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Speaker 1: Hey, look, well, Lucas here, black tech, green money. This

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Speaker 1: conversation that you're about to hear it's from afro Tech,

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Speaker 1: held in Oakland, California. It's with the incredible Delaying Parnell,

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Speaker 1: who's the CEO of play Versus, a competitive gaming company

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Speaker 1: otherwise known as an e sports company. Delian is on

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Speaker 1: the main stage at afro Tech, the world's largest black

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Speaker 1: tech conference, talking with Morgan d vaughan, CEO of Levity. Honestly,

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Speaker 1: for me, this is the talk that I remember most

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Speaker 1: from that year's conference. There have been a lot of

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Speaker 1: memorable experiences at afro techs of Yord, but this one

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Speaker 1: in particular features a few gyms dropped, a few bars

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Speaker 1: laid down perfectly, and if you listen, a few nuggets

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Speaker 1: of wisdom which would help you find your own ways

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Speaker 1: to success in tech. It's the holiday season, so I'm

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Speaker 1: throwing it back to be honest, because I want to

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Speaker 1: hang out with my family too. But I didn't want

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Speaker 1: to leave you with Adobe the step two, So I'm

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Speaker 1: bring us some meat today. So I hope you listen

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Speaker 1: to this conversation diligently and with the idea that you're

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Speaker 1: gonna come away better than you were going in. So

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Speaker 1: let's listen. Please give it up for the session all

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Speaker 1: about play to Win the Business of E Sports with

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Speaker 1: Delane Parnell from the three one three at Morgan Dubon

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Speaker 1: from the three one four. What's up after a check?

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Speaker 1: He did? Anybody's arms start hurting? Whatever? Watching that? Okay? Alright, Delane?

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Speaker 1: How are you good? Recover from that party? Beautiful room?

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Speaker 1: Right here? It is a beautiful room. So first, let's

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Speaker 1: just talk about what is the sports? You know? I

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Speaker 1: think a lot of people have maybe heard the phrase esports,

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Speaker 1: but we might not know what it is. So why

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Speaker 1: don't you know what it means? So how many people

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Speaker 1: hear about show hands have ever heard of the sports before? Alright? Cool?

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Speaker 1: So for most of you you have a good understanding

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Speaker 1: of exactly what it means. For those who don't, E

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Speaker 1: sports is really a term used to describe competitive video gaming.

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Speaker 1: So playing video games uh in the same format and

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Speaker 1: structure as sports, So there's an entire industry built around it.

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Speaker 1: Um professional leagues that look like the NBA to NFL.

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Speaker 1: Lots of the team owners in those professional leagues are

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Speaker 1: the same owners who own franchises in the NFL, NBA.

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Speaker 1: UM and yeah, and like we're we're working on the

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Speaker 1: amateur side of that, right. So when you say amateur side,

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Speaker 1: what does that mean? Nine of gamers? Right? So of

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Speaker 1: the thousand pro players, there's two point four billion amateur

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Speaker 1: players who enjoy playing video games, and we're building software

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Speaker 1: that enables competition for them. So you recently closed your

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Speaker 1: series C. Let's big shout out to that got many

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Speaker 1: of us have made it a serious C. Yet I

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Speaker 1: do not envy that level of pressure. Um. So you've

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Speaker 1: raised a little under um in nine million. I was saying,

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Speaker 1: don't forget a million? Now million in under months. The

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Speaker 1: company's eighteen months old. Tell me about that experience, telling

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Speaker 1: about how you're gonna started and what your journey has

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Speaker 1: been to get to where you are today. So yeah,

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Speaker 1: So I started the company last January really around the

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Speaker 1: mission of building out the infrastructure around amateur e sports.

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Speaker 1: So what that means is if you're gonna play e

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Speaker 1: sports and you're not going to be a professional, um,

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Speaker 1: you're gonna play online and so who's gonna own the

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Speaker 1: generational product where all of that competition happens? And so

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Speaker 1: we went out to build that company the way that

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Speaker 1: we approached it UM is really unique, mostly because we

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Speaker 1: have to to even have a company, we have to

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Speaker 1: work with game publishers who own their i P. So

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Speaker 1: in many ways, it's the same challenge that groups like

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Speaker 1: Spotify our Netflix have where they have to go work

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Speaker 1: with third parties who spend billions of dollars developing i

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Speaker 1: P and you have to acquire the rights to be

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Speaker 1: able to like commercialize that. And so we we to

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Speaker 1: be able to accomplish that, we decided to take a

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Speaker 1: really unique aproach into how we enter the market and

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Speaker 1: UM and ended up basically owning and operating high school

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Speaker 1: e sports. So we went to this group called the NFLJS,

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Speaker 1: who governs all high schools in the country essentially the

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Speaker 1: same as the n C double A in the same

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Speaker 1: office for the past under years, and we received a

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Speaker 1: partnership with them to own and operate e sports at

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Speaker 1: twenty thousand high schools across the country. So having that

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Speaker 1: distribution allowed us to go out, thank you if so.

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Speaker 1: Having that distribution allowed us to go out, acquired the

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Speaker 1: rights from publishers, build a team that built you know,

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Speaker 1: product UM, and then essentially started to you know, raise

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Speaker 1: money on the back of that idea, and so you know,

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Speaker 1: last May we raised our Series A fifteen and a

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Speaker 1: half million, which uh just a few months after launching,

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Speaker 1: and then a few months later raised our Series B

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Speaker 1: thirty and a half million, and then a couple of

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Speaker 1: months ago we closed our seriously uh fifty million. What

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Speaker 1: is all this money for? What are you how are

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Speaker 1: you going to deploy this capital? What is the return

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Speaker 1: on investment? I mean, it's a multibillion dollar industry, so

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Speaker 1: we know that you need a lot of money to

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Speaker 1: go after it. So what are you gonna do? Sure? Yeah, So, look,

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Speaker 1: the the opportunity in front of us, at least, you know,

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Speaker 1: based on you know, our assumption and all of the

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Speaker 1: research that we've done, is that we're building a hundred

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Speaker 1: million plus user subscription business. Right, so we're building the

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Speaker 1: biggest company and gaming biggest company certainly the most impactful

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Speaker 1: and most valuable company needs sports, uh and we need

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Speaker 1: people right to get there, and people in l A

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Speaker 1: specifically are really expensive and so as you you know

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Speaker 1: all too well, and so uh so yeah, so look,

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Speaker 1: we're using that money to build more product, to invest

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Speaker 1: in our community. It's a new category. Um So there's

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Speaker 1: certainly going to be some bumpy bumpy rolls within uh,

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Speaker 1: within the sort of you know bubble that's being created. Um,

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Speaker 1: and we want to be around and so um. We

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Speaker 1: we haven't spent most of that money, but um, but

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Speaker 1: we're certainly looking forward to continue to invest in our

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Speaker 1: people and we're launching some new stuff next year. So

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Speaker 1: today we're in high school and the third of the

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Speaker 1: country has a the E sports right video games as

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Speaker 1: a sanction sport in high school, which is pretty crazy. Um,

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Speaker 1: next year we're gonna be Can you just explain that,

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Speaker 1: because I'm not sure that everybody full like that. What

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Speaker 1: does it mean to be a sanction sport in high school?

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Speaker 1: You've got people with like vart City Sports, right, Yeah, No,

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Speaker 1: it's pretty wild. So when you if you go to

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Speaker 1: high school and you play a sport, um, you can

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Speaker 1: win a state championship for it. The fact that you

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Speaker 1: can win that state championship means that the sport has

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Speaker 1: been sanctioned. Um. Uh. You know, we partner with this

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Speaker 1: group and all of these states for them to adopt

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Speaker 1: video games as a sanction sport mean kids who go

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Speaker 1: to certain schools like in California, for example, they can

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Speaker 1: play a game like League of Legends or you know,

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Speaker 1: maybe in the future NBA two K for state championship,

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Speaker 1: as the kids in basketball or football or soccer today does. UH.

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Speaker 1: They can earn a varsity letter, they can be eligible

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Speaker 1: for the you know, state Hall of Fame and the

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Speaker 1: state record books. They can receive you know, millions of

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Speaker 1: dollars in scholarship because you know, hundreds of colleges offered

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Speaker 1: tens of millions of dollars in scholarships. And so you know,

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Speaker 1: we've created uh an entire and ronment for kids who

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Speaker 1: care about video games and want to be recognized for

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Speaker 1: their talents there to be able to go out and

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Speaker 1: take their career to the next level. That's awesome. Um, yeah,

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Speaker 1: don't be shy, affort tech, don't be shy. This is

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Speaker 1: a lot of work. Yeah, so let's bring it back.

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Speaker 1: Let's bring it back to Detroit. So from Detroit. Um,

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Speaker 1: you're a serial entrepreneur. We got Detroit and the build

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Speaker 1: it just in the front. Okay, Um, but so you

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Speaker 1: you're a serial entrepreneur. Um, you've been hustling almost all

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Speaker 1: your life. What made you decide to take it to

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Speaker 1: the next level and go after the Silicon Valley money. Yeah. No, look,

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Speaker 1: I mean, well there's no what's the alternative, right, it's

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Speaker 1: the real question. So, um, you know, I grew up

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Speaker 1: born and raised in Detroit, um Jeffreys Projects. Spent the

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Speaker 1: sort of second half of my life as a teenager

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Speaker 1: on the West side of Detroit, raised by a single mother.

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Speaker 1: Um self and my older brother. And my mom she

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Speaker 1: did some stuff that was pretty impactful, like early on

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Speaker 1: into my career looking back, especially now you know she

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Speaker 1: got a summer jobs. Um, I worked at the cell

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Speaker 1: phone store, and my brother ended up working at this

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Speaker 1: meat packing place called meat Town and now he works

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Speaker 1: as a chef. Um. And obviously I worked in business

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Speaker 1: and so um this guy at the cellphone stores named Sam.

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Speaker 1: He took me under his wing, allowed me the opportunity

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Speaker 1: to be basically be able to learn and experiment as

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Speaker 1: I went and um yeah, eventually I end up owning

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Speaker 1: some cell phone stores in high school, started a car

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Speaker 1: into um, end up working in venture capital, worked at

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Speaker 1: a startup there. When I was working in inventure I

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Speaker 1: was like, yeah, no, so was super early. There was

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Speaker 1: like no, that's one you know, it's interesting people people

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Speaker 1: would tell me like, hey, you need an m b A.

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Speaker 1: Uh And I was like, man, you know maybe for

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Speaker 1: you you know, like I was like, what's an m

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Speaker 1: v A. Like I dropped out of school? I went

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Speaker 1: to school for a semester. I was like even nobody

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Speaker 1: getting money here. I was, I gotta get out of here.

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Speaker 1: Uh no for real? So yeah so uh so yeah,

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Speaker 1: so I love school and I was like I'm gonna

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Speaker 1: I'm gonna figure it out, you know, like for me

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Speaker 1: to go. My mom has like all of these old

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Speaker 1: videos of me when I was a kid. People will

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Speaker 1: be like, you know, what do you wanna what do

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Speaker 1: you want to be? What do you want to do?

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Speaker 1: And I would always respond like I'm I want to

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Speaker 1: be a billionaire, like or I'm going to be a billionaire.

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Speaker 1: And I never I never really knew exactly how I

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Speaker 1: get there. I always had the conviction that I would

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Speaker 1: and and luckily, you know, I was able to find

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Speaker 1: uh an avenue through gaming, which is something I care

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Speaker 1: a lot about, you know, uh tech, which is something

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Speaker 1: I care a lot about. And you know, for me,

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Speaker 1: like I want to be the first African American to

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Speaker 1: sell a tech company for a billion dollars and I

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Speaker 1: think we're well on our way, so you know half

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Speaker 1: about that. So a lot of times, I mean, I

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Speaker 1: want to talk about this. I feel like we've talked

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Speaker 1: about this before. A lot of times, I think in

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Speaker 1: the black tech space, because there's so few of us

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Speaker 1: who raise a venture funding, we celebrate the race um

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Speaker 1: and sometimes it can be kind of a false sense

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Speaker 1: of success because that's fake. You know, that's just numbers

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Speaker 1: on a piece of paper, right, it's not liquid. So

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Speaker 1: what is your point of view on kind of the

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Speaker 1: state of black startups black tech? Do you think that

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Speaker 1: we've um made progress? Do you think that we're approaching

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Speaker 1: it the right way? Just what are your general thoughts

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Speaker 1: about where we are today? Yeah, well, first off, I

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Speaker 1: think you know, uh, you know, lots of companies are

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Speaker 1: investing into you know, fixing whatever said pipeline issue that

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Speaker 1: they have, and I think, well, I don't think that

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Speaker 1: there's a pipeline issue, just from having exposure to being

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Speaker 1: in those rooms. It's really it's really for them an

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Speaker 1: awareness issue and an exposure issue. You know. I went

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Speaker 1: down to Atlanta with a really well known angel investor

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Speaker 1: who's invested into companies that are sod for tens of

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Speaker 1: billions of dollars. He never been to Atlanta. You know,

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Speaker 1: he had no ever intentions of ever going to Atlanta.

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Speaker 1: And in the one time I asked them, you know,

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Speaker 1: he was so curious he decided to like get on

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Speaker 1: a plane and come down. Um. And I'd imagine that

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Speaker 1: that's the case for lots of like a lots of investors,

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Speaker 1: you know, who invest tons of capital into companies, it's

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Speaker 1: mostly like into people who look like them because that's

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Speaker 1: like the the that's the exposure that they have, right,

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Speaker 1: those are the relationships that they have within their network.

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Speaker 1: And so you know, I think the I think what

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Speaker 1: we need to really spend a lot of time talking about,

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Speaker 1: and I talk about this quite often, is that, um, certainly,

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Speaker 1: like we need to continue to put pressure on investors

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Speaker 1: to put money into black companies. And I do that

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Speaker 1: very often. In fact, like I was invited to some

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Speaker 1: big like CEO exclusive conference earlier this year and I

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Speaker 1: told them they sent me this invite, and it was

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Speaker 1: like it was you know, not or obviously, but I

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Speaker 1: responded and I said, hey, look, I looked at the

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Speaker 1: list of people there. There's no black people besides me. Like,

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Speaker 1: if if you can invite these ten people like I'm

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Speaker 1: happy to come otherwise like I don't want to be there.

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Speaker 1: I think the people in those positions need to do

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Speaker 1: more of that and like continue to put pressure on

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Speaker 1: thank you. Yeah, look, I think I think we need

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Speaker 1: to continue to put pressure on um, you know, people

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Speaker 1: with the resources right to to open up doors for

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Speaker 1: our people and invest in our ideas. I also think

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Speaker 1: we need to invest in and our people's ideas right

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Speaker 1: in our own community. Right like we have our we

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Speaker 1: have our own resources. We have to be willing to

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Speaker 1: take risks in each out there, uh and really in

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Speaker 1: to to build our our own community right and take

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Speaker 1: ownership in that. Secondly, you know, because not everyone's an entrepreneur,

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Speaker 1: I think we need to really start. Obviously, people should

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Speaker 1: go to school and certainly focused on engineering our product

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Speaker 1: related roles. I think there's a lot of opportunity to

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Speaker 1: build generational wealth and and being an engineer or being

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Speaker 1: um a product manager or even a project manager at

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Speaker 1: a company. But I also think that we need to

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Speaker 1: encourage our people to go work in HR, right. I

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Speaker 1: think HR is the perfect opportunity to be able to

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Speaker 1: to go out and you know, hire the next set

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Speaker 1: of executives and train the next set of executives. And

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Speaker 1: I think if there were more people who look like

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Speaker 1: us in some of these big companies in HR roles,

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Speaker 1: especially um, like HR leadership roles, you'll see more people

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Speaker 1: within these companies that look like us. And so I

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Speaker 1: think between those three things, you're seeing a little bit

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Speaker 1: of it now, like we're in the early stages of

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Speaker 1: development there, but um, but certainly a long way to go.

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Speaker 1: And I think that's that's that's a good road map

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Speaker 1: to get in there. Yeah. Um, So thinking about kind

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Speaker 1: of your journey to eight, you've got some rockstar investors. Um,

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Speaker 1: what has been your process for fundraising? You know, Detroit

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Speaker 1: doesn't necessarily have a ton of people who are in

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Speaker 1: venture capital. There are a couple of people who have

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Speaker 1: made a significant amount of investments there, um, but the

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Speaker 1: number is small, but the amount is big. They're very rich.

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Speaker 1: So what is what was your process? How did you

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Speaker 1: get started with your first check? Yeah? So I had

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Speaker 1: to leave Detroit by the way to get my first check. Um.

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Speaker 1: You know, it's interesting to be this kid from Detroit

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Speaker 1: really and all of the right networks when there's really

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Speaker 1: in Detroit there's like only one network right then, Gilbert

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Speaker 1: Um he like owns the entire city, owns the biggest

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Speaker 1: companies in the city. But I'm within the network, right.

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Speaker 1: We have a relationship personally. You know, I have this

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Speaker 1: idea and I wanted to start this company. I went

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Speaker 1: to meet with his team that like the week before

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Speaker 1: I was scheduled to leave and um, and you know,

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Speaker 1: I was like, hey, look, I got this idea. We

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Speaker 1: obviously have a relationship to you guys want to support

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Speaker 1: and and the guy whose job is to keep people

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Speaker 1: like talented people in the city told me like, no,

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Speaker 1: you should go. You should go and do that. Why

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Speaker 1: did you think he said that? I mean, look, you

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Speaker 1: know they typically invest in white Jewish men right like

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Speaker 1: within their within their community. And while I have like

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Speaker 1: great respect for that, like that's just like that's what

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Speaker 1: they do, right, And so you know, frankly, I don't

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Speaker 1: think he had faith, Like uh, I think that's super clear.

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Speaker 1: Um uh. And he certainly didn't see the vision. And

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Speaker 1: so you know, it's it's interesting I go back now,

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Speaker 1: it's just there for the forest conference, and everybody knew

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Speaker 1: I was going to be a great success. They're like, man,

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Speaker 1: I knew you know, I'm so you know, the sakest

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Speaker 1: love in the world is like when they come up

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Speaker 1: to you you try to work with somebody like I'm

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Speaker 1: so proud of you, you know, like what are you

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Speaker 1: talking about? Man? But I met this guy named Peter

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Speaker 1: fam at UH south By Southwest, UM, and you know, Peter,

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Speaker 1: Peter is super important in my journey because you know,

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Speaker 1: he's you know, he spoke with me for thirty minutes.

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Speaker 1: I thought the idea that I was thinking about was

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Speaker 1: super compelling, and said, hey, give me your phone number. UM,

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Speaker 1: let's talk about this. And he followed up like I

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Speaker 1: didn't have to reach out to him. He followed up

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Speaker 1: the next day and say, hey, I've been thinking a

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Speaker 1: lot about what you've been thinking, what you talked about, UH,

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Speaker 1: and here's how I think we can approach it, and

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Speaker 1: asked me to come to l A and spend time

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Speaker 1: with him and his partners and and so I did

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Speaker 1: so one you know, I talked to him. I was

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Speaker 1: not afraid to share my idea with him. And I

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Speaker 1: think a lot of us were so possessive of our ideas.

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Speaker 1: We're afraid to get our ideas out in the universe.

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Speaker 1: Like you gotta share it. That's the only one. Like,

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Speaker 1: first off, it's such an arrogant, you know, mentality to

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Speaker 1: be like I don't want to share my idea, Like

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Speaker 1: we all have ideas. No one's gonna steal your idea. Um,

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Speaker 1: the only thing that can really happen is like you'll

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Speaker 1: have conversation and people will help you evolve and enhance

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Speaker 1: the idea, right, And so like that's the first thing

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Speaker 1: I did there. I think that like as a strong

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Speaker 1: lesson and beyond that, like when Peter followed up, you know,

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Speaker 1: I jumped at the opportunity. So he's like, hey, come

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Speaker 1: to l A. I was like on the next plane

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Speaker 1: to l A. And I recognized not everyone has the

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Speaker 1: financial resources to do that, but if you do, like

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Speaker 1: you should take those opportunities and don't really worry about

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Speaker 1: what's on the other side of that. And so I

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Speaker 1: went out there. I spent time with him and um

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Speaker 1: and it was still you know some time where you know,

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Speaker 1: I was like on the fence about it because I

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Speaker 1: was like, I'm from Detroit. I like to do this

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Speaker 1: in Detroit. Um, but the like there was nobody there

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Speaker 1: really willing to support me. And even then I was

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Speaker 1: still pretty committed to the city. But Peter caught me.

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Speaker 1: He said something I'll never forget. He's like, look, you

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Speaker 1: can be a millionaire in Detroit or a billionaire in

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Speaker 1: l a Like you get you get to choose. He's like,

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Speaker 1: but like, you give me twenty four hours, like don't

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Speaker 1: waste my time, you know, and uh, And I caught

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Speaker 1: in the next day. I was like, man, I gave

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Speaker 1: everything away, like I'm on my way. Uh. And I

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Speaker 1: jumped there and I went out to l a UM

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Speaker 1: and you know, basically worked on the idea for like

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Speaker 1: six months, really like talking to people, sharing the idea

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Speaker 1: of making relationships, uh, figuring out the fundamentals of the

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Speaker 1: the idea to actually go out and establish a company.

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Speaker 1: So I spent six months working on it before we

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Speaker 1: never started the company. And that was just me in

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Speaker 1: a tiny room figuring it out. There was times where

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Speaker 1: I couldn't articulated, times where I didn't even think like

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Speaker 1: we'd be successful. But I just every single day stay

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Speaker 1: focused and uh. And I wrote out like three objectives too.

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Speaker 1: I said, Hey, if I can acquire publisher relationships, acquired distribution,

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Speaker 1: and build a strong product, like I can build a

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Speaker 1: company and so I would always focus on the three

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Speaker 1: things because I think in the early days, if you

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Speaker 1: don't like set a north star, um, it's a lot

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Speaker 1: of distractions out there, so you end up not being

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Speaker 1: productive and how you approach work um, And so you know,

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Speaker 1: I think it's super like important to do that. And

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Speaker 1: I wrote those three things down early on, and I

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Speaker 1: stayed focused on those three things, and eventually, like the

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Speaker 1: you know, pieces of the puzzle started to come together,

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Speaker 1: and so you know, we went out and raised our

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Speaker 1: first round, and I think in April, and our story

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Speaker 1: is super privileged, Like we did four meetings, were really

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Speaker 1: strategic about how we approached it. We only met Thursday

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Speaker 1: and Friday and Thursday and Friday because the objective is

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Speaker 1: to get to a partner's meeting on Monday, and so

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Speaker 1: if you meet too early in the week, you know,

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Speaker 1: as there's a change where the whole thing falls apart.

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Speaker 1: And so you know, we did Thursday and Friday, did

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Speaker 1: a bunch of partners meet this Monday, luckily, and then

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Speaker 1: we announced our company publicly on like Tuesday. So we're

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Speaker 1: like really strategic about it. And when we announced it publicly,

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Speaker 1: hundreds of publications started to write about us. And so

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Speaker 1: now all of the investors we just met with the

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Speaker 1: day before who were muling over if they want to

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Speaker 1: make a decision, and they're seeing all of the excitement

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Speaker 1: around the business, tons of other companies, investors excuse me,

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Speaker 1: want to meet with us. And so we take another

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Speaker 1: set of Thursday and Friday. We started to get all

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Speaker 1: of these offer sheets, offer letters, excuse me, and uh,

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Speaker 1: and then we just like quickly made a decision on

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Speaker 1: who we wanted to work with, and so um, the

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Speaker 1: next couple of rounds were like pretty easy as well,

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Speaker 1: like very quick for us. Um. Uh you know, So

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Speaker 1: I don't know if that's super helpful for anyone here,

396
00:18:22,320 --> 00:18:25,080
Speaker 1: but um, but yeah, like you know, I think it's just, uh,

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Speaker 1: every every story is a lot different. And from reason.

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Speaker 1: I think the one thing that people talk about, like

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Speaker 1: our investors talk about that I think it's helpful. It's like,

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Speaker 1: you know, I walked into that room with a ton

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Speaker 1: of confidence, like when they would ask me first off,

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Speaker 1: like as black entrepreneurs, Like even when I was an investor,

403
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Speaker 1: one thing I always realized is that like we're willing

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Speaker 1: to share all of the details, like we'll give you,

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Speaker 1: we'll tell you anything you ask for, Like investors don't

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Speaker 1: have truth shorem like attached to you. Like you, you

407
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Speaker 1: have the opportunity to say what you want to disclose

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Speaker 1: and what you don't want to disclose. Like an investor's

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Speaker 1: job is to like meet you learn as much as

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Speaker 1: they can because they're taking notes, and then they're going

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Speaker 1: to track you over time, right, And and if you

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Speaker 1: if you're progressing, they're going to be like really aggressive

413
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Speaker 1: and trying to write a check and if you're not,

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Speaker 1: they're going to refer back to their notes and then

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Speaker 1: like they're gonna like check back in and some time afterwards.

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Speaker 1: And so you know, I always take the approach of

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Speaker 1: if I'm not from raising, I'm not building relationships with investors.

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Speaker 1: And then to UM, nothing kills a raise better than

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Speaker 1: numbers and time, right, and so like if you're if

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Speaker 1: you're saying you're gonna hit some numbers and you know

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Speaker 1: over some time you don't do that, or if you're

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Speaker 1: saying you're raising, but you know a year later someone

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Speaker 1: sees you again and you're still raising, like the raises

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Speaker 1: did you know? So like it's time to get back

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Speaker 1: to work and find an alternative. UM. But Uh, but look,

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Speaker 1: venture venture dollars also aren't the only the only way

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Speaker 1: to build a company, like there's tons of ways to

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Speaker 1: do so and uh and and to Morgan's earlier point, like,

429
00:19:42,080 --> 00:19:44,560
Speaker 1: when you raise capital, it's not like the endoor b

430
00:19:44,680 --> 00:19:46,000
Speaker 1: all Like we have a ton of work to do.

431
00:19:46,040 --> 00:19:48,920
Speaker 1: I like to say, it's like, you know, having resources

432
00:19:48,960 --> 00:19:50,399
Speaker 1: to buy a plot of land, but we still have

433
00:19:50,440 --> 00:19:52,240
Speaker 1: to build the house, right and didn't sell the house

434
00:19:52,520 --> 00:19:55,520
Speaker 1: and so, um, we have a mortgage essentially. Um. But

435
00:19:55,680 --> 00:19:57,880
Speaker 1: you know, investors want to return on their capital and uh,

436
00:19:57,880 --> 00:19:59,919
Speaker 1: and we're committed to give them one. But but just

437
00:20:00,040 --> 00:20:03,760
Speaker 1: know that that pressure is real. Yeah, absolutely so, momentum

438
00:20:03,840 --> 00:20:07,040
Speaker 1: is key. Um. Let's talk about your team. So you

439
00:20:07,160 --> 00:20:10,679
Speaker 1: raise all this money. Um, you guys are growing incredibly fast.

440
00:20:11,520 --> 00:20:13,640
Speaker 1: How are you structuring your team? How are you organizing

441
00:20:13,640 --> 00:20:17,040
Speaker 1: your time as a CEO? You're on the road constantly. UM.

442
00:20:17,080 --> 00:20:19,159
Speaker 1: I know you're very careful about what you do and

443
00:20:19,200 --> 00:20:22,280
Speaker 1: not do and how you manage your time. So talk

444
00:20:22,359 --> 00:20:24,720
Speaker 1: us through a little bit, because again there's very few

445
00:20:24,760 --> 00:20:29,080
Speaker 1: people at your level in our generation. So, um, how

446
00:20:29,080 --> 00:20:31,240
Speaker 1: do you manage your time today? Yeah? So I say

447
00:20:31,320 --> 00:20:34,120
Speaker 1: no to as much you know, as many things as possible.

448
00:20:34,760 --> 00:20:38,520
Speaker 1: Hanging out with some celebrity no, like uh, you know,

449
00:20:38,640 --> 00:20:42,080
Speaker 1: unless it Diddy as my man, like like that's the

450
00:20:42,119 --> 00:20:44,240
Speaker 1: different thing. But there's been time to where I've like

451
00:20:44,280 --> 00:20:45,880
Speaker 1: had to take the back seat because I'm like, look,

452
00:20:45,880 --> 00:20:48,639
Speaker 1: I just got stuff to do. Um, but no, like

453
00:20:48,680 --> 00:20:51,119
Speaker 1: you know, like you know, if if the opportunity, you

454
00:20:51,119 --> 00:20:52,720
Speaker 1: know comes along, like you know, I'm trying to be

455
00:20:52,760 --> 00:20:56,200
Speaker 1: in the car, you know, like uh but uh but no,

456
00:20:56,240 --> 00:20:58,320
Speaker 1: look you know, but seriously though, like you know, saying

457
00:20:58,359 --> 00:21:00,960
Speaker 1: no to to to opportunity to hang out with people,

458
00:21:01,040 --> 00:21:04,080
Speaker 1: to go to parties, to do dinners and meetings or

459
00:21:04,119 --> 00:21:05,639
Speaker 1: like whatever it is. You know, like you have to

460
00:21:05,760 --> 00:21:07,960
Speaker 1: learn how to say no. That also like also like

461
00:21:08,000 --> 00:21:10,920
Speaker 1: applies to like family. Um, Like it's super important to

462
00:21:11,040 --> 00:21:14,119
Speaker 1: like just be focused on your time and to prioritize

463
00:21:14,160 --> 00:21:15,640
Speaker 1: like what's in front of you from like a team

464
00:21:15,680 --> 00:21:17,960
Speaker 1: perspective and then the personal perspective, like you gotta make

465
00:21:18,000 --> 00:21:20,159
Speaker 1: sure you're taking care of yourself. And so saying not

466
00:21:20,240 --> 00:21:22,040
Speaker 1: that as much stuff as possible as like one thing

467
00:21:22,040 --> 00:21:24,720
Speaker 1: that I practice, um and people get mad about it, Like,

468
00:21:24,760 --> 00:21:26,320
Speaker 1: but you know, you just have to you have to

469
00:21:26,320 --> 00:21:28,480
Speaker 1: do that if you want to be successful from a

470
00:21:28,480 --> 00:21:30,919
Speaker 1: team perspective, like I love my team, Like uh, I

471
00:21:30,960 --> 00:21:34,000
Speaker 1: think I have an incredible collection of people. It's one

472
00:21:34,040 --> 00:21:37,119
Speaker 1: of the most diverse companies you'll walk into ever. Um,

473
00:21:37,160 --> 00:21:40,680
Speaker 1: you know, gender, ethnicity, background, you know, so many beautiful

474
00:21:40,680 --> 00:21:43,400
Speaker 1: shades of people. Uh. And they're all really experienced. They've

475
00:21:43,400 --> 00:21:46,959
Speaker 1: helped build companies. Uh. They all have different backgrounds, um

476
00:21:47,080 --> 00:21:49,199
Speaker 1: and UH, and I'm super fortunate for that. The one

477
00:21:49,240 --> 00:21:52,280
Speaker 1: thing that that make a company be successful is team.

478
00:21:52,440 --> 00:21:55,399
Speaker 1: Like the idea literally does not matter because the idea

479
00:21:55,400 --> 00:21:58,000
Speaker 1: involves too right, and it changes over time, and and

480
00:21:58,040 --> 00:21:59,919
Speaker 1: it changes based on the people that you work with

481
00:22:00,040 --> 00:22:03,359
Speaker 1: and you're hiring. So finding the best team possible UH

482
00:22:03,480 --> 00:22:05,920
Speaker 1: is super important. And the one thing that you know

483
00:22:05,960 --> 00:22:09,160
Speaker 1: I always focused on, especially because we raised so much money,

484
00:22:09,240 --> 00:22:12,119
Speaker 1: was now I have the resources to swing, you know,

485
00:22:12,200 --> 00:22:14,200
Speaker 1: basically in the different weight class. So I went out

486
00:22:14,240 --> 00:22:16,679
Speaker 1: and hired the best executives. Like, you know, I was

487
00:22:16,760 --> 00:22:20,200
Speaker 1: hiring executives whose opportunity was like come joined this really

488
00:22:20,240 --> 00:22:23,560
Speaker 1: small start up with five people, or go be then

489
00:22:23,600 --> 00:22:25,720
Speaker 1: executive at Bird when they were you know, just raised

490
00:22:25,720 --> 00:22:27,359
Speaker 1: a billion dollars. But you know, I had a lot

491
00:22:27,400 --> 00:22:29,960
Speaker 1: of confidence. You know, I had a really strong vision

492
00:22:30,359 --> 00:22:33,280
Speaker 1: and I was just on their phone every day. Hey, look,

493
00:22:33,359 --> 00:22:35,439
Speaker 1: let's talk about this more. Tell me, tell me what

494
00:22:35,520 --> 00:22:38,280
Speaker 1: issues you know you have? What are you contemplating on this?

495
00:22:38,480 --> 00:22:40,399
Speaker 1: Just like trying to work through their problems to convince

496
00:22:40,480 --> 00:22:42,359
Speaker 1: them to come over, and we end up hiring some

497
00:22:42,400 --> 00:22:45,439
Speaker 1: really incredible people, like one of our guys is Robert Lambvick,

498
00:22:45,480 --> 00:22:47,639
Speaker 1: who uh as the VP, was the head of growth

499
00:22:47,640 --> 00:22:51,600
Speaker 1: at Spotify and Headspace. His team grew Spotify while he

500
00:22:51,640 --> 00:22:54,040
Speaker 1: was there through thirty million subs from basically nothing, and

501
00:22:54,040 --> 00:22:56,240
Speaker 1: then through seventy million subs after he left through his

502
00:22:56,240 --> 00:22:58,359
Speaker 1: strategy and vision. And then he left to go to

503
00:22:58,400 --> 00:23:00,240
Speaker 1: Headspace and grew him to a hundred million of renew

504
00:23:00,440 --> 00:23:03,200
Speaker 1: and he joined super early, like before we've done any

505
00:23:03,240 --> 00:23:06,000
Speaker 1: sort of acquisition, Like we had no acquisition strategy, was

506
00:23:06,080 --> 00:23:09,280
Speaker 1: all organic growth um and in fact, I mean so insane.

507
00:23:09,280 --> 00:23:11,399
Speaker 1: We paid this. We paid a recruiter a hundred and

508
00:23:11,400 --> 00:23:14,800
Speaker 1: fifteen thousand dollars just to like identify a list of

509
00:23:14,840 --> 00:23:17,120
Speaker 1: people and try to help us go out to recruit them.

510
00:23:17,480 --> 00:23:19,600
Speaker 1: He was he was the number one person on the list,

511
00:23:19,680 --> 00:23:21,720
Speaker 1: but he wouldn't take the call. But we went to

512
00:23:21,720 --> 00:23:24,600
Speaker 1: go hire the CTO who was actually on the Beast

513
00:23:24,680 --> 00:23:27,680
Speaker 1: Leadership team and and on the head Space leadership team,

514
00:23:27,680 --> 00:23:30,320
Speaker 1: and he joined, and soon as he joined, Robert would

515
00:23:30,359 --> 00:23:33,280
Speaker 1: take his call because they worked together. And then you know,

516
00:23:33,320 --> 00:23:35,320
Speaker 1: a couple of weeks later, you know he was at

517
00:23:35,320 --> 00:23:37,680
Speaker 1: the company. But you know, we definitely lost that hundred

518
00:23:37,720 --> 00:23:40,000
Speaker 1: and fifteen thousand. So being a recruiter again, being an

519
00:23:40,200 --> 00:23:43,199
Speaker 1: HR is a good business. Uh, there's a there's a

520
00:23:43,200 --> 00:23:45,680
Speaker 1: lot of money to be made there, you know. Um,

521
00:23:45,720 --> 00:23:48,239
Speaker 1: and it actually doesn't take much effort. It's just like

522
00:23:48,280 --> 00:23:51,040
Speaker 1: find people, you know, get them to talk to this company,

523
00:23:51,040 --> 00:23:53,119
Speaker 1: and then you take thirty of their salary. It's like

524
00:23:53,160 --> 00:23:56,480
Speaker 1: super easy. Um. But uh but yeah, like look, team

525
00:23:56,640 --> 00:24:00,840
Speaker 1: hired hiring really strong people. Don't prioritize how friends hire

526
00:24:00,920 --> 00:24:03,720
Speaker 1: the best person for the job and and and don't

527
00:24:03,720 --> 00:24:06,000
Speaker 1: worry about domain experience. So like for us, like we're

528
00:24:06,000 --> 00:24:07,760
Speaker 1: focused on the sports, so we don't need people who

529
00:24:07,800 --> 00:24:10,960
Speaker 1: understand the sports. We need people who have incredible death

530
00:24:11,000 --> 00:24:13,560
Speaker 1: at whatever there's job is. So if you're a CFO,

531
00:24:13,760 --> 00:24:16,120
Speaker 1: I want you to be the best CFO possible based

532
00:24:16,160 --> 00:24:17,879
Speaker 1: on that skill set. And then I want you to

533
00:24:17,880 --> 00:24:21,160
Speaker 1: be an incredible leader, right, so, like leadership ability and skill,

534
00:24:21,280 --> 00:24:23,720
Speaker 1: and then depth in your experience. Uh and like your

535
00:24:23,720 --> 00:24:27,119
Speaker 1: domain I think is most important than actual market experience.

536
00:24:28,560 --> 00:24:30,360
Speaker 1: So we have about six minutes left, so I want

537
00:24:30,359 --> 00:24:32,560
Speaker 1: to get some tangible advice. You've given some great advice

538
00:24:32,600 --> 00:24:35,600
Speaker 1: about um folks who are already have startups and how

539
00:24:35,600 --> 00:24:38,600
Speaker 1: they can approach the raising process. What about people who

540
00:24:38,640 --> 00:24:40,919
Speaker 1: are considering getting into startup world? How many of you

541
00:24:40,920 --> 00:24:42,520
Speaker 1: all have a day job but may want to be

542
00:24:42,600 --> 00:24:47,240
Speaker 1: an entrepreneur. Yeah, so what are your thoughts on people

543
00:24:47,280 --> 00:24:48,800
Speaker 1: who may have a good because you're here, You've got

544
00:24:48,880 --> 00:24:52,199
Speaker 1: a good paying job, so you're doing well, but do

545
00:24:52,240 --> 00:24:53,879
Speaker 1: you really want to be broke like the rest of

546
00:24:53,960 --> 00:24:56,560
Speaker 1: us for some time? So that's the rest. What is

547
00:24:56,600 --> 00:24:58,680
Speaker 1: your advice for people who are thinking about taking that

548
00:24:58,760 --> 00:25:01,119
Speaker 1: leap of faith and starting their own company and following

549
00:25:01,119 --> 00:25:04,399
Speaker 1: their dreams? Yeah? So so look, my first piece of

550
00:25:04,440 --> 00:25:06,959
Speaker 1: advice is before you become an entrepreneur, come work at

551
00:25:07,000 --> 00:25:10,040
Speaker 1: play versus. Uh. So that's the that's the first piece

552
00:25:10,040 --> 00:25:12,840
Speaker 1: of advice, right, Like, Uh, I think, especially if it's

553
00:25:12,880 --> 00:25:15,200
Speaker 1: a tech company, you want to be at a company

554
00:25:15,240 --> 00:25:17,840
Speaker 1: that was really small that went really big. Um. And

555
00:25:17,880 --> 00:25:20,080
Speaker 1: you you want to be a part of that experience, right,

556
00:25:20,119 --> 00:25:23,280
Speaker 1: because like learning, going through that journey will prepare you

557
00:25:23,600 --> 00:25:26,640
Speaker 1: to actually be an entrepreneur. I had that journey right

558
00:25:26,680 --> 00:25:30,040
Speaker 1: before I started play Versus. I was an early employee

559
00:25:30,080 --> 00:25:32,600
Speaker 1: at this company called Rocket Fiber, and we raised thirty

560
00:25:32,600 --> 00:25:34,879
Speaker 1: one million from Dan Gilbert and so we were like

561
00:25:34,960 --> 00:25:37,399
Speaker 1: the largest raised in Michigan history at the time. And

562
00:25:37,440 --> 00:25:39,160
Speaker 1: we were just like a couple of kids who knew

563
00:25:39,200 --> 00:25:41,560
Speaker 1: nothing about what we were doing. Uh. And we built

564
00:25:41,600 --> 00:25:44,720
Speaker 1: this incredible company, right, And so I learned so much

565
00:25:44,720 --> 00:25:47,320
Speaker 1: through that process. Uh. And I got to work hands

566
00:25:47,320 --> 00:25:50,520
Speaker 1: on directly with our CEO. UH. And had I not

567
00:25:50,640 --> 00:25:52,560
Speaker 1: had that experience, I would never have been able to

568
00:25:52,560 --> 00:25:55,919
Speaker 1: be successful at play Versus, especially like this fast. Um.

569
00:25:55,960 --> 00:25:58,160
Speaker 1: And you know this early and so look, I think

570
00:25:58,240 --> 00:26:00,240
Speaker 1: that's like the first piece of advice I would give y'all.

571
00:26:00,240 --> 00:26:02,640
Speaker 1: Know everyone's really excited to jump out there and start companies,

572
00:26:02,920 --> 00:26:06,000
Speaker 1: but definitely go and learn and study before you do so.

573
00:26:06,400 --> 00:26:08,919
Speaker 1: And then when you're committed to doing so, like do

574
00:26:09,000 --> 00:26:11,840
Speaker 1: it right like you can. You can start by working

575
00:26:11,960 --> 00:26:14,920
Speaker 1: at whatever company you're working at, as long as it's

576
00:26:14,960 --> 00:26:17,720
Speaker 1: not play versus and be working like on on the

577
00:26:17,800 --> 00:26:21,240
Speaker 1: project on the side right after work, you know, on weekends,

578
00:26:21,280 --> 00:26:23,919
Speaker 1: and really commit to it. Get something built, get it

579
00:26:23,960 --> 00:26:26,840
Speaker 1: out and market um you know, testing t you to

580
00:26:26,880 --> 00:26:29,640
Speaker 1: iterate and then like jump and like you know, quit

581
00:26:29,640 --> 00:26:31,639
Speaker 1: your job for a time and like focus on it.

582
00:26:31,680 --> 00:26:33,959
Speaker 1: But like whatever you do if you take that approach

583
00:26:34,040 --> 00:26:36,200
Speaker 1: or you just jump straight out the window, like make

584
00:26:36,200 --> 00:26:38,440
Speaker 1: sure you're like committed to it and like you focus

585
00:26:38,480 --> 00:26:41,359
Speaker 1: on um, you focus your time like while you're working

586
00:26:41,359 --> 00:26:45,600
Speaker 1: on it. So any final advice for the avro tech

587
00:26:45,640 --> 00:26:51,080
Speaker 1: community before you read apart, any final advice, any final words? Yeah,

588
00:26:51,119 --> 00:26:53,720
Speaker 1: we just you know, look, man, you know we we

589
00:26:53,840 --> 00:26:56,720
Speaker 1: deserve you know, I think that a lot of people,

590
00:26:57,040 --> 00:26:59,239
Speaker 1: you know, we always are like asking to be in

591
00:26:59,240 --> 00:27:02,720
Speaker 1: the room or asking for a seat at the table. Like, look,

592
00:27:02,760 --> 00:27:05,439
Speaker 1: we deserve not only to be at those tables, to

593
00:27:05,520 --> 00:27:08,080
Speaker 1: like to to own those rooms. And so I think,

594
00:27:08,160 --> 00:27:10,040
Speaker 1: you know, as you guys are all in here. First off,

595
00:27:10,080 --> 00:27:12,639
Speaker 1: it's incredible to see so many people committed on a

596
00:27:12,680 --> 00:27:15,280
Speaker 1: Saturday to be here or learn to meet people. I

597
00:27:15,280 --> 00:27:17,320
Speaker 1: think this is a beautiful thing and this isn't this

598
00:27:17,400 --> 00:27:19,679
Speaker 1: is already you know, one step ahead of whoever is

599
00:27:19,680 --> 00:27:23,439
Speaker 1: talking about doing something but actually having started. Uh. And

600
00:27:23,480 --> 00:27:25,520
Speaker 1: so you guys should really be off like just proud

601
00:27:25,520 --> 00:27:29,159
Speaker 1: of yourself frankly for like being here and committing that time. Um.

602
00:27:29,200 --> 00:27:31,879
Speaker 1: But like yeah, but like in general, like yo, we

603
00:27:31,960 --> 00:27:35,240
Speaker 1: just have to prioritize ownership, Like we have to own stuff,

604
00:27:35,480 --> 00:27:38,520
Speaker 1: you know, whether that's our homes. Uh. To be honest,

605
00:27:38,560 --> 00:27:40,320
Speaker 1: I don't know if owning a car makes sense, but

606
00:27:40,440 --> 00:27:44,119
Speaker 1: like certainly homes, you gotta like have equity and businesses

607
00:27:44,240 --> 00:27:47,200
Speaker 1: and yourself. Uh. And and you have to like, uh,

608
00:27:47,359 --> 00:27:49,119
Speaker 1: you have to really care about that. And also we

609
00:27:49,160 --> 00:27:51,159
Speaker 1: have to like we have to support each other. You know,

610
00:27:51,280 --> 00:27:53,800
Speaker 1: Jay had jay Z had this uh this rap and

611
00:27:53,880 --> 00:27:55,800
Speaker 1: if anyone hasn't heard it, like they should go listen

612
00:27:55,800 --> 00:27:57,520
Speaker 1: to And it was like at one of his concerts

613
00:27:57,960 --> 00:28:00,359
Speaker 1: um where like after Nipsey Hustle passed and he talked

614
00:28:00,359 --> 00:28:03,040
Speaker 1: about how like the what most people don't recognize that

615
00:28:03,160 --> 00:28:05,160
Speaker 1: like a crab and the barrel mentality is like if

616
00:28:05,200 --> 00:28:07,560
Speaker 1: the crab holds on to each other as they like

617
00:28:07,920 --> 00:28:09,720
Speaker 1: or you know, on their way out, the barrel the

618
00:28:09,760 --> 00:28:11,919
Speaker 1: first one that gets out. As long as everyone stays attached,

619
00:28:11,920 --> 00:28:14,760
Speaker 1: everyone will get out, but instead, you know, one crab

620
00:28:14,840 --> 00:28:16,840
Speaker 1: is trying to pull each other down. Basically as soon

621
00:28:16,840 --> 00:28:19,479
Speaker 1: as someone makes progress, like we can't we can't be

622
00:28:19,720 --> 00:28:22,040
Speaker 1: on that wave anymore. Like we can't hate on each other.

623
00:28:22,080 --> 00:28:23,960
Speaker 1: We have to support each other. If we say we're

624
00:28:23,960 --> 00:28:25,879
Speaker 1: gonna do something for each other, we have to actually

625
00:28:25,880 --> 00:28:28,080
Speaker 1: follow through with that, and we have to hold each

626
00:28:28,080 --> 00:28:30,520
Speaker 1: other accountable like when we aren't doing that, you know.

627
00:28:30,560 --> 00:28:32,400
Speaker 1: And so I think that that's like that's an important

628
00:28:32,480 --> 00:28:35,000
Speaker 1: lesson that that, you know, I found, It's super helpful

629
00:28:35,040 --> 00:28:38,080
Speaker 1: in my life, and I try to prioritize that, UM

630
00:28:38,160 --> 00:28:40,240
Speaker 1: and just that mentality in general, Like I don't want

631
00:28:40,240 --> 00:28:42,320
Speaker 1: to be I never want to be the only black

632
00:28:42,320 --> 00:28:44,760
Speaker 1: person in the rooms that I'm in. I say, notice stuff,

633
00:28:44,760 --> 00:28:46,600
Speaker 1: if I'm the only black person in the rooms that

634
00:28:46,640 --> 00:28:48,960
Speaker 1: I'm in, um, And like, you know, if you get

635
00:28:49,000 --> 00:28:50,920
Speaker 1: to that level, or even if like even if the

636
00:28:51,000 --> 00:28:53,520
Speaker 1: room is a small room, like you gotta bring people

637
00:28:53,520 --> 00:28:55,360
Speaker 1: who look like you. There are people who want to

638
00:28:55,400 --> 00:28:57,480
Speaker 1: be in that room. And then like y'all gotta just

639
00:28:57,520 --> 00:28:59,280
Speaker 1: put in the work, you know, and stay focused and

640
00:28:59,320 --> 00:29:01,240
Speaker 1: then open the door for the next generation of people

641
00:29:01,280 --> 00:29:04,320
Speaker 1: who also want to be there. Well, thank you doing

642
00:29:05,320 --> 00:29:10,440
Speaker 1: got it about. We appreciate you, we celebrate you. Congratulations again.

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Speaker 1: Come on, this is a big moment, so thank you all.

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Speaker 1: Please keep your seats because we want to go straight.

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Speaker 1: Black Tech Green Money is the production of Black and

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Speaker 1: the Afro Tech Black Effect podcast network in My Heart Media.

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Speaker 1: It's produced by Morgan Dubarn and me Little Lucas, with

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Speaker 1: additional production supported by Love Beach and Rissa Lewis. Special

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00:29:46,120 --> 00:29:49,280
Speaker 1: thank you to Michael Davis, Sadam Sims, and Sakara savon Yon.

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Speaker 1: You know like the one. Yes, that's his real name.

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Speaker 1: Learn more about my guessing of the technists the innovatives

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00:29:56,160 --> 00:29:59,280
Speaker 1: at afro tech dot com. The video version of this episode,

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Speaker 1: We'll talk to Black Tech Green Money on YouTube. So

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Speaker 1: tapp in enjoying Black Tech Green Money. Leave us a

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Speaker 1: five star rating on iTunes. Go get your money. Peace

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Speaker 1: of Love,