Speaker 1: Welcome to Prognosis. I'm Laura Carlson. It's day two hundred
Speaker 1: and sixty three since coronavirus was declared a global pandemic.
Speaker 1: Today's main story. One of Joe Biden's first acts as
Speaker 1: president elect was to announce a COVID nineteen advisory Board,
Speaker 1: putting the fight against the pandemic front and center in
Speaker 1: his presidential plans. Today, a member of that advisory board
Speaker 1: talks to us about how a Biden White House plans
Speaker 1: to overhaul the government's coronavirus response. But first, here's what
Speaker 1: happened in virus news today. The UK became the first
Speaker 1: Western country to approve a fully vetted COVID nineteen vaccine.
Speaker 1: The region's regulator cleared FIGHTSER and bio En text shot
Speaker 1: this week, sooner than the US and the European Union.
Speaker 1: The emergency authorization clears the way for the deployment of
Speaker 1: a vaccine that Fightser and its German partner have said
Speaker 1: iscent effective in preventing illness. The shot will be available
Speaker 1: in Britain starting next week. INTERPOL issued a global warning
Speaker 1: to law enforcement that organized crime will target COVID nineteen vaccines.
Speaker 1: The International Crime Fighting organizations that authority should expect an
Speaker 1: onslaught of all types of criminal activity linked to the shot.
Speaker 1: Interpol said some criminals have already begun advertising, selling and
Speaker 1: administering fake vaccines. They added that ensuring the safety of
Speaker 1: the supply chain and identifying illicit websites offering fake products
Speaker 1: will essential. Finally, the World Health Organization has updated its
Speaker 1: guidance on wearing masks. People should wear masks indoors and
Speaker 1: outdoors where physical distancing of at least one meter can't
Speaker 1: be maintained. The organization said that's especially true in areas
Speaker 1: with community or cluster transmission. At home, people should wear
Speaker 1: a mask when receiving visitors in case of crowding or
Speaker 1: poor ventilation. The WHO recommended against wearing a mask during
Speaker 1: vigorous workouts, as well as against the use of valved masks.
Speaker 1: Face shields provide a level of eye protection only in
Speaker 1: our inferior to masks when it comes to droplet transmission
Speaker 1: and prevention. And now for today's main story, Tackling the
Speaker 1: surging Corona virus outbreak in the US is priority number
Speaker 1: one for President elect Joe Biden and Vice President elect
Speaker 1: Kamala Harris. Last month, by named a thirteen member team
Speaker 1: of doctors and scientists who will advise the new administration
Speaker 1: in responding to the pandemic. Dr Selene Gownder, an infectious
Speaker 1: disease physician and epidemialogist, is one of those doctors. Jordan
Speaker 1: Gospore spoke with Dr Gownder about the makeup of this
Speaker 1: COVID nineteen Advisory Board and how a Biden White House
Speaker 1: will approach the pandemic very differently from the Trump administration.
Speaker 1: What is the difference between the advisory board that you
Speaker 1: sit on and the Coronavirus Task Force team? Is there
Speaker 1: a difference between those two designations. Yeah, So it's really
Speaker 1: interesting you ask that, because I actually had to ask
Speaker 1: for some clarification around some of this language myself. So
Speaker 1: you have the current White House Coronavirus Task Force, which
Speaker 1: has led by Vice President Mike Pence. We're all familiar
Speaker 1: with many of the members, which include Dr Deborah Brooks,
Speaker 1: Dr Tony Faucci, Dr Robert Redfield, Dr Jerome Adams, and others.
Speaker 1: So that is the current administration task force. Then you
Speaker 1: have the Biden Harris Transition Team, which has actually been
Speaker 1: working on these issues for months now, even before the election.
Speaker 1: I mean, you have to really develop your policy and
Speaker 1: plans well in advance so that you are ready if
Speaker 1: you are elected. And so there's a very deep bench
Speaker 1: of scientists and doctors and public health and policy experts
Speaker 1: who have been working on these issues for months, and
Speaker 1: that's the transition team. Then you have the Advisory Board,
Speaker 1: which was recently named, which I suppose you could say
Speaker 1: sort of the counterpart to the task force. But I
Speaker 1: think part of the reason for calling it the Advisory
Speaker 1: Board is that our job really is to provide advice
Speaker 1: to the Biden Harrassed transition team and to the President
Speaker 1: elect and vice president elect, and to function as sort
Speaker 1: of a second set of eyes on the plans that
Speaker 1: the transition team has been developing, to be thinking creatively,
Speaker 1: to be thinking big and providing our feedback, and then
Speaker 1: also to function as something of a liaison between the
Speaker 1: transition team and the public that could be in the
Speaker 1: form of interviews like this, and then also to help
Speaker 1: liaise if we're asked. And then there's a need to
Speaker 1: liaise with state and local officials, including governors and public
Speaker 1: health officials, as well as with the private sector. So
Speaker 1: that could be with the vaccine companies or with the
Speaker 1: retail pharmacy chains who are going to be really important
Speaker 1: with distribution of vaccines. So we function as sort of
Speaker 1: a layer on top of the transition team. You could say,
Speaker 1: what role will the CDC and the World Health Organization
Speaker 1: play in this task force? You're going to see the
Speaker 1: establishment of a new task force under the new administration,
Speaker 1: and there will no doubt be representation from the CDC,
Speaker 1: including whoever is the the director of the CDC at
Speaker 1: that time. We are planning to re establish normal relations
Speaker 1: with the World Health Organization. That's you know, really a
Speaker 1: return to normalcy. They will not be on the task
Speaker 1: force per se. They are not now, but you will
Speaker 1: see a normalization of relationship with the World Health Organization
Speaker 1: moving forward. What will be considered an essential service once
Speaker 1: Biden is in office in January. I think the way
Speaker 1: to think about what is a frontline or essential worker is,
Speaker 1: first of all, what are jobs that can only be
Speaker 1: done in person? And what are services we really cannot
Speaker 1: live without? So we can't live without food, we can't
Speaker 1: live with our prescription medicines, and you know, some basic
Speaker 1: hygienic supplies and schools really are important, not just for
Speaker 1: the education in an academic way, but also for the
Speaker 1: social and emotional supports that they provide, the social work
Speaker 1: supports that they provide, and schools are also a really
Speaker 1: important provider of food to kids. Unfortunately, many children in
Speaker 1: this country live in poverty, and so that is an
Speaker 1: essential service that schools are also providing. I found a
Speaker 1: lot of of the interviews that you've done, um, the
Speaker 1: things that you've said around how the task Force is
Speaker 1: going to help communities that are unequipped to deal with
Speaker 1: outbreaks very fascinating, specifically with Indigenous populations and Rule populations,
Speaker 1: and so wanting to to pick your brain a little
Speaker 1: bit here about how the task Force is planning to
Speaker 1: help those communities, in particular Rule and Indigenous populations. Well,
Speaker 1: I think that has to start with how you collect
Speaker 1: your data, because you can't address disparity without knowing that
Speaker 1: there is a disparity, the nature of the disparity, you know.
Speaker 1: One common problem with indigenous populations is that they're often
Speaker 1: misclassified in terms of their race and ethnicity. This is
Speaker 1: something as somebody who's a brown person I have experienced myself.
Speaker 1: I'm not indigenous, but I am a I guess you
Speaker 1: could say, non specific looking brown person, and in this country,
Speaker 1: that means you generally get classified as Hispanic. My dermatologist
Speaker 1: here in New York City classified me as Hispanic, and
Speaker 1: I am not Hispanic in the medical record. And so
Speaker 1: the problem with that is if an indigenous person gets misclassified,
Speaker 1: you're not actually able to properly assess and study what
Speaker 1: the risks and outcomes and so on are in that population.
Speaker 1: So that's a really important starting point, is just getting
Speaker 1: the data right. You know, another issue that we've seen
Speaker 1: with communities of color, and this is really throughout the country,
Speaker 1: including in urban areas as well. We've seen fewer number
Speaker 1: of coronavirus testing sites in poorer communities of color than
Speaker 1: in wider, wealthier communities, which means that it's a lot
Speaker 1: easier to get tested if you live in a white,
Speaker 1: wealthy community then in a community of color. The lines
Speaker 1: have been longer at testing facilities and communities of color.
Speaker 1: And if you're being paid by the hour on your
Speaker 1: your job, if you're a wage worker, that means every minute,
Speaker 1: every hour that you're standing in line is also income lost.
Speaker 1: So you know, this is something that really does need
Speaker 1: to be addressed. We need to be decentralizing as much
Speaker 1: as possible some of these services, especially to communities that
Speaker 1: are underserved, whether that's a community of color in urban
Speaker 1: areas or out to rural areas. Will there be an
Speaker 1: opportunity for free testing once Biden gets into office. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I think free testing free vaccination are both very high priorities.
Speaker 1: The current administration had promised free testing and access to
Speaker 1: testing to every American who wanted testing, and that simply
Speaker 1: has not been the case because it's not just the
Speaker 1: cost of the test, it's also the cost of everything
Speaker 1: that goes into providing somebody with a test. So that's
Speaker 1: the collection of the specimen, the swabs, the nurse time,
Speaker 1: the doctor's office visit, or hospital visit, and so a
Speaker 1: lot of people got surprise bills for their coronavirus tests
Speaker 1: as a result of that, and that is something we
Speaker 1: really want to make sure does not happen. That all
Speaker 1: of those costs are covered, whether that's for a test
Speaker 1: or for a vaccination. And so my final question is
Speaker 1: around mandatory mask squaring. How will the Task Force implement
Speaker 1: mandatory mask wearing? It is this is something that's still
Speaker 1: being discussed. Yeah, I think there is going to be
Speaker 1: conversation with the states, with the governors around MASK mandates
Speaker 1: at the state level. But I think big picture, the
Speaker 1: most important thing is to try to get people to
Speaker 1: do the right thing on their own. I think people,
Speaker 1: especially in the United States, really don't like to be
Speaker 1: told what to do, and that's the honest Enforcement of
Speaker 1: a mandate is going to be a challenge, and so
Speaker 1: to really have people understand, look, mass or effective, they're cheap,
Speaker 1: they don't shut down the economy. If what you care
Speaker 1: about is keeping the economy open, this is one of
Speaker 1: the most important things you can do right now. Not
Speaker 1: to mention that it will save many lives. This is
Speaker 1: you know, the politicization of mass is like politicizing toilet paper.
Speaker 1: You know this idea that based on your political party,
Speaker 1: you would or would not use toilet paper. I mean,
Speaker 1: this is a basic hygienic measure. And so we just
Speaker 1: need to to reframe our thinking about it and understand that,
Speaker 1: you know, big picture, this is not a hugely burdensome
Speaker 1: thing that can have tremendous impact. How would you get
Speaker 1: someone in these these communities too that are refusing to
Speaker 1: wear masks? I mean, would you need to implement a
Speaker 1: fine or some sort of punishment. I mean the the
Speaker 1: challenges of course enforcement again, and that you're going to
Speaker 1: have to have local law enforcement agreeing to work with
Speaker 1: you on that. I'm not sure that local law enforcement
Speaker 1: would work with you on that. So in general, I
Speaker 1: prefer the carrot versus the stick approach. I think it
Speaker 1: makes behaviors stickier and more acceptable. And I think the
Speaker 1: couple of things I would suggest in terms of how
Speaker 1: to achieve behavior change, The fact is, if you look
Speaker 1: at the most recent surveys, over nine of Americans are
Speaker 1: now wearing masks. They may not be doing it perfectly,
Speaker 1: they may not be doing it all the time, but
Speaker 1: the vast majority of Americans are doing this, and it's
Speaker 1: really small pockets a very strong resistance to this where
Speaker 1: you're not seeing that. And so I think one to
Speaker 1: say this is becoming a social norm. I think it's
Speaker 1: helpful people tend to behave based on what is the
Speaker 1: behavior around them. I think another thing you can do
Speaker 1: is in a more personal situation, like say you're in
Speaker 1: line at the grocery checkout and somebody is not wearing
Speaker 1: a mask. I think it would be helpful for all
Speaker 1: of us to have mass on us extra ones, and
Speaker 1: you know, maybe you reach out to them and you say, hey,
Speaker 1: here's the here's you know, you seem like a carrying
Speaker 1: kind in person. Would you be willing to wear this
Speaker 1: mask to protect me? Because what you're doing there is
Speaker 1: you're framing, you're labeling them as a something positive, and
Speaker 1: then you're giving them the opportunity to live up to
Speaker 1: that and reinforce that positive label. So I think that's also,
Speaker 1: you know, depending on the situation, something else you can try.
Speaker 1: And then finally, I think we need to be reaching
Speaker 1: out to local leaders, community leaders in these pockets of resistance,
Speaker 1: and they should really be the ones leading the charge
Speaker 1: on this. And so you really need to be working
Speaker 1: in collaboration with people from the community, identifying those who
Speaker 1: might be at least somewhat sympathetic, educating them, providing them
Speaker 1: with the science, empowering them to be the leader on
Speaker 1: this issue in their community, and then let them really
Speaker 1: run with it because they're the ones that are more
Speaker 1: likely to be trusted on this. That was Jordan Gaspoure
Speaker 1: in conversation with Dr Selene Gownder, and that's it for
Speaker 1: our show today. For coverage of the outbreak from one
Speaker 1: and twenty bureaus around the world. Visit Bloomberg dot com,
Speaker 1: slash Coronavirus, and if you like the show, please leave
Speaker 1: us a review and a rating on Apple Podcasts or Spotify.
Speaker 1: It's the best way to help more listeners find our
Speaker 1: global reporting. The Prognosis Daily edition is produced by Topha
Speaker 1: foreheads Jordan Gaspoore, Magnus Henriksen, and me Laura Carlson. Today's
Speaker 1: main story was reported by Jordan Gaspore. Original music by
Speaker 1: Leo Sidran. Our editors are Rick Shine and Francesca Levi.
Speaker 1: Francesco Levi is Bloomberg's head of podcasts. Thanks for listening.
Speaker 1: Let