1 00:00:09,560 --> 00:00:09,720 Speaker 1: Hi. 2 00:00:09,960 --> 00:00:13,840 Speaker 2: I'm Laura Vanderkamp. I'm a mother of five, an author, journalist, 3 00:00:13,880 --> 00:00:14,440 Speaker 2: and speaker. 4 00:00:15,320 --> 00:00:19,120 Speaker 3: And I'm Sarah Hart Hunger, a mother of three, practicing physician, writer, 5 00:00:19,440 --> 00:00:22,280 Speaker 3: and courtse creator. We are two working parents who love 6 00:00:22,320 --> 00:00:24,000 Speaker 3: our careers and our families. 7 00:00:24,720 --> 00:00:27,360 Speaker 2: Welcome to best of both worlds. Here we talk about 8 00:00:27,360 --> 00:00:30,360 Speaker 2: how real women manage work, family, and time for fun. 9 00:00:30,880 --> 00:00:33,360 Speaker 2: From figuring out childcare to mapping out long. 10 00:00:33,280 --> 00:00:34,200 Speaker 1: Term career goals. 11 00:00:34,440 --> 00:00:39,320 Speaker 2: We want you to get the most out of life. 12 00:00:41,159 --> 00:00:43,680 Speaker 1: Welcome to best of both worlds. This is Laura. 13 00:00:43,800 --> 00:00:46,920 Speaker 2: This episode is airing in early May of twenty twenty five. 14 00:00:47,320 --> 00:00:51,040 Speaker 2: Sarah is going to be interviewing Tiffany Moon, who some 15 00:00:51,040 --> 00:00:55,200 Speaker 2: people may know from her appearances on the Real Housewives 16 00:00:55,240 --> 00:01:00,880 Speaker 2: of Dallas. However, she also has a career as a physician, 17 00:01:01,200 --> 00:01:03,800 Speaker 2: done a lot of other interesting, fascinating things that she 18 00:01:03,880 --> 00:01:07,080 Speaker 2: writes about in her new memoir, Joy Prescriptions. So we're 19 00:01:07,240 --> 00:01:11,479 Speaker 2: very excited to talk to Tiffany. But Sarah, you were 20 00:01:11,520 --> 00:01:16,320 Speaker 2: not a regular Real Housewives of Dallas viewer prior to this. 21 00:01:16,520 --> 00:01:16,880 Speaker 1: Correct. 22 00:01:17,280 --> 00:01:21,039 Speaker 3: No, I really haven't spent much time watching Real Housewives 23 00:01:21,080 --> 00:01:25,039 Speaker 3: in general, and so I didn't necessarily know what to 24 00:01:25,080 --> 00:01:28,240 Speaker 3: expect I knew that she would probably be super glamorous, 25 00:01:28,959 --> 00:01:31,120 Speaker 3: but when I read her memoir, actually, like, I was 26 00:01:31,240 --> 00:01:35,040 Speaker 3: really drawn in by just how interesting her entire life 27 00:01:35,120 --> 00:01:37,679 Speaker 3: story and the trajectory and how The Real Housewives was 28 00:01:37,680 --> 00:01:40,360 Speaker 3: like one piece of her history. But definitely, once I 29 00:01:40,440 --> 00:01:42,360 Speaker 3: was finished, I was like, well, that does not define 30 00:01:42,480 --> 00:01:45,520 Speaker 3: Tiffany Moon. So yeah, some people are probably coming at 31 00:01:45,520 --> 00:01:47,560 Speaker 3: this from like knowing her from the show, and I 32 00:01:47,600 --> 00:01:49,360 Speaker 3: can't came at it from a different angle, but I 33 00:01:49,480 --> 00:01:51,720 Speaker 3: kind of think her story is probably fascinating from either. 34 00:01:52,200 --> 00:01:54,280 Speaker 2: Yeah, what I should say, It was funny you guys 35 00:01:54,280 --> 00:01:56,880 Speaker 2: were having such a challenging time coming up with the 36 00:01:56,920 --> 00:01:59,000 Speaker 2: time to make the interview work because you are both 37 00:01:59,480 --> 00:02:00,520 Speaker 2: still seeing patients. 38 00:02:00,560 --> 00:02:02,320 Speaker 1: I mean she sees patients a couple of days a week. 39 00:02:02,320 --> 00:02:06,440 Speaker 3: Correct, Well, they're actually the opposite days, so her like, oh, 40 00:02:06,480 --> 00:02:10,800 Speaker 3: our days are my like podcasting days, and vice versa. 41 00:02:10,960 --> 00:02:14,080 Speaker 3: So it actually turned out that the day that our 42 00:02:14,120 --> 00:02:16,080 Speaker 3: family left on a spring break trip, I had taken 43 00:02:16,120 --> 00:02:17,840 Speaker 3: off and was like a Thursday, which is not a 44 00:02:17,919 --> 00:02:20,239 Speaker 3: day like usually I'm clinically, So it was like, woo, 45 00:02:20,560 --> 00:02:22,560 Speaker 3: the stars aligned. I think we moved it like three 46 00:02:22,600 --> 00:02:24,640 Speaker 3: times and it worked out, and it was my fault 47 00:02:24,639 --> 00:02:27,880 Speaker 3: that we were moving it like not the Real Housewife. 48 00:02:27,400 --> 00:02:30,400 Speaker 2: Like, yeah, well I should tell people Sarah's so conscientious 49 00:02:30,400 --> 00:02:32,760 Speaker 2: that we got when I got the text that Sarah 50 00:02:32,840 --> 00:02:35,120 Speaker 2: was like in the hospital with her cardiac event, She's 51 00:02:35,120 --> 00:02:37,640 Speaker 2: also like R and I can't dinner view Tiffany because 52 00:02:37,639 --> 00:02:42,160 Speaker 2: I'm here, and I'm like, huh, okay, well they'll probably understand. 53 00:02:43,000 --> 00:02:43,440 Speaker 1: They did. 54 00:02:43,600 --> 00:02:47,560 Speaker 3: They were so nice, like they really were the whole team. 55 00:02:47,600 --> 00:02:48,280 Speaker 1: So are you much? 56 00:02:48,320 --> 00:02:50,839 Speaker 2: I mean you don't really watch You've watched some reality TV, 57 00:02:51,000 --> 00:02:51,720 Speaker 2: haven't you read that? 58 00:02:51,919 --> 00:02:54,120 Speaker 3: Fun to do a little rundown of like some of 59 00:02:54,160 --> 00:02:58,160 Speaker 3: our favorite reality shows over the years, So Dance Moms 60 00:02:58,880 --> 00:03:01,880 Speaker 3: with Annabelle mostly, But yeah, is it cake is one 61 00:03:01,880 --> 00:03:02,799 Speaker 3: that my kids enjoy? 62 00:03:03,040 --> 00:03:06,000 Speaker 1: Is it cake? I don't even know what this is. 63 00:03:06,120 --> 00:03:09,680 Speaker 3: Oh, they make a cake or maybe it's not a cake, 64 00:03:09,720 --> 00:03:11,560 Speaker 3: and you have to guess if it's cake or not 65 00:03:11,720 --> 00:03:13,560 Speaker 3: because some of these things look so life like. And 66 00:03:13,560 --> 00:03:15,880 Speaker 3: then they get a knife and like if it cuts 67 00:03:15,919 --> 00:03:17,840 Speaker 3: and opens in the cake, then it was cake. 68 00:03:18,320 --> 00:03:20,239 Speaker 1: Laura, You've got to check this out or feel like 69 00:03:20,320 --> 00:03:22,400 Speaker 1: you would do all right? Somehow I have my kids 70 00:03:22,480 --> 00:03:24,040 Speaker 1: like is it cake cultural phenomenon. 71 00:03:24,760 --> 00:03:28,120 Speaker 3: Really really old shows that I really loved were The 72 00:03:28,160 --> 00:03:30,520 Speaker 3: Glee Project, which was a spin off of the show Glee, 73 00:03:30,560 --> 00:03:32,720 Speaker 3: but they were like trying to find the next cast member, 74 00:03:32,800 --> 00:03:35,320 Speaker 3: so it was like a performance reality show. I did 75 00:03:35,360 --> 00:03:37,880 Speaker 3: watch The Real World for a few seasons, like twenty 76 00:03:37,960 --> 00:03:41,960 Speaker 3: years ago, American Idol of course, and then a sleeper 77 00:03:42,040 --> 00:03:46,160 Speaker 3: hit in my family has been Shark t Ooh okay, yeah, 78 00:03:46,320 --> 00:03:48,200 Speaker 3: like we'll watch that weirdly at like hotels. 79 00:03:48,560 --> 00:03:51,960 Speaker 1: Yeah yeah, well, you know, it comes on. It's interesting. 80 00:03:52,000 --> 00:03:52,360 Speaker 1: I'm sure. 81 00:03:52,440 --> 00:03:55,480 Speaker 3: Yeah, sure, it's like always on and everyone likes it, 82 00:03:55,520 --> 00:03:57,240 Speaker 3: like all five of us, so great. 83 00:03:57,040 --> 00:03:59,119 Speaker 1: It works about you, it works not that many. 84 00:03:59,160 --> 00:04:01,760 Speaker 2: I mean I did watch the season finale of the 85 00:04:01,800 --> 00:04:04,840 Speaker 2: first season of Survivors, so I had that Richard Hatch 86 00:04:04,880 --> 00:04:08,280 Speaker 2: cultural point there, that cultural reference point. 87 00:04:08,560 --> 00:04:09,960 Speaker 1: I haven't really watched it since. 88 00:04:10,880 --> 00:04:13,640 Speaker 2: I do like remodeling and renovation shows, which I don't 89 00:04:13,640 --> 00:04:15,600 Speaker 2: know if that counts as reality TV, but they are 90 00:04:16,080 --> 00:04:17,320 Speaker 2: real he does. 91 00:04:17,640 --> 00:04:20,840 Speaker 1: Usually you get their hunting for houses or something. I 92 00:04:20,880 --> 00:04:21,200 Speaker 1: don't know. 93 00:04:21,480 --> 00:04:25,120 Speaker 2: I like the design and renovation stuff and seeing what 94 00:04:25,160 --> 00:04:27,400 Speaker 2: people are able to do with the space and like 95 00:04:27,440 --> 00:04:31,320 Speaker 2: what can be in vision and often people are able 96 00:04:31,360 --> 00:04:33,520 Speaker 2: to stay in their homes that they thought they couldn't 97 00:04:33,560 --> 00:04:34,200 Speaker 2: stay in their homes. 98 00:04:34,200 --> 00:04:36,080 Speaker 1: It's just it needed to be renovated, and once. 99 00:04:35,920 --> 00:04:38,159 Speaker 2: It was, it's like they don't actually want to sell it, 100 00:04:39,240 --> 00:04:40,160 Speaker 2: which is amazing. 101 00:04:40,480 --> 00:04:42,200 Speaker 1: I always love seeing that. 102 00:04:42,279 --> 00:04:47,200 Speaker 2: But we're excited to hear what Tiffany has to say, 103 00:04:47,279 --> 00:04:48,960 Speaker 2: so let's move to the interview. 104 00:04:49,640 --> 00:04:53,080 Speaker 3: Well, I am so excited to welcome doctor Tiffany Moon 105 00:04:53,240 --> 00:04:55,599 Speaker 3: to the show. This is such an honor to have her. 106 00:04:56,000 --> 00:04:58,480 Speaker 3: I think she and her story are going to resonate 107 00:04:58,560 --> 00:05:01,359 Speaker 3: so much with our listeners. She is definitely the first 108 00:05:01,520 --> 00:05:04,080 Speaker 3: TV reality star we have had on the show. So 109 00:05:04,160 --> 00:05:06,240 Speaker 3: with that, welcome, doctor Tiffany Moon. 110 00:05:06,760 --> 00:05:08,279 Speaker 4: Hi, thank you for having me. 111 00:05:09,520 --> 00:05:12,479 Speaker 3: So can you share. Let's just start from the beginning. 112 00:05:12,640 --> 00:05:16,400 Speaker 3: And I actually really enjoyed reading your origin story. And 113 00:05:16,440 --> 00:05:17,840 Speaker 3: I don't know that you need to get into all 114 00:05:17,839 --> 00:05:19,920 Speaker 3: of that now, although we may revisit some of it, 115 00:05:20,360 --> 00:05:23,680 Speaker 3: but give our listeners if they are not familiar with 116 00:05:23,720 --> 00:05:26,640 Speaker 3: your TV career or your kind of hybrid creative and 117 00:05:26,720 --> 00:05:30,480 Speaker 3: professional career, give us the story in like the three 118 00:05:30,520 --> 00:05:31,159 Speaker 3: minute version. 119 00:05:31,600 --> 00:05:35,800 Speaker 4: Okay, So I immigrated to the United States when I 120 00:05:35,880 --> 00:05:38,520 Speaker 4: was six years old from China. I didn't speak a 121 00:05:38,560 --> 00:05:41,040 Speaker 4: word of English. I had to go to ESL. I 122 00:05:41,160 --> 00:05:46,880 Speaker 4: was a super huge nerd my entire life. We moved 123 00:05:47,000 --> 00:05:49,720 Speaker 4: very frequently, and so it was hard for me to 124 00:05:50,160 --> 00:05:53,200 Speaker 4: make friends, and so I found a lot of solace 125 00:05:53,360 --> 00:05:57,520 Speaker 4: in reading and doing schoolwork. I ended up graduating from 126 00:05:57,920 --> 00:06:01,240 Speaker 4: high school at the age of fifteen, going to college, 127 00:06:01,560 --> 00:06:03,640 Speaker 4: moved out of my parents' house, lived in a dorm. 128 00:06:04,080 --> 00:06:07,120 Speaker 4: So I graduated from college when I was nineteen, went 129 00:06:07,279 --> 00:06:11,120 Speaker 4: straight into medical school, graduated from medical school when I 130 00:06:11,200 --> 00:06:16,120 Speaker 4: was twenty three, got married a few years later, and 131 00:06:16,160 --> 00:06:18,360 Speaker 4: then by the time I turned thirty, I had two 132 00:06:18,440 --> 00:06:23,280 Speaker 4: kids because I had twins. And then somewhere like in 133 00:06:23,320 --> 00:06:27,799 Speaker 4: my mid thirties, about seven years into being a full 134 00:06:27,839 --> 00:06:33,159 Speaker 4: time academic antithesiologist, I sort of had this like is 135 00:06:33,240 --> 00:06:37,320 Speaker 4: this all there is? Moment? Not that I was ungrateful 136 00:06:37,480 --> 00:06:39,920 Speaker 4: or that anything was wrong, but I just felt like 137 00:06:40,000 --> 00:06:43,760 Speaker 4: I had worked so hard my entire life to get 138 00:06:43,760 --> 00:06:46,599 Speaker 4: to this place that was supposed to be the summit 139 00:06:46,760 --> 00:06:49,719 Speaker 4: of this great mountain I had been climbing for all 140 00:06:49,760 --> 00:06:55,120 Speaker 4: my life, and it just wasn't all that I lacked laughter, 141 00:06:55,560 --> 00:06:59,920 Speaker 4: I lacked creativity, I lacked connection, and I just felt 142 00:07:00,120 --> 00:07:03,480 Speaker 4: like I went to the operating room at six thirty 143 00:07:03,520 --> 00:07:07,520 Speaker 4: every day, got off sometime between four to five pm, 144 00:07:08,040 --> 00:07:11,640 Speaker 4: missed all the mommy and me things that my kids preschool. 145 00:07:12,520 --> 00:07:16,280 Speaker 4: Sometimes I would have a sick child at home and 146 00:07:16,360 --> 00:07:19,320 Speaker 4: my nanny was taking care of my sick child while 147 00:07:19,400 --> 00:07:21,440 Speaker 4: I went to the operating room to take care of 148 00:07:21,480 --> 00:07:24,880 Speaker 4: my patients, and I just felt torn all the time. 149 00:07:25,360 --> 00:07:29,720 Speaker 4: So I decided to go part time at work, which 150 00:07:29,760 --> 00:07:33,120 Speaker 4: then opened up a lot of new opportunities for me, 151 00:07:33,560 --> 00:07:38,120 Speaker 4: such as going on the Real Housewives of Dallas, trying 152 00:07:38,160 --> 00:07:43,400 Speaker 4: my hand at stand up comedy, becoming a social media influencer, 153 00:07:43,920 --> 00:07:47,440 Speaker 4: and then writing my book. My husband jokes that I 154 00:07:47,480 --> 00:07:50,360 Speaker 4: went part time with my anesthesia job, but then I 155 00:07:50,480 --> 00:07:52,320 Speaker 4: just picked up like three new jobs. 156 00:07:52,840 --> 00:07:56,480 Speaker 3: So that's kind of where I am now, which is amazing, 157 00:07:56,520 --> 00:07:58,920 Speaker 3: and listeners to this podcast can appreciate that I have 158 00:07:59,000 --> 00:08:02,480 Speaker 3: a far less glass version of that in my own life. 159 00:08:03,000 --> 00:08:06,240 Speaker 3: Talk a little bit about your decision to go part time, 160 00:08:06,280 --> 00:08:08,760 Speaker 3: because the way you just described it is not quite 161 00:08:08,760 --> 00:08:11,520 Speaker 3: the order you talked about it in your book. You 162 00:08:11,800 --> 00:08:16,040 Speaker 3: really really struggled with that, Yeah, Can you share how 163 00:08:16,080 --> 00:08:16,720 Speaker 3: that played out? 164 00:08:17,240 --> 00:08:22,360 Speaker 4: Yes. In my department at work, I had seen a 165 00:08:22,480 --> 00:08:26,520 Speaker 4: couple of women go part time before, either because they 166 00:08:26,560 --> 00:08:29,280 Speaker 4: wanted to be more present with their families, and sometimes 167 00:08:29,280 --> 00:08:31,440 Speaker 4: it was because they got sick and they needed to 168 00:08:31,760 --> 00:08:34,160 Speaker 4: have time off to go to their appointments and stuff. 169 00:08:34,840 --> 00:08:39,319 Speaker 4: And the unsaid thing at my work was that if 170 00:08:39,360 --> 00:08:43,000 Speaker 4: you go part time, you sort of fall off the 171 00:08:43,160 --> 00:08:52,920 Speaker 4: rising star trajectory in terms of having leadership positions, committee roles, teaching, mentoring, 172 00:08:52,960 --> 00:08:55,840 Speaker 4: that kind of stuff. And they would call it going 173 00:08:55,920 --> 00:08:58,679 Speaker 4: on the quote unquote mommy trap, like that was what 174 00:08:58,800 --> 00:09:02,920 Speaker 4: going part time was. And I had worked so hard 175 00:09:03,000 --> 00:09:05,800 Speaker 4: my entire life. I went into the best anesthesia program 176 00:09:05,840 --> 00:09:08,000 Speaker 4: in the country. I graduated at the top of my 177 00:09:08,120 --> 00:09:12,040 Speaker 4: medical school class. I was running multiple clinical trials and 178 00:09:12,080 --> 00:09:16,000 Speaker 4: writing manuscripts. I mean I was breastfeeding one of my 179 00:09:16,120 --> 00:09:20,160 Speaker 4: twins and literally typing a manuscript with the other hand 180 00:09:20,160 --> 00:09:22,280 Speaker 4: on a laptop like it was wild. I had that 181 00:09:22,360 --> 00:09:28,840 Speaker 4: Bobby Pillow thing, and I was so scared that if 182 00:09:28,840 --> 00:09:33,200 Speaker 4: I went part time, I would fall off that growth 183 00:09:33,280 --> 00:09:36,440 Speaker 4: curve and drop down. And I just didn't want to 184 00:09:36,520 --> 00:09:41,240 Speaker 4: sacrifice all the hard work that I had spent to 185 00:09:41,320 --> 00:09:44,800 Speaker 4: get there, only to then be relegated to the mommy track, 186 00:09:44,920 --> 00:09:48,600 Speaker 4: and so I was like full force ahead. And I 187 00:09:48,640 --> 00:09:51,920 Speaker 4: also wanted to do everything for my twin girls. So 188 00:09:52,040 --> 00:09:54,560 Speaker 4: if I wasn't at the hospital, I was at home 189 00:09:55,360 --> 00:09:59,160 Speaker 4: trying to make them homemade food, take them to mommy 190 00:09:59,200 --> 00:10:03,679 Speaker 4: and me like jimboree and swim classes and music and 191 00:10:03,760 --> 00:10:08,120 Speaker 4: all that stuff. And I quite frankly burned myself out 192 00:10:08,440 --> 00:10:12,960 Speaker 4: because I was trying to be everything for everyone all 193 00:10:13,000 --> 00:10:13,440 Speaker 4: at once. 194 00:10:14,360 --> 00:10:16,920 Speaker 3: And I think now that i've I mean, this can 195 00:10:16,960 --> 00:10:19,800 Speaker 3: be common, but your story is even more nuanced, because 196 00:10:19,840 --> 00:10:23,439 Speaker 3: I think it's very interesting how much you even though 197 00:10:23,480 --> 00:10:27,120 Speaker 3: you had a good amount of financial security, although obviously 198 00:10:27,760 --> 00:10:30,480 Speaker 3: that can always change, but you could have gone part 199 00:10:30,520 --> 00:10:34,600 Speaker 3: time earlier. You had an influencer career that was probably 200 00:10:34,640 --> 00:10:38,000 Speaker 3: growing at that time already, and yet you stopped yourself. 201 00:10:38,960 --> 00:10:41,240 Speaker 3: I wonder, and this is kind of in the book. 202 00:10:41,240 --> 00:10:42,719 Speaker 3: I'm like reading between the lines, but you can tell 203 00:10:42,760 --> 00:10:46,080 Speaker 3: me with some of that more like answering to your 204 00:10:46,320 --> 00:10:50,280 Speaker 3: family's expectations or sort of like your concept of what 205 00:10:50,480 --> 00:10:53,480 Speaker 3: being good kind of meant and how did you reckon 206 00:10:53,520 --> 00:10:53,720 Speaker 3: with that? 207 00:10:54,559 --> 00:10:58,000 Speaker 4: It was both You're right that none of this was 208 00:10:58,080 --> 00:11:02,520 Speaker 4: about money. I mean I don't want to sound inconsiderate, 209 00:11:02,559 --> 00:11:05,520 Speaker 4: but like I didn't need to work right and certainly 210 00:11:05,600 --> 00:11:09,440 Speaker 4: not work that hard and be full time running clinical trials, 211 00:11:09,600 --> 00:11:12,920 Speaker 4: taking overnight trauma call and liver transplant call like I 212 00:11:13,040 --> 00:11:17,120 Speaker 4: was doing like way more. I think this is the 213 00:11:17,160 --> 00:11:20,280 Speaker 4: crux of it that I've come to, this realization after 214 00:11:21,120 --> 00:11:24,480 Speaker 4: lots of therapy, is that growing up as a child, 215 00:11:24,720 --> 00:11:29,200 Speaker 4: the only time that I ever felt worthy was when 216 00:11:29,240 --> 00:11:33,840 Speaker 4: I was doing something and helping other people and or 217 00:11:33,960 --> 00:11:37,000 Speaker 4: making money. So I think a lot of this comes 218 00:11:37,160 --> 00:11:42,600 Speaker 4: from my family upbringing. My parents were very strict, typical 219 00:11:43,400 --> 00:11:46,520 Speaker 4: Asian immigrant parents, you know, like a ninety six was 220 00:11:46,559 --> 00:11:49,000 Speaker 4: not good enough. They would ask me like, oh, why 221 00:11:49,040 --> 00:11:51,240 Speaker 4: did you get a ninety six, Like you missed a problem. 222 00:11:51,320 --> 00:11:53,360 Speaker 4: Let me see that, Like how could you miss that? 223 00:11:53,360 --> 00:11:55,680 Speaker 4: That's such an easy problem, you know, that kind of thing. 224 00:11:57,000 --> 00:12:00,280 Speaker 4: And so even as a young adult, even now in 225 00:12:00,280 --> 00:12:05,320 Speaker 4: my forties, I still struggle with my worth and I 226 00:12:05,440 --> 00:12:11,679 Speaker 4: keep taking on more tasks in order to prove how 227 00:12:11,760 --> 00:12:16,839 Speaker 4: strong and capable I am. And here I wrote an 228 00:12:16,960 --> 00:12:21,439 Speaker 4: entire book about finding joy. But I still have moments 229 00:12:21,520 --> 00:12:24,520 Speaker 4: where there's this little nagging voice in the back of 230 00:12:24,520 --> 00:12:28,840 Speaker 4: my head that tells me if I don't continue to 231 00:12:29,400 --> 00:12:35,200 Speaker 4: achieve and do things, that I won't be seen as worthy. 232 00:12:35,240 --> 00:12:37,839 Speaker 4: And I have to remind myself all the time. It's 233 00:12:37,920 --> 00:12:40,839 Speaker 4: not like I just figured it out and I'm healed. Now. 234 00:12:41,880 --> 00:12:44,160 Speaker 3: That's interesting that you still consider it like a work 235 00:12:44,160 --> 00:12:48,079 Speaker 3: in progress. Yeah, is it something you talk about like, well, 236 00:12:48,160 --> 00:12:50,920 Speaker 3: you've mentioned therapy and then I guess like with family 237 00:12:50,920 --> 00:12:52,839 Speaker 3: members and your husband. 238 00:12:52,520 --> 00:12:57,199 Speaker 4: And yes, I think therapy has been so helpful because 239 00:12:57,240 --> 00:13:00,880 Speaker 4: I had so many complicated feelings about my childhood that 240 00:13:01,120 --> 00:13:04,480 Speaker 4: I kind of swept under the rug. In my family, 241 00:13:04,480 --> 00:13:07,440 Speaker 4: we didn't talk about feelings or problems, Like even when 242 00:13:07,480 --> 00:13:10,200 Speaker 4: my parents were fighting, they would just not speak to 243 00:13:10,280 --> 00:13:12,360 Speaker 4: each other for days at a time. And I saw 244 00:13:12,400 --> 00:13:17,360 Speaker 4: this as a child. It was very weird. So I 245 00:13:17,600 --> 00:13:21,560 Speaker 4: credit a lot of my personal growth the last five 246 00:13:21,600 --> 00:13:27,040 Speaker 4: to ten years to therapy. Also working with an executive coach. 247 00:13:27,480 --> 00:13:29,680 Speaker 4: I used to make fun of women who had coaches 248 00:13:29,720 --> 00:13:31,560 Speaker 4: because I'd be like, what are they coaching you for? 249 00:13:31,800 --> 00:13:34,320 Speaker 4: Like you don't know how to be an adult? But 250 00:13:34,440 --> 00:13:37,520 Speaker 4: like I've now swung the other way, and I tell 251 00:13:37,600 --> 00:13:40,400 Speaker 4: everybody that they need a coach, no matter what line 252 00:13:40,400 --> 00:13:43,560 Speaker 4: of work. You're in. And I think the third thing 253 00:13:43,840 --> 00:13:48,400 Speaker 4: probably was learning to set healthy boundaries, because I grew 254 00:13:48,520 --> 00:13:51,079 Speaker 4: up in a home where there were no boundaries, and 255 00:13:51,160 --> 00:13:55,319 Speaker 4: I grew up wanting to be perfect and people please 256 00:13:55,640 --> 00:13:59,880 Speaker 4: and always do more. And when I learned to set 257 00:14:00,360 --> 00:14:04,120 Speaker 4: healthy boundaries and enforce them, I really feel like that 258 00:14:04,400 --> 00:14:05,440 Speaker 4: changed my life. 259 00:14:05,679 --> 00:14:07,920 Speaker 3: I love that We're going to take a quick break 260 00:14:07,920 --> 00:14:09,880 Speaker 3: and we'll be back talking a little bit more about 261 00:14:09,880 --> 00:14:11,920 Speaker 3: some of the lessons that you share in your book. 262 00:14:24,480 --> 00:14:27,680 Speaker 3: All right, we are back, And one of the chapters 263 00:14:27,720 --> 00:14:31,960 Speaker 3: that I really enjoyed was you talking about your college 264 00:14:32,000 --> 00:14:35,040 Speaker 3: experience and then your med school experience. Maybe I enjoyed 265 00:14:35,040 --> 00:14:37,880 Speaker 3: those because I followed somewhat of a similar path, although 266 00:14:37,920 --> 00:14:39,640 Speaker 3: I did not do my college in two years the 267 00:14:39,680 --> 00:14:43,080 Speaker 3: way you did. But then you came to a conclusion 268 00:14:43,560 --> 00:14:45,400 Speaker 3: that I think you regretted some of the way you 269 00:14:45,440 --> 00:14:49,360 Speaker 3: approached college. And talk a little bit about the concept 270 00:14:49,360 --> 00:14:52,320 Speaker 3: of enjoying the process. Can you share how that played 271 00:14:52,320 --> 00:14:54,160 Speaker 3: out and maybe some of the ways in which you 272 00:14:54,200 --> 00:14:56,960 Speaker 3: feel like you're better able to enjoy the process today 273 00:14:57,000 --> 00:14:57,920 Speaker 3: or what that might look like. 274 00:14:58,720 --> 00:15:03,440 Speaker 4: Yes, So I always thought that there was a finish 275 00:15:03,560 --> 00:15:07,280 Speaker 4: line and the faster I got to the finish line 276 00:15:07,320 --> 00:15:11,000 Speaker 4: than I would win, but life is not a race. 277 00:15:11,800 --> 00:15:15,880 Speaker 4: And because I went to college so early, like I 278 00:15:15,920 --> 00:15:20,800 Speaker 4: never went to senior prom, I never had like that 279 00:15:21,440 --> 00:15:25,800 Speaker 4: first crush experience, like I was basically in high school 280 00:15:25,800 --> 00:15:27,800 Speaker 4: and then I moved out of my parents' house to 281 00:15:27,840 --> 00:15:30,400 Speaker 4: go to the dorm and had to grow up very 282 00:15:30,440 --> 00:15:33,640 Speaker 4: quickly with it in like a several months. And then 283 00:15:33,680 --> 00:15:38,000 Speaker 4: I went to Cornell after my program in Texas, and 284 00:15:38,160 --> 00:15:41,360 Speaker 4: I was just studying all the time. I was taking 285 00:15:41,440 --> 00:15:45,240 Speaker 4: like seventeen to nineteen credits a semester. I was taking 286 00:15:45,360 --> 00:15:49,560 Speaker 4: organic chemistry and physics and studying for the MCAT at 287 00:15:49,600 --> 00:15:53,080 Speaker 4: the same time. Because god forbid I take a gap 288 00:15:53,240 --> 00:15:57,880 Speaker 4: year between undergrad and medical school, Like no, I needed 289 00:15:57,880 --> 00:16:00,400 Speaker 4: to go straight through. And that was just too much 290 00:16:00,440 --> 00:16:03,560 Speaker 4: of a course load for someone, you know, So I 291 00:16:03,720 --> 00:16:08,440 Speaker 4: missed out on a lot of those rich college experiences 292 00:16:08,480 --> 00:16:12,800 Speaker 4: that other people talk about because I was just straight 293 00:16:12,880 --> 00:16:15,760 Speaker 4: up going to class and study like that was all 294 00:16:15,840 --> 00:16:18,960 Speaker 4: college was for me. I went to Cornell a total 295 00:16:19,080 --> 00:16:24,640 Speaker 4: of four semesters, no summer school, no whatever, and basically 296 00:16:24,720 --> 00:16:27,720 Speaker 4: just packed it all in. But because there was so 297 00:16:27,800 --> 00:16:32,800 Speaker 4: much emphasis on like academic achievement and finishing early. I 298 00:16:32,800 --> 00:16:37,440 Speaker 4: didn't get to study abroad. I don't really have besties 299 00:16:37,480 --> 00:16:40,200 Speaker 4: from college because you need to spend time with people 300 00:16:40,280 --> 00:16:44,280 Speaker 4: in order to nurture those deep friendships, and I just wasn't. 301 00:16:44,360 --> 00:16:46,640 Speaker 4: I was like in the library studying all the time. 302 00:16:47,760 --> 00:16:50,640 Speaker 4: And when I graduated, I was nineteen. So I tell 303 00:16:50,720 --> 00:16:54,400 Speaker 4: people how I look at my life, my medical school 304 00:16:54,480 --> 00:16:57,040 Speaker 4: was my college because when I was in medical school, 305 00:16:57,040 --> 00:17:01,040 Speaker 4: I was nineteen to twenty three years old. That's more 306 00:17:01,320 --> 00:17:04,800 Speaker 4: college age. And I'm telling you, like, those four years 307 00:17:04,880 --> 00:17:09,160 Speaker 4: were probably the most fun years of my life, which 308 00:17:09,440 --> 00:17:12,400 Speaker 4: when I tell normal people that, they're like, oh my god, 309 00:17:12,440 --> 00:17:15,520 Speaker 4: this girl's such a dork, like she loved medical school 310 00:17:15,600 --> 00:17:19,080 Speaker 4: so much. But my two best friends from this very 311 00:17:19,160 --> 00:17:22,600 Speaker 4: day until this very day were my tank mates from 312 00:17:22,680 --> 00:17:26,679 Speaker 4: Cadaver Lab, Lisa and Michelle. And so I think I 313 00:17:26,840 --> 00:17:32,080 Speaker 4: replaced my college experience with my medical school experience. But 314 00:17:32,200 --> 00:17:35,280 Speaker 4: I do wish that I could have just slowed down 315 00:17:35,400 --> 00:17:39,359 Speaker 4: a little bit and enjoyed and stopped to smell the roses, 316 00:17:39,960 --> 00:17:44,600 Speaker 4: because I was just a one track horse with blinders 317 00:17:44,600 --> 00:17:46,960 Speaker 4: on focus at the finish line. And then the sad 318 00:17:47,040 --> 00:17:50,200 Speaker 4: thing is you think it's going to be like confetti 319 00:17:50,720 --> 00:17:53,400 Speaker 4: and streamers at the finish line. And you get there 320 00:17:53,440 --> 00:17:57,200 Speaker 4: and it's kind of like meh, like, what's the next thing? Oh, 321 00:17:57,240 --> 00:17:59,240 Speaker 4: I guess we'll start med school. Now, you know, what's 322 00:17:59,280 --> 00:18:02,080 Speaker 4: the next thing? I need to do residency fellowship. Then 323 00:18:02,119 --> 00:18:04,600 Speaker 4: I got to get a prestigious academic job. Like the 324 00:18:04,640 --> 00:18:08,840 Speaker 4: finish line always moves, there's always another target. And so 325 00:18:08,960 --> 00:18:12,520 Speaker 4: what I tell people now is like the joy is 326 00:18:12,680 --> 00:18:16,120 Speaker 4: in the journey and not in the destination. 327 00:18:16,960 --> 00:18:20,080 Speaker 3: And that that's true now, right, Like, cause I'm sure 328 00:18:20,480 --> 00:18:23,120 Speaker 3: as you were doing Real Housewives it was like, okay, this, well, 329 00:18:23,640 --> 00:18:25,320 Speaker 3: it didn't sound like you loved every minute of that, 330 00:18:25,359 --> 00:18:25,879 Speaker 3: but you enjoy it. 331 00:18:25,920 --> 00:18:28,800 Speaker 4: There was not a whole lot of joy in Housewives. 332 00:18:28,880 --> 00:18:31,800 Speaker 4: There was a lot of drama, a lot of fighting, 333 00:18:32,359 --> 00:18:35,840 Speaker 4: a lot of stupidity, but like joy not so much. 334 00:18:36,920 --> 00:18:39,400 Speaker 3: And then not, well, that process might have been more 335 00:18:39,520 --> 00:18:41,520 Speaker 3: tough to enjoy. But I guess even with something like that, 336 00:18:41,600 --> 00:18:43,600 Speaker 3: which for some people might have been like the pinnacle 337 00:18:43,640 --> 00:18:45,800 Speaker 3: of what they were aiming for, not necessarily you, but 338 00:18:45,800 --> 00:18:48,840 Speaker 3: for some people they're still what's next? Now it's the book? Okay, 339 00:18:48,840 --> 00:18:52,479 Speaker 3: the book's done. Now, what's next, and even with less 340 00:18:52,920 --> 00:18:54,879 Speaker 3: glamorous things in their lives. I think a lot of 341 00:18:54,920 --> 00:18:58,560 Speaker 3: our listeners can relate to that. How do you go 342 00:18:58,640 --> 00:19:02,720 Speaker 3: about like enjoying your now as it is every day, 343 00:19:02,920 --> 00:19:04,440 Speaker 3: mundane day to mundane day. 344 00:19:04,760 --> 00:19:07,600 Speaker 4: Yes, So okay, these are like the three pillars that 345 00:19:07,680 --> 00:19:11,920 Speaker 4: I try to focus on. It's connection, gratitude, and laughter, 346 00:19:12,560 --> 00:19:14,880 Speaker 4: And that's what I have in the book as well, 347 00:19:14,880 --> 00:19:18,320 Speaker 4: like each of the chapters that ends with the joy prescription. 348 00:19:18,920 --> 00:19:21,800 Speaker 4: So connection is so important to me because I used 349 00:19:21,840 --> 00:19:24,120 Speaker 4: to feel like I live life like on the very 350 00:19:24,280 --> 00:19:27,240 Speaker 4: surface of the water, but never going deep enough to 351 00:19:27,320 --> 00:19:32,240 Speaker 4: make those actual connections. It's you know, like passing by colleague, surgeons, 352 00:19:32,320 --> 00:19:35,120 Speaker 4: nurses in the army like oh, hey, how is your weekend? 353 00:19:35,359 --> 00:19:37,639 Speaker 4: Like where'd y'all go for spring break? It was just 354 00:19:37,720 --> 00:19:40,360 Speaker 4: all very like surface level, and I was like, I'm 355 00:19:40,359 --> 00:19:42,119 Speaker 4: not going to do that anymore. I'm going to like 356 00:19:42,240 --> 00:19:45,520 Speaker 4: choose some people to interact with in a more deep 357 00:19:45,560 --> 00:19:47,879 Speaker 4: and meaningful manner, you know, like we would have a 358 00:19:47,920 --> 00:19:51,080 Speaker 4: new faculty on board, and after they settled in a 359 00:19:51,080 --> 00:19:53,960 Speaker 4: little bit, I'd be like, hey, next time you're in 360 00:19:54,040 --> 00:19:56,720 Speaker 4: between surgeries or whatever, like let me buy you a 361 00:19:56,800 --> 00:19:59,080 Speaker 4: coffee and let's go sit and talk, and I'd be like, 362 00:19:59,119 --> 00:20:01,679 Speaker 4: where are you from? Why did you come to Dallas? 363 00:20:01,720 --> 00:20:04,119 Speaker 4: Why did you pick this job? And just get to 364 00:20:04,200 --> 00:20:07,040 Speaker 4: know people a little bit better, Like I really feel 365 00:20:07,040 --> 00:20:11,400 Speaker 4: like for many years I didn't have rich, deep connections. 366 00:20:12,280 --> 00:20:15,520 Speaker 4: The second thing is gratitude, because I think we're all 367 00:20:15,560 --> 00:20:18,000 Speaker 4: so busy and the world is a crazy place, and 368 00:20:18,080 --> 00:20:22,239 Speaker 4: sometimes I would catch myself like just being complaining or 369 00:20:22,400 --> 00:20:25,440 Speaker 4: woe is me? Things aren't going the way I wanted. Oh, 370 00:20:25,480 --> 00:20:27,600 Speaker 4: I was supposed to go home at three pm, but 371 00:20:27,680 --> 00:20:29,760 Speaker 4: they just put an ad on case in my room 372 00:20:29,840 --> 00:20:33,360 Speaker 4: and I'd be all cranky about it. And I started 373 00:20:33,400 --> 00:20:36,600 Speaker 4: like doing a lot of mindset work. I read so 374 00:20:36,720 --> 00:20:40,720 Speaker 4: many self help books, listen to all the podcasts, and 375 00:20:40,760 --> 00:20:45,919 Speaker 4: I started telling my brain that when things happen, that 376 00:20:46,000 --> 00:20:48,920 Speaker 4: I get to do something, not I have to do something, 377 00:20:49,200 --> 00:20:51,399 Speaker 4: you know, like when my alarm goes off at five 378 00:20:51,480 --> 00:20:53,520 Speaker 4: and I'm supposed to go to the gym before I 379 00:20:53,560 --> 00:20:56,320 Speaker 4: go to ther I'm like ugh. But then I just 380 00:20:56,320 --> 00:20:59,399 Speaker 4: tell myself like, Nope, it's a privilege, Like I get 381 00:20:59,440 --> 00:21:02,280 Speaker 4: to go to the jim you know, my body is able, 382 00:21:02,480 --> 00:21:06,679 Speaker 4: and I'm working on not having sarcipedia when I'm older 383 00:21:06,720 --> 00:21:10,120 Speaker 4: in osteoporosis, so I'm doing like weight bearing exercise, and yeah, 384 00:21:10,160 --> 00:21:12,720 Speaker 4: it's a pain in the ass, it really is, especially 385 00:21:12,760 --> 00:21:15,520 Speaker 4: at five point thirty in the morning. But like, I 386 00:21:15,520 --> 00:21:20,720 Speaker 4: think it's a privilege, not a punishment. And I was 387 00:21:20,760 --> 00:21:24,240 Speaker 4: listening to a podcast about a year ago and the 388 00:21:24,320 --> 00:21:30,440 Speaker 4: woman on there said some people would take your problems 389 00:21:31,000 --> 00:21:35,679 Speaker 4: and call them blessings, and I was like, oh, like, 390 00:21:35,760 --> 00:21:39,080 Speaker 4: you're right, Like I've come so far, and sometimes I 391 00:21:39,240 --> 00:21:43,280 Speaker 4: just catch myself complaining about the stupidest things. But then 392 00:21:43,320 --> 00:21:45,879 Speaker 4: when I think about that line, it kind of like 393 00:21:46,000 --> 00:21:50,280 Speaker 4: humbles and grounds me. And then the last thing is laughter. 394 00:21:50,800 --> 00:21:53,480 Speaker 4: My twin girls are ten now, so they're not as 395 00:21:53,520 --> 00:21:55,920 Speaker 4: goofy as they were when they were like three, four 396 00:21:56,000 --> 00:21:59,680 Speaker 4: or five, and I could do silly things, but sometimes 397 00:21:59,720 --> 00:22:03,160 Speaker 4: before get to laugh, or we just take ourselves so seriously, 398 00:22:03,280 --> 00:22:08,399 Speaker 4: And anesthesia's not exactly like a fun funny specialty. I 399 00:22:08,400 --> 00:22:11,919 Speaker 4: have like really sick people on the table, and so 400 00:22:12,040 --> 00:22:16,720 Speaker 4: now I try to like intentionally cultivate laughter, whether that's 401 00:22:16,760 --> 00:22:20,719 Speaker 4: like watching a one hour Netflix special, doing something silly 402 00:22:20,760 --> 00:22:23,760 Speaker 4: with my kids, running around like just trying to find 403 00:22:24,280 --> 00:22:28,800 Speaker 4: the funny in life's situations versus being like pissed off 404 00:22:28,800 --> 00:22:29,360 Speaker 4: and annoyed. 405 00:22:30,160 --> 00:22:32,879 Speaker 3: So it's a really interesting reframe. I'm like picturing you 406 00:22:32,960 --> 00:22:34,720 Speaker 3: and the well, there could be things to make fun 407 00:22:34,760 --> 00:22:36,320 Speaker 3: of in the oar. I could see my war. 408 00:22:36,400 --> 00:22:39,760 Speaker 4: It's pretty serious. The laughter part actually doesn't really go 409 00:22:39,840 --> 00:22:42,760 Speaker 4: in the or. You know, some of the surgeons they 410 00:22:42,760 --> 00:22:45,880 Speaker 4: don't like my jokes, or the patients they're like, are 411 00:22:45,920 --> 00:22:48,639 Speaker 4: you gonna put me to sleep? And I'm like, uh huh, 412 00:22:48,840 --> 00:22:51,800 Speaker 4: maybe I'll even wake you up and they're like they're 413 00:22:51,800 --> 00:22:55,200 Speaker 4: like that, No, we leave the jokes outside the. 414 00:22:55,160 --> 00:22:58,199 Speaker 3: Or oh my gosh. Well, we're going to take another 415 00:22:58,480 --> 00:23:01,600 Speaker 3: break and then we're going to talk about something I 416 00:23:01,640 --> 00:23:05,240 Speaker 3: loved that you brought up, which is weaponized professionalism. All right, 417 00:23:05,280 --> 00:23:20,320 Speaker 3: we will be right back. All right, we are back. 418 00:23:20,480 --> 00:23:25,399 Speaker 3: And I was so fascinated by you talking about how 419 00:23:26,280 --> 00:23:28,520 Speaker 3: you know, if I met you at work, I would 420 00:23:28,520 --> 00:23:30,639 Speaker 3: be like, that is the coolest thing ever. She is 421 00:23:30,680 --> 00:23:33,679 Speaker 3: like doing it all. She's so fashionable, she's so cool, 422 00:23:33,720 --> 00:23:35,480 Speaker 3: Like let me follow her around, let me try to 423 00:23:35,480 --> 00:23:37,960 Speaker 3: get surgery. So anyway, I would be very excited to 424 00:23:37,960 --> 00:23:40,360 Speaker 3: work with you, and like in awe of all you've accomplished, 425 00:23:40,359 --> 00:23:45,200 Speaker 3: but then you've noted that in some spheres, doing things 426 00:23:45,240 --> 00:23:49,040 Speaker 3: that might be seen as more feminine, maybe maybe more superficial, 427 00:23:49,400 --> 00:23:52,440 Speaker 3: are sort of like used against you. And I think 428 00:23:52,480 --> 00:23:55,119 Speaker 3: the phrase from your book was weaponized professionalism, and I 429 00:23:55,160 --> 00:23:58,040 Speaker 3: was like, ooh, and I do feel like this is 430 00:23:58,080 --> 00:24:02,359 Speaker 3: something that disproportionately impacts I'm in. It might even disproportionally 431 00:24:02,400 --> 00:24:05,960 Speaker 3: impact people of color, different ethnicities, And I'd love to 432 00:24:06,040 --> 00:24:08,200 Speaker 3: know kind of what you've seen with this and then 433 00:24:08,240 --> 00:24:10,280 Speaker 3: how you have learned to handle it. 434 00:24:11,040 --> 00:24:14,160 Speaker 4: Yeah, I've dealt with a lot of that. I think whenever, 435 00:24:14,600 --> 00:24:20,680 Speaker 4: as a female professional, someone else doesn't like something you're doing, 436 00:24:21,280 --> 00:24:26,120 Speaker 4: they weaponize the word professionalism against you. Oh, that's unprofessional. 437 00:24:26,560 --> 00:24:31,040 Speaker 4: So several years ago, like twenty twenty, actually, COVID Times 438 00:24:31,440 --> 00:24:34,600 Speaker 4: is when I really started being more active on social media. 439 00:24:34,760 --> 00:24:38,040 Speaker 4: Before that, I would just like look at other people's 440 00:24:38,040 --> 00:24:40,320 Speaker 4: social media and maybe like some stuff, but I never 441 00:24:40,440 --> 00:24:44,440 Speaker 4: posted anything on my page. And then in twenty twenty, 442 00:24:44,560 --> 00:24:47,879 Speaker 4: because of the pandemic and all the elective surgeries at 443 00:24:47,920 --> 00:24:50,520 Speaker 4: work had been canceled, we were only doing like cancer 444 00:24:50,560 --> 00:24:54,040 Speaker 4: and trauma surgeries. I had more time on my hands, 445 00:24:54,080 --> 00:24:57,200 Speaker 4: and so I started posting just really as a way 446 00:24:57,240 --> 00:24:59,879 Speaker 4: to relieve my boredom and try to engage with a 447 00:25:00,040 --> 00:25:05,760 Speaker 4: their human beings. And I got called into my supervisor's 448 00:25:05,880 --> 00:25:10,640 Speaker 4: office at the hospital and I was told that some 449 00:25:10,720 --> 00:25:14,760 Speaker 4: of my social media content was unprofessional. That was the 450 00:25:14,800 --> 00:25:17,960 Speaker 4: word they used. I remember it very clearly. My male 451 00:25:18,119 --> 00:25:22,040 Speaker 4: supervisor said, stop by my office when you get a chance. 452 00:25:22,080 --> 00:25:25,000 Speaker 4: I'm like, ret row. So I go and I'm like, hi, sir, 453 00:25:25,280 --> 00:25:26,920 Speaker 4: you wanted to talk to me and he's like, yeah, 454 00:25:26,960 --> 00:25:31,840 Speaker 4: have a seat. So there's been some concern from some 455 00:25:31,920 --> 00:25:37,120 Speaker 4: of our colleagues that some of your recent social media 456 00:25:37,800 --> 00:25:43,280 Speaker 4: posts aren't professional. And I was like, okay, do you 457 00:25:43,640 --> 00:25:48,160 Speaker 4: care to elaborate? He was very vague. He wouldn't tell 458 00:25:48,200 --> 00:25:53,879 Speaker 4: me which post who brought. I was like, is someone concerned? 459 00:25:53,920 --> 00:25:56,840 Speaker 4: Like have I offended someone? And he was like, well, 460 00:25:56,880 --> 00:26:00,480 Speaker 4: you know, it's just not a good look because were 461 00:26:01,560 --> 00:26:04,320 Speaker 4: supposed to be, you know, professionals, and people look up 462 00:26:04,359 --> 00:26:07,720 Speaker 4: to us. And I'm like, okay, I'm dancing. I'm posting 463 00:26:07,720 --> 00:26:12,320 Speaker 4: about skincare, beauty fashion. I had made this thing called 464 00:26:12,440 --> 00:26:15,639 Speaker 4: quarantine fashion, and I pretended like the hallway of my 465 00:26:15,720 --> 00:26:19,199 Speaker 4: house was a runway and then we made different outfits 466 00:26:19,520 --> 00:26:23,800 Speaker 4: using like trash bags, toilet paper, like weird stuff, and 467 00:26:23,880 --> 00:26:27,439 Speaker 4: it was a quarantine fashion show. Like it was all 468 00:26:27,560 --> 00:26:30,399 Speaker 4: in good fun. It was all filmed during off time. 469 00:26:30,560 --> 00:26:33,359 Speaker 4: It's not like I was engaging in dangerous or legal 470 00:26:33,400 --> 00:26:36,240 Speaker 4: activities or whatever. And I just sat there in his 471 00:26:36,480 --> 00:26:42,800 Speaker 4: office like absolutely flabbergasted that one people were watching me 472 00:26:43,119 --> 00:26:48,760 Speaker 4: enough to care and then two like screenshotting it and 473 00:26:48,800 --> 00:26:51,600 Speaker 4: sending it to him. Because I was like kind of upset, 474 00:26:51,680 --> 00:26:55,040 Speaker 4: and I was like, look, unless you have a specific 475 00:26:55,800 --> 00:26:59,640 Speaker 4: thing that I did, like giving me this blanket, your 476 00:26:59,680 --> 00:27:02,760 Speaker 4: social media is unprofessional, like doesn't help me. Like I 477 00:27:02,800 --> 00:27:05,760 Speaker 4: don't know what should I just stop posting altogether? And 478 00:27:05,800 --> 00:27:08,679 Speaker 4: I was like, also, who told you this? Because he 479 00:27:08,760 --> 00:27:10,919 Speaker 4: was like, oh, well, I'm not even on social media, 480 00:27:11,040 --> 00:27:13,159 Speaker 4: so I don't really understand what's going on. And I 481 00:27:13,240 --> 00:27:15,960 Speaker 4: was like, well, did you actually see any of the posts? 482 00:27:16,280 --> 00:27:19,040 Speaker 4: And he said, well, some people screenshoted some stuff and 483 00:27:19,080 --> 00:27:21,280 Speaker 4: texted it to me, and I was like, you know what, 484 00:27:21,720 --> 00:27:25,320 Speaker 4: these people need something better to do. Obviously they're following 485 00:27:25,359 --> 00:27:27,919 Speaker 4: and watching me, you know, and then they don't like 486 00:27:28,000 --> 00:27:31,040 Speaker 4: something I'm doing and then they like report it under 487 00:27:31,119 --> 00:27:35,720 Speaker 4: the guise of like, I'm concerned this may reflect poorly 488 00:27:35,840 --> 00:27:38,600 Speaker 4: on our department, and I was like, get out of here. 489 00:27:38,920 --> 00:27:42,400 Speaker 4: Like people like that, I can't stand them. 490 00:27:42,720 --> 00:27:46,800 Speaker 3: There's something a little sinister about specifically, I don't know, 491 00:27:46,920 --> 00:27:48,960 Speaker 3: targeting like more feminine, you know, because if it was 492 00:27:49,000 --> 00:27:52,359 Speaker 3: a guy like picturing showing his like monster truck hobby 493 00:27:52,359 --> 00:27:56,159 Speaker 3: and his fishing, like I just don't think the conversation, 494 00:27:56,240 --> 00:27:58,400 Speaker 3: like no one would have minded right, Like. 495 00:27:58,440 --> 00:28:01,119 Speaker 4: No guys are doing like that. You're chugging thing with 496 00:28:01,240 --> 00:28:03,680 Speaker 4: the hose or whatever, and like having a con it's 497 00:28:03,720 --> 00:28:06,239 Speaker 4: like a frat party, you know what I mean, and 498 00:28:07,080 --> 00:28:10,520 Speaker 4: everybody thinks it's funny. But then like I model a 499 00:28:10,600 --> 00:28:14,359 Speaker 4: dress made out of toilet paper and that's unprofessional, you 500 00:28:14,400 --> 00:28:18,320 Speaker 4: know what I mean. It's a double standard for sure. 501 00:28:18,920 --> 00:28:21,159 Speaker 3: But ultimately you you must have worked it out. So 502 00:28:21,920 --> 00:28:25,520 Speaker 3: did you tell them that, like, hey, let's pretend this 503 00:28:25,640 --> 00:28:28,320 Speaker 3: was some other topic, Like what specifically do you have 504 00:28:28,359 --> 00:28:31,280 Speaker 3: an issue with? Like how were you able to resolve things? 505 00:28:32,080 --> 00:28:36,320 Speaker 4: I don't know that I resolved them. I basically said, 506 00:28:36,480 --> 00:28:40,400 Speaker 4: unless you have more specific and constructive feedback for me, 507 00:28:40,760 --> 00:28:44,760 Speaker 4: I don't know what more else I can do. And 508 00:28:45,280 --> 00:28:48,560 Speaker 4: that was basically it, and I thought, Okay, there's a 509 00:28:48,600 --> 00:28:51,360 Speaker 4: fork in the road here. I can either play small 510 00:28:51,920 --> 00:28:56,720 Speaker 4: and tone down my social media because apparently I've made 511 00:28:56,800 --> 00:29:01,240 Speaker 4: some people uncomfortable with it. But also I'm like, stop watching, 512 00:29:01,760 --> 00:29:03,920 Speaker 4: Like if you don't like my content, you know, there's 513 00:29:04,000 --> 00:29:08,200 Speaker 4: this whole button that says like block or unfollow or something, 514 00:29:08,280 --> 00:29:10,920 Speaker 4: you know, like why keep watching my content? But then 515 00:29:11,080 --> 00:29:13,920 Speaker 4: like report it to get me in trouble. That's so lame. 516 00:29:15,120 --> 00:29:16,920 Speaker 4: And the other side of the fork of the road 517 00:29:17,080 --> 00:29:21,040 Speaker 4: was like, hey, how about I just keep being myself 518 00:29:21,320 --> 00:29:24,000 Speaker 4: and posting the things that I like and this is 519 00:29:24,080 --> 00:29:27,280 Speaker 4: my life and I will not shrink or dim my 520 00:29:27,480 --> 00:29:31,080 Speaker 4: light because it's a little too bright for you. And 521 00:29:31,240 --> 00:29:34,960 Speaker 4: I went with that. I was like, I'm not going 522 00:29:35,080 --> 00:29:38,800 Speaker 4: to play small. So in many ways, I kept doing 523 00:29:38,840 --> 00:29:41,880 Speaker 4: what I was doing, and in many ways I doubled 524 00:29:41,880 --> 00:29:45,320 Speaker 4: down and made even more content because I was like, 525 00:29:45,680 --> 00:29:49,080 Speaker 4: I don't know it kind of like whenever people challenge me, 526 00:29:49,280 --> 00:29:53,320 Speaker 4: I'm like, watch this. So I made even more content. 527 00:29:53,520 --> 00:29:58,440 Speaker 4: I started getting brand partnerships, my follower count started going 528 00:29:58,560 --> 00:30:00,920 Speaker 4: up and up. I was like getting invited to go 529 00:30:00,960 --> 00:30:04,040 Speaker 4: to dinners at new restaurants, that were opening in town 530 00:30:04,200 --> 00:30:07,360 Speaker 4: just because they wanted some people to go and post 531 00:30:07,360 --> 00:30:09,440 Speaker 4: about it. And I was like, this is kind of 532 00:30:09,480 --> 00:30:11,960 Speaker 4: a cool side gig, Like I'm so glad that I 533 00:30:12,000 --> 00:30:14,480 Speaker 4: didn't decide to play small when all these losers were 534 00:30:14,480 --> 00:30:17,200 Speaker 4: complaining about me, because now look at all these opportunities 535 00:30:17,200 --> 00:30:17,640 Speaker 4: that I have. 536 00:30:18,240 --> 00:30:20,320 Speaker 3: I think it's awesome. You said a boundary and then 537 00:30:20,400 --> 00:30:22,720 Speaker 3: you went for it, and you're like, if you have 538 00:30:22,800 --> 00:30:25,800 Speaker 3: feedback for my anesthesia performance, please let me know. I 539 00:30:25,800 --> 00:30:27,320 Speaker 3: would love to hear about that. 540 00:30:27,920 --> 00:30:30,800 Speaker 4: Yes, the funniest thing that ever happened was it was 541 00:30:30,840 --> 00:30:36,120 Speaker 4: actually a woman. It's funny. There's like man on women badness, 542 00:30:36,200 --> 00:30:39,280 Speaker 4: and then there's like women on women badness. One of 543 00:30:39,320 --> 00:30:46,320 Speaker 4: my female physician colleagues screenshotted something that I posted, and 544 00:30:46,400 --> 00:30:48,880 Speaker 4: I guess she meant to send it to someone else, 545 00:30:49,560 --> 00:30:52,960 Speaker 4: but she sent it to me, talking crap about me 546 00:30:54,240 --> 00:30:57,320 Speaker 4: like it yeah, oops, right, Like this was like before 547 00:30:57,400 --> 00:30:59,400 Speaker 4: the days of like I think you can unsend an 548 00:30:59,440 --> 00:31:01,880 Speaker 4: I message Now I don't really know how that works, 549 00:31:02,640 --> 00:31:05,480 Speaker 4: but I screenshoted it anyway, and I have it like 550 00:31:05,560 --> 00:31:09,640 Speaker 4: forever in my camera role. And then she tried to backtrack. 551 00:31:09,880 --> 00:31:11,520 Speaker 4: She was like oh, I didn't mean, and I was like, 552 00:31:11,560 --> 00:31:16,360 Speaker 4: you can't. You cannot backtrack from that. So I became 553 00:31:16,480 --> 00:31:19,640 Speaker 4: very acutely aware that there were people in my department 554 00:31:19,760 --> 00:31:22,640 Speaker 4: like actively trying to take me down. And that was 555 00:31:22,680 --> 00:31:26,760 Speaker 4: a crappy feeling. But I have screenshots so if this 556 00:31:26,880 --> 00:31:29,840 Speaker 4: ever goes anywhere, like, I have a whole folder of 557 00:31:29,920 --> 00:31:32,840 Speaker 4: receipts on stuff like this. 558 00:31:33,520 --> 00:31:36,240 Speaker 3: Oh my goodness, And you shared the acronym haters having 559 00:31:36,320 --> 00:31:40,240 Speaker 3: anger towards everybody reaching success. Hadn't heard that before? 560 00:31:40,520 --> 00:31:43,920 Speaker 4: Yes, I didn't come up with that. I borrowed it 561 00:31:43,960 --> 00:31:47,600 Speaker 4: from a podcast or something else that I read. But 562 00:31:47,680 --> 00:31:50,760 Speaker 4: that's how I think of haters. I do social media 563 00:31:50,800 --> 00:31:55,880 Speaker 4: coaching for female physicians and other business leaders. I basically 564 00:31:56,320 --> 00:31:59,400 Speaker 4: audit their social media page and look at what's working, 565 00:31:59,440 --> 00:32:03,760 Speaker 4: what's not, give them content, ideas and just strategies to 566 00:32:03,800 --> 00:32:08,440 Speaker 4: elevate their brand presence on social media. And often it 567 00:32:08,520 --> 00:32:11,760 Speaker 4: comes up with my clients that when they post and stuff, 568 00:32:11,800 --> 00:32:15,160 Speaker 4: there's always some haters in the comments, and so this 569 00:32:15,200 --> 00:32:17,720 Speaker 4: is when I use that, and I'm like, haters stands 570 00:32:17,800 --> 00:32:22,840 Speaker 4: for having ancher towards everyone reaching success, because anytime you 571 00:32:22,960 --> 00:32:25,200 Speaker 4: kind of like come out of your lane a little 572 00:32:25,200 --> 00:32:30,240 Speaker 4: bit and put yourself out there. There's going to be negativity. Like, 573 00:32:30,520 --> 00:32:35,160 Speaker 4: that's how human nature works. So the way I explain 574 00:32:35,240 --> 00:32:37,960 Speaker 4: it is like, say you play small, you go to work, 575 00:32:38,000 --> 00:32:41,080 Speaker 4: you go to church, your kids have some parents that 576 00:32:41,120 --> 00:32:44,240 Speaker 4: are your friends. So you have like one hundred people 577 00:32:44,600 --> 00:32:47,600 Speaker 4: in your sphere of influence, right, and like five or 578 00:32:47,680 --> 00:32:50,280 Speaker 4: ten of them you just don't care for. You don't 579 00:32:50,320 --> 00:32:53,200 Speaker 4: get along, You generally try to avoid each other. The 580 00:32:53,280 --> 00:32:55,840 Speaker 4: problem is when you start putting yourself out there, especially 581 00:32:55,840 --> 00:32:59,560 Speaker 4: on social media, and now your sphere of influence grows 582 00:32:59,600 --> 00:33:02,800 Speaker 4: from let's say one hundred to a thousand or ten 583 00:33:02,840 --> 00:33:09,040 Speaker 4: thousand people now fifty to one hundred or five hundred 584 00:33:09,080 --> 00:33:12,800 Speaker 4: to one thousand people don't care for you. It's the 585 00:33:12,920 --> 00:33:18,640 Speaker 4: same exact proportion, but it's much more people. And we 586 00:33:18,680 --> 00:33:22,600 Speaker 4: as humans always have a negativity bias, right, And so 587 00:33:23,040 --> 00:33:25,320 Speaker 4: a lot of my clients, once they start getting the 588 00:33:25,360 --> 00:33:27,120 Speaker 4: hater comments, I'm like, that's. 589 00:33:26,960 --> 00:33:27,719 Speaker 1: Great, babe. 590 00:33:28,080 --> 00:33:31,040 Speaker 4: That means you're doing something, that means you're growing. And 591 00:33:31,080 --> 00:33:34,840 Speaker 4: they're like, doesn't feel great, and I'm like, no, trust me, Like, 592 00:33:35,240 --> 00:33:39,200 Speaker 4: if you have haters, that means you are doing something right. 593 00:33:39,240 --> 00:33:41,960 Speaker 4: It means you're putting yourself out there and not everyone 594 00:33:42,000 --> 00:33:45,680 Speaker 4: agrees with everything. You don't agree with everything you hear, 595 00:33:45,760 --> 00:33:48,920 Speaker 4: you don't like everybody that comes across your feet, and 596 00:33:48,960 --> 00:33:52,160 Speaker 4: it's fine. So my goal, I tell my clients, I'm like, 597 00:33:52,240 --> 00:33:55,200 Speaker 4: your goal is to get more haters, because that means 598 00:33:55,200 --> 00:33:57,880 Speaker 4: you're growing. I mean, it's kind of a joke, but 599 00:33:58,200 --> 00:34:01,720 Speaker 4: I want to normalize the fact that there will always 600 00:34:01,720 --> 00:34:05,840 Speaker 4: be naysayers and we should not let that detract us 601 00:34:06,240 --> 00:34:10,320 Speaker 4: from following our passion and continuing to put ourselves out there. 602 00:34:10,480 --> 00:34:12,560 Speaker 4: If I had let all that stuff at work happen, 603 00:34:12,719 --> 00:34:15,640 Speaker 4: I would have like not kept posting on social media. 604 00:34:16,200 --> 00:34:22,239 Speaker 4: And now that's like one of my actual jobs and 605 00:34:22,280 --> 00:34:25,480 Speaker 4: it's so fun and it gives me way more flexibility 606 00:34:25,560 --> 00:34:28,080 Speaker 4: than working in the operating room, and it allows me 607 00:34:28,160 --> 00:34:34,040 Speaker 4: to flex my creativity and laughter, which there's not much 608 00:34:34,120 --> 00:34:37,320 Speaker 4: creativity or laughter in the operating room. So it's really 609 00:34:37,440 --> 00:34:40,560 Speaker 4: enriched my life. And had I listened to the haters, 610 00:34:40,600 --> 00:34:43,200 Speaker 4: I wouldn't even be here. So the lesson to the 611 00:34:43,520 --> 00:34:46,760 Speaker 4: listeners here is like, do not listen to the haters. 612 00:34:46,920 --> 00:34:49,520 Speaker 3: I love it, I love it, love it. I love 613 00:34:49,520 --> 00:34:51,560 Speaker 3: that you're still doing the hybrid. I love that you 614 00:34:51,600 --> 00:34:54,960 Speaker 3: are working full time in different ways while still enjoying 615 00:34:55,000 --> 00:34:57,680 Speaker 3: your time with your kids. This has been so much 616 00:34:57,680 --> 00:35:01,000 Speaker 3: fun and I absolutely recommend your bo especially because I 617 00:35:01,040 --> 00:35:03,840 Speaker 3: really feel like you share so much and it reads 618 00:35:04,200 --> 00:35:06,920 Speaker 3: like a juicy memoir, not like Self Help to Me, 619 00:35:06,960 --> 00:35:09,920 Speaker 3: which I thought like was a good thing. Before we 620 00:35:09,960 --> 00:35:12,240 Speaker 3: wrap up, I forgot to warn you, but we always 621 00:35:12,239 --> 00:35:14,600 Speaker 3: share one thing that we love on the show. Just 622 00:35:14,719 --> 00:35:16,240 Speaker 3: anything making you happy this week. 623 00:35:16,440 --> 00:35:16,560 Speaker 4: Now. 624 00:35:16,600 --> 00:35:18,920 Speaker 3: I remember your gratitude list from your book, which was 625 00:35:19,000 --> 00:35:22,000 Speaker 3: kind of funny. So you could do something like what 626 00:35:22,080 --> 00:35:24,960 Speaker 3: you put on there, or just anything. It could be 627 00:35:25,000 --> 00:35:27,280 Speaker 3: like the weather, it could be like a product, anything. 628 00:35:27,440 --> 00:35:28,879 Speaker 3: I'm going to start us off to give you time 629 00:35:29,360 --> 00:35:31,399 Speaker 3: to think, and I'm just going to share. My love 630 00:35:31,400 --> 00:35:33,160 Speaker 3: of the week is that I got to take my 631 00:35:33,360 --> 00:35:37,319 Speaker 3: thirteen year old shopping for her birthday. And I don't know, 632 00:35:37,360 --> 00:35:39,239 Speaker 3: I feel like that was one of those kind of 633 00:35:39,239 --> 00:35:40,960 Speaker 3: things you envision when your kids are little, like, oh, 634 00:35:41,000 --> 00:35:42,279 Speaker 3: my kid's gonna be a teen and we're gonna go 635 00:35:42,280 --> 00:35:44,279 Speaker 3: shopping together. There's gonna be fun. And it really really 636 00:35:44,440 --> 00:35:46,960 Speaker 3: was fun. We mostly got like ath leisure like Lulu 637 00:35:47,000 --> 00:35:49,680 Speaker 3: and Alo, and it was great. I had a wonderful time. 638 00:35:50,040 --> 00:35:52,000 Speaker 4: So what is so sweet? 639 00:35:52,400 --> 00:35:53,680 Speaker 3: So what is your love of the week. 640 00:35:53,800 --> 00:35:57,200 Speaker 4: Okay, well we just got a new dog. He's right here, 641 00:35:57,320 --> 00:35:59,960 Speaker 4: let me see if oh, well your people can't see there. 642 00:36:01,680 --> 00:36:02,560 Speaker 3: That's so exciting. 643 00:36:02,680 --> 00:36:05,399 Speaker 4: We got a new dog. His name is Custom. He's 644 00:36:05,480 --> 00:36:07,640 Speaker 4: laying on the floor next to me right now. He's 645 00:36:07,680 --> 00:36:12,040 Speaker 4: such a sweet boy. He is a Belgian malinoaw. I 646 00:36:12,040 --> 00:36:13,880 Speaker 4: don't know if you know what that is. It's people 647 00:36:13,920 --> 00:36:16,719 Speaker 4: think he's a German Shepherd. They look similar, but it's 648 00:36:16,760 --> 00:36:21,960 Speaker 4: not exactly the same. But he's so sweet. I haven't 649 00:36:22,000 --> 00:36:25,040 Speaker 4: My other dog is like seven. And if Custom is new, 650 00:36:25,400 --> 00:36:27,959 Speaker 4: you forget. It's like having a child, Like how hard 651 00:36:28,000 --> 00:36:29,759 Speaker 4: it is in the beginning, you know, because he's like 652 00:36:29,880 --> 00:36:33,760 Speaker 4: chewing everything and having accidents and all this kind of stuff. 653 00:36:33,880 --> 00:36:37,520 Speaker 4: But I don't know, he's like my son. I love 654 00:36:37,600 --> 00:36:39,680 Speaker 4: him so much and I don't know what it is, 655 00:36:39,760 --> 00:36:43,280 Speaker 4: but like, I just love animals. I just have away 656 00:36:43,320 --> 00:36:48,360 Speaker 4: with animals. My friend calls me snow white because animals 657 00:36:48,440 --> 00:36:52,480 Speaker 4: just gravitate towards me. I'm like the dog whisper, not 658 00:36:52,560 --> 00:36:56,759 Speaker 4: so much with people, but but with dogs. Yes, So 659 00:36:57,040 --> 00:36:59,759 Speaker 4: my obsession right now is my new dog. 660 00:37:00,320 --> 00:37:03,120 Speaker 3: I love it. So just remind our listeners the name 661 00:37:03,160 --> 00:37:05,279 Speaker 3: of your book and where they can find you. 662 00:37:06,200 --> 00:37:11,359 Speaker 4: Yes, the name of my memoir is Joy Prescriptions. It's 663 00:37:11,440 --> 00:37:16,680 Speaker 4: available anywhere where books are sold, or on joyprescriptions dot com, 664 00:37:16,719 --> 00:37:19,920 Speaker 4: where before May sixth you can get over three hundred 665 00:37:19,960 --> 00:37:23,640 Speaker 4: dollars worth of pre order bonuses. And if you guys 666 00:37:23,680 --> 00:37:28,719 Speaker 4: want to follow me along on all my unprofessional antics, 667 00:37:29,600 --> 00:37:33,799 Speaker 4: I'm across all the social media platforms at Tiffany Moon MD. 668 00:37:34,520 --> 00:37:37,160 Speaker 3: Amazing. Thank you so much for coming on, Tiffany. 669 00:37:36,960 --> 00:37:39,799 Speaker 4: Thanks for having me. Sarah, Well we are back. 670 00:37:39,880 --> 00:37:40,480 Speaker 1: That was great. 671 00:37:40,520 --> 00:37:43,319 Speaker 2: Sarah interviewing Tiffany Moon, author of the brand new book 672 00:37:43,400 --> 00:37:47,439 Speaker 2: Joy Prescriptions. So our question this week comes from someone 673 00:37:47,440 --> 00:37:49,880 Speaker 2: who says her husband and she have agreed to do 674 00:37:49,960 --> 00:37:52,760 Speaker 2: more date nights, but seem to tire of the typical 675 00:37:52,800 --> 00:37:57,000 Speaker 2: dinner and we cannot stay up for a movie. Other ideas, 676 00:37:57,040 --> 00:38:00,319 Speaker 2: including even home dates, are welcome. So, Sarah, what are 677 00:38:00,320 --> 00:38:04,640 Speaker 2: you thinking would be fun in the offbeat date night category? 678 00:38:05,400 --> 00:38:05,640 Speaker 4: Yeah? 679 00:38:05,640 --> 00:38:07,680 Speaker 3: So, I always feel like a low key sport can 680 00:38:07,719 --> 00:38:12,040 Speaker 3: be good, meaning like bowling, mini golf, something where there's 681 00:38:12,040 --> 00:38:14,200 Speaker 3: a little like competition to keep it spicy, and I 682 00:38:14,760 --> 00:38:16,759 Speaker 3: top golf is like a new thing. I mean that's 683 00:38:16,800 --> 00:38:19,239 Speaker 3: like a specific chain, but like that's sort of like 684 00:38:19,320 --> 00:38:22,399 Speaker 3: regular golf, but can be gamified, which would I think 685 00:38:22,400 --> 00:38:25,160 Speaker 3: be fun on a date. I think anything that could 686 00:38:25,160 --> 00:38:27,960 Speaker 3: be gamified, like even a museum, Like, okay, let's go 687 00:38:28,040 --> 00:38:30,839 Speaker 3: to a museum together and then decide if we can 688 00:38:30,880 --> 00:38:34,239 Speaker 3: each find like guess each other's favorites in a given room. 689 00:38:34,760 --> 00:38:37,960 Speaker 3: Or my other idea was night of hedonism where you 690 00:38:37,960 --> 00:38:40,120 Speaker 3: get massages and then go out for ice cream. 691 00:38:40,160 --> 00:38:44,280 Speaker 1: Interesting and at home you had some ideas for at home? Yes, 692 00:38:44,360 --> 00:38:44,880 Speaker 1: at home. 693 00:38:45,800 --> 00:38:48,360 Speaker 3: Someone told me about this, I think in a Patreon maybe. 694 00:38:48,360 --> 00:38:51,719 Speaker 3: But virtual wine tasting is a thing where you can 695 00:38:51,840 --> 00:38:53,680 Speaker 3: get a box sent to you and then like they 696 00:38:53,680 --> 00:38:55,719 Speaker 3: do a zoom and then you and your partner like 697 00:38:55,760 --> 00:38:58,640 Speaker 3: taste wines like in together, but like with a like 698 00:38:58,680 --> 00:38:59,960 Speaker 3: a Somelier leading. 699 00:39:00,239 --> 00:39:03,080 Speaker 1: Interesting. This that's interesting. Huh yeah. Yeah, it's not like 700 00:39:03,080 --> 00:39:05,719 Speaker 1: how do you virtually drink wine? I'm not sure. No, 701 00:39:05,880 --> 00:39:07,759 Speaker 1: you drink the real drink the real wine. Okay, that's good. 702 00:39:07,840 --> 00:39:11,400 Speaker 1: That makes for a better date. Yeah, that's sounds fun. 703 00:39:12,080 --> 00:39:13,680 Speaker 2: I think one idea is you know if it sounds 704 00:39:13,680 --> 00:39:15,760 Speaker 2: like people are tired at this could be a problem. 705 00:39:15,760 --> 00:39:17,560 Speaker 2: Like you've gotten through the work weekends, like Friday night 706 00:39:17,640 --> 00:39:19,600 Speaker 2: is date night, but then like everyone's so tired they 707 00:39:19,680 --> 00:39:21,120 Speaker 2: kind of want to go to bed. I wonder if 708 00:39:21,120 --> 00:39:23,279 Speaker 2: you could get out of the idea of night or 709 00:39:23,320 --> 00:39:27,280 Speaker 2: maybe like move your regular date time. Maybe for your family, 710 00:39:27,280 --> 00:39:29,040 Speaker 2: it would work better if you hired a sitter for 711 00:39:29,080 --> 00:39:32,560 Speaker 2: like four hours on Saturday afternoon, and you could go 712 00:39:32,640 --> 00:39:35,200 Speaker 2: out to lunch, or go to the gym together, or 713 00:39:35,360 --> 00:39:38,320 Speaker 2: go to an art museum, or go play top golf 714 00:39:38,360 --> 00:39:40,480 Speaker 2: for whatever, but at a time when you would have 715 00:39:40,800 --> 00:39:44,480 Speaker 2: a lot more energy. Or as we heard in our 716 00:39:44,880 --> 00:39:47,839 Speaker 2: Cheap It Hot episode a few weeks ago, you could 717 00:39:47,920 --> 00:39:50,680 Speaker 2: also hire that sitter to take your children out of 718 00:39:50,719 --> 00:39:52,879 Speaker 2: your house and then you could do whatever you want 719 00:39:52,920 --> 00:39:57,200 Speaker 2: in your house during that time on Saturday afternoons. I 720 00:39:57,200 --> 00:40:00,759 Speaker 2: would also just suggest pro sports is a a different thing. 721 00:40:00,760 --> 00:40:02,919 Speaker 2: If you've got any or minor league sports would work 722 00:40:03,400 --> 00:40:05,040 Speaker 2: in major league, minor league, whatever. If you are in 723 00:40:05,080 --> 00:40:07,120 Speaker 2: a reasonable size city, there might be something you can do. 724 00:40:07,200 --> 00:40:10,640 Speaker 2: It turns out places have a lot of different teams. 725 00:40:10,640 --> 00:40:15,120 Speaker 2: We've been doing the tour of Phillies Professional sports institutions, 726 00:40:15,160 --> 00:40:18,920 Speaker 2: and that's made for a couple of fun activities for us. 727 00:40:19,640 --> 00:40:21,759 Speaker 3: And that's a great one because like you have entertainment 728 00:40:21,800 --> 00:40:23,520 Speaker 3: but on like a play or a movie, like, there's 729 00:40:23,560 --> 00:40:24,759 Speaker 3: plenty of time to talk to each other. 730 00:40:25,000 --> 00:40:26,560 Speaker 1: So yeah, yeah, I like it. 731 00:40:26,840 --> 00:40:28,719 Speaker 2: But you know it might be helpful just to brainstorm 732 00:40:28,760 --> 00:40:31,600 Speaker 2: ideas too, Like we could treat this as something of 733 00:40:31,640 --> 00:40:33,920 Speaker 2: a project for the two of you instead. 734 00:40:33,600 --> 00:40:35,439 Speaker 1: Of because I think sometimes this gets to the well, 735 00:40:35,480 --> 00:40:36,960 Speaker 1: we have this center for Friday, like we have a 736 00:40:37,000 --> 00:40:38,680 Speaker 1: regular Friday setters that what are we supposed to do? 737 00:40:38,719 --> 00:40:39,560 Speaker 1: I don't know what do you want to do? 738 00:40:40,080 --> 00:40:42,759 Speaker 2: So just some other time, like both of you, like 739 00:40:43,080 --> 00:40:46,800 Speaker 2: brainstorm a short list separately, and then you come together 740 00:40:47,320 --> 00:40:50,040 Speaker 2: and compare your lists and brainstorm together to add no 741 00:40:50,200 --> 00:40:50,839 Speaker 2: more to the list. 742 00:40:50,960 --> 00:40:52,600 Speaker 3: This would be a fun date night activity. 743 00:40:52,680 --> 00:40:54,319 Speaker 1: Well that's true. You could make that into a date 744 00:40:54,400 --> 00:40:56,239 Speaker 1: night activity as well. Let's play on our next date. Right, 745 00:40:56,239 --> 00:40:59,040 Speaker 1: we're not doing anything tonight, but here's what we might 746 00:40:59,080 --> 00:41:01,080 Speaker 1: do at our next time. We do this. 747 00:41:01,600 --> 00:41:03,240 Speaker 3: Combine it with your virtual wine tasting. 748 00:41:03,920 --> 00:41:05,640 Speaker 2: Yes, that's true, that could work as well, or just 749 00:41:05,840 --> 00:41:08,680 Speaker 2: forget the tasting, just pour a glass of wine it's 750 00:41:08,680 --> 00:41:11,040 Speaker 2: all good, yeah, and who knows what you might come 751 00:41:11,080 --> 00:41:13,160 Speaker 2: up with, but I think you know it's worth spending 752 00:41:13,200 --> 00:41:14,799 Speaker 2: some time and then you'll have a couple ideas for 753 00:41:15,440 --> 00:41:18,440 Speaker 2: there on Thurne Well, this has been best of both worlds. 754 00:41:18,480 --> 00:41:22,000 Speaker 2: Sarah has been interviewing Tiffany Moon, author of the book 755 00:41:22,080 --> 00:41:25,680 Speaker 2: Joy Prescriptions, also known for her appearances on Real Housewives 756 00:41:25,680 --> 00:41:27,799 Speaker 2: of Dallas. We will be back next week with more 757 00:41:27,840 --> 00:41:29,520 Speaker 2: on making work and life fit together. 758 00:41:31,640 --> 00:41:34,440 Speaker 3: Thanks for listening. You can find me Sarah at the 759 00:41:34,440 --> 00:41:38,839 Speaker 3: shoebox dot com or at the Underscore Shoebox on Instagram, 760 00:41:39,280 --> 00:41:39,600 Speaker 3: and you. 761 00:41:39,560 --> 00:41:43,200 Speaker 2: Can find me Laura at Laura vandercam dot com. 762 00:41:43,680 --> 00:41:46,239 Speaker 1: This has been the best of both worlds podcasts. 763 00:41:46,600 --> 00:41:49,400 Speaker 2: Please join us next time for more on making work 764 00:41:49,480 --> 00:41:50,760 Speaker 2: and life work together.