresno State,
Speaker 3: and he looks terrible.
Speaker 2: Like I his swing if you I saw some video
Speaker 2: on the Cape. I was like, Geez, would not have
Speaker 2: taken this guy. So you know, I think the Yankees
Speaker 2: are a dark horse in that as well. And then
Speaker 2: of course the Dodgers.
Speaker 3: Of course, because the Dodgers are just the answer kind
Speaker 3: of for everything about the gold standard. And then how
Speaker 3: about just another guy with Yankee Spencer Jones is a
Speaker 3: guy who's flying up prospect lists and he was a
Speaker 3: guy who I was like, oh wait, we're taking him
Speaker 3: in the first round. And it's like, well, he might
Speaker 3: have gotten number one overall if we redid that draft
Speaker 3: based on the house. But he's so question number four
Speaker 3: Cardinals fans are pissed, and I understand. And this next
Speaker 3: question is the Cardinals pitching seems to be getting worse.
Speaker 3: That's just that's the start of the question. Good thing
Speaker 3: we have Grandpa Waino making his rehab start. They need
Speaker 3: to be eighty three and sixty five for the rest
Speaker 3: of the season to get to ninety wins. Do they
Speaker 3: do it? Or are they throwing out another year of
Speaker 3: really nice offense. This was asked by Seth Partney on Twitter.
Speaker 3: We're talking about a nauseum, dude.
Speaker 2: Before you say anything, you know, fan bases and shambles
Speaker 2: when they're doing the math of what they need to
Speaker 2: do to get to ninety wins. That will always make
Speaker 2: you feel like shit as a fan. I promise we're
Speaker 2: ten percent into the season, like Peter sent off the cuff.
Speaker 2: No matter what, if you do the math to how
Speaker 2: it you get to ninety wins after a swell start,
Speaker 2: you're gonna make yourself miserable. Don't do that. And also
Speaker 2: they can very easily go eighty three and sixty five.
Speaker 2: But anyway, Peter, thefloor is yours.
Speaker 3: I mean, the question at hand is what do they
Speaker 3: do right? Like the question at hand is more do
Speaker 3: we think they have it in the tank? And Cardinals
Speaker 3: fans are looking for some optimism and I can be
Speaker 3: optimistic about Jack Flerity. Jack Flaerity a.
Speaker 2: Good last start.
Speaker 3: His command hasn't been there, but guess what, he's fixing
Speaker 3: it and he's getting better. And this is a guy
Speaker 3: who we can't forget. In twenty nineteen was one of
Speaker 3: the better pitchers in the now National League. And it's
Speaker 3: not like he looks unhealthy. Yeah, he has some command
Speaker 3: issues early on, but he's got this new fastball that
Speaker 3: looks really good. His slider looks sharp, breaking stuff looks good.
Speaker 3: They got Libby coming up from the pipe, and like
Speaker 3: we'll see, could be another rookie who ends up not
Speaker 3: being what we might think. But you and Jack have
Speaker 3: talked about the game.
Speaker 2: Jack's calling a game with him on the mountain right
Speaker 2: now as we record.
Speaker 3: Amazing, So we'll have you know, a recap of how
Speaker 3: that went, and we'll talk to Jack, because I know
Speaker 3: Cardinals fans are looking for pitchers, and what I do
Speaker 3: know is if you are a team in need of pitching,
Speaker 3: the Cardinals are in the best spot to make a
Speaker 3: big time trade. They have so many young hitting prospects.
Speaker 3: Now we've talked about this at nauseum because they just
Speaker 3: ain't doing it right. They did trade Harrison Beta for
Speaker 3: Jordan Montgomery, so it's not like they're, you know, allergic
Speaker 3: to doing stuff like that. They brought in Jose Kintana,
Speaker 3: they just haven't brought in the all time ace that
Speaker 3: Cardinals fans are looking for. The they want to hang
Speaker 3: their hat on and say, every fifth day, we can
Speaker 3: give this guy a ball and we should win the game.
Speaker 3: And that's what you need as a World Series contender?
Speaker 3: Is that type of starter? Now you know, whould they
Speaker 3: make a deal with the Marlins for Sandy? Of course
Speaker 3: they might be able to, but we're grasping at straws
Speaker 3: with that one. It's it's really tough. We have to
Speaker 3: wait for the season to continue to unfold to really
Speaker 3: see who could be available. Because the Marlins are playing
Speaker 3: good baseball right now? Why would you want to trade
Speaker 3: Sandy if you're competing right Like, you're not gonna get
Speaker 3: Gallon from the Arizona Diamondbacks. You're not gonna get like
Speaker 3: to Grum from the Rangers. Like I mean, it's it's
Speaker 3: tough right now. We could come up with random options
Speaker 3: just to get people excited, but we have to wait.
Speaker 3: But Flari Day looks good, Waino's gonna come back. Then
Speaker 3: you have Libby. It's not like Monty's pitching bad and
Speaker 3: like Michael's can't be any worse.
Speaker 2: Right, Michael's legit can't be worse. My thing, too, is
Speaker 2: is what if they took a Twins type approach? You're
Speaker 2: not gonna be able to go get an ace, Go
Speaker 2: get like a couple of threes. I think jay Mont's
Speaker 2: pretty much a three. You went out and got him
Speaker 2: Quintana once he comes, you know, once he gets going
Speaker 2: like that. That was a guy that I liked that pickup.
Speaker 2: Is that a three? I don't know. But now now
Speaker 2: that they subtract him, right now they're looking at what
Speaker 2: they have here. I feel like you're not gonna get
Speaker 2: an ace. You're not gonna be able to get that
Speaker 2: frontline guy. I need the aforementioned guys that you just listed.
Speaker 2: Maybe you just go for a few threes and build
Speaker 2: that rotation of threes. I think Jack Flaherty at his peak,
Speaker 2: you know what he's looking like now, could be a
Speaker 2: solid three. J Mott could be a solid three. Waino
Speaker 2: is probably depth arm, but Joe's flashes of being a
Speaker 2: solid and middle rotation arm go like. Don't you think
Speaker 2: they're kicking themselves right now for not getting Pablo like
Speaker 2: Pablo Lopez. They could have done Tyler O'Neill plus a
Speaker 2: prospect or two and got and got Pablo Lopez.
Speaker 3: I feel like they have Dylan Carlson. They could have
Speaker 3: done Dylan Carlson in p like not that long ago,
Speaker 3: and they decided, no, we needed a seventh outfielder. We
Speaker 3: need them. We're not gonna go get Pablo Lopez. But
Speaker 3: with this said, and this is why on lives in
Speaker 3: my comments, I'm sure in yours DMS Cardinals fans are
Speaker 3: freaking out. And I know. But if you're gonna be
Speaker 3: a team loaded with threes, the Cardinals, if you look
Speaker 3: at the rest of the team, it's the perfect team
Speaker 3: to have a bunch of threes. You have an unbelievable offense,
Speaker 3: you have an unbelievable defense, you have a very solid bullpen.
Speaker 3: So all you really need is guys like Caintana. Now
Speaker 3: you're not gonna get him anymo because he's on the Mets,
Speaker 3: but guys like that, they will open up in the
Speaker 3: trade market. Even a guy like Herman Marquez from the Rockies,
Speaker 3: Like maybe could he get him he turns into some
Speaker 3: sort of three four, that's another arm that you could
Speaker 3: go get. Like, we're gonna keep talking about this. This
Speaker 3: is I feel like one of the big stories in
Speaker 3: Major League Baseball right now is that there there's such
Speaker 3: a difference right now in talent, like you look at
Speaker 3: the offense and you look at the starting staff, but
Speaker 3: it's so early, so it's like, what you want me
Speaker 3: to freak out with your call?
Speaker 2: Yeah, so here here's the thing, and it's frustrating because
Speaker 2: of how good they are position player wise, and because
Speaker 2: the clock's ticking, you're not gonna you know, Nolan Eronato's
Speaker 2: not getting any younger. Neither is Paul gold Schmidt. So
Speaker 2: I get it from that perspective, but they've got a
Speaker 2: lot of time to figure stuff out. One Libertor could
Speaker 2: come up and be a legit, legit starter. Obviously that's
Speaker 2: a tall ask, but it's possible. If that's clear that
Speaker 2: that's not gonna happen. He struggles when you when you
Speaker 2: call him up, and you know, Michaelist doesn't get any better.
Speaker 2: You're not getting anything from Matts, Like I think you
Speaker 2: got to wait finally get all of those answers being
Speaker 2: the worst case scenario, and then from there you panic
Speaker 2: and you go, you know, pay dollar twenty on the dollar,
Speaker 2: like that's what they'll end up having to do. My
Speaker 2: question to wrap up on this is do you give
Speaker 2: up a big prospect package or do you just trade time?
Speaker 2: Tyler O'Neill plus a prospect or two, if there's a
Speaker 2: team that's looking to do that kind of deal, Because
Speaker 2: I feel like O'Neill, it seems like he's probably going
Speaker 2: to be somebody that's going to be the odd man out. Ultimately,
Speaker 2: he's got one more year of control after this year.
Speaker 2: I think this is kind of the perfect time to
Speaker 2: trade him, especially with the little spat we had recently.
Speaker 2: But I don't know. I just get the sense that
Speaker 2: his days might be numbered. Carlson has more control. They
Speaker 2: don't like trading prospects. Maybe you trade an O'Neill and
Speaker 2: a prospector too for a team that you know wants
Speaker 2: a player that can add to their lineup. That might
Speaker 2: be an interesting way to upgrade. But yeah, that's not
Speaker 2: going to get you an ACE, but it could get
Speaker 2: you a middle rotation arm.
Speaker 3: Two reasons I love that option from you. One, if
Speaker 3: you trade Tyler O'Neill, you can get a good starter
Speaker 3: from a contender, right, a contender that has a bulk
Speaker 3: of pitching that needs offense. They're not trading for that
Speaker 3: high a nineteen year old with upside, Right, you're getting
Speaker 3: Tyler O'Neal. He could help right now, luis a Raja's
Speaker 3: trade for Pablo Lopez kind of in that same breath
Speaker 3: where you get a Pablo back and you give up
Speaker 3: a major leaguer. Both teams want to contend they don't
Speaker 3: want prospects. So that for Tyler Neil. Second reason, the
Speaker 3: contract thing is big right because he only has one
Speaker 3: more year of control. So unless you're going to give
Speaker 3: him a big extension, which you see all the different
Speaker 3: guys on offense that the Cardinals have, are you going
Speaker 3: to give him a big time deal? Might as well
Speaker 3: cash in on that. So I think this is a
Speaker 3: perfect time to transition to a segment sponsored by bet MGM.
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Speaker 3: And the King of Sports Books. The link is in
Speaker 3: our episode description. Use code JB fans. And the reason
Speaker 3: I really want to go to this now is I
Speaker 3: want to look at the National League Central odds to
Speaker 3: win the division because the Brewers are twelve and five,
Speaker 3: the Cardinals haven't gone off to the best start in
Speaker 3: the world, and the Brewers are minus one thirty to
Speaker 3: win the division. Now they are the favorites. Cardinals are
Speaker 3: plus one sixty, Cubs are plus seven point fifty. Who
Speaker 3: talking about all this, I was thinking about making a
Speaker 3: move on the Cardinals at this point. Now, my gambling
Speaker 3: brain says, you knew that was a trap line at
Speaker 3: the beginning of the year where they gave us minus
Speaker 3: one fifteen for the Cardinals, you know what a steel
Speaker 3: But now at this point it's like, do I go
Speaker 3: back in on the Cardinals. That's excellent value for them,
Speaker 3: at least in my opinion, considering the line move. And
Speaker 3: it's like an overreaction to the Brewers doing so well.
Speaker 3: Brandon Woodruff, you know, on the IL for an extended
Speaker 3: period of time, Corbin Burns isn't pitching his best either,
Speaker 3: Like maybe the Cardinals at plus one sixty is a
Speaker 3: decent bet. You bet ten, you win sixteen, you bet
Speaker 3: one hundred, you win one sixty. Like that's good value
Speaker 3: on the Cardinals.
Speaker 2: Well, and a team that we talked about how they're
Speaker 2: they're going to be patient and probably not rush anything.
Speaker 2: They have a get out of jail free card with
Speaker 2: a litany of minor league talent if they want to
Speaker 2: push the Chips forward, and of course even excess outfielders
Speaker 2: at the big league level. When you have teams that
Speaker 2: have resources like that that are in win now mode,
Speaker 2: I'm always a little bit more confident laying some money
Speaker 2: on them. So I didn't like them at that minus
Speaker 2: anything to win the division, But now at that value,
Speaker 2: I if you're getting free credits, like I'm gonna bet
Speaker 2: on the best franchise and still the most talented team
Speaker 2: with that free credit to throw on there that I
Speaker 2: think that's one hundred percent worth like a unit splash,
Speaker 2: and you get to root for a good team to
Speaker 2: turn it around. It's a long season, and if they
Speaker 2: get hot, I think you hit the nail on the head.
Speaker 2: Like I'm a little week Jack and I just talked
Speaker 2: about it. We're a little worried about what the Woodroof
Speaker 2: injury means it could be out for basically majority of
Speaker 2: the season. He said himself, he's not going to rush back.
Speaker 2: And you know, the Cubs, they look good. I think
Speaker 2: they're going to hang around, you know, five hundred and
Speaker 2: be a competitive team and in exceed expectations. But that's
Speaker 2: not going to be what wins the division. So it's
Speaker 2: really Cardinals versus Brewers, and you're hoping the Brewers can
Speaker 2: hold on given their ace struggling, having a lot of
Speaker 2: issues before the year with the team, and then their
Speaker 2: number two now being out for a long time, no
Speaker 2: ashby a lot of other moving parts. I really like
Speaker 2: that value there.
Speaker 3: And I'm not saying it's crazy, but there is value
Speaker 3: on the Cubs here. I mean, the Cubs are playing
Speaker 3: good baseball considering their plus seven fifty. If we talk
Speaker 3: about the Brewers issues, Let's say the Cardinals don't solve
Speaker 3: these issues and the pitching does go down the drain.
Speaker 3: I don't think it's gonna happen, but maybe, considering that
Speaker 3: they're plus seven point fifty, I also think that's somewhat
Speaker 3: worthy of a sprinkle. Do I think it's gonna happen? No,
Speaker 3: But sometimes I gave out to my subscribers Bears to
Speaker 3: win the division in the NFL. Do I think it's
Speaker 3: gonna happen. I don't know, But the fact is that
Speaker 3: they were the farthest down, they have the most cap space,
Speaker 3: they have the number or they trade the number one
Speaker 3: overall pick. They have a ton that they can do.
Speaker 3: And the Jaguars went from worse to first two right,
Speaker 3: so it's a value play. And plus seven fifty, I
Speaker 3: just think that's too high for the Cubs, considering problems
Speaker 3: within the other team. One more race that I want
Speaker 3: to talk about with you on is this American League East,
Speaker 3: because there's bluster at the top, and I'm curious as
Speaker 3: we sit here today which team you like. Because the
Speaker 3: Rays are plus one thirty, the Yankees are plus one eighty,
Speaker 3: and the Blue Jays are plus two seventy five. I'm
Speaker 3: jumping for joy I got the Rays at plus three
Speaker 3: fifty to win the division, so I'm feeling good right now.
Speaker 3: But at the same time, like you never know, right
Speaker 3: the Ras are super talented. Anything had happened, it's so early,
Speaker 3: but I'm thinking about jumping back in with the Blue
Speaker 3: Jays and plus two seventy five. I mean, like that
Speaker 3: is just I mean, is that line telling us something.
Speaker 3: That's why I think that one scene is almost too
Speaker 3: good to be true.
Speaker 2: I think that one's too good to be true. I
Speaker 2: was gonna say I'm almost looking at the Yankees because
Speaker 2: I'm getting the Yankees at that plus line there. At
Speaker 2: this point, they haven't had their team fully healthy at all.
Speaker 2: They've still looked fine. Volpi's just getting going. Judge looks
Speaker 2: like he's gonna be something close to what he was
Speaker 2: last year. Yes, Stanton's hurt, but at the end of
Speaker 2: the day, that's a DH that you know was not
Speaker 2: a game changer for you in the regular season. He
Speaker 2: wasn't in the postseason. And I think, you know, we're
Speaker 2: gonna wait and see hen ro Don, who now is
Speaker 2: a little back thing. And but the pitching is only
Speaker 2: gonna get stronger. They're only going to get more and
Speaker 2: more guys back. I don't hate the value there. I'm
Speaker 2: worried about the Jays pitching. We've seen them regression looking
Speaker 2: pretty real now. Gosman got knocked around the other day.
Speaker 2: I don't think that's gonna be a huge issue, But
Speaker 2: then he got Barrios we talked about Bassett. I think
Speaker 2: I like your Yankees at that value there.
Speaker 3: Man, Yeah, I think if you're gonna make a Swendy
Speaker 3: pull swenaity, I think if you're gonna make a move,
Speaker 3: it has to be on the Yankees. One more thing
Speaker 3: about the Carlos Ordon back thing. It's funny because he's
Speaker 3: on the ihel for an arm thing. It's in a
Speaker 3: back thing. And at the beginning, you know, it was
Speaker 3: like he slept on it wrong, or at least that
Speaker 3: was a report I heard, and I was like, oh,
Speaker 3: that doesn't matter. And then then in that spring training
Speaker 3: star Boone came out and Boone's like normally a really
Speaker 3: positive guy. He did not sound happy, Like it was like,
Speaker 3: what is happening to our guy who we just signed
Speaker 3: to this enormous contract. It was an arm thing. Armfelt good,
Speaker 3: he's making a reup starry. Now it's a back thing,
Speaker 3: Like come on, yeah, right, I mean, I don't blame Boone.
Speaker 3: It's like, what's going on? Everyone we sign, everyone we
Speaker 3: trade for. You know, we talked about the litany of
Speaker 3: bullpen guys get going down, then Stanton goes down, then
Speaker 3: Rodn goes down, and then Boone suffers the blame when
Speaker 3: the Yankees aren't at their peak on playoff time, like
Speaker 3: Yankee fans totally forget. I mean, probably not Yankee fans,
Speaker 3: but I think the greater good of baseball fans, Like
Speaker 3: DJ le Maye wasn't in the playoffs last year, like
Speaker 3: they had a lot of injuries to that team, and
Speaker 3: then they got swept by the Ashers, and everybody's calling
Speaker 3: for Boone's job, Like it's a lot of pressure on
Speaker 3: manager Aaron Boone if none of the players that Brian
Speaker 3: Cashman got for you are playing.
Speaker 2: And I think he's gonna get guys back, slowly but surely,
Speaker 2: and I think that helps. I totally agree with you.
Speaker 2: My favorite pick to end the segment here is I
Speaker 2: think it's the Minnesota Twins to win the division. I
Speaker 2: know the value is not insane. I think I'm the.
Speaker 3: Only thing the value. It's like minus now, and they're
Speaker 3: like they're doing well, like this is what I looked at.
Speaker 3: I was like, well, the Razor plus one thirty and
Speaker 3: the Twins are minus one fifteen. I'm like minus one
Speaker 3: fifteen because also two days ago they were plus one fifteen.
Speaker 3: Guardian's just lost a doublehead or another minus one fifteen,
Speaker 3: Like that's such an overreaction.
Speaker 2: I agree, I just I really agree with you. I
Speaker 2: really feel good about this pitching staff, and that was
Speaker 2: the big question. And then they're only going to get
Speaker 2: better offensively. They're getting Royce Lewis back, They're getting some
Speaker 2: other guys back in the coming months. They haven't had
Speaker 2: Jorge Polonko at all so far this season. I mean,
Speaker 2: Pablo looks like a dude. Joe Ryan, you just talked
Speaker 2: about stock up on that TikTok video you did breaking up.
Speaker 2: He looks awesome. What was that.
Speaker 3: No, I'm just saying I love Joe Ryan.
Speaker 2: He's awesome. He's awesome. And then like Tyler Maley's are four,
Speaker 2: Miata looks pretty damn good as a five. And then
Speaker 2: they've got Ober and all this depth. I'm gonna probably
Speaker 2: take it like I'm probably gonna sprinkle more because the
Speaker 2: White Times you can eliminate, I mean, you can eliminate
Speaker 2: the White Sox. It's really just Twins versus Guardians, and
Speaker 2: the Guardians bost Mackenzie offense looks a little bit shaky
Speaker 2: to start the year. I kind of like the Twins
Speaker 2: that at even minus one fifteen. I wouldn't take it
Speaker 2: any later than that though, or any any you know,
Speaker 2: worse than that in terms of the value.
Speaker 3: So I have a future on the Guardians to win
Speaker 3: the division of plus one twenty five. And I was thinking,
Speaker 3: because I do think it's going to be down to
Speaker 3: the wire in this division with these two teams, because
Speaker 3: I love them both. I'm almost thinking what I kind
Speaker 3: of want to do is wait for the Twins to
Speaker 3: go on like a three game losing streak, Like right
Speaker 3: now they're losing against Boston. It's one zero on the second.
Speaker 3: But these lines just switch all the time, so I'm like,
Speaker 3: I might just grab both at plus money and like,
Speaker 3: no matter what, like I'm gonna win money because if
Speaker 3: you bet a plus and then another plus at the
Speaker 3: same unit, like you're gonna make profits. So that's kind
Speaker 3: of what I'm thinking about, and I'll be sending those
Speaker 3: of my subscribers when I do, so I'm not totally
Speaker 3: sure yet. I want to kind of wait because it's
Speaker 3: so early, But again, use the King of Sportsbooks. All
Speaker 3: these lines are available, so if you're hearing lines that
Speaker 3: you want to take, you can get some free money
Speaker 3: by using code JB fans. Let's get back to the
Speaker 3: mail bag questions. Another really good one, and this one
Speaker 3: I grabbed because I was like, I just want to
Speaker 3: ask oh about this one. I think we all agree
Speaker 3: that both teams benefited from the Gallon Jazz Chisholm trade.
Speaker 3: That was Zach Gallen for Jazz Chisholm, but on a
Speaker 3: neutral franchise. Which player would you rather have? That was
Speaker 3: asked by at NATS eventually, which is a great Eventually.
Speaker 3: I agree eventually that was him on Twitter. Go over
Speaker 3: the trade kind of what happened, and then we'll answer
Speaker 3: who we'd rather have.
Speaker 2: Yeah, So, I mean, so Zach Gallen originally came over
Speaker 2: in that package with Sandy a contra U, Magnari Sierra
Speaker 2: and Dan Costano for Marcelo Zuna from the Cardinals. That's
Speaker 2: a rare occasion of the Cardinals giving up a lot there.
Speaker 2: And I don't think they thought Sandy would become Sandy,
Speaker 2: and definitely didn't think Gallen would become Gallon. He was
Speaker 2: a pitch ability over stuff guy. Something just really clicked
Speaker 2: with Gallon. The story was that he got stung by
Speaker 2: a bee and like that was his joke and he
Speaker 2: saw his Vilow tick up in spring training, so they
Speaker 2: called him be man like. It just something happened there
Speaker 2: and he saw this uptick and in his first handful
Speaker 2: of start to the Marlins, he was unbelievable. I think
Speaker 2: the Marlins thought like, Okay, maybe this isn't sustainable. We'll
Speaker 2: have a ton of pitching. Let's cash this in. So
Speaker 2: they try right him for Jazz Chisholm, who at the
Speaker 2: time was kind of struggling a little bit in Double
Speaker 2: A but showing big power and stealing bags and looks
Speaker 2: really really dynamic, and so they kind of make that
Speaker 2: trade and Jazz eventually makes his way up. Gallon obviously
Speaker 2: does what he has been doing for the Arizona Diamondbacks,
Speaker 2: and I think both teams are are happy. I think
Speaker 2: for the Marlins perspective, it's we're talking neutral franchise, so
Speaker 2: we got to remove this aspect of it. But the
Speaker 2: Marlins have their most marketable player in a long time,
Speaker 2: and that goes a long way for that franchise beyond
Speaker 2: what we see on the field. From a pure baseball perspective,
Speaker 2: you have to look at it this way, right, we
Speaker 2: wouldn't be putting him in center. That's first of all,
Speaker 2: if I'm if I'm another, if I'm a neutral franchise
Speaker 2: that just acquired Jazz Chisholm for Zach Gallen, I'm not
Speaker 2: putting him in Centiven. Feel he's a second baseman. Maybe
Speaker 2: I try him it short even, but I'm probably playing
Speaker 2: him at second. So that's what He's an all star
Speaker 2: second basement. Yes, that's number one. So that's number one.
Speaker 2: The second thing is how sold are you on this
Speaker 2: Zach Gallan? Because now this is this he's following up
Speaker 2: what was a breakout, breakout year last year. I know
Speaker 2: he showed flashes of being fantastic. There's been some concerns
Speaker 2: about his elbow and health, but he won one hundred
Speaker 2: and eight four innings last year to two five four. Realistically,
Speaker 2: that is probably more valuable if he sustains that. To
Speaker 2: start this year, he's been pretty damn good. I think
Speaker 2: you got to kind of ignore the slow start from Jazz.
Speaker 2: He's already heating up. I think he's had a great
Speaker 2: game as we're recording this at a great game of
Speaker 2: the day before that. I think he's going to be
Speaker 2: something between what we saw in the first half last
Speaker 2: year and obviously what we're seeing right now, which is
Speaker 2: you know, well above average, regular, borderline all star, twenty
Speaker 2: five years old, power hitting shortstop, second, really second basement
Speaker 2: that can go twenty twenty. I think I'd rather have
Speaker 2: Gallon though, Like that's just the reality of.
Speaker 3: It at the end of the day. And I'm going
Speaker 3: to simplify this down and you know, we can, you know,
Speaker 3: go over the margins and see truly, you know, age
Speaker 3: contract all that kind of stuff. Starting pitching wins championships. Yeah,
Speaker 3: I'll say that till the day I die. When I
Speaker 3: bet on an individual game, what do you look at? First?
Speaker 3: The starting pitcher. It matters so much in Major League baseball.
Speaker 3: The starting pitcher, I think is the most valuable asset
Speaker 3: in all of baseball. You could argue that the shortstop
Speaker 3: or the catcher might be maybe this gold Glove center fielder,
Speaker 3: it's the starter, Like even if Jazz was I don't know, Like,
Speaker 3: let's talk about some Major League Baseball players who like
Speaker 3: position players, who'd rather have over a guy like Zach Gallen.
Speaker 3: You know, I think of who on the Cardinals where
Speaker 3: you know, we keep bringing them up, Who on the
Speaker 3: Cardinals would you take over Zach Gallen?
Speaker 2: Right, Like, Goldie. I mean, but I see what you're saying, Like,
Speaker 2: I wouldn't either have Tommy Edmond or Zach Gallen Zach
Speaker 2: mc gallen. Yeah, I even looking at the second base
Speaker 2: position as a whole, that the whole league. Would you
Speaker 2: rather have there's a few guys obviously I'd rather have
Speaker 2: out two Obviously I would rather.
Speaker 3: Have would you rather have all?
Speaker 2: Yeah, Andreez, I'd rather have Andre Semenez. I think would
Speaker 2: you a six war position player? Yeah, McNeil, I'd rather.
Speaker 3: Have Dollan than McNeil.
Speaker 2: Jeff McNeil plays every day, Like I do think that
Speaker 2: pitching is super valuable, But I think that's where I
Speaker 2: draw the line pretty much though.
Speaker 3: Yeah, and it's it's jazz.
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's really it's nothing on jazz, but it's it's
Speaker 2: second basement. If we go shortstop, I could lest you
Speaker 2: a ton of shortstops I'd rather have, but it's second me.
Speaker 3: Maybe I'm so like I love pitching so much that
Speaker 3: I'm like, I don't know if i'd rather have Andre
Speaker 3: Semnez than Gallon. Like I think, if you have an eight,
Speaker 3: if you have a guy who looks like an ace,
Speaker 3: and it's not even that he looks like he's pitching
Speaker 3: like an ace. Pitch like an ace last year, and
Speaker 3: he is already off to a good start, had a
Speaker 3: rough go in the first couple of starts because his
Speaker 3: vlows down. Then it ticked up, and now he just
Speaker 3: looks unbelieva. It looks unhittable, like against the Marlins offense,
Speaker 3: Like with Joe about the Marlins offense. They've been great
Speaker 3: this year.
Speaker 2: Like, yeah, I think it's more my concern about, like
Speaker 2: the sustainability of Zach Gollen.
Speaker 3: That's fair, that's fair. I'm more thinking about starting pitchers
Speaker 3: as a whole and not looking.
Speaker 2: I mean, if he's if it's a true true ace
Speaker 2: to fuck Andre Samenez. But how sure are you the
Speaker 2: Zach Allen's going to continue this? He's a really interesting case. Yeah,
Speaker 2: he when his command, like his command is really impressive,
Speaker 2: and that's what what's really kind of helped him here.
Speaker 2: But I don't know, like you talked about the view
Speaker 2: of being down, it's a little sporadic. He's he's a
Speaker 2: little bit of that like makes me nervous with the
Speaker 2: arm kind of guy. It's a tough one regardless. The
Speaker 2: answer is I would rather have Gallon than Jazz, because
Speaker 2: you could trade Gallon for more than Jazz, I think
Speaker 2: at this point, especially with the control and where he's at.
Speaker 2: So while both teams did well, I don't think the
Speaker 2: Marlins would undo it because of what Jazz means to
Speaker 2: their franchise now in terms of just having a bat
Speaker 2: that they can't mess up and having the marketability there
Speaker 2: neutral franchise. Give me Zach Gallen, right, like, give me
Speaker 2: the frontline guy, even if he's closer to a two
Speaker 2: or three, that's still extremely valuable. To your point, I'd
Speaker 2: rather have Gallen.
Speaker 3: The way you talk about the Marlins is gonna make
Speaker 3: me laugh for the rest of my life. Like a
Speaker 3: bat they can't mess up like that is just gonna
Speaker 3: make me laugh forever. How about a bat that at
Speaker 3: least this person thinks his own team is messing up.
Speaker 3: Question number six. Spencer Torkelsen is off to a really
Speaker 3: bad start for the Detroit Tigers. His on base percentage
Speaker 3: is barely over two hundred. Are we out on him officially?
Speaker 3: Is he maybe a change of scenery guy? Not ruling
Speaker 3: out Detroit's development being a big part of the problem.
Speaker 3: Asked by Matt Alec Gold on Twitter.
Speaker 2: I'll let you start on this one. What do you think?
Speaker 2: How do is he twenty three to twenty four, twenty
Speaker 2: three years, seven months, twenty three days.
Speaker 3: How can I give up on a guy like that
Speaker 3: who at Arizona State I thought was a freaking missile.
Speaker 3: This guy was one of the best college hitters ever
Speaker 3: in the last half decade. I mean it was just
Speaker 3: every single day. Like we talk about Dylan Cruz, right,
Speaker 3: we talk about Tommy Tanks at LSU. Just more LSU guys,
Speaker 3: Jack Aglion of Florida. You know why at Langford? You
Speaker 3: know the kid at UNC. I don't know why I'm
Speaker 3: forgetting his name right now? Who's the kid at you see?
Speaker 2: Honey?
Speaker 3: Yeah, Vance honeycut Yeah. I don't know how got his
Speaker 3: name because he's a freaking nature. But these guys are
Speaker 3: all great college players, like that guy like Dylan Cruz,
Speaker 3: who's the camp miss guy that was Torque at ASU.
Speaker 3: Just like it didn't matter if he could never play
Speaker 3: a position, because he's going to hit forty bombs. I
Speaker 3: just think it's he's off to a slow start, and
Speaker 3: I know it's crazy, Like Jeremy Peney is two years
Speaker 3: older than him. It took him a little while. He
Speaker 3: might just be a little bit of a late bloomer.
Speaker 2: He broke Barry Bond's freshman home run record in Arizona
Speaker 2: State with twenty five.
Speaker 3: I just, you know, it's so hard to say. And
Speaker 3: but the thing is, what's so tough about this question,
Speaker 3: and why I know he's asking it is because it's
Speaker 3: been horrible. It's not just been ups and downs. There
Speaker 3: have been no ups. It's just been a steady, bad
Speaker 3: batch of baseball from Spencer Torkilsen. And you can say,
Speaker 3: all right, you're one, throw it out the window. It
Speaker 3: hasn't gotten good this year, and he's not really doing
Speaker 3: much anyway. So it's it's a really tough question because
Speaker 3: there's a part of me that says, oh, don't worry
Speaker 3: about it at all. But I've watched Tigers games because
Speaker 3: I freaking bet on them all the time. I even
Speaker 3: tweeted on a drunk on Tiger's buddy line. Yeah it
Speaker 3: doesn't look good on him. It does not look good.
Speaker 2: It's I do wonder too, how much being a young
Speaker 2: power hitter and being thrust it into Kamerica Park where
Speaker 2: your power goes to die, how much that pressure kind
Speaker 2: of mounts on you as a young hitter. You know,
Speaker 2: we kind of saw it with Riley Green in early going,
Speaker 2: who also was his can't miss of a bat. He
Speaker 2: looks really he's starting to get better and get rolling
Speaker 2: here too. And Homer today was hitting.
Speaker 3: Like two fifty. I feel like he grounds on every bat. Frustrating,
Speaker 3: starting to get going, yeah, but.
Speaker 2: That was like a can't miss bat as well. So
Speaker 2: the two can't miss bats are missing right now. Like
Speaker 2: that's scary. I do think America like has that mental
Speaker 2: impact on some young hitters, especially power guys. But what
Speaker 2: stands out to me, especially this year, is how aggressive
Speaker 2: Spencer Torklssen has been. Thirty four percent chase right, small sample,
Speaker 2: but it's early fifty three percent swing rate is way
Speaker 2: too high. He's just trying to do too much. He's
Speaker 2: he's walked once because he's swinging at everything, and like,
Speaker 2: that's not how Spencer Towarklesen was successful. That's not how
Speaker 2: he got to where he is. He walked, he was patient,
Speaker 2: he crushed mistakes, and he's just a good, well rounded hitter.
Speaker 2: That's not who we're seeing. So I do feel like
Speaker 2: he he is in cro coaching on the change of
Speaker 2: scenery candidate area. I still don't think like if Jared
Speaker 2: Kelnick could figure it out, which it looks like he is,
Speaker 2: Spencer Torklsen can figure it out. But it is getting
Speaker 2: a little bit alarming here. When you have a guy
Speaker 2: that's swinging right now, it's sixty two percent of fastballs.
Speaker 2: Sixty two percent of fastballs he's swinging at. That tells
Speaker 2: me either one, he's just trying to do too much,
Speaker 2: which is I think part of the answer. Two he
Speaker 2: doesn't want anything to do with breaking balls, so every
Speaker 2: fastball he sees he's he's swinging, He's like, I'm jumping
Speaker 2: on this one. So he just doesn't seem to feel right.
Speaker 2: And the Tigers development is among the worst. They have
Speaker 2: a new guy at the helm here in Scott Harris,
Speaker 2: who I do believe in, and I think you're seeing
Speaker 2: the difference, but I don't know if that's kind of
Speaker 2: made its way to Torq yet. It's also a team
Speaker 2: that has had seems like it has some issues in
Speaker 2: the clubhouse. I mean, we saw a Jay Hinch just
Speaker 2: come out and hang out the vets to dry, hang
Speaker 2: out everybody to dry, and sometimes that stuff's contagious. I'm
Speaker 2: not I'm not saying Torque's cooked, but I am starting
Speaker 2: to wonder if it's gonna happen in Detroit.
Speaker 3: That's fair, will it happen in Detroit? But Tigers fans,
Speaker 3: I can't give up on him. I just can't. He
Speaker 3: is he was too special in college. He was such
Speaker 3: a good talent, like I don't.
Speaker 2: Know in the minor leagues, I mean, ops and and
Speaker 2: and between high A, double A and triple A and
Speaker 2: twenty twenty one.
Speaker 3: I'm so glad you brought up Kelnick because we're seeing
Speaker 3: what Kelnic can do. Correct me if I'm wrong, but
Speaker 3: I don't think I am. Spencer Torkusen was a better
Speaker 3: offensive prospect than he was.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean one hundred percent. I mean people would
Speaker 2: have until Kelnick was at the very very end, and
Speaker 2: even then I still think I still think people would
Speaker 2: have said torus a safer, safer offensive prospect.
Speaker 3: There you go, So we aren't giving up hope yet.
Speaker 2: Very breath, breathe. It's gonna be okay. It's fourteen games,
Speaker 2: it's a slow start to this year. It's cold. I
Speaker 2: think he'll be fine.
Speaker 3: It's cold. It is cold. And he's a he's a
Speaker 3: weather guy. Our last question, and it was so funny.
Speaker 3: We had seven Orioles questions and they were all surrounding
Speaker 3: the same thing. So I apologized we didn't credit you,
Speaker 3: but there was so many that I'm just like, all right,
Speaker 3: let's just tackle this. Yeah you put dash everyone, Yeah,
Speaker 3: dash everyone. Because it was the teams that asked the
Speaker 3: most questions Cardinals and Orioles, and Orioles almost doubled the Cardinals,
Speaker 3: and the Cardinals tripled every other team, So tons of
Speaker 3: oose questions. Basically, this is what it is. What do
Speaker 3: they do with the litany of infield prospects? And which
Speaker 3: picture should they get?
Speaker 2: Okay, so let me start with I think this is
Speaker 2: the beginning. This is the first domino, and I'll start
Speaker 2: with a question back to you. Are you buying what
Speaker 2: Jorge Matteo is selling. I know you guys talked about
Speaker 2: it the other episode. Are you buying it? Because that's
Speaker 2: the first step of this entire thing that we have
Speaker 2: to go.
Speaker 4: Through here, like kinda like he's so dynamic because even
Speaker 4: if he's not hitting, it's not like, oh he's a
Speaker 4: hole at shortstop or he's not running he's a demon
Speaker 4: on the base pass.
Speaker 3: I used that with Jack. That word. It's like there
Speaker 3: are a couple of demons.
Speaker 2: He's gonna steal fifty bags this year. He's gonna stay and.
Speaker 3: He's great defensively, so even if he doesn't hit, he
Speaker 3: provides value. And he's hitting and he looks good and
Speaker 3: it's not like this guy came out of nowhere. He
Speaker 3: was a good prospect and he's really developing. This is
Speaker 3: an incredibly tough situation, but it's a good situation of
Speaker 3: being if you're a trouble and paradise. And then of
Speaker 3: course Adam Fraser's just getting abs and you know, an
Speaker 3: Oils fan put a curse on me when Adam Fraser
Speaker 3: was doing well. He was like, if you don't give
Speaker 3: Adam Fraser his praise, we're putting the Adam Fraser curse
Speaker 3: on you. I was afraid I'm gonna start losing bets.
Speaker 3: They put a curse on me arm because I wouldn't
Speaker 3: apologize crazy for Adam Fraser.
Speaker 2: That's pretty funny. I mean, dude, so mateo Fullman, all right,
Speaker 2: a one point zero four through fourteen games. You mentioned
Speaker 2: the defense. His strikeout rates down ten percent, to start
Speaker 2: the year. And look, I don't know if that part sustainable,
Speaker 2: but I do think that the swing rate being down
Speaker 2: as a legitimate alteration in his approach, him realizing, Okay,
Speaker 2: I need to stop swinging at everything and I can
Speaker 2: still be that get on base guy. And he is,
Speaker 2: and he's really been setting the table and making a difference.
Speaker 2: He's gonna steal fifty bags and he's gonna play a
Speaker 2: lead defensive short You're not moving that guy from shortstop
Speaker 2: unless he hits a damn wall. So what do you
Speaker 2: do with the other guys. You've got Joey Ortiz, who's
Speaker 2: elite defensively as well, a really good bat to ball
Speaker 2: guy in triple a very impressive prospect. You've got Connor Norby,
Speaker 2: who's limited to second base more so but hit twenty
Speaker 2: seven homers last year, absolutely rakes. Then you got Jordan Westburg,
Speaker 2: who could play all over fast, above average power average
Speaker 2: or better hitter. All those guys rake and are really interesting.
Speaker 2: The question is do you want to move those guys guy,
Speaker 2: because at the end of the day, like they've tried
Speaker 2: Westburg a little bit in the outfield, he could potentially
Speaker 2: play left. I don't know what they can do with
Speaker 2: Norby and Ortiz. A lot of Ortiz's value comes from
Speaker 2: short I know they like Ortiz more than Westburg from
Speaker 2: what I understand, Like, you could get a lot of
Speaker 2: players with those packs, with those prospects, you could get
Speaker 2: a lot. But do you trade just to trade? Know
Speaker 2: what pictures are going to be available that have a
Speaker 2: ton of control that make it worth it? I don't
Speaker 2: know either, Like that's the interesting part. Like the Orioles,
Speaker 2: you don't want to just give up an asset. I
Speaker 2: know it's a surplus, but it's a valuable asset just
Speaker 2: to do it. But how long can you sit on
Speaker 2: those guys because several of them are going to be
Speaker 2: kind of bored in the minor leagues at a certain point,
Speaker 2: specifically Joey Ortiz as he continues to get going here,
Speaker 2: like that guy's going to be ready to go. But
Speaker 2: I could see them just dashing them in triple all year.
Speaker 3: There is one name who I keep thinking about, Shane
Speaker 3: Bieber available. We're trying to win, they're trying to win
Speaker 3: the division. I know they're trying to win the division,
Speaker 3: but they're also the Guardians, right. The Guardians have been
Speaker 3: prone to make No, they haven't been prone to I
Speaker 3: guess make big miss those.
Speaker 2: Of a billion in field prospects too.
Speaker 3: Yeah they do. Maybe that's a bad, bad idea. I'm
Speaker 3: just thinking about four aces, like I'm grasping at straws here.
Speaker 3: I'm trying to make some sort of mock trade, like
Speaker 3: who who's a great pitcher? Who's worthy of all of
Speaker 3: these incredible interfield prospects, Because it's like, yeah, you could
Speaker 3: trade it like a Jordan Westburg and get a three,
Speaker 3: and like, I don't know how much that helps. I'm
Speaker 3: thinking about like a game changing I would paid who
Speaker 3: would have been? So I'm just like, yeah, you could
Speaker 3: tear down Shane Bieber and you're probably But it's like then, who,
Speaker 3: I guess.
Speaker 2: So I got a team for you. The San Francisco
Speaker 2: Giants need. If they didn't extend Logan web that would
Speaker 2: have been the perfect perfect example. They yeah they did.
Speaker 2: The thing is is they need a shortstop in the
Speaker 2: worst way. They're moving their third base prospect right now
Speaker 2: to shortstop in Casey Schmidt, like Logan Webb would have
Speaker 2: been the perfect perfect example, but now he's he's not available.
Speaker 2: Most likely, I don't know if there's anything out there
Speaker 2: for them for those guys, Like, that's the problem, So
Speaker 2: what do you do? And that's the most fascinating aspect
Speaker 2: of it, don't I don't know if it's a prospect
Speaker 2: for prospect deal that they could eventually make. I don't
Speaker 2: know if it's it's something else, but it seems like
Speaker 2: right now the only way that they're gonna be able
Speaker 2: to upgrade the pitching is through short rentals, and you're
Speaker 2: not trading any of those guys for short rentals. So
Speaker 2: I know that's a common question, but it's kind of
Speaker 2: part of the reason why we haven't really seen anything happen.
Speaker 2: Pabo again, Pabo Lopez was the guy to go try
Speaker 2: to do it for, but the Marlins wanted big league talent,
Speaker 2: so that wasn't gonna line up. And I don't know
Speaker 2: if there's really any other teams, maybe the Braves, Like,
Speaker 2: maybe you could work out a deal if the Braves
Speaker 2: feel better about, you know, what they've got going on
Speaker 2: pitching wise, Maybe a Bryce Elter for one of those guys,
Speaker 2: maybe you put him.
Speaker 3: You got von Grissel at Ozzie Alby's at Austin, Riley
Speaker 3: and Matt Olsen here was my thinking. This won't happen.
Speaker 3: But we're just talking. What would it take for Kyle
Speaker 3: Harrison from the Giants? What would it take for Max
Speaker 3: Meyer from the Marlins? Right teams we hire, I think,
Speaker 3: who need offense like prospect for prospect deals. Again, it
Speaker 3: won't happen. I don't know why. It doesn't like teams
Speaker 3: should have more prospects in one position with other teams
Speaker 3: that have a ton of prospects and not like make
Speaker 3: a deal help both sides. So I'm just I'm spitballing.
Speaker 2: Here is the best scenario I think is to do
Speaker 2: a prospect for prospect deal. The problem is I know
Speaker 2: more about my prospect, you know more about your prospect,
Speaker 2: and we're always gonna be wary about swapping them. Why
Speaker 2: does he want to trade me this prospect?
Speaker 3: And that's why it doesn't happen.
Speaker 2: It's a great PI, that's why. But there could be
Speaker 2: a scenario where that does happen. I would do like
Speaker 2: a Max Meyer for Connor Norby, and in two seconds,
Speaker 2: I would do Maximyer for Jordan Westberg in two seconds.
Speaker 2: I would do Max Meyer for for any of those
Speaker 2: guys in two seconds. And I think there's teams out
Speaker 2: there with some pitching talent that would consider doing that.
Speaker 2: Kyle Harrison's off to a bit of a slow start.
Speaker 2: Maybe the Giants consider it. That might be the best
Speaker 2: way to do it for the Orioles, this prospect for prospects,
Speaker 2: and I've read about teams considering that through the offseason.
Speaker 2: Nothing materialized with some other teams that were considering prospect
Speaker 2: for prospects. But I think the Orioles might be the
Speaker 2: team that's willing to do that, and I think it
Speaker 2: would be a really smart thing to do where they're
Speaker 2: at in the rebuild.
Speaker 3: And that'll do it for this episode of Just Baseball Show.
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Speaker 2: That's it. Definitely look out for that Mason Miller feature piece.
Speaker 2: I think you guys will enjoy that. But other than that,
Speaker 2: I'm good.
Speaker 3: And with that, thank you everybody.