Speaker 1: Pushkin. Hi, I'm Phil Donahue and I'm Marlowe Thomas, and
Speaker 1: we're going on a series of double dates to find
Speaker 1: out what makes a marriage last. The great thing about
Speaker 1: being with John McEnroe and Patti smithe there's no warm
Speaker 1: up time needed. You're in the middle of a conversation
Speaker 1: in a minute you start. They're both champs. He's a
Speaker 1: tennis legend, she's a rock and roll check and their
Speaker 1: personalities are as big as their careers. We capped it
Speaker 1: across town to their big, family friendly apartment on the
Speaker 1: Upper West Side of Manhattan, and while we were setting
Speaker 1: up the mics, they were already going at it. Got
Speaker 1: to stop wiggling because it's driving me crazy. That sound
Speaker 1: you're making on the chair. He can't barely moving. Now
Speaker 1: that this is him barely moving. Yeah, this is exactly
Speaker 1: I'm used to standing up and running. It was fun
Speaker 1: to see them banter and Patty sure is a match
Speaker 1: for him, And that was on the fall shelf did ask,
Speaker 1: but he was a little cocky back in the day,
Speaker 1: because is it possible, might have said no, that would
Speaker 1: say no to fall get at it. Lucky for us
Speaker 1: this time they said yes, So we settled into their
Speaker 1: comfy living room, just the four of us and their
Speaker 1: mischievous cat, Bobby. I kicked off our conversation by asking
Speaker 1: them how they kept up such a busy pace. I
Speaker 1: would say it was true for John, he likes to
Speaker 1: stay busy. But for good fifteen to twenty years, I
Speaker 1: was working, you know, taking care of our six kids.
Speaker 1: That was my main job, and John taking care of
Speaker 1: John too because I traveled with him, because he didn't
Speaker 1: like to be alone for long stretches of time. So
Speaker 1: sometimes I brought the sometimes I didn't, and I put
Speaker 1: out a Greatest Hits record. I wrote songs, I mean,
Speaker 1: I did some and then I actually, I guess for
Speaker 1: the last eight that's true. I guess for the eight
Speaker 1: or nine years, I've been touring more like in the summers.
Speaker 1: But I was mainly, you know, the stability at home
Speaker 1: for the kids. She was never with me during my
Speaker 1: main career. She's been with me after I stopped playing out.
Speaker 1: I would have had a heart attack. There's a transitional
Speaker 1: period where you're sort of not sure about what's going
Speaker 1: to happen and what you're going to do with the
Speaker 1: rest of your life, and so it was very fortunate
Speaker 1: that I was able to find Patty and she sort
Speaker 1: of let me do my thing in essence, which was basically,
Speaker 1: as it turned out, to sort of veer back towards tennis.
Speaker 1: You know, at first, I was having trouble coming to
Speaker 1: grips with what I was going to do in tennis,
Speaker 1: because at the end of your career, or at least me,
Speaker 1: I was certain, you don't want to have any part
Speaker 1: of it. And so he was like thirty five and
Speaker 1: I was thirty seven, and he was playing these you know,
Speaker 1: exhibitions and stuff. I'm getting a lot of money for them.
Speaker 1: But I wasn't really preparing that well for him, preparing
Speaker 1: at all. He wasn't taking it seriously. But I said
Speaker 1: to me, if you're going to play practice, and when
Speaker 1: he did that, he beat everybody After that, then he
Speaker 1: was number one on the seniors tours, taking it seriously,
Speaker 1: taking pride in what you're doing. You're going to do
Speaker 1: it at the top of Yeah. I mean, if he
Speaker 1: told me I'd be a commentator and I was going
Speaker 1: to play seniors tennis, that would be sort of like,
Speaker 1: shoot me now. But also you were kind of just
Speaker 1: had that attitude like he hated, the prayers he hated.
Speaker 1: I mean, it was all like the establishment, and that
Speaker 1: wasn't going to be him. I mean, that was part
Speaker 1: of your thing. But low and behold, he's like the
Speaker 1: greatest commentator that ever came down the pike, you know.
Speaker 1: And also right at the end of my career was
Speaker 1: the end of my first marriage, as it turned out,
Speaker 1: So that next year was all sort of trying to
Speaker 1: time figure out what the hell was going on and
Speaker 1: how this had happened, and that feeling of failure you
Speaker 1: have about a marriage and wanting the kids to be
Speaker 1: okay because they're very young when this happened. So then
Speaker 1: I mean you're taking it day by day at that stage.
Speaker 1: So I actually changed, well it's a lot of change.
Speaker 1: So that was exactly why the last thing that I
Speaker 1: wanted was to get remarried. You know, the toughest thing
Speaker 1: about marriage is getting the divorce is getting out of it.
Speaker 1: And it took me a couple of years and it's
Speaker 1: just sort of horrific in a way, and then it
Speaker 1: feels like, Okay, I just want to go out with
Speaker 1: young girls that don't want anything. Basically, Well that's what
Speaker 1: I thought. Did that for a couple of years. How
Speaker 1: did you meet? We met the first time at a
Speaker 1: friend's Christmas party on Christmas Day. It was a setup,
Speaker 1: but they were smart enough not to tell me about
Speaker 1: the setup, or I wouldn't have come right because I
Speaker 1: really wasn't ready to be too embarrassed and it would
Speaker 1: be embarrassing. But he walked in. I always like to
Speaker 1: tell us where He walked in with like a kid
Speaker 1: in each arm and one wrapped around his leg. So
Speaker 1: it was pretty funny. I mean, you could barely walk
Speaker 1: for the weight of your kids, six to five and two?
Speaker 1: Come on, how are you? How can you resist that? So?
Speaker 1: Really was that your moom? You like to have babies
Speaker 1: in your arms? Whenever we walked into a room, he'd say,
Speaker 1: give me her and he'd want to. I mean, it
Speaker 1: was John's a little bit shy, So I think having
Speaker 1: a baby made you feel like it's a wonderful thing
Speaker 1: to have little kids in your arms. I mean, there's
Speaker 1: probably not It's almost nothing they can top that feeling.
Speaker 1: So I'm not going to say that it was was
Speaker 1: not my move or it was my I mean, it
Speaker 1: just seemed like they were probably all nervous. You and
Speaker 1: the three kids. It seems like a natural thing to do, hopefully.
Speaker 1: I mean when you're just there and you're not I
Speaker 1: mean you're by just with them, right, Yeah, you're with
Speaker 1: a maybe a fair amount of people you may not know,
Speaker 1: including the person who I was sort of am my,
Speaker 1: I guess set up to me, and she sort of
Speaker 1: was avoiding me. Well. No, I sat and talked to
Speaker 1: him for a while, and then I liked him, and
Speaker 1: then I got nervous, and then I avoided him, and
Speaker 1: did you like her right away too? I thought that
Speaker 1: we should, you know, think seriously about going out, which
Speaker 1: which is why I said, Hey, I'm going to be
Speaker 1: here for the week. We should get together. I'm we'll
Speaker 1: fight about this. Don't even let us. Don't make us
Speaker 1: tell the story. Do not make us out because he's
Speaker 1: rewritten it's and it's all wrong. Maybe I don't remember it. Okay,
Speaker 1: I'm not doing anything for New Year's Eve. I'm not
Speaker 1: doing anything for New Year's Eve. I'm saying, hey, between
Speaker 1: the lars, you know, we both grew up thirteen fifteen
Speaker 1: minutes away from each other and Queens. Yeah, you go
Speaker 1: around the world and you wind up with a guy
Speaker 1: from Queens, which is what I think is you know, awesome.
Speaker 1: But I think the thing that happened for us, I
Speaker 1: mean I would speak for John. Somehow he saw something
Speaker 1: about us together and I felt very safe and really really,
Speaker 1: like I said, this weird familiar thing. I was in
Speaker 1: La where it's like I always said, like La is
Speaker 1: like the Vietcong. You know, you never know, you couldn't
Speaker 1: identify the enemy. I liked you. Who doesn't like you?
Speaker 1: You know, like because everybody's full of shit and flirting.
Speaker 1: And then when I met John, that was someone I knew.
Speaker 1: He was a guy from New York. I knew him.
Speaker 1: He was very forthbright. All he talked about was his
Speaker 1: divorce and how crushed he was by it, and so
Speaker 1: that was all really endearing and great. And then when
Speaker 1: we went on that on that one date, and then
Speaker 1: he came over the second night and we were together
Speaker 1: from from then on after that second night on our
Speaker 1: second date, and I just was sort of still didn't
Speaker 1: believe in love, in monogamy, in marriage, but I had
Speaker 1: some kind of faith in him, and so I thought, well,
Speaker 1: I'm going to go along with him. And I'm like,
Speaker 1: I call it stepping into the river of John. I
Speaker 1: stepped into the river and I let him sweep me
Speaker 1: along with him until I caught up. I realized this
Speaker 1: opportunity to get this second chance that I wasn't sure
Speaker 1: I was going to be able to get, so I was.
Speaker 1: I'm proud of myself that I was able to make
Speaker 1: that choice, because at that time, when you're still just
Speaker 1: sort of just out of a divorce, it doesn't seem
Speaker 1: like the sensible thing to do necessarily to get back
Speaker 1: into a very serious relationship. But I didn't want to
Speaker 1: do it either. But then there was John saying, you know,
Speaker 1: like trying to get me to move back to New
Speaker 1: York right away, and he just knew to me. I
Speaker 1: was like, I got a brilliant idea. We gotta have
Speaker 1: a kid so that the other kids realize how committed
Speaker 1: we are and how much we love. Choice had that
Speaker 1: brilliant idea. It was always like, you know, that was
Speaker 1: his cure for everything. Have a kid right now, if
Speaker 1: I knock you up, you'll get healthier, get happier or whatever.
Speaker 1: That was your go to move. I think when you
Speaker 1: loved somebody or like them, you wanted them to have
Speaker 1: your baby, well that would almost seems bigger than getting married. No,
Speaker 1: it's true. So he was like, I want to have
Speaker 1: a kid, but I don't want to get married. So
Speaker 1: I was like, I didn't really want to get married.
Speaker 1: I was thirty seven. I didn't think I was going
Speaker 1: to get pregnant right away, but I did. How long
Speaker 1: did it take you to come to New York? Well,
Speaker 1: we came, I went. We saw each other all the time,
Speaker 1: we came back and forth, and it was the next
Speaker 1: school year, nine months. Yeah, so I was already pregnant.
Speaker 1: But she moved in my place in Malibu. It was
Speaker 1: you know she I mean I was spending time with
Speaker 1: her in Tepega then maybe early on, and you were
Speaker 1: making me come to Malibu. So I was always leaving
Speaker 1: Ruby and so I was like, how about I moved
Speaker 1: down to the house in Malibu. But you know, he
Speaker 1: was like he's come a long way. He was like
Speaker 1: a little bit, you know, wanted it the way he
Speaker 1: wanted it. But I mean it's a pretty good It's
Speaker 1: not like the worst scenario. I'm you know, putting her
Speaker 1: into well down to Malibu could be worse, right, So, yeah,
Speaker 1: but I loved my house. I loved where I lived.
Speaker 1: I mean, it's not like I wanted to give all
Speaker 1: that up. I gave everything away. I mean it wasn't
Speaker 1: like no sacrifice for me. But it had a nice
Speaker 1: house in Malibu. Right, didn't say for my kid, But
Speaker 1: that was more trust Right. I just love talking to
Speaker 1: a couple. Yeah, I really did, really, just a little bit,
Speaker 1: because makes love my husband more, because I realized we're
Speaker 1: not as crazy as I exactly. John is just as
Speaker 1: scrappy as he was on the tennis court. But Patty
Speaker 1: holds her own with him, she sure does. Plus she
Speaker 1: has a magic superpower. Music must be the fact that
Speaker 1: Patty is a musician a singer, so but must have
Speaker 1: been part of the attraction. I mean, it's a great combination.
Speaker 1: A beautiful woman and a great singer. Then I didn't
Speaker 1: play any music or singing. She wasn't. I remember we
Speaker 1: early on. I was playing some music with my friends.
Speaker 1: I mean, admittedly compared to what she's used to badly,
Speaker 1: but I thought like, hey, come on up in jail,
Speaker 1: and she goes, I don't jam, And I'm like, you're saying,
Speaker 1: you know, why don't you jam? And it seemed like,
Speaker 1: at least in my mind, it seemed like she had
Speaker 1: lost a love of you know, what she was doing
Speaker 1: for a variety of reasons. This is a tough business.
Speaker 1: And Grenge came in and there was just you know whatever,
Speaker 1: you know the way that's illustrated and in music and etc.
Speaker 1: And so it seemed like she needed a little bit of,
Speaker 1: you know, someone like myself who has a lot of
Speaker 1: energy that could get her back to maybe loving what
Speaker 1: she was doing more. And yeah, I needed somebody like you,
Speaker 1: I'm saying, to impregnate me and just keep me home
Speaker 1: taking care of the kids, because that's what you know.
Speaker 1: There was no like, you know, pushing me towards music.
Speaker 1: You were touring. I suggested that we we because I
Speaker 1: was actually playing more than she was. And that's which
Speaker 1: was when I was like getting pissed. And then I'm like,
Speaker 1: you know what, you need to come come home, like
Speaker 1: you can't like play a tennis tournament and then do
Speaker 1: a gig, like do your gigs around here. So she said,
Speaker 1: if anyone is going to play music, it's me. But
Speaker 1: I wouldn't it be amazing if we were, you know,
Speaker 1: I was in her band basically. So Patty said, yeah,
Speaker 1: we should play mixed doubles at Wimbledon. So I go,
Speaker 1: you don't play tennis, and she goes exactly, So that
Speaker 1: shut that down. We'll have more after a quick break.
Speaker 1: We're back to our conversation with John McEnroe and Patty
Speaker 1: Smythe and one thing we hadn't quite touched on yet
Speaker 1: was John's famous temper. It probably took me a minute
Speaker 1: to really hold my own. I probably let him push
Speaker 1: me around a little bit. Did you say, when you're made,
Speaker 1: don't even I'm not allowed to any where. Patty won't
Speaker 1: let me use a phrase. They don't give a damn
Speaker 1: about how I play now. They just want me to yell.
Speaker 1: You can't be serious. But there's a lot of owner thing,
Speaker 1: as you said, can't you just resort to? Very ironically
Speaker 1: the thing that I said once, my dad, God rest
Speaker 1: his soul, said, listen, you don't need to do this,
Speaker 1: you know, go off on the umpires. You know you're
Speaker 1: better than them. Just play. But he'd say it like,
Speaker 1: you don't need to do this, you're better than them.
Speaker 1: But then he go, but if you do do it,
Speaker 1: because he's he was a lawyer and he was my
Speaker 1: manager at the time, he goes, don't curse, And who
Speaker 1: else said that? To you me like Patty would say
Speaker 1: it later because I I lost control. It's like being
Speaker 1: a say what you want, but don't drop. So that
Speaker 1: was me not cursing and said I'm going fuck you,
Speaker 1: you stupid, you know, which is what I wanted to say.
Speaker 1: I grew up in a loud, loud dinner table. Let's
Speaker 1: just say that my parents were together for three years,
Speaker 1: two younger brothers. It was living in Queen's living in
Speaker 1: New York. I just seemed like everywhere you turned it
Speaker 1: was very loud. So loud seemed normal. You know. When
Speaker 1: I went to London the first time in nineteen seventy seven,
Speaker 1: which is when I made the semis of Wimbledon, I
Speaker 1: was shocked at how polite they were and how quiet
Speaker 1: everything was, and you have to act as I'm like,
Speaker 1: what is with these people? I thought they were weird.
Speaker 1: I've always had this theory about you because I'm married
Speaker 1: to a man who seems to have the same trait.
Speaker 1: Phil does not take criticism well ever since we were married.
Speaker 1: No matter what I would say to him, he would
Speaker 1: say he's had a criticism. That really just drove me mad.
Speaker 1: He had a very critical mother. She didn't bother me
Speaker 1: that much. But it did bother me that she criticized
Speaker 1: him so much. The first time she walked into our house,
Speaker 1: either beautiful ornate mirror that had all these animal faces
Speaker 1: on it, she walked in and she said, oh, so
Speaker 1: Halloween house. You know. She just couldn't help Irish Catholic, Yeah, Irish,
Speaker 1: he's Irish. I'd say, I'm tired. She said, we're all tired,
Speaker 1: you know. Yeah. Yeah. Well, I was wondering would you
Speaker 1: have a critical mother or father? I would say that
Speaker 1: my parents were expected big things. I mean they expected
Speaker 1: me to be very good at school. I guess they
Speaker 1: said that I was a perfectionist without them having to
Speaker 1: push him to be one. I do remember being very
Speaker 1: competitive and anxious, kind of driven to remember that, driven
Speaker 1: and pushed, you know, not nearly as bad as other
Speaker 1: tennis parents, but I was definitely pushed. It seemed like
Speaker 1: in retrospect they were a perfectionist. Though his parents they
Speaker 1: weren't critical because his father worked all day, went to
Speaker 1: law school at night, and came home. Was he second
Speaker 1: or third in his class? He was second? Why my
Speaker 1: mom would say, why wouldn't you first? I mean that
Speaker 1: makes you a perfectionist. Yeah, a lot of this stuff
Speaker 1: makes you who you are, so that when you become
Speaker 1: a husband and become a partner to somebody, I mean
Speaker 1: they bickered all the time, they were like, but they
Speaker 1: loved each other, right, I mean, obviously the key to
Speaker 1: success in any marriage is you have to compromise and
Speaker 1: you have to trust each other and also hopefully have
Speaker 1: a lot of sex. Is it that would be the thrick? Yeah,
Speaker 1: that's it. When did you first get that smart? Probably
Speaker 1: not early enough in the first marriage, let's put it
Speaker 1: that way. Um, they should have anything to do with
Speaker 1: the person and the person obviously. I mean it's just
Speaker 1: your three your formula, and no matter who it was,
Speaker 1: it's like, my god, that's not what I said. But
Speaker 1: that's okay. But you know, I sort of if you
Speaker 1: have to ask so then so, so, how do you fight?
Speaker 1: That's screaming and yelling sometimes? How I you know, as
Speaker 1: I look at you too, I see you guys has
Speaker 1: been raising your voice. But somehow none of your loud
Speaker 1: arguments are lethal. I don't think you take any crap
Speaker 1: I'm talking about. I found it somewhat amusing to me
Speaker 1: that I'd be the one overall, which we said earlier
Speaker 1: that I would be more like Jesus calmed down. Yeah,
Speaker 1: but we're not lethal to each other. I think there's
Speaker 1: a line. I do believe there are things you can't say,
Speaker 1: Like there have been sometimes maybe where we've said things,
Speaker 1: you know, where we didn't mean it, and maybe we
Speaker 1: crossed a line. Well, then go ahead and you know,
Speaker 1: get a group or whatever you know, or like you know,
Speaker 1: you said that, Yeah, I probably said that to him. Yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: that's sort of the wibblton of all that's I mean,
Speaker 1: we'll know. There's way worse than that. I mean, I
Speaker 1: think have you over said the D word divorce? I
Speaker 1: don't under said that word. I mean there's been times
Speaker 1: where no, we haven't said that. The thing that he
Speaker 1: has said to me our whole life together is don't
Speaker 1: give up on me. I'm a work in progress. Don't
Speaker 1: give up on me. And then I started saying to him,
Speaker 1: don't give up on me. You know, I'm a work
Speaker 1: in progress too, because you know, I grew up with
Speaker 1: only women. I never thought I would be married. I
Speaker 1: had no idea how to be a couple, and it's
Speaker 1: been a learning curve for me. I was so independent,
Speaker 1: and he was, you know, wanted us to be like this,
Speaker 1: and I was like, you know, it took me a
Speaker 1: long time to do that. Someone said a second marriage
Speaker 1: is a triumph of hope over experience. And the biggest
Speaker 1: thing that Patty did for me basically was allowed me
Speaker 1: to be me. He needs a best friend and a
Speaker 1: consigliari and a wife and a lover and all those things.
Speaker 1: That's what makes him thrive and be a better person.
Speaker 1: John has the best moral compass. And what's great about
Speaker 1: people assuming that he's this like hothead is that they
Speaker 1: continually underestimate how smart he is. Oh, what a nice
Speaker 1: thing to say. Yeah, is there anything about yourself, either
Speaker 1: one of you that you consciously changed to accommodate the
Speaker 1: other one. For years, it was like the idea of
Speaker 1: me taking a girl's trip or traveling or going away
Speaker 1: on my own was like out of the question. I mean,
Speaker 1: John just could. He didn't want me to do it.
Speaker 1: He would get really angry at me if I did it,
Speaker 1: because he traveled and he thought I should be with
Speaker 1: him and I should go away when he went away,
Speaker 1: But then my kids would be alone. And so finally,
Speaker 1: over the years now it's dawned on him that my happiness,
Speaker 1: you know, these things are end of my happiness. Yeah,
Speaker 1: it does matter. It's not like like, you know, he
Speaker 1: really did think that I should just be happy with him.
Speaker 1: All my happiness should be with him, And a lot
Speaker 1: of my happiness is with him, but I get happiness
Speaker 1: from other things like my girlfriends and going on traveling
Speaker 1: to places that he wouldn't want to go to, and
Speaker 1: also music. What did you change your accommodate John virtually
Speaker 1: giving up her career, that's what she accommodated. I mean,
Speaker 1: that's the biggest thing by far. Now she was the
Speaker 1: bit disillusion but I don't think she envisioned that it
Speaker 1: would lead to twenty years, you know, twenty years later
Speaker 1: where you're still like, Okay, I've gone through batches of
Speaker 1: song did this? To get over that hump requires an
Speaker 1: incredible commitment that you know, because you have to not
Speaker 1: only do the record, but you got to set up
Speaker 1: how it's going to be. I mean, there's so many
Speaker 1: things to lose your place in line. You lose your
Speaker 1: place in line, well, that's in essence what you are,
Speaker 1: and then it's you. It becomes more and more of
Speaker 1: an uphill battle. And the weird thing is is being
Speaker 1: a woman and being married to John. People assume that
Speaker 1: I don't want to work. They would never say that
Speaker 1: to a guy. No, never, no, say I was like
Speaker 1: some heiress. They would never ever say why are you
Speaker 1: still playing tennis? Or why are you a commentator? I
Speaker 1: know you have to go want to ask one did
Speaker 1: we clear up? Like when you have a fight, who
Speaker 1: makes it okay? Do you both do that? Well, we
Speaker 1: both do that, but you're better at it. I think
Speaker 1: I'm a little better at sort of trying to diffuse
Speaker 1: it at this point. I think ultimately I've had to
Speaker 1: take the lead in that that's amazing. Well, some of
Speaker 1: it may be that. Yeah, so I guess that's a
Speaker 1: good quality change that I've made. Because I'm pretty stubborn
Speaker 1: and sort of get and me too, it's hard for
Speaker 1: me to say I'm sorry, so and believe that even
Speaker 1: you know that it doesn't matter if you're right. I
Speaker 1: think to myself, I'm eighty percent right. It's still like
Speaker 1: it so wide. I mean, ultimately, it's a hollow victory.
Speaker 1: So that part was took me a long time to feel.
Speaker 1: Like Jesus, if you look at it in what I
Speaker 1: did for a living, you always try to put yourself
Speaker 1: in a position to get the odds in your favor
Speaker 1: as much that's where you want to be. So it
Speaker 1: seemed like, you know, I'd sort of feel like I
Speaker 1: cornered into It's like, you know, there it is. I mean,
Speaker 1: you know, it's it's almost all your fault. But it
Speaker 1: didn't matter ultimately because it was still weird fighting and
Speaker 1: I felt bad and she felt bad. It was like
Speaker 1: so I think over time I was able to sort
Speaker 1: of put that aside a little bit and realize that's
Speaker 1: not the point. Maybe that is one of the most
Speaker 1: important ingredients in a good marriage is like do you
Speaker 1: want to be right or do you want to be happy?
Speaker 1: Like you can just be like okay, whatever, you know,
Speaker 1: like I'm wrong And even if you feel like you're right,
Speaker 1: because a lot of times you feel like you're right
Speaker 1: but you're not. Is there something you'd like to pass
Speaker 1: on that you've learned. Don't try to change someone, I mean,
Speaker 1: that would be the thing. I mean, you gotta do.
Speaker 1: Marry potential, like marry the person, like not who he's
Speaker 1: going to be. Women are like notorious for that, Like,
Speaker 1: oh you know he's got the potential, but like potential
Speaker 1: is not good enough. But you can soften some of you, can't.
Speaker 1: I mean, I think you so my soft edges and
Speaker 1: vice versa. Yeah, soften is one thing, changes another. I'm
Speaker 1: pretty sure that neither John McEnroe or Patty Smite needs
Speaker 1: any serious changes at this point. Since we talked with him,
Speaker 1: Patty released her latest album. It's called It's About Time.
Speaker 1: It's about their marriage, and just like the two of them,
Speaker 1: it's in perfect rhythm until next time. I'm Marlo Thomas
Speaker 1: and I'm Phil Donahue. I think you can change them
Speaker 1: to the type of person the day he or she
Speaker 1: needs to. You know, you think that they double day.
Speaker 1: There's a production of Pushkin Industries. The show was created
Speaker 1: by US and produced by Sarah Lily. Michael Bahari is
Speaker 1: a ship producer musical adaptations of It Had to Be
Speaker 1: You by Selwagon, Symfinette, Marlo and I are executive producers,
Speaker 1: along with Mia Lobell and Letal Molad from Pushkin. Special
Speaker 1: thanks to Jacob Weisberg, Malcolm Gladwell, Heather Faine, John Snars,
Speaker 1: Carly Migliori, Eric Sandler, Emily Rostek, Jason Gambrel, Paul Williams,
Speaker 1: and Bruce Kluger. If you like our show, please remember
Speaker 1: to share, rate, and review. Thanks for listening.