WEBVTT - Linda Perry 0:00:08.360 --> 0:00:13.640 Pushkin. Just a quick note here. You can listen to 0:00:13.680 --> 0:00:16.560 all of the music mentioned in this episode on our playlist, 0:00:16.640 --> 0:00:18.720 which you can find a link to in the show 0:00:18.760 --> 0:00:22.439 notes for licensing reasons. Each time a song is referenced 0:00:22.480 --> 0:00:27.720 in this episode, you'll hear this sound effect all right, 0:00:28.360 --> 0:00:32.240 enjoy the episode. You know, when you're on stage live 0:00:33.280 --> 0:00:35.800 and there's that whole crowd out there, there's a whole 0:00:35.880 --> 0:00:39.920 other adrenaline we're vibing off of. We're playing with Dolly 0:00:40.000 --> 0:00:43.559 fucking Parton at the Grammys. You got to be in 0:00:43.600 --> 0:00:47.920 the moment, man, Linda Perry. If you don't immediately recognize 0:00:47.960 --> 0:00:52.839 the name, you'll know her songs. That last one was 0:00:52.880 --> 0:00:55.280 a huge hit in the nineteen nineties for Linda's group 0:00:55.440 --> 0:00:58.840 Four Non Blondes. She's since become one of the most 0:00:58.840 --> 0:01:02.600 sought after songwriters and one of the only women considered 0:01:02.600 --> 0:01:05.600 a go to producer in the business. She's worked with 0:01:05.600 --> 0:01:11.440 Alicia Keys, Gwen Stefani, Celine dion Adele, and she reinvented 0:01:11.440 --> 0:01:14.960 the careers of Pink and Christina Aguilera. I met Linda 0:01:15.040 --> 0:01:17.039 North Hollywood at the first hout she ever bought in 0:01:17.200 --> 0:01:21.040 La She since transformed it into a beautiful recording studio. 0:01:21.360 --> 0:01:24.520 It's one of the most inviting creative spaces I've ever 0:01:24.560 --> 0:01:27.199 been in. When we met that day, I thought I'd 0:01:27.200 --> 0:01:31.600 be talking to someone obsessed with writing and producing hits. 0:01:31.720 --> 0:01:35.960 I couldn't have been more wrong. The level of songwriting 0:01:37.040 --> 0:01:40.479 is so low right now. I mean, do you think 0:01:40.480 --> 0:01:42.800 it's lower than it's been in the past. It's to 0:01:42.920 --> 0:01:47.080 me the worst it's ever been because everything. When you 0:01:47.160 --> 0:01:52.680 have Sony ATV and all these companies signing songwriters that 0:01:52.720 --> 0:01:55.559 have absolutely that never actually wrote a whole entire song 0:01:55.600 --> 0:01:58.560 by themselves, but they wrote a third of a top line, 0:01:59.320 --> 0:02:02.320 there's just something not right about that. It turns out 0:02:02.360 --> 0:02:05.320 Linda Perry, who's responsible for so many hits over the 0:02:05.360 --> 0:02:09.640 past two decades, isn't interested in manufactured pop, but in 0:02:09.680 --> 0:02:14.560 creating deep, impactful songs that will last. I'm Bruce Headlam 0:02:14.720 --> 0:02:38.680 and this is broken record. So we're talking to you 0:02:38.720 --> 0:02:42.839 today for many many reasons. One is that you were 0:02:43.760 --> 0:02:47.320 nominated for Producer of the Year at the Grammys this year. 0:02:48.120 --> 0:02:52.640 What amazed me was you hadn't been nominated before. Were 0:02:52.680 --> 0:02:58.160 you surprised when you were nominated? Unfortunately, I expected it 0:02:58.280 --> 0:03:02.040 because of the conditions of the world, because it's like, 0:03:02.040 --> 0:03:06.399 why didn't I get nominated before? Like why this one? 0:03:06.880 --> 0:03:10.480 And the fact that the last time that was And 0:03:10.520 --> 0:03:13.800 I could get this wrong so you can fact check me, 0:03:14.280 --> 0:03:17.399 but I believe the person who did get the last 0:03:17.560 --> 0:03:22.400 nomination that was a female was Lauren Christy, but she 0:03:22.639 --> 0:03:25.120 was part of a team that had two guys in it, 0:03:25.480 --> 0:03:28.720 so it was the matrix got the nomination. She happened 0:03:28.760 --> 0:03:31.160 to be in the matrix, so it's not that she 0:03:31.400 --> 0:03:35.200 got it solely, but it was her and two other guys. 0:03:35.520 --> 0:03:38.560 But the fact that the Grammys have been was it 0:03:38.600 --> 0:03:42.280 sixty three years? Yeah, something like that that a woman 0:03:42.320 --> 0:03:47.200 has never won is a bigger situation to me. Sod 0:03:47.360 --> 0:03:51.240 and rarely been nominated. So people should be eligible and 0:03:51.560 --> 0:03:56.280 represented because they're good, not because of who they are. 0:03:57.440 --> 0:03:59.560 And that's just where I just want life to get to. 0:03:59.800 --> 0:04:02.480 It's it's like, right now we're in a place like 0:04:02.720 --> 0:04:05.760 are we really choosing the best people for the job, 0:04:06.520 --> 0:04:10.160 or are we choosing them because we need this race 0:04:10.600 --> 0:04:15.160 or gender or diversity. And That's where I'm waiting to 0:04:15.200 --> 0:04:19.039 get out of because it's I want just people to 0:04:19.120 --> 0:04:22.479 know that they're just chosen because they're great. I mean, 0:04:22.520 --> 0:04:25.719 that's at issue, and that's the criticism a lot of 0:04:25.800 --> 0:04:29.000 forms of affirmative action and all kinds of things. Do 0:04:29.040 --> 0:04:32.960 you have to go through a period where necessarily something 0:04:33.040 --> 0:04:35.320 like the Academy says, yes, we have to honor women 0:04:35.440 --> 0:04:37.440 until you get to that business. That's what I'm trying 0:04:37.480 --> 0:04:39.599 to say. It's like, I'm waiting for this period to 0:04:39.600 --> 0:04:43.120 be over right now, right, so we can just we 0:04:43.200 --> 0:04:46.640 all got the information, the cats out of the bag, 0:04:47.720 --> 0:04:50.640 the bad guys have been pointed out at now let's 0:04:50.680 --> 0:04:55.359 move forward, yeah, to the real stuff. And I don't 0:04:55.440 --> 0:04:59.400 want to ever be honored for something that I don't 0:04:59.440 --> 0:05:03.760 deserve only because I wear cool hats and I'm a chick, 0:05:04.520 --> 0:05:08.600 you know. I want to earn and know that I 0:05:09.520 --> 0:05:12.800 got chosen because I am great at what I do, 0:05:12.880 --> 0:05:15.320 and I do believe that. But I don't ever want 0:05:15.360 --> 0:05:18.440 it to be a question to everybody else. But you've 0:05:18.440 --> 0:05:22.640 been great at what you do for a fairly long time. Yeah, 0:05:22.680 --> 0:05:25.479 and there weren't times in the past you thought what 0:05:25.560 --> 0:05:27.560 do I have to do here? Yeah? You know, I 0:05:27.680 --> 0:05:33.560 just don't operate that way. Like I've sold millions of records, 0:05:33.880 --> 0:05:37.520 I've have awards. Do you see anything in the studio 0:05:37.760 --> 0:05:42.280 that represents a plaque and an award? No, in your 0:05:42.320 --> 0:05:44.520 won't find it anywhere. You won't find it in the bathroom. 0:05:44.520 --> 0:05:47.840 You won't find it hidden in the closet, you won't 0:05:47.839 --> 0:05:50.520 find it in the garage. It's just not who I am. 0:05:50.760 --> 0:05:57.400 I don't base my beliefs on how people see me, 0:05:58.320 --> 0:06:03.279 or by a trophy or a plaque or being honored. 0:06:03.360 --> 0:06:07.440 I've never so it slips my mind. You know. My 0:06:07.560 --> 0:06:11.120 intention is always to just be the best that I 0:06:11.200 --> 0:06:15.760 possibly can. If my intention was ever I want to 0:06:15.800 --> 0:06:19.840 be I want to win that, then I have a 0:06:19.880 --> 0:06:23.120 personal problem with myself. One of the people who walked 0:06:23.160 --> 0:06:26.919 through the door recently in this beautiful house turned studio 0:06:27.800 --> 0:06:33.599 was Dolly Parton. And you hadn't done country music before. 0:06:34.120 --> 0:06:38.239 I don't think did you have a love of country music? 0:06:38.440 --> 0:06:44.280 Or my ego wanted to take over Nashville about twelve 0:06:44.320 --> 0:06:47.320 years ago. Nashville was not having it, and they threw 0:06:47.360 --> 0:06:50.520 me out the door. I have an obsession with Nashville. 0:06:51.640 --> 0:06:55.599 I've always felt that Nashville needed me, and I wanted 0:06:55.600 --> 0:06:57.400 to go in there and I wanted to find the 0:06:57.440 --> 0:07:00.800 Patsy Clins. I wanted to find the Willie Nelson's. I 0:07:00.839 --> 0:07:06.880 wanted to find Roy and Johnny and Loretta, Like, where's that. 0:07:07.920 --> 0:07:13.240 Why isn't that, you know, happening right now? Where's those dark, 0:07:13.560 --> 0:07:19.760 brooding country stars that told these incredible stories. It's like 0:07:19.800 --> 0:07:23.440 it all just sounds like, let's think of something that 0:07:23.840 --> 0:07:27.360 sounds like beer bottles and Jack Daniels, you know, or whatever. 0:07:28.400 --> 0:07:32.320 And to me, that's it's like taking the jazz out 0:07:32.360 --> 0:07:36.560 of jazz. So country music to me, I was brought 0:07:36.640 --> 0:07:40.280 up and my father loved country music, country music and 0:07:40.400 --> 0:07:45.120 Frank Sinatra, so it's it's in my I mean, I 0:07:45.120 --> 0:07:47.360 can write, I can write, I can go be country 0:07:47.440 --> 0:07:50.240 if I wanted to, I make a whole country album. 0:07:50.280 --> 0:07:56.240 It's in me somehow. So that didn't work out, And okakay, 0:07:56.280 --> 0:07:58.680 tell me how you said your ego try to take over. Well, 0:07:58.720 --> 0:08:00.360 I went to go. I went out there to work 0:08:00.400 --> 0:08:03.640 with Faith Hill, and I wrote some really great songs 0:08:03.640 --> 0:08:05.720 for her. One was like a gospel and one was 0:08:05.760 --> 0:08:09.679 a great country song, and she was over the moon. 0:08:10.600 --> 0:08:13.440 Basically as soon as I left the studio in the car, 0:08:13.560 --> 0:08:16.720 her manager called my manager at the time and said, 0:08:16.840 --> 0:08:19.280 you know these songs will never see the light of day. 0:08:19.800 --> 0:08:22.320 They're not going to go on any faith Hill record, 0:08:22.800 --> 0:08:26.040 Like it was crazy. And then I guess people were 0:08:26.120 --> 0:08:31.480 upset at her for bringing an outsider, so it was 0:08:31.600 --> 0:08:36.400 just obviously not a good fit for me. And then 0:08:36.520 --> 0:08:39.160 so the fact that when this all full circle came 0:08:39.200 --> 0:08:43.640 back around what ten twelve years later, and I'm getting 0:08:43.640 --> 0:08:48.760 an opportunity to go work with Dolly Parton, I was like, fuck, yes, 0:08:49.000 --> 0:08:52.120 you know. I told the music supervisor Buck Damon, like, 0:08:52.160 --> 0:08:54.800 don't you dare go hire anybody else. I am the 0:08:54.920 --> 0:08:58.000 right person for this job. And then because there was 0:08:58.000 --> 0:09:01.000 somebody else, he was going to look at that more qualified, 0:09:01.120 --> 0:09:03.960 you know. And because I had to do with like 0:09:04.000 --> 0:09:05.920 a little bit of scoring too, like be able to 0:09:05.960 --> 0:09:09.280 take the songs that I write and weave them through 0:09:09.679 --> 0:09:13.600 the movie. So then I was I had this whole 0:09:13.600 --> 0:09:17.080 brainstorm like, well, they want me to write one song 0:09:17.120 --> 0:09:21.640 with her and re record one old song, and I said, 0:09:22.040 --> 0:09:24.520 now we got to do a whole album. I'm gonna 0:09:24.520 --> 0:09:26.920 get together Dolly Parton. I'm writing an album with her. 0:09:26.960 --> 0:09:28.960 I'm doing a whole album. So I came up with 0:09:29.000 --> 0:09:31.880 the idea to do five redos, like you know, and 0:09:31.920 --> 0:09:34.200 get duets, you know. So I get to see it, 0:09:34.200 --> 0:09:36.000 and I start picking out people that I thought would 0:09:36.040 --> 0:09:39.160 be a great fit, not who was most popular, but 0:09:39.160 --> 0:09:42.120 what would be a great fit for Dolly's voice, and 0:09:42.280 --> 0:09:44.520 put that all together. And then when her and I 0:09:44.720 --> 0:09:48.080 finally met and she heard these songs, she was like, 0:09:48.280 --> 0:09:52.360 holy smoke. The when when they told me you're gonna 0:09:52.360 --> 0:09:54.560 I was gonna work with Lynda pair I said, okay, 0:09:54.600 --> 0:09:56.920 I do. She's like, you know, I thought you were 0:09:56.920 --> 0:09:59.400 going to take the songs more pop, and I was 0:09:59.400 --> 0:10:01.440 gonna be fine with that. I wouldn't have said anything, 0:10:01.880 --> 0:10:03.720 you know, and because she would not have liked that 0:10:03.800 --> 0:10:05.719 at all. So you wrote the songs not with her, 0:10:05.720 --> 0:10:09.960 but no, I re recorded the songs the re records, 0:10:10.000 --> 0:10:13.320 like here I Am Dune Blonde. I got in here 0:10:13.440 --> 0:10:15.840 the band. I put a band together that were not 0:10:16.240 --> 0:10:19.680 session players and they were not from Nashville, recorded it here, 0:10:20.480 --> 0:10:23.760 had someone sing the parts down for her, and then 0:10:23.800 --> 0:10:27.280 I sent that those are just the re records. And 0:10:27.320 --> 0:10:30.280 then when we met and she was so happy with 0:10:30.320 --> 0:10:32.400 what it sounded like. She was like, it sounds modern, 0:10:32.440 --> 0:10:35.120 but it doesn't. It sounds like me. And it's like 0:10:35.200 --> 0:10:37.480 Oh my god, I'm just sitting in my chair and 0:10:37.600 --> 0:10:40.400 spinning and loving this and whatever. And she's like, so, 0:10:40.480 --> 0:10:42.040 what do you want? We had? I guess we're gonna 0:10:42.040 --> 0:10:45.480 write tomorrow. And everybody's like saying, Dolly hasn't written with anybody. 0:10:45.920 --> 0:10:49.320 You know, she doesn't write with people, and she hasn't 0:10:49.520 --> 0:10:53.000 she hasn't written in a while, so good luck you 0:10:53.040 --> 0:10:55.560 know to that. And I'm like, okay, don't worry. I'm 0:10:55.559 --> 0:10:57.960 not worried at all. So when we met, we just 0:10:58.080 --> 0:11:01.480 instantly got along. And she's like, so, you know, we're 0:11:01.480 --> 0:11:05.120 gonna writing session tomorrow. What are you expecting. And I'm like, well, 0:11:05.240 --> 0:11:08.320 we're gonna sit down and just hang out. She's like, well, 0:11:08.400 --> 0:11:10.600 just so you know, I just don't write with people 0:11:10.679 --> 0:11:13.000 and it's been a while since I've written a song. 0:11:13.160 --> 0:11:15.640 She's like, are you you have a number in mind? 0:11:15.679 --> 0:11:17.520 And I'm like, yeah, I feel like five or six. 0:11:17.960 --> 0:11:20.240 And she just like looked at me and started laughing, 0:11:20.280 --> 0:11:23.000 and she was like, okay, well let's just get one, 0:11:23.280 --> 0:11:27.200 you know. And it two days. We wrote six songs. 0:11:27.920 --> 0:11:30.040 It was just like bang, bang bang bang. We just 0:11:30.679 --> 0:11:34.920 hit it off. It literally, she's like a close friend 0:11:34.960 --> 0:11:36.960 now and We talked to each other like at least 0:11:37.000 --> 0:11:43.400 twice a week, and she's an incredible inspiration and her 0:11:43.520 --> 0:11:49.200 talent is obviously beyond belief, and her storytelling is that 0:11:49.720 --> 0:11:52.160 of what I've been missing. So we wrote these great 0:11:52.200 --> 0:11:56.199 fucking songs. And it doesn't sound modern, but it doesn't 0:11:56.240 --> 0:11:59.199 sound old, but it sounds like Dolly. Still, how did 0:11:59.200 --> 0:12:00.960 you start to write with You're in a room. Were 0:12:00.960 --> 0:12:03.000 you in this room with her? No, I was in Nashville. 0:12:03.080 --> 0:12:05.400 You were in Nashville. So you're sitting down in her place. 0:12:05.440 --> 0:12:07.400 She has a place where she calls it the villa. 0:12:08.000 --> 0:12:09.520 She had her long nails, so she didn't want to 0:12:09.520 --> 0:12:11.360 play guitar. Just pick up the guitar and I start 0:12:11.400 --> 0:12:14.840 coming up with ideas just like that. You didn't did 0:12:14.840 --> 0:12:17.240 you talk much? First? Yeah? We talked, and then we 0:12:17.320 --> 0:12:19.920 just it was time to create. You know, when there's 0:12:19.920 --> 0:12:22.520 time to create, there's no talking. You just go into create. Really, 0:12:22.600 --> 0:12:25.560 you just flip a switch, just flip a switch. And 0:12:25.600 --> 0:12:28.160 it was funny because the bob that was in there, 0:12:28.280 --> 0:12:29.839 he was like, what are you guys doing. It's like, 0:12:29.840 --> 0:12:32.920 we're just writing songs and he's like, that's another good one. 0:12:32.960 --> 0:12:35.000 And then we did it again. So the first day 0:12:35.120 --> 0:12:38.120 was three songs, the second day was three songs. Then 0:12:38.200 --> 0:12:42.040 she took it and wrote lyrics on the second night 0:12:42.120 --> 0:12:44.800 to all of the songs, and then by the third 0:12:44.840 --> 0:12:49.120 day she came and we recorded them down with the lyrics, 0:12:49.640 --> 0:12:54.160 and then I came here with those songs and recorded them, 0:12:54.400 --> 0:12:56.559 and then she showed up and then we did the vocals. 0:12:56.760 --> 0:12:59.680 So she then wrote the lyrics in a day to 0:12:59.760 --> 0:13:03.000 all the songs. Yeah, and she also came and sang 0:13:03.280 --> 0:13:06.880 all of those songs in one day. Was she surprised 0:13:06.880 --> 0:13:09.400 how fast you were doing it? She was surprised, Yeah, 0:13:09.440 --> 0:13:11.160 because she's written a lot of songs. She's written like 0:13:11.160 --> 0:13:14.960 five thousand songs. Yeah, she was surprised how easy it 0:13:15.080 --> 0:13:16.760 was with the two of us. But then she calls 0:13:16.800 --> 0:13:20.160 me her creative soulmate. She and I are very very 0:13:20.160 --> 0:13:23.760 similar when we have a lot of we're very the 0:13:23.800 --> 0:13:26.440 same when it comes to work. It's like we're very 0:13:26.480 --> 0:13:30.080 hardcore about our work ethics and we're workers, and so 0:13:30.640 --> 0:13:35.440 it was like easy, writing songs should be easy. You 0:13:35.440 --> 0:13:38.839 shouldn't have to labor over writing a song when you're 0:13:38.920 --> 0:13:42.160 laboring when you're like I've heard I hear people about 0:13:42.320 --> 0:13:44.520 working on a song for a week, Like you've been 0:13:44.520 --> 0:13:47.080 writing a song for a fucking week? Are you kidding me? 0:13:47.679 --> 0:13:50.400 It's time to let go and move on, you know, 0:13:50.520 --> 0:13:52.640 And especially if it's taken five of you to write 0:13:52.640 --> 0:13:54.680 a song in one week, there's a bigger problem there. 0:13:55.200 --> 0:13:58.120 And Dolly and I just went We just had a 0:13:58.160 --> 0:14:01.960 creative flow and we just took advantage of the energy 0:14:01.960 --> 0:14:04.480 that was going on. And then she showed up on 0:14:04.520 --> 0:14:07.720 the third day with all the lyrics and we just 0:14:07.880 --> 0:14:11.319 recorded it down. It is a god. These are incredible. 0:14:12.200 --> 0:14:15.360 And then when I got here, I recorded all the songs, 0:14:16.080 --> 0:14:19.240 sent them ahead. She came down here and walked in 0:14:20.080 --> 0:14:24.640 and sang all six songs in one day. I was like, 0:14:24.880 --> 0:14:28.360 are you fucking kidding me? Like what, I can't even 0:14:28.480 --> 0:14:32.160 get a young artist to come in and sing one 0:14:32.280 --> 0:14:36.760 song in a day. Dolly Parton at seventy three walked 0:14:36.800 --> 0:14:41.200 in here and sang six very difficult songs in one day. Okay, 0:14:41.240 --> 0:14:44.440 So that part impressed you, that she could writing fast 0:14:44.840 --> 0:14:47.400 doesn't impress you. But singing six songs in a day, 0:14:47.480 --> 0:14:52.680 because it's you have to understand, Dolly. Normally, a woman 0:14:52.800 --> 0:14:57.880 loses their high range as they get older. Dolly is 0:14:57.920 --> 0:15:01.600 singing all her songs and all the original keys. There's 0:15:01.640 --> 0:15:08.240 no change does all in the original keys. Wow. And 0:15:08.280 --> 0:15:12.520 that is extremely impressive because like I've known artists at 0:15:12.560 --> 0:15:16.240 twenty and then I see him again at thirty and 0:15:16.280 --> 0:15:19.400 they're already they can't even get In fact, I have 0:15:19.480 --> 0:15:23.440 an artist that isn't even singing all her songs right now, 0:15:23.480 --> 0:15:27.360 and she's really new and she's already dropping the keys 0:15:27.400 --> 0:15:31.600 down to preserve her voice. Dolly, Dolly's in it. She's 0:15:31.640 --> 0:15:35.640 a singer, She's that's all even. She's a writer and 0:15:35.680 --> 0:15:39.200 she's a singer. She's a performer. She's Dolly Parton, one 0:15:39.240 --> 0:15:42.600 of the most recognizable people on this planet. Yeah you know. 0:15:43.440 --> 0:15:47.240 And she does not take her name lightly like she 0:15:47.600 --> 0:15:52.520 wants to know that Dolly Parton did all this, like 0:15:52.920 --> 0:15:57.120 it's a Dolly Parton is her business and she does. 0:15:57.160 --> 0:15:59.840 She practice every day? Does she She's writing all the time. 0:15:59.880 --> 0:16:02.840 She says that she's you know, I always get around 0:16:02.880 --> 0:16:04.800 with her. I'm like, do you really, like what do 0:16:04.840 --> 0:16:07.840 you do at home? Like are you you know? Because 0:16:07.880 --> 0:16:11.480 she's always decked out, yeah you know, And I'm like, 0:16:11.520 --> 0:16:13.760 are you do you go to a store. Do you 0:16:13.800 --> 0:16:15.960 go to a store? And if you do, you know? 0:16:16.040 --> 0:16:19.720 And I'm convinced she has a whole other life, because 0:16:19.720 --> 0:16:22.240 once you take off all that stuff, there's got to 0:16:22.240 --> 0:16:26.120 be you can't recognize her, I'm certain. So she'll laugh 0:16:26.280 --> 0:16:28.560 and I'm like, do you have another lifestyle going on? 0:16:28.640 --> 0:16:32.840 And she's like, you never know. Well, she also taps 0:16:32.920 --> 0:16:38.560 into clearly her early life. Yeah, very easily, because girl 0:16:38.600 --> 0:16:44.480 to movies to me, I mean it's it's a different period, 0:16:44.520 --> 0:16:46.920 but it reminded me of Code of many Colors. Yeah, 0:16:47.040 --> 0:16:50.440 well that's some saying that Dolly won't write just for 0:16:50.480 --> 0:16:54.000 a movie. She has to relate to it. So the 0:16:54.040 --> 0:17:00.000 inspiration was, how can I write some stories that are 0:17:00.080 --> 0:17:04.240 are going to be fulfilling to me emotionally and support 0:17:04.280 --> 0:17:08.000 this film and the characters. But the people you have 0:17:08.080 --> 0:17:12.560 worked with were very consciously or maybe not consciously when 0:17:12.600 --> 0:17:16.840 they showed up trying to make a change in their career, 0:17:17.600 --> 0:17:20.400 trying to sort of push limits. I think of the 0:17:20.520 --> 0:17:24.000 first Pink album you did, certainly the albums you did 0:17:24.000 --> 0:17:26.800 with Christine Aguiler and those are those are probably your 0:17:27.200 --> 0:17:31.600 most famous albums. Is that process different than what working 0:17:31.680 --> 0:17:34.760 with someone like Dolly Parton, who's such a pro. When 0:17:34.760 --> 0:17:37.520 someone else comes in here, how do you work with them? Well, 0:17:37.560 --> 0:17:41.400 I still was changing Dolly. I told her, I said, 0:17:41.440 --> 0:17:44.439 I'm going to change it up a little bit, you know, 0:17:44.680 --> 0:17:48.639 because when you listen to Dolly Parton records, there's a 0:17:48.720 --> 0:17:50.959 lot going on in the production. And I told her 0:17:51.000 --> 0:17:53.919 I was going to clean out everything. I just warned 0:17:53.920 --> 0:17:56.239 them and I said, I didn't want to make this 0:17:56.320 --> 0:17:59.040 a Nashville country album. I just wanted it to have 0:17:59.080 --> 0:18:04.280 a cool feel. I wanted to divibe, and they were 0:18:04.680 --> 0:18:07.840 all up for it. And you know, she has this 0:18:07.960 --> 0:18:10.280 song called here I Am that. I'm shocked it was 0:18:10.359 --> 0:18:14.120 never a single, so see us sing it with her. 0:18:15.040 --> 0:18:18.600 It's such a big song and it never was a 0:18:18.640 --> 0:18:21.119 single in the seventies. But I listened to it and 0:18:21.160 --> 0:18:23.240 I'm like, well I could see why it was. It 0:18:23.280 --> 0:18:26.479 was just a lot was going on, you know, So 0:18:27.800 --> 0:18:31.800 Dolly doesn't need someone like me. But what I offered, 0:18:31.840 --> 0:18:34.239 and what I came in with was giving kind of 0:18:34.280 --> 0:18:37.600 like a a flip a little bit like I just 0:18:38.080 --> 0:18:41.000 flipped it, you know, kind of just gave her a 0:18:41.119 --> 0:18:44.280 tiny little not makeover, but more of a like a 0:18:44.440 --> 0:18:47.520 let's just get you a little bit more present into 0:18:47.560 --> 0:18:51.720 the here and now. What were the musical aesthetics you 0:18:51.760 --> 0:18:54.560 wanted to change? The music was just taking all the 0:18:54.600 --> 0:18:58.800 twang out and all the it was like the Nashville 0:18:58.840 --> 0:19:02.240 out of it. Because those players incredible players, but it's 0:19:02.240 --> 0:19:04.400 hard to get a grip on them, and then there's 0:19:04.440 --> 0:19:08.359 no feel. It's just guys going in a room and 0:19:08.359 --> 0:19:11.600 they're clocking in and they're taking their fifteen minute break, 0:19:12.400 --> 0:19:14.919 you know. But guys in bands they don't do that. 0:19:16.480 --> 0:19:19.640 They work for pizza and beer and they're done until 0:19:19.640 --> 0:19:22.919 they're done, and the heart of it comes from that, 0:19:24.000 --> 0:19:26.600 you know. So that was the biggest thing she heard 0:19:26.640 --> 0:19:29.640 that right off the top. Like one of the biggest 0:19:29.640 --> 0:19:34.040 compliments I recently just received was, you know, I put 0:19:34.080 --> 0:19:39.040 together her Grammy performance with that same band and the 0:19:39.119 --> 0:19:42.959 sound everything, and after the performance, I did the whole medley, 0:19:43.600 --> 0:19:47.640 you know, and and Ken Erlek said that he's never 0:19:47.800 --> 0:19:51.239 let somebody do that before, so he just let me 0:19:51.600 --> 0:19:55.240 do the medley, put it all together, and it came 0:19:55.280 --> 0:19:58.720 out incredible. It was a big hit and everybody remembers it. Yeah. 0:19:58.760 --> 0:20:01.200 So then I'm out there, I'm about to go sit 0:20:01.240 --> 0:20:03.879 down and Beck comes up to me, and you know, 0:20:04.000 --> 0:20:06.679 Beck doesn't talk a lot, and he comes up to 0:20:06.720 --> 0:20:10.679 me and he's all, that was great, you know, really 0:20:10.840 --> 0:20:14.159 like mellow And I'm like, thank you. He's like, so, 0:20:14.760 --> 0:20:17.080 who is the band? Like, would it be anybody I know? 0:20:17.160 --> 0:20:22.040 And I'm like no. He's like, are they studio players? 0:20:22.080 --> 0:20:24.720 I'm like no, I said, they're all from you know, 0:20:24.880 --> 0:20:27.320 I'm talking in his like you know, like this lower 0:20:27.440 --> 0:20:31.640 level and I'm like no, back, I go there, they're friends, 0:20:31.680 --> 0:20:36.200 they're from bands. And he's like, you could totally tell. 0:20:36.520 --> 0:20:39.160 That was really great. They had a great feel. And 0:20:39.200 --> 0:20:42.760 that is exactly what I was trying to go for, 0:20:42.920 --> 0:20:45.880 is that when all the musicians in that room could 0:20:45.920 --> 0:20:50.080 hear the difference of all of what you normally get 0:20:50.119 --> 0:20:52.719 on the Grammys. And what was even funnier is that 0:20:52.760 --> 0:20:55.600 they kept calling me the Grammys would ask me for 0:20:55.640 --> 0:20:59.600 the files and I'm all, what files, Like, well, when 0:20:59.640 --> 0:21:01.840 you can't, just can you just send us over the files? 0:21:01.840 --> 0:21:04.639 And I kept on going, what files are you talking about? 0:21:04.840 --> 0:21:07.800 You know, They're like, you know the tracks? Oh, I 0:21:07.840 --> 0:21:12.200 go no, dude, this is live. Oh okay. And then 0:21:12.200 --> 0:21:15.200 I'd get a call the next day do you when 0:21:15.240 --> 0:21:17.400 do you think you'll have those files over to us? 0:21:18.240 --> 0:21:21.320 The sessions, And I'm like, I'm going to say it again. 0:21:21.680 --> 0:21:26.000 We are playing live. There's no clicks, there's no back 0:21:26.200 --> 0:21:29.920 click track or none of that. We're playing live. At 0:21:29.920 --> 0:21:32.160 this point, Linda stepped out to take a phone call, 0:21:32.680 --> 0:21:34.920 so we'll take a break too. When we come back, 0:21:34.960 --> 0:21:44.960 we'll have more with Linda Perry. We're back with Linda Perry. 0:21:45.200 --> 0:21:49.120 So your background, you grew up not here, You grew 0:21:49.200 --> 0:21:52.240 up East, is that right? I grew up in San Diego. 0:21:52.320 --> 0:21:54.480 I was born in Boston, but I was only one 0:21:54.560 --> 0:21:59.040 years one year old, and then I moved to San Diego. 0:21:59.280 --> 0:22:03.000 And guitar was your first instrument. Guitar, Yeah, I just 0:22:03.040 --> 0:22:05.399 started kind of singing writing. It just all kind of 0:22:05.520 --> 0:22:09.199 fell together. And then and what age did you know 0:22:09.480 --> 0:22:14.240 that was going to be it? I didn't, So I 0:22:14.320 --> 0:22:17.760 never looked at it as music. I just knew I 0:22:17.880 --> 0:22:21.960 was different and I was special. So I would like 0:22:23.280 --> 0:22:27.360 do stuff like interview myself. At the time, we had 0:22:27.440 --> 0:22:30.399 Mike Douglas and the mrv Griffin Show, and I'd be 0:22:30.440 --> 0:22:34.640 on the MURV Griffin Show, Hey in my room, and well, 0:22:34.680 --> 0:22:36.880 now we're going to bring back Linda Perry. Oh, it's 0:22:36.920 --> 0:22:39.320 so good to have you back, Linda. And I never 0:22:39.359 --> 0:22:40.840 know why I'm on the show, but i'd be like, 0:22:40.920 --> 0:22:44.240 thanks merv. Oh yeah, it feels good to be here 0:22:44.440 --> 0:22:47.160 and everybody, and I see the plause, I see everybody. 0:22:47.160 --> 0:22:50.440 I'm doing this interview and everything, but there was no 0:22:50.760 --> 0:22:54.359 clear understanding of what it was I was famous and 0:22:54.400 --> 0:22:57.840 on the show for, and then everything that I did 0:22:58.000 --> 0:23:05.320 was modeled after this very confidence. Whatever it was the way, 0:23:05.320 --> 0:23:07.399 it was never clear way anybody was on the merv 0:23:07.440 --> 0:23:10.080 of Griffin. Yeah, I remember, it was like and then 0:23:11.680 --> 0:23:14.120 and then it got to school and I just could 0:23:14.200 --> 0:23:18.840 not you know, I'm very I'm not good in school. 0:23:18.920 --> 0:23:22.520 I'm not good with learning something like it's hard for 0:23:22.880 --> 0:23:26.280 you to teach me something. So I got out of 0:23:26.280 --> 0:23:30.000 school very early, like eighth grade. But I kept telling 0:23:30.040 --> 0:23:33.480 myself this was okay because what I'm going to be 0:23:34.160 --> 0:23:37.840 I don't need school. I don't need to know math 0:23:38.040 --> 0:23:41.479 and social studies and this is going to be of 0:23:41.520 --> 0:23:44.159 no use for me. Well, what are you going to do, Linda. 0:23:44.640 --> 0:23:48.560 I don't know, but I know it's not okay. I'm 0:23:48.560 --> 0:23:53.199 going to stop you right there, because as beautiful as 0:23:53.240 --> 0:23:56.280 this room is there is a there's the studio room 0:23:56.320 --> 0:23:58.520 over there with all the equipment and I'll bet you 0:23:58.600 --> 0:24:00.880 know that equipment backwards and forward. Yeah, I had to 0:24:01.000 --> 0:24:03.120 buy it and teach myself how to do it. Okay, 0:24:03.200 --> 0:24:05.399 but that it is a room that would scare most 0:24:05.440 --> 0:24:08.480 engineers a general dynamic, yes, but you were able to 0:24:10.080 --> 0:24:14.320 teach yourself even things that complicated. Yeah, well, it's really 0:24:14.359 --> 0:24:17.760