WEBVTT - Ted Leonsis: “People want purpose.” 0:00:01.800 --> 0:00:06.200 You're listening to Math and Magic, a production at iHeartRadio. 0:00:07.960 --> 0:00:11.600 We have to innovate, we have to keep pushing the 0:00:11.720 --> 0:00:16.960 envelope to build our audience and really be relevant. And 0:00:17.000 --> 0:00:19.440 the only way that you'll be able to innovate and 0:00:19.480 --> 0:00:23.640 provide those services and build value is to know who 0:00:23.720 --> 0:00:26.600 they are what they do in a real way. 0:00:30.320 --> 0:00:32.800 Hi, I'm Bob Pittman, and welcome to this episode of 0:00:32.840 --> 0:00:36.240 Math and Magic Stories from the Frontiers of Marketing. Today, 0:00:36.280 --> 0:00:39.040 we have an honest to god magician. He began his 0:00:39.080 --> 0:00:42.800 career at what was a revolutionary tech company in its day. 0:00:43.240 --> 0:00:46.559 Wang Labs had a few startups that hit, was a 0:00:46.760 --> 0:00:50.159 hugely important player in the incredible success of AOL in 0:00:50.200 --> 0:00:54.840 the nineties. Continued his tech investing while building a Washington, 0:00:54.960 --> 0:00:59.160 DC based sports powerhouse centered on the Washington Capitals and 0:00:59.200 --> 0:01:03.040 the Wizards. He's the former vice chair of AOL. He's 0:01:03.080 --> 0:01:06.640 the founder and CEO of Monumental Sports and Entertainment, and 0:01:06.680 --> 0:01:09.760 he's a co founder of the investment group Revolution Growth. 0:01:10.120 --> 0:01:14.520 Ted Leonsis ted is Brooklyn, born, raised there and in Massachusetts. 0:01:14.560 --> 0:01:17.920 He's a Georgetown grad and tech pioneer. He's known for 0:01:18.000 --> 0:01:21.120 seeing things early and in a way others can't. He 0:01:21.319 --> 0:01:24.520 cares deeply about people and communities and always finds a 0:01:24.520 --> 0:01:26.880 way to put them first and all he does. He's 0:01:26.959 --> 0:01:29.960 the former mayor of a small Florida town. He has 0:01:30.000 --> 0:01:33.560 a wicked sense of humor, big heart, and a perpetual smile. 0:01:34.000 --> 0:01:36.560 He's been a friend for almost thirty years, and I 0:01:36.640 --> 0:01:40.000 have to say he is also the person who talked 0:01:40.080 --> 0:01:43.520 me into going to AOL just as our big ride began, 0:01:43.720 --> 0:01:45.959 So I owe him a big one for that. 0:01:46.080 --> 0:01:47.720 Ted, welcome, Thank you, Bob. 0:01:47.760 --> 0:01:51.160 It's very sweet of you, and I missed everything about 0:01:51.320 --> 0:01:55.880 your voice and leadership, and you shouldn't be shy to 0:01:55.920 --> 0:01:59.400 say that. I reported to you and I learned a 0:01:59.440 --> 0:02:02.559 lot from you back in the day, so it's wonderful 0:02:02.680 --> 0:02:04.280 to be on your podcast. 0:02:04.560 --> 0:02:06.720 Well, you're very nice, Ted. I always thought of us 0:02:06.760 --> 0:02:09.920 as partners, and boy, did you contribute a lot. Before 0:02:09.919 --> 0:02:12.440 we jump into that meat though, I want to do 0:02:12.520 --> 0:02:16.080 you in sixty seconds. You ready to go yep? Do 0:02:16.120 --> 0:02:21.160 you prefer cats or dogs? Dogs, VITYL or CDs, Vinyl 0:02:21.280 --> 0:02:22.040 FaceTime or. 0:02:22.000 --> 0:02:25.040 Call oh face to face, hugging. 0:02:25.080 --> 0:02:29.120 DC or Brooklyn DC, Slow and steady or pedal to 0:02:29.160 --> 0:02:32.360 the metal, both early riser or night out. 0:02:32.520 --> 0:02:33.519 Oh, I'm early rise. 0:02:33.600 --> 0:02:36.680 I get all my best work done between five and 0:02:36.800 --> 0:02:37.600 seven am. 0:02:37.800 --> 0:02:41.880 Movies at the theater are a streaming movie, streaming crypto 0:02:42.080 --> 0:02:46.120 or dollars dollars Elvis or David Bowie Elvis. 0:02:46.200 --> 0:02:47.760 Me and Elvis had the same birthday. 0:02:48.040 --> 0:02:48.840 Guilty pleasure. 0:02:49.320 --> 0:02:51.960 I am spoiling the shit out. 0:02:51.760 --> 0:02:52.920 Of my grandchildren. 0:02:54.840 --> 0:02:58.559 Okay, let's jump into the meat. You have an uncanny 0:02:58.600 --> 0:03:02.760 ability to see around corners, computers, new media, online, e sports, 0:03:02.800 --> 0:03:05.040 and on and on. Let's start with the topic of 0:03:05.080 --> 0:03:08.760 the minute AI friend or foe and how's it going 0:03:08.800 --> 0:03:10.360 to change our lives in business? 0:03:10.760 --> 0:03:17.000 Oh, it's totally faux right now, and I'm horrified with 0:03:17.160 --> 0:03:22.440 the answers that I'm hearing from. You would think socially 0:03:22.560 --> 0:03:27.520 responsible CEOs. So you know, we used to talk about 0:03:27.560 --> 0:03:32.080 early in the computer industry, you know, garbage in, garbage out, 0:03:32.320 --> 0:03:35.840 And so you know, these machines in the cloud that 0:03:35.880 --> 0:03:40.960 are doing machine learning, the input that they're getting, it's 0:03:41.240 --> 0:03:42.960 bad info. 0:03:43.880 --> 0:03:46.520 You can't tell the sentiment if you will. 0:03:46.600 --> 0:03:51.440 That's on social media and Reddit and all of the 0:03:51.520 --> 0:03:55.720 rivers of data that's at scale, and so we will 0:03:55.880 --> 0:04:02.840 get very, very bad answers, because it's holding a mirror 0:04:03.000 --> 0:04:07.640 up to ourselves, but it's not our real self. We're 0:04:08.000 --> 0:04:13.800 holding a mirror up to this faux personality, this faux 0:04:13.840 --> 0:04:18.320 knowledge base. When you're seeing and you hear a CEO 0:04:18.600 --> 0:04:25.320 say the machines lined, they call it hallucinations. But the 0:04:25.320 --> 0:04:30.800 machines line and we don't know why. It's like, hey, 0:04:31.240 --> 0:04:35.039 full stop till you can figure out why. 0:04:35.920 --> 0:04:40.520 So with this view of AI, in our day in 0:04:41.000 --> 0:04:44.040 taking the Internet to the mass market, it was really 0:04:44.080 --> 0:04:48.840 AOL versus Microsoft today in the AI battleground, and it 0:04:48.960 --> 0:04:51.680 is a battle. Who do you think are the big competitors? 0:04:51.680 --> 0:04:54.359 If you're sort of watching saying, wow, we need to 0:04:54.400 --> 0:04:57.719 watch this, who are the two companies? Are there more 0:04:58.080 --> 0:05:00.039 that are really in the middle of this that we 0:05:00.120 --> 0:05:02.040 have to look to provide that kind of guidance. 0:05:02.560 --> 0:05:07.560 Well, like every industry, you'll have the big incumbents. Certainly 0:05:07.680 --> 0:05:13.320 here Microsoft, which has a multi trillion dollar market cap 0:05:13.440 --> 0:05:16.440 and more cash than the United States does right now, 0:05:16.839 --> 0:05:21.640 they will be formidable. Apple certainly will be late to 0:05:21.720 --> 0:05:27.400 the game, but they'll be formidable. Obviously, Alphabet and Google 0:05:27.600 --> 0:05:32.760 they'll be big and important, and then you'll have startups 0:05:33.080 --> 0:05:38.839 But where I see a positive difference is that we 0:05:39.040 --> 0:05:43.599 always thought in our generation that there would be some 0:05:44.640 --> 0:05:50.040 fantastic verticalization and where you could go deeper in a 0:05:50.160 --> 0:05:53.880 vertical with a solution. You know, we thought vertical search 0:05:54.000 --> 0:05:57.360 one day would be important. I'm an investor in a 0:05:57.360 --> 0:06:05.520 company called tempest Temus, and it is a AI company. 0:06:05.880 --> 0:06:10.560 It uses a power plant now mostly from Google and 0:06:10.760 --> 0:06:14.880 alphabet but you wouldn't know it as a doctor, a 0:06:14.960 --> 0:06:21.160 healthcare provider, or a consumer, and it is noble. It 0:06:21.279 --> 0:06:27.000 is using the power of machine learning all of the 0:06:27.120 --> 0:06:33.000 data that's out there to help families answer a question. 0:06:33.440 --> 0:06:36.240 Your wife gets diagnosed. 0:06:35.600 --> 0:06:39.720 With stage three cancer and she would go to the 0:06:39.800 --> 0:06:42.679 doctor and they would take a sell and say you've 0:06:42.680 --> 0:06:47.960 got cancer, and then they would tell you, hey, there 0:06:48.080 --> 0:06:51.640 was a study in the New England Journal of Medicine 0:06:51.680 --> 0:06:57.520 of fifteen people and based on that and my experience 0:06:57.560 --> 0:07:01.120 as the doctor, it's her genetics, family history. 0:07:01.680 --> 0:07:04.799 Here's what you should be doing. 0:07:05.000 --> 0:07:10.000 So AI in that kind of setting where you can 0:07:10.160 --> 0:07:18.080 provide at scale data with deep genomic information, to me 0:07:19.000 --> 0:07:23.240 is a positive on AI. If we can take that 0:07:23.720 --> 0:07:27.960 high road, use a higher calling around the tools. I 0:07:28.000 --> 0:07:31.240 think we're going to be in good shape, and I 0:07:31.280 --> 0:07:38.000 think that will only come from deep verticalization where companies 0:07:38.040 --> 0:07:42.840 are saying this isn't a business. We're using this technology 0:07:43.040 --> 0:07:48.760 for research and to help doctors to find better ways. 0:07:49.320 --> 0:07:53.400 And yes it'll help save money, Yes it'll help activate 0:07:53.920 --> 0:07:58.040 more efficiency. But we should be using the technology to 0:07:58.160 --> 0:08:03.680 answer big questions, not fill the algorithms up with junk. 0:08:04.120 --> 0:08:07.640 So let's take AI sports. You got into team ownership 0:08:07.680 --> 0:08:10.800 in the late nineties, and I'm sure technologies have affected 0:08:10.840 --> 0:08:13.800 your business. What are the new opportunities with the tech 0:08:13.840 --> 0:08:16.800 today and especially with AI. Is this going to select 0:08:16.840 --> 0:08:18.160 your players now? 0:08:18.640 --> 0:08:21.360 Well, that's really interesting because when you know, I came 0:08:21.400 --> 0:08:26.640 into sports in nineteen ninety nine, everyone lived on Fax 0:08:26.800 --> 0:08:30.720 machines and we were the first team. At least we 0:08:31.280 --> 0:08:35.679 gave everyone personal computers. I gave everyone email addresses. It 0:08:35.840 --> 0:08:42.080 was basic connectivity. But then we started to say, hey, 0:08:42.080 --> 0:08:47.480 this is a platform to launch a lot of new technology, 0:08:48.320 --> 0:08:52.240 and then if it takes hold here, it can be 0:08:52.559 --> 0:08:55.480 nested if you will, within sports and arenas because we 0:08:55.600 --> 0:09:01.640 touched so many people, and then move into general media. 0:09:02.400 --> 0:09:06.240 And so the first big investments that were being made 0:09:06.360 --> 0:09:11.760 were selecting of teams for coaching the players, and the 0:09:12.080 --> 0:09:16.560 amount of work that was done in high speed cameras 0:09:16.679 --> 0:09:21.040 and being able to create these heat maps on where 0:09:21.120 --> 0:09:24.520 was the optimal place for the player to take the shot. 0:09:24.800 --> 0:09:28.880 When you were playing defense, we would pixelate the floor. 0:09:29.400 --> 0:09:32.479 And I remember once Kobe Bryant were playing the Lakers 0:09:32.559 --> 0:09:35.040 and he was going to get the end of game 0:09:35.160 --> 0:09:38.560 shot and was, well, if you can move Kobe two 0:09:38.600 --> 0:09:43.199 pixels to the left, he shoots thirty eight percent. If 0:09:43.240 --> 0:09:47.000 he's those two pixels to the right, he's forty four percent. 0:09:47.480 --> 0:09:48.640 All you can do. 0:09:49.120 --> 0:09:53.320 Is get him to the suboptimized place and where the 0:09:53.360 --> 0:10:01.199 most transparent of providing that data to fans, to coaches, 0:10:01.559 --> 0:10:06.280 to competitors, and now to sports betters. 0:10:06.360 --> 0:10:08.719 Right, they have access to. 0:10:08.840 --> 0:10:13.920 More data, certainly than a Wall Street trader has in 0:10:14.040 --> 0:10:14.800 trying to. 0:10:14.800 --> 0:10:17.120 Pick whether you should short a stock. 0:10:17.320 --> 0:10:20.680 Right, So I looked at sports as being the most 0:10:20.800 --> 0:10:23.560 data rich side on the product. 0:10:23.840 --> 0:10:26.160 And now it's moved into marketing. 0:10:26.240 --> 0:10:30.480 We have a database and monumental sports and entertainment that's 0:10:30.640 --> 0:10:37.240 closing in on four million active records where we really 0:10:37.360 --> 0:10:41.000 know who's coming into the building, how long have they 0:10:41.080 --> 0:10:45.440 been a customer, what have they spent, how do they 0:10:45.559 --> 0:10:49.640 renew who do they give their tickets to, how far 0:10:49.760 --> 0:10:53.640 do they travel? What are they're viewing habits? Are they 0:10:53.720 --> 0:10:59.000 streaming now? Are they still watching games on cable? How 0:10:59.040 --> 0:11:04.360 important is radio? One thing I'll say, radio and digital 0:11:04.480 --> 0:11:11.440 radio and podcasting has become incredibly powerful and on trend again. 0:11:11.960 --> 0:11:13.400 We have to innovate. 0:11:13.480 --> 0:11:17.920 We have to keep pushing the envelope to build our 0:11:18.120 --> 0:11:22.360 audience and really be relevant. And the only way that 0:11:22.400 --> 0:11:25.400 you'll be able to innovate and provide those services and 0:11:25.480 --> 0:11:29.280 build value is to know who they are, what they 0:11:29.360 --> 0:11:33.760 do in a real way, not a superficial way, which 0:11:33.800 --> 0:11:36.600 is what's happened on the internet. But I think it's 0:11:36.720 --> 0:11:43.400 lost its efficacy and deep verticalization. Really understanding your customer, 0:11:43.559 --> 0:11:48.600 really understanding how to connect all the way through all 0:11:48.720 --> 0:11:51.840 of the ways that they live their life on the 0:11:51.920 --> 0:11:55.160 net is what the challenge for the next set of 0:11:55.240 --> 0:11:56.720 marketers will. 0:11:56.480 --> 0:11:57.520 Be in our industry. 0:11:58.000 --> 0:12:01.240 Well, okay, we've covered the business. I mean it's fascinating 0:12:01.360 --> 0:12:04.560 how you've applied all you knew from technology to sports. 0:12:04.960 --> 0:12:07.440 I want to jump for a minute to you with 0:12:07.520 --> 0:12:10.800 a personal matter. One of the most interesting things we 0:12:10.920 --> 0:12:13.840 talked about when we first met, was this list you 0:12:13.960 --> 0:12:16.560 had one hundred and one things you wanted to do 0:12:16.640 --> 0:12:20.360 before you die. Tell us about the genesis of that list. 0:12:20.679 --> 0:12:22.960 And by the way, I also want to know how 0:12:23.000 --> 0:12:25.960 many of those one hundred and one have you achieved? 0:12:27.040 --> 0:12:27.400 Thank you. 0:12:27.440 --> 0:12:33.760 It's you know, deeply personal and everyone will have their reckonings. 0:12:34.080 --> 0:12:39.880 Everyone will have something very disruptive happen in their life 0:12:39.960 --> 0:12:44.959 and times, and it's how you react to that. And 0:12:45.480 --> 0:12:50.280 a lot of times the disruption ends up being a 0:12:50.320 --> 0:12:55.200 grade advantage if you take it in and process it 0:12:55.360 --> 0:12:58.320 in a positive way. So for me, you know, I 0:12:58.400 --> 0:13:01.320 was a poor kid growing up. My father was a waiter. 0:13:01.440 --> 0:13:05.160 It was an immigrant family. We grew up in Lowell, Massachusetts, 0:13:05.240 --> 0:13:08.360 working in mills. And then my dad went into the 0:13:08.440 --> 0:13:12.640 service and married later in life and was a waiter 0:13:12.720 --> 0:13:13.640 and we lived in a. 0:13:13.600 --> 0:13:15.640 Rental apartment in Brooklyn, and. 0:13:15.559 --> 0:13:19.400 I'm an only child. They taught me to work hard, 0:13:19.520 --> 0:13:21.880 get good grades. If you get good grades, you'll get 0:13:21.920 --> 0:13:24.040 into a good school. If you get in good school 0:13:24.080 --> 0:13:26.240 and you get good grades, you'll get a good job 0:13:26.600 --> 0:13:29.439 and you'll make a lot of money. And so I 0:13:29.520 --> 0:13:34.520 followed that Mantra. I went to Georgetown University and had 0:13:34.559 --> 0:13:39.720 some academic success and got out of college and worked 0:13:39.720 --> 0:13:43.040 at a tech company as you mentioned, Wang Laboratories, and 0:13:43.080 --> 0:13:45.760 then I had the entrepreneurial bug and I started my 0:13:45.880 --> 0:13:50.600 first company. I was lucky and maybe clever, and I 0:13:50.920 --> 0:13:54.280 sold that company two years after I started for sixty 0:13:54.320 --> 0:13:57.040 million dollars, and Bob I declared victory. 0:13:57.400 --> 0:14:01.760 And how society tells you to the clear victory. 0:14:01.960 --> 0:14:07.079 Ends up being false social responsibility. In false victory, you 0:14:07.160 --> 0:14:11.160 buy stuff. You're very popular with people who were using 0:14:11.240 --> 0:14:16.280 you as their platform for success. And so I kind 0:14:16.280 --> 0:14:19.520 of lost my way. And then I got on the 0:14:19.560 --> 0:14:24.000 wrong airplane. I had a reckoning. The plane was going down. 0:14:24.520 --> 0:14:27.200 I was alone on the plane, and I started praying. 0:14:27.440 --> 0:14:30.320 Seemed like the right thing to do. And I started 0:14:30.400 --> 0:14:35.480 laughing because I was praying to God, saying, you know, 0:14:35.680 --> 0:14:37.560 please let me get through this. 0:14:37.760 --> 0:14:38.640 I don't want to die. 0:14:39.440 --> 0:14:43.000 And my first thought was if there was a God listening, 0:14:43.120 --> 0:14:46.080 they say, oh, now you need me. You're in deep 0:14:46.240 --> 0:14:50.840 angst and you think I'm here to help you. So 0:14:50.920 --> 0:14:53.760 I reverted back to type. I said, all right, let's 0:14:53.840 --> 0:14:56.480 cut a deal. If I live. 0:14:56.400 --> 0:15:00.480 Through this, I promise I will leave more than I take. 0:15:00.600 --> 0:15:01.000 How's that? 0:15:01.680 --> 0:15:06.440 Obviously we made it through, but I've always been well, 0:15:06.480 --> 0:15:11.760 a deal's a deal. How will I now pay that 0:15:12.280 --> 0:15:15.760 debt back? I made this list of one hundred and 0:15:15.880 --> 0:15:19.880 one things to do before I die, so that I 0:15:20.040 --> 0:15:25.120 could say an end of my life. Could I look 0:15:25.320 --> 0:15:30.600 back and metric and score? How did I do it? 0:15:30.720 --> 0:15:35.440 As I matured and I look at the list, I 0:15:35.480 --> 0:15:39.720 go some of the things that I thought was a 0:15:39.720 --> 0:15:44.800 good way of keeping score ended up not being as 0:15:45.200 --> 0:15:47.080 important as I thought. 0:15:47.840 --> 0:15:51.600 But Bob, and you'll remember, you were kind of there. 0:15:52.120 --> 0:15:55.080 I had put on my list on a sports team 0:15:55.120 --> 0:15:58.960 win a championship, and if I hadn't have written that down. 0:15:59.480 --> 0:16:03.640 When I was approach to buy the teams, I initially 0:16:03.800 --> 0:16:08.400 said no. I said, I'm working at AOL, I have 0:16:08.560 --> 0:16:12.040 two young children. There's no way I could own a team. 0:16:12.560 --> 0:16:16.360 And I came home and Lynn said to me, what's new? 0:16:16.440 --> 0:16:18.920 What happened today? And I said, oh, this guy approached 0:16:18.920 --> 0:16:21.920 me wanted to buy teams. And she said what did 0:16:22.000 --> 0:16:22.440 you say? 0:16:22.480 --> 0:16:25.440 And I said, I can't engaged at the company. We 0:16:25.560 --> 0:16:26.400 have young kids. 0:16:26.600 --> 0:16:30.240 And Lynn said to me, hey, we've been together for 0:16:30.280 --> 0:16:34.240 a long time. We'd be together forever. What if you 0:16:35.200 --> 0:16:37.840 get ninety nine of the one hundred and one thing's 0:16:37.960 --> 0:16:40.600 done and you don't buy a team and you don't 0:16:40.600 --> 0:16:43.520 win a championship, and so well, this is why I 0:16:43.560 --> 0:16:43.960 love you. 0:16:44.200 --> 0:16:46.080 Yeah, I'm going to go and. 0:16:46.040 --> 0:16:50.400 I bought the team and we've won championships. But it's 0:16:50.440 --> 0:16:54.000 also been like the best financial decision as a family 0:16:54.360 --> 0:16:55.640 we could have made. 0:16:55.840 --> 0:16:58.080 So I'm now at like ninety four. 0:16:58.640 --> 0:17:04.840 I wrote this list in nineteen eighty six, and back 0:17:04.880 --> 0:17:06.800 then I said I want to go into outer space. 0:17:07.480 --> 0:17:11.480 That seemed crazy. Right now I go, oh, I'm definitely 0:17:11.520 --> 0:17:14.719 gonna get that one checked off, right, I mean, Richard 0:17:14.720 --> 0:17:18.360 Branson's called me, Bezos has called me, and I'm sure 0:17:19.240 --> 0:17:23.919 I will get into outer space, and I'm clicking them off. 0:17:24.640 --> 0:17:29.840 But it also was will I be happy and self 0:17:29.920 --> 0:17:34.359 actualized at the end of the journey, And some of 0:17:34.440 --> 0:17:39.600 the things on the list weren't going to make me happy, 0:17:39.880 --> 0:17:43.280 And so I've matured, if you will, And I don't 0:17:43.280 --> 0:17:45.480 think I have to get all one hundred and one done, 0:17:46.080 --> 0:17:49.280 But you know, big important things like falling in love, 0:17:49.840 --> 0:17:54.760 getting married, and having children, having grandchildren, living a healthy life, 0:17:55.560 --> 0:17:56.600 giving back. 0:17:56.720 --> 0:18:00.719 Those are the things that I think will be most important. 0:18:00.840 --> 0:18:02.080 At the end of the day. 0:18:02.640 --> 0:18:06.680 You touched on your childhood and growing up and what 0:18:06.720 --> 0:18:09.480 it meant to you. If I remember my story right, 0:18:10.040 --> 0:18:12.560 I think your high school guidance counselor told you you 0:18:12.600 --> 0:18:14.800 weren't college material and tried to steer you to a 0:18:14.880 --> 0:18:18.719 vocational school. Obviously that didn't sit well with you. You 0:18:18.760 --> 0:18:22.760 went onto Georgetown, and I think that really set you 0:18:22.800 --> 0:18:26.200 on the track of technology and got you into tech. 0:18:26.640 --> 0:18:28.840 Can you tell us a little bit more about that story, 0:18:28.880 --> 0:18:31.560 because I do think that probably was a seminal moment 0:18:31.680 --> 0:18:34.120 for ted Leonsis and where you wound up. 0:18:35.000 --> 0:18:45.320 Yeah, I probably created the first algorithmic based liberal arts 0:18:45.880 --> 0:18:53.080 program ever and it was powered by a Jesuit priest 0:18:53.119 --> 0:18:54.320 who was my mentor. 0:18:54.400 --> 0:18:56.760 I had to write a thesis. 0:18:56.520 --> 0:19:01.159 And I was a little bit lazy and said what 0:19:01.200 --> 0:19:03.520 are you going to write about? And I said, I'll 0:19:03.560 --> 0:19:05.960 come up with the idea over the weekend. So I 0:19:06.000 --> 0:19:09.000 went to the library and I was with some buddies 0:19:09.040 --> 0:19:13.199 and I said, all right, I'm going to find the shortest, 0:19:13.600 --> 0:19:18.359 easiest book to read in the library. I found Old 0:19:18.359 --> 0:19:21.199 Man in the Seat and it's a novella. If you 0:19:21.280 --> 0:19:24.159 will and I read in like an hour and a half. 0:19:24.920 --> 0:19:28.160 And on Monday I went to see my mentor, father, 0:19:28.320 --> 0:19:32.240 Joseph Dirkin, Society of Jesus, and he said, okay, great, 0:19:32.480 --> 0:19:34.879 tell me what you thought of the book. And I 0:19:34.920 --> 0:19:38.400 gave him like an annotated book report, and he said, 0:19:38.400 --> 0:19:41.919 I'm so disappointed in you. There's so much going on 0:19:42.720 --> 0:19:46.959 in this book with this author at the time it 0:19:47.080 --> 0:19:51.119 was published. You're better than this. And he challenged me 0:19:51.320 --> 0:19:54.000 to be more of a critical thinker. 0:19:54.280 --> 0:19:56.560 So I didn't know anything about Hemingway. 0:19:56.680 --> 0:20:00.520 There was no Internet back then, so I literally and 0:20:00.600 --> 0:20:01.760 got a bunch. 0:20:01.520 --> 0:20:02.240 Of his books. 0:20:02.600 --> 0:20:04.760 And the second book I read, Across the River and 0:20:04.840 --> 0:20:08.800 Into the Trees, was nothing like Old Man in the Sea, 0:20:09.320 --> 0:20:12.600 And as I started to do research, Hemingway was a 0:20:12.800 --> 0:20:17.800 journalist Esquire Magazine, New Yorker Magazine, and then he became 0:20:17.920 --> 0:20:23.520 a writer and Old Man in the Sea was published 0:20:23.520 --> 0:20:27.080 in the fifties. He won a Pulit surprise, he ended 0:20:27.119 --> 0:20:31.160 up taking his life. And I just had this idea 0:20:31.359 --> 0:20:37.199 that I think Ernest Hemingway wrote this book earlier in 0:20:37.240 --> 0:20:41.360 his career and he needed the money, and you know, 0:20:41.520 --> 0:20:46.280 jazz was becoming popular and Jack Kerouac and Allen Ginsburg, 0:20:46.680 --> 0:20:49.840 and he went back to his journalistic style. And Father 0:20:49.920 --> 0:20:52.159 Dirk and said, well, great, how are you going to 0:20:52.280 --> 0:20:56.399 prove it? And I said, I'll call his wife. Oh, 0:20:56.560 --> 0:21:01.399 I'll try and talk to the publisher. And Father Dirkin, 0:21:01.520 --> 0:21:04.800 to his credit, said why don't we use a computer? 0:21:06.320 --> 0:21:11.119 And I said, a computer like in the movies. Like. 0:21:12.119 --> 0:21:16.040 We had one computer on campus in the registrar's office. 0:21:16.080 --> 0:21:19.800 It was IBM three stixy and it spit out for 0:21:19.920 --> 0:21:25.800 students what classes you would take. So he introduced me 0:21:26.160 --> 0:21:32.040 to a linguistics major. He introduced me to someone who 0:21:32.240 --> 0:21:36.800 worked in the computer mis department, and we went to 0:21:36.880 --> 0:21:40.840 dinner and we came up with the idea of I 0:21:40.920 --> 0:21:46.200 would have to type in the first five thousand lines 0:21:46.520 --> 0:21:51.879 of a book and articles from the fifties, from the forties. 0:21:51.400 --> 0:21:52.359 From the thirties. 0:21:53.280 --> 0:21:57.960 And then the linguistics major she came up with these 0:21:58.160 --> 0:22:05.040 metrics words, person sentences, sentences per paragraph, pronoun references. There 0:22:05.040 --> 0:22:11.080 were seventeen measures, and then the programmer wrote this code 0:22:12.000 --> 0:22:19.520 to basically answer the question. Based on this algorithm, when 0:22:19.720 --> 0:22:22.480 was Old Man in the Sea as a control written? 0:22:23.359 --> 0:22:25.920 And it said the book was written in. 0:22:25.840 --> 0:22:30.680 The thirties, not in nineteen fifty two, and it was 0:22:31.520 --> 0:22:37.000 mind blowing to us. And you know, I wrote a 0:22:37.040 --> 0:22:42.919 college thesis. But it showed how a computer and software 0:22:42.920 --> 0:22:49.640 and algorithms could find essence of truth in the data 0:22:49.880 --> 0:22:55.320 and show you something that you never knew happened. 0:22:56.480 --> 0:22:58.320 And it was truly for me. 0:22:59.320 --> 0:23:06.399 Ah moment, and it powered pretty much everything for the 0:23:06.440 --> 0:23:07.919 rest of my life and career. 0:23:09.000 --> 0:23:13.120 Made a movie in a similar fashion in that. 0:23:14.200 --> 0:23:17.400 I didn't have anything to read Bob and I started 0:23:17.440 --> 0:23:21.560 reading the Last thirty Days of the New York Times 0:23:21.600 --> 0:23:25.080 from a bookstore in Saint Bart's and I read an 0:23:25.080 --> 0:23:30.160 obituary about an author named Iris Chang and she wrote 0:23:30.200 --> 0:23:31.320 a book called. 0:23:31.080 --> 0:23:32.520 The Rape of Name King. 0:23:33.520 --> 0:23:37.760 And when I got home, I went on Amazon and 0:23:37.800 --> 0:23:41.640 I said, I'm going to buy the book, and their 0:23:41.800 --> 0:23:43.680 simple little algorithm said, oh. 0:23:43.640 --> 0:23:47.800 If you like this book, then you like these books. 0:23:48.640 --> 0:23:52.440 And there was a starburst that said the Forgotten Holocaust 0:23:53.640 --> 0:23:58.200 and it was basically behind the Chinese Communist Wall. This 0:23:58.359 --> 0:24:02.159 was in nineteen thirty four. I was at AOL, I 0:24:02.200 --> 0:24:05.560 had some contacts. I worked with the people at CIA, 0:24:06.040 --> 0:24:09.879 and I made a film called Nang King and it 0:24:10.119 --> 0:24:13.200 won Best at Open Sundayands, it. 0:24:13.200 --> 0:24:14.480 Went on HBO. 0:24:15.520 --> 0:24:19.600 It won the Emmy Award for Best Documentary. And it 0:24:19.680 --> 0:24:26.520 all came from reading an obituary and an algorithm telling 0:24:26.600 --> 0:24:31.879 me there's more to this story than this just this 0:24:32.200 --> 0:24:38.520 one book, and that turned me into making films. 0:24:39.440 --> 0:24:48.800 More mathem magic. Right after this quick break, welcome back 0:24:48.880 --> 0:24:52.120 to Mathemagic. Let's hear more from my conversation with Ted 0:24:52.200 --> 0:25:00.440 leonsis so Ted, you make mundane things sound exciting about 0:25:00.440 --> 0:25:02.399 adding a twist, and I want to tell a story 0:25:02.440 --> 0:25:04.960 on you. When I got to AOL and we were 0:25:05.520 --> 0:25:07.679 in this whole process of how can we make this 0:25:07.840 --> 0:25:11.159 company profitable? I was laying out to our group of 0:25:11.200 --> 0:25:14.800 senior leaders, tying it to what the stock price could 0:25:14.840 --> 0:25:17.679 be because they all were equity holders if we achieved 0:25:17.720 --> 0:25:22.080 those earnings levels, and I start think it's mathematical, it's 0:25:22.080 --> 0:25:23.920 this and this and this, and you could see people 0:25:23.960 --> 0:25:27.840 sort of glazing over some skepticism. You suddenly amped up 0:25:27.840 --> 0:25:32.040 the discussion by declaring to the room that Bob, I'm 0:25:32.040 --> 0:25:34.159 going to give you my house if we hit that 0:25:34.240 --> 0:25:38.520 stock price. Suddenly the room was on fire. And by 0:25:38.560 --> 0:25:40.399 the way, when we walked out of the room, you 0:25:40.440 --> 0:25:42.920 sort of gave me that ted le Ounce's smile and goes, 0:25:43.200 --> 0:25:45.199 I'll be delighted to give you by house hip. The 0:25:45.200 --> 0:25:47.840 stock hits that price, and you knew exactly what you 0:25:48.240 --> 0:25:52.360 were doing. I've seen you use that technique other times, 0:25:52.760 --> 0:25:56.080 and I know you're using it in your business. How 0:25:56.080 --> 0:26:00.040 do you think about that and what's the benefit of it? 0:26:00.200 --> 0:26:06.239 Well, I think that people want to have romance in 0:26:06.320 --> 0:26:13.600 their life. People want to have hopes and dreams. And 0:26:13.720 --> 0:26:18.280 my beef if you will after we acquire Time Warner 0:26:19.200 --> 0:26:24.080 was we put out a company goal of ten billion 0:26:24.200 --> 0:26:31.280 dollars of EBITA and with a billion dollars of synergy 0:26:32.040 --> 0:26:33.600 EBAA savings. 0:26:34.119 --> 0:26:35.280