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Speaker 1: Coming to you from fabulous Las Vegas. The right side

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Speaker 1: is the winning side. The late move is the correct move.

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Speaker 1: Sports betting capital of the world. We all know when

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Speaker 1: a sharp like me weighs in the lines move, it's

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Speaker 1: a party for your ears. This is the Buffet with

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Speaker 1: Chad and Scooch. I want to buy that guy at buffet. Hello,

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Speaker 1: welcome back to the buffet. I am Chad Millman. Scooch

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Speaker 1: Bob Scucci from Your Leans is off this week. He

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Speaker 1: took off last week too, so clearly he's a little lazy.

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Speaker 1: But Scooch is coming back next week. Um. On the

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Speaker 1: podcast today, we have so much to discuss because we're

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Speaker 1: getting we're in the middle of in the middle of

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Speaker 1: the college basketball conference tournaments. Were a week away from

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Speaker 1: the tournament itself. Beginning later on in the show, Tom

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Speaker 1: Tolbert the voice the afternoon voice of can BA in

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Speaker 1: San Francisco. You also may know him as a former

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Speaker 1: NBA player, also may know him as a former All

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Speaker 1: American in Arizona who also happens to be a huge better,

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Speaker 1: a massive, massive better, and he knows the betting markets. Um,

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Speaker 1: so he's gonna come on a little bit. He's gonna

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Speaker 1: play you bet your life. We're gonna talk a little

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Speaker 1: bit about Arizona. We're gonna talk a little bit about

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Speaker 1: the Pact Golf Tournament. We're going to talk about uh,

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Speaker 1: college basketball in general, heading into March Madness. Before we

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Speaker 1: get to that, my first guest. If you follow gambling Twitter,

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Speaker 1: you know exactly who he is. His his name is

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Speaker 1: Lockey Lockerston. In real life, his name is Ken Barkley,

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Speaker 1: and he is a former ESPN producer. Ken. How are

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Speaker 1: you man, I'm good chat. Thanks for having me on.

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Speaker 1: I appreciate it. So not only are you a former

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Speaker 1: ESPN producer, but you are a brand new contributor to

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Speaker 1: the Action Network. And um, I love how this happened. Like,

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Speaker 1: tell me how you got into gamble ing and then

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Speaker 1: decided you were going to make a go of it

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Speaker 1: in your life in this world. Yeah, no problem. I

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Speaker 1: mean it's been it's been a crazy journey, no question.

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Speaker 1: So I know a lot of people that come onto

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Speaker 1: these podcasts and do a lot of these things, they

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Speaker 1: sort of preface it by saying, I have you know,

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Speaker 1: I have more than forty years in the industry, you know,

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Speaker 1: like I've been around since night or whatever doing this,

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Speaker 1: Like I've only really seriously been doing this for like

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Speaker 1: two to three years. Um, I'm I'm a super newcomer

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Speaker 1: to sort of the serious side of gambling, if you

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Speaker 1: want to call it that, like the actual you know,

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Speaker 1: sort of doing your own work in preparation and handicapping

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Speaker 1: and understanding markets and all those things. And so basically, like,

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Speaker 1: there came a point I worked at ESPN for more

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Speaker 1: than a decade, worked on a lot of really interesting

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Speaker 1: shows with a lot of interesting people, and there basically

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Speaker 1: came a point where my passion for this work sort

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Speaker 1: of ended up overtaking my passion for other stuff that

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Speaker 1: I wanted to do. So as a result, I sort

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Speaker 1: of made a bold switch and now spending much more

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Speaker 1: of my time I'm doing this content that I was before,

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Speaker 1: which which I'm really excited about. I will tell you

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Speaker 1: I had multiple people reach it. You had reached out

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Speaker 1: to me about all this stuff, and we had a

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Speaker 1: conversation and we started talking and you and I, you know,

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Speaker 1: we didn't know each other at ESPN, um despite sort

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Speaker 1: of being there and having a very similar set of friends. Uh,

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Speaker 1: multiple people reached out to me on your behalf, including

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Speaker 1: Stanford Steve Um, including Tom de Cordy, who's the producer

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Speaker 1: of the s VP show, Um talking about what a

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Speaker 1: genius you were when it come when it came to

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Speaker 1: writing about sports betting. Wow, that's the bar has now

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Speaker 1: been set pretty high. So I amost suppose you hadn't

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Speaker 1: said that because now we're but it's gonna be on

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Speaker 1: pins and needles for what I'm gonna say next. But yeah,

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Speaker 1: I mean a ton of there's a ton of smart

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Speaker 1: people that work there, we both know that, and a

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Speaker 1: ton of good content that still comes out of there,

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Speaker 1: some of it about gambling, especially, so great to hear

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Speaker 1: that stuff. Oh I didn't. I figured you put them

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Speaker 1: up to it. I'm like, hey, can you reach out

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Speaker 1: like staying to Stanford into already, Like hey can you

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Speaker 1: reach out to Milman and like putting the good word

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Speaker 1: for me? Make sure to use the word genius. That's

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Speaker 1: really important. So genius, absolute genius. But you've got to

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Speaker 1: do it in a very specific way because you write

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Speaker 1: a lot about futures and you have a story up

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Speaker 1: in the Action Network today about SEC futures and for

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Speaker 1: the tournament, and this is a strange year because Kentucky

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Speaker 1: is not one of the favorites and the two teams

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Speaker 1: is you sort of smartly put it in contextualizing in

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Speaker 1: the piece that are atop the conference seatings are Auburn

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Speaker 1: and Tennessee, who were supposed to be ninth and thirteenth, respectively.

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Speaker 1: How does the conference set up for you then, So

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Speaker 1: the thing that's really interesting is that I feel like

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Speaker 1: people have spent the entire year waiting for a regression

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Speaker 1: from those two teams and and didn't really get one.

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Speaker 1: And as a result, we have sort of this weird

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Speaker 1: unique opportunity in this tournament where the pricing is like

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Speaker 1: kind of out of whack. You basically have the two

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Speaker 1: teams that everyone thought we're gonna be really good, Florida

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Speaker 1: and Kentucky rated a certain way, and now you have

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Speaker 1: Auburn and Tennessee, the teams that actually finished at the

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Speaker 1: top of the conference. All four of those teams basically

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Speaker 1: have identical prices right now. Kentucky has a little bit

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Speaker 1: more attractive price. I think the thing that's really interesting

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Speaker 1: anytime you approach futures, there's actually a difference between who

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Speaker 1: you think is going to win the tournament and who

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Speaker 1: you should bet on, and that will immediately make no

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Speaker 1: sense to a lot of people. So here's sort of

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Speaker 1: what I'm talking about. I think Florida is the most

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Speaker 1: likely team to win this tournament. Um, but their price

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Speaker 1: is sort of correct, and the reason is is that

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Speaker 1: they have to play Tennessee, who is probably the second

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Speaker 1: best team in the conference, in the semifinals. That matchup

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Speaker 1: is incredibly likely. Then most likely they would probably play

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Speaker 1: Kentucky in the final. So there's just not a lot

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Speaker 1: of value in the price right now that you get

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Speaker 1: for them. Meanwhile, Kentucky, who I also think happens to

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Speaker 1: have like a really high feeling, their path is really easy. Uh,

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Speaker 1: they get Auburn on their semi and Auburn is the

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Speaker 1: team I'm trying to fade like crazy right now because

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Speaker 1: they played really poorly down the stretch they played. I

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Speaker 1: would say more like the team that they're supposed to play,

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Speaker 1: like considering all the players that they're missing. Uh they

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Speaker 1: had are too highly touted players that didn't even play

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Speaker 1: this year. Uh their best shot blockers for the year now,

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Speaker 1: So they're a team down the stretch that I've been

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Speaker 1: looking to fade. Kentucky gets them in the semifinal, most

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Speaker 1: likely Uh, they're hanging out around five to one right now.

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Speaker 1: The price has actually gone up like a few cents.

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Speaker 1: So if you grab them at five to one, then

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Speaker 1: even if they just get to the Auburn game or

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Speaker 1: they get to the final, like, there's immediate hedge opportunities

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Speaker 1: if they play Florida, which I think is really likely. Um,

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Speaker 1: So Kentucky's are really attractive option. They're ceiling is really high,

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Speaker 1: they're playing really well right now. Um. The other team

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Speaker 1: that I think is just kind of interesting as a

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Speaker 1: long shot price grab, which I talked about in the article,

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Speaker 1: is Alabama, and they're a team that people were pretty

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Speaker 1: excited about a lot of this season. Uh, Like obviously

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Speaker 1: Colin Sextons somebody who NBA draft guys have been following

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Speaker 1: the whole year. But this is sort of a team

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Speaker 1: with a lot of talent that has had a really

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Speaker 1: tough time with consistency and down the stretch that's come

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Speaker 1: through big time. They lost five games in a row,

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Speaker 1: but nothing has really changed as a result of that.

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Speaker 1: They've just you know, sometimes you look at results and

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Speaker 1: it's there's like a schematic change. There's a lot of injuries,

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Speaker 1: there's you know, some reason for this failure, Like this

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Speaker 1: is sort of the thing an Alabama team really in

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Speaker 1: terms of its core parts. And you know, I think

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Speaker 1: that their ceiling is still pretty high because of the

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Speaker 1: freshman they have on their team. You know, they're like

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Speaker 1: a massive long shot right now. They're twenty to one.

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Speaker 1: They play, they don't play in the first round, but

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Speaker 1: they get Texas A and M in the second round.

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Speaker 1: They played them basically to a draw less than a

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Speaker 1: week ago, a game arguably that they should have won.

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Speaker 1: And Texas A and M. Meanwhile, it's tend to want

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Speaker 1: to win the tournament. So I have two teams who

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Speaker 1: should basically be rated equals, and one of them is

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Speaker 1: tend to want to win the tournament, and one of

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Speaker 1: them is one that immediately yells out to me that

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Speaker 1: there's probably a little bit of value there that's sewed

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Speaker 1: by Alabama's losing streaks. So my sort of philosophy is

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Speaker 1: I'm taking Kentucky and Alabama. I'm hoping that they end

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Speaker 1: up playing sort of in the the Auburn semi. I'm

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Speaker 1: hoping they end up playing each other. When that happens,

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Speaker 1: there's like all kinds of lucrative opportunities available you say

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Speaker 1: it is if it's an automatic, what if it doesn't happen?

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Speaker 1: What if? What if what doesn't happen? Like, let's say

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Speaker 1: Alabama doesn't play Kentucky in that particular situation, or Florida

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Speaker 1: doesn't play and See in the opposite final, And so

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Speaker 1: all of a sudden, all these scenarios that you've sort

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Speaker 1: of very eloquently outlined and that make total sense from

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Speaker 1: a price shopping perspective, what if they don't happen? Then

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Speaker 1: what do you do? Sure? I mean the I mean,

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Speaker 1: what what anyone would tell you about gambling, especially even

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Speaker 1: people that are successful, is you lose all the time.

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Speaker 1: You lose so frequently that it doesn't affect you whatsoever.

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Speaker 1: You're obviously just trying to win more than you lose.

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Speaker 1: So there are hundreds or even thousands of permutations that

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Speaker 1: can take place in this tournament. Like Vanderbilt could end

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Speaker 1: up winning every game and make it to the final.

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Speaker 1: That's a permutation that could happen. The likelihood of it

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Speaker 1: happening is incredibly small, but that's the thing that could happen.

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Speaker 1: And so you know, what I'm kind of trying to

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Speaker 1: plan out is like, what are the things that I

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Speaker 1: think are the most likely, and like the I'm trying

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Speaker 1: to compare the likelihood of this matchup happening with the

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Speaker 1: price that is in the market. So if I think

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Speaker 1: that something is really likely to happen, and the price

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Speaker 1: tells me that the market doesn't think it's likely to happen,

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Speaker 1: that comparison to me creates value, all right. So as

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Speaker 1: you think about what the tournament looks like, is what

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Speaker 1: March madness looks like. How are you trying to price

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Speaker 1: shop for those teams? Where are you finding value? So

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Speaker 1: the thing that gets interesting at this point is you're

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Speaker 1: almost better days with the seventh So you're almost better

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Speaker 1: waiting until the seating has taken place, because obviously so

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Speaker 1: much of the seating is going to determine where value lies.

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Speaker 1: Once you get to this point, you know, when you're

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Speaker 1: in January and February, there are teams that are D

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Speaker 1: one one that are sort of lingering in the middle.

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Speaker 1: They still have a lot of time left to sort

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Speaker 1: of improve their profile and resume and metrics to the

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Speaker 1: point that they sort of fit the profile of what

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Speaker 1: a final four team looks like or what a championship

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Speaker 1: team looks like. Especially defensively. That's usually one of the

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Speaker 1: big things the to find winners is they're adjusted defense

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Speaker 1: is usually through the roof. It's usually in the top ten.

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Speaker 1: So there's still a lot of time left for teams

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Speaker 1: to get there. Now we're you know, two games away,

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Speaker 1: one game away. For some of these teams from the tournament,

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Speaker 1: there's probably not allowed enough time left to change the

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Speaker 1: profile significantly. So as a result, like the long shot

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Speaker 1: long shot teams, like you're really really taking a flyer

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Speaker 1: on that being said, Uh, one team that I think

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Speaker 1: is really really interesting, and I've talked about this a

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Speaker 1: little bit is Florida, and this is a team that

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Speaker 1: everybody sort of that caught everybody by surprise last year

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Speaker 1: and made a really deep run in the tournament, played

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Speaker 1: a lot of dramatic games. Uh, their profile is actually

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Speaker 1: pretty good right now, despite the fact that they've had

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Speaker 1: huge consistency issues all season. They basically have never been

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Speaker 1: able to get their act together for more than a

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Speaker 1: week at a time, and they've showed these flashes that

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Speaker 1: make people like me really excited about what they're ceiling is.

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Speaker 1: And you know, an example is they went to the

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Speaker 1: p K Tournament and they basically, they probably played like

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Speaker 1: the best thirty minutes of basketball of the season against Duke,

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Speaker 1: and we're just running them off the court. Then they

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Speaker 1: ended up blowing that game that caused them to go

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Speaker 1: into kind of like a bit of a tumble, and

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Speaker 1: then the whole conference play was this series of impressive

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Speaker 1: win and then two losses in a row, and then

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Speaker 1: two wins over cupcakes, and then a loss to somebody

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Speaker 1: that you think they should be And so I think

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Speaker 1: their price is really interesting at you know, I think

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Speaker 1: it's around six two one right now. You know, that's

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Speaker 1: that's sort of correct based on how their season is

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Speaker 1: played out. But I think just based on their ceiling

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Speaker 1: and their metrics and how many returning players they had

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Speaker 1: from last year, some of the new pieces, I think,

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Speaker 1: especially with their coach, I think they're a really sort

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Speaker 1: of exciting proposition. They're gonna get seated, you know, somewhere

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Speaker 1: in like five six seven range. I think they are

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Speaker 1: a team that can make a deep run. And I

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Speaker 1: kind of like that price. How do you measure someone

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Speaker 1: like Virginia. And we've written a lot about this on

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Speaker 1: the Action Network And by the way, don't forget later

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Speaker 1: in the show Tom Tolbert UH former NBA player, former

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Speaker 1: college All American, UH, current sports radio host in San Francisco,

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Speaker 1: longtime host. They're also contribute over the years to ESPN.

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Speaker 1: He's coming on the show, talk about betting, talk about

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Speaker 1: is you bet your life moment, talk about UH college

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Speaker 1: basketball in general right now. UM, how do you measure

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Speaker 1: a team? Ken Barkley, a k A. Lackey Lockerson Like

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Speaker 1: Virginia where at the Action Network we've written a lot

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Speaker 1: about how they're still undervalued even as the consensus number

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Speaker 1: one overall team UM from a futures perspective based on

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Speaker 1: how they play offense, they're adjusted UM defensive efficiency rate, UH,

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Speaker 1: sort of the metrics that matter the most if you

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Speaker 1: look back to see who is winning these tournaments UM

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Speaker 1: and who's one of the championships. They're a team that,

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Speaker 1: like if you play a ten thousand times, which we've done,

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Speaker 1: they win more often than the odds are giving them

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Speaker 1: credit for sure. So I have I have a ton

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Speaker 1: of competing thoughts in my head at all times about

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Speaker 1: Virginia because they're they're sort of a fascinating team this

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Speaker 1: year because this you could argue, this is like the

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Speaker 1: best version of Virginia that we can get like what

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Speaker 1: you know, every year they sort of they put together

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Speaker 1: these massive winning regular seasons. I've I've fade them in

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Speaker 1: the tournament every single year and it's always successful. And

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Speaker 1: my philosophy in those cases was, you know, when you

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Speaker 1: play a game against you know, a sort of like

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Speaker 1: mid tier conference opponent or a poor conference opponent, um,

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Speaker 1: you can sort of employ a different strategy than you

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Speaker 1: can against a team that can make shots. And when

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Speaker 1: you play, you know, six games in the tournament, you

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Speaker 1: have to play to win. If you play every game,

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Speaker 1: has you know, the smallest number of possessions possible because

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Speaker 1: of the way you play. To me, that like opens

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Speaker 1: up variants where if a team makes five more threes

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Speaker 1: than they're supposed to, and a lot of these teams

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Speaker 1: have high ceilings with shooting, then you're getting eliminated. So

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Speaker 1: just that doesn't mean they can't win two to three games,

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Speaker 1: win three to four games, but the likelihood of winning

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Speaker 1: all six games to win, to me, is lower with them.

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Speaker 1: The other thing with them is that they're like the

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Speaker 1: best coach team in the entire country, and as a result,

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Speaker 1: they don't really have an extra gear to go to

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Speaker 1: you know, Bennett is getting the most out of them

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Speaker 1: every single game. So you get to the tournament. Sometimes

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Speaker 1: you see these teams like pop for lack of a

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Speaker 1: better term, where finally sort of like the talent and

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Speaker 1: the coaching comes together and they reached this upper echelon,

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Speaker 1: you know. So you saw it with Oregon a little

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Speaker 1: bit last year, and with Virginia there's no extra gear

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Speaker 1: because Bennett is literally squeezing the maximum out of them

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Speaker 1: every single game because he's such a phenomenal coach. And

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Speaker 1: so I think this year's Virginia is the most interesting

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Speaker 1: because there, you know, they're doing all the same things,

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Speaker 1: but they're doing them so much better. And you know,

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Speaker 1: you sort of brought up metrics. One thing that I

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Speaker 1: ran a couple of days ago that I thought was

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Speaker 1: really interesting was, you know, everybody sort of does a

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Speaker 1: different form of this, right, Like what is the profile

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Speaker 1: of a team that wins the n C Double a tournament? Uh,

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Speaker 1: even if you just look at like Ken Pond metrics,

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Speaker 1: like let's try to build a profile for what the

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Speaker 1: winner looks like. Uh, they're sort of like minimums and

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Speaker 1: maximums for teams at the end of the season, after

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Speaker 1: they've won the title. You look at okay, like what

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Speaker 1: were their numbers? The only team that fits every single category.

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Speaker 1: So that's the adjusted offense rating, adjust a defense rating. Uh,

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Speaker 1: what rank they have to be that year in adjusted offense?

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Speaker 1: What rank they have to be that year and adjusted defense.

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Speaker 1: There's four metrics. They're the only one who right now

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Speaker 1: before we've even played the tournament, fits all four of them.

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Speaker 1: As Virginia, they're the only one um which is not

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Speaker 1: totally uncommon, Like teams are gonna, you know, if Duke

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Speaker 1: plays really really well in the tournament, they're gonna get

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Speaker 1: into that profile by the end because their numbers will

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Speaker 1: be so good. But it's just crazy that like Virginia

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Speaker 1: is already there. That's how good they are. So you know,

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Speaker 1: that's that's sort of like a long way of saying,

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Speaker 1: I'm not really sure how to how to address Virginia

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Speaker 1: this year. Like I still think that my philosophy about

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Speaker 1: their team is still logical and and the path will

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Speaker 1: make a big difference. But you know, when you encounter

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Speaker 1: more and more teams that are better and better at

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Speaker 1: making shots and you play this style, like, to me,

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Speaker 1: you're sort of ripe to be upset at some point

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Speaker 1: along the way. Yeah, well that's actually really interesting. I

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Speaker 1: hadn't thought about sort of that possession where if everyone

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Speaker 1: is going to be so valuable, you actually limit the

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Speaker 1: opportunity to come back in a game. And that's what

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Speaker 1: those things are all about. Like if you're if you're

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Speaker 1: playing so methodically, you can't break yourself out of that

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Speaker 1: particular rhythm. Sometimes you screw yourself, right, Absolutely, Virginia games

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Speaker 1: always sort of play out a certain way, like how

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Speaker 1: many times this season have you seen Virginia down by

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Speaker 1: fifteen points? Like how many times have you seen it?

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Speaker 1: Like it almost never happens. Um, they get like you know,

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Speaker 1: obviously they play a lot better with a lead, and

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Speaker 1: they milk the clock and you know they're getting great

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Speaker 1: offensive possessions all the time, Like their offensive provisiency is

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Speaker 1: very good. Um, and obviously they play phenomenal defense. But

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Speaker 1: you know, the types of teams they're going to be

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Speaker 1: playing along the way, like that's it's possibly going to

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Speaker 1: put them in a position that they're unaccustomed to being

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Speaker 1: in and that will require them playing in a way

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Speaker 1: that they don't want to play. All right, So in

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Speaker 1: that regard, do you feel like Virginia as a futures

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Speaker 1: bet is actually a pretty good play because based on

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Speaker 1: the metrics and based on the simulations, um they are

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Speaker 1: the most likely team to win, and there is still

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Speaker 1: value just based on the mass. I think. I think

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Speaker 1: it's tough. I think like the you know, I like

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Speaker 1: truth be told. I actually I did something I've never

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Speaker 1: done before. I have a Virginia futures ticket from a

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Speaker 1: couple of months ago. I have thirty three to one,

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Speaker 1: and I'm for months I've been in my head kind

361
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Speaker 1: of racking my brain with at what point do I

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Speaker 1: want to buy out of this? Like do I I

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Speaker 1: probably want to wait for the seating process to at

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Speaker 1: least take place so I can kind of project the path.

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Speaker 1: But I'm I'm trying to get out of this as

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Speaker 1: fast as possible, with you know, at getting as much

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Speaker 1: money as I can. But like, this is not a

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Speaker 1: ticket that I'm interested in holding onto very long. Uh,

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Speaker 1: just because of all the my sort of preconceived notions

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Speaker 1: of what I think Virginia basketball is and what that means,

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Speaker 1: you know, like if you're looking at their prices right now,

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Speaker 1: I think you have to wait for the field to

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Speaker 1: be said, Like somebody's gonna get an easy draw here,

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Speaker 1: probably Duke because they do every year. But like, somebody's

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Speaker 1: gonna get an easy draw here, and you know at

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Speaker 1: that point, you know, maybe do you grab Virginia to

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Speaker 1: win the region at two to one or one seventy

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Speaker 1: five or something? Uh? Kind of knowing what the path

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Speaker 1: is like? Uh? Like maybe, but I think, you know,

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Speaker 1: with all of the attention on them and the market activity,

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Speaker 1: like I think the value has been kind of like

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Speaker 1: sucked out of that price. Uh. As of right now?

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Speaker 1: All right, here's my last question for you. There are

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Speaker 1: currently props that joe Lunhardy, our former colleague at ESPN,

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Speaker 1: one of our favorite people at least mind Joey Brackett's

386
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Speaker 1: uh will go undefeated? Will he get the um everything

387
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Speaker 1: from Willie go undefeated and get all sixty eight teams?

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Speaker 1: Which has happened twice? Two? Uh? Will he yet the

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Speaker 1: first four seeds correct the number one seeds? Um. I

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Speaker 1: love the fact there are props on Joey and Joey brackets.

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Speaker 1: I feel like you've entered the cultural zeitgeist in an

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Speaker 1: entirely different way. When five Times, which is a relatively

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Speaker 1: sharp book, is offering props on um on you were

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Speaker 1: going to do in your job. Yeah, I mean it's

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Speaker 1: I mean it's it's incredible. It's sort of like the

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Speaker 1: the lead Corso headgear props if you can find them.

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Speaker 1: This is like that to the maximum, right, So that's

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Speaker 1: it's not just some kind of one off entertainment prop.

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Speaker 1: Will he get everything right? Yes? No, Like there was

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Speaker 1: a lot of time and effort putting into pricing and

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Speaker 1: variety uh in the offerings, which is which is really interesting.

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Speaker 1: These were these were up before even the overtime props

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Speaker 1: that like I priced and some of the other buzzer

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Speaker 1: beater props and stuff. These these were up first, uh,

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Speaker 1: which is just really funny to me that like that's

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Speaker 1: where we are. Um. I think there was a really

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Speaker 1: interesting piece written action network that sort of prices these out.

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Speaker 1: And you know, the the reason these props are so

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Speaker 1: interesting to me is that you know, there is data

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Speaker 1: that you can go back and put together. You know

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Speaker 1: a lot of people are kind of just throwing ten bucks,

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Speaker 1: twenty bucks into a lot of these. The limits are

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Speaker 1: really low, um, and not maybe doing all the logical

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Speaker 1: calculation associated with it. There is kind of a way

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Speaker 1: to price most of this stuff a lot of the time,

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Speaker 1: and you know, that article kind of goes into the

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Speaker 1: nuts and bolts of you know, exactly how many teams

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Speaker 1: he gets every year, what the average is there for,

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Speaker 1: what the right prices, all that kind of stuff. I

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Speaker 1: think that's interesting to me that the article brought up

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Speaker 1: is how many one seeds he's gonna get right and

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Speaker 1: how how much different that is this year than the

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Speaker 1: previous pricing. And I think that goes into a philosophy

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Speaker 1: that you're going to hear a ton going forward. Uh

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Speaker 1: in the tournament, which is, oh man, this year, anybody

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Speaker 1: can win, you know. I think I heard Dick Vital

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Speaker 1: say that during the Gonzaga game fifteen times last night, UM,

428
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Speaker 1: because Gonzaga is one of the teams that they were

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Speaker 1: hyping up as as a contender. And I think this

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Speaker 1: price sort of reflects that, which is, we don't really

431
00:20:41,080 --> 00:20:43,359
Speaker 1: know who the best four teams are. UM. And I

432
00:20:43,400 --> 00:20:45,520
Speaker 1: think that's true this year in terms of who gets

433
00:20:45,520 --> 00:20:48,720
Speaker 1: the one seeds. I think that's still kind of unpredictable,

434
00:20:48,800 --> 00:20:51,919
Speaker 1: based on especially the a CC tournament. UM. You know,

435
00:20:52,000 --> 00:20:53,680
Speaker 1: I think like if I had to guess, I would

436
00:20:53,680 --> 00:20:56,320
Speaker 1: say he does get all four, right, But I mean

437
00:20:56,359 --> 00:20:58,159
Speaker 1: the price is sort of reflecting that it's minus one

438
00:20:58,200 --> 00:21:01,080
Speaker 1: forty that he will. Uh maybe there's like a little

439
00:21:01,080 --> 00:21:03,080
Speaker 1: bit of value there because by the time we get

440
00:21:03,080 --> 00:21:04,960
Speaker 1: to a certain point, you know, he's going to be

441
00:21:05,000 --> 00:21:08,120
Speaker 1: able to create a profile he being Lenardi. Uh, he's

442
00:21:08,119 --> 00:21:10,400
Speaker 1: gonna be able to pretty accurately project this. I think

443
00:21:10,440 --> 00:21:13,160
Speaker 1: once we have all the information in the thing that's

444
00:21:13,160 --> 00:21:15,560
Speaker 1: really interesting to me though, with this philosophy of anybody

445
00:21:15,600 --> 00:21:18,840
Speaker 1: can win, is I think it's completely fraudulent. Um. I

446
00:21:18,920 --> 00:21:21,760
Speaker 1: think that there's actually a very small number of teams

447
00:21:21,760 --> 00:21:23,800
Speaker 1: that can actually win the tournament. Now, there are teams

448
00:21:23,800 --> 00:21:25,359
Speaker 1: that can go on deep runs, and there are like

449
00:21:25,440 --> 00:21:28,439
Speaker 1: thirty of them, that's no question team I mean the

450
00:21:28,440 --> 00:21:30,920
Speaker 1: equivalent of South Carolina last year. But I mean, like

451
00:21:31,119 --> 00:21:33,800
Speaker 1: if Loyal the Chicago goes to the Elite eight, does

452
00:21:33,840 --> 00:21:36,240
Speaker 1: that mean anyone can win the tournament? Will know, because

453
00:21:36,240 --> 00:21:37,560
Speaker 1: that means they're gonna get to that point and they're

454
00:21:37,560 --> 00:21:40,040
Speaker 1: gonna play Duke and they're gonna lose. So like, I

455
00:21:40,080 --> 00:21:42,840
Speaker 1: think there's maybe six seven teams that can win the

456
00:21:42,840 --> 00:21:45,280
Speaker 1: tournament this year. Uh So I just you know, I

457
00:21:45,320 --> 00:21:47,760
Speaker 1: kind of wanted to take a few seconds to say

458
00:21:47,840 --> 00:21:49,760
Speaker 1: you're gonna get a ton of this philosophy in the

459
00:21:49,800 --> 00:21:53,359
Speaker 1: next week and or this opinion, this take, and to me,

460
00:21:53,520 --> 00:21:56,840
Speaker 1: this take is way off base. Is there's six or

461
00:21:56,840 --> 00:22:00,199
Speaker 1: seven teams. Who do you think they are the uh,

462
00:22:00,320 --> 00:22:02,240
Speaker 1: the teams that I've sort of identified right now that

463
00:22:02,280 --> 00:22:10,440
Speaker 1: I think can win uh Duke, Michigan State, Villanova, Florida, Kentucky, Wichita.

464
00:22:11,920 --> 00:22:15,240
Speaker 1: I think that the team that worries me the most

465
00:22:15,280 --> 00:22:17,400
Speaker 1: that's not in that group. And it's funny we talked

466
00:22:17,400 --> 00:22:20,760
Speaker 1: about Virginia forever. Cincinnati worries me a ton this year

467
00:22:20,800 --> 00:22:24,080
Speaker 1: because I have no exposure to them whatsoever to do anything,

468
00:22:24,560 --> 00:22:27,719
Speaker 1: and they actually have a profile this year that's like

469
00:22:28,080 --> 00:22:30,080
Speaker 1: really equivalent to a team that makes a deep run

470
00:22:30,080 --> 00:22:32,760
Speaker 1: in the tournament. Their second and defensive efficiency with a

471
00:22:32,840 --> 00:22:36,120
Speaker 1: really low number, and their offensive efficiency isn't as poor

472
00:22:36,160 --> 00:22:38,520
Speaker 1: as it normally is. Uh, and they've shown an ability

473
00:22:38,520 --> 00:22:40,840
Speaker 1: to play really well away from home, better than they

474
00:22:40,840 --> 00:22:43,720
Speaker 1: normally do. Uh. They're the team that is sort of

475
00:22:43,760 --> 00:22:46,320
Speaker 1: like not in my group that I I may have

476
00:22:46,359 --> 00:22:48,119
Speaker 1: to add to my group before kind of the tournament

477
00:22:48,160 --> 00:22:53,600
Speaker 1: gets set. You didn't mention Virginia. You mentioned Duke Michigan State, Florida, Kentucky,

478
00:22:53,960 --> 00:22:59,119
Speaker 1: Villanova WA. Arizona is the other team. Sorry that I

479
00:22:59,840 --> 00:23:01,600
Speaker 1: had to add them to my list. Now that they're

480
00:23:02,000 --> 00:23:03,560
Speaker 1: sort of the scandal has passed and it looks like

481
00:23:03,600 --> 00:23:06,680
Speaker 1: everyone's gonna play. Arizona can definitely win. It's not super likely,

482
00:23:06,680 --> 00:23:09,640
Speaker 1: but they could definitely win. I feel like you need

483
00:23:09,680 --> 00:23:13,320
Speaker 1: to write this story before the tournament, like this could

484
00:23:13,359 --> 00:23:17,640
Speaker 1: be your good Monday column. Sure, absolutely so. The uh

485
00:23:17,640 --> 00:23:20,159
Speaker 1: in the interest of self promotion, Episode one of the

486
00:23:20,240 --> 00:23:23,480
Speaker 1: Locky Lockerson podcast was just recorded last weekend. Uh. This

487
00:23:23,560 --> 00:23:25,840
Speaker 1: was one of the primary commentaries that I did up

488
00:23:25,880 --> 00:23:28,600
Speaker 1: the front. So, uh, you know, anyway I can spread

489
00:23:28,600 --> 00:23:31,320
Speaker 1: this this gospel to the people, I'm happy to do it.

490
00:23:32,040 --> 00:23:34,000
Speaker 1: Do you write the story, will link to the podcast?

491
00:23:34,040 --> 00:23:37,000
Speaker 1: Everybody wins? Yeah, absolutely, I'm in I'm in on it

492
00:23:37,880 --> 00:23:41,159
Speaker 1: all right. Lacky Lockerson also known as Ken Barkley. I

493
00:23:41,160 --> 00:23:43,239
Speaker 1: wish I could call you Ken tremendous. I feel like

494
00:23:43,280 --> 00:23:45,040
Speaker 1: that name. It's taken, but I would have liked to

495
00:23:45,040 --> 00:23:48,840
Speaker 1: have called you that. Uh. Very knowledgeable, great work. I'm

496
00:23:48,880 --> 00:23:51,120
Speaker 1: so glad all those people from ESPN that we mutually

497
00:23:51,119 --> 00:23:52,959
Speaker 1: know Colin told me that I had to hire you.

498
00:23:54,280 --> 00:23:56,360
Speaker 1: I'm happy they did too. So I'm in a great

499
00:23:56,400 --> 00:23:58,960
Speaker 1: spot and and happy to be here. All right, brother,

500
00:23:59,119 --> 00:24:02,280
Speaker 1: thank you man taught you later great Thanks. Next up

501
00:24:02,320 --> 00:24:08,080
Speaker 1: on the buffet, as promised, longtime voice of afternoon Sports

502
00:24:08,160 --> 00:24:11,520
Speaker 1: radio in San Francisco and K and B R. Former

503
00:24:12,160 --> 00:24:18,920
Speaker 1: NBA player, former college superstar Arizona also a bit of

504
00:24:18,960 --> 00:24:23,160
Speaker 1: a better Tom Tilbert, How you doing, buddy, tremendous chat

505
00:24:23,200 --> 00:24:25,639
Speaker 1: yourself and by the way, superstars a little bit of

506
00:24:25,640 --> 00:24:28,600
Speaker 1: an over exaggeration, maybe a lot of an over exaggeration,

507
00:24:28,640 --> 00:24:31,240
Speaker 1: but I'll take it. Were you an All American? Did

508
00:24:31,240 --> 00:24:33,800
Speaker 1: you make any All American teams? I think I identified

509
00:24:33,800 --> 00:24:36,080
Speaker 1: you as an All American in the earlier interview when

510
00:24:36,119 --> 00:24:37,520
Speaker 1: I was previewing who was going to be on in

511
00:24:37,560 --> 00:24:40,120
Speaker 1: the show today? Well not unless my mom and dad

512
00:24:40,119 --> 00:24:43,359
Speaker 1: had an All American list. Well that's too bad. I

513
00:24:43,359 --> 00:24:45,239
Speaker 1: feel like you've been around for so long, and the

514
00:24:45,280 --> 00:24:47,080
Speaker 1: fact you played in the NBA for so long, and

515
00:24:47,119 --> 00:24:49,840
Speaker 1: that you were famous in college, and I feel like

516
00:24:49,960 --> 00:24:53,840
Speaker 1: everybody at Arizona in the like eighties when you played

517
00:24:53,880 --> 00:24:56,480
Speaker 1: there was an All American, so I figured you must

518
00:24:56,480 --> 00:24:59,199
Speaker 1: have been an All American. That's great. I appreciate I mean,

519
00:24:59,240 --> 00:25:00,800
Speaker 1: I appreciate the for it can give me like a

520
00:25:00,840 --> 00:25:04,720
Speaker 1: Lifetime Achievement award or something like that. But unfortunately, now

521
00:25:04,760 --> 00:25:07,440
Speaker 1: we had two All Americans on our teams. Shanellett was one,

522
00:25:07,480 --> 00:25:11,320
Speaker 1: Steve Kerry was the other one. I mean, those guys

523
00:25:11,320 --> 00:25:13,320
Speaker 1: did all, right, what are you gonna do? Yeah, okay,

524
00:25:13,400 --> 00:25:16,199
Speaker 1: I've I've been too bad for themselves. Actually, when you

525
00:25:16,280 --> 00:25:18,880
Speaker 1: look at Arizona, like what's going on in Arizona right now?

526
00:25:19,440 --> 00:25:21,640
Speaker 1: What do you think of it? Both from a an

527
00:25:21,640 --> 00:25:23,679
Speaker 1: alumni perspective and then what do you think of it

528
00:25:23,800 --> 00:25:28,800
Speaker 1: from someone who analyzes sports? You know that one's that

529
00:25:28,880 --> 00:25:32,440
Speaker 1: one's tough because I've talked about that type of stuff,

530
00:25:32,800 --> 00:25:35,159
Speaker 1: uh for a long time, and I've been done this

531
00:25:35,160 --> 00:25:37,560
Speaker 1: twenty plus years and there's always been scandals that it's

532
00:25:37,560 --> 00:25:42,760
Speaker 1: been football or basketball. And it's been a rough, a

533
00:25:42,880 --> 00:25:44,879
Speaker 1: rough go of it. The last few months for Arizona.

534
00:25:44,920 --> 00:25:49,840
Speaker 1: You had the allegations of sexual misconduct going on when

535
00:25:49,920 --> 00:25:52,840
Speaker 1: rich Rod was there as a football coach, so he

536
00:25:53,320 --> 00:25:56,199
Speaker 1: was let go. There were allegations of players doing stuff.

537
00:25:57,280 --> 00:26:00,480
Speaker 1: Then you get the book Richardson Thing where he's funneling

538
00:26:00,480 --> 00:26:04,879
Speaker 1: money or steering players to Arizona or whatever, and he

539
00:26:05,000 --> 00:26:07,600
Speaker 1: gets putting cuffs and lead away and then you know

540
00:26:07,640 --> 00:26:10,800
Speaker 1: Alonzo Treer and trace elements of the drug that he

541
00:26:10,800 --> 00:26:12,879
Speaker 1: had an assist him last year and he's been cleared

542
00:26:12,920 --> 00:26:15,439
Speaker 1: to play now. And then two days after that, it

543
00:26:15,520 --> 00:26:20,440
Speaker 1: was the whole you know, uh FBA wire tap fiasco.

544
00:26:21,280 --> 00:26:22,840
Speaker 1: And I don't, I be honest, I don't know what

545
00:26:22,960 --> 00:26:25,879
Speaker 1: to think. I know Sean Miller, I've met him a

546
00:26:25,960 --> 00:26:29,040
Speaker 1: number of times, and you know, I believe him when

547
00:26:29,040 --> 00:26:32,240
Speaker 1: he says he's never done this, But I mean, take

548
00:26:32,280 --> 00:26:34,840
Speaker 1: it from the source. I went to Arizona. I want

549
00:26:34,840 --> 00:26:37,520
Speaker 1: to believe him, and other coaches. Maybe I don't want

550
00:26:37,520 --> 00:26:39,520
Speaker 1: to believe because I don't have a personal connection with him,

551
00:26:39,520 --> 00:26:41,800
Speaker 1: but you know, I believe him, and I know I'll believe.

552
00:26:41,840 --> 00:26:44,000
Speaker 1: Like I said this on the radio, people rolling their eyes, going,

553
00:26:44,040 --> 00:26:45,679
Speaker 1: of course, you went to Arizona, and I totally get

554
00:26:45,760 --> 00:26:48,760
Speaker 1: that I'd be doing the same exact thing uh people

555
00:26:48,760 --> 00:26:50,680
Speaker 1: are doing, you know when I say something like that,

556
00:26:51,160 --> 00:26:53,680
Speaker 1: But it's just weird. The whole time frame was off

557
00:26:53,680 --> 00:26:56,560
Speaker 1: with the wire tap. No one can hear the wire tap,

558
00:26:56,720 --> 00:26:58,840
Speaker 1: the FBA is probably not going to release it until

559
00:26:58,960 --> 00:27:00,760
Speaker 1: you know, this thing goes to trial, and who knows

560
00:27:00,760 --> 00:27:03,280
Speaker 1: when it's going to trial. So it was just it's

561
00:27:03,320 --> 00:27:06,040
Speaker 1: just a bizarre thing that you can accuse somebody. Somebody

562
00:27:06,040 --> 00:27:10,080
Speaker 1: can leak information and really not have any information they

563
00:27:10,080 --> 00:27:13,120
Speaker 1: can share with anybody. But ESPN stands by their report

564
00:27:13,600 --> 00:27:16,080
Speaker 1: and Sean saying that he didn't do anything. So the

565
00:27:16,119 --> 00:27:20,240
Speaker 1: one thing I do feel confident in saying someone's line. Yeah, well,

566
00:27:21,560 --> 00:27:24,040
Speaker 1: but isn't that often the case? But that's the problem.

567
00:27:24,119 --> 00:27:28,080
Speaker 1: That's often the case in college sports. It's like you

568
00:27:28,119 --> 00:27:31,359
Speaker 1: almost can't have the conversation without having the conversation about

569
00:27:32,280 --> 00:27:37,600
Speaker 1: the inequities in college sports, or how dirty college sports are,

570
00:27:37,840 --> 00:27:40,040
Speaker 1: or the n c double A not managing it right.

571
00:27:40,880 --> 00:27:43,600
Speaker 1: What do you do to fix it at this point? Well,

572
00:27:43,600 --> 00:27:48,439
Speaker 1: that's a great question, and it's been going on for ever. Uh.

573
00:27:49,840 --> 00:27:52,479
Speaker 1: When I went to Vegas all right, didn't go to Vegas.

574
00:27:53,600 --> 00:27:56,120
Speaker 1: I got recruited by Vegas many many, many years ago,

575
00:27:56,800 --> 00:28:00,320
Speaker 1: and I remember them telling me I won't yeh. When

576
00:28:00,359 --> 00:28:01,800
Speaker 1: I was an off metric right before I was not

577
00:28:01,800 --> 00:28:03,320
Speaker 1: All American. Absolutely, I think I might have had an

578
00:28:03,320 --> 00:28:07,560
Speaker 1: All American Burger on the recruiting visit. Uh. They told

579
00:28:07,640 --> 00:28:09,520
Speaker 1: me that they got out on a player at ninety

580
00:28:09,600 --> 00:28:15,160
Speaker 1: thousand and this was like in late eighties orbe late eighties. Uh,

581
00:28:15,280 --> 00:28:17,199
Speaker 1: and it just said it didn't stun me back then.

582
00:28:17,240 --> 00:28:18,760
Speaker 1: It doesn't stun me now. I mean, this is going

583
00:28:18,800 --> 00:28:22,000
Speaker 1: on before that, the conversation, after that conversation. I mean,

584
00:28:22,000 --> 00:28:25,240
Speaker 1: it just that's the way college athletics are. I mean,

585
00:28:25,240 --> 00:28:27,520
Speaker 1: you're trying to get an advantage. It's it's money for

586
00:28:27,560 --> 00:28:30,800
Speaker 1: the school, it's money for the coach. Unfortunately, it's not

587
00:28:30,840 --> 00:28:32,840
Speaker 1: money for any of the players. That's why they decided

588
00:28:32,840 --> 00:28:34,600
Speaker 1: they're going to take it, and that's why you get

589
00:28:34,600 --> 00:28:38,280
Speaker 1: steered to certain places. Uh. And kids are saying, well,

590
00:28:38,280 --> 00:28:40,680
Speaker 1: wait a minute, I'm making millions and billions of dollars

591
00:28:40,720 --> 00:28:42,160
Speaker 1: for these people and I'm not getting paid. If I

592
00:28:42,200 --> 00:28:43,720
Speaker 1: get a chance to get paid, I'm gonna get paid.

593
00:28:43,720 --> 00:28:46,920
Speaker 1: And I don't blame I don't blame the kids. Uh.

594
00:28:47,280 --> 00:28:48,960
Speaker 1: How do you fix That's a good one. I mean,

595
00:28:48,960 --> 00:28:53,520
Speaker 1: I don't know all the all the details of what

596
00:28:53,600 --> 00:28:55,680
Speaker 1: I would propose, but I would say I would I

597
00:28:55,680 --> 00:28:58,720
Speaker 1: would propose that kids get paid, not by the colleges,

598
00:28:58,800 --> 00:29:01,200
Speaker 1: but they get to hire rippers seditive. And if a

599
00:29:01,240 --> 00:29:02,960
Speaker 1: shoe company wants to pay my hunter grand to go

600
00:29:03,000 --> 00:29:05,360
Speaker 1: to Arizona, pay Hunter Grand to go to Arizona. If

601
00:29:05,360 --> 00:29:07,280
Speaker 1: a local business wants to pay money to go to

602
00:29:07,320 --> 00:29:09,720
Speaker 1: the school, let them pay money to go to the school.

603
00:29:09,840 --> 00:29:11,560
Speaker 1: I know people would say, well, all the big schools

604
00:29:11,600 --> 00:29:13,880
Speaker 1: are gonna get all the best athletes. Well, yeah, they

605
00:29:13,880 --> 00:29:17,520
Speaker 1: already do. I mean all it's not like in basketball,

606
00:29:18,240 --> 00:29:21,640
Speaker 1: Kentucky and Akron are ever going for the same player.

607
00:29:21,880 --> 00:29:23,480
Speaker 1: I mean, the same schools that are going for the

608
00:29:23,520 --> 00:29:25,440
Speaker 1: same players would be going for the same players, whether

609
00:29:25,480 --> 00:29:27,880
Speaker 1: they're getting paid or not. So I think if they

610
00:29:27,960 --> 00:29:29,400
Speaker 1: you know, if someone wants to pay money to go

611
00:29:29,440 --> 00:29:30,800
Speaker 1: to the school, let them pay them money to go

612
00:29:30,800 --> 00:29:32,920
Speaker 1: to a school, even if the school doesn't have to

613
00:29:32,960 --> 00:29:37,719
Speaker 1: be be involved. I think, uh, letting the kids go

614
00:29:38,680 --> 00:29:40,920
Speaker 1: enter the NBA draft then come back to college even

615
00:29:40,960 --> 00:29:43,520
Speaker 1: if they if they don't get drafted, that's fine. You

616
00:29:43,560 --> 00:29:45,960
Speaker 1: want to go after your sophomore year, you don't get drafted,

617
00:29:46,040 --> 00:29:48,760
Speaker 1: come back to school. That's not a scholarship available for you.

618
00:29:48,800 --> 00:29:51,000
Speaker 1: Oh well, go find a scholarship somewhere. Maybe there's not

619
00:29:51,000 --> 00:29:53,360
Speaker 1: available one at your school. But I think we need

620
00:29:53,400 --> 00:29:55,280
Speaker 1: to take care of the kids more than we need

621
00:29:55,320 --> 00:29:58,080
Speaker 1: to take care of the coaches. I mean, Tubby Smith

622
00:29:58,120 --> 00:30:01,640
Speaker 1: came out a couple of days go saying that, uh,

623
00:30:01,720 --> 00:30:05,080
Speaker 1: we're just allowing the kids to quit by transferring. It's like, well,

624
00:30:05,120 --> 00:30:07,200
Speaker 1: wait a minute, what do the coaches get to do?

625
00:30:07,560 --> 00:30:09,800
Speaker 1: I mean, the coaches get to transfer whenever they want to,

626
00:30:10,240 --> 00:30:12,200
Speaker 1: and I don't want to hear about contracts, and there's

627
00:30:12,200 --> 00:30:14,400
Speaker 1: always a buyout. And if you ever want to move schools,

628
00:30:14,440 --> 00:30:17,080
Speaker 1: you can move schools. Kids can't move schools. I've got

629
00:30:17,160 --> 00:30:19,280
Speaker 1: to sit out a year. And they're the ones that

630
00:30:19,360 --> 00:30:21,520
Speaker 1: are I'm not saying they're they're they're the ones that

631
00:30:21,560 --> 00:30:23,920
Speaker 1: are solely responsible for making all the money. That would

632
00:30:23,920 --> 00:30:26,720
Speaker 1: be inaccurate. But without the athletes, you're not gonna have

633
00:30:26,720 --> 00:30:28,320
Speaker 1: a sport, and it's kind of hard to make money.

634
00:30:28,760 --> 00:30:31,200
Speaker 1: I don't think people want to watch nothing. So I

635
00:30:31,760 --> 00:30:33,880
Speaker 1: just think we need to take care of the kids. Uh,

636
00:30:34,040 --> 00:30:36,560
Speaker 1: take care of the kids more. Make the money above board.

637
00:30:36,800 --> 00:30:38,960
Speaker 1: Then we won't worry who's getting paid and won't have

638
00:30:39,040 --> 00:30:42,120
Speaker 1: investigations on who's getting paid. It'll be well, yeah, we

639
00:30:42,160 --> 00:30:44,880
Speaker 1: know they're getting paid and let's stop calling it if

640
00:30:44,920 --> 00:30:46,960
Speaker 1: we get to get rid of the word amateurism, get

641
00:30:47,040 --> 00:30:49,400
Speaker 1: rid of that word, and I think would be okay

642
00:30:49,400 --> 00:30:51,520
Speaker 1: because people still fall in love with this idea, this

643
00:30:51,720 --> 00:30:54,480
Speaker 1: notion how pure amateurism is, and it's a bunch of bullcrap,

644
00:30:55,120 --> 00:30:57,240
Speaker 1: is what it is. I mean, go with the Olympic models.

645
00:30:57,280 --> 00:30:59,840
Speaker 1: People still watch the Olympics now and they're making money

646
00:30:59,840 --> 00:31:04,880
Speaker 1: on the side, and rightfully so. So UM, I feel

647
00:31:04,920 --> 00:31:09,640
Speaker 1: like you are making a similar argument for sports betting

648
00:31:09,960 --> 00:31:14,960
Speaker 1: right in that UM athletes get paid. You might as

649
00:31:14,960 --> 00:31:19,440
Speaker 1: well make it above board instead of trying to legislate

650
00:31:19,480 --> 00:31:22,880
Speaker 1: that it's not going to change, and ultimately you're not

651
00:31:22,920 --> 00:31:25,480
Speaker 1: doing anything that's sort of improves the life of the

652
00:31:25,520 --> 00:31:28,960
Speaker 1: athletes or makes life better for the organization that's running it. UM,

653
00:31:29,000 --> 00:31:30,800
Speaker 1: and you're trying to adhere to an ideal that no

654
00:31:30,840 --> 00:31:34,240
Speaker 1: longer exists. You're into betting like you're making the same

655
00:31:34,240 --> 00:31:36,600
Speaker 1: case for legalized sports betting. So one of the things

656
00:31:36,640 --> 00:31:38,560
Speaker 1: that always comes up when you talk about legalized sports

657
00:31:38,560 --> 00:31:43,080
Speaker 1: betting is at then it's okay at the professional levels,

658
00:31:43,400 --> 00:31:45,120
Speaker 1: it's not okay at the n C Double A level,

659
00:31:45,160 --> 00:31:48,520
Speaker 1: because that is a sport where those that's an area

660
00:31:48,560 --> 00:31:51,560
Speaker 1: where actually the athletes could be more corrupted because they

661
00:31:51,560 --> 00:31:53,040
Speaker 1: aren't making the kind of money that people at the

662
00:31:53,120 --> 00:31:55,120
Speaker 1: NBA and the NFL levels are making. What's your take

663
00:31:55,160 --> 00:31:58,800
Speaker 1: on that, Oh, I mean it's just erroneous logic, is

664
00:31:58,840 --> 00:32:01,120
Speaker 1: what it is. I mean, it's the same thing is

665
00:32:01,200 --> 00:32:05,160
Speaker 1: the NBA. I read somewhere where the Cardinals and the

666
00:32:05,280 --> 00:32:07,840
Speaker 1: Royals also want to do this. If they want, you know,

667
00:32:08,400 --> 00:32:10,800
Speaker 1: legalized sports betting in their state, or the NBA wants

668
00:32:10,880 --> 00:32:12,920
Speaker 1: legalized sports betting, they want to charge you one percent

669
00:32:13,480 --> 00:32:16,000
Speaker 1: integrity tax, which just makes me laugh. It's like the

670
00:32:16,040 --> 00:32:18,040
Speaker 1: stupidest thing. I mean, who came up with this name,

671
00:32:18,320 --> 00:32:20,400
Speaker 1: let's call it the integrity tax? And who people will

672
00:32:20,400 --> 00:32:21,760
Speaker 1: buy it? Well, I guess people will buy it. They

673
00:32:21,760 --> 00:32:25,360
Speaker 1: don't understand gambling. People don't understand gambling are gonna laugh

674
00:32:25,440 --> 00:32:28,360
Speaker 1: at the integrity tex because the here's the bottom line,

675
00:32:28,360 --> 00:32:31,840
Speaker 1: and I've been saying this for years and years and years,

676
00:32:33,200 --> 00:32:35,600
Speaker 1: you're no more likely to be able to fix the game.

677
00:32:36,280 --> 00:32:40,959
Speaker 1: Whether betting is legal in the States, I mean everywhere

678
00:32:40,960 --> 00:32:44,960
Speaker 1: outside of the Nevada or illegal, I mean, because people

679
00:32:45,000 --> 00:32:47,120
Speaker 1: can put down bets wherever they want to put down bets.

680
00:32:47,120 --> 00:32:48,680
Speaker 1: I mean, if people want to get down money, didn't

681
00:32:48,680 --> 00:32:50,200
Speaker 1: get down money right now, they just got to get

682
00:32:50,200 --> 00:32:54,560
Speaker 1: it down off offshore. If you make betting legal here,

683
00:32:55,600 --> 00:33:00,400
Speaker 1: it's the reason it's gonna be no more like you're

684
00:33:00,440 --> 00:33:03,240
Speaker 1: gonna be no more likely to see game fixing. Is

685
00:33:03,280 --> 00:33:07,400
Speaker 1: the watchdogs are the books themselves. I mean the books themselves.

686
00:33:07,440 --> 00:33:10,320
Speaker 1: If they're not vigilant, If the books themselves they're not vigilant,

687
00:33:10,800 --> 00:33:13,760
Speaker 1: they're the ones that stand to lose. Yes, you don't

688
00:33:13,800 --> 00:33:16,040
Speaker 1: want to have scandals in sports. You don't want it

689
00:33:16,080 --> 00:33:19,040
Speaker 1: to be w W E where you feel like everything

690
00:33:19,120 --> 00:33:21,920
Speaker 1: scripted and why am I watching? But the books are

691
00:33:21,920 --> 00:33:24,640
Speaker 1: the ones that are the best watch dogs because if

692
00:33:24,640 --> 00:33:27,320
Speaker 1: they hang a bad line, or if someone wants to

693
00:33:27,360 --> 00:33:29,800
Speaker 1: come in and bet that they don't know uh and

694
00:33:29,920 --> 00:33:32,200
Speaker 1: bet large sums of money, and they're the ones that

695
00:33:32,240 --> 00:33:34,560
Speaker 1: are gonna put the red flag or raise the red flag,

696
00:33:34,680 --> 00:33:36,720
Speaker 1: either call the FBI, curl over, they need to do

697
00:33:36,760 --> 00:33:39,160
Speaker 1: whatever authorities they need to call, because they're the ones

698
00:33:39,160 --> 00:33:42,080
Speaker 1: that stand to lose a ton of money. That's not

699
00:33:42,120 --> 00:33:45,080
Speaker 1: going to change whether you legalize sports betting or not.

700
00:33:45,200 --> 00:33:47,520
Speaker 1: And I don't know why people think it is. I mean,

701
00:33:47,520 --> 00:33:49,600
Speaker 1: if if I go I can go to Vegas and bet,

702
00:33:50,040 --> 00:33:51,480
Speaker 1: or if I can get a guy to fix the

703
00:33:51,480 --> 00:33:54,320
Speaker 1: game for you know, state, you I can go offshore

704
00:33:54,360 --> 00:33:56,680
Speaker 1: and bet it. And now maybe it's easier to bet it,

705
00:33:56,920 --> 00:33:59,600
Speaker 1: although I still contend off shore books will still uh,

706
00:33:59,800 --> 00:34:03,120
Speaker 1: I mean, they'll still live whether sports betting is legal

707
00:34:03,200 --> 00:34:05,760
Speaker 1: or not. Because if you're gonna bet sports legally here

708
00:34:05,800 --> 00:34:07,920
Speaker 1: in the United States, you're gonna actually have to pull

709
00:34:08,040 --> 00:34:10,600
Speaker 1: cash out of your pocket and bet it. You're not

710
00:34:10,600 --> 00:34:12,400
Speaker 1: gonna be able to get down to your local, you know,

711
00:34:12,520 --> 00:34:14,480
Speaker 1: bookshop and say, yeah, give me a hundred on so

712
00:34:14,640 --> 00:34:16,600
Speaker 1: and so. Oh yeah, credit, And I mean, I'm gonna

713
00:34:16,640 --> 00:34:19,800
Speaker 1: give you credit to always do one hundred. So credit

714
00:34:19,880 --> 00:34:22,879
Speaker 1: is always going to be available with the books, and

715
00:34:23,000 --> 00:34:25,000
Speaker 1: people like to have credit, and that's a lot of

716
00:34:25,040 --> 00:34:27,080
Speaker 1: times how they get in trouble. But that's just a given.

717
00:34:27,120 --> 00:34:31,440
Speaker 1: But I just have always found that argument just infuriating

718
00:34:31,680 --> 00:34:34,319
Speaker 1: that if you legalize sports betting, you're gonna be more

719
00:34:34,400 --> 00:34:37,319
Speaker 1: likely to fix games here. It's just nonsense, regardless of

720
00:34:37,320 --> 00:34:40,880
Speaker 1: who's monitoring it. Don't you think it's easier for gamblers

721
00:34:40,920 --> 00:34:44,320
Speaker 1: to get to college players? Then two NFL players, of course.

722
00:34:44,400 --> 00:34:47,880
Speaker 1: I mean logic dictates that the more money you're making,

723
00:34:48,480 --> 00:34:52,160
Speaker 1: the harder it is to have you in on it,

724
00:34:52,200 --> 00:34:56,080
Speaker 1: because the more money you'd have to try and get

725
00:34:56,120 --> 00:34:58,200
Speaker 1: down in a bet to make it worth your while,

726
00:34:58,880 --> 00:35:05,239
Speaker 1: which would arouse more interest. Um. So yeah, of course

727
00:35:05,280 --> 00:35:07,960
Speaker 1: you have the college guys don't make any money, so

728
00:35:08,040 --> 00:35:10,760
Speaker 1: they're the ones you want to go to and say,

729
00:35:10,800 --> 00:35:13,440
Speaker 1: if we give you five grand. I mean that that

730
00:35:13,440 --> 00:35:16,160
Speaker 1: would be like a you know, and can you imagine

731
00:35:16,200 --> 00:35:21,640
Speaker 1: in college when five grand for you helping to shave points. Hey,

732
00:35:21,640 --> 00:35:23,880
Speaker 1: you're supposed to by twelve, just won by less than twelve,

733
00:35:23,920 --> 00:35:25,799
Speaker 1: and we'll get you five k. They'd be like all

734
00:35:25,800 --> 00:35:28,160
Speaker 1: the money in the world be laughable. I think you

735
00:35:28,239 --> 00:35:30,719
Speaker 1: get any NBA player to do it for five grand,

736
00:35:30,800 --> 00:35:33,640
Speaker 1: especially the players that matter in the NBA. I mean

737
00:35:33,640 --> 00:35:37,239
Speaker 1: those guys you have to pay millions. I would think

738
00:35:37,280 --> 00:35:39,200
Speaker 1: to try and at least a money, try and fix

739
00:35:39,239 --> 00:35:43,080
Speaker 1: the game. I actually feel like the stuff. If you're not,

740
00:35:43,400 --> 00:35:45,759
Speaker 1: I mean, this is where the rub is because you

741
00:35:45,840 --> 00:35:49,480
Speaker 1: always at the NBA level. If you're doing it, it's

742
00:35:49,520 --> 00:35:56,920
Speaker 1: because you're you've got so many money problems that you are. Um,

743
00:35:57,640 --> 00:36:00,879
Speaker 1: you're completely vulnerable to somebody coming you and and sort

744
00:36:00,880 --> 00:36:02,680
Speaker 1: of tapping you on the shoulder and saying, hey, I

745
00:36:02,680 --> 00:36:05,800
Speaker 1: can fix this all for X. But I actually feel

746
00:36:05,800 --> 00:36:08,040
Speaker 1: like the number at the NBA level is in the

747
00:36:08,120 --> 00:36:11,040
Speaker 1: tens of millions. I think it's eight figures before it

748
00:36:11,080 --> 00:36:15,040
Speaker 1: becomes worthwhile for an NBA player to even come close

749
00:36:15,080 --> 00:36:18,759
Speaker 1: to considering throwing a game. It could be, I mean,

750
00:36:18,800 --> 00:36:20,520
Speaker 1: it could be. It depends on who you're talking about.

751
00:36:20,520 --> 00:36:22,280
Speaker 1: I mean, you can maybe get a third best player

752
00:36:22,320 --> 00:36:25,120
Speaker 1: to do it for you know, a million, A couple

753
00:36:25,120 --> 00:36:27,880
Speaker 1: of MILLI made. But again, that's what we're talking about,

754
00:36:27,920 --> 00:36:30,359
Speaker 1: is if you're gonna pay someone, let's say you're gonna

755
00:36:30,400 --> 00:36:33,000
Speaker 1: pay someone a million dollars or two million dollars to

756
00:36:33,000 --> 00:36:35,080
Speaker 1: fix the game for you, I need to make it

757
00:36:35,120 --> 00:36:36,960
Speaker 1: worth your while. You're gonna have to get down four,

758
00:36:36,800 --> 00:36:40,399
Speaker 1: four or five million. I mean, I don't care who

759
00:36:40,440 --> 00:36:42,279
Speaker 1: you are. You're gonna be able a gam four or

760
00:36:42,280 --> 00:36:44,680
Speaker 1: five million dollars a method. That's that's tough. Try jam

761
00:36:44,719 --> 00:36:48,319
Speaker 1: that type of money down on one game. So I

762
00:36:48,400 --> 00:36:50,040
Speaker 1: just don't think and I mean I could be off

763
00:36:50,040 --> 00:36:52,120
Speaker 1: on the numbers obviously, but I just it would be

764
00:36:52,120 --> 00:36:55,239
Speaker 1: too tough with college five grand back, you can bet

765
00:36:55,280 --> 00:36:57,399
Speaker 1: fifty grand. You can get down fifty grand, hundred grand

766
00:36:57,400 --> 00:36:59,520
Speaker 1: just about that. Some of these big guys can get

767
00:36:59,520 --> 00:37:03,080
Speaker 1: that down easily. So if someone were to say, hey,

768
00:37:03,120 --> 00:37:05,560
Speaker 1: like I got great information for you, you know, I'll

769
00:37:05,640 --> 00:37:08,520
Speaker 1: charge you grand for it. So the kid gets five,

770
00:37:08,880 --> 00:37:11,040
Speaker 1: the guy who has information, it's twenty five. And then

771
00:37:11,040 --> 00:37:12,799
Speaker 1: the betters, you know, can bet a hundred or whatever,

772
00:37:12,840 --> 00:37:15,719
Speaker 1: and everybody, everybody makes money. I mean, yeah, absolutely, I

773
00:37:15,760 --> 00:37:17,759
Speaker 1: still think the easiest guys to do would be and

774
00:37:17,840 --> 00:37:21,160
Speaker 1: be be somewhat tougher. But the officials, I mean, that's

775
00:37:21,320 --> 00:37:24,359
Speaker 1: really where I mean. If you were trying to fix

776
00:37:24,360 --> 00:37:26,000
Speaker 1: the game, just think if you had an umpire in

777
00:37:26,000 --> 00:37:28,160
Speaker 1: your back pocket. I mean, you could have a small

778
00:37:28,200 --> 00:37:30,560
Speaker 1: strike zone, a large strike zone. I mean, I can't

779
00:37:30,560 --> 00:37:33,120
Speaker 1: guarantee the guys can hit the ball, but if you

780
00:37:33,160 --> 00:37:35,040
Speaker 1: get me an Eric greg strike zone in the in

781
00:37:35,040 --> 00:37:37,360
Speaker 1: the World Series about fifteen years ago, the Marlins and

782
00:37:37,360 --> 00:37:40,520
Speaker 1: the Indians, like, I almost guarantee that game is gonna

783
00:37:40,560 --> 00:37:42,680
Speaker 1: go under, or you get a super tight strike zone,

784
00:37:43,360 --> 00:37:45,360
Speaker 1: NBA call a few more fouls, put them in the

785
00:37:45,360 --> 00:37:50,120
Speaker 1: penalty earlier, better total whether it be over or under football.

786
00:37:50,160 --> 00:37:51,680
Speaker 1: How you can throw a flag that's about in every place.

787
00:37:51,719 --> 00:37:53,080
Speaker 1: If you want to bet a total on that game,

788
00:37:53,120 --> 00:37:55,160
Speaker 1: I mean, you say, let's go there in fog range,

789
00:37:55,200 --> 00:37:57,279
Speaker 1: let's call holding, moving back ten yards and make it

790
00:37:57,320 --> 00:38:00,120
Speaker 1: more difficult for him to score. So those are the

791
00:38:00,160 --> 00:38:03,919
Speaker 1: guys I think that would be most vulnerable. I don't

792
00:38:03,920 --> 00:38:05,480
Speaker 1: know that they are, but I'm just saying, if you

793
00:38:05,520 --> 00:38:07,680
Speaker 1: were going to fix the game, I think a total

794
00:38:08,360 --> 00:38:10,760
Speaker 1: and an official and you're probably in pretty good shape.

795
00:38:12,120 --> 00:38:13,719
Speaker 1: Why do you know so much about betting? How did

796
00:38:13,719 --> 00:38:19,000
Speaker 1: you get into it? Oh? Man, jeez? That they My

797
00:38:19,040 --> 00:38:21,840
Speaker 1: mom and dad played poker when I was younger, and

798
00:38:21,880 --> 00:38:26,000
Speaker 1: they used to let me play occasionally with the neighborhood couples.

799
00:38:26,040 --> 00:38:27,719
Speaker 1: They I'll come over and play, and I want to play,

800
00:38:27,760 --> 00:38:30,440
Speaker 1: And I'd sit at the table and and watch them play.

801
00:38:30,480 --> 00:38:32,880
Speaker 1: And they didn't let me play until god, I was

802
00:38:33,800 --> 00:38:36,520
Speaker 1: probably you know, they let me sit in a couple

803
00:38:36,560 --> 00:38:38,960
Speaker 1: of times, a couple of rounds and we played poker.

804
00:38:39,200 --> 00:38:42,279
Speaker 1: And then from there me and my buddies used to

805
00:38:42,320 --> 00:38:46,960
Speaker 1: go to loss al At Race Track down in southern California.

806
00:38:47,120 --> 00:38:49,680
Speaker 1: Who it's a thoroughbred track now used to be quarter horses,

807
00:38:49,680 --> 00:38:52,880
Speaker 1: so we used to go there on on Friday nights

808
00:38:53,520 --> 00:38:56,000
Speaker 1: and it was funny. We'd get in there and one

809
00:38:56,040 --> 00:38:57,919
Speaker 1: would pay, then we'd go in and let the other

810
00:38:57,920 --> 00:39:00,600
Speaker 1: ones in through the side door lass out, because I mean,

811
00:39:00,719 --> 00:39:02,480
Speaker 1: our reasoning was, what the hell they're gonna take our

812
00:39:02,480 --> 00:39:04,319
Speaker 1: money anyway? What do we gotta pay four bucks to enter?

813
00:39:05,120 --> 00:39:06,520
Speaker 1: You kidding me? Let us go in there and just

814
00:39:06,560 --> 00:39:12,000
Speaker 1: lose our money. So between bucks, nine races, two dollars

815
00:39:12,000 --> 00:39:14,560
Speaker 1: a race, and a dollar for a hot dog, dollar

816
00:39:14,640 --> 00:39:18,479
Speaker 1: for a soda. So that was like like Friday nights

817
00:39:18,520 --> 00:39:22,040
Speaker 1: out at uh los Ale and then from there, you know,

818
00:39:22,160 --> 00:39:26,160
Speaker 1: Vegas trips, uh you know, we're eighteen nineteen. Me and

819
00:39:26,200 --> 00:39:29,840
Speaker 1: my buddy used to take there were these trips that

820
00:39:29,880 --> 00:39:33,839
Speaker 1: go to Vegas uh gambling junkts, these vans that would

821
00:39:33,920 --> 00:39:37,600
Speaker 1: leave like Friday evening and come back Sunday morning. So

822
00:39:37,680 --> 00:39:39,800
Speaker 1: we'd go and get a room, like a cheap room somewhere,

823
00:39:39,840 --> 00:39:42,560
Speaker 1: maybe at the start Us. And it was funny because

824
00:39:42,560 --> 00:39:44,279
Speaker 1: everyone else is going there to gamble. We don't want

825
00:39:44,280 --> 00:39:47,240
Speaker 1: to gamble the whole time, So we brought tennis rackets

826
00:39:47,239 --> 00:39:48,719
Speaker 1: and we had to hide the tennis racket because they

827
00:39:48,719 --> 00:39:50,640
Speaker 1: don't want you. I mean, I let you have a

828
00:39:50,680 --> 00:39:53,759
Speaker 1: gambling junk at van with tennis rackets, like taking this, guys,

829
00:39:53,760 --> 00:39:57,120
Speaker 1: they're played tennis, so we had to hide the rackets.

830
00:39:57,120 --> 00:40:00,200
Speaker 1: We played tennis a little bit and then uh then

831
00:40:00,239 --> 00:40:03,680
Speaker 1: gamble and then come home on on Sunday morning, and

832
00:40:04,320 --> 00:40:06,200
Speaker 1: so yeah, I mean that's aid. Before it started though,

833
00:40:06,239 --> 00:40:08,920
Speaker 1: was probably I'd watched my mom and dad, watch my

834
00:40:08,960 --> 00:40:11,719
Speaker 1: mom and dad play play cards, and my mom likes

835
00:40:11,719 --> 00:40:13,600
Speaker 1: to gamble a little bit. They live in Vegas now

836
00:40:13,800 --> 00:40:15,720
Speaker 1: and they like to go and they'll play their bingo

837
00:40:15,920 --> 00:40:19,120
Speaker 1: and they're both retired, so lingo and mom play the

838
00:40:19,200 --> 00:40:22,080
Speaker 1: nickel slots stuff like that. But uh, yeah, that's probably

839
00:40:22,120 --> 00:40:25,319
Speaker 1: where it started, right there, right there at home. Did

840
00:40:25,360 --> 00:40:27,520
Speaker 1: you feel like you had an advantage because you were

841
00:40:27,560 --> 00:40:32,480
Speaker 1: an athlete, like you understood the games better gambling or

842
00:40:32,560 --> 00:40:37,200
Speaker 1: sports wagering sports wagering, No, not at all. I mean

843
00:40:37,239 --> 00:40:41,200
Speaker 1: I don't think anybody. In fact, I think that's can

844
00:40:41,280 --> 00:40:43,799
Speaker 1: be the worst thing for you, is thinking you understand

845
00:40:44,560 --> 00:40:48,120
Speaker 1: the game because there's so many gambling and picking the

846
00:40:48,160 --> 00:40:52,239
Speaker 1: winner two different things, and they just they are. In baseball,

847
00:40:53,400 --> 00:40:55,239
Speaker 1: it's a little bit different. Hockey is a little bit

848
00:40:55,280 --> 00:40:58,560
Speaker 1: different because you have money lines football, basketball or spreads.

849
00:40:59,040 --> 00:41:01,120
Speaker 1: But even with the the money lines, I mean now,

850
00:41:01,440 --> 00:41:03,520
Speaker 1: I mean, okay, is a team worth being a one

851
00:41:03,680 --> 00:41:05,239
Speaker 1: You think they're gonna win? But are they worth being

852
00:41:05,239 --> 00:41:07,560
Speaker 1: a one seventy favorite? Maybe they're not, but maybe it

853
00:41:07,600 --> 00:41:11,280
Speaker 1: won fifty. They're a good play. I don't think value

854
00:41:11,320 --> 00:41:15,160
Speaker 1: was understand I mean, values really really tough to understand.

855
00:41:15,280 --> 00:41:19,040
Speaker 1: I don't really understand it myself. Uh you know, I

856
00:41:19,080 --> 00:41:20,960
Speaker 1: try to get to spreads and games and go, okay,

857
00:41:20,960 --> 00:41:22,719
Speaker 1: what would it take me to bet the other side?

858
00:41:22,760 --> 00:41:24,160
Speaker 1: If I like one side, what would it take me

859
00:41:24,200 --> 00:41:26,560
Speaker 1: to bet the other side? But the back back to

860
00:41:26,560 --> 00:41:28,920
Speaker 1: the original question, I don't think it helps because I

861
00:41:29,000 --> 00:41:32,800
Speaker 1: understand every sport. I mean some more, some more than others,

862
00:41:33,000 --> 00:41:35,320
Speaker 1: but everything, every one of the four majors. I understand

863
00:41:35,400 --> 00:41:37,160
Speaker 1: enough to like know what teams the better team, and

864
00:41:37,239 --> 00:41:39,279
Speaker 1: what team could win, what teams should win. But then

865
00:41:39,280 --> 00:41:42,799
Speaker 1: there's you know, with with professional sports, scheduling is a

866
00:41:42,800 --> 00:41:46,520
Speaker 1: big deal and mindset is a big deal, and you

867
00:41:46,600 --> 00:41:51,200
Speaker 1: never know. I mean that's the one thing in basketball, baseball, hockey,

868
00:41:51,320 --> 00:41:53,520
Speaker 1: who was out the night before? Who gotta got a

869
00:41:53,520 --> 00:41:56,319
Speaker 1: good night's sleep the night before who's having trouble in

870
00:41:56,360 --> 00:41:58,359
Speaker 1: their home life? I mean, who knows all these things.

871
00:41:58,360 --> 00:42:00,120
Speaker 1: I don't know all these things, but I mean the

872
00:42:00,160 --> 00:42:02,960
Speaker 1: mindset is a big deal for professional athlete, and if

873
00:42:03,000 --> 00:42:05,080
Speaker 1: you don't know it, I mean he kind of bet

874
00:42:05,080 --> 00:42:07,839
Speaker 1: in blindly a little bit. But now I don't think

875
00:42:07,880 --> 00:42:10,399
Speaker 1: I have any advantage. I know sports, I know him well.

876
00:42:10,840 --> 00:42:13,960
Speaker 1: As far as gambling goes, it doesn't. I mean it

877
00:42:14,080 --> 00:42:16,880
Speaker 1: may help a little bit here there, like bet in

878
00:42:16,880 --> 00:42:18,799
Speaker 1: a second half. If I watch a game, I can

879
00:42:18,840 --> 00:42:21,240
Speaker 1: kind of dissect what's going on and what may continue

880
00:42:21,239 --> 00:42:24,719
Speaker 1: to go on, what adjustments coaches may make at halftime.

881
00:42:25,560 --> 00:42:28,600
Speaker 1: But really, now, eyeballs can be your worst enemies as

882
00:42:28,640 --> 00:42:31,640
Speaker 1: a better eyeballs and sort of what you think you

883
00:42:31,719 --> 00:42:36,560
Speaker 1: know because of your experience. Yep, absolutely, and you can

884
00:42:36,600 --> 00:42:40,600
Speaker 1: be deceived. The game that I want to play with

885
00:42:40,640 --> 00:42:42,880
Speaker 1: you is that we have you know, people who have

886
00:42:43,000 --> 00:42:46,879
Speaker 1: been very successful in life. Uh. Some would say they're

887
00:42:46,880 --> 00:42:51,760
Speaker 1: all Americans, Um, why do you have me on that? Exactly? Uh?

888
00:42:52,320 --> 00:42:55,000
Speaker 1: They will come on. I will say, Uh, it's a

889
00:42:55,040 --> 00:42:57,600
Speaker 1: second we call you bet your life. You're gonna tell

890
00:42:57,600 --> 00:43:01,759
Speaker 1: me the biggest risk you've taken in life and how

891
00:43:01,760 --> 00:43:03,719
Speaker 1: it played out, could be good news, could be bad news,

892
00:43:03,760 --> 00:43:05,839
Speaker 1: could be bad news that led to something else down

893
00:43:05,840 --> 00:43:08,560
Speaker 1: the road that ultimately was fantastic. But tell me about

894
00:43:08,560 --> 00:43:10,760
Speaker 1: the biggest risk you've taken in life and what happened

895
00:43:11,760 --> 00:43:16,279
Speaker 1: in life or in wagering life. God, I don't even

896
00:43:16,280 --> 00:43:22,080
Speaker 1: know what risk I've taken in life. I guess who.

897
00:43:22,640 --> 00:43:26,319
Speaker 1: That's a tough one. I mean, I guess what led

898
00:43:26,360 --> 00:43:28,839
Speaker 1: me here. And I don't know if I'd have been

899
00:43:29,040 --> 00:43:33,360
Speaker 1: here anyway. But when I was at you see Irvine,

900
00:43:33,480 --> 00:43:36,600
Speaker 1: I got a scholarship do you see Irvine? Out of

901
00:43:36,640 --> 00:43:39,080
Speaker 1: high school? I went to our teacher high school scholarship

902
00:43:39,120 --> 00:43:41,960
Speaker 1: do you see Irvine? Uh was there for a year

903
00:43:41,960 --> 00:43:45,600
Speaker 1: and a half and I transferred to Currito's College to

904
00:43:45,640 --> 00:43:48,000
Speaker 1: play football. And I wanted to play football. I never

905
00:43:48,000 --> 00:43:50,480
Speaker 1: played football in high school, and I thought, you know

906
00:43:50,520 --> 00:43:51,840
Speaker 1: what I can I could play football. I know I

907
00:43:51,880 --> 00:43:53,440
Speaker 1: can play football, and I can play at a big

908
00:43:53,480 --> 00:43:55,800
Speaker 1: time level, and I'm gonna go to through this college

909
00:43:56,000 --> 00:44:01,000
Speaker 1: and in play football. But I told my mom, almost surious,

910
00:44:01,280 --> 00:44:03,080
Speaker 1: that I had given up my scholarship or I was

911
00:44:03,080 --> 00:44:06,680
Speaker 1: going to give up my scholarship at Irvine because Irvine's

912
00:44:06,719 --> 00:44:09,120
Speaker 1: a that was pretty good school, and I'm getting, you know,

913
00:44:09,280 --> 00:44:12,200
Speaker 1: getting at least get an education. And I just said, look,

914
00:44:12,200 --> 00:44:14,840
Speaker 1: this is what I'm gonna do, is that I I

915
00:44:14,880 --> 00:44:17,200
Speaker 1: want to do this. So I didn't even make it

916
00:44:17,280 --> 00:44:23,120
Speaker 1: to spring practice, and we were just running some seven

917
00:44:23,120 --> 00:44:24,600
Speaker 1: on seven I think I might have been running or

918
00:44:24,600 --> 00:44:26,560
Speaker 1: maybe no, maybe it was eleven on eleven, but we

919
00:44:26,560 --> 00:44:29,800
Speaker 1: weren't even in pads. So I got to a crossing

920
00:44:29,880 --> 00:44:33,160
Speaker 1: route and I'm crossing. I get knocked down by the

921
00:44:33,520 --> 00:44:37,239
Speaker 1: by the tight end or by the defensive end, and

922
00:44:37,320 --> 00:44:39,600
Speaker 1: the other tight end comes across and he's running in

923
00:44:39,719 --> 00:44:41,960
Speaker 1: a shallow or crossing route and he hits the clips

924
00:44:41,960 --> 00:44:44,880
Speaker 1: my shoulder. As I'm getting up, my whole body spins,

925
00:44:44,920 --> 00:44:47,040
Speaker 1: my clik get stuck in the ground. I dissocate my hip.

926
00:44:47,920 --> 00:44:50,319
Speaker 1: Never dislocated anything in my life. I knew exactly what

927
00:44:50,360 --> 00:44:52,000
Speaker 1: I had done when I did it. It was the

928
00:44:52,040 --> 00:44:54,760
Speaker 1: most painful thing ever. So I'm laying on the ground,

929
00:44:55,960 --> 00:44:58,280
Speaker 1: uh for about a half an hour. Get the ambulance

930
00:44:58,320 --> 00:45:01,879
Speaker 1: out there, take me to the hospital, put the hip

931
00:45:01,880 --> 00:45:05,040
Speaker 1: back in place, which was which was interesting. They finally

932
00:45:05,040 --> 00:45:07,160
Speaker 1: gave me a shot and I look at the doctor

933
00:45:07,200 --> 00:45:09,920
Speaker 1: and He's standing over me with my leg trying to

934
00:45:09,960 --> 00:45:12,520
Speaker 1: pull it and and configure it to where he could

935
00:45:12,520 --> 00:45:14,480
Speaker 1: get to get at the right angle and then pull

936
00:45:14,520 --> 00:45:15,960
Speaker 1: it up real quick to get the hit back in

937
00:45:16,040 --> 00:45:18,279
Speaker 1: the socket. And I couldn't feel anything at the time,

938
00:45:18,280 --> 00:45:22,439
Speaker 1: but I'm looking at him thinking that's my leg, my leg.

939
00:45:22,800 --> 00:45:24,440
Speaker 1: I closed my eyes, went to bed. I couldn't watch

940
00:45:24,440 --> 00:45:28,239
Speaker 1: anymore that it's like ridiculous. So I remember watching the

941
00:45:28,280 --> 00:45:31,360
Speaker 1: Villanova door found uh into the final. I think that

942
00:45:31,440 --> 00:45:35,759
Speaker 1: was eight five maybe in the hospital bed. I was

943
00:45:35,800 --> 00:45:39,160
Speaker 1: in the hospital for like a week, and I said,

944
00:45:39,200 --> 00:45:43,359
Speaker 1: all right, that's enough of enough football. I'm gonna gonna

945
00:45:43,400 --> 00:45:46,319
Speaker 1: get back playing basketball. So after my hip healed, I

946
00:45:46,320 --> 00:45:48,520
Speaker 1: started playing hoops again, getting in shape, and then got

947
00:45:48,560 --> 00:45:51,800
Speaker 1: a scholarship to Arizona and the rest is kind of history.

948
00:45:51,840 --> 00:45:53,640
Speaker 1: But that was a you know, that was you know,

949
00:45:53,680 --> 00:45:55,680
Speaker 1: who knows who would happened if I wouldn't have got hurt.

950
00:45:56,120 --> 00:45:58,640
Speaker 1: Uh and ended up working out okay for me, although

951
00:45:58,680 --> 00:46:00,520
Speaker 1: now I have a new hip to the show for

952
00:46:00,640 --> 00:46:03,399
Speaker 1: I got that a couple of years ago. Uh So, yeah,

953
00:46:03,400 --> 00:46:05,759
Speaker 1: that was probably the biggest risk I took because I

954
00:46:05,800 --> 00:46:08,040
Speaker 1: didn't know exactly what was gonna happen. I felt like

955
00:46:08,080 --> 00:46:10,160
Speaker 1: it would work out okay, like I would figure out

956
00:46:10,160 --> 00:46:12,439
Speaker 1: a way to to make the same work. I still

957
00:46:12,440 --> 00:46:14,200
Speaker 1: felt like I could have played football if I wouldn't

958
00:46:14,160 --> 00:46:17,120
Speaker 1: have been been injured. But if I didn't leave Irvine,

959
00:46:17,200 --> 00:46:20,480
Speaker 1: then who knows if I if I go to Arizona,

960
00:46:20,600 --> 00:46:24,080
Speaker 1: probably not Final four, probably not met my wife at Arizona,

961
00:46:24,400 --> 00:46:27,120
Speaker 1: and that led to an NBA career, which led to

962
00:46:27,239 --> 00:46:29,560
Speaker 1: doing the radio appears. So don you ever know what

963
00:46:29,640 --> 00:46:32,359
Speaker 1: turns U turns you may make in life right or left?

964
00:46:32,360 --> 00:46:35,200
Speaker 1: And now it's gonna work out? Well, I would agree

965
00:46:35,239 --> 00:46:38,520
Speaker 1: with you. You stay at Irvine, you are never getting

966
00:46:38,520 --> 00:46:40,759
Speaker 1: any of those things. Like Irvine was just not a

967
00:46:40,760 --> 00:46:43,440
Speaker 1: basketball factory in the way Arizona was. You're not playing

968
00:46:43,840 --> 00:46:46,719
Speaker 1: with Seawan Elliott and Steve Kerr and getting coached by

969
00:46:46,760 --> 00:46:53,120
Speaker 1: lud Olsen. If like you're us Irvine, No, there's there's

970
00:46:53,120 --> 00:46:56,480
Speaker 1: no doubt. If I give you a funny aside. So

971
00:46:56,600 --> 00:47:00,000
Speaker 1: Bill Mulligan, who was a coach, late Bill Mulligan, uh

972
00:47:00,000 --> 00:47:01,719
Speaker 1: at hevery mine when I was there and I told

973
00:47:01,800 --> 00:47:03,600
Speaker 1: him I was on a transfer. I remember we're sitting

974
00:47:03,600 --> 00:47:08,520
Speaker 1: out by by the pool at Santa Clara as a

975
00:47:08,560 --> 00:47:10,360
Speaker 1: cable car class, and I told him, I go, you

976
00:47:10,400 --> 00:47:12,080
Speaker 1: know this, this isn't working out. I go, I just,

977
00:47:12,200 --> 00:47:14,160
Speaker 1: I just I don't feel like you trust me. I

978
00:47:14,200 --> 00:47:15,839
Speaker 1: don't feel like I want to be here. I don't

979
00:47:15,840 --> 00:47:17,239
Speaker 1: know that you want me here. I go, I'm just

980
00:47:17,239 --> 00:47:19,280
Speaker 1: gonna be on a transfer and try to play football

981
00:47:20,080 --> 00:47:23,520
Speaker 1: at Truto's college. And you know, maybe if it doesn't

982
00:47:23,520 --> 00:47:26,520
Speaker 1: worry me to play basketball somewhere. And I remember looking

983
00:47:26,560 --> 00:47:29,880
Speaker 1: at me, go, you go, that's not gonna work. I go,

984
00:47:29,960 --> 00:47:31,879
Speaker 1: all right, well, I guess if you don't care, what's

985
00:47:31,920 --> 00:47:34,160
Speaker 1: the difference does it make? Let me? Let me go? Anyway.

986
00:47:34,160 --> 00:47:35,680
Speaker 1: I think it was a languor that I was leaving.

987
00:47:36,560 --> 00:47:40,719
Speaker 1: Uh So, anyway, fast forward a number of years. Had

988
00:47:40,760 --> 00:47:43,640
Speaker 1: already been in the NBA a few years and and

989
00:47:43,760 --> 00:47:48,879
Speaker 1: having a pretty good career. And I was in Vegas, surprisingly, uh,

990
00:47:49,160 --> 00:47:53,040
Speaker 1: walking down the strip, uh, and I who'd I run into?

991
00:47:53,120 --> 00:47:55,880
Speaker 1: Bill Mulligan. Bill Mulligan was actually in Vegas, and I

992
00:47:56,000 --> 00:47:58,040
Speaker 1: ran into him, like, hey, coach, get what's going on?

993
00:47:58,160 --> 00:48:01,560
Speaker 1: He goes, Hey, Tommy Horrea goes remember what I said?

994
00:48:01,560 --> 00:48:05,880
Speaker 1: I go, oh, yeah, he goes I was wrong, And

995
00:48:05,920 --> 00:48:07,480
Speaker 1: I told him I said, well, we didn't need to

996
00:48:07,480 --> 00:48:10,440
Speaker 1: tell me that. I already already knew that at everybody

997
00:48:10,480 --> 00:48:12,239
Speaker 1: in the NBA for like four years at the time.

998
00:48:12,320 --> 00:48:14,360
Speaker 1: But it was kind of a kind of a funny

999
00:48:14,440 --> 00:48:17,160
Speaker 1: moment that he goes, yeah, I was wrong. Yeah, I

1000
00:48:17,200 --> 00:48:22,000
Speaker 1: know who is the who is the best gambler in

1001
00:48:22,040 --> 00:48:25,400
Speaker 1: the NBA when you were playing? Oh, I don't know

1002
00:48:25,440 --> 00:48:28,279
Speaker 1: of one. I don't know if any good gamblers. I

1003
00:48:28,360 --> 00:48:32,399
Speaker 1: used to I used to make money on road trips playing. Uh,

1004
00:48:32,640 --> 00:48:35,359
Speaker 1: we'd play when I was with the Clippers and I

1005
00:48:35,520 --> 00:48:38,560
Speaker 1: and they loved so we played poker and they loved

1006
00:48:38,560 --> 00:48:40,440
Speaker 1: playing like new games. So I had all kinds of

1007
00:48:40,480 --> 00:48:42,160
Speaker 1: new games, and of course I knew the rules of

1008
00:48:42,200 --> 00:48:43,680
Speaker 1: the games, and I was teaching them the rules of

1009
00:48:43,719 --> 00:48:45,960
Speaker 1: the games. And it was gonna cost them money to

1010
00:48:46,040 --> 00:48:48,359
Speaker 1: learn the rules of the games, but they didn't care.

1011
00:48:48,520 --> 00:48:50,359
Speaker 1: You know, I bet twenty or forty bucks. I bet

1012
00:48:50,400 --> 00:48:53,840
Speaker 1: twenty I raised fifty sixty. So one of my favorite

1013
00:48:53,880 --> 00:48:57,840
Speaker 1: games was seven Cards No Peak. And for those that

1014
00:48:57,880 --> 00:49:02,160
Speaker 1: have never played it, what it is. You get seven cards, uh,

1015
00:49:02,200 --> 00:49:04,120
Speaker 1: and they're all faced down so you can't see any

1016
00:49:04,120 --> 00:49:07,439
Speaker 1: of your cards, and the person to your immediate left

1017
00:49:07,480 --> 00:49:10,239
Speaker 1: starts first. You go clockwise, so you turn over a

1018
00:49:10,239 --> 00:49:11,719
Speaker 1: card off the top of the deck, and let's say

1019
00:49:11,760 --> 00:49:15,160
Speaker 1: it's a five. Person to the left has to keep

1020
00:49:15,160 --> 00:49:18,560
Speaker 1: turning over cards until they beat the five. So let's

1021
00:49:18,560 --> 00:49:20,880
Speaker 1: say your first card that ace boom, you beat it

1022
00:49:21,480 --> 00:49:24,399
Speaker 1: round a betting. Next person goes. They have to beat

1023
00:49:24,400 --> 00:49:27,279
Speaker 1: an ace, so either an ace plus something or a pair,

1024
00:49:28,000 --> 00:49:30,120
Speaker 1: so a pair of fours now they bet. Now the

1025
00:49:30,160 --> 00:49:31,719
Speaker 1: other person has to be a pair of four, so

1026
00:49:31,760 --> 00:49:33,279
Speaker 1: it just keeps going around. You have to beat the

1027
00:49:33,280 --> 00:49:36,759
Speaker 1: person to your right, and then around a betting commences.

1028
00:49:36,800 --> 00:49:38,719
Speaker 1: So it was awesome because they love to play it,

1029
00:49:38,760 --> 00:49:41,880
Speaker 1: because they love the suspense of turning over the cards

1030
00:49:41,880 --> 00:49:46,160
Speaker 1: and seeing what they could get. And oh the meanwhile,

1031
00:49:46,200 --> 00:49:48,439
Speaker 1: I'm counting all the cards on the table, saying, okay,

1032
00:49:48,520 --> 00:49:50,479
Speaker 1: what do I have on my hand? How many cards

1033
00:49:50,520 --> 00:49:52,759
Speaker 1: are out there? If I need a four and there's

1034
00:49:52,800 --> 00:49:54,680
Speaker 1: four fours out there, obviously they can't get it. If

1035
00:49:54,680 --> 00:49:56,279
Speaker 1: there's no fources out there, get a better chance of

1036
00:49:56,360 --> 00:49:58,640
Speaker 1: getting it. How many spades are out there if I

1037
00:49:58,680 --> 00:50:01,280
Speaker 1: need a spade? Flush or right? All those sort of things.

1038
00:50:01,719 --> 00:50:03,600
Speaker 1: So you know i'd fold if I didn't have a

1039
00:50:03,600 --> 00:50:05,360
Speaker 1: good hand or raised if I thought I had a

1040
00:50:05,400 --> 00:50:08,160
Speaker 1: decent chance that of catching the card and winning the pot.

1041
00:50:08,480 --> 00:50:10,040
Speaker 1: They didn't care. They just wanted to bet and keep

1042
00:50:10,040 --> 00:50:11,719
Speaker 1: turning the cards over to see what the head. I mean,

1043
00:50:11,760 --> 00:50:14,560
Speaker 1: one time I forgot who it was, turned his cards over,

1044
00:50:14,600 --> 00:50:17,280
Speaker 1: like he beat I think I got like fifty sixty

1045
00:50:17,280 --> 00:50:19,160
Speaker 1: bucks something like that. He turned his cards over and

1046
00:50:19,160 --> 00:50:21,640
Speaker 1: he couldn't beat me. He just wanted to be like

1047
00:50:21,719 --> 00:50:24,560
Speaker 1: he wanted. I didn't tell him, but he wanted to see, like, okay,

1048
00:50:24,560 --> 00:50:27,680
Speaker 1: what do I have her? I'm like, oh, thanks for

1049
00:50:27,719 --> 00:50:31,279
Speaker 1: the fifty bucks. Like I mean, he could not mathematically,

1050
00:50:31,320 --> 00:50:32,880
Speaker 1: he couldn't beat me. He just could not beat me.

1051
00:50:32,920 --> 00:50:35,160
Speaker 1: He didn't even have cards left that he hadn't seen

1052
00:50:35,480 --> 00:50:37,240
Speaker 1: to be able to beat my full house or whatever

1053
00:50:37,960 --> 00:50:40,360
Speaker 1: I had. So yeah, that was fun. And then we

1054
00:50:40,480 --> 00:50:44,480
Speaker 1: had guys. We had a guy with the Warriors. I

1055
00:50:44,520 --> 00:50:48,440
Speaker 1: was playing playing blackjack with him, and I guess I

1056
00:50:48,440 --> 00:50:50,359
Speaker 1: could say his name. I said on the radio Tyrone Hill,

1057
00:50:50,360 --> 00:50:52,080
Speaker 1: who I played with. And I liked Tyrone a lot,

1058
00:50:52,160 --> 00:50:55,399
Speaker 1: but I mean just his blackjack skills. We're playing black

1059
00:50:55,480 --> 00:51:00,479
Speaker 1: jack and he gives him my cards and eight teen Okay,

1060
00:51:00,520 --> 00:51:06,799
Speaker 1: I'll stay and he flips his over fifteen seven and

1061
00:51:06,840 --> 00:51:09,239
Speaker 1: he goes to take my money. What are you doing?

1062
00:51:10,080 --> 00:51:12,720
Speaker 1: He goes, what's closest to twenty one? I go, what

1063
00:51:12,719 --> 00:51:15,839
Speaker 1: what do you what? Were you closest to twenty one?

1064
00:51:15,880 --> 00:51:19,399
Speaker 1: It's not closest one, it's close to twenty one without

1065
00:51:19,400 --> 00:51:21,520
Speaker 1: going over twenty one. He goes, no, it's not. I go,

1066
00:51:22,840 --> 00:51:25,360
Speaker 1: somebody tell this guy. I go, somebody telling that's the

1067
00:51:25,360 --> 00:51:27,640
Speaker 1: way you play black jack. So it finally goes, yeah,

1068
00:51:28,080 --> 00:51:30,359
Speaker 1: that's yeah, of course, that's the why you play black jacks.

1069
00:51:30,400 --> 00:51:33,239
Speaker 1: I take my money and the next time we both

1070
00:51:33,280 --> 00:51:35,080
Speaker 1: get twenties and he goes to take my money again.

1071
00:51:36,040 --> 00:51:37,520
Speaker 1: I go, what are you dealing? He goes what dealer

1072
00:51:37,560 --> 00:51:40,239
Speaker 1: gets pushes. I go, I where do you go? Where

1073
00:51:40,239 --> 00:51:41,520
Speaker 1: do you play black jack? Because I want to go

1074
00:51:41,520 --> 00:51:43,560
Speaker 1: play there. I want to go play black jack. Where

1075
00:51:43,600 --> 00:51:45,239
Speaker 1: you go play black jack? Or either that or you

1076
00:51:45,320 --> 00:51:47,400
Speaker 1: let me deal. I go. If you let me deal

1077
00:51:47,520 --> 00:51:50,839
Speaker 1: with your rules, I swear I'll drive to your house

1078
00:51:50,880 --> 00:51:52,799
Speaker 1: after we get back from road trips and I'll just

1079
00:51:52,880 --> 00:51:54,640
Speaker 1: deal to you. You do, tell me when you're done,

1080
00:51:54,640 --> 00:51:56,040
Speaker 1: then I'll go home, and then you tell me when

1081
00:51:56,040 --> 00:51:57,399
Speaker 1: you want to play and I'll come back and deal

1082
00:51:57,480 --> 00:51:59,719
Speaker 1: some more. I go if it's closest to twenty one

1083
00:51:59,840 --> 00:52:05,000
Speaker 1: and I get pushes. You killed me in for that. Well,

1084
00:52:05,000 --> 00:52:07,600
Speaker 1: like basically everyone wants to play at the House of Hill.

1085
00:52:07,719 --> 00:52:11,160
Speaker 1: Like that is, he's setting the rules. Whatever rules he

1086
00:52:11,280 --> 00:52:13,120
Speaker 1: decides are the ones you get to play by. It

1087
00:52:13,160 --> 00:52:16,680
Speaker 1: feels like everyone's gonna make a lot more money. Like

1088
00:52:16,360 --> 00:52:19,640
Speaker 1: that was ready, I wouldn't be doing this job. If

1089
00:52:19,640 --> 00:52:21,560
Speaker 1: I could deal black check like that, I'd open up

1090
00:52:21,560 --> 00:52:24,120
Speaker 1: my own joint. But like when you're in the NBA,

1091
00:52:24,200 --> 00:52:25,839
Speaker 1: how high did the hands get? Like on a car,

1092
00:52:26,080 --> 00:52:28,279
Speaker 1: like on a card game on the plane? How high

1093
00:52:28,320 --> 00:52:31,120
Speaker 1: will the hands get? Highest the hand I have, highest

1094
00:52:31,120 --> 00:52:36,360
Speaker 1: hand ever got? When you're playing freaking uh Acy Doozy

1095
00:52:36,680 --> 00:52:40,200
Speaker 1: or between the sheets, I'm sure anybody that plays cards

1096
00:52:40,239 --> 00:52:42,080
Speaker 1: knows what that is. But basically, it's two cards. You've

1097
00:52:42,080 --> 00:52:44,600
Speaker 1: got two cards down, and if you think you can

1098
00:52:44,640 --> 00:52:47,000
Speaker 1: get between those two cards, you bet as much of

1099
00:52:47,040 --> 00:52:50,640
Speaker 1: the pot as you want to. So a six and

1100
00:52:50,680 --> 00:52:53,319
Speaker 1: a ten would be terrible, uh two and a king

1101
00:52:53,320 --> 00:52:57,800
Speaker 1: would be great. Your best hand would be ace. Ace

1102
00:52:58,040 --> 00:53:00,400
Speaker 1: called because you can call the first day's higher, and

1103
00:53:00,440 --> 00:53:02,919
Speaker 1: I always called the first dates low, just in case

1104
00:53:02,960 --> 00:53:04,799
Speaker 1: I got the second ash, which was always high, because

1105
00:53:04,800 --> 00:53:06,960
Speaker 1: then boom, you're you're you're good. The only way you

1106
00:53:06,960 --> 00:53:09,880
Speaker 1: can get beat is with another ace. Now the catches,

1107
00:53:10,920 --> 00:53:14,719
Speaker 1: if you match your card, you pay double. So if

1108
00:53:14,760 --> 00:53:17,720
Speaker 1: you happen to get another ace, which I've seen happened before,

1109
00:53:18,080 --> 00:53:21,279
Speaker 1: it's not pretty. Uh, you gotta double the pot. So

1110
00:53:21,440 --> 00:53:22,799
Speaker 1: this is what I was with the Warriors, and it

1111
00:53:22,840 --> 00:53:26,000
Speaker 1: was like me and Nelly and Pimmy and uh, I

1112
00:53:26,040 --> 00:53:28,759
Speaker 1: don't I don't think Chris was planned. Maybe Mitch and

1113
00:53:28,760 --> 00:53:31,160
Speaker 1: and Rod and I mean there's all of us, like

1114
00:53:31,600 --> 00:53:34,319
Speaker 1: so many of us were playing. So the pot was

1115
00:53:34,680 --> 00:53:41,040
Speaker 1: at one point four four thousand dollars and it was

1116
00:53:41,120 --> 00:53:47,200
Speaker 1: my turn. First card ace low, second card ace high.

1117
00:53:48,239 --> 00:53:51,680
Speaker 1: Now I'm a rookie at this point, so I'm making

1118
00:53:51,800 --> 00:53:54,640
Speaker 1: decent money, but not not you know, maybe a couple

1119
00:53:54,680 --> 00:54:00,400
Speaker 1: hundred rand something like that. So thinking, okay, who Either

1120
00:54:00,920 --> 00:54:04,239
Speaker 1: I can I can go for all of it. Either

1121
00:54:04,280 --> 00:54:06,600
Speaker 1: I went four grand, which is almost assured because there's

1122
00:54:06,600 --> 00:54:08,480
Speaker 1: only two waces left in the deck because it did

1123
00:54:08,560 --> 00:54:10,480
Speaker 1: a fresh deck, so there's still two ways of lurking.

1124
00:54:11,280 --> 00:54:13,480
Speaker 1: I'm thinking it's either I went four I'm gonna lose eight,

1125
00:54:13,800 --> 00:54:17,240
Speaker 1: I go, I can't. I can't lose eight. I got

1126
00:54:17,040 --> 00:54:19,840
Speaker 1: the eight grand I go, you kidding down on a card?

1127
00:54:20,960 --> 00:54:23,400
Speaker 1: So I said, I'll go for half of it. So

1128
00:54:23,440 --> 00:54:25,880
Speaker 1: I went for two, and of course it came like

1129
00:54:25,960 --> 00:54:27,640
Speaker 1: seven of diamonds, and I was like, God damn it,

1130
00:54:27,680 --> 00:54:29,040
Speaker 1: why did't I go for all of us? Stupid? I

1131
00:54:29,040 --> 00:54:31,400
Speaker 1: should have went for all of it. Uh. And then

1132
00:54:31,440 --> 00:54:32,880
Speaker 1: I ended up winning a little bit more. But there

1133
00:54:32,960 --> 00:54:35,600
Speaker 1: ended up being like seven thousand in the pot at

1134
00:54:35,600 --> 00:54:37,279
Speaker 1: one point, because I mean, the guys that have money,

1135
00:54:37,280 --> 00:54:40,560
Speaker 1: they don't care. Jack four. That must be good. It's

1136
00:54:40,560 --> 00:54:42,239
Speaker 1: a face card in a kind of a low card

1137
00:54:42,280 --> 00:54:44,799
Speaker 1: that must be pretty good. It's like, dude, there's like

1138
00:54:44,800 --> 00:54:46,960
Speaker 1: thirteen cards. Start figuring out what cards are in the

1139
00:54:46,960 --> 00:54:51,040
Speaker 1: middle of stub jack and four you got five, six, seven, eight, nine, ten.

1140
00:54:51,560 --> 00:54:54,160
Speaker 1: That's six. That doesn't quite add up, now, does it.

1141
00:54:54,280 --> 00:54:56,279
Speaker 1: But they didn't care. I was like, oh, face card four,

1142
00:54:56,320 --> 00:54:58,640
Speaker 1: We're good. So the pod got huge, and I just

1143
00:54:58,680 --> 00:55:02,399
Speaker 1: remember what am I My favorite parts was. I think

1144
00:55:02,400 --> 00:55:06,080
Speaker 1: Nelly went for one time missed it and I don't

1145
00:55:06,080 --> 00:55:07,640
Speaker 1: know how it ended up working out, but I ended

1146
00:55:07,680 --> 00:55:10,839
Speaker 1: up having check from Nelly, which I thought was pretty cool.

1147
00:55:11,760 --> 00:55:13,560
Speaker 1: I love, I love. I love that he's writing you

1148
00:55:13,600 --> 00:55:19,040
Speaker 1: a check that check for a gay I love he's

1149
00:55:19,040 --> 00:55:23,160
Speaker 1: writing you a check fors and uh. He's also like

1150
00:55:23,200 --> 00:55:24,920
Speaker 1: one of the greatest coaches I've ever lived. I love

1151
00:55:25,000 --> 00:55:27,760
Speaker 1: the fact that he's knee deep in the game. Awesome.

1152
00:55:28,160 --> 00:55:34,320
Speaker 1: Absolutely for the game. It was an unbelievable game. That's awesome. Alright,

1153
00:55:34,360 --> 00:55:36,719
Speaker 1: Tom Tilber, I gotta let you go, man, get back

1154
00:55:36,760 --> 00:55:41,759
Speaker 1: to your all American life and to your I know what, Man,

1155
00:55:42,040 --> 00:55:46,919
Speaker 1: you're living large. I appreciate it. Oh, no problem. Chad

1156
00:55:46,960 --> 00:55:49,839
Speaker 1: and I have a fun conference turning week and a

1157
00:55:49,840 --> 00:55:53,200
Speaker 1: fun tournament and hopefully be profitable for all of us.

1158
00:55:53,880 --> 00:55:55,399
Speaker 1: I hope, so I say, I'll taught you later. Man.

1159
00:55:56,920 --> 00:56:09,800
Speaker 1: Thanks