1 00:00:01,760 --> 00:00:10,760 Speaker 1: Cool Zone Media book Club book Club book Club Club. 2 00:00:12,680 --> 00:00:16,000 Speaker 1: It's the Cool Zone Media book Club, the only podcast 3 00:00:16,160 --> 00:00:21,240 Speaker 1: started by chanting that is never in sync. I'm your host, 4 00:00:21,480 --> 00:00:25,480 Speaker 1: Margaret Kiljoy, and my guest today is Daniel Hi. 5 00:00:26,880 --> 00:00:27,840 Speaker 2: First time, long time. 6 00:00:28,120 --> 00:00:31,200 Speaker 1: Daniel's often known as the person who does the editing 7 00:00:31,280 --> 00:00:32,280 Speaker 1: behind the scenes. 8 00:00:32,560 --> 00:00:36,080 Speaker 2: Yes, it is I, the occasional angelic voice interrupting the podcast. 9 00:00:36,560 --> 00:00:39,080 Speaker 1: Yeah, I really like that effect. That's like one of 10 00:00:39,080 --> 00:00:39,879 Speaker 1: my favorite effects. 11 00:00:39,920 --> 00:00:41,640 Speaker 2: Okay, good, Yeah. 12 00:00:41,720 --> 00:00:43,960 Speaker 1: So Cool Zone Media book Club is every Sunday we 13 00:00:44,000 --> 00:00:48,280 Speaker 1: bring you fiction. And this week I'm recovering from oral surgery, 14 00:00:48,720 --> 00:00:53,720 Speaker 1: so instead of finding a different story, I'm going to 15 00:00:53,800 --> 00:00:56,520 Speaker 1: read one of my stories, yay. And because it's not 16 00:00:56,560 --> 00:01:00,080 Speaker 1: a short story, it's a medium short story, it's I 17 00:01:00,080 --> 00:01:02,400 Speaker 1: think technically a novelette. I think I'm like right on 18 00:01:02,440 --> 00:01:05,039 Speaker 1: the novelette line. You ever spend your time thinking about 19 00:01:05,040 --> 00:01:07,800 Speaker 1: the word counts that distinguish different lengths of fiction. 20 00:01:08,600 --> 00:01:09,720 Speaker 2: Only all the time? 21 00:01:10,200 --> 00:01:12,240 Speaker 1: Yeah, Like, I don't know if I've been to a 22 00:01:12,280 --> 00:01:15,280 Speaker 1: dinner where people aren't talking about the difference between flash fiction, 23 00:01:15,400 --> 00:01:21,320 Speaker 1: short story, novelette, novella, novel, and how they're just it's 24 00:01:21,360 --> 00:01:26,679 Speaker 1: just so much there's social constructs just like gender and yeah, truly, 25 00:01:26,760 --> 00:01:29,880 Speaker 1: yeah truly, which I actually kind of did once. I 26 00:01:29,959 --> 00:01:32,000 Speaker 1: wrote this book called The Country It Goes once and 27 00:01:32,080 --> 00:01:34,319 Speaker 1: I was like, it's my first novel because it's about 28 00:01:34,319 --> 00:01:37,000 Speaker 1: fifty two thousand words long, okay, And then I quickly 29 00:01:37,080 --> 00:01:39,120 Speaker 1: learned that it is like far better for my career 30 00:01:39,240 --> 00:01:44,919 Speaker 1: if I was like, it's my it's a novella. Really yeah, interesting, yeah, 31 00:01:44,920 --> 00:01:48,280 Speaker 1: because a debut novel is like a specific thing, and 32 00:01:48,280 --> 00:01:52,400 Speaker 1: fifty thousand words is like it's on the line. It's okay, 33 00:01:52,880 --> 00:01:56,040 Speaker 1: you could call it either way. Okay, interesting, interesting, it's 34 00:01:56,040 --> 00:01:59,120 Speaker 1: a novella, gotcha, gotcha? This one you could call either 35 00:01:59,120 --> 00:02:02,880 Speaker 1: a short story or nottat, which is obviously interesting to 36 00:02:02,960 --> 00:02:06,400 Speaker 1: anyone who isn't a writer. No one cares about these lengths. 37 00:02:07,720 --> 00:02:13,200 Speaker 1: But this story was first published by the magazine's Strange 38 00:02:13,240 --> 00:02:16,920 Speaker 1: Horizons in twenty eighteen, and it is a story of 39 00:02:19,240 --> 00:02:26,400 Speaker 1: AI and murder ooh fun and justifiable homicide. 40 00:02:27,040 --> 00:02:28,080 Speaker 2: Maybe topical. 41 00:02:28,680 --> 00:02:34,080 Speaker 1: I know. It's called the Fortunate Death of Jonathan sandalson 42 00:02:35,960 --> 00:02:39,560 Speaker 1: Solid Name. Thanks. I straight up didn't think I was 43 00:02:39,560 --> 00:02:42,920 Speaker 1: gonna saw this story. I was like, I have clearly 44 00:02:42,960 --> 00:02:45,399 Speaker 1: written to extreme of a story. No one is going 45 00:02:45,440 --> 00:02:48,560 Speaker 1: to buy this, and I sold it to the first 46 00:02:48,639 --> 00:02:50,760 Speaker 1: magazine I sent it to Boom. 47 00:02:50,840 --> 00:02:52,440 Speaker 2: There you go, rules. 48 00:02:52,560 --> 00:02:56,640 Speaker 1: Thanks. I was just trying to box troll that asshole 49 00:02:56,639 --> 00:02:58,880 Speaker 1: in the quitting like I'd gotten the two guys before 50 00:02:58,919 --> 00:03:00,800 Speaker 1: him to do. I swear I wasn't trying to get 51 00:03:00,840 --> 00:03:03,320 Speaker 1: him all dead and shit. It wasn't my box that 52 00:03:03,400 --> 00:03:06,480 Speaker 1: did it, but I guess all drone related crimes fall 53 00:03:06,560 --> 00:03:10,119 Speaker 1: under federal jurisdiction. And when a SEVI octocopter box put 54 00:03:10,120 --> 00:03:13,320 Speaker 1: a bullet in Jonathan Sandalson's front left tire and sent 55 00:03:13,400 --> 00:03:16,640 Speaker 1: him careening into the ocean and the afterlife, the Feds 56 00:03:16,680 --> 00:03:20,360 Speaker 1: assumed it was me. Well, they assumed it was my handle. 57 00:03:21,000 --> 00:03:24,680 Speaker 1: Hey Hey, Cameron. They probably hadn't made the connection between 58 00:03:24,760 --> 00:03:29,160 Speaker 1: heyy and real world and me Jay Diana Diaz, not yet. 59 00:03:30,840 --> 00:03:32,880 Speaker 1: I watched the whole thing happen on a live feed. 60 00:03:34,400 --> 00:03:37,040 Speaker 1: Oh that's funny. I just realized, whenever you set a 61 00:03:37,160 --> 00:03:39,840 Speaker 1: story in the future, most magazines are like, don't put 62 00:03:39,840 --> 00:03:42,600 Speaker 1: a date in it. Oh interesting, And the reason that 63 00:03:42,640 --> 00:03:44,360 Speaker 1: they do that is why I'm about to read this 64 00:03:45,760 --> 00:03:49,000 Speaker 1: At four thirty am on September eighth, twenty twenty four, 65 00:03:49,840 --> 00:03:52,840 Speaker 1: mister Sandalson pulled out of his garage and his vintage beamer. 66 00:03:53,360 --> 00:03:55,480 Speaker 1: He drove a dumb, dumb car, probably because he was 67 00:03:55,520 --> 00:03:59,280 Speaker 1: afraid I'd hack anything else, which was true. I'd hacked 68 00:03:59,320 --> 00:04:03,920 Speaker 1: his neighbor secure cameras. Two years earlier, an Amazon delivery 69 00:04:03,920 --> 00:04:06,280 Speaker 1: bot had been out of cell service during an automated 70 00:04:06,280 --> 00:04:09,000 Speaker 1: firmware update. It drifted too close to one of the 71 00:04:09,040 --> 00:04:11,680 Speaker 1: nodes in my box net, and my AI owned it. 72 00:04:12,560 --> 00:04:15,240 Speaker 1: Then it just went about its job, a sleeper agent, 73 00:04:15,400 --> 00:04:18,919 Speaker 1: patiently waiting for its chance to troll my enemies. My 74 00:04:19,000 --> 00:04:21,520 Speaker 1: Amazon was in the area and it got a call 75 00:04:21,560 --> 00:04:24,240 Speaker 1: from my AI at four thirty one am. By four 76 00:04:24,240 --> 00:04:27,520 Speaker 1: point thirty two, it was tailing, mister Sanderson. I don't 77 00:04:27,560 --> 00:04:30,480 Speaker 1: go for manual control. That's a nubs game, too slow 78 00:04:30,640 --> 00:04:32,960 Speaker 1: and it lacks art. I trust my code to make 79 00:04:33,000 --> 00:04:36,200 Speaker 1: its own decisions about how to ruin people's lives. Hacking 80 00:04:36,200 --> 00:04:39,800 Speaker 1: billboards on his route, party boxes outside his windows at night, 81 00:04:40,279 --> 00:04:43,080 Speaker 1: armies of toy dolls following him through the mall announcing 82 00:04:43,120 --> 00:04:48,000 Speaker 1: his various crimes. That kind of thing. I set hard limits, 83 00:04:48,560 --> 00:04:51,000 Speaker 1: not just the standard no injury or anything that might 84 00:04:51,040 --> 00:04:54,200 Speaker 1: cause injury stuff. I also told my AI not to 85 00:04:54,240 --> 00:04:58,400 Speaker 1: harass civies. No targeting relatives, no targeting low or medium 86 00:04:58,480 --> 00:05:03,000 Speaker 1: level employees of Herculean Solutions Group, only Sandalson and the 87 00:05:03,000 --> 00:05:07,640 Speaker 1: board of directors. Oh and Sandalson's therapists. That might not 88 00:05:07,720 --> 00:05:10,120 Speaker 1: be fair, but it was fun to watch those fuckers 89 00:05:10,160 --> 00:05:14,120 Speaker 1: quit so fast. That morning, September eighth, the protocol was 90 00:05:14,160 --> 00:05:17,760 Speaker 1: set to hover right outside of personal EMP reach, just 91 00:05:17,800 --> 00:05:20,080 Speaker 1: to remind him that I was there, that I was 92 00:05:20,120 --> 00:05:25,760 Speaker 1: watching that morning, I even was a couple thousand miles away. 93 00:05:25,800 --> 00:05:27,760 Speaker 1: I was up early and still tipsy enough that my 94 00:05:27,800 --> 00:05:31,320 Speaker 1: hangover hadn't kicked in yet. The Texas sun wasn't going 95 00:05:31,360 --> 00:05:33,479 Speaker 1: to be up for an hour or so yet, and 96 00:05:33,560 --> 00:05:36,160 Speaker 1: McGonagall was curled up next to me in a fuzzy 97 00:05:36,160 --> 00:05:38,640 Speaker 1: ball of cat on my sleeping bag on the couch. 98 00:05:39,720 --> 00:05:41,760 Speaker 1: Two of my housemates had just gone to sleep after 99 00:05:41,800 --> 00:05:43,800 Speaker 1: a long night of work driving around the city for 100 00:05:43,839 --> 00:05:48,159 Speaker 1: whatever the latest uber but for drugs app. Was my 101 00:05:48,200 --> 00:05:50,560 Speaker 1: third roommate, the one I actually liked, had just run 102 00:05:50,560 --> 00:05:52,600 Speaker 1: off in his ill fitting polo shirt to sit at 103 00:05:52,600 --> 00:05:57,560 Speaker 1: an IT desk. Poor Marcel, I think the reason we 104 00:05:57,560 --> 00:06:01,080 Speaker 1: don't call our boxes drones much anymore is because it 105 00:06:01,120 --> 00:06:03,120 Speaker 1: would be a shame to compare something as cool as 106 00:06:03,120 --> 00:06:08,680 Speaker 1: a semi autonomous robot to human drones at office jobs. 107 00:06:09,000 --> 00:06:11,400 Speaker 1: I turned on the TV set it to watch my 108 00:06:11,480 --> 00:06:15,240 Speaker 1: mark idle curiosity. I usually checked in a couple times 109 00:06:15,240 --> 00:06:19,400 Speaker 1: a week when I couldn't sleep. I saw my marks 110 00:06:19,440 --> 00:06:22,559 Speaker 1: BMW hit the coastal roads, and maybe he was driving 111 00:06:22,600 --> 00:06:25,440 Speaker 1: extra fast because he saw that Amazon box on his tail. 112 00:06:26,200 --> 00:06:29,360 Speaker 1: Maybe that part is my fault. Maybe you don't get 113 00:06:29,400 --> 00:06:31,599 Speaker 1: to harass a man for a year and feel innocent 114 00:06:31,680 --> 00:06:36,440 Speaker 1: in his death. I don't know. The city Octo came 115 00:06:36,480 --> 00:06:39,520 Speaker 1: out of a live oak on the hillside, no running lights. 116 00:06:40,120 --> 00:06:41,640 Speaker 1: It wouldn't have been seen if it weren't for my 117 00:06:41,640 --> 00:06:45,360 Speaker 1: Amazon scouring the thing's defenses. My AI was pretty sure 118 00:06:45,360 --> 00:06:47,279 Speaker 1: we could own this one in a matter of seconds, 119 00:06:47,360 --> 00:06:50,200 Speaker 1: indicated by a blue rectangle overlay on the feed that 120 00:06:50,320 --> 00:06:54,080 Speaker 1: started to turn green. That blue rectangle streaked out from 121 00:06:54,080 --> 00:06:57,320 Speaker 1: the branches, fired one shot, then kept going out over 122 00:06:57,360 --> 00:07:01,400 Speaker 1: the ocean. The box self destructed before I gained full control, 123 00:07:01,960 --> 00:07:06,200 Speaker 1: but not before I had an IP address. The whole 124 00:07:06,240 --> 00:07:08,599 Speaker 1: thing happened so fast I had to rewind and watch 125 00:07:08,600 --> 00:07:12,080 Speaker 1: in slow motion bullet to the tire time to drive 126 00:07:12,160 --> 00:07:15,280 Speaker 1: him over the cliff. The city was a custom job. 127 00:07:15,920 --> 00:07:19,720 Speaker 1: Someone had handbuilt that fucking thing just to kill Jonathan sandalson. 128 00:07:21,240 --> 00:07:23,840 Speaker 1: My AI was smart enough not to drop my box 129 00:07:23,880 --> 00:07:27,120 Speaker 1: down over the cliff and look for signs of life. Instead, 130 00:07:27,320 --> 00:07:30,480 Speaker 1: it went into crisis mode, self destructed the Amazon over 131 00:07:30,520 --> 00:07:33,080 Speaker 1: the ocean and locked down the whole box net to 132 00:07:33,160 --> 00:07:36,600 Speaker 1: keep me from getting popped. For all the good it did, 133 00:07:37,920 --> 00:07:40,800 Speaker 1: my hands shook made tapping out commands on my tablet 134 00:07:40,840 --> 00:07:43,680 Speaker 1: all the harder. The IP address led to a VPN, 135 00:07:43,840 --> 00:07:46,400 Speaker 1: a shitty one with known vulnerabilities and a tendency to 136 00:07:46,400 --> 00:07:48,200 Speaker 1: take at least a day to wipe their logs, no 137 00:07:48,240 --> 00:07:51,040 Speaker 1: matter what they claim in their ads. That gave me 138 00:07:51,080 --> 00:07:55,520 Speaker 1: another IP address, that gave me a name. I set 139 00:07:55,560 --> 00:07:57,760 Speaker 1: my search AI to docks the man while I looked 140 00:07:57,800 --> 00:08:01,240 Speaker 1: for recent attacks by custom octocopters. I'm not the best 141 00:08:01,240 --> 00:08:03,480 Speaker 1: of finding people and what they've done. I've got nothing 142 00:08:03,480 --> 00:08:07,600 Speaker 1: on Marcel, but even still it didn't take long. Three 143 00:08:07,600 --> 00:08:10,920 Speaker 1: weeks ago, someone box killed a judge in San Diego. 144 00:08:11,960 --> 00:08:19,080 Speaker 1: There was video I clicked. I wish I hadn't Box 145 00:08:19,200 --> 00:08:23,200 Speaker 1: killers are the enemy. Box trolling, at least leftist box 146 00:08:23,240 --> 00:08:26,800 Speaker 1: trolling is a proud political tradition that goes back years. Okay, 147 00:08:27,160 --> 00:08:31,040 Speaker 1: like maybe three or four years. Still, we don't kill people, 148 00:08:31,960 --> 00:08:35,240 Speaker 1: don't risk killing people with autonomous or semi autonomous drones. 149 00:08:35,440 --> 00:08:38,760 Speaker 1: That's the golden rule of box trolling. The other two 150 00:08:38,840 --> 00:08:41,520 Speaker 1: rules don't snitch on your fellow box trollers and don't 151 00:08:41,520 --> 00:08:44,040 Speaker 1: boxtroll people who aren't in the process of wrecking the world. 152 00:08:44,640 --> 00:08:46,960 Speaker 1: Those were important too, but it ain't got nothing on 153 00:08:47,000 --> 00:08:51,760 Speaker 1: the golden rule. We have a reputation to maintain, much 154 00:08:51,920 --> 00:08:55,439 Speaker 1: like the reputation of these fine products and services that 155 00:08:55,600 --> 00:08:59,120 Speaker 1: support this podcast. You're muted. 156 00:09:00,120 --> 00:09:02,719 Speaker 2: I love as an audio engineer when I miss that 157 00:09:02,880 --> 00:09:07,600 Speaker 2: very simple thing, Oh you're muted. I hope that these 158 00:09:07,640 --> 00:09:11,280 Speaker 2: products and services are eventually dropped by Box to you 159 00:09:11,520 --> 00:09:13,400 Speaker 2: and or me and or the listener. 160 00:09:13,600 --> 00:09:16,840 Speaker 1: That's right, they will be if you insist. If you say, 161 00:09:16,880 --> 00:09:19,679 Speaker 1: do not deliver this except by semi autonomous drone that 162 00:09:19,760 --> 00:09:24,280 Speaker 1: it can then repurpose to harass CEOs. But in the 163 00:09:24,360 --> 00:09:27,000 Speaker 1: like comments section, the like special part of the order, 164 00:09:27,080 --> 00:09:44,320 Speaker 1: you know, yeah, yeah, and we're back. I signed into 165 00:09:44,360 --> 00:09:47,680 Speaker 1: work at Taco Dick's at seven fifty nine am. Jittery 166 00:09:47,760 --> 00:09:51,160 Speaker 1: from caffeine intension. I get marked late if I'm not 167 00:09:51,240 --> 00:09:53,480 Speaker 1: at least a minute early, and that pisses me off 168 00:09:53,600 --> 00:09:55,840 Speaker 1: enough that I always sign in one minute early to 169 00:09:55,880 --> 00:09:59,560 Speaker 1: the millisecond, whether or not I'm actually there. I usually am, 170 00:09:59,640 --> 00:10:04,000 Speaker 1: though I'm too poor to risk getting fired. Working at 171 00:10:04,040 --> 00:10:07,040 Speaker 1: an automated fast food joint is lonely, just me and 172 00:10:07,080 --> 00:10:10,920 Speaker 1: the food robots and the customers. I prefer the food robots. 173 00:10:11,720 --> 00:10:14,400 Speaker 1: I'd rather help a gualk box that's accidentally tracked itself 174 00:10:14,440 --> 00:10:17,000 Speaker 1: into a corner than some hungover asshole who is upset 175 00:10:17,040 --> 00:10:20,520 Speaker 1: because there are potatoes in his potato and rice burrito. 176 00:10:22,480 --> 00:10:25,440 Speaker 1: Mostly people in boxes can figure that shit out themselves, 177 00:10:25,480 --> 00:10:27,920 Speaker 1: and I'm extraneous, so at least half my day I 178 00:10:27,960 --> 00:10:30,640 Speaker 1: sit around and listen to podcasts. That's what I was 179 00:10:30,679 --> 00:10:33,839 Speaker 1: doing that morning, nine am, just listening to the history 180 00:10:33,840 --> 00:10:36,880 Speaker 1: of the Maganestas in the Mexican Revolution, just trying to 181 00:10:36,920 --> 00:10:38,920 Speaker 1: get through my day without thinking about the death of 182 00:10:38,960 --> 00:10:41,920 Speaker 1: my mark when that voice of the state robot cut 183 00:10:41,960 --> 00:10:46,040 Speaker 1: in on my headphones. While authorities have yet to issue 184 00:10:46,040 --> 00:10:48,280 Speaker 1: an arrest warrant, they are asking for the public's help 185 00:10:48,280 --> 00:10:52,680 Speaker 1: and identifying the hacker known as JJ Cameron. They pronounced 186 00:10:52,679 --> 00:10:56,400 Speaker 1: he Hey wrong like JJ instead of he he simple 187 00:10:56,440 --> 00:11:01,559 Speaker 1: as that, sudden as that I was a wanted girl. Fuck. 188 00:11:02,400 --> 00:11:04,439 Speaker 1: When I first got into the whole hackedavist thing three 189 00:11:04,520 --> 00:11:08,240 Speaker 1: years back, I'd started off small. Stealing four hundred thousand 190 00:11:08,240 --> 00:11:10,760 Speaker 1: dollars wasn't nearly enough to bankrupt a for profit prison, 191 00:11:11,120 --> 00:11:13,920 Speaker 1: let alone a holding company the size of Herculean Solutions 192 00:11:13,920 --> 00:11:17,199 Speaker 1: Group with dozens of prisons and deportation and tournament camps 193 00:11:17,240 --> 00:11:20,160 Speaker 1: to its name. When my friend Miguel got deported, and 194 00:11:20,520 --> 00:11:22,360 Speaker 1: he'd spent all but the first two years of his 195 00:11:22,400 --> 00:11:25,080 Speaker 1: twenty years living in the Land of the Free, the 196 00:11:25,080 --> 00:11:28,560 Speaker 1: people who deported him took all of his cash. Is 197 00:11:28,600 --> 00:11:31,160 Speaker 1: that legal? I'd asked him when he got online in 198 00:11:31,240 --> 00:11:32,280 Speaker 1: Nogaulis and called me. 199 00:11:33,360 --> 00:11:33,880 Speaker 2: I don't know. 200 00:11:34,280 --> 00:11:36,280 Speaker 1: They gave me a fucking bank card, but it doesn't 201 00:11:36,320 --> 00:11:38,040 Speaker 1: work right and the balance is in half of what 202 00:11:38,120 --> 00:11:41,120 Speaker 1: I had on me when they picked me up. Tell 203 00:11:41,160 --> 00:11:46,600 Speaker 1: me about the bank card, like the details. That's how 204 00:11:46,679 --> 00:11:49,679 Speaker 1: it had started four hundred thousand dollars, which was all 205 00:11:49,679 --> 00:11:52,640 Speaker 1: I could grab easily filing a counterfeit request for middle 206 00:11:52,679 --> 00:11:55,800 Speaker 1: management bonuses. I tried to give it all to Miguel, 207 00:11:55,840 --> 00:11:57,720 Speaker 1: but he made me split it one hundred ways and 208 00:11:57,760 --> 00:12:00,400 Speaker 1: give it to the next ninety nine deporties. He ran cross. 209 00:12:01,800 --> 00:12:04,160 Speaker 1: I never heard from him again. I don't think he 210 00:12:04,200 --> 00:12:07,280 Speaker 1: got caught. Marcel was good at keeping tabs on people 211 00:12:07,320 --> 00:12:09,079 Speaker 1: and helped me write an AI to main a search 212 00:12:09,160 --> 00:12:12,080 Speaker 1: for him in any new databasis of the dead or arrested. 213 00:12:12,840 --> 00:12:15,880 Speaker 1: But I'm pretty sure he got spooked, went underground and 214 00:12:15,960 --> 00:12:20,360 Speaker 1: stayed underground. It's funny how deep you can get buried 215 00:12:20,360 --> 00:12:25,760 Speaker 1: without dying these days. Hey, what the hell am I 216 00:12:25,760 --> 00:12:31,480 Speaker 1: gonna do? Maximum? Go to Mexico? Hey? If I'm in Mexico, 217 00:12:31,520 --> 00:12:33,319 Speaker 1: when the Feds catch me, I don't know, they might 218 00:12:33,360 --> 00:12:39,120 Speaker 1: just fucking box kill me. Maximum Iceland, heyy, I could 219 00:12:39,160 --> 00:12:41,920 Speaker 1: definitely get to Iceland. They definitely still let American citizens 220 00:12:41,920 --> 00:12:46,080 Speaker 1: in without a visa. Maximum, I'm just trying to help 221 00:12:46,120 --> 00:12:51,679 Speaker 1: my favorite Forever House guest. Hey, I'm freaking the fuck out. Maximum. 222 00:12:52,080 --> 00:12:55,959 Speaker 1: Use your AI. HEYY, it trolls people, I'd tell it 223 00:12:56,040 --> 00:12:58,600 Speaker 1: to troll That's all it does. It's semi autonomous software, 224 00:12:58,679 --> 00:13:02,880 Speaker 1: not a fucking oracle. Or something Star Trek shit, Maximum, 225 00:13:02,920 --> 00:13:05,520 Speaker 1: cool because I didn't know that because I'm a total nube. 226 00:13:06,360 --> 00:13:10,080 Speaker 1: Hey sorry, Maximum, you said you tracked down the person 227 00:13:10,080 --> 00:13:14,080 Speaker 1: who did it. Hey, yeah, I'm about eighty percent. I 228 00:13:14,120 --> 00:13:17,720 Speaker 1: got the guy. He's bad at OPSEC. Took me twenty minutes, ruthless, though. 229 00:13:17,840 --> 00:13:19,439 Speaker 1: I don't think my life will get any better if 230 00:13:19,440 --> 00:13:24,679 Speaker 1: he knows who I am. Maximum, What do you mean? Hey, 231 00:13:24,920 --> 00:13:30,280 Speaker 1: here's a video content warning? Maximum? Did you know that 232 00:13:30,360 --> 00:13:32,480 Speaker 1: dead men are more likely to float face down than 233 00:13:32,520 --> 00:13:34,520 Speaker 1: dead women. It has to do with their center of 234 00:13:34,559 --> 00:13:37,120 Speaker 1: gravity or something. They all sink at first, but later 235 00:13:37,160 --> 00:13:41,120 Speaker 1: they float back up. Hey, Hey, you watch a video 236 00:13:41,120 --> 00:13:43,040 Speaker 1: of a guy bleeding out in a swimming pool shot 237 00:13:43,080 --> 00:13:45,520 Speaker 1: by a drone at Sunday barbecue and that's what you 238 00:13:45,559 --> 00:13:50,680 Speaker 1: respond with? Maximum? Okay, yeah, the box Killer guys fucked up. 239 00:13:50,720 --> 00:13:52,560 Speaker 1: He killed some dude in front of his screaming kids 240 00:13:52,600 --> 00:13:54,400 Speaker 1: and shit. It's just that I wrote a paper on 241 00:13:54,440 --> 00:13:56,000 Speaker 1: dead bodies floating when I was in college, and I 242 00:13:56,040 --> 00:14:01,319 Speaker 1: thought it was kind of cool. Hey, why are we friends? Maximum? 243 00:14:01,679 --> 00:14:03,760 Speaker 1: For you, I think it's because you need somewhere to live. 244 00:14:03,880 --> 00:14:08,760 Speaker 1: For me, I'm guessing it's because you put up with me. Maximum. Anyway, 245 00:14:09,000 --> 00:14:11,880 Speaker 1: your box killer is scary af and there's no reason 246 00:14:11,920 --> 00:14:14,080 Speaker 1: why you should take the fall for what someone else did. 247 00:14:14,600 --> 00:14:18,920 Speaker 1: You could snitch, hey, Hey, No Maximum? 248 00:14:19,040 --> 00:14:19,360 Speaker 2: Why not? 249 00:14:20,400 --> 00:14:25,280 Speaker 1: Hey? Because I am not a bad person? Maximum? Yeah, 250 00:14:25,320 --> 00:14:27,280 Speaker 1: I get it. The second rule of box troll club 251 00:14:27,320 --> 00:14:29,280 Speaker 1: is no snitching. But the first rule of box troll 252 00:14:29,320 --> 00:14:33,080 Speaker 1: club is no killing. Hey. First, if I read this 253 00:14:33,160 --> 00:14:35,240 Speaker 1: guy out, hell, if I get caught snooping on him 254 00:14:35,240 --> 00:14:37,640 Speaker 1: at all, you'll be telling your roommates some neat new 255 00:14:37,680 --> 00:14:41,960 Speaker 1: fact about what dead bodies do. Hey. Second, I mean, 256 00:14:42,320 --> 00:14:44,320 Speaker 1: I don't know this judge, but I know my mark. 257 00:14:44,480 --> 00:14:46,480 Speaker 1: I promise you that that box killer man has less 258 00:14:46,520 --> 00:14:48,840 Speaker 1: blood on his hands than that fucking dead CEO did. 259 00:14:49,360 --> 00:14:52,240 Speaker 1: I'm not really sad Sandalson is dead. And when I'm 260 00:14:52,240 --> 00:14:54,000 Speaker 1: being thrown under a bus, I don't try to find 261 00:14:54,000 --> 00:14:58,480 Speaker 1: someone else to be under the bus instead. Maximum. Someone's 262 00:14:58,520 --> 00:15:01,240 Speaker 1: going to go down for this, and it shouldn't be you. Hey, 263 00:15:01,760 --> 00:15:09,880 Speaker 1: that's an idea. Maximum? What is maximum? What's the idea? Maximum? 264 00:15:09,920 --> 00:15:13,760 Speaker 1: God damn it, I'm coming into your work. Yea. How 265 00:15:13,760 --> 00:15:17,479 Speaker 1: hard it is to read transcriptive chat. 266 00:15:17,360 --> 00:15:18,560 Speaker 2: A text message conversation? 267 00:15:18,680 --> 00:15:21,480 Speaker 1: Yes, yeah, he nailed it though, Thank you, thank you, 268 00:15:24,320 --> 00:15:27,840 Speaker 1: Marcel Maximus Monroe has a way of drawing every eye 269 00:15:27,880 --> 00:15:31,080 Speaker 1: in the room every time. It's that he doesn't stand. 270 00:15:31,240 --> 00:15:35,000 Speaker 1: He he leans everywhere he goes. He drapes himself against 271 00:15:35,000 --> 00:15:37,800 Speaker 1: walls and doorways and chairs. He's the kind of guy 272 00:15:37,840 --> 00:15:40,600 Speaker 1: who looks like he's smoking even when he's not. It's 273 00:15:40,640 --> 00:15:43,240 Speaker 1: not his fault, any of it. It's just who he is. 274 00:15:44,160 --> 00:15:47,120 Speaker 1: He also won't let me call him three M, which 275 00:15:47,160 --> 00:15:51,200 Speaker 1: is fucked up. He should let me call him three M. 276 00:15:51,320 --> 00:15:53,320 Speaker 1: So what's your plan, he asked as he propped himself 277 00:15:53,400 --> 00:15:55,200 Speaker 1: up on the end of the counter, and Taco Dix. 278 00:15:56,040 --> 00:15:58,160 Speaker 1: My plan is to not talk about it here, I said. 279 00:15:58,640 --> 00:16:01,000 Speaker 1: There weren't any customers, but that sure shit didn't mean 280 00:16:01,040 --> 00:16:03,640 Speaker 1: no one was listening. Then can I get a French 281 00:16:03,680 --> 00:16:06,880 Speaker 1: fri burrito? He asked, No, I answered, but I put 282 00:16:06,880 --> 00:16:10,640 Speaker 1: in the order anyway. He went to a booth to eat, 283 00:16:10,800 --> 00:16:13,520 Speaker 1: and I ran my tablet through a couple VPNs. I 284 00:16:13,560 --> 00:16:15,880 Speaker 1: had the Taco Dix network pretty well owned, but you 285 00:16:15,880 --> 00:16:19,040 Speaker 1: can never be too careful. It didn't take too long 286 00:16:19,120 --> 00:16:21,680 Speaker 1: to set up Jonas James Abrams as if he was 287 00:16:21,720 --> 00:16:24,880 Speaker 1: a real person and probably the one responsible for all 288 00:16:24,880 --> 00:16:28,120 Speaker 1: my box NetCrime, a couple of forum hacked to insert 289 00:16:28,160 --> 00:16:31,600 Speaker 1: backdated posts on above ground boxer sites, a few purchase 290 00:16:31,680 --> 00:16:35,120 Speaker 1: records for drone equipment, and an IT profile on jobber. 291 00:16:36,120 --> 00:16:38,480 Speaker 1: Everyone assumes that every hacker who has ever lived has 292 00:16:38,520 --> 00:16:41,200 Speaker 1: an above ground career in it. Some of us just 293 00:16:41,200 --> 00:16:44,000 Speaker 1: sell burritos because some of us are women who, even 294 00:16:44,040 --> 00:16:46,840 Speaker 1: though were more or less white, have LATINX last names 295 00:16:46,880 --> 00:16:49,720 Speaker 1: and federal records for computer crime going back to middle school. 296 00:16:51,680 --> 00:16:53,760 Speaker 1: I used one of my custom sock puppet tools to 297 00:16:53,800 --> 00:16:58,560 Speaker 1: develop Abram's personality and Internet history. He was disgruntled. He 298 00:16:58,680 --> 00:17:01,240 Speaker 1: wasn't an activist. He was an IT guy at the 299 00:17:01,320 --> 00:17:04,159 Speaker 1: end of his proverbial rope who'd applied to Herculean Solutions 300 00:17:04,160 --> 00:17:06,840 Speaker 1: group and had been turned down and maybe taking it personally. 301 00:17:06,880 --> 00:17:08,720 Speaker 1: And the activist angle of the trolling was just to 302 00:17:08,760 --> 00:17:12,360 Speaker 1: cover it only took me an hour would have been less, 303 00:17:12,359 --> 00:17:14,840 Speaker 1: but halfway through the food mover box dropped a sack 304 00:17:14,880 --> 00:17:16,359 Speaker 1: of potatoes and I had to get down on all 305 00:17:16,400 --> 00:17:19,280 Speaker 1: fours and rescue a couple dozen spuds that rolled underneath 306 00:17:19,320 --> 00:17:23,480 Speaker 1: the fryer. The best part was Jonas Abrams was a 307 00:17:23,480 --> 00:17:26,960 Speaker 1: fall guy who didn't exist. He was already underground. They'd 308 00:17:26,960 --> 00:17:30,560 Speaker 1: never catch him. Eventually they might figure out he wasn't real, 309 00:17:31,040 --> 00:17:33,680 Speaker 1: but he should buy me some time and plausible deniability. 310 00:17:34,960 --> 00:17:37,359 Speaker 1: After I finished setting up the puppet, I ordered myself 311 00:17:37,440 --> 00:17:39,600 Speaker 1: rice and beans and went to go join Marcel in 312 00:17:39,640 --> 00:17:42,879 Speaker 1: his booth. He took out his phone. I did the same. 313 00:17:43,520 --> 00:17:48,240 Speaker 1: Encryption is safer than voice. Maximum, it work out. Whatever 314 00:17:48,280 --> 00:17:52,840 Speaker 1: you did, Newbgirl zero one, I think so, yeah, Maximum, 315 00:17:53,160 --> 00:17:58,720 Speaker 1: nice handle, New Girl zero one. Whatever, Maximum, you never 316 00:17:58,800 --> 00:18:02,639 Speaker 1: let me or anyone help any more, New Girl zero one, 317 00:18:02,880 --> 00:18:05,240 Speaker 1: the fuck would you want in now? For it's over? 318 00:18:05,320 --> 00:18:09,280 Speaker 1: And also, remember how I almost just got caught Maximum 319 00:18:09,320 --> 00:18:11,880 Speaker 1: just saying you're never on the channels or nothing anymore. 320 00:18:12,800 --> 00:18:14,720 Speaker 1: I glared at him for a minute, but he didn't 321 00:18:14,720 --> 00:18:16,480 Speaker 1: do me the kindness of looking up from his phone 322 00:18:16,480 --> 00:18:20,680 Speaker 1: to catch it. Maximum, I'm misshelping, that's all. Doing white 323 00:18:20,720 --> 00:18:23,720 Speaker 1: hat shit is murder boring, And besides, I'm good at 324 00:18:23,760 --> 00:18:27,160 Speaker 1: making people get underground or stay underground. You have box trolling, 325 00:18:27,680 --> 00:18:31,680 Speaker 1: I have doxing and counterdoxing. I can help New Girl 326 00:18:31,800 --> 00:18:34,600 Speaker 1: zero one. Working with other people is how you get caught. 327 00:18:35,920 --> 00:18:38,800 Speaker 1: Maximum No. Working with the wrong people. Is how you 328 00:18:38,840 --> 00:18:42,200 Speaker 1: get caught Just a couple of roommates sitting across from 329 00:18:42,200 --> 00:18:46,000 Speaker 1: one another texting instead of talking. A common enough scene 330 00:18:46,160 --> 00:18:48,240 Speaker 1: still probably didn't look good to the two Feds and 331 00:18:48,320 --> 00:18:51,840 Speaker 1: suits who walked in. People who wear suits don't eat 332 00:18:51,880 --> 00:18:56,280 Speaker 1: at Taco Dicks. They weren't caricatures of Feds. One man, 333 00:18:56,359 --> 00:18:59,040 Speaker 1: one woman, dressed like gender was a thing that mattered. 334 00:18:59,440 --> 00:19:02,080 Speaker 1: The man was white, real white, red hair, and shit. 335 00:19:02,320 --> 00:19:04,200 Speaker 1: The woman might have been white and might not have been. 336 00:19:04,960 --> 00:19:07,600 Speaker 1: They walked right up to the counter. I thought about 337 00:19:07,640 --> 00:19:09,720 Speaker 1: just putting my head down, pretending I didn't work there, 338 00:19:09,800 --> 00:19:13,040 Speaker 1: than leaving. Then I remembered I had a Taco Dick's 339 00:19:13,080 --> 00:19:16,480 Speaker 1: visor on also that more information is always better than 340 00:19:16,560 --> 00:19:20,439 Speaker 1: less information. I locked my phone in my tablet and 341 00:19:20,480 --> 00:19:23,919 Speaker 1: went to stand behind the counter. Can I help you 342 00:19:24,000 --> 00:19:28,760 Speaker 1: navigate the ordering system? I asked on script Jay Diaz. 343 00:19:28,920 --> 00:19:31,200 Speaker 1: The woman asked she was going to be good cop. 344 00:19:31,200 --> 00:19:33,919 Speaker 1: I could hear it in her voice. I scoured the 345 00:19:33,920 --> 00:19:36,160 Speaker 1: proverbial hard drive of my mind for everything I'd read 346 00:19:36,160 --> 00:19:40,160 Speaker 1: about interacting with federal agents. Can I help you navigate 347 00:19:40,200 --> 00:19:41,320 Speaker 1: the ordering system? 348 00:19:41,440 --> 00:19:41,919 Speaker 2: I asked. 349 00:19:42,400 --> 00:19:45,840 Speaker 1: That's not lying, and it's not admission. We'd like to 350 00:19:45,840 --> 00:19:48,280 Speaker 1: ask you a few questions, Miss Diaz. That was the 351 00:19:48,359 --> 00:19:51,879 Speaker 1: man bad cop, his voice full of rocks and threat 352 00:19:53,160 --> 00:19:55,320 Speaker 1: if you provide me with your information, I said, not 353 00:19:55,440 --> 00:19:58,120 Speaker 1: doing a particularly good job of making eye contact. I'll 354 00:19:58,160 --> 00:20:01,639 Speaker 1: have my lawyer contact you. That's also off a script, 355 00:20:01,720 --> 00:20:04,919 Speaker 1: a different script. I was scared. I wanted to just 356 00:20:04,960 --> 00:20:09,000 Speaker 1: play along, play dumb, start denying things. But everything I'd read, 357 00:20:09,000 --> 00:20:13,119 Speaker 1: both anecdotes and data said STFU was always the safer 358 00:20:13,119 --> 00:20:17,280 Speaker 1: bet for the innocent and guilty alike. We're investigating the 359 00:20:17,320 --> 00:20:21,040 Speaker 1: drone related death of Jonathan Sandalson. Bad Cops said, do 360 00:20:21,119 --> 00:20:23,919 Speaker 1: you know anything about that? If you provide me with 361 00:20:23,960 --> 00:20:28,000 Speaker 1: your information, I'll have my lawyer contact you. The thing is, 362 00:20:28,119 --> 00:20:30,239 Speaker 1: we're trying down a hacker with the name of Hey 363 00:20:30,280 --> 00:20:33,120 Speaker 1: Hey Cameron. We think he made use of this network 364 00:20:33,240 --> 00:20:37,520 Speaker 1: to construct another alias. I don't have a good poker face, 365 00:20:37,840 --> 00:20:40,640 Speaker 1: and I don't play cards. I don't play liars when 366 00:20:40,640 --> 00:20:43,240 Speaker 1: I play RPGs because I suck at it. But I 367 00:20:43,320 --> 00:20:47,000 Speaker 1: kept myself from gasping, and for that I deserve an oscar. 368 00:20:48,520 --> 00:20:50,960 Speaker 1: It's possible that this location's network was just a stop 369 00:20:51,000 --> 00:20:54,480 Speaker 1: along the way, but analysis indicates it likely originated here. 370 00:20:54,920 --> 00:20:56,640 Speaker 1: If you have any information that might be of use 371 00:20:56,680 --> 00:20:59,080 Speaker 1: to us, I recommend you tell us sooner than later. 372 00:20:59,440 --> 00:21:03,320 Speaker 1: Miss Diaz. Yes, he slid a business card across the counter, 373 00:21:03,760 --> 00:21:11,119 Speaker 1: Dale Carter FBI. With that, they left Bach And this 374 00:21:11,320 --> 00:21:13,680 Speaker 1: is a good point to tell you about our perennial 375 00:21:13,720 --> 00:21:17,119 Speaker 1: sponsor of the show. Don't talk to cops. 376 00:21:17,320 --> 00:21:20,639 Speaker 2: Amen, something I've learned in the past and learned doubly 377 00:21:20,720 --> 00:21:21,000 Speaker 2: from you. 378 00:21:21,600 --> 00:21:31,320 Speaker 1: Yeah. Thanks, here's those ads, Hi, Margaret Kiljoy here, boy, 379 00:21:31,480 --> 00:21:34,159 Speaker 1: the world sure is a mess right now? Huh. Seems 380 00:21:34,200 --> 00:21:35,919 Speaker 1: like every day there are more and more reasons to 381 00:21:35,920 --> 00:21:38,800 Speaker 1: get out into the streets and protest. That's why when 382 00:21:38,840 --> 00:21:42,199 Speaker 1: I get arrested, there's only one strategy. I trust. I 383 00:21:42,280 --> 00:21:45,080 Speaker 1: shut the fuck up. I say, I would like to 384 00:21:45,119 --> 00:21:47,199 Speaker 1: remain silent, I would like to talk to my lawyer, 385 00:21:47,520 --> 00:21:49,840 Speaker 1: and then I shut the fuck up. In the United 386 00:21:49,880 --> 00:21:53,240 Speaker 1: States of America, it's constitutionally protected and recommended by the 387 00:21:53,320 --> 00:21:54,280 Speaker 1: National Lawyers Guild. 388 00:21:54,760 --> 00:21:59,760 Speaker 2: That's s h u t t f u c k up. 389 00:22:00,520 --> 00:22:06,280 Speaker 1: Once again, that's sahu t thche f uc k up. 390 00:22:07,040 --> 00:22:09,600 Speaker 1: Because you can't talk yourself out of custody, but you 391 00:22:09,640 --> 00:22:11,480 Speaker 1: can talk yourself into a conviction. 392 00:22:11,920 --> 00:22:14,720 Speaker 3: Providing identification to law enforcement required in some states and 393 00:22:14,720 --> 00:22:18,000 Speaker 3: situations giving them an address expedient in most circumstances. Never 394 00:22:18,040 --> 00:22:20,440 Speaker 3: discuss the events leading to arrest with anyone except your lawyer, doctor, 395 00:22:20,520 --> 00:22:23,200 Speaker 3: or therapist. Posting pictures of protests and actions on social 396 00:22:23,240 --> 00:22:25,880 Speaker 3: media may lead to complications. If you have already talked 397 00:22:25,880 --> 00:22:28,440 Speaker 3: to cops or experienced confusion about talking to cops, call 398 00:22:28,480 --> 00:22:30,680 Speaker 3: your attorney immediately, as these may be signs of more 399 00:22:30,680 --> 00:22:33,240 Speaker 3: serious legal problems. The concept of not talking to cops 400 00:22:33,240 --> 00:22:34,879 Speaker 3: does not provide legal advice, and the foregoing statements are 401 00:22:34,920 --> 00:22:37,480 Speaker 3: for informational purposes only. If you have specific legal questions, 402 00:22:37,520 --> 00:22:41,200 Speaker 3: consult an attorney. 403 00:22:47,560 --> 00:22:52,480 Speaker 1: And we're back when the Feds have a case, Marcel said, 404 00:22:52,720 --> 00:22:55,200 Speaker 1: they now show up in uniform and shit. I was 405 00:22:55,240 --> 00:22:57,000 Speaker 1: off shift and we sat in the park down by 406 00:22:57,000 --> 00:22:59,480 Speaker 1: the South Congress Bridge. The bats would be out in 407 00:22:59,520 --> 00:23:02,040 Speaker 1: a couple of hours, but it wasn't peak bat season, 408 00:23:02,160 --> 00:23:05,680 Speaker 1: so the place wasn't mobbed with bat tourists. They don't 409 00:23:05,680 --> 00:23:07,880 Speaker 1: even do it to get information out of people. They 410 00:23:07,880 --> 00:23:10,200 Speaker 1: do it to stir people up, to scare people into 411 00:23:10,240 --> 00:23:13,439 Speaker 1: coming forward or making some dumb move they don't need 412 00:23:13,480 --> 00:23:15,520 Speaker 1: to scare confessions out of anyone. They've got a solid 413 00:23:15,560 --> 00:23:21,080 Speaker 1: case against He was nervous, I realized, scared even Yeah, 414 00:23:21,160 --> 00:23:23,560 Speaker 1: he was still leaning, even while sitting down. He was 415 00:23:23,600 --> 00:23:28,439 Speaker 1: somehow leaning, but there was a tremor in his voice. Yeah, sure, 416 00:23:28,600 --> 00:23:30,800 Speaker 1: I said, I mean he was right. I'd read about 417 00:23:30,840 --> 00:23:36,320 Speaker 1: this shit. They're good at it scaring people. Hey, we're friends, right, sure, 418 00:23:36,400 --> 00:23:38,439 Speaker 1: I said. It was hard to concentrate on anything but 419 00:23:38,480 --> 00:23:42,120 Speaker 1: fear to be honest. You never do anything to hurt me, right, 420 00:23:42,440 --> 00:23:47,040 Speaker 1: Marcel asked, Of course not. Then Marcel took a deep 421 00:23:47,040 --> 00:23:49,520 Speaker 1: breath in. Maybe it'd be better if you found somewhere 422 00:23:49,560 --> 00:23:53,520 Speaker 1: else to stay what. I'd been staying with Marcel in 423 00:23:53,520 --> 00:23:55,640 Speaker 1: his roommates for a couple months, and it was generally 424 00:23:55,680 --> 00:23:57,639 Speaker 1: agreed that as soon as a room opened up, I 425 00:23:57,640 --> 00:24:01,600 Speaker 1: could move in. I paid my share of utilities earlier. 426 00:24:01,680 --> 00:24:03,920 Speaker 1: You wanted to help. Now you're fucking kicking me out. 427 00:24:04,880 --> 00:24:07,560 Speaker 1: My boyfriend's a coke dealer, for Christ's sake. We can't 428 00:24:07,640 --> 00:24:11,680 Speaker 1: risk a police raid. I'll go to prison and a 429 00:24:11,840 --> 00:24:14,720 Speaker 1: box killer. I don't know. I was making light of it, 430 00:24:14,880 --> 00:24:16,520 Speaker 1: but I can't get that image out of my head. 431 00:24:17,840 --> 00:24:19,879 Speaker 1: Whatever happened to them not having a case? I asked. 432 00:24:20,200 --> 00:24:22,320 Speaker 1: I tried to keep my voice level because frankly, this 433 00:24:22,440 --> 00:24:24,040 Speaker 1: was not a good conversation for us to be having 434 00:24:24,080 --> 00:24:29,080 Speaker 1: in public. Them not having enough information, that's why they'd raid, 435 00:24:29,200 --> 00:24:33,200 Speaker 1: he said. Fuck having emotions, Fuck having friends, Fuck everything. 436 00:24:34,119 --> 00:24:37,320 Speaker 1: I'll leave, I said, but it's too late. You know that, right, 437 00:24:37,440 --> 00:24:39,280 Speaker 1: You need to get everything sketchy out of the house. 438 00:24:40,400 --> 00:24:44,520 Speaker 1: I stood up, grabbed my backpack. Hey Jay, Marcel said. 439 00:24:44,560 --> 00:24:47,720 Speaker 1: He grabbed my leg. If you need anything, I don't know, 440 00:24:47,960 --> 00:24:48,760 Speaker 1: money or something. 441 00:24:49,720 --> 00:24:50,119 Speaker 2: Fuck you. 442 00:24:50,920 --> 00:24:53,000 Speaker 1: I pulled my leg free and started out of the park. 443 00:24:53,200 --> 00:24:57,439 Speaker 1: Eat a bag of rocks. You fucking cowered. Did you 444 00:24:57,480 --> 00:24:59,800 Speaker 1: know that you can get fired by text? It turns 445 00:24:59,800 --> 00:25:02,199 Speaker 1: out you can get fired by text. There was no 446 00:25:02,280 --> 00:25:05,240 Speaker 1: proof of my misuse of the network, but hey, no union, 447 00:25:06,119 --> 00:25:11,240 Speaker 1: I hear there's plenty of jobs in jail. There must 448 00:25:11,240 --> 00:25:12,879 Speaker 1: have been a snitch net on top of the network 449 00:25:12,880 --> 00:25:15,960 Speaker 1: at work. It's not standard Taco Dick's protocol, and I'd 450 00:25:16,000 --> 00:25:18,280 Speaker 1: double and triple checked when I first started working there. 451 00:25:18,680 --> 00:25:21,200 Speaker 1: The regional manager must have installed it after I'd convinced 452 00:25:21,240 --> 00:25:22,960 Speaker 1: the gualk box to leave work and go join the 453 00:25:22,960 --> 00:25:27,000 Speaker 1: Mayday Parade downtown and dispense free Guacamolean chips for demonstrators. 454 00:25:27,720 --> 00:25:30,320 Speaker 1: I can't believe I hadn't checked again before making the alias. 455 00:25:31,040 --> 00:25:34,760 Speaker 1: That's amateur shit. That's how they must have found me. 456 00:25:35,440 --> 00:25:38,239 Speaker 1: Sure there was some plausible deniability. It could have been 457 00:25:38,240 --> 00:25:41,080 Speaker 1: a customer, but I'd bet what little I owned that 458 00:25:41,119 --> 00:25:44,040 Speaker 1: they were on to me. The whole he made use 459 00:25:44,080 --> 00:25:46,440 Speaker 1: of the network thing was probably a faint designed to 460 00:25:46,520 --> 00:25:49,000 Speaker 1: draw out a response, maybe to trick me into giving 461 00:25:49,040 --> 00:25:53,000 Speaker 1: a little self assured smile. Killing a dude with a 462 00:25:53,040 --> 00:25:56,840 Speaker 1: box is a life in prison thing, no parole, probably 463 00:25:56,840 --> 00:26:00,760 Speaker 1: a communications management unit, to be honest, Even just my 464 00:26:00,800 --> 00:26:03,880 Speaker 1: box trolling campaign was a life in prison thing. I'd 465 00:26:03,960 --> 00:26:07,080 Speaker 1: driven one CEO into early retirement and another to move 466 00:26:07,119 --> 00:26:09,720 Speaker 1: to the other side of the globe, and Herculean Solutions 467 00:26:09,720 --> 00:26:11,679 Speaker 1: Group had roughly a third of the gross value it 468 00:26:11,720 --> 00:26:14,760 Speaker 1: did three years ago. By my projections, they would have 469 00:26:14,800 --> 00:26:18,240 Speaker 1: gone under if I'd gotten mister Sanderson to walk away. 470 00:26:18,280 --> 00:26:21,399 Speaker 1: Destroying a major company through a campaign of harassment is 471 00:26:21,480 --> 00:26:26,720 Speaker 1: definitely a life in prison thing. It's just politically motivated, 472 00:26:26,720 --> 00:26:30,320 Speaker 1: premeditated murder. That's a for real terrorism thing. That's a 473 00:26:30,359 --> 00:26:33,200 Speaker 1: whole different class of bad. That's a no matter how 474 00:26:33,240 --> 00:26:35,199 Speaker 1: deep you go underground, they'll follow you to the ends 475 00:26:35,240 --> 00:26:39,000 Speaker 1: of the earth thing. If they wanted to find me, though, 476 00:26:39,520 --> 00:26:42,439 Speaker 1: I guess that would be easy. I pushed the dumpster 477 00:26:42,560 --> 00:26:45,240 Speaker 1: up against the shitty cement facade, hopped up, and pulled 478 00:26:45,240 --> 00:26:48,440 Speaker 1: myself onto the roof of Taco Dix. I had slept 479 00:26:48,480 --> 00:26:50,199 Speaker 1: there before I met Marcel and the rest of his 480 00:26:50,320 --> 00:26:55,919 Speaker 1: chicken shit friends. I'd sleep there again. Whenever I closed 481 00:26:55,960 --> 00:26:59,119 Speaker 1: my eyes, I saw Sanderson drive off that cliff. I 482 00:26:59,119 --> 00:27:01,760 Speaker 1: saw the blood in the pool and the screaming family. 483 00:27:02,440 --> 00:27:06,040 Speaker 1: I saw it from drone operator's point of view. I'd 484 00:27:06,040 --> 00:27:08,320 Speaker 1: be willing to bet my dreams would be worse if 485 00:27:08,320 --> 00:27:11,679 Speaker 1: I'd had time to sleep and to dream. Plenty of 486 00:27:11,720 --> 00:27:14,440 Speaker 1: time to sleep when I'm dead. Floating face up in 487 00:27:14,480 --> 00:27:18,480 Speaker 1: the water, A handful of boxes buzzed overhead. Some of 488 00:27:18,480 --> 00:27:20,880 Speaker 1: them had TSA running lights, which likely meant they were 489 00:27:20,920 --> 00:27:24,320 Speaker 1: registered work boxes. Some of them didn't. Some of them 490 00:27:24,359 --> 00:27:26,520 Speaker 1: had the amateur lights you're allowed to use under fifty 491 00:27:26,520 --> 00:27:28,800 Speaker 1: feet altitude and in line of sight with the user. 492 00:27:29,800 --> 00:27:32,760 Speaker 1: One of them ran dark when it went over I 493 00:27:32,800 --> 00:27:36,760 Speaker 1: got chills. I'd always assumed that was a metaphor, but 494 00:27:36,800 --> 00:27:40,119 Speaker 1: I shook down my spine. It was probably just kids. 495 00:27:40,560 --> 00:27:42,760 Speaker 1: How many boxes had I run dark in middle school? 496 00:27:43,040 --> 00:27:45,720 Speaker 1: How many boxes did I still run dark? It would 497 00:27:45,760 --> 00:27:50,159 Speaker 1: be fine, I'd be fine living in fear as garbage. 498 00:27:50,200 --> 00:27:51,920 Speaker 1: I got my tablet out and set down to work. 499 00:27:52,240 --> 00:27:54,359 Speaker 1: Didn't use the Taco Dick's Wi Fi. I tethered to 500 00:27:54,359 --> 00:27:56,359 Speaker 1: one of the burner cards. I kept around for my phone. 501 00:27:57,000 --> 00:27:59,359 Speaker 1: Someone did this to me. It was time he and 502 00:27:59,400 --> 00:28:06,199 Speaker 1: I talked. New Girl zero one. Damn you fucked me up? 503 00:28:06,240 --> 00:28:11,320 Speaker 1: Something real, Neseramus Mill. I don't know what you're talking about. 504 00:28:11,920 --> 00:28:15,440 Speaker 1: New Girl zero one. Nicholas Sanchez, forty four years old, 505 00:28:15,520 --> 00:28:19,240 Speaker 1: San Diego, resident of nineteen years, law abiding, tax pain productive, 506 00:28:19,320 --> 00:28:23,119 Speaker 1: undocumented member of society, Low level office job volunteers at 507 00:28:23,160 --> 00:28:26,159 Speaker 1: a community center called Noester Lugar, teaching English as a 508 00:28:26,200 --> 00:28:31,480 Speaker 1: second language. Also pilot a handmaid not printed octocopter with 509 00:28:31,560 --> 00:28:34,439 Speaker 1: an H and K G thirty six ce mounted to 510 00:28:34,480 --> 00:28:38,080 Speaker 1: the bottom. Newgirl zero one? That enough? Or do you 511 00:28:38,080 --> 00:28:40,480 Speaker 1: want me to send you a screencap of your driver's license? 512 00:28:41,640 --> 00:28:45,880 Speaker 1: Neseramus Mill? How did you find me? New Girl zero one? 513 00:28:46,120 --> 00:28:51,000 Speaker 1: Don't use VPNs with non vulnerabilities. Neaseramus Mill, what do 514 00:28:51,080 --> 00:28:54,959 Speaker 1: you want? New Girl zero one? Fuck, that's a hard question. 515 00:28:55,440 --> 00:28:57,080 Speaker 1: The Feds are up in my shit. They think I 516 00:28:57,160 --> 00:28:58,920 Speaker 1: did it, and there's not an easy way to prove 517 00:28:58,960 --> 00:29:03,880 Speaker 1: I didn't, Neseramus Mill. Besides ratting me out, New Girl 518 00:29:03,960 --> 00:29:06,959 Speaker 1: zero one, I'm not fucking ratting anyone out. I just 519 00:29:08,240 --> 00:29:13,840 Speaker 1: I just need help, your Helpnaseramus Mill, So you're blackmailing me, 520 00:29:14,480 --> 00:29:17,360 Speaker 1: New Girl zero one. God damn it, I'm not ratting 521 00:29:17,400 --> 00:29:20,160 Speaker 1: you out. I'm not blackmailing you. I'm not even fucking 522 00:29:20,240 --> 00:29:23,040 Speaker 1: mad at you. I'm glad Sandalson is dead, which I 523 00:29:23,040 --> 00:29:26,280 Speaker 1: thought i'd feel complicated about, but I don't. He was 524 00:29:26,320 --> 00:29:28,880 Speaker 1: a monster and now he's dead and that's good, and 525 00:29:28,920 --> 00:29:32,920 Speaker 1: I'm not sad. I'm just fucking scared. I'm scared of 526 00:29:32,920 --> 00:29:37,360 Speaker 1: the Feds, and frankly, i'm kind of scared of Younaseramus Mill. 527 00:29:38,120 --> 00:29:41,520 Speaker 1: You're the one tracking him, right, New Girl zero one. Yeah, 528 00:29:41,560 --> 00:29:46,720 Speaker 1: it's called box trolling, Neseramus Mill. Does it work, New 529 00:29:46,760 --> 00:29:50,400 Speaker 1: Girl zero one? Honestly it works better than killing people, 530 00:29:50,640 --> 00:29:53,360 Speaker 1: because you kill someone, you make a martyr, break them down, 531 00:29:53,400 --> 00:29:55,959 Speaker 1: and everyone just pities them. Or some shit, and everything 532 00:29:55,960 --> 00:29:58,880 Speaker 1: they believe in loses credibility and power. I don't know 533 00:29:58,960 --> 00:30:04,240 Speaker 1: that's the theory anyway. Naseramus Mill, I had to kill him. 534 00:30:04,720 --> 00:30:10,200 Speaker 1: New Girl zero one, Whynaseramus Mill. He deported my son 535 00:30:10,680 --> 00:30:12,480 Speaker 1: got a judge in his pocket who sends people his 536 00:30:12,520 --> 00:30:15,480 Speaker 1: way for minor infractions, and any conviction at all was 537 00:30:15,600 --> 00:30:18,600 Speaker 1: enough to get my kid deported. I told Sandalson. I 538 00:30:18,680 --> 00:30:21,320 Speaker 1: left the message with the secretary that if my kid 539 00:30:21,360 --> 00:30:23,640 Speaker 1: died on his way back home to the States, I 540 00:30:23,680 --> 00:30:26,920 Speaker 1: would murder him. Border militia shot my son down in 541 00:30:26,920 --> 00:30:29,600 Speaker 1: the desert, claimed he'd been working for the narcos, and 542 00:30:29,640 --> 00:30:33,880 Speaker 1: they got away with it. New Girl zero one, fuck 543 00:30:33,960 --> 00:30:36,040 Speaker 1: the guy in the pool that was the judge. I 544 00:30:36,080 --> 00:30:41,240 Speaker 1: bet why the Sunday barbecue Maaseramus Mill dead is dead. 545 00:30:41,440 --> 00:30:45,280 Speaker 1: His family will mourn him either way, New Girl zero one. 546 00:30:45,840 --> 00:30:48,000 Speaker 1: This is why you don't fucking kill people. You break 547 00:30:48,040 --> 00:30:51,160 Speaker 1: them or drive them into hiding, render them ineffective. It's 548 00:30:51,160 --> 00:30:53,520 Speaker 1: not just an ethics thing, it's an efficacy thing. That 549 00:30:53,600 --> 00:30:55,120 Speaker 1: dude's kids are going to fucking go to the end 550 00:30:55,160 --> 00:30:58,840 Speaker 1: of the earth to haunt you, well me maybe, and 551 00:30:59,000 --> 00:31:01,640 Speaker 1: or dedicate their lives to him, making other immigrants lives miserable. 552 00:31:01,760 --> 00:31:06,640 Speaker 1: Cycle continues, Naseramus Mill. I cannot control his kids nor 553 00:31:06,680 --> 00:31:10,400 Speaker 1: their reactions. I control only me. I knew Sandalson wouldn't 554 00:31:10,400 --> 00:31:13,120 Speaker 1: believe me if my threat even reached his ears. But 555 00:31:13,160 --> 00:31:14,960 Speaker 1: I said what I said, and I'm a man of 556 00:31:15,000 --> 00:31:20,880 Speaker 1: my word. New Girl zero one, all right, Naseramus Mill. 557 00:31:22,000 --> 00:31:24,560 Speaker 1: The border militia camp was harder. You can't get enough 558 00:31:24,560 --> 00:31:27,040 Speaker 1: explosive onto a quad copter. I had to rig one 559 00:31:27,040 --> 00:31:28,840 Speaker 1: of their own trucks to blow. How to do the 560 00:31:28,840 --> 00:31:32,200 Speaker 1: work in person? Sanderson was the hardest, though, couldn't get 561 00:31:32,280 --> 00:31:34,440 Speaker 1: near him with a drone. I guess thanks to you, 562 00:31:35,600 --> 00:31:38,440 Speaker 1: New Girl zero one. Why are you telling me this? 563 00:31:39,040 --> 00:31:43,160 Speaker 1: Weren't you worried I would blackmail you, Maseramus Mil. At 564 00:31:43,160 --> 00:31:45,440 Speaker 1: this point it might be important to be understood than 565 00:31:45,480 --> 00:31:49,240 Speaker 1: to live. New Girl zero one. What was his name, 566 00:31:49,800 --> 00:31:53,880 Speaker 1: Messermus Mill? What New Girl zero one? Your kid? What 567 00:31:54,000 --> 00:31:59,040 Speaker 1: was his name? Master Ramus Mill? Daniel, New Girl zero one? 568 00:31:59,440 --> 00:32:04,200 Speaker 1: Thats fucking rough, nas Ramus Mill fedser after you? New 569 00:32:04,240 --> 00:32:08,000 Speaker 1: Girls zero one? Yeah, they think I did it, Neseramus Mill. 570 00:32:08,640 --> 00:32:13,840 Speaker 1: I'll turn myself in New girlszrera one. What no why 571 00:32:13,960 --> 00:32:16,040 Speaker 1: I I'll be real. I was sort of hoping you'd 572 00:32:16,040 --> 00:32:18,080 Speaker 1: say that when I talk to you, but but now, hey, 573 00:32:18,320 --> 00:32:22,320 Speaker 1: don't do that, Naseramus Mill. It's fine if I go down. 574 00:32:22,360 --> 00:32:25,520 Speaker 1: No one expects to survive a killing spray New Girls 575 00:32:25,560 --> 00:32:29,600 Speaker 1: zero one. See, now that's a better idea, Neseramus Mill. 576 00:32:29,920 --> 00:32:33,680 Speaker 1: It's better if I die New Girls zero one. No, no, 577 00:32:33,880 --> 00:32:36,400 Speaker 1: just that people think you're dead, as long as we 578 00:32:36,400 --> 00:32:40,160 Speaker 1: can do it without killing anyone else, Maseramus Mill. You 579 00:32:40,200 --> 00:32:43,800 Speaker 1: know how to do that New Girls here one No, 580 00:32:44,360 --> 00:32:48,120 Speaker 1: but I know someone who does, and that's where we're 581 00:32:48,160 --> 00:32:49,080 Speaker 1: gonna leave it today. 582 00:32:51,280 --> 00:32:55,480 Speaker 2: WHOA talk about chills down my spine when you get 583 00:32:55,480 --> 00:33:02,440 Speaker 2: to what was his name? Daniel? Yeah, wow, that was gripping. 584 00:33:02,640 --> 00:33:03,000 Speaker 1: Thanks. 585 00:33:04,000 --> 00:33:06,520 Speaker 2: I really love your stories, Margaret. I think you know 586 00:33:06,640 --> 00:33:09,920 Speaker 2: you are such a good writer. And also you write 587 00:33:09,920 --> 00:33:14,240 Speaker 2: in this way that feels super approachable and real and 588 00:33:14,360 --> 00:33:17,160 Speaker 2: just like immediately understandable, in a way that I feel 589 00:33:17,200 --> 00:33:22,360 Speaker 2: like sci fi really requires in my experience. Yeah, sci 590 00:33:22,400 --> 00:33:24,800 Speaker 2: fi often like requires a sci fi fan who's like 591 00:33:24,960 --> 00:33:27,440 Speaker 2: ready to grabble on to something, who's ready to like 592 00:33:28,080 --> 00:33:32,480 Speaker 2: take on a thousand terms and lore a thousand terms exactly. 593 00:33:32,680 --> 00:33:39,640 Speaker 2: But everything was so just like natural and easily understandable 594 00:33:39,680 --> 00:33:44,400 Speaker 2: and translatable and real. It was really really really great storytelling. 595 00:33:44,440 --> 00:33:47,640 Speaker 1: Thank you. I really appreciate that. Course, I try very 596 00:33:47,680 --> 00:33:50,200 Speaker 1: hard specifically with that issue. Actually when I write where 597 00:33:50,200 --> 00:33:53,960 Speaker 1: I'm like, okay, I need a term for what they're 598 00:33:53,960 --> 00:33:57,040 Speaker 1: doing total, you know, but like I'm going to do 599 00:33:57,040 --> 00:33:58,560 Speaker 1: it as legibly as I can. 600 00:34:00,000 --> 00:34:01,640 Speaker 2: I loved it. There was a bunch of terms that 601 00:34:01,680 --> 00:34:03,920 Speaker 2: I wrote down and I just thought were perfect. First 602 00:34:03,960 --> 00:34:06,840 Speaker 2: of all, dumb dumb car was great. It's just like, 603 00:34:06,960 --> 00:34:08,920 Speaker 2: as you know, especially now when it's like, oh, we 604 00:34:08,920 --> 00:34:10,560 Speaker 2: can't get used cars because we don't have enough micro 605 00:34:10,560 --> 00:34:12,040 Speaker 2: trips for cars, and it's like, well, better to have 606 00:34:12,040 --> 00:34:15,440 Speaker 2: a dumb dumb car. I guess, yeah, totally personal emp 607 00:34:15,680 --> 00:34:17,520 Speaker 2: I loved. I was like, of course that is for 608 00:34:17,719 --> 00:34:21,680 Speaker 2: sure right on the horizon. Yeah, Box for Drone is great. 609 00:34:22,000 --> 00:34:25,080 Speaker 2: I love that. Especially the comparison to worker drones was great. 610 00:34:26,000 --> 00:34:26,320 Speaker 1: Thanks. 611 00:34:27,120 --> 00:34:30,279 Speaker 2: Also, I was getting a lot of the struggle that 612 00:34:30,760 --> 00:34:33,280 Speaker 2: our main character is going through, or rather what they're 613 00:34:33,400 --> 00:34:35,399 Speaker 2: you know, talking about in their goal of taking down 614 00:34:35,400 --> 00:34:37,640 Speaker 2: sandalson gave me a lot of like cop city vibes 615 00:34:37,719 --> 00:34:40,239 Speaker 2: right now and the whole box trolling gave me kind 616 00:34:40,239 --> 00:34:43,520 Speaker 2: of real mud reaching vibes. It's like the idea of, 617 00:34:43,560 --> 00:34:47,000 Speaker 2: you know, just wearing someone down until they're ineffective. I 618 00:34:47,040 --> 00:34:48,880 Speaker 2: was like, that is the move. I think that is 619 00:34:49,239 --> 00:34:51,600 Speaker 2: super effective and very well illustrated by you. 620 00:34:51,840 --> 00:34:53,520 Speaker 1: Thank you. It's funny. I hadn't even thought of that, 621 00:34:53,560 --> 00:34:55,799 Speaker 1: but I mean that's the strategy that like, you know, 622 00:34:55,840 --> 00:34:57,600 Speaker 1: the forest offense stuff that I came up in is 623 00:34:57,640 --> 00:35:00,560 Speaker 1: like you just you just make it not worth their time. 624 00:35:00,880 --> 00:35:02,360 Speaker 1: You know, you're like, oh, you want to log this 625 00:35:02,400 --> 00:35:04,200 Speaker 1: old growth for us? That's going to be such a 626 00:35:04,200 --> 00:35:05,319 Speaker 1: pain in the ass, isn't it. 627 00:35:05,880 --> 00:35:07,239 Speaker 2: That's going to be such a pain. 628 00:35:07,520 --> 00:35:10,279 Speaker 1: We used to go to timber sales auctions where they 629 00:35:10,280 --> 00:35:12,279 Speaker 1: would sell off public lands for cutting, and if it 630 00:35:12,320 --> 00:35:14,520 Speaker 1: was an old growth sale, we would stand outside and 631 00:35:14,560 --> 00:35:16,440 Speaker 1: if the name of the sale was like solo, let's 632 00:35:16,440 --> 00:35:19,080 Speaker 1: say like you buy solo, you buy us? Is the chant, 633 00:35:19,560 --> 00:35:22,880 Speaker 1: and it's just like, look, is it worth it? Like 634 00:35:23,320 --> 00:35:25,680 Speaker 1: we're gonna make your life such a pain in the button. 635 00:35:26,560 --> 00:35:28,759 Speaker 2: Yeah, we're gonna make it miserable. All right. 636 00:35:28,800 --> 00:35:31,680 Speaker 1: Well, if people want to hear part two, they're going 637 00:35:31,719 --> 00:35:35,480 Speaker 1: to have to wait until next Sunday, unless it's the future, 638 00:35:35,920 --> 00:35:40,880 Speaker 1: in which case you can just press next or whatever button. 639 00:35:41,800 --> 00:35:43,440 Speaker 1: I used to know about how computers work back when 640 00:35:43,440 --> 00:35:44,920 Speaker 1: I wrote this, I'm not sure I do anymore. 641 00:35:46,280 --> 00:35:48,799 Speaker 2: Who knows how they're work anymore? Who knows they're double 642 00:35:48,840 --> 00:35:51,680 Speaker 2: tapping on their AirPod to skip to the next whatever. 643 00:35:53,680 --> 00:35:54,640 Speaker 1: See y'all next week. 644 00:35:56,640 --> 00:35:59,120 Speaker 2: It could Happen here as a production of pool Zone Media. 645 00:35:59,239 --> 00:36:01,920 Speaker 2: For more podcasts from cool Zone Media, visit our website 646 00:36:01,920 --> 00:36:05,040 Speaker 2: coolzonemedia dot com, or check us out on the iHeartRadio app, 647 00:36:05,080 --> 00:36:08,440 Speaker 2: Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to podcasts. You can 648 00:36:08,440 --> 00:36:11,160 Speaker 2: find sources for It could Happen Here, Updated monthly at 649 00:36:11,160 --> 00:36:14,440 Speaker 2: coolzonemedia dot com slash sources. Thanks for listening.