WEBVTT - Part Two: The Ballad of Wally George 0:00:02.880 --> 0:00:10.760 What what Robert Evans, this has been Behind the Bastards 0:00:10.920 --> 0:00:15.960 a podcast opened? Are we are? Is that it was 0:00:15.960 --> 0:00:18.640 the whole episode wide. You want to try you want 0:00:18.640 --> 0:00:23.360 to try again. We don't do second takes. The amateur 0:00:23.360 --> 0:00:26.920 operation you run, you might do things like second takes 0:00:26.920 --> 0:00:32.000 and proper introduction, but here we just go what's a 0:00:32.200 --> 0:00:35.000 tonally and then trail off for several seconds of dead 0:00:35.040 --> 0:00:45.280 air like the pros oh Man, that's called cinema veritate. Tom, 0:00:45.320 --> 0:00:49.720 That's how that works. I know what that term meets. What? 0:00:49.720 --> 0:00:53.120 What is? This? Is? This show? What's happening? This is 0:00:53.159 --> 0:00:56.520 Behind the Bastards Episode two on our episode about the 0:00:56.520 --> 0:01:00.720 men who built the right wing media land Escape and 0:01:00.840 --> 0:01:07.280 are consequently ratcheting our world ever closer to calamity. Tom Ryan, 0:01:07.360 --> 0:01:11.200 Robert is your name is of all the Rymans I know, 0:01:11.319 --> 0:01:14.959 certainly the thomast and as the riemannist of the Toms 0:01:14.959 --> 0:01:18.679 that I know? Um, Tom, you are co founder co 0:01:18.840 --> 0:01:22.320 host of the game Fully Unemployed podcast network, which people 0:01:22.880 --> 0:01:25.679 patreon you right for Collider, and you are about to 0:01:25.720 --> 0:01:28.679 listen to a lot of really really unpleasant clips of 0:01:28.800 --> 0:01:31.760 people that are just not very nice. I woke up 0:01:31.800 --> 0:01:34.920 this morning and I was thinking, Man, I hope before 0:01:35.000 --> 0:01:37.080 the sun sets on this day, I get to hear 0:01:37.120 --> 0:01:41.160 a bunch of ship heads have terrible opinions. Tom, I 0:01:41.240 --> 0:01:45.840 heard your prayers. I am here to answer them. I 0:01:45.920 --> 0:01:53.600 texted them to you. Yeah, and it's they're They're usually 0:01:53.640 --> 0:01:58.040 a lot more erotic than this, But I'll take it, Tom. 0:01:58.080 --> 0:02:00.400 It would take years, by some kind. It's more than 0:02:00.440 --> 0:02:03.400 a decade before Joe Pine would have a true successor. 0:02:03.760 --> 0:02:06.280 He was so far ahead of his time that it 0:02:06.320 --> 0:02:08.840 was not until the nineteen eighties he died in nineteen 0:02:08.880 --> 0:02:12.639 seventy that the media landscape was truly ready for someone 0:02:12.680 --> 0:02:16.480 to pick up the torch seems like the wrong word, 0:02:16.639 --> 0:02:23.400 like the word yeah yeah. The first man to follow 0:02:23.400 --> 0:02:26.280 in his wake was Wally George. Have you heard of 0:02:26.320 --> 0:02:29.720 Wally George? No? And I usually I'm usually pretty up 0:02:29.760 --> 0:02:32.400 on my wallis, so yeah, no. No, he's not of 0:02:32.440 --> 0:02:35.640 all the Walies, but one of the most consequential of 0:02:35.720 --> 0:02:40.880 the Wallies. So. George Walter Perch was born on December fourth, 0:02:41.560 --> 0:02:45.760 nineteen thirty one, in Oakland, California. His father owned a 0:02:45.800 --> 0:02:49.240 small shipping company. His mother, Eugenia, had been a vaudeville 0:02:49.240 --> 0:02:52.880 performer and a child actress in Hollywood. She'd started Western's 0:02:52.880 --> 0:02:55.840 opposite cowboy actors whose names have apparently been forgotten to 0:02:55.880 --> 0:02:58.200 time because they were not Val Kilmer and Tombstone so 0:02:58.240 --> 0:03:01.200 who gives a ship? Wally's and most of his childhood 0:03:01.200 --> 0:03:03.280 and Sam Mateo. But when he was in high school 0:03:03.320 --> 0:03:05.880 his parents divorced and his mother moved to Hollywood where 0:03:05.919 --> 0:03:08.519 he finished his education. Tom who is the who is 0:03:08.560 --> 0:03:11.839 the who was the sheriff in Deadwood? Timothy the old fan? Yeah, 0:03:11.840 --> 0:03:14.240 Timothy Oilefant. That's the other one. That's the other cowboy, 0:03:14.320 --> 0:03:17.720 Val Kilmer, Timothy Oilefant. That's all those are the only 0:03:19.040 --> 0:03:24.520 Sam Elliott, Sam Elliott. Yeah, of course Sam Elliott. So, um, 0:03:24.560 --> 0:03:26.880 you're talking about Sam Elliott in in the Hunt for 0:03:26.880 --> 0:03:29.600 Red October because he's honorarily a cowboy, even though he 0:03:29.639 --> 0:03:32.320 never got to live out his Montana dreams. Right. Yeah, 0:03:32.360 --> 0:03:35.360 that's it. That's Sam Neil. That's Sam Neil. Esa Christ, 0:03:35.760 --> 0:03:41.200 Jesus Christ, Jesus Christ, don't do that very different extremely now. 0:03:41.240 --> 0:03:44.120 I'll say this, I'll bet Sam Elliott appreciates ducks too. 0:03:44.480 --> 0:03:46.880 Sam's a duck. That's his best friend. I bet Sam 0:03:46.920 --> 0:03:49.320 Elliott has has loved a duck or two in his life, 0:03:50.920 --> 0:03:53.200 cared for a duck. He looked, those eyes looked like 0:03:53.200 --> 0:03:56.720 a duck is brought at twinkleton or twice. Yeah, Ben, 0:03:56.760 --> 0:03:59.360 you can't smile the way Sam Elliott smiles unless you've 0:03:59.360 --> 0:04:02.119 been friendly with the duck. There's a duck in that life. 0:04:02.160 --> 0:04:04.839 I can tell it's a duck in that man's heart 0:04:04.920 --> 0:04:09.400 was somewhere in there. So Wally spends most of his 0:04:09.480 --> 0:04:12.120 childhood in San Mateo. But when he's in high school, 0:04:12.160 --> 0:04:15.640 his parents divorce, and that's not common in the forties, Right, 0:04:15.640 --> 0:04:18.760 It's got to be a great marriage for that to 0:04:18.800 --> 0:04:21.640 be happening in the forties. Alternatively, maybe it's the two 0:04:21.640 --> 0:04:25.440 parents who are uncommonly aware of how bad a toxic 0:04:26.440 --> 0:04:28.080 union can be for a kid. I don't really know 0:04:28.120 --> 0:04:29.599 what the case was. I'm going to guess it was 0:04:29.600 --> 0:04:33.960 a really unpleasant situation, judging by the probably, I don't think. 0:04:34.000 --> 0:04:36.760 I don't think no fault divorces exist yet existed yet 0:04:36.960 --> 0:04:39.240 in California. So you had to like sue for like 0:04:39.279 --> 0:04:43.080 a reason. Yeah, you had to fistfight a judge to 0:04:43.200 --> 0:04:48.560 get that fight. Yeah. Um, so his mother moves to Hollywood, 0:04:48.720 --> 0:04:51.480 where he finishes his education. He was immediately drawn to 0:04:51.520 --> 0:04:55.920 the entertainment industry, obviously his family's involved in it. Um. 0:04:55.960 --> 0:04:58.359 At age fourteen, he gets a gig working as a 0:04:58.480 --> 0:05:02.600 DJ and an AM radio station in Glendale. Prior to this, 0:05:02.640 --> 0:05:05.240 Wally had been a stutterer, just like Joe Pine. I 0:05:05.320 --> 0:05:07.600 do find that interesting. Both these guys are dudes who 0:05:07.640 --> 0:05:10.799 stutter when their kids. Um. He credits his first radio 0:05:10.839 --> 0:05:13.159 gig with curing him. He kind of like overcomes his 0:05:13.160 --> 0:05:16.520 speech impediment on the job, um, which I did with 0:05:16.560 --> 0:05:20.440 carpal tunnel syndrome. Now. He subsequently worked at bit gigs 0:05:20.520 --> 0:05:23.360 at other local radio stations. He held ambitions to write 0:05:23.400 --> 0:05:25.960 for television, and in his early twenties he did write 0:05:25.960 --> 0:05:32.080 one episode if the TV show Bonanza. Okay, alrighte, good work. 0:05:33.040 --> 0:05:35.599 That's a real TV show. After we listen, after we 0:05:35.640 --> 0:05:37.520 listen to this, after we record this, I'm gonna have 0:05:37.560 --> 0:05:41.200 to go watch that Episode's gonna see if anything pops 0:05:41.200 --> 0:05:44.560 out to me if there's anything problematic about Wally George's 0:05:44.640 --> 0:05:47.960 episode of Bonanza? Is there anything problematic about an episode 0:05:47.960 --> 0:05:51.680 of Bonanza? That's the one. It's the one Bonanza episode 0:05:51.720 --> 0:05:53.799 that in that in the middle has a seven minute 0:05:53.880 --> 0:05:59.960 rant about Martin Luther King Jr. So, Wally got hit 0:06:00.160 --> 0:06:03.599 first radio show, the Wally George Show on Katie Y 0:06:03.760 --> 0:06:06.479 n f M in Inglewood. I was trying to do 0:06:06.560 --> 0:06:10.280 my radio voice for that one came across. Yeah, thank you, Tom. 0:06:10.320 --> 0:06:13.120 I love how not imaginative any of these people are. 0:06:13.200 --> 0:06:16.919 It's always either just the My Name Show or the 0:06:17.200 --> 0:06:20.960 My Name Report or the my Name file. That's the 0:06:21.000 --> 0:06:23.560 only thing they have. Yeah, I think there's a degree 0:06:23.560 --> 0:06:26.400 of it that's just like, look, you're gonna move, as 0:06:26.400 --> 0:06:28.840 we we saw with Joe Pine. It's not uncommon. It's 0:06:28.880 --> 0:06:30.599 just been like a year or less. At most of 0:06:30.600 --> 0:06:32.360 the places you work. You're moving around all the time. 0:06:32.400 --> 0:06:34.599 You're trying to build brand recognition. So at least you 0:06:34.600 --> 0:06:37.520 want people to like know your name. You know um, 0:06:37.560 --> 0:06:39.440 And to be fair, everybody doesn't. They don't say let's 0:06:39.440 --> 0:06:42.440 watch tonight, so the Tonight Show. They say, let's watch Carson, 0:06:42.520 --> 0:06:45.920 let's watch let's watch Harrison, let's watch Leno, let's watch 0:06:46.600 --> 0:06:50.320 Uh No, there's no one else anyone. Yeah, that's it. 0:06:50.320 --> 0:06:54.040 It's done now. Yeah, I mean, I have no animosity 0:06:54.080 --> 0:06:56.880 towards Stephen Colbert, but my god, late night TV is 0:06:56.920 --> 0:07:00.200 just a horrible idea. Um, we should know that, we 0:07:00.200 --> 0:07:02.880 should accept it. It's it's it's it needs to go. 0:07:02.960 --> 0:07:05.200 Craig Ferguson needs to be allowed to take it out 0:07:05.240 --> 0:07:09.360 behind a barn and shoot it. That that's who should 0:07:09.400 --> 0:07:14.480 do it. Craig crying like the boy and old yellers 0:07:14.560 --> 0:07:24.080 and loads of shotgun's shotgun and did you so? He 0:07:24.120 --> 0:07:26.280 gets his first show in nineteen sixty nine, which is 0:07:26.320 --> 0:07:28.840 the year before Joe Pine dies. Um, and yeah, he 0:07:28.840 --> 0:07:30.560 goes through, you know, he does, like they all do. 0:07:30.680 --> 0:07:33.120 He runs through like a series of shows on different networks. 0:07:33.120 --> 0:07:36.600 He produces and co hosts talk radio programs one with 0:07:36.800 --> 0:07:40.280 l A's then mayor Sam Yourty for like nearly a decade. Um, 0:07:40.320 --> 0:07:42.600 so he's in like talk radio for a while, but 0:07:42.680 --> 0:07:46.040 kind of a respectable turn of talk radio. Um. He 0:07:46.120 --> 0:07:48.960 starts his own radio show and it does well enough 0:07:49.000 --> 0:07:51.280 that he's able to Uh. In nineteen seventy nine, he 0:07:51.320 --> 0:07:53.960 starts his own talk radio show again. Um, and this 0:07:54.000 --> 0:07:55.800 one does well enough that he's able to launch his 0:07:55.840 --> 0:07:58.680 own TV show off of it, called hot Seat, which 0:07:58.720 --> 0:08:02.080 first airs in nineteen eighty three. And an independent radio 0:08:02.120 --> 0:08:06.200 station in Anaheim, California. Three is a year before Rush 0:08:06.320 --> 0:08:09.760 Limboss started his first political radio show UM and a 0:08:09.840 --> 0:08:12.320 decade before the first episode of the Jerry Springer Show. 0:08:12.360 --> 0:08:16.720 In nineteen Hot Seat with Wally George would include elements 0:08:16.800 --> 0:08:19.280 from both of these later shows. From an article in 0:08:19.360 --> 0:08:21.920 Timeline Quote, George had a way of rilling even the 0:08:21.920 --> 0:08:25.080 most collected and intelligent guests. In his first year, for instance, 0:08:25.120 --> 0:08:27.360 George invited then a c l U lawyer and later 0:08:27.440 --> 0:08:30.600 journalist Jeff Cohen to talk about police brutality and surveillance 0:08:30.640 --> 0:08:34.720 of lawful, politically motivated organizations. At first, Cohen's responses to 0:08:34.800 --> 0:08:37.000 questions like why do you want to handcuff the police 0:08:37.040 --> 0:08:40.840 department from catching criminals seemed prepared, choreographed, But after a 0:08:40.840 --> 0:08:43.640 few minutes the interview intensifies. Both raised their voices, the 0:08:43.679 --> 0:08:47.600 audience clatters and gesticulates. George interjects with an age old challenge, 0:08:47.800 --> 0:08:49.480 I have nothing to hide, so what do I care 0:08:49.480 --> 0:08:52.600 if police watch me? The audience braise with joy. But 0:08:52.720 --> 0:08:56.160 for all his cruel, bravado and personal attacks, George consistently 0:08:56.240 --> 0:08:58.839 stumbled when the tables were turned. His ideology was full 0:08:58.840 --> 0:09:01.760 of contradictions. In one episode, he spits, I say, Martin 0:09:01.840 --> 0:09:04.440 Luther King does not deserve a national holiday in his name. 0:09:04.600 --> 0:09:06.520 There are many more Americans who deserve it a heck 0:09:06.520 --> 0:09:08.960 of a lot more so. That's the kind of guy 0:09:09.000 --> 0:09:12.120 he is. We're no longer like the genteel playing it 0:09:12.200 --> 0:09:15.439 being polite kind of guy. Um. He's He's very much 0:09:15.480 --> 0:09:20.400 a recognizable sort of right wing media figure. Yeah. Keeps 0:09:20.480 --> 0:09:25.640 keeping it authentically asshole. Yeah, keeping it authentically asshole. Um. 0:09:25.640 --> 0:09:27.920 In November of nineteen eighty three, while he earned his 0:09:28.000 --> 0:09:31.120 first national news story when he's so irritated his guest 0:09:31.160 --> 0:09:35.360 Blaze bond Pain, a pacifist in Human Rights Act rules. 0:09:35.600 --> 0:09:37.960 That is a good name right now. The short version 0:09:37.960 --> 0:09:40.920 of the stories that Blaze got angry and flipped Wally's desk. 0:09:41.000 --> 0:09:44.640 He had to be escorted out by security. That sounds 0:09:44.760 --> 0:09:47.440 like something a person named Blaze would do. It does 0:09:47.520 --> 0:09:49.839 it does because he's a Blaze man. He's full of fire. 0:09:49.960 --> 0:09:53.280 Sounds like an American clamator. It's gonna flip pacifically like 0:09:53.760 --> 0:09:56.480 while he gets like a pacifist activist to flip his 0:09:56.520 --> 0:10:00.280 desk on TV desk never really happened before? Is like 0:10:00.320 --> 0:10:02.840 a huge deal, Like this is the first Horoldo getting 0:10:02.920 --> 0:10:05.960 hit with a fucking share you know. Um God, what 0:10:06.000 --> 0:10:08.480 a great moment that was. I found an interview with 0:10:08.559 --> 0:10:11.040 Blaze that sheds more light on this incident and what 0:10:11.160 --> 0:10:13.760 came after. Because this incident really like you could draw 0:10:13.800 --> 0:10:16.360 a direct line from this to Jerry Springer. I'm sorry, 0:10:16.360 --> 0:10:21.560 what year was this again? This is er starts, um, 0:10:22.080 --> 0:10:25.280 and this is really like this, this, this chunk I'm 0:10:25.280 --> 0:10:27.160 gonna read is interesting because it gives you. It gives 0:10:27.200 --> 0:10:28.880 you a sense of the way in which Wally is 0:10:28.880 --> 0:10:30.760 helping to give birth to not just the cultural space 0:10:30.760 --> 0:10:33.400 that guys like Jerry Springer occupied, but like what reality 0:10:33.440 --> 0:10:36.760 TV becomes. Um, So this is him. This is Blaze 0:10:36.760 --> 0:10:39.120 talking about what happened after he flips that desk and 0:10:39.120 --> 0:10:42.120 gets escorted off by security. Quote. He called me this 0:10:42.160 --> 0:10:43.960 had to be nineteen eighty three and asked if I 0:10:43.960 --> 0:10:45.880 could come on his program. It was right during Reagan's 0:10:45.880 --> 0:10:48.760 Warren Grenada. In a phone conversation, he seemed just delightful. 0:10:48.800 --> 0:10:50.760 I was in the background listening to his interviews just 0:10:50.800 --> 0:10:53.400 before me, a Mexican American attorney, and Wally was just 0:10:53.440 --> 0:10:55.520 insulting him with racial slurs and so on, and I 0:10:55.559 --> 0:10:57.920 was quite irritated just hearing him operate. When it was 0:10:57.960 --> 0:10:59.400 my turn, I went to the interview and he had 0:10:59.440 --> 0:11:01.240 a large group of young people in the audience, and 0:11:01.280 --> 0:11:03.160 just as he was getting started, I torn towards the 0:11:03.200 --> 0:11:05.280 audience and I said, I hope you won't go and 0:11:05.320 --> 0:11:07.520 die as the enemy in a place like Grenado where 0:11:07.559 --> 0:11:09.560 you're not wanted. He got a little upset when I 0:11:09.559 --> 0:11:11.560 made that comment. He came over and assaulted me and 0:11:11.600 --> 0:11:13.679 battered me. He attacked me from behind. It was a 0:11:13.679 --> 0:11:16.240 little difficult for a long standing boxer to not respond, 0:11:16.280 --> 0:11:17.959 but I thought that would be a terrible thing to do. 0:11:18.320 --> 0:11:20.000 So I looked at his desk and I saw there 0:11:20.040 --> 0:11:21.480 was no one near it and no one that would 0:11:21.480 --> 0:11:23.240 be harmed. So I just flipped the desk over and 0:11:23.240 --> 0:11:25.480 walked out. I came home and I told my wife 0:11:25.520 --> 0:11:27.960 and children how surprised I was, and within moments we 0:11:27.960 --> 0:11:30.760 saw it on ABC, CBS, NBC. It was all over 0:11:30.800 --> 0:11:33.240 the country. I think that particular episode had has been 0:11:33.280 --> 0:11:36.319 played a thousand times across the country. I still see it. 0:11:36.320 --> 0:11:38.959 It's amazing how it made an impact on TV. There 0:11:39.040 --> 0:11:41.959 was no staging. However, after the security men ushered me 0:11:42.000 --> 0:11:44.240 to my car, I went home and the following morning, 0:11:44.400 --> 0:11:47.360 Wally called me and said, Blaze, we have a terrific 0:11:47.400 --> 0:11:49.920 thing going here. We can do this all over the country. 0:11:50.280 --> 0:11:52.720 I said, Wally, you're a charlatan and there will be 0:11:52.760 --> 0:11:56.400 no further interviews, thank you. Wally doesn't believe in shit. 0:11:57.600 --> 0:12:00.240 Wal Wally is just like, yeah, I'll bring this. I like, 0:12:00.240 --> 0:12:01.760 I want him to throw ship. I want to like, 0:12:01.800 --> 0:12:03.640 this is great TV. So that's more of the thing 0:12:03.679 --> 0:12:07.120 that I was talking about last episode, where it's like, 0:12:07.240 --> 0:12:09.120 is he genuinely getting pulled in this direction or is 0:12:09.120 --> 0:12:10.800 he getting pulled in this direction because like this is 0:12:10.840 --> 0:12:14.240 make this makes good TV? And Yeah, that's like the 0:12:14.320 --> 0:12:16.360 guiding light of a lot of these chuds is that 0:12:16.400 --> 0:12:19.160 they don't actually believe in a lot of things. If anything, 0:12:19.200 --> 0:12:21.640 I just believe in whatever gets them the money, gets 0:12:21.640 --> 0:12:24.400 in the attention. I think Joe Pine might have believed 0:12:24.440 --> 0:12:27.920 in things. He certainly fought for something at one point. Um. 0:12:28.200 --> 0:12:32.640 I Wally clearly doesn't like he's just happy to like yeah, um, 0:12:32.800 --> 0:12:35.560 like the next day, like it was a pro wrestling match, 0:12:36.080 --> 0:12:38.079 Yeah exactly, Like, yeah, we can do this, all of it, 0:12:38.120 --> 0:12:39.760 and you can tear the country. So what the funk 0:12:39.800 --> 0:12:42.880 are you talking about? Joe Pine is like not a 0:12:42.920 --> 0:12:46.679 good person, not a nice person, pretty racist and bigot, 0:12:46.679 --> 0:12:47.959 and I'm sure in a lot of ways, although I 0:12:48.200 --> 0:12:51.480 doubt excessively for his time UM, which is not saying 0:12:51.480 --> 0:12:53.960 anything good about him. It's talking about like the white 0:12:54.040 --> 0:12:56.840 dudes in the nineteen sixties and his generation. We're pretty 0:12:56.840 --> 0:12:59.800 fucking racist. But I don't think I wouldn't qualify him 0:12:59.840 --> 0:13:02.760 as a bastard based on like the things he intentionally did. 0:13:03.000 --> 0:13:05.600 Once we're at Wally George, We're we're in like the 0:13:06.040 --> 0:13:09.719 like full bastard territory, like sweat, because Joe Paine is 0:13:09.760 --> 0:13:11.960 a guy who's like willing to do things and like 0:13:12.160 --> 0:13:15.040 drudge up, judge up controversy, but also can listen to 0:13:15.080 --> 0:13:18.560 people and like has something he believes in UM and 0:13:18.679 --> 0:13:21.160 is trying to get across with Wally George. It is 0:13:21.240 --> 0:13:24.679 pure I'm into this right wing ship just for because 0:13:24.720 --> 0:13:27.120 it's what it gets the rage views, it gets people angry, 0:13:27.160 --> 0:13:28.800 gets people riled up. I don't care who I have 0:13:28.920 --> 0:13:30.960 on I want folks to fight. I just want to 0:13:30.960 --> 0:13:34.120 like tickle people's amygdala and make them angry. You know, 0:13:34.360 --> 0:13:37.839 does he start selling brain pills forever? No? No, he's 0:13:37.880 --> 0:13:39.640 not not to mine. O. Well, I don't know. Maybe 0:13:39.720 --> 0:13:43.440 I I can't comprehensively say he never sold brain pills. Um, 0:13:43.640 --> 0:13:46.920 I I cannot make that claim to a point of certainty. 0:13:46.920 --> 0:13:52.439 Tom excited that that, like Alex Jones and like a 0:13:52.480 --> 0:13:54.600 lot of the folks who came after, Wally George built 0:13:54.600 --> 0:13:57.480 an audience that was cult like in its devotion. By 0:13:57.559 --> 0:14:00.360 nineteen eighty four, an audience of mostly college age men 0:14:00.400 --> 0:14:02.480 were waiting up to six months for their chance to 0:14:02.480 --> 0:14:05.000 sit in his eight person studio audience. People would like 0:14:05.440 --> 0:14:08.120 sign up for this ship way ahead of time. They'd 0:14:08.120 --> 0:14:12.240 shout who and wear shirts with American flags on them, 0:14:12.360 --> 0:14:15.600 roaring until he forced them to stop. Where Joe Pine 0:14:15.640 --> 0:14:17.640 could be mocking and even cruel, as long as he 0:14:17.679 --> 0:14:21.000 maintained an air of genteel politeness, Wally George was free 0:14:21.040 --> 0:14:23.800 to scream, shout, and even strike people. He told one 0:14:23.800 --> 0:14:26.800 interviewer in nineteen eighty four. They say that I'm a lunatic, 0:14:26.840 --> 0:14:28.520 that I'm a maniac. But why do you have to 0:14:28.560 --> 0:14:30.600 smile at your guests and be nice and let them 0:14:30.600 --> 0:14:33.440 say what they want to say. In this, Wally completed 0:14:33.440 --> 0:14:36.280 the transition from Joe Pine, a right wing firebrand whose 0:14:36.280 --> 0:14:38.760 work was still firmly rooted in the outward civility of 0:14:38.800 --> 0:14:42.320 the nineteen fifties, to modern right wing media. Wally would 0:14:42.360 --> 0:14:44.840 not sit and listen to, for example, a trans woman 0:14:44.880 --> 0:14:47.680 explaining her life. He had no interest in letting guests 0:14:47.720 --> 0:14:50.440 say their peace. The central conceit of his show was 0:14:50.480 --> 0:14:52.360 that left leaning guests would be allowed to show up 0:14:52.360 --> 0:14:54.320 and try to make an argument, while Wally and his 0:14:54.360 --> 0:14:57.320 audience harassed and assaulted them. I want to play this 0:14:57.400 --> 0:14:59.800 segment from his show where he is a popular radio 0:14:59.880 --> 0:15:02.240 d e j A on the DJ brings you two 0:15:02.320 --> 0:15:04.640 albums to hand out to the audience. It was nineteen 0:15:05.000 --> 0:15:09.040 four and he chastise and he chastises Wally for having 0:15:09.080 --> 0:15:12.280 previously claimed the band were devil worshippers, which is an 0:15:12.360 --> 0:15:15.640 argument Wally George made a number of times. Here's Wally's reply. 0:15:16.000 --> 0:15:18.640 You said, you two a bunch of devil worships. They 0:15:18.640 --> 0:15:21.920 are terrible that Christians three of the four that Chris, 0:15:22.040 --> 0:15:27.800 you're saying, I'm wrong, You're wrong. Wally is never my God. 0:15:28.240 --> 0:15:30.640 That's what he looks like to me, I don't want 0:15:30.640 --> 0:15:33.160 any proof because he looks like Rick Flair with a 0:15:33.240 --> 0:15:40.480 person balance getting we're getting one of the same time. 0:15:40.760 --> 0:15:46.840 It looks like cracking down on what they call radio 0:15:47.520 --> 0:15:51.680 shock radio. And I say it's about time. I say 0:15:51.760 --> 0:15:54.560 the f c C should crack down. There's a lot 0:15:54.600 --> 0:15:59.600 of nonstance, a lot of really filth and sexual innuendo 0:15:59.800 --> 0:16:02.440 that little kids you're listening to. And I say, it's 0:16:02.440 --> 0:16:06.040 about time at the FCC cracked down on these filthy 0:16:06.320 --> 0:16:11.720 radio stations. All right, all right, that's enough of this clip. 0:16:12.840 --> 0:16:18.240 So first off, he looks incredible. It looks incredible. He 0:16:19.040 --> 0:16:24.400 looks the amazing thing about Wally looks like a carnival magician. 0:16:24.600 --> 0:16:27.280 You you watch, he looks like a guy that ties 0:16:27.320 --> 0:16:35.160 balloon animals. You watched thirty seconds of Wally George, and 0:16:35.400 --> 0:16:38.760 every fake media figure from a Paul Verhoeven movie in 0:16:38.800 --> 0:16:42.320 the nineteen nineties suddenly make because they're all him. They're 0:16:42.360 --> 0:16:45.640 all Wally George. Like every media figure that like Gott 0:16:45.760 --> 0:16:49.280 mocked in one of those like surreal nineties movies is 0:16:49.320 --> 0:16:52.920 fucking Wally George. He looks like Julian Sands as a 0:16:52.960 --> 0:16:59.880 TV preacher. He looks like if Julian sanj was a warlock. Yes, yes, 0:17:00.400 --> 0:17:04.680 if a vampire bits Julian a Sanja's neck, he would tear. 0:17:07.480 --> 0:17:10.840 It's incredible. He's in. For those of you who are 0:17:10.920 --> 0:17:12.920 going to look at the picture. He has like shoulder 0:17:13.040 --> 0:17:18.000 length white hair that can't be real. It's it's either 0:17:18.160 --> 0:17:22.320 a wig or like so flat ironed that it just there. 0:17:22.680 --> 0:17:25.480 Like he's got a white suit. He looks like Mr 0:17:25.600 --> 0:17:28.920 White from the Venture Brothers, but not at I'll bite. 0:17:32.720 --> 0:17:38.520 It's just an amazing, amazing commitment to a very specific aesthetic. Yeah, 0:17:39.200 --> 0:17:41.119 he's like, this is my thing and I'm just gonna 0:17:41.400 --> 0:17:45.960 blunt forced the nineteen eighties. A third of my body 0:17:46.000 --> 0:17:49.600 weight is cocaine. It's he's he does. He looks like 0:17:49.680 --> 0:17:52.280 somebody like he looks like the Shredder dumped Mutagen on 0:17:52.440 --> 0:17:56.240 the Pilot cocaine. Yeah, like that Ian was a man. 0:17:56.640 --> 0:18:03.640 That's so tom Yeah. Here's him talking to Larry Rice, 0:18:03.760 --> 0:18:07.000 a same sex marriage advocate and an AIDS awareness activist. 0:18:07.119 --> 0:18:17.640 Oh boy hooraye a gay pride parade. I say it 0:18:17.080 --> 0:18:21.560 is very offensive. It is very offensive for gays to 0:18:21.640 --> 0:18:25.080 be running around or groping each other in the park. 0:18:25.240 --> 0:18:29.560 What do you think about that? I don't think I 0:18:29.600 --> 0:18:31.960 don't think that. I don't think it's very fair for 0:18:32.000 --> 0:18:35.520 you to make fun of people who's whose lifestyle is 0:18:35.520 --> 0:18:37.399 not the way you want it to be. And I 0:18:37.440 --> 0:18:40.240 think it's all it really. I think it's kind of sad, 0:18:40.600 --> 0:18:43.920 you know, because like they don't hurt you what they do. 0:18:44.280 --> 0:18:47.480 And you know, I'm down offense that you stupid, that 0:18:47.800 --> 0:18:55.240 it's offensive and offensive. It's a lot fair, I'll tell 0:18:55.280 --> 0:18:58.760 you what, because people like you, you're the people because 0:18:58.840 --> 0:19:07.240 the problem people people who are gay. People who are gay, 0:19:07.600 --> 0:19:14.199 they do very rough. They have it very rough in 0:19:14.240 --> 0:19:16.959 this world, okay, because of people like you, And I 0:19:17.000 --> 0:19:23.159 think this is very upset. I think that will make 0:19:23.200 --> 0:19:25.199 it so hard for them to live that they have 0:19:25.320 --> 0:19:28.840 a lot of like mental disorders and things. All right, 0:19:29.000 --> 0:19:32.720 that's probably about enough of That's it's man, If you 0:19:32.800 --> 0:19:36.960 guys listening can stomach looking up this clip, it's an 0:19:38.160 --> 0:19:43.200 it's horrible his audience and they're just like huge nothing 0:19:43.280 --> 0:19:48.400 but high school bullies, like screaming with He's said it's horrible. 0:19:48.560 --> 0:19:50.360 He's just trying to get his point out, and he's 0:19:50.359 --> 0:19:53.879 saying like this these completely rational things. Oh my god. 0:19:54.080 --> 0:19:55.439 But it's also one of these a couple of things 0:19:55.480 --> 0:19:57.720 that are interesting. Comparing Pine. Number one, you can think 0:19:57.720 --> 0:19:59.720 back to Joe Pine, who gain I'm certain how very 0:19:59.720 --> 0:20:03.159 regret restI views on on gay people, but asking with 0:20:03.240 --> 0:20:05.439 genuine interest. Oh so someone who is a who's a 0:20:05.440 --> 0:20:08.159 transvestor isn't necessarily a homosexual. Oh that's interesting to me, 0:20:08.200 --> 0:20:11.119 as opposed to Wally George, who just starts screaming at 0:20:11.119 --> 0:20:13.760 how offensive like the thought of a gay person existing. 0:20:13.800 --> 0:20:16.720 It's like his with his flaxen shoulder length, fair and 0:20:16.840 --> 0:20:20.440 long sleeved turtleneck with a blazer, and he's screaming about 0:20:20.440 --> 0:20:24.760 how gay Pride parade is offensive. Roger Stone vibes. Yeah, 0:20:24.800 --> 0:20:31.520 he definitely has that Roger Stone would wear. He does 0:20:31.600 --> 0:20:37.520 look like a disguise in a Bond villain wig. Yeah. Um. 0:20:37.560 --> 0:20:39.320 And the other thing that's different is that, you know, 0:20:39.400 --> 0:20:42.440 Joe Pine could be We played him being very rude 0:20:42.440 --> 0:20:44.640 to some people, but also they were all people who 0:20:44.640 --> 0:20:47.480 could go toe to toe with him rhetorically, like Krassner. 0:20:47.640 --> 0:20:50.760 You know, obviously he didn't respect Krastner's media trained Krassner 0:20:50.840 --> 0:20:53.120 was ready for what he got. You know he gave 0:20:53.160 --> 0:20:55.600 as good as he got. This poor man Larry Rice. 0:20:55.720 --> 0:20:58.520 Nothing against him because he's saying very reasonable things. He's 0:20:58.560 --> 0:21:01.600 clearly not media trained. He's not, really he's not, and 0:21:01.640 --> 0:21:04.119 he's so you can say against him. The clip is 0:21:04.200 --> 0:21:07.160 so upsetting because you can see it, like it's part 0:21:07.200 --> 0:21:09.760 of why, it's part of like the bad faith of 0:21:09.840 --> 0:21:13.720 like debate me, because the tactic is just to keep 0:21:13.840 --> 0:21:17.760 shouting at you these things to keep you off topic. 0:21:17.840 --> 0:21:19.879 And it's like, not only is this guy battling this 0:21:20.040 --> 0:21:24.159 overbearing dipshit of a host, but the entire audience is 0:21:24.320 --> 0:21:27.480 jeering at him the whole time. It's like, I can't 0:21:27.520 --> 0:21:30.560 imagine being in that, like even if you are media trained, 0:21:30.640 --> 0:21:32.359 like even if you are media trained, being in that 0:21:32.440 --> 0:21:36.440 situations like Jesus, like, I can't. I can't find footing 0:21:36.480 --> 0:21:39.360 to even make my argument. No one can do well 0:21:39.359 --> 0:21:42.080 in that kind of an environment. But no, And it's again, 0:21:42.080 --> 0:21:43.920 it's one of those things. I do think that like 0:21:44.440 --> 0:21:46.840 Joe Pine was someone who did want to debate people 0:21:46.880 --> 0:21:48.440 and would debate people and would go out of his 0:21:48.480 --> 0:21:52.119 way to get people who he who could present themselves 0:21:52.119 --> 0:21:55.080 well on television, even if what they were saying was like, 0:21:55.160 --> 0:21:57.280 and I'm not gonna say that maybe this was comprehensibly 0:21:57.280 --> 0:21:59.600 true of everything he did, but all of Wally George 0:21:59.640 --> 0:22:02.880 is like it is nothing, but but this is it's 0:22:02.960 --> 0:22:05.200 just hate. I want to point out that his little 0:22:05.200 --> 0:22:07.840 turtleneck matched the wallpaper of his set. It did it. 0:22:08.760 --> 0:22:11.080 He's got He's got a little behind him is a 0:22:11.119 --> 0:22:14.160 framed photo of of of a Space shuttle taking off. 0:22:14.160 --> 0:22:17.680