Speaker 1: Welcome in What's Right with Nick right as promised a
Speaker 1: special bonus episode one of our now very few two
Speaker 1: time guests, our Boxing and Gambling and Poker correspondent. But
Speaker 1: in this episode we are going to focus exclusively on
Speaker 1: the boxing piece of it for and tell me if
Speaker 1: I'm wrong, not just fight of the year, but arguably
Speaker 1: the fight of the decade the last few years. At
Speaker 1: the very least, it is Poker Hall of Famer and
Speaker 1: for my money, the sharpest of the boxing sharps Nick Shulman, Nick,
Speaker 1: great to see you, Fight of the year, fight of
Speaker 1: the decade. How excited are you for Canelo Crawford?
Speaker 2: So excited? Great to be here. Every time football comes back,
Speaker 2: it's like I sort of remember what a big sort
Speaker 2: of deal you are, you know, so I really appreciate
Speaker 2: this crazy because you're my boy. You know, I'm kind
Speaker 2: of just poker in the fights. But whenever it come like,
Speaker 2: oh yeah, you know, I'm very honored to be here,
Speaker 2: and well I know how hard you work. So thank you, sir,
Speaker 2: Thank you brother.
Speaker 1: We have been listen. If people didn't see your last appearance,
Speaker 1: I'm gonna give a quick recap of it. So Nick
Speaker 1: told us many Pakiao can win that fight. Yeah, throw
Speaker 1: the shades on. Nick said, many Pakiao can win the fight,
Speaker 1: and Nick got Packiau at plus four hundred correct four
Speaker 1: to ten, but fo ten okay, no, no, I'm not changing
Speaker 1: I'm not going to short change you ten cents. He
Speaker 1: went off at two to one plus one ninety plus
Speaker 1: two hundred something. You got a great number. You were
Speaker 1: at the fight with six seats, and I don't think
Speaker 1: in the moment realized the gravity of how bad you
Speaker 1: got scammed in that fight.
Speaker 2: I realized he was minus eight hundred on Penny Live
Speaker 2: after that the tenth rounds. Yeah, but so.
Speaker 1: Any somehow that fight ended up being a majority draw,
Speaker 1: which is just as painful as it gets. And but
Speaker 1: you were definitively on the right side of it. And now,
Speaker 1: to be fair also, and here's the thing, I love boxing,
Speaker 1: but I love boxing the way some of the professional
Speaker 1: poker world loves, you know, like the EPL where they
Speaker 1: watch it and they bet it. But if you asked
Speaker 1: him to take like a hundred question tests, they wouldn't
Speaker 1: do great on it. And so I can't speak with
Speaker 1: real authority, which is why I bring you on. But
Speaker 1: you really liked some an undercard, and so I was like, listen,
Speaker 1: this was the one. I forget who it was, but
Speaker 1: he wasn't want to. I don't want you to tell
Speaker 1: me because it'll spoil the story. And so I bet it.
Speaker 1: I was like, yeah, Nick likes it. I bet it.
Speaker 1: I and I was rolling with you. And then we
Speaker 1: turned the fight on and I I see the guy
Speaker 1: that I bet against is six eight one fifty. I
Speaker 1: text you and I'm like, yo, we got like a
Speaker 1: foot and a half height difference, and you just sext
Speaker 1: me back. They don't call him the Towering Inferno for
Speaker 1: nothing that our guys just couldn't lay in the shot.
Speaker 2: But well, yeah, go ahead, no no, I mean no, please.
Speaker 1: So but during that preview of the Pacquia fight, we
Speaker 1: talked to little Canelo Crawford. You gave away Ivy's gambling position.
Speaker 1: We talked about this, the magnitude of this fight, and
Speaker 1: we said we were gonna do this again. So I
Speaker 1: am now, and I'm also gonna say one more thing
Speaker 1: and then we're really I'm gonna see most of the
Speaker 1: floor to you because I do this. And by the way,
Speaker 1: people are watching as Nick drink some wine, I have
Speaker 1: one rule for the podcast. If I am doing doing
Speaker 1: broadcasting after six pm Eastern, I'm drinking during it. This
Speaker 1: is we are taping this on a Wednesday night. My
Speaker 1: friend will yeah, thank you. It will post sometime. I
Speaker 1: think either Thursday or Friday. Set you up for the fight.
Speaker 1: But I'm doing this for three reasons. One is, it's
Speaker 1: the fight of the year and it needs to be covered.
Speaker 1: Another is I love the idea of boxing becoming super
Speaker 1: mainstream again. And and I want to help however I can,
Speaker 1: because at its core, there is something just human about
Speaker 1: wanting to watch two grown men stand in the center
Speaker 1: of a ring and see who wins comes out and Third,
Speaker 1: and this is the part that Nick may or may
Speaker 1: not appreciate. I happen to truly believe that Nick Shulman's
Speaker 1: boxing knowledge t plus his broadcasting chops would make help
Speaker 1: make boxing more mainstream if he was a part of
Speaker 1: some boxing broadcasts. So this is my entry point to
Speaker 1: pushing him in that direction. So I am going to
Speaker 1: essentially interview you as if I know nothing about the fight,
Speaker 1: even though I know at least a little bit about
Speaker 1: the fight. So the story going in for the undefeated
Speaker 1: Terrence Crawford against the legend Canelo Alvarez. Is that he
Speaker 1: is jumping what from one fifty four to one sixty eight?
Speaker 1: How set the table for how he even got to
Speaker 1: one fifty four? He being Crawford and is that the
Speaker 1: story of the fight.
Speaker 2: That's I mean, aside from them both being all time greats,
Speaker 2: that's absolutely the main focal point here. A weight jump
Speaker 2: of this magnitude is quite rare. You've seen guys move
Speaker 2: up the ranks. You've seen pac Yao beat bigger guys.
Speaker 2: Roy Jones Junior, nobody thought he'd ever be fighting at
Speaker 2: light heavyweight heavyweight. He was up there doing crazy things.
Speaker 2: Sugar Ray Leonard beating Marvin Hagler is the one that
Speaker 2: everybody really talks about. Nobody gave Ray Leonard a chance
Speaker 2: in that fight, and he went in there and boxed.
Speaker 2: You know, he did his thing. But yeah, to move
Speaker 2: up two way classes like this is somewhat unprecedented in
Speaker 2: the modern era.
Speaker 1: Why is he doing it?
Speaker 2: Well, it's interesting. You know when they first announced the fight,
Speaker 2: I will admit I was thinking, Wow, they made Terrence
Speaker 2: an offer that he can't refuse to lock up generational
Speaker 2: wealth for his family. But This is wild that the
Speaker 2: number one pound four pound guy has to go up
Speaker 2: multiple divisions to fight, you know, the one of the
Speaker 2: best guys at that weight. Perhaps Canelo's slipping a little bit,
Speaker 2: but that was just my knee jerk. And even Terrence
Speaker 2: said himself in an interview that he feels his ceiling
Speaker 2: is one fifty four. He said that fairly recently, So
Speaker 2: I'm like, I gotta take him at his word. But
Speaker 2: now that things have come to a head and the
Speaker 2: pre fight has happened and everything, I think he believes
Speaker 2: he will win. I think his team believes he'll win,
Speaker 2: and I believe he'll win.
Speaker 1: So the and we'll listen. The market is not If
Speaker 1: the I don't listen, you get a sharper price, probably
Speaker 1: than most would. And you've been looking at this for months.
Speaker 1: But as we sit here today, it's right around minus
Speaker 1: one fifty five, minus one thirty five or plus one
Speaker 1: thirty five, Like is that where I don't know what
Speaker 1: I was seeing?
Speaker 2: More like one eighty one sixty.
Speaker 1: All right, So then I listen. So he I mean,
Speaker 1: with Canelo being the favorite, the point I sew Canello
Speaker 1: is the favorite, but he is not a overwhelming favorite.
Speaker 1: He's not even that substantial of a favorite for our
Speaker 1: if if it is minus if it is minus one eighty, uh,
Speaker 1: just to give context for that, for our you know,
Speaker 1: football fans out there, that is the same as the
Speaker 1: Packers money line when they're a three point favorite against
Speaker 1: the Commanders for Thursday Night football, like minus one eighty is.
Speaker 1: Though those upsets happen all the time, so the so
Speaker 1: is it fair to say this? The boxing world believes
Speaker 1: Terrence Crawford's the better fighter at this point than Canelo Alvarez,
Speaker 1: But because of the weight change, that is what's tilting
Speaker 1: the scale. Not that people think Canelo and this is unfair,
Speaker 1: but is purely a better fighter.
Speaker 2: You know, it's so interesting, Nick, It's like every take
Speaker 2: you hear, for the most part, Canelo's too big, he's
Speaker 2: too strong. If you talk to the public, that's what
Speaker 2: everybody thinks. And there's a few takes from trainers to
Speaker 2: that really kind of bothered me. Joel Diaz and Abel
Speaker 2: Sanchez come to mind. They're just saying, like Crawford's got
Speaker 2: no shot. Love him, but you know he can't do
Speaker 2: anything to Canelo. I'll take you back to the last
Speaker 2: time I bet against Crawford. It was twenty sixteen. I
Speaker 2: was playing the World Series of Poker and I was
Speaker 2: playing with Ivy. I was just playing cash. But uh,
Speaker 2: and once again just qualifier. I'm not a tout. You know,
Speaker 2: I'm gonna black out and go nuts and give all
Speaker 2: my picks and plays. But just so you guys know,
Speaker 2: you know, protect yourself at all times in the betting.
Speaker 2: But Ivy said, you know you like the fights, right Nick,
Speaker 2: you want to go to night see Budd? I said absolutely,
Speaker 2: So he slid me a ticket and he was fighting
Speaker 2: Victor post All and he was something like minus six hundred.
Speaker 2: I got somewhere around six to one on post All. Rangy,
Speaker 2: good Japs, smart, Eastern European. I'm always high up on
Speaker 2: the Eastern Europeans in general because they tend to be
Speaker 2: quite humble, pragmatic. You know, maybe a little bit of
Speaker 2: that's from poker, but also in boxing, they're a little
Speaker 2: bit slept on. In America. Sometimes this is a popularity contest.
Speaker 2: These guys can really fight.
Speaker 1: I don't want to interrupt. The story is who's the
Speaker 1: favorite in this?
Speaker 2: Going back to twenty sixteen, Crawford was a six to
Speaker 2: one favorite.
Speaker 1: Okay, so Crawford was minus six hundred. YEA bet the dog,
Speaker 1: you bet, I've got the dog, got it, go ahead,
Speaker 1: so keep going.
Speaker 2: I pulled up to the arena, and, you know, much
Speaker 2: to my pleasure, I realized I had the best seat
Speaker 2: in the house and I was alone for four rounds
Speaker 2: as Crawford was getting his shit off switching stances. I
Speaker 2: knew he was great, but this was like something really
Speaker 2: special and the camaraderie with his team and everything. Ivy
Speaker 2: pulled up middle of the fourth round and spent the
Speaker 2: entire fight on his phone betting basketball, you know, just
Speaker 2: eight seven and a half, not eight right, texting, you know.
Speaker 2: Every once in a while he'd like pop up and
Speaker 2: come with like a yes sir, you know, but then
Speaker 2: right back to work. So finally in the ninth round,
Speaker 2: I said, by the way, Phil, uh, do you have
Speaker 2: a sat Did you bet this fight? He said, oh,
Speaker 2: this fight? Uh, I have Crawford, Nick, But you never know,
Speaker 2: it's boxing. Anything can happen. He got this smug kind
Speaker 2: of smile, you know in a Bronx taill when when
Speaker 2: when mush bet the horse and Palmentary rips up the tick,
Speaker 2: That's what it felt like. I was like, okay, right,
Speaker 2: And a lot of people don't know this, but ever
Speaker 2: since then, I've I've actually been business partners with Bud.
Speaker 2: And the business plan, yeah, it's it's crazy. And the
Speaker 2: business plan it's a really simple one. He goes out
Speaker 2: there and fights and I bet on him every single
Speaker 2: fucking time. And guess what, nick business has been booming.
Speaker 2: Why would I switch up on my man? Now you
Speaker 2: know what I mean?
Speaker 1: So this is so, this is what I want and listen,
Speaker 1: die hard boxing fans.
Speaker 2: And by the way, sorry to cut you off, but
Speaker 2: after post all he rattled off eleven straight stoppages. They
Speaker 2: call his resume to question. But he beat Jeff Horn,
Speaker 2: who was undefeated at the time, who beat Pacyao. He
Speaker 2: beat David Benavitez, his brother in a in a fight
Speaker 2: where he didn't really engage, and then he found just
Speaker 2: a gorgeous stoppage. He beat a mere Khan, he beat
Speaker 2: kel Brooke. We'll get into it, but but he beat
Speaker 2: the mean machine kaval Yawskis, who's great. Please just sorry, go.
Speaker 1: On, no, no, no, so you got you got exactly
Speaker 1: where I was going. And I promise for Canelo fans,
Speaker 1: we're gonna get there. But I want what really perked
Speaker 1: my ears up about this is when we were talking
Speaker 1: about this a month ago and you said, Ivy, and
Speaker 1: now I'm gonna sidebar it real quick. I have. This
Speaker 1: is a weird thing about the way I'm wired because
Speaker 1: of the industry that I'm in and the people I've
Speaker 1: been around, because of the industry that I'm in versus
Speaker 1: poker and the poker world, I have been lucky enough
Speaker 1: to I mean, I guess I can say this because
Speaker 1: it was public. It was I didn't talk about it,
Speaker 1: but it was all over the internet. A few months ago,
Speaker 1: I'm in a Grizzlies game and at the Grizzlies Lakers
Speaker 1: and at the end of the game, Lebron James comes
Speaker 1: over hugs My wife tells her it's great to see her.
Speaker 1: DAPs me up and like and I was, as you know,
Speaker 1: as Leonardo DiCaprio would say in The Departed, My hand
Speaker 1: didn't shake like that felt. It didn't feel normal, but
Speaker 1: like it was. It wasn't like a as big of
Speaker 1: a thing as I think people would assume. Here Friday night,
Speaker 1: I'm going to Kansas City to do our first things,
Speaker 1: first show, but then after the show, Patrick Mahomes Steakhouse.
Speaker 1: This is grand opening, and I'll probably get to spend
Speaker 1: some time with Patrick, who I've become I consider a friend.
Speaker 1: That's not like I'm I'm not saying that for any
Speaker 1: reason other than like to set the table for what
Speaker 1: I'm about to say. With that said, about three months ago,
Speaker 1: I was in Vegas at the World Series with Jared
Speaker 1: Blesnik and Blez is like, hey, you know what I
Speaker 1: was with Blez. But it wasn't Bleaz who did this.
Speaker 1: It was Nacho Barbero, legendary Nacho. I see him as
Speaker 1: for poor people. And Nacho says to me, have you
Speaker 1: ever met Ivy? And I'm like, no, I actually it,
Speaker 1: And Nacho says he's like, oh, you have to meet Ivy.
Speaker 1: And in that moment, my heart raced like I was
Speaker 1: a child, like my nerves of the situation. It was
Speaker 1: so unlike anything that's happened to me as an adult,
Speaker 1: because if you don't run in those circles and you're
Speaker 1: a poker fan or gambling fan, he is Lebron Mahomes
Speaker 1: whatever you want, like this legendary, large in life figure.
Speaker 1: Which is why I say all that to say this
Speaker 1: when you said that Ivy thinks Bud might be the
Speaker 1: best ever pound for pound, the best ever, I was like,
Speaker 1: holy shit, that's not gonna be a comment that's thrown
Speaker 1: around loosely. So my question is I know he's won
Speaker 1: of all these fights. What has happened over the last
Speaker 1: decade that is there a moment? Is there a sequence
Speaker 1: of moments? What is the evidence or the reasoning someone
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Speaker 2: That's a great question, and you know that was indeed
Speaker 2: a profound sentiment from IV. My favorite Bud moments in
Speaker 2: no particular order, Number one, the Kelbrook stoppage. Now you
Speaker 2: can say what you want about where Brooke was at
Speaker 2: his career. It was at in his career. But and
Speaker 2: I've ran this back hundreds of times, and I'm not
Speaker 2: saying that to sound deep. I just he landed the
Speaker 2: shortest little right hand. They're both on the inside, kind
Speaker 2: of like right on top of each other, and they
Speaker 2: punch at the same time. As the legendary Connor McGregor
Speaker 2: once said, timing beats speed, and precision beats power. But
Speaker 2: it shocked Brook to where he kind of didn't know
Speaker 2: where he was. And if you go watch it for
Speaker 2: people that haven't seen it, it's the knockdown before the
Speaker 2: stoppage for the official stoppage. That's one. Another one was
Speaker 2: Jose Benavitez Junior comes to town, comes to Omaha, Nebraska
Speaker 2: or abut Is from starts going to the barbershop, starts talking,
Speaker 2: starts talking crazy, right, but then he gets out there
Speaker 2: and fights really not to win, big respect to Jose
Speaker 2: and the whole family, but he's kind of on the
Speaker 2: back foot. It's hard to look great against these guys
Speaker 2: who don't really engage. He's just kind of jabbing, moving,
Speaker 2: shaking his head. Nope, And somehow, some way Bud found
Speaker 2: him in the twelfth round and put him out with
Speaker 2: a crazy upper cut sequence. Wild stuff. And again, do
Speaker 2: I think Canelo would have beaten kel Brook and Jose
Speaker 2: Benavitez Junior? Yes, I do, So you know we're not
Speaker 2: overlooking the task at hand. Another one was the Sean
Speaker 2: Porter stoppage. And there's a clip that any boxing fan knows,
Speaker 2: but it's going into the eleventh round. I believe maybe
Speaker 2: the tenth. I believe the eleventh Bud's corner says, we
Speaker 2: think he might be up on the cards. He wasn't,
Speaker 2: by the way Porter that is, and Bud. Bud looked
Speaker 2: really surprised, and he said he's up, and they said,
Speaker 2: you know, we think he might be up, and he
Speaker 2: said it again. He kind of said how and he
Speaker 2: looked at another member of his corner and he said
Speaker 2: he's up, and they said, Bud, it's time to go.
Speaker 2: Got him right out next round and it was an
Speaker 2: amazing sequence. He sort of faked a left upper cut
Speaker 2: then let it go. It was like really beautiful boxing,
Speaker 2: sublime skills. There was one knockdown. Reporter was genuinely, you know,
Speaker 2: shocked on the canvas. He looked at his corner, then
Speaker 2: he got up. Then there was another knockdown where they
Speaker 2: had a wild exchange in the center of the ring.
Speaker 2: That's where Porter started punching the canvas. It was a
Speaker 2: very kind of poignant moment. I guess you know, he
Speaker 2: fought his ass off. He's a legend, but it was
Speaker 2: just kind of like and his dad threw the toweling
Speaker 2: Kenny Porter in the corner. Did David Avenisian knockout in
Speaker 2: the center of the ring, a fairly unsung fighter, but again,
Speaker 2: this is an incredible display of power from in Cloak.
Speaker 2: They were off the clinch and he put him out
Speaker 2: close cold in the middle of the ring. This is
Speaker 2: when he went to another promotion BK Prime or whatever.
Speaker 2: It was a little bit odd, but that one was shocking.
Speaker 2: And of course Nick the aerrol Spence win in its entirety,
Speaker 2: but especially the little right uppercut he landed off the
Speaker 2: ropes in the seventh or eighth round. That's a shot
Speaker 2: where when you watch it you don't know what happened.
Speaker 2: Spence just went down. You have to run it back
Speaker 2: to see how crisp the timing was. This guy's throwing shots.
Speaker 2: When you think about throwing something, it's not the timing
Speaker 2: is impeccable, all right, I mean that was This is crazy.
Speaker 2: Shit going on with this guy is when all time
Speaker 2: great and people are so sleep like the bud disrespect
Speaker 2: has gotten wild. And listen, I will eat all these
Speaker 2: words if Canelo pieces them up and it's just another
Speaker 2: day at the office. But it's not gonna be. He
Speaker 2: might not be able to win or overcome the weight.
Speaker 2: But these guys that are acting like this isn't a
Speaker 2: generational talent who's already unified two divisions and jumping up
Speaker 2: two more to go for a third. What are we
Speaker 2: doing here? Okay, so a few things.
Speaker 1: Here that That's why I that Nick Shulman needs to
Speaker 1: be on these broadcasts.
Speaker 2: Any fight fan. There's millions of fight fans out there
Speaker 2: who can rattle off all those highlights too. But I
Speaker 2: love you, brother, thank you. I'm not trying to.
Speaker 1: I know I make you uncomfortable, But the point I'm
Speaker 1: making is, you're right. A lot of people, there's a
Speaker 1: lot of fucking people, bro, who know all the stats.
Speaker 1: I know, but I I'm I am, I am aware,
Speaker 1: but they can't deliver it the way I can. That
Speaker 1: was That was awesome. Here's my question before we go
Speaker 1: to the Canelo's side of things. It's actually a two
Speaker 1: part of the first one. Is this because I'm gonna
Speaker 1: show my own ignorant. Is it fair to say Madromov
Speaker 1: is not like a great fighter?
Speaker 2: No, No, that's unfair. Actually, okay, he is a great fighter,
Speaker 2: and I feel really sorry for whoever has to fight
Speaker 2: that kid off back to back losses to Crawford and
Speaker 2: Virgil Ortiz. That's the same Madromov who was a heralded
Speaker 2: amateur who Dimitri Beeval brought into camp to prepare for Canelo.
Speaker 2: And let me tell you something, nobody's gonna look good
Speaker 2: versus that guy. You might get the job done, but
Speaker 2: no one's gonna do that guy. Like so people love
Speaker 2: talking about that performance, like bud By the way bud
Speaker 2: pieced him up and clearly won and had to wait
Speaker 2: for Turkey Ala Sheik getting into the California Hall of Fame,
Speaker 2: eight different concerts, Strobe lights, a smoke show. It was
Speaker 2: a crazy delayed event. No problem. The game is the game.
Speaker 2: But let's not acct like he went out there and
Speaker 2: looked bad. I really that's not.
Speaker 1: Even that's not even why I was asking. And it's
Speaker 1: kind of why I was asking, But here was the point.
Speaker 1: So Madramov is a great fighter. He you know, back
Speaker 1: to back, tough, elite. He's very good. Very is reserved
Speaker 1: for Okay. Sure, but he's he's not a he's not
Speaker 1: a walkover. That's a real fight. But here is okay.
Speaker 1: Regardless of that, I'm just looking at timeline since the
Speaker 1: Spence fight, that's July of twenty three, Bud has fought
Speaker 1: Madromov and now he fights Canelo in that same time frame,
Speaker 1: I mean, Canelo has fought fought four has had four fights. Now.
Speaker 1: I guess there's two ways to look at that. One
Speaker 1: is Bud should be fresh and healthy and clean. But
Speaker 1: how much is it the fact that Canelo is just
Speaker 1: in the mix so much more, including fighting one of
Speaker 1: the Charlow brothers like you know, and fighting all of
Speaker 1: these unanimous decisions it's going the distance, Like, how much
Speaker 1: does that play into what what we could see Saturday night.
Speaker 2: It's a great point. It's very pertinent. Inactivity is an issue.
Speaker 2: But for a guy like this who not only lives
Speaker 2: in the gym, everybody that's been around this guy attests
Speaker 2: to that that's his happy place, that's where he relaxes
Speaker 2: in the gym. So this is a year round guy,
Speaker 2: much like a Mayweather who you know, unretired. And we
Speaker 2: saw what he did to Juan Manuel Marquez where people
Speaker 2: were thinking, we don't know. I think it was a
Speaker 2: fifteen month layoff, and you know, his boxing skills were
Speaker 2: just on full display. And also another thing about Bud,
Speaker 2: this guy's team is to me really special, starting with Bowmack,
Speaker 2: Brian McIntyre. He just seems so humble and so don't
Speaker 2: make it about me. And he said something that I
Speaker 2: thought was really beautiful. Terrence actually said this in an
Speaker 2: interview that when you know, he strolled into the gym
Speaker 2: as a kid and has never switched up same team.
Speaker 2: But as he was rising through the ranks, he went
Speaker 2: somewhere I don't remember where, but there there were other
Speaker 2: trainers there. I don't know if it was Olympic Trials
Speaker 2: or Golden Glove. I don't know what it was, but
Speaker 2: he said, Bomack said to him, listen, any exercises you
Speaker 2: pick up over there, any tactics, any new wrinkles to
Speaker 2: your game, you know, bring him back to the gym.
Speaker 2: Teach him to me because I'm still learning on the job,
Speaker 2: and he says it to this day. They're always trying
Speaker 2: to add little things to their game. Isau Dieguez another
Speaker 2: guy in his corner, wonderful story. Came from Guatemala, tried
Speaker 2: to make a better life for himself, tried to make
Speaker 2: it as a pro, struggle to get fights, had a
Speaker 2: little losing streak. He was in Cali, went to Omaha,
Speaker 2: met Brian McIntyre, Bomack, They struggled. It was, you know,
Speaker 2: the grind was real. And then in walked fourteen year
Speaker 2: old Bud Crawford. And there's another guy in his team,
Speaker 2: Red Spikes. And again you can see interviews with all
Speaker 2: these guys. They're never there's no ego there. These are
Speaker 2: students of the game. So inactivity is an issue for
Speaker 2: me more for the guys who they're in camp, they
Speaker 2: fight and then they're partying, or then they're on vacation.
Speaker 2: A lot of boxers, because it's a vicious sport in
Speaker 2: life happens, you know, like it's we're human beings, end
Speaker 2: of the day. But this guy has wanted to be
Speaker 2: a world champion since he was a kid, and he's
Speaker 2: been unwavering in this pursuit. That's real you know that
Speaker 2: that's real life and he's coming. So I don't think
Speaker 2: it matters that much here, but it's it is an issue.
Speaker 1: All right, Let's talk Canelo before we get to how
Speaker 1: the fight. I mean, it's obvious you know what side
Speaker 1: you're going, but how the fight you see it playing out? Specifically,
Speaker 1: because Canelo's a legend in his own right and Canelo
Speaker 1: is the guy who is going to be I think
Speaker 1: it's fair to say more comfortable, not because Bud's not
Speaker 1: used to spotlight, but because Canelo is not the one
Speaker 1: having to change weight glasses. What again, I'm gonna go,
Speaker 1: as I was saying before, die hard boxing fans are
Speaker 1: gonna love this either way. So for the casual fans,
Speaker 1: how did Canelo Alvarez become Canelo Alvarez? Like? Why is
Speaker 1: he a legend?
Speaker 2: So Canelo, Hi, sweetheart, Hi baby.
Speaker 1: She can definitely stop by. Both of my daughters have
Speaker 1: co hosts.
Speaker 2: You want to she wants to goodness, you want to
Speaker 2: come say high for one second? Baby on anything?
Speaker 1: Okay, well well then don't.
Speaker 2: Maybe I'm on CV right now. You know what I mean.
Speaker 2: I love you so much, mama, All right, Uh, Canelo
Speaker 2: Canelo has been a superstar, uh for a long time,
Speaker 2: just just just has it. But he turned pro at fifteen,
Speaker 2: you know, which is insane. Obviously, he has the looks,
Speaker 2: he has the charm, and he's an unbelievable fighter who's
Speaker 2: fought everybody. His style is so cool. He's like he's
Speaker 2: become a pressure sort of power puncher. But he used
Speaker 2: to be a slick boxer, kind of incorporating all the elements.
Speaker 2: But this guy's put on major fights now for fifteen
Speaker 2: years and he's a global superstar. He's an icon, you know,
Speaker 2: I don't I mean, we could run through all his moments. No, no,
Speaker 2: you know, we don't.
Speaker 1: Have to do that. But is there what is the
Speaker 1: is there? Is it legitimate to worry that he's obvious? Well, again,
Speaker 1: tell me if I'm saying, yeah, please, it's fair to say.
Speaker 1: I think clearly he's not in his prime at this point?
Speaker 1: Is it fair? And tell if you disagree, tell me
Speaker 1: is it fair to say? The question is how far
Speaker 1: down from his prime he is? And if you had
Speaker 1: to answer that question, like where would you put him?
Speaker 2: You know, it's a little bit tricky for me. I
Speaker 2: think about when he fought John Ryder, I think in
Speaker 2: Mexico City. Now is the first time I ever watched,
Speaker 2: and I said, man, you know, he looks a little
Speaker 2: bit stuck in the mudd. He looks just a little
Speaker 2: bit slower. But he keeps beating guys outside of BEV Hall.
Speaker 2: And one thing I'll say, I do think sometimes he
Speaker 2: will do just enough. Now, when he fought Charlow, Charlo
Speaker 2: wasn't really engaging. If we're racking up the rounds, getting
Speaker 2: out of their unscathed and home to our families. You know,
Speaker 2: I'm talking like I'm in there, but like what you like,
Speaker 2: you can't really fault him for that. When he fought
Speaker 2: Edgar Berlanga, he had a really sweet knockdown, caught him
Speaker 2: with the left hook. It was like the shot came
Speaker 2: out of nowhere fast. But then he just sort of
Speaker 2: he gassed a little. He did his thing, you know
Speaker 2: what I mean, one one, eighteen one ten. And still
Speaker 2: when he fought what's the guy's name, how Mungbia himI
Speaker 2: Mungbi Yeah again, Yeah, it's kind of like you felt
Speaker 2: like he could get the stoppage. Mungia then lost to
Speaker 2: an Italian dude with a job. I think the guy
Speaker 2: is like a teacher or a soccer coach, like something
Speaker 2: like a nine to five nick and it's kind of like, Okay,
Speaker 2: that didn't age particularly well, but he got the job.
Speaker 2: And his last outing against William Skull, he was struggling
Speaker 2: to sort of cut the ring off. Listen, He's in
Speaker 2: Saudi Arabia, and again he took no damage. He came
Speaker 2: out of there with a win. But to answer your question,
Speaker 2: he doesn't look like prime Canelo to me, but he's
Speaker 2: very intelligent. He interviews. Every time I sleep on him.
Speaker 2: I find everything he's saying is very smart and sharp
Speaker 2: and calculated. And you know, I believe he will be
Speaker 2: prepared to the utmost for this fight. And I don't
Speaker 2: think he's sleeping on Crawford. But yeah, I wonder after
Speaker 2: sixty five professional fights, sixty seven, you know, you never know.
Speaker 2: I mean, father Time is undefeated.
Speaker 1: Well, what's weird is Crawford's older. Crawford's like older but younger,
Speaker 1: way exactly right, That's what I was gonna say it.
Speaker 1: Crawford is older biologically, but seems to be the younger
Speaker 1: as a fighter. And I think that's and again maybe
Speaker 1: that's too simplistic. That's my view of it. I what
Speaker 1: is the Are they splitting two hundred million?
Speaker 2: I would have to think, uh Saoul is getting a
Speaker 2: little bit more, you know.
Speaker 1: Oh no, I don't mean even split. But I'm saying,
Speaker 1: like the purse doesn't have this exactly right. I figured
Speaker 1: you might like, is it is it realistic that Canelo
Speaker 1: could be getting a hundred million and Bud could be
Speaker 1: getting fifty million respectively minimum for this fight.
Speaker 2: I don't know, because we're in unprecedented times where this
Speaker 2: guy Turkey Alaschik has come in with you know, uh
Speaker 2: big paper from Saudi Arabia, and he genuinely loves the sport.
Speaker 2: And you know what, I was hating on him a
Speaker 2: little bit in the big and there's some things that
Speaker 2: I still found a little bit unsettling. But end of
Speaker 2: the day, he is putting on immaculate fights and shows
Speaker 2: and there does seem to be some integrity there as
Speaker 2: far as let's give the people what they want to see,
Speaker 2: and you know, hopefully the judging and so on and
Speaker 2: so forth is as legit as we can hope. For now,
Speaker 2: we have Dana White in there promoting his first fight.
Speaker 2: He's in there.
Speaker 1: I don't I don't.
Speaker 2: Love that I don't really love it either, And I
Speaker 2: know I heard something today that he's that they're not
Speaker 2: allowing these guys from the sanctioning bodies. You know, the WBA, WBO, IBC.
Speaker 2: You always get chills when you when they start rattling
Speaker 2: off the eighty belts, like he's the former unified WBA, like,
Speaker 2: but now I'm here in white, is not allowing Mauricio
Speaker 2: Suliman into the ring. Mauricio is a you know, a
Speaker 2: Mexican running one of the sanctioning but I don't know,
Speaker 2: it's all getting messy and strange, and I don't I
Speaker 2: kind of like the hood element of boxing, but something
Speaker 2: that when I say hood, I just mean, you know, yeah,
Speaker 2: the streets are involved in this sport, but I want
Speaker 2: it to be fair. But some polymolognology brought up a
Speaker 2: great point that having multiple world titles gives more contenders
Speaker 2: a shot. You know, if you only have one belt,
Speaker 2: it's very very hard to ever contend for it, but
Speaker 2: when you have multiple, then figure it out. For for
Speaker 2: a unified undisputed champion. It kind of has some flavor
Speaker 2: the four belt era. You know, I don't hate it,
Speaker 2: but anyway, it's complicated, Nick, I don't know what they're making,
Speaker 2: but it's a lot, a lot.
Speaker 1: It's it's a lot, lot and it is again I'm
Speaker 1: gonna I'm throwing stuff at you.
Speaker 2: We didn't talk about.
Speaker 1: But I if I were to say, in the last
Speaker 1: decade ish the biggest fights that you can count on
Speaker 1: one hand are what I think, it's pretty definitive. This
Speaker 1: is one of them. But it's like, like, what are
Speaker 1: this is in line with? You know, give me a
Speaker 1: couple other fights as far as the anticipation, not necessarily
Speaker 1: perse but all of it that goes into it. This
Speaker 1: is equivalent or bigger or similar to gimme a couple
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Speaker 2: I mean Mayweather Paco. So it's interesting from a purest standpoint, again,
Speaker 2: not to be potential, That's what I mean. That's what
Speaker 2: I'm asking, you know what I mean, Like, from a
Speaker 2: purest standpoint, this is this right, from a purest standpoint,
Speaker 2: this is up there with anything that I think any
Speaker 2: boxing fan can recall in quite a while.
Speaker 1: So that's where I was asking.
Speaker 2: So like when we but even person wise, they're saying
Speaker 2: this is there's Mayweather pack you Mayweather McGregor, and then
Speaker 2: this as far as Gate and everything I've heard that
Speaker 2: you know, you never know what's real and what's not.
Speaker 2: But this is up there with Tyson, with Tyson Holyfield,
Speaker 2: This is up there with uh uh Canelo Floyd. This
Speaker 2: is up there with Canelo Triple G one, which Canelo lost,
Speaker 2: by the way, gifted a draw. Then this is up
Speaker 2: there with Canelo Triple G two, which he lost again.
Speaker 2: He he outperformed expectation. Did he back triple g up
Speaker 2: for the first time in his career? Yes? Was he was?
Speaker 2: He swaggy with it and his hands were low and
Speaker 2: he's shaking his head. Nope and exchanging with one of
Speaker 2: the scariest punchers in the history of boxing. Yes. Do
Speaker 2: I feel he lost seven rounds? Absolutely, but you know
Speaker 2: it is what it is. Did you know, Nick, you
Speaker 2: just could tell you could feel the residual anger.
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, it does feel like there's at least a
Speaker 1: touch of bitterness.
Speaker 2: Mayweather de la Joya when Mayweather came out not only
Speaker 2: with fifty cent but the Mexican colored robe and the sombrero.
Speaker 2: You know, yeah, this is up there with these moments.
Speaker 2: And let's of course not forget some of the show's
Speaker 2: packing out put on and I mean, you know, oo
Speaker 2: sick fury like there have been some huge fights. This
Speaker 2: is up there with any of them.
Speaker 1: Okay, I'm gonna ask if Canelo wins, it looks like
Speaker 1: what If Crawford wins, it looks like what? And I
Speaker 1: was going to have my third question, b and you
Speaker 1: think it's going to look like what? But I think
Speaker 1: my second and third question the answers are the same.
Speaker 1: But if Canelo wins it, how does it play out?
Speaker 2: So I could see Canelo winning with sublime skills and
Speaker 2: reminding everybody what time it is. And if you were
Speaker 2: asleep on him, that was your mistake. And he's still
Speaker 2: Canelo and this and that. Could he hurt and stop
Speaker 2: Terrence Crawford? I guess, man, I guess it's possible. You know,
Speaker 2: I don't see it, but he is the smaller man,
Speaker 2: not in a literal sense. He actually has a longer reach,
Speaker 2: and he's a little bit taller, but Canelo's beefier, he's thicker,
Speaker 2: he has a bigger frame, and he's more naturally filled
Speaker 2: out at this weight, and he's been in there with
Speaker 2: some huge punchers and he seems very very hard to
Speaker 2: hurt all time. Chin. I could see Canelo, I suppose
Speaker 2: backing Bud down and just wailing on him with huge
Speaker 2: shots and showing his craftiness and either just winning a
Speaker 2: somewhat clear decision where budd Is is wounded in there
Speaker 2: at some point and it just that's how it shakes out,
Speaker 2: or I guess even getting the stoppage if Bud wins hold.
Speaker 1: On real quick. I want to stop you real quick,
Speaker 1: if some and again, I want to make this incredibly clear.
Speaker 1: It is very important to Nick that nobody think he's
Speaker 1: trying to be a tout. As he made it clear. Oh,
Speaker 1: it's the opposite, very important to me, right, it is
Speaker 1: very important and to me that I want to respect
Speaker 1: Nick's wishes that he is not a tout and he
Speaker 1: is not trying to be, while also I want to
Speaker 1: get his picks. So it's a bit of a yeah,
Speaker 1: the audience understand. So I am the one presenting this.
Speaker 1: If someone were going it sounds to me that if
Speaker 1: someone's like, I'm fucking betting Canelo, would you like betting
Speaker 1: him to win by decision would.
Speaker 2: Be the way you would bet it, you know something
Speaker 2: generally not even no, No, it's a great, No, it's
Speaker 2: a great it's a great question. I mean you have
Speaker 2: to shop around, you know, there are so many different
Speaker 2: outs and bookies and legal accounts and ways to get down.
Speaker 2: So number one, I would say, look for the best price.
Speaker 2: If you think Canel is gonna win by decision, try
Speaker 2: to shop around. Maybe you get uh, I don't know
Speaker 2: what that is. That feels like it's probably like that
Speaker 2: might even be a small dog because the knockout is
Speaker 2: on the table as well, or maybe it's pick him ish, but.
Speaker 1: I'm looking it up. So our lines, yeah, I agree
Speaker 1: with Nick. Our lines are provided by our friends at
Speaker 1: hard Rock Bet. But the I think it's like plus
Speaker 1: one twenty five.
Speaker 2: There you go. So what I was going to say.
Speaker 2: And you know, I don't know if hard Rock bet
Speaker 2: will appreciate this, but generally those props, they the bookies
Speaker 2: and the geniuses they hire in the back office kind
Speaker 2: of know how to present a problem that's hard to solve.
Speaker 2: You can find value in props.
Speaker 1: You know.
Speaker 2: One of my biggest wins ever was a UFC fight
Speaker 2: where I bet a guy would win by sub like
Speaker 2: plus twenty eight hundred. It was glorious.
Speaker 1: You know.
Speaker 2: By the way, I'm on a huge UFC rip, but
Speaker 2: it doesn't wow. You know. It's about time.
Speaker 1: It's about time, and on a hard rock bet. Here
Speaker 1: here's just what it is. If you want to bet Canelo.
Speaker 1: Canelo's straight to win is minus one sixty five. Canelo
Speaker 1: by knockout, technical knockout ordqu is plus three point fifty.
Speaker 1: Canelo by decision is plus one thirty. So that's Look,
Speaker 1: there's a lot of as you have.
Speaker 2: There's a lot of fans out there who've watched all
Speaker 2: his fights, and a lot of people watching this now.
Speaker 2: You know, I get that boxing isn't your main thing,
Speaker 2: but you know you you definitely have a lot of
Speaker 2: boxing heads out there. So it's really hard to say
Speaker 2: if you feel the size imposition will be so dramatic
Speaker 2: for Bud to handle, you know, bet him to win
Speaker 2: by knockout. I think Terrence is going to take his time,
Speaker 2: find his openings and beat the brakes off him with
Speaker 2: respect and love to anybody that steps in the ring.
Speaker 2: And I think Bud is live for the stoppage, which
Speaker 2: is something like ten to one. No one thinks it's possible.
Speaker 2: I do. I think he could land something that Canelo
Speaker 2: does not see, shock him from the head down to
Speaker 2: the toes, hit him with something crazy, and I really
Speaker 2: do believe that that Terrence is live to stop Canelo.
Speaker 2: But the most likely situation I see in my heart.
Speaker 2: And obviously I'm a super fan of Terrance. Obviously I'm biased.
Speaker 2: I love this guy. I can't see you know what
Speaker 2: I mean. Like, I'm a huge fan, so it you
Speaker 2: gotta be careful betting with your heart. And like I said,
Speaker 2: that wasn't a joke. You know, combat sports is different
Speaker 2: than team sports. Sure, maybe you bet the Chiefs every
Speaker 2: game because you love the Chiefs.
Speaker 1: No, I actually don't. I just will never bet against them.
Speaker 2: You'll never bet against them. Cool for me with Bud, though, Like,
Speaker 2: this wasn't a This isn't a joke. Like I at
Speaker 2: some point my brain switched on to I'm just never
Speaker 2: betting against this guy. No, it's not the most sophisticated theory,
Speaker 2: but I've believed for a long time that he's the
Speaker 2: best guy in the world. So you know, it all
Speaker 2: leads to this moment. But it's very interesting and the
Speaker 2: betting market, if I can, if I may the market
Speaker 2: for this, and I wonder how often you think about
Speaker 2: this in football or whatever it may be. But for
Speaker 2: this particular fight, conventional wisdom says Canelo's too big. It
Speaker 2: says that this is too tall of an order. In
Speaker 2: addition to which Canelo is an icon, he's a true
Speaker 2: household name, and Terence Crawford is like a little bit
Speaker 2: Niche still if you go up to people who don't
Speaker 2: follow boxing, it's me. Yet he hasn't fully crossed over
Speaker 2: and yet Canelo is less than a two to one favorite.
Speaker 2: I don't quite understand it, and it just feels to
Speaker 2: me like the streets might be talking or something. You know,
Speaker 2: some big players might be doing some things. But I
Speaker 2: will tell you this, my mark. I am not a trader.
Speaker 2: I'm not a finance guy, and my market analysis historically
Speaker 2: has been rather shaky. I've come with some theories and
Speaker 2: they don't always pan out. But I'm a little confused
Speaker 2: by this line.
Speaker 1: Well, so this is you brought us to, and we're
Speaker 1: going twice as long as I told you we would,
Speaker 1: so I'll wrap this up quickly soon. But you brought
Speaker 1: us to what was for good or for bad? What
Speaker 1: is like an element of boxing, which is who's if
Speaker 1: the fights goes to the cards and it's a true
Speaker 1: coin flip, is there a which of the two fighters
Speaker 1: is it better for let's just call it Vegas to
Speaker 1: be the winner.
Speaker 2: Well, I'm not sure. I'm not sure, But one thing
Speaker 2: I do know is there's an old adage you can't
Speaker 2: beat Canelo in Vegas. You don't want to go to
Speaker 2: the cards with Canelo. What about the there is Londi
Speaker 2: Laura fight where he landed eight head shots and by
Speaker 2: the way, I still think he won the fight because
Speaker 2: Laura was so on his bike, but it certainly was
Speaker 2: was nuanced. It's certain he landed eight shots to the
Speaker 2: dome Nick eight and one on decision and one on
Speaker 2: the points. What about C J. Ross who had Canelo
Speaker 2: Mayweather one fourteen one fourteen Floyd won thirteen rounds of
Speaker 2: a twelve round fight. Yeah, what happened there? So I
Speaker 2: don't want to get too into what might be going
Speaker 2: on with that situation, because you know, I mean, but
Speaker 2: we can all speculate as to why it has seemed
Speaker 2: very hard to beat Canelo on the cards, and there
Speaker 2: have been many cards that have come in where it's
Speaker 2: that sort of feeling in your stomach.
Speaker 1: But bud just has to maybe Budges has to win
Speaker 1: in a stoppage.
Speaker 2: I'm feeling the changing of the tides. I'm feeling like integrity.
Speaker 2: Might you know? And again we'll see, we don't only
Speaker 2: they know how this is going to go.
Speaker 1: But yeah, right, do you can you before you go?
Speaker 1: And I'm obviously I would never publicly maybe privately, but
Speaker 1: I would never publicly ask you for bet amounts. But
Speaker 1: can you tell us your journey of betting this fight,
Speaker 1: because it's hard for me to believe it was one time,
Speaker 1: one ticket, one trip to the window.
Speaker 2: No, honestly, I've only made one bet so far on
Speaker 2: this fight. It it uh, it's on my mind. I
Speaker 2: want it to take a real amount of money. Yeah,
Speaker 2: it's an amount of money. But my theory on this
Speaker 2: so I refresh the line for this one for two
Speaker 2: weeks now every five to eight minutes. You know, I'm
Speaker 2: prone to rumination. I have some neurotic tendencies that can
Speaker 2: turn on me at times, but also as a gift
Speaker 2: and a curse, you know, and I've accepted myself, but
Speaker 2: one of them for something like this is constantly refreshing line.
Speaker 2: My theory is that on Mexican Independence Weekend, one of
Speaker 2: the biggest fights ever at Allegiant Stadium, a lot of
Speaker 2: Mexicans are going to come to town and start firing Canelo.
Speaker 2: So my theory, which is not particularly advanced, is that
Speaker 2: if you want to bet Bud, conventional wisdom might be
Speaker 2: to wait. So I'm eyeing it. I'd love to get
Speaker 2: Bud at something like two to one would just be delightful. However,
Speaker 2: I think.
Speaker 1: It's right now. In the short term, it's moved a
Speaker 1: little bit against you.
Speaker 2: If it's it will by against me, you mean kind
Speaker 2: of with me, but against what I want to get you.
Speaker 2: But if I'm seeing those tendencies, I'm gonna come in again,
Speaker 2: probably pretty soon. And and like I said, you know,
Speaker 2: I'm not a market expert, but I've done this enough
Speaker 2: for a long time. I tend to have some decent
Speaker 2: ideas about where the lines are going to end up.
Speaker 2: So that was my idea. We'll see, And I also
Speaker 2: have some bud By stoppage a little better than ten
Speaker 2: to one. That would be an evening what a needs mercy, That.
Speaker 1: Would be That would my His name is Nick Shulman.
Speaker 1: He was a first ballot Poker Hall of Famer. He's
Speaker 1: seven seven time World Series of Poker Bracelet winner. He
Speaker 1: is universally regarded as America's favorite poker commentator. He one
Speaker 1: day will be regarded as one of the best boxing
Speaker 1: commentators out there, if I have anything say about it.
Speaker 1: It is an honor and a privilege to uh call
Speaker 1: him my friend. And when it's not football season, I
Speaker 1: get to spend a lot of time with him in Vegas.
Speaker 1: When it is football season. We text about other people's
Speaker 1: losing football bets and our own gambling weekends. Nick, I
Speaker 1: appreciate you. You have made me if I wasn't already
Speaker 1: heavily invested in Terrence Bud Crawford winning. He's a Midwestern
Speaker 1: kid like me. Uh, is there anything I would imagine?
Speaker 1: I don't know. Is there anything that you don't you
Speaker 1: want to promote, you want to tell the audience about
Speaker 1: anyone you want to shout out before we go? Any
Speaker 1: other final thoughts about the fight? Anything?
Speaker 2: Uh? No final thoughts. You know Naolia in a way
Speaker 2: fights this weekend two put eyes on him. He's arguably
Speaker 2: the best fighter in the world. And uh, you know,
Speaker 2: it's a true honor to be on your platform. You know,
Speaker 2: I really appreciate it. And I just want to say
Speaker 2: when we were kicking it in Vegas and you were
Speaker 2: getting all sorts of love left and right, it's touching
Speaker 2: how real you keep it and how you know nice
Speaker 2: you are to every single person that comes up to you,
Speaker 2: DAPs you up. You're the same way off the air
Speaker 2: and that that touched me. You know that's what it's
Speaker 2: all about.
Speaker 1: Man.
Speaker 2: Thanks, thank you so much for.
Speaker 1: That tried to the one guy who.
Speaker 2: Said Lebron you know who did that stuff?
Speaker 1: That was like wanted to fight me?
Speaker 2: No, that was that was a lot then a I.
Speaker 1: Think it's fair to say a half drunk Scott sever
Speaker 1: almost tackled it.
Speaker 2: Yeah, Scotty, you don't want to you don't want Scotty,
Speaker 2: but you know, aside from that gentleman and he just
Speaker 2: sort of dropped it almost like you know, like I'll
Speaker 2: see you outside. It's just kind of like it was
Speaker 2: like all right, but yeah, all right, man, have a
Speaker 2: great trip.
Speaker 1: Thank you so much to absolutely give my best to
Speaker 1: the family and appreciate you coming on. And we'll be
Speaker 1: back on what's right on Monday or Tuesday, pending what
Speaker 1: happened to football this week, and see you guys. Letter.
Speaker 2: We'll try later, Bro