WEBVTT - Bonus Episode | Nothing but a Meatball 0:00:06.000 --> 0:00:08.360 One of the questions I'm always asked is how do 0:00:08.400 --> 0:00:12.040 I get through this? And it's really tough, and you 0:00:12.039 --> 0:00:16.440 feel it, it hurts, and then you put your shoulders back, 0:00:16.520 --> 0:00:19.000 you put your head up, you'll hug your friends and 0:00:19.040 --> 0:00:25.439 your family, and you just keep going. So as you 0:00:25.560 --> 0:00:31.080 know that commissioners decide what's gonna happen, and then there's 0:00:31.120 --> 0:00:35.640 always this plan to send letters and to talk to 0:00:35.720 --> 0:00:37.480 them and kind of get a feel for where they're going. 0:00:37.600 --> 0:00:40.400 And last time we did that, we were so helpful. 0:00:40.800 --> 0:00:43.880 The night before we thought, oh, this is it, so 0:00:44.000 --> 0:00:48.840 hopeful and it turned out really crappy. So tonight, based 0:00:48.880 --> 0:00:53.760 on some of the information, we're not so hopeful. So 0:00:54.440 --> 0:00:58.600 we're gonna let Laurie say that prayer and we're gonna 0:00:58.680 --> 0:01:02.640 just keep going. Okay, Lisa, can you come over so 0:01:02.720 --> 0:01:04.520 we can all kind of be close. 0:01:08.680 --> 0:01:13.720 Dear Heavenly Father, we ask Lord to do only what 0:01:13.760 --> 0:01:16.959 you can do that you would bring us the outcome 0:01:17.000 --> 0:01:20.399 that we want. We ask that you would speak with 0:01:20.560 --> 0:01:22.640 the people on this board who are gonna make this 0:01:22.760 --> 0:01:27.399 life altering decision for Leo and Chrissy. We ask Lord 0:01:27.480 --> 0:01:32.200 that you would speak to their hearts, that you would 0:01:32.200 --> 0:01:37.160 give them that, knowing in the bottom of their soul 0:01:37.280 --> 0:01:40.160 that they would be doing the right thing by granting 0:01:40.240 --> 0:01:44.119 him parole. We just ask and pray, and we are 0:01:44.160 --> 0:01:47.120 begging on our knees that it is the outcome that 0:01:47.160 --> 0:01:50.880 we so desire. We love you, Lord, we praise you, 0:01:52.000 --> 0:01:55.200 and we pray this in your son Christ's name. Amen. 0:01:55.760 --> 0:02:10.640 Amen, do you hear my mind? I have to hide 0:02:11.280 --> 0:02:23.240 my feelings saw roosetemps sorry lists in this valle te 0:02:27.639 --> 0:02:42.600 na see ralation o my long water rage, das rash 0:02:43.639 --> 0:02:46.600 to the one who's holding. 0:02:46.320 --> 0:02:47.040 The star. 0:02:49.240 --> 0:02:58.760 To the warm solding stop to the warming sort. 0:03:09.160 --> 0:03:16.000 This is a special bonus episode of Bone Valley. The 0:03:16.120 --> 0:03:19.040 day before Leo's parole hearing, Scott Kup and I had 0:03:19.080 --> 0:03:21.640 one last chance to meet with the commissioners who would 0:03:21.639 --> 0:03:25.320 decide if Leo was going to be granted parole. Going 0:03:25.360 --> 0:03:27.840 into these meetings, we had some insight about where the 0:03:27.840 --> 0:03:33.000 commissioners might stand. The commission's chair, Melinda Kunrod, had been 0:03:33.080 --> 0:03:36.840 asking Leo's lawyers questions that seemed to indicate she believes 0:03:36.880 --> 0:03:41.760 in Leo's innocence. The second Commissioner, David Wyant, is a 0:03:41.840 --> 0:03:45.720 former police officer from Polk County. We heard he'd had 0:03:45.720 --> 0:03:48.680 a close relationship with the former state Attorney Jerry Hill, 0:03:49.080 --> 0:03:52.440 and he'd be the commissioner least receptive toward granting Leo parole. 0:03:53.560 --> 0:03:58.160 That left Commissioner Richard Davison the third vote, the wild card, 0:03:58.880 --> 0:04:01.400 the one who would probably passed the tie breaking vote 0:04:01.480 --> 0:04:05.200 in determining Leo's fate. So we came to Tallahassee for 0:04:05.280 --> 0:04:08.200 a meeting with Davison just twenty four hours before the 0:04:08.280 --> 0:04:11.760 official ruling would be made at Leo's May third parole hearing. 0:04:14.240 --> 0:04:16.560 Kelsey was outside waiting for me and Scott when we 0:04:16.640 --> 0:04:17.159 walked out of. 0:04:17.160 --> 0:04:17.720 The meeting. 0:04:19.200 --> 0:04:19.560 The car. 0:04:21.040 --> 0:04:23.920 No, it's really bad and he's not gonna talk right now. 0:04:23.960 --> 0:04:24.680 I can't. 0:04:25.920 --> 0:04:29.480 I'm sorry, fucking disaster. 0:04:31.480 --> 0:04:34.400 He's been talking to the tenth and went over and 0:04:34.480 --> 0:04:37.240 he said, I've listened to both sides now and I'm 0:04:37.320 --> 0:04:40.080 just not convinced he's innocent. And I'm going to vote 0:04:40.120 --> 0:04:43.920 for twenty four months at Everglades and he says, maybe 0:04:43.960 --> 0:04:47.520 they'll be an epiphany tomorrow, but that's the way I'm voting. 0:04:49.160 --> 0:04:52.400 He started talking to me about bloodstains, and it's just 0:04:52.520 --> 0:04:54.840 fucking very clear that the state is talking to him 0:04:54.880 --> 0:04:56.960 and giving him all sorts of bullshit about the evidence. 0:04:57.000 --> 0:04:59.360 He goes, where's the blood. There's no blood. Where's the 0:04:59.360 --> 0:05:00.919 blood at the canal? I was like, it's fucking there. 0:05:00.960 --> 0:05:04.920 You want to see the picture. FDL says it in 0:05:04.960 --> 0:05:07.240 the transcript, that's where her blood is. And he's arguing 0:05:07.279 --> 0:05:09.560 that shit with me, and I just you know, he said, 0:05:09.600 --> 0:05:13.440 this is not about guilt or innocence anyway, but he says, 0:05:13.520 --> 0:05:16.240 I'm a creature of the system, and I have to 0:05:16.320 --> 0:05:18.880 believe that what the courts have sucided is correct. 0:05:18.640 --> 0:05:20.200 And the courts are saying he's guilty. 0:05:21.160 --> 0:05:24.160 And he said, I didn't hear one thing in your 0:05:24.200 --> 0:05:27.800 podcast that was inaccurate to me. Okay, well, then you 0:05:27.920 --> 0:05:30.920 know he's innocent. What I just never forget the words 0:05:30.960 --> 0:05:33.359 he said, I'm a creature of the system the courts 0:05:33.400 --> 0:05:38.400 have ruled, and he's not willing to acknowledge that there 0:05:38.440 --> 0:05:41.440 are mistakes made, which you know, he did write the 0:05:41.560 --> 0:05:44.960 report to give clemency to the Groven Force, so he 0:05:45.040 --> 0:05:47.080 knows that mistakes are made and just won't do it. 0:05:49.000 --> 0:05:53.840 And you know, I mean, I'm just imagining that Wyant 0:05:53.960 --> 0:05:56.280 is in the same boat. We saw Wyant in the hallway, 0:05:57.279 --> 0:05:58.680 asked him if you would meet with us. He said, 0:05:58.680 --> 0:06:00.640 I'm busy, I'm busy, give me a call my cellphone 0:06:01.480 --> 0:06:07.480 and just walked away. Twenty four months. 0:06:07.520 --> 0:06:10.159 That I everglades twenty four months? 0:06:10.680 --> 0:06:11.760 Two fucking years? 0:06:12.200 --> 0:06:13.159 Why two years? 0:06:14.320 --> 0:06:16.520 Well, the thing he did say, unless I have an epiphany, 0:06:17.440 --> 0:06:20.680 that's gonna be my vote. And so we just talked 0:06:20.680 --> 0:06:22.880 about keep an open mind for the epiphany. 0:06:25.160 --> 0:06:33.000 But I don't know, was the worst meeting I've ever 0:06:33.040 --> 0:06:33.760 been in my life. 0:06:35.839 --> 0:06:38.640 We gave Scott a minute to process what had just happened, 0:06:38.880 --> 0:06:40.559 and then we got in the car with him and left, 0:06:40.960 --> 0:06:43.239 knowing that we'd be back the next morning for the hearing. 0:06:44.760 --> 0:06:45.640 Two years. 0:06:47.360 --> 0:06:48.560 So let's think about that. 0:06:49.920 --> 0:06:54.160 You don't give a flying fuck whether this man is 0:06:54.279 --> 0:06:55.279 guilty or innocent. 0:06:57.200 --> 0:06:58.160 That's what it boils out. 0:06:58.400 --> 0:06:59.279 He has to respect. 0:07:00.640 --> 0:07:03.239 Scott knew he owed Leo an update about the meetings. 0:07:03.800 --> 0:07:05.760 He tried to get Leo on the phone to tell 0:07:05.839 --> 0:07:08.040 him about what just happened, but he couldn't get through. 0:07:08.920 --> 0:07:14.400 Scott forwarded me the email he sent him. Hey Davison 0:07:14.440 --> 0:07:16.800 says he listened to the podcast, but he is still 0:07:16.920 --> 0:07:21.280 inclined to vote extension to Everglades for the lifers. We 0:07:21.440 --> 0:07:23.760 may still be able to convince him to straight parole 0:07:23.880 --> 0:07:26.640 to Noah's and that's what we're working on now and. 0:07:26.720 --> 0:07:27.640 Going into the evening. 0:07:28.680 --> 0:07:32.840 We're still at the worst case scenario of transfer to Everglades. 0:07:33.560 --> 0:07:36.160 Please try to hang in there. We are not finished 0:07:36.200 --> 0:07:39.440 by any stretch. I will keep sending you emails through 0:07:39.480 --> 0:07:42.320 the evening as I get more info. I still know 0:07:42.440 --> 0:07:50.440 God has this. I pray you agree, Scott. After we'd 0:07:50.480 --> 0:07:52.280 met with the commissioner, as I got a text from 0:07:52.360 --> 0:07:57.000 Chrissy just said I need to talk and then yea, 0:07:57.200 --> 0:08:00.440 she knows Leo must have got that thing and knew 0:08:00.480 --> 0:08:03.480 it and called her. I'm gonna have to just give 0:08:03.480 --> 0:08:04.000 her some hope. 0:08:04.080 --> 0:08:04.400 I don't know. 0:08:04.480 --> 0:08:05.000 I just can't. 0:08:05.760 --> 0:08:07.600 I can't just tell her it's came over because I 0:08:07.640 --> 0:08:09.680 don't know it's over. I mean, it's not hasn't been 0:08:09.720 --> 0:08:10.320 voted on yet. 0:08:11.600 --> 0:08:22.080 Yeah, yeah, exactly, because he's ready, she says, I prefer 0:08:22.200 --> 0:08:22.840 not to record. 0:08:24.000 --> 0:08:31.200 Okay, let me just turn this off. Then sorry, she 0:08:31.560 --> 0:08:35.240 never does this, so she's gonna be upset. 0:08:37.080 --> 0:08:41.400 Okay, here we go, crazy, Hey, where are you right now? 0:08:42.600 --> 0:08:43.640 Called her, and. 0:08:46.440 --> 0:08:50.400 She's as upset as I've ever heard her in knowing her. 0:08:51.120 --> 0:08:58.880 She was just crying and venting. She was frustrated. It's okay, 0:08:59.559 --> 0:09:03.520 you don't have to apologize for anything. No, you don't apologize, Chrissy. 0:09:03.920 --> 0:09:07.079 If I know this, I know, it's okay. 0:09:07.200 --> 0:09:07.839 You can do it to me. 0:09:07.960 --> 0:09:12.959 It's okay. The stress about this and just knowing that 0:09:13.040 --> 0:09:15.720 you have another defeat coming, I know, can't even imagine 0:09:15.720 --> 0:09:21.560 what that's like. It's I don't know, it's a really 0:09:21.600 --> 0:09:23.520 hard place to be in and to hear somebody just 0:09:24.960 --> 0:09:27.040 desperate and you know, in tears. 0:09:27.120 --> 0:09:27.440 It's just. 0:09:30.080 --> 0:09:32.640 Brutal. And you know, I think there's probably some hope that, 0:09:32.760 --> 0:09:34.760 like this story is going to change everything, and you 0:09:34.840 --> 0:09:41.160 know kind of didn't I know exactly. 0:09:44.600 --> 0:09:45.439 I'm sorry. 0:09:46.880 --> 0:09:49.760 She's she said, I'm in desperation mode. What else is there? 0:09:49.920 --> 0:09:51.680 Someone else? We got to try something different. 0:09:51.880 --> 0:09:54.400 We're all sitting here thinking, just scrambling and trying to 0:09:54.400 --> 0:09:56.599 do last minute things. And is there is there a 0:09:56.720 --> 0:09:58.840 magic thing to that was said that that will change 0:09:58.880 --> 0:10:00.839 their minds? I mean, if you have any ideas about that, 0:10:00.960 --> 0:10:04.160 I don't know. She said, Well, then we need a miracle. 0:10:04.240 --> 0:10:07.920 We have to pray for a miracle, and you know, well, 0:10:07.960 --> 0:10:10.240 that's all well and good, but I'm just thinking there's 0:10:10.280 --> 0:10:14.040 not gonna be any miracles in that f court building tomorrow. 0:10:15.320 --> 0:10:18.400 Man, that has gone through the motions tomorrow is gonna suck. 0:10:20.840 --> 0:10:26.040 Yeah, And just seeing people who are like hopeful and 0:10:26.200 --> 0:10:33.560 us standing around knowing what's gonna happen should I'm feeling 0:10:33.600 --> 0:10:38.199 it now. It's just this home court advantage that they have. 0:10:38.559 --> 0:10:45.720 They have, it's all stacked in their favor and reason logic, 0:10:45.880 --> 0:10:50.800 the right thing doesn't really matter. Winning matters. I can't 0:10:50.840 --> 0:10:53.280 distance myself from me like it should be just like, well, 0:10:53.440 --> 0:10:55.600 this is the story I'm reporting. It's unfortunate for all 0:10:55.640 --> 0:10:58.360 the people arout like no, we're in it, and I mean, 0:10:59.080 --> 0:10:59.800 I don't know what to do. 0:11:00.200 --> 0:11:03.880 That's you know, we're still reporting on everything. But it's 0:11:04.000 --> 0:11:05.280 just how do you not feel this? 0:11:05.480 --> 0:11:05.640 Man? 0:11:05.720 --> 0:11:06.720 I just know what's wrong. 0:11:10.520 --> 0:11:10.640 Hi. 0:11:10.720 --> 0:11:14.199 I'm Jason Flamm, CEO and founder of Lava for Good podcasts, 0:11:14.360 --> 0:11:17.400 Home to Bone Valley, Wrongful Conviction, The War on Drugs, 0:11:17.440 --> 0:11:21.160 and many other great podcasts. Today we're asking you, our listeners, 0:11:21.240 --> 0:11:23.800 to take part in a survey. Your feedback is going 0:11:23.840 --> 0:11:26.960 to help inform how we make podcasts in the future. 0:11:27.240 --> 0:11:29.920 Your complete and candid answers will help us continue to 0:11:30.000 --> 0:11:34.000 bring you more insightful and inspiring stories about important topics 0:11:34.040 --> 0:11:36.679 that impact us all. So please go to lava for 0:11:36.800 --> 0:11:40.599 goood dot com slash survey and participate today. Thank you 0:11:40.800 --> 0:11:41.480 for your support. 0:11:46.960 --> 0:11:50.920 Bone Valley is sponsored by Stand Together. Stand Together is 0:11:50.920 --> 0:11:54.840 a philanthropic community that partners with America's boldest change makers 0:11:55.080 --> 0:11:58.080 to tackle the root causes of our country's biggest problems, 0:11:58.440 --> 0:12:03.679 including the broken criminal justice system. Weldon Angelos is one 0:12:03.720 --> 0:12:06.680 of those change makers. At the age of twenty three, 0:12:07.120 --> 0:12:09.800 Weldon was arrested for a first time offense of selling 0:12:09.880 --> 0:12:13.800 weed to a confidential informant. At the time, he was 0:12:13.800 --> 0:12:18.679 a budding musician spending time with artists like Tupac Snoop Dogg, Pink, 0:12:18.920 --> 0:12:22.240 and Gnase. His entire life was ahead of him when 0:12:22.280 --> 0:12:24.959 he was sentenced to a mandatory fifty five years in 0:12:25.040 --> 0:12:30.160 federal prison without the possibility of early release. After serving 0:12:30.280 --> 0:12:34.760 thirteen years, a bipartisan effort led to him getting officially pardoned. 0:12:35.520 --> 0:12:39.719 Upon his release, he founded The Weldon Project, a nonprofit 0:12:40.000 --> 0:12:43.160 working to create better outcomes for those still in prison 0:12:43.520 --> 0:12:47.319 that funds social change and provides financial aid for all 0:12:47.440 --> 0:12:51.199 those who were still serving time for cannabis related offenses. 0:12:52.400 --> 0:12:55.599 Weldon Angelos is one of the many entrepreneurs partnering with 0:12:55.760 --> 0:13:01.000 Stand Together to drive solutions in education, healthcare, poverty, and 0:13:01.120 --> 0:13:04.800 criminal justice. To learn more about the War on Drugs, 0:13:05.240 --> 0:13:08.600 listen to the War on Drugs podcast on Apple Podcasts 0:13:08.920 --> 0:13:16.520 or wherever you get your podcasts. The night before the hearing, 0:13:16.600 --> 0:13:19.400 we had dinner reservations at a restaurant in Tallahassee with 0:13:19.520 --> 0:13:22.760 Chrissy Ashley, her two baby boys, and some of their 0:13:22.800 --> 0:13:25.240 close friends who had made the trek up to Tallahassee 0:13:25.320 --> 0:13:28.760 to support them. The dinner was supposed to be about hope, 0:13:29.160 --> 0:13:31.880 final chance to come together and center themselves for the 0:13:31.960 --> 0:13:35.160 next day, but after the news from the meetings, the 0:13:35.240 --> 0:13:39.040 mood was somber. Leo's best friend and bandmate, Kevin Herrick 0:13:39.400 --> 0:13:42.120 his family showed up to be with Chrissy. They've known 0:13:42.200 --> 0:13:46.280 Leo and Chrissy for decades. Kevin's sister Laurie led everyone 0:13:46.360 --> 0:13:46.760 in prayer. 0:13:48.240 --> 0:13:52.400 We ask right now for comfort for Leo. We can't 0:13:52.440 --> 0:13:55.040 even imagine Lord, what he's going through right now. I 0:13:55.200 --> 0:13:58.920 pray that you surround him right now, this evening tomorrow 0:13:59.000 --> 0:14:03.000 morning with people who love him, who can lift him 0:14:03.160 --> 0:14:06.240 up and bring him comfort. And we ask that you 0:14:06.440 --> 0:14:09.400 bring him comfort Lord, as we know only you can 0:14:09.480 --> 0:14:12.679 do in times like this when we feel that you know, 0:14:13.080 --> 0:14:16.199 everything is out of our control, but we know that 0:14:16.320 --> 0:14:20.160 everything goes through your hands first. So we are accepting that. 0:14:21.000 --> 0:14:24.600 We are, as Chrissy said, lifting our heads high, and 0:14:24.760 --> 0:14:27.080 we are leaving this at the altar. 0:14:30.320 --> 0:14:31.680 High shudders back. 0:14:33.360 --> 0:14:36.880 We're okay, We're okay, yes we are, We're good. 0:14:37.160 --> 0:14:38.000 This is gonna work. 0:14:39.320 --> 0:14:39.480 You know. 0:14:39.640 --> 0:14:42.040 Those are the boys came in Leo's grandsons and just 0:14:42.240 --> 0:14:43.640 like he know, I wanted to hug from one of 0:14:43.680 --> 0:14:46.600 those kids. I just wanted to hold those kids. So 0:14:46.760 --> 0:14:53.480 that was for me. Yeah, you know, I definitely understand 0:14:53.920 --> 0:14:55.600 why so many people. 0:14:55.680 --> 0:14:57.840 Are religious in this world because if you have no 0:14:58.000 --> 0:15:02.040 hope this and you got to believe in something and 0:15:02.760 --> 0:15:05.440 this is it and it's happening right in front of me, and. 0:15:05.720 --> 0:15:07.520 Uh, I'm all in. 0:15:09.720 --> 0:15:12.400 While we sat at dinner with Chrissy, Scott was sending 0:15:12.440 --> 0:15:15.800 me messages. He was working to pull whatever strings he 0:15:15.840 --> 0:15:19.800 could to trigger that epiphany. You know, Scott also. 0:15:19.680 --> 0:15:22.480 Recognized that, you know, we need to rawther kitchen sink 0:15:22.520 --> 0:15:25.320 at this and pull out all the stops everything, and 0:15:25.760 --> 0:15:26.960 you know, we agreed. 0:15:27.000 --> 0:15:28.000 We need Jonathan here. 0:15:29.080 --> 0:15:32.040 Senator Jonathan Martin had already told us that he thought 0:15:32.160 --> 0:15:35.200 Leo was innocent and should not only be paroled, he 0:15:35.240 --> 0:15:38.800 should be exonerated. He's also the chair of the Florida 0:15:38.880 --> 0:15:42.320 Senate's Committee on Criminal Justice and has oversight of the 0:15:42.400 --> 0:15:46.440 Florida Commission on a Fender Review. Those three appointed officials 0:15:46.600 --> 0:15:50.000 who'd be making the decision to grant Leo parole or not. 0:15:51.520 --> 0:15:55.000 His presence at the hearing might be Leo's last hope. 0:15:55.880 --> 0:15:58.560 If he could appear, you know, and with him and 0:15:58.600 --> 0:16:03.080 Scott speaking together about this, I think that if that 0:16:03.400 --> 0:16:07.360 could happen, that might be the Hail Mary pass. We 0:16:07.480 --> 0:16:10.000 need something really powerful, something that was kind of like 0:16:10.080 --> 0:16:10.800 a game changer. 0:16:11.560 --> 0:16:11.720 You know. 0:16:12.120 --> 0:16:15.560 Davidson talked about wanting to have some kind of epiphany, 0:16:15.640 --> 0:16:19.080 and I said, that's what we need, something so powerful 0:16:19.160 --> 0:16:21.040 that it's going to change the vote. 0:16:22.520 --> 0:16:24.760 But this is the last week of the legislative session 0:16:24.800 --> 0:16:28.240 in Tallahassee, and Senator Martin has to be present to vote, 0:16:28.840 --> 0:16:30.960 so showing up at a parole hearing might not even 0:16:31.040 --> 0:16:31.680 be possible. 0:16:32.800 --> 0:16:35.320 He had said early on, I'll do whatever I can, 0:16:36.760 --> 0:16:39.600 if I can, if I'm available. So I texted him 0:16:39.600 --> 0:16:42.600 a couple of times. He wasn't responding to the text. 0:16:43.240 --> 0:16:45.400 I didn't read anything negative into it. I just was like, 0:16:46.720 --> 0:16:49.400 he's inundated, and I get it. You know, he's got 0:16:50.000 --> 0:16:51.240 major responsibilities. 0:16:52.560 --> 0:16:52.800 Ah. 0:16:55.960 --> 0:16:57.640 I called him last night. 0:16:58.880 --> 0:17:01.840 Left a voicemail, and I left a pretty long text 0:17:02.400 --> 0:17:08.879 was basically help, please help, because I was panicked. And 0:17:09.400 --> 0:17:13.639 within fifteen minutes of that text, I got a text 0:17:13.760 --> 0:17:16.720 from Jonathan very short, I'll be there at nine o'clock, 0:17:19.440 --> 0:17:22.359 and then I had to text back that we're not 0:17:22.440 --> 0:17:27.920 scheduled till ten, so then start panicking again. 0:17:29.119 --> 0:17:31.280 The next morning, Scott pulled into the parking lot for 0:17:31.359 --> 0:17:34.600 the hearing. He didn't know whether or not Senator Martin. 0:17:34.320 --> 0:17:36.960 Would really be there. He's pulling in. 0:17:37.119 --> 0:17:37.720 Right next to me. 0:17:37.760 --> 0:17:40.679 At the same time, he goes, I'm gonna go sit 0:17:40.720 --> 0:17:42.080 in the front row. See if that helps. 0:17:42.560 --> 0:17:45.040 You can't miss him. He's like six seven six eight, 0:17:46.400 --> 0:17:47.000 That's what he did. 0:17:48.359 --> 0:17:51.320 Senator Martin promised to make an appearance, but with the 0:17:51.440 --> 0:17:54.040 timing and a schedule. He might not be able to 0:17:54.080 --> 0:17:57.560 stay until Leo's case was called, but he was promising 0:17:57.600 --> 0:17:59.440 Scott he'd stay for as long as he could. 0:18:04.200 --> 0:18:09.600 I was sitting there and like the dread really hit me. 0:18:10.920 --> 0:18:14.280 I was so aware of my blood pressure, like it 0:18:14.440 --> 0:18:15.520 was just through the roof. 0:18:16.720 --> 0:18:20.439 And then the commissioner, the chair announced that we're going 0:18:20.520 --> 0:18:22.280 to take a short three minute break and we're going 0:18:22.359 --> 0:18:23.720 to come back and we're going to start with the 0:18:23.760 --> 0:18:26.280 Schofield case, and we're going to do that one first. 0:18:26.400 --> 0:18:27.840 And you could tell there was some buzz in the 0:18:27.880 --> 0:18:31.040 crowd because everybody was there for Leo's case. 0:18:31.000 --> 0:18:34.000 And it just made me think, all right, three minutes, 0:18:34.080 --> 0:18:37.240 that's the countdown, Okay. 0:18:37.040 --> 0:18:45.639 Keep ready. And then when the hearing actually started, seeing 0:18:45.760 --> 0:18:51.000 all of our familiar faces around, and I don't know, 0:18:51.359 --> 0:18:52.800 I feel like I was worried about you. 0:18:54.640 --> 0:18:55.960 I didn't even know what I was supposed to do 0:18:56.080 --> 0:18:59.840 except sit there and just suffer. And that was that 0:19:00.160 --> 0:19:02.359 was the hard part, just feeling like, well, I'm just 0:19:02.440 --> 0:19:05.120 gonna be watching this and I know where it's going. 0:19:05.280 --> 0:19:08.320 It's just gonna be painful, all right. 0:19:08.320 --> 0:19:10.520 I'll go ahead and use meaning to order for the 0:19:10.600 --> 0:19:13.320 full commission is ten am. We're back on the record. 0:19:14.280 --> 0:19:16.760 If everyone could please take your seat, if you are 0:19:16.840 --> 0:19:18.080 not going to be speaking. 0:19:20.280 --> 0:19:23.680 Seeing the commissioners walk in and like you know, making 0:19:23.800 --> 0:19:27.600 eye contact with them and knowing like that they know 0:19:27.880 --> 0:19:30.639 what I'm thinking, and like I know what they're thinking, 0:19:30.760 --> 0:19:34.879 and there's just like that recognition and I don't know 0:19:35.160 --> 0:19:37.000 that that felt really intense. 0:19:37.119 --> 0:19:37.480 I felt. 0:19:37.840 --> 0:19:39.520 I was like, oh, why did we choose to sit 0:19:39.600 --> 0:19:41.760 in the front row. I feel like very vulnerable and. 0:19:41.840 --> 0:19:42.600 Exposed right now. 0:19:42.720 --> 0:19:44.680 Yeah, I was thinking the same thing. I'm just it's 0:19:44.720 --> 0:19:47.440 just a totally helpless feeling, like, you know, after all 0:19:47.480 --> 0:19:50.560 we've done and everything, and it was just like it's 0:19:50.680 --> 0:19:54.160 really difficult to sit there and like maintain any kind 0:19:54.200 --> 0:19:54.520 of hope. 0:19:55.880 --> 0:19:57.280 So we're now in the full portion. 0:19:57.200 --> 0:19:57.560 Of the dock. 0:19:57.600 --> 0:20:00.880 People're all three commissioners will be voting. East side gets 0:20:00.920 --> 0:20:03.280 ten minutes in which to make your presentation. We'll start 0:20:03.320 --> 0:20:07.280 with the supporters, followed by anyone in opposition the investigators 0:20:07.359 --> 0:20:11.000 recommending an extension. And this is on the leoscope. Okase 0:20:11.040 --> 0:20:14.240 I had to number thirty one on page sixteen and 0:20:15.240 --> 0:20:15.800 made proceed. 0:20:17.359 --> 0:20:20.679 At that point, I see Scott move towards the podium. 0:20:21.840 --> 0:20:25.840 I see Jonathan sitting at the front table, and I 0:20:26.000 --> 0:20:30.119 just remember thinking, they know it's desperation time, they know 0:20:30.800 --> 0:20:34.240 where things stand, and so they're not going to hold 0:20:34.240 --> 0:20:34.720 anything back. 0:20:34.760 --> 0:20:36.280 And I just had that feeling that it was just 0:20:36.359 --> 0:20:40.600 going to be not your typical parole hearing. 0:20:41.640 --> 0:20:42.760 Good morning, commissioners. 0:20:42.960 --> 0:20:43.280 Thank you. 0:20:44.000 --> 0:20:48.680 My name is Scott Cupp. I'm an attorney representing Leo Schofield, obviously, 0:20:49.720 --> 0:20:52.400 but there's many, many other attorneys. A lot of them 0:20:52.480 --> 0:20:55.000 are here today, and I would just like to mention them. 0:20:55.280 --> 0:20:55.680 Briefly. 0:20:55.880 --> 0:20:58.359 I was facing his back. I couldn't see his eyes, 0:20:58.440 --> 0:21:01.960 but I was watching the commissioners and there was like 0:21:02.080 --> 0:21:04.719 this anticipation. I could sort of see it in their 0:21:04.760 --> 0:21:05.440 eyes through me. 0:21:06.240 --> 0:21:08.920 The first thing I would like you to hear from 0:21:10.480 --> 0:21:15.160 is a letter written by Jesse Sam who's Michelle Schofield's brother. 0:21:16.000 --> 0:21:18.960 It was written for the last parole hearing, which was 0:21:19.560 --> 0:21:23.520 in twenty twenty. For some reason, and maybe the state 0:21:23.560 --> 0:21:26.359 will tell us here today, it was not read. I 0:21:26.440 --> 0:21:28.879 have no idea why it wasn't read. I think it 0:21:28.960 --> 0:21:30.680 was part of the record, but I want to read 0:21:30.720 --> 0:21:33.760 it now. Make it part of the record. January two 0:21:33.880 --> 0:21:37.440 twenty twenty in reference to Leo R. Schofield prole hearing 0:21:37.480 --> 0:21:40.280 one eight twenty. To whom it may concern, I'm not 0:21:40.400 --> 0:21:43.240 going to attend the prole hearing of Leo R. Schofield. However, 0:21:43.359 --> 0:21:46.040 I do ask you to read this letter and take 0:21:46.119 --> 0:21:48.800 my comments into consideration as you make a decision about 0:21:48.840 --> 0:21:52.560 granting Leo parole. I was sixteen at the time of 0:21:52.680 --> 0:21:55.480 my sister's murder. I never knew the details of the case. 0:21:55.520 --> 0:21:58.399 Because of my age, I had assumed the detectives and 0:21:58.480 --> 0:22:02.720 the state involved had substantial evidence beyond a shadow of 0:22:02.760 --> 0:22:06.640 a doubt to convict Leoschofield first degree murder. Over the years, 0:22:06.720 --> 0:22:09.760 I've done some research and have found many inconsistencies and 0:22:09.840 --> 0:22:13.440 discrepancies in the investigation and the trial. These have led 0:22:13.480 --> 0:22:16.640 to many questions about the state's handling of my sister's murder. 0:22:17.520 --> 0:22:20.240 I'm not one hundred percent convinced Leo is guilty of 0:22:20.280 --> 0:22:23.600 this crime. In fact, for my research, he could be innocent. 0:22:24.600 --> 0:22:27.760 It just seems likely you got the wrong guy. I 0:22:27.880 --> 0:22:30.520 do not have confidence in the conviction of Leo Schofield, 0:22:30.600 --> 0:22:32.640 and I support his request for parole. 0:22:33.359 --> 0:22:33.680 Thank you. 0:22:34.040 --> 0:22:37.840 Jesse Song At this time, I would like to have 0:22:38.400 --> 0:22:40.000 Senator Jonathan Martin speak. 0:22:42.400 --> 0:22:46.040 And then Jonathan Rose. And you know when he stands 0:22:46.119 --> 0:22:48.320 up at the podium, it looks like the podium's up 0:22:48.359 --> 0:22:52.639 to his waist and he's just staring at the commissioners intensely. 0:22:53.400 --> 0:22:53.840 Good morning. 0:22:53.880 --> 0:22:56.399 My name is Jonathan Martin. I've known Scott Cup for 0:22:56.520 --> 0:22:58.720 many years. I met him when I was a prosecutor. 0:22:59.119 --> 0:23:03.760 I've handled Holmes cases. Everything that I've seen about this 0:23:03.880 --> 0:23:12.280 case turns my stomach. I don't know why Leo Schofield 0:23:12.359 --> 0:23:15.680 wasn't released years ago when he was before this board. 0:23:20.640 --> 0:23:24.200 You have the opportunity to release him immediately. He wasn't 0:23:24.240 --> 0:23:28.960 released last time because he wasn't remorseful. You cannot be 0:23:29.119 --> 0:23:33.879 remorseful for something you did not do. It's not your 0:23:33.960 --> 0:23:36.520 job to determine guilt or innocence. But if you are 0:23:36.560 --> 0:23:39.159 going to consider whether somebody is remorseful and whether they 0:23:39.200 --> 0:23:41.640 should be released today or should have been released years ago, 0:23:43.960 --> 0:23:48.600 you have to at least crack the transcript. You have 0:23:48.680 --> 0:23:51.920 to at least wonder why the fingerprints of a serial 0:23:52.040 --> 0:23:56.600 killer were inside Michelle's car And we're never tested, and 0:23:56.720 --> 0:23:59.040