1 00:00:00,280 --> 00:00:04,720 Speaker 1: From UFOs to psychic powers and government conspiracies. History is 2 00:00:04,840 --> 00:00:09,119 Speaker 1: riddled with unexplained events. You can turn back now or 3 00:00:09,240 --> 00:00:12,160 Speaker 1: learn this stuff they don't want you to know. A 4 00:00:12,280 --> 00:00:13,920 Speaker 1: production of iHeartRadio. 5 00:00:24,200 --> 00:00:26,680 Speaker 2: Hello, welcome back to the show. My name is Matt, 6 00:00:26,880 --> 00:00:28,960 Speaker 2: my name is Noel. They call me Ben. 7 00:00:29,000 --> 00:00:32,160 Speaker 1: We're joined as always with our super producer Alexis code 8 00:00:32,240 --> 00:00:36,440 Speaker 1: named Doc Holliday Jackson. Most importantly, you are you. You 9 00:00:36,600 --> 00:00:40,240 Speaker 1: are here that makes this this stuff they don't want 10 00:00:40,280 --> 00:00:42,960 Speaker 1: you to know. It's an exciting time of the week 11 00:00:43,000 --> 00:00:47,480 Speaker 1: for us, folks. This is our listener mail program where 12 00:00:47,520 --> 00:00:50,600 Speaker 1: we get to hear directly from the best part of 13 00:00:50,680 --> 00:00:56,080 Speaker 1: the show, you, specifically you. We always conclude our episode saying, Hey, 14 00:00:56,160 --> 00:00:58,560 Speaker 1: reach out to us, find us online, call us on 15 00:00:58,600 --> 00:01:01,920 Speaker 1: the phone, send us an email, and we're not blowing smoke. 16 00:01:02,240 --> 00:01:05,039 Speaker 1: We're going to hear about active fitness groups. We'll get 17 00:01:05,040 --> 00:01:10,080 Speaker 1: a note from a Knoxvillian, we'll learn about some mysterious holes. 18 00:01:10,120 --> 00:01:13,200 Speaker 1: And before we do any of that, we have a 19 00:01:13,240 --> 00:01:15,440 Speaker 1: couple of voicemails we'd like to share with you. 20 00:01:22,040 --> 00:01:24,600 Speaker 2: I have so many questions about active fitness groups, and 21 00:01:24,640 --> 00:01:27,640 Speaker 2: that just sounds like a group of people that's really active, 22 00:01:27,640 --> 00:01:29,520 Speaker 2: and they go out and they do fitness together. 23 00:01:30,560 --> 00:01:32,520 Speaker 1: Because I do that part is true. 24 00:01:32,600 --> 00:01:34,840 Speaker 2: I know a lot of those see them at the 25 00:01:35,040 --> 00:01:37,840 Speaker 2: what is it? There's orange theory Jim right around where 26 00:01:37,880 --> 00:01:41,360 Speaker 2: I am and see him doing that. All right, So 27 00:01:41,480 --> 00:01:45,240 Speaker 2: let's jump first to a voicemail message from Ta Gray. 28 00:01:45,720 --> 00:01:49,400 Speaker 3: Hi, you can call me Gray. I'm a PhD candidate 29 00:01:49,480 --> 00:01:54,160 Speaker 3: at Florida State and I study political science and international relations. 30 00:01:54,800 --> 00:01:58,040 Speaker 3: And I just want to say I teach American foreign policy. 31 00:01:58,680 --> 00:02:01,120 Speaker 3: Uh and as a long time listener of your show, 32 00:02:01,160 --> 00:02:05,040 Speaker 3: it's hard not to deveolop my class into discussions of 33 00:02:05,240 --> 00:02:07,640 Speaker 3: all the shady stuff that the United States government has 34 00:02:07,680 --> 00:02:11,440 Speaker 3: done overseas. But I'm a big fan of the show. 35 00:02:11,560 --> 00:02:14,760 Speaker 3: Keep up the good work. I'm calling because I had 36 00:02:15,080 --> 00:02:20,360 Speaker 3: any potential idea for a future episode. Recently, I had 37 00:02:20,600 --> 00:02:26,320 Speaker 3: a talk at my university from professor Danielle Donno. She's 38 00:02:26,360 --> 00:02:32,959 Speaker 3: at University of Oklahoma on fraudulent election monitors. So according 39 00:02:32,960 --> 00:02:37,600 Speaker 3: to her, there's an international conspiracy going on about election monitors. 40 00:02:38,120 --> 00:02:42,560 Speaker 3: These popped up a lot in international relations after the 41 00:02:42,639 --> 00:02:46,200 Speaker 3: fall of the Soviet Union. What they do is they 42 00:02:46,240 --> 00:02:49,960 Speaker 3: go into countries that are you know, developing democracies and 43 00:02:50,000 --> 00:02:55,480 Speaker 3: they monitor their elections. They then develop objective reports about, 44 00:02:56,000 --> 00:02:58,280 Speaker 3: you know, whether the election was free or fair, or 45 00:02:58,320 --> 00:03:02,280 Speaker 3: whether there was some fraudulent to be going on. However, 46 00:03:02,600 --> 00:03:07,960 Speaker 3: recently there have been efforts uncovered that Russia has been 47 00:03:08,000 --> 00:03:13,160 Speaker 3: spearheading a lot of fraudulent election monitors. These monitors are 48 00:03:13,280 --> 00:03:18,320 Speaker 3: usually you know, kind of developed overnight, paid off by 49 00:03:18,400 --> 00:03:23,639 Speaker 3: either the governments that they're monitoring, or you know, Russia themselves, 50 00:03:24,360 --> 00:03:26,720 Speaker 3: and they go in and say elections are free and 51 00:03:26,760 --> 00:03:29,919 Speaker 3: fair when they weren't. But they always assign themselves really 52 00:03:29,919 --> 00:03:32,880 Speaker 3: official sounding names, so if you're citizen of that country, 53 00:03:33,240 --> 00:03:35,960 Speaker 3: it's hard to tell, you know, whether or not this 54 00:03:36,160 --> 00:03:39,440 Speaker 3: is legit, especially if your media is you know, not 55 00:03:39,600 --> 00:03:42,160 Speaker 3: free and fair as well. So I know there's some 56 00:03:42,280 --> 00:03:45,560 Speaker 3: work in terms of sources by Danielle Donnell and her 57 00:03:45,600 --> 00:03:49,320 Speaker 3: co authors. There's also been a series of investigative journalism 58 00:03:49,480 --> 00:03:51,480 Speaker 3: that looks at some of these kind of pop up 59 00:03:51,520 --> 00:03:55,640 Speaker 3: election monitors and tracks their finances and has found a 60 00:03:55,680 --> 00:03:59,440 Speaker 3: lot of ties to Russia and other kind of shady 61 00:03:59,480 --> 00:04:03,360 Speaker 3: governments as well. So anyways, I thought this might be 62 00:04:03,400 --> 00:04:06,560 Speaker 3: of interest. Of course, I'm a political scientist, so my 63 00:04:06,680 --> 00:04:10,680 Speaker 3: interests are a little bit more niche. But I hope 64 00:04:10,680 --> 00:04:13,720 Speaker 3: to see this in a future episode, thinks I. 65 00:04:14,600 --> 00:04:19,000 Speaker 2: Yes, well, thank you take grade. That's amazing. It's awesome 66 00:04:19,040 --> 00:04:24,720 Speaker 2: to your PhD candidate at Florida State that's teaching international relations. 67 00:04:25,400 --> 00:04:28,920 Speaker 2: My goodness. And this is something that we have had 68 00:04:28,960 --> 00:04:30,760 Speaker 2: our eyes on for a long time. We've talked about 69 00:04:30,760 --> 00:04:33,120 Speaker 2: this a little bit in the past, been in Noel right, 70 00:04:33,520 --> 00:04:38,320 Speaker 2: specifically election monitoring and kind of a fishiness that can 71 00:04:38,480 --> 00:04:41,359 Speaker 2: occur there when it's a third party or an NGO 72 00:04:41,560 --> 00:04:43,960 Speaker 2: or some you know, some other group that goes into 73 00:04:44,040 --> 00:04:48,279 Speaker 2: a country to verify in some way that this election 74 00:04:48,440 --> 00:04:51,320 Speaker 2: is good to go, you guys, especially when it's a 75 00:04:51,360 --> 00:04:55,480 Speaker 2: paid group, right, because the money flows from somewhere for 76 00:04:55,520 --> 00:05:00,880 Speaker 2: some reason. If it's not just some some pro democratic 77 00:05:01,320 --> 00:05:05,839 Speaker 2: group that is just all good and only you know, 78 00:05:05,960 --> 00:05:08,040 Speaker 2: only working for good in the world. 79 00:05:08,440 --> 00:05:12,359 Speaker 1: The good folks at Wagner want you to vote your conscience. 80 00:05:12,800 --> 00:05:16,120 Speaker 2: Yeah, but they would never say that, would never say it. 81 00:05:16,240 --> 00:05:18,520 Speaker 2: Bogner would be some other group. I don't know, have 82 00:05:18,560 --> 00:05:21,320 Speaker 2: you guys heard anything about this or been specifically just 83 00:05:21,320 --> 00:05:24,720 Speaker 2: do you know much about the election monitoring process that's 84 00:05:24,760 --> 00:05:25,599 Speaker 2: in place right now. 85 00:05:25,800 --> 00:05:31,000 Speaker 1: Yeah, this is astic, T Gray, thank you for reaching 86 00:05:31,040 --> 00:05:36,200 Speaker 1: out to us. We share similar interest, especially appreciate your 87 00:05:36,400 --> 00:05:41,320 Speaker 1: recommendation to our fellow conspiracy realist about Professor Donno's work. 88 00:05:41,920 --> 00:05:47,240 Speaker 1: The idea here in specific seems to be a conspiracy 89 00:05:47,680 --> 00:05:53,640 Speaker 1: to legitimize corrupt elections. Election monitoring is an at times 90 00:05:53,760 --> 00:05:58,520 Speaker 1: controversial industry. The Carter Center, based here in Atlanta, Georgia, 91 00:05:59,240 --> 00:06:04,760 Speaker 1: sends groups across the world to monitor elections. We know 92 00:06:04,960 --> 00:06:10,479 Speaker 1: people who work in election monitoring. However, we see in 93 00:06:10,560 --> 00:06:16,160 Speaker 1: this in this industry, we do see opportunity for conspiracy 94 00:06:16,200 --> 00:06:20,279 Speaker 1: and corruption. I mean, you know, it's weird because there 95 00:06:20,360 --> 00:06:26,320 Speaker 1: is an arguably condescending framework for Americans. Looking at the 96 00:06:26,400 --> 00:06:31,719 Speaker 1: elections in other countries. The Americans say this election needs 97 00:06:31,720 --> 00:06:37,040 Speaker 1: to be investigated, but never our own, because we're so great. 98 00:06:37,640 --> 00:06:41,000 Speaker 2: Yeah, I'm looking at outfits like the Office for Democratic 99 00:06:41,040 --> 00:06:44,200 Speaker 2: Institutions and Human Rights based at least it looks like 100 00:06:44,279 --> 00:06:46,600 Speaker 2: it is based out of Poland. Maybe yeah it is. 101 00:06:46,640 --> 00:06:51,120 Speaker 2: It's based in Warsaw, Poland that do this very thing, right, 102 00:06:51,320 --> 00:06:55,680 Speaker 2: go into other countries and monitor elections for theoretically the 103 00:06:56,160 --> 00:07:00,320 Speaker 2: good of everyone. And they've got something called thesc E, 104 00:07:01,200 --> 00:07:03,720 Speaker 2: which I'm just finding a handbook on it. Maybe it's 105 00:07:03,720 --> 00:07:07,360 Speaker 2: just because I've already searched for it. OSCEE called the 106 00:07:07,880 --> 00:07:11,680 Speaker 2: Organization for Security and Cooperation in Europe, which is a 107 00:07:11,720 --> 00:07:15,840 Speaker 2: whole other thing. Again, like some of this stuff, just 108 00:07:15,880 --> 00:07:17,440 Speaker 2: in looking at it, you know, in the moment here 109 00:07:17,480 --> 00:07:20,000 Speaker 2: after listening to that message, there's no way for me 110 00:07:20,040 --> 00:07:22,119 Speaker 2: to die or at least me personally to dive into 111 00:07:22,200 --> 00:07:25,200 Speaker 2: all the stuff we need to talk about. But y'all, 112 00:07:25,200 --> 00:07:28,720 Speaker 2: I found a handbook from for that Office of Democratic 113 00:07:28,760 --> 00:07:32,280 Speaker 2: Institutions and Human Rights that goes over like how to 114 00:07:33,200 --> 00:07:35,840 Speaker 2: make sure an election is good to go or at 115 00:07:35,920 --> 00:07:38,960 Speaker 2: least on the up and up. Wow, there's a lot here. 116 00:07:39,880 --> 00:07:45,960 Speaker 1: And to be clear, folks, election monitoring is a necessary process. 117 00:07:46,360 --> 00:07:51,640 Speaker 1: There are tons of corrupt elections around the world every year. 118 00:07:52,320 --> 00:07:55,240 Speaker 1: That is not a hot take, That is simply true. 119 00:07:55,560 --> 00:07:59,760 Speaker 1: The question then becomes something like who watches the Watchman? 120 00:08:00,280 --> 00:08:02,760 Speaker 1: Yeah that's not a dated reference. 121 00:08:02,720 --> 00:08:06,360 Speaker 2: No it's not. But but legitimately is there something like that? 122 00:08:06,480 --> 00:08:08,680 Speaker 2: Is there some kind of third party that comes into 123 00:08:08,720 --> 00:08:11,600 Speaker 2: the United States and monitors our elections? 124 00:08:11,800 --> 00:08:14,280 Speaker 1: Do you mean like consensually or do you mean they're 125 00:08:14,360 --> 00:08:15,400 Speaker 1: pole watchers. 126 00:08:16,480 --> 00:08:19,200 Speaker 2: No, No, I mean not. I mean an actual third 127 00:08:19,240 --> 00:08:21,760 Speaker 2: party like this one based out of Warsaw, Poland that 128 00:08:21,840 --> 00:08:23,640 Speaker 2: goes into the United States just to be like, okay, well, 129 00:08:23,680 --> 00:08:25,480 Speaker 2: let's monitor these elections, just to make sure. 130 00:08:25,800 --> 00:08:25,880 Speaker 1: No. 131 00:08:25,960 --> 00:08:28,840 Speaker 4: I mean to Ben's point though, right, Like, isn't that 132 00:08:28,920 --> 00:08:32,080 Speaker 4: sort of a little bit uh oh, We're so great 133 00:08:32,360 --> 00:08:35,679 Speaker 4: like these these things don't happen here, you know, because 134 00:08:35,720 --> 00:08:38,280 Speaker 4: I think that would be a conflict of interest to 135 00:08:38,320 --> 00:08:40,760 Speaker 4: the election process. There's so many things you're not allowed 136 00:08:40,800 --> 00:08:44,520 Speaker 4: to do at polls, you know, like they're very particular 137 00:08:44,559 --> 00:08:47,640 Speaker 4: about certain you know, campaigning and the like. I don't 138 00:08:47,679 --> 00:08:50,280 Speaker 4: think there would have to be special dispensations made for 139 00:08:50,320 --> 00:08:53,400 Speaker 4: an organization quote unquote doing that poll watchers. If I'm 140 00:08:53,440 --> 00:08:55,160 Speaker 4: not mistaken, what's the deal with that? 141 00:08:55,200 --> 00:08:55,480 Speaker 5: Guys? 142 00:08:55,559 --> 00:08:58,199 Speaker 4: Remind me, I don't think I've ever witnessed that practice. 143 00:08:58,240 --> 00:09:00,760 Speaker 4: But don't they have to keep a distance of some kind? 144 00:09:01,240 --> 00:09:03,880 Speaker 4: They hang out outside the polling place. They're certainly not 145 00:09:04,040 --> 00:09:06,400 Speaker 4: looking over people's shoulders whilst they vote. 146 00:09:06,920 --> 00:09:09,160 Speaker 2: Well, there's a whole issue that was brought up with 147 00:09:09,200 --> 00:09:14,480 Speaker 2: that thing with intimidation, right, pole watchers being put in 148 00:09:14,559 --> 00:09:19,720 Speaker 2: place as an intimidation tactic. Potentially, maybe not, but it 149 00:09:19,760 --> 00:09:22,719 Speaker 2: certainly seems that way to me, at least from my perspective. 150 00:09:23,400 --> 00:09:26,680 Speaker 2: I wonder what hole monitoring is like in another country 151 00:09:26,720 --> 00:09:29,040 Speaker 2: where it is a third party coming through just to 152 00:09:29,120 --> 00:09:31,760 Speaker 2: keep an eye on everything. And the point you made 153 00:09:31,840 --> 00:09:35,040 Speaker 2: been like it could be some third party that is 154 00:09:35,120 --> 00:09:38,080 Speaker 2: actually a part of the election, that is doing it 155 00:09:38,120 --> 00:09:40,960 Speaker 2: on purpose. I don't know. It just gives me a 156 00:09:40,960 --> 00:09:43,520 Speaker 2: weird feeling, you guys, because it makes me want to 157 00:09:43,520 --> 00:09:46,640 Speaker 2: look internally and just make sure we're actually good. I 158 00:09:46,679 --> 00:09:49,880 Speaker 2: think the US is good, but maybe that's just because 159 00:09:49,920 --> 00:09:52,040 Speaker 2: I grew up saying the pledge of allegiance, you know. 160 00:09:53,320 --> 00:09:55,480 Speaker 4: And just to answer my own question, I guess pole 161 00:09:55,520 --> 00:09:59,240 Speaker 4: watchers can be affiliated with any number of organizations where 162 00:09:59,280 --> 00:10:02,120 Speaker 4: they be a political party or some kind of non 163 00:10:02,160 --> 00:10:06,080 Speaker 4: partisan group. They also can conduct exit polls, which we 164 00:10:06,160 --> 00:10:08,960 Speaker 4: know are really important for e Gauging how an election 165 00:10:09,160 --> 00:10:11,200 Speaker 4: is going right in advance. 166 00:10:11,640 --> 00:10:15,160 Speaker 1: I think they just had one hundred feet back. Yeah, 167 00:10:15,320 --> 00:10:22,400 Speaker 1: the idea of corruption here is worth asking, it's worth investigating. Completely, 168 00:10:22,440 --> 00:10:25,440 Speaker 1: agree with you, Tay. This maybe an episode in the future. 169 00:10:26,080 --> 00:10:29,920 Speaker 1: We do know that Vladimir Putin's pulling numbers are through 170 00:10:29,960 --> 00:10:34,120 Speaker 1: the roof. Who would have saw that coming unanimously loved 171 00:10:34,320 --> 00:10:35,120 Speaker 1: by the nation. 172 00:10:35,000 --> 00:10:39,320 Speaker 2: Of Russia now that we're there, the shirt off. 173 00:10:39,760 --> 00:10:42,560 Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, he's he's a real stub buff in that guy. 174 00:10:43,280 --> 00:10:47,600 Speaker 1: We do know that there are international observers to your question, Matt, 175 00:10:48,520 --> 00:10:52,199 Speaker 1: that will. I guess they're not quite on the level 176 00:10:52,240 --> 00:10:56,480 Speaker 1: of poll watchers all the time, but there are institutions 177 00:10:56,520 --> 00:11:01,840 Speaker 1: and groups from other countries that will monitor US elections, 178 00:11:02,080 --> 00:11:06,040 Speaker 1: and yeah, and it needs to happen. Elections do need 179 00:11:06,080 --> 00:11:10,920 Speaker 1: to be monitored, hopefully by an objective third party. The 180 00:11:11,040 --> 00:11:13,880 Speaker 1: problem is that a lot of those parties are not 181 00:11:14,160 --> 00:11:15,960 Speaker 1: indeed objective. 182 00:11:15,640 --> 00:11:17,600 Speaker 2: Right, How do you get one? There was such a 183 00:11:17,720 --> 00:11:22,160 Speaker 2: huge issue during the last presidential election in the United States, 184 00:11:22,240 --> 00:11:24,360 Speaker 2: and there's about to be another one. It would be 185 00:11:24,400 --> 00:11:27,400 Speaker 2: awesome if there was some kind of watchers of the watchmen, 186 00:11:27,480 --> 00:11:30,120 Speaker 2: as you said, Ben, that could just go, hey, guys, 187 00:11:30,120 --> 00:11:31,840 Speaker 2: we got it. We're just gonna make sure we're all good, 188 00:11:31,920 --> 00:11:36,000 Speaker 2: and we're good, or and oh nope, we have to 189 00:11:36,080 --> 00:11:37,400 Speaker 2: do that one again, sorry, y'all. 190 00:11:38,440 --> 00:11:41,079 Speaker 1: I wonder what would happen, though, if some member state 191 00:11:41,120 --> 00:11:45,520 Speaker 1: of NATO came out and publicly said or like the 192 00:11:45,679 --> 00:11:51,040 Speaker 1: United Nations said, this election has too many serious problems 193 00:11:51,280 --> 00:11:54,360 Speaker 1: and we need to just do a take to reset 194 00:11:54,840 --> 00:11:57,360 Speaker 1: vote again. America would not have. 195 00:11:57,280 --> 00:12:00,760 Speaker 2: It at I know you're right, especially if it was 196 00:12:00,800 --> 00:12:03,800 Speaker 2: like a NATO or some other group that we're supposed 197 00:12:03,840 --> 00:12:08,240 Speaker 2: to say. Okay, we'll do what you say. Oh man, 198 00:12:08,720 --> 00:12:11,600 Speaker 2: oh well, this feels like a conundrum to me. We 199 00:12:11,679 --> 00:12:15,240 Speaker 2: need people like Take Gray out there figuring out what 200 00:12:15,360 --> 00:12:16,240 Speaker 2: to do next. 201 00:12:17,200 --> 00:12:19,600 Speaker 1: So congratulations on the PhD. 202 00:12:19,800 --> 00:12:25,520 Speaker 2: Tap absolutely, heck yeah, and shout out to Professor Danielle Adno, 203 00:12:25,600 --> 00:12:29,600 Speaker 2: that's awesome. I've looked at her about page on her 204 00:12:29,640 --> 00:12:32,240 Speaker 2: own website. It's very interesting stuff and there's a whole 205 00:12:32,240 --> 00:12:33,520 Speaker 2: book that we can look into. 206 00:12:33,679 --> 00:12:33,959 Speaker 5: Guys. 207 00:12:34,480 --> 00:12:36,679 Speaker 1: The Cypress research is fascinating. 208 00:12:37,080 --> 00:12:37,200 Speaker 3: Hm. 209 00:12:38,120 --> 00:12:38,679 Speaker 5: Very cool. 210 00:12:38,840 --> 00:12:41,120 Speaker 2: All right, well, thanks so much, Take Gray. We are 211 00:12:41,200 --> 00:12:43,680 Speaker 2: going to jump to another piece of a listener mail, 212 00:12:43,679 --> 00:12:46,240 Speaker 2: but we'll be right back with more messages from you. 213 00:12:53,000 --> 00:12:59,240 Speaker 4: And we have returned with listener mail. This particular missive. 214 00:12:58,960 --> 00:13:03,439 Speaker 5: Comes from Cool Guy, big fan of Cool Guy. Let's 215 00:13:03,480 --> 00:13:06,680 Speaker 5: just jump right into it. This is a fun one. Howdy, gentlemen. 216 00:13:07,040 --> 00:13:09,160 Speaker 4: I've been a huge fan of you guys four years 217 00:13:09,200 --> 00:13:11,280 Speaker 4: now and always wanted to reach out but never had 218 00:13:11,320 --> 00:13:13,520 Speaker 4: anything to say, so glad you finally did. 219 00:13:13,640 --> 00:13:14,160 Speaker 5: Cool guy. 220 00:13:14,679 --> 00:13:17,480 Speaker 4: I was scrolling through the internet when I stumbled upon 221 00:13:17,559 --> 00:13:21,520 Speaker 4: a whole m Mel's hole. To be exact, who is 222 00:13:21,559 --> 00:13:23,480 Speaker 4: this mel, you may ask, as son in the email. 223 00:13:23,880 --> 00:13:26,160 Speaker 4: I was just curious if you guys have ever heard 224 00:13:26,200 --> 00:13:28,120 Speaker 4: of it, and what are your thoughts. 225 00:13:28,200 --> 00:13:29,480 Speaker 5: I'm going to attach a link. 226 00:13:29,320 --> 00:13:32,400 Speaker 4: To a YouTube video because it's like, actually super gn hourly. 227 00:13:33,200 --> 00:13:33,760 Speaker 5: Cool guy. 228 00:13:34,559 --> 00:13:37,679 Speaker 4: I appreciate your podcast and can't wait to hear your thoughts. 229 00:13:38,000 --> 00:13:38,400 Speaker 5: Ps. 230 00:13:38,440 --> 00:13:40,720 Speaker 4: I apologize if I have a spell this, which he does. 231 00:13:41,280 --> 00:13:45,560 Speaker 4: But Noel's evil voice definitely is sounding like the killing 232 00:13:45,679 --> 00:13:46,440 Speaker 4: Joke joker. 233 00:13:47,240 --> 00:13:49,920 Speaker 5: What is my evil voice? I love it? 234 00:13:49,960 --> 00:13:53,200 Speaker 4: I gotta know. Let us know, cool guy you're talking about. 235 00:13:53,240 --> 00:13:55,040 Speaker 4: I hope he's not saying that I sound evil all 236 00:13:55,080 --> 00:13:58,680 Speaker 4: the time. Apparently I put on a bit of an 237 00:13:58,720 --> 00:13:59,719 Speaker 4: evil patois. 238 00:14:00,440 --> 00:14:02,360 Speaker 2: Let's do a test. Let's do a test. Say something 239 00:14:02,440 --> 00:14:04,440 Speaker 2: really evil in your evil. 240 00:14:04,160 --> 00:14:06,640 Speaker 5: Voice, meda most foul. 241 00:14:07,200 --> 00:14:09,360 Speaker 2: There we go. Yeah, I think that's what he's talking about. 242 00:14:09,400 --> 00:14:10,079 Speaker 5: Okay, cool. 243 00:14:10,720 --> 00:14:13,120 Speaker 4: He spells my name nol though, like the grassy noole, 244 00:14:13,200 --> 00:14:15,480 Speaker 4: which I get a lot, and I guess that makes 245 00:14:15,520 --> 00:14:18,640 Speaker 4: sense considering, you know the nature of the of the podcast, 246 00:14:18,720 --> 00:14:19,640 Speaker 4: So I do not. 247 00:14:20,480 --> 00:14:22,160 Speaker 5: Begrudge you that cool guy. 248 00:14:22,840 --> 00:14:27,000 Speaker 4: But Mel's Hole, y'all, this is actually pretty prescient because 249 00:14:27,000 --> 00:14:29,840 Speaker 4: we may well have a full episode coming up on 250 00:14:30,920 --> 00:14:33,720 Speaker 4: mysterious Holes, and we're gonna try real hard not to 251 00:14:33,760 --> 00:14:38,200 Speaker 4: giggle like little school girls throughout that one. But yeah, 252 00:14:38,280 --> 00:14:42,520 Speaker 4: this actually kind of ties back around to an episode 253 00:14:42,640 --> 00:14:47,080 Speaker 4: of a show that's in some ways adjacent to our show, 254 00:14:47,280 --> 00:14:49,360 Speaker 4: at least in this in the sense that it's on 255 00:14:49,400 --> 00:14:52,680 Speaker 4: our network, the iHeart Podcast network. 256 00:14:52,480 --> 00:14:55,120 Speaker 5: Coast to Coast AM. 257 00:14:55,160 --> 00:14:58,960 Speaker 4: And if I'm not mistaken, this story first surfaced in 258 00:14:59,080 --> 00:15:02,720 Speaker 4: the nineties, and there's a real cool article. You guys, 259 00:15:02,760 --> 00:15:06,720 Speaker 4: remember ifl Science you still have a dirty word in 260 00:15:06,760 --> 00:15:10,240 Speaker 4: it was still around. Holly Large is kicking it as 261 00:15:10,280 --> 00:15:14,760 Speaker 4: their resident whole expert, and the headline to this piece 262 00:15:15,120 --> 00:15:21,000 Speaker 4: is geologically impossible. The strange story of Mel's supposedly bottomless 263 00:15:21,000 --> 00:15:25,800 Speaker 4: hole essentially what the gist is. And in February of 264 00:15:26,120 --> 00:15:30,520 Speaker 4: nineteen ninety seven, a fellow calling himself Mel Waters called 265 00:15:30,560 --> 00:15:34,400 Speaker 4: into the late night conspiratorial. 266 00:15:33,680 --> 00:15:35,080 Speaker 5: Talk show Coast to Coast. 267 00:15:35,320 --> 00:15:38,080 Speaker 4: This is back when Art Bell was still at the 268 00:15:38,160 --> 00:15:41,280 Speaker 4: helm there and this guy you know, I you know, guys, 269 00:15:41,280 --> 00:15:43,400 Speaker 4: I've never really spent any time with coast to coast. 270 00:15:43,480 --> 00:15:45,680 Speaker 4: Is this pretty common? Like folks just calling in and 271 00:15:45,720 --> 00:15:47,920 Speaker 4: telling their wild stories? Is that sort of the format? 272 00:15:48,720 --> 00:15:52,040 Speaker 5: Yes? Early, Okay, got it, So that makes sense. So 273 00:15:52,080 --> 00:15:53,880 Speaker 5: this guy had a bit of a doozy. 274 00:15:54,000 --> 00:15:57,200 Speaker 4: He calls in and says that on his property around 275 00:15:57,280 --> 00:16:02,000 Speaker 4: fourteen kilometers nine miles to the west of Ellensburg, Washington State, 276 00:16:02,920 --> 00:16:08,359 Speaker 4: there was once a giant hole that, according to this fellow, waters. 277 00:16:08,800 --> 00:16:13,240 Speaker 5: Had no end was it was an endless, bottomless pit. 278 00:16:13,960 --> 00:16:17,040 Speaker 4: He talks about how locals from the area would throw 279 00:16:17,160 --> 00:16:20,560 Speaker 4: away their their garbage into the hole pretty regularly, and 280 00:16:20,600 --> 00:16:23,040 Speaker 4: one might ask, well, then, at what point wouldn't that 281 00:16:23,120 --> 00:16:26,200 Speaker 4: hole just start to fill up and an overflow with 282 00:16:26,200 --> 00:16:30,560 Speaker 4: with nasty waiste. Apparently it never did, because he goes 283 00:16:30,640 --> 00:16:33,840 Speaker 4: on to talk about how he went to literally try 284 00:16:33,840 --> 00:16:35,480 Speaker 4: to get to the bottom of this thing, ha ha, 285 00:16:36,360 --> 00:16:41,000 Speaker 4: And he took a real large amount of fishing line. 286 00:16:41,040 --> 00:16:43,720 Speaker 4: You know, I mean, I'm not I'm no fishermen here, 287 00:16:43,760 --> 00:16:46,320 Speaker 4: no angler, but I think a big old reel of 288 00:16:46,360 --> 00:16:50,120 Speaker 4: fishing line probably comprises quite a lot of length and 289 00:16:50,200 --> 00:16:52,360 Speaker 4: he had to go through several of them, so he 290 00:16:52,440 --> 00:16:56,400 Speaker 4: claimed to get to still not the bottom, he exhausted. 291 00:16:56,680 --> 00:16:58,960 Speaker 5: I believe three reels that he had brought. 292 00:16:59,240 --> 00:17:06,480 Speaker 4: Constitute around eighty thousand feet twenty four thousand meters. 293 00:17:07,520 --> 00:17:10,520 Speaker 5: So yeah, without, he said, without, still, by the way. 294 00:17:10,560 --> 00:17:15,959 Speaker 4: Reaching the bottom of this chasm. The IFL Science article 295 00:17:16,040 --> 00:17:18,480 Speaker 4: then goes on to talk a little bit about geology. 296 00:17:18,880 --> 00:17:21,199 Speaker 5: So let's not be the spoilers quite yet. 297 00:17:21,280 --> 00:17:22,919 Speaker 4: Let's talk a little bit more about some of the 298 00:17:22,960 --> 00:17:27,760 Speaker 4: lore behind Mel's hole. Waters also goes on to claim 299 00:17:27,880 --> 00:17:34,159 Speaker 4: that some government agents of unknown origin or affiliations just 300 00:17:34,200 --> 00:17:40,040 Speaker 4: call them general spook type individuals showed up and shut 301 00:17:40,119 --> 00:17:42,560 Speaker 4: down the area, claiming that it had been the site 302 00:17:42,920 --> 00:17:47,280 Speaker 4: of a plane crash, an official you know, government vehicle, 303 00:17:47,320 --> 00:17:51,480 Speaker 4: perhaps some kind of spyplane. Perhaps didn't really go into detail, 304 00:17:51,640 --> 00:17:54,520 Speaker 4: so they shut it down. And then he claims that 305 00:17:54,640 --> 00:18:01,240 Speaker 4: they essentially forced him to lease his land to the government, 306 00:18:02,359 --> 00:18:05,560 Speaker 4: which they paid him, you know, obviously for and he 307 00:18:05,600 --> 00:18:08,639 Speaker 4: supposedly was able to use that money paid to him 308 00:18:08,640 --> 00:18:11,760 Speaker 4: by the government to move to Australia, which sounds nice. 309 00:18:12,119 --> 00:18:14,960 Speaker 4: Probably got some pretty deep holes out there Australia way 310 00:18:15,480 --> 00:18:18,800 Speaker 4: as well. So some of the properties of this hole 311 00:18:18,880 --> 00:18:23,359 Speaker 4: that he described were things like bringing animals back from 312 00:18:23,400 --> 00:18:26,120 Speaker 4: the dead is one that strikes me. I'm a big 313 00:18:26,359 --> 00:18:28,480 Speaker 4: I don't know fan is the right word. Pet Cemetery 314 00:18:28,520 --> 00:18:30,600 Speaker 4: I find to be one of the most nihilistic and 315 00:18:30,760 --> 00:18:33,399 Speaker 4: upsetting pieces of fiction ever penned. 316 00:18:34,000 --> 00:18:35,480 Speaker 5: I think it was so effed up. 317 00:18:35,400 --> 00:18:39,879 Speaker 4: That sorry, talking like Jojo Sewell over here, that Stephen 318 00:18:39,960 --> 00:18:41,959 Speaker 4: King kept it in a drawer for many years. 319 00:18:42,160 --> 00:18:44,680 Speaker 1: He says it's the novel that scared him the most. 320 00:18:44,920 --> 00:18:47,160 Speaker 4: That's right, yeah, because it was also I think when 321 00:18:47,200 --> 00:18:49,960 Speaker 4: he was in the deepest throes of his cocaine addiction. 322 00:18:51,000 --> 00:18:52,639 Speaker 4: I don't know if that has anything to do with it, 323 00:18:52,720 --> 00:18:56,000 Speaker 4: but it certainly is a really, really, really dark and 324 00:18:56,080 --> 00:19:00,480 Speaker 4: sinister novel about a place in of course, Maine, where 325 00:19:01,200 --> 00:19:03,840 Speaker 4: is supposedly an Indian burial ground on the other side 326 00:19:03,840 --> 00:19:07,760 Speaker 4: of what became a child's kind of cemetery for dead 327 00:19:07,880 --> 00:19:11,520 Speaker 4: burying dead pets and when you bury them on the 328 00:19:11,560 --> 00:19:14,439 Speaker 4: other side, the Micmac burial ground, I believe what they 329 00:19:14,440 --> 00:19:17,159 Speaker 4: call it. The First Nations tribe that is depicted in 330 00:19:17,240 --> 00:19:20,359 Speaker 4: the book and in the film. Then it comes back, 331 00:19:20,560 --> 00:19:23,080 Speaker 4: but it comes back bad comes back. 332 00:19:23,600 --> 00:19:25,000 Speaker 5: The soul sour? 333 00:19:25,200 --> 00:19:28,960 Speaker 4: Yes, boy, is it ever? Fred Gwyn for the Wind 334 00:19:29,040 --> 00:19:31,640 Speaker 4: to the Road loss Loss, I. 335 00:19:31,560 --> 00:19:33,800 Speaker 5: Mean God, talk about what a bummer. 336 00:19:33,800 --> 00:19:35,760 Speaker 4: And then that guy meets a real gnarly end at 337 00:19:35,800 --> 00:19:39,040 Speaker 4: the hands of a spoiler for a probably thirty year 338 00:19:39,040 --> 00:19:41,880 Speaker 4: old piece of fiction. At this point, they bury a 339 00:19:41,920 --> 00:19:45,000 Speaker 4: small child in the pet cemetery and it comes back 340 00:19:45,040 --> 00:19:48,320 Speaker 4: and slices old Herman munster up with a scalpel and 341 00:19:48,520 --> 00:19:51,840 Speaker 4: eats his Adam's apple out of his throat. Scared the 342 00:19:51,880 --> 00:19:53,520 Speaker 4: crap out of me. You guys have a memory of 343 00:19:53,560 --> 00:19:56,040 Speaker 4: seeing a movie that was above your pay grade for 344 00:19:56,119 --> 00:19:58,119 Speaker 4: the age you were, and it kind of wrecked you 345 00:19:58,119 --> 00:20:01,480 Speaker 4: a little bit. That was that for me Event Horizon 346 00:20:01,680 --> 00:20:05,360 Speaker 4: as well, because I would argue Event Horizon was irresponsibly marketed. 347 00:20:05,880 --> 00:20:09,320 Speaker 4: I thought that was gonna be a fun space romp, 348 00:20:09,440 --> 00:20:13,040 Speaker 4: and it had all kinds of weird, horrible hell raiser surgery, 349 00:20:14,160 --> 00:20:16,440 Speaker 4: clawing out people's eyes kind of stuff in and that one 350 00:20:16,440 --> 00:20:18,520 Speaker 4: wrecked me. But Pet Cemetery really did a number on me. 351 00:20:18,600 --> 00:20:21,359 Speaker 4: So guy claims that a local threw his dog in 352 00:20:21,400 --> 00:20:24,920 Speaker 4: there and saw it later shambling around. 353 00:20:24,560 --> 00:20:26,760 Speaker 5: With another hunter and it didn't recognize him. 354 00:20:27,040 --> 00:20:32,119 Speaker 4: Okay also claims that he had heard tale of people 355 00:20:32,280 --> 00:20:36,320 Speaker 4: taking radios holding it up around the ridge, which I 356 00:20:36,359 --> 00:20:39,800 Speaker 4: believe the mouth of this cavern hear this thing he 357 00:20:39,840 --> 00:20:44,639 Speaker 4: claimed to be around nine feet wide the mouth of 358 00:20:44,680 --> 00:20:51,359 Speaker 4: the hole, only to pick up music from the past. Huh, 359 00:20:51,880 --> 00:20:58,879 Speaker 4: broadcasts from yesteryear. There are claims of transmutation of substances, 360 00:20:59,520 --> 00:21:01,280 Speaker 4: the kinds of things that you would only hear in 361 00:21:01,400 --> 00:21:05,560 Speaker 4: tales of alchemy, you know of like turning you know, 362 00:21:05,880 --> 00:21:09,520 Speaker 4: brass into gold or what have you. Metals specifically said 363 00:21:09,600 --> 00:21:12,639 Speaker 4: held near the whole would morph into other substances, and 364 00:21:12,880 --> 00:21:14,439 Speaker 4: you guys are already kind of getting the just this 365 00:21:14,520 --> 00:21:17,200 Speaker 4: is starting to take on urban lore urban legend type 366 00:21:17,200 --> 00:21:23,280 Speaker 4: status real quick. My favorite one was the story of 367 00:21:23,800 --> 00:21:27,320 Speaker 4: like somebody lowered like a pack of life savers down 368 00:21:27,359 --> 00:21:29,879 Speaker 4: there be not my favorite one, and it's pretty smart, 369 00:21:30,040 --> 00:21:32,080 Speaker 4: hoping they would reach water and then it would call. 370 00:21:32,080 --> 00:21:32,440 Speaker 3: You know what. 371 00:21:32,560 --> 00:21:34,000 Speaker 5: I think it was the fishing line. 372 00:21:34,080 --> 00:21:36,439 Speaker 4: It had life savers on the end of it and 373 00:21:36,480 --> 00:21:39,160 Speaker 4: it was supposedly if it hit water then it would dissolve, 374 00:21:39,320 --> 00:21:42,080 Speaker 4: but it never did. So that's that's one thing. And 375 00:21:42,160 --> 00:21:45,760 Speaker 4: the last thing was sounds black beams emitted from this 376 00:21:45,840 --> 00:21:52,120 Speaker 4: thing and supposedly the sounds of some sort of sinister creature, 377 00:21:52,520 --> 00:21:55,520 Speaker 4: you know, lurking within. This is very Cthulhu esque kind 378 00:21:55,520 --> 00:21:58,560 Speaker 4: of stuff. So before we try to debunk it, or 379 00:21:58,560 --> 00:22:01,880 Speaker 4: at least talk to some folks that maybe we'll try 380 00:22:01,880 --> 00:22:02,520 Speaker 4: their hand at that. 381 00:22:03,000 --> 00:22:04,840 Speaker 5: This cool stuff is very interesting. 382 00:22:04,880 --> 00:22:08,360 Speaker 4: It's the stuff of probably Coast to Coast, you know vibes. 383 00:22:09,119 --> 00:22:11,320 Speaker 4: It seems to me to have clearly been an influence 384 00:22:11,400 --> 00:22:14,760 Speaker 4: in the television series I think it's called Outer Range 385 00:22:15,240 --> 00:22:19,920 Speaker 4: starring Josh Brolin, about a mysterious hole that is some 386 00:22:19,960 --> 00:22:23,440 Speaker 4: sort of portal. It would have to be because it's 387 00:22:23,480 --> 00:22:26,320 Speaker 4: definitely a rural kind of setting and similar kind of 388 00:22:26,359 --> 00:22:27,720 Speaker 4: mystery surrounding this hole. 389 00:22:28,000 --> 00:22:29,600 Speaker 5: But how does this guy? How does this hit you? 390 00:22:29,680 --> 00:22:29,880 Speaker 3: Guys? 391 00:22:29,920 --> 00:22:32,280 Speaker 4: Do you have any analogs for this sor as you 392 00:22:32,280 --> 00:22:33,280 Speaker 4: guys heard of this story? 393 00:22:33,640 --> 00:22:37,360 Speaker 1: Yeah, I have heard of it. In full disclosure, I 394 00:22:37,440 --> 00:22:40,080 Speaker 1: am one of the executive producers for a lot of 395 00:22:40,080 --> 00:22:44,439 Speaker 1: Coast to Coast AM podcast. However, I didn't put my 396 00:22:44,560 --> 00:22:49,000 Speaker 1: thumb on the scale of this exploration of mysterious holes. 397 00:22:49,640 --> 00:22:50,000 Speaker 5: It is. 398 00:22:50,200 --> 00:22:53,000 Speaker 1: It is startling. I think one of the things we 399 00:22:53,080 --> 00:22:55,720 Speaker 1: have to remember if we're hearing this and we're saying, 400 00:22:55,840 --> 00:22:59,239 Speaker 1: I'm a skeptical person. We have to remember that the 401 00:23:00,040 --> 00:23:06,080 Speaker 1: vast majority of cavern systems on this planet remain unexplored. 402 00:23:06,560 --> 00:23:10,960 Speaker 1: Like right now, it is totally possible, not plausible, but 403 00:23:11,080 --> 00:23:17,320 Speaker 1: totally possible that there is an entire region of the world, 404 00:23:17,440 --> 00:23:22,359 Speaker 1: subterranean region that we do not understand knell. For the 405 00:23:22,480 --> 00:23:26,879 Speaker 1: case of mel Waters in particular, if I recall correctly, 406 00:23:27,800 --> 00:23:32,200 Speaker 1: we just know that the guy called himself Mel Waters. 407 00:23:32,400 --> 00:23:36,080 Speaker 4: We don't know if real Further exploration of into this 408 00:23:36,200 --> 00:23:41,400 Speaker 4: dude revealed that no such individual existed by that name, 409 00:23:42,200 --> 00:23:45,080 Speaker 4: and he also referred to his wife, I believe, by 410 00:23:45,160 --> 00:23:49,080 Speaker 4: name in the broadcast, who was affiliated with a university 411 00:23:50,000 --> 00:23:53,480 Speaker 4: in the area. And the cross references of that name 412 00:23:53,640 --> 00:23:56,119 Speaker 4: also led to bump. Guess when it came to you know, 413 00:23:56,240 --> 00:23:58,640 Speaker 4: somebody that had been employed at this university And sorry, 414 00:23:58,680 --> 00:24:02,359 Speaker 4: I'm my tabs are all askew and I'm not getting 415 00:24:02,400 --> 00:24:04,040 Speaker 4: the names quite right. 416 00:24:04,119 --> 00:24:05,040 Speaker 5: Way here we go. 417 00:24:06,640 --> 00:24:15,160 Speaker 4: Ellensburg, Ellensburg, Washington, and yeah, Kitchitas County. Yeah, his wife, 418 00:24:15,800 --> 00:24:19,400 Speaker 4: he claimed worked at c w U, which I guess 419 00:24:19,480 --> 00:24:21,119 Speaker 4: is Central Washington University. 420 00:24:21,720 --> 00:24:23,920 Speaker 5: He named her, and no. 421 00:24:23,400 --> 00:24:28,720 Speaker 4: No person of that name working at Central Washington University. 422 00:24:28,800 --> 00:24:30,400 Speaker 5: So yeah, one hundred percent. 423 00:24:30,480 --> 00:24:34,840 Speaker 4: Ben Seattle's k o m O TV station did a 424 00:24:34,880 --> 00:24:38,200 Speaker 4: piece on it on February seventh of that year. 425 00:24:38,600 --> 00:24:40,879 Speaker 5: You know this, this conversation. 426 00:24:40,440 --> 00:24:43,560 Speaker 4: On art Bell definitely hit the hit the small community 427 00:24:43,920 --> 00:24:48,280 Speaker 4: pretty hard for whatever reason though this the exact location 428 00:24:49,720 --> 00:24:52,399 Speaker 4: is very vague and no one seems to have been 429 00:24:52,440 --> 00:24:55,440 Speaker 4: able to actually find the thing. And for a giant, 430 00:24:55,480 --> 00:24:57,840 Speaker 4: bottomless hole, that seems a little sketchy, but again, the 431 00:24:57,840 --> 00:25:00,360 Speaker 4: guy said that the government basically co opted it. One 432 00:25:00,359 --> 00:25:02,199 Speaker 4: would maybe, you know, if we were to believe that 433 00:25:02,280 --> 00:25:06,199 Speaker 4: line of thinking, maybe filled it in or camouflaged it 434 00:25:06,320 --> 00:25:07,440 Speaker 4: or whatever in some way. 435 00:25:07,720 --> 00:25:11,560 Speaker 2: Well, we are talking about only a nine foot diameter hole, right, 436 00:25:11,640 --> 00:25:15,640 Speaker 2: so that's I don't know, imagine if you're looking out 437 00:25:15,680 --> 00:25:19,520 Speaker 2: on this like vast landscape where there's not really much 438 00:25:19,560 --> 00:25:23,280 Speaker 2: there that does have ups and downs to it, right, 439 00:25:23,359 --> 00:25:26,760 Speaker 2: the elevation shifts a little bit, it'd be pretty hard, 440 00:25:26,800 --> 00:25:29,240 Speaker 2: I think to find just a hole that's that small. 441 00:25:29,680 --> 00:25:30,120 Speaker 5: Yeah. 442 00:25:30,400 --> 00:25:36,160 Speaker 1: Also, didn't didn't this person make repeat appearances on Coast 443 00:25:36,200 --> 00:25:36,600 Speaker 1: to Coast? 444 00:25:36,760 --> 00:25:37,120 Speaker 5: He did? 445 00:25:37,400 --> 00:25:41,600 Speaker 4: Yeah, as recently as two thousand, is my understanding, and 446 00:25:42,160 --> 00:25:45,680 Speaker 4: another person who kind of entered the chat when this 447 00:25:45,800 --> 00:25:48,399 Speaker 4: story first, you know, kind of hit the airwaves and 448 00:25:48,440 --> 00:25:51,360 Speaker 4: then the you know, the TV was a guy who 449 00:25:51,400 --> 00:25:58,480 Speaker 4: actually did confirmed, did work at CWU, a geologist for 450 00:25:58,640 --> 00:26:02,280 Speaker 4: the Department of now Shore Resources by the name of 451 00:26:03,320 --> 00:26:07,320 Speaker 4: Jack Powell, and he was very skeptical. He kind of 452 00:26:07,320 --> 00:26:09,159 Speaker 4: even referred to the art Belt show as being all 453 00:26:09,200 --> 00:26:11,240 Speaker 4: about UFOs and sasquatches in kind of. 454 00:26:11,160 --> 00:26:12,040 Speaker 5: A dismissive way. 455 00:26:13,160 --> 00:26:18,399 Speaker 4: And he had this to say when interviewed by filmmakers. 456 00:26:18,480 --> 00:26:20,760 Speaker 4: Jack Powell, a geologist with the Washington State Department of 457 00:26:20,840 --> 00:26:24,400 Speaker 4: Natural Resources, he said, geologically and physically, it's not possible 458 00:26:24,440 --> 00:26:26,760 Speaker 4: for a hole to be that deep. It would collapse 459 00:26:26,840 --> 00:26:30,359 Speaker 4: into itself under the tremendous pressure and heat from the 460 00:26:30,400 --> 00:26:37,240 Speaker 4: surrounding strata. He believes that the legend sparked from the 461 00:26:37,280 --> 00:26:41,440 Speaker 4: existence of a local goldbind shaft that he remembered from 462 00:26:41,480 --> 00:26:44,359 Speaker 4: being a boy that had its entrance in a local 463 00:26:44,400 --> 00:26:47,639 Speaker 4: field with a shaft of around twenty seven meters or 464 00:26:47,760 --> 00:26:50,720 Speaker 4: ninety feet deep, which is certainly deep, but not what 465 00:26:50,760 --> 00:26:54,560 Speaker 4: one might call bottomless or like you know, portal into 466 00:26:54,640 --> 00:26:59,399 Speaker 4: the unknown waters does reference something called the Cola super 467 00:26:59,440 --> 00:27:03,600 Speaker 4: deep hole on the Cola Peninsula in northwestern Russia. Which 468 00:27:03,680 --> 00:27:06,120 Speaker 4: is a hole that or it is a project, I guess, 469 00:27:06,160 --> 00:27:09,000 Speaker 4: a dig that spanned from May twenty fourth, nineteen seventy 470 00:27:09,359 --> 00:27:12,960 Speaker 4: to after the collapse of the Soviet Union, which saw 471 00:27:13,160 --> 00:27:18,560 Speaker 4: the digging of the deepest hole ever, which is forty 472 00:27:18,640 --> 00:27:22,320 Speaker 4: thousand feet below the surface. That's a that's a pretty 473 00:27:22,480 --> 00:27:25,600 Speaker 4: deep hole there. It's about still a half what this 474 00:27:25,640 --> 00:27:29,440 Speaker 4: hole was purported to have been. And there was another 475 00:27:29,640 --> 00:27:33,520 Speaker 4: kind of point of reference. Let's see the Russians, he said, 476 00:27:33,600 --> 00:27:36,199 Speaker 4: drilled the deepest hole two hundred and thirty feet in 477 00:27:36,320 --> 00:27:39,160 Speaker 4: nineteen eighty nine is when that rapped. He said, if 478 00:27:39,160 --> 00:27:41,440 Speaker 4: they had said over the radio was on the north 479 00:27:41,520 --> 00:27:44,439 Speaker 4: side of the valley, well I might have stayed with 480 00:27:44,560 --> 00:27:46,600 Speaker 4: the program for a while longer. I was thinking the 481 00:27:46,600 --> 00:27:49,720 Speaker 4: hole I knew about was somehow being made into Mel's hole. 482 00:27:50,520 --> 00:27:52,560 Speaker 5: And he's referring to. 483 00:27:54,320 --> 00:27:58,159 Speaker 4: Some areas of the eastern Washington you know region, the 484 00:27:58,240 --> 00:28:04,200 Speaker 4: lower Kitsitas County and Manna stash Ridge Specifically. 485 00:28:04,280 --> 00:28:07,080 Speaker 5: He says, geologically and physically. 486 00:28:06,800 --> 00:28:09,440 Speaker 4: It's not possible for a hole to be that deep 487 00:28:09,480 --> 00:28:13,440 Speaker 4: because of the reasons we mentioned earlier. He said whoever 488 00:28:13,560 --> 00:28:16,320 Speaker 4: mel was, he probably knew about the hole in northwest 489 00:28:16,320 --> 00:28:19,359 Speaker 4: of allens Burglet's on private land fenced with barbed wire 490 00:28:19,600 --> 00:28:22,120 Speaker 4: and is not too far from State D in r Lands. 491 00:28:22,480 --> 00:28:25,080 Speaker 4: I suppose this mell Waters, he says, usually the real 492 00:28:25,119 --> 00:28:27,840 Speaker 4: hole as a kind of inspiration for making up this 493 00:28:27,920 --> 00:28:30,760 Speaker 4: mysterious one in Manustache Ridge. 494 00:28:31,520 --> 00:28:32,280 Speaker 5: Cool idea. 495 00:28:32,560 --> 00:28:35,640 Speaker 4: I really get it, you know. And it's like I 496 00:28:35,680 --> 00:28:38,440 Speaker 4: know that art Bell and Coast to Coast. Certainly there 497 00:28:38,480 --> 00:28:41,120 Speaker 4: are stuff that gets talked about on there that you 498 00:28:41,160 --> 00:28:43,040 Speaker 4: know has grains of truth, like a lot of the 499 00:28:43,080 --> 00:28:46,240 Speaker 4: stuff we talk about on this show. But this one 500 00:28:46,280 --> 00:28:48,600 Speaker 4: does maybe seem like someone was trying to get some 501 00:28:48,640 --> 00:28:53,520 Speaker 4: airtime and created a story that was maybe rooted in 502 00:28:53,600 --> 00:28:55,680 Speaker 4: a grain of truth with this other hole, but then 503 00:28:55,760 --> 00:28:59,040 Speaker 4: kind of went a little bit. He jumped the shark 504 00:28:59,080 --> 00:29:01,800 Speaker 4: a little bit in terms of some of the details. 505 00:29:01,920 --> 00:29:04,080 Speaker 2: What do you guys think, I think we should all 506 00:29:04,080 --> 00:29:06,240 Speaker 2: watch out Arrange. I think we've talked about it before 507 00:29:06,240 --> 00:29:06,600 Speaker 2: on the show. 508 00:29:06,640 --> 00:29:09,600 Speaker 4: It's good show, really a lot very twin peaksy I 509 00:29:09,640 --> 00:29:12,760 Speaker 4: really dig it. I like the the weird, evil kind 510 00:29:12,760 --> 00:29:17,480 Speaker 4: of rancher guy who's always singing like to his son, 511 00:29:17,920 --> 00:29:19,880 Speaker 4: like he bursts into song all the time. And I 512 00:29:19,880 --> 00:29:22,160 Speaker 4: can't remember the character's name. It's been a minute, but 513 00:29:22,200 --> 00:29:24,040 Speaker 4: I think there's another season of that too. But I 514 00:29:24,080 --> 00:29:27,120 Speaker 4: did watch every episode of the first season and enjoyed 515 00:29:27,120 --> 00:29:27,760 Speaker 4: it very much. 516 00:29:28,560 --> 00:29:30,560 Speaker 5: Been any any other thoughts about Mel's hole? 517 00:29:31,040 --> 00:29:38,600 Speaker 1: Oh you know, Mel, I'm kidding me very very much, 518 00:29:38,680 --> 00:29:44,320 Speaker 1: looking forward to our future subterranean exploration. Uh, it's a 519 00:29:44,480 --> 00:29:48,360 Speaker 1: it's very it's very hold by beer of humanity to 520 00:29:48,440 --> 00:29:51,640 Speaker 1: say how deep can we dig? And we will dig 521 00:29:51,720 --> 00:29:54,280 Speaker 1: into that in a future episode. So thank you so 522 00:29:54,400 --> 00:29:57,080 Speaker 1: much for writing in what a fantastic suggestion. 523 00:29:57,560 --> 00:30:00,320 Speaker 5: Absolutely thanks a lot. Cool guy. 524 00:30:00,400 --> 00:30:02,360 Speaker 4: We're gonna take a quick pause here a word from 525 00:30:02,360 --> 00:30:06,320 Speaker 4: our sponsor, and then come back with another one final. 526 00:30:06,080 --> 00:30:16,320 Speaker 5: For this evening's episode. Piece of listener Mayo. 527 00:30:15,720 --> 00:30:17,960 Speaker 2: And we've returned, Ben. I thought you were gonna say, 528 00:30:18,280 --> 00:30:20,880 Speaker 2: hold my beer like you just tossed it in. 529 00:30:21,480 --> 00:30:22,560 Speaker 1: This is why we hang out. 530 00:30:22,680 --> 00:30:25,040 Speaker 2: Yeah, maybe you would come out a different kind, right, 531 00:30:25,160 --> 00:30:26,120 Speaker 2: Or are. 532 00:30:26,080 --> 00:30:27,920 Speaker 5: You guys talking about beers in butts? 533 00:30:28,240 --> 00:30:28,400 Speaker 3: Uh? 534 00:30:29,120 --> 00:30:29,280 Speaker 5: No. 535 00:30:29,360 --> 00:30:32,320 Speaker 1: Always If you look back over the course of this show, 536 00:30:32,480 --> 00:30:35,320 Speaker 1: every episode in some way is about beers and butts. 537 00:30:35,480 --> 00:30:40,480 Speaker 1: Mm hm, you know, think about it. We have. We 538 00:30:40,640 --> 00:30:44,320 Speaker 1: have a couple of pieces of correspondence here. This is 539 00:30:44,400 --> 00:30:48,680 Speaker 1: something that is pretty serious. It's been on our collective 540 00:30:48,720 --> 00:30:53,400 Speaker 1: mind for some time. Here is a piece of correspondence 541 00:30:53,440 --> 00:30:58,600 Speaker 1: from our longtime conspiracy realist Fiota. Fiona says, hi, all, 542 00:30:59,120 --> 00:31:01,800 Speaker 1: very long time listener here. I had never heard the 543 00:31:01,920 --> 00:31:06,400 Speaker 1: term active clubs until today. I've missed some episodes recently, 544 00:31:06,520 --> 00:31:10,040 Speaker 1: so not sure if you've covered these already, Fiona. We 545 00:31:10,120 --> 00:31:12,640 Speaker 1: have yet to do so, and we're glad you brought 546 00:31:12,640 --> 00:31:17,440 Speaker 1: this up. Fiona is quoting from a newsletter called The 547 00:31:17,480 --> 00:31:23,160 Speaker 1: Real Intel, and Fiona quotes the following. Active clubs are fraternal, 548 00:31:23,440 --> 00:31:27,520 Speaker 1: white only fitness groups that use physical fitness as a 549 00:31:27,640 --> 00:31:33,080 Speaker 1: lifestyle draw to funnel men into white nationalism and into 550 00:31:33,160 --> 00:31:37,920 Speaker 1: militant neo Nazism. In addition to using fitness culture as 551 00:31:37,920 --> 00:31:41,680 Speaker 1: a means of influence and recruitment, the fitness proposition of 552 00:31:41,720 --> 00:31:46,320 Speaker 1: active Clubs allows white nationalists to train for street violence. 553 00:31:46,720 --> 00:31:50,680 Speaker 1: They were started in January twenty twenty one and use 554 00:31:51,000 --> 00:31:55,160 Speaker 1: Mma style training to train for what they claim is 555 00:31:55,200 --> 00:31:59,640 Speaker 1: an upcoming race war. They're found throughout the US, Canada, Europe, 556 00:31:59,720 --> 00:32:04,880 Speaker 1: and Australia. Canada has twenty two known chapters, including a 557 00:32:04,960 --> 00:32:09,280 Speaker 1: rare women only chapter. They've spread fast and hard in 558 00:32:09,320 --> 00:32:13,280 Speaker 1: an unprecedented amount of time by hiding and Playing Sight 559 00:32:13,640 --> 00:32:18,280 Speaker 1: and making it easier to draw new members in. Let's 560 00:32:18,320 --> 00:32:22,200 Speaker 1: pause there, peep behind the curtain. All of us are 561 00:32:22,640 --> 00:32:27,240 Speaker 1: exploring physical fitness on our own as individuals. Have you, guys, 562 00:32:27,280 --> 00:32:28,959 Speaker 1: ever heard of active fitness clubs? 563 00:32:29,240 --> 00:32:29,560 Speaker 5: Literally? 564 00:32:29,640 --> 00:32:32,760 Speaker 4: Matt was talking about earlier and it sounded perfectly innocuous 565 00:32:32,800 --> 00:32:33,040 Speaker 4: to me. 566 00:32:33,520 --> 00:32:36,680 Speaker 5: But what you're describing doesn't, doesn't. 567 00:32:37,040 --> 00:32:41,440 Speaker 2: Yeah, I've never seen one, and I'm right now searching 568 00:32:41,480 --> 00:32:46,400 Speaker 2: for and failing to find like official websites of any 569 00:32:46,400 --> 00:32:49,320 Speaker 2: of these things. All I see is links from Anti 570 00:32:49,360 --> 00:32:50,560 Speaker 2: Defamation League and a bunch. 571 00:32:50,400 --> 00:32:51,880 Speaker 5: Of other groups talking about them. 572 00:32:52,040 --> 00:32:55,400 Speaker 2: Yeah, but nobody. But there's no like place online. I 573 00:32:55,440 --> 00:32:56,720 Speaker 2: guess where there was. 574 00:32:57,640 --> 00:33:00,320 Speaker 1: You know what I mean? You wouldn't advertise that, you 575 00:33:00,320 --> 00:33:04,440 Speaker 1: would just have your gym's website. We want to recommend, 576 00:33:04,640 --> 00:33:07,080 Speaker 1: First off, Fiona, thank you for the suggestion. 577 00:33:07,240 --> 00:33:07,480 Speaker 5: Here. 578 00:33:07,680 --> 00:33:11,520 Speaker 1: We want to recommend an excellent piece by Tim Dickinson 579 00:33:11,680 --> 00:33:15,640 Speaker 1: writing for The Rolling Stone, who says, quote this violence 580 00:33:15,720 --> 00:33:20,240 Speaker 1: ready militia is hiding in Playing Sight and also Dickinson 581 00:33:20,360 --> 00:33:25,680 Speaker 1: describes these active clubs as quote who the Proud Boys 582 00:33:25,840 --> 00:33:30,960 Speaker 1: wanted to be. Do you guys remember the Proud Boys debacle? Unfortunately, Well, 583 00:33:33,040 --> 00:33:36,360 Speaker 1: I wish we were video for this, because folks, you 584 00:33:36,440 --> 00:33:40,760 Speaker 1: had to see Matt nol nod when we remember Proud Boys. 585 00:33:41,160 --> 00:33:41,920 Speaker 1: Oh my gosh. 586 00:33:41,960 --> 00:33:44,360 Speaker 2: Well, yeah, we talked about them a while back before 587 00:33:44,400 --> 00:33:48,440 Speaker 2: they got involved with the January six things at the 588 00:33:48,520 --> 00:33:52,480 Speaker 2: right date, that whole stuff, because they were one of 589 00:33:52,480 --> 00:33:59,280 Speaker 2: those groups that seems like an interesting way for especially 590 00:33:59,600 --> 00:34:03,280 Speaker 2: like former soldiers or people who are no longer soldiers, 591 00:34:03,320 --> 00:34:06,560 Speaker 2: to get together and have like a thing to do, right, 592 00:34:06,840 --> 00:34:10,960 Speaker 2: a post deployment hang kind of thing, which is really 593 00:34:11,000 --> 00:34:16,520 Speaker 2: important actually, but it seems like it went a different way. 594 00:34:17,200 --> 00:34:20,160 Speaker 2: I don't know it, like this whole defending the constitution 595 00:34:20,360 --> 00:34:22,840 Speaker 2: thing no matter what. From like there's something at the 596 00:34:22,840 --> 00:34:25,120 Speaker 2: heart of it that seems like, okay, I get that, 597 00:34:25,560 --> 00:34:29,040 Speaker 2: but then it just goes towards I don't know how 598 00:34:29,080 --> 00:34:34,040 Speaker 2: to even say it. Some often racism and terrible things. 599 00:34:34,360 --> 00:34:34,880 Speaker 5: Yeah. 600 00:34:35,040 --> 00:34:39,800 Speaker 1: You can read reports from outfits like the Counter Extremism 601 00:34:39,920 --> 00:34:46,359 Speaker 1: Project or CEP that describes these groups this cottage industry 602 00:34:46,480 --> 00:34:53,120 Speaker 1: of militias as a backup standby army for what they 603 00:34:53,440 --> 00:34:57,960 Speaker 1: envision as some sort of apocalyptic reckoning, right, some sort 604 00:34:57,960 --> 00:35:02,440 Speaker 1: of race war. They have been affiliated with groups like 605 00:35:02,480 --> 00:35:05,279 Speaker 1: the oath Keepers, right, and I'm sure there are some 606 00:35:05,840 --> 00:35:11,200 Speaker 1: one percenter motorcycle clubs that might have a Venn diagram there. 607 00:35:12,040 --> 00:35:16,959 Speaker 1: We do have to say, most importantly, one, this conspiracy 608 00:35:17,080 --> 00:35:19,760 Speaker 1: does appear to be real. It may be an episode 609 00:35:19,760 --> 00:35:22,960 Speaker 1: in the future. And two, I hate to say it, 610 00:35:23,000 --> 00:35:26,480 Speaker 1: but hashtag not all gyms. Some people just like to 611 00:35:26,480 --> 00:35:27,560 Speaker 1: go boxing, you. 612 00:35:27,560 --> 00:35:30,759 Speaker 2: Know, well, of course, well, absolutely not all gyms, and 613 00:35:30,760 --> 00:35:34,719 Speaker 2: also not all groups like that. I mean, it's so 614 00:35:34,800 --> 00:35:38,680 Speaker 2: weird to me because you guys remember early early in 615 00:35:38,719 --> 00:35:41,799 Speaker 2: the especially ben early in the video days, when we 616 00:35:41,840 --> 00:35:45,120 Speaker 2: would get reached out to sometimes by people who were 617 00:35:45,200 --> 00:35:50,160 Speaker 2: like oathkeeper kind of folks. I would say, right, who 618 00:35:50,600 --> 00:35:54,840 Speaker 2: have this mentality of I am finished with my military service, 619 00:35:55,080 --> 00:35:58,000 Speaker 2: but I'm dedicated to either the country or the human 620 00:35:58,040 --> 00:36:01,680 Speaker 2: beings inside the country. Right, So, at least from what 621 00:36:01,719 --> 00:36:06,040 Speaker 2: we've saw from their writings, it's I will protect the 622 00:36:06,120 --> 00:36:08,319 Speaker 2: human beings who live in the United States from any 623 00:36:08,480 --> 00:36:13,360 Speaker 2: enemy that tries to roll through here, right, including exactly 624 00:36:13,400 --> 00:36:16,320 Speaker 2: including if it's like a government that comes through, or 625 00:36:16,320 --> 00:36:19,240 Speaker 2: a tyrant comes through, I will defend the people around 626 00:36:19,280 --> 00:36:22,200 Speaker 2: me basically, which I don't know about you guys. That 627 00:36:22,320 --> 00:36:26,359 Speaker 2: feels pretty noble to me, at least in theory when 628 00:36:26,400 --> 00:36:29,040 Speaker 2: you say it like that. But again, when you have 629 00:36:29,120 --> 00:36:31,279 Speaker 2: a bunch of people who are like minded in that 630 00:36:31,320 --> 00:36:33,799 Speaker 2: way and then there's a leader who maybe has some 631 00:36:33,880 --> 00:36:36,800 Speaker 2: different kind of views, it gets it's a slippery slope 632 00:36:36,880 --> 00:36:40,759 Speaker 2: towards radicalization. So it's it's I don't know, I just 633 00:36:40,800 --> 00:36:42,239 Speaker 2: I just want to put that out there because I 634 00:36:42,239 --> 00:36:44,680 Speaker 2: know there are people listening, at least some people listening 635 00:36:44,760 --> 00:36:48,799 Speaker 2: right now that feel the positive parts of that, but 636 00:36:49,160 --> 00:36:52,799 Speaker 2: hopefully aren't in you know, infected or influenced by the 637 00:36:52,800 --> 00:36:53,520 Speaker 2: negative parts. 638 00:36:53,640 --> 00:36:57,120 Speaker 1: Dude, honestly shout out to everybody doing reps as you're 639 00:36:57,160 --> 00:36:59,240 Speaker 1: listening to the show. You know what I mean. 640 00:37:00,800 --> 00:37:01,000 Speaker 5: There. 641 00:37:01,280 --> 00:37:04,480 Speaker 1: Yeah, this also reminds me to your point, met, this 642 00:37:04,560 --> 00:37:08,680 Speaker 1: reminds me of nol and observation you made in a 643 00:37:08,719 --> 00:37:13,440 Speaker 1: recent previous episode where he said, yeah, communism could be 644 00:37:13,520 --> 00:37:19,040 Speaker 1: great if anybody actually did it right. Because these theories, 645 00:37:19,280 --> 00:37:24,800 Speaker 1: these grand ideas, in practice, they so often divolve into 646 00:37:24,960 --> 00:37:30,720 Speaker 1: very different things. And when we're talking about active clubs. Again, 647 00:37:31,560 --> 00:37:35,799 Speaker 1: it's just like motorcycle gangs. A very small percentage of 648 00:37:36,080 --> 00:37:39,040 Speaker 1: active clubs or whatever you want to group them as, 649 00:37:39,280 --> 00:37:43,360 Speaker 1: a very small percentage of them are these white supremacists. 650 00:37:43,680 --> 00:37:46,239 Speaker 1: But if you look at the origin story, as far 651 00:37:46,280 --> 00:37:48,880 Speaker 1: as we can tell, it goes back to a guy 652 00:37:48,960 --> 00:37:54,000 Speaker 1: named Robert Rundo, Are you in d operating out of 653 00:37:54,040 --> 00:37:59,480 Speaker 1: Orange County, California, was attempting to launch an extremist network 654 00:37:59,520 --> 00:38:03,800 Speaker 1: for some time. In twenty seventeen, he built something called 655 00:38:04,160 --> 00:38:10,200 Speaker 1: the Rise Above Movement or RAM, and it called itself 656 00:38:10,320 --> 00:38:13,520 Speaker 1: like a top notch MMA club. It was going to 657 00:38:13,600 --> 00:38:18,160 Speaker 1: find the warrior spirit in you, and anyone could sign 658 00:38:18,239 --> 00:38:20,760 Speaker 1: up as long as they were a dude and white. 659 00:38:21,440 --> 00:38:27,680 Speaker 1: Low caveat there. He got into a lot of trouble. 660 00:38:27,719 --> 00:38:31,680 Speaker 1: In twenty nineteen, this guy was charged with federal conspiracy 661 00:38:31,719 --> 00:38:37,000 Speaker 1: to riot in sight violence right to try to create 662 00:38:37,080 --> 00:38:40,400 Speaker 1: the race war the same way that Charles Manson pushed 663 00:38:40,440 --> 00:38:45,759 Speaker 1: his followers to enact Helter Skelter and tune in for 664 00:38:45,920 --> 00:38:48,919 Speaker 1: our Manson and Cia episode on the way. 665 00:38:49,120 --> 00:38:51,360 Speaker 4: There's some wild stuff in there, Ben, with the Manson 666 00:38:51,440 --> 00:38:54,360 Speaker 4: Cia connections that I only just stumbled across recently. 667 00:38:55,000 --> 00:38:57,120 Speaker 5: I can't wait to have that conversation. 668 00:38:56,840 --> 00:38:59,720 Speaker 1: Excited as well. Yeah, that's going to be a doozy, 669 00:39:00,040 --> 00:39:05,400 Speaker 1: as you said, federal prosecutors when they charged Robert Rundo. 670 00:39:06,600 --> 00:39:11,480 Speaker 1: The judge threw the case out just in March of 671 00:39:11,520 --> 00:39:14,920 Speaker 1: this year, in twenty twenty four, and then another judge 672 00:39:14,960 --> 00:39:18,799 Speaker 1: came back in and reinstated the case. If you want 673 00:39:18,840 --> 00:39:23,000 Speaker 1: to learn more, check out the Fantastic Guardian article summarizing 674 00:39:23,040 --> 00:39:28,960 Speaker 1: this by Ali Winston. The headline is jailed, released, jailed again. 675 00:39:29,360 --> 00:39:34,719 Speaker 1: Whiplash in a leading neo Nazis legal case. It's strange, man, 676 00:39:34,840 --> 00:39:36,960 Speaker 1: I don't know about this stuff. Have you guys ever 677 00:39:37,600 --> 00:39:42,520 Speaker 1: entered into an organization or pursued some kind of hangout 678 00:39:42,600 --> 00:39:46,440 Speaker 1: or fellowship only defined? It was very different than what 679 00:39:46,560 --> 00:39:48,000 Speaker 1: it presented itself. 680 00:39:48,040 --> 00:39:50,120 Speaker 4: As I think I mentioned to you that I had 681 00:39:50,120 --> 00:39:51,960 Speaker 4: a brief period where I was hanging out with some 682 00:39:52,080 --> 00:39:56,640 Speaker 4: behigh faith folks that you know, it has been lumped 683 00:39:56,680 --> 00:39:57,960 Speaker 4: in with the C word and. 684 00:39:58,160 --> 00:40:00,960 Speaker 5: You know, the cult that is the other sea where. 685 00:40:01,600 --> 00:40:05,520 Speaker 4: I found it to be very friendly, you know, kind 686 00:40:05,560 --> 00:40:09,839 Speaker 4: of meet for dinner and like minded folks just kind 687 00:40:09,840 --> 00:40:10,280 Speaker 4: of talking. 688 00:40:10,600 --> 00:40:13,040 Speaker 5: It's almost like a group therapy or like an AA 689 00:40:13,160 --> 00:40:14,560 Speaker 5: meeting or something like that. 690 00:40:14,800 --> 00:40:16,480 Speaker 4: I did get to a point where it felt a 691 00:40:16,520 --> 00:40:20,040 Speaker 4: little weird or like it wasn't exactly what my wheelhouse is. 692 00:40:20,920 --> 00:40:24,640 Speaker 4: But I never felt like I was being coerced into 693 00:40:24,680 --> 00:40:25,960 Speaker 4: anything at all. 694 00:40:26,239 --> 00:40:27,759 Speaker 5: But I did get to the point where I'm like, 695 00:40:27,840 --> 00:40:30,279 Speaker 5: I don't think I am the same as these people. Well, 696 00:40:30,320 --> 00:40:32,200 Speaker 5: they're very lovely people. And then I have, you know, 697 00:40:32,239 --> 00:40:33,839 Speaker 5: gradually just sort of slow faded it. 698 00:40:34,080 --> 00:40:36,160 Speaker 4: But it was it was, you know, because of school 699 00:40:36,239 --> 00:40:39,640 Speaker 4: friends of my kid, and no shade on any of 700 00:40:39,640 --> 00:40:41,560 Speaker 4: those people. They are all really lovely people. Just you know, 701 00:40:41,760 --> 00:40:43,160 Speaker 4: I just felt like I didn't really belong. 702 00:40:43,480 --> 00:40:46,000 Speaker 2: Yeah, for a while I was in this group. We 703 00:40:46,040 --> 00:40:48,960 Speaker 2: would get together like once or twice a week and 704 00:40:49,040 --> 00:40:51,319 Speaker 2: we would all kind of sit together, listen to somebody talk, 705 00:40:51,360 --> 00:40:56,520 Speaker 2: and we would sing songs together, often like repeat these 706 00:40:56,760 --> 00:40:58,719 Speaker 2: words that were written down in this book we had. 707 00:40:59,200 --> 00:41:01,040 Speaker 2: And then they tried to get me to drink blood 708 00:41:01,320 --> 00:41:05,319 Speaker 2: and eat you know, human flesh. And they were called 709 00:41:05,320 --> 00:41:08,600 Speaker 2: the United Methodist Church or something like that. 710 00:41:08,920 --> 00:41:10,000 Speaker 5: I did stuff to you. 711 00:41:10,239 --> 00:41:11,520 Speaker 2: I'm just playing. I'm just playing. 712 00:41:12,920 --> 00:41:18,040 Speaker 1: Canibalism tells us that transubstantiation is like calling bass in 713 00:41:18,120 --> 00:41:20,239 Speaker 1: a game attack catalyst. 714 00:41:20,320 --> 00:41:23,000 Speaker 4: I don't think transibstantiation counts as cannibalism. 715 00:41:23,120 --> 00:41:25,759 Speaker 5: I think it's okay. Yeah, yeah, I went to youth 716 00:41:25,800 --> 00:41:26,319 Speaker 5: group too. 717 00:41:26,760 --> 00:41:28,759 Speaker 4: I ate a lot of tacos, didn't really eat any 718 00:41:28,840 --> 00:41:29,879 Speaker 4: human flesh that I know. 719 00:41:29,920 --> 00:41:31,000 Speaker 1: Technically a sandwich. 720 00:41:33,239 --> 00:41:35,360 Speaker 5: Why am I so anti taco as sandwich? 721 00:41:35,360 --> 00:41:38,960 Speaker 1: I'm just it's like the most conservative opinion I have 722 00:41:39,120 --> 00:41:39,640 Speaker 1: ever heard. 723 00:41:39,680 --> 00:41:42,319 Speaker 4: I never really associated that with being one way or 724 00:41:42,320 --> 00:41:43,800 Speaker 4: the other politically speaking. 725 00:41:44,040 --> 00:41:45,640 Speaker 1: I like that you're a firebrand for it. 726 00:41:45,640 --> 00:41:47,640 Speaker 4: I think I just like being contankerous about this one 727 00:41:47,719 --> 00:41:49,520 Speaker 4: really pretty meaningless issue. 728 00:41:49,920 --> 00:41:53,759 Speaker 5: You know, I will die on this hills. 729 00:41:53,840 --> 00:41:58,200 Speaker 1: And there are people who appear to have decided that 730 00:41:58,280 --> 00:42:02,759 Speaker 1: they will die on this hill of white supremacy. Right 731 00:42:03,080 --> 00:42:06,520 Speaker 1: of active militias. One thing we need to understand in 732 00:42:06,560 --> 00:42:10,840 Speaker 1: the larger context, going back to our earlier conversation in 733 00:42:10,840 --> 00:42:16,400 Speaker 1: tonight's program about the importance of election monitoring, we see 734 00:42:16,840 --> 00:42:22,959 Speaker 1: opportunities for conspiracy and we see opportunities for corruption. One 735 00:42:23,200 --> 00:42:28,640 Speaker 1: very clever thing that the US military does is rotate 736 00:42:28,800 --> 00:42:33,600 Speaker 1: out its leaders such that you are following a position 737 00:42:34,360 --> 00:42:37,800 Speaker 1: rather than following a person right, and this avoids the 738 00:42:39,239 --> 00:42:42,920 Speaker 1: cultish riz that is created by the Mansons and the 739 00:42:43,000 --> 00:42:46,600 Speaker 1: Jim Joneses, and you know, I'll say at the castros. 740 00:42:46,880 --> 00:42:51,080 Speaker 1: But the issue here is that the US right now, 741 00:42:51,840 --> 00:42:57,799 Speaker 1: the anglosphere entire is pretty concerned about the idea of 742 00:42:57,840 --> 00:43:04,840 Speaker 1: this hidden column of successionist supremacist you know, and oftentimes 743 00:43:05,320 --> 00:43:10,040 Speaker 1: you will hear references to groups like this in just 744 00:43:10,760 --> 00:43:16,880 Speaker 1: passing in, like our conversations about attacks on power stations, 745 00:43:17,160 --> 00:43:21,640 Speaker 1: right on the very vulnerable US infrastructure, we see again 746 00:43:21,760 --> 00:43:26,240 Speaker 1: the shadow of these supremacists. It's a very old enemy, 747 00:43:26,640 --> 00:43:30,720 Speaker 1: and it's a it survives, and it's a very troubling 748 00:43:30,760 --> 00:43:35,439 Speaker 1: conspiracy in my opinion. Obviously, we don't obviously we don't 749 00:43:35,480 --> 00:43:38,720 Speaker 1: co sign this stuff. We think fitness is super cool, 750 00:43:39,040 --> 00:43:42,400 Speaker 1: but we really appreciate you, Fiona, for reaching out because 751 00:43:42,440 --> 00:43:45,319 Speaker 1: a lot of people don't know about this. Imagine you 752 00:43:45,440 --> 00:43:48,440 Speaker 1: go to a gym, right You've got your New Year's 753 00:43:48,480 --> 00:43:52,719 Speaker 1: resolution or whatever, and you're thinking, this is it. I'm 754 00:43:52,760 --> 00:43:57,240 Speaker 1: gonna learn mma, I'm gonna learn parkour, I've got my gloves, 755 00:43:57,719 --> 00:44:02,040 Speaker 1: I got my weird little shorts whatever, and then several 756 00:44:02,200 --> 00:44:06,040 Speaker 1: months in they start inviting you to a different sort 757 00:44:06,080 --> 00:44:09,840 Speaker 1: of meeting. I don't know, like, how prevalent do you 758 00:44:09,840 --> 00:44:11,080 Speaker 1: guys think this could be. 759 00:44:11,400 --> 00:44:13,120 Speaker 2: I don't think it's prevalent at all. 760 00:44:13,520 --> 00:44:15,120 Speaker 1: I think it must be a rarity, right. 761 00:44:15,400 --> 00:44:17,960 Speaker 2: I've seen a lot of MMA Jim's. I've seen a 762 00:44:18,000 --> 00:44:22,240 Speaker 2: lot of individuals who like study that kind of martial arts, 763 00:44:23,040 --> 00:44:27,279 Speaker 2: and I've yet to meet somebody who crosses that goes 764 00:44:27,320 --> 00:44:30,120 Speaker 2: into whatever that is, or at least openly. Right, Maybe 765 00:44:30,120 --> 00:44:33,680 Speaker 2: I haven't. I just haven't had that conversation with them. 766 00:44:33,880 --> 00:44:34,320 Speaker 5: Yeah. 767 00:44:34,520 --> 00:44:38,080 Speaker 1: Yeah, maybe they did a vibe check on you and 768 00:44:38,120 --> 00:44:41,560 Speaker 1: they decided you weren't receptive, which I think is a 769 00:44:41,560 --> 00:44:41,960 Speaker 1: good thing. 770 00:44:42,200 --> 00:44:43,759 Speaker 2: I doubt it, though, I don't know. 771 00:44:44,960 --> 00:44:49,399 Speaker 1: Well, they're out there, folks, And with this we are 772 00:44:49,520 --> 00:44:52,560 Speaker 1: going to call it an evening. We're going to dive 773 00:44:52,760 --> 00:44:57,279 Speaker 1: into these stories in future episodes. Thank you to everybody 774 00:44:57,320 --> 00:44:59,920 Speaker 1: who took the time to reach out and touch faith 775 00:45:00,080 --> 00:45:02,799 Speaker 1: and contact us. If you would like to join the 776 00:45:02,840 --> 00:45:07,760 Speaker 1: show in a future program, please come into our cult. 777 00:45:08,920 --> 00:45:12,520 Speaker 1: It feels weird to ask people to contact us after 778 00:45:12,560 --> 00:45:16,320 Speaker 1: we just talked about how fitness clubs will sucker people 779 00:45:16,320 --> 00:45:20,880 Speaker 1: into evil things. But you know, find us online. 780 00:45:20,440 --> 00:45:21,600 Speaker 5: Oh, find us online. 781 00:45:21,680 --> 00:45:26,160 Speaker 4: Indeed, we exist in the handle conspiracy Stuff on YouTube, 782 00:45:26,400 --> 00:45:28,520 Speaker 4: where we have video content rolling out and switching up 783 00:45:28,560 --> 00:45:32,520 Speaker 4: the order this time, on xfka, Twitter, and on Facebook 784 00:45:32,520 --> 00:45:34,239 Speaker 4: where you can join our Facebook group Here's where it 785 00:45:34,239 --> 00:45:37,400 Speaker 4: gets crazy. On Instagram and TikTok or Conspiracy Stuff Show. 786 00:45:37,600 --> 00:45:41,319 Speaker 2: You can find us by calling this number one eight 787 00:45:41,480 --> 00:45:46,000 Speaker 2: three three std WYTK. When you call in, you've got 788 00:45:46,080 --> 00:45:49,520 Speaker 2: three minutes. It's a voicemail system. Say whatever you'd like do. 789 00:45:49,640 --> 00:45:51,680 Speaker 2: Give yourself a cool nickname and let us know if 790 00:45:51,680 --> 00:45:54,200 Speaker 2: we can use your voice and name on the air. 791 00:45:54,480 --> 00:45:55,840 Speaker 2: If you got more to say thing and fit in 792 00:45:55,840 --> 00:45:58,479 Speaker 2: that three minutes, why not instead send us a good 793 00:45:58,560 --> 00:45:59,760 Speaker 2: old fashion email. 794 00:46:00,080 --> 00:46:21,680 Speaker 1: We are conspiracy at iHeartRadio dot com. 795 00:46:21,840 --> 00:46:23,880 Speaker 2: Stuff they don't want you to know is a production 796 00:46:24,000 --> 00:46:28,520 Speaker 2: of iHeartRadio. For more podcasts from iHeartRadio, visit the iHeartRadio app, 797 00:46:28,600 --> 00:46:31,480 Speaker 2: Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.