Speaker 1: It's me daughter. It's still giving Mario. That's because Mario
Speaker 1: always says, let's go. Oh that sounds a much bita
Speaker 1: what kind of name is amer? Oh? My god, the
Speaker 1: ice pack resting on my neck right now is dripping
Speaker 1: into my cleavance. I can see that we are coming
Speaker 1: to you the night after having seen Doctor Strange in
Speaker 1: the Multiverse of Madness, and it was so good that
Speaker 1: Fran twisted her neck reacting to it in the theater. No,
Speaker 1: that's not what it's not. I love when you just
Speaker 1: say lies for the sake of it. Well, I love
Speaker 1: you love to lie. You'm an antihero, much like Luna Maxima,
Speaker 1: and yet you insist on everyone believing women. What kind
Speaker 1: of a liar would I be if I didn't want
Speaker 1: people to believe the lies? I wasn't convincing anyway, just
Speaker 1: like Wanda in the beginning of the movie when she
Speaker 1: was giving folklore and then all of a sudden she
Speaker 1: was giving evermore. And we're going to talk about it
Speaker 1: today because this is like a virgin the show where
Speaker 1: we give yesterday's pop culture, literally yesterday, because that's when
Speaker 1: we saw the movie. Today's takes I'm rose, Damn you
Speaker 1: and I'm Fran Toronto one Division One Want Division, Do
Speaker 1: Do Do Do Do, once again, the song stress of
Speaker 1: this podcast. I honestly wish that my voice had the
Speaker 1: power of the guy with the tuning for us, so
Speaker 1: that every time I sang you exploded died heroes, how
Speaker 1: are you? Oh God, I'm so sick of being asked
Speaker 1: that question, how dare you know? The vibes are, the
Speaker 1: vibes are not quite vibing, the vibes are, vibes are significant,
Speaker 1: the vibes are significantly off. But you know what, I'm
Speaker 1: really looking forward to, um being in New York this weekend.
Speaker 1: By the time this episode comes out, I will be
Speaker 1: uh in transit to New York City. UM, because I'm
Speaker 1: finally going to be taking advantage of my Christmas gift
Speaker 1: from Mixed Frien Toronto got me tickets to see Into
Speaker 1: the Woods at New York City Center, which I'm very
Speaker 1: excited about. I've been hearing such good things about the production,
Speaker 1: starring A One Sarah morellus Bearing starring Sarah Borellis, Neil
Speaker 1: Patrick Harris, Heather Headley as the Witch. My God Sarah Barrellis.
Speaker 1: When she wrote love Song, she came on this bitch
Speaker 1: Matt as hell like she really did you know tweet
Speaker 1: again recently because you it's definitely become part of your
Speaker 1: um lexicon more as of late. I honestly I don't
Speaker 1: know why. I mean, I think it's one of the
Speaker 1: funniest tweets in instance, it's it's a Christina. If you
Speaker 1: haven't just google, you know Christina bit Matt. Actually think
Speaker 1: people don't know what we're talking about. I don't want
Speaker 1: them listening to this podcast if you don't know. If
Speaker 1: you don't know, you're excommunicated. UM. But yeah, no, I've
Speaker 1: been thinking about it that a lot. And I mean
Speaker 1: Sarah Brillas. Do you know why she wrote that song? Yeah,
Speaker 1: because she was in love. No, it was because her
Speaker 1: label at the time, I really wanted she was like
Speaker 1: writing about a lot of things that weren't love, and
Speaker 1: her label was like, well, no one's going to really
Speaker 1: care about her music until you write about love if
Speaker 1: you write a love song. So she wrote she wrote
Speaker 1: a song that I'm not going to write you ask
Speaker 1: for it, which is her mind. And it is a
Speaker 1: very iconic song and it's also very it's very Joni
Speaker 1: Mitchell too because Joanie wrote music that was critically acclaimed
Speaker 1: but not commercially viable, and her the people in her
Speaker 1: camp really wanted her to succeed more commercially and they
Speaker 1: were like, you need a song for the radio, Joni,
Speaker 1: you need a song for the radio, the radio, the radio.
Speaker 1: If it's not in the radio, you don't matter. And
Speaker 1: so she wrote you turned me on I'm a Radio
Speaker 1: because of that and to basically making fun of capitalism
Speaker 1: and like and the radio. We love art that was
Speaker 1: created through trolling. UM. So yeah, very excited for Into
Speaker 1: the Woods. UM. I was actually gonna tell you if
Speaker 1: you want to see a Strange Loop on Broadway, they've
Speaker 1: reached out to us. UM recently. Zach Stafford, who produces
Speaker 1: that show, said they would love to have us so
Speaker 1: I would go see that Friday night. So if y'all
Speaker 1: have not heard a Strange Loop, is this amazing, amazing,
Speaker 1: very black, very queer show that just raked in the
Speaker 1: most Tony's this year as of today of this recording,
Speaker 1: UM eleven nominations. As is the case with every Tony season,
Speaker 1: there's always like one play that just kind of sweeps
Speaker 1: because you know, Broadway is dead. UM, not to of
Speaker 1: course devalue the wind in any way. But the Tony's
Speaker 1: made history though to nominate the first trans person to
Speaker 1: get nominated for an acting nom uh l Morgan. I think,
Speaker 1: what's her name? Let me yeah? What else am I
Speaker 1: going to do in New York? Well? I have an
Speaker 1: Airbnb and bed sty, so hopefully I will turn it
Speaker 1: into a sex dungeon um within hours of arriving. Um,
Speaker 1: I will be eating a lot of pizza um and
Speaker 1: bagels so lots of bread. Generally I'm gonna be there.
Speaker 1: Saturday is Charlene's birthday. Charlene and Karnate, who has an
Speaker 1: iconic episode of this podcast about Jack a Little Pill.
Speaker 1: If you haven't listened to it, you definitely should. Um,
Speaker 1: it's Char's birthday, so I need to find out what
Speaker 1: she's doing. Um. Hopefully she has some kind of show.
Speaker 1: I would love it if she was doing her brunch
Speaker 1: with Tyler Ashley baby Tea. Which is if you live
Speaker 1: in New York City or ever traveling there, if you
Speaker 1: are looking for a daytime drag show where it's literally
Speaker 1: like two queens giving shows NonStop for like three or
Speaker 1: four hours, broad daylight, daylight, like stomping on the tables
Speaker 1: like that is that is the drag show, and you
Speaker 1: everyone in the world needs to go at least once.
Speaker 1: And it has come a long way since it started
Speaker 1: at fucking Bizarre Bushwick. Do you remember Bizarre? Yeah? I do,
Speaker 1: I do. This was a mess. I hated it. I
Speaker 1: don't know that. I don't know what the venue is now,
Speaker 1: but yeah, Baby t is I think like legally one
Speaker 1: of the eighth Wonders of the worst. It's a um
Speaker 1: someplace in Dumbo. It's a restaurant that's owned by some
Speaker 1: very nice lesbians and it literally, like Charlene just kind
Speaker 1: of like jumps from table to table, you know, doing
Speaker 1: like Macavity from Cats. It should not be missed. And
Speaker 1: it's like always kind of announced like a little last minute.
Speaker 1: So definitely, you know, if you live in New York,
Speaker 1: don't miss Baby te Brunch if you have the chance
Speaker 1: to see it. And if that's not happening this weekend,
Speaker 1: which I think it probably would have already been announced,
Speaker 1: I will find some way to see the dolls in
Speaker 1: addition to seeing um. Sarah Brellis fran you sent me
Speaker 1: a very dangerous text today that I was really with
Speaker 1: you about, which is and then I went to check
Speaker 1: my email and saw that I had gotten the same
Speaker 1: message from you, which is that the Essence private sale
Speaker 1: is happening. And I screamed, cried, threw up, took a
Speaker 1: ship um, and then through my phone because I'm really
Speaker 1: trying to do a no by month. Um. Oh oh,
Speaker 1: good luck with that. I've been I've been somewhat successful
Speaker 1: so far. I'm just just in that in that single sentence,
Speaker 1: I know that you have not been. Um, you're right,
Speaker 1: but how much was that person you brought to the
Speaker 1: or this? I'm returning it so it doesn't matter. So
Speaker 1: are you returning? Returning literally packed in a box? The
Speaker 1: private SI looks so good though, like Heaven by Mark
Speaker 1: Jacobs is on sale, and like there's some Ghani stuff
Speaker 1: that's stop saying it. But I made the chatlow, which
Speaker 1: is never ever ever I made. I made. What I'm
Speaker 1: trying to do is I'm adding things to my wish list.
Speaker 1: I'm like being intentional about what I actually need versus
Speaker 1: what I just want. Because I did this the last
Speaker 1: time Essence had to sail, like two weeks ago, where
Speaker 1: I only wanted one thing, and then because the sale
Speaker 1: was happening, I bought a ton of other things and
Speaker 1: then ended up returning, not liking and returning everything except
Speaker 1: the original thing that I bought. They're going to come
Speaker 1: for us with the guillotine. No, but we're not rich,
Speaker 1: We're just stupid. Um that's so true. Yeah, like we're
Speaker 1: we're living outside our means the same way that everyone is. Um. So,
Speaker 1: I I'm asked for to do something for me somewhat recently,
Speaker 1: which was um, you know, Fran is kind of my
Speaker 1: go to person for if I'm like waffling about whether
Speaker 1: or not I want to buy something, I will send
Speaker 1: a link to them and ask their opinion. The problem
Speaker 1: is that I've started just not sending you things because
Speaker 1: I know you're going to say no, and I doesn't
Speaker 1: buy them anyway. Um. So to find a friend who
Speaker 1: can hold you accountable and actually make them hold you accountable.
Speaker 1: So I'm going to start doing that. Um I will.
Speaker 1: But I've been pretty good and then I have been
Speaker 1: not really buying things. I've been returning a lot. And
Speaker 1: I also I like made a rule for myself about
Speaker 1: getting take out and like eating out, and last week
Speaker 1: I cooked or made every meal at home Monday to Thursday.
Speaker 1: That's like my new rule. Oh that's joke. I love that.
Speaker 1: But I'm going to New York this weekend, so obviously
Speaker 1: a lot of this is going out the window. But
Speaker 1: it's travel. It's travel. It's vaka, it's gonna have so much.
Speaker 1: You're gonna have so much fun. And and really for me,
Speaker 1: it's more like the not spending is more about saving money.
Speaker 1: So as long as I'm like saving the amount that
Speaker 1: I want to save every paycheck or every month, like,
Speaker 1: then it's all good. And I'm just trying to curb
Speaker 1: the shopping impulses so that like I can save more
Speaker 1: on top of that. And you know, as long as
Speaker 1: you have a plan and a budget and it works
Speaker 1: for you, then you're good. You know, Queer people, we
Speaker 1: as a community have money trauma, and that money trauma
Speaker 1: manifests in an absolutely against all odds, like completely irrational
Speaker 1: inability to ever look at our bank accounts, not once.
Speaker 1: But you know that I cannot look at my bank
Speaker 1: account like to save my life. I look at it
Speaker 1: maybe like one s aquarter, and every time it's true.
Speaker 1: So I have I have a separate savings account. I
Speaker 1: use this app called um digit and what it does
Speaker 1: is it not sponsored? Um, but I would love for
Speaker 1: it to be. UM. It's an app that tracks your
Speaker 1: income and you're spending and automatically takes money out of
Speaker 1: your account to add to a separate savings account at
Speaker 1: like five days a week, which is great because it's
Speaker 1: just like savings that I don't have to think about,
Speaker 1: and like that's kind of like my like vacation slush
Speaker 1: fund and just like whatever. Like if I ever have
Speaker 1: like a like a big purchase that I need to
Speaker 1: pull money from something like that's where I'll take it from,
Speaker 1: UM and then everything else just get saved. UM. But
Speaker 1: every time I open it to like if I want
Speaker 1: to pull money out, like notice comes up where it
Speaker 1: has like all of the other times I've done that,
Speaker 1: and what my bank account balance is and what I
Speaker 1: do is I like when I pull it up on
Speaker 1: my phone, I like cover the top half of my
Speaker 1: phone that I am so I don't have to see
Speaker 1: it because like see no evil, speak no evil, and
Speaker 1: like honestly like back to the shopping thing, truly, when
Speaker 1: I'm trying to reconfigures that I shop when I'm bored.
Speaker 1: I don't shop because I need things. I shop when
Speaker 1: I'm like sitting on the couch and I'm like, what
Speaker 1: am I going to do? So I pull up the
Speaker 1: Essence app or like go on Nordstrom it and like,
Speaker 1: I end up not liking or caring about or actually
Speaker 1: using the things that I buy. So I'm just trying
Speaker 1: to like break those habits because truly the worst thing
Speaker 1: that ever happened to me was that I attained a
Speaker 1: level of economic stability where I had more disposable income,
Speaker 1: and instead of saving it, I started spending it. So
Speaker 1: now I'm trying to tip it in the other direction. Okay,
Speaker 1: I love that. I really wish I had had that
Speaker 1: app because I think if I had been maybe monitoring
Speaker 1: my bank a little more or been more mindful about it,
Speaker 1: I wouldn't have been in New York this weekend with
Speaker 1: a bouncing credit card. I I my credit card got
Speaker 1: declined multiple time and unfortunately, very humiliated. Unfortunate for me.
Speaker 1: I got an email from American Express this weekend telling
Speaker 1: me my credit limit had been increased. Oh no, but
Speaker 1: you know what that But you know what that just means?
Speaker 1: Like that is good for me. I'm building credit, um
Speaker 1: I now have. I'm not like putting anything else on
Speaker 1: my credit cards and now just like I have more, um,
Speaker 1: I have a lower usage now because of that higher limit.
Speaker 1: So I think, I like a lot of this is
Speaker 1: really ugly what we're talking about, all the shopping stuff.
Speaker 1: But I do think that a lot of people, I know, millennials,
Speaker 1: queer people, marginalized folks like we are not taught the
Speaker 1: realities of our finances, um in any meaningful way. Um.
Speaker 1: You don't learn this in school, you don't learn this
Speaker 1: in college. Were thrust out into the into a world
Speaker 1: usually with tons of debt um and and I've never
Speaker 1: taught how to manage it. So if we can kind
Speaker 1: of like like talk about this together and figure these
Speaker 1: things out for ourselves, then I think that's a good thing.
Speaker 1: And that's why we have That's why none of us
Speaker 1: have four O one case, none of us have you know,
Speaker 1: savings accounts, none of us have like credit, none of
Speaker 1: us pay our taxes like we were taught to do
Speaker 1: any of this ship um, and we are are the
Speaker 1: queer commune basements that we live in. Sure as hell
Speaker 1: aren't teaching us either, not that either of us live
Speaker 1: in a queer commune basement. But maybe we should start,
Speaker 1: but maybe we should start one if you would like
Speaker 1: to be part of the like a Virgin Queer commune basement, Um,
Speaker 1: slide into our d M s at like Virgin four.
Speaker 1: That's right. Yeah, Actually, while we're at it, can I
Speaker 1: just quickly say because we usually say this in the credits,
Speaker 1: but like Pride is coming up, which is a big,
Speaker 1: huge eye roll. However, Pride is a huge opportunity for
Speaker 1: this podcast, Like a Virgin and you, the virgins listening
Speaker 1: at home, are the number one asset to help us
Speaker 1: accomplish our dreams and aspirations. So please recommend this podcast
Speaker 1: your friends this Pride season. We would love that, and
Speaker 1: that is like the number one way to like know,
Speaker 1: get our show to pop off, or you can side
Speaker 1: into d MS, you can follow us whatever, And if
Speaker 1: you have a podcast and you want to have us
Speaker 1: on it, we would love to do that. Um, if
Speaker 1: you are writing a list of your favorite queer podcasts
Speaker 1: and you want to include us on it. But truly,
Speaker 1: just like keep listening, keep vibing, and we will have
Speaker 1: some surprises for y'all very series. No one would be
Speaker 1: talking about Doctor Strange two Rwanda because I didn't I
Speaker 1: never even saw Doctor Strange one, I was like, Oh,
Speaker 1: this is the this is one of the marvel things
Speaker 1: that I just have no interest in and we'll never see.
Speaker 1: And I only even watch Doctor Strange recently because I
Speaker 1: knew that this movie was coming out, and I can't
Speaker 1: remember how you felt about it, but I really liked it.
Speaker 1: I loved it. And I have to say now, in
Speaker 1: terms of like the m c U at large, like
Speaker 1: Doctor Strange is very high in the ranking of my
Speaker 1: favorite superheroes. And also just like imagistically, I think the
Speaker 1: visuals of like Doctor Strange's like powers and like the
Speaker 1: illusions that and optical illusions that happened, it's very like,
Speaker 1: um I spy level, like optic illusions that we're seeing
Speaker 1: are really gorgeous. I think the dissonance for me is
Speaker 1: that I like Doctor Strange is part of the m
Speaker 1: c U. I like the magical part of the m
Speaker 1: c U. I don't necessarily love Doctor Strange himself, and
Speaker 1: even in this movie, I found him kind of boring
Speaker 1: and just like very reactive to everything that was going on,
Speaker 1: and like this movie was about Wanda for me, But
Speaker 1: I like that he is our entry point into the
Speaker 1: more magical side of the Marvel Cinematic universe. I will
Speaker 1: also say the jokes for the first Doctor Strange movie,
Speaker 1: we're much better for him. I also agree, like I
Speaker 1: liked him a lot better in his first movie, and
Speaker 1: here he kind of I mean didn't fade necessarily, but
Speaker 1: like it was about Wanda. It was it was about Wanda,
Speaker 1: and I think some of the So let's I think
Speaker 1: before we get into everything, let's give like a kind
Speaker 1: of t l d R of just what we thought
Speaker 1: of the movie generally. Um, and maybe a loose premise
Speaker 1: as well. Um, sure if you can even like you
Speaker 1: are the one to do that. Yeah, okay, So loose
Speaker 1: premise of the movie is in the chronology of Marvel,
Speaker 1: Doctor Strange in the Multiverse of Madness is like basically
Speaker 1: kind of a sequel to wand Division the show, um,
Speaker 1: and also obviously a sequel to the first Doctor Strange
Speaker 1: movie in it Doctor Strange is now you know, uh, well,
Speaker 1: I guess actually Okay, So the two things that I
Speaker 1: think set this movie up the most are wand Division
Speaker 1: and Spider Man No Way Home. Because Doctor Strange in
Speaker 1: No Home has had his first run in with the
Speaker 1: Multiverse um and did not go well and did not
Speaker 1: go well. And so in this movie, Doctor Strange Um
Speaker 1: encounters America Chavez, who is a girl with the power
Speaker 1: to travel between multiverses, and she is being chased by
Speaker 1: what we ultimately find out is Wanda maxim Off the
Speaker 1: Scarlet which who wants America's powers so that she can
Speaker 1: get to a universe where the children that she created
Speaker 1: and lost in wand division um exist. Yeah, and she's
Speaker 1: gonna be reunited, yes, these fake children essentially, And so
Speaker 1: that drives the whole plot of the movie is Wanda
Speaker 1: chasing Doctor Strange in America through various universes, causing all
Speaker 1: kinds of mayhem, killing people left and right, truly killing
Speaker 1: like brutally people like it's cuckoo um. And yeah, I
Speaker 1: mean in terms of like my overall impressions, I thought, um,
Speaker 1: we went into it. You know, I had read a
Speaker 1: lot of sentiment that was not very nice. Like I
Speaker 1: think a lot of Marvel stands were feeling a type
Speaker 1: of way about the movie and feeling like it didn't
Speaker 1: live up to the hype. And this movie is also
Speaker 1: I think a year delayed. It was supposed to come
Speaker 1: out last summer, and so you know, there's a lot
Speaker 1: of reasons for people to feel like they have been
Speaker 1: on the edge of their seats for something that promised
Speaker 1: a lot and didn't get what they wanted. However, I
Speaker 1: had a ball and I thought, I really liked you know,
Speaker 1: the movie. Um I think that, Um, not to start
Speaker 1: off sour, because I really did like the movie, but
Speaker 1: I think I came away from it feeling kind of like,
Speaker 1: you know, fine, in the way that I feel about
Speaker 1: a lot of movies, a lot of Marvel movies. Um like, um,
Speaker 1: I don't know, like I think. I sometimes when Marvel
Speaker 1: movies get super formulaic, I tend to forget a lot
Speaker 1: of the details and I don't get that invested in
Speaker 1: the characters. And this one was kind of that. But
Speaker 1: also just like Wandas, like all care about is Wanda,
Speaker 1: and every time she was on screen, which was most
Speaker 1: of the movie, like I was invested. Yeah, it does.
Speaker 1: It is a movie that really I think maybe some
Speaker 1: of the criticism is that it is not a movie
Speaker 1: you can watch as a standalone film, but like, is
Speaker 1: any Marvel thing something you can watch standalone? At this point, Like,
Speaker 1: you can only understand this film if you have the
Speaker 1: context of watching wand Division, like some of the things
Speaker 1: I've I've seen people saying or that you know, Wanda
Speaker 1: is um you know, just like a flat villain and
Speaker 1: like you don't understand from the movie, like her motivation,
Speaker 1: but like the whole point of Wan Division the TV
Speaker 1: show was to set up this arc within the m
Speaker 1: c U. Like her motivation is division Division, And honestly,
Speaker 1: the emotional stakes are not there if you haven't watched.
Speaker 1: And literally all you need is that moment, the first
Speaker 1: moment Wanda's in the movie when the wand Division theme
Speaker 1: song like amazing Needles, Oh my god, it was so
Speaker 1: incredible and so evocative, and immediately I it brought me
Speaker 1: back to the show and I understood exactly where she
Speaker 1: is um and you get it, like you get the
Speaker 1: that show was all about grief and her letting go
Speaker 1: of her grief for vision, but like I think it
Speaker 1: did transform literally into these children that she created and
Speaker 1: when she lost them, like and now that she has
Speaker 1: all this power at her disposal, She's going to do
Speaker 1: whatever she has to do to get them back. I
Speaker 1: would also argue that like most Marvel characters are flat, sorry,
Speaker 1: like and I think that the performances of the prestige
Speaker 1: stars that they bring into these ship shows and movies
Speaker 1: are the things that ground the characters and an emotional
Speaker 1: reality totally well well, Um, Elizabeth Olsen ate this movie
Speaker 1: absolutely like no question, Like she to me was just
Speaker 1: as like fierce and complex as she was is in
Speaker 1: the TV show. I think it was kind of unnerving
Speaker 1: to see the level of her villainy as like, what
Speaker 1: is being set up to make her the big bad
Speaker 1: of like future movies? I think UM. And I also UM,
Speaker 1: I felt like, uh, I don't know if we necessary.
Speaker 1: I feel like we saw something new from Wanda too.
Speaker 1: I think that's something I appreciate. It is like there
Speaker 1: was there was like a level of violence, um, and
Speaker 1: a level of mania from Wanda that you know was
Speaker 1: unsettling and it felt earned because we've seen glimmers of
Speaker 1: it before, like in End Game when she you know,
Speaker 1: goes after Thanos and he says like he has no
Speaker 1: idea who she is and she says, you will um,
Speaker 1: and we saw moments of it. I rewatched the first
Speaker 1: couple episodes of WandaVision last night, and the moment where
Speaker 1: she realizes that Monica Rambo has like invaded her world
Speaker 1: and like turns and like throws her out, like this
Speaker 1: has all been seated. And I do think that Wanda's
Speaker 1: level of villainy in this movie is earned by everything
Speaker 1: we've seen before. Um and it's actually just really fun
Speaker 1: to see the creation of a villain because I think
Speaker 1: one of the things Marvel does well sometimes and not
Speaker 1: well others is makes the villains really engaging and fun.
Speaker 1: I thought that that's true, and also tries to give
Speaker 1: them a little bit of depth, like I do think
Speaker 1: in Infinity War and End Game, Like Infinity War especially,
Speaker 1: Fanis is kind of the protagonist of it. Like it
Speaker 1: really does the work to make you understand why he's
Speaker 1: trying to kill half the people in the universe. Um.
Speaker 1: And so WandaVision is Wanda's villain origin story and now
Speaker 1: she's the villain. Yeah, and you know, she's a tragic villain.
Speaker 1: She's an anti hero in a way, but she is
Speaker 1: the bad guy and we route for her, like she's
Speaker 1: fully like decapitating people and like blowing their heads off,
Speaker 1: and we're like yes, works, like queen, you know, like
Speaker 1: it really is that. Um Okay, So we've talked, we
Speaker 1: we've overviewed the movie. Have you given you really loved it?
Speaker 1: You liked the movie? Yeah, I liked it a lot.
Speaker 1: I thought the pacing was pretty good. It's very short
Speaker 1: form Marvel movie, which also it's like around two hours,
Speaker 1: and um, I think that's probably good because I wanted
Speaker 1: more Wanda, which means that I enjoyed every moment she
Speaker 1: was on screen and never felt like there was too
Speaker 1: much of her, and and we wanted so much that
Speaker 1: we did. Yes, in fact, wait in the theater for
Speaker 1: the post credit scene for both for both post credit
Speaker 1: scenes like Boo Boo with the fool sitting there humid
Speaker 1: the humiliating experience of sitting through minutes of rolling credits
Speaker 1: holding in my piss so that I can watch a
Speaker 1: less than thirty second clip that basically spits in my face.
Speaker 1: Maybe there's another universe where you don't have to piss,
Speaker 1: Okay whatever. The post credit scene you know, I don't.
Speaker 1: There's the second post second one is a trolling. It's
Speaker 1: a direct troll. It was not a slap in the face.
Speaker 1: It was not as bad as when they just rolled
Speaker 1: the Doctor Strange trailer um the Multiverse of Madness trailer
Speaker 1: from from Spider Man. Um, but it was still insulting. Um.
Speaker 1: And so you know to that, I say, how dare you?
Speaker 1: And I don't know if I will ever wait for
Speaker 1: another post credit scene again. There are some things that
Speaker 1: not not like fully didn't work from me, but that
Speaker 1: I think could have been better. Like, as I said,
Speaker 1: I found Doctor Strange like a little boring at times.
Speaker 1: I just anytime we were spending a lot of time
Speaker 1: with him, I just kind of wanted to get back
Speaker 1: to Wanda. I also thought America Chavez was good, um,
Speaker 1: but I think I think she should have just been
Speaker 1: an adult. I think they should have just aged her up.
Speaker 1: I don't understand why she needed to be a teenager.
Speaker 1: I was telling you, bros, I really hate most things
Speaker 1: that are like here's the story of an adult and
Speaker 1: a kid, like you know what I mean, Like, I
Speaker 1: just it's never entertainment. Felt like she had to be
Speaker 1: a kid, so that Dr Strange felt like he had
Speaker 1: to protect her. Yes, I mean that said, I think
Speaker 1: it's really amazing that they're putting America Chavez in the multiverse,
Speaker 1: into the cinematic multiverse. Um. And I have to say, like,
Speaker 1: you know, America Chavez is like a really dope character
Speaker 1: of recent conception that was the first Latin LGBTQ character
Speaker 1: to lead a series. The serious was unfortunately you can't
Speaker 1: sold after one year. But it's written by this phenomenal,
Speaker 1: amazing writer Gaby Rivera. Um and like, I just felt
Speaker 1: like a comic series. Yes, a comic series. Sorry, sorry
Speaker 1: paper comics imagine that. Um, But yeah, I felt like
Speaker 1: it was not something that I was expecting. However, it
Speaker 1: must be said that America Chavez as a name for
Speaker 1: a character is cho ch hang levels of offensive. Like
Speaker 1: it's just not a good name for a character, and
Speaker 1: it was written by two white guys, So like, I
Speaker 1: just we needed another name for her. But I do
Speaker 1: love that she has um lesbian moms yes, who were
Speaker 1: featured in the movie, although she had immediately killed that
Speaker 1: talk about barrier games and the m C is like,
Speaker 1: oh my god, look representation and then let's have their
Speaker 1: own child to murder them because she got stung by
Speaker 1: a bee. Well, the other thing is was giving Britain.
Speaker 1: It really was, but what they also didn't really address
Speaker 1: America shop as his own queerness, even though she was
Speaker 1: wearing a rainbow pin on her dentmitis because she has
Speaker 1: lesbian moms or is she queer herself. She is queer herself, Yeah,
Speaker 1: she's but they didn't I mean, or maybe she doesn't
Speaker 1: know that yet in this universe. I don't know. It
Speaker 1: was just literally never addressed. Um. But I I all
Speaker 1: so want to say, unfortunately that I don't feel like so.
Speaker 1: Chill Gomez, who plays America Shavi Is was amazing, like
Speaker 1: and maybe it's because it was a movie, Like I
Speaker 1: do think they're setting her up. I was watching a
Speaker 1: TikTok last night that was saying that they're setting up
Speaker 1: a Young Avengers eventual thing that America Javes is like
Speaker 1: canonically part of as Our Wanda's Children. And I think
Speaker 1: that's also probably why what um Kate Bishop, who is
Speaker 1: the new Hawkeye from The Hawkeye Show, is part of
Speaker 1: so um. I think these are like this is how
Speaker 1: Marvel works, you know, like something is seated in a
Speaker 1: movie that eventually becomes its own thing like four years later.
Speaker 1: I was kind of wishing that they had cast um
Speaker 1: Isabel Myer said instead, who played Dora the Explorer and
Speaker 1: the the live action Remacha We I mean, wouldn't it
Speaker 1: be great if Dora the Explorer just was in the
Speaker 1: Marvel stud out of the Universe. They're literally like tentacle
Speaker 1: demons like coming out of the multiverse. And then all
Speaker 1: of a sudden, it's me Donna like and like her
Speaker 1: powers the backpack or something backpack that I just take
Speaker 1: a quick as side. Yeah, maybe she sings things in
Speaker 1: it like hypnotizes people. Yes, okay, okay, I'm I'm writing this, um,
Speaker 1: but I have to say also, um, just as quick
Speaker 1: as I The Door the Explore movie, the live action
Speaker 1: remake was amazing, like really underrated Doors performances phenomenal. I
Speaker 1: lulled on my own in this theater all the way
Speaker 1: through it. But I don't think it was. I think
Speaker 1: it was. No, I don't think it was. It was
Speaker 1: it is, Yeah, okay. I was like, um, have you
Speaker 1: ever thought about like the slant rhyme of Dora the
Speaker 1: Explorer or It's like you either need to say Dora
Speaker 1: or the Explorer er, which most people I think say
Speaker 1: the Ladder. But it's like, I mean, proud of you
Speaker 1: for that slant rhyme, but it just doesn't sell it.
Speaker 1: My favorite moment was when she goes to attack the
Speaker 1: place where all the sorcerers are I don't know what
Speaker 1: the name of it is. And then she's like trying
Speaker 1: to get past their shields and there's a crack in it,
Speaker 1: and then she like goes and like invades the mind
Speaker 1: of one of the sorcerers and she just kind of
Speaker 1: like appears behind him and like comes out to the
Speaker 1: side and she goes runs. It's so good. It's so
Speaker 1: and like moments like that to me pulled off a
Speaker 1: villain that isn't flat, you know what I mean, A
Speaker 1: villain that is like dynamic, that is like engaging and
Speaker 1: fund Yeah, and like even though you know, I feel
Speaker 1: like some of the kind of plot devices in this
Speaker 1: movie are like kind of like you know, they're just
Speaker 1: like fine, Like it doesn't it didn't really matter to
Speaker 1: me because she was selling it and she was witchy,
Speaker 1: which I loved, like I and they I think they
Speaker 1: made a lot of they put a lot of emphasis
Speaker 1: on her being a witch and like that being different
Speaker 1: than the Sorcerer's It's just you know, because like the
Speaker 1: the idea of a witch has all this like loaded
Speaker 1: cultural context um and Wanda is very much by the
Speaker 1: end of this movie, when she finds the temple to
Speaker 1: her and like the demons and stuff. She is the
Speaker 1: Scarlet Witch, and even I think more so than she
Speaker 1: was at the end of one division when she's like
Speaker 1: floating in the air and like transforms into her new outfit.
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, that was just the beginning, and truly early MCU,
Speaker 1: they very much doubled down on the idea that anything
Speaker 1: magic was just a science that we didn't understand yet,
Speaker 1: Like that's always kind of what they said about th
Speaker 1: Um and all this other stuff, but now it's it's like,
Speaker 1: it's literally magic because magic is a huge part of
Speaker 1: the comic books, and Wanda is one of the most
Speaker 1: powerful magic users specifically in the Marvel Universe comic books
Speaker 1: and movies, if not the most powerful, which is like,
Speaker 1: I guess the question that we're is running through a
Speaker 1: lot of the minds of people that are now going
Speaker 1: to be affected by Wanda's like insurmountable power. Yes, because
Speaker 1: we saw it in this movie, because she cleared everyone.
Speaker 1: Every single person who came up against her was not
Speaker 1: a match for her. The only and again obviously spoilers,
Speaker 1: Wanda is the villain and the hero of this movie
Speaker 1: because she was the only one who could defeat herself.
Speaker 1: It must be said also that while Wanda is enacting
Speaker 1: this horror and using the powers of the Dark Whole
Speaker 1: to kill the superheroes of the Illuminati and destroy buildings
Speaker 1: and like chase America Chavez, she is wearing old navy
Speaker 1: jeans like jeans, babe, like like fully because like she's
Speaker 1: in mom gear and yeah, like and we are like
Speaker 1: a thin hoodie like it was. Yeah, And I love
Speaker 1: when she's chasing them. You can see if she's all
Speaker 1: injured and like and like, um, it's only like because
Speaker 1: she's in her mom form, yes, and it's only through
Speaker 1: sheer force of will that she is able and even
Speaker 1: still like Christina was like her lowest fat nascune broke.
Speaker 1: She came on this bitch mad as hell. That is
Speaker 1: very much wan energy exactly want. Yeah, I loved Also,
Speaker 1: I love her like black fingers from using the dark hold.
Speaker 1: Is that what it is? That what it is because
Speaker 1: those in one division. Do you think if I go
Speaker 1: to pampered hands and like, can you make my fingertips black? Literally?
Speaker 1: I mean that is kind of a beauty trend slash,
Speaker 1: Isn't it also like a spiritual thing? Like people, it's
Speaker 1: probably appropriate we don't need to get into it. Yeah,
Speaker 1: but in the movie, it's supposed to be a sign
Speaker 1: that that the Dark Hold is corrupting Wanda. It also
Speaker 1: kind of we also find out it's corrupted Doctor Strange
Speaker 1: and different universes, but he uses it to kind of
Speaker 1: help save the day. And it also leads to him
Speaker 1: getting a third eye at the end of the movie. Yeah,
Speaker 1: which is like the big kind of cliffhanger, I guess.
Speaker 1: And then in the post credit scene, we got we
Speaker 1: got her, We got Charlie's Throne. Charlie's Throne is in
Speaker 1: the Marvel universe. I did a little digging on what
Speaker 1: character she is, so Charlie's is playing clear who is
Speaker 1: a um apprentice of In the comic book, she's one
Speaker 1: of Doctor Strange's apprentices and later his wife. So Charlie's
Speaker 1: is not coming in as like a cameo like she I.
Speaker 1: She I think is going to be a big part
Speaker 1: of the next phase of Marvel. It's astounding that she
Speaker 1: is not already in the MC I know. I kind
Speaker 1: of thought, like, has she been in one of these movies?
Speaker 1: I thought for sure she was in a DC franchise
Speaker 1: or something that I guess she doesn't. That's crazy to me. Um,
Speaker 1: but she, I mean she. I'm ready for her. I'm
Speaker 1: ready for her. I'm ready for Harry Styles. I would
Speaker 1: like to say to get her a better wig. I
Speaker 1: would like for the eventual movie. I thought she looked
Speaker 1: actually really really looked good. I loved her purple cut crease.
Speaker 1: I'm ready. I hope they bring back John Krasinski. Do
Speaker 1: you think they're gonna do or do you think they
Speaker 1: killed him permanently? Kind of feel like it was just
Speaker 1: a gag. I think it was just for this movie. Well,
Speaker 1: I was telling you as well, like the kind of
Speaker 1: four members of the Illuminati Sons dr X are kind
Speaker 1: of like marginal I forgot one. One of one of
Speaker 1: the other members is Peggy Carter, who is in in
Speaker 1: a couple of different universes. Became Captain America. Well she
Speaker 1: became Captain Carter instead of Steve Rogers. And when they
Speaker 1: all die, i'd um, I was just like I was
Speaker 1: like Captain Uk Tuning Fork Guy Fantastic four member, like
Speaker 1: these are all Marvel reject superheroes. The way they wanted
Speaker 1: to kill them was in her old Navy. I don't
Speaker 1: believe I don't believe in the glorification of murder, but
Speaker 1: I do. What is the Gaga quote, Um, I I
Speaker 1: believe in the glorification of old navy jeans of Fourth
Speaker 1: of July discount T shirts and um um she said,
Speaker 1: she said, I don't believe in the glorification of murder.
Speaker 1: I do believe in the empowerment of women. That is
Speaker 1: exactly how I felt watching Wanda kill person after person,
Speaker 1: Like I think one of the early scenes when she
Speaker 1: attacks the sorcerers, she like turned someone to dust. Yeah,
Speaker 1: and it's great. And I think, obviously, and I think maybe,
Speaker 1: um if she's like she obviously thinks that this is
Speaker 1: all justified in the grand scheme of things. I also
Speaker 1: think maybe if you are thinking about the multiverse and
Speaker 1: like all these infinite universes, like these lives are kind
Speaker 1: of meaningless because there's trillions of zillions of millions of
Speaker 1: the bavilions of people. I would love to get into
Speaker 1: the multiverse of it all. Because this movie was hot.
Speaker 1: On the release of everything everywhere all at once, Jamie
Speaker 1: Lee Curtis reminded us, yes, you weren't telling me that
Speaker 1: I need to pull up the basic tl DR. Jamie
Speaker 1: Lee Curtis is dragging UM the Multiverse of madness, saying
Speaker 1: that it's a flop and that everyone should go see
Speaker 1: Everything Everywhere, All at Once instead, which is like these
Speaker 1: movies have nothing really to do with each other outside
Speaker 1: of being multiverse movies. All these sidelines are saying, Jamie
Speaker 1: Lee Curtis starts feud with with Doctor Strange. Not so
Speaker 1: she so, she said, Is it just me? Does it
Speaker 1: seem strange that our tiny movie that could and did
Speaker 1: and continues to do number one movie in America and
Speaker 1: is true truly marvelous out marvels any Marvel movie they
Speaker 1: put out there. And then she tagged, um, everything Everywhere,
Speaker 1: all at once. Um, that's barely everything everywhere all at once.
Speaker 1: UM has a deep beating heart and brilliant visual treats
Speaker 1: as well as extraordinary performances and fantastic beastly fight scenes.
Speaker 1: And it costs less than the entire Craft service budget
Speaker 1: on Doctor Strange and or any other Marvel, which I'm
Speaker 1: sure is true. There's no reason to put them against
Speaker 1: each other tv H, but it is obvious. I mean,
Speaker 1: no one's gonna say that Everything Everywhere, All at Once
Speaker 1: is like not as good as like the Doctor Strange movie.
Speaker 1: You know, I would say, like it's a better movie.
Speaker 1: Yes it's a it's a fundamentally better movie. But there
Speaker 1: it's it's apples and oranges. Apples and oranges, but any
Speaker 1: different universes. But anyways, the reason I invoke everything everywhere
Speaker 1: at once is because I kind of want to examine,
Speaker 1: like the function of a multiverse when it like is
Speaker 1: in these like cultural objects. Because they also just watched, um,
Speaker 1: the first season of Russian Doll for the first time.
Speaker 1: I had never watched it. I tried watching the multiple times.
Speaker 1: Did you ever watch it? I don't remember anything about it,
Speaker 1: but basically that I remember the premise. But Russian Doll
Speaker 1: is like, um, it's like um groundhog Day, but kind
Speaker 1: of girl bossy, you know, like it's like I wake up,
Speaker 1: I kind of live the same day over and over
Speaker 1: again and die in in conspicuous ways. And she finds
Speaker 1: her kind of a match es. Basically, she finds someone
Speaker 1: who is going through the same thing, and they try
Speaker 1: to figure out together why they're stuck in this kind
Speaker 1: of groundhog Day scenario. But they do encounter a kind
Speaker 1: of multiverse where in many different cells are going throughout
Speaker 1: their days and dying in different ways, and they're trying
Speaker 1: to together figure out why this is happening and what
Speaker 1: the consequences of their actions are in each universe that
Speaker 1: they kind of decided to do stuff in UM we're in.
Speaker 1: I don't know. I think that when I like pull
Speaker 1: these all together, it's like the multiverse in something like
Speaker 1: I think the the thematic question of the multiverse in
Speaker 1: Russian doll is kind of like how do you um
Speaker 1: reconcile trauma? I guess trauma to to talk in a
Speaker 1: Jamie the Curtis way um through like living through past
Speaker 1: selves or trying to think about you know, future selves
Speaker 1: or like other universes or whatever. It's kind of a yeah,
Speaker 1: it's about like the reconciliation of trauma. And then with
Speaker 1: maybe everything everywhere all at once, it's more about like happiness,
Speaker 1: like fundamental happy. I think everywhere, everything everywhere, all at
Speaker 1: once is about choices and how the choices we make
Speaker 1: have all of these different implications on our life um
Speaker 1: and can lead us down all these different paths, and
Speaker 1: like it's very human to think, what if I had
Speaker 1: made this choice, where would I be? UM? And I
Speaker 1: guess I would say in Doctor Strange, like the multiverse,
Speaker 1: I'd no, there's not. I think we can be generous
Speaker 1: and find like a deeper thematic meaning, but like it's
Speaker 1: not really there. It's a plot device. It was very
Speaker 1: similar to everything everywhere all at once. Thematically, It's like if,
Speaker 1: how if you could be happy in another universe, would you?
Speaker 1: But I think with with Doctors, with the Multiverse of Madness,
Speaker 1: it was kind of more about grief because he was
Speaker 1: mourning the loss of his lover and Wanda's mourning the
Speaker 1: loss of her children, and they're trying to figure out
Speaker 1: if this bizarre universal like plot twist that they can
Speaker 1: manipulate is something that can you know, heal that. Yeah,
Speaker 1: they they're really just looking at the multiverse as a tool.
Speaker 1: They're looking to escape their own lives into something else,
Speaker 1: and they don't care about about the repercussions of that.
Speaker 1: Because even early on in the movie, someone I forget who,
Speaker 1: Maybe it's Doctor Strange, maybe it's America. Shavas asked Wanda, well,
Speaker 1: when you get to that other universe, what are you
Speaker 1: going to do to the other Wanda, And she never
Speaker 1: answers it, and like we do find out, like she
Speaker 1: abandons that other Wanda in the weird like middle dimension,
Speaker 1: the purple middle dimension. Um, she doesn't really care about
Speaker 1: her other selves. And it's because really, I think, as
Speaker 1: we learn at the end of the movie, like Wanda
Speaker 1: like kind of hates herself and she thinks that having
Speaker 1: all these external things, having her children will heal her
Speaker 1: in some way. And then that's why like another version
Speaker 1: of herself giving her that grace and that reassurance is
Speaker 1: I think what ultimately like lets her let go of
Speaker 1: all this pain and and see the pain that she
Speaker 1: has caused and be like no more. And I think
Speaker 1: that pain and the emotional stakes of the movie, I
Speaker 1: think I kind of I am seeing now more and
Speaker 1: more why people didn't like this movie, because if you haven't,
Speaker 1: like one division to me is about grief like period,
Speaker 1: Like the whole the whole arc of the show is
Speaker 1: about her dealing with and coping with and learning how
Speaker 1: to I guess Navigator circumnavigate like what grief feels like
Speaker 1: and how the denial that comes with that. And this
Speaker 1: is like being the final stage of that overcoming grief
Speaker 1: feels a little flat because it's only one stage as
Speaker 1: opposed to the entire um. The entire like trials and
Speaker 1: tribulations she had throughout Westview. Yeah, well you just can't
Speaker 1: fit that all in a movie. And like the movie really,
Speaker 1: you know, the movie is Doctor Strange and the Multiverse
Speaker 1: of Madness. Wanda is not the star of it, even
Speaker 1: though she is the star of it. And you know,
Speaker 1: maybe Wanda will get her own movie eventually. Maybe in
Speaker 1: the next version of whatever The Avengers is, Juanna will
Speaker 1: be the fanos. I don't really know. It's interesting because
Speaker 1: you know, against spoiler alert, the movie ends with Wanda
Speaker 1: seemingly dying. She destroys this temple and like it collapses.
Speaker 1: Obviously didn't she didn't die. She's coming back in some way. Um.
Speaker 1: I do still hold out hope that she will be
Speaker 1: the link to Mutants because we know that that X
Speaker 1: Men is coming into the m c U and Wanda
Speaker 1: obviously is a huge part of X Men and like
Speaker 1: mutant she is, Yeah, Wanda, because she's Wanda originated an
Speaker 1: X Men. She's the daughter Wanda. Wanda is the daughter
Speaker 1: of Magneto. She and she's the daughter of Magneta. Yeah.
Speaker 1: She and Pietro, her twin brother, are both mutants and
Speaker 1: there have been lots of theories about like because there's
Speaker 1: a really iconic comic book series called House of m
Speaker 1: in which Wanda alters reality by saying no more mutants. Um,
Speaker 1: And so people like we're theorizing that maybe in Wan
Speaker 1: Division she was going to create mutants or you know,
Speaker 1: but obviously, like we're seeing in Wan Division that somewhere
Speaker 1: in the Marvel multiverse mutants exist because because we have
Speaker 1: professor X. Did you ever read Cheryl straight like advice columnist?
Speaker 1: She wrote Dear Sugar. She also wrote, um sure that
Speaker 1: movie that Reaese Witherspoon was in, Yes, while thank you Phoebe.
Speaker 1: Um okay, So she used to be like one of
Speaker 1: my favorite writers. And she has this essay where she
Speaker 1: talks about a ghost ship life, which is essentially like,
Speaker 1: you know, as you go down the path of your life,
Speaker 1: or rather the sea of your life, it splits ways
Speaker 1: when you make a choice, and one of those ships
Speaker 1: is a ghost ship that you maybe think about like
Speaker 1: if I had gone to this college, if I had
Speaker 1: had a baby, if I had decided to marry this
Speaker 1: person or whatever. And um, I feel like that is
Speaker 1: something that we all thematically deal with, um, Rose, what
Speaker 1: is like your primordial ghost ship. Well, I hate to
Speaker 1: be really obvious, but what if I had a transition?
Speaker 1: Really that I think about it all the time. And
Speaker 1: I don't mean to get like deep and emotional on
Speaker 1: this podcast where we're talking about a Marvel movie, but
Speaker 1: you know, um, transitioning for me, and I think for
Speaker 1: a lot of people is a choice that you make.
Speaker 1: I absolutely could have lived the rest of my life
Speaker 1: not as a woman without medically transitioning. Email. Yeah, And
Speaker 1: it is the most active thing I have ever done
Speaker 1: in my life. It was the most active choice I've
Speaker 1: ever made. It's something that once I admitted to myself
Speaker 1: that I was a woman. Um, because I think a
Speaker 1: lot of different people have different experiences of transnis and gender,
Speaker 1: and some people really do feel like they're like we're
Speaker 1: born in the wrong body, blah blah blah all these
Speaker 1: other things, and like, you know, I don't want to
Speaker 1: go like too deep into my experience of gender, but
Speaker 1: there was a moment in my life where I had
Speaker 1: had this realization about myself and I knew that there
Speaker 1: were two pasts in front of me, and one of
Speaker 1: them is um, you know, following through on this and transitioning,
Speaker 1: and one of them was not. And I do think
Speaker 1: a lot about what my life would be life if
Speaker 1: I hadn't made that choice, and I think, I that's
Speaker 1: kind of dangerous um and and it's honestly a choice
Speaker 1: that I don't I truly don't think I ever could
Speaker 1: have made, because I know myself enough to know that
Speaker 1: once I had um admitted that to myself, I never
Speaker 1: could have been happy in any other life. But it
Speaker 1: is a fucking trip to think about, you know. I mean,
Speaker 1: like it's I know, Wanda and the multiverse of gender
Speaker 1: like would watch um, But I yeah, I feel like
Speaker 1: there is definitely especially when it comes to gender stuff,
Speaker 1: and especially when it comes to like how culturally we've
Speaker 1: conflated like medical transition with like the experience of transnis,
Speaker 1: which like are not like you know, intrinsically linked because
Speaker 1: it's it's a it's kind of a given that if
Speaker 1: you were trans, you will transition um. And that's not
Speaker 1: everyone's experience. Not everyone has the privilege to be able
Speaker 1: to transition um. And I don't think you need to
Speaker 1: medically transition to be trans. It was a choice that
Speaker 1: I had to make, and it's like not always helpful
Speaker 1: or like productive for me. To think about, like the
Speaker 1: what if of if I hadn't and like I don't
Speaker 1: want to live in that universe, but I don't know
Speaker 1: if I was given the chance, would I at least
Speaker 1: want to like peek at it and see what it
Speaker 1: would be. That sounds really dangerous because like obviously life
Speaker 1: is so much easier as a SIS person and not
Speaker 1: that like in this like whatever if I have these superpowers,
Speaker 1: if I like found that out, Like what if I
Speaker 1: had the power to change it? I don't, I don't.
Speaker 1: I don't even want to know if that's something I
Speaker 1: would even consider, Yeah, because it's like it's like torturous,
Speaker 1: it's so dangerous. And that's why I like, even as
Speaker 1: a thought exercise, this feels it feels really weird. Um,
Speaker 1: But I do think it's it's like important for me
Speaker 1: for me to say because I like, I know that
Speaker 1: a lot of queer and trans people listen to this
Speaker 1: podcast that like it is activating your identity like living
Speaker 1: your truth blah blah blah, being on your journey whatever. Um.
Speaker 1: You know, forming yourself out of clay in the way
Speaker 1: that queer and trans people do is a choice you make, um,
Speaker 1: and something that you have a lot of agency in
Speaker 1: and if you are able to do that, like, that's
Speaker 1: so fucking cool, um that we get to make ourselves.
Speaker 1: And of course you're always going to think about the
Speaker 1: what if, what if lots of things, um, and just
Speaker 1: know that you're not alone in that. Yeah, I feel
Speaker 1: like a lot of like what you're talking about is
Speaker 1: like a big reason why it's like so difficult, whether
Speaker 1: later in life or when you're not necessarily on a
Speaker 1: kind of binary spectrum of transnus, like on the needle
Speaker 1: of transnis between like boy and girl. Like we usually
Speaker 1: think it's like either all boy or all girl, or
Speaker 1: like directly in the middle, and like some people are like, actually,
Speaker 1: you know, in between those kind of two spots. And
Speaker 1: like for me, when I think about like my transniss
Speaker 1: or like where I am on the spectrum, I feel
Speaker 1: like my ghost ship is like if I had had
Speaker 1: access to trans stories at all in any form when
Speaker 1: I was young, would that have changed who I am now?
Speaker 1: Because now I'm at a place where, like medically, transitioning
Speaker 1: in any way sounds relate taxing and heartbreaking. And now
Speaker 1: that we are lucky enough to have models of transnis
Speaker 1: that don't necessitate medical transition. I feel like there's a
Speaker 1: version of me that I can be. But like you know,
Speaker 1: I was like in first grade, like writing in my
Speaker 1: journal that like I'm a girl or whatever, and like
Speaker 1: you know, I didn't have Yeah, exactly knows where we
Speaker 1: would be because the thing is, I transition at the
Speaker 1: point in my life. I did it because it was
Speaker 1: the advent of transvisibility, and all of a sudden it was, Oh,
Speaker 1: this is something I could actually do. There are mechanics
Speaker 1: for it, and I am the same in that when
Speaker 1: I was like one of the most validating parts of
Speaker 1: my transition, and like coming out to my family was
Speaker 1: a lot of people in my family saying, oh, you
Speaker 1: always told us that when you were a kid that
Speaker 1: you were a girl. And it was like great to
Speaker 1: feel like I wasn't like gaslighting myself in my own
Speaker 1: mind so that I had had that experience, because of
Speaker 1: course I have a lot of memories of that, but
Speaker 1: to have the outside validation of it, um was really
Speaker 1: important to my transition. And who knows if when I
Speaker 1: was a kid and I had told them I'm a girl,
Speaker 1: if they had understood what that means the way that
Speaker 1: parents today do who knows who I would be, you know,
Speaker 1: I mean. And meanwhile, my my first grade bully, Charlie Crupp,
Speaker 1: which is a very good bully name, by the way,
Speaker 1: I found my journal that said I am a girl
Speaker 1: and like read it to my entire music class in
Speaker 1: first grade. And then I think my my parents eventually
Speaker 1: found the journal too, and we're like, what the funk is?
Speaker 1: Like they may I just was, at a very early
Speaker 1: age made to believe that like what I was thinking
Speaker 1: about my gender, which like you know, was probably just
Speaker 1: a latent understanding of like my gender fluidity, and like
Speaker 1: who I am now was totally like pushed and pushed
Speaker 1: and pushed under like all of this shame. And it's
Speaker 1: like if that had never happened, you know, who would
Speaker 1: I be now? I don't know, but I do think
Speaker 1: just as you're saying, like to all the little virgins
Speaker 1: out there who are thinking about this like it, don't
Speaker 1: flatten your ideas of transness, and don't like overthink the
Speaker 1: medicalization of transnis and don't like pressure yourself, you know,
Speaker 1: to fit into a certain box or two mirror exactly
Speaker 1: what you see on screen, like your journey is your own,
Speaker 1: and like all you can do is you know, talk
Speaker 1: to loved ones about it and keep journaling about it
Speaker 1: and you know, but don't live a life of regret.
Speaker 1: And like, as I said, once I the the night
Speaker 1: and I can pinpointed to a specific night, like the
Speaker 1: night that I admitted to myself that I was a woman. Um,
Speaker 1: and like knew that there was no going back from that,
Speaker 1: Like I could have gone back from that, and I
Speaker 1: think I would have lived a life of regret. And
Speaker 1: I I think, like in the what if of the
Speaker 1: multiverse of it all, like I don't think that's a
Speaker 1: path that anyone wants to be on of like having
Speaker 1: lived a life looking back and saying what if I
Speaker 1: hadn't like lied to myself or like whatever, you know,
Speaker 1: I I don't think, like it doesn't have to look
Speaker 1: the same for anyone. But um, if you're thinking about
Speaker 1: it enough, it's worth pursuing. Like I've been thinking about
Speaker 1: my like be being trans like every single day for
Speaker 1: the last two years. And like if you feel like,
Speaker 1: you know, you could push a button and like you know,
Speaker 1: feminize your face or like you know whatever, like do
Speaker 1: all the things that you need to do, right, Like
Speaker 1: if I was Wanda and I could and I could
Speaker 1: go to it, and I could go to a different
Speaker 1: universe where like I started HRT when I was like
Speaker 1: four years old. How do you that that other person
Speaker 1: is like, you know, we are we are burying you,
Speaker 1: We are burying you under that bunker with Professor X
Speaker 1: and snapping your neck my hairline, snatched my eyes. Yeah. Wow,
Speaker 1: how did this discussion about like the popcorn movie of
Speaker 1: the summer turn into like a very like let me
Speaker 1: tell you it was of mysid, It was of my design, babe.
Speaker 1: I knew exactly what I was doing. Anyways. My ghost
Speaker 1: ship was not chasing my ex boyfriend to a shitty
Speaker 1: state school, UM, which I wish. I'm glad to wish. No,
Speaker 1: I did do it, and I wisht that is my
Speaker 1: ghost shop. We'll be back next week with the discussion
Speaker 1: on Lord of the Rings. So please watch all the
Speaker 1: extended editions of every Lord of the Rings movie and
Speaker 1: tell us what you want us to talk about next,
Speaker 1: whether it's UM, a book, a movie, a TV show,
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Speaker 1: You can call us to confess a three two three
Speaker 1: pennants or slide into our d m s or tag
Speaker 1: us in something through our fence to Like a Virgin
Speaker 1: fore and make sure you follow Duh. I'm your co
Speaker 1: host Rose Damn You. You can find me anywhere you
Speaker 1: want on social media at Rose Damn You and I
Speaker 1: am Francrato. You can find me at friends, squish co
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Speaker 1: a Virgin is an i Heeart radio production. Our producer
Speaker 1: is Phoebe Unter, with support from Lindsay Hoffman, Julian Weller,
Speaker 1: Jess Crane Chitch and Nikki Etre. Until next week see later. Virgins.
Speaker 1: Wont Division, Want Want Division