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Speaker 1: Hey guys, thanks for listening to Breaking Points with Crystal

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Speaker 1: and Sager. We're going to be totally upfront with you.

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Speaker 1: We took a big risk going independent to make this work.

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Speaker 1: We need your support to beat the corporate media CNN, Fox, MSNBC.

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Speaker 1: They are ripping this country apart. They are making millions

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Speaker 1: of dollars doing it. To help support our mission of

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Speaker 1: making us all hate each other less and hate the

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Speaker 1: corrupt ruling class more, we need you to support the

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Speaker 1: show by becoming a Breaking Points Premium member today. You

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Speaker 1: get to watch and listen to the entire show ad

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Speaker 1: free and uncut, an hour early before everyone else. You

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Speaker 1: get to hear our reactions to each other's monologues, participate

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Speaker 1: and weekly ask me any things, and you don't need

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Speaker 1: to hear our annoying voices pitching you like I am

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Speaker 1: right now. So what are you waiting for? Go to

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Speaker 1: Crystalandsager dot com to become a Premium member today, which

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Speaker 1: is available in the show notes. We love you, guys,

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Speaker 1: enjoy the show. Good morning, everybody, Happy Monday. Welcome to

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Speaker 1: Breaking Points with Crystal and Sager. We have an amazing

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Speaker 1: show for everybody today. I miss saying that crystalk. I know,

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Speaker 1: indeed we do. Guys, super excited, Welcome Breaking Points. Can't

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Speaker 1: tell you how hard we've been working to get all

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Speaker 1: of this together, how excited we are. I'm actually feel

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Speaker 1: like a little nervous this morning, So you have to

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Speaker 1: forgive us for all of that. Just give you a

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Speaker 1: little bit of a sort of rundown of tour of

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Speaker 1: how we're going to be doing the show. You can

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Speaker 1: see we've got this new graphic along the side that

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Speaker 1: kind of gives you a guide post to the type

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Speaker 1: of stories that we're going to be covering today. So

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Speaker 1: we've got a little intro for you this morning. We're

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Speaker 1: going to look at a dem autopsy and some warning

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Speaker 1: signs for them, Trump's Facebook band, the New York City

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Speaker 1: mayoral race, Sager's Breaking Points, new name for our monologues,

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Speaker 1: my Breaking Points. We've got the one and only Glenn

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Speaker 1: Greenwald on. He's gonna address some of the attempts to

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Speaker 1: smear him and also talk about the media, so you

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Speaker 1: know you don't want to miss that. What are we

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Speaker 1: doing here? What is sort of the ethos of what

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Speaker 1: the show are? What are we doing? Why am I

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Speaker 1: on this beautiful new set, this beautiful, really well designed desk.

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Speaker 1: We what are we doing that? I love this desk.

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Speaker 1: I always will listen what we're trying to do here.

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Speaker 1: We said this in our mission statement, we said this

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Speaker 1: whenever we announced, which is that we truly believe in

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Speaker 1: making everybody really hate each other lesson hate the corrupt

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Speaker 1: ruling class more. And I don't think there's ever been

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Speaker 1: a more politically charged time in America. Yes, January sixth

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Speaker 1: and all that happened, that was like the high water mark,

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Speaker 1: if you will, But the scars of all of that

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Speaker 1: are with us, and the Biden presidency is now as

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Speaker 1: sclerotic as I think both of you and I predicted,

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Speaker 1: and there's just this empty rot which we're constantly fighting

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Speaker 1: over and asking questions about what comes next, and nobody

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Speaker 1: who works in politics or in the media seems to know.

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Speaker 1: These people are all reporting on January sixth commissions as

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Speaker 1: if that's going to solve everything. We need to be

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Speaker 1: focused on what's actually breaking a part in this country,

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Speaker 1: and I think that that is the core ethos of

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Speaker 1: the show. We want to tell people what the media

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Speaker 1: is not going to tell them. We want to take

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Speaker 1: them behind the scenes about how elite corruption works and

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Speaker 1: really just connect it to the lived experience of your

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Speaker 1: day to day life. People know they're being lied to,

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Speaker 1: they know that the system is rigged, they do not

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Speaker 1: know and have the ability to articulate why. And I

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Speaker 1: really see that as the overall mission of what we're

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Speaker 1: trying to do here. You know, we want to take

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Speaker 1: the pieces of Rising that you all really responded to

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Speaker 1: and that we thought were really important, and honestly, over

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Speaker 1: the course of Rising it went through a few different

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Speaker 1: evolutions and iterations. It had different focuses at different times,

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Speaker 1: but one through line was those sort of breaking points

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Speaker 1: that underlie all of what's happening, whether it's in our

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Speaker 1: political system, whether it's in housing, whether it's in the

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Speaker 1: rise of sort of conspiracy theories. All of these things

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Speaker 1: are happening underneath the surface, and you know that that's

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Speaker 1: going on, and yet no one is speaking to them

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Speaker 1: in the media. And it's wild. You know, we say

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Speaker 1: this thing about hate each other less and hate the

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Speaker 1: elite more, and as you were just saying it right now,

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Speaker 1: it's sort of mind blowing that that's the exact opposite

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Speaker 1: of what most media. Most media. Most media is literally

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Speaker 1: about making us hate each other and love the elites.

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Speaker 1: Like that's the message that's being pushed time and time again.

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Speaker 1: So when you see these metrics that show trust in

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Speaker 1: the media declining and declining and declining, it's because people

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Speaker 1: sense that and they really resistant it doesn't reflect what

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Speaker 1: they're seeing in their daily life. So we want to

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Speaker 1: bring you know. The other thing that you always told

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Speaker 1: us you really responded to on Rising was the high

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Speaker 1: level of production. I want to say thank you to

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Speaker 1: everybody who's already subscribed as a premium member ten dollars

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Speaker 1: a month. You get the whole thing uncut in your inbox,

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Speaker 1: the full entire show early. Yeah. We also though if

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Speaker 1: that's out of your reach, like guys, really don't worry

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Speaker 1: about it. The clips are going to be up on YouTube.

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Speaker 1: The audio is going to be free with breaks anywhere

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Speaker 1: that you get normal pod cast. By the way, that

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Speaker 1: was one of the top comments we would always get

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Speaker 1: on Rising, Its like where's the podcast? I can't we

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Speaker 1: listen to this as audio? Now you're going to be

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Speaker 1: able to get that, And look, we really want to

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Speaker 1: look forward. We have our reasons for leaving the Hill,

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Speaker 1: but the bottom line is this is more true to

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Speaker 1: our values. We believed in you guys. We thought that

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Speaker 1: this was important to you and that you would give

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Speaker 1: us the support necessary to continue the production values and

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Speaker 1: the type of product that we want to put out

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Speaker 1: into the world that you all have told us has

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Speaker 1: been very impactful and you've really really showed up for

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Speaker 1: us as we sort of like stepped into the breach.

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Speaker 1: So guys, thank you, thank you, thank you, and we're

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Speaker 1: so excited to be able to do this show with

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Speaker 1: any out any sort of like corporate anything. It's just

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Speaker 1: totally reliant on you all. I couldn't be more excited

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Speaker 1: and I'm blown away. I mean, this is a final

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Speaker 1: message to the suits, which is that we don't need you,

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Speaker 1: which is that we have of enough people believe in

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Speaker 1: your product. You can make something happen. And because of

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Speaker 1: all the premium subscribers, we are going to be able

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Speaker 1: to do this, and more importantly, we are going to

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Speaker 1: be able to continually improve. So we heard your feedback

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Speaker 1: which was that the audio wasn't at the level where

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Speaker 1: you guys want. So because of you, guys, we were

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Speaker 1: able to hire an audio person who is here on

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Speaker 1: the set who's going to be helping and if you

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Speaker 1: have any more feedback, I'll send it over to him

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Speaker 1: and I'll be like, what's going on here, man, I'm

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Speaker 1: just kidding. Look, really, what it is is that over

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Speaker 1: the next several months, as we get the feel of

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Speaker 1: the show and all that, we are going to make

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Speaker 1: continuous improvements. And that's all that we're trying to do here.

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Speaker 1: We did not expect to be able to do this

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Speaker 1: at the level of what we are at right now,

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Speaker 1: and the ability of us, I think, to try and

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Speaker 1: actually have a chance now to fulfill our mission. I

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Speaker 1: am just absolutely blown away. Also, can we address the

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Speaker 1: elephant in the room? Well, I was just saying exactly that,

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Speaker 1: which is a lot of consternation online about this one.

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Speaker 1: We did switch side, and what it really comes from

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Speaker 1: is a deep meditation on we want to get out

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Speaker 1: of this partisan left right mindset, which no, just kidding.

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Speaker 1: We just literally sat at these seats when we got

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Speaker 1: on the set to start with, and now we're because

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Speaker 1: we've done rehearsals in these seats, we're sort of attached

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Speaker 1: to them. So you guys are all gonna have to

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Speaker 1: relax and get used to Mommy and Daddy being on

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Speaker 1: the different size of the table. I promise it's gonna

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Speaker 1: be the emotional connection some of you have to MYE

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Speaker 1: really fun, unbelievable. Yeah, truly. I also loved in the

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Speaker 1: videos we released last week, they noted are my I

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Speaker 1: still had like the goo from the hills is a

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Speaker 1: metaphor that. Yeah. But now we got nice new breaking

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Speaker 1: Points stickers, and I should mention we have lovely breaking

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Speaker 1: Points smugs which are both Union made and Maine in America,

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Speaker 1: and we'll give you guys details about where you can

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Speaker 1: get those and all all of the products that you know,

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Speaker 1: any merchandise we do. We're really committed to also sharing

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Speaker 1: and reflecting our values. So union made and American made,

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Speaker 1: but everything we ever produce will be Union made and

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Speaker 1: made in America. Are solemn pledge to all of you.

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Speaker 1: But I think that it is time to get to

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Speaker 1: some of the news. So Democrats warning, let's go ahead

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Speaker 1: and do that. We'll cue the directors there in the

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Speaker 1: control room. What are we looking at? Okay, So there's

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Speaker 1: a new big autopsy ound about the Democratic Party and

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Speaker 1: how they fared in twenty twenty. And it's sort of

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Speaker 1: a weird thing because Democrats won the White House. They

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Speaker 1: won the Senate. They maintained control of the House, but

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Speaker 1: it's still seen as like they wildly underperformed expectations, which

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Speaker 1: they did. So a number of groups got together and

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Speaker 1: went through to say like, Okay, here's what went wrong,

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Speaker 1: and here are the warning signs for the future. Let's

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Speaker 1: say this New York Times haar sheet up there on

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Speaker 1: the screen. And basically, first of all, you need to

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Speaker 1: know that one of the groups that was most involved

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Speaker 1: with this was Third Way centristing tank. They hate the left.

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Speaker 1: They take every opportunity that they can to trash the left.

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Speaker 1: So keep in mind when you're reading the details here

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Speaker 1: that there's like an ideological agenda behind it, and keeping

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Speaker 1: with that, some of what they say is useful and

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Speaker 1: some of it is clearly very ideologically motivated. So here

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Speaker 1: where there's sort of top findings. Number One, voters of

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Speaker 1: color are persuasion voters who need to be convinced. And

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Speaker 1: this to me was maybe like the biggest takeaway is

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Speaker 1: that Democrats were assuming that minority voters were just automatically

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Speaker 1: in their camp and all they needed to do was

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Speaker 1: worry about turning them out. So there was no persuasion pitch,

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Speaker 1: there was no effort to actually go into these communities

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Speaker 1: and be like, here's why you should vote for Joe Biden,

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Speaker 1: here's why you should vote for the Democratic Party. They

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Speaker 1: just took these voters for granted. That's the bottom line,

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Speaker 1: which does reflect what Chuck Roach has been telling us

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Speaker 1: forever about the total underinvestment in Latino communities. And what

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Speaker 1: they also came up with was that no brainer. Democrats

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Speaker 1: lacked an economic pitch that was effective. They didn't lean in.

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Speaker 1: They leaned too much into just like Trump is bad messaging,

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Speaker 1: which everybody can judge for themselves and could experience and

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Speaker 1: witness for themselves whether the how ever they felt about

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Speaker 1: Donald Trump. And so the fact that there wasn't a

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Speaker 1: coherent economic message meant that Republicans were effective at portraying

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Speaker 1: Democrats as like the Party of lockdowns, that they just

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Speaker 1: want to keep you in your house forever and keep

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Speaker 1: the schools closed and keep your masks on, et cetera,

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Speaker 1: et cetera, et cetera. The part where I where they

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Speaker 1: it's funny because most of the report is very data driven. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: and they've got all these charts and here's the turnout

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Speaker 1: percentage in all of this, and then the part where

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Speaker 1: they're like, oh, it was all the left's fault, it's

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Speaker 1: all anecdotal. It's like, you know, we asked Abigail Spanberger

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Speaker 1: and she said it's the left's fault. Right. I also

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Speaker 1: would say, though, and we've talked about this before, there's

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Speaker 1: no ability to distinguish between the sort of like economic

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Speaker 1: left policy and the cultural left. And look, I'm from

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Speaker 1: a values perspective. I'm totally aligned with both the economic

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Speaker 1: and cultural left. But if you just look at the

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Speaker 1: polling and look what lands, there's no doubt that the

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Speaker 1: economic policies are more popular. And also, if your whole

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Speaker 1: beef is like they lacked a coherent economic message, well,

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Speaker 1: literally the only part of the party that has a

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Speaker 1: coherent economic message is the left. Yes, so that part

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Speaker 1: seemed to be very very thin, but it's interesting and

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Speaker 1: they basically say, look, Democrats could really be in trouble

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Speaker 1: in twenty twenty two. I think the parsing of it

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Speaker 1: is very important because you're right, Look, I think the

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Speaker 1: cultural left is one hundred percent to blame for both

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Speaker 1: the current state of American politics in terms of the

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Speaker 1: division and really in terms of the Democratic underperformance in

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Speaker 1: twenty twenty and the only thing that saved them was

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Speaker 1: really Trump in his complete and total idiocy. But if

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Speaker 1: you want to see a picture of the future my

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Speaker 1: own home state of Texas, let's put this up there

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Speaker 1: on the screen. McCallen. Texas in eighty five percent Hispanic

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Speaker 1: town on the border. And I mean when I say

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Speaker 1: on the border, I mean literally on the border. That

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Speaker 1: is what it is. Just elected a Republican mayor, which

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Speaker 1: shows actually that the Republican gains in South Texas are

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Speaker 1: going to stay despite the fact that Trump was on

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Speaker 1: the ballot. So yes, Trump was on the ballot, the

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Speaker 1: stimulus texts and all that, but something oceanic has happened

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Speaker 1: down in South Texas. And I think that what it

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Speaker 1: does show you is what we speak about all the time,

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Speaker 1: which are there are Hispanic voters in South Texas who

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Speaker 1: are like pro Medicare for all, pro life, pro gun,

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Speaker 1: and anti PC anti establishment. What party speaks to them,

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Speaker 1: Not the National GOP, certainly not the National Democratic Party,

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Speaker 1: but on a localized level, this is what the future

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Speaker 1: of politics looks like. I'm not gonna say it's for

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Speaker 1: the future of GOP. What it is is that they

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Speaker 1: are recognizing that the national brands of both of the

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Speaker 1: parties are totally out of step with these brand new constituencies. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: and I would say that the reason why the Republican Party,

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Speaker 1: if anything, can be the mantle why some of this

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Speaker 1: is going to be seen, at least in the emerging time,

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Speaker 1: is they don't stand for anything, so the people down

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Speaker 1: there can make it stand for whatever they need to

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Speaker 1: in the future. The Democratic Party could too. I don't know. Well,

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Speaker 1: I just you know, having lived in Ohio and Kentucky

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Speaker 1: and then work in West Virginia, local politics is dead.

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Speaker 1: Everything is nationalized now, and you really can't escape. Like

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Speaker 1: if the Democratic Party brand is trash, there's no escaping it.

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Speaker 1: If the Republican Party brand is trash, there's no escaping it.

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Speaker 1: You're gonna be tarred with stop the steal at every

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Speaker 1: single level. In the Republican Party, the suburban voters, yes, sure, well,

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Speaker 1: and whether that's a good thing or a bad thing

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Speaker 1: depending on where you live, but you're not going to

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Speaker 1: be able to escape that. And for the Democratic Party,

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Speaker 1: I mean, this is why they've lost all of rural

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Speaker 1: America and why even candidates who you know, had a

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Speaker 1: long history in some of these seats and were really

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Speaker 1: well known among the population. That's why they haven't been

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Speaker 1: able to make up any ground there or even have

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Speaker 1: these sort of like outlier races anymore, because there's just

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Speaker 1: this aura of contempt and condescension coming from the National

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Speaker 1: Party that you cannot escape, which is why you know,

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Speaker 1: all these and this is what's really depressing any sort

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Speaker 1: of like individual candidate qualities are like oh, what platform

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Speaker 1: does this particular candidate run on, or like what what's

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Speaker 1: their bio? And how do they relate or how do

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Speaker 1: they have deep roots in the district? All of that

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Speaker 1: stuff matters almost not at all, right, right, you know, correct?

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Speaker 1: And that's actually and so that's the national brand is

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Speaker 1: everything that matters. And so you know, I think you

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Speaker 1: have these two choices that are both like lackluster and

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Speaker 1: anemic in very different different ways. And I do want

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Speaker 1: to say on the like, you know, blaming defund the

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Speaker 1: police for all democratic underperformance, I think that's very convenient

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Speaker 1: for the democratic establishment. I'm not going to say that

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Speaker 1: it didn't have any impact at all. But guess what

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Speaker 1: Joe Biden could have run on a platform, right, he

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Speaker 1: could have run on like, hey, here's what I'm actually

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Speaker 1: gonna do for you economically. Here's the healthcare plan that

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Speaker 1: I'm actually going to push for. He stopped even talking

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Speaker 1: about the public option. Oh this is see what denomination.

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Speaker 1: It's very easy for It's very easy for span Berger

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Speaker 1: and these other Blue Dogs or for the Biden team

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Speaker 1: or whatever to be like, oh, it was all the

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Speaker 1: fault of these activists saying defund the police, because that

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Speaker 1: keeps them from having to do a single moment of

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Speaker 1: soul searching about the fact that they did not offer

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Speaker 1: an economic agenda that was coherent for people, and they

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Speaker 1: continue to not learn the lessons of twenty sixteen that

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Speaker 1: it's not enough to just lean into like oh Trump

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Speaker 1: is bad. Well there, yeah, and they're learning that the

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Speaker 1: hard way. Look, I think defund the police is absolutely

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Speaker 1: responsible for state of Florida and for a lot of

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Speaker 1: South Texas. That being said, it's not the only thing.

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Speaker 1: And you're right, which is that whenever you everything is

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Speaker 1: very complicated. Coalitions are difficult, Which is that why do

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Speaker 1: millions of people come out and vote. Many of them

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Speaker 1: can't even really tell you themselves. We're like, oh, maybe

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Speaker 1: I did it for this, maybe I did it for that.

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Speaker 1: At the end of the day, sometimes it's about a

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Speaker 1: gut feeling. But I do think that it does lie

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Speaker 1: with this. Neither candidate of twenty twenty proposed any transformative

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Speaker 1: way in order to change your life. So what did

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Speaker 1: it come down to? Of Course, the default was culture. Right,

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Speaker 1: if there was no argument around how you're going to

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Speaker 1: remake American society, then of course we're going to default

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Speaker 1: to defund the police or immigration or anything else that. Yes,

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Speaker 1: we can say those are the top issues in people's lives,

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Speaker 1: but also things are downstream from each other. When Trump

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Speaker 1: is out there saying what he run his economic agenda

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Speaker 1: in twenty twenty was I'm going to cut social Security

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Speaker 1: and pass another large tax cut. That's literally what he said, Okay,

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Speaker 1: oh awesome, And then Biden, I don't even know what

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Speaker 1: the hell he was running on. I mean restore the

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Speaker 1: soul of the America, which again doesn't actually mean anything.

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Speaker 1: So in that particular case, it does, of course makes

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Speaker 1: sense to me, which is that you're going to have

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Speaker 1: a default cultural election. So we have cultural numerism right

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Speaker 1: now in America where everybody's like, the cultural war rules everything.

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Speaker 1: And I've said it here many times, but it's because

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Speaker 1: we have the absence of political parties speaking to the

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Speaker 1: actual economics and societal problems of the twenty first century. Now,

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Speaker 1: in the year nineteen thirty two, you know what, they

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Speaker 1: didn't have to argue about culture, and it wasn't just

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Speaker 1: because it was a homogenous society. It was about what

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Speaker 1: is the government role in the Great Depression? We were

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Speaker 1: owed that this time around, and we've completely lost it.

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Speaker 1: That's some of these books behind here are exactly about

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Speaker 1: what happened back then, and it makes me so sad

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Speaker 1: to see the way that our politics works today. This

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Speaker 1: is actually what my breaking points are about today. I'm

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Speaker 1: how to get used to saying that radar is very

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Speaker 1: ingrained in my in my brain. But this is what

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Speaker 1: it's about, because it's not just in the US. Across

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Speaker 1: twenty one different Western democracies that Thomas Pakhetti and some

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Speaker 1: of his colleagues studied, you've had this what they call

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Speaker 1: multi party elite system. So on the right you have

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Speaker 1: the financial elites, and on the left you have the

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Speaker 1: education elites, like people who have college degree and higher degrees,

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Speaker 1: and so that means you have every party dominated by

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Speaker 1: various elites who continue to pursue pursue their own class interest,

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Speaker 1: which means that economics is essentially taken off the table.

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Speaker 1: And what all the fights are over is culture. And

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Speaker 1: that's very easy, it's very convenient for like you know,

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Speaker 1: the Democratic Party, the Republican Party establishment. They don't have

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Speaker 1: to do anything other than say the right words and

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Speaker 1: signal the right things. So that is the state of

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Speaker 1: our politics. Does it have to be that way? No,

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Speaker 1: even today there are exceptions. There are countries that are

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Speaker 1: exceptions to that rule. But the more that you focus

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Speaker 1: on just like this sort of like gauzy meaningless rhetoric

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Speaker 1: rather than a concrete, actionable policy plan, the more you're

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Speaker 1: just going to have these fights over culture. And that

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Speaker 1: is what we see. It's absolutely correct. One of the

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Speaker 1: core themes I think we're on a track in the

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Speaker 1: future is just how much the culture war is ripping

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Speaker 1: us apart and to what end and why? And I

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Speaker 1: really do blame the people at the top. I do

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Speaker 1: not blame the voters whatsoever, and I never will. Hey, guys,

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Speaker 1: so remember how we told you how awesome premium membership was. Well,

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Speaker 1: here I am again to remind you that becoming a

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Speaker 1: premium member means you don't have to listen to our

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Speaker 1: constant please for you to subscribe. So what are you

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Speaker 1: waiting for? Become a premium member today by going to

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Speaker 1: Crystalansager dot com, which you can click on in the

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Speaker 1: show notes. The other story that we wanted to talk

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Speaker 1: about is this new Facebook decision. This is the most

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Speaker 1: ridiculous thing I've ever seen. Let's put it up there

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Speaker 1: on the screen, which is that Facebook has decided that

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Speaker 1: they're going to uphold Trump's ban but he can maybe

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Speaker 1: come back in twenty twenty three. I think this is

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Speaker 1: just the most ludicrous thing. Either ban him or don't.

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Speaker 1: I mean, at a certain point, this is all becoming ridiculous.

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Speaker 1: They said it will look to experts to decide whether

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Speaker 1: the risk to public safety has receded. Which expert are

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Speaker 1: they the nut jobs who screwed up? Yeah? I'm the expert.

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Speaker 1: Which is that let people generally say what they want.

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Speaker 1: And look, you know, I don't think it's a secret.

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Speaker 1: I'm not a huge Trump fan, okay, And I think

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Speaker 1: he probably did do a lot of damage on January sixth.

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Speaker 1: All of that being said, this is a farce, which

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Speaker 1: is that take Trump out of it and make take

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Speaker 1: a look at this from a pure power perspective. It

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Speaker 1: is ludicrous to have a fake oversight board providing fake

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Speaker 1: recommendations to a fake transparent company. Who's in charge here?

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Speaker 1: It's Zuckerberg. He's the only one who makes a decision

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Speaker 1: according to his own stock structure. What do I say

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Speaker 1: all the time? Follow the money. He controls the company.

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Speaker 1: He has a majority stake whenever it comes to a

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Speaker 1: majority shareholder power. So this one person is the person

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Speaker 1: who's deciding whether the president is going to be here

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Speaker 1: till twenty twenty one or twenty twenty one till twenty

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Speaker 1: twenty three. And I think this really scary part is

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Speaker 1: the Trump campaign or the former campaign potential campaign has

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Speaker 1: even said they view the Facebook decision as their ability

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Speaker 1: in order to run again. So look, I mean, I

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Speaker 1: particularly want Trump to run again, but it's not my place.

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Speaker 1: It's above to the American people, and it's certainly not

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Speaker 1: up to Mark Zuckerberg. That is the hard thing to separate.

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Speaker 1: It's actually really nice not on these platforms, like on

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Speaker 1: a day to day basis the fact that and it

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Speaker 1: has worked. He just took his like crappy blog site

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Speaker 1: thing down and no one, No one was going to it,

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Speaker 1: no one was reading it. The media wasn't it covering

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Speaker 1: That was apparently his big thing was the fact that

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Speaker 1: it wasn't what he was putting up on this blog

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Speaker 1: site was not getting covered by the media, and so

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Speaker 1: they gave up on that thing. So it has actually

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Speaker 1: really worked to not have him on these platforms. But yeah,

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Speaker 1: I read the corporate speak memo that Facebook put out

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Speaker 1: about their decision to ban him for at least two years,

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Speaker 1: and it was all like, oh, this shows that were accountable,

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Speaker 1: and this shows were really listening to the board, et cetera,

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Speaker 1: et cetera. But you know, one of the really basic

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Speaker 1: things that they don't explain is what exactly did he

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Speaker 1: say on your platform that justified this band? Because the

431
00:21:08,720 --> 00:21:11,160
Speaker 1: sense that I get is that this is much more

432
00:21:11,240 --> 00:21:15,400
Speaker 1: about the totality of his actions than whether he actually

433
00:21:15,520 --> 00:21:19,960
Speaker 1: violated their specific terms of service. So, okay, if you're

434
00:21:20,000 --> 00:21:22,680
Speaker 1: in the business now of judging like the totality of

435
00:21:22,720 --> 00:21:25,919
Speaker 1: a person and their actions in terms of whether they

436
00:21:25,920 --> 00:21:28,720
Speaker 1: can have access to your platform, like, that's a whole

437
00:21:28,760 --> 00:21:32,640
Speaker 1: other situation that you're putting. That's called democracy. That's democracy.

438
00:21:32,800 --> 00:21:35,880
Speaker 1: Only America gets to decide the totality of the president's

439
00:21:35,920 --> 00:21:38,359
Speaker 1: actions and whether they constitute something where he should be booted.

440
00:21:38,600 --> 00:21:40,960
Speaker 1: And we did that. And here's the thing, is like

441
00:21:41,280 --> 00:21:44,719
Speaker 1: I actually if and and to be honest with you,

442
00:21:44,800 --> 00:21:46,959
Speaker 1: I don't know what he said on Facebook to know

443
00:21:47,000 --> 00:21:50,480
Speaker 1: whether it was the same videos to Twitter, he's like,

444
00:21:50,520 --> 00:21:54,520
Speaker 1: we love you. I could actually be persuaded that a

445
00:21:54,600 --> 00:21:59,280
Speaker 1: short term ban could make sense if this sort of

446
00:21:59,359 --> 00:22:03,800
Speaker 1: rule is being applied consistently to all political candidates, to

447
00:22:03,840 --> 00:22:06,520
Speaker 1: all people, or if I don't know if political candidates

448
00:22:06,520 --> 00:22:09,439
Speaker 1: should have a separate category to all world leaders. But

449
00:22:09,520 --> 00:22:14,640
Speaker 1: it's very clearly not any sort of consistent standard or pattern,

450
00:22:15,040 --> 00:22:18,520
Speaker 1: and none of those decision points are laid out. And then,

451
00:22:18,600 --> 00:22:21,120
Speaker 1: I mean, the bottom line is always this, like, no

452
00:22:21,119 --> 00:22:23,879
Speaker 1: matter whether this was the right or wrong decision, this

453
00:22:24,000 --> 00:22:26,080
Speaker 1: ban or this length of time, et cetera, et cetera,

454
00:22:26,280 --> 00:22:28,960
Speaker 1: the bottom line is that a single person should not

455
00:22:29,040 --> 00:22:32,920
Speaker 1: have so much incredible control over our political system. And so, yeah,

456
00:22:32,960 --> 00:22:37,360
Speaker 1: you've basically vested in Mark Zuckerberg the ability to determine

457
00:22:37,760 --> 00:22:40,680
Speaker 1: which political candidates are going to be viable and which

458
00:22:40,760 --> 00:22:42,600
Speaker 1: or not. And that is an outrageous state of affairs

459
00:22:42,600 --> 00:22:45,359
Speaker 1: because Facebook. You know, we don't pay as much attention

460
00:22:45,480 --> 00:22:48,080
Speaker 1: to it, and it doesn't get as much elite media

461
00:22:48,080 --> 00:22:50,480
Speaker 1: attention at all. Twitter is basically the only thing that

462
00:22:50,600 --> 00:22:52,880
Speaker 1: exists for elite media, and I fall into that trap

463
00:22:52,920 --> 00:22:54,560
Speaker 1: as well if we're looking at Twitter. I don't even

464
00:22:54,600 --> 00:22:57,760
Speaker 1: know how to log onto Facebook anymore. But Facebook, the

465
00:22:57,800 --> 00:23:01,480
Speaker 1: Trump team says, was the most critical goal social media

466
00:23:01,600 --> 00:23:05,720
Speaker 1: network for their success. They invested tons in Facebook, they

467
00:23:05,760 --> 00:23:09,840
Speaker 1: were pushing tons of messaging there, So this was absolutely critical.

468
00:23:10,160 --> 00:23:11,760
Speaker 1: And the fact that you have one guy who can

469
00:23:11,800 --> 00:23:13,760
Speaker 1: just say like no and shut off, that's bigot. It

470
00:23:13,760 --> 00:23:16,280
Speaker 1: is crazy. No, I think that's exactly what it is,

471
00:23:16,280 --> 00:23:18,480
Speaker 1: which is that at the end of the day, the

472
00:23:18,600 --> 00:23:22,480
Speaker 1: arbitrariness of this all is not acceptable and a democracy.

473
00:23:22,520 --> 00:23:26,480
Speaker 1: And actually, before he left, Ajipai actually proposed something or

474
00:23:26,520 --> 00:23:28,720
Speaker 1: it was working on something which I thought was very important,

475
00:23:28,720 --> 00:23:31,480
Speaker 1: which is that the section two thirty debate gets very

476
00:23:31,480 --> 00:23:34,800
Speaker 1: complicated very quickly about who's liable, etc. But it would

477
00:23:34,840 --> 00:23:37,679
Speaker 1: be an amendment, and what it would do is it

478
00:23:37,720 --> 00:23:41,280
Speaker 1: would force transparency of moderation. And what that means is

479
00:23:41,280 --> 00:23:45,879
Speaker 1: that companies would have to publicly say exactly when and

480
00:23:45,960 --> 00:23:49,120
Speaker 1: where they're going to remove something or not. As you said,

481
00:23:49,400 --> 00:23:51,840
Speaker 1: Facebook should be required to point to the exact post

482
00:23:51,840 --> 00:23:53,920
Speaker 1: time date and stamp they had all that data. I

483
00:23:53,920 --> 00:23:55,960
Speaker 1: think we all know that and say, this is the

484
00:23:56,000 --> 00:23:59,240
Speaker 1: reason this post right here, why Trump has been taken off.

485
00:23:59,280 --> 00:24:00,920
Speaker 1: This is what might are in terms of service said.

486
00:24:00,960 --> 00:24:02,760
Speaker 1: These are other examples where he applied it in a

487
00:24:02,800 --> 00:24:05,560
Speaker 1: similar way. And what I mean remember Twitter and then

488
00:24:05,560 --> 00:24:08,960
Speaker 1: their arbitrary ban of the Hunter Biden that was insane.

489
00:24:09,040 --> 00:24:12,080
Speaker 1: That was completely insane. You are not allowed to censor

490
00:24:12,359 --> 00:24:16,600
Speaker 1: a cup private news organization if they're libeling Hunter Biden.

491
00:24:16,760 --> 00:24:18,719
Speaker 1: Hunter is welcome to sue them. Oh and guess what

492
00:24:18,920 --> 00:24:20,600
Speaker 1: he hasn't you know why because every single one of

493
00:24:20,640 --> 00:24:22,439
Speaker 1: those emails are true, and every single one of those

494
00:24:22,440 --> 00:24:25,080
Speaker 1: stories are true. And what that means to me is

495
00:24:25,119 --> 00:24:28,760
Speaker 1: that the arbitrary position of all of this moderation is

496
00:24:28,800 --> 00:24:30,960
Speaker 1: what has to be slayed more than anything, like we

497
00:24:31,080 --> 00:24:34,800
Speaker 1: have to create a situation and this is totally reasonable,

498
00:24:34,920 --> 00:24:38,359
Speaker 1: which is we're not nationalizing Google or Facebook. We're saying, hey, guys,

499
00:24:38,520 --> 00:24:40,480
Speaker 1: if you're going to take stuff off, which I don't

500
00:24:40,520 --> 00:24:42,880
Speaker 1: think anyone wants to live in a one hundred percent

501
00:24:43,000 --> 00:24:46,480
Speaker 1: unmoderated Internet, right, that's like child porn and death threats

502
00:24:46,480 --> 00:24:49,239
Speaker 1: and suicide and all that. Nobody. No, we don't want

503
00:24:49,280 --> 00:24:50,920
Speaker 1: to live in that world. We're just gonna say, hey,

504
00:24:51,000 --> 00:24:53,399
Speaker 1: you got to publish your standards, You got to come forward,

505
00:24:53,520 --> 00:24:55,840
Speaker 1: and you got to say to us, this is exactly when,

506
00:24:56,000 --> 00:24:58,480
Speaker 1: where how that we decide that we're going to take

507
00:24:58,480 --> 00:25:00,560
Speaker 1: something off or we're going to put something on. Okay,

508
00:25:00,760 --> 00:25:03,119
Speaker 1: and this is again, this is a democratic thing. We

509
00:25:03,160 --> 00:25:05,159
Speaker 1: can make this and write this into law. This is

510
00:25:05,160 --> 00:25:07,960
Speaker 1: what Congress is supposed to be. What we talked about earlier,

511
00:25:08,080 --> 00:25:10,399
Speaker 1: which is that who is actually asking the questions of

512
00:25:10,440 --> 00:25:13,120
Speaker 1: the twenty first century? No one. Every time these goddamn

513
00:25:13,160 --> 00:25:16,040
Speaker 1: tech companies get launched before Congress, what do we see

514
00:25:16,200 --> 00:25:21,359
Speaker 1: some Republican who's like, what does my iPhone email send

515
00:25:21,440 --> 00:25:25,640
Speaker 1: to the I kid? You not? I saw this guy

516
00:25:26,119 --> 00:25:30,560
Speaker 1: ask why his campaign emails go to the promotions folder

517
00:25:30,800 --> 00:25:33,560
Speaker 1: on Gmail. He asked that to the CEO of Google.

518
00:25:34,000 --> 00:25:37,000
Speaker 1: The CEO of Google and the Sundak Pachai was like,

519
00:25:37,240 --> 00:25:39,879
Speaker 1: I'll look into that for you. I'm like, I'm like,

520
00:25:39,960 --> 00:25:42,760
Speaker 1: what are you doing? You're literally destroying my brain. I'm

521
00:25:42,840 --> 00:25:45,280
Speaker 1: dumber for having watched you and then the same thing

522
00:25:45,560 --> 00:25:49,080
Speaker 1: whenever Facebook, remember that embarrassing Facebook hearing. They were like,

523
00:25:49,119 --> 00:25:51,520
Speaker 1: mister Zuckerberg, how do you make money? And he was like,

524
00:25:51,640 --> 00:25:55,120
Speaker 1: ads senator. And then one of them asked him why

525
00:25:55,160 --> 00:25:58,639
Speaker 1: something had been taken down, and Zuck goes, I believe

526
00:25:58,640 --> 00:26:01,720
Speaker 1: you're referring to Twitter. So I'll leave that to my colleague,

527
00:26:01,800 --> 00:26:05,560
Speaker 1: mister Dorsey. I'm just it is pathetic the way that

528
00:26:05,600 --> 00:26:08,560
Speaker 1: these people are in serious. I mean should say none

529
00:26:09,359 --> 00:26:13,399
Speaker 1: very few are actually serious. And yeah, and Republicans, for

530
00:26:13,440 --> 00:26:16,960
Speaker 1: all their talk of like big tics, etcetera, etcetera, they

531
00:26:17,000 --> 00:26:20,000
Speaker 1: have no they have no interest in actually curtailing the

532
00:26:20,040 --> 00:26:23,520
Speaker 1: power having like real solutions to any of these problems.

533
00:26:23,560 --> 00:26:27,040
Speaker 1: And I mean, I think platforms as large and as

534
00:26:27,080 --> 00:26:30,480
Speaker 1: significant as Facebook is to just the basic workings of

535
00:26:30,480 --> 00:26:32,359
Speaker 1: our democracy at this point, I do think they should

536
00:26:32,400 --> 00:26:36,119
Speaker 1: be regulated like public utilities, Like this is beyond what

537
00:26:36,200 --> 00:26:39,360
Speaker 1: we should have in the hands of one individual or

538
00:26:39,520 --> 00:26:44,960
Speaker 1: a public publicly traded company. This is really really essential

539
00:26:45,359 --> 00:26:49,080
Speaker 1: to just the basic functioning of our country and our democracy.

540
00:26:49,240 --> 00:26:52,760
Speaker 1: And so yeah, you can't have someone who has so

541
00:26:52,880 --> 00:26:55,879
Speaker 1: much power over which candidate can and can't run and

542
00:26:55,920 --> 00:26:58,679
Speaker 1: can and can't have a shot at success. Do you

543
00:26:58,720 --> 00:27:02,000
Speaker 1: actually think that that's true, that whether he's back on

544
00:27:02,040 --> 00:27:04,159
Speaker 1: Facebook is going to determine whether Trump is going to run.

545
00:27:04,240 --> 00:27:06,840
Speaker 1: I actually do because they need it. I don't think

546
00:27:06,880 --> 00:27:09,879
Speaker 1: people can truly understand the sheer amount of cash and

547
00:27:09,920 --> 00:27:13,280
Speaker 1: how important it is. Also, ask any of your boomer relatives.

548
00:27:13,359 --> 00:27:15,679
Speaker 1: Boomers love Facebook. I don't really get it. They love

549
00:27:15,720 --> 00:27:18,119
Speaker 1: their getting the news from Facebook, they love sharing stuff

550
00:27:18,160 --> 00:27:23,800
Speaker 1: on Facebook. They really enjoy like sharing stuff around creating Facebook.

551
00:27:23,880 --> 00:27:26,639
Speaker 1: This is very boomer phenomenon and something I truly actually

552
00:27:26,680 --> 00:27:29,399
Speaker 1: don't understand. But I know that they use it, and

553
00:27:29,400 --> 00:27:31,800
Speaker 1: they use it a lot, and so that is the base.

554
00:27:31,960 --> 00:27:34,919
Speaker 1: I mean, that is where Trump his true power is

555
00:27:34,960 --> 00:27:38,040
Speaker 1: in the know. Yeah. Go. We also know that since

556
00:27:38,080 --> 00:27:41,520
Speaker 1: he's been off these platforms, like everything Trump has plummeted,

557
00:27:41,600 --> 00:27:43,959
Speaker 1: That's right. I mean Google Search, Google Search on the

558
00:27:44,040 --> 00:27:48,399
Speaker 1: cable news segments, the number of mentions on Twitter, the

559
00:27:48,400 --> 00:27:51,440
Speaker 1: Google search traffic, that's the makety indicators went down to

560
00:27:51,640 --> 00:27:55,640
Speaker 1: levels from before he even ran for president. So and then,

561
00:27:55,880 --> 00:27:57,560
Speaker 1: like I said before, the fact that he had to

562
00:27:57,600 --> 00:28:01,200
Speaker 1: take his like shitty blog post thing because just no one,

563
00:28:01,520 --> 00:28:02,760
Speaker 1: no one was looking at I remember when he looked

564
00:28:02,760 --> 00:28:05,280
Speaker 1: at those numbers and his all of his posts together

565
00:28:05,359 --> 00:28:08,199
Speaker 1: had like a few hundred thousand engagements, which is like

566
00:28:08,240 --> 00:28:10,280
Speaker 1: what we get in one segment, you know, I mean

567
00:28:10,320 --> 00:28:14,080
Speaker 1: it really is like it was a pathetic number of

568
00:28:14,560 --> 00:28:18,520
Speaker 1: level of engagement. Media wasn't covering it, etc. So, yeah,

569
00:28:18,560 --> 00:28:21,040
Speaker 1: I think if he remains banned on these platforms, it

570
00:28:21,080 --> 00:28:24,560
Speaker 1: will be very difficult for him to be able to run. Now, look,

571
00:28:24,720 --> 00:28:27,560
Speaker 1: if he did run even without being on Facebook, would

572
00:28:27,560 --> 00:28:30,600
Speaker 1: he win the GOP nomination? Yeah? Right? And then are

573
00:28:30,600 --> 00:28:33,000
Speaker 1: you really going to be in a position where the

574
00:28:33,160 --> 00:28:37,480
Speaker 1: Republican nominee for president is banned from these different platforms.

575
00:28:37,480 --> 00:28:40,680
Speaker 1: That's just that seems completely insane. No, you can't have that.

576
00:28:41,080 --> 00:28:43,000
Speaker 1: And look, like I said, I don't think Trump should

577
00:28:43,000 --> 00:28:45,200
Speaker 1: be I think Trump was a terrible president and overall

578
00:28:45,200 --> 00:28:48,200
Speaker 1: will probably be remembered it was largely a failure. However,

579
00:28:48,400 --> 00:28:50,520
Speaker 1: that doesn't mean that it's up to me. It's up

580
00:28:50,560 --> 00:28:52,920
Speaker 1: to the American people, and it's certainly not up to

581
00:28:53,160 --> 00:28:55,360
Speaker 1: Mark Zuckerberg. I gave you my opinion, you know, I'm

582
00:28:55,400 --> 00:28:57,480
Speaker 1: just sharing it. But I'm just one of three hundred

583
00:28:57,480 --> 00:28:59,800
Speaker 1: and thirty million, and I think that people need to

584
00:28:59,840 --> 00:29:02,360
Speaker 1: be a lot more humble whenever it comes to actual

585
00:29:02,440 --> 00:29:06,280
Speaker 1: questions fundamental to democracy. But at the same time, Crystal,

586
00:29:06,600 --> 00:29:09,000
Speaker 1: we've got some developments in the NYC mayworld. There's a

587
00:29:09,040 --> 00:29:13,000
Speaker 1: lot going on. This race has basically become a total mess.

588
00:29:13,320 --> 00:29:16,480
Speaker 1: New York City mayoral race coming to close very shortly.

589
00:29:17,080 --> 00:29:20,560
Speaker 1: And all right, the latest thing, the polls are all

590
00:29:20,600 --> 00:29:22,960
Speaker 1: over the map in terms of who is actually leading.

591
00:29:22,960 --> 00:29:25,000
Speaker 1: So Andrew Yang for a long time is holding onto

592
00:29:25,000 --> 00:29:27,960
Speaker 1: this lead. Now it looks like it's him. Eric Adams.

593
00:29:28,000 --> 00:29:31,920
Speaker 1: Captain Garcia got the New York Times endorsement and she

594
00:29:32,040 --> 00:29:34,320
Speaker 1: shot it up. It seems to be causing her to searge.

595
00:29:34,360 --> 00:29:36,520
Speaker 1: And I have to think. I mean New York City

596
00:29:36,560 --> 00:29:39,120
Speaker 1: at this point, like a lot of it has been

597
00:29:39,400 --> 00:29:41,440
Speaker 1: gentrified to the point that it's like, you know a

598
00:29:41,440 --> 00:29:44,120
Speaker 1: lot of affluent liberals who are very influential, who read

599
00:29:44,160 --> 00:29:46,200
Speaker 1: the New York Times, so that endorsement carries a lot

600
00:29:46,240 --> 00:29:50,720
Speaker 1: of weight. And then you have just a total sort

601
00:29:50,720 --> 00:29:54,760
Speaker 1: of meltdown on the left in terms of picking a

602
00:29:54,840 --> 00:29:59,640
Speaker 1: candidate sticking with that candidate. It really is a total mess.

603
00:30:00,000 --> 00:30:02,840
Speaker 1: So the latest thing that you have is there was

604
00:30:02,880 --> 00:30:08,400
Speaker 1: a second allegation of sexual harassment against Scott Stringer, who

605
00:30:08,480 --> 00:30:11,360
Speaker 1: previously it seemed like a lot of progressives were kind

606
00:30:11,360 --> 00:30:16,160
Speaker 1: of coalescing around Stringer as their candidate of choice. Then

607
00:30:16,360 --> 00:30:20,720
Speaker 1: this first sexual harassment allegation comes out, which Ryan Grimm

608
00:30:20,760 --> 00:30:23,640
Speaker 1: did the digging into and found like, there's a lot

609
00:30:23,640 --> 00:30:27,520
Speaker 1: of holes in this person's story. But it was already

610
00:30:27,640 --> 00:30:29,720
Speaker 1: a lot of the progressive groups had like run away

611
00:30:29,720 --> 00:30:33,360
Speaker 1: from Stringer and unendorsed him and all of this stuff.

612
00:30:33,400 --> 00:30:36,200
Speaker 1: The new allegation we can throw Ryan Grimm's tweet up

613
00:30:36,240 --> 00:30:41,320
Speaker 1: here as well, so the new allegation also has similar holes.

614
00:30:41,320 --> 00:30:44,640
Speaker 1: The New York Times reporting on it was such a mess,

615
00:30:44,720 --> 00:30:48,160
Speaker 1: so they had to change like they're reporting on it

616
00:30:48,240 --> 00:30:51,520
Speaker 1: and the way that they were indicating his response and

617
00:30:51,560 --> 00:30:53,920
Speaker 1: how he was responding. So again, look, we don't know

618
00:30:53,960 --> 00:30:57,280
Speaker 1: what happened, and this new allegation is from thirty years ago,

619
00:30:57,440 --> 00:30:59,800
Speaker 1: so we really don't know what happened back then. But

620
00:31:00,920 --> 00:31:03,120
Speaker 1: in any case, the left as a bandon Stringer, then

621
00:31:03,160 --> 00:31:06,800
Speaker 1: it was like, oh, maybe Diane Morales who positioned herself

622
00:31:06,800 --> 00:31:10,360
Speaker 1: as the leftiest in the field, and she's had a

623
00:31:10,400 --> 00:31:13,920
Speaker 1: total implosion too. Number one, her campaign staff there were

624
00:31:13,960 --> 00:31:18,000
Speaker 1: allegations of like a toxic work environment. They wanted to unionize,

625
00:31:18,080 --> 00:31:20,680
Speaker 1: but it's really late in the campaign, and then they

626
00:31:20,760 --> 00:31:23,760
Speaker 1: marched on her office and it became this entire sort

627
00:31:23,760 --> 00:31:28,800
Speaker 1: of like navel gazing exercise. It also then came out, Oh,

628
00:31:28,960 --> 00:31:32,480
Speaker 1: she's positioning herself as the sort of democratic socialist candidate,

629
00:31:32,880 --> 00:31:36,760
Speaker 1: but her views are not left at all. At least

630
00:31:36,760 --> 00:31:39,000
Speaker 1: they weren't until the minute that she thought it would

631
00:31:39,000 --> 00:31:42,640
Speaker 1: be politically advantageous. Take a listen to this interview she

632
00:31:42,720 --> 00:31:44,920
Speaker 1: gave where she laid out some of her views on

633
00:31:45,000 --> 00:31:47,440
Speaker 1: things like charter schools and also on whether she voted

634
00:31:47,440 --> 00:31:56,280
Speaker 1: for Andrew Cuomo or Cynthia nixcent tangalism For Democratic voters

635
00:31:56,280 --> 00:31:58,080
Speaker 1: that you're going to be trying to appeal to, can

636
00:31:58,120 --> 00:32:01,640
Speaker 1: you give folks an early sense of where you fall

637
00:32:01,680 --> 00:32:06,280
Speaker 1: in this supposedly big tent party. Are there ways that

638
00:32:06,320 --> 00:32:09,280
Speaker 1: you talk about what kind of Democrat you are? Should

639
00:32:09,320 --> 00:32:12,080
Speaker 1: people know who you're supporting in the presidential race? You know,

640
00:32:12,080 --> 00:32:14,360
Speaker 1: are there some markers you can give folks? Yeah, you know,

641
00:32:14,400 --> 00:32:16,200
Speaker 1: I've been asked that question a couple of times, and

642
00:32:16,240 --> 00:32:19,640
Speaker 1: I've been really resistant to the label, mostly because I

643
00:32:19,640 --> 00:32:23,240
Speaker 1: don't check all the boxes in any one lane. I think,

644
00:32:23,320 --> 00:32:25,600
Speaker 1: you know, people have tended to want to let me

645
00:32:25,640 --> 00:32:28,440
Speaker 1: in the sort of progressive or the democratic socialist, but

646
00:32:28,480 --> 00:32:31,880
Speaker 1: then we talk about schools and we talk about school choice,

647
00:32:32,360 --> 00:32:34,720
Speaker 1: and then they go, oh, you know, maybe not right,

648
00:32:35,080 --> 00:32:37,680
Speaker 1: because I do. I am a strong believer in school choice.

649
00:32:38,440 --> 00:32:41,640
Speaker 1: And that's definitely a much longer conversation that I'd love

650
00:32:41,680 --> 00:32:44,640
Speaker 1: to be able to unpack. But so I don't. I

651
00:32:44,640 --> 00:32:47,400
Speaker 1: don't fall neatly into any one category. I don't think,

652
00:32:47,440 --> 00:32:50,080
Speaker 1: and I'm hoping that that's actually going to be pretty

653
00:32:50,080 --> 00:32:52,240
Speaker 1: appealing to New Yorkers. Just quickly on that. Do you

654
00:32:52,280 --> 00:32:56,000
Speaker 1: have a favorite in the Democratic presidential primary? I am

655
00:32:56,240 --> 00:32:59,080
Speaker 1: honestly going to vote for whoever the candidate is, the

656
00:32:59,120 --> 00:33:02,960
Speaker 1: nominee is, and I haven't quite made up my mind. Okay,

657
00:33:03,520 --> 00:33:07,480
Speaker 1: And were you supporter of Governor Cuomo or Cynthia Nixon

658
00:33:07,520 --> 00:33:13,280
Speaker 1: in twenty eighteen. That's a good question. I I think

659
00:33:13,320 --> 00:33:18,800
Speaker 1: I voted for Cuomo. Okay, she is sleep oh my god,

660
00:33:19,120 --> 00:33:23,200
Speaker 1: extraordinary levels of cringe. Well, I won't say, like doesn't

661
00:33:23,280 --> 00:33:25,560
Speaker 1: know she's going to vote for in the Democratic primary.

662
00:33:25,640 --> 00:33:28,520
Speaker 1: School So this is the person who's positioning herself as

663
00:33:28,600 --> 00:33:32,800
Speaker 1: like the lefty candidate and now total implosion. The latest

664
00:33:32,840 --> 00:33:36,640
Speaker 1: effort to sort of coalesce behind a progressive candidate is

665
00:33:36,720 --> 00:33:40,479
Speaker 1: Maya Wiley. AOC just endorsed her. We can throw that

666
00:33:40,640 --> 00:33:43,959
Speaker 1: up on the screen. So that's Scott Stringer, you know,

667
00:33:44,040 --> 00:33:49,480
Speaker 1: derailed by maybe possibly bogus sexual harassment or assault allocations.

668
00:33:49,960 --> 00:33:53,560
Speaker 1: Diane Morales collapses. Now they're trying to coalesce behind Maya Wiley,

669
00:33:53,680 --> 00:33:55,320
Speaker 1: who was you know, she has a big Russia gator

670
00:33:55,360 --> 00:33:59,080
Speaker 1: over on MSNBC. Is that's who she is? How everybody

671
00:33:59,480 --> 00:34:02,320
Speaker 1: knows her at this point? I think so anyway, that's

672
00:34:02,360 --> 00:34:05,680
Speaker 1: the latest that's the latest choice. But it really is

673
00:34:05,720 --> 00:34:10,399
Speaker 1: interesting and Ross Barkan had a great piece on this

674
00:34:10,600 --> 00:34:14,600
Speaker 1: and how politics became just like neoliberal through and through

675
00:34:14,880 --> 00:34:16,840
Speaker 1: in New York City. And it's basically like, you know,

676
00:34:16,880 --> 00:34:19,000
Speaker 1: in New York City was a real innovator in these

677
00:34:19,000 --> 00:34:23,040
Speaker 1: sort of like new deal projects with rent stabilization and

678
00:34:23,120 --> 00:34:26,719
Speaker 1: with these big housing developments for affordable so all of

679
00:34:26,719 --> 00:34:28,759
Speaker 1: that stuff. Then you have the New York City bankruptcy.

680
00:34:28,840 --> 00:34:31,680
Speaker 1: That's right again what he trained nineteen seventies. And after that,

681
00:34:32,000 --> 00:34:34,680
Speaker 1: you know, the focus in New York City becomes like,

682
00:34:35,000 --> 00:34:37,400
Speaker 1: how do we make this an attractive target for capital

683
00:34:37,440 --> 00:34:40,120
Speaker 1: and how do we make sure that we've got developers

684
00:34:40,120 --> 00:34:43,800
Speaker 1: who want to come in here. And even Deblasio, who

685
00:34:44,239 --> 00:34:47,440
Speaker 1: with some of his rhetoric tried to signal an end

686
00:34:47,480 --> 00:34:51,959
Speaker 1: to that neoliberal era, that train is hard to slow down,

687
00:34:52,120 --> 00:34:55,279
Speaker 1: and so he had some surface level reforms and also

688
00:34:55,400 --> 00:34:57,680
Speaker 1: was just sort of like ineffectual in terms of just

689
00:34:57,760 --> 00:35:01,120
Speaker 1: like his level of confidence and to get their job done.

690
00:35:01,120 --> 00:35:05,120
Speaker 1: So he loses trust. And at this point there's really

691
00:35:05,160 --> 00:35:08,640
Speaker 1: no one in the field who's proposing anything significantly different

692
00:35:09,080 --> 00:35:12,480
Speaker 1: from the neoliberal era that, whether it's been a Republican

693
00:35:12,600 --> 00:35:15,680
Speaker 1: or Democratic mayor, has dominated in New York City. There

694
00:35:15,680 --> 00:35:18,680
Speaker 1: may be some differences around the edges, but that's the

695
00:35:18,719 --> 00:35:21,400
Speaker 1: direction that this race is going in. So you know

696
00:35:21,800 --> 00:35:24,799
Speaker 1: Yang looking shakier. Eric Adams is bored to the right

697
00:35:24,880 --> 00:35:28,240
Speaker 1: than Yang is and has like active hostility and contact

698
00:35:28,280 --> 00:35:31,799
Speaker 1: aoc contempt for the less that actually, well, he's just

699
00:35:32,000 --> 00:35:34,800
Speaker 1: trying to distinguish himself that way. You have Maya Wiley

700
00:35:34,880 --> 00:35:36,480
Speaker 1: who's sort of like again, I mean, she worked in

701
00:35:36,520 --> 00:35:39,000
Speaker 1: the Deblasio administrate captin Garcia, the same thing worked in

702
00:35:39,040 --> 00:35:42,960
Speaker 1: the Deblasio and these are technocratic type of neoliberal managers.

703
00:35:43,120 --> 00:35:45,520
Speaker 1: And that's essentially what the choices come down. And you know,

704
00:35:45,600 --> 00:35:47,279
Speaker 1: to the point that we were making earlier in the

705
00:35:47,320 --> 00:35:49,719
Speaker 1: show about the cut cultural and the democrat or the

706
00:35:49,760 --> 00:35:52,760
Speaker 1: economic left. I mean AOC in them endorse myle Wiley

707
00:35:52,920 --> 00:35:55,359
Speaker 1: because of defund the police, not because of any other

708
00:35:55,440 --> 00:35:58,759
Speaker 1: economic reason, which actually is very pathetic from that point

709
00:35:58,800 --> 00:36:02,200
Speaker 1: of view, which is that there's no economic agenda. Really,

710
00:36:02,320 --> 00:36:04,239
Speaker 1: this is New York City. I mean, this is the

711
00:36:04,280 --> 00:36:08,719
Speaker 1: greatest city in America, like a beacon of America that

712
00:36:08,920 --> 00:36:13,120
Speaker 1: shines throughout the world. And like you said, that's a veryous,

713
00:36:13,160 --> 00:36:15,160
Speaker 1: dude point from Ross. I've never thought about it that way,

714
00:36:15,200 --> 00:36:17,279
Speaker 1: which is that the bankruptcy and Ford telling them to

715
00:36:17,360 --> 00:36:19,520
Speaker 1: drop dead basically made it. We're like, Okay, we have

716
00:36:19,520 --> 00:36:21,040
Speaker 1: to make New York to playground of the rich because

717
00:36:21,040 --> 00:36:22,839
Speaker 1: that's the only way we're going to make the same happen. Yeah,

718
00:36:22,840 --> 00:36:25,760
Speaker 1: and it worked. I mean, what's the average home price

719
00:36:25,800 --> 00:36:28,200
Speaker 1: of what's the average home price? We can go and

720
00:36:28,239 --> 00:36:30,560
Speaker 1: ask some of these major candidates. They don't know. I

721
00:36:30,600 --> 00:36:35,200
Speaker 1: mean in Manhattan, it's absolutely outrageous. And the bloombergization of

722
00:36:35,280 --> 00:36:38,080
Speaker 1: New York City, where they explicitly were just like, look,

723
00:36:38,080 --> 00:36:39,759
Speaker 1: we're going after the millionaires. That's going to be an

724
00:36:39,880 --> 00:36:42,400
Speaker 1: entire tax base, and screw everybody else. I said, Manhattan

725
00:36:42,400 --> 00:36:44,359
Speaker 1: it should be a luxury good I mean, and it is,

726
00:36:44,440 --> 00:36:47,279
Speaker 1: and it's very expensive and everybody you basically import, you know,

727
00:36:47,360 --> 00:36:49,720
Speaker 1: cheap labor from all around the rest of the boroughs

728
00:36:49,920 --> 00:36:52,560
Speaker 1: and from the surrounding New York City area, and everybody

729
00:36:52,560 --> 00:36:54,719
Speaker 1: has to commute like nine hours in just to go

730
00:36:54,719 --> 00:36:57,000
Speaker 1: work at Starbucks or something like that. I think that's

731
00:36:57,040 --> 00:36:59,640
Speaker 1: a pathetic situation for the biggest, one of the biggest

732
00:36:59,680 --> 00:37:03,399
Speaker 1: cities in America, a beacon of our country itself. And

733
00:37:03,480 --> 00:37:05,479
Speaker 1: from that point of view, it is a very sad

734
00:37:05,520 --> 00:37:07,319
Speaker 1: state of affairs. I will say. I know the left

735
00:37:07,360 --> 00:37:09,479
Speaker 1: is very down on Yang. If he wins, it still

736
00:37:09,480 --> 00:37:13,320
Speaker 1: does change politics forever. I still truly believe that Yang

737
00:37:13,640 --> 00:37:17,440
Speaker 1: is such a post almost post cultural figure who rises

738
00:37:17,480 --> 00:37:20,319
Speaker 1: above like culture war in a way that I have

739
00:37:20,400 --> 00:37:23,200
Speaker 1: not seen in politics in a very long time. It's

740
00:37:23,239 --> 00:37:25,960
Speaker 1: also fascinating because he became famous by running for president.

741
00:37:26,120 --> 00:37:28,759
Speaker 1: It wasn't famous before he ran for president, so that

742
00:37:28,960 --> 00:37:31,200
Speaker 1: hasn't happened in a long time. I don't think it's

743
00:37:31,239 --> 00:37:33,000
Speaker 1: just the left that's down on Yang judgment by the

744
00:37:33,000 --> 00:37:37,080
Speaker 1: place he has lived quite a lot, and I really

745
00:37:37,080 --> 00:37:39,359
Speaker 1: think it comes down to something simple, which is part

746
00:37:39,480 --> 00:37:42,040
Speaker 1: of his magic that made him so compelling, is he

747
00:37:42,239 --> 00:37:44,640
Speaker 1: just seemed like this normal guy who was trying to

748
00:37:44,640 --> 00:37:48,120
Speaker 1: figure it out and super authentic and like war it

749
00:37:48,160 --> 00:37:50,160
Speaker 1: all out there and would answer any question you want

750
00:37:50,400 --> 00:37:52,960
Speaker 1: in the most direct way. Now he's teamed up with

751
00:37:53,000 --> 00:37:57,200
Speaker 1: these Bloomberg consultants, and you can tell in what he

752
00:37:57,360 --> 00:38:00,240
Speaker 1: says that this is what he's been told to say

753
00:38:00,360 --> 00:38:04,200
Speaker 1: in order to win. And so to me, on the

754
00:38:04,200 --> 00:38:06,600
Speaker 1: one hand, I see your point about the fact that

755
00:38:06,640 --> 00:38:09,520
Speaker 1: he just you know, became famous and running for president

756
00:38:09,640 --> 00:38:13,000
Speaker 1: and he really circumvented the traditional media and went on

757
00:38:13,040 --> 00:38:16,360
Speaker 1: all these independent media platforms, et cetera, et cetera. So yeah,

758
00:38:16,400 --> 00:38:18,680
Speaker 1: in that sense, but then if he wins, he did

759
00:38:18,680 --> 00:38:21,920
Speaker 1: it by becoming basically a standard issue politician, and so

760
00:38:22,600 --> 00:38:24,920
Speaker 1: it really muddles whether this is any kind of a

761
00:38:25,040 --> 00:38:28,120
Speaker 1: breakthrough point or not. I'll put it this way. It's

762
00:38:28,120 --> 00:38:31,040
Speaker 1: not the endpoint. It's V one. It's like the version

763
00:38:31,120 --> 00:38:33,000
Speaker 1: one of what I want to see which is in

764
00:38:33,000 --> 00:38:35,640
Speaker 1: the new style of why did he become famous in

765
00:38:35,640 --> 00:38:37,040
Speaker 1: the first place? And I agree with you. Look, Andrew,

766
00:38:37,080 --> 00:38:38,680
Speaker 1: by the way, if you ever watched this, you didn't

767
00:38:38,719 --> 00:38:40,919
Speaker 1: become famous by being, you know, like a Bradley Tusk

768
00:38:40,920 --> 00:38:44,880
Speaker 1: Bloomberg consultant. What you did was by showing. His greatest

769
00:38:44,920 --> 00:38:47,040
Speaker 1: moment on the campaign is when he said we're all

770
00:38:47,080 --> 00:38:49,920
Speaker 1: wearing makeup. This is theater in front of millions of

771
00:38:49,920 --> 00:38:53,960
Speaker 1: people that resonated with everyone. And so look how he

772
00:38:54,040 --> 00:38:56,279
Speaker 1: is as an actual mayor, and you know how he

773
00:38:56,360 --> 00:38:58,759
Speaker 1: is even now as a candidate. I actually do think

774
00:38:58,760 --> 00:39:01,080
Speaker 1: it's beside the point because that is v one in

775
00:39:01,160 --> 00:39:03,480
Speaker 1: my opinion of what the future could look like. But

776
00:39:03,560 --> 00:39:06,680
Speaker 1: you know, the sad thing is, I'm afraid if he

777
00:39:06,840 --> 00:39:09,000
Speaker 1: does win, and at this point, like I don't have

778
00:39:09,040 --> 00:39:11,000
Speaker 1: a dog of fight at this point, like I don't

779
00:39:11,040 --> 00:39:12,600
Speaker 1: know who I even want to win or who I

780
00:39:12,640 --> 00:39:14,760
Speaker 1: would vote for if I was there, et cetera, et cetera.

781
00:39:14,920 --> 00:39:18,279
Speaker 1: But I think the learning from this, unfortunately, it would

782
00:39:18,320 --> 00:39:20,919
Speaker 1: be if he did win, like, oh, he won by

783
00:39:21,480 --> 00:39:26,160
Speaker 1: doing the normal politician stuff and like pandering to these

784
00:39:26,200 --> 00:39:28,840
Speaker 1: groups that he knew were key to being able to

785
00:39:28,840 --> 00:39:31,279
Speaker 1: have success in the city. I don't know if it's

786
00:39:31,280 --> 00:39:33,280
Speaker 1: going to work out. The polls have been very dicey

787
00:39:33,320 --> 00:39:35,720
Speaker 1: for him. It seems like Catherine Garcia's kind of surging

788
00:39:35,800 --> 00:39:38,640
Speaker 1: or Adam's been very aggressive. Who knows if my Wiley

789
00:39:38,719 --> 00:39:40,839
Speaker 1: may have a last minute, like you know, if there's

790
00:39:40,840 --> 00:39:43,279
Speaker 1: a new coalescing around her. We really don't know, and

791
00:39:43,320 --> 00:39:45,439
Speaker 1: these races can be very fluid up to the end.

792
00:39:45,960 --> 00:39:49,680
Speaker 1: But but yeah, I sadly think that would be the takeaway,

793
00:39:49,719 --> 00:39:52,680
Speaker 1: whether it's the right takeaway or not, that he played

794
00:39:52,680 --> 00:39:56,839
Speaker 1: by the rules, got the political class consultantcs IN, had

795
00:39:56,880 --> 00:39:59,759
Speaker 1: the right poll tested messaging, and that that was the

796
00:39:59,840 --> 00:40:02,280
Speaker 1: key to success. So I'm not sure that the takeaway

797
00:40:02,280 --> 00:40:05,520
Speaker 1: would be what we wanted to. We'll see. Wow, you

798
00:40:05,520 --> 00:40:07,920
Speaker 1: guys must really like listening to our voices, because here

799
00:40:07,960 --> 00:40:10,520
Speaker 1: I am again asking you to become a premium member

800
00:40:10,560 --> 00:40:13,520
Speaker 1: at Crystalandsager dot com so you don't have to hear

801
00:40:13,600 --> 00:40:15,920
Speaker 1: these please, And as annoying as I know this is,

802
00:40:16,040 --> 00:40:18,279
Speaker 1: it's not a viiagric commercial like you're gonna see on

803
00:40:18,320 --> 00:40:20,920
Speaker 1: cable news. So go ahead and count your lucky stars

804
00:40:21,120 --> 00:40:23,440
Speaker 1: as you're about to notice the free show does not

805
00:40:23,640 --> 00:40:26,480
Speaker 1: include the discussion after each of our monologues, which is

806
00:40:26,520 --> 00:40:29,800
Speaker 1: one of our premium benefits. Help us beat the corporate

807
00:40:29,840 --> 00:40:33,120
Speaker 1: media today. Get access to the full show. Take care, guys.

808
00:40:33,440 --> 00:40:36,440
Speaker 1: All right, Sager, what are your breaking points? Wow? I

809
00:40:36,560 --> 00:40:39,840
Speaker 1: love that. The reason I am sitting at this beautiful

810
00:40:39,880 --> 00:40:42,799
Speaker 1: desk today is because of the Iraq War. All my

811
00:40:42,840 --> 00:40:45,560
Speaker 1: politics start there, the outrage that I felt at watching

812
00:40:45,600 --> 00:40:49,080
Speaker 1: American soldiers die for a despicable lie. It still sticks

813
00:40:49,080 --> 00:40:51,400
Speaker 1: with me to this day. And of course those who

814
00:40:51,560 --> 00:40:54,600
Speaker 1: ordered our sons into battle for nothing are most responsible,

815
00:40:54,840 --> 00:40:57,359
Speaker 1: and those who carried the lie on their behalf when

816
00:40:57,400 --> 00:40:59,640
Speaker 1: their job was to do the opposite, they bear a

817
00:40:59,680 --> 00:41:01,960
Speaker 1: lot of the blame to I never thought I would

818
00:41:01,960 --> 00:41:04,680
Speaker 1: actually live to see another screw up as bad as

819
00:41:04,719 --> 00:41:07,560
Speaker 1: the Iraq WMD. But I was wrong, and that has

820
00:41:07,600 --> 00:41:10,759
Speaker 1: become increasingly evident in the last several weeks as the

821
00:41:10,800 --> 00:41:14,400
Speaker 1: evidence mounts that coronavirus may have leaked from the Wuhan

822
00:41:14,480 --> 00:41:20,239
Speaker 1: Institute of Virology. Now a hypothesis which has been denigrated, debunked, dismissed,

823
00:41:20,520 --> 00:41:23,520
Speaker 1: cast aside, all but written off by our corporate press

824
00:41:23,640 --> 00:41:27,160
Speaker 1: for over a year, based upon a single premise they

825
00:41:27,200 --> 00:41:30,279
Speaker 1: just hated Trump. Hating Trump is not good enough of

826
00:41:30,320 --> 00:41:33,319
Speaker 1: a reason to cover up a true investigation into the

827
00:41:33,360 --> 00:41:37,040
Speaker 1: worst pandemic in a century. And as more information enters

828
00:41:37,080 --> 00:41:40,640
Speaker 1: the public domain, the worse the media looks. It's like

829
00:41:40,640 --> 00:41:43,560
Speaker 1: September two thousand and four all over again. The truth

830
00:41:43,640 --> 00:41:47,160
Speaker 1: is slowly dripping out, and instead of acknowledging their mistake

831
00:41:47,280 --> 00:41:50,200
Speaker 1: and coming clean with the American people, the cover up

832
00:41:50,320 --> 00:41:53,320
Speaker 1: only continues. That is the current state of the situation

833
00:41:53,560 --> 00:41:56,680
Speaker 1: with the latest release of doctor Anthony Fauci's emails. Now,

834
00:41:56,680 --> 00:41:58,960
Speaker 1: many Republicans and others have made a lot of the

835
00:41:59,000 --> 00:42:03,320
Speaker 1: emails regarding Fuji's own lies around mass and the pandemic guidance.

836
00:42:03,520 --> 00:42:06,520
Speaker 1: That's a whole other monologue in itself, but in my opinion,

837
00:42:06,640 --> 00:42:11,200
Speaker 1: the original question remains the most pressing. Did coronavirus leak

838
00:42:11,239 --> 00:42:13,640
Speaker 1: from the Wuhan lap? While we do not have the

839
00:42:13,640 --> 00:42:17,840
Speaker 1: full picture, the initial one emerging from Fauci's emails are stunning.

840
00:42:18,120 --> 00:42:22,440
Speaker 1: Fauci's emails show on January thirty first, twenty twenty, after

841
00:42:22,560 --> 00:42:26,200
Speaker 1: COVID's genome was decoded, he received an email from the

842
00:42:26,280 --> 00:42:30,520
Speaker 1: virus had quote unusual features and that quote one has

843
00:42:30,560 --> 00:42:33,600
Speaker 1: to look really closely at all the sequences to see

844
00:42:33,600 --> 00:42:38,520
Speaker 1: that some of the features potentially look engineered. Oh really,

845
00:42:38,719 --> 00:42:41,960
Speaker 1: the email continues, he and his team quote all find

846
00:42:42,080 --> 00:42:46,719
Speaker 1: the genome inconsistent with expectations from evolutionary theory. You know

847
00:42:46,800 --> 00:42:51,480
Speaker 1: what something inconsistent with evolutionary theory means. It means man made. Now,

848
00:42:51,480 --> 00:42:53,880
Speaker 1: the especially stunning part is that the author of that

849
00:42:53,960 --> 00:42:57,240
Speaker 1: email in January of twenty twenty was himself the ringleader

850
00:42:57,280 --> 00:43:01,640
Speaker 1: of a statement in March of twenty twenty which declare, unequivocally, quote,

851
00:43:01,680 --> 00:43:04,800
Speaker 1: we do not believe any type of laboratory based scenario

852
00:43:04,920 --> 00:43:09,560
Speaker 1: is plausible. What changed, Well, politics did the exact opposite

853
00:43:09,560 --> 00:43:11,920
Speaker 1: of what science is supposed to be concerned with. It

854
00:43:12,000 --> 00:43:14,800
Speaker 1: was in February of twenty twenty that Senator Tom Cotton

855
00:43:14,880 --> 00:43:17,400
Speaker 1: first appeared on the Fox News channel and positive that

856
00:43:17,440 --> 00:43:20,480
Speaker 1: coronavirus may have come from the Wuhan lab. Now, it

857
00:43:20,560 --> 00:43:24,200
Speaker 1: spawned a million takes and debunkings from the mainstream media,

858
00:43:24,520 --> 00:43:27,080
Speaker 1: and the theory was quickly recited by President Trump and

859
00:43:27,120 --> 00:43:30,440
Speaker 1: Secretary Pompeo as well. The culture War is the best

860
00:43:30,480 --> 00:43:33,360
Speaker 1: thing that ever happened to doctor Fauci and the scientists

861
00:43:33,600 --> 00:43:37,320
Speaker 1: why because they all had an institutional interest in making

862
00:43:37,360 --> 00:43:40,319
Speaker 1: sure that the potential truth never came to light that

863
00:43:40,400 --> 00:43:44,799
Speaker 1: coronavirus was a result of gain of function research, a

864
00:43:44,840 --> 00:43:47,960
Speaker 1: type of research they all spent their lives championing and

865
00:43:48,040 --> 00:43:52,279
Speaker 1: directing millions of dollars towards in service of allegedly trying

866
00:43:52,320 --> 00:43:55,319
Speaker 1: to stop a pandemic. The gravy train drives up if

867
00:43:55,360 --> 00:43:58,240
Speaker 1: the lab Leaue hypothesis is true. So they were happy

868
00:43:58,280 --> 00:44:01,200
Speaker 1: to be media darlings of the last year in service

869
00:44:01,200 --> 00:44:04,040
Speaker 1: of standing up against Trump to cover up what could

870
00:44:04,120 --> 00:44:07,320
Speaker 1: actually be the truth. Now. The email is particularly damning

871
00:44:07,360 --> 00:44:10,600
Speaker 1: because it reveals not only did the top scientists involved

872
00:44:10,600 --> 00:44:15,719
Speaker 1: in declaring coronavirus natural origin definitely disregard their own findings,

873
00:44:16,000 --> 00:44:18,920
Speaker 1: but it shows that Fauci was not being clear with

874
00:44:18,960 --> 00:44:21,799
Speaker 1: the American people. In this May twenty twenty interview with

875
00:44:21,880 --> 00:44:24,960
Speaker 1: National Geographic, he states, quote, if you look at the

876
00:44:25,000 --> 00:44:27,719
Speaker 1: evolution and virus and bats and what's out there, the

877
00:44:27,760 --> 00:44:31,600
Speaker 1: scientific evidence is very, very strongly leaning toward this could

878
00:44:31,640 --> 00:44:35,279
Speaker 1: not have been artificially or deliberately manipulated. Everything about the

879
00:44:35,280 --> 00:44:39,440
Speaker 1: stepwise evolution over time strongly indicates that this virus evolved

880
00:44:39,440 --> 00:44:43,680
Speaker 1: in nature and then jumped species. Oh really, the evidence

881
00:44:43,680 --> 00:44:47,040
Speaker 1: strongly leans that way. Huh, well, not according to information

882
00:44:47,200 --> 00:44:50,440
Speaker 1: he was directly aware of four months before that interview.

883
00:44:50,680 --> 00:44:53,960
Speaker 1: And worse, the emails also reveal that in April of

884
00:44:54,000 --> 00:44:58,160
Speaker 1: twenty twenty, doctor Peter Dazak, the person whose nonprofit funneled

885
00:44:58,200 --> 00:45:02,000
Speaker 1: money from Fauci to the Wuhan Lamb, emailed Fauci saying, quote,

886
00:45:02,080 --> 00:45:04,480
Speaker 1: I just wanted to say a personal thank you on

887
00:45:04,520 --> 00:45:07,600
Speaker 1: behalf of our staff and collaborators for publicly standing up

888
00:45:07,600 --> 00:45:10,640
Speaker 1: and stating that the scientific evidence supports a natural origin

889
00:45:10,880 --> 00:45:14,319
Speaker 1: for COVID nineteen. Just a reminder, Dazak is the only

890
00:45:14,360 --> 00:45:17,960
Speaker 1: American attached to the World Health Organization team who concluded

891
00:45:17,960 --> 00:45:20,520
Speaker 1: that the lab leak theory was not true. When it

892
00:45:20,600 --> 00:45:23,640
Speaker 1: was asked why this was his little response to sixty minutes,

893
00:45:23,719 --> 00:45:26,759
Speaker 1: Let's take a listen. Do you audit the lab? And

894
00:45:26,800 --> 00:45:29,960
Speaker 1: they said annually? Did you audit it after the outbreak? Yes?

895
00:45:30,080 --> 00:45:34,160
Speaker 1: Was anything found? No? Do you test your staff? Yes? No,

896
00:45:34,200 --> 00:45:36,759
Speaker 1: you're just taking their word for it. Well, what else

897
00:45:36,800 --> 00:45:38,799
Speaker 1: can we do. There's a limit to what you can do,

898
00:45:38,880 --> 00:45:42,839
Speaker 1: and we went right up to that limit. The more

899
00:45:42,920 --> 00:45:45,480
Speaker 1: information that comes to light, the more we begin to

900
00:45:45,520 --> 00:45:49,000
Speaker 1: see the makings of an immense conspiracy of public health

901
00:45:49,080 --> 00:45:53,240
Speaker 1: establishment seemingly caught in a gigantic mistake in the media

902
00:45:53,320 --> 00:45:56,000
Speaker 1: assisting them with a cover up because they hate Trump

903
00:45:56,280 --> 00:45:58,680
Speaker 1: and more than a year's long gas lighting of the

904
00:45:58,719 --> 00:46:02,919
Speaker 1: American people about one of the worst crises in modern memory. Now,

905
00:46:02,920 --> 00:46:05,120
Speaker 1: in a normal country, what I just told you would

906
00:46:05,160 --> 00:46:07,720
Speaker 1: be on the nightly news, but this is how NBC

907
00:46:07,920 --> 00:46:10,600
Speaker 1: is covering it. You can't even make these things up.

908
00:46:10,880 --> 00:46:13,799
Speaker 1: After a year of lies. The media cannot admit the

909
00:46:13,840 --> 00:46:17,200
Speaker 1: truth because it shows just how badly they screwed this up.

910
00:46:17,480 --> 00:46:19,720
Speaker 1: And luckily we're here to tell you what they won't.

911
00:46:19,880 --> 00:46:21,960
Speaker 1: Thank you for tuning in to our very first Breaking

912
00:46:21,960 --> 00:46:24,680
Speaker 1: Points monologue. It's just the first of many, and I

913
00:46:24,680 --> 00:46:28,040
Speaker 1: think Crystal, it's me again. Guys. We hope that you're

914
00:46:28,200 --> 00:46:30,960
Speaker 1: loving the show. If you have any questions, you know

915
00:46:30,960 --> 00:46:33,920
Speaker 1: where you can ask them. Go to Crystalinsager dot com.

916
00:46:33,960 --> 00:46:36,680
Speaker 1: Become a premium member and then you'll get to participate

917
00:46:36,760 --> 00:46:39,520
Speaker 1: and weekly ask me anything. The link is in the

918
00:46:39,520 --> 00:46:43,080
Speaker 1: show notes. What's absolutely stunning about all of this is

919
00:46:43,080 --> 00:46:47,040
Speaker 1: that in the emails it directly contradicts the scientists themselves

920
00:46:47,120 --> 00:46:50,640
Speaker 1: two months later, and it shows that Fauci was basically

921
00:46:50,719 --> 00:46:53,560
Speaker 1: lying whenever he said that the evidence strongly points to

922
00:46:53,600 --> 00:46:56,000
Speaker 1: something else. The evidence he was pointing to was the

923
00:46:56,080 --> 00:46:59,160
Speaker 1: letter put out by the guy who emailed him in

924
00:46:59,239 --> 00:47:02,000
Speaker 1: January of twenty twenty that this does not look of

925
00:47:02,040 --> 00:47:06,640
Speaker 1: evolutionary theory. I also love the term. I mean, here's

926
00:47:06,680 --> 00:47:09,120
Speaker 1: the thing. What happened in January twenty twenty, it wasn't

927
00:47:09,160 --> 00:47:11,400
Speaker 1: a culture war. What happened by March of twenty twenty

928
00:47:11,520 --> 00:47:13,600
Speaker 1: it was the culture war. I know what changed. It

929
00:47:13,640 --> 00:47:17,560
Speaker 1: wasn't the science. And amazingly around all of this is

930
00:47:17,719 --> 00:47:22,000
Speaker 1: you begin to see clearly how ideology mixes with their

931
00:47:22,080 --> 00:47:25,080
Speaker 1: moneyed interest, which is what they need to protect gain

932
00:47:25,120 --> 00:47:27,680
Speaker 1: of function research. And they rode this gravy chain for

933
00:47:27,719 --> 00:47:29,440
Speaker 1: a year. They probably thought they were going to get

934
00:47:29,440 --> 00:47:32,400
Speaker 1: away with it too. And here's the funniest part. Biden

935
00:47:32,520 --> 00:47:34,760
Speaker 1: winning may have been the worst thing that ever happened

936
00:47:34,800 --> 00:47:37,640
Speaker 1: to them, because it allowed us all to at least

937
00:47:37,719 --> 00:47:40,920
Speaker 1: have an honest conversation and let people lose all of

938
00:47:40,920 --> 00:47:44,879
Speaker 1: their stop losing their minds around whether this Lavely hypothesis

939
00:47:45,040 --> 00:47:48,880
Speaker 1: is true or not. I really reserved judgment on Fauci

940
00:47:48,920 --> 00:47:51,040
Speaker 1: for a very long time. Both did. I gave him

941
00:47:51,040 --> 00:47:52,719
Speaker 1: a lot of better, gave him a lot about it.

942
00:47:52,760 --> 00:47:55,160
Speaker 1: Even after the mask thing, We're like, all right, once

943
00:47:55,239 --> 00:47:58,080
Speaker 1: grew up, all right, you know, like he seems like

944
00:47:58,120 --> 00:48:00,440
Speaker 1: he's acting and he's really trying to act in every's

945
00:48:00,480 --> 00:48:02,880
Speaker 1: best interests, the very top position, etc. But when you

946
00:48:03,000 --> 00:48:07,360
Speaker 1: had at the beginning him lying about masks, then it

947
00:48:07,440 --> 00:48:11,760
Speaker 1: comes down that he's like changing the numbers on herd

948
00:48:11,760 --> 00:48:14,960
Speaker 1: immunity based on and he admitted this openly based on

949
00:48:15,040 --> 00:48:17,399
Speaker 1: what he thought the public could handle at that moment.

950
00:48:17,400 --> 00:48:20,360
Speaker 1: It's like, is not your job to be politician or

951
00:48:20,400 --> 00:48:23,799
Speaker 1: to be a spinmaster to decipher what the mood of

952
00:48:23,800 --> 00:48:26,520
Speaker 1: the American public is. It's your job to tell the truth.

953
00:48:27,080 --> 00:48:29,280
Speaker 1: And then in this I see a very similar dynamic

954
00:48:29,400 --> 00:48:33,840
Speaker 1: where he's playing games with what he thinks the public

955
00:48:33,960 --> 00:48:38,359
Speaker 1: should hear or wants to hear. It's also interesting what

956
00:48:38,400 --> 00:48:41,520
Speaker 1: you point out about the way that these like shiny

957
00:48:41,600 --> 00:48:44,160
Speaker 1: objects of the culture war can be used to hide

958
00:48:44,200 --> 00:48:47,240
Speaker 1: the truth. So the minute that you've got this narrative

959
00:48:47,360 --> 00:48:52,760
Speaker 1: that the Lablaque hypothesis is like the trumpy conspiracy theory,

960
00:48:53,040 --> 00:48:56,719
Speaker 1: and you layer on top of that this baseless insinuate

961
00:48:56,920 --> 00:49:00,239
Speaker 1: like allegation that it's somehow racist and more racist by

962
00:49:00,280 --> 00:49:02,440
Speaker 1: the way than the like, oh, Chinese people eat bats

963
00:49:02,480 --> 00:49:04,919
Speaker 1: and other weird stuff. The minute you have those two

964
00:49:04,960 --> 00:49:09,400
Speaker 1: things together, you have a sort of like airtight ability

965
00:49:09,880 --> 00:49:13,680
Speaker 1: to keep the truth of or at least the allegation,

966
00:49:13,840 --> 00:49:16,960
Speaker 1: or at least a real upfront investigation. You have an

967
00:49:17,000 --> 00:49:19,600
Speaker 1: ability to keep that under wraps. That's why this whole

968
00:49:19,600 --> 00:49:23,080
Speaker 1: episode is so revealing. Obviously, at the surface level, we

969
00:49:23,160 --> 00:49:25,960
Speaker 1: need to know what happened as best we can. We

970
00:49:26,040 --> 00:49:28,719
Speaker 1: may never know exactly because at this point so much

971
00:49:28,719 --> 00:49:31,440
Speaker 1: time has elapsed. But if you want to prevent a pandemic,

972
00:49:31,640 --> 00:49:34,000
Speaker 1: important to know how this last one started. But it's

973
00:49:34,080 --> 00:49:38,440
Speaker 1: just such a commentary on the way sectarian divisions cloud

974
00:49:38,480 --> 00:49:42,120
Speaker 1: our ability to see sort of basic facts. Clearly, the

975
00:49:42,160 --> 00:49:45,280
Speaker 1: way that Trump made all of that so much worse,

976
00:49:45,600 --> 00:49:47,680
Speaker 1: which is partly his fault and partly the fault of

977
00:49:47,719 --> 00:49:50,720
Speaker 1: the people whose brains he broke, and who intentionally also

978
00:49:51,000 --> 00:49:53,440
Speaker 1: used the fact that he was so awful and like

979
00:49:54,040 --> 00:49:58,440
Speaker 1: actively intentionally weaponized that to cover for themselves and to

980
00:49:58,560 --> 00:50:02,360
Speaker 1: escape any accountability themse And then you have this media

981
00:50:02,440 --> 00:50:04,920
Speaker 1: story too, where you know, in the SERI in the

982
00:50:04,960 --> 00:50:06,920
Speaker 1: over the course of just a couple of months, this

983
00:50:07,040 --> 00:50:11,040
Speaker 1: theory goes from like discredited, debunked, fact checked all this

984
00:50:11,080 --> 00:50:14,200
Speaker 1: stuff to like, oh, maybe there's more here than Times

985
00:50:14,239 --> 00:50:16,879
Speaker 1: said debunked as of just a few months ago, Yeah,

986
00:50:16,920 --> 00:50:18,960
Speaker 1: two months ago that they were calling it debunked in

987
00:50:19,000 --> 00:50:22,400
Speaker 1: a headline. I do think that that is so incredibly significant.

988
00:50:22,440 --> 00:50:25,360
Speaker 1: What else we cover here that the lead COVID reporter

989
00:50:25,560 --> 00:50:27,759
Speaker 1: for The New York Times says that the lab leak

990
00:50:27,880 --> 00:50:32,879
Speaker 1: theory itself has a racist origin. Yeah, okay, And all

991
00:50:32,920 --> 00:50:35,360
Speaker 1: of this comes down to a simple fact. Did it

992
00:50:35,400 --> 00:50:38,440
Speaker 1: come from the lab or not? It's a basic question it.

993
00:50:38,719 --> 00:50:41,880
Speaker 1: As I've said before too, the Chinese are liars. I

994
00:50:41,920 --> 00:50:44,000
Speaker 1: expect them to lie. You know what I don't expect

995
00:50:44,120 --> 00:50:47,160
Speaker 1: I don't expect our government to be complicit in funding

996
00:50:47,200 --> 00:50:49,920
Speaker 1: gain of function research which could have led to this

997
00:50:50,080 --> 00:50:53,680
Speaker 1: large pandemic outbreak. That's something that we can control. And

998
00:50:53,719 --> 00:50:56,200
Speaker 1: I love this too. What are we arguing about right now?

999
00:50:56,520 --> 00:50:59,920
Speaker 1: All of American politics cleaves along the line of January

1000
00:51:00,320 --> 00:51:03,759
Speaker 1: sixth Commission or not. You know what actually bears investigation.

1001
00:51:04,120 --> 00:51:06,920
Speaker 1: Did this virus leak from a lab? It is a

1002
00:51:07,080 --> 00:51:10,880
Speaker 1: job of Congress. They have subpoena authority over the intelligence community.

1003
00:51:11,040 --> 00:51:14,200
Speaker 1: Now we have all these new stories. Oh, the intelligence

1004
00:51:14,200 --> 00:51:17,239
Speaker 1: community believe so and so was sick. Yeah, maybe I

1005
00:51:17,280 --> 00:51:19,240
Speaker 1: want to see the evidence. I mean, I don't trust

1006
00:51:19,280 --> 00:51:21,239
Speaker 1: these people as far as we can throw them. The

1007
00:51:21,360 --> 00:51:23,400
Speaker 1: only thing that the nine to eleven Commission was actually

1008
00:51:23,440 --> 00:51:27,200
Speaker 1: good for was declassifying a lot of the initial cables

1009
00:51:27,360 --> 00:51:29,880
Speaker 1: around some of the screw ups between the FBI, the

1010
00:51:29,880 --> 00:51:32,920
Speaker 1: CIA and the lack of coordination. I want to see

1011
00:51:33,040 --> 00:51:36,840
Speaker 1: the raw intelligence report from the people who determined this

1012
00:51:36,960 --> 00:51:40,520
Speaker 1: sickness came in November twenty nineteen for the WUHAN staffers.

1013
00:51:40,640 --> 00:51:42,719
Speaker 1: I want to see all of the stuff that is

1014
00:51:42,760 --> 00:51:46,400
Speaker 1: out there. It is of immense public import that we

1015
00:51:46,480 --> 00:51:49,760
Speaker 1: get this out there, not only to America, to the globe.

1016
00:51:49,960 --> 00:51:53,319
Speaker 1: If gain of function research just led to trillions of

1017
00:51:53,360 --> 00:51:57,319
Speaker 1: dollars shutdown of the global economy, everybody deserves to know.

1018
00:51:57,719 --> 00:52:00,200
Speaker 1: The other thing that was interesting about you email a

1019
00:52:00,200 --> 00:52:03,160
Speaker 1: little bit like of a side tangent from the focus

1020
00:52:03,239 --> 00:52:05,839
Speaker 1: of the lap leakue focus. But there were all these

1021
00:52:05,880 --> 00:52:08,520
Speaker 1: reporters who were like emailing and love, tell me the

1022
00:52:08,560 --> 00:52:11,280
Speaker 1: truth about Trump stifling you, tell me the truth about

1023
00:52:11,280 --> 00:52:13,759
Speaker 1: how you're being muzzled. Yeah, which is I mean, you

1024
00:52:13,800 --> 00:52:16,799
Speaker 1: can just see like they wanted to write that story

1025
00:52:17,560 --> 00:52:21,319
Speaker 1: and they're just begging for the good and he's repeatedly like, no, no,

1026
00:52:21,360 --> 00:52:24,200
Speaker 1: I don't feel like that, and no, I appreciate your concern,

1027
00:52:24,200 --> 00:52:26,680
Speaker 1: et cetera, et cetera. The other thing that maybe more

1028
00:52:26,719 --> 00:52:29,160
Speaker 1: than anything, struck me about these emails is just how

1029
00:52:29,360 --> 00:52:33,080
Speaker 1: cozy the a lot of the journalists who had a

1030
00:52:33,120 --> 00:52:36,800
Speaker 1: longtime relationship with him, like Donald McNeil, Like Donald McNeil

1031
00:52:37,239 --> 00:52:40,279
Speaker 1: felt they they had this very cozy relationship with him

1032
00:52:40,320 --> 00:52:42,839
Speaker 1: where they're emailing him and what feels like a very

1033
00:52:42,880 --> 00:52:48,880
Speaker 1: personal way as more friends than as you know, reporter

1034
00:52:49,200 --> 00:52:52,600
Speaker 1: and subject of said reporting. And so you can see

1035
00:52:52,640 --> 00:52:57,279
Speaker 1: how some of these failings of Fauci throughout the pandemic,

1036
00:52:57,760 --> 00:53:00,359
Speaker 1: they just get overlooked by the press. They don't dig

1037
00:53:00,400 --> 00:53:03,080
Speaker 1: into it, they don't ask hard questions about it. There's

1038
00:53:03,120 --> 00:53:05,680
Speaker 1: never any critical coverage because this is their buddy, and

1039
00:53:05,719 --> 00:53:11,360
Speaker 1: that's Fuji's not unique in that way. This is power literally,

1040
00:53:11,640 --> 00:53:14,600
Speaker 1: like this is standard operating procedure where the more that

1041
00:53:14,680 --> 00:53:18,799
Speaker 1: you the more that you have these chummy relationships in

1042
00:53:18,840 --> 00:53:21,720
Speaker 1: this town with people in power and authority, the higher

1043
00:53:21,760 --> 00:53:25,839
Speaker 1: you rise in these elite legacy media organizations. And I mean,

1044
00:53:25,880 --> 00:53:27,680
Speaker 1: on the one hand, it makes sense because that means

1045
00:53:27,680 --> 00:53:29,719
Speaker 1: you've got all these sources. You may be able to

1046
00:53:29,719 --> 00:53:32,640
Speaker 1: get scoops and stories that other people can't get, but

1047
00:53:33,200 --> 00:53:36,880
Speaker 1: it comes with a massive price of basically, you have

1048
00:53:36,960 --> 00:53:39,520
Speaker 1: to treat these people with kid gloves and be their

1049
00:53:39,560 --> 00:53:41,920
Speaker 1: best friend if you want to get those stories. And

1050
00:53:41,920 --> 00:53:44,400
Speaker 1: that means that when it is the people in power

1051
00:53:44,680 --> 00:53:49,040
Speaker 1: who are doing the bad things, the critical coverage doesn't come. Why,

1052
00:53:49,080 --> 00:53:50,880
Speaker 1: because you want to preserve your network, you want to

1053
00:53:50,920 --> 00:53:54,080
Speaker 1: preserve your relationship, you want to preserve your access. So

1054
00:53:54,320 --> 00:53:56,799
Speaker 1: I also thought the emails maybe more than anything, I

1055
00:53:56,800 --> 00:53:59,080
Speaker 1: thought that was kind of like the most fascinating point.

1056
00:53:59,080 --> 00:54:02,400
Speaker 1: I think you're absolutely right. I call it down payments

1057
00:54:02,440 --> 00:54:05,000
Speaker 1: on the future, which is that what you do, is

1058
00:54:05,080 --> 00:54:07,799
Speaker 1: what these elites do, is they build up credibility in

1059
00:54:07,840 --> 00:54:11,160
Speaker 1: relationships with reporters so that when the big one comes coronavirus,

1060
00:54:11,280 --> 00:54:13,560
Speaker 1: that it all pays off for everybody. The reporters have

1061
00:54:13,600 --> 00:54:16,080
Speaker 1: your phone number and you have they know they can

1062
00:54:16,120 --> 00:54:19,080
Speaker 1: trust you, and so you can spin them whoever they want.

1063
00:54:19,120 --> 00:54:21,880
Speaker 1: And that down payment could have cost America a lot

1064
00:54:21,920 --> 00:54:23,840
Speaker 1: in the last years. Yeah, and you're right, that's what

1065
00:54:23,920 --> 00:54:26,600
Speaker 1: Donald McNeil admitted to that. He admitted that out right,

1066
00:54:26,640 --> 00:54:29,799
Speaker 1: how long some ways are respectable? Yeah, I actually appreciate that.

1067
00:54:29,880 --> 00:54:32,960
Speaker 1: He said, Like, here was my thinking and why I

1068
00:54:33,080 --> 00:54:37,040
Speaker 1: dismissed this theory out of hand because I trusted doctor Fauci,

1069
00:54:37,080 --> 00:54:39,320
Speaker 1: because I'd worked with him, and I thought he'd always

1070
00:54:39,360 --> 00:54:41,719
Speaker 1: been a good actor, et cetera, et cetera. And so

1071
00:54:42,239 --> 00:54:46,239
Speaker 1: you multiply that by a thousand, and that's exactly what's

1072
00:54:46,280 --> 00:54:49,720
Speaker 1: going on behind the scenes at all of these organizations. Absolutely. Okay, Christal,

1073
00:54:49,840 --> 00:54:53,959
Speaker 1: what are your breaking points? Well, an Amazon delivery driver

1074
00:54:54,280 --> 00:54:57,560
Speaker 1: just won the million dollar vaccine lottery in Ohio. So

1075
00:54:57,640 --> 00:55:00,080
Speaker 1: as you may recall, that state is offering five one

1076
00:55:00,160 --> 00:55:02,720
Speaker 1: million dollar prizes to adults who get vaccinated, with winners

1077
00:55:02,760 --> 00:55:05,799
Speaker 1: who are selected randomly in a lottery. Here's what that

1078
00:55:05,920 --> 00:55:08,960
Speaker 1: delivery driver, whose name is Jonathan Carlile, said he would

1079
00:55:08,960 --> 00:55:11,600
Speaker 1: do with the money. You just want a million dollars?

1080
00:55:11,760 --> 00:55:15,160
Speaker 1: How the hell do you feel it's overwhelming? I don't

1081
00:55:15,160 --> 00:55:18,320
Speaker 1: know what to do. I'm just still dreaming. I know

1082
00:55:18,360 --> 00:55:20,719
Speaker 1: I got all it deals say, so this is the

1083
00:55:20,760 --> 00:55:25,520
Speaker 1: first thing that's going to happen. Jonathan goes on to

1084
00:55:25,560 --> 00:55:27,560
Speaker 1: say that he might also use the money to help

1085
00:55:27,600 --> 00:55:29,440
Speaker 1: him get a house, that he knows that he's going

1086
00:55:29,480 --> 00:55:30,960
Speaker 1: to have to keep working, and that he is in

1087
00:55:31,080 --> 00:55:33,640
Speaker 1: any way set for life, but it would provide what

1088
00:55:33,719 --> 00:55:36,000
Speaker 1: he described as a good bedrock. It's a sort of

1089
00:55:36,080 --> 00:55:38,120
Speaker 1: version of the American dream, the chance to be a winner,

1090
00:55:38,160 --> 00:55:40,600
Speaker 1: to change your life, to obtain all the trappings of

1091
00:55:40,640 --> 00:55:44,240
Speaker 1: American affluence. It's just that at this point it takes

1092
00:55:44,520 --> 00:55:47,840
Speaker 1: literally winning a million dollar lottery to be able to

1093
00:55:47,920 --> 00:55:51,840
Speaker 1: achieve that American dream. Just think about that. Jonathan Carlile

1094
00:55:51,920 --> 00:55:55,800
Speaker 1: works a brutally difficult job for literally the most successful

1095
00:55:55,800 --> 00:55:58,200
Speaker 1: company on the planet, founded by the richest man on

1096
00:55:58,239 --> 00:56:01,520
Speaker 1: the planet, and without winning there's a lottery, he can't

1097
00:56:01,520 --> 00:56:04,080
Speaker 1: stay current on his bills, let alone dream of buying

1098
00:56:04,120 --> 00:56:07,240
Speaker 1: a house for him and his girlfriend. So what happened?

1099
00:56:07,760 --> 00:56:11,799
Speaker 1: Why is grinding ever escalating inequality the norm in America?

1100
00:56:11,880 --> 00:56:14,799
Speaker 1: Why are we stuck in the neoliberal health cycle when

1101
00:56:14,840 --> 00:56:17,520
Speaker 1: we could be doing so much more for people at least.

1102
00:56:17,520 --> 00:56:19,319
Speaker 1: Some of the solutions to give everyone a life of

1103
00:56:19,320 --> 00:56:22,959
Speaker 1: basic dignity are well known and well available. Yet nothing

1104
00:56:22,960 --> 00:56:27,200
Speaker 1: ever seems to fundamentally change. Where is the class conflict

1105
00:56:27,320 --> 00:56:31,040
Speaker 1: that should be central to a wildly unequal moment such

1106
00:56:31,040 --> 00:56:35,200
Speaker 1: as this will new paper from renowned leftist economist Thomas Spaghetti,

1107
00:56:35,280 --> 00:56:39,680
Speaker 1: Amory Gethen, and Clara Martinez TOLDNANO offer some important insights

1108
00:56:39,719 --> 00:56:43,720
Speaker 1: into the forces that may be preventing significant structural change, beyond,

1109
00:56:43,800 --> 00:56:46,360
Speaker 1: of course, the obvious failings of the American political class.

1110
00:56:46,760 --> 00:56:50,360
Speaker 1: The paper is titled Brahmin Left Versus Merchant Right, Changing

1111
00:56:50,360 --> 00:56:54,279
Speaker 1: Political Cleavages in twenty one Western democracies nineteen forty eight

1112
00:56:54,320 --> 00:56:57,560
Speaker 1: through twenty twenty, and it explores a persistent trend in

1113
00:56:57,719 --> 00:57:01,200
Speaker 1: twenty one different countries where educated elites have been moving

1114
00:57:01,239 --> 00:57:04,640
Speaker 1: towards the left of center parties and financial elites have

1115
00:57:04,680 --> 00:57:07,920
Speaker 1: remained in the right of center parties. So that means

1116
00:57:08,239 --> 00:57:11,239
Speaker 1: that both sides the political spectrum are ruled by a

1117
00:57:11,280 --> 00:57:14,239
Speaker 1: different set of elites. So while working class people remain

1118
00:57:14,320 --> 00:57:18,440
Speaker 1: atomize split across the political spectrum, elites continue to defend

1119
00:57:18,480 --> 00:57:22,520
Speaker 1: their economic class interests, focusing political conflict around culture and

1120
00:57:22,600 --> 00:57:26,840
Speaker 1: identity issues rather than on issues of economic fairness and redistribution.

1121
00:57:27,280 --> 00:57:29,560
Speaker 1: As they put it in fancy academic language in that

1122
00:57:29,680 --> 00:57:32,840
Speaker 1: paper quote. A key result from this literature is that

1123
00:57:32,880 --> 00:57:36,880
Speaker 1: political support for redistribution should be inversely proportional to the

1124
00:57:36,920 --> 00:57:40,840
Speaker 1: strength of other political cleavages. Cross cutting class divides. The

1125
00:57:40,880 --> 00:57:43,640
Speaker 1: divergence of the effects of income and education on the

1126
00:57:43,760 --> 00:57:47,320
Speaker 1: vote documented in this paper to strongly correlated measures of

1127
00:57:47,360 --> 00:57:50,640
Speaker 1: inequality could in this context contribute to explaining why the

1128
00:57:50,760 --> 00:57:54,000
Speaker 1: rise of economic disparities in the past decades has not

1129
00:57:54,480 --> 00:57:58,680
Speaker 1: been met by greater redistribution or renewed class conflicts. In

1130
00:57:58,720 --> 00:58:01,640
Speaker 1: other words, the data compiled from twenty one different Western

1131
00:58:01,680 --> 00:58:07,280
Speaker 1: democracies shows that culture wars kill economic populism. It says

1132
00:58:07,600 --> 00:58:10,720
Speaker 1: that the places where sectarian strife are the worst and

1133
00:58:10,760 --> 00:58:13,640
Speaker 1: where identity and culture are at the center of political

1134
00:58:13,720 --> 00:58:16,960
Speaker 1: debate are also the places where inequality is highest and

1135
00:58:17,040 --> 00:58:20,280
Speaker 1: life is the most brutal. For the working class at

1136
00:58:20,360 --> 00:58:22,880
Speaker 1: least can feel comfortable in either party year because they

1137
00:58:22,920 --> 00:58:26,880
Speaker 1: will see their economic interest protected either way, politics collapses

1138
00:58:26,920 --> 00:58:31,360
Speaker 1: down to in group signaling and cultural posturing rather than policy.

1139
00:58:31,880 --> 00:58:34,680
Speaker 1: Things like this start to count as politics just take

1140
00:58:34,680 --> 00:58:38,040
Speaker 1: a look at this. It's a totally content free bs

1141
00:58:38,200 --> 00:58:40,960
Speaker 1: gesture just to signal to a Republican base in Ohio

1142
00:58:41,000 --> 00:58:44,720
Speaker 1: that this candidate will fearlessly own the Libs. Or you

1143
00:58:44,720 --> 00:58:48,840
Speaker 1: could consider the liberal equivalent of Mandel's nonsense there Hattap,

1144
00:58:48,920 --> 00:58:50,960
Speaker 1: by the way, to Thomas Frank for pointing this one out.

1145
00:58:51,440 --> 00:58:55,280
Speaker 1: Behold this sign which declares, in this house we believe

1146
00:58:55,520 --> 00:58:58,440
Speaker 1: black lives matter, women's rights or human rights. No human

1147
00:58:58,520 --> 00:59:02,160
Speaker 1: is illegal, science is real, Love is love, Kindness is everything.

1148
00:59:02,200 --> 00:59:04,000
Speaker 1: It's a sign you can buy from the modern day

1149
00:59:04,000 --> 00:59:06,400
Speaker 1: sweatship of Amazon for the low low price of seven

1150
00:59:06,400 --> 00:59:09,160
Speaker 1: dollars and ninety nine cents. You can find this sign

1151
00:59:09,320 --> 00:59:11,560
Speaker 1: and ones very similar to it in the yards of

1152
00:59:11,680 --> 00:59:15,280
Speaker 1: rich liberals all across the city. And look, I agree

1153
00:59:15,320 --> 00:59:18,040
Speaker 1: with all of these vague sentiments, but you can't help

1154
00:59:18,040 --> 00:59:20,880
Speaker 1: but notice that not one of them includes a concrete,

1155
00:59:20,920 --> 00:59:24,960
Speaker 1: actionable policy demand, and none have anything to do with economics.

1156
00:59:25,000 --> 00:59:28,080
Speaker 1: There's no healthcare, no living wage, certainly no union rights.

1157
00:59:28,480 --> 00:59:31,320
Speaker 1: Love is love and kindness is everything are very nice

1158
00:59:31,400 --> 00:59:34,280
Speaker 1: values that require only things from Nancy Pelosi that she

1159
00:59:34,400 --> 00:59:36,920
Speaker 1: is willing to offer, such as kneeling and kentake cloth

1160
00:59:37,480 --> 00:59:40,240
Speaker 1: in Piquetti's paper. He and his co author's note there

1161
00:59:40,240 --> 00:59:43,600
Speaker 1: are two actual exceptions to the trend of educational leits

1162
00:59:43,600 --> 00:59:46,320
Speaker 1: moving to the left of center party, and those exceptions

1163
00:59:46,360 --> 00:59:49,840
Speaker 1: are Ireland and Portugal. It's important to note how those

1164
00:59:49,880 --> 00:59:53,400
Speaker 1: two countries have bucked the trend. In those nations, new

1165
00:59:53,480 --> 00:59:56,320
Speaker 1: left wing parties found success after the two thousand and

1166
00:59:56,320 --> 00:59:58,960
Speaker 1: eight financial crisis, and they managed to keep class based

1167
00:59:58,960 --> 01:00:03,480
Speaker 1: concerns front and center rather than cultural or sectarian divides.

1168
01:00:03,880 --> 01:00:06,200
Speaker 1: At the other end of the spectrum is the US,

1169
01:00:06,440 --> 01:00:09,760
Speaker 1: where not only have education elites moved left, but nearly

1170
01:00:09,840 --> 01:00:15,200
Speaker 1: alone among Western democracies, financial elites have also begun consolidating

1171
01:00:15,360 --> 01:00:19,840
Speaker 1: in the Democratic Party. So deep are our intentionally stoked

1172
01:00:19,880 --> 01:00:23,880
Speaker 1: sectarian divisions, so class loyal are the Democrats, and so

1173
01:00:24,120 --> 01:00:27,720
Speaker 1: just completely insane are the Republicans that elites of all

1174
01:00:27,760 --> 01:00:31,600
Speaker 1: stripes have flocked freely to the Democratic Party without doubting

1175
01:00:31,720 --> 01:00:34,520
Speaker 1: for a single moment that their class interests are going

1176
01:00:34,560 --> 01:00:38,000
Speaker 1: to be protected. Instead, we have political skirmishes over the

1177
01:00:38,040 --> 01:00:42,240
Speaker 1: battleground of a January sixth Commission or personal mask wearing choices,

1178
01:00:42,320 --> 01:00:45,480
Speaker 1: as just a few examples. At its core, though, this

1179
01:00:45,640 --> 01:00:49,360
Speaker 1: paper really questions the feasibility of the American dream, the

1180
01:00:49,360 --> 01:00:52,360
Speaker 1: American dream that says anyone from anywhere can make it here,

1181
01:00:52,680 --> 01:00:54,320
Speaker 1: the one that says you don't have to win a

1182
01:00:54,400 --> 01:00:57,160
Speaker 1: damn lottery to pay your bills, buy a house, and

1183
01:00:57,280 --> 01:01:00,000
Speaker 1: lay down that stable bedrock of a middle class life,

1184
01:01:00,560 --> 01:01:03,080
Speaker 1: but also the American dream that says we can make

1185
01:01:03,120 --> 01:01:06,600
Speaker 1: a functional and just nation out of an idea rather

1186
01:01:06,640 --> 01:01:10,400
Speaker 1: than a singular ethnic identity. Are we doomed to watch

1187
01:01:10,600 --> 01:01:13,920
Speaker 1: cynical elites leverage our human differences for fun and profit

1188
01:01:14,160 --> 01:01:17,200
Speaker 1: while serving as a grand distraction from any sort of redistribution.

1189
01:01:17,680 --> 01:01:20,880
Speaker 1: Will we just endlessly repeat the cycle of letting the

1190
01:01:20,920 --> 01:01:23,360
Speaker 1: news media convince us that the greatest threat to our

1191
01:01:23,360 --> 01:01:26,800
Speaker 1: existence is not a rigged and corrupted system, but our

1192
01:01:26,800 --> 01:01:30,760
Speaker 1: neighbors who happen to have different political or cultural beliefs. Now,

1193
01:01:30,800 --> 01:01:33,440
Speaker 1: I reject the cynicism that says that this outcome of

1194
01:01:33,480 --> 01:01:37,560
Speaker 1: sectarian strife and skyrocketing inequality is inevitable, but it is

1195
01:01:37,600 --> 01:01:39,560
Speaker 1: certainly good to know what we are up against here

1196
01:01:39,880 --> 01:01:42,560
Speaker 1: the barriers that are in our way, and those barriers

1197
01:01:42,600 --> 01:01:45,040
Speaker 1: look a lot like the Democratic Party convincing us that

1198
01:01:45,120 --> 01:01:47,800
Speaker 1: Joe Biden not being Donald Trump is enough. It looks

1199
01:01:47,800 --> 01:01:50,800
Speaker 1: a lot like Republicans pretending their anti corporate because they

1200
01:01:50,840 --> 01:01:54,240
Speaker 1: tweet something about woke HR departments and all of us

1201
01:01:54,280 --> 01:01:57,880
Speaker 1: accepting these gestures and symbols as meaningful change when they

1202
01:01:57,960 --> 01:02:01,600
Speaker 1: are anything but. And Sager, the paper is not that long,

1203
01:02:01,680 --> 01:02:05,720
Speaker 1: and it's actually incredibly important because for the first time

1204
01:02:06,200 --> 01:02:10,120
Speaker 1: they compile data about where elites have shifted in these parties.

1205
01:02:10,120 --> 01:02:12,720
Speaker 1: And it's not just the US, and it's not just

1206
01:02:12,800 --> 01:02:16,120
Speaker 1: a last five years phenomenon. This has been happening over

1207
01:02:16,200 --> 01:02:19,640
Speaker 1: decades and decades. And then they tie it together to Okay, well,

1208
01:02:19,720 --> 01:02:22,600
Speaker 1: the countries that are outliers and have resisted this trend

1209
01:02:22,640 --> 01:02:25,120
Speaker 1: and have been able to maintain some sort of class politics.

1210
01:02:25,400 --> 01:02:28,240
Speaker 1: What is different about those countries and what they find

1211
01:02:28,400 --> 01:02:32,160
Speaker 1: is that they've had lefty parties that have centered class

1212
01:02:32,160 --> 01:02:35,600
Speaker 1: consciousness and class politics, and that is what has sort

1213
01:02:35,600 --> 01:02:38,360
Speaker 1: of rebuffed the trend. The US is the worst of

1214
01:02:38,400 --> 01:02:42,600
Speaker 1: all the countries in that it's not just the education elites,

1215
01:02:42,640 --> 01:02:44,560
Speaker 1: but it's also the financial elites who have started to

1216
01:02:44,600 --> 01:02:47,400
Speaker 1: coalesce into the Democratic Party. And then, weirdly though, you

1217
01:02:47,440 --> 01:02:49,680
Speaker 1: still have the Republican Party like doing the bidding of

1218
01:02:49,720 --> 01:02:51,840
Speaker 1: the elites who are fleeing them like the plagus that

1219
01:02:51,920 --> 01:02:55,560
Speaker 1: I've realized. It's an amazing situation. The Republicans are professional opposition.

1220
01:02:55,640 --> 01:02:59,120
Speaker 1: They're like a permanent rentier class who will use the

1221
01:02:59,280 --> 01:03:03,000
Speaker 1: cultural even of a portion of the population and sell

1222
01:03:03,040 --> 01:03:07,000
Speaker 1: that as arbitrage to the financial and basically oil elite

1223
01:03:07,080 --> 01:03:09,840
Speaker 1: in order to stand up for their interests. In our politics.

1224
01:03:09,840 --> 01:03:12,920
Speaker 1: They've still got the oil elite. Oh yeah, my home state.

1225
01:03:14,240 --> 01:03:16,880
Speaker 1: You know. It's fascinating to see it because what I'm

1226
01:03:16,920 --> 01:03:20,440
Speaker 1: realizing is America. One guys, this is what the American

1227
01:03:20,440 --> 01:03:25,120
Speaker 1: empire looks. We've exported our values to the entire Western

1228
01:03:25,160 --> 01:03:28,400
Speaker 1: world and ruined all of This is the final triumph

1229
01:03:28,480 --> 01:03:30,840
Speaker 1: of the Marshall Plan, which is that what we've done

1230
01:03:31,040 --> 01:03:34,880
Speaker 1: is that our empire across the Western world has inculcated

1231
01:03:34,920 --> 01:03:40,160
Speaker 1: these total westernization, globalization of the interconnected culture, and our

1232
01:03:40,200 --> 01:03:43,720
Speaker 1: politics have become exactly the same. In France, in Germany,

1233
01:03:43,800 --> 01:03:47,040
Speaker 1: across the European Union, I mean they literally connected themselves.

1234
01:03:47,160 --> 01:03:49,680
Speaker 1: And then here at home, Portugal and Ireland being the

1235
01:03:49,800 --> 01:03:54,240
Speaker 1: rarest of exceptions, they have very distinct populations, religiosities and

1236
01:03:54,280 --> 01:03:56,960
Speaker 1: other things. It's very very unique situation. But if you

1237
01:03:57,040 --> 01:04:00,480
Speaker 1: take which companies which are more pan ethnic, which are

1238
01:04:00,680 --> 01:04:04,400
Speaker 1: more you know, less homogeneous, and such larger, more integral

1239
01:04:04,480 --> 01:04:07,720
Speaker 1: to the global economy, especially like America, this is what happens.

1240
01:04:07,960 --> 01:04:11,880
Speaker 1: And I think it's stunning to see how our both

1241
01:04:11,880 --> 01:04:15,280
Speaker 1: of our party systems have become flocked towards these elites.

1242
01:04:15,600 --> 01:04:17,520
Speaker 1: And it's not an accident, which is that it's the

1243
01:04:17,600 --> 01:04:20,720
Speaker 1: greatest thing that ever happened to them, the ability to

1244
01:04:20,800 --> 01:04:25,560
Speaker 1: own both because it does essentially ensure that nothing will happen,

1245
01:04:25,840 --> 01:04:29,040
Speaker 1: and as long as nothing happens, the status quo continues.

1246
01:04:29,200 --> 01:04:32,480
Speaker 1: And I don't think that people appreciate how much that

1247
01:04:32,640 --> 01:04:35,600
Speaker 1: is actually worth to the American ruling class. People say

1248
01:04:35,600 --> 01:04:37,400
Speaker 1: all the time to be like, oh, well, you know,

1249
01:04:37,440 --> 01:04:40,720
Speaker 1: why would people donate to someone because nothing's happening in Congress. Well,

1250
01:04:40,720 --> 01:04:42,400
Speaker 1: first of all, some stuff does happen, you don't hear

1251
01:04:42,400 --> 01:04:45,040
Speaker 1: about it. It's usually tax breaks and extensions on the

1252
01:04:45,080 --> 01:04:48,640
Speaker 1: defense budget, stuff like that. But status quo is great.

1253
01:04:48,760 --> 01:04:50,480
Speaker 1: I mean, look at the tax rate, right like, look

1254
01:04:50,520 --> 01:04:53,000
Speaker 1: at the way that people move money around, look at

1255
01:04:53,040 --> 01:04:55,240
Speaker 1: the estate tax, and then what happened with the corporate

1256
01:04:55,320 --> 01:04:58,440
Speaker 1: tax rate. It's all at a historic low. Keeping things

1257
01:04:58,520 --> 01:05:01,560
Speaker 1: exactly where they are is an in kind donation to

1258
01:05:01,680 --> 01:05:05,120
Speaker 1: the billionaire class. Yeah, well, it really solves a puzzle.

1259
01:05:05,560 --> 01:05:09,000
Speaker 1: That is something we've been i think asking ourselves for

1260
01:05:09,040 --> 01:05:11,880
Speaker 1: a while now, which is when you have this state

1261
01:05:11,880 --> 01:05:15,360
Speaker 1: of affairs of a country that is very wealthy in

1262
01:05:15,400 --> 01:05:18,080
Speaker 1: the US, and you know, you just look over the

1263
01:05:18,080 --> 01:05:22,800
Speaker 1: past year at the trillions of dollars that billionaires have accumulated.

1264
01:05:22,960 --> 01:05:25,520
Speaker 1: As every one else was here, we can go through

1265
01:05:25,560 --> 01:05:27,280
Speaker 1: all of the statistics. It's going to be the worst

1266
01:05:27,400 --> 01:05:30,440
Speaker 1: year ever for opioid deaths, it's going to be the

1267
01:05:30,480 --> 01:05:33,520
Speaker 1: worst year ever for suicides. You know, you have and

1268
01:05:33,840 --> 01:05:36,520
Speaker 1: that's a little unique to the pandemic, but these are

1269
01:05:36,560 --> 01:05:39,680
Speaker 1: trends that have been mounting and mounting and mounting over years,

1270
01:05:39,720 --> 01:05:42,000
Speaker 1: to the point that certain demographics are seeing their life

1271
01:05:42,000 --> 01:05:47,360
Speaker 1: expectancy decline. Right, So you have this endemic misery, you

1272
01:05:47,480 --> 01:05:52,320
Speaker 1: have this mass inequality, you have just a blatant exploitation

1273
01:05:53,000 --> 01:05:58,240
Speaker 1: in corporate workplaces across the country, and yet you don't

1274
01:05:58,320 --> 01:06:03,400
Speaker 1: have a massive like public uprising or any responsiveness whatsoever,

1275
01:06:03,520 --> 01:06:06,440
Speaker 1: certainly from the political system. Because you do see occasional

1276
01:06:06,480 --> 01:06:09,080
Speaker 1: flayers you saw like the teacher strike, right, you saw

1277
01:06:09,200 --> 01:06:12,320
Speaker 1: certainly the Black Lives Matter movement over the summer, triggered

1278
01:06:12,320 --> 01:06:14,720
Speaker 1: by George Floyd's murder. But there was a lot of

1279
01:06:14,880 --> 01:06:18,200
Speaker 1: just like upset and grievance over all kinds of conditions

1280
01:06:18,240 --> 01:06:21,040
Speaker 1: going on there too. But you don't see the political

1281
01:06:21,080 --> 01:06:25,680
Speaker 1: system responding in any way at all. Why how can

1282
01:06:25,720 --> 01:06:28,080
Speaker 1: they get away with that? Like? How do they keep

1283
01:06:28,080 --> 01:06:31,800
Speaker 1: getting elected? I was just reading this bogus article from

1284
01:06:32,160 --> 01:06:36,000
Speaker 1: NBC News that was like, Joe Biden abandons the public

1285
01:06:36,000 --> 01:06:39,400
Speaker 1: option and the left is okay with that. It's like, okay,

1286
01:06:39,560 --> 01:06:42,880
Speaker 1: just because AOC is maybe not like maybe, doesn't mean

1287
01:06:42,920 --> 01:06:47,000
Speaker 1: that people in general are okay with this. And yet

1288
01:06:47,280 --> 01:06:50,480
Speaker 1: is he going to pay a price? No? Why? Because

1289
01:06:50,600 --> 01:06:53,880
Speaker 1: all he had to do was not be Donald Trump.

1290
01:06:54,320 --> 01:06:57,960
Speaker 1: That was it. The minute he's inaugurated and he exists

1291
01:06:58,000 --> 01:07:01,840
Speaker 1: and is alive and is not Donald Trump. For the hardcore,

1292
01:07:02,160 --> 01:07:04,560
Speaker 1: for the Democratic base, for about half the country, really,

1293
01:07:04,960 --> 01:07:06,920
Speaker 1: that was sufficient. That was all he had to do.

1294
01:07:06,960 --> 01:07:08,800
Speaker 1: And the Republicans have their own equivalent. And you know

1295
01:07:08,840 --> 01:07:10,480
Speaker 1: what the sad part was, this took a lot of

1296
01:07:10,520 --> 01:07:13,600
Speaker 1: reckoning For me. I never realized how important it was

1297
01:07:13,720 --> 01:07:17,000
Speaker 1: for Republican base how important it was for just Trump

1298
01:07:17,120 --> 01:07:19,760
Speaker 1: to be Trump. All they needed was for him to

1299
01:07:19,840 --> 01:07:22,960
Speaker 1: exist and piss off elite liberals. That signed, by the way,

1300
01:07:23,080 --> 01:07:25,720
Speaker 1: is literally my entire neighborhood. Yeah, got so sick of

1301
01:07:25,760 --> 01:07:28,880
Speaker 1: looking at it. And the thing is, and usually it's

1302
01:07:28,920 --> 01:07:30,760
Speaker 1: next to some sign which is like say no to

1303
01:07:30,840 --> 01:07:33,800
Speaker 1: high rise apartment buildings. Perfect, don't let them build anymore

1304
01:07:33,880 --> 01:07:36,280
Speaker 1: real estate next to my million dollar house. Can't have

1305
01:07:36,280 --> 01:07:39,280
Speaker 1: any affor I can't have. It's always hilarious and I

1306
01:07:39,280 --> 01:07:42,200
Speaker 1: could go into the hypocrisy of elite liberals all day. Really,

1307
01:07:42,280 --> 01:07:44,920
Speaker 1: what it is is that so many people. Max Alvares

1308
01:07:45,000 --> 01:07:48,040
Speaker 1: said this on Rising, which was they put Trump gave

1309
01:07:48,080 --> 01:07:52,560
Speaker 1: them cultural power. Told the story before driving through rural

1310
01:07:52,600 --> 01:07:56,280
Speaker 1: Nevada right before the twenty twenty election and there was

1311
01:07:56,320 --> 01:08:01,280
Speaker 1: this giant sign in the middle of nowhere, like nowhere

1312
01:08:01,800 --> 01:08:05,520
Speaker 1: hour from anywhere, and this huge sign and it just

1313
01:08:05,560 --> 01:08:08,680
Speaker 1: said Trump, fuck your feelings, and that was it, and

1314
01:08:08,680 --> 01:08:11,160
Speaker 1: it actually hit home for me. I'm like, for him,

1315
01:08:11,520 --> 01:08:15,640
Speaker 1: this man, woman, whomever they were, they truly felt nobody

1316
01:08:15,800 --> 01:08:18,439
Speaker 1: listened to me until Trump came. And it's all he

1317
01:08:18,479 --> 01:08:20,880
Speaker 1: has to do anything, He just has to merely exist

1318
01:08:20,920 --> 01:08:24,040
Speaker 1: in the White House and say screw you. That was

1319
01:08:24,080 --> 01:08:26,400
Speaker 1: his way, and I understand that that was a very

1320
01:08:26,439 --> 01:08:29,640
Speaker 1: powerful force. Seventy five million people who finally they're just like,

1321
01:08:29,760 --> 01:08:35,080
Speaker 1: no enough, Hollywood media. Everything's just bombarding your daily life.

1322
01:08:35,120 --> 01:08:37,920
Speaker 1: Is full of indignities from their boss class and more.

1323
01:08:38,240 --> 01:08:40,479
Speaker 1: But they don't have to do anything. And that's the

1324
01:08:40,479 --> 01:08:42,479
Speaker 1: worst part, isn't it. He doesn't have to do anything.

1325
01:08:42,520 --> 01:08:45,759
Speaker 1: He cut the corporate tax rate. Not only that, even

1326
01:08:45,880 --> 01:08:49,559
Speaker 1: as the people that hated him, you know, made these

1327
01:08:49,600 --> 01:08:52,679
Speaker 1: public displays of meltdowns and whatever that we're very satisfying

1328
01:08:52,720 --> 01:08:55,160
Speaker 1: to watch for all of us, right and by the way,

1329
01:08:55,160 --> 01:08:56,840
Speaker 1: they're flag down the street from me. It says, Trump

1330
01:08:56,880 --> 01:08:59,760
Speaker 1: twenty twenty make liberals cries exactly the same thing. But

1331
01:09:00,560 --> 01:09:03,280
Speaker 1: the sad truth is that he actually made those people

1332
01:09:03,320 --> 01:09:05,919
Speaker 1: that you hate more powerful than they've ever been before

1333
01:09:06,000 --> 01:09:08,840
Speaker 1: and richer than they've ever been before. And like you said,

1334
01:09:09,160 --> 01:09:12,200
Speaker 1: didn't have to do anything. All he had to do

1335
01:09:12,400 --> 01:09:16,160
Speaker 1: was like tweet some nonsense that made people men. And

1336
01:09:16,200 --> 01:09:19,720
Speaker 1: that was the total content of his promise and what

1337
01:09:19,840 --> 01:09:23,320
Speaker 1: he offered and fulfilled for his base, that was all

1338
01:09:23,360 --> 01:09:25,679
Speaker 1: that they needed to feel like, well, this is the guy,

1339
01:09:25,840 --> 01:09:27,479
Speaker 1: this is the one that I'm with. I wrote in

1340
01:09:27,520 --> 01:09:30,519
Speaker 1: a review of Thomas Frank's book that the charlatanism in

1341
01:09:30,560 --> 01:09:33,760
Speaker 1: the Trump administration is the single greatest gift to the

1342
01:09:33,800 --> 01:09:36,960
Speaker 1: oligarchy in modern American memory, and I think it will

1343
01:09:37,000 --> 01:09:39,639
Speaker 1: remain with us as long as he's alive, and probably

1344
01:09:39,640 --> 01:09:41,479
Speaker 1: for twenty years to come. All Right, we wanted to

1345
01:09:41,560 --> 01:09:45,360
Speaker 1: review the state of the media writ large with a

1346
01:09:45,400 --> 01:09:48,800
Speaker 1: great friend of us, a new friend of Breaking Points,

1347
01:09:48,840 --> 01:09:50,920
Speaker 1: I would say, the one and only Glenn Greenwald. He's

1348
01:09:50,920 --> 01:09:53,720
Speaker 1: of course com bounding editor of The Intercept. He has

1349
01:09:53,760 --> 01:09:56,720
Speaker 1: a fantastic substack that you're probably already subscribed to, but

1350
01:09:56,760 --> 01:09:58,679
Speaker 1: if you're not, you should do that. He's also author

1351
01:09:58,720 --> 01:10:02,040
Speaker 1: of a new book called Securing Democracy, Pulitzer Prize winner.

1352
01:10:02,080 --> 01:10:04,320
Speaker 1: Blah blah blah. Great to see Glenn. Good to see you, Glenn.

1353
01:10:05,200 --> 01:10:07,960
Speaker 1: Great to be with you, guys. Congratulations on the success

1354
01:10:08,200 --> 01:10:11,160
Speaker 1: of the new launch. I'm super happy for you and

1355
01:10:11,240 --> 01:10:15,000
Speaker 1: super happy to participate. Well, it's awesome and as usually,

1356
01:10:15,040 --> 01:10:17,479
Speaker 1: you have like an idyllic background, which makes us jealous

1357
01:10:17,479 --> 01:10:19,960
Speaker 1: of where we currently are. Actually, that's the first day

1358
01:10:20,000 --> 01:10:25,000
Speaker 1: that you guys back we're all proud of it, So

1359
01:10:25,080 --> 01:10:26,760
Speaker 1: I just wanted to make you feel a little less

1360
01:10:27,000 --> 01:10:31,240
Speaker 1: proud of accomplished. Take us down a notch, and that's

1361
01:10:31,240 --> 01:10:32,840
Speaker 1: what you do. He doesn't just do it for us, though,

1362
01:10:32,880 --> 01:10:34,960
Speaker 1: he does it for the entire media. So we have

1363
01:10:35,040 --> 01:10:37,640
Speaker 1: to start with this one. Glenn, you flagged this. I

1364
01:10:37,720 --> 01:10:41,160
Speaker 1: just thought it was incredible. CNNs Brian Stelter yesterday on

1365
01:10:41,240 --> 01:10:44,720
Speaker 1: a show Precious Time with the American Press Secretary. This

1366
01:10:44,800 --> 01:10:49,360
Speaker 1: is what he chose to ask her. Let's take a listen, Jen,

1367
01:10:49,439 --> 01:10:54,720
Speaker 1: thanks for coming on, reliable sources, my pleasure. Busy summer ahead, infrastructure,

1368
01:10:54,760 --> 01:10:59,200
Speaker 1: election reform. What does the press get wrong when covering

1369
01:10:59,360 --> 01:11:02,679
Speaker 1: Biden's When you watch the news, when you read the news,

1370
01:11:02,880 --> 01:11:06,559
Speaker 1: what do you think we get wrong? Well, look, I

1371
01:11:06,560 --> 01:11:08,960
Speaker 1: think some of our muscles of atrophied a little bit

1372
01:11:09,000 --> 01:11:12,000
Speaker 1: over the last few years, and there isn't a lot

1373
01:11:12,000 --> 01:11:15,639
Speaker 1: of memory or recent memory or longer memory on how

1374
01:11:15,680 --> 01:11:19,960
Speaker 1: long it takes to get legislation forward. I don't even

1375
01:11:20,000 --> 01:11:22,160
Speaker 1: know where to begin with that one. Glinn. How does

1376
01:11:22,280 --> 01:11:27,800
Speaker 1: one ask a question like that to the American Press Secretary. Well,

1377
01:11:27,880 --> 01:11:30,040
Speaker 1: first of all, I think it's important that any video

1378
01:11:30,200 --> 01:11:34,679
Speaker 1: that contains any clips from that interview have an adult's

1379
01:11:34,760 --> 01:11:39,640
Speaker 1: only designation on it because it's really not appropriate or

1380
01:11:39,680 --> 01:11:42,840
Speaker 1: suitable for anyone under eighteen. And the amazing thing is

1381
01:11:42,920 --> 01:11:46,280
Speaker 1: Sagar that as bad as that opening question was, I mean,

1382
01:11:46,320 --> 01:11:49,320
Speaker 1: the opening question that he had was basically a jen

1383
01:11:49,960 --> 01:11:52,120
Speaker 1: tell us what we do wrong? How can we better

1384
01:11:52,200 --> 01:11:56,080
Speaker 1: serve you? What can we do better for you? It

1385
01:11:56,160 --> 01:12:00,400
Speaker 1: actually descended from there. It got more sycophantic, you know,

1386
01:12:00,479 --> 01:12:03,000
Speaker 1: he asked her. One of the most interesting parts was

1387
01:12:03,000 --> 01:12:06,519
Speaker 1: he asked her, you have, you know, a seven year

1388
01:12:06,520 --> 01:12:08,439
Speaker 1: old daughter, which is already kind of creepy that he

1389
01:12:08,520 --> 01:12:10,519
Speaker 1: knows that that's at the forefront of his brain. He's like,

1390
01:12:10,560 --> 01:12:12,799
Speaker 1: I have a kiddergardener. So he's trying to like establish

1391
01:12:12,800 --> 01:12:15,000
Speaker 1: his personal relationship with there. And he's like, do you

1392
01:12:15,040 --> 01:12:17,599
Speaker 1: worry about the world the future of the world, giving

1393
01:12:17,640 --> 01:12:20,720
Speaker 1: that the Republican Party is so evil? And she was

1394
01:12:20,760 --> 01:12:24,760
Speaker 1: like uncomfortable with that question because it was just too adoring,

1395
01:12:24,840 --> 01:12:26,400
Speaker 1: and she actually went out of her way to say,

1396
01:12:26,439 --> 01:12:29,320
Speaker 1: I don't really see the world democrat versus Republican like you,

1397
01:12:29,439 --> 01:12:32,960
Speaker 1: Brian Stelter, the ten journalists do. So the White House

1398
01:12:32,960 --> 01:12:35,559
Speaker 1: Press Secretary was telling him that he was being too

1399
01:12:35,640 --> 01:12:39,559
Speaker 1: partisan and politicized in how he used the world. And

1400
01:12:39,600 --> 01:12:42,519
Speaker 1: I think what this really shows is over the last

1401
01:12:42,520 --> 01:12:46,880
Speaker 1: five years, CNN has transformed from an organization that used

1402
01:12:46,880 --> 01:12:50,000
Speaker 1: to pretend to be neutral and that in some ways

1403
01:12:50,000 --> 01:12:53,080
Speaker 1: did try to be, into one that has just completely

1404
01:12:53,120 --> 01:12:56,080
Speaker 1: given up the pretense to the point where you now

1405
01:12:56,200 --> 01:12:59,120
Speaker 1: have a CNN host who has seven or eight minutes

1406
01:12:59,160 --> 01:13:02,240
Speaker 1: with the spokesperson and a nominally the world's most powerful

1407
01:13:02,240 --> 01:13:06,360
Speaker 1: politician and refuses to ask her a single difficult question

1408
01:13:06,920 --> 01:13:09,200
Speaker 1: about any of the things the government is or is

1409
01:13:09,240 --> 01:13:11,920
Speaker 1: not doing, but instead is just desperate to become her

1410
01:13:11,920 --> 01:13:14,720
Speaker 1: best friend in an odd way that's so obvious it's

1411
01:13:14,760 --> 01:13:18,320
Speaker 1: actually uncomfortable to watch. I mean, this has been great

1412
01:13:18,360 --> 01:13:20,920
Speaker 1: for ratings, right Glenn. I mean, they're doing fabulously in

1413
01:13:20,920 --> 01:13:24,800
Speaker 1: the Biden are aren't they. Well, that's the other thing is,

1414
01:13:24,840 --> 01:13:27,360
Speaker 1: you know, I think people have forgotten that. In twenty

1415
01:13:27,360 --> 01:13:31,200
Speaker 1: fourteen and twenty fifteen, especially MSNBC but also CNN, there

1416
01:13:31,200 --> 01:13:35,720
Speaker 1: were constant articles about how Phil Griffin, the president of MSNBC,

1417
01:13:35,840 --> 01:13:38,760
Speaker 1: wanted to fire basically everybody who was on the air

1418
01:13:38,840 --> 01:13:43,000
Speaker 1: except for Rachel Matdow In part because the idea of

1419
01:13:43,040 --> 01:13:47,320
Speaker 1: turning MSNBC into a organ of the Democratic Party was

1420
01:13:47,360 --> 01:13:50,160
Speaker 1: starting to jeopardize the NBC news brand because so many

1421
01:13:50,280 --> 01:13:55,920
Speaker 1: NBC news journalists would appear on MSNBC and get contaminated

1422
01:13:56,040 --> 01:14:00,240
Speaker 1: by this overt partisan ethos that had been created there.

1423
01:14:00,280 --> 01:14:04,240
Speaker 1: But also obviously more important to Phil Griffin, nobody was watching,

1424
01:14:04,680 --> 01:14:07,400
Speaker 1: nobody was. I mean, the ratings were abysmal. They were

1425
01:14:07,439 --> 01:14:10,080
Speaker 1: all this close to getting fired, and the only person

1426
01:14:10,120 --> 01:14:12,800
Speaker 1: who came and saved them was Donald Trump. For four years,

1427
01:14:12,840 --> 01:14:18,920
Speaker 1: they induced enough mania and paranoia and psychosis in enough

1428
01:14:18,960 --> 01:14:23,479
Speaker 1: people to make their ratings sustainable, in fact, quite vibrant.

1429
01:14:23,880 --> 01:14:26,800
Speaker 1: But it was all based on this artificial sugar high

1430
01:14:28,080 --> 01:14:30,519
Speaker 1: that a lot of med organs fed on, which was

1431
01:14:30,520 --> 01:14:33,680
Speaker 1: scaring people enough about Trump to make them consume more

1432
01:14:33,720 --> 01:14:36,839
Speaker 1: news than they ordinarily would want to. And with him gone,

1433
01:14:37,280 --> 01:14:39,559
Speaker 1: it's like we've reverted back to twenty fifteen, where these

1434
01:14:39,600 --> 01:14:42,240
Speaker 1: people have nothing to offer. They all sound exactly alike.

1435
01:14:42,240 --> 01:14:46,640
Speaker 1: They're all upholding the same banal liberal orthodoxies. There's no independence,

1436
01:14:46,680 --> 01:14:49,759
Speaker 1: there's no dissidence, there's no deviation or from or questioning

1437
01:14:49,800 --> 01:14:52,879
Speaker 1: of orthodoxy. And how do you make people pay attention

1438
01:14:52,920 --> 01:14:55,559
Speaker 1: to what you're doing. If all you're doing is just

1439
01:14:55,720 --> 01:15:00,360
Speaker 1: uphold status, upholding status quote pieties, nobody is interested. And

1440
01:15:00,560 --> 01:15:06,360
Speaker 1: their ratings of both MSNBC and CNN are shockingly collapsing.

1441
01:15:06,439 --> 01:15:09,400
Speaker 1: I mean, CNN in primetime can't even get close to

1442
01:15:09,439 --> 01:15:13,599
Speaker 1: a million viewers, a million overall viewers, ten percent only

1443
01:15:13,640 --> 01:15:16,639
Speaker 1: of their audience is under fifty five, and even there

1444
01:15:16,720 --> 01:15:20,240
Speaker 1: among people under fifty five, these primetime shows are getting

1445
01:15:20,280 --> 01:15:23,519
Speaker 1: like one hundred thousand, one hundred and fifty thousand people watching,

1446
01:15:23,680 --> 01:15:27,200
Speaker 1: like a mid level YouTuber gets more than that. And

1447
01:15:27,240 --> 01:15:32,160
Speaker 1: the same obviously is happening with digital liberal outlets Huffington Post, BuzzFeed, Vice,

1448
01:15:32,240 --> 01:15:36,480
Speaker 1: Volterra Box. They're all the same, and therefore they're all disappearing,

1449
01:15:36,479 --> 01:15:39,479
Speaker 1: and everything's consolidating with the New York Times and the

1450
01:15:39,600 --> 01:15:42,840
Speaker 1: Washington Post because if you don't offer anything unique, no

1451
01:15:42,840 --> 01:15:45,920
Speaker 1: one's going to pay attention. It's stunning to me that

1452
01:15:45,960 --> 01:15:48,719
Speaker 1: they continue to go along with the strategy, though, Glenn,

1453
01:15:48,800 --> 01:15:51,719
Speaker 1: because I thought that they would at least try to innovate.

1454
01:15:51,720 --> 01:15:53,920
Speaker 1: But you saw Stelter. One of my favorite stories we

1455
01:15:53,960 --> 01:15:55,680
Speaker 1: covered here is he actually got higher ratings on his

1456
01:15:55,680 --> 01:15:58,280
Speaker 1: show when he was on vacation and they actually dropped

1457
01:15:58,360 --> 01:16:02,360
Speaker 1: whenever he came back. And you're watching this happen all

1458
01:16:02,400 --> 01:16:06,160
Speaker 1: across the ecosystem, and yet the reporting and the overall

1459
01:16:06,680 --> 01:16:09,960
Speaker 1: fawning over the Democratic politicians and more, it doesn't change.

1460
01:16:10,160 --> 01:16:13,519
Speaker 1: Why How can they continue to go on this road?

1461
01:16:13,560 --> 01:16:16,360
Speaker 1: Do they believe it? What are the structural incentives beyond

1462
01:16:16,400 --> 01:16:19,519
Speaker 1: that we're not seeing? Yeah, So I think it's a

1463
01:16:19,520 --> 01:16:22,920
Speaker 1: few things. First of all, if you train your audience

1464
01:16:23,840 --> 01:16:27,519
Speaker 1: to expect that you're only going to tell them what

1465
01:16:27,560 --> 01:16:30,400
Speaker 1: they want to hear, what is affirming of their worldview,

1466
01:16:30,439 --> 01:16:32,599
Speaker 1: and never challenge or question them in any way, you're

1467
01:16:32,720 --> 01:16:36,840
Speaker 1: essentially now captive to or imprisoned by your own audience.

1468
01:16:37,360 --> 01:16:40,479
Speaker 1: I have a friend who, or a former friend who

1469
01:16:40,600 --> 01:16:42,920
Speaker 1: is the host of a prominent MSNBC show, and that

1470
01:16:42,960 --> 01:16:45,960
Speaker 1: person once told me that they don't get showed by

1471
01:16:46,000 --> 01:16:48,800
Speaker 1: show ratings. They get segment by segment ratings. And they said,

1472
01:16:48,800 --> 01:16:51,639
Speaker 1: if we put somebody on who's critical of the Democratic Party,

1473
01:16:52,000 --> 01:16:55,080
Speaker 1: you can watch in real time the ratings collapse. People

1474
01:16:55,160 --> 01:16:57,760
Speaker 1: just don't want to hear it. They switch channels. On

1475
01:16:57,840 --> 01:17:00,479
Speaker 1: top of that, they get attacked on social media by

1476
01:17:00,479 --> 01:17:04,920
Speaker 1: their own audience. Brian Stalter asked one question that he

1477
01:17:04,960 --> 01:17:07,240
Speaker 1: claims made liberals angry, and I actually believe him, which

1478
01:17:07,280 --> 01:17:09,840
Speaker 1: is he asked JENSACKI, why doesn't President Biden have more

1479
01:17:09,840 --> 01:17:12,479
Speaker 1: news conferences? And he claims that all of the liberals

1480
01:17:12,520 --> 01:17:16,040
Speaker 1: who watched CNN were attacking him for even asking one

1481
01:17:16,120 --> 01:17:18,960
Speaker 1: like mildly. I wouldn't even call it challenging, but just

1482
01:17:18,960 --> 01:17:21,280
Speaker 1: like a question that implied that maybe Joe Biden is

1483
01:17:21,320 --> 01:17:24,320
Speaker 1: not perfect, and this is what they've trained their audience

1484
01:17:24,360 --> 01:17:26,200
Speaker 1: to do. So if you're a cable host, or if

1485
01:17:26,240 --> 01:17:29,040
Speaker 1: you're a cable executive and you see your audience vanishing,

1486
01:17:29,680 --> 01:17:31,400
Speaker 1: the last thing you want to do is to take

1487
01:17:31,439 --> 01:17:34,080
Speaker 1: the few remaining old people in nursing homes who are

1488
01:17:34,120 --> 01:17:38,000
Speaker 1: still watching and say things that might force even them

1489
01:17:38,040 --> 01:17:40,519
Speaker 1: to go away. It's a huge dilemma. It's like, do

1490
01:17:40,640 --> 01:17:44,280
Speaker 1: we stick to this failing strategy of feeding an ever

1491
01:17:44,320 --> 01:17:46,960
Speaker 1: shrinking audience the part is in tripe that they want

1492
01:17:47,000 --> 01:17:50,519
Speaker 1: to hear, or do we change course knowing we're going

1493
01:17:50,560 --> 01:17:52,760
Speaker 1: to alienate the few people who are still watching in

1494
01:17:52,800 --> 01:17:55,759
Speaker 1: the hope of trying to get something different. The problem

1495
01:17:55,840 --> 01:17:58,479
Speaker 1: is where where's that something different going to come from?

1496
01:17:58,960 --> 01:18:02,040
Speaker 1: They they're out with people who are now believers. I

1497
01:18:02,080 --> 01:18:04,000
Speaker 1: do believe, you asked me, Sucker, like, is this all

1498
01:18:04,040 --> 01:18:06,439
Speaker 1: synacle or is it true conviction? I believe that when

1499
01:18:06,479 --> 01:18:11,120
Speaker 1: you are in institutions long enough like this that subsume

1500
01:18:11,160 --> 01:18:13,760
Speaker 1: you in a certain political perspective, at some point you

1501
01:18:13,840 --> 01:18:16,080
Speaker 1: do start to actually believe that what you're saying is true,

1502
01:18:16,080 --> 01:18:20,320
Speaker 1: because no human being wants to consciously believe that I'm

1503
01:18:20,360 --> 01:18:22,880
Speaker 1: saying something I don't really believe from material or careers end.

1504
01:18:22,920 --> 01:18:24,639
Speaker 1: So I think part of it is also true conviction,

1505
01:18:24,720 --> 01:18:29,000
Speaker 1: which makes it even harder to get out of also

1506
01:18:29,040 --> 01:18:30,680
Speaker 1: in this mindset, and this is actually so, there's a

1507
01:18:30,720 --> 01:18:35,400
Speaker 1: big Daily Beast hit piece out on you, very lengthy,

1508
01:18:35,479 --> 01:18:37,200
Speaker 1: it's kind of all over the map. But there's one

1509
01:18:37,240 --> 01:18:39,320
Speaker 1: part of it that I found very revealing and that

1510
01:18:39,360 --> 01:18:42,920
Speaker 1: fits into this conversation, which is they're essentially accusing you

1511
01:18:43,320 --> 01:18:47,160
Speaker 1: of providing ammunition for Fox News, and they don't dispute

1512
01:18:47,160 --> 01:18:48,840
Speaker 1: that any of the things that you were talking about

1513
01:18:48,840 --> 01:18:51,600
Speaker 1: are legitimate critiques or you know that they got you know,

1514
01:18:51,720 --> 01:18:54,559
Speaker 1: MSMBC and CNN got certain stories wrong that you were

1515
01:18:54,600 --> 01:18:57,040
Speaker 1: pointing out, and then Fox News latches onto it and

1516
01:18:57,160 --> 01:18:59,800
Speaker 1: uses it for their own ends. But there's this e

1517
01:19:00,360 --> 01:19:04,160
Speaker 1: of like, you can't criticize the Democrats because you're giving

1518
01:19:04,200 --> 01:19:06,800
Speaker 1: ammunition to the bad guys. So we just have to

1519
01:19:06,840 --> 01:19:09,559
Speaker 1: stay silent, even if it's a legitimate knock. We just

1520
01:19:09,600 --> 01:19:15,360
Speaker 1: have to keep quiet because people who have nefarious ends

1521
01:19:15,400 --> 01:19:18,479
Speaker 1: in mind may use that in their own sort of

1522
01:19:18,479 --> 01:19:21,599
Speaker 1: propaganda and as a talking point. And I kind of

1523
01:19:21,720 --> 01:19:25,519
Speaker 1: understand the instinct, but it's the path to hell because

1524
01:19:25,560 --> 01:19:29,120
Speaker 1: the minute that you just sort of like blindspot everything

1525
01:19:29,160 --> 01:19:32,800
Speaker 1: that's a failing of your team is the minute that

1526
01:19:32,960 --> 01:19:35,679
Speaker 1: no one trusts you anymore and there is no sort

1527
01:19:35,720 --> 01:19:39,840
Speaker 1: of like baseline truth factor principle left. So I found

1528
01:19:39,840 --> 01:19:41,639
Speaker 1: it really interesting that that was sort of like their

1529
01:19:41,680 --> 01:19:44,519
Speaker 1: main critique of you as how dare you say anything

1530
01:19:44,960 --> 01:19:48,080
Speaker 1: that's uncomfortable for the Democratic Party, and that right wing

1531
01:19:48,120 --> 01:19:53,720
Speaker 1: actors might like, Yeah. I always find media criticisms of

1532
01:19:53,760 --> 01:19:56,360
Speaker 1: me or other people to be most revealing because in

1533
01:19:56,800 --> 01:19:59,519
Speaker 1: identifying the things that they think are incriminating about you,

1534
01:19:59,600 --> 01:20:02,479
Speaker 1: they're implicitly saying what they think the role of a

1535
01:20:02,560 --> 01:20:06,240
Speaker 1: journalist ought to be. So exactly as you said, by

1536
01:20:06,640 --> 01:20:12,120
Speaker 1: criticizing me for saying things that might find a favorable

1537
01:20:12,160 --> 01:20:16,000
Speaker 1: audience on the right or among Fox News. They're essentially

1538
01:20:16,000 --> 01:20:18,080
Speaker 1: saying that a journalist should never report anything or say

1539
01:20:18,120 --> 01:20:20,840
Speaker 1: anything that in any way can undermine the Democratic Party

1540
01:20:20,920 --> 01:20:24,160
Speaker 1: or make the Republican Party stronger, even if what you're

1541
01:20:24,200 --> 01:20:27,519
Speaker 1: saying is true. And I really think this mentality has

1542
01:20:27,520 --> 01:20:31,320
Speaker 1: done more to corrupt modern journalism than any other. I

1543
01:20:31,320 --> 01:20:35,360
Speaker 1: think we see it most vividly in this incredible debacle

1544
01:20:35,400 --> 01:20:38,320
Speaker 1: that I know you guys have discussed before, of how

1545
01:20:38,400 --> 01:20:41,320
Speaker 1: for an entire year, the liberal sectors of the US

1546
01:20:41,439 --> 01:20:46,280
Speaker 1: media treated the question of COVID's origin as a settled question,

1547
01:20:46,920 --> 01:20:50,080
Speaker 1: that it clearly was zonotic jumping from animal to human,

1548
01:20:50,120 --> 01:20:51,920
Speaker 1: and that anyone who raised the question of whether it

1549
01:20:51,960 --> 01:20:55,439
Speaker 1: might have escaped from a lab was a deranged conspiracy theorist,

1550
01:20:55,479 --> 01:20:56,680
Speaker 1: to the point where they ought to be banned from

1551
01:20:56,720 --> 01:20:59,240
Speaker 1: social media, when in fact that certainty was never warranted

1552
01:20:59,320 --> 01:21:02,120
Speaker 1: or even close to it. And now everyone's recognizing that

1553
01:21:02,160 --> 01:21:04,800
Speaker 1: they're both plausible theories, neither of which has yet been proven.

1554
01:21:04,840 --> 01:21:06,439
Speaker 1: And the question is why would that happen? And the

1555
01:21:06,880 --> 01:21:13,240
Speaker 1: answer is because it was Who were the ones saying

1556
01:21:13,280 --> 01:21:14,960
Speaker 1: that maybe there was a lab leak? And so that

1557
01:21:14,960 --> 01:21:17,120
Speaker 1: mentality that you just described, which is never saying anything

1558
01:21:17,160 --> 01:21:19,559
Speaker 1: that might help the Republican Party led the media to

1559
01:21:19,720 --> 01:21:22,360
Speaker 1: endorse a view of the world that was totally false,

1560
01:21:22,439 --> 01:21:26,479
Speaker 1: namely that the question of COVID's origins had been resolved

1561
01:21:26,479 --> 01:21:29,599
Speaker 1: with finality, that there was conclusive evidence in supported the

1562
01:21:29,760 --> 01:21:32,000
Speaker 1: zoonotic theory. It was the same thing with Russhigate. It

1563
01:21:32,040 --> 01:21:34,400
Speaker 1: doesn't matter if FRESHI Gate is true or not. Saying

1564
01:21:34,439 --> 01:21:37,559
Speaker 1: that it's true helps the Democrats. Saying that it's not

1565
01:21:37,600 --> 01:21:40,439
Speaker 1: true or questioning whether it is helps the Republicans, And

1566
01:21:40,439 --> 01:21:42,320
Speaker 1: therefore the role of a journalist is to make sure

1567
01:21:42,360 --> 01:21:44,960
Speaker 1: you do everything possible not to help Donald Trump. That's

1568
01:21:44,960 --> 01:21:46,519
Speaker 1: the reason also why they didn't want to report on

1569
01:21:46,560 --> 01:21:49,040
Speaker 1: the Hunter Biden archive. It didn't matter if it was authentic,

1570
01:21:49,160 --> 01:21:51,280
Speaker 1: it didn't matter if it was in a public interest.

1571
01:21:51,280 --> 01:21:53,040
Speaker 1: All that matter is that reporting on it would have

1572
01:21:53,120 --> 01:21:56,120
Speaker 1: helped the Democrats become weaker. And therefore the role of

1573
01:21:56,120 --> 01:21:58,559
Speaker 1: a journalist is to avoid anything that does that. And

1574
01:21:58,600 --> 01:22:01,880
Speaker 1: that absolutely is the pailing mindset in most of these

1575
01:22:01,920 --> 01:22:04,400
Speaker 1: failing outlets. And it's not only making them fail because

1576
01:22:04,479 --> 01:22:07,120
Speaker 1: nobody trusts them, but it's also corrupting the role of

1577
01:22:07,200 --> 01:22:09,439
Speaker 1: journalism and a democracy, which is not to serve one

1578
01:22:09,439 --> 01:22:13,880
Speaker 1: party or the other, but to unearth the truth. Absolutely right, Glenn.

1579
01:22:14,000 --> 01:22:16,280
Speaker 1: We really appreciate it. Thank you for being our very

1580
01:22:16,280 --> 01:22:19,000
Speaker 1: first Breaking Points. Guess we couldn't think of anybody better.

1581
01:22:19,040 --> 01:22:21,320
Speaker 1: We appreciate it. Man, appreciate you, Glenn. Thank you. Yeah,

1582
01:22:21,320 --> 01:22:25,679
Speaker 1: I couldn't. I couldn't think of anybody better either, And

1583
01:22:25,880 --> 01:22:27,160
Speaker 1: you know I'm a huge fan of both of you,

1584
01:22:27,280 --> 01:22:29,519
Speaker 1: so I'm wishing you huge luck and I know you're

1585
01:22:29,520 --> 01:22:32,040
Speaker 1: not going to need it, but congratulations again. That means

1586
01:22:32,120 --> 01:22:34,759
Speaker 1: a lot to us. Thank you, Glenn, appreciate it. Okay,

1587
01:22:36,920 --> 01:22:38,960
Speaker 1: how should be on this show? Oh shit, h let

1588
01:22:38,960 --> 01:22:45,360
Speaker 1: me retry this Jesus. Thank you for watching Breaking Points.

1589
01:22:45,560 --> 01:22:51,200
Speaker 1: Thank you for thank you Supercast, Thanks to everybody. Thanks

1590
01:22:51,240 --> 01:22:54,200
Speaker 1: for everybody for watching Breaking Points. Has been an incredible

1591
01:22:54,280 --> 01:22:56,800
Speaker 1: ride here and a special shout out to Supercast, who

1592
01:22:56,840 --> 01:22:58,720
Speaker 1: we are powered by in terms of all of our

1593
01:22:58,760 --> 01:23:01,120
Speaker 1: premium membership. If if you guys want to check out

1594
01:23:01,360 --> 01:23:03,320
Speaker 1: all of the awesome benefits that you get from being

1595
01:23:03,360 --> 01:23:05,759
Speaker 1: a premium subscriber, from being able to watch the show early,

1596
01:23:05,960 --> 01:23:08,120
Speaker 1: You get to watch it uncut, you get to listen

1597
01:23:08,160 --> 01:23:10,240
Speaker 1: to it wherever you get your pot or listen to

1598
01:23:10,280 --> 01:23:13,920
Speaker 1: it on your podcast app same thing, totally uncut. Then

1599
01:23:14,200 --> 01:23:16,080
Speaker 1: you also get to support Let me try this again,

1600
01:23:16,120 --> 01:23:19,640
Speaker 1: I'm sorry. Okay, good, okay, I let me try this

1601
01:23:19,720 --> 01:23:25,719
Speaker 1: one more time. All right, how should I do it? Supercast? Okay?

1602
01:23:26,840 --> 01:23:29,120
Speaker 1: Thanks so guys, Thank you guys so much for watching

1603
01:23:29,240 --> 01:23:32,360
Speaker 1: our first breaking point show. We are so so excited

1604
01:23:32,360 --> 01:23:34,120
Speaker 1: to be doing what we're doing here. It wouldn't be

1605
01:23:34,200 --> 01:23:37,080
Speaker 1: possible without Supercast, who we are one hundred percent powered

1606
01:23:37,080 --> 01:23:39,439
Speaker 1: by for our premium subscriptions. If you want to become

1607
01:23:39,439 --> 01:23:41,760
Speaker 1: a premium member today, you get to say number one,

1608
01:23:41,840 --> 01:23:44,000
Speaker 1: screw you to the corporate media. You get to help

1609
01:23:44,080 --> 01:23:46,320
Speaker 1: us support our work here, and in exchange, you get

1610
01:23:46,360 --> 01:23:48,920
Speaker 1: to watch the show completely uncut. You can listen to

1611
01:23:48,960 --> 01:23:51,600
Speaker 1: it as well, one hour early before everyone else, and

1612
01:23:51,640 --> 01:23:54,280
Speaker 1: we do weekly Q and a's as well. Make sure

1613
01:23:54,320 --> 01:23:55,960
Speaker 1: you watch out for that coming at the end of

1614
01:23:56,000 --> 01:23:58,280
Speaker 1: the week. Link right there down in the description. Go

1615
01:23:58,320 --> 01:24:00,880
Speaker 1: ahead and check it out. We love you guys so much.

1616
01:24:01,120 --> 01:24:04,160
Speaker 1: Thank you for watching, and we will see you back

1617
01:24:04,200 --> 01:24:21,559
Speaker 1: here tomorrow. Thanks for listening to the show, guys, We

1618
01:24:21,640 --> 01:24:24,040
Speaker 1: really appreciate it. To help other people find the show,

1619
01:24:24,120 --> 01:24:26,080
Speaker 1: go ahead and leave us a five star rating on

1620
01:24:26,160 --> 01:24:29,639
Speaker 1: Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts. Really helps

1621
01:24:29,680 --> 01:24:32,920
Speaker 1: other people find the show as always special, Thank you

1622
01:24:33,000 --> 01:24:36,559
Speaker 1: to Supercast for powering our premium membership. If you want

1623
01:24:36,560 --> 01:24:39,559
Speaker 1: to find out more, go to Crystalansager dot com