1 00:00:15,516 --> 00:00:22,516 Speaker 1: Pushkin. Blue Note is one of the first and longest 2 00:00:22,556 --> 00:00:26,636 Speaker 1: standing institutions of jazz music, and it's always been one 3 00:00:26,676 --> 00:00:29,596 Speaker 1: of my favorite record labels. It started when my guitar 4 00:00:29,636 --> 00:00:32,556 Speaker 1: teacher passed along Herbie Hancocks made in Voyage and the 5 00:00:32,596 --> 00:00:35,276 Speaker 1: self titled album from Art Blaking and the Jazz Messengers, 6 00:00:35,476 --> 00:00:38,716 Speaker 1: the one featuring Monin. It was the music, of course 7 00:00:38,756 --> 00:00:41,476 Speaker 1: that made the most lasting impression, but there was the 8 00:00:41,636 --> 00:00:45,836 Speaker 1: artwork also. No label had cooler branding than Blue Note. 9 00:00:46,436 --> 00:00:48,436 Speaker 1: Later I'd find out that was thanks to people like 10 00:00:48,516 --> 00:00:51,556 Speaker 1: Reed Miles, who was the label's art director, and Francis Woolf, 11 00:00:51,596 --> 00:00:54,356 Speaker 1: who was a photographer that became an important executive at 12 00:00:54,356 --> 00:00:57,436 Speaker 1: the label shortly after its founding in nineteen thirty nine. 13 00:00:58,276 --> 00:01:00,236 Speaker 1: And in those eighty five years, the labels put out 14 00:01:00,276 --> 00:01:04,676 Speaker 1: albums by Robert glasper Lee Morgan, John Coltrane, Wayne Shorter, 15 00:01:04,956 --> 00:01:09,716 Speaker 1: Bobby McFerrin, Gregor Reporter, and so many more. To celebrate 16 00:01:09,756 --> 00:01:12,596 Speaker 1: eighty five years of music from this iconic label, I 17 00:01:12,596 --> 00:01:15,156 Speaker 1: thought I'd get together with Blue Notes's current president, Don 18 00:01:15,396 --> 00:01:18,796 Speaker 1: Was to speak with the labels past president in future 19 00:01:19,356 --> 00:01:24,356 Speaker 1: that's Ron Carter, Michelle and Digiocello. Charles Lloyd, Julian Lodge, 20 00:01:24,836 --> 00:01:29,236 Speaker 1: and today Nora Jones. Nora's been with Blue Note Records 21 00:01:29,316 --> 00:01:32,636 Speaker 1: her entire career, starting with her Juggernaut two thousand and 22 00:01:32,676 --> 00:01:35,596 Speaker 1: two debut Come Away with Me, to her latest album, 23 00:01:35,676 --> 00:01:39,316 Speaker 1: Visions that was put out just this year. Visions was 24 00:01:39,356 --> 00:01:42,116 Speaker 1: created with New York's Leon Michelle's of El Michelle's Affair, 25 00:01:42,476 --> 00:01:46,236 Speaker 1: and there are two distinctive sounds, Nora and Leon's blend beautifully. 26 00:01:47,156 --> 00:01:48,956 Speaker 1: Nora was the first interview Don and I did in 27 00:01:48,996 --> 00:01:52,236 Speaker 1: this series. It came together quickly and Hollywood Studio Sunset 28 00:01:52,316 --> 00:01:55,076 Speaker 1: Sound was kind enough to accommodate us at the last minute, 29 00:01:55,236 --> 00:01:58,596 Speaker 1: not only for a chat with Nora, but also a performance. 30 00:01:59,276 --> 00:02:00,956 Speaker 1: And I should tell you before we begin that you 31 00:02:00,996 --> 00:02:03,996 Speaker 1: can binge the entire Blue Note Anniversary series early in 32 00:02:04,076 --> 00:02:06,756 Speaker 1: ad free by subscribing to Pushkin Plus on the Broken 33 00:02:06,796 --> 00:02:09,956 Speaker 1: Record Show page on Apple Podcasts or at pushkin dot 34 00:02:10,076 --> 00:02:16,676 Speaker 1: fm Slash plus. This is Broken Record Liner Notes for 35 00:02:16,756 --> 00:02:20,196 Speaker 1: the digital age. I'm justin Mitchman. Here's Don Was and 36 00:02:20,276 --> 00:02:23,076 Speaker 1: myself in conversation with Norah Jones. To see the full 37 00:02:23,156 --> 00:02:25,716 Speaker 1: video version of this episode, go to YouTube dot com 38 00:02:25,756 --> 00:02:30,156 Speaker 1: slash Broken Record Podcast Well I'm excited. This is the 39 00:02:30,156 --> 00:02:31,956 Speaker 1: eighty fifth anniversary of Blue Note. 40 00:02:32,196 --> 00:02:32,836 Speaker 2: That's wild. 41 00:02:33,636 --> 00:02:36,556 Speaker 1: Yeah, the year twenty twenty four. We have Nora Jones here. 42 00:02:36,556 --> 00:02:39,436 Speaker 1: We're going to celebrate the anniversary of Blue Note with 43 00:02:39,556 --> 00:02:43,156 Speaker 1: the series of guests, our first being Nora Jones who's 44 00:02:43,436 --> 00:02:46,436 Speaker 1: releasing her ninth album with Blue Note. The newest album 45 00:02:46,516 --> 00:02:50,596 Speaker 1: is Visions. And also to celebrate, we have Don was 46 00:02:50,876 --> 00:02:53,876 Speaker 1: president of Blue Note Records, and it's going to be 47 00:02:53,916 --> 00:02:56,036 Speaker 1: a guest with us on these episodes. 48 00:02:57,036 --> 00:02:58,316 Speaker 3: Lovely to be here. Thank you man. 49 00:02:58,596 --> 00:03:00,156 Speaker 1: So excited to have the both of you here. 50 00:03:00,316 --> 00:03:01,116 Speaker 2: Thanks and. 51 00:03:03,596 --> 00:03:05,676 Speaker 1: Love the new album. I want to get to that, 52 00:03:06,116 --> 00:03:11,476 Speaker 1: but first I want to ask Don your first recollections 53 00:03:11,516 --> 00:03:14,516 Speaker 1: of Norah Jones as an artist. 54 00:03:16,636 --> 00:03:20,636 Speaker 3: Sandra Bullock turned me on to you. 55 00:03:19,516 --> 00:03:21,676 Speaker 2: In person or in the movie two weeks notice. 56 00:03:22,156 --> 00:03:24,196 Speaker 3: I was going to work on that movie. Oh really, 57 00:03:24,276 --> 00:03:26,876 Speaker 3: and she said, we want to have this artist. You 58 00:03:26,876 --> 00:03:28,476 Speaker 3: got to hear this record, and it was I think 59 00:03:28,516 --> 00:03:30,636 Speaker 3: before the album came out, but she had an advanced 60 00:03:30,636 --> 00:03:33,436 Speaker 3: copy and she sent it to me. I said, yeah, 61 00:03:33,756 --> 00:03:36,196 Speaker 3: it's incredible. And then I ended up not working on 62 00:03:36,196 --> 00:03:37,756 Speaker 3: the movie. But yeah, but you. 63 00:03:37,716 --> 00:03:38,156 Speaker 1: Were in it. 64 00:03:38,396 --> 00:03:39,036 Speaker 2: I was in it. 65 00:03:39,076 --> 00:03:41,756 Speaker 4: I was in a scene that Donald Trump was in also, 66 00:03:41,916 --> 00:03:43,716 Speaker 4: which is so weird going back. 67 00:03:44,916 --> 00:03:48,196 Speaker 2: Yeah it was, Yeah, it was cool though. She was 68 00:03:48,276 --> 00:03:50,756 Speaker 2: really sweet. She loved me so sweet. 69 00:03:50,876 --> 00:03:54,076 Speaker 1: Yeah, so she had how did she become aware of 70 00:03:54,436 --> 00:03:55,236 Speaker 1: I don't know I had. 71 00:03:55,116 --> 00:03:57,836 Speaker 3: An advance copy of the record, I didn't, And she 72 00:03:57,996 --> 00:04:01,436 Speaker 3: was looking for music to put in her movie. I 73 00:04:01,436 --> 00:04:02,836 Speaker 3: can't even remember the name of the movie. 74 00:04:03,076 --> 00:04:05,596 Speaker 2: Two weeks notice Grant. 75 00:04:05,356 --> 00:04:06,076 Speaker 3: Yes, that's right. 76 00:04:06,196 --> 00:04:09,836 Speaker 2: Yeah, that's funny. I didn't know she had an advanced happy. 77 00:04:10,076 --> 00:04:15,196 Speaker 4: I think we shot it somewhere in November, and the 78 00:04:15,356 --> 00:04:17,836 Speaker 4: album had come out in February, and it was kind 79 00:04:17,876 --> 00:04:20,356 Speaker 4: of a slow, steady rise that year. 80 00:04:20,916 --> 00:04:26,516 Speaker 1: Yeah, it's that kind of is the perfect illustration of 81 00:04:26,596 --> 00:04:31,556 Speaker 1: how quickly you kind of went from somebody playing music 82 00:04:31,636 --> 00:04:35,196 Speaker 1: for fun to getting signed to recording an album and 83 00:04:35,516 --> 00:04:38,196 Speaker 1: the album just sort of becoming a phenomenon. The fact 84 00:04:38,236 --> 00:04:41,076 Speaker 1: that not early in your recording career you were and 85 00:04:41,116 --> 00:04:43,516 Speaker 1: a Sandra Bullet. I mean, that was a huge movie 86 00:04:43,556 --> 00:04:43,956 Speaker 1: at the time. 87 00:04:44,036 --> 00:04:44,916 Speaker 2: You know, it's a big movie. 88 00:04:46,116 --> 00:04:48,996 Speaker 3: Well, I want to get to that, but I'd kind 89 00:04:48,996 --> 00:04:53,516 Speaker 3: of like to start at the beginning. Okay, I got 90 00:04:53,516 --> 00:04:57,276 Speaker 3: this this image of grape fun Texas is then like 91 00:04:57,916 --> 00:05:05,076 Speaker 3: the City and Last Picture Show like Tumbleweed. Yeah, it's 92 00:05:05,116 --> 00:05:06,916 Speaker 3: not right suburb of Dallas. 93 00:05:07,236 --> 00:05:09,356 Speaker 4: It's a suburb of Dallas. When I was little was 94 00:05:09,476 --> 00:05:12,036 Speaker 4: very small though. There was a McDonald's and nothing else. 95 00:05:12,796 --> 00:05:16,676 Speaker 4: But it is now like one of the biggest I mean, 96 00:05:16,756 --> 00:05:23,076 Speaker 4: it's just I think strip malls and chain restaurants, and 97 00:05:23,236 --> 00:05:26,756 Speaker 4: it's got one of the biggest malls in Texas. It's 98 00:05:26,876 --> 00:05:27,676 Speaker 4: quite the suburb. 99 00:05:27,876 --> 00:05:31,436 Speaker 3: Yeah, so it didn't have like a small town mentality 100 00:05:31,716 --> 00:05:32,076 Speaker 3: to it. 101 00:05:32,556 --> 00:05:33,196 Speaker 5: Maybe it did. 102 00:05:33,276 --> 00:05:36,316 Speaker 2: I think it was kind of a small town when 103 00:05:36,316 --> 00:05:36,756 Speaker 2: I was little. 104 00:05:36,876 --> 00:05:40,916 Speaker 4: I really was only there until I was maybe I 105 00:05:40,916 --> 00:05:43,596 Speaker 4: guess I was there till ninth grade. I kind of 106 00:05:43,636 --> 00:05:46,436 Speaker 4: bounced around, though, and I bounced around schools a lot. 107 00:05:46,476 --> 00:05:48,396 Speaker 4: And we moved to Alaska for six months. Then we 108 00:05:48,436 --> 00:05:50,636 Speaker 4: came back and I went to the Junior High and 109 00:05:50,676 --> 00:05:53,156 Speaker 4: then I went to Colleyville, which is the neighboring town, 110 00:05:53,236 --> 00:05:54,476 Speaker 4: and then you know what I mean, I was kind 111 00:05:54,516 --> 00:05:54,796 Speaker 4: of all. 112 00:05:54,716 --> 00:06:01,916 Speaker 3: Over because it seems a little incongruous that the world's 113 00:06:02,796 --> 00:06:06,676 Speaker 3: most successful jazz singer comes comes out of great time, 114 00:06:06,756 --> 00:06:07,236 Speaker 3: but maybe not. 115 00:06:07,436 --> 00:06:07,916 Speaker 5: I don't know. 116 00:06:08,596 --> 00:06:12,876 Speaker 4: I was in marching band in ninth grade and they 117 00:06:12,916 --> 00:06:17,876 Speaker 4: had a I had a saxophone teacher, John Rosina, and 118 00:06:17,916 --> 00:06:19,676 Speaker 4: I had quit piano at that time because I didn't 119 00:06:19,676 --> 00:06:23,276 Speaker 4: want to practice anymore, and he turned me onto this 120 00:06:23,316 --> 00:06:26,476 Speaker 4: piano teacher named Julie Bank who lived in the area, 121 00:06:27,076 --> 00:06:30,596 Speaker 4: who was a jazz pianist because Dallas, you know, and Denton, 122 00:06:30,676 --> 00:06:34,796 Speaker 4: Texas is a big jazz college. So that kind of 123 00:06:34,796 --> 00:06:37,156 Speaker 4: got me going on on the jazz tip. But I 124 00:06:37,196 --> 00:06:40,196 Speaker 4: grew up singing in church choir at Grapevine Methodist Church. 125 00:06:41,036 --> 00:06:45,236 Speaker 3: Yeah, did you listen? Like, I got a son who's 126 00:06:45,796 --> 00:06:47,356 Speaker 3: he's a year or two older than you, but I 127 00:06:47,476 --> 00:06:50,396 Speaker 3: remember what he was listening to, and you know, like 128 00:06:50,476 --> 00:06:53,236 Speaker 3: Paul Abduel and Millie Vanilli and Bobby Brown. 129 00:06:53,796 --> 00:06:57,876 Speaker 4: You were absolutely I loved Paul Abdul that album. 130 00:06:58,316 --> 00:07:02,876 Speaker 2: That one album was just it was huge when straight Yeah. 131 00:07:02,476 --> 00:07:05,636 Speaker 3: Yeah, it's actually it was a great record. 132 00:07:05,676 --> 00:07:08,116 Speaker 2: It was a great record. The songs are really good. 133 00:07:08,156 --> 00:07:11,236 Speaker 4: I think I covered one on my during COVID because 134 00:07:11,276 --> 00:07:15,036 Speaker 4: I was just like in a normal Yeah, I was 135 00:07:15,076 --> 00:07:17,356 Speaker 4: into all that stuff growing up. I listened to case 136 00:07:17,396 --> 00:07:18,356 Speaker 4: case them every weekend. 137 00:07:18,596 --> 00:07:20,156 Speaker 3: Do you remember the first record you bought? 138 00:07:20,996 --> 00:07:26,996 Speaker 4: Yeah, it was digital underground. Wow, that's the Humpty Dances. 139 00:07:28,516 --> 00:07:31,716 Speaker 2: The radio. And then my first concert was EMC Hammer. 140 00:07:32,316 --> 00:07:35,396 Speaker 3: Wow. Yeah, were you a shy kid? 141 00:07:35,676 --> 00:07:39,516 Speaker 4: I was kind of shy. I wasn't that shy until 142 00:07:39,556 --> 00:07:41,636 Speaker 4: seventh grade. I think in sixth grade, I was like 143 00:07:42,356 --> 00:07:46,556 Speaker 4: completely unaware of how I was perceived, and I was 144 00:07:46,596 --> 00:07:49,316 Speaker 4: completely open and you know that time in your life 145 00:07:49,356 --> 00:07:50,796 Speaker 4: where you don't care what people think. 146 00:07:51,916 --> 00:07:53,676 Speaker 2: And then I remember. 147 00:07:54,076 --> 00:07:55,916 Speaker 4: There were some girls at school who were kind of mean, 148 00:07:56,236 --> 00:07:59,356 Speaker 4: and I think I realized. For the end of the year, 149 00:07:59,716 --> 00:08:02,116 Speaker 4: I just got really self aware and self conscious and 150 00:08:02,156 --> 00:08:03,236 Speaker 4: I kind of went inside. 151 00:08:03,516 --> 00:08:07,036 Speaker 3: You know, did you kounter of racism. 152 00:08:08,036 --> 00:08:13,916 Speaker 2: Towards me? Not that I was aware of. I never 153 00:08:14,116 --> 00:08:14,516 Speaker 2: was aware. 154 00:08:15,316 --> 00:08:18,716 Speaker 1: Yeah, I'm mixed as well. I'm black and white. My 155 00:08:18,716 --> 00:08:22,196 Speaker 1: mom's white, my dad's black, and I feel like there 156 00:08:22,196 --> 00:08:24,836 Speaker 1: was a time when it was less common to be mixed. 157 00:08:25,316 --> 00:08:28,876 Speaker 1: So that was kind of like a weird experience not 158 00:08:28,956 --> 00:08:33,356 Speaker 1: knowing many other people who were of two cultures. Did 159 00:08:33,396 --> 00:08:35,876 Speaker 1: you feel of two cultures or did you feel well? 160 00:08:35,996 --> 00:08:37,276 Speaker 2: I felt a lot of. 161 00:08:39,716 --> 00:08:42,556 Speaker 4: I mean, I didn't see a ton of my dad. 162 00:08:42,636 --> 00:08:46,676 Speaker 4: I grew up seeing my dad, but because I wasn't 163 00:08:46,836 --> 00:08:50,996 Speaker 4: in his culture, so much. I didn't feel very of 164 00:08:51,076 --> 00:08:55,676 Speaker 4: two cultures, but I did feel a little different, and 165 00:08:55,716 --> 00:08:57,796 Speaker 4: people never really knew what I was, and they would 166 00:08:57,796 --> 00:09:02,476 Speaker 4: always ask, but they always assumed I was Mexican. Especially Yeah, 167 00:09:02,836 --> 00:09:04,916 Speaker 4: and then like they would speak Spanish to me, and 168 00:09:04,916 --> 00:09:07,116 Speaker 4: then I wouldn't speak Spanish because I didn't know Spanish, 169 00:09:07,116 --> 00:09:07,436 Speaker 4: and then. 170 00:09:07,316 --> 00:09:10,236 Speaker 2: I felt bad, you know, like I'm so are you like? 171 00:09:11,316 --> 00:09:15,756 Speaker 4: But then yeah, and then in high school some people 172 00:09:15,756 --> 00:09:18,796 Speaker 4: thought I was half black and they just didn't know 173 00:09:18,796 --> 00:09:21,276 Speaker 4: what to make of me. But I never encountered any 174 00:09:21,716 --> 00:09:24,676 Speaker 4: negativity from it. Just nosiness, you know what I mean? 175 00:09:24,916 --> 00:09:26,196 Speaker 2: Yeah, what are you? 176 00:09:26,516 --> 00:09:29,996 Speaker 4: That question was always funny, but I never got offended 177 00:09:29,996 --> 00:09:30,276 Speaker 4: at it. 178 00:09:31,756 --> 00:09:34,716 Speaker 3: So you fit in. I have this industry of being 179 00:09:34,836 --> 00:09:39,276 Speaker 3: like like someone who was thirty years late for being 180 00:09:39,316 --> 00:09:39,996 Speaker 3: a beatnik. 181 00:09:41,716 --> 00:09:45,316 Speaker 4: Well, I mean, I think as a kid, I was 182 00:09:45,476 --> 00:09:48,316 Speaker 4: just sort of like other kids, just weird. 183 00:09:48,396 --> 00:09:50,516 Speaker 2: You know, all kids are kind of weird, I think. 184 00:09:51,316 --> 00:09:53,716 Speaker 4: And then in junior I when kids were starting to 185 00:09:53,716 --> 00:09:57,516 Speaker 4: get into football, especially in Texas, at cheerleading, I wanted 186 00:09:57,556 --> 00:09:59,236 Speaker 4: to be a cheerleader and my mom wouldn't let me 187 00:09:59,276 --> 00:09:59,676 Speaker 4: because it was. 188 00:09:59,676 --> 00:10:02,116 Speaker 2: Too expensive, I think. And then. 189 00:10:03,556 --> 00:10:06,356 Speaker 4: And then I got into band. So then I was 190 00:10:06,436 --> 00:10:09,876 Speaker 4: with my people, the band nerds, you know. So I 191 00:10:09,876 --> 00:10:13,236 Speaker 4: felt like you always kind of find your thing. And 192 00:10:13,276 --> 00:10:15,276 Speaker 4: then in high school, I went to Performing Arts High 193 00:10:15,276 --> 00:10:20,076 Speaker 4: School in Dallas, which was completely all all people of 194 00:10:20,916 --> 00:10:23,676 Speaker 4: artistic you know interests, and. 195 00:10:23,636 --> 00:10:26,596 Speaker 3: That's like I didn't like Roy Hargrove go to school 196 00:10:26,596 --> 00:10:30,316 Speaker 3: and Erica Badri. Yeah. So it's a great school, great school, 197 00:10:30,396 --> 00:10:33,516 Speaker 3: and there was an influence. There was an emphasis put 198 00:10:33,516 --> 00:10:34,076 Speaker 3: on jazz. 199 00:10:35,196 --> 00:10:37,796 Speaker 4: Yeah, I think I was a jazz piano major. But 200 00:10:37,836 --> 00:10:40,676 Speaker 4: I still had to take a classical piano class, which 201 00:10:40,676 --> 00:10:42,676 Speaker 4: I was horrible at, and I still had to take 202 00:10:43,956 --> 00:10:46,356 Speaker 4: I took Actually it was kind of cool because they 203 00:10:46,356 --> 00:10:50,196 Speaker 4: had a synthesis ensemble. Wow, And so I took a 204 00:10:50,236 --> 00:10:56,076 Speaker 4: synthesis class with my heroes, some guys in my class. 205 00:10:56,516 --> 00:11:00,556 Speaker 4: They were older and they really, I know, they were 206 00:11:00,596 --> 00:11:03,516 Speaker 4: just really insanely amazing musicians. 207 00:11:03,556 --> 00:11:04,836 Speaker 2: So that was really fun. 208 00:11:05,196 --> 00:11:07,796 Speaker 4: We had like a d X seven and a Moog 209 00:11:07,996 --> 00:11:10,876 Speaker 4: and we all the teacher encouraged us to al write 210 00:11:10,956 --> 00:11:12,756 Speaker 4: songs and we actually put out. 211 00:11:12,636 --> 00:11:13,476 Speaker 2: A cassette tape. 212 00:11:13,836 --> 00:11:14,636 Speaker 1: It was pretty cool. 213 00:11:14,756 --> 00:11:18,436 Speaker 4: I must somewhere my song I hated on it. I 214 00:11:18,476 --> 00:11:21,236 Speaker 4: hated it so much because it had like synth strings 215 00:11:21,276 --> 00:11:23,156 Speaker 4: on it, which wasn't really what I wanted. 216 00:11:22,876 --> 00:11:25,676 Speaker 1: But that can be a rough sound. 217 00:11:26,956 --> 00:11:27,876 Speaker 6: That's not what. 218 00:11:27,796 --> 00:11:30,236 Speaker 4: I was going for, but that's what ended up happening, 219 00:11:30,316 --> 00:11:33,396 Speaker 4: and it was fine, but it was just funny. 220 00:11:33,796 --> 00:11:37,356 Speaker 3: You know, where did the where did the jazz come in? 221 00:11:38,116 --> 00:11:40,716 Speaker 4: After I quit piano because I didn't want to practice, 222 00:11:40,916 --> 00:11:42,396 Speaker 4: My mom said I had to take for five years 223 00:11:42,436 --> 00:11:44,156 Speaker 4: and then I could quit it. So on five years 224 00:11:44,156 --> 00:11:47,916 Speaker 4: on the dot, I quit, well, yeah, sixth grade, and 225 00:11:47,956 --> 00:11:51,956 Speaker 4: then she took me to a big band concert at 226 00:11:52,676 --> 00:11:55,876 Speaker 4: University of North Texas, which is funny. 227 00:11:55,756 --> 00:11:57,116 Speaker 2: That's how I got into jazz. 228 00:11:57,796 --> 00:12:01,476 Speaker 4: But I liked it, and so she found a saxophone 229 00:12:01,516 --> 00:12:03,556 Speaker 4: teacher and that's when I joined the band, and then 230 00:12:03,596 --> 00:12:05,476 Speaker 4: he found me the jazz piano teacher. 231 00:12:06,076 --> 00:12:06,276 Speaker 2: Yeah. 232 00:12:06,796 --> 00:12:09,716 Speaker 3: Yeah, I never made my kids practice. They're all three 233 00:12:09,716 --> 00:12:13,796 Speaker 3: of my sons are musicians, and I start making him 234 00:12:13,796 --> 00:12:15,836 Speaker 3: practice was like the worst thing, supposed to be the 235 00:12:15,876 --> 00:12:21,516 Speaker 3: thing from work too. Yeah, but you got the background 236 00:12:21,756 --> 00:12:24,196 Speaker 3: so when you wanted to, when you finally felt compelled 237 00:12:24,236 --> 00:12:27,076 Speaker 3: to play, you didn't have to start from scratch. 238 00:12:27,236 --> 00:12:28,796 Speaker 2: She was right, I had the foundation. 239 00:12:28,996 --> 00:12:30,236 Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, exactly. 240 00:12:30,516 --> 00:12:30,996 Speaker 2: It was good. 241 00:12:31,556 --> 00:12:35,556 Speaker 3: So then you went to North Texas and then I ended. 242 00:12:35,476 --> 00:12:37,876 Speaker 2: Up going to North Texas. Yeah, for two years. 243 00:12:37,916 --> 00:12:40,436 Speaker 3: From that it was really a jazz program. 244 00:12:40,596 --> 00:12:41,756 Speaker 2: It was very jazz. 245 00:12:42,276 --> 00:12:45,396 Speaker 4: And in high school I was in the vocal ensemble too, 246 00:12:45,476 --> 00:12:46,796 Speaker 4: even though piano was my major. 247 00:12:47,276 --> 00:12:50,316 Speaker 2: And then college same thing. I started out. 248 00:12:50,236 --> 00:12:53,316 Speaker 4: Just doing piano and then I joined the vocal ensemble too, 249 00:12:53,716 --> 00:12:56,836 Speaker 4: like the jazz singers, and so I sang a little bit, 250 00:12:56,916 --> 00:12:59,596 Speaker 4: but it wasn't my main focus for school. 251 00:12:59,836 --> 00:13:02,716 Speaker 3: You know. The only time I ever saw Willie Nelson 252 00:13:02,796 --> 00:13:06,316 Speaker 3: get mad was in a session that we did, and 253 00:13:06,356 --> 00:13:08,596 Speaker 3: he came back in the room to listen to a playback, 254 00:13:09,556 --> 00:13:15,476 Speaker 3: and the engineer had his guitar down, and he just 255 00:13:15,476 --> 00:13:20,516 Speaker 3: couldn't understand why anyone would separate his singing from his guitar, 256 00:13:20,516 --> 00:13:22,796 Speaker 3: why they wouldn't be at an equal level, because to him, 257 00:13:23,036 --> 00:13:28,836 Speaker 3: it was one form, one solitary expression was coming from 258 00:13:28,916 --> 00:13:30,796 Speaker 3: his vocal chords or his. 259 00:13:30,676 --> 00:13:32,676 Speaker 2: Fingers, that makes sense. 260 00:13:32,956 --> 00:13:36,796 Speaker 3: Was there a point where the two became inextricable to 261 00:13:36,836 --> 00:13:41,556 Speaker 3: you where you weren't like where it's just one expression. 262 00:13:42,476 --> 00:13:44,196 Speaker 2: I mean, I don't think I realized it till the 263 00:13:44,236 --> 00:13:45,476 Speaker 2: last ten years, but. 264 00:13:47,196 --> 00:13:50,476 Speaker 4: I think in college because I sang and I played, 265 00:13:50,516 --> 00:13:52,916 Speaker 4: but I didn't really do it together so much. I 266 00:13:52,916 --> 00:13:55,396 Speaker 4: mean I tried, but I had a couple of demos 267 00:13:55,396 --> 00:13:58,116 Speaker 4: where I did. But I got a gig at a 268 00:13:58,276 --> 00:14:02,276 Speaker 4: restaurant in Dallas called Popolo's. It was an Italian restaurant, 269 00:14:02,996 --> 00:14:06,916 Speaker 4: and somehow I got a gig playing every Friday and 270 00:14:06,956 --> 00:14:10,396 Speaker 4: Saturday night and if I could sing too, because that 271 00:14:10,436 --> 00:14:12,836 Speaker 4: wasn't really the gig, and they said sure, but not 272 00:14:12,996 --> 00:14:15,916 Speaker 4: like every song, and so that was my paid practice 273 00:14:16,156 --> 00:14:20,516 Speaker 4: and that's how they got sort of like the coordination factor. 274 00:14:21,516 --> 00:14:25,036 Speaker 3: Yeah. I don't know if people understand what a great 275 00:14:25,036 --> 00:14:30,476 Speaker 3: pianist do. I hear it in your voicings are incredibly sophisticated. 276 00:14:30,916 --> 00:14:34,356 Speaker 3: So you clearly study theory and you understand your scales 277 00:14:34,396 --> 00:14:37,916 Speaker 3: and your modes and all that. And I just think 278 00:14:38,116 --> 00:14:40,556 Speaker 3: you're such a great singer that it might get overlooked, 279 00:14:40,556 --> 00:14:42,276 Speaker 3: but you're an incredible pianist. 280 00:14:42,476 --> 00:14:44,956 Speaker 2: Thanks, don I mean, were you. 281 00:14:45,596 --> 00:14:48,076 Speaker 3: In bands as just a keyboard player? 282 00:14:48,196 --> 00:14:49,276 Speaker 2: No, I wasn't. 283 00:14:49,716 --> 00:14:53,556 Speaker 4: I was still you know, as far as the piano 284 00:14:53,596 --> 00:14:57,436 Speaker 4: players in college and high school, I mean everyone else 285 00:14:57,476 --> 00:14:59,956 Speaker 4: could play circles around me. I never had a lot 286 00:14:59,996 --> 00:15:02,356 Speaker 4: of chops. I still don't. I can't play very fast, 287 00:15:03,596 --> 00:15:05,996 Speaker 4: but yeah, I have my own thing that has developed 288 00:15:06,036 --> 00:15:12,076 Speaker 4: over the years. But I think just over the last 289 00:15:12,236 --> 00:15:14,716 Speaker 4: ten years, even I've played so much more piano live, 290 00:15:15,516 --> 00:15:19,316 Speaker 4: sort of stripping my band back into trio form at 291 00:15:19,316 --> 00:15:20,236 Speaker 4: some point. 292 00:15:21,956 --> 00:15:24,396 Speaker 2: That I've just I just have gotten. 293 00:15:24,116 --> 00:15:26,556 Speaker 4: A lot better in the last ten years, and it's 294 00:15:26,596 --> 00:15:27,756 Speaker 4: been really fun to play. 295 00:15:28,396 --> 00:15:28,556 Speaker 3: You know. 296 00:15:28,596 --> 00:15:31,676 Speaker 4: I feel more connected to it than I did even 297 00:15:32,356 --> 00:15:33,276 Speaker 4: fifteen years ago. 298 00:15:33,476 --> 00:15:36,596 Speaker 3: You know, is it hard now when you have to 299 00:15:38,156 --> 00:15:40,836 Speaker 3: when you're in a situation where you have an accompanist. 300 00:15:41,156 --> 00:15:42,916 Speaker 3: Does that ever come up where you just have to 301 00:15:42,956 --> 00:15:43,596 Speaker 3: stand and sing? 302 00:15:43,836 --> 00:15:46,316 Speaker 4: I'm not great at it. I'm much better if I 303 00:15:46,356 --> 00:15:50,036 Speaker 4: accompany myself. Yeah, And like if there's a situation where 304 00:15:50,036 --> 00:15:52,156 Speaker 4: there's a house band or a tribute show, I always 305 00:15:52,196 --> 00:15:54,876 Speaker 4: try to play, you know, because I feel like I 306 00:15:54,876 --> 00:15:57,956 Speaker 4: can do my thing a little easier. But it depends 307 00:15:57,996 --> 00:16:01,196 Speaker 4: on the situation, of course. Yeah, sometimes it's fun to 308 00:16:01,236 --> 00:16:03,356 Speaker 4: have an accompanist if it's the right person. 309 00:16:03,516 --> 00:16:06,516 Speaker 1: But so there is a bit of a willy thing though. 310 00:16:06,996 --> 00:16:10,076 Speaker 1: It does feel like these are these I do these 311 00:16:10,076 --> 00:16:12,636 Speaker 1: things together, not so much apart. 312 00:16:13,076 --> 00:16:16,276 Speaker 4: I do think that where I can do my thing, 313 00:16:16,316 --> 00:16:18,676 Speaker 4: which is more special. It's when they're together. 314 00:16:19,596 --> 00:16:23,076 Speaker 3: Yeah, absolutely gives you something to bounce off of. 315 00:16:23,236 --> 00:16:23,436 Speaker 2: Yeah. 316 00:16:23,796 --> 00:16:26,556 Speaker 4: Also, I'm really not great at standing and singing because 317 00:16:26,596 --> 00:16:29,236 Speaker 4: I don't know what to do with my hands. So 318 00:16:29,276 --> 00:16:31,036 Speaker 4: even in college, I was in a couple of bands 319 00:16:31,036 --> 00:16:32,916 Speaker 4: where I just sang, and I think it was a 320 00:16:32,956 --> 00:16:36,876 Speaker 4: good match musically, but I always just they're looking really awkward. 321 00:16:37,076 --> 00:16:39,476 Speaker 3: That's the whole other thing, especially if you're used to it. 322 00:16:39,556 --> 00:16:41,876 Speaker 3: But I think it's rhythmically too. He I was just 323 00:16:42,116 --> 00:16:46,356 Speaker 3: I was talking to Lucinda Williams who's having trouble guitar, 324 00:16:46,956 --> 00:16:51,756 Speaker 3: and she just what she's got no rhythmic point of reference. 325 00:16:51,796 --> 00:16:55,196 Speaker 3: Bob Villains another person like that. His guitar playing was 326 00:16:55,276 --> 00:16:58,556 Speaker 3: so essential to the way he sang that when he 327 00:16:58,716 --> 00:17:03,756 Speaker 3: stopped being the primary source of accompaniment, his singing changed, 328 00:17:04,316 --> 00:17:07,876 Speaker 3: and he's been looking for a band that would play 329 00:17:08,916 --> 00:17:10,076 Speaker 3: the he plays. 330 00:17:10,396 --> 00:17:13,116 Speaker 4: But it's not that it's that he's doing the thing 331 00:17:13,396 --> 00:17:17,676 Speaker 4: and filling the space with part of him. Yeah, probably 332 00:17:17,796 --> 00:17:21,836 Speaker 4: it's more that that you're not filling the space. And Yeah, 333 00:17:21,916 --> 00:17:25,516 Speaker 4: I feel like when I record, I'm always getting a 334 00:17:25,556 --> 00:17:28,356 Speaker 4: better vocal and piano take. If I am doing it 335 00:17:28,396 --> 00:17:31,356 Speaker 4: at the same time live. If I overdubbed the piano 336 00:17:31,676 --> 00:17:33,836 Speaker 4: or the vocal, it can be cool if it's the 337 00:17:33,876 --> 00:17:36,076 Speaker 4: first or second take. But the more I the more 338 00:17:36,116 --> 00:17:38,156 Speaker 4: takes I do, I get really busy, or like I 339 00:17:38,196 --> 00:17:41,076 Speaker 4: overthink or I over sing or I overplay, and it's 340 00:17:41,236 --> 00:17:42,516 Speaker 4: just not the same. 341 00:17:43,196 --> 00:17:46,156 Speaker 3: All right. So when you when you finally go to 342 00:17:46,196 --> 00:17:48,556 Speaker 3: New York City, you dropped out of college, right, Yeah, 343 00:17:49,236 --> 00:17:50,396 Speaker 3: I did too. It's a good move. 344 00:17:51,476 --> 00:17:52,196 Speaker 2: Well, I didn't want to. 345 00:17:52,276 --> 00:17:54,916 Speaker 4: I didn't want to teach, so I didn't know that 346 00:17:54,996 --> 00:17:57,476 Speaker 4: I needed a music degree. And I also failed my 347 00:17:57,556 --> 00:18:02,436 Speaker 4: classical piano jury. That's I'm not proud of that, but 348 00:18:02,956 --> 00:18:03,756 Speaker 4: I am not. 349 00:18:04,476 --> 00:18:05,436 Speaker 2: Afraid to admit it. 350 00:18:06,036 --> 00:18:08,556 Speaker 4: So I was also faced with like having to do 351 00:18:08,676 --> 00:18:11,956 Speaker 4: six semesters of classical piano, and I had already failed 352 00:18:11,996 --> 00:18:14,916 Speaker 4: the first one, which was pretty sad. 353 00:18:14,996 --> 00:18:16,116 Speaker 3: So there was no alternatives. 354 00:18:16,156 --> 00:18:17,916 Speaker 4: And it's really just because I didn't practice. It's not 355 00:18:17,916 --> 00:18:20,356 Speaker 4: because I couldn't do it. It was because I didn't practice. 356 00:18:20,516 --> 00:18:23,076 Speaker 1: Were you busy doing other things besides practicing? 357 00:18:23,516 --> 00:18:26,516 Speaker 4: I mean I was practicing for other classes, I was 358 00:18:26,516 --> 00:18:29,076 Speaker 4: playing in two bands, I was doing gigs, so I 359 00:18:30,156 --> 00:18:34,756 Speaker 4: wasn't practicing my classical piano, got it or my arpeggios. 360 00:18:35,676 --> 00:18:38,956 Speaker 1: It was back to the original. Yeah, quandary almost of 361 00:18:38,956 --> 00:18:42,836 Speaker 1: your piano plan, being forced to do a site reading 362 00:18:42,836 --> 00:18:44,716 Speaker 1: and classical and when you got in your own thing, 363 00:18:44,876 --> 00:18:46,636 Speaker 1: fell back in love. But now you're kind of going 364 00:18:46,676 --> 00:18:48,796 Speaker 1: back to this is not the stuff I like. 365 00:18:48,876 --> 00:18:49,836 Speaker 2: Yeah, I didn't want to do that. 366 00:18:50,076 --> 00:18:51,596 Speaker 1: Yeah, it's interesting. 367 00:18:51,756 --> 00:18:53,756 Speaker 3: That's the same for me. I went to the University 368 00:18:53,756 --> 00:18:57,596 Speaker 3: of Michigan, but this is in nineteen seventy and if 369 00:18:57,636 --> 00:18:59,396 Speaker 3: you wanted to be in the music program, you were 370 00:18:59,436 --> 00:19:02,476 Speaker 3: in the orchestra, or you weren't in the music program. 371 00:19:02,556 --> 00:19:03,156 Speaker 2: Yeah, exactly. 372 00:19:03,196 --> 00:19:06,796 Speaker 3: It was a recording lab or electronic music lab or 373 00:19:07,116 --> 00:19:11,196 Speaker 3: no jazz pro and nothing like that. Yeah, so I 374 00:19:11,236 --> 00:19:14,116 Speaker 3: knew what I wanted to do. So when you got 375 00:19:14,156 --> 00:19:16,836 Speaker 3: to New York, were you did you? Were you thinking 376 00:19:16,876 --> 00:19:20,636 Speaker 3: that you'd be someone like Shirley Horn, you know, a 377 00:19:20,796 --> 00:19:21,636 Speaker 3: jazz singer. 378 00:19:23,156 --> 00:19:26,196 Speaker 4: I didn't really know, but at that point I was 379 00:19:26,236 --> 00:19:31,076 Speaker 4: still way into jazz. And so I got a gig 380 00:19:31,156 --> 00:19:36,276 Speaker 4: at an Italian restaurant, another Italian restaurant, but it paid 381 00:19:36,356 --> 00:19:38,796 Speaker 4: way less than the Texas one, Did I tell you that? 382 00:19:39,236 --> 00:19:41,436 Speaker 4: And I was just I was going to Smalls every 383 00:19:41,516 --> 00:19:43,956 Speaker 4: night and watching people play and just so in love 384 00:19:43,996 --> 00:19:46,036 Speaker 4: with going to hear music every night. I mean, I 385 00:19:46,036 --> 00:19:47,996 Speaker 4: went out and I heard music every night of the week. 386 00:19:48,876 --> 00:19:52,476 Speaker 4: And I would hear Brazilian bands, I would hear jazz 387 00:19:52,516 --> 00:19:54,316 Speaker 4: I would go to you. 388 00:19:54,236 --> 00:19:56,596 Speaker 2: Know, there were so many different jazz scenes too. In 389 00:19:56,636 --> 00:19:57,036 Speaker 2: New York. 390 00:19:57,116 --> 00:19:59,636 Speaker 4: There was there was the small scene, and then there 391 00:19:59,716 --> 00:20:02,396 Speaker 4: was the tonic scene, which was kind of avant garde, 392 00:20:02,396 --> 00:20:03,996 Speaker 4: and I knew some people in that scene, and I 393 00:20:04,036 --> 00:20:05,116 Speaker 4: knew some people in that scene. 394 00:20:05,156 --> 00:20:07,916 Speaker 2: So there was all these different scenes and talk as 395 00:20:07,956 --> 00:20:12,036 Speaker 2: in it was a club, a club called. 396 00:20:15,636 --> 00:20:21,956 Speaker 4: Yeah Yeah. And then I had friends who were songwriters 397 00:20:21,996 --> 00:20:24,116 Speaker 4: and I would go see them play at the living room, right, 398 00:20:25,516 --> 00:20:27,476 Speaker 4: And that was totally different for me because I had 399 00:20:27,516 --> 00:20:33,756 Speaker 4: never thought about songwriting since my synthesizer class song that I. 400 00:20:32,756 --> 00:20:33,156 Speaker 2: I don't know. 401 00:20:33,196 --> 00:20:35,796 Speaker 4: I think I wrote two songs for that class, which 402 00:20:35,796 --> 00:20:37,556 Speaker 4: I still think is so cool that he encouraged us 403 00:20:37,556 --> 00:20:42,156 Speaker 4: to write songs. But I think I was embarrassed by 404 00:20:42,236 --> 00:20:46,916 Speaker 4: them because you know, it was an assignment, and so 405 00:20:46,956 --> 00:20:48,916 Speaker 4: we had to show them and we had to and 406 00:20:48,956 --> 00:20:52,116 Speaker 4: we recorded them and they didn't come out or I 407 00:20:52,236 --> 00:20:54,796 Speaker 4: liked it, but I didn't like the way I sound it. 408 00:20:54,836 --> 00:20:56,556 Speaker 4: You know how it is when you hear yourself for 409 00:20:56,596 --> 00:20:58,916 Speaker 4: the first time. It takes a long time to do 410 00:20:58,996 --> 00:21:01,076 Speaker 4: it in a way that you like it. And so 411 00:21:01,196 --> 00:21:04,036 Speaker 4: I was a little put off by myself, and so 412 00:21:04,076 --> 00:21:06,116 Speaker 4: I didn't write after that at all. 413 00:21:06,116 --> 00:21:08,436 Speaker 1: Put you off to songwriting like that, Yeah, I was. 414 00:21:08,436 --> 00:21:10,476 Speaker 4: Like, oh, I'm not going to I didn't even think 415 00:21:10,516 --> 00:21:12,596 Speaker 4: of it as something that I should do. It was 416 00:21:12,636 --> 00:21:15,796 Speaker 4: weird now thinking back that I didn't even like occur 417 00:21:15,876 --> 00:21:18,636 Speaker 4: to me that I could get better at it or 418 00:21:19,556 --> 00:21:20,356 Speaker 4: do it differently. 419 00:21:20,636 --> 00:21:21,116 Speaker 2: I don't know. 420 00:21:21,956 --> 00:21:23,716 Speaker 4: And so then when I was seeing all my friends 421 00:21:23,756 --> 00:21:26,156 Speaker 4: at the living room, I was I was getting inspired, 422 00:21:26,196 --> 00:21:29,876 Speaker 4: and I didn't have a piano yet because I you know, 423 00:21:29,916 --> 00:21:32,436 Speaker 4: I lived in a rental and I didn't have a 424 00:21:32,476 --> 00:21:35,116 Speaker 4: keyboard or anything. And so my mom sent me this 425 00:21:35,156 --> 00:21:38,436 Speaker 4: old guitar that I had in Texas that I knew 426 00:21:38,436 --> 00:21:41,836 Speaker 4: two chords on, and I played like five chords. I 427 00:21:41,876 --> 00:21:44,876 Speaker 4: learned five chords and I wrote come Away with Me 428 00:21:44,916 --> 00:21:51,156 Speaker 4: one night, and then I started writing songs that's good. Yeah, 429 00:21:51,636 --> 00:21:54,156 Speaker 4: And oh, I think because the guitar, I could play 430 00:21:54,236 --> 00:21:58,516 Speaker 4: really simple chords on piano. I knew all these cool chords, 431 00:21:58,876 --> 00:22:01,516 Speaker 4: but I didn't know how a song fit in, and 432 00:22:01,556 --> 00:22:04,956 Speaker 4: they always sounded like a standard, and then it sounded not. 433 00:22:05,356 --> 00:22:08,076 Speaker 4: I don't know the piano. I couldn't make sound how 434 00:22:08,116 --> 00:22:10,676 Speaker 4: I wanted to write songs with at the time, I 435 00:22:10,676 --> 00:22:12,796 Speaker 4: couldn't put that together yet. 436 00:22:13,556 --> 00:22:17,596 Speaker 3: Just you know, and I know that you don't think 437 00:22:17,636 --> 00:22:21,676 Speaker 3: about genre. I don't know any musician who sits and thinks, well, 438 00:22:21,836 --> 00:22:24,836 Speaker 3: I think I'll phrase this next line like a jazz line, 439 00:22:24,916 --> 00:22:27,156 Speaker 3: and then I'll throw in it. It doesn't work that 440 00:22:27,236 --> 00:22:31,876 Speaker 3: way you but you was there a disparity between what 441 00:22:31,916 --> 00:22:35,636 Speaker 3: you were hearing at Smalls and what you were hearing 442 00:22:35,676 --> 00:22:37,796 Speaker 3: at the living room. 443 00:22:38,356 --> 00:22:41,316 Speaker 4: It was just different. I mean, the people playing at 444 00:22:41,316 --> 00:22:45,316 Speaker 4: Smalls were incredible musicians, and then the people playing at 445 00:22:45,316 --> 00:22:48,076 Speaker 4: the living Room were playing really simple chords and writing 446 00:22:48,196 --> 00:22:49,236 Speaker 4: really great songs. 447 00:22:50,596 --> 00:22:51,076 Speaker 2: And so. 448 00:22:53,636 --> 00:22:55,836 Speaker 4: I did all these gigs, but I wasn't playing in 449 00:22:55,876 --> 00:22:58,956 Speaker 4: clubs yet because I wasn't really there yet. I did 450 00:22:58,956 --> 00:23:02,516 Speaker 4: a lot of restaurant gigs where nobody listened. And then 451 00:23:02,916 --> 00:23:06,596 Speaker 4: my friend Jesse Harris, who's the songwriter, asked if I 452 00:23:06,596 --> 00:23:09,796 Speaker 4: would do some demos for him. He had a Sony 453 00:23:09,796 --> 00:23:12,436 Speaker 4: publishing deal, and so I sang a few of his 454 00:23:12,516 --> 00:23:14,716 Speaker 4: songs for his demos and he loved the way I 455 00:23:14,756 --> 00:23:18,916 Speaker 4: sang them, and he said, let's do a gig at 456 00:23:18,916 --> 00:23:19,476 Speaker 4: the living room. 457 00:23:19,516 --> 00:23:21,116 Speaker 2: Why not? It's just I mean, you don't get paid. 458 00:23:21,116 --> 00:23:22,596 Speaker 2: It's not like that hard to get it. And he 459 00:23:22,676 --> 00:23:24,036 Speaker 2: was already playing there. 460 00:23:24,116 --> 00:23:26,516 Speaker 4: So I said, all right, sure, maybe we'll do come 461 00:23:26,556 --> 00:23:28,916 Speaker 4: Away with Me this song I wrote, you know, And 462 00:23:28,996 --> 00:23:31,476 Speaker 4: so we did his songs, we did like one or 463 00:23:31,516 --> 00:23:34,636 Speaker 4: two of mine, and my bass player Lee Alexander started 464 00:23:34,676 --> 00:23:37,476 Speaker 4: writing songs. We did a few of his, and that 465 00:23:37,556 --> 00:23:39,756 Speaker 4: was sort of the beginning of the first album. And 466 00:23:39,796 --> 00:23:42,236 Speaker 4: it was a really big moment because it was the 467 00:23:42,276 --> 00:23:45,076 Speaker 4: first time I'd played in a place like that. And 468 00:23:46,196 --> 00:23:51,556 Speaker 4: they passed a tip jar around and you couldn't you 469 00:23:51,556 --> 00:23:54,916 Speaker 4: could hear a pin drop. Nobody was talking, everybody was listening, 470 00:23:55,436 --> 00:24:01,876 Speaker 4: and I hadn't experienced that yet. Really yeah, yeah, yeah. 471 00:24:01,956 --> 00:24:04,036 Speaker 1: Did it freak you out then? I mean, in the moment, 472 00:24:04,196 --> 00:24:05,516 Speaker 1: it was nice. 473 00:24:05,996 --> 00:24:08,756 Speaker 2: I mean I was nervous, but it was nice. 474 00:24:09,196 --> 00:24:12,996 Speaker 4: You know, Wow, imagine that people listening. 475 00:24:13,436 --> 00:24:16,476 Speaker 3: So is that around the same time that the woman 476 00:24:16,556 --> 00:24:19,236 Speaker 3: from me and my publishing came I forgot. 477 00:24:19,036 --> 00:24:20,156 Speaker 2: Her name, Shelle White. 478 00:24:20,396 --> 00:24:24,036 Speaker 3: Yeah, and she how did she end up coming to 479 00:24:24,076 --> 00:24:24,796 Speaker 3: hear you play? 480 00:24:24,956 --> 00:24:25,676 Speaker 2: Her husband? 481 00:24:26,676 --> 00:24:29,956 Speaker 4: My bass player played with her husband, and I also 482 00:24:30,076 --> 00:24:31,836 Speaker 4: did had done a gig or I ended up doing 483 00:24:31,876 --> 00:24:34,476 Speaker 4: a gig with him, and so they were friends. 484 00:24:34,476 --> 00:24:36,276 Speaker 2: He was a musician, Jace Hopkins. 485 00:24:36,316 --> 00:24:40,716 Speaker 4: So they came. It was my twenty first birthday. We're 486 00:24:40,716 --> 00:24:43,516 Speaker 4: playing at the garage on Seventh Avenue. We're playing jazz 487 00:24:43,556 --> 00:24:50,316 Speaker 4: brunch trio and they came to hear us, and she's like, Hey, 488 00:24:50,516 --> 00:24:52,276 Speaker 4: you know, I just was at a company picnic and 489 00:24:52,316 --> 00:24:54,836 Speaker 4: I met Bruce Lenvall, the head of Blunot Records. 490 00:24:55,396 --> 00:24:57,116 Speaker 2: I'm going to set up a meeting. How about that? 491 00:24:57,156 --> 00:25:02,316 Speaker 2: I was like, O, guy, whatever, I didn't. 492 00:25:02,076 --> 00:25:05,476 Speaker 3: Really did you aspire to get a record too? 493 00:25:05,796 --> 00:25:08,836 Speaker 4: I was aspiring to pay my rent and to get 494 00:25:08,876 --> 00:25:13,716 Speaker 4: a at a non brunch venue. My sites, we're not 495 00:25:13,996 --> 00:25:16,596 Speaker 4: very far ahead of my next week. Yeah, get out 496 00:25:16,636 --> 00:25:19,476 Speaker 4: of restaurants and into a club, like I was so 497 00:25:19,756 --> 00:25:20,876 Speaker 4: not even there yet. 498 00:25:21,476 --> 00:25:24,916 Speaker 3: But you were aware of the legacy of Blue Note Records. 499 00:25:24,916 --> 00:25:27,476 Speaker 2: I knew Blueot Records, so I was not going to 500 00:25:27,516 --> 00:25:29,036 Speaker 2: say no, did. 501 00:25:28,916 --> 00:25:30,676 Speaker 3: You own some blue Oot Records? 502 00:25:30,716 --> 00:25:31,356 Speaker 2: Absolutely? 503 00:25:31,556 --> 00:25:32,356 Speaker 3: What were your favorites. 504 00:25:33,996 --> 00:25:34,836 Speaker 2: I don't know. 505 00:25:34,876 --> 00:25:38,876 Speaker 4: I always like that something else canniball outly record. I mean, 506 00:25:38,916 --> 00:25:43,356 Speaker 4: I think I didn't even know which ones were Blue Oat, 507 00:25:43,396 --> 00:25:44,956 Speaker 4: but I know I owned a lot of them. 508 00:25:45,596 --> 00:25:48,676 Speaker 1: Yeah, we'll be back with more from Don was and 509 00:25:48,716 --> 00:25:56,716 Speaker 1: myself in conversation with Norah Jones, We're back with more 510 00:25:56,796 --> 00:25:57,876 Speaker 1: from Norah Jones. 511 00:25:58,876 --> 00:26:01,356 Speaker 3: So there you are. You're in a meeting with the 512 00:26:01,396 --> 00:26:03,436 Speaker 3: head of Blue Note, And how did that go? 513 00:26:06,636 --> 00:26:06,796 Speaker 7: Well? 514 00:26:06,836 --> 00:26:08,476 Speaker 4: I didn't know if I was going to have to 515 00:26:08,516 --> 00:26:11,356 Speaker 4: play like that's not really that feels so embarrassing to 516 00:26:11,356 --> 00:26:13,596 Speaker 4: me to go into an office and audition for somebody 517 00:26:13,636 --> 00:26:16,636 Speaker 4: like that, So I didn't know. I brought in a demo. 518 00:26:17,196 --> 00:26:19,236 Speaker 4: I had a three song demo that I brought around 519 00:26:19,396 --> 00:26:24,196 Speaker 4: to restaurants to get gigs. And on the demo I 520 00:26:24,276 --> 00:26:28,236 Speaker 4: put a song from Maybe College that I had recorded 521 00:26:28,236 --> 00:26:31,436 Speaker 4: a standard, and then a song I had recorded in 522 00:26:31,436 --> 00:26:35,836 Speaker 4: New York with a friend, a standard with basin trumpet 523 00:26:35,836 --> 00:26:37,996 Speaker 4: on it. And then I threw one of the Jesse 524 00:26:38,076 --> 00:26:40,716 Speaker 4: Harris songs from the demos we made on there right, 525 00:26:41,556 --> 00:26:43,916 Speaker 4: and so Bruce listened and he liked it. And then 526 00:26:43,996 --> 00:26:46,276 Speaker 4: after the Jesse song came out here goes, well, what 527 00:26:46,316 --> 00:26:48,116 Speaker 4: do you want to be a jazz singer a pop singer? 528 00:26:48,156 --> 00:26:50,436 Speaker 4: I was like, jazz singer, I'm here in Bluna. 529 00:26:52,516 --> 00:26:54,996 Speaker 2: Yeah, but I also like, I don't I don't think 530 00:26:54,996 --> 00:26:55,996 Speaker 2: I was thinking about that. 531 00:26:56,876 --> 00:27:01,756 Speaker 3: Well, I don't think there's that big a difference. I've 532 00:27:01,836 --> 00:27:05,356 Speaker 3: listened to all three of those. Yeah, and with the 533 00:27:05,516 --> 00:27:07,876 Speaker 3: Jesse songs got like a is it a dobro? 534 00:27:09,156 --> 00:27:11,636 Speaker 4: The Jesse song we had played him was it was 535 00:27:11,716 --> 00:27:13,756 Speaker 4: just sort of six eight like country song. 536 00:27:13,876 --> 00:27:16,276 Speaker 3: I mean, what instrument was there's something kind of picking 537 00:27:16,276 --> 00:27:16,476 Speaker 3: on it? 538 00:27:17,116 --> 00:27:20,236 Speaker 4: There was no This was just it's called World of Trouble. 539 00:27:20,276 --> 00:27:23,916 Speaker 4: It was piano and guitar, yeah, and bass. 540 00:27:24,316 --> 00:27:30,116 Speaker 3: So there was some textural differences, but you sang the 541 00:27:30,156 --> 00:27:32,436 Speaker 3: way you approached the song and the voice he used. 542 00:27:32,436 --> 00:27:36,156 Speaker 3: It wasn't like you sang, you know, Jesse song with 543 00:27:36,276 --> 00:27:40,596 Speaker 3: like a twang. I thought you're incredibly consistent. 544 00:27:41,036 --> 00:27:44,276 Speaker 4: Yeah, I mean, I don't know when I made the disc. 545 00:27:44,436 --> 00:27:47,356 Speaker 4: I mean I grew up mimicking my favorite singers. That's 546 00:27:47,356 --> 00:27:51,476 Speaker 4: how you learn, right, who were there? I mean I 547 00:27:51,596 --> 00:27:55,356 Speaker 4: tried say, I tried to mimic or Ethan all her 548 00:27:55,396 --> 00:27:57,876 Speaker 4: background singing. You know, I was always doing the harmonies 549 00:27:57,916 --> 00:28:01,996 Speaker 4: to Ain't no Way, but I mean Billie Holliday was 550 00:28:02,036 --> 00:28:05,356 Speaker 4: a big one. I actually got a part as Billie Holiday. 551 00:28:05,396 --> 00:28:08,716 Speaker 4: In the high school. They did a black history program 552 00:28:08,756 --> 00:28:12,076 Speaker 4: every year and somehow I got to play Billie Holiday, 553 00:28:12,116 --> 00:28:12,996 Speaker 4: which is crazy. 554 00:28:14,076 --> 00:28:15,596 Speaker 2: It was just a program with. 555 00:28:15,556 --> 00:28:18,876 Speaker 4: Lots of different stuff and I was like, I went 556 00:28:18,916 --> 00:28:21,276 Speaker 4: into that was weird because I had to audition it. 557 00:28:21,396 --> 00:28:24,356 Speaker 4: We auditioned in front of the whole group of students. 558 00:28:24,396 --> 00:28:25,156 Speaker 2: It was like. 559 00:28:26,196 --> 00:28:28,796 Speaker 4: And I sang I think I sang like fight and 560 00:28:28,876 --> 00:28:32,396 Speaker 4: mellow or something. But the actual song for the performance 561 00:28:32,436 --> 00:28:36,556 Speaker 4: was Strange Fruit, which was also crazy, you know. 562 00:28:37,356 --> 00:28:40,436 Speaker 1: And it's heavy for for for high school and to 563 00:28:40,596 --> 00:28:42,996 Speaker 1: not only have to sing it in front of people 564 00:28:43,076 --> 00:28:44,676 Speaker 1: and find them heavy. 565 00:28:44,756 --> 00:28:47,116 Speaker 2: Very heavy. And I'm also not black, so. 566 00:28:47,636 --> 00:28:49,476 Speaker 8: You know, people people thought you were, but I think 567 00:28:49,556 --> 00:28:52,676 Speaker 8: I think maybe they did, and I know I did 568 00:28:52,716 --> 00:28:56,076 Speaker 8: definitely did not tell them I was, but I think 569 00:28:56,356 --> 00:28:58,396 Speaker 8: maybe there was a little bit of a mystery surrounding 570 00:28:58,436 --> 00:28:59,156 Speaker 8: my background. 571 00:28:59,156 --> 00:29:01,836 Speaker 2: I'm not really sure. I'm actually not sure about that. 572 00:29:02,236 --> 00:29:05,396 Speaker 1: Did you try it? Did you try to sing it 573 00:29:05,476 --> 00:29:06,756 Speaker 1: like Billy or. 574 00:29:06,956 --> 00:29:10,556 Speaker 4: Yes, Yeah, I definitely tried to out like Billy that 575 00:29:10,676 --> 00:29:11,916 Speaker 4: was an amazing experience. 576 00:29:11,956 --> 00:29:16,116 Speaker 2: The director Edra James. She was incredible. She really taught 577 00:29:16,116 --> 00:29:16,236 Speaker 2: me a. 578 00:29:16,236 --> 00:29:23,396 Speaker 4: Lot about embodying something, you know, because I wasn't into theater. 579 00:29:24,076 --> 00:29:25,756 Speaker 4: I wasn't in the theater group, but she was like 580 00:29:25,796 --> 00:29:27,036 Speaker 4: the theater director. 581 00:29:26,716 --> 00:29:27,036 Speaker 2: And she. 582 00:29:29,236 --> 00:29:31,556 Speaker 4: I don't know, the way she told me to do 583 00:29:31,596 --> 00:29:34,276 Speaker 4: it was really it was very spiritual. She was talking 584 00:29:34,316 --> 00:29:37,316 Speaker 4: about Billy in her life and everything, which, of course, 585 00:29:37,436 --> 00:29:39,676 Speaker 4: you know, I didn't know that much about yet. 586 00:29:39,676 --> 00:29:43,516 Speaker 2: I just knew I loved her her singing. Yeah, so 587 00:29:43,916 --> 00:29:48,836 Speaker 2: Aretha Billy, Billy God, Judy Garland. You know. 588 00:29:50,716 --> 00:29:52,476 Speaker 1: The other day that Judy Garland is one of the 589 00:29:53,116 --> 00:29:56,316 Speaker 1: great I mean, at least twenty greatest singers ever. 590 00:29:56,756 --> 00:29:58,356 Speaker 2: Oh you had to convince that. 591 00:30:00,196 --> 00:30:02,356 Speaker 1: Well. I mean, I mean, I don't know. I guess 592 00:30:02,356 --> 00:30:06,076 Speaker 1: people think maybe of her as hokey, but I don't know. 593 00:30:06,116 --> 00:30:09,036 Speaker 1: I mean, when you think about the standards that have 594 00:30:09,276 --> 00:30:11,596 Speaker 1: come from her, the definitive versions of. 595 00:30:11,556 --> 00:30:15,116 Speaker 3: Certain phrasing, brilliant, man. Yeah, it's all for real. 596 00:30:17,796 --> 00:30:21,476 Speaker 4: Yeah, an incredible. I love the Cardigi Hall Live album. 597 00:30:22,396 --> 00:30:26,316 Speaker 4: It's really hard, a lot of heart. Yeah, And as 598 00:30:26,356 --> 00:30:28,236 Speaker 4: I got older, I think I realized that that's all 599 00:30:28,276 --> 00:30:33,236 Speaker 4: that matters really. And I remember in college once I 600 00:30:33,276 --> 00:30:34,956 Speaker 4: was singing a stand. I was playing a demo for 601 00:30:34,996 --> 00:30:37,956 Speaker 4: a friend of mine and he and it was a 602 00:30:37,996 --> 00:30:40,196 Speaker 4: jazz standard and he's like, gosh, you really hear your 603 00:30:40,196 --> 00:30:43,196 Speaker 4: Texas toang no matter what you do. And I was like, really, 604 00:30:43,556 --> 00:30:47,036 Speaker 4: I didn't know that, and he's like, yes, it really cool. 605 00:30:47,196 --> 00:30:48,716 Speaker 2: And I was like, that's cool, okay. 606 00:30:48,956 --> 00:30:50,796 Speaker 4: And I think that was one of those moments where 607 00:30:50,836 --> 00:30:52,276 Speaker 4: I sort of was like, Okay, I can kind of 608 00:30:52,276 --> 00:30:56,036 Speaker 4: be myself and I don't have to imitate Ella, you know, 609 00:30:56,276 --> 00:30:56,836 Speaker 4: or Seravon. 610 00:30:56,956 --> 00:30:58,716 Speaker 2: I loved Saravon. I was obsessed with Serevon. 611 00:31:00,716 --> 00:31:03,356 Speaker 4: But I mean, yeah, I mean some of my favorite 612 00:31:03,396 --> 00:31:07,636 Speaker 4: voices are imperfect or weird or whatever they are, but 613 00:31:07,676 --> 00:31:10,836 Speaker 4: they embody them themselves, you know, they're their own thing. 614 00:31:11,596 --> 00:31:13,876 Speaker 3: So then then you get the chance to make a record. 615 00:31:14,396 --> 00:31:16,516 Speaker 2: Yeah, And I. 616 00:31:18,276 --> 00:31:21,796 Speaker 3: Thought, like, call on Craig Street. There's a smart move. 617 00:31:22,396 --> 00:31:22,556 Speaker 9: Well. 618 00:31:22,596 --> 00:31:25,516 Speaker 2: I was obsessed with New Moon Daughter, the Cassandra Wilson album. 619 00:31:25,676 --> 00:31:27,916 Speaker 3: Is that the one where she does I'm So Lonesome? 620 00:31:28,396 --> 00:31:29,916 Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean I love that album. 621 00:31:30,116 --> 00:31:31,516 Speaker 3: That tied it all together. 622 00:31:31,836 --> 00:31:34,116 Speaker 4: Well, I loved that album so much. It was so 623 00:31:34,156 --> 00:31:36,356 Speaker 4: different from anything else I listened to. And I remember 624 00:31:36,396 --> 00:31:39,636 Speaker 4: being in high school, and I mean, that album was 625 00:31:39,636 --> 00:31:41,796 Speaker 4: really emotional for me because my aunt was dying of 626 00:31:41,836 --> 00:31:46,916 Speaker 4: cancer and I was listening to it NonStop in Florida 627 00:31:46,996 --> 00:31:50,876 Speaker 4: with my aunt. So it was very emotional for me 628 00:31:50,996 --> 00:31:54,236 Speaker 4: for that reason. But also it was the first time 629 00:31:54,276 --> 00:31:58,796 Speaker 4: I had an album of a singer where there's just guitar. 630 00:31:58,996 --> 00:32:02,436 Speaker 4: It's all acoustic guitars on that album. There's no keys 631 00:32:02,516 --> 00:32:06,396 Speaker 4: at all, and it just had such a different sound, 632 00:32:06,996 --> 00:32:10,716 Speaker 4: you know, it was earthy and kind of it had 633 00:32:10,756 --> 00:32:14,316 Speaker 4: like some twang on it, and she's Southern, so she 634 00:32:14,436 --> 00:32:18,236 Speaker 4: has a little twang and she's incredible, And yeah, I 635 00:32:18,356 --> 00:32:18,796 Speaker 4: was cool. 636 00:32:19,116 --> 00:32:22,076 Speaker 3: It was great records, and so you called Craig and 637 00:32:22,196 --> 00:32:22,796 Speaker 3: started to make it. 638 00:32:23,036 --> 00:32:25,476 Speaker 4: I asked Bruce if I could use Craig, and He's like, yeah, okay, 639 00:32:25,556 --> 00:32:26,236 Speaker 4: I'll call Craig. 640 00:32:26,556 --> 00:32:30,676 Speaker 3: You discovered that it was probably a more function of 641 00:32:30,716 --> 00:32:33,996 Speaker 3: mixing really than it's like you did achieve the thing 642 00:32:34,036 --> 00:32:35,676 Speaker 3: you went into work with Craig for. 643 00:32:36,116 --> 00:32:36,516 Speaker 5: We did. 644 00:32:36,596 --> 00:32:39,756 Speaker 4: I mean, we made a twenty one We recorded twenty 645 00:32:39,836 --> 00:32:44,156 Speaker 4: one songs in a week and mixed it immediately, and 646 00:32:44,196 --> 00:32:47,236 Speaker 4: maybe it wasn't the smartest way to do it with. 647 00:32:47,636 --> 00:32:50,356 Speaker 4: I think space is always the place when you're recording. 648 00:32:51,956 --> 00:32:53,876 Speaker 4: And then we turned the record in and it got rejected, 649 00:32:54,756 --> 00:32:58,956 Speaker 4: and I was kind of scared and sad, but also 650 00:32:58,996 --> 00:33:02,036 Speaker 4: a little relieved because I didn't love I didn't feel 651 00:33:02,076 --> 00:33:07,356 Speaker 4: like it came out exactly like it could have. But yeah, 652 00:33:07,396 --> 00:33:10,636 Speaker 4: in hindsight, I think the mix says we're not right. 653 00:33:10,836 --> 00:33:13,716 Speaker 4: And again I think Space would have been the place, 654 00:33:13,756 --> 00:33:15,836 Speaker 4: and we would have used what was great, and we 655 00:33:15,876 --> 00:33:18,716 Speaker 4: would have either redone or used some demos from something else, 656 00:33:19,396 --> 00:33:21,876 Speaker 4: and then that ended up being what happened. We used 657 00:33:21,996 --> 00:33:25,596 Speaker 4: three of the amazing takes from that that session on 658 00:33:25,636 --> 00:33:26,116 Speaker 4: the record. 659 00:33:27,556 --> 00:33:30,476 Speaker 3: Don't know why. It's the first take right from your demos, right. 660 00:33:30,436 --> 00:33:32,636 Speaker 4: Don't know why was the first take of the demos 661 00:33:32,676 --> 00:33:34,476 Speaker 4: we made because Blue Note gave me some money to 662 00:33:34,476 --> 00:33:36,796 Speaker 4: make demos before they decided if they wanted to sign me. 663 00:33:37,476 --> 00:33:41,076 Speaker 4: And then whenever Bruce heard the demos and he liked them, 664 00:33:41,196 --> 00:33:44,596 Speaker 4: he called me and he was like, all right, this 665 00:33:44,636 --> 00:33:47,556 Speaker 4: isn't jazz, this is country, some of it even, but 666 00:33:47,636 --> 00:33:48,076 Speaker 4: I don't care. 667 00:33:48,236 --> 00:33:50,556 Speaker 2: Let's do it. Let's make a record. That's kind of 668 00:33:50,556 --> 00:33:51,316 Speaker 2: how he was. 669 00:33:52,796 --> 00:33:53,516 Speaker 1: Funny review. 670 00:33:53,716 --> 00:33:55,276 Speaker 5: Yeah, all right. 671 00:33:55,476 --> 00:33:57,676 Speaker 3: It's just the greatest, wasn't he his enthusiasm. 672 00:33:57,916 --> 00:33:58,996 Speaker 2: Yeah, Bruce was great. 673 00:33:59,236 --> 00:34:03,596 Speaker 4: Yeah, Bruce was so great. But he was also so 674 00:34:03,836 --> 00:34:07,556 Speaker 4: into jazz. I mean, later on, after many, many years, 675 00:34:07,556 --> 00:34:10,756 Speaker 4: I made records that I made The Fall, and then 676 00:34:10,756 --> 00:34:12,796 Speaker 4: I made Little Broken Hearts with the injer Mass and 677 00:34:12,836 --> 00:34:15,516 Speaker 4: we went to lunch one day and he's like, well, 678 00:34:15,676 --> 00:34:17,916 Speaker 4: I'm gonna be honest with you. I didn't like those 679 00:34:17,956 --> 00:34:21,596 Speaker 4: records when you turn them in. They're not really my thing. 680 00:34:21,876 --> 00:34:25,796 Speaker 4: But I think now I like them, and I get it. 681 00:34:25,996 --> 00:34:27,996 Speaker 4: Now I get it, and I thought that was cool. 682 00:34:28,116 --> 00:34:28,716 Speaker 3: That's cool. 683 00:34:28,836 --> 00:34:29,956 Speaker 2: He never kissed my butt. 684 00:34:30,036 --> 00:34:32,556 Speaker 4: He never told me he liked him, so I never 685 00:34:32,636 --> 00:34:35,956 Speaker 4: really thought about him not saying anything, but like it 686 00:34:36,076 --> 00:34:36,516 Speaker 4: was fine. 687 00:34:37,156 --> 00:34:37,396 Speaker 2: You know. 688 00:34:37,996 --> 00:34:41,316 Speaker 3: I don't think you had a shift in sensibilities or 689 00:34:41,436 --> 00:34:46,596 Speaker 3: a shift in your style of delivering the songs. You 690 00:34:46,676 --> 00:34:53,036 Speaker 3: were always you, but the textures kind of changed dramatically, 691 00:34:54,596 --> 00:34:56,876 Speaker 3: you know, which I think is a cool thing. That's 692 00:34:56,876 --> 00:34:59,836 Speaker 3: what Miles did. You know, if you listen to Miles, 693 00:34:59,836 --> 00:35:02,676 Speaker 3: whether it's with an electric band or whether it's I'm 694 00:35:02,956 --> 00:35:06,676 Speaker 3: kind of Blue or in the Herbie Wayne Tony Ron band. 695 00:35:07,556 --> 00:35:10,676 Speaker 3: He always sounded like Miles. He was always Miles, and yeah, 696 00:35:10,876 --> 00:35:13,996 Speaker 3: he just kept it interesting for himself by changing the textures. 697 00:35:16,116 --> 00:35:20,876 Speaker 3: After the success of Have Come Away with Me? Were 698 00:35:20,916 --> 00:35:25,876 Speaker 3: you trying to avoid getting pigeonholed into piano trio? 699 00:35:27,956 --> 00:35:31,996 Speaker 4: I was just excited to keep finding stuff and I 700 00:35:32,116 --> 00:35:35,676 Speaker 4: was really getting into songwriting. I only wrote two or 701 00:35:35,676 --> 00:35:37,676 Speaker 4: three songs on Come Away with Me, and the rest 702 00:35:37,676 --> 00:35:41,476 Speaker 4: were Jesse songs, Lee songs and a few covers, and 703 00:35:41,556 --> 00:35:44,516 Speaker 4: I loved doing them. But I was excited to write, 704 00:35:44,556 --> 00:35:47,076 Speaker 4: and I was getting into like bluegrass that year, and 705 00:35:48,396 --> 00:35:50,356 Speaker 4: so the second album was a little more country, but 706 00:35:50,836 --> 00:35:53,516 Speaker 4: everyone in the band wrote for it, and so we 707 00:35:53,556 --> 00:35:56,436 Speaker 4: did everyone in the band's songs, and I wrote a 708 00:35:56,436 --> 00:35:59,356 Speaker 4: little more, but we had the same engineer and same 709 00:35:59,396 --> 00:36:01,316 Speaker 4: producer of course, a Reef Martin. 710 00:36:01,636 --> 00:36:01,996 Speaker 3: Let's talk. 711 00:36:02,196 --> 00:36:05,556 Speaker 2: Yeah, I got to talk about is you. 712 00:36:05,516 --> 00:36:09,716 Speaker 3: Know, certainly one of my great heroes and a guy 713 00:36:09,756 --> 00:36:17,116 Speaker 3: who I aspired to I want to emulate. I don't 714 00:36:17,156 --> 00:36:18,836 Speaker 3: feel I ever hit it, but I try. 715 00:36:18,916 --> 00:36:18,996 Speaker 9: No. 716 00:36:19,516 --> 00:36:21,476 Speaker 4: I mean, I think you have the same spirit a 717 00:36:21,556 --> 00:36:24,956 Speaker 4: Reef did, which is just very nice. He embodied like 718 00:36:25,516 --> 00:36:29,396 Speaker 4: sweetness and goodness and you have that absolutely. 719 00:36:29,036 --> 00:36:32,356 Speaker 3: That's very kind. Ye what bo was a like making 720 00:36:32,436 --> 00:36:33,556 Speaker 3: records for him? 721 00:36:33,756 --> 00:36:36,116 Speaker 4: It ended up being so fun And I never thought 722 00:36:36,116 --> 00:36:38,436 Speaker 4: I would have this old man as a friend. You know, 723 00:36:38,716 --> 00:36:40,436 Speaker 4: the same thing with Bruce. I always thought that was 724 00:36:40,476 --> 00:36:42,636 Speaker 4: so funny. I could go to lunch with a Reef 725 00:36:42,716 --> 00:36:45,596 Speaker 4: or Bruce and we could drink Martini's for hours and just. 726 00:36:45,596 --> 00:36:47,716 Speaker 2: Blah blah blah blah. 727 00:36:47,236 --> 00:36:50,596 Speaker 4: Talk about relationships like I would talk about my boyfriend, 728 00:36:50,796 --> 00:36:50,996 Speaker 4: you know. 729 00:36:50,996 --> 00:36:53,516 Speaker 2: What I mean, Like they were like my my friends. 730 00:36:53,916 --> 00:36:55,396 Speaker 2: And I always thought that was funny. 731 00:36:55,636 --> 00:36:58,356 Speaker 1: How did a reef like join the project? 732 00:36:58,756 --> 00:37:05,196 Speaker 4: Actually, a Reef had just started either started or revamped 733 00:37:05,236 --> 00:37:08,236 Speaker 4: I'm not sure. Maybe you know Manhattan Records, which was 734 00:37:08,276 --> 00:37:12,636 Speaker 4: a sort of sister labeled to Blue Note that Bruce oversaw, 735 00:37:13,236 --> 00:37:18,716 Speaker 4: which was either classical or musical theater kind of adult contemporary. 736 00:37:19,396 --> 00:37:21,676 Speaker 2: Yes, that's adult contemporary. 737 00:37:21,836 --> 00:37:23,716 Speaker 1: Yeah, it would have revaed because I think I started 738 00:37:23,716 --> 00:37:27,076 Speaker 1: in the eighties. Maybe it started, probably was revamped. 739 00:37:26,556 --> 00:37:27,316 Speaker 2: That's what it was. 740 00:37:28,556 --> 00:37:30,996 Speaker 3: He left Atlantic and went to yeah do that. 741 00:37:31,436 --> 00:37:31,756 Speaker 2: Yeah. 742 00:37:31,796 --> 00:37:35,196 Speaker 4: So whenever the Craig Street version of the record got 743 00:37:35,236 --> 00:37:40,076 Speaker 4: sort of rejected, Bruce said that he wanted me to 744 00:37:40,116 --> 00:37:42,196 Speaker 4: go back in with a Reef Martin, and I was 745 00:37:42,556 --> 00:37:45,276 Speaker 4: a little confused. I was like, well, you like the 746 00:37:45,316 --> 00:37:47,476 Speaker 4: demos we did on our own, should we just do that? 747 00:37:48,716 --> 00:37:52,476 Speaker 4: And of course I respected everything where Reef had done, 748 00:37:52,796 --> 00:37:55,236 Speaker 4: but I was starting to get a little protective at 749 00:37:55,236 --> 00:38:00,956 Speaker 4: this point and like stubborn, and I didn't know if 750 00:38:00,996 --> 00:38:04,676 Speaker 4: he still you know, like I didn't know if it 751 00:38:04,716 --> 00:38:07,916 Speaker 4: was going to be strings and stuff I didn't want. 752 00:38:07,716 --> 00:38:09,476 Speaker 2: On there, you know, or or what. 753 00:38:11,116 --> 00:38:12,916 Speaker 4: So I was a little hesitant, to be honest, even 754 00:38:12,916 --> 00:38:15,796 Speaker 4: though he was a legend and I'm obsessed with all 755 00:38:15,836 --> 00:38:19,116 Speaker 4: of the stuff he did with Donnie Hathaway and Retha. 756 00:38:19,436 --> 00:38:22,796 Speaker 4: But then Bruce said, why don't we set up a meeting. 757 00:38:23,076 --> 00:38:25,676 Speaker 4: We'll go into a rehearsal space. We went to this 758 00:38:25,716 --> 00:38:26,556 Speaker 4: rehearsal space. 759 00:38:26,636 --> 00:38:29,996 Speaker 2: It was so silly and like he came in and 760 00:38:30,036 --> 00:38:33,636 Speaker 2: he's this sweet old man and he sits down and 761 00:38:34,476 --> 00:38:36,996 Speaker 2: I play or something. I don't know. It was weird. 762 00:38:37,436 --> 00:38:40,676 Speaker 4: And then Bruce said, well, you guys have a four 763 00:38:40,756 --> 00:38:41,476 Speaker 4: days book. 764 00:38:41,316 --> 00:38:41,836 Speaker 2: In the studio. 765 00:38:41,876 --> 00:38:43,596 Speaker 4: He'll just come the first day and if it goes well, 766 00:38:43,636 --> 00:38:45,676 Speaker 4: then he can come the rest of the days. I 767 00:38:45,676 --> 00:38:49,156 Speaker 4: don't know if he ever told a reeffat but that's 768 00:38:49,196 --> 00:38:52,596 Speaker 4: what was my understanding. And so because it was still 769 00:38:52,756 --> 00:38:55,116 Speaker 4: just my band, he didn't hire the band. It was 770 00:38:55,116 --> 00:38:56,996 Speaker 4: still in my band, and I hired the band and 771 00:38:57,796 --> 00:39:00,036 Speaker 4: the engineer, and so that's what happened. He came in 772 00:39:00,076 --> 00:39:03,916 Speaker 4: for the first day. He was super sweet, he had 773 00:39:04,036 --> 00:39:08,836 Speaker 4: great like years, and he didn't try to impose anything 774 00:39:08,876 --> 00:39:12,196 Speaker 4: on it, I think, which was my main thing. But 775 00:39:12,276 --> 00:39:17,076 Speaker 4: he definitely helped guide us into the right directions every time, 776 00:39:17,236 --> 00:39:19,636 Speaker 4: and all right, he can stay. It was like, kind 777 00:39:19,676 --> 00:39:22,036 Speaker 4: of funny, but what would. 778 00:39:21,836 --> 00:39:24,596 Speaker 3: He make suggestions about. 779 00:39:25,636 --> 00:39:28,716 Speaker 4: Actually, When I did the Nearness of You, which is 780 00:39:28,716 --> 00:39:32,236 Speaker 4: the old Hogey Carmichael ned Washington song and I play 781 00:39:32,276 --> 00:39:34,676 Speaker 4: it solo, there's a part on it. 782 00:39:34,836 --> 00:39:38,196 Speaker 2: The nearness of You, the nearness of You. 783 00:39:38,396 --> 00:39:41,116 Speaker 4: Or whatever the melody is, I was kind of like, 784 00:39:41,436 --> 00:39:42,956 Speaker 4: I think I had sung that song for a long 785 00:39:42,996 --> 00:39:45,756 Speaker 4: time and I was kind of phrasing it a little loosely, 786 00:39:46,716 --> 00:39:50,156 Speaker 4: and he said, no, I know, I like how you're 787 00:39:50,156 --> 00:39:52,196 Speaker 4: phrasing it, but at least the first time, can you 788 00:39:52,276 --> 00:39:56,156 Speaker 4: just hit the actual melody on the actual the nearness 789 00:39:56,196 --> 00:40:00,036 Speaker 4: of because it's such a classic song, hit that melody 790 00:40:00,876 --> 00:40:03,116 Speaker 4: every time I sing that song. Now I think about him. 791 00:40:03,996 --> 00:40:06,756 Speaker 4: But yeah, stuff like that. Like he wasn't trying to 792 00:40:06,756 --> 00:40:10,356 Speaker 4: put me in a box or change anything. It was 793 00:40:10,436 --> 00:40:13,876 Speaker 4: just the stuff that makes the melodies, you know, the 794 00:40:13,916 --> 00:40:18,516 Speaker 4: stuff that we needed to hear, picking a take, comping vocals. 795 00:40:18,596 --> 00:40:18,836 Speaker 2: You know. 796 00:40:18,916 --> 00:40:21,356 Speaker 4: He had this crazy like contraption. He used to camp 797 00:40:21,436 --> 00:40:23,956 Speaker 4: vocals from the seventies, remember that. 798 00:40:24,076 --> 00:40:30,316 Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, so you could just compare different different takes. 799 00:40:28,796 --> 00:40:34,356 Speaker 2: Yeah, he would put it into this movie box. It 800 00:40:34,396 --> 00:40:36,156 Speaker 2: was like very old school. 801 00:40:37,036 --> 00:40:39,676 Speaker 4: He was just so cool and in the end, I 802 00:40:39,796 --> 00:40:42,716 Speaker 4: just grew to love him so much. So I was 803 00:40:42,756 --> 00:40:46,436 Speaker 4: just very I was just afraid in the beginning, you know, 804 00:40:46,876 --> 00:40:48,916 Speaker 4: afraid of strings. And it's funny because he was a 805 00:40:48,916 --> 00:40:51,636 Speaker 4: great string arranger and I almost never let him do 806 00:40:51,716 --> 00:40:55,956 Speaker 4: an arrangement for me. Actually, for the Sondra Bullock movie, 807 00:40:57,396 --> 00:40:59,356 Speaker 4: she wanted Nearness of You, but she wanted it with 808 00:40:59,436 --> 00:41:02,316 Speaker 4: like strings or something. And that's when he finally got 809 00:41:02,316 --> 00:41:04,836 Speaker 4: to do it. We took the album version and he 810 00:41:04,916 --> 00:41:07,156 Speaker 4: just made a really nice string arrangement and then we 811 00:41:07,236 --> 00:41:08,596 Speaker 4: used it and he was so excited. 812 00:41:08,596 --> 00:41:10,076 Speaker 2: And I remember he came into the shoot. 813 00:41:10,356 --> 00:41:14,076 Speaker 1: Would you mind showing demonstrating just the difference between how 814 00:41:14,076 --> 00:41:16,716 Speaker 1: you were singing it versus how he wanted you to sing. 815 00:41:17,996 --> 00:41:18,996 Speaker 2: On the piano piana. 816 00:41:19,076 --> 00:41:24,996 Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, it's it's miked up and running fantastic mm hmm. 817 00:41:29,036 --> 00:41:35,076 Speaker 5: H Vanana City. 818 00:41:37,156 --> 00:41:40,436 Speaker 2: And he was like, no, go Vanana zoze. 819 00:41:44,476 --> 00:41:45,596 Speaker 5: Is a vanas. 820 00:41:48,516 --> 00:41:56,116 Speaker 9: It isn't your sweet conversation that brings this sensation. 821 00:41:58,716 --> 00:42:06,196 Speaker 10: Oh oh, I think it's it's just the that's what 822 00:42:06,316 --> 00:42:06,636 Speaker 10: it was. 823 00:42:07,116 --> 00:42:08,996 Speaker 5: It's just the nanis. 824 00:42:10,156 --> 00:42:11,916 Speaker 4: That's like I was doing something like that maybe, And 825 00:42:11,956 --> 00:42:15,636 Speaker 4: he's like, it's just the naness of He's like, no, 826 00:42:15,676 --> 00:42:16,276 Speaker 4: you gotta. 827 00:42:16,076 --> 00:42:16,636 Speaker 9: Do hit that. 828 00:42:17,436 --> 00:42:20,036 Speaker 5: It's just it's just the narness. 829 00:42:22,596 --> 00:42:26,756 Speaker 3: Or yeah, that's good advice. 830 00:42:26,956 --> 00:42:28,316 Speaker 5: I think it was good advice. 831 00:42:29,356 --> 00:42:32,516 Speaker 4: Yeah, do the melody at least once before you start 832 00:42:32,556 --> 00:42:33,116 Speaker 4: messing with it. 833 00:42:34,916 --> 00:42:36,836 Speaker 1: That makes it sound sound advice. 834 00:42:36,996 --> 00:42:38,636 Speaker 2: Yeah, it's good advice. 835 00:42:38,876 --> 00:42:42,716 Speaker 4: And then for the second record, he he was also 836 00:42:43,756 --> 00:42:45,956 Speaker 4: he came with us, we just we all had fun. 837 00:42:46,116 --> 00:42:47,796 Speaker 1: How did that did you? Just just because you just 838 00:42:47,916 --> 00:42:50,196 Speaker 1: enjoyed his presence and so you asked him, I mean well, 839 00:42:50,196 --> 00:42:52,196 Speaker 1: and because he was helpful and you brought him back. 840 00:42:52,556 --> 00:42:54,036 Speaker 4: I think we were going to go into the studio 841 00:42:54,116 --> 00:42:57,276 Speaker 4: and he called me. He's like, well, I mean I 842 00:42:57,276 --> 00:42:59,316 Speaker 4: don't want to come in later again, I was like, Okay, 843 00:42:59,516 --> 00:43:02,716 Speaker 4: let's do it. Like I wasn't even I feel like 844 00:43:02,956 --> 00:43:05,116 Speaker 4: at that point, I was just trying to record and 845 00:43:05,156 --> 00:43:07,676 Speaker 4: seeing what kind of songs I had, you know, So 846 00:43:07,916 --> 00:43:12,156 Speaker 4: I wasn't even really making the second album until we 847 00:43:12,156 --> 00:43:16,196 Speaker 4: were almost done, if that makes sense, which I like recording. 848 00:43:15,836 --> 00:43:18,676 Speaker 1: Like that, were you getting you probably were getting a 849 00:43:18,716 --> 00:43:21,876 Speaker 1: lot of people wanting to come in to make your 850 00:43:21,876 --> 00:43:24,116 Speaker 1: second record with you too, I'd imagine, right. 851 00:43:23,996 --> 00:43:25,436 Speaker 2: I don't remember that happening at all. 852 00:43:25,636 --> 00:43:28,636 Speaker 4: Actually, I think we were pretty insular at that point, 853 00:43:28,716 --> 00:43:31,556 Speaker 4: and I think Bruce really wanted a Reef to do it, 854 00:43:31,676 --> 00:43:34,156 Speaker 4: and a Reef really wanted to do it, and we 855 00:43:34,196 --> 00:43:36,636 Speaker 4: loved a Reef, so it just there was never any 856 00:43:36,716 --> 00:43:40,156 Speaker 4: question of changing it up. I think it was more 857 00:43:40,316 --> 00:43:42,756 Speaker 4: just like, let's just see what happens in the studio 858 00:43:42,876 --> 00:43:46,076 Speaker 4: and not overthink it, because I didn't want to make 859 00:43:46,116 --> 00:43:50,196 Speaker 4: it be a thing where we were thinking about it 860 00:43:50,276 --> 00:43:53,316 Speaker 4: being a follow up in the studio, so and we 861 00:43:53,396 --> 00:43:55,916 Speaker 4: kind of didn't. We went, Yeah, we went up to 862 00:43:56,316 --> 00:43:59,236 Speaker 4: upstate to Alaer with a Reef for like a week 863 00:43:59,316 --> 00:44:01,876 Speaker 4: or like maybe five days, and we had so much 864 00:44:01,916 --> 00:44:05,476 Speaker 4: fun and oh the funny part was that when we 865 00:44:05,516 --> 00:44:07,436 Speaker 4: recorded Come Away with Me, the one rule was that 866 00:44:07,476 --> 00:44:10,796 Speaker 4: a reef leaves at six o'clock every night. And I 867 00:44:10,836 --> 00:44:13,076 Speaker 4: remember at the time thinking that was ridiculous because we 868 00:44:13,116 --> 00:44:15,516 Speaker 4: wanted to squeeze every second out of the studio and 869 00:44:15,556 --> 00:44:18,356 Speaker 4: I was used to recording late and drinking and like, you. 870 00:44:18,316 --> 00:44:21,476 Speaker 2: Know, seeing what happened. But we did it his way 871 00:44:21,516 --> 00:44:24,596 Speaker 2: and it was kind of nice. Yeah, And then at 872 00:44:24,596 --> 00:44:25,236 Speaker 2: a Laire. 873 00:44:25,516 --> 00:44:27,276 Speaker 4: I didn't think he would go for it, because I 874 00:44:27,316 --> 00:44:28,996 Speaker 4: know he liked to go home as he had a 875 00:44:28,996 --> 00:44:34,436 Speaker 4: wonderful wife and dinner and you know, but he wanted 876 00:44:34,436 --> 00:44:37,716 Speaker 4: to and he came up. We had so much fun 877 00:44:37,836 --> 00:44:41,556 Speaker 4: drinking martini's. They called him the Martini. He used to 878 00:44:41,556 --> 00:44:45,236 Speaker 4: make these very lethal martinis. And I remember him coming 879 00:44:45,276 --> 00:44:47,716 Speaker 4: down in his pajamas one night we stayed up and 880 00:44:47,756 --> 00:44:49,076 Speaker 4: he had gone to bed, and he came down in 881 00:44:49,116 --> 00:44:52,356 Speaker 4: his pajamas with his Martini glass and to get some 882 00:44:52,396 --> 00:44:53,636 Speaker 4: water from the. 883 00:44:53,596 --> 00:44:57,596 Speaker 2: Cooler in his Martino and then I remember him and 884 00:44:57,676 --> 00:45:01,516 Speaker 2: his like his robe going up the stairs. It was cute. 885 00:45:01,956 --> 00:45:03,196 Speaker 2: It was like such a. 886 00:45:03,116 --> 00:45:04,836 Speaker 3: Fun time so he could hang. 887 00:45:05,276 --> 00:45:08,316 Speaker 2: Oh he hung Yeah, he he just didn't want to 888 00:45:08,356 --> 00:45:09,796 Speaker 2: make the work late. 889 00:45:09,996 --> 00:45:13,556 Speaker 3: You know, what do you think about that? The older 890 00:45:13,556 --> 00:45:16,036 Speaker 3: I get, I start to think, you know, nothing good 891 00:45:16,036 --> 00:45:17,276 Speaker 3: happens after eight hours. 892 00:45:17,436 --> 00:45:19,516 Speaker 4: Oh that's how I work now. But I'm also on 893 00:45:19,596 --> 00:45:23,756 Speaker 4: a different schedule. But yeah, absolutely, I just want to 894 00:45:23,356 --> 00:45:25,756 Speaker 4: eat dinner and like turn my brain. 895 00:45:25,516 --> 00:45:28,476 Speaker 2: Off after a five I don't want to. I don't 896 00:45:28,476 --> 00:45:28,756 Speaker 2: want to. 897 00:45:29,636 --> 00:45:33,916 Speaker 3: I've ruined records by staying up for thirty six hours. 898 00:45:34,676 --> 00:45:37,876 Speaker 3: Oh yeah, yeah, you know. I mean, thankfully you get 899 00:45:37,916 --> 00:45:40,516 Speaker 3: some sleep and then you catch it the next day. 900 00:45:39,636 --> 00:45:42,436 Speaker 3: I've ruined records. I would say, I've wasted a lot 901 00:45:42,476 --> 00:45:45,516 Speaker 3: of time going down. Yeah, when pro tools first came out, 902 00:45:45,556 --> 00:45:47,876 Speaker 3: all the plugins you can go down, the plug in the. 903 00:45:47,916 --> 00:45:49,036 Speaker 2: Abyss and the. 904 00:45:50,636 --> 00:45:54,636 Speaker 4: Tracks unlimited. It's not always a good thing. I did 905 00:45:54,636 --> 00:45:58,116 Speaker 4: get some really good late night after a long dinner 906 00:45:58,156 --> 00:46:01,996 Speaker 4: and a few drinks takes though, and sometimes that works out. 907 00:46:02,676 --> 00:46:05,076 Speaker 4: But I never was somebody who did more than three 908 00:46:05,196 --> 00:46:07,156 Speaker 4: or four takes of a song. Maybe there was an 909 00:46:07,156 --> 00:46:10,636 Speaker 4: occasional like five or six takes, but but that was it. 910 00:46:10,716 --> 00:46:14,796 Speaker 4: There was never we never beat anything into the ground. 911 00:46:15,076 --> 00:46:15,356 Speaker 8: You know. 912 00:46:15,516 --> 00:46:15,956 Speaker 3: That's good. 913 00:46:16,476 --> 00:46:18,516 Speaker 4: So that late night kind of thing works if you're 914 00:46:18,556 --> 00:46:20,196 Speaker 4: just sort of having fun and playing music. 915 00:46:21,796 --> 00:46:23,996 Speaker 1: We'll be right back with more from nor Jones after 916 00:46:23,996 --> 00:46:29,916 Speaker 1: the break, We're back with the rest of nord Jones's 917 00:46:29,956 --> 00:46:33,156 Speaker 1: conversation with down was and me. Can I ask you 918 00:46:33,196 --> 00:46:37,556 Speaker 1: about it? We're talking about the second record I don't 919 00:46:37,556 --> 00:46:38,236 Speaker 1: miss you at all. 920 00:46:38,476 --> 00:46:38,636 Speaker 2: Oh. 921 00:46:38,716 --> 00:46:43,956 Speaker 1: Yeah, it's so interesting that that's you wrote the lyrics over. 922 00:46:44,556 --> 00:46:47,516 Speaker 1: It's a Duke Ellington composition and you wrote the lyrics. 923 00:46:47,916 --> 00:46:51,076 Speaker 1: Was that something that you'd done before and did did you? 924 00:46:51,716 --> 00:46:53,876 Speaker 1: How did you find Melancholia by Duke Ellington? 925 00:46:53,916 --> 00:46:55,556 Speaker 2: Oh? I think my boyfriend was playing it. 926 00:46:55,556 --> 00:47:00,516 Speaker 4: It's such an amazing album, so beautiful, and that. 927 00:47:00,556 --> 00:47:03,876 Speaker 2: Song is just I mean, it was just. 928 00:47:03,316 --> 00:47:05,796 Speaker 4: So good that I think I was just like trying 929 00:47:05,836 --> 00:47:08,436 Speaker 4: to learn it and I just started singing and it 930 00:47:08,516 --> 00:47:11,956 Speaker 4: just kind of happened and by chance, and then I 931 00:47:11,996 --> 00:47:14,036 Speaker 4: was like, maybe I'll try to record this, and then 932 00:47:14,196 --> 00:47:17,396 Speaker 4: we did and it was so pretty and I was like, 933 00:47:17,516 --> 00:47:19,076 Speaker 4: I don't know if we're going to get permission to 934 00:47:19,236 --> 00:47:22,276 Speaker 4: do it like this, because I'm not trying to take 935 00:47:22,316 --> 00:47:24,796 Speaker 4: advantage of this song or anything. I just really loved 936 00:47:24,836 --> 00:47:28,396 Speaker 4: it and just it just, you know, happened, and luckily 937 00:47:28,476 --> 00:47:29,476 Speaker 4: we got to do it. 938 00:47:29,036 --> 00:47:30,236 Speaker 3: It's beautiful too. 939 00:47:30,276 --> 00:47:32,636 Speaker 1: It's in the spirit of, you know, like how many 940 00:47:32,716 --> 00:47:38,276 Speaker 1: great songs compositions, you know, did a songwriter come in 941 00:47:38,356 --> 00:47:40,836 Speaker 1: later and write, you know, a beautiful set of lyrics 942 00:47:40,836 --> 00:47:42,916 Speaker 1: to you know, And so it's totally not at all 943 00:47:42,956 --> 00:47:46,236 Speaker 1: taking advantage and it's it's funny though. It's hard not 944 00:47:46,316 --> 00:47:49,436 Speaker 1: to hear the duke, not to hear even just the 945 00:47:49,436 --> 00:47:51,716 Speaker 1: way you play it now, you know it just it's 946 00:47:51,796 --> 00:47:55,036 Speaker 1: kind of sounds like Anora Anora song. 947 00:47:56,196 --> 00:47:58,516 Speaker 2: I mean, it's a beautiful, beautiful melody. 948 00:47:59,156 --> 00:47:59,876 Speaker 1: It's gorgeous. 949 00:48:00,036 --> 00:48:06,116 Speaker 3: Yeah, did you start doing that second album before the Grammys? No? 950 00:48:06,916 --> 00:48:08,916 Speaker 4: So this is all after No, we were just on 951 00:48:09,236 --> 00:48:13,356 Speaker 4: tour for NonStop. We were, and then after the Grammys 952 00:48:13,396 --> 00:48:16,876 Speaker 4: we did like a huge tour of bigger venues. Right, 953 00:48:16,916 --> 00:48:18,756 Speaker 4: so we were on tour for at least two years. 954 00:48:18,756 --> 00:48:22,276 Speaker 4: I feel like and doing promo and like I was exhausted. 955 00:48:22,996 --> 00:48:26,076 Speaker 4: I was not having fun the whole time. 956 00:48:27,036 --> 00:48:29,356 Speaker 3: It's a whole lot to deal with. Yeah, I went 957 00:48:29,396 --> 00:48:31,956 Speaker 3: through it a little bit with Bonnie, but I wasn't 958 00:48:31,996 --> 00:48:37,716 Speaker 3: the artist just to I went from like not, I 959 00:48:37,836 --> 00:48:40,476 Speaker 3: went from being a pariah as a record producer to 960 00:48:40,716 --> 00:48:43,836 Speaker 3: being in demand and I feel sort of like, even now, 961 00:48:44,236 --> 00:48:47,796 Speaker 3: thirty five forty years later, I'm still kind of surfing 962 00:48:48,476 --> 00:48:52,316 Speaker 3: that wave a little bit. It changed one one night, 963 00:48:52,676 --> 00:48:57,156 Speaker 3: can like change your whole reality. But had you had 964 00:48:57,156 --> 00:49:00,356 Speaker 3: a year? I had a year of incredible trajectory. 965 00:49:00,436 --> 00:49:02,916 Speaker 2: Yeah, but then the Grammys just like was insane. 966 00:49:03,196 --> 00:49:03,676 Speaker 3: Yeah. 967 00:49:03,796 --> 00:49:06,676 Speaker 4: So, and then the next day my picture was on 968 00:49:06,716 --> 00:49:09,796 Speaker 4: the cover of the New York Post next to Saddam 969 00:49:09,876 --> 00:49:12,956 Speaker 4: Hussein's picture. It said hunt and Destroy, and then it 970 00:49:12,996 --> 00:49:14,716 Speaker 4: was like a split screen, you know, it was like 971 00:49:14,796 --> 00:49:17,916 Speaker 4: me and Saddam, and then on on the Daily News, 972 00:49:18,596 --> 00:49:20,356 Speaker 4: and then then the New York Post the next day 973 00:49:20,356 --> 00:49:22,436 Speaker 4: had a picture of my apartment and it said how 974 00:49:22,516 --> 00:49:24,916 Speaker 4: much rent I paid? And then I couldn't go home again, 975 00:49:25,036 --> 00:49:26,236 Speaker 4: and it was just weird. 976 00:49:26,796 --> 00:49:27,676 Speaker 3: How'd you deal with it? 977 00:49:29,876 --> 00:49:34,196 Speaker 4: I drank a lot, yeah I did, But I also 978 00:49:34,276 --> 00:49:36,316 Speaker 4: had I had my band. We were having fun. 979 00:49:37,076 --> 00:49:37,836 Speaker 2: There was also a. 980 00:49:37,756 --> 00:49:40,276 Speaker 4: Weird thing that was happening because my dad and I 981 00:49:40,356 --> 00:49:43,996 Speaker 4: had been reunited when I was eighteen, and we started 982 00:49:44,036 --> 00:49:47,156 Speaker 4: to really find our relationship and it was great and 983 00:49:47,196 --> 00:49:49,116 Speaker 4: it was really nice to have that. And I got 984 00:49:49,116 --> 00:49:52,556 Speaker 4: to know my sister finally, my half sister Anyushka Shankar 985 00:49:52,716 --> 00:49:55,916 Speaker 4: and I did kind of finally get to know my 986 00:49:55,996 --> 00:49:58,876 Speaker 4: Indian side a little bit, you know, which was a 987 00:49:58,956 --> 00:50:03,196 Speaker 4: really beautiful new thing for me. And then all the 988 00:50:03,276 --> 00:50:06,276 Speaker 4: stuff that happened with the record and the way they 989 00:50:06,316 --> 00:50:08,996 Speaker 4: talked about my dad or it was never quite right 990 00:50:09,316 --> 00:50:10,956 Speaker 4: and somebody was always. 991 00:50:10,596 --> 00:50:14,036 Speaker 1: Mad, you know, like someone within your family. 992 00:50:14,116 --> 00:50:16,436 Speaker 4: Yeah, like either my mom felt like it wasn't represented 993 00:50:16,516 --> 00:50:18,956 Speaker 4: right or my dad did, or you know, like it 994 00:50:18,996 --> 00:50:22,116 Speaker 4: was just kind of that was actually a really hard 995 00:50:22,156 --> 00:50:23,316 Speaker 4: thing for me to be honest. 996 00:50:23,476 --> 00:50:28,076 Speaker 3: You know, when people ask me about you, a lovely person, 997 00:50:28,356 --> 00:50:33,196 Speaker 3: super talented, best singer in the world. But I also say, 998 00:50:33,316 --> 00:50:36,196 Speaker 3: if they press for more details, I think you're the 999 00:50:36,356 --> 00:50:43,276 Speaker 3: sanest artist I know because I don't think you're trying 1000 00:50:43,356 --> 00:50:50,636 Speaker 3: to fill some huge hole in your soul by in 1001 00:50:50,636 --> 00:50:54,436 Speaker 3: a quest for fame. I think you do music for 1002 00:50:54,476 --> 00:50:57,836 Speaker 3: all the right reasons, and if you can't do it 1003 00:50:57,876 --> 00:51:00,036 Speaker 3: for the right reasons, you'd walk away. I don't see 1004 00:51:00,036 --> 00:51:06,996 Speaker 3: you sitting up strategizing about marketing or the brand late 1005 00:51:07,076 --> 00:51:09,476 Speaker 3: at night or anything. Can you relate to that? 1006 00:51:09,876 --> 00:51:12,156 Speaker 4: Yeah, I don't think I think about it that way. 1007 00:51:12,236 --> 00:51:16,076 Speaker 4: But I think also because the first record was so bananas. 1008 00:51:16,836 --> 00:51:18,956 Speaker 4: I don't have to and I know that I don't 1009 00:51:19,036 --> 00:51:22,716 Speaker 4: quite want that. Again, I don't like this new record 1010 00:51:22,716 --> 00:51:25,836 Speaker 4: I'm so excited about and it's like, you know, I 1011 00:51:25,876 --> 00:51:27,836 Speaker 4: want people to hear it. I don't want it to 1012 00:51:27,916 --> 00:51:31,476 Speaker 4: just go unnoticed. But I don't think I would want 1013 00:51:31,836 --> 00:51:33,996 Speaker 4: it to be like my first record ever. 1014 00:51:34,076 --> 00:51:37,676 Speaker 2: Again, that was just too much. It was also really nice, 1015 00:51:38,836 --> 00:51:40,316 Speaker 2: but it was just like. 1016 00:51:44,276 --> 00:51:47,996 Speaker 4: H and with social media now, it's just like you 1017 00:51:48,036 --> 00:51:50,276 Speaker 4: don't want to you don't want to get all in that, 1018 00:51:51,276 --> 00:51:52,436 Speaker 4: you don't want to get too deep in. 1019 00:51:53,156 --> 00:51:57,756 Speaker 3: How long did it take to find a stable ground 1020 00:51:57,796 --> 00:52:00,356 Speaker 3: after all that, to think this is this is where 1021 00:52:00,356 --> 00:52:01,956 Speaker 3: I land, this is who I am, this is what 1022 00:52:01,996 --> 00:52:03,996 Speaker 3: I'm willing to do, this is what I'm not willing 1023 00:52:04,076 --> 00:52:04,356 Speaker 3: to do. 1024 00:52:04,876 --> 00:52:05,356 Speaker 2: I don't know. 1025 00:52:05,996 --> 00:52:08,116 Speaker 4: I think I found it quickly in a lot of ways, 1026 00:52:08,156 --> 00:52:11,076 Speaker 4: and it took a long time in other ways. I 1027 00:52:11,076 --> 00:52:13,796 Speaker 4: think I was very stubborn, so I definitely got comfortable 1028 00:52:13,836 --> 00:52:17,756 Speaker 4: with saying no. But I also was excited to try everything, 1029 00:52:17,996 --> 00:52:20,276 Speaker 4: you know, like sample everything that was put in front 1030 00:52:20,316 --> 00:52:20,476 Speaker 4: of me. 1031 00:52:20,676 --> 00:52:20,996 Speaker 2: I was. 1032 00:52:21,796 --> 00:52:23,956 Speaker 4: I got to play with all kinds of people, and 1033 00:52:24,116 --> 00:52:25,236 Speaker 4: you know, it was amazing. 1034 00:52:25,836 --> 00:52:31,316 Speaker 1: Was the stubbornness, you having boundaries and knowing your boundaries, 1035 00:52:31,436 --> 00:52:36,996 Speaker 1: or was your stubbornness was it more of a youthful both? 1036 00:52:37,996 --> 00:52:38,636 Speaker 2: Probably both. 1037 00:52:38,676 --> 00:52:41,156 Speaker 4: My mom is a very strong woman, and I learned 1038 00:52:41,196 --> 00:52:44,916 Speaker 4: a lot about that and how to be like that. 1039 00:52:46,396 --> 00:52:49,316 Speaker 2: In the best way. But I also think I was 1040 00:52:49,396 --> 00:52:50,916 Speaker 2: just young and extra. 1041 00:52:50,956 --> 00:52:52,316 Speaker 1: Mom was a concert promoter. 1042 00:52:52,676 --> 00:52:55,916 Speaker 4: That's how she met my dad. She wasn't when I 1043 00:52:55,956 --> 00:52:57,636 Speaker 4: was born. I don't think she was anymore. 1044 00:52:57,676 --> 00:53:00,316 Speaker 1: But I've been that at any point. To be a 1045 00:53:00,356 --> 00:53:03,436 Speaker 1: woman in that era doing any amount of concert promoting 1046 00:53:03,516 --> 00:53:06,316 Speaker 1: for endy amount of time, I imagine, Yeah, she learned 1047 00:53:06,316 --> 00:53:07,876 Speaker 1: how to throw a weight around, you know. 1048 00:53:08,076 --> 00:53:10,116 Speaker 2: I mean, have you met my mom. Yeah, she's a 1049 00:53:10,116 --> 00:53:13,996 Speaker 2: strong woman. I mean she doesn't she You might be 1050 00:53:14,036 --> 00:53:15,636 Speaker 2: intimidated by her. And you're tall. 1051 00:53:15,796 --> 00:53:19,036 Speaker 4: She's tall, you know, Like I was just like a 1052 00:53:19,076 --> 00:53:22,636 Speaker 4: strong tall lady. So and I'm short, but I still 1053 00:53:22,636 --> 00:53:23,676 Speaker 4: have some of her spirit. 1054 00:53:24,476 --> 00:53:25,116 Speaker 2: I think I was. 1055 00:53:25,996 --> 00:53:28,596 Speaker 4: I think I was just very rigid in what I 1056 00:53:28,596 --> 00:53:31,796 Speaker 4: didn't want, you know. I remember early on the label 1057 00:53:31,836 --> 00:53:33,716 Speaker 4: wanted me to do a remix I don't know why, 1058 00:53:33,796 --> 00:53:36,396 Speaker 4: to get it to pop radio or something, and I 1059 00:53:36,436 --> 00:53:37,476 Speaker 4: was like, that's ridiculous. 1060 00:53:37,556 --> 00:53:40,276 Speaker 2: That's not a musical reason. And I didn't like the remix. 1061 00:53:39,996 --> 00:53:42,916 Speaker 4: That they gave me, and so I was like no, 1062 00:53:44,316 --> 00:53:47,756 Speaker 4: and guess what, it somehow made it on pop radio anyway. 1063 00:53:49,196 --> 00:53:50,956 Speaker 2: But like now I'm. 1064 00:53:50,876 --> 00:53:53,676 Speaker 4: Into that if it's for an artistic reason, it just wasn't. 1065 00:53:53,756 --> 00:53:55,756 Speaker 4: Then it was for the wrong reason. 1066 00:53:56,236 --> 00:53:57,716 Speaker 1: I want to go back real quick, because you mentioned 1067 00:53:57,756 --> 00:53:59,716 Speaker 1: earlier writing come Away with Me. It was like the 1068 00:53:59,716 --> 00:54:00,436 Speaker 1: first song. 1069 00:54:00,436 --> 00:54:04,756 Speaker 2: You wrote after the college day, no high school. 1070 00:54:05,756 --> 00:54:07,836 Speaker 1: High school. Right in high school, I forgot that it's 1071 00:54:07,876 --> 00:54:16,036 Speaker 1: amazing a synth or it's crazy. Do you do you 1072 00:54:16,036 --> 00:54:20,196 Speaker 1: remember writing it? You remember that night, remember what inspired 1073 00:54:20,196 --> 00:54:20,956 Speaker 1: and how you felt? 1074 00:54:20,996 --> 00:54:23,316 Speaker 4: And yeah, I came home from the living room seeing 1075 00:54:23,356 --> 00:54:27,116 Speaker 4: all my friends play, and I just sat in my 1076 00:54:27,156 --> 00:54:29,356 Speaker 4: tiny little bedroom and I played the five chords I 1077 00:54:29,436 --> 00:54:31,356 Speaker 4: knew and it came out really fast. And I didn't 1078 00:54:31,396 --> 00:54:33,476 Speaker 4: have a voice recorder or anything, and we didn't have 1079 00:54:33,516 --> 00:54:37,076 Speaker 4: cell phones yet, and so I wrote it in my 1080 00:54:37,156 --> 00:54:40,236 Speaker 4: notebook and I wrote the chord changes above it. And 1081 00:54:40,356 --> 00:54:43,916 Speaker 4: being the theory nerd I had, I had taken theory 1082 00:54:43,956 --> 00:54:47,236 Speaker 4: classes since I was in second grade for some reason. 1083 00:54:47,676 --> 00:54:50,476 Speaker 4: That's this kind of piano lessons I took, so I 1084 00:54:50,516 --> 00:54:53,596 Speaker 4: know how I knew how to notate like the numbers 1085 00:54:53,636 --> 00:54:57,116 Speaker 4: of the. 1086 00:54:55,436 --> 00:54:56,556 Speaker 2: The chord, you know. 1087 00:54:56,636 --> 00:55:00,356 Speaker 4: I was like one, two, three, one, six, five three, what, 1088 00:55:00,556 --> 00:55:03,236 Speaker 4: you know, Like I nerd it out. But I and 1089 00:55:03,276 --> 00:55:05,396 Speaker 4: I did that and I went to sleep, and then 1090 00:55:05,436 --> 00:55:06,796 Speaker 4: the next morning I was like, oh my god, I 1091 00:55:06,876 --> 00:55:07,716 Speaker 4: hope I remember that. 1092 00:55:07,756 --> 00:55:08,236 Speaker 2: What was that? 1093 00:55:08,876 --> 00:55:09,036 Speaker 11: Then? 1094 00:55:09,236 --> 00:55:12,276 Speaker 4: I just was together. Yeah, I think it's a little different. 1095 00:55:12,796 --> 00:55:14,916 Speaker 4: It was a little different than what I had originally 1096 00:55:14,916 --> 00:55:16,676 Speaker 4: come up with. And I will never know. 1097 00:55:18,356 --> 00:55:20,596 Speaker 2: Because I didn't record it. I don't remember. 1098 00:55:21,356 --> 00:55:22,076 Speaker 1: It's amazing. 1099 00:55:22,676 --> 00:55:26,316 Speaker 3: One time I saw Keith Richards. He was trying to 1100 00:55:26,316 --> 00:55:28,836 Speaker 3: do the same thing, but he didn't have the theory background. Yeah, 1101 00:55:28,916 --> 00:55:32,876 Speaker 3: so he was staying at the Sunset Marquee and had 1102 00:55:32,876 --> 00:55:35,156 Speaker 3: a piano in his room. Came to his room the 1103 00:55:35,196 --> 00:55:39,716 Speaker 3: next morning and he had taped put piece of masking 1104 00:55:39,756 --> 00:55:42,796 Speaker 3: tape down with numbers like the order that you play 1105 00:55:42,836 --> 00:55:43,316 Speaker 3: the notes in. 1106 00:55:43,436 --> 00:55:47,516 Speaker 2: That's so funny, brilliant. Yeah, whatever method works for you. 1107 00:55:47,916 --> 00:55:49,396 Speaker 3: Yeah, he was able to pick it out. 1108 00:55:49,436 --> 00:55:51,076 Speaker 2: You can't forget it because you won't remember. 1109 00:55:52,956 --> 00:55:54,596 Speaker 1: That's a good segue too, to the new because I 1110 00:55:54,636 --> 00:55:59,796 Speaker 1: was thinking about McCartney writing yesterday in his sleep Keith 1111 00:55:59,916 --> 00:56:04,956 Speaker 1: Richards writing Satisfaction in his sleep and thinking about, you know, 1112 00:56:05,436 --> 00:56:07,516 Speaker 1: your new album. I don't know if it's written in 1113 00:56:07,516 --> 00:56:11,076 Speaker 1: your sleep, but you maybe it was. You did there 1114 00:56:11,116 --> 00:56:14,676 Speaker 1: are some the point between you said, dreaming and sleeping 1115 00:56:14,716 --> 00:56:15,396 Speaker 1: and being awake. 1116 00:56:15,676 --> 00:56:18,276 Speaker 4: Yeah, that that moment right when you're falling asleep. I 1117 00:56:18,316 --> 00:56:21,196 Speaker 4: had all these ideas, and I would just get up 1118 00:56:21,196 --> 00:56:23,396 Speaker 4: and like do a little quiet or try not to 1119 00:56:23,436 --> 00:56:25,196 Speaker 4: wake up my husband, or go to the bathroom and 1120 00:56:25,276 --> 00:56:27,836 Speaker 4: do a quiet little voice memo of it. 1121 00:56:27,996 --> 00:56:31,196 Speaker 1: Was that uncommon before this occurrence. 1122 00:56:30,756 --> 00:56:34,436 Speaker 4: Like that, It wasn't uncommon, but it wasn't as much. 1123 00:56:35,196 --> 00:56:37,236 Speaker 4: I think this was a lot. Maybe it was also 1124 00:56:37,356 --> 00:56:40,596 Speaker 4: kind of pandemic y times, and there was a lot 1125 00:56:40,636 --> 00:56:42,476 Speaker 4: of being awake in the middle of the night at 1126 00:56:42,516 --> 00:56:45,836 Speaker 4: that time and looking at the news and getting you know, 1127 00:56:46,076 --> 00:56:46,796 Speaker 4: feeling weird. 1128 00:56:46,876 --> 00:56:53,236 Speaker 3: And I don't know, yeah, that was like this new album. 1129 00:56:53,716 --> 00:56:56,236 Speaker 3: Did you feel it's time for me to make a 1130 00:56:56,276 --> 00:56:58,396 Speaker 3: new album? Because you didn't have songs? Really right? 1131 00:56:58,556 --> 00:56:59,076 Speaker 2: Not really? 1132 00:56:59,196 --> 00:57:01,756 Speaker 4: I think I think it really came from working with 1133 00:57:01,876 --> 00:57:05,876 Speaker 4: Leon Michaels. I did a song with him, Can you 1134 00:57:05,916 --> 00:57:10,716 Speaker 4: believe this song? Because we had worked together. He played horn, 1135 00:57:10,956 --> 00:57:12,836 Speaker 4: he played saxophone on a few of my albums, and 1136 00:57:12,836 --> 00:57:16,436 Speaker 4: then we did the song together because I knew he's 1137 00:57:16,436 --> 00:57:18,316 Speaker 4: a producer and I wanted to put out singles. 1138 00:57:18,316 --> 00:57:18,516 Speaker 3: You know. 1139 00:57:18,556 --> 00:57:19,956 Speaker 4: That's like what I've been trying to do the last 1140 00:57:19,956 --> 00:57:22,836 Speaker 4: few years, just sort of not overthink things and try 1141 00:57:22,876 --> 00:57:25,956 Speaker 4: to work with people, low commitment, just one song, you know, 1142 00:57:27,596 --> 00:57:29,156 Speaker 4: And it was fun. And then we ended up making 1143 00:57:29,156 --> 00:57:31,596 Speaker 4: a Christmas album together and that was really fun. 1144 00:57:31,636 --> 00:57:33,316 Speaker 1: You did a lot of tracks from that too. 1145 00:57:33,556 --> 00:57:36,796 Speaker 4: Yeah, And then when it was done, I said, I 1146 00:57:36,876 --> 00:57:40,716 Speaker 4: miss I miss working together. Should we try to make 1147 00:57:40,756 --> 00:57:43,316 Speaker 4: a real album where there's no like rules and no 1148 00:57:43,556 --> 00:57:47,756 Speaker 4: Christmas parameters? And so that's what we decided to do. 1149 00:57:48,316 --> 00:57:51,076 Speaker 4: We just got together whenever we could. This album was 1150 00:57:51,116 --> 00:57:54,196 Speaker 4: different for me and that it was sort of pieced 1151 00:57:54,236 --> 00:57:55,716 Speaker 4: together whenever we were around. 1152 00:57:56,156 --> 00:57:58,236 Speaker 2: So it wasn't like. 1153 00:57:58,196 --> 00:57:59,996 Speaker 4: When I made the album with Danger Mouse. I didn't 1154 00:57:59,996 --> 00:58:01,836 Speaker 4: have any material, but we went into the studio for 1155 00:58:01,876 --> 00:58:04,916 Speaker 4: two months together to do it and come up with it. 1156 00:58:05,116 --> 00:58:07,996 Speaker 4: This was just here and there and dribs and drabs 1157 00:58:08,036 --> 00:58:11,196 Speaker 4: and all always short days because our kids were in 1158 00:58:11,276 --> 00:58:16,036 Speaker 4: school and just you know, eleven to two and all right, cool, 1159 00:58:16,476 --> 00:58:18,756 Speaker 4: I'll try to come up with some lyrics for that, 1160 00:58:18,876 --> 00:58:22,156 Speaker 4: you know, And it was so fun. He would play 1161 00:58:22,236 --> 00:58:24,236 Speaker 4: drums and I would play piano and we would just 1162 00:58:24,316 --> 00:58:25,836 Speaker 4: play and it just felt so good. 1163 00:58:26,476 --> 00:58:29,156 Speaker 1: Yeah, Reef might have thrived in this eleven to two. 1164 00:58:30,596 --> 00:58:32,596 Speaker 2: Yeah, talk about a work day. 1165 00:58:33,276 --> 00:58:35,476 Speaker 4: It was kind of great. I kind of loved it 1166 00:58:35,996 --> 00:58:38,196 Speaker 4: because he has his own studio. There was no like booking. 1167 00:58:38,316 --> 00:58:40,436 Speaker 4: It was just like, hey, what day next week works 1168 00:58:40,436 --> 00:58:40,716 Speaker 4: for you? 1169 00:58:41,356 --> 00:58:45,076 Speaker 2: Tuesday? Can we squeeze in two days Tuesday and Thursday? Okay? Cool? 1170 00:58:45,916 --> 00:58:48,836 Speaker 3: Yeah, it's still fun to make records. 1171 00:58:48,956 --> 00:58:52,076 Speaker 4: It was so fun, and I think from the minute 1172 00:58:52,076 --> 00:58:55,116 Speaker 4: we played. I remember when we did Can you Believe? 1173 00:58:55,436 --> 00:58:58,236 Speaker 4: It was just one of the funnest times I've had 1174 00:58:58,276 --> 00:59:01,156 Speaker 4: playing because it was sort of that time after the 1175 00:59:01,196 --> 00:59:03,796 Speaker 4: pandemic where I hadn't played with anyone in a year 1176 00:59:03,836 --> 00:59:06,116 Speaker 4: and a half and I don't think he had either, 1177 00:59:07,316 --> 00:59:10,116 Speaker 4: And it was just like that feeling when you're playing 1178 00:59:10,156 --> 00:59:11,156 Speaker 4: something and then you stop me. 1179 00:59:11,196 --> 00:59:13,716 Speaker 2: He's like, oh, yes, that feels so good. 1180 00:59:13,796 --> 00:59:13,996 Speaker 1: You know. 1181 00:59:14,076 --> 00:59:16,436 Speaker 2: It's just like it's like you're back in college or 1182 00:59:16,516 --> 00:59:17,516 Speaker 2: high school or something. 1183 00:59:17,716 --> 00:59:20,356 Speaker 3: So do you get that when you're playing live? 1184 00:59:21,196 --> 00:59:21,436 Speaker 2: Yeah? 1185 00:59:21,516 --> 00:59:24,756 Speaker 4: I mean you try to you don't always, but I 1186 00:59:24,756 --> 00:59:27,076 Speaker 4: think that's the goal, and I think playing with people 1187 00:59:27,116 --> 00:59:29,316 Speaker 4: who make you feel that way is the best way. 1188 00:59:30,396 --> 00:59:32,396 Speaker 4: I definitely feel like that when I play with Brian 1189 00:59:32,476 --> 00:59:33,556 Speaker 4: Blade on drums. 1190 00:59:33,636 --> 00:59:35,156 Speaker 3: Oh, let's talk about Brian. 1191 00:59:35,316 --> 00:59:35,556 Speaker 2: Yeah. 1192 00:59:35,636 --> 00:59:38,036 Speaker 3: I mean, he was on those first sessions with Craig. 1193 00:59:37,916 --> 00:59:39,996 Speaker 2: And he is a blue note artist, and he's a blue. 1194 00:59:39,756 --> 00:59:44,076 Speaker 3: Note artist, and he's had a bunch of great blue 1195 00:59:44,116 --> 00:59:48,476 Speaker 3: note records too. He's on Charles Lloyd's new album. He 1196 00:59:48,916 --> 00:59:51,396 Speaker 3: did those records with Wayne. We've got another one coming 1197 00:59:51,476 --> 00:59:51,796 Speaker 3: this year. 1198 00:59:52,316 --> 00:59:55,916 Speaker 2: Nice. No one plays like him, no, nobody, But I've. 1199 00:59:55,796 --> 00:59:57,436 Speaker 3: Never played with him. What's that like? 1200 00:59:58,276 --> 00:59:58,596 Speaker 2: Heaven? 1201 00:59:59,396 --> 01:00:04,996 Speaker 4: He doesn't play anything just to play it. He's always listening, 1202 01:00:05,196 --> 01:00:07,876 Speaker 4: and he listens more than anyone I've ever played with. 1203 01:00:08,676 --> 01:00:10,836 Speaker 4: And he's a he's reacting in the moment to it 1204 01:00:10,916 --> 01:00:14,396 Speaker 4: in a way where you know, the music just feels 1205 01:00:14,396 --> 01:00:18,116 Speaker 4: so alive. But he's never reacting in a like a 1206 01:00:18,156 --> 01:00:23,076 Speaker 4: bullshit way. It's never wrong and it's never distracting or 1207 01:00:23,956 --> 01:00:26,476 Speaker 4: or or busy. 1208 01:00:26,636 --> 01:00:30,356 Speaker 1: So it's never to assert himself no I'm here. 1209 01:00:30,516 --> 01:00:33,516 Speaker 4: No, it's never for the wrong reasons. And his pocket 1210 01:00:33,556 --> 01:00:35,756 Speaker 4: is also super deep, like his groove. 1211 01:00:35,556 --> 01:00:36,076 Speaker 2: Is so good. 1212 01:00:36,236 --> 01:00:38,556 Speaker 3: Yeah, and his dynamics. 1213 01:00:38,996 --> 01:00:41,716 Speaker 2: Really quiet yeah. 1214 01:00:40,796 --> 01:00:42,476 Speaker 3: And then explodes. Yeah. 1215 01:00:42,556 --> 01:00:44,796 Speaker 2: Yeah, he's he's like a sound person's nightmare. 1216 01:00:44,836 --> 01:00:48,076 Speaker 4: But also it's a dream to watch him. 1217 01:00:48,116 --> 01:00:51,636 Speaker 3: So when I saw you play with Wayne and Brian 1218 01:00:52,156 --> 01:00:54,796 Speaker 3: and there's Patatucci and there's Jason Moran. 1219 01:00:55,476 --> 01:00:58,196 Speaker 2: Oh yeah, the Blue Note Anniversary, right. 1220 01:00:58,476 --> 01:01:01,116 Speaker 3: That was I was. I was sitting on the side 1221 01:01:01,116 --> 01:01:08,076 Speaker 3: of the stage and I just remembered like I felt 1222 01:01:08,076 --> 01:01:13,116 Speaker 3: like I was experiencing some kind of cosmic truth and 1223 01:01:13,476 --> 01:01:17,596 Speaker 3: I wasn't tripping. This is like I got a little 1224 01:01:17,596 --> 01:01:20,676 Speaker 3: scared because it was like hyper real the things you 1225 01:01:20,716 --> 01:01:23,436 Speaker 3: guys were doing, And how'd you feel about that? 1226 01:01:24,516 --> 01:01:27,236 Speaker 4: That was amazing. I also it was the first time 1227 01:01:27,276 --> 01:01:28,996 Speaker 4: I played with Brian in a long time. I hadn't 1228 01:01:28,996 --> 01:01:30,596 Speaker 4: actually seen him in a while. He played on my 1229 01:01:30,636 --> 01:01:34,116 Speaker 4: first two records, but we sort of drifted and he's 1230 01:01:34,156 --> 01:01:37,396 Speaker 4: hard to pin down. He's always so busy. I definitely 1231 01:01:37,756 --> 01:01:39,396 Speaker 4: hadn't talked to him, and I hadn't seen him in 1232 01:01:39,396 --> 01:01:42,716 Speaker 4: a long long time, like years, and I hadn't played 1233 01:01:42,756 --> 01:01:47,316 Speaker 4: with him, and so and to play with Wayne again. 1234 01:01:47,396 --> 01:01:49,556 Speaker 4: I think I had already played with Wayne and Herbie 1235 01:01:49,596 --> 01:01:53,076 Speaker 4: on a Jony thing, but to play with Wayne and 1236 01:01:53,116 --> 01:01:58,476 Speaker 4: Brian together and then Patatucci and then Jason Ran and 1237 01:01:58,556 --> 01:02:01,476 Speaker 4: Jason I think organized it. 1238 01:02:01,476 --> 01:02:02,276 Speaker 2: It was so fun. 1239 01:02:02,396 --> 01:02:04,276 Speaker 4: I did feel a little naked because I wasn't playing, 1240 01:02:04,316 --> 01:02:06,436 Speaker 4: but I also didn't feel like I could play with 1241 01:02:06,516 --> 01:02:08,516 Speaker 4: those guys like hang with them. 1242 01:02:09,156 --> 01:02:11,356 Speaker 3: It was just so fun, and you could because you 1243 01:02:11,396 --> 01:02:12,796 Speaker 3: did well certainly there. 1244 01:02:13,436 --> 01:02:16,876 Speaker 4: I have to credit Jason Moran for that. He emailed 1245 01:02:16,916 --> 01:02:18,476 Speaker 4: me after that, He's like, you know, you should make 1246 01:02:18,476 --> 01:02:21,596 Speaker 4: a record with Wayne, or you should like record with Wayne, 1247 01:02:21,676 --> 01:02:25,756 Speaker 4: And it was so like a little push that I needed. 1248 01:02:26,556 --> 01:02:28,716 Speaker 4: I wouldn't have probably asked Wayne to play on that 1249 01:02:28,756 --> 01:02:32,796 Speaker 4: record if Jason hadn't encouraged me. And then to have 1250 01:02:32,876 --> 01:02:37,276 Speaker 4: Brian and play with him again was so special, And yeah, 1251 01:02:37,516 --> 01:02:39,236 Speaker 4: it was sweet good night. 1252 01:02:39,836 --> 01:02:42,076 Speaker 1: What was recording with Wayne? Like? 1253 01:02:44,076 --> 01:02:45,396 Speaker 2: It was? 1254 01:02:45,596 --> 01:02:47,476 Speaker 4: My friend Sarah and I were talking about it the 1255 01:02:47,516 --> 01:02:51,796 Speaker 4: other day. Actually, I was so nervous for it and 1256 01:02:51,876 --> 01:02:56,556 Speaker 4: a little underprepared. I didn't have that many songs. We 1257 01:02:56,596 --> 01:02:59,236 Speaker 4: had two days in the studio, and I knew we 1258 01:02:59,236 --> 01:03:02,796 Speaker 4: weren't gonna like do something a million times with Wayne, 1259 01:03:02,996 --> 01:03:06,676 Speaker 4: but I wasn't really sure of what was going to happen. 1260 01:03:06,716 --> 01:03:09,916 Speaker 4: And we did we did a song. We did a 1261 01:03:09,916 --> 01:03:12,476 Speaker 4: Horrace Silver song that I've recorded before, but I just 1262 01:03:12,556 --> 01:03:15,316 Speaker 4: loved and I knew he played with Horace at some point, 1263 01:03:15,396 --> 01:03:18,916 Speaker 4: and yeah, the song piece, which is just such an 1264 01:03:18,996 --> 01:03:23,436 Speaker 4: heavy song, and I don't remember if it was the 1265 01:03:23,476 --> 01:03:27,276 Speaker 4: first one we did, but well, first I went to 1266 01:03:27,316 --> 01:03:32,476 Speaker 4: Wayne's house in La and I for an afternoon and 1267 01:03:32,556 --> 01:03:35,836 Speaker 4: he just played me a bunch of stuff and talked 1268 01:03:35,836 --> 01:03:38,156 Speaker 4: about his He showed me his comic books that he 1269 01:03:38,196 --> 01:03:38,636 Speaker 4: made when. 1270 01:03:38,556 --> 01:03:39,076 Speaker 2: He was a kid. 1271 01:03:39,396 --> 01:03:44,956 Speaker 4: Did you see those? Yeah, that was an incredible day. Yeah, yep. 1272 01:03:45,036 --> 01:03:47,356 Speaker 2: He showed me the action figures, and he told me 1273 01:03:47,396 --> 01:03:51,556 Speaker 2: about watching Fox News and playing soprano sacks just angrily 1274 01:03:51,636 --> 01:03:54,276 Speaker 2: and like writing while he was watching Fox News, and like, 1275 01:03:54,636 --> 01:03:55,636 Speaker 2: I mean, that was crazy. 1276 01:03:56,876 --> 01:04:01,076 Speaker 4: It was an amazing afternoon. Yeah, he was really one 1277 01:04:01,116 --> 01:04:03,476 Speaker 4: of a kind. And so we had had that afternoon 1278 01:04:03,516 --> 01:04:06,076 Speaker 4: which was really nice. And they were playing this song 1279 01:04:06,196 --> 01:04:09,036 Speaker 4: piece and I play an intro and it's you know, 1280 01:04:09,596 --> 01:04:12,916 Speaker 4: patitude cham base, Brian on drums, Me and then Wayne 1281 01:04:12,916 --> 01:04:15,476 Speaker 4: and we're all in the same room playing the intro 1282 01:04:15,596 --> 01:04:18,836 Speaker 4: to piece and then I sang and he still hasn't 1283 01:04:18,836 --> 01:04:19,116 Speaker 4: come in. 1284 01:04:19,196 --> 01:04:19,756 Speaker 2: I'm like singing. 1285 01:04:19,796 --> 01:04:21,476 Speaker 4: I'm like, wow, he hasn't come in, but I'm just 1286 01:04:21,516 --> 01:04:23,956 Speaker 4: gonna I'm just gonna enjoy this verse and not worry 1287 01:04:23,956 --> 01:04:27,196 Speaker 4: about that. Come around in the second verse, he still 1288 01:04:27,236 --> 01:04:30,156 Speaker 4: didn't come in. I'm like, I wonder if he's enjoying this. 1289 01:04:30,236 --> 01:04:32,596 Speaker 4: But then, but I wasn't like over ruminating on it 1290 01:04:32,636 --> 01:04:34,796 Speaker 4: because it would have taken me out of it. And 1291 01:04:34,836 --> 01:04:36,556 Speaker 4: then as soon as we get to like the solo, 1292 01:04:36,636 --> 01:04:39,236 Speaker 4: I'm like, I guess maybe all solo I wasn't sure, 1293 01:04:39,236 --> 01:04:41,756 Speaker 4: and that he just burdered like he came in, and 1294 01:04:42,876 --> 01:04:44,956 Speaker 4: I think the thing I've learned, and I've noticed that 1295 01:04:44,956 --> 01:04:47,956 Speaker 4: Brian is like this as well. They don't really play 1296 01:04:48,036 --> 01:04:51,476 Speaker 4: until they have something to say. You know, there's times 1297 01:04:51,516 --> 01:04:53,716 Speaker 4: where Brian is sat out on half a tune. I'm like, 1298 01:04:54,996 --> 01:04:56,636 Speaker 4: I guess he's not gonna play, but then he comes 1299 01:04:56,676 --> 01:04:59,356 Speaker 4: in and it's like perfect interests, you know, It's like 1300 01:04:59,476 --> 01:04:59,956 Speaker 4: it's right. 1301 01:05:01,316 --> 01:05:04,236 Speaker 1: So this incredible thing about Wayne it's playing can be 1302 01:05:04,836 --> 01:05:07,396 Speaker 1: like I've been down we're talking about before. I didn't 1303 01:05:07,396 --> 01:05:09,756 Speaker 1: realize it took me a lot long time before I 1304 01:05:09,756 --> 01:05:12,716 Speaker 1: realized Wayne was playing on that rack. I mean, yeah, 1305 01:05:12,796 --> 01:05:16,156 Speaker 1: I knew the sack sounded gorgeous, and then when you 1306 01:05:16,156 --> 01:05:17,716 Speaker 1: see the card like, oh fuck that make that makes 1307 01:05:17,796 --> 01:05:19,796 Speaker 1: that makes sense? It's Wayne, but you know, he doesn't. 1308 01:05:19,996 --> 01:05:23,076 Speaker 1: He doesn't impos It's not it's like a really it's 1309 01:05:23,356 --> 01:05:27,196 Speaker 1: gorgeous and it's amazing, but it's humble and it's there's 1310 01:05:27,236 --> 01:05:28,396 Speaker 1: no reason for it to be humble. 1311 01:05:28,556 --> 01:05:29,516 Speaker 2: It's just spiritual. 1312 01:05:29,676 --> 01:05:32,516 Speaker 4: I think it was just such a spiritual practice, probably 1313 01:05:32,596 --> 01:05:35,596 Speaker 4: to him. I mean that's how he can went about it. 1314 01:05:35,636 --> 01:05:36,876 Speaker 1: Spiritual is the right word for it. 1315 01:05:36,996 --> 01:05:38,796 Speaker 2: Yeah, he's not coming in in the intro just because 1316 01:05:38,796 --> 01:05:42,036 Speaker 2: he's supposed to. He was listening. He wasn't. 1317 01:05:42,396 --> 01:05:44,156 Speaker 4: I don't even think he wasn't coming in because he 1318 01:05:44,156 --> 01:05:45,916 Speaker 4: didn't like it. I think he was just listening to 1319 01:05:45,996 --> 01:05:47,516 Speaker 4: see what it was happening. 1320 01:05:48,156 --> 01:05:50,996 Speaker 2: You know, I don't know. It's cool. That was one 1321 01:05:50,996 --> 01:05:52,396 Speaker 2: of the cooler things I've got to do. 1322 01:05:53,396 --> 01:05:57,156 Speaker 3: It's awesome and it's wonderful to really really holds up. 1323 01:05:57,196 --> 01:06:01,236 Speaker 1: Are you ever tempted to do a larger project that 1324 01:06:01,356 --> 01:06:05,876 Speaker 1: really like like that's more in the jazz idiom like 1325 01:06:05,916 --> 01:06:08,956 Speaker 1: more squarely and that like in your like jazz snob. 1326 01:06:09,636 --> 01:06:13,596 Speaker 4: You know, I'm not And I feel like that album 1327 01:06:13,876 --> 01:06:17,516 Speaker 4: sort of was that for me, but also it also 1328 01:06:17,636 --> 01:06:20,676 Speaker 4: wasn't completely all the way there either, but it was 1329 01:06:20,716 --> 01:06:22,956 Speaker 4: more than more than my first record. I'll say I 1330 01:06:23,396 --> 01:06:25,396 Speaker 4: still don't think my first record sounds like a jazz 1331 01:06:25,436 --> 01:06:30,876 Speaker 4: album to me completely, and so I think I think 1332 01:06:30,916 --> 01:06:37,036 Speaker 4: if I were bored and thinking about what can I do, 1333 01:06:37,196 --> 01:06:39,476 Speaker 4: maybe I would decide to do something like that. But 1334 01:06:39,556 --> 01:06:44,516 Speaker 4: I'm always finding other stuff that's inspiring, and if that's inspiring, 1335 01:06:44,556 --> 01:06:46,916 Speaker 4: it's because I'll find something that inspires it. I think, 1336 01:06:47,036 --> 01:06:50,036 Speaker 4: not not thinking let's do a jazz album, Let's do 1337 01:06:50,076 --> 01:06:52,916 Speaker 4: a country album, let's do you know. I just I 1338 01:06:52,916 --> 01:06:53,996 Speaker 4: guess I don't think that way. 1339 01:06:54,276 --> 01:06:59,756 Speaker 3: When you're touring, do you have room to approach a 1340 01:06:59,796 --> 01:07:03,156 Speaker 3: song with beginner's mind every night? 1341 01:07:03,516 --> 01:07:06,556 Speaker 4: Yeah, especially when I started without without the band and 1342 01:07:06,596 --> 01:07:11,116 Speaker 4: I'm just piano and entering it. I do, especially playing 1343 01:07:11,116 --> 01:07:13,356 Speaker 4: with Brian, because I know we'll just go to wherever 1344 01:07:13,396 --> 01:07:16,996 Speaker 4: it goes, and there's some arrangements we've found that way 1345 01:07:16,996 --> 01:07:19,196 Speaker 4: that we stick to a little more, and then some 1346 01:07:19,356 --> 01:07:22,916 Speaker 4: that are different. Sometimes a song is really dynamic in 1347 01:07:22,956 --> 01:07:24,356 Speaker 4: the set, and then I'll put it in the set 1348 01:07:24,396 --> 01:07:26,396 Speaker 4: the next night, thinking like, Okay, this is where the 1349 01:07:26,396 --> 01:07:28,996 Speaker 4: set will get big and it's like tiny, the song 1350 01:07:29,076 --> 01:07:30,756 Speaker 4: is tiny. I'm like, well that set was a little 1351 01:07:30,796 --> 01:07:31,916 Speaker 4: sleepy in that section. 1352 01:07:31,836 --> 01:07:35,036 Speaker 2: But I prefer it that way, not knowing. 1353 01:07:35,076 --> 01:07:37,116 Speaker 3: It's the I think it's the best thing. Man. 1354 01:07:37,436 --> 01:07:38,236 Speaker 2: I've so fun. 1355 01:07:39,276 --> 01:07:41,996 Speaker 4: Well, it's where it's where you get that feeling that 1356 01:07:41,996 --> 01:07:44,276 Speaker 4: from high school, where you're just like, oh my god, music. 1357 01:07:44,116 --> 01:07:44,996 Speaker 5: Is so fun. 1358 01:07:45,036 --> 01:07:45,276 Speaker 2: You know. 1359 01:07:46,076 --> 01:07:48,476 Speaker 3: Are you still finding new things, like just a different 1360 01:07:48,516 --> 01:07:51,956 Speaker 3: way to move your finger to a different angle or 1361 01:07:51,996 --> 01:07:55,716 Speaker 3: something that will open up a whole new universal notes. 1362 01:07:55,796 --> 01:07:56,036 Speaker 9: Yeah. 1363 01:07:56,076 --> 01:07:59,436 Speaker 4: Sometimes, and sometimes I'll use the whole piano, which I 1364 01:07:59,516 --> 01:08:01,676 Speaker 4: never used to do. I wouldn't think to go way 1365 01:08:01,716 --> 01:08:05,996 Speaker 4: low or way high. And I actually back to your 1366 01:08:06,076 --> 01:08:09,516 Speaker 4: question though, I would say about doing like a jazz am. 1367 01:08:10,596 --> 01:08:14,316 Speaker 4: I think even though I started out interpreting songs and 1368 01:08:14,436 --> 01:08:17,716 Speaker 4: I love doing it, and I think I've found a 1369 01:08:17,756 --> 01:08:21,956 Speaker 4: lot more inspiration from writing in the last few years, 1370 01:08:22,756 --> 01:08:25,876 Speaker 4: and so it's more based on what I'm writing and 1371 01:08:25,916 --> 01:08:29,596 Speaker 4: what's inspiring me in that way than trying to make 1372 01:08:29,636 --> 01:08:31,236 Speaker 4: something sound a certain way. 1373 01:08:31,836 --> 01:08:36,356 Speaker 1: I think did on your new album, which we were 1374 01:08:36,356 --> 01:08:38,796 Speaker 1: talking about before, I really love it and the joy 1375 01:08:38,796 --> 01:08:41,636 Speaker 1: you were you were explaining to making it. I feel 1376 01:08:41,636 --> 01:08:44,236 Speaker 1: like you can really hear it when you were writing 1377 01:08:44,316 --> 01:08:47,036 Speaker 1: the songs, thinking maybe like a staring at the at 1378 01:08:47,036 --> 01:08:50,676 Speaker 1: the wall or something, how it sounds on the record. 1379 01:08:50,836 --> 01:08:52,196 Speaker 1: Is that how you heard it writing it? 1380 01:08:52,316 --> 01:08:54,716 Speaker 4: That one in particular, was there's nothing to it. It's 1381 01:08:54,756 --> 01:08:56,956 Speaker 4: just him on drums and me on guitar, just like 1382 01:08:57,036 --> 01:08:59,316 Speaker 4: having the time of our lives, going as fast as 1383 01:08:59,356 --> 01:09:02,116 Speaker 4: we can. He's like, we need something fast, Let's try 1384 01:09:02,156 --> 01:09:04,116 Speaker 4: something fast. I was like, okay, and then I just 1385 01:09:04,116 --> 01:09:05,836 Speaker 4: started playing. He started playing, and we were just like 1386 01:09:05,916 --> 01:09:07,996 Speaker 4: going trying to keep up with it, and then it 1387 01:09:08,076 --> 01:09:11,276 Speaker 4: was so fun, and then we just added words and 1388 01:09:11,636 --> 01:09:15,036 Speaker 4: like harmonies and that was it. 1389 01:09:13,996 --> 01:09:15,356 Speaker 1: Sounds like nothing I've heard before. 1390 01:09:15,516 --> 01:09:17,436 Speaker 4: Yeah, I like that one a lot. That's one of 1391 01:09:17,516 --> 01:09:19,836 Speaker 4: my favorites. And it's not like anything else on the record. 1392 01:09:20,596 --> 01:09:22,596 Speaker 1: It's not it's not like anything really at all. 1393 01:09:22,636 --> 01:09:25,556 Speaker 3: I don't know's that's a hard thing to achieve, you know, 1394 01:09:25,676 --> 01:09:29,916 Speaker 3: to do something that works on a basic level, that 1395 01:09:30,076 --> 01:09:34,996 Speaker 3: makes people respond emotionally, but doesn't sound like anything else. 1396 01:09:35,156 --> 01:09:36,916 Speaker 3: I think. I think that's the highest thing you can 1397 01:09:37,276 --> 01:09:37,876 Speaker 3: aspire to. 1398 01:09:38,236 --> 01:09:41,796 Speaker 1: Is there anything from the new album you could play? Sure? 1399 01:09:41,876 --> 01:09:43,796 Speaker 1: What do you want could you do paradise? 1400 01:09:44,356 --> 01:09:47,596 Speaker 4: Oh yeah, I could try that one. I mean, we'll 1401 01:09:47,596 --> 01:09:49,676 Speaker 4: miss the drums, but you can imagine a back there. 1402 01:09:49,836 --> 01:10:02,876 Speaker 9: Yeah, well. 1403 01:10:02,756 --> 01:10:07,956 Speaker 6: Take me back to paradise. I could make the sacrifice. 1404 01:10:08,276 --> 01:10:16,796 Speaker 12: Ama to say, what else is they left to learn? 1405 01:10:17,516 --> 01:10:19,836 Speaker 5: Watching all these fires balloon? 1406 01:10:20,076 --> 01:10:30,916 Speaker 12: I'm waiting, It's true. I'll watch your fall. I try 1407 01:10:31,036 --> 01:10:35,156 Speaker 12: to stop, wait, turn for the pain. 1408 01:10:35,196 --> 01:10:37,236 Speaker 2: To pluck, and know. 1409 01:10:39,116 --> 01:10:42,636 Speaker 6: I've got to let you go again. 1410 01:10:43,276 --> 01:10:43,636 Speaker 5: Over. 1411 01:10:45,156 --> 01:10:51,796 Speaker 10: I never wanted this too d and no, it's time 1412 01:10:51,956 --> 01:10:53,076 Speaker 10: to let you go. 1413 01:10:54,636 --> 01:11:11,636 Speaker 13: A lord, find a place to come you man, I'll 1414 01:11:11,676 --> 01:11:13,756 Speaker 13: take yours and you take mine. 1415 01:11:14,076 --> 01:11:18,156 Speaker 5: I'm well again. You paid. 1416 01:11:20,436 --> 01:11:25,476 Speaker 9: Conversations beading hearts to always beading. 1417 01:11:26,036 --> 01:11:34,836 Speaker 5: I'm there, man, I'll watch you fall. 1418 01:11:36,436 --> 01:11:42,476 Speaker 12: I try to stop, time for the pain to drop, 1419 01:11:43,036 --> 01:11:43,476 Speaker 12: and know. 1420 01:11:45,316 --> 01:11:48,476 Speaker 6: I've got to let you go again. 1421 01:11:49,196 --> 01:11:54,556 Speaker 9: All I never wanted this to end. 1422 01:11:55,556 --> 01:11:55,956 Speaker 7: I know. 1423 01:11:57,476 --> 01:12:09,396 Speaker 14: It's time to let you go. 1424 01:12:19,036 --> 01:12:34,196 Speaker 7: Hell maa lolla, Lola, Lola la, lola. 1425 01:12:41,156 --> 01:12:42,316 Speaker 6: I want you for. 1426 01:12:44,156 --> 01:12:48,996 Speaker 5: I try to stop, wait, turned for the pain. 1427 01:12:49,236 --> 01:12:56,196 Speaker 6: To drop, and no, I've got to let you go again. 1428 01:12:59,196 --> 01:13:05,996 Speaker 10: And never morning this to th and no, it's trying 1429 01:13:06,116 --> 01:13:07,236 Speaker 10: to let you go. 1430 01:13:26,396 --> 01:13:28,596 Speaker 5: So high it's great. 1431 01:13:28,676 --> 01:13:30,516 Speaker 2: I didn't imagine singing that high today. 1432 01:13:31,116 --> 01:13:34,716 Speaker 3: Wow, you sound cool, And it lends a whole new 1433 01:13:34,996 --> 01:13:37,036 Speaker 3: reference point for the song, a whole different. 1434 01:13:38,436 --> 01:13:40,596 Speaker 2: Like thanks. I didn't know how that was going to go. 1435 01:13:40,876 --> 01:13:41,516 Speaker 1: You're all over. 1436 01:13:43,796 --> 01:13:46,636 Speaker 2: That's a loud piano, yeah, but it's. 1437 01:13:46,516 --> 01:13:50,036 Speaker 3: Wild how it's a great example of how it's one 1438 01:13:50,996 --> 01:13:52,756 Speaker 3: connected to the piano plane. 1439 01:13:53,316 --> 01:13:55,316 Speaker 4: Yeah, and I forgot there's some harmonies in there. I 1440 01:13:55,396 --> 01:13:58,116 Speaker 4: try to catch it with the piano, but I forgot 1441 01:13:58,116 --> 01:13:58,556 Speaker 4: some of them. 1442 01:13:58,596 --> 01:14:00,316 Speaker 2: But it was cool. Some of them worked out. 1443 01:14:00,356 --> 01:14:03,116 Speaker 3: It really reminds me of Aretha, you know, when when 1444 01:14:03,116 --> 01:14:03,916 Speaker 3: she played piano. 1445 01:14:04,516 --> 01:14:07,196 Speaker 4: Well, she's one of my favorite piano players. I think 1446 01:14:07,396 --> 01:14:09,396 Speaker 4: I didn't before I even knew that was on the 1447 01:14:09,396 --> 01:14:13,076 Speaker 4: piano and all those recordings. She's always been my favorite, 1448 01:14:13,796 --> 01:14:15,876 Speaker 4: you know, one of the best feels out there. 1449 01:14:16,276 --> 01:14:18,956 Speaker 3: We came this close to having her signed to Blue Note. 1450 01:14:18,996 --> 01:14:21,356 Speaker 3: Really yeah, And I went to Detroit a couple of 1451 01:14:21,396 --> 01:14:27,316 Speaker 3: times I'd known her, you know, and uh, and I said, 1452 01:14:27,396 --> 01:14:30,596 Speaker 3: she got to play piano. You We're just we're just 1453 01:14:30,636 --> 01:14:33,356 Speaker 3: going to do a thing like maybe you have Jerry 1454 01:14:33,436 --> 01:14:38,476 Speaker 3: Jamont playing bass and Narada playing drums, and maybe someone 1455 01:14:38,516 --> 01:14:42,396 Speaker 3: playing organ or guitarist, keeping a real basic and everything 1456 01:14:42,436 --> 01:14:44,716 Speaker 3: would stem from her piano playing. We're going to do 1457 01:14:44,756 --> 01:14:47,836 Speaker 3: it in Detroit, so she didn't have to travel, and 1458 01:14:48,876 --> 01:14:49,516 Speaker 3: she got sick. 1459 01:14:49,916 --> 01:14:51,716 Speaker 2: Ah, so she was into it. 1460 01:14:51,956 --> 01:14:55,036 Speaker 3: Yeah, she's totally. I was texted. I still have my 1461 01:14:55,116 --> 01:14:57,676 Speaker 3: text change. I believe I was texting with Resa Franklin. 1462 01:14:57,756 --> 01:15:00,396 Speaker 2: That's amazing. I wish that could happened too. 1463 01:15:00,556 --> 01:15:03,236 Speaker 1: But I'm glad you at least try. I'm glad someone 1464 01:15:03,396 --> 01:15:06,116 Speaker 1: was thinking of that about that with her. 1465 01:15:06,516 --> 01:15:10,156 Speaker 4: Yeah, I find that, you know, some your favorite artists, 1466 01:15:10,156 --> 01:15:14,836 Speaker 4: you see them grow and do all these amazing things, 1467 01:15:14,876 --> 01:15:18,396 Speaker 4: and then as they get older, it gets there. 1468 01:15:18,716 --> 01:15:21,316 Speaker 2: It's like she didn't play piano and everything anymore, and 1469 01:15:21,836 --> 01:15:25,996 Speaker 2: you miss that that basic core of like what you loved. 1470 01:15:26,156 --> 01:15:28,396 Speaker 1: You know, her plane reminds me of like when I 1471 01:15:28,396 --> 01:15:30,716 Speaker 1: hear like I can always tell like Stevie on drum, 1472 01:15:30,756 --> 01:15:33,356 Speaker 1: When Stevie plays drums, it's so unique and it matches 1473 01:15:33,396 --> 01:15:35,756 Speaker 1: almost his voice, like the way he sings man, and 1474 01:15:35,796 --> 01:15:38,716 Speaker 1: to read the same, like the just the rhythm in 1475 01:15:38,756 --> 01:15:42,796 Speaker 1: her plane matches perfectly the way she sings. 1476 01:15:43,116 --> 01:15:48,276 Speaker 2: Yeah, it's the pocket. You can't imitate that somebody. 1477 01:15:49,716 --> 01:15:52,596 Speaker 3: You can hear it's so it's so churchy and it's 1478 01:15:52,596 --> 01:15:56,876 Speaker 3: so so soulful. What do you think is the best 1479 01:15:56,916 --> 01:15:59,116 Speaker 3: written song that you've ever heard? 1480 01:15:59,436 --> 01:16:01,636 Speaker 2: I don't know a million of them? 1481 01:16:01,796 --> 01:16:04,716 Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean what what? 1482 01:16:04,716 --> 01:16:05,596 Speaker 1: What comes to mind? 1483 01:16:05,916 --> 01:16:07,636 Speaker 2: Like okay comes to mind? 1484 01:16:07,676 --> 01:16:10,636 Speaker 4: A song I always have loved is that song Heartache 1485 01:16:10,676 --> 01:16:14,716 Speaker 4: by Lowell George. And there's a version of it on 1486 01:16:14,836 --> 01:16:17,436 Speaker 4: Thanks I'll need to Hear, which is fine, but there's 1487 01:16:17,476 --> 01:16:20,556 Speaker 4: a version of it floating around there with Linda ron 1488 01:16:20,596 --> 01:16:22,556 Speaker 4: Sat like a demo of it. That is the version 1489 01:16:22,556 --> 01:16:26,756 Speaker 4: I'm thinking. And it's just a great song. And the 1490 01:16:26,796 --> 01:16:29,516 Speaker 4: way the chord structure is it kind of turns around 1491 01:16:29,596 --> 01:16:32,716 Speaker 4: and the key center changes and it's weird and it's 1492 01:16:32,756 --> 01:16:33,516 Speaker 4: just one of those songs. 1493 01:16:34,596 --> 01:16:41,716 Speaker 2: Let's see if I know it? Oh Frankie. 1494 01:16:44,436 --> 01:16:51,116 Speaker 9: Will oh No, I don't want to do that. Will 1495 01:16:51,156 --> 01:16:58,916 Speaker 9: am here love And I'm feeling no pain, but. 1496 01:16:59,036 --> 01:17:01,796 Speaker 5: I know you heartache. 1497 01:17:02,556 --> 01:17:04,356 Speaker 2: Stand in my way. 1498 01:17:06,076 --> 01:17:11,716 Speaker 9: There's no use inuition because I ain't satisfied. 1499 01:17:13,156 --> 01:17:18,276 Speaker 5: I'm fit to be missing with him you at my. 1500 01:17:18,796 --> 01:17:29,396 Speaker 9: Side, I find another place to be. I'm tired to 1501 01:17:29,516 --> 01:17:39,316 Speaker 9: being your best friend. Look too, another. 1502 01:17:40,116 --> 01:17:44,796 Speaker 2: For your companion, and when you. 1503 01:17:45,036 --> 01:18:03,076 Speaker 9: Do, my pain wail. But there's no way at all 1504 01:18:04,636 --> 01:18:12,036 Speaker 9: when I'm feeling no pain. My body ye sickly, my 1505 01:18:12,276 --> 01:18:20,036 Speaker 9: mind is insane. I call on you Hardy to come 1506 01:18:20,276 --> 01:18:25,916 Speaker 9: show me how because I can't get no lower. 1507 01:18:25,916 --> 01:18:34,756 Speaker 5: Than the whole man. I find another. 1508 01:18:34,596 --> 01:18:36,476 Speaker 6: Places to be. 1509 01:18:37,716 --> 01:18:38,636 Speaker 5: I'm tired. 1510 01:18:39,636 --> 01:18:40,116 Speaker 11: Would be. 1511 01:18:41,716 --> 01:18:44,636 Speaker 5: You besttray. 1512 01:18:47,236 --> 01:18:55,956 Speaker 9: The two another for your companion and when you. 1513 01:18:56,116 --> 01:19:13,836 Speaker 15: Do, my heart pain Willie. 1514 01:19:15,476 --> 01:19:16,236 Speaker 1: It's crazy. 1515 01:19:16,316 --> 01:19:17,396 Speaker 2: I usually played on guitar. 1516 01:19:18,156 --> 01:19:20,356 Speaker 3: Oh that's beautiful, that's really nice. 1517 01:19:20,516 --> 01:19:23,476 Speaker 4: It's a sweet one, right, But do you see how 1518 01:19:23,476 --> 01:19:24,476 Speaker 4: it changes keys? 1519 01:19:25,116 --> 01:19:29,276 Speaker 2: It's weird, like that's what's cool about it. 1520 01:19:29,276 --> 01:19:29,516 Speaker 1: It's not. 1521 01:19:29,596 --> 01:19:32,036 Speaker 11: It doesn't seem like something that was overthought, but it 1522 01:19:32,036 --> 01:19:38,196 Speaker 11: goes It starts there and then goes to the minor five, 1523 01:19:38,796 --> 01:19:41,036 Speaker 11: and then to the and then it kind of stays 1524 01:19:41,036 --> 01:19:44,036 Speaker 11: there and then that becomes the center, and then it 1525 01:19:44,116 --> 01:19:46,156 Speaker 11: goes back to the sort of bridgie chorus and it 1526 01:19:46,196 --> 01:19:48,596 Speaker 11: goes back to e flat. Anyway, Nerd, when did you 1527 01:19:48,596 --> 01:19:53,316 Speaker 11: discover that song, Nerd town I discovered it maybe probably 1528 01:19:53,356 --> 01:19:55,756 Speaker 11: around this time I was making my second record. I 1529 01:19:55,796 --> 01:19:59,836 Speaker 11: think Kevin Bright, who played on my guitar my first record, 1530 01:19:59,836 --> 01:20:03,956 Speaker 11: turned me on too Little George that album. Thanks I'll 1531 01:20:03,996 --> 01:20:04,556 Speaker 11: hate it here, and. 1532 01:20:06,636 --> 01:20:09,316 Speaker 4: Then somehow we found a bootleg of that Linda so 1533 01:20:09,476 --> 01:20:12,716 Speaker 4: in the in the demo that I love. It's low 1534 01:20:13,036 --> 01:20:16,436 Speaker 4: and Linda singing harmony on the whole chorus and it's 1535 01:20:16,516 --> 01:20:16,836 Speaker 4: just the. 1536 01:20:16,836 --> 01:20:20,236 Speaker 2: Prettiest thing ever Brook. Yeah, I just love Linda. 1537 01:20:20,396 --> 01:20:22,236 Speaker 1: Thank you so much for thank you. 1538 01:20:22,316 --> 01:20:24,716 Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, thank you so much. That was a lot 1539 01:20:24,716 --> 01:20:27,276 Speaker 3: of time and you're very forthcoming. It was beautiful. 1540 01:20:30,036 --> 01:20:33,076 Speaker 1: Thanks Norah Jones for sharing her incredible story with us. 1541 01:20:33,396 --> 01:20:35,636 Speaker 1: You can hear her new album Visions, along with our 1542 01:20:35,676 --> 01:20:38,356 Speaker 1: other favorite Nora tracks on a playlist at Broken Record 1543 01:20:38,396 --> 01:20:41,436 Speaker 1: podcast dot com. I also want to thank Don Was 1544 01:20:41,436 --> 01:20:43,636 Speaker 1: for going on this excursion with me. We have four 1545 01:20:43,676 --> 01:20:46,916 Speaker 1: more episodes coming, so stay tuned for those. You can 1546 01:20:46,956 --> 01:20:49,156 Speaker 1: also watch the full video of this interview and other 1547 01:20:49,156 --> 01:20:52,836 Speaker 1: recent episodes at YouTube dot com, slash broken Record Podcast, 1548 01:20:53,236 --> 01:20:55,316 Speaker 1: and be sure to follow us on Instagram at the 1549 01:20:55,316 --> 01:20:58,396 Speaker 1: Broken Record Pod. You can follow us on Twitter at 1550 01:20:58,516 --> 01:21:02,556 Speaker 1: broken Record. Broken Record is produced and edited by Leah Rose, 1551 01:21:02,636 --> 01:21:05,756 Speaker 1: with marketing help from Eric Sandler and Jordan McMillan. Our 1552 01:21:05,796 --> 01:21:09,556 Speaker 1: engineer is Ben Tolladay. Broken Record is a product of 1553 01:21:09,676 --> 01:21:13,036 Speaker 1: Pushkin Industries. If you love this show, and others from 1554 01:21:13,076 --> 01:21:17,396 Speaker 1: Pushkin consider subscribing to Pushkin Plus. Pushkin Plus is a 1555 01:21:17,436 --> 01:21:20,796 Speaker 1: podcast subscription that offers bonus content and ad free listening 1556 01:21:20,876 --> 01:21:24,236 Speaker 1: for four ninety nine a month. Look for Pushkin Plus 1557 01:21:24,276 --> 01:21:27,876 Speaker 1: on Apple podcast subscriptions, and if you like this show, 1558 01:21:27,996 --> 01:21:30,516 Speaker 1: please remember to share, rate, and review us on your 1559 01:21:30,556 --> 01:21:34,836 Speaker 1: podcast app. Our theme Music's back, any beats. I'm justin Richmond.