WEBVTT - Player Storytelling: Seth Joyner 0:00:03.120 --> 0:00:07.600 Welcome to the NFL Legends Podcast, an NFL podcast for 0:00:07.720 --> 0:00:12.959 the players, by the players. Here is your host, fourteen 0:00:13.039 --> 0:00:24.080 year NFL veteran and Hall of famer As Williams. Hello, 0:00:24.239 --> 0:00:27.720 Welcome to the NFL Legends Podcast. I am As Williams. 0:00:28.160 --> 0:00:32.519 Today our guest is NFL Legend, my former teammate. The 0:00:32.800 --> 0:00:34.680 set join it and I'll tell you why I say 0:00:34.760 --> 0:00:38.800 the shortly. On addition of playing thirteen seasons in the 0:00:38.880 --> 0:00:43.440 league and being a Super Bowl champion, also host an 0:00:43.520 --> 0:00:49.080 NFL podcast, The Set join the show. Welcome Seth and there. 0:00:49.120 --> 0:00:51.080 This is a pleasure to be with you, my friend. 0:00:51.159 --> 0:00:54.400 I'm glad that you're doing well and I'm looking forward 0:00:54.400 --> 0:00:56.920 to this, uh, this time of chatting with you, my friend. 0:00:57.600 --> 0:01:01.640 We've been doing this podcast over three years, Set, and 0:01:02.040 --> 0:01:04.760 I really haven't had a lot of my teammates that 0:01:04.800 --> 0:01:08.000 I've had the opportunity to be on the podcast, so 0:01:08.080 --> 0:01:12.240 this is special for me. You've had former teammates on 0:01:13.520 --> 0:01:17.800 You just had Randall Cunningham something like on on your show, 0:01:17.880 --> 0:01:22.080 and you've had we were called the Mount rushmore of 0:01:22.480 --> 0:01:26.880 players from the Philadelphia Eagles. What was it like having 0:01:26.920 --> 0:01:31.720 conversations with those guys? Well, It's really interesting because, um, 0:01:31.920 --> 0:01:35.520 you know, one of the one of the greatest shows 0:01:35.560 --> 0:01:39.039 that I had, I had Randall, I had Ron Jaworski, 0:01:39.560 --> 0:01:42.880 had Donovan McNabb, and I had Michael Vick all on 0:01:42.920 --> 0:01:45.440 the same show. I mean, I came up with the idea, 0:01:45.720 --> 0:01:49.040 you know, okay, if quarterback is the most important position 0:01:49.120 --> 0:01:52.120 on the field, you got you know, the four greatest 0:01:52.320 --> 0:01:55.800 quarterback icons almost you know, in the present day history 0:01:55.840 --> 0:01:58.600 of the of the of the organization. So why not 0:01:58.720 --> 0:02:02.240 have those guys come on. They're all from different errors 0:02:02.800 --> 0:02:06.440 and have them talk about you know, um, their experiences 0:02:06.480 --> 0:02:09.120 being the Philadelphia Eagle, their experienced in the league. And 0:02:09.200 --> 0:02:11.600 let me tell you, my show is supposed to be 0:02:11.680 --> 0:02:14.880 an hour. We went an hour in forty five minutes. 0:02:15.080 --> 0:02:18.720 You know. Once once I got everybody ramped up. I mean, 0:02:18.760 --> 0:02:21.160 they were just firing away and it was so organic. 0:02:21.240 --> 0:02:23.520 I just set back and just let them let them 0:02:23.560 --> 0:02:27.480 go and and it was a phenomenal, phenomenal show. You know, 0:02:27.600 --> 0:02:30.680 it's interesting you had Michael Vicken when you had a 0:02:30.800 --> 0:02:36.120 random cutting him. I would dare say today's young quarterbacks 0:02:36.360 --> 0:02:39.359 remind me of those two guys. When it comes down 0:02:39.400 --> 0:02:43.240 to Russell Wilson, Carla Murray, we have the hype right 0:02:44.160 --> 0:02:47.440 supposedly at one time impediment and then you had the 0:02:47.520 --> 0:02:51.040 duck flute, as you had John Elways, the mobile guys. 0:02:51.080 --> 0:02:56.000 So justin Herbert, big old guys at are mobile said, 0:02:56.160 --> 0:02:58.640 what would have it been like for you playing today? 0:02:59.639 --> 0:03:03.400 What what I called the quarterback? When we were playing, 0:03:03.400 --> 0:03:08.280 I thought the most vulnerable defense was a defense plan 0:03:08.360 --> 0:03:12.000 against a mobile quarterback who not only could run, but 0:03:12.080 --> 0:03:14.680 had the ability to throw the ball. Right. Do you 0:03:14.720 --> 0:03:17.720 think it had been like were you playing during this era? Well, 0:03:17.840 --> 0:03:21.040 it's it always created a problem because you know, sitting 0:03:21.080 --> 0:03:24.240 back watching Randall Cunningham grow and coming to his own 0:03:24.720 --> 0:03:27.040 and then Michael Vick come in and take you know, 0:03:27.080 --> 0:03:30.200 the lead by storm. Those guys were the genesis of 0:03:30.280 --> 0:03:34.080 the you know, the triple threat quarterback, and it would 0:03:34.080 --> 0:03:37.000 have been difficult. I don't know. Sometimes I watched defense 0:03:37.080 --> 0:03:39.200 today and I wonder, how is it possible that you 0:03:39.200 --> 0:03:42.600 can stop these guys? But you know, you know, playing 0:03:42.600 --> 0:03:45.000 on the buddy, we were a pressure defense and we 0:03:45.000 --> 0:03:48.760 were all about applying pressure to the quarterback position. Um, 0:03:48.800 --> 0:03:52.040 the greatest hinders that you have when defensively, when you're 0:03:52.040 --> 0:03:55.920 trying to stop a guy like Colin Murray, Lamar Jackson, 0:03:56.360 --> 0:03:58.640 you know, ad Justin Herbert, these guys that can move 0:03:58.680 --> 0:04:01.680 around and make plays. Is trying to keep these guys 0:04:02.160 --> 0:04:05.960 bottled up and contained, and it's it's it's a tough 0:04:06.040 --> 0:04:09.600 thing to do when you only rushed for because you're 0:04:09.640 --> 0:04:12.640 always gonna have these gaps, you know, in your defensive 0:04:12.680 --> 0:04:16.240 line when you got you know, your alignement, and their 0:04:16.279 --> 0:04:19.480 focus is, you know, getting sacks, getting sacks, getting sacked, 0:04:19.760 --> 0:04:22.880 you know, so tell sometimes they lose the discipline of 0:04:23.000 --> 0:04:25.840 laying integrity and making sure that they keep the quarterback 0:04:25.880 --> 0:04:28.480 in the pocket. And these quarterbacks are smart enough to 0:04:28.560 --> 0:04:30.760 understand the game and know now that you know, hey, 0:04:30.760 --> 0:04:35.240 when I read you know man and man in passing situations, 0:04:35.279 --> 0:04:38.440 when the play breaks down, everybody's got their backs turn. 0:04:38.680 --> 0:04:42.080 Whether you're single high, too high safety, you know, those 0:04:42.120 --> 0:04:45.080 safeties are thirty yards deep, so I'm gonna pick up 0:04:45.360 --> 0:04:49.160 fift twenty yards before the defense can't even react. And 0:04:49.200 --> 0:04:51.719 they're smart enough to understand it. When I read zone 0:04:51.760 --> 0:04:54.880 pre snap that I'm scrambling to buy time. I'm not 0:04:54.920 --> 0:04:57.280 trying to cross the line of scrimmage and get yards 0:04:57.320 --> 0:05:00.240 I'm trying to scramble to buy time for my guys 0:05:00.279 --> 0:05:02.919 that uncover and find a hole where I can actually 0:05:02.920 --> 0:05:07.120 complete complete passes. So it's a tough task today, you know, 0:05:07.240 --> 0:05:11.160 no doubt, you know me playing in in today's NFL 0:05:11.560 --> 0:05:17.520 or US playing defensively in today's version of offensive football 0:05:17.560 --> 0:05:20.599 would have been a major, major challenge. And that's what 0:05:20.640 --> 0:05:23.480 I was thinking, because the Patrick Mahomes, de Lamar Jackson, 0:05:23.520 --> 0:05:28.000 these guys Cassette, they will wear out a pass rush. 0:05:28.320 --> 0:05:30.719 So just intriguing to see how we would have played 0:05:30.839 --> 0:05:34.320 in this era. But as you were doing your interview 0:05:34.400 --> 0:05:37.599 with your guys, what were the stories like when you 0:05:37.640 --> 0:05:42.600 were talking to Ron Jaworski and and Randall and and 0:05:42.640 --> 0:05:46.480 Michael those guys. It was really interesting in this because 0:05:47.240 --> 0:05:51.320 you had Randall was drafted um I think a year 0:05:51.440 --> 0:05:53.839 or two before me, and he was drafted to be 0:05:54.000 --> 0:05:56.839 the Arab parent to Ron Jaworski, And a lot of 0:05:56.839 --> 0:06:01.039 people don't know my last year, Ron was my first year. 0:06:01.120 --> 0:06:05.360 Rather Ron was on the team. He um was the 0:06:05.440 --> 0:06:08.360 first second down quarterback, but he was trying to implement 0:06:08.480 --> 0:06:11.960 Randall n because the plan was the following year Randall 0:06:12.040 --> 0:06:13.640 was going to be the starting quarterback and they were 0:06:13.640 --> 0:06:16.800 gonna move on from Jaws. Jaws would play first and 0:06:16.880 --> 0:06:19.719 second down, but he would put Randall in the game 0:06:19.760 --> 0:06:22.680 and on third down. I mean, this happened all year long. 0:06:22.720 --> 0:06:25.000 It was the craziest thing that you'd ever want to see. 0:06:25.320 --> 0:06:28.640 So you knew that Ron felt some type of way 0:06:28.680 --> 0:06:30.839 about that, you know, because he wants to stay on 0:06:30.880 --> 0:06:33.320 the field and convert the third down. But the Randall 0:06:33.360 --> 0:06:36.320 comes on and more times than not, he was gonna 0:06:36.440 --> 0:06:38.760 run and he was gonna scramble, you know, for a 0:06:38.839 --> 0:06:43.479 first down. So the dynamic, you know, of those two 0:06:43.560 --> 0:06:48.640 quarterbacks and what they went through in six was amazing 0:06:48.680 --> 0:06:52.040 to me because under normal circumstances, you know, human nature 0:06:52.120 --> 0:06:56.040 would say that that Ron would still feel some type 0:06:56.040 --> 0:06:59.479 of way about that situation, and how Randall supplanted him. 0:07:00.040 --> 0:07:05.240 And then and then you fast forward to Donovan McNabb 0:07:05.960 --> 0:07:09.080 and Donovan McNabb, you know, having Michael fit come in 0:07:09.200 --> 0:07:12.480 after you know, his off the field issues, and it's 0:07:12.520 --> 0:07:15.720 been documented that Andy Reid and Jeffrey Lourie and Day 0:07:15.800 --> 0:07:19.240 and Joe banner Um the brain stress of the Philadelphia 0:07:19.480 --> 0:07:23.080 was actually when they had a conversation with Donovan about 0:07:23.080 --> 0:07:26.400 bringing in Michael and then how a couple of years later, 0:07:26.480 --> 0:07:31.160 the same thing transpired where Donovan's you know, play begin 0:07:31.240 --> 0:07:33.080 to wane a little bit. He began to have some 0:07:33.200 --> 0:07:37.720 issues and Michael had an opportunity to play, and the 0:07:37.800 --> 0:07:41.840 next thing, you know, Donovan gets traded to the Washington 0:07:42.080 --> 0:07:45.480 you know, football team, and now Michael Vick is now 0:07:45.600 --> 0:07:48.440 the starting quarterback for the Philadelphia Eagles. I mean, it 0:07:48.560 --> 0:07:53.120 was just it was a phenomenal um interview because of 0:07:53.160 --> 0:07:55.240 those dynamics and then to be able to see the 0:07:55.280 --> 0:07:58.040 respect that all four those guys, even through all of that, 0:07:58.160 --> 0:08:01.680 still half for each other, and how they talked about 0:08:01.760 --> 0:08:04.640 each other, and you know, Randall talked about how Jaws 0:08:04.720 --> 0:08:08.119 helped him and and and and Michael talked about how 0:08:09.080 --> 0:08:13.920 you know, Donovan feeling comfortable enough to to okay him 0:08:13.960 --> 0:08:17.720 coming you know, getting a second chance with the Philadelphia Eagles. 0:08:17.760 --> 0:08:22.040 And then that whole transition of how Randall replaced Jaws 0:08:22.160 --> 0:08:25.840 and how Michael Vick replaced Donovan um to be able 0:08:25.840 --> 0:08:28.040 to have him on and and and see the reverence 0:08:28.080 --> 0:08:30.200 that they you know, still have for each other. You know, 0:08:30.200 --> 0:08:33.640 it was a great thing. How much did you guys 0:08:33.679 --> 0:08:40.400 sense as teammates. That's some the overtones of possibly prejudices 0:08:41.240 --> 0:08:47.880 of an African American quarterback replacing a Caucasian brother, Ron Jaworski. 0:08:48.040 --> 0:08:52.040 Did you guys feel any of that, Oh, you could 0:08:52.080 --> 0:08:55.120 feel it was probable in the city, um, not only 0:08:55.160 --> 0:08:59.520 among the fans, because you gotta remember Ron Zawarski actually quarterback. 0:09:00.200 --> 0:09:04.320 You know, this this Eagle's franchise, you know, to their 0:09:04.360 --> 0:09:07.640 first modern day Super Bowl. So there was a major 0:09:07.280 --> 0:09:11.520 reverence in the city of Philadelphia for for Ron Jaworski, 0:09:11.559 --> 0:09:14.840 even though you know, his his his skills had erode 0:09:14.840 --> 0:09:17.360 it and you know Randall was was gonna be the 0:09:17.440 --> 0:09:21.199 new guy when the shift was made. Among the fans, 0:09:21.280 --> 0:09:23.960 among the media, and even some of the guys on 0:09:24.000 --> 0:09:26.760 the team felt like, you know, that wasn't the move 0:09:26.840 --> 0:09:29.080 to be made, that was you know, so there was 0:09:29.120 --> 0:09:32.719 some animosity there. But you know, it was a situation 0:09:32.800 --> 0:09:36.040 where the Eagles, along with the Cardinals at that time, 0:09:36.520 --> 0:09:39.800 you know, resided in the basement of the NFC East. 0:09:39.840 --> 0:09:43.040 There was a turnover on the roster, so it wasn't 0:09:43.080 --> 0:09:46.440 just a quarterback position, but it was across the board. 0:09:46.800 --> 0:09:49.760 But it was even magnified that much more when you had, 0:09:50.240 --> 0:09:54.600 you know, a Caucasian quarterback whom the city and the 0:09:54.640 --> 0:10:00.680 media revered being replaced by a scrambling African America and quarterback. 0:10:01.000 --> 0:10:04.120 And it was still not you know, the politically correct 0:10:04.280 --> 0:10:08.240 thing at that time. You know that African American quarterbacks 0:10:08.520 --> 0:10:11.600 would take over those types of positions and and it 0:10:11.679 --> 0:10:15.240 wasn't believed that they could flourish in those in those situations. 0:10:15.600 --> 0:10:19.800 So it also gives us probably the mindset behind coach 0:10:19.840 --> 0:10:23.000 Buddy running right, because some coaches would have been pressured 0:10:24.000 --> 0:10:27.480 not do this. So tell me about Buddy. What what 0:10:27.679 --> 0:10:32.720 was your first experience with coach Buddy Ryan. You know, listen, 0:10:32.880 --> 0:10:37.439 I thought the guy was crazy. Um, I'm a young guy. 0:10:38.080 --> 0:10:39.719 You know when I got drafted by the Eagles and 0:10:40.040 --> 0:10:42.040 I was twenty years old. I was the youngest player 0:10:42.080 --> 0:10:45.880 in the NFL. I wasn't even legal when I got drafted. Um. 0:10:46.160 --> 0:10:48.640 You know, you get the training camp and you know, 0:10:49.160 --> 0:10:52.440 Buddy is just custing to everybody out and you know, 0:10:53.120 --> 0:10:57.960 I had never experienced that that type of intensity and 0:10:58.040 --> 0:11:00.800 that type of workload, you know, all of my years 0:11:00.800 --> 0:11:03.680 of playing football. Um, as I look back at it 0:11:03.760 --> 0:11:07.160 now in retrospect, I understand it wholeheartedly because what he 0:11:07.240 --> 0:11:10.000 was doing is he was trying to figure out just 0:11:10.080 --> 0:11:12.959 like when he came to Arizona that first training camp 0:11:13.040 --> 0:11:16.680 was was hell, you know, and what he was trying 0:11:16.720 --> 0:11:19.480 to figure out, Okay, who wants to be here and 0:11:19.520 --> 0:11:22.280 who's willing to sacrifice and who's willing to put in 0:11:22.320 --> 0:11:25.000 the work to be here? Because the guys that don't 0:11:25.000 --> 0:11:27.040 want to do the work and the guys that don't 0:11:27.080 --> 0:11:30.880 want to sacrifice, you know, I gotta get those guys 0:11:30.920 --> 0:11:32.920 out of here because in order for me to change 0:11:32.960 --> 0:11:35.120 the culture, I've got to brand guys that are gonna 0:11:35.160 --> 0:11:37.679 buy in to what it is that I'm trying to do. 0:11:37.880 --> 0:11:40.280 And that's what it was like on a daily basis, 0:11:40.400 --> 0:11:42.680 on a daily basis, and for the young guys, because 0:11:42.720 --> 0:11:45.839 I was drafted by him. For the young guys, you 0:11:45.920 --> 0:11:48.120 had to you had to write of passes that you 0:11:48.200 --> 0:11:50.000 had to get through. I didn't even think he knew 0:11:50.040 --> 0:11:52.360 my name because for two years he never called me 0:11:52.400 --> 0:11:55.000 by my name. I was fifty nine. How did your 0:11:55.040 --> 0:11:58.960 teammates help twenty years old a rookie? How was it 0:11:58.960 --> 0:12:01.160 in the locker room? What he may help you get 0:12:01.200 --> 0:12:06.240 through it? Oh? Yeah, well I mean, listen, there was 0:12:06.280 --> 0:12:09.160 a lot of transition. There was a lot of animosity, 0:12:09.880 --> 0:12:12.920 you know, when I got there. We we drafted four 0:12:12.960 --> 0:12:16.840 linebackers that year in the draft. Um, there was another 0:12:16.960 --> 0:12:20.319 seven or eight veterans that were excuse me, that were 0:12:20.400 --> 0:12:23.320 on the roster. Um. I had some guys telling me 0:12:23.480 --> 0:12:25.320 to go right when I should have been going left, 0:12:25.840 --> 0:12:28.960 you know. But I was fortunate enough to have one guy, um, 0:12:29.000 --> 0:12:32.520 one veteran named Gary Cole. You know, he took all 0:12:32.600 --> 0:12:35.920 the young guys under his wing, and one day, you know, 0:12:36.000 --> 0:12:37.760 he made it pretty clear. He was like, you know, 0:12:37.880 --> 0:12:39.920 you guys, don't think all of y'all gonna make the team. 0:12:40.200 --> 0:12:42.840 You know, a rookies, you know, you you think that 0:12:42.960 --> 0:12:45.479 just because you're drafted that you're gonna make the team. 0:12:45.520 --> 0:12:47.800 You know, we we had no idea what the process 0:12:47.920 --> 0:12:50.199 was like. So he says, not all of you guys 0:12:50.240 --> 0:12:51.679 are gonna make the team, and I'm like, what are 0:12:51.720 --> 0:12:54.360 you talking about? You know, we were all drafted. He 0:12:54.480 --> 0:12:57.240 was like, listen, there are there are seven or other 0:12:57.360 --> 0:13:01.040 eight guys here who have NFL experience. You know the 0:13:01.080 --> 0:13:03.960 majority of those guys gonna play. We're gonna keep you know, 0:13:04.040 --> 0:13:06.960 too deep at each position, but I understand that there's 0:13:06.960 --> 0:13:10.240 gonna be some some spots on this roster for some 0:13:10.320 --> 0:13:13.520 of you guys that can play special teams. And it 0:13:13.760 --> 0:13:16.320 dawned on me at that point in time that that 0:13:16.480 --> 0:13:18.880 is how I was going to make the team, you know, 0:13:19.280 --> 0:13:22.160 So I focused my attention. Yeah, I was still studying. 0:13:22.240 --> 0:13:24.600 I was still preparing because I knew I had to 0:13:24.679 --> 0:13:26.600 learn the defense even though I wasn't getting a lot 0:13:26.600 --> 0:13:29.480 of reps at the linebacker position. But what I quickly 0:13:29.559 --> 0:13:32.199 realize is that, you know what, if I can show 0:13:32.240 --> 0:13:34.960 them the type of player that I can be on 0:13:35.080 --> 0:13:38.960 special teams, somehow that might translate in their minds that 0:13:39.040 --> 0:13:41.480 at some point in time down the road an opportunity 0:13:41.559 --> 0:13:43.880 might present it so for me to show them what 0:13:43.960 --> 0:13:46.679 type of linebacker I could be, you know, and sometimes 0:13:46.720 --> 0:13:49.200 as young guys, that's how you have to you have 0:13:49.280 --> 0:13:52.200 to approach it. So I'm I'm forever in debt, you know, 0:13:52.240 --> 0:13:55.600 to Gary for not only teaching us how to be professionals, 0:13:55.600 --> 0:13:57.360 because he said, you know, if you're gonna be a professional, 0:13:57.480 --> 0:13:58.760 this is what you do. This is where you go. 0:13:58.840 --> 0:14:00.160 This way you don't go. This is what you do, 0:14:00.360 --> 0:14:02.080 is what you don't think this is how you study, 0:14:02.160 --> 0:14:04.440 This is how you prepare. I mean, he gave us 0:14:04.840 --> 0:14:07.880 all the tools that was necessary and he mentored us 0:14:07.920 --> 0:14:10.920 along the way. Um, but I'm forever grateful that I 0:14:11.000 --> 0:14:14.040 had a guy like that, and I'm forever grateful, you know, 0:14:14.120 --> 0:14:16.880 for the opportunity to be able to showcase what I 0:14:16.880 --> 0:14:20.360 could do special teams wise, because had he not and 0:14:20.480 --> 0:14:22.560 he not shed a light on those things for us, 0:14:23.240 --> 0:14:25.960 you know, I wouldn't never, you know, been able to 0:14:26.040 --> 0:14:29.600 enjoy a thirteen year career. I had no idea. You 0:14:29.640 --> 0:14:33.120 mentioned Gary Cobb, and he's worked obviously with the Legends 0:14:33.160 --> 0:14:36.080 community what we're doing this podcast. When I was thinking 0:14:36.120 --> 0:14:40.000 about you, I said Seth was a five too. I 0:14:40.040 --> 0:14:41.960 was thinking of a way to put this a five 0:14:42.040 --> 0:14:46.200 tool linebacker. What are the five tools I was I 0:14:46.280 --> 0:14:50.040 was referencing. You can rush the passer, you can play 0:14:50.040 --> 0:14:53.920 the run, You're very good in coverage, you can intercept 0:14:54.000 --> 0:14:57.040 the ball. In the fifth thing, you can play special teams. 0:14:58.200 --> 0:15:01.920 And now you bring that up that Yarry mentor you 0:15:01.960 --> 0:15:06.240 guys telling you guys, bring it to your attention. Special 0:15:06.280 --> 0:15:08.400 teams will be the way that you're able to get 0:15:08.440 --> 0:15:12.520 on board. And once you were on board. As we said, 0:15:12.520 --> 0:15:17.880 the rest is history. Here's another question I would ask you, said, 0:15:18.400 --> 0:15:23.520 what was it like coming from Philadelphia and Buddy bringing 0:15:23.560 --> 0:15:26.960 what I what I called some of his tested troops 0:15:27.920 --> 0:15:31.360 to Arizona? What was that like? And what was it 0:15:31.480 --> 0:15:34.240 like coming into a culture where we hadn't won a lot? 0:15:35.120 --> 0:15:37.520 But you knew what Buddy was capable of? What was 0:15:37.560 --> 0:15:41.080 that like? Well, it wasn't only the fact that you know, 0:15:41.200 --> 0:15:43.960 I knew what you know, what Buddy could do, and 0:15:44.000 --> 0:15:46.640 I knew what he was like. But we played against 0:15:46.680 --> 0:15:50.760 you guys twice a year, every year, every year, um, 0:15:50.840 --> 0:15:53.680 and it was never a situation all the years that 0:15:53.760 --> 0:15:56.080 we you know that playing against you guys all my 0:15:56.160 --> 0:15:58.240 years in the league wasn't a situation. And you guys 0:15:58.360 --> 0:16:01.480 didn't have talent. It was trying to figure out, Okay, 0:16:01.520 --> 0:16:03.800 why is it that they can't that they can't win? 0:16:04.800 --> 0:16:08.560 So the decision to come was twofold that I know 0:16:08.680 --> 0:16:11.720 that they got talent. And second of all, I know 0:16:11.960 --> 0:16:15.680 I've seen Buddy make the trans the trans the transformation, 0:16:15.960 --> 0:16:18.400 and I believe that he could, you know, do something 0:16:18.760 --> 0:16:22.720 special with the talent that that's there. It was just 0:16:23.520 --> 0:16:26.120 you know, it was. It was a good move. It 0:16:26.200 --> 0:16:29.440 was not only a good career move, a good financial move, 0:16:29.480 --> 0:16:33.080 but it was also an opportunity to try to change, 0:16:33.520 --> 0:16:38.240 to do something special. I'll never forget you, Clyde Simmons 0:16:38.280 --> 0:16:44.080 and the late uh roommate of mine, Andre Water, and 0:16:44.240 --> 0:16:47.880 just the personality and what you guys brought the leadership. 0:16:48.520 --> 0:16:52.200 Hopefully I'll hold back tears because said you didn't know. 0:16:52.920 --> 0:16:56.640 But so Buddy has got the job after my uh 0:16:56.680 --> 0:16:59.720 my third year. So going to my fourth year, I 0:16:59.880 --> 0:17:03.080 was a restrictive free agent and my wife was getting 0:17:03.120 --> 0:17:05.879 her NBA at the University of Illinois, and I was 0:17:05.960 --> 0:17:10.000 considering whether I was gonna go back to Arizona. So 0:17:10.040 --> 0:17:11.720 I told my wife, I said, I don't think I'm 0:17:11.720 --> 0:17:14.320 going back the Arizona Once Buddy got the job, I said, 0:17:14.359 --> 0:17:19.160 because I heard Buddy wasn't a player's coach. Well that's 0:17:19.160 --> 0:17:21.960 not true at all. As you know, I thought I 0:17:22.000 --> 0:17:25.320 was gonna get that over on my wife, and but 0:17:25.400 --> 0:17:28.399 it turned out she says, what are you talking about? 0:17:28.800 --> 0:17:31.640 And she you know how wives, I asked questions, probing questions, 0:17:32.560 --> 0:17:35.720 and what it was. I was afraid, I really, I 0:17:35.800 --> 0:17:39.720 really wasn't sure that I could play in the system 0:17:40.040 --> 0:17:43.200 where the cornerback was on the island. So Man, we 0:17:43.440 --> 0:17:45.119 my wife and I prayed and we said, well, are 0:17:45.160 --> 0:17:47.720 we sensed to go back to Arizona. And I'll never 0:17:47.720 --> 0:17:51.280 forget once I signed. This is when I found out 0:17:51.280 --> 0:17:54.119 the power of a coach and a coach's belief in 0:17:54.119 --> 0:17:56.560 a person. As soon as I went back and I 0:17:56.640 --> 0:17:59.320 signed back, the first person I saw was Rob Ryan 0:17:59.480 --> 0:18:04.960 rexas Uh, one of the twins right to Ron. Rob 0:18:05.000 --> 0:18:06.639 put his arms around me Set when I was in 0:18:06.680 --> 0:18:09.240 the weight room, came up to me. He says, in 0:18:09.440 --> 0:18:13.800 this you will make All Pro You'll lead the league 0:18:13.800 --> 0:18:17.520 in interceptions, You'll make the Pro Bowl. This defense is 0:18:17.520 --> 0:18:19.639 perfectly suited for you because I saw you do it 0:18:20.200 --> 0:18:26.720 at Southern University. And I'm telling you Set, like I said, 0:18:26.760 --> 0:18:31.439 I'm holding it in man, because that was a game changer. 0:18:32.720 --> 0:18:36.120 And that's when I learned the power of coaches speaking 0:18:36.119 --> 0:18:40.399 into players and realizing sometimes when players don't know what 0:18:40.480 --> 0:18:44.240 they're capable of doing, for the coast to verbalize it 0:18:45.560 --> 0:18:50.480 and no doubt about it. Man. That training camp, Uh, 0:18:50.560 --> 0:18:55.080 my trainer, as you know, Mac Newton. It was a 0:18:55.160 --> 0:18:57.600 game change changed my life and I was obviously the 0:18:57.600 --> 0:19:00.280 first year I made the Pro Bowl, first year I 0:19:00.359 --> 0:19:02.960 led the leading interceptions, first year I made All Pro. 0:19:04.160 --> 0:19:06.480 But it was because of your leadership. And I'll never forget. 0:19:06.480 --> 0:19:11.120 I want to put on this podcast. You understood, you're 0:19:11.119 --> 0:19:13.919 in cloude. Understood the connection of not just on the field, 0:19:13.960 --> 0:19:16.600 but off the field. Because when you guys came in, 0:19:17.480 --> 0:19:20.120 you brought us together as a defense. We were even 0:19:20.119 --> 0:19:23.000 at your house and I say, this is a joke, 0:19:23.040 --> 0:19:29.840 and I never forget. You forget, man, we're at so 0:19:29.920 --> 0:19:33.280 we're we're at your house. You remember this, and you 0:19:33.359 --> 0:19:39.000 had a big corn bread and and I never forget. 0:19:39.040 --> 0:19:41.879 So everybody, all the defense out and you're then somewhere. 0:19:41.920 --> 0:19:44.480 We're all sitting around and I went in the kitchen, 0:19:44.520 --> 0:19:47.600 and man, I saw that corn bread was fresh. Nobody 0:19:47.680 --> 0:19:50.800 had tested nobody in the kitchen. I look around and 0:19:51.000 --> 0:19:53.520 I love the inside of the corn bread. Right, So 0:19:53.560 --> 0:19:56.159 I go here, I cut the center out, eat it, 0:19:56.800 --> 0:19:59.080 come back and sit down with the rest of the defense. 0:19:59.119 --> 0:20:02.119 Everybody joking. Let's day you. Let's how I know, you 0:20:02.200 --> 0:20:05.280 get know going to kitchen, you come back out the 0:20:05.400 --> 0:20:09.280 kitchen with the pen in your head. We're just asides. 0:20:09.520 --> 0:20:12.679 The corners of the corn bread. Man at the world, 0:20:12.800 --> 0:20:16.919 ask it, who ain't who ain't the center of the 0:20:17.000 --> 0:20:20.160 corn bread? I mean, man, I was so nervous, and 0:20:20.200 --> 0:20:22.840 I'm like, oh, man, I gotta I gotta show my code. 0:20:22.880 --> 0:20:28.080 Man a second, ready kill somebody. Man. But but it really, 0:20:28.119 --> 0:20:32.640 when I think back, those were moments that helped defense 0:20:32.640 --> 0:20:36.080 has become great. It's not just the excellent ols and 0:20:36.160 --> 0:20:40.240 not just the coaching, but it's the camaraderie and players 0:20:40.240 --> 0:20:42.479 getting to know each other on and off the field. 0:20:42.640 --> 0:20:45.720 And I thought you were and Clyde did a tremendous 0:20:45.840 --> 0:20:49.479 job doing that. Why was that important to you? It 0:20:49.560 --> 0:20:52.760 was important because listen, we we learned it in Philadelphia, 0:20:53.000 --> 0:20:56.360 you know. I mean we we have one day week, 0:20:56.720 --> 0:21:00.000 you know where we got together as a defense okay, 0:21:00.080 --> 0:21:03.320 and we got together, we went to dinner. And when 0:21:03.359 --> 0:21:05.480 dinner was over, you know, the guys that were married, 0:21:05.480 --> 0:21:08.159 the guys that you know, they went their way, they 0:21:08.200 --> 0:21:10.080 went home, and the guys that was gonna go out 0:21:10.119 --> 0:21:12.200 and you know, while out, they were gonna go out 0:21:12.200 --> 0:21:14.800 and do their thing. But it was important, and but 0:21:14.960 --> 0:21:19.520 it instilled in us, you know early on. You know, 0:21:19.600 --> 0:21:24.760 it's hard for a team or a unit to be 0:21:24.920 --> 0:21:28.639 successful if you don't know each other, because if you 0:21:28.680 --> 0:21:30.960 don't know each other and you and you don't care 0:21:31.080 --> 0:21:34.120 enough about each other, when you get tired and the 0:21:34.119 --> 0:21:37.359 grind gets gone, you know, then it becomes about you. 0:21:38.280 --> 0:21:41.719 But when you're a unit and you're a brotherhood and 0:21:41.800 --> 0:21:43.920 you look at that guy next to you and you're 0:21:43.960 --> 0:21:47.000 tired and you know he's tired, then it becomes bigger 0:21:47.040 --> 0:21:50.720 than just you. You're not playing just for yourself. You're 0:21:50.800 --> 0:21:52.960 playing for that guy is next to you. And you 0:21:53.000 --> 0:21:54.919 know that when you go in the film study on 0:21:55.000 --> 0:21:58.840 Monday morning that thean this guy don't lie and everything 0:21:58.920 --> 0:22:02.640 is right there for every about to see. And the accountability. 0:22:02.960 --> 0:22:05.520 The coaches are gonna hold you accountable, but you hold 0:22:05.560 --> 0:22:09.600 each other accountable as teammates. So coming there, yeah, we want. 0:22:09.640 --> 0:22:13.119 I wanted to be successful, you know so, and and 0:22:13.480 --> 0:22:15.520 you know, throughout the first couple of weeks, I didn't 0:22:15.560 --> 0:22:20.119 see you know that camaraderie. So I'm like, okay, let's 0:22:20.119 --> 0:22:23.040 do something to try to bring the entire team together. 0:22:23.200 --> 0:22:25.399 So I'm like, okay, let's do a fish fry at 0:22:25.440 --> 0:22:28.040 the house and bring all the guys together and try 0:22:28.080 --> 0:22:31.000 to figure out a way where, you know, because we 0:22:31.000 --> 0:22:34.240 were new to y'all, to y'all's team, and I'm trying 0:22:34.240 --> 0:22:35.680 to get to know a new and I'm trying to 0:22:35.720 --> 0:22:37.440 get to know Eric Hill, and I'm trying to get 0:22:37.480 --> 0:22:39.719 to know Eric Swan. I'm trying to get to know 0:22:39.760 --> 0:22:42.080 all these guys because if I don't get to know 0:22:42.240 --> 0:22:45.040 them and they don't get to know me, then how 0:22:45.040 --> 0:22:48.479 do we create the camaraderie that's necessary in order for 0:22:48.560 --> 0:22:50.800 us to win. When you're trying to build a team 0:22:50.800 --> 0:22:53.200