1 00:00:00,960 --> 00:00:02,040 Speaker 1: I am six forty. 2 00:00:02,120 --> 00:00:05,560 Speaker 2: You're listening to the John Cobel podcast on the iHeartRadio app. 3 00:00:06,519 --> 00:00:07,520 Speaker 1: Welcome, how are you? 4 00:00:08,480 --> 00:00:12,240 Speaker 2: We are here like always one to four o'clock in 5 00:00:12,280 --> 00:00:15,280 Speaker 2: the afternoon that you can listen to us on KFI 6 00:00:15,360 --> 00:00:18,680 Speaker 2: and also streaming on the iHeart app. You can also 7 00:00:18,680 --> 00:00:21,440 Speaker 2: hear the podcast after four o'clock, John Cobelt's show on 8 00:00:21,560 --> 00:00:24,919 Speaker 2: demand on the iHeart app, and that's where you listen 9 00:00:24,960 --> 00:00:26,520 Speaker 2: to what you miss because it's the same as the 10 00:00:26,600 --> 00:00:30,600 Speaker 2: radio show and eventually you'll be able to hear every second, 11 00:00:30,640 --> 00:00:35,280 Speaker 2: every minute of the program. We will start with the 12 00:00:35,920 --> 00:00:41,760 Speaker 2: Nick Reiner case of the son of Rob and Michelle Ryder, 13 00:00:41,800 --> 00:00:45,760 Speaker 2: who were brutally murdered. He's up on two first degree 14 00:00:45,800 --> 00:00:49,280 Speaker 2: murder charges and he made his first court appearance today 15 00:00:50,360 --> 00:00:53,520 Speaker 2: and they didn't allow any video or photos of him 16 00:00:53,600 --> 00:00:58,360 Speaker 2: wearing his suicide desk, but there was audio of him 17 00:00:59,720 --> 00:01:04,360 Speaker 2: wave his right to an immediate arraignment. The attorney Alan Jackson, 18 00:01:05,720 --> 00:01:11,280 Speaker 2: he asked for a continuance until January seventh. And we're 19 00:01:11,280 --> 00:01:14,240 Speaker 2: going to talk now a Royal Oaks ABC News legal 20 00:01:14,240 --> 00:01:19,679 Speaker 2: analyst about this royal. Before we start, I want to 21 00:01:19,680 --> 00:01:23,160 Speaker 2: play about forty five seconds. This is Alan Jackson. It's 22 00:01:23,160 --> 00:01:27,280 Speaker 2: about the only public statement he's made about Nick Reiner. 23 00:01:27,680 --> 00:01:31,520 Speaker 2: And listen, and I want you want to start with 24 00:01:31,560 --> 00:01:32,400 Speaker 2: you reacting to it. 25 00:01:33,080 --> 00:01:37,800 Speaker 3: This is a devastating tragedy that has befallen the Reiner families. 26 00:01:37,800 --> 00:01:40,480 Speaker 3: We all recognize that our hearts go out to the 27 00:01:40,640 --> 00:01:46,800 Speaker 3: entire Reiner family. There are very, very complex and serious 28 00:01:46,840 --> 00:01:52,000 Speaker 3: issues that are associated with this case. They just need 29 00:01:52,000 --> 00:01:57,320 Speaker 3: to be thoroughly but very carefully dealt with and examined 30 00:01:58,000 --> 00:02:03,400 Speaker 3: and looked at and analyzed. We asked that during this process, 31 00:02:03,440 --> 00:02:05,960 Speaker 3: you allow the system to move forward in the way 32 00:02:06,000 --> 00:02:08,079 Speaker 3: that it was designed to move forward, not with the 33 00:02:08,160 --> 00:02:11,400 Speaker 3: rush to judgment, not with jumping to conclusions, but with 34 00:02:11,480 --> 00:02:15,920 Speaker 3: restraint and with dignity and with the respect that the 35 00:02:16,000 --> 00:02:20,520 Speaker 3: system and this process deserves and that the family deserves. 36 00:02:21,240 --> 00:02:25,480 Speaker 2: Now, Royle, I think the average person listening to this saying, 37 00:02:25,720 --> 00:02:29,520 Speaker 2: the hell are you talking about? Don't rush to judgment, 38 00:02:29,960 --> 00:02:35,360 Speaker 2: don't jump to conclusions. There's no question, I think factually 39 00:02:35,600 --> 00:02:37,600 Speaker 2: that we're going to find out he definitely did it. 40 00:02:38,919 --> 00:02:42,679 Speaker 2: I think he's talking about what state of mind Nick 41 00:02:42,720 --> 00:02:43,480 Speaker 2: Reiner was in. 42 00:02:44,720 --> 00:02:47,560 Speaker 4: Absolutely that's what's going on, though, We've seen reports from 43 00:02:47,560 --> 00:02:50,960 Speaker 4: three or four outlets that in fact, there was blood 44 00:02:51,000 --> 00:02:55,119 Speaker 4: all over Nick Reiner's hotel room. So it's likely that 45 00:02:55,160 --> 00:02:57,400 Speaker 4: there is strong evidence that he did it. And as 46 00:02:57,440 --> 00:03:00,519 Speaker 4: you say, then the big question becomes what's state of mind? 47 00:03:00,600 --> 00:03:03,079 Speaker 4: And here's what's happening. You know, all of the nice 48 00:03:03,120 --> 00:03:06,120 Speaker 4: words vi alent Jackson there. What it boils down to 49 00:03:06,400 --> 00:03:09,120 Speaker 4: is he wants more time to get to his arms 50 00:03:09,160 --> 00:03:12,400 Speaker 4: around the mental issue. One question is is he going 51 00:03:12,440 --> 00:03:16,000 Speaker 4: to plead not guilty by reason of insanity? That usually 52 00:03:16,040 --> 00:03:18,520 Speaker 4: doesn't get rolled out at the arrangement on January seven, 53 00:03:18,600 --> 00:03:22,040 Speaker 4: but it might. Another question is is Jackson going to 54 00:03:22,080 --> 00:03:24,600 Speaker 4: ask the court for a competency hearing where a bunch 55 00:03:24,639 --> 00:03:29,280 Speaker 4: of shrinks examine Nick and talk about his understanding of 56 00:03:29,320 --> 00:03:31,519 Speaker 4: what's going on. Is he even able to stand trial? 57 00:03:31,800 --> 00:03:35,240 Speaker 4: Whereas he just so whacked out? So the whole ballgame 58 00:03:35,560 --> 00:03:38,880 Speaker 4: is about his mental state, because if he knew what 59 00:03:38,920 --> 00:03:41,640 Speaker 4: he was doing and it wasn't purely a result of 60 00:03:41,720 --> 00:03:46,440 Speaker 4: drugs or addiction or mental health, then murder is a 61 00:03:46,600 --> 00:03:50,760 Speaker 4: likely outcome. On the other hand, manslaughter would be a 62 00:03:50,800 --> 00:03:53,760 Speaker 4: gigantic advantage for the defense because he might get just 63 00:03:53,840 --> 00:03:57,480 Speaker 4: a few years behind bars under ten as opposed to 64 00:03:57,640 --> 00:03:59,720 Speaker 4: sitting in the cell for the rest of his life. 65 00:04:01,480 --> 00:04:06,560 Speaker 2: When people plead insanity and it actually sticks, what's the 66 00:04:06,640 --> 00:04:09,600 Speaker 2: legal definition of insanity. 67 00:04:09,760 --> 00:04:12,520 Speaker 4: You don't know right from wrong, that's the essence of it. 68 00:04:13,440 --> 00:04:16,760 Speaker 4: If you act in a guilty way, you try to escape, 69 00:04:17,120 --> 00:04:18,880 Speaker 4: if you try to do some sort of cover up, 70 00:04:19,040 --> 00:04:22,000 Speaker 4: that's a recognition that he did something wrong. But at 71 00:04:22,040 --> 00:04:24,440 Speaker 4: the moment of the crime, if you can demonstrate through 72 00:04:24,440 --> 00:04:28,560 Speaker 4: psychiatric testimony that he didn't know right from wrong, that 73 00:04:28,800 --> 00:04:32,000 Speaker 4: is not guilty by reason of insanity. Country And what 74 00:04:32,120 --> 00:04:34,919 Speaker 4: happens John, then is they don't go home. They go 75 00:04:35,000 --> 00:04:37,400 Speaker 4: to the mental hospital, kind of like John Hinckley was 76 00:04:37,440 --> 00:04:40,159 Speaker 4: shooting Ronald Reagan back in the eighties and he was 77 00:04:40,200 --> 00:04:43,320 Speaker 4: there for decades. So it's not clear how long a 78 00:04:43,320 --> 00:04:46,480 Speaker 4: person would have to be confined if they were found 79 00:04:46,560 --> 00:04:49,640 Speaker 4: not guilty by reason of insanity, but that certainly would 80 00:04:49,640 --> 00:04:52,599 Speaker 4: be the gold standard. And it's so weird to think 81 00:04:52,600 --> 00:04:54,640 Speaker 4: about this, John, And you think of the Menendez case. 82 00:04:54,680 --> 00:04:57,960 Speaker 4: The extended family members that supported the sons and helped 83 00:04:58,000 --> 00:05:01,320 Speaker 4: finance the defense. They hated parents because they thought the 84 00:05:01,400 --> 00:05:05,919 Speaker 4: parents were monsters. But here nobody's hating Rob and Michelle. 85 00:05:06,400 --> 00:05:08,279 Speaker 4: And so you say, well, why would the family, you know, 86 00:05:08,560 --> 00:05:11,960 Speaker 4: help to hire Alan Jackson. It's probably happened. It's because 87 00:05:12,000 --> 00:05:14,760 Speaker 4: they've seen Nick as you know, a little kid. They've 88 00:05:14,760 --> 00:05:17,440 Speaker 4: known him for his whole life. They see him as 89 00:05:17,440 --> 00:05:20,080 Speaker 4: a victim in a way because of his addiction. They 90 00:05:20,120 --> 00:05:22,760 Speaker 4: don't want him to rot in prison or be executed. 91 00:05:23,000 --> 00:05:26,040 Speaker 4: They want him in a mental facility to get help, 92 00:05:26,400 --> 00:05:29,320 Speaker 4: or have a short manslaughter sentence and then get help. 93 00:05:29,400 --> 00:05:32,719 Speaker 4: So that's the whole ballgame that Alan Jackson's trying to arrange. 94 00:05:32,760 --> 00:05:35,200 Speaker 2: And by the family, I assume you're talking about the 95 00:05:35,279 --> 00:05:37,159 Speaker 2: surviving sister and brother, right. 96 00:05:38,800 --> 00:05:43,360 Speaker 4: Yeah, or anybody in the family who has a significant relationship, 97 00:05:44,160 --> 00:05:46,640 Speaker 4: you know with Nick. I mean you ask yourself, because 98 00:05:46,680 --> 00:05:49,159 Speaker 4: we don't know who hired Alan Jackson. And he's one 99 00:05:49,200 --> 00:05:52,960 Speaker 4: of the most you know, the powerful criminal defense lawyers 100 00:05:53,000 --> 00:05:56,279 Speaker 4: on the planet, Kevin Spacey and Harvey Weinstein. You know, 101 00:05:56,279 --> 00:05:58,600 Speaker 4: he doesn't come cheaply. I mean, back in the day, 102 00:05:58,880 --> 00:06:01,640 Speaker 4: Meneda's brothers were able to spend part of their fourteen 103 00:06:01,680 --> 00:06:04,919 Speaker 4: million dollars estap from their parents on fancy lawyers and 104 00:06:04,960 --> 00:06:08,120 Speaker 4: plus you know, a spending spree because they hadn't been 105 00:06:08,160 --> 00:06:11,200 Speaker 4: convicted of killing the parents yet, therefore they had for 106 00:06:11,240 --> 00:06:13,599 Speaker 4: a while access to the funds. After a while, the 107 00:06:13,600 --> 00:06:16,400 Speaker 4: court system said, okay, that you have had your fund 108 00:06:16,640 --> 00:06:18,960 Speaker 4: no more money because it looks like you may be convicted. 109 00:06:19,240 --> 00:06:21,640 Speaker 4: So who knows who's running the show in the rein 110 00:06:21,760 --> 00:06:24,839 Speaker 4: Or family, But it's probably unlikely that Nick reached out 111 00:06:25,040 --> 00:06:27,880 Speaker 4: in his rolodex and said, oh, well, I'll call Alan Jackson. 112 00:06:28,320 --> 00:06:31,359 Speaker 4: I imagine somebody else helped. Again. Their goal is to 113 00:06:31,400 --> 00:06:34,880 Speaker 4: get help for this young man and not just have 114 00:06:35,000 --> 00:06:35,960 Speaker 4: him brought in prison. 115 00:06:36,640 --> 00:06:38,479 Speaker 2: I would be if I was a family member, I'd 116 00:06:38,520 --> 00:06:42,200 Speaker 2: be terrified that he comes out and he'll come and 117 00:06:42,279 --> 00:06:44,760 Speaker 2: kill me, because. 118 00:06:44,800 --> 00:06:45,760 Speaker 4: Anything can happen. 119 00:06:45,880 --> 00:06:49,360 Speaker 2: Yeah, because they don't cure a lot of people who 120 00:06:49,400 --> 00:06:52,400 Speaker 2: are in mental institutions. They might say they do, but 121 00:06:52,920 --> 00:06:54,000 Speaker 2: it's impossible to know. 122 00:06:55,880 --> 00:06:57,880 Speaker 4: Well, that's right, and even if they can cure, then 123 00:06:57,880 --> 00:07:01,120 Speaker 4: we know from stories about people with schizopher they're fine 124 00:07:01,120 --> 00:07:03,719 Speaker 4: on their meds, but they don't like their meds and 125 00:07:03,760 --> 00:07:06,000 Speaker 4: they go off and then suddenly they're violent again. 126 00:07:06,440 --> 00:07:09,800 Speaker 2: Now all right, that's insanity. Now, something we touched on 127 00:07:09,920 --> 00:07:13,080 Speaker 2: earlier this week. If you could explain further this this 128 00:07:13,080 --> 00:07:18,720 Speaker 2: this other plea where it's not it's not insanity so much, 129 00:07:18,800 --> 00:07:26,320 Speaker 2: but maybe the drugs affected his ability to make rational decisions. 130 00:07:26,800 --> 00:07:29,360 Speaker 2: I'm not articulating it right, but you know the legal 131 00:07:29,440 --> 00:07:33,520 Speaker 2: terminology for this. If you could explain the terminology, Yeah, 132 00:07:33,560 --> 00:07:34,200 Speaker 2: go ahead. 133 00:07:33,960 --> 00:07:36,720 Speaker 4: Yeah, you're onto it. So here's the deal. It's so 134 00:07:36,840 --> 00:07:38,760 Speaker 4: hard to prove insanity because you know that you're going 135 00:07:38,800 --> 00:07:40,800 Speaker 4: to believe that, oh, he didn't know right from wrong. 136 00:07:41,000 --> 00:07:43,040 Speaker 4: How convenient. You know, you don't want to go to prisoner, 137 00:07:43,040 --> 00:07:45,840 Speaker 4: you don't want to be executed. The better option is 138 00:07:45,880 --> 00:07:49,560 Speaker 4: what you're talking about, which the law calls voluntary intoxication. 139 00:07:50,000 --> 00:07:53,800 Speaker 4: So if you kill somebody because you voluntarily chose to 140 00:07:53,800 --> 00:07:55,880 Speaker 4: go on to drugs and alcohol and then you were 141 00:07:55,920 --> 00:07:57,760 Speaker 4: whacked out and you killed somebody, it is not a 142 00:07:57,800 --> 00:08:00,160 Speaker 4: basis to be found not guilty, but it is a 143 00:08:00,200 --> 00:08:02,760 Speaker 4: basis and this is the whole ballgame to drop it 144 00:08:02,840 --> 00:08:06,760 Speaker 4: down from murder to manslaughter, because murder means you intended 145 00:08:06,760 --> 00:08:10,280 Speaker 4: to kill, You formed an intent in your normal, healthy 146 00:08:10,320 --> 00:08:12,600 Speaker 4: mind to kill. If you didn't have a normal healthy 147 00:08:12,600 --> 00:08:16,520 Speaker 4: mind because of the voluntary intoxication, and you intend to 148 00:08:16,640 --> 00:08:19,280 Speaker 4: kill but it was really because of the drugs and 149 00:08:19,280 --> 00:08:22,720 Speaker 4: the metal illness and so on. That justifies dropping it 150 00:08:22,720 --> 00:08:26,160 Speaker 4: from murder to manslaughter, which is, yes, he intended to kill, 151 00:08:26,360 --> 00:08:29,080 Speaker 4: but he can't be held legally responsible for that intent. 152 00:08:29,400 --> 00:08:31,800 Speaker 4: And that means like three six, nine eleven years in 153 00:08:31,840 --> 00:08:35,280 Speaker 4: prison for manslaughter as opposed to twenty five years life 154 00:08:35,280 --> 00:08:37,640 Speaker 4: in prison or maybe even the death penalty if you're 155 00:08:37,679 --> 00:08:38,600 Speaker 4: convicted of murder. 156 00:08:40,080 --> 00:08:42,719 Speaker 2: Stories I'm reading and you know, in the last few 157 00:08:42,800 --> 00:08:45,400 Speaker 2: days there have been a number of stories that turned 158 00:08:45,440 --> 00:08:48,120 Speaker 2: out to be wrong. So and some of these come 159 00:08:48,160 --> 00:08:49,520 Speaker 2: from the New York Posts, so you got to put 160 00:08:49,520 --> 00:08:55,640 Speaker 2: an asterisk. But they say that the whiners took him 161 00:08:55,679 --> 00:08:59,400 Speaker 2: to the Christmas party because his behavior was so erratic 162 00:08:59,800 --> 00:09:03,760 Speaker 2: in recent weeks. They didn't trust him being alone. They 163 00:09:03,760 --> 00:09:07,600 Speaker 2: didn't know what would happen. Didn't say what specifically they 164 00:09:07,640 --> 00:09:09,360 Speaker 2: were afraid of. If they thought he was going to 165 00:09:09,440 --> 00:09:12,319 Speaker 2: kill himself, burned down the house, didn't say, But that's 166 00:09:12,360 --> 00:09:15,040 Speaker 2: why they took him to the party. And then he 167 00:09:15,080 --> 00:09:17,520 Speaker 2: started acting bizarrely there and they had to leave, and 168 00:09:17,559 --> 00:09:21,480 Speaker 2: then the murder happened. How does that play into it? 169 00:09:21,559 --> 00:09:24,440 Speaker 2: What does that suggest when you have a read because 170 00:09:24,480 --> 00:09:27,520 Speaker 2: obviously there were times he did act rationally in life, 171 00:09:27,600 --> 00:09:29,760 Speaker 2: and I don't know if his mental illness was in 172 00:09:29,840 --> 00:09:32,520 Speaker 2: and out of its schizophrenia, if it was depending on 173 00:09:32,800 --> 00:09:34,800 Speaker 2: the amount of drugs he was taking. But there were 174 00:09:34,840 --> 00:09:37,520 Speaker 2: times he was normal and times he went apparently through 175 00:09:37,559 --> 00:09:41,040 Speaker 2: episodes where they couldn't leave them alone. And as that 176 00:09:41,120 --> 00:09:45,800 Speaker 2: comes out, does that send this plea or a trial 177 00:09:45,960 --> 00:09:47,520 Speaker 2: into a different direction. 178 00:09:49,080 --> 00:09:51,440 Speaker 4: I think what it means is that they were fully 179 00:09:51,480 --> 00:09:53,280 Speaker 4: aware of the fact that even though they made that 180 00:09:53,320 --> 00:09:56,800 Speaker 4: movie together a decade ago about a son with troubles 181 00:09:57,000 --> 00:10:01,679 Speaker 4: and a prominent dad, they felt that at least it 182 00:10:01,800 --> 00:10:04,520 Speaker 4: was safe for him to interact with people, but you know, 183 00:10:04,720 --> 00:10:09,640 Speaker 4: keep them close to possibly prevent problems, encouraging to take medication. 184 00:10:09,760 --> 00:10:11,360 Speaker 4: I think what it says is that they of course 185 00:10:11,440 --> 00:10:14,520 Speaker 4: had no idea that he might have this potential for violence, 186 00:10:14,559 --> 00:10:17,360 Speaker 4: because otherwise, why would you subject all that, you know, 187 00:10:17,760 --> 00:10:21,079 Speaker 4: all the guests at Conan O'Brien's holiday party to somebody 188 00:10:21,120 --> 00:10:23,680 Speaker 4: who could spin out of control. I think, you know, 189 00:10:23,679 --> 00:10:25,760 Speaker 4: the bottom line is a person like that is a 190 00:10:25,760 --> 00:10:28,120 Speaker 4: loaded gun. You just never know when it's going to 191 00:10:28,160 --> 00:10:30,720 Speaker 4: go off. You know, you love them, you struggle to 192 00:10:30,720 --> 00:10:32,560 Speaker 4: try to help them. You work with them in terms 193 00:10:32,559 --> 00:10:35,200 Speaker 4: of therapy and medication, but there's only so much you 194 00:10:35,200 --> 00:10:37,280 Speaker 4: can do if he's just going to aspire a lot 195 00:10:37,320 --> 00:10:37,840 Speaker 4: of control. 196 00:10:39,040 --> 00:10:42,720 Speaker 2: There is no legal option when you have an adult 197 00:10:42,760 --> 00:10:47,880 Speaker 2: in your family who's consistently erratic, either a drug addict 198 00:10:48,040 --> 00:10:52,640 Speaker 2: or mentally ill, and they won't voluntarily get treatment or 199 00:10:52,640 --> 00:10:55,720 Speaker 2: take their medication, whatever the reason is, and you're living 200 00:10:55,760 --> 00:10:58,400 Speaker 2: with them, and there's nothing you could do other than 201 00:10:58,520 --> 00:10:59,680 Speaker 2: throw them out of the house. 202 00:11:00,040 --> 00:11:01,560 Speaker 1: And I hope they don't come back and kill you. And 203 00:11:01,640 --> 00:11:04,280 Speaker 1: I just find that people get. 204 00:11:04,160 --> 00:11:07,920 Speaker 2: Trapped in just terrible situations because there isn't an outlet 205 00:11:07,960 --> 00:11:11,760 Speaker 2: in society or in government to care for these people 206 00:11:11,840 --> 00:11:13,040 Speaker 2: and force them into treatment. 207 00:11:14,840 --> 00:11:17,800 Speaker 4: No, you're right, it's a real tragedy. Now there is 208 00:11:17,960 --> 00:11:20,960 Speaker 4: a stopgap measure, you know, the sixty one fifty hole 209 00:11:21,040 --> 00:11:23,800 Speaker 4: the people talk about, where if somebody is a danger 210 00:11:23,840 --> 00:11:26,520 Speaker 4: to themselves or others, you can go to the court 211 00:11:26,559 --> 00:11:29,200 Speaker 4: and say, hey, your honor, we want them civilly committed 212 00:11:29,240 --> 00:11:32,319 Speaker 4: to be evaluated by some shrinks and get some medication 213 00:11:32,440 --> 00:11:36,120 Speaker 4: into them, so you can temporarily get them off the street. 214 00:11:36,440 --> 00:11:41,240 Speaker 4: But that only lasts for seventy two hours hours. Yeahmstrat Yeah, 215 00:11:41,320 --> 00:11:44,360 Speaker 4: an even higher level of risks. So yeah, it's just 216 00:11:44,679 --> 00:11:46,640 Speaker 4: I mean, when you see people, you know, driving around 217 00:11:46,800 --> 00:11:49,520 Speaker 4: LA with a homelessness situation, you know that a good 218 00:11:49,559 --> 00:11:52,280 Speaker 4: chunk of these folks they're not living lives, they don't 219 00:11:52,320 --> 00:11:55,880 Speaker 4: really have a brain, They've got awful mental illness. They're 220 00:11:55,880 --> 00:11:58,959 Speaker 4: in the grips the throes of addiction, and you drive 221 00:11:59,000 --> 00:12:01,600 Speaker 4: by and nobody doing anything for them. I think that's 222 00:12:01,640 --> 00:12:03,800 Speaker 4: why a lot of people john are sympathetic to the 223 00:12:03,840 --> 00:12:07,600 Speaker 4: idea that, look, let's lock up some people against their will, 224 00:12:07,679 --> 00:12:09,839 Speaker 4: like they did, you know, before Ronald Reagan changed the 225 00:12:09,920 --> 00:12:13,400 Speaker 4: rules back in the sixties and early seventies. Because you know, 226 00:12:14,360 --> 00:12:17,200 Speaker 4: the government, you know, the government takes half of your money. 227 00:12:17,400 --> 00:12:19,800 Speaker 4: If you make a lot of money, why can't the 228 00:12:19,840 --> 00:12:23,199 Speaker 4: government do some other things to protect you, to protect 229 00:12:23,200 --> 00:12:26,760 Speaker 4: public health. So you know, it's a big debate going on. 230 00:12:26,840 --> 00:12:29,319 Speaker 4: But you know a lot of libertarians say, no, you know, 231 00:12:29,679 --> 00:12:31,360 Speaker 4: the government should be locking you up. 232 00:12:31,640 --> 00:12:33,840 Speaker 2: If they had one of these guys in their family, 233 00:12:34,040 --> 00:12:36,400 Speaker 2: they might change their mind. It's easy to have a 234 00:12:36,520 --> 00:12:40,040 Speaker 2: theoretical objection it's something abstract, but when it's actually in 235 00:12:40,080 --> 00:12:40,559 Speaker 2: your house. 236 00:12:40,840 --> 00:12:42,160 Speaker 1: That's a whole different story. 237 00:12:42,640 --> 00:12:44,760 Speaker 4: Now. I agree. I think what's going to happen here 238 00:12:44,840 --> 00:12:46,880 Speaker 4: is that the family is going to push super hard 239 00:12:47,200 --> 00:12:50,880 Speaker 4: to present all the evidence of addiction and mental health 240 00:12:50,920 --> 00:12:55,000 Speaker 4: problems to at all costs avoid the murder conviction. And 241 00:12:55,040 --> 00:12:57,520 Speaker 4: then if he deserves to spend some time in prison, okay, 242 00:12:57,920 --> 00:12:59,920 Speaker 4: but the important thing is to get the guy help. 243 00:13:00,640 --> 00:13:03,280 Speaker 2: All right, Royal Oaks, ABC News Legal Analysts, thank you, 244 00:13:03,559 --> 00:13:04,319 Speaker 2: Thank you for coming on. 245 00:13:04,960 --> 00:13:06,440 Speaker 1: All right, we'll do more on this coming up. 246 00:13:07,240 --> 00:13:11,280 Speaker 5: You're listening to John Cobelt on demand from KFI A 247 00:13:11,480 --> 00:13:12,360 Speaker 5: M six forty. 248 00:13:13,920 --> 00:13:17,120 Speaker 2: Moisteine for Friday eight seven seven Moist eighty six eight 249 00:13:17,240 --> 00:13:20,400 Speaker 2: seven seven Moist eighty six, or use the talkback feature 250 00:13:20,760 --> 00:13:22,160 Speaker 2: on the iHeartRadio app. 251 00:13:22,200 --> 00:13:22,800 Speaker 1: We just had. 252 00:13:23,160 --> 00:13:25,079 Speaker 2: We just had Royal Oaks on for BBC News the 253 00:13:25,160 --> 00:13:29,360 Speaker 2: legal analyst, because it's really important to understand the legal 254 00:13:29,440 --> 00:13:35,480 Speaker 2: pathways from here for Nick Reiner. First of all, there's 255 00:13:35,240 --> 00:13:39,800 Speaker 2: there's no question obviously that he committed the murder. So 256 00:13:40,040 --> 00:13:42,319 Speaker 2: what does a defense attorney do. Why would you pick 257 00:13:43,520 --> 00:13:50,360 Speaker 2: Alan Jackson, who's who's very expensive obviously highest level cases 258 00:13:50,600 --> 00:13:55,040 Speaker 2: that he handles, including Kevin Spacey and Harvey Weinstein, and 259 00:13:55,960 --> 00:14:00,280 Speaker 2: so what could they possibly say not guilty by rest 260 00:14:00,280 --> 00:14:04,800 Speaker 2: of insanity. Well, if you plead that, you have to 261 00:14:04,840 --> 00:14:06,920 Speaker 2: prove you didn't know right from wrong, that you really 262 00:14:06,960 --> 00:14:09,680 Speaker 2: had a psychotic break from reality and you didn't know 263 00:14:09,720 --> 00:14:12,160 Speaker 2: what was going on and you didn't know what you 264 00:14:12,240 --> 00:14:18,320 Speaker 2: were doing. And I don't think that's the case. But 265 00:14:18,440 --> 00:14:29,840 Speaker 2: then you have this voluntary intoxication defense, which can strongly 266 00:14:29,880 --> 00:14:36,160 Speaker 2: affect your judgment and cause you to do things that 267 00:14:36,200 --> 00:14:39,960 Speaker 2: you ordinarily wouldn't do, that you didn't plan or intend 268 00:14:40,000 --> 00:14:44,200 Speaker 2: to do. It sounds murky, doesn't it, But it's going 269 00:14:44,280 --> 00:14:46,840 Speaker 2: to be that kind of defense if there is one. 270 00:14:51,240 --> 00:14:56,280 Speaker 2: It's about an intent to kill and when the intent formed, 271 00:14:57,040 --> 00:15:01,400 Speaker 2: and how compromised was his mind, how diminished was his 272 00:15:01,440 --> 00:15:06,600 Speaker 2: mind when he decided to do that. None of these 273 00:15:06,640 --> 00:15:11,640 Speaker 2: are easy paths. But Alan Jackson might decide to go 274 00:15:11,680 --> 00:15:14,720 Speaker 2: down that road or threaten to go down that road 275 00:15:15,200 --> 00:15:18,560 Speaker 2: to get a plea deal which eliminates the death penalty 276 00:15:19,120 --> 00:15:22,880 Speaker 2: or perhaps gives his nick rein or parole at some point. 277 00:15:23,200 --> 00:15:25,520 Speaker 2: So some of that is legal strategy, and that's why 278 00:15:25,720 --> 00:15:29,480 Speaker 2: he wanted to take three weeks until the official arraignment day. 279 00:15:29,520 --> 00:15:33,440 Speaker 2: On January seventh. To look at all the possibilities here. Now, 280 00:15:33,800 --> 00:15:36,360 Speaker 2: if you look, they didn't have photos or videos allowed 281 00:15:36,360 --> 00:15:39,560 Speaker 2: in the courtroom. But I'm looking at the New York 282 00:15:39,600 --> 00:15:45,720 Speaker 2: Post and they have an old fashioned courtroom sketch. I 283 00:15:45,720 --> 00:15:50,160 Speaker 2: would have thought courtroom sketch artists were an extinct species, 284 00:15:50,200 --> 00:15:54,240 Speaker 2: but they did them in color. Now, and here is 285 00:15:54,280 --> 00:15:58,120 Speaker 2: one of Nick Reiner, and he's wearing the suicide smock, 286 00:15:58,800 --> 00:16:01,120 Speaker 2: which in the sketch it looks like he's wearing a 287 00:16:01,160 --> 00:16:02,440 Speaker 2: purple sleeveless dress. 288 00:16:04,160 --> 00:16:05,800 Speaker 1: It really is a smock. 289 00:16:05,920 --> 00:16:08,680 Speaker 2: It comes down to his knees, his legs are bare, 290 00:16:08,840 --> 00:16:14,600 Speaker 2: his arms are bare, his hands are shackled together. And 291 00:16:14,840 --> 00:16:16,920 Speaker 2: I don't know what the smock is made of, but 292 00:16:18,040 --> 00:16:21,920 Speaker 2: it makes it impossible for him to use his arms, 293 00:16:22,120 --> 00:16:24,280 Speaker 2: or you use any kind of clothing, right, because you 294 00:16:24,520 --> 00:16:27,440 Speaker 2: could hang yourself with your the sleeves of your shirt 295 00:16:27,600 --> 00:16:31,560 Speaker 2: or your pant legs, and there are no sleeves, There 296 00:16:31,560 --> 00:16:33,880 Speaker 2: are no pant legs here, so I guess it really 297 00:16:34,200 --> 00:16:35,240 Speaker 2: is just a one piece. 298 00:16:36,040 --> 00:16:37,680 Speaker 1: It looks ridiculous. 299 00:16:37,720 --> 00:16:40,600 Speaker 2: Actually, in the sketch it looks like he's wearing a 300 00:16:40,640 --> 00:16:47,680 Speaker 2: summer dress, some kind of purple plaid number. He apparently 301 00:16:47,720 --> 00:16:53,160 Speaker 2: sat stone faced. He was behind a glass panel, and 302 00:16:54,360 --> 00:16:57,080 Speaker 2: god knows how many drugs he was on. And I 303 00:16:57,080 --> 00:16:58,880 Speaker 2: don't know how, you know, do they just go cold 304 00:16:58,920 --> 00:17:03,000 Speaker 2: turkey in prison if he's got some horrific withdrawal situation 305 00:17:03,160 --> 00:17:13,159 Speaker 2: going on, I don't know that either. But there are 306 00:17:13,280 --> 00:17:17,399 Speaker 2: new details coming out on how Rob and Michelle were found. 307 00:17:18,440 --> 00:17:21,320 Speaker 1: A massage therapist arrived at. 308 00:17:21,160 --> 00:17:25,159 Speaker 2: The home and they were supposed to give Robin or 309 00:17:25,400 --> 00:17:30,679 Speaker 2: Michelle Reiner a massage and then later on Robin Michelle, 310 00:17:30,680 --> 00:17:33,679 Speaker 2: We're gonna have dinner with Barack and Michelle Obama and 311 00:17:33,720 --> 00:17:38,199 Speaker 2: other people in just a few hours. And this is 312 00:17:38,240 --> 00:17:42,760 Speaker 2: the day after the party. The massage therapist got no 313 00:17:42,840 --> 00:17:46,760 Speaker 2: answer at the gate. That's when she called the couple's daughter, 314 00:17:47,680 --> 00:17:50,760 Speaker 2: Romy Reiner, who came in with a roommate. Romy walked 315 00:17:50,800 --> 00:17:56,040 Speaker 2: in found her father's body and obviously it was really horrific. 316 00:17:57,080 --> 00:18:00,840 Speaker 2: They had their throats slit by all the blood must 317 00:18:00,920 --> 00:18:06,200 Speaker 2: have come out. She ran away outside and didn't realize 318 00:18:06,240 --> 00:18:09,160 Speaker 2: that her mother had also been slaughtered in the same way. 319 00:18:11,200 --> 00:18:17,240 Speaker 2: Somebody connected to the family provided some information to The 320 00:18:17,240 --> 00:18:28,080 Speaker 2: New York Times yesterday on condition of anonymity and this person, 321 00:18:28,359 --> 00:18:33,320 Speaker 2: and again I've seen multiple conflicting reports. This person said 322 00:18:33,359 --> 00:18:36,080 Speaker 2: that nothing in recent weeks suggested that Nick would be 323 00:18:36,160 --> 00:18:40,439 Speaker 2: capable of such violence, and this person disputed accounts that 324 00:18:40,480 --> 00:18:44,439 Speaker 2: the family had been especially apprehensive in the weeks before 325 00:18:44,560 --> 00:18:50,960 Speaker 2: Reiner's behavior. I've seen other reports which suggested otherwise, but 326 00:18:51,040 --> 00:18:56,439 Speaker 2: who knows. But he definitely behaved erratically that evening. He 327 00:18:56,600 --> 00:19:00,320 Speaker 2: was running up to people and saying, what's your name, 328 00:19:00,440 --> 00:19:03,560 Speaker 2: what's your last name? Are you famous? In a very 329 00:19:03,600 --> 00:19:07,720 Speaker 2: aggressive manner. Rob Reiner j scolded him a couple of times, 330 00:19:09,200 --> 00:19:15,080 Speaker 2: and that caused tension. Varying reports just how intense, how 331 00:19:15,160 --> 00:19:18,480 Speaker 2: loud the exchange was. But that's when the Rhiners decided 332 00:19:18,520 --> 00:19:23,400 Speaker 2: to leave. And like I said to Royal, they took 333 00:19:23,440 --> 00:19:27,120 Speaker 2: him there because they didn't want to leave him alone. 334 00:19:28,720 --> 00:19:32,439 Speaker 2: It's very possible that you had many, many years of 335 00:19:32,560 --> 00:19:39,520 Speaker 2: really really erratic, crazy, unpredictable violent or near violent behavior, 336 00:19:40,840 --> 00:19:43,879 Speaker 2: and guys thirty two years old and they're at the 337 00:19:43,960 --> 00:19:45,000 Speaker 2: end of the rope, like what. 338 00:19:44,920 --> 00:19:49,199 Speaker 1: Do you do? And it's inconceivable to me. 339 00:19:52,000 --> 00:19:55,600 Speaker 2: It is absolutely conceivable that in the state, in this country, 340 00:19:55,920 --> 00:19:59,800 Speaker 2: we don't have an outlet when there's a family member 341 00:20:00,119 --> 00:20:04,920 Speaker 2: who is acting insane, even though that's not the legal 342 00:20:04,960 --> 00:20:08,879 Speaker 2: definition of insanity, that you can't forcibly take them somewhere 343 00:20:09,240 --> 00:20:12,280 Speaker 2: and lock them up. Some people need to be in 344 00:20:12,280 --> 00:20:15,520 Speaker 2: a mental institution. Some people need to be forcibly medicated. 345 00:20:15,960 --> 00:20:19,800 Speaker 2: It's always been that way, and for fifty years now 346 00:20:20,119 --> 00:20:26,600 Speaker 2: that option has been difficult to access and it's just stupid. 347 00:20:26,680 --> 00:20:30,200 Speaker 2: And I know there's all these libertarian types or ACLU 348 00:20:30,320 --> 00:20:33,080 Speaker 2: types who think everybody ought to have the freedom to 349 00:20:33,119 --> 00:20:37,200 Speaker 2: do anything, and that's just not possible in the real world. 350 00:20:37,240 --> 00:20:42,439 Speaker 2: That's in their fantasy, utopia, academic, abstract world. It's not 351 00:20:42,760 --> 00:20:44,879 Speaker 2: in the real world. You got to get them out 352 00:20:44,880 --> 00:20:46,680 Speaker 2: of the house, you got to get them off the streets. 353 00:20:46,680 --> 00:20:48,240 Speaker 2: You have to force them into treatment. 354 00:20:49,080 --> 00:20:49,560 Speaker 1: A lot of the. 355 00:20:49,480 --> 00:20:52,640 Speaker 2: Treatment doesn't work, it doesn't that's you know, all these 356 00:20:52,680 --> 00:20:56,640 Speaker 2: rehab centers wildly over sold. A lot of them are criminal, 357 00:20:56,680 --> 00:21:00,200 Speaker 2: they're cruks. But there's got to be a better way this. 358 00:21:01,720 --> 00:21:06,080 Speaker 5: You're listening to John Cobelt on demand from KFI AM 359 00:21:06,080 --> 00:21:06,639 Speaker 5: six forty. 360 00:21:07,720 --> 00:21:09,720 Speaker 2: We are on every day from one until four o'clock. 361 00:21:10,000 --> 00:21:12,479 Speaker 2: You could follow us at John Cobelt Radio and social 362 00:21:12,480 --> 00:21:15,560 Speaker 2: media at John Cobelt Radio, and you can subscribe to 363 00:21:15,600 --> 00:21:18,879 Speaker 2: our YouTube channel. That's where we put on put up 364 00:21:18,920 --> 00:21:23,359 Speaker 2: longer segments and you subscribe by going to YouTube dot 365 00:21:23,400 --> 00:21:28,000 Speaker 2: com slash at John Cobelt Show. YouTube dot com slash 366 00:21:28,119 --> 00:21:32,320 Speaker 2: at John Cobelt Show to subscribe. And it's a little 367 00:21:32,320 --> 00:21:35,280 Speaker 2: different at John Cobelt Radio to follow us on the 368 00:21:35,320 --> 00:21:36,959 Speaker 2: rest of social media. 369 00:21:37,040 --> 00:21:39,080 Speaker 1: Coming up after two o'clock. 370 00:21:40,840 --> 00:21:45,040 Speaker 2: Los Angeles Times had had several stories today as we 371 00:21:45,080 --> 00:21:48,119 Speaker 2: head towards the one year anniversary of the great Bass 372 00:21:48,240 --> 00:21:54,840 Speaker 2: Newsom fire in the Palisades and in Altadena, and Karen Bess, 373 00:21:54,840 --> 00:21:58,800 Speaker 2: since she's running for reelection, is going on the podcast tour. 374 00:22:00,119 --> 00:22:02,840 Speaker 2: She did an out well, I'll be very specific. She 375 00:22:02,920 --> 00:22:06,800 Speaker 2: did a sixty two minute podcast that you could find 376 00:22:06,920 --> 00:22:08,360 Speaker 2: on YouTube. 377 00:22:08,560 --> 00:22:10,760 Speaker 1: It's called The Fifth Column, but. 378 00:22:10,840 --> 00:22:15,960 Speaker 2: It was originally a sixty six minute podcast. There was 379 00:22:16,000 --> 00:22:21,520 Speaker 2: four more minutes. She thought the podcast had ended and 380 00:22:21,600 --> 00:22:26,280 Speaker 2: she started telling the truth. And for a while that 381 00:22:26,720 --> 00:22:31,480 Speaker 2: version was up online, but Karen Bass didn't want you 382 00:22:31,600 --> 00:22:34,680 Speaker 2: to see or hear her say the things she did, 383 00:22:36,040 --> 00:22:39,119 Speaker 2: and the LA Times must have gotten hold of the 384 00:22:39,160 --> 00:22:42,320 Speaker 2: original cut, and I'll tell you about it. 385 00:22:43,320 --> 00:22:46,200 Speaker 1: But the Best staff. 386 00:22:46,080 --> 00:22:49,520 Speaker 2: Went to some lengths to make sure that make sure 387 00:22:49,600 --> 00:22:53,120 Speaker 2: that was off YouTube, and now nobody wants to talk 388 00:22:53,160 --> 00:22:57,640 Speaker 2: about it on either side. We'll explain all that coming up. 389 00:22:58,320 --> 00:23:01,680 Speaker 2: And we also have Katie Grimes on the show after three, 390 00:23:02,119 --> 00:23:06,560 Speaker 2: and Katie's from californiaglobe dot com and she's gonna tell 391 00:23:06,600 --> 00:23:12,680 Speaker 2: us about all the disasters up in Sacramento with Gavin Newsom. 392 00:23:13,000 --> 00:23:17,760 Speaker 2: There's a massive budget deficit, among other things. We'll go 393 00:23:17,840 --> 00:23:19,840 Speaker 2: through the list. The list is lengthy. 394 00:23:21,440 --> 00:23:21,640 Speaker 4: Now. 395 00:23:21,680 --> 00:23:24,000 Speaker 2: On the Nick Reiner case, which we were talking about 396 00:23:24,000 --> 00:23:27,080 Speaker 2: for the first half hour, we're talking about his state 397 00:23:27,119 --> 00:23:31,959 Speaker 2: of mind because besides the guilty not guilty options, there 398 00:23:32,040 --> 00:23:36,840 Speaker 2: is guilty not guilty by reason of insanity or not 399 00:23:37,680 --> 00:23:40,399 Speaker 2: or guilty but with a and I'm gonna call a 400 00:23:40,400 --> 00:23:46,320 Speaker 2: diminished mind. It's or voluntary intoxication. You take drugs, messes 401 00:23:46,400 --> 00:23:50,000 Speaker 2: up your brain so much you can't make a rational decision. 402 00:23:50,040 --> 00:23:51,560 Speaker 1: You didn't really have intent to kill. 403 00:23:52,320 --> 00:23:56,200 Speaker 2: And these are the options that Alan Jackson is looking at, 404 00:23:56,680 --> 00:23:59,199 Speaker 2: which is why he wants another three weeks. The arrangement 405 00:23:59,240 --> 00:24:03,800 Speaker 2: didn't happen today. Some clues about his state of mind. 406 00:24:04,040 --> 00:24:07,439 Speaker 2: There's a couple of videos and one of them shows 407 00:24:07,560 --> 00:24:15,359 Speaker 2: Nick Reiner walking down Santa Sente Boulevard. There's a gas 408 00:24:15,400 --> 00:24:17,879 Speaker 2: station there at the Sinclair Station. It's on the corner 409 00:24:17,880 --> 00:24:20,760 Speaker 2: of twenty sixth Street. It's a station that I go 410 00:24:20,840 --> 00:24:24,120 Speaker 2: to sometimes. You know, has one of the dinosaurs. Oh, 411 00:24:24,119 --> 00:24:27,480 Speaker 2: in fact, this was the place where the dinosaur was kidnapped. 412 00:24:28,160 --> 00:24:30,440 Speaker 1: You know their mascot. I forgot what it. 413 00:24:30,359 --> 00:24:34,000 Speaker 2: Was made of, but you remember some thief stole it, 414 00:24:34,760 --> 00:24:36,639 Speaker 2: threw it in the back of a pickup truck and 415 00:24:36,720 --> 00:24:39,879 Speaker 2: ran off and there was such an outcry. Maybe he 416 00:24:39,960 --> 00:24:42,720 Speaker 2: decided he couldn't sell it because everybody was looking for it, 417 00:24:43,040 --> 00:24:45,240 Speaker 2: and so he brought it back. Well, it's the same station. 418 00:24:45,720 --> 00:24:48,200 Speaker 2: It's odd the station has been in the news twice 419 00:24:48,240 --> 00:24:52,840 Speaker 2: in the last few weeks. Well, there's surveillance cameras on 420 00:24:52,920 --> 00:24:57,880 Speaker 2: the station property, and it caught Nick Reiner walking by 421 00:24:57,920 --> 00:25:01,960 Speaker 2: casually just before midnight on Saturday. Now New York Posts 422 00:25:01,960 --> 00:25:06,719 Speaker 2: said this was hours before Rob and Michael Rob and 423 00:25:06,720 --> 00:25:11,240 Speaker 2: Michelle Ryder were killed, and they lived not far from 424 00:25:11,359 --> 00:25:15,560 Speaker 2: that gas station, and so I was thinking, it's like, well, 425 00:25:15,640 --> 00:25:19,359 Speaker 2: what time did they come home from the Christmas party? 426 00:25:20,240 --> 00:25:23,720 Speaker 2: And did he leave and then come back Because he's 427 00:25:23,760 --> 00:25:27,720 Speaker 2: walking normally. You wouldn't have noticed him twice if you 428 00:25:27,760 --> 00:25:33,600 Speaker 2: were driving by. Was this after he did the killing, 429 00:25:34,320 --> 00:25:39,440 Speaker 2: because they haven't released a timeline, and so they haven't 430 00:25:39,480 --> 00:25:43,120 Speaker 2: released when they left the party and when they went 431 00:25:43,160 --> 00:25:46,240 Speaker 2: to bed, if they were killed while in bed or 432 00:25:46,440 --> 00:25:50,560 Speaker 2: killed before they went to sleep. But he's walking calmly, 433 00:25:50,600 --> 00:25:53,720 Speaker 2: and if you're using that photo to give an assessment 434 00:25:53,760 --> 00:25:56,240 Speaker 2: of a state of mind, he looks completely normal. 435 00:25:56,760 --> 00:25:56,960 Speaker 4: Now. 436 00:25:57,000 --> 00:26:01,399 Speaker 2: The second photo is definitely after the killing, because this 437 00:26:01,680 --> 00:26:05,600 Speaker 2: is the photo where he buys a drink at a 438 00:26:05,640 --> 00:26:10,239 Speaker 2: gas station near Exposition Park, and that's where he was 439 00:26:10,880 --> 00:26:21,080 Speaker 2: found by police and arrested and handcuffed. And this was 440 00:26:21,119 --> 00:26:27,639 Speaker 2: Sunday night, and he was waiting to purchase a drink 441 00:26:28,119 --> 00:26:34,960 Speaker 2: something in a can inside the convenience store. And if 442 00:26:34,960 --> 00:26:37,680 Speaker 2: you look at the clip, he's dressed normally, just jeans, 443 00:26:37,680 --> 00:26:41,320 Speaker 2: a striped jacket, baseball cap, red backpack, reaches into his 444 00:26:41,400 --> 00:26:45,080 Speaker 2: pockets to grab his wallet to pay, and it's just 445 00:26:45,480 --> 00:26:50,879 Speaker 2: a short time before he gets arrested by the police, 446 00:26:51,200 --> 00:26:55,600 Speaker 2: and the video shows him holding his arms up surrendering 447 00:26:56,080 --> 00:26:57,879 Speaker 2: as police cars pulled to the sidewalk. 448 00:26:58,480 --> 00:26:58,840 Speaker 1: Again. 449 00:26:59,240 --> 00:27:03,199 Speaker 2: In both videos, one if these if all this is accurate. 450 00:27:03,280 --> 00:27:08,720 Speaker 2: Saturday night at the Sinclair Station, Brentwood. Sunday night at 451 00:27:08,760 --> 00:27:15,200 Speaker 2: this convenience store near Exposition Park, he's completely relaxed and calm, 452 00:27:16,200 --> 00:27:19,159 Speaker 2: like if he was truly psychotic, you think he'd be 453 00:27:19,200 --> 00:27:22,480 Speaker 2: acting like one of the lunatics we see in the streets. 454 00:27:23,160 --> 00:27:25,520 Speaker 2: I mean, you can drive around in LA for an 455 00:27:25,520 --> 00:27:29,000 Speaker 2: hour and you'll see one hundred and fifty guys acting 456 00:27:29,600 --> 00:27:34,960 Speaker 2: far more menacingly, far more crazy than you saw. 457 00:27:36,440 --> 00:27:37,240 Speaker 1: In Nick Reiner. 458 00:27:38,000 --> 00:27:41,800 Speaker 2: So again I questioned this idea that there's you're going 459 00:27:41,840 --> 00:27:48,080 Speaker 2: to be able to sell this impaired mind or this 460 00:27:48,680 --> 00:27:50,680 Speaker 2: voluntary intoxication defense. 461 00:27:51,840 --> 00:27:56,080 Speaker 1: Now, there was also a story in. 462 00:27:56,000 --> 00:28:00,919 Speaker 2: The post about he would go on meth binges, and 463 00:28:01,200 --> 00:28:05,000 Speaker 2: if you've ever ever well, actually, I was going to say, 464 00:28:05,280 --> 00:28:07,520 Speaker 2: you don't have to know somebody on a meth binge. Again, 465 00:28:07,600 --> 00:28:09,840 Speaker 2: you just drive around Los Angeles for an hour and 466 00:28:09,880 --> 00:28:12,560 Speaker 2: you'll see dozens of people on a meth binge. These 467 00:28:12,600 --> 00:28:17,280 Speaker 2: are the menacing, aggressive, violent, craziest of the crazy out there. 468 00:28:18,320 --> 00:28:19,320 Speaker 1: Most of that is meth. 469 00:28:20,200 --> 00:28:25,760 Speaker 2: Because you take heroin or fentanyl that knocks you out, 470 00:28:25,840 --> 00:28:28,680 Speaker 2: you're not functioning. Those are the people that are either 471 00:28:28,800 --> 00:28:32,719 Speaker 2: laying on the ground, or they're slightly bent over in 472 00:28:32,720 --> 00:28:37,680 Speaker 2: a locked position. What gets you crazy can be cocaine, 473 00:28:37,920 --> 00:28:42,240 Speaker 2: but certainly meth. I saw a guy on meth once, 474 00:28:42,360 --> 00:28:47,040 Speaker 2: a homeless guy, and he gotten loose inside my son's 475 00:28:47,600 --> 00:28:53,080 Speaker 2: little league baseball the facility they had, they had several fields, 476 00:28:53,520 --> 00:28:58,479 Speaker 2: and all the baseball fields were caged off. They had 477 00:28:58,560 --> 00:29:02,160 Speaker 2: chainling fences separating and it kind of created a labyrinth. 478 00:29:03,000 --> 00:29:07,000 Speaker 2: You could walk on these paths in between the fencing 479 00:29:07,120 --> 00:29:11,880 Speaker 2: for the fields. And he was in there, and my 480 00:29:11,960 --> 00:29:13,680 Speaker 2: son was on a team and they were about to 481 00:29:13,720 --> 00:29:16,360 Speaker 2: have a practice and he's on the loose. The dads 482 00:29:16,400 --> 00:29:20,200 Speaker 2: and the coaches get scared, so everybody grabbed baseball bats 483 00:29:20,440 --> 00:29:24,760 Speaker 2: and started chasing this guy. Now, this guy is in 484 00:29:24,760 --> 00:29:32,240 Speaker 2: his mid forties, gray hair, he's got a paunch, not 485 00:29:32,400 --> 00:29:35,640 Speaker 2: athletic in any way, but he's on the meth. And 486 00:29:35,680 --> 00:29:38,600 Speaker 2: he jumped on the chain link fence, which was at 487 00:29:38,720 --> 00:29:42,080 Speaker 2: least twenty feet high, if not more, and in a 488 00:29:42,160 --> 00:29:44,080 Speaker 2: blink of an eye, climbed all the way to the 489 00:29:44,080 --> 00:29:48,520 Speaker 2: top of the fence and then swung his legs around 490 00:29:48,680 --> 00:29:51,600 Speaker 2: and then quickly climbed all the way down the fence 491 00:29:54,000 --> 00:29:58,360 Speaker 2: at a shaped, graying, paunchy, middle aged guy put on 492 00:29:58,440 --> 00:30:01,560 Speaker 2: this Olympic style performance, and then he ran across the street, 493 00:30:01,600 --> 00:30:06,840 Speaker 2: across the pulit of Boulevard into traffic and disappeared. And 494 00:30:06,880 --> 00:30:10,920 Speaker 2: it's the first time I understood what I normally just 495 00:30:11,000 --> 00:30:16,360 Speaker 2: read about about the incredible amount of superhuman energy that 496 00:30:16,400 --> 00:30:19,440 Speaker 2: can be released in your body when you've taken this 497 00:30:19,560 --> 00:30:24,080 Speaker 2: much myth. You don't see that in the Nick Reiner 498 00:30:24,320 --> 00:30:28,360 Speaker 2: photos or videos, either on Saturday night or Sunday night. 499 00:30:28,680 --> 00:30:31,560 Speaker 2: But apparently that's what caused a lot of mayhem at 500 00:30:31,640 --> 00:30:34,080 Speaker 2: the Reiner's house. He was living in the guest house 501 00:30:34,160 --> 00:30:37,480 Speaker 2: behind behind the main house. That's a lot that's why 502 00:30:37,520 --> 00:30:41,560 Speaker 2: the family members rolling fear, especially when he was when 503 00:30:41,560 --> 00:30:45,280 Speaker 2: he was on the meth, which, from what I understand, 504 00:30:45,600 --> 00:30:47,320 Speaker 2: you get on that, you get addicted to that, that's 505 00:30:47,360 --> 00:30:52,000 Speaker 2: nearly impossible to get off of the pull. What it 506 00:30:52,040 --> 00:30:54,040 Speaker 2: does to your brain, what it does to the receptors 507 00:30:54,040 --> 00:30:57,120 Speaker 2: in your brain, is so powerful, so damaging. It's like 508 00:30:57,160 --> 00:30:59,360 Speaker 2: you're really screwed. You're you're gonna You're gonna have those 509 00:30:59,400 --> 00:31:02,880 Speaker 2: desires for ever. And maybe that's why he went, you know, 510 00:31:02,960 --> 00:31:07,840 Speaker 2: seventeen years and eighteen rehabs and couldn't get straight. 511 00:31:08,160 --> 00:31:12,040 Speaker 1: It wouldn't stick all right. Well, when we. 512 00:31:12,040 --> 00:31:15,320 Speaker 2: Come back, Karen Bass stayed a little too long in 513 00:31:15,360 --> 00:31:19,479 Speaker 2: a podcast and said some things that now she doesn't 514 00:31:19,520 --> 00:31:23,680 Speaker 2: want anyone to know about. So she got it cut 515 00:31:23,680 --> 00:31:26,320 Speaker 2: out of a podcast, so we can't see it and 516 00:31:26,400 --> 00:31:29,560 Speaker 2: we can't hear it. But the La Times somehow got 517 00:31:29,560 --> 00:31:31,240 Speaker 2: a hold of it and described it, and I'm going 518 00:31:31,320 --> 00:31:33,840 Speaker 2: to tell you about it coming up after two o'clock. 519 00:31:33,960 --> 00:31:41,560 Speaker 2: And next segment, if you run into a guy you're 520 00:31:41,640 --> 00:31:44,160 Speaker 2: hiring at a school and you have a guy who 521 00:31:44,200 --> 00:31:48,520 Speaker 2: shows up to be your girls cheerleader coach, don't hire him. 522 00:31:49,280 --> 00:31:49,959 Speaker 2: Tell you about that. 523 00:31:50,040 --> 00:31:55,480 Speaker 5: Next you're listening to John Cobels on demand from KFI 524 00:31:55,720 --> 00:31:56,640 Speaker 5: AM six forty. 525 00:31:57,720 --> 00:32:01,280 Speaker 2: Coming up after two o'clock, I'll tell you about the 526 00:32:01,320 --> 00:32:05,800 Speaker 2: podcast video that Karen Bass had removed from YouTube and 527 00:32:05,880 --> 00:32:08,880 Speaker 2: she doesn't want you to hear or see it, but 528 00:32:09,000 --> 00:32:12,320 Speaker 2: the La Times explained it, and I will tell you 529 00:32:12,360 --> 00:32:15,760 Speaker 2: what it's about, coming up right after Brigida's News at 530 00:32:16,080 --> 00:32:20,440 Speaker 2: two o'clock. Okay, So there's this guy, Eric Joseph Christiansen, 531 00:32:21,680 --> 00:32:26,880 Speaker 2: and he shows up in Orange County to be a 532 00:32:27,040 --> 00:32:33,920 Speaker 2: cheer coach he was working at He'd been working around 533 00:32:34,000 --> 00:32:40,080 Speaker 2: the country as a cheer coach, and he got a 534 00:32:40,160 --> 00:32:46,479 Speaker 2: job as a South Orange County YMCA sleepaway camp counselor. Okay, 535 00:32:48,040 --> 00:32:51,040 Speaker 2: when guys show up to take care of kids, call 536 00:32:51,120 --> 00:32:53,800 Speaker 2: the police right away. Middle aged guys show up and 537 00:32:53,840 --> 00:32:57,920 Speaker 2: they want to take care of anything from teenage girls, 538 00:32:57,960 --> 00:33:01,680 Speaker 2: teenage boys, little kids. Get him out of there. Here's 539 00:33:01,720 --> 00:33:04,719 Speaker 2: what happened. He's facing one hundred and fifty years in prison. 540 00:33:05,120 --> 00:33:08,160 Speaker 2: He just got convicted of twenty three felony counts of 541 00:33:08,200 --> 00:33:11,240 Speaker 2: molesting several girls, some of them as young as nine. 542 00:33:11,520 --> 00:33:14,920 Speaker 2: The charges go back to nineteen ninety eight. He was 543 00:33:15,040 --> 00:33:18,400 Speaker 2: arrested in twenty twenty three in North Dakota. His name 544 00:33:18,440 --> 00:33:22,840 Speaker 2: is Eric Joseph Christiansen, forty six years old. Eleven counts 545 00:33:22,880 --> 00:33:27,200 Speaker 2: of louton lucidius acts on a minor under fourteen, four 546 00:33:27,800 --> 00:33:32,560 Speaker 2: charges on a child aged fourteen or fifteen, six counts 547 00:33:33,160 --> 00:33:35,920 Speaker 2: for a minor under eighteen I mean all kinds of 548 00:33:35,960 --> 00:33:40,880 Speaker 2: sexual perversion charges here and what he did. According to 549 00:33:40,880 --> 00:33:44,320 Speaker 2: Todd Spitzer, the Orange County da IS, he used cheerleading 550 00:33:44,360 --> 00:33:47,400 Speaker 2: gyms in Orange County and across the country as kind 551 00:33:47,440 --> 00:33:50,480 Speaker 2: of a perverted catalog from which to select the next 552 00:33:50,520 --> 00:33:52,640 Speaker 2: young girl he was going to molest. He was arrested 553 00:33:52,680 --> 00:33:56,800 Speaker 2: in Kansas in twenty twenty two, extra dieded to Daytona Beach. 554 00:33:57,640 --> 00:34:00,960 Speaker 2: He was working at Champion Elite Legacy cheerleading gym in 555 00:34:01,040 --> 00:34:03,680 Speaker 2: South Daytona Beach, which they've closed. 556 00:34:04,760 --> 00:34:05,360 Speaker 1: News came. 557 00:34:05,680 --> 00:34:08,960 Speaker 2: People learned of the news, and a victim I guess, 558 00:34:09,000 --> 00:34:14,040 Speaker 2: recognized his name because of his arrests and contacted Orange 559 00:34:14,080 --> 00:34:18,080 Speaker 2: County authorities said Christensen forced her to have sex during 560 00:34:18,120 --> 00:34:21,880 Speaker 2: her school lunch, taking her to home, to his home 561 00:34:22,040 --> 00:34:25,160 Speaker 2: or on the beach in California. From nineteen ninety eight 562 00:34:25,160 --> 00:34:29,719 Speaker 2: to six, he was molesting kids. He was a competitive 563 00:34:29,800 --> 00:34:33,439 Speaker 2: cheerleading coach at Magic All Stars of Anaheim for three 564 00:34:33,520 --> 00:34:36,719 Speaker 2: years in the two thousands, an assistant cheer coach at 565 00:34:36,800 --> 00:34:40,840 Speaker 2: Mission Viejo Tribucle Hills High School from four to six 566 00:34:41,200 --> 00:34:45,719 Speaker 2: and at tribuco Is, where he gained access and ended 567 00:34:45,800 --> 00:34:49,080 Speaker 2: up molesting eight young girls. He was also a South 568 00:34:49,160 --> 00:34:54,040 Speaker 2: Orange County YMCA sleepaway camp counselor hiding in plain sight, 569 00:34:54,200 --> 00:34:59,160 Speaker 2: said Spitzer, And all you have to do is when 570 00:34:59,160 --> 00:35:02,120 Speaker 2: a middle aged got shows up wanting to lead the 571 00:35:02,160 --> 00:35:08,760 Speaker 2: girls cheerleading team. You kick him out, you call the police. 572 00:35:08,960 --> 00:35:11,560 Speaker 2: There's no middle aged guy who wants to do that. 573 00:35:12,320 --> 00:35:17,040 Speaker 2: There isn't. It's got to be trouble. It has to 574 00:35:17,080 --> 00:35:22,680 Speaker 2: be And I am just shocked. And this what's wrong 575 00:35:22,719 --> 00:35:25,759 Speaker 2: with people. You do have to stereotype, you do have 576 00:35:25,800 --> 00:35:28,200 Speaker 2: to profile, you have to use your freaking common sense. 577 00:35:29,640 --> 00:35:32,520 Speaker 2: Guys who want to spend their time with young girls 578 00:35:32,560 --> 00:35:38,080 Speaker 2: and teaching them to cheer, Really, you need instruction on this. 579 00:35:40,400 --> 00:35:43,920 Speaker 2: More coming up Karen Bass what she doesn't want you 580 00:35:43,960 --> 00:35:46,440 Speaker 2: to see in here? Hey, you've been listening to The 581 00:35:46,520 --> 00:35:49,200 Speaker 2: John Cobalt Show podcast. You can always hear the show 582 00:35:49,239 --> 00:35:52,000 Speaker 2: live on KFI AM six forty from one to four 583 00:35:52,040 --> 00:35:54,920 Speaker 2: pm every Monday through Friday, and of course, anytime on 584 00:35:55,000 --> 00:35:56,879 Speaker 2: demand on the iHeartRadio app