1 00:00:01,240 --> 00:00:14,440 Speaker 1: The volume. This is Prime Cuts, the best of the 2 00:00:14,440 --> 00:00:17,680 Speaker 1: Colin Coward Podcast. This week we have Marcus Thompson of 3 00:00:17,720 --> 00:00:20,560 Speaker 1: The Athletic. He's great talking about why Ben simmons trade 4 00:00:20,560 --> 00:00:24,520 Speaker 1: to the Warriors makes sense for both teams. Nick Wright 5 00:00:24,720 --> 00:00:26,720 Speaker 1: his take on why Zion could end up in New 6 00:00:26,800 --> 00:00:30,960 Speaker 1: York sooner rather than later, even if he does sign 7 00:00:31,000 --> 00:00:35,040 Speaker 1: an extension with the Pelicans. Tom Verducci SI Fox Sports 8 00:00:35,080 --> 00:00:39,080 Speaker 1: on baseball's sticky Stuff controversy and as the Mavericks are 9 00:00:39,120 --> 00:00:43,480 Speaker 1: making big organizational changes. We revisit my interview with Mark 10 00:00:43,640 --> 00:00:45,840 Speaker 1: Cuban from a few months ago, where he talks about 11 00:00:46,040 --> 00:00:48,440 Speaker 1: what he learned from Dirk and the mistakes he won't 12 00:00:48,520 --> 00:00:52,320 Speaker 1: make with Luca. Interesting stuff in hindsight. But first my 13 00:00:52,520 --> 00:00:56,200 Speaker 1: top takes of the week. You know, people are bagging 14 00:00:56,240 --> 00:00:59,600 Speaker 1: on Ben Simmons, justifiably so, because he can't shoot. That's 15 00:00:59,640 --> 00:01:02,800 Speaker 1: sort of a problem. It is called basketball, not basketball. 16 00:01:02,800 --> 00:01:04,840 Speaker 1: You gotta put it in the hoop. It doesn't mean though, 17 00:01:04,840 --> 00:01:07,400 Speaker 1: Ben Simmons can't still be a force in this league. Seriously, 18 00:01:08,080 --> 00:01:10,479 Speaker 1: you know, there's a word out there that if you're 19 00:01:10,800 --> 00:01:12,959 Speaker 1: about my age, you probably never even heard of until 20 00:01:12,959 --> 00:01:15,280 Speaker 1: the nineties or early two thousands. In fact, it wasn't 21 00:01:15,440 --> 00:01:18,680 Speaker 1: used until like the mid eighties. The word was repurpose, 22 00:01:19,200 --> 00:01:21,679 Speaker 1: and basically it means find a new purpose for something 23 00:01:21,720 --> 00:01:25,840 Speaker 1: that's different from its original use. And I like what 24 00:01:25,920 --> 00:01:30,560 Speaker 1: it implies, like nothing is ever useless, just find another use, 25 00:01:30,640 --> 00:01:32,600 Speaker 1: sometimes a better use for it. I mean, in sports, 26 00:01:33,120 --> 00:01:36,720 Speaker 1: Julian Edelman was a quarterback until Belichick made him a 27 00:01:36,760 --> 00:01:40,360 Speaker 1: wide receiver. He repurposed him. Dennis Sackersley remember him, burned 28 00:01:40,360 --> 00:01:43,440 Speaker 1: out done with the Cubs. Manager Tony LaRussa brought him 29 00:01:43,440 --> 00:01:45,880 Speaker 1: to the a's moved him to the bullpen. He's one 30 00:01:45,880 --> 00:01:48,840 Speaker 1: of the greatest examples he was repurposed. I mean, how 31 00:01:48,840 --> 00:01:51,240 Speaker 1: many times have you seen an old card tire as 32 00:01:51,280 --> 00:01:54,280 Speaker 1: a kid's tire swing. A lot of times we blame 33 00:01:54,360 --> 00:01:57,600 Speaker 1: the player for not succeeding, and sometimes it is the 34 00:01:57,640 --> 00:02:00,440 Speaker 1: player's fault. But every player needs a coach or at 35 00:02:00,440 --> 00:02:05,040 Speaker 1: GM and a direction, and for most guys, they come 36 00:02:05,080 --> 00:02:08,600 Speaker 1: in as raw prospects. I mean, Ben Simmons is only 37 00:02:08,600 --> 00:02:11,840 Speaker 1: twenty four, and even that's misleading because he barely played 38 00:02:11,880 --> 00:02:15,000 Speaker 1: any college basketball. I mean, more people have probably seen 39 00:02:15,000 --> 00:02:17,560 Speaker 1: Bigfoot than saw him play for LSU. He missed his 40 00:02:17,639 --> 00:02:20,799 Speaker 1: first entire season with an injury. So the guy's basically 41 00:02:20,840 --> 00:02:24,280 Speaker 1: three or four years into his career. Well, I mean 42 00:02:24,320 --> 00:02:27,359 Speaker 1: Trey Young. Many people thought DeAndre eight and Trey Young 43 00:02:27,400 --> 00:02:30,040 Speaker 1: a year in, we're just not gonna work. So Ben 44 00:02:30,080 --> 00:02:33,200 Speaker 1: Simmons isn't done at all. He needs to be repurposed 45 00:02:33,200 --> 00:02:37,160 Speaker 1: as a point forward or the Golden State Warriors big 46 00:02:37,280 --> 00:02:40,320 Speaker 1: who can run the floor. There's a lot he can do. 47 00:02:40,560 --> 00:02:43,720 Speaker 1: What he can't do is be relied on to hit jumpers. 48 00:02:44,280 --> 00:02:49,040 Speaker 1: But repurpose him do a Dennis Eckersley. Something else on 49 00:02:49,080 --> 00:02:51,320 Speaker 1: my mind. Tom Brady was on a show Uninterrupted with 50 00:02:51,360 --> 00:02:54,960 Speaker 1: Maverick Carter Lebron James. It's the kind of Lebron produced 51 00:02:55,000 --> 00:02:57,600 Speaker 1: show and Brady was one of the guests this week 52 00:02:57,639 --> 00:02:59,799 Speaker 1: and it made news because he took a shot many 53 00:03:00,040 --> 00:03:02,639 Speaker 1: leave it Jimmy Garoppolo. Brady was recounting when he left 54 00:03:02,680 --> 00:03:05,639 Speaker 1: New England one of the teams in the end that 55 00:03:05,960 --> 00:03:08,400 Speaker 1: wasn't interested in him. He didn't say who it was. 56 00:03:08,480 --> 00:03:11,720 Speaker 1: Many perceived it to be the Niners. He said, you know, 57 00:03:11,880 --> 00:03:15,280 Speaker 1: late in the process, one of the teams wasn't interested 58 00:03:15,320 --> 00:03:17,800 Speaker 1: in me, and I thought, you like that, mother effer 59 00:03:18,560 --> 00:03:22,000 Speaker 1: and the perception again is Jimmy Garoppolo. The truth is 60 00:03:22,520 --> 00:03:25,160 Speaker 1: the market was really small for Tom. There was about 61 00:03:25,200 --> 00:03:27,920 Speaker 1: four teams that really wanted him. I was told the 62 00:03:28,000 --> 00:03:30,840 Speaker 1: Chargers really wanted him. I know they did. That has 63 00:03:30,880 --> 00:03:33,960 Speaker 1: been confirmed, and I know Tampa really wanted him and 64 00:03:34,040 --> 00:03:37,640 Speaker 1: the Colts kicked the tires. But let's not do revisionist 65 00:03:37,760 --> 00:03:41,320 Speaker 1: history here. Tampa was the perfect spot for Tom, and 66 00:03:41,440 --> 00:03:44,560 Speaker 1: he really chose that because what they needed was a 67 00:03:44,680 --> 00:03:47,560 Speaker 1: right tackle and probably needed a little more of a 68 00:03:47,640 --> 00:03:51,600 Speaker 1: running game. But Brady wouldn't be nearly successful in a 69 00:03:51,720 --> 00:03:55,000 Speaker 1: lot of these other places when he signed with Tampa. 70 00:03:55,200 --> 00:03:58,680 Speaker 1: What was our first takeaway? God, all that's missing is 71 00:03:58,680 --> 00:04:01,680 Speaker 1: a quarterback. If you put him on Philadelphia right now, 72 00:04:01,960 --> 00:04:04,600 Speaker 1: if you put them on half this league's rosters, Tom 73 00:04:04,640 --> 00:04:08,280 Speaker 1: would not have had this success. Tom's smartest strength. Much 74 00:04:08,320 --> 00:04:11,160 Speaker 1: like Peyton Manning going to Denver, he saw himself as 75 00:04:11,200 --> 00:04:13,960 Speaker 1: a missing piece. I mean, we said when Tom went 76 00:04:14,000 --> 00:04:17,120 Speaker 1: to Tampa, shit, man, look at those wide receivers, look 77 00:04:17,120 --> 00:04:19,720 Speaker 1: at those tight ends. All they need to right tackle. 78 00:04:19,800 --> 00:04:22,240 Speaker 1: We knew their defense was good with Todd Bowles because 79 00:04:22,279 --> 00:04:24,679 Speaker 1: the previous year before Tom got there, if you remember 80 00:04:24,720 --> 00:04:29,000 Speaker 1: post Thanksgiving. The Buccaneers defense right number one in the NFL. 81 00:04:29,160 --> 00:04:33,960 Speaker 1: So the credit goes to Tom Brady scouting the Buccaneers 82 00:04:34,000 --> 00:04:37,480 Speaker 1: before he landed there. But Tom isn't the kind of 83 00:04:37,560 --> 00:04:39,640 Speaker 1: athlete at this point where you put him behind a 84 00:04:39,839 --> 00:04:43,479 Speaker 1: bad old line with average receivers. I mean, you really 85 00:04:43,520 --> 00:04:47,560 Speaker 1: think he's going to change the Titans significantly. No. So 86 00:04:48,440 --> 00:04:52,680 Speaker 1: it's almost like presidents never get credit for the crisis 87 00:04:52,720 --> 00:04:57,280 Speaker 1: they avoid, you know, and there's a lot of little details. 88 00:04:57,360 --> 00:05:02,159 Speaker 1: Presidents make end decisions and they avoid economic disasters. You 89 00:05:02,240 --> 00:05:05,160 Speaker 1: never get credit for the mistakes you avoid. You know. 90 00:05:05,360 --> 00:05:10,400 Speaker 1: Brady gets credit for revitalizing his career, but his greatest 91 00:05:10,480 --> 00:05:13,760 Speaker 1: asset was his knowledge of football and going to the 92 00:05:13,839 --> 00:05:16,919 Speaker 1: right spot for him. You had an old Drew Breese 93 00:05:17,640 --> 00:05:23,520 Speaker 1: rebuilding Carolina up and down, hot and cold Atlanta. Tampa 94 00:05:23,600 --> 00:05:26,479 Speaker 1: had the best offensive talent in the division, and we 95 00:05:26,520 --> 00:05:30,160 Speaker 1: can argue now they had the best defensive talent in 96 00:05:30,200 --> 00:05:33,160 Speaker 1: the division as well. Peyton Manning won a Super Bowl 97 00:05:33,200 --> 00:05:37,400 Speaker 1: in Denver. He went to the place a winnable division, 98 00:05:37,600 --> 00:05:41,480 Speaker 1: Prima Homes. Philip Rivers was aging Raiders were the Raiders, 99 00:05:41,960 --> 00:05:44,640 Speaker 1: and he went to a really good defense and they 100 00:05:44,640 --> 00:05:47,240 Speaker 1: had a nice offensive line. So that's the strength of 101 00:05:47,279 --> 00:05:51,040 Speaker 1: Manning and Brady. The dudes no personnel, and they went 102 00:05:51,080 --> 00:05:53,960 Speaker 1: to spots that could protect them and elevate them as 103 00:05:54,000 --> 00:05:57,960 Speaker 1: they could no longer carry a football team. I just 104 00:05:58,040 --> 00:06:05,800 Speaker 1: finished watching the Sixers debacle against Atlanta. Never has a 105 00:06:05,800 --> 00:06:10,520 Speaker 1: team had this much talent and been so hard to 106 00:06:10,600 --> 00:06:13,720 Speaker 1: watch at the end of a basketball game than the Sixers. 107 00:06:13,839 --> 00:06:17,440 Speaker 1: But you know, I'll say something I said during the 108 00:06:17,480 --> 00:06:23,279 Speaker 1: week on television is that sometimes you need a really 109 00:06:23,400 --> 00:06:26,640 Speaker 1: bad fight to realize it's time to get a divorce. 110 00:06:27,600 --> 00:06:32,920 Speaker 1: And you really needed that ending. And this series for 111 00:06:33,040 --> 00:06:37,560 Speaker 1: the Mbad Simmons relationship to break. It just doesn't work. 112 00:06:37,600 --> 00:06:40,280 Speaker 1: Simmons can't be on the floor, you know, and Bead 113 00:06:40,320 --> 00:06:42,559 Speaker 1: can't stay healthy and is a bit of a turnover mess. 114 00:06:42,600 --> 00:06:44,919 Speaker 1: Sometimes at the end of games in the half court set. 115 00:06:45,360 --> 00:06:47,680 Speaker 1: It doesn't work. But they're so talented that you'll keep 116 00:06:47,720 --> 00:06:51,320 Speaker 1: talking yourself into it. I compare it to a Hollywood relationship. 117 00:06:51,720 --> 00:06:54,680 Speaker 1: Oh they're both beautiful, Oh their careers are on fire. 118 00:06:54,800 --> 00:06:58,839 Speaker 1: How does this marriage not work well? Probably because you 119 00:06:58,920 --> 00:07:02,280 Speaker 1: know that sacrifice or they're not committed to each other. 120 00:07:02,720 --> 00:07:05,159 Speaker 1: And I feel like with Embid and Simmons. It's just 121 00:07:05,400 --> 00:07:08,960 Speaker 1: two ships passing in the night. Neither game works for 122 00:07:09,000 --> 00:07:12,080 Speaker 1: the other. They don't like each other. It's well documented 123 00:07:12,160 --> 00:07:14,560 Speaker 1: during the All Star Game. Both made the All Star Game. 124 00:07:14,600 --> 00:07:17,280 Speaker 1: They wouldn't fly together on a private jet. They don't 125 00:07:17,280 --> 00:07:20,160 Speaker 1: like each other. The games don't fit, the personalities don't fit, 126 00:07:20,400 --> 00:07:24,560 Speaker 1: but they're so gifted that you talk yourself into keeping 127 00:07:24,600 --> 00:07:27,880 Speaker 1: them together for years and years. You needed this, You 128 00:07:27,960 --> 00:07:31,840 Speaker 1: needed to lose to a marginally talented Atlanta team. You 129 00:07:31,920 --> 00:07:35,560 Speaker 1: needed to look ugly at the end of games. It's 130 00:07:35,560 --> 00:07:37,960 Speaker 1: just a basketball team. That's situationally. When you have to 131 00:07:37,960 --> 00:07:40,480 Speaker 1: take Ben Simmons off the floor, you know, Seth Curry 132 00:07:40,880 --> 00:07:44,440 Speaker 1: becomes far more valuable than Ben Simmons at the end 133 00:07:44,480 --> 00:07:47,400 Speaker 1: of games, especially if you're trailing by a few points. 134 00:07:47,680 --> 00:07:50,440 Speaker 1: So I watched the Sixers and I think, hey, we 135 00:07:50,480 --> 00:07:52,160 Speaker 1: had to break this thing up. This was not a 136 00:07:52,240 --> 00:07:55,920 Speaker 1: championship team. Championship talent, but not championship chemistry. And Doc 137 00:07:56,000 --> 00:07:58,280 Speaker 1: Rivers will take a ton of heat for it, because 138 00:07:58,280 --> 00:08:01,520 Speaker 1: whenever a team loses games, the coach takes the hit. 139 00:08:01,720 --> 00:08:04,520 Speaker 1: You know, people killing Quinn Snyder because he didn't go 140 00:08:04,640 --> 00:08:07,480 Speaker 1: small in the series against the Clippers, ever, but the 141 00:08:07,560 --> 00:08:10,320 Speaker 1: reality is his best players Donovan Mitchell, and he was 142 00:08:10,400 --> 00:08:14,680 Speaker 1: planning at about eighty percent. Well, so, Mike Conley's not healthy, 143 00:08:14,800 --> 00:08:17,800 Speaker 1: Donovan Mitchell's hurt. You're not going to beat a Clipper team. 144 00:08:18,040 --> 00:08:22,040 Speaker 1: Even with Kawhi Leonard out, Paul George was virtually unguardable. 145 00:08:22,120 --> 00:08:24,800 Speaker 1: Utah doesn't have the personnel. So we tend to blame 146 00:08:24,840 --> 00:08:28,760 Speaker 1: these coaches, and they're certainly imperfect. But the Philadelphia situation, 147 00:08:28,880 --> 00:08:31,120 Speaker 1: how many coaches are we going to fire before we 148 00:08:31,160 --> 00:08:36,559 Speaker 1: realize Simmons and embiide talented. It's a bad marriage on 149 00:08:36,600 --> 00:08:40,200 Speaker 1: the court. Off the court, it just doesn't work. And 150 00:08:40,280 --> 00:08:43,360 Speaker 1: you needed to lose this series, and the way they 151 00:08:43,440 --> 00:08:48,080 Speaker 1: lost it was perfect ugly. More talent had leads and 152 00:08:48,320 --> 00:08:52,680 Speaker 1: little young Trey Young carries the Hawks to the Eastern 153 00:08:52,679 --> 00:08:56,840 Speaker 1: Conference Finals. All right, let's bring in my friend Marcus Thompson. 154 00:08:56,880 --> 00:08:59,400 Speaker 1: Barry a columnist for The Athletic. He's written books on 155 00:08:59,520 --> 00:09:03,680 Speaker 1: k D and about Steph Curry. Steph Curry Golden was 156 00:09:03,679 --> 00:09:07,440 Speaker 1: the first time that I knew a lot about Marcus Thompson. 157 00:09:07,440 --> 00:09:11,920 Speaker 1: I think he's so connected. He's got a great way 158 00:09:11,960 --> 00:09:16,760 Speaker 1: of seeing the NBA and we'd love to have him 159 00:09:16,760 --> 00:09:19,120 Speaker 1: in the volume. We just can't afford him. Shit, guy 160 00:09:19,240 --> 00:09:21,880 Speaker 1: is expensive, that's all I know. You know what I'm saying. 161 00:09:22,160 --> 00:09:25,080 Speaker 1: It's about time I've been expensive in my life. You 162 00:09:25,080 --> 00:09:27,120 Speaker 1: know how many times I've gold myself out for five 163 00:09:27,200 --> 00:09:32,040 Speaker 1: dollars of the pecking nih laters. You know. So I'm 164 00:09:32,040 --> 00:09:35,840 Speaker 1: watching that Sixers stuff. By the way, as one of 165 00:09:35,840 --> 00:09:38,480 Speaker 1: the guys on the staff said, Kevin Herder has never 166 00:09:38,520 --> 00:09:42,320 Speaker 1: not been underestimated on any NBA floor he's ever entered. 167 00:09:42,760 --> 00:09:46,880 Speaker 1: Kevin Herder and Trey Young, Alice Ben Simmons. I mean, 168 00:09:46,960 --> 00:09:48,920 Speaker 1: let's just let's cut to the chase. I said this 169 00:09:50,200 --> 00:09:52,560 Speaker 1: on the Herd this week. This is how it had 170 00:09:52,600 --> 00:09:55,280 Speaker 1: to end for the Sixers because we keep talking ourselves 171 00:09:55,280 --> 00:09:58,720 Speaker 1: into this, Marcus, because they're so talented and Mbden Simmons 172 00:09:58,840 --> 00:10:00,960 Speaker 1: that we just keep talking oursel off into what's gonna work. 173 00:10:01,040 --> 00:10:02,720 Speaker 1: It had to end this way in my opinion. It 174 00:10:02,800 --> 00:10:05,120 Speaker 1: had to be ugly. They had to lose leads. We 175 00:10:05,200 --> 00:10:07,880 Speaker 1: had to go, oh shit, this just doesn't work. We 176 00:10:08,360 --> 00:10:11,280 Speaker 1: can't keep firing coaches on this stuff. It's like a 177 00:10:11,320 --> 00:10:13,760 Speaker 1: bad breakup, right, Like you need that real fight so 178 00:10:13,880 --> 00:10:16,040 Speaker 1: you could be like, yo, we don't, we don't need 179 00:10:16,080 --> 00:10:19,280 Speaker 1: to be together. I mean, it doesn't get worse than 180 00:10:19,320 --> 00:10:23,839 Speaker 1: losing to Kevin Herder, right, like in on your how 181 00:10:23,880 --> 00:10:26,680 Speaker 1: do you lose three times on your own floor? I don't. 182 00:10:27,320 --> 00:10:31,400 Speaker 1: It's unbelievable that this team wasn't able to at least 183 00:10:31,400 --> 00:10:34,600 Speaker 1: get to the Eastern Conference finals in this year. This year, 184 00:10:34,920 --> 00:10:38,679 Speaker 1: you don't have to face Brooklyn, right you You kind 185 00:10:38,720 --> 00:10:42,120 Speaker 1: of got a cake walk to the finals. It's yes, 186 00:10:42,240 --> 00:10:45,199 Speaker 1: it's over. It's done now, we know it. You did 187 00:10:45,240 --> 00:10:47,280 Speaker 1: it in front of Alan Iverson. That's what really hurts 188 00:10:47,320 --> 00:10:49,679 Speaker 1: my heart. Alan Iverson had to sit here and watch that. 189 00:10:50,120 --> 00:10:53,880 Speaker 1: You know, he dragged Aaron McKee and Eric Snow to 190 00:10:54,000 --> 00:10:56,640 Speaker 1: the finals and these dudes got the better roster and 191 00:10:56,679 --> 00:10:59,960 Speaker 1: losing to the five seed. I mean, pray for Alan 192 00:11:00,000 --> 00:11:03,640 Speaker 1: and Iverson tonight because this has hurting his heart. Well, 193 00:11:03,640 --> 00:11:08,679 Speaker 1: I've a better roster, I mean, and I mean this, Atlanta, 194 00:11:08,720 --> 00:11:11,720 Speaker 1: and I say this with all due respect. That is 195 00:11:11,760 --> 00:11:15,000 Speaker 1: one of the weakest rosters I've ever seen get to 196 00:11:15,040 --> 00:11:18,000 Speaker 1: a conference final. And I love Trey Young, but think 197 00:11:18,000 --> 00:11:21,319 Speaker 1: about this, Marcus. They got to an Eastern Conference final, 198 00:11:21,400 --> 00:11:23,960 Speaker 1: not only on the road. Trey Young had his worst 199 00:11:23,960 --> 00:11:27,000 Speaker 1: shooting night in the playoffs. I mean the fact that 200 00:11:27,000 --> 00:11:28,880 Speaker 1: that happen. I mean one thing of Trey Young shot 201 00:11:28,960 --> 00:11:31,440 Speaker 1: seventeen to twenty six, and you're like, we lost, We 202 00:11:31,559 --> 00:11:35,080 Speaker 1: give up the whiz kid shit. He played poorly for 203 00:11:35,080 --> 00:11:38,680 Speaker 1: all but about the last four minutes. But that's that's 204 00:11:38,800 --> 00:11:42,080 Speaker 1: how you be Philly, right, stay close, they're going to 205 00:11:42,160 --> 00:11:46,000 Speaker 1: fall apart. I so, look, they tricked me a little bit. 206 00:11:46,280 --> 00:11:48,959 Speaker 1: They tricked me a little bit, I must admit and 207 00:11:49,160 --> 00:11:52,079 Speaker 1: be like totally like what the bed It was the 208 00:11:52,200 --> 00:11:55,320 Speaker 1: game five in Philly, and it's like, oh, he was hurt, 209 00:11:55,360 --> 00:11:58,439 Speaker 1: and I'm like this team has they don't have the 210 00:11:58,520 --> 00:12:00,880 Speaker 1: clutch gene, Like they don't have it. You don't come 211 00:12:00,920 --> 00:12:03,480 Speaker 1: back from that. Then they do it, and then they 212 00:12:03,480 --> 00:12:05,360 Speaker 1: go ahead and win game six, and it's like, all right, 213 00:12:05,400 --> 00:12:08,080 Speaker 1: maybe this thing is settled. But no, you know what 214 00:12:08,080 --> 00:12:10,400 Speaker 1: happened in game six. They didn't get down to the end. 215 00:12:10,720 --> 00:12:13,920 Speaker 1: It didn't come down to we gotta make plays over 216 00:12:13,960 --> 00:12:16,080 Speaker 1: and over and over again in the crutch. And it 217 00:12:16,120 --> 00:12:19,280 Speaker 1: happened again tonight. So Trey was terrible and then the 218 00:12:19,320 --> 00:12:22,680 Speaker 1: game was close because Kevin hurt her wouldn't stop hurting him. 219 00:12:22,760 --> 00:12:25,120 Speaker 1: And next thing you know, now Philly's got to make 220 00:12:25,160 --> 00:12:28,280 Speaker 1: place and they don't. They don't have the gene. They 221 00:12:28,360 --> 00:12:30,480 Speaker 1: don't have the gene. Nope, Joel Emba does not have 222 00:12:30,559 --> 00:12:33,240 Speaker 1: the gene. Ben Simmons like, he doesn't even have the 223 00:12:33,280 --> 00:12:38,200 Speaker 1: chemistry set to to discover the gene, like Tobias Harris 224 00:12:38,240 --> 00:12:42,800 Speaker 1: was bad. Like, they don't have the player. Meanwhile, Trey 225 00:12:43,480 --> 00:12:47,760 Speaker 1: Sunday's making all kind of plays when they matter like this, 226 00:12:48,400 --> 00:12:53,520 Speaker 1: you gotta break this up. The callin Coward Podcast proud 227 00:12:53,600 --> 00:12:57,120 Speaker 1: to be presented by fan Duel. Never played fan Duel 228 00:12:57,200 --> 00:13:01,840 Speaker 1: Fantasy before. Great FanDuel's offering users the chance to play free, 229 00:13:02,080 --> 00:13:05,920 Speaker 1: no deposit required. 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In fact, they're free Action 248 00:14:13,480 --> 00:14:17,560 Speaker 1: Network app free recently named the best app in sports betting. 249 00:14:18,120 --> 00:14:21,000 Speaker 1: With the Action app, you can one see the latest 250 00:14:21,000 --> 00:14:23,960 Speaker 1: picks and articles from the Action Network gambling experts too, 251 00:14:24,520 --> 00:14:28,800 Speaker 1: compare odds from different sports books, and three track every 252 00:14:28,800 --> 00:14:31,360 Speaker 1: bet you make so you always know how your picks 253 00:14:31,400 --> 00:14:34,000 Speaker 1: are doing. So if the game means more to you, 254 00:14:34,360 --> 00:14:38,560 Speaker 1: download the free Action Network app and start betting smarter. 255 00:14:41,040 --> 00:14:44,400 Speaker 1: Do you remember Marcus DeAndre Ayton's first year He was 256 00:14:44,440 --> 00:14:48,960 Speaker 1: a little lost at times and there were people saying 257 00:14:49,000 --> 00:14:51,280 Speaker 1: he was a bust. I mean, there were people that 258 00:14:51,320 --> 00:14:53,600 Speaker 1: were out on it because he was a dominant college 259 00:14:53,640 --> 00:14:56,960 Speaker 1: player at Arizona, and I remember hearing people like scouts, 260 00:14:57,000 --> 00:14:59,880 Speaker 1: They're like, I don't know, he's lost. And by the way, 261 00:15:00,320 --> 00:15:02,280 Speaker 1: this is where a Chris Paul is so great. He 262 00:15:02,280 --> 00:15:06,920 Speaker 1: can cinch everything together, he's so smart. But you know, 263 00:15:07,160 --> 00:15:09,800 Speaker 1: you know what I like about them. Everybody always talks 264 00:15:09,800 --> 00:15:12,840 Speaker 1: about positionless basketball because Lebron's the Swiss army knife and 265 00:15:12,920 --> 00:15:16,000 Speaker 1: Kevin Durant can do everything. But they're actually constructed like 266 00:15:16,000 --> 00:15:19,880 Speaker 1: an eighties team, true point guard with a legitimate backup, 267 00:15:20,000 --> 00:15:22,200 Speaker 1: So Chris Paul only has to play thirty one minutes. 268 00:15:22,720 --> 00:15:27,640 Speaker 1: Two athletic wings, one old crowder, one young, a rim 269 00:15:27,680 --> 00:15:31,080 Speaker 1: protector who can move, and then they have bench players 270 00:15:31,240 --> 00:15:33,280 Speaker 1: and they have a star guard. If you look at 271 00:15:33,280 --> 00:15:37,440 Speaker 1: how they're built, it's not positionless. Everybody's got a defined role. 272 00:15:37,800 --> 00:15:42,040 Speaker 1: And for me as a fan, I like watching them play. 273 00:15:42,080 --> 00:15:44,840 Speaker 1: It feels almost like eighties and nineties basketball. They're not 274 00:15:44,880 --> 00:15:47,240 Speaker 1: position less. They all have it. They know exactly what 275 00:15:47,280 --> 00:15:50,760 Speaker 1: they do and who they are, and the beauty of 276 00:15:50,760 --> 00:15:53,720 Speaker 1: it is they can switch up the style of play. 277 00:15:54,000 --> 00:15:57,800 Speaker 1: For me, what makes them so appealing is the diversity. 278 00:15:58,000 --> 00:16:00,520 Speaker 1: Like then they can go half court, can walk you 279 00:16:00,560 --> 00:16:03,520 Speaker 1: down and mid range you to death, right, or they 280 00:16:03,520 --> 00:16:06,520 Speaker 1: could go small just run. They got horses like bridges 281 00:16:06,600 --> 00:16:11,000 Speaker 1: and Booker eight is not slow. They can play that way. 282 00:16:11,080 --> 00:16:14,000 Speaker 1: They like, you know, styles make fights, right, they can 283 00:16:14,040 --> 00:16:16,880 Speaker 1: contrast however you want to play. It's exciting to watch. 284 00:16:16,920 --> 00:16:21,280 Speaker 1: They've got and they've got You're right, they're more They're 285 00:16:21,360 --> 00:16:24,280 Speaker 1: much more like the Barkley suns right than the seventh 286 00:16:24,280 --> 00:16:27,560 Speaker 1: seconds or less match suns. Right. They're like just how 287 00:16:27,600 --> 00:16:30,440 Speaker 1: they're how they're set up. It is a very traditional, 288 00:16:30,480 --> 00:16:32,720 Speaker 1: even like the sizes. Right, they don't have a player 289 00:16:33,240 --> 00:16:35,520 Speaker 1: who's too small or too big for his position. Right, 290 00:16:35,560 --> 00:16:38,680 Speaker 1: Like there's everybody's like the height they're supposed to be, 291 00:16:38,800 --> 00:16:42,280 Speaker 1: which is well, wacourts perfect. The backcourt's perfect. So I 292 00:16:42,360 --> 00:16:47,160 Speaker 1: have this distribution, first veteran point guard who can score, 293 00:16:47,440 --> 00:16:49,840 Speaker 1: but he's a throwback. He's he plays defense, he yells 294 00:16:49,840 --> 00:16:51,640 Speaker 1: at people, and he hits mid range. He's like an 295 00:16:51,680 --> 00:16:55,920 Speaker 1: eighties guard. But we all know that Devin Booker's the 296 00:16:55,960 --> 00:16:58,920 Speaker 1: true scoring guard. So that's a perfect backcourt. And he's 297 00:16:58,920 --> 00:17:02,120 Speaker 1: like six five, right, he's not little, Yeah, and then 298 00:17:02,160 --> 00:17:04,520 Speaker 1: you have a backup to the venom point who can 299 00:17:04,560 --> 00:17:06,959 Speaker 1: spell him for about twelve minutes a game. So like, 300 00:17:07,000 --> 00:17:09,199 Speaker 1: if you go back to the eighties and like the 301 00:17:09,280 --> 00:17:11,560 Speaker 1: Laker teams, there was the Norm Nixon, there was the 302 00:17:11,600 --> 00:17:13,639 Speaker 1: Byron Scott, there was the Magic, there was the Cooper. 303 00:17:13,640 --> 00:17:15,440 Speaker 1: You always had this role and they all had roles. 304 00:17:15,480 --> 00:17:19,879 Speaker 1: Cooper played defense, Magic distributes. Nixon can shoot like, you know, 305 00:17:20,000 --> 00:17:24,479 Speaker 1: the whole positionless thing. Nothing against it, but yeah, that's 306 00:17:24,480 --> 00:17:27,880 Speaker 1: because Lebron and KD can do everything, but most players 307 00:17:28,320 --> 00:17:31,480 Speaker 1: do one or two things exceptionally well. Like everybody's trying 308 00:17:31,480 --> 00:17:33,280 Speaker 1: to make you honest, a three point shooter, cut that 309 00:17:33,280 --> 00:17:37,280 Speaker 1: shit out. He's a big like he is within six feet, 310 00:17:37,320 --> 00:17:40,520 Speaker 1: he's unstoppable outside of it, let him shoot, like, let 311 00:17:40,560 --> 00:17:43,240 Speaker 1: guys do what they did shoot right, Like he's pulling 312 00:17:43,359 --> 00:17:46,159 Speaker 1: up with twenty seconds of the shot, collect please stop that, 313 00:17:46,600 --> 00:17:49,600 Speaker 1: and that's you know, uh eighton right. You don't see 314 00:17:49,680 --> 00:17:52,960 Speaker 1: him dancing on the perimeter trying to check three. He's 315 00:17:53,000 --> 00:17:55,400 Speaker 1: trying to like he's like, yo, I'm six foot eleven 316 00:17:55,880 --> 00:17:58,080 Speaker 1: and I'm a beast, so you're about to get this work. 317 00:17:58,160 --> 00:18:03,320 Speaker 1: So there's Look, Monte Williams is an old school guy, right, 318 00:18:04,000 --> 00:18:07,560 Speaker 1: so you know they're getting a bit of that that 319 00:18:07,680 --> 00:18:10,960 Speaker 1: feel and that vibe. It's it's that is a very 320 00:18:11,080 --> 00:18:14,440 Speaker 1: unique take. They are old They're they're an old school team. 321 00:18:14,560 --> 00:18:18,720 Speaker 1: This is like a you know, afro and butterfly collar 322 00:18:18,800 --> 00:18:21,920 Speaker 1: type team, you know what I'm saying, Like they're throwback. 323 00:18:21,960 --> 00:18:25,520 Speaker 1: It's like eighties night, seventies night in Phoenix every night, like, 324 00:18:25,640 --> 00:18:28,640 Speaker 1: and the crowd is even throwback, right, Like they got 325 00:18:28,680 --> 00:18:31,240 Speaker 1: the Rockets situation going. They're fighting in the crowd like 326 00:18:31,240 --> 00:18:33,800 Speaker 1: a Raiders game, Like you know what I'm saying, Like, yeah, 327 00:18:33,880 --> 00:18:36,480 Speaker 1: this is actually a good throwback team. And look they 328 00:18:36,520 --> 00:18:39,000 Speaker 1: got they got the two best mid range shooters in 329 00:18:39,040 --> 00:18:41,560 Speaker 1: the game, and Chris Paul and Devin Booker, Like they 330 00:18:42,000 --> 00:18:45,439 Speaker 1: are literally killing teams with jabs and body blows right 331 00:18:45,640 --> 00:18:48,919 Speaker 1: like this all game long. This is throwback. Kevin Johnson 332 00:18:48,920 --> 00:18:52,159 Speaker 1: will be proud. You're incredibly tight in not only to 333 00:18:52,240 --> 00:18:55,960 Speaker 1: the NBA but the Warriors. And you start looking at 334 00:18:56,000 --> 00:18:58,639 Speaker 1: the Ben Simmons situation. There's been a lot of rumors 335 00:18:58,680 --> 00:19:02,800 Speaker 1: about you know, Simmons could fit Golden State. They don't 336 00:19:02,800 --> 00:19:05,840 Speaker 1: need his shooting. They need his defense, they need his 337 00:19:06,000 --> 00:19:08,600 Speaker 1: size because they can get small and they can ship 338 00:19:08,720 --> 00:19:13,560 Speaker 1: like Wiseman Andrew Wiggins multiple picks. Do you buy that 339 00:19:13,640 --> 00:19:17,000 Speaker 1: Simmons Warriors rumor at all? Uh? Yeah, I mean, I 340 00:19:17,000 --> 00:19:19,840 Speaker 1: don't think they're into Simmons that much. I think there's 341 00:19:19,880 --> 00:19:22,400 Speaker 1: a split. There are some people who are like, man, 342 00:19:22,440 --> 00:19:25,040 Speaker 1: give me that much talent, I'll make it work. But 343 00:19:25,520 --> 00:19:28,680 Speaker 1: I think the Draymond problem is a big concern. They 344 00:19:28,720 --> 00:19:32,080 Speaker 1: already have a guy who's kind of like that, right, 345 00:19:32,640 --> 00:19:35,480 Speaker 1: but Draymond is like a little bit, not a little bit. 346 00:19:35,480 --> 00:19:39,760 Speaker 1: He's definitely more aggressive offensively, but he doesn't stick to three. 347 00:19:40,240 --> 00:19:42,520 Speaker 1: You don't have to guard him like that. So I 348 00:19:42,520 --> 00:19:45,000 Speaker 1: think they're concerned about putting two of those guys together. 349 00:19:46,080 --> 00:19:47,720 Speaker 1: I don't know if they pull a trigger, but at 350 00:19:47,760 --> 00:19:50,320 Speaker 1: this point, look, Hollin, the price ain't what it used 351 00:19:50,320 --> 00:19:52,520 Speaker 1: to be. So it might be like, Yo, I got this, 352 00:19:52,920 --> 00:19:55,200 Speaker 1: I got this Mercedes for you for five hundred dollars. 353 00:19:55,200 --> 00:19:57,440 Speaker 1: It's like, who wouldn't take it? Right at some point? 354 00:19:57,600 --> 00:20:00,919 Speaker 1: Right right? Like it's like yo, I mean no, I 355 00:20:01,040 --> 00:20:03,879 Speaker 1: talked about this the other day. I said, and beat 356 00:20:04,080 --> 00:20:07,119 Speaker 1: once a big gets hurt you better move him early. 357 00:20:07,359 --> 00:20:10,520 Speaker 1: He's just gonna lose market value every injury. Listen, I 358 00:20:10,560 --> 00:20:12,720 Speaker 1: love him, beat He's the closest thing I've seen to Shack. 359 00:20:13,320 --> 00:20:16,200 Speaker 1: But I'm not giving you a ton for him. I'm 360 00:20:16,240 --> 00:20:18,560 Speaker 1: baking in his injuries. I'm just gonna stay as a 361 00:20:18,640 --> 00:20:21,760 Speaker 1: GM brother. Where do you want me to go on 362 00:20:21,800 --> 00:20:23,640 Speaker 1: that this is not a nine year player, This may 363 00:20:23,680 --> 00:20:26,480 Speaker 1: not be a four year player. Facts, yeah, I'm not. 364 00:20:27,240 --> 00:20:29,359 Speaker 1: I think the price is dropping. I think the price 365 00:20:29,440 --> 00:20:33,240 Speaker 1: is dropping, not just because like you got the injuries 366 00:20:33,280 --> 00:20:35,000 Speaker 1: with him. Bet you got the fact that he just 367 00:20:35,040 --> 00:20:37,480 Speaker 1: didn't close and this is not the first time he 368 00:20:37,520 --> 00:20:40,960 Speaker 1: didn't close out Atlanta and wherever he goes. You know, 369 00:20:41,040 --> 00:20:43,680 Speaker 1: he's a guy who's gonna want the ball. Ben Simmons 370 00:20:43,720 --> 00:20:47,320 Speaker 1: stock way down right. You gotta you can't play him 371 00:20:47,359 --> 00:20:50,960 Speaker 1: at the end of games, though. I wonder if he 372 00:20:51,040 --> 00:20:54,200 Speaker 1: hung out with Clay would this be an issue. Clay 373 00:20:54,240 --> 00:20:57,240 Speaker 1: would have him shooting free throws at eighty percent. Ray 374 00:20:57,440 --> 00:21:00,240 Speaker 1: Hank with Clay is a life solution. Clay right now 375 00:21:00,359 --> 00:21:04,040 Speaker 1: is swimming in the Bay Area with in the literal Bay. 376 00:21:04,280 --> 00:21:06,840 Speaker 1: Put Bits Simmons with Clay for an offseason. I bet 377 00:21:06,840 --> 00:21:09,639 Speaker 1: you we shoot eighty percent from Free to Live Well. Also, 378 00:21:09,880 --> 00:21:12,280 Speaker 1: Simmons can give you nineteen to twenty two a game 379 00:21:12,440 --> 00:21:15,640 Speaker 1: as long as you don't have a dominating big wagging 380 00:21:15,720 --> 00:21:18,399 Speaker 1: it up. So that's why he's perfect. That's why he's perfect. 381 00:21:18,400 --> 00:21:21,119 Speaker 1: You got Clay, you got Steph, you got Draymond, and 382 00:21:21,160 --> 00:21:25,199 Speaker 1: they're pushing it. He's incredible in transition, like you're not 383 00:21:25,320 --> 00:21:29,119 Speaker 1: asking him to do this. And also it's not clashing 384 00:21:29,160 --> 00:21:31,800 Speaker 1: with the big guy who needs to be posted unless 385 00:21:31,840 --> 00:21:34,480 Speaker 1: you know, somehow Chris Steve Kerr decides that, you know, 386 00:21:34,560 --> 00:21:37,560 Speaker 1: we're gonna turn James Wiseman into Joel and b. But 387 00:21:37,720 --> 00:21:40,200 Speaker 1: I don't think that's happening at all. But I think 388 00:21:40,280 --> 00:21:45,040 Speaker 1: Simmons is a is a fit in the sense that 389 00:21:46,080 --> 00:21:49,280 Speaker 1: he can play the Warriors style and you don't need 390 00:21:49,359 --> 00:21:53,040 Speaker 1: a shooting. I just wouldn't give up a lot for 391 00:21:53,119 --> 00:21:57,040 Speaker 1: him after what we just saw. Now it's like I 392 00:21:57,160 --> 00:22:01,520 Speaker 1: got some used air Jordan's and you know what I'm saying, 393 00:22:01,560 --> 00:22:06,359 Speaker 1: maybe Wiggins right, Like I give Wiggins and Wiseman that's 394 00:22:06,359 --> 00:22:09,280 Speaker 1: a lot. That was the price before. What was the 395 00:22:09,320 --> 00:22:13,480 Speaker 1: price for James Harden? It was like a pig or Okay, 396 00:22:13,480 --> 00:22:16,560 Speaker 1: how about Wiggins Wiseman, and you give me your first 397 00:22:16,640 --> 00:22:19,679 Speaker 1: round pick. I get the Sixers number one pick, but 398 00:22:19,720 --> 00:22:22,600 Speaker 1: I'll give you Wiggins, Wiseman and Simmons. I get Simmons. 399 00:22:22,640 --> 00:22:28,879 Speaker 1: I do that already, my buddy Nick, right host, First 400 00:22:28,880 --> 00:22:32,200 Speaker 1: things first, FS one's joining us. So you know, as 401 00:22:32,240 --> 00:22:35,640 Speaker 1: I always think is funny, Nick, is that. And I've 402 00:22:35,680 --> 00:22:37,920 Speaker 1: watched a lot of people do this to their careers 403 00:22:37,920 --> 00:22:41,320 Speaker 1: in radio and television, like they have they have they 404 00:22:41,359 --> 00:22:44,760 Speaker 1: have a flaw and they just don't correct it. And 405 00:22:45,000 --> 00:22:48,159 Speaker 1: I mean, there's no perfect broadcaster, but they'll like some 406 00:22:48,200 --> 00:22:50,600 Speaker 1: people just don't have a great voice or they're you 407 00:22:50,600 --> 00:22:52,840 Speaker 1: know whatever, there's a deficiency. But there are people that 408 00:22:52,880 --> 00:22:54,760 Speaker 1: are really talented, but they keep making the same mistake 409 00:22:54,800 --> 00:22:56,000 Speaker 1: over and over and over and over. And I think 410 00:22:56,000 --> 00:22:59,480 Speaker 1: we both know people like that. And like with Ben Simmons, 411 00:22:59,720 --> 00:23:02,720 Speaker 1: you're like, dude, this is not this difficult. It's a 412 00:23:02,720 --> 00:23:07,119 Speaker 1: free throw. It's free It's a free throw. I'm always 413 00:23:07,280 --> 00:23:12,280 Speaker 1: shocked when the solution is easy. It's not like we're 414 00:23:12,280 --> 00:23:16,800 Speaker 1: asking him to be quick or advertical. It's like, it's 415 00:23:16,800 --> 00:23:19,560 Speaker 1: a free throw. It is unguarded. What do you make 416 00:23:19,600 --> 00:23:24,760 Speaker 1: of that? Well, I think it I listen. He I 417 00:23:24,920 --> 00:23:29,880 Speaker 1: talked someone close to Ben after game five when he's 418 00:23:29,920 --> 00:23:34,159 Speaker 1: said whatever whichever game he said, ah, yeah, I was 419 00:23:34,200 --> 00:23:38,680 Speaker 1: in my own head it's mental. And the person said, yeah, 420 00:23:38,680 --> 00:23:40,920 Speaker 1: he shouldn't have said that, because now that's out there, 421 00:23:40,960 --> 00:23:43,200 Speaker 1: now that's in the universe. Now people are talking about 422 00:23:43,200 --> 00:23:45,880 Speaker 1: it being mental. That the advice was no, just say 423 00:23:45,920 --> 00:23:48,280 Speaker 1: you had a bad shooting night. But the thing is this, 424 00:23:48,760 --> 00:23:52,280 Speaker 1: it was one hundred in his head. It is one 425 00:23:52,359 --> 00:23:56,960 Speaker 1: hundred percent mental, and that has to be, at least 426 00:23:57,000 --> 00:24:01,520 Speaker 1: to me, Colin a massive concern. It's why it's not free. 427 00:24:01,560 --> 00:24:05,639 Speaker 1: It's why it's not easy because he is thinking so hard. 428 00:24:05,760 --> 00:24:09,040 Speaker 1: And you saw it on the play that Embiid said 429 00:24:09,080 --> 00:24:12,720 Speaker 1: turned the game Colin, where he said, well, what turned 430 00:24:12,760 --> 00:24:15,760 Speaker 1: the game was we could have gotten two points and 431 00:24:15,800 --> 00:24:17,840 Speaker 1: we got one point and they scored the next time 432 00:24:17,920 --> 00:24:20,760 Speaker 1: down he had a dunk, but he was so afraid 433 00:24:20,800 --> 00:24:24,480 Speaker 1: of going to the line that he passed the ball. 434 00:24:24,520 --> 00:24:27,639 Speaker 1: And then that's that. Compare that to Jannis, who they're 435 00:24:27,720 --> 00:24:32,879 Speaker 1: counting one, two, three, he's airballing free throws and he 436 00:24:32,960 --> 00:24:35,320 Speaker 1: just kept attacking and ended up making seven in a 437 00:24:35,440 --> 00:24:38,199 Speaker 1: row in the biggest game of his life. If my 438 00:24:38,400 --> 00:24:43,840 Speaker 1: career was only going to be fourteen years and I 439 00:24:43,880 --> 00:24:49,080 Speaker 1: was tied financially, tied to my first job for four years, 440 00:24:49,880 --> 00:24:51,800 Speaker 1: and I didn't even grow up poor. I didn't grow 441 00:24:51,880 --> 00:24:54,240 Speaker 1: up rich, but I didn't grow up poor. Many professional 442 00:24:54,240 --> 00:24:55,960 Speaker 1: athletes don't grow up with a ton of money, right, 443 00:24:56,400 --> 00:24:59,560 Speaker 1: And I got fourteen years to make it, and I 444 00:24:59,560 --> 00:25:02,600 Speaker 1: get rafted by a mess of a franchise that couldn't 445 00:25:02,600 --> 00:25:05,240 Speaker 1: get Chris Paul or Anthony Davis. Right, Zion's going to 446 00:25:05,280 --> 00:25:07,359 Speaker 1: be on his third coach in three years. This is 447 00:25:07,359 --> 00:25:09,760 Speaker 1: where I always sided with pro athletes. I would be 448 00:25:09,760 --> 00:25:13,359 Speaker 1: fucking impossible to deal with one of the reasons. Even 449 00:25:13,359 --> 00:25:15,639 Speaker 1: if I signed a contract and don't love it, you know, 450 00:25:15,840 --> 00:25:17,560 Speaker 1: I'll be out in two and a half three years. 451 00:25:17,680 --> 00:25:19,640 Speaker 1: I can go somewhere else if I was ever unhappy. 452 00:25:20,480 --> 00:25:23,400 Speaker 1: I don't blame Zion. The Pelicans are a mess. They're 453 00:25:23,400 --> 00:25:25,520 Speaker 1: owned by a football owner who, by the way, they 454 00:25:25,640 --> 00:25:27,840 Speaker 1: run a hell of a football operation. They run a 455 00:25:27,880 --> 00:25:33,240 Speaker 1: real bad basketball operation. There was a story by Tom 456 00:25:33,280 --> 00:25:37,920 Speaker 1: Haberstro or somebody that they're probably the most likely relocation franchise. 457 00:25:38,640 --> 00:25:41,400 Speaker 1: Like I side with him, Like what I hope is this? 458 00:25:41,520 --> 00:25:46,000 Speaker 1: Nick players have always had two revenue streams the stars, 459 00:25:46,000 --> 00:25:50,840 Speaker 1: shoes and basketball. They now have a third, social media. 460 00:25:51,080 --> 00:25:53,600 Speaker 1: I think if he goes to a Nix or a Lakers, 461 00:25:53,640 --> 00:25:56,720 Speaker 1: he can make the money up in shoes and social 462 00:25:56,760 --> 00:26:00,320 Speaker 1: media and it's really not that big of a loss. Yeah, 463 00:26:00,359 --> 00:26:05,040 Speaker 1: well yeah, I think financially he couldn't make it. Even then. 464 00:26:05,800 --> 00:26:08,480 Speaker 1: The thing is this what they've got the rookies by 465 00:26:08,680 --> 00:26:12,480 Speaker 1: financially is the risk. It's he would have to basically 466 00:26:12,520 --> 00:26:15,760 Speaker 1: take a massive risk for a year and assuming nothing 467 00:26:15,840 --> 00:26:18,480 Speaker 1: traumatic injury wise happens, then by the end of his 468 00:26:18,520 --> 00:26:21,680 Speaker 1: career he does probably make the money up, but it 469 00:26:21,800 --> 00:26:24,359 Speaker 1: is And Marcus Thompson, who you talked to, I actually 470 00:26:24,359 --> 00:26:26,520 Speaker 1: heard him make this point, I think or he was 471 00:26:26,520 --> 00:26:28,280 Speaker 1: on a podcast where somebody who made this point. I 472 00:26:28,280 --> 00:26:30,840 Speaker 1: think it's a good one, which is part you mentioned. 473 00:26:30,880 --> 00:26:32,800 Speaker 1: These guys don't grow a lot of guys don't grow 474 00:26:32,840 --> 00:26:34,960 Speaker 1: with a ton of money, right, And he made the 475 00:26:35,000 --> 00:26:41,040 Speaker 1: point there is some social pressure from your peer group 476 00:26:41,359 --> 00:26:43,800 Speaker 1: of friends at home if it comes out in the public, 477 00:26:43,840 --> 00:26:48,560 Speaker 1: like really you turned you turned down a hundred and 478 00:26:48,760 --> 00:26:53,240 Speaker 1: fifty million dollars you said no to that? Like sign 479 00:26:53,320 --> 00:26:55,639 Speaker 1: the contract? Just good and maybe you just signed to 480 00:26:55,640 --> 00:26:57,960 Speaker 1: take the money. So I understand that part of it, 481 00:26:58,240 --> 00:27:00,440 Speaker 1: and I also understand why we've never seen a guy 482 00:27:01,520 --> 00:27:04,600 Speaker 1: on his rookie contract turned down the max extension, but 483 00:27:04,840 --> 00:27:08,679 Speaker 1: somebody eventually will. And your point on New Orleans, it 484 00:27:08,760 --> 00:27:12,880 Speaker 1: would really bother me if I knew my team owner 485 00:27:13,600 --> 00:27:17,240 Speaker 1: that we are the second most important team they own, 486 00:27:17,560 --> 00:27:20,359 Speaker 1: like what like that? That would bother me, Like, I 487 00:27:20,359 --> 00:27:22,680 Speaker 1: don't think i'd love that as a pro athlete, and 488 00:27:23,200 --> 00:27:25,520 Speaker 1: I also wouldn't love the history. I think New Orleans 489 00:27:25,560 --> 00:27:29,560 Speaker 1: an awesome city. I also, you know, previously have said 490 00:27:29,600 --> 00:27:31,960 Speaker 1: I think David Griffin's a good GM. I don't think 491 00:27:31,960 --> 00:27:34,000 Speaker 1: he's done. I don't think Sam van gundy Hire was 492 00:27:34,000 --> 00:27:36,320 Speaker 1: a great one. We'll see how the moves work. But 493 00:27:36,440 --> 00:27:40,720 Speaker 1: I here's where I think it's going to thread the needle, Colin, 494 00:27:40,840 --> 00:27:44,480 Speaker 1: And this is where I think NBA guys, the true superstars, 495 00:27:45,040 --> 00:27:49,239 Speaker 1: really have the leverage. I think guys can sign the 496 00:27:49,280 --> 00:27:52,520 Speaker 1: contract to lock in the money and then still leave, 497 00:27:53,520 --> 00:27:56,720 Speaker 1: Like we've never seen an NBA team willing to be like, no, 498 00:27:56,920 --> 00:28:00,399 Speaker 1: you're under James Harden was under contract for two more years. 499 00:28:00,800 --> 00:28:02,959 Speaker 1: He had one press conference was like I gotta get 500 00:28:03,000 --> 00:28:05,000 Speaker 1: out of here. They traded him in four days to 501 00:28:05,119 --> 00:28:07,520 Speaker 1: the exact place he wanted to go to. So like, 502 00:28:07,560 --> 00:28:11,800 Speaker 1: I think Zion and Luca can sign the deals and 503 00:28:11,920 --> 00:28:14,359 Speaker 1: the team still know it's year to year because at 504 00:28:14,400 --> 00:28:16,800 Speaker 1: the moment they really want out, we're gonna have to 505 00:28:16,800 --> 00:28:18,960 Speaker 1: get him out. So I think that's what happens. I 506 00:28:18,960 --> 00:28:23,359 Speaker 1: think Zion, he's played two years for the Pelicans, I 507 00:28:23,440 --> 00:28:27,280 Speaker 1: would say I think he will play at least five 508 00:28:27,359 --> 00:28:31,000 Speaker 1: years for the Pelicans. Anthony Davis played seven, you know, 509 00:28:31,119 --> 00:28:34,000 Speaker 1: Lebron played seven. I think he'll play at least five 510 00:28:34,119 --> 00:28:36,200 Speaker 1: and evaluate then. But they got a lot of work 511 00:28:36,240 --> 00:28:38,040 Speaker 1: to do, man, they got a lot of work to 512 00:28:38,080 --> 00:28:40,840 Speaker 1: do just to be a second round playoff team, much 513 00:28:40,920 --> 00:28:46,479 Speaker 1: less a championship contender. Well, when there's a baseball topic, 514 00:28:46,520 --> 00:28:49,200 Speaker 1: I call two people, Bob cost Us or Tom Verducci. 515 00:28:49,240 --> 00:28:51,440 Speaker 1: And since we had cost Us, we would have taken 516 00:28:51,520 --> 00:28:56,600 Speaker 1: Verducci ahead of Bob obviously, but Tom is joining US 517 00:28:56,640 --> 00:29:00,320 Speaker 1: Sports Illustrated Senior baseball writer reporter for Fox base Ball 518 00:29:00,360 --> 00:29:03,960 Speaker 1: and Major League Baseball. Three time National Sports Writer of 519 00:29:03,960 --> 00:29:06,080 Speaker 1: the Year, he is the premier baseball writer in my 520 00:29:06,160 --> 00:29:10,960 Speaker 1: opinion in the last ten fifteen years minimum, and Tom's 521 00:29:11,000 --> 00:29:13,480 Speaker 1: joining us. So let's get to the sticky stuff controversy, 522 00:29:13,520 --> 00:29:17,640 Speaker 1: because you've been somebody who's been willing if you hear 523 00:29:17,680 --> 00:29:19,920 Speaker 1: stuff that's not necessarily great news for the sport. To 524 00:29:19,920 --> 00:29:22,960 Speaker 1: be honest about it, an upfront, you talked very early 525 00:29:23,000 --> 00:29:27,200 Speaker 1: on the steroids when you when did you hear about tack? 526 00:29:27,720 --> 00:29:29,920 Speaker 1: Was it last year? Was it around a batting cage? 527 00:29:29,960 --> 00:29:32,920 Speaker 1: Did you read about it? When did you hear about it? Well, 528 00:29:33,000 --> 00:29:34,719 Speaker 1: con you got to go back a few years to 529 00:29:34,720 --> 00:29:38,479 Speaker 1: find out about the whole suntan lotion and rosin combo 530 00:29:38,600 --> 00:29:41,040 Speaker 1: that was going on. Yes, that probably I want to 531 00:29:41,080 --> 00:29:43,920 Speaker 1: go you know, even maybe six seven years ago, started 532 00:29:43,920 --> 00:29:47,120 Speaker 1: hearing about that, and if you watch the game, you 533 00:29:47,160 --> 00:29:50,720 Speaker 1: saw guys playing at night with their arms lathered with 534 00:29:50,840 --> 00:29:54,200 Speaker 1: suntan lotion and they're going through it after every pitch, right, 535 00:29:54,280 --> 00:29:56,320 Speaker 1: So that's when I first realized there's something going on 536 00:29:56,360 --> 00:29:59,360 Speaker 1: here besides just you know, grabbing the rosin bag and 537 00:29:59,520 --> 00:30:01,920 Speaker 1: using some sweat or licking your fingers to put something 538 00:30:01,920 --> 00:30:04,200 Speaker 1: out of baseball. But it was really in the last 539 00:30:04,280 --> 00:30:07,800 Speaker 1: i want to say, three to four years that you 540 00:30:07,880 --> 00:30:11,760 Speaker 1: started seeing ridiculous spin rates because We started tracking those 541 00:30:11,760 --> 00:30:14,840 Speaker 1: in twenty fifteen, so now we had actual data besides 542 00:30:14,880 --> 00:30:17,520 Speaker 1: what we were watching to say there's something really interesting, 543 00:30:17,640 --> 00:30:21,400 Speaker 1: if not fishy, going on here. And then after talking 544 00:30:21,440 --> 00:30:24,600 Speaker 1: to pictures, pitching coaches and whatnot, you realize that they 545 00:30:24,600 --> 00:30:29,040 Speaker 1: are now chasing spin rate more than they're chasing velocity. 546 00:30:29,200 --> 00:30:31,760 Speaker 1: That was mind blowing concept to me because we've always 547 00:30:31,800 --> 00:30:33,400 Speaker 1: been in love with the radar gun. Right, the guy 548 00:30:33,440 --> 00:30:36,560 Speaker 1: throws hard, it's hard to hit. But they figured out 549 00:30:36,600 --> 00:30:40,280 Speaker 1: that actually spin rate has a greater effect on limiting 550 00:30:40,320 --> 00:30:43,760 Speaker 1: hitting than velocity. And now because they have slow, high 551 00:30:43,800 --> 00:30:46,480 Speaker 1: speed cameras, they can figure out all the spin rates 552 00:30:46,480 --> 00:30:49,480 Speaker 1: and how to generate that to maximum purpose. And that's 553 00:30:49,520 --> 00:30:54,680 Speaker 1: why I started making these combinations of pine tar, diet coke, 554 00:30:55,120 --> 00:30:57,920 Speaker 1: melting pine tar down, all kinds of scientific things going 555 00:30:57,960 --> 00:31:00,800 Speaker 1: on to maximize spin rates. And I might say, this 556 00:31:00,920 --> 00:31:02,760 Speaker 1: is going on, Colin. This has been going on even 557 00:31:02,760 --> 00:31:06,240 Speaker 1: in the minor leagues, systematically in organizations. So I would 558 00:31:06,280 --> 00:31:08,239 Speaker 1: say the last two to three years is when I 559 00:31:08,240 --> 00:31:11,760 Speaker 1: started hearing that this had jumped really from maybe a 560 00:31:11,760 --> 00:31:16,760 Speaker 1: few guys to something that was industry wide. So after 561 00:31:16,800 --> 00:31:20,840 Speaker 1: the Astro scandal, and of course the steroid scandal predated that. 562 00:31:21,080 --> 00:31:25,719 Speaker 1: It's pretty obvious that baseball once this started getting talked 563 00:31:25,760 --> 00:31:29,120 Speaker 1: about in mainstream media, they jumped on it. You love 564 00:31:29,160 --> 00:31:33,480 Speaker 1: to figure this out in the offseason. It looks esthetically 565 00:31:34,040 --> 00:31:36,840 Speaker 1: pretty choppy to frisk guys during a game. The optics 566 00:31:36,880 --> 00:31:39,200 Speaker 1: are not great. The other day I said, I compared 567 00:31:39,200 --> 00:31:42,040 Speaker 1: it to the NFL catch rule, where guys made catches. 568 00:31:42,360 --> 00:31:44,440 Speaker 1: They'd go to super slo moo, the ball would move 569 00:31:44,480 --> 00:31:46,960 Speaker 1: a little in the elbow crease and you'd say, no catch. 570 00:31:47,400 --> 00:31:49,920 Speaker 1: It looked really bad. It's obviously a catch, And Roger 571 00:31:49,960 --> 00:31:52,720 Speaker 1: Goodell had come on my radio show and acknowledged it's 572 00:31:52,760 --> 00:31:57,960 Speaker 1: bad television. It looks bad. So is it fair to 573 00:31:58,000 --> 00:32:00,520 Speaker 1: say Manfred was if you knew about it three years ago. 574 00:32:01,360 --> 00:32:04,320 Speaker 1: Other players knew about it probably three and a half 575 00:32:04,400 --> 00:32:10,080 Speaker 1: years ago. Was baseball reticent to get involved? Slow because 576 00:32:10,080 --> 00:32:13,200 Speaker 1: it kind of feels like now they're being reactive in 577 00:32:13,240 --> 00:32:16,160 Speaker 1: the middle of a season and kind of it's clunky 578 00:32:16,200 --> 00:32:19,120 Speaker 1: as they make it up as they go. Right. But 579 00:32:19,240 --> 00:32:21,600 Speaker 1: I think you have to rewind the tape here because 580 00:32:21,680 --> 00:32:25,800 Speaker 1: go back to preseason twenty twenty, when MLB really did 581 00:32:25,960 --> 00:32:27,640 Speaker 1: know that there was a lot more than just a 582 00:32:27,680 --> 00:32:30,680 Speaker 1: few guys doing something to baseball. So they sent out 583 00:32:30,680 --> 00:32:32,680 Speaker 1: a memo, it was Chris Young at the time, vice 584 00:32:32,720 --> 00:32:35,840 Speaker 1: president of Baseball Operations for MLB to all the clubs, 585 00:32:35,960 --> 00:32:38,880 Speaker 1: addressed all the managers and general managers, essentially saying, knock 586 00:32:38,920 --> 00:32:41,960 Speaker 1: it off. Here's the rule that's in the books, and 587 00:32:42,400 --> 00:32:44,240 Speaker 1: there is a rule that you can't have it on 588 00:32:44,280 --> 00:32:46,960 Speaker 1: your possession. Obviously you can't put it on a baseball. 589 00:32:47,600 --> 00:32:50,560 Speaker 1: It was a warning to the players to knock it off, 590 00:32:51,280 --> 00:32:53,479 Speaker 1: but there was really no enforcement to it, right, So 591 00:32:53,640 --> 00:32:56,720 Speaker 1: behavior is not going to change without enforcement. Right. Then 592 00:32:56,760 --> 00:33:00,160 Speaker 1: this year they sent another memo out and they said, oh, 593 00:33:00,200 --> 00:33:02,520 Speaker 1: and we're also going to have monitors down at the 594 00:33:02,560 --> 00:33:05,280 Speaker 1: field to see that nothing fishy is going on. We 595 00:33:05,360 --> 00:33:07,640 Speaker 1: are going to take samples and baseballs out of the 596 00:33:07,720 --> 00:33:10,760 Speaker 1: game and look at what's on them and figure out 597 00:33:10,760 --> 00:33:13,600 Speaker 1: what you're putting on baseballs. And we're going to monitor 598 00:33:13,680 --> 00:33:17,040 Speaker 1: your individual spin rate because it really shouldn't change that much, 599 00:33:17,120 --> 00:33:20,360 Speaker 1: not by going up three four, five hundred RPMs is 600 00:33:20,360 --> 00:33:23,120 Speaker 1: what we've seen. That was another case where MLB is 601 00:33:23,160 --> 00:33:26,040 Speaker 1: trying to get players to change their behavior on their own, 602 00:33:26,440 --> 00:33:29,760 Speaker 1: and they didn't so now they can went past the 603 00:33:29,880 --> 00:33:34,880 Speaker 1: warning phase, the evidentiary phase, to finally the enforcement phase, 604 00:33:34,920 --> 00:33:36,520 Speaker 1: and they gave them a few weeks here to make 605 00:33:36,560 --> 00:33:39,000 Speaker 1: the adjustment, right, because the word went out there early 606 00:33:39,000 --> 00:33:41,360 Speaker 1: in June. They gave two or three weeks to say, 607 00:33:41,360 --> 00:33:43,600 Speaker 1: we're not going to start be forcing this, but here's 608 00:33:43,600 --> 00:33:45,600 Speaker 1: our time now to start cleaning things up and make 609 00:33:45,640 --> 00:33:48,920 Speaker 1: the adjustment. So I do not buy the argument that 610 00:33:48,960 --> 00:33:51,120 Speaker 1: this was dropped on the players out of the blue 611 00:33:51,160 --> 00:33:54,200 Speaker 1: mid season. Oh my goodness, we can't change No, You've 612 00:33:54,240 --> 00:33:57,880 Speaker 1: been warned for two years to knock get off and 613 00:33:58,040 --> 00:34:00,959 Speaker 1: it's like your kids disciplining them, right, you threaten him 614 00:34:00,960 --> 00:34:03,239 Speaker 1: with a curfew, but until you actually do it, it 615 00:34:03,280 --> 00:34:07,200 Speaker 1: doesn't have any effect. So it took now the enforcement 616 00:34:07,200 --> 00:34:10,520 Speaker 1: phase to start the change behavior. And I agree with you, Colin, 617 00:34:10,680 --> 00:34:12,719 Speaker 1: it's not a great look. They're trying to do it 618 00:34:12,760 --> 00:34:16,239 Speaker 1: as unobtrusively as they can, but there's no other around it. 619 00:34:16,239 --> 00:34:19,160 Speaker 1: It is ubtrusive, but it needs to be done. There's 620 00:34:19,160 --> 00:34:21,520 Speaker 1: a certain amount of theater to it, sort of like 621 00:34:21,560 --> 00:34:23,840 Speaker 1: TSA at the airport. It just has to be done. 622 00:34:24,160 --> 00:34:26,759 Speaker 1: And there's going to be one time where someone's going 623 00:34:26,800 --> 00:34:29,120 Speaker 1: to be foolish enough to be caught. But it's more 624 00:34:29,200 --> 00:34:32,160 Speaker 1: about making sure that now there's an enforcement phase to 625 00:34:32,239 --> 00:34:37,320 Speaker 1: this and that changes behavior, not just a warning. All right, Tom, 626 00:34:37,360 --> 00:34:41,920 Speaker 1: what I'm about to say you cover baseball intensely, so 627 00:34:41,960 --> 00:34:45,399 Speaker 1: this is going to sound ridiculous, and I'm you can 628 00:34:45,440 --> 00:34:49,040 Speaker 1: take shots at me, But what shoh Otani is doing 629 00:34:49,719 --> 00:34:53,440 Speaker 1: is Babe ruthian. He throws a hundred and leads baseball 630 00:34:53,480 --> 00:34:56,319 Speaker 1: and Homer's. Now, throughout the course of my life, there 631 00:34:56,400 --> 00:35:00,840 Speaker 1: have been athletes Dave Winfield who really could have played 632 00:35:01,120 --> 00:35:05,400 Speaker 1: multiple sports. I mean, Will Chamberlain basketball, multiple sports. We 633 00:35:05,520 --> 00:35:08,560 Speaker 1: know Lebron was All State in Ohio as a football player. 634 00:35:08,960 --> 00:35:13,040 Speaker 1: That's understood. But to throw it a hundred and to 635 00:35:13,239 --> 00:35:18,040 Speaker 1: lead baseball in home runs, that is ruthian. Give me 636 00:35:18,160 --> 00:35:22,920 Speaker 1: the players, Tom, since you've covered baseball, I mean, nobody's 637 00:35:23,000 --> 00:35:25,880 Speaker 1: doing it, but you thought it could get into that 638 00:35:26,200 --> 00:35:29,800 Speaker 1: sphere in that because I can't think of anybody. No, 639 00:35:30,160 --> 00:35:33,080 Speaker 1: it's zero. First of all, I go back to Bo 640 00:35:33,280 --> 00:35:37,040 Speaker 1: Jackson when he was playing baseball, right, amazing athlete. There 641 00:35:37,120 --> 00:35:40,680 Speaker 1: was nobody on the field who looked like Bo Jackson. 642 00:35:41,280 --> 00:35:44,680 Speaker 1: But I wouldn't say his skill set you know, as 643 00:35:44,719 --> 00:35:48,759 Speaker 1: far as high average hitter was really extraordinary. This is 644 00:35:48,800 --> 00:35:52,520 Speaker 1: what's amazing about Otani. He's a great athlete, and yet 645 00:35:52,680 --> 00:35:56,640 Speaker 1: his skill set in multiple phases of the game is 646 00:35:57,040 --> 00:36:01,719 Speaker 1: elite elite hitter, elite runner, elite pitcher. We have not 647 00:36:02,000 --> 00:36:06,000 Speaker 1: seen this since Babe Ruth. This is the most underappreciated 648 00:36:06,120 --> 00:36:08,879 Speaker 1: story in baseball easily, and I don't know how long, 649 00:36:09,040 --> 00:36:11,640 Speaker 1: maybe since Babe Ruth a hundred years ago. Let me 650 00:36:11,760 --> 00:36:13,600 Speaker 1: put this, let me put this in context for you. 651 00:36:14,200 --> 00:36:18,440 Speaker 1: This year, Otani is hitting the baseball harder than Juan Soto. 652 00:36:19,320 --> 00:36:25,920 Speaker 1: He is throwing the baseball harder than Walker Bueller. I mean, 653 00:36:25,960 --> 00:36:29,920 Speaker 1: it's crazy. And he's running faster than Brick Gardner. So 654 00:36:30,239 --> 00:36:33,280 Speaker 1: he's doing things on a baseball field that we literally 655 00:36:33,440 --> 00:36:38,799 Speaker 1: haven't seen in a hundred years, and it's amazing. Mark 656 00:36:38,840 --> 00:36:42,000 Speaker 1: Cuban's one of those guys that's fascinating. I frankly, I 657 00:36:42,080 --> 00:36:44,920 Speaker 1: think Donald Trump opened the door for celebrities to run 658 00:36:45,000 --> 00:36:47,600 Speaker 1: for president, and I would be a huge fan of 659 00:36:47,719 --> 00:36:51,760 Speaker 1: Mark Cuban. I don't have to agree with every candidate 660 00:36:51,840 --> 00:36:54,600 Speaker 1: on every issue. I really don't. That's not how I think. 661 00:36:54,920 --> 00:36:58,440 Speaker 1: I'm an independent. I go left socially fiscally right. But 662 00:36:58,560 --> 00:37:02,080 Speaker 1: I think Cuban would be a fascinating candidate if you 663 00:37:02,120 --> 00:37:04,240 Speaker 1: put himself out in the fray. And he is joining 664 00:37:04,360 --> 00:37:06,960 Speaker 1: us now. So Mark, I We've talked a lot of 665 00:37:07,000 --> 00:37:09,640 Speaker 1: times about different stuff, and we talk sports in business 666 00:37:09,680 --> 00:37:11,840 Speaker 1: and I'm I'm a guy that's fascinated with business and 667 00:37:11,920 --> 00:37:13,080 Speaker 1: you know a lot more of it than I do. 668 00:37:13,640 --> 00:37:17,160 Speaker 1: And you always respond to you play kte me when 669 00:37:17,200 --> 00:37:19,920 Speaker 1: I email you with my stupid questions, I'm gonna throw 670 00:37:20,000 --> 00:37:22,200 Speaker 1: I'm gonna throw this at you that I'm a big 671 00:37:22,239 --> 00:37:24,480 Speaker 1: fan of mobility. It's the only reason I've had success 672 00:37:24,520 --> 00:37:27,280 Speaker 1: in my life. I have moved for commerce the NBA. 673 00:37:27,520 --> 00:37:31,920 Speaker 1: I am a huge proponent of player mobility. I support 674 00:37:32,040 --> 00:37:36,879 Speaker 1: all players with mobility. Owners can move franchises, GMS, coaches move, 675 00:37:36,920 --> 00:37:39,719 Speaker 1: players can too. But yet you and Dirk were together 676 00:37:39,840 --> 00:37:43,080 Speaker 1: twenty one years. It's the greatest longest relationship for any 677 00:37:43,239 --> 00:37:47,480 Speaker 1: player and a team. Could I make the argument that 678 00:37:47,719 --> 00:37:51,640 Speaker 1: player mobility, which there's less of in the NFL, is 679 00:37:51,760 --> 00:37:55,560 Speaker 1: not always a good thing for your sport. It's great 680 00:37:55,600 --> 00:37:58,399 Speaker 1: for the summertime ratings, it's more difficult during the season. 681 00:37:58,440 --> 00:38:01,800 Speaker 1: There's no question about it, because you know, continuity, corporate 682 00:38:01,880 --> 00:38:04,160 Speaker 1: knowledge is always a good thing for a team. So 683 00:38:04,600 --> 00:38:07,120 Speaker 1: there's definitely challenges there and it creates a lot of 684 00:38:07,160 --> 00:38:09,760 Speaker 1: adjada as well. You know, when you have a great player, 685 00:38:10,000 --> 00:38:12,959 Speaker 1: every team stress is about and fan base stress is about, 686 00:38:13,080 --> 00:38:15,440 Speaker 1: you know, will you lose them? And so, you know, 687 00:38:15,520 --> 00:38:18,439 Speaker 1: the minute you find out somebody's great, you start working 688 00:38:18,560 --> 00:38:22,560 Speaker 1: really hard to make them successful. Do you use Dirk's 689 00:38:22,640 --> 00:38:25,960 Speaker 1: career at all as a template for Luca? What did 690 00:38:26,000 --> 00:38:28,719 Speaker 1: you learn to do and maybe not to do? I 691 00:38:28,880 --> 00:38:30,840 Speaker 1: learned a lot more what not to do, you know, 692 00:38:31,120 --> 00:38:33,000 Speaker 1: and some things to do. I mean, one of the 693 00:38:33,080 --> 00:38:35,480 Speaker 1: most important things is I don't think I fully appreciated 694 00:38:35,560 --> 00:38:37,800 Speaker 1: Dirk while he was playing, you know, because it was 695 00:38:37,840 --> 00:38:39,960 Speaker 1: all new to me and I was getting into the whole, 696 00:38:40,200 --> 00:38:43,440 Speaker 1: you know, experience of having a team and enjoying it 697 00:38:43,680 --> 00:38:47,160 Speaker 1: and you know, twenty years ago, and so I don't 698 00:38:47,200 --> 00:38:49,560 Speaker 1: I don't think I fully fully register on me just 699 00:38:49,760 --> 00:38:51,920 Speaker 1: on the excellence I was seeing in front of my 700 00:38:52,040 --> 00:38:54,360 Speaker 1: eyes for so many years. And I won't make that 701 00:38:54,440 --> 00:38:57,520 Speaker 1: same mistake with Luca. And in terms of you know, 702 00:38:57,719 --> 00:39:01,200 Speaker 1: keeping Luca for the next twenty one actually twenty five years, 703 00:39:01,560 --> 00:39:05,600 Speaker 1: you know, with the way medicine and science is going. Yeah, 704 00:39:05,640 --> 00:39:07,840 Speaker 1: you start, you know, you start building those types of 705 00:39:07,920 --> 00:39:12,120 Speaker 1: relationships now because this is a relationship business. And you know, 706 00:39:12,440 --> 00:39:14,920 Speaker 1: I have to understand the goals of every player, and 707 00:39:15,040 --> 00:39:17,640 Speaker 1: some I can help come true and some I can't. 708 00:39:17,760 --> 00:39:21,120 Speaker 1: But you know, the underpinnion is winning. It's really hard 709 00:39:21,200 --> 00:39:24,480 Speaker 1: to leave a team that is doing really well and winning. 710 00:39:25,440 --> 00:39:27,800 Speaker 1: From the outside, mark they look like different I'll just 711 00:39:27,960 --> 00:39:29,640 Speaker 1: throw my opinion out and you can tell me if 712 00:39:29,640 --> 00:39:32,640 Speaker 1: I'm wrong. They look like different people. Luca's a little feistier, 713 00:39:33,040 --> 00:39:38,160 Speaker 1: Luca was greater, younger, Luca has perhaps more domestic star appeal. 714 00:39:39,600 --> 00:39:41,520 Speaker 1: That's what it looks like to me. He's a little 715 00:39:41,600 --> 00:39:44,760 Speaker 1: more mature early, That's what I see. Is that harder 716 00:39:44,840 --> 00:39:47,520 Speaker 1: to manage? Do you think? No, it's different simply because 717 00:39:47,840 --> 00:39:49,239 Speaker 1: you know, even when I got to the MAVs and 718 00:39:49,320 --> 00:39:51,000 Speaker 1: Dirk had been a year and a half in Dallas, 719 00:39:51,360 --> 00:39:54,920 Speaker 1: then there's still language challenges for Dirk. You know, you know, 720 00:39:55,040 --> 00:39:57,640 Speaker 1: he German was his first, second and third language, and 721 00:39:57,960 --> 00:39:59,920 Speaker 1: he had to learn English. He knew something from school, 722 00:40:00,320 --> 00:40:03,200 Speaker 1: but he wasn't comfortable with it. He wasn't comfortable expressing himself, 723 00:40:03,600 --> 00:40:06,560 Speaker 1: you know, and because of that, um, I think he 724 00:40:06,719 --> 00:40:09,560 Speaker 1: held back, whereas Luca is completely confident. He speaks multiple 725 00:40:09,640 --> 00:40:15,160 Speaker 1: languages like it's nothing, Spanish, Serbian, Slovenian, English, you know, 726 00:40:15,280 --> 00:40:17,279 Speaker 1: and you know, maybe every now and then I'll miss 727 00:40:17,320 --> 00:40:19,480 Speaker 1: a word, But so that allows him to be much 728 00:40:19,560 --> 00:40:22,640 Speaker 1: more confident than Dirk was. And then just generally, you know, 729 00:40:22,840 --> 00:40:25,360 Speaker 1: while they both had that same burning desire to be 730 00:40:25,480 --> 00:40:31,200 Speaker 1: the best, I think Dirk Luca, Luca and Dirk are 731 00:40:31,280 --> 00:40:35,439 Speaker 1: similar in that where there's kids, hospitals, people in need, 732 00:40:35,880 --> 00:40:38,439 Speaker 1: they both are there, right there's no question. You don't 733 00:40:38,480 --> 00:40:39,960 Speaker 1: have to ask him, you don't have to force them. 734 00:40:40,280 --> 00:40:43,319 Speaker 1: They voluntarily want to help. That's that's a strong similarity. 735 00:40:44,360 --> 00:40:46,560 Speaker 1: But I do think Luca's just a little bit more 736 00:40:46,960 --> 00:40:49,320 Speaker 1: outgoing at the same age, you know, And maybe a 737 00:40:49,360 --> 00:40:51,279 Speaker 1: lot of that has to do with social media. You know, 738 00:40:51,440 --> 00:40:53,480 Speaker 1: who knows what Dirk would have been like if he 739 00:40:53,640 --> 00:40:56,920 Speaker 1: had ten million Instagram followers or you know, Dirk dancing 740 00:40:57,000 --> 00:40:59,200 Speaker 1: and was on TikTok. You know, it could be a 741 00:40:59,280 --> 00:41:02,840 Speaker 1: whole different ball game. But social media definitely has an impact. 742 00:41:03,040 --> 00:41:05,279 Speaker 1: Because we remember Luca was a star in Europe and 743 00:41:05,560 --> 00:41:07,879 Speaker 1: he had a big following there and so that made 744 00:41:07,920 --> 00:41:17,239 Speaker 1: a big difference as well. That wraps it up for 745 00:41:17,280 --> 00:41:19,080 Speaker 1: the week before heading into another big week here at 746 00:41:19,120 --> 00:41:22,160 Speaker 1: The Volume. Make sure to subscribe and follow us at 747 00:41:22,239 --> 00:41:27,360 Speaker 1: the Volume Sports on Twitter and Instagram. The Volume