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Speaker 1: Welcome to playmakers everyone. I am your host, Haley Ellwood.

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Speaker 1: It is Week five and the Los Angeles Chargers will

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Speaker 1: finish up this two game road stretch in Cleveland against

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Speaker 1: the Browns. So joining me to talk about this one

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Speaker 1: is Mary Kay Cabot, Browns beat writer of Cleveland dot

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Speaker 1: Com and the plane Dealer. Mary Okay, Mary Kay, thanks

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Speaker 1: for coming on. Sure, thanks for having me, absolutely all right,

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Speaker 1: So let's get to know this opponent a little bit.

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Speaker 1: The Browns lose to the Falcons last week, are two

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Speaker 1: and two on the season. What is the state of

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Speaker 1: this team right now? Well, things are a little up

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Speaker 1: in the air right now, in part because no one's

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Speaker 1: really sure if Myles Garrett is going to be coming

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Speaker 1: back for this game or not. And the same thing

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Speaker 1: with Jadeveon Clowney, and I thought that was the difference

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Speaker 1: in the game in Atlanta. I really think if they

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Speaker 1: had those two guys that the Falcons would not have

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Speaker 1: been able to run all over the Browns like they

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Speaker 1: did in the second half for one hundred and seventy

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Speaker 1: of their two hundred and two yards. If you have

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Speaker 1: one of the best edge setters in the NFL and

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Speaker 1: Jadavian Clowney out there, and you've got Miles Garrett. I

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Speaker 1: doubt that's happening. I'm also not certain that Marcus Mariota

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Speaker 1: would have been able to complete a forty two yard

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Speaker 1: pass in the fourth quarter had Miles Garrett been there

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Speaker 1: to menace him. It's hard to say, but I do

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Speaker 1: think that those two guys make any enormous difference. There's

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Speaker 1: been so much talk about this team obviously in the

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Speaker 1: off season. I think maybe two and two is probably

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Speaker 1: better than some people might have expected them to be

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Speaker 1: at this point. But given the tenor of the season,

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Speaker 1: I know it's early, but is this game, in your mind,

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Speaker 1: maybe a make or break with some of the opponents

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Speaker 1: that they have coming up down the stretch While the

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Speaker 1: Browns are embarking on a really grueling stretch right now

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Speaker 1: where they have the second toughest schedule in the NFL

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Speaker 1: going forward, it's really hard. They just came off the

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Speaker 1: cushy part of their schedule where they had the fourth

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Speaker 1: easiest schedule in the NFL according to ESPN's Football Power Index,

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Speaker 1: So they really needed to come out of that three

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Speaker 1: and one to try to kind of keep this team

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Speaker 1: in the hunt until Deshaun Watson comes back in week thirteen,

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Speaker 1: So two and two isn't really going to cut it

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Speaker 1: when you're losing to the Jets, when you're losing to

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Speaker 1: the Falcons, so I think everyone's pretty disappointed with that.

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Speaker 1: I don't want to call this a must win game,

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Speaker 1: because I'm a must win game purist. Unless you're about

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Speaker 1: to be eliminated from playoff contention, I usually don't use

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Speaker 1: that phrase, So I'm not going to call it a

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Speaker 1: must win game. But certainly it's a conference game. The

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Speaker 1: Browns don't want to string together two losses, and they

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Speaker 1: certainly want to do everything they can to get back

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Speaker 1: on the winning track. Yeah. I think from the Charger's

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Speaker 1: perspective too, it's the same sort of thing. I'd listen

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Speaker 1: to serious x M NFL radio a lot, and Pat

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Speaker 1: Herwin always calls these games wildcard games because these are

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Speaker 1: the games that, look, they're in your conference. They made

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Speaker 1: me in something at the end when it comes down

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Speaker 1: to seating, right, oh my gosh. Yeah, I mean, and

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Speaker 1: then you know that you've got the whole common opponent

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Speaker 1: thing that goes on, but just the you know the

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Speaker 1: conference is going to be so difficult. This year. I mean,

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Speaker 1: you know, every division is tough. There are so many

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Speaker 1: good quarterbacks throughout the whole entire AFC. You just can't

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Speaker 1: afford to be losing these games for whatever tiebreakers and

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Speaker 1: everything else. So it's definitely a big game for the Browns.

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Speaker 1: They're going to be back in front of the home

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Speaker 1: crowd for the first of two back to back home games,

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Speaker 1: and once again they let one get away there in

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Speaker 1: Atlanta that they really are regretting and they don't want

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Speaker 1: to compound that. So you mentioned QB's great segue, We're

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Speaker 1: going to do this naturally here. You mentioned Deshaun Watson

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Speaker 1: obviously not playing, Jacobe Brissette stepping up in his place,

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Speaker 1: and to me, he's one of those capable backup quarterbacks

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Speaker 1: if you will, just because he's had so much starting

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Speaker 1: experience in the NFL. But what have you seen from

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Speaker 1: him through these first four games. Well, for the most part,

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Speaker 1: he's been what the Browns have needed him to be.

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Speaker 1: He's played with poise, he's played with confidence, he's held

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Speaker 1: it together from an off the field standpoint, he's sort

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Speaker 1: of has been the perfect replacement for Deshaun Watson. But

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Speaker 1: he's had a couple of games that weren't as good

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Speaker 1: as I'm sure he would like them to be. That

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Speaker 1: was the Panthers game. They were lucky to get out

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Speaker 1: of that one with a victory. And then this past

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Speaker 1: week in Atlanta, he just seemed a little bit off

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Speaker 1: to me, and he closed out the game with an

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Speaker 1: interception when they really just needed to get in position

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Speaker 1: for a game tying field goal. So he's had his

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Speaker 1: ups and downs. But when he gets it going, when

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Speaker 1: he's playing well, when he's seeing the field and when

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Speaker 1: he's on target, he can be a winning quarterback. So

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Speaker 1: it just sort of depends on what kind of day

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Speaker 1: he's going to have. What kind of day do you

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Speaker 1: think he'll have this Sunday, You know, if he gets

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Speaker 1: it going with Amari Cooper, which he could not do

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Speaker 1: in at nineteen Amari Cooper only had one catch for

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Speaker 1: nine yards. I mean, you need your best playmakers to

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Speaker 1: be out there making plays. When you're in this situation

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Speaker 1: where you don't have all of your best people and

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Speaker 1: your defensive line is sort of decimated. They needed to

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Speaker 1: have the offense kind of humming along, and it just

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Speaker 1: really wasn't. So I think that's a key for Jacoby

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Speaker 1: to get it rolling early if he can with Amari Cooper. Now,

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Speaker 1: it's easy to focus on Amari Cooper because there are

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Speaker 1: not that many other good receivers on the team in

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Speaker 1: terms of experience, there aren't any other one thousand yard

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Speaker 1: type receivers on this football team. So a lot of

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Speaker 1: times teams will try to take Amar out of the game,

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Speaker 1: and the Falcons basically were able to do that. So

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Speaker 1: last week, the Browns were two of three on fourth down.

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Speaker 1: This aggression is something Kevin Stefanski likes. It's something Brandon

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Speaker 1: Staley likes. We see it obviously with the Chargers a lot.

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Speaker 1: How can an opponent like the Chargers sort of maybe

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Speaker 1: influence and factor into how he plays this game out? Well,

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Speaker 1: you know, I think Kevin Stefanski will do his own thing,

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Speaker 1: and I don't think he's going to let the criticism

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Speaker 1: of what he did in this past game against it

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Speaker 1: Land affect him in any way, shape or for him,

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Speaker 1: just the same way John Harbaugh is not letting criticism

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Speaker 1: of going for it on fourth down and losing that

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Speaker 1: game to the Bills affect him. Kevin has his ways.

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Speaker 1: Brandon Staley did the two right, Yeah, so Kevin has

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Speaker 1: you know, he's got his way, like you know, like

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Speaker 1: you said, you're familiar with it there, and he's not

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Speaker 1: going to change. And I think they're going to continue

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Speaker 1: to go for it on fourth down. They're not going

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Speaker 1: to let public pressure or media pressure influence how they

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Speaker 1: do things, and they'll game plan. I mean, I'm sure

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Speaker 1: that they think this is going to be another game

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Speaker 1: where they have to score a lot of points. So

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Speaker 1: if they have the chance to go for seven instead

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Speaker 1: of three, they're going to do it. This is the

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Speaker 1: new way of football in the NFL. This is really

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Speaker 1: not the nineteen eighties. That's so true. It's this new age.

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Speaker 1: We're seeing it all over the place now. When you

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Speaker 1: mentioned scoring points. To me, it is so funny that

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Speaker 1: this game is in Week five again this year because

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Speaker 1: you go back to Week five of twenty twenty one,

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Speaker 1: which turned into a shootout between the Browns and the Chargers.

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Speaker 1: The Chargers obviously cannot match the Browns ground game, and

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Speaker 1: we'll get to that in a second. But with that

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Speaker 1: being said, how does maybe their air attack match up

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Speaker 1: against the brown secondary. Well, yeah, it's going to be

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Speaker 1: interesting to see the Browns secondary. The defense in general

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Speaker 1: has surrendered some big place this season, especially in the

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Speaker 1: fourth quarter, so they are sort of vulnerable to that,

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Speaker 1: and they've got to get that tightened up this week.

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Speaker 1: In this pass game, they let Marcus Mariota complete a

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Speaker 1: forty two yard pass, then Denzel Ward tack down a

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Speaker 1: fifteen yard face mask penalty on top of that, and

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Speaker 1: you know, they let Baker Mayfield throw a seventy five

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Speaker 1: yard touchdown pass on them, and they let Joe Flacco

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Speaker 1: do the same thing. So they've got to tighten that up.

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Speaker 1: I mean, they've got a string of really good, really

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Speaker 1: good quarterbacks coming up here, obviously, justin Herbert being one

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Speaker 1: of the best, and they've got to be on point.

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Speaker 1: They've got really good safeties and they've got really good

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Speaker 1: cornerbacks in the back end. They mix it up sometimes

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Speaker 1: between zone and man to man, but they have had

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Speaker 1: some mentals. They've had a few mental errors and a

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Speaker 1: couple of blown coverages, and they're not going to get

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Speaker 1: away with that this weekend. I think if Chargers fans

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Speaker 1: are listening to this and hearing you talk about those

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Speaker 1: long passes that have been given up, they're probably licking

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Speaker 1: their chops so excited to see what would happen on

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Speaker 1: Sunday with Herbert because when he goes down there, it

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Speaker 1: usually turns out pretty well for the Bolts. Yeah, and

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Speaker 1: you know what I'll tell you though, I mean, the

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Speaker 1: Browns do have a lot of talent in the back end,

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Speaker 1: so it's not like they're bereft of talent. You've got

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Speaker 1: Denze Award, he's a pro bowler. You've got Grant Delpit,

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Speaker 1: a safety who made some big plays on Kyle Pitts

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Speaker 1: in the last game. You know, these guys can get

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Speaker 1: their hands on some footballs. You've got John Johnson, the

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Speaker 1: three back there at safety. You've got Greg Newsome, Martin

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Speaker 1: Emerson who seems to me like he's shaping up to

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Speaker 1: be a little bit of a ballhawk. He's got really

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Speaker 1: good instincts. So you know, there will be opportunities, I

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Speaker 1: think for those guys to go and try to snag

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Speaker 1: the football and make some breakups. But they have to

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Speaker 1: be communicating, which they haven't always done well this season. Okay,

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Speaker 1: so we mentioned we were going to get into the

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Speaker 1: Brown's ground game, and it is seriously unlike any other

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Speaker 1: in the NFL. Nick Chubbs still getting his yards. What

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Speaker 1: makes this attack so lethal, well, a couple of things.

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Speaker 1: You know, it all starts up front. I mean, the

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Speaker 1: Browns have done a good job of building tough through

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Speaker 1: the lines. They really have. They've got a good offensive line,

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Speaker 1: they've got a good defensive line when three of the

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Speaker 1: starters aren't missing like they were in Atlanta, but their

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Speaker 1: offensive line is excellent. The offensive coordinator Alex Van Pelt

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Speaker 1: called the two guards, Joel Betonio and Wyatt Teller, the

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Speaker 1: two dancing bears, and so you know they're Pro bowlers.

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Speaker 1: They're really good. You've got Jack Conklin at right tackle.

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Speaker 1: He's an All Pro right tackle. Then you've got Jed Wills,

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Speaker 1: a number ten overall pick from a couple of years ago,

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Speaker 1: and he's starting to come into his own. So it's

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Speaker 1: a really good offensive line. It starts there, and then

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Speaker 1: you've got arguably the best pure runner in the NFL

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Speaker 1: in Nick Chuck. Nick is amazing. If he doesn't like

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Speaker 1: what he sees, he'll just try to jump over you

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Speaker 1: or whatever the case may be. He seems to get

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Speaker 1: stronger in the fourth quarter. He is right at the

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Speaker 1: top of the list in terms of fourth quarter running.

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Speaker 1: One of the reasons for that is because Kareem Hunt

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Speaker 1: keeps him fresh. They've got a really good one two

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Speaker 1: punch going. They don't play a ton of them together

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Speaker 1: on the field. I think they could do more of that.

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Speaker 1: So sometimes that shows up in the game plan. Other

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Speaker 1: times it's really not there as much. But Nick is

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Speaker 1: one of the best in the business, and when they

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Speaker 1: use him a lot, then you know it's really effective.

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Speaker 1: He has three one hundred yard games already this season.

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Speaker 1: That's insane. How I mean, just you know what the

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Speaker 1: goal is, right, went into a game against them, you

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Speaker 1: got to stop him. And just why is he so

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Speaker 1: hard to contain? Well, I mean, he's just got a

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Speaker 1: you know, a never say die attitude. He's tough, he's big,

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Speaker 1: he's hard to bring down. He's got great instincts. He

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Speaker 1: can hit the hole very quickly, he can bounce it outside.

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Speaker 1: And again, as I mentioned before, he's got great blocking

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Speaker 1: in front of him, and that you know that means

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Speaker 1: a lot. And then these two guys together, you know,

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Speaker 1: when you've got Kareem Hunt, he can catch the ball

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Speaker 1: really well out of the backfield. So when those guys

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Speaker 1: are on top of their game, they're tough to defend. Absolutely,

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Speaker 1: So getting to a couple of the guys that you

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Speaker 1: mentioned up top, Jadavian Clowney and Miles Garrett Stefanski has

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Speaker 1: said we're taking this on a Tuesday. Stefanski has said

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Speaker 1: he's not really going to give an update on them

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Speaker 1: until Wednesday of this week. What is maybe your assessment

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Speaker 1: or your vibe right now in terms of their availability

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Speaker 1: for Sunday. Gosh, it's so hard to predict, and that

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Speaker 1: is by design because they don't want the chargers to

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Speaker 1: know what they're doing. They don't want anybody to know

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Speaker 1: what they're up to with this. But because Jadavian Clowney

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Speaker 1: has been quote unquote really really close the past week,

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Speaker 1: I think he probably has a pretty good chance. With Miles,

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Speaker 1: that one's a little bit up in the air because

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Speaker 1: it was only eight days ago that he flipped his

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Speaker 1: Porsche three times, and I mean that was a multiple times.

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Speaker 1: I should say that was a harrowing accident that he

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Speaker 1: went through. He suffered a sprain shoulder and a strained

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Speaker 1: right viceps and I think it's just a matter of

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Speaker 1: seeing how he feels. When we talked to him on Friday,

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Speaker 1: he was only you know, four or five days removed

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Speaker 1: from the accident, and he was pretty darn sore at

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Speaker 1: that time. So I think they just have to, as

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Speaker 1: Kevin Stefanski said, they have to get to Wednesday and

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Speaker 1: see how he feels. And I think it's going to

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Speaker 1: be a little bit of a work in progress regardless

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Speaker 1: if one of them plays, if both of them play,

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Speaker 1: if they're not exactly at one hundred percent, how does

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Speaker 1: maybe an eighty percent Jadavian Clowney or seventy five percent

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Speaker 1: Miles Garrett still affect a game, I think in a

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Speaker 1: huge way. I mean, if you guys, if you have

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Speaker 1: those guys out there, even on a limited basis, I

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Speaker 1: think it's absolutely huge. You have to account for them

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Speaker 1: on every play. Quite often you'll see Miles not only

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Speaker 1: double teamed, but sometimes triple teamed. I mean, he has

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Speaker 1: just been so explosive this year. He was off to

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Speaker 1: a tremendous start. He's one of the best in the

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Speaker 1: business obviously, and you know, and Jadevion. I mean, Jadevion

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Speaker 1: does a great job of containing the quarterback, setting the

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Speaker 1: edge and he gets a lot of pressure in his

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Speaker 1: own right. So even if you have them, like you said,

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Speaker 1: for you know, eighty percent of the time, or eighty

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Speaker 1: percent effective when they're out there. I still think that

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Speaker 1: that will be a huge difference in this football game.

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Speaker 1: And then last one, Mary, Kay, what do you think

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Speaker 1: is maybe a deciding factor in terms of how you

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Speaker 1: think this game shakes out. I know we've talked a

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Speaker 1: lot about the availability of those two guys, but maybe

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Speaker 1: something else. Well, you know, this is sort of simplistic,

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Speaker 1: but I I'm gonna go with it. Anyways, when the

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Speaker 1: Browns went into the Falcons game, they thought they could

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Speaker 1: get some takeaways because the Falcons were turning the ball

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Speaker 1: over at that time. They had four fumbles and three interceptions,

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Speaker 1: and they were way way at the top of the league.

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Speaker 1: The Browns have got to continue to protect the ball,

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Speaker 1: which is something that Jacoby usually does pretty well. But

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Speaker 1: in this past game, David and Joku had a fumble

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Speaker 1: and Jacoby Brisset through an interception. They lost the takeaway battle.

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Speaker 1: And if they do that again, they're going to lose

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Speaker 1: the football game. So they have to protect the football

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Speaker 1: at all costs. And I think that, you know, it

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Speaker 1: could come down to that. And then Jacoby has got

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Speaker 1: to play better than he did in the Falcons game.

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Speaker 1: He missed a lot of guys. He was just off

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Speaker 1: the mark and if he can get back to playing

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Speaker 1: good football, then they'll have a chance. Mary Kay, thank

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Speaker 1: you so much for joining us Brown's Expert, Brown's Extraordinaire.

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Speaker 1: We appreciate it. Thank you for sharing your insight on

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Speaker 1: this one. Sure thanks for having me