1
00:00:12,560 --> 00:00:15,960
Speaker 1: Hey, Brack. Okay, this is Brack Costin. I've known him.

2
00:00:16,480 --> 00:00:18,799
Speaker 1: Do you know how long we've known each other, Breck.

3
00:00:18,840 --> 00:00:22,320
Speaker 2: It's probably been close to twenty years at this point.

4
00:00:21,760 --> 00:00:25,880
Speaker 1: No more, because I was like thirty thirty one, maybe

5
00:00:25,920 --> 00:00:28,760
Speaker 1: even younger anyway, so easily, No, I think it's twenty five.

6
00:00:29,840 --> 00:00:34,320
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, I've never I've never been with time and yeah.

7
00:00:34,200 --> 00:00:37,239
Speaker 1: I think I was like in my early thirties. All right,

8
00:00:37,240 --> 00:00:39,800
Speaker 1: So this is Breck Costin. I've known him for years

9
00:00:40,280 --> 00:00:43,400
Speaker 1: because a group of friends of mine had found this

10
00:00:43,720 --> 00:00:47,800
Speaker 1: Freedom course in LA and it was transformative for them,

11
00:00:47,840 --> 00:00:49,680
Speaker 1: and I liked the name Freedom, and I was like

12
00:00:49,960 --> 00:00:52,519
Speaker 1: at a crossroads with a relationship. Yeah, Breck, I think

13
00:00:52,560 --> 00:00:53,960
Speaker 1: it was earlier. It was like in my twenties.

14
00:00:54,280 --> 00:00:55,840
Speaker 2: Yeah, and I was.

15
00:00:55,920 --> 00:00:57,880
Speaker 1: So that was like a long time ago, maybe almost

16
00:00:57,920 --> 00:01:00,920
Speaker 1: thirty years ago, and you could probably go back and

17
00:01:00,920 --> 00:01:03,040
Speaker 1: look at the dates. I probably stole my Freedom notebook

18
00:01:03,120 --> 00:01:05,800
Speaker 1: upstairs and I went to this like three day immersive

19
00:01:05,840 --> 00:01:09,000
Speaker 1: experience at Breck and uh learned a language a lot

20
00:01:09,000 --> 00:01:11,560
Speaker 1: of people use now that I actually know is because

21
00:01:11,560 --> 00:01:13,480
Speaker 1: of me, which we'll get into. And Breck's sort of

22
00:01:13,520 --> 00:01:15,640
Speaker 1: like oblivious to all that like commercial stuff in ways,

23
00:01:15,680 --> 00:01:18,040
Speaker 1: which I like because like he never knows how many

24
00:01:18,080 --> 00:01:19,920
Speaker 1: times I use his words, but I do always give

25
00:01:19,959 --> 00:01:23,119
Speaker 1: him credit, but like other people do also. So Breck

26
00:01:23,360 --> 00:01:29,600
Speaker 1: is a life coach slash non traditional therapist but not

27
00:01:29,720 --> 00:01:33,279
Speaker 1: like a doctor. And we've known each other for years

28
00:01:33,440 --> 00:01:37,679
Speaker 1: and we talk fairly regularly, and he's a great guy

29
00:01:37,720 --> 00:01:39,760
Speaker 1: and he's had a big life, and I wanted to

30
00:01:39,800 --> 00:01:40,440
Speaker 1: have him on here.

31
00:01:40,480 --> 00:01:42,520
Speaker 3: I think you came on years ago when I started.

32
00:01:43,160 --> 00:01:46,360
Speaker 2: No, I never came on as podcast. We did you

33
00:01:46,400 --> 00:01:47,480
Speaker 2: when you had your talk show?

34
00:01:47,680 --> 00:01:48,000
Speaker 3: You didn't.

35
00:01:48,200 --> 00:01:50,240
Speaker 1: I think we did, but maybe yeah we did in

36
00:01:50,280 --> 00:01:52,640
Speaker 1: the very beginning, one hundred percent.

37
00:01:52,840 --> 00:01:55,120
Speaker 2: Telling you you know, it's way too long now I

38
00:01:55,240 --> 00:01:57,480
Speaker 2: can't remember apparently, yeah, I.

39
00:01:57,360 --> 00:02:00,440
Speaker 1: Mean one hundred percent. In the very very beginning we talked.

40
00:02:01,000 --> 00:02:04,320
Speaker 1: So you're in LA and we spoke the other day,

41
00:02:04,920 --> 00:02:07,920
Speaker 1: and I thought that hopefully you'd want to come on more,

42
00:02:08,000 --> 00:02:10,160
Speaker 1: but I'll sort of drive and I wanted to just

43
00:02:10,200 --> 00:02:13,519
Speaker 1: like bring up different concepts that we've discussed over the

44
00:02:13,600 --> 00:02:15,799
Speaker 1: years that jump off the page to me, and also

45
00:02:15,960 --> 00:02:18,320
Speaker 1: that you probably don't even know that I've discussed the

46
00:02:18,360 --> 00:02:20,600
Speaker 1: people and have jumped off the page with them. So

47
00:02:20,639 --> 00:02:23,480
Speaker 1: like you talk about a million things, but like probably

48
00:02:23,480 --> 00:02:25,399
Speaker 1: the things you wouldn't even think would be the biggest thing.

49
00:02:25,880 --> 00:02:27,760
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's true. I mean, you know, people will take

50
00:02:27,760 --> 00:02:30,160
Speaker 2: away what they think is really relevant and resonates. And

51
00:02:30,200 --> 00:02:32,120
Speaker 2: I think we're, you know, as a as a coach

52
00:02:32,280 --> 00:02:35,280
Speaker 2: or just as as a person who's contributing, you're you're

53
00:02:35,280 --> 00:02:39,400
Speaker 2: always looking for different portals and different metaphors and different language, music,

54
00:02:39,480 --> 00:02:42,080
Speaker 2: anything you can that you think will get something from

55
00:02:42,120 --> 00:02:45,280
Speaker 2: your mouth to someone's ear that will be useful, right,

56
00:02:45,360 --> 00:02:48,440
Speaker 2: like digestible and people respond to you know, two different

57
00:02:48,560 --> 00:02:53,080
Speaker 2: different image imagery, different music, different rhythms, different metaphors. So

58
00:02:53,120 --> 00:02:55,720
Speaker 2: it's kind of figuring out what's what will translate for

59
00:02:55,760 --> 00:02:56,320
Speaker 2: each person.

60
00:02:56,919 --> 00:02:58,760
Speaker 1: So I guess we'll go with the biggest ticket item.

61
00:02:58,760 --> 00:03:00,600
Speaker 1: I was going to do charming, which we'll do after

62
00:03:00,639 --> 00:03:03,359
Speaker 1: because it really surprises people in the charming. I had

63
00:03:03,360 --> 00:03:06,360
Speaker 1: a podcast called Charming is a Red Flag and it

64
00:03:06,440 --> 00:03:08,959
Speaker 1: was it was very It had a lot of impact,

65
00:03:08,960 --> 00:03:11,400
Speaker 1: which was shocking because it really people. It spoke to

66
00:03:11,400 --> 00:03:13,560
Speaker 1: people because charming is used as something positive. But let

67
00:03:13,560 --> 00:03:15,840
Speaker 1: me just park that for one second. Okay, let's talk

68
00:03:15,880 --> 00:03:20,200
Speaker 1: about noise. Okay, many people use the term noise as

69
00:03:20,240 --> 00:03:23,480
Speaker 1: a result of me commercializing the term noise as a

70
00:03:23,520 --> 00:03:26,560
Speaker 1: result of learning it from you at the Freedom course,

71
00:03:26,600 --> 00:03:30,080
Speaker 1: and I took it to another level. You talked about

72
00:03:30,280 --> 00:03:33,040
Speaker 1: food noise and money noise, and different people have different

73
00:03:33,120 --> 00:03:38,680
Speaker 1: noise or like talking about someone's particularly noisy in that area.

74
00:03:38,720 --> 00:03:42,600
Speaker 1: And I wrote a book called Naturally Thin about food noise.

75
00:03:43,120 --> 00:03:45,760
Speaker 1: But I've seen people, I've seen on social media other

76
00:03:45,760 --> 00:03:47,560
Speaker 1: people talk about it. They don't even realize that it

77
00:03:47,560 --> 00:03:49,000
Speaker 1: came from me and that it came from you.

78
00:03:49,680 --> 00:03:53,720
Speaker 3: So just talk. Let's talk about noise for a little bit, okay.

79
00:03:53,840 --> 00:03:56,880
Speaker 2: So and I like that, you know, I love that.

80
00:03:57,040 --> 00:03:59,280
Speaker 2: As you said, you know, I kind of think of

81
00:03:59,280 --> 00:04:03,080
Speaker 2: myself as being the scenes and not to diminish any

82
00:04:03,080 --> 00:04:05,000
Speaker 2: other coaches or any other people who are in the

83
00:04:05,200 --> 00:04:07,680
Speaker 2: working in you know, transformational world or in a self

84
00:04:07,680 --> 00:04:11,400
Speaker 2: help world, spiritual world. But I just think the contract

85
00:04:11,560 --> 00:04:15,480
Speaker 2: really is is that you're you're a source, right, you know,

86
00:04:15,680 --> 00:04:18,080
Speaker 2: you're not the you know, you're not not that you

87
00:04:18,120 --> 00:04:21,520
Speaker 2: can't be the mouthpiece for what you're delivering, but you're

88
00:04:21,560 --> 00:04:23,520
Speaker 2: actually the source, and you want other people to be

89
00:04:23,600 --> 00:04:26,280
Speaker 2: able to deliver that from their own particular expression, right,

90
00:04:26,320 --> 00:04:27,680
Speaker 2: and they make it their own, they take it to

91
00:04:27,720 --> 00:04:30,440
Speaker 2: all other level. So that's always exciting for me when

92
00:04:30,480 --> 00:04:32,960
Speaker 2: you know, like as you take you know, noise and

93
00:04:33,040 --> 00:04:35,800
Speaker 2: kind of disseminate it so it becomes part of the vernacular,

94
00:04:36,120 --> 00:04:38,640
Speaker 2: part of the culture. Right. I like that. I like

95
00:04:38,839 --> 00:04:40,440
Speaker 2: watching that those kinds of things happen.

96
00:04:40,760 --> 00:04:43,120
Speaker 1: They say the best relationships are the rock and the stars.

97
00:04:43,160 --> 00:04:45,760
Speaker 1: So you have many stars that you talk to, but

98
00:04:46,080 --> 00:04:48,320
Speaker 1: like you're they're the star. You're the rock, Like you're

99
00:04:48,360 --> 00:04:50,560
Speaker 1: behind the scenes and understanding.

100
00:04:50,760 --> 00:04:54,080
Speaker 2: Like any great team, you understand your position, you know,

101
00:04:54,279 --> 00:04:56,000
Speaker 2: and you play your position. And I think a lot

102
00:04:56,000 --> 00:04:57,960
Speaker 2: of times where it's conflicted and I'll get into noise.

103
00:04:58,360 --> 00:05:00,680
Speaker 2: Even from this context, I think for a lot of

104
00:05:00,720 --> 00:05:03,520
Speaker 2: people that they're they're they're so wanting to play a

105
00:05:03,560 --> 00:05:07,120
Speaker 2: position that they're just not designed for and it's and

106
00:05:07,160 --> 00:05:09,960
Speaker 2: it's just and then and I consider that to be

107
00:05:10,080 --> 00:05:12,080
Speaker 2: one of the you know, when you're trying to compete

108
00:05:12,080 --> 00:05:14,320
Speaker 2: where you're not competitive, it is it is a source

109
00:05:14,360 --> 00:05:17,599
Speaker 2: of suffering. Wow, it is. And people will spend years

110
00:05:17,600 --> 00:05:19,839
Speaker 2: and years and years trying to squeeze them into something

111
00:05:19,880 --> 00:05:22,880
Speaker 2: that they just weren't designed to do and so, and

112
00:05:22,920 --> 00:05:26,120
Speaker 2: that goes right into noise as well. So noise is

113
00:05:26,160 --> 00:05:30,320
Speaker 2: this very basically it's your really your internal commentary that's

114
00:05:30,600 --> 00:05:32,960
Speaker 2: good or bad. Now, this is what people think, they oh,

115
00:05:33,000 --> 00:05:35,880
Speaker 2: good noise is good. I'm saying no, no good noise.

116
00:05:35,880 --> 00:05:37,840
Speaker 2: You're trying to keep around. Bad noise you're trying to

117
00:05:37,839 --> 00:05:41,120
Speaker 2: get rid of. So it has you either way. It

118
00:05:41,120 --> 00:05:42,560
Speaker 2: holds you hostage either way.

119
00:05:42,640 --> 00:05:45,360
Speaker 1: So you're saying, like, the absence of noise is real

120
00:05:45,440 --> 00:05:47,279
Speaker 1: true piece. It doesn't matter if it's good or bad.

121
00:05:47,560 --> 00:05:50,000
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's where freedom and peace is right. And if

122
00:05:50,040 --> 00:05:51,960
Speaker 2: you look at when you're the most brilliant, well you're

123
00:05:52,040 --> 00:05:55,080
Speaker 2: when you look at where your essence is being fully expressed,

124
00:05:55,120 --> 00:05:57,960
Speaker 2: and it's the essential you. It's when there's no noise.

125
00:05:58,240 --> 00:05:59,960
Speaker 2: So that's a singer singing in front of the sea

126
00:06:00,320 --> 00:06:02,479
Speaker 2: thousand people and they're not trying to remember their lyrics.

127
00:06:02,680 --> 00:06:05,400
Speaker 2: They're not remembering it. They're connected to the audience. They're

128
00:06:05,440 --> 00:06:08,000
Speaker 2: expressing themselves there. They don't have like oh man, I'm

129
00:06:08,480 --> 00:06:12,440
Speaker 2: crushing it or I'm you know, or this when badly.

130
00:06:12,760 --> 00:06:15,640
Speaker 1: Meaning like even if it's family noise and you're managing it,

131
00:06:15,680 --> 00:06:17,600
Speaker 1: you're still having to deal with that. You're thinking about

132
00:06:17,600 --> 00:06:20,760
Speaker 1: it positive, like I got it under control. That's noisy too,

133
00:06:20,880 --> 00:06:21,799
Speaker 1: and bad noises.

134
00:06:22,000 --> 00:06:25,240
Speaker 2: Yeah, so management, the management of something is even more.

135
00:06:25,600 --> 00:06:28,640
Speaker 2: I kind of think of this as like a feral tiger, Like,

136
00:06:28,680 --> 00:06:30,839
Speaker 2: you know, your noise can be running rampant and just

137
00:06:30,960 --> 00:06:34,520
Speaker 2: eating anything that's on the African plane, right, feral, and

138
00:06:34,560 --> 00:06:36,760
Speaker 2: then when it comes up with a solution to a problem, Okay,

139
00:06:36,800 --> 00:06:40,760
Speaker 2: I'll manage this. I'll juste question this animal, this ferocious animal,

140
00:06:40,760 --> 00:06:44,400
Speaker 2: and that just as bad. Right. It's literally like you,

141
00:06:44,800 --> 00:06:47,240
Speaker 2: this is a Siegfried and Roy of noise. Is they

142
00:06:47,279 --> 00:06:49,520
Speaker 2: know how to work with white tigers, you know they

143
00:06:49,760 --> 00:06:52,719
Speaker 2: they made millions of dollars working with with this, you know.

144
00:06:52,800 --> 00:06:56,360
Speaker 2: So it's a it's understanding. It's understanding how to work

145
00:06:56,520 --> 00:06:59,080
Speaker 2: with you know, your own you know animal. I'll talk

146
00:06:59,120 --> 00:07:01,760
Speaker 2: about survivally noise in that regard as well, but it

147
00:07:01,839 --> 00:07:05,120
Speaker 2: really is understanding that when you are truly there is

148
00:07:05,160 --> 00:07:07,760
Speaker 2: when there's no noise. So that's that's when you, like,

149
00:07:08,160 --> 00:07:11,160
Speaker 2: in this conversation that we're having, if you and I

150
00:07:11,200 --> 00:07:13,120
Speaker 2: were going, God, I hope this is going well. I

151
00:07:13,200 --> 00:07:15,200
Speaker 2: wonder if this is going all right or our internal

152
00:07:15,240 --> 00:07:18,760
Speaker 2: dialogue was like, I'm not sure what to say. It's noisy, Yeah,

153
00:07:18,760 --> 00:07:19,760
Speaker 2: it'd be like a noise.

154
00:07:20,160 --> 00:07:23,000
Speaker 1: Well, that's funny because in the book Naturally Thin, the

155
00:07:23,040 --> 00:07:24,520
Speaker 1: way that I took it to the next level, which

156
00:07:24,520 --> 00:07:27,600
Speaker 1: I forgot until this exact moment, is I said that

157
00:07:27,600 --> 00:07:30,840
Speaker 1: with people with food, they wanted to turn their noise

158
00:07:30,880 --> 00:07:32,840
Speaker 1: into a voice, like you're having just a conversation. I'm

159
00:07:32,880 --> 00:07:34,440
Speaker 1: about to have a meal, and this what I'm gonna

160
00:07:34,440 --> 00:07:37,280
Speaker 1: have versus I was bad, I was good. I ate

161
00:07:37,360 --> 00:07:39,000
Speaker 1: so much so I have to beat myself up and

162
00:07:39,040 --> 00:07:42,640
Speaker 1: eat more or I have to eat nothing like that's managing.

163
00:07:42,680 --> 00:07:45,760
Speaker 1: That's noisy, but just being like okay, chocolate I wanted,

164
00:07:45,800 --> 00:07:47,800
Speaker 1: and I'm you know, next, I'm doing this like have

165
00:07:47,920 --> 00:07:51,160
Speaker 1: it be like a voice, which to me seemed calmer.

166
00:07:51,920 --> 00:07:54,720
Speaker 2: Well it's not only calmer, but you know it's I'd

167
00:07:54,760 --> 00:07:57,640
Speaker 2: see this in phases ethany where you kind of like

168
00:07:58,160 --> 00:08:01,040
Speaker 2: are first of all recognizing it's coming out of the eathers.

169
00:08:01,080 --> 00:08:04,240
Speaker 2: You're recognizing it as an internal dialogue rather that's just

170
00:08:04,280 --> 00:08:06,720
Speaker 2: your personality or that's just the way it is. So

171
00:08:06,800 --> 00:08:10,560
Speaker 2: you're seeing some distinction between oh, this isn't me, this

172
00:08:10,600 --> 00:08:13,200
Speaker 2: is the noise in my head. But most people associate

173
00:08:13,240 --> 00:08:15,800
Speaker 2: the noise in their head with them. And when you

174
00:08:15,800 --> 00:08:18,560
Speaker 2: were your essential you, there's no noise, and it's a

175
00:08:18,560 --> 00:08:22,040
Speaker 2: strange phenomenon, like, oh, when I'm truly being myself, it's

176
00:08:22,040 --> 00:08:24,000
Speaker 2: when there's no noise that's happening.

177
00:08:24,520 --> 00:08:26,640
Speaker 3: That's the most meditative state, is being.

178
00:08:26,600 --> 00:08:29,680
Speaker 2: Just just there, right, yeah. So, and I think in

179
00:08:29,680 --> 00:08:32,200
Speaker 2: a world attempting that right to get to that. So,

180
00:08:32,880 --> 00:08:34,920
Speaker 2: I call that the thing you just mentioned, the cherry

181
00:08:34,920 --> 00:08:37,520
Speaker 2: pie I made it up as a cherry pye conflict.

182
00:08:37,840 --> 00:08:39,680
Speaker 2: And that is like, okay, you got to you got

183
00:08:39,679 --> 00:08:43,280
Speaker 2: to lunch, you got to dinner. And the waiter says, okay,

184
00:08:43,280 --> 00:08:47,000
Speaker 2: would you like dessert and says with a cherry pie?

185
00:08:47,240 --> 00:08:49,360
Speaker 2: Person goes no, you know, no, I'm not going to

186
00:08:49,400 --> 00:08:52,719
Speaker 2: have any cherry pie, and so and and he goes

187
00:08:52,760 --> 00:08:54,319
Speaker 2: ask again, do you want any cherry pie? And verse

188
00:08:54,320 --> 00:08:57,280
Speaker 2: says no, I don't want a cherry pie. And so

189
00:08:57,400 --> 00:08:58,800
Speaker 2: throughout the day you're like, hey, you know I didn't

190
00:08:58,800 --> 00:09:00,240
Speaker 2: eat that cherry pie. I didn't needt the cherry pie

191
00:09:00,240 --> 00:09:01,680
Speaker 2: at all. You know, you didn't have the cherry pie.

192
00:09:01,800 --> 00:09:05,240
Speaker 2: But you're still being dominated by cherry pie, when whether

193
00:09:05,280 --> 00:09:06,320
Speaker 2: you ate it or not.

194
00:09:06,600 --> 00:09:08,160
Speaker 1: You should have just had yeah, take up by a

195
00:09:08,160 --> 00:09:10,800
Speaker 1: couple of bites of it. Yeah, that's funny.

196
00:09:10,640 --> 00:09:12,800
Speaker 2: Whether you ate it or not. That's noisy yet and

197
00:09:12,840 --> 00:09:14,120
Speaker 2: that's what noise looks like.

198
00:09:14,760 --> 00:09:17,560
Speaker 1: Well, also, I want to tell everyone that and we

199
00:09:17,600 --> 00:09:19,760
Speaker 1: can move to something else because I think they maybe

200
00:09:19,760 --> 00:09:22,200
Speaker 1: get it. But like that when Breck introduced it to me,

201
00:09:22,200 --> 00:09:23,719
Speaker 1: because we're talking about thirty years ago. But I have

202
00:09:23,800 --> 00:09:26,040
Speaker 1: a crazy memory for the stuff. You've taught so many

203
00:09:26,040 --> 00:09:28,360
Speaker 1: different things and talked about so many different things. But

204
00:09:28,440 --> 00:09:30,640
Speaker 1: I want to like take people back to what I

205
00:09:30,720 --> 00:09:34,760
Speaker 1: learned that He talked about how each person has different

206
00:09:35,200 --> 00:09:39,480
Speaker 1: Someone could have religion, noise, food, noise, money, noise, age, noise, vanity, noise,

207
00:09:39,559 --> 00:09:41,079
Speaker 1: like it could be anything. It could be all the

208
00:09:41,120 --> 00:09:44,160
Speaker 1: seven deadly sins. It's just you could be noisy about something.

209
00:09:45,040 --> 00:09:46,600
Speaker 1: It could be it could be anything, right, Like, it

210
00:09:46,600 --> 00:09:48,400
Speaker 1: could be the Emperor has no clothes or I'm not

211
00:09:48,559 --> 00:09:51,360
Speaker 1: I'm even someone has billion dollars. They could still think

212
00:09:51,360 --> 00:09:52,199
Speaker 1: they're gonna lose it all.

213
00:09:52,400 --> 00:09:54,319
Speaker 2: Oh no, no, that happens. I mean, have a lot

214
00:09:54,320 --> 00:09:56,000
Speaker 2: of clients just like you know, who have you know,

215
00:09:56,280 --> 00:09:58,040
Speaker 2: story amount of money, and there they can be the

216
00:09:58,040 --> 00:09:58,760
Speaker 2: most terrified.

217
00:09:59,200 --> 00:10:02,040
Speaker 1: Okay, so that that's overall. Noise can be different for

218
00:10:02,080 --> 00:10:03,000
Speaker 1: every single person.

219
00:10:03,120 --> 00:10:06,600
Speaker 2: But the goal It doesn't mean that noise doesn't produce.

220
00:10:07,720 --> 00:10:10,360
Speaker 2: It doesn't mean that it can't produce, meaning like you

221
00:10:10,400 --> 00:10:13,840
Speaker 2: can make a ton of money in a certain area. Right.

222
00:10:14,400 --> 00:10:17,720
Speaker 2: But the thing is is that it mostly where you

223
00:10:17,800 --> 00:10:20,079
Speaker 2: have no noise is where you're the most created, most

224
00:10:20,280 --> 00:10:25,040
Speaker 2: most of alved, most accomplished, most you know, most evolutionary. Right.

225
00:10:25,480 --> 00:10:28,319
Speaker 1: Well, that's interesting, Okay, So this is why that's interesting

226
00:10:28,400 --> 00:10:32,520
Speaker 1: to me because usually the thing that the person's most

227
00:10:32,559 --> 00:10:35,280
Speaker 1: obsessed with, you've called that their plates of wounding, the

228
00:10:35,320 --> 00:10:38,079
Speaker 1: thing that they're thinking about the most, is the thing

229
00:10:38,080 --> 00:10:41,320
Speaker 1: that isn't coming naturally to them. And I also think

230
00:10:41,360 --> 00:10:43,880
Speaker 1: that like between sleep and wake is when all my

231
00:10:43,960 --> 00:10:46,240
Speaker 1: best ideas come, and when I'm the most relaxed, is

232
00:10:46,240 --> 00:10:49,840
Speaker 1: when my amazing like ideas they just come to solve

233
00:10:49,880 --> 00:10:51,199
Speaker 1: a problem that I've had forever.

234
00:10:51,760 --> 00:10:54,720
Speaker 3: And that's quiet, it's literally quiet.

235
00:10:55,480 --> 00:10:58,880
Speaker 2: Well, yeah, you can't you can't solve you know, certainly,

236
00:10:59,559 --> 00:11:02,480
Speaker 2: you know you can can't be creative or innovative or

237
00:11:02,600 --> 00:11:06,560
Speaker 2: generative when fear or shame is dominating, right, It's it's

238
00:11:06,559 --> 00:11:09,880
Speaker 2: a it's a threat, right, So why I say it

239
00:11:09,920 --> 00:11:14,120
Speaker 2: can it can produce? It means that someone can can

240
00:11:14,280 --> 00:11:17,920
Speaker 2: start like they're there, can start start their mote or

241
00:11:17,920 --> 00:11:19,680
Speaker 2: their engine. In terms of I don't want to be

242
00:11:19,800 --> 00:11:21,800
Speaker 2: like that. I'm going to change my circumstances. I'm going

243
00:11:21,840 --> 00:11:26,120
Speaker 2: to drive something, right. So, like the difference between ambition

244
00:11:26,240 --> 00:11:29,160
Speaker 2: and invention is you can start something from a place

245
00:11:29,200 --> 00:11:31,719
Speaker 2: of noise, right, you can. It can kick off from

246
00:11:31,760 --> 00:11:33,480
Speaker 2: place like I don't want to be like my dad.

247
00:11:33,520 --> 00:11:34,559
Speaker 2: I don't want to be like my mom, and I

248
00:11:34,600 --> 00:11:36,080
Speaker 2: don't want to live like this. I want to do

249
00:11:36,120 --> 00:11:39,360
Speaker 2: something from a reactive place. But in order for it

250
00:11:39,400 --> 00:11:41,960
Speaker 2: to fulfill and move, it's got to move into an

251
00:11:42,000 --> 00:11:45,600
Speaker 2: evolutionary creative place where it's not driven drop driven from

252
00:11:45,600 --> 00:11:49,600
Speaker 2: that that source. So we're all we're always looking at

253
00:11:49,720 --> 00:11:52,240
Speaker 2: at you know, what is it that? What is it

254
00:11:52,280 --> 00:11:55,480
Speaker 2: that has us? And what is it that we have right?

255
00:11:55,679 --> 00:11:57,920
Speaker 2: And what is holding us hostage? And what do I

256
00:11:57,960 --> 00:12:02,280
Speaker 2: actually have? So today you know, or just riddled with anxiety, right,

257
00:12:02,320 --> 00:12:05,920
Speaker 2: And anxiety is I mean just kind of globally anxiety

258
00:12:06,200 --> 00:12:08,439
Speaker 2: is trying to get control of something of no control

259
00:12:08,480 --> 00:12:11,520
Speaker 2: over right, and so people come up with tons of

260
00:12:11,559 --> 00:12:12,720
Speaker 2: solutions to that.

261
00:12:13,600 --> 00:12:15,680
Speaker 1: Like you're you're saying, because you talk about this with

262
00:12:15,760 --> 00:12:20,520
Speaker 1: charm too, anxiety has us and you say that charm

263
00:12:20,720 --> 00:12:24,880
Speaker 1: has people too, Like, so go into like how these

264
00:12:24,880 --> 00:12:28,280
Speaker 1: things are having us, Like we're going to that because

265
00:12:28,280 --> 00:12:28,880
Speaker 1: I think that's interesting.

266
00:12:28,960 --> 00:12:29,959
Speaker 3: Most people don't say that.

267
00:12:30,559 --> 00:12:34,320
Speaker 2: Okay, so when I say someone can be productive, I'm

268
00:12:34,360 --> 00:12:39,160
Speaker 2: saying that they don't know that. People don't distinguish out enough.

269
00:12:40,120 --> 00:12:41,680
Speaker 2: You know, what is it, you know where they have

270
00:12:41,760 --> 00:12:44,040
Speaker 2: noise and no noise, so it just looks like, oh,

271
00:12:44,320 --> 00:12:47,439
Speaker 2: I if that I'm being manic here, and I'm going, well, no,

272
00:12:47,520 --> 00:12:50,000
Speaker 2: you're actually not being manic there. You know here you're

273
00:12:50,040 --> 00:12:52,920
Speaker 2: pretty freed up. Here you're manic and you're collapsing both

274
00:12:52,960 --> 00:12:56,360
Speaker 2: of those those things. So someone could be have their

275
00:12:56,440 --> 00:12:59,480
Speaker 2: craft just to kind of finish that up. Their craft

276
00:12:59,520 --> 00:13:01,439
Speaker 2: could be straordinary, like they be able to play the

277
00:13:01,440 --> 00:13:04,840
Speaker 2: guitar brilliantly. They can do that, but their career is noisy,

278
00:13:05,000 --> 00:13:07,680
Speaker 2: so they never fulfill in their career. But they could

279
00:13:07,679 --> 00:13:10,599
Speaker 2: be the best, the best guitarist in the world, and

280
00:13:10,640 --> 00:13:12,560
Speaker 2: people understand, what if I'm really great at this, How

281
00:13:12,600 --> 00:13:15,040
Speaker 2: come this isn't fulfilling? And some it could be mediocre

282
00:13:15,800 --> 00:13:19,240
Speaker 2: in their craft, but really freed up in their career, right,

283
00:13:19,320 --> 00:13:22,199
Speaker 2: meaning they have all this room to make mistakes, to fail,

284
00:13:22,320 --> 00:13:26,400
Speaker 2: to lose, to move right. And so you know, watching,

285
00:13:26,559 --> 00:13:29,240
Speaker 2: you know, watching where things produce and how they produce,

286
00:13:29,720 --> 00:13:33,160
Speaker 2: you know, is my entire kind of work, right, Like

287
00:13:33,200 --> 00:13:35,199
Speaker 2: what is what is it that has someone to be effective,

288
00:13:35,520 --> 00:13:38,280
Speaker 2: you know in a particular way. So the question that

289
00:13:38,320 --> 00:13:44,119
Speaker 2: you're asking is, I consider identities. I look at identities,

290
00:13:44,160 --> 00:13:45,600
Speaker 2: and the identity is a way you want to be

291
00:13:45,640 --> 00:13:48,280
Speaker 2: seen or a way you do not want to be seen. Right,

292
00:13:48,640 --> 00:13:50,959
Speaker 2: So I want to I might want to be seen

293
00:13:51,000 --> 00:13:52,720
Speaker 2: as smart. I can't be seen as stupid. I want

294
00:13:52,760 --> 00:13:54,160
Speaker 2: to be seen as a tractor. I can't be seen

295
00:13:54,160 --> 00:13:56,240
Speaker 2: as ugly. I obn to see this as powerful. They

296
00:13:56,280 --> 00:13:57,240
Speaker 2: can't be seen as weak.

297
00:13:57,600 --> 00:13:59,559
Speaker 1: I feel like you used to call that image. Also,

298
00:13:59,760 --> 00:14:01,120
Speaker 1: is that you're saying that's the same.

299
00:14:01,400 --> 00:14:03,640
Speaker 2: Well I did. It was it was a It may

300
00:14:03,760 --> 00:14:07,480
Speaker 2: had a much broader context, okay, right, but the identity

301
00:14:07,520 --> 00:14:10,040
Speaker 2: is very specific. You know. We walk around, you know,

302
00:14:10,200 --> 00:14:12,240
Speaker 2: wanting to be seen in a particular way. And if

303
00:14:12,240 --> 00:14:17,479
Speaker 2: we're not seen in a particular way, we get reactive, threatened, disconsolate,

304
00:14:17,640 --> 00:14:21,120
Speaker 2: something like that. So I always consider that identities have you,

305
00:14:22,200 --> 00:14:25,720
Speaker 2: qualities and characteristics you have. So this is there to

306
00:14:25,760 --> 00:14:29,640
Speaker 2: your point about Charmin. So you could have an identity

307
00:14:29,880 --> 00:14:32,840
Speaker 2: of loyal like you need to be seen as a

308
00:14:32,840 --> 00:14:36,280
Speaker 2: loyal person. That's an identity, right, So you're loyal to

309
00:14:36,320 --> 00:14:39,120
Speaker 2: a fault, steal, stay in situations long after you should,

310
00:14:39,600 --> 00:14:42,840
Speaker 2: you don't get out fast enough. You ally yourself to

311
00:14:42,920 --> 00:14:45,640
Speaker 2: things you shouldn't because you've got a dysfunction, so you're

312
00:14:45,680 --> 00:14:48,680
Speaker 2: not seeing things correctly. It's loyal to a fault is problematic.

313
00:14:49,120 --> 00:14:52,960
Speaker 1: Yep, agreed. And that's almost like the obligation to a fault.

314
00:14:52,960 --> 00:14:55,280
Speaker 1: When people constantly have to go, they always have to

315
00:14:55,320 --> 00:14:58,480
Speaker 1: show up, it feels disingenuous, like they're doing it to

316
00:14:58,560 --> 00:14:59,320
Speaker 1: check the box.

317
00:15:00,240 --> 00:15:04,760
Speaker 2: So with regards to loyalty as a characteristic equality, that's

318
00:15:04,800 --> 00:15:08,080
Speaker 2: different than an identity. I mean you have loyalty, Loyalty

319
00:15:08,120 --> 00:15:11,040
Speaker 2: doesn't have you. So you can be loyal to the

320
00:15:11,080 --> 00:15:16,080
Speaker 2: appropriate situations, you can exit situations appropriately, and you can

321
00:15:16,160 --> 00:15:18,400
Speaker 2: be disloyal if you have loyal I mean I'm not

322
00:15:18,400 --> 00:15:20,240
Speaker 2: going to be loyal to someone who's saying, you know,

323
00:15:20,560 --> 00:15:23,200
Speaker 2: an asshole or someone who's doing this. Right, But you

324
00:15:23,280 --> 00:15:26,080
Speaker 2: can't be disloyal if loyalty to a fault has you.

325
00:15:26,400 --> 00:15:28,440
Speaker 2: So that is true for everything. So it could be

326
00:15:28,800 --> 00:15:38,320
Speaker 2: so everything to be positive or negative depending on the context.

327
00:15:47,360 --> 00:15:52,280
Speaker 1: Okay, so talk about obligation, because everybody that's listening is

328
00:15:52,360 --> 00:15:54,840
Speaker 1: doing a bunch of things they don't actually want to

329
00:15:54,880 --> 00:15:58,840
Speaker 1: be doing. And I do many things for other people,

330
00:15:58,840 --> 00:16:02,120
Speaker 1: but I don't do anything anywhere that I don't want

331
00:16:02,160 --> 00:16:02,520
Speaker 1: to do.

332
00:16:02,800 --> 00:16:04,880
Speaker 3: And I think that's jarring, and I.

333
00:16:05,320 --> 00:16:08,000
Speaker 2: That's revolution that's this almost is like you now we're

334
00:16:08,040 --> 00:16:10,520
Speaker 2: talking kind of like graduate school in terms of self help,

335
00:16:10,600 --> 00:16:16,240
Speaker 2: just because it really is such a revolutionary concept because

336
00:16:16,240 --> 00:16:19,680
Speaker 2: it looks completely selfish. Yes, because someone says, but what

337
00:16:19,760 --> 00:16:22,960
Speaker 2: looks what looks one way to the culture might be

338
00:16:23,120 --> 00:16:29,360
Speaker 2: entirely different to what's actually true. Right. So if someone

339
00:16:30,200 --> 00:16:32,560
Speaker 2: is saying, oh, you you know, you never do anything,

340
00:16:32,640 --> 00:16:35,160
Speaker 2: you know, obligatorily, and I go and I say, yeah,

341
00:16:35,200 --> 00:16:38,400
Speaker 2: I don't, and they go, well, that's just completely selfish.

342
00:16:38,520 --> 00:16:41,600
Speaker 2: I go, well, actually know it's selfless because who wants

343
00:16:41,600 --> 00:16:44,720
Speaker 2: someone around who's doing something as they're a pain in

344
00:16:44,760 --> 00:16:47,480
Speaker 2: the ass. They're doing it for you. They're sanctimonious about it,

345
00:16:47,520 --> 00:16:50,600
Speaker 2: they're self righteous about it, and that's not yielding anything.

346
00:16:50,880 --> 00:16:52,720
Speaker 2: It's no benefit to any right.

347
00:16:53,320 --> 00:16:56,080
Speaker 1: I don't like when people count who gave a gift

348
00:16:56,120 --> 00:16:58,040
Speaker 1: to give a gift back. I don't want any gifts.

349
00:16:58,360 --> 00:17:01,200
Speaker 1: I have one, no gifts. Gifts giving is literally my

350
00:17:01,240 --> 00:17:04,760
Speaker 1: love language. I don't want any because I'm not giving

351
00:17:04,800 --> 00:17:06,399
Speaker 1: a gift because I want something back or because I

352
00:17:06,400 --> 00:17:07,960
Speaker 1: got something. They have nothing to do with each other,

353
00:17:07,960 --> 00:17:10,320
Speaker 1: and it irritates me when I hear someone, well, can

354
00:17:10,359 --> 00:17:11,800
Speaker 1: you believe they came to the wedding and they only

355
00:17:11,800 --> 00:17:12,200
Speaker 1: did whatever?

356
00:17:12,800 --> 00:17:14,159
Speaker 3: Who gives a shit that?

357
00:17:14,320 --> 00:17:14,399
Speaker 2: So?

358
00:17:14,640 --> 00:17:17,680
Speaker 1: I hate that shit. I hate counting. That's the opposite

359
00:17:17,680 --> 00:17:18,920
Speaker 1: of being a good person.

360
00:17:19,480 --> 00:17:22,520
Speaker 2: An obligation can can just like you said that, it

361
00:17:22,600 --> 00:17:27,800
Speaker 2: can trans can translate to many many situations. It can

362
00:17:27,880 --> 00:17:31,320
Speaker 2: go to It can go to gift giving. It can

363
00:17:31,359 --> 00:17:35,720
Speaker 2: go to emotional context like I love you. I didn't

364
00:17:35,760 --> 00:17:38,360
Speaker 2: hear it back, right, You're obligated to say it back,

365
00:17:38,359 --> 00:17:38,600
Speaker 2: so it.

366
00:17:38,520 --> 00:17:41,000
Speaker 3: Can be I agree with that too, that's so ridiculous.

367
00:17:41,240 --> 00:17:43,240
Speaker 2: It can be on emotional context, it can be in

368
00:17:43,280 --> 00:17:47,119
Speaker 2: a physical context. Obligation can translate to many many different situations.

369
00:17:47,440 --> 00:17:51,880
Speaker 2: So obligation, you know, to live a life obligation free, right,

370
00:17:52,000 --> 00:17:54,359
Speaker 2: meaning you know, I'm only going to do things that

371
00:17:55,880 --> 00:17:57,879
Speaker 2: I want to do, and I'm only going to do

372
00:17:58,000 --> 00:17:59,760
Speaker 2: things that I say I'm gonna do or I'm not

373
00:17:59,760 --> 00:18:03,160
Speaker 2: going to do them, right, And you know, like when

374
00:18:03,160 --> 00:18:04,720
Speaker 2: someone goes, well, what if your wife asks you to

375
00:18:04,760 --> 00:18:06,800
Speaker 2: do something to me, I go, that's usually my pleasure.

376
00:18:07,000 --> 00:18:08,200
Speaker 2: You know, I want to do something for it.

377
00:18:08,280 --> 00:18:11,280
Speaker 1: It's not an obligation, right, right, but you may not

378
00:18:11,440 --> 00:18:13,760
Speaker 1: totally want to do that thing, but you want to

379
00:18:13,800 --> 00:18:14,320
Speaker 1: do like.

380
00:18:14,600 --> 00:18:16,040
Speaker 2: But you want to do that for them because you

381
00:18:16,040 --> 00:18:16,560
Speaker 2: know it'll.

382
00:18:16,400 --> 00:18:18,960
Speaker 3: Like yess what I'm saying, yes exactly.

383
00:18:19,080 --> 00:18:22,040
Speaker 2: So that's for people get stuck. And you know, in

384
00:18:21,640 --> 00:18:25,119
Speaker 2: my marriage, I mean, I think it's been really generous

385
00:18:25,160 --> 00:18:27,320
Speaker 2: in that way. Like if I say I don't want

386
00:18:27,359 --> 00:18:29,840
Speaker 2: to do exit like something simple like Jane goes, oh,

387
00:18:30,600 --> 00:18:32,520
Speaker 2: the dishes are the in the sink? Yeah, I said

388
00:18:32,520 --> 00:18:34,520
Speaker 2: I didn't want to do them. She goes, Okay, so

389
00:18:34,640 --> 00:18:36,919
Speaker 2: it's it's gonna be as simple as that, and then

390
00:18:36,960 --> 00:18:39,880
Speaker 2: they get done you know down the road right where

391
00:18:39,920 --> 00:18:41,640
Speaker 2: it's kind of something you want to do, but it's

392
00:18:41,680 --> 00:18:43,280
Speaker 2: like literally simple.

393
00:18:43,320 --> 00:18:45,359
Speaker 1: Well no if she lets that go a couple of

394
00:18:45,400 --> 00:18:47,439
Speaker 1: times and it is like says to you like it

395
00:18:47,440 --> 00:18:49,119
Speaker 1: would be nice if you did them, but doesn't give

396
00:18:49,160 --> 00:18:49,639
Speaker 1: you damage.

397
00:18:49,680 --> 00:18:51,080
Speaker 3: Next time you might want to do them.

398
00:18:51,119 --> 00:18:54,080
Speaker 1: It's kind of like this weekend, I was with someone

399
00:18:54,200 --> 00:18:57,479
Speaker 1: that I care about and I was exhausted, and I

400
00:18:57,640 --> 00:19:00,119
Speaker 1: just I am always activated, but I'm when I do

401
00:19:00,200 --> 00:19:02,440
Speaker 1: a lot of things that involve other people, I really

402
00:19:02,520 --> 00:19:05,080
Speaker 1: need to restore. And it could be like organizing sweaters,

403
00:19:05,160 --> 00:19:07,000
Speaker 1: or like looking at lip gloss or just staring at

404
00:19:07,040 --> 00:19:07,320
Speaker 1: the TV.

405
00:19:07,440 --> 00:19:08,440
Speaker 3: I just need to be.

406
00:19:08,440 --> 00:19:11,640
Speaker 1: Alone ish, or like wandering in a house with someone

407
00:19:11,680 --> 00:19:13,240
Speaker 1: else there, but not like a you know, in an

408
00:19:13,280 --> 00:19:16,080
Speaker 1: obligation mode. Yes, so this person is an extrovert and

409
00:19:16,119 --> 00:19:18,960
Speaker 1: I'm more of an introvert. And they said, my cousin's

410
00:19:19,080 --> 00:19:21,960
Speaker 1: in town and I was in the Hamptons, and do

411
00:19:22,000 --> 00:19:23,600
Speaker 1: you want to go for lunch with him? Now? I

412
00:19:23,680 --> 00:19:26,240
Speaker 1: really didn't want to go, but I really care about

413
00:19:26,280 --> 00:19:27,840
Speaker 1: this person who's doing a lot of things for me

414
00:19:28,080 --> 00:19:32,040
Speaker 1: and and really caring. And I said, I first just

415
00:19:32,080 --> 00:19:33,720
Speaker 1: want to know if you care if I go or not,

416
00:19:33,840 --> 00:19:35,600
Speaker 1: Like I just want to know where you stand with it.

417
00:19:35,960 --> 00:19:37,600
Speaker 2: Yeah, that was the question. I was to say, is

418
00:19:37,640 --> 00:19:38,920
Speaker 2: this important to you that I go?

419
00:19:39,560 --> 00:19:40,800
Speaker 3: Like do you care? Like how much?

420
00:19:40,800 --> 00:19:42,240
Speaker 1: On a one to ten because all of sudden you're

421
00:19:42,240 --> 00:19:44,800
Speaker 1: not communicating and you just say yes and then you

422
00:19:44,840 --> 00:19:46,879
Speaker 1: resent it or you say no and they resent that

423
00:19:46,960 --> 00:19:48,520
Speaker 1: you said no, even though they didn't really care.

424
00:19:48,600 --> 00:19:50,080
Speaker 3: But it was the way that it was discussed.

425
00:19:50,119 --> 00:19:52,800
Speaker 1: I said, listen, you, if it's really important to you,

426
00:19:52,880 --> 00:19:55,040
Speaker 1: then we should discuss that. I wasn't even ready to

427
00:19:55,119 --> 00:19:56,600
Speaker 1: go yet. I just was ready to say, if it's

428
00:19:56,600 --> 00:19:59,960
Speaker 1: really important, you should discuss that. I on my own

429
00:20:00,160 --> 00:20:02,680
Speaker 1: vacuum don't want to go, but like, if it's really

430
00:20:02,720 --> 00:20:05,280
Speaker 1: important to you, because as a family member, that's a discussion.

431
00:20:05,680 --> 00:20:07,080
Speaker 1: And then he was like it's really not and I

432
00:20:07,119 --> 00:20:08,879
Speaker 1: was like, okay, great, I really don't want to go.

433
00:20:09,320 --> 00:20:12,040
Speaker 1: And then later he was gone for like three hours

434
00:20:12,040 --> 00:20:14,240
Speaker 1: and he was worried that it was too long, and

435
00:20:14,280 --> 00:20:16,920
Speaker 1: that became a I'm like, no, like not to make

436
00:20:16,960 --> 00:20:19,760
Speaker 1: you feel bad. You could go for five hours like

437
00:20:19,920 --> 00:20:21,680
Speaker 1: I you know, I want eventually I want you to

438
00:20:21,680 --> 00:20:23,440
Speaker 1: come back and not be But it's like that kind

439
00:20:23,440 --> 00:20:25,600
Speaker 1: of stuff. It like frees you up because you could

440
00:20:25,680 --> 00:20:28,040
Speaker 1: really go on the wrong road. You could go and

441
00:20:28,080 --> 00:20:28,720
Speaker 1: resent it.

442
00:20:29,080 --> 00:20:31,880
Speaker 2: First of all, you're always looking to maintain like you're

443
00:20:32,160 --> 00:20:35,480
Speaker 2: now talking relationships, so you're talking, so you always are

444
00:20:35,520 --> 00:20:39,640
Speaker 2: looking to maintain the affinity of the connection, the love

445
00:20:39,760 --> 00:20:43,280
Speaker 2: connection and the relationship. That's kind of like the intention, right,

446
00:20:43,640 --> 00:20:47,120
Speaker 2: and in between fights and disagreements and you don't feel

447
00:20:47,119 --> 00:20:49,920
Speaker 2: appreciated or whatever people's issues are, you know, that can

448
00:20:50,000 --> 00:20:54,080
Speaker 2: be that can that can get threatened that affinity, right,

449
00:20:54,160 --> 00:20:57,199
Speaker 2: So those kinds of conversations of like, well is this

450
00:20:57,280 --> 00:21:00,399
Speaker 2: important to you? No, it's not, okay, then I'm not

451
00:21:00,440 --> 00:21:03,560
Speaker 2: going to go, and it maintains the affinity in the

452
00:21:03,640 --> 00:21:07,040
Speaker 2: relationship rather than I'm just not going right.

453
00:21:07,520 --> 00:21:10,399
Speaker 1: No, you're right, or like going and resenting. I do

454
00:21:10,560 --> 00:21:12,960
Speaker 1: ask a lot if something's important, Because someone said to

455
00:21:12,960 --> 00:21:14,520
Speaker 1: me years ago, Dennis, who you knew, He said, if

456
00:21:14,560 --> 00:21:16,720
Speaker 1: it's important to you, it's important to me. He didn't

457
00:21:16,720 --> 00:21:18,400
Speaker 1: act that way, but I liked the sentence.

458
00:21:18,600 --> 00:21:20,440
Speaker 2: I do too, and I like and I like that too.

459
00:21:20,480 --> 00:21:24,280
Speaker 2: So it's obligation. So you live a life obligation free, right,

460
00:21:24,480 --> 00:21:26,920
Speaker 2: So you take away the victim. That's really what you're doing,

461
00:21:26,960 --> 00:21:29,280
Speaker 2: because a victim is somewhere something or someone.

462
00:21:29,200 --> 00:21:31,720
Speaker 3: Smarter like the marthing, or someone's.

463
00:21:31,400 --> 00:21:33,280
Speaker 2: Doing something to you. You take away the victim in

464
00:21:33,320 --> 00:21:37,000
Speaker 2: the conversation, right, and then we so get into those

465
00:21:37,000 --> 00:21:40,680
Speaker 2: habits of acting like victims and situations and and living

466
00:21:40,800 --> 00:21:44,320
Speaker 2: life implication free. So obligation and implication free are like

467
00:21:44,840 --> 00:21:47,320
Speaker 2: implication free means you know what it means about you.

468
00:21:47,320 --> 00:21:48,879
Speaker 2: If I do this, I'm a good person. If I

469
00:21:48,920 --> 00:21:51,160
Speaker 2: don't do this, I'm a bad person. Right, And people

470
00:21:51,240 --> 00:21:53,000
Speaker 2: live mostly obligatorily.

471
00:21:53,200 --> 00:21:54,800
Speaker 1: No, they want and they check the butt, they want

472
00:21:54,800 --> 00:21:57,199
Speaker 1: the scorecard. It's counting, which is the opposite of a

473
00:21:57,200 --> 00:21:58,840
Speaker 1: good relationship, is counting anything.

474
00:21:59,200 --> 00:22:02,840
Speaker 2: Yeah, you're looking to live a life you know, obligation free,

475
00:22:02,880 --> 00:22:06,639
Speaker 2: implication free, and you're more generous, you're more creative, you're

476
00:22:06,680 --> 00:22:10,080
Speaker 2: more connected, you're more communication and you have less noise

477
00:22:10,119 --> 00:22:10,600
Speaker 2: in your head.

478
00:22:10,800 --> 00:22:11,200
Speaker 3: Bravo.

479
00:22:11,400 --> 00:22:14,680
Speaker 1: So we've accomplished. Okay, let's get into charm. So tell

480
00:22:14,680 --> 00:22:16,080
Speaker 1: me about charming. I'm eating a little bite of my

481
00:22:16,080 --> 00:22:18,960
Speaker 1: snack because I have very breafacet let's talk about charming.

482
00:22:19,560 --> 00:22:22,639
Speaker 2: So you know, when someone says and usually charm is

483
00:22:22,640 --> 00:22:25,600
Speaker 2: associated with you know, men or masculine. Let's call it

484
00:22:25,600 --> 00:22:26,679
Speaker 2: that way, you know, can take it.

485
00:22:27,000 --> 00:22:28,760
Speaker 3: Wow, yeah, right, so explain that.

486
00:22:29,119 --> 00:22:32,720
Speaker 2: Yeah. So you know, we don't usually say the woman's charming.

487
00:22:32,760 --> 00:22:35,200
Speaker 2: We will use a different term for that. You know, oh, god,

488
00:22:35,240 --> 00:22:38,719
Speaker 2: she's really gracious, or she's really soak, you know, sweet,

489
00:22:38,760 --> 00:22:42,400
Speaker 2: like all kinds of different things. But that's associated culturally

490
00:22:42,440 --> 00:22:45,320
Speaker 2: with a man, right, and it's usually associated in a

491
00:22:45,440 --> 00:22:50,760
Speaker 2: really favorable way. Right now. The thing about charm is

492
00:22:50,880 --> 00:22:55,080
Speaker 2: that it's and people that people don't like this. But

493
00:22:55,160 --> 00:22:58,040
Speaker 2: I considered myself quite charming, you know, early on, so

494
00:22:58,119 --> 00:23:00,320
Speaker 2: I figured I can get away with talking about this,

495
00:23:00,760 --> 00:23:02,879
Speaker 2: right even I've got you know, it's like someone like

496
00:23:02,960 --> 00:23:05,520
Speaker 2: who's who's If you've got the wound, you can really

497
00:23:05,520 --> 00:23:07,159
Speaker 2: talk about the wound, right.

498
00:23:07,040 --> 00:23:10,600
Speaker 1: So you probably were really charming. That's why you know

499
00:23:10,640 --> 00:23:13,399
Speaker 1: about it so well? Yeah, because you would just guys,

500
00:23:13,440 --> 00:23:16,760
Speaker 1: Breck was like a hotshot data models, party like a

501
00:23:16,840 --> 00:23:20,520
Speaker 1: rock star, came from money, trust, fun like big swinging dick.

502
00:23:20,760 --> 00:23:25,159
Speaker 1: The whole thing, had a life, life humbled you. You

503
00:23:25,200 --> 00:23:27,800
Speaker 1: probably were a charming motherfucker with that money and the

504
00:23:27,840 --> 00:23:29,879
Speaker 1: models and the looks and all that shit in New

505
00:23:29,960 --> 00:23:32,040
Speaker 1: York City partying in La got it?

506
00:23:32,160 --> 00:23:34,639
Speaker 2: Okay? Yeah, so I mean, so I feel like I

507
00:23:34,680 --> 00:23:37,000
Speaker 2: have a strong sense of this right now. You can

508
00:23:37,040 --> 00:23:39,200
Speaker 2: also have a strong sense of how, you know, how

509
00:23:39,720 --> 00:23:43,960
Speaker 2: the narcissistic wound that's associated with charming, right which is

510
00:23:44,160 --> 00:23:46,080
Speaker 2: very you know, it's a it's a painful thing for

511
00:23:46,119 --> 00:23:48,159
Speaker 2: people to say, but that's what it is. Why is it?

512
00:23:48,200 --> 00:23:53,160
Speaker 2: Because it if you're a man who's incredibly charming, you

513
00:23:53,400 --> 00:23:56,399
Speaker 2: are you create an addiction of meeting that kind of

514
00:23:56,440 --> 00:23:58,719
Speaker 2: attention and that kind of feedback. Do you know you

515
00:23:58,720 --> 00:24:00,879
Speaker 2: go to a party, you go to this and something

516
00:24:00,920 --> 00:24:01,919
Speaker 2: has to be said about you.

517
00:24:02,320 --> 00:24:04,480
Speaker 1: Okay, So I want to tell everybody because this was

518
00:24:04,760 --> 00:24:08,720
Speaker 1: I talked about this. It's the guy who sometimes not you,

519
00:24:08,800 --> 00:24:11,359
Speaker 1: but sometimes the charming is the hey, Dan, how's your

520
00:24:11,359 --> 00:24:14,000
Speaker 1: golf game? And like real Gregario is then at home

521
00:24:14,160 --> 00:24:16,720
Speaker 1: like treating his wife like shit or I've had that scenario.

522
00:24:17,280 --> 00:24:19,760
Speaker 1: I've also had this scenario where the guy's like the bro,

523
00:24:20,560 --> 00:24:24,439
Speaker 1: real bro, real friend, you know, just hugging everybody and

524
00:24:24,480 --> 00:24:26,639
Speaker 1: good looking and everybody likes him and girls like it,

525
00:24:26,680 --> 00:24:28,640
Speaker 1: and he's a life of the party and like the

526
00:24:28,680 --> 00:24:31,760
Speaker 1: peacock like and you're right, because it is an addiction.

527
00:24:31,840 --> 00:24:34,040
Speaker 3: They just go to it right away. It works so well,

528
00:24:34,520 --> 00:24:35,280
Speaker 3: and go ahead.

529
00:24:35,520 --> 00:24:40,360
Speaker 2: So it becomes really your go to in as a man,

530
00:24:40,119 --> 00:24:42,520
Speaker 2: and that's and you and it gets narrowed down so

531
00:24:42,600 --> 00:24:47,400
Speaker 2: that becomes mostly your entire or you're organized around when

532
00:24:47,400 --> 00:24:50,399
Speaker 2: you're driven by, you know, getting feedback for how charming

533
00:24:50,440 --> 00:24:52,760
Speaker 2: you are needing to seduce all the time, whether it's

534
00:24:52,800 --> 00:24:54,920
Speaker 2: men or women. You're just you're like an animal and

535
00:24:55,000 --> 00:24:56,439
Speaker 2: is constantly generating that.

536
00:24:56,880 --> 00:24:59,520
Speaker 1: You're singing the karaoke song, you're doing the shots, You're

537
00:24:59,560 --> 00:25:02,000
Speaker 1: a charming, the mom you got, everybody loves you.

538
00:25:02,280 --> 00:25:05,400
Speaker 2: Whatever's required. If what's required is be completely quiet, what's

539
00:25:05,440 --> 00:25:08,119
Speaker 2: required to be totally entertaining, what's required to be this,

540
00:25:08,400 --> 00:25:12,040
Speaker 2: You're you're you're managing whatever you need to do to

541
00:25:12,119 --> 00:25:17,840
Speaker 2: get that feedback. Wow, so and and it and it

542
00:25:17,880 --> 00:25:21,120
Speaker 2: becomes an addiction like anything else. That's why age can

543
00:25:21,119 --> 00:25:24,360
Speaker 2: be really challenging for people as they you know, as

544
00:25:24,359 --> 00:25:26,199
Speaker 2: they fall and they don't have the same skills, they

545
00:25:26,240 --> 00:25:30,359
Speaker 2: don't do the same resources that they had. So what

546
00:25:30,440 --> 00:25:33,439
Speaker 2: I all say to women, and women will say this

547
00:25:33,680 --> 00:25:38,359
Speaker 2: right as well, is if you see someone who's particularly charming,

548
00:25:38,600 --> 00:25:39,479
Speaker 2: run for the hills.

549
00:25:39,720 --> 00:25:42,960
Speaker 3: I literally called the podcast charming is a red flag.

550
00:25:43,359 --> 00:25:46,639
Speaker 2: Yeah, so run for the hills because in two years

551
00:25:46,680 --> 00:25:50,359
Speaker 2: you're gonna hate this God, You're gonna hate, You're gonna go,

552
00:25:50,440 --> 00:25:51,640
Speaker 2: I'm gonna kill this guy.

553
00:25:51,560 --> 00:25:54,840
Speaker 1: The very thing that you found so fascinating that the stick,

554
00:25:54,920 --> 00:25:57,159
Speaker 1: this bit is gonna make you sick, it.

555
00:25:57,080 --> 00:25:58,879
Speaker 2: Is, and in two years you're gonna be out of

556
00:25:58,880 --> 00:26:02,199
Speaker 2: your mind. Right. So I say I say this to

557
00:26:02,240 --> 00:26:05,359
Speaker 2: women when women go, you know, I'm marrying my yoga instructor.

558
00:26:05,400 --> 00:26:07,479
Speaker 2: I go. Just because he can put his you know,

559
00:26:07,720 --> 00:26:11,240
Speaker 2: legs around his head doesn't mean that he's got emotional flexibility.

560
00:26:11,359 --> 00:26:13,800
Speaker 2: Don't confuse those two, right. I'm not saying he doesn't.

561
00:26:14,200 --> 00:26:16,680
Speaker 2: I'm saying that those are different phenomenas. There's a different

562
00:26:16,720 --> 00:26:21,800
Speaker 2: photomen beeing spiritual evolution, creative evolution, emotional evolution, right, and

563
00:26:21,920 --> 00:26:24,479
Speaker 2: these things so a lot of times, and that can

564
00:26:24,520 --> 00:26:27,800
Speaker 2: be a highly seductive thing for you know, and and

565
00:26:28,200 --> 00:26:33,080
Speaker 2: dating charms. So I'm saying most men, other men who

566
00:26:33,480 --> 00:26:36,800
Speaker 2: so who have integrity, you know, a sense of themselves

567
00:26:36,880 --> 00:26:38,320
Speaker 2: and a sense of you know, kind of a moral

568
00:26:38,320 --> 00:26:40,439
Speaker 2: compass in terms of who they are and what they are,

569
00:26:40,440 --> 00:26:42,359
Speaker 2: and they don't need all that feedback. They have a

570
00:26:42,400 --> 00:26:47,040
Speaker 2: stronger sense themselves, they can have charm. So meaning you

571
00:26:47,080 --> 00:26:50,159
Speaker 2: can have charm from a context of integrity, right, But

572
00:26:50,200 --> 00:26:53,919
Speaker 2: if charm is your whole story, that's where it's problematic.

573
00:26:54,000 --> 00:26:56,000
Speaker 3: It's owning you, it's wearing you.

574
00:26:56,359 --> 00:26:58,720
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's it's what it has you your dow'n have it.

575
00:26:58,840 --> 00:27:02,000
Speaker 2: So it doesn't mean you can have charm. It just can't.

576
00:27:02,040 --> 00:27:03,480
Speaker 2: It's got to be like anything. You've got to be

577
00:27:03,480 --> 00:27:04,920
Speaker 2: able to pick it up and put it down and

578
00:27:05,000 --> 00:27:07,200
Speaker 2: use it, and it's got to be more more mobile

579
00:27:07,200 --> 00:27:10,760
Speaker 2: in play in all that way. And most men who

580
00:27:10,880 --> 00:27:14,440
Speaker 2: have integrity and have a great deal of respect dismiss charm.

581
00:27:14,840 --> 00:27:17,080
Speaker 2: They'll see other men and they'll they'll dismiss it because

582
00:27:17,119 --> 00:27:19,880
Speaker 2: they can smell like it's it's self centered, it's narcissistic,

583
00:27:20,200 --> 00:27:22,320
Speaker 2: it's it's superficial, it doesn't.

584
00:27:22,000 --> 00:27:25,200
Speaker 3: Have enough weight love it wow.

585
00:27:25,560 --> 00:27:27,359
Speaker 2: And so you've got to be interested. And this is

586
00:27:27,400 --> 00:27:30,920
Speaker 2: always the game, you know, for me, loss is always

587
00:27:30,960 --> 00:27:33,760
Speaker 2: the game that you're willing to lose what you considered

588
00:27:33,840 --> 00:27:37,239
Speaker 2: maybe your most important asset for the possibility of your

589
00:27:37,280 --> 00:27:37,840
Speaker 2: own evolution.

590
00:27:38,680 --> 00:27:41,520
Speaker 1: Well, it's funny you say that, because the way I

591
00:27:41,520 --> 00:27:44,280
Speaker 1: think of it is things that you're good for and

592
00:27:44,320 --> 00:27:46,800
Speaker 1: things that are good for you. So I used to

593
00:27:47,119 --> 00:27:49,119
Speaker 1: remember friends of our Shannon, et cetera. I used to

594
00:27:49,119 --> 00:27:52,440
Speaker 1: produce events, large scale events, multimillion dollar events, the Grammy's,

595
00:27:52,480 --> 00:27:55,760
Speaker 1: the Emmys, on the Rock, Alcatraz. No one was ever

596
00:27:55,800 --> 00:27:57,480
Speaker 1: better at it than I was. No one you could

597
00:27:57,480 --> 00:27:59,439
Speaker 1: ask the woman who ran all the events at Disney.

598
00:27:59,600 --> 00:28:02,080
Speaker 1: My bodyline was perfect, my P and L sheet, I

599
00:28:02,160 --> 00:28:05,480
Speaker 1: missed not a detail I didn't. I picked up every floral,

600
00:28:05,680 --> 00:28:06,640
Speaker 1: like every chair, like.

601
00:28:06,760 --> 00:28:08,800
Speaker 2: I mean, yeah, that makes that make perfect sense.

602
00:28:08,720 --> 00:28:12,840
Speaker 1: Because I'm sick like so. But I was great for it.

603
00:28:12,840 --> 00:28:15,639
Speaker 1: It wasn't great for me. So I had to be

604
00:28:15,720 --> 00:28:17,320
Speaker 1: like you know, and that's what goes on in my

605
00:28:17,720 --> 00:28:19,480
Speaker 1: work every day. Things that I'm good at, and my

606
00:28:19,520 --> 00:28:21,600
Speaker 1: whole entire team relies on me for all the details

607
00:28:21,640 --> 00:28:24,080
Speaker 1: in the detail of every video and every caption and

608
00:28:24,200 --> 00:28:26,440
Speaker 1: all the weeds because I'm amazing at them, but they're

609
00:28:26,440 --> 00:28:28,679
Speaker 1: not good for me. And it's like a discipline for

610
00:28:28,680 --> 00:28:31,600
Speaker 1: the people around me. Like you guys cannot come to

611
00:28:31,680 --> 00:28:34,600
Speaker 1: Mommy for every single question otherwise I cannot do what

612
00:28:34,640 --> 00:28:35,639
Speaker 1: I need to do in my business.

613
00:28:35,680 --> 00:28:36,520
Speaker 3: It's not good for me.

614
00:28:37,160 --> 00:28:40,720
Speaker 1: So that's sort of my like cross to bear is

615
00:28:40,760 --> 00:28:44,120
Speaker 1: what I'm good for, but what's not good for me?

616
00:28:44,760 --> 00:28:46,600
Speaker 2: Yeah, and those are those are and there they can

617
00:28:46,640 --> 00:28:49,400
Speaker 2: be very different, right they can. They can be very

618
00:28:49,520 --> 00:28:53,720
Speaker 2: very different. So, and that's also understanding what's bankrupt, you

619
00:28:53,760 --> 00:28:56,840
Speaker 2: know as it because because you can be highly productive

620
00:28:57,200 --> 00:29:00,360
Speaker 2: and have no sense of that illution. Yes, do you

621
00:29:00,440 --> 00:29:01,960
Speaker 2: know what I mean? Like you know? I mean you can,

622
00:29:02,000 --> 00:29:03,400
Speaker 2: you can make a billion dollars, you can do all

623
00:29:03,520 --> 00:29:07,360
Speaker 2: kinds of things, and yet your sense of self, your development,

624
00:29:07,800 --> 00:29:10,960
Speaker 2: you know, you're still maintaining the same You're still maintaining

625
00:29:11,000 --> 00:29:13,320
Speaker 2: the same way of being because.

626
00:29:13,080 --> 00:29:14,960
Speaker 1: You do the same exercise at the gym every time.

627
00:29:15,040 --> 00:29:17,160
Speaker 1: My inclination is to solve the problem, is to tell

628
00:29:17,200 --> 00:29:19,600
Speaker 1: you I'm dealing with the situation with this guy or

629
00:29:19,640 --> 00:29:22,239
Speaker 1: with Brin's school, or with work, and go attack and

630
00:29:22,320 --> 00:29:24,760
Speaker 1: produce the problem and use it like a relief effort

631
00:29:25,000 --> 00:29:27,280
Speaker 1: and solve it. But I'm not growing, I'm a feeling.

632
00:29:27,320 --> 00:29:29,640
Speaker 1: I'm not learning. I just know how to like wrap

633
00:29:29,680 --> 00:29:31,960
Speaker 1: it up. And so Milin to my therapist, who you've met,

634
00:29:32,000 --> 00:29:34,080
Speaker 1: will be like now she's not like a how do

635
00:29:34,120 --> 00:29:36,600
Speaker 1: you feel? But she doesn't really care about me, giving

636
00:29:36,600 --> 00:29:39,400
Speaker 1: her like the news, sports and weather. She wants to

637
00:29:39,400 --> 00:29:41,360
Speaker 1: like get to like what's going on about it?

638
00:29:41,760 --> 00:29:43,600
Speaker 2: Yeah, like what what is the what is the thing

639
00:29:43,640 --> 00:29:46,040
Speaker 2: that you're that you have kind of have to lose

640
00:29:46,120 --> 00:29:48,400
Speaker 2: in order to gain. Now, people think that they're going

641
00:29:48,440 --> 00:29:51,760
Speaker 2: to lose their their essential asset, and I'm going, no,

642
00:29:51,880 --> 00:29:55,080
Speaker 2: that's an illusion that the sense the essential asset just

643
00:29:55,160 --> 00:29:57,600
Speaker 2: moves into the foundation of your life. It's no longer

644
00:29:57,600 --> 00:30:00,840
Speaker 2: in the foreground, right, but you have to have that

645
00:30:01,000 --> 00:30:03,480
Speaker 2: noise back to noise. That noise in your head is

646
00:30:03,480 --> 00:30:08,560
Speaker 2: like if you if you introduce a new possibility something

647
00:30:08,800 --> 00:30:11,040
Speaker 2: and I don't care who, it's an emotional possibility, like

648
00:30:11,080 --> 00:30:12,560
Speaker 2: you know, I want to be I want to I

649
00:30:12,600 --> 00:30:14,360
Speaker 2: want to be on time I don't know, or I

650
00:30:14,360 --> 00:30:16,080
Speaker 2: want to I want to complete things. I want to

651
00:30:16,080 --> 00:30:18,200
Speaker 2: when I say I'm going to start a complete whatever

652
00:30:18,240 --> 00:30:20,600
Speaker 2: you introduce or I want to be more compassionate. Whatever

653
00:30:20,640 --> 00:30:24,760
Speaker 2: you might introduce, you also introduce because you wouldn't be

654
00:30:24,840 --> 00:30:27,840
Speaker 2: introducing that if it was something that you didn't have.

655
00:30:28,160 --> 00:30:30,560
Speaker 2: You're introducing it because it's something you don't have that

656
00:30:30,600 --> 00:30:34,680
Speaker 2: you're wanting, right, And so if you're introducing that you're

657
00:30:34,720 --> 00:30:38,240
Speaker 2: also introducing the loss, the loss of well, wait me,

658
00:30:38,320 --> 00:30:39,840
Speaker 2: I won't I won't be able to produce over here,

659
00:30:39,960 --> 00:30:42,400
Speaker 2: or I won't be effective over here, or this might

660
00:30:42,480 --> 00:30:45,040
Speaker 2: you know, fall apart. So that's the fear. That's why

661
00:30:45,080 --> 00:30:47,920
Speaker 2: when someone says, well, most people don't change, they're not wrong,

662
00:30:48,520 --> 00:30:51,840
Speaker 2: just because what it requires to change is huge.

663
00:30:52,200 --> 00:30:54,040
Speaker 1: You mean, like, I'm stopping drinking, so I'm not gonna

664
00:30:54,040 --> 00:30:55,840
Speaker 1: be the life of the party anymore. I'm overweight, I'm

665
00:30:55,840 --> 00:30:59,000
Speaker 1: losing weight. I'm not going to be jovial exactly. Yeah,

666
00:30:59,160 --> 00:31:01,280
Speaker 1: there's that Friends, that episode about fun and Bob.

667
00:31:01,440 --> 00:31:04,240
Speaker 2: I think it's fun Bobby Worth, right, Oh god, Bobby's

668
00:31:04,280 --> 00:31:06,160
Speaker 2: coming over, you know, because he is an alcoholic and

669
00:31:06,200 --> 00:31:08,400
Speaker 2: he was hysterical and now and he's no longer drinking

670
00:31:08,400 --> 00:31:11,040
Speaker 2: and he's not fun anymore, right, Which is not accurate.

671
00:31:11,160 --> 00:31:13,920
Speaker 2: It's not you know, lots of people have been sober

672
00:31:13,920 --> 00:31:16,920
Speaker 2: for years who are incredibly entertaining and great and creative

673
00:31:16,920 --> 00:31:19,600
Speaker 2: at all and more productive than ever. So it's not

674
00:31:19,680 --> 00:31:23,000
Speaker 2: a function of that, but it is a function of

675
00:31:23,040 --> 00:31:25,560
Speaker 2: not being afraid to lose. And I think and I

676
00:31:25,600 --> 00:31:27,400
Speaker 2: look at that as one of the major themes of

677
00:31:27,480 --> 00:31:31,120
Speaker 2: evolution right that you're willing in some area to you know,

678
00:31:31,160 --> 00:31:44,200
Speaker 2: to lose in a powerful, profound way.

679
00:31:47,160 --> 00:31:49,520
Speaker 3: Okay, so now I have two little things.

680
00:31:49,600 --> 00:31:51,400
Speaker 1: So the two things I want to talk about are

681
00:31:51,400 --> 00:31:53,680
Speaker 1: something you said recently about people don't come batteries are

682
00:31:53,720 --> 00:31:56,400
Speaker 1: not included the way that we start like catastrophizing and

683
00:31:56,400 --> 00:31:58,240
Speaker 1: thinking about something. But they're not this, but they're this,

684
00:31:58,680 --> 00:32:00,400
Speaker 1: whe they're different than the last person. And I was

685
00:32:00,400 --> 00:32:02,920
Speaker 1: with and like, and you've said, like battery, people don't

686
00:32:02,960 --> 00:32:06,160
Speaker 1: come with batteries. That's one concept, and then the other

687
00:32:06,160 --> 00:32:08,840
Speaker 1: one is like I don't think this is just like

688
00:32:08,920 --> 00:32:11,120
Speaker 1: a bit. But when I was talking to a writer

689
00:32:11,280 --> 00:32:13,800
Speaker 1: who works for Fortune magazine last night, this woman Diane Brady,

690
00:32:13,840 --> 00:32:17,520
Speaker 1: and she was talking really intimately about the difference between

691
00:32:17,520 --> 00:32:20,600
Speaker 1: extroverts and introverts as it pertains to being a CEO,

692
00:32:20,680 --> 00:32:23,239
Speaker 1: and she was like, I'm an extrovert. She knew who

693
00:32:23,320 --> 00:32:26,239
Speaker 1: she was, and she was like, the pandemic killed me.

694
00:32:26,400 --> 00:32:28,320
Speaker 1: I was like wanting to like go talk to like

695
00:32:29,000 --> 00:32:30,600
Speaker 1: essential essential worker.

696
00:32:30,800 --> 00:32:31,200
Speaker 2: Yeah.

697
00:32:31,040 --> 00:32:32,600
Speaker 1: Yeah, she was like I wanted to walk out. And

698
00:32:32,640 --> 00:32:36,760
Speaker 1: for me, I was like I was a in a

699
00:32:37,200 --> 00:32:40,560
Speaker 1: like a blanket. I extended the pandemic two years by

700
00:32:40,600 --> 00:32:43,760
Speaker 1: that behavior like it gave me license to keep using

701
00:32:43,760 --> 00:32:46,200
Speaker 1: it as an excuse to never leave the house. So

702
00:32:46,480 --> 00:32:50,480
Speaker 1: and then she was talking about how entrepreneurs introverts are

703
00:32:50,560 --> 00:32:54,880
Speaker 1: very good entrepreneurs because they get really deep and granular

704
00:32:54,920 --> 00:32:58,160
Speaker 1: and extroverts don't have have more difficult time focusing. They

705
00:32:58,160 --> 00:32:59,680
Speaker 1: may be good at knowing a lot of different things,

706
00:32:59,720 --> 00:33:02,760
Speaker 1: maybe about the market, about so many different companies and

707
00:33:02,840 --> 00:33:05,840
Speaker 1: different topics, but they don't they have a difficulty focusing.

708
00:33:06,240 --> 00:33:08,440
Speaker 2: I think that's a really use just just to put

709
00:33:08,480 --> 00:33:10,960
Speaker 2: some you know, parentheses around it. I think that's I

710
00:33:11,000 --> 00:33:14,840
Speaker 2: think it's really astute in terms of introverts and extroverts

711
00:33:14,880 --> 00:33:19,160
Speaker 2: that if you look at CEO, someone who's doing all

712
00:33:19,160 --> 00:33:23,280
Speaker 2: the operations and managing all those operations and managing people, yeah,

713
00:33:23,360 --> 00:33:27,400
Speaker 2: you know, they're mostly extroverts. They have that ability visionaries,

714
00:33:27,880 --> 00:33:30,880
Speaker 2: you know, founders, entrepreneurs, they're more introverted. They're like, you know,

715
00:33:30,960 --> 00:33:33,080
Speaker 2: that's a very that's a that's more of a thing.

716
00:33:33,120 --> 00:33:36,080
Speaker 2: They wouldn't be running and managing a bunch of people.

717
00:33:36,400 --> 00:33:39,080
Speaker 2: So that's why when I when I look at you know,

718
00:33:39,480 --> 00:33:42,560
Speaker 2: like when Elon Musk kind of took over Twitter, I

719
00:33:42,880 --> 00:33:47,920
Speaker 2: management is not his you know, he's an inventor, right, and.

720
00:33:47,920 --> 00:33:50,520
Speaker 1: What are you? I'm totally an introvert and people are

721
00:33:50,560 --> 00:33:53,160
Speaker 1: shocked by that, but I can't. I hate managing people

722
00:33:53,480 --> 00:33:53,840
Speaker 1: from the.

723
00:33:54,000 --> 00:33:57,680
Speaker 2: So I'm the same way. I'm a complete introvert. Okay, interesting,

724
00:33:57,920 --> 00:34:00,600
Speaker 2: I'm a complete and everybody says, so I'm much more

725
00:34:01,040 --> 00:34:04,360
Speaker 2: like the pandemic. I thrived in the pandemic and and

726
00:34:04,480 --> 00:34:09,040
Speaker 2: zoom became everything. So everybody, even I always say, an

727
00:34:09,080 --> 00:34:11,799
Speaker 2: act of love is that you don't invite me anywhere, right,

728
00:34:12,000 --> 00:34:15,880
Speaker 2: so you cancel on me, right, So so all of

729
00:34:15,920 --> 00:34:20,520
Speaker 2: those that's that's but being creative, generative, you know, collaborative

730
00:34:20,640 --> 00:34:23,120
Speaker 2: and making something happen, those that's you know, that's where

731
00:34:23,160 --> 00:34:26,680
Speaker 2: I thrive. And you don't want me running your company.

732
00:34:27,080 --> 00:34:32,160
Speaker 1: But this woman said that that that they draw upon

733
00:34:32,360 --> 00:34:37,040
Speaker 1: each other like. Well, It's interesting though, because I find

734
00:34:37,080 --> 00:34:41,680
Speaker 1: that people. I've had people gravitate towards me because of

735
00:34:41,680 --> 00:34:44,359
Speaker 1: my like the light and the way that I am,

736
00:34:44,480 --> 00:34:47,319
Speaker 1: like my passion, which isn't about being an extrovert, and

737
00:34:47,440 --> 00:34:50,359
Speaker 1: sometimes they'll like dim my light as a result. It's

738
00:34:50,440 --> 00:34:52,160
Speaker 1: kind of a different thing. But I'm thinking to who

739
00:34:52,200 --> 00:34:54,719
Speaker 1: is attracted to who introverts are attracted to extroverts or

740
00:34:54,880 --> 00:34:58,080
Speaker 1: extroverts because there are two extroverts are not the best combination, right,

741
00:34:58,120 --> 00:34:59,440
Speaker 1: because you can't focus.

742
00:34:59,719 --> 00:35:02,000
Speaker 2: Well first, well, you don't necessarily want to, you know

743
00:35:02,040 --> 00:35:04,760
Speaker 2: when when you're just back to the whole idea of

744
00:35:05,000 --> 00:35:08,279
Speaker 2: knowing your position, which you kind of started with, like yeah,

745
00:35:08,280 --> 00:35:11,040
Speaker 2: and knowing what your contribution is and people wanting to

746
00:35:11,080 --> 00:35:14,279
Speaker 2: be what they're not. Right, you know, this is really

747
00:35:14,360 --> 00:35:18,320
Speaker 2: understanding you know how you where you fully express yourself

748
00:35:18,360 --> 00:35:20,400
Speaker 2: and what does that look like? And just like in

749
00:35:20,400 --> 00:35:22,440
Speaker 2: a relationship, if if you have two people of the

750
00:35:22,480 --> 00:35:25,160
Speaker 2: same issues, you know that's problematic and you know, meaning

751
00:35:25,200 --> 00:35:26,680
Speaker 2: like oh we're going to run out of money, Yeah,

752
00:35:26,680 --> 00:35:28,960
Speaker 2: we're going to die. You don't want those two things

753
00:35:29,080 --> 00:35:30,960
Speaker 2: or like god, look out fat i am, look out,

754
00:35:31,000 --> 00:35:33,960
Speaker 2: look at my butt. You don't want both those all

755
00:35:34,000 --> 00:35:37,080
Speaker 2: those issues colliding. You want them missing. And that's the

756
00:35:37,120 --> 00:35:39,640
Speaker 2: same with assets. When you build a team, you know,

757
00:35:39,840 --> 00:35:44,000
Speaker 2: the CEO is not the is not the CTO, and

758
00:35:44,080 --> 00:35:48,040
Speaker 2: the CTO is not the CEO, and the founders and

759
00:35:48,080 --> 00:35:51,200
Speaker 2: the visionaries not and they're all they're all and building

760
00:35:51,400 --> 00:35:56,080
Speaker 2: a profound championship team is understanding each person playing their

761
00:35:56,120 --> 00:35:58,400
Speaker 2: position perfectly and they intersect.

762
00:35:58,640 --> 00:36:00,760
Speaker 1: Yeah, you could be in the I've had someone who's

763
00:36:01,160 --> 00:36:04,000
Speaker 1: seems who's in the wrong seat, but and they're great

764
00:36:04,040 --> 00:36:05,080
Speaker 1: in the right seat.

765
00:36:04,880 --> 00:36:06,960
Speaker 2: Like absolutely, just a little exactly.

766
00:36:07,239 --> 00:36:09,799
Speaker 1: Okay, you could have someone who seems terrible because they're

767
00:36:09,800 --> 00:36:12,080
Speaker 1: in the wrong fucking seat. But if they're loyal and

768
00:36:12,160 --> 00:36:15,560
Speaker 1: seems smart enough, you should play musical chairs. And what's

769
00:36:15,600 --> 00:36:18,120
Speaker 1: interesting is that. So I'm at this Fortune event last night.

770
00:36:18,160 --> 00:36:20,680
Speaker 1: I'm sitting at the table with a woman very high

771
00:36:20,760 --> 00:36:23,920
Speaker 1: up at General Motors and another and we're next to uh,

772
00:36:24,040 --> 00:36:27,600
Speaker 1: Josh Kushner, uh, and the guy who is the CEO,

773
00:36:27,760 --> 00:36:31,160
Speaker 1: Sebastian of hoult Renfrew, like major people. And this woman

774
00:36:31,239 --> 00:36:33,920
Speaker 1: Diane Brady next to me, who had an interesting conversation

775
00:36:33,960 --> 00:36:36,680
Speaker 1: with journalists and she's at Fortune. Now that's her, that's her.

776
00:36:37,200 --> 00:36:39,040
Speaker 1: She's the one who said it. But to be honest,

777
00:36:39,400 --> 00:36:42,400
Speaker 1: I have never heard anyone use it in human resources

778
00:36:42,480 --> 00:36:46,600
Speaker 1: and in staffing and in executive searches. And they should,

779
00:36:46,920 --> 00:36:48,680
Speaker 1: like you're not allowed to ask someone how old they are,

780
00:36:48,680 --> 00:36:51,359
Speaker 1: but you should be you should actually do the emotionally

781
00:36:51,440 --> 00:36:55,280
Speaker 1: intelligent conversation in staffing and ask are you an introvise?

782
00:36:55,280 --> 00:36:57,880
Speaker 1: This is no wrong answer, but here's the here's the quiz,

783
00:36:58,000 --> 00:36:59,560
Speaker 1: or give them the quiz, like it's like an IQ

784
00:36:59,719 --> 00:37:03,440
Speaker 1: quiz because it's true, Like I have been in relationships

785
00:37:03,480 --> 00:37:06,520
Speaker 1: with introverts many times because I'm attracted to someone similar

786
00:37:06,520 --> 00:37:07,920
Speaker 1: to me because they're gonna say I don't want to

787
00:37:07,920 --> 00:37:08,640
Speaker 1: go out either.

788
00:37:08,640 --> 00:37:09,600
Speaker 3: But it's bad for me.

789
00:37:10,239 --> 00:37:13,560
Speaker 1: It's bad for me, and I haven't realized that because

790
00:37:13,560 --> 00:37:15,080
Speaker 1: it's like I get into like sort of like there's

791
00:37:15,080 --> 00:37:16,000
Speaker 1: like a film on us.

792
00:37:16,040 --> 00:37:17,160
Speaker 3: It's like stale.

793
00:37:17,280 --> 00:37:21,080
Speaker 2: Understanding, you know, understanding and the one hundred of nuances

794
00:37:21,120 --> 00:37:23,840
Speaker 2: that go to those kind of headlines intovert an extrovert

795
00:37:23,880 --> 00:37:27,480
Speaker 2: r because underneath those two things are tons of nuances that, yeah,

796
00:37:27,520 --> 00:37:31,040
Speaker 2: that someone should use this as some sort of scrutiny

797
00:37:31,080 --> 00:37:33,279
Speaker 2: in terms of discerning like, well, is this the person

798
00:37:33,360 --> 00:37:35,239
Speaker 2: the right position? I mean, I'm doing that all day long.

799
00:37:35,280 --> 00:37:37,320
Speaker 2: In terms of subtle pivot, it's like just a little

800
00:37:37,560 --> 00:37:40,359
Speaker 2: subtle pivot and changes is a game changer with that

801
00:37:40,400 --> 00:37:42,919
Speaker 2: person or a dramatic pivot, right, Yeah.

802
00:37:42,960 --> 00:37:44,880
Speaker 1: But I think in this case the label is important

803
00:37:44,920 --> 00:37:46,600
Speaker 1: because I don't think that the average person if I

804
00:37:46,640 --> 00:37:50,080
Speaker 1: were applying for a job, they would not think that

805
00:37:50,120 --> 00:37:50,960
Speaker 1: I was an introvert.

806
00:37:51,080 --> 00:37:53,400
Speaker 2: No, no, no, no, they wouldn't. They wouldn't have no idea.

807
00:37:53,760 --> 00:37:56,359
Speaker 3: You too, if someone were hiring you, Brick, they.

808
00:37:56,239 --> 00:37:59,000
Speaker 2: Would no, no, no, absolutely right, So.

809
00:37:58,880 --> 00:38:00,520
Speaker 1: They might think you could manage a bunch of people.

810
00:38:00,560 --> 00:38:02,840
Speaker 1: They might think you could be the head. You know.

811
00:38:02,960 --> 00:38:04,520
Speaker 2: You know what I mean, I've done that. When I'm

812
00:38:04,560 --> 00:38:06,719
Speaker 2: pitching something that I really want you to take over this,

813
00:38:06,800 --> 00:38:09,439
Speaker 2: I go, that's a lesson you want me doing exactly,

814
00:38:09,600 --> 00:38:12,520
Speaker 2: And I say that directly. You know, that's not that

815
00:38:12,840 --> 00:38:15,000
Speaker 2: I'm not I'm not doing that, right, But that's because

816
00:38:15,000 --> 00:38:18,120
Speaker 2: also you won't do obligation. Yes, so, but I was

817
00:38:18,160 --> 00:38:21,439
Speaker 2: saying about Bethane. When you're seeing being attracted to your light,

818
00:38:21,920 --> 00:38:26,560
Speaker 2: that is what That's what someone who's an entrepreneur, visionary,

819
00:38:26,920 --> 00:38:30,520
Speaker 2: you know, someone who like you. People know that shit's

820
00:38:30,560 --> 00:38:33,560
Speaker 2: going to happen over there. This is something, this is

821
00:38:33,719 --> 00:38:37,000
Speaker 2: you know, there's something creative, something innovative, something will happen

822
00:38:37,040 --> 00:38:40,319
Speaker 2: that will translate into you know, into the world. Right,

823
00:38:40,520 --> 00:38:42,960
Speaker 2: So I think people know that, right.

824
00:38:43,080 --> 00:38:45,640
Speaker 3: And I get vampired and I don't even realize it is.

825
00:38:45,680 --> 00:38:47,440
Speaker 2: And then you need to know who then you need

826
00:38:47,480 --> 00:38:49,880
Speaker 2: to know like who are you going to allow do

827
00:38:50,000 --> 00:38:52,239
Speaker 2: that because they have to be complementary in terms of

828
00:38:52,280 --> 00:38:55,200
Speaker 2: feeding you as much as you feed that. Right, it's

829
00:38:55,239 --> 00:38:56,800
Speaker 2: a it's that's part of the dance.

830
00:38:57,360 --> 00:38:59,960
Speaker 1: And by the way, that's a thing that's another construct

831
00:39:00,080 --> 00:39:02,000
Speaker 1: that like could be a chapter in a book that

832
00:39:02,080 --> 00:39:04,640
Speaker 1: I never have thought about that and this age I've

833
00:39:04,719 --> 00:39:08,319
Speaker 1: never thought about that I'm gonna draw certain people, but

834
00:39:09,080 --> 00:39:10,960
Speaker 1: if they're if we're not gonna be playing tennis where

835
00:39:10,960 --> 00:39:12,640
Speaker 1: I'm playing with a better tennis player and they're just

836
00:39:12,680 --> 00:39:16,960
Speaker 1: gonna draw off of me, but I'm not getting anything positive.

837
00:39:17,080 --> 00:39:19,280
Speaker 1: It's gonna kill me. And it's happened like it actually

838
00:39:19,360 --> 00:39:22,240
Speaker 1: you feel like you're just light is dimming. It's actually

839
00:39:22,239 --> 00:39:22,759
Speaker 1: happened to me.

840
00:39:22,880 --> 00:39:26,120
Speaker 2: It's wild and that I mean, I'm possibly I don't

841
00:39:26,160 --> 00:39:29,040
Speaker 2: know if it's actually, you know, completely true. But that's

842
00:39:29,080 --> 00:39:32,600
Speaker 2: an age thing also where you then know that because

843
00:39:32,600 --> 00:39:35,959
Speaker 2: mostly you're just gonna you're gonna draw in everything, because

844
00:39:35,960 --> 00:39:38,560
Speaker 2: that's what the light does. It'll draw in all kinds

845
00:39:38,600 --> 00:39:41,799
Speaker 2: of things. And then the ability to discern who you

846
00:39:41,920 --> 00:39:44,680
Speaker 2: actually collaborate with, who you're with, what you're gonna do.

847
00:39:44,920 --> 00:39:48,480
Speaker 1: Mark, That's exactly my biggest problem. Literally, access is my

848
00:39:48,560 --> 00:39:50,440
Speaker 1: number one problem. Everyone around me. We have to go

849
00:39:50,480 --> 00:39:51,400
Speaker 1: on an access diet.

850
00:39:51,480 --> 00:39:51,839
Speaker 3: Two things.

851
00:39:51,960 --> 00:39:55,440
Speaker 1: Having too many ideas is number one. But access it's insane.

852
00:39:55,480 --> 00:39:58,160
Speaker 1: Like I'll talk, I'll be giving my phone number to

853
00:39:58,200 --> 00:40:00,000
Speaker 1: the person that's bringing the ice bucket to the table

854
00:40:00,080 --> 00:40:02,040
Speaker 1: because they're like fun and they were so good at it,

855
00:40:02,120 --> 00:40:04,640
Speaker 1: like and people around me, but then to everybody in

856
00:40:04,680 --> 00:40:07,080
Speaker 1: business and everybody in charity and people around me like, stop,

857
00:40:07,239 --> 00:40:10,279
Speaker 1: we're on an access you can't know too much.

858
00:40:10,760 --> 00:40:12,920
Speaker 2: Yeah, And I think I do think that's a function

859
00:40:13,040 --> 00:40:15,000
Speaker 2: of a of age and wisdom where you just have

860
00:40:15,160 --> 00:40:18,520
Speaker 2: the ability to discern and that and that you start doing.

861
00:40:18,560 --> 00:40:21,640
Speaker 2: It's like one action impacts one hundred actions rather than

862
00:40:21,640 --> 00:40:24,759
Speaker 2: a hundred actions impact one hundred actions. Right, you really

863
00:40:24,920 --> 00:40:27,560
Speaker 2: use your leverage and your understanding and your discernment and

864
00:40:27,600 --> 00:40:30,960
Speaker 2: you and you honor the you know your capacity and

865
00:40:31,000 --> 00:40:33,080
Speaker 2: what you have to offer. I mean, I'm saying that

866
00:40:33,120 --> 00:40:35,439
Speaker 2: all the time. Like, you know, I remember years ago.

867
00:40:35,480 --> 00:40:37,520
Speaker 2: It's a it's a crazy story, but I remember this

868
00:40:37,560 --> 00:40:40,480
Speaker 2: person came to me and I don't know they were

869
00:40:40,520 --> 00:40:43,640
Speaker 2: kind of they were a client but they said, I

870
00:40:43,680 --> 00:40:45,440
Speaker 2: really want to be I really want to be friends

871
00:40:45,440 --> 00:40:47,560
Speaker 2: with you, Breck correct, Like, I said, what are you seven?

872
00:40:47,800 --> 00:40:49,759
Speaker 2: It's an interesting thing like seven year olds? You never

873
00:40:49,800 --> 00:40:51,520
Speaker 2: I said, He goes, I really want to be friends

874
00:40:51,560 --> 00:40:54,000
Speaker 2: with you. And I said, well, I can either tell

875
00:40:54,000 --> 00:40:56,359
Speaker 2: you the truth or nor your phone call. Which one

876
00:40:56,400 --> 00:40:56,839
Speaker 2: do you want?

877
00:40:57,120 --> 00:40:57,319
Speaker 1: Right?

878
00:40:57,640 --> 00:40:59,920
Speaker 2: And he said, okay, tell me the truth. I go,

879
00:41:00,040 --> 00:41:02,399
Speaker 2: I would never be friends with you, and he said

880
00:41:02,680 --> 00:41:06,560
Speaker 2: what I said, you understand my friendships are based on

881
00:41:06,880 --> 00:41:09,479
Speaker 2: collaborative things. That doesn't mean emergencies don't happen. That doesn't

882
00:41:09,520 --> 00:41:11,600
Speaker 2: mean we're not there for each other. It means that

883
00:41:11,960 --> 00:41:14,200
Speaker 2: you know, we're not there's no draining of each other.

884
00:41:14,480 --> 00:41:17,080
Speaker 2: And I said, you would be draining the hell out

885
00:41:17,120 --> 00:41:19,520
Speaker 2: of me, right, And they said there'd be not enough

886
00:41:19,600 --> 00:41:22,000
Speaker 2: that you could bring that would actually, you know, change that.

887
00:41:22,400 --> 00:41:24,360
Speaker 2: So why don't you just keep coming to me until

888
00:41:24,360 --> 00:41:27,200
Speaker 2: you can be your own best friend? Okay? I like

889
00:41:27,239 --> 00:41:31,480
Speaker 2: that's so it's understanding, you know that, not from an

890
00:41:31,560 --> 00:41:34,400
Speaker 2: egotistical place. It's more from really understanding.

891
00:41:34,600 --> 00:41:37,640
Speaker 3: And so it's actually selfless because you're being honest and.

892
00:41:37,600 --> 00:41:39,960
Speaker 2: It's useful for him. Yeah, it's useful. Hand and to

893
00:41:40,000 --> 00:41:42,000
Speaker 2: see like, really, well, what is it about me that's

894
00:41:42,040 --> 00:41:42,520
Speaker 2: doing that?

895
00:41:43,040 --> 00:41:43,279
Speaker 3: Right?

896
00:41:43,520 --> 00:41:46,480
Speaker 2: Where's the neediness in me that's you know, and that's

897
00:41:46,880 --> 00:41:48,640
Speaker 2: that's telling complete Yeah.

898
00:41:48,920 --> 00:41:52,839
Speaker 1: Yeah, So I could talk to Breck forever and I'm

899
00:41:52,840 --> 00:41:55,719
Speaker 1: like exasperated today. I'm a little manic because there's so

900
00:41:55,800 --> 00:41:57,799
Speaker 1: many topics that I want to get you guys in

901
00:41:57,880 --> 00:41:59,719
Speaker 1: two with him, and next time there'll be ten more.

902
00:42:00,080 --> 00:42:01,759
Speaker 1: So I'm reminding myself the next time, I want to

903
00:42:01,800 --> 00:42:04,920
Speaker 1: talk about intervening in our own behavior. And also the

904
00:42:04,920 --> 00:42:08,800
Speaker 1: break has said batteries not including batteries are not included

905
00:42:08,800 --> 00:42:11,680
Speaker 1: in people like how we expect to either fix someone

906
00:42:11,800 --> 00:42:13,880
Speaker 1: or them to be everything or just start criticizing what

907
00:42:13,920 --> 00:42:16,520
Speaker 1: they are today when they're a fully formed human being

908
00:42:16,520 --> 00:42:19,680
Speaker 1: when you meet them, and also catastrophizing.

909
00:42:19,719 --> 00:42:21,200
Speaker 3: So I want to talk to you about a lot

910
00:42:21,200 --> 00:42:21,440
Speaker 3: of things.

911
00:42:21,480 --> 00:42:23,560
Speaker 2: It's too many them. Also just to add, I mean,

912
00:42:23,600 --> 00:42:25,960
Speaker 2: there's so many things you're right that can go on forever.

913
00:42:26,239 --> 00:42:28,359
Speaker 2: And that's the whole nature of just when we're talking

914
00:42:28,400 --> 00:42:31,640
Speaker 2: about partnerships or relationships, most people commit to their expectations,

915
00:42:31,640 --> 00:42:34,240
Speaker 2: they don't really commit to the to the actual person.

916
00:42:34,480 --> 00:42:36,880
Speaker 1: They don't really Okay, all right, so that we're going

917
00:42:36,920 --> 00:42:38,239
Speaker 1: to get into that. All right, So we got to

918
00:42:38,239 --> 00:42:39,920
Speaker 1: do this more. I could go for days, but you

919
00:42:39,920 --> 00:42:40,560
Speaker 1: got to get off.

920
00:42:40,480 --> 00:42:43,480
Speaker 2: All right, all right, great talking, all right, Oh my god.

921
00:42:43,520 --> 00:43:00,560
Speaker 1: But beyond by Breck

922
00:43:00,600 --> 00:43:06,080
Speaker 2: After Bos want to back to the conser