Speaker 1: When something is shouting at me to feel a certain way,
Speaker 1: my automatic reaction will always be bullshit.
Speaker 2: Hello again, and welcome back to Midnight Chat, a podcast
Speaker 2: of informal interviews with musicians we love, posted weekly at
Speaker 2: midnight to suit these very unplanned conversations. This week's episode
Speaker 2: is hosted by me Stuart Stubbs, the editor of Loud
Speaker 2: and Quiet magazine, and tonight's guest on the podcast is
Speaker 2: Oliver sim who I'm sure you know already is a
Speaker 2: member of the British trio The XX, alongside his very
Speaker 2: good and very long standing friends Jamie Smith aka Jamie
Speaker 2: XX and Rommy madley Croft. He's known Ronny since he
Speaker 2: was three years old. They went to nursery together. Oliver's
Speaker 2: on the podcast, though, not to talk about a new
Speaker 2: XX record, but about his debut solo album. It's called
Speaker 2: Hideous Bastard Incredible Name, and it is out this Friday,
Speaker 2: which is what that's the ninth of September. I spoke
Speaker 2: to Oliver as you're here pretty much exactly two weeks ago.
Speaker 2: We do get into a bit of XX Chat, though,
Speaker 2: reminisce a bit about the old days, particularly about a
Speaker 2: show that I once put on with a couple of friends.
Speaker 2: Shout out to Ian and Sasha, but we mainly there's
Speaker 2: a lot to talk about with Hideous Bastard. It comes
Speaker 2: with a film which will be available on the streaming
Speaker 2: service Movie Perhaps Now. It's kind of a horror film.
Speaker 2: We talk a bit about horror films that's inspired this
Speaker 2: record as well, a very personal record for Oliver. We
Speaker 2: talk about a track called Hideous, which is the first
Speaker 2: track on the album. It features Jimmy Somemerville and it's
Speaker 2: a song in which Oliver openly talks about how he's
Speaker 2: been living with HIV since he was seventeen years old.
Speaker 2: So we get into that as well. I'm not gonna
Speaker 2: say anymore than that because I've got one thing that
Speaker 2: I've just quick like to plug. We don't do many
Speaker 2: parties at Loud and Quiet anymore, but we are hosting
Speaker 2: a special party with Village Underground. They're celebrating fifteen years
Speaker 2: of their venue here in London, and we've got a
Speaker 2: show on the nineteenth of September. There's a link in
Speaker 2: the show notes to this episode that will get you
Speaker 2: ten percent off tickets. Tickets are only thirteen pounds anyway.
Speaker 2: We've got theon cross Playing, Donnad Thompson and Lunch Money Life,
Speaker 2: all incredible artists doing different things with jazz and rock
Speaker 2: and experimental music. All the information is in that link
Speaker 2: in the show notes. Hopefully I'll see some of you
Speaker 2: there right then, here is Oliver sim talking mainly about
Speaker 2: his new album Hideous Bastard. I employ you to check
Speaker 2: it out. It's an amazing record and it comes out
Speaker 2: this Friday on the ninth of September. This episode of
Speaker 2: Midnight Chats is supported by London South Bank Center, who
Speaker 2: have so much coming up in that autumn season it's
Speaker 2: hard to know where to start, but here are two
Speaker 2: events that look particularly special. Lorraine James will be performing
Speaker 2: live at the Queen Elizabeth Hall on October the second
Speaker 2: with the London Contemporary Orchestra for My Money. Lorraine is
Speaker 2: one of our best electronic musicians and if you haven't
Speaker 2: seen her live yet, she is incredible even when she's
Speaker 2: on her own, So this is going to be a
Speaker 2: very special show where she will be performing an homage
Speaker 2: to the New York composer Julius Eastman with the LCO
Speaker 2: or perhaps an evening with Nick Cave is more up
Speaker 2: your Street as part of London Literature Festival. Here be
Speaker 2: in conversation at the south Bank Center on October the
Speaker 2: twenty seventh with Sean O'Hagan, as the pair discussed their
Speaker 2: new book Faith, Hope and Carnage. Tickets for both of
Speaker 2: those events can be found at Southbankcentre dot co dot uk,
Speaker 2: but I've also linked to both of them in the
Speaker 2: show notes of this episode. As I say, there's plenty
Speaker 2: more going on at the south Bank this autumn, including
Speaker 2: Christine and the Queens, Janeweaver and a late nighter with
Speaker 2: the excellent Snapped Ankles. Visit Southbank Center dot co dot
Speaker 2: uk and thank you once again to them for supporting
Speaker 2: this episode of Midnight Chats.
Speaker 1: So today marks it is two weeks until the album
Speaker 1: comes out, and it's come about really quickly. From like
Speaker 1: feeling like it was ages away, it's now pretty much
Speaker 1: here and I feel so conflicted because I'm like, I want,
Speaker 1: I want it out. I want it out right now.
Speaker 1: Also I don't want it out. It's like releasing records
Speaker 1: just comes like there is like a faint air of sadness.
Speaker 1: I like, right now that it's my option to play
Speaker 1: it to people right and I have ownership, and like, realistically,
Speaker 1: I can't change anything. It's like the vinyls are printed,
Speaker 1: it's done, ready to go. Yeah, but in the back
Speaker 1: of my head, I still kind of could change things.
Speaker 2: Have you stopped listening to it for that reason? Because
Speaker 2: I would stop listening to it at this point myself.
Speaker 1: It takes years to get to that point though. Like
Speaker 1: the our first album with the XX had its tenth
Speaker 1: Anniverse three a few years back, we had like a
Speaker 1: playback and listening to it then was one of the
Speaker 1: first time ten years later that I was like, I
Speaker 1: wasn't critiquing it. I wasn't like, oh I've changed that.
Speaker 1: I wouldn't do that, and I was able to like
Speaker 1: switch off and actually listen to it. What do you
Speaker 1: think of their record now? It's nice to listen to it.
Speaker 1: It's I think we sound like babies. I think because
Speaker 1: we were babies, we really were, And it's it's it's
Speaker 1: fun to listen to it because I'm like, oh, I
Speaker 1: wouldn't make that choice today. Oh, I like, I don't
Speaker 1: understand that choice or where that went there in a
Speaker 1: nice way, it's it's it is a time in our
Speaker 1: lives that it's just like cemented and encapsulated, which is
Speaker 1: really nice.
Speaker 2: So two weeks till the new record, do you think
Speaker 2: the anxiety is just going to ramp up until release day?
Speaker 1: I'm keeping busy. I'm keeping really busy. I'm like, it's
Speaker 1: it's different because normally, like I do have Ronny and
Speaker 1: Jamie tellin on, but this is my record. I see
Speaker 1: what there were so many feelings of just like naivety,
Speaker 1: Like I've been doing this for quite a long time,
Speaker 1: but like there is a naivety and just like an
Speaker 1: unknown that's really nice to feel.
Speaker 2: Again, do you mean just in the sense of like
Speaker 2: not having Jamie and Rommy to there with doing it
Speaker 2: yourself on your own like that that whole thing kind
Speaker 2: of it just it reminds me of that first record
Speaker 2: because it's like I we didn't know, we didn't know
Speaker 2: how that it was going to be received, where it
Speaker 2: was going to take us, and like I've definitely my
Speaker 2: enthusiasm for the XX has only grown, but it changes
Speaker 2: record from record of like, well, you know, you have
Speaker 2: this other piece of work behind you to like support you,
Speaker 2: and I don't have that. This is this is my
Speaker 2: first record on my own and it's scary, but it's exciting.
Speaker 2: It's it's I feel like I'm like reconnecting with like
Speaker 2: teenage feelings, which is always nice to feel. Yeah, that's
Speaker 2: quite nice, isn't I kind of I speak about this.
Speaker 2: I tend to speak about this a lot on the
Speaker 2: podcast as I go through my midlife crisis. I tend
Speaker 2: to talk a lot with artists about kind of missing
Speaker 2: that teenage kind of horrible but nice feeling of that
Speaker 2: those teenage anxieties that you had, like you kind of
Speaker 2: start to miss them when there's enough distance between them
Speaker 2: happening and where you are now.
Speaker 1: The drama.
Speaker 3: The drama is like, yeah, I'm thinking about like I've
Speaker 3: always had like a wild imagination, but like the drama,
Speaker 3: especially around romance of like I could take the smallest
Speaker 3: like morsel of like potential of romance that could feed
Speaker 3: my imagination for like.
Speaker 1: A year, all just like months. Yeah, I missed that drama.
Speaker 2: Have the other two given you any sort of tips
Speaker 2: because they've obviously released solo albums and solo work.
Speaker 1: Yeah?
Speaker 2: Have they kind of been coaching you through this period
Speaker 2: or have they just said, Oliver, you're on your own,
Speaker 2: We've been there.
Speaker 1: No, they're there, and then that Jamie's just Jamie's too
Speaker 1: like cool for school sometimes and he's just but he's
Speaker 1: also invested, like he I made this record with it,
Speaker 1: so he's like very invested. But I don't know, Like
Speaker 1: Rommy's finishing her record at the moment, and we've been
Speaker 1: kind of like coaching each other through it and like
Speaker 1: the whole though she didn't work on this record, she's
Speaker 1: like been by my side the whole time and like
Speaker 1: playing each other what we've been doing, which has been great.
Speaker 1: And like Rommie, I've known since I was three years old.
Speaker 1: We've done like nursery, primary school, secondary school, sixth form.
Speaker 1: We've had a career together there and I love her,
Speaker 1: I support her, I celebrate her. But there is a
Speaker 1: part of me that is just like pure sibling. When
Speaker 1: she does well, there is nothing more like a greater
Speaker 1: source of energy of just like so when we've been
Speaker 1: like meeting actually playing me a song, I'm like, damn,
Speaker 1: that's good.
Speaker 2: Damn I've got to like I've got I've got to
Speaker 2: go one better.
Speaker 1: Yeah.
Speaker 2: One thing I love about the XX and you three
Speaker 2: is how tight you still are, like you know, because
Speaker 2: you have been doing this as you say, for a
Speaker 2: while now. Just had the tenth anniversary of the of
Speaker 2: the debut, and but you know, Jamie produced this album
Speaker 2: with you. You work, you contribute to each other's solo
Speaker 2: material and have done since you started doing bits and
Speaker 2: pieces each and I think that's quite rare. You know,
Speaker 2: maybe it just maybe it does come down to the
Speaker 2: fact that you and Rommy, you know, I've known each
Speaker 2: other since you were three, and that's like a bond
Speaker 2: that is unbreakable in certain ways. But is there like
Speaker 2: a secret, like I kind of see you as like
Speaker 2: that This is how bands should This is the ideal situation.
Speaker 2: You know, your your you make records when you want to,
Speaker 2: you don't rush them, you but you you know, in
Speaker 2: those periods it's obviously very intense and touring and all
Speaker 2: of that sort of stuff, and that sort of thing
Speaker 2: is normally what breaks bands up, even if they've got
Speaker 2: really close friends. In some siblings can't you know, be
Speaker 2: in bands with each other and it kind of ruins
Speaker 2: their relationships. But you three seem to have this relationship
Speaker 2: that is constantly getting stronger, if you know what I mean.
Speaker 1: I wish I don't know what the secret is that
Speaker 1: we've definitely had moment. I get why tour is the
Speaker 1: one that breaks is the part that breaks people, because
Speaker 1: it's it's the it's the being around each other when
Speaker 1: it's not necessarily our choice, like it's it's we're just
Speaker 1: constantly with each other, and it takes away that, you know,
Speaker 1: I've decided to hang out with you. We are just
Speaker 1: together twenty four to seven. But it's I don't know,
Speaker 1: it's just never really those scales between like being friends
Speaker 1: and colleagues have never like tilted the wrong way. I wish,
Speaker 1: I wish I had tips and secrets, but it is
Speaker 1: it is actually fairly easy for the most part. Like
Speaker 1: I still love them and I still see them out
Speaker 1: of toys, just to be friends, no music involved.
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, I remember when Crystallized first came out and
Speaker 2: I interviewed you were a four piece, then it was one.
Speaker 2: I like to say it was your first interview. I've
Speaker 2: been dining out on this ever since two thousand and nine,
Speaker 2: but it was so exciting to watch your band kind
Speaker 2: of grow and and kind of just then almost not overnight,
Speaker 2: but I remember it just suddenly stepping up a notch
Speaker 2: because we put on a show. I co hosted a
Speaker 2: show that you guys played with Little Boots DJ. It
Speaker 2: was in a basement, I'm sure I remember this, but
Speaker 2: it was in like a weird part of town here
Speaker 2: in London. It was in like ELL's Court under there's
Speaker 2: a cafe over there and Troubadour, the.
Speaker 1: Troubadoor Theoretical Girl. Yes we're playing, Yes I do. I
Speaker 1: do remember very well that that show was the first
Speaker 1: time we played Crystallized. We just we just wrote it
Speaker 1: like that week that's trying it out.
Speaker 2: It was the first time I'd seen I saw you.
Speaker 2: It was then and the first time I heard the
Speaker 2: first time, very first time I saw he was me
Speaker 2: and Sasha and I and who were putting on the
Speaker 2: night we came watching the sound check, and I remember
Speaker 2: the three of us clapped at the end of the
Speaker 2: sound check, which I have since learned one does not do.
Speaker 2: But we were like just like mesmerized by and we
Speaker 2: were particularly mesmerized by like Jamie at his MPC going
Speaker 2: and we are like wow, and and I remember that.
Speaker 2: I'm really distinctly remember that night, and I remember that,
Speaker 2: and it was at a time when when you know,
Speaker 2: it was kind of bubbling up for you, and like
Speaker 2: you were playing a lot of shows around town, I think,
Speaker 2: and then maybe I saw you like a couple of
Speaker 2: times since then, but I remember then all of a sudden,
Speaker 2: I saw you at Prima Era Sound playing on like
Speaker 2: the Amphitheater ray Band stage, which felt like maybe the
Speaker 2: distance between those two shows is a much longer than
Speaker 2: I then. I know that I am recalling, but it
Speaker 2: was suddenly like, oh wow, like this is this is
Speaker 2: a They're absolutely huge one. The Mercury and all that
Speaker 2: sort of stuff. I mean, so much has happened since
Speaker 2: then and now, and like I could sit here and
Speaker 2: bombard you with a million questions about all that stuff.
Speaker 2: But we should talk about the album because I've heard
Speaker 2: the album. I've listened to it a lot. It's I
Speaker 2: think it's brilliant. I've also watched the film. I saw
Speaker 2: the film yesterday, so I've got some things to ask
Speaker 2: you about that. But let's talk. Let's start. I guess
Speaker 2: with Hideous, the track that essentially announced the album, extremely
Speaker 2: personal track for you. It's I suppose what I wanted
Speaker 2: to ask you about that was like, it's probably frightening
Speaker 2: enough for you to be in this successful group and
Speaker 2: be doing your first solo album and be doing that
Speaker 2: is kind of a you know, a big thing in
Speaker 2: and of itself. But for you to come out with
Speaker 2: the track you did that openly talks about your HIV
Speaker 2: status in the way that it does. I mean that
Speaker 2: takes it to a whole new kind of level. My
Speaker 2: two questions on it, really one is how did you
Speaker 2: feel the day that was coming out? Can you take
Speaker 2: me back to how you you knew that was going
Speaker 2: to be sent out by the label and that was
Speaker 2: going to be a story from like music, press and stuff.
Speaker 2: How did you How did you feel?
Speaker 1: I fell? So I was in can I was at
Speaker 1: Camp Film Festival, and I was like busy doing a
Speaker 1: day of press and I remember it was went out
Speaker 1: at three and I was doing an interview from I
Speaker 1: think like two thirty to three thirty, which was perfect, great,
Speaker 1: which was perfect and minute. I wasn't like gleed to
Speaker 1: my phone or anything. But it it was uncomfortable. It
Speaker 1: was uncomfortable. And like I've had like moments of this
Speaker 1: has been as a general thing, like been very liberating,
Speaker 1: but it hasn't been you know, I've had very few. No,
Speaker 1: I don't think I've had any moments that I just
Speaker 1: like flipping a switch of Oh, I suddenly feel so
Speaker 1: much lighter, I feel liberated, I feel free air and
Speaker 1: everything like that has been slow burn. And you know
Speaker 1: I've I've made I've made an album about fear and
Speaker 1: shame and not to to liberate myself. You know it
Speaker 1: sounds quite heavy on paper, but you know I've written
Speaker 1: about these things not to beat myself up, but to
Speaker 1: air them out. And when I when I first wrote Hideous,
Speaker 1: it was such a fuck it moment of I was
Speaker 1: at a point in my life life where I would
Speaker 1: say most of the key people in my life knew
Speaker 1: about my status, but some people didn't know. A lot
Speaker 1: of people knew in a way of I told them
Speaker 1: one time and then I'd put like a subliminal, like
Speaker 1: invisible force field around it of like that's done. We've
Speaker 1: talked about that. Now we don't talk about it again.
Speaker 1: And me putting it in a song was quite a
Speaker 1: drastic thing considering where I was in my life, because
Speaker 1: it's much easier for me to be honest in songwriting
Speaker 1: than it is in a conversation, because there is no
Speaker 1: I don't have to be in the room when somebody
Speaker 1: listens to this, I don't have to look at them
Speaker 1: in the eye. There's no back and forth like Songwriting's
Speaker 1: just a conversation with myself. And when I decided to
Speaker 1: put my HIV status in the song, you know it's
Speaker 1: it's at the end of the song, because that's the
Speaker 1: moment where you know I'd pretty much written a song.
Speaker 1: I was like, should I do this? Should I do this? Okay, fine, yeah,
Speaker 1: put checking it at the end. Rad gonesty, Mike, scept
Speaker 1: me free if it makes me Idio been living with
Speaker 1: the Javy since seven c Namma idiom and I played
Speaker 1: the song to Jamie and the second person I played
Speaker 1: it to was my mom. And my mom my mom
Speaker 1: knows me, she knows me, and she was like, this
Speaker 1: is drastic, This is drastic, and how about some baby
Speaker 1: steps first? How about you start having conversations And that's
Speaker 1: just not what I wanted to do. And that's not
Speaker 1: what I wanted to do.
Speaker 2: Were you like, well, Mom, put it in a song,
Speaker 2: which I don't want to have the conversation.
Speaker 1: Yeah, let me have the drama. I don't know, but
Speaker 1: I did start having these conversations with my nearest and
Speaker 1: dearest and they were super uncomfortable to begin with, but
Speaker 1: I started to have Like each one I had, it
Speaker 1: became a little less heavy, and I started working my
Speaker 1: way out of my like inner circle. I started meeting
Speaker 1: new people, collaborators and sharing the music with them, and
Speaker 1: then I started making a film where I was playing
Speaker 1: Hideous in front of loads of people I didn't know,
Speaker 1: and like my way of dealing with my status or
Speaker 1: just like things I felt ashamed of in general, is
Speaker 1: just like control. I know exact actually who I've told them,
Speaker 1: what I've told and it was just like a really
Speaker 1: stressful way to be And each one of these conversations
Speaker 1: was a bit of letting go of control. And then
Speaker 1: before I knew, I was speaking to journalists, and by
Speaker 1: the time I released Hideous, it didn't feel like a
Speaker 1: Catholic guarded secret. Sure I didn't have control over it anymore.
Speaker 1: It was kind of out in the world.
Speaker 2: Helps the reaction to it being.
Speaker 1: It has been good, and it's been really good. I
Speaker 1: have I've kind of avoided doing a deep dive, especially
Speaker 1: into my messages on social media, not because I'm scared
Speaker 1: of seeing anything negative, but more I think this is
Speaker 1: like a really beautiful thing and I love it. But
Speaker 1: you know, when you share something personal, it kind of
Speaker 1: opens the door for somebody to share something personal back,
Speaker 1: and I it makes me scared because I am not
Speaker 1: necessarily equipped to deal. Like I'm a musician, I'm not
Speaker 1: a trained healthcare professional and I don't want to pretend
Speaker 1: to be one. But I love it, like meeting I've
Speaker 1: played a few shows and meeting people outside of the
Speaker 1: shows and has been amazing. But it does it does
Speaker 1: make me. It can be overwhelming.
Speaker 2: Yeah, Jimmy Summervill is on the track. Yeah, how does
Speaker 2: that come about? Is it true that you send him
Speaker 2: a message? Just an un solicited message, like how do
Speaker 2: you get how do you get to know Jimmy Summerville?
Speaker 1: So I you know, I talk about like being like
Speaker 1: a new artist and things. Thankfully for the XX, like
Speaker 1: a few doors are open and I was able to
Speaker 1: get hold of like people's email addresses and phone numbers.
Speaker 1: But I think like one thing that's been on my
Speaker 1: agenda with this record was like I want to make
Speaker 1: some friends. Yeah, I want to make some friends, Like
Speaker 1: I love Ronny and I love Jamie, but being in
Speaker 1: a band with my two best mates has given me
Speaker 1: the perfect excuse, like excuse of I don't need to
Speaker 1: talk to anybody?
Speaker 2: Yes, are you when you get when you're at a
Speaker 2: party together? Do you just stick with them? Historically?
Speaker 1: Would you?
Speaker 2: Would you be like, I don't need to go over
Speaker 2: to that side of the room because we're here and
Speaker 2: that's the same. That's that's me at a wedding.
Speaker 1: Yeah, no, that that's that's me. I'm I am My
Speaker 1: friends make fun of me. Of Like, if I get
Speaker 1: an invite to go somewhere, my first question would be
Speaker 1: who's going to be then, of like making sure it's
Speaker 1: people I know, because I don't want to be overwhelmed
Speaker 1: by new people. But I was like, I need to
Speaker 1: make some friends. Like Ronny and Jamie are fantastic, but
Speaker 1: they can't be my only two people. And I want
Speaker 1: to sit not only just like musical friends, but like
Speaker 1: queer musicians, especially like older that I keep saying, I
Speaker 1: will not use that word more experienced musicians. And Jimmy
Speaker 1: was kind of like top of my list?
Speaker 2: Were you a fat just a fan of his?
Speaker 1: I was a fan of his. You know, he's just
Speaker 1: a voice that's just always been around. And I think
Speaker 1: for most people that they know that voice, and I
Speaker 1: don't remember the first time I heard it, but then
Speaker 1: like growing up and really getting to know and appreciate
Speaker 1: everything he's done and everything he represents, not not not
Speaker 1: just around HIV and AIDS, but for queer people and
Speaker 1: even more just like people that just feel a bit
Speaker 1: removed and feel a bit other I see. I've always
Speaker 1: seen him as like a beacon, and my like reaching
Speaker 1: out to him was nothing more than like a fanboy
Speaker 1: of high mister Somerville. My name's Oliver, I'm in a band,
Speaker 1: huge fan. I didn't, and he messaged back, and did.
Speaker 2: You say to him in that first message, I'd like
Speaker 2: to work with you or you? Just just seeing if
Speaker 2: he was going to respond?
Speaker 1: I didn't. I didn't. I I had it in the
Speaker 1: back of my head. Yeah I hadn't.
Speaker 2: You didn't say I'm in a band, but I need
Speaker 2: some new friends.
Speaker 1: I think that would have been too desperate, too desperate
Speaker 1: be my mate?
Speaker 2: Will you be my friend?
Speaker 1: Will you be my project? Line?
Speaker 2: Will you be my friend?
Speaker 1: Maybe that's a good approach, Maybe I should take that
Speaker 1: going forward, But no, I didn't. I didn't mention working together,
Speaker 1: and I just wanted to get to know him.
Speaker 2: And he was open to it.
Speaker 1: That's amazing, it's really open to it.
Speaker 2: I mean, because that could have gone another way, you know.
Speaker 1: But that's the thing I've realized is, like I've reached
Speaker 1: out to quite a few people. For the most part,
Speaker 1: people are up for hearing that you're a fan of
Speaker 1: theirs and and are out for chatting, and you know,
Speaker 1: that anxious voice might be like, don't do it and
Speaker 1: stay at home, don't speak to anyone, but but people people,
Speaker 1: Most of the people I reached out to one did.
Speaker 1: But yeah, Jimmy. Jimmy became like a real pen pal
Speaker 1: through lockdown for quite a few months before I was
Speaker 1: able to like drive down to the seaside where he
Speaker 1: lives and visit him and then start talking about working together.
Speaker 2: And You're like, can you be on my track? Did
Speaker 2: I read a quote from you about Jimmy saying that
Speaker 2: he taught you to not take yourself too seriously?
Speaker 1: Yeah?
Speaker 2: What do you mean by that?
Speaker 1: He is He's quite a silly man, And that's maybe
Speaker 1: not the best way of putting it. But it's a
Speaker 1: common thread that I've noticed from my like getting reaching
Speaker 1: out and Pempau relationships like Jimmy Elton ANNONI John Grant.
Speaker 1: I think the common thread is just like a certain
Speaker 1: type of sense of humor, which is.
Speaker 2: I can imagine Jimmy. I don't know him at all,
Speaker 2: I've never met him, but I can imagine him and
Speaker 2: Elton John getting on quite well. Are they similar a similar?
Speaker 2: They're the characters.
Speaker 1: They they similar in terms of like that sense of
Speaker 1: humor and that also like they're both like massive fans
Speaker 1: of stuff, which I think is really cool.
Speaker 2: And you definitely get that from Elton, don't you Like
Speaker 2: he is he.
Speaker 1: Is the most interested in like new music and what
Speaker 1: is happening then the rest of my mates. I say that,
Speaker 1: especially like even the ones in their twenties. And that's
Speaker 1: what I want to be. Yeah, when I'm in my seventies,
Speaker 1: I want that enthusiasm for like seeking out new music
Speaker 1: and supporting it.
Speaker 2: So I watched Hideous the film yesterday. I got sent
Speaker 2: a link to it. Well, it opened at Canned, isn't it.
Speaker 2: So that's that's when you were. That was when the
Speaker 2: track came out. You you were there for the for
Speaker 2: the premiere.
Speaker 1: I guess I was there.
Speaker 2: How how was caned?
Speaker 1: First of all, can is a place I never thought
Speaker 1: I would be at professionally, so it was wild, but
Speaker 1: it's it's a weird place.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I've see I've heard this. I've heard that because
Speaker 2: I've got I suppose, like a lot of people that
Speaker 2: haven't been like myself, we've got this idea of can
Speaker 2: which is like old Hollywood arriving on a speedboat, scarfs
Speaker 2: and big sunglasses and being very glamorous, essentially like a
Speaker 2: Monte Carlo vibe. Yeah, but it's not that.
Speaker 1: It's that it's kind of side by side with socks
Speaker 1: and sandals. Okay, so like at two am, it's like
Speaker 1: the wasted people are like socks and sandals and then
Speaker 1: people in like full chu or right. But it's not
Speaker 1: it's not just I suppose just the glamour. Everyone is
Speaker 1: interested in films. It's like you're meeting people at like
Speaker 1: parties at two am and they're like, oh, well, I'm
Speaker 1: waking up at in like four hours time to go
Speaker 1: into a screening at eight am, which I wasn't expecting.
Speaker 1: I thought it was all going to be for sad.
Speaker 2: Yeah, that sounds like it's more kind of engaged than
Speaker 2: the music industry, and in a sense of my experience
Speaker 2: in the music industry, like because you know, I guess
Speaker 2: an equivalent, like you go to Glastonbury and most people
Speaker 2: spend a lot of time almost bragging about how little
Speaker 2: music you know what I mean, Like people go to
Speaker 2: Glass to me and they just walk and say, oh, no, no,
Speaker 2: I've not seen anything on the Pyramid stage today, or
Speaker 2: oh I've hardly seen anything I've been over here, or
Speaker 2: I've been talking discern So oras this sounds like the
Speaker 2: opposite that, like we're here because we love film and
Speaker 2: we want to go and that's why we're here, and
Speaker 2: we'll do the party. Sure we're going to get wrecked,
Speaker 2: but I do have to get up because I have
Speaker 2: to go to that thing because I want to go
Speaker 2: to that thing.
Speaker 1: Definitely was a dedication that I wasn't expecting. I think
Speaker 1: the thing, I mean, I don't know why that, Like
Speaker 1: I think it's because of the glamour, the grammar. You know,
Speaker 1: Custombury doesn't have that excuse. But it was wild and
Speaker 1: like to play the film there, you know when I
Speaker 1: talked when I talk about like things the lead up
Speaker 1: to Hideous that the day before we released it, we
Speaker 1: had premiered the film. I didn't know a single person
Speaker 1: other than my people in that screening, and that was
Speaker 1: kind of like her like the final it is out there.
Speaker 2: So hey, So when you're at the screen because I'm
Speaker 2: quite fast, because I'd love to be in the film
Speaker 2: world in a way. Yeah, the when you're at the screening,
Speaker 2: is it one of those situations where you introduce the film?
Speaker 2: Does the director introduce it? Is there a round of
Speaker 2: applause at the end. There's a lot of questions here
Speaker 2: on there. Do you have to sit? Do you sit
Speaker 2: like in a prominent position where other people can see you?
Speaker 2: What's the deal?
Speaker 1: So it is, so we did introduce the film, me,
Speaker 1: the director and some of the cast, and mister Jimmy
Speaker 1: x X him up on stage reluctantly, really reluctantly. I'd
Speaker 1: drag him because he's in the film. And then you
Speaker 1: sit down and I was I think were like five
Speaker 1: rows from the front. And and the talking I find
Speaker 1: hard because I just I find it, this is the
Speaker 1: hard thing about even things like this of like over talking.
Speaker 1: I find it such a bony killer. Sometimes when I
Speaker 1: hear artists talking about their craft or talking about their process,
Speaker 1: it's just so unattractive and I don't want to be
Speaker 1: that person. But we introduced step and we got a
Speaker 1: standing innovation for quite a few minutes, which was incredible,
Speaker 1: but like attacked the core like britishness of me. Do
Speaker 1: you know that feeling at your birthday party of just
Speaker 1: like but it was more extreme and it's like do
Speaker 1: you for yourself? Do you clap for the the people
Speaker 1: that were part of it, or do you just do
Speaker 1: one of those bounds? But and then we kind of
Speaker 1: like scooted out and went to a party.
Speaker 2: Did you were you okay with watching yourself up there?
Speaker 2: Like what like seeing yourself on the screen because you know,
Speaker 2: you're you're the star of it, You're you're in it.
Speaker 1: It is so I spent half the film in prosthetics,
Speaker 1: under like three inches of prosthetics, and that was so
Speaker 1: much fun to do. Like that's fulfilling all of my
Speaker 1: like childhood dreams of like like I grew up watching
Speaker 1: like Buffy the Vampire Slayer and I've always been a
Speaker 1: big does look.
Speaker 2: Buff the make Yeah, the prosthetics, I can see.
Speaker 1: That they were my Like that was like my reference point.
Speaker 2: Sure, okay, yeah that makes sense because I was watching
Speaker 2: yesday thinking what does this remind me? Of of and
Speaker 2: that is what it reminds me.
Speaker 1: Of the best, And like going to like the prosthetics studio,
Speaker 1: and like being covered in I don't know what you'd
Speaker 1: call it, having the molds taken. I loved every minute
Speaker 1: of that and being able to wear that allowed me
Speaker 1: to do so many things I wouldn't normally allow myself
Speaker 1: to do. And playing like big parts, like killing lots
Speaker 1: of people like I do in this film. Fantastic, so
Speaker 1: much fun, the big the big brushstrokes of like villainous
Speaker 1: fun things great, the more earnest moments. Not wearing prosthetics
Speaker 1: so so much harder. But you're really good in it,
Speaker 1: Thank you.
Speaker 2: And that that beginning section before before I don't already
Speaker 2: want to spoil it. I don't want to say too
Speaker 2: much to ruin it for people because it's going to
Speaker 2: be shown on movie.
Speaker 1: Isn't it.
Speaker 2: But the bit before the the mask bit when you're
Speaker 2: in an interview chair, the black and white part, it's
Speaker 2: so subtle, like and you when when you can't hear
Speaker 2: hear what you're talking, you can as subtitles in there.
Speaker 2: I am giving too much way here, but just your
Speaker 2: mannerisms and there certain looks where I really felt for you.
Speaker 2: And at that point, because that's the beginning of the film,
Speaker 2: I didn't know what was going to have and it
Speaker 2: takes a massive left turn, but at that point I
Speaker 2: was like, wow, like it's it's brilliant, Like that part
Speaker 2: of the acting I just thought was so good. And
Speaker 2: there's one moment where you do a glance a very
Speaker 2: Norman Baits look, which is amazing, Like had you acted before?
Speaker 2: Like is this was this all like just let's just
Speaker 2: try and act and see what happens?
Speaker 1: Or I did? I did?
Speaker 2: Do you do a bit drama?
Speaker 1: No? No, I was not that kid. Okay, I was
Speaker 1: not that kid, but I did like lessons and the
Speaker 1: lead up to it. But it's it's this is just
Speaker 1: like something I've really wanted to bring some like showmanship
Speaker 1: to this. Yeah, Like I feel like I've made something
Speaker 1: that is confessional and I have been honest, but I
Speaker 1: don't want to present it in a like overly earnest
Speaker 1: package like I have. I've always had a relationship with
Speaker 1: like fantasy. Ye, that is what excites me, and I
Speaker 1: think fantasy can be just as meaningful as anything that
Speaker 1: like has documentary film, And that's why I love horror.
Speaker 1: Horror taught me so much about the world and it's
Speaker 1: and it's fun. I did like if I was to
Speaker 1: pair this album though, I think there's like fans. I
Speaker 1: brought fantasy into the music. But if I was to
Speaker 1: pair it with a visual that was like raw and real,
Speaker 1: that would have been so boring. It would have been
Speaker 1: so boring. And I know the way that I digest things.
Speaker 1: When something is shouting at me, to feel a certain
Speaker 1: way like this is real, this is me at my
Speaker 1: baresss and straight back, my automatic reaction will always be bullshit,
Speaker 1: No it's not, why are you screaming at me? I
Speaker 1: can work this out for myself. So I wanted. I
Speaker 1: wanted to push myself to like have some showmanship to
Speaker 1: make this fantastical. I don't think that would dilute and
Speaker 1: dilute this for a listener or a viewer, And if anything,
Speaker 1: I think there's more capacity to do it.
Speaker 2: What horror films are your favorites? You grew up watching horror,
Speaker 2: like that's an old time passion for you. Yeah, what,
Speaker 2: what's what your all time classic horror films?
Speaker 1: It's hard to pick.
Speaker 2: Do you like the do you like the the gory
Speaker 2: stuff or the kind of more psychological I.
Speaker 1: Enjoy some of the gore I enjoy. The thing that
Speaker 1: draws me to horror is like I'm on paper, it
Speaker 1: doesn't make sense that I do, because I'm quite I've
Speaker 1: always been quite fearful. I was quite scared kid, but
Speaker 1: horror doesn't scare me necessarily. The thing that drew me
Speaker 1: to horror was just like characters, right, and the scream
Speaker 1: queens that the women like buffer the vampires later that
Speaker 1: it's not really horror, or Sigourney Weaver and I talk
Speaker 1: about this in the film, or Jamie Lee Curtis. They
Speaker 1: were like the I'm in that. When I was a kid,
Speaker 1: I was like, that's what I want to be because
Speaker 1: they were they were feminine and they were beautiful, but
Speaker 1: they were also like angry and they were the final girls.
Speaker 1: I loved them, and I loved the monsters. I loved
Speaker 1: the villains. I loved Patrick Bateman, I love Norman Bates,
Speaker 1: Buffalo Bill because again, they were so much more exciting
Speaker 1: and relatable to me. It's like, now there's like a
Speaker 1: trend and cinema of making films about the origin stories
Speaker 1: behind the villains, because it's fascinating, and it's like they're
Speaker 1: not doing that for the action heroes or the Disney princes,
Speaker 1: because the question of like, how did you get so
Speaker 1: brave and charming and kind boring? Who the fuck cares?
Speaker 1: It's just like, I want to know where you got
Speaker 1: what fucked you are? I want to know how you
Speaker 1: ended up so twisted. And those characters were the ones
Speaker 1: that were being cast away for being hideous in some way.
Speaker 1: And I think those characters that I mentioned all to
Speaker 1: me had like a repressed quinness to them, especially Baits,
Speaker 1: especially Baits.
Speaker 2: Oh yeah, I remember the first time I saw Psycho
Speaker 2: because I studied film at a level and then at
Speaker 2: university and I watched it at a level and it's
Speaker 2: still quite it's like Psycho and I would so I
Speaker 2: would have been sixteen when I first watched it, and
Speaker 2: I kind of just thought, well, this isn't going to
Speaker 2: bother me in any way. It's like an old black
Speaker 2: and white film. It's clearly less set, you know, like
Speaker 2: you know, like growing up in the nineties. I was like, Wow,
Speaker 2: this is all very fake, and I was pretty petrified, especially.
Speaker 1: Of what context did you watch it in? Was it
Speaker 1: like a sleepover is it.
Speaker 2: Just watched it home on my own, so I think
Speaker 2: that was it. I was like, suddenly I felt very
Speaker 2: alone a bit where spoiler alert where he runs out
Speaker 2: of you know that shot from the hallway on the
Speaker 2: top of the stairs he runs out with the with
Speaker 2: when you're just with a wig on the back of
Speaker 2: it and you stabs the guy and you're.
Speaker 1: Like horrifying, really really scary.
Speaker 2: I think it's amazing. It's something so kind of I mean,
Speaker 2: that's what obviously what I hitched cocks of a classic,
Speaker 2: but something that classic can still have an impact like now,
Speaker 2: Like I think if I watched it now as a
Speaker 2: fifteen or sixteen year old, I'd probably still be just
Speaker 2: as creeped out by the whole thing.
Speaker 1: That's that is. I talk about horror not scaring me,
Speaker 1: but that's one of the films that scares me. And
Speaker 1: also it's it's again spoiler alert, but it's just so
Speaker 1: open ended of you know, ending with that kind of
Speaker 1: monologue of you know, I wouldn't.
Speaker 2: And then he does the look and that's the look.
Speaker 1: There is something about that that you know, look of.
Speaker 1: I just learned these words recently Louche and Rakish of
Speaker 1: just like presenting yourself beautifully, but if you look closer,
Speaker 1: the devil is behind the person's eyes. There is something
Speaker 1: so attractive, There's something if I would just like describe
Speaker 1: my type. That's so Do you.
Speaker 2: Think you're gonna as it made you want to make
Speaker 2: more films or act in more films?
Speaker 1: I would love two still have a like relationship with
Speaker 1: film in terms of like whatever that might be of
Speaker 1: Do you want some music, I'd love to be a
Speaker 1: part of that. Do you need to like a villain,
Speaker 1: a cameo, a monster, I'd love to be a part
Speaker 1: of That's it just excites me so much, And I've
Speaker 1: tried to lean into as much like film in how
Speaker 1: I've like even just like put out this record in
Speaker 1: terms of just like the merchandising of like the rollout
Speaker 1: of film is so much more fun than music. But yeah,
Speaker 1: I would love to I've definitely made a lot of
Speaker 1: friends through this, but.
Speaker 2: That was top of your list of things to do
Speaker 2: and get more friends, get more For previous episodes of
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Speaker 2: on the music magazine that makes this series, visit Loud
Speaker 2: and Quiet dot com.
Speaker 1: Anyway, good night.
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