1 00:00:15,076 --> 00:00:22,836 Speaker 1: Bushkin. Okay, I'm just honestly opening my fridge. I've got 2 00:00:24,196 --> 00:00:27,716 Speaker 1: a little thing of half and half. It's half full 3 00:00:27,876 --> 00:00:31,156 Speaker 1: or half empty. There's another few days left in that 4 00:00:31,436 --> 00:00:35,076 Speaker 1: very good. There's a bottle of wine in here. Oh, 5 00:00:35,116 --> 00:00:40,956 Speaker 1: that's red wine. That's embarrassing. I've got vanilla mascapone cheese. 6 00:00:41,956 --> 00:00:48,276 Speaker 1: I'll see if that's oh, oh, it's gone off. The stinks. Okay. 7 00:00:49,276 --> 00:00:52,356 Speaker 1: Then I've got some beef short ribs that I have 8 00:00:53,076 --> 00:00:57,636 Speaker 1: covered in aluminum foil that I mean to cook today. 9 00:00:58,276 --> 00:01:01,876 Speaker 1: But I can kind of already feel myself like sliding 10 00:01:01,916 --> 00:01:08,476 Speaker 1: out the door to go for dinner that was earlier 11 00:01:08,516 --> 00:01:11,876 Speaker 1: in my kitchen, And now I'm here in the Solvable studios, 12 00:01:11,876 --> 00:01:14,556 Speaker 1: and I'm wondering, is there anybody who can help me 13 00:01:14,596 --> 00:01:17,596 Speaker 1: with this? I need a hero. If only one of 14 00:01:17,596 --> 00:01:20,916 Speaker 1: the world's most innovative thinkers was dealing with what to 15 00:01:20,996 --> 00:01:24,516 Speaker 1: do with rich people's food waste, I may have Higgins 16 00:01:24,516 --> 00:01:29,236 Speaker 1: and you're listening to Solvable, Well, I think food waste 17 00:01:29,556 --> 00:01:32,316 Speaker 1: is one of the lowest hanging fruit, and the great 18 00:01:32,356 --> 00:01:34,196 Speaker 1: thing is that we can solve it by eating and 19 00:01:34,316 --> 00:01:37,476 Speaker 1: enjoying food together instead of throwing it away and that's 20 00:01:37,516 --> 00:01:40,836 Speaker 1: something that everyone can engage in in a way that 21 00:01:40,876 --> 00:01:46,396 Speaker 1: saves money, reduces environmental impact, and can build companionship between humans. 22 00:01:46,916 --> 00:01:49,956 Speaker 1: That is a vision that is not unattainable, and I 23 00:01:49,996 --> 00:01:54,516 Speaker 1: find it very, very attractive. That's Tristram Stewart. He's an 24 00:01:54,516 --> 00:01:58,076 Speaker 1: author and campaigner with a laser focus on the environmental 25 00:01:58,156 --> 00:02:01,036 Speaker 1: and social impacts of food. You know, I actually heard 26 00:02:01,036 --> 00:02:03,796 Speaker 1: of Tristram because a few years ago he put together 27 00:02:03,836 --> 00:02:07,356 Speaker 1: this dinner for five thousand Londoners and meal was made 28 00:02:07,516 --> 00:02:11,196 Speaker 1: entirely of food scrap that would have otherwise gone to waste. 29 00:02:11,516 --> 00:02:16,156 Speaker 1: That's his solvable It's eliminating food waste. That's it. It 30 00:02:16,196 --> 00:02:20,076 Speaker 1: may sound simple, but the problem is just gigantic. It's 31 00:02:20,116 --> 00:02:23,196 Speaker 1: not just me. You know. Globally, we throw out about 32 00:02:23,276 --> 00:02:27,076 Speaker 1: one point three billion tons of food a year. That's 33 00:02:27,076 --> 00:02:30,356 Speaker 1: a third of all the food that we grow. Inequality 34 00:02:30,396 --> 00:02:32,996 Speaker 1: plays a huge role in this. Of course. Very little 35 00:02:33,036 --> 00:02:36,476 Speaker 1: food in poor countries is thrown out by consumers it's 36 00:02:36,476 --> 00:02:40,196 Speaker 1: too precious. But in wealthy countries, especially here in the 37 00:02:40,276 --> 00:02:44,356 Speaker 1: United States and in Canada, around forty percent of wasted 38 00:02:44,396 --> 00:02:48,836 Speaker 1: food is thrown out by consumers. So what to do. 39 00:02:49,396 --> 00:02:53,556 Speaker 1: The conversation you're about to hear, offers us guidance. Now 40 00:02:53,556 --> 00:02:56,756 Speaker 1: you've already heard from three of our Solvable interviews so far, 41 00:02:57,156 --> 00:03:01,476 Speaker 1: Malcolm Gladwell, Jacob Weisberg, and Ann Applebaum. Now we meet 42 00:03:01,516 --> 00:03:05,156 Speaker 1: the fourth. It's Ahmed Ali Akbar. You might know him 43 00:03:05,196 --> 00:03:08,476 Speaker 1: from his own podcast, See Something, Say Something about what 44 00:03:08,636 --> 00:03:12,076 Speaker 1: America Muslims are talking about right now, and we are 45 00:03:12,116 --> 00:03:16,396 Speaker 1: thrilled to have him Unsolvable. To begin, Ahmed asks Tristram 46 00:03:16,476 --> 00:03:20,916 Speaker 1: Stewart about smart ways to avoid waste, from saying yes 47 00:03:20,996 --> 00:03:25,356 Speaker 1: to ugly bananas to making beer from our kids breadcrusts. 48 00:03:25,396 --> 00:03:28,956 Speaker 1: And listen out too for big changes he's helping to 49 00:03:28,996 --> 00:03:33,196 Speaker 1: make in the entrepreneurial world, as well as transforming food 50 00:03:33,196 --> 00:03:36,716 Speaker 1: waste legislation in the UK. Okay, here we go. It's 51 00:03:36,756 --> 00:03:41,116 Speaker 1: Tristram Stewart and Ahmed ali Akbar. Welcome to the program. 52 00:03:41,156 --> 00:03:43,876 Speaker 1: Welcome to Solvable, Tristram, thanks very much for having me. 53 00:03:44,316 --> 00:03:47,596 Speaker 1: So let's start really big. Global food waste is a 54 00:03:47,636 --> 00:03:52,036 Speaker 1: massive problem. Do you think that it's a solvable problem. Yes. 55 00:03:52,196 --> 00:03:57,436 Speaker 1: So the problem, of course is a food production itself, 56 00:03:57,676 --> 00:04:00,756 Speaker 1: and a large amount of the food waste that is 57 00:04:00,756 --> 00:04:05,596 Speaker 1: being generated can be designed out can be eliminated through 58 00:04:05,596 --> 00:04:10,116 Speaker 1: behavior change, through improved business practice, through better government policy. 59 00:04:10,396 --> 00:04:14,636 Speaker 1: Those things are eminently solvable. So myself, as a consumer 60 00:04:14,676 --> 00:04:18,196 Speaker 1: who is concerned with reducing my impact, what can I 61 00:04:18,236 --> 00:04:20,916 Speaker 1: do you know in that process from going to the 62 00:04:20,956 --> 00:04:24,516 Speaker 1: supermarket to bring it harm? And I will stop you 63 00:04:24,556 --> 00:04:26,756 Speaker 1: in your tracks and say, the first thing that you 64 00:04:26,796 --> 00:04:31,196 Speaker 1: could probably do to help yourself avoid food wastes not 65 00:04:31,236 --> 00:04:33,516 Speaker 1: go to the supermarket at all if you possibly can 66 00:04:33,556 --> 00:04:37,156 Speaker 1: help it. Okay. The reason for that, and I'm not 67 00:04:37,196 --> 00:04:43,356 Speaker 1: being entirely flippant here, is that the supermarket grocery supply 68 00:04:43,476 --> 00:04:49,836 Speaker 1: system has waste and surplus as a cornerstone of its 69 00:04:49,876 --> 00:04:54,756 Speaker 1: business model. It's almost impossible for a supermarket to avoid 70 00:04:54,836 --> 00:04:59,356 Speaker 1: waste entirely. The entire marketing model of a supermarket is 71 00:04:59,396 --> 00:05:05,956 Speaker 1: to create a cornucopian display of plenty. And the reason 72 00:05:05,996 --> 00:05:08,436 Speaker 1: why they do that is because, having invested billions of 73 00:05:08,476 --> 00:05:12,356 Speaker 1: dollars in working out what we Homo sapiens, this very 74 00:05:12,396 --> 00:05:17,036 Speaker 1: sophisticated great ape will respond to. We have evolved over 75 00:05:17,156 --> 00:05:20,676 Speaker 1: two million years in an environment of scarcity, and we 76 00:05:20,756 --> 00:05:25,756 Speaker 1: are hardwired therefore, when we see abundance to take to hoard, 77 00:05:26,396 --> 00:05:33,756 Speaker 1: to glut to feast, and that hardwiring comes very powerfully 78 00:05:33,796 --> 00:05:37,156 Speaker 1: into action when we walk down those supermarket aisles, and 79 00:05:37,276 --> 00:05:39,236 Speaker 1: the result is that we buy more than we need 80 00:05:39,276 --> 00:05:42,036 Speaker 1: and we throw a third of it away. I think 81 00:05:42,076 --> 00:05:44,116 Speaker 1: for most of us, what we see as food waste, 82 00:05:44,236 --> 00:05:47,516 Speaker 1: we can't envision that like massive picture you've given us. 83 00:05:47,796 --> 00:05:49,836 Speaker 1: We just see that, you know, those things being wasted 84 00:05:49,876 --> 00:05:52,396 Speaker 1: at the supermarket, and then we bring home vegetables and 85 00:05:52,436 --> 00:05:54,996 Speaker 1: they rite the milk rats. That's what happens with me, 86 00:05:55,276 --> 00:05:56,876 Speaker 1: and then we throw it out. Can you talk a 87 00:05:56,916 --> 00:06:00,316 Speaker 1: little bit about how you effectively made that behavioral change 88 00:06:00,316 --> 00:06:04,396 Speaker 1: and sort of business change as well that made led 89 00:06:04,476 --> 00:06:08,196 Speaker 1: to that reduction. Well to address some of the business changes. 90 00:06:08,276 --> 00:06:10,836 Speaker 1: I mean, one of the issues that we highlight is 91 00:06:10,876 --> 00:06:14,196 Speaker 1: the issue of ugly fruit and vegetables, and we immediately 92 00:06:14,196 --> 00:06:16,516 Speaker 1: affected a change on the part of the supermarkets who 93 00:06:16,556 --> 00:06:22,476 Speaker 1: started stocking cosmetically imperfect vegetables, partly because they had been 94 00:06:22,556 --> 00:06:26,636 Speaker 1: hurt so badly by the press around the campaigning on 95 00:06:26,636 --> 00:06:29,836 Speaker 1: this issue. And once they'd seen that there was public demand, 96 00:06:30,156 --> 00:06:34,596 Speaker 1: of course they responded and started supplying to that demand. 97 00:06:34,596 --> 00:06:36,316 Speaker 1: Instead of saying, oh, well, you know the reason why 98 00:06:36,316 --> 00:06:39,036 Speaker 1: we have these cosmetic standards is because people expect perfection. 99 00:06:39,556 --> 00:06:43,796 Speaker 1: By changing public attitudes, we changed corporate policy and that 100 00:06:43,916 --> 00:06:48,196 Speaker 1: massively reduced food waste in those supermarket supply chains. And 101 00:06:48,636 --> 00:06:50,836 Speaker 1: as I say, that started here in the United Kingdom, 102 00:06:50,876 --> 00:06:53,716 Speaker 1: but it has become a global phenomenon now pretty much 103 00:06:53,716 --> 00:06:58,996 Speaker 1: every Western supermarket chain has in some way dabbled in 104 00:06:59,036 --> 00:07:01,956 Speaker 1: the issue of fruit and vegetables that are cosmetically imperfect 105 00:07:02,476 --> 00:07:05,156 Speaker 1: and try to kind of sell those to customers. And 106 00:07:05,276 --> 00:07:08,516 Speaker 1: they're basically being stoked alongside, you know, the sort of 107 00:07:09,276 --> 00:07:12,076 Speaker 1: supermodel fruit that makes it out there most of the time, 108 00:07:12,516 --> 00:07:15,916 Speaker 1: Like they're just are are they being labeled separately? Because 109 00:07:15,916 --> 00:07:17,356 Speaker 1: I think part of the issue here is like how 110 00:07:17,356 --> 00:07:20,996 Speaker 1: does the consumer know to invest in things that are 111 00:07:21,476 --> 00:07:24,756 Speaker 1: less wasteful. Well, that's a very good question. Of course, 112 00:07:24,796 --> 00:07:28,236 Speaker 1: every supermarket chain has a different brand and a different 113 00:07:28,236 --> 00:07:30,876 Speaker 1: approach to this issue. So if you go to Well 114 00:07:30,876 --> 00:07:33,356 Speaker 1: in the UK, we have a supermarket chain here called Waitros, 115 00:07:34,196 --> 00:07:37,356 Speaker 1: some more upmarket chain for people who kind of care 116 00:07:37,356 --> 00:07:40,796 Speaker 1: about where their food is from, and they're absolutely the 117 00:07:41,596 --> 00:07:44,516 Speaker 1: weather blemished apples will have a story about how it 118 00:07:44,636 --> 00:07:47,796 Speaker 1: hailed in the orchards in the autumn, and that's why 119 00:07:47,836 --> 00:07:50,836 Speaker 1: this russeting on. You know, they'll have all of that narrative. 120 00:07:51,116 --> 00:07:53,956 Speaker 1: You go to Tesco, which is a completely different more 121 00:07:54,036 --> 00:07:58,716 Speaker 1: like the warm Heart of the UK. They don't tell 122 00:07:58,756 --> 00:08:02,116 Speaker 1: that story to their customers. They just sell those wonky 123 00:08:02,156 --> 00:08:08,236 Speaker 1: carrots cheaper than the cosmetically premium carrots, and that's what 124 00:08:08,276 --> 00:08:11,236 Speaker 1: their demographic is most interested in. So you can be 125 00:08:11,916 --> 00:08:15,476 Speaker 1: helping to reduce that food waste without even necessarily knowing 126 00:08:15,476 --> 00:08:18,156 Speaker 1: it in that store. So I think everyone, and quite rightly, 127 00:08:18,236 --> 00:08:21,196 Speaker 1: has got a different approach to solving the problem. What 128 00:08:21,316 --> 00:08:24,916 Speaker 1: are some policies that you want to see the world's 129 00:08:24,956 --> 00:08:30,396 Speaker 1: governments and corporations implement in order to reduce food waste 130 00:08:30,396 --> 00:08:35,116 Speaker 1: at a noticeable level over the next sixty years or so. 131 00:08:35,116 --> 00:08:37,276 Speaker 1: So let me start by saying most of my work 132 00:08:37,316 --> 00:08:42,036 Speaker 1: has been directed at the people directly. What is it 133 00:08:42,076 --> 00:08:45,716 Speaker 1: that we humans need to do to reform our food 134 00:08:45,716 --> 00:08:49,316 Speaker 1: system and our system as a whole to ensure that 135 00:08:49,956 --> 00:08:55,116 Speaker 1: this environmental and social calamity that we find ourselves in 136 00:08:55,156 --> 00:09:00,956 Speaker 1: the midstaff does not reach its logical conclusion, namely that 137 00:09:01,076 --> 00:09:05,796 Speaker 1: the mass species extinction event that we are causing very 138 00:09:05,876 --> 00:09:09,076 Speaker 1: largely through our food system. How do we galvanize human 139 00:09:09,116 --> 00:09:14,876 Speaker 1: action directly through behavior change, through organization, through entrepreneurship. We 140 00:09:14,916 --> 00:09:18,836 Speaker 1: can do almost all of it without the intervention of governments. 141 00:09:18,836 --> 00:09:22,636 Speaker 1: I believe that said governments clearly have a role to play, 142 00:09:22,796 --> 00:09:25,676 Speaker 1: and there are a number of things that governments should 143 00:09:26,356 --> 00:09:29,676 Speaker 1: be looking at. The one I will start with is 144 00:09:29,756 --> 00:09:34,996 Speaker 1: farm subsidies. At the moment, the USA and Europe gather 145 00:09:36,196 --> 00:09:42,276 Speaker 1: massive budgets through levying taxes on their populations for farm subsidies. 146 00:09:42,836 --> 00:09:49,036 Speaker 1: That money is currently being grotesquely misspent to support a 147 00:09:49,076 --> 00:09:55,076 Speaker 1: commodity industrial agricultural system to produce exactly the kinds of 148 00:09:55,116 --> 00:10:01,276 Speaker 1: food that are both nutritionally less than optimal and are 149 00:10:01,516 --> 00:10:06,036 Speaker 1: environmentally harmful. That is not a good use of public money, 150 00:10:06,556 --> 00:10:08,796 Speaker 1: and the government of the USA and the governments of 151 00:10:08,796 --> 00:10:15,276 Speaker 1: Europe should delink their subsidies from such poor public service 152 00:10:15,596 --> 00:10:19,236 Speaker 1: and instead should be paying farmers to farm the land 153 00:10:19,236 --> 00:10:23,036 Speaker 1: in a way that regenerates the soil, that creates habitat 154 00:10:23,356 --> 00:10:26,956 Speaker 1: that enhances the land's ability to take on and store 155 00:10:26,996 --> 00:10:30,916 Speaker 1: water in the water table at the same time as 156 00:10:30,956 --> 00:10:34,836 Speaker 1: producing healthy, accessible food for everyone. What is the best 157 00:10:34,836 --> 00:10:38,476 Speaker 1: way to actually make an impact such that subsidies aren't 158 00:10:38,476 --> 00:10:40,996 Speaker 1: having such a massive effect on our environment. Well, but 159 00:10:41,316 --> 00:10:43,836 Speaker 1: the answer to that question is exactly why I tend 160 00:10:43,876 --> 00:10:47,956 Speaker 1: to start with the using of blemish bananas to make 161 00:10:47,996 --> 00:10:51,356 Speaker 1: smoothies and pancakes and other nice things. Is something that 162 00:10:51,396 --> 00:10:54,116 Speaker 1: you can do without getting too depressed, and that tastes 163 00:10:54,156 --> 00:10:57,036 Speaker 1: good and is fun. And so starting with a nice, 164 00:10:57,076 --> 00:11:01,476 Speaker 1: hearty meal using all the food that you have. Moving on, 165 00:11:01,676 --> 00:11:05,116 Speaker 1: if you feel so moved to changing your buying practices 166 00:11:05,756 --> 00:11:08,836 Speaker 1: and maybe having good conversations with your friends about looking 167 00:11:09,236 --> 00:11:12,076 Speaker 1: to planet Earth by making our choice, Yeah, that's a 168 00:11:12,156 --> 00:11:15,756 Speaker 1: much nicer, easier way to start. How do we change 169 00:11:15,916 --> 00:11:19,036 Speaker 1: a farm subsidy system that is deeply entrenched in which 170 00:11:19,076 --> 00:11:21,716 Speaker 1: some of the biggest food corporations in the world, the 171 00:11:21,716 --> 00:11:26,116 Speaker 1: biggest corporations in the world, have an enormous stake when 172 00:11:26,396 --> 00:11:31,756 Speaker 1: our political system, to take the US political system as 173 00:11:32,116 --> 00:11:37,676 Speaker 1: a quintessential example, is itself stitched up by that financial system. 174 00:11:37,996 --> 00:11:42,316 Speaker 1: You know, the strong correlation between successful electoral candidates and 175 00:11:42,396 --> 00:11:44,396 Speaker 1: the money they have at their disposal to spend on 176 00:11:44,436 --> 00:11:48,756 Speaker 1: their campaigns, which is an absolutely inexorable correlation in the USA. 177 00:11:48,916 --> 00:11:50,996 Speaker 1: You ask me, how do you change that? Well, You've 178 00:11:51,036 --> 00:11:54,436 Speaker 1: got to start there and delink the amount of money 179 00:11:54,436 --> 00:11:57,196 Speaker 1: a candidate has from whether or lot they get elected, 180 00:11:57,796 --> 00:12:00,156 Speaker 1: and then you might start having free and fair elections, 181 00:12:00,756 --> 00:12:03,876 Speaker 1: and you might start getting people in public office who 182 00:12:03,876 --> 00:12:10,276 Speaker 1: are not completely indebted to the corporations who benefit the 183 00:12:10,316 --> 00:12:13,316 Speaker 1: financial subsidies that are being dulled out by those people 184 00:12:13,356 --> 00:12:17,076 Speaker 1: when they get into government. Difficult to achieve. I mean, ultimately, 185 00:12:17,116 --> 00:12:19,996 Speaker 1: that's where we've got to go. But you ask the question, 186 00:12:20,036 --> 00:12:22,316 Speaker 1: I'm afraid that's where the answer is, right. I mean, 187 00:12:22,356 --> 00:12:24,636 Speaker 1: that's part of why we're having this conversation is because 188 00:12:24,636 --> 00:12:27,156 Speaker 1: it can feel so daunting. And I think also one 189 00:12:27,156 --> 00:12:29,676 Speaker 1: thing that really interested me in you was that you 190 00:12:29,756 --> 00:12:33,636 Speaker 1: also have some sort of entrepreneurial endeavors that you've gone 191 00:12:33,636 --> 00:12:37,356 Speaker 1: into around bread that would otherwise be wasted. Can you 192 00:12:37,436 --> 00:12:40,596 Speaker 1: tell me a little bit more about your company that 193 00:12:40,676 --> 00:12:44,116 Speaker 1: deals with leftover bread? I will, and I'll take a 194 00:12:44,156 --> 00:12:46,916 Speaker 1: step back there, since we just touched on some of 195 00:12:46,956 --> 00:12:53,676 Speaker 1: the really deeply pressing and occasionally depressing need to create 196 00:12:53,836 --> 00:12:57,876 Speaker 1: dramatic and swift change on planet Earth if we're to 197 00:12:57,916 --> 00:13:01,396 Speaker 1: avert catastrophe, and say that most of my work is 198 00:13:01,636 --> 00:13:06,996 Speaker 1: focused on mobilizing and inspiring people to act in a 199 00:13:07,076 --> 00:13:10,796 Speaker 1: way that both sustains planet Earth but also sustains us 200 00:13:10,956 --> 00:13:15,396 Speaker 1: and sustains us through companionship. This is a word I 201 00:13:15,796 --> 00:13:21,316 Speaker 1: absolutely love companion. Literally it breaks down Latin Colm is 202 00:13:21,356 --> 00:13:24,596 Speaker 1: with and pan is bread. A companion is somebody who 203 00:13:24,676 --> 00:13:30,116 Speaker 1: share food with and Wow, isn't that beautiful. It's also 204 00:13:30,156 --> 00:13:32,516 Speaker 1: the nature of food to bring people together. I think. 205 00:13:32,556 --> 00:13:37,516 Speaker 1: I think that's so. It is universal what you say 206 00:13:37,596 --> 00:13:44,316 Speaker 1: is right, the universal human practice of building community through 207 00:13:44,396 --> 00:13:52,316 Speaker 1: sharing food in families, in localities, and indeed internationally. We 208 00:13:52,396 --> 00:13:57,396 Speaker 1: build companionship and friendship through the sharing of food and 209 00:13:57,996 --> 00:14:02,196 Speaker 1: this powerful way in which we can bond with each 210 00:14:02,196 --> 00:14:08,316 Speaker 1: other and also bond with the earth from which all 211 00:14:08,316 --> 00:14:13,036 Speaker 1: this food comes. That is why I have used food 212 00:14:13,596 --> 00:14:18,516 Speaker 1: as the principal tool to communicate how we humans can 213 00:14:18,516 --> 00:14:22,596 Speaker 1: and must change our system as a whole. One of 214 00:14:22,636 --> 00:14:26,516 Speaker 1: the most recent ones, which you just alluded to, was 215 00:14:26,756 --> 00:14:30,516 Speaker 1: the beer that became known and is known as toast Ale, 216 00:14:30,676 --> 00:14:33,636 Speaker 1: which we are now producing in several different countries in 217 00:14:33,636 --> 00:14:36,916 Speaker 1: the US and the UK and elsewhere. And that is 218 00:14:36,956 --> 00:14:41,236 Speaker 1: made in a very in fact an ancient way of 219 00:14:41,276 --> 00:14:44,076 Speaker 1: making beer, which is to use leftover bread and other 220 00:14:44,116 --> 00:14:47,236 Speaker 1: grains to make your beer. That is what beer originally was, 221 00:14:47,276 --> 00:14:50,996 Speaker 1: for preserving the calories in grains that might otherwise be wasted. 222 00:14:51,636 --> 00:14:55,716 Speaker 1: And we essentially have brought the beer industry back to it. 223 00:14:55,716 --> 00:15:00,076 Speaker 1: It's ancient Babylonian roots. And I discovered that you could 224 00:15:00,076 --> 00:15:02,436 Speaker 1: make beer with waste bread in twenty fifteen when I 225 00:15:02,476 --> 00:15:05,396 Speaker 1: was in Brussels with the Brussels Beer Project. The brewer 226 00:15:05,436 --> 00:15:09,996 Speaker 1: there Sebastia showed me and I said, my goodness, I've 227 00:15:09,996 --> 00:15:12,876 Speaker 1: been around the world and I've seen industrial quantities of 228 00:15:12,876 --> 00:15:16,756 Speaker 1: bread being wasted in every country. It's one of the 229 00:15:16,796 --> 00:15:19,076 Speaker 1: most wasted products of all and it's being wasted one 230 00:15:19,116 --> 00:15:23,596 Speaker 1: it is still perfectly good. It's kind of sandwich crusts, 231 00:15:23,676 --> 00:15:26,676 Speaker 1: you know, the end slices of the loaves being wasted 232 00:15:26,716 --> 00:15:30,876 Speaker 1: by the hundreds of thousands everyday day fresh bread. So 233 00:15:30,916 --> 00:15:33,996 Speaker 1: that's going on all the world. Meanwhile, craft brewing has 234 00:15:34,036 --> 00:15:36,956 Speaker 1: become a global phenomenon, and I've spent the last twenty 235 00:15:37,036 --> 00:15:39,716 Speaker 1: years building a global food waste movement. So let's bring 236 00:15:39,756 --> 00:15:43,476 Speaker 1: these three things together into a global brand called toast Ale. Obviously, 237 00:15:43,476 --> 00:15:46,476 Speaker 1: we're toasting the end of food waste. We think that 238 00:15:46,516 --> 00:15:48,916 Speaker 1: bread shouldn't be wasted and neither should use. So we 239 00:15:49,036 --> 00:15:54,116 Speaker 1: encourage people to drink responsibly. And so we've created this company. Sorry, 240 00:15:54,316 --> 00:15:57,676 Speaker 1: now you got that's a pretty good, pretty good tagline. 241 00:15:58,196 --> 00:16:02,076 Speaker 1: Oh crumbs, the puns are going to come flying now 242 00:16:04,796 --> 00:16:07,196 Speaker 1: now we'll we'll move on. It is the best thing 243 00:16:07,276 --> 00:16:10,236 Speaker 1: since slice bread. But the the idea is that we've 244 00:16:10,236 --> 00:16:13,716 Speaker 1: made this company. We're producing beer. It's on sale. People 245 00:16:13,716 --> 00:16:17,556 Speaker 1: absolutely love it. It's one Craft Beer Awards on blind 246 00:16:17,676 --> 00:16:21,396 Speaker 1: taste testing. So this is a really high quality product, 247 00:16:21,716 --> 00:16:25,916 Speaker 1: quite independently of the nice story that we have at 248 00:16:25,956 --> 00:16:29,716 Speaker 1: our backs. But then rather uniquely, as a company, a 249 00:16:29,756 --> 00:16:32,876 Speaker 1: for profit company, we give all of our profits. One 250 00:16:32,916 --> 00:16:36,516 Speaker 1: hundred percent of our distributor profits go to the charity 251 00:16:36,556 --> 00:16:39,836 Speaker 1: that I founded and have spent most of my last 252 00:16:39,876 --> 00:16:45,036 Speaker 1: ten years working four and that is a charity that 253 00:16:45,076 --> 00:16:47,476 Speaker 1: campaigns on reforming the food system in all the ways 254 00:16:47,476 --> 00:16:49,996 Speaker 1: that we're now talking about. And in addition to that, 255 00:16:50,036 --> 00:16:53,516 Speaker 1: we also share revenues with other aligned not in profits 256 00:16:53,556 --> 00:16:56,676 Speaker 1: in any country that we go and work in. That's 257 00:16:56,716 --> 00:17:00,596 Speaker 1: six or seven countries so far. Well, I'd say I 258 00:17:00,636 --> 00:17:05,156 Speaker 1: can't wait to try it, But I don't drink alcohol, 259 00:17:05,316 --> 00:17:07,916 Speaker 1: so sorry, but I think it's really interesting that I 260 00:17:08,356 --> 00:17:10,836 Speaker 1: have some good news for you. I have just been 261 00:17:10,876 --> 00:17:14,716 Speaker 1: handed our first bottle of a collaboration brew of low 262 00:17:14,756 --> 00:17:20,756 Speaker 1: alcohol beer, which so you may yet get to try, 263 00:17:20,836 --> 00:17:24,356 Speaker 1: and you definitely deserve to. With a pun like that. 264 00:17:24,836 --> 00:17:28,716 Speaker 1: Are there any other items, you know waste by products, 265 00:17:28,796 --> 00:17:30,556 Speaker 1: or you know things that like the end of a 266 00:17:30,596 --> 00:17:33,836 Speaker 1: sandwich bread that you wish somebody else would toastify that 267 00:17:33,876 --> 00:17:35,956 Speaker 1: you don't have time to address something that's like a 268 00:17:35,956 --> 00:17:38,396 Speaker 1: slammed sort of potential product that you don't have the 269 00:17:38,436 --> 00:17:42,756 Speaker 1: time to do. Oh my goodness. A very large part 270 00:17:42,756 --> 00:17:47,756 Speaker 1: of the last twenty years of campaigning has having created 271 00:17:47,796 --> 00:17:52,476 Speaker 1: a massive noise around food waste. Yes, I changed the 272 00:17:52,476 --> 00:17:57,956 Speaker 1: policies of some big corporations, got laws passed by governments. 273 00:17:58,116 --> 00:18:00,476 Speaker 1: But one of the most exciting parts of my work 274 00:18:00,516 --> 00:18:06,236 Speaker 1: has been helping many entrepreneurs, dozens of entrepreneurs create businesses 275 00:18:06,996 --> 00:18:11,196 Speaker 1: that mine that got gantuan mountain of food waste, the 276 00:18:11,316 --> 00:18:14,436 Speaker 1: one point three billion tons of food that are wasted, 277 00:18:14,716 --> 00:18:21,916 Speaker 1: and turn that food into good products that run good businesses. 278 00:18:22,836 --> 00:18:28,076 Speaker 1: So in California, there's a brilliant company that called Imperfect Produce, 279 00:18:29,236 --> 00:18:34,196 Speaker 1: and that is a vegetable box scheme that delivers discounted 280 00:18:34,556 --> 00:18:37,996 Speaker 1: fresh fruit and vegetables two people's doors, and exactly the 281 00:18:37,996 --> 00:18:42,316 Speaker 1: way I was describing, but all using wonky product products 282 00:18:42,316 --> 00:18:45,316 Speaker 1: that would otherwise have been wasted. A fantastic company. Here 283 00:18:45,316 --> 00:18:47,756 Speaker 1: in the United Kingdom, we have a company called Rubies 284 00:18:47,756 --> 00:18:50,476 Speaker 1: in the Rubble that makes chutneys and jams entirely at 285 00:18:50,516 --> 00:18:53,556 Speaker 1: fruit and vegetables that would otherwise be wasted. The company 286 00:18:53,596 --> 00:18:57,236 Speaker 1: that makes juice called Rejuice in the UK Misfit Juicery 287 00:18:57,676 --> 00:19:00,836 Speaker 1: over in the USA. I mean, I could go on 288 00:19:01,076 --> 00:19:06,876 Speaker 1: all evening, but just suffice to say that the entrepreneurial 289 00:19:06,956 --> 00:19:10,596 Speaker 1: spirit tackling food waste is one of the most exciting 290 00:19:11,396 --> 00:19:14,316 Speaker 1: parts of this work. So, as somebody who thinks about 291 00:19:14,316 --> 00:19:17,396 Speaker 1: this all the time, how do you keep positive that 292 00:19:17,796 --> 00:19:21,356 Speaker 1: this enormous global problem of food waste is actually solvable 293 00:19:21,716 --> 00:19:26,116 Speaker 1: in our generation? Well, I think food waste is one 294 00:19:26,116 --> 00:19:28,436 Speaker 1: of the lowest hanging fruit and the great thing is 295 00:19:28,476 --> 00:19:30,676 Speaker 1: that we can solve it by eating and enjoying food 296 00:19:30,676 --> 00:19:33,756 Speaker 1: together instead of throwing it away. And that's something that 297 00:19:33,836 --> 00:19:38,236 Speaker 1: everyone can engage in in a way that saves money, 298 00:19:38,476 --> 00:19:42,356 Speaker 1: reduces environmental impact and as I said, can build companionship 299 00:19:42,756 --> 00:19:46,556 Speaker 1: between humans, and it starts in our own refrigerators, and 300 00:19:46,596 --> 00:19:50,076 Speaker 1: it moves on to the shopping aisles. And it's a 301 00:19:50,196 --> 00:19:54,956 Speaker 1: very kind of reassuring thing that we can make the 302 00:19:54,996 --> 00:19:58,316 Speaker 1: lives of our fellow humans better and that of the 303 00:19:58,436 --> 00:20:01,556 Speaker 1: natural system that we depend on simply by ensuring that 304 00:20:01,596 --> 00:20:06,436 Speaker 1: all the food we have is eaten. I think where 305 00:20:07,116 --> 00:20:10,356 Speaker 1: it's rather more challenging when one looks at the global 306 00:20:10,396 --> 00:20:16,436 Speaker 1: trend and sees that environmental damage, deforestation, and global warming 307 00:20:16,436 --> 00:20:19,516 Speaker 1: and species extinction and not just still going in the 308 00:20:19,556 --> 00:20:22,996 Speaker 1: wrong direction. In some cases, they're still accelerating in the 309 00:20:23,036 --> 00:20:27,516 Speaker 1: wrong direction. And I think we have to face the reality, 310 00:20:27,636 --> 00:20:33,476 Speaker 1: which is that the probability of us putting a stop 311 00:20:33,516 --> 00:20:37,556 Speaker 1: to this mass species extinction event is really quite low. 312 00:20:38,156 --> 00:20:41,956 Speaker 1: For me, that doesn't mean we sit down and get depressed. 313 00:20:42,716 --> 00:20:45,716 Speaker 1: For me, that means that the less likely it is 314 00:20:46,316 --> 00:20:50,196 Speaker 1: that we'll win, the more energy and the more people 315 00:20:50,756 --> 00:20:54,876 Speaker 1: who have to get engaged and dedicate themselves to solving 316 00:20:54,876 --> 00:20:58,756 Speaker 1: this problem. And I believe that alongside all the negative 317 00:20:58,756 --> 00:21:02,636 Speaker 1: tipping points that we are facing in this world, we 318 00:21:02,716 --> 00:21:07,956 Speaker 1: may also be on a tipping point socially towards the 319 00:21:08,156 --> 00:21:11,996 Speaker 1: ultimate realizing that we are one species, we have one planet, 320 00:21:12,356 --> 00:21:16,076 Speaker 1: and we must act as one instead of vying with 321 00:21:16,116 --> 00:21:19,436 Speaker 1: each other, between different countries to have the biggest slice 322 00:21:19,436 --> 00:21:22,156 Speaker 1: of the cake, and between different corporations to have a 323 00:21:22,196 --> 00:21:24,796 Speaker 1: bigger slice of the cake. At some point, I believe 324 00:21:24,836 --> 00:21:29,116 Speaker 1: we will tip into a kind of global consciousness and 325 00:21:29,196 --> 00:21:33,716 Speaker 1: a global governance of sort where we say, actually, this 326 00:21:33,836 --> 00:21:38,636 Speaker 1: is not in anyone's interest to undermine the viability of 327 00:21:38,676 --> 00:21:44,516 Speaker 1: our living planet through this wasteful and destructive way in 328 00:21:44,516 --> 00:21:47,676 Speaker 1: which we're producing food. I believe that is possible, and 329 00:21:47,716 --> 00:21:50,436 Speaker 1: I believe that the benefit that will bring in terms 330 00:21:50,476 --> 00:21:56,076 Speaker 1: of bringing great, accessible, nutritious food that helps to regenerate 331 00:21:56,076 --> 00:21:59,796 Speaker 1: our land. That is a vision that is not unattainable, 332 00:21:59,956 --> 00:22:03,636 Speaker 1: and I find it very very attractive. So trust him. 333 00:22:03,676 --> 00:22:06,076 Speaker 1: If somebody is listening into this and feels like very 334 00:22:06,116 --> 00:22:09,276 Speaker 1: motivated to reduce the impact, what are five things that 335 00:22:09,316 --> 00:22:14,076 Speaker 1: they can do today? Buy less? That is the first 336 00:22:14,116 --> 00:22:20,996 Speaker 1: thing that everyone can do. Buy less stuff. Number two, 337 00:22:22,036 --> 00:22:28,236 Speaker 1: when you've bought food, just make sure every morsel is eaten. 338 00:22:29,076 --> 00:22:32,716 Speaker 1: Think of the value in that food, and is sure 339 00:22:32,796 --> 00:22:37,276 Speaker 1: that you squeeze every last bit out of that. Number 340 00:22:37,316 --> 00:22:40,476 Speaker 1: Three make it fun. My motto is, if you want 341 00:22:40,516 --> 00:22:43,396 Speaker 1: to change the world for a better party than the 342 00:22:43,396 --> 00:22:47,276 Speaker 1: people destroying it, that's such a good motto. I want 343 00:22:47,276 --> 00:22:54,156 Speaker 1: to steal that. Number four, change where you buy your food. 344 00:22:54,796 --> 00:22:59,676 Speaker 1: There are businesses and farms producing food in a way 345 00:22:59,716 --> 00:23:02,836 Speaker 1: that looks after the health of the planet and looks 346 00:23:02,876 --> 00:23:07,156 Speaker 1: after your health. Those are where we need to gravitate 347 00:23:07,516 --> 00:23:11,116 Speaker 1: and give our money to, and not the massive corporations 348 00:23:11,156 --> 00:23:16,796 Speaker 1: that are stripping the earth. Bear. Yeah. Number five, eat 349 00:23:16,916 --> 00:23:21,676 Speaker 1: more plants and less meat and dairy products. That is 350 00:23:22,076 --> 00:23:25,996 Speaker 1: a very simple shift that we can all do to 351 00:23:25,996 --> 00:23:30,436 Speaker 1: our own degree, and that will massively increase the efficiency 352 00:23:30,756 --> 00:23:33,596 Speaker 1: and reduce the harm that we do through our food 353 00:23:33,716 --> 00:23:39,156 Speaker 1: production system. Is there anything else that I didn't ask 354 00:23:39,196 --> 00:23:41,796 Speaker 1: that you'd like to say? You can wash that food 355 00:23:41,836 --> 00:23:47,436 Speaker 1: down with a can of toastale and thereby help to 356 00:23:47,956 --> 00:23:50,596 Speaker 1: fund the great work of all the NGOs that are 357 00:23:50,596 --> 00:23:53,636 Speaker 1: trying to solve this massive problem on behalf of us. 358 00:23:53,676 --> 00:23:59,756 Speaker 1: All the realization that we are in an extinction event 359 00:23:59,836 --> 00:24:02,436 Speaker 1: and humans may be on the way out, well, that's 360 00:24:02,436 --> 00:24:07,156 Speaker 1: obviously dark and frightening, But as Tristram says, the smaller 361 00:24:07,196 --> 00:24:10,356 Speaker 1: our odds of making it through, the more people who 362 00:24:10,356 --> 00:24:12,956 Speaker 1: will join in the fight, so we better make it fun. 363 00:24:13,476 --> 00:24:15,996 Speaker 1: When I think about how best to help instead of 364 00:24:16,076 --> 00:24:18,756 Speaker 1: hurt the environment, it's often something I need to stop doing. 365 00:24:19,196 --> 00:24:22,276 Speaker 1: Don't fly, don't eat meat, don't buy fast fashion, and 366 00:24:22,396 --> 00:24:25,716 Speaker 1: that's all good. But what I love about Tristram's philosophy 367 00:24:25,756 --> 00:24:29,916 Speaker 1: is that it's so positive. Use everything, enjoy it, Support 368 00:24:29,996 --> 00:24:33,156 Speaker 1: farmers where you can. And obviously he's speaking to those 369 00:24:33,196 --> 00:24:35,476 Speaker 1: of us who are lucky enough to even have a 370 00:24:35,636 --> 00:24:39,556 Speaker 1: personal choice, people who have an abundance of snacks everywhere 371 00:24:39,556 --> 00:24:42,636 Speaker 1: we look. In future episodes of Solvable, we're going to 372 00:24:42,716 --> 00:24:45,956 Speaker 1: look at food waste in less fortunate parts of the world, 373 00:24:46,476 --> 00:24:49,756 Speaker 1: where food is lost not because people don't like brown bananas, 374 00:24:50,156 --> 00:24:53,796 Speaker 1: but because of poor infrastructure. The food spoils before it 375 00:24:53,876 --> 00:24:57,196 Speaker 1: even reaches them. But there's a solvable for that too, 376 00:24:57,276 --> 00:25:05,076 Speaker 1: so keep listening. Solvable is a collaboration between Pushkin Industries 377 00:25:05,116 --> 00:25:08,756 Speaker 1: and the Rockefella Foundation, with production by Chalk and Blade. 378 00:25:09,236 --> 00:25:14,036 Speaker 1: Pushkin's executive producer is Mia LaBelle. Engineering by Jason Gambrell 379 00:25:14,156 --> 00:25:18,596 Speaker 1: and the fine folks at GSI Studios. Original music composed 380 00:25:18,596 --> 00:25:22,636 Speaker 1: by Pascal Wise. Special thanks to Maggie Taylor, Heather Faine, 381 00:25:22,996 --> 00:25:28,596 Speaker 1: Julia Barton, Carlie Migliori, Sheriff Vincent, Jacob Weisberg, and Malcolm Gladwell. 382 00:25:29,076 --> 00:25:32,276 Speaker 1: You can learn more about solving Today's biggest problems at 383 00:25:32,396 --> 00:25:37,756 Speaker 1: Rockefeller Foundation dot org slash solvable. I'm Mave Higgins, Now 384 00:25:37,796 --> 00:25:48,316 Speaker 1: go solve it. Oh are you still here? I wanted 385 00:25:48,356 --> 00:25:50,796 Speaker 1: to leave you with this little gem that we found 386 00:25:50,956 --> 00:25:55,676 Speaker 1: from a French campaign called Inglorious Fruits and Vegetables. This 387 00:25:55,916 --> 00:25:59,596 Speaker 1: is the ugly carrot. I want you to ask yourself 388 00:26:00,036 --> 00:26:03,516 Speaker 1: what defines you? Is it your taste? Is it your texture? 389 00:26:03,996 --> 00:26:08,836 Speaker 1: Is it what you're made of? Potassium, iron, calcium, Vitamin ABC? 390 00:26:09,476 --> 00:26:13,756 Speaker 1: Even kay you have them all. You have everything that 391 00:26:13,796 --> 00:26:17,276 Speaker 1: other fruits and vegetables have. You can be whatever you 392 00:26:17,316 --> 00:26:21,516 Speaker 1: want to be, juice, soup, stew, you name it. Who 393 00:26:21,596 --> 00:26:26,076 Speaker 1: says you're not eligible for supermarkets? Who? You got to 394 00:26:26,116 --> 00:26:30,876 Speaker 1: stop believing in yourself otherwise nobody else will when you'll 395 00:26:30,916 --> 00:26:33,716 Speaker 1: be lined up in boxes that supermarkets. I want you 396 00:26:33,796 --> 00:26:37,716 Speaker 1: to stand upright and feel proud but what you are, 397 00:26:38,236 --> 00:26:41,356 Speaker 1: because there's nothing wrong in being ugly.