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Speaker 1: Unpacking the Toolbox is a production of Shondaland Audio in

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Speaker 1: partnership with Higheartradio.

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Speaker 2: Micshas and Katie.

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Speaker 3: Guys.

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Speaker 4: First of all, we have to say that at the

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Speaker 4: time of this recording, we're just coming together after my

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Speaker 4: one of my best friends in the entire world's favorite

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Speaker 4: day on Earth, which is Halloween.

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Speaker 2: Halloween.

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Speaker 5: Whose special holiday is that? Is that? Mister Cci, Oh,

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Speaker 5: mister Cci.

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Speaker 1: Mister Gierma Diazes. Yes, I love Halloween. I do, I do.

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Speaker 1: And oddly enough, I was traveling. I was in Berlin

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Speaker 1: for about a week, so I was traveling up until

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Speaker 1: the thirtieth. So on the thirty first, on Halloween, I

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Speaker 1: ended up just staying like home in my living room

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Speaker 1: watching horror movies.

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Speaker 5: And I didn't do anything.

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Speaker 1: I didn't even dress up, but I was I was

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Speaker 1: fine with that. I was exhausted.

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Speaker 3: Oh my god. Secretly, gee, you kind of loved that day.

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Speaker 4: I mean, you've done all the things you could possibly

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Speaker 4: do out to celebrate Halloween. That it's like it's okay

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Speaker 4: once in a while to have a quiet And it

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Speaker 4: was on.

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Speaker 1: A Tuesday, so it was like, okay, it's gonna stay

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Speaker 1: home and rest.

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Speaker 4: Yes, for everyone listening. Who who has listened to Unpacking

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Speaker 4: the Toolbox? And it's different incantations. You know that a

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Speaker 4: big part of the show is that we always do

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Speaker 4: six degrees of horror films, and the biggest part of

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Speaker 4: horror films and just what we do in general is

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Speaker 4: the casting of them.

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Speaker 5: G Oh, oh, you brought that up. I wish we

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Speaker 5: had someone who is the best casting person in the

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Speaker 5: history of casting people around to speak about that. It's

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Speaker 5: so weird.

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Speaker 3: Yes do we?

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Speaker 5: Oh? Way we do? Oh?

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Speaker 4: How like the person that oh, one of the people

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Speaker 4: that I think saved my life and saved Germo Diaz's

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Speaker 4: life along with Yeah, saved all of our lives and

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Speaker 4: countless countless actors. Countless actors have paid their rent, their mortgage,

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Speaker 4: their health insurance because of this. Yes, Goddess, goddess who

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Speaker 4: goes by the name of.

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Speaker 6: So long, you all have saved me countless times. Betsy,

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Speaker 6: you saved my life so many times, so many times,

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Speaker 6: just by.

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Speaker 5: Hiring, by the way, that was the smartest. I made

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Speaker 5: some good decisions and dumb ones, but that was one

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Speaker 5: of the smartest ones. We pat ourselves in the back

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Speaker 5: of the luck that we ended up meeting when we did,

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Speaker 5: and how when I also tell you too, because you

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Speaker 5: won't see this that Linda, there's a whole side of

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Speaker 5: our business for people who are listening to this, who

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Speaker 5: are learning about these sides of the business, where there

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Speaker 5: are these agents and agents represent actors. And when I

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Speaker 5: tell you that, Linda Lowie, every time there was a problem,

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Speaker 5: I would look at Linda and say, I can't talk

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Speaker 5: to that person. I'm gonna I'm gonna I'm gonna lose

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Speaker 5: my mind. I'm gonna lose my much. She's like, will

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Speaker 5: save you. I'm We're going to save you for the

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Speaker 5: losing the mind part. I'll take care of it. From

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Speaker 5: from the actual casting, the reading, the choosing, the the

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Speaker 5: ad the deal making. It sounds the advocating just advocating

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Speaker 5: for different people, the ability to put an ensemble together,

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Speaker 5: and also being just an all round lovely human being

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Speaker 5: who's the most terrific to be around, and also who

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Speaker 5: also has a baller husband. You can say that again. Yeah,

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Speaker 5: And just so we're clear, we didn't know Linda Lowie

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Speaker 5: had a baller husband. When we hired Linda Lowie. She

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Speaker 5: was just a baller. It turns out it's a what.

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Speaker 2: No, you didn't know that.

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Speaker 3: Linda Lowe went along with the one and only Jeff Perry.

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Speaker 5: For one We saw we saw Jeff Perry moving like

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Speaker 5: a microwave one day and we were like, what's that

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Speaker 5: dude doing here? And Linda said, that's my husband. We

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Speaker 5: were like, that's her husband.

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Speaker 4: This isn't Prospect Studios, right, this is like the OG.

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Speaker 4: I mean, for all of you guys listening, Linda Lowe

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Speaker 4: and Betsy Beers and Shondaland go back so long before

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Speaker 4: there was a Shondaland, before there was Shondaland. I mean

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Speaker 4: the of the Shondaland was with Linda Lowi And so

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Speaker 4: I'm just assuming you're at your offices in Prospect, and

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Speaker 4: lovely husband Jeff Perry, who is like the most amazing actor,

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Speaker 4: is helping you put a microwave in your office.

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Speaker 5: I think it was a microwave.

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Speaker 6: He was walking, he was he was bringing in some

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Speaker 6: boxes from the car because I was moving into my office.

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Speaker 6: It was the only time I ever saw Shonda run.

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Speaker 6: She came running towards me because she saw him out

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Speaker 6: the window. And she one of the things she said was,

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Speaker 6: oh my god, it's so sad. And I said, what's

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Speaker 6: so sad? And she said that that he's moving. Why

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Speaker 6: is that actor who's my favorite actor? Were boxes?

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Speaker 5: She came back. She was like, it must be really

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Speaker 5: hard and I.

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Speaker 6: Said that's my husband. She went, oh my god.

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Speaker 1: Was she mortified?

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Speaker 5: Was she immediately was just like, oh my god, we

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Speaker 5: can cast him, we.

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Speaker 6: Can cast him. And I said, well, he could be

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Speaker 6: you know, t R's father. I was already starting to think, though,

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Speaker 6: please got cast it. And she was and she and

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Speaker 6: in her way, the way she was, the wheels were turning.

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Speaker 6: You could see it in her face. You all know

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Speaker 6: that face. Oh yeah, oh yeah, and she was she said, no,

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Speaker 6: not his father, but a different father, like she already knew,

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Speaker 6: and she wouldn't tell me, but she already. It was

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Speaker 6: pretty great. It was pretty great.

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Speaker 5: And that was so early, super early on.

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Speaker 4: Oh that his role is so iconic as Meredith Gray's dad,

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Speaker 4: iconic iconic role.

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Speaker 5: That do you mean that the dad of somebody who

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Speaker 5: might have been on a medical show.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, that's exact, that's exactly correct on a medical show.

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Speaker 5: Linda, tell us a little bit, and tell everybody who's list,

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Speaker 5: say a little bit. So you are have been for

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Speaker 5: years and you are a casting director. What's your story?

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Speaker 5: How did you start? How do you how did this happen?

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Speaker 4: Yeah, Betsy likes to call it, what's your superhero like

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Speaker 4: origin story?

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Speaker 2: Yeah?

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Speaker 3: Because I I don't.

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Speaker 4: Did you just wake up one day and know that

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Speaker 4: being a casting director is something you could do?

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Speaker 5: Because we all start as actors. I always figure like.

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Speaker 6: Yeah, well I started as an actor, but that isn't

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Speaker 6: you know. Look, I think for me it was it

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Speaker 6: was a bit of a different journey. I have to say, say,

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Speaker 6: and Katie, I think I told you this, so I

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Speaker 6: hope you're not bored. I think we you and I

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Speaker 6: talked about this recently. But besides the fact, you know,

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Speaker 6: growing up in New York, growing up in New York

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Speaker 6: was a huge boost because if you grew up in

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Speaker 6: New York and if your parents went to see the

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Speaker 6: theater sometimes they sometimes you got lucky and they took

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Speaker 6: you to Broadway, and they took me to you know,

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Speaker 6: the big Broadway shows. Sound of Music in my time,

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Speaker 6: you know Sound of Music and My Fair Lady and

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Speaker 6: Oklahoma and Westside Store, you know all those big musicals.

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Speaker 6: I was never so happy in my life as when

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Speaker 6: I was sitting there, and I think for a kid,

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Speaker 6: it was more than just I love this. I like

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Speaker 6: wanted to work there. I wanted to vacuum the carpets.

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Speaker 6: I wanted to be an usher. I wanted to see

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Speaker 6: the show every night for the rest of my life.

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Speaker 6: I wanted to, you know, run away from home and

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Speaker 6: just be like join the circus. I thought about it

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Speaker 6: all the time. I had a little record player and

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Speaker 6: I used to play the records over and over and

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Speaker 6: over and over and over again, the musicals, and I

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Speaker 6: just thought that probably I wanted to be an actor.

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Speaker 6: And I think that's where we get confused, because you

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Speaker 6: don't know what the other jobs are, right, You just

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Speaker 6: don't really know. So I went to the American Academy

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Speaker 6: of Dramatic Arts.

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Speaker 3: I did not know that you went to AMDA.

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Speaker 6: From ninth grade to twelfth grade. I went from just

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Speaker 6: on Saturdays, and I took the train to New York

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Speaker 6: ause I grew up in Westchester County. Anyway, I did

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Speaker 6: really well there, and they invited me into their college program.

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Speaker 6: And they only invited two of us from all of

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Speaker 6: the classes into the college program. So you know, I

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Speaker 6: was going to go. So I went home that night

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Speaker 6: and I said to my dad and my mom, I said,

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Speaker 6: you know, this is what's happening. I'm going to stay

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Speaker 6: in New York and I'm going to go to the

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Speaker 6: American Academy for college. They did not look happy. And

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Speaker 6: it's not that they didn't want me to be an actor.

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Speaker 6: They just said, that's what is that? And I said,

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Speaker 6: it's a two year pro that was it. They were like,

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Speaker 6: that's a junior college. No, yeah, that's how they viewed

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Speaker 6: the world. It was college, junior college. And I was

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Speaker 6: a good student. So my dad and I made a

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Speaker 6: deal that i'd apply to one school and if I

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Speaker 6: didn't get in, it was pretty a good deal for me.

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Speaker 6: I thought, just if I didn't get in, I could

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Speaker 6: go and Harvard and Yale and some of the sort

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Speaker 6: of we used to call them the seven Sister schools.

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Speaker 6: You know, we're off the list, you know, because not

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Speaker 6: the obvious. You're not getting into Harvard, so you can't

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Speaker 6: use that. But I knew about a little school called

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Speaker 6: Northwestern that we used to call the Harvard of the

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Speaker 6: Midwest growing up. They didn't know that, my parents, they

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Speaker 6: didn't know anything about it. It was in Chicago, it

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Speaker 6: was out in the provinces, so to speak. So I said, okay,

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Speaker 6: and I knew they had a good theater department if

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Speaker 6: worse came to worse, you know. So I applied to

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Speaker 6: Northwestern and I got it. So never today could I

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Speaker 6: get into that school, but I got in.

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Speaker 1: Did you do a lot of plays, Linda, while you

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Speaker 1: were there?

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Speaker 6: No place?

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Speaker 5: Really?

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Speaker 6: I got so scared because at north When I got

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Speaker 6: to Northwestern, you were all kind of mushed together, you know,

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Speaker 6: for auditions and whatnot into a little theater in the

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Speaker 6: heart of Evanston, which was called the Benson Street Theater

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Speaker 6: or Cohn Auditorium, and you were auditioning against seniors and

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Speaker 6: like stars at Northwestern. And that's when I got a

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Speaker 6: taste of rejection. And I thought, oh, I don't like

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Speaker 6: hell I don't know hell no, hell no, I don't

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Speaker 6: know how you all do it. I just was like,

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Speaker 6: this is the most depressing I'm you know, I just

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Speaker 6: but I still like the the literature, you know, and

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Speaker 6: I love the professors, and I loved like my interp

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Speaker 6: class and one of the professors at Northwestern. I graduated early,

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Speaker 6: and I kept going back to the school to visit,

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Speaker 6: and I ran into him and can't even remember his

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Speaker 6: name right now. And he said, look, Lynda, I've been

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Speaker 6: thinking about you. There's a course in England, in the

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Speaker 6: North of England at Durham University that is starting a

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Speaker 6: degree for drama and education and they're accepting applicants and

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Speaker 6: it's just starting and they're only going to take a

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Speaker 6: few people. And I think you should apply. And I

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Speaker 6: know that I know the professor who's running it a

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Speaker 6: little bit, and he's worth he's worth it. So what

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Speaker 6: did I I just thought, okay, you know, I didn't

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Speaker 6: even look at a map. I just thought, oh, Durham,

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Speaker 6: it's probably near London. I mean it was six hours

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Speaker 6: by trying because you'd have to go to the library

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Speaker 6: to look at him. I had never been out of

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Speaker 6: the country except to Canada. On the train going to Durham,

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Speaker 6: it seemed like every stop we made we went back

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Speaker 6: in time, about fifteen years. I thought, by the time

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Speaker 6: we got to Durham, like the women would be wearing

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Speaker 6: like little and I thought there was there was. I

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Speaker 6: thought there was Queen's English and Cockney. I had no

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Speaker 6: idea that there were all the other.

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Speaker 5: Actual you were raised on. You were waste on my

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Speaker 5: fir lady.

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Speaker 3: I mean, what else did you Poppins? Which they're just

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Speaker 3: too Yeah, what did I know it's like?

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Speaker 6: And so when I get off the train and it's

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Speaker 6: a Jordy thing, I thought I was in Scotland and

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Speaker 6: I had gotten off at the wrong time. I couldn't

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Speaker 6: understand anybody, and it started drizzling, and I walked into

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Speaker 6: my classroom and maybe the most beautiful man I had

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Speaker 6: ever seen in my life, in my whole life, was

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Speaker 6: standing at the head of I thought it was hallucinating.

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Speaker 3: And it's not Jeff Perry.

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Speaker 6: It's not Jeff Perry. It wasn't Jeff Perry. It wasn't

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Speaker 6: my first husband either. But it was Sting.

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Speaker 3: Oh, no one, the only Sting.

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Speaker 6: The only only He wasn't Sting. Then he was Gordon

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Speaker 6: Sumner and he was a teacher in a high school

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Speaker 6: in Newcastle.

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Speaker 5: Please tell me, Please tell me there was love. You

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Speaker 5: guys make out.

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Speaker 4: And then please take us through you.

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Speaker 5: Please tell me there was sweet sweet love.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, and then tell us what I was like.

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Speaker 1: Truth.

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Speaker 6: So the reason I bring that up is because you

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Speaker 6: never know how your past is going to intersect with

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Speaker 6: your future. And the reason I got my first big

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Speaker 6: break in casting, which was to do a Michael Apted film. Wow,

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Speaker 6: every casting director wanted to meet him, every single one

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Speaker 6: in the world, And I thought, I don't even know

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Speaker 6: how I got there. Anyway. I was sitting there and

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Speaker 6: I was thinking to.

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Speaker 3: Myself, how do I make out with Sting?

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Speaker 6: Yeah? How come I didn't make out with Sting? That's

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Speaker 6: what I was thinking about. I was thinking to myself, Well,

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Speaker 6: wait a minute, he did Bring on the Night. Michael

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Speaker 6: Apted directed Bring on the Night, the Sting documentary, so

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Speaker 6: I thought, oh, I'll talk to him about Sting. You know,

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Speaker 6: I'll tell him what happened. And when I told him

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Speaker 6: that story, it was like his chin had to be

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Speaker 6: lifted off of the desk. He just said, you know,

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Speaker 6: when we were doing Bring on the Night, we were

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Speaker 6: looking for anybody who knew him in that at that time,

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Speaker 6: if there was an American that might have known him

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Speaker 6: during those years when he had that other band. He said,

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Speaker 6: this is so incredible, and he and I got along

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Speaker 6: like wildfire, and I got the job above like I

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Speaker 6: hadn't cast one thing yet.

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Speaker 4: Wow, Wow, we will be back with more after the break.

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Speaker 6: My degree never helped me one bit. It was the

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Speaker 6: place and people, so sting that helped before that. Going

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Speaker 6: back now to after graduate school, when I moved back

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Speaker 6: to New York and I lived in the West Village,

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Speaker 6: I lived in the East Village. Sorry, I lived on

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Speaker 6: Tenth Street. And I go and interview with this company.

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Speaker 6: They're called TDF and they support Broadway during previews through

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Speaker 6: a subscription that they do, and they pretty much support

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Speaker 6: completely support off off Broadway, or they did through this

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Speaker 6: thing called a voucher program. It's just to give theater

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Speaker 6: a boost, and they gave Broadway a boost during previews

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Speaker 6: because they sold cheaper tickets to their subscriber based smart right.

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Speaker 6: Any company that was getting X amount of dollars from

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Speaker 6: the federal government at that time that was a not

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Speaker 6: for profit had to start providing for the differently able. Anyway,

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Speaker 6: go for my interview, and I made it to like

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Speaker 6: the third or fourth, I guess it was the third

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Speaker 6: interview where I met that guy who ran the place

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Speaker 6: and he was a brit I didn't know that. And

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Speaker 6: he's looking at my resume and he said, did you

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Speaker 6: actually go to Durham University? And I said, well, you know,

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Speaker 6: I didn't make it up. And he said, I'm from

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Speaker 6: Durham and I've never met an American that's ever spent

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Speaker 6: time there. So we talked about Durham the whole time

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Speaker 6: and where I lived and my experiences and everything, and

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Speaker 6: he hired me off the spot at age twenty three

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Speaker 6: to run this program to make Bad Way cut to

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Speaker 6: I was interested in doing this, getting sign language interpreters

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Speaker 6: in and signing the shows, you know, once a month.

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Speaker 6: We figured we would figure it out. The Schuberts and

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Speaker 6: the Nederlanders wouldn't let us do that because of union rules.

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Speaker 6: They were being so still. It was like we're unionized

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Speaker 6: down to the floor tax and you can't do that

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Speaker 6: or we'll get sued. And we're like, well what do

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Speaker 6: you That doesn't anyway. They just didn't want to do it.

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Speaker 6: They thought it would be I didn't want to do

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Speaker 6: a night for the deaf, and I knew so they

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Speaker 6: could look through the sign language interpreters onto the stage.

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Speaker 6: We'd have a special play bill. It would be an

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Speaker 6: integrated event. And they said you can't start at Broadway.

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Speaker 6: You need to start off off Broadway and I was like, okay, Well,

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Speaker 6: if you're a deaf person and you're taking the bus,

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Speaker 6: to work like every person in the city. And you

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Speaker 6: see marquees for you know, a chorus line. You want

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Speaker 6: to go see a chorus line. You do not want

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Speaker 6: to go see kabuki media down in the east, you know.

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Speaker 2: Yep.

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Speaker 3: And it was and I was.

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Speaker 1: Naked, which Katie was doing in a black box theater

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Speaker 1: when she started.

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Speaker 5: She was naked and she was reroly running glass.

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Speaker 3: Yeah anyway, that's hard period.

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Speaker 4: No, yeah, no, I want to see the show like

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Speaker 4: this is ridiculous.

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Speaker 5: People.

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Speaker 6: Yeah, yes, it was ridiculous. So for two So for

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Speaker 6: two years or a year and a half, while that

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Speaker 6: was a fight between my boss and the supert Anitalanders,

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Speaker 6: I went around all the boroughs and got a mailing list,

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Speaker 6: like a huge mailing list of deaf people interested. And

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Speaker 6: Phyllis Freelich was you know, around then, and there were

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Speaker 6: people that were helping me. And but in the meantime,

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Speaker 6: I did a wheelchair access. I did tickets if you

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Speaker 6: were visually impaired. I became like a little box office,

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Speaker 6: and so people could come to me and I could

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Speaker 6: get your seats up front. I could get your seats

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Speaker 6: a nile seat. I could get you what you needed

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Speaker 6: because I became friends with all the box office treasurers.

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Speaker 6: Here was I twenty three, running around God, my friends

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Speaker 6: with all the box office treasurers.

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Speaker 1: So Great lod.

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Speaker 6: Hold, Children of a Lesser God comes to Broadway and

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Speaker 6: wins two. And at that point the Schubert's called Hugh

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Speaker 6: Southern my boss. And they said, that little persnickety sassy

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Speaker 6: gal you got back there. Tell her she can do

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Speaker 6: whatever she wants.

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Speaker 5: No way.

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Speaker 6: So we started and I hired the I had the

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Speaker 6: ability to hire a few of the actors from the

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Speaker 6: National Theater of the Deaf to be like my board,

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Speaker 6: you know, to be like my to make sure that

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Speaker 6: the signing, that the signage of the interpreters was correct,

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Speaker 6: and to just to just lend a hand, so to speak.

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Speaker 6: And so what happened was I started casting, and I

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Speaker 6: didn't know I was casting because I wanted the sign

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Speaker 6: language interpreters, and there's a lot of them in New York,

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Speaker 6: to look like the shows. So if we were doing

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Speaker 6: chorus line, I wanted them to look like dancers. If

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Speaker 6: we were doing you know, best Little Whorehouse in Texas,

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Speaker 6: I didn't want them to look like I wanted them

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Speaker 6: to look like something else. And so that's that's that

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Speaker 6: isn't so, you know, incredible. So I didn't really know

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Speaker 6: I was casting though until I came to Hollywood.

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Speaker 1: That's amazing.

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Speaker 5: We keep start hearing this. That's what's interesting because I

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Speaker 5: think certainly I can relate to a lot of what

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Speaker 5: you're talking about. Is I always say when people ask them,

377
00:19:53,840 --> 00:19:57,119
Speaker 5: like every single thing you do will lead you to

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Speaker 5: what ends up bringing you joy or you feel success

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00:20:00,160 --> 00:20:03,639
Speaker 5: full or confident doing every single job you do, every

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Speaker 5: single thing you study. I mean, the fact that you've

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Speaker 5: just pointed out that the location you were in, which

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Speaker 5: was in Stick City, England, that I mean, then the

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00:20:15,280 --> 00:20:18,160
Speaker 5: stink connection, the fact that you had the experience you had,

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Speaker 5: all of that added to a job and it's like

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Speaker 5: it's like spirits were going like, this is your job,

386
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Speaker 5: but you don't know it yet. You're just gonna build it.

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Speaker 5: But there's a job. And that's one of the things

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Speaker 5: we keep saying in this podcast is listen, like what

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Speaker 5: you did. That's amazing story because you've absolutely encapsulated what

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00:20:39,720 --> 00:20:45,800
Speaker 5: I would call an incredibly inspiring but successful path of

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Speaker 5: accepting what comes in your lap. It's like, for me,

392
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Speaker 5: I gave up acting because I needed to make money,

393
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Speaker 5: and I read scripts and it turned out I was

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Speaker 5: really good with scripts and material. All of a sudden

395
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Speaker 5: there was a job.

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Speaker 6: At that point, I thought maybe I was going to

397
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Speaker 6: turn into Betsy. Do you remember the producing team in

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Speaker 6: New York for theater Now Nation and Len McCann. Yeah,

399
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Speaker 6: I thought I was going to be them with a

400
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Speaker 6: different person, you know, like I'd have a partner and

401
00:21:13,920 --> 00:21:16,560
Speaker 6: I produced theater. I had no idea how you did it,

402
00:21:16,960 --> 00:21:20,000
Speaker 6: but I just loved, you know, that cold New York thing.

403
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Speaker 6: And to tell you the truth, when you would go

404
00:21:22,880 --> 00:21:25,520
Speaker 6: see movies. I didn't really watch television, but when you

405
00:21:25,560 --> 00:21:28,920
Speaker 6: would go see movies, casting directors did not get upfront

406
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Speaker 6: credit for a very very long time. It did not

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Speaker 6: become a thing. I think Lynn stall Master.

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Speaker 5: I remember Wody Allen. It was a big thing. Like

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Speaker 5: it happened relatively early.

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Speaker 6: Alan gave it and also Mike Fenton fought for it,

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Speaker 6: and I think it started somewhere around Kramer versus Kramer,

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00:21:50,440 --> 00:21:55,320
Speaker 6: people started getting, you know, main title credit. Lynn Stallmaster

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Speaker 6: got it early, I think for something that he had done,

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Speaker 6: but it didn't stick. It wasn't like every have know

415
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Speaker 6: and that was it, and.

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Speaker 5: It was like a one off with different directors too,

417
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Speaker 5: so it's like it was a it was a cluster.

418
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Speaker 5: But it's so interesting when you look at that, and

419
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Speaker 5: this is a whole other area of the business that

420
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Speaker 5: obviously it's relevant to all of us. And when you

421
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Speaker 5: look at credits, if you're just a viewer, there's a

422
00:22:21,000 --> 00:22:24,760
Speaker 5: lot that goes into figuring out like who's before the

423
00:22:24,840 --> 00:22:27,600
Speaker 5: show starts or the movie starts and credits on TV

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Speaker 5: or sort of wacka doodle.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, And also for you listening, there's shared cards or

426
00:22:31,280 --> 00:22:34,240
Speaker 4: single cards, which means some actors get their name by themselves.

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00:22:34,480 --> 00:22:37,960
Speaker 4: Some actors have to have their name alongside one, possibly

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Speaker 4: two other actors. And these are all things worked out

429
00:22:40,480 --> 00:22:44,359
Speaker 4: in the deal before you start working. And that's the

430
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Speaker 4: stuff that Betsy was talking about in the beginning that

431
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Speaker 4: when she's like, ah, this sucks, because it does, Linda Lowe,

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Speaker 4: that is a muge part of casting is like these deals.

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Speaker 6: That's the biggest thing is credit.

434
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Speaker 5: The deals are and to the it's it's such a

435
00:23:00,960 --> 00:23:04,639
Speaker 5: big deal. And when you think about like basically what

436
00:23:04,640 --> 00:23:07,440
Speaker 5: I've always thought is okay, cour with the people you

437
00:23:07,480 --> 00:23:11,000
Speaker 5: couldn't make the show without right for the genesis of show.

438
00:23:11,720 --> 00:23:16,000
Speaker 5: You can't do Jack Poop without a great casting director,

439
00:23:16,040 --> 00:23:18,400
Speaker 5: like you can't because the whole show the same way,

440
00:23:19,000 --> 00:23:20,919
Speaker 5: the look of it, I mean, every single thing like

441
00:23:20,960 --> 00:23:24,040
Speaker 5: and the fact that it was sort of treated as

442
00:23:24,080 --> 00:23:27,720
Speaker 5: I would say, a chick job for years. It's like

443
00:23:27,800 --> 00:23:29,800
Speaker 5: the casting ladies. I mean, there are men too, but

444
00:23:29,840 --> 00:23:34,880
Speaker 5: it was sort of like it's it's not a supporting roles,

445
00:23:35,680 --> 00:23:38,480
Speaker 5: it's every single thing. And I think what's interesting to me,

446
00:23:38,600 --> 00:23:42,160
Speaker 5: Lenny is it's like, you know, you started looking at

447
00:23:42,200 --> 00:23:46,439
Speaker 5: theater and then you ended up in movies, and then

448
00:23:46,800 --> 00:23:50,120
Speaker 5: in a way you skip movies for a second where

449
00:23:50,160 --> 00:23:52,840
Speaker 5: their leads and their stars, and that's so much of it.

450
00:23:53,160 --> 00:23:55,400
Speaker 5: And you go back to your comment about ensembles, which

451
00:23:55,440 --> 00:23:58,520
Speaker 5: to me is so much theater and TV. It must

452
00:23:58,560 --> 00:24:01,120
Speaker 5: have been really interesting to make the transition for movies

453
00:24:01,800 --> 00:24:03,480
Speaker 5: to televisions.

454
00:24:02,840 --> 00:24:07,760
Speaker 6: Because because even in theater, and we all have experienced

455
00:24:07,760 --> 00:24:11,919
Speaker 6: this with theater, and we all experience this with with

456
00:24:13,400 --> 00:24:16,240
Speaker 6: I mean Girmo and Katie. You know what I'm talking

457
00:24:16,280 --> 00:24:20,720
Speaker 6: about when I say there's a difference between what feels

458
00:24:20,880 --> 00:24:26,960
Speaker 6: canned and you know, we ordained compared to what feels

459
00:24:27,560 --> 00:24:31,400
Speaker 6: in the moment, and that's how I conducted every audition

460
00:24:31,680 --> 00:24:35,160
Speaker 6: I ever. Did you know how much did you rehearse

461
00:24:35,240 --> 00:24:37,200
Speaker 6: this at home? And how much can I get out

462
00:24:37,200 --> 00:24:39,159
Speaker 6: of you right now here in the moment where I

463
00:24:39,200 --> 00:24:42,040
Speaker 6: feel something and you're telling me the truth and it's

464
00:24:42,080 --> 00:24:46,159
Speaker 6: exciting and it's not just just something you worked on

465
00:24:46,240 --> 00:24:48,240
Speaker 6: at home, which I can tell that you're not veering

466
00:24:48,280 --> 00:24:52,240
Speaker 6: off from. And that's what all my direction was always about.

467
00:24:52,480 --> 00:24:57,879
Speaker 6: And for me, that's been a continual signpost right up

468
00:24:57,920 --> 00:24:58,600
Speaker 6: to right now.

469
00:24:59,080 --> 00:25:01,120
Speaker 4: You know, Oh my god, And you can really tell

470
00:25:01,240 --> 00:25:03,480
Speaker 4: for all the actors listening, Like when you go into

471
00:25:03,520 --> 00:25:06,679
Speaker 4: other auditions rooms, it might be in like a big

472
00:25:06,800 --> 00:25:09,479
Speaker 4: conference room that's like massive, and you're trying to like

473
00:25:10,119 --> 00:25:12,199
Speaker 4: fill the space with your voice, even though it might

474
00:25:12,200 --> 00:25:14,760
Speaker 4: be like a very intimate scene. Or you might be

475
00:25:14,880 --> 00:25:17,159
Speaker 4: in like, oh my god, I've been in casting offices

476
00:25:17,200 --> 00:25:19,520
Speaker 4: that I am not going to name names where such

477
00:25:19,680 --> 00:25:21,239
Speaker 4: fucking insanity is going on.

478
00:25:21,400 --> 00:25:22,440
Speaker 3: I can't even begin to.

479
00:25:22,400 --> 00:25:26,120
Speaker 4: Tell you, like such like like twenty I know we're

480
00:25:26,119 --> 00:25:28,439
Speaker 4: all dog people here, but like twenty dogs in the

481
00:25:28,520 --> 00:25:31,560
Speaker 4: audition room like jumping on my lap and I'm trying

482
00:25:31,560 --> 00:25:33,959
Speaker 4: to have a break down like craziness, but like you

483
00:25:34,000 --> 00:25:38,800
Speaker 4: go into Linda's office and it feels like you go

484
00:25:38,960 --> 00:25:43,399
Speaker 4: and there's a cat like it's very intimate and informal,

485
00:25:43,480 --> 00:25:45,280
Speaker 4: but formal at the same time, it's like you know

486
00:25:45,359 --> 00:25:47,000
Speaker 4: and you know you better do your work because in

487
00:25:47,040 --> 00:25:49,640
Speaker 4: the business, everyone knows Linda Lowie's a theater person, she's

488
00:25:49,680 --> 00:25:53,200
Speaker 4: a real actor's casting director, she's married to Jeff Perry.

489
00:25:53,200 --> 00:25:54,200
Speaker 3: You got to know your shit.

490
00:25:54,640 --> 00:25:57,120
Speaker 4: But then when you get in there, it's all about

491
00:25:57,840 --> 00:26:04,119
Speaker 4: like honesty and truth and yeah, it's really I mean,

492
00:26:04,160 --> 00:26:05,760
Speaker 4: I know ge you feel like that when you go

493
00:26:05,840 --> 00:26:07,080
Speaker 4: in Oh totally.

494
00:26:07,240 --> 00:26:09,520
Speaker 6: Yeah, well we had so much fun. We have so

495
00:26:09,600 --> 00:26:11,399
Speaker 6: much fun. But there's no room in it. Like the

496
00:26:11,480 --> 00:26:14,400
Speaker 6: last time I was casting, there was a room. Now

497
00:26:14,400 --> 00:26:17,760
Speaker 6: there's no room. It doesn't seem like as I go

498
00:26:17,920 --> 00:26:23,000
Speaker 6: back into you know, the casting world arena.

499
00:26:22,800 --> 00:26:25,800
Speaker 5: I really, I really hope that there rooms because we

500
00:26:25,840 --> 00:26:28,760
Speaker 5: need it. I still believe, especially for chemistry readings. And

501
00:26:28,800 --> 00:26:30,240
Speaker 5: I think we've talked about this a little bit on

502
00:26:30,280 --> 00:26:32,919
Speaker 5: this podcast, but that's something we all do. When we

503
00:26:32,960 --> 00:26:34,640
Speaker 5: have a couple of actors who are going to work

504
00:26:35,160 --> 00:26:39,520
Speaker 5: very closely together and the casting director puts the two

505
00:26:39,560 --> 00:26:42,239
Speaker 5: actors in a room so that and tapes it so

506
00:26:42,320 --> 00:26:43,920
Speaker 5: we can see it if we're not there or if we're

507
00:26:43,920 --> 00:26:45,879
Speaker 5: sitting there, we watch it so we can sort of

508
00:26:45,880 --> 00:26:48,480
Speaker 5: feel if there's real if there's a real vibe between

509
00:26:48,800 --> 00:26:53,720
Speaker 5: the actors, right, And I think at the I still

510
00:26:53,760 --> 00:26:56,160
Speaker 5: think that there's something about in person. And I also

511
00:26:56,240 --> 00:26:59,480
Speaker 5: can say as a producer in Linda Lwi's office, it's

512
00:26:59,520 --> 00:27:02,320
Speaker 5: a little bit like how do I put this, It's

513
00:27:02,359 --> 00:27:06,560
Speaker 5: like a cross between a spa and a church, but

514
00:27:07,200 --> 00:27:11,639
Speaker 5: now but with a sense of humor. I'm never in

515
00:27:11,640 --> 00:27:15,399
Speaker 5: that office, I did, no, but you coming in like

516
00:27:15,440 --> 00:27:18,400
Speaker 5: there there'd be water and there'd be sort of like

517
00:27:18,480 --> 00:27:21,240
Speaker 5: it'd be kind of quiet and nice, and people would

518
00:27:21,240 --> 00:27:22,840
Speaker 5: be coming in and out and feel.

519
00:27:22,720 --> 00:27:23,800
Speaker 3: Kind of sacred. Like it didn't.

520
00:27:23,840 --> 00:27:26,760
Speaker 4: It doesn't feel like did like you're part of this

521
00:27:26,880 --> 00:27:31,280
Speaker 4: huge machine. The other like cool thing about Linda is like,

522
00:27:32,840 --> 00:27:35,399
Speaker 4: you know, some of these rooms you go in and

523
00:27:35,400 --> 00:27:37,679
Speaker 4: there's five hundred people, like you feel like you're in

524
00:27:37,720 --> 00:27:42,600
Speaker 4: a meat market. I mean it is bananas. And I

525
00:27:42,640 --> 00:27:45,200
Speaker 4: feel like, Linda, you do so much of your work

526
00:27:45,400 --> 00:27:48,480
Speaker 4: knowing all of what the actors are currently doing, what's

527
00:27:48,560 --> 00:27:50,760
Speaker 4: on what are they working on, so that when a

528
00:27:50,840 --> 00:27:55,520
Speaker 4: park comes up, you already know who would be quote

529
00:27:55,600 --> 00:27:57,960
Speaker 4: unquote right for this, and also who are all the

530
00:27:58,040 --> 00:28:02,920
Speaker 4: outside types that might or completely not what we've discussed

531
00:28:02,960 --> 00:28:05,800
Speaker 4: but could be very fucking right and different.

532
00:28:06,760 --> 00:28:11,639
Speaker 6: Yeah, you know, for me, usually every actor, you know,

533
00:28:11,640 --> 00:28:13,719
Speaker 6: I want them so bad to get the job, and

534
00:28:13,760 --> 00:28:16,040
Speaker 6: I always want them to leave the office feeling good

535
00:28:16,040 --> 00:28:18,480
Speaker 6: about what they did. And I always do. I get

536
00:28:18,480 --> 00:28:22,199
Speaker 6: behind because I direct a lot and I you know,

537
00:28:22,280 --> 00:28:24,879
Speaker 6: always tip them off to sort of what the real

538
00:28:24,920 --> 00:28:27,159
Speaker 6: reel is. You know that it's not really going to

539
00:28:27,200 --> 00:28:29,520
Speaker 6: be this actually because we know we changed all the

540
00:28:29,600 --> 00:28:31,119
Speaker 6: sides a lot of the times.

541
00:28:32,080 --> 00:28:34,760
Speaker 5: No, you you do. And and the thing a lot

542
00:28:34,800 --> 00:28:37,080
Speaker 5: of people don't know is, and this is sort of

543
00:28:37,160 --> 00:28:39,880
Speaker 5: rare for Linda because I've worked with other casting directors

544
00:28:39,880 --> 00:28:43,760
Speaker 5: at different points, is very often you'll have an actor

545
00:28:43,800 --> 00:28:45,959
Speaker 5: in that you think actually has real possibility or you

546
00:28:46,000 --> 00:28:48,880
Speaker 5: feel like could use it, and you do a precession

547
00:28:50,080 --> 00:28:53,520
Speaker 5: so right, because you know, thank you for that us.

548
00:28:53,760 --> 00:28:57,160
Speaker 5: All thats for us, But it's also as a producer

549
00:28:57,200 --> 00:28:59,600
Speaker 5: who's coming in and like Linda, look, I know what

550
00:28:59,600 --> 00:29:01,880
Speaker 5: it's like to fail in rooms because that's all I

551
00:29:01,880 --> 00:29:03,960
Speaker 5: did when I was an actor, so I how it feels.

552
00:29:04,320 --> 00:29:08,600
Speaker 5: But it's there's something about going in because I just

553
00:29:08,640 --> 00:29:10,200
Speaker 5: walk in and I just want, like you said, I

554
00:29:10,280 --> 00:29:13,480
Speaker 5: want everyone to be good and to know that somebody's

555
00:29:13,520 --> 00:29:17,920
Speaker 5: already had they've already had that begetting leg up so

556
00:29:17,960 --> 00:29:20,960
Speaker 5: that you can really get into it is a gigantic

557
00:29:21,600 --> 00:29:24,320
Speaker 5: piece of the success I think of the work you

558
00:29:24,360 --> 00:29:27,520
Speaker 5: do because it's not a game. It's not like the

559
00:29:27,560 --> 00:29:30,440
Speaker 5: actor is getting tricked into guessing what you're thinking, because

560
00:29:30,480 --> 00:29:32,840
Speaker 5: then you'd have to be a freaking weird psychic and

561
00:29:32,880 --> 00:29:34,440
Speaker 5: you should be an actor. You should make a lot

562
00:29:34,440 --> 00:29:40,040
Speaker 5: of money on like being clairvoyant television. It's not your job,

563
00:29:40,120 --> 00:29:42,320
Speaker 5: it's Linda. It's our job to know what we want

564
00:29:42,400 --> 00:29:45,760
Speaker 5: or be able. And then so many times Lynn, it's

565
00:29:45,800 --> 00:29:48,200
Speaker 5: like we will see somebody and kind of go that

566
00:29:48,240 --> 00:29:51,680
Speaker 5: person's great. Either you'll put them in the this is

567
00:29:51,720 --> 00:29:53,880
Speaker 5: a great person room, which I'm sure both of you

568
00:29:53,920 --> 00:29:57,480
Speaker 5: know what that's like, and always go back and say, wait,

569
00:29:57,520 --> 00:29:58,240
Speaker 5: is this the right part?

570
00:29:58,280 --> 00:29:58,480
Speaker 2: Wait?

571
00:29:58,560 --> 00:30:00,680
Speaker 5: Is this the right part? Because you fall in love

572
00:30:00,680 --> 00:30:03,680
Speaker 5: with an actor and it's not true. Everything is like

573
00:30:03,720 --> 00:30:05,120
Speaker 5: the part. Then the actor you fall in love with

574
00:30:05,200 --> 00:30:07,440
Speaker 5: an actor, and all of a sudden, a part emerges,

575
00:30:07,600 --> 00:30:10,480
Speaker 5: because I can say it from working with Shonda or

576
00:30:10,560 --> 00:30:12,120
Speaker 5: and all the other writers we've worked with. All of

577
00:30:12,120 --> 00:30:15,400
Speaker 5: a sudden, you write for somebody you know, and that's

578
00:30:15,440 --> 00:30:18,080
Speaker 5: only because the way you spend time with people, and

579
00:30:18,200 --> 00:30:18,920
Speaker 5: so many.

580
00:30:18,680 --> 00:30:21,040
Speaker 6: Times when you were in the room and Shonda was

581
00:30:21,040 --> 00:30:23,560
Speaker 6: in the room, we would look at each other and say,

582
00:30:23,920 --> 00:30:27,360
Speaker 6: save that one for episode three, or that person's going

583
00:30:27,440 --> 00:30:29,320
Speaker 6: to make a great senator and we have a senator

584
00:30:29,360 --> 00:30:31,680
Speaker 6: coming up. Or And I always say to actors, you

585
00:30:31,800 --> 00:30:34,800
Speaker 6: never know when you're auditioning for something what's going to happen,

586
00:30:35,200 --> 00:30:38,000
Speaker 6: because we might be saving you for a bigger part.

587
00:30:38,360 --> 00:30:41,280
Speaker 6: You might look too much like someone else who's already

588
00:30:41,320 --> 00:30:43,840
Speaker 6: been cast in the scene, so we can't cast you now.

589
00:30:43,920 --> 00:30:45,720
Speaker 6: But we love you, so we're going to bring you back.

590
00:30:45,720 --> 00:30:48,280
Speaker 6: And it might even be for a series regular. I mean,

591
00:30:48,440 --> 00:30:51,880
Speaker 6: look what happened to Kelly McCreary, you know that kind

592
00:30:51,960 --> 00:30:54,400
Speaker 6: of thing, Or and a million.

593
00:30:55,160 --> 00:30:58,440
Speaker 4: Every doctor on I don't know if we can say

594
00:30:58,480 --> 00:31:01,560
Speaker 4: it's a different show on a show that was like

595
00:31:01,600 --> 00:31:05,160
Speaker 4: a off of the medical show you all worked on

596
00:31:05,240 --> 00:31:09,040
Speaker 4: together that took place in Hawaii or Doctors Without Borders

597
00:31:09,680 --> 00:31:14,920
Speaker 4: starring Mamie Gummer and uh all those girls. I went

598
00:31:14,960 --> 00:31:19,280
Speaker 4: in a bunch of times for inside the Sarah Drew situation.

599
00:31:19,640 --> 00:31:22,160
Speaker 4: Like I just mean to say, I was knocking on

600
00:31:22,240 --> 00:31:22,800
Speaker 4: your door.

601
00:31:23,640 --> 00:31:24,880
Speaker 3: It's like bel.

602
00:31:26,960 --> 00:31:30,040
Speaker 4: Kept being like throwlos in there, like throw her in

603
00:31:30,080 --> 00:31:34,120
Speaker 4: there at some point, and thank god it was the one.

604
00:31:34,720 --> 00:31:39,239
Speaker 5: That I got. Yes, I think definitely, because the other

605
00:31:39,240 --> 00:31:41,360
Speaker 5: on a couple of the other ones not so much.

606
00:31:42,240 --> 00:31:44,280
Speaker 3: Well, they didn't have as long as a shelf life.

607
00:31:44,440 --> 00:31:46,560
Speaker 5: Now this is just an off the walk question because

608
00:31:46,560 --> 00:31:48,440
Speaker 5: we're talking about this, but do you know what like

609
00:31:48,680 --> 00:31:53,760
Speaker 5: the weirdest or most gigantically strange thing anybody's can you remember?

610
00:31:53,800 --> 00:31:55,400
Speaker 5: Because I can remember one thing that I thought was

611
00:31:55,400 --> 00:32:00,720
Speaker 5: incredibly strange, a bit weird. In your experience an actress

612
00:32:00,760 --> 00:32:05,720
Speaker 5: done to get apart or in the process of an audition,

613
00:32:06,200 --> 00:32:08,680
Speaker 5: do you have does anything stick out in your head?

614
00:32:09,080 --> 00:32:11,840
Speaker 6: Something one thing sticks out? I don't and I have

615
00:32:11,960 --> 00:32:16,400
Speaker 6: no idea, but I auditioned. This is early in my career.

616
00:32:17,480 --> 00:32:24,480
Speaker 6: I I auditioned actress and before she left, she handed

617
00:32:24,520 --> 00:32:28,520
Speaker 6: me some toilet paper, and on the toilet paper it

618
00:32:28,680 --> 00:32:32,720
Speaker 6: said I want this role or you know the role

619
00:32:32,800 --> 00:32:38,040
Speaker 6: you have, like as she walked out of the room,

620
00:32:38,160 --> 00:32:42,040
Speaker 6: and I thought, that is so desperate. And I kept

621
00:32:42,040 --> 00:32:44,840
Speaker 6: that toilet paper for a very very long time until

622
00:32:44,840 --> 00:32:46,840
Speaker 6: I just couldn't keep it anymore. To a roll of

623
00:32:46,920 --> 00:32:49,680
Speaker 6: toilet paper that had her name all over it. God,

624
00:32:50,880 --> 00:32:51,840
Speaker 6: I want the role.

625
00:32:58,040 --> 00:32:59,960
Speaker 5: Well put Oh my god.

626
00:33:00,120 --> 00:33:00,880
Speaker 1: We'll be right back.

627
00:33:00,920 --> 00:33:03,400
Speaker 6: Guys.

628
00:33:05,200 --> 00:33:07,920
Speaker 1: I've told this story before where I didn't. I didn't

629
00:33:07,920 --> 00:33:11,720
Speaker 1: even want to go in to audition for the political

630
00:33:11,760 --> 00:33:14,800
Speaker 1: show that we all worked on because the character in

631
00:33:15,280 --> 00:33:18,680
Speaker 1: the sides was described as a much older gentleman who

632
00:33:18,760 --> 00:33:20,920
Speaker 1: was sort of nebbish and nerdy, and I was I

633
00:33:20,960 --> 00:33:23,920
Speaker 1: remember being angry at my managers and being like, why

634
00:33:23,960 --> 00:33:25,640
Speaker 1: am I going in on this? I don't. It was

635
00:33:25,720 --> 00:33:28,880
Speaker 1: during pilot season. You know, you have fifty thousand auditions.

636
00:33:28,880 --> 00:33:32,160
Speaker 1: I was like, no, no, and my manager kept saying, geirmo,

637
00:33:32,320 --> 00:33:36,520
Speaker 1: Linda Lowe knows who you are. Just go in. So

638
00:33:36,640 --> 00:33:40,200
Speaker 1: that's just a so our listeners have a peek into

639
00:33:40,960 --> 00:33:43,720
Speaker 1: what sort of Linda Lowe and a lot of casting

640
00:33:43,760 --> 00:33:46,040
Speaker 1: directors are. Like. I was thinking about it last night.

641
00:33:46,080 --> 00:33:49,680
Speaker 1: I thought, you guys are are also magicians in a way,

642
00:33:49,720 --> 00:33:54,960
Speaker 1: and like Crystal ball readers because you you somehow were like, no,

643
00:33:55,080 --> 00:33:57,160
Speaker 1: I want to see Ghirmo Diaz. And I even remember

644
00:33:57,200 --> 00:33:59,040
Speaker 1: walking into the room and just being like, oh, I'm

645
00:33:59,080 --> 00:34:03,600
Speaker 1: not what felt like, it's not me? Yeah, and then

646
00:34:03,720 --> 00:34:06,880
Speaker 1: I yo, But then I started doing saying the words

647
00:34:06,960 --> 00:34:10,800
Speaker 1: and something happened and I thought, I remember getting chills.

648
00:34:10,840 --> 00:34:13,319
Speaker 1: And then at the end of my monologue, I looked

649
00:34:13,320 --> 00:34:15,160
Speaker 1: at Shanda and she was just staring at me, and

650
00:34:15,200 --> 00:34:17,720
Speaker 1: she said, you're a very interesting actor. And I felt

651
00:34:17,719 --> 00:34:19,640
Speaker 1: in my gut. I was like, oh my god, I

652
00:34:19,680 --> 00:34:23,160
Speaker 1: think I'm gonna get it. And and that's that's I mean.

653
00:34:23,520 --> 00:34:25,879
Speaker 1: I would have never gone in the room to even

654
00:34:25,920 --> 00:34:29,000
Speaker 1: audition if Linda had not told my managers I want

655
00:34:29,040 --> 00:34:31,600
Speaker 1: to see him. I see something in him, even though

656
00:34:31,640 --> 00:34:35,400
Speaker 1: the sides describe the character much different from who he is,

657
00:34:35,520 --> 00:34:36,239
Speaker 1: Do you know what I mean?

658
00:34:36,440 --> 00:34:41,200
Speaker 6: So yeah, Oh that's so good, Piermo. I remember that moment,

659
00:34:41,440 --> 00:34:45,920
Speaker 6: I really do. I remember so many of the elements well.

660
00:34:45,800 --> 00:34:49,120
Speaker 4: Casting directors, because you're married to Jeff, and you really

661
00:34:49,160 --> 00:34:53,680
Speaker 4: are inside, like you're just so inside. You're like you're

662
00:34:53,719 --> 00:34:57,280
Speaker 4: such an inside baseball casting director and I and I

663
00:34:57,280 --> 00:34:58,399
Speaker 4: think that you.

664
00:34:58,320 --> 00:34:59,719
Speaker 3: Are the secret gatekeeper.

665
00:34:59,760 --> 00:35:01,880
Speaker 4: Like, I don't think enough actors who are listening to

666
00:35:01,960 --> 00:35:06,880
Speaker 4: this understand it is the same three casting directors that

667
00:35:06,880 --> 00:35:10,920
Speaker 4: have employed me my entire twenty years, you know, and

668
00:35:11,000 --> 00:35:12,239
Speaker 4: like one I was a nanny for.

669
00:35:12,880 --> 00:35:16,520
Speaker 6: So by the way, you know, people like Laurie Metcalf

670
00:35:16,560 --> 00:35:18,880
Speaker 6: could say the same thing. I'm not kidding. Do you

671
00:35:19,000 --> 00:35:23,680
Speaker 6: have your favorite you have your ensemble ever casting director?

672
00:35:24,200 --> 00:35:26,600
Speaker 4: Yeah, one of my favorite casting stories of all time.

673
00:35:26,760 --> 00:35:29,480
Speaker 4: Talking about different people reading stuff and correct me if

674
00:35:29,480 --> 00:35:31,800
Speaker 4: I'm wrong. There's a certain character on a certain medical

675
00:35:31,880 --> 00:35:34,280
Speaker 4: drama that's still on. It might be the longest running

676
00:35:34,280 --> 00:35:36,320
Speaker 4: medical drama or drama of all time.

677
00:35:36,719 --> 00:35:37,719
Speaker 5: It might be that.

678
00:35:37,840 --> 00:35:43,560
Speaker 4: I think originally the role was for Kristin Chenowith type

679
00:35:44,200 --> 00:35:47,560
Speaker 4: that's correct of Bailey, and then Chandra Wilson ends up

680
00:35:47,560 --> 00:35:51,680
Speaker 4: booking it. I need to know in what world that's

681
00:35:51,719 --> 00:35:53,600
Speaker 4: what we're talking about, where it's like get out of

682
00:35:53,600 --> 00:35:54,360
Speaker 4: your own way.

683
00:35:55,080 --> 00:35:58,080
Speaker 5: Well, also, by the way, let's just I will add

684
00:35:58,120 --> 00:36:00,880
Speaker 5: to that and say there was only one character and

685
00:36:00,920 --> 00:36:05,840
Speaker 5: that whole script. My memory is that was described because

686
00:36:05,920 --> 00:36:08,920
Speaker 5: one of the things from the beginning we Shanda never

687
00:36:09,000 --> 00:36:12,880
Speaker 5: did and we never did, was we never identified look

688
00:36:13,360 --> 00:36:18,400
Speaker 5: type an age race age race like. We were like

689
00:36:18,640 --> 00:36:21,320
Speaker 5: not doing it except for one character.

690
00:36:22,120 --> 00:36:27,239
Speaker 6: One character a Shonda, both of you, all the producers.

691
00:36:27,239 --> 00:36:29,200
Speaker 6: They was like, you cast it the way you see

692
00:36:29,360 --> 00:36:31,520
Speaker 6: the world. Cast it the way you see the world.

693
00:36:31,520 --> 00:36:33,800
Speaker 6: And that's another thing, by the way, for casting directors,

694
00:36:34,120 --> 00:36:36,000
Speaker 6: you got to see a little bit before you can

695
00:36:36,040 --> 00:36:39,200
Speaker 6: cast it. I had been inside a courtroom. I had

696
00:36:39,200 --> 00:36:42,799
Speaker 6: been inside a police station. I had been inside you know,

697
00:36:42,800 --> 00:36:45,279
Speaker 6: I had traveled a little bit. You can't just be

698
00:36:45,480 --> 00:36:49,360
Speaker 6: like a you know, go from teenager in LA to

699
00:36:49,640 --> 00:36:53,560
Speaker 6: like an adult in LA. And I want to be

700
00:36:53,600 --> 00:36:55,759
Speaker 6: a casting director. That's we can talk about that in

701
00:36:55,760 --> 00:36:58,720
Speaker 6: a little bit. But you have to see some stuff

702
00:36:58,800 --> 00:37:02,120
Speaker 6: to be able to reflect that back into your work,

703
00:37:02,239 --> 00:37:02,480
Speaker 6: you know.

704
00:37:02,640 --> 00:37:06,200
Speaker 5: So yeah to that to your tier point, Katie, that's

705
00:37:06,200 --> 00:37:07,200
Speaker 5: that's true story.

706
00:37:10,200 --> 00:37:11,360
Speaker 3: Type. And you did not.

707
00:37:11,560 --> 00:37:17,400
Speaker 4: We cast the greatest actress, one of my favorite actresses,

708
00:37:17,520 --> 00:37:19,440
Speaker 4: and also directed some of the show that she and

709
00:37:19,440 --> 00:37:19,719
Speaker 4: I were on.

710
00:37:19,760 --> 00:37:20,440
Speaker 3: She's unbelievable.

711
00:37:21,120 --> 00:37:23,200
Speaker 5: We saw a tape from her in New York.

712
00:37:24,120 --> 00:37:27,680
Speaker 6: Remember we saw she put herself on tape in New York.

713
00:37:28,080 --> 00:37:31,799
Speaker 6: It was a VHS tape. May I just say that

714
00:37:32,080 --> 00:37:34,600
Speaker 6: I pulled it out of the machine. I watched it,

715
00:37:35,000 --> 00:37:37,000
Speaker 6: I pulled it out of the machine and I thought,

716
00:37:37,080 --> 00:37:40,960
Speaker 6: this cannot be denied. I walked down to where you

717
00:37:41,040 --> 00:37:44,200
Speaker 6: and Shonda were in that hospital. We were in that

718
00:37:44,320 --> 00:37:48,480
Speaker 6: hospital that that rented that It was a closed hospital

719
00:37:48,840 --> 00:37:51,960
Speaker 6: that we were using for offices and to shoot. Yeah, okay,

720
00:37:53,800 --> 00:37:55,560
Speaker 6: and I had an office in there, and I just

721
00:37:55,640 --> 00:37:57,640
Speaker 6: walked down there and I said, you have to see this.

722
00:37:58,840 --> 00:38:02,560
Speaker 6: You know, at that point, Chonda, we were just all

723
00:38:02,840 --> 00:38:04,680
Speaker 6: we might as well have all been in the same room.

724
00:38:04,760 --> 00:38:07,000
Speaker 6: We were all just always just talking to each other,

725
00:38:07,000 --> 00:38:07,719
Speaker 6: and I just walked in.

726
00:38:08,040 --> 00:38:09,960
Speaker 5: We did a lot of casting actually out of the

727
00:38:10,000 --> 00:38:11,839
Speaker 5: old office that I used to work in, and we

728
00:38:11,840 --> 00:38:14,000
Speaker 5: were all in this It's right. We were all in

729
00:38:14,080 --> 00:38:16,759
Speaker 5: this conference room that was tiny, and we'd have all

730
00:38:16,760 --> 00:38:19,239
Speaker 5: the additions. We met Dempsey in that one.

731
00:38:19,320 --> 00:38:19,600
Speaker 2: It was.

732
00:38:21,719 --> 00:38:26,360
Speaker 5: Yeah, West La off of Olympic, and we met everybody

733
00:38:26,400 --> 00:38:28,520
Speaker 5: in there. And I remember like Jim Pickens going in

734
00:38:28,560 --> 00:38:32,040
Speaker 5: and like Cape Burton going in. And the thing about

735
00:38:32,040 --> 00:38:34,239
Speaker 5: pilot season, as you all know, which is it was

736
00:38:34,280 --> 00:38:36,439
Speaker 5: the first time we'd ever made a television show. Neither

737
00:38:36,480 --> 00:38:38,840
Speaker 5: us knew what the hell we were doing. It was Lenny,

738
00:38:38,840 --> 00:38:41,160
Speaker 5: it was your first television show or like one of

739
00:38:41,160 --> 00:38:41,879
Speaker 5: your second ones.

740
00:38:42,040 --> 00:38:45,520
Speaker 6: I had been hired. I had been hired. I didn't

741
00:38:45,560 --> 00:38:47,800
Speaker 6: do the pilot. I had done a handful of pilots,

742
00:38:47,800 --> 00:38:49,640
Speaker 6: but I would never stay on them for the show

743
00:38:50,080 --> 00:38:52,360
Speaker 6: because I didn't understand television. I didn't think would be

744
00:38:52,360 --> 00:38:55,440
Speaker 6: good at it. And television and film were pretty separated

745
00:38:55,920 --> 00:38:59,759
Speaker 6: until around this moment when films started to lose a

746
00:38:59,760 --> 00:39:03,200
Speaker 6: lot of foreign financing and all of us became super frustrated,

747
00:39:03,719 --> 00:39:05,880
Speaker 6: and the ship was sinking and we had to like

748
00:39:06,360 --> 00:39:09,520
Speaker 6: jump off or sink with it. So Betsy jumped off.

749
00:39:09,600 --> 00:39:12,480
Speaker 6: I jumped off. Shonda jumped off. That's why people jumped off.

750
00:39:13,960 --> 00:39:15,160
Speaker 3: Were doing movies.

751
00:39:15,440 --> 00:39:18,360
Speaker 6: Yes, we were all doing movies, and we were trying

752
00:39:18,520 --> 00:39:21,680
Speaker 6: so which which added to some of the hilarity of

753
00:39:21,680 --> 00:39:24,359
Speaker 6: Betsy and I doing these deals, you know, as time

754
00:39:24,400 --> 00:39:27,200
Speaker 6: went on, because we didn't know what the hell had happened,

755
00:39:27,320 --> 00:39:32,239
Speaker 6: and I you know that. But anyway, Shonda, Shonda, I

756
00:39:32,360 --> 00:39:34,400
Speaker 6: just said you have to see this, and I shoved

757
00:39:34,440 --> 00:39:37,120
Speaker 6: it into the machine and as soon as it started,

758
00:39:37,160 --> 00:39:39,400
Speaker 6: she was like, no, but I want and then she

759
00:39:39,480 --> 00:39:42,920
Speaker 6: stopped talking and she just we were like me, and

760
00:39:42,960 --> 00:39:46,720
Speaker 6: she just said this is, this is, this cannot be denied.

761
00:39:46,880 --> 00:39:48,000
Speaker 6: We have to test it.

762
00:39:48,080 --> 00:39:53,800
Speaker 4: I am flabber gasted. Wow, by the way you used

763
00:39:53,800 --> 00:39:56,400
Speaker 4: to have to, which Linda and Betsy know more than

764
00:39:56,440 --> 00:39:58,080
Speaker 4: gen I, although I did it a few times, like

765
00:39:58,560 --> 00:40:02,120
Speaker 4: when you would screen test for a pilot, means it's

766
00:40:02,239 --> 00:40:03,000
Speaker 4: so awful.

767
00:40:03,120 --> 00:40:05,200
Speaker 3: Everyone listening. It used to be this old way of

768
00:40:05,239 --> 00:40:05,440
Speaker 3: you do.

769
00:40:05,560 --> 00:40:07,560
Speaker 4: You would have to do the audition for all the

770
00:40:07,600 --> 00:40:11,239
Speaker 4: studio and you would either get cut or passed, like

771
00:40:11,440 --> 00:40:13,440
Speaker 4: you could move on to network, and then you'd have

772
00:40:13,440 --> 00:40:15,799
Speaker 4: to do the audition again for like a ton of

773
00:40:15,840 --> 00:40:18,480
Speaker 4: other people in suits who were told like not to react,

774
00:40:18,640 --> 00:40:19,520
Speaker 4: not laugh.

775
00:40:19,400 --> 00:40:23,240
Speaker 3: Don't give you anything. It was a night mare.

776
00:40:23,680 --> 00:40:26,040
Speaker 6: I remember when a friend of mine audition had a

777
00:40:26,040 --> 00:40:29,879
Speaker 6: certain network and a certain head of the network at

778
00:40:29,880 --> 00:40:34,080
Speaker 6: that time, who was you know, he had roped off

779
00:40:34,400 --> 00:40:38,880
Speaker 6: seats like please like the house seats, so you know

780
00:40:38,920 --> 00:40:42,200
Speaker 6: we had a Anyway, she said that when she went in,

781
00:40:43,960 --> 00:40:47,120
Speaker 6: you know, auditioned her little heart out. When she left

782
00:40:47,200 --> 00:40:50,680
Speaker 6: before the door closed, he yelled at what about And

783
00:40:50,719 --> 00:40:53,200
Speaker 6: he said an actor's name that was like twenty five

784
00:40:53,280 --> 00:40:56,840
Speaker 6: years older than her. So just to know you're not

785
00:40:56,920 --> 00:41:00,359
Speaker 6: getting the role and to know that, like he you

786
00:41:00,360 --> 00:41:02,680
Speaker 6: look older than you are. I mean, it was just

787
00:41:02,800 --> 00:41:05,879
Speaker 6: all bad. It was a very bad way you did

788
00:41:05,880 --> 00:41:08,640
Speaker 6: do any bad system and actors and actors had to

789
00:41:08,680 --> 00:41:09,840
Speaker 6: sign their deals there.

790
00:41:10,080 --> 00:41:12,480
Speaker 1: Yeah, we had to sign our deals before you go auditioned.

791
00:41:12,560 --> 00:41:14,719
Speaker 6: Yeah, and a lot of times you were held up.

792
00:41:14,920 --> 00:41:15,960
Speaker 6: You were held up.

793
00:41:15,880 --> 00:41:17,680
Speaker 5: And everyone saw the deal didn't make and the person

794
00:41:17,719 --> 00:41:20,759
Speaker 5: went home. I mean I saw that happen too, so

795
00:41:20,920 --> 00:41:22,240
Speaker 5: it's yeah, it was sesty.

796
00:41:22,320 --> 00:41:24,200
Speaker 4: And also a lot of times you're fucking broke as

797
00:41:24,239 --> 00:41:27,480
Speaker 4: shit and you're seeing like, holy crap, I'm signing this

798
00:41:27,560 --> 00:41:31,080
Speaker 4: piece of paper that my entire life would change. If

799
00:41:31,080 --> 00:41:34,120
Speaker 4: I just booked one episode, I would make more money

800
00:41:34,160 --> 00:41:35,000
Speaker 4: than I've made this year.

801
00:41:35,239 --> 00:41:36,879
Speaker 3: Oh action, is it time to go?

802
00:41:37,160 --> 00:41:38,560
Speaker 4: And then you would have to just act in front

803
00:41:38,560 --> 00:41:42,479
Speaker 4: of all these people. It was so such a mind game.

804
00:41:42,600 --> 00:41:46,239
Speaker 6: It sucked well and then it sucked for the producers

805
00:41:46,280 --> 00:41:50,920
Speaker 6: too because in a little show that was about football

806
00:41:51,120 --> 00:41:55,520
Speaker 6: that took place in Texas, the character of Riggins, we

807
00:41:55,600 --> 00:41:59,720
Speaker 6: found a perfect person we thought was the perfect person.

808
00:42:00,200 --> 00:42:02,839
Speaker 6: He was sitting there before he goes in for his test.

809
00:42:02,960 --> 00:42:05,840
Speaker 6: I'm sitting there with Pete Berg and all the people

810
00:42:06,560 --> 00:42:09,239
Speaker 6: and it was we were at NBC, and you know

811
00:42:09,280 --> 00:42:14,000
Speaker 6: it was Kevin Riley who ran NBC. He find he

812
00:42:14,080 --> 00:42:16,080
Speaker 6: had been He was so new to town that his

813
00:42:16,280 --> 00:42:18,600
Speaker 6: manager at the time didn't even know that he was

814
00:42:18,640 --> 00:42:24,080
Speaker 6: a series regular on another show. Didn't even know until

815
00:42:24,120 --> 00:42:27,040
Speaker 6: we were like getting to the legal stuff. He was like, oh,

816
00:42:27,080 --> 00:42:29,160
Speaker 6: I thought he was just recurring. No, he had a deal.

817
00:42:29,200 --> 00:42:31,120
Speaker 6: He was a series regular on a show called like

818
00:42:31,239 --> 00:42:35,080
Speaker 6: Models Ink or something. We all had to go home

819
00:42:35,320 --> 00:42:38,920
Speaker 6: and go to bed. Pete Sarah mean, we all were

820
00:42:39,080 --> 00:42:40,920
Speaker 6: just I was so freaked out because he was the

821
00:42:40,960 --> 00:42:43,840
Speaker 6: only one we had. And then for the next week

822
00:42:44,640 --> 00:42:47,439
Speaker 6: I went back and back into all the we all

823
00:42:47,480 --> 00:42:50,520
Speaker 6: went crazy, and that's how we found the one who

824
00:42:50,600 --> 00:42:51,920
Speaker 6: really did play Riggins.

825
00:42:52,200 --> 00:42:54,600
Speaker 5: That actually happened on the Metal Coach Shows pilot, where

826
00:42:54,840 --> 00:42:58,240
Speaker 5: somebody we were planning and casting somebody. Then it turned

827
00:42:58,239 --> 00:43:01,320
Speaker 5: out that they in fact had to deal with another

828
00:43:01,400 --> 00:43:03,440
Speaker 5: show that they couldn't get out of, and then we

829
00:43:03,560 --> 00:43:06,040
Speaker 5: ended up having to recast that part. But the happy

830
00:43:06,360 --> 00:43:09,640
Speaker 5: part of that story is we left that person so

831
00:43:09,800 --> 00:43:13,120
Speaker 5: much that on another show a role was built specifically

832
00:43:13,160 --> 00:43:15,920
Speaker 5: for that person and it ended up being a long

833
00:43:16,040 --> 00:43:16,560
Speaker 5: running show.

834
00:43:16,719 --> 00:43:18,680
Speaker 4: Okay, Okay, so a couple more questions I want to know.

835
00:43:18,880 --> 00:43:21,560
Speaker 4: So you guys, what I was thinking about was how

836
00:43:22,160 --> 00:43:25,920
Speaker 4: I think you three, Betsy and Shanda Linda really changed

837
00:43:25,920 --> 00:43:29,000
Speaker 4: the game in terms of we're not going to have

838
00:43:29,080 --> 00:43:33,680
Speaker 4: the actors do this testing thing anymore. Like when g

839
00:43:33,840 --> 00:43:38,400
Speaker 4: and I were, you know, going in for our DC show.

840
00:43:39,120 --> 00:43:41,560
Speaker 4: That was the first time I had ever heard of

841
00:43:41,640 --> 00:43:44,759
Speaker 4: us making tapes in a casting dutcher's office, and that

842
00:43:44,920 --> 00:43:48,480
Speaker 4: somebody was big enough to just show the tape to

843
00:43:48,560 --> 00:43:51,560
Speaker 4: studio and network and make them sign off on it.

844
00:43:52,320 --> 00:43:54,600
Speaker 3: Right, Like Ge, you didn't have to go test.

845
00:43:54,400 --> 00:43:56,040
Speaker 1: But I was so happy that we didn't have to

846
00:43:56,040 --> 00:43:57,759
Speaker 1: tell you it was.

847
00:43:57,680 --> 00:44:00,000
Speaker 3: The greatest thing in the world. How did you guys

848
00:44:00,280 --> 00:44:01,080
Speaker 3: make that happen?

849
00:44:01,520 --> 00:44:04,879
Speaker 5: I actually think that started to be a thing too.

850
00:44:04,920 --> 00:44:06,239
Speaker 5: We may have been at the head of it, but

851
00:44:06,280 --> 00:44:09,400
Speaker 5: it started to be a thing because as management changed

852
00:44:09,480 --> 00:44:12,760
Speaker 5: at the studio in which we were working. Lyn, correct

853
00:44:12,760 --> 00:44:14,839
Speaker 5: me if I'm wrong, but I think I think we

854
00:44:14,840 --> 00:44:17,520
Speaker 5: were at the canary and the coal mine, frankly, because

855
00:44:17,840 --> 00:44:19,280
Speaker 5: you didn't want to do it.

856
00:44:19,480 --> 00:44:22,200
Speaker 6: And then it started to change. It started to change

857
00:44:22,200 --> 00:44:25,160
Speaker 6: all over because people just started to keep bel and

858
00:44:25,200 --> 00:44:27,640
Speaker 6: it just wasn't working. It was so different and as

859
00:44:28,000 --> 00:44:32,240
Speaker 6: tape right better, you know, as this was way before cast.

860
00:44:32,280 --> 00:44:34,520
Speaker 6: It once cast it became a thing, and then that

861
00:44:34,680 --> 00:44:41,359
Speaker 6: started to really improve and you know, update itself. It

862
00:44:41,400 --> 00:44:44,080
Speaker 6: was pretty much no more live because you know, we're

863
00:44:44,080 --> 00:44:46,279
Speaker 6: not doing theater here. It was better to watch it

864
00:44:46,360 --> 00:44:47,480
Speaker 6: right at your desk.

865
00:44:48,400 --> 00:44:50,600
Speaker 5: It was now I can't speak to comedies because my

866
00:44:50,719 --> 00:44:54,759
Speaker 5: memory is comedies were the last to go. And then,

867
00:44:54,960 --> 00:44:58,480
Speaker 5: as we all know, for actors, the next waterloo is

868
00:44:58,520 --> 00:45:02,160
Speaker 5: the table read. In the old day is because it's

869
00:45:02,160 --> 00:45:04,400
Speaker 5: funny because I work on a British show, and the

870
00:45:04,400 --> 00:45:06,360
Speaker 5: first table read we do with the British show, they

871
00:45:06,400 --> 00:45:09,680
Speaker 5: were all very nervous because they'd heard in America you

872
00:45:09,719 --> 00:45:12,120
Speaker 5: could get cut after the table read, and I had

873
00:45:12,160 --> 00:45:13,880
Speaker 5: to explain to all of them that that was not

874
00:45:14,000 --> 00:45:17,080
Speaker 5: the case. And in fact, we were pretty sure that

875
00:45:17,080 --> 00:45:18,640
Speaker 5: we were in good shape and we were filming the

876
00:45:18,680 --> 00:45:20,680
Speaker 5: next week, so I think it was all gonna be okay.

877
00:45:21,280 --> 00:45:25,319
Speaker 5: But they'd heard these these stories of and they were

878
00:45:25,360 --> 00:45:27,439
Speaker 5: all incredibly nervous. Where we started and I was doing

879
00:45:27,520 --> 00:45:31,000
Speaker 5: stage directions and I stopped everyone. I was like, and

880
00:45:31,120 --> 00:45:33,960
Speaker 5: it's like, well, you know, we might get cut. Oh no.

881
00:45:34,040 --> 00:45:36,520
Speaker 4: I remember feeling that way at the network table read

882
00:45:36,560 --> 00:45:40,000
Speaker 4: of our political show. It was like the Cutwork's gonna

883
00:45:40,040 --> 00:45:42,120
Speaker 4: call an hour after I walk out the door and

884
00:45:42,120 --> 00:45:44,160
Speaker 4: they're gonna say, get her out of there.

885
00:45:44,239 --> 00:45:44,960
Speaker 3: She's not good at.

886
00:45:45,080 --> 00:45:47,799
Speaker 5: Don't I don't like the cut of Girmo's jib.

887
00:45:47,960 --> 00:45:50,120
Speaker 1: I remember feeling like I could be cut, like after

888
00:45:50,200 --> 00:45:53,359
Speaker 1: season three, right after like episode I was like, oh shit.

889
00:45:53,400 --> 00:45:54,400
Speaker 5: When me and Katie werew.

890
00:45:54,360 --> 00:45:55,920
Speaker 1: Was like, are they going to kill us off? Are

891
00:45:55,920 --> 00:45:56,600
Speaker 1: we going to get cut?

892
00:45:56,800 --> 00:45:57,200
Speaker 5: Yeah?

893
00:45:57,560 --> 00:46:01,799
Speaker 4: Yeah, wait Linda, before we lose everybody? What are what's

894
00:46:01,840 --> 00:46:03,000
Speaker 4: your favorite?

895
00:46:03,880 --> 00:46:04,719
Speaker 3: What we need to hunt?

896
00:46:04,719 --> 00:46:06,200
Speaker 5: We need to part We may do a part two.

897
00:46:06,800 --> 00:46:09,240
Speaker 3: What's just interestriate thing about casting?

898
00:46:09,320 --> 00:46:13,439
Speaker 6: My favorite thing about casting is being in the room

899
00:46:13,440 --> 00:46:19,279
Speaker 6: with the actor and how the reason I know after uh,

900
00:46:19,680 --> 00:46:24,799
Speaker 6: you know, it's funny how you can hit potholes, you

901
00:46:24,840 --> 00:46:29,200
Speaker 6: can hit you just can hit something very bad, whether

902
00:46:29,239 --> 00:46:32,560
Speaker 6: it's the beginning of your career or as I like

903
00:46:32,600 --> 00:46:37,239
Speaker 6: to call it, the last lane, the last lane of

904
00:46:37,280 --> 00:46:40,799
Speaker 6: my career. And you know, a not very pretty thing

905
00:46:40,920 --> 00:46:44,080
Speaker 6: happened in August of twenty twenty two, which was the

906
00:46:44,280 --> 00:46:48,640
Speaker 6: HBO Max thing. It was sort of the unforeseen disintegration.

907
00:46:49,520 --> 00:46:53,440
Speaker 6: So that was a gigantic thing. And the reason I

908
00:46:53,520 --> 00:46:56,280
Speaker 6: know that I want to keep doing it is because

909
00:46:56,440 --> 00:46:58,600
Speaker 6: I just like, I was just in London and I

910
00:46:58,640 --> 00:47:02,880
Speaker 6: just saw you know, I just saw Mark ry Lance,

911
00:47:02,920 --> 00:47:06,040
Speaker 6: I'll just say it in Doctor shermel Weiss. And then

912
00:47:06,080 --> 00:47:08,799
Speaker 6: we saw a play a key at the National called

913
00:47:08,800 --> 00:47:11,200
Speaker 6: The Effect that was written by one of the writers

914
00:47:11,320 --> 00:47:16,480
Speaker 6: of Succession. Blah blah blah. And I find myself still

915
00:47:17,080 --> 00:47:20,239
Speaker 6: all these years later, you know, leaning forward and leaning forward.

916
00:47:20,320 --> 00:47:23,120
Speaker 6: And it's not just that I love it. It's more

917
00:47:23,160 --> 00:47:25,600
Speaker 6: than that. It's that I want to take the actors

918
00:47:26,360 --> 00:47:29,200
Speaker 6: with me to the next thing, and I want to

919
00:47:29,360 --> 00:47:33,080
Speaker 6: find stuff for these people, all the people. I want

920
00:47:33,120 --> 00:47:35,879
Speaker 6: to be able to cast, all the people I've seen

921
00:47:35,960 --> 00:47:39,120
Speaker 6: in the last four years or five years, you know,

922
00:47:39,120 --> 00:47:41,759
Speaker 6: because I got when I got the HBO Max job,

923
00:47:41,800 --> 00:47:44,879
Speaker 6: and I wasn't really a casting director anymore. It's more

924
00:47:45,239 --> 00:47:48,799
Speaker 6: overseeing everything, and even though I cast some people, it

925
00:47:48,880 --> 00:47:52,880
Speaker 6: was different. You know. The great thing about television, and

926
00:47:52,960 --> 00:47:55,839
Speaker 6: the great thing about being a casting director for television

927
00:47:55,920 --> 00:47:59,040
Speaker 6: is you see every age all the time, every week, amaze,

928
00:47:59,040 --> 00:48:02,319
Speaker 6: all the time. In movies, you could be four years out.

929
00:48:02,360 --> 00:48:04,399
Speaker 6: You're like, I haven't seen a forty five year old

930
00:48:04,440 --> 00:48:07,880
Speaker 6: woman because I haven't had the need for one, you

931
00:48:07,960 --> 00:48:09,839
Speaker 6: know what I mean, you really could go a long time.

932
00:48:09,880 --> 00:48:13,600
Speaker 6: But in television, that was the big secret that I

933
00:48:13,840 --> 00:48:17,120
Speaker 6: never thought about. So I like to be in the

934
00:48:17,200 --> 00:48:21,879
Speaker 6: room with the actress. I like to find people and

935
00:48:22,000 --> 00:48:25,239
Speaker 6: then push them in to the light. That's what I

936
00:48:25,360 --> 00:48:27,960
Speaker 6: like to do. So I have a whole list of

937
00:48:28,000 --> 00:48:36,960
Speaker 6: people for my new bat Cough that I'm starting.

938
00:48:35,200 --> 00:48:37,440
Speaker 3: Gary Diaz and Kittie's.

939
00:48:40,160 --> 00:48:42,879
Speaker 6: Everybody could have worked together. I My thing is, I

940
00:48:42,920 --> 00:48:47,719
Speaker 6: would love so much to all work together again. You know,

941
00:48:47,719 --> 00:48:49,560
Speaker 6: I just I love working with the people that I

942
00:48:49,600 --> 00:48:53,400
Speaker 6: love and me and I just love it. I just

943
00:48:53,440 --> 00:48:56,120
Speaker 6: want to work with my friends. Everybody else.

944
00:48:57,440 --> 00:48:57,760
Speaker 2: Tired.

945
00:48:58,840 --> 00:49:02,399
Speaker 6: I'm too much of a hag to meet new pupils. Well.

946
00:49:02,800 --> 00:49:06,480
Speaker 3: Linda Lowing, Oh thank you Linda, Linda. We love you

947
00:49:06,520 --> 00:49:07,120
Speaker 3: so much.

948
00:49:07,560 --> 00:49:11,719
Speaker 4: We're so grateful for you coming on the show and

949
00:49:11,840 --> 00:49:15,200
Speaker 4: telling and like giving us a peek behind the curtain

950
00:49:15,320 --> 00:49:16,880
Speaker 4: of the toolbox of casting.

951
00:49:17,040 --> 00:49:20,040
Speaker 6: I loved everything and go second and Betsy, I need

952
00:49:20,080 --> 00:49:23,440
Speaker 6: to see you more. Bets and Bruce. I love that

953
00:49:23,560 --> 00:49:24,440
Speaker 6: husband of yours.

954
00:49:24,640 --> 00:49:26,920
Speaker 5: He popped his little head in and wanted to know

955
00:49:26,960 --> 00:49:28,320
Speaker 5: what the hell was going on in here, because I

956
00:49:28,400 --> 00:49:30,360
Speaker 5: was having such a good time yet I was alone,

957
00:49:30,520 --> 00:49:32,440
Speaker 5: So I think he thought that I was going crazy

958
00:49:32,760 --> 00:49:34,280
Speaker 5: because all he can hear is me talking.

959
00:49:35,480 --> 00:49:38,120
Speaker 3: He's right now, Are you Matt's Betsy, just going crazy?

960
00:49:38,680 --> 00:49:40,440
Speaker 5: Do we need to put you in a rubber room again?

961
00:49:41,120 --> 00:49:43,600
Speaker 5: It is so wonderful to get to talk to you here.

962
00:49:43,719 --> 00:49:46,799
Speaker 5: We will be making plans immediately when I get off

963
00:49:46,840 --> 00:49:47,480
Speaker 5: the podcast.

964
00:49:47,760 --> 00:49:48,160
Speaker 2: Yay.

965
00:49:48,400 --> 00:49:50,719
Speaker 5: Thank you so much for doing this and spending the time,

966
00:49:50,800 --> 00:49:53,759
Speaker 5: I think for anybody listening to this, you learned so

967
00:49:53,880 --> 00:49:57,040
Speaker 5: much about so many different possibilities that are available in

968
00:49:57,080 --> 00:50:00,239
Speaker 5: the beautiful world in which we work, and Linda has

969
00:50:00,280 --> 00:50:06,080
Speaker 5: made such an eloquent and gorgeous case for how special

970
00:50:06,280 --> 00:50:09,560
Speaker 5: and how meaningful and how important this job is. So

971
00:50:09,640 --> 00:50:17,240
Speaker 5: thank you so much for that, Linda.

972
00:50:14,239 --> 00:50:15,879
Speaker 3: One actor at a time, you too.

973
00:50:16,920 --> 00:50:20,479
Speaker 6: We love you so much, Love you all so much,

974
00:50:20,520 --> 00:50:21,960
Speaker 6: and see you again soon.

975
00:50:32,320 --> 00:50:36,240
Speaker 4: Scandal is executive produced by Sandy Bailey, alex Alcea, Lauren Homan,

976
00:50:36,560 --> 00:50:40,319
Speaker 4: Tyler Klang, and Gabrielle Collins. Our producer and editor is

977
00:50:40,400 --> 00:50:44,000
Speaker 4: Vince de Johnny, with music by Chad Fisher. Unpacking the

978
00:50:44,040 --> 00:50:47,359
Speaker 4: Toolbox is a production of Shondaland Audio in partnership with iHeartRadio.

979
00:50:47,719 --> 00:50:51,279
Speaker 4: For more podcasts from Shondaland Audio, visit the iHeartRadio app

980
00:50:51,360 --> 00:50:53,480
Speaker 4: or anywhere you subscribe to your favorite shows.

981
00:51:00,080 --> 00:51:00,239
Speaker 1: Yeah