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Speaker 1: This is the Meat Eater Podcast coming at you shirtless, severely,

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Speaker 1: bug bitten, and in my case, underwear listeningcast. You can't

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Speaker 1: predict anything. The Meat Eater Podcast is brought to you

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Speaker 1: by first Light. Whether you're checking trail cams, hanging deer stands,

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Speaker 1: or scouting for ELP, First Light has performance apparel to

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Speaker 1: support every hunter in every environment. Check it out at

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Speaker 1: first light dot com. F I R S T L

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Speaker 1: I T E dot com. All right, so I'm joined,

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Speaker 1: uh with Brent Reeves, I'm with Tony Peterson, I'm with

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Speaker 1: Mark Kenyon, and we're gonna we're doing a little white

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Speaker 1: tail tutorial here, a white tail bow hunting tutorial, and

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Speaker 1: we're gonna there's a lot of stuff we're gonna skip.

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Speaker 1: I'm just gonna warn everybody up top. We're not talking

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Speaker 1: about scouting. We're not talking about uh cooking, what else?

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Speaker 1: Are we not talking any of that stuff. We're not

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Speaker 1: talking about how to you know, what kind of camper

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Speaker 1: you want? You know, we're not counting about how to

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Speaker 1: get permissions, none of that stuff. I'm not talking about

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Speaker 1: food plots. I could go on all day about what

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Speaker 1: we're not talking about. Long least we're not talking about

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Speaker 1: the problem I'm currently having, which is black bears destroying

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Speaker 1: your cameras. What we're talking about is you're in the

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Speaker 1: you're in the you're in the white tail woods with

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Speaker 1: your bow. We're talking about how to make your arrow

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Speaker 1: go where it wants and what to do after you

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Speaker 1: let the arrow fly. So we're talking about everything that

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Speaker 1: happens between oh my god, here he comes or she

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Speaker 1: oh my god, here it comes to I found it,

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Speaker 1: and everything that fits between those two moments.

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Speaker 2: Okay, sounds good, a man.

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Speaker 1: Love it all right? Saddle up, white tail hunters at

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Speaker 1: that little joke.

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Speaker 3: Yep, we got it.

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Speaker 1: Get your spurs on this. This is a white tail special.

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Speaker 1: We've got a bunch of avid white tail hunters in

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Speaker 1: the room. And when you say white tail hunters that

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Speaker 1: I feel like it almost kind of means like you're

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Speaker 1: bow hunting white tails, right, That's the first impression I Geah,

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Speaker 1: if I say he's a big time whitetail hunter, you know,

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Speaker 1: I picture a bow hunter, right, because because that you

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Speaker 1: can hunt for such a long period of time.

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Speaker 2: Is there anyone you know of who would consider themselves

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Speaker 2: a diehard white tail hunter? But just do it with

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Speaker 2: a firearm.

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Speaker 1: I couldn't think of one. No, I think of Doug

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Speaker 1: duran as a Doug Durren is a very enthusiastic, dedicated

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Speaker 1: hunter of white tails.

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Speaker 2: Who's antagonistic to bow hunters.

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Speaker 1: Well he does, it's not these antagonistic buners. He's had

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Speaker 1: a lot of late nights, yeah, looking for he's had

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Speaker 1: a lot of late nights looking for people's deer. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: did they hit with a bow? And I don't think

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Speaker 1: he's had that many late nights looking for the ones

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Speaker 1: that he shot with his gun?

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Speaker 4: Coming through our family deer camp is ninety five percent

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Speaker 4: gun hunters like me and a nephew. There only two

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Speaker 4: out of However, that math figures out that the bow

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Speaker 4: hunt okay.

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Speaker 2: But I do feel like that, like that was my

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Speaker 2: family too, And I guess they would identify as like,

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Speaker 2: I love deer hunting. But the number of days they

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Speaker 2: actually did it, you know, it was four days a years.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, week.

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Speaker 2: So they're enthusiasts, but I don't know if they were practitioners.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, I think we still have the goalpost for what

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Speaker 3: an avid Yeah, we sort think an avid whitetail hunter.

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Speaker 1: Sure, this this this episode is meant to be full

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Speaker 1: of very practical information. But we're going to indulge this

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Speaker 1: for one more second, and I'll point out when I

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Speaker 1: was a boy, if you didn't hunt with a bow,

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Speaker 1: if you were a big time whitetail hunter, you had

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Speaker 1: ten days. So that'd be like saying, that'd be like

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Speaker 1: if you went on an annual vacation to Florida for

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Speaker 1: spring break week, you wouldn't say you're a big time

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Speaker 1: Floridian right, yeah, yeah, be like, dude, you go there

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Speaker 1: once a week. You go there for a week every year, right,

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Speaker 1: So if you didn't bow hunt, you couldn't be a

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Speaker 1: big time whitetail person because they'd be like, Okay, you

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Speaker 1: had a ten day season.

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Speaker 3: But I mean if you compared that to whitetail hunting,

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Speaker 3: that would be like if you put a sandbox in

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Speaker 3: your backyard and all summer long you pretended like you

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Speaker 3: were at the beach building sand castles, you know, and

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Speaker 3: like working on your beach umbrella.

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Speaker 1: No, that's true. You could be a big time Florida guy.

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Speaker 4: You could be a off season, off season.

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Speaker 3: Florida That's what I'm saying. That the reason I don't

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Speaker 3: think that the criteria for being an avid whitetail hunter

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Speaker 3: is the amount days in the field necessarily good.

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Speaker 1: Point Yep, it's where your head's at.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, you did speak about this whole sand castle thing

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Speaker 2: in the backyard.

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Speaker 3: With a lot of experience, Tony, I could see myself

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Speaker 3: just getting cold up. I'm maybe a couple of bad

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Speaker 3: decisions away from being a beach bum like saltwater fishing,

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Speaker 3: and I could see it.

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Speaker 2: All right, stay focused, white tails.

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Speaker 1: I have a piece of insulation lodged in my back

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Speaker 1: of my throat, so you have to pardon me for

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Speaker 1: my a lot.

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Speaker 3: Can we get more contact to that.

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Speaker 4: I went open my.

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Speaker 1: Head at crawlspace late last night trying to identify a

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Speaker 1: source of a leak, oh, and caused me to get

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Speaker 1: insulation lodged in my throat. Let me ask you this.

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Speaker 1: Let me ask you guys this. I'll go out on

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Speaker 1: a limb and say, most people wind up that they

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Speaker 1: don't shoot their bow as much as they thought they

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Speaker 1: were gonna before season starts.

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Speaker 3: For me, yeah, you know, almost everybody.

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Speaker 1: Snow melts, and I'm like, man, I'm gonna shoot this

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Speaker 1: bow every day, you know, and like and then August,

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Speaker 1: I'm like man, I really ought to be shooting.

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Speaker 3: That bow and the US.

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Speaker 1: It's not easy to how do you know an you're ready?

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Speaker 1: What's ready? I mean, how many people do you know?

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Speaker 1: This is a complicated question because do you have you

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Speaker 1: ever known anyone in the end said I better not hunt,

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Speaker 1: I'm not ready.

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Speaker 2: Oh we were just talking about this yesterday, and Tony,

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Speaker 2: we're just saying how we never feel like we are ready.

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Speaker 2: There's always more we could have should have done. But

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Speaker 2: you need to put yourself in as best a position

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Speaker 2: as possible so that even though you feel like you're

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Speaker 2: not ready, you are, you know, ten times more ready

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Speaker 2: than you were last year, at least, or more than

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Speaker 2: the average. And I think that might be a function

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Speaker 2: of us being we have very high standards for what

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Speaker 2: ready should look like, and the reason we're able to

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Speaker 2: do half decent.

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Speaker 1: Is because of that.

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Speaker 2: I think there's always more you could do, right.

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Speaker 4: That's what I was going to say. How much is

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Speaker 4: that is due to anxiety and fat in a hunt

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Speaker 4: getting ready for it? And is the time approaches you

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Speaker 4: just get more angst about getting out there and and

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Speaker 4: maybe checking the spot that you didn't get to check

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Speaker 4: too And oh, man, that's eating me alive because I

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Speaker 4: didn't get to go check that once.

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Speaker 1: Oh No, when I talk about ready, I'm trying right now.

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Speaker 1: Just talk specifically about how do you know when you're

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Speaker 1: ready as a marksman, just the marksman with a bow,

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Speaker 1: as an archer, arch archman. Yeah, there's no there's no word.

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Speaker 3: I can tell you my before the season, I will shoot.

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Speaker 3: I know, I have to shoot enough to where I

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Speaker 3: can walk back to forty or fifty yards and every

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Speaker 3: shot I take is gonna hit the vitals on a

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Speaker 3: three D deer target in my backyard. And then I

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Speaker 3: always when I hit that level where I can different distances,

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Speaker 3: you know, maybe shoot like I don't. I don't shoot

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Speaker 3: a lot, like twelve arrows a day, but where every

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Speaker 3: one of them I'm like, very confident that's going right

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Speaker 3: where I need it. And then I start shooting broadheads,

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Speaker 3: and if they're doing that, then I start to feel

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Speaker 3: like that.

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Speaker 1: Okay, okay, so mixed distances out to fifty yards every

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Speaker 1: arrow in the vitals on a three D target.

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Speaker 4: Yeah.

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Speaker 3: Like, I don't want to make this sound like I'm

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Speaker 3: super methodical, because I'm not. But I do a lot

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Speaker 3: of early summer not a lot. My early and midsummer

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Speaker 3: shooting is always like twenty yards. Just get back into

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Speaker 3: the groove, muscle memory kind of thing, get the bow

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Speaker 3: settled in, and then as I start to hit August,

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Speaker 3: I'll start to back out a little bit and just

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Speaker 3: start working in twenty five, thirty, thirty five, forty whatever,

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Speaker 3: and then walk back range twenty seven yard shoot And

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Speaker 3: I don't I don't do volume shooting, Like I go

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Speaker 3: out and I'm like, you know, let's say I'm shooting

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Speaker 3: four arrows, I'll just do three rounds, but I want

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Speaker 3: to get to the point where I never miss, Like

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Speaker 3: I'm never like, oh that one went in the shoulder,

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Speaker 3: that one went in the guts. And when you start

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Speaker 3: to get to that point out to like forty or

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Speaker 3: I can shoot to fifty in my yard, then it's

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Speaker 3: like okay, now now it's broadhead time. And if the

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Speaker 3: broadheads follow suit and I'm matching up arrows and everything's

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Speaker 3: going good, then I'm like, I feel really good because

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Speaker 3: I'm not going to shoot a white till fifty yards,

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Speaker 3: you know, Like I know when I'm at that point,

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Speaker 3: when I'm on my standing their twenty yards away, then

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Speaker 3: feeling pretty good.

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Speaker 2: So when I get to the point where I can,

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Speaker 2: I have that feeling, and then what I'll do is

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Speaker 2: start practicing specific situations like I'm beyond I have that

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Speaker 2: that threshold of confidence, and now I'm gonna actually get

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Speaker 2: the saddle out and start shooting in the saddle at

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Speaker 2: different distances, or I'll try kneeling and shoot, or I'll

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Speaker 2: get to all sorts of wonky angles and start guessing distances.

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Speaker 2: And when you're doing that and you're starting to have

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Speaker 2: confidence with that, then I'm like, Okay, I can handle

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Speaker 2: whatever might whatever the real world might throw at me.

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Speaker 1: I was gonna ask you guys about that, how much

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Speaker 1: time do you do you? Tony? Ever move up and

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Speaker 1: start shooting from an elevated position.

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Speaker 3: So I do. I can shoot from my deck, and

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Speaker 3: so it's pretty easy if I want to. I don't.

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Speaker 3: I've spent so much time bow hunting out of tree stands.

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Speaker 3: Like I know, I think I probably know where you're

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Speaker 3: going with this. No, I don't think about that, Like

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Speaker 3: I have a kind of just like I know where

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Speaker 3: I'm aiming on white tails, and I know what I'm

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Speaker 3: gonna do. Uh, It's pretty second nature to me. So

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Speaker 3: I don't really need to reinforce that with tons of

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Speaker 3: elevated shooting or sitting on you know, on my knees

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Speaker 3: or whatever. It's different. I actually go through a way

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Speaker 3: different process when I'm coming out west because that's just

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Speaker 3: a different deal. But it's I think for a lot

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Speaker 3: of newer hunters, that's like a crazy important element to

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Speaker 3: build in, like figure out how to shoot somehow set

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Speaker 3: up a stand, figure out how to shoot off a deck,

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Speaker 3: an elevated platform something, because it's just coming like you're

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Speaker 3: going to take that shot.

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Speaker 2: But I think just as important as the elevation thing,

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Speaker 2: and sometimes maybe more important, it's it's the the positions

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Speaker 2: you're shooting from that are different. Like how many times

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Speaker 2: the deer hunter have you stood perfectly upright and shot.

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Speaker 2: Usually you're sitting down, or you're leaning in a saddle,

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Speaker 2: or you're swung around and shooting behind you, and we

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Speaker 2: never most folks never practice that. And so doing that

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Speaker 2: so even though I don't have a tree, actually I

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Speaker 2: can actually get up into. I just have like a

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Speaker 2: support pole in the back of my barn that I

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Speaker 2: saddle into, so I'm not significantly higher on a little

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Speaker 2: bit of a hill, but The biggest thing I try

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Speaker 2: to do is practice shooting standing, leaning, turning, angled, high low,

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Speaker 2: just because that's so different. You have a different structure,

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Speaker 2: you have a different platform for your feet, you have

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Speaker 2: totally different muscles that are being activated in those different positions,

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Speaker 2: and that you know, you know, what's the first time

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Speaker 2: you do that to be with the deer.

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Speaker 4: And that was a big learning curve for me when

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Speaker 4: I both hunted forever and then my son got into

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Speaker 4: it in his early teens. He wanted to start hunting,

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Speaker 4: so we obviously were shooting in the backyard. So I

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Speaker 4: hung a stand up and showed in the difference between

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Speaker 4: shooting at a thirty yard target level and then thirty

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Speaker 4: yard an elev from elevated position, and the amount of

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Speaker 4: the technique of bending at the keeping the tea and

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Speaker 4: bending at the waist and all that was really reinforced

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Speaker 4: in me. It helped me a lot. When I was

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Speaker 4: supposedly teaching him what to do, he was really teaching

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Speaker 4: me seeing it, putting that practical application. It was so

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Speaker 4: I've I still got that that elevated stand back there,

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Speaker 4: and I still shoot. I know it.

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Speaker 1: Do you guys ever, do dress rehearsals.

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Speaker 4: So I'll shoot out of your hunting.

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Speaker 1: Suit, because man, I tell you, you shoot all summer and

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Speaker 1: your T shirt yep. And then all of a sudden

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Speaker 1: you got your freezing your ass. You now you got

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Speaker 1: a net gat around which you've never found. You've never

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Speaker 1: found your draw point. You know, you never found your

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Speaker 1: hand position with a net gate around. There's a big

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Speaker 1: old hood on that. All of a sudden you pull

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Speaker 1: back and you're like, what the hell is that? You

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Speaker 1: got binos? Maybe gloves? Yeah, you never thought about the

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Speaker 1: fact that now you got a gloved hand or not

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Speaker 1: a gloved hand. You realize the string is actually sort

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Speaker 1: of like pressed into and folded into a heavy jacket,

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Speaker 1: which surprises you.

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Speaker 3: I mean, I I just shot some photos for a

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Speaker 3: piece I did for for us shooting shooting like that,

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Speaker 3: and I had to set up and shoot out of

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Speaker 3: a saddle, and I you know, I'm still wearing shorts

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Speaker 3: and a T shirt, but I've got my bino harness on.

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Speaker 3: And no I didn't. I didn't do that because it

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Speaker 3: was so hot. But I was out of a saddle

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Speaker 3: like two feet off the ground.

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Speaker 4: Huh.

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Speaker 3: And even then, you know, so when when you're asking about,

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Speaker 3: you know, shooting at an angle or whatever. People will

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Speaker 3: hear that and go, I have to shoot at an

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Speaker 3: angle just to understand my like where I'm holding, point impact,

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Speaker 3: aero trajectory, all that stuff. But also it puts you

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Speaker 3: in a position to be like get used to the

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Speaker 3: safety harness, get used to the movement like Mark kind

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Speaker 3: of alluded to on a little platform, you know, because

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Speaker 3: a lot of people don't spend very much time in

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Speaker 3: a tree stand, you know, you think about it. You know,

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Speaker 3: even the avid hunters they spend a fair amount of time,

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Speaker 3: but your average hunter is not going to be in

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Speaker 3: a tree stand for that many hours in any given season.

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Speaker 3: And now you have to do this thing that takes

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Speaker 3: a lot of a lot of concentration, a lot of

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Speaker 3: form in a little tiny environment that you're just not

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Speaker 3: that used to. And so you're also you're not just

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Speaker 3: conditioning yourself for how to shoot, you know, like how

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Speaker 3: to hit something, but you're conditioning yourself like how to

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Speaker 3: work around these like parameters that you're gonna you're gonna

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Speaker 3: be in.

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Speaker 2: Maybe the most important dress rehearsal I go through, though,

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Speaker 2: is not at home before the hunt. It's actually when

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Speaker 2: I'm in the tree at the beginning of the hunt.

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Speaker 2: So every time I get up into the tree or

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Speaker 2: get into my blind or get into my position, I

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Speaker 2: get you unpacked settled. The very first thing I do

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Speaker 2: then at that point is I envision the scenarios that

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Speaker 2: might happen. I envisioned, Okay, deer I think could come

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Speaker 2: through here and I could have a shot there, and

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Speaker 2: a deer might come through and it might have a

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Speaker 2: shot there. And then I like role play that scenario.

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Speaker 2: So imagine, Okay, if a deer comes through here, like

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Speaker 2: I hope he does, how do I have to get

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Speaker 2: my bow? How will I move? What do I need

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Speaker 2: to And I'll literally do it. I'll practice doing the thing.

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Speaker 2: I'll practice drawing back as if I'm going to shoot

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Speaker 2: right there, and then I test. I'm testing to see,

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Speaker 2: like does my elbow hit a limb here? Am I

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Speaker 2: going to hit against my tree here?

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Speaker 4: Like?

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Speaker 2: Can I do that? Can I make that movement quietly, smoothly?

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Speaker 2: And I'll do that for every possible scenario, so that

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Speaker 2: I've I've done it all. I'm not surprised in any

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Speaker 2: kind of way from that perspective at least, And that's

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Speaker 2: That's been a very important thing for me.

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Speaker 3: Mark, when you're doing that heavier accidentally just hit the relief.

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Speaker 2: Not yet, but knock on wood.

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Speaker 1: The part of my dad's routine is he would, you know,

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Speaker 1: climb up, pull his gear up, get situated, pick a leaf,

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Speaker 1: shoot the leaf, and then start hunting.

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Speaker 4: Yeah.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, every time.

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Speaker 4: I don't know a lot of folks unless there was

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Speaker 4: a squirrel.

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Speaker 3: The squirrel. Yeah, well, I mean when we were growing up,

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Speaker 3: we had an era with a judo point in the

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Speaker 3: quiver every everywhere you went, and you might shoot at

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Speaker 3: a squirrel. Like when I was younger, I shot at

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Speaker 3: squirrels out of my sho you're staying a lot like

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Speaker 3: my dad. I drove my dad nuts. He would spend

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Speaker 3: all that time sharpening a broadhead, you know, like strapping

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Speaker 3: that bear razor head, and then I'd shooted at a

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Speaker 3: squirrel into the dirt and he'd have to start over. Ah.

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Speaker 3: But yeah, I mean that was that used to be

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Speaker 3: really common now. I mean, can you imagine if you

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Speaker 3: gave people that advice now, just leave that arrow with

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Speaker 3: all your scent on it.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, there's there's a I think there's a difference in

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Speaker 1: approaches and Mark had brought this up. That Mark, you

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Speaker 1: spent a lot of time when you're bow hunting for

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Speaker 1: white tails. You spend a lot of time where you'll

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Speaker 1: have a particular deer in mind. Yeah, you'll know how

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Speaker 1: the deer moves. You know, you'll kind of have a plan.

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Speaker 1: You'll you'll have a couple of spots picked out where

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Speaker 1: you might get an opportunity on the deer. And then

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Speaker 1: with you Tony last fall, you don't know who's around

347
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Speaker 1: and you're kind of hunting on the fly in the

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Speaker 1: situation where you're in like on the fly on public

349
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Speaker 1: land place, going to some places you hadn't had experience

350
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Speaker 1: with before, and that approach necessitates unusual circumstances that can

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Speaker 1: happen in the tree, Like like you're saying, you get

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Speaker 1: up in the tree and you go like, okay, I

353
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Speaker 1: got this shot in that shot, in this shot. But

354
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Speaker 1: you can also probably plant it out a little bit

355
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Speaker 1: throughout the year sure where you'd want to set up

356
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Speaker 1: what it might look like as opposed to every night,

357
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Speaker 1: perhaps every night being in a new situation where you're

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Speaker 1: not able to put a lot of thought into it,

359
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Speaker 1: and you get up there and you might realize well

360
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Speaker 1: here I am. I'm not going to move again. But man, yep,

361
00:17:41,160 --> 00:17:45,440
Speaker 1: that tree is not where that particular tree over there

362
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Speaker 1: is blocking my best shooting lane.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, you know, but.

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Speaker 3: That's that's why I love that. Okay. So when you

365
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Speaker 3: think about the hunt we did that first night that

366
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Speaker 3: Chris gil and I went out, I had a pond

367
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Speaker 3: that I had scouted out and there wasn't a tree

368
00:17:59,119 --> 00:18:01,840
Speaker 3: there that was more than like six inches in diameter.

369
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Speaker 3: So we were up there and it was super windy

370
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Speaker 3: that night, and then I think, what was it three

371
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Speaker 3: days later or two days later when we figured out

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Speaker 3: that little deal where you hit that spike And then

373
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Speaker 3: now you're sitting on the ground on an edge of

374
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Speaker 3: a you know, twenty foot drop down to a dry

375
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Speaker 3: river bed in a totally different kind of setup. And

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Speaker 3: that's that's that hunting makes you just like I have

377
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Speaker 3: to figure out what works here now because this is

378
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Speaker 3: the spot they're at. So I can't I can't like

379
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Speaker 3: choose that awesome, perfect tree with all these branches for

380
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Speaker 3: cover and then sort of curate a white tail spot

381
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Speaker 3: around it, which is like a pretty common thing. Now,

382
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Speaker 3: Like you go in there and you're like you're just

383
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Speaker 3: working with what it gives you.

384
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Speaker 4: I love that we had that same kind of thing

385
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Speaker 4: happened to Clay and I in Mississippi last year. We

386
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Speaker 4: got into we took we took the boat down there

387
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Speaker 4: was it was deer hunting down there. We went to

388
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Speaker 4: a spot that had only a few cameras on it,

389
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Speaker 4: but there's a lot of deer on it, but it

390
00:18:58,320 --> 00:19:03,440
Speaker 4: had been hunted z. So we went from day one

391
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Speaker 4: trying to figure out where we needed to go, and

392
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Speaker 4: we just kind of eased into each place. You know,

393
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Speaker 4: there was a lot of sign here in this in

394
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Speaker 4: this area right here, so we just stayed back a

395
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Speaker 4: little bit and on the third day we finally kept

396
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Speaker 4: moving up and moving up and moving.

397
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Speaker 1: Up, hanging stands all the time.

398
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Speaker 4: Yeah, rehanging hunting out of Sadad is going from tree

399
00:19:23,119 --> 00:19:25,600
Speaker 4: to tree to tree. And finally on the third day

400
00:19:25,880 --> 00:19:28,000
Speaker 4: we finally did it. You know, I killed that deer

401
00:19:28,320 --> 00:19:31,680
Speaker 4: like you U with a rifle, but.

402
00:19:31,680 --> 00:19:35,600
Speaker 1: You were you essentially stalked, you slowly stalked the spot.

403
00:19:35,400 --> 00:19:38,639
Speaker 4: You wanted to be in, yep, exactly. And it would

404
00:19:39,760 --> 00:19:43,040
Speaker 4: weather conditions prevented us from from continued to hunt with

405
00:19:43,080 --> 00:19:46,320
Speaker 4: a bow because it was twenty five miles an hour

406
00:19:46,359 --> 00:19:49,399
Speaker 4: of sustained winds gusting up to forty that day, and

407
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Speaker 4: it was just miserable and there was just no way

408
00:19:53,000 --> 00:19:56,320
Speaker 4: I could shoot a bow further than I don't know

409
00:19:56,359 --> 00:19:58,520
Speaker 4: that I would have trust myself to shoot further than

410
00:19:58,560 --> 00:20:01,159
Speaker 4: fifteen or twenty yards with the high wind. With the

411
00:20:01,240 --> 00:20:03,720
Speaker 4: high wind like that, Yeah, so we I switched to

412
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Speaker 4: a rifle and luckily we got it done there. So,

413
00:20:06,960 --> 00:20:09,760
Speaker 4: but we just incrementally worked our way closer and closer,

414
00:20:09,880 --> 00:20:12,200
Speaker 4: not because we had we had four days to do it,

415
00:20:12,920 --> 00:20:15,040
Speaker 4: and we started on the third day. We finally got

416
00:20:15,040 --> 00:20:17,359
Speaker 4: close enough to make it happen and where you wanted

417
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Speaker 4: to be.

418
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Speaker 1: What do you guys think is the number one reason

419
00:20:21,640 --> 00:20:23,840
Speaker 1: people miss deer don't hit them?

420
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Speaker 4: Right?

421
00:20:25,119 --> 00:20:29,400
Speaker 1: Missimer wound him. Let's talk physical first and then we'll

422
00:20:29,440 --> 00:20:29,920
Speaker 1: talk mental.

423
00:20:31,040 --> 00:20:34,399
Speaker 3: It's all mental. Yeah, there's no we can skip the

424
00:20:34,440 --> 00:20:35,200
Speaker 3: first part, buddy.

425
00:20:35,280 --> 00:20:41,000
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's a mental it's always mental and lack of

426
00:20:41,040 --> 00:20:43,560
Speaker 1: experience going through that mental turbulence.

427
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Speaker 2: Like so many hunters especially now get into hunting and

428
00:20:50,320 --> 00:20:53,040
Speaker 2: they see folks like the three the four of us

429
00:20:53,440 --> 00:20:56,040
Speaker 2: out there shooting deer or passing on younger bucks, and

430
00:20:56,080 --> 00:20:57,440
Speaker 2: we shoot big deer, and then they come in and

431
00:20:57,480 --> 00:20:59,639
Speaker 2: they're they're seventeen years old, and they think that they

432
00:20:59,680 --> 00:21:01,960
Speaker 2: should hold out for a big buck for their first

433
00:21:02,000 --> 00:21:04,119
Speaker 2: year or something like that, and so they never go

434
00:21:04,240 --> 00:21:06,440
Speaker 2: through what many of us did, where for years and

435
00:21:06,520 --> 00:21:08,800
Speaker 2: years and years we shot the first year we saw

436
00:21:09,119 --> 00:21:13,880
Speaker 2: and we got experience going through that incredibly wild ten

437
00:21:13,960 --> 00:21:17,240
Speaker 2: seconds right, And even after all of the experience that

438
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Speaker 2: I like, at least the two of us have talked

439
00:21:18,680 --> 00:21:20,840
Speaker 2: about this a lot, We've had a lot of experience

440
00:21:20,880 --> 00:21:24,040
Speaker 2: going through that, and we still screw it up mentally

441
00:21:24,080 --> 00:21:26,399
Speaker 2: sometimes in those moments. So how can someone who's done

442
00:21:26,440 --> 00:21:28,920
Speaker 2: it four times expect to get it just right?

443
00:21:29,520 --> 00:21:30,320
Speaker 4: And so just.

444
00:21:30,320 --> 00:21:32,960
Speaker 2: Going through that many, many, many times to try to

445
00:21:33,040 --> 00:21:36,760
Speaker 2: learn how to control yourself mentally in that moment is

446
00:21:36,800 --> 00:21:38,760
Speaker 2: the biggest thing that a lot of people just never

447
00:21:39,040 --> 00:21:39,560
Speaker 2: go through.

448
00:21:40,480 --> 00:21:43,160
Speaker 3: So I think the easiest way to frame this up

449
00:21:43,800 --> 00:21:47,120
Speaker 3: is like imagine you're just imagine you've shot enough right,

450
00:21:47,400 --> 00:21:50,440
Speaker 3: and you put out a full sized deer target at

451
00:21:50,440 --> 00:21:53,520
Speaker 3: twenty yards, climb into a tree whatever, shoot from the ground.

452
00:21:53,720 --> 00:21:55,119
Speaker 3: How many times do you think you'd have to shoot

453
00:21:55,119 --> 00:21:59,040
Speaker 3: at that before you missed it completely? Target practically. I mean,

454
00:21:59,320 --> 00:22:04,800
Speaker 3: you might go thousands and thousands of shots. Now that

455
00:22:05,200 --> 00:22:09,680
Speaker 3: thing has a heartbeat and it walks in and it's

456
00:22:09,760 --> 00:22:13,200
Speaker 3: not a physical thing. I mean everybody said, oh, I

457
00:22:13,240 --> 00:22:16,560
Speaker 3: misjudged the range, or I hit an unseen limb, or

458
00:22:16,560 --> 00:22:19,000
Speaker 3: he ducked the string or like the you know, the

459
00:22:19,040 --> 00:22:22,919
Speaker 3: greatest hits, right, but it's always between your ears and

460
00:22:22,960 --> 00:22:28,040
Speaker 3: you just didn't do the basic stuff to execute your shot.

461
00:22:28,240 --> 00:22:30,320
Speaker 3: You know, we run and it's all panic, right like

462
00:22:30,400 --> 00:22:33,920
Speaker 3: people I used to do. I suffered from buck fever

463
00:22:34,160 --> 00:22:36,560
Speaker 3: so bad for so long. I mean it forced me

464
00:22:36,600 --> 00:22:38,720
Speaker 3: to totally reinvent how I shot and everything because I

465
00:22:38,800 --> 00:22:41,159
Speaker 3: was like I have to quit or I have to

466
00:22:41,200 --> 00:22:45,760
Speaker 3: do something different because it was like ugly and so

467
00:22:46,280 --> 00:22:48,600
Speaker 3: once I kind of got my stuff figured out, and

468
00:22:48,640 --> 00:22:51,679
Speaker 3: I like how Mark talks about it, like training yourself,

469
00:22:52,480 --> 00:22:54,840
Speaker 3: you know, to go through your internal you know, here's

470
00:22:54,880 --> 00:22:59,760
Speaker 3: my checklist, bubble level whatever. I had to dumb down

471
00:22:59,760 --> 00:23:02,359
Speaker 3: my whole setup and work with how I just naturally shoot.

472
00:23:02,359 --> 00:23:04,919
Speaker 3: I naturally shoot really fast. I shot a lot of

473
00:23:04,960 --> 00:23:07,919
Speaker 3: traditional archy growing up, and I don't know if that's why,

474
00:23:07,960 --> 00:23:10,840
Speaker 3: but I'm like, I don't take a long time to

475
00:23:10,880 --> 00:23:13,040
Speaker 3: aim like, it's just I can't do it. It's the

476
00:23:13,040 --> 00:23:14,840
Speaker 3: same thing like people will ask me about wing shooting

477
00:23:14,880 --> 00:23:16,440
Speaker 3: like pheasants. I'm like, I can't give you any tips

478
00:23:16,480 --> 00:23:17,879
Speaker 3: because I can never remember what happens.

479
00:23:17,960 --> 00:23:20,160
Speaker 1: Count it down for me. So you hit full draw

480
00:23:20,160 --> 00:23:21,920
Speaker 1: on your hit in your punch and the trigger at

481
00:23:21,920 --> 00:23:22,680
Speaker 1: what full draw?

482
00:23:22,840 --> 00:23:23,480
Speaker 4: One too?

483
00:23:24,720 --> 00:23:30,320
Speaker 3: For sure? Very often really yeah, in like a two count. Yeah, yeah,

484
00:23:30,480 --> 00:23:32,680
Speaker 3: I mean it's quick, you know. I've even had camera

485
00:23:32,720 --> 00:23:36,280
Speaker 3: men say that, like Holy god, you know. But so

486
00:23:36,600 --> 00:23:39,040
Speaker 3: I had to dumb down my setup for that. But

487
00:23:39,320 --> 00:23:41,280
Speaker 3: I would do when I when I started to kind

488
00:23:41,280 --> 00:23:43,000
Speaker 3: of get my shit together a little bit, I started

489
00:23:43,000 --> 00:23:45,520
Speaker 3: doing seminars on how to beat buck fever because I

490
00:23:45,600 --> 00:23:48,919
Speaker 3: kept reading about like traditional advice and I was like,

491
00:23:48,960 --> 00:23:52,800
Speaker 3: my path was just vastly different. And you know, you'd

492
00:23:52,840 --> 00:23:55,119
Speaker 3: have a lot of people show up sometimes as I

493
00:23:55,119 --> 00:23:58,120
Speaker 3: would Dear Classic or wherever, and then I would say,

494
00:23:58,280 --> 00:23:59,679
Speaker 3: right at the beginning of the seminar, I'd say, hey,

495
00:23:59,760 --> 00:24:02,000
Speaker 3: how many of you guys and gals get buck fever?

496
00:24:02,280 --> 00:24:05,280
Speaker 3: And there'd be like three hands raised, and I'd be like, well,

497
00:24:05,359 --> 00:24:07,320
Speaker 3: why are the rest of you here? And you just

498
00:24:07,359 --> 00:24:09,879
Speaker 3: want to hear me talk, you know, So it's not

499
00:24:10,040 --> 00:24:14,600
Speaker 3: something it's just not something that people really want to

500
00:24:14,600 --> 00:24:18,320
Speaker 3: talk about. And I don't think they understand the depths

501
00:24:18,359 --> 00:24:20,880
Speaker 3: it goes, you know. And when you're talking a game

502
00:24:20,960 --> 00:24:24,840
Speaker 3: of variables like bow hunting, you just don't have to

503
00:24:24,880 --> 00:24:28,640
Speaker 3: be off by very much, like one little part falls

504
00:24:28,960 --> 00:24:31,680
Speaker 3: like that cascading failure thing, and now you're going to

505
00:24:31,720 --> 00:24:34,160
Speaker 3: miss that deer at twenty yards that you would never

506
00:24:34,280 --> 00:24:37,199
Speaker 3: miss in a thousand shots target shooting.

507
00:24:38,080 --> 00:24:40,600
Speaker 2: Now, I think there might be two different parts of

508
00:24:40,640 --> 00:24:43,320
Speaker 2: this equation, or two different versions of this. There's something

509
00:24:43,359 --> 00:24:45,040
Speaker 2: that I would think of as buck fever, and then

510
00:24:45,040 --> 00:24:47,040
Speaker 2: there's something that I would think of as like target panic,

511
00:24:47,240 --> 00:24:49,840
Speaker 2: and I think they're different. Oh okay, yeah, so so

512
00:24:49,920 --> 00:24:53,840
Speaker 2: I would I would define buck fever as breaking down,

513
00:24:54,320 --> 00:24:59,680
Speaker 2: as the animals approaching, like you are physically breaking down, shaking, nervous.

514
00:25:00,119 --> 00:25:01,800
Speaker 1: So I did I have target panic then?

515
00:25:01,840 --> 00:25:04,320
Speaker 2: So I used to have buck fever. I don't have

516
00:25:04,400 --> 00:25:08,040
Speaker 2: that anymore. Like when I see like I'm like in business,

517
00:25:08,080 --> 00:25:10,280
Speaker 2: it's like business time, like you just know what you're doing,

518
00:25:10,280 --> 00:25:10,920
Speaker 2: You're doing the thing.

519
00:25:10,920 --> 00:25:11,359
Speaker 3: It's fine.

520
00:25:11,480 --> 00:25:13,640
Speaker 1: But oh yeah, yeah, oh my god, oh my god.

521
00:25:13,720 --> 00:25:15,160
Speaker 2: Yeah that's here he goes.

522
00:25:15,359 --> 00:25:19,040
Speaker 3: That's me. That's me on the inside.

523
00:25:19,400 --> 00:25:28,840
Speaker 1: I remember having the feelings sometimes of like oh no.

524
00:25:25,320 --> 00:25:28,760
Speaker 3: Now, uhh yeah, when I a couple of years that

525
00:25:28,840 --> 00:25:30,640
Speaker 3: I hunted. That's how I knew I had to stop

526
00:25:30,720 --> 00:25:34,280
Speaker 3: hunting deer with a recurve because I started to be like,

527
00:25:34,320 --> 00:25:37,600
Speaker 3: oh ship, like here he comes, I come. Now, I

528
00:25:37,640 --> 00:25:39,359
Speaker 3: know I'm gonna have to shoot at him, and this

529
00:25:39,480 --> 00:25:41,120
Speaker 3: sucks because I'm probably gonna screw it up.

530
00:25:42,200 --> 00:25:45,200
Speaker 2: But target panic is more like what or at least

531
00:25:45,200 --> 00:25:47,639
Speaker 2: how I experienced. Target panic is how I think you

532
00:25:47,720 --> 00:25:51,439
Speaker 2: had in the past, where I would rush through that

533
00:25:51,480 --> 00:25:53,640
Speaker 2: final part of it. So as soon as I would

534
00:25:53,720 --> 00:25:55,560
Speaker 2: draw back, as soon as my pen at the vitals,

535
00:25:56,119 --> 00:25:58,800
Speaker 2: I didn't have conscious control of my release at that point.

536
00:25:58,800 --> 00:26:00,760
Speaker 2: It was as soon as the was on the vitals,

537
00:26:00,800 --> 00:26:04,600
Speaker 2: it was gone, like the arrow was sent surprise and

538
00:26:04,600 --> 00:26:08,359
Speaker 2: and and I've that led to a lot of rush shots,

539
00:26:08,400 --> 00:26:09,800
Speaker 2: like I hit. I mean, I was used. It was

540
00:26:09,880 --> 00:26:13,000
Speaker 2: usually usually fine, but sometimes it's a little back back,

541
00:26:13,080 --> 00:26:15,959
Speaker 2: it's a little bit forward, or when you're not fully

542
00:26:15,960 --> 00:26:19,600
Speaker 2: in control of that, there is this increased possibility for

543
00:26:19,680 --> 00:26:22,520
Speaker 2: things to go wrong in a situation where already so

544
00:26:22,600 --> 00:26:26,399
Speaker 2: many variables are out of your control, and that is

545
00:26:26,440 --> 00:26:27,119
Speaker 2: not acceptable.

546
00:26:27,240 --> 00:26:29,800
Speaker 3: Well, and there's a good lesson in there, right because

547
00:26:29,880 --> 00:26:33,119
Speaker 3: how how you miss tells you partially what you're doing wrong.

548
00:26:33,600 --> 00:26:37,760
Speaker 3: So my my failure starting out, even the twelve years

549
00:26:37,800 --> 00:26:39,800
Speaker 3: old bow hunting, I started right out of the gate

550
00:26:40,240 --> 00:26:42,640
Speaker 3: where I would draw and come down on my target

551
00:26:42,920 --> 00:26:45,240
Speaker 3: and I would get some part of deer in my

552
00:26:45,359 --> 00:26:48,600
Speaker 3: site window I'm punching that trigger. So I never shot

553
00:26:48,680 --> 00:26:51,600
Speaker 3: under a deer. Literally, it was every time I would

554
00:26:51,640 --> 00:26:55,800
Speaker 3: miss him high, and if I got one, it would

555
00:26:55,840 --> 00:26:58,280
Speaker 3: be because I miss misjudged the artisan. He was a

556
00:26:58,320 --> 00:27:04,280
Speaker 3: lot farther than I thought. And so when that nailed right,

557
00:27:05,000 --> 00:27:06,560
Speaker 3: I had a little buck come in once I'm one

558
00:27:06,600 --> 00:27:11,119
Speaker 3: of the first bucks I killed. I had he started

559
00:27:11,119 --> 00:27:14,280
Speaker 3: coming in a little six pointer and I drew and

560
00:27:14,359 --> 00:27:17,239
Speaker 3: I shot square into a little tiny sapling about six

561
00:27:17,320 --> 00:27:20,159
Speaker 3: feet in front of my tree stand, just bong, and

562
00:27:20,200 --> 00:27:23,639
Speaker 3: he spooped out and just in like desperation mode, I

563
00:27:23,720 --> 00:27:26,120
Speaker 3: knocked another arrow, and you know we didn't I didn't

564
00:27:26,160 --> 00:27:30,040
Speaker 3: have a rangefinder then I was like fifteen, and I

565
00:27:30,119 --> 00:27:32,760
Speaker 3: drew and shot and that arrow just went right into

566
00:27:32,800 --> 00:27:34,680
Speaker 3: his heart and he ran up the hill and fell

567
00:27:34,680 --> 00:27:36,240
Speaker 3: all the way back down, and I was like, oh

568
00:27:36,280 --> 00:27:40,520
Speaker 3: my god, looking back on it, now, all that was

569
00:27:40,520 --> 00:27:42,879
Speaker 3: was that deer picked a horrible spot to run to

570
00:27:43,480 --> 00:27:47,160
Speaker 3: when I just panicked, and didn't you know, I shot

571
00:27:47,200 --> 00:27:49,879
Speaker 3: exactly like I always do. I just had an extra

572
00:27:49,920 --> 00:27:52,320
Speaker 3: fifteen yards for that old alumina marrow to fall into

573
00:27:52,320 --> 00:27:53,840
Speaker 3: his heart, into his pocket.

574
00:27:54,000 --> 00:27:57,720
Speaker 1: Yeah, it feels like there's a magnet in their paunch

575
00:27:58,640 --> 00:27:59,760
Speaker 1: that pulls arrows in that.

576
00:28:00,440 --> 00:28:02,040
Speaker 2: Yeah, that does seem common.

577
00:28:02,240 --> 00:28:02,840
Speaker 4: Yeah.

578
00:28:03,400 --> 00:28:08,840
Speaker 1: Uh with the target panic, how did like I understand

579
00:28:08,920 --> 00:28:12,400
Speaker 1: overcoming it through repetition, but then I feel like there's

580
00:28:12,400 --> 00:28:15,960
Speaker 1: like a thing that needs to be refreshed. I Uh.

581
00:28:16,080 --> 00:28:19,040
Speaker 1: When I was at Tony last year, I hit a

582
00:28:19,040 --> 00:28:23,320
Speaker 1: spike that I lost, and then reviewing it in my mind.

583
00:28:25,200 --> 00:28:26,600
Speaker 1: In reviewing it in my mind, I'm like, I knew

584
00:28:26,640 --> 00:28:29,359
Speaker 1: exactly what happened, and it reminds me of that you

585
00:28:29,480 --> 00:28:33,159
Speaker 1: might go to bed last night, or like you might

586
00:28:33,200 --> 00:28:35,359
Speaker 1: go to bed at night like I did last night, thinking, Okay,

587
00:28:35,480 --> 00:28:37,800
Speaker 1: next time I get really annoyed at my kids, I'm

588
00:28:37,800 --> 00:28:43,400
Speaker 1: gonna handle it more professionally. Right today, I'll get annoyed

589
00:28:43,400 --> 00:28:46,280
Speaker 1: at one of them about something and I'll handle it unprofessionally,

590
00:28:46,440 --> 00:28:48,520
Speaker 1: and then the minute, a couple of seconds after I

591
00:28:48,560 --> 00:28:52,640
Speaker 1: handle it unprofessionally, i'd be like, so the gun I

592
00:28:52,720 --> 00:28:55,040
Speaker 1: just said last night, I wasn't gonna do that. And

593
00:28:55,080 --> 00:28:57,640
Speaker 1: so with shooting, you're like, there's no way I do

594
00:28:57,640 --> 00:29:01,440
Speaker 1: that anymore. I'm never gonna let an arrow fly. I'm

595
00:29:01,480 --> 00:29:04,959
Speaker 1: gonna have the hair picked out. And even when you're like, oh,

596
00:29:05,000 --> 00:29:07,479
Speaker 1: here comes a deer. When he gets here, I'm going

597
00:29:07,560 --> 00:29:12,360
Speaker 1: to pick out a hair and shoot that hair, and

598
00:29:12,360 --> 00:29:14,440
Speaker 1: then all of a sudden you're you're drawing your bow

599
00:29:14,560 --> 00:29:17,760
Speaker 1: back and whatever commitments you made yourself. It's just something

600
00:29:18,520 --> 00:29:19,760
Speaker 1: so powerful.

601
00:29:20,080 --> 00:29:22,840
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, but part of it is just the repetition

602
00:29:22,920 --> 00:29:25,720
Speaker 3: and the mechanics. Like for me, you know when Mark

603
00:29:25,760 --> 00:29:30,000
Speaker 3: talks about like target panic, what I did was started well.

604
00:29:30,040 --> 00:29:32,400
Speaker 3: I went to a single pin site, which was huge

605
00:29:32,440 --> 00:29:35,240
Speaker 3: for me because I couldn't in the moment of truth.

606
00:29:35,240 --> 00:29:39,000
Speaker 3: I couldn't gap. I couldn't like, I couldn't keep it

607
00:29:39,040 --> 00:29:41,240
Speaker 3: together enough to put the yellow pin high or the

608
00:29:41,280 --> 00:29:43,400
Speaker 3: red pin low. I had to just dumb it down.

609
00:29:43,720 --> 00:29:48,120
Speaker 3: But also I specifically taught myself to draw at the

610
00:29:48,160 --> 00:29:51,440
Speaker 3: target so instead of coming down even if you come

611
00:29:51,440 --> 00:29:53,000
Speaker 3: down just a little bit. That was the death of me.

612
00:29:53,320 --> 00:29:55,000
Speaker 3: So I would draw at the target and what that

613
00:29:55,040 --> 00:29:59,240
Speaker 3: actually did for target, right, And then what that did

614
00:29:59,280 --> 00:30:01,640
Speaker 3: for me was I off and drew and had to

615
00:30:01,640 --> 00:30:05,000
Speaker 3: come up. And that was that's a different thing for

616
00:30:05,040 --> 00:30:07,080
Speaker 3: me because when I get that target acquisition, when I'm

617
00:30:07,120 --> 00:30:10,160
Speaker 3: coming up, the pin finds its spot for me. And

618
00:30:10,200 --> 00:30:13,080
Speaker 3: it was just like a you know, enough arrows gets

619
00:30:13,120 --> 00:30:14,880
Speaker 3: you sort of like where you're going to take to

620
00:30:15,120 --> 00:30:17,680
Speaker 3: that to the woods. But there's still so many times

621
00:30:17,720 --> 00:30:20,480
Speaker 3: where you don't do that.

622
00:30:20,960 --> 00:30:26,160
Speaker 1: Like still when I pull back my pin when I

623
00:30:26,200 --> 00:30:29,720
Speaker 1: come to arrest right pre shot, my pin is always

624
00:30:29,720 --> 00:30:31,160
Speaker 1: to the left or where it needs to be, and

625
00:30:31,200 --> 00:30:35,400
Speaker 1: I always need to consciously move it to the right,

626
00:30:35,480 --> 00:30:37,600
Speaker 1: like I like, I don't like to, like there's something

627
00:30:37,640 --> 00:30:39,800
Speaker 1: in my head that doesn't want to obscure the area.

628
00:30:39,920 --> 00:30:42,200
Speaker 1: So and so I'm looking and the pin's always to

629
00:30:42,240 --> 00:30:43,959
Speaker 1: the left, and I always got to like then like

630
00:30:44,640 --> 00:30:46,600
Speaker 1: hop it over to where it belongs.

631
00:30:46,320 --> 00:30:48,040
Speaker 4: Regardless of which way of the animal's face.

632
00:30:48,200 --> 00:30:51,280
Speaker 1: Because you're a left handed shooter, yeah, and you're totally regardless,

633
00:30:51,320 --> 00:30:52,320
Speaker 1: it doesn't matter, always.

634
00:30:52,120 --> 00:30:52,800
Speaker 4: Left, just left.

635
00:30:52,920 --> 00:30:56,120
Speaker 3: You're shooting multipin sight, right. Yeah, so you're looking around

636
00:30:56,160 --> 00:30:58,560
Speaker 3: that rack of pins. So if you did a if

637
00:30:58,560 --> 00:31:01,760
Speaker 3: you did vertical pins and had that had equal spacing

638
00:31:01,800 --> 00:31:04,400
Speaker 3: on both sides through your aperture where your pins are

639
00:31:04,400 --> 00:31:07,000
Speaker 3: perfectly centered in the middle coming from the bottom, you

640
00:31:07,000 --> 00:31:08,120
Speaker 3: wouldn't do that, I bet.

641
00:31:08,040 --> 00:31:08,480
Speaker 4: You think so.

642
00:31:08,680 --> 00:31:10,760
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's something about obscure in the thing.

643
00:31:11,120 --> 00:31:14,280
Speaker 4: You went to it this year? Yeah, single pin this

644
00:31:14,360 --> 00:31:17,000
Speaker 4: year and that what do you say? And worked from me?

645
00:31:17,720 --> 00:31:20,640
Speaker 3: You see this with a lot of new hunters. A

646
00:31:20,680 --> 00:31:23,960
Speaker 3: lot of new hunters hit too far left, too far right, shoulders,

647
00:31:24,000 --> 00:31:28,840
Speaker 3: guts right, And it's because they will. I mean, imagine

648
00:31:28,960 --> 00:31:31,240
Speaker 3: how little you have to move your head to get

649
00:31:31,440 --> 00:31:33,640
Speaker 3: just a slightly different view through your site window. So

650
00:31:33,640 --> 00:31:35,400
Speaker 3: you're already looking through your peep you're already looking through

651
00:31:35,400 --> 00:31:38,280
Speaker 3: your aperture to that deer, and if your just natural

652
00:31:38,320 --> 00:31:40,440
Speaker 3: inclination is to see just a little bit more of

653
00:31:40,440 --> 00:31:44,080
Speaker 3: that deer, you've changed your point of impact by six inches.

654
00:31:44,840 --> 00:31:47,080
Speaker 3: And it's you would never know. You would never do

655
00:31:47,160 --> 00:31:49,400
Speaker 3: that on a target because you don't care. It would

656
00:31:49,400 --> 00:31:51,200
Speaker 3: never your brain would never take over and do that.

657
00:31:51,680 --> 00:31:53,720
Speaker 3: But on a deer people do it a lot and

658
00:31:53,760 --> 00:31:56,360
Speaker 3: So that's like back to our earlier point. If you're

659
00:31:56,760 --> 00:32:00,920
Speaker 3: a chronic shoulder or a gut shooter, that's that could

660
00:32:00,920 --> 00:32:01,720
Speaker 3: be very well.

661
00:32:01,760 --> 00:32:04,120
Speaker 1: The reason why Yeah, well, I'll point out the buck

662
00:32:04,120 --> 00:32:07,720
Speaker 1: eye just referenced. Uh, the buck eye just referenced.

663
00:32:08,320 --> 00:32:09,640
Speaker 4: It was to the left. Yep.

664
00:32:09,880 --> 00:32:11,160
Speaker 1: It was the left where it belonged.

665
00:32:11,280 --> 00:32:11,520
Speaker 4: Yep.

666
00:32:12,120 --> 00:32:14,120
Speaker 1: And I bet you had he been the other had

667
00:32:14,120 --> 00:32:16,320
Speaker 1: he come from the other direction, it probably would have

668
00:32:16,600 --> 00:32:17,800
Speaker 1: probably hit him.

669
00:32:17,680 --> 00:32:18,200
Speaker 3: In the shoulder.

670
00:32:18,360 --> 00:32:18,640
Speaker 4: Yep.

671
00:32:19,000 --> 00:32:21,160
Speaker 3: And you know what, I'll bet that maybe this is

672
00:32:21,200 --> 00:32:23,600
Speaker 3: totally this is just speculation on my part. But you've

673
00:32:23,600 --> 00:32:26,920
Speaker 3: shot a lot of stuff through a rifle scope with

674
00:32:27,000 --> 00:32:30,000
Speaker 3: like a perfect view, you know what I mean. So

675
00:32:30,120 --> 00:32:33,960
Speaker 3: your brain is used to in that moment, which mirrors

676
00:32:34,080 --> 00:32:36,720
Speaker 3: a lot of stuff you've shot, you know, the same emotions,

677
00:32:36,760 --> 00:32:39,800
Speaker 3: the same kind of like adrenaline rush, whatever that you've

678
00:32:39,800 --> 00:32:41,440
Speaker 3: shot with a rifle. But you've had a very clear

679
00:32:41,480 --> 00:32:43,880
Speaker 3: sight window. Yeah, and when you pull out a bow,

680
00:32:44,320 --> 00:32:47,080
Speaker 3: you're you're kind of obscuring half of that sight window,

681
00:32:47,080 --> 00:32:48,800
Speaker 3: and your brain is used to seeing the whole thing.

682
00:32:50,160 --> 00:32:52,600
Speaker 2: Well, go ahead, Mark, I was just gonna say just

683
00:32:52,640 --> 00:32:55,000
Speaker 2: to kind of rewind us to half a step to

684
00:32:55,440 --> 00:32:59,120
Speaker 2: your your issue or your question around actually dealing with

685
00:32:59,160 --> 00:33:00,920
Speaker 2: target panic in the idea, like we know what we

686
00:33:00,960 --> 00:33:02,800
Speaker 2: should do, but then when it actually happens, you don't

687
00:33:02,840 --> 00:33:06,480
Speaker 2: do it. You mentioned mechanics being one thing that can help.

688
00:33:06,920 --> 00:33:11,560
Speaker 2: I had to introduce a new mental mechanic of sorts

689
00:33:11,800 --> 00:33:16,840
Speaker 2: to force me into actually executing on the right thing,

690
00:33:17,400 --> 00:33:20,240
Speaker 2: because again, my issue has always been it's like a

691
00:33:20,280 --> 00:33:22,880
Speaker 2: roller coaster, and like, as soon as I draw back,

692
00:33:22,880 --> 00:33:24,280
Speaker 2: I'm at the top of a roller coaster, and then

693
00:33:24,320 --> 00:33:27,320
Speaker 2: I'm flying down that hill. And so what I had

694
00:33:27,320 --> 00:33:30,400
Speaker 2: to do was introduce speed bumps into it. And so

695
00:33:30,440 --> 00:33:33,200
Speaker 2: I followed this the shot iq program. That's kind of

696
00:33:33,200 --> 00:33:36,719
Speaker 2: the model that I turned to and helped me. And

697
00:33:36,760 --> 00:33:38,960
Speaker 2: the way that I've done it, and the way this

698
00:33:39,040 --> 00:33:43,040
Speaker 2: program recommends you do it is by tying in actual

699
00:33:43,160 --> 00:33:46,840
Speaker 2: verbal cues to physical actions, and you drill that into

700
00:33:46,920 --> 00:33:50,400
Speaker 2: your psyche through repetition over and over and over again

701
00:33:50,800 --> 00:33:54,440
Speaker 2: until you have a certain degree of conscious control of

702
00:33:54,480 --> 00:33:56,200
Speaker 2: each step in the process. So instead of being at

703
00:33:56,200 --> 00:33:58,760
Speaker 2: the top of the roller coaster and then just it's gone,

704
00:33:59,160 --> 00:34:00,880
Speaker 2: I'm at the top of the roller coaster and then

705
00:34:00,880 --> 00:34:02,600
Speaker 2: I'm three cords of the way and there's a pause.

706
00:34:02,800 --> 00:34:05,040
Speaker 2: And then I'm halfway down, there's a pause, and I'm

707
00:34:05,040 --> 00:34:08,160
Speaker 2: making when I'm doing this right, I'm making a conscious

708
00:34:08,160 --> 00:34:11,400
Speaker 2: decision to take each step down the roller coaster, keeping

709
00:34:11,440 --> 00:34:14,520
Speaker 2: me from pins on, shot off. So it's when I

710
00:34:14,600 --> 00:34:16,359
Speaker 2: draw back, no matter what, I'm going to do this right,

711
00:34:16,400 --> 00:34:18,840
Speaker 2: and I'm literally saying this, and then I have to

712
00:34:18,880 --> 00:34:20,600
Speaker 2: address the target. So that's just dropping the pin right

713
00:34:20,640 --> 00:34:22,319
Speaker 2: in the bo Tell me what you're saying. That's what

714
00:34:22,360 --> 00:34:24,960
Speaker 2: I'm saying, start, start from the scratch. I draw back.

715
00:34:25,080 --> 00:34:27,560
Speaker 1: I'm a big buck. Also, Nick there, I am, Hey Mark,

716
00:34:28,239 --> 00:34:29,719
Speaker 1: but I don't see you. You don't see me.

717
00:34:30,320 --> 00:34:33,360
Speaker 2: As literally as I'm drawing back, I'm saying, no matter what,

718
00:34:33,520 --> 00:34:35,960
Speaker 2: I'm going to do this right. So that's that's like

719
00:34:36,640 --> 00:34:39,520
Speaker 2: locking in, so trying to like take a degree of

720
00:34:39,520 --> 00:34:42,319
Speaker 2: conscious control, no matter what, I'm going to do this right.

721
00:34:43,120 --> 00:34:45,799
Speaker 2: Then it's address the target. So that means drop the

722
00:34:45,800 --> 00:34:48,680
Speaker 2: pin on the vitals. Now address the trigger. So that's

723
00:34:48,719 --> 00:34:53,040
Speaker 2: me locking on my finger around the release and then

724
00:34:53,719 --> 00:34:55,279
Speaker 2: here we go. And when I see here we go,

725
00:34:55,600 --> 00:34:58,440
Speaker 2: that's when I can begin my pull. And each one

726
00:34:58,480 --> 00:35:01,680
Speaker 2: of those verbal cues triggers the physical.

727
00:35:01,280 --> 00:35:02,440
Speaker 1: Direction you copyright there.

728
00:35:02,520 --> 00:35:04,640
Speaker 2: No, that's this all Joel Turner from Shot. I Q

729
00:35:05,000 --> 00:35:07,560
Speaker 2: the actual words, even the words. Yeah, he helped me

730
00:35:07,600 --> 00:35:11,040
Speaker 2: with us and and I do not get a one

731
00:35:11,080 --> 00:35:14,640
Speaker 2: hundred percent all the time, but it has definitely helped

732
00:35:14,640 --> 00:35:18,400
Speaker 2: me regain a level of control and has improved things

733
00:35:19,040 --> 00:35:22,240
Speaker 2: and against it's the speed bumps. Just getting a little

734
00:35:22,239 --> 00:35:25,319
Speaker 2: bit of a stop gap in there from that free

735
00:35:25,360 --> 00:35:26,959
Speaker 2: fall can help.

736
00:35:28,000 --> 00:35:30,040
Speaker 1: I'm gonna take this through the approach of I come

737
00:35:30,120 --> 00:35:35,480
Speaker 1: home and I see a bunch of my tools are

738
00:35:35,719 --> 00:35:38,239
Speaker 1: like out in the road and out in the yard.

739
00:35:39,320 --> 00:35:41,319
Speaker 1: I'm going to say to myself, I'm gonna get this right.

740
00:35:43,040 --> 00:35:43,360
Speaker 4: Yep.

741
00:35:43,600 --> 00:35:45,880
Speaker 1: Then I call my kids all into the grange and

742
00:35:45,920 --> 00:35:56,759
Speaker 1: I'm gonna say, here we go. Please, all right, let's

743
00:35:56,760 --> 00:35:58,280
Speaker 1: move post shot.

744
00:35:58,520 --> 00:36:04,200
Speaker 4: Okay, that's the longest twenty minutes ever. Here we're gonna do.

745
00:36:04,480 --> 00:36:08,279
Speaker 1: We're gonna break up post shot until you guys are

746
00:36:08,320 --> 00:36:10,480
Speaker 1: gonna I'm gonna give you each an assignment. You can

747
00:36:10,480 --> 00:36:11,720
Speaker 1: pick who gets what assignment.

748
00:36:12,239 --> 00:36:13,680
Speaker 3: Dude, I feel like you gave me a couple of

749
00:36:13,680 --> 00:36:15,680
Speaker 3: assignments last fall. Okay.

750
00:36:16,000 --> 00:36:19,160
Speaker 1: Assignment number one is like it just looks perfect and

751
00:36:19,200 --> 00:36:23,640
Speaker 1: you hear a crash. Okay, someone can have that. Okay,

752
00:36:24,360 --> 00:36:26,000
Speaker 1: someone can have man, I don't even know if I

753
00:36:26,080 --> 00:36:30,399
Speaker 1: hit that thing. Okay, and someone can have that wasn't good.

754
00:36:33,239 --> 00:36:37,320
Speaker 1: You guys can fight amongst yoursel I'll take whatever's lived.

755
00:36:38,560 --> 00:36:41,279
Speaker 3: I'll take the I don't know if you hit it one.

756
00:36:41,400 --> 00:36:42,320
Speaker 1: I don't even know if I hit it.

757
00:36:42,400 --> 00:36:46,759
Speaker 3: Yeah, because I my dad was he patented that shit.

758
00:36:48,920 --> 00:36:50,799
Speaker 3: There's a copyright on it. It's my dad.

759
00:36:50,880 --> 00:36:52,799
Speaker 2: Well, based on some phone calls I've gotten from you,

760
00:36:52,800 --> 00:36:53,719
Speaker 2: you've done a few of those.

761
00:36:55,800 --> 00:36:58,319
Speaker 3: I've been there. But it was like there was a

762
00:36:58,360 --> 00:37:00,680
Speaker 3: time period and so.

763
00:37:00,600 --> 00:37:02,200
Speaker 1: This is like a so you're taking out you know

764
00:37:02,239 --> 00:37:02,719
Speaker 1: if I hit it?

765
00:37:03,239 --> 00:37:05,319
Speaker 3: Yeah, okay, yeah, you want me to go.

766
00:37:05,880 --> 00:37:08,880
Speaker 1: And well, here's an added dimension. It's dusk.

767
00:37:09,760 --> 00:37:15,200
Speaker 3: Oh yeah, it's not neon. It's never noon, you know. Yeah,

768
00:37:15,440 --> 00:37:18,960
Speaker 3: I've been on. I've went on one of those last year.

769
00:37:19,360 --> 00:37:23,120
Speaker 3: Not with a buddy of mine who's just kind of

770
00:37:23,120 --> 00:37:26,280
Speaker 3: getting into it. Although, to be like, to be totally

771
00:37:26,280 --> 00:37:28,520
Speaker 3: fair to that situation, he was like, I smoked it,

772
00:37:28,880 --> 00:37:32,520
Speaker 3: oh okay, and then it became after some questioning, it

773
00:37:32,600 --> 00:37:36,040
Speaker 3: became I'm not sure. And then it became a total miss.

774
00:37:36,080 --> 00:37:37,160
Speaker 3: When we went out und the arrow.

775
00:37:38,440 --> 00:37:41,439
Speaker 2: It's amazing how not uncommon that is.

776
00:37:41,480 --> 00:37:43,720
Speaker 3: Right, I mean, I'm sure I'm sure there's some white

777
00:37:43,719 --> 00:37:45,960
Speaker 3: tail guides listening to this, and there's some people who've

778
00:37:45,960 --> 00:37:47,759
Speaker 3: been around the block with this stuff who are like,

779
00:37:48,480 --> 00:37:54,360
Speaker 3: who can just totally understand the post shot thing of

780
00:37:54,760 --> 00:38:02,320
Speaker 3: just total confusion, like it just the brain happened, no idea,

781
00:38:02,680 --> 00:38:05,799
Speaker 3: felt like I did everything right, like deer ran off

782
00:38:05,960 --> 00:38:07,600
Speaker 3: reaction was this no clue?

783
00:38:07,960 --> 00:38:08,160
Speaker 4: You know?

784
00:38:08,800 --> 00:38:11,960
Speaker 3: And so often with that, you know, like it doesn't

785
00:38:12,040 --> 00:38:15,799
Speaker 3: do you any good typically until you just go find

786
00:38:15,800 --> 00:38:18,520
Speaker 3: that arrow, like you know, because you can be like,

787
00:38:18,520 --> 00:38:20,920
Speaker 3: where was he standing? All you standing right by that

788
00:38:21,640 --> 00:38:23,480
Speaker 3: birch tree or whatever, and then you go over there

789
00:38:23,520 --> 00:38:27,120
Speaker 3: there's no tracks, and then fifteen yards away there's big

790
00:38:27,160 --> 00:38:29,880
Speaker 3: digging tracks, you know what I mean, Like it's just

791
00:38:30,160 --> 00:38:32,479
Speaker 3: or what did he run by? When he left? Right

792
00:38:32,520 --> 00:38:35,840
Speaker 3: by brush that teeter tree out there, and you go

793
00:38:35,960 --> 00:38:39,120
Speaker 3: over there and the blood trail is, you know, ninety

794
00:38:39,120 --> 00:38:40,280
Speaker 3: degrees in a different direction.

795
00:38:40,480 --> 00:38:43,760
Speaker 1: In literary criticism, that's called an unreliable narrator.

796
00:38:44,880 --> 00:38:48,200
Speaker 3: Yeah, well, there's some unreliable narrators in the deer Woods. Buddy,

797
00:38:48,600 --> 00:38:50,520
Speaker 3: let me tell you I'm and I came from some

798
00:38:50,600 --> 00:38:56,719
Speaker 3: of them, man. But it's always just kind of just

799
00:38:56,760 --> 00:38:59,080
Speaker 3: like feeling out, trying to get every detail because you

800
00:38:59,080 --> 00:39:01,879
Speaker 3: know the Poe shot thing, and we've been we've all

801
00:39:02,080 --> 00:39:05,120
Speaker 3: been through this a million times. You have to trust

802
00:39:05,160 --> 00:39:08,440
Speaker 3: your initial instinct like did he kick his did he

803
00:39:08,520 --> 00:39:10,839
Speaker 3: meal kick? Did he not? Did he wheel this way

804
00:39:10,920 --> 00:39:13,640
Speaker 3: or that way? Like what did your brain register right away?

805
00:39:14,160 --> 00:39:17,440
Speaker 3: And that will be right like forty percent of the time.

806
00:39:17,320 --> 00:39:19,759
Speaker 1: Not what you think happened forty five minutes later, but

807
00:39:19,840 --> 00:39:21,160
Speaker 1: what you initially.

808
00:39:20,680 --> 00:39:23,719
Speaker 3: Thought happened, not what you talked yourself into because you

809
00:39:23,840 --> 00:39:26,560
Speaker 3: heard that crash or all the squirrels started barking down

810
00:39:26,600 --> 00:39:29,640
Speaker 3: the ridge, or you know, the full moon came out. Whatever.

811
00:39:29,719 --> 00:39:33,240
Speaker 3: Like however, you know black magic, you want to introduce

812
00:39:33,280 --> 00:39:36,440
Speaker 3: into it, you have to go what did it feel like?

813
00:39:36,880 --> 00:39:39,400
Speaker 3: And then like what were the initial reactions? But it

814
00:39:39,480 --> 00:39:43,160
Speaker 3: doesn't it really doesn't matter till you go try to

815
00:39:43,160 --> 00:39:46,239
Speaker 3: find that arrow. And what really sucks is when you

816
00:39:46,239 --> 00:39:48,520
Speaker 3: can't find the arrow and then you're.

817
00:39:48,400 --> 00:39:50,799
Speaker 1: Like, do you wait it all on a I don't

818
00:39:50,800 --> 00:39:52,959
Speaker 1: even know if I hit that thing. It's getting dark?

819
00:39:53,080 --> 00:39:53,400
Speaker 4: Are you?

820
00:39:54,360 --> 00:39:56,400
Speaker 1: Are you cool? Just climbing down and going looking for

821
00:39:56,440 --> 00:39:59,600
Speaker 1: the arrow. Yeah okay, oh yeah, I wouldn't so that personally.

822
00:39:59,600 --> 00:40:03,279
Speaker 3: Oh really okay, every everything Marks, but Mark's got his

823
00:40:03,320 --> 00:40:05,200
Speaker 3: own assignment, Mark Mart.

824
00:40:06,160 --> 00:40:06,799
Speaker 1: That ain't good.

825
00:40:07,040 --> 00:40:09,520
Speaker 2: Yeah, So I'll give my thought on this. When we

826
00:40:09,560 --> 00:40:10,960
Speaker 2: get to my piece.

827
00:40:14,200 --> 00:40:17,319
Speaker 3: I'll go right away. Now, I will say this. I

828
00:40:17,360 --> 00:40:21,879
Speaker 3: will be real stealthy, and I will not push it

829
00:40:22,040 --> 00:40:24,400
Speaker 3: in any way. So if my in my head or

830
00:40:24,440 --> 00:40:27,200
Speaker 3: if somebody one of my buddies is like, I know

831
00:40:27,360 --> 00:40:31,200
Speaker 3: you was standing there and we like, I'll go investigate that.

832
00:40:31,280 --> 00:40:33,680
Speaker 3: And if I start getting vibes like this is going

833
00:40:33,760 --> 00:40:35,799
Speaker 3: to turn into something we got to do some real

834
00:40:35,840 --> 00:40:40,080
Speaker 3: detective work on, then typically I'll pull out because there's

835
00:40:40,120 --> 00:40:43,319
Speaker 3: no that's only like a net game.

836
00:40:43,560 --> 00:40:45,800
Speaker 1: Can you quickly explain what we're talking about? The people

837
00:40:46,560 --> 00:40:47,960
Speaker 1: pull out for what reason?

838
00:40:48,080 --> 00:40:50,000
Speaker 3: Oh, because we don't want to push it, right, because

839
00:40:50,040 --> 00:40:53,360
Speaker 3: you you just don't know. You know, Yanni hit that

840
00:40:53,360 --> 00:40:55,719
Speaker 3: buck last year in Wisconsin, that sucker ran off a

841
00:40:55,719 --> 00:40:58,439
Speaker 3: little ways better down he thought it was over, got

842
00:40:58,520 --> 00:41:01,240
Speaker 3: up like they're that stuff happens, yeah.

843
00:41:01,040 --> 00:41:04,000
Speaker 1: And like he might have would have otherwise probably just died,

844
00:41:04,200 --> 00:41:06,520
Speaker 1: but you spooked it, right, And then it ran another

845
00:41:06,640 --> 00:41:08,799
Speaker 1: three hundred yards and now you can't find themn thing right,

846
00:41:09,320 --> 00:41:10,560
Speaker 1: and there's just nothing.

847
00:41:11,440 --> 00:41:16,400
Speaker 3: The thing, the hardest thing to do with people is

848
00:41:16,400 --> 00:41:18,560
Speaker 3: to blood trail with impatient people.

849
00:41:19,880 --> 00:41:21,759
Speaker 2: It's almost everyone right.

850
00:41:22,200 --> 00:41:24,600
Speaker 3: It's like a you know, when you like when we

851
00:41:24,600 --> 00:41:26,520
Speaker 3: were looking for your buck, the good one you shot

852
00:41:26,520 --> 00:41:29,239
Speaker 3: in Oklahoma, you like fall into that cadence where there's

853
00:41:29,280 --> 00:41:31,400
Speaker 3: like a leader a follower, a leader a follower, but

854
00:41:31,440 --> 00:41:35,839
Speaker 3: the pace is kind of dictated by like it's it's

855
00:41:36,040 --> 00:41:40,359
Speaker 3: always like way slower and more methodical than you think.

856
00:41:40,400 --> 00:41:42,239
Speaker 3: Even when you're on like there's blood here, blood here,

857
00:41:42,239 --> 00:41:44,759
Speaker 3: blood here, you're kind of like there's like a little

858
00:41:44,800 --> 00:41:47,840
Speaker 3: governor on people who know what they're doing, just because

859
00:41:47,880 --> 00:41:50,319
Speaker 3: you might come up. You might you know, like the

860
00:41:50,320 --> 00:41:54,120
Speaker 3: potential fifteen yards down that you might run out of blood,

861
00:41:54,920 --> 00:41:58,680
Speaker 3: you know, so you're just like you just fall into

862
00:41:58,719 --> 00:42:02,040
Speaker 3: this sort of cadence where you're like, there's nothing good

863
00:42:02,040 --> 00:42:03,840
Speaker 3: that comes from us. We're running down this or all

864
00:42:03,880 --> 00:42:05,239
Speaker 3: of a sudden just starting to grid search or go

865
00:42:05,280 --> 00:42:07,960
Speaker 3: look ahead, like you just got to dial it back.

866
00:42:08,000 --> 00:42:10,840
Speaker 3: In a lot of people and this is just probably

867
00:42:10,880 --> 00:42:12,640
Speaker 3: mostly because they don't get to do it very much,

868
00:42:12,640 --> 00:42:15,319
Speaker 3: and they haven't been through all those different scenarios where

869
00:42:15,360 --> 00:42:18,120
Speaker 3: you've had that those real late nights, the Doug Durn

870
00:42:18,200 --> 00:42:21,000
Speaker 3: thing where it's like you've been on another nightmare, one

871
00:42:21,040 --> 00:42:23,120
Speaker 3: that didn't turn out, or the coyotes got it the

872
00:42:23,120 --> 00:42:26,400
Speaker 3: next morning. And so when I say go look for

873
00:42:26,440 --> 00:42:30,080
Speaker 3: that arrow, and then if you don't get it right away,

874
00:42:30,200 --> 00:42:32,759
Speaker 3: or it's like you feel that poll to just go

875
00:42:32,840 --> 00:42:35,920
Speaker 3: a little bit farther down the trail, that's when you

876
00:42:36,000 --> 00:42:37,920
Speaker 3: got to just check yourself and go, I'm gonna get out.

877
00:42:37,920 --> 00:42:39,520
Speaker 3: We're gonna go get a sandwich, We're gonna go get

878
00:42:39,520 --> 00:42:43,080
Speaker 3: like good lights, batteries, we're gonna set up for this,

879
00:42:43,120 --> 00:42:45,840
Speaker 3: and we're gonna have a discussion outside of that zone

880
00:42:45,880 --> 00:42:48,920
Speaker 3: where that deer might still be, and just figure this

881
00:42:48,960 --> 00:42:52,120
Speaker 3: plan out. And then cause there's you might you might

882
00:42:52,160 --> 00:42:54,080
Speaker 3: go back, your buddy might relax, or you might just

883
00:42:54,120 --> 00:42:56,560
Speaker 3: be like man kind of felt like maybe it was

884
00:42:56,600 --> 00:42:59,759
Speaker 3: too far back or just like something, or if it's

885
00:42:59,840 --> 00:43:02,759
Speaker 3: just something you usually do, like we talked about, if

886
00:43:02,760 --> 00:43:04,719
Speaker 3: you're a lot of times too far left, too far right,

887
00:43:05,520 --> 00:43:08,799
Speaker 3: you could go if even though I can't remember, I

888
00:43:08,800 --> 00:43:12,200
Speaker 3: don't know that if I did screw up and hit him.

889
00:43:12,719 --> 00:43:15,440
Speaker 3: That's probably or what did it sound like? It's kind

890
00:43:15,440 --> 00:43:17,719
Speaker 3: of like the sound of that arrow is kind of

891
00:43:17,800 --> 00:43:20,120
Speaker 3: jiving with the mistake I make a lot, God, so

892
00:43:20,200 --> 00:43:22,560
Speaker 3: did I got shoot him? And so you just always

893
00:43:22,719 --> 00:43:26,400
Speaker 3: err on that side of don't go push it, you know, like,

894
00:43:26,560 --> 00:43:28,839
Speaker 3: just do not do that. And I know, I mean

895
00:43:28,840 --> 00:43:31,280
Speaker 3: we talk about that all the time, but it really

896
00:43:31,360 --> 00:43:33,640
Speaker 3: hits home when you're on one of those or you know,

897
00:43:33,680 --> 00:43:37,719
Speaker 3: you're like, it's probably you talk yourself into it, and

898
00:43:37,719 --> 00:43:40,560
Speaker 3: then you jump that sucker and now he's on the

899
00:43:40,600 --> 00:43:43,640
Speaker 3: neighbors across the neighbor's fence, and now it's like it's

900
00:43:43,680 --> 00:43:46,719
Speaker 3: become a thing that it didn't have to become. And

901
00:43:46,760 --> 00:43:50,240
Speaker 3: it never almost never becomes a better thing by accident,

902
00:43:50,880 --> 00:43:52,040
Speaker 3: you know what I mean. You never like, well, I'm

903
00:43:52,040 --> 00:43:53,520
Speaker 3: gonna look for the arrow. Oh there he is.

904
00:43:53,800 --> 00:43:57,360
Speaker 1: You know, it's like, yeah, oh, it's much more common

905
00:43:57,480 --> 00:44:00,120
Speaker 1: to go look and I'd be like, oh, right, right.

906
00:44:02,840 --> 00:44:05,360
Speaker 4: I guess I got the crash and you.

907
00:44:04,840 --> 00:44:06,640
Speaker 1: You got the man that looked perfect and I heard

908
00:44:06,640 --> 00:44:07,080
Speaker 1: a crash.

909
00:44:07,239 --> 00:44:10,279
Speaker 4: It's the hardest twenty minutes ever. That's what you do.

910
00:44:10,320 --> 00:44:13,560
Speaker 4: Twenty minute twenty minutes is what I shoot for. Thirty

911
00:44:13,600 --> 00:44:15,800
Speaker 4: is what I shoot for. Twenty I think.

912
00:44:16,239 --> 00:44:17,040
Speaker 1: That's where you come from.

913
00:44:17,080 --> 00:44:21,800
Speaker 4: Okay, twenty will be good enough. And then at fifteen

914
00:44:21,880 --> 00:44:25,239
Speaker 4: I'm standing at the bottom of the tree and go

915
00:44:25,320 --> 00:44:28,520
Speaker 4: find and go find the arrow and it's just absolutely

916
00:44:28,560 --> 00:44:31,160
Speaker 4: painted and it looks just like you want it to look.

917
00:44:31,560 --> 00:44:34,560
Speaker 4: But what I will do, regardless of my excitement level,

918
00:44:34,600 --> 00:44:37,080
Speaker 4: I have taught myself in the story office. And to

919
00:44:37,200 --> 00:44:39,359
Speaker 4: tell you, it was the day that I did it.

920
00:44:40,320 --> 00:44:44,480
Speaker 4: When I heard that crash took I had my compass

921
00:44:44,520 --> 00:44:46,360
Speaker 4: in my hand and I shot an as with to

922
00:44:46,480 --> 00:44:49,040
Speaker 4: it from where I was sitting in that tree, so

923
00:44:49,120 --> 00:44:52,000
Speaker 4: I knew the direction because it's the world is a

924
00:44:52,040 --> 00:44:55,280
Speaker 4: different place when you're fifteen feet closer to the planet

925
00:44:55,560 --> 00:44:59,200
Speaker 4: and you get down there, and which tree was was

926
00:44:59,239 --> 00:45:01,560
Speaker 4: I am? You know, once you get out there and

927
00:45:01,560 --> 00:45:04,920
Speaker 4: you can't see the sand. But I get out there

928
00:45:05,040 --> 00:45:09,120
Speaker 4: and I find the arrow. If I'm finally waiting twenty minutes,

929
00:45:09,200 --> 00:45:12,319
Speaker 4: and it's just blood, blood, blood, blood, and you and

930
00:45:12,560 --> 00:45:15,440
Speaker 4: like to Tony, like what Tony's talking about, you just

931
00:45:15,480 --> 00:45:17,880
Speaker 4: start walking faster and faster. Oh, I can see it,

932
00:45:17,920 --> 00:45:19,640
Speaker 4: I can see it. And if you ain't careful if

933
00:45:19,640 --> 00:45:23,160
Speaker 4: it stops, if that hole plugs up, or if it

934
00:45:23,520 --> 00:45:25,520
Speaker 4: rubs up against a tree and it doesn't drip on

935
00:45:25,560 --> 00:45:27,399
Speaker 4: the ground that you don't see when it goes by,

936
00:45:28,160 --> 00:45:31,360
Speaker 4: and all of a sudden there's no blood and you

937
00:45:31,440 --> 00:45:34,799
Speaker 4: turn around looking, you've already walked five yards past it,

938
00:45:35,200 --> 00:45:37,080
Speaker 4: and then you got to go all the way back.

939
00:45:37,160 --> 00:45:38,520
Speaker 4: If you can find it again.

940
00:45:38,400 --> 00:45:40,239
Speaker 1: Then you gotta wonder if you didn't step on what

941
00:45:40,440 --> 00:45:41,640
Speaker 1: was there exactly?

942
00:45:41,719 --> 00:45:46,840
Speaker 4: Now I've ruined it. So this blood trail on this

943
00:45:47,000 --> 00:45:51,160
Speaker 4: deer went, it's like a sling shot straight away from

944
00:45:51,160 --> 00:45:53,759
Speaker 4: where I shot it. And then it started very kind

945
00:45:53,800 --> 00:45:56,520
Speaker 4: of back to the left. And in my mind, I'm

946
00:45:56,560 --> 00:45:59,719
Speaker 4: thinking I heard him, heard him crash over here, But

947
00:45:59,760 --> 00:46:03,080
Speaker 4: maybe maybe that's not Maybe that was just excitement, because

948
00:46:03,080 --> 00:46:06,200
Speaker 4: the blood's going here. Well, the blood starts, it gets

949
00:46:06,360 --> 00:46:09,280
Speaker 4: sixty yards away from the tree now in the bottoms

950
00:46:09,280 --> 00:46:11,279
Speaker 4: there where there's thickets, and I can't see the tree

951
00:46:11,320 --> 00:46:13,960
Speaker 4: I'm in now, So I'm in my mind I'm assuming

952
00:46:14,560 --> 00:46:18,000
Speaker 4: I have got this bloodline is straight, but I've actually

953
00:46:18,000 --> 00:46:21,000
Speaker 4: made a big curve to the left, and the blood

954
00:46:21,000 --> 00:46:24,200
Speaker 4: trail starts going up this bluff and it stops. But

955
00:46:24,280 --> 00:46:26,680
Speaker 4: where I missed where and I get to the top

956
00:46:26,680 --> 00:46:28,759
Speaker 4: of the bluff, I can't find blood anywhere, I can't

957
00:46:28,800 --> 00:46:31,759
Speaker 4: find a deer, I can't find anything. But where I

958
00:46:31,840 --> 00:46:34,880
Speaker 4: missed was when that deer got to the edge of

959
00:46:34,880 --> 00:46:38,439
Speaker 4: that bluff, he fell and rolled down the other side.

960
00:46:38,480 --> 00:46:41,200
Speaker 4: And where I heard him crash was where I heard

961
00:46:41,239 --> 00:46:44,560
Speaker 4: him crash, But it was eighty yards difference from where

962
00:46:44,560 --> 00:46:46,840
Speaker 4: I lost That blood trailed right there and was actually

963
00:46:46,920 --> 00:46:50,200
Speaker 4: back closer to the deer standing from where I shot

964
00:46:50,280 --> 00:46:52,680
Speaker 4: him at I got you. So when I and how

965
00:46:52,719 --> 00:46:55,120
Speaker 4: I found him was I walked back to the base

966
00:46:55,160 --> 00:46:57,360
Speaker 4: of that tree and took asthmus, and I walked that

967
00:46:57,480 --> 00:46:59,880
Speaker 4: asthmus that I shot out there and walked right up

968
00:47:00,360 --> 00:47:02,279
Speaker 4: to that sound you heard and to the sound I heard,

969
00:47:02,280 --> 00:47:05,359
Speaker 4: and that was him because I thought maybe if if

970
00:47:05,400 --> 00:47:07,840
Speaker 4: that was him, maybe he bedded, you know, and I

971
00:47:07,880 --> 00:47:09,640
Speaker 4: would jump him up at least know which way he

972
00:47:09,760 --> 00:47:11,680
Speaker 4: was going. But I mean, but he was dead as

973
00:47:11,719 --> 00:47:12,160
Speaker 4: a hammer.

974
00:47:12,719 --> 00:47:14,319
Speaker 1: That's a good idea on that compass deal.

975
00:47:14,440 --> 00:47:16,520
Speaker 4: Yeah, it cats come in handy a lot.

976
00:47:17,760 --> 00:47:24,080
Speaker 1: I remember being kids and it would be a big thing.

977
00:47:24,120 --> 00:47:26,440
Speaker 1: It was the old man that sends you back up

978
00:47:26,440 --> 00:47:29,239
Speaker 1: in the tree yep, yep, and you'd have a surveyor's

979
00:47:29,280 --> 00:47:31,600
Speaker 1: tape yep. And he wanted to where did you first

980
00:47:31,640 --> 00:47:32,000
Speaker 1: see it?

981
00:47:32,320 --> 00:47:32,640
Speaker 3: Yep?

982
00:47:33,280 --> 00:47:36,520
Speaker 1: Where was it when you shot? Okay, where do you

983
00:47:36,560 --> 00:47:39,640
Speaker 1: think it last saw it was? And mark all this stuff,

984
00:47:39,680 --> 00:47:41,960
Speaker 1: you know, and start laying out like a crime scene,

985
00:47:42,000 --> 00:47:44,160
Speaker 1: you know what I mean, because he's trying to pry

986
00:47:44,200 --> 00:47:47,440
Speaker 1: as much out of an unreliable narrator as he could,

987
00:47:47,480 --> 00:47:49,960
Speaker 1: you know, like visually on the ground.

988
00:47:49,760 --> 00:47:52,440
Speaker 4: You know what I mean. Well, it became painfully obvious

989
00:47:52,880 --> 00:47:56,560
Speaker 4: how they're not. They may leave in a straight line,

990
00:47:56,600 --> 00:47:58,279
Speaker 4: but that don't mean they're going to stay in one,

991
00:47:58,800 --> 00:48:01,080
Speaker 4: you know. And I'm gonna believe that there would have

992
00:48:01,080 --> 00:48:03,040
Speaker 4: went on top of that bluff and lay and fell

993
00:48:03,040 --> 00:48:05,120
Speaker 4: over dead. But he fell over before you got the

994
00:48:05,160 --> 00:48:08,439
Speaker 4: top and rolled down to that other spot over there.

995
00:48:08,680 --> 00:48:11,799
Speaker 4: You know. If I hadn't done that, you know, we

996
00:48:11,840 --> 00:48:13,320
Speaker 4: could still be out there looking for it.

997
00:48:13,800 --> 00:48:18,480
Speaker 3: You're like fighting, you're fighting this this dual thing where

998
00:48:18,520 --> 00:48:22,319
Speaker 3: you have real information, which is like the spore, and

999
00:48:22,360 --> 00:48:26,040
Speaker 3: then like this information you're making up, like you're filling

1000
00:48:26,080 --> 00:48:28,640
Speaker 3: in the blanks. And so I think that's like the

1001
00:48:28,640 --> 00:48:31,400
Speaker 3: the most dangerous stuff on blood trails is always and

1002
00:48:31,480 --> 00:48:34,279
Speaker 3: never stuff and then talking yourself into like, we got

1003
00:48:34,280 --> 00:48:36,319
Speaker 3: to go because there's a whole lot of coyotes around here,

1004
00:48:36,760 --> 00:48:38,720
Speaker 3: or we got to go because it's kind of warm,

1005
00:48:38,760 --> 00:48:42,480
Speaker 3: and maybe you know, like when you're when you're when

1006
00:48:42,480 --> 00:48:45,160
Speaker 3: you're talking yourself into going and you're filling in the

1007
00:48:45,160 --> 00:48:49,520
Speaker 3: blanks instead of working off the actual information that tends

1008
00:48:49,520 --> 00:48:50,399
Speaker 3: to break bad a lot.

1009
00:48:50,480 --> 00:48:53,080
Speaker 4: Well, the only reason you're coming up with those things

1010
00:48:53,080 --> 00:48:54,480
Speaker 4: to do is because you want to get there and

1011
00:48:54,560 --> 00:48:56,600
Speaker 4: put your hands on right right, so.

1012
00:48:58,080 --> 00:49:00,120
Speaker 1: You're gonna take over on your thing about this Ian

1013
00:49:00,200 --> 00:49:02,080
Speaker 1: to tell you a funny story. One time we were

1014
00:49:02,120 --> 00:49:09,120
Speaker 1: out and hit a bowl elk and then drew back

1015
00:49:09,200 --> 00:49:12,360
Speaker 1: and kind of like went off to a rock area

1016
00:49:12,920 --> 00:49:13,480
Speaker 1: just to lay.

1017
00:49:13,360 --> 00:49:13,879
Speaker 4: Down and wait.

1018
00:49:14,200 --> 00:49:16,280
Speaker 1: And the whole time we're I can't wait forty five minutes.

1019
00:49:16,840 --> 00:49:21,040
Speaker 1: The whole time, I'm like kinda smell elk, I can

1020
00:49:21,120 --> 00:49:23,920
Speaker 1: smell elk, and in are going back wound up like

1021
00:49:24,040 --> 00:49:27,240
Speaker 1: setting up like right next to that thing. No waited

1022
00:49:27,280 --> 00:49:28,080
Speaker 1: forty five minutes.

1023
00:49:28,640 --> 00:49:35,560
Speaker 5: Oh my god, that I pointed that out, because that's

1024
00:49:35,640 --> 00:49:39,120
Speaker 5: usually not how that goes, all right, So Mark take

1025
00:49:39,160 --> 00:49:40,839
Speaker 5: it where it's just like that ain't good.

1026
00:49:41,160 --> 00:49:44,120
Speaker 2: Yeah, So in that scenario, everything that we've talked about

1027
00:49:44,160 --> 00:49:48,439
Speaker 2: so far is even more important. So the very first

1028
00:49:48,440 --> 00:49:51,080
Speaker 2: thing I'm going to do in that situation is try

1029
00:49:51,120 --> 00:49:54,200
Speaker 2: to collect as much information as I possibly can to

1030
00:49:54,320 --> 00:49:58,280
Speaker 2: ensure that the narrator is as useful as possible, at least.

1031
00:49:58,160 --> 00:49:58,680
Speaker 1: Even if it's you.

1032
00:49:58,880 --> 00:50:01,759
Speaker 2: Yeah, even if let's put it the it is me, which, hey,

1033
00:50:01,840 --> 00:50:04,799
Speaker 2: this has happened. So so in a situation where like

1034
00:50:05,000 --> 00:50:07,480
Speaker 2: I saw the hit, I knew it wasn't great. Now

1035
00:50:07,520 --> 00:50:09,719
Speaker 2: I know, man, my job from here on out is

1036
00:50:09,719 --> 00:50:10,720
Speaker 2: going to be extra difficult.

1037
00:50:10,760 --> 00:50:13,319
Speaker 1: Let's put a finer point to it. It's way back, yeah,

1038
00:50:13,360 --> 00:50:16,600
Speaker 1: way back. Not in the hip, it's in that narrowest

1039
00:50:16,680 --> 00:50:18,000
Speaker 1: little waste part.

1040
00:50:18,200 --> 00:50:21,480
Speaker 4: Yeah when it sounds like yeah.

1041
00:50:21,760 --> 00:50:26,640
Speaker 2: So So in that scenario number one, I see that happen.

1042
00:50:27,239 --> 00:50:30,320
Speaker 2: Then I'm watching that deer and very very carefully trying

1043
00:50:30,320 --> 00:50:33,080
Speaker 2: to see where's the last place I saw, like marking

1044
00:50:33,160 --> 00:50:36,560
Speaker 2: any possible visual waypoint in my mind. And then I

1045
00:50:36,600 --> 00:50:39,160
Speaker 2: try to take it a step further two ways. One

1046
00:50:39,320 --> 00:50:41,840
Speaker 2: I will oftentimes like after the deer disappears out of you,

1047
00:50:42,239 --> 00:50:43,959
Speaker 2: the first thing I'm thinking about is in my mind

1048
00:50:44,040 --> 00:50:46,399
Speaker 2: trying to think through okay, what did I hear? What

1049
00:50:46,560 --> 00:50:49,239
Speaker 2: I see and trying to like have an internal dialogue

1050
00:50:49,239 --> 00:50:53,080
Speaker 2: and very clearly like okay, he went that way, saw

1051
00:50:53,160 --> 00:50:55,440
Speaker 2: him by that big oa. Try last, and something I

1052
00:50:55,480 --> 00:50:57,840
Speaker 2: haven't done but I should do and would recommend is

1053
00:50:57,840 --> 00:51:00,080
Speaker 2: actually pull out your notes app in your phone and

1054
00:51:00,120 --> 00:51:02,120
Speaker 2: actually write this down right then in the moment, write

1055
00:51:02,160 --> 00:51:04,960
Speaker 2: down everything you can remember while it's fresh, before your

1056
00:51:04,960 --> 00:51:08,360
Speaker 2: mind starts playing tricks on you. Another thing I have done,

1057
00:51:08,520 --> 00:51:11,520
Speaker 2: I will take a picture from the tree stand of

1058
00:51:11,719 --> 00:51:13,839
Speaker 2: where I shot it, so I know what the view

1059
00:51:13,840 --> 00:51:15,319
Speaker 2: looks like from up there with my phone, and then

1060
00:51:15,320 --> 00:51:17,359
Speaker 2: I will take a picture of the last place I

1061
00:51:17,400 --> 00:51:20,200
Speaker 2: saw him, and then like even like circle in the photo,

1062
00:51:20,280 --> 00:51:22,840
Speaker 2: like there's where he was. In my mind's eye, it's fresh,

1063
00:51:22,920 --> 00:51:25,000
Speaker 2: it just happened. I can see what it looks like

1064
00:51:25,120 --> 00:51:26,880
Speaker 2: right now, I'll zoom in and get a picture of

1065
00:51:26,880 --> 00:51:29,160
Speaker 2: that that way. You know, just like you said, when

1066
00:51:29,160 --> 00:51:30,719
Speaker 2: you're down there on the ground, it's like you know

1067
00:51:30,760 --> 00:51:32,840
Speaker 2: your dad in the surveyor's tape, similar thing, But you

1068
00:51:32,840 --> 00:51:34,600
Speaker 2: can do this on your own right, so then when

1069
00:51:34,600 --> 00:51:36,200
Speaker 2: you're on the ground, you can be like Okay, is

1070
00:51:36,239 --> 00:51:38,239
Speaker 2: this the tree? Look at the picture. Oh yeah, this

1071
00:51:38,280 --> 00:51:40,279
Speaker 2: is the oak tree. Here's that little sapling he was

1072
00:51:40,320 --> 00:51:42,720
Speaker 2: standing by. This is that sapling. You can orient yourself

1073
00:51:42,719 --> 00:51:45,399
Speaker 2: on the ground. Cause again, I know that my job

1074
00:51:45,480 --> 00:51:47,760
Speaker 2: is going to be extra challenging. I need every single

1075
00:51:47,880 --> 00:51:52,400
Speaker 2: possible data point. So I'm doing these things, collecting all

1076
00:51:52,400 --> 00:51:55,440
Speaker 2: that data that I can from the tree already. If

1077
00:51:55,480 --> 00:51:58,600
Speaker 2: I know it's a far back hit right away, I know, hey,

1078
00:51:58,640 --> 00:52:02,080
Speaker 2: this steer is going to need time. I will with

1079
00:52:02,200 --> 00:52:05,960
Speaker 2: any shot. And maybe I'm overly conservative here, but even

1080
00:52:06,000 --> 00:52:08,879
Speaker 2: if I heard it crash, I always will wait an hour.

1081
00:52:10,800 --> 00:52:11,480
Speaker 4: The only.

1082
00:52:12,719 --> 00:52:14,160
Speaker 2: Time that would not be the case would be if

1083
00:52:14,200 --> 00:52:16,520
Speaker 2: I can literally see the deer dead. But if I

1084
00:52:16,520 --> 00:52:19,120
Speaker 2: can't see it dead, I just think it's off there somewhere.

1085
00:52:19,120 --> 00:52:22,520
Speaker 2: I'll at least wait an hour. God, that's a lot

1086
00:52:22,560 --> 00:52:27,160
Speaker 2: of discipline, try to It just seems like there's so

1087
00:52:27,200 --> 00:52:29,640
Speaker 2: many ways that can go wrong. There's no way it

1088
00:52:29,680 --> 00:52:32,560
Speaker 2: can get more right. Like, if he's dead, he's not

1089
00:52:32,560 --> 00:52:34,279
Speaker 2: going to be more dead if I get down there

1090
00:52:34,280 --> 00:52:36,799
Speaker 2: at thirty minutes. If he's dead, he's dead. As long

1091
00:52:36,800 --> 00:52:38,439
Speaker 2: as it's not crazy hot and I'm not worried about

1092
00:52:38,440 --> 00:52:39,839
Speaker 2: the meat going bad, Like that would be the only

1093
00:52:39,840 --> 00:52:41,520
Speaker 2: time I'd like rush down there if that was case.

1094
00:52:41,560 --> 00:52:45,799
Speaker 2: But like, assuming that's not a concern, the only thing

1095
00:52:45,840 --> 00:52:47,920
Speaker 2: that could happen is it could be worse. Maybe he crashed,

1096
00:52:47,920 --> 00:52:50,000
Speaker 2: but he's actually not dead and I spook him. So

1097
00:52:50,080 --> 00:52:51,799
Speaker 2: when it goes out, it comes down to checking the arrow.

1098
00:52:51,840 --> 00:52:54,640
Speaker 2: I like to wait to check the arrow because again,

1099
00:52:55,320 --> 00:52:58,200
Speaker 2: worst case scenario, what if he crashed but it's not dead.

1100
00:52:58,360 --> 00:53:01,799
Speaker 2: You go walk thirty yards out, it's crunchy, You go

1101
00:53:01,880 --> 00:53:03,480
Speaker 2: check that arrow, and all of a sudden he's up

1102
00:53:03,480 --> 00:53:05,520
Speaker 2: and running. I just don't want that to happen. I

1103
00:53:05,520 --> 00:53:08,279
Speaker 2: don't I want zero chance of that happening. So I wait.

1104
00:53:08,680 --> 00:53:11,719
Speaker 2: If I know I hit this deer back, I might

1105
00:53:11,800 --> 00:53:13,279
Speaker 2: not even go check the arrow at all.

1106
00:53:13,640 --> 00:53:14,560
Speaker 4: So this is.

1107
00:53:17,200 --> 00:53:21,840
Speaker 2: This is exactly. This is very close to a scenario

1108
00:53:21,880 --> 00:53:23,880
Speaker 2: I had last fall at Doug's place. So speaking to

1109
00:53:23,960 --> 00:53:26,800
Speaker 2: Doug with guys with archery shots and not hitting getting

1110
00:53:26,800 --> 00:53:31,080
Speaker 2: perfect hits. So I had a shot at a buck

1111
00:53:31,440 --> 00:53:33,880
Speaker 2: and I probably rushed the shot a little bit and

1112
00:53:33,960 --> 00:53:36,239
Speaker 2: he spun on the shot and the shot hit back.

1113
00:53:36,880 --> 00:53:40,680
Speaker 2: And so wait at an hour, thought about going to

1114
00:53:40,760 --> 00:53:42,480
Speaker 2: check the arrow, and I'm having a hard time remembering

1115
00:53:42,560 --> 00:53:44,400
Speaker 2: if I did. I'm pretty sure that I did not

1116
00:53:44,520 --> 00:53:46,080
Speaker 2: go to the tree to check the arrow at all.

1117
00:53:46,480 --> 00:53:48,120
Speaker 2: I remember we talked on the phone afterwards, but I

1118
00:53:48,160 --> 00:53:50,080
Speaker 2: went back and immediately knew you hit a deer back.

1119
00:53:51,000 --> 00:53:53,600
Speaker 2: My view is like a ten to twelve hour wait,

1120
00:53:53,800 --> 00:53:59,360
Speaker 2: no matter what. Again, it goes back to what's the

1121
00:53:59,360 --> 00:54:00,359
Speaker 2: worst come out come.

1122
00:54:00,320 --> 00:54:03,960
Speaker 1: Like any shot is an hour a punt shot. You're

1123
00:54:03,960 --> 00:54:04,880
Speaker 1: going to give it ten.

1124
00:54:05,000 --> 00:54:08,759
Speaker 2: Yeah, just because that deer is going to die like

1125
00:54:09,040 --> 00:54:11,319
Speaker 2: that deer. A deer does not survive a shot in

1126
00:54:11,360 --> 00:54:15,360
Speaker 2: that region. But unfortunately, the reality is that is not

1127
00:54:15,400 --> 00:54:19,960
Speaker 2: a fast thing. It might, you might get lucky, but

1128
00:54:20,120 --> 00:54:21,719
Speaker 2: most of the time it is not a fast thing.

1129
00:54:21,800 --> 00:54:24,600
Speaker 2: But what you can count on usually is that that

1130
00:54:24,640 --> 00:54:27,160
Speaker 2: deer does not want to travel far. That deer wants

1131
00:54:27,200 --> 00:54:29,279
Speaker 2: to get to its first point of safety and it

1132
00:54:29,280 --> 00:54:30,880
Speaker 2: wants to lay down and it does not want to

1133
00:54:30,920 --> 00:54:33,320
Speaker 2: move again. And so the only silver lining here is

1134
00:54:33,320 --> 00:54:35,319
Speaker 2: that that's the case. So you hit a deer back,

1135
00:54:35,760 --> 00:54:38,160
Speaker 2: there's a pretty darn good chance he's going to bed

1136
00:54:38,200 --> 00:54:40,719
Speaker 2: down quickly and he's not going to leave that bed

1137
00:54:41,400 --> 00:54:44,960
Speaker 2: unless you bump him. So that's why it's it's almost

1138
00:54:45,000 --> 00:54:48,200
Speaker 2: always better to give that deer a good amount of time,

1139
00:54:48,239 --> 00:54:52,640
Speaker 2: at least ten to twelve hours, and then you can

1140
00:54:52,719 --> 00:54:56,040
Speaker 2: know with relatives certaintly certainty that deer is going to

1141
00:54:56,040 --> 00:54:58,799
Speaker 2: be somewhere kind of close. Just don't screw it up.

1142
00:54:58,880 --> 00:55:02,000
Speaker 1: Give it to me. Let's say we're not out in

1143
00:55:02,040 --> 00:55:04,960
Speaker 1: like prairie country, but we're in mixed egg land, and

1144
00:55:05,000 --> 00:55:07,319
Speaker 1: you're we're in mixed egg land with a lot of

1145
00:55:07,320 --> 00:55:09,600
Speaker 1: betting covers scattered around how many yards away?

1146
00:55:10,239 --> 00:55:12,719
Speaker 2: One to two hundred yards, you think? So first good

1147
00:55:12,800 --> 00:55:16,400
Speaker 2: security cover. Usually they'll they'll bed down. And so I

1148
00:55:17,000 --> 00:55:19,360
Speaker 2: was on the edge of really thick cover, and I

1149
00:55:19,440 --> 00:55:21,880
Speaker 2: knew that he could be within seventy yards. Got it like,

1150
00:55:21,920 --> 00:55:24,640
Speaker 2: I don't think he went far, And so I knew he.

1151
00:55:24,640 --> 00:55:27,760
Speaker 1: Might go seventy yards from that point of like feeling

1152
00:55:27,800 --> 00:55:30,600
Speaker 1: that scared and feeling that hurt, he might go seventy

1153
00:55:30,680 --> 00:55:32,279
Speaker 1: yards and feel safe enough to lay down.

1154
00:55:32,360 --> 00:55:34,840
Speaker 2: Like I've seen deer get hitting that paunch, they bound

1155
00:55:34,840 --> 00:55:37,440
Speaker 2: off like one or two bounds, stop, kind of hunch up,

1156
00:55:37,440 --> 00:55:39,480
Speaker 2: and then just slowly walk away, And as soon as

1157
00:55:39,480 --> 00:55:40,759
Speaker 2: they hit cover, they bed down.

1158
00:55:40,880 --> 00:55:41,080
Speaker 3: Yep.

1159
00:55:41,160 --> 00:55:46,600
Speaker 2: Yeah, and so many people though have this pull like

1160
00:55:46,640 --> 00:55:48,000
Speaker 2: I just need to see, I just need to know.

1161
00:55:48,040 --> 00:55:50,839
Speaker 2: I just want to find it and it'll go. It's

1162
00:55:50,880 --> 00:55:55,040
Speaker 2: the worst, but nothing good comes of that. So I

1163
00:55:55,080 --> 00:55:58,480
Speaker 2: am I am going to if if I feel very

1164
00:55:58,480 --> 00:56:00,520
Speaker 2: confident because of the terrain and the habit, that I

1165
00:56:00,560 --> 00:56:03,600
Speaker 2: can get to the arrow site without spooking it, then yes,

1166
00:56:03,640 --> 00:56:05,840
Speaker 2: I will go there and collect all the information that

1167
00:56:05,880 --> 00:56:08,720
Speaker 2: you talked about, get as much information as I possibly

1168
00:56:08,719 --> 00:56:11,480
Speaker 2: can to arm me with, you know, the ability to

1169
00:56:11,480 --> 00:56:14,360
Speaker 2: make as good of a decision as possible. So wanting

1170
00:56:14,400 --> 00:56:16,960
Speaker 2: to see, like trying to confirm if maybe you're not

1171
00:56:17,000 --> 00:56:19,319
Speaker 2: sure if it was liver or stomach or something, then

1172
00:56:19,320 --> 00:56:20,839
Speaker 2: I'm looking at the arrow, I'm looking at the blood.

1173
00:56:20,880 --> 00:56:22,719
Speaker 2: I'm looking at that kind of thing. But if I

1174
00:56:22,760 --> 00:56:25,200
Speaker 2: saw far back like we know that's what it is,

1175
00:56:25,760 --> 00:56:29,800
Speaker 2: then I'm backing out and I'm doing two things, waiting

1176
00:56:29,920 --> 00:56:33,960
Speaker 2: three things. I'm waiting that long predetermined time. Number two,

1177
00:56:34,320 --> 00:56:37,319
Speaker 2: I'm trying to get some help. And number three, if

1178
00:56:37,360 --> 00:56:39,440
Speaker 2: it's legal in your state and you have someone who

1179
00:56:39,520 --> 00:56:42,360
Speaker 2: has a dog, get the dog. There's no downside of

1180
00:56:42,400 --> 00:56:45,400
Speaker 2: getting a dog. They are like magic. They are an

1181
00:56:45,440 --> 00:56:49,680
Speaker 2: incredible asset and tool, and if you can do it,

1182
00:56:49,719 --> 00:56:53,840
Speaker 2: there's no reason not to do it right. Twelve hours passes.

1183
00:56:54,520 --> 00:56:57,080
Speaker 2: Now I'm going to return to the site of the

1184
00:56:57,400 --> 00:56:59,560
Speaker 2: where the shot was. I have all of this information.

1185
00:56:59,640 --> 00:57:01,560
Speaker 2: I have my photo of the last place that saw him.

1186
00:57:01,719 --> 00:57:03,719
Speaker 2: I have the photo of the shot site, I have

1187
00:57:03,800 --> 00:57:07,280
Speaker 2: my arrow, I have the blood at the sight of impact.

1188
00:57:07,719 --> 00:57:10,880
Speaker 2: And now doing everything Tony talked about, and you know,

1189
00:57:11,080 --> 00:57:13,319
Speaker 2: Brent talked about slowly trying to follow that blood if

1190
00:57:13,360 --> 00:57:15,839
Speaker 2: at all possible, if you have the dog, staying out

1191
00:57:15,880 --> 00:57:18,560
Speaker 2: of the dog's way. A big thing is like a

1192
00:57:18,600 --> 00:57:22,320
Speaker 2: mistake many people make with a subpar shot, is that

1193
00:57:23,520 --> 00:57:26,959
Speaker 2: maybe they thought, well, maybe it was liver, maybe back

1194
00:57:27,000 --> 00:57:30,160
Speaker 2: a lungs, and they want to believe the best case scenario,

1195
00:57:30,480 --> 00:57:32,440
Speaker 2: and then they start walking around and looking and they

1196
00:57:33,240 --> 00:57:36,240
Speaker 2: mess up the whole area. And then six hours later like, well,

1197
00:57:36,240 --> 00:57:37,560
Speaker 2: now I got to call a dog, and they call

1198
00:57:37,640 --> 00:57:39,720
Speaker 2: the dog, but you messed up the first four hundred

1199
00:57:39,800 --> 00:57:43,520
Speaker 2: yards of circumference around the area of impact. What I've

1200
00:57:43,600 --> 00:57:45,760
Speaker 2: learned with a I've got one of my best buddies

1201
00:57:45,960 --> 00:57:48,080
Speaker 2: as a dog, and so he's done this hundreds of times.

1202
00:57:48,120 --> 00:57:50,000
Speaker 2: And now he comes out with me just for practice,

1203
00:57:50,000 --> 00:57:51,920
Speaker 2: and so I've gotten to see this many times myself.

1204
00:57:52,600 --> 00:57:54,560
Speaker 2: The best thing you can do is that the first

1205
00:57:54,720 --> 00:57:57,720
Speaker 2: hint of eh, I'm not like I've lost blood, not

1206
00:57:57,760 --> 00:58:00,360
Speaker 2: feeling good about this. If you have that tool in

1207
00:58:00,400 --> 00:58:04,560
Speaker 2: your toolbox, grab it because it can. It can cure

1208
00:58:04,640 --> 00:58:06,920
Speaker 2: so many woes. If you have that tool, Yeah, there

1209
00:58:06,920 --> 00:58:07,200
Speaker 2: are a lot.

1210
00:58:07,240 --> 00:58:08,520
Speaker 3: Those dogs are a lot better at it.

1211
00:58:08,440 --> 00:58:08,840
Speaker 4: Than we are.

1212
00:58:08,960 --> 00:58:11,800
Speaker 2: Yeah, So of course, like if you can follow blood, absolutely,

1213
00:58:11,920 --> 00:58:14,080
Speaker 2: but if you're reaching that question mark point and you're

1214
00:58:14,080 --> 00:58:16,400
Speaker 2: thinking dog, no dog, dog, no dog, I would always

1215
00:58:16,440 --> 00:58:20,200
Speaker 2: lean towards dog. So now we've waited, we have the information,

1216
00:58:20,400 --> 00:58:23,920
Speaker 2: we're on the trail. Now it's just slow. Do not

1217
00:58:24,040 --> 00:58:28,000
Speaker 2: be impatient, Do not rush ahead mark last blood. Always,

1218
00:58:28,320 --> 00:58:31,600
Speaker 2: don't rush into the well. Let's just start around the corner.

1219
00:58:32,040 --> 00:58:35,080
Speaker 2: Just follow all those protocols that force you to go slow,

1220
00:58:35,120 --> 00:58:38,120
Speaker 2: that force you to be methodical about it, and more

1221
00:58:38,160 --> 00:58:40,880
Speaker 2: often than not, with that far back hit deer, if

1222
00:58:40,880 --> 00:58:43,160
Speaker 2: you do all of that within one hundred and two

1223
00:58:43,240 --> 00:58:46,120
Speaker 2: hundred yards, you're gonna find it. Bet it up not

1224
00:58:46,280 --> 00:58:48,640
Speaker 2: that far away, and you have your happy endingg And

1225
00:58:49,080 --> 00:58:51,120
Speaker 2: it worked out as best as it can out of

1226
00:58:51,160 --> 00:58:53,440
Speaker 2: a bad outcome good because I was nervous forer me

1227
00:58:53,560 --> 00:58:58,120
Speaker 2: there as we all are, and that that that thing

1228
00:58:58,240 --> 00:59:01,080
Speaker 2: that's that process is exactly the process we followed, and

1229
00:59:01,120 --> 00:59:04,560
Speaker 2: we found a great, big giant buck on Missus Duran's farm.

1230
00:59:04,560 --> 00:59:06,600
Speaker 2: And it was a happy ending and a little stressful

1231
00:59:06,600 --> 00:59:10,800
Speaker 2: in between. But you never want that situation to be

1232
00:59:10,880 --> 00:59:13,640
Speaker 2: the situation you're in. But once you find yourself there,

1233
00:59:14,000 --> 00:59:17,840
Speaker 2: you have to just do everything you possibly can to

1234
00:59:18,000 --> 00:59:21,080
Speaker 2: end it well. And that's easier than done.

1235
00:59:21,320 --> 00:59:24,040
Speaker 1: We're gonna be one last thing, now, go ahead, you

1236
00:59:24,120 --> 00:59:24,680
Speaker 1: had something.

1237
00:59:24,560 --> 00:59:25,920
Speaker 3: Well, I was just going to weigh in on like

1238
00:59:25,960 --> 00:59:29,480
Speaker 3: a couple quick things there. The thing that we do

1239
00:59:29,560 --> 00:59:31,520
Speaker 3: a lot of times, especially if you're talking about shooting

1240
00:59:31,520 --> 00:59:33,760
Speaker 3: one in the evening right as it's getting dark, is

1241
00:59:33,800 --> 00:59:36,200
Speaker 3: you've got your head lamp with you, and it's easy

1242
00:59:36,240 --> 00:59:40,440
Speaker 3: to just start down that trail with like the wrong stuff.

1243
00:59:40,880 --> 00:59:42,920
Speaker 3: You know, you've got what you have with you. So

1244
00:59:43,000 --> 00:59:45,400
Speaker 3: I started keeping like a blood trailing box in my truck.

1245
00:59:46,040 --> 00:59:49,120
Speaker 3: It forces me to leave go back, like no matter

1246
00:59:49,200 --> 00:59:51,600
Speaker 3: what if I'm not like I smoked him and he's

1247
00:59:51,800 --> 00:59:54,760
Speaker 3: seventy yards away. It forces me to take that moment

1248
00:59:54,800 --> 00:59:57,360
Speaker 3: to get out of the woods. And at the very least,

1249
00:59:57,360 --> 00:59:59,520
Speaker 3: I'm like, I got to go arm up with the

1250
00:59:59,640 --> 01:00:04,840
Speaker 3: right lights batteries. And then the other thing. I think

1251
01:00:04,880 --> 01:00:08,280
Speaker 3: a big mistake people make on a blood trail as

1252
01:00:08,280 --> 01:00:10,840
Speaker 3: they think they need a lot of help. And I

1253
01:00:11,360 --> 01:00:13,520
Speaker 3: kind of equate it to pheasant hunting with a young dog.

1254
01:00:14,280 --> 01:00:17,120
Speaker 3: If you go out into the cattails and there's just

1255
01:00:17,280 --> 01:00:19,919
Speaker 3: you and you have a dog, that dog will set

1256
01:00:19,920 --> 01:00:22,240
Speaker 3: the pace because it knows how to work the cover

1257
01:00:22,280 --> 01:00:25,840
Speaker 3: and it's figuring things out. So you're pacing yourself to

1258
01:00:25,880 --> 01:00:27,960
Speaker 3: that dog. But you get one more person in there,

1259
01:00:28,520 --> 01:00:30,959
Speaker 3: or two more people in that slew, Now everybody wants

1260
01:00:31,000 --> 01:00:34,280
Speaker 3: to be in front because everybody wants to shoot that rooster. Yeah,

1261
01:00:34,320 --> 01:00:36,440
Speaker 3: so then that dog is like shit, they're walking up

1262
01:00:36,480 --> 01:00:39,520
Speaker 3: on me. They're forcing that dog to go faster. So

1263
01:00:39,520 --> 01:00:41,040
Speaker 3: then you get that stuff where that dog gets out

1264
01:00:41,120 --> 01:00:44,160
Speaker 3: works back because they're moving past them, and it changes

1265
01:00:44,200 --> 01:00:48,120
Speaker 3: the entire dynamic of the process. Now you think about

1266
01:00:48,120 --> 01:00:50,440
Speaker 3: a blood trail, now, grid searching is different. Like if

1267
01:00:50,480 --> 01:00:52,640
Speaker 3: you run out of blood and every eyeball you even

1268
01:00:52,680 --> 01:00:56,280
Speaker 3: gets better. But when you get just two people on

1269
01:00:56,360 --> 01:00:58,600
Speaker 3: a blood trail, a real blood trail where you're following

1270
01:00:58,680 --> 01:01:03,520
Speaker 3: actual spore you just fall into. Uh, I found this,

1271
01:01:03,920 --> 01:01:07,240
Speaker 3: he found this time to do circles. He found this.

1272
01:01:07,720 --> 01:01:09,960
Speaker 3: But if you have three, where's that third guy go?

1273
01:01:10,480 --> 01:01:11,840
Speaker 3: He starts walking.

1274
01:01:11,440 --> 01:01:14,160
Speaker 1: Ahead, going and checking at one spot right, and then.

1275
01:01:14,080 --> 01:01:16,120
Speaker 3: You're like, you're like, well, this guy doesn't know the

1276
01:01:16,160 --> 01:01:18,240
Speaker 3: bloodshair like I do, so I want to get ahead

1277
01:01:18,240 --> 01:01:21,880
Speaker 3: of him. And now it becomes a pacing issue where

1278
01:01:21,920 --> 01:01:22,920
Speaker 3: it's just no, boy, no.

1279
01:01:23,120 --> 01:01:26,000
Speaker 4: And everybody wants to everybody wants to be the guy

1280
01:01:26,040 --> 01:01:28,360
Speaker 4: that finds it right here, here's your deal.

1281
01:01:28,400 --> 01:01:31,600
Speaker 3: Well, there's just like a It just changes the pace,

1282
01:01:31,840 --> 01:01:33,080
Speaker 3: and not in a in a good way.

1283
01:01:33,160 --> 01:01:36,200
Speaker 2: The exception is when you're color blind. Yeah, they didn't

1284
01:01:36,200 --> 01:01:36,960
Speaker 2: need a little more help.

1285
01:01:37,080 --> 01:01:39,360
Speaker 3: No, well, right, which is like you fall over the

1286
01:01:39,400 --> 01:01:39,720
Speaker 3: back and.

1287
01:01:42,240 --> 01:01:47,360
Speaker 1: Right, we're gonna do one last thing. Uh. The focus

1288
01:01:47,400 --> 01:01:50,320
Speaker 1: is on making the shot, and then the moments after

1289
01:01:50,360 --> 01:01:53,160
Speaker 1: the shot, we're skipping all that other beautiful white tail stuff.

1290
01:01:54,680 --> 01:01:58,000
Speaker 1: I want a hot tip from each of you. Take

1291
01:01:58,000 --> 01:02:01,840
Speaker 1: your pick on post shot. What everything leading up to

1292
01:02:02,440 --> 01:02:05,480
Speaker 1: everything beginning with you pulling your bow back and ending

1293
01:02:05,520 --> 01:02:07,320
Speaker 1: with you saying like, oh my god, there he is

1294
01:02:08,000 --> 01:02:11,560
Speaker 1: meaning he's dead, found him, any kind of hot tip

1295
01:02:11,600 --> 01:02:14,560
Speaker 1: within that area. Just be prepared.

1296
01:02:14,960 --> 01:02:17,160
Speaker 4: Have the stuff you need to take care of that animal,

1297
01:02:17,200 --> 01:02:21,240
Speaker 4: regardless of the situation that happens between climbing up the

1298
01:02:21,280 --> 01:02:25,120
Speaker 4: tree and finding him at the end. Take this stuff

1299
01:02:25,120 --> 01:02:27,520
Speaker 4: with you that you need to take care to get

1300
01:02:27,560 --> 01:02:29,720
Speaker 4: you to get the animal taken care of, and get

1301
01:02:29,760 --> 01:02:32,720
Speaker 4: you both to the back to the truck. Would be mine.

1302
01:02:33,200 --> 01:02:36,800
Speaker 1: So load it in there, have it be ready. No surprises,

1303
01:02:36,920 --> 01:02:39,400
Speaker 1: no surprises, No damn. I should have brought my knife.

1304
01:02:39,480 --> 01:02:41,400
Speaker 4: I wish I had brought my knife. Should have brought

1305
01:02:41,400 --> 01:02:46,000
Speaker 4: some where's my flashlight? Man?

1306
01:02:48,120 --> 01:02:50,240
Speaker 3: I want to do a pre shot one? Yeah, this

1307
01:02:50,320 --> 01:02:53,680
Speaker 3: has changed, so we're we're a in the white tail

1308
01:02:53,720 --> 01:02:57,840
Speaker 3: space right now. The primary scouting methodist trail cameras very

1309
01:02:57,880 --> 01:03:01,240
Speaker 3: effective in a lot of different ways. Not a substitute

1310
01:03:01,240 --> 01:03:06,840
Speaker 3: for watching deer and so are. The reason that we

1311
01:03:06,880 --> 01:03:08,880
Speaker 3: get buck fever and fall apart bad is there's something

1312
01:03:08,880 --> 01:03:11,600
Speaker 3: we really really want. It means a lot to us,

1313
01:03:11,600 --> 01:03:14,680
Speaker 3: and we are not comfortable around there. Like I always,

1314
01:03:14,800 --> 01:03:16,880
Speaker 3: I always kind of like equate this to like if

1315
01:03:16,920 --> 01:03:18,920
Speaker 3: missus Peterson got hit by a train tomorrow and I

1316
01:03:18,920 --> 01:03:21,720
Speaker 3: had to go into the dating world and Margot Robbie

1317
01:03:21,720 --> 01:03:24,080
Speaker 3: showed up next to me at the buck, I would

1318
01:03:24,080 --> 01:03:27,760
Speaker 3: not be that smooth, Like, I think my odds would

1319
01:03:27,760 --> 01:03:29,600
Speaker 3: be pretty low to begin with, but I don't think

1320
01:03:29,640 --> 01:03:30,480
Speaker 3: i'd help my case in.

1321
01:03:30,560 --> 01:03:32,720
Speaker 1: And then then the next day you'd be sitting there

1322
01:03:32,800 --> 01:03:35,760
Speaker 1: being like, I can't even remember why I said what

1323
01:03:35,800 --> 01:03:36,400
Speaker 1: I said.

1324
01:03:36,440 --> 01:03:42,960
Speaker 3: Right, I just know it didn't work. But so watching deer,

1325
01:03:43,000 --> 01:03:46,040
Speaker 3: that's why I love the long rain scouting thing. Just

1326
01:03:46,080 --> 01:03:50,440
Speaker 3: seeing bucks, it like demystifies what they do. But also

1327
01:03:50,560 --> 01:03:52,560
Speaker 3: when you're sitting in a tree stand and we're we're

1328
01:03:52,560 --> 01:03:55,120
Speaker 3: in this like kind of hit lister mentality, where like

1329
01:03:55,160 --> 01:03:57,280
Speaker 3: I know the bucks that I'm like, I'm gonna shoot

1330
01:03:57,280 --> 01:03:59,120
Speaker 3: because they're worth my tag and this is the effort

1331
01:03:59,160 --> 01:03:59,520
Speaker 3: I put in.

1332
01:03:59,560 --> 01:03:59,880
Speaker 4: Whatever.

1333
01:04:01,120 --> 01:04:04,840
Speaker 3: When you have deer around you and you look at

1334
01:04:04,840 --> 01:04:07,600
Speaker 3: them from a perspective of you were going to shoot them.

1335
01:04:07,600 --> 01:04:09,840
Speaker 3: So that little foky comes in, you'd never kill, but

1336
01:04:09,920 --> 01:04:11,920
Speaker 3: you watch him and he walks in and he turns

1337
01:04:11,960 --> 01:04:15,120
Speaker 3: this way, and where where did your point of impact go?

1338
01:04:15,440 --> 01:04:17,920
Speaker 3: Because he scratched his nose with his back hook? Yep,

1339
01:04:18,080 --> 01:04:20,280
Speaker 3: where did your point of impact go? When he kind

1340
01:04:20,280 --> 01:04:22,320
Speaker 3: of he heard that squirrel behind you and he just

1341
01:04:22,560 --> 01:04:24,919
Speaker 3: made that kind of half body turn.

1342
01:04:25,080 --> 01:04:27,479
Speaker 1: Understood. Yeah, so you're sort of like like, let's play

1343
01:04:27,480 --> 01:04:29,680
Speaker 1: this game, dude. Let's say I did want this buck,

1344
01:04:29,840 --> 01:04:32,040
Speaker 1: So did I really have a shot opportunity?

1345
01:04:32,160 --> 01:04:32,800
Speaker 4: Right? You know what I mean?

1346
01:04:32,880 --> 01:04:35,480
Speaker 3: Yeah, all I think about when a deer's coming in

1347
01:04:35,920 --> 01:04:38,360
Speaker 3: that I know I want to shoot as I'm looking

1348
01:04:38,400 --> 01:04:41,040
Speaker 3: at where my point of impact is. And that's like

1349
01:04:41,400 --> 01:04:44,440
Speaker 3: my little internal computer is always going now it's here, now,

1350
01:04:44,440 --> 01:04:47,280
Speaker 3: it's there, here it is. Stop. He try to stop

1351
01:04:47,320 --> 01:04:50,480
Speaker 3: him and he jumps six feet Like thinking about that

1352
01:04:50,520 --> 01:04:54,080
Speaker 3: because we get so conditioned to just well we aim

1353
01:04:54,800 --> 01:04:58,120
Speaker 3: three inches behind the shoulder, halfway up whatever. But they're

1354
01:04:58,200 --> 01:05:04,080
Speaker 3: three d anim and you're you know, like your aerow trajectory,

1355
01:05:04,160 --> 01:05:07,880
Speaker 3: that wound channel is everything. And if you're thinking about

1356
01:05:07,920 --> 01:05:10,680
Speaker 3: that all the time when you're looking at deer, it

1357
01:05:10,800 --> 01:05:12,960
Speaker 3: just gets you into that mindset of when that big

1358
01:05:13,040 --> 01:05:15,040
Speaker 3: boy starts coming down the trail during the root, You're

1359
01:05:15,240 --> 01:05:17,560
Speaker 3: you're not looking at his antlers. You're not like I

1360
01:05:17,560 --> 01:05:19,360
Speaker 3: gotta get this over with. You're like, where would I

1361
01:05:19,400 --> 01:05:22,720
Speaker 3: shoot him? Like when he hits this window, you're already

1362
01:05:22,760 --> 01:05:25,200
Speaker 3: your eyes are like there's my point of impact and

1363
01:05:25,240 --> 01:05:29,720
Speaker 3: it's rarely, not rarely, but often not three inches behind

1364
01:05:29,720 --> 01:05:31,760
Speaker 3: the shoulder and halfway up, you know what I mean,

1365
01:05:31,800 --> 01:05:33,680
Speaker 3: Like where do I need to run that arrow through?

1366
01:05:34,160 --> 01:05:39,000
Speaker 3: And that's that's something that has really helped me because

1367
01:05:39,040 --> 01:05:41,880
Speaker 3: I look at deer that way. You know, I don't.

1368
01:05:41,880 --> 01:05:43,600
Speaker 3: I'm not drawing and aiming at the dough with a

1369
01:05:43,680 --> 01:05:46,640
Speaker 3: fawn walking by, but I'm looking at her. And then

1370
01:05:47,120 --> 01:05:50,640
Speaker 3: when you do that, because you know, most people probably

1371
01:05:50,640 --> 01:05:53,200
Speaker 3: listening to this aren't doing the they're not hunting out

1372
01:05:53,240 --> 01:05:55,000
Speaker 3: of a saddle in a new spot every night, right,

1373
01:05:55,040 --> 01:05:56,920
Speaker 3: They're going to that ladder stand on the food plot.

1374
01:05:57,280 --> 01:06:00,400
Speaker 3: And so when that foky comes down the trail and

1375
01:06:00,560 --> 01:06:02,720
Speaker 3: you know you're on Instagram because you don't care, and

1376
01:06:02,760 --> 01:06:05,000
Speaker 3: he walks through and you don't pay attention to it, Well,

1377
01:06:05,040 --> 01:06:06,920
Speaker 3: when one hundred and forty incher comes down there, he's

1378
01:06:06,960 --> 01:06:09,560
Speaker 3: doing the same thing that Forky did. Like he's on

1379
01:06:09,600 --> 01:06:11,280
Speaker 3: the same trail and he jumps through the crossing the

1380
01:06:11,320 --> 01:06:13,680
Speaker 3: same way, you know what I mean, And like you're

1381
01:06:13,760 --> 01:06:17,080
Speaker 3: learning that like the minutia of like deer behavior in

1382
01:06:17,120 --> 01:06:21,240
Speaker 3: that spot, and it just changes how you view like

1383
01:06:21,360 --> 01:06:22,840
Speaker 3: the setup to your shot.

1384
01:06:23,120 --> 01:06:23,360
Speaker 4: Yep.

1385
01:06:23,400 --> 01:06:25,640
Speaker 3: And I just think I think we don't spend enough

1386
01:06:25,640 --> 01:06:28,960
Speaker 3: time watching actual deer do actual deer things.

1387
01:06:29,120 --> 01:06:32,040
Speaker 4: God, there's a science behind that, and we used it

1388
01:06:32,080 --> 01:06:35,360
Speaker 4: in law enforcement when we would be clear in the house,

1389
01:06:35,440 --> 01:06:40,400
Speaker 4: just practicing going from stress shooting, and the more you practice,

1390
01:06:41,680 --> 01:06:45,360
Speaker 4: when it becomes second nature in stress level, you always

1391
01:06:45,360 --> 01:06:48,360
Speaker 4: result in stress. In times of stress, you will always

1392
01:06:48,680 --> 01:06:51,960
Speaker 4: resort back to your level of training, whether it's low

1393
01:06:52,240 --> 01:06:57,280
Speaker 4: or whether it's very high. And that's what makes you know,

1394
01:06:57,360 --> 01:07:00,720
Speaker 4: special forces so good because they constantly train, train, training, training,

1395
01:07:00,800 --> 01:07:04,680
Speaker 4: train about different scenarios, but they constantly train about them

1396
01:07:04,720 --> 01:07:07,760
Speaker 4: all the time. And what Tony is saying is is

1397
01:07:07,800 --> 01:07:12,640
Speaker 4: really the same concept. He's looking and watching, looking and watching,

1398
01:07:12,680 --> 01:07:15,400
Speaker 4: looking and watching, and then there's that guy. Then he's

1399
01:07:15,400 --> 01:07:19,520
Speaker 4: looking and watching doing it subconsciously just because he's he's

1400
01:07:19,560 --> 01:07:22,360
Speaker 4: amped up, but he's going back to that level of

1401
01:07:23,280 --> 01:07:25,360
Speaker 4: the stress is taking him back to the highest level

1402
01:07:25,440 --> 01:07:27,680
Speaker 4: of training that he's put hisself through. That's that's a

1403
01:07:27,720 --> 01:07:28,480
Speaker 4: really good deal.

1404
01:07:29,920 --> 01:07:34,400
Speaker 2: So my tip would be something that I say to

1405
01:07:34,480 --> 01:07:38,080
Speaker 2: myself often, like all the time during a hunt or

1406
01:07:38,200 --> 01:07:40,640
Speaker 2: during the hunting season, and that is slow as smooth

1407
01:07:41,080 --> 01:07:44,560
Speaker 2: smooth as fast. I'm constantly trying to remind myself to

1408
01:07:44,600 --> 01:07:47,880
Speaker 2: slow down. For example, when I'm about to head out

1409
01:07:47,880 --> 01:07:52,080
Speaker 2: for hunt, my my uh, my usual default mode is

1410
01:07:52,120 --> 01:07:55,080
Speaker 2: like I'm rushing to get out there, rushing, rushing, rushing.

1411
01:07:55,160 --> 01:07:56,840
Speaker 2: And then you do that and you realize I walked

1412
01:07:56,840 --> 01:07:58,880
Speaker 2: out to the tree and didn't put my saddle on

1413
01:07:59,040 --> 01:08:01,920
Speaker 2: all right, left my release back of the truck or whatever.

1414
01:08:02,360 --> 01:08:05,240
Speaker 2: So I'm always slow down, be smooth. Same thing when

1415
01:08:05,280 --> 01:08:07,360
Speaker 2: you're walking to the tree, slow down, be smooth. Same

1416
01:08:07,360 --> 01:08:09,320
Speaker 2: thing when I'm setting up sticks in the saddle going

1417
01:08:09,320 --> 01:08:10,920
Speaker 2: out of the tree. I'm always wanting to rush. I'm

1418
01:08:10,920 --> 01:08:12,560
Speaker 2: always worried, Oh God, a deer is gonna come up

1419
01:08:12,560 --> 01:08:14,240
Speaker 2: while I'm getting ready. And then as soon as you

1420
01:08:14,240 --> 01:08:16,920
Speaker 2: start trying to rush it, you make mistakes, you make

1421
01:08:16,960 --> 01:08:19,679
Speaker 2: a noise, you end up screwing things up. That slows

1422
01:08:19,720 --> 01:08:21,760
Speaker 2: you down more in the long run. You get into

1423
01:08:21,800 --> 01:08:25,519
Speaker 2: the tree, you want to rush into glassing whatever, or

1424
01:08:25,600 --> 01:08:28,280
Speaker 2: rushing into your phone and doing something on Instagram. But again,

1425
01:08:28,400 --> 01:08:33,080
Speaker 2: slow down, do the visualization, practice everything like I talked about,

1426
01:08:33,640 --> 01:08:37,479
Speaker 2: when the shot comes right, again, slow down, slow down.

1427
01:08:37,600 --> 01:08:39,240
Speaker 2: That's the most important thing for me in the shot

1428
01:08:39,520 --> 01:08:42,240
Speaker 2: processes is slow down, do your thing, don't fly down

1429
01:08:42,280 --> 01:08:45,840
Speaker 2: the roller coaster. After the shot, same thing. The instinct is,

1430
01:08:46,000 --> 01:08:47,280
Speaker 2: I want to go. I want to see the arrow,

1431
01:08:47,320 --> 01:08:48,080
Speaker 2: I want to go find the deer.

1432
01:08:48,120 --> 01:08:49,000
Speaker 3: I want to hold them.

1433
01:08:49,400 --> 01:08:52,080
Speaker 2: Slow as smooth, smooth as fast, slow it down. If

1434
01:08:52,120 --> 01:08:55,479
Speaker 2: you don't rush, you've got a much better chance of

1435
01:08:55,520 --> 01:08:58,240
Speaker 2: the happy ending in the end versus rushing down there

1436
01:08:58,240 --> 01:09:01,280
Speaker 2: and then having a nightmare in your hands. So constantly

1437
01:09:01,479 --> 01:09:02,839
Speaker 2: trying and tell myself that.

1438
01:09:02,680 --> 01:09:07,240
Speaker 3: What and slowest is quiet too and quite important.

1439
01:09:07,240 --> 01:09:10,360
Speaker 1: You need to add that and do the same well,

1440
01:09:10,840 --> 01:09:15,479
Speaker 1: Mark Canyon, Brent Reeves, Tony Peterson. Thanks for the advice.

1441
01:09:15,520 --> 01:09:17,559
Speaker 1: I'm sure people at home will appreciate it. And when

1442
01:09:17,560 --> 01:09:20,360
Speaker 1: everybody gets up in that gets up in that tree

1443
01:09:20,439 --> 01:09:22,880
Speaker 1: or up in that box blind this white tail season,

1444
01:09:23,400 --> 01:09:26,120
Speaker 1: a couple of things to keep in mind. Thanks guys,