Speaker 1: I get everybody.
Speaker 2: I'm Dan Hord and thanks for downloading The Bengals Booth Podcast.
Speaker 1: The Remember When addition.
Speaker 2: As I look back at roughly twenty five years of
Speaker 2: Bengals draft history with a guy who knows the stories
Speaker 2: behind the selections, Bengals dot Com editor Jeff Butch Hobson.
Speaker 2: You'll also hear from local draft prospect Juwan Briggs out
Speaker 2: of the University of Cincinnati, who got quite the surprise
Speaker 2: this week, from Bengals team president Mike Brown, and last
Speaker 2: but not least, it's my third attempt at a three
Speaker 2: round Bengals mock draft. The Bengals Booth Podcast is brought
Speaker 2: to you by pay Corps, proud to be the Bengals
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Speaker 2: Internet designed to elevate your home, business, and community to
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Speaker 2: for the best fans. Kettering Health is the official health
Speaker 2: healthcare provider.
Speaker 1: Of the Bengals.
Speaker 2: Now here's a quick reminder that you can have the
Speaker 2: latest edition of this podcast delivered right to your phone, tablet,
Speaker 2: or computer by subscribing wherever you get your podcasts. It's
Speaker 2: the greatest thing since Zach Taylor randomly treating Bengals fans
Speaker 2: to breakfast. There was a letter to the editor last
Speaker 2: Sunday and the Cincinnati Inquirer that told the story of
Speaker 2: a couple having breakfast at a local diner who were
Speaker 2: wearing Bengals gear. When they went to the counter to pay,
Speaker 2: they were told that Zach Taylor, who was there with
Speaker 2: one of his sons, had picked up the tab. On Monday,
Speaker 2: I asked Zach if he had seen the letter and
Speaker 2: remembered the encounter.
Speaker 3: My neighbor Bart sent me that, so I was aware
Speaker 3: of that.
Speaker 4: I do know.
Speaker 3: The interaction was my son was in abast my other
Speaker 3: son was in a basketball tournament in Batavia, and so
Speaker 3: I was with my younger son, Luke, and we were
Speaker 3: just trying to find some breakfast, and so we went
Speaker 3: into the diner there and had a great time, and
Speaker 3: there was just it was smaller dinner, and there were
Speaker 3: several people wearing gear like you are right now, and
Speaker 3: it's it's fun interacting with people seeing them wear Bengals gear.
Speaker 3: So it just I just felt felt like I wanted
Speaker 3: to show my appreciation. It does lead me to, hey,
Speaker 3: if I see people wearing Bengals gear. You never know
Speaker 3: that may continue to happen. It may be something we
Speaker 3: stumbled upon there that is fun. But again, I just
Speaker 3: like being out and about in the community. I think
Speaker 3: you guys have heard me say that, and interacting with people.
Speaker 3: It's it is amazing. It's always one hundred percent positive.
Speaker 3: I know there's there's a lot of negativity in the
Speaker 3: world that can happen online all that stuff, but face
Speaker 3: to face interactions that I've had with with people in
Speaker 3: the community is one hundred percent positive and supportive and
Speaker 3: always appreciate that. Love driving down the road and just
Speaker 3: seeing people wearing Bengals gears are out jogging or walking,
Speaker 3: and so when I get a chance to go into
Speaker 3: these restaurants and see those people, it's it's it's just
Speaker 3: fun to interact with them.
Speaker 2: The moral of the story is out, if you live
Speaker 2: in the Cincinnati area and you're going out to eat
Speaker 2: where Bengals gear, your meal could be paid for by
Speaker 2: a generous and very kind Bengals head coach. Now let's
Speaker 2: get to my first guest. In the Broadway musical Hamilton,
Speaker 2: the Aaron Burr character sings about wanting to be in
Speaker 2: the room where it happens, referring to places where powerful
Speaker 2: people make important decisions. Well, when it comes to the draft,
Speaker 2: Bengals dot Com editor Jeff Hobson has been there, the
Speaker 2: so called war room where Bengals picks are discussed and
Speaker 2: ultimately made. Jeff joined me this week to discuss some
Speaker 2: key decisions in the past and what we might expect
Speaker 2: next week. Which let me start by wishing you a
Speaker 2: happy anniversary. It was twenty four years ago this week
Speaker 2: that you joined the Bengals to write for the website,
Speaker 2: and it was unheard of at the time. No team
Speaker 2: had ever hired a local beat writer who at times
Speaker 2: had been critical of coaches and ownership, et cetera, to
Speaker 2: be their website reporter.
Speaker 1: So twenty four years ago this week.
Speaker 5: Thank you for saying at times, because it was a
Speaker 5: little bit. There was a lot of.
Speaker 6: Times in the nineties when you know, a lot of
Speaker 6: things were written, and I think there were some people
Speaker 6: in the building looking at Mike like he was nuts.
Speaker 6: But I actually even told him, I said, you know, Mike,
Speaker 6: I'm not too sure, you know, I said, I you know,
Speaker 6: you might want to look for a younger person who's
Speaker 6: got a background in computers, because you know, I didn't.
Speaker 6: I didn't know anything about the you know Internet. They
Speaker 6: could barely operate my own laptop, which is, you know,
Speaker 6: best known for losing a space bad during Tim Pughes
Speaker 6: near no hitdring San Diego.
Speaker 5: So I thought that perhaps that.
Speaker 6: But he said no, He said, I want somebody that
Speaker 6: the fans know when they trust and will give them
Speaker 6: the you know, give them the information.
Speaker 5: And I always knew.
Speaker 6: The best contract in sports was a handshake with Mike
Speaker 6: Brown because a loyal guy, and if I was loyal
Speaker 6: to him, it would be Ah, I.
Speaker 5: Think it would be a it was.
Speaker 6: It was you know what I mean, it was a
Speaker 6: it was a I knew it was gonna be an
Speaker 6: honest deal. Sometimes the newspapers, you never know was gonna happen,
Speaker 6: and I knew I didn't. But I think Mike could
Speaker 6: see a little bit that uh he had he had
Speaker 6: seen what had happened to the afternoon paper. You know,
Speaker 6: I had seen what had happened in the afternoon paper.
Speaker 6: And I think we were you know, I think he
Speaker 6: kind of sense that something was happening with the Internet,
Speaker 6: and he was he was exactly right. I I like
Speaker 6: a couple of months after I joined, Mike Eisen, the
Speaker 6: Giants dot com guy called me wondering what the Cincinnati
Speaker 6: Inquirer was going to do to fill the beat job,
Speaker 6: and I told him about my job, and like he
Speaker 6: hung up the phone with me, and he called John
Speaker 6: Marra and now he's he's been over there, uh since
Speaker 6: since then too, So it's uh, you know, I I
Speaker 6: credit Mike to me. It was Mike kind of seeing
Speaker 6: ahead before a lot of us, including me, and I
Speaker 6: would It's the best decision I ever made in the business,
Speaker 6: and keep doing it for as long as I can.
Speaker 5: I'm thrilled, and I hope Mike is too.
Speaker 2: Happy anniversary. Mike was ahead of his time, and so
Speaker 2: were you. Your office here at Peykor Stadium is right
Speaker 2: around the corner from the Bengals quote unquote war room
Speaker 2: for the draft. What's going on a week before the draft?
Speaker 6: I think they're still going by positions. I think that's
Speaker 6: probably gonna finish up. If it hasn't finished up already,
Speaker 6: and we're talking Wednesday, eight days out, then it's gonna
Speaker 6: be finished up tomorrow, or it'd certainly be finished up
Speaker 6: by the time Duke meets the media on Friday, and
Speaker 6: then I think next week is reserved for stacking if
Speaker 6: they haven't already done some of that stacking the board
Speaker 6: ranking just purely ranking the players who's uh, you know,
Speaker 6: who's who they see has better than the guy blow
Speaker 6: why's better? And I think a lot of goes into that.
Speaker 6: It goes into you know, feedback and coaches. Obviously the
Speaker 6: scouts and Duke are are at the helm, and I
Speaker 6: also needs, I think, you know, needs go into it two.
Speaker 6: So I think that's what's happening right now. They're on
Speaker 6: the verge of stacking it if they haven't already.
Speaker 2: Your first draft for Bengals dot Com was two thousand,
Speaker 2: the Peter Warwick first round draft pick a draft, but
Speaker 2: the previous year you were covering the team for the
Speaker 2: Inquirer when the Bengals turned down multiple picks from the
Speaker 2: Saints and selected Akilee Smith. Of all of the topics
Speaker 2: that I have ever discussed with Mike Brown, that was
Speaker 2: probably the one he was least interested in revisiting. I
Speaker 2: guess for obvious reasons. The Bengals weren't the only team
Speaker 2: to turn down that deal. They were one of four
Speaker 2: that said no to the Saints. But do you think
Speaker 2: if the Bengals could have a mull again on just
Speaker 2: about any decision in franchise history, that would be high list.
Speaker 4: You know.
Speaker 6: It's it's interesting because Mike, as you know, is so
Speaker 6: fought right about you know, about talking about things, and
Speaker 6: I it's funny, I think because that is at the
Speaker 6: core of Mike's philosophy. I think, is how important quarterback is,
Speaker 6: you know, And I just think he.
Speaker 5: Felt like a kill. And again I think he had
Speaker 5: a I think he.
Speaker 6: Knew that Achilles Smith was at least he was kind
Speaker 6: of had the traits of the modern guy, you know,
Speaker 6: he was a very athletic guy, didn't really you know,
Speaker 6: obviously he struggled for many reasons and it was not
Speaker 6: a good pick. But I think the core is, you know,
Speaker 6: you need the quarterback. I don't need the nine guys, right.
Speaker 6: It was like nine draft picks, right, And he says,
Speaker 6: but if you get a quarterback, if you get a
Speaker 6: franchise quarterback, that's more important than nine picks. So which
Speaker 6: is at the crux? And I think that's at the
Speaker 6: crux of philosophy now. And I think it's at the
Speaker 6: crux at the philosophy of the league now because in
Speaker 6: those twenty five years it's become a it always was
Speaker 6: a quarterbacks league. It's really a quarterbacks league after Radiant
Speaker 6: Manning and the rule changes. You know, so my kind
Speaker 6: of but was you know, he could see it there too.
Speaker 6: It just didn't have the right guy. I later went
Speaker 6: back and you know who did the the nine guys
Speaker 6: who did they become well, nobody that changed the game.
Speaker 2: There was one really good player, Champ Bailey. The other
Speaker 2: guys didn't really work out for what right, Yeah, I'm
Speaker 2: talking yeah, right. Bailey was a Hall of Famer.
Speaker 6: Yeah, and uh but the other you know, uh uh
Speaker 6: And would Champ Bailey have turned around the Bengals at
Speaker 6: that point more than a good quarterback.
Speaker 5: Probably not.
Speaker 2: The Bengals turned down a lot, or at least we
Speaker 2: believe they turned down a lot. When Joe Burrows the
Speaker 2: number one overall pick, that one worked out pretty well, Joe.
Speaker 6: And that's Mike's philosophy right there, in a nutshell. And
Speaker 6: he wasn't budget he uh you know, he met the
Speaker 6: guy at the combine and his coaches loved them.
Speaker 5: It's another big piece of it.
Speaker 6: And the coaches just thought he was you know, remember
Speaker 6: Dan Pitcher then the quarterbacks coach, and that was his
Speaker 6: first That was his first assignment really as quarterbacks coach,
Speaker 6: was to go to the combine and walk Joe Burrow
Speaker 6: through about fifteen clips in their eighteen minute interview and
Speaker 6: picture now the offensive coordinator. But you know, he was
Speaker 6: great talking about how you know, he just knew when
Speaker 6: the guy never minded he had the greatest you know,
Speaker 6: he went in and everybody knew what in he had
Speaker 6: the greatest college season anybody had ever had. His accuracy,
Speaker 6: you couldn't value with it, his performance in big games,
Speaker 6: couldn't argue with it. But when you talk to him
Speaker 6: about the game and how it just seamlessly. You know,
Speaker 6: that's why I think sold everybody was. It wasn't just
Speaker 6: those eighteen minutes, but it was you know, I think
Speaker 6: I think that sealed it because they had known what
Speaker 6: they were getting, but then to see the guy up close,
Speaker 6: and I think, you know, like I said, that's that's
Speaker 6: the philosophy at work, and the Brady Manning decade did
Speaker 6: nothing but to amplify it.
Speaker 5: It is a quarterbacks league.
Speaker 2: So your second draft for Bengals dot Com was arguably
Speaker 2: the best draft in franchise history. Five time Pro bowler
Speaker 2: Justin Smith in round one, six time Pro bowler Chad
Speaker 2: Johnson in round two, the Bengals single season rushing record
Speaker 2: holder Rudy Johnson in round four. He was a pro bowler,
Speaker 2: the single season receptions record holder TJ.
Speaker 1: Hushman's ot in round seven. He was a pro bowler.
Speaker 2: Does anything stand out to you about being around the
Speaker 2: team for that two thousand and one draft.
Speaker 6: Yeah, the it started out with Mike would get back
Speaker 6: to Mike about how this guy he knows his stuff, right.
Speaker 6: I think you'll recall with just coming off the Achilles
Speaker 6: Smith thing, he wasn't the answer. They were a month
Speaker 6: out after signing John Kidnap, who was They felt like
Speaker 6: he was a guy they could fit in and they
Speaker 6: had They felt like they had a really good defense,
Speaker 6: and if you get a quarterback with their running game,
Speaker 6: I think they felt like with with you know, with
Speaker 6: Donay Scott and Peter war I think they felt like
Speaker 6: they had the weapons they had. You know, Corey was
Speaker 6: at the top of his game, Corey Dillon the running back.
Speaker 6: So I think they felt like we Kittna could couldn't
Speaker 6: manage it, could manage, you know, could could win games
Speaker 6: for them and make them contenders. And so they weren't
Speaker 6: thinking about a quarterback, but you know, Mike was. You know,
Speaker 6: if it was if Mike had his brothers at number four,
Speaker 6: they had the fourth pick, he would have taken Drew Brees,
Speaker 6: you know. And so what I remember about that draft
Speaker 6: is you remember the Bengals took Justin Smith hell of
Speaker 6: a pick, and then but as Breeze kept dropping, you know,
Speaker 6: people were getting uncomfortable because as Breeze kept getting close
Speaker 6: and closer, they knew Mike would not pass him in
Speaker 6: the second round.
Speaker 5: You know that that they knew that was not going
Speaker 5: to happen.
Speaker 6: So they were getting little you know, we get Kit
Speaker 6: and they were just signed Kitt and there we can
Speaker 6: of get hey, you know, they're not. I don't think
Speaker 6: many people were. You know, they thought that they thought
Speaker 6: the kid was too short. They thought that was kind
Speaker 6: of high form, I think, you know, going back and
Speaker 6: trying to place, but you know, the they it was high.
Speaker 6: It was regarded for Breeze in the room. But I
Speaker 6: you know, I think they felt like they had had
Speaker 6: their plan here and that he wasn't the kind of
Speaker 6: guy who was gonna make you rip it up. I
Speaker 6: think they knew that Mike would though, and as it
Speaker 6: you know.
Speaker 5: And then of.
Speaker 6: Course we know history tells us the Chadgers took breeze
Speaker 6: I think at thirty.
Speaker 5: Two perhaps, uh.
Speaker 4: And then.
Speaker 6: Three four five picks later, Chad Johnson worked worked out,
Speaker 6: worked out pretty well, you know, and then to get
Speaker 6: t J. Huschmanzada, which I'm gonna write about later in
Speaker 6: the week. You know, Bob Bratkowski making a call as
Speaker 6: to pick up closer in the seventh round, uh, making
Speaker 6: a call to uh Dennis Erickson, who was a good
Speaker 6: coach a long time with Bratt.
Speaker 4: Uh and Uh.
Speaker 6: He made a quick call because Bratt liked tushman Zada, Uh,
Speaker 6: I think on tape, but he wanted to you know,
Speaker 6: he wanted to get more from Ericsson. And I think
Speaker 6: that was what put him over the top there and
Speaker 6: that that was a good call as well.
Speaker 5: And that was a good you know, it was a.
Speaker 6: Practice had a few questions and Eric's had answered them
Speaker 6: and that's the way it should be done.
Speaker 1: And then TJ answered them in the affirmative. That's for sure.
Speaker 2: I think you can make the case that since two
Speaker 2: thousand and eight, when the Bengals drafted Andre Smith, Ray
Speaker 2: Maulaluga and Kevin Huber. They've drafted as well as just
Speaker 2: about any team in the NFL. They've landed impact players
Speaker 2: in fourteen of their last fifteen drafts.
Speaker 1: I would say only the Cedric Oboahi Jake Fisher year
Speaker 1: was the exception.
Speaker 2: Have they done anything differently since two thousand and eight
Speaker 2: or better in your opinion?
Speaker 6: Well, I mean, all you can look is at the changes.
Speaker 6: You know, Duke Toben has taken over the draft pretty much.
Speaker 6: You know, Mike still cheers the meetings, and Mike's still
Speaker 6: you know, heavily involved running the thing, but it's Duke's
Speaker 6: Duke's run in the draft room. I think that's a shift.
Speaker 6: You know, you've obviously had a change in coaches and
Speaker 6: coaching philosophy. Uh And I think probably, you know, it's
Speaker 6: probably you know, it's it's probably more the process is
Speaker 6: probably more scouting centric than than coaching centric. I think,
Speaker 6: probably than it has been in the past. But I
Speaker 6: still think the coaches are are involved here as much
Speaker 6: as they are anywhere in the league. Any Paul Brown team,
Speaker 6: Mike Brown team will make sure to that that the
Speaker 6: coaches are involved on the and on the same page.
Speaker 6: You know, I just think there's probably a little bit
Speaker 6: more directions from the scouts and you know, Duke, Duke
Speaker 6: is running the thing so with you know, with heavy
Speaker 6: input from Mike. And you know, Duke's been here a
Speaker 6: long you know, Duke's been here since I think ninety
Speaker 6: nine and I think the ninety nine draft I think
Speaker 6: was his first draft, and so he's got a good
Speaker 6: feel for the family and uh for what Mike's looking for,
Speaker 6: what the team needs, and so you get that experience too.
Speaker 5: So if there's a difference, I just think it's probably
Speaker 5: you know, Duke.
Speaker 6: Is Duke is is running it, has more of a
Speaker 6: has more of a hand with Mike now. And I
Speaker 6: think the draft rooms more streamlined too.
Speaker 5: That's a change. I think that.
Speaker 6: Probably came from COVID, but I think that's the way
Speaker 6: Duke was headed any way, to kind of cut down
Speaker 6: the people in the room a little bit. The position
Speaker 6: coaches are no longer in the when when the clock
Speaker 6: is ticking, the position.
Speaker 5: Coaches are no longer in the room. But they've had
Speaker 5: their say.
Speaker 6: I mean they've they've already had their say in the
Speaker 6: meetings leading up to it.
Speaker 5: So those are just a few of the changes.
Speaker 6: But I think, you know, you talk about the two
Speaker 6: thousand and one draft, I think that two thousand you know,
Speaker 6: the two thousand and six draft was was huge too,
Speaker 6: because those guys, I think five of those guys.
Speaker 5: Draft that played at least twelve years.
Speaker 6: You're talking about, uh, you know, Jonathan Joseph, Andrew Whitworth,
Speaker 6: Frosty Rucker, Domito Peigo, and then the supplement will picking
Speaker 6: that draft.
Speaker 5: I'm on Brooks I think played a dozen years.
Speaker 6: The other guys sort of the the other guy's played
Speaker 6: more than a dozen years. I believe that's a hell
Speaker 6: of a draft. And then any discussion the best draft
Speaker 6: in franchise history is going to be twenty twenty and
Speaker 6: twenty twenty one. You know, Burrow Higgins, Logan Wilson, top three.
Speaker 6: That's as about as impactful as you get. They might
Speaker 6: not have the awards the one people had, but certainly
Speaker 6: the impact. And then the next year you got Jamett Chase,
Speaker 6: the greatest rookie receiver of all time and Evan McPherson
Speaker 6: the greatest rookie kicker of all time.
Speaker 5: That's a pretty good draft too.
Speaker 2: The Bengals have never allowed live network TV cameras into
Speaker 2: the war room, but you've.
Speaker 7: Been in there.
Speaker 1: Is there drama? Are there knocked down dragouts?
Speaker 5: What's it like as nobody's standing on a table? You
Speaker 5: know a lot of these.
Speaker 6: Decisions have been made. Well, no, they aren't made. They're
Speaker 6: being made now. You know, like you talk, what are
Speaker 6: they doing now? They're having those exact discussions.
Speaker 5: You know, it's Mike.
Speaker 6: Is chairing it, you know, two command on the phones.
Speaker 6: It's like I said this, I think I wrote this
Speaker 6: the other day. It's like you ever watch the series.
Speaker 5: Banded Kind, you know, for all Mankind.
Speaker 6: The series about space. It's like these guys are looking
Speaker 6: at console. They're trying to they're trying to land a
Speaker 6: man on Mars, you know what I mean.
Speaker 5: It's very quiet.
Speaker 6: It's very you know, there's the word of computers or
Speaker 6: they've had these discussions.
Speaker 5: There's the board, you know, it's it's in there.
Speaker 6: As you get closer, there's discussion about yeah, this is
Speaker 6: how we thought it was gonna happen, you know, and
Speaker 6: there might be ah, you know, LOUI you like this
Speaker 6: guy right, and you know, or something like that. I mean,
Speaker 6: it's a it's pretty it's pretty made up. There's no
Speaker 6: there's no scrambling, Oh my god, we got to trade
Speaker 6: up or trade down or yeah, you know, here's our guy.
Speaker 6: And if and if you know, the board is the
Speaker 6: board is done, and that's pretty much. Yeah, it's not
Speaker 6: the you know, I hate to hate to say it,
Speaker 6: but it's.
Speaker 5: Not you know, it's not madness.
Speaker 4: You know.
Speaker 2: I think one of the lesser known significant figures in
Speaker 2: Bengals draft history was Pete Brown, Mike's brother who passed
Speaker 2: away back in twenty seventeen. Well before there was a
Speaker 2: mel Kiper or a Dane Brugler. Pete Brown was the
Speaker 2: guy who you could name anybody in the upcoming draft
Speaker 2: and he had his bio down inside and out.
Speaker 5: This guy was the ultimate personnel guy.
Speaker 6: I mean he was what a great man too, just
Speaker 6: a great guy, just a great personality. And he he knew.
Speaker 6: I mean, you know, I always thought if you gave Mike,
Speaker 6: I mean, if you gave Pete a you know, a
Speaker 6: six pack of a sprite and a Subway sandwich and
Speaker 6: just saying going to the draft and draft force to
Speaker 6: be a hell of a draft. You know, first of
Speaker 6: all the board was in his mind. He knew the way,
Speaker 6: he knew this stuff off the top of his head.
Speaker 6: He could and it was everybody. It just wasn't the
Speaker 6: top twelve prospects.
Speaker 5: It was it was. Remember Pete, uh.
Speaker 6: Did great work for this franchise back in the day
Speaker 6: with the historically black colleges, did a lot of travel.
Speaker 5: You know, he had a lot of networks.
Speaker 6: You know, he was the guy who you know, kind
Speaker 6: of got the first tip on Kenny Anderson. Uh So
Speaker 6: he just had all these all this vast network. And
Speaker 6: then as the scouting because he was basically he and
Speaker 6: Frank Smouse were the guys who were doing it. And
Speaker 6: then when the scouting staff grew, Pete kind of court.
Speaker 6: You know, Pete did coordinate the board and where everybody
Speaker 6: was going and what they were doing. And but he
Speaker 6: just he just he had this just this great knowledge
Speaker 6: of the board. He could answer any question about any guy,
Speaker 6: and very calm.
Speaker 5: He was very very calming presence.
Speaker 6: And I think, uh, obviously it was devastating for Mike
Speaker 6: to lose Pete for obviously many reasons. He was his
Speaker 6: he was his younger brother, he was the Pete was
Speaker 6: the baby you know and uh they were very close.
Speaker 6: And uh but you know when he passed and the
Speaker 6: next in and in the ensuing drafts, it was, you know,
Speaker 6: Mike had lost his you know, his right arm almost
Speaker 6: you know, uh, because Mike could look there, he could
Speaker 6: look to his right or to his left wherever Pete
Speaker 6: was sitting. And you know they were they were, they
Speaker 6: were like brothers. They they thought alike, you know, they
Speaker 6: the you know, they felt a lot alike. And and
Speaker 6: they and Pete was never afraid to speak his mind.
Speaker 6: And uh, you know what a what a resource that man,
Speaker 6: that man was, I mean he was, uh it was,
Speaker 6: uh he was the the ultimate NFL personnel guy. And
Speaker 6: as you could see when he passed, you know, everybody
Speaker 6: from Gil Gil Brandt and and and and and I
Speaker 6: remember at the UH at a super Bowl, I he
Speaker 6: he had I recently Pete had passed, and I had
Speaker 6: I knew that Belichick liked, you know, liked Pete, So
Speaker 6: I I made it a point to try and ask
Speaker 6: him a question at the Super Bowl about the passing
Speaker 6: of uh of Pete. And he was very u you know,
Speaker 6: he gave a great, great answer and uh An he
Speaker 6: made sure he called mommy, because I think I had
Speaker 6: tried to tell the Patriots people, look, I just got
Speaker 6: to get him on this topic. And so uh and
Speaker 6: which says something for what what what Pete was thought
Speaker 6: of in the game.
Speaker 1: No question about it.
Speaker 2: More recently, has the dynamic changed in the draft room
Speaker 2: from a Marvin Lewis draft to a Zach Taylor draft?
Speaker 5: You're talking about two different guys.
Speaker 6: I think the dynamic of the organization is the same,
Speaker 6: but they obviously have you know, they bring their perspectives
Speaker 6: and opinions different, you know, different, But I don't think
Speaker 6: and I'm and you know, like I said, since they're streamlined,
Speaker 6: you know, since since the room is streamlined now you
Speaker 6: only can get a sense of what's going on in there.
Speaker 6: But my, you know, my sense is that Zach's gotta
Speaker 6: got a lot to say, just like any just like
Speaker 6: all the head.
Speaker 5: Coaches or you know, for the Bengals have had in.
Speaker 6: Drafts's let's face it, it's a like I said before, it
Speaker 6: was an organization founded by a coach and that's the
Speaker 6: way things are gonna be run. So I think Zach
Speaker 6: hash you know, I think Zach's got a lot to say.
Speaker 6: I mean, he's got he's the guy with the vision
Speaker 6: of the of the roster because he's the guy that
Speaker 6: I mean, Duke has a vision. And I think that's
Speaker 6: why Zuke and Zach and Duke maybe you should call
Speaker 6: him Zuke because that they're they're they're that close to
Speaker 6: the team, you know. And I think Duke and Zach
Speaker 6: do a great job talking, uh, because you can tell
Speaker 6: that the Duke is getting his kind of guys, you know.
Speaker 6: And so I think there's that that symmetry going. And
Speaker 6: I think, you know, yeah, Zach, Zach, I think has
Speaker 6: h you know, he's he's got uh. I think Zach
Speaker 6: and Duke both have each other's confidence, which is what
Speaker 6: you have to have. I mean, you know how many
Speaker 6: you know, when you see the demise of these teams, it's, uh,
Speaker 6: where does it start? It's you know, it's uh, coaches,
Speaker 6: GM's not on the same page. But you don't get
Speaker 6: that here. But those two guys, Zuke, Zeke, I guess
Speaker 6: or whatever. I don't know, but those are those guys
Speaker 6: are a good team.
Speaker 2: In the twenty twenty draft, everybody they selected except for
Speaker 2: Tea was a captain on his college team, and he
Speaker 2: probably would have been if he's stuck around at Clemson
Speaker 2: for another year. Do you think that that has changed
Speaker 2: under Zach? Is there more of an emphasis not specifically
Speaker 2: in captains per se, but guys that love the grind?
Speaker 5: Yeah, I think that's right.
Speaker 6: I think he's left his imprint on that on this,
Speaker 6: on on that, I think, uh, what's what's he said?
Speaker 6: We want guys that like ball, you know. And I
Speaker 6: think you can see that in the guys that they
Speaker 6: go after. And of course Zach doesn't have his he
Speaker 6: gets immersed in these guys later on in the process.
Speaker 6: The big thing is the scouts know, I think what
Speaker 6: a Zach guy is. That's a big thing. And and
Speaker 6: and uh so they go into these places, you know,
Speaker 6: when a when a Christian Sakkasian or Andrew Johnson, the regionals,
Speaker 6: you know, the area of Scouts go in. They know
Speaker 6: they're they're looking for those grinders. And you know, Paul
Speaker 6: Danner Jr. Had an interesting story the other day on
Speaker 6: The Athletic. He does a hell of a job covering
Speaker 6: the club for The Athletic about the traits that have
Speaker 6: emerged in Zach's six seasons. And that's a big that's
Speaker 6: that's a lot of it up there is the captain,
Speaker 6: you know, and that's that's one of the things that
Speaker 6: certainly is emerged in the last couple of years.
Speaker 5: Is that they they seem to get terrific guys.
Speaker 1: Yeah, and it pays off.
Speaker 2: I think the culture is a direct reflection of the
Speaker 2: kind of guys that they've been drafting in recent years.
Speaker 1: So let's talk a little bit about this year's draft.
Speaker 2: The Bengals almost certainly will need a right tackle next year,
Speaker 2: since Trent Brown only signed for one season. They could
Speaker 2: also use a defensive tackle with DJ Reader going to
Speaker 2: Detroit and BJ Hill entering the final year of his contract.
Speaker 1: In your opinion, is.
Speaker 2: The eighteenth pick most likely to be an offensive or
Speaker 2: defensive tackle?
Speaker 5: Most likely? I hate to say most likely in a draft.
Speaker 6: I think if you look at the trends of the
Speaker 6: last couple of years under Zach say, or you know
Speaker 6: recently under Duke, that's gonna be it's gonna be a
Speaker 6: big man. It would seem like, you know, I know,
Speaker 6: there's a thought process of there, you know, the the
Speaker 6: higher the pick, the bigger the guy, you know. So
Speaker 6: I clearly they view it as a premium position. But
Speaker 6: I also think on the other end of it. That's
Speaker 6: why I'm a little bit hesitant to pigeonhole this one
Speaker 6: because I you know, talking to Steven Is, the director
Speaker 6: of Pro Scouting.
Speaker 5: I sat down with him last week.
Speaker 6: He was really good talking about for the first time
Speaker 6: since he in a long time, both the first you're
Speaker 6: gonna get a first round or in the first round
Speaker 6: at number eighteen and you're gonna get a second round
Speaker 6: or where they picking the second round, and in most
Speaker 6: years you don't see that, you know, particularly in the
Speaker 6: first round. He goes, you know, if you're picking at eighteen,
Speaker 6: probably not a guy who you have graded as a
Speaker 6: first rounder.
Speaker 2: Let me just clarify for a second, because people might
Speaker 2: be confused when you say they're going to get a
Speaker 2: first rounder in the first round, and people will think, well,
Speaker 2: what do you mean by that. Last year, I believe
Speaker 2: they had thirteen players graded is what they considered to
Speaker 2: be first round cal burd players. Miles Murphy was one
Speaker 2: of them and they were able to select him. So
Speaker 2: this year they think there are more true first round
Speaker 2: picks graded his first round picks than usual.
Speaker 6: Yeah, they will get if you're at eighteen, you will
Speaker 6: get one of those, and I think the year before
Speaker 6: with Dak Hill the same thing. It was about thirteen
Speaker 6: or fourteen graded in the graded first round game. And
Speaker 6: then when they picked at thirty I think or thirty one.
Speaker 6: I guess they picked at thirty one, Dax was one
Speaker 6: of those first rounders who was there. So they've been
Speaker 6: kind of lucky as far as their board goes, you know,
Speaker 6: but this time it's going to be a legit guy.
Speaker 6: So what I guess all I'm saying is if you
Speaker 6: think you can get a right tackle on the second
Speaker 6: round and you got the best corner, if you got
Speaker 6: the best cornerback staring back and you know they're not.
Speaker 5: Exactly deeper corner. Now I get the DJ Reader thing.
Speaker 6: I understand that, but you know they've only got like,
Speaker 6: they've only got two who's who are the outside guys
Speaker 6: behind their two starters, Cam Taylor Britt and DJ Turner.
Speaker 6: You know, so I think, you know what if Wicked
Speaker 6: is from Clemson staring at you there and you know
Speaker 6: you can get a right tackle, and you know you
Speaker 6: can get a right tackle in the second round, I mean,
Speaker 6: you know, we've talked about the d tackles. There seem
Speaker 6: to be some but there later there may be third
Speaker 6: day guys. So and another thing, what if Brian Thomas
Speaker 6: Junior is sitting at the wide receiver from LSU.
Speaker 5: You know he's yeah, okay, he's.
Speaker 6: Not a great round or a great right runner and
Speaker 6: all that and everything, but he can do it. You know,
Speaker 6: I mean, he's gonna be a hell of a player
Speaker 6: once he learns to run some routes, you know what
Speaker 6: I mean. And you know they don't have their slock
Speaker 6: guye Tyler Boyd. You know what if you get a
Speaker 6: guy like promise, you stick him in and he and
Speaker 6: he catches forty balls. That's the other thing is Joe
Speaker 6: Burrow's window. Get a guy that can help you. Now,
Speaker 6: get a guy you know you're this close that well,
Speaker 6: that first round pick is going to help you anyway.
Speaker 6: He better be his a first round pick. Even Miles
Speaker 6: Murphy was in a last year, the first round pick.
Speaker 6: He was played at a very stacked position edge, which
Speaker 6: is already you know, two great veterans, you still play
Speaker 6: two hundred and sixty eight snaps and still play some
Speaker 6: Keith thirty downs. This guy's got to be a do
Speaker 6: you take a right tackle? He's gonna sit behind Trent.
Speaker 6: You know, do you take a rotating defensive tackle or
Speaker 6: do you take a corner who's probably going to be
Speaker 6: playing quicker.
Speaker 5: I don't know.
Speaker 6: This is why it's not a just the you know,
Speaker 6: it's never really easy, especially to me. It's more of
Speaker 6: a problem, not a problem, but it's more of a dilemma.
Speaker 6: When you have a you're staring at a first round guy.
Speaker 6: You know, you might be able to pass it off
Speaker 6: and say, okay, if he's a second round or let's
Speaker 6: get an alignment now, let's get our alignment now. But
Speaker 6: if he's a legit guy, if he's a legit corner
Speaker 6: or a legit wide receiver staring at you, well, you know,
Speaker 6: let's think about.
Speaker 1: It, right sure. I mean, on the topic of wide receiver.
Speaker 2: I hear Zach Taylor's voice in the back of my
Speaker 2: head going back to the twenty twenty one draft where
Speaker 2: I was pounding the table for take Pinace, well take
Speaker 2: the pass blocker, and Zach Taylor said, we chose the
Speaker 2: guy who scores touchdowns, so that is always going to
Speaker 2: be a consideration.
Speaker 6: And he was echoing Pete Brown right there. Pete Brown
Speaker 6: was let's get a touchdown guy. So yeah, I mean in.
Speaker 5: Zach, look at the Zach. That's exactly right.
Speaker 6: And you know Zach's not only run of the offense,
Speaker 6: he's calling the game.
Speaker 5: Give the guy to pick.
Speaker 6: You know, if he thinks this guy is going to
Speaker 6: help him right now on Sunday, maybe you better listen
Speaker 6: to that guy. Now.
Speaker 5: I don't know what Zach is saying.
Speaker 4: I don't know, but I.
Speaker 5: Mean if he's got input.
Speaker 6: On like that, like on an offensive guy, you know
Speaker 6: that's got a factor into two two.
Speaker 2: So you talked about stacking the board earlier. They're going
Speaker 2: to have a list of the top eighteen players in
Speaker 2: their mind going into the first round of the draft,
Speaker 2: and it won't include quarterbacks because they don't need one.
Speaker 2: So certainly three quarterbacks are going to be taken before
Speaker 2: they're on the clock, probably four, maybe five, But they're
Speaker 2: going to get one of the top probably fourteen guys
Speaker 2: on their with their first round pick.
Speaker 6: The latest Bengals dot Com media mark had six quarterbacks taken.
Speaker 5: Yeah, yeah, so right.
Speaker 6: I mean you're gonna get a you know, uh what
Speaker 6: if what if Mitchell somehow slides the cornerback?
Speaker 5: You know, you won't slide the cornerback from Toledo.
Speaker 6: But what if what if Wiggins is the first cornerback
Speaker 6: taken from Clemson and Mitchell is is sitting there. That's one.
Speaker 6: The Thomas scenario is another. The other scenario was, well,
Speaker 6: you know, maybe somebody maybe maybe maybe Pennix and or
Speaker 6: bow Knix is falling and uh, some team comes up
Speaker 6: to get them at eighteen and then then maybe do
Speaker 6: you trade back a couple and boom you get your
Speaker 6: O tackle and your wide receiver or your O tackle
Speaker 6: and your corner or whatever, say whatever it is, a
Speaker 6: defensive tackle or whatever it is, with a trade back.
Speaker 6: I you know, that's what they're doing right now. I
Speaker 6: think is when we talked about stacking. I think they
Speaker 6: already know. I think they already have as of who
Speaker 6: they're going to be talking about at eighteen. I think
Speaker 6: they already know the four guys are probably going to
Speaker 6: be talking about five maybe, and they'll make that decision.
Speaker 6: And they'll make that decision now because they'll see it.
Speaker 6: They'll see it at you know, Indie will pick, the
Speaker 6: Saints will pick at fourteen, and there's going to be
Speaker 6: the fifteen, sixteen, seventeen in the left right and they'll
Speaker 6: be the forty guys that they had talked about a
Speaker 6: week ago, and they'll, you know, and it will be
Speaker 6: and it will be decided. It won't be, you know,
Speaker 6: they'll they'll and the reasons will be said now and
Speaker 6: not undrafted.
Speaker 2: Let me get back to offensive line. They've drafted great
Speaker 2: ones like Andrew Whitworth and Kevin Zeitdler. They've drafted good
Speaker 2: ones like Jonah Williams. They've drafted guys that didn't work out,
Speaker 2: like Cedric Colboyhee and Billy Price. They've spent a ton
Speaker 2: of money in free agency in recent years on the
Speaker 2: offensive line. It's going to be harder to do that
Speaker 2: after the Joe Burrow extension. How do you think that
Speaker 2: impacts them going into the draft. Do they need to
Speaker 2: take an offensive lineman with high end traits early in
Speaker 2: light of the salary cap in their budget going forward.
Speaker 5: That's a great question.
Speaker 4: You know.
Speaker 6: He always I'm always amazed by these guys. And I'm
Speaker 6: not on Twitter very much, but when I'm on there
Speaker 6: and I'm always amazed by people say get him an
Speaker 6: offensive line, get them this, get him, you know, get
Speaker 6: him an offense, get him. Somebody's gonna protect them. That's
Speaker 6: all they've done since he's arrived here. They've they've signed guys,
Speaker 6: they've drafted guys. So I don't know what more else
Speaker 6: they have to do. I think it's a great question.
Speaker 6: I do think they have to. They got left tackle solved,
Speaker 6: and they've got to solve right tackle. And it's it's
Speaker 6: will they be able to rent a guy? I guess
Speaker 6: is the question. They've rented ever since he's been here,
Speaker 6: they've rented or right tackle, And you know, I think
Speaker 6: it to me, it sounds like there's plenty of them
Speaker 6: out there this year who do have those traits. And
Speaker 6: I you know, something else too, is I think that
Speaker 6: you're talking about a guy like Trent Brown. He is
Speaker 6: a hell of a pass protector, that's what he does.
Speaker 6: I mean, you know, he's a little you know, you know,
Speaker 6: he's he's been He's only thirty, I think, correct me
Speaker 6: if I'm writing, but he's been. You know, this is
Speaker 6: his tenth season. I think, so he brings a lot
Speaker 6: of experience. You know, do you maybe bring him back
Speaker 6: two or three more years or something? So you know,
Speaker 6: I just think yes, I mean, you know, they'll have
Speaker 6: to eventually, I guess find it right tackle.
Speaker 5: But it's worked out pretty good, pretty well the way
Speaker 5: they've been doing it.
Speaker 6: I mean, I don't think you know, it's a position
Speaker 6: that's uh. I think they've you know, when they switched
Speaker 6: Jonah over there, they draft some you know, they signed
Speaker 6: some guys reef Lyle Collins. I think those guys did
Speaker 6: what they were supposed to do. Now can you keep
Speaker 6: doing that? I guess that's the question.
Speaker 5: But when can you do it? Can you do it
Speaker 5: in the first round or can you do it in
Speaker 5: the second round? To me, that's that's the question.
Speaker 6: You might be able to You might be able to
Speaker 6: solve the problem, just maybe not on Thursday Night.
Speaker 2: How big of a voice does Frank paulakapp and drafting
Speaker 2: offensive lineman huge?
Speaker 6: I think it's compare it to Darren Simmons on special
Speaker 6: on kickers on special teams. I think it's gonna go
Speaker 6: through him. You know, they're not gonna draft the guy
Speaker 6: that Frank doesn't like. That'd be hired for me to see,
Speaker 6: you know, uh, And that goes for any position coach, I.
Speaker 5: Mean, h or coordinator.
Speaker 6: You know, it would be hard for me to see
Speaker 6: a the first round pick not being able to pass
Speaker 6: muster with somebody on the coaching staff.
Speaker 5: So I think Frank's.
Speaker 6: Gonna you know, and particularly offensive line is seen as
Speaker 6: one of those niche positions like special teams, you know,
Speaker 6: the guys kind of the Kuys, the Kuys, the guys
Speaker 6: kind of king of all these surveys. You know.
Speaker 5: So it's you gotta feel like Frank has gotta got.
Speaker 2: A lot of Say, the Bengals have ten picks, they
Speaker 2: have extras in the third, sixth, and seventh rounds. Do
Speaker 2: you expect them to use one of those extras to
Speaker 2: move up at some point?
Speaker 5: They certainly have, you know, they never used to.
Speaker 6: And I think that's another probably trade that's different that
Speaker 6: two kids bought and Stuke's been in there. I think
Speaker 6: they've traded up maybe six seven times since twenty eleven,
Speaker 6: you know, and so they've shown that they will do that.
Speaker 6: It wouldn't be surprising if they did it this year
Speaker 6: because they've done it. They did it, you know, a
Speaker 6: couple of years ago to go get Tyson Anderson, they
Speaker 6: did it to get the cam tail of brit And
Speaker 6: it wouldn't be you know, that would it wouldn't be
Speaker 6: stunning because they've done it they're used to it, and
Speaker 6: they've done it to make some pretty good moves. I mean,
Speaker 6: the cam tail of brit Is that they've traded up
Speaker 6: and probably got a pro bowler.
Speaker 2: I don't see them giving up the extra third round pick,
Speaker 2: but that's what extra sixth and seventh round picks are
Speaker 2: ideally for.
Speaker 6: Yeah, I mean, I think it's you know, listen to
Speaker 6: Bill Polian the other day on U Serious Radio talking
Speaker 6: about uh Sali Wilcotts was talking about how h his
Speaker 6: big guys, Mike Gettings Junior, who's a independent consultant scouting
Speaker 6: consultant used by several teams, including the Bengals, And you know,
Speaker 6: Napoleon said your blue you're blue guys, which is what
Speaker 6: Gettings calls elite players who produce at the top level,
Speaker 6: the top level players. You get them in the first, second,
Speaker 6: or third rounds. That's pretty much proven through the draft
Speaker 6: those other picks.
Speaker 5: That's exactly right.
Speaker 6: Stock pilm trade up to get into the you know,
Speaker 6: get into the you know, fourth or fifth you know, uh,
Speaker 6: get up, you know, get up as high as you
Speaker 6: can and so and I you know, and they've and
Speaker 6: they've done that, and I would you know, you wouldn't
Speaker 6: be surprised to see him do it now.
Speaker 5: I mean, it's gonna be how many picks do you need?
Speaker 4: You know what I mean?
Speaker 5: How many picks do you need?
Speaker 6: And then and this team is so young anyway, right
Speaker 6: I think last opening day they were the third youngest
Speaker 6: in the team and in the third youngest in the league.
Speaker 6: So I'm not sure ten ten draft picks is you know?
Speaker 6: I I would uh, I would imagine, and they would.
Speaker 5: Find a way to convert him.
Speaker 2: You mentioned Brian Thomas from LSU as at least somebody
Speaker 2: they would have to think about if he were on
Speaker 2: the clock at number eighteen. Tyler Boyd is likely gone.
Speaker 2: T Higgins could be in a year. Do you think
Speaker 2: that they will take a wide receiver in the first
Speaker 2: two days or yeah, first two days, first three rounds.
Speaker 5: I think they could.
Speaker 6: I mean I I it wouldn't surprise me, you know,
Speaker 6: a couple of years removed from the big Man's draft,
Speaker 6: right when that those first two days were all guys
Speaker 6: at least three hundred pounds on either side of the ball.
Speaker 6: So you know, maybe it is time to go go
Speaker 6: get somebody early. It's like you said, you know, you
Speaker 6: got a you know, there's Zach. There's Zach in the
Speaker 6: back of your head, you know, and you know, yeah,
Speaker 6: you start thinking about it a little bit, and you
Speaker 6: know there's no boyd teas Te's on a one year deal,
Speaker 6: and you know, Joshavish looks like he's going to be help.
Speaker 1: Me there, help me there, Hordy prime pronunciation.
Speaker 5: Yeah, yo, you call him Yoshi, Yeah, and he's yeah.
Speaker 1: I'm sure you would get andre right, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 6: Well yeah, I think that uh, you know, he looks
Speaker 6: I think he's he's going to pan out better than
Speaker 6: they thought he you know, I think you're looking at
Speaker 6: the guy who can catch fifty balls, you know. So,
Speaker 6: I mean that's a big that's a big boost. But still,
Speaker 6: you got Burrow, you get this offense, you know, you know,
Speaker 6: drafting and receiver is never a stunner.
Speaker 5: I guess it's it might be where where you take him.
Speaker 5: But I mean I think if you know.
Speaker 6: Just the way things are going, I mean, if they
Speaker 6: take a you know, if they now tell me what
Speaker 6: kind of guy, because I think that kind of you know,
Speaker 6: is it the big is it the big tall TSH guy?
Speaker 6: Is it is it a guy? Is it a guy? Built,
Speaker 6: you know, is it a guy built more like.
Speaker 5: Like Jamar?
Speaker 4: You know?
Speaker 6: Is it you know that I have a kind of
Speaker 6: have a hearted time finding out if they've got if
Speaker 6: there's a proto. But I don't think there is a
Speaker 6: prototype for the great ones, you know what I mean?
Speaker 6: I mean, I don't think they gotta be Jami has chosen.
Speaker 6: He doesn't have to be six ' four and T
Speaker 6: shows that, you know, you don't have to be uh be.
Speaker 5: Able to scuot and scat and everything.
Speaker 6: You know.
Speaker 5: So I think it's uh.
Speaker 6: I think if they feel like you know, the nice
Speaker 6: thing about it is this is this is what separates
Speaker 6: the Bengals, I think in the draft room now. And
Speaker 6: a big reason for why I think they have drafted
Speaker 6: well is they get the same coaches, They get the
Speaker 6: same structure, they got the same organization.
Speaker 4: You know.
Speaker 6: Pitcher, Damn Pitcher, the coordinator, uh Brad Crack Brad Krag
Speaker 6: thought the new quarterbacks coach has been here for five years, I.
Speaker 5: Mean, Zach.
Speaker 6: So these guys know exactly what they want and that's
Speaker 6: a big I think that's a big plus to put
Speaker 6: them over to.
Speaker 2: Speaking of t Higgins, he told reporters this week that
Speaker 2: he expects to play for the Bengals this year. I
Speaker 2: never thought that there was a remote possibility that he
Speaker 2: was going to leave nearly twenty two million dollars on
Speaker 2: the table. But did you take that as a good
Speaker 2: sign that this is going to be drama free?
Speaker 5: Yeah?
Speaker 6: I mean I think, you know, I look back to
Speaker 6: Jesse Bates, and that was drama free. He had a
Speaker 6: hell of a year. He played it right. I think
Speaker 6: he got into camp probably just about the right time.
Speaker 6: Tea is a winner, you know. I never worry, you know.
Speaker 6: And maybe it's because now that i'm you know, maybe
Speaker 6: I'm gonna you.
Speaker 5: Know, I just don't focus on that as much.
Speaker 6: And maybe it's because I work for the team. I
Speaker 6: just don't focus on that as much. But I do
Speaker 6: think there's there's not any drama here.
Speaker 5: I don't know, you know. I mean, and I've been
Speaker 5: here when there was plenty of drama and it's just
Speaker 5: a tea.
Speaker 6: They got guys who are not, you know, drama kings,
Speaker 6: you know what I mean. That's just the way they're
Speaker 6: wired to me, in my opinion. Yeah, I just don't think.
Speaker 6: I mean, yeah, I mean, the stuff that's on Twitter
Speaker 6: and the stuff they might say in videos. I mean
Speaker 6: to me, it's all kind of that's not drama, you
Speaker 6: know what I mean? And so I yeah, I never
Speaker 6: get the sense the thing was going to because I think,
Speaker 6: I think, if I'm not mistaken, teas represented by as
Speaker 6: Jesse Bates's agent correct, And you know, Jesse came in
Speaker 6: here and had a he old a year, and I
Speaker 6: would expect you to do the same.
Speaker 2: Looks like there's going to be no drama where Dax's
Speaker 2: Hill is concerned as well. We were in on the
Speaker 2: cluster on Monday when he spoke to reporters after the
Speaker 2: players we turned back to Cincinnati, and I thought he
Speaker 2: said all of the right things about not knowing exactly
Speaker 2: what his role is going to be this year.
Speaker 5: Yeah, he said all the right things.
Speaker 6: And that's another thing they'll probably get answered in the draft,
Speaker 6: you know, if they don't take a corner back any time,
Speaker 6: you know, maybe that's telling us something. I tell you
Speaker 6: what the nice thing about dak Shill is, not only
Speaker 6: is he did he stand up there and say all
Speaker 6: the things he should have said, and you know, just
Speaker 6: exactly what you're looking for. But the guys player, I think,
Speaker 6: I mean I I maybe I'm nuts, and I know
Speaker 6: he had a few bad plays last year, but they
Speaker 6: stand out because he did beat deep. But I also
Speaker 6: think he had a hell of a lot of good plays.
Speaker 6: The guy runs, he closes on the ball, he's smart. Uh,
Speaker 6: he looks to me like, wherever you put him, he's
Speaker 6: going to be a productive guy.
Speaker 5: And that's a pretty good guy to have on your club.
Speaker 6: I mean, uh, you know, there's a lot of guys
Speaker 6: who would have stood in front of that cluster on
Speaker 6: Monday and not said the right things and made it
Speaker 6: a drama thing. And they would and they would still
Speaker 6: be written about today. But no, I mean, so to
Speaker 6: have a guy like that with as much talent as
Speaker 6: he does, that's a that's another.
Speaker 5: That's a that's a that's a draft pick. Well done.
Speaker 1: All right, we have the TJ.
Speaker 2: Hushman Zada look back at the draft story to look
Speaker 2: forward to. Well, there'd be one more media mock draft.
Speaker 5: Oh there has to be. There just has to be.
Speaker 5: I know, Uh, the scouts are looking at me like saying,
Speaker 5: how many of those do you do? I said, I said, well,
Speaker 5: probably three too many right now? But why not?
Speaker 6: I mean, you get a pretty good uh grip, you know,
Speaker 6: like the Jets guy.
Speaker 5: I always talk to our good friend.
Speaker 1: Rich Semini, my classmate.
Speaker 6: Classmate, and uh, you know, why not call rich Semidia?
Speaker 5: Think who who are just gonna draft?
Speaker 6: And and if he can get seventeen of those of opinions,
Speaker 6: those opinions, maybe you just get a better idea. Now,
Speaker 6: maybe it is ridiculous to have five. But hoo do
Speaker 6: you know this? People are eating them up. You you
Speaker 6: do a three round mark right.
Speaker 1: I'll be doing another one at the end of this podcast.
Speaker 6: Yeah, it's uh and I calls I call us mock
Speaker 6: rakers now now Teddy Roosevelt called journalist back in the day,
Speaker 6: muck rakers.
Speaker 5: We're mock rakers.
Speaker 6: Where the uh where the sad descendants of that?
Speaker 5: And uh I, uh yeah, I'll be uh Thursday morning.
Speaker 6: I'll put up another pathetic run out and uh I've
Speaker 6: picked three different players. I'm sure people, but this is
Speaker 6: what could happen and said, well, you know, and uh,
Speaker 6: I'll probably pick somebody else because think.
Speaker 5: About it, you know, just think about these things.
Speaker 6: You know, I picked Wigans the last time, and you know,
Speaker 6: maybe I'll pick Thomas's time or something. But it's The
Speaker 6: good thing about this draft, though, is you've done enough
Speaker 6: of the marks, is you pretty much know.
Speaker 5: I don't know if they're going to take.
Speaker 6: Four quarterbacks or six, but you pretty much know what
Speaker 6: offensive tackles are going to be there, what defensive tackles
Speaker 6: are going to be there, what corners and what wide receivers.
Speaker 6: And what's interesting is maybe somebody likes one of those
Speaker 6: offensive tackles that has not been on the board, you know,
Speaker 6: that has been available. Well maybe they're gone, you know,
Speaker 6: and we don't know what Frank's thinking. We don't know
Speaker 6: who Frank likes, so let's keep doing the marks.
Speaker 2: I can tell you this, I despised my first three
Speaker 2: round mock draft. At the end of it, I'm like, gosh,
Speaker 2: can I start over? But I just had to go
Speaker 2: through with it. The second one that I did, I
Speaker 2: was convinced I was the greatest NFL drafter in history,
Speaker 2: partly because the computer spit out tremendous options in one
Speaker 2: of these mock draft simulators. So that kind of gets
Speaker 2: back to you just don't know what's going to be
Speaker 2: taken before.
Speaker 1: You're on the clock.
Speaker 6: Yeah, you're a step up on me with those simulators.
Speaker 5: I think I think I did one and I drafted
Speaker 5: Millard film. I think so. I'm really kind of struggle
Speaker 5: with that, a.
Speaker 1: Little bit of positions Millard players.
Speaker 6: Whatever it was, it was the he was, he was
Speaker 6: in the he was a know nothing free agent.
Speaker 2: All right, great stuff is always again, congratulations on your
Speaker 2: twenty fourth anniversary with the club and look forward to
Speaker 2: working with you next week.
Speaker 5: Whatdye, I always appreciate it.
Speaker 6: This is always where I can get in a chance
Speaker 6: to say hello to my daughter Kerrie, you avid fan
Speaker 6: of the podcast, and her son and husband.
Speaker 5: Her son is fourth down.
Speaker 6: Freddy Miller, Hello, guys, Hope all's well, thanks for listening.
Speaker 2: More on the draft in a moment, but first, here's
Speaker 2: a quick reminder that the Bengals Booth podcast is brought
Speaker 2: to you by pay Corps, proud to be the Bengals
Speaker 2: official HR software provider, by Alta Fiber future proof fiber
Speaker 2: Internet designed to elevate your home, business, and community to
Speaker 2: a new level, and by Kettering Health the best care
Speaker 2: for the best fans. Kettering Health is the official healthcare
Speaker 2: provider of the Bengals. Every year, NFL teams are allowed
Speaker 2: to hold a workout for players who played high school
Speaker 2: or college football in that team's regional area. This Tuesday,
Speaker 2: thirty players with local ties worked out in the Bengals
Speaker 2: indoor practice facility, including defensive lineman Juwan Briggs out of
Speaker 2: Walnut Hills High School in Cincinnati, who started his college
Speaker 2: career at Virginia before coming home and spending three seasons
Speaker 2: as a UC Bearcat. In addition to being a team
Speaker 2: captain and a first team All Conference player, Juwan is
Speaker 2: a renaissance man. He was a great student, earning multiple
Speaker 2: college degrees. He's a talented singer, and get this, he's
Speaker 2: a married father of three. Juwan played inside and outside
Speaker 2: on the defensive line at UC, but projects to be
Speaker 2: a defensive tackle in the NFL and could be selected
Speaker 2: on Day three of the draft. I spoke to him
Speaker 2: after Tuesday's workout about a week away from the draft.
Speaker 1: How do you think your prep has gone?
Speaker 8: I think I've just you know, as I said earlier,
Speaker 8: I think I've taken advantage of every opportunity it was
Speaker 8: coming my way. Of course, you can always, you know,
Speaker 8: grow compared to what you've done, but you know, just
Speaker 8: being able to crush everything that's come towards my way
Speaker 8: has been something I've been focusing on this whole process.
Speaker 2: I've seen you at U see anywhere from about two
Speaker 2: hundred and ninety five pounds to three hundred and twenty
Speaker 2: five pounds. It looks like maybe three point fifteen to
Speaker 2: three twenty right now.
Speaker 8: Yeah, I'm actually around you know, three ten, okay, And
Speaker 8: I actually didn't get a chance to eat dinner last night.
Speaker 8: I got said, I was fresh off the plane. I
Speaker 8: was traveling for eight hours, so you know I probably
Speaker 8: hver run around three thirteen, just like pro day to
Speaker 8: be a tap Yes, sir, Yes, Y're definitely interior guy.
Speaker 8: And like I said, I'll do anything. You know, I
Speaker 8: can drop two ninety five if you want me rushing
Speaker 8: off that edge, I'll gladly do it. You know, as
Speaker 8: you said, I've been as low as two ninety five,
Speaker 8: as high as basically through thirty. So it really doesn't matter.
Speaker 8: Wherever you guys need me home, wherever anyone needs me,
Speaker 8: I'll go out there.
Speaker 1: Where were you last night?
Speaker 8: I was at Kansas City, So I literally just touched
Speaker 8: down touchdown at about eleven forty and got out of
Speaker 8: CVG at twelve thirty, got home around They probably got
Speaker 8: home around one, took a bath, got in the bed.
Speaker 8: It's about one thirty, you know, got to sleep by
Speaker 8: to and woke up and came here.
Speaker 2: You're an observant guy. Have you been able to pick
Speaker 2: up a vibe that the Bengals are interested?
Speaker 4: Ah?
Speaker 8: Well, like you know, like I said, I was taking
Speaker 8: it back when you know him him and talking.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 1: Let me set the scene.
Speaker 2: So you complete this local workout, you're doing interviews with
Speaker 2: local reporters, and Mike Brown, Bengals team president, walks over
Speaker 2: to chat you up, which I don't know that any
Speaker 2: of us have seen before.
Speaker 8: Like I said, it is a it was a it
Speaker 8: was a humbling experience to say, at least uh as
Speaker 8: I you know, for once, I've kind of had a
Speaker 8: loss of words with that. It's just honoring and it's
Speaker 8: humbling too. You know, see that someone at that level
Speaker 8: knows me, and especially with the you know, the pool,
Speaker 8: I'd say, has it means a lot to me doing
Speaker 8: the right things.
Speaker 1: He definitely has pulled.
Speaker 2: There's a need here for a nose tackle three technique
Speaker 2: kind of guy. Have you been doing the research looking
Speaker 2: at rosters and thinking, all right, I'm a fit at
Speaker 2: that particular teams.
Speaker 8: Yes, sir, So you know, any place that's expressed interest
Speaker 8: to me, I've tried to, you know, look down into
Speaker 8: the roster see what they have there.
Speaker 4: Like we were talking about earlier, you.
Speaker 8: Know, attack d tackle here just left, so you know
Speaker 8: there's a of course, there are people here as well,
Speaker 8: so you know it'll be a chance to kind of
Speaker 8: if I am fortunate to get drafted, it's a chance
Speaker 8: to come in compete. Same thing with any other place
Speaker 8: I've been. It's just a chance to know who you'll be,
Speaker 8: know your peers so that you can compete and you know,
Speaker 8: just have a leg up no matter where I'm at.
Speaker 2: So you're a married father of three, the kids are young.
Speaker 2: Do they have any idea what daddy's trying to pull
Speaker 2: off right now?
Speaker 8: Well, my son he loves football. I mean we're out
Speaker 8: of the spring game the other day and he was
Speaker 8: throwing the ball around and tackling stuff. But I don't
Speaker 8: think he knows what I'm doing exactly. You know, every
Speaker 8: time I leave, and probably when he wakes up, he says, oh,
Speaker 8: it's daddy in practice. I'm not calling it in practice,
Speaker 8: but you know I'm trying to make it so I
Speaker 8: can be in practice for a couple a couple more years.
Speaker 4: Down the line.
Speaker 2: He played extremely well and you see, you know, first
Speaker 2: team All Conference honors and then the various achievements that
Speaker 2: you had but didn't get the combine invite, didn't get
Speaker 2: the Senior Ball invite.
Speaker 1: Is there a chip on your shoulder from that?
Speaker 8: Yeah, there's a big chip, you know. And I kind
Speaker 8: of expressed it in two different ways. So after the
Speaker 8: combine thing didn't come around, and you know, I got
Speaker 8: the list, I kind of made it a point to
Speaker 8: and I still have it on my phone. I made
Speaker 8: it a point to make a list of every single
Speaker 8: guy that got a combine, every single guy that got
Speaker 8: a Senior Bowl invite, and just have their exact measurements, height, weight,
Speaker 8: hand harm have what they ran in the forty, what
Speaker 8: they did their ten split, their twenty split, what they
Speaker 8: didn't broad jump, or how many bench press reps they got,
Speaker 8: and who didn't compete in certain drills. And I made
Speaker 8: it a point to just go after and chase them.
Speaker 8: So when as you said, I was two ninety five
Speaker 8: or three twenty five, a big thing for me was
Speaker 8: what weight can I be to make the most.
Speaker 4: Impact at my pro day.
Speaker 8: So for me, I decided instead of me being light
Speaker 8: and maybe run a little faster and possibly you know,
Speaker 8: losing a couple of reps on the bench, well, I'm
Speaker 8: an interior D line and I need to get as
Speaker 8: much on the I can, so let me go ahead
Speaker 8: and showcase that I can be the strongest, no, most
Speaker 8: athletic three fifteen guy you could be. So I weighed
Speaker 8: in at three thirteen point eight I say three fourteen.
Speaker 4: They freaking docked me point eight pounds, and I.
Speaker 8: Just made sure that I crushed literally every single guy
Speaker 8: that was listed above that three ten mark.
Speaker 4: I half the chart broken.
Speaker 8: Down from three ten three or five two ninety five
Speaker 8: because three hundred three or five to two ninety five
Speaker 8: the guys were a little bit of the same. And
Speaker 8: I didn't look at anything two ninety five down because
Speaker 8: that's light. So you know, it was just a really
Speaker 8: important for me to have that goal in mind. And
Speaker 8: you know, those guys that already started with the leg up,
Speaker 8: so I just wanted to be able to showcase that
Speaker 8: may do something a little better.
Speaker 2: Sounds like you crushed it at the Shrine Bowl as well.
Speaker 2: Did you get good feedback from that.
Speaker 8: Yeah, So, I mean it was actually pretty interesting. You know,
Speaker 8: the D line on the east side. We were actually
Speaker 8: doing pretty good, so good that the second day they said, guys,
Speaker 8: we can't bull rush our guys. You know, we're got
Speaker 8: bag holding them up. And you know, I made it
Speaker 8: a point to pretty much do that every rep. And
Speaker 8: the second day we took it off them a little bit,
Speaker 8: getting let him play Patty Hickul live, but came back
Speaker 8: hard the third day. So you know, it's just a
Speaker 8: matter of taking advantage of the reps I can get.
Speaker 8: You know, I kept getting in there and getting as
Speaker 8: many reps as.
Speaker 4: I can get. I didn't sit out. I didn't sit
Speaker 4: out for any drills. In practice.
Speaker 8: I try to get as many reps are in the
Speaker 8: game as I can get because, like I said, every
Speaker 8: time I can step, you know, and the grid iron
Speaker 8: is an interview.
Speaker 4: So just making sure that I can make the most
Speaker 4: of everything.
Speaker 2: Wearing that Bengals jersey, practicing in this Bengals facility does
Speaker 2: that make it all feel a little more real.
Speaker 4: It makes it feel a lot closer. You know.
Speaker 8: It was one thing to be practicing in this bubble,
Speaker 8: you see, because we didn't have our own bubble. But
Speaker 8: it's another thing to be literally a week out, you know,
Speaker 8: from big things happening for you know a lot of
Speaker 8: guys and around my position, and you.
Speaker 4: Know, it means a lot.
Speaker 8: It means a lot that you're this close old hopefully
Speaker 8: you know if I'm ever so fortunate a rookie mini camp.
Speaker 2: So so you're on the freaks list last year. I
Speaker 2: know how athletic you are. What kind of numbers did
Speaker 2: you post on the bench and things like that.
Speaker 8: Yeah, so on the bench, I did forty two. They
Speaker 8: docked me three, so they gave me thirty nine official,
Speaker 8: but you know I did dockey three cuz you know,
Speaker 8: at the beginning they'll say lockout, but you know, for
Speaker 8: some guys they'll screen lockout at you. You know, the
Speaker 8: counter rip. I guess I did too many, so they
Speaker 8: had to dock me three, give you sub forty. But
Speaker 8: you know, I mean, no matter what, whoever was there
Speaker 8: saw me throw the way around forty two times, whether
Speaker 8: it be officially or unofficial.
Speaker 1: So Julia, rooting for you, best of luck, Thank you.
Speaker 2: Final thought on Juwan, I've interviewed him many times in
Speaker 2: the past, and knowing that he's a talented singer, I
Speaker 2: asked him this question. So the latest season of Hard
Speaker 2: Knocks started this week. The Lions are the featured team.
Speaker 2: The rookie Aiden Hutchinson was asked to perform at the
Speaker 2: you know, like the rookies often do, and he sang
Speaker 2: Michael Jackson's Billy Jean. So, when you're an an NFL
Speaker 2: training camp and they ask you to sing your rookie year,
Speaker 2: what are you gonna break out?
Speaker 4: Shoot?
Speaker 8: Honestly, ah hey, let me think I'd say Purple Rain
Speaker 8: by Prince. Prince is probably one of the Prince is
Speaker 8: probably my favorite musician overall. Just a great persons music wise,
Speaker 8: in you know, just outside of music. But Bubba Rain's
Speaker 8: definitely a classic some everybody can relate to and some
Speaker 8: everybody knows.
Speaker 2: So you want to give us a little.
Speaker 7: I never meant to cause you any trouble. I never
Speaker 7: meant to cause you any pain, but oh see you laughing.
Speaker 7: I only wanted to see you standing in the purple ring.
Speaker 2: Here's a sneak peek for what one NFL team will
Speaker 2: be treated to at training camp. On the last two
Speaker 2: editions of this podcast, I did three round Bengals mock drafts.
Speaker 2: Using simulators to examine my options before explaining the reasoning
Speaker 2: behind my pain. On my first try, using the Pro
Speaker 2: Football Focus simulator, I chose Washington offensive lineman Troy fa
Speaker 2: Utanu in round one, Florida State defensive tackle Brayden Fisk
Speaker 2: in round two, North Carolina wide receiver Devontes Walker with
Speaker 2: my first third round pick, and Florida State cornerback Ronardo
Speaker 2: Green with my second third round pick. Last week, using
Speaker 2: the Pro Football Network simulator, I grabbed offensive lineman JC
Speaker 2: Latham in round one, Western Kentucky wide receiver Malachi Corley
Speaker 2: in round two, Michigan defensive tackle Chris Jenkins with my
Speaker 2: first third round pick, and his Michigan teammate, cornerback Mikey
Speaker 2: Seiners Still with my second.
Speaker 1: Third round pick.
Speaker 2: This time around, I used the ESPN Mock Draft simulator
Speaker 2: and was delighted when five quarterbacks were taken in the
Speaker 2: top eleven picks. Tight end brought Powers went thirteenth to
Speaker 2: the Raiders, but to that point only one one offensive
Speaker 2: lineman had been taken, Joe Alt at number nine. The
Speaker 2: run on offensive tackles began with a fourteenth pick that
Speaker 2: was Olu Fashanu JC Latham went fifteenth and Talisi Fuaga
Speaker 2: went sixteenth. So here were the options I considered with
Speaker 2: the eighteenth overall pick. Offensive lineman Troy fa Utanu and
Speaker 2: Marius Mims, defensive lineman Byron Murphy, wide receiver Brian Thomas,
Speaker 2: and cornerback Nate Wiggins. I ultimately went with the same
Speaker 2: guy I chose in my first three round, MOC Washington's.
Speaker 1: Troy faugh Utanu.
Speaker 2: Dane Brugler of The Athletic has him ranked number nine
Speaker 2: overall in this year's class and wrote the following in
Speaker 2: his draft guide. Fautanu is explosive on the move and
Speaker 2: at contact, with the foot quickness, body control, and temperament
Speaker 2: to stack wins in both pass protection and as a
Speaker 2: run blocker in the NFL. While he has the talent
Speaker 2: to remain a tackle, his skill set also projects well
Speaker 2: to guard and center, and he offers legitimate five position
Speaker 2: potential at the next level.
Speaker 1: End of quote.
Speaker 2: The Bengals have obviously had hits and misses when it
Speaker 2: comes to drafting offensive linemen, but falloutan who sounds like
Speaker 2: he's as close to a sure thing as you'll find.
Speaker 2: I'm delighted to grab him in round one in the
Speaker 2: second round. Cincinnati has picked number forty nine overall, and
Speaker 2: both of my previous second round selections, defensive tackle Braden
Speaker 2: Fisk and wide receiver Malachi Corley, were still on the board.
Speaker 2: But this time I chose a wide receiver who is
Speaker 2: taller and faster than Corley, Oregon's Troy Franklin. Franklin had
Speaker 2: eighty one catches for more than thirteen hundred yards this
Speaker 2: year and ran a four to four to one at
Speaker 2: the combine. The knock on him is that he's skinny
Speaker 2: at roughly one hundred eighty pounds, But we know the
Speaker 2: Bengals are looking to be more explosive, and Franklin had
Speaker 2: eight catches of more than forty yards last season. Imagine
Speaker 2: adding that speed to the combo of Jamar Chase and
Speaker 2: t Higgins. With my first third round pick, I chose
Speaker 2: the same guy I selected with my second third round
Speaker 2: pick last week, Michigan cornerback Mikey Seiner. Still he's forty
Speaker 2: third overall on the Brugler board, and I find it
Speaker 2: hard to believe he'll actually be there at number eighty overall,
Speaker 2: but the simulator gave me that option, and I took advantage.
Speaker 2: Maybe the Bengals will be just as lucky. He's small
Speaker 2: at five nine two, so some teams will be scared off,
Speaker 2: but the team that employs Mike Hilton won't be. He's
Speaker 2: a faster version with experience on the outside and in
Speaker 2: the slot. The former Michigan captain remains one of my
Speaker 2: favorite guys in this year's draft. My second third round
Speaker 2: pick this time around was LSU defensive tackle Mason Smith.
Speaker 2: He's number sixty four overall on the Brugler and I
Speaker 2: was able to grab him with a ninety seventh pick.
Speaker 2: There aren't a lot of big defensive tackles in this
Speaker 2: year's class, but Smith is one of them at six
Speaker 2: five three oh six. He tore his ACL a couple
Speaker 2: of years ago, but Smith came back to play in
Speaker 2: twelve games last season and will immediately see the field
Speaker 2: in the Bengals defensive line rotation. So to recap, I
Speaker 2: took offensive tackle Troy fa Utanu in round one, wide
Speaker 2: receiver Troy Franklin in round two, Michigan corner Mikey Sainer
Speaker 2: still with my first third round pick, and LSU defensive
Speaker 2: tackle Mason Smith with my second. Coming up on my
Speaker 2: next podcast one of the most popular episodes of the year,
Speaker 2: as Dave Lapham joins me to predict who the Bengals
Speaker 2: are going to take in Round one that will be
Speaker 2: posted in time for your drive to work on Monday.
Speaker 2: That's going to do it for this episode of The
Speaker 2: Bengals Booth Podcast, brought to you by pay Corps, proud
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Speaker 2: I'm Dan Hord and thanks for listening to The Bengals
Speaker 2: Booth Podcast.