1 00:00:00,200 --> 00:00:03,120 Speaker 1: Matt back in the day. Uh you, You and I 2 00:00:03,200 --> 00:00:07,440 Speaker 1: got pretty uh pretty weirded out by this one. Sony 3 00:00:07,560 --> 00:00:10,639 Speaker 1: got hacked and we had to we We were lucky 4 00:00:10,720 --> 00:00:14,319 Speaker 1: enough to be able to ask our our colleague friend 5 00:00:14,320 --> 00:00:18,200 Speaker 1: of the show Tech Stuff host and creator Jonathan Strickland 6 00:00:18,600 --> 00:00:23,040 Speaker 1: to talk a little bit more about what really went 7 00:00:23,079 --> 00:00:25,400 Speaker 1: down with the Sony hack. And you know, it's interesting. 8 00:00:25,760 --> 00:00:28,760 Speaker 1: I think having Jonathan on is why this became a 9 00:00:28,800 --> 00:00:32,680 Speaker 1: two parter um. What why Why did you say that 10 00:00:35,200 --> 00:00:37,040 Speaker 1: he had a lot to cover? He had a lot 11 00:00:37,080 --> 00:00:40,199 Speaker 1: to cover. There's so much ground to cover here on 12 00:00:40,360 --> 00:00:43,240 Speaker 1: exactly how the heck happened? What the heck is? Why 13 00:00:43,640 --> 00:00:45,800 Speaker 1: you know what the allegations are of why it occurred, 14 00:00:45,840 --> 00:00:47,519 Speaker 1: and how does it have to do with this weird 15 00:00:47,680 --> 00:00:52,239 Speaker 1: movie called The Interview. Does anybody remember that movie? I'm 16 00:00:52,240 --> 00:00:53,920 Speaker 1: pretty sure you can watch it right now if you 17 00:00:53,960 --> 00:00:57,240 Speaker 1: want to on a streaming service. Yeah, we'd recommend it. 18 00:00:57,320 --> 00:01:01,160 Speaker 1: Check out the movie. Just see see why I watched 19 00:01:01,200 --> 00:01:06,360 Speaker 1: The Interview entirely because of this episode and why I 20 00:01:06,400 --> 00:01:09,919 Speaker 1: watched it as well. Also, Seth Rogan has a special 21 00:01:09,920 --> 00:01:13,760 Speaker 1: place in my heart from UFOs two Ghosts and Government 22 00:01:13,840 --> 00:01:17,600 Speaker 1: cover Ups. History is riddled with unexplained events. You can 23 00:01:17,600 --> 00:01:20,440 Speaker 1: turn back now or learn the stuff they don't want 24 00:01:20,480 --> 00:01:28,800 Speaker 1: you to now. Hello, ladies and gentlemen, I'm Ben. We've 25 00:01:28,840 --> 00:01:31,759 Speaker 1: got our super producer, Noel is always on the ones 26 00:01:31,800 --> 00:01:35,000 Speaker 1: and twos. But that's not all right. Yeah, we got Matt. 27 00:01:35,080 --> 00:01:38,400 Speaker 1: I'm the guy who's here who listens mostly and sometimes 28 00:01:38,440 --> 00:01:41,319 Speaker 1: fills in. But we've got one other person been. Yes, 29 00:01:41,400 --> 00:01:45,320 Speaker 1: our very special guest. Ladies and gentlemen, give it up. 30 00:01:45,360 --> 00:01:47,000 Speaker 1: I don't care where you are. Clap. If you're in 31 00:01:47,000 --> 00:01:49,800 Speaker 1: a place where you can't clap, you shouldn't be there anyway. Anyhow, 32 00:01:49,920 --> 00:01:53,559 Speaker 1: Clap and cheer for our friends. Special guest, resident tech 33 00:01:53,680 --> 00:01:59,960 Speaker 1: expert and host of numerous how Stuff Work shows, Jonathan Strickland. Hey, 34 00:02:00,760 --> 00:02:03,040 Speaker 1: it's a it's a pleasure to be on the show. 35 00:02:03,440 --> 00:02:05,680 Speaker 1: I love this show. I am so glad to be 36 00:02:05,720 --> 00:02:11,800 Speaker 1: on this show. You are distorting my voice, right, yeah, okay, alright, 37 00:02:11,960 --> 00:02:14,520 Speaker 1: Just I mean, I know you said my name so clearly. 38 00:02:14,560 --> 00:02:17,760 Speaker 1: My identity is already out there, but I it would 39 00:02:17,800 --> 00:02:21,560 Speaker 1: just made me feel a little more, you know, comfortable. Sure, Yeah, Now, 40 00:02:21,639 --> 00:02:23,760 Speaker 1: the reason we have Jonathan on the show. Yeah, I'm 41 00:02:23,840 --> 00:02:26,799 Speaker 1: dying to hear this. You are our tech expert. You're 42 00:02:26,840 --> 00:02:28,519 Speaker 1: the guy that Ben and I go to when we've 43 00:02:28,560 --> 00:02:32,640 Speaker 1: got something pressing, recovering something that is tech heavy, because 44 00:02:32,680 --> 00:02:35,200 Speaker 1: you know your stuff. Buddy, I follow, I follow the 45 00:02:35,200 --> 00:02:38,639 Speaker 1: tech news, that's right, and and today we're covering something 46 00:02:39,080 --> 00:02:45,040 Speaker 1: really tech heavy. The hack attacks were perpetrated against Sony 47 00:02:45,040 --> 00:02:49,560 Speaker 1: Pictures Entertainment most recently, not the two thousand and eleven attacks, yes, 48 00:02:49,760 --> 00:02:52,680 Speaker 1: or the attacks on the Sony network, the PlayStation network, 49 00:02:53,680 --> 00:02:55,360 Speaker 1: or any of the other ones like you were mentioning 50 00:02:55,360 --> 00:03:00,680 Speaker 1: the Microsoft right, sorry, um, inft picular the ones on 51 00:03:00,720 --> 00:03:05,239 Speaker 1: Sony Pictures Entertainment because it has had some weirdly far 52 00:03:05,320 --> 00:03:09,800 Speaker 1: reaching consequences. Yeah, and we're just gonna kind of go 53 00:03:09,919 --> 00:03:12,520 Speaker 1: over I don't mean to co opt this, by the way, 54 00:03:12,560 --> 00:03:14,920 Speaker 1: but we're just gonna go over uh kind of a 55 00:03:14,919 --> 00:03:18,600 Speaker 1: timeline of events and uh, just kind of look at 56 00:03:18,680 --> 00:03:22,520 Speaker 1: what happened, what we know so far and the effects. 57 00:03:22,840 --> 00:03:26,519 Speaker 1: Sounds great. Yeah, I I have followed the Sony story 58 00:03:27,280 --> 00:03:29,240 Speaker 1: quite a bit, and I am interested to hear what 59 00:03:29,360 --> 00:03:32,240 Speaker 1: you guys have to think about. You know this, this 60 00:03:32,280 --> 00:03:34,480 Speaker 1: is a big one, right, This is a big story 61 00:03:34,520 --> 00:03:37,840 Speaker 1: for multiple reasons, not just the extent of the attack, 62 00:03:37,880 --> 00:03:40,840 Speaker 1: which I'm sure you guys will get into, but also, 63 00:03:41,000 --> 00:03:44,000 Speaker 1: like you were saying that the consequences of that attack, 64 00:03:44,080 --> 00:03:48,360 Speaker 1: how it's it's affecting everything from business decisions, which you 65 00:03:48,480 --> 00:03:52,000 Speaker 1: might call draconian or cold hearted, depending upon your perspective. 66 00:03:52,640 --> 00:03:58,800 Speaker 1: It's it's really opening up yet another UH avenue for 67 00:03:58,960 --> 00:04:05,720 Speaker 1: the criticism of unequal compensation in the workplace. This is 68 00:04:05,760 --> 00:04:08,480 Speaker 1: something that has been a scene throughout two thousand fourteen 69 00:04:08,760 --> 00:04:12,080 Speaker 1: in the tech sector and elsewhere. Uh. There are a 70 00:04:12,120 --> 00:04:14,800 Speaker 1: lot of themes that are all wrapped up in this 71 00:04:14,920 --> 00:04:17,240 Speaker 1: one story. So thank you very much for having me 72 00:04:17,279 --> 00:04:20,800 Speaker 1: on for this one. Are you kidding? No, I'm not kidding. 73 00:04:20,800 --> 00:04:22,880 Speaker 1: If I were a kidding, I would say, hey, North Korea, 74 00:04:22,960 --> 00:04:26,599 Speaker 1: bring it on. I am kidding. Well, technically, the name 75 00:04:26,720 --> 00:04:30,320 Speaker 1: of North Korea is the Democratic People's Republic of Korea. 76 00:04:30,520 --> 00:04:34,720 Speaker 1: It's a country that's slightly smaller than Mississippi. Uh. South 77 00:04:34,839 --> 00:04:37,200 Speaker 1: Korea is actually a little bit smaller than North Korea, 78 00:04:37,400 --> 00:04:41,800 Speaker 1: but has double the population. If you have watched the 79 00:04:41,839 --> 00:04:44,800 Speaker 1: news in the past few years, then you probably know 80 00:04:44,920 --> 00:04:47,640 Speaker 1: North Korea is the thing that pops up with a 81 00:04:47,880 --> 00:04:52,800 Speaker 1: some kind of bellicost hyperbolic threat about reigning fire and 82 00:04:53,560 --> 00:04:56,480 Speaker 1: their nuclear their nuclear work is something that garnered a 83 00:04:56,520 --> 00:04:58,679 Speaker 1: lot of attention here in the West. Yeah, and also 84 00:04:58,880 --> 00:05:02,640 Speaker 1: they have a have of doing things like missile tests. Well, 85 00:05:02,720 --> 00:05:07,520 Speaker 1: perhaps there are other things going on in the Pacific area. Um, 86 00:05:07,600 --> 00:05:11,400 Speaker 1: there's also and you see this kind of of increase 87 00:05:11,640 --> 00:05:14,880 Speaker 1: in I guess, I mean it's almost like showmanship. It's 88 00:05:14,960 --> 00:05:18,560 Speaker 1: it's not quite aggression. It's kind of very Cold War 89 00:05:18,720 --> 00:05:21,479 Speaker 1: era kind of stuff where North Korea will put on 90 00:05:21,520 --> 00:05:24,360 Speaker 1: a demonstration and then the United States will hold war 91 00:05:24,480 --> 00:05:28,000 Speaker 1: games in that area in that region, or North Korea 92 00:05:28,040 --> 00:05:31,000 Speaker 1: will warn against war games and then after they happened, 93 00:05:31,040 --> 00:05:35,280 Speaker 1: then put on a demonstration. And so it's a very odd, 94 00:05:35,560 --> 00:05:40,200 Speaker 1: sort of almost cartoonish relationship here. Like if you were 95 00:05:40,240 --> 00:05:43,080 Speaker 1: to explain to this to someone who had no knowledge 96 00:05:43,720 --> 00:05:46,599 Speaker 1: about relations between North Korea and the rest of the world, 97 00:05:47,080 --> 00:05:49,160 Speaker 1: they would think you were talking about some sort of 98 00:05:49,279 --> 00:05:54,479 Speaker 1: fantasy novel Dr. Seuss book. Maybe, because one interesting fact 99 00:05:54,520 --> 00:05:57,600 Speaker 1: that some people don't know is that North Korea never 100 00:05:57,680 --> 00:06:01,320 Speaker 1: officially made peace after it is known as the Korean War. 101 00:06:01,360 --> 00:06:03,840 Speaker 1: In the West, there is a ceasefire which holds, which 102 00:06:03,839 --> 00:06:05,880 Speaker 1: is why we have a d m Z, which is 103 00:06:05,880 --> 00:06:09,360 Speaker 1: a lovely little spot of biodiversity actually on the Korean peninsula. 104 00:06:09,839 --> 00:06:12,120 Speaker 1: We say all this just to say that it is 105 00:06:12,880 --> 00:06:16,000 Speaker 1: and has been, since the close of the war, remarkably 106 00:06:16,120 --> 00:06:20,720 Speaker 1: tense situation between most of the rest of the world 107 00:06:21,240 --> 00:06:27,040 Speaker 1: and the world's only patrilineal communist dictatorship. I think I 108 00:06:27,120 --> 00:06:31,920 Speaker 1: think North Korea and China are kind of buddies, right, 109 00:06:32,120 --> 00:06:36,040 Speaker 1: but pretty much no one else. Um. Yeah, and did 110 00:06:36,080 --> 00:06:39,640 Speaker 1: you know trivia, one of the world's most dangerous golf courses, 111 00:06:40,640 --> 00:06:43,640 Speaker 1: butts up against the d m Z, so you do 112 00:06:43,640 --> 00:06:47,400 Speaker 1: not want to knock the ball out of bounds? Tea 113 00:06:47,480 --> 00:06:49,520 Speaker 1: games so much more interesting? Yeah? You thought the ones 114 00:06:49,560 --> 00:06:52,280 Speaker 1: in Florida with alligators were bad? Yeah? I really want 115 00:06:52,279 --> 00:06:54,240 Speaker 1: to know the rules, like the standing rules for if 116 00:06:54,279 --> 00:06:57,320 Speaker 1: ball goes past this point, you just you call it 117 00:06:57,360 --> 00:06:59,200 Speaker 1: out of bounds and you play it again. Is there 118 00:06:59,240 --> 00:07:04,360 Speaker 1: just as then? Yeah? I don't know anymore to tell. 119 00:07:05,880 --> 00:07:08,840 Speaker 1: Let's get back to the hacking. So yeah, so funny 120 00:07:08,839 --> 00:07:14,800 Speaker 1: thing happens June eleven. Well funny, maybe it depends on 121 00:07:14,840 --> 00:07:17,520 Speaker 1: your taste in comedy. What are we talking about? Talking about? 122 00:07:17,520 --> 00:07:20,480 Speaker 1: The trailer for the film The Interview, which is a 123 00:07:21,200 --> 00:07:25,200 Speaker 1: film starring Seth Rogan and uh and what's his face 124 00:07:25,280 --> 00:07:29,520 Speaker 1: the Franco, Right, James Franco and Uh. Premise of the 125 00:07:29,560 --> 00:07:34,720 Speaker 1: film is that you've got a celebrity talk show host guy. 126 00:07:34,880 --> 00:07:37,200 Speaker 1: He has. He does this show where it's essentially he 127 00:07:37,240 --> 00:07:40,200 Speaker 1: sits down with other like celebrities and has a conversation 128 00:07:40,240 --> 00:07:44,360 Speaker 1: with them, very fluffy stuff and uh and his producer 129 00:07:44,640 --> 00:07:47,800 Speaker 1: is about to dump him to go do bigger, better 130 00:07:47,840 --> 00:07:51,840 Speaker 1: things when they get word that Kim jongoon, the current 131 00:07:52,000 --> 00:07:54,840 Speaker 1: leader of North Korea, is a huge fan of the 132 00:07:54,880 --> 00:07:58,040 Speaker 1: show and wants them to come and interview him. And 133 00:07:58,120 --> 00:08:01,360 Speaker 1: that allows James Franco's after who is the host, to 134 00:08:01,400 --> 00:08:04,040 Speaker 1: hold on to Seth Rogan who's his producer, and go 135 00:08:04,160 --> 00:08:07,440 Speaker 1: over there. Meanwhile, they are contacted by the United States 136 00:08:07,480 --> 00:08:09,880 Speaker 1: government and told, hey, while you're over there, if you 137 00:08:09,880 --> 00:08:12,600 Speaker 1: could just do us a solid and kill Kim Jong 138 00:08:12,720 --> 00:08:16,000 Speaker 1: un while you're there, that would be great. And then 139 00:08:16,120 --> 00:08:19,880 Speaker 1: hilarity is supposed to ensue. Right in theory, this is 140 00:08:19,920 --> 00:08:23,880 Speaker 1: a comedy, Yes, just interesting trivia. Here. I was listening 141 00:08:23,920 --> 00:08:27,480 Speaker 1: to Howard Stern interview with Seth Rogan and he you know, 142 00:08:27,480 --> 00:08:29,600 Speaker 1: because he wrote it or co wrote it, I guess, 143 00:08:29,880 --> 00:08:31,680 Speaker 1: and he was saying that it was initially supposed to 144 00:08:31,680 --> 00:08:35,000 Speaker 1: be Kim Jong Ill was the bad guy that they're 145 00:08:35,000 --> 00:08:37,600 Speaker 1: supposed to go assassinate, but when he died, they changed 146 00:08:37,640 --> 00:08:42,040 Speaker 1: it over. And so when we move forward to June ten, 147 00:08:42,160 --> 00:08:45,559 Speaker 1: we start seeing some signals from the North Korean government, 148 00:08:45,600 --> 00:08:48,480 Speaker 1: isn't that right? Yeah, there was a reaction from a 149 00:08:48,520 --> 00:08:52,800 Speaker 1: North Korean official. I don't want to butcher his name, 150 00:08:52,960 --> 00:08:59,000 Speaker 1: so I'm just tell you Kim Mung Choi, Yeah, Young, 151 00:08:59,720 --> 00:09:02,520 Speaker 1: that was John at the well, Kim Young Choi says, 152 00:09:03,320 --> 00:09:05,880 Speaker 1: this is a quote. There's a special irony in this 153 00:09:05,920 --> 00:09:08,440 Speaker 1: storyline as it shows the desperation of the U. S. 154 00:09:08,480 --> 00:09:11,720 Speaker 1: Government and American society. A film about the assassination of 155 00:09:11,720 --> 00:09:13,719 Speaker 1: a foreign leader mirrors what the U. S has done 156 00:09:13,720 --> 00:09:17,160 Speaker 1: in Afghanistan, Iraq, Syria and Ukraine. And let us not 157 00:09:17,240 --> 00:09:23,000 Speaker 1: forget who killed Kennedy. Americans from North Korea. Yeah, and 158 00:09:23,040 --> 00:09:27,720 Speaker 1: this is actually kind of the norm for their diplomatic tone. 159 00:09:28,640 --> 00:09:30,800 Speaker 1: That's an interesting way of putting it. Yes, that our 160 00:09:30,840 --> 00:09:36,640 Speaker 1: diplomatic tone, they're diplomatic. It sometimes lacks diplomacy, but yes, yeah, 161 00:09:36,679 --> 00:09:39,760 Speaker 1: so this is uh Matt as you have said in 162 00:09:39,840 --> 00:09:42,440 Speaker 1: these wonderful notes. Uh, that's not the first time the 163 00:09:42,480 --> 00:09:44,959 Speaker 1: North Korean government played a part of antagonist in a 164 00:09:45,000 --> 00:09:47,640 Speaker 1: Hollywood film. Yeah, there were several others. There was a 165 00:09:47,760 --> 00:09:50,920 Speaker 1: James Bond movie where in North Korea, I guess was 166 00:09:50,960 --> 00:09:54,680 Speaker 1: the bad guy. Um, and then, like you said, Team America, 167 00:09:55,200 --> 00:09:58,079 Speaker 1: which is still one of my favorite movies. And then 168 00:09:58,120 --> 00:10:00,400 Speaker 1: there's that remake of Red Dawn, which I still have 169 00:10:00,480 --> 00:10:03,040 Speaker 1: not seen well. And the interesting thing there was that 170 00:10:03,440 --> 00:10:05,920 Speaker 1: the original villains and Red Dawn were to beat China, 171 00:10:06,440 --> 00:10:09,240 Speaker 1: but the decision was made to switch China to North Korea, 172 00:10:09,320 --> 00:10:15,120 Speaker 1: and of course for the reason that everyone would suspecting money. Yeah, 173 00:10:15,240 --> 00:10:20,440 Speaker 1: China is an enormous market for United States films, but 174 00:10:20,679 --> 00:10:22,800 Speaker 1: if they were to make China the bad guy, that 175 00:10:23,080 --> 00:10:28,880 Speaker 1: endangered that entire market. Plus there's this incredibly incestuous relationship 176 00:10:28,960 --> 00:10:32,200 Speaker 1: with Hollywood and Beijing that we could go into, but 177 00:10:32,280 --> 00:10:35,360 Speaker 1: it's not really relevant here. But any rate, North Korea 178 00:10:35,400 --> 00:10:37,120 Speaker 1: became the bad guys in that film because of that, 179 00:10:37,360 --> 00:10:41,920 Speaker 1: and so this president exists on both sides. But by 180 00:10:42,080 --> 00:10:46,760 Speaker 1: July of we have North Korean Ambassador to the U 181 00:10:46,920 --> 00:10:50,240 Speaker 1: n Ja Song Nam, right into Bon Ki Moon, who, 182 00:10:50,559 --> 00:10:53,600 Speaker 1: as you know, is the South Korean head of the 183 00:10:53,760 --> 00:10:57,360 Speaker 1: u N at this time, and uh he makes uh 184 00:10:57,480 --> 00:11:00,320 Speaker 1: the North Korean ambassador is makes a really great point 185 00:11:00,760 --> 00:11:05,160 Speaker 1: in the following quotation to allow the production and distribution 186 00:11:05,360 --> 00:11:08,079 Speaker 1: of such a film on the assassination of an incumbent 187 00:11:08,120 --> 00:11:10,520 Speaker 1: head of a sovereign state should be regarded as the 188 00:11:10,559 --> 00:11:14,040 Speaker 1: most undisguised sponsoring of terrorism as well as an act 189 00:11:14,120 --> 00:11:16,960 Speaker 1: of war. The United States authorities should take immediate and 190 00:11:17,000 --> 00:11:20,120 Speaker 1: appropriate actions to ban the production and distribution of the 191 00:11:20,120 --> 00:11:24,120 Speaker 1: aforementioned film, otherwise it will be fully responsible for encouraging 192 00:11:24,160 --> 00:11:30,160 Speaker 1: and sponsoring terrorism. Now, clearly, if the United States government 193 00:11:30,200 --> 00:11:33,400 Speaker 1: did engage in such things, that would immediately be a 194 00:11:33,440 --> 00:11:37,320 Speaker 1: case of censorship in the United States, we generally consider 195 00:11:37,600 --> 00:11:40,640 Speaker 1: to be something we're not supposed to engage in on 196 00:11:40,679 --> 00:11:44,240 Speaker 1: a governmental level. And let's also not forget that the 197 00:11:44,240 --> 00:11:49,920 Speaker 1: West is home to so many parody films. The things 198 00:11:50,000 --> 00:11:55,240 Speaker 1: that have been done on film fictionally to every single 199 00:11:55,400 --> 00:11:59,520 Speaker 1: president except for maybe Harding, his career didn't really take off. 200 00:12:00,120 --> 00:12:03,000 Speaker 1: But man, the fun we had with Taft, the fun 201 00:12:03,440 --> 00:12:06,560 Speaker 1: we're still having with Taft. So what, I guess what 202 00:12:06,559 --> 00:12:10,880 Speaker 1: we're saying is that there is a degree of perception 203 00:12:10,960 --> 00:12:15,240 Speaker 1: at play here. You know, remember when Borat, Now this 204 00:12:15,320 --> 00:12:18,560 Speaker 1: was not a US film, but when Borat came out right, uh, 205 00:12:18,679 --> 00:12:23,440 Speaker 1: Kazakhstan was not happy with the way that the Kazakh 206 00:12:23,480 --> 00:12:29,680 Speaker 1: people were portrayed, which makes sense, but they didn't threaten um, well, 207 00:12:29,679 --> 00:12:32,600 Speaker 1: they didn't call it terrorism but there But also this 208 00:12:32,640 --> 00:12:36,080 Speaker 1: point here is really interesting. Is this a situation where 209 00:12:36,120 --> 00:12:39,760 Speaker 1: there's a definite wronger right or is this opinion? I 210 00:12:39,800 --> 00:12:42,400 Speaker 1: think it's a little strong to call it an active terrorism. 211 00:12:42,679 --> 00:12:44,680 Speaker 1: Well I do too, But then again, we live in 212 00:12:44,679 --> 00:12:47,800 Speaker 1: a country where we have entertainment where presidents have been 213 00:12:48,200 --> 00:12:52,079 Speaker 1: assassinated as part of the story. You know, there are 214 00:12:52,120 --> 00:12:55,960 Speaker 1: the Death of a President film or or twenty four 215 00:12:56,240 --> 00:12:59,439 Speaker 1: which has had that happen. I mean spoilers. Man, Okay, 216 00:12:59,440 --> 00:13:04,040 Speaker 1: I didn't say season right, They're like, I haven't seen 217 00:13:04,040 --> 00:13:07,800 Speaker 1: twenty four. In twenty four is an active sitting president, 218 00:13:08,040 --> 00:13:12,040 Speaker 1: Like that is actually really sitting assassinated he's actually standing 219 00:13:12,080 --> 00:13:17,439 Speaker 1: at the time a A. So, okay, is it Barack Obama? No? No, 220 00:13:19,720 --> 00:13:23,160 Speaker 1: But we're talking about an actual human being that is 221 00:13:23,280 --> 00:13:27,000 Speaker 1: in office, right, So we're seeing that there is an 222 00:13:27,000 --> 00:13:34,120 Speaker 1: international well a national outcry from another nation that this film, 223 00:13:34,160 --> 00:13:35,959 Speaker 1: you know, we don't want this film to go forward. 224 00:13:36,000 --> 00:13:39,680 Speaker 1: Is essentially what North three is saying. And I don't 225 00:13:39,679 --> 00:13:42,720 Speaker 1: know really what the I can't say at least what 226 00:13:42,880 --> 00:13:45,920 Speaker 1: the pressures were at least from our government or from 227 00:13:46,320 --> 00:13:49,680 Speaker 1: the U N or anything on Sony to censor the 228 00:13:49,679 --> 00:13:52,880 Speaker 1: film in anyway, if any at all. But we do 229 00:13:52,960 --> 00:13:56,160 Speaker 1: know that the theatrical release of the interview got pushed 230 00:13:56,160 --> 00:14:01,240 Speaker 1: back from October to December twenty Christmas day. Um, not 231 00:14:01,600 --> 00:14:04,720 Speaker 1: long after this little less than a month after this, 232 00:14:04,760 --> 00:14:09,559 Speaker 1: it was officially pushed back. Um. Now here's where it's 233 00:14:09,559 --> 00:14:12,760 Speaker 1: a little interesting to me. Uh. There there were official 234 00:14:13,120 --> 00:14:15,600 Speaker 1: edits going on at Sony of the film where they 235 00:14:15,600 --> 00:14:18,840 Speaker 1: were digitally changing the buttons that were worn by the 236 00:14:18,840 --> 00:14:23,120 Speaker 1: North Korean soldiers because originally they were actually showing, um, 237 00:14:23,160 --> 00:14:25,640 Speaker 1: the buttons that are worn in reality by North Korean 238 00:14:25,680 --> 00:14:28,840 Speaker 1: soldiers that commemorate Kim Jong ill and Kim Jong oon. 239 00:14:29,440 --> 00:14:33,680 Speaker 1: And uh. Sony was officially stating that these buttons were 240 00:14:34,280 --> 00:14:38,480 Speaker 1: a clearance problem, that's why they were changing them. Um, 241 00:14:38,480 --> 00:14:41,800 Speaker 1: but it was known that this was kind of blasphemy 242 00:14:41,920 --> 00:14:45,080 Speaker 1: to show this on film. At least to North Korean's 243 00:14:45,520 --> 00:14:49,760 Speaker 1: North Korea's view, well, sure, because in the in the 244 00:14:50,000 --> 00:14:55,920 Speaker 1: culture of North Korea, the leaders are exalted, deified even 245 00:14:56,240 --> 00:14:59,640 Speaker 1: and if you've seen some of the interviews or documentaries 246 00:14:59,680 --> 00:15:02,560 Speaker 1: about the I'm I've been fastening with North Korea for 247 00:15:02,560 --> 00:15:05,000 Speaker 1: a long time, Matt. You know, so I so stopped 248 00:15:05,000 --> 00:15:07,760 Speaker 1: me if I start talking about irrelevant stuff. Please keeping 249 00:15:07,880 --> 00:15:11,200 Speaker 1: you guys youtune all all right, So there are practices 250 00:15:11,240 --> 00:15:13,880 Speaker 1: that might seem very strange to people from outside of 251 00:15:13,880 --> 00:15:17,640 Speaker 1: this culture, such as um, you know, we have this 252 00:15:18,240 --> 00:15:21,480 Speaker 1: old picture of Nikola Tesla here in the studio, right. 253 00:15:22,400 --> 00:15:26,440 Speaker 1: If he were you know, Kim Jong il or Kim 254 00:15:26,480 --> 00:15:28,480 Speaker 1: Il sung, and we were in North Korea, we would 255 00:15:28,480 --> 00:15:30,760 Speaker 1: have a picture like that in every house, and we 256 00:15:30,760 --> 00:15:33,200 Speaker 1: would also have a button that everyone has to wear. 257 00:15:33,680 --> 00:15:36,560 Speaker 1: So it is, it is a really really big deal, 258 00:15:36,640 --> 00:15:39,400 Speaker 1: and Sony was probably smart to alter them. But I 259 00:15:39,440 --> 00:15:43,960 Speaker 1: don't think that changes how offensive it would still be, right, Yeah, 260 00:15:44,000 --> 00:15:47,240 Speaker 1: I mean it's kind of like saying the To me, 261 00:15:47,320 --> 00:15:50,320 Speaker 1: it's the same thing as as leading up to but 262 00:15:50,440 --> 00:15:54,520 Speaker 1: not saying a curse word. Right, you don't say it, 263 00:15:54,960 --> 00:15:57,920 Speaker 1: but the people who hear you know what you were intending. 264 00:15:58,000 --> 00:16:01,600 Speaker 1: And they think it anyway. So yeah, like somehow that 265 00:16:01,600 --> 00:16:05,040 Speaker 1: that that ends up exonerating you of offending other people. Know, 266 00:16:05,200 --> 00:16:07,280 Speaker 1: that doesn't because actually what you've done has made the 267 00:16:07,280 --> 00:16:09,880 Speaker 1: other person do the work for you. Actually, Louis c. 268 00:16:10,000 --> 00:16:13,760 Speaker 1: K has a great bit about that in my head. Yeah, 269 00:16:14,120 --> 00:16:16,560 Speaker 1: so so it's the same sort of thing, right, Like, 270 00:16:16,680 --> 00:16:18,960 Speaker 1: if you see it, even if you know it's been altered, 271 00:16:19,000 --> 00:16:21,200 Speaker 1: you know what the original intent was. And so it's 272 00:16:21,240 --> 00:16:24,480 Speaker 1: not like that somehow magically erases the intent. There was 273 00:16:24,520 --> 00:16:28,160 Speaker 1: also the story about how and here's a spoiler alert 274 00:16:28,400 --> 00:16:32,040 Speaker 1: for anyone who plans to see the interview because breaking news, 275 00:16:32,320 --> 00:16:34,160 Speaker 1: there are a couple of places where you might actually 276 00:16:34,160 --> 00:16:37,520 Speaker 1: get a chance to do that. But spoiler alert. There 277 00:16:37,680 --> 00:16:40,720 Speaker 1: is a scene in the movie in which the leader 278 00:16:40,800 --> 00:16:44,280 Speaker 1: Kim Jong un is actually killed and uh, it's a 279 00:16:44,520 --> 00:16:47,560 Speaker 1: I believe he's in a helicopter that is struck by 280 00:16:47,720 --> 00:16:52,840 Speaker 1: a very powerful explosive. Looks like a tank round. Yeah, 281 00:16:52,840 --> 00:16:56,400 Speaker 1: it looks like a tank round. And so then there 282 00:16:56,640 --> 00:16:59,880 Speaker 1: is the sequence of Kim jongun dying by being blown 283 00:17:00,080 --> 00:17:04,399 Speaker 1: up in slow motion, and that one of the things 284 00:17:04,440 --> 00:17:07,080 Speaker 1: we learned as a result of all the stuff we're 285 00:17:07,080 --> 00:17:10,399 Speaker 1: about to talk about is that there was a whole 286 00:17:10,560 --> 00:17:14,400 Speaker 1: series of changes that were dictated by the by Sony 287 00:17:14,640 --> 00:17:21,320 Speaker 1: to to Seth Rogan, who very clearly was getting uh 288 00:17:21,440 --> 00:17:23,800 Speaker 1: exasperated by all the changes towards the end of it 289 00:17:23,880 --> 00:17:27,760 Speaker 1: to make it less and less graphic. So they're watering 290 00:17:27,800 --> 00:17:30,520 Speaker 1: it down. And as as we know, and as you 291 00:17:30,600 --> 00:17:34,480 Speaker 1: probably know, two listeners, often when people attempt to make 292 00:17:34,600 --> 00:17:37,400 Speaker 1: those kinds of series of compromises, what they end up 293 00:17:37,400 --> 00:17:40,439 Speaker 1: doing is making something they didn't want to make in 294 00:17:40,480 --> 00:17:43,600 Speaker 1: the beginning. Hey guys, I feel like I'm just playing 295 00:17:43,640 --> 00:17:47,680 Speaker 1: the interrupted guy this whole thing. I'm sorry, but we 296 00:17:47,680 --> 00:17:49,240 Speaker 1: we do need to take a break just for a 297 00:17:49,280 --> 00:17:51,359 Speaker 1: moment to hear a word from our sponsors, so we 298 00:17:51,400 --> 00:18:03,280 Speaker 1: will be right back. So we know that it is 299 00:18:03,320 --> 00:18:08,720 Speaker 1: retroactively revealed around November twenty one, h that some top 300 00:18:08,880 --> 00:18:13,680 Speaker 1: execs at Sony's are getting these emails with ransom requests 301 00:18:13,720 --> 00:18:18,440 Speaker 1: pretty much right. Yeah, it was something that the executives 302 00:18:18,480 --> 00:18:22,720 Speaker 1: didn't take very seriously, I guess because this was a 303 00:18:22,760 --> 00:18:27,400 Speaker 1: couple of days before the big hit occurred. Um, and 304 00:18:27,520 --> 00:18:31,000 Speaker 1: I've just gotten excerpt from one of the alleged emails. 305 00:18:31,400 --> 00:18:34,560 Speaker 1: It said notice to Sony Pictures Entertainment. We've got great 306 00:18:34,640 --> 00:18:38,800 Speaker 1: damage by Sony Pictures. The compensation for it, monetary compensation. 307 00:18:38,920 --> 00:18:41,800 Speaker 1: We want pay the damage or Sony Pictures will be 308 00:18:41,880 --> 00:18:46,159 Speaker 1: bombarded as a whole. And in November, sources at Sony 309 00:18:46,240 --> 00:18:48,719 Speaker 1: go public with the hack. They have been hacked by 310 00:18:48,760 --> 00:18:54,000 Speaker 1: a group called Guardians of Peace or GOP, but a 311 00:18:54,040 --> 00:18:58,560 Speaker 1: different one. That's also another reference to well anyway, we'll 312 00:18:58,600 --> 00:19:02,199 Speaker 1: get into it. Yeah, And you can find uh screen 313 00:19:02,200 --> 00:19:05,960 Speaker 1: grabs of an allegedly hat Sony terminal online. It's got 314 00:19:06,000 --> 00:19:08,760 Speaker 1: red skeleton background the following message, Jonathan, could you do 315 00:19:08,800 --> 00:19:13,320 Speaker 1: this like an evil voice warning? We've already warned you, 316 00:19:13,880 --> 00:19:18,399 Speaker 1: and this is just a beginning. We continue till our 317 00:19:18,440 --> 00:19:23,359 Speaker 1: request be met. We've obtained all your internal data, including 318 00:19:23,400 --> 00:19:29,040 Speaker 1: your secrets and top secrets. If you don't obey, us 319 00:19:29,359 --> 00:19:33,600 Speaker 1: will release data shown below to the world. Determine what 320 00:19:33,680 --> 00:19:40,120 Speaker 1: you do till November twenty eleven o'clock pm GMT. That's great. 321 00:19:40,119 --> 00:19:42,119 Speaker 1: I'm glad that they I'm glad that they put the 322 00:19:42,160 --> 00:19:44,840 Speaker 1: Greenwich meantime there because that could have really been right, 323 00:19:45,240 --> 00:19:48,080 Speaker 1: been like well how eleven win like if it's a 324 00:19:48,040 --> 00:19:50,720 Speaker 1: specific time. We've got some debt. We've got some time, guys. Yeah, 325 00:19:50,760 --> 00:19:53,840 Speaker 1: you have to have a line of communication. And then 326 00:19:53,880 --> 00:19:57,680 Speaker 1: below that there were five links to I guess very 327 00:19:58,200 --> 00:20:03,000 Speaker 1: top secret material and secret material um that, some of 328 00:20:03,040 --> 00:20:06,040 Speaker 1: which has subsequently been leaked, but not necessarily all of 329 00:20:06,040 --> 00:20:09,720 Speaker 1: it exactly. There's still there's still a couple of still 330 00:20:09,720 --> 00:20:12,359 Speaker 1: a couple of cards up the sleeve, perhaps even a 331 00:20:12,440 --> 00:20:15,920 Speaker 1: dead man's hand kind of thing going on. Yes, So, 332 00:20:16,720 --> 00:20:21,600 Speaker 1: the Guardians of Peace described themselves as an international organization 333 00:20:21,680 --> 00:20:25,159 Speaker 1: including famous figures in the politics and society from several 334 00:20:25,280 --> 00:20:29,320 Speaker 1: nations such as the United States, United Kingdom, and France. 335 00:20:29,600 --> 00:20:32,640 Speaker 1: We are not under the direction of any state. This 336 00:20:32,680 --> 00:20:35,720 Speaker 1: is an important thing to point out because you might 337 00:20:35,760 --> 00:20:37,879 Speaker 1: be thinking, hey, you guys spent an awful lot of 338 00:20:37,920 --> 00:20:40,199 Speaker 1: time talking about North Korea in the interview at the 339 00:20:40,200 --> 00:20:44,320 Speaker 1: beginning of this podcast, right, I mean, possibly too much 340 00:20:44,359 --> 00:20:47,440 Speaker 1: time because Jonathan was in the show I'm known as 341 00:20:47,440 --> 00:20:50,760 Speaker 1: the talkie one. Yeah, this is This is also important 342 00:20:50,760 --> 00:20:53,360 Speaker 1: because obviously, if you've been following the story at all, 343 00:20:53,480 --> 00:20:57,520 Speaker 1: you know that there had later been um some allegations 344 00:20:57,560 --> 00:21:00,160 Speaker 1: made that North Korea was at least in part, if 345 00:21:00,160 --> 00:21:03,920 Speaker 1: not wholly, behind these attacks and these allegations came from 346 00:21:03,960 --> 00:21:07,639 Speaker 1: Uncle Sam, and that, in fact, the impetus for the 347 00:21:07,680 --> 00:21:11,520 Speaker 1: attacks of the first place was specifically because of this movie. 348 00:21:11,520 --> 00:21:13,720 Speaker 1: We talked about the interview. However, if you've been paying 349 00:21:13,760 --> 00:21:17,240 Speaker 1: attention to the messages we've been reading, you'll notice that 350 00:21:17,359 --> 00:21:21,320 Speaker 1: there's been no mention of the interview so far. You'll mention. 351 00:21:21,400 --> 00:21:23,439 Speaker 1: You'll notice a couple of things, And also one of 352 00:21:23,480 --> 00:21:27,920 Speaker 1: them is that the English on these statements, at least 353 00:21:27,920 --> 00:21:33,080 Speaker 1: the grammar, isn't that great. But it also doesn't necessarily 354 00:21:33,359 --> 00:21:36,800 Speaker 1: seem to be the same kind of stilted English that 355 00:21:36,880 --> 00:21:40,680 Speaker 1: we tend to see in actual communications from places like 356 00:21:41,280 --> 00:21:47,320 Speaker 1: North Korea. Right. We do know, however, that a lot 357 00:21:47,440 --> 00:21:52,000 Speaker 1: of information was leaked, So December one, if you could 358 00:21:52,040 --> 00:21:53,879 Speaker 1: just know, you talked a little bit about this on 359 00:21:53,960 --> 00:21:57,240 Speaker 1: tech stuff, right, Okay, so if you guys could just 360 00:21:57,320 --> 00:22:02,480 Speaker 1: detail some of the information, Okay, Yeah, no specifics so 361 00:22:02,520 --> 00:22:05,240 Speaker 1: that we all don't also get attacked. But sure, well, 362 00:22:05,280 --> 00:22:07,199 Speaker 1: I mean, first of all, my heart goes out to 363 00:22:08,200 --> 00:22:10,879 Speaker 1: say what you will about any large company or whatever, 364 00:22:10,920 --> 00:22:14,560 Speaker 1: but I don't wish anyone to have suffered the kind 365 00:22:14,600 --> 00:22:18,040 Speaker 1: of huge setbacks that Sony Pictures has um, you know 366 00:22:18,200 --> 00:22:21,880 Speaker 1: my opinions of their movies, notwithstanding, I don't wish them 367 00:22:21,920 --> 00:22:25,960 Speaker 1: harm so some of the because I'm not a big 368 00:22:25,960 --> 00:22:29,280 Speaker 1: fan of a lot of Sony pictures. Look just release 369 00:22:29,320 --> 00:22:33,880 Speaker 1: Spider Man back to Marvel, That's all I'm saying anyway. Um, So, 370 00:22:34,080 --> 00:22:37,360 Speaker 1: they they had several films stolen from them. They had 371 00:22:37,920 --> 00:22:41,479 Speaker 1: essentially in screener format. Screeners are the kind of movies 372 00:22:41,920 --> 00:22:45,000 Speaker 1: that a movie studio will send out to uh to 373 00:22:45,320 --> 00:22:49,400 Speaker 1: usually two members of say the Academy, the producers Guild. Right, 374 00:22:49,480 --> 00:22:53,080 Speaker 1: it's the idea that there's there's certain communities that get 375 00:22:53,119 --> 00:22:56,159 Speaker 1: to see this so that they can end up nominating 376 00:22:56,160 --> 00:22:58,479 Speaker 1: it for an award or voting for it or whatever. 377 00:22:59,200 --> 00:23:03,520 Speaker 1: And these were clearly coming from this source because they 378 00:23:03,560 --> 00:23:06,480 Speaker 1: still had water marks on the screener water marks, so 379 00:23:06,640 --> 00:23:08,760 Speaker 1: you know, it wasn't like a clean copy of the movie. 380 00:23:09,760 --> 00:23:12,800 Speaker 1: You had this overlay on top. But these were movies 381 00:23:12,840 --> 00:23:15,240 Speaker 1: that included ones that had not yet been released. There 382 00:23:15,280 --> 00:23:17,680 Speaker 1: was Fury, which had already come out, and Annie which 383 00:23:17,720 --> 00:23:20,920 Speaker 1: had not come out, and a few others, and so 384 00:23:21,080 --> 00:23:23,080 Speaker 1: that was very high profile. But then there was just 385 00:23:23,400 --> 00:23:26,479 Speaker 1: tons of information that got released as well. Some of 386 00:23:26,480 --> 00:23:30,320 Speaker 1: it was merely embarrassing things like a list of internal 387 00:23:30,760 --> 00:23:34,760 Speaker 1: communications between employees that ended up revealing some very personal 388 00:23:34,800 --> 00:23:37,960 Speaker 1: opinions about the direction of the company. I think Angelina 389 00:23:38,119 --> 00:23:40,600 Speaker 1: Jolie is a bad actor. I think we need to 390 00:23:40,640 --> 00:23:43,920 Speaker 1: stop making Adam Sandler movies. You know. George Clooney wrote 391 00:23:43,920 --> 00:23:46,240 Speaker 1: me a really nice email. Yeah. Well, and there was 392 00:23:46,280 --> 00:23:50,119 Speaker 1: even stuff about the president. Uh. People had to apologize 393 00:23:50,160 --> 00:23:53,399 Speaker 1: formally before yeah, and then and then beyond that, beyond 394 00:23:53,440 --> 00:23:56,480 Speaker 1: the just the internal communications, we started getting information about 395 00:23:56,480 --> 00:23:59,880 Speaker 1: things like executive salaries. Uh. And that's where we really 396 00:24:00,000 --> 00:24:05,280 Speaker 1: all the disparity between people of certain races and genders 397 00:24:05,320 --> 00:24:10,359 Speaker 1: like white men and then everybody else. So, as you 398 00:24:10,400 --> 00:24:14,439 Speaker 1: have noted here, Matt, we don't want to exacerbate the situation, 399 00:24:14,520 --> 00:24:17,360 Speaker 1: so WO won't go into too much further detail. If 400 00:24:17,400 --> 00:24:21,639 Speaker 1: you want information about the specific content of these leaks, um, 401 00:24:21,720 --> 00:24:27,600 Speaker 1: you can find it online. I mean pretty much just 402 00:24:27,600 --> 00:24:31,480 Speaker 1: scouring over the stuff and just I don't know from 403 00:24:31,520 --> 00:24:33,640 Speaker 1: in my opinion, it's really weird. And we'll talk about 404 00:24:33,640 --> 00:24:38,959 Speaker 1: this maybe a little later. The the journalists view of this, 405 00:24:39,080 --> 00:24:42,399 Speaker 1: like what what is really newsworthy about the specific leaked 406 00:24:42,440 --> 00:24:45,240 Speaker 1: information should even be talking about it in that kind 407 00:24:45,240 --> 00:24:48,000 Speaker 1: of specifics when you're looking at well, I mean, I 408 00:24:48,000 --> 00:24:51,280 Speaker 1: don't know. There There's there're multiple layers, right, There's the 409 00:24:51,400 --> 00:24:54,600 Speaker 1: layer of the heck itself is newsworthy and needs to 410 00:24:54,600 --> 00:24:59,080 Speaker 1: be talked about because BBC Guardian Zeer and and that 411 00:24:59,160 --> 00:25:01,520 Speaker 1: needs to be talked about because not only is a 412 00:25:01,520 --> 00:25:04,440 Speaker 1: newsworthy event, but it's something that should alert other companies 413 00:25:04,440 --> 00:25:06,360 Speaker 1: to say, we really do need to take a serious 414 00:25:06,400 --> 00:25:09,680 Speaker 1: look at our our cyber security, right, and we need 415 00:25:09,680 --> 00:25:12,879 Speaker 1: to really look at that. And we know that cybersecurity 416 00:25:13,000 --> 00:25:17,159 Speaker 1: or cyber attacks have been on the rise globally. The 417 00:25:17,240 --> 00:25:20,960 Speaker 1: United States and China are as we speak, engaged in 418 00:25:21,040 --> 00:25:25,119 Speaker 1: a really weird great game online. Oh yeah, including a 419 00:25:25,200 --> 00:25:29,040 Speaker 1: game where we discover things like Chinese code that's embedded 420 00:25:29,080 --> 00:25:34,040 Speaker 1: deep in US infrastructure. That's that's interesting and so um, 421 00:25:34,119 --> 00:25:36,600 Speaker 1: you know, there's that that part of newsworthy. There's another 422 00:25:36,680 --> 00:25:41,200 Speaker 1: layer that's something that investigative journalists would normally go after 423 00:25:41,400 --> 00:25:44,399 Speaker 1: things like this disparity and pay. Now, that's that's something 424 00:25:44,440 --> 00:25:47,399 Speaker 1: that an investigative journalist would look into and want to 425 00:25:47,440 --> 00:25:51,760 Speaker 1: try and it's a whole another story. But the way 426 00:25:51,800 --> 00:25:55,840 Speaker 1: that this information was revealed does raise some ethical issues 427 00:25:55,880 --> 00:25:59,679 Speaker 1: that are really murky. These are not easy questions to answer, 428 00:25:59,800 --> 00:26:02,320 Speaker 1: and in fact it I think it depends upon the outlet. 429 00:26:02,400 --> 00:26:05,680 Speaker 1: Some of them are really engaged in shout in freuda 430 00:26:05,800 --> 00:26:08,400 Speaker 1: right there, just like especially the ones about the Adam 431 00:26:08,520 --> 00:26:11,560 Speaker 1: Sandler quote quotes the things about like even Sony kids 432 00:26:11,640 --> 00:26:15,240 Speaker 1: did Adam Sandler movies? Um, And yeah, there's something really 433 00:26:15,280 --> 00:26:17,160 Speaker 1: funny about that. I left when I read it too. 434 00:26:17,160 --> 00:26:18,920 Speaker 1: But at the same time you think about and you're like, wow, 435 00:26:18,960 --> 00:26:21,800 Speaker 1: that's kind of a crappy thing to report on. Um. 436 00:26:21,840 --> 00:26:23,640 Speaker 1: I mean, I don't know that I wouldn't have done 437 00:26:23,680 --> 00:26:26,520 Speaker 1: it myself. If I had thought about it, I probably 438 00:26:26,520 --> 00:26:29,680 Speaker 1: would have. I might have felt badly about later. I've 439 00:26:29,880 --> 00:26:34,800 Speaker 1: I've actually stopped saying horrible things about our coworkers and email. Yeah, 440 00:26:34,920 --> 00:26:37,240 Speaker 1: I just say it's straight to the face. These days, 441 00:26:37,280 --> 00:26:38,880 Speaker 1: I just sort of yell at we have an open 442 00:26:38,960 --> 00:26:41,520 Speaker 1: office plan, So I think they'll get the message. Ever 443 00:26:41,560 --> 00:26:44,200 Speaker 1: since I stopped calling people jerks and just referred to 444 00:26:44,240 --> 00:26:48,680 Speaker 1: them as Josh, he's certainly gotten the message. Yeah, he's 445 00:26:48,680 --> 00:26:53,119 Speaker 1: working on a macaroni picture of you guys for Christmas, 446 00:26:53,200 --> 00:26:56,000 Speaker 1: But for really gets into the whistleblower territory right where, 447 00:26:56,760 --> 00:27:01,199 Speaker 1: you know, and it really made me question deeply some 448 00:27:01,320 --> 00:27:04,959 Speaker 1: of my beliefs about whistle blowers and information that I 449 00:27:05,000 --> 00:27:07,959 Speaker 1: feel is important to be shared when it's you know, 450 00:27:08,000 --> 00:27:10,920 Speaker 1: when you have that moral conundrum of a managed other 451 00:27:10,920 --> 00:27:14,280 Speaker 1: people need to know about your responsibility. And then I 452 00:27:14,400 --> 00:27:17,000 Speaker 1: gotta tell you, guys, it's it's hurting my brain a little, 453 00:27:17,040 --> 00:27:19,040 Speaker 1: but I like it. I don't think. I don't think 454 00:27:19,119 --> 00:27:23,240 Speaker 1: this is quite the same as whistle blowing outside of 455 00:27:23,359 --> 00:27:27,760 Speaker 1: the systemic policy problems that that kind of inequality and 456 00:27:27,760 --> 00:27:31,680 Speaker 1: pay can have. But what we know that's interesting here 457 00:27:31,840 --> 00:27:36,240 Speaker 1: is that December two, just this past month, the Federal 458 00:27:36,280 --> 00:27:40,600 Speaker 1: Bureau of Investigation says they're officially looking into North Korea 459 00:27:40,680 --> 00:27:42,840 Speaker 1: for doing this. And I don't know about you, guys, 460 00:27:43,800 --> 00:27:46,720 Speaker 1: but one movie is kind of flimsy for a state 461 00:27:46,760 --> 00:27:51,760 Speaker 1: sponsored hack of this magnitude. I am not saying it 462 00:27:51,840 --> 00:27:56,480 Speaker 1: wasn't them, but I'm saying if it is. But that's touchy. Hey, guys, 463 00:27:56,920 --> 00:28:00,399 Speaker 1: I am really sorry. I hate to interrupt Jonathan Ben 464 00:28:00,480 --> 00:28:03,359 Speaker 1: I hate you when you interrupted me too. I know. Look, 465 00:28:03,880 --> 00:28:06,280 Speaker 1: we're going along here, would you guys mind if we 466 00:28:06,680 --> 00:28:09,000 Speaker 1: split this up into two. Okay, well, let's end on 467 00:28:09,240 --> 00:28:12,240 Speaker 1: a cliffhanger. Usually we do the email address, but let's 468 00:28:12,280 --> 00:28:14,240 Speaker 1: let's do a cliffhanger noun so we can get people 469 00:28:14,359 --> 00:28:16,919 Speaker 1: set up for part two. K totally, totally okay? Was 470 00:28:16,960 --> 00:28:19,480 Speaker 1: it North Korea? Was it the n p A A? 471 00:28:20,320 --> 00:28:26,440 Speaker 1: Was it someone inside Sony the whole time? To find out, 472 00:28:26,760 --> 00:28:29,800 Speaker 1: you'll at least have to listen to part two. Dun 473 00:28:29,920 --> 00:28:33,480 Speaker 1: Dune done, dun Dune done, done, dun doune. Oh, that 474 00:28:33,520 --> 00:28:38,000 Speaker 1: was kind of NBC ishue, Thanks so much, guys. Tune 475 00:28:38,000 --> 00:28:41,840 Speaker 1: in next week and that's the end of this classic episode. 476 00:28:41,920 --> 00:28:45,760 Speaker 1: If you have any thoughts or questions about this episode, 477 00:28:46,120 --> 00:28:48,200 Speaker 1: you can get into contact with us in a number 478 00:28:48,240 --> 00:28:50,200 Speaker 1: of different ways. One of the best is to give 479 00:28:50,280 --> 00:28:52,880 Speaker 1: us a call. Our number is one eight three three 480 00:28:53,160 --> 00:28:55,960 Speaker 1: st d w y t K. If you don't want 481 00:28:55,960 --> 00:28:57,880 Speaker 1: to do that, you can send us a good old 482 00:28:57,880 --> 00:29:00,920 Speaker 1: fashioned email. We are conspire to see at i heart 483 00:29:01,040 --> 00:29:04,479 Speaker 1: radio dot com. Stuff they Don't want you to Know 484 00:29:04,720 --> 00:29:07,680 Speaker 1: is a production of I heart Radio. For more podcasts 485 00:29:07,680 --> 00:29:09,920 Speaker 1: from my heart Radio, visit the i heart Radio app, 486 00:29:10,000 --> 00:29:12,880 Speaker 1: Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.