Speaker 1: I am Yamba.
Speaker 2: I've been very open about the fact that I was
Speaker 2: not always good at making my relationships work. I have
Speaker 2: been divorced three times, twice from the same person. In
Speaker 2: other words, I have seen a lot and failed a
Speaker 2: lot in my relationships. So I am here to share
Speaker 2: with you what I learned along the way because I
Speaker 2: did take copious note. Welcome to The R Spot, a
Speaker 2: production of Shondaland Audio in partnership with iHeartRadio blessing In Greetings,
Speaker 2: belleved This is the R Spot and I am im
Speaker 2: the van zandt your host, your guide, a teacher for some,
Speaker 2: and a soft place to fall for others. As we explore, examine,
Speaker 2: investigate some of the most common and often mind boggling
Speaker 2: complexities of relationships. I have a guest today. My guest
Speaker 2: today is known to his one million listeners as Ace Metaphor.
Speaker 2: He is the host of Tonight's Conversation on YouTube, where
Speaker 2: he dives headfirst into some of the most challenging and
Speaker 2: common relationship issues and fallacies. He identifies himself as a
Speaker 2: bad boy turn good and I want to know exactly
Speaker 2: what that means now. What attracted me to Ace were
Speaker 2: some of the topics of his shows. He did a
Speaker 2: show called do Big Girls Pay More Bills? He did
Speaker 2: another one called True or False Men do not want
Speaker 2: an independent woman? And one of my favorites, the bitter
Speaker 2: Baby Daddy, is the deadbeat Daddy. So today I want
Speaker 2: to talk to Ace about everything you and I I
Speaker 2: want to know and want to ask a man about relationships.
Speaker 2: Ace Metaphor, hostuff Tonight's Conversation, Ace, Welcome to the R Spot.
Speaker 3: I am extremely honored to be here. I appreciate it
Speaker 3: so much. Thank you so much for the invite. It
Speaker 3: means a lot to me.
Speaker 1: You crack me up.
Speaker 2: First of all, you are what I call cold water
Speaker 2: in your face, which I do sometimes when I'm working
Speaker 2: with people when you got to say the same thing
Speaker 2: over and over. But one of the reasons I want
Speaker 2: to talk to you is, first of all, you're a youngest,
Speaker 2: whole different generation. We have probably very different experiences of relationships,
Speaker 2: and I really want to examine and explore some of
Speaker 2: your concepts and the things that you say, because many
Speaker 2: of the things that you said say in your conversation
Speaker 2: I need to hear as an elder. I want to
Speaker 2: start here, though you said in your bio it says
Speaker 2: I'm a former bad guy turn in to a good guy.
Speaker 2: Tell me what a bad guy is.
Speaker 4: You know what?
Speaker 3: Honestly, because I get asked that question a lot. I
Speaker 3: need to change my bio because I'm getting sick of
Speaker 3: that quick no, but no, really, when I talk about
Speaker 3: the things that I want people to take heed to,
Speaker 3: it's from personal experience of being this type of man,
Speaker 3: being somebody younger who wasn't very intentional, through dating someone
Speaker 3: that was crafty with words, that was able to omit things,
Speaker 3: but lead you to believe that I was.
Speaker 4: Actually interested in relationships.
Speaker 3: So although I've gotten to this place where I've matured
Speaker 3: as a man and learned self restraint in boundaries, which
Speaker 3: is oddly important to learn as an adult. Before, though
Speaker 3: I didn't necessarily have that, I turned myself bad in
Speaker 3: terms of relationships, and even deeper than that situationships. There
Speaker 3: were so many women when I was going through that
Speaker 3: phase that I led on. I was that good guy
Speaker 3: on paper, so obviously had attention, but I didn't have
Speaker 3: intention on doing anything other than to be honest wasting time. Now,
Speaker 3: I think, in self reflection, if I was forthcoming about
Speaker 3: my intentions and I was an open book and I
Speaker 3: let people know exactly what I wanted to do and
Speaker 3: what I expected it'd be different. But being twenty three,
Speaker 3: twenty four to twenty five, I did none of that.
Speaker 3: But when I say bad, God mean in terms of that.
Speaker 2: So you were careless with people's hearts for sure. You
Speaker 2: were out of integrity with the people you went relationships with.
Speaker 1: You were dishonest.
Speaker 2: And I'm saying these things not to retraumatize you, but
Speaker 2: are you good to let me know some of.
Speaker 1: The things that we need to look for?
Speaker 2: So as I go through your videos, a couple of
Speaker 2: things that you said that I was like, oh my god,
Speaker 2: we need to just put that in a cracker and
Speaker 2: sell it.
Speaker 1: Let's talk about standards, yes, because.
Speaker 2: That's one of the things we talk about, and that's
Speaker 2: one of the things women have. And he don't live
Speaker 2: up to my standards or lowers because that's what's available
Speaker 2: to it.
Speaker 1: So talk to us from a man's point of view
Speaker 1: about standards.
Speaker 3: You know what this is a it's a tricky conversation, yes,
Speaker 3: because people have different definitions of what standards actually mean. So,
Speaker 3: like you have a pocket of people that think standards
Speaker 3: are life lofty financial goals, what somebody looks like, and
Speaker 3: that can be a I call that preferences, but to
Speaker 3: some people, that's a finite stand okay for me. When
Speaker 3: you think about relationships, one of the first standards I
Speaker 3: think we should negotiate on is how someone treats us,
Speaker 3: Because you can be in some with somebody who has
Speaker 3: all these things on paper, but they treat you horribly
Speaker 3: and so then you're still settling. So when it comes
Speaker 3: to standards, it's how someone treats you, how they show
Speaker 3: up for you, what person do they bring out of you?
Speaker 3: Do they bring the best out of you or the
Speaker 3: worst out of you? Is this person understanding? And so
Speaker 3: those are the things that I think we shouldn't negotiate on,
Speaker 3: but often times we will because some of our preferences
Speaker 3: are a little bit more shiny. It's easier to be
Speaker 3: attracted to the shiny things, so we get distracted.
Speaker 4: So that's how we define it.
Speaker 1: I totally agree. I think the standards is one thing.
Speaker 2: Preferences is another. But there are so many women who
Speaker 2: don't want to be alone, so they overlook their standards.
Speaker 2: And when you did that YouTube video, I put a
Speaker 2: comment in the thread that said, so many women have
Speaker 2: been treated so poorly for so long they don't even
Speaker 2: know what good treatment talks about. How do you, as
Speaker 2: a man, or how do men learn what it means
Speaker 2: or what it is to treat someone good.
Speaker 3: So I can only speak for myself, and I'm gonna
Speaker 3: give you a cold, honest answer. Most times men learn
Speaker 3: through fumbling the right woman, it's unfortunately, because you should
Speaker 3: learn by, you know, educate yourself, picking up a book,
Speaker 3: maybe going to a seminar, maybe talking to a professional,
Speaker 3: not watching dad. So here's the thing though, But dads
Speaker 3: wasn't around. So for a lot of us, we didn't
Speaker 3: grow up in household seeing productive relationships. We didn't even
Speaker 3: grow up in household with that quote unquote masculine structure
Speaker 3: and discipline, and oftentimes a lot of us were enabled
Speaker 3: by our mothers. So here we are, we have this.
Speaker 2: Wait a minute, a minute, Wait a minute, a minute,
Speaker 2: Wait a minute, hold up, talk to me about mothers
Speaker 2: enabling their sons.
Speaker 3: For sure, it's so many times that I feel like,
Speaker 3: and I can speak from my personal experience, that my
Speaker 3: mother made excuses for me. My mother was an avid
Speaker 3: defender of me, even when I was wrong. My mother
Speaker 3: did cook and clean and make sure I had without
Speaker 3: and I was the quote unquote man of the house
Speaker 3: as a young boy, and so these this complex that
Speaker 3: I developed now going into dating, I expected people to
Speaker 3: treat me like my mother did right, to have this
Speaker 3: unwavering belief that whatever I said was true, no matter
Speaker 3: against the evidence. Right this, I hate this word, but
Speaker 3: I'm gonna say it just for the mama's boying of
Speaker 3: young men, because I think about it, like, if you
Speaker 3: really this single mother and best believe, I believe they
Speaker 3: do the best that they can. And we're not going
Speaker 3: to excuse aptin fathers. But then the absence of a father,
Speaker 3: behaviors happened between mothers and sons that wouldn't happen if
Speaker 3: a father was there. If a father was there, you
Speaker 3: wouldn't call that son the mother of the man of
Speaker 3: the house if a father was there. It's certain certain affections,
Speaker 3: which I'm not going to say is inappropriate, but certain
Speaker 3: affections that probably wouldn't happen as much and maybe less excuses.
Speaker 3: So this happens, and then when we get adults, because
Speaker 3: we didn't have that role model to look for, and
Speaker 3: then we had this understanding that people are supposed to
Speaker 3: love is like our mother. Now, we put our girlfriends
Speaker 3: and the people that we are interested in through the
Speaker 3: same gauntlet that we put our mothers, and we expect
Speaker 3: them to love us unconditionally the same way our mothers did,
Speaker 3: despite how we treat them. You know what I mean,
Speaker 3: Because ain't nobody gonna love you like your mother no
Speaker 3: matter how wrong you are, She's still gonna love you absolutely. Yeah,
Speaker 3: And we expect sometimes that are the women in our
Speaker 3: lives do the same thing. And that's an unreasonable expectation
Speaker 3: to have.
Speaker 2: So let me clean this up, because I know all
Speaker 2: the single mothers out there right now are clutching their
Speaker 2: pearlshment on the floor. So let me say it. Let
Speaker 2: me clean it up, and then we'll go on to
Speaker 2: the next thing. He is not making you wrong, He
Speaker 2: is not making you bad. Mothers. Hear what is being said.
Speaker 2: As a man raised by a single mom. He is
Speaker 2: saying that he was enabled in behaviors as a young
Speaker 2: man that don't work in relationship, that what he has
Speaker 2: to say is always right. He has made the man
Speaker 2: before he was ready or I had the skills or
Speaker 2: tools to do that. This is not saying that you're wrong,
Speaker 2: mother's It's just saying that even at our best, there
Speaker 2: are things that our sons need that they don't get
Speaker 2: that then show up as bad behaviors in relationship. Now,
Speaker 2: that's what he said. This is what I'm saying. Very often,
Speaker 2: when the father isn't in the home, the mother makes
Speaker 2: the son her emotional husband. She looks to him to
Speaker 2: make her feel good, to make her proud. Let me
Speaker 2: speak for myself. I had a son. I was a
Speaker 2: sixteen year old mom, and I was going to prove
Speaker 2: to everybody that I wasn't just another teenage mom. So
Speaker 2: he had to look a certain way, walk a certain way,
Speaker 2: talk a certain way, be a certain way. I beat
Speaker 2: him up about some things and let him get away
Speaker 2: with other things because he was my emotional husband. So
Speaker 2: what I want us to hear as women is sometimes
Speaker 2: times our best efforts and our deep love still shows
Speaker 2: up for our sons as disfunctional behavior. So does that
Speaker 2: land for you?
Speaker 4: I believe it does.
Speaker 2: Okay, let me ask you this. Who is the woman
Speaker 2: you did the fumble with? What happened in there? And
Speaker 2: how did you lose her? Did you walk away? Did
Speaker 2: she walk away as you're fumbling around trying to figure
Speaker 2: out what to do.
Speaker 4: You know what did it multiple times, so we had
Speaker 4: to just narrow down which one we do.
Speaker 3: I would say collectively, though, I would say the biggest
Speaker 3: fumble that I had it wasn't because I actually needed
Speaker 3: to be with this one. We were in twenty twenty one,
Speaker 3: twenty two. We didn't need to be with nobody. In
Speaker 3: my opinion at that age. You know what I'm saying,
Speaker 3: You're still immature, and I grew up very religious, and
Speaker 3: I was now finding my own autonomy outside of that,
Speaker 3: so it was a little difficult for me to adjust
Speaker 3: who I was as an individual. But I would ultimately
Speaker 3: say the biggest fumble is because now I live with regret.
Speaker 3: I can't go back and fix you know what I'm saying,
Speaker 3: You know how you got survivor's remorse. I feel like
Speaker 3: I'm doing really good now, so I'm happy that I
Speaker 3: made my mistakes, but I know that that doesn't make
Speaker 3: people feel good in which I made mistakes against I
Speaker 3: wish I could go back and still be the same
Speaker 3: person I am now without those mistakes, but I can't.
Speaker 2: Your lab rats, yeah they did what I you know,
Speaker 2: my work, which is forgiveness work. Because I was a laborrat. Okay,
Speaker 2: so we got single moms. We still make mistakes, and
Speaker 2: it's important in a relationship mother, son, husband, wife, wife,
Speaker 2: whatever it is that we understand even if we have
Speaker 2: the best of intentions, we're still accountable to the outcome.
Speaker 2: And that's what I hear you say that you can't
Speaker 2: go back and clean it up with your lab.
Speaker 3: Rat, and let me tell you something. It and it's
Speaker 3: not just a specific person. It's a period in time
Speaker 3: where I made multiple mistakes. And as much as I
Speaker 3: can go back and rationale, hey, I was young, or
Speaker 3: I was depressed, or I was doing this from that
Speaker 3: in the moment when you gave about that, even after
Speaker 3: you've gotten over it, it still feels bad because it's
Speaker 3: not like sometimes you can go back and get that
Speaker 3: closure that everybody be searching for, right, you can go
Speaker 3: back to that person you did wrong and they're gonna
Speaker 3: listen to you, and you're gonna be like, hey man,
Speaker 3: I'm sorry. Sometimes you don't get that. Sometimes you get
Speaker 3: it ended and we never talked again, and you have
Speaker 3: to find your own closure from that, and that's a
Speaker 3: struggle sometimes when you admit to yourself, I'm not the
Speaker 3: same person I used to be, but maybe they still
Speaker 3: think I am. And you care so much about trying
Speaker 3: to go back and change their perception of you, because
Speaker 3: here they are stuck in twenty ten and now you're
Speaker 3: living in twenty twenty three, and now they watch your
Speaker 3: videos online and they like, man, he ain't about that life,
Speaker 3: and so it's a struggle. So if I could go
Speaker 3: back and give myself advice, which you can't, but I
Speaker 3: wish you could, my advice would simply be treat people
Speaker 3: the way you want to be treated. And let me
Speaker 3: tell you this, we hear that all the time, but
Speaker 3: it would be like for real dog because here's the thing.
Speaker 3: I heard that from so many adults in my life,
Speaker 3: but I ain't listen to them. But I guarantee if
Speaker 3: I could listen to my older self say that, I
Speaker 3: probably would.
Speaker 4: But I can't.
Speaker 3: But I wanted to answer a question you said you
Speaker 3: asked though earlier, if I may, You asked, how do
Speaker 3: men learn or where's that transition into becoming a better person?
Speaker 3: And I said, oftentimes it's because you fumble the woman
Speaker 3: in which.
Speaker 4: Was right for you. You know what I mean? Too often.
Speaker 3: Let me tell you something, too often in my life,
Speaker 3: I was so used of women just forgiving me and
Speaker 3: giving me second and third and fourth and fifth chances
Speaker 3: that it was an actual shock when somebody left and
Speaker 3: stayed away and that hold odo you really leaving like
Speaker 3: it was a shock because at that point there was
Speaker 3: never real consequences for my behavior.
Speaker 4: And so the pain.
Speaker 3: And I'll say this, and I don't want to do
Speaker 3: the struggle Olympics, but I really believe that men put
Speaker 3: on a pison like we don't be hurting after breakup,
Speaker 3: but we'd be hurt. I could just speak for myself,
Speaker 3: and that's a pain that I never want to happen again.
Speaker 3: Because of that, I was really intentional about my healing
Speaker 3: and I was making sure that hey, listen, if I
Speaker 3: do like somebody in the future, if I do want
Speaker 3: a relationship, I'm ready.
Speaker 4: I'm in a relationship now.
Speaker 3: But it took ten years from my first relationship to
Speaker 3: my next relationship. It was a ten year gap, and
Speaker 3: that gap I learned myself. I created a nest, I
Speaker 3: created skills, but most importantly, I became a better person
Speaker 3: than a person that I'm proud of. But it's only
Speaker 3: because I learned my lesson from fumbling and breaking the heart.
Speaker 3: And unfortunately there's so many guys that are learning their
Speaker 3: lesson how to treat a woman right from breaking another woman,
Speaker 3: and that I wish it was a way for that
Speaker 3: not to happen, But that's what's happening out here.
Speaker 2: This is loaded here. So I want to backpedal just
Speaker 2: a little bit. They forgive me the third, the fourth,
Speaker 2: the fifth time. Let's talk about that from a man's perspective,
Speaker 2: because as women sometimes I think we want it so
Speaker 2: badly and we bank on something you said don't bank on,
Speaker 2: which I say, don't bank on, which is potential?
Speaker 1: When is enough? When do we have to say no?
Speaker 2: Is it the first time? The second time? See, I'm
Speaker 2: a first time verson? Yeah, when is enough enough?
Speaker 3: You're right, you are a first time person, and it's
Speaker 3: a lot of women and men, but we're talking about
Speaker 3: women that believe that they're first time people too. But
Speaker 3: then there's the right guy or wrong guy come alone
Speaker 3: and this man, to your point, maybe he doesn't have
Speaker 3: the potential. Maybe it's not the potential you like. Maybe
Speaker 3: he's actually this ambitious person, Maybe he actually is a
Speaker 3: person that has a good reputation with everybody else. Maybe
Speaker 3: he is on his square. He's a protector and a provider,
Speaker 3: and maybe he's so different than of the other men
Speaker 3: that you have met on paper that you're willing to
Speaker 3: be more than the one time girl, because you've been taught. Hey, listen,
Speaker 3: he's quote unquote high value. He may make a mistake
Speaker 3: here and there. Girl, You lucky to be with him.
Speaker 3: He paying the bills, he doing this. You know how
Speaker 3: hard it is with these men. So then you convince
Speaker 3: yourself to Hey, if I leave this guy, when it
Speaker 3: took me thirty four years to meet a guy like this,
Speaker 3: when the next time I'm going to meet a man
Speaker 3: like that. And here's the thing, me and it got
Speaker 3: something going for him. They know that too. They know
Speaker 3: that too. And the behaviors in which happened in relationships
Speaker 3: prior to them leads them believe that, no, if I
Speaker 3: cheat on you, you won't go because I've cheated before and
Speaker 3: they didn't go the first time or the second time.
Speaker 4: And here's the thing.
Speaker 3: The things that a lot of women are attracted to charisma, right,
Speaker 3: that's the thing that some women are attracted to. Some
Speaker 3: people are charismatic, when they're trying to get you to
Speaker 3: forgive them too. They can use these words, Hey, baby,
Speaker 3: it ain't gonna happen again. I got you. You can
Speaker 3: trust me, believe in me. Have I ever steered you wrong?
Speaker 3: Outside of this blah blah blah and that person talks
Speaker 3: you out of your decisions. I guess what I'm saying
Speaker 3: is I can understand while women give three, four chances,
Speaker 3: five chances. I can understand it. Though I feel like
Speaker 3: it's unwise, I can understand it.
Speaker 2: I hear you, and I hear it all the time.
Speaker 2: I see it all the time. I believe instead of
Speaker 2: trying to manufacture the CARO work the prevention.
Speaker 4: Yeah.
Speaker 2: And one of the ways I tell women you can
Speaker 2: prevent that is know who he is before you introduce
Speaker 2: him to the huha. Yeah, and then the huhas all
Speaker 2: attracted and attached. My first you know, preventive is a
Speaker 2: good to his mother. I want to know if he's
Speaker 2: a man of his word? Does he show up on time,
Speaker 2: does he do what he's going to say? Does he
Speaker 2: give me a bunch of excuses? And see I want
Speaker 2: to know this before he meets the hoho ha, before
Speaker 2: he sees her a sniffer or any of that. Does
Speaker 2: he have a vision for himself? Because if I want
Speaker 2: him to be the leader, if I want to follow him,
Speaker 2: he can't be walking around blindly.
Speaker 1: And for me, this is me. I know a lot
Speaker 1: of you young and don't have it.
Speaker 2: I want to know if he has a relationship with God,
Speaker 2: something bigger, grander than himself. Now he got to know.
Speaker 2: I got to know all of that before I give
Speaker 2: him the huha. So if he's willing to hang out,
Speaker 2: whether you do the ninety day rule or the one
Speaker 2: twenty day rule, before you do, I need.
Speaker 1: To know that.
Speaker 3: That's if you're dating from a place of self worth,
Speaker 3: okay and self confidence, because some people not.
Speaker 4: And let me tell you what the issue is. The
Speaker 4: issue is you.
Speaker 3: May make a man way ninety days, but she won't
Speaker 3: and she won't and so your competition doesn't hold the
Speaker 3: same standard as you. So what happens is you may
Speaker 3: come in and this is what I've heard, I don't experience.
Speaker 3: You know why as a man, I just never felt
Speaker 3: like it was a lack of options of women. I
Speaker 3: just feel like it's an abundance. But the opposite way
Speaker 3: out is like you're dating from a scarcity mindset, because
Speaker 3: you're like, Okay, this is a man I know gets
Speaker 3: attention and I want to keep it.
Speaker 4: I want to keep it.
Speaker 3: So it influences women if you're not dating from a
Speaker 3: place of self worth and self confidence to maybe give
Speaker 3: up the hupah a little bit sooner to keep his attention.
Speaker 3: And it's a lot of women doing that.
Speaker 2: We'll talk about that right after the break. Welcome back
Speaker 2: to the R spot. Let's get back to the conversation.
Speaker 1: You are dropping gems.
Speaker 2: I want to summarize them for people who may be
Speaker 2: coming in date from a place of self confidence and
Speaker 2: self worth. Yeah, make sure that you're not being a
Speaker 2: lab rat trying to figure out what to do. You
Speaker 2: don't want to be a lab rat. Mom's raising sons,
Speaker 2: This is from me. Don't make your son your emotional husband.
Speaker 2: And this is from Ace if I heard you correctly.
Speaker 2: You have to teach him how to be who he
Speaker 2: is without teaching him that who he is just as
Speaker 2: he is going to be acceptable to everybody. Because we
Speaker 2: see our son, his breath, don't sting, his feet, don't sting.
Speaker 2: I have to pick up behind him, I have to
Speaker 2: cook his food. Let me so don't think that how
Speaker 2: you see him and hold him as a single mom
Speaker 2: is the same way other people are going to see him.
Speaker 1: And hold him. This is something you said on one
Speaker 1: of your ason I want to talk to you about it.
Speaker 2: You said that when your light is intimidating to a man,
Speaker 2: then he's not the man for you. Because the reality
Speaker 2: is so many women have advanced in their education, have
Speaker 2: advanced in their career, and they're trying to find a
Speaker 2: male partner. And let me say this too, this particular show,
Speaker 2: we're talking about men and women because Ace is a
Speaker 2: man and I'm a woman. I am not excluding same
Speaker 2: sex relationships and any of this stuff that.
Speaker 1: Applies to you.
Speaker 2: We all crazy as hell, subject to lose our minds
Speaker 2: at any moment. So I love that when you said,
Speaker 2: if your light is intimidating to him, then he's not
Speaker 2: the one for you. Let's talk about that a little bit.
Speaker 3: Yes, if I could tell you how many times a
Speaker 3: woman has came to the microphone at our shows and
Speaker 3: talked about intimidation. But instead of it seeing it as
Speaker 3: a sign that this person, this particular person, we can
Speaker 3: judge his morality. We can say that's good, bad, or
Speaker 3: and different that he feels intimate, but this person feels
Speaker 3: intimidated by you. Instead of saying, okay, this is not
Speaker 3: my person. See here's the thing. There is a person
Speaker 3: for you that will embrace all the things this person
Speaker 3: is saying is intimidating. But instead of doing that, what
Speaker 3: we do is force to fit. And what we do
Speaker 3: is say, let me deal my lights so they feel
Speaker 3: more comfortable. Firstly, we don't realize that dating is just
Speaker 3: that it's dating to see if something is right or
Speaker 3: wrong for us. And before we start dating, we have
Speaker 3: to be okay with either result because either result is
Speaker 3: in a successful dating thing. So I'm dating you to
Speaker 3: see if you're right or wrong for me if someone
Speaker 3: is intimidated by you in a relationship, regardless what the
Speaker 3: reason is. Right now, we can talk. We're gonna talk
Speaker 3: about reasons in a second. But what happens is sometimes
Speaker 3: that can foster jealousy inside of a relationship. It can
Speaker 3: foster I feel like you're trying to minimize me. So
Speaker 3: now what I have to do is puff up my
Speaker 3: chest a little bit more. And I guess what I'm
Speaker 3: saying is instead of recognizing that even though you like
Speaker 3: this man, he's not right for you and moving on.
Speaker 3: There are some people that's tempted to dim And let
Speaker 3: me say this, and I want to add this caveat
Speaker 3: your life though, and I know I'm about to make
Speaker 3: people mad. Is not your degree.
Speaker 1: Break that deck.
Speaker 3: And this is from my personal opinion. There's so many
Speaker 3: women they come to the microphone and they say I'm
Speaker 3: a good woman because I got a degree, I got
Speaker 3: a house, I have a car. It is the same
Speaker 3: starter pack of And it's like, how does that make
Speaker 3: you a good woman. How many men think that they're
Speaker 3: good men simply because they have a high paying job,
Speaker 3: they got a car, and they got a house. And
Speaker 3: we know that they're horrible people. So if you defining
Speaker 3: yourself as being a good woman because of these accolades
Speaker 3: you have, you didn't say that you're caring, that you're
Speaker 3: a great listener, that you are a supportive partner, that
Speaker 3: you're welling to contribute. You don't say those things and
Speaker 3: define yourself that you got a good heart and you
Speaker 3: say that makes me a good woman. So a lot
Speaker 3: of times, and this is the part that I know
Speaker 3: people gonna disagree with. A lot of times, men aren't
Speaker 3: necessarily intimidated. They're just turned off because you're describing yourself
Speaker 3: by your accolades. Now I get it, it's important, it's
Speaker 3: part of the conversation. But I'm looking for a partner,
Speaker 3: not an individual player. You're telling me your individual statistics.
Speaker 3: I'm dating you to see if you can be a
Speaker 3: partner for me. What I encourage women and men to do,
Speaker 3: because as much as women lead with they accolades, men
Speaker 3: do it ten times is worse. What I encourage people
Speaker 3: to do is find who you are outside of what
Speaker 3: you do for a living. Now, I know that's difficult.
Speaker 3: I know it's difficult because we spend ten years in college,
Speaker 3: we spend forty hours or fifty hours at our job.
Speaker 3: But I'm concerned about learning about you. How you laugh,
Speaker 3: what makes you laugh, When do you show up to
Speaker 3: this relationship. Where are you willing to invest to it?
Speaker 3: Are you caring? Are you loving? Do you want children?
Speaker 3: These are things that we should highlight. And so I
Speaker 3: guess what I'm saying is, now, if you're doing that
Speaker 3: and that man is still intimidated, he probably not the
Speaker 3: right person for you.
Speaker 4: Be honest.
Speaker 2: I hear them all the emails they sent me, But
Speaker 2: I did that. I was caring to him, and he
Speaker 2: lost his job. I held it down, and he's still cheated,
Speaker 2: and he still left me.
Speaker 1: What do you say to that?
Speaker 2: If she is caring, he is supportive, and she does
Speaker 2: show up in a partnership and in a very affirmative
Speaker 2: and loving way, and he's still cheats and he's still live.
Speaker 3: Being all those things you described, it's still not an
Speaker 3: excuse to not enforce your boundaries. You can kindly enforce
Speaker 3: your boundaries. You can, with an honest heart, walk away
Speaker 3: from somebody that's toxic. And so my point is some
Speaker 3: people define being a good woman as being overly tolerant
Speaker 3: of someone that is putting you through the ringer. That
Speaker 3: ain't being a good one either. I'm all four hoole
Speaker 3: people down if they lost their job, if you are
Speaker 3: compensating in other areas, and you are still president inside
Speaker 3: this relationship, and you have given me more reasons to
Speaker 3: believe staying here is wise than unwise. Howsomever you think
Speaker 3: that just because you come and boy, they people gonna
Speaker 3: be mad. Normally I have more time to explain these things.
Speaker 3: So I'm just saying, you think you coming from this
Speaker 3: dominant position and What I mean by that is there
Speaker 3: are certain women that will intentionally date down. This man
Speaker 3: now is indebted to you because here you are believing
Speaker 3: in him in ways other women are wise enough not to.
Speaker 4: I'm just saying.
Speaker 3: I'm just saying other women saying the ran flags and
Speaker 3: they said, nah, but you like you know what, though,
Speaker 3: I can fix this man, and you define it as
Speaker 3: you being good because you know what, And I'm glad
Speaker 3: you brought religion into this. We've taught We've been taught
Speaker 3: from this sense that God loves everybody. I should love everybody,
Speaker 3: and God doesn't give up on people. I shouldn't give
Speaker 3: up on people. And what I'm saying is sometimes we
Speaker 3: bring this God complex into relationships and it don't fit.
Speaker 3: That's not where we supposed to be doing this at.
Speaker 3: You know what I'm saying. If you want to love
Speaker 3: this person as a Frank Coop, you want to help
Speaker 3: him out as a Frank Coop, but this person still
Speaker 3: has to meet your standards.
Speaker 4: And here's the thing. The worst thing in the world.
Speaker 3: Is to get cheated on by the guy you settled
Speaker 3: for that got to hit different. It got to hit different.
Speaker 3: It's one thing, all right, Getting cheated on his back.
Speaker 3: But by the God, you better than quote unquote, and
Speaker 3: that gotta hurt different. It gotta hurt different. Oh my goodness.
Speaker 2: And on that note, let's take a break.
Speaker 4: We'll be right back.
Speaker 2: Welcome back to the our spot. Let's get back to
Speaker 2: the conversation. This is is so important because I think
Speaker 2: this is a place where it really breaks down for
Speaker 2: a lot of women because in their minds, they have
Speaker 2: been good women. They have relaxed their boundaries, they have
Speaker 2: lowered their standards, thinking that the big mistake women thing
Speaker 2: is that I can fix them. And the thing that
Speaker 2: I know this goes for old dogs, new dogs, young dogs, puppies,
Speaker 2: safer nots when you think you can fix it. So
Speaker 2: we have to take off our tool belt and stop
Speaker 2: being repair people. But also so many women are so
Speaker 2: afraid to be alone that they will they do dumb down.
Speaker 2: I had.
Speaker 1: Let me just share this experience.
Speaker 2: I had just a beginning interaction with a doctor, okay,
Speaker 2: the emergency room doctor. We talked and talked, and he's
Speaker 2: emergency room, so that's absolutely insane. And then I'm all
Speaker 2: over the place with my work. And so there was
Speaker 2: one weekend that he finally had off and I had
Speaker 2: to teach, and so he wanted me to give up
Speaker 2: my teaching.
Speaker 1: To meet for the first time, and I said, it's
Speaker 1: my ministry. I can't do that.
Speaker 2: And he said, as we get deeper into this relationship,
Speaker 2: that's gonna have to change. Okay, So now I'm a
Speaker 2: red flag swat team. So I said, really, what does
Speaker 2: that mean. You know how I work, and you know
Speaker 2: what I'm doing, and I get a weekend off, and
Speaker 2: you're not gonna make adjustments so that we can be together.
Speaker 1: And I said nope.
Speaker 2: At my age, you know, if you get somebody whose
Speaker 2: teeth fit.
Speaker 1: You try to hang on.
Speaker 2: I said, nope, that's it for women. My point is this,
Speaker 2: there have to be some things you will not compromise.
Speaker 2: But so then I think is women we compromise so
Speaker 2: many sacred places in our life and so many things
Speaker 2: to be in the relationship that that So I just said,
Speaker 2: that's not going to work for me. And so when
Speaker 2: he called, he did say, what have I done something wrong?
Speaker 2: I said, no, not wrong, It just doesn't work for me.
Speaker 2: It doesn't work for me in my life. You have
Speaker 2: to know that what's important to me is important to me,
Speaker 2: and we both adjust and we both compromise. But I
Speaker 2: don't know you like that for you to be telling.
Speaker 3: Me what's interesting, because and I caught it earlier. But
Speaker 3: even now, that purpose part is so important. Your cup
Speaker 3: is filled with purpose, right, And when your cup is
Speaker 3: filled with purpose, you don't have to feel it with
Speaker 3: people that don't fit you.
Speaker 4: Know what I'm saying.
Speaker 3: But oftentimes there are so many people devoid of that
Speaker 3: purpose in direction. So now becoming a white are a
Speaker 3: girlfriend is a soul motivating factor. And so now when
Speaker 3: you're drinking because you're thirsty, because you're not feel with
Speaker 3: purpose in the other way in other areas. And the
Speaker 3: one thing you said, I want to just go back
Speaker 3: a little bit when you had talked about being a
Speaker 3: good woman to him, and I want to emphasize that
Speaker 3: there are so many women that are good women to
Speaker 3: undeserving men, But are you a good woman to yourself?
Speaker 3: You call yourself a good woman in relations to how
Speaker 3: you treat him, But are you a good woman in
Speaker 3: relation to how you treat you? It matters because you
Speaker 3: have to just in my psyche, right, And I'm gonna
Speaker 3: just briefly break it down. There are certain men that
Speaker 3: don't care how you feel inside, just as long as
Speaker 3: he's satisfied from this relationship. This is why you can
Speaker 3: have two people in the same relationship view it completely different.
Speaker 3: You're miserable, I'm happy. I'm happy because you do serve me,
Speaker 3: you do benefit me, you do give me lee waye
Speaker 3: you allow me to be who I am without consequence.
Speaker 3: I am happy. You are the perfect woman for me,
Speaker 3: and you are doing the things that make me happy.
Speaker 3: But in the process, it's like a seesaw. And that's
Speaker 3: why I say these relationships be unbalanced. The worse you
Speaker 3: feel about yourself, the better he views this relationship. The
Speaker 3: more you start doing for yourself and you start caring
Speaker 3: for yourself, you start loving yourself, you start saying no,
Speaker 3: you start enforcing boundaries, the more he feels like you're
Speaker 3: not treating him well.
Speaker 4: And these are relationships you can't be in. So I
Speaker 4: get it.
Speaker 3: You define yourself as a good woman because you are
Speaker 3: doing good things for him, but at the expense of
Speaker 3: being a good woman for you. So you have to
Speaker 3: get with somebody where being a good woman for you
Speaker 3: is in turn being a good woman for him. Because
Speaker 3: you guys are on the same path the same purpose,
Speaker 3: You got a similar morality and understanding, and most importantly,
Speaker 3: y'all reciprocate. So now it doesn't feel like a seesaw,
Speaker 3: feels like an elevator. As you elevate, so do he,
Speaker 3: and as he elevates, so do you. And I know
Speaker 3: this sounds idealistic, but it's true. It's just true.
Speaker 2: So very often again, as women, particularly women of color, red, black,
Speaker 2: and brown women are taught that our job is to
Speaker 2: make everything in everyone more important than us, So we
Speaker 2: will we are value in our worth by giving so
Speaker 2: much of ourselves away. But you keep mentioning consequences for behavior,
Speaker 2: and that's something that I think we as women don't
Speaker 2: put enough energy into. So talk to me about when
Speaker 2: a woman, when there are consequences for bad behavior or
Speaker 2: disruptive behavior in a relationship, how does that impact you
Speaker 2: as a man.
Speaker 3: It makes me think twice about doing it. If the
Speaker 3: consequence of me doing this action is you gonna be
Speaker 3: mad for a couple of days, You're gonna I'm breaking
Speaker 3: up with you, blah blah blain, and I just say
Speaker 3: I'm sorry. I go to a couple therapy sessions, and
Speaker 3: then we back where we are all I had to
Speaker 3: do is pretend to be different for three or four
Speaker 3: weeks and here that bought me another two years in
Speaker 3: your life. All right, then cool? But if the but
Speaker 3: that's what But that's the thing, that is what's happening.
Speaker 3: I know it sounds funny when you say it, but
Speaker 3: it's what's happening. It's that cycle, right, it's the cycle.
Speaker 3: And so what happens is when someone truly believes that
Speaker 3: you can leave, you have the power to they behave Differently,
Speaker 3: when people figure out you don't have the power to leave,
Speaker 3: they're enabled to do what they want to do because
Speaker 3: where you gonna go, where you're gonna go. And so
Speaker 3: I just encourage people.
Speaker 4: This is my thing.
Speaker 3: I encourage people to tell people the fine print. And again,
Speaker 3: I know this is controversial, I say it. I'll tell
Speaker 3: people disagree with me. Look my love for you. I'm sorry.
Speaker 3: I'm gonna just say it very conditional. Now the conditions
Speaker 3: I'm gonna lay out for you. Treat me well, don't
Speaker 3: do this, don't do that. Very simple things, basic things
Speaker 3: that remedial adults should understand in relationships. If that doesn't happen,
Speaker 3: my act of loving you will be revoked period. But
Speaker 3: what happens is what we do. Though we tell people
Speaker 3: I ain't gonna never leave. I promise I'm gonna always
Speaker 3: be here. We say all these things, and I get
Speaker 3: it because it sounds romantic. It really do. But we
Speaker 3: need to start reading people to fine print. Fine Print
Speaker 3: is just as long as you are present, as long
Speaker 3: as you're not repeatedly disrespectful to me, as long as
Speaker 3: if cheating is a boundary for you, as long as
Speaker 3: you're not violating that boundary, and blah blah blah. This
Speaker 3: is things you have to tell people, and then there
Speaker 3: has to be consequences.
Speaker 4: This is the thing. You have to love you and
Speaker 4: your healing and your journey the same amount, if not
Speaker 4: more than you love that man. And here's the interesting part.
Speaker 4: Sometimes we love that person more than we love those things,
Speaker 4: and that person treats us orbly. And so my point is,
Speaker 4: consequences has to be there, because what are standards and
Speaker 4: boundaries without consequences. They're just suggestions.
Speaker 3: It literally, you're just suggesting things at that points.
Speaker 2: Yeah, what you're talking about is consequences. I call deal breakers.
Speaker 2: What are your deal breakers? I say, each partner, you
Speaker 2: get three deal breakers, and then you get some boundaries
Speaker 2: to work with them. And for me, a boundary is
Speaker 2: that standard that keeps me safe. But this is how
Speaker 2: a boundary works. And this is what I tell women
Speaker 2: all the time. The number one thing is you have
Speaker 2: to announce the boundaries. Tell the person the boundary is.
Speaker 2: Chances are they're going to violate it. Number the second
Speaker 2: time they violated, you announce the boundary and you announce
Speaker 2: the consequence, and so they know if you do this again,
Speaker 2: this is a consequence. Chances are they're going to violate
Speaker 2: it again when that third time comes. This is the
Speaker 2: boundary we talked about it. This is the consequence I announced.
Speaker 2: So now you violated the boundary the third time, there
Speaker 2: are no more opportunities. If that violated again, done off
Speaker 2: with your head. But so, because then you're giving people
Speaker 2: the opportunity, You're stating your expectation.
Speaker 1: You're letting them know what you expect. You're letting them
Speaker 1: know what.
Speaker 2: Happens if they don't honor that expectation. You have to
Speaker 2: enact the consequence. You must otherwise, like you said, it's
Speaker 2: just the recommendation or a suggestion.
Speaker 4: Yeah, it really is.
Speaker 1: Do men settle for women.
Speaker 4: You know what, let me say this.
Speaker 3: See, now you're about to give me in trouble because
Speaker 3: IM about to say I'm about to be real with you.
Speaker 1: Hey, please be real.
Speaker 4: Not in the same way. Okay, I don't believe in
Speaker 4: the same way.
Speaker 1: Tell me more.
Speaker 3: Ah, you about to give me your trouble. Okay, here's
Speaker 3: the thing I believe when women. I believe that there
Speaker 3: are pocket of women. I'm not going to put a
Speaker 3: percentage that believe they're settling, but they really not.
Speaker 4: You are getting what you can get at this point
Speaker 4: you are.
Speaker 2: You're attracting what the same thing that's vibrating where you are.
Speaker 2: You may think you're vibrating at sixty five when you're
Speaker 2: really at thirty seven point six.
Speaker 3: Now I believe men. I believe that there are men
Speaker 3: that are content with what they know they can get
Speaker 3: at this moment. They don't view it necessarily as settling.
Speaker 3: Now does that mean that they won't try to upgrade
Speaker 3: if they situations change? I don't know about that. But
Speaker 3: in the moment, I don't think they view it as
Speaker 3: I could do better, and I don't think in their head.
Speaker 4: And let me tell you why.
Speaker 3: I think for men, love and loyalty are so tied together,
Speaker 3: like when I say I love you, I'm loyal to you,
Speaker 3: which is amazing because some men be cheating and still
Speaker 3: think they loyal, but just follow me. The loyalty is
Speaker 3: I'm gonna be here for you. I'm invested in being
Speaker 3: a pair.
Speaker 4: And it's so.
Speaker 3: Do I believe men settle, meaning that do they get
Speaker 3: with women with whom they feel like if they looked
Speaker 3: a little bit harder they could find quote unquote better, Yes,
Speaker 3: but they're not haunted or spelled or overly imp impulsive
Speaker 3: about focusing on them. The settling part, it's okay, I'm
Speaker 3: content here, like I'm done looking. I don't want to
Speaker 3: I don't want to date. Yo, it sucks like I'm
Speaker 3: thirty four. I don't want to go dating no more.
Speaker 3: I am happy where I am. Okay, I am happy
Speaker 3: where I am. Now Here's the fundamental part though about
Speaker 3: this discussion. They don't feel like they settle at the
Speaker 3: same rate because I don't feel like men view the
Speaker 3: day dating pool of women the same way women view
Speaker 3: the dating pool of men. I had mentioned it before.
Speaker 3: I don't think as a man, even before I've gotten
Speaker 3: a little cloud or whatever, the case may be. When
Speaker 3: I was working a regular job, I was a nurse.
Speaker 3: I didn't think that there was a lack of quality
Speaker 3: women in my small town. I'm from Dayton, Ohio. Everywhere
Speaker 3: I looked, there was a quality woman for what I
Speaker 3: was looking for, because I didn't have to look at
Speaker 3: how much finances they had. I looked at were they
Speaker 3: a good person? How did they make me feel? Did
Speaker 3: I laugh around them? Were they supportive? Could she believe
Speaker 3: in my dream? The metrics I define a good woman
Speaker 3: as isn't the same as what women define or the
Speaker 3: metrics they use for men. Women are more selective, so
Speaker 3: of course they're going to feel like they're settling a
Speaker 3: little bit.
Speaker 2: Late, a minute later, a minute that is goal, right,
Speaker 2: then we should be able to get two shows out
Speaker 2: of that. That was the Ace of Broken Hearts, Ace
Speaker 2: metaphor keeping it real For real. Ace is hysterically funny,
Speaker 2: totally animated, and his point of view is more often
Speaker 2: than knock on point. He is raw, he is real.
Speaker 2: He has a kind of ancient wisdom and perspective to
Speaker 2: many of the current problems and issues encountered in our relationships.
Speaker 2: But the special sauce for me is that this is
Speaker 2: a man, a young man, who is talking to women,
Speaker 2: spilling the tea about what men do, how they do it,
Speaker 2: and why they do it. Ace is very clear that
Speaker 2: men do what they do because we as women.
Speaker 1: Do what we do.
Speaker 2: We allow it, we accommodated, we tolerated, and it hurts
Speaker 2: up now that conversation was so deep and so nice.
Speaker 1: I say, we do it twice.
Speaker 2: We'll be back next week with part two of my
Speaker 2: interview with Ace Metaphor, see you there in the meantime,
Speaker 2: Stay in peace, not in peace.
Speaker 1: Bye.
Speaker 2: The R Spot is a production of Shondaland Audio in
Speaker 2: partnership with iHeartRadio. For more podcasts from Shondaland Audio, visit
Speaker 2: the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to
Speaker 2: your favorite shows.