1 00:00:00,160 --> 00:00:04,480 Speaker 1: Paper Ghosts is a production of I Heart Radio. The 2 00:00:04,519 --> 00:00:08,920 Speaker 1: following episode contains material that may be unsuitable and difficult 3 00:00:09,000 --> 00:00:16,600 Speaker 1: for some to hear. Previously on Paper Ghosts, among the 4 00:00:16,600 --> 00:00:20,040 Speaker 1: cult cases, twenty year old Susan Lorosa banished on a 5 00:00:20,079 --> 00:00:25,520 Speaker 1: trip to a story in Rockville in my sister Sue 6 00:00:25,920 --> 00:00:31,200 Speaker 1: was not a good mother. She was She's a horrible mother. Actually, Uh, 7 00:00:31,520 --> 00:00:36,000 Speaker 1: she went off on a little one and she backhanded him. 8 00:00:36,520 --> 00:00:41,519 Speaker 1: Kame was bleeding profusely. Police used to handle domestic violence 9 00:00:41,760 --> 00:00:44,120 Speaker 1: just for the warning. They would tell husbands, you know, 10 00:00:44,320 --> 00:00:49,560 Speaker 1: control your wife, or I'll go back inside. Don't call us. 11 00:00:49,600 --> 00:00:54,400 Speaker 1: So the theory the family has is that either okay, 12 00:00:54,680 --> 00:00:56,840 Speaker 1: he went off on her because he couldn't take it 13 00:00:56,920 --> 00:01:00,240 Speaker 1: anymore and he was trying to protect his kid. He 14 00:01:00,360 --> 00:01:03,360 Speaker 1: either took a piece of type that he always had 15 00:01:03,400 --> 00:01:07,560 Speaker 1: in the house because he always collected it and knocked 16 00:01:07,560 --> 00:01:10,120 Speaker 1: her with it, or he just knocked her down and 17 00:01:10,200 --> 00:01:17,600 Speaker 1: she smashed her head against the top. My name is 18 00:01:18,000 --> 00:01:49,760 Speaker 1: and William Phelps. This is paper Ghosts dying right? What's 19 00:01:49,800 --> 00:01:55,120 Speaker 1: going on there? How the fighting is Dingleverever never the 20 00:01:55,400 --> 00:01:59,040 Speaker 1: I got this because he has commany lo jinky dark 21 00:01:59,080 --> 00:02:01,920 Speaker 1: you need you were your mom? What's his name? What 22 00:02:02,040 --> 00:02:14,280 Speaker 1: is his name? Your father's name? That voice you here, 23 00:02:14,840 --> 00:02:19,000 Speaker 1: begging the operator for help is from a six year old. 24 00:02:20,080 --> 00:02:23,160 Speaker 1: There can be no doubt what she is witnessing. Her 25 00:02:23,240 --> 00:02:26,760 Speaker 1: stepfather is beating her mother and siblings, which she had 26 00:02:26,760 --> 00:02:33,000 Speaker 1: been doing continually for years. It was the call became infamous, 27 00:02:33,360 --> 00:02:36,240 Speaker 1: changing the way in which we as Americans thought about 28 00:02:36,320 --> 00:02:41,520 Speaker 1: domestic violence. Go back fifteen years from there, and mentioning 29 00:02:41,560 --> 00:02:44,480 Speaker 1: this sort of thing or talking about it to anyone 30 00:02:44,520 --> 00:02:50,440 Speaker 1: in the seventies was unheard of. For that reason, among others, 31 00:02:50,840 --> 00:02:53,360 Speaker 1: it hasn't been easy to get direct family members to 32 00:02:53,400 --> 00:02:56,679 Speaker 1: talk to me about what happened to night Susan Larrossa disappeared. 33 00:02:57,760 --> 00:03:01,440 Speaker 1: It's taken months, years even to build the relationships I 34 00:03:01,480 --> 00:03:04,320 Speaker 1: have and gain their trust enough to get the true story. 35 00:03:06,200 --> 00:03:08,720 Speaker 1: I've now spoken to two of Susan's sisters and have 36 00:03:08,800 --> 00:03:11,760 Speaker 1: gotten a better understanding of who she was, both as 37 00:03:11,760 --> 00:03:15,160 Speaker 1: a mother and a wife, and that her own family 38 00:03:15,200 --> 00:03:18,960 Speaker 1: believes she was murdered by her husband, Bob, in an 39 00:03:18,960 --> 00:03:24,000 Speaker 1: attempt to protect their child from abuse. It's really difficult 40 00:03:24,040 --> 00:03:27,840 Speaker 1: to imagine how bad things were behind closed doors inside 41 00:03:27,880 --> 00:03:30,800 Speaker 1: that apartment, or what life was like for a child 42 00:03:30,919 --> 00:03:35,160 Speaker 1: to grow up in such an unhealthy environment. That being said, 43 00:03:35,640 --> 00:03:39,080 Speaker 1: I was finally able to track down an important Larrosa source, 44 00:03:39,880 --> 00:03:44,880 Speaker 1: someone unafraid to confront her past, a primary witness who 45 00:03:44,880 --> 00:03:49,720 Speaker 1: claims to have been in the room a June the 46 00:03:49,880 --> 00:03:58,960 Speaker 1: night Susan Larrosa was murdered. The story has always been 47 00:03:59,000 --> 00:04:01,600 Speaker 1: that Susan left her apartment to call her mother, as 48 00:04:01,640 --> 00:04:04,080 Speaker 1: she did just about every night at the same time, 49 00:04:04,400 --> 00:04:07,520 Speaker 1: to pick up diapers and formula at a nearby drug store. 50 00:04:09,520 --> 00:04:15,000 Speaker 1: But according to this witness, Susan Larrossa's only daughter, her 51 00:04:15,040 --> 00:04:23,040 Speaker 1: mother never left their apartment alive. Good morning, Hi, Stacy, 52 00:04:23,120 --> 00:04:28,160 Speaker 1: how are you? Stacy LaRosa is Bob and Susan Lerossa's 53 00:04:28,240 --> 00:04:32,880 Speaker 1: oldest child, now in her mid forties. She lives nowhere 54 00:04:32,920 --> 00:04:36,839 Speaker 1: near New England these days, for reasons that will become 55 00:04:37,279 --> 00:04:43,360 Speaker 1: abundantly clear. You guys grew up on Ward Street. Um, 56 00:04:43,440 --> 00:04:45,760 Speaker 1: do you have many memories about Ward Street in the 57 00:04:45,760 --> 00:04:50,200 Speaker 1: household before this? Um? Just a rocking chair in the 58 00:04:50,240 --> 00:04:53,839 Speaker 1: window we sat at now to night that night. That's 59 00:04:53,880 --> 00:04:57,240 Speaker 1: my memory that night, That's the only memory actually have 60 00:04:57,440 --> 00:05:02,320 Speaker 1: of my mom, which is messed up. In the days 61 00:05:02,360 --> 00:05:08,000 Speaker 1: after Susan LaRosa went missing. Days literally, Bob LaRosa separated 62 00:05:08,080 --> 00:05:12,159 Speaker 1: his three children, Stacy, Robert, and Moe and sent them 63 00:05:12,200 --> 00:05:15,599 Speaker 1: to stay with different family members, which is, for me, 64 00:05:16,080 --> 00:05:21,320 Speaker 1: in and of itself, strange behavior. Families generally bond stay 65 00:05:21,320 --> 00:05:25,279 Speaker 1: close and connected during such a traumatic time, especially so 66 00:05:25,320 --> 00:05:29,440 Speaker 1: early into it. Stacy, the oldest of the Larosa's three kids, 67 00:05:29,800 --> 00:05:33,880 Speaker 1: wound up with their godparents in western Massachusetts. She was 68 00:05:33,920 --> 00:05:38,039 Speaker 1: three years old. The documents I have describing this period 69 00:05:38,080 --> 00:05:44,000 Speaker 1: of time are incredibly detailed, not to mention alarming. Exactly 70 00:05:44,040 --> 00:05:48,159 Speaker 1: three months to the day Susan went missing, Stacy's godmother 71 00:05:48,200 --> 00:05:51,840 Speaker 1: called Vernon police and said, quote, the child has brought 72 00:05:51,920 --> 00:05:55,760 Speaker 1: up the subject of her missing mother. That alone might 73 00:05:55,760 --> 00:05:59,919 Speaker 1: not sound like much, but it's what Stacy says next 74 00:06:00,120 --> 00:06:04,279 Speaker 1: that is both chilling and revealing. I have night tears. 75 00:06:04,880 --> 00:06:07,240 Speaker 1: I mean, that's what they call them, their thread Back 76 00:06:07,240 --> 00:06:09,480 Speaker 1: then they were just scary dreams, but I mean the 77 00:06:10,000 --> 00:06:13,960 Speaker 1: proper terminologies, their nightcars. Night terrors are a type of 78 00:06:13,960 --> 00:06:16,880 Speaker 1: sleep disorder in which a person is suddenly awakened in 79 00:06:16,920 --> 00:06:21,520 Speaker 1: a state of fear. Uncommon, they predominantly affect young children, 80 00:06:22,160 --> 00:06:26,239 Speaker 1: they're unlike nightmares. I eat bad dreams. They can result 81 00:06:26,240 --> 00:06:29,680 Speaker 1: from a number of reasons, but in Stacy's case, that 82 00:06:29,839 --> 00:06:32,800 Speaker 1: fear is directly related to what she witnessed as a 83 00:06:32,839 --> 00:06:36,120 Speaker 1: three year old. To tell me about that, So, how 84 00:06:36,160 --> 00:06:39,520 Speaker 1: does that start for you? It always starts the same 85 00:06:39,520 --> 00:06:43,040 Speaker 1: way with Robert and me, you know. Like Robert and 86 00:06:43,080 --> 00:06:48,640 Speaker 1: I are arguing over his truck and he pulled my hair, okay, 87 00:06:48,760 --> 00:06:51,800 Speaker 1: and I screamed, and I see my mom she's changing 88 00:06:51,839 --> 00:06:54,400 Speaker 1: my wan and changing thing, that table thing, and I 89 00:06:54,520 --> 00:06:57,320 Speaker 1: scream and she just kind of left. Mo. I mean 90 00:06:57,720 --> 00:06:59,320 Speaker 1: back then, I guess I didn't realize all this was 91 00:06:59,360 --> 00:07:01,560 Speaker 1: going on. But an adult now you can see it better. 92 00:07:01,800 --> 00:07:03,880 Speaker 1: But she turned around and she stopped my brother in 93 00:07:03,880 --> 00:07:07,440 Speaker 1: the face and right on the nose, and it bled, 94 00:07:07,680 --> 00:07:14,080 Speaker 1: it bled, it was bleeding. In the police report of 95 00:07:14,120 --> 00:07:17,120 Speaker 1: this incident, the fight between Stacy and her middle brother 96 00:07:17,320 --> 00:07:22,000 Speaker 1: Robert is outlined. A bloody nose, however, is not only 97 00:07:22,040 --> 00:07:25,720 Speaker 1: a cut lip, the kind of cut quote caused by 98 00:07:25,720 --> 00:07:29,320 Speaker 1: a tooth sticking into the lip from inside the mouth. 99 00:07:30,080 --> 00:07:33,280 Speaker 1: It's obvious but important to point out a cut lip 100 00:07:33,320 --> 00:07:37,080 Speaker 1: and bloody nose will produce vastly different amounts of blood. 101 00:07:39,040 --> 00:07:42,440 Speaker 1: So Robert wiped his hand on his nose. He touched 102 00:07:42,440 --> 00:07:45,560 Speaker 1: the wall, so there's a bloody hand print. Okay, my dad, 103 00:07:46,160 --> 00:07:50,400 Speaker 1: he wasn't the kitchen. In one law enforcement document written 104 00:07:50,440 --> 00:07:53,440 Speaker 1: the day after Susan went missing, the Vernon p D 105 00:07:53,640 --> 00:07:56,680 Speaker 1: reported how Bob the Rosa told one of Susan's sisters 106 00:07:56,760 --> 00:08:00,720 Speaker 1: that quote, Sue swiped the child in the face, causing 107 00:08:00,800 --> 00:08:03,600 Speaker 1: him to strike his head on the stove. Su then 108 00:08:03,640 --> 00:08:06,440 Speaker 1: grabbed the child by the hair and dragged him into 109 00:08:06,440 --> 00:08:10,160 Speaker 1: a bedroom and threw him against the wall. I asked 110 00:08:10,160 --> 00:08:15,600 Speaker 1: Stacy about this bullshit. She said she remembers none of it. 111 00:08:16,960 --> 00:08:19,840 Speaker 1: I should note that Bob Lerosa never told that story 112 00:08:19,880 --> 00:08:23,880 Speaker 1: again and actually changed his story several times throughout the years. 113 00:08:25,600 --> 00:08:29,760 Speaker 1: Stacy continues explaining what she does recall about her dad. 114 00:08:31,120 --> 00:08:34,920 Speaker 1: He used to clean metals, um, he used to return metal. Okay, 115 00:08:35,200 --> 00:08:38,800 Speaker 1: he's cleaning this this long like silver pipe thing. So 116 00:08:39,200 --> 00:08:42,240 Speaker 1: he comes in and her back was towards him, you know, 117 00:08:42,640 --> 00:08:45,480 Speaker 1: and he just he was angry. Like I always thought 118 00:08:45,480 --> 00:08:47,439 Speaker 1: it was an accident. I really did believe that in 119 00:08:47,480 --> 00:08:50,240 Speaker 1: my heart. I think I needed to And he just 120 00:08:50,280 --> 00:08:52,640 Speaker 1: took his arm and he had the pipe and he 121 00:08:52,720 --> 00:08:55,120 Speaker 1: just hit her. He hit her hard, and my mom 122 00:08:55,200 --> 00:08:58,280 Speaker 1: just fell, like totally just fell. And I remember, I 123 00:08:58,360 --> 00:09:00,959 Speaker 1: even know what I'm wearing, Hike, I know what I'm wearing, 124 00:09:01,520 --> 00:09:04,560 Speaker 1: and um and knelt down by her head and there's 125 00:09:04,600 --> 00:09:07,360 Speaker 1: all this this blood. You know, to me, it was 126 00:09:07,400 --> 00:09:10,280 Speaker 1: just red, geeky stuff. But there was all this blood 127 00:09:10,320 --> 00:09:11,720 Speaker 1: and there was a lot of blood. There was a 128 00:09:11,760 --> 00:09:14,360 Speaker 1: lot of blood, Dad said, because she was sleeping, and 129 00:09:14,480 --> 00:09:17,240 Speaker 1: I kept mommy, Mommy, wake up, Mommy, wake up, Mommy, 130 00:09:17,240 --> 00:09:19,520 Speaker 1: wake up. My mom wasn't moving, you know, like there 131 00:09:19,600 --> 00:09:21,840 Speaker 1: was no twitching there was. My mom just didn't move. 132 00:09:25,280 --> 00:09:27,480 Speaker 1: Some might not trust what a three year old says. 133 00:09:27,880 --> 00:09:31,600 Speaker 1: Others have judged Stacy's memories, viewing what she recalls through 134 00:09:31,600 --> 00:09:34,840 Speaker 1: a lens of a substance abuse problems she develops later, 135 00:09:35,200 --> 00:09:39,400 Speaker 1: and psychological issues she deals with throughout her life. They 136 00:09:39,400 --> 00:09:43,160 Speaker 1: can have their opinions. For me, however, I tend to 137 00:09:43,240 --> 00:09:47,800 Speaker 1: lean more toward professional analysis. A three year old cannot 138 00:09:47,880 --> 00:09:51,160 Speaker 1: make up what Stacy reported at that age. They do 139 00:09:51,240 --> 00:09:55,040 Speaker 1: not have the mental capacity. Stacy had no idea. I 140 00:09:55,080 --> 00:09:57,440 Speaker 1: had the documents in front of me as we spoke. 141 00:09:58,160 --> 00:10:01,480 Speaker 1: She's never seen these reports and act no one outside 142 00:10:01,480 --> 00:10:05,439 Speaker 1: of law enforcement has. And the psychologist who treated Stacy 143 00:10:05,720 --> 00:10:09,480 Speaker 1: right after she began having night terrors, he said, the 144 00:10:09,600 --> 00:10:14,880 Speaker 1: child is too young to fantasize. And what she tells 145 00:10:14,880 --> 00:10:20,880 Speaker 1: me next, well, listen for yourself. The gentleman and that 146 00:10:21,000 --> 00:10:24,240 Speaker 1: was there that showed up. He has on a red 147 00:10:24,280 --> 00:10:27,559 Speaker 1: and black checkered um flannel shirt kind of thing, and 148 00:10:27,640 --> 00:10:30,199 Speaker 1: the black T shirt thing underneath with a podcast thing, 149 00:10:30,760 --> 00:10:34,640 Speaker 1: and he really smells. He smells like a very strong 150 00:10:35,160 --> 00:10:38,520 Speaker 1: and it's definitely cherry tobacco, very strong smell like I 151 00:10:38,800 --> 00:10:41,160 Speaker 1: even now to this day, I can't smell that smell 152 00:10:41,200 --> 00:10:44,959 Speaker 1: without like freezing. Stacy is referring to someone she claims 153 00:10:45,160 --> 00:10:48,880 Speaker 1: showed up after her father allegedly killed her mother, a 154 00:10:48,920 --> 00:10:52,960 Speaker 1: man who came by specifically to help Bob dispose of 155 00:10:53,040 --> 00:10:57,959 Speaker 1: Susan Larosa's body. So and my dad, Um, they brought 156 00:10:57,960 --> 00:11:00,520 Speaker 1: my mom at her house and that's last time I've 157 00:11:00,520 --> 00:11:05,240 Speaker 1: seen my mom. Stacy's story has not changed since she 158 00:11:05,360 --> 00:11:08,000 Speaker 1: was three years old, according to the report from the 159 00:11:08,120 --> 00:11:12,000 Speaker 1: child psychologist at the time. Quote. The child then stated 160 00:11:12,040 --> 00:11:15,880 Speaker 1: that her daddy and some man carried Mommy to the 161 00:11:15,960 --> 00:11:20,400 Speaker 1: car end quote the shirts he wore, the SeMet, the 162 00:11:20,480 --> 00:11:22,800 Speaker 1: cherry to thecklasm. I know that that's the person that 163 00:11:22,880 --> 00:11:25,360 Speaker 1: was there. I can describe what he's wearing. I can 164 00:11:25,440 --> 00:11:29,280 Speaker 1: smell him a mile away. The smell is very very strong. 165 00:11:29,600 --> 00:11:31,320 Speaker 1: I can't. I want to see his face, and I 166 00:11:31,400 --> 00:11:34,120 Speaker 1: just never did. I never saw. I mean I did 167 00:11:34,160 --> 00:11:36,480 Speaker 1: at that time, but for some reason, I can't see 168 00:11:36,480 --> 00:11:39,040 Speaker 1: his face when I when I go into this this 169 00:11:39,160 --> 00:11:41,840 Speaker 1: state that I mean, actually right now, I can't see 170 00:11:41,880 --> 00:11:46,120 Speaker 1: his face. Months after Susan went missing, Bob LaRosa took 171 00:11:46,120 --> 00:11:51,720 Speaker 1: a polygraph test administered by police. He passed, but exactly 172 00:11:51,840 --> 00:11:55,400 Speaker 1: nine months to the day Susan disappeared, Bob took a 173 00:11:55,440 --> 00:12:02,040 Speaker 1: second test. The one question Bob failed, do you know 174 00:12:02,160 --> 00:12:22,079 Speaker 1: for sure who killed your wife? His answer no. About 175 00:12:22,120 --> 00:12:25,240 Speaker 1: a year after Susan Leros's body was found, Bob married 176 00:12:25,280 --> 00:12:28,600 Speaker 1: a woman he began dating only weeks after his wife 177 00:12:28,600 --> 00:12:31,640 Speaker 1: went missing, and yet one police source has told me 178 00:12:31,679 --> 00:12:36,240 Speaker 1: it was weeks before. The fact is if Bob had 179 00:12:36,280 --> 00:12:40,640 Speaker 1: a girlfriend before Susan went missing, that creates the oldest 180 00:12:40,720 --> 00:12:44,240 Speaker 1: motive in the Idiot's Guide to Murdering your Spouse handbook. 181 00:12:46,559 --> 00:12:49,440 Speaker 1: After living with her godparents for nearly a year. Stacy 182 00:12:49,520 --> 00:12:51,760 Speaker 1: moved back in with her father and his new wife, 183 00:12:52,040 --> 00:12:55,720 Speaker 1: but according to Stacy and other family members, Bob would 184 00:12:55,760 --> 00:12:59,040 Speaker 1: also send Stacy to live with other people from time 185 00:12:59,080 --> 00:13:03,520 Speaker 1: to time. I have to say at this point during 186 00:13:03,520 --> 00:13:06,720 Speaker 1: our interview, the next moment opens up a thread with 187 00:13:07,000 --> 00:13:11,040 Speaker 1: alleged accusations so horrific as both the father of four 188 00:13:11,120 --> 00:13:15,760 Speaker 1: myself and an investigator who's thought he's heard everything, what 189 00:13:15,920 --> 00:13:21,240 Speaker 1: I hear next is deeply disturbing, but also vitally important 190 00:13:21,280 --> 00:13:25,160 Speaker 1: within my investigation. My dad was not a very good man. 191 00:13:25,520 --> 00:13:28,520 Speaker 1: My dad was bad with me. My dad didn't stop 192 00:13:28,559 --> 00:13:31,960 Speaker 1: touching me. Tis twelve, I see, my dad gave me 193 00:13:32,000 --> 00:13:36,319 Speaker 1: to somebody kind of like like I had to live 194 00:13:36,360 --> 00:13:41,360 Speaker 1: with friends and his and um I was nine the 195 00:13:41,480 --> 00:13:45,520 Speaker 1: first time, No, seven, seven the first time, and then 196 00:13:46,000 --> 00:13:48,120 Speaker 1: I didn't tell us I was twelve, you know. But 197 00:13:49,360 --> 00:13:53,360 Speaker 1: this guy, his name was armand Llard, my dad's friend 198 00:13:53,440 --> 00:13:55,120 Speaker 1: was friends with him. We had a lot of male 199 00:13:55,200 --> 00:13:57,360 Speaker 1: friends and we we were told to call them uncle's, 200 00:13:57,559 --> 00:13:59,840 Speaker 1: you know, like we had lots of uncle's, lots of uncles. 201 00:14:00,800 --> 00:14:03,360 Speaker 1: And I had to stay with him. I don't know why, 202 00:14:03,400 --> 00:14:06,640 Speaker 1: but I lived with them for a year. While staying 203 00:14:06,679 --> 00:14:12,120 Speaker 1: at this man armand Rullard's house, Stacy recalled horrendous abuse. 204 00:14:13,200 --> 00:14:17,480 Speaker 1: I was being hurt. There, really bad things, you know, 205 00:14:17,559 --> 00:14:21,040 Speaker 1: like things, and and I still to this day believe 206 00:14:21,080 --> 00:14:22,960 Speaker 1: my dad gave me to him for some reason. But 207 00:14:23,080 --> 00:14:25,520 Speaker 1: I pretended I was sick one time, you know, like 208 00:14:26,080 --> 00:14:28,320 Speaker 1: I pretended I was sick. I was pretending I couldn't 209 00:14:28,360 --> 00:14:31,200 Speaker 1: move my net and and I got I got to 210 00:14:31,200 --> 00:14:32,880 Speaker 1: go home. I got to go back to my dad's house, 211 00:14:33,040 --> 00:14:35,960 Speaker 1: you know. And um, when I was nine, this guy 212 00:14:36,080 --> 00:14:39,480 Speaker 1: he came to live with us, you know. And I 213 00:14:39,560 --> 00:14:44,040 Speaker 1: never told. I never told. I'm told Bob Larossa actually 214 00:14:44,080 --> 00:14:47,800 Speaker 1: turned the guy in. Armand Ruellard was sentenced on May 215 00:14:47,840 --> 00:14:52,920 Speaker 1: one after being found guilty of molest in several young girls, 216 00:14:53,400 --> 00:14:57,360 Speaker 1: including Stacy. He served nineteen of a thirty three year 217 00:14:57,440 --> 00:15:02,840 Speaker 1: sentence and recently died of natural causes. This was a 218 00:15:02,880 --> 00:15:06,600 Speaker 1: time when amber alert, serial killer, stranger, danger, and abduction 219 00:15:06,640 --> 00:15:10,560 Speaker 1: were not part of the everyday global news cycle. There 220 00:15:10,640 --> 00:15:13,920 Speaker 1: was no such thing. This type of crime was not 221 00:15:14,040 --> 00:15:19,480 Speaker 1: discussed socially inside homes or openly in neighborhoods. There was 222 00:15:19,560 --> 00:15:25,040 Speaker 1: no internet, There were no task forces and FBI databases 223 00:15:25,080 --> 00:15:30,920 Speaker 1: of serial offender stats and profiles, no sex offender registry. 224 00:15:31,280 --> 00:15:33,840 Speaker 1: It was a period when sex trafficking and the idea 225 00:15:33,880 --> 00:15:38,200 Speaker 1: of missing people and murder, especially young females, were so 226 00:15:38,320 --> 00:15:42,600 Speaker 1: outside the norm. Few considered such a dark element of society. 227 00:15:42,640 --> 00:15:46,240 Speaker 1: Committing these crimes could infiltrate what was a safe image 228 00:15:46,240 --> 00:15:50,280 Speaker 1: of rural America. And when I speak of sex trafficking 229 00:15:50,280 --> 00:15:53,920 Speaker 1: in the sixties and seventies, especially in the cases I'm investigating, 230 00:15:54,600 --> 00:15:58,680 Speaker 1: I am referring to an unorganized system of passing kids around. 231 00:16:02,480 --> 00:16:05,320 Speaker 1: Stacy had confided in an adult she was close to 232 00:16:05,360 --> 00:16:09,560 Speaker 1: and explained the allegations against armand Roullard and her father, 233 00:16:10,720 --> 00:16:14,800 Speaker 1: And I told him that Dad was hurting me, spit 234 00:16:14,920 --> 00:16:17,040 Speaker 1: in my face, slapped me across the face, and called 235 00:16:17,040 --> 00:16:21,120 Speaker 1: me a liar. After Bob heard of his daughter's allegations, 236 00:16:21,680 --> 00:16:24,600 Speaker 1: Stacy claims he told her brother to pack her suitcase, 237 00:16:24,960 --> 00:16:28,440 Speaker 1: a factor brother later confirmed from me Stacy was not 238 00:16:28,560 --> 00:16:31,440 Speaker 1: part of the family anymore, and she was then forced 239 00:16:31,480 --> 00:16:35,920 Speaker 1: to leave and Dad brought me to Hartford I'm Marshall 240 00:16:35,920 --> 00:16:38,640 Speaker 1: Street and freaking left me there twelve years old. Left 241 00:16:38,680 --> 00:16:41,520 Speaker 1: me there, okay, I'm gracious to God that I'm alive 242 00:16:41,560 --> 00:16:43,240 Speaker 1: because of me and could have killed me because he 243 00:16:43,320 --> 00:16:46,320 Speaker 1: knew I told on him. There's some dispute whether Stacy 244 00:16:46,440 --> 00:16:51,720 Speaker 1: was twelve or fourteen, but still Marshall Street, Hartford is 245 00:16:51,760 --> 00:16:55,600 Speaker 1: in the Asylum Hill section, very dangerous in some areas. 246 00:16:55,880 --> 00:16:59,200 Speaker 1: According to Stacy, Bob dropped her off on the street, 247 00:16:59,600 --> 00:17:02,480 Speaker 1: said good luck, there's a woman's shelter up the road, 248 00:17:03,160 --> 00:17:07,040 Speaker 1: and drove away. Stacy found the shelter and began life 249 00:17:07,040 --> 00:17:10,520 Speaker 1: on the street on her own. She spent the next 250 00:17:10,560 --> 00:17:14,360 Speaker 1: ten years surviving anyway she could. I just wanted dead 251 00:17:14,400 --> 00:17:16,960 Speaker 1: to stop. I wanted you need to stop. I wasn't 252 00:17:17,040 --> 00:17:19,959 Speaker 1: his stating he was, And even as an adult when 253 00:17:20,000 --> 00:17:21,679 Speaker 1: I kept trying to forgive him, and I really do 254 00:17:21,760 --> 00:17:24,720 Speaker 1: look to God, and I really I know God says 255 00:17:24,720 --> 00:17:27,480 Speaker 1: were supposed to forgive it. I kept trying, kept trying 256 00:17:27,520 --> 00:17:29,639 Speaker 1: to have some kind of a father relationship, you know, 257 00:17:30,080 --> 00:17:31,680 Speaker 1: but the man will kiss me in the lips, and okay, 258 00:17:31,680 --> 00:17:33,159 Speaker 1: that would freak me up because you're my dad. You 259 00:17:33,160 --> 00:17:35,080 Speaker 1: don't need to be doing that, you know. And and 260 00:17:35,200 --> 00:17:37,040 Speaker 1: just weird things that and my dad was just he's 261 00:17:37,080 --> 00:17:39,639 Speaker 1: not a good He wasn't when I keep do not, 262 00:17:39,920 --> 00:17:42,679 Speaker 1: I know I'm being recorded, but my brothers can't know 263 00:17:43,119 --> 00:17:49,160 Speaker 1: that I wanted him dead. I really did. No charges 264 00:17:49,240 --> 00:17:52,920 Speaker 1: for sexual abuse or exploitation were ever filed against Bob 265 00:17:52,920 --> 00:17:56,000 Speaker 1: the Rosa. He died in two thousand and eighteen. From 266 00:17:56,040 --> 00:17:58,480 Speaker 1: what I've been told, is a combination of heart disease 267 00:17:58,520 --> 00:18:02,240 Speaker 1: and other ailments, so he cannot dispute his daughters and 268 00:18:02,400 --> 00:18:09,119 Speaker 1: other family members allegations. But documents and witnesses corroborate Stacy's story. 269 00:18:09,640 --> 00:18:12,920 Speaker 1: Many of Bob's siblings and relatives refer to Bob as 270 00:18:12,960 --> 00:18:16,520 Speaker 1: a pervert. They have told me stories of him coming 271 00:18:16,560 --> 00:18:21,680 Speaker 1: on to them as young as twelve years old, thirteen 272 00:18:22,560 --> 00:18:29,359 Speaker 1: years old, which I find very interesting. What Stacy says 273 00:18:29,400 --> 00:18:32,679 Speaker 1: next changes things from me. It becomes a factor in 274 00:18:32,720 --> 00:18:39,199 Speaker 1: the disappearances. I cannot overlook or underestimate. I know my 275 00:18:39,280 --> 00:18:46,280 Speaker 1: dad like young girls. I know my dad liked young girls. 276 00:18:59,800 --> 00:19:02,600 Speaker 1: Bab Lar Rosa is someone I am now focused on. 277 00:19:03,240 --> 00:19:07,200 Speaker 1: So I meet with Stacy's brother, Bob, and Susan's youngest son, 278 00:19:07,359 --> 00:19:11,520 Speaker 1: Maurice Molarosa, to ask what he remembers about his father 279 00:19:11,960 --> 00:19:15,360 Speaker 1: and what he has to say about Bob immediately spurs 280 00:19:15,400 --> 00:19:19,800 Speaker 1: my interest. More. Let me ask you what did Bob 281 00:19:19,840 --> 00:19:23,200 Speaker 1: do for a living during the seventies. During the seventies, 282 00:19:23,240 --> 00:19:26,280 Speaker 1: he did a lot of scrap metal. Mo was nine 283 00:19:26,320 --> 00:19:30,000 Speaker 1: months old when his mother disappeared. Today he is a 284 00:19:30,000 --> 00:19:33,720 Speaker 1: heavy set guy. He sports a thick goatee, short brown 285 00:19:33,760 --> 00:19:38,040 Speaker 1: hair buzz cut. He has a charming disposition. Knowing now 286 00:19:38,080 --> 00:19:41,720 Speaker 1: what I learned from most Sister Stacy, I have several 287 00:19:41,760 --> 00:19:44,400 Speaker 1: new leads in mind that I'm hoping Moe can help with. 288 00:19:45,359 --> 00:19:51,280 Speaker 1: Did your dad ever have a model of a station wagon? Um? Yeah, Um, 289 00:19:51,359 --> 00:19:56,639 Speaker 1: we owned a Stacia wagon. I'm told Bob LaRosa often 290 00:19:56,640 --> 00:20:00,560 Speaker 1: wore khaki pants and khaki shirts, kind of like blue 291 00:20:00,560 --> 00:20:05,159 Speaker 1: collar or workers uniform. More than that, Bob drove around town, 292 00:20:05,880 --> 00:20:09,359 Speaker 1: sometimes with one of his kids, nieces or nephews in 293 00:20:09,480 --> 00:20:12,560 Speaker 1: the station wagon. He collected what he could find and 294 00:20:12,600 --> 00:20:15,879 Speaker 1: salvaged it at the junkyard. I mean, what do you 295 00:20:15,920 --> 00:20:20,679 Speaker 1: think happened to your mom? I honestly, I don't know 296 00:20:20,720 --> 00:20:23,240 Speaker 1: what happened to her. I just don't think my dad 297 00:20:23,320 --> 00:20:27,000 Speaker 1: had anything to do with it physically, I don't know. 298 00:20:28,119 --> 00:20:30,320 Speaker 1: I don't know if he didn't, I don't know. How 299 00:20:30,359 --> 00:20:32,440 Speaker 1: do I want to say, I don't know if he 300 00:20:32,520 --> 00:20:35,240 Speaker 1: doesn't know the person that did, but I don't think 301 00:20:35,280 --> 00:20:39,480 Speaker 1: he had anything himself physically to do it. As I 302 00:20:39,520 --> 00:20:43,320 Speaker 1: listened to MO, I take note of his trepidation, his uncertainty, 303 00:20:43,560 --> 00:20:45,720 Speaker 1: and the fact that he was just nine months old 304 00:20:45,840 --> 00:20:50,399 Speaker 1: in diapers when his mother went missing. I understand his conflict, 305 00:20:51,200 --> 00:20:54,560 Speaker 1: especially when you put it into a box of family secrets, 306 00:20:54,840 --> 00:20:58,400 Speaker 1: discourse and disunity. But what I think is, I keep 307 00:20:58,440 --> 00:21:02,200 Speaker 1: my investigator's cap tight. He secured. Is maybe how Bob 308 00:21:02,240 --> 00:21:06,040 Speaker 1: lar Rossa might have spent a lifetime convincing his youngest 309 00:21:06,080 --> 00:21:09,560 Speaker 1: son that he had nothing to do with it, and 310 00:21:09,640 --> 00:21:13,240 Speaker 1: an even bigger red flag from me. Mola Rossa is 311 00:21:13,280 --> 00:21:16,840 Speaker 1: now the second person to suggest Bob lar Rossa might 312 00:21:16,920 --> 00:21:20,760 Speaker 1: not have acted alone on the night his wife Susan 313 00:21:21,080 --> 00:21:31,040 Speaker 1: disappeared far and away. Most sexual assaults and sexual violence 314 00:21:31,040 --> 00:21:36,120 Speaker 1: are perpetrated by men and typically arise within asymmetrical power dynamics, 315 00:21:36,320 --> 00:21:40,120 Speaker 1: where the perpetrator occupies a more powerful or dominant position 316 00:21:40,520 --> 00:21:43,280 Speaker 1: in relation to the victim. That is a quote from 317 00:21:43,280 --> 00:21:47,560 Speaker 1: an article written by lynnonic Board, certified in Clinical social Work, 318 00:21:47,880 --> 00:21:51,679 Speaker 1: published in Psychology Today. It is a contextual piece of 319 00:21:51,680 --> 00:21:54,600 Speaker 1: information from me within the framework of what you are 320 00:21:54,640 --> 00:22:05,040 Speaker 1: about to hear. Hello, Hi, Bernard That yes, Hi, it's 321 00:22:05,200 --> 00:22:11,080 Speaker 1: uh M William Phelps. Call me Matthew, Matthew okay. Bernardette 322 00:22:11,080 --> 00:22:15,000 Speaker 1: Gonthier is one of Susan Loross's other sisters. At the 323 00:22:15,040 --> 00:22:17,800 Speaker 1: time of her death, Susan was twenty years old and 324 00:22:17,880 --> 00:22:20,840 Speaker 1: living with her husband, Bob, and their three children in 325 00:22:20,880 --> 00:22:24,760 Speaker 1: a three bedroom apartment on Ward Street in Rockville, Connecticut, 326 00:22:25,040 --> 00:22:30,080 Speaker 1: just a fifteen minute drive away from Crystal Lake. How 327 00:22:30,200 --> 00:22:33,520 Speaker 1: was your sister right around that time? How was she 328 00:22:33,600 --> 00:22:39,800 Speaker 1: doing great? I mean, she um was doing good. She 329 00:22:40,960 --> 00:22:48,879 Speaker 1: you know, she was, Oh my god, she was. I 330 00:22:48,880 --> 00:22:50,840 Speaker 1: don't know. I guess she was too. When she come 331 00:22:50,880 --> 00:22:53,840 Speaker 1: to our house. She was. She seemed to be up 332 00:22:53,840 --> 00:22:56,120 Speaker 1: to part of that. Then I was, you know, I'm 333 00:22:56,160 --> 00:22:59,800 Speaker 1: fourteen years old, burking in fourteen, and she didn't do 334 00:22:59,840 --> 00:23:02,440 Speaker 1: a lot of talking to me, you know, she did 335 00:23:02,480 --> 00:23:04,600 Speaker 1: to my mom. I mean, because back then you didn't 336 00:23:04,640 --> 00:23:06,680 Speaker 1: do that, you know what I mean, back in those 337 00:23:06,760 --> 00:23:10,040 Speaker 1: days between mom and daughter or but it wasn't the 338 00:23:10,119 --> 00:23:15,639 Speaker 1: whole family. Bernadette has a way of not holding anything back. 339 00:23:16,280 --> 00:23:21,080 Speaker 1: She will tell you exactly how it is no bullshit. This, 340 00:23:21,240 --> 00:23:24,840 Speaker 1: for one, I can relate to, and two I greatly appreciate. 341 00:23:25,359 --> 00:23:28,600 Speaker 1: Bullshit is nothing but a waste of everyone's time. The 342 00:23:28,640 --> 00:23:32,159 Speaker 1: world needs to hear truth, not a watered down version 343 00:23:32,200 --> 00:23:35,880 Speaker 1: of what might offend someone. I asked her about Bob 344 00:23:35,920 --> 00:23:41,119 Speaker 1: and Susan's relationship, and she reveals something I find very interesting. 345 00:23:42,359 --> 00:23:44,360 Speaker 1: They seem to argue a lot, you know what I mean. 346 00:23:44,920 --> 00:23:46,600 Speaker 1: When it came to the kids and stuff, they seemed 347 00:23:46,640 --> 00:23:54,800 Speaker 1: to argue a lot um. She she would throw things 348 00:23:54,840 --> 00:23:59,600 Speaker 1: at him, but most of the time, when she got 349 00:23:59,640 --> 00:24:02,879 Speaker 1: pissed off, she'd go for a walk, you know what 350 00:24:02,920 --> 00:24:06,000 Speaker 1: I mean. She and she always took This is the 351 00:24:06,040 --> 00:24:10,280 Speaker 1: weird thing. She never went anywhere without the baby, Maurice, 352 00:24:10,960 --> 00:24:15,520 Speaker 1: never except for this one day, supposedly the day she disappeared. 353 00:24:15,840 --> 00:24:19,560 Speaker 1: She didn't have the baby with her, right, so tell 354 00:24:19,600 --> 00:24:22,520 Speaker 1: me about that. Tell me about the day she disappeared. 355 00:24:23,520 --> 00:24:25,760 Speaker 1: We had been at my uncle's house up in Wales 356 00:24:25,920 --> 00:24:35,200 Speaker 1: math Um. We came home later that early evening and 357 00:24:35,240 --> 00:24:40,360 Speaker 1: my mother got a call from Bob. I guess yeah, 358 00:24:40,359 --> 00:24:42,120 Speaker 1: I think, yeah, it was Bob that called and said, 359 00:24:42,720 --> 00:24:46,160 Speaker 1: have you heard from your daughter? And my mother. Susan 360 00:24:46,200 --> 00:24:48,680 Speaker 1: always knew, I mean mostly every Sunday we want my 361 00:24:48,760 --> 00:24:52,720 Speaker 1: uncle's in math and I soon knew when we were 362 00:24:52,760 --> 00:24:54,760 Speaker 1: there and when we come home, you know what I mean. 363 00:24:56,280 --> 00:24:59,120 Speaker 1: And this one day, my mother didn't get her phone call. 364 00:25:00,359 --> 00:25:03,159 Speaker 1: Bernadette mentions a cop who worked a beat just up 365 00:25:03,160 --> 00:25:06,200 Speaker 1: the street from the apartment, a cop who was familiar 366 00:25:06,240 --> 00:25:09,040 Speaker 1: with Susan because he saw her every day when she 367 00:25:09,080 --> 00:25:11,719 Speaker 1: would walk to the drug store to make her daily 368 00:25:11,760 --> 00:25:15,080 Speaker 1: phone call to her mom at six pm. And he 369 00:25:15,160 --> 00:25:18,440 Speaker 1: never saw her that day. And the pharmacist, Now back 370 00:25:18,440 --> 00:25:20,720 Speaker 1: then you could buy cigarettes in a pharmacy, and the 371 00:25:20,760 --> 00:25:23,240 Speaker 1: pharmacist just dis sumed my sister all the time, and 372 00:25:23,359 --> 00:25:30,280 Speaker 1: he never saw since dead day. And so the night passes, 373 00:25:30,960 --> 00:25:35,440 Speaker 1: the next day comes, and what happens. My mom didn't 374 00:25:35,480 --> 00:25:38,440 Speaker 1: sleep much, let me tell you, you know, she just 375 00:25:38,760 --> 00:25:41,960 Speaker 1: was up constantly waiting for Sue to call, to see 376 00:25:41,960 --> 00:25:53,040 Speaker 1: if maybe she had gone off somewhere or whatever. Bernadette said. 377 00:25:53,080 --> 00:25:57,160 Speaker 1: The days after Susan went missing were absolute torture on everyone. 378 00:25:57,920 --> 00:26:03,919 Speaker 1: The family on edge, we eating, wondering, everyone that is, 379 00:26:04,520 --> 00:26:11,639 Speaker 1: except Bob LaRosa. Apparently Bernardette knew this because with my 380 00:26:11,680 --> 00:26:15,720 Speaker 1: brother in law to take care of the kids. Bernardette 381 00:26:15,760 --> 00:26:18,040 Speaker 1: was only fourteen when she had to move into Bob 382 00:26:18,080 --> 00:26:21,480 Speaker 1: and Susan's home just days after her older sister went missing. 383 00:26:22,320 --> 00:26:24,199 Speaker 1: They lived on the second floor of what was an 384 00:26:24,240 --> 00:26:29,399 Speaker 1: old colonial home converted to several low income apartments. What 385 00:26:29,520 --> 00:26:33,320 Speaker 1: Bernardette saw when she stepped into the apartment, it's something 386 00:26:33,400 --> 00:26:36,840 Speaker 1: she's never forgotten. What did you see when you went 387 00:26:36,880 --> 00:26:40,879 Speaker 1: there the first time after she went missing. Blood on 388 00:26:40,960 --> 00:26:46,320 Speaker 1: the floor, on the wall, on the door, down the stairs, everywhere. Yeah, yeah, 389 00:26:46,440 --> 00:26:49,320 Speaker 1: there was well, there was trickles going down the stairs, 390 00:26:49,560 --> 00:26:53,359 Speaker 1: you know. Now they had a living room kitchen combination. Okay, 391 00:26:53,400 --> 00:26:57,560 Speaker 1: so it was just one room open. The blood was 392 00:26:57,680 --> 00:27:01,720 Speaker 1: over near my nephew Roberts bedroom, A big pool of 393 00:27:01,760 --> 00:27:05,960 Speaker 1: it was on the floor and the door and all that. 394 00:27:06,119 --> 00:27:09,080 Speaker 1: And he gave me a putty knife to clean it up. 395 00:27:09,840 --> 00:27:11,600 Speaker 1: I kind of clean it with a putty knie because 396 00:27:11,600 --> 00:27:15,160 Speaker 1: it wouldn't come off. Bernardette says she had to scrape 397 00:27:15,359 --> 00:27:20,680 Speaker 1: what she believed was her sister's blood off the floor, walls, door, 398 00:27:20,840 --> 00:27:24,120 Speaker 1: and down the stairs. So she got on her hands 399 00:27:24,119 --> 00:27:28,639 Speaker 1: and knees and went to work. Let me just ask 400 00:27:28,720 --> 00:27:31,640 Speaker 1: you when he gave you the putty knife to clean 401 00:27:31,720 --> 00:27:34,760 Speaker 1: up the blood, where did he say the blood came from? 402 00:27:34,920 --> 00:27:37,199 Speaker 1: He said it came from my nephew. He said, my 403 00:27:37,240 --> 00:27:41,040 Speaker 1: sister slapped them in the face and he got a 404 00:27:41,040 --> 00:27:45,200 Speaker 1: bloody nose and a bloody lip. Well, I didn't see 405 00:27:45,240 --> 00:27:48,159 Speaker 1: anything that could have blood like that. I'm not stupid. 406 00:27:49,119 --> 00:27:52,000 Speaker 1: He had a little boo boo, But way with that 407 00:27:52,080 --> 00:27:55,600 Speaker 1: amount of blood come out? So that blood? When when 408 00:27:55,720 --> 00:27:57,560 Speaker 1: when you started to clean that blood up with the 409 00:27:57,560 --> 00:28:01,479 Speaker 1: putty knife, what were you thinking? I was fourteen. Wo 410 00:28:01,560 --> 00:28:03,920 Speaker 1: did you expect me to think? You know, back then 411 00:28:04,480 --> 00:28:08,119 Speaker 1: we were clean living, you know, we didn't think that way. 412 00:28:08,720 --> 00:28:12,920 Speaker 1: What a sobering statement. In this same situation today, your 413 00:28:12,960 --> 00:28:16,840 Speaker 1: mind would go right to murder. In the seventies, murder 414 00:28:16,880 --> 00:28:20,000 Speaker 1: was not thought of in the same way or reported 415 00:28:20,000 --> 00:28:23,240 Speaker 1: by the media as headline news like it is today. 416 00:28:24,160 --> 00:28:26,000 Speaker 1: But as it was cleaning and I'm like, you know, 417 00:28:26,440 --> 00:28:28,040 Speaker 1: I said to him, I said, well, this is a 418 00:28:28,119 --> 00:28:32,720 Speaker 1: lot of blood from coming from Robbie. I said, put 419 00:28:32,760 --> 00:28:36,159 Speaker 1: the hell oh well, he lent really hard and this 420 00:28:36,359 --> 00:28:39,920 Speaker 1: and that and um, what did you do with the 421 00:28:39,960 --> 00:28:43,720 Speaker 1: party knife? Give me back to him? Did he ask 422 00:28:43,800 --> 00:28:49,480 Speaker 1: for it back. Yes, Bernadette was not questioned by police then. 423 00:28:50,480 --> 00:28:53,600 Speaker 1: That came many years later. In fact, the Vernon Police 424 00:28:53,600 --> 00:28:57,120 Speaker 1: Department never went into the LaRosa residence after Susan went 425 00:28:57,200 --> 00:29:02,400 Speaker 1: missing or after her body was found. As Bernard that 426 00:29:02,520 --> 00:29:05,680 Speaker 1: stayed at the apartment. Days passed and with them came 427 00:29:05,680 --> 00:29:10,200 Speaker 1: additional odd behaviors on Bob Lerosa's part, and that's when 428 00:29:10,240 --> 00:29:13,640 Speaker 1: the card disappeared. One day Bob had the vehicle, the 429 00:29:13,720 --> 00:29:17,680 Speaker 1: next he didn't. When asked, he said he'd sold it. 430 00:29:21,800 --> 00:29:26,040 Speaker 1: Did Bob ever act weird around you while you were there? 431 00:29:27,960 --> 00:29:29,960 Speaker 1: He was always kind of weird. I mean I was 432 00:29:30,000 --> 00:29:32,800 Speaker 1: fourteen years old and it was dead of summer, you 433 00:29:32,800 --> 00:29:34,920 Speaker 1: know what I mean, in June and it was really 434 00:29:34,960 --> 00:29:37,680 Speaker 1: hot in the city. And he had taken all the 435 00:29:37,720 --> 00:29:40,760 Speaker 1: fans in his room. He was a freaking pervert. And 436 00:29:40,800 --> 00:29:43,360 Speaker 1: he said to me, I said, Bob, can I have 437 00:29:43,400 --> 00:29:45,600 Speaker 1: the fans please? If he goes, you know the the way 438 00:29:45,600 --> 00:29:47,360 Speaker 1: you're gonna get a fan if is if you come 439 00:29:47,400 --> 00:29:49,120 Speaker 1: in here and sleep with me. And I looked at 440 00:29:49,160 --> 00:29:51,960 Speaker 1: him and I said, what is You're freaking problem? Is it? 441 00:29:52,120 --> 00:29:58,480 Speaker 1: No way? No way? Thanks anyway, keep them. Days after 442 00:29:58,600 --> 00:30:01,960 Speaker 1: his wife goes missing. The guy is asking his fourteen 443 00:30:02,080 --> 00:30:05,240 Speaker 1: year old sister in law, who'd scrape blood off the 444 00:30:05,280 --> 00:30:07,560 Speaker 1: floor and walls on her hands and knees with a 445 00:30:07,560 --> 00:30:14,760 Speaker 1: putty knife to have sex with him. Bernadette told nobody 446 00:30:14,800 --> 00:30:19,360 Speaker 1: about the blood. She was terrified. As years passed, she 447 00:30:19,480 --> 00:30:24,360 Speaker 1: eventually let family members know and finally went to the police. 448 00:30:25,440 --> 00:30:28,600 Speaker 1: Her statement led the Vernon p D to take another 449 00:30:28,640 --> 00:30:32,320 Speaker 1: look at Susan Lorosa's murder in the year two thousand, 450 00:30:33,080 --> 00:30:37,280 Speaker 1: which put Bernadette back in the l Rosa's apartment all 451 00:30:37,320 --> 00:30:40,920 Speaker 1: those years later. I think it was a detective coughed 452 00:30:41,080 --> 00:30:45,400 Speaker 1: saying that they would like me if I was able to, 453 00:30:45,600 --> 00:30:47,959 Speaker 1: They would like me to go back to the house 454 00:30:48,640 --> 00:30:53,320 Speaker 1: and where the blood was that I cleaned and insane. 455 00:30:55,440 --> 00:30:59,640 Speaker 1: If the police found one droplet, it would corroborate Stacy 456 00:30:59,800 --> 00:31:06,720 Speaker 1: La Rosa's statements to police from Anne Bernardette Gauthier's later statements, 457 00:31:07,880 --> 00:31:14,000 Speaker 1: both of which would be huge, big enough in fact, 458 00:31:14,640 --> 00:31:28,160 Speaker 1: to possibly charge Bob la Rossa with murder. In the 459 00:31:28,280 --> 00:31:33,360 Speaker 1: next episode of Paper Ghosts, it's like she dropped off 460 00:31:33,440 --> 00:31:36,560 Speaker 1: the face of the earth, and if you tried to 461 00:31:36,680 --> 00:31:40,400 Speaker 1: say anything to them about her, they didn't like that. 462 00:31:42,120 --> 00:31:45,280 Speaker 1: They would walk away or you know, they didn't like it. 463 00:31:47,400 --> 00:31:51,120 Speaker 1: So you have the more intelligent ones saying, oh, she's missing, 464 00:31:51,680 --> 00:31:53,480 Speaker 1: and then you have the ones over here that are saying, 465 00:31:53,680 --> 00:31:58,040 Speaker 1: we've seen her. There was a child abuse going on 466 00:31:58,120 --> 00:32:01,200 Speaker 1: in New Yorkhanas and I know, I know for a fact. 467 00:32:02,560 --> 00:32:05,440 Speaker 1: So that was enough for me. So somebody do something. 468 00:32:05,600 --> 00:32:08,120 Speaker 1: Get over here. I want him to tell you, guys, 469 00:32:08,200 --> 00:32:13,880 Speaker 1: what he told me, what happened. Paper Ghosts is written 470 00:32:14,080 --> 00:32:17,880 Speaker 1: and executive produced by me and William Phelps, with help 471 00:32:17,960 --> 00:32:21,320 Speaker 1: from producer Christina Everett and sound editing by Pete Cardi 472 00:32:21,440 --> 00:32:25,920 Speaker 1: from Backroom Audio. A special thanks to Abu Safar and 473 00:32:25,960 --> 00:32:30,000 Speaker 1: Will Pearson from My Heart Radio. The series theme number 474 00:32:30,040 --> 00:32:33,400 Speaker 1: four four two is written and performed by Tom Mooney 475 00:32:33,680 --> 00:32:38,640 Speaker 1: and Thomas Phelps. For more podcasts from my heart Radio, 476 00:32:38,960 --> 00:32:43,160 Speaker 1: visit the I Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever 477 00:32:43,200 --> 00:32:44,840 Speaker 1: you listen to your favorite shows.